The Charlie Kirk Show - Jeffrey Epstein: The Myths, The Facts, And What's Still Missing

00:00:03.000 My name is Charlie Kirk.

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00:01:09.000 All right.

00:01:09.000 Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show.

00:01:11.000 Hour two is now underway.

00:01:13.000 And as promised, we are going to dive headlong into everything Epstein.

00:01:19.000 And we told you yesterday we wanted to do it right.

00:01:22.000 And I had been hearing this gentleman's name mentioned in multiple different places as the guy that's been working on this for years and has interviewed all of the main players, maybe not all, but darn near all, including Jeffrey Epstein's brother and many of the alleged victims and so on and so forth.

00:01:40.000 And so without further ado, we're going to welcome him onto the show.

00:01:43.000 His name's Jay Beecher.

00:01:44.000 He's an investigative journalist.

00:01:45.000 He's British, so he also has an accent.

00:01:48.000 You can find him at Substack, substack.com forward slash at Jay Beecher.

00:01:55.000 There's a lot to talk about.

00:01:56.000 It's a lot to talk about.

00:01:57.000 So welcome to the show, Jay.

00:01:59.000 Honored to have you from the mother island there in the UK.

00:02:04.000 So just by way of introduction for our audience that doesn't know who you are and what you've been up to, how long have you been working on investigating the Jeffrey Epstein saga and maybe just some of the people that you've interviewed along the way?

00:02:21.000 Yeah, sure.

00:02:21.000 So I got into the story by reading just a generic article about one of the allegations made by Virginia Geoffrey, one of the most vocal Epstein accusers.

00:02:32.000 And I was just going to write a basic article and, you know, sort of copying what she said.

00:02:37.000 And then I started to find some contradictions in there and it led me down a rabbit hole.

00:02:41.000 And six years, this is six years ago.

00:02:43.000 So for the past six years, I've been traveling the world really interviewing Jeffrey Epstein's brother, some of the Maxwell family, but also Professor Alan Dershowitz, Virginia Geffrey's inner circle, and the accused and the accusers.

00:02:59.000 So at the moment, the media just go one side and have only really, they'll interview the accusers.

00:03:05.000 They'll print the allegations verbatim.

00:03:07.000 There's very minimal fact-checking involved there, just looking for sensational headlines.

00:03:12.000 So I wanted to get both sides of the story so that people can make up their own minds and see the full facts.

00:03:18.000 Well, so, you know, we talked.

00:03:20.000 I did a little bit of a pre-interview call with you just because I wanted to understand where you were coming from on all of this.

00:03:26.000 Your substack goes into great detail.

00:03:28.000 I encourage people to check it out there.

00:03:31.000 What brings us to this point now?

00:03:33.000 There was a Transparency Act passed.

00:03:36.000 President Trump signed it despite some of his misgivings.

00:03:39.000 Which I feel a lot of his misgivings have panned out because what he said when he was opposing it, he said, there's going to be a lot of stuff in this that's going to hurt innocent people.

00:03:49.000 Hurt innocent people kind of lead to a lot of wild allegations and certainly embarrassing true stuff for a lot of people.

00:03:55.000 We've seen that about Bill Gates.

00:03:56.000 We've seen that about Elon.

00:03:58.000 Summers, Elon Musk, for example.

00:03:59.000 Certainly, some people have had real things embarrass them.

00:04:02.000 But it also, at least, you can correct me if I'm wrong, Jay, but I don't feel that it's blown open what some people were saying would be revealed like a massive blackmail ring or the like.

00:04:13.000 And let me put a pin on that because a fine point.

00:04:16.000 You said something.

00:04:17.000 You said, we don't need to sensationalize the lies because the truth is sensational enough.

00:04:23.000 And I think that's a really good guiding principle for this whole conversation.

00:04:27.000 Again, the whole hour about it.

00:04:28.000 So explain how we got here and what some of the new evidence is.

00:04:32.000 And then I want to go through name by name, allegation by allegation.

00:04:36.000 Yeah, sure.

00:04:37.000 So, you know, it stems back to a man being arrested for having sex. 0.94

00:04:44.000 Well, he didn't actually have sex, but having a sexual encounter with underage girls.

00:04:49.000 So this took place because originally Jeffrey Epstein was a typical sort of Hugh Hefner type. 0.96

00:04:55.000 He liked to be surrounded by attractive women and he was a creep.

00:04:58.000 Let's not, there's no whitewashing of Jeffrey Epstein. 1.00

00:05:00.000 He was an absolute creep and a pervert. 0.92

00:05:02.000 But he did surround himself with girls between the ages of 18 and around about 25, some of them a bit older. 0.98

00:05:10.000 So nothing illegal there.

00:05:11.000 It wasn't until Virginia Geoffrey came onto the scene. 0.99

00:05:15.000 And Jeffrey at this time was well known for telling the girls, if you bring me more girls, I will give you extra money.

00:05:21.000 It's sort of like a finder's fee.

00:05:23.000 So we use this term recruitment and it's quite sinister.

00:05:26.000 It was more of sort of introductions.

00:05:29.000 Sleazy as hell, obviously.

00:05:31.000 But Virginia took it upon herself to, whereas Jeffrey Epstein didn't actually ask to get underage girls, Virginia went into her local community and got vulnerable schoolgirls who were around about 14, some of them are 16, 17, etc.

00:05:47.000 And all of this is documented in the police reports.

00:05:50.000 Virginia got them to lie about their ages.

00:05:53.000 Another girl called Hayley Robson, who was recruited by Virginia, got these girls to lie about their ages. 1.00

00:05:59.000 So she would put them in makeup.

00:06:01.000 She would put them in clothes that made them look more adult.

00:06:04.000 And then she would drive them to Jeffrey Epstein.

00:06:07.000 And once in the house, Jeffrey is actually documented as asking, Are you over 18?

00:06:12.000 And the girls admitted to the police that they had lied and said that they were over 18.

00:06:19.000 So long story short, one of them spilled the beans.

00:06:23.000 Jeffrey Epstein was arrested because he had committed a felony, even though he didn't know their age.

00:06:29.000 You know, and he took a lie detector test.

00:06:31.000 The lie detector test proved that he was telling the truth, that he didn't know that they were under 18.

00:06:36.000 But either way, he committed a crime.

00:06:38.000 He went to prison.

00:06:39.000 The story would have died there if it were not for the fact that Jeffrey Epstein was friends and associated with some of the most famous and richest people in the world, some of the most influential people, from presidents to prime ministers, Hollywood stars, directors, all sorts of people.

00:06:55.000 And so the media wanted to latch onto this.

00:06:58.000 Then, at this halfway through the time, the story actually did go quite quiet.

00:07:03.000 Then you had the QAnon, you had Pizzagate shortly before that, talking about elite trafficking networks at play.

00:07:10.000 Then you had the Me Too movement come up right in the middle of all of this.

00:07:14.000 And so people were focused on the Jeffrey Epstein scandal again.

00:07:18.000 You had the original victims, and they are victims because they were underage.

00:07:22.000 You know, these schoolgirls, although they lied about their ages, they still were vulnerable young schoolgirls.

00:07:28.000 They started filing some lawsuits.

00:07:30.000 There were about six different girls, maybe a few more. 1.00

00:07:33.000 And then the lawyers thought this is a great way to make some money.

00:07:37.000 And then all these salacious stories came out.

00:07:39.000 So you had Alan Dershowitz accused, falsely accused by Virginia Geoffrey.

00:07:44.000 And this is the lawyer of Donald Trump.

00:07:48.000 You had Donald Trump falsely accused by a woman, and it turned out to have been orchestrated.

00:07:53.000 It was a hoax that was orchestrated actually by a producer of the Jerry Springer show.

00:07:58.000 And, but then Virginia had fed into this narrative.

00:08:02.000 She, this Pizzagate conspiracy of a global trafficking network, she accused, said that she'd slept with foreign presidents and then later admitted that she'd never met any in her life.

00:08:13.000 But that wasn't picked up by the media intentionally because that destroyed the narrative.

00:08:18.000 And so it's dragged on and on and on.

00:08:20.000 And then it became heavily politicized because it's become a great smear campaign.

00:08:25.000 Anybody who was ever, you know, snapped with in a photograph of Jeffrey Epstein, anyone who had a cup of tea or a coffee with him, or some of his friends who had business dealings with him, they were suddenly targeted via guilt by association.

00:08:41.000 And then there was a big buildup.

00:08:43.000 How can we turn this against Donald Trump?

00:08:45.000 Well, exactly.

00:08:46.000 Yeah, well, and that's, and Jay.

00:08:48.000 I've been critical of him.

00:08:49.000 Yeah, of course.

00:08:50.000 I mean, I don't consider you to be some fan of President Trump.

