The Glenn Beck Program - Best of the Program ｜ Guests： Russell Vought & Douglas Murray ｜ 5⧸9⧸25

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00:00:15.000 Today's a podcast, so you need to hear all of it.

00:00:17.360 You can get the full podcast wherever you get your podcast.

00:00:20.500 This is the best of, and the best of today, we talk about the Pope.

00:00:25.500 John Henry Weston is with us.

00:00:27.760 He is a Catholic over in Rome who knows the ins and outs of this current Pope.

00:00:33.500 Tell me about him, the American Pope.

00:00:35.960 Also, Russ Vogt from Washington, D.C.

00:00:38.380 as they're preparing the new bill, the big, beautiful bill for Congress.

00:00:42.820 When is that going through?

00:00:44.200 What is the status on it?

00:00:45.460 What is the status of our debt and the cuts?

00:00:48.560 And this talk about raising the taxes on the rich.

00:00:52.460 And one of the most important voices, I believe, of our time, Douglas Murray,

00:00:56.540 joins me on today's podcast.

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00:02:27.740 Hello, America.

00:02:29.000 You know we've been fighting every single day.

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00:03:12.860 You're listening to the best of the Glenn Beck program.

00:03:26.960 Welcome to the Glenn Beck program.

00:03:29.920 We're so glad that you're here.

00:03:31.520 We have John Henry Weston on with us.

00:03:33.640 He is the co-founder and CEO of LifeSiteNews.com.

00:03:37.300 He is over in Rome right now.

00:03:39.720 He was there when they announced the new pope, an American pope.

00:03:44.860 I don't know why that scares me just a little bit.

00:03:48.780 You know, would you like fries with that?

00:03:53.500 Anyway, maybe it's because I know all the elites in the United States.

00:03:59.900 Not so good.

00:04:01.280 Not so good.

00:04:01.980 But anyway, I don't know anything about this guy.

00:04:08.300 But the guy who does know is John Henry Weston, and he is here with us now.

00:04:13.080 Hi, John.

00:04:13.560 How are you?

00:04:15.940 Very good to be with you, Glenn.

00:04:17.440 I am literally standing in front of St. Peter's Basilica.

00:04:21.460 We're a sunny day, and it is unbelievable what just happened.

00:04:26.540 We're walking around while the announcement was being made, and the crush, like, to walk

00:04:31.720 around, you had to, like, excuse yourself through people.

00:04:34.420 You were in a crush of a crowd, kind of like a rock concert.

00:04:37.000 Yeah.

00:04:37.240 But it was everywhere.

00:04:38.340 It was all the streets filled, and no one knew he was an American, because he didn't

00:04:41.800 speak a word of English during the announcement from the Logia Nato.

00:04:45.200 I know.

00:04:45.640 I know.

00:04:46.200 And he speaks perfect English.

00:04:47.300 He's American-born.

00:04:48.220 He's a Chicago boy.

00:04:50.020 So how are you feeling about that one?

00:04:52.360 Is it just me that's like, I don't know?

00:04:57.340 I mean, you know, Bishop Strickland would be good.

00:04:59.580 I'd go for that one.

00:05:00.760 But what do we know about this guy?

00:05:04.160 Okay, so this is where it gets scary.

00:05:06.880 So in the Catholic world, Bishop Strickland was the bishop, the holiest bishop in the whole

00:05:13.100 church in America.

00:05:14.120 Everybody knew it.

00:05:15.180 The guy spent three hours of prayer a day in church.

00:05:18.420 That was apart from his mass.

00:05:20.000 In other words, the service that he himself says.

00:05:23.100 So everybody knew he was the holiest.

00:05:25.320 He got removed, though, because he was, well, he went up against the machine.

00:05:31.700 Francis was going anti-Catholic in his teaching on all sorts of issues, including, you know,

00:05:37.740 fooling around with abortion, contraception, homosexuality, divorce.

00:05:41.740 So all of it was going offline.

00:05:44.240 And Strickland was one of the only ones who spoke up.

00:05:47.300 And, you know, he is a, you know, a guy from Tyler, Texas, like middle of nowhere.

00:05:52.180 Even if you're in America, have you heard of Tyler?

00:05:56.000 And so, you know, the poor guy, he gets removed.

00:06:00.400 Now, the problem is, when you're a holy bishop like that, you attract people.

00:06:06.480 There's a story about the Courier of ours.

00:06:07.960 You guys can look up.

00:06:08.840 And it's wonderful, you know, Hodunk Town, middle of nowhere.

00:06:12.620 And they built trains to it because they sent this holy priest there.

00:06:15.860 Bishop is the same.

00:06:17.760 700 families moved to Tyler, Texas, if you can believe it.

00:06:22.600 Wow.

00:06:23.000 And they, you know, and there was all sorts of priests, all sorts of religious orders moved there.

00:06:28.320 And then he was yanked from them.

00:06:30.680 So, super sad story.

00:06:33.500 But, unfortunately, and much more so even now, it was done with the cooperation of our current pope.

00:06:41.880 The reason being is our current pope was then the head of the Congregation for Bishops

00:06:46.240 and was involved in doing an investigation on Strickland and in removing him.

00:06:53.520 And you might think, oh, was there anything really wrong with Strickland?

00:06:56.300 No.

00:06:56.760 He had the best numbers in terms of per capita seminarians.

00:07:00.440 His financial situation was in great shape, like the rest of them aren't.

00:07:04.760 And, you know, there was just great things going on in the diocese.

00:07:09.660 Unlike most places, they don't have any sexual abuse scandal or anything like that.

