The Charlie Kirk Show - March 27, 2025


Protecting Your Kids From the Rainbow Mafia


Episode Stats


Length

41 minutes

Words per minute

185.172

Word count

7,626

Sentence count

611

Harmful content

Misogyny

2

sentences flagged

Hate speech

6

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode of The Charlie Kirk Show, host Charlie Kirk is joined by Sean Spicer to discuss Mike Waltz's claim that he and Jeffrey Goldberg were in a secret, top-secret group chat. Is this true or false?

Transcript

Transcripts from "The Charlie Kirk Show" are sourced from the Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool. Explore them interactively here.
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 Hey, everybody.
00:00:00.000 We explore more of this idea of the signal group chat.
00:00:03.000 Is Mike Waltz telling the truth or not?
00:00:05.000 I want to hear from you.
00:00:06.000 Freedom at charliekirk.com.
00:00:07.000 Also, subscribe to our podcast.
00:00:09.000 That is the Charlie Kirk Show podcast page.
00:00:11.000 And get involved with Turning Point USA at tpusa.com.
00:00:14.000 That is tpusa.com.
00:00:16.000 Also, we have a great partner here from the Tuttle Twins.
00:00:19.000 It's tuttletwins.com slash Charlie, tuttletwins.com slash Charlie, tuttletwins.com.
00:00:25.000 You're going to love this conversation.
00:00:27.000 If you're a parent, grandparent, make sure you guys listen to this entire episode.
00:00:31.000 You're going to love it.
00:00:32.000 Email me, freedom at charliekirk.com.
00:00:34.000 Buckle up, everybody.
00:00:35.000 Here we go.
00:00:36.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
00:00:37.000 Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.
00:00:39.000 I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
00:00:43.000 Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
00:00:46.000 I want to thank Charlie.
00:00:47.000 He's an incredible guy.
00:00:48.000 His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
00:00:56.000 We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
00:01:05.000 That's why we are here.
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00:01:18.000 Learn how you can protect your wealth with Noble Gold Investments at noblegoldinvestments.com.
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00:01:33.000 Okay, everybody, welcome back.
00:01:35.000 Email us, freedom at charliekirk.com, and subscribe to our podcast.
00:01:38.000 Joining us now is Sean Spicer, host of the Sean Spicer Show, great man and great American.
00:01:44.000 Sean, welcome to the program.
00:01:46.000 Sean, what is your take on this entire Signal chat story?
00:01:50.000 I use Signal a lot.
00:01:51.000 You've used Signal a lot.
00:01:52.000 Something here does not add up.
00:01:55.000 Either Mike Waltz is totally lying, or Signal was compromised by the CIA.
00:02:02.000 One or the other, which is it?
00:02:04.000 Yeah, well, look, I mean, keep in mind, so there's a few things to this story that need to be taken care of, because the media and the Democrats are taking this and blowing everything up and using terms that, frankly, with all due respect, they have no right, I mean, they have no understanding of.
00:02:17.000 When they throw out words like war plan, classified.
00:02:21.000 Those might be words, but they actually have meaning, right?
00:02:24.000 So there are operational plans, we call them O-plans.
00:02:27.000 They're sensitive, classified, or confidential, secret, top secret.
00:02:32.000 The first thing that we got to get out of the way is that...
00:02:34.000 Clearly, from what John Radcliffe, the CIA director, said yesterday, Signal is an authorized platform.
00:02:40.000 The second issue is what was being discussed.
00:02:43.000 Was it classified or not?
00:02:44.000 I trust the folks, you know, the CIA director, the DNI director, to determine that more than a bunch of lefty media types that have no experience in this.
00:02:53.000 And then the third thing is what you're talking about, Charlie, which is how does Jeffrey Goldberg get into this chat?
00:02:59.000 Now, Mike Waltz, as you said, or alluded to, He's admitted.
00:03:02.000 He went on Laura Ingraham last night and said, I'm the guy who created this group chat.
00:03:06.000 But how did he get in his phone book?
00:03:09.000 Right? And that's where I think the big issue is, is that Walt said last night, I don't know.
00:03:13.000 Now, here's the deal.
00:03:14.000 When I first met Jeffrey Goldberg, I called to yell at him in the 2016-2017 transition because his publication had this gadfly horrible person named Julia Offey who wrote a disgusting and despicable story about Ivanka Trump.
00:03:30.000 And I called to yell at him and said, hey, I know we've never met.
00:03:33.000 Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
00:03:34.000 So he's in my phone.
00:03:35.000 So I went to Signal and I said, okay, let me kind of recreate this.
00:03:38.000 How would he?
00:03:39.000 Signal imports all of your contacts.
00:03:42.000 They're in your phone to the thing.
00:03:44.000 So one has to assume either Mike Waltz, and by the way, Jeffrey Goldberg admits that he's only met Waltz maybe once, maybe twice, several years ago.
00:03:53.000 And that's Washington for you.
00:03:55.000 Hey, I was at an event, we were at a forum, we crossed paths.
00:03:58.000 But how did his number end up in his phone book?
00:04:01.000 Because Waltz says, I don't know, I've never talked to him.
00:04:04.000 That's the question.
00:04:05.000 That I think is important here.
00:04:07.000 Because there's a lot of theories.
00:04:09.000 Like, you think about this.
00:04:10.000 The U.S. trade rep is Jameson Greer, JG.
00:04:13.000 So if you're looking down initials in your phone book, you mistakenly get the wrong JG, not Jeffrey Goldberg, Jameson Greer.
00:04:19.000 Bring him in.
