The Debrief With MyronGainesX - This BANNED Book Led To The Most EVIL Murder For Hire Case Ever....

00:00:00.000 all right and we are live what's up guys welcome to fed it man we got a lot to talk about we got

00:00:04.540 an episode on a hitman from the early 90s it's going to be a great episode murder for hire let's

00:00:08.720 get into it i was a special agent with homelands investigations okay guys hsi the cases that i did

00:00:16.060 mostly were human smuggling and drug trafficking no one else has these documents by the way here's

00:00:22.980 who are fed it covered doctor lofredo confirmed lacerations due to stepping on glass murder

00:00:30.880 investigations you don't know and he's positioning been on february 13 2019 you're facing two counts

00:00:37.380 of the meditative murder racketeering and rico conspiracy young slime life here and after

00:00:42.560 referred to as ysl the defendants uh six nine and then this is billy seiko right here now when they

00:00:47.820 first started guys six nine random i'm upset i'm watching this music video you know i'm bobbing

00:00:53.040 my highlight hey this shit lit but at the same time i'm pausing oh wait who this right well who's that

00:00:57.940 in the back firearms and violent claims aka bush i see violated in order to stay away from the victim

00:01:04.340 this is the one that that's gonna fuck him up because this gun is not tracing well it happened

00:01:12.500 at the gun range here's your boy 42 dug right here on the left okay sex trafficking and sex crimes they can

00:01:17.680 effectively link him to paying an underage girl and the first bomb went off right here

00:01:24.740 suspect to shut down a backpack on the site of the second explore inspired by al-qaeda two terrorists

00:01:30.520 brothers the zokar sarnev and tamarland sarnev when the cartel shipped drugs into the country as this

00:01:36.840 guy got arrested for um espionage okay trading secrets with the russians for monetary compensation

00:01:42.980 the largest corrupt police bust in new ormond history the days of the police are gone so he

00:01:49.680 was in this bad boy we're gonna go over his past the gang time so that this all makes sense

00:01:54.880 all right what's up guys welcome to fed it man i'm here with two special guests in the house

00:02:04.780 christina and mia you guys want to introduce yourself to the people real quick

00:02:08.020 hello i'm mia uh currently a lot of what i'm doing is um i'm doing tiktok managing for fresh

00:02:15.500 and fit yes she is yeah other uh social media slash talent management um opportunities that i've

00:02:23.940 been pursuing bam welcome now what about you christina all right hi christina um honestly i'm just

00:02:31.140 gonna go down to fed it if you guys are in memphis or new york please contact me on ig at fede 1811

00:02:37.500 or my ig at christy bojas um i just need people to get some documents bam she's right to the business

00:02:43.360 but uh yeah guys this is a second take man because i recorded this already and then what ended up

00:02:47.920 happening was uh the audio didn't play so we're doing it again man it is what it is uh because we

00:02:53.700 got to get this content out to you guys man we got it we got to work hard over here but anyway with that

00:02:57.460 said guys i'm without further ado we're going to break down a documentary from fbi files you guys

00:03:01.160 have come to learn and love one of my favorite documentaries this is a case from the early 90s

00:03:05.340 that concerns a murder for hire investigation uh so yeah without further ado ladies you have anything

00:03:10.540 you want to say before we get into it i'm excited all right let's get into it man

00:03:14.120 when three people were found murdered in their home it appeared like a burglary gone awry

00:03:21.380 but a crime this horrific deserved the closer look the suspect who had the most to gain from the

00:03:27.500 deaths also had the perfect alibi photographic proof that he was 3 000 miles away when the crime was

00:03:34.780 committed i'm jim kalstrom former head of the fbi's new york office it's our job to find the holes in

00:03:40.980 even the most bulletproof alibi in this case we had our work cut out for us

00:03:46.500 a montgomery county maryland police officer responded to vivian rice's frantic 9-1-1 call

00:03:57.060 he found a female victim dead just inside the front door

00:04:02.660 he also found a second one dead

00:04:07.980 and a young boy apparently murdered in his bed

00:04:17.140 you guys got uh three victims here need uh detectives and uh evidence technicians over here

00:04:26.940 through the day and into the anytime bodies are discovered guys

00:04:32.260 the primary job of the officer that discovers the scene is to you know make sure the scene is

00:04:36.300 preserved safe taped off so that investigators can come and get collect as much evidence when

00:04:42.280 it's fresh as possible because the first 48 hours is always critical to solving a murder case

00:04:47.080 tonight investigators would scour the scene for evidence thoroughly searching both inside and

00:04:54.620 outside the house they soon identified all the victims

00:04:59.740 the victims

00:05:03.820 mildred horn was a 43-year-old divorced mother employed as an american airlines flight attendant

00:05:09.820 she had been shot three times in the head her eight-year-old quadriplegic son trevor who required

00:05:16.380 round-the-clock nursing care appeared to have been suffocated police found him disconnected from his respirator

00:05:23.900 and trevor's overnight nurse 38-year-old janice saunders had been shot twice in the skull and that's where the noise is coming from guys uh with the respirator because once you know obviously some danger arises or their blood pressure goes down or anything happens with their vitals the machine starts to make a lot of noise so the nurse knows to come over

00:05:43.980 and in the eye

00:05:48.060 evidence technicians began work immediately

00:05:54.060 they were thorough but there was little evidence to collect

00:06:00.140 they dug a single distorted bullet fragment from the wood beside trevor's window

00:06:06.220 investigators took swabs of blood carefully collecting samples for dna testing

00:06:16.300 but the blood would match only the victim's dna

00:06:22.300 with so little to lead investigators to a suspect

00:06:25.500 technicians scrounged harder for clues collecting anything and everything that seemed promising

00:06:34.220 outside the house investigators found a metal file

00:06:44.860 that's going to be very important later on guys so make a note of that they found the metal file outside of the home

00:06:53.020 police were thorough but the killer had been meticulous

00:06:56.620 they found the metal file inside the house

00:07:00.060 montgomery county maryland homicide detective craig wittenberg named lead investigator struggled to make

00:07:06.380 sense of a case with three helpless victims no obvious motive and a few clues

00:07:13.260 there were some things that struck us so this was the lead investigator on this on this case guys uh typically uh when it comes to homicide and

00:07:22.380 and and rotations whoever was on duty on that night is the one that's going to clean up that case when it comes through because homicide investigators are typically on call 24

00:07:33.020 seven so he got assigned this case so as the main uh case detective or case officer in this case

00:07:38.140 he's going to be the one responsible for gathering all the evidence writing the reports writing affidavits preparing search warrants and presenting the case to the ada or is a

00:07:48.380 assistant district attorney for prosecution as odd

00:07:53.500 i think from the very beginning of the on-scene investigation

00:07:58.300 inside the house the foyer area a closet and that's actual uh footage from uh

00:08:06.380 the the crime scene which you know in the early 90s

00:08:08.780 had to bring in probably a big ass camcorder and lug that thing in and take video

00:08:12.300 the contents had been dumped everything been pulled out of the closet dumped onto the floor

00:08:22.300 we found a purse which we would later learn ultimately belonged to millie you had a lot of

00:08:31.420 stereo entertainment equipment tvs a lot of jewelry furs

00:08:37.660 that was untouched and left which again strikes you as odd if this is a if this is a burglary or

00:08:45.980 robbery going bad you're going to take something

00:08:51.820 which back then guys you got to remember back in the 90s right having that type of equipment was

00:08:56.220 extremely expensive you know any type of entertainment television uh entertainment equipment vcrs cable

00:09:02.220 boxes televisions all this stuff was expensive back in the 90s man so you know this was very unnormal

00:09:08.380 for someone to break into the house it'd be all ransacked like that and no one actually take anything

00:09:12.700 um you know it's not like nowadays where you can get a tv for next to nothing back then you know things

00:09:18.060 were a little bit more expensive especially like good entertainment equipment so this was 93 93 way before

00:09:24.780 you were born just a little bit yeah when were you born um yeah 99 god damn 99 barely 90s baby

00:09:34.540 in fact mildred's minivan was missing from the garage as her sister had noticed

00:09:42.460 but it was found quickly not far from the house

00:09:50.540 so that's important they found a car not too far from the home

00:09:53.260 some of mildred's credit cards were also missing

00:09:58.220 but found the next day on a nearby roadside by a jogger

00:10:02.940 gotcha with the closed caption baby investigators now positively eliminated burglary as a moment

00:10:09.740 instead they wondered if the missing items were a deliberate attempt by the killer to throw them

00:10:14.620 off his trail the scene had the earmarks of a planned professional execution

00:10:23.260 as for a suspect at the crime scene vivian told the mildred's ex-husband lawrence

00:10:32.940 horn was probably responsible man he said these uh captions are sucking right now

00:10:38.940 but uh yeah so there we go guys we got our first suspect right now

00:10:42.940 okay her husband ex-husband lawrence horn guys not lawrence home but lawrence horn

00:10:48.620 he quickly became the prime suspect all the family members and just so you guys know typically the

00:11:02.300 first person that's found at at the crime scene or the person that discovers the crime scene is almost

00:11:07.020 always going to be heavily interrogated by the police they're typically the first suspect

00:11:11.500 unless the police are able to quickly identify someone else so in this case right you had a

00:11:16.140 divorced woman that was murdered you know a likely suspect a lot of times going to be the ex-husband

00:11:20.460 so she's able to quickly say hey it was more than likely lawrence horn that was involved

00:11:24.860 and and the police were able to divert their attention to him but you know if you find a dead body best