00:07:13.700 What they had was a great bishop.

00:07:15.120 But he was a holy one, and those holy ones are used to making noise sometimes.

00:07:19.000 So, my podcast, Tomorrow That Comes Out Everywhere, is with Bishop Strickland.

00:07:24.120 And we were talking during, when the smoke started, and we were recording this podcast.

00:07:30.300 And so, he asked, when we get the name, he's like, what was the name, what's the name, what's the name?

00:07:36.160 And I told him, and he said, oh, he was the head of the Council of Bishops.

00:07:41.040 And I said, what do you know about him?

00:07:42.400 And he said, well, you know, there's some things that he's done that I don't necessarily agree with.

00:07:46.980 But he did not.

00:07:48.620 I mean, honestly, I got the impression he really didn't know much about him.

00:07:52.500 There's no way he didn't know about this guy, right?

00:07:57.100 Well, yeah.

00:07:57.860 He also knew.

00:07:59.080 He's just being kind.

00:08:00.100 He would regard it, true, and he would regard it as worse than him.

00:08:04.960 He wouldn't even think of himself in this scenario.

00:08:07.760 But what's worse, well, from his perspective, is that he elevated, that Francis elevated Cardinal McCarrick.

00:08:17.620 Excuse me.

00:08:18.680 That's a Freudian flip, honestly.

00:08:22.120 McElroy to Washington.

00:08:25.280 And this is the thing.

00:08:26.820 That also had to be done with the current Pope.

00:08:30.560 So, now there's going to be a excuse, because he sees right away, look, that is Pope Francis' will.

00:08:35.620 What could you do with it?

00:08:36.280 You're the underling.

00:08:37.300 If you object, you're just going to get turfed anyway.

00:08:40.300 Okay. 0.81

00:08:41.040 Let's say that makes you kind of weak anyway.

00:08:43.720 But let's just say that's it.

00:08:46.080 That's why the number one sign all of America, in fact, all the world, should be looking for is the restoration of Bishop Strickland.

00:08:55.600 Bishop Strickland is still young for a bishop.

00:08:57.640 There's no way he can be retired.

00:08:59.940 He's a young man, and he's for a bishop.

00:09:04.380 He's like 65.

00:09:05.700 And so, he has to be restored.

00:09:08.300 If you want the true signal, the one sign that will indicate where Pope Leo XIV is coming from, watch Tyler, Texas, or wherever he's put.

00:09:19.100 Because if that man is not reinstated, there's something really wrong.

00:09:24.140 Wow.

00:09:24.640 What else do you know about him?

00:09:26.660 I mean, are there any good signs that maybe he's going to be different?

00:09:35.080 Well, there's this.

00:09:36.300 Okay, so when – if you look up in history, there is a pope called Pius IX.

00:09:42.560 He came in actually as kind of a liberal.

00:09:45.840 Once he got elected, he – and there was a bit of trefuffle in the world, especially in Italy.

00:09:54.240 He converted.

00:09:55.440 He had – he became Orthodox.

00:09:57.520 He became – in fact, he became one of the most Orthodox popes.

00:10:02.600 He made – he worked against all heresies.

00:10:05.980 Wait, wait, wait.

00:10:06.760 Is that Pius – is that Pope – is that the Pope Pius IX?

00:10:10.700 Was that the one in the 20th century?

00:10:14.160 No, that was before that.

00:10:15.640 Okay.

00:10:16.340 He's the one before that.

00:10:17.900 Okay.

00:10:18.160 That was Pius X you're thinking of.

00:10:19.820 All right.

00:10:20.100 But what – what that tells us is the grace of the office can change the man, because literally all the world's Catholics pray for the pope.

00:10:29.560 So, you know, he gets bestowed on him this huge responsibility in office and position, if you will.

00:10:35.900 Well, and it's unlike a political position.

00:10:40.320 It's a position established by Jesus, and he said – Jesus said to the first pope, to Peter, you know, I will pray for you.

00:10:48.280 So it's a very, very specific kind of a role.

00:10:51.060 So there's a great hope when it comes to the pope and the possibility of change, even for a weak man, because all men are weak.

00:10:59.280 And yet he's called to fulfill almost a supernatural task, you know, to be the vicar of Christ on earth, the representative of Jesus for Jesus' church.

00:11:09.740 He's not – he's not some kind of alter Jesus.

00:11:13.240 He is just the representative of Jesus' church. 0.65

00:11:16.700 And so he's – that's why the pope is not about making his own rules.

00:11:20.540 He can't change anything to do with the religion at all.

00:11:24.160 He's just there to enforce it, to bring unity in the faith, and that – there's only unity in the truth.

00:11:32.280 So he's there to basically uphold the truth of the faith.

00:11:34.640 Well, but you do know – I mean, you know this, you're Catholic, and so you know this, but, I mean, look at the change that John Paul made in the world.

00:11:46.060 I mean, it was Margaret Thatcher, Ronald Reagan, and Pope John Paul that ended communism.

00:11:52.820 And we just don't have those kinds of leaders.

00:11:55.240 And this particular now pope has been railing against Donald Trump.

00:12:01.400 So it's not exactly, like, he's friendly to Donald Trump or what Donald Trump is doing.

00:12:08.100 Yeah.

00:12:08.720 And it's funny because he's a registered Republican in Chicago.

00:12:12.160 Is he really?

00:12:12.940 Which that's – yeah.

00:12:14.960 So that's kind of odd.

00:12:16.520 But at the same time, he's anti-Trump.

00:12:19.800 So what does that mean?