00:04:19.000 Okay. But how did he end up in the phone book in the first place, in his list of contacts?
00:04:24.000 And that's where I think the Waltz team is saying, hey, we're asking the tech folks to look at this.
00:04:30.000 Because you're right.
00:04:30.000 At some point, this is going to come out.
00:04:33.000 Right? It's, did you personally add him in or did somebody else do it?
00:04:36.000 But there's only two ways that that can happen.
00:04:39.000 Right. And so, other than that, or something even more nefarious happened, like the intel agencies hacked this group chat, which is a very low probability.
00:04:48.000 But let's just play some of the statements from Mike Waltz.
00:04:54.000 His denials, I mean, outright denials, saying that Waltz claims the staffer did not put his contact in.
00:05:01.000 Let's play cut 232. 0.82
00:05:03.000 So your staffer did not put his contact information.
00:05:08.000 No, no, no.
00:05:09.000 But how did it end up in your phone?
00:05:10.000 That's what we're trying to figure out.
00:05:12.000 But that's a pretty big problem.
00:05:14.000 That is what we've got in the best technical minds, right?
00:05:18.000 That's disturbing.
00:05:18.000 And that's where, I mean, I'm sure everybody out there has had a contact.
00:05:23.000 It was said one person and then a different phone number.
00:05:26.000 But you've never talked to him before, so how's the number on your phone?
00:05:28.000 I mean, I'm not an expert on any of this, but it's just curious.
00:05:31.000 How's the number on your phone?
00:05:32.000 Well, if you have somebody else's contact and then somehow it gets sucked in.
00:05:36.000 Oh, someone sent you that contact.
00:05:37.000 It gets sucked in.
00:05:38.000 Was there someone else supposed to be on the chat that wasn't on the chat that you thought was on the chat?
00:05:41.000 So the person that I thought was on there was never on there.
00:05:45.000 It was this guy.
00:05:46.000 Who was that person supposed to be?
00:05:47.000 Well, I'm not.
00:05:48.000 Look, Laura, I take responsibility.
00:05:50.000 I built the group.
00:05:52.000 I mean, I'm sorry, Sean, getting sucked in.
00:05:55.000 I use Signal all the time.
00:05:57.000 I have no idea what he's talking about here.
00:05:59.000 Well, that's why I thought what was weird is that, like, so I get that, like, so what he's alluding to is I have Charlie Kirk in my phone, but gosh, you know, instead of Charlie Kirk's phone number, I have, you know, Bob Smith.
00:06:13.000 And so I think I'm texting you, and that seems to be what he was saying.
00:06:17.000 I don't get that.
00:06:18.000 Right? In other words, what he was saying is, and again, I'm just speculating, but JG, Jameson Greer, the U.S. trade rep, that would make sense.
00:06:25.000 Okay, so what he seems to be saying is, I thought I was adding somebody to the text, and it turns out that it was Jeffrey Goldberg's number.
00:06:32.000 Right? And my point is, okay, that still doesn't, you still have, like, no one goes, like, that's just...
00:06:38.000 I mean, that to me...
00:06:53.000 Okay, but the idea that you thought you were contacting somebody else and their numbers were just transposed, I've never had that happen, right?
00:07:01.000 I mean, that to me...
00:07:03.000 And also, just like, let's face it, Jamison Greer just happens to have a one-off phone number than Jeffrey Goldberg.
00:07:10.000 This is where I hope he does get the best technical minds to look at this.
00:07:15.000 Right. And so the other thing about Signal, if you and I were to talk on Signal a lot, Sean, and then I went to go create a new message and I put S in, the people you contact the most are elevated, actually, in the suggested and recommended the next contacts.
00:07:31.000 In order for this to be true, somebody who added Jeffrey Goldberg, which Mike Waltz admitted he is the admin and he is the creator of the group, he must have had established contact with Jeffrey Goldberg.
00:07:43.000 Had to have.
00:07:45.000 Yeah, I mean, look, I'm not as much of an expert on, I've used Signal, but my technical expertise is somewhat limited to on and off on most devices.
00:07:54.000 That being said, again, part of this doesn't, like, I've made mistakes.
00:07:58.000 I've added people to text chains that I didn't intend to.
00:08:01.000 But that's obvious.
00:08:03.000 Like, someone the other day was texting my wife and I, and they got the wrong Rebecca, right?
00:08:08.000 And immediately, I'm like, who are you adding to this?
00:08:11.000 But here's the issue.
00:08:13.000 Is that this wouldn't have been a scandal, whatever, it's not a scandal, if all of a sudden Mike Waltz had been like, look, we are moving too fast, I have all these old contacts in my congressional days, and I meant to add Jamison Greer, and I added Jeffrey Goldberg.
00:08:27.000 This is unbelievably embarrassing and humiliating.
00:08:30.000 In the tech world, we all had this happen.
00:08:32.000 I'm so sorry.
00:08:33.000 I take full responsibility.
00:08:35.000 But now, Mike Waltz is making us speculate one of two things.
00:08:39.000 Either he's a pathological liar, which I really don't want to believe, That's the option one.
00:08:44.000 Or number two is that signal is compromised and that our own intel agencies created a backdoor to be able to look at private government chats.
00:08:54.000 We are literally in a binary.
00:08:56.000 There is no in between.
00:08:58.000 Yeah, yeah.
00:08:59.000 So look, I agree with you.
00:09:00.000 Except, look, I've known Mike Waltz for a while.
00:09:03.000 I think he is a man of high integrity.
00:09:05.000 He served his country honorably.
00:09:07.000 He's a brilliant guy when it comes to diplomacy.
00:09:09.000 He's an SF guy from the Army.
00:09:12.000 That's my only issue, that he chose the wrong service.
