Nigeria's Christian Genocide, Media Ignoring Atrocities w⧸ Judd Saul & Kyle Abst
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
185.38574
Hate Speech Sentences
169
Summary
In this episode, we talk with the International Committee in Nigeria about the persecution of Christians in their home country, Nigeria. We talk about how Christians in Nigeria are being persecuted and killed, and how we can do something about it.
Transcript
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So today, there's a lot of talk about conflicts in the Middle East that are ongoing,
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but there's a conflict going on in part of Africa that hasn't been getting the attention
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In Nigeria, there are a lot of Christians that are dealing with what some people are calling
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And so here today to talk about that, we've got some people that'll dive into it.
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So Kyle, why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself?
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I'm Executive Director of the International Committee in Nigeria and also a colleague
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I moved to Nigeria in 1999, raised my family there, left in 2016, and came back with the
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need to share the voices of Nigerians that are being persecuted and being killed.
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So I've taken it upon myself to do that for the last 10 years.
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I'm Judd Saul, founder and director of Equipping the Persecuted, a boots-on-the-ground mission
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in Nigeria that actually helps persecuted Christians.
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And we've been at this for a long time, trying to get word out about what's going on in Nigeria,
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and we are very grateful to be on the show today.
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In case you don't know, Carter Banks is here as well.
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All right, so for the people that are unfamiliar, because this hasn't gotten a lot of coverage.
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I mean, if you're an extremely online person, if you're a religious Christian, you might
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be aware of this kind of stuff, because this kind of stuff would come across your feed,
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or maybe you've heard about it in your particular church, possibly people asking for donations
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But for the average kind of politically interested person, would you go ahead and kind of give
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us the background of what's going on and how we've gotten to this point?
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Yeah, I mean, Nigeria is the most populous African nation with over 220 million people.
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So by and large, it should be getting focused because there's so much population, but somehow
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Maybe there's something dumbing it down or something.
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Nigeria, is it similar to most of the other, like most other countries where there's significant
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population densities in cities, or is it kind of spread out, more tribal kind of thing?
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I mean, cities is where the money is, where you get a job.
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But then people are, it's 50% agricultural, so a lot of people have farms.
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So there's a lot of people in the village areas.
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But it was developed or designed by the European powers, you know, after the First World War,
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they kind of put these borders, absorbed over 500 different ethnic groups.
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So there's a lot of, you know, tension already because the Muslims came from the north.
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They came from the Middle East along the Sahel Desert.
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And then they indoctrinated and converted people there while the Christians came in from the
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south, from the ocean, slave trade and all that stuff.
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So the history is already ripe with contention because of the different ethnic groups.
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But it's taken on a whole different dimension when they started killing the Fulanese who
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declared a jihad in 1804 and designed a caliphate in parts of what is northern Nigeria now.
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And with that sort of remnant in their minds, they continue to use that.
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And there's a radical group of Fulani militant extremist Islamic who are trying to kill Christians
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and just displace them and convert the whole of Nigeria into an Islamic republic.
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So the location of Nigeria, it's not actually, well, no, Africa's huge.
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And you look at a regular map that you're familiar with on, you know, from school or whatever,
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and Africa kind of doesn't get the credit that it's due for the size of the land mass.
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Like it's the only, the only, it's the biggest continent that, except for Asia, right?
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It's the second biggest continent, I believe it is.
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And Nigeria is kind of in the middle of it and kind of, it's a landlocked country, right?
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So where were the people that were coming up from the south, the Christians and stuff?
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They are descendants of like the Dutch, or who were the people that actually colonized the south
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that actually started bringing the Christian faith into Africa?
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Portuguese was first, and then the British was the main colony.
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So at this point, there's the violence you said has been going on for...
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But 20 years is really, it's taken this religious turn.
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Yeah, the primary driving force of the killing of Christians in Nigeria is the Fulani tribe.
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They're a radical Islamist tribe that practice a Saudi Arabian...
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These Saudi Arabian Sunni form of Islam, that is the same ideology of ISIS, that is the same ideology of Boko Haram.
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And they have declared that Nigeria is theirs for the taking.
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And Allah has given them Nigeria so they feel that they can do whatever they want to grab that land.
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And so they've just been running unimpeded for the last 20 years.
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So it's not like a giant army going in and taking over major cities, but over systematically over time, they move in.
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They're not indigenous to Nigeria, but they move in, they grow the population, they gain political power.
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Once they have the political power, then the killing starts.
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And then once they have the political cover in these northern states, then they start going after more land and more villages and start doing the killing.
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And this is why hardly anybody talks about it, because they have the political cover, even within the Nigerian government, to go do these killings and run around on just killing unimpeded.
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So you often see them with herds of cattle, and that's where they make their money.
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And they're actually stretched from Senegal all the way through Central Africa, some say even to South Sudan, into Sudan.
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And when he says they're not indigenous to Nigeria, it means they will not – if you speak to a Fulani in Senegal, where are you from?
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They have no form of identity, the nomadic ones.
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Some have settled since the 1800s in cities and set up in politics, as Judd said.
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But so they're – in 1804, the Fulani Jihad was declared, and they wiped out – or they tried to wipe out all the non – the infidels, anyone who didn't want to convert to their belief of Islam.
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But there are – to be fair, there are Fulani who are Christians.
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It's not because a missionary or some Western person converts them.
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It's somehow they come to know who Jesus was through a vision, something.
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And they're stuck between a rock and a hard place, because if they tell anyone in their family that they've converted to Christianity, they'll be killed.
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But at the same time, they've got to cover that and make sure they don't expose themselves.
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So why don't you guys go ahead and give a little more backstory on – you said that the – it was the – what, the 1907 Jihad is what they say?
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Can you give a little – can you give a little of the history for that?
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Is it that they declared a caliphate, they said, and then they were – essentially decided that it was time to engage in jihad, engage in holy war.
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How is it that they – how have they been trying to carry out the jihad, and why has it kicked up in the past 20 years?
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Is it just that the information gets out more readily because of the internet?
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I don't imagine that there's a lot of people – or that 20 years ago there were a lot of people with internet-capable phones.
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That's something that came in the past 10 years if it is out there.
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Because I know that Facebook was doing a lot to try and bring the internet to people in Africa, and they were spending a lot of money, and they were giving out phones and building infrastructure.
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That was one of the things that Facebook is famous for doing is like spreading Facebook by spreading the internet.
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And so that makes sense that the information would get out in the past 10 years, but this is something that's been going on.
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So can you give me a little bit of backstory about the actual history of the jihad?
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I'll do the backstory, then you take it to modern day.
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So the history – so there's different kingdoms that were set up all throughout West Africa, right?
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But then the – 1804, a Fulani named Uthman dan Fodio declared jihad because he thought all the Muslims that were there weren't worshipping the way they should.
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So he slaughtered, killed people that wouldn't go about the way he wanted to set up the emirates, different locations with different emirates.
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And those exist to this day, the emir of Sokoto, Sultan of Tokoto, there's the Kano.
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There's different places where these emirs live or they rule, and they have to be Fulani.
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And so that backstory, that history still remains to this day.
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They were taking the resources and then exporting them.
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But they worked with the tribal groups to try to rule by exemption.
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They weren't there in the country, or they were there, but they ruled through these leaders.
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And the Fulani had that sort of central system, the emir, the sultan.
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So they figured out, let's use them to rule and to take this further into the south.
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And then that's how, to this day, we'll talk, Judd will talk more about that, how it became today.
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But to this day, Fulani's are in power strategically to rule.
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And they've, 36 states in Nigeria, 12 of them are allowed to practice Sharia law, which is against the Constitution.
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You're not supposed to have an opposing political belief, but they're allowed 12 states because those are in the...
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Is the Nigerian Constitution similar to the United States, or is it...
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They started with the parliamentary system in 1960, but then by three years later, they decided to become a Republican, copy the U.S. Constitution.
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Yeah, so continue to what's going on now, is 9-11, 2001, in Nigeria, they executed a major, major attack, killing over 1,000 Christians in one swoop.
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And that was kind of their mark in the sand, that the jihad is starting again.
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And ever since then, so we say over the last 20 years, they have been actively moving and systematically been restarted the jihad and conquering territory.
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There was really peace amongst all the tribes, because they kind of kept order.
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But go to 9-11, 2001, 1,000 Christians get killed, and then systematically moving in.
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So that was right after 9-11, but was it like on the same day?
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Oh, really? So they did it? They did it in conjunction?
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Major attack happened, 1,000 Christians died in Nigeria, got no attention whatsoever, no notice.
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But ever since then, they have elevated and continue their jihad and continue to get more political power.
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And now we're to the point where the last three presidents of Nigeria have been Muslims, and the vice presidents...
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00:14:02.040
I've also been Muslims. Muslim, Muslim tickets.
00:14:08.320
No, it was, but no, it's still Christian-majority.
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You could ask people, they say, oh, it's 50-50. That's just a general thing.
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But if you ask Christians, they'll say they're actually more Christians than Muslims.
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So it's actually majority, but the last three election cycles have been Muslim-Muslim tickets, and that has allowed, I say, political cover for these terrorists to run around the country unimpeded with AK-47s and all sorts of other military-style weapons going around and doing killing, while Nigeria's a country that banned guns.
00:14:40.800
Yeah, to have a gun in Nigeria, you have to register, and typically it's for hunting.
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If you use it on a human, even if you're defending your house, someone's coming in, you shoot them, you could go to jail.
00:14:53.140
I mean, there are states in the United States where that's the case.
00:14:56.160
You know, if you're in New Jersey or Massachusetts or Illinois or any other, there's probably seven or eight different states where that's the case, but...
00:15:03.740
Yeah, but for some reason, terrorists, a band of motorcycles with AK-47s and RPGs just blow by the police and the military throughout Nigeria, and they let them go right on by.
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It's typical of leftist governments, to be honest with you, but go ahead.
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There's a lot of reasons as to why, and we can go into the corruption talk later about how a lot of Nigerian government officials are on the take.
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They're being paid off, and some of them are even profiting off of the activities of the terrorists through their kidnapping, the extortion, the stealing of lands, and the jizya they're having, making the farmers pay in the communities.
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It's corrupt from the top down, but many of these, there are politicians that are on the take and profiting off of this.
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So, like, that's kind of something that Alexander Solzhenitsyn was talking about in the Soviet Union.
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He mentioned or he discussed how if a criminal, someone that was, you know, living outside of the rules, not trying to obey the law and stuff, if he was caught with a knife or with a weapon, they would say, well, you know, he doesn't know any better, and this is just his nature, so we have to forgive him and forget and et cetera.
00:16:14.380
Whereas if a normal person that's trying to live within the rules is caught with a weapon, well, you know, you should have known better, and they'll throw the book at you.
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Is there a lot of leftist policy that's being implemented in Nigeria, or is this kind of just emergent where people that don't have a Western sensibility kind of just behave that way?
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Well, I mean, so it's set up, oil is their biggest export, so they have billions of dollars in oil.
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The money for the states and local governments is given by the federal government.
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So the federal government gives us, blocks them all the money to the state, to the districts, to the wards, so it trickles down.
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So if you're disobeying or you're doing something that doesn't please the federal government, i.e. the president or in his administration, you could be, your money could be withheld.
00:17:10.940
At the same time, as Job was saying, that there's people that need extra money, so they confide or they turn a blind eye to these attacks and things happen.
00:17:22.200
We don't know, but there's increasing evidence that there's some people connected with these terrorists and militants.
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Okay. So if the terrorists or if these Muslim groups, the Islamic radicals, are attacking the Christians and they have no way to fight back, what do you guys think is the prescription here?
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Do you think that there's – if the government is actually protecting the people that are attacking, do you think that there's any kind of political solution or is it something where the people that are being attacked, they're going to have to defend themselves?
00:18:00.520
And if they're going to have to defend themselves, like what means – because you said there are gun laws there and you can't have guns.
00:18:07.540
And so what do you think that the way for these people to move forward is?
00:18:15.740
So the terrorists, Boko Haram, I swap up in the northeast, Borno, that's being handled by the army, by the military, of the government.
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And to say they're doing a good job, maybe, I don't know, but they're at least stopping spread.
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But they're not – they haven't defeated them.
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They claim to defeat them five, ten years ago, but they haven't.
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So they're continually doing stuff with and against them with the aid of India, with Pakistan, with the U.S. money for military weapons to help combat these.
00:18:41.640
But oftentimes they get overrun and those weapons get stolen and who knows where they end up.
00:18:45.580
Well, I guess we kind of know where they end up.
00:18:47.540
So then the terrorists are the one, the I swap, the Boko Haram, but then the Fulani militants is a different one.
00:18:54.680
So let me just tell you how – explain how things work in Nigeria.
00:19:03.460
You know, the terrorists a lot of times get their weapons, and we got this documented and through testimony, they actually rent their weapons from the military for 24 hours.
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So there's bad actors in the military and police where they will rent weapons from the police and military for a 24-hour attack and then give the weapons back the day after the attack.
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They get – they call it sophisticated weapons in Nigeria, but they're getting brand new AK-47s, new Russian-based AK-47s, and that money is coming up from the north.
00:19:46.240
So the Fulani terrorists do coincide and work with ISIS, and they do work with Boko Haram, but they're kind of the – I refer to them as the Viet Cong-style force.
00:19:58.740
You have the North Vietnamese Army, which is well-funded, orchestrated, everything going on.
00:20:02.620
Well, then you have the Viet Cong, which are the renegade boots on the ground.
00:20:07.080
They're given marching orders, and they are executing the jihad in the middle belt while all the attention, all the money is being focused on up north.
00:20:20.440
Now, these current politicians and people in power could not be in place without the support of these terror-controlled – these territories controlled by terrorists.
00:20:37.160
Are they getting outside money as well, or is this just something that's coming out of the government?
00:20:41.240
We believe that they are getting outside money.
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They're getting outside money from up north, from the Middle East, from places like Turkey, Saudi Arabia.
