The Charlie Kirk Show - Tyler Robinson Hearing Aftermath: Day 3

00:00:03.000 My name is Charlie Kirk.

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00:01:17.000 Recap of the State of Utah versus Tyler Robinson preliminary hearing.

00:01:21.000 Just to set the stage again, this is about probable cause.

00:01:25.000 All right.

00:01:26.000 So that is the bar that the state is trying to meet in all of this.

00:01:30.000 So we're trying to see if this is going to go to a full trial.

00:01:34.000 I think it's been pretty compelling evidence thus far.

00:01:37.000 Today started at one o'clock.

00:01:39.000 Mountain time.

00:01:40.000 And so we lost out on half a day and it just got bogged down in a bunch of arguments.

00:01:45.000 But there were some significant things that happened.

00:01:47.000 Not a lot of significant things.

00:01:48.000 Well, there was.

00:01:49.000 There's two things and it kind of leads to a third big thing. 0.98

00:01:51.000 Here to help us break this down is Liz Wheeler, host of the Liz Wheeler Show on Blaze TV.

00:01:58.000 She's been doing amazing work, really heroes work, Liz, on what you've been doing, just fact checking, fact checking, fact checking.

00:02:06.000 Give us your perception of how it's gone so far and today.

00:02:10.000 Hi, Andrew.

00:02:10.000 Hi, Blake.

00:02:12.000 Yeah, my small service, you know, to honor Charlie's legacy is just to make sure that I can help untangle the truth as the truth comes out.

00:02:19.000 I think the three days, especially the first two days of this preliminary hearing, the probable cause hearing, have been incredibly damning for Tyler Robinson, which is maybe not unexpected for some of us who've been tracking the facts and the evidence from day one.

00:02:35.000 But it's also been a very revealing couple of days for applying these facts.

00:02:41.000 Against the delusional conspiracies that we know have taken root among so many on our side.

00:02:47.000 So, when we saw the video yesterday of Tyler Robinson's movements showing up four different times on campus, that's incredibly revealing.

00:02:54.000 Watching him scale that staircase, seeing how easily accessible the roof is, watching him lie prone on the corner of the roof, and then the moment that the shot is fired, get up and run away, jump off that roof, seeing him limp as if he has a rifle down his pants.

00:03:12.000 Which, of course, is the allegation.

00:03:13.000 These are incredibly telling things.

00:03:15.000 Hearing the testimony about the DNA that on the towel and the screwdriver, which were found on the roof, that were allegedly used by Tyler Robinson, to see that the vast majority of the DNA samples on both of those items was a match for Tyler Robinson, and then a small portion of the DNA found on those items was from his transgender lover, Lance Twiggs.

00:03:38.000 These are incredibly revealing things.

00:03:40.000 To see today, I think the timeline of when he turned himself in.

00:03:45.000 About 9 p.m. mountain time, which would have been local time, to the Washington County Police.

00:03:51.000 And then seeing that juxtaposed against when he made that confession to the Discord chat that he was part of, that would have been over an hour.

00:03:59.000 The confession would have happened over an hour prior to him turning himself in to hear the testimony that he was then not formally arrested until they had probable cause.

00:04:08.000 And that maybe happened at 4 a.m. local time.

00:04:11.000 These are incredibly revealing, incredibly damning pieces of evidence against Tyler Robinson.

00:04:17.000 And the thing is, this is just the preliminary hearing.

00:04:19.000 This isn't even necessarily like the good stuff or the most compelling evidence.

00:04:25.000 This is just enough to establish that a trial should take place.

00:04:29.000 And I'm glad, in a sense, that America's watching because I'm glad that they can see these facts for themselves finally.

00:04:34.000 And it's not only preliminary to the actual trial.

00:04:36.000 Today was practically preliminary to the evidence that even the witness was going to present, because as we'll get into, a very large portion of today was extended debate, extended back and forth about what will actually be shown.

00:04:53.000 So we heard this agent that interviews were conducted with Tyler Robinson's mother, with Tyler Robinson's father.

00:05:00.000 They never really got into what was said in those interviews, only that they happened.

00:05:05.000 They talked about getting this statement from Lance Twiggs and then twice they interviewed him twice.

00:05:10.000 They said, but then we got very extended arguments about how much is going to be redacted.

00:05:16.000 We got statements from the defense that basically said if the evidence they're planning to show here is shown, it would basically be broadcasting to the world what the state will call a confession and it would be prejudicial to his right to a fair trial for that to be shown before the trial itself.

00:05:36.000 So we got.

00:05:38.000 More signs today that the evidence against Tyler Robinson is extremely strong, and the defense is very aware of that.

00:05:46.000 So, even if we're not able to see all of it, it does look like we're likely to get a lot of this redacted when it does finally air tomorrow.

00:05:53.000 But we're just slowly grinding away.

00:05:57.000 Probably the other highlight of the day for me is actually early on where Judge Graff just essentially gives a statement that's saying, We are supposed to get this done by the end of business on Friday.

00:06:08.000 So, can we please try to hurry it up?

00:06:10.000 Is more or less what he said.

00:06:11.000 Exactly.

00:06:11.000 Well, and I want to go back to what you just said, Liz, that the timeline piece of it.

00:06:15.000 We know that certain purveyors of this propaganda, this conspiracy stuff, like Baron Coleman, have made much about the timeline, that he could have never confessed because they would have had his phone already.

00:06:25.000 Well, the timeline got established today.

00:06:28.000 And that was a very key part of what we saw in this case.

00:06:30.000 And I'm going to play something from this Turkey Tom video.

00:06:33.000 Watchers of our show know that I've referenced Turkey Tom.

00:06:37.000 This is a whistleblower friend that.

00:06:41.000 Approached this YouTuber and said, Hey, I actually know these guys.

00:06:44.000 I hung out with them a lot.

00:06:45.000 And this is exactly how they talked the text messages.

00:06:47.000 He confirms that this is the language they used for each other.

00:06:50.000 And he also shared with him this Discord confession.

00:06:54.000 And it was the first time we'd seen the Discord confession with a timestamp and a time zone on it.

00:07:00.000 So go ahead and play this SOT 70.

00:07:02.000 And it's a short clip, but it establishes the timeline.

00:07:05.000 Confession message to their old friend group server.

00:07:07.000 It's interesting to me that he sent it in this server and not to Lance's new server because I'm not sure why that is.

00:07:14.000 It could just be that he was less familiar with the people there.

00:07:16.000 But based on the kind of messages sent there, which we're going to go over later, it could be that he wanted to avoid having anyone say something that resembled support for his actions.

00:07:25.000 In the original.

00:07:26.000 So what did you see there?

00:07:27.000 It said 9 57 p.m. EDT, which would have been 7 57 Utah time.

00:07:35.000 And then we find out, we hear from the testimony today that he turned himself in approximately at 9 local time.

00:07:41.000 So he sends that Discord chat almost an hour, probably a full hour before he turned himself in.

00:07:48.000 So, gone is one giant conspiracy on the timeline.

00:07:52.000 Yeah, and there's actually an additional element to that, too, is when he turned himself in.

00:07:56.000 We saw that video today of him being held at the Washington County Police Department, but he wasn't held in a cell.

00:08:03.000 He was held in basically a back office until, like I said, they established probable cause and formally arrested him, possibly around 4 a.m.

00:08:11.000 We actually don't know when he lost access to his cell phone.

00:08:15.000 He could have had access to, I mean, he could have had access to his phone in that room.

00:08:19.000 We don't know that.

00:08:20.000 Yeah, but Liz, here's the thing.

00:08:22.000 We don't know that he didn't have it then either.

00:08:23.000 Yeah, but even if they took it away from him right at nine o'clock when he turns himself in, which we have no reason to believe at this point.

00:08:29.000 He still had time to make the confession.

00:08:31.000 And there has been literally millions of views on social media pontificating about this one piece.

00:08:38.000 And I want to show you something.

00:08:40.000 Here, show this, these two images, by the way, guys.

00:08:44.000 I'm going to show this to Liz.

00:08:45.000 I think this is a really big deal here.

00:08:49.000 So we see this image, the first one, put it up when you can.

00:08:51.000 And this is in the holding room, Liz.

00:08:54.000 So notice that the color of the shirt, the hat, this is what he's wearing, okay?

00:08:59.000 Now, go to the image that we saw in the compilation video the day before.

00:09:04.000 Notice the color of shirt and the hat.

00:09:06.000 So, we have been told, Liz, that there is, even with this, the social media of it all, we have been told that there is no proof that that's actually Tyler Robinson.

00:09:17.000 It doesn't matter that his own mom recognized him from the images that were published from the surveillance.

