The Charlie Kirk Show - How 'Wokeism' is Waking Up the Masses with Megyn Kelly

00:00:00.000 Hey, everybody.

00:00:00.000 This very special episode of the Charlie Kirk Show, Megan Kelly.

00:00:04.000 You heard that right.

00:00:05.000 We have a conversation about wokeism, CRT, New York schools, Me Too, the left, and so much more.

00:00:11.000 It's a fascinating conversation with someone who does not call herself a conservative.

00:00:15.000 I think you'll really enjoy this, especially if you have independent women in your life.

00:00:20.000 I think this episode is worth circulating and texting around.

00:00:23.000 Email us your thoughts, freedom at charliekirk.com.

00:00:26.000 If you want to support our show, you could do so at charliekirk.com/slash support.

00:00:30.000 That's charliekirk.com/slash/support.

00:00:33.000 Where if you guys want to help us hire more staff and remain strong, Suzanne from California, thank you for supporting our show.

00:00:38.000 I want to thank Sharon from New Jersey.

00:00:41.000 I want to thank Ryan from Florida, Jerome from Maryland.

00:00:45.000 I want to thank Carl from Montana.

00:00:47.000 I want to thank Greg from North Dakota.

00:00:50.000 And I want to thank Kathy from Iowa, charliekirk.com/slash support, for getting behind the work we are doing.

00:00:56.000 Thank you, thank you, thank you.

00:00:57.000 If you want to get involved with Turning Point USA, come to America Fest, everybody, December 18th, December 19th, December 20, 21, tpusa.com/slash A-M-F-E-S-T TPUSA.com/slash amfest.

00:01:09.000 Check it out, everybody.

00:01:10.000 tpusa.com/slash amfest.

00:01:12.000 Megan Kelly is here.

00:01:14.000 Send this episode to your friends and make sure you're subscribed to the Charlie Kirk Show podcast.

00:01:18.000 Buckle up. 0.96

00:01:19.000 Here we go.

00:01:20.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.

00:01:22.000 Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.

00:01:24.000 I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.

00:01:27.000 Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.

00:01:31.000 I want to thank Charlie.

00:01:32.000 He's an incredible guy.

00:01:33.000 His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created.

00:01:40.000 Turning point USA. 0.65

00:01:41.000 We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.

00:01:50.000 That's why we are here.

00:01:52.000 Hey, everybody.

00:01:53.000 This episode is brought to you by my friends at ExpressVPN, expressvpn.com/slash Charlie.

00:02:00.000 Secure your device, anonymize your online activity, protect your action online.

00:02:06.000 Expressvpn.com/slash Charlie.

00:02:09.000 Help our show out by also helping yourself protect yourself.

00:02:13.000 Expressvpn.com slash Charlie.

00:02:19.000 Hey, everybody.

00:02:20.000 Welcome to this episode of the Charlie Kirk Show.

00:02:22.000 With us today is someone I think you all know, a journalist and, of course, host of the Megan Kelly Show, Megan Kelly.

00:02:28.000 And I've been enjoying her podcast a lot.

00:02:30.000 So, everyone, go download it and subscribe.

00:02:32.000 Megan, welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show.

00:02:34.000 Hi, so happy to be here.

00:02:36.000 Thanks for having me.

00:02:37.000 So, I kind of want to start with some would call it an evolution from you being a political commentator to now kind of a cultural phenomenon and kind of a voice in the middle of sanity.

00:02:48.000 Talk a little bit about that because I think some of our audience is just getting reintroduced to Megan Kelly.

00:02:53.000 They saw you for years on TV, and I think this would be really helpful.

00:02:57.000 Well, it's funny because I feel like my career as more of a political commentator is in its infancy.

00:03:04.000 Because, you know, while I was out in Fox and I had been at ABC for a short stint before that, and then ultimately NBC, I was in more of a straight news journalist role.

00:03:13.000 And when I did the Kelly file, you know, primetime cable is at best a mix of journalism and some opinion.

00:03:21.000 Now, I think it's all opinion, right?

00:03:22.000 If you watch what's on cable right now in primetime, it's all opinion.

00:03:24.000 But I tried to hold the line so that I could continue doing things like presidential debates and so on.

00:03:30.000 You know, I didn't want to give up my role as a journalist there.

00:03:32.000 And now I'm kind of, I can, I don't know, more into a little bit more opinion giving than I'm used to.

00:03:38.000 And it's fun.

00:03:39.000 I like it.

00:03:40.000 You know, I can say what I want and I'm not under anybody's control, whether it's Fox or NBC, and it's liberating.

00:03:47.000 Well, and I think that's where a lot of Americans are too, where there's kind of this pressure to always kind of say things that people want you to say.

00:03:55.000 Can you talk kind of about how what you've learned in the last couple of years of kind of getting into this space of, you know, kind of some of the political orthodoxies out there of things you're not allowed to talk about?

00:04:07.000 For example, critical race theory or the trans issue.

00:04:11.000 I'm sure you get some backlash for even talking about these things.

00:04:14.000 Well, listen, I would say the one advantage to having been called all the worst names, you know, I've been called them all.

00:04:21.000 I mean, and, you know, you.

00:04:22.000 you sort of worry about that, right?

00:04:24.000 When you touch these dicey issues, whether it's the trans stuff or the race stuff.

00:04:28.000 And then to wake up one morning and see those names hurled at you on the front cover of every newspaper in the country, it's terrible to go through, but it's also quite liberating because the bad thing happened and you're fine.

00:04:39.000 You know, it's painful in the moment.

00:04:41.000 But then you look around, you're like, what's my world?

00:04:43.000 My world's my husband, my kids, my friends, my family.

00:04:47.000 I'm fine.

00:04:48.000 And now that the bad thing has happened, I feel totally free to talk about everything in exactly the way I want to because they've already fired that bullet at me and I'm still standing.

00:04:59.000 So it's, it's all, it's like the, um, it reminds me of the scene in Jerry McGuire where Kelly Preston's character looks at Tom Cruise and she's like, you can't hurt me, Jerry.

00:05:08.000 I'm too strong for you.

00:05:09.000 That's how I feel about the mainstream press.

00:05:11.000 That's me with the mainstream press.

00:05:13.000 Oh, wait, you already did and I'm fine.

