Best of the Program ｜ Guests： John Douglas, Dave Rubin & Blake J. Harris ｜ 5⧸9⧸19
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 2 minutes
Words per Minute
178.36336
Summary
Glenn Beck is joined by John Douglas to discuss Chernobyl and how that relates to health care in America, and Joe Biden's call for open borders and universal health care. Also, Dave Rubin is on the show to talk about how YouTube is trying to silence him, and Blake Harris, the author of the new book, The History of the Future, joins the show.
Transcript
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Hello, podcasters. What a day to listen to the podcast. We start with Chernobyl and how that
00:00:09.200
relates to health care here in America and Joe Biden. You don't want to miss it. Don't want to
00:00:14.540
miss John Douglas. If you saw the Netflix show Mindhunter, this is the Mindhunter. This is the
00:00:22.860
guy who is talking to all the serial killers for the FBI. He is fascinating, just fascinating.
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Also, Dave Rubin is on. He's just broken through the million mark on YouTube, and he talks about
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how YouTube was trying to stop him. And on that front real quick, Glenn, I mean, you know, here's
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a situation where people are getting taken down off of YouTube. They're being deplatformed from
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all of these sites. This is why, essentially, I mean, really, a reason at the beginning that
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you created the Blaze, and now it's a creative part of this Blaze media situation, which is
00:00:57.080
fantastic. BlazeTV.com slash Glenn is the place to go to subscribe, help conservatives get their
00:01:02.500
voice out, people who care about free speech. BlazeTV.com slash Glenn, use the promo code Glenn.
00:01:07.900
Okay, and Blake Harris, he's the author of the History of the Future. He came in today on the
00:01:15.380
podcast with some emails that he has received from journalists. He exposed Mark Zuckerberg,
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in a way kind of against his will, he was a fan of Mark Zuckerberg, on a massive, massive scandal,
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where Mark forced an executive of Oculus to issue a statement that he was not for Donald Trump,
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even though he was. It's illegal, it's crazy, and then Facebook fired him. That story is in the book,
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The History of the Future, but he brought in some responses from journalists on why they were okay
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with getting the story so wrong. Don't miss a second of today's podcast.
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You're listening to The Best of the Glenn Beck Program.
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Boy, we've got a great show for you today. We have John Douglas is going to be on with us.
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You may not know his name, but if you read the New York Times bestseller or saw, what is it,
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I think a Netflix show, Mindhunter, this is the guy who has interviewed David Berkowitz,
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Ted Bundy, John Wayne Gacy, Charles Manson, Lynette Fromm, Ed Edmund Kemper, James Earl Ray,
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Sirhan Sirhan, Richard Speck. I mean, all of them. He's the guy who started the behavioral science
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at the FBI. It's going to be a fascinating interview. Also, Dave Rubin is going to be
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joining us today. And Blake J. Harris, more on Facebook and his book, The History of the Future,
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coming up. But I want to start with, can we play the audio of Joe Biden, where he is talking
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compassionately here about how America must now provide health care for people who are here
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Look, I think that anyone who is in a situation where they're in need of health care,
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regardless of whether they're documented or undocumented, we have an obligation to see that
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they're cared for. That's why I think we need more clinics around the country. And this idea that
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undocumented, and by the way, a significant portion of undocumented folks in this country
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are there because they've overstayed their visas. It's not people breaking down gates coming across
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Either way, it doesn't matter. Here's the thing. If you want socialized medicine,
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then you must have a secure border. We cannot do both. You want open borders? Great. Private medicine.
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But you cannot open the borders and say, anybody who's sick, come to America. Because then we're
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healing the world, and we will not have the resources to heal anybody in a very short period
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of time. That's just math. And I know that math doesn't really work for socialists right now. But in
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the end, the gods of the copybook headings will teach us that two and two do indeed always equal
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Yeah. I mean, this is amazing. You have a society that is trying to do both, right? I mean,
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even libertarians, and there are some libertarians who kind of, not open borders, but argue for much,
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you know, many libertarians are open borders. Some of them might even say they're open borders.
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But the reason is, well, we don't have to support them. We can do, we don't, we don't,
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we don't have to have these giant programs. We don't want them.
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So if you don't have socialist medicine, if you don't have free health care for everybody,
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if you don't have a requirement to treat every person at a hospital that needs to be treated.
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Right. Financially, it's still, it's not a problem. Now there's other reasons why you might
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not want to do that, but financially it doesn't become as big a problem because, well, I mean,
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look, you're not giving away all this money. There's still employment and concerns and everything
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else. But this is the way it goes every single time. And you have to put your, you have to
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understand, and I don't think many of the younger, you know, millennials and younger who are suddenly
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embracing socialism realize what underlies that. What underlies all of socialism is your dedication
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to the state. It's the state as your God. And that is really where this, you know, where this ends
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up. You can sit back and say, well, I want this program and I want this program. But once things
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start going wrong, the socialist government that you've given all this power to has no other option
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but to protect itself at all costs. And that dedication winds up killing a hundred million
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people in a century or so. Right. We've seen this before. There's a great new series on HBO
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I haven't. I've seen the, I've seen the ads for it, but I will tell you, this is a great
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way, assuming that it's good. I know you've seen it. So assuming that it is, is good. This
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is a great way to teach our kids who did not live through the Soviet Union, teach our kids
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and our grandkids exactly what it's like to live in a socialist country. Remember, it's not
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really communists. You know, the communists, oh, they didn't do communism right. No, that's
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right. That's why it was the USSR, Soviet socialist states. Okay. So it was not communism because
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that's the higher law. It was socialist. And so when you see what a real socialist state
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was and Chernobyl is a great example of what happens.
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And it's also a great example of what happens to the regular people because the regular people
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who are in this society, they might not be, you know, socialist ideologues, right? They
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are people who are just trying to make a living and they're living under what is, I believe,
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a terrible system. And many of the people in the Soviet Union during Chernobyl were heroes.
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The people who were working there, the people who came in to try to stop it.
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Firefighters. Firefighters. I mean, and they talk about this and they show it in great detail
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of what they went through and what they were asked to do. But let me give you this, this
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part. This is amazing. So there, to set the scene, Chernobyl's happened, the nuclear meltdown
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in, you know, Soviet, in the Soviet Union, Ukraine. And they are talking about, what do
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we do? Now they have not come to the point where they realized how bad it was or had been
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admitted to themselves how bad it was. And they're just starting to have those first conversations
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back and forth about, you know, most people are saying, oh, it's a fire and it's mostly
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out. And the other side saying, look, I don't, I don't think, I think we should evacuate the
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town. I mean, this looks, this looks a lot worse than we thought it was. And we should
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get the people out of the town. And so the, the, there's a, the two sides of this arguing
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back and forth at this table as they're planning for, for what happens to the people in the
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community. And as this is all going on, uh, an old guy, an old socialist, an old school
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guy taps his cane on the floor and silences the room and gives this speech. It's amazing.
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I wonder how many of you know the name of this place.
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And how proud he would be of you all tonight. Especially you, young man.
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And the passion you have for the people. For is that not the sole purpose of the apparatus
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of the state? Sometimes we forget. Sometimes we fall prey to fear. But our faith in Soviet
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Now, the state tells us the situation here is not dangerous. Have faith, comrades.
