The Glenn Beck Program - Best of the Program ｜ Guests： Russ McKamey, Bill O'Reilly & Megan Phelps-Roper ｜ 11⧸1⧸19

00:00:00.760 Hey, welcome to Friday. We have the McCamey Manor.

00:00:07.140 Well, we don't actually have the manor. We have Russ McCamey on.

00:00:10.100 He's the guy from the McCamey Manor.

00:00:12.440 If you've not heard about this, this is a place in Tennessee that Pat told me about yesterday.

00:00:19.400 And we started reading about it. We're like, I gotta get this guy on.

00:00:22.520 It's a freak show.

00:00:24.180 It is. There's over 80,000 people signing a petition to try to shut him down.

00:00:28.920 And it's supposedly the best haunted house in the world.

00:00:36.720 Scariest, most extreme.

00:00:38.100 Yeah, and no one's ever... He offers $20,000 to anybody who can make it.

00:00:43.100 No one makes it. We talked to him about it.

00:00:45.680 And it's really bizarre. Not as bizarre as our time with Bill O'Reilly today.

00:00:50.320 Or Megan Phelps Roper, who is a woman who was part of the Phelps family.

00:00:57.920 You know, the Westboro Baptist Church.

00:01:01.020 That and Sugar Bear, the pimp that, you know, killed his girlfriend.

00:01:06.520 No, he didn't kill her.

00:01:08.060 No, he just chopped her up and put her in the freezer. 1.00

00:01:11.080 Okay, alright. You're right, you're right.

00:01:12.820 You're right. He's being tried for murder.

00:01:15.820 But he testified just yesterday that he didn't kill her.

00:01:20.220 He just chopped her up.

00:01:21.420 This is a Friday episode you don't want to miss.

00:01:30.960 You're listening to...

00:01:33.200 The Best of the Glenn Beck Program.

00:01:39.340 Remember the Cheshire Cat in Alice in Wonderland?

00:01:42.780 And his most famous line,

00:01:44.600 We're all a little mad here.

00:01:46.860 Well, welcome to 2019 in America.

00:01:51.220 Congress is trying to impeach the president this week for...

00:01:55.740 Well, I don't know.

00:01:57.560 You know, they had to drop their attempt last week to impeach Kavanaugh baselessly.

00:02:03.240 So they could baselessly impeach the president this week.

00:02:07.380 They're basically squirrels, you know, or dogs that are like,

00:02:10.720 Squirrel! Squirrel! 0.90

00:02:12.400 They keep seeing a nut, something shiny in the wind, and they've got to move.

00:02:16.120 The constant assault on our Constitution, the rule of law, and liberty is something that is subsidized by many large corporations in the United States.

00:02:25.860 And your cell phone company may be among them.

00:02:29.040 Patriot Mobile.

00:02:30.000 You know, we've often said, you know,

00:02:32.000 I can't stop going to see movies because we're not making enough good movies, you know,

00:02:37.700 with a conservative or at least a common sense bent to it.

00:02:41.980 I can't boycott Hollywood.

00:02:43.640 I can't boycott Johnson & Johnson.

00:02:46.000 What am I going to do?

00:02:47.600 Well, you can.

00:02:49.300 You can replace your cell company and get the same great service at a fraction of a cost,

00:02:56.160 and you will ensure that your money is going for that service to a veteran-led company.

00:03:05.020 And they're not taking that money and spending it at Planned Parenthood, giving it to La Raza, giving it to anti-free speech movements.

00:03:14.900 They're giving it to the things that you believe in.

00:03:19.320 So now is the time.

00:03:21.400 Put your money where your mouth is.

00:03:23.760 Let your money do the work while you are on the phone.

00:03:28.440 Switching is really easy.

00:03:29.880 Go to PatriotMobile.com slash Beck or call them at 877-367-7524.

00:03:36.120 That's 877-367-7524.

00:03:40.260 Or just go to PatriotMobile.com slash Beck.

00:03:43.440 Switch today.

00:03:45.280 PatriotMobile.com slash Beck.

00:03:47.760 McKamey Manor, not your standard haunted house.

00:03:52.200 It's an audience participation event in which you, as an individual, will live your own horror movie.

00:03:59.520 You have to be in great health.

00:04:02.400 You have to be drug-free.

00:04:06.520 You have to have a doctor's slip, I believe.

00:04:09.280 You go through all kinds of things that you must complete, including a three- to four-hour release form.

00:04:20.220 And of all things, you also cannot swear.

00:04:25.720 This is the craziest thing ever.

00:04:30.200 Russ McKaney is the owner.

00:04:32.680 He's been doing it for about 30 years.

00:04:34.620 And there is actually a petition now to get him to stop doing it.

00:04:42.120 Nobody's hurt by it.

00:04:44.180 It's not any kind of sexual gratification kind of thing.

00:04:48.680 This guy used to be in the military and knows how to get to people.

00:04:57.140 And he is a fascinating individual.

00:05:00.160 Russ, how are you?

00:05:01.020 Do we have Russ on the...

00:05:05.580 I see him there.

00:05:06.500 Do we have him?

00:05:09.360 For some reason, we can't get him on the phone.

00:05:12.980 All right.

00:05:13.420 Can you call him back, please?

00:05:15.440 For some reason, our phones aren't working.

00:05:17.500 This is really going to piss me off.

00:05:19.900 Yeah.

00:05:22.000 There he is.

00:05:22.780 Russ, how are you?

00:05:23.980 I'm here.

00:05:24.580 Yeah, where are you guys at?

00:05:26.240 We're here.

00:05:27.240 We're just your worst nightmare.

00:05:28.760 No, actually, I can't.

00:05:31.920 I really cannot understand what's happening here.

00:05:36.000 Because everything I've heard about you is that you are a really good, normal, nice guy.

00:05:43.740 And yet, you bring everybody's worst nightmare to reality.

00:05:50.740 Yeah, they get kind of hysterical about this whole thing.

00:05:53.960 And I don't know what the deal is.

00:05:56.260 I mean, it happens every year around this time of the year.

00:05:59.520 You know, the whole shut McKamey Manor down.

00:06:02.200 But no, I don't get it either.

00:06:03.380 It's just that...

00:06:04.080 Well, I do get it.

00:06:04.940 So I make these crazy movies.

00:06:06.500 I make these wild YouTube films.

00:06:09.200 And they look scary because they're supposed to look scary.

00:06:12.000 I mean, I'm a filmmaker, so I'm trying to make it look as scary as possible.

00:06:16.660 And people just get really upset, blow things way out of proportion.

00:06:21.360 And now they're doing anything and everything to shut me down.

00:06:27.360 And I don't know if it's going to happen.

00:06:28.700 I mean, this is America.

00:06:30.340 This is, you know...

00:06:32.200 Well, look, Russ, here's the thing.

00:06:34.900 I am so intrigued by you.

00:06:38.400 So you're a fan of the show, are you not?

00:06:42.380 Yeah, absolutely.

00:06:43.180 Yeah, okay.

00:06:44.140 So you're...

00:06:45.660 I mean, a lot of people on the left would say that shows how sick you are.

00:06:49.500 But I'm fascinated by you because you are a...

00:06:54.060 You are a...

00:06:56.800 You don't seem to be doing this just for hype or for kicks.

00:07:01.240 You've never hurt anybody, right?

00:07:04.140 No.

00:07:04.660 Okay.

00:07:06.140 No, it's not that.

00:07:07.660 No one gets hurt.

00:07:08.400 It's very safe.

00:07:10.040 It just seems frightening when you're going through it.

00:07:12.900 It's all just a big show, a big illusion.

00:07:16.420 But I definitely have a few people kind of fooled into thinking it's something other than it is, I expect.

00:07:21.900 Right.

00:07:22.320 But you have been...

00:07:24.080 I've seen a video where you've buried a person except for their open mouth.

00:07:30.040 Well, yeah, of course.

00:07:31.180 Well, yeah.

00:07:32.120 Well, yeah, of course.

00:07:33.180 Of course, obviously.

00:07:34.260 You've got to put a cage over somebody's face and then bury them alive.

00:07:37.240 Yeah.

00:07:37.840 Well, obviously.

00:07:38.960 I mean, who hasn't done that before?

00:07:41.580 Right.

00:07:42.920 Right.

00:07:43.380 So I'm wondering...

00:07:44.820 Let's just start here.

00:07:48.760 Why do people do this?

00:07:52.860 They're just major adrenaline junkies.