00:05:13.000 Take your best shot.

00:05:16.000 You see, the only scene of that movie I hear quoted is show me the money.

00:05:19.000 And so it's very impressive that you got to watch it as a chick.

00:05:23.000 No, that's right.

00:05:24.000 You're totally right.

00:05:26.000 Which I never thought of some of the other wisdom in that movie.

00:05:28.000 I actually know the people, the family that was, that was based off of it.

00:05:31.000 That's a different story for a different time.

00:05:33.000 So talk, let's talk, let's get into some of the contentious issues.

00:05:36.000 Let's talk about the CRT battle.

00:05:37.000 You've decided to speak out about this, saying, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but you've given some opinions about this, especially given your own family in New York City and kind of all the drama surrounding that.

00:05:49.000 Comment a little about where you think our country's at with this.

00:05:51.000 And do you consider kind of wokeism to be a threat to the American way of life?

00:05:57.000 Yes, I do.

00:05:58.000 I mean, I think it needs to be fought and we need all hands on deck because while their army is a lot smaller than our army, it's powerful.

00:06:06.000 And it may be small in number, but they have control of some key institutions, including the media, including academia, now sports and so on.

00:06:15.000 And so if we don't fight, they're only going to grow further and more powerful.

00:06:20.000 So now's the time.

00:06:21.000 And I get that it's scary, but I'm kind of done listening to how scary it is because this is an existential moment for our country, of our way of life.

00:06:31.000 And I just interviewed John McWhorter.

00:06:32.000 You know, he's a brilliant Columbia University professor.

00:06:34.000 He and Glenn Lowry, they speak sense when it comes to race and all this stuff that we've been listening to.

00:06:40.000 And McWhorter just said to me, and I quote, and it's in his new book, make no mistake, they are coming for your children.

00:06:46.000 That's exactly right.

00:06:47.000 Yes.

00:06:48.000 And so if you won't fight for yourself or risk your job or risk being called names for yourself, do it for your kids because CRT is incredibly racist and damaging.

00:06:57.000 And I view it as like, if we don't, we're going to create a whole next generation of racists.

00:07:04.000 If that's not worth fighting, I don't know what is.

00:07:06.000 Well, and what, but what's surprising is how few people are willing to talk about this.

00:07:11.000 You've been willing to talk about it, Barry Weiss and others, but it's almost like this dissident network of truth tellers.

00:07:18.000 And why do you think that is?

00:07:19.000 Are people afraid of kind of engaging this in conversation or they think, oh, we've been through these cultural battles before.

00:07:25.000 It's not a big deal.

00:07:26.000 Talk about the unprecedented nature of these ideas.

00:07:28.000 We haven't lived through anything like this, at least in the last couple of decades.

00:07:32.000 I think most people are, they don't have the advantage of having been called all the terrible names in the paper and all of our social media.

00:07:39.000 They're pre the names and they don't want it to happen.

00:07:43.000 And they still think that they can sort of hold on to their street cred with these people, with these magazines, what have you.

00:07:51.000 And other people's people are worried about jobs and that's real.

00:07:54.000 The name calling you got to get past because it's coming for you one way or another.

00:07:57.000 And, you know, unless you subscribe to all of the woke ideals, they're coming for you.

00:08:02.000 You can't put enough chips in the bag for them not to turn on you.

00:08:05.000 But I do think there are a few of us who just kind of don't care.

00:08:08.000 And it's some on the center left, some on the center right.

00:08:12.000 You know, I think people on the established right, for the most part, are good, sort of saying how they feel.

00:08:17.000 But there's a collection of us closer to the center that have had some love for the main from the mainstream media.

00:08:22.000 And I think those of us who have been have managed to sort of break free of those chains are important to this fight, right?

00:08:30.000 Because we're a little bit closer to the ones we need to get on our side and in our army.

00:08:34.000 Do you find yourself becoming more conservative the more you see this nonsense?

00:08:41.000 Has it changed your views at all, or has it just made you speak out against this nonsense more?

00:08:46.000 I mean, I don't know if I'm, I'm certainly more conservative than I was when I was in my young 20s for sure.

00:08:53.000 It's tough to say because I'm just not ideological.

00:08:56.000 I don't think of myself as a political person.

00:08:58.000 I'm more like the lawyer that wants the arguments on both sides.

00:09:01.000 And I know when I feel comfortable, you know, somebody's giving me enough evidence.

00:09:03.000 I'm like, all right, I'm good.

00:09:05.000 But I'm not somebody who can't listen to a liberal talk about why their ideas are better without feeling upset or anger.

00:09:13.000 You know what I mean?

00:09:14.000 Like, I still like the intellectual exercise.

00:09:17.000 It's like Frank McCourt wrote, it's like chewing rubies in your mouth when you get really smart people talking about their ideals, even if you don't agree with them.

00:09:27.000 So I guess overall, look, I would say on the ideological scale, one through 10, you know, one being like a far left liberal wokesters and 10 being, you know, far, far right.

00:09:38.000 I don't know.

00:09:38.000 I won't even say MAGA.

00:09:39.000 I'm just talking about like crazy, crazy far right.

00:09:43.000 I'd probably like a 6.5.

00:09:46.000 You know, I used to have some issues that I was more like a four on.

00:09:50.000 I don't know.

00:09:50.000 The social ground is shifting so quickly under my feet.

00:09:53.000 I don't know what the hell I am, Charlie, but I just, I'm a registered independent.

00:09:57.000 I think that sums me up.

00:09:58.000 And I'm not trying to label you.

00:10:00.000 I'm just interested in whether or not their campaign to destroy America's core ideas and ideals, right?

00:10:07.000 Is it bringing people more to the right, or is it just the way that we measure it, has it changed itself?

00:10:12.000 I'm just curious at that.

00:10:14.000 So I don't see it like that. 0.81

00:10:14.000 So the way I see it is they're sane and insane. 0.81

00:10:17.000 And this 10, 11% of wokesters are in the insane camp, and we're all against them. 1.00

00:10:22.000 And that's why I always remind my friends who are established right: don't cut our army in half.

00:10:28.000 Because, you know, I've been in New York City for the past 20 years.

00:10:31.000 All my friends are liberals.

00:10:32.000 I've got like one Republican friend of my girlfriend's.

00:10:35.000 They're with us.

