In this episode, we are joined by John Carpe, a constitutional lawyer and founder of the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms (JCCF), to talk about how the JCCF came to be and what it does to fight for freedom in Canada.
00:00:00.000It's a chilling effect that makes it hard to engage in open, honest, healthy debate because it's, it's possible if depending on how the, depending on the wording of the law, the wording of the law might allow somebody to say that, uh, there's only 37, uh, uh, bodies of, of murder children that are buried there and not 215.
00:00:26.340And so you got this great freedom to go ahead and make the argument for 37, but even if the law is worded in such a way that you can get away with, uh, saying 37 bodies instead of 215 bodies is still a chilling effect.
00:00:39.620People are not even gonna say that there's only 37 bodies and they're certainly not gonna feel free to say that it's unlikely that there's any children and argue these arguments have been put forward by people because we, we still have a lot of free speech left in Canada.
00:00:54.660that there probably aren't any children buried there because there's no children reported missing.
00:01:01.040Uh, there, there's no complaints of parents on file about, uh, you know, their, their child not coming back home in June or whatever the end of the school year was.
00:01:10.860So the only way to find out if there's bodies there is to do an excavation.
00:01:24.660Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the Critical Compass.
00:01:38.880My name is Mike, and this is my co-host James, and we are very happy to be joined today by Mr. John Carpe,
00:01:44.740a constitutional lawyer and, uh, one of the founders of the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms.
00:01:51.360Uh, about a 14-year-old institution, uh, uh, Mr. Carpe, before we get into it, why don't you give us a brief, uh, overview, overview of, uh, how you ended up where you are today, how the JCCF did, and, uh, and a little bit about your story.
00:02:07.500So the Justice Center defends freedom in Canada.
00:02:10.340We fight, uh, for freedom in the courts of law and in the court of public opinion, in the courts of law in the past, uh, 14, 15 years that we've been in existence, we have fought for and continue to fight for the freedoms of expression, conscience, religion, association, peaceful assembly, mobility, and travel, uh, the right to life, liberty, and security of the person,
00:02:36.340which includes a right to bodily autonomy, which includes a right to not get pressured or forced or coerced into, uh, a medical treatment that you might not want.
00:02:46.340So we've gone to bat for the rights of individuals to not get injected with the, uh, COVID vaccine.
00:02:54.340We have fought for the rights of parents to have, be able to raise and educate their own children as they deem best.
00:03:01.340Uh, not necessarily as some political activists might deem best.
00:03:06.340Uh, we're on the front lines of fighting the harms of transgender ideology.
00:03:12.340One of our court cases is to defend the rights of women in federal prisons to not be subjected to male inmates who get into women's prisons by claiming to be a woman.
00:03:25.340Um, we have, uh, we're, we have defended or currently defending Chris Barber, uh, who's co-accused with Tamara Leach, uh, over there.
00:03:35.340Uh, participation in the peaceful freedom convoy in Ottawa.
00:03:40.340Uh, we had lawyers on the ground in Ottawa in, uh, February of 2022 to help the truckers and provide legal advice.
00:03:48.340Uh, the justice center was the only civil liberties group in Canada to call for an end to lockdowns.
00:03:55.340Uh, other civil liberties groups thought that some of the rules went a bit too far, but they were fundamentally not opposed to the whole lockdowns.
00:04:03.340The whole lockdowns and, and, and vaccine passports.
00:04:06.340Uh, so we've grown a lot since, uh, since lockdowns and vaccine passports.
00:04:12.340And then today we, we are still in the trenches.
00:04:16.340We've got, uh, nine lawyers in BC, Alberta, uh, Ontario, Quebec taking on cases in, I think every province or maybe we're missing PEI or, you know, but, uh, we, we've got cases all over Canada.
00:04:35.340Uh, so what, what I'm hearing is that you're very popular with the liberal, liberal government and media of this country.
