The Charlie Kirk Show - The Best Arguments for LIFE with Seth Gruber LIVE from Freedom Night in America

00:00:00.000 Hey everybody, happy Sunday.

00:00:01.000 A pretty remarkable conversation I had with Seth Gruber.

00:00:04.000 If any of you in this audience have questions about your position on abortion, I think Seth is going to blow you away.

00:00:10.000 It's factual, it's deep, it's exciting, it's lively, it's fun.

00:00:15.000 Seth Gruber, who has a new organization called the White Rose Resistance.

00:00:19.000 I think it's worthy of support.

00:00:20.000 We're getting behind Seth.

00:00:22.000 There are no advertisers in this episode, so first help out Turning PointUSA, tpusa.com, in our educational mission to help protect liberty for this generation and future generations.

00:00:32.000 Get involved with tpusafaith at tpfaith.com.

00:00:35.000 That's tpfaith.com.

00:00:37.000 You can contact me directly at freedom at charliekirk.com.

00:00:41.000 That's freedom at charliekirk.com.

00:00:43.000 And support the Charlie Kirk Show at charliekirk.com slash support.

00:00:47.000 Open up your podcast app, type in Charlie Kirk Show, and hit subscribe.

00:00:52.000 If you guys want to support us at charliekirk.com slash support, I just want to thank some of you that do because there's no advertisers in this episode.

00:00:58.000 It really means a lot.

00:00:59.000 David from Illinois, thank you.

00:01:01.000 Alicia from Nebraska.

00:01:03.000 Deanna from Texas.

00:01:03.000 Thank you.

00:01:04.000 Thank you.

00:01:04.000 Eva from Texas.

00:01:05.000 Thank you.

00:01:06.000 Susan from California.

00:01:07.000 Thank you.

00:01:08.000 Annette from North Carolina.

00:01:09.000 Leslie from Arkansas.

00:01:09.000 Thank you.

00:01:11.000 Thank you.

00:01:11.000 Emily from North Carolina.

00:01:13.000 Alita from Wisconsin.

00:01:14.000 Rachel from New Jersey.

00:01:17.000 Priscilla from Tennessee.

00:01:18.000 Ronald from Alaska.

00:01:20.000 Eric from Illinois.

00:01:21.000 Rita from Illinois.

00:01:22.000 Michelle from Texas.

00:01:24.000 And more.

00:01:25.000 CharlieKirk.com slash support.

00:01:27.000 That is charliekirk.com slash support.

00:01:30.000 Buckle up, everybody.

00:01:31.000 Here we go.

00:01:33.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.

00:01:34.000 Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.

00:01:36.000 I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.

00:01:40.000 Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.

00:01:43.000 I want to thank Charlie.

00:01:44.000 He's an incredible guy.

00:01:45.000 His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.

00:01:54.000 We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.

00:02:02.000 That's why we are here.

00:02:05.000 Thank you, everybody.

00:02:06.000 Thank you.

00:02:07.000 A great turnout.

00:02:08.000 This just keeps on growing and growing, everybody.

00:02:10.000 Great to be here.

00:02:12.000 I first just want to say thank you to Dream City for continually hosting this.

00:02:15.000 You all have a lot to do, and to be here is a big deal.

00:02:18.000 And this is growing to churches all across the country.

00:02:21.000 We have our good friend John Randall here from Calvary Chapel, San Juan Capistrano, who and we have pastors from all over the valley here, by the way.

00:02:29.000 This is spreading, and the idea of the church taking biblical stands in a chaotic and troubling time is more important than ever before.

00:02:38.000 You know, I do want to make sure I brag, though, on our project that we're working together up in Glendale.

00:02:44.000 I had somebody that kind of tracked me down in a grocery store.

00:02:47.000 They kept on following me through aisles, like, what does this person want?

00:02:50.000 And they wanted to tell me that they were taking their kid out of the Scottsdale Unified School District, and at the soonest moment possible, they're going to enroll them at Dream City Christian, a Turning Point Academy.

00:03:01.000 How great is that?

00:03:04.000 And it was a very surprise when I get hunted down like that.

00:03:08.000 It's very, it's much better than what sometimes happens.

00:03:12.000 And speaking of that, I'm going, we're doing our college campus tour soon, so prayers are very much appreciated.

00:03:18.000 I think a week from tonight, I'll be at University of Texas Austin, which if you know anything about UT Austin, it's not exactly friendly territory.

00:03:25.000 So I want to talk about a couple things that we're doing at Turning Point, but also for those of you that are new here, welcome.

00:03:31.000 We do this every single month, as Angel mentioned, our last one of the year, because December is a very busy year.

00:03:39.000 First, December is a busy year.

00:03:41.000 It's a busy time of the year.

00:03:42.000 First here at Dream City, obviously, with the amazing Christmas shows that go on, but also at Turning Point USA, we have America Fest.

00:03:49.000 So our last one of the year will be on November 2nd with Pete Hegseth and Jensen Franklin.

00:03:54.000 So you're very welcome to come there.

00:03:56.000 But if you're new here and you're not really sure what you expect, tonight is about a couple things.

00:04:00.000 The theme verse of us coming together tonight is Jeremiah 29:7, where the Lord is speaking and he says, Demand the welfare of the nation that you are in, because your welfare is tied to your nation's welfare.

00:04:12.000 We are called as Christians to reject apathy and cynicism.

00:04:16.000 We are called as Christians to care about what happens within our city gates, within the boundaries of our nation.

00:04:23.000 We are called to care about the most vulnerable, the least of these in our society.

00:04:28.000 We're called to pray for our leaders, as it says in 1 Timothy.

00:04:31.000 And we're also called as Christians to be aware of what is happening.

00:04:34.000 You know, far too often I hear Christians where they say, you know, I just don't have time. 1.00

00:04:38.000 The news is too confusing and I can't make sense of what's happening.

00:04:42.000 Well, that's what tonight is hopefully able to compress so much into one night so you can walk away better informed from a biblical perspective of what is happening nationally and in the state of Arizona.

00:04:53.000 And it's not even about politics, by the way.

00:04:55.000 It's about something much more important.

00:04:57.000 It's biblical, not political, what we do tonight.

00:05:00.000 It's about eternal truths that we are focusing on.

00:05:04.000 And the stories that come out of Freedom Night are just extraordinary.

00:05:09.000 You know, we hear about people that thought that they were completely alone.

00:05:13.000 They come to tonight and they get filled up, they get energized, and they get really motivated to do meaningful things here in the Valley and across the state of Arizona.

00:05:22.000 And so, a couple things I want to mention: first of all, we have a project at Turning Point USA that we've been working on for about nine months.

00:05:28.000 Where is Matt?

00:05:29.000 Matt, do we have that queued up?

00:05:31.000 Okay, we do.

00:05:31.000 Good.

00:05:32.000 I didn't want to call for it and then have it not play.

00:05:34.000 And so, look, this project has been something, it's been nine months of work.

00:05:38.000 And, you know, I have been very disappointed at how the national media has ignored what is happening on our southern border.

00:05:48.000 And I, and by the way, this is not political.

00:05:51.000 It's not at all.

00:05:52.000 This is an issue of human rights.

00:05:54.000 It's an issue of dignity.

00:05:56.000 It's an issue of human trafficking.

00:05:59.000 It is an issue of smuggling.

00:06:00.000 This is not right at all.

00:06:02.000 You can have your own views about immigration, all that.

00:06:04.000 This is something much deeper than that.

00:06:07.000 And so we felt from Turning Point USA, it was imperative, since we being here at a border state, to factually tell the story of what's happening on the southern border.

00:06:16.000 And so we've been working on this project for nine months.

00:06:19.000 I went down to Yuma and I saw the firsthand things that are so sad and so terrible.

00:06:24.000 And so we have a new series coming out called Border Battle.

00:06:27.000 I want to show you the trailer.

00:06:29.000 We're partnering with the great Salem Media Company to distribute this.

00:06:32.000 You guys can find it at salemnow.com.

00:06:34.000 I'll tell you more about it.

00:06:35.000 And then there will be a release for all of our wonderful Freedom Night in America attendees.

00:06:40.000 But watch this and tell me this doesn't get you motivated.

00:06:42.000 Check out this trailer.

00:06:56.000 Describe the cartel pure evil.

00:06:59.000 They have zero regard for human life and they're about as evil as they come.

00:07:05.000 They're not just a transnational crime organization.

00:07:08.000 They're well beyond that.

00:07:10.000 Now they have sophisticated weapons.

00:07:12.000 They have tanks.

00:07:13.000 They have drones.

00:07:14.000 They drop in explosives.

00:07:16.000 We've never seen this before in the history of the country.

00:07:19.000 Fentanyl is an extremely powerful drug.

00:07:22.000 It is 100 times more powerful than morphine and 50 times more powerful than heroin.

00:07:28.000 That would be like three grains of salt.

00:07:30.000 If you were to have that much fentanyl, it would kill you. 1.00

00:07:33.000 I just think of every mom that is going to spend the rest of their lives. 1.00

00:07:37.000 What about someday they work?

00:07:48.000 It's not a red or a blue issue.

00:07:49.000 It's a red, white, and blue issue.

00:07:53.000 Amen.

00:07:55.000 And so, if you're interested in checking that out, thank you.

00:07:58.000 It's SalemNow.com for the exclusive release, and we're partnering from Turning Point USA.

00:08:02.000 Look, we're doing a lot.

00:08:03.000 We have our campus tour, our high school tour, but I wouldn't be able to live with myself if we did not tell the story of the border living in a border state, truly.

00:08:11.000 And we talk about, I don't even have to say it here.

00:08:14.000 There's some graphic stuff in there that from an adult eyes, if you feel your kids are mature enough to see it, it's a wake-up call.

00:08:21.000 What's happening there?

00:08:22.000 The exploitation, the sex trade, it is so unspeakable, and we have to fix it.

00:08:27.000 One other story I want to focus on about the need to fight early, because I know so many of you here tonight are very worried about the future that your children are entering.

00:08:37.000 There's a story that has really disturbed me over the last couple of days.

00:08:39.000 It's not here in Arizona, but it very well could be soon.

00:08:42.000 And it's around this theme of what happens when you do not intervene with truth early because you're afraid of offending somebody.

00:08:48.000 I don't know if you've been following the story of the volleyball girls team, the girls' volleyball team in Vermont.

00:08:53.000 It's very, very instructive.

00:08:55.000 So there is an all-girl volleyball team in Vermont where an individual who claimed to be a woman, a man who thinks he's a woman, comes and says, I want to participate on this volleyball team.

00:09:07.000 Vermont, being Vermont, they said, sure, why not?

00:09:10.000 And they allowed that to happen.

00:09:12.000 The individual then was granted access to the locker room to change alongside other girls, and people said nothing, right?

00:09:19.000 Or, you know, just kind of little musings or rumblings.

