The Comment Section with Drew Afualo - HOW TO BE A HOT SLUT Ft. Jonathan Van Ness ｜ The Comment Section Ep. 84

00:00:00.000 My platform and my podcast is not a space to platform your rhetoric and your hate.

00:00:05.120 And that's not someone I'm going to convince because believe it or not, someone who's violently misogynistic is not going to hear me when I say that you shouldn't treat women like that because that's bad. 0.72

00:00:15.540 They're not even going to hear that very foundational, like superficial understanding of why bigotry is harmful and violent.

00:00:22.140 They're never going to listen.

00:00:23.460 They don't want to listen or learn.

00:00:24.860 They just want to speak into a bigger microphone.

00:00:30.000 Hey, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of the comment section show starring me, blah, blah, blah.

00:00:38.040 Who cares about me?

00:00:38.880 Nobody cares about me anymore.

00:00:40.220 On to the guest.

00:00:41.480 Everyone cares about you.

00:00:43.400 We have the one, the only, the iconic, the legendary Jonathan Van Ness.

00:00:49.540 Clap for myself.

00:00:50.720 Oh, my gosh.

00:00:51.360 I'll cheer for you.

00:00:52.140 Everyone cheer for JVM.

00:00:53.780 Everyone.

00:00:54.820 There we go.

00:00:56.260 Love it.

00:00:57.240 I'm so happy to have you.

00:00:58.400 Me too.

00:00:58.940 I'm ecstatic that you're here.

00:01:01.120 I am ecstatic that I'm here, too.

00:01:02.620 And also, do you need to tell everyone about the iMakeup today?

00:01:05.700 Because it is the placement, the colors.

00:01:08.420 Thank you so much.

00:01:08.920 I'm really obsessed with this part.

00:01:10.940 Oh, my God.

00:01:11.360 Thank you.

00:01:12.060 I have a hired hair and makeup artist who's far more talented than me.

00:01:15.320 And he did it for me.

00:01:16.620 We need to put his socials on so that people can know.

00:01:18.800 Oh, yeah.

00:01:19.240 Adam Lee Simmons.

00:01:20.280 Everyone follow Adam Lee Simmons.

00:01:21.240 You've got to be doing GRWMs.

00:01:22.940 I know.

00:01:24.700 He does a strip, and then he put little extra fluttery ones on his eyes.

00:01:28.700 Yes.

00:01:29.140 Period.

00:01:29.300 The eyes are really giving it to me today.

00:01:30.980 Thank you.

00:01:31.580 I have big anime eyes.

00:01:32.880 I've got a lot of real estate, so I've always got to put a lot of lashes on. 0.99

00:01:36.220 I want fucking more real estate on my eyeballs. 0.99

00:01:38.180 Do you? 1.00

00:01:38.320 Yeah.

00:01:38.480 I've got big saucers for eyes.

00:01:40.340 I have, like, limited.

00:01:42.060 It's like, you know, they've all been there for years.

00:01:43.960 Yeah.

00:01:44.120 Like, there's just not that much extra room, you know?

00:01:47.000 Yeah.

00:01:47.360 I think you have beautiful eyes.

00:01:48.220 No, I mean, thank you, too, but, like, makeup artists call them, like, hooded.

00:01:52.820 Oh.

00:01:53.280 Oh, yeah.

00:01:53.600 You do kind of have hooded eyes.

00:01:54.660 It's like, I've got to, like, paint, like, a fake crease, like, up here on my eyebrow

00:01:57.900 bone so that it, like, makes it look like I got, like, eye skin creases.

00:02:02.720 Oh.

00:02:03.480 I don't see that at all. 0.98

00:02:04.580 Because I got, like, some really good-ass fucking, like, high-up eyeshadow today. 0.97

00:02:07.960 I think it looks great. 0.99

00:02:09.200 You look stunned.

00:02:09.920 You look stunned.

00:02:10.080 You look stunned.

00:02:10.840 You know what I'm saying?

00:02:12.120 I think you look stunning.

00:02:13.480 It's like, bam!

00:02:16.120 There you go.

00:02:16.960 You know?

00:02:17.320 Period.

00:02:17.560 Period.

00:02:17.960 Give it to them.

00:02:18.900 Give it to them.

00:02:19.440 It's like...

00:02:20.320 I love it.

00:02:22.680 I'm such a huge fan of you.

00:02:23.940 I'm such a huge fan of you, queen.

00:02:25.320 I've been a fan of you for so long.

00:02:27.560 Queen.

00:02:28.260 Forever.

00:02:28.780 My mom and sister aren't here.

00:02:30.020 They normally come every time I tape.

00:02:32.960 And I'm not kidding.

00:02:34.040 My mom was devastated that she didn't get to come today.

00:02:37.680 So was my sister.

00:02:38.420 My sister's read all your books.

00:02:40.100 So they actually, like, are huge, huge fans.

00:02:42.220 So I have to shout them out because they're not here today.

00:02:44.240 Wait, what's your sister's name?

00:02:45.480 Dason.

00:02:46.160 Dason.

00:02:46.920 That's a really cool name, first of all.

00:02:48.460 And second of all, that's really, like, the weight of my heart.

00:02:50.500 I feel like I'm...

00:02:51.460 I mean, I feel like I'm always, like, kind of myself.

00:02:54.000 Yeah.

00:02:54.180 But, like, on a show, like...

00:02:55.900 It's not the full you.

00:02:56.980 Yeah.

00:02:57.360 And then, like, I feel like we're the two places where I'm, like, the most myself is, like,

00:03:01.320 in my writing and then on stage.

00:03:03.460 Oh, I love that.

00:03:03.700 Because I feel like that's where I can, like, most, like...

00:03:06.120 Encapsulate everything.

00:03:07.580 Yes.

00:03:08.000 And, like, where it can be, like, pretty much...

00:03:09.860 Obviously, I have support with my show and I have support with my, like, books.

00:03:12.740 Like, no one does anything, like, fully alone.

00:03:14.380 But, like, I feel like that's, like, where I can really, like, be the most myself.

00:03:17.620 Absolutely.

00:03:18.180 I'm actually writing a book currently.

00:03:20.580 Do you have any advice for me?

00:03:21.740 Is this your...

00:03:22.260 My very first book.

00:03:23.240 It is, right?

00:03:24.020 Yeah.

00:03:24.280 Do you have any pearls of wisdom for me?

00:03:25.940 What is it?

00:03:26.500 I have more questions.

00:03:27.780 I don't know if you can...

00:03:28.580 Yeah, yeah.

00:03:29.040 Is it fiction?

00:03:30.000 Is it nonfiction?

00:03:30.660 Is it a memoir?

00:03:31.600 It's more, like, self-help memoir.

00:03:34.060 I love.

00:03:35.040 I love that.

00:03:36.080 It's very, like, Brene Brown type vibes.

00:03:38.460 I love that so much.

00:03:40.420 And I can't...

00:03:41.020 Like, literally, I need to read it first.

00:03:42.580 If you need, like...

00:03:43.520 I cannot wait.

00:03:44.840 I'm so excited for you.

00:03:45.800 Thank you.

00:03:46.160 One thing I would say is, like...

00:03:47.560 Okay, well, like, at least for, like, over-the-top, like, when I did it the first time, it didn't

00:03:51.040 occur...

00:03:51.400 Because I was, like, talking a lot about, like, HIV in my first book.

00:03:53.840 Yeah.

00:03:54.240 And it didn't occur to me until, like, literally, like, two weeks.

00:03:58.440 Like, it was, like, the day after, like, you couldn't make any more changes, I was, like,

00:04:03.420 wait.

00:04:04.120 Like, that's, like, what my doctor told me.

00:04:06.360 But, like, I need to, like...

00:04:07.540 What's, like, the National Institute of, like, whoever? 0.99

00:04:10.240 Like, I need to really fact-check this shit. 0.99

00:04:12.800 Yeah. 0.99

00:04:13.380 And so then I was, like, it was, like, a 911 call to, like, the team. 0.99

00:04:16.020 And I was, like, wait, that shit didn't... 0.99

00:04:17.000 And they were... 0.99

00:04:17.440 And this was, like, a Friday.

00:04:18.960 And, like, it was supposed to be, like, the Thursday.

00:04:20.520 And they were, like, no, we can...

00:04:21.460 You can do it till Monday.

00:04:22.800 And then I, like, called my doctor.

00:04:24.280 I got people from, like, National Institute.

00:04:26.340 Hell, I was, like...

00:04:26.880 Oh, love.

00:04:27.060 Actually, I don't want to, like, drop that name because, like, might be wrong.

00:04:28.980 But I had major people from major places.

00:04:30.940 Yeah.

00:04:31.060 I was, like, I need to make sure that this is, like...

00:04:32.000 Confirmation.

00:04:32.660 Yes.

00:04:33.000 Like, all the way, like...

00:04:34.320 Like, this is, like, factually medically accurate into every way that we understand it in this moment

00:04:38.500 in time, correct?

00:04:39.000 Yeah.

00:04:39.560 And so just that.

00:04:40.620 Like, if you're going for, like, anything that's really definitive, like, if you're

00:04:43.260 talking about HIV transmission in there or something, I don't know if that's going to

00:04:46.060 be your self-help, like, how to not get HIV.

00:04:48.120 I don't know.

00:04:49.120 But just make sure, like, just, like, you think you have such a long time and then all

00:04:53.520 of a sudden it's, like, pub day.

00:04:55.080 No, literally.

00:04:55.620 And it, like, just, like, so fast.

00:04:56.920 That's how it feels.

00:04:57.700 Yeah.

00:04:58.020 Because I finished my manuscript, so... 0.99

00:05:00.040 Oh, this actually shit is serious. 0.99

00:05:01.580 Yeah, it's serious, girl. 0.99

00:05:02.860 No, but this other thing I'm about to say, I haven't even said it yet.

00:05:04.600 Are you ready?

00:05:05.320 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:05:05.740 Okay, this is actually scary if you ever write a book, so this is a thing.

00:05:08.320 I learned this from my lawyer.

00:05:09.980 So a publisher is going to have a legal read of your book, right? 0.99

00:05:14.800 To make sure that, like, no one can come back and sue them if you talk shit about your gym 0.98

00:05:18.340 teacher or this person or whoever. 0.98

00:05:20.260 I don't know why I said gym teacher, but whoever pissed you off, you know?

00:05:23.420 But they're looking out for themselves, the publisher.

00:05:27.120 You need to have your own personal libel lawyer who you represent or who you hire with your money,

00:05:34.000 not by the publisher.

00:05:34.660 And usually those policies cost, like, five grand.

00:05:37.120 So it's like, I mean, it's not $3.50 from the corner store, but it's a good five.

00:05:41.700 It's a good investment.

00:05:42.680 It's a great investment, yeah.

00:05:43.400 And then they will read it from, like, anybody's perspective for you, like, for your protection.

00:05:48.000 And there were a few things that he did have me...

00:05:51.540 Change.

00:05:52.220 Yes.

00:05:52.620 Oh, okay.

00:05:53.320 That's actually great advice.

00:05:54.520 I'm taking that.

00:05:54.740 Take a little bit of a description, lessen that up.

00:05:57.620 Change it a little bit.

00:05:58.440 Yes.

00:05:58.620 Oh, okay.

00:05:59.060 That's a really good point.

00:05:59.920 Because they did tell me about legal read, but that's a good point.

00:06:01.860 No, that's really...

00:06:02.300 But at Goodbye, I was all like, oh, I'm so protected. 0.99

00:06:04.040 And then my team was like, girl, they don't give a fuck about you. 0.97

00:06:06.000 They're only covering them. 0.94

00:06:06.960 And actually, if it's a little spicy in there at the end of the day, like, that could even

00:06:09.780 benefit them and, like, leave you...

00:06:10.840 So you just...

00:06:11.520 Not that all publishers are like that or anything, but you just gotta, like...

00:06:13.740 Just in case.

00:06:14.380 Yes.

00:06:14.760 A CYA.

00:06:15.440 Yes.

00:06:15.840 Every time.

00:06:16.120 So it's important.

00:06:16.920 For real, I'm taking that advice, so for sure.

00:06:18.720 No, it's important.

00:06:18.920 But not in my pocket, girl.

00:06:20.440 And then also just, like, that tour is really important.