00:08:54.000 I, you know, it's interesting because I do think that you mentioned the Pizzagate, the Me Too, QAnon, all of that stuff.

00:09:03.000 And the confluence of those stories mixed with President Trump coming into power and everybody understood that President Trump knew Jeffrey Epstein and associated with him.

00:09:15.000 So we really have to sort of start there with the President Trump allegations because that was long the assumption is that we were going to find that President Trump had done some untoward things with underage women, you know, yes or no, and then expound on it.

00:09:30.000 Did President, has President Trump been, is there anything in there that would be criminal, that would be salacious even, embarrassing?

00:09:39.000 Absolutely nothing.

00:09:40.000 Absolutely nothing.

00:09:41.000 And I think it's very telling.

00:09:42.000 So the reason, only reason I agree with Donald Trump on certain policies, I disagree with him on others.

00:09:48.000 I think that's healthy with politicians.

00:09:50.000 I'm not one of these, you know, believe them in everything.

00:09:52.000 But I have not found a single piece of evidence to suggest that Donald Trump has done anything wrong at all.

00:10:00.000 He was bound to have been in the, he was in the same social circles as Jeffrey Epstein.

00:10:06.000 We know that he had a friendship with Jeffrey Epstein at one time, and then he ended that relationship.

00:10:11.000 And what's very telling is that from the very beginning, none of these vocal accusers and some of the genuine victims, absolutely none of them have accused him of doing anything wrong.

00:10:23.000 In fact, Virginia Geffrey herself said that he was a gentleman, you know, that he didn't do anything bad whatsoever.

00:10:29.000 Jay, I will let you continue here in a sec, but it's very funny to me that I feel like that's a pattern we've had for over a decade at this point.

00:10:36.000 Like when you think of how scrutinized Donald Trump's entire existence has been, every business relationship he's ever had, every political engagement he's ever had.

00:10:44.000 And now this, it kind of is remarkable how clean he ends up coming out of everything.

00:10:49.000 They couldn't get anything on his business other than, oh, he like he lied to get a loan that no one complained about other than the state of New York.

00:10:58.000 I don't know.

00:10:58.000 I'm just digressing here.

00:10:59.000 But yeah, it's funny here, even on this, you know, he could have had something like Bill Gates, where it's not necessarily criminal, but it's like highly embarrassing.

00:11:07.000 And they don't even have that, it seems.

00:11:08.000 And you're, I believe, you're, as you said, a man who's criticized the president a lot.

00:11:12.000 Yeah.

00:11:13.000 So I've, with regards to Ukraine, I criticize him heavily and I have criticized him quite heavily in the past.

00:11:18.000 I've supported him in the past in certain things.

00:11:19.000 I do it with all politicians.

00:11:21.000 I'm not really a, you know, sort of a, I pick a team and stick with it no matter what.

00:11:27.000 But on this, 1 million percent, he is, they are just weaponizing it to try and attack it.

00:11:32.000 And I think they're devastated that they found no ammunition against him.

00:11:36.000 And it's sort of backfired.

00:11:38.000 I really do.

00:11:40.000 So, Jay, I asked you a very pointed question.

00:11:44.000 And I said, besides, when we were talking before, I said, besides Jeffrey Epstein, because I do believe Jeffrey Epstein is a creep.

00:11:52.000 He's a sleaze. 0.99

00:11:53.000 He was a crook and a fraudster, actually. 1.00

00:11:55.000 And we can get into that. 0.96

00:11:57.000 But who are the villains of this story?

00:12:00.000 Because that is what's driving a lot of this.

00:12:03.000 They want to see the list.

00:12:04.000 They want to see who was sleeping with underage girls.

00:12:07.000 And you gave me a very surprising answer.

00:12:11.000 What was that?

00:12:12.000 If people want to, so I do not victim shame or anything like that, because what I'm trying to do is expose the genuine victims in all of this.

00:12:21.000 And there are genuine victims.

00:12:23.000 And those victims are the people who were recruited by adults.

00:12:27.000 They were adults at the time.

00:12:28.000 Virginia Duffray, Haley Robinson, and a couple of others.

00:12:32.000 And yet, that's the backwardsness in all of this.

00:12:34.000 They have been projected as the heroes of the story, when in fact they were the villains.

00:12:39.000 And they have admitted that they went out of their way to target, groom, and recruit underage girls, schoolgirls, get them to lie about their ages, and take them to a rich guy who they knew would then abuse them.

00:12:54.000 And yet the media, because that does not fit the narrative, they refuse to cover that.

00:13:00.000 They have just canonized these people.

00:13:02.000 And anybody who criticizes them is called a victim shamer.

00:13:07.000 I've interviewed Virginia DuFray's ex-partner, and he's openly admitted that whilst he was over 18, he was hunting down schoolgirls to sell to Jeffrey Epstein.

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00:15:54.000 All right, more with Jay Beecher.

00:15:55.000 Jay, I asked you who the villain was, and you said that there are real victims, these underage girls that were recruited.

00:16:02.000 They were dressed up in fancy clothes and makeup, and they were told to lie about their age.

00:16:07.000 Apparently, it sounds like Jeffrey Epstein asked if they were over 18.

00:16:10.000 I'm not saying what Jeffrey Epstein was doing is okay, by the way.

00:16:12.000 That's that's gross.

00:16:14.000 That I just don't think that's even up for debate. 1.00

00:16:16.000 Like, I don't, Jeffrey Epstein's a creep, a crook, a fraudster. 0.99

00:16:19.000 And whatever. 0.96

00:16:20.000 That's not really been up for debate.

00:16:21.000 That's never been up for everything else that, but how did this happen and who else was involved is really the central question.

00:16:29.000 And you're telling me that Virginia Guffery, I believe I'm saying her name right, is implicated.

00:16:36.000 The police know it, that she was the one that was going out grooming these young women.

00:16:40.000 And she had an accomplice.

00:16:42.000 I forget the name.

00:16:43.000 And then that begs the question: what was Gheline Maxwell doing? 0.94

00:16:47.000 Was she aware that these underage women were getting recruited? 1.00

00:16:51.000 Well, that's the travesty in all of this: is that the media just refused to report the truth because it doesn't fit the narrative.

00:16:58.000 And it was Virginia Geoffrey and a girl called Haley Robson, who Virginia had introduced to Jeffrey Epstein, who were going out of their way to find schoolgirls to make money.

00:17:08.000 It was all financially motivated.

00:17:10.000 They knew what they were doing.

00:17:11.000 I have interviewed the mother of one of Virginia's victims.

00:17:16.000 So Caroline Andiaranio, sadly, was groomed by Virginia, given drugs, put on this life of prostitution, and eventually she was found dead in a hotel room, allegedly of a drug overdose.

00:17:31.000 And so she destroyed Virginia, destroyed a lot of lives. 0.69

00:17:34.000 But at the time, the Me Too mantra was believe all women.

00:17:38.000 And the media were very adamant that they didn't want to deviate from that whatsoever.

00:17:42.000 So Virginia's story was newsworthy.

00:17:45.000 It was brilliant for journalists because here she is saying that she'd slept with foreign presidents, that she'd slept with a Prince of England, and just making all of these wild, headline-grabbing, sensational claims that they didn't want to fact-check it.

00:18:02.000 They didn't want to fact-check any of it.

00:18:04.000 So if you want to look at the villains in this story, it is Virginia, it's Haley Robson, and a couple of others.

00:18:11.000 So if I and Virginia's ex-partner, who I interviewed, and he quite casually just talks about how he went out of his way to find schoolgirls and girls to recruit because he thought, well, that's an extra $200.

00:18:26.000 And there's no shame there.

00:18:27.000 The police know about it.

00:18:28.000 He's admitted it on record to me and also in his affidavits, you know, his depositions.

00:18:35.000 And yet he's never been prosecuted.

00:18:36.000 Virginia has been acknowledged with foolproof and has admitted that she recruited schoolgirls while she herself was an adult, but they refused to prosecute her.

00:18:48.000 The police wanted to prosecute Haley Robson, but then it went higher up and they decided to drop it and only go after Epstein.

00:18:56.000 Now, Epstein did take a lie detector test.

00:18:58.000 The police were quite annoyed because the result came back that he was telling the truth that he didn't know that they were underage.

00:19:04.000 Fast forward 10 years or so, and suddenly you've got all these lawsuits coming in.

00:19:11.000 You've got journalists who want to write stories because it's making them a lot of money.

00:19:16.000 And you've got lawyers who want these articles and headlines out there because it's making them a lot of money.

00:19:23.000 They've made over 100 million so far, just the lawyers alone.

00:19:27.000 Because what they were doing, the lawyers, and this is well documented, they would get an accusation, they would approach the person who was accused, and then they would try to say, if you don't want this going into the press, don't want to be smeared, pay up.