00:09:22.000 Well, then the man who thinks he's a woman started to say somewhat derogatory and kind of offensive things to the other young ladies on the volleyball team, making the young ladies uncomfortable, teenage girls, by the way.

00:09:33.000 So they report this to the coach and to the leaders of the school, saying, Hey, we're not trying to be intolerant here.

00:09:40.000 We're not trying to be mean, but we're really not comfortable because he's saying some rather offensive things and we don't like changing around this individual.

00:09:49.000 And so what ended up happening is now that girls' volleyball team is being disciplined for being intolerant for not wanting to forcibly change around another male in the high school.

00:10:01.000 Now, this is a real, you could check it out yourself.

00:10:03.000 It's a huge story where they are facing disciplinary action for what basically they're describing as being bigoted towards a trans person.

00:10:14.000 And isn't that interesting how this marks in sequential steps?

00:10:18.000 Where first they say, hey, you must tolerate something, then you must accept something, then you must celebrate that something, and then you must participate in that something.

00:10:28.000 And it's so shocking, isn't it?

00:10:30.000 Because some people say, oh, come on, what's the big deal of just tolerating the fact that men can participate in female sports?

00:10:36.000 Well, despite the fact that it is not fair and it's cheating and it's wrong, that aside, now all of a sudden, the new standard being set in Vermont, this is what happens when you do not fight early for truth, when you're afraid of people being offended by what you have to say, is the new standard that is being set is that you could very well face disciplinary action.

00:10:56.000 You could get in trouble if you dare not want to change around another man as a woman, as an athlete in Vermont.

00:11:04.000 And I know what a lot of you are probably thinking.

00:11:06.000 You're probably thinking, where are the adult men in this community that are allowing this to happen?

00:11:14.000 And the answer is complex but simple.

00:11:20.000 I know it sounds paradoxical, but we could spend an hour on it or 10 seconds.

00:11:24.000 We are living through what C.S. Lewis predicted as the men without chests. 0.95

00:11:30.000 We are living through that right now.

00:11:32.000 You should read Abolition of Man.

00:11:34.000 It's a short, beautiful book.

00:11:35.000 C.S. Lewis, one of the great authors of all time, definitely one of the greatest in the 20th century, of a society of men without chests, without courage.

00:11:43.000 Where we look around and we say, well, you know, I don't, I want to be tolerant.

00:11:47.000 And this is where we as Christians have to be prayerful, but also very wise, which is if you love God, you must hate evil.

00:11:54.000 Psalm 97, 10.

00:11:55.000 And this is the opposite of tolerance.

00:12:02.000 This is forced tolerance now.

00:12:04.000 No, it's worse than that.

00:12:05.000 It's forced participation.

00:12:07.000 That you are not allowed to now be on a volleyball team as a woman if you do not want to share the locker room with a man who makes you feel uncomfortable.

00:12:14.000 All to not want to offend a single person.

00:12:17.000 That's what happens when the strong do not protect the young.

00:12:21.000 When the adults do not come in and set moral standards and moral boundaries.

00:12:25.000 If you ask me, that's much more important than politics.

00:12:28.000 That's much more important than red and blue and all that stuff.

00:12:30.000 It's a question of right and wrong.

00:12:32.000 It's a question of the moral compass of a society.

00:12:34.000 And there's just one thing, and it actually ties in beautifully to what Seth and I are going to talk about tonight.

00:12:39.000 You can judge a society based on what people with strength do or do not do to protect those of people.

00:12:47.000 You could call them weak, but that sounds insulting.

00:12:49.000 People that are not as strong, people that are not as big, people that are as powerful.

00:12:53.000 Because a nation that says it doesn't matter if we abort a million lives every single year, why on earth would they then care about a teenager that has to do something that makes them uncomfortable?

00:13:01.000 It's the same sort of moral slide that allows that to happen.

00:13:05.000 But we're going to address that head-on tonight.

00:13:07.000 And I could say collectively, we're not going to put up with it here in Scottsdale.

00:13:11.000 We're not going to put up with it here in the state of Arizona.

00:13:13.000 We're not going to allow our children to be taken advantage of.

00:13:15.000 It's not going to happen.

00:13:17.000 And that's a beautiful segue.

00:13:20.000 Beautiful segue to what I consider to be one of the most articulate and charismatic pro-life speakers in the country.

00:13:28.000 He's a very special person.

00:13:29.000 I've known him for a while.

00:13:30.000 He's doing an entire tour around the issue of abortion.

00:13:35.000 I don't like giving trigger warnings, but I know that there's people that are here that probably don't even know what you're about to experience.

00:13:42.000 If you hear something and it offends you, try to just anchor yourself in that seat to the end of the program tonight.

00:13:48.000 Because I think God has something in store for you to challenge maybe your worldview about what is abortion, what is a human being, and what, how should we talk about this issue?

00:13:57.000 Because if you're like me, I am exhausted with the political advertising around abortion in this state.

00:14:05.000 Are you?

00:14:06.000 It is nonstop.

00:14:09.000 And I'm just looking for a little bit of clarity on the subject.

00:14:13.000 And boy, you're about to get a fair dose of clarity.

00:14:17.000 Please join me in welcoming Seth Gruber to the stage.

00:14:21.000 All right, Seth, welcome to Freedom Night.

00:14:23.000 Thank you, brother.

00:14:24.000 Let's dive right in.

00:14:26.000 So why should we as Christians care about the issue of abortion?

00:14:31.000 I hear from pastors all the time, too controversial.

00:14:33.000 The Bible is not clear.

00:14:35.000 I only preach the gospel.

00:14:37.000 Yeah, just preach the gospel.

00:14:37.000 That's right.

00:14:38.000 Well, firstly, let me just say, you guys know this already, but just as a reminder, Charlie Kirk is probably one of the most outspoken conservative pundits who regularly addresses the issue of life and the plight of the unborn as frequently as he can on his program.

00:14:52.000 And if I could bottle the intellectual, spiritual, and moral courage and clarity of Charlie Kirk and inject it like a booster shot into the arms of American pastors, I could end abortion in this country in one year.

00:15:02.000 Don't worry, I won't mandate it.

00:15:04.000 I won't mandate.

00:15:05.000 The booster shot hopefully would work, and amongst other things.

00:15:05.000 Hold on.

00:15:09.000 That's right, that's right.

00:15:12.000 I'm so sorry.

00:15:12.000 I couldn't resist.

00:15:13.000 That's right.

00:15:14.000 Well, to your question, brother, and thank you so much for this privileged opportunity.

00:15:18.000 Charlie and Turning Point Faith are sponsoring a nationwide church tour I'm doing right now called the White Rose Resistance National Life Tour.

00:15:24.000 And the White Rose Resistance is the name of my new organization.

00:15:27.000 We have a table out back.

00:15:28.000 We'd love to give you guys a hug and connect afterwards.

00:15:30.000 So there really is no option for a Christian to be pro-choice or pro-abortion for one simple reason. 0.81

00:15:36.000 Your Savior entered human history in a uterus to redeem mankind from their sins.

00:15:41.000 Jesus Christ is the greatest former fetus to have ever existed who actually chose to identify with you at your most vulnerable stage, the prenatal stage.

00:15:52.000 And one more thing from the scriptures, Charlie.

00:15:54.000 I know, knit together, fearfully and wonderfully made.

00:15:56.000 Psalm 139, beautiful.

00:15:57.000 We could unpack it all day.

00:15:58.000 Let me go to a different one.

00:15:59.000 In Luke 1, it says that the prenatal John the Baptist leaps in the womb.

00:16:04.000 Remember, because he recognizes his prenatal deity, Savior, in Mary's womb, in the same room.

00:16:09.000 And because Christ is fully God and fully human at the moment of conception and God knits life together in the womb, it means that the prenatal Jesus is knitting himself together in the womb while he knits the prenatal John the Baptist together in the womb while he knits himself together in a womb that he once knit together when Mary was in the womb of her mother.

00:16:26.000 Christianity is called the incarnation. 0.97

00:16:29.000 Welcome to the Christian faith.

00:16:30.000 If you need some wonder brought back into your faith, wake up every morning and dwell on the incarnation for a few moments.

00:16:37.000 And so you read Luke 1 and it says the baby leaped in Elizabeth's womb.

00:16:41.000 So that's referring to the unborn prenatal John the Baptist.

00:16:45.000 What Greek word is used to refer to the prenatal unborn John the Baptist?

00:16:49.000 It's a Greek word, berephos.

00:16:50.000 Okay, turn to Luke 2, and it says, Mary laid baby Jesus in the manger.

00:16:57.000 So this is the infant Christ already outside of the utero.

00:17:01.000 What Greek word does the author of scripture use to refer to an infant already born?

00:17:06.000 Berephos.

00:17:08.000 Oh, our Savior uses the same term to refer to a baby in the womb as a baby outside the womb.

00:17:15.000 Oh, for Christians and pastors who would see no distinction in dignity, value, and worth as well.

00:17:23.000 That right there, you should clip and send to every pastor in America, right?

00:17:26.000 Right, by the way.

00:17:27.000 So, but Seth, you know, some pastors would say it's too controversial of an issue, and you're not being very nice.

00:17:35.000 So, I've been a pro-life activist since I was a fetus, Charlie.

00:17:41.000 And I'm actually only half joking, brothers and sisters.

00:17:44.000 You see, my mother was the executive director of a pregnancy resource center in the late 1980s, early 1990s while pregnant with me.

00:17:52.000 And she only stepped down from directing that pregnancy center right across the street from Azusa Pacific University when she gave birth to me.

00:17:58.000 And I've been reliably informed by Fauci and Francis Collins in the Fall of the Science tyrants.

00:18:02.000 I've been reliably informed that the body in her body is just her body.

00:18:06.000 It was always just her body.

00:18:07.000 There is no other body.

00:18:08.000 Therefore, according to the law of transitive property, the babies my mother was saving as the director of a pregnancy resource center were babies I was saving because I was part of her body.

00:18:17.000 I was her body.

00:18:19.000 And so that's why I've been a pro-life activist since I was a fetus.

00:18:21.000 Follow the science, you degenerate rubes, right?

00:18:24.000 And we can get into how actually the science of transgenderism and abortion are identical.

00:18:28.000 Very interesting conversation.

00:18:29.000 But I've been trying to get pastors to preach on the issue of abortion for years.

00:18:32.000 I gave my first speech on abortion at 18.

00:18:34.000 I just turned 31.

00:18:36.000 And here's what I was always told: Seth, we don't talk about it because it's political.

00:18:39.000 Or secondly, they say, well, we don't want to shame and condemn the men and women in our church who are post-abortive.

00:18:45.000 But as one of my colleagues says, pastor silence on abortion does not spare his men and women hurt.

00:18:52.000 It spares them healing.