00:20:52.720
In fact, we know that there are – several of these terror leaders are getting paid trips to Saudi Arabia for their pilgrimage and pilgrimage to Saudi Arabia.
00:21:06.920
Mecca, and they're being funded by folks up in Saudi Arabia and in the Middle East.
00:21:17.700
And you asked about how the – is leftist politics involved?
00:21:23.600
Well, we know that the far left across the world, far left governments have been supporting the current president and the previous presidents that have been allowing the killing of Christians, including Democrat operatives from the United States.
00:21:41.800
Obama operatives, David Axelrod and company, have been in Nigeria the last three presidential election cycles, helping Muslim candidates win offices over Christian candidates.
00:21:54.540
So there is a collusion of the far left working within the Nigerian government and getting bad actors elected.
00:22:05.820
And you have this sort of narrative that goes out.
00:22:13.180
But this middle belt one, this middle area of Fulani extremists, militants, we can't say that because that's – you're denigrating the whole population of Fulanis.
00:22:23.980
We know some good Fulanis, but they're militant.
00:22:26.880
Some of them are very militant, and the good ones can't expose.
00:22:30.100
They can't help, and they can't do anything to stop it because they'll be killed themselves.
00:22:37.080
But the narrative that goes out in the U.S. and around the world is it's a farmer-herder, it's an ethnic clash.
00:22:42.380
That's why you don't hear about – what sounds better, ethnic clash, farmer-herder, or Christian genocide?
00:22:48.380
Well, I mean the idea of a Christian genocide is there are a lot of people in the West that are just allergic to that concept because they feel like it's a – they feel like any kind of acknowledgement of that is going to be helping their political opponents in the U.S.
00:23:06.480
I mean, you can bring this up from Al Jazeera here.
00:23:10.020
Bill Maher has said there is no Christian genocide in Nigeria.
00:23:15.480
Bill Maher says there's a systematically killing of Christians in Nigeria, so they're countering his –
00:23:21.380
No, Bill Maher, there is no Christian genocide in Nigeria.
00:23:23.620
So Al Jazeera is running cover for essentially what's going on in Nigeria.
00:23:31.140
From Al Jazeera, in recent days, coordinated attacks on Nigeria's nationhood have swept across social media, blogs, and television outlets, alleging a so-called Christian genocide.
00:23:40.700
These attacks, driven by foreign actors, mischaracterize Nigeria's domestic conflicts, ignore its complexities, and manipulate longstanding ethnic and resource-based tension to advance sectarian agendas.
00:23:51.320
I mean, this doesn't seem like it's particularly surprising from Al Jazeera, considering where it's based and the people that fund it.
00:24:01.540
But is it not an issue for the – that Christians should be focused on, or is it something that – you know, is it something that they could actually convince people it's just tribalism and it has nothing to do with their Christianity?
00:24:25.280
This particular guy that wrote this article is from the office of vice president of Nigeria.
00:24:31.820
Now, the vice president of Nigeria has been very well affiliated with bad actors for a very, very long time, and he's got quite the reputation in Nigeria of being affiliated with the bad guys.
00:24:43.420
Now, why is there spin, and why does a spin hit the U.S.?
00:24:47.520
Al Jazeera is one of those publications to blame for this.
00:24:50.940
It's because – I'll just give you a prime example.
00:24:54.000
For example, in June, Father's Day this year, 280 Christians were killed.
00:25:01.820
They were – half of them were burned alive, and the ones that weren't burned alive were trying to escape or hacked to death with machetes.
00:25:19.140
Al Jazeera comes out, and they lie about the numbers.
00:25:22.540
They say 100 were killed, and they call it tribal clashes, farmer-herda clashes.
00:25:31.980
When they talk about it like that, do they get into the motivation?
00:25:40.220
So here's what happens with the news in Nigeria, okay?
00:25:43.320
And this is kind of different for Westerners to understand this.
00:25:47.300
If a major event happens, the government calls for the press conference.
00:25:54.140
The government pays the journalists to show up to cover the press conference.
00:25:59.800
If the government does not call for a press conference, the event never happened.
00:26:05.440
But the journalists who are getting paid to cover press conference have to repeat exactly what the government said.
00:26:12.680
Now, you guys had said that the constitution in Nigeria is modeled after Western constitutions.
00:26:20.940
They don't have – so far, we've kind of established that there's no protection for individual right to self-defense,
00:26:27.640
and there's no protection for the freedom of the press or freedom of religion or freedom of speech.
00:26:35.280
So by the time the information gets out and it goes to the AP, when it gets to the AP, it's all filtered through Al Jazeera.
00:26:44.620
And the AP just accepts the narrative that's being sent out.
00:26:47.940
They don't have their own – I mean, obviously, there's –
00:26:51.560
But even worse still is the data that's compiled that the U.S. government looks at, ACLED, A-C-L-E-D, that if you go to that website, they do a good job.
00:26:59.800
They try, but they're just culling the internet, just going through it.
00:27:04.880
They get this – oh, they don't say Fulani militants killed.
00:27:16.460
They know exactly who it is, and they're trying to say it, but they get stopped.
00:27:19.480
So this whole – this data system that you see reported is incorrect because all the information being fed by the so-called journalists in Nigeria aren't reporting accurately.
00:27:28.920
Right, and the final filter goes through Al Jazeera, which then goes to the AP.
00:27:34.780
And so a reason why you don't hear anything, especially coming out of mainstream press, is, one, the Nigerian government does not hold a press conference.
00:27:44.100
And the only time they hold a press conference on something is when there's more than 100 people that were killed.
00:27:49.240
You don't hear about the 10 people, the 20 people, the 30 people in the killings.
00:27:53.720
The 30 people in the killings never, never hits mainstream media unless it's over 100.
00:27:58.960
And that's – and that is where the bodies are piling up and communities are destroyed.
00:28:05.780
And then what no one talks about is after we hear about the killings is after killings, well, you have survivors that lived in these communities.
00:28:15.840
And all these people are now removed from their homes, and they have to live in camps.
00:28:21.140
And so currently, right now, there's 3.5 million Christians that are living in squalor, in awful camps, and have been removed from their communities.
00:28:32.700
Not that I'm some kind of pro-UN guy, but the UN has nothing to say about this.
00:28:37.100
They're there, but they're where the terrorists are, right?
00:28:39.320
So everyone focuses on the terrorists because that's a bad word.
00:28:42.000
We want to stop the spread of Islamic terrorism.
00:28:44.260
No one's looking at the middle – the Fulani militants action because, again, it's their own problem.
00:28:52.440
So because they're the Fulani militants, because they're not officially associated with either Boko Haram or ISIS or what have you,
00:29:00.440
they don't get any attention and no pushback from the UN or from international organizations, and there's no –
00:29:10.580
The people, the 3.5 million in this place, they don't get help.
00:29:16.800
There's no independent journalists that are down there trying to get the word out.
00:29:22.780
Can they go there and expect to not get killed by the Fulanis?
00:29:25.740
So two years ago, we created a website called truthnigeria.com to give outlets to citizen journalists in Nigeria.
00:29:32.960
We have 15 troublemaking journalists that risk their lives every day to document these things,
00:29:38.660
and that is the only outlet right now of truth getting out about what's going on in Nigeria is through truthnigeria.com.
00:29:55.160
They have to live in a few different locations.
00:29:59.720
But we are the only ones who've given them an outlet to actually say what's going on.
00:30:04.140
Otherwise, none of the information is getting out.
00:30:14.540
And so the Nigerian government doesn't want this to get out because it makes the—because, well, they're aligned with the Fulanis apparently, right?
00:30:22.020
They believe—they're at the very least, they're sympathetic to the Fulanis' perspective.
00:30:27.580
And so they're not getting any kind of help internationally.
00:30:34.300
So how many organizations such as yours are actually trying to get information out?
00:30:47.340
You know, what kind of resources do the organizations that are currently there that are trying to get information out, what kind of resources do they have?
00:30:55.860
And what is the best means to help them in your estimation?
00:31:00.500
I'll start with my ideally situation, and you cover up the emergency.
00:31:04.480
Ideally, we want to be there just to encourage them, whatever they need, help with farming, you know, sustainable agriculture, education, medical.
00:31:14.160
Just giving them a hand up, not a handout, right?
00:31:18.400
But because of the crisis, because of all the killings, you can't do that.
00:31:21.940
You're more or less responding in the emergency situation.
00:31:24.980
I mean, do they need to send Green Berets in to teach the Christians how to fight?
00:31:30.240
Like, time to get CIA involved or something, you know?
00:31:33.720
We pray for intervention, but what resources are going on?
00:31:37.240
There's not very many organizations doing what we do.
00:31:42.020
And those of us that are in the fight are underfunded, don't have the resources, because it's all private donations.
00:31:50.520
We get our organization, EquippingThePersecuted.org, gets no government funding.
00:31:54.940
The other local missionaries that are out there that we team up with don't get any big funding.
00:32:00.880
And this is a fight we've been in for several years.
00:32:03.380
That's why we're all kind of shocked that, you know, thank you for bringing us on again to talk about this,
00:32:08.240
because we've been at this for years, trying to get the truth out.
00:32:12.000
And so we're very underfunded, and the government funding, like UNICEF and the U.N., they're expending resources up at the north,
00:32:24.560
and the resources that come in from the U.N. and came in from UNICEF end up in terrorist hands.
00:32:29.640
It never gets to the people that are really suffering and need it.
00:32:33.080
I mean, you hear the same kind of argument when it's dealing with—whether it's—you go way back to the 90s when Adid was in Somalia.
00:32:43.700
You hear the same narrative when it comes to Gaza, that Hamas takes all of the aid and controls who does and does not get it.
00:32:51.740
So they use it as a tool to keep the people in line.
00:32:55.120
And so that's something that's fairly typical of these type of regimes,
00:33:00.900
where the government is actually supposed to be processing the aid and handing it out to the people that need it.
00:33:09.540
But really what they end up doing is holding on to it and enriching themselves.
00:33:14.180
So USAID, when they pulled the funding, yes, it did hurt some people that knew their HIV, AIDS, medication, whatever.
00:33:22.080
But those getting food assistance and that kind of something, they were rejoicing because the price of—
00:33:28.420
They were bringing in food that was being confiscated, sold off at a profit, higher margins than they could in other parts of Nigeria.
00:33:35.100
As soon as that was stopped, the price came down.
00:33:41.700
That's actually—it's good to hear that because, you know, you hear about all of the—you hear from the left people that are—
00:33:47.100
that wanted USAID to stay in business and stay, you know, continue to do the things they're doing.
00:33:53.180
You hear about the, oh, well, you know, they're not—they're going to be so many people that are going to die and et cetera, et cetera.
00:33:57.140
But you don't—you don't very often hear, oh, well, you know, actually prices came down in this place because, you know, there's no longer market manipulation by the food aid getting sold on the private market.
00:34:10.780
Instead of delivering aid and giving it to the hungry people that need it, they're just taking and selling it off.
00:34:15.580
And, you know, magically, these aid trucks would just happen to break down right in front of terror camps.
00:34:21.700
And the food would be gone, and then they could get back in the trucks and move it in.
00:34:25.540
Oh, get the truck out of the way that way, yeah.
00:34:26.860
It was just too heavy, you know, to get to get offloaded so that way you could actually go.
00:34:37.600
So we've been working with this IDP camp in Benway for a long time, and we've spent lots of funds getting them out of garbage bag tents and putting them into living structures that they could live in.
00:34:49.240
And we went back to check on the camp and see how things were going, brought medicine, did a medical intervention.
00:34:54.100
And I look over, and I see four giant garbage cans slapped with USAID and UNICEF stickers on them.
00:35:06.780
Well, you got to understand, in Nigeria and especially these camps, there's just trash everywhere.
00:35:17.760
And I look at these four giant garbage cans full of trash sitting around trash.
00:35:30.320
I said, did they, do they come back and like help pick up the trash or haul it away?
00:35:40.120
So their magical gift to a camp of 5,000 people living in, that was living in garbage bag tents was four garbage cans.
00:35:49.920
That was, that was our USAID contribution and a slap in the face to these people that are starving and dying of disease.
00:35:58.260
And they give them garbage cans and that was it.
00:36:03.340
Another, another NGO, a UN group came in and they built them a latrine.
00:36:12.200
They gave them no option to haul out the waste.
00:36:17.340
So they have a giant latrine filled with waste and no mechanism to empty the waste.
00:36:26.720
That's, that's our, that's our government dollars at work.
00:36:29.800
Well, I mean, that's, this is just an argument against USAID.
00:36:34.180
I'm like, generally I'm, I'm of the opinion that aid tends to hurt more than it actually helps.
00:36:39.360
Because like you were talking about the, the people, the people that are in charge.
00:36:43.580
Which, in most places in the world nowadays, particularly in 2025, most places that are, that are, you know, really poverty stricken.
00:36:51.360
It's not that there is not the capacity to get out of poverty.
00:36:55.300
It's that they are kept in poverty by the government.
00:37:01.280
I mean, the people themselves are completely capable of engaging in markets and, and producing their own food.
00:37:07.540
It's, it's not that they, they lack the ability to do that because humans have been doing things like that for thousands of years.
00:37:14.700
But, uh, it's the, the, the, you know, generally it's the, the governments that prevent those kinds of things.
00:37:26.100
They, they were happy doing their farming, but it wasn't until these Islamic terrorists came in, ripped them away from their tribal lands, their ancestral lands, and shove them in camps.
00:37:38.240
They have no way to produce anything because of these terrorists.
00:37:44.240
It's, it's, it's the, uh, the, the more, the lush part of, or one of the, it's sub-Saharan is one of the more lush parts of that.
00:37:51.020
It's rich in agricultural, rich in natural resources.
00:37:54.820
If you could just get rid of the corruption, if you could get rid of the stupid Islamic terrorists that are going around killing people and destroying everything they touch,
00:38:13.200
It would be a great tourist destination, be a great place to invest, great place for economy.
00:38:18.020
Um, and speaking of which, there are people capitalizing off of this terrorism and off of these things.
