The Charlie Kirk Show - November 22, 2023


Is AI Going To Destroy Us, Or Save Us?


Episode Stats


Length

41 minutes

Words per minute

171.1048

Word count

7,021

Sentence count

518

Harmful content

Toxicity

17

sentences flagged

Hate speech

10

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode of What's Going on with Artificial Intelligence, host Joe Allen talks with Turning Point USA President Charlie Kirk about the dangers of artificial intelligence and why it's a bad idea to have a conversation about it with your kids.

Transcript

Transcripts from "The Charlie Kirk Show" are sourced from the Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool. Explore them interactively here.
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 Hey everybody, what's going on with artificial intelligence?
00:00:03.000 Pretty heavy episode here with Joe Allen.
00:00:05.000 I think you'll love it.
00:00:06.000 Email us as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
00:00:08.000 If you want to support our show directly, go to charliekirk.com and click on the members tab.
00:00:13.000 That's charliekirk.com and click on the members tab.
00:00:16.000 Get involved with turning pointusa today at tpusa.com.
00:00:20.000 That is tpusa.com.
00:00:21.000 Start a high school or college chapter today at tpusa.com.
00:00:26.000 Okay, I want to encourage you guys.
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00:02:00.000 Amfest.com, just coming in a couple of weeks, Phoenix, Arizona.
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00:02:07.000 Love seeing all of you taking selfies.
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00:02:46.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
00:02:48.000 Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.
00:02:50.000 I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
00:02:53.000 Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
00:02:57.000 I want to thank Charlie.
00:02:58.000 He's an incredible guy.
00:02:59.000 His spirit, his love of this country.
00:03:01.000 He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
00:03:07.000 We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
00:03:16.000 That's why we are here.
00:03:19.000 Brought to you by the Loan Experts I Trust, Andrew and Todd at Sierra Pacific Mortgage at andrewandTodd.com.
00:03:28.000 There is some serious AI news right now.
00:03:32.000 It is really hard to follow.
00:03:34.000 Joining us now is the expert, Joe Allen, author of Dark Eon.
00:03:39.000 I think I said that right.
00:03:40.000 Joe Allen, Transhumanism, The War Against Humanity.
00:03:44.000 Joe, what is going on with Sam Altman?
00:03:46.000 He leaves.
00:03:46.000 He's back.
00:03:47.000 What is going on here?
00:03:48.000 Well, Charlie, at present, he is back at Open AI.
00:03:52.000 It appears that the board who ousted him is being replaced by a new set of experts, including Larry Summers, incidentally.
00:04:01.000 Altman has long been the sort of face of AI.
00:04:08.000 And it really, when you saw the release of GPT about this time last year, he became, in a sense, the voice of AI and especially AGI.
00:04:20.000 Altman tends towards what's called accelerationism, just the idea that these technologies should be pushed forward as fast as possible, whatever the costs.
00:04:32.000 On the other side of it, members of the board, such as Helen Toner or Adam D'Angelo, they tend much more towards the effective altruist sort of perspective or rationalists.
00:04:45.000 On that end, they also want to see the development of AGI, artificial general intelligence or artificial godlike intelligence.
00:04:56.000 The real difference is how fast you get there and what risks you're willing to accept to have an AI that they believe will be superior to human beings in pretty much every way and will ultimately replace every intellectual job and even as robotics increase, every blue-collar job.
00:05:16.000 So when do they think that will be developed?
00:05:21.000 And I mean, are there any sort of guardrails on the development of this?
00:05:25.000 Some people even claim it's impossible.
00:05:28.000 Some think that we're a year away.
00:05:29.000 What do you think, Joe?
00:05:30.000 You know, it ranges, and I am not going to predict whether or not they will even create AGI or whether they'll do it in the timelines they're talking about.
00:05:41.000 But I will say that I do believe that the AGI projects that we're seeing right now have been built up by such a high degree of hype that it's very likely that something like an AGI will be developed and billed as an AGI.
00:05:58.000 What's really surprised me, Charlie, is how many people that were also fairly skeptical are now talking about timelines of five to seven years for the creation of AGI.
00:06:11.000 That includes Elon Musk, also Sam Altman.
00:06:15.000 And they really, I think, whether they truly believe it or whether it's a sales pitch, what they're doing is cultivating a mindset in the public consciousness that is going to be much more amenable to the existence of AGI, or at the very least, is going to be much more likely to accept the possibility of its existence.