00:18:54.000 You may have an opportunity to share the gospel in a way to that broken, hurting man or woman such that they could experience forgiveness and healing and redemption and then be used to be a voice against this culture of death because they've been there and they can say, don't do what I did.

00:19:13.000 And so for people to say, oh, it's too controversial, we're not going to address it.

00:19:17.000 You're actually causing more harm in your congregation.

00:19:20.000 And you're giving the enemy of our soul, Satan himself, a foothold, a stronghold in your congregation to keep men without chests and to keep the hurting women silent who could be leading others into freedom.

00:19:33.000 So Seth, let's go through.

00:19:34.000 This is really well said.

00:19:37.000 By the way, I love having him as a guest.

00:19:39.000 I just get to listen.

00:19:40.000 It's like Bill Federer type energy.

00:19:43.000 Let's go through SLED.

00:19:44.000 I use it all the time.

00:19:45.000 Well, let's follow the science.

00:19:46.000 Yeah, let's follow the science.

00:19:48.000 Is Anthony Fauci here?

00:19:50.000 We invited him, I don't know.

00:19:52.000 I don't think he's more than welcome, by the way.

00:19:55.000 I want all to be saved.

00:19:56.000 I really do.

00:19:57.000 I mean that.

00:19:58.000 And so, sled, size, level of development, environment, and degree of dependency.

00:20:04.000 So, I go to a lot of college campuses.

00:20:06.000 I hear a lot of pro-abortion arguments.

00:20:08.000 You and I were both at Berkeley back to back, I think, day after day.

00:20:11.000 And it just turns out my conversation went to abortion.

00:20:13.000 I think yours obviously did as well.

00:20:16.000 But almost every single one of the pro-abortion arguments can fall into one of these four categories: the Ackerman sled, S-L-E-D.

00:20:24.000 So, let's start with size.

00:20:25.000 I will play the pro-abortion devil's advocate. 1.00

00:20:28.000 But, Seth, the fetus is so small and therefore small, not a lot of moral worth.

00:20:34.000 So, why do you want to protect something so small?

00:20:36.000 Yeah, well, men are generally larger than women, but that doesn't mean that men have more rights than women.

00:20:42.000 It's not like Shaquille O'Neal has any more rights than Barbara Streisand, right? 0.97

00:20:46.000 Our dignity and rights don't come from our size.

00:20:49.000 But notice what the pro-abortion arguments always do: they point out a difference between the unborn and the born, and then they insert or inject moral value into those differences.

00:21:02.000 So, the differences, Charlie, just referred to size, level of development, environment or location, and degree of dependency.

00:21:09.000 Now, notice today, most pro-abortion advocates will not argue that the unborn is not biologically human.

00:21:16.000 That harkens back to like 30 years ago.

00:21:18.000 They don't really make those arguments anymore.

00:21:20.000 They're fully willing to admit that it is a human being, but they say, But look, it's so different than us. 0.98

00:21:25.000 So, from a 30 or 60,000-foot view, you should just be aware of the fact that this is no different than the arguments to kill the Jews and black men in this country by saying, Well, look, they're so different than us. 0.56

00:21:34.000 You see, our dignity and rights don't come from our cognitive abilities, our accidental properties, or our functions, they come from our human nature.

00:21:42.000 And if you don't ground human rights in the only thing we have in common, we're all human beings, you leave it to the political class and the elite class to define which categories or cognitive abilities must be met to meet their litmus test for personhood.

00:21:56.000 So, yes, the baby's less developed.

00:21:58.000 That's the second one.

00:21:59.000 I mean, look at it, it can't feel pain, it's not viable, it doesn't aware that it's existing, it's not self-aware, doesn't have any desires.

00:22:07.000 And so, because these are sort of developmental markers on the continuum of human development, they say if you don't have this level of development or function, you're not a person with rights.

00:22:16.000 But it's very easy to debunk all these arguments if you understand the undergirding worldview that they're operating off of.

00:22:22.000 And that undergirding worldview is actually the same worldview that animates transgenderism today. 0.53

00:22:27.000 And it's a worldview, or let's call it a religion, called body self-dualism or Gnostic dualism, which, by the way, the church Charlie declared a heresy centuries ago.

00:22:36.000 So, Gnostic dualism or body self-dual dualism is this idea that the real person is not their bodies.

00:22:43.000 The real person are our thoughts, our aims, our consciousness, and our desires.

00:22:49.000 And so, the baby might have a human body, its heart might start beating at 21 days, it might be capable of responding to stimuli, according to experts in fetal pain, as early as about 12 weeks.

00:23:01.000 It might respond to stimuli, but none of that matters because it doesn't have any desires, so it doesn't have a desire to go on living.

00:23:08.000 It's not self-aware of itself, or they say it can't feel pain yet.

00:23:12.000 And so, they say those are the markers that must be met before one is a person.

00:23:16.000 So, here's one argument: the baby doesn't have a desire to go on living, Charlie.

00:23:20.000 So, what's it to them?

00:23:21.000 Ever heard a pro-abort say the baby doesn't know they're being aborted?

00:23:25.000 So, what's it to them? 0.99

00:23:27.000 Let's see, can we kill people who have suicidal tendencies? 0.98

00:23:31.000 Do they desire to go on living? 0.99

00:23:34.000 What about Buddhists? 0.89

00:23:35.000 What do Buddhists try to reach? 1.00

00:23:37.000 Nirvana.

00:23:38.000 I don't think this is possible, guys.

00:23:40.000 But if you reach Nirvana, do you know what that means?

00:23:42.000 You eradicate all desires, including, I guess, the desire to go on living.

00:23:48.000 Oh, like the fetus that you're saying we can rip limb from limb in the womb because they don't have a desire to go on living.

00:23:53.000 I can do this all day.

00:23:55.000 Whatever function they hone in on and say, the baby can't display this function right now that I demand they be able to show to me to be a person.

00:24:03.000 You'll find some born person who also can't meet that litmus test for personhood.

00:24:08.000 So here's what pro-abortion arguments do: is that you put in place the premises that justify your own enslavement.

00:24:15.000 You put in place the premises that justify your own enslavement.

00:24:19.000 Lincoln, in preparing for his debates against Stephen Douglas, would pen a little piece of paper called Fragments on Slavery in 1854.

00:24:30.000 And he would use this type of reasoning in the 1858, 1859 famous Lincoln-Douglas debates.

00:24:36.000 So I want to show you how these arguments are identical because you separate the dignity of the person from the fact that they're humans, which means then the Sauchies and the Francis Collins, the elite class, the Margaret Sangers, they get to decide the litmus test for personhood.

00:24:53.000 So here's what, this is what Lincoln wrote.

00:24:54.000 It's brilliant.

00:24:55.000 He said, okay, he was pretending he was in a debate with a slavery supporter.

00:24:59.000 And Lincoln said, you say A is white and B is black.

00:25:03.000 It is color then.

00:25:05.000 The lighter having the right to enslave the darker. 1.00

00:25:08.000 Take care.

00:25:10.000 By this rule, you are to be a slave to the first man you meet with a skin fairer than your own. 1.00

00:25:16.000 Oops.

00:25:17.000 Putting in place the premises that justify your own enslavement.

00:25:21.000 But then Lincoln said, but you say it is intellect. 0.94

00:25:23.000 You say that whites are intellectually the superiors of blacks and therefore have the right to enslave them. 0.97

00:25:29.000 Take care again. 0.98

00:25:30.000 By this reasoning, you were to be a slave to the first man you meet with an intellect superior to your own.

00:25:35.000 But you say it is a question of interest, says Lincoln.

00:25:37.000 That if you can make it in your interest, you have the right to enslave another.

00:25:41.000 And if he can make it in his interest, he has the right to enslave you.

00:25:41.000 Very well.

00:25:46.000 Do you see what pro-slavery arguments were doing?

00:25:48.000 Rather than arguing that the black man was not a human, they were saying they're not persons because they can't currently exercise certain cognitive abilities or functions that I demand they show me in the present to meet my litmus test for personhood.

00:26:02.000 And so every argument that dehumanizes the unborn by saying they don't display this cognitive ability or function that I demand they meet can always be applied to some born person outside the womb who at some point in their life will also not be able to evident that very same cognitive ability or function.

00:26:21.000 So whether it was slavery arguments then or abortion arguments now, we put in place the premises that justify our own enslavement.

00:26:27.000 Those who murder the unborn therefore cannot be trusted to govern the born.

00:26:32.000 So the final D is degree of dependency, which is the one that most pro-lifers stumble over.

00:26:41.000 It's probably the best argument, if you will, where the fetus, the baby, the human being is dependent on another, therefore you should be able to eliminate that being.

00:26:52.000 But Seth, let's go a little deeper here, which is this really all is a moral argument.

00:26:58.000 Every argument around this comes down to some morality.

00:27:02.000 And absent the church or Christians weighing in on this topic, it is almost always going to yield in the pro-abortion direction because the secular world does not have any sort of moral standard to be able to argue abortion correctly.

00:27:18.000 It will always come back down to, well, it's whatever makes me feel the best, whatever I want to do whenever I want to do it.

00:27:25.000 When in Christianity, it's actually not really about your feelings or your desires.

00:27:29.000 It's about serving God and doing what he commands.

00:27:33.000 And so what is the morality that drives forward a million abortions a year in America?

00:27:39.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:27:40.000 Well, you know, the enemy of our souls has no new stories.

00:27:45.000 He has no original ideas.

00:27:48.000 All Satan can do is invert and pervert and copycat.

00:27:52.000 And obviously, the rainbow is the greatest example of this in the culture wars today.

00:27:56.000 The rainbow, this sign that God's saying, I will never wipe you out by water again because of disgusting immorality that was normalized and celebrated.

00:28:04.000 And then the rainbow becomes the symbol of the same type of immorality that caused God's judgment in the first place.

00:28:09.000 So Satan can only invert and pervert.

00:28:12.000 And so, from a this, what Charlie's talking about, this detached morality that deifies ourselves into modern gods to decide who gets to live and who gets to die.

00:28:21.000 This is not progressive, this is regressive.

00:28:24.000 Child killing and child sacrifice goes right back to the years just following Adam and Eve.

00:28:29.000 This is a very ancient practice, the belief that in sacrificing an adult, a child, a baby to the sex gods, the war gods, the weather gods, the crop gods, the sun gods, right?

00:28:40.000 Means that you would receive a blessing in return and you would get to live just a little bit longer.

00:28:44.000 And you see this today in the secular moral revolutionary culture.

00:28:48.000 You have people that make arguments saying, Well, we need to fund abortions in poor countries, in black countries, because we have overpopulation and then too many people, it's harming the environment, Charlie, and that's causing climate change, which is making Witzela Pokeley, the Aztec sun god, really angry, right?

00:29:05.000 And I'm actually not joking.

00:29:06.000 At the time.

00:29:07.000 That's in California curriculum, by the way.

00:29:09.000 Yeah, the chance to the sun god.