00:11:30.540 believe that they're going to ask you a bunch of questions and you're going to be the primary suspect in the

00:11:34.380 beginning with a homicide investigation because remember guys that first 48 hours is critical

00:11:38.700 to them solving the case we're giving us this information that kept pointing to lawrence horn

00:11:45.980 that would be based on the very stormy rocky relationship that millie and lawrence horn had had for many many years

00:11:59.020 uh danny could you get this drum set up in number five for me please

00:12:02.380 all right investigators learned that in the 1960s and 70s horn had been a top producer and recording

00:12:09.260 engineer for motown records credited with many hits including shotgun by junior walker and the all-stars

00:12:17.340 he'd married mildred an airline attendant in 1973. then he'd moved with motown from detroit to los angeles

00:12:25.740 okay but when the company's fortunes waned so did his

00:12:33.180 he and mildred divorced in 1987 but their problems continued

00:12:39.820 as bob dean maryland assistant state's attorney soon discovered

00:12:44.620 all right and when they say maryland state's attorney guys that's the equivalent to uh assistant district attorney

00:12:49.740 same thing he's a prosecutor at the state level and as you guys know typically the state takes

00:12:55.100 exclusive rights when it comes to premeditated murder investigations feds are only involved

00:12:59.660 in murder investigations when there's some other type of prerequisite crime involved whether it was

00:13:03.900 gang related racketeering rico influence it was during the commission of a federal crime like let's

00:13:09.500 say a bank robbery but when it comes to murder in itself just standalone murder premeditated or

00:13:15.340 otherwise it's almost always investigated by the state predominantly so it would make sense that

00:13:22.140 you got a maryland investigator and then you got a maryland assistant district attorney uh involved in

00:13:26.780 the investigation we did some research on lawrence horn in the courthouse that day particularly um what

00:13:34.300 the status of his child support uh payments were and whatever civil aspects of his ongoing

00:13:42.700 uh civil battle with his wife were and he had just been held in contempt several months before

00:13:49.100 for failure to pay 18 18 000 in child support but in reviewing more oh that's a clue right there

00:13:56.700 he owed some money court records investigators learned that on march 3rd the day of the murders

00:14:03.500 horn's financial outlook had brightened considerably with his wife and son dead he now stood to inherit

00:14:11.580 1.7 do we know why they died the money came one 1.7 million dollars what was that um yeah his his wife

00:14:20.540 and son died yeah oh is this are these is this the wife and son yeah i'm stupid and he said the whole

00:14:29.820 time and he just said why oh well it's because there was two dead women and then one son so i was

00:14:35.820 wondering if like who if this killer was a random guy or no you're gonna get we're gonna get to that we're

00:14:40.460 gonna get to that she's she's another world guys don't worry about that um but yeah so 1.7 million

00:14:47.260 dollars guys just so you guys know let me go ahead and show y'all um what 1.7 million dollars in 1993

00:14:53.340 would have been today it's um it would have been three million four hundred eighty four thousand

00:15:00.300 three hundred sixty four dollars and seventy one cents today guys so that's what 1.7 million dollars

00:15:05.020 so that's what he was standing to win um if his if his son passed away and obviously that would be

00:15:10.780 split among him and his wife so that each of them would have got like what a 650 000 uh thousand dollars

00:15:17.580 back then in 1993 so if she's dead he gets all 1.7 million which in today's buying power is almost

00:15:23.500 3.4 million dollars so quick little recap of what's going on here so so far um with there's three dead

00:15:30.460 right you got the nurse the mom and the son right uh the son was on a respirator and he was uh it covered

00:15:39.020 by some type of insurance that would have given him uh or some kind of lawsuit win that would have

00:15:44.700 gotten the family 1.7 million dollars obviously lawrence horn had some issues with his wife they were

00:15:49.180 divorced he was a former music uh musician she was an airlines attendant and um they were divorced

00:15:56.140 living on opposite sides of the country and um and that's kind of where we're at so far but we don't

00:16:02.780 know who the suspect is yet and we're gonna go to 18k and child support and he owed 18 000 in child

00:16:09.020 support yes yes thank you mia uh so there's obviously a strong financial motive here so you

00:16:15.420 know it's looking like uh the the police might have a solid suspect here but let's see what happens next

00:16:21.740 from a malpractice settlement awarded to trevor when a routine operation left him with brain damage

00:16:27.100 should trevor die the settlement also listed his beneficiaries the beneficiaries of trevor were

00:16:37.500 obviously his mother and his father and that was millie and lawrence if millie were dead lawrence got

00:16:46.220 everything at detective wittenberger's request the los angeles police department contacted lawrence

00:16:54.380 horn within hours of the murders all right i think you better come out here they tracked him to his

00:17:01.980 mother's house mr horn i'm off police told horn about the murders and were surprised by his response

00:17:13.340 am i suspect no sir mr horn's behavior was very odd it was odd enough that the lapd officers took note

00:17:22.300 of it from the very very outset not only did he not want to cooperate and want to want an attorney

00:17:30.300 and that's strange behavior guys your son just got killed and you know you're kind of like oh am i

00:17:36.060 a suspect what's going on here basically his only questions or inquiries about were whether he was a suspect in this thing

00:17:44.780 police took him to the station for further questions they asked where he was at the time of the crime

00:17:56.220 he told them he was with his live-in girlfriend shira boba and described their activities

00:18:03.180 later they would question her and she'd corroborate his story

00:18:07.180 i was at home if horn or someone he employed it crossed state lines to commit the crime

00:18:14.860 they would have violated the interstate travel in aid of racketeering statute

00:18:20.780 a federal offense under fbi jurisdiction bam so now that's how you get the feds involved because uh now

00:18:28.860 we can articulate if he was actually involved in the crime that there was an effect on interstate uh

00:18:35.260 nexus which would allow the feds to be involved because he's in la the crime occurred in maryland

00:18:40.700 other side of the country now the fbi was brought in

00:18:49.900 a heinous crime had shocked the quiet community of silver spring maryland

00:18:54.380 a triple murder that brutally ended the lives of a quadriplegic boy his mother and his overnight nurse

00:19:04.940 with the prime suspect 3 000 miles away in los angeles

00:19:08.860 the prospect of an interstate investigation

00:19:15.580 local detectives called on the fbi okay all right goodbye special agent ed roach

00:19:21.580 the case uh immediately became a coast-to-coast uh investigation because so same thing guys case

00:19:30.620 agent is the same thing as a case officer so he's going to be the primary uh you know personal

00:19:36.620 contact the poc for the bureau uh to help the state do this investigation because as you guys know

00:19:42.140 since it's a coast-to-coast investigation well the maryland investigators are kind of limited because

00:19:45.980 they don't have the jurisdiction to investigate a crime uh that occurred in los angeles which obviously if

00:19:50.860 this does that this did go down it'd be considered a conspiracy uh so that's why the fbi was brought

00:19:56.860 in to help out the principal suspect uh was living at that time in in los angeles so uh we involved uh

00:20:05.420 the los angeles division of the fbi perhaps uh that we could assist uh later in the investigation

00:20:13.260 either uh through uh profiling at quantico or with the assistance of uh the fbi laboratory and profiling

00:20:20.300 guys is when they're able to go ahead and identify uh a murder suspect based on characteristics left

00:20:25.180 at the crime scene how the murder was perpetrated time of day all these different factors go into

00:20:29.180 it so it allows the state and locals to be able to kind of hone in on who was uh more than likely

00:20:34.620 the killer in the crime and this especially is used in cases where they go cold or it's difficult to

00:20:39.340 identify the suspect um but it's very important to note that the state is still the lead agency on

00:20:45.100 this investigation fbi was brought in simply to assist desperate for more clues investigators sent

00:20:53.980 a canine team back to where mildred horn's credit cards have been found by a jogger

00:21:00.460 the team soon recovered a rusty piece of metal badly corroded

00:21:04.300 but clearly a gun part is that a silencer it's uh you'll see here in a second it's not a silencer

00:21:12.940 but we are going to get there but look at look at that there there's another clue right here my friends

00:21:19.740 wittenberger sent it to the fbi lab for testing

00:21:25.420 fbi examiners determined the part was a trigger mechanism from an ar-7 rifle

00:21:30.220 a gun that's easy to disassemble into small pieces for transport

00:21:37.420 or disposal which seemed exactly what the killer had done efficient yeah

00:21:46.620 he had also taken another step to distance himself from the weapon

00:21:50.620 he very carefully drilled out the serial number

00:21:55.180 oh often a trained examiner can piece these numbers back together

00:22:00.220 but this killer had erased another firearms expert would determine how long the gun parted

00:22:13.260 lane by the side of the road so quick note on serial numbers guys the reason why it's so important for

00:22:17.900 crooks to get rid of serial numbers is because with the serial number you can trace the gun back

00:22:21.580 okay thank uh the atf or the alcohol the bureau of alcohol tobacco firearms and explosives they're the

00:22:27.100 ones responsible for any time you purchase a firearm you have to fill out some paperwork

00:22:31.180 in that paperwork that serial number is in there located on the gun okay it's very difficult to

00:22:35.340 drill out and or get rid of and what happens is when you purchase that firearm if that firearms ever

00:22:39.340 found on a crime scene or if that's if it's ever discovered or reported stolen whatever it may be

00:22:44.220 the feds are able to track it and what they're going to do is let's say they find your gun under

00:22:48.060 let's say i buy a gun and they find my gun at a murder scene 10 years prior well they're going to