00:19:43.000 And that's well documented.

00:19:44.000 There are even there are emails in the Epstein files of the lawyers discussing this.

00:19:49.000 And they've even talked about how they can first represent the accusers and then represent the accused and make sure that they keep these stories out of the headlines.

00:20:00.000 I've listened to a secret recording taken by Alan Dershowitz, where David Boyce, who represented Virginia, admitted to him that he knew that Virginia was wrong, in his words, wrong, completely wrong to accuse him.

00:20:13.000 But he said, if you pay up, find some, in his words, Jewish lawyers, some rabbis, those were his words, pay up, and this will go away.

00:20:22.000 Now, that's blackmail, it's extortion.

00:20:25.000 And they would use the press, weaponize the press with Prince Andrew.

00:20:29.000 That catapulted the story back into the headline news across the world.

00:20:35.000 Because here you had.

00:20:36.000 I want to come in there.

00:20:37.000 You just mentioned David Boyce.

00:20:38.000 That's not going to be a name most people are familiar with, but that is a superstar lawyer.

00:20:43.000 He's been involved in, among other things, he represented Theranos, which was that blood analysis company that was a huge scam.

00:20:50.000 He's represented Harvey Weinstein.

00:20:52.000 So he's certainly not deeply motivated, I would say, by protecting victims necessarily.

00:20:59.000 He can play both sides of that.

00:21:01.000 He represented Al Gore and Bush v. Gore.

00:21:04.000 This is a celebrity guy who's certainly been involved in high profile.

00:21:08.000 And frankly, he's worked for some sinister actors, as we know with Theranos.

00:21:12.000 And so it would be entirely believable for him to be a sinister actor in this case as well.

00:21:17.000 And in the Faranaus case, he was found, him and his team, to have intimidated the whistleblowers.

00:21:24.000 In this instance, what his MO seems to have been is to, so let's take the Prince Andrew case, the allegations as an example.

00:21:32.000 He knows that they're not true.

00:21:34.000 Virginia had originally claimed that she didn't sleep with Prince Andrew at all. 0.75

00:21:38.000 Then she claimed that she had sex with Prince Andrew in New Mexico.

00:21:42.000 She wrote three pages going into law of detail saying they went horseback riding together, had sex in the bathroom with champagne.

00:21:49.000 Then under oath, she admitted she had never happened.

00:21:51.000 She'd never been to New Mexico, Prince Andrew.

00:21:54.000 Then she changed it to that she'd had an audi with Prince Andrew on the island.

00:21:57.000 But then it was shown to her that she'd already written about this audio and it was actually, she claimed, with Jean-Luc Brunel, not with Prince Andrew.

00:22:05.000 But they knew this, the lawyers, and yet they don't want to drop that.

00:22:09.000 The journalists want to keep it going because they're making money from producing clickbait.

00:22:14.000 And the lawyers want to get money from it. 0.78

00:22:16.000 Now, Prince Andrew, when it comes to him as well, what David Boyce would do is, and he said this during an interview with Piers Morgan, if he doesn't settle out of court, if he doesn't pay up, I will depose Megan Markle, I'll depose his daughters, I'll depose all of his family.

00:22:32.000 Knowing that that can't happen because the royal family wouldn't allow it to happen.

00:22:35.000 The judge at the same time refused to allow him to submit certain evidence from proving that Virginia had made false allegations against him.

00:22:44.000 And the lawyers have been working with politicians even now to get all of this together.

00:22:51.000 Jay, we've got so much to get to here.

00:22:53.000 I want to make sure we're moving quickly.

00:22:55.000 So I have a thousand questions for you.

00:22:59.000 Did, and we've got this, I didn't, we've got Boyce with Guffery here, a picture that we could throw up here, which so just to kind of add a visual element to this, just so everybody can see this.

00:23:13.000 Do you believe that Virginia committed suicide?

00:23:15.000 I know her dad has said that he doesn't think that that was the case.

00:23:19.000 You just never know what to believe anymore with this, if I'm honest.

00:23:23.000 So you've got she, I think she likely did.

00:23:26.000 The reason that I believe that is because her web of lies was so she stacked a lie upon a lie upon a lie. 0.57

00:23:33.000 And I think it was slowly beginning to collapse because she was about to be deposed for the very first time.

00:23:39.000 She was going to have her very first court appearance because she was being sued by Rena Rowe, who I've interviewed quite a lot. 0.97

00:23:46.000 And because she'd made a false statement against Rina. 0.65

00:23:50.000 And so, whereas she, if you look into her past history, she's always settled out of court.

00:23:55.000 So, with Alan Dershowitz, she settled out of court, not financially, but she admitted that she was mistaken in accusing him.

00:24:04.000 Well, she wasn't mistaken.

00:24:05.000 She lied.

00:24:06.000 But with Reena, she was trying and trying to prevent herself from being dragged into court.

00:24:12.000 And the judge, two weeks before she committed suicide, had ruled that no, whatever happens, you must come into court and testify.

00:24:20.000 Now, while she's in the courtroom, the defense lawyers, so Rena Rose's lawyers, sorry, would have grilled her. 0.84

00:24:27.000 And I know this for a fact because I helped them with certain information.

00:24:32.000 They were using, there's a photograph of Rena Rowe leaving the courtroom with a 200-page report that I did, just compiling all of Virginia's lies with the evidence.

00:24:42.000 And so what they were preparing to do was to use that as an opportunity to finally, under oath, force Virginia to admit the truth.

00:24:52.000 And she would have been shown all of this evidence and she would have been confronted with it.

00:24:56.000 And now it would have been covered by the newspapers.

00:24:59.000 You also at the same time had her marriage breakdown.

00:25:04.000 Her kids were taken away from her, which is very rare.

00:25:07.000 You know, you don't often see children being taken away from the mother and the mother losing custody.

00:25:13.000 So her life was sort of caving in.

00:25:16.000 Yeah, it does seem that's a, I think, a strong narrative.

00:25:21.000 But so bigger picture, I think an issue I want us to talk about when people do push the idea that there's not as much here as people thought.

00:25:31.000 It's kind of a more mundane guy who had relations with underage girls, got caught, and then he also knew a lot of people, but there's not a bigger conspiracy or bigger behind the scenes thing.

00:25:44.000 One thing people fixate on a lot is just Jeffrey Epstein's wealth.

00:25:49.000 Even the vice president the other day was saying it should be investigated how he became so wealthy, because that seems very mysterious to people and that it must have some sort of dark explanation.

00:26:00.000 Do you have an explanation for that that would be satisfactory?

00:26:03.000 How did Jeffrey Epstein become this super rich and connected person like that?

00:26:08.000 Yeah, because I had the exact same thoughts.

00:26:10.000 How the hell did a mathematician, like just a low-level maths teacher without any degree, become so wealthy?

00:26:15.000 It was actually through fraud.

00:26:17.000 A lot of it was through fraud.

00:26:19.000 He was arrested in the, I think it was the late 80s, very early 90s.

00:26:24.000 He was involved in a, he'd left Bear Stearns.

00:26:27.000 So whilst he was a teacher, he'd been poached by one of his students' father, who was high up in Bear Stearns, and saw that he was very good with numbers, got him on board.

00:26:37.000 He made quite a lot of money there.

00:26:39.000 But then he went and left and made his own company with a partner.

00:26:43.000 And now both of them were arrested because they said it was a pyramid scheme and they were engaged in fraudulent transactions.

00:26:50.000 And Jeffrey Epstein made a hell of a lot of money, millions from that.

00:26:53.000 His partner was sent to prison.

00:26:55.000 And Jeffrey Epstein, for whatever reason, managed to get out of it.

00:26:59.000 They didn't have enough evidence. 0.62

00:27:00.000 Now his partner squealed like a pig and said, Jeffrey was just as guilty as I am. 0.95

00:27:06.000 You know, he was just as guilty as this, but he got away with it. 0.96

00:27:10.000 Then he got as a client for his next company, Leslie Wexner.

00:27:14.000 And Leslie gave him the keys to the kingdom because he was helping people to avoid paying taxes.

00:27:21.000 And he did that by setting up offshore offshore companies and shell companies in the US Virgin Islands.

00:27:27.000 And so Leslie Wexner saw, wow, this guy's good.

00:27:30.000 He's running my companies well.

00:27:32.000 He's saving me a hell of a lot of money.

00:27:34.000 I'm going to sign him power of attorney.

00:27:36.000 And he did that.

00:27:37.000 But then later on, it turned out that Epstein had stolen tens of millions of dollars from Leslie Wexner, enough.