00:06:23.040 That book, you gotta, like...

00:06:23.740 Yeah.

00:06:24.100 You already know, but, like, just, you know...

00:06:25.280 I know.

00:06:25.540 If they just...

00:06:27.040 They say jump, you say, girl, I'm gonna give you a standing double tuck. 1.00

00:06:29.920 But then when I did that the second time, I actually Miss Rona fucking fisted me to 1.00

00:06:34.080 death. 0.99

00:06:34.640 And I just literally was so fucking sick. 0.96

00:06:37.580 And then I was, like, trying to be Mariah Carey and, like, do my, like, just give you, 0.95

00:06:40.860 like, a bathtub press...

00:06:42.260 Not that you ever...

00:06:42.900 Well, yeah, it was on Crips.

00:06:44.020 Yeah.

00:06:44.260 I was just like...

00:06:44.640 I was like, let me give you, like, my, like, live from a bubble bath.

00:06:46.840 But I was like, I have a fever.

00:06:48.460 And it's like when the Queen of England was working through COVID.

00:06:50.460 And I was like, maybe I should rest.

00:06:51.520 But I was like, I've worked so hard for the last two years.

00:06:53.400 Exactly.

00:06:53.760 And my second book was so research-based.

00:06:55.840 Like, I worked my ass off on that book.

00:06:58.740 And I was just...

00:06:59.160 That's what my sister told me.

00:06:59.240 I wanted to promote it.

00:07:00.380 And I was, like, really trying to, like, show, like, my growth and stuff as, like, a writer.

00:07:03.600 Absolutely.

00:07:04.140 You know, my first book, I thought I had to, like, say honey every four words.

00:07:06.760 And, like, every time I got really, like, serious, like, I felt like I needed to, like,

00:07:11.120 lighten it up with, like, a joke or, like, soften it.

00:07:13.340 And...

00:07:13.440 I feel you.

00:07:14.040 I feel like I spent a lot of time, like, getting more comfortable with things that are uncomfortable.

00:07:18.460 Yeah.

00:07:18.960 And that, like, I don't have to...

00:07:20.000 That way the second book is, like, a different vibe.

00:07:21.500 Yeah.

00:07:21.780 I mean, it's still, like, myself.

00:07:23.440 Like, I can't resist a figure skating analogy.

00:07:25.560 But instead of, like, once every other page, it's, like, once every few chapters or something.

00:07:29.780 Like, I just get more choosy.

00:07:31.140 But it still is, like, fun.

00:07:32.540 It's still my voice.

00:07:33.300 But I just...

00:07:33.840 I wanted to be able to, like, explore how much of my voice is because I think I need to...

00:07:40.420 Because, like, in my first book, I explore, like, would you still love me if you really knew all my stuff?

00:07:44.040 Yeah.

00:07:44.740 And then in my second book, I was, like, okay, well, it seems like you do still love me.

00:07:48.140 So I'm kind of even interrogating in myself, like, how much some of that, like, honey is...

00:07:54.360 Yeah.

00:07:54.540 I wanted it to be, like, really earnest.

00:07:56.100 Yeah.

00:07:56.200 And not that it wasn't.

00:07:57.120 But I just think as we grow, we change.

00:08:00.100 And I wanted to, like, be able to explore that in my writing.

00:08:02.240 Yeah.

00:08:02.320 It's, like, a different lens.

00:08:03.520 Yeah.

00:08:03.800 So once you grow, you want to explore those different things you've learned.

00:08:07.800 Yeah.

00:08:07.840 Like, when you read it in the past, you're like, oh, I've changed a lot since then.

00:08:10.780 Yeah.

00:08:11.000 So your second book is, like, a way to explore a different, like, lens that you now have.

00:08:15.920 Exactly.

00:08:16.240 I cannot wait to read your book.

00:08:17.700 Oh, my gosh.

00:08:18.100 Thank you. 0.76

00:08:18.620 It's going to be so fucking good. 0.68

00:08:20.040 I'm going to send you it. 0.90

00:08:21.340 Like, early, can't I?

00:08:22.780 Next day.

00:08:23.180 And you got to...

00:08:23.600 I want to talk to you about it.

00:08:25.640 Okay.

00:08:26.560 I want to have you on.

00:08:27.340 We'll have you on ours.

00:08:28.260 Oh, period.

00:08:28.880 Let's do it.

00:08:29.400 Please.

00:08:29.440 I'm so excited.

00:08:30.280 Yes.

00:08:30.580 I'm so honored to have you as a guest.

00:08:32.560 You're amazing.

00:08:33.300 Can we clock the Clueless?

00:08:35.100 Are you too young for Clueless?

00:08:36.300 No, I know Clueless.

00:08:37.320 Like, barely.

00:08:38.520 I'm going to be 28.

00:08:39.380 I'm not that young.

00:08:40.100 Yeah, barely.

00:08:40.460 Exactly.

00:08:40.900 So you're like...

00:08:41.520 So there's this, like, line in Clueless when she's like, oh, my God.

00:08:44.320 Like, Miss Geist and what's-his-face, like, have their legs crossed towards each other.

00:08:47.300 It's an unequivocal sex invite.

00:08:48.660 But for people like us, it just means that we, like, love each other so much.

00:08:51.880 I love that for us.

00:08:52.500 Like, our energies are, like, leaning in here.

00:08:53.520 Look at us.

00:08:53.980 Because, like, our legs are crossed towards each other.

00:08:55.660 And then at the end, we're going to kiss.

00:08:56.980 Oh, my God.

00:08:57.180 I can't wait.

00:08:57.820 And that'll be, like, a literal second for me.

00:08:59.780 Love that.

00:09:00.500 But whenever my husband crosses his legs away from me, I'll be like...

00:09:03.740 That's actually so real because when I'm mad at my boyfriend in the car, I, like, face the other way.

00:09:08.120 No, like, if his legs are like that, I'm like...

00:09:10.360 The way I'm facing, like, the window like this because I'm pissed. 1.00

00:09:11.860 Why don't you want to fuck me yet? 1.00

00:09:12.840 Like, you know, if he's like this, I'm like, what's wrong? 1.00

00:09:16.740 You're like, so you hate me.

00:09:17.920 You better be like this. 0.75

00:09:18.740 Yeah, so you hate me. 0.81

00:09:20.040 Let's talk about it.

00:09:20.860 Yeah, that's what I do wrong.

00:09:21.740 Yeah.

00:09:22.040 So you've been busy, girl.

00:09:31.860 You've been doing so many things.

00:09:34.300 You've been in the industry for a really, really long time.

00:09:36.920 And you've, in a long time, in the sense that you've established this platform and you've explored so many different avenues, like, you know, like your book and your tour and your show and everything under the sun.

00:09:48.740 So, like, what would you say you're most excited about nowadays now that you've kind of conquered so many different, like, industries?

00:09:55.140 I don't know if I've conquered them, darling.

00:09:56.720 I would say you have.

00:09:57.700 I'll say it.

00:09:58.640 I'll say it to everyone. 0.80

00:09:59.380 I mean, I have to say, like, why I was laughing because I was like, not your journalistic prowess is fucking major and I'm obsessed with it.

00:10:06.360 But that is the first time in an interview where someone has told me, like, you've been in the industry for a long time.

00:10:10.980 And it reminds me of this time when this, like, amazing journalist from, like, Out Magazine referred to me in an interview as one of our community elders.

00:10:18.000 And I was like, I would never call you that.

00:10:20.940 I was like, it's, that's how I, I, I just, I always was that person who was, like, the youngest girl in her group of friends.

00:10:27.060 And, like, that's not the truth anymore for me.

00:10:29.980 Well, who's to say, who's to say you're not the youngest girl in this room?

00:10:32.780 You could lie.

00:10:33.420 I'll lie.

00:10:34.120 I actually think aging is such a privilege.

00:10:35.780 And I think, like, I'm not afraid of aging.

00:10:37.400 I'm not coloring my hair, honey.

00:10:38.580 I'm, like, going silver.

00:10:39.460 I'm proud of it.

00:10:40.000 I, like, I'm proud of, I want to get to be 100.

00:10:42.420 That's always been a goal for me.

00:10:43.460 So, no, I'm into it.

00:10:44.720 But I'll answer your question.

00:10:45.980 And I'm obsessed with you.

00:10:46.780 So, I'm excited about a lot of things.

00:10:49.480 Yeah.

00:10:49.720 I do think one thing in my career or my ADHD is that, like, if I don't naturally want to learn about it or, like, do the thing, it's really hard for me to do the thing.

00:11:02.120 Yeah.

00:11:02.480 Like, I didn't really like math, but, like, history, geography, biology, like, kind of biology, like, science, earth science, like, biology, like, animals.

00:11:12.340 Yeah.

00:11:12.600 Like, I am really interested in those things.

00:11:14.860 Yeah.

00:11:15.080 So, learning about things that I'm naturally interested in, hair.

00:11:18.000 Yeah.

00:11:18.200 Easy.

00:11:18.480 Like, I want to do those things.

00:11:19.880 But that kind of transposes onto my career that, like, if I don't really think it's that interesting, then I'm not really going to be doing it.

00:11:27.340 Yeah.

00:11:27.840 So, people are like, what's your favorite thing?

00:11:29.120 Or, like, what are you most excited about?

00:11:29.960 It's, like, hard for me to say because, like, I'm so fucking excited about all the stuff that I get to do.

00:11:35.260 Yeah, the only things you do are things you're excited about.

00:11:36.860 Yeah.

00:11:37.200 Yeah.

00:11:37.400 But, like, lately I do feel like the podcast has been really fire.

00:11:41.720 We've been, like, doing it.

00:11:42.640 We're kind of, like, branching out and getting Curious World right now.

00:11:45.220 Yeah.

00:11:45.620 Which, like, I've been doing my podcast for, since 2015.

00:11:49.700 I've done, like, 330-something episodes. 0.99

00:11:51.760 Holy shit. 0.99

00:11:52.420 That's crazy. 1.00

00:11:52.700 Approaching, like, 350.

00:11:53.540 I did have a little hiatus there when I, like, there was, like, a time when I went from, like, self-producing to being on a network.

00:11:59.060 And then being off a network and then being back on a network.

00:12:02.160 So, there was, like, but, yeah, like, 330-something episodes.

00:12:05.080 And it dawned on me, like, again, speaking to the ADHD, honey.

00:12:08.860 Yeah.

00:12:09.100 Like, in the last, like, five weeks, these are the episodes that we've covered on Getting Curious.

00:12:12.880 We've learned about orcas, like, just, like, Killer Whales 101.

00:12:16.520 Love.

00:12:16.680 I learned all about, like, they're called ecotypes.

00:12:19.200 But there's, like, 10 main different types of orcas.

00:12:22.260 I learned so much about them.

00:12:23.700 Love.

00:12:23.820 I've never been so, we interviewed this scientist.

00:12:27.040 Yeah. 1.00

00:12:27.320 Who, their team developed this fucking technique to sample killer whale shit. 1.00

00:12:33.640 You guys. 1.00

00:12:34.360 Everyone here. 1.00

00:12:34.780 Killer whale shit. 1.00

00:12:35.640 And they sample it. 1.00

00:12:36.420 And they can tell that it's killer whale poop because theirs looks, like, specific.

00:12:39.040 Because it's kind of this, like, milky, like, floating texture.

00:12:42.040 Interesting.

00:12:42.160 And it's, like, it's very specific to whales.

00:12:43.580 Yeah.

00:12:43.860 And they can, like, track the whale pods and they see this.

00:12:45.520 So, they are able to sample it.

00:12:46.520 And they can tell, like, health of the animal, age, sex, if they're pregnant.

00:12:50.400 Like, how they're reproducing.

00:12:51.400 It's just, like, so interesting.

00:12:52.620 Yeah.

00:12:52.940 But, so, I got deep into that, like, knowledge, but I also just, like, 101.

00:12:56.240 But then the week before that was all about sleep.

00:12:57.680 I learned all about the science of sleep.

00:12:58.940 It was, like, a Mythbusters episode of the podcast.

00:13:00.920 Because I was, like, is this true?

00:13:01.700 Is that true?

00:13:02.660 I had learned so much, like, also about, like, how, like, weed impacts sleep.

00:13:06.140 What did they say?

