On this episode of the Charlie Kirk Show, my exclusive conversation with Speaker Newt Gingrich with his new book, Beyond Biden, we talk about how Nancy Pelosi is a thug, and so much more. You're going to really enjoy this insightful conversation.
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00:03:13.000Well, first of all, it's always great to be with you, and you do an amazing show.
00:03:18.000When I sat down and tried to decide on my next book, I decided not to do an anti-Biden book, which obviously would have been pretty popular, at least among our folks, because I thought Biden himself would prove to be sufficiently anti-Biden.
00:03:32.000And that's exactly what's been happening.
00:03:34.000But I was concerned about the country.
00:03:37.000What are the things that when Republicans get back in charge, they should focus on?
00:03:43.000Because it's not enough to just be anti.
00:03:46.000We have a real competitor with China, which is, I think, a genuine danger to eliminating our freedom and our independence.
00:03:53.000We have great challenges in our inner cities, both from crime and in education.
00:03:59.000We have a huge challenge on the border with illegal immigration.
00:04:04.000And so I wanted to write a book that was beyond just being anti-Biden and that really talked about this is the kind of stuff we're going to have to do.
00:04:13.000We got to roll our sleeves up if we're going to be successful as a country.
00:04:17.000And I absolutely think we have to think in terms of modernizing America.
00:04:23.000We have very old bureaucracies that are based on the industrial era.
00:04:29.000And that includes the Pentagon, which we just saw in Afghanistan.
00:04:33.000It includes NASA, which has had a particularly large project that is absurdly overpriced, two of them actually, that are extraordinary over budget and over time.
00:04:43.000It includes all the major bureaucracies in Washington and from them, parallel bureaucracies at the state and local level.
00:04:52.000And Beyond Biden is my effort to begin to communicate how big the changes have to be.
00:04:58.000Well, and I appreciate it because there is this ongoing debate, and I would love your take on it of how much do we talk about of things that happened, like the 2020 election?
00:05:09.000How much do we focus on things that need to be done?
00:05:12.000And then how much do we focus on things that are currently happening, such as the Biden regime?
00:05:16.000You're making the argument that we need to have a little bit more of a forward-thinking approach, obviously not discounting things that happened previously.
00:05:25.000What's the correct balance in that sense?
00:05:28.000Well, I think other than stipulating that the 2020 election was rigged, where we have a brilliant book by Hemingway entitled Riggs.
00:05:44.000Overwhelmingly, the American people want you to prove who you are.
00:05:48.000They want the votes to be honest and accurate.
00:05:50.000And we're seeing in most of the Republican states serious, methodical election reforms to get to honest elections where everybody gets to vote, but we know who they are.
00:06:03.000Then I think I would sort of argue for a two-step process.
00:06:09.000Inflation is terrible and is a natural consequence of big government socialism.
00:06:14.000And therefore, here's what we would do about it.
00:06:17.000The border being uncontrolled is a disaster.
00:06:20.000And therefore, here's what we would do about it.
00:06:22.000So I think it's always, it should always be a one punch at them and then an open hand offering a better future on our side.
00:06:30.000And I think if we do that, then when we do win, and I think we're going to win big next year and even bigger in 2024, then we enter office knowing what we're going to do.
00:06:41.000That's part of what we did with the contract with America is we had 10 major goals.
00:06:48.000And the result was when we did win the first majority in 40 years, we're in a position to actually do what we promised.
00:06:57.000And I think that's a very, you know, the thing that drives people crazy is when, for example, Biden runs as a unifier and promptly is a divider.
00:07:06.000I think people, you know, people would like to know in advance, what are you really going to do and do you mean it?
00:07:11.000And so in the book Beyond Biden, you have a couple of different parts.
00:07:14.000The first part is we will win again, which I appreciate the optimistic and forward-thinking tone.
00:07:19.000Then you say rebuilding the America we love.
00:07:22.000And one of the topics I want to zero in on is you say understanding and defeating wokeism and the moral case against wokeism.
00:07:29.000Mr. Speaker, I would argue that wokeism gives us, the conservative movement, an opportunity to build a coalition that we have not had since the Soviet Union, where it's like, if we do not defeat this, then almost nothing else matters.