00:12:21.260 It didn't strike me as healthy, particularly because – hey, if you look at his last tweet before he became pope,

00:12:27.380 it was from, like, April 15th, you'll see it's bashing Trump's immigration policy.

00:12:32.920 It's a retweet of somebody else bashing Trump's immigration policy.

00:12:36.300 So that's pretty bad.

00:12:38.060 He's real bad on immigration.

00:12:39.940 And, you know, most of the bishops in the U.S. are – they either don't get it or choose not to get it,

00:12:44.840 or they want to show favor with Francis, who knows?

00:12:46.920 But he seems to be on the same page.

00:12:49.480 Also, when it comes to things like COVID, there was very few people, honestly, Glenn, though,

00:12:55.240 who were on the right side of the COVID thing, which is now plain and clear, but back then wasn't.

00:13:01.340 So, you know, he was fully masked, talking to the media.

00:13:04.300 He was back and forth about how you should receive Holy Communion in the hand,

00:13:08.640 which actually should be disastrous for Catholics.

00:13:10.940 I don't know how that went down.

00:13:12.020 He wanted confession by phone call, which doesn't even work.

00:13:14.680 So those are oddities as well.

00:13:18.260 But, you know, there were some signs of hope.

00:13:20.700 Yes, about anything hopeful.

00:13:21.900 There was.

00:13:22.720 So when he got out there on the loggia for the first time,

00:13:26.360 Francis was like in his liturgical underwear relative to what this guy did.

00:13:30.480 This guy went back to the traditional vestments of a pope when you get out there,

00:13:35.200 because these are thousand-year-old traditions.

00:13:37.940 Francis basically threw them out and just said, no, I'm going to do my own thing.

00:13:40.820 He went back to it.

00:13:42.320 So that was interesting.

00:13:43.000 That's good.

00:13:43.100 He said lots of it in Latin.

00:13:46.260 And then he did something really neat.

00:13:49.000 So you know how in the Bible it says, at the name of Jesus, every knee shall bow and every head shall bend?

00:13:54.020 Yeah.

00:13:54.420 Well, he did that.

00:13:56.440 He was praying, and at the name of Jesus, you could see, if you look at the camera close, you'll see,

00:14:00.580 he just slightly bows.

00:14:03.440 And I thought, wow, that's the highest practice of many, many Catholics and Christians,

00:14:08.700 a scriptural understanding where they literally do what the scriptures say,

00:14:11.900 bow their head in the name of Jesus. 0.51

00:14:13.760 And then he did something else that I thought was really neat.

00:14:17.180 He went to give his first blessing as pope.

00:14:20.540 And, you know, it's in Latin because there's every country in the world standing out here,

00:14:24.820 and Latin's the one language that everybody understands.

00:14:26.620 And he gives him his blessing, and he starts to tear up as he gives him the blessing.

00:14:32.160 I thought, you know, signs of hope and hopefully signs of conversion and whatnot.

00:14:39.220 And so we'll see.

00:14:40.480 There is hope that way.

00:14:42.120 And there's other things that you could say he was not nearly as far left as my son.

00:14:50.020 So, yes, there's hope.

00:14:52.040 And, you know, that's what we're at. 0.96

00:14:54.500 Well, the mood in Rome, what was it like when everybody realized, oh, crap, he's an American? 0.99

00:15:02.320 I mean, nobody expected that. 0.97

00:15:04.580 He didn't.

00:15:04.880 I don't think that happened until today when everybody went home and realized.

00:15:09.440 Because the guy's Italian's perfect. 1.00

00:15:11.320 His Spanish is perfect.

00:15:12.520 He was in Peru for the longest time.

00:15:15.040 And on the loja, not a single word of English.

00:15:18.900 The first time English came out was today.

00:15:21.160 Today, in his first mass as pope, all the way through, going through the mass,

00:15:25.340 and a lot of Latin and very chant.

00:15:27.160 And so for your American audience, for most of the audiences, it'll look like a Latin mass.

00:15:33.140 It was an Italian mass with a lot of Latin in it, which was kind of cool.

00:15:37.900 But at the start of the hobbling, out comes perfect English.

00:15:43.440 And you're like, oh, my gosh, because this is the first time we have an American pope.

00:15:47.880 So we've never had this kind of an English that we could all inherently not only understand,

00:15:53.180 but it's so clear.

00:15:53.960 And you're like, whoa.

00:15:54.540 So that's going to be something new, because the American church is going to be reached

00:16:01.280 in a way that it never has been, because you're going to have absolute clarity of language.

00:16:08.940 And we'll find out, for good or for ill, what that's going to mean.

00:16:12.940 But, you know, despite all of what I know, and I know a lot, unfortunately, that it's not great,

00:16:18.400 I'm still hopeful.

00:16:19.440 We're called to be a people of hope, and I believe in conversions. 0.99

00:16:22.120 I believe in miracles.

00:16:22.780 I do, too.

00:16:23.120 And I'm looking forward to it.

00:16:26.240 And if it's, you know what, if it's another Francis, if it's a Francis 2.0,

00:16:30.880 the one great thing is, our Lord said, I will be with you to the end of time.

00:16:35.560 The gates of hell shall not prevail.

00:16:37.140 And I will never give you a cross too heavy for you to bear.

00:16:40.660 And it always works out to his advantage, you know, and which is always our advantage as well.

00:16:49.600 So I am hopeful, and I pray for not only this new pope, but also for all of the leadership

00:16:57.420 from every religion in the world.

00:16:59.380 We need them to stand up.

00:17:01.420 They are critical at this time.

00:17:03.820 Against the, there's no other force against the woke mob that has a chance.