00:06:36.000 What that means is that you will have tech corporations in possession of a technology that they will say is justifiably superior to human beings and therefore should be the source of authority for questions ranging from medicine to military strategy and even the proper upbringing of children.
00:06:57.000 Do you think the government should regulate this?
00:07:00.000 I do believe the government should regulate it.
00:07:02.000 How much effect that would actually have, again, I'm very doubtful.
00:07:06.000 One of the real issues you have, let's say that the government puts stringent regulations in place.
00:07:12.000 Let's say that the government were to take the advice of the people who wrote the open letter coming out of the Future of Life Institute, in which they argued that no AI should be created above the level of GPT-4.
00:07:25.000 That's the current iteration.
00:07:27.000 What you would see almost immediately are the tech corporations in America working on this that ranges from Microsoft with OpenAI, Google with DeepMind, Amazon and Microsoft both with Anthropic, and then a former DeepMind co-founder who founded Inflection AI, on and on.
00:07:46.000 These corporations will simply move overseas.
00:07:49.000 They already have labs overseas.
00:07:51.000 And you would also probably see technology transfers to countries like China, perhaps India, certainly different nations in Europe, including the UK or Germany, so on and so forth.
00:08:04.000 And so it's really a matter of these AI projects are best thought of sort of like Mycelia.
00:08:10.000 And what you see in Silicon Valley is the mushroom.
00:08:12.000 You could destroy all of those mushrooms in Silicon Valley.
00:08:16.000 They will start popping up all over the world.
00:08:20.000 So the kind of understand the flow of capital here is incredible.
00:08:24.000 I mean, OpenAI is the fastest growing tech company ever.
00:08:27.000 It's not even close.
00:08:28.000 And so Sam Altman is back here, and there's allegedly a board and a power struggle.
00:08:35.000 I mean, your analysis seems to be awfully heavy, Joe.
00:08:39.000 It doesn't seem like anything is going to slow these people down.
00:08:42.000 I don't think so.
00:08:43.000 The only thing that would slow them down is their own decision-making processes.
00:08:47.000 And that's really not going to, I just don't see that.
00:08:51.000 I think that's a prediction I can confidently make.
00:08:53.000 These people are so fixated on this.
00:08:55.000 This is, as I argue in my book and have argued for years on the war room, this is a techno-religion.
00:09:01.000 And so to take a more Luddite position or even really cautious position would be tantamount to a sort of blasphemy to them.
00:09:10.000 They see this as the ultimate realization of human endeavor.
00:09:14.000 They believe it will be the kind of culmination or even the justification for human existence.
00:09:20.000 They think that these AI programs will eventually lead to such extended lifespans that people are basically immortal.
00:09:28.000 There will be radical abundance, no want whatsoever.
00:09:31.000 And of course, Elon Musk is the spearhead of this.
00:09:35.000 They believe that AI will enable humans to colonize the solar system and the galaxy, or perhaps the more the darker scenario, that the machines themselves are our successors, our sort of mind children, and that they will, in fact, carry the torch of life and consciousness and reason forward.
00:09:54.000 So as long as this techno-religion persists, and I believe it will, as long as there are technologies that some humans believe are worthy of worship, it will guide the development of these technologies.
00:10:07.000 It will guide the deployment of these technologies.
00:10:11.000 And more and more so, as I mentioned earlier, more and more so, you see it seeping into the public consciousness.
00:10:16.000 You could think of that as sort of the Orthodox church or the exoteric church that reflects the esoteric interests of those in Silicon Valley and elsewhere.
00:10:27.000 Yeah, I mean, there's a whole political angle that we'll explore.
00:10:30.000 This is a way that they'll be able to impose wokeism because somebody has to write the core programming.
00:10:35.000 And we see that with ChatGPT.
00:10:38.000 So can you explain the Microsoft versus OpenAI philosophy?
00:10:42.000 And then also there's BARD from Google as well.
00:10:46.000 Explain that to us.
00:10:48.000 Yeah, so Microsoft invested $10 billion in OpenAI.
00:10:52.000 They have access to their weights, meaning that Microsoft, in effect, now owns the technologies being developed at OpenAI.
00:11:01.000 OpenAI came on the map with DALI, the AI art generator, and also then, of course, ChatGPT.
00:11:10.000 I think it was like 100 million subscribers almost immediately, just completely unprecedented.
00:11:17.000 And Microsoft, you can just think of them really as the corporate arm of what is ultimately an ideological organization.
00:11:26.000 Open AI was founded with Elon Musk and Ilya Sutzkovar, of course, Sam Altman there.
00:11:32.000 And then the ideas that they were working with were somewhere between accelerationism and effective altruism.
00:11:40.000 But all of them wanted to see the creation of this AGI.