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The state tells us it wants to prevent a panic. Listen well.
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It's true. When the people see the police, they will be afraid. But it is my experience
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that when the people ask questions that are not in their own best interest, they should
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simply be told to keep their minds on their labor. And leave matters of the state to the state.
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We seal off the city. No one leaves. And cut the phone lines. Contain the spread of misinformation.
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That is how we keep the people from undermining the fruits of their own labor.
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Yes, comrades. We will all be rewarded for what we do here tonight. This is our moment to shine.
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That is wow. Amazing. They don't let the people undermine their fruits of their own labor when
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they ask questions that are not in their best interests. So John Huntsman was a friend of mine,
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John Huntsman Sr. Yeah. And we talked because he was one of the first guys in the former Soviet
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Union. And, you know, the idea was capitalists can go in and help heal the country. So he bought
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Aeroflot Airlines. Did you know that? No, I didn't know that. Yeah. So he bought when the Soviet Union
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collapsed. These were all state run things. And they sold them off. And they sold them off. So he
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went in and he thought, I'll buy Aeroflot so the planes can still fly. He bought Aeroflot. He sold
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it so quickly. Because when he bought it, little did he know how bad things were. They literally
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would lose planes full of passengers, plow it into a mountain. And when the families would be waiting
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at the gate, waiting for their family, that plane to arrive, they would say it's late. And then they
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would find out that, you know, it was, it had crashed the heads of it. And they would say the
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heads of Aeroflot would just tell the gate people, uh, never took off. This, this never took off.
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This plane didn't, this, this plane didn't exist. And so the people who were standing at the gate
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when I, I, I just talked to my aunt or my husband, he was getting onto that plane. Nope. That plane
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didn't, that didn't, it never took off. I don't know where your husband is. And they just had to
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go back to their home and concentrate on their labor. Yeah. I mean, that's questions. Couldn't
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ask questions. That's, that is the real problem of socialism is there's no police to run to
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when a corporation that would never happen in America. Can you imagine a plane just plows into
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a mountain and American airlines would say that plane never took off? It wouldn't, it wouldn't
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happen. It wouldn't happen. But if the state controls the communication, the airlines and
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absolutely everything else, who are you going to run to? Your husband dies in a plane crash.
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Your husband is, is at Chernobyl and, and it's a massive meltdown. Nobody gets sued. No, nobody
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investigates because the police are part of it. And socialists don't understand that somehow,
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somehow or another, they just, and it comes from this progressive idea that man can progress.
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Well, yes, man can progress, but each man must progress on his own.
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And, and so, and, and there are certain things that are naturally born into all of us. Yeah.
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And a, a willingness to be corrupt. If you're in charge, absolute power corrupts. Absolutely.
00:15:13.040
Yeah. A friend of mine works with a bunch of millennials and they, there was some, they're
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having some conversation about some mandatory program that generally speaking would be a good
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idea, but should it be mandatory? And none of them could see any negative. These aren't
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left-wingers either. Couldn't see any negative in the government forcing these people to participate
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in it. And it's, it's, it's fascinating because that is a, they, all they could see was the common
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good. Well, what you just heard, that speech is the end of the common good. That's where it gets
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to. Remember, he's not doing this because he wants to kill people. Right. He's doing this because he
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wants to protect Soviet socialism, which is for the common good. And I, I have a proposal here.
00:15:50.480
You know, when you, you go to like a YouTube and you click play in a video and it says you have
00:15:54.180
to wait 15 seconds before you see the video. I think when you go to a voting booth and you try
00:15:59.780
to vote for Bernie Sanders, you should have to wait and watch that entire video before the vote
00:16:03.640
goes through. Just, just, you should just be able to see what you're voting for. Are you sure?
00:16:07.640
Are you sure you're casting this vote? Are you sure? Okay.
00:16:21.920
Hey, it's Glenn. And I want to tell you about something that you should either end your day
00:16:25.480
with or start your morning with. And that is the news and why it matters. If you like this show,
00:16:32.780
you're going to love the news and why it matters. It's a bunch of us that all get together at the
00:16:37.320
end of the day and just talk about the stories that matter to you and your life. The news and why
00:16:41.960
it matters. Look for it now, wherever you download your favorite podcast. Pat Gray joins us now from
00:16:47.460
Pat Gray Unleashed, the podcast that is sweeping America. Everybody's talking about it. Everybody's
00:16:54.500
talking about it. I mean, it's crazy. It's a little embarrassing. And what do you have? Calm down.
00:16:59.400
Everybody. And what do you have? What do you have for us today? I have a stat that I think
00:17:05.160
you're going to love on immigration. Well, illegal immigration. I'm going to love it. Yeah. I think
00:17:11.800
you're going to love this. Okay. From the entire populations of Guatemala and Honduras, 1% of the
00:17:18.380
total population of each of those countries has crossed the U.S. border. But you're thinking,
00:17:25.340
okay, what, since 1975, 1980, since last September. But, you know, how old were you last September?
00:17:34.600
I was six. And so, I mean, 1% of the population of two pretty significant countries have illegally
00:17:46.500
entered our country in the last nine months. Nine months. Wow. But this is definitely not an
00:17:51.840
crisis. It's not a crisis. It's not an invasion. Right. Can you imagine if 1% of Iran or Al-Qaeda,
00:18:01.060
1% of Al-Qaeda came across and just was in- In nine months. In nine months in America, would we say,
00:18:08.020
there's a problem? I mean, of course we would. I would love to know, what percentage must come
00:18:14.340
across the border illegally from those two countries or any other countries? 75%. 75%.
00:18:19.840
Yeah. And then they'd get alarmed? Then I'd start to get worried. I'd put a chain link fence at that
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point. Hang on just a second. I mean, you can't look at it as if, well, it's not 100%, right?
00:18:30.060
Right. We didn't empty out both those countries. There's still some people that come.
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Could I make the suggestion? I mean, I make the suggestion that let's slow down on this. Let's
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think about this for a minute. Okay. Because there's no place for conservatives to go right
00:18:45.200
now. Like I'd love to live in California. I'll never live in California. It's crazy. So why don't
00:18:53.000
we look at Honduras and say, okay, I tell you what, you guys sneak across the border and you come in
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here. And when you get to about 99%, just alert us. And then I'm going to go down to Honduras
00:19:10.520
by the entire country. And we will live as conservatives and free men.
00:19:16.880
You know, there's, that's kind of appealing actually. It is. It's kind of got oceanfront
00:19:21.000
property. I mean, start over and, and just use the constitution and we'll live by that.
00:19:27.740
You guys go ahead and go ahead and have a good time. Have a good time. It's, I mean, it's
00:19:32.860
nuts. I, the Democrats love to talk about sustainability. That's not sustainable. Is it sustainable that every
00:19:40.800
nine months, another 1% from those two countries, Central American countries or any countries
00:19:47.060
continue to flood into the United States? That's sustainable. Can you add, you know, it's not
00:19:51.060
1% of Canada, 1% of Canada crossed our border. They'd be pissed about it. Who'd be pissed?
00:19:58.380
The, the left. Oh yeah. Well, they'd be pissed because they'd be bringing their back bacon and
00:20:03.400
they're, and curling and all their, they would not like that at the Olympics. No, they wouldn't.