00:13:07.180 I'm so curious.

00:13:08.300 You guys, it's not great.

00:13:10.780 It definitely impacts the quality of our sleep.

00:13:13.520 Really?

00:13:14.120 As does alcohol.

00:13:15.420 Well, that I kind of agree.

00:13:16.000 And as does, like, sleep aids.

00:13:18.000 That's so crazy.

00:13:19.380 Wait, how does weed impact it?

00:13:20.900 Like, it makes it harder?

00:13:22.340 No.

00:13:22.620 Okay, so basically, like, the sleep cycles, it's, like, first, second, third, and then

00:13:27.140 rim cycle.

00:13:27.820 And you cycle through that several times.

00:13:29.680 Yeah.

00:13:29.920 But it goes, like, one, two, three, rim, one, two, three, rim.

00:13:32.860 Then, like, you stop doing that third, and it's, like, one, two, rim, one, two, rim.

00:13:36.320 Okay, gotcha.

00:13:37.240 Like, in that second cycle of sleep, it's really important for, like, consolidation of memory

00:13:41.420 and, like, learning new things.

00:13:42.780 Gotcha.

00:13:43.120 And there's this thing that happens in that cycle called a sleep spindle, which, like, should

00:13:46.600 happen for, like, I'm not a scientist, you guys, but I did interview a neuroscientist

00:13:50.940 who is.

00:13:51.800 In sleep studies, like, a sleep spindle should last, like, a few seconds within a minute

00:13:55.400 for the duration of that second cycle.

00:13:57.360 Okay.

00:13:57.660 So it's, like, every minute, it's, like, and it's called a sleep spindle.

00:14:00.420 Okay.

00:14:00.700 And I don't know what that means, but that's what's supposed to happen.

00:14:02.800 Yeah.

00:14:03.520 Marijuana users, their sleep spindles would last for, like, two and three and four and five

00:14:08.060 minutes.

00:14:08.680 Wow.

00:14:08.920 And, like, on the monitors, it's, like, zzzz for, like, the whole time.

00:14:11.440 So it impacts, like, consolidation, memory.

00:14:15.180 So you're just, like, not getting, like, as restive of a sleep.

00:14:18.080 Wow.

00:14:18.200 And so when you don't get that, like, that's, like, where problems can end.

00:14:21.880 But that can, you can also get that from sleep apnea.

00:14:24.360 So it's not, like, a quality sleep.

00:14:25.920 Right.

00:14:26.120 Essentially.

00:14:26.580 It's, like, it's not as, like, restorative as it, you know, needs to be or could be or

00:14:30.180 whatever.

00:14:30.580 Gotcha.

00:14:31.600 That's crazy.

00:14:32.480 Yeah.

00:14:32.740 But I partake in the devil's lettuce.

00:14:34.460 I love the devil's lettuce.

00:14:35.440 So do I.

00:14:36.180 But so I was just, like, a little, like.

00:14:37.200 That's why when you said that, I said, hold on.

00:14:38.700 I was, like, hold on.

00:14:39.680 And there's more where that came from.

00:14:40.920 For my own personal records, why is that?

00:14:42.400 No, totally.

00:14:43.200 I was, like, it's, I was, like, wow.

00:14:45.440 That's crazy.

00:14:45.880 But we get to cover, like, it's, like, orcas, sleep.

00:14:48.260 We did an episode on the paparazzi the week before that.

00:14:50.340 Oh, tea. 0.98

00:14:50.680 It was, like, parasites.

00:14:51.800 Like, I was, like, I was scared about parasites, not as much.

00:14:53.700 But it's just, like, very, like, flavorful.

00:14:55.140 There's, like, a big gambit.

00:14:56.240 But now I'm doing a beauty podcast that we're starting called Pretty Curious.

00:14:59.700 That's going to be all about, like, beauty-based things.

00:15:01.860 Just, like, I've learned so much with JVN hair.

00:15:03.960 I've always loved hair.

00:15:04.800 I've been a hairdresser since I was a teenager.

00:15:06.260 Yeah.

00:15:06.760 But, like, why am I forcing my niche interests down all of my community's throats, like, and

00:15:12.860 curiosities?

00:15:13.480 Like, why don't I give the people what they want?

00:15:15.420 Like, maybe everybody's not trying to learn about all the things that I am.

00:15:17.840 Sometimes, like, maybe people want to learn more about beauty.

00:15:19.820 And also, I am so invigorated with beauty.

00:15:22.220 Like, I'm going through such a makeup renaissance right now.

00:15:24.800 Oh, cute.

00:15:25.000 Like, I've been so into makeup.

00:15:26.480 Love.

00:15:26.660 And I love, also, I've met, like, so many incredible, like, other brand founders and

00:15:30.100 beauty experts, cosmetic chemists, hairdressers, stylists, like, through JVN hair and even,

00:15:34.780 like, prior from, like, when I was, like, just doing hair full, not just, but doing hair

00:15:38.020 full time.

00:15:38.560 Yeah.

00:15:39.000 Not just, honey, because I love that profession as well.

00:15:41.560 But, yeah.

00:15:42.120 So, like, it's, like, all beauty.

00:15:43.480 We're going to do that every other week.

00:15:44.620 And Getting Curious isn't going anywhere.

00:15:45.700 So it'll still be, like, Getting Curious every Wednesday.

00:15:47.240 It's just, like, an extension of it.

00:15:48.400 Yes.

00:15:48.720 I love that.

00:15:49.140 And it'll be out on Mondays.

00:15:50.080 And then I'm doing one about news, which is really going to center, like, queer news and really just,

00:15:53.520 like, the stories that, like, I kind of most caught my eye and, like, you know, stories that we think

00:15:58.640 should be more talked about, also covering the stories that are kind of, so that's going to be

00:16:01.620 called Curious Now.

00:16:02.580 I love that.

00:16:03.860 You're definitely too young for this, which I love saying now as a community elder.

00:16:08.200 But there was this show in the 90s called Talk Sex with Sue Johansson and also, like, early 2000s. 0.84

00:16:13.260 And she was this older woman. 0.99

00:16:14.580 She just passed away, but she did, like, she was a sex therapist or, like, a sex doctor.

00:16:18.500 She was, like, major.

00:16:19.560 I'm unqualified completely in that respect.

00:16:21.780 But I'm doing this other one that's Ask JVN, where it's, like, all, like, sex questions,

00:16:26.100 relationship questions.

00:16:27.080 Oh, cool.

00:16:27.180 It's, like, it's, like, giving, like, it's just giving, like, it's sexy times.

00:16:30.360 Gotcha.

00:16:30.780 So that one's Ask JVN.

00:16:31.980 She's very, you know, for adults, obviously, whereas other ones are probably also for adults,

00:16:35.780 but less so.

00:16:37.060 But they can be for everyone.

00:16:38.140 Yeah.

00:16:38.420 Yeah.

00:16:39.300 But those things I'm really excited about.

00:16:41.120 Yeah.

00:16:41.680 And I love all aspects of podcasting.

00:16:43.980 Like, you just get to, I mean, I've been doing it for a long time, but I'm excited to get

00:16:46.560 to, like, try my hand in, like, different ways.

00:16:48.640 So I'm getting curious and, like, learning so much, but now I get to, like, talk a little

00:16:52.240 more.

00:16:52.780 Yeah, I love that.

00:16:53.520 Which I'm excited about.

00:16:54.020 You get to expand a little bit more.

00:16:55.340 Yeah.

00:16:55.620 For those of you who don't know, Getting Curious, JVN has a podcast that's so amazing, and he

00:17:00.500 invites experts onto the podcast, and they talk about something that you don't know that

00:17:04.680 much about.

00:17:05.100 Yes.

00:17:05.560 Right.

00:17:05.980 Sometimes I know more.

00:17:07.160 Sometimes I know less.

00:17:08.040 It's just really anything I'm curious about.

00:17:09.620 Yeah.

00:17:10.020 But sometimes it's giving, like, 101 entry levels.

00:17:12.000 Sometimes it's a little more heady, depending on, like, how much I know about it, you know?

00:17:14.540 But, like, I love, like, animals, so we've covered, like, bumblebees, snakes, cats, dogs,

00:17:20.840 orcas, insects of every kind.

00:17:23.320 Yeah.

00:17:24.040 But then also, like, celebrities.

00:17:25.200 Like, I've had, like, Reese Witherspoon on.

00:17:26.580 I've had, like, I got to interview Jordan Childs, Michelle Kwan.

00:17:31.080 So just, like, athletes. 0.95

00:17:32.300 Were you shitting yourself when you talked to Michelle Kwan?

00:17:34.380 Well, luckily for that episode, I'd already become friends with her for a couple years. 0.79

00:17:37.500 Oh, that's good.

00:17:37.940 By then, I did get to meet my hero in her, and she ended up becoming my friend, and she's, like, the most cool, amazing, like, I just love her so much.

00:17:47.120 And she's actually the ambassador to Belize now.

00:17:49.440 Wow.

00:17:50.240 Okay, period.

00:17:51.420 The ambassador Kwan for life, honey.

00:17:54.700 I think, yeah, I think what you get ambassador title, like, you're ambassador Kwan forever, honey.

00:17:58.240 Oh, period.

00:17:58.740 Yeah.

00:17:59.000 So, but, yeah, but it's just, like, very, like, there's something in there for everybody.

00:18:02.820 What would you say is the most interesting thing you've learned about on your podcast?

00:18:06.860 Oh, my gosh.

00:18:07.240 Like, shockingly interesting.

00:18:08.620 Like, you're, like, I did not think that was going to be so surprising.

00:18:12.440 These are really hard-hitting.

00:18:13.700 They're, like, heavy.

00:18:14.280 They're not light.

00:18:14.780 I'm so sorry.

00:18:15.400 And I would also say this question would be so answered for anyone who watches or who listens because we have, it depends on, like, what you're interested in.

00:18:21.660 Yeah, absolutely.

00:18:22.560 Yeah.

00:18:22.640 Um, but the history of when, uh, Dobbs happened and Roe v. Wade was overturned.

00:18:29.380 We had a historian called Dr. Jackie Antonovich on who is an expert in, um, early legislation around medicine in the American West.

00:18:38.580 Oh, wow.

00:18:39.000 So, she studies, like, Dr. Quinn medicine woman vibes. 0.99

00:18:41.560 Yeah.

00:18:41.760 And some of, like, and she also is an expert in, like, the early inception of the KKK.

00:18:46.600 Oh, okay.

00:18:47.060 So, actually, that had a lot to do with medicine.

00:18:49.360 Yeah.

00:18:49.860 Believe it or not.

00:18:50.660 Mm-hmm.

00:18:51.080 And so, that episode was really interesting in learning about just, like, how far back, learning when, like, really controlling women's bodies, like, really came into play.

00:18:58.740 Yeah.

00:18:59.140 So, that was really interesting.

00:19:00.240 And also, the relationship between transphobia, or our relationship to transphobia and homophobia is actually really closely linked to the Nazis.

00:19:11.240 And I learned that from Dr. Jake Newsome.

00:19:13.380 Eugenics. 0.69

00:19:14.180 Yes.

00:19:14.640 Yeah.

00:19:14.840 And so, I learned, with that, where I was just, like, I did not even know.

00:19:19.120 Yeah. 0.99

00:19:19.420 But also, I learned that sea turtles, their throats are fucking covered. 0.98

00:19:23.120 The inside of their throats are covered in these, like, white spikes. 0.99

00:19:26.780 And also, they only have one hole. 0.99

00:19:32.040 Like, their butts and their vaginas are one. 1.00

00:19:34.900 So, then I asked this, like, literal sea turtle expert, who I think is a sea biologist, but, like, a literal doctor. 0.97

00:19:41.560 Yeah. 0.88

00:19:41.800 I was like, wait, so all turtles, all sea turtles are only into anal then. 0.98

00:19:47.880 He was not ready. 0.90

00:19:49.420 So, you never know. 0.82

00:19:50.400 Like, sometimes episodes are really funny because, like, our guests are just like, the fuck did I get my, how did my assistant let me come on this podcast? 0.98

00:19:56.840 Because a lot of times, like, our guests, like, don't know who the fuck I am. 0.98

00:19:59.680 Which is always fun. 0.79

00:20:00.500 Yeah, because they're, like, biologist, they're just, like, these really academic, like, you know, people that are, like, researching, like, really different, important, niche things.