00:27:45.000 actually just just about 25 a quarter of the money that he stole from uh wexner was enough for him to buy his island and with with more money that he'd stolen he bought his place in france his ranch and he'd already got the house in new york from leslie wexner and then also leslie wexner gave him sort of this era of aura of credibility you know he's representing wexner he could do me so Every day,

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00:29:20.000 So you're basically laying out a case, Jay, that he was good at one thing financially.

00:29:27.000 And that was shielding people from tax liabilities.

00:29:29.000 He was a tax evader, essentially.

00:29:32.000 And not even, I'd say two things, a tax evader and also kind of a confidence game man.

00:29:38.000 Like he just, he wormed his way in with Wexner and maybe did valid work for the first couple of years.

00:29:45.000 And then after that, it just seems he was soaking him.

00:29:47.000 You mentioned he got that place from him.

00:29:48.000 He basically got it for what, a dollar?

00:29:50.000 He took a free $20 million home in New York off of him.

00:29:54.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:29:55.000 You know, he was rewarded.

00:29:57.000 He was seen as this great genius, sort of some asset.

00:30:01.000 I think he exaggerated himself to some extent.

00:30:04.000 He'd lied on his CB to get to Bear Stones.

00:30:08.000 But regardless, he knew how to get rich people to pay less taxes.

00:30:12.000 And that was making those shell companies in the U.S. Virgin Islands.

00:30:16.000 His island, people think that he purchased this to have secrecy and to run some sort of strange operation.

00:30:23.000 Well, no, it was originally just for the fact that if you're in the U.S. Virgin Islands, you get certain tax exemptions, you pay so much less tax than you would in the U.S.

00:30:35.000 So he set up all of these companies.

00:30:37.000 And then he was approached by Noam Chomsky, by Woody Allen.

00:30:43.000 He helped Woody Allen.

00:30:44.000 He helped Leon Black.

00:30:46.000 He had all of these different people who he would help pay less taxes.

00:30:51.000 They would filter their money into the U.S. Virgin Islands, into his shell companies.

00:30:55.000 And then obviously they avoided paying millions and millions of tax.

00:30:58.000 So they're going to like him.

00:31:00.000 Then he built up all of these connections through that and through political donations.

00:31:05.000 His political donations were not really because he believed in the politics that he was supporting.

00:31:11.000 It was because he coveted famous names and famous faces because that gave him more credibility.

00:31:18.000 They gave him more access.

00:31:19.000 And having that access and that ring of circles attracts more people to him.

00:31:24.000 Jay, I got it.

00:31:24.000 So let me just challenge the premise here, though.

00:31:28.000 I mean, is there any indication that he was a Mossad agent, that he was working with CIA?

00:31:32.000 Because you say he didn't get arrested, but his partner did.

00:31:36.000 Okay, was somebody protecting him?

00:31:38.000 Was, you know, then he's connected with Ehud Barak later on.

00:31:43.000 You know, you just, you sort of start wondering, like, why is this charmed man so charmed?

00:31:49.000 And it does he have a handler?

00:31:50.000 Does he have people that are someone looking out for him?

00:31:54.000 Yeah, that's how he gets out of things over and over.

00:31:57.000 You know, Leslie Wexner is a obviously a Jewish American.

00:32:00.000 Was there, was there a connection there that he was, you know, was he blackmailed?

00:32:05.000 Did he blackmail Wexner?

00:32:06.000 What, what is, is there any indication?

00:32:09.000 Because this, some, sometimes it feels a little too convenient.

00:32:12.000 No, I know what you mean.

00:32:12.000 I know what you mean.

00:32:13.000 It's sort of like this is the luckiest guy in the world, right?

00:32:15.000 You know, gone from being a humble maths teacher.

00:32:18.000 But there is no evidence that he was involved with Mossad, that he was in intelligence.

00:32:25.000 His former girlfriend used to joke that, you know, his son, he's so quiet and mysterious that he must be in this CIA.

00:32:31.000 And then it sort of snowballed from there.

00:32:34.000 But he did help.

00:32:36.000 So he doesn't need to be a member of an agent to influence world politics and influence, you know, some of the most influential people in the world, because we can see that in his email exchanges.

00:32:47.000 He's being contacted by some of the most powerful leaders asking him for advice.

00:32:53.000 But that tends to be more, if you read between the lines of the emails, it's more the fact of his connections.

00:32:59.000 And they're always asking him, can you connect me with this person?

00:33:03.000 So one of them, I think it was the Sultan of wherever, asked him, how do I talk to Donald Trump?

00:33:08.000 That's because he was associated with Donald Trump.

00:33:11.000 Another one asks them for an introduction with Clinton.

00:33:15.000 And they are talking about what we would deem intelligence.

00:33:19.000 He was definitely that the Russia angle needs more explanation and more investigation.

00:33:25.000 And you will start to see that over the coming weeks.

00:33:28.000 You know, isn't any involvement with Russia.

00:33:32.000 But I have not found any genuine evidence to prove that he was a member of Mossad.

00:33:39.000 And when Jeffrey Epstein was asked, so he was asked, let's think, we talk about him escaping from sort of dodging one conviction early on for fraud, but he didn't escape two major convictions.

00:33:55.000 So the first one being obviously when he was arrested in, I think it was 2007 and for sleeping with an underage girl.

00:34:04.000 And he was asked during that time by Professor Dershowitz, do you know, are you a member of any intelligence thing?

00:34:11.000 Do you have anyone who can shut this thing down?

00:34:13.000 And he didn't.

00:34:15.000 He just, he said, I don't.

00:34:16.000 I'm not like, you know, I don't have any of those connections.

00:34:19.000 And they would have exploited that.

00:34:20.000 They would have shut that down.

00:34:22.000 And then years later, again, no one came to his defense.

00:34:25.000 No one came to help him.

00:34:26.000 If he had all of this information to blackmail people, he wasn't able to pull any strings.

00:34:31.000 But Jay, and just again, to keep pressing the point.

00:34:34.000 So you spoke with Jeffrey Epstein's brother.

00:34:38.000 You've interviewed him.

00:34:40.000 He does not believe Jeffrey committed suicide.

00:34:44.000 I guess the question would be, what do you believe after speaking with Jeffrey Epstein's brother?

00:34:49.000 And if he didn't commit suicide, then it's apparent that there would be forces that wanted him dead.

00:34:55.000 Yeah.

00:34:56.000 So when this is coming out, there are a hell of a lot of people who are associated with him.

00:35:02.000 Now, some of these, though I say some of these powerful people have done nothing wrong, they are still likely, some of them may have slept with some of the women, because you've got to remember that 99% of the women that Jeffrey Epstein had were over legal age.

00:35:19.000 Some of them are registered escorts.

00:35:21.000 They're fully documented as being escorts at the time.

00:35:24.000 We don't know if he, if, if some of them had slept with them, we just don't know.

00:35:28.000 There's no way of telling.

00:35:30.000 But with regards to his death, going back to his death, I believe that there are some, it still needs a proper investigation.

00:35:38.000 And that is for my next book.

00:35:40.000 Have been investigating the dev and a few things that I can't go into right now, to be honest, but they um, there are too many unanswered questions, too many coincidences from that night, his final night.

00:35:54.000 We we forget that there was an original incident where Jeffrey Epstein was found.

00:35:58.000 There was a commotion in his cell.

00:36:00.000 Suddenly he wakes up um, suddenly they burst open the door.

00:36:03.000 They find his cellmate.

00:36:05.000 So they they the cellmate who they put him in with Nick um, claims he's innocent, etc.

00:36:10.000 I'm not going to touch on that right now.

00:36:12.000 But why did they put him in with somebody who is supposed to have committed multiple murders?

00:36:20.000 And yet they chose him as a safe and non-aggressive?

00:36:23.000 That's the term they used.

00:36:24.000 This is a non-aggressive, safe cellmate and on this incident the guards, the um, the prison officers, burst into the cell.

00:36:33.000 Jeffrey's snoring, the noose has been taken off of him and he's gone unconscious.

00:36:37.000 The first thing he says when he wakes up is, Nick tried to kill me, that his cellmate tried to kill him, excuse me now he.

00:36:44.000 He went back on that later on and said, oh, i'm confused.

00:36:47.000 But they, you know they, they think he might have been frightened into into talking about that, but he had mentioned that before that people were going to harm him.

00:36:56.000 So then you've got the CCTV cameras not working.

00:36:59.000 At the same time, you've got the the prison guards falling asleep on the watch conveniently.

00:37:04.000 You've got one who allegedly claims that a prisoner, potentially Epstein, was shipped out um just shortly before.

00:37:11.000 Now that needs um exploring properly before it's completely debunked or proven.

00:37:16.000 You never know.

00:37:17.000 But Jeffrey Epstein is a man who had the means to organize um an escape if he wanted to, but I don't believe that happened.

00:37:26.000 I believe that he died.