00:09:23.000 It's only images where he's wearing different clothing, where he's trying to hide his appearance.

00:09:26.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:09:28.000 But this is the, looks like the same shirt and same hat.

00:09:31.000 I can't say that to Definitively, maybe he had a number of them or something, or maybe it's a slightly different shirt in a similar color.

00:09:38.000 But the hat, look at these back to back, just keep going back and forth.

00:09:41.000 This looks like the exact same person to me, Liz.

00:09:46.000 Am I missing something here?

00:09:48.000 No, I think not.

00:09:49.000 I think one of the things that I pointed out on X earlier, and of course, it was Candace Owens yesterday who was not just asking, do we have definitive proof that the person that we see in this is a grainy video?

00:10:01.000 I think there was a clearer video that was played in court, to my understanding.

00:10:04.000 The clearer video hasn't been released to the public.

00:10:06.000 We just have the grainy version of it.

00:10:07.000 Right.

00:10:08.000 It was Candace Owens who wasn't just saying, How do we know this is him?

00:10:10.000 Because we can't see his face clearly.

00:10:12.000 She was denying it was him.

00:10:13.000 She was casting doubt actively on whether this was him.

00:10:16.000 And my point was just well, his own mother identified him from a grainy still that was taken from these videos that was released by police on the day that Tyler Robinson committed this crime, allegedly.

00:10:32.000 And so who are we going to believe here?

00:10:34.000 Candace Owens, who doesn't.

00:10:36.000 Seem to have an idea of how this process works, the judicial process, or how to establish whether there's probable cause, or his own mother who not only identified him, but this is one of the.

00:10:47.000 I can't even fathom what that must be like for parents.

00:10:49.000 You know, a parent's worst nightmare turning in their own son for a hideous crime they believe he committed because she recognized him from this video.

00:10:59.000 I can't imagine that either.

00:11:00.000 Liz, I'm so glad.

00:11:02.000 Yeah, I'm so glad you brought that up because, you know, I actually.

00:11:08.000 They have a soft spot in my heart because they did the right thing.

00:11:10.000 I don't know their family story at all.

00:11:12.000 I don't know any of it.

00:11:14.000 But that they did a brave thing, I have a lot of respect for that, actually.

00:11:19.000 I want to play this clip.

00:11:20.000 This is from Jeffrey Neiman, who is a family representative inside the courthouse for the Kirks.

00:11:27.000 And I just want to point this out very clearly.

00:11:31.000 One side is arguing for max transparency, the other side is obstructing anything being shared with the public.

00:11:38.000 And the cynic in me, Liz, is kind of assuming.

00:11:41.000 I hope I'm wrong.

00:11:43.000 But the cynic in me thinks that maybe it's because they want all these conspiracy theories to run wild.

00:11:49.000 They want less that's plainly out there because they understand that the more the public sees, the more that the credibility of the conspiracy crowd is getting just crippled completely.

00:12:00.000 So here it is.

00:12:01.000 This is Jeff Neiman advocating on behalf of the family, SOT 71.

00:12:07.000 All right.

00:12:09.000 Council, if you would like to state your name.

00:12:13.000 Your Honor, Jeffrey Nyman on behalf of the Kirk family.

00:12:16.000 I've been very hesitant to speak up at these proceedings.

00:12:19.000 We understand.

00:12:20.000 It's the state, the defense, and the judge.

00:12:22.000 You're all doing your job.

00:12:24.000 But I feel as if we need to.

00:12:25.000 I want to be clear as to what the Kirk family's position is on all of this.

00:12:29.000 The Kirk family believes strongly that if the evidence is being admitted in this preliminary hearing, it should be made public for the world to see.

00:12:37.000 No redactions.

00:12:38.000 This court has tools at its disposal to make sure the defendant receives a fair trial.

00:12:45.000 You'll use them if you find that you need to.

00:12:50.000 That's it, Your Honor.

00:12:52.000 To not be transparent here, to not be open, to not let the world see what happened, will create doubt and distrust in the judicial system.

00:13:02.000 And that's not what anybody wants.

00:13:03.000 That's not what any of us believe should happen here.

00:13:05.000 And we'd ask the court to consider the position of the family in making its ultimate decision.

00:13:10.000 Thank you.

00:13:12.000 I thought that was a really important moment from today, Liz, because, you know, we get a lot of people chipping at us online that we don't have any questions, we don't want any.

00:13:23.000 We have lots of questions.

00:13:25.000 We want max transparency.

00:13:26.000 We want the world to see the process play out, the legal process play out.

00:13:31.000 And so I just want to highlight that.

00:13:32.000 I thought it was powerful that Jeffrey Nyman chose to stand up in that moment.

00:13:37.000 I thought it was critical.

00:13:38.000 Liz, I only have you for three more minutes, and I know you got to go.

00:13:42.000 I want to highlight what you were talking about because I think you've articulated it very well, better than anybody I've seen online.

00:13:49.000 When it comes to the DNA, you, there was, explain the, the, the, Stories that were floating around on social media and how you rebutted them.

00:13:58.000 Yeah, let me comment on the Kirk family lawyer for just a second, too.

00:14:01.000 I know that the argument from the other side is that it could taint the jury pool if some of the more damning evidence is shown.

00:14:09.000 And in a regular trial, that may be an argument that carries some water.

00:14:12.000 That's true.

00:14:13.000 But the counter argument in this particular case, because it's such a high profile case, is that the conspiracy theories, which are so abundant surrounding the murder of Charlie Kirk and who was involved in that, Could also taint the jury pool.

00:14:26.000 And so I think it is in the interest of the American people to see this evidence because God forbid you get a jury pool that's full of people who bought into some of those conspiracies because they didn't have the access to see some of this evidence that could change their minds.

00:14:40.000 Because let's be real, everyone in the country is aware of the facts of this.

00:14:44.000 You're not going to get a jury pool of people that are like, oh, I didn't know who Charlie Kirk was.

00:14:47.000 I didn't know the details of this.

00:14:48.000 I never saw the video.

00:14:49.000 I know nothing about it.

00:14:50.000 That's not going to happen in a high profile case like this.

00:14:52.000 And so I think maximum transparency is the wisest.

00:14:55.000 Course of action, and it is fair in our judicial process given the circumstances of this particular case.

00:15:01.000 That being said, the DNA evidence that came out today or the analysis, there's fake news immediately.

00:15:10.000 Anytime that a piece of evidence is damning to Tyler Robinson, the fake news propagated online proliferates instantly.

00:15:17.000 And that happened again.

00:15:19.000 I think this was actually late yesterday that the testimony came from the DNA analyst that said, listen, of this screwdriver, And of this towel that were found on the roof, there were several DNA samples that were found.

00:15:30.000 Instantly, the propagators of fake news online claimed that the majority of the DNA was Lance Twiggs and only a fraction was Tyler Robinson.

00:15:39.000 And the point of propagating this lie, of course, was to cast doubt on whether Tyler Robinson was actually the one who committed this crime, because that's key to the conspiracies.

00:15:46.000 He cannot be the one who committed the crime in order for the vast global conspiracy that's been painted by Candace Owens to be real.

00:15:55.000 But of course, that wasn't true.

00:15:56.000 If you listen to the testimony, I posted this on my ex account, the video of it.

00:16:00.000 The DNA analyst said there were multiple DNA samples.

00:16:03.000 Yeah, you can see that on the screen.

00:16:05.000 That were found on the towel and the screwdriver.

00:16:07.000 About 5% of it was Lance Twiggs, and 95% was Tyler Robinson's, or a match for them on one item.

00:16:14.000 And on the other item, a fraction, 11%, matched Lance Twiggs' DNA.

00:16:18.000 And 89% matched Tyler Robinson, which makes sense. 0.60

00:16:22.000 I mean, they were gay lovers.

00:16:23.000 They're going to have the stuff in their apartment, which you can assume, I suppose, that this is where this stuff came from.

00:16:30.000 It's probably going to have some of their shared DNA on it.

00:16:33.000 That's not something that should surprise anyone.

00:16:36.000 I think it probably does bring up questions, questions that we've had for a long time since we initially found out who did this.

00:16:44.000 Whether Lance Twiggs knew about it or was involved, I mean, I assume those are questions that will be answered in the days and weeks and months to come.

00:16:51.000 But the lie that was propagated initially was just that.

00:16:54.000 It was just a lie.

00:16:56.000 And I hope it actually serves to open people's eyes because when you see a lie like that and then you see the actual testimony that contradicts the lie and you realize that the liars were lying, you should ask, well, what else are they lying about?

00:17:07.000 I think that's really well said, Liz.