00:17:09.020 John Henry Weston.

00:17:09.940 And you know what?

00:17:11.040 Go ahead, real quick.

00:17:12.120 God bless you, my friend.

00:17:13.280 Yeah, you were made for this time.

00:17:15.340 You, Glenn, and your listeners, trust in that.

00:17:18.380 Trust in the Lord.

00:17:19.260 Pray, pray, pray.

00:17:21.000 And remember, God loves you.

00:17:23.180 John Henry Weston.

00:17:23.940 And thank you so much from LifeSiteNews.com.

00:17:27.120 LifeSiteNews.com.

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00:17:34.160 I mean, I don't know.

00:17:36.580 I mean, something that happens over there.

00:17:39.480 I mean, really, I mean, I don't want to think that there are things living inside of us, but

00:17:44.400 there are.

00:17:45.280 It's actually more common than anybody realized.

00:17:48.000 And they're often misdiagnosed or ignored.

00:17:50.960 And it kind of gives me the heebie-jeebies.

00:17:52.760 I've been taking ivermectin now once a month.

00:17:56.300 See your doctor about that.

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00:18:28.560 Now, back to the podcast.

00:18:30.520 This is the best of the Glenn Beck program.

00:18:33.440 Douglas Murray.

00:18:34.640 Welcome to the program, sir.

00:18:35.820 How are you?

00:18:37.280 Very good to be back with you.

00:18:38.840 Thank you.

00:18:39.260 So, I mean, I hate to get into this because it's been talked about for so long, but I

00:18:45.400 just, I think I agree with you, Douglas, and I just want to make sure that we're saying

00:18:51.560 the same thing.

00:18:52.640 Can you lay out the controversy that you've been embroiled in here recently?

00:18:56.640 Do you mean, sorry, because I tend to be embroiled in quite a lot of controversy.

00:19:02.540 Which one do you think?

00:19:04.240 The one where you're accused of saying, don't listen to anybody unless they have an Oxford

00:19:09.900 degree.

00:19:13.200 Something which, of course, I never said.

00:19:15.380 Yeah, I know.

00:19:16.480 Never would say.

00:19:18.300 I think this is the controversy that came up from my recent appearance on Joe Rogan podcast.

00:19:24.180 Now, the simple thing I said, which has been, I think, misrepresented by a very large number

00:19:30.980 of people deliberately, is that everybody has the right to say anything they like about

00:19:35.560 anything, but that doesn't mean that all opinions should be regarded as being equal.

00:19:41.980 And when I was brought on to debate, and it's not often in Joe Rogan's podcast that he

00:19:49.320 ever does that.

00:19:50.080 He normally has people on to just give their opinion, and you can take it or leave it.

00:19:55.740 But he felt that, clearly, that a pro-Israel voice like mine had to be countered on air.

00:20:04.320 And when I was talking about my recent book, the recent bestseller on democracies and death,

00:20:11.120 cults, Israel and the Future of Civilization, I got into the weeds of what has been happening

00:20:17.700 in the last two years in the Middle East.

00:20:20.220 I got into it because, not just because I've written about it, but because I've seen it

00:20:24.040 all up close.

00:20:24.940 I've spent the last couple of years mainly living in Israel and being embedded with the

00:20:30.260 Israeli Defense Forces in Gaza and in Lebanon and elsewhere.

00:20:34.680 And I've seen this war up close.

00:20:36.360 And I discovered that the person I was being pitched against, who was wildly, wildly uninformed

00:20:41.920 on issue after issue, was just spouting and spouting and spouting, turned out never to

00:20:47.800 have even been to the region.

00:20:50.180 And I said, this is like if we were to discover that Chinese state media had somebody on all

00:20:58.120 the time talking about America, claiming that America was a racist country, claiming that

00:21:03.900 black Americans are currently being lynched and sold into slavery, if we discovered that

00:21:09.320 that person was rampaging across the Chinese media, but he had never been to America, didn't

00:21:14.600 speak English, and obviously so, because he's so wildly misinformed, we would regard that person

00:21:21.920 as being almost comical in their ignorance, certainly malevolent.

00:21:25.480 So why should it be that when there are people at home here in America who are also just not

00:21:33.520 informed, just as many British people are not informed, about big situations in the world

00:21:38.680 that they're talking about, why should their opinion be regarded as being somehow sacrosanct?

00:21:45.560 I don't think it is.

00:21:47.360 And yes, I believe in standards.

00:21:50.940 I believe that elites have let us down badly.

00:21:53.760 Experts have let us down badly, but it doesn't mean there is no such thing as expertise or

00:22:01.240 comparative expertise in matters.

00:22:05.040 And if people don't understand that and don't understand that, for instance, a journalist who

00:22:11.140 goes and reports firsthand may well get things wrong, but it's a darn sight better than somebody

00:22:18.480 who's never left their bedroom and thinks they know the world.

00:22:21.920 You know, I just read a quote, I think it was from Jefferson, and I've adapted it to modern

00:22:31.240 times.

00:22:31.980 The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the man who reads nothing but 0.69

00:22:37.280 social media.

00:22:38.700 He said newspapers.

00:22:40.300 But I think that's the kind of expert we have now that are running around.

00:22:45.680 And I don't believe in you have to be credentialed or anything like that.

00:22:50.500 I don't think you have to have a formal education.

00:22:52.940 I don't think that hurts.

00:22:54.540 But I think serious people can do serious study on their own, especially in today's world,

00:23:01.820 and become an expert in a field.

00:23:04.620 But, you know, you also have to have enough humility to go, look, I'm not an expert in

00:23:13.720 this.