00:37:29.000 We just don't know if it was suicide or not.

00:37:31.000 There are, there are, multiple reasons why we shouldn't close the book as case solved on the death of Jeffrey Epstein.

00:37:38.000 Yeah, I mean that if people wanted him dead, I mean maybe it was just they were embarrassed, maybe they did sleep with some of these underage girls that were recruited by Virginia and and uh, I believe you said Haley, if i'm not right, if not yeah, Haley Robinson yeah yeah, so okay question.

00:37:52.000 So there's a lot of names that were mentioned.

00:37:53.000 Sorry, I got.

00:37:54.000 We might have the same question, which is just, there has been millions of documents that have come out there.

00:37:59.000 There is new stuff coming out.

00:38:00.000 Whatever it is, have we learned anything from it and is anyone, is there anyone who actually might be criminally implicated, even if it's just on the level of what Epstein himself was?

00:38:10.000 Yeah no, you've got sort of things that you could highlight as fraud, potentially fraudulent, that have been raised from the documents.

00:38:16.000 But I think the people who so let's look at why these were released and again it goes for political and financial is political and financially motivated.

00:38:26.000 You had the lawyers who need this to be released because they have, they still have on ongoing lawsuits.

00:38:32.000 They've got them against institutions like banks that the last one paid out over a hundred million dollars and they get up to 40 of that, the lawyers.

00:38:40.000 So it's good for them to keep this story alive and to keep these bankers and targets trembling.

00:38:48.000 And then, of course, you have the House Democrats, and i'm sorry, but they do not give a Damn about justice or victims, or they only care about going after Donald Trump, and yet nothing has been found in there.

00:39:01.000 That's why they've been pushing for it.

00:39:02.000 The lawyers, if you look into it, the uh David Boys, etc., have admitted that they've been working with the House Democrats pro bono, and they've been helping orchestrate this entire smear campaign.

00:39:15.000 And yet, what has been revealed is really disappointing for them because there isn't anything.

00:39:20.000 There are, don't get me wrong, there are some fascinating things in there, some really interesting scandals and things that arise and connections that we didn't know about, but none of them are illegal.

00:39:32.000 What you're seeing is guilt by association.

00:39:34.000 They're looking for photographs of, and it's the way that they portray them.

00:39:39.000 So, they get the media to put out the headline: a victim of Jeffrey Epstein was in the presence of Donald Trump.

00:39:48.000 But then they admit intentionally, they redact the name of the victim.

00:39:53.000 And yet, we know the victim was Virginia Jufray, and that Virginia Duffray had said, Well, no, I met Donald Trump, he was a gentleman, he did nothing wrong.

00:40:00.000 So, they're weaponizing the Epstein files.

00:40:03.000 They want to use it to keep the story alive, to confuse the hell out of the public, and to make money.

00:40:09.000 And that is what most of this is about, making money.

00:40:12.000 And from the politician side, it's about using this to keep the heat and the pressure on Donald Trump.

00:40:19.000 And yet, they are really disappointed because they've not been able to find anything explosive, and they've definitely not been able to find anything damaging against the president whatsoever.

00:40:29.000 So, I want to go through rapid fire name by name that have been implicated in this recent drop.

00:40:34.000 And so, try we've got to keep our answers tight here because we're running low on time here and there's so much to go through.

00:40:39.000 But just touch on the Pizzagate thing.

00:40:41.000 They mentioned pizza, they mentioned so, so obviously, this thing makes us think back a few years.

00:40:46.000 All the steak mentions a lot of people.

00:40:48.000 Is there anything on that?

00:40:49.000 Is there anything there that you can see?

00:40:51.000 People like pizza, people, people like pizza, people like steak.

00:40:55.000 I worked in politics before.

00:40:57.000 Where do you go for a campaign meeting?

00:40:59.000 You go to a pizza house, um, you all meet.

00:41:01.000 It's the go-to thing.

00:41:03.000 The problem is when you take thousands, tens and tens of thousands of emails and only pick out the emails that say pizza.

00:41:12.000 I bet if we looked through your emails or my emails, we would find references to pizza.

00:41:17.000 We might find some to steak.

00:41:19.000 And when they're put out there without any context, then you can spin this whole conspiracy theory and all the things.

00:41:25.000 So, you've looked at the emails in context.

00:41:28.000 Yeah, you're saying you've looked at them 100%.

00:41:31.000 And many of these emails, we've got to remember about 90% of what we're seeing in the Epstein files so far is already out there.

00:41:38.000 So, I have seen them, I've seen the context.

00:41:41.000 There is nothing sinister.

00:41:42.000 I just checked.

00:41:43.000 There's 94 emails about pizza in my Gmail.

00:41:47.000 I don't think I have any.

00:41:49.000 I keep that quiet.

00:41:50.000 We're going to end up on a list.

00:41:52.000 Jay, we see references to Goyam, Goy.

00:41:58.000 Is there any indication?

00:41:59.000 I mean, obviously, you think Mossad, you think Israeli connections, Ehud Baragi, any of that's a obviously Jeffrey Epstein's Jewish. 0.58

00:42:06.000 That's not what I think.

00:42:07.000 Well, is there anything there?

00:42:11.000 Because that's a term that would be offensive.

00:42:16.000 Did he sort of see himself as us versus them?

00:42:19.000 You know, anything there?

00:42:21.000 Well, if you go back to the context and read it in there, he's actually joking when he mentions that cohem. 0.78

00:42:26.000 I can't remember who it is now who asks him a question: Are there Jewish people there?

00:42:31.000 No, she says something like, Oh, that will be a predominantly Jewish event.

00:42:34.000 You know, it's like a dinner party or something.

00:42:36.000 And he said, No, there'll be a lot of Goyam there.

00:42:38.000 It's it's but it's tongue-in-cheek when you read his emails, and particularly the emails that he's had in exchange with this person before.

00:42:46.000 They joke and banter a lot, so it is just a tongue-in-cheek comment.

00:42:51.000 You know, it's not, there's nothing, you know, sort of like they're the master race, or, you know, there's no, there's nothing like that in there at all.

00:42:58.000 Once again, it comes down to context and reading when you learn, spend years reading how Jeffrey Epstein talks, he did actually joke quite a lot.

00:43:07.000 He did make a lot of tongue.

00:43:09.000 Did he make any references of killing people or offing people?

00:43:13.000 I've seen rumors of that.

00:43:15.000 Yeah.

00:43:15.000 So, so, you know, there were some, there's a couple of emails where he jokes about killing people and they're clearly evidence as jokes.

00:43:22.000 But then there's some accused, there's an accuser who accused him in the documents of killing certain victims.

00:43:30.000 And yet this accuser, because her name's redacted, the public don't know.

00:43:34.000 I've already looked into her and she was debunked many, many years ago as a complete fantasist.

00:43:39.000 She was found to have had a history of serious mental health problems and of making false accusations.

00:43:47.000 And those investigate those claims were investigated and found not to be credible.

00:43:52.000 So it's not like, you know, this is anything new.

00:43:55.000 Rapid fire here.

00:43:57.000 Peter Thiel, what did we learn?

00:43:59.000 Not much about Peter Thiel.

00:44:01.000 There's not much.

00:44:02.000 I've focused less on Peter Thiel.

00:44:04.000 At the moment, I've been focusing more on Prince Andrew and on Peter Mandelson and people, people like that.

00:44:12.000 And of course, Elon Musk.

00:44:14.000 Elon Musk, what did we learn?

00:44:16.000 Elon Musk.

00:44:17.000 So I had known when I very first saw Elon put out, you know, this claim that he'd photobombed, Ghillenne Maxwell had photobombed him.

00:44:25.000 I knew that to be a lie anyway, because I'd already interviewed some of Ghelen Maxwell's siblings.

00:44:31.000 And he was close friends with Ghelen Maxwell.

00:44:34.000 But they wanted to distance themselves.

00:44:36.000 Elon Musk and other people wanted to say, no, I wasn't very close with them at all.

00:44:41.000 But there isn't anything damning against Elon Musk.

00:44:44.000 Again, it's guilt by association.

00:44:46.000 Of course, he knew Ghillenne Maxwell.

00:44:49.000 He knew Jeffrey Epstein.

00:44:51.000 He was invited to the island, but didn't go to the island.

00:44:54.000 So there's absolutely nothing in the Epstein files that is critical about Elon Musk.

00:45:00.000 So he basically just wanted to go to a party.

00:45:02.000 And by the way, Elon Musk has been public.

00:45:04.000 He wants to see Jeffrey Epstein, the accusers, and the actual victims, these underage girls.

00:45:11.000 He wants to see justice for them.

00:45:13.000 Obviously, Jeffrey Epstein's already dead, so there's only so much you could do.

00:45:16.000 But if anybody else was involved.