00:10:36.000 They love what you're doing.

00:10:38.000 They love what I'm doing. 0.96

00:10:39.000 We don't need to exclude them from our army and fighting these insane lunatics. 0.99

00:10:43.000 We don't have to agree on taxes or abortion in order to fight that particular battle, which I agree is threatening our country. 0.83

00:10:51.000 So how do we do that then?

00:10:52.000 Because I'm probably doing the worst job of that.

00:10:54.000 How do we like not be excluding and like build kind of magnanimous relationships with Manhattanites?

00:10:59.000 I'm not, I'm not sure how to do that.

00:11:01.000 I don't think we need to demonize them.

00:11:03.000 You know, I think in order to get those folks to work with us, you know, we shouldn't be saying like every day the left does this, the left does all that, because some on the left are lunatics, but a lot are pretty cool and pretty reasonable and just whatever.

00:11:15.000 They don't make a lot of money.

00:11:16.000 So they like Democrats' tax policy, right?

00:11:17.000 They want to tax the rich. 0.63

00:11:18.000 I mean, I know these people.

00:11:19.000 I'm related to a lot of them.

00:11:21.000 They're not people who are working against us on the core things that we really care about.

00:11:25.000 Now, it's not somebody, you're not going to convince somebody who's pro-choice to join a pro-life army.

00:11:31.000 I get that.

00:11:32.000 But on this stuff, like getting out and protesting against CRT, against this crazy radical trans ideology, it's really damaging to children. 0.77

00:11:39.000 It's abusive to children.

00:11:42.000 Even on protesting a lot of the COVID bizarre mandates from masks to vaccines and children and so on, it's almost like you just agree to table all the other stuff.

00:11:52.000 You can fight those good fights on another day.

00:11:54.000 But right now, we have a really important fight we all need to get all hands on deck for.

00:11:59.000 And when we're fighting those battles, just don't talk about the other stuff.

00:12:04.000 It's back to school time, and you may be feeling the burden of college bills or private tuition school expenses.

00:12:10.000 With home equity at a all-time high and interest rates low, refinancing your house could be a great way to get some cash and pay out those bills.

00:12:16.000 But look, I'm going to cut it to you straight.

00:12:18.000 Stop using banks to refinance your home that hate you.

00:12:21.000 Every big bank hates you.

00:12:22.000 They hate your values.

00:12:23.000 They hate your worldview.

00:12:24.000 They want to take our guns away.

00:12:26.000 They fund Planned Parenthood.

00:12:27.000 Enough.

00:12:27.000 So let's go with the good guys.

00:12:28.000 I got two good friends.

00:12:29.000 These guys love the Lord.

00:12:31.000 They love their country.

00:12:32.000 They're really fun people.

00:12:34.000 They're down to earth.

00:12:35.000 It's Andrew Del Rey and Todd Avakian at andrewandTodd.com.

00:12:40.000 They are with Sierra Pacific Mortgage, people I know and trust with them, and you should too.

00:12:44.000 So it's super simple.

00:12:45.000 Anything you need for a home loan, anything at all, refinance, take out a loan.

00:12:50.000 Don't go to Chase.

00:12:51.000 Don't go to Wealth Fargo.

00:12:52.000 Definitely don't go to Goldman Sachs.

00:12:54.000 I don't think many people would because I don't think they have a retail operation.

00:12:57.000 Don't go to this brick and mortar nonsense of these people that are woke USA, wearing two masks, take your money and deposit it, charge you fees, and then say, oh, let's take out a loan.

00:13:07.000 By the way, the money we make is going to go fund the downfall of America.

00:13:11.000 Done with that.

00:13:12.000 Instead, just go to andrewandtodd.com.

00:13:14.000 Again, these are two patriots who love the Lord and they love their country.

00:13:18.000 Take 30 seconds to answer a couple questions.

00:13:20.000 That gives them the info they need and gives you value information often on the first call.

00:13:25.000 Andrew and Todd, they are not brokers.

00:13:27.000 They are bankers, which means they can handle your loan from start to finish.

00:13:31.000 So you always have someone in your corner.

00:13:32.000 Again, they're honest.

00:13:34.000 They are great people.

00:13:36.000 I've got to know them so well.

00:13:37.000 So take that first step towards getting the cash you need today.

00:13:40.000 Stop taking out loans from banks that hate you.

00:13:44.000 Go to andrewandtodd.com.

00:13:46.000 AndrewandTodd.com.

00:13:47.000 Call 888-888-1172.

00:13:49.000 That's 888-888-1172.

00:13:52.000 Go to andrewandtodd.com.

00:13:54.000 I'm about to use them for something at andrewandtodd.com.

00:13:57.000 They've been so easy to work with.

00:14:00.000 And you know what gives me some peace at night?

00:14:02.000 I know that when I use them, they love the Lord and they love the flag and they love the country.

00:14:08.000 It really makes me feel good about it.

00:14:10.000 AndrewandTodd.com.

00:14:12.000 Start supporting the good guys and stop taking out loans of people that hate you and hate your values.

00:14:20.000 And that's the essence of building a coalition, which I think is so sorely needed right now.

00:14:26.000 Yeah, I'm not sure how I see it, which is kind of how, and you would know because you live there, what percentage of the people in Manhattan or New York actually support this stuff.

00:14:36.000 And maybe it's a very vocal minority, or maybe people are just voting passively for stuff they don't quite agree with.

00:14:43.000 But let's just focus on the trans issue.

00:14:45.000 You know, what you just said out loud is, you know, when I say that I get picketed and protested or whatever, you know, most people aren't even allowed to say that, you know, giving puety blockers to seven-year-olds is a bad thing, which it obviously is.

00:15:00.000 I'm just curious, just kind of in what you see, do you really believe that there is a majority of people that stand against it?

00:15:06.000 Because we're not always seeing that reflected in public policy.

00:15:09.000 Is it just people are afraid to take it on?

00:15:12.000 I do believe.

00:15:12.000 I do believe that the majority is against it.

00:15:14.000 Absolutely.

00:15:16.000 And I think New York is tough to, it's tough to use as the benchmark.

00:15:19.000 It went 87% for Biden.

00:15:21.000 I mean, it is a far left city.

00:15:24.000 And I do think it's woke.