00:22:52.620 later they're going to come back to me say hey you were the one that purchased this gun on such and

00:22:56.940 such date where is that where's that gun now or how did that gun end up there and i'm going to be

00:23:01.660 like oh well you know i have a bill of sale right hopefully you would have a bill of sale if you sold

00:23:04.860 it and i sold this gun on such and such day and then it allows the investigators to have a starting

00:23:09.260 point to figure out how that gun got to that crime scene okay so when the serial numbers are drilled

00:23:15.820 out and or removed or whatever it is which is a federal crime by the way to scratch out serial numbers

00:23:19.580 um they're a it's much tougher for the investigators to go ahead and be able to trace that gun back and

00:23:25.420 get a starting point you had something mia no i just didn't know that it was illegal yeah yeah it's

00:23:29.500 illegal to scratch out serial numbers on a firearm uh so let's get back to it

00:23:38.140 analysis showed the amount of corrosion was consistent with the time elapsed

00:23:42.060 since the killings had occurred so this was likely the murder weapon

00:23:49.580 while the fbi lab processed the gun part investigators in maryland interviewed tiffany

00:23:58.300 horn lawrence and mildred's 18 year old daughter straight ahead

00:24:03.500 she was a student at howard university in washington dc

00:24:08.300 they gave her a routine polygraph test which she easily passed

00:24:11.660 polygraph test by the way guys is simply a lie detector test

00:24:21.020 did you commit those murders they're not really doing them anymore right yeah valid yeah they're

00:24:26.700 i mean they're not admissible in court uh but they they still do them sometimes some some agencies

00:24:31.980 still do them on suspects uh but if i was being investigated for a crime i would never i'd be

00:24:37.180 like no i'm not doing it yeah i've read it's more like a psychology trick yeah it actually what it

00:24:41.500 does is it um asks it basically when they ask you questions it responds to your biological like uh

00:24:47.020 bodily functions i mean in terms of why they still use it even though it's not admissible in court

00:24:51.260 like they use it to kind of pressure the the victim but not the victim the person that could be guilty

00:24:56.540 yeah into confessing or hey hey you're lying on this test or whatever it gives them it's a basically

00:25:01.820 a tool for them to kind of like try to catch you in a lie but yeah it's definitely not admissible in

00:25:05.500 court because there's so many people that can beat polygraphs so a lot of crooks beat them all the

00:25:10.060 time and a lot of times it's innocent people that fail them psychopaths too because it's based on your

00:25:14.780 heart rate exactly yep heart rate sweat um all different types of bodily functions uh are measured on

00:25:22.060 the polygraph later that day tiffany would talk with detective wittenberger revealing three key clues

00:25:30.060 the first was something that had happened in the summer of 1992 her father had called asking her to

00:25:39.660 videotape the outside of her mother's house for him along with trevor's room the idea was so bizarre

00:25:47.020 she'd only taped trevor and his nurse with trevor in his bed attached to his respirator tiffany gave the

00:25:54.700 tape to her father and you guys got to remember in 1992 that'd be a weird request because you got

00:25:59.820 to walk around the big ass camcorder trying to like record the shit you know get on vhs make sure you

00:26:04.860 got an empty tape i didn't even think about that you know what i'm saying it's not like nowadays where

00:26:09.180 it's like okay sure i'll record a video for you so you could go ahead and you know commit a murder

00:26:13.180 down the road no like no now now back then in 1992 it was extremely cumbersome to uh get video footage

00:26:21.420 so that's something that would obviously stick out in her memory it's a weird request what are you

00:26:26.300 saying an iphone is more traceable now well yeah no yeah an iphone definitely is more traceable now

00:26:31.500 destroy the camera if that's it yeah but but again it's just you gotta remember it's a weird request

00:26:36.380 that's why she was able to remember it like oh yeah he wanted me to to record the inside

00:26:42.140 now wittenberger and the fbi wondered if horn wanted someone to know the layout of the house

00:26:47.580 then on march 1st two days before the murders horn had called her again he wanted to know where his

00:26:56.620 younger daughter tamiel would be for the next few days another clue

00:27:05.660 tiffany said tamiel would be with aunt vivian the night of march 2nd because her mother was flying

00:27:10.700 out on an early flight the morning of march 3rd it made investigators suspect that horn had known

00:27:18.060 when the murders would occur yep he spared one child

00:27:26.620 tiffany shared one other revealing incident

00:27:31.980 at about 2 30 the morning of the murders she had inadvertently called her mother

00:27:36.940 tiffany had hit the wrong speed dial key on her phone she'd meant to call her boyfriend

00:27:47.100 yeah speed dial was a thing in the 90s guys she apologized and hung up

00:27:54.780 the timing of the call helped investigators estimate the timing of the murders along with another

00:27:59.980 observation trevor's round the clock nurses made entries every hour in a logbook near his bed

00:28:06.940 um based on that the 2 30 uh phone call the two o'clock entry in the nurse's log and there

00:28:16.300 not being a three o'clock entry uh and the autopsy findings i think we pretty much based

00:28:25.180 the time of death as being around two between 2 33 o'clock in the morning so look at all that

00:28:31.340 circumstantial evidence guys you know between um him wanting a strange recording of the

00:28:36.700 the inside of the house right with the layout um him making sure that his daughter his youngest

00:28:41.180 daughter wasn't in the home um the nurse's logbook that showed that uh that was done on every hour

00:28:48.620 um and then the final which was um damn it drawing a blank here ladies help me what was the other thing

00:28:54.060 that that was also weird just asking where the daughter was going to be the little one yeah there

00:28:59.740 was one other thing that he wanted as well hold on it was first it was a video camera yeah i'm

00:29:05.740 actually like yeah the video camera yeah and then the daughter uh the daughter and then it was

00:29:12.700 oh and then and then the fact that she called late at night right and accidentally was trying to call

00:29:17.980 her boyfriend but her mom was awake she called her mom on accident yeah so that was those were the

00:29:23.180 those are the things that kind of you know of course each piece of evidence by themselves isn't that

00:29:28.140 important but when it's all put together this is strange you know what i mean so it definitely makes

00:29:32.220 you get the red flag three o'clock entry uh and the autopsy findings i think on march 11th about a

00:29:42.860 week after the murders wittenberger and his partner flew to la with the assistance of the los angeles police

00:29:50.220 department they carried a probable cause affidavit to search horns apartment yeah so what they mean by

00:29:57.180 that guys is what basically more than likely happened was the detectives in this case from

00:30:02.140 maryland said uh got with a detective from los angeles right hey i have this probable cause i need to

00:30:08.380 search this residence can you swear to this affidavit for me and get a uh you know a search warrant from

00:30:13.260 the judge in your local area because as a maryland officer they don't have the authority and or

00:30:18.060 jurisdiction to swear out an affidavit in front of a judge in california so lapd gets involved

00:30:25.100 they get the affidavit give it to a judge he signs it boom now they're able to go ahead and

00:30:29.820 execute a search warrant in another state a state search warrant

00:30:40.380 they collected hundreds of audio videotapes police also gathered computers personal papers

00:30:47.420 address books bank statements and telephone logs

00:30:56.940 back at the station investigators began the time-consuming task of reviewing all they'd recovered

00:31:05.420 they'd printed thousands of pages from the hard drives of horn's computers

00:31:09.260 they found he'd made handwritten notes on documents regarding trevor settlement money

00:31:18.300 oh another red flag handwritten notes on trevor settlement money the notes confirmed what they

00:31:24.140 already suspected horn was well aware he could gain a fortune from his son's death

00:31:29.820 and he was well versed in the legalities of the settlement

00:31:37.100 investigators also found a map that was telling

00:31:39.820 it was hand-drawn showing mildred horn's neighborhood the streets were outlined and labeled

00:31:49.100 an ex and her initials marked her house

00:31:51.260 more circumstantial evidence because remember guys he's in la why the hell is he drawing a map

00:32:07.820 of uh his ex-wife's home videotape that were recovered one home they stood out

00:32:16.780 horn had videotaped himself standing in front of his television set which was tuned to the cable tv

00:32:22.380 program guide station the station was clearly broadcasting the time and date 11 45 pm march 2nd 1993

00:32:31.900 california time 2 45 am march 3rd maryland time exactly the time and date of the murders

00:32:42.940 investigators quickly dubbed it the alibi team since it's holy my guy was prepared he totally did that

00:32:50.860 yeah he was prepared he had all this stuff in place man but then those papers isn't that kind

00:32:56.940 of sloppy having those papers yeah but i think for him he didn't anticipate that they would search his

00:33:01.660 home so yeah uh that's funny been created for that purpose

00:33:10.700 now wittenberger and the fbi but you got to remember he could always say oh well i took notes

00:33:15.420 on it because it was just i needed to know the policy and understand the policy blah blah blah

00:33:19.580 like the thing with circumstantial evidence is that it's typically weak on its own and you can easily

00:33:23.980 refute it right like in that case oh uh i you know i found that your policy and you had a bunch

00:33:28.540 of handwritten notes on it what was that oh well you know he can easily explain well you know i just

00:33:32.060 want to kind of know it i wrote some notes asked an attorney you know nothing too crazy but when you

00:33:36.700 add the fact that you know he wanted to make sure his daughter wasn't in the house he asked for a

00:33:41.420 strange vcr vid from his daughter from his 18 year old daughter of the home he had a map of the home um

00:33:47.740 and then you had uh the fact that he did a strange home movie where he um was in front of the tv with the

00:33:53.500 day and time saying look where i'm at niggas day and time right here i'm here in la and whatever