00:04:41.340Oh, the media love me, you know, they just, uh, they just can't write enough positive stories about the justice center and, uh, and John Carpe, especially the CBC.
00:04:51.340They get the most government money more, more than the other media.
00:04:54.340So they're, they just love the justice center.
00:04:59.340So it seems like you're feeling very much a, uh, a necessary checks and balance against the system.
00:05:07.340And as we see more and more, as we see this line get pushed, your need, like your, your role expands because there's more things to push back upon.
00:05:19.340So it makes sense that you have more and more lawyers.
00:05:22.340Like you've been fairly busy since 2020 because the most egregious examples of this emerged in the last five years.
00:05:30.340Before that, maybe we had more isolated examples or like on campus, maybe you have some free speech examples, but now these are things that the average person can't ignore.
00:05:43.340It's very transparent to a lot of people.
00:05:46.340And we need the, we need these checks and balances.
00:05:49.340We've had, I would say a gradual decline in respect for the free society in the past 40, 50, 60 years.
00:05:58.340It used to be pretty obvious in 1945 at the end of world war II, we had just fought a war against Nazi Germany and a fascist Italy, Imperial Japan.
00:06:08.340We went on to fight and eventually win a cold war with the communists who were in power in the Soviet union.
00:06:15.340And what all these different regimes had in common is that they did not have freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of conscience, parliamentary democracy, an open society, a free society debate on issues, rights of citizens when they are accused of a crime.
00:06:34.340So a right to, you know, a fair hearing and a right to a lawyer and a right to not have a confession extracted out of you by torture.
00:06:44.340All of these rights and freedoms, you know, we, in 1945 at the end of world war II, every Canadian of every age understood that the free society is superior to tyranny.
00:06:58.340Tyranny, whether it's a Nazi tyranny or a communist tyranny or a theocratic tyranny, you know, you've got the exterior coding can be very different.
00:07:09.340It can be any, any color of the rainbow.
00:07:11.340Right. But fundamentally you've got tyranny is a disrespect for human rights.
00:07:16.340And so it used to be that everybody in Canada understood that, but I gradually, uh, because history is not taught in the school system, uh, judge, I mean, there's very little of it left.
00:07:28.340Okay. So it's been declining every decade.
00:07:31.340There's less and less and less history that's being taught and people who are ignorant of history can be persuaded of anything.
00:07:38.340And so when the lockdowns were imposed and these were blatant violations of our freedom of association, if it's illegal to have Christmas dinner with your parents, that's a violation of your freedom of association.
00:07:50.340Uh, the, and the government's admitted in court when the justice center, uh, when our court actions, when we were suing governments, the governments admitted in court quite freely that yes, these lockdowns were violations of charter rights and freedoms.
00:08:05.340And so the, but the, the lack, the level of respect has, has gone downhill.
00:08:13.340And so when these violations of charter rights and freedoms were imposed on Canadians, a lot of Canadians just shrugged their shoulders and said, oh, well, you know, that's okay.
00:08:21.340Like they didn't really care, uh, about it being fundamental freedoms that were being violated.
00:08:27.340So this is where we're at in the country today.
00:08:30.340And, uh, things might have to get a bit worse before enough people wake up to fight back hard enough to restore the freedoms that we've lost.
00:08:40.340There's a, you may be familiar with this.
00:08:42.340Uh, he's a, he's a psychologist and an economist, I believe, Matthias Desmet.
00:08:50.340So his, his theory about how mass formations, um, generally, I think, I believe the number is they only take about 15 to 20% of a population.
00:08:59.340To believe something so strongly that they can start a mass formation in your opinion.
00:09:04.340Um, what, I don't, I don't know if you can put a number on this, but what's your feeling on the percentage of people in Canada who truly don't seem to care about their fundamental freedoms?
00:09:16.340Is it, is it more of a, of a manufactured media sort of narrative or do people fundamentally just, are they just too lax to really, they're too kind of lazy to care about their, their freedoms?