00:11:46.000 Microsoft, I think they're probably more interested in profit, but when you have a product like OpenAI is billing a machine that can think like a human or a machine that will eventually think better than a human, you can see where their interests lie.
00:12:01.000 It was those, though, on the effective altruist end of the spectrum at OpenAI that have really been digging their heels in.
00:12:08.000 Of course, that led to the ouster of Sam Altman for just a few days.
00:12:12.000 Microsoft said they would take Sam Altman on.
00:12:15.000 700 of the 770 employees at Open AI said they would go with him.
00:12:20.000 So you can see really where the weight of interest is in the organizations as a whole.
00:12:25.000 Yeah, I mean, I feel incredible darkness around this entire thing.
00:12:29.000 This, you know, they say, oh, we're going to solve all the world's problems.
00:12:32.000 I really haven't met anybody who's excited about this unless you're a very creepy person, honestly.
00:12:37.000 Like if you're creepy and weird and wear a spacesuit, you get excited about this.
00:12:42.000 I get almost nothing but just really, really dark vibes around this.
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00:14:16.000 Joe, there is an undercurrent of the AI talk about inevitability.
00:14:22.000 And so I want to just push back a little bit.
00:14:24.000 We've had you on the show before.
00:14:26.000 There is a chance that some of this is more bluster than rooted in reality, meaning that their Star Trek world they want to create is not exactly seamless.
00:14:40.000 Is there a chance based on what you've seen that AI becomes a glorified parlor trick and some of this kind of vaporizes?
00:14:49.000 And for example, there has been self-driving cars is a good example.
00:14:53.000 By 2018, we were supposed to have nothing but self-driving cars.
00:14:56.000 They're still rare, actually, right now, for a lot of different reasons.
00:15:00.000 So there is a chance.
00:15:01.000 By the way, we could be totally wrong.
00:15:03.000 This stuff could be, we could have sentience in five months, right?
00:15:07.000 Or it could be 50 years and just it turns out the tech can't get to that level.
00:15:13.000 Help us unpack this, Joe Allen.
00:15:15.000 Yeah, Charlie, there's at least two levels of this that really have to be taken into account.
00:15:19.000 You have the advertisement, right?
00:15:22.000 You have the promotion of these things, the hype around them, and then you have the actual product.
00:15:28.000 Oftentimes, almost all the time, the hype outstrips the actual capabilities of the product.
00:15:36.000 What really stunned everybody about ChatGPT, of course, it has been ridiculed for all sorts of good reasons.
00:15:42.000 But the fact remains that there was never a system like this before.
00:15:46.000 This was a dream that was finally coming to realization.
00:15:50.000 The very first chatbot was developed in the 60s, and it basically stayed at that level until roughly 10 or so years ago, and then just really exploded with the development of transformers and the use of transformers by open AI.
00:16:05.000 So, what this means is you're never to take what they're saying at face value.
00:16:10.000 But I think that to simply dismiss everything as just hype is to miss the actual power of these technologies.
00:16:17.000 You'd mentioned self-driving cars.
00:16:20.000 They have certainly lagged behind the promises of Elon Musk or Google, but the self-driving cars as they exist right now are really excellent.
00:16:30.000 They're not perfect, but statistically, they're in fact safer than human drivers.
00:16:35.000 It's a very, very small sample compared to a very large sample, but it's still the fact is that these systems do work.
00:16:44.000 The real barrier is that human beings don't want to crash because a robot screwed up.
00:16:49.000 And there aren't really any ethical norms in place for what happens if a robot runs a child over, for instance.
00:16:55.000 So as we're moving forward into this period, as we're moving into an era in which these tech corporations consolidate more and more power over our politics, over our economies, and most importantly, over the public's consciousness, over our minds, you have to move into it with real skepticism.
00:17:15.000 But again, it would be a real mistake to simply dismiss it all.
00:17:18.000 It's just simply a parlor trick.
00:17:21.000 It's a parlor trick with a fairly impressive rabbit coming out of the hat.
00:17:26.000 Talk about energy.
00:17:27.000 You say the use of transformers.
00:17:29.000 In order to get AI at scale, I'd imagine it's going to require a ton of energy, maybe building entire hydroelectric dams or nuclear power plants.
00:17:38.000 How energy intensive is AI?
00:17:40.000 Extremely.
00:17:41.000 There's a wonderful book by Lefty, and it's very PC, but it's very based as far as energy goes, Kate Crawford's The Atlas of AI.
00:17:52.000 But one of the things that she really emphasizes is for all of their talk of green economies and green energy, AI companies such as Microsoft, Google, so on, they use up enormous amounts of energy in their data centers and their server farms.
00:18:08.000 Right now, Microsoft is working on linking their data centers to small nuclear power plants.