00:45:17.000 So Prince Andrew, you mentioned Prince Andrew.

00:45:22.000 What did we learn and are learning about Prince Andrew?

00:45:25.000 So a lot of what you're seeing now that these headlines are saying this new revelation has been found against Prince Andrew in the Epstein files.

00:45:34.000 It's a lie.

00:45:35.000 There are allegations that have been public for many, many years and available.

00:45:39.000 People just haven't looked for them.

00:45:42.000 Like I say, going back to it with Prince Andrew, Virginia is the only person who has accused him.

00:45:47.000 He was originally, she originally claimed she didn't have sex with him at all. 0.83

00:45:51.000 Then she claimed that she had sex with him in New Mexico.

00:45:54.000 Then she claimed a few other things and admitted that it was a complete lie.

00:45:58.000 So I think that whilst he has made some, you know, made some mistakes in the past and has not helped himself with regards to this, he is innocent.

00:46:08.000 He was just cheating, though, right?

00:46:10.000 I mean, he was going, he was essentially going outside of his marriage.

00:46:13.000 We know that much, correct?

00:46:15.000 Well, you've got to remember he was divorced.

00:46:17.000 Long before he ever supposedly met Virginia Juffray, he was already divorced.

00:46:22.000 He lives still with his wife, Fergie.

00:46:25.000 But here we have, so the latest revelation that the headlines are going mad about is that a new woman has accused Prince Andrew.

00:46:34.000 She said that when she was about 24, she met Prince Andrew.

00:46:38.000 She slept with Prince Andrew, that the following morning, they woke up, had breakfast together, and he gave her a tour of Buckingham Palace, and then she said goodbye and left.

00:46:48.000 Now, that's seen as a big scandal, but here we have a single divorcee supposedly sleeping, if it's true, with an adult woman of her own free will.

00:46:59.000 And suddenly you've got the lawyer saying, you know, he must pay up more money to help her get over her trauma.

00:47:06.000 I don't know what trauma, I think he should be invoicing her.

00:47:09.000 You know, I had to pay for a tour of Buckingham Palace.

00:47:11.000 Yeah, fair enough.

00:47:12.000 Bill Gates.

00:47:13.000 Bill Gates is obviously the damning email about him supposedly getting an STI.

00:47:22.000 Now, I don't know if that's true.

00:47:24.000 Nobody knows except from Jeffrey Epstein, who's dead, and Bill Gates, who is alive, but he isn't going to go on any shows too soon.

00:47:32.000 So it could be true.

00:47:33.000 I don't know about Bill Gates, but it's very damaging for his reputation.

00:47:37.000 Not because he was associated with Jeffrey Epstein, but that I think that that one claim about him in the email from Jeffrey is going to stick with him and smear him for a long time.

00:47:48.000 So there is something you told me about that I actually found surprising, and I think it gets lost in all the noise here.

00:47:55.000 You know, my assumption was that Jeffrey Epstein was sleeping with all of these women.

00:48:00.000 This is going to be a little graphic.

00:48:02.000 So if you have young kids in the room with you right now, please earmuff or take them away. 0.97

00:48:09.000 Do your best to not be so graphic, but that's not the case, apparently.

00:48:13.000 Can you explain he had some deformities?

00:48:17.000 Do your best.

00:48:19.000 So Jeffrey Epstein has admitted this himself.

00:48:21.000 Gillen Maxwell has testified to this.

00:48:24.000 And 99% of the victims have all corroborated each other when they say this.

00:48:28.000 And yeah, apologies for being 18 plus here, but he was proven to have erectile dysfunction.

00:48:36.000 He couldn't get up, basically.

00:48:37.000 He was taking medication for that.

00:48:39.000 It wasn't working.

00:48:40.000 He was taking testosterone for that.

00:48:41.000 He was a very frustrated man.

00:48:43.000 The victims have all stated that he had a deformity as well.

00:48:48.000 He wasn't exactly the biggest of chaps. 1.00

00:48:50.000 Let's just put it that way. 0.98

00:48:52.000 And that he would not have sexual intercourse with them. 0.81

00:48:56.000 If you read the lawsuits themselves and read the testimonies, you'll see that 99% of the time he did not have sexual, like full sex with these people. 0.90

00:49:07.000 He was a person who would get, that's why the massage table was there. 0.86

00:49:11.000 He would be massaged. 0.99

00:49:12.000 And whilst the massage was happening, he would use a toy on one of the girls and he would masturbate. 0.99

00:49:19.000 That's the clean, but that's the cleanest I can put it, Andrew, I'm afraid. 0.99

00:49:23.000 But that's what we're doing.

00:49:25.000 I think people have it in their mind that it's, yeah, there were these girls around. 1.00

00:49:30.000 would want to party with jeffrey epstein and you know they might have done other things but him particularly i i that was a revelation to me because i just was assuming it's interesting how the same thing has come to play with the harvey weinstein case that he also apparently had deformities down there that hinder a lot of the Well, we were talking about this earlier.

00:49:51.000 There is a lot of psychology that's been into this.

00:49:54.000 And some of the biggest people who have committed sexual assault or prolific in committing sexual assault, a very high portion of them have found to have had erectile dysfunction or some sort of deformity.

00:50:07.000 And it internalizes their sexual frustration.

00:50:10.000 And then they lash out on or try and do it other ways, or they're so sexually charged.

00:50:14.000 And Jeffrey Epstein was the most sex-obsessed person I think I've ever read about and looked into.

00:50:20.000 And yeah, yeah, that's not talked about, but it wasn't sex.

00:50:24.000 He was into BDSM.

00:50:25.000 He was into, you know, thing, but his main thing was self-pleasure because he couldn't get anyone else to bring him to that point of satisfaction.

00:50:36.000 That's, I just, I know it's graphic and I apologize to our viewers.

00:50:41.000 I think it's important, though, to get the truth.

00:50:43.000 And the truth is, it's some sort of mix between the lies and the headlines.

00:50:49.000 And I think, you know, it's interesting.

00:50:53.000 We kind of end where we started that President Trump was probably proven right in a lot of it.

00:50:57.000 I do not support the messaging necessarily.

00:51:00.000 I think it was counterproductive. 0.71

00:51:01.000 But President Trump knew this guy was just a creep that was leeching off a lot of people and a fraudster. 0.98

00:51:07.000 And he was a kink, sexually charged, certainly, and has done a lot of bad things. 1.00

00:51:13.000 But a lot of people are getting smeared by guilt by association in this story.

00:51:18.000 And I think that's interesting.

00:51:21.000 Hi, folks.

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00:52:20.000 Blake, please, if you have any other final thoughts here, I'm not necessarily convinced he wasn't working as a sort of an agent of Israel.

00:52:28.000 I'm still very curious about that.

00:52:30.000 And I have questions about Russia.

00:52:32.000 Sure, sure.

00:52:33.000 We should do that.

00:52:34.000 I guess my card's on the table here, but people who've followed us a long time should know.

00:52:39.000 I was always a bit skeptical of this.

00:52:41.000 I've talked to Charlie about Charlie was much more open to a lot of theories on this, on JFK, on a lot of stuff.

00:52:48.000 And it was always my role to kind of say, yeah, I'm the spock of the relationship, I guess, if he's Captain Kirk.

00:52:55.000 And so I've always been a little skeptical on this.

00:52:59.000 And I guess, so I would just say there's been a lot of stuff where people have run ahead with assumptions.

00:53:06.000 And I remember even something that always stood out to me was when it was repeated over and over.

00:53:12.000 Well, they told the U.S. attorney in Miami when he was being prosecuted that Epstein belongs to intelligence.

00:53:18.000 And it was so revealing to me when I'd heard that over and over and over again.

00:53:23.000 And I kind of just assumed, oh, that must be a stone-cold fact.

00:53:26.000 And instead, it was a hearsay claim.

00:53:28.000 And one of the things we got from all these documents was we got into what that U.S. attorney said when he was asked about it in the first Trump administration.

00:53:36.000 He said, no, I actually never said that.

00:53:38.000 So it's not nearly as ironclad that that was true.

00:53:41.000 And I guess what I liked with all of this is it let us pause and say, what do we actually know stone cold for a fact versus what is stuff where innuendo has greatly outrun what you can see in hardware?

00:53:54.000 And I have a question.

00:53:55.000 I have a question related to that.

00:53:57.000 Please, but go ahead.

00:53:58.000 Well, I would say, and honestly, as a journalist, I lost my job for covering this and for putting out this, you know, looking at the other side of the story.

00:54:06.000 But I would say I became very disillusioned with the media.

00:54:10.000 So when we say what is established, I would say start at the beginning with a fresh mind.

00:54:15.000 My book, Naked Lies, is coming out soon, and that contains a lot.