00:09:26.340It's, it's, you know, it's such a good question.
00:09:30.340It would be, you would need to do some pretty comprehensive polling.
00:09:35.340And I think you might see different responses to different kinds of freedoms.
00:09:38.340So you might see, um, that a lot of Canadians have, um, a lot of appreciation for freedom of expression.
00:09:48.340But then some of those same people that are strong on freedom of expression, they might not care if they get confined to a 15 minute prison district or a 15 minute city in order to save the planet from the impending climate Holocaust.
00:10:02.340You know, so you might have some people that, that are, uh, I, I know some people were strong, strongly in favor of religious freedom, uh, generally, but when the government shut down churches and said, you know, you can't worship, which was, which happened in British Columbia and, and on a, on a smaller scale elsewhere.
00:10:22.340Some of those same people who pre 2020 were strong believers in religious freedom, they also supported lockdowns.
00:10:30.340So it's a little bit all over the map.
00:10:32.340Uh, you used to have people who, uh, called themselves pro choice and said that the right to bodily autonomy includes the right to abortion.
00:10:41.340And then a lot of those same people, they were fanatical, like, oh yeah, everybody's got to get injected.
00:10:47.340And if you don't get injected, well, uh, too bad, you're, you're going to be a second class citizen.
00:11:53.340You don't have to give them your wallet.
00:11:55.340You can test them and see whether they're serious or not about blowing your brains out.
00:12:00.340So it's technically true that yes, Canadians who chose not to get injected, technically it's true that yes, they did have a choice to get injected or get kicked out of university, lose their job, lose their ability to travel.
00:12:17.340Um, but very disingenuous the way that these people were kind of pounding the table saying you have a choice when in fact it was the pressure and the coercion that removed that choice.
00:12:31.340So I think the thing that underpins this is coercion feels necessary if you wrap it up in moral camouflage.
00:12:40.340So they'll say that our rights and freedoms, well, okay, we hold those dear, but the collective good is essential.
00:12:49.340And what that actually means depends who's defining the collective good.
00:12:53.340So that's open to manipulation, let it be from politicians or the media.
00:12:58.340And as soon as you wrap it in moral camouflage, the coercion is a necessity because it's a threat to the collective good.
00:13:08.340It's a threat to other people's expression.
00:13:11.340So let's say if we point to the, um, even just the, like the trans, um, issue right now, we're saying, well, we're protecting their freedom of expression because if you deny their identity, you're denying their expression.
00:13:30.340And it's almost like they're inverting what these lines actually mean and they're weaponizing the, like inverting the spirit of the law and weaponizing it to, to push these ideas forward, using coercion to protect the vulnerable in that sense.
00:13:53.340That's a perfect example because freedom of expression could mean that any of the three of us, if we wanted to put on.
00:13:59.340Uh, lipstick and other makeup and a wig and wear a dress and, and say that we're women, you know, part of freedom of expression would be is like, well, okay, you go ahead and do that.
00:14:11.340But if I take that a step further and I demand that other people call me a woman.
00:14:16.340Now this is, this becomes core speech.
00:14:19.340It's a perversion of free expression, right?
00:14:21.340Free expression could mean that a guy can, uh, dress up like a woman, act like a woman, call himself a woman.
00:14:30.340You're not imposing that on others, but when you demand that other people must refer to you.
00:14:36.340Uh, and, and this is a serious problem in certainly in Ontario, Manitoba, other places where you've got human rights legislation gets twisted into.
00:14:44.340Uh, that, that, that there, there's this obligation to say things that you disagree with.
00:14:52.340So you, you lose the freedom to, uh, to be able to look at a guy with the makeup and the dress and to say, well, I'm not going to refer to you as ma'am.
00:15:04.340You know, because I don't want to because, or whatever, right?
00:15:14.340That's, that was a, you know, one of the most fundamental points that I don't know if people accept it now and they've moved on to other arguments.