00:09:14.000 That being said, to your point, like, again, I admit, like, I yelled at Jeffrey Goldberg once because of this despicable story.
00:09:20.000 Like, I have no problem, like, to say, yeah, I got the guy in my contacts and I mistakenly added him when I meant to add so enough.
00:09:25.000 We all do it.
00:09:26.000 That's what I'm saying.
00:09:27.000 But the idea...
00:09:28.000 Why not say that if that's what happened?
00:09:30.000 Because then you are begging the question of, you're not telling the truth.
00:09:34.000 Right, right.
00:09:34.000 That's my point.
00:09:35.000 Yeah, we all have people in our phone.
00:09:38.000 I've got some people in my phone that, believe me, I would never, because of, you know...
00:09:43.000 To the people I've been in contact with over the last 10 years that I wouldn't ever want to call or contact.
00:09:48.000 But, you know, you don't delete the contact just because you hate them or they're despicable.
00:09:51.000 I have Gavin Newsom's phone number.
00:09:52.000 I'm not going to add Gavin Newsom to our show group chat, okay?
00:09:56.000 And if you did, by the way, Charlie, here's the point.
00:09:59.000 If you did, you could say, God, we just did this podcast and I was coordinating with him.
00:10:04.000 And so it doesn't, right, it makes sense.
00:10:06.000 And so just say if that's the case.
00:10:08.000 But otherwise, you're absolutely right.
00:10:10.000 there's got to be an explanation about why.
00:10:13.000 And here's the thing, to your second point, because I think there's got to be a third issue, which is some staffer did it.
00:10:19.000 Because if you're going to break into somebody's phone, are you really going to add Jeffrey Goldberg to the chain?
00:10:24.000 I mean, I've got a list of people I'd rather add to a chain.
00:10:27.000 I'm not saying Mike Waltz is lying.
00:10:32.000 I'm saying what the binary has been created based on his public statements and his denials is one of two.
00:10:40.000 And the second of which is...
00:10:42.000 There's some technical backdoor that the Intel...
00:10:45.000 That is such a high threshold.
00:10:48.000 But can't you believe that some staffer at some point added...
00:10:50.000 He said that he didn't, though.
00:10:52.000 He also said it wasn't my staffer either, so he was denying that as well.
00:10:56.000 And that's where I'm...
00:10:57.000 But, Sean, he's also acting like, well, we have the best technical minds on it.
00:11:01.000 He's alluding that this had a backdoor.
00:11:04.000 It doesn't take a technical mind.
00:11:06.000 You know what I'm saying?
00:11:07.000 No, no, but here's the way I look at this.
00:11:11.000 I have a belief, and I haven't asked the president this, but knowing the president's view of Jeffrey Goldberg, I think that's what pisses him off the most, that of all people that you did this to.
00:11:24.000 So if you have to explain it to him...
00:11:27.000 And you're talking to Donald Trump, and you say, Mr. President, here's what happened, and I don't know why, and so here's my answer.
00:11:33.000 I'm going to get the best technical mind to explain.
00:11:35.000 That's your way of at least being like, hey, I'm on it.
00:11:38.000 Yeah, but it is dishonest, though, and that's what I don't—if that's correct.
00:11:43.000 At the same time, I mean, it's—he's going on Laura Ingraham saying, I never talked to him, never had communication, I don't know who he is, I've never had all this, I don't know how this happened.
00:11:52.000 I hope it's not correct that the intel agencies have the backdoor.
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00:13:06.000 Great people.
00:13:09.000 Joe Biden's incompetence and pathetic weakness on the world stage for years.
00:13:14.000 The Houthi terrorists grew emboldened.
00:13:16.000 Immediately after taking office in 2021, Joe Biden removed the Iran-backed Houthis from the foreign terrorist organization and specifically designated global terrorist list.
00:13:27.000 Did anybody in this room ask the Biden administration at the time why they made such a stupid mistake?
00:13:33.000 This reckless action undid the designation put in place by President Trump during his first term, and what followed was predictable and devastating.
00:13:42.000 The Houthis targeted U.S. military ships and aircraft, hit commercial ships, including U.S.-flagged vessels, threatened our personnel overseas, and attacked our allies in the region.
00:13:53.000 This resulted in more than a year of U.S.-flagged commercial ships being prevented from safely sailing through the Suez Canal, the Red Sea, and the Gulf of Aden.
00:14:03.000 This had a massive negative impact on global trade of the economic security of the United States.
00:14:09.000 Joe Biden was the commander-in-chief and he sat on his hands while the United States of America was bullied and embarrassed by terrorists.
00:14:18.000 President Trump and his team are putting a stop to these threats in restoring American strength around the world.
00:14:24.000 The Trump peace through strength approach means no terrorist force will stop American commercial and naval vessels from freely sailing the waterways of the world.
00:14:34.000 But unfortunately, this is not what the Democrats and the media want to talk about.
00:14:39.000 They are focused on a coordinated campaign to try and sow chaos in this White House.
00:14:44.000 And this has been the most successful first two months of any administration ever, which is exactly why they are doing this.
00:14:51.000 We are not going to bend in the face of this insincere outrage.
00:14:55.000 And here is just one example of how bad faith the Democrats' criticisms are.
00:15:00.000 Democrat Senator Mark Warner is hysterical over the use of Signal.
00:15:04.000 Which is an approved decrypted app in the killing of Houthi terrorists.