00:17:09.000 And by the way, I know you got to go, but you've been on the record now predicting the next conspiracy theory or the next wild hare that they chase.

00:17:19.000 And then literally within minutes, all the usual suspects.

00:17:23.000 Take that thing that you predicted because you're watching it live and you're like, they're going to go with that.

00:17:27.000 I know it.

00:17:28.000 They're not very original people, so I wouldn't even put it beyond them to listen to what Liz or someone says and go, that's a great idea.

00:17:34.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:17:35.000 I should run with that.

00:17:36.000 Or they'll frame it this way.

00:17:38.000 They'll frame it.

00:17:38.000 It's like they're taunting us, they're telling us what they did.

00:17:41.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:17:42.000 This is how they operate.

00:17:43.000 Well done, Liz.

00:17:44.000 Thank you for taking some time tonight.

00:17:46.000 I know you got a busy schedule, so God bless you.

00:17:49.000 You seriously are doing hero's work.

00:17:52.000 You're out in front.

00:17:53.000 Hopefully, you're not inspiring.

00:17:54.000 You're not inspired, so this.

00:17:56.000 I don't think that's true.

00:17:57.000 So, thank you again for joining us.

00:17:59.000 Liz Wheeler, host of the Liz Wheeler Show.

00:18:01.000 Have a great rest of your night.

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00:19:05.000 If you're wondering, they are, you know, who is currently running with, you know, the video of him turning himself in is a body double.

00:19:12.000 I don't know why they would need to fake that because they did have to get him in custody at some point.

00:19:15.000 I mean, like, for real, you got to, a lot of things got to line up, including how tall he is, which is another really funny one.

00:19:23.000 Here to help us do, oh, actually, let the team bring him in.

00:19:26.000 I'm sorry, team.

00:19:27.000 But we're going to have Taylor Hansen, who's actually on the ground doing reporting for TPSA Frontlines.

00:19:33.000 He's going to come.

00:19:35.000 And join us.

00:19:36.000 And he actually went on campus, went on campus to where some of these videos from the surveillance videos are being broadcast, right?

00:19:45.000 So we've got the compilation video.

00:19:48.000 There was a lot of, let's just say, noise being made about exactly how tall Tyler Robinson is and did that compare to how tall the gentleman in the video was.

00:20:02.000 So let's, we've got, I think, a couple of these clips.

00:20:04.000 Maybe we can use this as we bring in.

00:20:07.000 As we bring him in.

00:20:08.000 Okay, how about this? 1.00

00:20:09.000 Let's play 67 while we bring Taylor Hansen into the show.

00:20:13.000 It was the third and fourth stair.

00:20:16.000 So he has his foot roughly right here, right here.

00:20:20.000 It's about as close as you're going to be able to replicate.

00:20:22.000 And obviously, you have the retaining wall behind me.

00:20:23.000 Keep in mind, my camera is not roughly at the exact same angle.

00:20:29.000 It's touching the bulb of the other security camera.

00:20:32.000 They are different cameras, though, so there's going to be a different effect.

00:20:35.000 This is just how cameras work.

00:20:36.000 Camera 101, science, awesome stuff.

00:20:39.000 Hand roughly on the wall, have the same spacing, at least as close as we can possibly get.

00:20:45.000 This is what it looks like.

00:20:46.000 Okay, he had his head slightly down, not all the way down.

00:20:48.000 It was roughly about here.

00:20:50.000 I'm six foot tall.

00:20:50.000 Obviously, I'm a lot wider than Robinson would be in this case, but this is about as close of a replication as you can get.

00:21:00.000 All right, Taylor Hanson joins us now from TPSA Frontlines, independent reporter on the ground there.

00:21:06.000 How are you doing, Taylor?

00:21:09.000 Quite the project you endeavored upon at UVU campus.

00:21:14.000 First of all, just like how creepy was it to be there and kind of retrace those steps?

00:21:20.000 Yeah, it was definitely creepy.

00:21:21.000 That's one way to put it.

00:21:22.000 I've been there a few times since Charlie was assassinated.

00:21:26.000 And I was there actually the day of, right afterwards, and then the following day as well.

00:21:31.000 And the feeling kind of never goes away, put it in perspective.

00:21:34.000 There's always something in the air.

00:21:37.000 So, where are you at right now?

00:21:39.000 Is that the courthouse that you're at?

00:21:41.000 Yeah, I'm right outside the fourth judicial courthouse here in Bravo, Utah.

00:21:44.000 Okay.

00:21:44.000 All right.

00:21:45.000 So, going back to that clip, I don't know if you saw it.

00:21:47.000 We were bringing you in at the same time.

00:21:48.000 But, you know, did you guys do sort of markings?

00:21:52.000 And actually, I think you, in that clip, you went with the fact that Robinson is 5'10.

00:21:57.000 I actually think he's six foot.

00:21:59.000 This is debated because I think there's some, I think there's a police processing document or something where it says 5'10.

00:22:06.000 It's one of those things how much of their hair do you measure, all of that.

00:22:09.000 All right.

00:22:11.000 Getting deeper into this, I mean, the claim when they were getting whipped up by the conspiracies is that this person is well over six feet.

00:22:18.000 He must be 6'4, 6'5, 6'8, who knows?

00:22:22.000 And I think that's trivially easy to debunk through what Tyler's been doing, or even in the video footage you can see.

00:22:28.000 He passes by another guy in the stairwell, and that guy is clearly much taller than him.

00:22:33.000 Well, and there was also that woman that was the young woman walking past him, and it looked like they were almost equal height.

00:22:40.000 But explain what you were talking about.

00:22:43.000 First of all, in that clip, you say, It's going to be impossible for me to perfectly match this because of camera angles, because of different lenses.

00:22:53.000 I mean, you tried to match the angle as much as you could, but it's going to be impossible to match.

00:22:59.000 And then also because you've done a lot of camera work over the years, Taylor, explain how something on camera can be deceptive to the person that's viewing it.

00:23:10.000 For example, I always use the example of Tom Cruise.

00:23:13.000 Tom Cruise, I thought, was like a tall man.

00:23:15.000 And then I found out later he's 5'7.

00:23:17.000 And you know what I mean?

00:23:18.000 No one was ever more betrayed than this guy.

00:23:20.000 I was very betrayed myself.

00:23:21.000 He had this big man crush on him.

00:23:22.000 That's not true.

00:23:23.000 That's not true.

00:23:25.000 But he is a good actor.

00:23:26.000 I have to give it to him.

00:23:27.000 But the point is explain how that can be deceptive.

00:23:30.000 Yeah, well, I mean, everything is angles, everything is lighting.

00:23:32.000 I mean, granted, I mean, you have to keep in mind that the footage that, you know, Candace and others are pulling and referencing in regards to him being taller than, you know, he was prior.

00:23:42.000 In the first time that, you know, the alleged assassin came onto campus, he is actually farther away from the railing.

00:23:48.000 So that can also kind of factor into the angle, into where he, how much he slumped over.

00:23:53.000 But the actual lens used in the security footage, I mean, I don't have access to the UVU security cameras.

00:23:59.000 So, you know, I wish I did, but that's not how it works.

00:24:02.000 And the lens is going to capture things differently than, you know, an eye.

00:24:05.000 iPhone 17 camera, which is what was used to film this video.

00:24:08.000 You know, the iPhone 17, completely different lens than what the actual security footage is, you know, that's being portrayed here in the preliminary hearings.

00:24:15.000 So it doesn't matter how much comparison you're giving, you can only get so much, I would say, when using a different camera lens to actually being entirely accurate.

00:24:26.000 But I tried my best, had, you know, held it up.

00:24:28.000 It was touching the same height.

00:24:30.000 It was literally touching the actual UVU security camera to basically try and replicate that.

00:24:35.000 And regarding, You know, 5'10, 6'4.

00:24:37.000 I believe I had seen online that the new thing is that, you know, the second guy that came through is a different guy and he appears to be anywhere between 6'4 to 6'4.

00:24:46.000 And I figured I would go because I'm exactly 6'4.

00:24:49.000 And you can see, I mean, I am taller than that person in the video.

00:24:52.000 And in the later videos, I imagine you guys will show, there's a retaining wall with a line that is clearly about halfway through the person's head that is walking through the tunnel.

00:25:03.000 And I go, who is 6'4, I go and stand next to it.

00:25:06.000 Touching my shoulders essentially.

00:25:07.000 So there's clearly a height differential taking place in regards to that.

00:25:11.000 Yeah, well, let's show that.

00:25:13.000 68.

00:25:14.000 This is obviously the tunnel where it came down the retaining stairs.