00:18:16.000 So it's going to be extremely energy intensive.
00:18:18.000 And I think the real takeaway from that is that when people like Apple or people like Google come off with these platitudes about green energy, they are among the largest carbon footprints on the planet.
00:18:31.000 They have no standing there.
00:18:33.000 Yeah, it's really remarkable.
00:18:35.000 What can the everyday man do to fight against this obvious dystopian, I think, demonic satanic push from Silicon Valley?
00:18:45.000 Well, number one, brace yourself and prepare to be surprised.
00:18:48.000 Also, prepare to be disappointed.
00:18:50.000 Number two, I think that really, for those who are already rooted in a traditional view of the universe, the specter of an AI God shouldn't really threaten their deepest core beliefs.
00:19:04.000 Now, on the other hand, when one thinks about, for instance, the second beast creating an image of the first beast in Revelation, which can speak and to which all people on the earth should kneel, it does perhaps fit into a traditionalist perspective in a very sinister way.
00:19:26.000 But one way or the other, I think that the real thing that people have to do is decide where their boundaries are, and they will be called to defend them strenuously, just as we are with mass immigration, just as we are with the sexual revolution.
00:19:40.000 Check Joe Allen's doing a tour.
00:19:41.000 We'll put it on CharlieKirk.com, Joe, see you at Amfest.
00:19:44.000 Biggest change to our economy we've seen in hundreds of years.
00:19:49.000 The world is in flames, and Bydonomics is a complete and total disaster.
00:19:53.000 But it won't ruin my day.
00:19:54.000 And that's because I start my day with a hot America first cup of blackout coffee.
00:19:57.000 Now, I've been trying to trim how much coffee I have, but when I have coffee, boom, it's blackout coffee.
00:20:03.000 This coffee is 100% America and 0% Grift.
00:20:06.000 Blackout Coffee is 100% committed to conservative values from sourcing the beans to the roasting process, customer support, and shipping.
00:20:12.000 They embody true American values and accept no compromise on taste or quality.
00:20:16.000 By the way, I was traveling recently and somebody brought me a cup of coffee and it tasted really bad.
00:20:22.000 It was really bad.
00:20:23.000 I said, where's my blackout?
00:20:24.000 And they said, we didn't bring the blackout on this trip.
00:20:27.000 And I was really disappointed.
00:20:28.000 It was a tough day.
00:20:30.000 When you get used to blackout coffee, you know what I mean.
00:20:32.000 Go to blackoutcoffee.com/slash Charlie.
00:20:34.000 Use coupon code Charlie for 20% off your first order.
00:20:36.000 By the way, it's kind of coffee season, isn't it?
00:20:38.000 It gets dark around like 3:30.
00:20:40.000 It's cloudy.
00:20:42.000 It's not exactly the most uplifting weather.
00:20:44.000 You kind of need to pick me up sometimes around 2 p.m.
00:20:46.000 Go to blackoutcoffee.com slash Charlie.
00:20:48.000 Be awake, not woke.
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00:20:52.000 The taste is amazing.
00:20:53.000 It is smooth.
00:20:56.000 And people know that I need my cup of coffee in the morning.
00:20:59.000 Not too much, not over the top.
00:21:01.000 But if it's not blackout, then the mood is not so good.
00:21:04.000 Go to blackoutcoffee.com/slash Charlie.
00:21:04.000 Go south.
00:21:07.000 Blackoutcoffee.com slash Charlie.
00:21:07.000 Great company.
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00:21:13.000 We have been fired up about the MyNot Air Force Base story.
00:21:17.000 And joining us now is Senator Kramer, as well as Mary Greiner and Carmen Sirota, ladies of Another View.
00:21:25.000 Hello, everybody.
00:21:26.000 Welcome to the program.
00:21:27.000 Hey, good to see you.
00:21:28.000 Thanks for having us, Charlie, and thanks for accommodating my doing two shows at once.
00:21:33.000 Oh, yeah, no problem.
00:21:34.000 So, Senator, you sent out a great statement.
00:21:37.000 Thank you for that and your quick response.
00:21:38.000 I deeply appreciate it.
00:21:40.000 This troubling development from the MyNot Air Force Base, what have you learned?
00:21:45.000 I know you have relationships there and you're privately dialoguing.
00:21:48.000 What can you share with our audience in regards to the breaking news story yesterday?
00:21:52.000 So thanks, Charlie, for the opportunity.
00:21:54.000 I did.
00:21:54.000 I sent a text immediately in the morning to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, C.Q. Brown, who is a former chief of staff of the Air Force.
00:22:02.000 And then I had a pretty lengthy telephone conversation with the Chief of Staff at the Air Force, General David Alden, yesterday, as well as a lot of staff back and forth.
00:22:12.000 And what I learned was that, you know, what I learned was somewhat comforting, but not adequate.
00:22:19.000 And what I learned was that one person listening to a radio ad or reference to the event took it upon themselves to send out this little alarm message, if you will, to a number of the sergeants in the Security Forces squadron at the Minota Air Force Base.