00:29:10.000 Literally, chants to the Aztec sun god.

00:29:12.000 Yep, to Tisla Topoca.

00:29:13.000 And that's right.

00:29:15.000 Not a joke.

00:29:15.000 It was passed in the California Curriculum Committee.

00:29:18.000 We had videos of high school students from Tisla Topoca.

00:29:21.000 So when pastors say, Charlie, I don't preach against abortion because I don't preach on politics.

00:29:26.000 No, you don't preach against false religion that masquerades as politics to keep the politically impotent pastor silent.

00:29:26.000 You know what I say?

00:29:33.000 So we're contending not against an alternative politics, brothers and sisters, but against an alternative religion, the religion of secular progressivism and its sacrament or centerpiece of abortion.

00:29:46.000 Peter Kraft, the Catholic philosopher, once said that abortion is the demonic parody of the Eucharist.

00:29:53.000 That's why it uses the same holy words.

00:29:59.000 This is my body, but with the opposite blasphemous meaning.

00:30:06.000 So our Savior says at the Final Supper, This is my body, and I break it for you.

00:30:14.000 Take and eat in remembrance of me.

00:30:16.000 Not ironically, the culture of death says, This is my body, my choice, and I'll kill whatever's inside of my body because that serpent told me in Genesis 3: Eat the apple, do it my way, then your eyes shall be opened.

00:30:31.000 So Eve got woke, by the way.

00:30:33.000 You do need to know this.

00:30:34.000 It is the first woke story.

00:30:36.000 The serpent says, If you eat the apple, your eyes will be opened and you'll see real systems of systemic oppression because God's holding out on you.

00:30:43.000 He doesn't really want you to see.

00:30:44.000 Get woke, then ye shall be as gods.

00:30:50.000 And a God gets to decide who lives and who dies, don't they?

00:30:53.000 A God also gets to live forever.

00:30:55.000 Isn't that what makes a god a god?

00:30:56.000 They're eternal.

00:30:58.000 So you need to know this about Anthony Fauci, the high priest of secular progressivism in the last two years.

00:31:03.000 Fauci and Francis Collins, the disgraced NIH director, have approved funding to the University of Pittsburgh, where they kill babies in the early and late second trimester, some of those babies who were old enough to survive outside the womb.

00:31:17.000 Then they take them to another wing of the same hospital at the University of Pittsburgh, and they scalp their heads off, like the Aztecs would have. 1.00

00:31:25.000 By the way, Judicial Watch should expose all this.

00:31:27.000 I can show you the pictures.

00:31:28.000 Then they insert the scalps of late trimester aborted children on the backs of lab rats, and they call these humanized mice.

00:31:37.000 Then the rat grows the infant human hair that should have grown on the scalp of that baby had they not been aborted in the womb.

00:31:46.000 Could show you the pictures, and they use the humanized mice to find solutions to staph infections.

00:31:51.000 So, notice, guys, the baby just becomes a sacrifice on man's pursuit for eternal life.

00:31:56.000 And we do this with embryonic stem cell research, fetal organ harvesting, fetal tissue research, and recently prenatal gene editing, where they screw around and poke around with the genes of babies conceived in test tubes.

00:32:07.000 Because if you can edit the genes and get rid of things we don't like in the gene code, Margaret Sanger, eugenics, yes, then we can apply it on ourselves later when it's safe.

00:32:15.000 God forbid my rights are compromised.

00:32:17.000 And we'll edit out of our genes certain susceptibilities to diseases so we can live just a little bit longer.

00:32:24.000 C.S. Lewis once said that everyone wants progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means doing an about turn and walking back to the right road.

00:32:34.000 In that case, the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive.

00:32:39.000 I want to shout out Choice's Pregnancy. 0.84

00:32:42.000 They do such a great job because I think that they do such a great job.

00:32:47.000 And I'm doing this before we get into the super controversial stuff.

00:32:51.000 This has all just been surface-level stuff.

00:32:53.000 Because we're going to go into the stuff that even pro-lifers sometimes are uncomfortable talking about, which is how do you navigate rape, incest, life of the mother.

00:33:01.000 These are very serious questions, by the way, and I don't, you know, I don't expect complete agreement on every one of them because there's reasonable people can differ there on certain one of them.

00:33:10.000 I certainly have my opinions, and Seth, I think we're in total alignment there.

00:33:13.000 The second thing, as you were talking about, you know, the Catholic issue, I just want to say that the Catholic community here in Phoenix is some of the great pro-life warriors in Arizona.

00:33:22.000 They really deserve a lot of credit, and I think it's very important to mention that.

00:33:26.000 So, anyway, and I think you've seen the same, right, Seth, in pro-life circles.

00:33:30.000 Okay, so let's just, there's been a lot of, let's just say, advertisements run in the state on rape, incest, life of the mother.

00:33:40.000 Let's talk the facts.

00:33:42.000 How often is abortion medically necessary to save the life of a mother?

00:33:46.000 Right, good question.

00:33:46.000 Thank you, Charlie.

00:33:47.000 It actually never is.

00:33:50.000 And I meet pro-lifers a lot of the time who actually parrot the pro-abortion talking points on this.

00:33:55.000 This actually may be, Charlie, the most successful propaganda weaving into the American conscious and pro-life consciousness from the other side that I've seen in recent memory, such that you have pro-life pastors saying, I oppose abortion except when the mother's going to die.

00:34:11.000 Here's the thing: in these super, super minority rare cases where if the pregnancy continues, mom will die, the solution is not abortion.

00:34:20.000 The solution is you induce early labor with Pitocin or you perform a cesarean section.

00:34:25.000 And guess what? 1.00

00:34:27.000 That's safer for mom than the abortion would be. 0.52

00:34:31.000 Now, what do we hear?

00:34:32.000 What do we hear all the time, Charlie?

00:34:34.000 No, Cecile Richards, the former president of Planned Parenthood, told me that abortion is as safe as taking Tylenol.

00:34:43.000 And I've been told, follow the science.

00:34:45.000 It's actually the safest medical procedure in modern medicine.

00:34:48.000 This is what we hear from the abortion industrial complex. 0.68

00:34:52.000 I could go into the moral argument.

00:34:54.000 Let me just cite Planned Parenthood for you.

00:34:56.000 How about that?

00:34:57.000 In a 1963 booklet that actually we have a scan of, so maybe I'll send it to Charlie sometime on the show.

00:35:05.000 In a 1963 Planned Parenthood booklet, they admitted what I just said.

00:35:10.000 They said, abortion ends the life of a baby after it has already begun.

00:35:18.000 And it is dangerous to your life and health.

00:35:23.000 Planned Parenthood said that in a 1963 booklet. 0.83

00:35:27.000 One year later, Mary Calderon, the medical director for Planned Parenthood, would leave Planned Parenthood and found the Sexuality Information Education Council of the United States with seed money from Hugh Hefner with a board member who ran the Kinsey Institute at Indiana University, the Alfred Kinsey demon degenerate rapist who interviewed pedophiles to get his data on the sexual activity of the American male.

00:35:47.000 Let me just say one thing about if you ever want to see how sick and how dark some of this stuff goes and you want to see who actually is the architect of the perversion of children, just read a little bit of Dr. Kinsey and Judith Reisman.

00:36:03.000 Yeah, he wrote a book in the 1920s called Sexuality and the Human Male.

00:36:07.000 That's exactly right.

00:36:08.000 And it is.

00:36:09.000 And Judith Reisman, who died a couple years ago, spent her life debunking the science of Alfred Kinsey.

00:36:16.000 Dr. Money was another one.

00:36:17.000 I'll just give you one quote from Dr. Kinsey, and I'm paraphrasing.

00:36:20.000 He said, the only abnormal sexual act for a child is one of which they can't perform.

00:36:25.000 Yeah.

00:36:25.000 Continuously.

00:36:26.000 Yeah, on table 34, table 34 of his book, he actually details the rape of children between 18 months old and 12 years old.

00:36:38.000 I only say this, that this guy is published and widely celebrated in education.

00:36:44.000 Indiana University just erected a new statue of Alfred Kinsey.

00:36:50.000 So anyways, let's say this.

00:36:51.000 Remember the tangent.

00:36:52.000 Remember that T-level sort of a mama bear papa bear speaking at school board meetings in the last two years?

00:36:58.000 What was that in response to? 0.90

00:36:59.000 Yes, critical race theory, but secondly, the pornographic sex it in the schools.

00:37:03.000 And when you start studying this stuff, all roads lead to Kinsey.

00:37:06.000 Anyways, I have a podcast called Unaborted with Seth Gruber because we're all unaborted.

00:37:10.000 And we've done stuff on Kinsey.

00:37:11.000 We've had experts on Kinsey on the show, so go check it out.

00:37:14.000 Anyway, so Planned Parenthood admits in 63, abortion is dangerous to the mother's life and health.

00:37:19.000 And then when Roe v. Wade got overturned.

00:37:22.000 Amen, by the way, total providential thing that happened, right?

00:37:28.000 We started hearing a lot of propaganda, shocker, from the true peddlers of misinformation, the abortion industrial complex.

00:37:35.000 And what were they saying?

00:37:36.000 They were saying, now in states where abortion is illegal or highly, highly restricted, women are not going to be able to get miscarriage treatments, and they're not going to be able to have a baby removed from the fallopian tube in an ectopic pregnancy.

00:37:49.000 And because they were arguing that that was technically the abortion surgical procedure.

00:37:54.000 And since abortion is now illegal in that state, pro-lifers are trying to force pregnant women to die.

00:38:00.000 And they're just going to have their babies rotting in their womb after a miscarriage. 0.88

00:38:03.000 Well, no, that's an ad they're running.

00:38:05.000 I'm sure you've seen that.

00:38:06.000 Yeah.

00:38:06.000 25 times an hour.

00:38:07.000 Yeah.

00:38:08.000 And so guess what?

00:38:09.000 Guess what Planned Parenthood did right after the overturning of Roe versus Wade?

00:38:13.000 They deleted a line from their website, but the internet's forever, so we found it.

00:38:16.000 They deleted a line from their website that said this, verbatim.

00:38:20.000 It said, treatment for ectopic pregnancy is fundamentally different than treatment for abortion.

00:38:27.000 Because they were like, oh, gosh, all the pro-lifers might learn that we're actually lying and we need to strike that line from our website, which is just a Joseph Goebbels attempt of misinformation and censoring your political opponents that we saw in the Third Reich in a conversation for another time.

00:38:38.000 So that's one of the lines.

00:38:39.000 That's actually a good segue before we get to questions here, Seth.

00:38:42.000 And you can see he's an endless reservoir of every, if you have ever encountered a pro-abortion, yeah, you should give it up for Seth.

00:38:49.000 I mean, it's every angle you can imagine.

00:38:55.000 Which it and I text Seth often because, again, I have to cover 500 issues, right?