00:25:18.000 What's interesting about this, once again, camera differentials, but we're about matching roughly as close as we can height wise.

00:25:26.000 Look in the Robinson video.

00:25:28.000 He's about right here, okay?

00:25:30.000 Roughly about somebody that would land at 5'10.

00:25:32.000 It's about right in the middle of his face.

00:25:34.000 I'm six foot.

00:25:35.000 This is barely above my shoulders.

00:25:37.000 So there's a clear difference taking place right here.

00:25:41.000 So, this is the staircase right off the retaining wall I was just showing you in the tunnel.

00:25:45.000 Comes up this right side of the rail, walking with one fairly straight leg going up.

00:25:53.000 Roughly right about here is where you see that girl come down the staircase right next to him.

00:26:01.000 And he keeps his head slightly down, obviously, because my phone is right underneath the camera, as close as we can replicate.

00:26:08.000 He swings close to this railing right here, and then he swings out wide again.

00:26:14.000 So, you know, I think this is interesting.

00:26:17.000 And because now I have a question about, I don't know that it's relevant, but so here's the image that Candace Owens published originally.

00:26:25.000 She cut off the top of his head, which I think was first indicators.

00:26:31.000 Notice how you don't see the top number.

00:26:33.000 You get up to about 70 inches, which would put him at 510.

00:26:37.000 But here is the actual.

00:26:40.000 So it goes all the way up.

00:26:42.000 And to Blake's point, maybe he's.

00:26:45.000 Six foot, maybe it's 5'11 and a half or something.

00:26:47.000 I mean, who knows?

00:26:48.000 It's like to your point, it's like how much of that is hair.

00:26:50.000 I don't know.

00:26:51.000 Yeah, and just, but it's an approximation.

00:26:53.000 So, based on those two images, that now go back to that retaining wall.

00:26:59.000 What are the takeaways?

00:27:00.000 Draw our eyes and ears to what needs to be seen by the audience there, Taylor.

00:27:04.000 I mean, well, you see that they're, I mean, it would say that it's almost roughly the same, but it is just slightly different to kind of drive that fact that, okay, even if he is 5'10, then it doesn't matter in this scenario because one, Camera angles play into it, but me as a six foot tall man, I am completely different than what that video essentially portrayed.

00:27:24.000 And that also leads into angling, that leads into me using my iPhone camera.

00:27:28.000 So, the idea that this is kind of the new narrative, it's debunked in itself.

00:27:32.000 I don't even need to go down there to really even raise this argument, but the internet has kind of been taken over in a sense with these conspiracy theories.

00:27:40.000 And I can understand questioning certain things, it's human nature.

00:27:43.000 But when you can't actually question things of substance, when the goalposts continuously move, I figured I would go down to the campus and actually draw attention to this.

00:27:52.000 So, let's see where the goalposts move the next time, essentially.

00:27:55.000 That's my goal is to see, okay, what are we actually going to talk about that has substance?

00:28:00.000 Why don't We watch the preliminary hearing, see the evidence come out.

00:28:04.000 I'm out here every single day reporting on what's going on, both inside and outside the courtroom.

00:28:09.000 All of these people online, they are not here, and they're not here for a reason.

00:28:12.000 And the only clips that they're actually using are clips completely taken out of context.

00:28:17.000 That's what I've noticed.

00:28:18.000 Yep, I totally agree.

00:28:19.000 So, because you're there, Taylor, and thank you for doing that, that was really interesting.

00:28:24.000 And it does show that you guys are probably a little bit taller than him, but it shows that you basically are what we would have expected.

00:28:34.000 That based on where your shoulder lines up to his, etc., plus he's also hunched over with the gun potentially, you know, down one or two legs.

00:28:42.000 We're not sure how exactly that was.

00:28:43.000 I'm significantly wider as well.

00:28:45.000 That's another big factor.

00:28:46.000 Yeah, totally.

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00:30:44.000 All right.

00:30:46.000 So here's another thing.

00:30:48.000 Because you're actually there on the ground covering this, I saw this.

00:30:52.000 You know, there's this, there's this, I forget her, Elizabeth Lane or something.

00:30:57.000 There's this whole crew of these people that are devoted.

00:31:01.000 They have a cult like devotion to these conspiracy theories.

00:31:04.000 And they were spotted out there.

00:31:07.000 You can show this.

00:31:07.000 This is from Tammy McDonald17 on social media.

00:31:11.000 It says, Candace's favorite Russian spy is at the Tyler Robinson preliminary hearing today.

00:31:16.000 Her words, not mine.

00:31:17.000 Of course, she didn't wait in line.

00:31:19.000 One of her cronies held a spot since 2 30 this morning.

00:31:22.000 Okay, that's interesting.

00:31:25.000 And then we have some videos of you can, I guess, throw the B roll.

00:31:32.000 They're literally posting images of them camping out, very happy, jolly, happy go lucky, which is weird, actually.

00:31:45.000 This is a murder trial, and they're very excited to be waiting in line.

00:31:48.000 What are you seeing when it comes to this?

00:31:50.000 Did you see these people?

00:31:52.000 What's the scene like outside of the courthouse?

00:31:55.000 I'd say it's about 95% press, given the national attention that this trial has drawn.

00:31:59.000 But you do have people that are camping out.

00:32:01.000 And I did actually see these people today.

00:32:03.000 I did not interact with them, but I interacted with another group of people yesterday that I had gotten a tip from.

00:32:08.000 And it was a left wing journalist that actually tipped me off to it.

00:32:11.000 They were wearing freedom shirts, believe it or not.

00:32:14.000 And I guess they are pro Tyler Robinson, essentially.

00:32:17.000 And I attempted to interview them.

00:32:18.000 They almost immediately clocked me as contracting with Front Lines.

00:32:21.000 They had seen my work in the past, and they were not willing to speak on the issue.

00:32:25.000 And of course, I told them, you know, I'll be polite.

00:32:27.000 I just want to know your authority.

00:32:29.000 Opinion.

00:32:30.000 Why are you here?

00:32:30.000 Why are you sitting in attendance?

00:32:32.000 What interest does it have to you?

00:32:34.000 And they weren't willing to talk to me.

00:32:36.000 So every single day, at least so far, you do have people that are basically coming in here getting access to the preliminary hearings that are pro Tyler Robbins.

00:32:45.000 Yeah.

00:32:45.000 And they are actually getting access, right, Taylor?

00:32:48.000 Yes.

00:32:49.000 Yeah.

00:32:50.000 They're camping out.

00:32:51.000 These people are staying overnight in a lot of cases.

00:32:53.000 So they're the very first to actually get access.

00:32:56.000 And there's only a limited amount of spots.

00:32:58.000 So they're essentially taking up the places of people.

00:33:01.000 I mean, there's, Children out here, there were people that attended UVU that witnessed it firsthand that actually wanted to get in today that weren't able to get in.

00:33:09.000 Well, it doesn't surprise me because you know it's a cult, you know, those are the people that are going to have this cultish devotion to this, I think, misplaced moralizing about this, right?

00:33:24.000 Wearing the freedom shirts, yeah, they're part of a whole contingent online that wants to rip down Charlie's organization, attack his widow and his family, but they see themselves as the defenders.

00:33:35.000 Uh, of the of Charlie's legacy, which you know, I think that's Erica's job personally, but that's but that's fine.

00:33:43.000 Anything else you want to bring up, Taylor, that you want our audience to be aware of that's happening around the courthouse or what you're witnessing?

00:33:50.000 Yeah, I mean, just uh, I would say get your information from the actual preliminary hearing, it's live streamed for a reason.

00:33:56.000 Watch it all if you have time, don't just go on social media, you know, because all these clips are being taken out of context.

00:34:02.000 Um, you know, obviously, Lance Twiggs was a very big focal point today, yesterday, it was DNA evidence.

00:34:07.000 So, every single day we're seeing new developments and it's always being taken out of context.

00:34:12.000 So, if you actually want to understand what's taking place during this preliminary hearing, you need to just watch the thing.

00:34:18.000 However, slow it goes.

00:34:19.000 Yeah.

00:34:19.000 And it's very slow.

00:34:20.000 Exactly.

00:34:21.000 It's very slow.

00:34:23.000 Taylor, thank you so much for your reporting.

00:34:25.000 Appreciate you making some time for us tonight.

00:34:27.000 Great job, man.

00:34:28.000 Of course.

00:34:28.000 Thanks for having me.

00:34:29.000 I do want to show this clip.

00:34:32.000 And we have it loaded as 72.

00:34:35.000 It's the rifle disassembled and put in both pant legs.

00:34:39.000 This is a really interesting visual.