00:15:26.000 I do think there's a fair amount of people who aren't, right?

00:15:29.000 I mean, I know all my liberal friends aren't, but having just left the schools and understood who was on the school boards and driving policy, they weren't just left.

00:15:37.000 They were woke and thus had to be left.

00:15:40.000 But like I just visited my good girlfriends in the Midwest, Chicago and Detroit.

00:15:45.000 They're from.

00:15:47.000 100% not woke.

00:15:49.000 And my one gal is, she's 100% liberal, progressive. 0.59

00:15:53.000 You know, there's not a Democrat she hasn't voted for.

00:15:55.000 She hates Trump.

00:15:57.000 Not woke in the least, right?

00:16:00.000 So it's like they're out there, but they would never take the helm on an issue this divisive because they recognize where the media is and that there's no benefit for them to speak up publicly.

00:16:12.000 Well, I think that's one of the advantages of the school board movement is that it's one thing to see a cable news segment about, you know, wokeism and what it means or Christopher Rufo's take on wokeism.

00:16:26.000 Like, okay, yeah, I don't agree with that.

00:16:28.000 And then all of a sudden your five-year-old comes home and you're like, oh, yeah, by the way, the white kids go to this classroom and the black kids go to this classroom. 0.54

00:16:35.000 And the Bernie Sanders, you know, bumper sticker Prius driving, you know, liberal mom is like, wait a second, what? 1.00

00:16:43.000 Like that, and it's kind of all of a sudden, there's this, there's this confusion that sets in.

00:16:50.000 Can you talk about the educational piece?

00:16:52.000 Because I think that's actually what is moving people more than anything else, especially in that kind of demographic you describe.

00:16:58.000 I think you're exactly right.

00:17:00.000 And I think it's why we had the National School Board Association or National Association of School Boards write that letter and that we now know, thanks to parents defending education, a great group that's fighting against this nonsense, they subpoenaed or they FOIA'd the board members on the NASB because their stuff's not protected and it's publicly accessible.

00:17:21.000 Anyway, they got it.

00:17:22.000 And now we know they coordinated with the White House before they wrote that letter, before, right?

00:17:26.000 So the fix was in.

00:17:28.000 And then they wrote the letter and within a couple of days, Merrick Garland was like, yes, we got you.

00:17:33.000 FBI, we're going to sick them on parents. 1.00

00:17:34.000 Was that all because they felt altruistic and really thought this was wrong? 0.95

00:17:38.000 No, what nonsense.

00:17:40.000 They recognized how effective these parents are and how damaging these images are.

00:17:46.000 And the messaging, I mean, the parents who will not be silenced, who won't let go of the mics because they want America to hear what's happening.

00:17:56.000 God bless those parents.

00:17:58.000 In the same way you and I probably sat in our separate locations saying, right on.

00:18:03.000 They sat in their separate locations saying, oh my God, we've got to silence them.

00:18:08.000 Like we've got to do something about this.

00:18:09.000 This is, we're going to lose this fight.

00:18:11.000 That's why the White House wanted this to happen.

00:18:14.000 And when I, like, I experienced everything, I feel like almost the canary in the coal mine in this having come from New York City private schools, which are about as woke as they come.

00:18:23.000 I mean, truly, I've seen all the national stories.

00:18:25.000 I don't think there's a group more woke than the New York City private schools.

00:18:30.000 And I left because my husband and I did a year plus investigation, like, can we change it?

00:18:35.000 You know, like, do, can it, can we fight the battle and win it?

00:18:39.000 And really came to the conclusion that in New York, the answer was no.

00:18:41.000 Talked to people who are billionaires who had donated tens of millions to some of these schools whose views were completely dismissed.

00:18:48.000 No one cared. 0.96

00:18:49.000 You know, they were like, if you're not woke, piss off. 0.98

00:18:52.000 Don't care about your tens of millions. 0.98

00:18:53.000 You can take your library back.

00:18:55.000 So it didn't seem like the tide was going our way.

00:18:58.000 But the reason I spoke out about it after leaving is because I wanted to throw a lifeline to the parents who are still stuck there, unable to say anything because the tide is against them.

00:19:06.000 And they're all worried about little junior getting into Harvard or whatever.

00:19:09.000 And the instinct is to not be a squeaky wheel.

00:19:12.000 But I'll tell you, Charlie, you just to short form my one story.

00:19:16.000 At our school, the messaging that being circulated was literally, literally, they're quoting this so-called scholar saying, in every classroom where a white children, where a white child learns, there is a future killer cop.

00:19:30.000 I mean, that was the messaging that we need studies on white mothers and why they are indoctrinating their children in black death. 0.98

00:19:39.000 Okay.

00:19:40.000 I'm like, what?

00:19:42.000 I could go on the transgender education program that was forced on my third grade boy, who was only eight at the time, which we found out about at a parent-teacher meeting when one of our fellow parents, a dad, raised his hand and said, Why did my son come home and ask if it's true that he was taught in, he was taught in school and he wanted to know if it was true that he could take a pill to prevent puberty. 0.96

00:20:03.000 And then at age 18, he could have a surgery to cut off his penis and then he would be a woman. 1.00

00:20:08.000 We, I mean, we were all like, what? 1.00

00:20:11.000 Sure enough, it happened.

00:20:13.000 They didn't even try to deny it.

00:20:15.000 And their defense was, we take the discussion where the boys wanted to, oh, no, you know, you don't.

00:20:20.000 You do not.

00:20:21.000 If my kid comes in and says, mom's expecting another baby, not sure we want one.

00:20:25.000 What are our options?

00:20:26.000 Are you going to answer?

00:20:27.000 No, you are not.

00:20:29.000 Some things are not appropriate between a teacher and a student.

00:20:32.000 Never mind students as young as eight.

00:20:34.000 And I'm seeing all of this spread across America to the Midwest, to Iowa, you name it.

00:20:41.000 And it's real.

00:20:41.000 Yes.

00:20:43.000 Well, and, you know, Megan, I'm sensing from you, which I sense from others, like this righteous indignation, which is like, yeah, you're not going to do this to my kid.

00:20:51.000 And we'll pull out, we'll declare war on the school.

00:20:54.000 But can you talk about that?

00:20:55.000 Because so many of our listeners feel trapped.

00:20:57.000 They feel trapped in Seattle, Portland, Los Angeles.