00:15:08.000 But Senator Warner himself used Signal to work with a lobbyist for a Russian oligarch to connect the disgraced Steele dossier author who started the Russia hoax.
00:15:20.000 Which Jeffrey Goldberg later reported on.
00:15:23.000 How ironic.
00:15:24.000 We're not going to lose focus of the bottom line, which is that Joe Biden's weakness enabled and emboldened Houthi terrorists, and President Trump's strength and resolve eliminated those terrorists.
00:15:35.000 Here in our new media seat today, we have Lindsay Keith. 1.00
00:15:37.000 She is the managing editor for Merit TV and serves as their White House correspondent.
00:15:43.000 Merit TV launched one year ago and creates and distributes content across diverse platforms.
00:15:48.000 We're glad to have you with us, Lindsay.
00:15:49.000 Please kick us off.
00:15:50.000 Thank you, Caroline.
00:15:51.000 I appreciate this opportunity for Merit TV.
00:15:54.000 Two questions, if I may.
00:15:56.000 One on Signal, one on the economy.
00:15:58.000 Sure. On Signal, how comfortable is the president with what was shared so far now?
00:16:04.000 The president's view on all of this remains the same today as it did yesterday.
00:16:11.000 And I think it speaks volumes about the leadership of this president that he went directly to all of you, members of the press corps.
00:16:17.000 He was asked, do you want someone else to go out and do a briefing?
00:16:20.000 And he said, no, I will tackle this story.
00:16:23.000 I will discuss it.
00:16:24.000 The people need to hear from me about the situation.
00:16:26.000 And so his thoughts on this remained the same today.
00:16:29.000 He has placed great trust in his national security team.
00:16:33.000 And as for the usage of signal, as the president said yesterday, as the CIA director has testified under oath, this is an approved app.
00:16:41.000 It's an encrypted app.
00:16:43.000 The Department of Defense, the Department of State, the CIA has it loaded onto government phones because it is the most secure and efficient way to communicate.
00:16:51.000 As for, again, the original situation in this messaging thread, the National Security Council, the White House Counsel's Office continues to look in to how this mistake, which the National Security Advisor has owned, occurred.
00:17:03.000 And the president has ensured they are doing that.
00:17:05.000 On the economy, consumer confidence hit a four-year low this month.
00:17:09.000 Can you help explain to the American people how tariffs will help them in the long run?
00:17:15.000 Yeah, absolutely.
00:17:16.000 And I'm grateful for the question.
00:17:17.000 The American public will hear later this afternoon from the president directly on the topic of tariffs.
00:17:23.000 And as you all know, April 2nd day, President Trump has proudly dubbed it Liberation Day for our country.
00:17:29.000 What he means by that is it will be a day where the United... 0.88
00:17:33.000 Caroline Levitt is taking questions live from the briefing room.
00:17:38.000 We can listen to that if we'd like.
00:17:41.000 However, let's see if it kind of escalates.
00:17:43.000 We have Sean Spicer.
00:17:44.000 Sean, I'm sure you saw some of the dialogue there.
00:17:46.000 Your reaction, did we learn anything from Caroline Levitt's back and forth there?
00:17:50.000 I don't think so.
00:17:51.000 Not yet.
00:17:51.000 I mean, I think the bigger question right now, one, is about the discussion that we're having.
00:17:57.000 What is the government doing to find out how this got added?
00:17:59.000 Because that seems to be now the big question.
00:18:02.000 The second is, I think one of the issues that we need to also understand is, were these officials on their government phones or their personal phones?
00:18:09.000 And that's what I thought would probably be coming out right off the bat.
00:18:13.000 I try to tend to look at Charlie, can I make a quick point?
00:18:19.000 Because this goes back to the point you're making.
00:18:20.000 If it was on a government phone, I think that raises the question about why Jeffrey Goldberg was in there in a very different way than if it was on Waltz's personal phone, which he's probably had for 10 or 15 years or whatever he had during his tenure as a member of Congress.
00:18:36.000 If it's on his government phone, that brings up a whole new set of questions as to how Jeffrey Goldberg was on...
00:18:46.000 Well, that's exactly right.
00:18:53.000 And so, I hate dwelling on this story too much, but it's only getting bigger and bigger.
00:18:58.000 And to be perfectly honest with you, Mike Waltz, who I've always gotten along with and I respect, made it bigger by going on Laura Ingraham last night.
00:19:04.000 By the outright denials and saying, we have a tech team looking into this.
00:19:08.000 I'll be honest, Sean, if you want my personal opinion, I think he just messed up and added him by mistake.
00:19:13.000 I don't think the CIA has a backdoor to signal.
00:19:16.000 I don't think that there's some sort of clandestine thing.
00:19:19.000 It's possible.
00:19:20.000 But you're moving too fast.
00:19:22.000 You're doing too much stuff.
00:19:24.000 I would have preferred just, oh my goodness, this is so embarrassing.
00:19:28.000 We're moving too fast.
00:19:30.000 We're doing too much stuff.
00:19:31.000 And I get it.
00:19:32.000 Yeah, the president wouldn't be happy with that.
00:19:33.000 But I think the president's going to be 10 times angrier if he finds out that this has been some rigmarole and trying to have some tech team and we're going to have some sort of investigation.
00:19:43.000 When in reality, you press JG and you met Jameson Greer and it actually ended up Jeffrey Goldberg.
00:19:48.000 But then it's like, wait a second, why is that guy in your phone?
00:19:51.000 So I'm going to tell you this right now.
00:19:53.000 I don't think I know, to your point.