00:15:21.340But I remember this being such a mind blowing thing in like 2016, 2017, when Jordan Peterson was really actively fighting this, when he was explaining how there's a difference between a band speech and compelled speech, because that's, it's a fundamentally different ask that is being made of you.
00:15:43.340So censorship would be that if, if you say that there's too many immigrants coming into Canada and the government says, well, that's racist.
00:15:50.340So we're going to shut you up and, you know, we're going to file a human rights prosecution against you and whatever.
00:15:58.340You're not allowed to say such and such, but also the, a different form of violating free expression is compelled speech, where the law says that.
00:16:08.340If a dude calls himself a woman, you also must speak or write, you know, if you're typing an email or if you're speaking to him or speaking about him, you must, uh, refer to this guy as a woman.
00:16:23.340Uh, you see it on a minor scale, um, with the Ontario law society a few years ago required every lawyer in Ontario had to sign a statement of principles saying that they personally supported and would promote.
00:16:38.340These weren't the exact words, but the gist of it was you would personally promote, uh, equity, diversity, inclusion, and this is coerced speech.
00:16:49.340Like your first, there might be people who say, Hey, you know, I don't believe in equity, diversity, inclusion, or I do believe it, but I, I believe it in a very different way than what you do.
00:16:59.340And so, um, Canada summer jobs, uh, one of the justice centers cases was, um, uh, this is about six years ago.
00:17:09.340The government said in order to be eligible for a Canada summer jobs grant, a small business or a charity needs to sign a statement saying that they support abortion or they support pro-choice or they support.
00:17:22.340I don't know what the wording was, but you had to, you had to tick off this box to say, yes, we, as a church, a charity, a small business, uh, we believe in a woman's right to choose.
00:17:53.340So like, let it be these professional societies, they act as they, they are enforcing ideology in their own ways and they can bully anybody in like, let it be nurses, let it be lawyers, let it be engineers.
00:18:09.340Like we're seeing some industries get maybe a little bit more intertwined with the ideology than others.
00:18:15.340Like, but it eventually, uh, like appears in, in pretty much all these societies.
00:18:22.340I, I did want to, um, ask you specifically, where have you seen, like, there's, there's been some discussion about the human rights tribunals being these pseudo courts.
00:18:35.340And they've kind of got a strange setup and they're not, they don't have the exact same structure as a court of law and they're not staffed in the same way.
00:19:05.340Like, uh, what is that doing to actually ensure people's fundamental rights and freedoms?
00:19:11.340Well, they've, they've just gone completely woke.
00:19:14.340And I think we're at a point where they're doing more harm than good.
00:19:17.340Uh, we defended, uh, women, we provided lawyers for women in British Columbia who were subjected to the harassment of a person.
00:19:25.340A person who at that time had the name of Jonathan Yaniv.
00:19:29.340Uh, Jonathan Yaniv now goes by the name Jessica Simpson.
00:19:33.340And, uh, Jonathan Yaniv was, I don't know, transgender, trans identifying, whatever, but, uh, he had his male parts intact and he would phone up these Brazilian bikini wax.
00:19:47.340Uh, he would phone up women who provided a Brazilian bikini wax to women.
00:20:30.340They wrote him a check to settle the complaint.
00:20:33.340And so he was harassing and intimidating these women with these human rights complaints.
00:20:38.340One of the women, uh, was turned down by, and I, I don't remember where the 17 law firms or 13 law firms, but it was, there was a whole bunch of law firms said, oh, we're not going to take on your case.
00:20:51.340We're terrified of being called transphobic.
00:20:53.340And so the justice center is not terrified of being called any names.
00:20:59.340I say, call me whatever you want, as long as it's not late for dinner.
00:21:03.340And, um, so we took on these cases and we were successful in defending these women against Yaniv, whose Twitter handle, by the way, was wax my balls.
00:21:14.340And, um, we also defended, um, Canada galaxy beauty pageant, uh, based in Mississauga, Ontario.