00:07:56.080 These are people who have lived and they've done all the bungee jumping and skydiving and then all the exciting things out there and nothing really affects them anymore.

00:08:05.720 So they come to me like, oh, I really want to feel this again.

00:08:08.340 I want to feel what it's like when I wrote my first roller coaster or saw my first scary movie.

00:08:13.220 Help me out, Russ.

00:08:14.120 Help me out.

00:08:14.820 I'm like, okay, I can help you out.

00:08:17.320 That's bizarre.

00:08:18.360 So it's definitely not some sort of, you know, sexual thing.

00:08:25.320 There's none of that going on.

00:08:27.860 No.

00:08:28.400 In fact, there's three very, very big rules in the matter.

00:08:33.120 There's nothing sexual.

00:08:34.440 There's nothing inappropriate.

00:08:35.840 And there's nothing religious.

00:08:37.900 So we keep it.

00:08:38.540 There's nothing, you know, satanic or I mean, there's nothing like that in there whatsoever.

00:08:43.060 Never has been.

00:08:43.740 It's very PG-13.

00:08:45.900 It's like an Indiana Jones ride on steroids kind of, you know, and like you mentioned, there's no cussing.

00:08:51.060 I mean, how scary can it be?

00:08:52.720 There's no cussing.

00:08:54.060 Well, there's no cussing.

00:08:55.380 You are, you find, you, everybody starts with 20 grand.

00:08:59.360 And then I understand that if you cuss, you're, you're docked $500.

00:09:05.120 So there might be cussing, but they're penalized for it. 0.82

00:09:10.380 That's right.

00:09:11.080 That's right.

00:09:11.660 Okay.

00:09:11.960 You learn real fast.

00:09:13.180 Well, I won't say that anymore.

00:09:15.480 And so, yeah.

00:09:16.400 So now each of these are custom to each person?

00:09:21.640 Because aren't you just doing really enhanced interrogations?

00:09:28.260 Basically, yes.

00:09:29.560 And it's customized for that one individual or two folks that go through per week.

00:09:34.760 It's funny, you know, we talk to their parents or talk to their family and friends or the coworkers, and they're more than willing to throw them under the bus.

00:09:44.020 They're more than willing to give us all the dirt about what really scares them.

00:09:48.440 Wow.

00:09:48.480 And so we do a lot of investigative work to find out what's going to make a good show of that individual before anything starts.

00:09:56.140 So there's a lot to it.

00:09:57.300 It's not just showing up and going, okay, I'm here, Russ.

00:09:59.700 Torture me now.

00:10:01.200 You know, and I hate that word because no one's tortured anyways.

00:10:05.560 But, you know, that's what the audience seems to think.

00:10:08.540 And that's why that petition has gained so much speed, which is just incredible.

00:10:12.900 It's like 80,000 plus, you know, signatures now, maybe more than that.

00:10:18.340 It's over a haunted house, over somebody just doing a hobby.

00:10:23.820 It's not even a business.

00:10:25.200 It's just a little old hobby.

00:10:27.240 People pay you in dog food, right?

00:10:30.880 Dog food, yes.

00:10:32.200 One big bag of dog food helps towards the rest of the animals.

00:10:37.540 Yeah.

00:10:38.160 So that's it right there.

00:10:39.620 It is.

00:10:40.220 It's crazy.

00:10:41.280 Okay.

00:10:41.560 All right.

00:10:42.100 Let me just add to it.

00:10:44.080 Is there, I mean, if you go through enhanced interrogation, I know Navy SEALs and I know

00:10:51.100 people in the military who have gone through it for real, and it does psychologically scar

00:10:57.260 you.

00:10:59.620 Well, hopefully we're not scarring anybody.

00:11:02.160 It's not as intense as if you went to like SEER school, which is search and rescue and

00:11:07.280 survival school, that type of thing.

00:11:09.040 And our BUDS training, you know, which is SEAL training.

00:11:12.200 It's not like that, but I definitely do take aspects of what I learned in the military

00:11:18.380 after 23 years.

00:11:20.120 And it's just a lot of common sense.

00:11:22.320 I mean, you know, I do hypnosis, which everybody knows I do that, and I'm not hiding it from

00:11:28.280 the audience.

00:11:28.880 When they first come here, one of the first things on the contract is saying, you know

00:11:33.200 that I'm going to try to hypnotize you.

00:11:36.380 Now, I may not hypnotize everybody, but I'm going to give it my old college try here because

00:11:40.900 if I can do that, then they're like putty in my hands at that point in the game.

00:11:45.900 And so there is mind control techniques, but in a fun kind of way, not in fun.

00:11:51.180 That's what's so crazy about this is you, I've seen videos where this woman is just, 0.99

00:11:58.200 she looks like, and I know it's not, but she looks like she has blood all over her face. 1.00

00:12:02.620 She looks like she's in hysterics and she's got something in her mouth that's keeping

00:12:06.940 her mouth open and you're, and you're like, okay, it's about to get intense and you're

00:12:13.740 like, what are you okay with that?

00:12:16.860 Are you okay?

00:12:17.640 You seem like Santa that is bringing somebody through hell.

00:12:25.000 Maybe a little bit.

00:12:26.560 I'm always checking on people.

00:12:28.440 I'm always stopping the show to ask if they're mentally and physically okay to go on.

00:12:33.940 And that's what a lot of people don't see.

00:12:35.660 If you saw that little tidbit and that's probably a mistake in editing, but who knows?

00:12:40.200 I'm sure it's out there, but I do.

00:12:41.840 I'm always trying to make sure that people know and that the, that the person going through

00:12:47.040 knows that they're safe and they have total control.

00:12:50.020 They can stop the show anytime they want to.

00:12:52.940 This deal of not having a safe, safe word that ended several years ago.

00:12:58.140 Cause there was a time I have to admit that we didn't offer a safe phrase and they signed

00:13:03.060 up to go as long as we wanted them to go.

00:13:05.920 It's so entertaining.

00:13:08.540 But, but now, but now, yeah, there's absolutely a safe phrase.

00:13:12.660 So you would be fine, Glenn.

00:13:13.800 I think you might want to try this just as a, you know, no, what's the longest anybody's

00:13:19.560 gone since you've had the safe phrase, Russ, how long is, because you say the show can

00:13:25.340 last up to 10 hours, right?

00:13:28.980 Right, right.

00:13:29.760 So the way it works is that you have to start the clock.

00:13:33.360 You have to do an event, grab a key, open a door, do something to start the clock.

00:13:38.720 Once you start the clock, then your 10 hour meter is on, but nobody has even started the

00:13:45.500 clock yet.

00:13:46.560 Oh my gosh.

00:13:47.740 And that's not to say that people, yeah.

00:13:49.380 Wow.

00:13:50.120 Wait, wait, wait, you've buried people with their mouth open.

00:13:59.080 That's not on the clock?

00:14:02.300 You have to get to a certain point of being buried.

00:14:05.360 You have to have a certain depth, so to speak.

00:14:08.040 And once you get to a certain point, now the clock starts.

00:14:10.640 Now, I must say, there is one woman who's actually coming back here again in November. 0.74

00:14:17.920 She's been through it nine times, and she's this solid, upstanding individual, you know,

00:14:25.220 who works in Washington, D.C., and a big high player, and she just loves the stuff.

00:14:30.720 But we counted up how much time she spent inside the actual manor.

00:14:34.820 And she's been inside 45 hours of actually doing activities, 45 hours of doing different

00:14:42.640 things.

00:14:43.480 So, my God.

00:14:44.240 Is Elizabeth Warren?

00:14:45.320 There's a lot to see in it, dude.

00:14:46.860 Is Elizabeth Warren?

00:14:48.220 Nancy Pelosi?

00:14:49.460 Yeah.

00:14:50.980 Have you ever had like a Navy SEAL or Delta Force try this?

00:14:55.960 I have.

00:14:56.420 You have?

00:14:56.860 I have.

00:14:57.440 And they have not made it through, huh?

00:14:59.620 They have not.

00:15:00.800 They have not.

00:15:01.320 And I get a lot of military folks.

00:15:04.860 In fact, military folks are my favorite because they have their head on a swivel.

00:15:09.140 They know how to overcome and adapt.

00:15:10.780 They know how to, you know, they're not knuckleheads.

00:15:13.640 And this is definitely a non-knucklehead zone. 0.65

00:15:16.820 And, you know, we don't want the crazy ones.

00:15:18.740 We don't want the ones that are just trying to come here just for the money.

