Glenn Beck talks to Icon Carver about drones and why he thinks they're ours. Plus, he talks to Michael Schellenberger in the airport about the latest on the drone issue. Glenn Beck is a conservative commentator and host of the Glenn Beck Program on the conservative radio network Glenn Beck Radio.
00:04:32.440Meanwhile, in this dimension, we are going up to cover the inauguration on Monday.
00:04:40.040And I thought, you know, if I were to just make my flight a little earlier, I might find myself maybe a little north in Philadelphia where I could go watch the Eagles play this weekend.
00:06:17.060And Carvey, you know, Thomas Jefferson said, if you really want to embed the truth, you want people to remember who your society was embedded in your architecture.
00:06:25.580And there's a lot of lost meaning in icons.
00:06:30.160And I was talking about this today with one of my researchers, and she said, you know, Jonathan's probably going to be able to talk about this.
00:06:38.760And I don't know how he's going to talk about this, but I wanted to get him on first thing as he's in the airport traveling here for the full show later today.
00:07:01.500So Michael Schellenberger, last night, I asked him about the UFOs or the UAPs, the flying disc, whatever they are in all over America and the world.
00:07:17.120And I said, what do you think those are?
00:07:20.100And he said, well, I'll be surprised if they're China.
00:08:12.180Well, I think the first thing to say, in terms of meaning, like the thing that I'm interested in is really symbolic structures and symbolic meaning.
00:08:22.040The first thing to understand is that this is an unidentified phenomenon.
00:09:31.960They won't be unidentified, and we'll be able to know how to deal with them.
00:09:36.860But until we have an idea of what they are, now we're dealing with the problem of something that's like a monster, that's like a hybrid monster that you don't know what it means.
00:10:12.540For instance, Abigail Schreiber says, you know, there's now this thing that is not part of you but lives outside of you and inside of you that might tell you that you're a different gender.
00:10:23.200Well, that sounds like a soul that's misinformed.
00:10:26.520And so it seems as though we are creating or recreating a religion in our society.
00:10:38.340And for sure, the extraterrestrial and the unidentified flying orb lights are a way to kind of re-inscribe religious stories and religious imagery into our world with a scientific lens.
00:10:50.660And so, and often the problem, I think, and that's why I focused on meaning before, that the problem is that we're so focused on understanding what these phenomena are in terms of, you know, what is their physical, mechanical causes.
00:11:02.360And we are not trying to figure out what they're doing in terms of the way we perceive ourselves and the way we perceive our place in the cosmos.
00:11:11.720And so, and that's what, that's the biggest thing.
00:11:13.960AI, all of these questions, people are always asking the technical question, but very few people are asking, what does it mean for us to be dealing with these types of intelligences that are kind of poking their nose back into the world right now?
00:11:26.800So, what would happen to us, I mean, my faith would be fine, but what would happen to us if we did find that we weren't alone in the universe?
00:11:39.380Well, you know, you could ask the question in all kinds of ways.
00:11:43.040What happened when we discovered that there was a whole continent that we didn't know about and that there were cultures that nobody has ever talked about and no one has ever dealt with?
00:11:52.460The situation would be the same. It would be catastrophic in some ways. It would lead to the end of a world. It would lead to mass transformation, but it wouldn't change the basic structure of what meaning is and what, you know, spirituality is, what God, when we talk about God, what we're talking about.
00:12:11.640In some ways, it would be a big clash, like the Colombian clash, you could say, but it wouldn't destroy religion at all. I don't see why it even affects them.
00:12:20.900Right. You know, in looking at icons that have happened all over the world, you see a lot of the same kind of icons on different continents that look to be like some sort of an alien or something that's coming from the sky.
00:12:42.240You see the huge icons that can really only be viewed from up above and made at a time when nobody was up above. What do you make of those?
00:12:53.320Well, I think that the idea of something that comes down from heaven is definitely a, you know, it's a universal image. It's universal structure. It has to do with how light is up in the heavens. It has to do with how the stars are like a big clock that, you know, structure our world. And that's really important to understand.