00:20:09.980 Yeah, yeah.

00:20:11.320 That's so interesting.

00:20:12.360 That's so interesting.

00:20:42.360 You would be shocked to see how much homophobia is, like, literally a byproduct.

00:20:47.880 It's a man-made invention because of religion, which is a byproduct of colonization. 0.73

00:20:52.340 And also the fat phobia.

00:20:54.100 Exactly.

00:20:54.660 Because we also did an episode about that.

00:20:56.820 I have cut my teeth very publicly talking about food, snacks.

00:21:01.820 So, when I started hearing about, like, how, like, fat phobia is racist, I was, like, definitely wasn't, like, I never questioned that.

00:21:08.780 I was, like, how?

00:21:09.560 But I wanted to, because I was, like, I buy it, but why?

00:21:11.940 Yeah.

00:21:12.160 Like, I was, like, I buy it, but why?

00:21:13.120 I just want to understand why.

00:21:13.840 Exactly.

00:21:14.160 And prior to the invention of eugenics, when, like, European explorers first went to Africa, they were, like, these people are gorgeous and stunning and, like, their features and this and that.

00:21:25.140 And it was, like, you know, beautiful and, like, interest.

00:21:27.240 Because then after the invention of eugenics, they were, like, we have to save all these people because they are not Christian and they're actually evolving to become not civilized. 1.00

00:21:35.620 And so we got to make sure that we're all, you know, evolving because they took Darwin and evolution, which, like, you know, Charles Darwin, his first cousin. 0.96

00:21:43.540 This is actually one of the fucking craziest things. 0.93

00:21:45.140 Now that I know that you're fucking hip, so I can tell you about it. 0.99

00:21:47.680 Didn't know this until you say walking in my field. 0.98

00:21:49.720 But, so, Charles Darwin, first cousin, Francis Galton, inventor of eugenics.

00:22:01.240 So he literally just took, like, he just took, like, evolution and survival of the fittest and all that and just, like, and, like, racialized it.

00:22:10.460 Yeah.

00:22:10.960 And then people took it on as, like, scientific fact.

00:22:13.980 Yeah.

00:22:14.500 And so that was a lot of stuff, you know.

00:22:16.340 I don't know if this is, like, very too political for you guys and you can, like, cut me off.

00:22:19.300 But I can talk about this all day and I'm really into it.

00:22:20.680 No, you're totally fine.

00:22:21.360 Okay, great. 0.99

00:22:21.720 So, you know, DeSantis and people, like, on that fucking Republican debate just, like, last night. 0.99

00:22:27.180 I kept seeing all these clips. 0.98

00:22:27.940 It's like, you know, we got to get back to the basics of talking about, like, American civics and, like, American history. 0.98

00:22:32.540 And it's, like, what I just said is fucking American history. 0.96

00:22:35.940 Do they want to really talk about American history? 0.99

00:22:37.280 Exactly.

00:22:37.840 And we don't really want to talk about American history.

00:22:40.700 And I think that that is actually what makes America so cool is that we can have the chance to learn.

00:22:47.560 Yeah.

00:22:47.800 And not have our books banned and not have our information censored.

00:22:51.700 Well, and also, like, just because it's not something that you're familiar with doesn't mean that it's wrong.

00:22:56.520 Doesn't mean that it's never existed.

00:22:58.240 Like, this whole rhetoric of, oh, everyone's trans or non-binary people are new. 0.99

00:23:03.520 None of that shit is new. 0.97

00:23:04.920 And I'm someone, so, like, I'm indigenous, Polynesian indigenous. 0.98

00:23:08.760 And for us, like, there were no genders prior to being colonized.

00:23:12.800 We actually had three.

00:23:14.520 Well, we had a third gender, someone who didn't conform to either. 0.99

00:23:17.400 But we didn't really recognize a gender binary at all until we were colonized.

00:23:21.520 And then religion wasn't, like, forced upon my people.

00:23:25.480 So now they adhere to a very strict gender binary.

00:23:28.280 But many indigenous and native people did not adhere to any sort of binary at all.

00:23:33.180 And we've been here for thousands of years.

00:23:35.460 So to say that all of it's just new, it's just a fad, you're literally wrong, like, historically and factually or wrong.

00:23:42.060 Like, that is not true at all.

00:23:43.680 All the way wrong.

00:23:44.240 And two-spirit people exist, too, with the Native American people.

00:23:46.680 Absolutely.

00:23:47.300 There are many different cultures.

00:23:48.680 There are many different cultures that have been here much longer than European settlers were here colonizing all of America.

00:23:55.000 But even the colonizers were transing gender.

00:23:57.840 But I did not mean to cut you off when we're talking.

00:23:59.620 I'm not trying to talk about colonizers right now. 0.99

00:24:01.380 We're talking about indigenous fucking people and Native Americans, honey. 1.00

00:24:03.480 That's what I'm fucking not doing right now is, like, fucking talking over you when you're fucking talking about that. 1.00

00:24:06.900 No, you're totally fine. 0.99

00:24:07.540 I'm not cutting you off in the middle of that sentence, which I just did.

00:24:10.320 No, you're totally fine.

00:24:11.560 No.

00:24:12.100 Basically, like, I've had this conversation many times because, especially on TikTok, because I feel like these are things when I have really nuanced conversations, especially about the gender binary.

00:24:22.740 And how it plays right into the hands of misogyny and patriarchy and their pillars of the patriarchy, which is also a pillar of white supremacy.

00:24:30.060 When I talk about all of that, a lot of times they're like, ugh, ugh.

00:24:34.900 Right.

00:24:35.140 And I'm like, see, some of you aren't smart enough to have this conversation with me. 1.00

00:24:38.060 I can tell people to suck my wiener all day long. 1.00

00:24:39.860 But at the end of the day, that kind of shit is real. 1.00

00:24:42.120 And that's the most important part that I want you guys to leave with when you watch my content. 0.98

00:24:46.100 But you know what's interesting about that?

00:24:48.340 I want to, like, say this is, like, embarrassing, but it's true.

00:24:50.840 No.

00:24:51.000 So, like, when I first started understanding and hearing, like, what white privilege meant, and, like, hearing that term, for me, it was, like, Amanda Seals, and it was, like, 2016, like, 2015.

00:25:01.100 And I got into work with her on Game of Thrones, and there were absolutely times where, like, things, like, where she would post in where I'd be like, no.

00:25:09.720 Like, like, and it really, like, I did get defensive, and I did feel some kind of way about it.

00:25:15.020 And it didn't take me a week or two.

00:25:17.780 It took me, like, following her for, like, a long time.

00:25:21.080 Yeah.

00:25:21.500 And then starting to be like, oh, that's true. 0.98

00:25:23.860 Like, we are absolutely built on genocide and absolutely reparations right fucking now. 0.75

00:25:28.860 And, but when you've been taught American history in a certain way from, you know, this big, and, like, and you really, like, are fitting the mold of what the people are teaching you, you know? 0.96

00:25:40.460 Yeah, absolutely.

00:25:40.660 Because, like, I fit into, like, I thought I fit into that gender binary.

00:25:43.560 And I thought, like, so I just, you know, believed all the way until.

00:25:46.500 It's indoctrination, really.

00:25:47.760 But until I, 100%.

00:25:49.100 And then as I realized that I'm super queer and not cishet, and I started to realize, like, and I started to feel the effects of that, which was, like, really early for me.

00:25:58.440 Yeah.

00:25:58.840 Calling back to that, I was like, oh, my God, that is, whoa.

00:26:01.440 And so I have, like, a whole chapter in my second, and love that story about, it's, that chapter is called, like, Sorry, Karen, White Supremacy Looks Really Bad on You.

00:26:08.200 And it's about, like, me kind of, like, trying to grapple with, like, my love for my family and talking about that defensiveness.

00:26:14.320 And then, like, but, like, that doesn't, it takes a while for that to, like, move through someone.

00:26:19.100 And some people, like, so, but I think the reason I bring that up in this context is, like, thank you.

00:26:24.440 Like, thank you so much for being willing to have those conversations on TikTok.

00:26:27.760 Because when people come in your comments, I'm, like, going to get emotional.

00:26:31.140 It is so hard.

00:26:32.620 Like, people are, there's so much vitriol.

00:26:34.780 There is, yeah.

00:26:35.340 Like, we just need all the people.

00:26:37.220 Yeah. 0.99

00:26:37.640 But I also just think, like, I try to remind myself, like, to try to be patient as I've, after I've, like, cussed somebody out and blocked them and told them to, like, go fist themselves in hell. 1.00

00:26:45.060 Like, you fucking transphobe, you know? 1.00

00:26:46.480 Yeah. 1.00

00:26:46.820 Which I do do.

00:26:47.660 Like, Alok.

00:26:48.160 We love Alok so much.

00:26:49.220 Yes, I do.

00:26:50.240 Because, like, I absolutely love them.

00:26:51.640 Like, those Instagram posts, like, where they, like, write those, like, most beautiful, loving messages to, like, haters.

00:26:57.540 Truly.

00:26:57.820 I'll be, like, Alok. 1.00

00:26:58.620 When I get messages like that, I want to be, like, I'm going to fucking go cut your mom's arm off. 1.00

00:27:02.960 And I'm going to fucking fist you with her bloody fucking arm. 1.00

00:27:05.260 And then I'm going to fucking, like, and then I'm, like, ooh, my loving public figure image is ruined. 1.00

00:27:09.920 And then I got to, like, delete that comment. 0.99

00:27:11.440 And then, like, but I was, like, no, not me, honey.

00:27:13.420 I was, like, I'm not.

00:27:14.040 You're going to delete the comment for a second. 0.98

00:27:16.160 Because, and actually, like, there has been times where Alok will, like, screenshot me a response that I was going to be, like, girl, you need to delete this shit right now. 0.97

00:27:22.520 Like, you, like, you got to tone it back. 0.97

00:27:24.140 Well, you know what I will tell you?

00:27:26.720 I'll tell you that that is, I'm so happy that Alok, someone like Alok exists, first of all.

00:27:32.240 And they're brave enough to have these conversations with people. 0.99

00:27:35.040 Because, first of all, they're so fucking smart. 0.97

00:27:37.540 I think the thought leader of our time. 0.99

00:27:39.200 Like, genuinely.

00:27:40.140 Yeah, I think so, too.

00:27:40.600 Like, a once in a lifetime.

00:27:41.320 Yeah, I think so, too.

00:27:41.960 Like, mind.

00:27:42.360 Me, too.

00:27:42.640 Right?

00:27:43.200 But I'm so glad you have someone like that to be, like, to kind of temp gauge you a little bit.

00:27:48.000 But at the same time, I'll be mean for you. 1.00

00:27:50.260 I don't give a fuck, bitch. 1.00

00:27:51.520 Like, my image is not I'm nice to everyone. 1.00

00:27:54.040 So that's the beauty of mine.

00:27:55.780 So, like, they need people like us.

00:27:57.520 Yeah, I'm an ally. 0.97

00:27:58.200 I've told people that before because I am very fucking mean to bigoted people. 0.98

00:28:03.840 And I stand on that. 0.98

00:28:04.960 And I stand behind it.

00:28:06.440 And even when I had my friend Caleb on the show and we talked about it because he's a comic. 0.98

00:28:11.200 And he's gay and he's also fat. 0.88

00:28:13.580 So he talks about being fat a lot. 0.98

00:28:15.260 And he talks about how he suffers from all this fat phobia all the time.

00:28:19.820 But he talks about how, like, when he was on the show with me, we were discussing hate and how, you know, bigoted people are everywhere.

00:28:26.800 And, unfortunately, the Internet has given them the ability to be anonymous and, like, kind of move in the shadows and whatnot.

00:28:33.720 And so he was saying, I admire people like Dylan.

00:28:36.440 Right?

00:28:36.600 We both love Dylan.

00:28:38.000 He said, I admire people like her because she is someone who approaches hate with kindness.

00:28:42.960 And she's someone who handles it with empathy.

00:28:44.540 She does it really good, too.

00:28:45.420 Because she is just that's just who she is.

00:28:47.760 She's a very kind person.

00:28:49.000 She's not someone who resorts to anger or anything like that.