00:21:23.340Uh, Yaniv filed a complaint there because the beauty pageant refused to allow Yaniv.
00:21:31.340Now, Jessica Simpson, uh, Jessica Simpson had male parts, twig and berries and wanted to get into the change room with women and girls as young as six years old.
00:21:44.340And so we, it was good that we defeated Yaniv's claim.
00:21:50.340The scary thing was it was defeated on procedural grounds because Yaniv or Jessica Simpson had been too late in meeting various deadlines for, you know, filing evidence and filing this, filing that.
00:22:05.340And so the human rights tribunal got fed up with, with all the delays and complaint was dismissed on procedural grounds.
00:22:12.340Had this gone to a real hearing, I'm not confident that the human rights tribunal in Ontario would have ruled in favor of the beauty pageant.
00:22:20.340Uh, I think there's a good chance they would have ruled in favor of Jessica Simpson, uh, having access to, uh, girls change room.
00:22:28.340That's, that's so, yeah, that's very frightening to think of.
00:22:31.340I, I often wonder, and I don't know, maybe you can shed some light based on your experience, but like, you know, we look at these cases, we talk about them all the time.
00:22:39.340And, and we think like looking at these cases, do these people on these boards or these, these, you know, kangaroo human rights tribunal courts, like, do they not have kids or grandkids?
00:22:50.740Like, do they not know like how they personally would react in their own lives?
00:22:54.880Like, is it, is it a case of sort of like what you said in, in, in a related, you know, they're just, they're so afraid of being called transphobic or being labeled as this or that, that they're willing to vote against, against their own personal beliefs because of it.
00:23:09.380Now, well, I wonder, you know, if, if, uh, if former prime minister Trudeau had a sister in, uh, women's prison, federal prison, federal penitentiary for women, uh, would he have the same view on allowing men to transfer into women's prisons?
00:23:29.380Uh, and the same goes for every member of parliament, uh, it was the liberal government of the day and the current liberal government has not changed this policy.
00:23:39.380So like today, if you're, um, by the way, the, the, the men that are transferring into women's prisons, 90% of them are, uh, have been convicted either of a violent crime or a sexual crime or both.
00:24:00.380And if they say I identify as a woman, then, uh, you know, I'm, I'm sure that they don't get transferred the same day.
00:24:09.380It might take a few days, a few weeks for the paperwork, you know, but they can, they can get transferred into a women's prison just by saying they identify as a woman.
00:24:17.380And yeah, I wonder like people who support this, you know, how would you feel if your mother, your aunt, your daughter, your grandmother, uh, your sister, your niece was in a federal prison and ended up getting raped by a male prisoner who got in there.
00:24:35.380Uh, by saying that, that he identified as a woman.
00:25:00.380You know, if in 2019 before lockdowns, if you had asked a hundred doctors, is it possible to stop the spread of a virus?
00:25:08.380They would have said, no, uh, you could protect the vulnerable and maybe set up, uh, really high, uh, safety protocols around nursing homes where people are the most vulnerable, but you can't stop a virus from spreading throughout society.
00:25:31.380And they would have, uh, uh, uh, thought about, talked about the harms of lockdowns, uh, because the Canadian death rates are up.
00:25:39.380But yeah, you know, people are there when they're, when they're in the, in the midst of that ideology, they're, they're not really thinking no.
00:25:48.380So I think it stems from, uh, as things become more complex, we offload a lot of our thinking to experts and we get hyper specialization.
00:25:58.380So we have less and less people that are confident, even like exploring a little bit in different areas that, that seems like, well, it's outside of my expertise.
00:26:07.380Who am I to say anything about a cloth mask, but you can vape and you can see it breathing out through like the vape coming through the cloth mask.
00:26:16.380Cloth mask, you can demonstrate these things pretty easily and make some educated guesses on the effectiveness of that.
00:26:24.380But as people export to experts, I feel like their level of thinking gets wrapped up in slogans.