00:13:13.320Now, we have to be careful and not confuse that with the kind of scientific worldview that we live in right now.
00:13:23.020And so there's a kind of inversion that happened at some point during the Copernican Revolution, where now, you know, how can I say this?
00:13:30.740It used to be that the earth was the place in which we stood and we look at the heavens to kind of to give us meaning. But now we've changed that. You know, the heavens are are as physical and as mechanical as our bodies.
00:13:44.760And so they're not that they're not the spiritual thing. They're not the pattern that helps us, at least when you see it from the scientific point of view.
00:13:52.260The sun still gives us meaning. You know, it's still cast light on your day. It's still it's still basically structures your your entire existence because you comes up in the morning and goes in the evening.
00:14:01.760You wake up, you go to sleep. But we have to be careful not to confuse science fiction with spirituality. And I think that that's a big danger.
00:14:12.540Well, what I mean is, you know, the idea, for example, that there are alien beings outside in the world is far more similar to the ancient story of what we call the Mariners tale.
00:14:24.480Right. Or something like going and discovering a new continent in America. So when we do that, but now outer space has become something like the ocean or you see that in Star Trek, the ocean that you go out and then you explore and you find these new worlds and find these new beings that you had never seen before.
00:14:40.080And that's very different from, let's say, a spiritual hierarchy of of gods or of angels that are qualitatively different from us, you know, and that are in some ways the beings that provide meaning to smaller beings.
00:14:53.080You know, like angels are messengers from higher meaning down into us.
00:14:57.520And so it's what the reason why I say that is because there will be a great temptation to confuse if we encounter aliens like extraterrestrial beings, there will be a great temptation to confuse those with the idea of angels or of gods.
00:15:10.980And we already see people talking about it that way, you know, like as if they have this idea that, you know, the ancient stories of gods and of angels were just extraterrestrials visiting.
00:15:21.640And you also, I mean, I'll get into this with you later when you come in, but the idea of a golem, I think we're, we're about to enter the word world of a new golem with AI.
00:15:33.500And the old story of golem is like, it's unbelievable.
00:15:38.060It matches today what we're going through.
00:15:41.600Well, we definitely, I think that humans have had intuition about the notion of artificial life and artificial beings for a very long time.
00:15:49.720And for sure, the story of the golem is a great warning about, you know, how, when we try to manipulate intelligence, we try to capture it in physical terms, how it can, you know, turn against us.
00:16:01.540There's also that image in revelation of, you know, the beast that the, the statue that speaks, like if we make this creation of ours speak, then everybody is, is surprised and, and can be deluded by it.
00:16:38.920We are beginning to enter this world where perverse spirituality is starting to take hold.
00:16:47.300People are looking for meaning and things.
00:16:49.800There is a, there's a bright light that is happening.
00:16:53.040I think we're at the very beginning of a new great awakening, but at the same time, I mean, it just really freaked me out with Michael Schellenberger yesterday because he's, he's not a guy to, he just doesn't, he doesn't exaggerate.
00:17:09.020Uh, he doesn't chime in on things that he's not sure of.
00:17:14.300I'm not sure, but he's like, if I had to place my money, I wouldn't place it on China or America, that this is earth technology or technology that mankind has.
00:21:09.960I, um, don't imagine that somebody's going to say something that will undermine that.
00:21:15.580But obviously there's some concern that if they are NHI, if they're non-human, then there's some sense in which people won't be able to handle it.
00:21:35.700Michael, it's going to be an interesting year.
00:21:40.020Let me ask you, because I asked him, I said, Trump is saying that he's going to come out with what it is on Tuesday.
00:21:47.280And he seems very nonchalant about it.
00:21:50.980And he said, yeah, that's the one thing I can't figure out.
00:21:53.820He said, if he does know, uh, you know, it's either the United States breaking the law or it's China telling us don't even think about Taiwan, uh, or, uh, it's, you know, non-human, uh, and, and, and all three of those are disturbing.