00:54:18.000 But let's just look at how the media are reporting on just very basic things.

00:54:23.000 If you were to Google right now, you will find out that there's a viral claim that Jeffrey Epstein had a baby and that Sarah Ferguson emailed him to congratulate him.

00:54:33.000 And the BBC, which is a very trustworthy organization, supposedly out.

00:54:39.000 Yeah, I don't believe that, but it's considered, considered to be.

00:54:43.000 And yet I proved that actually Sarah Ferguson wasn't congratulating Epstein at all.

00:54:49.000 That email is to one of Jeffrey Epstein's friends, and then he forwards it on to Jeffrey Epstein.

00:54:55.000 In other words, look what Sarah Ferguson has said to me. 0.79

00:54:58.000 I've located the mother, I've located the father, and I've the identity of the child and even the baby scan.

00:55:04.000 That sounds a bit strange.

00:55:06.000 That's how obsessed I get.

00:55:07.000 And yet the BBC have acknowledged that it's not accurate and they haven't corrected it.

00:55:12.000 And so if that's just one thing from just yesterday, we've had nearly 20 years of this case and the media dominating the narrative.

00:55:21.000 And I promise you, there are thousands of examples that I could pull up that show that what 99% of what you think you know about the Jeffrey Epstein scandal is a lie.

00:55:33.000 So I have a question related to, again, so I still think, I'll just be honest, I'm still sort of convinced that he was either, you know, in cahoots with the CIA or, you know, working, working on behalf.

00:55:46.000 Because I just do think that, you know, Israel, you've got these, you know, Jewish Americans, Jewish, there's French Jews, there's UK Jews that, you know, they feel a kindred spirit with the homeland.

00:55:59.000 I have zero problem with that necessarily.

00:56:01.000 Jay, my idea on that, which I've shared with a few people, and I want to hear your take.

00:56:06.000 I've had the thought, what if Jeffrey Epstein insinuated himself with Ehud Barak and others because he himself believed in sort of the myth of Mossad and he thought maybe this would protect me in some way, like almost get it backwards.

00:56:22.000 He wanted to be associated with it.

00:56:24.000 Yeah.

00:56:25.000 And we know, we know that Jeffrey Epstein lied about a lot of things.

00:56:28.000 He lied in his TV.

00:56:30.000 He would tell people certain things, say that he was something that he wasn't.

00:56:34.000 So he could very well have been.

00:56:35.000 You know, we can't prove either way that he will never find out if he was or wasn't a member of Mossad or he was working for intelligence.

00:56:44.000 We can't 100% say he wasn't, but I tend to go with the evidence.

00:56:48.000 And there isn't any evidence so far that states or would suggest that he was.

00:56:54.000 We're going by how connected he was, but there are people very even more connected than he was to Israel and to other organizations.

00:57:03.000 And yet we know that they're not members of Mossad.

00:57:05.000 So we don't know, but it's unlikely.

00:57:07.000 Yeah, I think your point was well made earlier, though.

00:57:09.000 It's like, why would he have to be, you know, connected with Mossad when he could just go over the top of the intel and go straight to, you know, to sort of influence world events?

00:57:17.000 And he was a very curious person, very gregarious, interesting, apparently, to be around.

00:57:23.000 So, so, I, but I do have more questions here.

00:57:26.000 So, when he gets arrested in 2007, 2008 timeframe, he basically gets put on like the most cush house arrest imaginable.

00:57:35.000 Again, that's just one of these clues where I'm like, who's looking out for him?

00:57:38.000 I'll tell you why that is.

00:57:40.000 I can tell you why that is.

00:57:41.000 So, they had, when they first were putting their case together, it was based on this school that they thought, right, we've got him.

00:57:48.000 This is slam dunk.

00:57:50.000 We've got him that he had a sexual encounter with multiple underage girls.

00:57:55.000 But then, what happened was they interviewed the girls and you can read all of their testimonies.

00:58:02.000 Under oath, they admitted that they'd lied about their ages.

00:58:05.000 The focus shifted originally onto Sarah Kellen, one of his assistants, but she was found to have asked about their ages and said, make sure they're over 18 to Virginia and Haley Robson.

00:58:16.000 And then the focus shifted back onto Epstein, but his lawyers did a very good job.

00:58:22.000 Alan Dershowitz was one of them in pointing out the fact that, well, he's taken a lie detector test.

00:58:29.000 It's proven that there are mitigating factors.

00:58:31.000 He's not innocent.

00:58:33.000 He has broken the law, even if he didn't know he was breaking the law at the time.

00:58:36.000 It's irrelevant.

00:58:37.000 So he's soliciting sex, right?

00:58:39.000 I mean, if you, if you're paying soliciting for sex and these girls were getting cars, college tuition, I mean, they were getting that's illegal, right? 1.00

00:58:48.000 Okay, so, so, yeah, yeah, but so I mean, I don't definitely, I mean, that's okay.

00:58:52.000 So, Alan Dershowitz is a good lawyer is the explanation, basically.

00:58:55.000 Not that, not that there were mitigating factors in that, you know, this wasn't just a first they thought, right, we've got a paedophile here who has targeted young girls.

00:59:06.000 That is very easy to send him into prison for a long time.

00:59:10.000 Then, when they realized that actually, no, he didn't target young girls, he didn't say, you know, I want to find some under 18s.

00:59:18.000 When that was established, that's when there were mitigating factors.

00:59:21.000 And the crime, although serious still, it was enough to get him a reduced sentence and to sort of give his defense ammunition to get a lesser charge.

00:59:32.000 Was he what?

00:59:33.000 So, Ghelane Maxwell was his girlfriend at one point, and he sort of loved this about himself.

00:59:40.000 He was proud that he maintained relationships with his ex-girlfriends.

00:59:44.000 Ghillaine essentially is described as his madam.

00:59:47.000 Is that a proper description of her then?

00:59:51.000 No, not at all.

00:59:52.000 No, no.

00:59:52.000 See, I've interviewed most of the so-called victims in all of the elder, the women who were overage at the time that they met Jeffrey Epstein, went to the island, etc., had their cars and apartments paid for them, are documented as asking to go back to the island.

01:00:09.000 Every single one of them has told me that they didn't see Gillene do anything wrong.

01:00:14.000 And two of them have previously told the press that Gillen was part of this massive sex trafficking operation.

01:00:20.000 During her trial, they wrote in victim impact statements, Gillene destroyed my life, that she was the madam, she was running all of this. 1.00

01:00:28.000 And yet, when I've interviewed them after the fact, they've admitted to me, when one of them went crazy when she realized she'd slipped up, that she never once saw Gillene Maxwell recruit anyone, groom anyone, or abuse anyone.

01:00:43.000 So the police, when Jeffrey Epstein died, not the police, sorry, the authorities, they were hugely humiliated and prosecutors, et cetera.

01:00:50.000 They had to get nail someone in her place, in his place. 0.99

01:00:54.000 They had to find someone else for the public to drag onto the pyre and burn as a witch and this massive witch hunt. 0.63

01:01:02.000 And they couldn't go after Virginia or the people who had actually recruited these girls.

01:01:08.000 They couldn't go after Sarah Kellen and some of his assistants who are proven to have arranged and organized the massages because they weren't big names and nobody knew who they were.

01:01:18.000 But here you had Ghillenne Maxwell, a famous name, a socialite, known practically around the world.

01:01:26.000 And she fit the bill, former, former girlfriend of his, and she was perfect.

01:01:30.000 If you look into the actual timeline, you'll see that Gillene is more or less a blip to some extent in Jeffrey Epstein's life.

01:01:38.000 And she was absent completely through a lot of the period, quite a large chunk of the period when some of these victims say that they were abused by Jeffrey Epstein.

01:01:47.000 She was in other relationships.

01:01:49.000 She broke contact briefly with Jeffrey.

01:01:52.000 And the evidence, so part of my evidence that I've found has been included in her habeas corpus, for instance.

01:02:01.000 Her trial was a complete travesty.

01:02:04.000 And that's a different, you could have a whole show just talking about.

01:02:09.000 Do you believe she was guilty?

01:02:11.000 Do you think she's guilty of some wrongdoing?

01:02:15.000 I originally honestly, and I get slated for this, but I originally went into this believing that everyone was telling the truth and that Ghillenne Maxwell must have been guilty and must have known.

01:02:27.000 But the evidence that I've unearthed, all the evidence that's already in existence and anyone can examine it, you know, the other stuff.

01:02:35.000 And people, if they went and read some of the stuff on my substack, they will see that I don't defend her.

01:02:41.000 I just say the evidence shows that she did not commit the crime.

01:02:47.000 She's not guilty.

01:02:48.000 Did she have an accuser?

01:02:50.000 Did she have a relationship with President Bill Clinton?