00:07:43.000And then talk a little bit about the existential threat posed by the diversity, equity, inclusion, wokeism regime that seems to run almost every major part of American life.
00:07:54.000Well, I think we just had a real demonstration of this in the Youngton campaign in Virginia.
00:08:01.000It was when Glenn Younkin went to Loudoun County and met with a thousand people who were angry about the schools.
00:08:09.000They were angry about critical race theory, which is essentially racism on the left.
00:08:14.000They were angry about being taught false history in the 1619 project that's designed to fundamentally undermine America.
00:08:22.000They were angry about the elimination of grades and opportunities for excellence.
00:08:27.000And when they came together, all of a sudden a campaign, a normal Republican campaign, might have been just on the economy.
00:08:36.000And certainly the old-time establishment Republicans would have said, oh, don't touch these issues.
00:08:41.000But I think Glenn realized when they looked at these thousand people that there was an energy and a drive coming in Virginia that was going to change everything.
00:08:49.000And by the way, that energy included Latinos, it included Asian Americans, it included African Americans.
00:08:57.000There was a real interest from ethnic groups who really care about education because they understand that's the road for their children to rise to a better future.
00:09:09.000And they see attacks on, for example, excellence in education as attacks on their children's future.
00:09:15.000So I think that we have an opportunity to forge an alliance.
00:09:20.000And for example, Governor DeSantis, running against an African-American opponent, got 19% of the black female vote in Florida on the issue of school choice because black mothers wanted their children to have a better future, felt that the unionized bureaucratic government schools weren't succeeding.
00:09:42.000And as a result, 19% of them, one out of every five basically, voted against the African-American liberal Democrat in favor of the Republican conservative because he was campaigning for their children to have a better future.
00:09:57.000So I do think taking on wokeism in all of its various forms and, you know, pretty simple model.
00:10:04.000The purpose of the Defense Department is to win wars.
00:10:08.000It's not to be a social rehabilitation agency.
00:10:11.000And what they're doing to it is risking the defeat of America by undermining the warfighting capabilities of the American military.
00:10:22.000Look, on a daily basis, conservative men are being inundated with garbage.
00:10:26.000All these ads about overpriced boxers or these slick ad campaigns, it's nonsense.
00:10:31.000I, speaking, like to keep it private, but I'm happy to tell you about a wonderful company.
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00:11:01.000Under Tech is durable, fade resistant, shrink-resistant, and ultra-lightweight.
00:11:30.000And I think we're starting to see a consensus amongst even establishment Republicans that this needs to be rooted out and defeated.
00:11:37.000So, Mr. Speaker, something I don't quite understand, and Yunkin kind of, I think, stumbled into this, is why Republicans do not continually embrace the sort of very specific, clear, and transparent contract with America that you led with in the 90s.
00:11:53.000If there were to be a contract with America today for this next election in 2022, what would it be?
00:12:01.000Why is it that Republicans just seem to not be able to get out of their own way when it comes to this?
00:12:06.000Well, look, I think there's an old tradition in the Republican Party, particularly among the country club Republicans, that they're better than that, that they don't get their hands dirty with those kind of issues.
00:12:19.000And I think part of what Trump did was he broke loose both the basically anti-confrontation Republicans who disliked Trump and became known for Trumpers, and he broke loose the blue-collar workers of every ethnic background.
00:12:36.000Remember, Trump in 2020 got a higher percentage of the minority vote than any Republican in 60 years.
00:12:44.000And that's because he was willing to take on and talk very bluntly and candidly about people who have radical views and want to profoundly change America.
00:12:56.000Now, I think, and this is where I think Glenn Young may be a very important figure in American history.
00:13:03.000Young could be a natural sort of establishment Republican.
00:13:09.000He was the co-chair of the Carlisle Group, which is the largest investment group in the mid-Atlantic.
00:13:16.000But he found that the hunger was to take on the left on their awoke values.
00:13:25.000And he was smart enough to respond and realize as a leader that he'd have a lot bigger army if he was prepared to roll up his sleeves and get in the middle of that fight.
00:13:34.000And I would say for next year, first of all, for the first time since 1994, I now advocate that we do have a contract with America both next year and again in 2024.