00:22:39.000 And so that people understand, Minnett Air Force Base is the only Air Force base in the world that has two of the three legs of the United States military's nuclear triad.
00:22:48.000 They have bombers with nuclear weapons and they have ground-based missiles, the Minuteman missiles.
00:22:55.000 And then they store over half of the United States nuclear weapon system.
00:23:00.000 So they have a lot of responsibility.
00:23:02.000 And so the security squadron, security force squadron is very important.
00:23:07.000 Somewhere along the line with all of these now sergeants and others having this memo or this text message, somebody determined that it was intended to be A security threat message, and they forwarded it out to all of the personnel on the base.
00:23:26.000 Obviously, with misinformation, obviously, you know, turning point is not a threat to the military.
00:23:31.000 If anything, they're the most supportive group of the military have in Mina.
00:23:35.000 So, anyway, here's what concerned me: that it could happen at all, Charlie concerns me.
00:23:39.000 That anybody could mistake your rally in Mina, North Dakota for something that could lead to a confrontation or that somebody could actually be thrown out of the Air Force if they attended.
00:23:51.000 Bad messages, all wrong, you know, and then that there's not a better filter.
00:23:55.000 So, that's my first problem.
00:23:57.000 But the response wasn't great and still isn't great because I don't know if you noticed, but we did because we're keeping close track of it.
00:24:03.000 They did not correct their website or their Facebook page till yesterday afternoon, four days after the event.
00:24:12.000 And so, they were dealing with the internal issue perhaps by sending the correction.
00:24:17.000 They claim they sent a corrected message, rescinding the original one within 52 minutes of the first one going out.
00:24:25.000 Okay, congratulations.
00:24:27.000 Somebody no doubt said, Ah, you might want to take another look at this, and they rescinded it and sent out a new message.
00:24:33.000 But they didn't inform the public of any of this until, well, really, until it became known to you and a whole bunch of other people yesterday.
00:24:41.000 That's inadequate to me.
00:24:43.000 Senator, thank you for addressing that.
00:24:45.000 And I do think we have to get answers from the top level of whether or not there's some sort of policy of conservative groups that are not welcome.
00:24:54.000 What concerned us, Senator, is they said that you might be discharged.
00:24:59.000 I'm paraphrasing, but your service might be put in jeopardy if you indeed attended the rally.
00:25:04.000 And, Senator, I think this is what's troubling a lot of our audience, and thank you for addressing it, is that this seems to be a pattern that we're seeing at certain elements of the military.
00:25:14.000 Our military is the best on the planet with amazing people, but it does seem to be a disturbing pattern of, for example, you know, just the other day we've learned that over $100 million was spent on diversity, equity, and inclusion programming from the Pentagon.
00:25:31.000 Senator, can you speak to this pattern that we are seeing?
00:25:36.000 And whistleblowers are coming out to say as soon as Joe Biden came over, the military has taken a rather radical turn.
00:25:44.000 Your reaction, Senator.
00:25:45.000 So, I addressed this directly with General Alkin yesterday.
00:25:48.000 He and I were at the Minota Air Force Base together just last month.
00:25:51.000 We spent an entire day there with the airmen.
00:25:54.000 We participated in lots of events, lots of meetings, lots of touring.
00:25:58.000 And I'll leave that at that.
00:26:01.000 But when I addressed the drift, what I called a left word drift, and I, because by the way, if this same scenario was carried out regarding a rally put on by Black Lives Matter, I suspect that person that did it would be fired by now.
00:26:19.000 That's a radical point.
00:26:21.000 I think we have to always remember while we have the best military in the world, an all-volunteer force, only a patriot would sign up to do it, in my mind.
00:26:30.000 We have this other wonderful exceptionalism that was given to us by our founders, and that is that our military is not led by generals, but rather it is led by civilians.
00:26:40.000 And I think your point that since Joe Biden became commander-in-chief, that we've seen this drift to the left is because Joe Biden is commander-in-chief.
00:26:47.000 When the commander-in-chief of Joe Biden, Jake Sullivan is the National Security Advisor, Lloyd Austin is the Secretary of Defense, you're going to have a different political bent.
00:26:55.000 My problem with it is that it's infiltrated quickly.
00:27:00.000 It's given a green light to people on the left within the military.
00:27:04.000 It's shedding a bad light on our military, and we have to stop it now because, as you know, they have a problem recruiting people into our services.
00:27:12.000 And this isn't going to help it any because what we want is we want people that listen to Charlie Kirk to sign up for the military.
00:27:20.000 We want people who love America, who love God, who love freedom, and who will die.