00:34:41.000 Because it shows how easy and how quick it is to disassemble a rifle and also how you could store it in your pant legs.

00:34:49.000 SOT 72.

00:34:51.000 Assuming that since this was the longest piece and then it was causing so much hiccup in his giddy up, that this is probably maybe what was sitting on his right leg.

00:35:01.000 So, because when you do see him walking, he's kind of this arm is not moving right now.

00:35:14.000 As it sits, the muzzle of the rifle is just below my knee.

00:35:20.000 We saw him moving with no hip movement, but he was still able to move his knee.

00:35:25.000 I can still bend my knee.

00:35:27.000 The stock is significantly thicker than the barrel and the receiver action, especially back here at the butt.

00:35:35.000 This is going to be a little trickier.

00:35:39.000 I wonder if it can go in this side and under the arm.

00:35:44.000 Let me pull it back up under me.

00:35:49.000 Okay, what that looks like from the front, is there any indication that you got that?

00:36:00.000 How's my movement?

00:36:02.000 I'm moving.

00:36:03.000 I don't know how I move.

00:36:04.000 I think that may be part of the limp, he was trying to move without printing the rifle.

00:36:11.000 Let's see how it was, because in that one, a couple of shots, he's got his arms out.

00:36:17.000 He's walking up the stairs.

00:36:24.000 It's not out of the realm of possibility that you can walk.

00:36:29.000 All right, I just wanted to show that as another example.

00:36:31.000 There's a series of these guys.

00:36:33.000 They tend to be, you know, gun aficionados and really into that space, and they're breaking down how that limp could happen, how you could assemble a rifle on a rooftop.

00:36:43.000 And I just think it's really, really interesting and I think really helpful to understand what probably happened.

00:36:51.000 Hi, folks.

00:36:52.000 Andrew Colvett here.

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00:37:50.000 We have Viva Fry on the show.

00:37:53.000 I always want to say Viva Frey because of the spelling, but he is a former litigator.

00:37:57.000 He's a YouTuber, rumbler, he's a content creator.

00:38:00.000 He's a Canadian, but now he's an American. 0.54

00:38:02.000 That's rough. 0.89

00:38:03.000 No, He's fully reformed.

00:38:06.000 He's changed.

00:38:06.000 All right.

00:38:07.000 Viva, welcome back, my friend.

00:38:09.000 We believe in personal growth.

00:38:12.000 Not fully reformed yet, but God willing, I'll take care of it.

00:38:15.000 Okay, you're in process.

00:38:16.000 You're in process.

00:38:18.000 Okay, so, Viva, you are always a guy that, and I actually love this because I believe, hey, Tyler Robinson is innocent until proven guilty.

00:38:26.000 I believe that is sacrosanct in our system.

00:38:29.000 I believe the evidence is very compelling.

00:38:32.000 But I believe he's innocent until proven guilty.

00:38:34.000 And you are a guy with nuanced takes.

00:38:36.000 You're a guy that kind of sees both sides.

00:38:40.000 You're willing to hear out the more conspiratorial end.

00:38:43.000 And you're also willing to hear out the people that are like, hey, it's pretty obvious.

00:38:48.000 From that vantage point, what are you seeing?

00:38:51.000 How is this going so far?

00:38:52.000 Well, from that vantage point, I will now be on the.

00:38:55.000 I'm in on it because I'm with TPUSA and Andrew Colvay.

00:38:59.000 Like, this is how lunatic the internet has become.

00:39:04.000 How do I see it going right now?

00:39:06.000 I happen to think there's substantial prima facie evidence to indicate Tyler Robinson was on the roof, pulled the trigger, was identified by his mother, et cetera, et cetera.

00:39:17.000 We're living in a world now, by the way.

00:39:19.000 I'm not in a Steam sauna.

00:39:20.000 This is just a backdrop.

00:39:22.000 We're living in a world now, however.

00:39:23.000 That's where people have gotten.

00:39:25.000 No, no, no.

00:39:25.000 People are like, hey, Viva, don't do vlogs from the Steam sauna anymore.

00:39:29.000 But we're living in a world where people have sort of gotten back into the realm of the Alex Jones InfoWars Sandy Hook level psychotic conspiracy everywhere, where now people are saying, all right, I believe everything we're being told is a lie.

00:39:44.000 So I'm going to not believe anything except for that which I've convinced myself of already.

00:39:50.000 I don't know if Tyler Robinson pulled the trigger.

00:39:52.000 I don't know if he was on the roof and he was the one who fired the gun.

00:39:56.000 I know what the preliminary evidence looks like right now.

00:39:59.000 And I know it's being adduced at the preliminary hearing.

00:40:02.000 But the insane conspiracy theories that are being floated that are implicating everyone and anyone involved that are unsubstantiated and unfalsifiable in their vagueness.

00:40:14.000 I mean, I'm seeing Sandy Hook 2.0 recurring right now.

00:40:19.000 I appreciate there are some.

00:40:21.000 Issues with the prosecution, there's some issues with the investigation, and there's some issues with the evidence.

00:40:26.000 I go, I can find, I can appreciate that. 0.61

00:40:28.000 But to go from there to say that it's exploding microphones, Israel did it, and not that Israel might not, Israel might have had a hand in this.

00:40:38.000 But until you can provide the slightest shred of evidence other than I can divine an intention or a motive, you have to admit that from the evidence that you have right now, if you have a more plausible theory than the one being presented, which is Tyler Robinson was on the roof, took the shot, had the rifle, had the moment, had the opportunity.

00:40:55.000 If you have a more plausible theory to present, you can go ahead and present it, but you don't get to manufacture facts out of whole cloth.

00:41:03.000 You don't get to misrepresent what is being adduced at this preliminary hearing in terms of the DNA evidence.

00:41:10.000 Whether you believe in DNA evidence or not, don't misrepresent which percentage it's favoring.

00:41:15.000 Whether or not you believe that Tyler Robinson was not able to have the rifle in his legs, if you misrepresent that he was shifting his limp from the right leg to the left leg without contemplating the idea that it might have been a reverse image mirror of the video, You don't get to make up facts.

00:41:30.000 You don't get to misrepresent law.

00:41:31.000 You don't get to say he's innocent because they haven't proven beyond a reasonable doubt that he's guilty at a preliminary hearing, which itself is probable cause.

00:41:42.000 I mean, we're in a realm now where it's, I guess, in a way, it's the ultimate flattery to Charlie Kirk, which is the loss is so great, the loss is so monumental that people have to come up with concoctions to try to make sense of what is a senseless crime.

00:41:57.000 But preliminary hearing is going the way it's going.

00:42:00.000 The evidence indicates.

00:42:02.000 On probable cause, that Tyler Robinson should go to trial.

00:42:05.000 If people think that the video evidence is not clear cut, not sufficiently clear that his own mother identified him, you can raise reasonable doubt at the trial.

00:42:14.000 Right now, it's preliminary hearing, probable cause, a lower threshold.

00:42:18.000 And people don't get to make up facts and misrepresent things to promote their insane conspiracy theories that are not tethered to reality.

00:42:27.000 Well, you know, it's funny because I've heard, I thought that was really well said, Viva, because, you know, One of my frustrations in all of this is that because there have been so many allegations heaped on the org, heaped on Erica, heaped on myself, or whoever, Ben Shapiro now is in the attention.

00:42:48.000 So here's what's interesting, though.

00:42:51.000 I have questions.

00:42:52.000 I do have questions.

00:42:53.000 I want to know was Lance Twiggs actually a co conspirator?

00:42:57.000 When I hear there's only six police officers at campus, that's frustrating to hear, like in a really deep, profound way.

00:43:03.000 I want to know was he radicalized by somebody?

00:43:06.000 I want to know about Armed Queers SLC.

00:43:08.000 I want to know was there money involved?

00:43:09.000 I want to know who knew what when.

00:43:11.000 I have lots of questions.

00:43:13.000 But what we're dealing with here and now is whether or not Tyler Robinson was the guy who pulled the trigger.

00:43:19.000 Okay.

00:43:20.000 And can you get proved probable cause to take this to a full trial?

00:43:23.000 Okay.

00:43:24.000 I want to show these two images back to back to back because this was actually something that happened today.

00:43:30.000 We got to see the video of Tyler Robinson in the holding room after he turned himself in.

00:43:35.000 Okay.

00:43:36.000 That's him.

00:43:38.000 That's him from that video.

00:43:40.000 Okay.

00:43:40.000 Now go to the still from the parking garage.

00:43:44.000 The day before, similar shirt, similar hat, and I was, I think, from testimony that he was wearing Converse shoes when he turned himself in.