00:28:51.320 And he's like, and at the same time, I know that I am not someone who handles hate or bigotry like that.

00:28:57.000 And that's OK.

00:28:57.600 We can both exist in the same world.

00:28:58.820 We all have different trauma responses.

00:28:59.900 And we all need each other in that sense.

00:29:01.460 Like, I need someone like her to balance me. 0.87

00:29:04.680 And she needs someone like me to balance her.

00:29:07.120 So it's like it works in both ways. 0.96

00:29:09.420 I think both approaches are necessary, especially because with my platform, I feel like anyone that doesn't identify as, like, a cis hitman who loves me and is part of my community, I've told many people, including the people that bought my book, I was telling them, I think what they love about me other than just me being silly and telling people to suck my dick, is that they also love that I validate them, not just in their, you know, sadness or their frustration, but I validate them in their anger. 0.96

00:29:36.100 And I tell people, you're allowed to be mad.

00:29:38.420 Like, if you want to be angry, if you want to be mad, if you want to handle bigotry with biting remarks and if you want to bite back and if you want to stand up for yourself, you can.

00:29:47.960 And I give you the license to do so. 0.97

00:29:49.480 And if you don't want to do it, send it to me and I'll fucking do it. 0.87

00:29:52.000 So I tell people all the time, I validate them in their anger because anger is a human emotion that we are all entitled to. 0.96

00:29:57.820 And just because someone else would handle it a different way, it doesn't mean that I have to handle it that way.

00:30:02.620 And I also have talked about before with criticism, especially from white, cis-hit white men, is that they like to tell me, like, well, I just feel like you could handle it better or you should take the high road.

00:30:12.060 And I think I always tell them, first of all, you have more problem with how I responded to bigotry than you do with the bigotry itself, which makes no sense.

00:30:19.900 At the same time, I say the fact that you expect me to respond to it with kindness and grace and empathy is an entitlement.

00:30:29.020 And that is also a byproduct of patriarchy and white supremacy because I'm not only a woman, but I'm also I don't identify just as a woman, but I'm also a brown woman and I'm also not a thin woman.

00:30:37.680 And so at the same time, you expect me to even at the the worst, most like violent and vitriolic comments, you still expect me to handle it with grace and empathy.

00:30:49.380 And that's because you feel entitled to that part of women all the time.

00:30:53.160 You feel entitled to women in general, but especially their emotions and how they handle you, which in most cases they do handle you with empathy and kindness because that's what they've been conditioned to do their entire lives.

00:31:07.680 I'm having like dueling intrusive thoughts right now.

00:31:14.280 Please share them.

00:31:15.120 I would love to hear that.

00:31:16.060 So like when I hear you speak and then we were talking about our ages earlier.

00:31:19.540 Yeah.

00:31:19.920 Like I feel so and not that we're like 80 years apart, but I do feel like you're like Jen, like you're like not a millennial.

00:31:26.800 No, I am millennial.

00:31:27.700 You're not.

00:31:28.420 I am.

00:31:29.100 28 year olds are allowed to be millennial.

00:31:30.820 Yes.

00:31:31.200 That makes me feel so much younger.

00:31:32.540 Am I three years old?

00:31:34.480 Am I a toddler?

00:31:35.440 Am I a tiny baby?

00:31:36.020 I'm like right in the middle of millennial.

00:31:37.380 You're like on the cusp.

00:31:38.640 But I so but like when I hear people who are younger than me speaking in ways that I feel like are teaching me, opening me, I'm like, yes, like, yes.

00:31:49.120 Then I feel like I'm I feel like this hope.

00:31:51.320 But then I like think about like there's all these like other people who are like our age box, younger age boxes who are like literally like the polar opposite.

00:31:59.080 Yeah.

00:31:59.380 And so it's like so I'm like so part of me wants to be like it's getting better.

00:32:02.620 But then it's like and I feel like those people are online.

00:32:05.620 Yeah.

00:32:05.940 Like and you just see like.

00:32:07.360 But my case for like not responding with biting.

00:32:11.280 Yeah.

00:32:11.720 But I still do.

00:32:12.740 I struggle with it.

00:32:14.320 Sometimes I get really crazy where I'll go and I'll do a DM of like an upside down smiley face.

00:32:19.580 And then like in the DMs and then I sit and I wait for it to say seen in IG.

00:32:24.920 And then once it says seen, then I block them.

00:32:28.760 It's like it's really like it's giving me the height of like I've done that like I have time today. 0.99

00:32:32.940 Sometimes I have I they start fights with me and comments and then they'll be like, this is why I really I really fucking hate you. 0.82

00:32:39.300 And they'll like start writing a dissertation and I wait till they get to the like second one and then I delete it.

00:32:44.580 And then they come back and they're like, she deleted my other comment anyways.

00:32:47.120 And they'll start again.

00:32:47.800 And then I delete it again.

00:32:49.920 And then I wait to see if they come back.

00:32:51.300 And once they come back and they start it, I just block them.

00:32:53.400 Oh, that makes me feel good.

00:32:54.120 It's like tennis.

00:32:54.800 It makes you feel better.

00:32:55.080 That makes you like human.

00:32:55.980 Yeah.

00:32:56.140 Yeah.

00:32:56.240 That makes me laugh because I feel like I'm slamming the door in their face.

00:33:01.360 And that's so funny.

00:33:02.120 OK, that is it is.

00:33:03.560 And it is.

00:33:04.040 But this is what I was going to say.

00:33:04.980 So this is like I'm trying to like not do it more now because it's actually like selfish and self-preservation because it's my nervous system.

00:33:11.880 Yeah.

00:33:12.160 Like I find myself saying the thing and then I'm like, I want to come back and check later.

00:33:16.160 Yeah.

00:33:16.540 I feel about it.

00:33:17.540 Yeah.

00:33:17.700 Absolutely. 0.99

00:33:17.940 And then I feel like embarrassed like two hours later because like I was like, you know, I said that I was going to like cut your mom's arm off and fucking fist you with it or whatever, you know. 0.98

00:33:25.960 Or like whatever the takedown was. 0.96

00:33:27.360 And I feel like it ended up like wasting so much of my time and making me feel like just like shame, like guilt and shame, like just like.

00:33:34.820 But that's because you're such a good person.

00:33:37.100 But it's like I don't want to like fuck up my nervous system. 0.56

00:33:40.140 I feel you.

00:33:40.620 Because it's like all the negativity.

00:33:41.960 And I've also like I've learned on the podcast, like when you have like memories, whether they're good or bad, but like especially with comments, like your brain makes these like memories.

00:33:48.920 And there's like literally proteins on the neurons of your like in the brain.

00:33:53.300 And so like when you have like a bad memory that you remember, even just thinking about it, your body will start to feel the feelings that it felt when you experience the thing.

00:34:02.640 Yeah, absolutely. 0.98

00:34:03.120 And so it's like the more times that I go back and I keep I call it like a cornrow like in my brain because I come from a fucking cornfield. 0.98

00:34:09.080 But it's like your pathway or whatever like that like habit is in your brain. 0.97

00:34:12.800 So I just like getting into it with them on those comments.

00:34:14.980 Yeah, just resurfaces every negative feeling force.

00:34:18.140 And I also think generally it's like veering back to the political.

00:34:20.880 I have been thinking a lot this year, like going into an election year.

00:34:25.000 Yeah.

00:34:25.360 Like I live in Texas.

00:34:27.260 Our voting turnout was like abysmal.

00:34:29.600 And obviously, like part of that is racism and disenfranchisement and making voting rights harder.

00:34:35.260 Yeah. 0.99

00:34:35.540 And also at the same time, there are a lot of fucking eligible voters that aren't fucking voting. 0.99

00:34:39.860 Yeah. 0.99

00:34:40.580 And a lot of those people are white, privileged, well-to-do people who I am afraid to say actually do align with our values.

00:34:48.620 Like they aren't even like vehemently opposed.

00:34:50.840 Yeah.

00:34:51.120 They just don't vote.

00:34:52.180 Yeah.

00:34:52.400 They don't think that their votes matter.

00:34:53.920 Yeah.

00:34:54.460 Or they – I also think that like there is some economics like some people I think just like literally can't afford to – but also pre-vote.

00:35:01.080 Like there's actually no excuse.

00:35:02.280 Yeah.

00:35:02.500 Because you can vote early.

00:35:03.500 There's no excuse.

00:35:04.060 Yeah.

00:35:04.480 But especially in places that are having like 50 and 55 and 60% voter turnout is considered like historic.

00:35:10.200 Yeah.

00:35:10.700 Which is crazy.

00:35:11.840 And that is like – 0.97

00:35:11.920 That is so fucking crazy to me. 0.98

00:35:14.220 Yeah, that's crazy. 0.98

00:35:15.000 But it's like instead of us trying to convince people that are – could honestly be Russian bots versus like literally.

00:35:21.220 Like they could actually like literally not even be like literally.

00:35:23.360 Yeah.

00:35:23.580 Because like that's like a literal – like a lot of trolls like really are like –

00:35:26.700 Actually.

00:35:27.360 Yeah.

00:35:27.620 Like they're literal bots.

00:35:28.640 Yeah.

00:35:29.000 So that's one thing.

00:35:30.000 Two, it's like instead of us wasting our time trying to convince people that are like as Alok says committed to misunderstanding us.

00:35:35.380 Exactly.

00:35:35.760 Like I want to try to spend more time like educating people that are on the sidelines.

00:35:39.520 Yeah, absolutely.

00:35:40.000 And try to get undecided.

00:35:41.480 Yeah. 0.98

00:35:41.840 And get undecided people in versus trying to change the minds of people who are like fucking committed. 0.96

00:35:46.540 Exactly. 0.93

00:35:47.180 To not getting it.

00:35:48.040 I've talked about that before too because I've had people ask like, oh, can – or would you ever have someone like this on the podcast?

00:35:55.300 And it's someone who's like violently bigoted.

00:35:56.800 And I always say no and then, you know, men because their brains are this big, they'll be like, oh, well, that's just because you're afraid.

00:36:04.760 Actually, I'm not.

00:36:05.540 I'm not afraid of anything, especially not someone who's shorter than me. 0.98

00:36:08.080 That's for fucking sure. 0.99

00:36:08.980 One. 0.99

00:36:09.420 Two.

00:36:10.120 At the same time, I tell them like my platform and my podcast is not a space to platform your rhetoric and your hate.

00:36:17.000 And that's not someone I'm going to convince because believe it or not, someone who's violently misogynistic is not going to hear me when I say that you shouldn't treat women like that because that's bad. 0.72

00:36:27.600 They're not even going to hear that very foundational, like superficial understanding of why bigotry is harmful and violent.

00:36:34.200 They're never going to listen.

00:36:35.520 They don't want to listen or learn.

00:36:36.960 They just want to speak into a bigger microphone.

00:36:38.900 And so my show is an opportunity for them to do that.

00:36:42.100 And I'm not giving them an opportunity. 0.98

00:36:43.340 I don't know if you could tell by anything about my platform, but I don't give men opportunities to do shit, especially not with my stuff. 0.99

00:36:49.180 So I even tell them, I'm like, if you want to platform your bigotry and you want to shout into a bigger microphone, get your own fucking show is what I always tell them because I got mine. 0.96

00:36:57.780 So I know my thing is like I run my platform as far as like when it comes to dealing with bigotry, I don't convince you. 0.97

00:37:05.620 I don't entertain you.

00:37:07.020 I don't like try to change you. 0.96

00:37:09.300 I'm literally just humiliate you. 0.94

00:37:11.140 And then I slam the door.

00:37:12.140 And I always describe my platform as like the one place that men like that don't have a seat at.

00:37:18.340 Like it's the one table they don't have a seat at. 0.98

00:37:20.100 And that's why they fucking hate me so much because they don't get a chance to like defend their misogyny, to stand up for themselves. 0.98

00:37:26.920 I don't give them that opportunity. 1.00

00:37:28.640 It's a one way street on my fucking platforms. 0.99

00:37:31.400 I just don't understand where there's like even any room to disagree with us. 0.99

00:37:35.140 Well, I honestly don't even get it. 0.98

00:37:37.500 I don't want to hear you disagree with me because you're fucking wrong. 0.97

00:37:41.400 It's like 20 minutes ago. 0.97

00:37:42.260 I was like, you got to give people time and patience and like whatever. 0.93

00:37:44.500 But then it's like once you get it, I'm like, get it the fuck together. 0.92

00:37:47.160 The only time I entertain them is to just is to solely make fun of them. 0.92

00:37:50.920 And that's literally it.