00:26:33.380So you're easily controlled by like, well, if it just reduces the spread a little bit and these things, yeah, it prevents inquiry.
00:26:44.380These, and it keeps everything on the surface level.
00:26:46.380Cause you're not diving into the full ideas you've kept at surface level and you're like, well, I can't go any further.
00:26:52.380They put their own mental roadblock and then they just let it be handled by the experts.
00:26:57.380And I think it doesn't matter if it's COVID.
00:27:01.380I don't, it doesn't matter if it's like the gender debate.
00:27:04.380They're like, well, I'm, I didn't study.
00:27:07.380Like, I can't speak about what a woman is because I didn't study gender.
00:27:12.380Cause you don't have a biology degree.
00:27:13.380I don't have a biology degree or I didn't study gender studies for four years.
00:27:19.380Therefore, well, I have to leave it to the experts.
00:28:01.380Uh, we don't, we don't need a biology degree.
00:28:03.380We don't need to be a zoologist or, or, or a veterinarian or, or whatever.
00:28:08.380And it is, it is a pretty scary trend.
00:28:11.380Um, I think the next, the future waves of attacks on our rights and freedoms are going to likely be under the banner of saving the world from the, uh, impending climate Holocaust.
00:28:26.380And we're all going to burn to a crisp unless we, uh, we, the people, not the elites, but as we, the people have to stop driving our cars and we have to, you know, uh, live in these 15 minute prison districts or 15 minute cities where you can walk everywhere within 15 minutes.
00:28:44.380And we don't have to drive our cars and, and so on and so forth.
00:28:48.380And, um, you know, a lot of people will buy into that because the, the, the so-called experts, uh, who typically will not debate, they will denounce their opponents as anti-science Neanderthals.
00:29:00.380I see a lot of the same dynamic with the, with the climate issue where you've got people who, you know, they won't answer a tough question.
00:29:10.380Like if, if mankind controls the climate, if that's true, how do you explain the medieval optimal when, you know, from the years 900 to 1100, the world's climate was much, much warmer than what it is now.
00:29:23.380And mankind thrived and we had vineyards in England and we had olives growing in Germany.
00:29:29.380And we, you know, the, the crops were abundant and, and mankind was thriving when the world was a lot warmer, but nobody was driving cars.
00:29:37.380So how did you get that, uh, um, increase in the temperature and then decrease and then heading into mini ice age in the 1600s?
00:29:46.380See, that's a question I would love to ask somebody who believes that mankind controls the weather.
00:29:52.380I'd like to ask, well, how do you explain just the past 2000 years, or even go back millions as well, but, but even the past two thousand years,
00:29:58.380how do you explain, you know, and you don't get debate.
00:30:03.380What you get told is, well, you're, you're, you're a climate Holocaust denier.
00:30:13.380That's trying to borrow the same kind of shame of somebody denying a Holocaust and they're just applying it to these new things to shut down discussion.
00:30:23.380Yeah, there's a, there's a modern day philosopher.
00:30:28.380We often, uh, bring up on the show, Peter Boghossian.
00:30:31.380I'm not sure if you're familiar with him.
00:30:32.380Um, he, uh, he's talked about what he calls a substitution hypothesis.
00:30:37.380And, uh, and so his, the, the idea is that as the, uh, global and specifically in the West, as the Western levels of, uh, adherence to religion drops, uh, we see an increase, uh, uh, uh, uh, counter increase in the adherence to these sorts of, uh, you know, climate, uh, catastrophe, uh, your gender ideologue or your, you know, things like veganism, stuff that you can identify with.
00:31:06.380As a, you know, as a, on a level that normally would in your brain be filled by religion, you substitute it for some of these ideologies that are totally like, but you treat it like a religion.
00:31:17.380And that's why people react as if you were blaspheming against their religion when you talk about these things.
00:31:26.380Um, well, it certainly was treated like, like blasphemy.