00:38:26.680
The Chinese have been moving in and they call it illegal mining.
00:38:33.360
So the, the, it's illegal mining, but they're going in and they're mining out natural resources in the Islamic controlled areas of Nigeria.
00:38:41.000
And let's say there's more land that becomes available.
00:38:45.800
Christians are kicked off their land and they're sitting on minerals.
00:38:50.740
They don't care what all the killing or what's happening around them.
00:38:55.700
And so there are foreign government interests that are capitalizing on this as well.
00:39:00.000
China's in like pretty much every African country.
00:39:02.740
If they, the belt road, whatever that started with.
00:39:06.020
But they, they, they don't come with any sort of democracy, any human rights.
00:39:09.820
So they just, whatever happens, whatever's under the table, let me come in.
00:39:22.700
Gold mine just collapsed, I think the other day.
00:39:24.540
So it's like, these things are happening and they just, when they get their truck loaded
00:39:28.000
up, find a port, they built a port in Lagos, a deep sea port, which is great for shipping
00:39:41.940
And then Russia is also throughout West Africa.
00:39:46.060
So, you know, you get the whole gamut of communism coming in.
00:39:50.200
And, and, and our inaction as a United States government in foreign policy, I mean, during
00:39:55.440
the Biden years, the operating directive was LGBTQ, feminism, women's empowerment had
00:40:05.940
These that are only going to alienate the, the, the Americans from whatever, whatever culture
00:40:14.840
So, so that was the operating directive from, from our U.S. embassy.
00:40:18.580
So they're focused on all this stuff while there's killing, there's terrorism, China
00:40:23.500
and Russia are taking over Africa and the United States foreign policy was social issues.
00:40:31.280
So anytime Chinese diplomats, government come over to Africa, Nigeria, they're, they're
00:40:37.680
They've already made their, China's made their deals.
00:40:39.480
Now America shows up and what are you going to do?
00:40:41.560
Well, China's offered us this, you know, can you beat that?
00:40:44.420
And they can't, you know, cause they want to tie it in with human rights and all this
00:40:48.640
The, the U S is, is this is, this goes back to a, an argument that, that is often made
00:40:54.460
about whether or not the United States should have, um, political influence in other countries.
00:40:59.660
And, and while it does produce situations like we had where there was so much BS going on,
00:41:10.860
Look with your, with your LGBTQIA kind of garbage being forced on cultures that, that just flat
00:41:18.040
out reject that, uh, alienating the, the Americans from whatever the local population thinks or
00:41:24.560
whether it be any other, um, you know, ideologically motivated stuff that's in, in significant conflict
00:41:30.980
with what tend to be religious, you know, religious, uh, tribal, whether it be tribes or, or religious
00:41:36.900
cultures, um, is it better for the United States to step back?
00:41:42.300
Now there's a lot of people that when they hear America first, they think that the U S shouldn't
00:41:48.380
And whereas I'm, um, the kind of America first kind of dude that thinks, well, the United States
00:41:53.960
is not alone and it's better for the United States to be able to influence countries than
00:42:00.340
to not like influence in, in ways that are, that benefit the United States.
00:42:05.820
And I think that allowing, um, allowing countries like China and like Russia to go in and not
00:42:14.600
actually do anything that helps the, the, the host countries, um, I think it's probably
00:42:20.840
worse for the United States because the United States gets nothing out of it except for countries
00:42:27.880
Well, and then you have, we have to look at this way is that there is vast, untapped natural
00:42:37.780
Um, if United States does not have a hand in that, it will hurt the United States in the
00:42:43.080
So if we sit back and we don't engage with other countries and policy in other countries,
00:42:49.820
um, you're those people that are, I say, uh, America first isolationists, they are advocating
00:42:57.080
for the same foreign policy our adversaries want.
00:43:01.060
If you take the U S out of the equation, China and Russia become more powerful.
00:43:05.180
And if China and Russia becomes more powerful, United States loses its influence and we become
00:43:10.740
So, and I look, putting America first, it means you do things that benefit America.
00:43:18.360
That doesn't mean that you step away from the rest of the world because that puts America
00:43:24.200
That's what Rubio's policy is safer, stronger, prosperous.
00:43:28.860
There's many ways, you know, you're not just focusing on America.
00:43:33.160
His intent is how does this make America safer getting involved in Nigeria?
00:43:38.740
Figuring out things in Nigeria, how does it make it more prosperous?
00:43:42.660
It's not, I, I, I'll be the first person to say that it's not America first to leave
00:43:48.840
That's, that's not good, a good thing for the United States, but cutting deals that allow
00:43:54.580
American companies to, to produce, uh, to get, you know, minerals or to get, uh, um, natural
00:44:01.720
resources out of, of an African country, as opposed to, you know, in a way that is going
00:44:08.100
to actually produce profit for the people of that country, as opposed to allowing China
00:44:14.900
or Russia to go in and acquire these, uh, modern day colonial.
00:44:20.460
So, and, and the, the, the Chinese and the Russian companies, I mean, the Nigerians hate,
00:44:26.880
hate working for them because they get treated like garbage.
00:44:33.800
If they end up working for the Chinese and Russian companies, American business comes in
00:44:38.920
with principle, with values, that it benefits the country, it benefits us.
00:44:46.380
And we see that if, if we move into a country and, um, we're doing business, we believe that
00:44:54.840
And I, I, I want to, on that note, I want to put a pin on that because there's going to
00:44:58.600
be a lot of people that are going to hear that and they're going to think, oh, well,
00:45:01.480
you know, when we had, uh, USAID, we were sharing American values and they're like, we talked
00:45:07.960
about their, they're sharing the LGBTQ ideology and, and they're sharing, sharing a lot of
00:45:13.000
progressive ideas that aren't just, uh, foreign to these, these countries that are, are oftentimes
00:45:20.060
their, their cultures based in their religion, but they're also foreign to the United States.
00:45:24.260
These are, these are things that, that the United States doesn't agree on, right?
00:45:27.740
Like these, these ideas, like the idea that men can become women, that, that, that goes
00:45:32.480
hand in hand with the LGBTQ ID, uh, you know, stuff like that.
00:45:35.500
Um, that, that's not something that the American people agree on.
00:45:41.980
Americans don't think by and large that you can change your gender or I don't even like
00:45:47.800
I think gender is just a made up word to, to, to allow for these ideas to be spread.
00:45:51.640
Um, and I can assure you that 99.9999999999% of Nigerians would agree.
00:45:58.320
You try to, so you put a pile of money on the table and you start talking about equality and
00:46:09.800
You know, donors, EU, whoever has money, whatever you want, we'll do it.
00:46:13.080
Whatever report you want us to write, we know how to write it.
00:46:23.320
So preventing that stuff is, is like largely on the United States side.
00:46:27.740
You know, I mean, granted, I'm, I'm extremely happy that the, that USAID has been shut down.
00:46:33.320
I'm glad that the Trump administration is doing all the things that it's doing to prevent
00:46:38.000
the, the, the exporting of, of ideas that are even foreign to the U S right there.
00:46:44.520
They're not ideas that the United States by and large, the American people agree with.
00:46:49.000
Um, so then how do you provide support or how do you like what, if you were to sit down
00:46:57.820
with Marco Rubio, what would you want him to, to say about Nigeria that in a, what, what
00:47:04.840
way would you, you want to hear the United States help in Nigeria?
00:47:10.680
I would say there is a lot of business to be done in Nigeria and I think it could be a
00:47:16.080
win-win situation for the United States, broker mineral rights deals with the Nigerian
00:47:21.680
government, but also predicate a major investment into Nigeria on the safety and security of
00:47:27.140
the people say we'll invest X amount of dollars, but you guys, and we'll help you along the
00:47:33.160
way, get rid of the security issue, get rid of this terrorism nonsense.
00:47:41.380
Or do they need to add, will the, will the, the, will a Christian need to win the election
00:47:50.280
We would, we would, I would prefer, I would prefer better leadership, but I say we can
00:47:56.260
get, I say the United States can give Nigeria an offer.
00:48:07.140
We looked at it on paper and we have been, we have been giving the, uh, administration
00:48:15.040
But the first things first is the U S government needs to identify who the enemy is, who the
00:48:24.820
It's the Fulani militants, the radical Islamist Fulani that are killing all the Christians.
00:48:33.040
So we have to identify who the bad guys are before we can get success.
00:48:37.380
Well, is it something, is it practical to think that the people that are telling the
00:48:41.600
story about what's going on in Nigeria, is it practical to think that they can actually
00:48:45.820
manage to spin a narrative that, that will identify the Fulani that are bad without, you
00:48:55.100
know, without, without making everyone think that the Fulani by and large are bad because
00:49:00.780
the reason I, well, the reason I ask is because Americans are familiar with the name Boko Haram.
00:49:08.180
Those two groups, yeah, Al Qaeda, these things are easy for Americans to understand.
00:49:13.020
And if you're going to try and convince the Americans that this is something that they
00:49:16.480
should care about, just saying Fulani, which is a name most, I've, I'd never heard the Fulani,
00:49:23.540
Most Americans are going to say, well, who are they?
00:49:26.920
And, and then you're going to say, well, it's a tribal thing.
00:49:28.760
And then the, then they're going to go back to, oh, then it's just tribal clashes.
00:49:33.200
So, so we, we refer to them as the Fulani ethnic militia.
00:49:38.260
We can't classify all Fulani people is the wrong term.
00:49:49.240
That separates the, those Fulani from the good Fulani, um, because these are the militants,
00:49:56.560
And the thing is the Nigerian government knows who the leaders are.
00:50:02.900
We know the command structure and who the leaders are and how it operates.
00:50:07.600
And there is clearly identifiable, you know, where the headquarters is, they know where they
00:50:12.260
This could easily be dealt with, with willpower and done very quickly.
00:50:19.580
So on that point, I'm going to go to this, uh, this bit from Newsweek card, if you're
00:50:23.620
going to bring this up, uh, the, from Newsweek, Trump administration, deeply concerned by
00:50:32.940
The state department has told Newsweek that it is deeply concerned about the levels of
00:50:37.040
violence against Christians and members of other groups in Nigeria.
00:50:40.240
It comes after American comedian Bill Maher brought attention to the high number of
00:50:43.800
Christians being killed by Islamic militant groups, such as Boko Haram in parts of Nigeria.
00:50:47.740
The country is generally pushed back against narratives that Christians are being systematically
00:50:52.020
killed in a genocide attempt, as Maher described it, with Nigeria's foreign, Nigeria's ministry
00:50:57.620
of foreign affairs saying in March that the terrorism in the country is not driven by religious
00:51:02.220
bias nor targeted against any particular religious groups.
00:51:05.560
Now, this is, this is the, the existing government, which you guys are saying is run essentially by
00:51:11.100
the, the Muslims, which are in at least sympathetic to the, the Milani.
00:51:16.060
You're complicit, right? If you're not stopping it, you're complicit.
00:51:19.060
Let me give you a story. 2018, then President Buhari came to the Rose Garden, had discussion
00:51:26.440
2018, so he was president, two terms, so he lasted eight years. He came, a girl named Leah
00:51:31.940
Sharib who was kidnapped a month, two months before. This has been going on by terrorists,
00:51:36.940
taking girls, forcefully converting them. It was terrible, it was tragic. He confronts Buhari
00:51:41.120
and says, what are you doing to Christians? I hear there's one girl still captive. You
00:51:44.940
need to free her. Why, why, why, why are they killing Christians? I was on my way to Nigeria
00:51:49.100
when that speech was being made. I was in a governor's office and he says, all hell's
00:51:53.240
breaking this. I said, what's going on? He said, your president said something yesterday
00:51:56.360
and all the generals, all the government is showing, trying to save face. They're trying
00:52:00.340
to respond to this. Same thing happened. So that was the Fulani is also helping with the
00:52:04.780
terrorists. Things started to happen. When Trump said something, the world, the Nigeria responded.
00:52:10.120
Well, this particular piece that I was watching in, or that I was reading from in Newsweek,
00:52:13.620
that was, this was October 1st. That was two or three days ago. Do you, do you get the
00:52:17.420
sense or do you add to any of your contacts in, in Nigeria? Did they, have they noticed
00:52:21.440
this? I think Bill Marsh started it. I think this, you know, there's Senator Cruz has introduced
00:52:28.700
legislation and then Congressman Chris Smith has done that as well. So when people say things,
00:52:34.300
they're ecstatic because of the voice. Well, we both know that no legislation is going
00:52:37.360
through Congress, right? Like it's just not going to happen. Like, I mean, it might get
00:52:40.740
through the house, but it's definitely not going to get through the Senate because the
00:52:43.580
Senate, they just don't have the votes for Republicans and anything that the Democrats
00:52:47.060
can do to stymie the Republicans. That's what we're focusing on Trump. Yeah. That's why we're,
00:52:50.800
that's why we're trying to get to Trump and the Trump administration. Look, even Trump saying
00:52:55.240
a few words changed the scope for a while in Nigeria and you saw the killings shrink and drop
00:53:02.540
down. Does your organization have any contact with people at state? Yes. Yeah. Okay. I just came
00:53:07.820
back from DC. I've been meeting with the state department. Okay. And, and, you know, providing
00:53:11.960
them information about what's going on. The problem is, is like I said, for the last four years
00:53:16.200
the U.S. Embassy had an operating directive focusing on stupid social issues. Sure. And I met
00:53:23.300
with the U.S. Embassy in Abuja. They had no idea what's going on outside their doors in Abuja.
00:53:28.460
They didn't know about the killing. They can't leave the grounds. They can't leave the grounds.