00:37:52.160 As soon as they're like, explain it to me.

00:37:53.880 I always go, no.

00:37:55.560 And that's it.

00:37:56.260 No is a complete sentence, by the way.

00:37:57.780 I don't need to justify it, explain it.

00:37:59.440 And they're like, why wouldn't you want to explain it to me?

00:38:01.240 Because you don't want to understand.

00:38:02.820 And also nuance is like going to give me carpal tunnel. 0.98

00:38:05.200 Like trying to fucking explain it to these people in the comments is like. 0.97

00:38:09.120 Well, I'm just like, you're older than me. 0.99

00:38:10.680 Why am I explaining to you?

00:38:11.720 Why?

00:38:11.860 But I really will try.

00:38:13.000 I will really find myself like if I wasn't going in an anger way.

00:38:16.860 Like I have literally tried.

00:38:19.140 I've spent so much time trying.

00:38:20.540 Yeah.

00:38:20.880 With so many strangers.

00:38:22.220 Yeah.

00:38:22.500 I still try with my family.

00:38:24.260 But I do think it's interesting about that idea.

00:38:26.360 Like would you ever platform or try to convince them?

00:38:28.520 I can't remember what, who I was told by.

00:38:30.480 But it's like if you have like a white person who's racist.

00:38:33.600 Yeah.

00:38:33.760 They got to hear from like a white person.

00:38:35.740 Exactly.

00:38:36.240 Why it's like, cause like you need to see yourself in the thing or not the thing.

00:38:41.040 Jesus Christ.

00:38:41.700 But you got to like see yourself in a person to like be able to understand. 1.00

00:38:44.260 Like, so it's really like if there's a fucking misogynistic fucking like anti-woman. 1.00

00:38:48.380 Yeah. 1.00

00:38:48.680 Or turfy. 1.00

00:38:49.300 Just like fucking piece of shit, dude. 1.00

00:38:50.660 Yeah. 1.00

00:38:51.000 He has to have like one of his bras.

00:38:52.840 Yeah.

00:38:53.440 Like, you know, sit down and be like bra. 0.94

00:38:55.320 Or like however they do that.

00:38:56.560 I don't know how they talk.

00:38:57.760 I don't know.

00:38:58.660 Actually, this one time I did such a good straight man impression.

00:39:01.740 No.

00:39:02.860 This one time I did.

00:39:04.240 No.

00:39:04.740 It's the list.

00:39:07.800 Well, I was trying to be a straight man.

00:39:09.240 It's going to take me a long time to get into that character.

00:39:10.880 So it's probably good that we got to do method acting.

00:39:12.920 I was like, bro, you know, I can't.

00:39:16.060 I don't know how to do it.

00:39:17.060 Yeah.

00:39:17.220 I don't know how they talk to each other.

00:39:18.840 But you got to have like a fun.

00:39:20.020 He'd have to go on like, you know, the like the pro woman, not and like not Joe Rogan podcast.

00:39:27.480 Like that's who like that turf anti-woman guy would have. 1.00

00:39:30.800 Well, they're not going to listen to me. 0.91

00:39:31.980 That's for damn sure. 0.97

00:39:32.660 They're going to go. 0.97

00:39:33.180 They got to go on like like that speech professor who I love on Instagram.

00:39:38.360 They got to hear it from other people who look like them.

00:39:40.480 Yeah.

00:39:40.800 And that's the only person to listen to.

00:39:42.140 And even then they don't listen to them very often.

00:39:44.220 But maybe they have a chance.

00:39:45.580 Yeah.

00:39:45.800 That they have more of a fighting chance than I do. 1.00

00:39:47.940 So if that's the case and I understand that truth, then catch these fucking jokes, bitch. 1.00

00:39:53.160 Like I'm just going to be mean to you. 1.00

00:39:54.600 Yes.

00:39:54.780 And then honestly, like I've had white men in the past, like make videos about me.

00:40:00.400 And they've like one guy made a video about me a while ago.

00:40:03.160 It was like a year or two ago. 0.96

00:40:04.140 And he was basically saying like if he had come across me five years ago, he would have fucking hated me. 0.99

00:40:09.320 But he said five years ago, I was a very misogynistic, racist, homophobe, like horrible person. 0.99

00:40:16.020 And he's like, but I lived such an unfulfilling life and I blamed the world for my problems and I blamed other people for my problems.

00:40:23.120 And he said, and then one day I just got to a point where I thought like, why am I so unhappy?

00:40:28.060 And so he said he read like some story about a dog that sits on a nail and every day the dog sits on the nail and it yelps.

00:40:35.060 And then someone who listens to the dog every day says like, why doesn't the dog just sit somewhere else?

00:40:40.120 And then the other person says, because it doesn't hurt enough yet.

00:40:43.140 So he was basically saying sometimes you have to get hurt really badly by someone like her in order to seek change.

00:40:50.380 Right.

00:40:50.740 He's like to understand, like, maybe I am really awful or why am I so unhappy?

00:40:54.660 Or like, was what she's saying to me, did it hit me so hard because it's true? 0.90

00:40:59.480 Did it hit me so hard because I do struggle with stuff like that?

00:41:01.780 He basically said like he's thankful for someone like me existing now. 0.93

00:41:05.440 He's like, because if he had found me five years ago, he would have fucking hated me too. 0.93

00:41:08.660 And he's like, but that's a me problem. 0.96

00:41:10.260 That's not because of her.

00:41:11.100 That's literally because of me.

00:41:11.700 It is weird when people are like, I would have been your worst nightmare.

00:41:14.560 Like, I get like that.

00:41:15.320 They're like, okay, cool. 0.99

00:41:16.920 He's like, I would have fucking hated. 1.00

00:41:18.280 I would have hated that bitch. 1.00

00:41:19.560 Anyways, she's great, though. 1.00

00:41:21.560 I took the like compliment, I guess. 1.00

00:41:24.760 But like the kind of shit compliment sandwich. 0.97

00:41:26.760 But like it basically just validated me and everything I've already believed about myself, which is like my content is literally not for them, which is another problem they have with me. 0.97

00:41:35.280 It's just like they struggle with the idea that not everything in this world is catered towards them.

00:41:41.000 And so I've always said like, if we're looking at what I'm actually trying to do, I'm not trying to like convince you or change you.

00:41:48.520 I'm trying to save everybody else.

00:41:50.640 I'm trying to like wake everybody up.

00:41:52.360 It's almost like everyone's been put to sleep and I'm just waking them up and telling them like it doesn't have to be this way if you don't want it to be that way.

00:41:58.760 So like it even when it ties to my book, I'm like, it's not for men.

00:42:02.300 It's about de-centering men entirely, removing them entirely from your thought processes.

00:42:06.780 Like once you unpack your internalized misogyny, you let go of so many different internalized biases.

00:42:10.900 How attached are you to living in California?

00:42:12.820 Could I get you to come to Texas in front of her office?

00:42:15.340 Beyonce's from there.

00:42:16.600 Period.

00:42:17.360 Love that.

00:42:17.980 She and I are Virgos.

00:42:19.080 Love that for us.

00:42:20.020 So even if it's here in California, there's bad people here, too, that need good people.

00:42:25.020 That is true.

00:42:25.640 A lot of people ask me, they're like, can you talk to my dad or my brother or whatever?

00:42:36.480 I think I honestly, I say this to people sometimes, but your way of like, you could totally hold elected office.

00:42:43.660 Oh, period.

00:42:44.800 Thank you.

00:42:45.580 I think that's a high compliment.

00:42:46.500 Get your bag first so you don't have like, you know, conflict of interest.

00:42:48.440 That's what I tell myself, you know, like get your bag so you can like not have a conflict of interest.

00:42:52.320 You can really like fight for everyone.

00:42:54.540 Yeah.

00:42:54.860 I mean, fight for people who need it, not the corrupt, not corrupt corporate people, not bigoted people.

00:43:00.280 Yeah.

00:43:00.460 I think that people like my like my platform and people like you are so important to have, especially now with so much visibility that like people have on whether it's politics, anything serious or anything silly.

00:43:14.600 Right.

00:43:15.000 Like they have people like us existing in this space, like able to like speak up for what we believe is right and stand for what we believe is true and important.

00:43:23.820 And I feel like that's a big reason why I don't platform bigotry at all.

00:43:28.840 Like I don't invite them on my show to debate.

00:43:31.020 There's just nothing to debate.

00:43:32.840 I'm not debating human existence with you.

00:43:34.560 I'm not debating the validity of trans people with you.

00:43:37.760 I'm not doing that. 0.99

00:43:38.400 Like I'm absolutely not fucking doing that. 0.99

00:43:40.440 That's when I tell them to get their own fucking show because they're not doing it on mine. 0.99

00:43:43.620 That's for goddamn sure. 0.99

00:43:45.180 It's just not worth it to me. 0.98

00:43:46.760 No.

00:43:47.040 That's why I said it's not for them.

00:43:48.440 Yeah.

00:43:48.860 It's for everybody else, like everyone else who needs it, who needs empowerment, who needs strength, who needs uplifting.

00:43:55.100 And I've told people before, too, that I feel like my ultimate goal at the end of the day would just be that they don't need me to do this forever.

00:44:03.980 Like they know they have the same exact confidence and like level of strength that they believe I have and they don't.

00:44:10.660 Because I get people like say all the time, I wish I had this kind of confidence.

00:44:13.780 And I always tell them, you do.

00:44:15.540 You just have to give yourself the permission to use it.

00:44:17.780 Because we've been conditioned to ignore it for a very long time.

00:44:21.260 I can't wait for the book.

00:44:23.240 I can't wait for the book.

00:44:24.900 I'm so glad.

00:44:26.100 Honey.

00:44:27.560 I always tell people that because it is true.

00:44:29.480 It's just like I just found mine a lot sooner. 1.00

00:44:32.500 But that's literally because I just fucking hate men. 0.97

00:44:36.020 Well, I just think sometimes like people's connection to their purpose is just comes up more clearly or differently. 0.99

00:44:45.400 Or like, you know, you can't help it that you're like tuned the fuck in. 0.84

00:44:49.540 I was like, I don't know. 0.92

00:44:50.820 I don't know why.

00:44:51.540 Because they've asked me before, like, how did you get like that?

00:44:53.720 I'm like, I honestly don't know.

00:44:55.040 I think.

00:44:55.720 Well, I have a really wonderful like family.

00:44:58.220 I have a very supportive family.

00:44:59.420 But I've also talked about like my mom has always been so incredibly strong.

00:45:03.820 And my mom's also was also the main breadwinner for a long time in my family.

00:45:07.420 But someone culture is very matriarchal. 1.00

00:45:09.260 Yeah.

00:45:09.500 My dad's dream has always been to be a stay at home dad.

00:45:11.980 That's been my dad's dream forever.

00:45:13.200 He's like, if I never have to go to work, I'm totally cool with that.

00:45:15.020 I'll stay home. 0.99

00:45:15.660 I don't give a fuck. 0.99

00:45:16.480 And my dad also has been very emotional around me my entire life. 0.99

00:45:19.500 Like my dad's cried in front of me many, many times.

00:45:21.460 More times than my mom, probably.

00:45:23.040 And so my dad's never been afraid to tell me he loves me or show emotion or anything like that.

00:45:26.940 So all of that, I think, plays a huge role.

00:45:28.740 Yeah.

00:45:29.160 I would say.

00:45:29.720 Yeah.

00:45:30.100 And then also, I think just my never ending fight against men who irritate me.

00:45:35.940 I think all of that perfect storm, you know.

00:45:38.040 I have to say, I've thought a few times, like, I feel like some, because I actually think I get this, too, with like more gays, not straight men, but or maybe questioning men.

00:45:48.360 Sometimes I feel like people also, when you're really outspoken, and then they're also attracted to you for some reason.

00:45:55.980 Like.

00:45:56.140 You're telling me.