00:31:31.380I mean, if you said that, uh, it was blasphemy to say that the, uh, COVID was a bad annual flu statistics, Canada backs it up.
00:31:43.380If you look at the death rates, uh, if you look at total death rates in Canada, uh, there was a, the, the jump from 2019 pre COVID to 2020 COVID's first year, that jump was certainly bigger.
00:31:56.380A little bit bigger than the previous jumps the last few years, but, um, it wasn't vaguely or remotely close to the catastrophic predictions that, uh, Neil Ferguson of Imperial College London.
00:32:41.380And, and the young, and it's just like, no, it was, uh, uh, definitely a serious threat to less than 1% of the population.
00:32:51.380And there were, uh, there were some seniors who died who, you know, but for COVID they might've lived for another three, six, nine months, or in some cases another year or two or three.
00:33:02.380But it didn't have a big impact on population mortality at all.
00:33:06.380And yet the lockdown deaths, um, and if you want to talk about a report that we've just released, the lockdown deaths are, are primarily amongst younger Canadians against the under 45 crowd of people.
00:33:20.380where the COVID deaths are, uh, less than 1% of Canadians under the age of 45.
00:33:49.380So three, three different, uh, three different things.
00:33:53.380First of all, this is all based on Statistics Canada data.
00:33:56.380So anybody who disagrees with the report, I say, okay, fine, uh, roll up your sleeves, get to work and spend many hours going through the Stats Canada data and tell us how and why our interpretation is wrong.
00:34:11.380I think it would be great if somebody rolled up their sleeves and did the hard work that our research, uh, primarily Ben Clausen, there's one researcher, but there's other people involved as well.
00:34:22.380According to Statistics Canada, COVID deaths went up after more than 80% of the Canadian population got two or more injections.
00:34:32.380The COVID deaths went up from 16,000 in 2020 before the vaccine to 20,000 in 2022 after the vaccine.
00:35:36.380So that accounts for a little bit, but this, this jump is more than three times as much as population growth.
00:35:44.380Um, so this is, this is stats Canada saying there's more, 30% more younger Canadians are dying after lockdowns and vaccine, uh, the vaccines, uh, and it's not COVID deaths.
00:35:59.380And so I, I would guess without having seen the report, that's going to be things like, uh, alcoholism related disease.
00:36:06.380That's going to be things like, uh, male suicide, probably females side as well.
00:36:11.380Other like socially, uh, socially predicated types of, uh, mortality.
00:36:16.380Could also be like some sudden death and those get washed out.
00:36:21.380So those are hard to like pin down without granular data.
00:37:41.380So even today, 2025, we are past the lockdowns.
00:37:45.380We're past the mandatory vaccinations, but we still have 55% more Canadians dying of drug overdoses than in the pre COVID years of, um, the, the 2019, 2018, 2017.
00:38:28.380So you have a large group of healthy working people who, if that unemployment jumps up, that there's a host.
00:38:37.380There's a whole range of ways that mortality goes up in them, let it be alcohol or drug abuse or suicide, that all, like that all increases.
00:38:47.380So you've turned a, a non at risk group into a at risk group in another way through these policies.
00:38:58.380I mean, this is, you get back to Matthias Desmet and the, uh, the, the, the psychosis.
00:39:03.380Uh, there was medical research pre 2020 medical literature, which I think it's safe to assume was not biased for or against lockdowns.
00:39:14.380I may, it might've had other biases in there.
00:39:16.380Nothing's totally unbiased, but the medical literature pre lockdowns, uh, made it very clear that in-person contact was essential to mental and physical wellbeing.
00:39:28.380And so there's abundant research showing that if, if you are isolated and your only contact with people is by, by phone or zoom, right?
00:39:37.380You're not doing in-person interactions.
00:39:39.380You have poor health and a shorter life expectancy.
00:39:43.380It's bad for you to be connecting with people only by phone and zoom.
00:39:49.380You know, we need, we need in-person contacts.