00:20:09.020
No, they wouldn't. But I would be just as upset if it was Canada. I would too. Doesn't matter.
00:20:14.420
Doesn't matter if it's the UK or Canada, Norway, I don't care. It's unsustainable. We just can't
00:20:20.380
do it. Well, you, you heard Joe Biden, uh, uh, yesterday talk about healthcare, right? Yeah.
00:20:27.160
Where he said, we have to provide healthcare. We have to provide a obligation. So now we're providing
00:20:33.340
healthcare for 1% of the population of those two countries in nine months.
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We've, we've, we're taking on 1% of two different countries and we're going to be providing their
00:20:46.200
healthcare. How, how is that sustainable? How and how, who pays for it? Who pays for it?
00:20:51.860
Of course we do. Right. We got to pay for the education. We have to pay for the healthcare.
00:20:57.080
We have to pay for the living, you know, as if we capture them, uh, we have to house them.
00:21:04.820
Uh, these, you lie. That, no, that usually works against that point. I've noticed over
00:21:11.720
the past few years, if you just yell, you lie. No, it doesn't. It doesn't anymore because
00:21:16.620
they're just admitting it. Yeah. They're just admitting it. I love that. I think about that
00:21:20.880
all the time when you predicted years ago, they're just going to start admitting all this
00:21:24.500
stuff and they have, and they are, and they're just, they're just naked Marxists.
00:21:28.640
Cause I told, I told you at the time, remember what I said, they want to know, they do.
00:21:34.500
They're dying to tell you they are so, they are so confident that socialism is the thing.
00:21:42.560
They're dying to tell you. And it's in, it's in these moments, you need to remember what the truth
00:21:49.740
is because the, you know, it wasn't that different in the mid nineties when Bill Clinton was saying
00:21:55.860
the era of big government is over. They didn't believe anything differently. Then they just
00:22:00.580
weren't telling you. Yeah. They were faking. They just believed that at that point, the best way to
00:22:05.060
advance it was to say the era of big government was over. And now they believe the opposite. They
00:22:09.520
think they can come out and admit it. And you're right. They're dying to do it. And
00:22:12.320
here's the thing. We were conspiracy theorists for saying that that's what they wanted to do.
00:22:16.820
Nine years ago, we were conspiracy theorists. Now they're coming out and saying it. And
00:22:22.560
when you point it out, nobody says you're a conspiracy theorist anymore. They're like, yeah.
00:22:29.940
You're like, wait, wait, wait, what? Yeah. I am a socialist. Yeah. I'm a communist.
00:22:35.400
That's a better system. Yeah. And, and, and then there are those people who I think the vast
00:22:41.100
majority of the voting Democrats, voting Democrats are different than Washington Democrats, big
00:22:46.520
time. And I think that the vast majority of the voting Democrats, uh, and you see this as
00:22:52.460
evidenced by, you know, Joe Biden being up 30, 30, 40, yeah. 32 to 40 points ahead of any of the
00:22:59.180
other competitors. Yeah. There is this desire that no, no, no, no. There is this starving for
00:23:06.420
anything other than socialist in the democratic party. And they are, they are willing to accept
00:23:13.840
Joe Biden, not being a socialist, but he'll give you the same stuff. He's going to give you exactly the
00:23:19.720
same stuff. You, you can't, you know, he wrapped it yesterday in compassion, compassion. Yes. But if
00:23:28.400
you're in a lifeboat, I'm sorry, but when the lifeboat is full, you must steer the lifeboat away
00:23:38.160
from the people who are flailing. And I'm sorry, but we will all die. And when that happens,
00:23:45.880
who then can we help? The answer is no, no one. When the lifeboat has been capsized or sunk,
00:23:52.540
everybody drowns. Correct. Correct. You, you, you have to, you have to balance compassion with reason.
00:24:03.180
Yeah. And when it comes to this situation, we are not able, we're the richest country in the world.
00:24:10.340
No, we're not. No, we're not. We're the biggest debtor in the history of the world. We have 23
00:24:18.440
trillion dollars, 23 trillion dollars. By the way, do you know how much money we have spent on poverty
00:24:25.540
since the great society speech from LBJ? Was it 20 trillion? 22 trillion dollars. Yeah. Yeah.
00:24:32.660
So everything that we've done and the poverty numbers have not changed. No. Everything that we have done,
00:24:39.040
we are now in debt, 20, 22 or 23 trillion dollars. We spend about 20 or 22 trillion dollars
00:24:48.680
trying to fix poverty. None of this is working. And those are all socialist programs and none of them
00:24:56.880
are working. It was 14% poverty rate, I think in 1965. It's 14% today after 22 or 23 trillion dollars.
00:25:07.500
It's crazy. Same with the war on drugs. I mean, all these wars that we're fighting against.
00:25:12.480
Because it doesn't work that way. It doesn't work. It doesn't work that way.
00:25:16.680
You know, it's like telling somebody who's depressed, you know, just cheer up.
00:25:26.340
Oh, by the way, the border, if you would like to talk about real compassion.
00:25:32.240
Mercury One is implementing child rescue systems at the border right now in Texas and New Mexico.
00:25:42.420
We got this charge. We were asked by churches because these churches, another delivery is coming
00:25:50.320
today to some of these churches. 2,000 people just dumped on their doorstep today.
00:25:56.480
Wow. Okay. Um, and the problem is these churches are yesterday. Didn't we say it was a thousand a
00:26:02.480
day yesterday and now it's 2000, 2000 at least today today. Um, so we, um, operation underground
00:26:10.400
rescue got a phone call from one of these churches on the border and said, you got to help us. You have
00:26:15.780
to train our people. Cause we know we are handing these kids over to sex traffickers, but we can't
00:26:21.860
do anything about it. Yeah. They said we can't do anything about it. We have to, you have to,
00:26:26.460
have to. So what do we do? The Democrats have put them in that position. Right. So we are sitting
00:26:31.000
here, um, providing training so the churches can identify the smugglers and, uh, we will assist,
00:26:39.040
uh, the government, uh, busting up these rings. Uh, but we really need your help. Uh, Mercury One,
00:26:46.540
the idea was to be a catalyst to restore the human spirit when it's broken. And if I don't, if,
00:26:51.800
if, if, if our spirit of Americans on the border isn't broken, I don't know what is. These people
00:27:01.220
have been abandoned. American citizens and towns and churches have been abandoned by our federal
00:27:10.080
government. Let's help these towns out on the border. All you have to do is, uh, just go to
00:27:16.880
mercuryone.org and donate five bucks a month. Uh, whatever you can do, mercuryone.org, but please
00:27:25.340
give, or you can call 972-499-4747. More on that later. Pat, thank you so much. Appreciate it.
00:27:33.480
Hey, it's Glenn. And if you like what you hear on the program, you should check out Pat Gray
00:27:37.840
Unleashed. His podcast is available wherever you download your favorite podcast.
00:27:58.720
John Douglas, the original mind hunter is, uh, on with us now. Hello, John. How are you, sir?