00:13:46.000And I would say that education issues have to be at the center of that.
00:13:52.000Now, I also would argue that we want to have a balanced budget at the center of it because we did balance the budget for four years when I was speaker.
00:14:02.000And nothing will force dramatic change in government waste and government corruption as rapidly as insisting on a balanced budget.
00:14:10.000So I think that's in a way a moral issue also.
00:14:13.000And frankly, something on crime and police has to be done.
00:14:16.000When you have the largest increase in murders in one year in American history, you know that even in the big cities which are nominally Democrat, there are a lot of people who are scared and who want more police, not less.
00:14:31.000They want them better trained, but they want more of them.
00:14:34.000And I think, again, Republicans should embrace that kind of position.
00:14:38.000And so, Mr. Speaker, you've seen a lot, and I'd love your take on the FBI and Merritt Garland Department of Justice now having special threat tags to go after parents that show up at these school board meetings.
00:14:53.000A lot of people please, yes, go ahead.
00:14:55.000No, I think, first of all, I think it's scary when the Department of Justice becomes a political arm that is pursuing people for political reasons.
00:15:05.000I think that's actually frightening and is a serious step towards a police state in the worst sense.
00:15:12.000Second, I think that just the absurdity.
00:15:15.000You have lots and lots of Chinese agents penetrating America.
00:15:21.000You have the largest increase in murders in modern times.
00:15:25.000And you have 1,400,000 illegal immigrants breaking the law, coming into the U.S. without any COVID test, without any check on their criminal background.
00:15:38.000But the FBI is going to worry about parents.
00:15:42.000Now, if you want an example of why I think big government socialists are crazy, here is a perfect example, how they could possibly have a meeting and say, you know what we really need to do is shift our resources because of these dangerous parents who sometimes even get angry at the lying people who have been ruining their children's lives.
00:16:09.000The idea that that is a, first of all, that's a question for the FBI as opposed to local police maintaining order.
00:16:16.000And second, the idea that that outranks the Chinese terrorists, murders, and illegal immigrants tells you that this administration, you know, I think has, I don't think it has a political problem.
00:16:26.000I think they have a mental health problem.
00:16:29.000Yeah, and that's a question, isn't it?
00:17:30.000And his point is that leftism is a virus and it gets in your brain and you can't argue with these people because the virus in their brain won't allow them to listen to reason.
00:17:43.000And it really moved me when we had him on my podcast and I decided, you know, that the best single explanation of this is that these people are crazy.
00:17:53.000And so I was asked yesterday, you know, by somebody, we were in a meeting talk about how you deal with public debate.
00:18:00.000And somebody said, well, you know, what do you do when somebody just gets up and says you're a racist?
00:18:05.000And I said, well, I laugh and say you must be crazy.
00:18:10.000I mean, a person who thinks, you know, and particularly when you realize that they think Clarence Thomas can't be black because he's a conservative or the new lieutenant governor of Virginia can't be black because she's a Republican.
00:18:22.000And what you're dealing with, of course, is a pathology, not an ideology.
00:18:53.000Especially you look at what they're doing with James O'Keefe and Project Veritas.
00:18:56.000We are seeing the weaponization of the Justice Department in a way that I have not seen.
00:19:02.000What wisdom do you have to share of actually a roadmap to actually start to fix some of this?
00:19:07.000Well, first of all, they have to have investigations and hearings and use subpoena power, and they have to get all the internal documents.
00:19:14.000We have a pretty good notion now, for example, that the National School Board Association was actually being coached by the White House in order to write the letter for the Justice Department.
00:19:25.000And the Justice Department was already prepared to issue the orders as soon as they got the letter.
00:19:30.000No, I think having that laid out, and then frankly, they should move to impeach the Attorney General Garland because he clearly is violating the rule of law.
00:19:42.000They should move to replace the head of the FBI, and they should use the power of the purse.
00:19:48.000They should say very clearly, if you don't clean this up, we're going to cut your budget in half.
00:20:53.000We've had a couple of cycles where the system was pretty corrupt.
00:20:57.000But these guys are, and they're so blatantly arrogant and so willing to lock you up.