00:33:58.300 then it starts to look more suspect that's the beauty of circumstantial evidence when uh when you

00:34:02.620 know it could be a higher put together somebody what was that could be that he hired somebody

00:34:07.420 oh we'll get there we'll get there exactly so we'll see what happens next um but yeah the fact

00:34:13.980 that he took all these steps to distance himself are definitely big red flags

00:34:18.700 seem to have some substantial leads but they were still far from apprehending the mastermind

00:34:25.420 of this brutal crime

00:34:32.060 when investigators searched the la apartment of their prime suspect in a triple murder they

00:34:37.180 discovered a suspicious videotape among themselves they called it the alibi tape

00:34:43.820 but they would soon find a recording that was even more incriminating

00:34:48.700 a 22 second exit from horn's dozens of audio tapes

00:34:57.340 it was from a conversation between horn and an unknown male

00:35:04.780 the words were cryptic but their meaning was clear

00:35:07.660 the noise

00:35:33.340 it was like the monitor hmm we'll see

00:35:43.020 after listening to that we felt mr horn probably was in los angeles at the time

00:35:51.420 we also felt after listening to that conversation that this was probably

00:35:55.740 the individual that committed these homicides making that phone call

00:36:02.940 with the help of the fbi investigators subpoenaed telephone records from at&t

00:36:08.620 for all the calls placed to lawrence horn's residence from a week before the murders to a week after

00:36:14.380 most were useless but four long distance calls stood out two had been made just days before the

00:36:23.020 murders from the detroit pay fund the other two were made in the early hours of march so guys real

00:36:28.780 quick what's the subpoena subpoena is basically you know a legal document that you know requires a

00:36:34.060 company or entity or whatever to go ahead and you know if they want to summon some records or get

00:36:38.460 some information so investigators a lot of times are able to subpoena phone companies and go ahead

00:36:43.180 and get toll records what are toll records so records are basically you know phone calls coming in and

00:36:47.340 out out of a potential phone number and or cell phone or device whatever it is um and they're able

00:36:55.100 to go ahead and look at calls and in this case since it's a murder what they're going to do is they're going

00:36:57.740 to look at the toll records for a particular set of time to see okay who was lawrence hearns lawrence

00:37:04.860 horn speaking to during this period of time maybe we can identify the person that potentially was

00:37:10.380 hired to commit this murder because we know he was los angeles so it would have been physically

00:37:15.100 impossible for him to do it however more than likely he's going to be in communication with the

00:37:19.260 bad guy that's involved so uh this is a common technique used from investigators to identify co-conspirators

00:37:26.540 subpoenaing phone records and uh getting those um getting those records you can spin a phone

00:37:31.580 records text messages all that type of stuff now are you going to actually see the contents of said

00:37:35.900 communication no you would need a title three for that however this will give you a good starting

00:37:40.460 point to figure out who's who and identify other potential conspirators you can subpoena people too

00:37:45.740 right yes you can okay you can third from payphones near mildred horns house one from outside

00:37:53.660 a denny's restaurant and the other from a day's in before you guys wonder what the hell is a payphone

00:37:59.340 a payphone is a was a big thing back in the 90s people didn't have cell phones right they had beepers

00:38:03.820 and you know if they were need to be contacted they get the beeper hit they go to the nearest payphone

00:38:08.380 you know put in a couple quarters and go ahead and make that phone call so that's yeah yeah what what is

00:38:13.900 that like a device that beeps when people were trying to contact you yeah oh my god how old are

00:38:18.620 you i'm 23. she has no clue yeah i've never heard of this yeah beepers man it's like before it's like

00:38:26.780 no one wanted a cell phone they want like a beeper so it was like a signal hit and somebody's like a

00:38:30.700 little device so it's like you pretty much call it and then your number pops up on it saying like

00:38:35.980 you can leave a message but it's not a phone you can't like no like you just get a beep it's like

00:38:39.900 you know what doctors still use it to this day yeah they do yeah it's like it's just like hey

00:38:44.940 like you gotta be like oh shoot uh my friend said the car hurt okay so go to a payphone and go to

00:38:48.540 like a house phone oh wow i'm gonna google this later yeah wow yeah yeah that's why i had to explain

00:38:54.860 it because i know a lot of young people are like what the hell what why is everyone using a payphone

00:38:58.220 this doesn't make sense so yeah the call for that's important to note that they that they're seeing

00:39:04.860 payphones uh conversations the denny's was made to the home of lawrence horn

00:39:13.100 at 5 12 a.m just a few hours after the murder

00:39:28.060 was it the 22 second conversation yeah

00:39:30.860 so the subpoenas right so see you guys have this all built upon itself the subpoenas were able to

00:39:53.020 allow them to identify a payphone that was used in maryland right around the time a few hours after the

00:39:59.020 murder so now they're like okay let's look at all the hotels in that area because this person

00:40:03.180 probably was an out-of-towner and that's how they're able to get to this point check of the hotels

00:40:10.700 and the motels in the area a few miles circumference of the murder scene turned up an individual

00:40:17.020 checking in approximately midnight the day these murders were committed checking in at midnight

00:40:22.380 to the day's end using a michigan driver's license in the name of james edward perry oh

00:40:30.140 james edward perry seemed a promising suspect

00:40:44.380 with lawrence horne's roots in detroit's music industry and the detroit call in his telephone

00:40:49.420 records perhaps there was a connection background checks revealed he'd served about 10 years time

00:40:56.380 for shooting a michigan state trooper after an attempted bank robbery in the early 1970s

00:41:02.140 shooting a state trooper looks like a promising suspect

00:41:08.460 now he was a minister

00:41:09.820 he claimed he would now he's a minister he's a but one of the lord be able to pick lottery numbers for

00:41:19.260 people people could call him for his advice he had business cards and flyers that he would hand out

00:41:28.300 that he was like i say a a minister i believe he called himself on some of these things apostle james

00:41:35.500 as investigators learned more about perry wittenberger

00:41:43.260 in lawrence horn's telephone records he'd noticed some calls have been made on a calling card

00:41:49.100 what do you want he subpoenaed the records the name on the card was camilla mckinney

00:41:57.020 fbi agents appeared at camilla's address instead they found marshall webb

00:42:02.220 it turned out she was lawrence horn's cousin oh no she said horn had asked her to get the card

00:42:08.540 claiming he needed it for business

00:42:11.020 she'd made up the name mckinney she thought her past payment problems might keep her from getting a card

00:42:20.380 all right now you guys are probably wondering what the hell is a calling card basically guys

00:42:23.580 it's a card that allows a user to make phone calls up to a specified value or charge

00:42:27.900 the cost to a specific account so it's a way to kind of like you know shell your uh your activities

00:42:35.180 on a phone to another level so obviously this is another red flag as well to conceal the nature

00:42:41.580 of the phone calls and the fact that he had a relative do it for him under another name more of a red flag

00:42:50.220 the calling card records revealed a complex web of phone calls they began almost a year before the

00:42:56.700 murders oh wow and continued for several months after we examined the records for that calling card

00:43:04.300 account and saw that there were numerous calls throughout 1992 and 1993 from pay phones in los angeles

00:43:18.460 pay phones that we plotted out on a street grid

00:43:21.020 primarily within walking distance of lawrence horn's house

00:43:26.540 uh more more clues went directly to james perry's house in detroit and likewise there were numerous

00:43:37.900 calls from 1992 to 1993 of pay phones throughout detroit primarily on the east side of detroit which is where

00:43:47.260 james perry lived to lawrence horn's house in hollywood and we figured perry was looking for the rest of his

00:43:55.900 payment and uh we we surmised that uh that horn was waiting for uh his windfall from his son's estate

00:44:06.780 but if it seemed investigators had finally hit the jackpot the prize remained just out of their grasp

00:44:13.100 connecting suspects to calls required painstaking detective work logging the time and phone number

00:44:21.020 where each call was made and received then attempting to place the suspects accordingly

00:44:27.980 it's a lot of work guys a lot a lot of old-fashioned uh detective work right there there's none of these

00:44:32.700 calls get recorded or saved anywhere like today right no no no with these pay phones now you would

00:44:39.180 have to wire tap the phone to be able to get those records the only thing you could get from the pay

00:44:43.420 phones is like the call records of like when uh when a phone call was made and to where but that's

00:44:48.140 about it you can't get the actual contents of it their best bet is having like some camera footage that

00:44:52.300 shows proof of who was in these pay phones yeah but the thing is in the 90s they wouldn't have that

00:44:59.980 it was tough man that's and the fact that these guys were using calling cards and all this other

00:45:04.300 stuff made it even tougher covered their tracks with many layers of deception investigators were

00:45:10.860 beginning to bog down and their frustration was starting to show it starts out at an extremely extremely

00:45:19.820 fast pace um everything's hot and heavy very uh high profile murder murder case everything like

00:45:28.620 i say is rocking and rolling very quickly uh then all of a sudden the skids are put on

00:45:35.180 if the investigation starts to slow down because now we're we're we've almost shifted gears and now going

00:45:41.660 into a documentation it turns into almost a paper trail case and i can tell you guys this from my

00:45:47.820 experience that paper you know going from like you know a response case like that where things are moving

00:45:52.780 fast to all of a sudden it's like a document paper case you're like ah fuck like ah man what and you

00:45:58.940 just get mad as hell because you're just like ah because you want to go ahead and get things done

00:46:03.660 but obviously when you got you know a complex situation like this where you got a bunch of