00:28:05.540
Very well, Glenn. Thanks for having me. Uh, it's an honor to talk to you. Um, I remember, um,
00:28:11.020
what in some way, what you went through when you first started talking to people. Cause I remember
00:28:17.220
my grandfather saying, these guys are just talking to them. They're going to make excuses. I don't
00:28:22.140
care what happened to them in their life. They did the crime. And that was the prevalent theory when
00:28:28.540
you started interviewing these mass murderers. Correct. Uh, at the FBI, very, very much what's
00:28:36.080
happening on the, uh, series, the mind hunter series on Netflix. Um, the question was, why am I doing
00:28:41.720
this? What, what are you doing? And, uh, uh, you shouldn't be going into the prisons doing these
00:28:46.080
interviews. Well, at the time I was 32 years old. Uh, I came back, uh, uh, to Quantico after working
00:28:52.680
seven years in the field. I was a very young agent when I was recruited. Uh, I just got out of the
00:28:57.080
military at four years of military, a couple of advanced degrees and came back and was sitting back
00:29:01.480
the classroom. Now I had to audit the senior instruction instructors and these senior instructors
00:29:08.380
just didn't have their facts right. And, and how do I know that? Because there were police officers in
00:29:14.060
the classroom that were challenging the instructors. And they say, Hey, look, you know, I worked the
00:29:18.840
Manson case. You got your facts all screwed up. So here I am now 32 years old and I got to get up in
00:29:25.160
front of these senior investigators from throughout the world and, and FBI agents, you know, at some
00:29:31.120
point and, and what can I do to accelerate my learning? So in the old days we had, we'd call
00:29:35.420
road schools. You go out and, and maybe teaching in San Diego, then later on Boise, Idaho, and, you
00:29:41.880
know, let's go into these prisons. I asked my partner, I said, let's go, let's see if Manson will
00:29:46.420
talk to us. Let's see if, um, uh, David Berkowitz, uh, the son of Sam or Sirhan Sirhan and, um, thought
00:29:54.120
it was a crazy idea, but went into the, the, uh, prisons just unannounced, which was kind of good
00:29:58.660
when you're an agent, you just show your creds, you can go in and, and you don't have to tell
00:30:02.920
anybody why you want to speak to these people. And to our surprise, they were very, very, uh, very,
00:30:08.720
very, very forthcoming, very, very, uh, interested in speaking with me. But we made mistakes early on
00:30:14.020
in the, uh, when we first started doing the interviews, uh, we'd go in there with notes,
00:30:19.260
uh, go in there with a tape recorder. And that was a eternal, uh, a, a turnoff for them. Uh, why?
00:30:25.540
Because they, uh, they're paranoid individuals and they should be paranoid. They're incarcerated
00:30:29.620
with a lot of other violent offenders. They don't trust corrections. They're certainly not
00:30:33.820
going to trust the, uh, the FBI. So what I began to do, uh, as we went along and teamed
00:30:40.760
up with Dr. Ann Burgess, Boston college, and we developed a computerized instrument for interviews,
00:30:46.040
uh, which I would never fill out, uh, during the interview process would be before and after
00:30:51.300
the, uh, you know, the interview and then, um, started to, uh, you know, document this, you know,
00:30:57.560
this material and, and began to get some really fantastic information, uh, from them regarding
00:31:04.220
victim selection, pre-offense behavior, post-offense behavior. Then I started thinking, what can I do
00:31:09.460
creatively, creatively to create a situation where I may cause David Berkowitz, for example, uh, to go to
00:31:16.620
the grave site, uh, of his, uh, victims or to inject himself into the police investigation? Well,
00:31:23.140
the Bureau stood afar. They were, they were really against this, you know, what the hell are you doing?
00:31:27.380
You know, this kind of, you know, this kind of work. And, and they were really the last ones to
00:31:31.980
embrace my own agency. They were waiting for me, I think, to screw up. And then they'd send me to,
00:31:37.240
uh, Butte, Montana, you know, wrestling cases or something like that. So, so, uh, you know,
00:31:43.220
they were the last ones, uh, you know, to embrace it. And then when I got really some national,
00:31:48.460
some international publicity, uh, and I was doing so many cases, but then when I hit the
00:31:52.980
Atlanta, the Atlanta child killings was very controversial. I was censured, uh, by the Bureau,
00:31:58.860
uh, when I, I publicly said the killer would be a, a, uh, a black offender would not be white in that
00:32:05.300
particular case. Historically, we had a lot of white serial killers leading up to, uh, to that time.
00:32:11.000
And, um, when they finally, they, uh, arrested, uh, Wayne B. Williams in the case, then I got
00:32:17.580
involved in cross-examination strategies, coaching the prosecutor on how to, how to, um, go after him
00:32:24.500
on the stand. And again, I was very, very, very, very young, but now it's this young, young agent.
00:32:29.700
And when I would now get in front of a group, a cop, senior, cop, senior agents, you know, it's, uh,
00:32:35.300
you're like the old show EF Hutton, when, when EF Hutton speaks, everyone listens. So they started,
00:32:41.000
started, you know, listening, but along the way, it's, it's stressful, man. It's stressful.
00:32:46.240
John, let me, let me ask you this on, on the, on the stress part of it. First of all,
00:32:50.800
I don't want to give any spoilers for anybody who hasn't seen the series on Netflix. Um, but
00:32:55.060
is that last episode, did that at all, anything like that? Did you go through that?
00:33:01.340
Well, it was, it's actually, it's worse, uh, it's worse than the episode.
00:33:05.700
Because it was that particular way that didn't, didn't happen like that. But I, um, I, I was
00:33:12.180
training in New York city, uh, to, um, in 1983 and it was around, let's see around October,
00:33:18.320
November. And while, while on stage training several hundred police from, from Nassau County,
00:33:24.520
Suffolk, all around Manhattan. Um, I'm sorry. I just came back on the Yorkshire Ripper case.
00:33:29.180
I, I, I have to go up to, uh, Alaska where a guy is, uh, believe is hunting down women. He's,
00:33:35.760
he's, uh, abducting women, stripping them down naked as he takes them to his airplane,
00:33:40.980
flies them up into the wilderness and hunts them down. And then there's the green river,
00:33:44.980
the green river killer in Seattle, Washington. So I had this anxiety attack, uh, while on stage.
00:33:51.880
And, and I know my material so well that my mouth is talking, but my brain is elsewhere.
00:33:58.100
And I, I feel like I'm, I'm, I'm having a heart attack. I'm, I, I'm perspiring. I'm saying to
00:34:03.640
myself, I was saying, Douglas, man, you got to regroup. You got to come, come out of this,
00:34:08.900
refocus, focus. And, uh, so I got through it. I don't think anyone, no one ever said anything.
00:34:13.700
No one ever detected it. But, uh, by the time I got back to Quantico, I, I felt at 38 years of age,
00:34:20.100
I'm going to have a heart attack. I'm going to something, I'm going to have cancer. Something's
00:34:24.000
going to happen to me. So I took out all this income protection insurance.
00:34:28.100
And then it's now time to go out on the green river murder case in Seattle, Washington.
00:34:31.540
I have tremendous headaches. I have to train two younger agents now assigned to my program.
00:34:37.840
And the long and short out there, what happened was, is before I, uh, I went to the, before
00:34:41.580
the task force, come back to my hotel room, tell the agents, I feel like I'm getting a flu.
00:34:46.800
And that night I collapsed in my hotel room floor. They kicked down the door three days later
00:34:52.060
because I have a do not disturb sign on the door. And they find me in a frog like position.