00:39:02.000 And so I have to go wide, sometimes more than I would like to go deep.

00:39:05.000 But there's some issues I want to go deep on.

00:39:08.000 But even sometimes I get a question and it's like, I don't know the best way to answer that.

00:39:12.000 And Seth immediately texts back.

00:39:13.000 He's a great resource and he's got a great spirit.

00:39:16.000 But Seth, I want to close this portion before we get to questions here because I know we're going to get some good questions on the topic about your project, the White Rose Resistance.

00:39:25.000 What is the White Rose Resistance?

00:39:27.000 I think it's great education for us.

00:39:29.000 And then what should our goal be?

00:39:30.000 What should our telos be?

00:39:32.000 What should our purpose be on this topic?

00:39:35.000 What is the call to action specifically?

00:39:37.000 Tell us about your project, then we'll get to questions.

00:39:39.000 Yeah, amen.

00:39:39.000 Thank you, Charlie.

00:39:40.000 So the White Rose Resistance is a story of a bunch of young 20-somethings in the Third Reich.

00:39:46.000 Now, we all know the name Oscar Schindler, right?

00:39:48.000 And Dietrich Bonhoeffer.

00:39:50.000 But as I've been sharing this story with some high-profile figures, by the way, most people don't know the story.

00:39:56.000 And so we have some pictures here.

00:39:58.000 This is Sophie and Hans Scholl in this picture here.

00:40:00.000 But Sophie Scholl was a young 21-year-old young woman in Nazi Germany in 1942.

00:40:06.000 She had dreams of becoming a school teacher.

00:40:08.000 She had a deep and abiding faith.

00:40:10.000 She loved the Lord.

00:40:11.000 Her father actually spent some time in prison for publicly criticizing Hitler.

00:40:16.000 And she comes in Munich one day across a leaflet, a pamphlet on the sidewalk, and she picks it up and it says, Leaflets of the White Rose.

00:40:24.000 And she starts reading it, and it's explicitly condemning the crimes of the Nazis and asking the good people to wake up.

00:40:29.000 It would say things like, We are the White Rose Resistance, we are your bad conscience, and we will not leave you alone. 0.83

00:40:35.000 They would say things like, If you know, why do you not act?

00:40:39.000 Remember, this is 1942.

00:40:41.000 The Jews have been wearing the yellow star for about three years now, the final salute. 0.99

00:40:44.000 They're being burned already and poisoned in cans.

00:40:47.000 She starts reading it, she goes, Huh, this sounds a lot how my brother talks a lot of the time.

00:40:52.000 Come to find out, the White Rose Resistance had not only been launched, but was being co-run by none other than her older brother, Hans, at 24 years old.

00:41:01.000 Now, you can imagine Sophie's surprise, like, what the heck, bro?

00:41:04.000 Why didn't you tell me about this?

00:41:05.000 You're like really cool.

00:41:06.000 But you have to understand, at 24 years old, Hans was just trying to protect his little sister.

00:41:11.000 He knew that what he was doing would likely cost him his life.

00:41:15.000 It did. 0.95

00:41:16.000 Sophie demands to join the White Rose Resistance as the youngest and the only woman.

00:41:21.000 And for the rest of 1942, they stay up late writing, printing, and distributing anti-Nazi leaflets all around Germany.

00:41:28.000 It was the 1942 Third Reich version of a social media campaign. 0.58

00:41:31.000 Powerful, equipping information, condemning bad ideas, and asking the good people to wake up.

00:41:36.000 And they take things to the next level in 1943.

00:41:40.000 And on February 18th, 1943, Hans and Sophie, brother and sixth, walk onto the campus at the University of Munich during class time when the halls were quieter.

00:41:50.000 And they begin to drop off piles, hundreds of these anti-Nazi leaflets all around the university.

00:41:56.000 Now, you need to remember the universities, just like the clergy, had largely been dominated by the Nazi state. 0.55

00:42:01.000 Sophie, in this iconic brave scene, walks to the third floor balcony of the University of Munich and she throws an entire stack of leaflets down to the atrium below.

00:42:12.000 Now, what happens when you throw paper?

00:42:14.000 It goes everywhere.

00:42:15.000 The janitor, a committed Nazi, catches Sophie in the act, calls the Gestapo, and has him arrested on the spot. 0.60

00:42:20.000 They spend the next four days in prison being brutally interrogated and physically assaulted.

00:42:25.000 Because they were arrested that morning, they missed a meeting they were supposed to go to that afternoon on February 18th, 1943, with a man named Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who had been so inspired by their courage as such young resistance fighters.

00:42:42.000 And it was as if God would enter that cell room in Sophie and Hans's final four days, pick them up into his hands, and condense their entire 21 and 24 years into four days.

00:42:53.000 And they would speak with a level of conviction and clarity that was lost on the German pulpits. 0.70

00:42:58.000 So I want to share with you one of the things Sophie said because I think Sophie is speaking prophetically to us today.

00:43:04.000 They understood that Edmund Burke line that all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing.

00:43:11.000 And so in her final days, Sophie would explain the problem as she saw it.

00:43:16.000 And remember, she's 21.

00:43:18.000 Here's what she said: The real damage is caused by all of those millions who just want to survive. 0.84

00:43:25.000 The honest men that just want to be left in peace.

00:43:28.000 Those who don't want their little lives disturbed by anything bigger than themselves.

00:43:33.000 Those with no sides and no causes.

00:43:36.000 Those who won't take measure of their own strength for fear of antagonizing their own weaknesses.

00:43:41.000 Those who don't like to make waves or enemies.

00:43:43.000 Those for whom freedom, honor, truth, and principle, it's just literature.

00:43:48.000 It's just words.

00:43:49.000 Those who live small die small. 1.00

00:43:53.000 It's the reductionistic approach to life.

00:43:56.000 If you keep it small, Christian, you'll keep it under control, right? 0.98

00:44:00.000 If you don't make any noise, the boogeyman won't find you.

00:44:04.000 But it's all an illusion because they die too.

00:44:08.000 Those people who roll up their spirits into tiny little balls so as to be safe.

00:44:16.000 Sophie would say, safe from what?

00:44:19.000 Life is always on the edge of death.

00:44:22.000 Narrow streets lead to the same place as wide avenues.

00:44:26.000 And a little candle burns itself out just like the flaming torch does.

00:44:32.000 I choose my own way to burn.

00:44:36.000 Who speaks like that at 21 years old?

00:44:39.000 That sounds like something Oscar Schindler or William Wilberforce or Dietrich Bonhoeffer would write, or Frederick Douglass or Harriet Tubman, or Martin Luther King Jr.

00:44:47.000 And she would say in her final moments before the Gestapo came to take her to the guillotine, she would say, How can we expect righteousness to prevail when there's hardly anyone willing to give themselves up individually to a righteous cause?

00:45:06.000 She would look out her window and say, Such a fine sunny day.

00:45:10.000 And I have to go now.

00:45:13.000 But what does my death matter if through us, thousands of people are awakened and stirred to action?

00:45:20.000 Her bravery so disturbed her prison guards that they relaxed the rules and let Hans and Sophie meet with their parents minutes before being taken to the chopping block.

00:45:33.000 And Sophie's mother would look at her doomed daughter and say, Remember Jesus, Sophie.

00:45:39.000 And Sophie would respond, Yes, but you too, Mama.

00:45:43.000 Her final words, according to the executioner, were, the sun still shines.

00:45:49.000 And Hans's final words were, Freedom.

00:45:54.000 They never saw the Christian army of resistance develop that they knew could bring a grinding halt to the Nazi regime.

00:46:00.000 So I'm rebuilding the White Rose Resistance for this generation against our silent but far more deadly Holocaust of abortion today to accomplish the goals that Hans and Sophie dreamed of but never saw realized. 0.76

00:46:13.000 And I'm promising you now, I'm a pain in the butt, a stick in the eye, and a fly in the ointment to the abortion industrial complex, the spirit of the age, and his obsession with wiping out the image of God from the earth. 0.86

00:46:27.000 So if you want to connect with us about what we're building, check out the White Rose Resistance and thank you. 0.83

00:46:34.000 That's pretty amazing.

00:46:36.000 I encourage you all to get behind Seth's work there.

00:46:38.000 It's one of the most amazing stories of history that is never told.

00:46:43.000 Let's line up for some questions here.

00:46:45.000 Seth is just getting his organization started.

00:46:48.000 As soon as I sat down with Seth, I said, this thing could catch on like wildfire.

00:46:51.000 I could see pastors, I could see people at churches wearing the white rose.

00:46:55.000 People could amazingly, like, I'm part of it, you're part of it.

00:46:58.000 And by the way, the goal is very simple, to end abortion our lifetime. 0.80

00:47:01.000 That's the goal.

00:47:01.000 That's right.

00:47:02.000 Very simple.

00:47:03.000 Okay, guys, we want to get to as many questions as we can.

00:47:06.000 So please keep them as questions.

00:47:09.000 And I do want to stay on topic.

00:47:10.000 I know a lot of you might have political questions or not.

00:47:13.000 Let's just try to stay on topic, okay?

00:47:15.000 Let's go here.

00:47:17.000 Good evening.

00:47:18.000 In regards to abortion, how would you address someone who claims to be Christian, yet says that we won't truly know what God believes is right and wrong until Jesus comes back to earth?

00:47:28.000 What was the second half?

00:47:30.000 How would you address someone who claims to be Christian, yet says that we won't truly know what God believes is right and wrong until Jesus comes back to earth?

00:47:38.000 Yeah, so this is an interesting argument.

00:47:40.000 I think what you're getting at, we hear this a lot.

00:47:42.000 Have you ever heard a pastor or Christian say something like, I speak where the Bible speaks, and I'm silent where the Bible's silent?

00:47:48.000 Kind of to what she's saying.

00:47:50.000 How can we truly know what God thinks is right or wrong until he comes back?

00:47:53.000 So I'm just going to address what's in the scriptures. 0.98

00:47:56.000 It's actually one of the dumbest statements ever said by Christians. 0.99

00:47:59.000 Here's why. 0.99

00:48:00.000 There's plenty of things that our Savior does not condemn.

00:48:04.000 That doesn't mean that the scriptures condone those behaviors.

00:48:07.000 What are some examples?

00:48:08.000 Did you know the Bible doesn't forbid forced female circumcision?

00:48:12.000 Oh, Charlie, we can't address that from a biblical worldview because it's not in the scriptures.

00:48:17.000 Did you know that the Bible doesn't forbid the lynching of homosexuals like some Muslim countries do? 1.00

00:48:24.000 But guess what?

00:48:25.000 I can still know that's wrong because I'm grounded in a Christian worldview that says man and woman has dignity and value and rights because they're created in the image of their God who entered human history in a uterus.

00:48:36.000 So lots of Christians who say that, and I'll end with this, do not read the Bible, do not take it seriously and commit to eisegesis rather than exegesis.