00:15:21.600 Because if you're coming here for the money, you're going to be really upset when you leave

00:15:26.120 here because you're not going to walk away with anything because the manor is always

00:15:29.580 going to win.

00:15:31.320 But in a fun way.

00:15:33.100 You know, it really is fun.

00:15:34.580 And that's why the testament to that is why people come back time and time again.

00:15:39.060 No, it doesn't sound fun.

00:15:40.440 No, it doesn't sound fun.

00:15:42.700 It just does.

00:15:43.520 I know.

00:15:43.620 I'm telling you, you've got to try it.

00:15:45.020 You've got to try it.

00:15:45.220 No, I'm not a candidate for this.

00:15:48.920 Let me hypnotize you.

00:15:50.560 Yeah.

00:15:51.560 All right.

00:15:52.460 Hang on just a second.

00:15:53.820 We'll continue with Russ McCamey from the McCamey Manor.

00:15:58.700 You follow it and find it at McCamey Manor dot com.

00:16:03.700 It is wild.

00:16:04.780 Netflix just did the movie on it.

00:16:08.440 It's it's pretty intense.

00:16:11.020 So Russ McCamey from McCamey Manor.

00:16:15.160 You're in Tennessee, a place called Summertown, which I believe the heat miser had to give

00:16:23.220 it to his brother so it could snow there one Christmas.

00:16:28.060 But you are you are.

00:16:31.160 How does the town react to you?

00:16:34.540 Oh, they oh, they they went crazy over me and they and they still do in a good way or a bad way.

00:16:40.620 In a bad way, at least at least the leadership.

00:16:44.320 You know, the leadership I first got here, they put out a community alert saying, get this

00:16:49.100 guy out of town.

00:16:50.080 This is where he lives.

00:16:51.100 Go get him.

00:16:51.840 You don't want him here.

00:16:52.660 You go tell him you don't want him here.

00:16:54.320 Basically, I had a target on my back for quite a while.

00:16:58.540 And then and then the town folk, they started kind of coming around my way.

00:17:03.540 They started meeting me and thought, this guy is OK.

00:17:06.160 It's not like what we thought he was.

00:17:08.620 But but the leadership's a whole different ballgame because they kind of put their neck

00:17:12.440 out there saying we're going to get him out of town no matter what.

00:17:16.380 And that hasn't happened.

00:17:17.500 So they're still looking for ways to to get me out of town.

00:17:21.640 Is that what happened to you in San Diego or did you did you just move?

00:17:25.280 No, no, no.

00:17:26.240 That's a rumor.

00:17:26.940 That's a rumor that OK.

00:17:28.320 Rumor that that probably I started because I like to start a lot of stories.

00:17:34.480 I love a guy who says I probably started.

00:17:41.000 Can't confirm nor deny.

00:17:42.860 Right.

00:17:43.520 Right.

00:17:44.120 Yeah.

00:17:44.840 Right.

00:17:45.040 OK, so now let me give you some things.

00:17:47.420 The petition claims that you hire employees with violent histories and you make people

00:17:53.380 ingest pills that cause hallucinations.

00:17:57.280 Right.

00:17:57.880 Well, first off, there are no employees because it's just a little old rust.

00:18:01.360 So you come to the manor.

00:18:03.340 There is nobody here except me against the contestant.

00:18:07.480 That's it.

00:18:08.000 My noggin against their noggin. 0.92

00:18:09.820 And their job is just not to let me get in their head.

00:18:12.880 So that's not true.

00:18:15.520 In San Diego, we had some actors.

00:18:18.420 But as far as what their backgrounds were, I have no idea.

00:18:21.860 Never heard about violent histories or whatever.

00:18:24.480 So that's a nice little story.

00:18:27.200 The the pill situation.

00:18:29.680 Again, here's here's where people have to put on their logic caps.

00:18:32.620 And I know it's hard to do sometimes or certain folks always want to sign that silly petition.

00:18:37.260 But if I was really, really doing things that were illegal and giving medication to people and torturing people and doing this and that, that would be illegal.

00:18:48.620 I don't care where you're at.

00:18:50.220 That's not allowed.

00:18:51.200 So there must be something more to the situation.

00:18:55.000 And that's where the hypnosis comes into play.

00:18:57.220 Because if I hypnotize you, like I was saying earlier, I can make you believe whatever I want.

00:19:02.920 And that's the magic of the manor.

00:19:05.180 Without giving too much away, just kind of add two and two together and realize that if that all this stuff is going on that's in the petition, I wouldn't be here right now.

00:19:14.700 I'd be locked away in the Birk Cage Theater someplace.

00:19:17.560 I'd be gone.

00:19:18.220 The petition says this.

00:19:19.940 You're literally running, literally, I'm quoting, a kidnapping and torture house.

00:19:24.440 Some people have had to seek professional psychiatric help and medical care for extensive injuries.

00:19:31.600 Jeez.

00:19:32.820 I know.

00:19:33.360 Sounds amazing.

00:19:35.660 It's good PR, but that's about all it is.

00:19:38.840 But they can write.

00:19:40.180 It just goes to show you they can write whatever they want.

00:19:42.380 And what they're doing is they're just taking their own thoughts based upon movies that are five, six, seven years old that I made back in San Diego.

00:19:51.520 They're not basing anything upon the reality of what it really is.

00:19:56.200 And, in fact, every show, before every show, I call the police.

00:20:00.180 I let them know what I'm doing.

00:20:01.920 I volunteer for them to come down and watch the show anytime they want to.

00:20:06.780 Law enforcement, the district attorney, anybody can come here unannounced, anytime they want to, with cameras in hand, film everything they want.

00:20:15.780 But no one ever does.

00:20:17.000 So no one's ever taken me up on my offer to actually see what I do.

00:20:22.000 Instead, they do things like the petition.

00:20:24.080 All right.

00:20:24.360 So if you wouldn't mind hanging on just a couple more minutes, I want to talk to you about how you design these things.

00:20:33.580 You know, some of the weirder things that you've had to do to freak people out and get them to not win the $20,000.

00:20:41.540 Also, the four-hour waiver process, what that's all about when we come back.

00:20:48.660 So we have Russ McCamey on.

00:20:51.200 He is the owner of McCamey Manor, McCameyManor.com.

00:20:55.080 You might have seen an episode on Netflix of Dark Tourist that is really quite frightening.

00:21:03.240 And you'll see, you know, you'll see military guys go through, and they won't make it an hour with Russ.

00:21:09.700 And they're tough guys.

00:21:11.320 It is, it's truly a frightening haunted house, if you will.

00:21:17.340 Well, he's on with us now.

00:21:19.780 You know, is water, waterboarding is considered torture, right?

00:21:25.380 Right, right.

00:21:26.760 Actual, real waterboarding is torture, correct.

00:21:29.400 You do a form of waterboarding, though, don't you?

00:21:32.760 Well, I mean, there is a lot of water at the Haunt.

00:21:36.080 It is a, it is a water ride, for sure.

00:21:39.380 Water ride.

00:21:40.380 You know, so it's like going to the water park, it's all.

00:21:44.000 So, and, because water is, it's a great way to, to motivate people.

00:21:50.680 Now, we have, we have, we've done waterboarding here at the studio.

00:21:54.520 Pat and I waterboarded Stu.

00:21:56.920 With Ensure.

00:21:58.040 Yeah, we used Ensure.

00:21:59.300 But it was too chocolatey.

00:22:01.000 He couldn't handle it.

00:22:02.100 He couldn't handle it.

00:22:03.060 He, he thought, he thought he could handle it with the chocolate opposed to water, but

00:22:08.180 it was just too chocolatey for him.

00:22:10.660 Uh, we, we have a guy on staff, uh, who is trained in enhanced interrogation techniques.

00:22:18.340 And he said, A, that, when I told him you were on this morning, he said, oh, I'd never go

00:22:26.920 because you're never going to win.

00:22:29.840 You can't, there's no way to win.

00:22:31.900 Everyone breaks.

00:22:33.580 True?

00:22:34.540 Right.

00:22:35.220 Yeah.

00:22:35.500 True.

00:22:35.820 Absolutely.

00:22:36.840 He says he knows because, um, he will neither confirm nor deny.

00:22:41.840 Uh, but I, I, I know some, you remember the hairy back guy from, uh, from, uh, Al Qaeda 0.99

00:22:49.520 that we got years and years ago.

00:22:51.520 Sheikh Mohammed.

00:22:52.020 Yeah.

00:22:52.500 He was, he was at least around the area when they were talking to that guy.