00:46:08.060 phone calls you got conspirators you know across state lines coast to coast you got to make sure and

00:46:14.300 it's a murder case obviously it's very serious you need to be able to look at all the records okay

00:46:20.140 um and on top of that these guys took some meticulous steps to protect their identities

00:46:24.140 from being identified from being discovered for after the crime so let's see how the police were

00:46:28.460 able to crack this one but wittenberger and the fbi stayed on the trail like blood

00:46:36.540 and in late september of 1993 they closed in one james berry

00:46:43.900 they began a 24 hour a day seven day a week surveillance

00:46:47.260 and i'll tell you guys this doing surveillance 24 7 is a pain in the ass as a guy that's done it

00:46:53.740 before it requires a shit ton of manpower you need different shifts you're going to need you know

00:47:00.380 eight to ten guys per surveillance block it is not easy to do man so the fact that they were going so

00:47:06.860 hard i mean lets you know the gravity of the importance of this case right a child was killed

00:47:12.140 and two women a nurse and a mother so they're going to do what they got to do to make sure

00:47:17.420 that they catch these guys because at this point they got some good circumstantial evidence

00:47:20.780 but they don't have anything actually concrete that identifies these guys as the cold hard killers

00:47:27.740 we had the michigan state police and the fbi both both agencies agreed to put them under

00:47:32.380 surveillance in a cooperative effort and this is a great um teamwork by the way the fact that the

00:47:37.580 maryland uh state state um investigators are the main guys that are running the case then you got the

00:47:42.940 fbi and the michigan state police that are assisting that are you know donate you know

00:47:46.460 donating quite a bit of manpower to making this case happen um and obviously i'm sure the michigan

00:47:50.860 state police would be interested because this guy shot a michigan state trooper back in the day

00:47:54.300 so they're probably trying to get their revenge on this guy like hey oh this guy's involved all

00:47:57.740 right we're involved so it was during a week in september that we saw that james perry hung out with a

00:48:06.220 particular individual we didn't know who he was until we checked the tag of his car this guy named

00:48:11.660 thomas turner bam and they identified him through what 24 7 surveillance this is old-fashioned police

00:48:17.580 work my friends you're not going to be able to get information like this a lot of the times unless

00:48:20.780 you watch your guy and see who they're meeting with with what they're doing etc so this was a very

00:48:25.900 important lead for them a background check showed the 52 year old turner was a trucker by trade more

00:48:32.780 significantly he was another of lawrence horn's cousins oh he was also another clue with perry

00:48:40.300 the two had met in prison 13 years before when perry was serving time for the state trooper

00:48:45.660 shooting incident and turner for robbing a bank bam another big link identifying turner would prove an

00:48:53.980 important break in the case but for now investigators were hoping for something more immediate

00:49:06.140 wittenberger and an agent did what investigators called tickling the wires

00:49:12.780 they paid perry a visit thinking perry would then contact horn and start talking

00:49:17.420 i've done this myself before it's actually a pretty good technique to allow you to go ahead

00:49:26.540 and uh you know stimulate the investigation a little bit and since they were already looking

00:49:30.380 at the phone records it allows them to kind of just be like oh you know what let's let's uh you know

00:49:34.860 poke the bear a little bit see what happens with these guys because if you're able to poke the bear and

00:49:39.580 and and you're actually monitoring the phone lines pretty uh uh pretty tightly you'll be able to see

00:49:44.860 patterns of of communication and if he goes ahead and contacts horn or the other guy right after the

00:49:51.420 police make contact well that there's a pretty good sign more than likely that they're going to be

00:49:55.260 talking about some type of criminal activity like oh the police hit me up blah blah we need to watch

00:49:58.940 out etc so i actually have done this myself before where i would uh you know when i was on the wiretap i

00:50:06.300 would you know we we would uh basically like make contact with the bad guys or we would have an

00:50:11.340 informant call and you know say something and then watch the phone lines go crazy with him like

00:50:16.300 calling other people saying like yo i think this is going on blah blah blah and allows you to kind

00:50:20.460 of get insight as to uh the criminal activity in the criminal organization a bit more so uh ladies

00:50:25.740 got anything interesting no i didn't know that that was used why like wouldn't that give it away

00:50:30.380 to them that they're being watched or spied it could it could it's it's definitely a calculated risk

00:50:35.180 and it can um cause some potential issues it's always a risk but um you know it works i mean

00:50:41.740 it definitely uh allows for uh you know how do i say this it's it's a calculated risk that allows

00:50:49.900 for you to get um identify other people and or see who's really involved you know so in this case

00:50:57.180 since they're kind of probably lower on evidence they don't they have a lot of good circumstantial

00:51:01.020 evidence they probably want to get something a little bit more solid

00:51:03.020 so we'll see what ends up happening with them uh doing this tickling of the wire

00:51:08.620 and it's interesting because at this point i don't think they're wiretapping phones yet

00:51:12.140 so this is a really good technique to use when you're wiretapping phones but they have the

00:51:15.660 technology for it right at this point to wiretap phones yes yes yes yeah i mean hell they started

00:51:20.940 wiretapping phones i think in like the 70s yeah before that they're wiretapping phones like in the in

00:51:26.220 the in the i think the first wiretap was you know i'm gonna look it up i think it was like in the

00:51:29.820 50s but um but they were they were monitoring the phones like probably with pen registers which is

00:51:35.500 like an active feed allows you to see who's calling in and out but i don't think there are

00:51:39.500 wiretaps at this point yet but i'm gonna actually i'm actually curious to see um when they first

00:51:44.060 started doing wiretaps it was a long time ago though and maybe even in the 1920s but let me double check

00:51:47.900 the investigators only talked briefly with perry but he admitted he was in maryland on march 3rd

00:51:54.860 though he claimed it was for business and that he knew nothing about the murders oh so he admitted

00:51:59.900 he was in maryland stupid right around the time of the murders what the hell is a guy from detroit

00:52:04.780 doing out there in maryland with no family or anything hmm that's a clue

00:52:20.460 in september of 93 after weeks of wrangling for court authorization to tap lawrence horn's home phone

00:52:27.740 federal agents finally got the go ahead special agent roach was key in obtaining the approval

00:52:34.780 okay so wiretapping got a start in new york in 1895 when a former telephone worker who had joined

00:52:42.460 the city police suggested that it might be a good idea to listen in on wires used by criminals so

00:52:47.980 damn long ass time that's wild um yeah so so they go so so now guys as you can see they get a federal

00:52:57.580 wiretap on uh perry which is which is huge you know now they can actually listen to the phones

00:53:03.740 so they'll be able to hear conversations real time of what they're talking about and i'll tell you

00:53:07.420 guys this from my personal experience listening to phones is a pain well listening to phones the pain

00:53:12.780 in the ass getting a wiretap in the first place is an even bigger pain in the ass you got to write

00:53:16.140 up like a 70 to 100 page affidavit as to why you think you need to go ahead and listen to this phone

00:53:21.900 a lot of the times it takes more probable cause to listen to someone's phone than it does to arrest them

00:53:25.180 we were hoping to get the smoking gun the conversation between james edward perry and uh

00:53:32.300 and lawrence horn we were hoping for a conversation that would say uh something like uh i want the rest

00:53:38.300 of my money you know i did the deed uh the down payment's not enough uh you promised me such and

00:53:45.260 such i only got this and uh now i want the rest of my money or maybe uh you're going to be next something

00:53:52.380 like wishful thinking my friend that would have been terrific but horn and perry were too sly to

00:53:59.660 let anything slip and by mid-november with the investigation at full tilt they stopped talking

00:54:06.300 to each other all together despite months of slow but steady progress these guys are smart man horn and

00:54:16.540 perry were still one step ahead of the law the fbi's coast-to-coast investigation of a triple murder

00:54:28.380 committed in maryland left agents scrambling to link la's lawrence horn and detroit's james perry to

00:54:35.020 their case investigators knew the two men were talking but they didn't know how

00:54:40.540 were they using perry's former jail buddy thomas turner as a go-between

00:54:49.420 the fbi secured authorization to tap turner's phone

00:54:54.220 so now they wiretap turner's phone because the other two guys stopped talking to each other let's

00:54:59.420 see what happens yep that was the key bam both horn and perry talked to turner often and turner relayed

00:55:11.740 messages between them but they were careful not to use language that might incriminate them

00:55:17.580 and once again agents found themselves back in the same old grind monitoring and logging hundreds of

00:55:24.220 calls them trying to make links between the calls all right i'll talk to you later

00:55:30.700 one surveillance would be taking place actively taking place a physical surveillance in los angeles

00:55:36.940 on on lawrence horn while at the same time 24 hours a day the detroit division

00:55:41.900 was conducting physical electronic surveillance on thomas turner and physical surveillance on james edward

00:55:47.660 perry ridiculous manpower needed to do that as before they made a few connections between calls

00:55:55.420 and callers but mostly the process seemed just a test of their endurance and dedication

00:56:03.820 horn and perry were giving them a run for their money

00:56:09.820 so here's a conspiracy guys just a quick little recap of what's going on here so everyone knows

00:56:14.540 so you got horn who pretty much wanted to get his wife and son killed because he had a big

00:56:20.380 lawsuit settlement 1.7 million dollars which is the equivalent about 3.4 million today in 2022 he would

00:56:25.980 get that if his son died and obviously would have had to split that with his wife so he wants her out

00:56:30.060 the picture too right so bam he would be like the main organizer then you got perry who's the alleged