00:22:11.240And he said, Trump is just taking this very casually.
00:22:14.140But I'm not sure if Donald Trump knows yet as the president, he says he does, but does he, I don't know.
00:22:23.980And if it is, are we going to get the truth?
00:46:10.800One of the things he told me over the summer before he was, uh, elected, he said, Glenn, I have to tell you, one of the places you really have to keep your eye on is the Panama Canal.
00:46:21.260Uh, and I thought it was just because, you know, we were getting screwed by the Panama Canal, blah, blah, blah.
00:48:42.320I'm fine, thanks, Glenn, and thank you so much.
00:48:44.400Yeah, I've wanted to talk to you about the Panama Canal.
00:48:48.480There's a lot of things I want to talk to you about with China.
00:48:51.720You know, you have been saying for a long time, China is a paper tiger.
00:48:55.200They've got, you know, real problems with their economy, which has proven to be absolutely right.
00:49:02.020They're in real trouble, which kind of makes me nervous because when somebody is backed into a corner
00:49:09.160and because of their economy, they're starting to have uprisings or at least people vocalizing that we're not with everything that China is doing,
00:49:18.460they're going broke, they're losing all of the money they've put towards housing, et cetera, et cetera.
00:49:25.320They need some sort of a nationalistic kind of move to galvanize the population behind the party.
00:50:43.540So a couple of weeks ago, I did a show on what I thought might happen in 2025,
00:50:49.280and one of them was China's going to war.
00:50:51.700But I thought it would be something that was not the Panama Canal.
00:50:56.160It would be something where we wouldn't get involved, but it would help them and their people,
00:51:02.740so they would go into one of the countries around them and just take it and go to war.
00:51:08.600Do you think that's likely, or more likely it's going to be something big?
00:51:13.360Well, right now, we've got proxy wars that China is waging in Ukraine, North Africa, and in the Middle East, in Israel.
00:51:22.720So one more war looks like global conflict, World War III.
00:51:28.280So anything can happen, Glenn, and so we have to be prepared for anything at any place at any time.
00:51:34.620I think that Xi Jinping is going to stumble into a war someplace in East Asia, South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Philippines, something like that.
00:51:43.900But the first sign that we will have of a war could be an incident in the Panama Canal
00:51:48.860because the Chinese want to prevent the U.S. Navy from taking ships and submarines from the Atlantic Fleet to the Pacific Fleet.
00:51:55.900So we may know about this first, and this war may start in our own hemisphere.
00:52:00.520And you've written that you think that an quote-unquote accident, something like what happened at the Francis Scott Key Bridge,
00:52:09.680where something just goes wrong with a ship and then just destroys the Panama Canal for at least a few days.
00:52:18.280Is that what you think, how it would begin?
00:52:21.580Yes. There are any number of ways for China to do that.
00:52:24.440So, for instance, they could take a ship, they could ram one of the locks, they could scuttle it in the Calibra cut, which is a narrow portion of the canal.
00:52:35.800They're building the fourth bridge over the canal.
00:52:38.900They can design that bridge to come down easily, or they could construct it so that it falls apart.
00:52:45.120These are things that we've got to be worried about because the Chinese have a thorough knowledge of, and they've penetrated Panama, so they know what to do.
00:52:55.280You know, one thing that we learned in New Orleans on New Year's Day, and that is when you have a determined adversary who knows a lot about the territory, the place is crowded, it's very difficult to prevent a terrorist act.
00:53:10.320It's the same thing with the Panama Canal. The Chinese are there. They've thoroughly penetrated everything. They know what to do.
00:53:17.380Yes, we can think about contingencies, but the Chinese will be one step ahead of us.
00:53:22.780So explain to people, because China says they're not there, but there's, what is it, C.K. Hutchinson or something like that, a company that was from Hong Kong, has been there for a long time, and they're saying that, no, that's not the Chinese.