00:21:00.000 What was the moment?

00:21:01.000 And can you just get more detailed into like what was the calculation of we're going to pull out or we're going to stay?

00:21:08.000 Because people are struggling and wrestling with that all the time.

00:21:12.000 I mean, I think once we realized we couldn't win, you know, the Sun Tzu art of war, right?

00:21:17.000 If outmatched, don't fight.

00:21:19.000 We didn't want to spin our wheels because every day was another day of abuse.

00:21:24.000 I mean, this is not victimless.

00:21:28.000 And day by day, while you can counter program as we had been with our kids, you can't let the messaging go on and the abuse go on day by day by day and not expect it to have some effect.

00:21:40.000 And, you know, we looked at our son, now he's 12.

00:21:43.000 At the time we pulled him, I guess he was 10.

00:21:46.000 His two best friends, one is brown, one is black, right?

00:21:49.000 It was an Indian kid and a black kid.

00:21:50.000 And we talked to their parents.

00:21:52.000 They were as outraged about it as we were.

00:21:54.000 They were taking three beautiful boys in the midst of a great friendship and driving wedges between them that didn't exist.

00:21:59.000 And you want to know how you really fight racism?

00:22:01.000 You expose your kids to all sorts of kids of different races and backgrounds.

00:22:05.000 And they just grow up understanding that difference is fine.

00:22:08.000 It doesn't need to be divisive.

00:22:11.000 And they don't even think about it.

00:22:13.000 You know, that beautiful sort of innocence they have as kids stays with them.

00:22:16.000 Nope, they were going exactly the opposite way.

00:22:19.000 So, I mean, when I saw that letter being circulated at the school that they wanted to be mandatory reading for the faculty about in every classroom where white children learn, I sent it to the superintendent of the school, the head of school, and said, the answer to racism is not more racism.

00:22:36.000 And he didn't care.

00:22:38.000 He wasn't bothered by it at all.

00:22:40.000 And that's when I knew we're out.

00:22:41.000 And Ibram X. Kendi has said that.

00:22:43.000 He said that the answer to segregation from yesterday is segregation today.

00:22:48.000 He has said that explicitly.

00:22:52.000 Did you know that if you shop at Nike, they turn around and give your hard-earned dollars to pro-abortion groups like Planned Parenthood and the Population Council?

00:22:59.000 Did you know that Airbnb gave $500,000 to the Marxist Black Lives Matter organization?

00:23:05.000 Your first vote is at the ballot box, but that isn't enough to defend our traditional Judeo-Christian values.

00:23:11.000 Left-wing corporations are subverting our democracy by taking money from conservative customers and giving it to radical organizations that support abortion, gun control, and critical race theory.

00:23:22.000 You have another vote, a second vote at the checkout line.

00:23:25.000 And that is where massively important organizations called Second Vote come in.

00:23:30.000 The courageous people at Second Vote are exposing corporations for how they spend your money.

00:23:34.000 Check out secondvote.com today.

00:23:37.000 Second Vote is developing incredible tools and engaging the smartest minds in the country to help inform Americans' purchasing decisions.

00:23:44.000 What if I told you Chick-fil-A is not all that you might think it is?

00:23:46.000 Well, their work is arduous, complex, and exhaustive.

00:23:50.000 It doesn't happen for free.

00:23:51.000 Please support their work so we can defend our future from the woke Marxist mob.

00:23:56.000 So, here's what I want you to do: go right now to secondvote.com and subscribe.

00:23:59.000 It's just $50 a year.

00:24:01.000 But if you use promo code Charlie, you get 50% off.

00:24:04.000 It's literally $2 a month, everybody.

00:24:06.000 And you get 50% off the information you need to have before you make your next purchase.

00:24:10.000 Do not buy products from people that hate you.

00:24:13.000 Don't buy products from people that are funding the downfall of America.

00:24:17.000 Join me, go to secondvote.com and subscribe with promo code Charlie today.

00:24:24.000 So I need to ask you: what is your opinion now with the country in the condition that it's in?

00:24:31.000 I would say it's falling apart of Donald Trump and kind of his presidency and what he did.

00:24:38.000 Just the floor is yours.

00:24:39.000 What's your take on him and what he did?

00:24:42.000 You know, it's funny, Charlie, because the day before the election, was it the day before or the day of, I did a long podcast about Trump versus Biden and what the considerations were going in.

00:24:53.000 And obviously, I understand why, you know, Trump is criticizable, right?

00:24:57.000 I understand his weaknesses.

00:24:58.000 He's definitely a thin-skinned guy who picks petty fights and says stuff that, you know, you probably shouldn't say in polite company and all that.

00:25:05.000 And Biden, you know, for the most part, you know, he knows how to behave in front of the cameras.

00:25:10.000 I mean, he's drooling half the time, but he doesn't say the stuff that Trump said, right?

00:25:14.000 Probably cannot anymore.

00:25:16.000 He probably cannot form a sentence.

00:25:19.000 But what he's done has been so incredibly divisive, and the media won't cover it, right?

00:25:23.000 They have you believe that Donald Trump is the devil incarnate.

00:25:26.000 And they don't, they give Biden a complete pass on the most divisive policies like taking away due process from young men who get accused on college campuses.

00:25:36.000 He wants to go back to his old boss, Barack Obama's rules of you don't get a lawyer, you don't get the right to discovery, you don't get the right to cross-examine your accuser.

00:25:43.000 You get tried in a kangaroo court that's your so-called jury is full of victims' rights advocates.

00:25:48.000 The fix is in, and when you get kicked out of school and labeled a sex offender, there's virtually no right of appeal.

00:25:53.000 He's the racist remarks that Biden has made over and over and over, complete pass, not to mention his son, who's used the N-word repeatedly, we now know.

00:26:02.000 Whereas Donald Trump Jr., my God, if he ever had that.

00:26:07.000 The stuff that Biden has done with respect to trying to award in the school system, writings based on Kendi and D'Angelo and the 1619 project.

00:26:15.000 Are you kidding me?

00:26:16.000 Right?

00:26:17.000 I mean, I could go on that helping only the black farmers and not the white farmers, even though the socioeconomic disparity between the two of them might favor the black farmer. 0.61

00:26:26.000 Doesn't matter.