00:27:25.000 And, you know, they should, in fact, in my mind, I think we should encourage our military men and women to be active in politics.
00:27:33.000 And right?
00:27:35.000 I mean, the very thing they're putting their lives on the line for, they should also be able to, and even encouraged to exercise.
00:27:42.000 So, Senator, you pinpointed something that I really want to talk about, which is military recruitment is down.
00:27:47.000 It's down the worst level since Vietnam.
00:27:52.000 When you address this with the members of the military, the general at Mina, what do they think is the problem?
00:27:58.000 Because I'm sure they have some theory or explanation.
00:28:01.000 I certainly do.
00:28:02.000 It's become hostile to anyone that shares traditional values.
00:28:06.000 But what do they tell you is the reason why we're so struggling to get recruits?
00:28:13.000 Some of what they tell me, and again, some of it's legitimate, I think, and that is that we have a workforce shortage in pretty much every industry in America.
00:28:20.000 And so they are competing with much higher pay and much more, you know, many benefits, better benefits in the private sector.
00:28:28.000 And we know all of that to be true.
00:28:30.000 We know that to be true in North Dakota.
00:28:31.000 When the oil workers are making a lot more money driving trucks than they can, you know, driving tanks, obviously it's harder to recruit them.
00:28:39.000 I don't dismiss any of that, Charlie.
00:28:42.000 But at the same time, we should be making it more appealing for people to want to join our military as opposed to less appealing.
00:28:49.000 And I think this leftward drift really does have an impact because the people most inclined to put their life on the line for freedom are people that they seem to look at as though they're second-class citizens.
00:29:01.000 And so I think that is a contributing factor.
00:29:04.000 Yeah, and the Air Force especially used to be long immune from recruiting challenges and it's just missed its goal for the first time in decades.
00:29:11.000 The Marines, it goes up and down, but the Air Force typically year after year hit its goals and hit its goals.
00:29:18.000 And, you know, if you talk to people, the Army, by the way, is 25% down.
00:29:22.000 This is a national security threat.
00:29:24.000 And if you talk to people in our audience, Senator, the question that I get that is one of the hardest to answer is when a mom comes to one of our events or emails us and she says, Charlie, my son wants to serve the country.
00:29:38.000 And I'm not sure that I'm comfortable given the tilt of the milk.
00:29:42.000 Just that attitude alone is you have the willingness to serve and not the receptivity.
00:29:47.000 So Senator, amongst just kind of the general consensus with your Democrat colleagues that care about national security, you know, there's definitely some.
00:29:57.000 Are they also seeing this?
00:29:58.000 Can this be a rare moment of bipartisanship where we can depoliticize our armed forces, Senator Kramer?
00:30:05.000 I think it can be because you touched on when you said depoliticize.
00:30:09.000 There's nobody of any political stripe that wants to see a hyper-politicized military.
00:30:14.000 We all might love to see it leaning more our way one way or the other.
00:30:18.000 But by and large, we want a politically neutral military.
00:30:23.000 We don't want individuals who are politically neutral.
00:30:25.000 We want them to have the same rights and freedoms of expression.
00:30:29.000 And by the way, I actually have the rules of ethics here that actually highlight that very point that allow partisan political activity within our military.
00:30:41.000 But as an institution, we don't want that.
00:30:44.000 And so I do think there's an opportunity with my Democrat friends.
00:30:47.000 As you know, I'm on the Senate Armed Services Committee.
00:30:49.000 I don't know a single Democrat on the Senate Armed Services Committee that doesn't want a stronger military.
00:30:55.000 Maybe one or one.
00:30:57.000 But we had, for example, with the National Defense Authorization Act, we only had one vote against the Defense Authorization Act this year on the Armed Services Committee.
00:31:06.000 And so, yeah, I think it's an opportunity, a learning experience, and we ought to get after it as soon as we get back.
00:31:12.000 One thing I will tell you, I want to bring the chief of staff of the Air Force or some other high-ranking Air Force official before the committee to go over line by line the entire clock and calendar of events that led to this event in Minutes because I feel you're right.
00:31:27.000 It's just one expression of many that's that are currently going on.
00:31:32.000 Well, thank you, Senator.
00:31:33.000 That means a lot to us.
00:31:34.000 And not just for us, it's just for the country, right?
00:31:37.000 I mean, that is a not, I mean, that story was viewed by millions of people.
00:31:41.000 And you have to imagine that a conservative American thinking of joining the Air Force, God bless them.
00:31:47.000 You know, they say, boy, is that really something I want?
00:31:50.000 And also, it's such an overreach of policing, like local political involvement.