00:22:58.540 Um, and, uh, and, and I'd like to send him with a bag of dog food just because I'm a

00:23:04.240 good employer, uh, and, uh, put him through your course to see how long he lasts.

00:23:10.580 Sure.

00:23:12.320 We can do that.

00:23:13.140 All right.

00:23:13.500 Absolutely.

00:23:14.240 All right.

00:23:14.500 Now, let me ask, let me ask you this, Russ.

00:23:17.780 Uh, you had really tough guys.

00:23:21.460 What is the, what's the shortest amount of time somebody has lasted, um, in, in, in the

00:23:30.120 manner who was a tough guy or thought he was a tough guy?

00:23:34.760 Oh, that's, that's easy.

00:23:36.400 Uh, I'd say half the people quit during the contract.

00:23:39.380 So they don't even get inside the manner.

00:23:41.800 So these rough and tumble guys, once they read what's coming down the pike for them, they're 0.99

00:23:46.900 like, no, I don't think so.

00:23:49.000 I'm, I'm done.

00:23:49.980 I really, so is that part of it?

00:23:52.300 Is that part of it is the, is the release form.

00:23:55.440 Is that part of the psychological workup?

00:23:59.820 Absolutely.

00:24:00.440 And that's also where I do all the hypnosis too, because I'm not, I'm not so good that

00:24:04.840 I can hypnotize somebody in five seconds.

00:24:06.740 Like some people can, I need several hours with them.

00:24:10.040 I need to really get inside their noggin.

00:24:11.900 I need to do all the repetitive words.

00:24:14.220 I need to do all the things, all the tricks that it takes to hypnotize somebody.

00:24:17.880 I need that time.

00:24:19.260 So I'm not so good that I can just click my fingers and you're hypnotized.

00:24:23.740 So time is important.

00:24:25.620 Time is on my side.

00:24:26.760 And that's why, that's why when you first get there in the morning, you're, you're, you're

00:24:30.380 there at, you know, like 10 AM and you're there until sunset.

00:24:34.540 And then when, uh, when the sun goes down, the fun begins.

00:24:37.640 So I've got, this is also wearing, this is also wearing people down.

00:24:42.460 So by the time they hit the manor, you've already worn them out.

00:24:47.980 Absolutely.

00:24:48.620 Cause we do a lot of physical activities during the daytime.

00:24:51.760 I call it kind of, kind of a mini bootcamp.

00:24:54.720 And this way, this way it's important because I need to know what type of physical activities

00:24:59.200 and they can do what they can't do.

00:25:01.680 So I'll have them hold their breath underwater, you know, in a nice way, not, not in a violent

00:25:06.780 way, but I'll just say, well, how long can you hold your breath?

00:25:08.940 These are things I need to know because there is breath holding inside, you know, whether

00:25:14.520 it be dirt or whether it be water you're going to deal with.

00:25:17.760 Um, I need to know these things.

00:25:19.460 So during the daytime portions, that's when I'm finding out what their limitations are.

00:25:24.720 And then I'll work around that.

00:25:26.080 Cause the last thing we want to do is have anyone get hurt.

00:25:28.820 So I really need to know where they stand physically before they roll inside the real 0.66

00:25:34.540 show.

00:25:34.820 What is the, what is the most common fear?

00:25:39.020 And what is the, what is the fear that you thought, wow, I'm, I have, I'm going to have

00:25:45.580 to work on that one for a minute.

00:25:46.940 The most common fear is definitely water.

00:25:51.440 Water is a great equalizer for sure.

00:25:54.860 And because there's so much of it being used, it's always on you.

00:25:58.160 You're either cold or, but you know, if it's hot outside, you're glad the water's on you,

00:26:02.760 but you're either getting cold or you're just, you're just wet and comfortable.

00:26:06.080 It's not always in your face, but, but you're always wet and it just drains you.

00:26:12.660 It drains your body after hours and hours of having a big, heavy onesie on.

00:26:17.880 Cause everybody has to wear these crazy onesies, like a bunny rabbit or a cow or something.

00:26:23.100 You gotta be something, you gotta be something silly when you're inside the haunt.

00:26:27.260 It just looks so goofy on film, but there's also a reason why I do it because it weighs you

00:26:33.120 down. You get those big old suits all full of water and it's hard to move.

00:26:37.840 It's just another, another means of tiring you out. Absolutely.

00:26:41.860 And what is the, have you, have you met with anybody that you thought

00:26:45.840 this one's going to be hard to crack or this person's fear is unusual?

00:26:52.120 I did a few weeks ago.

00:26:54.100 We had a war veteran who lost both his legs, the double amputee.

00:27:00.780 And I thought, how in the world am I going to put this guy through the show?

00:27:06.060 But he is a really motivated young man who is a rock climber.

00:27:10.640 One of those really athletic guys, you know, he weighs 170 pounds,

00:27:15.280 solid as a rock, but he's got no legs.

00:27:18.640 And I thought, should I even do this?

00:27:20.620 And I thought, you know what?

00:27:21.500 He's so motivated and it's so inspirational that I was like,

00:27:25.940 I couldn't say no to him.

00:27:27.180 And this guy just kicked it.

00:27:29.740 This guy was great.

00:27:31.340 He did everything we needed him to do.

00:27:33.200 I didn't need to dumb down the show whatsoever.

00:27:37.040 Eventually I think the water and just fatigue is what got to him,

00:27:41.120 but he held in there just as long as the big rough tough guys with all their

00:27:47.660 extremities.

00:27:48.420 It was incredible.

00:27:49.280 I mean, really inspirational.

00:27:50.960 I've never seen anything like it.

00:27:52.360 So men break slower than women. 0.96

00:27:54.580 No, no.

00:27:57.740 Women are much stronger. 1.00

00:27:59.560 Oh, no, by the part.

00:28:00.800 Because it's mainly psychological, right?

00:28:04.400 Absolutely.

00:28:05.280 Yeah, the women have a much higher tolerance to my little shenanigans than the 1.00

00:28:12.220 guys do.

00:28:13.080 Why is that?

00:28:13.700 They don't fall for it.

00:28:14.780 Why is that?

00:28:15.400 You know, I just think women are tougher overall, right? 1.00

00:28:18.740 We all have women in our lives and they're just tough. 1.00

00:28:21.400 Come on, we have to admit, guys, women are tougher than we are. 1.00

00:28:25.540 We know that.

00:28:26.800 So for being honest with ourselves, they go through some really amazing ordeals in

00:28:34.260 their life and things that a lot of guys would say, no, I don't think so.

00:28:39.040 And I think that there's a lot, I think there's something to girls.

00:28:42.700 I've had girls, I've had boys, uh, in the, at raising them, girls are mean, girls are 1.00

00:28:50.520 mean to each other when they're in, you know, their teen years, they go through some really

00:28:56.100 nasty things, uh, in school years.

00:28:59.160 Yeah, I agree.

00:29:01.300 They're, and they're very competitive.

00:29:02.860 I mean, they're much more competitive than the guys are.

00:29:05.120 The guys are like, but the women are like, no, this is serious, Russ, bring it on, bring 0.99

00:29:10.760 it on, Russ.

00:29:11.300 We're doing this right now.

00:29:12.240 And do you use, do you use animals?

00:29:16.160 I do.

00:29:16.940 Lots of spiders and snakes and scorpions and rats.

00:29:21.640 And rats?

00:29:23.060 A lot of bugs, a lot of, yeah, little rats, but they're, they're field mice, but field

00:29:27.660 mice, field mice are worse because they're smaller, they're quicker, and they love to

00:29:32.180 get inside your clothes.

00:29:33.440 Oh.

00:29:33.940 So as you're, you know, and then they stay in there.

00:29:37.000 And so now you're, you're walking, you're walking around the rest of the day with field

00:29:40.100 mice in your little outfit.

00:29:41.800 And they're just, you know, yeah, yeah.

00:29:43.980 That's what I say.

00:29:45.580 Oh my gosh.

00:29:47.180 Could you make it through?

00:29:48.280 Do you think?

00:29:49.060 Could you make it through your own show?

00:29:51.660 Yeah, because I, because I know how it works.

00:29:54.400 Yeah.

00:29:54.620 But if I didn't know how it, if I didn't know how it worked, then no, no.

00:29:59.480 So no one's going to make it through, you know, just be really clear with that.

00:30:03.220 And that's why when people come here, they need to come here for the right reason, because

00:30:07.120 they want to, they want to push themselves and they're, and they're coming here just because

00:30:10.860 it's entertainment.