00:23:14.060 I don't know.

00:23:14.640 I've just done a lot of homework, and I'm open to different opinions, but here's what

00:23:18.840 I found.

00:23:20.660 Right.

00:23:21.200 Absolutely.

00:23:21.940 And there's a lot of good that can come from that, and we all do that to some extent.

00:23:26.320 But that is, as you say, the ignorance that social media in particular is able to push

00:23:32.580 on people is extraordinary, not least because of the lack of humility.

00:23:37.240 And one of the things in that debate, it was really me against Joe and the comedian he'd

00:23:42.260 put me on with.

00:23:44.160 One of the things that was startling about it was the sheer lack of humility of the guy

00:23:48.920 I was debating.

00:23:50.160 I mean, he seemed to think that he knew everything about Israel and the IDF, despite never having

00:23:56.400 been there or met anyone or spoken with anyone on the ground in the IDF.

00:24:00.120 And he seemed to think that he knew better than the Israeli Defense Forces, how they should

00:24:04.440 protect their people from another massacre like October the 7th.

00:24:08.580 But maybe the generals in the Israeli army and the politicians and others who have been

00:24:15.680 losing family for the last 18 months fighting in Gaza, maybe they do know something more than

00:24:23.180 you have believed in different social media sitting in Austin, Texas.

00:24:27.380 Maybe it's my view.

00:24:30.000 I mean, people quite often say to me, you know, what would you what do you what would you tell

00:24:35.740 this politician or what would you tell this general when you meet them?

00:24:39.880 And I always say, I don't tell them anything.

00:24:42.620 I listen.

00:24:44.160 I listen because that's much, much more important because they know more about the proximate causes

00:24:53.620 of the conflict and what they're doing to prevent it.

00:24:56.780 And when I hear and see these people, there was a guy, one of Joe Rogan's friends who'd

00:25:01.980 been cropping up on social media recently, and he accepted this challenge that I put out,

00:25:06.520 which was, if you know, if you have a plan for how you would get 250 hostages back from

00:25:13.580 the densely built up and booby trapped area of Gaza, and if you know how to get 250 hostages

00:25:20.180 back and how to kill or capture all the leadership of Hamas, if you have a better plan than what

00:25:26.880 the Israelis have been doing from the last 18 months, let me know and I will pass it on 1.00

00:25:31.860 to anyone I know in Jerusalem.

00:25:34.020 OK, and one of these comedians decided to take up this challenge.

00:25:38.720 And you know what he said?

00:25:40.580 He said, among other things, he said, why don't they fight like men?

00:25:46.940 Why don't they fight like men?

00:25:49.000 And he said, I'm sorry, I've been to the funerals of young men who had no desire to have to ever

00:25:56.620 be in Gaza again, who lost their lives because they were fighting house to house with terrorists

00:26:03.300 embedded in mosques and in hospitals and in civilian homes and cropping up from tunnels

00:26:09.560 all over the place.

00:26:10.700 And if the IDF and the Israeli Air Force had wanted to level the place, they could have

00:26:15.820 done.

00:26:16.320 But they didn't because they wanted to minimize casualties on their opponent's side and

00:26:20.660 minimize casualties on their own.

00:26:22.740 And you have to put up with some doofus claiming that he's the real man.

00:26:29.340 And he knows because he's sitting in a podcast studio somewhere two continents away.

00:26:34.780 And I think that is just objectionable on every level and displays a lack of humility

00:26:40.500 and understanding that is almost pathological.

00:26:45.500 I tell you, Douglas, I mean, I think I struggled from this a little bit.

00:26:49.640 I mean, I've done this job for almost 50 years now.

00:26:52.020 Um, but when I got into, uh, television, everything changes so rapidly that I was, I was pretty

00:26:59.100 assured that I was right on.

00:27:00.800 I think we had a big, you know, I spent a lot of money on research and everything else

00:27:04.020 had really good, uh, you know, we, we were buttoned up, but when I left there and I was

00:27:09.240 reflecting on what I had done, um, I, I came to the understanding and, and I think this

00:27:18.420 just comes from maturity, um, and experience.

00:27:22.040 And that is the only thing I'm certain of is that I'm not certain of anything.

00:27:29.020 I don't, I don't know.

00:27:31.820 I I'm like you, I will ask questions.

00:27:34.360 I will voice my opinion.

00:27:36.140 I will voice what I do know, but that doesn't necessarily make it the absolute truth.

00:27:44.200 I need to understand more of the situation.

00:27:48.260 Yes.

00:27:48.920 And you do do that.

00:27:50.520 And, you know, one of the things going on is that, is that all of us who are, who I hope

00:27:56.220 are curious and want to learn more and know more and understand things better.

00:28:01.720 We, we, we, we, we have that instinct, but it also doesn't mean that on the things we know

00:28:08.300 about, including the things we've seen with our own eyes, that we should be lacking in

00:28:13.280 confidence to say what we know or what we see.

00:28:16.120 It's a really tough place to be.

00:28:19.120 You have to have the confidence in what you do know, but you also have to have the humility

00:28:23.600 to say, I, I, but I don't know everything.

00:28:26.500 Right.

00:28:27.080 And one of the things that I do know is that having seen war up close, not just in this conflict,

00:28:35.220 but in others as well, I know what the difference is between an, a death cult, as I call Hamaz, 0.76

00:28:43.020 like a death cult, like Hamaz, that fights for death, fights to bring death to its enemies, 0.96

00:28:50.600 fights to bring death to its own side, even to its own children.