00:34:57.180
My brain had split in the right temporal lobe from 107 degree body temperature. My heart beats 220
00:35:03.340
and I'm in a coma and I'll remain in a coma for a week and come out of the coma, uh, paralyzed all along
00:35:11.860
that the, uh, the left side can't, you know, can't speak. Uh, before I came out of the coma,
00:35:16.800
they were planning, I'm a veteran. They were planning to bury me at the veteran, uh, veteran
00:35:20.000
cemetery. And, um, uh, the doctors later on, when I came back, they flew me back after a month
00:35:26.520
in the hospital, back to where I live in, uh, Virginia, uh, went to various doctors, went to
00:35:33.220
psychologists and psychologists test to me. And they said, John, I said, man, well, first you got
00:35:37.400
the viral encephalitis brought on your immune system is so low. Uh, you came very close to dying.
00:35:44.080
Plus you had complications of blood clots that nearly killed you. And he says, but the,
00:35:48.440
the, you were really suffering this post-traumatic stress disorder that some, and some of the
00:35:52.700
things we see in, and our veterans coming back, but you're experiencing the same kind of thing,
00:35:57.080
the same kind of thing here, uh, dealing with death and violence and dealing with the victims
00:36:02.060
of these violent crimes that break your heart when you have to deal with them. Or when a victim's
00:36:08.140
mother tells you, John, you have to tell me how my daughter was killed. Did my daughter fight?
00:36:13.580
And, you know, on and on. And it really is, uh, it was emotionally, uh, exhausting.
00:36:17.940
So John, did you, did you, because in watching you and in reading these books that you've, you've
00:36:24.480
written, um, you, at least I am, I, I think the toll on you on sitting, you know, and, and, and
00:36:35.880
intentionally making them feel superior to you by, by adjusting the chair. So they're higher than
00:36:42.500
you are and doing all these things and befriending them. It just seems like there is a, you're
00:36:49.680
paying a, uh, a, a price in your soul, uh, to be able to get this information.
00:36:56.500
Well, yeah, I give you an example. I interviewed, uh, Richard Speck who killed seven nurses, uh,
00:37:01.280
in, uh, in the Chicago area. And, and, and he was extremely violent. Uh, they were holding him
00:37:07.880
in a cage, uh, and they wanted me to show, show me his cell first in his pornography and
00:37:12.980
in a cell. But meanwhile, he's screaming and yelling like, uh, you know, like crazy. And
00:37:18.120
when I finally got back in his cage with him, I was with his counselor. Uh, I decided to
00:37:22.900
totally ignore him and turn my back to him. And I had a conversation with his counselor and
00:37:28.840
I, I had to use, I use street language and talking to his counselor about the crimes that
00:37:34.280
he committed, you know, kind of filthy kind of language, but the kind of language that,
00:37:38.080
you know, Richard Speck, uh, can identify with. And I said something to the effect that,
00:37:42.920
you know, uh, to his counselor, I said, I don't know what this guy eats for breakfast, but man,
00:37:47.000
I said, he, uh, he raped these seven, uh, you know, seven women. I just don't understand it.
00:37:51.900
And I knew he didn't do that. So he chimes in behind me and he's, he's sitting up on top of
00:37:56.340
a credential. I'm six foot two and he's six two as well, but he still wants to dominate,
00:38:00.520
you know, over me and you let him do it. And he says, I didn't, I didn't, and using street
00:38:05.100
terms, what he did to those girls. And I said, I know, I said, it was just the, the one on the
00:38:09.060
couch. And he says, you're crazy, man. You ought to be in here with us. I mean, you're just like us
00:38:14.060
and I'm really not just like him, but I have to show this, this false sense of, of empathy.
00:38:19.400
And I'd be lying to you, Glenn, if I tell you at the end of the day, when I have to come back to my
00:38:23.580
own family and at the time, and then the young children, uh, you know, that have, uh, and that you may
00:38:29.400
have flashbacks, you may even be in bed with your wife one night and, and, and, um, you're thinking
00:38:36.100
that some amorous type of thing you may want to be doing, but now you're thinking about some horrific
00:38:41.100
case that you're, that you're working on. And it's really, uh, it's dangerous to your health.
00:38:47.540
All right. I want to, I want to take it. I assume you don't tell her to tell her that on date night,
00:38:51.040
you know, like, Oh honey. Yeah. You know what I'm thinking about right now.
00:38:55.760
John, I, I'm going to take a quick break for about a minute and then we're going to come back
00:38:59.080
and continue our conversation, but I just have to thank you for what you've endured as a,
00:39:03.660
as a human being for all of our sakes. Uh, you know, you, you put up with both sides,
00:39:10.160
the law and the devil, uh, and, uh, and took a lot of grief and, and thank you for, for standing
00:39:17.800
and doing that. Oh, thank you back in just one more minute. Uh, John Douglas, uh, the killer
00:39:23.860
across the table. He is the original mind hunter that if you've seen the Netflix show,
00:39:29.080
this is the guy, this is the best of the Glenn Beck program.
00:39:38.380
Hi, it's Glenn. If you're a subscriber to the podcast, can you do us a favor and rate us
00:39:42.940
on iTunes? If you're not a subscriber, become one today and listen on your own time. You can
00:39:48.440
subscribe on iTunes. Thanks. Dave Rubin. How are you, sir?
00:39:55.160
Where are you? Like the North pole? This is the worst phone connection I've heard since my
00:40:01.500
Are we on a bad connection here? I am. I'm in my backyard at the moment because LA, uh,
00:40:10.940
Let me see if I could, let me see if I can shift into.
00:40:13.380
No, no, no. It's fine. It just, it just sounds like you're on using on like an old timey phone
00:40:17.860
and a lot of his. It's like, I've got a person to person, coast to coast call for you, Mr. Beck.
00:40:24.040
Uh, Glenn, I have to go on the assumption that, you know, I've been dealing with these problems
00:40:28.480
with YouTube, that it must be the phone company.
00:40:31.180
That's right. Congratulations on a million subscribers on YouTube. And I know you have
00:40:37.480
taken, uh, some pretty big risks, uh, recently, uh, to stand up for your principles and, and
00:40:45.680
putting your eggs in the YouTube basket is really kind of a frightening thing. Uh, and
00:40:52.420
it is paying off for you in some regard. Uh, I know that they demonetize you. If, if you
00:40:58.940
have anybody that is slightly to the right of Bernie Sanders, I know they flag you immediately.
00:41:06.840
Well, it's pretty crazy what they're doing. And, you know, this is a really, really interesting
00:41:12.000
debate that we've discussed a little bit before where it's starting to push my libertarian side,
00:41:17.380
which is my, which is the core of what I am. Uh, it's pushing my libertarian side to its limits
00:41:22.800
because look, these are private companies and in my estimation, they can do what they want to do.
00:41:28.340
Nobody's forcing me to be on YouTube. I'm voluntarily using their service. They provide,
00:41:33.440
uh, when it, when they're doing it right. And then people are getting your videos and they're
00:41:37.540
staying subscribed and all those things. They're providing an incredible service and all of those
00:41:41.580
things. So I say that primarily, but the next part is how these tech companies become so awesomely
00:41:49.420
powerful that we actually can't even grapple with how much information they control, how much power
00:41:55.400
they have the amount of, uh, connections that they have with the government at this point. Uh,
00:42:02.300
these are all things that we have to think about. And, you know, there is a seemingly really big
00:42:06.700
push I'm seeing on the right right now from conservatives to ask for government intervention.