00:26:26.000 It's all about skin color, right?

00:26:28.000 The vaccine mandates now after saying he would never do it and now forcing it.

00:26:33.000 And by the way, over the objection of many in the black community for whom he claims to care so much, right?

00:26:40.000 Allowing this CRT to make its way into our school agendas, dividing kids by the skin color over which they have no control.

00:26:46.000 It's insanely divisive.

00:26:49.000 And that's why the day he was, he won and went out there and said, it's all about unity now.

00:26:56.000 I mocked it.

00:26:57.000 I mocked it openly on social media.

00:26:59.000 And, you know, everybody was like, she's defending Trump.

00:27:02.000 And he's like, you know what?

00:27:02.000 He doesn't want unity.

00:27:03.000 He just wants submission.

00:27:05.000 He wants you to unify behind his agenda, which is incredibly divisive.

00:27:10.000 Why would anybody do that?

00:27:11.000 Because we are talking about the destruction of fundamental principles that we've agreed to live by for many, many years-from due process to free speech to equal protection, all of which he wants to throw out the window.

00:27:24.000 Yes.

00:27:24.000 So I don't, you know, I get that Donald Trump says not nice things.

00:27:29.000 And, you know, people understandably think he's thin-skinned.

00:27:32.000 That's okay.

00:27:34.000 Everybody has flaws.

00:27:36.000 I could make the case all day long that this president is far more divisive than the last.

00:27:40.000 Yeah, and destructive.

00:27:42.000 So, I want to pick up on one of those things you mentioned, which is one of the fruits of the Enlightenment, which is equal protection and the presumption of innocence.

00:27:50.000 You know, kind of talk about Me Too, where I'm not saying you were part of that movement, but there was definitely some would characterize, you know, part of kind of what you went through and how it was kind of cataloged.

00:28:02.000 Where did Me Too go wrong?

00:28:04.000 Do you think it's gone too far?

00:28:06.000 Because now it's being put into policy where people are losing their potential legal protections on college campuses.

00:28:12.000 And this doesn't get as much coverage now, but this is an element of the kind of woke world, which is if you're a man, you're bad, and you don't get any sort of rights.

00:28:22.000 Please talk about that.

00:28:24.000 It's deeply problematic.

00:28:26.000 You know, if you watch that movie Bombshell, which tried to capture Ailes's, I did watch the movie.

00:28:32.000 Yeah.

00:28:32.000 Oh, you did?

00:28:33.000 Okay.

00:28:33.000 So you'll see that the woman playing me kept saying, I'm not a feminist, right?

00:28:38.000 But I sort of pulled myself, pulled, I was pulled into this sort of Me Too moment.

00:28:43.000 And I, and that's true.

00:28:44.000 And the reason I've never called myself a feminist is because I do think feminism is associated with hatred of men.

00:28:51.000 It's also, it connotes a certain position on various social platforms that I may or may not have.

00:28:56.000 I haven't, I don't talk about those issues as a journalist, but I'm certainly not signing on to those publicly.

00:29:01.000 And I just find it very, very divisive.

00:29:05.000 You know, as the mother of two young boys and the mother of a young girl, I don't feel the need to prioritize one over the other.

00:29:12.000 I don't think my daughter's empowerment should come at the expense of my sons.

00:29:16.000 And so I did have conflicting feelings about sort of being held up as this, I don't know, folks model for the Me Too movement.

00:29:25.000 I don't know what you'd say.

00:29:26.000 It was something I was dragged into, I don't know, sort of not against my will, but just not exactly of my own choosing.

00:29:34.000 But when faced with a question of what Roger Ailes was, you know, and whether I was going to tell my story or not, there was no question in my mind what the right thing to do was.

00:29:44.000 The Me Too movement, I want to start with this.

00:29:48.000 It has done a lot of good.

00:29:50.000 And I know that because, given my role, I get letters from young women all the time, like thanking me they were in an abusive situation and now they've gotten out of it, right?

00:29:59.000 So it's one of those things where you can't just bash it all together.

00:30:04.000 So, and I, those things bring tears to my eyes when I find out how women have gotten out of abusive situations with bad bosses and so on. 0.91

00:30:11.000 However, it's been weaponized.

00:30:14.000 It's lost credibility, all credibility.

00:30:16.000 I mean, virtually all.

00:30:18.000 Thanks to things like Kavanaugh.

00:30:21.000 That was really the watershed moment in the Me Too movement that killed it.

00:30:24.000 It was totally weaponized against him.

00:30:26.000 None of those claims held water. 0.93

00:30:29.000 The whole thing got driven by an insane lunatic lawyer, Michael Avenatti, who started alleging gang rape with absolutely no support.

00:30:36.000 By the way, NBC was fine going to air with those allegations, but held on for months, not reporting on Harvey Weinstein because they allegedly didn't have the story.

00:30:44.000 Oh, okay.

00:30:45.000 All right.

00:30:46.000 And I think now, especially when there's a politician involved or somebody who's political in any way, the movement has zero credibility.

00:30:53.000 Look at Time's Up.

00:30:54.000 Look at Time's Up.

00:30:54.000 The entire board had to resign because that organization cared more about access to power than actually protecting any women.

00:31:00.000 So I think to the extent it's given young women the idea that they don't have to take it, that no is an available option to them when their boss tries to paw them or condition advancement on sexual favors.

00:31:12.000 It did good.

00:31:13.000 It did some good.

00:31:15.000 But that's in no way an endorsement of the whole thing because it's gone too far and it's become weaponized to take out, you know, either political people or people who are just unpopular, who you might not like, right?

00:31:25.000 Like some, maybe some guy who did nothing.

00:31:27.000 But there are some women who are opportunists and misuse it. 1.00

00:31:34.000 Look, I often talk about the crushing debt and lack of jobs that come with the broken college system in our country and how entering a trade or vocational school can provide great career opportunities where your skills will always be in demand.

00:31:47.000 I want to talk to you about the American Institute of Non-Destructive Testing.

00:31:51.000 If you go to trainingndt.com, that's trainingndt.com, you can learn how to have an opportunity to work in industries such as aerospace, oil, gas, nuclear, and alternative energy as a technician performing critical inspections that make our world a safer place.

00:32:07.000 The American Institute of Non-Destructive Testing provides 93% job placement, and graduates enjoy a starting wage of about $50,000 a year.