00:48:46.000 Eisegesis is when you insert your priors into the scriptures or try to find ways that it confirms your priors.

00:48:54.000 Well said.

00:48:55.000 Yeah.

00:48:55.000 And if that person calls themselves a Christian, they should read their Bible more.

00:48:59.000 I mean, they don't know what God says is right or wrong.

00:49:03.000 Like, let's just read like a verse.

00:49:06.000 Okay.

00:49:07.000 By the way, if you guys in this part of the line want to go to that one, that one's shorter.

00:49:10.000 Vice versa, whatever.

00:49:11.000 Okay.

00:49:12.000 Get to our buddy right here from Dream City Christian, my man.

00:49:16.000 Oh, by the way, I'm speaking at Dream City Christian.

00:49:18.000 Check your high and students tomorrow, by the way.

00:49:20.000 How great is that?

00:49:23.000 So I just wanted to know, have you seen life, Mark?

00:49:29.000 You know what?

00:49:30.000 I have been traveling so much right now.

00:49:32.000 I have not seen it yet.

00:49:33.000 But Kurt Cameron and I are good friends.

00:49:35.000 And I was supposed to have him on my Instagram live yesterday, and Instagram decided and he could not join it for some reason.

00:49:41.000 But Kurt's a good friend.

00:49:42.000 I've heard wonderful things, and I encourage you guys to go see it.

00:49:45.000 It's going bonkers at the box office right now.

00:49:48.000 Thank you, man.

00:49:49.000 Thank you.

00:49:51.000 It's a wonderful story about adoption, which is the heart of the gospel.

00:49:54.000 Seth and Charlie, my name is Sloane Adams, and I'm actually from Austin, Texas.

00:50:00.000 Charlie, first off, I just wanted to say thank you for everything that you do as a watchman on the wall for our nation.

00:50:05.000 And I personally wanted to say thank you because the Lord has actually helped use you to reawaken my love for our country and the biblical foundation upon which we're built.

00:50:05.000 Amen.

00:50:14.000 With that said, I'm actually on staff at a church in Austin, and I have the honor and privilege of giving the message to our congregation on November 6th, the Sunday before the election.

00:50:24.000 I actually requested it.

00:50:26.000 So my question is, if either one of you were me and you had the ear of a congregation on that Sunday, what would you say?

00:50:34.000 Wow.

00:50:36.000 So what would I say?

00:50:40.000 Yeah, I would do an exegetical analysis of Zechariah. 0.90

00:50:43.000 No, it's.

00:50:46.000 Look, you got to lean in.

00:50:48.000 And I think you should be right off front.

00:50:50.000 Should say, listen, you know, this coming Tuesday is a big day for our nation because you're the Sunday before the Tuesday of the election, right?

00:50:57.000 And the Bible commands us to care about our nation.

00:51:01.000 Cite it biblically, right?

00:51:02.000 Jeremiah 29, 7.

00:51:04.000 Talk about Esther, Mordecai, Nehemiah, Jeremiah, all try to influence secular government for God's purpose.

00:51:12.000 And then talk about three things that everyone should be able to agree with and say, this is not political, it's biblical.

00:51:17.000 God created man and woman.

00:51:19.000 Life begins at conception.

00:51:20.000 And that churches are more important than strip clubs, and we're never going to allow the church to be locked down again.

00:51:29.000 And then you should just pause and say, I want every single person to have a fulfilled ballot.

00:51:35.000 I'm not going to tell you what party to vote for, but I am going to ask you to pray and to fast before you make that decision of which person has the set of policies, so vote for policies over people that would be most in alignment with the natural law and biblical truth.

00:51:52.000 And then I would give a call to action, which is, I don't want a single person not to fill out a ballot on Tuesday.

00:51:57.000 And whatever that leads you towards or to, then so be it.

00:52:00.000 But those three things are uncompromising.

00:52:03.000 It is no question of biological reality, when life begins, and the church's importance and how the government crushed the church over the last couple years.

00:52:12.000 And I just want to commend you and encourage you because where you're at right now is a posture of willingness, a posture of you're asking for help and curiosity.

00:52:22.000 And honestly, if every pastor in America gave a sermon as simple as that the Sunday before the election, righteousness would prevail.

00:52:29.000 God bless you, man.

00:52:30.000 That's beautiful.

00:52:31.000 Seriously.

00:52:34.000 Thank you.

00:52:38.000 Hi, can you explain more of how the abortion procedure works?

00:52:42.000 The abortion what?

00:52:44.000 I've seen like movies, like Christian movies about it, and it's really over.

00:52:44.000 Procedures.

00:52:48.000 I'm telling Seth not to be too graphic because I mean it.

00:52:51.000 It's just be general, Seth.

00:52:53.000 It's sick.

00:52:54.000 Yeah.

00:52:54.000 It really is.

00:52:54.000 So there are four primary different forms of abortion.

00:52:58.000 The most popular today, and it's accounting for 50% or more now, actually, of the abortions, is RU486.

00:53:06.000 That's the abortion pill. 0.60

00:53:07.000 By the way, just a quick little, let's see, 30, I'll use in 30 seconds, 35 seconds.

00:53:11.000 A history window into RU486.

00:53:13.000 This is the abortion pill.

00:53:14.000 What does RU stand for?

00:53:15.000 Roussell Ukloff.

00:53:17.000 What's Roussell Ukloff?

00:53:18.000 Roussel Ukloff's majority shareholder is Hookstey G. What's Hookstay G?

00:53:22.000 Hookstay G emerged from the breakup of the German chemical company known as IG Farben, a company infamous for creating a gas called Zyklon B used to poison Jews in Nazi concentration camps.

00:53:38.000 So Hookstay G simply moved from creating poison to kill Jews to creating poison to kill babies. 0.99

00:53:45.000 So when you hear people talk about the Nazi-esque eugenic demonic legacy of the abortion industrial complex, that's not embellishment, hyperbole. 0.89

00:53:56.000 That's the reality.

00:53:57.000 And the tour I'm doing right now that TP Faith is sponsoring is 70 minutes, 50 minutes of that entire eugenic legacy.

00:54:04.000 The abortion pill, with the first regimen of the abortion pill, cuts off the hormone progesterone, the lining of the uterus breaks down and the baby starved to death.

00:54:12.000 The second mifopristone and misoprostol.

00:54:15.000 Misoprostol forces your uterus to have contractions.

00:54:19.000 And Planned Parenthood will literally tell you, and we have multiple women who have confirmed this, sit on the toilet, don't look and flush.

00:54:25.000 So the American sewage system becomes the abortion industry's disposal system. 0.96

00:54:29.000 Then you have suction abortions, aspiration abortions, which just sucks limbs off.

00:54:35.000 Is that appropriate enough?

00:54:37.000 And then you have dismemberment abortions, and that's forceps.

00:54:41.000 That's clamping, that's tearing.

00:54:43.000 And when the white paste starts flowing, you know you got the baby's brains.

00:54:47.000 And then you have induction abortions.

00:54:49.000 And this is when a needle is inserted into the baby's skull or heart, injected with potassium chloride, which by the way is very similar, they use in on death row to kill inmates.

00:55:01.000 Isn't that interesting?

00:55:02.000 The baby goes into cardiac arrest, and then you deliver a dead child.

00:55:06.000 Yeah, and so I will say this: that's the PG version.

00:55:10.000 Yeah.

00:55:11.000 If anyone here or listening online is pro-abortion, I just challenge you to go learn as much as you can about it.

00:55:18.000 And if you remain pro-abortion after you really realize the medieval brutality of the procedure, then that's on you.

00:55:25.000 But I guarantee you, if 99% of pro-abortion people understood the horrific nature of that procedure, I think it would open a lot of eyes.

00:55:34.000 I asked Seth to water that down because he went.

00:55:36.000 Yeah, he went.

00:55:37.000 There's an R-rated version, which is the accurate version, by the way.

00:55:40.000 It's sick.

00:55:41.000 Thank you for your question.

00:55:41.000 It really is.

00:55:42.000 Appreciate it.

00:55:43.000 Yeah, sorry.

00:55:44.000 It's good.

00:55:45.000 Hi, Seth.

00:55:46.000 Hi, Charlie.

00:55:47.000 I'm a big fan of both of you.

00:55:49.000 I'm actually a graduate from Grand Canyon University, and I know you both have spoken at that university.

00:55:54.000 And Charlie, I know you're going to be speaking there pretty soon.

00:55:57.000 Monday.

00:55:58.000 So thank you both so much.

00:55:59.000 You are both such a big inspiration to me and to all of us here tonight.

00:56:03.000 So my question is: Seth, I loved how you debunked every single pro-abortion argument in the book.

00:56:12.000 The left has been using the same arguments for abortion for literally decades.

00:56:17.000 But one argument that I'm finding really hard to debunk is the argument of, you know, people say things like, oh, you're not pro-life.

00:56:26.000 You're just pro-birth.

00:56:28.000 You don't care about the baby after it's born.

00:56:30.000 You don't care what happens to it.

00:56:32.000 You don't care if it's fed or if it's clothed or if it grows up in a good home, yada, yada, yada.

00:56:36.000 Pretty good.

00:56:37.000 So, yeah, I know.

00:56:39.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:56:40.000 Yeah.

00:56:41.000 So yeah, you're just pro-birth.

00:56:42.000 Yeah.

00:56:42.000 So thank you.

00:56:43.000 So the argument goes like this.

00:56:47.000 You can't truly be pro-life and you haven't proven your pro-life convictions unless you're caring for all of the children not aborted.

00:56:54.000 So I have to somehow prove my moral position through more than standing against the killing of the babies in the womb, but through the adopting, the raising, or the financing of children already born.

00:57:06.000 If that's true, then I say then you, pro-abortion advocate, you cannot show the true courage of your pro-abortion convictions unless you're willing to abort the children.

00:57:17.000 Very interesting response.

00:57:18.000 Because let me tell you something, most people, after they start ripping arms and legs off, they're done.

00:57:22.000 They're done with that industry.

00:57:23.000 And by the way, this is why many, especially more conservative states, guess what?

00:57:26.000 They have a really hard time finding enough surgical abortionists because a lot of people don't want to do that work, right?

00:57:31.000 So, and then the other part of the answer would be this.

00:57:34.000 All that is required to be truly pro-life is to live and act as if abortion is wrong.

00:57:39.000 The pro-life movement already has a massive task on their shoulders to end the greatest genocide in human history. 0.71

00:57:44.000 And the pro-life movement and pro-life organizations are largely underfunded and understaffed.

00:57:49.000 And then we're told with that huge job description that you're not even pro-life unless you're adopting all the babies.

00:57:56.000 Your pro-life ethic is debunked unless I can see how many children you adopted and children you're fostering, right?