00:28:54.740 I know the difference between the death cult like that and the democracy like Israel or 0.99

00:29:00.480 the United States of America and our armies who fight for life, who fight to minimize casualties

00:29:08.220 on our own side and fight to minimize casualties on the enemy side.

00:29:13.860 And there is all the difference in the world between these two things.

00:29:17.640 Okay.

00:29:17.740 So when I see people finding it complicated to tell the difference between a democracy

00:29:22.440 and a death cult, I think they are lost.

00:29:25.460 You're streaming the best of Glenn Beck.

00:29:27.500 To hear more of this interview and others, download the full show podcasts wherever you

00:29:31.480 get podcasts.

00:29:33.520 Russell Boat, Office of Management and Budget.

00:29:36.600 He is the director and, uh, and one of my personal heroes.

00:29:41.240 And I think yours too, Stu.

00:29:42.520 Welcome to the program, Russell.

00:29:43.680 Thanks, Glenn.

00:29:45.580 Appreciate having me on.

00:29:46.800 You bet.

00:29:47.440 Okay.

00:29:47.720 So I want to talk to you about the, the Republicans because I believe they're kind of a waste of

00:29:53.480 space.

00:29:54.020 Um, they are not doing the things that I think the president promised, and that is cut the

00:30:01.100 budget and cut regulation in dramatic ways.

00:30:04.820 And president Trump has been playing very, very nice with them, trying to get them to do what

00:30:10.780 I think is something by passing the big, beautiful bill.

00:30:14.460 Can you tell me where we stand on this and what's in it?

00:30:18.920 Uh, we're working through it right now.

00:30:21.040 The houses, um, has a, they're trying to meet their instructions.

00:30:24.940 They basically passed a budget that would have a hundred or 1.5 trillion in savings, uh, and

00:30:31.080 about four, four and a half trillion in tax relief.

00:30:34.140 And they are working through to get a bill that can pass.

00:30:37.620 And, uh, we're right there with them trying to get it done.

00:30:40.840 And, uh, I think it would be, you know, big savings.

00:30:43.340 We could go north of that.

00:30:45.140 Um, and I think that's the, that is the goal is to try to figure out how to make this a historic

00:30:50.820 opportunity to both extend the tax cuts, do the, the tax cuts the president wanted to

00:30:56.820 do on the, on the campaign, uh, no tax on overtime, some other things, no tax on social

00:31:02.100 security benefits, um, and then to really, uh, make sure that, you know, this is an opportunity

00:31:07.500 to have some of the highest reforms to mandatory spending since the 1990s.

00:31:12.660 And there's a lot that we can do in this area.

00:31:14.780 And, um, I think that the house right now is, is trying to put these bills together.

00:31:19.760 Um, you know, we spent so much time debating whether you have a couple of bills or one bill.

00:31:25.660 We lost some time in that and we're trying to catch up.

00:31:28.300 And, um, I think they're hard at work and we just got to be right there by them to

00:31:32.080 help them get it done.

00:31:33.500 So what are we expecting this to be voted on and possibly go through?

00:31:38.300 My hope is next week that they pass it out of committee, the two big committees of ways

00:31:42.960 and means and energy and commerce, uh, and then go to budget and set up a vote thereafter

00:31:47.720 on the house floor.

00:31:48.980 Uh, that's our hope.

00:31:50.120 That's what we're working towards.

00:31:51.500 Uh, I don't think they've noticed yet the committees, but, uh, that's, that's what we're

00:31:55.900 So Russ, can you, can you do me a favor?

00:31:58.740 I mean, I'm sure you've done this to Congress, but I don't know the American people really

00:32:02.740 understand how dire this situation is.

00:32:06.460 I mean, I got a letter from a family member who I just love dearly a couple of weeks ago.

00:32:10.700 And he said, Glenn, you know what?

00:32:12.540 What the president is doing?

00:32:13.540 And I said, well, what the president is doing is trying to save the country from the great

00:32:20.400 reset because a reset is coming and you want it to be towards shareholder capitalism, not

00:32:28.280 stakeholder capitalism.

00:32:29.680 But with our debt, the way it is, the interest rates that we're now paying bigger than the

00:32:35.560 defense budget, no country has ever survived this.

00:32:39.560 Can you give us some idea on, on how serious, I mean, Congress needs to move a little quicker.

00:32:46.840 That's the, you know, look, we have $36 trillion in debt as you, you know, when I left office

00:32:51.820 the first time under president Trump, we had about $300 billion per year in interest costs.

00:32:56.220 And now it's above the defense spending at $900 billion, right?

00:33:00.960 It's actually $1.1.

00:33:01.680 So we've got this enormous interest cost as a result.

00:33:07.480 And it's one of the reasons why, you know, we've heard an emphasis from the administration

00:33:11.360 on balance, on taking dramatic actions through Doge.

00:33:15.460 Our budget that you referenced in the lead up is the lowest non-defense spending to $2,000

00:33:21.680 adjusted for inflation.

00:33:22.840 And so, and I think what we would try to do to deal with kind of the paralysis from Capitol

00:33:29.120 Hill is to change the reality on the ground.

00:33:32.600 I mean, I think that's what Doge has done in a fundamental way.

00:33:35.820 And we're going to try to make those savings permanent through a couple of different ways.

00:33:39.480 But it's to force Congress to, if they want to be a part of the process, you know, come

00:33:46.620 alongside of us, but we're going to move in as much as we can within the parameters of

00:33:52.440 the law and the Constitution.