00:56:34.940 potential hitman who was in maryland when the murder occurred okay and you got turner who is

00:56:41.100 lawrence horn's cousin but also a good friend of perry and they had served time together in prison

00:56:46.700 when perry was in there for shooting at a shooting a michigan state trooper so they're surveilling all

00:56:53.580 three parties now at this point because turner's the middleman in go between between perry and horn

00:56:59.900 because they suspect that the feds might be listening to their phones and they don't want to be identified

00:57:05.420 so um these guys were very sharp you know i mean in the plan that you see that there's communication

00:57:09.820 between the perry and horn since 1992 so a year prior to the murders

00:57:17.340 then around thanksgiving after three grueling months investigators got a bite

00:57:24.780 harry was preparing to move agents secured a federal warrant to search his residence before he left

00:57:32.780 that's a good time to search because you know he's going to have all of his stuff

00:57:35.740 ready to go and packed up at the spot before he moves

00:57:40.380 it was a dangerous mission perry had shot a michigan police officer and he was known to own high

00:57:46.300 powered weapons an fbi swat team made the entry wittenberger and his partner father

00:57:54.540 they roused perry and his girlfriend from bed catching these actors are hilarious

00:57:58.540 i'm unaware and unaware and on

00:58:10.300 then they began i just have to say that was terrible cuffing technique you know coming from

00:58:13.980 a former law enforcement officer that's fine they gotta do what they gotta do right to search the house

00:58:19.740 police collected videotapes bank statements and other documents

00:58:29.900 much of what they found seems strangely out of place in the home of a so-called minister

00:58:36.220 there were voodoo relics soldier of fortune magazines and books on topics like criminal

00:58:42.060 investigations managing gunshot movements and interpreting bloodstain evidence why would a

00:58:48.540 minister have all that stuff right there investigators hope to prove that perry had bought the books as well

00:59:00.780 they called the publishers getting only one hit from paladin press

00:59:07.020 a cancelled check proved to be the turning point in the case

00:59:10.140 perry had ordered two books from paladin press about a year before the murders two chilling titles

00:59:20.620 hitman a manual for independent contractors and oh this book looks familiar

00:59:29.820 look what i got guys hope you

00:59:31.660 so i went ahead and got this book for you guys this book is banned by the way and you guys are going

00:59:38.300 to see why here in a bit um but uh yeah and it was actually kind of expensive as well because they

00:59:43.340 don't make it anymore but this is the book and you guys are going to see here in a second why this book

00:59:48.300 was extremely relevant to this investigation how to build disposable silencers

00:59:55.340 when you read through those books it was so it was two books one on building disposable

01:00:03.660 silencers and uh hitman a technical manual for independent contractors it's illegal to make your

01:00:09.020 own silencers too right yeah i i know having a silencer it's not illegal to have one you just

01:00:13.820 got to pay taxes on it but if you're going to make your own homemade yeah more than likely i

01:00:17.260 would assume it's probably i think i remember reading that it's illegal yeah i'm sure it is

01:00:21.500 because you can buy one and have it but you got to pay taxes on it and it's got to be registered

01:00:24.940 with the atf so if you make your own yeah it's probably going to be illegal i'd have to ask my

01:00:30.380 atf buddy about that one i remember reading about that and something along the lines of like certain

01:00:34.380 only certain arms can have silencers on them and other ones like if it's not allowed yeah yeah no for

01:00:40.780 sure that is true very disturbing to see the number of similarities and parallels

01:00:50.940 from the hitman book to what transpired inside millie's home on march 3rd

01:01:00.060 finally the pieces began to form a single picture mildred's missing minivan was explained

01:01:06.460 harry had used it to get back to his rental car which he parked some distance from the crime scene

01:01:11.660 as the book recommended

01:01:17.020 the credit cards found by a jogger on a road near the house also fit in neatly

01:01:24.620 it said to if you want to make it look like a a burglary do a little bit of messing around the

01:01:30.620 house take some items and then throw them along the side of the road it said throw the pieces of the

01:01:35.660 rifle along the side of the road another thing that the book recommended was to take a little

01:01:44.620 narrow file and run it through the barrel of the rifle and a little narrow file was found in the

01:01:50.540 backyard with deposits of chemicals consistent with gunpowder red gunshot residue

01:01:56.780 the book also suggested using and also so i'll show you guys real quick what they're talking about

01:02:04.300 when it comes to the filing right so as you guys can see here bam okay it goes here using a rat tail

01:02:12.460 and i got a highlighter for y'all right there using a rat tail file alter the gun barrel the shell

01:02:17.980 chamber the loading uh sorry guys i feel like a teacher here reading to a class chamber the loading ramp

01:02:23.820 the firing pin and the injector pin each of these items leaves leaves its own definite mark and

01:02:28.780 impression on the shell casing which if any shells happen to be left behind can be matched up to the

01:02:33.660 gun under a microscope in the police laboratory so that is true guys each gun that fires a bullet

01:02:39.980 creates its own individual fingerprint on said bullet so by getting rid of um certain things on the

01:02:46.860 weapon uh uh altering the gun barrel that will also help and then also

01:02:51.660 with the uh with the serial number here i gotta find the page here i'll find it i'll keep playing

01:02:58.540 the documentary for y'all and i'll find it but it talks about how to also file down the what page is it

01:03:10.620 okay while christina does that we'll keep playing the documentary for y'all

01:03:13.580 an ar-7 rifle exactly the gun whose trigger mechanism was found earlier

01:03:25.580 likewise examiners determined the single spent bullet found in trevor's room

01:03:29.980 was 22 caliber popular with assassins

01:03:32.940 also in the book where they suggested the ar-7 right here

01:03:42.620 you go to your recommended uh equipment list right uh let me bring that closer to you guys so you can

01:03:48.780 see what i'm talking about here you see it right there ar-7 rifle um based equipment checklist and a 360

01:03:56.860 powered scope disposal rifle silencer two extra 15 or 30 short rifle clips uh 22 ruger mark one or mark

01:04:03.820 two pistol disposal pistol silencer shoulder holster extra pistol clip and then hollow point bullets so

01:04:10.460 it's on the equipment list man yeah let's keep going

01:04:18.540 22s distort when they enter a human body so it's hard to match them to a gun

01:04:23.980 they're also small quiet and inexpensive

01:04:33.340 now as far as the serial number of the gun guys i found the page right here uh

01:04:38.380 so it goes right here so second uh this is page 23 second paragraph right here so it goes if the

01:04:46.700 serial number is on the barrel of the gun grinding deeply enough to remove it may weaken the barrel

01:04:52.460 to the point that the gun could explode in your face when fired to make these numbers and traceable

01:04:57.020 use a hammer and chisel or a numbering set purchase from the hardware store to stamp

01:05:02.620 them out or make them illegible make sure your blows go as deep or as little or a little deeper

01:05:09.820 than as existing numbers then grind the serial numbers off slightly this method will keep the

01:05:15.020 true serial number from being raised in any acid test if the part is found wow yeah pretty detailed

01:05:21.180 detail that's crazy anywhere

01:05:27.020 of 1994 there was another big break in the case

01:05:31.500 after months of pressure from wittenberger a grand jury subpoena finally brought in thomas turner

01:05:37.660 he agreed so they brought thomas turner on a grand jury subpoena what's a grand jury subpoena guys a

01:05:41.660 grand jury subpoena is basically when you use a grand jury which is a can you know you convene a bunch of

01:05:48.460 citizens from the local area think of it as like a jury almost right uh in a criminal investigation

01:05:54.380 and they basically hear a case out and then they can go ahead and get you a grand jury subpoena to

01:06:00.220 bring someone in and testify under oath of course um to the grand jury and they can't lie it's basically

01:06:07.180 like a deposition so in this case they brought this guy in and to testify and you're going to see here in

01:06:12.060 a second why he ended up cooperating talk in exchange for immunity because they could have

01:06:18.860 got him for conspiracy as well so for him not being charged he's going to go ahead and sing like a bird

01:06:27.020 in a deposition for a maryland grand jury turner said his cousin lawrence horn had come for a visit in may

01:06:34.060 of 1992 five months before the murders though turner hadn't seen him in 20 years horn immediately

01:06:43.260 complained of trouble with his ex-wife mildred turner gave him the name of james paris that's

01:06:49.900 all turner would say though wittenberger believed he knew much more fortunately he'd said enough

01:06:57.740 at that point because of what we had learned from thomas turner

01:07:01.500 and what we had learned from um in the hitman book and the wiretaps we felt we were in a position

01:07:10.860 to establish a conspiracy to establish that james parry had in fact carried out the killings

01:07:17.740 that summer wittenberger struck on july 19th 1994 he arrested horn at his los angeles apartment without

01:07:25.020 insight oh they finally got him gotcha bitch wittenberger would question him for 45 minutes at the police

01:07:31.020 station but horn refused to talk about the crime

01:07:39.100 on the same day fbi agents in detroit were waiting for a judge to sign the warrants for the arrest of

01:07:48.380 in the meantime they conducted an overt surveillance the tactic is designed to pressure a suspect while

01:07:55.020 making sure he doesn't

01:08:00.620 it wasn't supposed to be a covert surveillance and we really didn't care if he saw them or not

01:08:05.500 we just didn't want it to be a confrontational surveillance until the warrants were signed

01:08:09.260 once the warrants were finalized agents could arrest barry until then they would follow him in the open

01:08:24.380 knowing he knew they were there they would keep him in sight at all times

01:08:28.620 perry grew increasingly annoyed the fbi didn't let him it seemed perry wondered what the fbi was trying