00:21:04.000And again, the sadness of watching the New York Times side with the police state against Project Veritas, which is totally in the long run, in the disinterest of the New York Times, because they're setting up a stage here where the government could intervene and seize things that historically have been protected.
00:21:27.000And I think that's very, very, very dangerous.
00:21:30.000We're not going to be a free society if the Pelosi dictatorship in the House and the Department of Justice kind of attitude, which is dictatorial, continues to grow and spread.
00:21:45.000Did you get hit with a big tax bill you weren't expecting?
00:21:48.000With rates being very low and home equity being high, perfect time to refinance.
00:21:51.000Look, we're all about refinancing all this.
00:22:52.000When you go take out a loan with Chase, when you go take out a loan with Wells Fargo, you might as well go give the money to Joe Biden.
00:23:00.000So when you go to DC next and you go travel, maybe with your family, why don't you just get a cashier's check and drop it off at the White House entrance?
00:23:08.000That's what you're doing when you bank with these woke losers at Wells Fargo.
00:23:14.000So take out a loan with the good guys.
00:24:07.000Well, I'm pleased to hear that, Mr. Speaker, because kind of my one of the themes we've been having on this show is inflation is a major crisis, China is, but the domestic police state issue has to be a top priority for House Republicans and Senate Republicans, given the opportunity they have.
00:25:04.000Well, look, I think I was very privileged as a young congressman to work with Ronald Reagan in 1979-80 when he was a candidate to help organize the first Capitol Steps event,
00:25:19.000which led to us winning control of the Senate and to see a presidential campaign which was ready to govern and which, with the help of the Heritage Foundation, which wrote a book called Mandate for Change, which had 250 experts.
00:25:35.000And the people who wrote each chapter ended up being recruited by Reagan to run the part of the government that he wrote about.
00:25:41.000So we really had a dramatic positive impact from day one.
00:25:46.000Similarly, when we did the contract with America, we got every single member of the House Republicans who were running to sign the contract.
00:25:54.000And therefore, we knew the day after the election what we were going to be doing for the first hundred days.
00:26:00.000And it gave us a unity and a purpose of real reform.
00:26:05.000And I think the Republicans have to do something like that next year because the worst thing that could happen to them would be to win, flounder around, accomplish nothing, and set the stage for them to recover in 26 or in 24.
00:26:35.000And I have a simple test, which is to take almost any topic like buying gasoline, buying food, looking at illegal immigrants coming across the border, and simply asking the question, do you think this is working?
00:26:47.000And then everybody who's in the it ain't working coalition, which will be much bigger than the Republican Party.
00:26:55.000I think then you have a chance to put together the American people and to start rolling up your sleeves and getting things fixed.
00:27:01.000So, but, you know, I hope they're listening to you, and they should.
00:27:04.000I think you're the best speaker the Republican Party has had.
00:27:08.000And especially, you see what you got done in the 90s.
00:27:15.000You know, he has to do a very tough balancing act.
00:27:17.000He is unlike Boehner and Ryan, where he does not declare war on the base of the party, which obviously I sympathize with.
00:27:24.000What is your public advice to what Speaker McCarthy has to do to balance the different camps?
00:27:29.000And what should he do with the Kinzinger-Cheney types that seem to be more kind of Democrat lights and they want to just keep on the carousel of going after Trump?
00:27:39.000In the difficult job of being Speaker, what would your wisdom be in that?
00:27:42.000You know, I've thought about it a lot because I was Speaker and I've thought about how do you handle certain kinds of problems.
00:27:50.000First of all, I think Kevin's done a good job overall.
00:29:37.000They won't be able to go home and say that they weren't given a chance.
00:29:40.000But we're not going to pretend that somebody who is a total turkey has got to be treated with respect.
00:29:47.000And we're going to take every single Democrat and require them to come and appear before the executive committee of the Republican Party if they want to get a committee of any kind.
00:30:00.000And if they don't want to come and appear, they will have no committee assignment next year because Pelosi has set the terms.
00:30:07.000And the terms are majority party gets to totally run over the minority party.
00:30:11.000And we're going to take that playbook.
00:30:13.000We may not do it the second time we're in charge, but for the very first time we're in charge for 22, for 23 and 24, we are going to let Democrats learn that there is, in fact, payback.
00:30:25.000And I think to not do that would be a terrible mistake.