00:33:54.340 We're going to move as fast and aggressively as possible to change the reality on the ground

00:33:58.820 with reductions in force, with reorganizations, with doing a programmatic review of spending

00:34:05.120 that doesn't have to go out through the use of rescissions.

00:34:07.860 There's a whole set of tools in our box that we're going to use aggressively to get Congress

00:34:13.780 moving in our direction, because we cannot be in a normal situation as an administration

00:34:20.180 where we just kind of send bills up and wait on them.

00:34:23.020 Right.

00:34:23.320 You know, we have one big bill that needs to occur.

00:34:27.340 We've tried to put everything as we possibly can on that, because it has procedural protection

00:34:33.140 in the Senate.

00:34:34.620 But even in that, it was, you know, part of our thinking was to make sure we limit the

00:34:41.140 number of things that we have to go to Congress for.

00:34:43.680 The taxes.

00:34:47.000 I mean, I was hoping that we were going to get new tax cuts and not just the renewal of

00:34:54.840 the Trump tax cuts, but I was hoping Congress would be at serious and we'd go even deeper

00:34:59.060 than that.

00:34:59.580 Um, and now, uh, the White House last night, the president last night tweeted, you know,

00:35:05.940 uh, I know that Congress, you know, they're going to be wishy-washy on, you know, they're

00:35:11.740 going to get blamed if they raise any taxes on the, on the very rich, but I'll, I'll go

00:35:17.260 along with it if, if they want to do that, that, that, that's a little scary.

00:35:21.860 We should be going the other way, shouldn't we?

00:35:23.700 Well, I think the president ran on a set of tax proposals that he's been very excited

00:35:31.300 about, committed out, designed towards the working class, um, that we, from an economic

00:35:36.840 standpoint, also believe are really critical to getting, um, more and more of, of labor

00:35:43.660 force participation out of this part of the economy.

00:35:47.200 And we think it would be a huge boon to the, to the, uh, the, the impetus on the economy

00:35:54.320 to growth.

00:35:55.460 Um, and so we are living in a, in a world where, you know, we don't, we don't have the, the

00:36:01.340 ability to have unlimited tax cuts.

00:36:04.180 Uh, and, and I think that's what, is it, is it, you're seeing a lot of different navigation

00:36:08.780 on that.

00:36:09.180 Is it impossible to go back to the 2019 budget?

00:36:13.560 I mean, why can't we just reset and say, we're going back to that budget?

00:36:17.420 It was fine.

00:36:18.120 Then it's fine.

00:36:18.800 Now we are trying to do that with the, what you saw in the budget that we sent up, uh,

00:36:24.520 that's, that is essentially what that budget represents.

00:36:28.000 It's a, it's an effort to go back, um, you know, non-adjusted for inflation.

00:36:32.500 It goes back to 2017.

00:36:34.540 Uh, it's a 35% cut for most programs when we account for maintaining, uh, infrastructure

00:36:40.540 and, and veteran spending.

00:36:41.980 But that's what we're trying to do.

00:36:43.840 Do we do the entitlements, the mandatory spending, the interest, do those have an impact on our

00:36:49.400 ability to go back overnight to 2019?

00:36:51.960 Yes, they do.

00:36:53.120 And so that's really what we're trying to say.

00:36:55.240 And, and I, and I, and I do think that there's a newfound, uh, desire to cut spending, even

00:37:01.400 in the context of the tax cuts on the Hill.

00:37:04.000 And you have a ton of members that are really trying to make sure this is either deficit neutral

00:37:09.760 or you have a, you know, this is a moment that can be used for significant mandatory

00:37:14.940 reform.

00:37:15.500 So to get there, are tax hikes on the rich part of that plan?

00:37:21.060 Well, the president, you know, put out a truth this morning.

00:37:24.420 Um, you know, he, he said, look, uh, I think he's of a couple of different minds.

00:37:28.740 He has always been very focused on the things he ran on.

00:37:31.340 This was not something that he ran on.

00:37:32.860 He ran on, um, the, the, the no tax on overtime, right?

00:37:38.360 Right.

00:37:38.520 Uh, the no tax on tips, no tax on tips, all that kind of things.

00:37:43.020 And so that's, that's really what we've been trying to fit in to the amount that, that Congress

00:37:49.760 is ready to reduce.

00:37:51.160 At the same time, we have to, you know, extend the tax cuts from, from his first term.

00:37:55.540 Um, I saw in the budget that we are increasing defense and homeland security.

00:38:00.020 Is that border?

00:38:02.180 Is that why this is happening?

00:38:04.400 On the border is like, we, we want to increase and really buy out all of our increases over

00:38:11.340 the next three to four years in one bill.

00:38:14.340 And we're doing that, that this is the paradigm shift.

00:38:17.440 And I'm really glad you asked.

00:38:18.900 We no longer want to be in a situation where we have to get Democrat votes for defense increases

00:38:25.960 that then they put us in a situation where they have to lever up and demand that non,

00:38:32.200 not only do our cuts not happen, but that we have to increase non-defense spending because

00:38:36.400 we need their votes in the Senate.

00:38:38.980 Secondly, they flat out oppose any border spending.

00:38:41.900 I mean, we, they put us on the precipice of a shutdown every single time we wanted to increase

00:38:46.420 spend for ice or the wall.

00:38:48.460 And so our view is to, to actually look to how they did it under Joe Biden administration

00:38:55.400 and put those increases on the mandatory one big, beautiful reconciliation bill.

00:39:01.760 And then it puts us in a situation where we have united the Republican party.

00:39:06.400 So your defense hawks are not working against us in the appropriations process to actually

00:39:12.020 get non-defense cuts.