01:08:42.540 to do though he seemed more irritated than concerned

01:08:45.500 he probably thought they didn't have enough on him what was that he probably just thought they didn't

01:08:55.980 have enough on him yeah exactly so he's annoyed he's like what the hell why are these guys following me

01:09:00.460 little does he know they didn't know where he was headed but stayed with him anyway

01:09:21.180 he stopped to pick up a friend

01:09:22.460 the two drove off in perry's car with the tail close behind

01:09:46.300 well let's give him something to play with

01:09:52.460 oh

01:10:00.540 then incredulous agents guessed where perry was going

01:10:05.020 after only about an hour the constant tail had made perry so angry he decided to file a complaint

01:10:12.620 amazingly he took his crime straight to the detroit fbi field office

01:10:17.340 wow stupid perry's timing was incredible

01:10:24.380 he and his friend arrived at the office just as fbi agents awaited final word on his arrest

01:10:30.060 i want to see an fbi agent now

01:10:34.460 i want to see an fbi agent right now

01:10:38.860 perry demanded to see an agent

01:10:40.460 i'm not going to come and he was quickly accommodated a clerk called special agent roach

01:10:51.180 bring one in

01:10:59.820 while agents checked him for weapons perry confronted roach wanting to know if agents were going to

01:11:05.100 arrest him or if they were just planning to arrest him we told him in minutes you were going to be

01:11:12.460 expect the phone call from montgomery county maryland telling us the warrants have been signed

01:11:16.140 and you've been indicted for three counts of first degree murder

01:11:19.180 holy shit just let him know in a few minutes later we advised him that he was in fact

01:11:26.540 under arrest oh man that's a hell for him could you imagine

01:11:33.820 he showed up so entitled yeah he's like i'm tired of this

01:11:37.180 shit stop following me but now even with both men in custody one question still remained

01:11:44.700 if perry was the hired gun how had horn paid him for the crime

01:11:54.620 after months of relentless pursuit by local investigators in the fbi

01:11:59.180 the elusive horn and perry were finally in custody

01:12:06.700 but there remained a nagging question how had horn paid perry for the crime

01:12:14.700 the answer came two months later only as a result of still more dogged detective work

01:12:26.060 as we were reviewing the results of the search on james perry's house we

01:12:31.020 noticed this photograph that in essence showed various cassette tapes that james perry had

01:12:37.820 that was the purpose of the photograph but underneath one of the items here we saw a western union

01:12:44.380 card we got a bundle of records from western union showing us that there were indeed a number of

01:12:52.300 transactions from los angeles now we finally got the money trail

01:12:58.700 to james perry's live-in girlfriend of course it's a wells fargo too

01:13:03.340 yeah wells fargo the worst bank ever bernard shaw

01:13:05.980 well we now had another area to investigate for a few months

01:13:15.260 after much digging dean discovered a man named george bernard shaw had died in july of 1992

01:13:22.060 in an auto accident in los angeles when dean sleuthed out the la times for the day of shaw's death

01:13:29.100 he discovered the man's connection though it wasn't in his obituary we have on the front page

01:13:36.540 mary wells dies and for those in our generation she was a big motown star go to the obituary page

01:13:42.860 big story about mary wells dying in los angeles the lower right hand corner was a list of other people

01:13:49.420 who had passed away one is a guy named george bernard shaw with no information about him just the cemetery

01:13:55.900 lawrence horn had used the name of this anonymous dead man as the front for his payments which were

01:14:03.180 made with the money horn was able to save almost two years after the crime investigators had finally

01:14:10.940 pieced together the whole story bam so now we're going to go into a summary of the investigation of

01:14:17.340 what they think actually occurred that led to these crimes and guys they got a pretty good amount of um

01:14:24.780 you know circumstantial evidence which they're going to go over right now but before they do that

01:14:28.140 guys don't forget to like the video subscribe to the channel you know i mean we're making content

01:14:32.780 like this for all the time we do one documentary breakdown per week and we also do one live stream

01:14:36.700 per week and we also release clips almost every day so please subscribe to the channel like the video

01:14:41.740 uh guys any thoughts so far before we get into how the police suspect that these guys did this

01:14:46.060 i just think it's interesting how part of his motive i mean obviously 1.7 million dollars is

01:14:52.140 a pretty penny but he would have gone to jail for the 18 000 that he owed so it was partially also

01:14:57.980 driven by him not wanting to go to jail yeah which is kind of ironic so that he commits a bigger crime

01:15:03.340 that'll give him even more jail time and you know let me look up since you said that 18 000

01:15:08.140 dollars what's your thoughts on this christina i just think he's so stupid to like you got to

01:15:12.780 speak up speak up i just think he's completely stupid to keep everything like i would like literally

01:15:17.260 burn everything from that bit away like we kept everything like the book and the instructions yeah

01:15:23.100 like it's just retarded yeah i don't think you knew that the police were looking at about 80 000

01:15:27.820 in 1993 is the equivalent purchasing power to about 36 000 today so about double

01:15:32.620 so but it doesn't matter on the amount like if you don't pay child support you eventually end up in jail

01:15:37.260 yeah after after a couple no absolutely absolutely and back then that's that's a lot of money so

01:15:41.420 regardless even in today's day and age 18 18 000 is a lot so all right let's get into how the uh

01:15:49.100 how they piece um how they think this happened it had been a cold and calculated murder for hire

01:15:59.100 that took more than a year to plan james perry had followed the instructions in the hitman book

01:16:06.060 almost to a tee harry had bought an ar-7 rifle and drilled out the serial number as the book suggested

01:16:15.660 and just so you guys know in the book okay it does suggest ar-7 as the primary weapon and i'll

01:16:21.260 read that little portion for you guys um right here okay and this is on page 22 the ar-7 and it's right

01:16:31.740 here the r7 is recommended because it is both inexpensive and accurate the barrel breaks down

01:16:37.100 for storage inside the stock with a clip it it is lightweight and easy to carry or conceal when

01:16:43.340 dissembled the rifle has a ridge on top that will easily accept the scope even though it is not

01:16:48.220 cut for one put the scope in place tighten it down then sit it in a sighted in after sighting it in

01:16:53.740 scratch a mark behind each scope clamp to allow remounting of the scope without sighting it each

01:16:59.820 time a three to six powered scope is recommended to ensure accuracy and up to six 65 yards when braced

01:17:07.740 eight to 15 shots should cover a four inch pattern area with no difficulty wow so that's pretty detailed

01:17:14.060 right there guys and uh sorry it's really hard to like read it to you while looking at the camera so

01:17:18.140 my apologies there so um so that's what the book says pretty much verbatim as far as uh which weapons

01:17:25.580 to use and we read earlier about the serial number and scratching it out which the book also gives

01:17:33.180 detailed information on that disposable silencer using the book's directions ah the disposable silencer

01:17:40.620 guys this book has an entire chapter on silencers okay and i'm going to show you this real

01:17:47.980 quick starting on page um 37 bam look at this the disposable silencer all right an entire chapter on

01:17:57.660 this and it has pictures diagrams how to make your silencer wow it's pretty detailed my friends

01:18:09.980 okay and it goes a to z on how to do it has um on page it starts on page 37 is the chapter and then on

01:18:17.820 uh 42 it goes ahead it starts actually um showing you diagrams of how to do it which is you know

01:18:27.900 pretty it's pretty interesting stuff right here also i googled it it is it's technically legal to make

01:18:33.500 a silencer but you have to do it a very specific way and you have to register the device ah so you can't

01:18:38.540 make it but you got to register it yeah okay and it has to be made in a very specific way that it's not

01:18:43.580 like i guess whatever that is like i guess that's probably a very yeah this is probably made in a

01:18:47.980 way that they can actually do a hit right yeah uh he'd carefully cut the parts of the sample

01:19:00.300 he also packed a bag of supplies a brown mechanic suit so he could walk through mildred's neighborhood

01:19:05.740 looking like a repairman and latex gloves so he'd leave no fingerprints

01:19:14.940 in the months before the crime he and horn had talked off discussing each detail

01:19:22.300 at perry's request horn had sent him a map of mildred's neighbor and a video of trevor's room

01:19:28.380 horn had chosen a date when tamiel would be out of the house his only show of mercy in this heinous crime

01:19:34.700 yep didn't want the daughter there on the appointed day perry had driven a car rented by turner from

01:19:41.500 detroit he checked into a hotel near mildred's house in maryland

01:19:49.820 and just so you guys know disguising right they discussed this in a book as well

01:19:54.060 with disguises and this is on page uh 105 okay it says here

01:20:00.540 at the bottom here uh where my middle finger is even if uh someone sees you uh casually uh leaving

01:20:14.460 the victim's house he has bear with me here guys because i'm reading this from the camera uh

01:20:21.100 uh he has no idea of the reason of your visit or what you have done and your disguise will conceal

01:20:28.220 your identity okay and then walk don't run to your car whatever your planned destination might be

01:20:33.260 the first thing you do when you reach the car is to change into another disguise and get out of those

01:20:37.340 work clothes check them for blood stains if there are none you can toss them into a charity collection

01:20:42.460 box or trash can if the victim's blood is on those clothes they must be burned or buried so

01:20:48.220 yeah this book is pretty damn thorough harry had paid cash as the book recommended hoping the motel

01:20:57.900 wouldn't require an id that's his money paying cash you need to see what it did oh without his xerox

01:21:07.900 driver's license police might never have cracked the case stupid we couldn't believe that he did