00:19:55.000 Like, if you went to the president, and I say this as a guy who had to do that, that if you go to the president and say, Mr. President, I screwed up and I'm going to go fix it because I serve at your pleasure, he is much more understanding.
00:20:12.000 Then I think if you dig a hole and then have to go back to him.
00:20:15.000 So I hope to God, for the sake of Mike Waltz, who I have the utmost respect for, that this is what happened.
00:20:21.000 Because if you have to go back to the president and say, all right, let me tell you what really happened.
00:20:27.000 You know, he was there.
00:20:28.000 That's going to get a lot worse.
00:20:31.000 And here's the, just from a PR standpoint.
00:20:34.000 And I made this point on the morning meeting this morning that I have on my YouTube channel every morning.
00:20:39.000 That's, look, in a crisis, It will only last about—it's like a fire.
00:20:44.000 After about 48 hours, if there's no new oxygen, it dies.
00:20:48.000 The only way a crisis is perpetuated is if more oxygen comes into the room.
00:20:53.000 And to your point, every time that you speak, you go out there, and if your story doesn't— Lock it down further and push oxygen out of the room, but rather lets it in.
00:21:04.000 It perpetuates the crisis.
00:21:06.000 And this is what's happening now.
00:21:08.000 They should have been put to bed last night, but I think for a lot of reasons, they want to go out there and try to show that, you know, here's what's really going on.
00:21:17.000 And unfortunately, I think they're adding more oxygen to the room than they are taking it out.
00:21:21.000 And you've got to give the Atlantic a little bit of credit in a really dark way.
00:21:25.000 They're using the Andrew Breitbart model, which is you don't release everything you have all at once.
00:21:30.000 You do a drip.
00:21:31.000 You do a first sensationalist.
00:21:33.000 And they baited the White House by saying, hey, if it's not...
00:21:36.000 You know, first of all, I think Jeffrey Goldberg's full of crap.
00:21:39.000 He didn't hold back.
00:21:40.000 Like, knowing what we see now, I'm like, are you kidding me?
00:21:43.000 This is what you said was so, you know, war plans?
00:21:46.000 Those aren't war plans.
00:21:47.000 He's a liar.
00:21:49.000 And the bottom line is, is that he did it for clicks and sensationalism.
00:21:54.000 And he was able to bait the White House to say, if it's not classified, let me know and I'll release it all.
00:22:00.000 It wasn't classified.
00:22:01.000 And so he released it all, and I think this is like Geraldo in the safe.
00:22:05.000 You open it up and go, this is what you were saying?
00:22:07.000 Yeah, it's not great, but this is no big deal.
00:22:10.000 I think that's right.
00:22:12.000 And you are correct.
00:22:13.000 The story dies if you don't give it new oxygen.
00:22:16.000 Mike Waltz going on Laura Ingraham, that gives it oxygen.
00:22:19.000 And then the second and third drip of the text messages give it oxygen.
00:22:23.000 Sean, please plug your show or anything else you'd like our audience to be aware of.
00:22:28.000 You can go to my YouTube channel, Sean Spicer.
00:22:31.000 We do live 9 to 10 Eastern.
00:22:34.000 And then tonight, we've got Ron Johnson at our show every night at 6 o'clock Eastern.
00:22:39.000 SeanSpicer.com is where you can get it all.
00:22:40.000 But thank you, Charlie.
00:22:41.000 I appreciate that.
00:22:41.000 Thank you, Sean.
00:22:42.000 Really appreciate it.
00:22:43.000 Thank you.
00:22:43.000 You bet, man.
00:22:47.000 History, economics, the great works of literature.
00:22:49.000 Did you study these things in school?
00:22:51.000 Probably not.
00:22:52.000 Or even if you did, maybe it's time for an enjoyable refresher.
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00:23:48.000 Joining us now is Connor Boyick, author of the Tuttle Twins books, tuttletwins.com slash Charlie.
00:23:55.000 Amazing kids book series, and everyone should check it out.
00:23:59.000 Connor, welcome to the program.
00:24:00.000 Thanks for having me, Charlie.
00:24:02.000 So, Connor, I want to use the lead-in of the flop, the multi-hundred-million-dollar flop that is Snow White.
00:24:10.000 Disney decided to resurrect Snow White and spend a lot of money.
00:24:15.000 It had a terrible showing this last weekend.
00:24:18.000 It turns out that millions of families do not want a repurposed, let's just say, modern take.
00:24:26.000 You could say it's woke, but it certainly is with the flair of the worst of modernity, of a beautiful story that existed well over 100 years ago.
00:24:36.000 You at the Tuttle Twins, you are the author and you are the brainchild of the Tuttle Twins, are having a lot of success getting down to fundamental truths and speaking in a way to families that appeal to them.
00:24:48.000 Tell us more about the Tuttle Twins.
00:24:50.000 Well, I think you're right.
00:24:51.000 There's been a lot of pushback from parents with Snow White.
00:24:53.000 This is just the latest of a long series of pushback that we've seen.
00:24:56.000 I'm actually very hopeful that we're seeing a lot of families stepping up and saying, no, we don't want that stuff in our home.
00:25:03.000 What parents have lacked in past years are resources that can help them teach their children good ideas, good principles that aren't being shared in the schools.
00:25:12.000 They're not being shared on social media.
00:25:15.000 And so fundamentally, what the Tuttle Twins books are.
00:25:19.000 Are a resource for parents to read alongside with their kids, simple and fun stories that introduce the ideas of human flourishing.
00:25:26.000 We're talking about the power of entrepreneurship, the importance of personal freedom, why merit is so important, right?
00:25:35.000 Property rights, free markets, the ideas upon which America was built, but increasingly in America's schools, not only are these ideas not taught, if...