00:42:11.500
Don't, don't, don't, don't. Bad idea. Bad idea. So look, I get why in the short term people think
00:42:19.300
this will be good because it does seem that conservatives are getting banned more, but you
00:42:23.200
have to always take, you know, a couple of steps down the road with these things. And the point is,
00:42:27.620
well, if you hand over the power to the government, I mean, first off, the idea that the government
00:42:31.160
could run tech companies or regulate tech companies. I mean, when was the last time you were on a
00:42:35.020
government website, it looks like AOL in 1994. So, so that, that's just like the easy version of it.
00:42:40.780
But the real issue of course, is that, so let's say you hand over the power to the government to,
00:42:46.440
to regulate or to be in charge of these tech companies or break them up or whatever it is.
00:42:50.580
Well, the government now, a Trump, you know, conservative presidency might be friendly to
00:42:55.540
conservatives right now, but what happens if the democratic socialists get in power and now they've
00:43:00.800
got the tech companies, we know they have the tech companies and now they've got the government
00:43:04.600
too. I mean, how quickly do you think they'll be banning all of the people that they deem to be,
00:43:09.380
you know, Nazis and white supremacists and the rest of it. So that's where, you know, I know,
00:43:13.660
you know this, but that of course is where you really have to be leery of, of using power until
00:43:20.480
the absolute last second. First of all, you know, regulation, you know, when, when Mark Zuckerberg comes
00:43:27.920
out and is begging for regulation, you know, it's in his best interest at Facebook to have
00:43:34.360
regulation. And the reason why is because they will come to those people and those companies
00:43:39.360
and say, how do we regulate? And they will write the laws, which will take all competition and crush
00:43:45.420
any possible contender, uh, to their throne. On top of that, if we get them and we, we go to them
00:43:54.520
and say, how do we regulate you? And they get their regulation. It will not only crush all competition,
00:44:01.360
but on top of it, it will then make the bill of rights absolutely worthless because these are
00:44:09.420
companies that are private. And so they do have a right, but if they're the backbone and because of
00:44:16.640
regulation, that's really all our choice, they can ban any voice and you have nowhere to go because
00:44:24.820
the bill of rights does not apply to them. It will apply to the government. So this is the,
00:44:32.860
the catch 22. And I think for people like us that put Liberty before everything else, I think this is
00:44:37.860
the tricky spot that we're in because look, but you know, Glenn, you've built an incredible company
00:44:41.700
using, using digital, uh, properties, right? Like I'm on YouTube. We use, we do podcasts and all
00:44:48.580
sorts of things. Now, the simple truth is, uh, you probably have some extra protections because of
00:44:53.340
the way I think you have a technology arm of the blaze. So some of your stuff is proprietary,
00:44:57.100
but which is, which is actually probably the way all creators should be going ultimately. And I've been,
00:45:02.440
I've been researching a little bit into that, but the point is that right this moment, as we're
00:45:06.980
talking, technically, there's nothing that I can do to stop YouTube from just shutting me
00:45:11.700
off and, and iTunes kicking me out and the rest of it. And it's like, that is, that is a truly,
00:45:17.800
truly awesome power that they have, especially as we know that all of this seems to be getting
00:45:22.640
ramped up to 2020. So it's putting all of us, especially the Liberty minded folks in a,
00:45:28.100
in a really weird position. And what I'm afraid of is I'm seeing too many conservatives, you know,
00:45:35.020
chomp at the bit here and say, you know, regulate, regulate, regulate, and it will just be used
00:45:41.100
together. Now that being said, you know, creating the competition. So for, for people like us that
00:45:45.360
believe in competition, right, we believe in human ingenuity. We believe we can, we can solve problems.
00:45:49.840
And I would always rather the free market solving. I mean, there's still a major issue here, which is
00:45:54.060
that the amount of money and resources to solve these problems is so massive. And, you know, there's
00:46:00.960
blockchain technologies and all sorts of interesting things that are, that are still sort of years away
00:46:05.920
from being mass adopted. So we're, we're just at a unique point. And, you know, hopefully,
00:46:11.740
hopefully those of us that are doing good work, uh, and, and trying to get some truth out there,
00:46:16.360
you know, hopefully it's not being turned against us just yet, but you just don't know. You really
00:46:21.660
don't. Um, Dave, I want to make a pitch for somebody. Um, there is a guy who's wrote, uh, who,
00:46:28.560
who wrote the book, uh, the history of the future. His name is Blake Harris. Do you know who he is?
00:46:33.900
Mm-hmm. You know, his name has come across every now and again. I get, I get messages suddenly,
00:46:39.260
and a few people have messaged me about him. You need to have him on. Um, I've had him on several
00:46:44.480
times and the story that he tells, he's just like you. I mean, he was a liberal and now he's kind of
00:46:51.380
like, wait a minute, wait a minute. I don't think that's not what I bought into. This is, I'm on the
00:46:55.820
wrong side. Um, and, and he's, he's much more of a classic liberal, uh, very, very freedom minded,
00:47:02.920
but he has the inside scoop of what's happening with Zuckerberg and Facebook. He has, he has
00:47:11.320
evidence of, of laws being, uh, broken by Mike, uh, by Mark Zuckerberg himself. Uh, it's, it's
00:47:20.920
incredible. And no one in the media is giving him any attention. And, you know, his, his books,
00:47:27.700
you know, one of the first book is being made into, it was made into a movie and now
00:47:31.900
a TV show. Seth Rogen is in it. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, interesting, you know, yeah, I do.
00:47:37.140
I do know who he is. He's the guy that wrote the book about Oculus and some of the internal
00:47:41.140
documents that were going around. Yeah. Uh, I, I will talk to him for sure. And it's super
00:47:45.700
interesting. And you know, that actually brings up a good point, uh, something that I was sort
00:47:49.000
of tweeting about this morning is that the other thing that we're seeing right now, you know,
00:47:52.560
in a, in an age of fake news, it's not just sort of the nonsense that the media puts out
00:47:58.140
that, that fake news and the manipulation and, you know, quotes where they literally
00:48:02.560
take out the word, not at the beginning of the sentence or anything. It's also what they
00:48:07.500
refuse to report on. So for example, this week, you know, I'm sure you talked about it on your
00:48:12.220
show, but Brian Sims, the state rep in Pennsylvania, who was harassing those little girls outside of
00:48:17.760
the abortion clinic. It's like CNN did not even touch that story. And that is a type of fake
00:48:23.880
news that we need to be aware of. You know, that, that, uh, the Muslim school in Philadelphia,
00:48:29.220
where they were literally training jihadists, also in Philadelphia, it's like that wasn't touched.