00:53:38.220Explain what they actually have in assets there.
00:53:42.460They have, well, you talk about Hutchinson. They've got ports at both ends of the canal, at Balboa on the Pacific end and San Cristobal on the Atlantic side.
00:53:53.980But they've also got Chinese state enterprises there.
00:53:56.540When Laura Hutchinson, who was head of U.S. Southern Command in the middle of 2022, she flew over the canal, and she pointed out all of the Chinese civilian, quote-unquote, operations, she said they were dual use.
00:54:13.200They would be turned into military facilities at a time of war.
00:54:16.860Now, Hutchinson is a private Hong Kong company, but the point is, in the People's Republic, no company, regardless of ownership, can disobey an order of the Communist Party.
00:54:28.040So Hutchinson port operations in the Panama Canal zone will be military bases, as will other Chinese facilities in the area.
00:54:36.880So what does Donald Trump, I mean, when he told me this, and I started looking into the Panama Canal, he told me this months ago, and he said, do your homework, and I did.
00:54:48.560And I saw him as somebody who actually knows what's going on and cares about the country and was way ahead.
00:54:59.760What does he, what does he have to do?
00:55:04.040Because people are poo-pooing everything he's saying about the Panama, oh, he wants a war in Panama.
00:55:18.040It's going to be very difficult, but I'm sure Trump can do it.
00:55:20.900And one of the things is we've got to make sure that China doesn't have port operations in the canal zone, which means Panama expropriating them.
00:55:29.240And that means we need to have American businesses who are willing to take it over.
00:56:04.280But when you know what the problem is and you're determined to protect the United States, you can do it.
00:56:10.620The other thing, and this is last resort, and that is that when we turned over the Panama Canal to Panama, there were two treaties.
00:56:20.660One of them is called the Neutrality Treaty, which is the treaty that survives, still in existence.
00:56:27.700We believe the United States, when we ratified that, we had a reservation that allowed the U.S. military to move into the canal zone to protect it from a third country.
00:56:58.880And we've got to make sure that American businesses are interested and alive to the possibilities of actually doing business and making profits in places like Central America, South America, Africa.
00:57:11.580American businesses have, I think, made poor business decisions in allowing those regions to be taken over by the Chinese.
00:57:20.320We have a strong diplomatic presence in Latin America.
01:03:26.400And the tone was set in April 2017 when Xi Jinping first met Trump as president.
01:03:32.760And that's when at Mar-a-Longa, where you have Trump standing up at dinner and saying he had just launched 59 missiles in Syria, which happens to be a Chinese friend.
01:03:52.060Because Xi Jinping was relatively well-behaved during the four years of Trump.
01:03:56.100He certainly wasn't well-behaved during Biden's four years.
01:03:59.080I heard a story last night that said that China didn't talk to the United States for several months after we blew their balloon out of the sky.
01:04:10.160And I'm like, we should have been the ones pissed, not them.
01:04:14.920You know, and that's an important point, because the State Department, after we shot the balloon as it crossed into the Atlantic, desperately tried to reestablish communications with China.
01:04:29.480I mean, American diplomats have been doing that for decades, and it's not produced good results for us.
01:04:34.960You know, we should make the Chinese come to us and beg for discussion.
01:04:40.360We shouldn't be going to the Chinese and saying, we want to talk to you, because that's all wrong, because the Chinese are doing, engaged in very bad behavior, and then we end up looking craven.
01:04:50.020I hate to do this to you now, who we've lost you so many times, but I've got to take a break here in a second.
01:04:57.020But I want to come back and talk to you about the drones and what you think those are.
01:05:02.740I was talking to somebody the other day, and they said, well, they think that this is China warning the Americans that we're going to take Taiwan or whatever it is and don't mess with us.
01:05:14.800But I think that almost defies logic that they would be that far ahead of the United States.
01:05:21.140Why would you be stealing our, you know, our plans for our, you know, our military jets if you can do that?