00:25:44.000 Ideas like them are taught.
00:25:45.000 They're quite opposite ideas.
00:25:46.000 And parents then wonder as their kids march off to college, how did my child turn into this, you know, brainwashed social justice warrior?
00:25:53.000 Well, it's because you haven't engaged your children's minds when they were younger.
00:25:56.000 And that's what Tuttle Twins is trying to do, to help parents engage their children with these ideas in a simplified, fun way.
00:26:03.000 So as they then go off to college or get on with their life, they've got a foundation of true principles to rest on.
00:26:08.000 And the popularity of it is growing right now.
00:26:11.000 everyone could check it out at TuttleTwins.com slash Charlie.
00:26:14.000 I'm going to buy a bunch of these for my kids.
00:26:16.000 Finding good kids books is very, very hard.
00:26:19.000 In fact, you know, we went to Barnes and Noble recently and our daughter just loves buying all the books and it's very funny.
00:26:26.000 She has great instincts.
00:26:27.000 She went up to one of the books and it was like a homosexual couple. 0.95
00:26:31.000 And she looked at it.
00:26:32.000 She said, that's not right.
00:26:33.000 And she put it back down.
00:26:35.000 It was like, We want you to be gay. 1.00
00:26:37.000 And this is a kid's book!
00:26:39.000 I mean, again, everyone in the audience, kind of your own views of marriage.
00:26:42.000 But for a kid to have to be forced upon, her intuition is amazing.
00:26:48.000 And so talk about how you are incorporating these beautiful ideas.
00:26:54.000 Liberty. Family-friendly, non-pornographic elements in a way that kids actually want to read it.
00:27:02.000 This is not a textbook.
00:27:03.000 This is not just giving them Milton Friedman's capitalism and freedom, but it is those ideas distilled in a digestible way for a child.
00:27:11.000 Well, I think you raise an interesting point with your personal story that children are being bombarded with these types of ideas now.
00:27:19.000 And when we started doing the Tuttle Twins in 2014 is when we published our first book.
00:27:24.000 We had a lot of conservatives and libertarians and others say, wait, wait, let kids be kids.
00:27:29.000 We don't need to talk to them about these big adult ideas.
00:27:32.000 We can wait until they're getting close to voting age.
00:27:35.000 And so we got pushback even from our own tribe for doing children's books talking about these big adult ideas.
00:27:41.000 Of course, going through the crazy BLM and DEI and all the stuff that we have in the past few years, nobody on our side talks that way anymore because they see what the left is doing, that they have just this cacophony of content that they're pushing out, whether it's cartoons or books or online stuff.
00:27:59.000 And so now I think increasingly parents recognize, whoa, my children's mind is like ground zero in an ideological battlefield.
00:28:09.000 And if I don't give my child armor and weaponry and knowledge of the enemy, then my child will become a casualty.
00:28:16.000 And so we live in a world where we can't just assume that we can talk to our kids later about these ideas.
00:28:21.000 We need to engage them.
00:28:23.000 Frankly, we need to compete for their hearts and minds because they're being, you know, attracted and exposed by so many hostile ideas.
00:28:31.000 Parents often have been caught in a trap because I'll tell you, Charlie, the biggest problem we run into is freedom-loving moms and dads who do want their kids to learn these ideas, but they, the parents, feel ill-equipped to explain and teach these ideas to their kids.
00:28:47.000 They feel the parents increase I did bad at that subject in school, right?
00:28:55.000 20 years ago.
00:28:57.000 And so that's where the Tuttle Twins come and we say, you don't have any prerequisites.
00:29:01.000 You don't need to know this stuff.
00:29:03.000 Just read some fun storybooks with your kids.
00:29:05.000 We've got some discussion questions at the end so that you can have amazing conversations.
00:29:10.000 I think you'll resonate with this, Charlie.
00:29:12.000 I, as a passionate lover of freedom here in America, I don't feel that we're going to save our country at the Capitol.
00:29:18.000 I don't feel that we're going to save our country in the courtroom, even though we ought to engage in both those places.
00:29:22.000 I think that if we're going to save our country, it's at the family dinner table.
00:29:26.000 We have to rebuild social fabric.
00:29:28.000 We have to model for our children what civic engagement looks like, what critical thinking looks like.
00:29:34.000 And to do that, we have to empower parents to do this on the daily.
00:29:38.000 In their home, in that environment where we can incubate strong, entrepreneurial, critical thinking minds that can be the future of saving our country.
00:29:46.000 And over 6 million copies sold.
00:29:49.000 Just talk about what you are, the author of The Tuttle Twins.
00:29:53.000 How did you conceptualize all of this?
00:29:55.000 There are so many different, let's just say, sister or cousin equivalents, the Hardy Boys.
00:30:02.000 I mean, typical ideas of, you know, duos that go about life and this kind of...
00:30:08.000 Well, my partner, Elijah, who's the illustrator of our books, he and I both had young kids at the time.
00:30:18.000 We are very passionate about freedom, and he had been working on the Ron Paul campaign, and I had been helping, and we had been talking about, hey, maybe there's an opportunity at some point to partner together.
00:30:30.000 Meanwhile, I started a think tank, Libertas Institute, and I'm out there fighting for freedom, and I wanted to share with my kids what dad does when I'm helping this farmer fight eminent domain so he can save his land.