00:30:11.540 And it really is fun and a testament to that.

00:30:14.220 No, it doesn't sound fun.

00:30:15.180 It doesn't.

00:30:16.020 You know, it sounds fun for, you know, honestly, if you watch like Mission Impossible and you

00:30:20.820 see, and, and, you know, I don't know, I don't imagine that there are very many people, if

00:30:25.620 any people like this, where, you know, he's, he's rock climbing without any rope or anything.

00:30:33.320 And he gets his thrills doing that because his life is so crazy.

00:30:39.060 If those people really exist, I could see those people saying, oh, I want to go through

00:30:44.100 this.

00:30:46.020 They're out there.

00:30:47.040 I mean, they fly in from all around the world to take on this little challenge.

00:30:50.920 It's amazing.

00:30:51.500 It's not a local thing, but the locals don't go, the locals have smartened up like, no

00:30:55.800 way I'm not doing that.

00:30:56.820 But all these folks are flying from around the world, you know, across the pond and it's

00:31:01.500 amazing.

00:31:01.880 They spend all this money to get here.

00:31:03.960 They, they spend their vacation time to get here.

00:31:06.400 So, so I, I kind of, I'm hard pressed.

00:31:09.000 I have to give them a good show because this means a lot to them.

00:31:12.360 Do they sell the dog food at the airport?

00:31:15.260 Cause that's what I would do.

00:31:16.300 I would set up a little dog food stand there at the airport.

00:31:19.020 It's your dog food here.

00:31:22.380 Russ, has, has there, has there, has there ever been a person you thought was going to

00:31:26.780 make it that you thought, okay, maybe, maybe they can go the distance.

00:31:31.100 Never.

00:31:31.740 No.

00:31:32.160 Wow.

00:31:32.920 Never.

00:31:33.460 How many people do you turn away?

00:31:36.880 Oh my gosh.

00:31:37.940 I turn away thousands and thousands because the waiting list is, I can't even, I can't

00:31:43.980 even comprehend what it is anymore.

00:31:45.360 Or in fact, it's so big right now, we have to go to a lot, a lotto to win a ticket here.

00:31:51.360 Especially since all this craziness, you know, that's one thing that these petition people

00:31:54.860 don't get.

00:31:55.640 All they did was just gain more attention to the manner and made it more popular.

00:32:00.560 I just hope that nothing crazy does go on because you know, it is life, liberty and

00:32:05.420 pursuit of happiness.

00:32:06.160 And this is just a hobby.

00:32:08.480 It's like saying, you know, Glenn, you like flying remote control airplanes.

00:32:11.940 Well, you're no longer allowed to do that, Glenn, because we don't like what you're doing.

00:32:15.740 And it's the same thing.

00:32:17.840 Nobody is getting hurt.

00:32:19.180 It's not what the petition says whatsoever.

00:32:21.300 So it is frustrating because I have people coming out of the woodwork.

00:32:25.200 You know, this weekend I have an inspector coming out now.

00:32:28.600 They have to inspect for fire safety now.

00:32:31.480 And there's no fire safety codes, but they're just doing whatever they can do to kind of

00:32:35.840 harass at this point in time.

00:32:38.060 You only charge dog food for doing this. 0.97

00:32:42.440 This is something that, you know, you're doing it part time.

00:32:46.440 Are you really actually a wedding singer as your full time job?

00:32:52.380 Well, kind of as a part time gig.

00:32:54.980 Yeah.

00:32:55.300 Like if you there's a movie on Netflix called Haunters, the art of the scare.

00:33:00.040 That's a really good movie.

00:33:01.000 That's a feature documentary.

00:33:02.180 And it stars stars me.

00:33:05.560 And there's also the dark tourist one.

00:33:07.920 But but Haunters is a feature film.

00:33:10.780 And it's got me doing the wedding stuff out there.

00:33:13.380 Yeah.

00:33:13.660 If you if you go to DJ party dot org, you'll see me in all my glory out there, entertaining

00:33:19.680 folks and stuff.

00:33:20.620 So.

00:33:21.420 So how scary can I be?

00:33:22.880 I'm a wedding singer.

00:33:23.980 Come on.

00:33:26.720 Bizarre.

00:33:27.520 It's just bizarre.

00:33:29.040 Russ, it's really good talking to you and best of luck.

00:33:32.180 The best of the Glenn Beck program.

00:33:42.480 Hey, it's Glenn.

00:33:43.460 And you're listening to the Glenn Beck program.

00:33:45.440 If you like what you're hearing on this show, make sure you check out Pat Gray Unleashed.

00:33:49.740 It's available wherever you download your favorite podcasts.

00:33:53.880 Mr. Bill O'Reilly from BillOReilly.com and the author of the new book, a new book called

00:34:01.220 The United States of America, According to Trump.

00:34:05.920 Welcome, Bill O'Reilly.

00:34:07.460 I want to start with this.

00:34:09.920 You've done an updated message of the day, which is 10 ways the impeachment process is

00:34:16.260 hurting every single American.

00:34:18.420 Let's start there.

00:34:19.800 All right.

00:34:20.220 It's the United States of Trump.

00:34:22.020 I know it's a complicated thing.

00:34:23.680 It is.

00:34:24.480 I didn't read it.

00:34:25.780 I haven't seen it.

00:34:26.920 You read it and refer with Pat and Pat will tell you.

00:34:31.780 You see, if I was, if I want your listeners to know before we get into the heavy duty stuff,

00:34:37.180 if I were advertising on Beck, the United States of Trump, paying him money, he would

00:34:43.280 be, he would know the title and he could tell you the title backward.

00:34:48.380 Nope.

00:34:49.480 He'd be sitting in the book.

00:34:51.860 You're the one that still wrote the book.

00:34:53.920 Wait, you're the one who still wrote the book.

00:34:55.880 I wrote the United States of Trump.

00:34:58.280 Right.

00:34:58.780 But I mean, in this, in this scenario where I'm doing advertising, you're paying me to

00:35:03.680 do it.

00:35:04.060 And you are the author of the book.

00:35:06.380 Yes.

00:35:06.980 And I am telling everyone that you would not boot the title of the book.

00:35:11.500 Nope.

00:35:12.280 If you were being paid.

00:35:14.120 You are wrong, Mr. O'Reilly.

00:35:16.040 But let's get, let's get to the, let's get to the 10 things on how the impeachment is,

00:35:21.000 is actually hurting the average American.

00:35:23.080 Yes.

00:35:24.200 There's nothing good about this.

00:35:25.680 Number one.

00:35:26.240 And if you see other people celebrating impeachment, you need to just pull them aside and say,

00:35:34.060 do you understand that we all are in this together in this country, that we have to have

00:35:40.980 a functioning federal government trying to solve vexing problems, that we must have

00:35:46.500 a robust economy to support 330 million people, most of whom want to improve themselves.

00:35:54.140 Do you understand that destroying the office of the presidency, not just the president, but

00:36:01.060 the office of it is counterproductive to freedom?

00:36:04.620 Do you understand any of that?

00:36:07.000 And you'll get silence because this isn't the way impeachment is being presented.

00:36:12.640 This is awful.

00:36:14.740 You know, I said earlier this week, Bill, that this impeachment, the, all of the so-called

00:36:22.320 evidence that they're presenting on TV is not evidence.

00:36:25.080 And this is really reminiscent of the glove in OJ Simpson's case.

00:36:30.080 African-Americans wanted OJ Simpson to be innocent.

00:36:34.560 So it would be a win for them because of history of, you know, blacks getting crushed by the 1.00

00:36:41.260 system.

00:36:41.760 They wanted this guy to beat the system.

00:36:44.620 And so the glove was, it didn't have really anything to do with the evidence.

00:36:49.860 They had bloodstains and drops in his car.

00:36:52.580 They had DNA evidence, everything else, but the glove gave them permission to say, yep,

00:36:58.100 he's innocent.

00:36:59.220 And the same thing, jury, certainly jury, uh, thought that, right.

00:37:04.280 But the same thing is happening here with this, this phone call is giving permission to people

00:37:10.020 who want Donald Trump to be out.

00:37:12.900 It's giving them an easy way of, even though it's not based on any fact of, yep, we win.

00:37:19.140 He's out.

00:37:20.340 Sure.

00:37:20.860 And that's what it's all about.

00:37:21.920 The destruction of Donald Trump.

00:37:24.580 Um, and whether it's Russian collusion or impeachment or whatever, they'll come up with

00:37:30.920 next abuse of power.