00:31:26.000And I thought, you know, let me give him a real feel for this.
00:31:28.000So I picked one of them and got him to stand where the president stands when he says, gives the state of the union.
00:31:36.000Then I picked another one from Latvia and I got him to sit in the speaker's chair behind the president.
00:31:43.000I pointed out that the speaker is above the president during the state of the union, and so is the president of the Senate, who was the vice president, because the president's there as their guest.
00:31:54.000But in that room, he is actually subordinate to these two.
00:31:58.000Well, the guy from Latvia comes down out of the chair and he's physically trembling.
00:32:04.000And he says to me, you know, all these years from the time Russia occupied us in 1940, those of us in Latvia really knew that America was our friend.
00:32:13.000And we never believed any of the propaganda.
00:32:16.000And he said, you've allowed me to sit at the center of freedom on the planet.
00:32:22.000Now, that was his view of the U.S. House.
00:32:53.000And by the way, you can tell the difference.
00:32:55.000I was in the Senate yesterday wandering around by myself without a name tag, without having to be escorted.
00:33:04.000You go to the House, they meet with whistleblowers off of Capitol Hill because otherwise the whistleblower is recorded by the Capitol Police as they enter the buildings.
00:33:15.000I mean, she has established on the House side of the Hill a dictatorship.
00:33:21.000And literally, I'm embarrassed to say this because I'm a creature of the House, but the Senate today is much freer and much more open than the U.S. House.
00:33:43.000Well, you bring in people who are for it and people who are against it.
00:33:47.000And you have hearings and they go on the record and you ask them questions.
00:33:51.000And inevitably, you improve it because there are lots of people in this country who know vastly more than congressmen about any specific topic.
00:34:06.000And some of the amendments pass, some of the amendments fail.
00:34:08.000Then you go to the full committee and you do the same thing.
00:34:12.000Then you have to go to a rules committee and make the case for why what you're doing is important enough that they should give you a rule to be heard on the House floor and to be voted on.
00:34:22.000Then you go to the floor, you make speeches in favor and speeches against, and then you normally have an amending process again to improve the bill.
00:34:32.000And then you finally get to final passage.
00:34:34.000Now, you've gone through a series of open public things.
00:34:38.000One of the things I was proudest of when I became Speaker is we created the Thomas system.
00:34:44.000And Bill Archer, the chairman of Ways and Means, got up one day in January, holding a card that he read from and said, I have just filed the Tax Cut Act of 1995.
00:34:57.000And that act is available for free on the internet at the Thomas system.
00:35:06.000You don't have to belong to an association.
00:35:09.000You personally can go and read it yourself.
00:35:12.000Now, compare that to the secrecy of a multi-trillion dollar bill being introduced one night and voted on the next day by a group of robots who are lockstep because they're terrified of Pelosi.
00:35:27.000And you can see that everything we think of as freedom is being crushed by the Pelosi dictatorship.
00:35:34.000I think it's truly more frightening than the Justice Department because in the end, if you end up with a Congress which is totally dictatorial, it will then lead to an even more dictatorial government.
00:35:48.000Look, if you've been keeping up with the news, or even if you haven't been, you might hear the word tapering being used a lot.
00:35:55.000It's the new Federal Reserve new buzzword, and you'll hear all kinds of meaning and definition for it.
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00:37:43.000We're being blackmailed in ways that we've never been before.
00:37:47.000And what Pelosi's endgame is, I'm not really sure.
00:37:49.000And I want to ask you that, Mr. Speaker, because this is something that I've actually been struggling with, and it involves Biden.
00:37:54.000And again, the book is called Beyond Biden.
00:37:57.000Usually when a president becomes less popular and starts to go down in approval ratings, they kind of pause and they don't continue or they don't accelerate the things that are kind of, let's say, attributable to their non-popularity or unpopularity.
00:38:15.000Why do you think that this regime in the Biden White House is almost putting the foot on the gas pedal as they become less popular?
00:38:26.000I think they think that their defeat is inevitable and that this is their one moment to try to radically change America before they're thrown out and that there's nothing they can do to avoid it.
00:38:38.000Because, you know, Bill Clinton was never forgiven by the left for having worked with me.