00:31:56.000 And the subtext, and they didn't say this explicitly, is they're almost alluding that turning point was like a terrorist organization.
00:32:02.000 Like if you go here, that you could be kicked out on, you know, moral qualms.
00:32:07.000 And so I just want to encourage you, Senator, this is a great fight for you.
00:32:12.000 You've been a real champion of our armed forces and the strength of the country.
00:32:18.000 And it's happening here in North Dakota.
00:32:21.000 Final thoughts, Senator, and thank you for the time.
00:32:23.000 Well, I'm happy to, and thank you for the opportunity to do, Charlie, because I raised this very point again with General Alvin.
00:32:30.000 I mean, the Chief of Staff of the Air Force, we were just in Minut.
00:32:32.000 We saw a lot of good things and we saw some concerning things.
00:32:36.000 But here's the bottom line.
00:32:37.000 Here's what I want in my military, and this is what I tell everybody.
00:32:40.000 I want a military that stays focused on their mission.
00:32:44.000 And the military's mission is pretty obvious.
00:32:46.000 First and foremost, deter our enemies from attacking us or our allies.
00:32:51.000 And you can only do that with a strong military.
00:32:55.000 And by the way, with a commander-in-chief who's demonstrated and projected strength.
00:32:59.000 And we have one that has not, by the way, another whole show. 0.96
00:33:02.000 And then if that doesn't work, they need to be able to kill our enemies.
00:33:06.000 And worrying about political activism, particularly just attending a turning point USA event is hardly that.
00:33:18.000 In fact, I think it works against them.
00:33:20.000 There's a lot more to learn about this, Charlie.
00:33:22.000 We're going to continue to dig into it.
00:33:23.000 We'll keep you informed.
00:33:25.000 And by the way, one of the things I suggested yesterday to the Air Force leadership is that they start with an apology to turning point for this message.
00:33:34.000 I mean, a sincere one, because I know that's not what's in the heart of our leaders in the Air Force, and certainly not of the airmen and women, the airmen in Minot, Grand Forks, Fargo.
00:33:45.000 We have a Space Force station in Cavalier, by the way, as well.
00:33:48.000 Space Force, by the way, does always meet their recruiting goals because it's sort of the new Air Force in terms of the place the cool kids want to go.
00:33:56.000 But all of that, and we'll just keep you informed.
00:33:59.000 I hope an apology is forthcoming.
00:34:01.000 In fact, I think they should get on your show.
00:34:02.000 They should put somebody on your show to explain what happened.
00:34:05.000 And I encourage that of them.
00:34:06.000 I said, it's not enough to send out a correction four days later.
00:34:10.000 You need to get out front on this and talk to the American people about what happened and why it was just a mistake and not a new trend in our Air Force or our military.
00:34:20.000 Yeah, for our national security.
00:34:21.000 Senator, thank you for that.
00:34:23.000 And we'd be willing to accept an apology if it's clear and honest.
00:34:27.000 Everyone makes mistakes, but I'm afraid it's a trend.
00:34:30.000 And I hope we learn more.
00:34:31.000 Senator Kramer, happy Thanksgiving.
00:34:33.000 And also, Mary and Carmen, hope to see you guys soon and have a great Thanksgiving.
00:34:40.000 Herzog Foundation, for years, I've been talking about our nation's public schools and how they've been captured by progressive ideologues, teaching things that directly contradict the values of American families.
00:34:52.000 That's especially true if you are a Christian family.
00:34:56.000 For those of you worried about the best educational path for your kids and grandkids, I'm pleased to announce our new partnership with the folks at the Herzog Foundation.
00:35:04.000 They are the trusted source on American K through 12 private education with a remarkable suite of resources for parents and grandparents thinking about making the switch from public schools to a Christian education.
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00:35:38.000 That is Herzogfoundation.com.
00:35:39.000 That's HerzogFoundation.com.
00:35:45.000 Yeah, I've actually, I've seen this bridge before.
00:35:47.000 I've never been on it.
00:35:48.000 Rainbow Bridge connecting U.S. and Canada at Niagara Falls has been closed after a vehicle explosion.
00:35:54.000 That it might just be an accident or it could be an act of terrorism.
00:35:59.000 I will say, though, yesterday there was a terrorism bulletin that was posted about New York that kind of got ignored.
00:36:07.000 So maybe it's just a coincidence.
00:36:08.000 Let me try to find this here.
00:36:11.000 There was one yesterday where they raised the threat assessment to New York.
00:36:15.000 But yeah, yesterday they raised the terror threat assessment.
00:36:17.000 So hopefully it's not a terrorist attack.
00:36:19.000 But that is a serious bridge.
00:36:21.000 Yeah, the bridge has been closed after a vehicular explosion.
00:36:25.000 That would be a very weird place to bomb.
00:36:28.000 Maybe just a normal accident.
00:36:30.000 And so who knows?
00:36:33.000 Maybe it's tied with the Israeli hostage deal.
00:36:36.000 I'm not so sure.