00:37:33.540 It is a game now.

00:37:35.680 It's a game.

00:37:36.740 All right.

00:37:37.160 So someone's going to have actual board game like monopoly.

00:37:41.020 And then you roll a dice and then you'll stop on a square and the square will say, Trump

00:37:48.380 did this.

00:37:49.460 Okay.

00:37:50.160 It's ridiculous.

00:37:51.880 Now I'm not in the business of defending Donald Trump, even though I wrote a book on him,

00:37:56.420 a fair book.

00:37:57.120 It's not a pro Trump book, but I'm in the, by the way, if you're looking for a great book

00:38:02.180 to read, uh, bill wrote that book, uh, called, uh, the country according to the president.

00:38:07.320 Yes.

00:38:08.080 Okay.

00:38:09.160 Um, the little red book by Mao Zedong.

00:38:12.460 There you go.

00:38:13.600 All right.

00:38:14.300 All right.

00:38:14.740 Go ahead.

00:38:14.900 Um, so I'm in the business of trying to improve America and I've always been in that business

00:38:24.060 and that's why I'm successful.

00:38:25.540 So whether it's a books or commentary or radio, whatever it may be, and I'm seeing this as

00:38:31.920 number one, a division in the country now based on hatred of one individual.

00:38:38.720 Now there is a system attached to the individual.

00:38:41.340 I understand that.

00:38:42.040 But when you've got a guy like Adam Schiff, by the way, I, I am counting my, um, trick

00:38:47.800 of treats.

00:38:48.400 I went as Adam Schiff last night and it was not easy getting a shirt three sizes too big.

00:38:55.420 Not easy.

00:38:56.320 Right.

00:38:56.880 Well, I did it.

00:38:57.860 Yeah.

00:38:58.120 Good for you.

00:38:58.680 I scared every urchin. 0.98

00:39:00.220 Urchins were screaming. 1.00

00:39:01.480 Blood.

00:39:01.760 That is crazy.

00:39:02.820 So did you, did you see the, uh, news that we know, we think we know who the whistleblower

00:39:07.660 is now?

00:39:08.520 I know.

00:39:08.960 I reported last night.

00:39:10.060 We know.

00:39:10.600 Yeah.

00:39:10.820 It's a 33 year old Yale guy who's a hate Trump guy who worked, uh, in the deep state

00:39:17.660 and still is in Langley, Virginia, um, who was associated with Biden and with other people

00:39:24.800 and has two best friends working for Adam Schiff.

00:39:27.720 And so it's a total con.

00:39:29.600 It's a total con.

00:39:30.400 I haven't heard anything about him in for three weeks.

00:39:32.680 Yeah.

00:39:33.200 And you know, it's interesting.

00:39:34.200 You know, it's interesting, uh, Bill is, uh, he is connected with Chalupa who was, who's

00:39:40.100 a main figure on our chalkboard.

00:39:42.260 And, uh, we did the chalkboard, uh, about a month ago, five, I think it was five days

00:39:49.760 later is when they said, yeah, we're don't worry about that.

00:39:53.360 We've got another whistleblower.

00:39:54.720 And as we find out now, this guy, this guy is connected directly to the storyline of

00:40:03.400 our chalkboard.

00:40:04.320 He is evidence that it's true.

00:40:06.700 If this were a criminal case, we'd have been thrown out.

00:40:09.680 Yeah.

00:40:10.360 We'd have been thrown out.

00:40:11.300 Everything's gone because the original complaint is a fraud.

00:40:15.100 So it's gone.

00:40:17.540 What does it say to you that yesterday, not a single Republican voted for this big time

00:40:22.360 for a win for Trump.

00:40:23.760 And the reason is that there are senators like Romney and Murkowski who hate Trump, hate

00:40:30.580 him and would vote to remove.

00:40:33.880 Now they can't because if they do, they'll be blackballed by their own party.

00:40:38.840 And, uh, I think it would make me happier.

00:40:42.400 Yeah.

00:40:42.960 Okay.

00:40:43.360 I mean, look, politics, politics, but I was surprised.

00:40:46.840 I thought there would be a couple of Republican congressmen, uh, to vote for the inquiry.

00:40:52.080 Remember, this was a vote to continue the inquiry, to continue compiling evidence of a possible,

00:41:00.060 uh, misdemeanor and high crime.

00:41:02.060 Not one person, not one witness is said that it is a crime, not one.

00:41:10.280 So that is in bold in Donald Trump.

00:41:12.400 So let me give you some inside info.

00:41:13.960 Cause you know, I know him pretty well.

00:41:15.780 I'm very good sources.

00:41:17.220 So there was a big meeting after the vote in the white house.

00:41:22.840 And why I shouldn't say big, because there aren't a lot of advisors in there.

00:41:26.580 And he doesn't trust Mulvaney.

00:41:27.960 Mulvaney is going to be gone and, you know, a matter of very short time.

00:41:32.460 Mulvaney's out.

00:41:33.480 Um, so there's a meeting about five or six people he trusts.

00:41:37.680 And they basically sat around and they said, look, um, now let's let this go forward because

00:41:43.860 we have Nunez and this is a big key, um, that every American should know.

00:41:49.840 We Nunez is stronger than Schiff.

00:41:51.880 So Nunez is the minority guy on the house Intel committee.

00:41:58.160 All right.

00:41:58.520 Devin Nunez from California.

00:42:00.380 He's stronger than Schiff.

00:42:02.660 So it's him and Schiff that will direct the questioning.

00:42:07.120 Nunez and Schiff.

00:42:08.440 And then in the summaries and the, and the leaking to the press, it's Nunez and Schiff.

00:42:13.880 Nunez will be on Fox news every second of every day.

00:42:17.460 All right.

00:42:18.560 And so they're, they believe that Nunez is going to kick Schiff's butt all over the place.

00:42:24.280 And this is going to directly lead to the reelection of Donald Trump.

00:42:28.260 So they're happy.

00:42:30.060 This is the first time that the president's been relieved.

00:42:33.560 I mean, last time we talked last week, I said I was worried about him personally, um, because

00:42:38.940 it was taking some emotional toll on him.

00:42:41.220 But now he's almost buoyant in the sense that he believes this whole thing has turned after

00:42:47.680 yesterday's vote.

00:42:49.380 I would agree.

00:42:49.900 I think this week was a turning point in this.

00:42:52.280 Um, and I think it's going to get worse and worse for the Democrats.

00:42:56.500 Um, with one exception, what do you think is going to happen with John Bolton?

00:43:02.580 Because very interesting.

00:43:04.120 Yeah.

00:43:04.240 They keep, they keep holding him out like, oh, he's, he's going to be the, the death knell

00:43:09.440 for, uh, I, I don't, I don't know the ambassador that well, I never used him on the O'Reilly

00:43:16.360 factor, not once.

00:43:18.480 And the reason I didn't use him very smart guy, very smart was because he, I knew what

00:43:26.160 he was going to say.

00:43:27.120 I knew it.

00:43:27.960 I mean, it was, there was never a surprise, never a nuance.

00:43:32.520 He was, he wasn't a, he was not a guy who was parroting, uh, a lot of other people.

00:43:38.220 I mean, hard right view of foreign policy.

00:43:42.140 Correct.

00:43:42.720 All right.

00:43:43.140 And, and I didn't, I didn't use any hard left people either.

00:43:47.060 I never did.

00:43:48.740 Um, so here's the dilemma for John Bolton.

00:43:53.660 Bolton, you can't assume that he has any regard for Donald Trump.

00:43:58.900 We can't assume that.

00:44:00.000 I mean, he doesn't like him because it didn't end well in the white house.

00:44:03.560 But if he goes in and crushes Trump and he could, he could, he's dangerous, um, in the

00:44:11.500 sense that he knows a lot of things, um, he will alienate himself from his entire ideological

00:44:18.660 structure.

00:44:19.380 He will be a pariah in this country.

00:44:22.140 I think he's, he's on that road already.

00:44:25.400 And he knows that he, there's not going to be any, anywhere for him to speak, speaking

00:44:31.260 engagements, no book audience for him, no comeback on Fox news, none of that.

00:44:38.700 So he cuts himself off.

00:44:41.380 Now the Trump administration has anticipated the worst.

00:44:45.820 They don't know.

00:44:46.700 Nobody knows what Bolton is going to say.

00:44:49.800 So the, the counter to Bolton is Pompeo.

00:44:54.620 And you saw that this week as well.