00:58:03.000 Imagine saying that you can't oppose me beating my wife, which I don't do, unless you're willing to marry her. 0.98

00:58:11.000 Let's assume I'm a child-abusing degenerate father. 0.68

00:58:14.000 And then I say, you, church, can't oppose me beating my toddler unless you're willing to adopt him. 0.87

00:58:20.000 And you would say, I'm not going to adopt your kid, but like, stop beating him.

00:58:26.000 And your anti-toddler torturing position would still be valid, even if you weren't adopting the toddlers being beaten.

00:58:33.000 Does that make sense?

00:58:34.000 So why should it be any different on the abortion issue?

00:58:36.000 We have other organizations better situated.

00:58:39.000 Oh, and by the way, better funded for foster care, for adoption, for these various things than telling the pro-life movement, who has an overwhelming job description, that they have to do more than try to end abortion for their pro-life ethic to be valid.

00:58:52.000 But the Christian worldview is broad and comprehensive.

00:58:56.000 It demands that we love and care for all neighbors.

00:58:59.000 But that doesn't mean that the operational objectives of the pro-life movement must be diverted to other social causes for our pro-life ethic to be valid.

00:59:08.000 Yeah, and I also get that question a lot, and I reject the premise.

00:59:12.000 I mean, every single policy that I believe in is a pro-life policy.

00:59:16.000 I want a southern border so children aren't sex trafficked into my country.

00:59:19.000 That's a pro-life position.

00:59:21.000 I want more cops on the streets so people aren't slain on the side of the street going to school.

00:59:25.000 I want school choice so that children can read and not be taught critical race theory or pornographic material.

00:59:31.000 I want medical mutilation to be outlawed because I don't think a 13-year-old should have to go into a surgical room because some pharmaceutical company will benefit from it.

00:59:40.000 I want a booming economy because it lifts people out of poverty and gives them dignity and a chance to flourish and not be on government handouts.

00:59:46.000 Every position I have is a pro-life position.

00:59:48.000 I'm not just pro-life.

00:59:49.000 I'm not pro-birth.

00:59:50.000 I'm pro-life in every capacity.

00:59:52.000 And so.

00:59:52.000 And don't let people who slaughter unborn children at the tune of a million a year pontificate about morality.

00:59:59.000 You reject the premise.

01:00:00.000 You're the pro-life position. 0.75

01:00:01.000 You're the children in the womb through all nine months of pregnancy.

01:00:03.000 And you have the gall to judge me from a moral framework.

01:00:07.000 Yeah, they lecture me because they say, you don't want as many government benefits as I want.

01:00:14.000 Therefore, you're not pro-life.

01:00:16.000 Maybe I don't want those government benefits because I think that God has a better future in store for you than just staying on taxpayer subsidy and being having to be subsidized the rest of your life.

01:00:27.000 So I always punch back twice as hard on that.

01:00:29.000 I believe everyone here has a heart for all people made in the image of God.

01:00:33.000 And we believe a free society is the best way for those people to flourish.

01:00:36.000 Thank you, man.

01:00:40.000 First of all, thank you guys both for being here.

01:00:42.000 I just wanted to ask: as far as the super, super rare when it comes to the mother's health, I was tricked by that as well.

01:00:52.000 And I kind of held that point of view.

01:00:54.000 If it was the mother's health, I couldn't force it if I were to have a wife. 0.74

01:00:58.000 And it came with her, I would plead with her to give her life for the baby.

01:01:02.000 But can you elaborate on the science about inducing early labor and a mother's health and when that all comes into play?

01:01:10.000 Yeah, so there's been a lot of studies on abortions link to negative consequences for the mother: preterm labor and subsequent pregnancies, breast cancer, and mental health.

01:01:22.000 But what you'll hear the pro-abortion side say is that there are no negative consequences for mom's health following an abortion.

01:01:28.000 I don't have time to get into all the data.

01:01:30.000 My friend Dr. Brent Bowles, kind of my in-house OBGYN on my podcast, Unaborted, we did a podcast, if you scroll down on my podcast, Unaborted, called Proof that Abortion is Linked to Breast Cancer, Preterm Labor, and Mental Health.

01:01:42.000 And basically, he goes through every study in existence.

01:01:45.000 He's very informed, OBGYN, that ever looked at the link between abortion and breast cancer, abortion, and preterm labor, abortion, and mental health.

01:01:52.000 It comes down to this: the abortion industry hones in on the two or three studies of about 70 or 80 that showed that there was no negative consequence.

01:02:00.000 And then they ran that as the CNN, Chirons, and headlines.

01:02:03.000 It gets repeated in academia and medicinal circles, and then the CDC and ACOG, American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, they run with it and they say, debunked, follow the science.

01:02:12.000 Okay.

01:02:13.000 But with Roe versus Wade and Doe versus Bolton, the two Supreme Court decisions in 1973 that legalized abortion through point of birth, they said that states could ban abortion in the third trimester unless a failure to get a third trimester abortion endangered the mother's life or health.

01:02:32.000 And then they defined health so broadly you could drive a Mac truck through it.

01:02:38.000 So, then in a 1981 congressional subcommittee hearing, they were forced to define what they meant by the word health.

01:02:45.000 And they said health can refer to familial, emotional, basically anything that you wanted to define it as to justify that third trimester.

01:02:55.000 What does emotional health mean?

01:02:56.000 What does familial health mean?

01:02:58.000 Does that mean you got in a fight with your husband and it kind of made you a little stressed out?

01:03:01.000 No, no blows were thrown, it was just some yelling. 0.79

01:03:03.000 And so now I need an abortion. 0.89

01:03:05.000 Yeah, that.

01:03:05.000 And guess who gets to define whether the mother's definition of health is the appropriate legal definition to meet the standard for a third trimester abortion?

01:03:15.000 The abortionist.

01:03:16.000 Oh, I'm sure he has no financial incentive to adopt her definition of health because guess which abortions pay the best? 0.97

01:03:24.000 Late-term abortions.

01:03:26.000 So that's a little bit about how they've used health to basically ramrod through abortion through point of birth.

01:03:32.000 But yeah, if you look at the studies, the breadth of the studies shows an overwhelming link of negative health consequences for the mother following the abortion.

01:03:42.000 Yeah, and finally, I also want to make sure we're all clear on the 99% of all abortions are done electively and are done for convenience, socioeconomic, socioeconomic reasons, according to the pro-abortion Gutmacher Institute.

01:03:57.000 We're talking about such a fraction of a fraction that are rape, incest, and even less so of even if you're able to get to that definition of life of the mother.

01:04:05.000 And so I always flip it.

01:04:07.000 Whenever this comes up, I always flip it.

01:04:09.000 And I say, let's not get too drawn into theoretics or abstractions.

01:04:13.000 Do you think that the 99% that's just at a socioeconomic is wrong?

01:04:18.000 And they'll never admit that.

01:04:19.000 It's never about that.

01:04:20.000 Just tell them if I give you rape and incest and life of the mother for a second, will you join me to fight to end the 98% of all other abortions? 0.89

01:04:26.000 And they always say no.

01:04:27.000 To which I say, then why are you hiding behind rape victims to make yourself look more compassionate?

01:04:31.000 Because they can't debate on anything else.

01:04:34.000 Thank you for being here.

01:04:35.000 I'm going to get to as many questions as we can.

01:04:37.000 Hi.

01:04:38.000 So this question is a little similar to one that was asked already, but I find myself continuously running into this when talking to people who are pro-abortion.

01:04:47.000 So I'm just curious to know what you would say to someone who says that they have no other option but to abort their baby because they can't financially support it, support a child, and they don't want to contribute to overcrowded orphanages.

01:04:59.000 Oh, wow.

01:05:00.000 Crowded ones.

01:05:00.000 Orphanages.

01:05:02.000 Or foster care.

01:05:02.000 Yeah.

01:05:03.000 So pregnancy resource centers outnumber abortion centers in this country more than two to one.

01:05:09.000 You need to know that, first of all.

01:05:12.000 Most people don't know what a pregnancy resource center is. 0.87

01:05:14.000 And we have some politicians who say that they torture pregnant women and that they hate women and that they're the peddlers of misinformation.

01:05:24.000 It's very interesting.

01:05:25.000 So some politicians wrote a letter to Google recently, Charlie, saying, You need to make sure that those nasty pregnancy centers that torture pregnant women that their results don't show up on Google.

01:05:36.000 And Google is going along with that right now.

01:05:38.000 Last year, Google made sure that pro-lifers couldn't promote ad spend for the abortion pill reversal.

01:05:44.000 Remember, I talked to you about RU486.

01:05:46.000 Well, the abortion pill reversal is just progesterone, so it gives her more of what the abortion pill was breaking down to help save the pregnancy.

01:05:53.000 And they're saying that the abortion pill reversal is dangerous to women.

01:05:56.000 And now they're saying pregnancy resource centers are the peddlers of misinformation.

01:05:59.000 Misinformation.

01:06:00.000 You mean when I go to Planned Parenthood's website and I try to find out what a suction abortion is, and it says that it gently suctions out the pregnancy?

01:06:07.000 The pregnancy tissue, pregnancy tissue.

01:06:10.000 Guys, there's no such thing as pregnancy tissue.

01:06:12.000 Pregnancy is not a thing, it's a condition. 0.97

01:06:15.000 Conditions don't have pregnancy. 0.93

01:06:19.000 Conditions don't have tissue.

01:06:20.000 So if you're pregnant, what are you pregnant with?

01:06:23.000 Well, if you're a human being, you're pregnant with another human being. 0.99

01:06:25.000 So that's human tissue.

01:06:26.000 And these are the people lecturing us on the peddling of misinformation.

01:06:30.000 Okay, so there are those pregnancy resource centers that are heroes, and we have some represented here tonight from Choices, they outnumber abortion centers more than two to one.

01:06:38.000 And they provide almost all of the same services that Planned Parenthood does, minus the baby butchery part. 0.78

01:06:44.000 And they do it all for free.

01:06:46.000 The Catholic Church is kind of big on charity and hospitals and loving the poor and orphanages and foster care, if you don't know that.

01:06:52.000 It's actually the most charitable religious institution in the United States of America.

01:06:57.000 There are plenty of ministries well situated to provide care for women who need help.

01:07:03.000 And the church ought to be the ones on the front lines, making sure that we're not prostituting our spiritual obligation to pregnancy centers and letting them do it while we make ourselves feel really good, but actually getting involved, being the hands and feet of Jesus to women who are hurting and need help.

01:07:19.000 Yeah.

01:07:19.000 So two things I'll say.

01:07:21.000 One that I think we'll all agree with, and the second one that you might agree with.

01:07:25.000 The first one is that now that Roe versus Wade is repealed, the church has to step up.

01:07:28.000 Dream City has done this and have a no-excuse policy of anybody who's pregnant, you know, unexpectedly in the community that will receive help and love and acceptance with all of that, regardless of circumstances.

01:07:40.000 And I've been really, really thrilled with Dream City in particular at how action-oriented they've been to really lean in on this.