01:21:13.660 something that dumb stupid put him in silver spring maryland uh on the date and the time of the murders

01:21:20.620 stupid then he'd driven his rental car to a shopping center near mildred's house

01:21:27.180 and walked from there following horn's hand-drawn map hand-drawn map

01:21:34.860 so in theory this book would work if he if it wasn't for the human error that that happened there yeah

01:21:40.300 with him messing up with that yeah it would have been hard way harder for them to find him

01:21:44.780 because they were able to put him at the location at the same time

01:21:49.660 in the house unsuspecting nurse janice saunders made the 2 a.m entry on a medical log attached to

01:21:55.980 trevor's bed

01:22:00.940 and real quick guys this is what the firearm looks like when it's fully assembled right here

01:22:05.260 okay that's the r7 with the makeshift um silencer on it

01:22:10.940 okay so now we're going to go into how we actually committed the crime here

01:22:25.740 perry approached the french doors at the back of the house as planned

01:22:40.300 the locked the doors were easily opened and just so you guys know the book does have a chapter

01:22:51.020 on we're not a chapter but a section page uh 30 called uninvited entry following the following is a

01:23:01.180 template uh for lock picks which will allow you to make a completely adequate set of picks out of

01:23:07.420 ordinary hacksaw blades ground to shape on your workshop grinder standard picks notice that one

01:23:14.540 has slightly less angle at the tip these two are the most commonly used and then bam the torsion bar

01:23:20.220 notice a small step down at the tip to allow for different size key slots a large thick hairpin makes

01:23:27.340 a good torsion bar so this book also talks about how to break in as well so um and then they got a

01:23:34.620 whole part here on lock pick directions and surveillance where's the guy that wrote this

01:23:42.220 is still alive i don't know that's a good question

01:23:44.460 do they even have his name here rex farrell probably a fake pen name oh yeah

01:23:58.460 i am barely making a sound inside he assembled his rifle and he made silence

01:24:12.460 i have some interesting information

01:24:33.580 go ahead share with the people the author was actually a woman

01:24:37.420 and oh i know right and she was she was never actually a killer she was a cash poor divorced

01:24:43.340 mother of two from florida who needed money to pay her property taxes what was she actually a hit

01:24:49.420 man or no no she was never a killer wow just a woman that needed to pay taxes

01:24:55.900 in florida too oh man fantastic oh wow there's a photo of her that's her oh hold on let me put it

01:25:04.380 back let me put on camera this is this is the girl right here guys this is the hitman what the

01:25:08.620 fuck very karen looking

01:25:13.660 holy man god damn it who would have thought man my man perry took advice from a karen that's why you're

01:25:22.380 in prison now

01:25:31.660 he likely took saunders completely by surprise

01:26:01.660 there's a noise but when the boy stopped breathing his medical alarm spoke for him

01:26:27.420 and keep in mind guys keep in mind guys he probably had to kill the son in a certain way for

01:26:45.900 them to be able to get the lawsuit money which is probably why instead of shooting him he pulled

01:26:50.060 uh the um he pulled the breathing device

01:26:56.460 there she too met the killer

01:27:01.580 perry shot mildred three times in the face

01:27:07.180 lauren's probably told him to do that

01:27:08.460 then perry roughed up the house to make it look like a robbery gone bad

01:27:22.140 as the book instructed he took mildred's credit cards but it seems the persistent beeping

01:27:28.060 of the medical alarm unnerved even this calculating killer

01:27:31.980 he stuck to the manual instructions on his way out he quickly bored out the gun barrel

01:27:41.740 using the metal file to foil ballistics tests as the book instructed

01:27:45.580 and then also just so you guys know on page 104 okay they struck here

01:28:00.460 if uh hold on sorry

01:28:06.380 it goes here if the uh

01:28:09.020 if the hit was supposed to look like a burglary mess the place up a bit and take anything of value

01:28:18.460 that you can carry concealed of course you can't keep anything these items will have to be dished

01:28:22.540 along with your work clothes and weapon but any cash you find is yours to pocket so that's uh where

01:28:30.300 they got that part from and then also um talking about the gloves they actually give a funny part

01:28:37.100 right here which i thought was very interesting paying attention to detail

01:28:42.220 hold on let me move this if you have to take a piss flush the toilet with your gloved fingers

01:28:47.660 you can't imagine how many idiots will remove the gloves to facilitate operation zipper to take a pee

01:28:52.700 without thinking they flush before pulling the clubs back or putting the uh put pulling the gloves

01:28:58.460 back on leaving in this disputable evidence to convict them on the primary sources uh for

01:29:06.940 prints during the investigation so yeah a lot of detail here and that's the importance of the

01:29:12.460 gloves as well which is also discussed in this book and rent using a rental car as well as discussed

01:29:19.100 let me see if i can find that page for y'all for a quick escape he took mildred's minivan back to

01:29:25.340 where his rental car was parked on the way he'd scattered mildred's credit cards and the gun parts

01:29:31.340 though only the trigger mechanism was found all right so i mean i'm sitting there can you uh

01:29:39.820 take a picture i can take a picture of him you know right you know right

01:29:43.180 it was a case that had to be put together by really an exhaustive search of and real quick

01:30:00.060 with the rental cars i'll show you guys right here this is on page 97 last paragraph okay it goes

01:30:11.500 and bring that into focus give me one second why is it not god damn it

01:30:17.660 i don't know why it's not focusing right now

01:30:27.980 okay there we go and for some uh reason you cannot fly you may have to drive uh trains and

01:30:33.260 buses are too slow and the trip would tire you considerably but if time permits train and bus

01:30:39.100 travel may be the safest method available in any event never use your own automobile as a means to

01:30:44.620 get into the job site a rental car would be best job site yeah i love how they call it that

01:30:52.940 of every clue possible every clue imaginable um and we literally spend a year and a half two years

01:31:00.380 doing nothing but working on this case in september of 1995 two and a half years after the murders

01:31:09.100 there he is james perry was brought to trial that's the hitman right there looks kind of crazy on easy

01:31:14.460 bad hair day bob dean served as special prosecutor because of his intimate knowledge of the case

01:31:25.900 perry received life for conspiracy and three death sentences for the murders

01:31:30.060 those death sentences were later commuted

01:31:34.380 perry has no chance for parole

01:31:38.060 he has never admitted to committing the crime

01:31:43.980 lawrence horn's trial began that april and packed maryland corporal so lawrence went to trial

01:31:49.820 he faced the same charges as perry so much of the same evidence was used bob bean again served as

01:31:58.860 special prosecutor after a five-week trial the jury found horn guilty on all counts

01:32:06.380 he showed no emotion and like perry he never confessed to the crime

01:32:11.180 on may 13th horn received three life sentences without parole he appealed once and was denied

01:32:25.020 justices served i think both mr horn mr perry did a very good job in

01:32:34.700 planning this and they came very close to getting away with this

01:32:41.740 there would be one more bittersweet victory for the families of the victims

01:32:47.180 following the murders they filed a federal lawsuit against the publishers of hitman a

01:32:52.700 technical manual for independent contractors in late may of 1999 they won the suit including

01:33:01.020 a multi-million dollar settlement and a promise from the publisher to stop selling the book wow

01:33:07.660 crazy stuff huh how did you get it it's a fan uh i was able to find it on amazon but it was more

01:33:15.500 expensive significantly it was like 70 bucks or something so yeah uh so uh ladies final thoughts

01:33:22.700 freshest favorite quote on the on the documentary i'm just shocked what an interesting book like i'm

01:33:29.900 shocked by the book i mean yeah yeah what about you christina and thank you by the way christina was

01:33:34.620 really helpful in getting this thing for me so shout out to her what what are your thoughts on this

01:33:38.380 christina i just feel like you have to be a sick man to kill your own son yeah that is crazy yeah

01:33:43.500 he spared the daughter though spared the daughter yeah because they're like not gonna they're pretty

01:33:49.740 much not from ourselves but yeah exactly and he was and he had a lot of money to win so

01:33:55.580 um but yeah hope you guys enjoyed that one man uh the second time is going to be the charm hopefully

01:34:01.180 on this one man like i said before we had recorded this before but uh those audio issues so hey doing it

01:34:06.700 again right uh but anyway guys with that said don't forget to like the video subscribe to the

01:34:11.340 channel check me out i post clips almost every day we live stream on sundays and i post documentary

01:34:16.060 breakdowns like this typically on thursdays but this was going to come out a little bit later since

01:34:19.420 we had the audio issue love you guys catch you guys on the next one peace

01:34:26.620 i was a special agent with homeland investigations okay guys hsi the cases that i did mostly were

01:34:31.500 human smuggling and drug trafficking no one else has these documents by the way here's what fed it

01:34:37.980 covered doctor lopredo confirmed lacerations due to stepping on glass murder investigations i'm

01:34:46.300 reaching in his jacket you don't know and he's positioning been on february 13 2019 you're facing

01:34:53.740 racketeering and rico conspiracies young slime life here and after referred to as ysl the defendants uh

01:34:58.940 six nine and then this is billy seiko right here now when they first started guys six nine ran with

01:35:04.380 i'm upset i'm watching this music video you know i'm bobbing my highlight hey this shit lit but at

01:35:08.860 the same time i'm pausing oh wait who this right who's that in the back firearms and violence a.k.a

01:35:15.900 bush i see violated you're wanting to stay away

The Debrief With MyronGainesX - October 16, 2022

This BANNED Book Led To The Most EVIL Murder For Hire Case Ever....

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