00:40:46.380He, um, he says, well, Kevin Bardosh was not, uh, an epidemiologist.
00:40:51.380So we're going to not listen to anything he has to say, even though his, uh, uh, evidence had been admitted and he was recognized as an expert.
00:41:00.380The judge didn't even go through his report and try to refute what was in the report.
00:41:08.380The, uh, the gateway Bible chapel case where the judge, he has before him a report from the former chief medical officer of Manitoba.
00:41:18.380Dr. Joel Kettner just eviscerates the government's case for lockdowns and explains why they're causing more harm than good, uh, on and on and on.
00:41:28.380And, uh, the judge doesn't even mention this report, right?
00:41:34.380So this report eviscerates the Manitoba government's case for lockdowns.
00:41:38.380It was open to the judge to explain why the report was wrong.
00:41:42.380The judge just doesn't mention the report at all in his court ruling.
00:41:47.380So this is, uh, this is a challenge we're facing too, that, that the, uh, and I say, I, I call the book corrupted by fear because that's the, um, it's, um, the judges as well as the media, the medical establishment, the legal profession, everybody's corrupted by fear.
00:42:05.380And so they're not thinking there's a fear element.
00:42:09.380And then there's also, there are some who they believe their position is so moral.
00:42:15.380Like it's a obvious moral truth that engaging with the opposite side would be immoral at that point.
00:42:23.380So they're like, we can't even give them any error.
00:42:26.380That's why you don't see, um, like, you, you don't see people on the right being invited to these left leaning, like, uh, spots on CPC or they, they get blacklisted essentially over the time because they, they get put in this kind of category.
00:42:45.380Well, you have the wrong views and like, since our position's so morally obvious, only a bad person would believe these wrong ideas.
00:42:56.620Therefore we, we don't have to treat you like we would anybody else on our side.
00:43:01.780Yeah. And, and John, just to, just to piggyback on that, and maybe you can tell us your experience about this, cause I'm sure you have lots.
00:43:09.100We've talked about this on the show where what we've noticed, uh, is that there's a, there's a fundamental difference between how the left views the right and how the right views the left tip tip, tip, generally speaking, how a conservative will view a liberal and vice versa.
00:43:21.680And, and generally speaking, conservatives, libertarians tend to view liberals and leftists as mostly just wrong, like maybe gullible, maybe silly, maybe naive, like these types of, yeah, maybe stupid, these types of words, but the, by and large, the left and liberals tend to view conservatives and libertarians as not just wrong or misguided, but actually as evil.
00:43:45.240And you can't have a conversation, and you can't have a conversation with somebody who you believe is evil.
00:43:54.160That is, that's a whole other level of interaction that people have that doesn't allow itself to be, uh, like you can't chat that out, you know, and, and maybe you could speak a little bit to your experience with that and some of the things that have been thrown your way.
00:44:07.000Well, let me preface, uh, David Suzuki, uh, this is, I can't remember this two, four, six years ago, but it, it was media reported that he, he said that if you, uh, don't embrace his thesis of the, uh, impending climate Holocaust, and we're all going to burn to a crisp and we need to, uh, we need to embrace poverty, which is what you get.
00:44:32.400If you cut off the, the oil and gas and try to run the economy on, on windmills and, and, and solar panels, you get poverty, massive poverty, but you know, we need to all embrace poverty to avoid the climate catastrophe, blah, blah, blah.
00:44:47.480And anybody who disagrees with that, they, they should be prosecuted.
00:45:01.600I don't know if she's still an MP today or not, but she said that the, uh, residential school denialism, uh, should be criminalized so that you cannot speak.
00:45:15.400Uh, you know, you cannot question, for example, the entirely unsupported claim, uh, by the Canloops Indian band saying that they found the bodies of 215 children.
00:45:25.720They've been given millions or at least large sums of money to do an excavation, which is the only way to actually determine whether bodies are buried there or not.