00:30:42.000 How do I tell my five-year-old what dad did all day, right?
00:30:45.000 Rather than, oh, I typed on a computer and simple stuff.
00:30:48.000 I wanted to teach the substantive ideas, albeit at a simple level.
00:30:52.000 So I did what any dad would do in my position.
00:30:54.000 I literally went on Amazon and I said books that teach about property rights for kids, right?
00:30:59.000 Children's books about free markets.
00:31:00.000 Keep in mind, this is 2013.
00:31:02.000 There was nothing.
00:31:04.000 So as you point out, there's other children's series for adventure and, you know.
00:31:09.000 Ideas like kindness and honesty.
00:31:11.000 But for economic ideas, civic and political ideas, historical stuff, there really was nothing.
00:31:17.000 And so that was the spark.
00:31:19.000 Elijah and I did a book.
00:31:20.000 We had no vision of what it's become.
00:31:22.000 It was just something we wanted for our kids.
00:31:24.000 A lot of people bought it.
00:31:25.000 They said, when are you doing the second one?
00:31:27.000 A series was born.
00:31:29.000 And frankly, things didn't really explode until COVID.
00:31:33.000 With all the craziness that happened, suddenly families were like, what's happening to my country?
00:31:37.000 You know, all the freedoms that I guess I've been taking for granted are now under assault.
00:31:42.000 And also, I'm now a homeschooler, apparently, because all the schools are shut down.
00:31:45.000 And so that was Tuttle Twins' big moment to really break through and start selling, you know, a million books plus per year.
00:31:52.000 So let's go through just an onslaught of the type of books that kids have to experience.
00:31:57.000 For example, there's this one, Shay-Ra and the Princess of Power.
00:32:03.000 This one is, quote, why we love it.
00:32:05.000 This is a Netflix series.
00:32:07.000 It's not a book.
00:32:07.000 It's a Netflix series.
00:32:08.000 It's a cartoon.
00:32:10.000 By the way, conservative parents are unknowingly allowing their kids to watch this stuff.
00:32:15.000 This goes through the family filter because sometimes they'll say this is just a kid's account.
00:32:19.000 Has there ever been a gayer, more inclusive cartoon than She-Ra and the Princesses of Power?
00:32:25.000 The series was created by trans artist N.D. Stevenson and its shows.
00:32:30.000 The show explores queer love, queer struggle, and the ultimate queer joy.
00:32:35.000 Adora and Katra share one of the most epic love stories set to screen, and they're surrounded by a literal rainbow of compelling, unapologetically queer and trans characters.
00:32:48.000 We only wish there were more seasons.
00:32:50.000 The list continues.
00:32:52.000 There's multiple series like this.
00:32:57.000 I guess Spongebob is now gay, apparently, according to this list.
00:33:01.000 Is this like the gayest list? 0.90
00:33:03.000 Is that what we're looking at here?
00:33:05.000 55 total shows.
00:33:07.000 Spongebob, the misadventures of the talking sea sponge, works at a fast food restaurant.
00:33:11.000 Why we love it, quote, SpongeBob has always been gay in our hearts.
00:33:15.000 I mean, he, Patrick, and their little kiddo, Gary, are pretty much queer fam goals.
00:33:19.000 Then in 2020, SpongeBob came out of the sea closet and is now canonically queer. 0.94
00:33:25.000 Available on Prime, which many parents allow them to watch.
00:33:28.000 People can also find the Tuttle Twins via Angel.
00:33:31.000 How can they watch the Tuttle Twins as well?
00:33:33.000 Yeah, so we have the books I've been talking about that have sold 6 million copies.
00:33:37.000 We also have a cartoon with Angel Studios.
00:33:38.000 It's free to watch.
00:33:40.000 You can go to the Angel Studios app or TuttleTwins.tv.
00:33:44.000 Charlie, the list that you share goes on.
00:33:46.000 There's many more shows and books that are pushing these types of ideas.
00:33:50.000 I'm actually less worried about that, though, because when freedom-minded, conservative parents see content like that, right, it raises...
00:33:59.000 Red flag.
00:33:59.000 They shut it down.
00:34:00.000 They banned Netflix and unsubscribe in their home.
00:34:03.000 I'm less worried about that because parents are more easily able to detect that.
00:34:08.000 I'm more worried about what parents struggle to detect.
00:34:11.000 And that's the sub-mediocre content in our textbooks used in classrooms across the country, K-12, that teach about government being the solution.
00:34:20.000 And they do it in very subtle ways, right?
00:34:23.000 They praise FDR and claim that he, you know, saved the country from the Great Depression.
00:34:28.000 They praise Woodrow Wilson and claim that the Federal Reserve helped, you know, stabilize.
00:34:37.000 These are things parents struggle to detect and yet plant seeds, stay with these children and lead them down a path of supporting big government and ultimately Marxism.
00:34:48.000 So what we're on guard for is not the big flashy stuff that make lists like that and get parents wrinkled.
00:34:56.000 We're on the hunt for and helping parents detect the problems that they're not wise perceiving.
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00:35:51.000 This is how you know that there's some good stuff on the Tuttle Twins.
00:35:54.000 They have one that is the creature from Jekyll Island, which of course is all about the creation of the Federal Reserve.
00:36:00.000 That would be a very good thing for a kid to read.
00:36:03.000 Connor continues this.
00:36:04.000 So let me ask, are there books also for toddlers, 2-, 3-, 4-year-olds?
00:36:10.000 Absolutely. We have board books for toddlers, such as the ABCs of Liberty or the 1-2-3s of the Bill of Rights.
00:36:18.000 Indestructible books that your toddler can slobber on and they'll still learn about freedom.
