00:00:48.000He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
00:00:54.000We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
00:01:29.000Almost nobody arrested, from my knowledge, on federal hate crime charges for the firebombing or the arson of pro-life clinics.
00:01:35.000But what they focused their attention on was going after a pro-life dad who's a pro-life activist, storming the home and trying to do a show trial to say that if you support pro-life ideas, if you are a pro-life activist, we are going to show the world that we're going to make you suffer.
00:01:59.000Well, Mark Hauk was raided by the FBI, indicted by the Department of Justice, and has now been acquitted.
00:02:04.000A federal jury rejected the government's intimidation against pro-life people.
00:02:22.000So all glory be to God for this opportunity.
00:02:25.000And it all began on October 13th, 2021, which was the day that my son and I, my 12-year-old son at the time, were coming into the city of Philadelphia for our normal prayer vigil, our weekly prayer vigil.
00:02:42.000We've been doing it for myself 20 years and my son for the last two years with me.
00:02:46.000And on this particular day, the fall afternoon, after about 45 minutes of praying, there was an altercation between myself and a Planned Parenthood escort.
00:02:59.000And that ensued to be, I guess, more problems with this man because that initial altercation where he was interfering with my First Amendment rights to give literature out to abortion-minded men and women who come and go from the facility led him to further harass me and my son.
00:03:22.000He placed himself on that day literally about a foot or two away from my son and started to sling insults at me and try to coerce and manipulate my son's mind about his own father, basically harassing my son.
00:03:36.000My son became very nervous, uneasy with the situation.
00:04:12.000Now, what followed from that, Charlie, is a private criminal complaint.
00:04:16.000The DA, the Philadelphia Police Department, did not want to do anything with it.
00:04:20.000They have bigger fish to fry, I guess.
00:04:23.000And he filed a private criminal complaint.
00:04:25.000It went to municipal court in Philadelphia.
00:04:27.000After about four hearings, the man that accused me of these things didn't even bother to show up for court.
00:04:35.000So it was dismissed on April 22nd, on April 20th, this past year, 2022.
00:04:41.000On April 27th, five days later, I was given a target letter saying that I was a target of a federal grand jury investigation and that my attorney should contact the assistant U.S. attorney in the Eastern District of Philadelphia.
00:05:31.000Next thing I know, Charlie, 6:45 in the morning, Friday, September 23rd, about two dozen federal agents and PA state troopers were on my doorstep, banging on my door, demanding me to open the door, full SWAT gear, full SWAT, heavily armored vest, ballistic shields, ballistic helmets, M16s, battering ram, ready to break down my door if I didn't open it up, which I calmly did,
00:05:59.000and proceeded to have dialogue with them.
00:06:02.000They said they were going to arrest me.
00:06:08.000They said we're taking him with or without a warrant.
00:06:11.000And then eventually, after about 15 minutes of reckless behavior, scary moments for my children and my wife, I was put in custody and taken down to the federal building in Philadelphia.
00:06:23.000And so you just recently had your trial.
00:06:25.000It seems as if this was a very quick timeline between the raid and the trial.
00:06:35.000I think, you know, you look some of these things up.
00:06:37.000Whenever there's a minor involved in a trial like this, they try to expedite it so that the child isn't further traumatized.
00:06:44.000No one communicated to me that that was the reason.
00:06:47.000We were just first up, couldn't believe it was four months after the David DeLeidon's case and he's still in court and waiting his trial for many things and it's been years.
00:07:01.000So you just recently had your trial and they were, this is the federal government, right?
00:07:05.000So there was a, is it fair to say there was a federal prosecutor that was arguing to try to put you in jail?
00:07:12.000What law were they alleging that you broke?
00:07:16.000So I was I was charged with allegedly violating the FACE Act, which is a 1994 federal law that was enacted sponsored by the late Senator Ted Kennedy and Chuck Schumer.
00:07:30.000And basically it was designed in the 1990s to deal with pro-lifers who were performing public sit-ins and civil disobedience called the rescue movement.
00:07:40.000And they effectively did that under Bill Clinton's administration.
00:07:44.000It has been resurrected to come after pro-lifers.
00:07:47.000Basically, the act stands for federal access to clinic entrances and it protects those.
00:07:55.000It protects those that are coming into and out of an abortion facility, or it even protects those trying to get into a pregnancy resource center, believe it or not.
00:08:04.000In this case, it's being applied widely to against pro-lifers and not being adequately or equally applied to the violations against people with intent to go to pregnancy resource centers or violence against pregnancy resource centers.
00:08:19.000But in this case, it was applied to me.
00:08:21.000They had two counts with three to four elements under each.