00:53:31.140
They can't go anywhere. The Nigerian staff can go out, but the American staff, but the information
00:53:36.700
that they get about what's happening in Nigeria is coming from the Nigerian government. Yeah. So
00:53:40.460
they, whatever they're selling, they're buying a hundred percent, you know, whatever the Nigerian
00:53:43.960
government's telling them, the U.S. Embassy was one, a congressman, a senator going. Are they still
00:53:48.520
currently? We don't know. Well, we're, things have been shaken up. Has there been new staff put into
00:53:53.820
place? Like, I mean, it's on its way in. Okay. It's on its way in. So we're hoping that we build new
00:53:59.380
relationships with them and we can actually inform them on what's going on. Like I said,
00:54:04.100
Truth Nigeria, our reporters on the ground, whenever there's attack, our guys are on the
00:54:07.660
ground interviewing people, eyewitnesses. Now for Newsweek and for people saying, well,
00:54:12.880
it's not religiously motivated. It's not religiously motivated. It's a lie from the pit of hell
00:54:18.460
that has been spread by Islamists and Islamic countries all over the world ever since its inception.
00:54:24.860
It's not religiously motivated. We're nice people. Let us in. The thousands of Christians
00:54:30.180
are being killed. There are over 20,000 churches have been attacked or destroyed. How many mosques?
00:54:34.920
Yeah. I mean, look. How many mosques? Yeah. No mosques have been destroyed. A few, but not by Christians.
00:54:38.180
You guys are probably familiar with Christopher Hitchens, passed away of cancer a couple of years
00:54:42.600
back. And he had a saying that Islam has bloody borders. And it generally, you know, any place
00:54:49.320
where a sufficiently large population of Muslims comes in contact with people that have a different
00:54:57.240
religion or a different culture, there tends to be clashes and fights and violence. So that's not
00:55:03.200
really particularly surprising. So it comes in three forms. It comes with cultural jihad. We move in,
00:55:08.840
populate. And every village, every village tells me the same story. The survivors of these attacks,
00:55:15.620
every single time tells me the same story. They're like, we had neighbors. We lived with,
00:55:21.160
lived next to them for 30 years. Fulani. We lived with the Fulani for 30 years. Our children played
00:55:25.800
together. We did business together. Everything was fine until the one day, the one day they just
00:55:32.500
weren't in town that one day. And then an hour later, boom. Militants killed. Okay. So essentially
00:55:37.560
they're, they're, they're, they're informing the Fulani. Yes. Or they're providing cover or they're
00:55:42.060
providing cover or partaking in the attacks themselves. Well, yeah. Every village, every
00:55:48.560
attack says the same story. And when they come in, they shout Allahu Akbar. They're going after
00:55:58.240
the churches. They, they go after the churches first. They desecrate the churches and burn the
00:56:02.060
churches. And they go after the pastors. They behead the pastors. They kill the pastors.
00:56:07.000
It is religious because this is how Islam has conquered every nation since its inception,
00:56:13.020
since 640 AD is how it is conquered. And there are more moderate Muslims that have, uh, you know,
00:56:21.800
um, leaving that kind of ideology, but the ideology that is with the Fulani ethnic militia
00:56:28.340
is the same Islam that has conquered and believes in killing anybody that gets in their way that
00:56:34.000
doesn't agree with them. And it's right. So you're saying, oh, there's Muslims being killed
00:56:38.120
too. Yeah. Right. Because they're non-Fulani Muslims. That's why they're being killed.
00:56:41.800
But not the same level, but there's there an, is there a difference between, are they Sunni
00:56:46.640
Muslims? Because I, I've Sunni Salaf is that, that's what they are, right? The Fulani, the
00:56:50.960
Fulani that are doing the killing are Sunni. So the Muslims that end up getting killed by them,
00:56:54.380
they're Sunni as well. There's a small group of Shias and they're based in one area. They're
00:56:58.960
being attacked by the government, but also could be the Fulani too. That's great for them. Yeah.
00:57:03.660
But it, but it's, that is cultural because they're not, you're not, you're not of the
00:57:07.340
pure blood of Fulani. So you're not a true Muslim unless you do this or we don't even care about
00:57:11.820
you. We'll get rid of you. You're not part of our emirate. You know, you're a slave because
00:57:15.040
that's what the emirate did. In 1804, they took on more, almost as many slaves as the British
00:57:20.020
were exporting out of Africa. So they had just as many slaves across their kingdoms. So,
00:57:26.780
yeah. So, and it still exists. Slavery still exists in Nigeria, in, in where, where, where
00:57:32.520
the Islam is. Yeah. So I want to talk about another issue that had, that needs to be brought
00:57:37.420
up is we have the killings. You have the displaced, the 3.5 million displaced, but we have a major
00:57:43.320
kidnap problem going on in Nigeria where right now, right now we know of over 1000 Christians
00:57:50.660
that are currently being held hostage or being beaten and starved to death. And they're trying
00:57:54.920
to be ransomed out. This is just one area we know of. Now, here's the thing. The Nigerian
00:57:59.560
government knows where these people are. We know where the, where the hostage camps are.
00:58:05.260
Nothing's being done to rescue these people. And we know that there's multiple camps like this
00:58:09.760
in other states, but what I know of for sure is a thousand Christians are being held captive
00:58:14.680
right now, being beaten and starved to death. And people that are trying to pay the ransom
00:58:20.320
are going bankrupt, having to sell everything they own just to get their people out. And
00:58:28.480
They take a phone, they kidnap people, students, children, women, and they film them being beaten,
00:58:34.340
pay money now, or this is going to continue. And that's how they, so they're sending messages,
00:58:38.520
recording it. So you get the cell data, you can get all that information. It's not,
00:58:41.880
it's not rock science. You do satellites or drones. Yeah. Find where they are.
00:58:45.600
They happen to be all Christian. Because they pay. They pay. Christians don't want to see this.
00:58:50.120
They pay up. Muslims won't pay if they get kidnapped. Really?
00:58:53.160
Well, they're martyred, so. So they know, you know. Okay. Opportunity. Yeah. So I'm just,
00:59:01.740
I'm kind of still at a loss for, for what the actual, you know, save for covert operations,
00:59:08.420
by state, which, I mean, that might be something that the, that state department's entertaining.
00:59:14.100
But there's not a significant appetite for that in the U.S. nowadays. You know, like,
00:59:17.860
especially after, you know, with, with Trump going in and into getting into office again and saying
00:59:24.120
that, that we're going to focus on the United States. I mean, you can see it in the chat.
00:59:26.800
There's a lot of people that are saying, well, they don't see how this is America's problem.
00:59:30.220
Right. So there are some people that are like, well, they're Christians there. And a lot of,
00:59:33.520
a lot of America, America first people tend to be religious. So they're like, well,
00:59:37.120
you know, maybe because they're Christians, but there's a lot of people that are America first
00:59:40.340
that are like, I don't see how this is an American problem. I don't see how this is,
00:59:43.660
this is something that we have to worry about. We have, have our own problems here, which,
00:59:48.060
you know, I agree in principle, the, the idea that the United States should be looking after
00:59:54.000
itself first. And then they, they bring up the, the actual monetary costs. But anytime anyone brings
01:00:00.480
up the monetary costs, I'm like, look, man, if you're not talking about, about Medicare and Medicaid
01:00:04.860
and social security, you're not talking about fixing any problem at all. All of the, I'm,
01:00:09.660
I'm against, um, like we were talking about it earlier, this earlier in the show, I'm against
01:00:14.720
foreign aid because it tends to actually, um, distort markets and it, it, it prevents countries
01:00:21.080
from taking care of themselves. So I'm against foreign aid in principle. Um, but if they stop,
01:00:26.160
if the U S stops all foreign aid to all other countries, it's not going to fix our deficit.
01:00:30.160
It's not going to fix our monetary issues. So two things, one, Nigerians are here in America
01:00:35.660
already. They've been born here. They've, some have immigrated here as they're Nigerian born.
01:00:39.620
There's over a million Nigerians for in Texas, in Atlanta. They say Atlanta is the second biggest
01:00:44.980
Nigerian city, right? And, and if you talk to Nigerians that are in the United States,
01:00:49.020
they tend to be extremely industrious. They tend to, to be, um, be very successful in, in opening
01:00:55.280
businesses and stuff. So, so the, the idea that, that, um, if there are Nigerians that are coming
01:01:00.800
to the U S that they're coming to, to get onto some kind of social support, I think that that's
01:01:04.380
actually, you know, they want to work. They don't, they don't. Nigerians, when they move to America,
01:01:10.220
they make, uh, like 15% more per capita than the average white person because they're, they're so
01:01:15.600
industrious and they are hardworking people. So they're not coming in here trying to get on the
01:01:20.820
on the system. They, they want to hustle and they want to make a good living. The second thing I was
01:01:25.820
going to say is that you, you have this radicalized young Muslim who wants to change, bring about change
01:01:33.860
for their full on E for terrorism, whatever they get, they get trained. They end up sneaking across
01:01:39.660
the desert, going into Europe. Some of I've ever watched these shows, this guy travels the border and
01:01:46.280
he sees ID cards and pass what people leave behind is crossing the border illegally. Yeah.
01:01:51.280
Yeah. Nigerians are already there. So you can't tell me that this won't, that this is not affect
01:01:56.640
Americans because they're coming in either for a hand up maybe, but maybe something worse. So how
01:02:01.920
do we stop that? You know, we joke we have is that this could be solved in six months, no money,
01:02:06.700
maybe the flight ticket, maybe some jet fuel, you know, Masad Boulus is a Nigerian Lebanese guy.
01:02:11.720
His son, Michael is married to who? Tiffany Trump. He knows Nigeria. Send him over. We'll show him who
01:02:19.720
the real Nigerians are. Talk to them, bring them to the government and say, how do we solve this in
01:02:24.420
six months? Let's make a deal. So do you think that it is something that could, that just, you know,
01:02:31.960
just the right people going in and talking could? Because it's my, I mean, from what I've been hearing
01:02:37.340
in this conversation, the problem is at a government of Nigeria level. I mean, I understand
01:02:42.660
that Donald Trump does have, you know, if Trump says, okay, we're going to do this or Trump points,
01:02:46.780
you know, if you get the eye of Sauron, which is the United States government, you get the eye of
01:02:50.760
Sauron on you, on you, people tend to, to make, make changes in their policy. Um, but is that something
01:02:56.660
that the, that is, would only be changes to save face and they wouldn't be substantive changes?
01:03:03.080
No, there would be substantive changes. Um, we've seen it, we've seen it work before.
01:03:09.140
All we, like I said, all we need is willpower and a very, very little
01:03:13.160
acknowledgement from the Trump administration. And if there's some resources, a tiny, tiny drop
01:03:19.820
in the bucket would change Nigeria overnight. Okay. So, so what is it that you have got the,
01:03:27.260
you said you've been to, to state and, and, and you're talking to people at state. Um, are they
01:03:31.980
making any kind of commitments or are they just giving you lip service or what's the,
01:03:35.380
what's going on in, in DC for this? Well, they're, they're fact finding, uh, the state
01:03:40.520
department's been upended. A lot of people have been fired from the state department, uh, department,
01:03:44.560
things have been consolidated. The entire infrastructure, the state department has been
01:03:49.540
totally, uh, totally changed. And so you think the situation is their way we're, we're kind
01:03:56.620
of waiting for a state to kind of get its feet back underneath it after all of the, the changes
01:04:01.440
from, from the government. Yeah. So that, that's, what's been happening. So I've been
01:04:05.000
meeting with state over the last several months. Now we're to a point where they got their footing.
01:04:09.640
They have their directives. They know what they're looking to do and they're, and they're looking
01:04:13.020
for information, real information, um, uh, about what's happening. And they're taking us very,
01:04:19.340
very seriously. And, um, there is a win-win scenario. U S could invest in Nigeria in return for
01:04:26.980
mineral rights and research resources to get a return on their investment back predicated on
01:04:32.240
the security of the country that, and that way there's no money being lost and it's a gain for
01:04:39.320
our country. I mean, simply just having them showing them and saying, heck, as Americans,
01:04:45.500
we're not coming in to solve your problem. We're coming in here to, to say what the world is saying.
01:04:49.580
So here's what's going on. Here's what you need to do to change. How can you stop this corruption,
01:04:54.480
remove some of these political corrupt people? How do you help your own people? Reinvest some of
01:04:59.860
that money. Some, some, some politicians have properties all over the world. Some people are
01:05:04.520
just exposed, extorting money from, from EU, from the U S. How do we stop that? These are the,
01:05:11.640
you need to show us this, this, and this do it yourself. How do you do it yourself? Do it. You
01:05:15.940
know, it's not, it's not that you need to show a billion dollars. We don't need that. We've had that
01:05:20.280
for almost 20 years going into Nigeria. It's done nothing. So it can be stopped.
01:05:24.740
Which is, I mean, like this, that's exactly why I say that, you know, the, the problem isn't actually
01:05:30.380
about funding or anything, or, or I think that the, the, the idea of aid is miss, you know,
01:05:37.820
aid is generally misallocated. And I think the ideas behind aid are, are erroneous. Like you don't
01:05:43.720
actually produce, you very rarely get the results you want when you send money and food aid and stuff.
01:05:49.600
You, you end up making a client nation or a client population. Dependency. Yeah. Dependency.
01:05:54.520
Well, the, the, the biggest problem is, is that when the aid would come through, they're
01:05:59.200
working with government officials. Yeah. That's problem. Number one, even if it's a
01:06:04.040
non-government organization, they'll register something as a nonprofit and then, yeah. But
01:06:07.920
that's, that's, that isn't that kind of always, what other, what other means of delivery
01:06:13.380
is there? If the government is in charge, right? Ostensibly. And the government is
01:06:17.960
corrupt than providing any aid is just providing support to the people that are oppressing the
01:06:24.260
people in, in Nigeria. Well, in our case at equipping the persecuted, um, we're privately
01:06:30.160
funded, but when we go in with aid, we don't work with government officials. We go in, we vet,
01:06:35.520
we identify the people that need it and go through a whole vetting process and we get them the aid they
01:06:39.260
need. And we assess the situation. So because we don't work with government officials, when aid's
01:06:45.340
delivered, we deliver it effectively and make sure the people that need it, get it.
01:06:49.380
And he doesn't want to do that. I don't want to go to Nigeria and help people that are persecuted.