01:05:31.700Yeah, I understand what you're saying.
01:05:33.340The drones are a little bit complicated because there are a lot of different drones, and there are different explanations for each set of them.
01:05:39.680Okay, all right, so let's come back to that.
01:05:41.700If you can hang on just a second, we'll come back with Gordon Chang.
01:05:45.020He has a book that is out now, China is going to war.
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01:08:11.400He's talking about immigration, cash crunch, getting rid of the money printing, downsizing the government, abolishing departments in the national government, and restore constitutional order.
01:08:26.420I've got to go back and look at my notes on her, but I met her probably a year ago because I was concerned, who's going to replace you, Governor DeSantis?
01:08:39.240And he said, I'd like you to meet our Attorney General.
01:10:12.040Over my great state of New Jersey, there have been a lot of drones, and I'm sure there are a lot of different explanations for different drones.
01:10:19.600But there is one thing the Pentagon and the Biden administration has refused to deal with, and that is drones entered U.S. territorial airspace from the Atlantic Ocean.
01:10:31.100Those could not have been domestic drones.
01:10:55.660So, Donald Trump says he knows what it is, and he doesn't know why the government won't announce what it is.
01:11:03.960It makes sense to me that some of these drones are coming from a foreign power, but it's awfully provocative.
01:11:11.560But if you're going to do that, the time to do it is under Biden, because, you know, he ran like a little girl after we shot down the balloon, begging them for forgiveness.
01:11:45.220We have always tried to encourage China into responsible behavior, even though the Chinese were engaged in extremely bad conduct.
01:11:54.620And certainly during the Biden years, he was trying to be as nice as possible to Beijing because he thought that would entice the Chinese into reciprocal good behavior.
01:12:04.880But as we know, the Chinese just took advantage of that and saw him as weak and they pressed the advantage.
01:12:11.980What should Trump do if that indeed some of those drones were Chinese?
01:12:17.060I mean, that that is in in in other times, that would have been almost an act of war, if not an act of war.
01:12:27.200You're violating our airspace and and flying over our most sensitive air bases.
01:12:33.360Well, it is an act of war, especially in these circumstances.
01:12:38.500And I think what Trump should do is to start imposing asymmetrical costs because we don't want to fly a balloon over China and we don't have the balloons to fly over China.
01:12:48.700But we don't want to do something like that.
01:12:52.860And the way to do that is what Trump has been already talking about, which are tariffs.
01:12:58.180Tariffs would certainly drive the Chinese economy into an even more desperate situation.
01:13:03.620I think the Chinese would understand that they cannot continue that.
01:13:07.800So there are things that we all sorts of things that we can do to make sure that China engages in much better behavior towards the United States.
01:13:16.660So who is in the driver's seat, us or China?
01:13:19.460I mean, they're making 80 percent of all of our non-name brand drugs.
01:13:26.000I mean, that's we are we're in trouble if they cut us off.
01:13:32.080That's the one area where I worry the most about.
01:13:35.900You know, I think that, you know, if you go back to the last months of the first Trump term,
01:13:42.240Trump actually had implemented a plan to bring pharmaceutical manufacturing back to the United States.
01:13:48.540He had a seven hundred and fifty million dollar loan program to Eastman Kodak to make APIs, active pharmaceutical ingredients.
01:14:29.620But right now is a time where the Chinese regime is desperate and Xi Jinping is desperate because he knows that he has probably no way out other than to engage in some sort of hostile behavior towards a neighbor.
01:14:45.840Could be Taiwan, but more likely the Philippines.
01:14:49.460It's anyone's guess, though, because there are any number of targets that Xi Jinping has already been going after in various ways.
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01:22:57.200So, yeah, my point is here is that this is both sides of the aisle, and it tends to be those who are more liberal and big government that are the ones involved in this.
01:23:13.740Now, not all of them, obviously, and there are some big government rhinos out there that aren't on this list, but, you know, if you want to know who's working the system, I would just look at their portfolios.
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