00:08:25.000And basically, it was a violation of the FACE Act that held up to 11 years in prison and $350,000 in fine.
00:08:34.000And so the government spent their time on you and these two charges.
00:08:38.000And thankfully, the system that our founding fathers established of having a jury of your peers and presumption of innocence and representation and a speedy trial and this legal system inherited by Blackstone and from biblical principles, you're now exonerated.
00:08:58.000Do you have plans, though, to counter-sue the government for going after you?
00:09:03.000Yes, I mean, people need to be held accountable.
00:09:06.000On that day, my wife and children were terrorized and to this day still feel the effects.
00:09:13.000I mean, I have seven children aged 14 at the time, 13 down to three.
00:09:18.000And my wife and children need and deserve justice and they will get justice.
00:09:25.000And myself, now that I'm acquitted, will be a part of that.
00:09:28.000And we will sue the federal government, the Department of Justice.
00:09:32.000We actually will probably be pursuing other lawsuits against planned parents.
00:09:38.000Yeah, I mean, and just I know a lot of people did pro bono work for you, but I mean, it just should be a law somewhere that if the government loses, they should have to pay your legal bills.
00:09:50.000I mean, they get to use the public treasury.
00:09:53.000I'm sure you had to spend some money, but I know a lot of groups stepped up and defend you.
00:10:16.000I want to ask you a couple more questions.
00:10:19.000I want to tell you guys about COVID tax relief.
00:10:23.000COVID Tax Relief is an amazing service that exists for you because of Washington, D.C.'s addiction to overspending.
00:10:31.000Again, I'm not a fan that this money exists or that's out there or that it's available, but as they say, it is what it is.
00:10:37.000Look, COVIDTaxRelief.org got a small retail business, almost $80,000.
00:10:42.000COVIDtaxRelief.org got a manufacturing business, nearly $250,000.
00:10:47.000COVIDtaxRelief.org got a large distribution business, almost $900,000.
00:10:51.000If you run a business, church or nonprofit, and paid your employees through all or part of the pandemic, you could qualify for up to $26,000 per employee through the Government Cares Act.
00:11:01.000COVIDtaxRelief.org receives a low commission, very reasonable, only after you receive the money.
00:11:44.000Well, the gentleman that you allude to, he's been there, a volunteer for 20 years.
00:11:48.000So, you know, that kind of puts that to rest.
00:11:52.000The government, how they handled this and how they treated me is interesting and something we'll hopefully take before Congress.
00:12:00.000When they came to my house that day, again, if you know anything about a federal agent coming to your home to serve a warrant or to arrest somebody, usually it's one or two people.
00:12:13.000Now, the FBI does their homework and they do tremendous research over who they're going to go out and bring this paperwork to.
00:12:21.000On that particular day, I had over 20 plus agents and PA state troopers that were at my house with long guns and full SWAT gear.
00:12:31.000I'm surprised someone didn't get shot that day.
00:12:33.000I'm surprised one of my children weren't shot.
00:12:35.000We do have some airsoft guns in the house.
00:12:38.000But if one of my children thought this was interesting, a little five-year-old or four-year-old, they would have been shot.
00:12:53.000Again, they said they were going to take me with her without a warrant.
00:12:56.000They did have a warrant, but that's how they communicated to my wife.
00:12:59.000As my children were screaming and they took me away, they wouldn't allow me to get a pair of pants, to get a sweatshirt on a cold day, to put socks on, wouldn't allow me to brush my teeth, wouldn't let me put antiodorant on.
00:13:15.000Normally, when an agent comes to your house, they might say, you know, sure, we're going to take you downtown, finish your coffee, you know, get your stuff together.
00:13:24.000On this day, I was rushed out of my home, taken to the federal building about 100 yards from Independence Hall, where our rights were established.
00:13:31.000I was cuffed, shackled in my waist and on my feet in the federal building.
00:13:37.000I was chained to a table for over six hours with my hands and shackled.
00:13:42.000I had bare ankles, tightly, the cuffs were tightly put on my ankles.
00:13:47.000And for six hours, I just prayed and entered into a deeper union with my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.
00:13:55.000Now, during that process, while I was praying and entering into that piece of that space, they manipulated and coerced me to give over information that they told me I didn't have to give.
00:14:34.000This is a Soviet tactic where they will drag an opposition political leader through the streets and they'll well-publicize it and they'll put you in prison and arrest you.
00:14:44.000And they'll say, Hey, for all of you out there there that think you can challenge the regime, look what happened to Mark.
00:14:50.000Well, you know, and it continued, a pre-trial hearing.
00:14:53.000And then eventually they moved me to the U.S. Marshals.