01:06:53.300
I want to help people get a hand up. I want to help people have sustainable agriculture,
01:06:57.360
work with their livestock, just get a better education. I don't want to do things for them.
01:07:01.760
I don't want to provide things. I want to see them do it, but just give them, maybe try this,
01:07:05.740
maybe try that. Maybe tell me what would work, you know, how do we help you?
01:07:09.420
And the best thing we do is get these people back to their land, back to their farms, back to their
01:07:14.600
land. So they're displaced. They can't, they can't, they're often in some neighbor's place or to
01:07:18.600
school or not. There's not like refugee, are there refugee camps, but they're not, they don't get
01:07:24.520
refugee, uh, refugee camp material and things from the U.N. That's the terrorists. The terrorist camp
01:07:30.440
have those U.N. places. There's several up there. Well funded. They have the nice tents. They get the
01:07:35.540
infrastructure. The persecuted Christians are getting nothing. So the, the, the Fulani militants
01:07:43.340
are looked at as refugees. No, no, no, no. They're nomadic. So they're coming around and
01:07:48.960
they're driving people off their land. So they go to a Christian village where there's Christians
01:07:53.420
living and they're farming. So they're living here, they farm there. So they're living and farming in
01:07:57.480
their area. They come in, they drive them out. No longer can they go back to the farm or they can,
01:08:02.260
they risk it. A lot of times they end up being killed or the Fulani come and cut. Like right
01:08:05.700
now it's, it's a harvest season. So they're going and cutting down crops. Corn that's
01:08:10.060
growing, maize that's growing up is being chopped down so they can't use it. You know, it's not
01:08:14.080
fully reached fruition. So they're cutting it down. So they're, they're destroying their
01:08:18.060
farms. They're destroying their farms. Destroying it just because they're there. They don't want
01:08:21.520
them to have success. They don't want to have them be sustainable. So I'm, I'm still, I'm still
01:08:28.340
not quite sure like what it is that the, the, the solution or what the United States
01:08:34.420
can do. And when I say can do, I'm not just talking about like what the U S is capable
01:08:39.760
of doing because I mean, look, look, if the U S wanted to, the U S could go in and take
01:08:43.020
the government out and take over and make it a state if they wanted to. But I'm talking
01:08:46.820
about like, what is something that the, the American people are going to have the stomach
01:08:51.340
for? And if, if the, the, the American people aren't going to have enough of a stomach to
01:08:58.260
do what's necessary to actually help, how do you convince them? Because a lot of, a lot
01:09:02.820
of, you know, what I'm hearing is look, you know, the U S can do it. Well, we live in a
01:09:07.900
world where America generally doesn't have an appetite for, you know, for, for military
01:09:14.960
adventurism. Right. And, and I think that you could probably convince most Americans, look,
01:09:20.200
if we're sending some green berets in to teach the, the, you know, teach the, the people that
01:09:25.560
are oppressed, how to fight, they might be able to do that, but it doesn't sound like
01:09:28.660
the Christians have any kind of organized resistance. You said yourself, they don't even
01:09:32.480
have guns. So they're, they're not going to be, be able to, to prop up some kind of
01:09:37.760
militia that can fight the Fulani. So I'm, I'm still, I'm still kind of at a, at a loss
01:09:41.600
as to what to do here. It very well could happen. It very well could happen. Part of our
01:09:46.500
ministry and what we do is we work with village security teams. So that's
01:09:50.180
that's risen in the last five years, vigilante, to come vigilante, which is a bad word for
01:09:53.860
us. It's a local people who are trained by hunters, how to use weapons, how to defend
01:10:02.180
And we've been working with village security teams and, and giving them training and giving,
01:10:06.000
and it has been successful at thwarting off attacks and saving a lot of lives, which separates
01:10:12.080
us from other missions. Cause we do get our hands dirty a little bit and working with,
01:10:15.800
uh, working with these guys. And there is a sense, there is a thing. And even a local
01:10:22.400
Christian governors are saying, you know what guys, government's not protecting you. Go
01:10:29.120
Former leaders have said that too. Christians, you need to defend yourself.
01:10:33.920
And so we're doing everything we can on a legal basis. Like we're, we're just, we're
01:10:37.660
a nonprofit. I can't give them weapons, but we can't give them training. We can give,
01:10:42.760
we can show them basic, uh, intelligence gathering methods and measures to prevent and thwart
01:10:49.900
off attacks to save lives. And that's what we've been doing on the ground out there. And
01:10:53.560
so it is very possible. And there is a very motivated group that, uh, uh, if, if they had
01:10:59.040
a leg up. So how do you convince Americans in state department that that's where that's
01:11:05.040
a worthy cause that that's, that's a stopgap that that's, that's because you're not doing
01:11:08.980
anything. The big thing is, is America's the superpower. No one's denied that. Nigerians
01:11:13.820
don't deny that they respect everything America does. When Trump says Nigeria is a shithole,
01:11:18.520
they said, you're right. It is, you know, we need help, you know? So Europe needs to be
01:11:25.800
You're not going to get any help from Europe. I don't believe, I don't buy that.
01:11:28.300
Well, you know what I'm saying? He was in the UN condemning the EU and all that. Britain
01:11:32.080
needs to help you. It's your colony. Fix it. Help us, you know, do something. Instead
01:11:35.860
of doing this, let's do this. So these kinds of things can be taught no money, maybe a plane
01:11:43.500
And by the way, I just want to say this, as far as the EU is concerned, they've come
01:11:46.980
out and said that the killing is occurring because of climate change.
01:11:55.940
Yeah. All these people are being killed because of climate change.
01:11:58.300
According to the EU. So you can tell you where their mind is.
01:12:04.220
Even if it was climate change, the Fulani are, they say because of the encroachment, the
01:12:08.780
arable lands are being pushed south and the Fulani got to come down further. They're still
01:12:13.480
finding Christians to kill. So if it's climate change, great. But the primary driver-
01:12:20.220
Desert. So the north of Nigeria is pretty much desert, rocks and desert. So they say that's
01:12:24.740
growing and encroaching on the arable land. So Fulani who take their cattle down south
01:12:28.780
during the rainy season to get water and fed and then come back up to sell, they're causing
01:12:34.220
But the ones that are actually doing the fighting and killing, they're nomads. They're not farmers.
01:12:44.620
They have no passport, no ID. They're just coming in. They've been trying to talk about
01:12:49.920
this for years, since the 60s, grazing routes. They don't want to do that. You don't tell
01:12:55.120
us where to go. We can take our cattle wherever we want. And the Christians are farming and using
01:13:00.360
land. Of course, there's going to be conflict. But who handles that conflict? Is it the government?
01:13:04.000
Is it the military? Is it a discussion between the Christian and the Muslims? Yeah. Those
01:13:07.660
kind of things are easily talked about without money. So we can go in as America and say,
01:13:13.720
let's have a sit down. We'll just sit and watch. We'll cheer you on. You guys talk, and we'll
01:13:22.260
But they're not seeing those people. That's what we joke about. The State Department's
01:13:26.360
Blinken. I was in Abuja when Blinken came through. He came through twice. And I saw the list
01:13:31.660
of people he was going to see. None of these people have a skin in the game. They're all
01:13:36.500
people that the U.S. State Department at that time, Biden's time, wanted to see, talk to
01:13:43.380
Blinken. You know, no problem. Yeah, we have a terrorist problem. Terrible. But it's farmer
01:13:48.460
herder. We just need a little bit more money here, a little bit more money there, and we'll
01:13:51.640
be fine. Right. So yeah, I'm just looking to see what kind of news I can find on what
01:14:04.360
He hasn't said much. So there is no policy on Nigeria. All the documents that you look
01:14:08.540
at from the State Department from 2023 and 24, that's one thing that we're trying to get
01:14:13.480
the State Department to advise the administration to come up with an actual policy on. They have
01:14:17.800
policies on visas, policies on other things, but there's real no policy on how to be solved
01:14:23.200
in Nigeria. Yeah, because, I mean, everything's been upended at the State Department. So what
01:14:27.980
we've been told is that Trump wanted to fix, look at America issues first, and get all that
01:14:34.420
done and in process. Then we'll start looking at foreign policy and interests. And we're at
01:14:40.640
the point now where they're starting to look at foreign policy and interests. Yeah, so here's
01:14:44.220
a piece. I'm not sure what just mania is, but it says, U.S. Senators call for Nigeria to
01:14:48.860
be redesignated as a country of particular concern. A coalition of Republican senators
01:14:54.560
in the United States has formally requested that Secretary of State Marco Rubio reconsider
01:14:58.800
labeling Nigeria as a country of particular concern under the International Religious Freedoms
01:15:03.720
Act, citing persistent acts of violence and terrorism targeting religious minorities.
01:15:08.600
The senators contend that Christians across Nigeria have been facing ongoing and extensive
01:15:13.600
attacks. According to Sahara reports, the appeal was delivered through a joint letter
01:15:18.380
endorsed by Senators Ted Budd, Josh Hawley, Pete Ricketts, Ted Cruz, and James Lankford.
01:15:24.080
The lawmakers pointed out that Nigeria was previously classified as a CPC by former Secretary of State
01:15:29.300
Mike Pompeo in December 2020 due to serious violations of religious freedom committed largely
01:15:35.620
by non-state actors, including Boko Haram and other terrorist organizations. I know you guys
01:15:40.120
say that this is the, that it's the Fulani, but if you, do you think that in all of this stuff that
01:15:45.700
we've read so far, like all of the official pieces, it's always Boko Haram. That's, that's named.
01:15:50.380
Is that, is that functionally accurate or is it, is it functionally, is it something that's going to
01:15:57.600
get the, the, the, these types of, of bills or these types of, of designations, get them passed
01:16:05.400
because they are names that the American people and the, and the senators and stuff are, are familiar
01:16:11.800
with? Because again, the name Fulani, I'd never heard that before today.
01:16:15.500
Yeah. So you, so we said genocide at the top of the show, right? So genocide, the definition of
01:16:21.060
genocide is any means or any of the following acts committed and it's intent to destroy in whole
01:16:26.340
or in part, whether you kill one or whether you kill a thousand, that's the start of a genocide,
01:16:30.600
killing group members, causing serious harm, inflicting life conditions to cause destruction,
01:16:34.660
preventing births, forcibly transfer of children. So we say this is a genocide, a targeted campaign
01:16:40.940
against Christians. This is, it's either an ethnic group or a religious group. This is a definite
01:16:45.280
religious group. So this is a genocide. Let's call it what it is. Let's get this designation back,
01:16:50.540
at least to make a statement and let's stop the killings. And then let's get the talks.
01:16:54.900
The country of particular concern, it needs more teeth though. It needs more teeth and more like
01:17:01.680
CPC is kind of lip service. In my opinion, it's important to make a statement, but the CPC needs
01:17:09.460
to come with teeth. And, um, but just to explain the, the situation of country of particular concern
01:17:15.360
during Trump's first administration, he designated Nigeria as a country of particular concern.
01:17:20.440
We saw attacks decrease during that time. Biden came into office within the first week.
01:17:28.620
Nigeria was taken off the CPC list. Do you know what the motivation for that was? Yeah. The Nigerian
01:17:33.040
government said, we weren't, we're working on everything you gave us, these requirements. We did
01:17:36.960
it. Take us off. No problem. That's what they did. And there was no kind of investigation. There's no
01:17:42.080
criteria that needs to be met. It's just the word of the government. No. And then, and then what you see now,
01:17:46.440
again, is an increase in attacks where this on average is about 5,000 a year. Now we're at 7,000
01:17:54.700
Christians killed this year alone in six months since January 1st.
01:17:58.160
Mm-hmm. And you said there's about a hundred thousand in the past 20 years or so? Yeah. I mean,
01:18:03.100
so inadvertently or whatever you want to say, um, uh, indirectly there's over 300,000 have been
01:18:08.920
killed by either by being starved out by injury, by health, whatever. So indirectly it's well over
01:18:15.500
that a hundred thousand by bullet machete burning, burning. Yeah.
01:18:21.240
Okay. So I'm still, I'm still trying to figure out exactly what the policy, you know, cause, cause
01:18:30.760
like I said, the, the solve it today, let's do it. Well, I mean, you know, that's, you know, that's
01:18:34.740
where we're, we're here to, to, you know, enlighten people on what, what the issue is, but also what
01:18:39.380
can be done. And again, my, my thought process is the American people are very focused or at least
01:18:46.520
conservatives, the people that are, that are supportive of the Trump administration, right?
01:18:50.300
Cause the left is going to do the same things that you're talking about. They're going to say,
01:18:53.120
oh no, everything's fine. You know, we, there's no, there's no problem. The Christians are doing
01:18:59.300
just great. This is all just, uh, um, some kind of BS because the knee jerk reaction, we were talking
01:19:05.060
about this a little bit earlier, the knee jerk reaction from the left, um, is that Christians are
01:19:10.660
essentially not worthy of being protected or being paid attention to. Uh, in fact, they should be
01:19:18.480
attacked. Like Charlie Kirk was just murdered and, and his Christian faith had a lot to do
01:19:23.080
with it. You know, the, the LGBT, you know, groups out there really look at Christians and they believe
01:19:30.660
that they have been persecuted by the Christians. And now is, is the time for the LGBT groups to fight
01:19:37.600
back. So whether it be using lawfare, like the cake issue in, in Colorado, the, the, you know,
01:19:44.480
that got to the Supreme court, the bake the cake bigot, you know, that was an attack on Christians.