00:44:57.500 Pompeo came out and said, look, I was on the call and we didn't deviate out from what our

00:45:02.420 policy for the Trump administration is.

00:45:04.740 So they'll put Pompeo up against Bolton and Pompeo is strong.

00:45:09.700 Remember XCIA chief.

00:45:11.580 All right.

00:45:12.360 Strong.

00:45:12.880 So does this boil down bill really to, um, an extreme disagreement in the policy of the

00:45:25.560 state department and the state department just saying we don't work for Donald Trump, even

00:45:29.460 though they do, we don't work for Donald Trump and Donald Trump's not going to get involved

00:45:33.540 and the state department engaging in some really nasty stuff over in the Ukraine.

00:45:39.280 Well, the state department now is very simpatico with, with president Trump.

00:45:46.480 I mean, there's Pompeo is a secretary of state.

00:45:48.800 They're buds.

00:45:49.680 Yeah.

00:45:49.900 No.

00:45:50.240 Yeah.

00:45:50.680 I mean, I mean those long-term players, for instance, they don't have any access other

00:45:57.080 than, uh, leaking, whatever.

00:45:59.820 There, there are two people that Donald Trump deals with, uh, every day, vice president Pence

00:46:06.400 and Pompeo, those are the only two.

00:46:09.780 And they're both very loyal to him.

00:46:12.680 And as long as they stay there, as long as he has them, he can use them to go out and,

00:46:19.820 and negate a Bolton.

00:46:21.460 Now, as for your question about the state department and the justice department and everybody else,

00:46:27.000 they all hate Trump.

00:46:28.500 They hated him from day one.

00:46:30.260 All right.

00:46:30.940 And that's why you saw the whistleblower.

00:46:32.780 Yes.

00:46:33.100 This guy was, was working to undermine Trump from the very beginning.

00:46:38.320 Oh, he's the guy who said that, uh, that, uh, Putin and Trump, um, you know, Putin told

00:46:43.700 Donald Trump to fire Comey.

00:46:45.400 He's the guy who started all of that.

00:46:47.160 This guy is, is, is an activist.

00:46:49.220 He's an activist.

00:46:50.300 Very bad.

00:46:50.860 Very bad.

00:46:51.400 But shrimp, uh, Schiff is in trouble because he went to Schiff because his two best friends

00:46:56.000 work for him.

00:46:57.160 I mean, he's really bad.

00:47:00.940 This is the best of the Glenn Beck program.

00:47:14.500 Hey, it's Glenn.

00:47:15.820 And if you like what you hear on the program, you should check out Pat Gray Unleashed.

00:47:19.960 His podcast is available wherever you download your favorite podcast.

00:47:23.780 Hi, it's Glenn.

00:47:24.700 If you're a subscriber to the podcast, can you do us a favor and rate us on iTunes?

00:47:29.180 If you're not a subscriber, become one today and listen on your own time.

00:47:33.620 You can subscribe on iTunes.

00:47:35.160 Thanks.

00:47:36.000 When you say, uh, at least 15 years ago, Hey, can you name a really horrible divisive group?

00:47:45.560 You could probably say, uh, yeah, Westboro Baptist church.

00:47:49.740 Oh yeah.

00:47:50.640 But now we are all kind of, we're kind of turning into that.

00:47:54.200 We see that everywhere.

00:47:55.340 Now we see people screaming these things at each other.

00:47:59.880 America has become an online version in many cases of the Westboro Baptist church, not necessarily

00:48:06.540 screaming the same things, but being just as vile and mean and, and, and awful.

00:48:13.380 Well, Megan Phelps, uh, she's a writer and an activist and a former member of the Phelps family member of the Westboro Baptist church.

00:48:26.280 And she joins us now.

00:48:27.540 She has a new book, uh, called unfollow.

00:48:31.000 Welcome Megan.

00:48:31.920 How are you?

00:48:33.000 I am wonderful.

00:48:33.960 What about you?

00:48:34.660 I'm good.

00:48:35.660 Good to have you on the program again.

00:48:36.940 Uh, first of all, can I ask you, um, the, you kept the name Phelps, your Megan Phelps Roper and Phelps is one of those words, you know, like we say, your name is mud around here. 0.84

00:48:51.700 That because that's, that's because the guy who was helping John Wilkes Booth, his name was mud. 0.94

00:48:57.060 The doctor was mud.

00:48:59.540 Phelps is kind of one of those names.

00:49:01.200 Why'd you keep it?

00:49:01.940 I kept it because I wanted to reform it, you know, not my name, Megan, Megan Phelps Roper for a very long time.

00:49:09.860 It meant, as my family would say, God hates fags. 1.00

00:49:12.880 And I didn't want it to mean that anymore.

00:49:14.880 I wanted to, I wanted to change.

00:49:16.800 I wanted to take it back.

00:49:17.700 And, you know, I, my husband, my husband recently, we've been talking about, you know, we want to start a nonprofit at some point.

00:49:23.960 And he had the idea of calling it the Westboro foundation, because I want people when they hear Westboro to not think of people who celebrate.

00:49:32.520 Tragedies and death, but people who are there when tragedies happen to help people who are suffering.

00:49:38.180 I mean, in some ways, it's what Chip and Joanna did for Waco, Texas.

00:49:41.860 But it was, I mean, that wasn't, that wasn't personally them.

00:49:47.320 Right.

00:49:47.760 And, and you have a, I mean, you, you were, you were there on the front lines.

00:49:52.920 Tell me, tell the audience, I know who you were, but tell the audience who you were and how you changed.

00:49:58.360 Oh, so Westboro Baptist Church was started by my grandfather, and it's almost entirely my extended family.

00:50:05.220 So my mother was the de facto spokesperson for a very long time.

00:50:09.440 And I was right there.

00:50:11.520 I grew up right at her elbow.

00:50:13.060 I'm her, you know, I'm the third of 11 children.

00:50:15.440 I'm her oldest daughter.

00:50:16.520 So, you know, she called me her right hand.

00:50:18.800 And I was right there in the middle of it.

00:50:20.580 I was, I was a hardcore believer, a zealous believer in everything that Westboro taught.

00:50:26.700 And I defended them in the media.

00:50:29.360 I was the one who took our message to social media initially and, you know, helped with all of the logistical work, you know, orchestrating the protest.

00:50:38.500 So I was not, I was not, you know, as I put it, I said I was all in.

00:50:42.880 That's how I felt.

00:50:43.620 And then before you, before you change, before you talk about how you changed, was there ever any discussion like, hey, guys, I don't think this is working.

00:50:55.900 This approach is not working.

00:50:57.700 Was there ever any discussion like that?

00:51:00.560 No, because for Westboro, you know, they do not use conversion numbers as a metric of their success.

00:51:06.640 They don't believe that, you know, changing hearts and minds is in their power because they believe in predestination.

00:51:12.140 So only God can change someone's heart.

00:51:14.600 And so we, we basically saw our, you know, we measured our success as the amount of publicity that we were getting.

00:51:21.300 Because all we were trying to do was publish this message that we thought was the word of God.

00:51:26.640 So, and so from that perspective, we were very successful.

00:51:29.960 We were all, I mean, you know, pop culture phenomenons, you know, True Blood, that, you know, really popular series on HBO.

00:51:35.860 So the opening credits included, you know, God hates fangs, you know, which is part of our, you know, just a play on our God hates gays message. 0.86

00:51:45.620 But so it's, you know, for them, they just, that's, they weren't trying to change people's minds.

00:51:51.240 And that's why they, to change, the idea of changing tactics didn't even occur to them.

00:51:57.560 And when people would insist that they should, that it was biblical for them to change tactics, for us to change tactics, we basically just dismissed them out of hand.

00:52:05.860 So, Megan, when, when you are away from this now, and your eyes have been opened, and you, you know what you were part of, and your family is a part of, and you know, you know, what's, what's true and what's not.

00:52:26.640 How difficult is it for you to look at our society today, and to see what people are doing online, on air, everything, and, and not just cry out, you fools, what are you doing?

00:52:44.040 Well, I can't say you fools, because I, I was exactly where so many people are now.

00:52:50.560 I know, I know how seductive that, that way of seeing things is, you know, the, the appeal of absolute certainty.

00:52:58.300 You know, the, it, my grandfather used to say that it was, there's something wonderfully liberating in the idea that, in the notion, the knowledge, that you are 100% right.

00:53:08.900 And he believed that.

00:53:09.900 He believed that we were 100% right, with no possibility of error, because we, again, we had the word of God.