00:45:56.840 Whether it's, like, whatever it is. 0.99

00:45:58.900 Like, I'm like, I'm not saying that every troll wants to fuck me, but I am saying that, like. 0.99

00:46:02.980 But also, probably. 0.99

00:46:03.780 Because if there's something about, like, that they like, they, like, want you to think that they're not.

00:46:08.520 Yeah.

00:46:08.800 Like, but then they're just trying to, like, air this dirty laundry, and you're like, wait, what?

00:46:11.800 To that same point, that's another reason why I stopped doing Cameo.

00:46:15.380 Because I started getting requests.

00:46:17.300 First, it was just like, can you wish happy birthday to my sister?

00:46:19.640 Like, that's what it was normally. 0.94

00:46:21.020 And then I started getting ones that were like, can you tell me I'm, like, a dirty, rotten boy, and, like, blah, blah, blah. 0.93

00:46:27.040 And I said, not for $30. 0.93

00:46:28.920 I literally canceled it because I was like.

00:46:30.360 I feel like I'm going to do, like, $3,500 for, like, dirty talk.

00:46:32.740 Yeah.

00:46:33.480 They wanted me to, like, say.

00:46:34.740 Like, in clothing, just, just, just, like, just dirty talk, and you can't post it or anything.

00:46:41.420 I would do that for $3,500.

00:46:42.960 Someone literally, it was $30.

00:46:44.200 With some boundaries, yeah.

00:46:45.340 But $30, no, both of us deserve $3,500.

00:46:47.060 $30, no, I will, Cameo founders, I'll join for that.

00:46:50.140 You want me to do a little dirty talk? 1.00

00:46:51.120 Add a few more zeros and we'll talk about it.

00:46:51.580 Yeah, do $3,500. 1.00

00:46:52.460 I will fucking, I will verbally lick hot sauce from between your toes. 1.00

00:46:56.020 I'll call you. 1.00

00:46:56.800 I remember the very last one.

00:46:58.640 You need a dirty, you need a makeover. 1.00

00:47:00.280 The last one I saw that, like, literally made me cancel it was, it was a man, like, asking

00:47:06.320 me to, like, degrade him, but he, like, told me to stand over the camera, like, I'm taller

00:47:13.100 than him.

00:47:13.680 And I said, oh, cancel.

00:47:15.040 Or did he want to see your, like, private parts?

00:47:17.620 No, no, no.

00:47:18.060 He just wanted me to, like, look down at him.

00:47:20.180 I thought he meant, like.

00:47:21.260 Oh, like, naked?

00:47:22.080 No.

00:47:22.300 I was like, that's way more than $30.

00:47:24.280 No, no, no.

00:47:25.020 It was literally just, like, to look down at him because I'm tall and I've talked about

00:47:28.440 being tall. 0.87

00:47:29.380 And I was like, girl, you're going to make me kill myself. 0.98

00:47:32.760 Cancel. 0.99

00:47:33.360 Girl, ew.

00:47:34.320 Ew.

00:47:35.000 These people.

00:47:35.880 I'm not playing into a fantasy. 1.00

00:47:37.020 These fucking men on the internet. 1.00

00:47:38.020 What is their goddamn problem? 1.00

00:47:39.320 I'm like, why don't you send me your pin and I'll come beat you up? 1.00

00:47:41.240 How about that?

00:47:41.640 Wait, can I tell you, like, the funniest story that I just thought of?

00:47:43.140 Please do.

00:47:43.700 My cousin and I, my little cousin, when, like, chat rooms were becoming a thing in, like, the

00:47:47.640 90s, we were, like, on a chat room when, like, we weren't supposed to be.

00:47:50.900 And, obviously, like, this, like, hideous old man, like, started to try to, like, sexualize 0.89

00:47:55.220 us. 0.90

00:47:55.760 And we were, like, teenagers, if not, like, younger.

00:47:58.520 And I remember, like, when it started, I was, like, my cousin's name was Sullivan.

00:48:01.720 I was, like, oh, girl, like, this is bad.

00:48:03.440 Like, we need to stop.

00:48:04.280 Like, because at first it was just, like, where are you?

00:48:06.800 Because it's, like, internet.

00:48:07.500 It was, like, fun.

00:48:08.200 Like, I can't believe there's people.

00:48:09.640 So all of a sudden this guy types, I'm naked right now.

00:48:12.340 And I looked at my cousin and I was, like, and then she, and she was younger than me.

00:48:16.820 And she is younger than me.

00:48:17.820 And she, I was, like, I don't know.

00:48:19.040 And she was, like, honey, she didn't say honey, but she was, like, I know what to say.

00:48:22.180 And so she responded and she said, you must be cold.

00:48:24.760 And then she was, like, mom, mom, we need help.

00:48:28.080 Like, this stranger is, like, telling us things.

00:48:30.440 But I've always thought that was so funny.

00:48:31.540 She literally said, like, you must be cold.

00:48:33.040 He was, like, I'm naked.

00:48:34.140 And then she was, like, you must be cold.

00:48:35.760 And then she was, like, mom.

00:48:37.220 It was so funny.

00:48:37.600 The very first time someone asked me for a nude, I was texting, like, on my Envy.

00:48:42.040 I was, like, flip up and, like, text like that.

00:48:44.180 And it was, like, when I was 14, I was a freshman in high school. 1.00

00:48:46.100 So some guy just, it's, like, teenager shit. 0.99

00:48:48.500 You're, like, hey, hey, what are you doing? 0.99

00:48:50.180 Nothing.

00:48:50.500 What are you doing? 1.00

00:48:50.920 Like, that type of shit. 1.00

00:48:51.880 And then it was just, like, you should send me a picture. 0.99

00:48:53.940 Because he said he didn't remember what I looked like.

00:48:56.300 Mind you, I met him an hour ago.

00:48:57.520 And I said, you don't remember what I look like?

00:48:59.500 He said, you should send me a picture.

00:49:01.000 And so I said, okay.

00:49:02.200 And then I sent him, like, a picture of my face.

00:49:04.240 Like, I literally took a picture with my phone. 0.99

00:49:06.020 It looked like a LinkedIn picture, bitch. 1.00

00:49:07.760 Like, literally, it was, like, me. 1.00

00:49:09.260 You know what I'm saying?

00:49:09.960 Like, I literally set it up and took it of myself like that.

00:49:12.420 Like, it's not cute or sexy in any way, which you can't be when you're 14.

00:49:16.200 And so then he was, like, no, you should take another one of your full body.

00:49:19.120 Never.

00:49:19.700 And I was, like, I literally can't.

00:49:20.960 Like, I was so literal that I was, like, I can't do that.

00:49:24.620 I'd have to ask someone to take it of me.

00:49:25.920 I don't have the time.

00:49:26.960 And then he was, like, well, no.

00:49:28.360 And then he, like, elaborated. 1.00

00:49:29.320 And I was, like, don't you ever text me again, you fucking sicko. 1.00

00:49:32.180 And then I went to school the next day and I talked so much shit. 1.00

00:49:34.560 I spread so many rumors. 1.00

00:49:35.700 I said, he sucks. 1.00

00:49:36.420 He's awful. 1.00

00:49:36.820 Oh, wait. 0.60

00:49:37.400 At least he was your age.

00:49:38.520 Yeah.

00:49:38.840 Okay, good.

00:49:39.220 He was 14, too.

00:49:39.820 Yeah, good for him.

00:49:40.480 Yeah.

00:49:40.900 But I hate him.

00:49:41.760 And I remember his name.

00:49:42.900 And he's married to a girl that went to my high school. 0.96

00:49:44.320 And if you ever see this, I hate you. 0.91

00:49:46.640 Anyways.

00:49:49.260 Is she nice?

00:49:50.720 His wife?

00:49:51.240 Do you feel bad for her?

00:49:51.600 Yeah.

00:49:53.160 Yeah, she was cool.

00:49:54.120 I mean, I kind of knew her in high school.

00:49:56.320 But she was, like, older than me.

00:49:57.720 And he's the same age as me.

00:49:59.040 Oh, my God.

00:49:59.400 It's, like, everyone.

00:50:00.000 Like, do we all need to, like, look up your yearbook?

00:50:01.860 Like, I'm dying to know.

00:50:03.260 All my high school friends know who it was.

00:50:04.720 Is this going to become, like, a spinoff podcast of, like, did you see that one podcast

00:50:08.540 about, like, the people?

00:50:09.840 It's, like, blowing up right now where, like, these people got married and then on, like, 0.99

00:50:14.720 a boat in, like, the Netherlands and someone shit in the bathroom. 0.98

00:50:19.300 Like, someone, like, took a dump on the floor of the bathroom. 0.99

00:50:21.300 And it's, like, who shit at the wedding? 0.99

00:50:22.600 And it's, like, the most popular podcast, like, right now. 0.99

00:50:25.340 I was reading about it the other day.

00:50:26.540 I wonder.

00:50:26.880 It's, like, and they, like, go through.

00:50:28.900 I don't know the name, but it's, like, it's, like, it's a Google, like, podcast about someone 0.99

00:50:31.680 who shit at the wedding. 0.96

00:50:32.380 But it's, like, yeah, they go through and, like, interview, like, each guest from the wedding 1.00

00:50:36.180 and they're, like, who shit? 0.99

00:50:36.980 Like, it's, like, a game of Clue. 0.99

00:50:39.280 Should we just, like, not stop our podcast and just go listen to that one?

00:50:49.800 We were so off topic, but who cares?

00:50:51.400 Because this is one of the best episodes ever.

00:50:53.420 Really?

00:50:54.120 Yes.

00:50:54.480 We're going to read one of the TikTok.

00:50:56.160 We're going to describe one of them.

00:50:57.220 For those of you who don't know, we bring TikToks that are applicable to our topic today. 0.98

00:51:00.400 Our topic was, and we didn't talk about it, being a hot slut. 1.00

00:51:03.700 We hit it, like, in flying colors, didn't we? 0.99

00:51:05.900 Yeah, I think so. 0.99

00:51:06.720 Well, because really, just being a slut is, like, anything that brings you pleasure. 0.99

00:51:09.300 Period. 0.99

00:51:09.580 And we had so much pleasure today.

00:51:10.600 I love that.

00:51:11.200 Yeah.

00:51:11.540 Yes.

00:51:12.000 Okay, so we're going to talk about this video.

00:51:13.880 Okay, so basically, this is a woman who gives incoming college women advice on how to be 1.00

00:51:18.240 a confident hot girl during their time in college.

00:51:21.240 She talks about how the most attractive qualities are to not care what other people think, to have

00:51:25.300 a backbone, and to be able to stand up for yourself and embracing yourself instead of constantly

00:51:29.560 chasing others, which probably means men.

00:51:31.720 Okay, so these comments on here says, to be honest, I don't know how you got a life if

00:51:36.320 you're really trying to be hot. 0.99

00:51:38.140 Go to the gym or some shit. 0.99

00:51:40.720 Nice. 1.00

00:51:41.420 That doesn't mean you're hot.

00:51:42.580 The comments, I hate the comments.

00:51:43.800 There's so, well, there's so many.

00:51:44.880 I loved the first essence, and then it took such a sharp turn.

00:51:48.220 Oh, yeah, as it normally does, huh?

00:51:49.940 Jesus.

00:51:50.160 And this next one says, the Industrial Revolution and its consequences.

00:51:54.720 Huh?

00:51:56.140 The Industrial Revolution, like Ford?

00:52:03.300 Yeah, it's a lot.

00:52:04.800 Yeah, this next one says, product of indoctrination.

00:52:08.440 Heteronormativity is a product of indoctrination, babe.

00:52:11.160 That's why you're all convinced you're straight until you're not, huh? 0.99

00:52:13.740 Ugh.

00:52:15.640 That's crazy. 0.91

00:52:16.520 Well, yeah, men just ruin everything. 0.68

00:52:18.100 That's nothing new, but these are all men.

00:52:19.840 It isn't not to be that person on your podcast who's like, not all men.

00:52:24.360 It's people who are lost in toxic misogyny.

00:52:28.700 It's true.

00:52:29.460 And there are some good.

00:52:32.380 There are some good men, for sure.

00:52:33.860 Like, I feel like I've met like.

00:52:38.600 Eight.

00:52:39.160 I can think of like five or six off the top of my head.

00:52:41.940 Eight.

00:52:42.540 Yeah, total.