01:19:49.120
That wasn't about the, the couple couldn't find a place to actually make the cake. They actually
01:19:55.520
were going around to multiple places, looking for someone to say no. The point was they wanted to make
01:20:01.300
an example of Christians that were trying to, trying to, you know, that were professing their faith and
01:20:06.500
saying, look, my faith doesn't allow me to do this because I don't agree with you. Not that, not that
01:20:11.340
they're looking to go ahead and, and inhibit your life in any way, not that they're looking to go
01:20:15.800
and stop you from being married, but they're specifically looking for someone to say, I have
01:20:21.560
religious convictions, so we should attack you. Right. That, that's, that was the whole point of
01:20:26.540
that. And now you've seen attacks instead of taking the form of lawfare. Now they're taking the form of
01:20:31.360
actual violence. You get a bunch of people that have the LGBT ideology. They believe that because
01:20:37.920
Christianity actually does judge, that has a sense of right and wrong that doesn't align with their
01:20:43.280
own, they believe that they're under attack. So the way that they defend themselves is to attack
01:20:48.360
Christian children in schools, right? There's been multiple, multiple shootings where the shooter was
01:20:54.380
trans and the justification was, well, Christians are hateful. You know, they, they hate me. So I went and
01:20:59.920
I did this and, and these, these people, these Christians that are, that are the victims of these
01:21:04.720
attacks are in no way doing anything to harm any kind of trans or, or LGBT person at all. Right.
01:21:13.820
They're mostly going after kids. And the same thing was the justification for, for the Charlie Kirk
01:21:19.140
shooting that, well, he's a hateful person. And the only hateful thing they can come up with
01:21:23.100
is he doesn't validate my lived experience. He, he, he makes me feel bad because he says, no,
01:21:30.700
you can't actually change from man to woman or woman to man. If you're born a man, you're going
01:21:35.620
to always be a man. If you're born a woman, you're always going to be a woman. And to actually say
01:21:40.600
these things is something that the, the specifically the LGBT groups really consider an affront. They
01:21:48.380
consider it an attack on themselves and they, and the more, um, the more loosely connected to reality,
01:21:55.900
people actually think that violence is an acceptable response to this. So that's why the left doesn't
01:22:03.300
want to get involved in helping to defend Christians. That's why, um, you'll hear, you know,
01:22:09.100
any number of leftists just poo-pooing the idea that Christians are being attacked for their
01:22:13.820
Christianity in Nigeria or in the U S they don't want to, they don't want to, you know, say that's
01:22:20.140
actually what's happening. So you're going to hear, have pushback of, uh, you know, just the idea of
01:22:25.200
helping them because they're Christians. I mean, again, back to Charlie Kirk, there were leftists
01:22:29.980
protesting Charlie Kirk's, uh, funeral. Yeah. How insane is that? I mean, this is, this is, this is so
01:22:38.500
ridiculous to think this, this guy got killed and we're going to go and protest his funeral. That
01:22:44.980
that's the level of vitriol that Christians are facing now. And again, I'm, I'm an agnostic guy,
01:22:49.480
right? I don't have a, a particular, uh, particularly strong faith in any religion. I'm kind of like,
01:22:54.840
I don't know what's, you know, I don't know what happens after you die. I don't know. Um, but I do know
01:23:00.140
that there are definitely people out there that look at Christians and all they see is Jerry Falwell.
01:23:06.180
They see the mega church pastors that are making a bunch of money and they see Catholics that, uh,
01:23:12.880
have, have, you know, Catholic altar boys that have been molested and the church covering it up.
01:23:18.580
They see only the bad things, uh, you know, of the past 30 or 40 years. And they say, well,
01:23:23.800
that's Christianity. So there, there, there's no reason to defend Christianity, ignoring the fact
01:23:29.960
that our entire moral system here in the West, everything that we consider right and good
01:23:35.220
is based on Christian morals, right? Like if we were, if we were, if our, if our society was based
01:23:43.100
on the Aztec religion, we would think it's right and good to kill children. So that way the sun keeps
01:23:49.440
coming up, you know, the, the Aztecs were, were sacrifice. Human sacrifice was totally normal.
01:23:54.100
If we were in, uh, um, an Islamic country based with an Islamic theocracy, we would think that it's
01:24:00.020
perfectly, perfectly fine to kill people for being gay. Not just, not just say, oh, we, we don't agree
01:24:05.180
with the act of being gay, literally throw them off the highest building in town. Um, these kinds of
01:24:10.740
things, the, the idea that, that Western morale or the morality that we live under, that we have, even
01:24:16.600
people largely on the left, the morality that, that they espouse, that they say is, is, is actually
01:24:23.020
right and good. To think that it's not connected to Christianity is an error. Yeah. And yet the left
01:24:29.700
will swear up and down that the, that Christians are the problem. And, and it is, so you're, so how
01:24:35.320
do you convince a population that has now been convinced that Christianity is the problem? How do
01:24:41.320
you convince them, hey, it's actually a worthwhile endeavor to try to protect these people?
01:24:45.560
Well, let's, let's, uh, for, for, for those that, uh, uh, on the left that may view Christianity
01:24:53.820
that way, uh, let's look at it from throw, throw a Christianity out of it, throw it, go into
01:25:01.140
a human perspective of men, women, children, elderly, who can't run fast enough that are being slaughtered,
01:25:13.720
being hacked to death with machetes, being burned alive, um, being treated, uh, in the
01:25:21.940
most horrific ways, being left for dead, just, just from a human perspective. If, if, if there's
01:25:31.300
any kind of humanity or morality at all in their hearts, these lives are worth saving. These
01:25:43.020
are innocents, innocent people that have done no wrong that are getting slaughtered and being
01:25:47.340
killed. Just from a human standpoint, they deserve protection. They deserve intervention.
01:25:59.080
When evil happens, good, good, good needs to fight it. And there's nothing more evil than
01:26:05.380
the slaughtering of children, innocent children, burning a grandmother alive as she's holding her
01:26:11.740
grandkids. This is what, this is what, this is what we've experienced.
01:26:15.220
I mean, what's the opposite? If you don't, if you don't intervene, if you don't allow for
01:26:20.120
voices to be raised or heard, then what are you doing? You're allowing, is it, it's okay
01:26:24.340
because my truth is to kill you, to slaughter you, to take over your land? Is that, is that
01:26:28.800
what we're saying here? Because if that happens, then what's going to stop them from going to
01:26:32.540
Ghana, to Burkina, to Europe, to England, to US, you know?
01:26:36.760
Well, I mean, it seems the answer is nothing, right? Because that's, that's kind of what
01:26:42.200
And look, look at history. And there's a, there's a misconception with a lot of people
01:26:46.980
that, you know, where Christians are persecuted, that Christianity explodes. That does not happen
01:26:52.800
in the case of Islam. That does not happen in the case of Islam at all. Virtually every
01:26:59.340
country that has been Islamized has not been de-Islamized without a war.
01:27:04.040
Yes. Yeah. I mean, you can look to Spain for that.
01:27:07.140
And the Christian populations shrink, shrink and shrivel and shrivel almost down to nothing.
01:27:13.380
And people don't talk about how Islam conquered its way all the way into Europe. They even conquered
01:27:20.560
Spain. Entire languages, entire cultures were wiped off the map that are no longer in existence.
01:27:27.880
And it wasn't until the Crusades and the Europeans got their act together and pushed Islam back to
01:27:33.280
the Middle East. But all that time they enslaved people, they eradicated entire cultures. They put
01:27:40.040
people in slavery until they died. And this is a history that no one really talks about or knows
01:27:45.680
about, but the only way this evil was stopped was by force. It wasn't done through diplomacy. It
01:27:53.060
wasn't done through things like this. It only responds to force. Evil is only stopped by force.
01:28:01.200
Yeah. I mean, the, the, the, the concept of, you know, the only thing that will stop a bad man
01:28:06.400
with a gun is a good man with a gun. Correct. The Nigerian government way of trying to solve this
01:28:11.040
issue is give the Fulani ethnic militia money to stop killing people. Yeah. They've paid off.
01:28:17.840
They've, they've come in, governments have come in deals with them and it's like,
01:28:21.220
that's not going to solve it. We're going to be nice to them. We're going to give you money.
01:28:24.000
We're going to give you trucks. We're going to give you all sorts of stuff.
01:28:26.100
Just quit killing people. That didn't work. Yeah. I mean, look at the Christians. So as a
01:28:31.260
Christian, the golden rule, love your neighbor as yourself. So how do I love myself? I know how
01:28:35.840
to wake up in the morning. I know how to get sleep. I know how to take care of myself,
01:28:38.720
bathe myself, feed myself. I want the same for my neighbor. And you ask any Christian, that's what
01:28:42.980
they, they'll say, you know, evil comes, bad things come. I turn my cheek, you know, but they've
01:28:47.880
said, now they're saying I've turned, I've turned both cheeks. I got no more cheeks to turn.
01:28:51.440
So what happens? They want to care for their, their neighbors, Muslim, Christian, animus,
01:28:58.380
whatever. And they were welcomed in with Christian charity, Christian charity, you know, come on
01:29:04.180
in neighbor. We'll share with food. We'll, we'll share land. We'll do this with you. They
01:29:08.320
were given Christian charity and that's where leftists and very naive people. And I say even
01:29:18.220
some naive Christians believe that the Christian charity is going to somehow work by letting them
01:29:23.720
in your land. And they know, and Islam knows how to take advantage of it every step of the way
01:29:28.620
until they get the population and the political control. Yeah. Look at Dearborn, Michigan right now.
01:29:37.120
Look at what's happening in Minneapolis. When they get the population and they get the politics,
01:29:42.480
they take over territory and push everybody out. And then eventually, you know, if it grows too much,
01:29:50.920
there will be a time where violence occurs because this is how it's been since 640 AD. We have to
01:29:55.660
acknowledge what's going on. So it is the moral and the right thing to do to stand up to evil and it
01:30:00.600
won't take a whole lot to do it. And it can be done. And why should people care? Why should people
01:30:07.840
care? Because if this came to your backyard, if this came to your neighborhood, came to your town,
01:30:12.920
wouldn't you want somebody standing up for you? Does this go further than just Nigeria? Now,
01:30:17.580
you said the Fulanis are nomadic and they're not, you know, they don't consider themselves Nigerian.
01:30:23.200
Are other countries that surround Nigeria subject to the same thing? And could you convince the other
01:30:30.280
countries surrounding Nigeria that this is a clear and present danger to them?
01:30:34.620
So what it happened, so Nigeria, 2001, as you alluded to, September 7th, that Friday,
01:30:40.760
September 11th was a Tuesday. September 7th, that Friday happened, some Christians supposedly
01:30:47.580
offended a Muslim and then the Muslims rounded up themselves and started to attack Christian areas
01:30:52.860
in Joss City where I was living. From that, you got...
01:30:57.040
I was there, yeah. I was trying to save people from being killed. You know, I was literally helping
01:31:00.880
people get into my house from there being chased down the street. So you saw this happening. And
01:31:05.420
then regionally, Niger, Mali, Burkina Faso, they started to see a rise of terrorists coming in.
01:31:14.220
You know, there's people wanting to fight the government that they had. And for good reason,
01:31:18.660
sometimes there's corruption. But they took it to a further extent, like the Fulanis, like the
01:31:23.880
Boko Haram, they kind of merged together with Al-Qaeda and ISIS. And they started to do this.
01:31:28.180
So the government, instead of trying to stop it, they just rose up and said, we're going
01:31:32.520
to do a coup. The president can't do it. His willy-nilly stuff is not going to work. We're
01:31:36.880
going to rise up and be a... We're going to take over military-wise and fight. And who helped
01:31:41.320
them? The Russians. So Burkina Faso is now a military rule and it's well-funded by Russians.
01:31:47.880
In fact, some Burkina Bays and Malians and Niger were signing up to go to Ukraine to fight
01:31:53.540
with Russia. Niger also has been a coup. The militaries are ruling there and Russia's there
01:31:58.480
as well as in Mali. So it's just going to keep spreading. And so all this is happening.
01:32:04.060
No one's saying or doing anything. France left. They just took off. So now Russia's taken up
01:32:08.560
the vacuum and filling in. So if Nigeria... If that stuff doesn't happen in Nigeria, you're
01:32:13.360
going to lose that sort of democracy in Africa, specifically West Africa. Because Nigeria is...
01:32:18.520
They say it's the trigger on the gun. If you take Africa, the continent, turn it at the
01:32:24.080
Yeah. So I imagine you've got the countries that are... I mean, Liberia is fairly close,
01:32:31.060
probably a thousand miles away or whatever. And that kind of... Those countries there,
01:32:37.800
they're largely influenced by the US, but that is no longer the case, correct?
01:32:43.160
Well, again, they're doing diplomacy aid. They're saying, we'll give you this money, but then
01:32:47.520
take these LGBT... Take these issues and make sure you're doing this as well. Well,
01:32:52.160
they've stopped that, so it doesn't happen. But so Burkina Faso wouldn't listen to France
01:32:56.800
because France was telling them to just play nice. And they wouldn't. So they said, well,
01:33:00.520
the only way we can stop it is militarily. So that's why the military rose up, dethroned the
01:33:05.320
president, and now is a military dictator in Burkina Faso, his name in Niger. Because they
01:33:09.940
know the threat that these terrorists, these militants are doing. And the only way to stop
01:33:13.780
it is with force. And that's what they're doing.
01:33:15.200
Yeah. And if Nigeria falls, just say, if Nigeria falls, so goes the rest of Africa.
01:33:28.020
The most populous country in Africa, 220 million. It's one of the most rich with natural resources,
01:33:33.840
oil, all that. And if Nigeria goes and they get that population, they get those natural resources
01:33:41.840
and minerals. Nigeria is the most populous country in all of Africa.
01:33:49.800
So they will then easily take over Benin, Togo, Ghana. They'll have the whole continent in
01:34:03.440
And it will be a bloodbath and millions and millions of lives will be destroyed.
01:34:07.500
So they're influential. So Nigeria as a nation is called into peace.
01:34:11.840
Keeping missions for African Union, ECOWAS, different things for themselves. So they've
01:34:16.680
gone into Liberia. They've gone into Sudan. At the same time, they've stopped crises in
01:34:20.940
East Africa. They've been part of discussions for South Africa. South Africa probably has
01:34:25.760
a little bit better economy, but it's a worse situation than Nigeria as far as the communism
01:34:30.440
and socialism go. But if Nigeria falls into these hands of militant Islamists, it's just
01:34:36.700
going to give everyone else, hey, all bets are off. Let's go. Let's just rise up and take over.