00:43:53.000 And I believe that's what was described in this image as well.

00:43:55.000 So go back to that other one.

00:43:58.000 And by the way, you see a profile shot of him in another time.

00:44:00.000 I just like this one because the shirt is clear.

00:44:02.000 And go back now to the parking garage.

00:44:05.000 Go back and forth.

00:44:06.000 Viva, I'm told there's no evidence that that's him.

00:44:09.000 I'm looking at that going, that looks like him.

00:44:12.000 And I guess the newest, the newest.

00:44:15.000 Uh, theory is that this person in body double is a body double, body double.

00:44:19.000 There, we can never see even though it was with a family friend and it was with his parents.

00:44:25.000 Yeah, no, appreciate that.

00:44:28.000 Like, okay, fine, you say it's a body double, then try to raise that as reasonable doubt.

00:44:32.000 Right now, we're at probable cause as to whether or not he committed the crime for which he should stand trial.

00:44:38.000 And I appreciate people saying the video or the images of him in a black shirt and the different clothing doesn't look like him.

00:44:44.000 Okay, fine.

00:44:46.000 You can raise those arguments right now.

00:44:48.000 You're at probable cause for the aggregate of the evidence.

00:44:52.000 His DNA is on the gun, not the gun, sorry.

00:44:55.000 His DNA is on the screwdriver and the towel.

00:44:59.000 And he was on campus.

00:45:00.000 He was not a student on campus.

00:45:02.000 His own mother called him in.

00:45:05.000 This is the probable cause stage of it.

00:45:07.000 If you want to argue it's a body double, it's not him, they don't match up.

00:45:11.000 He's got a limp switching from one leg to the other, you'll do that at trial.

00:45:14.000 And it's not to say he's got to prove his innocence.

00:45:16.000 It's that.

00:45:17.000 Probable cause versus proof beyond a reasonable doubt are two different thresholds at two different stages of the proceedings, and people need to understand that.

00:45:25.000 The bottom line he was arrested, detained in the clothing that he appears to be wearing the day before on campus.

00:45:32.000 That's probable cause on its face, set aside the DNA, set aside the text messages, which people can tear apart on trial.

00:45:41.000 But this is the insanity that the I'm calling it psychotic delusional insanity that Ben Shapiro, the news of the day.

00:45:49.000 He admitted on his show, he got a call from his security, got a call from Charlie Kirk's security right after the shooting, saying, you know, an update of sorts on the shooting.

00:45:59.000 And people are like, that's crazy.

00:46:02.000 They deduce from that that he was somehow in on it, that Mossad, because his security are former Mossad, that that's how they would coordinate between the two of them to confirm that the takeout by Mossad has been established.

00:46:15.000 I mean, it's so insane that you would go with that outlandish theory.

00:46:19.000 As opposed to these are prominent conservatives, and at the time after the shooting, my understanding is you know, people were fearful that this might have been a coordinated attack targeting other prominent conservatives, Candace included, by the way, by her own statements.

00:46:32.000 And that they jumped to the his agent, his security are former Mossad agents, and so they are calling to give him an update on the confirmation of the Mossad assassination hit on Charlie Kirk.

00:46:43.000 I mean, you're dealing with people positing theories that really can never be falsified and that don't even make sense on the simplest, most reasonable interpretation of things.

00:46:53.000 So My interpretation is that more likely than not, Ben Shapiro got a call and said, Charlie Kirk's been assassinated.

00:47:01.000 I think people knew he was dead well in advance.

00:47:05.000 Watch your back, Tucker Carlson.

00:47:07.000 Watch your back.

00:47:07.000 We don't know if this is isolated, the shooter's still on the loose.

00:47:10.000 But this is the delusion of conspiracy theory that people are entertaining right now.

00:47:15.000 When it comes to the actual evidence, yes, they now have evidence.

00:47:19.000 He was detained in the clothes that he was appeared in on the campus the day before.

00:47:24.000 Maybe he's got a good defense.

00:47:26.000 Maybe someone else was wearing the exact same stuff.

00:47:29.000 It'll get to the beyond a reasonable doubt at the trial on the merits.

00:47:32.000 Right now, it's probable cause and whether or not, more likely than not, a crime has been committed for which this individual, whoever he may be, should stand trial.

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00:49:23.000 I mean, I genuinely think you could not merely get probable cause.

00:49:27.000 You could probably actually get a conviction on the standalone element of any really of the four things, if you want to say the four legs of the stool here, which is the video footage of his car and him on the campus where he is at the time of the shooting, from the DNA evidence that we have on the towel and on the screwdriver, and possibly on the gun eventually it will turn out, which again we can trace back to him, from the text messages and from his interactions with his parents and turning himself in.

00:49:55.000 I think.

00:49:55.000 Any one of those legs of that stool would be enough to clear probable cause and probably get a conviction.

00:50:02.000 And instead, we have all four of those things.

00:50:04.000 And I think it's fascinating at that point to highlight the constant objection, objection, objection from the defense.

00:50:11.000 We saw this first with the compilation video, which was a huge bombshell.

00:50:15.000 I mean, that video alone, that compilation tracing his steps on campus the four times he visited, according to the state, was a really big revelation.

00:50:26.000 Social media was, I mean, on fire about it yesterday.

00:50:30.000 This is the second time that they seem to have been fighting tooth and nail to block at least certain parts of this Twigs video recording interview, right?

00:50:39.000 So I can only imagine that it's going to be the next big explosive piece of it.

00:50:45.000 It seems like the judge is going to be redacting a number of pages from the 22 page kind of transcript of it, which means we're going to lose big chunks of it, which the family representative for the Kirk family said, We want it all published.

00:50:59.000 If you're going to admit it as evidence, we want it all published.

00:51:01.000 And then the judge says, Hey, just to call my shot here.

00:51:04.000 Most of the stuff we're redacting is just the text messages, which have already been sort of publicized in the charging document.

00:51:11.000 Yeah.

00:51:11.000 No, true.

00:51:12.000 But yeah, but the judge said he's going to consider it.

00:51:14.000 It's just a question of not really not publishing it to the public.

00:51:17.000 So it's not that it's not going to be factored into the judge's decision.

00:51:20.000 He's going to determine relevance.

00:51:21.000 So he'll consider it.

00:51:22.000 But again, at this stage, come trial time, everything's going to be different.

00:51:27.000 It's going to sort of start from scratch.

00:51:29.000 But just to get to the issue that like you can convict him on any one of the four things, you know, No, the text messages, the provenance, the authenticity needs to be proven.

00:51:39.000 His DNA, that's a double edged sword just to not get into the conspiratorial ground.

00:51:45.000 If there's 89 and 95% DNA of Tyler Robinson, there's 5 and 11% of somebody else.

00:51:52.000 Is a 5 and 11% of it being someone else reasonable doubt?

00:51:56.000 You couple that with all of the other circumstantial evidence, and it'll be a separate issue to prove at trial.

00:52:02.000 So I don't think you get there on the preliminary hearing, even based on what's been adduced.

00:52:06.000 But what do you do get here?

00:52:08.000 And this is where people accuse me of buying into the Fed narrative and they call me, you know, gobbler of the Fed slob.

00:52:14.000 I sincerely and genuinely believe other people were involved.

00:52:18.000 And right now we're getting confirmation of it.

00:52:20.000 Tyler, sorry, Twiggs was more involved than we ever thought if his DNA is on not just the towel, a towel is easier to understand DNA on the screwdriver.

00:52:31.000 You know, Lance Twiggs knew that Tyler Robinson was engraving whatever fascist, you know, thing he was engraving on bullets.

00:52:38.000 So you're dealing with people who.

00:52:40.000 We were aware of a plot in advance.

00:52:43.000 Couple that with the actual evidence or Viva.

00:52:45.000 Hold on.

00:52:46.000 On that note, you can't deduce that yet that Twiggs knew about the plot.

00:52:51.000 I have stated multiple times from this chair that if we do find out that he was engaged as a co conspirator or had advance notice that this was going to happen and they tried to cover the tracks with these text messages, I want the guy held accountable to the max extent of the law.

00:53:06.000 Don't get me wrong.

00:53:08.000 But you can't deduce that from the fact, I mean, they were gay lovers in.

00:53:12.000 Living in the same house.

00:53:14.000 They could have shared towels.

00:53:15.000 They could have shared even screwdrivers.

00:53:17.000 It might have just been Lance's screwdriver.

00:53:20.000 I'm just saying, I don't think you could deduce that he was complicit or a co conspirator just from the movie.

00:53:28.000 Well, complicit, when he's texting his lover, remember when I was engraving the bullet casings?

00:53:34.000 I mean, that's not something that you witness your lover doing.

00:53:36.000 You don't ask second questions about it.

00:53:39.000 I mean, that's something an Antifa person would do, I would say.

00:53:42.000 You know, he could have just been, I mean, Listen, I agree. 0.92

00:53:45.000 Like, I've never engraved a bullet with, you know, screw communists or something like that.

00:53:49.000 But, like, they, if you, I don't know if you've seen the Turkey Tom video.

00:53:55.000 If not, I actually put it on X today.

00:53:58.000 I really encourage you to see it because it's a whistleblower friend that reached out to this YouTuber.

00:54:05.000 And it's, I think it's got like almost close to 2 million views on this thing.

00:54:08.000 He published it all the way back in like, what, October or November?

00:54:11.000 It was about, it was October.

00:54:13.000 And it is an inside look into this world that's, That these kids were living in.

00:54:17.000 I actually was talking to a reporter that's on the ground reporting there.

00:54:21.000 He gave me a call today and he watched it last night and he was like, Whoa.

00:54:24.000 Like, it is.

00:54:27.000 And I think the word he used was like, Now you can see really clearly how you could, the moral disassociation and just disassociating from reality that this world they were living in.

00:54:39.000 Lance Twiggs was super manic.

00:54:41.000 He was prone to these huge emotional shifts and waves.

00:54:46.000 And, you know, Robinson was comforting him according to this friend, right?

00:54:51.000 And I have every reason to believe that that video is credible.

00:54:53.000 I've been told it's credible.

00:54:55.000 So it's like you could see why this world was completely bizarre and weird.

00:55:01.000 And it doesn't necessarily lead me to believe that Twiggs knew anything was about to happen.

00:55:06.000 Well, no, if the Turkey Town video was the one describing a prior incident where two lovers, you know, got themselves basically to get psychotically enveloped in a murder conspiracy, I'm not sure if it's that video you're talking about.

00:55:19.000 No, it's a friend that is describing the world that they were living in.

00:55:23.000 It's, you know, Lance Twiggs would nest.

00:55:25.000 He would get really depressed and he wouldn't get off the floor out of the living room and he would just sort of slowly gather like a hoarder, all these objects around him.

00:55:32.000 Lots of drug use.

00:55:34.000 Was it black market, HRT?

00:55:37.000 Lots of drinking, lots of vaping.

00:55:42.000 We might be describing sort of the same thing.

00:55:44.000 When I say that Lance Twiggs had.

00:55:47.000 I see what you did there.

00:55:48.000 I see what you did there, Vivas.

00:55:50.000 No, because you're describing a world of abject insanity, which I have no doubt is this.

00:55:56.000 But the bottom line, when people are posting online in advance, something big is going to happen at the University of Utah.

00:56:05.000 Wouldn't it be great if Charlie gets shot?

00:56:08.000 That leads me to believe that.

00:56:10.000 You know, above and beyond Lance Twiggs being somehow, if not involved, at least aware of other people were as well.

00:56:16.000 And when I say like, I don't buy the, you know, buy anything, I question everything.

00:56:22.000 And I don't take for granted that Tyler acted alone and was the only one, I don't believe he was.

00:56:27.000 And whether or not, if it's not, go for it.

00:56:29.000 Viva, you just made me think of something.

00:56:32.000 I want to play this clip again, which is interesting.

00:56:35.000 I didn't clock it until you just said what you said.

00:56:38.000 I posted this on X and then we just played it.

00:56:41.000 I believe it's Cut 70.

00:56:44.000 This is from that Turkey Tom video talking about which Discord server he confessed in, because apparently he was active in two.

00:56:53.000 This isn't, I don't know if there's anything here, but play cut 70.

00:56:56.000 Confession message to their old friend group server.

00:56:59.000 It's interesting to me that he sent it in this server and not to Lance's new server, because I'm not sure why that is.

00:57:05.000 It could just be that he was less familiar with the people there, but based on the kind of messages sent there, which we're going to go over later, it could be that he wanted to avoid having anyone say something that resembled support for his actions.

00:57:17.000 In the original.

00:57:18.000 So that's where he's confessing, right?

00:57:21.000 And that's the time code 9 57 Eastern, which would have been 7 57.

00:57:27.000 He turned himself in around nine o'clock, so about an hour later.

00:57:32.000 It's interesting because there are two different Discord servers he was involved in.

00:57:38.000 Two that we know of.

00:57:39.000 Right, right, right.

00:57:41.000 Not to get too conspiratorial, but when we're told that Thomas Crooks was not involved in any social media activity, and then, you know, you get.

00:57:48.000 Reports coming out that he had multiple social media footprints.

00:57:52.000 Do I believe that Tyler Robinson was only involved in two Discord chats?

00:57:58.000 No, I don't.

00:57:59.000 And I'd love to know each and every individual who was on them, if they've been investigated, how people knew allegedly, apparently in advance, something was going to happen, how he's confessing to his boyfriend about remember when I was engraving those bullets.

00:58:12.000 And then he goes to the Discord servers to confess to what he did, where on the Discord servers, even according to the official narrative, they're already talking about having noticed what happened to Charlie Kirk.

00:58:22.000 I don't believe that there were only two Discord servers.

00:58:25.000 I don't believe that there was nobody of relevance on any of those Discord servers.

00:58:29.000 I don't believe that George Zinn, that old pervert who was subsequently arrested for and pleaded guilty to child sex abuse material on his cell phone after he admitted or purported to admit that he was there as a distraction to the shooter to allow him to get away, was there by accident.

00:58:44.000 So, all that said, do I believe that it was an exploding microphone that Mossad planted because they used Pages to kill some terrorists in Gaza and the West Bank? 0.74

00:58:53.000 No, because there's no evidence to suggest that.

00:58:55.000 At this point in time, do I refuse to ever believe it possibly in the future?

00:58:59.000 No, but there needs to be evidence to support certain things.

00:59:02.000 Well, that's exactly right.

00:59:03.000 That's what you said is key.

00:59:05.000 I mean, my mind is completely open to all of it.

00:59:09.000 Listen, I want to know the truth.

00:59:11.000 I totally have lots of questions.

00:59:14.000 When it comes to, first of all, you said exactly right, Viva.

00:59:18.000 Is there evidence?

00:59:20.000 Do you have actual proof?

00:59:21.000 Or is it just vibes and like gut feeling?

00:59:24.000 Okay.

00:59:24.000 That's not how you convict people.

00:59:26.000 That's not how you do this in our process.

00:59:28.000 Thank God, by the way.

00:59:30.000 And secondly, If that stuff comes out in the future, it's not like I'm going to fight it.

00:59:35.000 I think there's this perception among some online that, like, we're like, ah, don't ask questions.

00:59:38.000 Like, no, I want to know the truth on all this stuff.

00:59:43.000 But what I'm looking at, the evidence that has been presented at court in this preliminary hearing to, as you said, reach the burden of probable cause is extraordinarily compelling.

00:59:54.000 You know, and I just, I think there's some people that won't believe their lying eyes, you know?

00:59:58.000 Well, there are people who still insist nobody was killed at Sandy Hook.

01:00:03.000 There are people who insist that the destruction, tearing down and raising of the building at Sandy Hook, was an indication that no one was killed there.

01:00:11.000 Do I think it was suspicious?

01:00:13.000 Yes, because I think the Sandy Hook school was destroyed to cover up some of the corruption of the school, that they didn't actually invest the monies that they were given for the purposes of gun safety.

01:00:25.000 Do I think it's weird that they raised, leveled, and dug up the dirt of the crime scene here?

01:00:30.000 I can appreciate the official narrative, which is that the University of Utah wanted to.

01:00:36.000 Clean up a traumatic crime scene so they could get back to university activity as normal.

01:00:42.000 If I believe, and I might very well, that there might have been people at the university that were involved in not securing the roof, telling TPUSA that the roof was secure, that they don't need their own drones, and might they want to destroy and cover up and bury their own crime scene, I could believe that too.

01:01:00.000 But again, theories, beliefs, and that for which you have the slightest shred of evidence are three different things.

01:01:07.000 And I'm able to understand and distinguish between what I believe.

01:01:10.000 What I can prove and what I can reasonably argue.

01:01:12.000 And for the time being, if there's a better theory than Tyler Robinson having taken the shot, I appreciate all the holes everybody wants to poke.

01:01:19.000 They'll do that at trial.

01:01:20.000 That's what good lawyers do.

01:01:21.000 He didn't have enough time to assemble the gun.

01:01:23.000 He couldn't have been running around with it in his legs.

01:01:25.000 It's not him in the black shirt versus the maroon shirt.

01:01:29.000 They'll raise that at trial.

01:01:30.000 But until there's a better theory, and until there's the slightest shred of evidence to support exploding mic theories, a second gunman theory, a trapdoor theory, until there's the slightest shred of evidence to support that, You can float unsubstantiated and thus unfalsifiable conspiracy theories. 0.99

01:01:48.000 It makes you look like an idiot and untrustworthy. 0.96

01:01:52.000 But the bottom line right now, in the ordinary course of criminal prosecution, preliminary hearing, probable cause. 1.00

01:02:00.000 Here's Tyler Robinson.

01:02:01.000 Here are some images.

01:02:02.000 Sufficiently clear that his own mother identified him, the rifle identified by his father, fragments determined to be a bullet, not an exploding microphone.

01:02:11.000 And if it is an exploding microphone, my goodness, the defense will be that much easier come trial time.

01:02:15.000 There you go.

01:02:16.000 And by the way, medical examiner says it was a gunshot wound to the neck.

01:02:20.000 There's no mention of an exploding mic or anything like that.

01:02:23.000 Viva, we got to go.

01:02:24.000 I'm so sorry.

01:02:24.000 We're going to do a little bit of a handoff here with Jack over to his show.

01:02:28.000 That was excellent, my friend.

01:02:29.000 Thank you so much.

01:02:30.000 Thank you very much.

01:02:31.000 Godspeed, everyone.

01:02:32.000 God bless you, man.

01:02:35.000 All right.

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01:04:07.000 And to Viva's point, it's not that we don't have questions, we just don't have evidence.

01:04:11.000 So you can have all the vibes and whatever else you want to have, but if you have no evidence and you're accusing innocent people or innocent things or innocent groups, then that's reckless.

01:04:22.000 And we don't do that.

01:04:22.000 We stick to the facts.

01:04:24.000 It's what the state has to do, that's what we try and live by.

01:04:28.000 And I think the evidence in and of itself is very compelling.

01:04:31.000 One other thought.

01:04:32.000 That I think Viva brought up is that it's this sort of compliment to Charlie.

01:04:37.000 That people, because Charlie was so important, he was so incredible and so just influential, that I think it's hard for a lot of people to think hey, maybe it's this dude.

01:04:48.000 It's not.

01:04:49.000 This 22 year old that just climbs up on a roof.

01:04:51.000 It's not satisfying to think that some weird loser who lived with his furry boyfriend and they did a bunch of drugs and lived in their furry nest, that that guy could.

01:05:05.000 Almost just change the course. 0.95

01:05:07.000 Just he could he could kill a world historical figure like Charlie because he was a wretched person who embraced violence, and that's what drives a lot of theories.

01:05:16.000 It's just like we get the stuff with Kennedy because you don't want to believe a president can be taken out that way.

01:05:21.000 Totally, totally.

01:05:22.000 We have Jack Posobic now, Human Events Daily.

01:05:25.000 He's been on the ground in the courthouse.

01:05:27.000 Jack, good to see you, man.

01:05:30.000 Give us a little color from the scene today.

01:05:34.000 Yeah, look.

01:05:35.000 You know, I'll be blunt.

01:05:36.000 I'm kind of hot about what happened in the court today.

01:05:41.000 We did not get what we were told was going to happen.

01:05:45.000 We did not get the Lance Twiggs video, which was said from the very start that that's where, in fact, the defense was the one that first stipulated it, that it was going to be coming.

01:05:55.000 We had kind of been expecting, I think, to get at least, if not the full video, but at least the audio of the recording with Lance Twiggs, which is the trans boyfriend.

01:06:08.000 The defense moved to block this, moved to redact this.

01:06:14.000 And the judge, instead of, he made one ruling and then was about to allow the audio to be played and then very quickly agreed to even more redactions.

01:06:29.000 And this, of course, happened right about, so it's around the four o'clock hour local.

01:06:35.000 And they basically said, oh, we don't have time for this now, so we're going to break early.

01:06:41.000 And it's something where I'm looking at it going, look, I want justice here, but at the same time as that, I think transparency is part of that justice.

01:06:52.000 And having full transparency means having full access to the evidence.

01:06:56.000 And this individual who was closer to Tyler Robinson than anyone in terms of leading up to the shooting, it seems to me that his evidence would be extremely relevant.

01:07:11.000 His testimony would be extremely relevant, not just this interview, but he conducted another interview in April of this year.

01:07:17.000 And the fact that we have been blocked from seeing that is, I'm just livid.

01:07:22.000 I'm livid and I'm.

01:07:25.000 I would say I'm just speechless that here we are, three days now that we've spent in this courtroom, and we're still not getting key evidence like that.

01:07:37.000 Jack, you know what's interesting?

01:07:38.000 They're taking so much time.

01:07:41.000 I mean, they're fighting tooth and nail.

01:07:43.000 First, it was on the compilation video, which was extraordinarily damning.

01:07:47.000 Then, they're fighting tooth and nail on this Lance Twiggs recorded interview, which I agree.

01:07:52.000 How is that not the most relevant thing to establishing the fact that this guy confessed, the fact that he had a motive?

01:08:00.000 And the fact that he had this, frankly, a gay lover that also contributed to the motive, and he was the closest person to him.

01:08:07.000 This seems like the most relevant piece of information.

01:08:11.000 Well, at this point, they basically said it themselves when the defense is objecting.

01:08:15.000 They basically say this evidence is going to be so strong that presenting it now will prejudice his right to a fair trial because they will blast it out to everyone.

01:08:26.000 And basically, they're saying everyone will see the evidence published in all the news outlets about how Tyler Robinson.

01:08:32.000 Confessed and is guilty.

01:08:33.000 And so you just have to save that for the trial or it will be unfair.

01:08:36.000 That's basically what the defense is arguing.

01:08:37.000 Yeah.

01:08:38.000 And just to say, Jack, I read somewhere that it's going to be $10 million, that this could cost upwards of $10 million by the end for the state of Utah to defend this Tyler Robinson because it's going to drag out so long like this.

01:08:53.000 Well, and that, you know, it's clearly.

01:08:57.000 Look, they've got a very high profile defense lawyer, Richard Novikin from Southern California.

01:09:04.000 He is.

01:09:05.000 extremely well known for his defense of clients, and he's extremely well known for this type of litigation where he's able to come into the courtroom and bring up these constitutional defenses, and you're going up against these Utah provost, Utah County attorneys, and they don't have anyone from out of town coming in who's bringing in the big guns, so to speak.

01:09:35.000 When you're looking at the case, you know, I guess I would speak to a lot of like the misinformation that I see out there as well, because where people saying, well, you know, I don't want to hear the government narrative.

01:09:46.000 I don't trust the government because, you know, Fauci and COVID, et cetera.

01:09:50.000 Sure, fine.

01:09:50.000 There's lots of reasons to not want to trust the government, believe me.

01:09:53.000 But I'm not asking to hear the government's arguments.

01:09:57.000 I don't want to hear that at all.

01:09:59.000 In fact, I want to see what the evidence is.

01:10:01.000 And then I want to hear the direct testimony of the person who knew Tyler Robinson best.

01:10:11.000 That's Lance Twiggs.

01:10:12.000 That's why they're fighting so hard to block this.

01:10:16.000 And it seems as though Twiggs was given, we're told he was given this limited immunity, use immunity in the case for his testimony, that he has been cooperative to a point at least in terms of turning over his cell phone.

01:10:28.000 So that's how we got the text messages, the Discord messages, et cetera.

01:10:33.000 And so the idea that we can't see that evidence and that the public can't see that evidence, it seems to me as flying in the face.

01:10:42.000 of the ideals of not just victim rights for Erica and Charlie's parents, who this has been an incredibly trying week for them.

01:10:54.000 There's no question having to sit there just feed away from Tyler Robinson and to go through all of this again.

01:11:00.000 And this is just the start.

01:11:01.000 This isn't even the actual trial yet.

01:11:03.000 But then to be told that you can't even have that evidence to be played in open court, it really, really creates a situation that's incredibly frustrating having sat there now for three days.

01:11:17.000 And don't get me wrong, I think we've seen a lot of evidence, but knowing that there is more evidence out there that is still being held back creates a massive frustration.

01:11:28.000 Jack Pasoba, Human Events Daily.

01:11:30.000 He's been in there, being a support to the family and reporting the facts, reporting what he's seen.

01:11:36.000 Thank you so much, Jack.

01:11:36.000 I appreciate it.

01:11:41.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to charliekirk.com.

The Charlie Kirk Show - July 09, 2026

Tyler Robinson Hearing Aftermath: Day 3

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