00:48:35.980
And it's like, if you took the reverse of any of these, where this was a Christian school,
00:48:40.500
or it was a Christian man harassing somebody else or a Republican or a conservative doing any of
00:48:46.260
these things, if you just flip, if you flip the immutable characteristics on these things,
00:48:50.700
the media would be in an outrage. So we need to really recalibrate how, how we're looking at media
00:48:55.660
as a whole. It's why we, and that's of course, directly related to all the stuff we're talking
00:48:59.380
about with the tech companies. It's honestly why we have to talk to one another, because we just
00:49:04.920
assume that the Democrats that we might know, and I'm not talking about the, I'm not talking about
00:49:10.240
the activists. I'm talking about just the average Democrat that we know. We think that they know
00:49:15.280
these stories. And I did this with Riaz Patel, who is a guy who is, is very liberal. Um, and after the
00:49:23.040
election, I brought him in and I said, let me show you these stories. I just picked like 10 or 15
00:49:29.200
stories. This is why we were so upset at Barack Obama. And I gave him the stories and I think about
00:49:36.020
eight out of those 10 stories. And he's a well-informed guy he had never heard of. He had, he was like,
00:49:42.760
what is that? I don't even know what that is. And it was because of, of the editing of the truth.
00:49:50.120
Yeah. And this is the huge problem with, you know, look, we're all walking around with iPhones. We
00:49:54.260
have access to information in an absolutely unprecedented way, a way that I think 20 years
00:49:59.440
from now, there will be many, many studies written on how this changed the human mind and human
00:50:04.360
communication and all of these things. Uh, but you know, there, there is a risk here in that,
00:50:09.300
you know, 20 years ago when we had ABC, you know, CBS, NBC, you basically got the same stories
00:50:15.240
out of, out of the three networks, cable news interrupted and you had a little bit of a widening
00:50:19.320
of that. And now we live in a time where the, there's basically no safeguards whatsoever. Now,
00:50:24.420
I generally think that's a good thing. Uh, but the problem is that we're all catering it to
00:50:29.780
ourselves. And then yes, the good, because I believe, and I know you do too, there are still good
00:50:35.340
liberals out there. Um, but they, they are having the wool pulled over their eyes and they don't
00:50:41.140
hear these stories. And then, you know, then they see us, you know, sort of ranting and raving about
00:50:46.180
things and they go, ah, you know, they're, they're just nuts. You know, they're, they're aiming the
00:50:50.460
wrong way. And it's like, this is why what I've always said is if the media would just do a decent
00:50:55.660
job, they don't have to do a great job. They don't even have to do a good job. Truly. I mean this,
00:51:00.320
if they would have just, if they would just be doing a decent job so that I could wake up every
00:51:05.680
morning and look at Twitter and not realize that CNN either misquoted several people or, you know,
00:51:11.520
absolutely ignored a story or whatever it is. If they would just not do that, then the bunch of
00:51:16.420
us that are on the outside of this, uh, that are doing this in a YouTube space or in a podcast space,
00:51:20.940
we wouldn't have as much ammo. And I would actually prefer that. I would find something else to do with
00:51:25.700
my life. I wouldn't mind moving to a farm one day, you know? Yeah, me too. Me too.
00:51:29.700
Dave, congratulations. Thank you so much. We'll talk again.
00:51:45.640
Blake J. Harris on with us now. He is the author of the book, The History of the Future.
00:51:55.040
I am great. And in part, perhaps largely in part because of, of you guys and, and what you did for
00:52:02.840
me to help get the word out about the book a few weeks ago, it really, it's career changing and
00:52:08.760
therefore life changing because my life, my life is my career.
00:52:11.760
Yeah. That's, that's nice of you to say, but you deserve it. The book is fantastic. And if we lived in a
00:52:17.920
fair world, uh, it would have been reviewed, uh, and would have been everywhere, uh, because of the
00:52:23.800
information in it is phenomenal. Not only is it just riveting story about one of the greatest
00:52:29.000
entrepreneurs, uh, I think in, you know, in the last five years, at least, and there's, you know,
00:52:35.040
we're talking about Elon Musk and, you know, some crazy entrepreneurs, Palmer Luckey. He's this guy
00:52:41.380
who is, you know, was a kid and broke the code for, uh, VR and, and came up with Oculus.
00:52:49.380
What were you guys doing when you were 19 years old?
00:52:53.180
I certainly wasn't starting a multi-billion dollar company.
00:52:55.680
Uh, and so you started to do that story, uh, and halfway through the election happens and Palmer
00:53:05.300
is for Trump and all these things are started to be said by Facebook people and others, uh, about
00:53:13.480
Palmer. You know, those things aren't true. Uh, and you start to find out that some of the people
00:53:22.080
that you really had high hopes on and Facebook and, and Mark Zuckerberg were not what you thought
00:53:31.460
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, and that in particular, in two regards, one was with Palmer and the story
00:53:36.340
that I was covering, uh, you know, said Palmer posted that he would be supporting Gary Johnson
00:53:41.680
in the 2016 election. Um, which by the way, he did end up voting for Gary Johnson, not, not of his
00:53:48.800
own choice, but because it was suggested to him by the lawyers that because they had a trial coming
00:53:55.260
up, it would be best for him to follow through with your statement. I am not kidding you. So I
00:54:01.920
guess it, I guess it wasn't a lie that he was supporting Gary Johnson. It just wasn't his own
00:54:06.100
will since the statement had been written by Mark Zuckerberg. And you have to tell the story about
00:54:10.560
how you figured out it was not Palmer lucky. Cause this is, I, this is just a great piece of
00:54:15.520
journalism right here. Yeah, he wrote to me, I wrote you something and he writes to me and he's
00:54:22.440
like, by the way, uh, uh, this is because of the way you write your emails. This is how I figured out
00:54:29.240
that Palmer had not written that. I'm like, what? Yeah. So, so what that actually means is that most
00:54:37.620
people after the end of a sentence will use one space after a period, but, but people who grew up with
00:54:44.560
typewriters and for some reason, Palmer lucky use two spaces and you know, you use two spaces
00:54:49.640
and, um, and so Palmer's post in which he said he was going to be supporting Gary Johnson,
00:54:55.640
which was suspicious to me anyway, cause I knew we had talked so many hours about why he
00:55:00.500
supporting Trump. Uh, Palmer's post had one space, which was the first time on any of his Facebook
00:55:06.520
posts over the years that he had one space. So I thought that was suspicious. I obviously didn't
00:55:10.800
know at the time that the reason why was because Mark Zuckerberg wrote that and he had to post it,
00:55:15.100
but, but that was really what set me off. So that was like my, my one good Sherlock Holmes moment.
00:55:21.280
Um, and, and I'm pretty proud of noticing that one. Yeah. Can we be clear here though? By the way,
00:55:25.580
isn't, I mean, two spaces is the correct way, isn't it? Is it? I don't know. Yes, it is.
00:55:32.680
Two spaces is right. Yes. And I'll also, the reason I was so aware of that was because when
00:55:38.460
people leaked me emails, they oftentimes took photos of the emails and sent it to me instead
00:55:42.780
of forwarding it because I would create a paper trail. And so I would transcribe these things
00:55:46.400
and Palmer was often on the threads of when people would share stuff with me. So I was used to it,
00:55:50.100
but I would also say that John Carmack, who is one of the most brilliant people in the world and who
00:55:53.880
helped discover Palmer and is now at Oculus, uh, you know, he also uses two spaces. So I will probably
00:55:59.460
concede that when two billion people plus you guys, I'm doing it wrong, but it still grinds my gears.
