Discrimination Against White Men EXPOSED, DEI Narrative COLLAPSES ft. Amber Duke
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
181.28127
Summary
J.D. Vance's piece about diversity and equal pay for women and non-whites is one of the most widely read pieces of journalism in recent memory, and it's getting a lot of traction online. Today, we re talking about how much better things got.
Transcript
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You've probably seen a lot of chatter about DEI on the timeline,
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especially, and this is really particularly strange,
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is you're seeing condemnation of it from people who previously would lambast you for complaining about it.
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I don't know if you've had the chance to read the piece yet,
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it was probably one of the biggest pieces of all time.
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It had like 6 million views on just one tweet regarding it.
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It was this gentleman, Jacob Savage, who he was scalping tickets in Los Angeles.
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And he had done this entire write-up doing a deep dive on some of the data regarding these DEI practices in Hollywood
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and how they've had this sort of oppressive effect on white men specifically.
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He wrote here, this is a specific instance of some data that he presented.
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In 2011, the year I moved to Los Angeles, white men were 48% of lower-level TV writers.
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Keep in mind, white men still make up about 35% of the country, 30, 35% of the country.
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The Atlantic's editorial staff went from 53% male and 89% white in 2013 to 36% male and 66% white.
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White men fell from 39% of tenure track positions in the humanities at Harvard in 2014 to 18% in 2023.
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The year DEI became institutionalized across American life.
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A lot of people think DEI is a lame diversity seminars or racial slogans at NFL games.
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In reality, it was a deliberate program of discrimination, primarily against white men.
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This is an incredible piece that describes the evil of DEI and its consequences.
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Ann Coulter pointed out this data point, obviously, that I just read.
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That 14.6% of tenure track assistant professors hired at Yale had been white American men.
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And the humanities, the number was just 6 out of 76.
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I mean, there's no other calculation to make than just like full-blown hatred for white men.
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This poster here, Lindy Capital, he posted some graphs showing the dramatic drops among white men in a lot of these institutions.
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And he outlines, obviously, I'm running a little bit out of time here, but he outlines, obviously, a lot of the incentive structures that these companies have had to basically root out white men and favor women and non-whites.
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And if they reached their goal, they received an interest rate discount on their debt by banks.
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This wasn't just like a conscious, like philosophical movement.
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There was legitimate financial interests at play in conducting this rooting out.
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We're being punished for success, suffering for success, if you will.
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So with that, I will bring in Amber, and we're going to see what she has to say.
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Can you give the people a quick intro, who you are and what you do?
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I'm also the Friday co-host of Rising at the Hill and co-host of Free Media at Reason.
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And I wanted to bring you on to discuss, obviously, this piece that everyone is talking about.
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I mean, from J.D. Vance to Milo to Ann Coulter, everyone is jumping on this piece,
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and they're really scandalized by the findings.
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Obviously, the author, Jacob Savage, sort of combed through all of this data
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regarding the DEI practices specifically in Hollywood,
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the implications that's had on the market at large,
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but also like personal anecdotes from him and his friends on how this is impacting them.
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I wanted to get your reaction to that piece, what your takeaway was,
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and broadly what you think this means for the movement, or really America as a whole,
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I think the numbers is really what was so shocking.
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They saw this really concerted push from left-wing activists to not just have equal representation,
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but actually over-representation by minority groups in various industries,
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But I don't think anyone realized just how bad it really was,
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People keep asking, why are young men turning right-wing?
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Why are they seemingly open to radicalization and extremism?
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Well, maybe it's because you don't let them have jobs.
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And just to walk through some of these numbers, because they really are so stunning,
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in the media, he talks about the Atlantic, which is the sort of left-wing, long-form, profile-type outlet.
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Since 2020, nearly two-thirds of the hires have been women, along with nearly 50% of people of color.
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And now, just as a reminder, white men make up about 30% to 35% of the population,
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In 2024, the Atlantic announced that three-quarters of editorial hires in the past year
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So if you're a boomer white guy, right, this is the point the piece makes.
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You're probably not going to get outright fired.
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Maybe your advancement will be stunted a little bit in whatever industry you're in.
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But if you're a young Gen X to a Zoomer, you are completely being overlooked for these positions.
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And it's clearly not the case, which was, this is the common left-wing argument about DEI-Tate,
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is that the problem was not that they didn't want meritocracy.
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It's that people who were meritorious but were people of color were being overlooked
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The fact that they are now overhiring to such a massive extent clearly demonstrates that that's not true.
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I mean, are we really supposed to believe that this 69% of people of color,
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despite being such a minuscule part of the population,
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are better qualified for those roles than the 35% of white men or the 65% of white people in America?
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I mean, there's so much to get into in this piece because I think there's also some valid criticism
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coming from people on the right of some aspects of the piece.
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But I think overall, again, it has this effect where, sort of like the Atlantic has done for years
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with their long-form concept, I think Compact is sort of supplanting them in many ways
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because they're putting this on people's kitchen tables.
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They're laying out the data and people are saying,
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wow, you know, I've heard people complaining about this, but I didn't realize how bad things were.
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And I think that point that you made is very, very salient, which is, for kind of layman's terms,
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you're seeing ladder pulling from a lot of these older guys where, like you said,
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a lot of these boomers were sort of grandfathered into this.
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They knew that they had job security, but they were pulling the ladder up from people
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that came from the same background as they were because for a variety of reasons,
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the incentive structures all bended towards hiring minorities, hiring women,
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various other groups that were not like straight white men.
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And so that's, I think, the really sinister part of all of this is that you're seeing these,
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again, these straight white guys, these conventional hires that were in the boomer generation
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And this is something that was really endemic to the DEI takeover.
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For example, in academia, you would see that these white male university presidents
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were so terrified of having protests on campus, of having students camp out in the president's office,
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that they would just acquiesce to whatever demands that they had.
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I mean, I remember at Georgetown, when it was discovered that the university had sold slaves
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at one point in its history in order to save the university from bankruptcy, one of the responses
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from student activist groups, one of the demands that they made was that the university needed
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to make sure that new professors who were hired were like 50 percent people of color or something
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And I went and looked at the actual racial breakdown, the racial demographics of professors at Georgetown
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And it turned out that people of color were actually already overrepresented as a portion of the population
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So they were actually asking to make an overrepresentation problem worse
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in response to this, you know, hundreds of years old controversy.
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And the people at the top, you know, regardless of whether it was white men or otherwise, were
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They didn't want to have to deal with the annoyance of having student protesters running
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So they just completely abdicated leadership and responsibility for their institutions.
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Yeah, yeah, I mean, because that's that seemed to be the main sort of I don't know if gripe
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because I think everyone is acknowledging this is a good piece and this was good for
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But one thing people pointed out is that pretty much all of the blame was laid at the feet
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And it wasn't addressed enough was the action and the activism of young women and ethnic minorities,
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because in a lot of ways, I don't think it's necessarily fair to say I'm sure some of them
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were, but I don't think it's fair to say that all these boomers were just complete
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ideologues that wanted to ensure that young white guys were completely locked out of the
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I think a lot of them were, like you alluded to, were reacting out of fear.
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And there was a lot of cowardice to not do the right thing because they were feeling threatened.
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They felt like their position of standing might be threatened if they didn't acquiesce
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to this activist insurgency that was occurring at the bottom levels.
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And so in a lot of ways, again, a lot of the blame is laid at their feet because ultimately
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they were the ones that refused to stand up for what was right.
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They displayed immense cowardice, but a lot of them were just reacting to this activist
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base that I think a lot of people are a little too afraid to critique in addition to the larger
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This was not an ideological move by the people at the top.
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And it definitely speaks to, I think, the just immense abdication of responsibility, as I said,
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that they were willing to completely change institutional cultures for the sake of basically
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I talk about a lot of these issues in the media in terms of the shift towards really basically
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trying to over-empathize with the feelings of young staffers who are making ridiculous
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And we would see in these media outlets that a lot of the people who were complaining about
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editorial decisions that were supposedly racist or not sympathetic enough to LGBT rights, that
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these people were not even in the editorial process.
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It was people like cartoonists or people who worked in marketing.
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These were not people who were even on editorial staff.
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And so that's another element here that I think needs to be explored in the media and
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Hollywood space, is that a lot of this pressure comes from union leadership as well.
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Once these young people are able to coalesce into a union, that obviously gives them greater
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And no boss who's trying to run a profitable company is going to want to get in a long strike
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And so when you actually have an institutionalized way of these people protesting, as opposed to
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just these sort of loosely collected people sitting in the president's office, that actually
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I mean, that's what we saw with the writer's strike.
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It was like a year or two ago with SAG-AFTA, where obviously they went on strike, basically held
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all of Hollywood hostage for, it was a few months, if I recall.
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And that entire sort of movement, that whatever you want to call it, had a distinct leftist
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Because pretty much all of the demands that they were making, again, were pretty much
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indistinguishable from sort of these left-wing activists that you would see across the country.
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And the sort of makeup of this union, again, skewed very young, skewed towards groups that
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And all the sort of support they would receive were mainly from older boomers that, again,
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didn't really have to worry about losing their jobs, because all that was expected of them
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was to sing along, hand the keys over, and then retire in five years.
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And I think we need to take from this piece, too, a really fundamental question, which really
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cuts at the heart of the advocation for DEI, which is the idea that representation matters,
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because if you don't have certain voices in the room, or people from certain backgrounds
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in the room, that there's going to be an inherent bias that is skewed against those voices, that
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they have unique insight that is going to actually provide more value to the institution,
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just by nature of them being Black or being a woman, et cetera.
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Well, let's run through these institutions that the author is writing about, the media.
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They have been hiring, as we demonstrated, 50% to 60% of their new hires are people of color
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Would anyone argue, at this point, that all three of those institutions, any of the three,
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are better off now than they were prior to this big George Floyd push to over-representatively
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Or do people distrust these institutions more than ever?
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Like, we haven't seen any value add from this diversity shift because, as we all know, the
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real diversity that matters is ideological diversity, intellectual diversity, where you're
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actually having debates about what TV shows are people actually going to watch?
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Or are we just trying to prove some kind of woke point?
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So pretty much everything has gotten demonstrably worse.
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Trust in institutions has gone down at the precise time that this DEI push was really ramping up.
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I mean, the author points out, like, 2014 is where you start to see the groundwork laid.
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But, yeah, things really started ramping up during the George Floyd BLM era.
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But, yeah, something that's interesting, we had a guest on Tim Guest IRL last night who
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And we kind of got into it in the after show because we got into this sort of debate over
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And he was making this point that really what he values above all in regards to our immigration
00:17:02.940
And when I posited the question, what specifically about diversity has intrinsic value, he kind
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of just kept dancing on the question because he was really just advocating for diversity
00:17:16.020
And then eventually the mask slips and he just admits that I really just don't like when
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He clearly, and this was a white guy, but he clearly had some bone to pick with white
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And it was really hits at the heart of, I think, what's going on with a lot of these
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things is that, again, most of the sort of boilerplate lines they're able to give about
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diversity, like you're saying, like, well, you know, it increases like different ideas
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in the, in whatever room the decisions are being made.
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It's like, again, everyone is this point with how, how much democratization we've seen
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Trust me, everyone has different ideas about a variety of topics.
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It's bizarre to me to advocate for a policy because, again, you just have a prejudice against
00:18:04.960
Fundamentally, you are discomfort, you're uncomfortable with being around like a very
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And I think that's kind of at the core of what's going on here.
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This stems from just hatred, bitter, bitterness and resentment towards white men.
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All of these academic intellectual arguments are just after the fact justifications for
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And I think that definitely needs to be said stronger.
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And that was one of the criticisms of the piece, too, was that they say, well, we don't
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really blame the people who took the jobs from us because, you know, if you were offered
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But I think that kind of ignores that a large amount of the advocacy for these policies came
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This was self-interest at the expense of another racial group.
00:19:00.480
And so that needs to be acknowledged and called out for what it is.
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I mean, that kind of illustrates the, I think, the biggest kind of gripe people had with it.
00:19:10.080
Again, I want to reiterate, like, it's a good piece.
00:19:15.840
We're still trying to flush out what that even means, but it's directionally correct
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as far as, like, it has a benefit to the political zeitgeist in many ways.
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But, and this is, I think, an accurate assessment of the piece is in many ways, it's a permission
00:19:28.800
piece because what it does is it allows people specifically to the left of, like, Ted Cruz
00:19:35.200
that have been lambasting and trying to push down people that are conservatives for years who
00:19:40.620
have been pointing this out saying, hey, like, white men are getting discriminated against
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And previously where they would try to get you fired or, again, try to freeze you out
00:19:50.040
of whatever career path you would have available to you for making this case.
00:19:54.160
All of a sudden this piece drops and then now all of them are like, yeah, this is an issue.
00:19:58.760
We've all been saying, like, yes, we've been saying this for years.
00:20:03.720
So I think there's some value in saying welcome to the team, but at the same time, that is
00:20:09.000
a big critique of it is that, A, again, it's this sort of permission piece, and then B,
00:20:13.940
that it begs the question of, like, okay, what now?
00:20:17.020
I mean, Jeremy Carl, he wrote a fantastic response because obviously Jeremy Carl's been writing
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And he pointed out, like, look, I mean, again, I'm glad you laid out the data.
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Because the piece ends just basically demoralizing.
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Like, I don't know what I'm going to tell my kids when they try to follow their dreams.
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And it's like, okay, it's useful to point out the issue.
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Conservatives are very good at pointing out issues.
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Like, how can we ensure that your kids don't have to run up against that wall?
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And I think describing it as a permission piece is pretty perfect.
00:20:57.420
It kind of reminds me of when there was that exodus from the New York Times with Barry
00:21:03.820
And they started writing about how crazy things had gotten on trans issues and how the newspapers
00:21:12.620
And we were all like, hey, welcome to the party.
00:21:15.280
We've been waiting five years for you to get here.
00:21:18.660
And it's like the exact same thing happening here, right?
00:21:22.400
It's for the people who don't really watch Matt Walsh's show or they think that Charlie
00:21:27.780
Kirk's comments on the DEI pilots were distasteful because they just hear the one sentence said
00:21:33.240
by the people, you know, trashing him after his death.
00:21:36.260
It's for those people to read an ostensibly, you know, mainstream argument and publication
00:21:42.500
from a guy who doesn't have like a long history of being a conservative activist and say,
00:21:48.080
Yeah, yeah, it is frustrating when people who were like dyed in the wool leftists until
00:21:52.420
like two years ago come along and then just start like lecturing conservatives on like
00:21:58.160
I'm not saying he specifically is doing that, but a lot of people that are like, no, this
00:22:08.060
But yeah, I think Matt Walsh specifically made an excellent point regarding the sort of the
00:22:14.160
implication of DEI in which he said, if you look through, for example, the history of Western
00:22:19.080
civilization and you were to compile a list of like the thousand most impactful people in the
00:22:23.460
country and paraphrasing his tweet, if you were to compile a list of the thousand most impactful
00:22:27.420
people throughout civilization, he ballparked like 975 of them would be white men.
00:22:34.820
He's just making the point like this is how you thank them.
00:22:37.720
I mean, you kind of ride with the hot hand in many ways.
00:22:42.000
Because, again, if we believe in a meritocracy, you're just going to hire the best people that
00:22:48.820
And if that skews white to white men, it skews to white men.
00:22:51.700
I don't see why that's like such a pernicious thing.
00:22:54.180
I don't really see white men organizing on the basis of identity.
00:22:59.260
That's still like very frowned upon all across the political spectrum.
00:23:03.600
But you see with other groups that they are sort of advocating as a group.
00:23:07.800
They are advocating for, look, we're not we don't care about merit.
00:23:12.240
And that to me is specifically pernicious thing.
00:23:14.460
And that line that he used, this is how you thank them, seems very on point.
00:23:22.660
And the second, I'll get into what's next because you raised that.
00:23:26.400
The first one is that when looking at the media, one thing I find really interesting about
00:23:31.080
your point about how groups organize and how white men and I think white people kind of
00:23:36.000
generally have excluded themselves from that paradigm.
00:23:39.400
One of the really fascinating dichotomies to watch in the media over the past 10 years
00:23:45.080
is that as they've made this concerted effort to start hiring more people of color, what
00:23:50.800
is still really underrepresented in the media are just normal Americans.
00:23:54.840
And what I mean by that is when the media decided in the early 1900s that you had to go to journalism
00:24:03.160
school to prove that you could meet some amorphous standard of objectivity in order to become a
00:24:09.280
journalist, whereas it used to be a working class trade.
00:24:12.060
What happened was that most of the people who work for these major publications are sort of all cut from
00:24:25.480
They tend to have parents who are white-collar.
00:24:27.780
There aren't a lot of journalists who have parents who are blue-collar.
00:24:32.380
And if you look at the pages of the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal, one thing
00:24:37.080
that's really stunning is that they have the same educational attainment as U.S.
00:24:44.980
Like, they really are like the elite of the elite.
00:24:47.360
And as far as I can tell, the effort to hire minorities hasn't changed that.
00:24:51.560
You're still getting people from relatively the same background.
00:24:54.380
So it's not really actually experience or background diversity at all in the way that
00:25:00.940
Now, on the what's next, there was a really amazing video that came out yesterday, actually,
00:25:07.540
from the EEOC chair, the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, telling white men, if you
00:25:13.400
have been discriminated against in your jobs, we are going to go to bat for you.
00:25:18.280
We want to make sure that the people who were racist against you are held accountable, that
00:25:23.540
your workplaces are places of equal opportunity.
00:25:26.380
So there is movement from the federal government.
00:25:28.860
Also, last week, the Department of Justice sort of quietly rolled back their disparate impact
00:25:36.840
liability, which means that if a workplace is discriminating, not intentionally so, not because
00:25:45.440
they don't like black people, but because the outcome is different.
00:25:48.460
So if you have a policy that leads to you hiring more white men and fewer black men, for example,
00:25:56.660
even if the policy itself does not have some different standard applying to white men versus
00:26:02.760
black men, if the outcome is different, that's disparate impact, and you can be held liable
00:26:09.780
The DOJ said we're basically not going to prosecute any of those cases anymore.
00:26:14.320
We're not going to investigate any of those cases.
00:26:16.540
One of the big ones that just drove me absolutely insane was during the Biden administration,
00:26:21.440
the same day that President Joe Biden went to Sheetz to do a campaign stop and basically
00:26:26.460
show how much of a working class guy that he is.
00:26:29.200
He Scranton Joe, he went to get his schmuffin or whatever it was at Sheetz.
00:26:33.620
This is a great family-owned American institution.
00:26:36.040
It's based in the Mid-Atlantic for people who aren't familiar.
00:26:38.960
The same day, his EEOC announced a lawsuit against Sheetz under the disparate impact clause.
00:26:47.020
They said that they weren't going to hire certain criminals.
00:26:51.180
They have a policy that they review every job applicant's criminal record, and there are
00:26:58.140
certain things, we don't know exactly what they are because their hiring standards are
00:27:02.040
not fully public, but there are certain things where whatever's on your criminal background
00:27:08.560
Now, I assume it's probably things like violent crimes, felonies, right?
00:27:12.020
If you meet some certain threshold of a criminal history, then you don't get hired at Sheetz.
00:27:17.040
I don't want the person working the cash register at Sheetz to be a hardened criminal, right?
00:27:21.320
Seems pretty common sense, but because Black people have higher crime rates and tend to
00:27:29.000
have lengthier criminal backgrounds or are more likely to commit violent crime, that had
00:27:34.180
a disparate impact on Sheetz's ability to hire Black people, and so the Biden administration
00:27:40.420
The Trump administration dropped the lawsuit and is now getting rid of all similar investigations
00:27:47.900
Yeah, and that's kind of the tricky thing about undoing a lot of this because from the
00:27:55.260
EOC's perspective and other related government organizations, if they were to subpoena these
00:28:00.580
leaders that have built out this discrimination apparatus, it's really difficult to pin them
00:28:06.080
down because in the piece and also broader commentary, they've outlined how discreet a lot
00:28:12.300
of these things are because you look at the movies when you would see discrimination against
00:28:15.920
like Black people and they'd be like walking into a help wanted sign and they'd be like,
00:28:22.400
But like when white guys are applying to these places, there's like an entire incentive structure
00:28:27.300
all across the United States that is pointing away from them.
00:28:33.220
And so these companies, they just have these really discreet things like, we want to hire
00:28:36.720
someone that comes from like a unique perspective, like a diverse background.
00:28:41.460
And then they can like, you know, ask a few pointed questions in the interviews to have
00:28:45.480
like a justification to say, ah, he just wouldn't be like a great fit for our company culture.
00:28:50.220
They have all these like really just like gay terms that they use to justify this discrimination.
00:28:56.540
And that's, what's going to make it so difficult if the government, for example, is to take action
00:29:00.780
on these, these sorts of things, because outside of the data, they have a lot of plausible deniability
00:29:07.660
And that's what makes it so difficult to, again, put together a case here because it's
00:29:13.040
going, it's going to have to be case by case in a lot of situations, but yeah, so much
00:29:22.360
That's how you can tell it legitimately is a full throated effort to ensure that you can
00:29:27.480
crowd these people out and freeze them out forever.
00:29:30.300
I think you have to start with the really obvious cases because especially from 2020
00:29:34.900
to 2023, there, there, people were admitting it out loud, right?
00:29:39.700
I mean, they were not, they were, a lot of them weren't discreet.
00:29:42.140
So you start with those, the ones that were more discreet and subtle, I think you have to
00:29:46.280
have whistleblowers who are brave enough to come forward, which is why the cowardice demonstrated
00:29:50.740
in the piece by certain people is so infuriating because it perpetuated the system.
00:29:55.580
Um, and I mean, I also think, um, getting to the point about, um, uh, just like moving
00:30:05.880
forward and what the EEOC is doing, having this come from the federal government and, and
00:30:11.740
really open up that, um, permission structure as we're talking about, um, from the government
00:30:18.820
is really important just to show people that they have someone who's on their side, um, and
00:30:23.280
that there is an actual force with teeth that can back them up.
00:30:30.780
Cause he literally said, I'm only going to hire a POC woman to be my vice president.
00:30:35.640
So, I mean, it's like at the highest level, but, uh, yeah, Amber, we, we're, we're starting
00:30:40.860
I wanted to ask for maybe your closing thoughts, um, on, on all of this that we've discussed
00:30:45.420
and also where people can find you to get more of your work.
00:30:48.800
I want to tell one more quick story on this point of the subtlety when I was working at
00:30:53.260
WMAL, which is a conservative radio station in DC, they were owned by a corporate, uh,
00:30:58.320
conglomerate called Cumulus media, which owns a lot of the conservative media stations around
00:31:03.440
And on their, uh, workplace database, I was shocked one day when I logged on and I found
00:31:08.940
out that they were offering bonuses to people who recommended diverse candidates to be hired.
00:31:16.820
If the candidate ultimately got hired, you would get like a $2,000 bonus in your check.
00:31:25.220
And we're going to, we're going to actually give you money if you recommend some black woman
00:31:29.660
and she ends up getting hired at the radio station.
00:31:34.860
Um, I think this piece is, is a good start, I guess, and, and at least illuminating the problem
00:31:42.000
Um, but we're going to need serious action to correct this.
00:31:45.040
And so I'm Amber Duke, everybody, you can find my work at dailycaller.com.
00:31:51.960
And every Friday I'm on rising every Tuesday and Wednesday on reason, uh, on YouTube.
00:32:10.920
The, the oppression against swag, swagged up white boys with a little bit of motion.
00:32:15.840
They hate to see that the left really hates to see the left really hates to see a swagged
00:32:20.820
out boy with motion open in the corner, because we will knock that down every single time.
00:32:26.360
That is sort of the level that I'm talking about.
00:32:30.400
And they've built an entire apparatus around destroying that.
00:32:44.020
And, uh, I don't know what this sort of show is going to look like in the new year.
00:32:47.460
I hope I'm here again to chat with you guys, but there's a lot of things moving behind the
00:32:52.000
So we'll have to see how this show evolves and whatnot.
00:32:56.680
We're going to send you guys over to the great DeVorey darkens and, uh, you'll go hang
00:33:03.120
And, uh, yeah, I just want to say thank you guys very much for, um,
00:33:08.720
Obviously I had to develop, we had to, uh, a lot of different, uh, wrenches thrown in
00:33:15.960
I'm very happy with sort of how this presentation went, but I hope I will see you guys in the
00:33:19.780
You'll definitely see me on Tim cast IRL and some of our other shows.
00:33:23.120
But with that, you can follow me on X and Instagram at real tape Brown.
00:33:27.920
Just in case I don't see you after the new year, just in case, um, we will be back tonight
00:33:33.840
I want to wish everyone a merry, merry Christmas and a happy new year.
00:33:38.580
I want to wish everyone a merry, merry Christmas and a merry Christmas and a happy new year.