01:34:41.620
They're already creeping into northern, you know, Benin and Togo, northern Ghana. And
01:34:46.460
Ghana has enacted laws to stop Fulani for doing things. Togo's trying, Benin's trying, but
01:34:52.140
it's, you know, it's just waiting for Nigeria to fall.
01:34:56.840
Yep. Okay. So, I mean, you know, I get what you're saying about the influence of Nigeria,
01:35:06.080
Nigeria. Um, but I'm, I'm not sure that I, I understand why it is that the, that Nigeria
01:35:13.000
is such a linchpin. Um, I mean, obviously the, the population is a big deal. Um, it does
01:35:19.600
the population overall want to fight back? I mean, you said it's 220 million half or so
01:35:24.800
are, are, are Muslims. So, I mean, that's 110 million people, 110 million Christians that
01:35:30.460
are like, Oh, you know, we're on the chopping block and they, they don't have any political
01:35:34.380
power to, to influence the government or they don't, they don't seem to be able to. Is
01:35:40.600
So what I said in the beginning was the 36 States, the federal government, the oil money,
01:35:45.340
that's the oil revenues that come in, they divide it to the States. Here, use your pot.
01:35:48.900
Here's your pot. Okay. Then the local, here's your pot. Here's your pot. So it's, so it's coming
01:35:53.180
from the top down. Is there, I mean, you look at the map and is there a consolidation
01:35:57.200
of Christians or are they spread out throughout the country? Is it like
01:36:01.180
South is predominantly Christian and it gets to about 50, 50 in the middle and then it's
01:36:06.140
mostly Muslim in the North. Yeah. So go to, so you look at the capital of Abuja, um, which
01:36:12.400
is right in the center of the word Nigeria, South of Abuja, Christian, North of Abuja, right
01:36:17.620
at the middle belt, 50, 50. And then above the middle belt is Islam. So right. So you
01:36:23.140
demand, I mean, just by the look of it, you'd imagine that the Christians have more of the
01:36:26.260
resources as opposed to like, maybe, maybe not the oil resources, but they don't have
01:36:30.740
the military. Yeah. Military is often in the hands of the president. So the president sends
01:36:36.660
troops in, you know, you're at the mercy of whatever the president wants. The governor's
01:36:40.680
supposed to say we want troops, but the president could say, no, I'm going to send them anyways.
01:36:44.260
And, and he gets in there and then they do what he needs them to do. And the, the, the top
01:36:49.220
military command is Fulani. Okay. So they're, they're nomads that are no longer nomadic.
01:36:56.260
So they have city Fulani and then nomadic Fulani. City ones have been settled. They've
01:36:59.820
got jobs. They're in politics or some sort of job, but, and you know, their ideology could
01:37:05.520
be the same, but just not as aggressive as not holding a weapon, but they're allowing
01:37:10.000
things to happen. They're just basically like, well, you know, I'm, I, my life is, is
01:37:13.640
fairly, uh, I'm content in my life here, but I, I am sympathetic to the idea.
01:37:19.260
My brothers. Yeah. Yeah. The other Fulani's. Um, yeah. I mean, can you, can you tell me more
01:37:27.060
about, um, about the, the distinction between the, the, the Fulani that are the nomadic and
01:37:33.220
the Fulani that are kind of the, the ones that are, um, I guess normalized. Is it possible
01:37:40.600
to, to use the normal, to convince the normalized to, you know, influence the, the Fulani that
01:37:47.060
are, are the, uh, the, I guess for, for lack of a better term, the militants?
01:37:51.240
Yeah. I mean, by and large, like he was describing, so a village has Christian farmers living there
01:37:56.500
and the Fulani have come down for centuries. They've often come down. They ask the Christian
01:38:00.320
leaders, where can they set up their camp? They have these mobile tents that they can put
01:38:04.960
up so that they set up there, they help them with the manure from the cows. Life is grand.
01:38:09.540
And, but then, as you said, sometimes militants come in and say, we're going to attack this
01:38:13.860
village tomorrow night. You need to either be gone or allow us to cover. So they, or we'll
01:38:19.200
kill you. Right. So they've, they threaten them. They can't, you talk to Fulani who are,
01:38:22.720
who are trying to stop, they can't because they, they feel for their own, they threaten their
01:38:26.000
own lives. Yeah. And you're saying the Christians are the Christians. They're not, they're not
01:38:30.440
the, the, uh, the nomads at all. Right. The Christians are farmers. Farmers. Yeah. Okay. They've
01:38:34.940
had cattle, but they're, they've kept them on ranches. Right. So, and then the, the city
01:38:39.000
Fulani are the ones that are, you know, settled down. They don't have cattle. Maybe they have
01:38:42.420
a cattle, but someone else takes care of it, but they, they're in positions of power because
01:38:45.820
of the, the emirate that happened in 1804, the jihad. So the emir, this, then the politicians,
01:38:50.780
the British made them rulers, made them politicians. So the British kind of set up this whole catastrophic
01:38:55.960
system, you know, and the Christians will even say this, just let, let's draw, let's put
01:39:00.580
a wall in the North. You can have it, do what you want with it. You have no resources,
01:39:04.780
maybe have a little bit, nothing as we have, and we'll just, we'll take the South, you
01:39:08.260
know, go away. I imagine, I mean, if you look at the, just the, the, the fact that the South
01:39:13.160
is where, you know, it looks like all the things that grow, grow and the North is.
01:39:16.900
Yeah. The oil's all in the, in the ocean on the South.
01:39:19.400
Oh, so the oil's actually, okay. Well, I mean, I, I imagine that's not going to be, well,
01:39:23.320
I mean, that, that alone points to why the, the, the Northern, uh, the Northern people would
01:39:29.460
be pushing to the South because the resources are in the South, you know, that's where things
01:39:33.300
grow. That's if the oil's off the coast, you know, that, that, that makes perfect sense.
01:39:37.460
And, and I don't, I mean, I don't imagine that as much as we, you know, we've been talking about
01:39:42.900
if the U S kind of just puts a little bit of political pressure, a little, a little, you know,
01:39:47.280
kind of gets, like I said, the ISR on, on them. I don't imagine that, that that's actually going
01:39:51.600
to materially change the situation because the resources, whether or not there are ideologically
01:39:57.000
motivated people, there might be ideologically motivated people that are, that are like,
01:40:00.860
I'm willing to fight, but the people that are, are in positions of power, they know where the,
01:40:04.560
the resources are. They know what, where the money is and it's not in the desert. It's, it's,
01:40:09.760
you know, on the coast and, and in the port and where the rain comes and stuff. So, so how do you,
01:40:16.460
how do you deal with that particular, you know, dynamic, the, the, all of the resources are where
01:40:22.320
the Christians are and all of the aggression is, is coming from the North where the sand is.
01:40:27.000
That's where the discussion, that's what we said. If we sit down, dad and his two, two sons sit
01:40:32.380
down and have a discussion, there could be something, right? Dad's respected. He's, he's
01:40:36.960
going to be the, the, the authority, but he's the moderator, the mediator between the two fighting
01:40:41.300
quarreling brothers. Let's, let's have that. Let's start with that because if you show them,
01:40:45.500
this is what you get, if you continue to do this, this is what they may do or something may happen.
01:40:50.740
And let's figure this out. You know, again, it doesn't take money. It just takes
01:40:54.280
an effort to, to someone to say, let's do this. Let's talk this through. Let's see what you have
01:40:58.820
and let's figure out what we can, you know, what you could do together.
01:41:03.340
And, and you know, I, and if, if that doesn't work, I'm for intervention because if this,
01:41:08.840
if this isn't stopped, there's going to be a lot more dead bodies very, very, very soon.
01:41:16.760
And if intervention can happen now, it will stop and prevent a civil war from happening.
01:41:23.860
So what is in your mind, what does that intervention look like beyond just the secretary of state
01:41:29.600
saying, Hey, you know, does it look like troops on the ground or is it something, or are you more
01:41:38.260
thinking of, because I mean, we look, it's not going to be the UN, right? The UN peacekeepers aren't
01:41:43.200
going to, aren't going to be able to do anything. A major investment in Nigeria and that investment
01:41:47.940
being protected. So you're thinking something along the lines of, uh, um, companies going in to
01:41:56.480
expand on the natural resources there and then possibly the U S military protecting that.
01:42:02.580
Protecting and make, and just ensuring we'll have the Nigerian government ensure the protection of
01:42:07.500
those investments. Otherwise there's repercussions, but I think they're like, it's a win-win scenario.
01:42:12.580
Nigeria prospers, people aren't being killed, the economy prospers. And that is a very, very
01:42:20.700
Yeah. I don't, I don't, I'm not, I don't think that the U S has the, uh, that the, the people of
01:42:25.520
the United States are, are, I don't think that, that you could make the case in a strong enough
01:42:31.160
way where you could get, um, public support of that.
01:42:35.080
We can get the Trump, we can get Trump support if there's a win-win scenario and a major return
01:42:39.880
of investment back to the United States. And I think you can make that case. I think American
01:42:45.640
Okay. We'll flesh that out then. How do you, how do you convince the American people? I mean, look,
01:42:49.040
the, the, we're dealing with a population that doesn't trust the government, right? The, the,
01:42:54.380
the trust in the, in the American government has never been lower. Right. And you've got a,
01:42:59.860
an extremely polarized political climate here. So half of the country is just going to say no,
01:43:07.660
because it's something that Donald Trump talked about doing. And again, we, we've already talked
01:43:10.820
about the, the way that the, the left kind of looks at, at Christians. So as soon as they get a whiff
01:43:16.620
of, oh, you're going in to protect Christians. No, you don't want to do that because Donald Trump
01:43:20.200
wants to do it. So, I mean, you're talking about, it's the same deal. It's a landmine. It's the same,
01:43:23.960
same deal they did in the Congo. It's the same negotiations are doing the Congo. We can do the
01:43:30.980
same thing in Nigeria and the United States would buy it because, uh, one saving lives to growing
01:43:39.080
our economy and having, you know, and expanding our influence in natural resources. I believe that
01:43:45.640
American people that are smart enough would see the advantage in doing this. And, you know, yeah,
01:43:51.380
we might have a lot of isolationist skeptics out there, but at the end of the day, if there's money
01:43:55.720
to be made for the government while saving lives, I think those that are in the power and make the
01:44:00.960
decisions will make that decision. It's not coming to arm Christians so they can kill Muslims. That's
01:44:05.860
not what we're saying. The religious tension is there. The religious liberties aren't, right?
01:44:10.240
The freedom of religion is not. So a Muslim who becomes a Christian will be killed by his family,
01:44:15.340
right? That's typically, if you're the oldest son and you become a Christian from a Muslim family,
01:44:19.740
you'll be killed. So there's no, there's no rights for, for, for that in the Islamic and the
01:44:24.420
Sharia law sort of something. As a Christian, I want to take care of everyone, my neighbor,
01:44:29.020
myself. So I want to do that. So you start with the discussion of how can we reduce this,
01:44:34.380
this tension? What can we do? Start with the police. The police in Nigeria are, I say useless,
01:44:41.360
that's maybe too strong of a word. They're not functioning. Ineffective. They're federal. They're,
01:44:46.000
they're, they're paid by the, the federal government, the whim of the president. And they're, they,
01:44:50.220
they don't know what they're doing in local areas because they're not maybe from that area. So
01:44:53.600
start with getting, Hey, let's go to states or local police. Let's start with there because
01:44:57.600
you're not, when a crisis breaks out, the military is often sent in and, and people don't trust the
01:45:03.720
military now. You know, people, they, they, you know, he's talking to these reports of people being
01:45:07.960
attacked and killed or people just surviving. What were they wearing? Military fatigues. They're
01:45:13.020
wearing camouflage. They've got their, their names ripped off or they've, they, you know, they're,
01:45:17.060
they either stolen from a military base or they, they got them, they borrowed them or rented them,
01:45:21.240
as he says. So, you know, those kinds of things, just a discussion on those, right? Having that
01:45:25.780
providing a place to make, make Nigeria safer, but also it'll make America safer. As I said,
01:45:31.540
it'll stop that spread of radical Islam. Yep. Yeah. Um, I'm still, I like, I mean, you know,
01:45:41.100
the, the, the, because again, the, the realities of, of where the American people are. I mean,
01:45:45.860
I see it all the time, right? Like, even if you, if you look at our chat now, there's a lot of people
01:45:49.240
that are just like, how is this America's problem? Yeah. You know? And, and so I'm,
01:45:53.260
I'm trying to. It's America's problem because America is period. Yeah. You know, I think that's
01:45:58.620
the, the thing is, is we've, I've said this, he's said this, it doesn't need money. It just needs
01:46:03.400
a sit down, a discussion, a deal to be made. Right. And then eventually we'll say, we'll bring in this
01:46:09.660
business. There's a huge market there. You know, phone companies have come in from Middle East,
01:46:15.080
from South Africa made millions, millions of money. Cars are being imported from Japan, from
01:46:20.900
Belgium, you know, different European countries. They don't want Chinese products. Everyone
01:46:26.360
says, do you want, do you want original, this good Japanese car? Or do you want this cheap
01:46:30.460
Chinese one? You know, do you want this old used iPhone or do you want this new Chinese one?
01:46:36.220
Give me the old iPhone. They don't want Chinese products. Okay. So you have a market there that
01:46:40.160
can be easily. So there's demand for it then. Yeah. So, yeah. Okay. So do you think that there's
01:46:45.300
demand for, I mean, obviously the, the Christians in, in Nigeria would be like, look, we want as much
01:46:51.200
help as we can get, you know? They just want their voice to be heard first. And that's what we're
01:46:55.400
doing. We're just raising their voice, amplifying it, getting it heard by the right people because
01:47:00.240
they've been silenced by the mainstream media. It's been widely ignored.