00:56:07.940
It's just a little tap of one finger, man. I don't know why it's such an issue.
00:56:12.820
So can you go back to the beginning of this a little bit? And because it's one thing to say,
00:56:16.700
it's a great entrepreneurial story of a guy in a trailer coming up with something that
00:56:20.180
the best people in tech had tried to do for a while and had basically given up on at that point.
00:56:25.240
How on earth does he actually do this? What, how does he discover how to
00:56:29.420
crack this code? Well, part of it is exactly what you've said and that most of the people
00:56:33.280
had given up on it. So Palmer is a genius and a great entrepreneur and all that, but it is
00:56:38.940
partly just because he was one of, let's say less than a hundred people in the world who still cared
00:56:43.020
at cared about and believed in virtual reality. And so, you know, it seems shocking. I mean,
00:56:48.900
it just seems like such a, such a straight line sort of development when it comes to the way we're
00:56:53.260
immersed in everything. And he's not, he wasn't, he wasn't trying to crack it because I'm going to get
00:56:57.800
rich. He really believed in it. Well, that's really the thing that I think that you find with
00:57:03.720
most successful entrepreneurs or even the entrepreneurial side of writing is, you know,
00:57:07.880
I had seven years as a failed screenwriter. And then when I finally wrote something the first time
00:57:12.580
in my life, which was console wars, not for money, that was the thing that cracked because that was
00:57:17.020
passion fueled. And Palmer, he's a, he's a, he's a gamer at heart. And so he just wanted to step into
00:57:24.600
the screen and actually feel like he was in the game. So it was for his own selfish passion filled
00:57:29.320
reasons. And I was telling Glenn yesterday that the book starts in April, 2012, when he starts
00:57:34.860
Oculus and he connects with John Carmack and this whole crazy ride that ends with selling to Facebook
00:57:38.920
for $3 billion starts. But there's really a whole other story that is ignored by the three years
00:57:44.160
before that of how he cracked this code and why he did it and all that. But, you know, it's not
00:57:50.200
surprising in retrospect that he did because look what he's doing now. He has a new company,
00:57:54.040
Anderil, and they are coming up with great border solutions. They're in the defense,
00:57:58.120
the defense business. They're trying to bring technological solutions to it. So,
00:58:01.560
you know, lightning doesn't just happen to strike these people, you know, whether it's Elon Musk with
00:58:06.900
Tesla and SpaceX, you know, there's something about these kinds of people, whether it's their
00:58:11.260
brilliance, their ability to get other people on board. And Palmer Luckey is just one of those people
00:58:15.480
that I know for the next 50 years, he's going to keep dazzling us. It's most likely their
00:58:19.640
privilege. Um, but, uh, it's true because to me, and I think to you too, is, is the ultimate rags
00:58:26.540
to riches story. This kid living in a trailer. And I remember somebody once posted something like
00:58:31.800
that on Reddit. And there were people who said, Oh no, it's not a rags to riches story. He's in a
00:58:35.960
white male privilege. And I'm like, he could have been anyone. And when John Carmack reached out to him,
00:58:44.360
which set this whole thing in motion, John was reaching out to somebody, Palmer tech, that could
00:58:48.060
have been anyone. How could any of that have to do with something with this? But you're starting to
00:58:52.800
sound like a conservative and I apologize. Okay. So, um, uh, let me just talk about, uh, we were just
00:59:01.280
talking about Dave Rubin and about how he's being, you know, shut out and they're trying to shut him
00:59:05.700
down at YouTube. Um, Steven Crowder, the same thing is happening with him. Uh, you have,
00:59:13.600
you have had dealings with journalists in a completely different way. I mean, you,
00:59:19.960
you're a liberal, um, more of a classic liberal, I would think, but you considered yourself a regular
00:59:25.520
straight ahead. I've always voted Democrat since as far back as John Kerry. And then you, uh, things
00:59:32.020
have kind of changed for you because you're starting to see the same thing that we even found on our
00:59:36.760
side. Holy cow. Some of the people on our side really suck. I don't stand for what I thought we
00:59:42.560
all stood for. Um, and can you, can you go over some of the emails that you had? I brought some,
00:59:50.360
uh, some gifts. So there's a, I pulled these up because there's a great article on niche gamer by
00:59:55.820
Sophia Narwitz, who's a games writer. And she was curious about my interactions and dealings with
01:00:02.280
journalists. And to her credit was the only person who reached out to me about it. So I was happy to
01:00:06.680
share my experiences. And so I pulled up some of my emails from, from private conversations that I'd
01:00:11.640
had with, with game and tech journalists who I considered either friends or, you know, peers,
01:00:16.720
colleagues. I had a good relationship with them. And they were asking you about, okay, come on,
01:00:20.740
tell us he's really a racist or whatever. And, and you were answering them honestly, and they really
01:00:28.720
didn't have any intent of listening. Right. The one that I was telling you about yesterday was I,
01:00:32.440
I actually spent two hours on the phone with someone who I considered a friend. I mean, I was
01:00:36.320
spending two hours on the phone with him and he was asking if Palmer was a white supremacist. And I
01:00:40.320
said, I can't tell you what's in his heart, but as someone who knows him probably better than anyone
01:00:43.880
in the world, but his girlfriend, no, absolutely no. You know, you can go back to the start of
01:00:49.640
Oculus. The first three, three people he hired were an Asian guy and Indian guy and a bisexual guy.
01:00:55.840
Like, you know, he just doesn't care about that stuff. Um, and, and, and at the end of this call,
01:01:01.780
the person said, well, I guess I get what you're saying, but where's the smoking gun? I want the
01:01:05.740
proof that he's not a white supremacist. And I said, how can I give you the proof that he's not
01:01:09.640
something that he isn't? Um, and then here was a few, a few responses I got while just reaching out
01:01:15.440
privately to journalists after I had done this research and said for years. Yeah. And said,
01:01:20.600
you guys were wrong. Like you should correct your article or, or do you have any, like,
01:01:24.740
or tell me your pushback for why you think I'm wrong? Cause I don't want to publish this book.
01:01:28.220
If I'm missing something. And these articles were just to, to reset this part of it because
01:01:32.180
people had blamed him after he had come out and supported Trump. And it was not even a, in a major
01:01:37.700
public way, but he had made a small donation to one, uh, you know, a political organization
01:01:42.100
and had appeared at one rally where he wasn't hiding, but he wasn't like a main featured speaker
01:01:46.480
or anything. Right. The issue, the issue was largely that the organization he donated to people
01:01:51.840
would say, Oh, it was not just a harmless organization. This, this organization, Nimble
01:01:55.620
America, their plan was, uh, their actual plan was to put up billboards across America,
01:02:02.400
meme like billboards, just like more like younger, funny. Yeah. Certainly nothing offensive about
01:02:07.800
them, but people said, people interpreted that as that they were going to put up hateful,
01:02:11.600
that they had put up hateful memes across the internet. And this was a journalism error.
01:02:16.380
Like, I mean, like quite clearly put up one. It was not. Yeah. In the entire history of Nimble
01:02:21.900
America, they put up one billboard ever. And it was, and what did it say? It said controversially
01:02:27.480
too big to jail and had a picture of Hillary Clinton. The blaze radio network on demand.