00:53:16.560 And, and so when I see this, you know, this, this spirit, kind of the same spirit taking over, you know, the Westboroization of, of politics and American culture generally, I know, I know why people are drawn to it.

00:53:30.900 And, and I understand the group dynamics that lead people to it, but I also know, you know, how incredibly destructive it is to see the world that way, and how, how ineffective it is to try to, to change hearts and minds to, to, to come to, you know, collective, to compromise, how difficult that is to do when you have completely demonized anyone who doesn't agree with you on everything, anyone who steps outside of the party line on any, on any notion.

00:53:58.700 It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's not good.

00:54:01.740 It's, it's interesting, because I, I wrote in one of my books, I think it was my last one, where I said, the only thing I am now certain of is that I'm not certain of anything.

00:54:10.740 It is our certainty that is, is dividing us.

00:54:14.280 Um, and it, it, it's, it feels, it feels different than what you went through, because you see, and you claim what's happening over here is evil.

00:54:30.840 And, and I know the difference between good and evil, and this is just, this movement is evil, but that's what you guys thought.

00:54:40.840 Mm-hmm, yeah, and that's the thing, it's, if you are only looking at things from your perspective, you know, you're, you're, you are looking at, at, at current events in light of your, your own experiences.

00:54:52.820 And if you cut yourself off from trying to understand why other people have come to different conclusions, if you just attribute it to, you know, this person is evil, they are ill-intentioned, you, you are immediately cutting yourself off from really understanding that person and what has led them to those conclusions.

00:55:10.020 Right, and it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't mean that you, um, are going to change your point of view or, uh, or, uh, that you're not necessarily on the right track.

00:55:22.580 But you don't understand that you are limiting, um, yourself by not listening to how other people got there or viewed it, because they are going to teach you something.

00:55:36.080 Uh, and if you close yourself off to that, you end up alone, right?

00:55:41.420 Yeah, absolutely.

00:55:42.320 And there, you know, there is this instinct that I think is very human.

00:55:45.500 You know, when, when we encounter people that we believe are doing and believing destructive things, the instinct that we have is to isolate ourselves from them.

00:55:53.440 You know, we don't want to endorse them.

00:55:55.320 We don't want to have any part with what they're involved in.

00:55:57.960 And again, I think that's very, a very human response.

00:56:01.400 Um, you know, you're trying to shame them into changing.

00:56:04.060 The problem is that when the divide is as great as it is now in, in so many different spheres, you know, I was talking to an anthropologist last year, uh, and she, she explained the feeling of shame.

00:56:15.500 As, you know, the feeling that we get when we know that we have violated the norms of our community.

00:56:20.800 And so, you know, for me, Westboro was my community and I didn't have any community outside of that.

00:56:26.480 I felt completely alienated from the rest of the world.

00:56:28.840 It was this very us, them mentality.

00:56:30.700 And so when other people, outsiders attempted to shame me, I, I felt pride.

00:56:36.200 I was, I, I was happy that they, that they thought I was wrong because I thought they were evil.

00:56:40.400 So clearly it just reinforces your sense of righteousness.

00:56:44.260 What's the difference between this and moral relativity?

00:56:49.080 Uh, I, I think you're, I don't believe that you have to like have no opinions about things.

00:56:54.980 Like, I, I don't think that you have to say, well, I can't, when you said, um, certainty is the root of this.

00:57:01.320 For me, I, I, I totally agree.

00:57:03.740 This toxic sense of certainty in your own righteousness.

00:57:06.220 It's not, it's not that you don't have opinions or that you don't have strong values and strong beliefs.

00:57:11.120 It's that you hold them a bit more loosely because you understand that there is information and experiences outside of your own, which are necessarily limited, uh, that can and should change the way you see things.

00:57:25.040 We have to be willing to listen because, not because we are, are trying to, you know, say that, okay, white supremacy is okay or, or whatever the, whatever the specific issue is.

00:57:34.520 Um, it's that, what is that, what, what, what is in this that I can learn from and how can we build a bridge from where they are to where, where I am?

00:57:44.220 So show us how, uh, we need to change our behavior.

00:57:48.780 You know, your book is called, uh, unfollow, uh, and you're not necessarily saying disengage from social media.

00:57:57.900 Um, you, because at least I don't think, uh, because that's, that's what, that's what changed you was somebody using social media in the right way.

00:58:07.880 So what's the right way to approach this or another way?

00:58:12.700 Yeah. So I, I, on, I gave a TED talk a couple of years ago about this. This was, I think the last time I was on, um, that it was basically detailing these strategies that, um, that people used with me.

00:58:24.680 So the first was to don't assume bad intent, because again, you need to understand what is actually motivating this person.

00:58:31.340 And I think very few people are actually deliberately trying to do things that they know are evil or wrong.

00:58:37.440 They have somehow become convinced that this is the right way.

00:58:40.960 And so you need to understand where they're coming from if you're going to actually reach them.

00:58:45.620 Um, the second is to ask questions, partly again, to help you understand where that, where they are, where they're coming from, but also partly as a signal to them that they're being heard.

00:58:55.360 And so, and, you know, there's, there's this reciprocal thing that happens where, you know, somebody, you ask them questions and they, they go through their whole position.

00:59:03.360 They explain it all to you and then they get to the end and there's this natural, you know, sense of reciprocation often where they want to know what you think, where are you coming from?

00:59:11.500 And it's not asking questions, it's asking honest questions.

00:59:15.520 It's asking questions of, I want to know, not questions that will get them to change their mind, because I'm going to have a, I know the answer to this one.

00:59:24.160 Right, yes.

00:59:25.000 Okay.

00:59:25.320 And then the third is to stay calm, which is, you know, as you see in conversations on social media, on television, all over the place, it's really difficult, right, it seems like right now to be able to stay calm in these discussions, because we, these are conversations about deeply held values and disagreements that we, we cannot fathom how somebody has come to a different place.

00:59:47.100 And so if we can be very intentional and deliberate about keeping, you know, keeping the, the hostility level as low as possible, trying to acknowledge, you know, that the other person is, is coming from a place of genuine disagreement and to be, be able to tolerate that.

01:00:03.060 Like this is, you know, embodying the value of tolerance.

01:00:06.320 I think it's really important.

01:00:07.360 So that's the third step.

01:00:08.560 And then the fourth is to make your argument.

01:00:11.440 You know, and again, this is one of those things that sounds very obvious, but when we have these deeply held values,

01:00:17.100 there is this, you know, this sense that anybody that is a decent person would have already come to the same conclusions that I have.

01:00:25.860 And so we, we end up not actually articulating the defenses and the arguments for our position.

01:00:31.380 So we actually need to do that.

01:00:33.260 And then, you know, I think I mentioned this last time too, the fifth point that I would, that I would say that was not in my TED talk because I ran out of time, but it would be to be patient.

01:00:43.340 Because people don't change these kinds of deeply held values overnight, like in a moment, like even, even though I can look back in my own experience to how my mind changed over time.

01:00:53.940 I can point to several moments where I absolutely became aware that there was a contradiction in what I believed.

01:01:00.020 And what it caused me to do was kind of to shut down momentarily, right?

01:01:05.420 And that's what happens to human beings as we, you know, this cognitive dissonance, like to finally come to the place where we understand, wow, maybe there is something wrong with my position.

01:01:15.600 Maybe I need to reconsider this.

01:01:17.120 And if you push that, you know, if you try to use that as a gotcha moment, that's, people react very negatively to that.

01:01:24.560 Exactly. It pushes you deeper into your position.

01:01:28.700 Megan, I think you're a remarkable, remarkable woman.

01:01:33.580 And your message is so powerful and, and right on the money and right for this time.

01:01:40.580 I urge everybody in the audience to read this and share this with people.

01:01:45.900 What she lays out is, look, what we're doing isn't working.

01:01:50.500 We have to change tactics.

01:01:52.180 And I think she has a remarkable message.

01:01:55.620 The name of the book is Unfollow, Megan Phelps Roper.

01:02:00.160 Unfollow.

01:02:00.820 It's available wherever you buy books currently.

01:02:03.920 Thank you so much, Megan.

01:02:05.000 God bless.

01:02:06.080 Thank you.

01:02:06.460 Thank you.

01:02:06.860 You bet.

01:02:07.660 The Blaze Radio Network.

01:02:12.000 On demand.

The Glenn Beck Program - November 01, 2019

Best of the Program ｜ Guests： Russ McKamey, Bill O'Reilly & Megan Phelps-Roper ｜ 11⧸1⧸19

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