01:47:03.580
How would a sit down look though? Cause it seems like one of these groups has a religious view
01:47:10.380
that's just incompatible with any kind of progress in the direction of Christianity period. So like,
01:47:15.680
how do you convince them? Well, if it's, if it's, let's say it's governmental at that level. So U.S.
01:47:20.280
government, I said, Mossad Boulus and Rubio go over, sit down with the Nigerian government and talk
01:47:27.060
it through. They'll address, it's not a religious thing. It's a local crisis. Well, why is that? What,
01:47:31.680
what, why is it like this? What can we do to, to, to make sure that it doesn't grow,
01:47:36.260
doesn't spread. But we think we're hearing from other people that it is religious, right? So this
01:47:41.020
is why we think it is. And we'll put that CPC designation. It's kind of, it's toothless as,
01:47:45.560
as Judd said, but it's also, it's something we can use against them. You're not going to get this age.
01:47:49.960
You're not going to get this status with the CPC country, particular concern. So getting that
01:47:55.060
discussion in, you know, we've got businesses who want to come in, whether it's from another African
01:47:59.320
country or from America, from Europe, whatever, they want to come in and they can't, they won't
01:48:03.200
because it's unsafe. Yeah. Electricity grid is terrible there. They've had problems with it.
01:48:08.380
They've had so much money gone into it. They sell more electricity outside of the country than they
01:48:12.840
use in the country. So there's electricity to be used. They're just not, you know, making it stable.
01:48:17.440
How do they generate, generate their electricity? There's dams, there's oil, there's gas, there's, yeah.
01:48:22.940
The other thing I was thinking about was guns, because it seems like only one part is allowed to
01:48:27.140
have guns legally or loosely illegally. So how would they be able to have them?
01:48:33.740
Yeah. I mean, if you need those. Yeah. To that, to that point, how do you, how do you, if,
01:48:38.360
if hypothetically the U S were to send in, you know, um, military advisors, you know, cause I mean,
01:48:44.860
that's the job of the green berets. Like people think a lot of people think special forces are
01:48:48.360
special forces, but like the green berets, the job of them, their, their job is ostensibly to go in,
01:48:53.400
find existing military forces or, or existing resistance forces and train them up and make
01:48:59.320
them a functional military unit that can actually win engagements. Um, but if there is only a handful
01:49:06.380
of private contractors and there's not, you know, weapons and, and et cetera, um, how do you, how do you
01:49:14.680
arm the population? If there's, if the law prevents them from having arms and, and, and the means to
01:49:22.420
defend themselves, what good is a, uh, you know, a couple, couple hundred green berets if, uh, if
01:49:28.980
there's no one actually to train? Yeah. I mean, the thing is, is, is again, it's, it's education. So they,
01:49:36.580
you arm just a random Nigerian, they have to be learned how to use a gun, clean a gun, all that, all that.
01:49:44.460
But you, you have people that are already doing it. These hunting groups, they call them hunters
01:49:49.040
association, but they're, it's, it's hilarious, but not hilarious, but they're, they're armed and
01:49:53.180
they're willing to fight, but they, their guns are man-made. They're pipes and, and just different
01:49:57.720
things welded on. There are groups that are willing to protect villages. Like I said, vigilante,
01:50:03.200
it's a bad word, but that's what they call their groups that are, that are told to roam the, the places
01:50:07.980
where the hotspots are. And they do that. They're willing to do that. They're doing it. So let's help them
01:50:12.980
with the, if the weapons have to be brought in and the government of Nigeria has to sign off on what's
01:50:17.640
being in. So we know the, the serial numbers and all the, the munitions, whatever, fine, whatever. But
01:50:22.720
until you do that, you don't know what's going to happen. Right now they're being out, out, out gunned.
01:50:27.620
And just to explain. So, so they're called the vigilante. They're village security teams. Yeah.
01:50:31.540
These are people from the community. They're from their own village. They have the approval of the
01:50:35.800
government tab. They have the approval of the government to protect their village. They just,
01:50:42.100
they're, they're just not armed. They're not armed with AK 47s. They're not armed with the same weapons
01:50:46.920
as the terrorists are. If these guys got approval to defend themselves, you guarantee that a lot of
01:50:53.800
the killings would stop if they had the ability to protect themselves. And that wouldn't take a huge
01:51:00.000
investment from the United States government. I mean, that just, I mean, wouldn't that just take
01:51:03.900
the, the government of Nigeria to allow them to do that? So is that something that the, that state
01:51:10.040
could pressure them into? Be like, Hey, it is definitely something that could pressure them into.
01:51:13.700
Yep. Okay. So, so, uh, a sit down with, uh, with, you know, Marco Rubio himself went over there and
01:51:23.080
just said, Hey, let these people defend themselves from these attacks. And is that something that's out of
01:51:29.580
the question or, or, or we're just waiting? Do you just, do you think that it's just that the
01:51:33.920
Rubio going over? No, no. I mean, well, I mean, possibly, I mean, looks that, you know,
01:51:37.800
in the, in the grand scheme of things, it's not a big ask, but it also, it also puts the Nigerian
01:51:44.400
government on notices. Like how serious are you about protecting your own citizens? And the
01:51:49.460
citizens will be watching and watching to see how that government reacts. What do you think that
01:51:55.200
the, what do you think the rest of, so say for hypothetically, Marco Rubio, say he doesn't go,
01:52:00.580
but he sends a, sends the deputy right over and, and he's got the full authorization. Uh, what,
01:52:07.660
what the deputy says is what the state department is, the official position of the state department.
01:52:12.740
What does the rest of the world say? What is, what do the groups in, in the Middle East,
01:52:17.080
what are the Middle Eastern countries say? Is it something that they're, they just, we don't care
01:52:20.440
or, or what would the UN say, you know, is, is there, is there going to be pushback from the rest
01:52:25.680
of the world? Yeah, there'll be pushback from the rest of the world because the rest of the world
01:52:29.560
is bought in with the far left and it's funded and controlled by, uh, by, by Islamists. So anything
01:52:36.520
that goes against their narrative and their objective, they're going to raise all holy hell
01:52:41.140
about, and they'll be like, oh, Trump wants a civil war in Nigeria. They'll throw out all sorts of
01:52:45.580
insanity. I guarantee they will, but who cares what they say? They're in the wrong. They have
01:52:52.140
been in the wrong. They've been advocating every wrong policy for the last 20 years and have
01:52:56.240
destroying, uh, everything it touches. So, well, they're not going to do anything. They're not
01:53:01.460
going to do anything. No, they'll, but they'll just cry. And, and is it likely that there would be,
01:53:05.860
um, so the U S sends some kind of support and the Christians decide they're going to start,
01:53:10.940
you know, defending themselves. Will there be an influx of, of Islamic radicals of, of other,
01:53:17.880
you know, Muslims from other countries? Will they say this is where the jihad is now? Like there was
01:53:23.200
in, in, in, in, in Iraq and in Afghanistan. Is that something that's possible? Could this turn
01:53:29.620
into a larger conflict because they say, okay, look, they're Christians. They're there. It's now
01:53:35.200
they're attacking the Muslims. There's, you know, half the country is Muslim. So we have to go and defend
01:53:39.560
our Muslim brothers. Is that something that you could see? I don't, I don't think it'll be to
01:53:44.120
that extent. I think we have to engage other countries, Middle East, Europe, just to say,
01:53:50.640
look, stop giving aid, stop giving your, your resources, your food, whatever. Just stop it
01:53:54.920
for a while. Let's take this action. What does action of, of, of, of talking to the government
01:54:00.100
and say, we're all coming together to say, if they don't want to come, then it's on them,
01:54:03.820
but we're going to try this. Let's give this a chance. If it's arming or these vigilante groups
01:54:08.700
or make them better equipped, that would send the signals to any other group that,
01:54:12.720
hey, these guys are equipped too now. So I don't want to, I'm not, I'm not risking my
01:54:15.780
life right now. I, I'll gun them. I can just go in and do random, you know, I don't have
01:54:20.400
to worry about that. But if now I'm being equal, now, now my life maybe is more valuable and
01:54:26.960
I will stop. And I don't think it'll rise up a bigger terrorist, you know, from Northeast.
01:54:32.460
They'll continue to be driven down by the military, but the Fulani militants, I think
01:54:37.360
would hear, hear, would see the, the reaction and I believe would slow down or stop. Yeah.
01:54:44.180
I agree with his point. Yeah. Um, do you think that, that the possibility of, of, of it becoming,
01:54:53.460
you know, an inflection point prevents the, uh, the, or do you think that's what, that's
01:54:59.760
what prevented the, the previous administration from doing anything? Or is it just a matter
01:55:03.860
of, well, they don't really believe that there is a problem that the U.S. should be involved
01:55:07.700
in? I think it was, I mean, for sure it was, they, they, I mean, even Nigerians will say
01:55:12.540
we don't need Americans to solve our problem. We need to be heard. We need to make sure that
01:55:17.260
the Nigerian government is seeing what's actually happening. Yeah. I think that's the first
01:55:21.560
step, right? They're, it's not about, and, and I weren't there, the, the, all that the
01:55:26.700
Biden administration was listening to was the Nigerian government. They weren't listening
01:55:29.300
to the people. We would, you know, if we sell scenario, we took over Masad, Bullis, Rubio,
01:55:34.020
showed him what's going on in, in these IDP camps, show him what's going on in these,
01:55:37.820
these were the terrorists or the, the, the, the bandits have kidnapped people and are torturing
01:55:41.400
them, show them what's happening. He'd have a better take on what's going on. That would
01:55:45.300
probably be our first thing. But we need action. We need action and we need it to happen now.
01:55:56.060
Like I said, if action does not happen, it's going to be a bloodbath. There will be a civil
01:55:59.580
war. And, you know, right now we have 3.5 million Christians that are barely getting any aid,
01:56:05.680
any help. We have a crisis on the ground right now where people are starving. People are dying
01:56:11.580
of diseases. They weren't getting any help from USAID in the first place, but I'm making an appeal
01:56:17.780
to the audience. There are innocent people. There are Nigerians that need your help. If you don't
01:56:22.760
want the government to get involved, if you feel compelled, donate, support. Yeah. And I'll plug my
01:56:29.880
website, equippingthepersecuted.org. If you want to help persecuted Christians in Nigeria, partner with
01:56:34.520
us. Call your Senator, call your Congressman. If you want the United States to get involved,
01:56:40.160
ask your Senator and Congressman to get involved politically. Intervene on behalf of persecuted
01:56:44.500
Christians. But doing nothing is going to result in a lot more death. Sure. Well, why don't you
01:56:54.060
guys, I mean, that's kind of like a wrap up. Oh, I'm sorry. No, that's fine. That's fine. We're,
01:56:59.220
you know, we're just about two hours as it is. So, so Kyle, if you have any closing thoughts and
01:57:04.160
actually, where can people find you? So they can go to equippingthepersecuted.org,
01:57:11.000
all one word, equippingthepersecuted.org, partner with our organization. We get boots on the ground.
01:57:17.820
We respond to these attacks within 48 hours. We work with village security teams. We do medical
01:57:23.220
interventions in the IDP camps. We need all the help we can get. We're underfunded. I don't get grants,
01:57:28.620
government funding. It's all private donations. And then if you want to follow what's happening in
01:57:33.440
Nigeria from a news standpoint, go to truthnigeria.com and pray for these guys because
01:57:42.840
they're risking their lives every day to tell the truth about what's happening and share the
01:57:46.760
articles, help their voices be heard. Kyle, you got anything, last words?
01:57:51.640
I mean, so we're doing, so ICON is International Committee on Nigeria. The website is I-C-O-N,
01:57:56.700
ICON, help.org. We're more of the behind the scenes. We're gathering data and information. So
01:58:03.180
we've got some of his guys, some of our guys going out and when the crisis happens, they document it
01:58:08.920
using an app. And it's evidence, you know, it's locked in the cloud. So it's evidence. We can use
01:58:15.420
that for, if it's the International Criminal Courts or it's the UN, you know, those kinds of things can
01:58:20.860
happen. So I think, yeah, just get aware of what's going on. You can say, how does this affect America?
01:58:26.900
It already does. You don't even realize, why should we be given billions of dollars? We shouldn't. We
01:58:32.200
shouldn't be involved militarily, but we are. So what are we going to do? We're going to have to
01:58:37.160
figure out how to stop it. So let's, as he said, contact your Senate, your Congress, get them to say,
01:58:43.460
hey, look, I know there's things on Nigeria. What's going on? Let's stop this. Get President Trump,
01:58:48.460
as I said, he says something and it happens. So just, you know, as much as you can, if you can get to
01:58:53.900
any legislature, any, any politician, you know, do it, Democrat or Republican.
01:58:59.180
Okay. And then you're, you guys, you have a, an X account people can follow you at or anything
01:59:03.660
like that? No. Yeah. You can follow me, Judd Saul on X. Judd, J-U-D-D-S-A-U-L. Follow us at
01:59:12.840
EquipThePersecuted on X. You can find me on Facebook, EquippingThePersecuted on Facebook.
01:59:20.120
Just thank you for having us on and we encourage your audience, spread the word. This is a genocide
01:59:27.040
that has been completely ignored and we need people to speak about it. Okay. Kyle?
01:59:32.420
Yeah. IconHelp1, I-C-O-N-H-E-L-P-1 is our X account. Yeah. Again, just get things, go online,
01:59:40.900
retweet these, the things that you're sharing today, the other articles and get people aware. You know,
01:59:46.120
when Bill Mayer said that, it came out of the blue. We didn't know how, why, but it's, it's stirred
01:59:50.520
up the, the, the awareness now. So. Awesome. All right. Well, Judd, Kyle, thank you guys for
01:59:56.000
being a part, Carter. Thanks for pushing the buttons. We appreciate you coming in. For sure.
01:59:59.780
And so you guys can, you can check out clips from the show all weekend and Tim and the rest
02:00:06.200
of the IRL gang will be, well, not myself, but Tim and the guys are still out on location and
02:00:12.380
they'll be doing IRL tonight. And so you can catch clips from the IRL this week over the