01:07:47.000 That's number one.

01:07:48.000 But number two, and again, I'm not saying you should ever get preachy, but that's an awful argument that person made, which is who the heck cares about your feelings?

01:07:58.000 There's another being involved here.

01:08:00.000 It's completely irrelevant about your own perspective.

01:08:04.000 You think the termination of a being is going to be best for them? 0.97

01:08:08.000 Death is not the best for an individual.

01:08:11.000 That's not your call to make.

01:08:13.000 And again, this goes to a deeper kind of, you know, let's just say, theme that I've been on on our podcast, which is this kind of narcissistic ideology.

01:08:24.000 That's not the right way to put it.

01:08:26.000 Yeah, narcissistic philosophy that has invaded mostly our schools, which it's all about you.

01:08:30.000 By the way, this is why we have the most depressed, suicidal, medicated, alcohol-addicted, drug-addicted, and psychiatric drug-taking generation in history, because they're so focused on themselves and they're not focused on serving other people.

01:08:43.000 And more important, serving God.

01:08:46.000 Like, just think about yourself a little less for the next 30 minutes.

01:08:50.000 It actually creates very miserable people.

01:08:52.000 And so, without getting harsh about it, it's not always about you.

01:08:57.000 It's about serving other people.

01:08:58.000 Anyway, that's a tougher argument.

01:08:59.000 And by the way, we're not saying it's popular.

01:09:01.000 What she's saying about, oh, they're going to have a hard life in foster care and orphanage.

01:09:04.000 So what?

01:09:04.000 Lynch them now?

01:09:05.000 I mean, what in the world?

01:09:06.000 So you need to understand that is the eugenic philosophical tradition of Margaret Sanger and Margaret.

01:09:13.000 And Margaret Sanger was influenced by the Neo-Malthusians, Thomas Malthus.

01:09:16.000 Thomas Malthus said, we need to abolish private charities and let the poor and the physically afflicted just perish because the gene pool and bad genes and people we don't like. 1.00

01:09:26.000 And then that's the philosophy that influenced Hitler. 0.83

01:09:29.000 Margaret Sanger had a board member named Lothrop Stoddard, who was a high official of the Massachusetts Ku Klux Klan, who wrote a book called The Rising Tide of Color Against White World Supremacy, who wrote a book called The Rise of the Underman.

01:09:40.000 And Adolf Hitler's director of genetic sterilization, Alfred Rosenberg, appropriated the German term Untermensch from the English version of Margaret Sanger's board member's book, Untermensch, meaning subhuman, the Jews, eugenics, we don't want them to live.

01:09:54.000 That's the eugenic, Nazi-esque tradition that they're espousing when they say they're going to have a rough life. 0.77

01:09:59.000 And we, as the high priests of secular progressivism, we get to decide what level of suffering is appropriate and whether we'll let you live or not.

01:10:06.000 And the last thing I'll say, this is what happens.

01:10:08.000 If you don't believe a human being has a soul, then why not dispose of them?

01:10:11.000 They're not useful to your aims and ambitions.

01:10:13.000 As soon as you believe human beings have a soul, everything changes.

01:10:16.000 You remove God, really bad things start to happen.

01:10:19.000 Two more questions.

01:10:20.000 Next one.

01:10:21.000 Hi.

01:10:21.000 I volunteer at Choice's Pregnancy Center, so I see women every week.

01:10:25.000 Awesome.

01:10:26.000 Thank you for doing that.

01:10:28.000 I feel like, I love it.

01:10:30.000 It's a soul blessing. 0.97

01:10:31.000 But I feel like women now acknowledge it's a baby, but they still say that they have the right to kill it. 1.00

01:10:38.000 So, what is your advice?

01:10:39.000 Yeah, welcome to humanism.

01:10:41.000 Yeah, Francis Schaefer once defined humanism as placing man at the center of all things and making him the measure of all things.

01:10:48.000 You displace God in Christianity. 0.98

01:10:51.000 You can justify anything.

01:10:53.000 Let's complete the circle, Charlie.

01:10:55.000 Abolition of man.

01:10:57.000 Charlie said it at the beginning of the night.

01:10:59.000 Written in 1944.

01:11:02.000 What did he mean by the abolition of man?

01:11:04.000 Well, C.S. Lewis said the head rules the belly through the chest.

01:11:08.000 So the head is the intellect, the rational man, rules the belly.

01:11:12.000 The belly represents raw appetite, the animalistic desires, base appetites.

01:11:16.000 So what's the chest?

01:11:18.000 Virtue, honor, and morality.

01:11:20.000 So if the head rules the belly through the chest, then intellect rules raw animal appetite through virtue and honor.

01:11:26.000 So what's the abolition of man?

01:11:28.000 Men without chests. 0.54

01:11:32.000 So C.S. Lewis would say, such is the tragic comedy of our situation.

01:11:36.000 We continue to clamor for those very qualities we are rendering impossible.

01:11:40.000 In a sort of ghastly simplicity, we remove the organ and demand the function.

01:11:46.000 We make men without chests and expect of them virtue and enterprise.

01:11:50.000 We laugh at honor and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.

01:11:55.000 We castrate and bid the geldings be fruitful.

01:11:59.000 If you remove the chest, you can justify anything, even genocide, even Holocaust, even killing.

01:12:08.000 Humanism has been the bloodiest, most deadly religion we have ever seen.

01:12:14.000 And Margaret Sanger's body count is greater than Mao's, Stalin's, and Mussolini's combined.

01:12:20.000 More human beings were murdered in the 20th century than all of the tyrants and homicidal maniacs of the entire world history before the 20th century, thanks to humanism.

01:12:31.000 So the acknowledgement that the victim is a human, but it doesn't matter, is nothing new.

01:12:36.000 It's very ancient.

01:12:37.000 So when we as Christians refuse to contend against that alternative religion, we're refusing to fulfill the role God gave us to love neighbors, to hold back those staggering towards slaughter, and to expose the deeds of darkness because we're not demanding our rights.

01:12:54.000 We're exercising our responsibility.

01:12:57.000 There's not much I can add to that, but I will say just a C.S. Lewis quote: you only know a line is crooked if you have a straight line to compare it to.

01:13:05.000 And that straight line is God.

01:13:07.000 It's the Bible.

01:13:07.000 It's why we're all here tonight.

01:13:09.000 And this is why I'm so animated towards preachers and pastors that do nothing.

01:13:14.000 It's a very simple question.

01:13:15.000 What is a human being?

01:13:16.000 It's the most simple yet important question when it comes to abortion.

01:13:19.000 If a human being is a result of a multi-million year accident, then yeah, sure, wipe them out.

01:13:26.000 If it's just evolution and you roll the dice and we happen to get reason and intellect and consciousness and sight and hearing, there's nothing special about it.

01:13:35.000 But again, if a human being is a speaking being, in the beginning was the word, the word was God, the word was with God, logos, the two creation stories in Genesis and John, saying the same thing differently, God spoke into existence, we're image bearers of that being, then all of a sudden, that baby, we do not have a moral right to be able to eliminate that being.

01:13:51.000 Everything changes.

01:13:53.000 And so Seth is spot on.

01:13:54.000 Humanism makes you feel good.

01:13:56.000 It puts you at the center of all things.

01:13:58.000 But actually, deep down, they're the most depressed, miserable, and angry people. 0.93

01:14:02.000 And how do they invoke their wrath by killing other people? 0.98

01:14:06.000 Because they're not happy just being miserable themselves. 0.99

01:14:09.000 They have to make you miserable. 0.54

01:14:10.000 And they won't stop with the unborn, by the way. 0.87

01:14:12.000 Last question.

01:14:13.000 That's right.

01:14:14.000 I got pregnant at 18 and I walked into my church knowing I was choosing life and I wanted to raise my children.

01:14:19.000 You walked into your church and what?

01:14:21.000 I knew I was choosing life and I was going to raise my child.

01:14:24.000 And my church told me I had to give the baby up for adoption or I would ruin my life.

01:14:29.000 And I'm just wondering if even if the church seems to be like anti-abortion and they seem like they're doing everything right, could they still be part of the problem?

01:14:40.000 Oh, absolutely.

01:14:41.000 Yes, absolutely.

01:14:42.000 Wonderful.

01:14:42.000 Thank you for sharing your story.

01:14:43.000 Thank you so much.

01:14:44.000 Yeah, no, I mean, listen, thanks to, by the way, thanks to people like Charlie Kirk, my pastor Rob McCoy, and Jack Hibbs.

01:14:50.000 I've probably spoken in more pulpits in America in the last two years than any pro-life speaker in the world.

01:14:55.000 And so I just want to say that I meet these churches and pastors, and God is raising some of them up, but it's still not enough.

01:15:02.000 So many churches will pay lip service to the pro-life movement and to the dignity of life in the womb, but not do anything to contend for the life of that unborn child.

01:15:11.000 So if you can't get the family right, you're going to get everything else wrong.

01:15:15.000 That's the fundamental building block of society.

01:15:17.000 It's how God chooses to build societies and bring the gospel to a broken people.

01:15:22.000 And so I'm so sorry to hear that.

01:15:24.000 I'm so sorry that a church told you you would ruin your life if you chose to mother your child.

01:15:29.000 That is not a biblical model.

01:15:30.000 That is not a Christian message. 0.90

01:15:32.000 And that's why we need people like Charlie and Dream City Church to lead courageously because while cowardice is contagious, so is courage.

01:15:39.000 And we love you and we champion you.

01:15:41.000 Amen.

01:15:42.000 Thank you.

01:15:44.000 So that is a good segue to our close here, which is we have a lot of work to do.

01:15:50.000 I've said for I'm 100% pro-life and I'm proud of it, but I think there's a lot of people that say they're pro-life, but are not as pro-life as they claim.

01:15:58.000 Part of it's okay, part of it's confusion.

01:16:00.000 That's why his message is so important: to lean in to understand the issue with clarity and with wisdom.

01:16:06.000 And so, Seth, you have a table out there where people can meet you and support you, right?

01:16:09.000 Yes, I'll be back there.

01:16:09.000 All right, White Rose Resistance.

01:16:11.000 Give it up one more time for Seth Gruber, everybody.

01:16:13.000 And we'll see you guys November 2nd, right?

01:16:17.000 With Jensen Franklin and Pete Hegseth for the last Freedom Night of the Year.

01:16:21.000 Let's pack this whole thing up.

01:16:22.000 God bless you guys.

01:16:26.000 Thanks so much for listening, everybody.

01:16:28.000 Email me your thoughts as always.

01:16:29.000 Freedom at CharlieKirk.com.

01:16:30.000 Thanks so much for listening.

01:16:32.000 God bless.

01:16:36.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.

The Charlie Kirk Show - October 16, 2022

The Best Arguments for LIFE with Seth Gruber LIVE from Freedom Night in America

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