00:32:17.000 You can earn $60,000, $70,000 or even $80,000 yearly within a couple years as a technician.

00:32:22.000 Their program consists of six months online education followed by three weeks at the American Institute campus using state-of-the-art inspection equipment such as ultrasonics, capturing x-rays, and producing magnetic fields to inspect critical components to ensure their safety and reliability.

00:32:36.000 If you're looking for a career shift or if you are in high school and you're not sure what you want to do, I want you to know that Don Booth, the CEO, is a patriot and his whole team cares deeply about the future of every graduate.

00:32:47.000 Go to trainingndt.com to learn about this exciting and rewarding career.

00:32:51.000 Check it out, everybody.

00:32:52.000 Trainingndt.com.

00:32:54.000 Check it out.

00:32:55.000 It's a wonderful program, trainingndt.com.

00:33:01.000 So we have a lot of young women that listen to this podcast. 0.99

00:33:04.000 Can you speak to how that balance needs to be articulated and how we have to strike that balance?

00:33:10.000 Because sometimes I'm afraid that women have an expectation that if they go into workplace, it's there and they must find it.

00:33:18.000 They must root it out and become an activist before ever experiencing anything. 0.92

00:33:23.000 And so can you talk about in your own personal experience and how you say you obviously don't want it to become an anti-man movement, which it has, unfortunately, but also that it's a legitimate thing and some men are awful pigs like Harvey Weinstein and that people have a right to speak out.

00:33:38.000 How do we strike that balance without tearing down our entire society?

00:33:42.000 I wish we could do that.

00:33:44.000 I think women need to remember, you know, in general, lighten up is a good piece of advice for life. 1.00

00:33:50.000 Just lighten up.

00:33:52.000 People are complicated.

00:33:53.000 Men are complicated.

00:33:55.000 Men and women and their relationship is complicated, especially in the workplace setting.

00:33:59.000 And men don't stop being men just because they find themselves in the office.

00:34:02.000 You know, they've been chasing us for thousands of years and we like it.

00:34:06.000 We like it.

00:34:07.000 Now, that doesn't mean you should ignore power dynamics, especially as a guy in the office setting, right?

00:34:15.000 If the man is in the position of power or the woman, but who's ever in the position of power, it's very fraught with peril to chase somebody who's beneath you.

00:34:21.000 That's the Matt Lauer situation, right?

00:34:23.000 Where women said yes, even though they didn't want to say yes, they were afraid of him.

00:34:27.000 Not all of them.

00:34:28.000 I'm just saying I know some.

00:34:29.000 They're afraid of him.

00:34:30.000 And as the guy, you just never know, you know, you just never know.

00:34:33.000 And that's just not a smart move.

00:34:36.000 But I think, let me take you back to one of the reasons I got into journalism.

00:34:39.000 A woman named Ricky Kleeman was a badass prosecutor in Boston for many, many years. 1.00

00:34:44.000 She's married now to Bill Bratton, the guy who cleaned up New York under Giuliani.

00:34:47.000 Then he went out and was chief police in LA and so on.

00:34:50.000 And she, before she met Bill Bratton, was his kick-ass prosecutor.

00:34:55.000 She went to court one day in Boston.

00:34:57.000 She wrote about this in her book.

00:34:59.000 And the judge was like, oh, Ms. Kleeman, you're late to court.

00:35:02.000 Oh, I'm so sorry, Your Honor.

00:35:04.000 He's like, you know how you can make it up to me?

00:35:06.000 She's in front of a whole courtroom.

00:35:08.000 Why don't you do a pirouette in front of this bench? 0.89

00:35:12.000 Now, she writes about how she thought to herself, okay, I could stick it to this guy right now, like totally inappropriate judge.

00:35:18.000 Who do you think you're talking to?

00:35:21.000 Or I could play ball.

00:35:23.000 And you know what she did?

00:35:24.000 She went up on one toe. 1.00

00:35:27.000 She put her arms out.

00:35:28.000 She spun around as beautifully and perfectly as she could.

00:35:32.000 And she took a deep bow with a big smile and completely won that judge over. 1.00

00:35:39.000 I can make all the arguments about how it was a sexist moment and blah, blah, blah.

00:35:43.000 You know what?

00:35:43.000 She did the right thing.

00:35:44.000 Women should realize not everything has to become a federal case. 1.00

00:35:49.000 Some people say dumbass things. 1.00

00:35:50.000 They're sexist. 1.00

00:35:51.000 Sometimes they're racist.

00:35:53.000 Whatever.

00:35:54.000 People are complicated and no one has it all figured out and people will misstep.

00:35:59.000 And I don't want to live in a world where nobody missteps.

00:36:02.000 So laugh at them, laugh at yourself, laugh at this crazy life.

00:36:07.000 Don't take anything or anyone too seriously, least of all yourself.

00:36:11.000 But when you realize you are in actual trouble, you know, when you, that's sort of how it went with me and ails.

00:36:16.000 You know, he made baudy remarks.

00:36:19.000 He was like, he crossed lines.

00:36:20.000 You're talking about my bras and my breasts.

00:36:22.000 And I'm like, okay, this is not good.

00:36:24.000 But I laughed and laughed and laughed it off.

00:36:26.000 But then when he grabbed me and tried to shove his tongue down my throat three times in the office setting, and then when I wouldn't do it, asked me when my contract was up.

00:36:32.000 I knew we'd crossed a new line.

00:36:34.000 Even then, I didn't file a lawsuit, but I hired a lawyer.

00:36:38.000 I made a record of it.

00:36:39.000 I told the supervisor.

00:36:40.000 I started reaching out to other women, right?

00:36:42.000 So it's like, you got to go by instinct.

00:36:44.000 And I do think grace, forgiveness, understanding humanity is a big part of the process before you get to red line.

00:36:53.000 Let's go.

00:36:55.000 And what you're talking about is nuance, which is definitely missing in our country and in our society where there's just an overgeneralization to try to indict people just because you think they might kind of fit a certain archetype.

00:37:07.000 Talk a little bit about in our closing here about your podcast, what you're trying to do with it, some of the guests you've been having on.

00:37:14.000 I kind of like how you're not allowing people to pinpoint you.