00:14:58.000Now, you got to know in Philadelphia in the federal building, the U.S. Marshals are in the same building.
00:15:03.000So they kept me in shackles the whole time.
00:15:07.000As I walked to the U.S. Marshals, or I should say, shimmied my feet, there was no need to keep feet shackles, ankle shackles on me as I was going to be released at the U.S. Marshals.
00:15:20.000I asked why that had to be, and I got no answer.
00:15:50.000And these bloodthirsty savages had said, you know what?
00:15:56.000We need to go arrest anybody that has any sort of, that has like anything in the atmospherics of committing a crime, which of course you didn't.
00:16:05.000And they went after you and they went after so many other people because they need to make a public example of this.
00:16:11.000Look at the firebombing here we're showing on air here, one after the other, after the other.
00:16:16.000And I'm glad you got acquitted, but you should never have gone through that.
00:16:21.000And I think you should sue the federal government.
00:16:23.000Of course, no one will be fired from the federal government.
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00:19:10.000He made memes in the fall of 2016, making fun of the ridiculous Hillary Clinton advertisements and posters, and some of which that said, we could put it up on the screen, avoid the line, vote from home, text Hillary to 59925.
00:20:06.000This case, as you mentioned, really does present an unprecedented prosecution by the federal government against what we believe to be constitutionally protected speech.
00:20:18.000My client, Mr. Mackey, is accused of violating 18 U.S.C. 241.
00:20:26.000And I want to take a second and just explain what that statute stands for.
00:20:32.000It was passed originally, Charlie, in the aftermath of the Civil War to guarantee the right of newly freed slaves to vote and to protect them and to prevent recalcitrant forces in the South from interfering with, again, the right to vote, the right to exercise constitutional rights.
00:20:57.000And the statute speaks specifically of barring conspiracies to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in connection with the exercise of those rights.
00:21:14.000And up until Mr. Mackey's indictment just days after President Biden took office, to our knowledge, it's never been used in this way to really tackle what would otherwise be constitutionally protected speech, as we've argued in the motions and the pleadings that have been made in the case to this point.
00:21:44.000And so the government's position, and this is why this case is so important and could have such a chilling effect on free speech, is that what Mr. Mackey is alleged to have tweeted out on Twitter could end up with him facing down not only a felony conviction,
00:22:08.000but 10 years, up to 10 years in prison for the meme specifically you mentioned the draft of otters, which is mentioned in the government's indictment, but also the tweet that which we maintain is satirical, the tweet about being able to text your vote for Hillary Clinton.
00:22:31.000And so that's where we stand right now.
00:22:33.000And the case is set to go to trial in the middle of March in Brooklyn, New York.
00:22:41.000So the government's argument is that they think this meme, specifically the one with texting your vote, was misleading to people to such a great extent that it might have materially moved votes.
00:23:00.000From my memory, that's a very weak argument.
00:23:03.000Is the government going to be able to prove that?
00:23:05.000That somebody did not vote or was disenfranchised because of a meme?
00:23:12.000Now, the government's argument, I think, is that they don't have to, in their view, show that any particular person did not vote as a result of viewing this meme, right?
00:23:29.000That the conspiracy and the intention of a defendant in Mr. Mackey's alleged circumstances is sufficient in the government's view to support a conviction.
00:23:42.000Therefore, I suppose it's incumbent on your legal team to just prove that he's a satirist then.
00:24:03.000But certainly, if one goes back in time to the 2016 election, there were quite a few of these kinds of memes that were floating around in the Twitter sphere to include memes that were targeted toward Trump supporters.
00:24:21.000In fact, there's a similarly situated meme that's still on Twitter to this very day that invites Trump supporters to vote by mail.
00:24:33.000And so there were these efforts that were going on.
00:24:36.000There were conversations that were taking place and being had.
00:24:42.000But again, the government hasn't alleged that a single vote was moved because of Mr. Mackey's memes and its read of the statute is it's not something that it has to prove.
00:24:56.000But then it just has to improve, you have to prove intent of what.
00:25:00.000I'm just trying to make sure I understand this.
00:25:01.000So they have to prove that the intent, the deep-seated private beliefs of what he did was to try to disenfranchise blacks.
00:25:13.000I mean, is that what you to interfere to interfere with to interfere with the right to vote, to do what the statute says is barred, to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person with respect to exercising their right to vote is the theory that the government has advanced.
00:25:36.000And again, this is my synopsis of paper.
00:25:40.000And Charlie, as you can probably surmise, if this prosecution stands and this theory has legs, the implications for other speech are dire and they're troubling.
00:26:01.000Regardless of whether or not one agrees with Mr. Mackey's speech, regardless of your political ideology, left, right, center, whatever it might be, this prosecution has significant and in our view, troubling implications for First Amendment rights.
00:26:25.000And that's why we really are asking people who want to help with this effort to consider giving to support Mr. Mackey's legal defense.
00:26:38.000And you can learn more about that at memedefensefund.com.
00:26:45.000And if you feel led, you can donate and support the effort here.
00:26:56.000So this is one of the more dangerous prosecutions that could set a precedent to go after any commentator or political actor.
00:27:06.000And I also just can't quite wrap my head around this idea of interference because they're going to say, oh, look, he was a pro-Trump activist.
00:27:15.000Therefore, look at all these memes he was obviously trying to do.
00:28:03.000We would ask for prayer for the case, for Doug, for the defense and for justice to be done in this case.
00:28:12.000Because again, the implications are so, from our vantage point, so significant and the stakes are so high for the First Amendment.
00:28:23.000And the ability of people, regardless of political ideology, really, to use satire, to use memes to criticize the powers that be in our society.
00:28:38.000That's what we see as being at stake in this prosecution.
00:28:57.000I'm working with our team at Turning Point USA.
00:28:59.000We're going to do a matching type grant that if a certain amount could be raised, then we will match it at Turning Point USA up to a certain amount.
00:29:07.000We're going to figure that out and make an announcement because this is one of the more important cases and trials.
00:29:13.000The implications for freedom of speech are wide-ranging and significant.
00:29:19.000And the Biden regime knows, and of course they're doing this in Brooklyn, obviously.
00:29:22.000They wouldn't do this in Oklahoma City.
00:29:25.000They're doing this as a way to try to set a precedent.
00:29:28.000With this is James Lawrence, who's part of the legal team here.
00:29:31.000Can you just elaborate a little bit more on the far-ranging implications here?
00:29:36.000This is political speech that was done satirically with a comedic spirit.
00:29:41.000This could very well set a precedent where if you say something that we don't like, we could put you in prison.
00:29:50.000Well, yeah, Charlie, yeah, again, that's our view of this case from the defense side of the table, that if this prosecution stands and if the federal government using the statute,
00:30:04.000this well-intentioned statute, which again was passed to protect the rights of free slaves in the post-Civil War South, if this can be weaponized in this way to attack an individual's right to use memes to critique the powers that be in our society in this context,
00:30:27.000again, regardless of whether or not one agrees with the content, then one could see it being used not just to prosecute people who are accused of spreading disinformation about the method and ways of voting,
00:30:42.000but about the actual candidates that are on the ballot as well, conceivably, because it could, in an attenuated way, interfere with the person's ability to cast a vote for a desired candidate.
00:30:58.000This is the Pandora's box that the government's prosecution of Douglas Mackey invites.
00:31:05.000And we are committed on the defense team to shutting the door to this, which will be to the redown and the benefit really of all Americans, regardless of political ideology.
00:31:19.000And I mean, I can't imagine that this would withstand an equal protection appeal.
00:31:26.000I only say this because I know for certain that there is a voluminous records of people on the political left that use this sort of tactic.
00:31:38.000I mean, is that at all in your calculus or is that a separate issue?
00:31:42.000Well, you know, Charlie, one would expect that the most venerable civil liberties organization in our country would be standing up to the plate.
00:31:58.000Why are you talking to a person who spent most of their career as a complex commercial litigator from Raleigh, North Carolina? about a case like this?
00:32:10.000Why aren't you talking to somebody, again, from our nation's most respected and venerable civil liberties organization?
00:32:18.000No, the ACLU is too busy trying to make sure kids could chop off their private property.
00:32:24.000I will say this, you know, Charlie, I had the privilege.
00:32:28.000I had the opportunity in April of 2020 to stand shoulder to shoulder with working class people and moms who were trying to go out and protest our governor's lockdown orders here in North Carolina.
00:32:40.000It was work that the ACLU would not do.
00:32:42.000It's a privilege to stand shoulder to shoulder with Douglas Mackey and defend him in this case.
00:32:50.000I'm honored to be a part of the defense team.
00:32:53.000And again, my message to your viewers is support this effort at meme defensefund.com.
00:33:00.000But even more importantly, really, I believe in the power of prayer.
00:33:04.000James 5.16 says that the prayers of the righteous avail of much.
00:33:08.000And I know there are a lot of people that are listening to this broadcast right now that are righteous.
00:33:14.000And I would ask for them to pray for Doug, to pray for me, to pray for the defense team, to pray for justice to be done.
00:33:21.000It really is the most important thing you can do.