01:02:53.000 I think she's a very flirty person.

01:02:55.000 I think she's quite, you know, her family, if they were listening, wouldn't like me saying this, but I think she was quite sexually active and flirtatious.

01:03:03.000 But there's no evidence to say that she had a sexual relationship with Bill Clinton.

01:03:08.000 Didn't she reference his private areas?

01:03:13.000 Yeah, but she talked about that. 0.92

01:03:16.000 She mentioned that about many other people.

01:03:18.000 I think in some of the emails, she said, you're well hung.

01:03:21.000 You're hung like a bear and things like this, sort of jokey things.

01:03:25.000 We know that she was associated with Clinton, that she had a friendship with Clinton.

01:03:30.000 She went swimming with Clinton and things like this.

01:03:33.000 And they were at the same events together.

01:03:34.000 But there isn't actually any evidence.

01:03:36.000 One person did claim, but this person was Virginia. 0.98

01:03:41.000 So you have to take it with Pinchfelt that she had given oral sex to Bill Clinton. 0.90

01:03:47.000 But as I say, Virginia has been found to have lied about most of her allegations. 0.95

01:03:52.000 So you just don't know.

01:03:55.000 That's the thing about this.

01:03:56.000 There are certain things that I can prove one million centers and some that you can't.

01:04:00.000 So the final thing I'll ask you about is the Epstein's links to Putin and the Kremlin spies.

01:04:07.000 What do we know about this now from this latest email dump?

01:04:11.000 Yeah.

01:04:11.000 So his reference throughout Putin.

01:04:14.000 And I think now that is going to spawn a massive investigation into potential connections with the Kremlin.

01:04:21.000 We know that Jeffrey Epstein liked to have the control over people in the sense of manipulating politics, attacking Donald Trump.

01:04:30.000 He helped one of the Democrats.

01:04:33.000 He was texting her at the time and telling her how to grill a witness to go after Donald Trump.

01:04:41.000 So he was very keen on feeling powerful, being connected to powerful people.

01:04:46.000 And the documents clearly show that he was coveting a very close relationship with people high up in Russia.

01:04:56.000 And he had a fascination with Russia.

01:04:58.000 People don't mention this, but Jeffrey Epstein was Russia obsessed.

01:05:02.000 He was particularly obsessed with Russian women, young 18 to 20 year olds.

01:05:07.000 And that's because he loved the book Lolita.

01:05:10.000 That doesn't ring, you know, it's not very good in his defense.

01:05:14.000 But he was fascinated with that.

01:05:16.000 He was fascinated with Russian culture and politics.

01:05:19.000 And the documents that are being unearthed now, I'm going to be putting out a series about his Russia connections.

01:05:25.000 But they do show that there was his ties to Russia run far deeper than we thought.

01:05:31.000 Interesting.

01:05:32.000 So there is potentially, in your estimate, you and Blake are like the wet blankets of Epstein conspiracies.

01:05:40.000 So there is, but even you will admit that there is a thread to pull that still needs pulling when it comes to Russia.

01:05:46.000 Okay, fair enough.

01:05:49.000 I have to ask you because just, you know, it's another name that's being asked about.

01:05:56.000 Steve Bannon, what was Steve Bannon's connection to Jeffrey Epstein?

01:06:00.000 And is there any indication from the email and the new files that have been dumped that he did anything untoward, wrong, illegal?

01:06:07.000 Absolutely not.

01:06:08.000 So Steve Bannon, they're going after Steve Bannon because of his past connection with Trump.

01:06:13.000 Steve Bannon did nothing wrong.

01:06:15.000 There is no evidence whatsoever to show that he did anything wrong.

01:06:19.000 In fact, if you read through the Epstein files and all of the evidence that's come before this, you'll see that his part in all of this is very minor and that he wasn't as close to Jeffrey Epstein as anybody assumes.

01:06:32.000 So he did, after Jeffrey Epstein's conviction, Jeffrey Epstein was naturally a great person to interview.

01:06:39.000 That's a scoop to get to get hold of him.

01:06:41.000 Jeffrey Epstein at the same time wanted to exploit that because he wanted to reinvent his image and try and correct some of the negative publicity that was being naturally and understandably directed at him.

01:06:53.000 Steve Bannon approached him.

01:06:54.000 They were talking.

01:06:56.000 They'd already had a connection in the past, very brief association.

01:07:01.000 And then we're seeing now, you can go and watch the interview that Steve Bannon conducted.

01:07:06.000 And that was Steve Bannon does not hold any punches back. 0.69

01:07:11.000 He does, it's a fascinating interview, but he does say, you know, you're a convicted sex offender.

01:07:17.000 He gets Jeffrey Epstein a bit uncomfortable.

01:07:20.000 But as far as any guilt, it goes back to that guilt by association again.

01:07:26.000 You are photographed here or you're documented as having an association with a guy who turned out to be a criminal.

01:07:33.000 Ergo, you must be a criminal.

01:07:34.000 Well, that's completely nonsense. 0.99

01:07:36.000 You know, it's complete nonsense.

01:07:38.000 And there is no evidence to show that Bannon ever did anything wrong.

01:07:41.000 Yeah.

01:07:41.000 And that's, I've, I think that's a fair assumption.

01:07:46.000 I've always been told that it was sort of like post Bannon being in Trump world.

01:07:50.000 He went to go interview and wanted a scoop, wanted a documentary.

01:07:54.000 You know, it seems like it, you know, checks the smell tests, but we'll see as well.

01:08:01.000 We have to remember as well.

01:08:03.000 We have to remember that Epstein was very keen to go after Donald Trump.

01:08:07.000 They'd had this fallout.

01:08:08.000 You can read the emails where he's really criticizing Donald Trump.

01:08:12.000 He helped actively, the House Democrats try to smear Donald Trump.

01:08:16.000 Now, if Epstein, that goes to another point we were talking about earlier.

01:08:20.000 If Epstein had any information that was damaging against Donald Trump, he would have released it.

01:08:27.000 He didn't have any.

01:08:28.000 He didn't have anything against Donald Trump to release.

01:08:31.000 He was trying to find other ways, desperately scraping the barrel, just like the lawyers and the journalists are doing now, to attack Donald Trump.

01:08:39.000 But he didn't have anything damaging.

01:08:41.000 Well, and I've also heard the theory floated that Steve was also doing some counterintelligence to see if there was what the attack vectors could be.

01:08:53.000 I haven't spoken with him about it.

01:08:54.000 I've been doing video.

01:08:55.000 So that's another theory.

01:08:57.000 Jay Beecher, please let everybody know how they can follow you, how they can follow along in your upcoming book.

01:09:03.000 Yeah, sure.

01:09:03.000 So if you head over to my sub stack, I think it's at JayBeecher or go to the rebeljournalist.com and you can subscribe to me there.

01:09:12.000 It's riddled with exclusive interviews with most of the key players, with Donald Trump's lawyer, with the Maxwell family, with the accused and the accusers.

01:09:22.000 And my book, Naked Lies, is going to be covering my six-year investigation.

01:09:27.000 And there are some really, there's some evidence that I've had to hold back for the book.

01:09:31.000 So there's some really explosive things that when the book comes out, it's going to, there's going to be a mini earthquake, I think, in this.

01:09:39.000 It'll make some headlines and change some minds as well.

01:09:44.000 So it should be coming out at the end of this month, at the very latest at the first week of next month.

01:09:50.000 But it's looking to be the end of this month.

01:09:52.000 Well, congratulations on the book.

01:09:53.000 That's always a huge undertaking.

01:09:55.000 So Jay, thank you for your time.

01:09:57.000 Thank you for, you know, I'm sure the emails are going to be very upset at us, but that's, I'm sure, doesn't matter.

01:10:05.000 We're asking you the questions you're giving your POV.

01:10:08.000 It is what you're doing.

01:10:09.000 Just direct the hate to me.

01:10:10.000 Don't worry.

01:10:10.000 Just say, you know, don't shoot the messages.

01:10:13.000 Listen, one of them says you're full of poop emoji, but yeah, you know, I don't care.

01:10:18.000 We get a few of those every day.

01:10:20.000 All right.

01:10:20.000 Jay Beecher, thank you so much for your time.

01:10:23.000 Looking forward to Naked Lies coming out at the end of this month, early at the latest, early next month.

01:10:29.000 Thank you for your perspective and all of that hard work that you've done.

01:10:32.000 You've interviewed a ton of people.

01:10:34.000 Thanks, guys.

01:10:34.000 No, I appreciate you having me on.

01:10:36.000 Absolutely.

01:10:37.000 Take care.

01:10:37.000 Thanks very much.

The Charlie Kirk Show - February 05, 2026

Jeffrey Epstein: The Myths, The Facts, And What's Still Missing

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