00:37:16.000 You're saying some things that people would deem very conservative and then some things that people would deem liberal.

00:37:21.000 I think these labels all are kind of meaningless. 0.76

00:37:23.000 Like, are you sane or insane?

00:37:24.000 I think is a perfect framing.

00:37:25.000 But talk about what you're working on now: the podcast, the guests you're having on, the work you're trying to get them.

00:37:32.000 I mean, I would say it's sort of, you know, Megan Kelly, nobody's sycophant.

00:37:37.000 You know, I'm really not tribal in my approach to the news, and I never have been.

00:37:43.000 I think that's why I did well on Fox, because people knew they could come to me for the straight skinny, but that they weren't going to be getting, you know, a liberal in conservatives clothing, right?

00:37:54.000 Like that was never me either.

00:37:56.000 And that's kind of what I'm trying to do here.

00:37:58.000 Just be honest about the news, no matter what it is.

00:38:01.000 I don't have blind loyalty to either party. 0.99

00:38:04.000 If somebody behaves like an ass, I'm fine calling them out on it. 0.98

00:38:07.000 I tend to not get personal in my attacks. 0.99

00:38:11.000 Though if somebody really earns it, they'll get it.

00:38:14.000 Hi, Don Lemon.

00:38:15.000 Hi, looking at you.

00:38:18.000 And I just think it's sort of maybe it's me unleashed, right?

00:38:21.000 At Fox, you kind of understood there was only so far you could go if it was a Republican in trouble.

00:38:26.000 And at NBC, it was, of course, you know, originally I thought I wasn't going to be doing politics there, but the amount of editorial control they tried to exercise over everything was just insufferable and always in one direction.

00:38:37.000 And so now I'm just free.

00:38:39.000 And I think people understand I'm more fair and balanced at heart than your average journalist.

00:38:43.000 We've been having on everybody.

00:38:44.000 I mean, like Glenn and John McWhorter are two great examples, Glenn Lowry and John McWhorter.

00:38:49.000 But we also had on Ryan Holiday, this guy on, he's a stoic.

00:38:51.000 He's on, he talks about stoicism.

00:38:53.000 I had on The Wolf of Wall Street the other day, Jordan Belfort, fascinating X-rated discussion about his life, really interesting stuff.

00:39:00.000 Last year, I had on a cast of Willy Wonka, my favorite movie.

00:39:03.000 I mean, he's like, it's so random, right?

00:39:05.000 But, you know, everybody from true MAGA country, we put on Julie Kelly to talk about what's being done to those January 6th protesters and how messed up that is, to more, you know, liberal people like we had on James Carvel, right?

00:39:19.000 Like across the spectrum, I will say, I don't interview the woke.

00:39:23.000 I'm more in the John McWhorter camp of it's not worth your time.

00:39:27.000 So they don't really have an invitation to come on and it wouldn't go anyway because I don't, I don't like what they're doing.

00:39:33.000 That's super interesting.

00:39:34.000 Is it time just to like say, it's not even worth our time?

00:39:37.000 Like, we're not even going to engage that.

00:39:39.000 Because that's a tell me why.

00:39:41.000 Cause that's pastime.

00:39:43.000 It's a waste of your time.

00:39:44.000 They're not convertible.

00:39:46.000 They're not honest brokers.

00:39:48.000 They're not proceeding in good faith in this discussion.

00:39:50.000 And it's just not winnable.

00:39:52.000 So we have to more forge on without them.

00:39:54.000 They're no good to us.

00:39:54.000 Let's forge on without them.

00:39:55.000 Let's show up our own army.

00:39:57.000 Let's encourage our own people to speak up.

00:39:59.000 And that's the rest of the 90% of the country, right?

00:40:01.000 To speak up, to find their courage, to understand, God forbid you get fired.

00:40:04.000 There's going to be a safe landing spot.

00:40:06.000 You're going to wind up in a better place than you probably began.

00:40:09.000 And if you really know that that's not possible for you, then try to support those who can.

00:40:14.000 And above all, don't join the outrage mob.

00:40:17.000 You might not feel comfortable speaking out against them against them, but don't join them for the love of God.

00:40:22.000 Do not like their tweets on Twitter.

00:40:24.000 Do not signal support for them in any way. 1.00

00:40:27.000 They are evil and they must be destroyed. 0.99

00:40:30.000 Well, I completely agree with that. 0.93

00:40:32.000 Everybody, subscribe to Megan Kelly's show.

00:40:34.000 Super interesting to actually have someone who doesn't wear a partisan jersey say things that are true.

00:40:40.000 I want to make sure that everyone knows that you have a serious XM show, airs on Triumph from 12 to 2, Monday through Friday.

00:40:47.000 I think I'm getting this right.

00:40:48.000 And your podcast, make sure you subscribe.

00:40:51.000 Megan, we have to have you back on.

00:40:52.000 I have so many more questions, but I just want to just encourage you, please keep on speaking out.

00:40:57.000 There are so many people in the political middle that will listen to you a lot more than me.

00:41:01.000 Trust me.

00:41:02.000 And that is something that's important and it's necessary if we want to keep our country.

00:41:06.000 Well, thank you for saying that.

00:41:08.000 And I have to say, I'm a big fan of yours and I listen to you a lot because I love intake from smart people, whether I agree or not.

00:41:15.000 And I agree in a lot of it.

00:41:17.000 I learned from you.

00:41:18.000 I mean, I thought one of your arguments on the life issue was probably the best I'd heard anybody make the case.

00:41:24.000 It was really impressive.

00:41:25.000 So thanks for having me on.

00:41:26.000 And I'd love to have you back on my show one of these days.

00:41:29.000 Come on over to my neighborhood.

00:41:30.000 Thank you, Megan.

00:41:31.000 I appreciate it.

00:41:31.000 Talk to you soon.

00:41:32.000 Thanks so much.

00:41:35.000 Thank you so much for listening, everybody.

00:41:37.000 Email us your thoughts, freedom at charliekirk.com.

00:41:39.000 And if you want to get involved with Turning Point USA, you can do so at tpusa.com.

00:41:43.000 God bless you guys.

00:41:44.000 Speak to you soon.

00:41:47.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.

The Charlie Kirk Show - October 27, 2021

How 'Wokeism' is Waking Up the Masses with Megyn Kelly

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript