Housing Prices Are RADICALIZING Gen Z ｜ The Culture War's Across The Pond
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Summary
In this episode of Across the Pond, we're joined by Nathan Halberstadt, CEO and Founder of New Founding, a venture capital firm in Dallas, Texas. We discuss the growing divide between baby boomers and Generation Z, and whether or not the two are on the same page.
Transcript
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What is going on Patriots? We are here back for another installation of Across the Pond.
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We have an unbelievable, unbelievable guest. I love this man. I'm so glad we wrangled him
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between all of his different projects he's going on. He's one of the most dynamic men in the game
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right now. Nathan Halberstadt is here. Nathan, who are you? What do you do? Timcast viewers
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probably know who you are, but just in case they don't, what do you do? Well, thanks for having me
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back, Tate. We've had, I guess, a series of appearances together now, which has been
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fantastic. The New Founding podcast, you came on, I've been on your show, a few different shows,
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a few different times, and then Connor, nice to finally be on a show together as well.
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I'm hearing it's like 2026 will be the Tate and Connor generational run. It turns to my background,
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I'm at New Founding. It's a venture firm. We're based in Dallas, Texas. I'm a partner there.
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I travel around a good amount. So partly meeting with founders, investors, things like this, and
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then very interested in the political and civilizational and cultural questions. And
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it's a big part of why I enjoy talking with you, Tate. And Connor, I've been following some of your
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stuff as well. So excited about the conversation. I love it. I love it. Well, we are thankful. And
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we got a great topic. I mean, when I saw this topic jump up on the timeline, it had to be Halbs.
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Had to be Halbs. So I'm just going to jump in here. I'm going to read. This was a headline
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that dropped this week. It instigated quite interesting discourse. The boomers and zoomers
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went at it again. This happens like every three months. This was the headline. Gen Z has cut down
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on their effort at work because they do not think it is worth it if they cannot afford long-term
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financial calls per YF. So obviously there's been this big rift between boomers and zoomers.
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Pretty much as soon as zoomers could talk, this discourse started in which zoomers are saying,
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look, I'm looking towards the future. All of these promises that were made to me, this inheritance
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that I was supposed to receive is no longer there. Therefore, I'm going to black pill. Therefore,
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I'm going to check out. Housing prices are through the roof. Unemployment is super high. And when I do
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get a degree, I don't even feel like I can get a job that would utilize my degree. I don't think I'm
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going to get married. I can't even like riz up women anymore. Like where the hoes at has become
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a very salient question for the zoomer patriot, sensitive young patriot males. There's just a
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variety of issues that are causing zoomers to black pill. I don't know what you guys think of
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this, what your consensus is, what your reaction is to the discourse. Do the boomers have a point?
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Are the zoomers just inherently flawed? Or maybe do the zoomers have a point? The boomers are selfish
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and pull the ladder up behind them? Or is the truth somewhere in the middle? I want to first ask
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Connor for his take. And then Nathan, you can give us the correct take and just lay out all
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the data and probably provide some graphs like you typically do.
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Well, first of all, Tay, I know that you have far too large a harem of e-girls to really engage
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in the question of where the hoes at. So this is truly a 1% male problem. I remember the Sigma
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male grind set meme going around a few years ago and everyone, of course, lionizing the aesthetics
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of Patrick Bateman. And now it is not in vogue to dedicate your entire life to having your personal
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life be cannibalized by working away, whether it's day trading or slaving in a giant corporation.
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Having most of your hours dedicated to filling out spreadsheets for corporations that are lobbying
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politicians to replace you with your cheaper counterparts from India and Africa. And I think a
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lot of people are realizing that there's no use engaging in the pull yourself up by your bootstraps
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boomer promise that you can work 30 years at a corporation, retire in your 60s with a golden
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watch and have the white picket fence and a large family on a single income. Because since before we
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were born, we've been indebted and flooded with third world dependents that are not just changing
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our culture, but also pricing us out of jobs and housing. This is the work that Nathan's done. This
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is the stuff that I brought up in the recent rhetorical kerfuffle with Ben Shapiro appearing
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on Trigonometry saying, well, if you can't afford to live in the city you were born into, you know,
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just move. And at the same time, while insisting his comments are taken out of context, he was
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supporting H1B visas, which is exploited for like mid-level jobs and startup firms and big tech
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corporations where your average white collar, decently educated white guy would have got his start a few
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years ago and built his role up in a corporation, but is now inaccessible to him. And so this is
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behind, I think, a lot of Gen Z dispossession. And I think it cuts both towards men and women,
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because while men are being legally, systemically, and culturally discriminated against by feminine
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institutions, but also anti-discrimination laws and equalities legislation, the Civil Rights Act in
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the US, the Equalities Act, the Companies Act in the UK, there's also this burnout that Zuma women
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keep expressing this kind of existential rage on TikTok by saying that they don't feel safe
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commuting to their cities, regardless of which permissive migration policies and criminal justice
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policies they may vote for. God bless them. They don't enjoy their work. They don't feel it's
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meaningful. They feel alienated from their jobs and their roles and their social circles, and their job
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tires them out so much they don't have time to date or socialize. And so you get this kind of
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existential angst being expressed on social media by women who think it's a good idea to film their
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mental breakdown. However, we should have sympathy for them because this isn't how men and women are
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meant to interact. It's not how we're meant to live. And so Gen Z have kind of realized that the
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ladder's been pulled up for them. There's no use continuing to give more and more of your life and
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energy to something that isn't paying dividends. And so checking out is actually the reasonable response
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off to a certain point. Also, I'll just add that I was talking with a VC, let's say previously based,
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I won't say where based, but the individual was probably coming from more of a libertarian type
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of background. So not necessarily somebody who was really probably up to speed with a lot of the
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things that we think about and talk about. And he pointed out to me that the percent of Americans that
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believe in capitalism still has been declining year over year, and it's much sharper in the younger
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generation. And actually, we're hitting right about 50% of people who view capitalism positively.
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And at the same time, so this is like trending down of how you view capitalism. This is a turbo
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boomer take, by the way. So it's like doing like a libertarian capitalism. So, so, so, so like,
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forgive me here. But then on the same time, actually, the views of socialism is like increasing in
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sort of its people's positive views towards it. So I think, you know, nationally, it's approaching 40%
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positive view of socialism. So like, we're actually approaching this convergence where like,
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the view of capitalism may actually dip below, you know, we're probably on a, on trend for
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something like 2030 or something like that, that's a crossover. And then when, of course,
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when you segment by, by demographics, of course, as you move into the, like sort of the foreign
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demographic, you know, they're generally much more pro-socialism. And then actually younger
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people are, are also much more pro-socialism. I would argue for very different reasons, but
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so maybe like, this is me throwing, like granting a, like throwing a bone to the boomer and saying,
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like, maybe it is kind of true, actually, to some extent that like, young people are like,
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they're a little bit more radical. Maybe they don't believe in capitalism as much as you and like,
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you know, maybe as, as Warren Buffett did. But then I think we have to like ask like why that is,
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of course. Probably for the, for the foreigners, for the migrants, it's, it's resentment,
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right? It's that they, they showed up here. And I think that they like resent colonization,
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and they resent sort of Westerners. On the reverse, and I think for younger Americans,
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it's probably more of these economic problems that we talked about, and cultural problems. So,
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you know, like some of the really basic stuff, I won't pull up a graph, I'm tempted to, but,
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but, you know, basic stuff like the cost of home relative to, of a home relative to your income,
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you know, went to, went from about two times to six times, you know, from the boomer generation to
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ours. Like that's a, like a three X there is pretty meaningful, actually, like median income
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to medium, median home price. And then, yeah, we talk about marriage rates and family formation and
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things like that. And it's just like, let's just say for the average person who maybe just like
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gets a skilled labor job, or, you know, goes to a state school, you know, sort of like the
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probability of being able to like really stick the landing by 25 is like actually a lot lower than
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it used to be. And so, you know, in those conditions, it's maybe like, it's maybe like
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hard to believe in capitalism in that scenario. And so that pushes people maybe further to the
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right, in some cases. And then in other cases, it's like, where did Mamdani come from? Or like
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Rokana? I mean, I'm in SF right now. This is this, this, this, I can't say too many negative things
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about it, because I guess there's like, there are good, some good people here. But, you know, maybe,
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maybe to say a few things about what's happening out here is, I mean, there's this wealth tax that's
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been proposed. And it's going to tax unrealized, unrealized gains. And you know what that's going
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to do to like, even the founder ecosystem, you know, if you're a founder, and you maybe have like
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a, let's say paper gains, nice markups, maybe you like you, you know, you raise a seed round,
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series A, series B, you know, you now owe taxes on that, but it's not liquid, like you don't have any
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way to like, you know, you might be worth 40 million on paper, but you might have 70,000 in your bank
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account, and all of a sudden, you have to pay this massive tax bill. You know, that's, that's like
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an extremely, that's like, just like, raw socialism, like, that's like a very left wing, just like
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extracting wealth from people who are producer, you know, producing and this really, you know,
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investors, capitalists, and people who are own own production, essentially. And anyway, I just say,
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like, you know, that stuff is, I'm very pessimistic, pessimistic that that will actually pass into law,
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and that that'll have like really negative consequences out in California. And then out
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in New York, you have Mom Donnie as well. And I just think I see this as all kind of like the same
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story, where it's like, conservatives haven't had good solutions. Libertarians haven't had good
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solutions, kind of the boomers failed, of course. And, and we have serious problems, and we do have to
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solve them. Yeah. For one, I love when Connor just casually dropped H1B in his opening monologue,
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and then Halberstadt, like the gorilla meme, just like looks up at the camera, generational lock-in.
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And then Halberstadt. 30 minute segment on H1B, he's like, I'm ready.
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Literally, H1B's whole show. And then also Halberstadt, live, right in front of her very eyes, is
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like constructing a graph. He's, he's throwing up the door.
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Yeah. Beautiful thing. But there's so, I mean, there's so many different directions we could go.
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So, I mean, I think it's important to hit on. Again, this is going to be like a turbo boomer
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nuclear take, but like socialism is bad, broadly. It's not a controversial opinion in our sphere,
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especially on the TempCast channel. But the interesting thing is, this isn't of the flavor,
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this isn't the socialism of the flavor of sort of the Scandinavian, let's just try it and see if
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these redistributionist policies could work. Because maybe there is something to be said about that.
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Because, I mean, for the longest time, things were actually going quite well in Scandinavia
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to a degree in Canada as well. But these things are predicated on favorable demographics. It
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requires a degree of homogenization that just a homogenous population that doesn't exist anymore.
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And so the socialism, the flavor that we're seeing with Gen Z is more of the flavor of
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vindictiveness, more of the flavor of like retribution, which is why you get a Mamdani.
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Because Mamdani is not an economics scholar who is just really convinced that if we get the
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certain policies in and get the stats right and the numbers down, we will create prosperity and
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generate prosperity for New Yorkers. That's not really what he's going for. His is quite literally
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more just based off of resentment. And I think that gets at Zoomers generally. Our politics generally,
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even on the right, is based on a degree of resentment. I know that's like an unpopular take,
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an unpopular opinion, but it's true. And I would say in many ways, both right and left among Zoomers,
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they actually do kind of have the right to be resentful to a degree. The problem is the left
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wing Zoomers, their resentment is more channeled at the people that actually would create a prosperous
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civilization in the first place. It's typically just, they just hate white people fundamentally.
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That's where the resentment is stemming from. Mamdani, et cetera, you name it. They just tell you
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openly. Or on the right, it's resentful more at the correct, you know, directed correctly,
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which is at this post-war consensus, this liberal regime, this idea of the blank slate
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that is just completely deracinated Zoomers. I mean, again, there's a whole variety of different
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ways we can go with this topic. But a lot of people know for me, I really am interested in
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anthropology, specifically like religious anthropology. And you're seeing among Zoomers,
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this push into Catholicism. And I think the reason that's happening is because Zoomer men,
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particularly Zoomer men, feel incredibly deracinated. They feel incredibly,
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sort of cut off from heritage, cut off from lineage, cut off from the roots.
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And they see an institution that is ancient, that has sort of this clear, distinct connection
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to the past. And they're like, this is like oxygen for them. They can finally have something
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that is grounded, something that is real. And so they jump into it with two feet.
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And I think that's kind of what's going on, is I think there are very few places for young men
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where they can feel connected to the past, where they can feel a sense of rootedness,
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because the modern man really is just cut off from the past. And the problem with that
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is very obvious, is the past is always going to make claims on the present. And boomers hate that.
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Fundamentally, that is the biggest gripe boomers have, is with the idea that the past will make
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claims on the present. That is why, in a variety of ways, they're frustrated with Zoomers. Because
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Zoomers are saying like, no, we actually, we actually kind of like the restrictions that the
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past puts on us. We actually don't like individualism, because the problem with human
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nature is you do need guardrails to some degree. You do need a sense of purpose. And oftentimes,
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society is what prescribes purpose to your life. It's very hard to expect people to just sort of pull
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purpose out of thin air. That's why Zoomers are returning to Christianity broadly, is because it
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just prescribes you purpose. This is what you're supposed to do. Go do it. That's very hard for
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Zoomers to just generate out of thin air. Boomers inherited that. Their parents actually did give
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them these sort of assignments, so to speak. And they bucked it. They bucked it on purpose in favor
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of sort of pursuing individualism. But it's very frustrating. This whole debate started, at least
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the last time I remember seeing this discourse start, was over Vivek and his disparagement of the
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term heritage Americans. And what he was getting at was that, no, American...
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Over a year ago, it's hard to even believe it's been that long.
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Yeah. And then obviously, he had his speech at Amphus, where he's saying, like, okay, well,
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Heritage American is not even a real thing. Like, American is defined by your ideology.
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The problem with that, for a variety of reasons, is it just further contributes to the
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deracination of Zoomer men, Zoomer Americans specifically. Because again, it just puts them
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back in the same position that's destroyed us in the first place, is the situation where,
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hey, you're on your own, figure it out. Whatever your calling is, just pursue your calling,
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man. Just pursue your passions. We can't do that. It's ruined us. It really has. Like,
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we do need some guardrails. We do need some purpose.
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I just want to jump in and add two things here. It's like, one is it's like hilarious,
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like Vivek, like back-to-back Christmas crash-outs.
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You know, more could be said there. But, you know, you mentioned, of course, these ideas around,
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let's say, like, tradition. And, you know, Chesterton has the famous quote, like,
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tradition is the democracy of the dead. And I think that it's actually, that quote is,
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like, particularly true and, like, a funny sort of, like, if you read it, like, very literally.
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Like, the boomers were, you know, many of them are still alive, of course. But they,
00:16:01.540
of course, were, like, fundamentally quite rebellious as a generation. Of course,
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you could talk about, like, the 60s counterculture. And I was out at, I was,
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like, out stopping at the Stanford Review two nights ago out here. And you think about a place
00:16:13.340
like Silicon Valley and the, like, places like Stanford, like, UCLA, whatever, you know,
00:16:18.680
broadly California was, you know, sort of these technologists were this combination of,
00:16:23.660
like, rebels, visionaries, and sort of, like, hippies. But they were, like,
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they rejected, like, every form of tradition. You still sort of see it out here,
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actually. Like, like, people kind of, you know, now I'm going to start attacking SF.
00:16:34.880
Like, people just, like, dress like slobs, of course. It's sort of, even the way
00:16:37.500
that they talk, it's very, like, sort of everything is, like, is, like, layers of
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subversion. And this was, like, very much so, like, the boomer generation,
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sort of, this is inherited. So, when people, like, when Zoomers say, okay,
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you go to the Stanford Review, many of them are converts to Catholicism.
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Like, why is that? And it's that, I think they're trying to, like, reach,
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they're trying to, like, leap over the boomers to the dead people that the
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boomers subverted. It's, like, roughly how I would describe it. And, but otherwise,
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I just agree with everything that you said, yeah.
00:17:08.100
Yeah, Connor, what's your take on this? Is there a resident Catholic on the panel?
00:17:12.720
Carl Schmitt was correct when, in his critique of Protestantism, he compared
00:17:17.520
Protestantism to being quite literally rooted to the land and place and tradition.
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Whereas, he saw Protestantism as a seafaring ideology that was necessary in
00:17:28.040
conquering the new world, but much like Max Weber drew connective tissue between
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Protestantism and then the American work ethic and then the ever-revolving dynamo of
00:17:39.320
liberal capitalism, which liquidates identities. He saw that the rootlessness of
00:17:44.300
that led to the human life being fed into the thresher more of ever-growing technological
00:17:51.660
progression and GDP generation. And now we've got, you know, mass migration to keep the GDP
00:17:56.960
growing so that they can bet the GDP figures against the debt they've already accumulated
00:18:01.220
and will never pay back in order to pay for boomer entitlements like Medicaid and Social Security
00:18:06.420
in your country or pensions in the NHS in my country. And so we're, you know, we're just
00:18:11.740
devouring the future of not just ourselves, but those who haven't been born yet. And to do the
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Burke quote for tradition rather than Chesterton's, tradition is the thing that connects the living
00:18:24.120
with those who have come before them and those not yet born. Breaking the tradition allows you to
00:18:30.080
mortgage off the futures of those not yet born or just to kill them in pursuit of your own
00:18:34.860
personal hedonism. It's the, the other thing that's connected to that as well is that you don't
00:18:41.460
need the, the Protestant ethic or the secular version, which is limitless limbic capitalism,
00:18:47.100
where you're just working to basically goon in order to see that you, there is a degree,
00:18:54.260
and this is what the Catholics have recognized with things like distributism. There is a degree
00:18:58.940
of needing to own at least a subsistence level of property in order to have a stake in the land in
00:19:03.840
order to continue your traditions and have a, have a reason to participate in society.
00:19:08.680
And so when you have things like in my country, since 2015 to 2016, when they, when the first
00:19:14.280
years of the new student finance system came into effect, you've now got the impossibility of most
00:19:19.460
people ever paying off their student finance because the interest on the student loan is higher
00:19:23.880
than the average payments that are made. So you'll have people making loads of payments as a kind of
00:19:29.160
extra income tax all their lives. But then when they check their student finance, it's, it's a larger
00:19:33.300
loan when they originally started. And the same thing happens in the US. And this is what's turning
00:19:36.780
a bunch of, especially women, like college age women, the one who got these nonsense degrees and now
00:19:40.920
working in Starbucks to voting for the resentful socialism of Zoran Madani, who just says, we're
00:19:45.240
going to take rich white people's stuff and give it to you. Or we're going to, we're going to steal
00:19:49.080
from homeowners. And then, you know, his housing czar is quizzed on the fact that her, her mother
00:19:54.240
owned this massive property and she breaks down in tears. It's not about a coherent ideology. It's
00:19:58.340
not even about having the labor theory of value or the idea that expropriating property will have
00:20:04.000
us all live in a kind of kumbaya, John Lennon's imagine of infinite prosperity. It's just, I have
00:20:09.900
no stuff. They have all the stuff. I don't see a path to me getting stuff and I need stuff.
00:20:14.120
Otherwise, I don't feel like I belong in this civilization. So give me the stuff now. And if,
00:20:18.720
if our politicians don't fix that problem by actually upsetting the entrenched boomer class for which
00:20:23.320
they farm for votes, especially in my country, then they're going to have a revolution of various
00:20:27.680
flavors on their hands. Um, and it doesn't take a genius to see that. And, and the one thing I will
00:20:32.760
raise, cause Nathan will enjoy me mentioning H1Bs again, is Vivek in his, in his piece, which ended up
00:20:39.220
having to be retitled to what was it like, Groiperism is not Americanism. Um, in, in his piece, he said,
00:20:45.140
the solution to white guys realizing that every single other group has played identity politics
00:20:50.320
successfully at their expense is not for them to engage on the same terms. No, no, no.
00:20:54.600
Keep fighting with one hand behind your back. And instead we give to every child born in America,
00:20:59.820
a very, you know, clever rhetorical trick there, cause Vivek is an Indian anchor baby.
00:21:04.120
We give them the chance to, to have, uh, uh, X amount of stocks invested in fortune 500 companies.
00:21:10.520
We give them a chance to, to have their own apartment. And it's like, okay, even if you built
00:21:15.760
enough affordable housing across the entire Rust Belt so that every single person could have
00:21:20.460
a studio flat and, and a job filling in spreadsheets for info size, that still wouldn't
00:21:27.300
solve the problem of belonging that is causing the existential angst of Gen Z in order to, you
00:21:33.040
know, make them identify with the more concrete religions like Catholicism or rediscover their
00:21:36.940
identity as English people or heritage Americans, because they would still be packed cheap by jowl
00:21:41.380
with scammers and, and, and social climbers from the Indian subcontinent. So actually it's as much
00:21:47.480
a demographic and a identity issue as it is an economic issue. And so we can fix all the economics and
00:21:53.060
we need to, but you're still going to have that problem of feeling dispossessed in your own homeland
00:21:57.460
and severed from your patrimony. Even if, even if Vivek's, you know, is at farming at American
00:22:02.720
first pays off. Well, it's bred this really pernicious combination of simultaneously being nihilist,
00:22:10.780
but also being narcissistic. And it's a really, really grim combo that just completely grinds
00:22:15.800
your soul up. And I think why that's happening is the point that Connor made, um, or the multiple
00:22:20.500
points Connor made, which is you need, you need a sense of stake in the world to truly feel secure.
00:22:26.080
And what's happening with zoomers is as a lot of people have prescribed, uh, especially on TikTok is
00:22:31.000
zoomers all have main character syndrome. And what that means is, I guess in short, is they believe
00:22:37.880
that look, my only way I'm going to leave a mark on this world is by doing something big. And that's
00:22:42.740
going to be by being an influencer of some sort, because that, that seems for zoomers to be the
00:22:46.700
only avenue in which you can feel like you're taking up space in the world to feel like you're
00:22:50.760
possessing, um, space in the world that you're again, uh, leaving a mark in any meaningful way.
00:22:56.920
Cause that really is the only avenue that allows you to have your name put somewhere to again, feel
00:23:01.700
like I existed. I've proof that I existed on this earth. And that's because again, we are, we can't
00:23:07.700
own property. Like we, most zoomers have just given up on that. Um, there's data point after data point
00:23:12.180
just indicating that most zoomers are literally convinced they're never getting their property.
00:23:15.120
So they don't feel like they're ever going to have physical stake in this world. And then also they
00:23:19.700
don't feel like their heritage or their identity is going to have stake in this world. Because again,
00:23:23.380
they've flooded the place with third worlders. So it's like, they look around and it's like,
00:23:27.600
is my culture even going to like last another generation or my kids just going to experience
00:23:34.140
the same thing I did where I look around and who I am, who my identity as, as an American is,
00:23:39.380
I mean, going to be reflected in the environment around me. And it's just breeding this, breeding
00:23:43.460
this really horrific, uh, sort of, I guess, ethos for lack of bed work among zoomers where they're like,
00:23:50.060
well, if my identity is not going to be reflected in this world, there's gonna be no memory of memory of
00:23:54.900
me. And if I'm not going to leave a physical, you know, stake in the world, I'm not going to leave
00:23:58.600
any inheritance behind for my children. There's going to be no physical recollection of who I was
00:24:03.700
on this planet. So that only leaves me with one avenue, which is, you know, like the influencer
00:24:09.180
thing. So again, just leave my stake somehow in the, um, and the culture through entertainment and
00:24:14.740
these sorts of things. And that's, what's really breeding this main, uh, main character syndrome.
00:24:19.460
Tate, I think this is a great point. One of the, so Tate, you and Connor, you guys both do an
00:24:23.940
excellent job with all of your, you know, let's say all your like public facing communication and
00:24:28.080
such, but you know, there have to be other pathways for people to leave a mark, right?
00:24:32.600
We need more, uh, let's say zoomers to have the ambition to, you know, maybe become like a great
00:24:37.020
doctor, come back to their hometown, like, you know, really excellently serve their community
00:24:42.120
and then end up with, let's say like the school being named after them after they like coached the
00:24:46.220
team for this long and gave this money and whatever else. And like, increasingly that's not
00:24:49.960
the ambition of like the Gen Z individual, despite that being probably like in the twenties and thirties,
00:24:55.680
what we know was sort of an ambitious person would aim for. And that's, you know, that stuff
00:24:59.580
is really fundamentally pro-civilizational behavior. And like everybody's sort of trying to go viral on,
00:25:05.680
on Tik TOK or like, you know, maybe, uh, dabbling in looks maxing or, or, or, you know, trying to
00:25:11.500
mog online is like probably, uh, probably not, probably not healthy, um, uh, for us or, you know,
00:25:17.140
for future generations. I'll, uh, I really want to steer this towards the, towards the H1Bs. Like I,
00:25:21.880
I, um, thank you both for like teeing this up, like, you know, teeing this up, but no, really,
00:25:27.240
I actually, I want to lead to this historian from the late 20th century. Um, and, um, it's Helen
00:25:33.320
Horowitz and she, I was a professor across like, like a number of different sort of Ivy League and
00:25:38.400
adjacent, um, uh, universities. And it's really interesting, um, uh, let's say, uh, sort of way
00:25:45.260
of organizing campus life. And I think it relates actually to what we're seeing, um, in America
00:25:50.260
right now. And she essentially categorizes, um, students and she wrote mostly in like the eighties,
00:25:55.280
um, uh, was on this topic. Uh, she categorized students into three groups. Uh, the first is
00:26:00.740
college men. This would be like traditionally people like fraternity, ROTC, kind of like
00:26:05.480
traditionally even like wasps. And then the second would be the sort of rebels, which I mentioned
00:26:10.420
as relates to like, this is probably more of like the, uh, Vietnam war protester type, where even
00:26:14.840
like the Silicon Valley type, like sort of subverting, uh, the core. And then the third
00:26:19.860
would be like the outsider grind. And this would include, uh, you know, again, sort of
00:26:24.040
like very low, like low, low stats, low status, low class type individuals for maybe sort of
00:26:28.140
climbing through going to college. And there was always sort of a place for that. And, um,
00:26:32.220
and it could even like point to examples like Hamilton, right. Of course, who, uh, very, you
00:26:36.200
know, sort of low, low background, but really, uh, he would have been sort of in that
00:26:39.800
category, but, but made it through these sorts of institutions. Uh, but then finally,
00:26:43.780
like, you know, what's really important to note is that like foreigners are all in that
00:26:47.740
category and especially like foreign students and H1Bs. And I think that that heuristic actually
00:26:52.600
applies like broadly to our civilizations. Like really what we have with the boomers is
00:26:56.440
like the, like a whole bunch of people who should have been the core, like kind of the
00:26:59.480
college man or, you know, it's sort of a grouping. So it includes women as well. Um, you know,
00:27:03.680
maybe all of them sort of like moved into this like more rebel category, subversive category
00:27:07.480
and, or not all of them, but a great number of them are far too many. Um, and then now you
00:27:12.360
have all of these foreigners here, right. All different sorts of like visa programs,
00:27:15.960
legal migration, refugees, illegal immigrants, whatever else. And there's just like so few
00:27:20.680
people left who are actually preserving the core, like who like actually represents like
00:27:25.060
the, like the core Western identity and, and like our actual civilization. And this is like
00:27:30.060
fundamentally the biggest problem with the H1B. Like, yes, we can talk about the fact that
00:27:33.600
they're like, they're taking certain jobs. Like, yes, it is true that like H1B legally is supposed
00:27:38.140
to be for like critical skills that are missing. And it is true that like, as we, as we all saw
00:27:42.940
on Twitter and it was like, this is like, this was like published in prominent news versus like,
00:27:47.780
you know, the, the H1Bs were being used for a $30,000 per year cook number three at a hotel.
00:27:52.780
Like that's not like, that's, there's, there's like fraud. There are other problems. Like none
00:27:56.320
of this makes any sense, but at a very high level, you know, the, the problem is that there's,
00:28:02.200
there's just like not enough people advancing our civilization. And there are like far too many
00:28:06.860
people like advancing sort of like fundamentally foreign, um, you know, you, we could even go
00:28:12.000
into like the question, like, you know, a lot of these people are like, like, you know, in this
00:28:15.920
case, it's like, all of them are Hindu, right? It's like, you know, that's, this is like, like
00:28:19.280
base level idolatry, like pagan, like Eastern paganism. Like, we want to import like 50 million
00:28:27.300
more of those. Like, do you want your kid to have to like debate the merits of Hinduism in middle
00:28:32.340
school and like be proselytized or something? I think like some of this stuff, we have to like take
00:28:36.620
it, you know, uh, you know, maybe even moving like a stage, a step outside of the material
00:28:41.280
consideration for real, uh, like the cultural considerations and sort of like these sorts
00:28:46.200
of things I think are also particularly motivating for, uh, let's say Gen Z people who are like
00:28:50.580
reaching as you described, like, like, why are they looking at Catholicism? Why are they
00:28:54.080
like kind of maybe like yearning for more stability or like, like ownership or a stake? Um, you know,
00:28:59.860
a lot of assets do with, there's like actually not a lot to grab onto right now. And, um, uh, so,
00:29:05.300
like that's something we actually have to solve. Are you, are you implying that the founders didn't
00:29:09.760
envision a giant golden monkey god warrior statue in North Carolina? Are you, are you saying the
00:29:21.480
founding father Martin Luther King would have judged, uh, Hindus unfavorably on the content of
00:29:26.040
their character for that particular movie? Look, look, look, I mean, you, uh, you're the one,
00:29:30.220
you're the, you're a, you're the British lad, I guess. So, so, uh, I don't know if I should,
00:29:33.740
uh, I should, but yes, you're right. So they were not. So yeah, they wouldn't be allowed to do that
00:29:40.160
over here because obviously, uh, the Muslims wouldn't allow it. Exactly. What? Yeah.
00:29:48.220
Back on. I thought it was over, but I guess it's back. Yeah. I'll, I'll, I'll throw out something as
00:29:53.040
well. Like, I think, you know, not enough has been, not enough has been said on the, on the student
00:29:57.620
visa side of things. Like I think there's been a really good, um, really excellent attack on the
00:30:02.920
H1B where it's like pretty sour, like on average, probably like, you know, we talked to, we started
00:30:06.500
here like perception of capitalism, perception of socialism, perception of H1B has been, has been
00:30:11.140
tanking publicly, which is good. That means that, you know, we're winning the argument. I would say
00:30:15.140
student visas. It's still, uh, I think people still have a favorable view. Uh, you know, it's, it's like,
00:30:20.360
you know, NYU has 27,000 international students. Like I, it's like hard to even sort of wrap,
00:30:25.280
wrap your head around that, you know, MI, MIT has over a thousand citizens, like Chinese
00:30:30.640
communist, you know, like, like six full-blown CCP, um, you know, uh, people's Republic of China,
00:30:36.500
uh, people like currently like there and, you know, Stanford also that I was, you know,
00:30:42.580
with like some of the people at Stanford review, they blew a big story at Stanford that there was,
00:30:47.060
uh, you know, they reported on a, like a fully operationalized, basically like espionage
00:30:52.000
through students operation at Stanford, um, by, by, by China. And like, those are the,
00:30:58.220
there's like national security concerns, things like this. But then, um, you know, culturally
00:31:02.660
too, it's like, you go on campus and it's like, you know, like hall, it's like Halloween or
00:31:06.720
Thanksgiving or Christmas or whatever. And it's like, okay, like dude, what every year,
00:31:11.480
less of the student body even cares or participates. And, and this gets at like,
00:31:15.360
what we call like subversion of the core. Um, you know, I, I, I guess I want like our
00:31:21.280
colleges to like still have Halloween parties and like to still celebrate, like, let's do Christmas
00:31:26.180
actually at our colleges. And the fact that every year fewer people do is concerning, of course.
00:31:33.480
Yeah. It's quite depressing actually this year because, um, so my wife and I, we, so we actually
00:31:37.620
are one of the few zoom or she's a millennial, but we, we got a house. Um, it was 10 times when you said
00:31:48.560
earlier that, you know, American house prices have gone up from, you know, three times your average
00:31:52.360
income to a in Britain, it's gone from two times to 11 times. Like why? Yeah. My, my, my parents got
00:31:58.100
their house in the late nineties. It's tiny house, similar size to ours for, you know, less than a
00:32:03.940
hundred thousand pounds. And we paid North of 400,000 for ours. And it's like the same house
00:32:10.420
size just a few years later. Anyway. So when it was Halloween this year, we, we bought chocolate
00:32:15.220
expecting people to knock on doors. Cause obviously everyone goes trick or treating. We had one set
00:32:20.500
of kids knock on our door and it was two, two Asian kids. That's it. And we are, we are still
00:32:25.700
in a, a, we're in the, one of the only two places in London that's still like a English
00:32:30.260
majority borough. Nobody has kids in our suburb. It's so you're, you're right in that. Yes.
00:32:36.180
It's, it's also, you know, replacement migration. It's got economic effects. It's got national
00:32:40.720
security effects. We, we have about until the most recent immigration numbers, we had
00:32:45.880
90,000 Chinese visas issued every year. Pretty much all of those were students and a few extra
00:32:50.500
thousand as well from Bangladesh and India. So we had about a hundred thousand students
00:32:54.120
in again, a country, the size of New York state, our university system is entirely corrupt.
00:32:58.120
There was loads of intellectual property errors, but also, you know, campuses became an unfamiliar
00:33:02.980
environment. All of the best student accommodation was given to the Chinese students who were paying
00:33:07.200
for up from, and, you know, gambling in the common full, full sticker price. And same here
00:33:10.900
in America, I mean, we have one and a half million foreign students. And, uh, you know, a lot of it
00:33:14.740
is really this like interesting arrangement between the university administrations and these foreign
00:33:19.120
students where it's like, they, they sort of like profit personally, but I would argue a great
00:33:23.440
detriment to American students and to our sort of our country. Yeah. In Scotland where the university
00:33:28.660
is there, like, cause the Scottish students get free tuition. So there's zero incentive for these
00:33:33.000
Scottish universities actually accept Scottish students. So they just like literally battery
00:33:36.920
farm foreigners, as long as you're willing to pay again, full sticker price, come on in,
00:33:41.580
here's your visa and how you get two years extra in the UK. And there's a lot of people in China
00:33:46.100
and India. Right. And so it's like, it's not that hard to find like one, one guy whose parents are
00:33:52.320
willing to like cough up the 45 K or whatever it costs to send them to this place. And, and for them,
00:33:57.020
it's sort of a, you know, a way to sort of enter maybe some sort of another, you could be like,
00:34:00.780
you know, that, that incentive system is, is, you know, that, that's to be crushed. Of course,
00:34:04.860
like you can't, we can't have like the colleges that all of us went to just simply become like,
00:34:10.240
like farming zones for foreign students. Like, it's like, uh, it's, it's actually very dystopian.
00:34:15.040
Yeah, literally. And also it destroys your college teams. I mean, we need like, we need like,
00:34:19.120
Americans are the most athletic people on planet earth. What's Harvard going to do when it's all
00:34:23.020
Chinese? Seriously. I mean, like the, yeah, yeah. Oh, so many Jeremy Lens out there, you know,
00:34:28.800
like this is a serious consideration, but you two have both made a good point, which is like,
00:34:33.100
this needs to be amplified in the right is yes. There's a plethora of economic arguments against
00:34:40.120
mass migration or immigration broadly. And I accept all those and I utilize them myself,
00:34:45.620
but the demographic makeup of your country is a very, in and of itself is a very valid reason to
00:34:52.880
be opposed to immigration. Even if these immigrants were coming here and they were like economic miracles,
00:34:56.380
which they're not, but let's just presuppose that it's still valid to have a concern over
00:35:02.060
what my neighborhood, what my state, what my country looks like. Cause again, like I made the
00:35:07.400
point earlier, that's what gives you a sense of belonging in the world. That is when you look
00:35:11.880
around and there's people that reflect your culture and who you are as a person, that is a
00:35:16.280
stabilizing force. That gives you a sense of security in your life. Like you're not worried about
00:35:21.880
my culture, my people that are an extension of me, my nation, my people. You're not worried about that
00:35:27.540
being exterminated overnight. Like you still feel like you're going to have a degree of eternal,
00:35:32.740
um, you know, like you're going to have an echo of yourself continuing on after you pass.
00:35:38.960
Yeah. I mean, I've been, I've been spending, uh, maybe a little bit more time recently with a few,
00:35:42.860
let's say, look on my closer to fundamentals Baptists and you know, what's, what's,
00:35:47.560
that's always good for you. Right. I think, I think everybody should do a little bit more of that.
00:35:50.480
Even, even, even you caught her as a Catholic. Um, so, so, you know, you know, you, even just
00:35:56.240
like going back to the old Testament, right. And, uh, yes, we can, yes. First, before we go to the
00:36:01.440
old Testament, we can look at, you know, sort of the history of Christendom in, in Europe and across,
00:36:05.380
let's say, you know, after the fall of Rome up until sort of, uh, uh, let's say like, you know,
00:36:10.860
early modernity, but, um, you know, look, look at what like the actual old Testament says about like
00:36:16.140
how, how leaders of a nation should think about like foreign idolaters. Right. And, um, like,
00:36:22.600
just like, look at what Exodus has to say, like, yeah, it really is pretty explicit. Like you shall
00:36:26.000
like, you shall make no covenants with them or their gods. Like they shall not dwell in your land.
00:36:30.180
Like this is exactly what it, what it says now. Of course, this is a speaking to, to Israel in that
00:36:34.260
context, but of course, like, you know, uh, many of these things still apply. Like the, the church is
00:36:38.860
the sort of new Israel, the, the, the body of Christ. And yes, like, you know, I think people
00:36:43.860
took this seriously and, you know, whether you looked at like the battle of the Ponto, you know,
00:36:47.860
in 1571, you know, Christendom, you know, basically driving out the Muslims. Uh, it's like,
00:36:53.960
it's, um, you know, United forces and sort of interestingly, it's primarily, primarily Catholic,
00:36:58.160
but, uh, some, you know, like some like German Protestants, Lutherans came in and joined in,
00:37:02.080
in that, in that struggle. And I think like, you know, it's not just the Muslims. We have all sorts of,
00:37:07.020
you know, sort of, uh, sort of problems right now, I would say. And some of it's just nihilism,
00:37:11.420
atheism, like, you know, it was like the weirdest thing, of course, as well. And, um, these things
00:37:15.560
are real. And, uh, I think in the coming decades, uh, it's not going away. Like, uh, it, it will
00:37:20.440
require, you know, sort of like men who are, you know, men of the West who are Christian, who care
00:37:24.600
about these sorts of things to actually, uh, you know, let's like, you know, to actually like
00:37:29.440
advance, uh, something that's a little bit more, um, positive and serious, I would say.
00:37:34.220
Yeah. You're going to struggle to convince me diversity is a strength when it's
00:37:36.920
literally listed, uh, uh, as a punishment rule by foreigners in Deuteronomy. Like,
00:37:42.060
yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And I think, um, you know, there's, let's say previous generations
00:37:47.200
probably just like, didn't, didn't take this seriously enough, right. That this is like,
00:37:50.780
not going to go that well, actually in the, in the coming decades. You look at like, look
00:37:54.600
at Yugoslavia, look at what happened to South Africa or like, you know, all other places that
00:37:58.080
you could, you could look at, like this doesn't end well. Um, for, so, so, you know, it's important
00:38:03.100
that we, you know, people of our generation will say at least take it seriously. Yeah. Well,
00:38:07.580
like lip charts will literally be like, Oh, the reason these African countries are so
00:38:11.180
dysfunctional is because the European colonial powers arbitrarily drew borders without considerations
00:38:15.520
for like the tribal allegiances and qualms and that sort of thing. And I'm like, you just
00:38:19.780
accepted my terms, which is that diversity in and of itself will create a dysfunctional country.
00:38:25.000
They'll accept it when it comes to Africa. And that for the record is vaguely correct.
00:38:30.000
But then as soon as you import people from literally the other side of the world to the
00:38:34.340
United Kingdom, to the United States, and then that breeds dysfunction, it's attributed to
00:38:38.360
other factors rather than the truth, which is, yeah, you need, you need like demographic
00:38:43.300
cultural cohesion for a country to be functional.
00:38:47.100
If you create Somali spawn points in your suburbs though, I'm sure it'll just all go very well.
00:38:52.160
This is, this is the major frustration I have with a lot of, uh, liberals on the right where
00:38:58.320
they have blank slate presuppositions baked into their language, especially in Britain.
00:39:04.160
But you, you get a lot of this on the legacy American right, not, not much of the sort of
00:39:09.240
heritage American new right. Um, it's the idea that if we just got rid of the amplification
00:39:15.500
of differences caused by woke identity politics and kind of shut our eyes and refuse to recognize
00:39:22.520
intractable cultural and identity ethnic differences between groups. And if we just
00:39:28.180
did a rising tide raises all ships approach to the economy, and yet again, you know, we
00:39:33.120
need to fix a bunch of economic issues that have been dispossessing young men and women
00:39:36.740
of their opportunity to own a home and have meaningful work and have families, don't get me wrong.
00:39:41.100
But if we just rectified, if we just twiddled the dials on education, cultural cohesion,
00:39:45.480
and economic opportunities, then actually the, the kind of liberal utopia, the, the Mondani
00:39:52.880
socialists use as window dressing for their anti-white racial resentment, um, it will be
00:39:59.600
achieved. And it's actually, the problem is that the left are just going about the shared
00:40:04.660
premises the wrong way. I mean, this is, this is how you end up with the left and right
00:40:09.880
being the two cheeks of the same post-war liberal consensus backside that Reno's written about
00:40:13.920
before. And the, the, what I think we've recognized is with these fractured ethno-cultural
00:40:20.080
circumstances, which has, we've been born into because of just diversification and operating
00:40:26.680
our border and economic policies on blank slate assumptions, we recognize the natural tribalism
00:40:31.360
of human beings, and we are much more pessimistic about the prospect of integration and of the
00:40:36.480
material considerations that you spoke about, Nathan, resolving those intractable differences.
00:40:40.280
But our willingness to be honest about that is both the solution to the problem, but it's
00:40:46.120
also the reason the boomers recoil in horror from any person under 30 on their own ostensible
00:40:52.240
political side who is more honest about these issues. Like there is, there is no, nobody under
00:40:58.520
30 actually believes in the blank slate. They're either full-throated gay race, communist revolutionaries,
00:41:03.620
um, and appeasing various oppressed non-white groups or, or various perverted sexual identities,
00:41:11.220
or they're, they're just spouting 1350 and saying, saying Scott Adams quotes, uh, rest in peace.
00:41:18.100
Um, whereas your, your, your, your average boomer, like we've, we had this, we had this meltdown
00:41:22.720
recently where a bunch of liberal liberals on the ostensible right in the UK reacted to the,
00:41:28.680
the civil war in America between Shapiro and Vivek and Tucker and Fuentes by saying, oh yeah,
00:41:33.680
there's groupers all over the UK and they're talking about ethnicity and identity and they're
00:41:36.860
against civic nationalism. It's like, number one, that's not what that means. But number two,
00:41:39.860
we just speak in completely incompatible terms and you're not willing to recognize our concerns
00:41:45.820
as legitimate. And therefore, just like with economics, they're pulling up the political
00:41:49.940
ladder off to themselves and then wondering why their ideas don't have any purchase.
00:41:53.660
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Well, Nathan, I know you have a hard out coming up here soon,
00:41:59.740
seeing as you are in the business of solutions and, uh, you talk about this quite extensively on your,
00:42:05.180
uh, musings on Twitter and elsewhere in your publications. Could you give a sort of prescription
00:42:11.300
for young men watching this show? Um, obviously they are accepting all of our arguments because
00:42:16.420
they're just objectively true. We're just administering the correct take here. Can you maybe give a
00:42:20.560
prescription, um, and sort of a reaction to this, uh, you know, this entire conversation as we, uh,
00:42:26.200
close down here? Yeah, I would just say, I would, you know, I would encourage people to not fall into,
00:42:31.640
into nihilism or, or lack of action. Um, you know, what's exciting about doing venture capital is that
00:42:39.360
I get to talk with many of the young people who are excited about solving these problems. So things
00:42:44.400
like, like addiction in America or, um, you know, let's say family formation or home ownership,
00:42:50.920
uh, we generally look for young founders who are solving these problems. I just like,
00:42:56.200
so name one or two really quickly. Like we recently invested in sunflower sober, which is a platform for
00:43:01.520
people struggling with addiction. The founders passionate about, uh, solving opioid addiction,
00:43:06.100
other things in America, like the American housing corporation is doing basically, uh,
00:43:10.400
row home builds in cities that are well constructed for families. Uh, and there's some technology that
00:43:15.860
allows them to essentially build at a much cheaper price and sell to families. And so we're constantly
00:43:21.900
looking for people like that. And, uh, maybe my call to young people would be to, you know,
00:43:27.740
find people like that who are ambitious and are working on the big problems and, uh, go work on them
00:43:33.480
yourself. And so that might mean moving, um, or it might mean like investing more locally in your
00:43:39.260
community, but, uh, to, you know, like actually be, be a player character or maybe, you know,
00:43:44.400
we talked about, there's a little bit of like a main player syndrome, but maybe to like not do it as
00:43:48.020
much as the, like the influencer TikTok side, but to just go, like, go build and go, go do useful
00:43:52.980
things. And, uh, and then politics also matters. So I'd say, you know, you should be involved with that
00:43:57.180
as well. I love it, dude. Well, where can people find you? I'm on X. So just Nathan Halberstadt or
00:44:04.520
like at N-A-T-H-A-L-B-E-R-S-T-A-D-T. And, uh, also have a podcast, the new founding podcast where
00:44:12.840
I often try to talk with, uh, people across the cultural, political, and like technology type,
00:44:17.760
uh, type spaces that, uh, are, you know, working on some of the problems that we've been talking
00:44:22.360
about. I love it, dude. Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for hopping on Connor. Where can people
00:44:26.620
find you? And maybe if you have a similar anecdote for young guys. Uh, yeah, I don't know. I don't
00:44:33.080
have much advice other than, uh, in the inverse. Um, always, if you get the opportunity before you
00:44:39.280
have to enter the, the world of work proper, do a physical job. Like I would go insane if I didn't
00:44:45.660
have my garden. And I'm very glad that I was doing like day laborer gardening with my grandfather and
00:44:50.500
my uncle in my teenage years. Uh, it gave me some grounding and improved my work ethic. And it's
00:44:55.520
hopefully in Cincinnati's fashion, what I can go back to when we've, when we've won and we've pressed
00:44:59.680
the fix ever mix, which you can find me at Connor Tomlinson on YouTube and on sub stack should
00:45:04.860
be under Tomlinson talks. And you can follow me on Twitter at on the con underscore Tomlinson.
00:45:10.240
I love it. I love it. I agree with both your analysis. Yes. Find good people. That's the
00:45:14.480
most important part. It's the most difficult part of being a young person is finding other
00:45:17.960
like-minded individuals, but they're out there and trust me, you will find them if you look in
00:45:22.340
the right place. Uh, and yeah, I also agree with Connor. I mean, yeah, do something with
00:45:26.140
your hands, like figure out what you are capable of physically. I know it's, uh, you know, some
00:45:31.040
people in this space, they really go overboard with that, but there's so much truth. There's
00:45:35.040
you really need to know what you're capable of. If you are going to determine what your
00:45:38.600
purpose is and sort of which avenues you want to pursue. So I totally agree. Uh, with that,
00:45:42.980
you can follow me on X and Instagram at real tape Brown. We will be back next weekend with
00:45:47.000
more across the pond. Nathan, thank you so much for hopping on. We'll probably see you again
00:45:51.080
soon. So with that, we will see you guys next week. Thank you very much. Thanks guys.