00:39:13.300 That's what we're trying to do.

00:39:14.700 And then we've got Doge working overtime with Pete Hegseth to get reforms within DOD, because

00:39:21.160 obviously there's waste there as well.

00:39:23.320 And at least in this first year to make sure we reinvest those and let the new leaders there

00:39:29.680 get a sense of where the reforms need to be.

00:39:31.760 So with all the Doge stuff, uh, I mean, a, this has nothing to do with Doge, but I was

00:39:36.280 glad to see, um, uh, cash Patel yesterday, come back out and say, no, no, no, I'll go with

00:39:41.380 the budget on the FBI.

00:39:42.680 Cause he was saying, no, I, we can't live on that.

00:39:45.520 We need more, uh, and you know, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut.

00:39:49.680 And I was glad to see that he kind of changed his position on that yesterday.

00:39:53.120 Um, but, uh, you know, with, with Doge, I'm seeing that Congress is like, well, we're not

00:39:58.300 going to take all of the Doge recommendations.

00:40:00.080 Why?

00:40:03.140 Yeah.

00:40:03.560 I mean, I think that's the question that Congress needs to ask that we've, you know,

00:40:07.000 there's been on two minds.

00:40:08.120 Number one, they say, send us all these rescission bills, rescission bills, and I'm willing to

00:40:13.280 send rescissions bills.

00:40:14.320 Our administration is the Trump administration is, but we, man, we, they have to pass.

00:40:19.440 And so if they don't pass, it, it impacts our ability to, to use some of the tools that

00:40:25.900 we would have executively to spend less of that money.

00:40:29.000 And so, um, we are working with them.

00:40:32.180 That's why I haven't formally sent up the 9.3 first round of rescissions from Doge.

00:40:37.000 I am having great conversations surprisingly with the appropriations committee kind of

00:40:41.820 historic in of itself.

00:40:43.180 Uh, and they're trying to think through, okay, what's the version that we could do this a

00:40:47.820 little bit different, but hit the same amount of savings.

00:40:50.420 And so, uh, that's a healthy back and forth.

00:40:53.240 I think that in and of itself is a sign of this is a little bit different, Glenn.

00:40:57.840 I mean, this is, this is more like the 19 early 1980s when Reagan first came in, then, then

00:41:03.540 anything we've seen recently, um, Congress is saying we, instead of, we were going to

00:41:08.300 ignore your budget said, we want to hit your number.

00:41:11.620 So it's early.

00:41:13.040 I don't know if that, if that will materialize, but I am optimistic about it.

00:41:16.820 How, how optimistic are you that, I mean, cause you know, I've talked to the president

00:41:21.240 about this just a couple of weeks ago and I said, we are playing such a dangerous game

00:41:26.140 cause we have to, I mean, I think America, uh, no country's ever turned around from this

00:41:32.000 point and we have to, um, and it just requires some really big boy pants, uh, to do it.

00:41:38.900 Um, but I'm, I'm, I'm just so concerned about it.

00:41:43.300 Um, and I'm, you know, I'm, I'm hoping that we can get the, the reduction on the staff.

00:41:50.060 I know that you're, you know, you're doing a fantastic job on reducing the number of federal

00:41:55.080 employees, you believe we're going to be able to get these things actually codified.

00:42:01.720 So if things don't go well, or even if they do go well, but it's not president Trump the

00:42:07.800 next time that this remains, this path remains this direction.

00:42:13.980 I do.

00:42:14.820 I, I, so I think if you zoom out for a second, I think we're going to come away from this

00:42:20.060 year in particular, we've had no wins on spending in like two or three decades, you know, Paul

00:42:26.120 Ryan kind of put us in this cul-de-sac forever.

00:42:29.700 I think we're going to come away with this, this year with probably the largest mandatory

00:42:34.940 savings, um, ever or adjusted for inflation since the 1997 balanced budget agreement.

00:42:43.060 That's going to happen.

00:42:44.080 I think we're going to see the appropriations process fixed for the first time because of

00:42:50.460 our talking about executive tools like rescissions and impoundment.

00:42:56.920 It's going to cause the appropriations process, a return to separation of powers that Congress

00:43:02.720 actually listens to our cuts and we may not get all of them, but we'll get some of them.

00:43:07.560 And I think we're going to see something that is material progress on that front.

00:43:11.300 And third, I think in, I remember coming on your show in the first term and you just like

00:43:16.820 this, the extent to which the career bureaucracy is just impermeable, it's just totally unacceptable.

00:43:22.920 And you pushed us on that.

00:43:24.240 And I think, you know, many of us, the president, Elon have spent a ton of time thinking about

00:43:30.080 this.

00:43:30.460 And I think that will be the, one of the biggest stories, the extent to which the things that

00:43:35.400 have been done, the, you know, the fork in the road has fundamentally changed the reality

00:43:39.740 on the ground.

00:43:41.100 And so we have a much small, we will have a much smaller bureaucracy as a result of it,

00:43:45.560 notwithstanding the laws that are on the books that, that have been a barrier thus far.

00:43:50.480 I have to tell you, I, I stay away from Washington, DC, you know, as, as much as I try to stay away

00:43:56.740 from the plague.

00:43:58.200 But next time I'm up, Russ, I'd love to sit down with you and do a long form interview with

00:44:02.400 you.

00:44:02.580 Cause I, I, you're really one of the good guys and thank you for everything you're doing.

00:44:05.840 You've got it.

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The Glenn Beck Program - May 09, 2025

Best of the Program ｜ Guests： Russell Vought & Douglas Murray ｜ 5⧸9⧸25

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