00:38:48.000And in the spring of 1995, after we had taken control for the first time in 40 years, Clinton's advisors all said to him, you know, stick to the left, do the things that the true faith requires.
00:39:04.000And Clinton, who'd been an Arkansas Democrat, was more centrist than most Democrats, and who had been defeated for reelection in 1980 and learned from that that, in fact, you could make people mad enough, they'd throw you out.
00:39:17.000And then came back and won again in 82 and served after that.
00:39:21.000Clinton said to him, if I do what you want me to do, I'm going to get beat in 1996.
00:39:39.000You'll notice when the president comes into the State of the Union, they always give the Speaker and the President of the Senate a copy of their speech before they speak.
00:39:47.000So Clinton comes in, hands Al Gore a copy of the speech and hands me an envelope.
00:39:54.000And I look at Gore and I open the envelope and it says, from William Jefferson Clinton to Speaker Newt Gingrich, you are right.
00:40:41.000So Biden is sitting there thinking to himself, I'd rather go down as the hero of the left than stay here selling out to all these people and being reviled by my base.
00:40:54.000So I think they've made the decision consciously.
00:40:56.000And of course, look at the age of Schumer and of Pelosi and of the other two senior leaders in the House Party.
00:41:04.000These folks are all at the point in their lives where they better get it done now because they ain't going to get it done 10 years from now.
00:41:13.000And if the polls are hold up the way they are now, they're just going to get annihilated.
00:41:18.000I mean, this will be the biggest defeat for the Democratic Party since before Franklin Roosevelt.
00:41:24.000You have to go back to the 20s, I think, to see the scale of the defeat that's coming.
00:41:28.000And I don't think there's anything the Democrats can do to change that.
00:41:32.000In fact, it seems as if they want to still pass the Build Back Better plan.
00:41:36.000And so that's my last question is we kind of talked a little about this, what Republicans need to do and what they need to focus on, which is your prediction, you could pair it to 1994 and 2010.
00:41:49.000We have some young listeners, Mr. Speaker.
00:41:52.000My last question will be, just remind people what you did in 1994, the profound and historic nature there, and the similarities you see between the two.
00:42:01.000Well, in 1994, we had not been the Republicans in the House, had not been in a majority for 40 years.
00:42:08.000So people assumed that we would lose and that we'd still be in the minority.
00:42:13.000And when we won 53 seats and became a majority, it was a huge shock.
00:42:18.000What made it a bigger shock was we did it with a document called the Contract with America, which everybody had signed.
00:42:24.000We had a big event on the Capitol steps.
00:42:31.000So we actually knew in the first 100 days everything we were going to do.
00:42:36.000And we worked very hard and we actually got it all done in about 93 days.
00:42:40.000But one of the keys was that everything we picked had 70% approval or better.
00:42:47.000So we're in a position to know that if you defended what we were talking about, you were inevitably going to have seven or eight out of every 10 people agreeing with you.
00:42:58.000Welfare reform would be an example, reforming the House, making the House operate under the same laws as everybody else, balancing the federal budget, cutting taxes to create jobs.
00:43:42.000And, you know, we're tied in the Senate only because we were incredibly stupid in Georgia, or we'd have a majority.
00:43:49.000And we're right at the edge of breaking through on the House and having maybe the biggest majority since 1928.
00:43:56.000So, you know, I think it was a historic moment.
00:43:59.000But I would also say to 14-year-olds who are listening, you have a great, great future.
00:44:05.000You look at SpaceX, you look at the likelihood that people who are listening to this podcast are going to, in fact, in the end, be on Mars, be on the moon, have lives of enormous adventure.
00:44:17.000We're going to continue to have breakthroughs in healthcare and biology.
00:44:21.000People are going to live longer and healthier.
00:44:24.000And I'm excited about the next 40 or 50 years.
00:44:27.000And that's why I wrote Beyond Biden, because I wanted to communicate: don't just get gloomy and down because these people are idiots.
00:44:34.000Recognize that this is a free country and we have techniques for getting rid of idiots.
00:44:38.000We wipe them out in the election and these guys will be gone.
00:44:42.000And then you will have heard the last laugh from Kamala Harris, which will be a positive thing for civic culture.