00:36:23.000 We got books for teenagers as well, so we run the entire gamut no matter the age of your child.
00:36:28.000 And Charlie, this won't surprise you.
00:36:30.000 When we've surveyed our audience, over 52% of parents tell us that they are learning new things for the first time, even though they got these books for their kids.
00:36:39.000 We're educating entire families, and it's so critical because groups like yours are on college campus.
00:36:44.000 We have to engage there.
00:36:45.000 We've seen the closing of the American mind on these campuses.
00:36:48.000 I contend that if we invest earlier and help families incubate these ideas even earlier...
00:36:54.000 That helps downstream solve so many other problems.
00:36:57.000 And so families have struggled in the past.
00:37:00.000 How do I teach my kids about this stuff?
00:37:01.000 How do I talk about it?
00:37:02.000 I don't understand it very well.
00:37:03.000 That's the problem we're trying to solve.
00:37:05.000 Just read these fun books, talk about it together, and you'll be amazed at the aha moments that your kids will have.
00:37:10.000 So one of the books that we got about six months ago was a history book, allegedly.
00:37:15.000 And it was a beautiful thing.
00:37:17.000 It said, you know, top moments in American history.
00:37:20.000 Monuments, I think it was all about.
00:37:21.000 Okay, what could possibly be wrong with monuments?
00:37:23.000 We start reading this book, and there was an entire chapter illustrated of the Stonewall Riots, which was a series of these spontaneous riots back in 1969, all about the gay rights thing.
00:37:43.000 Page after page.
00:37:45.000 And this is supposed to be a book to American monuments.
00:37:47.000 Think of all the monuments that you could have for kids to learn.
00:37:51.000 So you don't know that at this, you know, you buy this monuments book, you don't know that.
00:37:55.000 I start reading this stuff, and it is remarkable, the toxins.
00:38:01.000 Look, the bottom line is this, is that there are dark forces that are trying to harm our kids.
00:38:06.000 And you must be vigilant, and it can be very subtle.
00:38:09.000 And going back to the Snow White theme, You know, there's this book, Antango Makes Three, is the true story of a same-sex penguin.
00:38:19.000 I don't know how it could possibly be a true story.
00:38:21.000 Last year, the Escambia County School Board paid a law firm at least $107,000 to defend its removal, and Tango Makes Three after a lawsuit was filed by its authors.
00:38:33.000 Imagine a school board investing six figures to defend itself against common sense because it's inappropriate to bring agendas to children.
00:38:42.000 So, just more broadly, what is your vision for the Tuttle Twins?
00:38:46.000 You've had great success.
00:38:48.000 Where do you want to see this go next?
00:38:49.000 Well, again, books like that, Charlie, raise the flag and we have focused attention on that is clearly a problematic book, the history book that you mentioned.
00:38:58.000 Think of the history books that are used in schools across the country.
00:39:01.000 We actually purchased all the popular ones.
00:39:03.000 We did a study of them.
00:39:04.000 And what you find is that they are all great at teaching American history to kids if the goal is to help them win Jeopardy in the future by being able to recite every little factoid and random tidbit.
00:39:15.000 But they did a horrible job at actually teaching the ideas, the philosophy.
00:39:19.000 The philosophy, the values that formed this country.
00:39:22.000 So the history books that we've created have tried to solve for that by saying, yeah, we've got to teach the what happened and the who did it.
00:39:28.000 That's important.
00:39:29.000 But the real context is the ideas that people were struggling over.
00:39:35.000 You ask about a vision for America.
00:39:36.000 I think of the NAEP scores that came out about a year ago.
00:39:39.000 This is the national assessment of how kids are learning in America.
00:39:42.000 And they found...
00:39:44.000 That for the 8th graders, when they tested them on American history, only 13% of them were proficient in American history.
00:39:51.000 That's 1-3, not 3-0.
00:39:54.000 13%. So then I ask you, Charlie, in our audience...
00:39:57.000 What becomes of America if the future voters are so ignorant about our past?
00:40:03.000 Those who don't learn from the past, of course, are condemned to repeat it.
00:40:06.000 So my vision for our country is that we can empower families across the country to learn these ideas together, to give their children an intellectual, ideological, historical foundation of ideas so that as they go out into society and they're bombarded with all the garbage that's going to come upon them, whether that's from peers, social...
00:40:27.000 They're going to have the capacity to think critically, to act independently.
00:40:40.000 But we've got to put in the work.
00:40:42.000 We can't assume best intentions of a system that's clearly been corrupted.
00:40:46.000 Where the curriculum has been dumbed down.
00:40:49.000 Parents need help.
00:40:50.000 They need a lifeline.
00:40:50.000 They want to step in and they want to help their kids.
00:40:53.000 That's what the Tuttle Twins is trying to be as a resource for them to do exactly that.
00:40:56.000 TuttleTwins.com slash Charlie.
00:40:58.000 Thanks so much.
00:40:58.000 Great work.
00:40:59.000 We'll have you back on soon.
00:41:00.000 Check it out.
00:41:00.000 Thank you.
00:41:01.000 Thanks, Charlie.
00:41:01.000 That is TuttleTwins.com slash Charlie.
00:41:03.000 I'm buying some right now and you should too.
00:41:06.000 Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
00:41:07.000 Email us as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
00:41:09.000 Thanks so much for listening and God bless.