00:52:43.400 Yeah.

00:52:43.580 Can you believe that?

00:52:44.320 Out of like four billion people in the world?

00:52:45.640 Like six, maybe, maybe 16.

00:52:48.940 Maybe.

00:52:49.300 Maybe.

00:52:49.700 Like 16 per thousand.

00:52:51.460 Yeah.

00:52:52.080 When I say that too, a lot of times I'm talking about cis hat men. 0.73

00:52:55.160 But you know what too though?

00:52:56.700 What? 1.00

00:52:57.560 Because I get that men suck. 1.00

00:52:59.520 Yeah. 1.00

00:52:59.760 Okay.

00:53:00.180 Period. 1.00

00:53:00.580 But if, so not if men, so men suck. 0.99

00:53:03.300 But then how do you explain Lauren Boebert or like Marjorie Taylor? 0.99

00:53:07.460 Because there are some women are really integral. 1.00

00:53:10.700 It's true.

00:53:11.300 And popping up the toxic misogyny and the patriarchy.

00:53:13.620 Because they think that if they can help to enable that toxicity, they can make themselves

00:53:19.720 closer to the power.

00:53:21.140 Yeah, absolutely.

00:53:21.880 It's aligning with white supremacy.

00:53:23.500 It's aligning with the power.

00:53:24.500 It's what that is.

00:53:25.280 Yeah, absolutely.

00:53:25.840 So like to me, that is super naughty and toxic.

00:53:29.940 But I, for the people who are not doing that, I'm just, the binary, I'm just like.

00:53:36.400 Exhausting.

00:53:37.060 Yes.

00:53:37.460 It truly is.

00:53:38.240 And we do have to make some, well, you don't have to do anything.

00:53:40.760 But I think that like we, like there are some, some who we can say like, honey, you, I would 1.00

00:53:46.900 suck your D. 1.00

00:53:47.780 Yeah. 1.00

00:53:47.960 Not because I have shame-based attraction to you, but because I'm attracted to you and

00:53:52.040 I would be honored to go to brunch with you tomorrow because you are fighting for queer 0.88

00:53:56.040 liberation or like, you know, humans.

00:53:58.580 Period.

00:53:59.120 I think too, with men, like my targeting towards men, like me zeroing in on them all the time

00:54:03.200 is truly because like, if we're talking about the dichotomy of power, they sit at the

00:54:06.940 very top.

00:54:07.520 And so like, in order to, to dethrone them, you have to take everyone out from the bottom.

00:54:11.780 And a lot of times it's all men holding them up and then women are still beneath them.

00:54:15.500 And I always, I use this example to, to your point about women, cause I talk about pygmies 1.00

00:54:19.740 a lot too.

00:54:20.400 And pygmy women are literally women who struggle with internalized misogyny.

00:54:23.980 But one time a man made a really awful vitriolic video about me. 0.99

00:54:27.560 He just said a bunch of racist shit about me. 0.99

00:54:29.320 He said awful things about my looks, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. 1.00

00:54:31.560 Sorry for another day.

00:54:32.500 We already know.

00:54:33.440 But there was a girl on there that commented on one of the video on that video.

00:54:37.520 Her comment was at the very top, which is why I saw it.

00:54:39.700 And she wrote, can we talk about how she looks so different in her pictures than she does

00:54:43.500 in real life, which is not true.

00:54:44.900 She's never met me in real life.

00:54:46.340 And then right underneath that, right.

00:54:48.340 was another man who said, you have a filter in your picture. 1.00

00:54:52.760 I wouldn't talk if I were you, bitch. 1.00

00:54:54.460 And then the creator of that video liked his comment. 1.00

00:54:58.040 And so then I thought to myself, you sold me down the river, bitch. 1.00

00:55:00.780 And you still got hit, didn't you? 1.00

00:55:02.860 Because you know what? 1.00

00:55:03.920 At the end of the fucking day, you're a bitch just like me. 1.00

00:55:07.240 And they don't respect women. 1.00

00:55:09.120 And that includes you. 1.00

00:55:10.780 So you can sell me out all you want, bitch, but they're never going to hold you in higher 1.00

00:55:15.220 regard than me. 1.00

00:55:16.020 That's for fucking sure. 0.99

00:55:17.440 That's a fact. 0.99

00:55:18.480 I got lost.

00:55:19.720 And then I came back.

00:55:22.500 I was lost.

00:55:24.140 But then I got found, honey.

00:55:25.580 That was like amazing grace of 2023.

00:55:28.500 That story was like, as I was once was lost. 0.97

00:55:32.140 And then I got fucking found. 0.98

00:55:33.800 There you go. 1.00

00:55:34.420 Fuck her and him. 1.00

00:55:36.420 Fuck both of them. 1.00

00:55:37.740 It was a lot. 1.00

00:55:40.720 I don't want to go back there.

00:55:42.060 But I'm so glad you came back to present.

00:55:44.200 Yeah, there you go.

00:55:45.060 I literally like love my body.

00:55:46.260 I went back into that room.

00:55:46.740 Your eyes rolling back.

00:55:47.540 I was like, I'm back.

00:55:54.020 To wrap all of this up, what would you say is your best piece of advice for all of my 0.98

00:56:00.200 community if they want to be the best version of their hot slut self? 0.94

00:56:05.020 I've said this before, but I do think it's really important. 0.98

00:56:09.020 And I'll elaborate just a little.

00:56:11.460 The most important relationship you will ever have is the relationship that you have with

00:56:15.420 yourself.

00:56:16.320 Love.

00:56:17.240 Dionne von Furstenberg said that to me when I interviewed her.

00:56:19.760 And I've said that before.

00:56:21.160 People are like, oh, that's actually really selfish, self-centered.

00:56:23.260 Like we know what about community because community is so important.

00:56:25.620 But if you don't have a strong enough relationship with yourself to know when you need support

00:56:30.660 and when you need community, like your awareness of that is based on your relationship with

00:56:37.280 yourself.

00:56:38.120 Yeah.

00:56:38.940 So the clarity in which you're able to communicate with yourself and like understand that we're

00:56:45.400 not the story of our lives that we tell ourselves.

00:56:48.820 Yeah.

00:56:49.440 Like we are like the centered self that like observes the story of our lives.

00:56:53.320 Like, and really to me, like that's what faiths and religions are like trying to say.

00:56:57.420 Yeah.

00:56:57.860 Is it like, you know, it's like your relationship to the universe or like, you know, whatever

00:57:02.140 like your thing is.

00:57:03.600 But like that relationship with that stillness is the most important relationship you will

00:57:08.280 ever have.

00:57:08.860 Absolutely.

00:57:09.040 Because if you don't have a relationship to that, community is important, but it's going

00:57:12.400 to steer you to the wrong community.

00:57:13.680 Yeah.

00:57:13.900 Like if you're not aligned with like your truest self and like your true self, like everything

00:57:19.420 becomes exponentially harder.

00:57:20.540 So like the relationship that you have with yourself is the most important relationship

00:57:23.080 you will ever have.

00:57:24.160 So take care of it.

00:57:25.480 Yeah.

00:57:25.680 I always say like, take care of yourself like you take care of others, like treat yourself

00:57:29.960 the way you treat other people.

00:57:31.440 Like you have so much love to give, give some of it to yourself.

00:57:34.480 Yeah.

00:57:34.720 I think you're worth it.

00:57:35.640 Yeah.

00:57:35.940 And I also will say too, you'll never be meaner to anyone.

00:57:38.480 Like no one could ever be as mean to you as you are to yourself.

00:57:41.360 I don't know. 0.98

00:57:41.660 People are pretty shitty as we've done. 0.95

00:57:43.240 That's true. 0.98

00:57:43.420 I think they're pretty. 0.97

00:57:44.820 And also like people are fucked up to people sometimes. 0.78

00:57:46.880 I think you should even like treat yourself, hold yourself in even higher regard and just 0.93

00:57:51.620 treat others how you would treat yourself.

00:57:53.600 Yeah.

00:57:53.860 You know, like how you want to be treated or whatever.

00:57:55.880 Yeah, absolutely. 0.99

00:57:56.760 Like bust out a 10 commandment or something than this fucking podcast. 0.98

00:58:00.780 Actually, honestly, I think we wrote new 10 commandments here today. 0.99

00:58:03.700 I love that.

00:58:04.340 I would love that for us.

00:58:05.320 And you can find them in whatever device you're listening to this podcast on.

00:58:08.740 You can get it on any streaming platform, especially Spotify.

00:58:11.620 Yes.

00:58:12.000 Especially Spotify.

00:58:12.640 But thank you so much.

00:58:14.880 Thank you.

00:58:15.280 I love you so much.

00:58:16.160 I adore you for inviting me.

00:58:17.680 Oh, my God.

00:58:18.040 Of course.

00:58:18.520 Anytime.

00:58:26.040 I've read a lot of podcasts.

00:58:26.940 I don't know if I've ever heard this much on a podcast.

00:58:28.560 Really?

00:58:29.220 Well, it wasn't my own.

00:58:30.260 I'm honored.

00:58:30.660 Like, I had so much fun.

00:58:32.400 Thank you so much.

00:58:33.440 I'm honored.

00:58:33.900 I love you too.

00:58:34.220 Did we do the TikTok?

00:58:35.680 No.

00:58:36.080 Yeah, we did.

00:58:36.840 I read one.

00:58:37.540 That was so easy.

00:58:38.800 That was like, I thought I was going to learn a dance or something.

00:58:41.780 Oh, no, no.

00:58:42.300 No worries.

00:58:42.760 Thank you all so much for joining me on this episode of the comment section show.

00:58:46.340 Make sure if y'all aren't already, but I know all of you are following Jonathan on

00:58:50.380 literally everything.

00:58:51.380 Make sure you do.

00:58:52.180 Where can everybody find you?

00:58:53.440 Oh, I'm at JVN on the gram, and I'm a visual JVN on TT.

00:58:59.160 But also, if you are into podcasts, you want to get into the beauty space with me, I'm

00:59:03.060 pretty curious.

00:59:03.600 If you like to keep up with the news, honey, curious now.

00:59:06.620 And if you just want to get generally curious with me, then tap that subscribe button on getting

00:59:10.500 curious. 0.81

00:59:11.140 And if you want to get slutty with me, ask JVN. 0.99

00:59:14.580 Period. 0.99

00:59:15.120 Yes.

00:59:15.500 Love that.

00:59:16.180 And JVN hair.

00:59:17.700 Yes.

00:59:18.080 Oh, my God.

00:59:18.360 Well, obviously, it goes without saying.

00:59:19.500 Yeah.

00:59:19.820 JVN hair.

00:59:20.440 Make sure y'all go cop some JVN hair, too, while you're at it. 0.98

00:59:23.140 Do all of it at the same time.

00:59:24.720 Yes, please.

00:59:25.620 Well, don't hurt yourself.

00:59:26.740 Thank you so much for joining me.

00:59:28.160 Thank you to the wonderful Jonathan for joining me.

00:59:30.260 Love you forever.

00:59:30.920 You're amazing.

00:59:31.840 And thank you so much for tuning in.

00:59:33.540 Don't forget, new episodes of the comment section show drop every Wednesday.

00:59:38.040 The video is free on Spotify, but the audio is available to stream anywhere you get podcasts.

00:59:42.980 But I'll see you next week.

00:59:44.120 Bye.

00:59:53.140 Bye.

00:59:54.240 Bye.

00:59:54.660 Bye.

00:59:54.800 Bye.

00:59:55.420 Bye.

00:59:55.700 Bye.

01:00:00.140 Bye.

01:00:01.220 Bye.

01:00:02.340 Bye.

01:00:03.120 Bye.

01:00:03.380 Bye.

01:00:03.900 Bye.

01:00:04.300 Bye.

01:00:06.120 Bye.

01:00:11.000 Bye.

01:00:14.820 Bye.

01:00:15.820 Bye.

01:00:15.920 Bye.

01:00:17.320 Bye.

01:00:18.420 Bye.

01:00:19.400 Bye.

01:00:20.340 Bye.

01:00:21.240 Bye.

The Comment Section with Drew Afualo - September 20, 2023

HOW TO BE A HOT SLUT Ft. Jonathan Van Ness ｜ The Comment Section Ep. 84

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