00:36:37.000 So Israel has just agreed to a ceasefire for four days in return to get some hostages.
00:36:44.000 And I am curious about you in the audience.
00:36:46.000 Do you support the ceasefire?
00:36:48.000 I personally don't like it, and I'll tell you why.
00:36:51.000 I mean, I don't like that the international pressure basically has blackmailed Israel into this.
00:36:58.000 They're going to try to keep rolling this into a four-day, a one-week, a two-week ceasefire.
00:37:03.000 The mission for Israel has been very clear, which is to eliminate Hamas. 0.62
00:37:09.000 And war is one of the messiest things that human beings do.
00:37:15.000 It's the worst thing, honestly, that we do.
00:37:18.000 And so doesn't this just give Hamas an opportunity to game the system? 0.90
00:37:23.000 I don't trust anything that Hamas does. 0.88
00:37:25.000 Nothing.
00:37:26.000 But look, Israel has a different way of doing things. 0.82
00:37:30.000 Israel has a value on hostage life far greater than any other country in the world. 0.97
00:37:38.000 In fact, Israel famously would trade hundreds, if not thousands of prisoners just for one, just for a single Israeli citizen.
00:37:49.000 I have to say, we are very honest on this program, and people call us anti-Semites because we dare be honest. 0.75
00:37:57.000 It is so silly, okay? 0.97
00:37:59.000 And it's wrong, and it's harmful. 0.87
00:38:01.000 But credit to the IDF, militarily, they've been excellent once they have gotten into Gaza.
00:38:08.000 They've been great once they got in.
00:38:11.000 Some of their social media stuff has been awful.
00:38:14.000 The Israeli government going after Hadid and the supermodel, these op-ed and the Jerusalem post of the Israeli intelligence minister.
00:38:20.000 It's awful.
00:38:21.000 I sent out a tweet yesterday, and I stand by the tweet 100%. 1.00
00:38:25.000 And the typical morons are coming after me. 1.00
00:38:28.000 Oh, how dare you? 1.00
00:38:29.000 You know, you're anti-stop it.
00:38:31.000 And I said, look, the Israeli intellect, we did a whole show on this.
00:38:33.000 Hila Hamil, the intelligence minister of Israel, wrote an op-ed calling for a worldwide refugee resettlement scheme to move 2 million Gazans out of Israel into the rest of the world.
00:38:41.000 By the way, when I did this, I had someone text me.
00:38:44.000 They said, Charlie, what is your evidence that the Israeli government, it's like, well, this is the op-ed, right?
00:38:50.000 I'm not making this up.
00:38:51.000 It is in the Jerusalem Post written by the current Israeli intelligence minister.
00:38:55.000 And you couple that with the Wall Street Journal piece of Danny Dinon.
00:38:58.000 And I think it's Ram Barak.
00:39:00.000 I might be getting his name wrong.
00:39:03.000 They're both former Mossad and current Knesset.
00:39:06.000 Gamil says that once Gazans are gone, quote, Israeli communities could then return to their homes and communities and live in safety.
00:39:12.000 She says nothing about a life that will be for the people in Paris or London or Detroit who'll be expected to then house these Hamas lovers. 0.98
00:39:18.000 Here's what I don't like about this framing.
00:39:20.000 And again, I call balls and strikes and I'm cheering for Israel. 1.00
00:39:23.000 And by the way, the end of the tweet I thought was perfect, which is, I support Israel, so I say this in goodwill.
00:39:28.000 If the members of the Israeli government keep up putting garbage op-eds like this, they will destroy their support among Western conservatives.
00:39:35.000 And I should have add, which is their base. 0.95
00:39:38.000 That is their base, is Western conservatives.
00:39:41.000 And they're destroying their base by doing that. 0.99
00:39:44.000 And by the way, a lot of Jews that I'm talking about say this is talking to, they think it's the dumbest thing ever. 1.00
00:39:49.000 I don't know why the Israeli government is doing it. 0.96
00:39:51.000 And here's what I don't like.
00:39:52.000 Here's the subtext of the two op-eds. 0.98
00:39:56.000 We can't live near these people because they're obviously terrorists that want to kill us. 0.99
00:40:03.000 And why don't you Westerners want to take these sweet people, you bigots? 0.99
00:40:08.000 What? 0.95
00:40:09.000 So these people are terrorists that we can't coexist with. 1.00
00:40:13.000 And so, hey, Westerners, take them or else you're bad and awful and evil. 0.98
00:40:19.000 Not evil, but they did say that Danny Dinon said you have a moral imperative.
00:40:23.000 Danny Dinon in the Israeli government says that we in the West have a moral obligation to clean up this mess for Israel.
00:40:29.000 No, we don't.
00:40:30.000 Now, there are big political divisions in Israel, but this, honestly, Israel, I'm going to keep on giving you unsolicited advice.
00:40:37.000 From Netanyahu on down, Herzog, who's the president of Israel, you guys have to be in unison.
00:40:42.000 Western world, you do not have to take these refugees. 1.00
00:40:49.000 Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
00:40:50.000 Email us as always freedom at charliekirk.com.
00:40:53.000 Thanks so much for listening.
00:40:54.000 God bless.
00:40:58.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk dot com.