The Glenn Beck Program - Ep 124 ｜ Did Jan. 6 & Ray Epps Expose a Corrupt FBI？｜ Darren Beattie ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

00:00:00.000 You remember the Trump days before the mainstream media went on a four-year vacation? 0.93

00:00:04.580 They worked nonstop like deranged bullies obsessed with destroying Donald Trump.

00:00:09.760 One of the rare instances of the media waking up during the Biden years is their obsession with January 6th, the insurrection. 0.58

00:00:18.780 And I say that in quotes because they have pushed that word like a thief pushes a stolen TV.

00:00:24.560 Meanwhile, they golf clapped last summer as anarchists and radicals literally burned American cities to the ground, resulting in $2 billion worth of damage.

00:00:35.620 And how many countless people have died since then for this experiment with our cops?

00:00:42.500 It's so more than a little strange that they've spent so much time on the insurrection narrative.

00:00:49.180 I mean, after a while, you have to wonder, why is it they're still talking about it?

00:00:53.180 Because they aren't really talking about it.

00:00:56.440 They're insisting that it was an insurrection without really giving us anything.

00:01:05.160 Strangely, their insistence focuses on the unquestionability of the whole situation.

00:01:12.960 Well, I have some questions.

00:01:14.700 And today's guest asked these questions in a more recent article for Revolver News titled Meet Ray Epps.

00:01:21.440 It's the Fed-protected provocateur who appears to have led the very first 1-6 attack on the U.S. Capitol.

00:01:30.780 But it goes deeper than that.

00:01:33.260 It's more of an expose and a very comprehensive one.

00:01:38.080 At the center of all of it is this mysterious guy from Arizona named Ray Epps, a name everyone should know, and a name that you will not hear on CNN, NPR, MSNBC, or from the administration.

00:01:52.580 We know that he was on the FBI most wanted list.

00:01:56.900 He was one of the first 20 people added to the list.

00:02:00.040 But he was removed just one day after Revolver published an article about him.

00:02:07.060 That alone would seem to be enough to raise the alarm.

00:02:11.940 We know this guy Ray Epps was there.

00:02:15.280 We know that he was encouraging Trump supporters to go into the Capitol the night before the rally.

00:02:20.440 There's footage of him doing it.

00:02:23.540 In response of him telling people who are Trump supporters, hey, we got to go in and take over the Capitol, people that were Trump supporters began to chant, Fed, Fed, Fed, because they felt he was a Fed plant.

00:02:36.500 As well as the footage of him on the morning of January 6th telling people to go to the Capitol 30 minutes before the end of Trump's speech.

00:02:46.100 Recently, in a House oversight hearing, Representative Thomas Massey asked Attorney General Garland about the situation, and Garland was surprisingly close-lipped about the matter.

00:02:58.260 This whole thing ends in a question, not an answer.

00:03:01.800 The question is, why?

00:03:04.440 Well, we don't know.

00:03:06.500 But we need to find out.

00:03:08.460 And Merritt Garland is not the guy, as you will find out at the end of this podcast, not the guy to really be looking into it.

00:03:17.260 Today's guest has devoted himself to this cause.

00:03:21.040 Please welcome Darren Beattie.

00:03:23.900 You may not know this about me, but I'm a man of taste.

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00:03:30.580 I also work out.

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00:04:46.840 So, Darren, how does a guy who's a professor at Duke University who likes Donald Trump, A, how did you even get that job?

00:04:56.820 Was that undercover?

00:04:57.900 And then you left there to go speech right for Donald Trump.

00:05:03.820 Yes.

00:05:04.560 Well, I was an academic.

00:05:06.160 That was my first profession.

00:05:08.780 I majored in mathematics as an undergraduate and did a Ph.D. in the philosophy of mathematics as presented through the lens of a German philosopher, Martin Heidegger.

00:05:20.220 And then I was teaching at Duke and one of the interests I had was sort of the underlying logic behind various political coalitions.

00:05:31.400 And I had a thesis that essentially the underlying logic behind the Republican coalition had become obsolete post-Cold War.

00:05:39.760 And it was due for a certain type of realignment.

00:05:42.940 And, in fact, I presented this thesis through a course I was teaching called Left, Right, and Center.

00:05:48.180 And contemporaneous to that course we saw it play out in real time with the emergence of Trump and, to a certain extent, with the emergence of Sanders on the left.

00:06:00.060 So it was very interesting to teach that and, of course, I was not just a detached theoretical observer.

00:06:06.440 I was a supporter of Trump.

00:06:08.980 I supported the underlying realignment that I thought he represented and symbolized.

00:06:14.360 And I was, in fact, if you can believe it, the only non-tenured academic in the country to have publicly endorsed Trump's candidacy.

00:06:26.160 And I was also the only faculty member at Duke to have correctly predicted the election, which I think irritated them even more.

00:06:33.840 I think it probably did.

00:06:36.440 So what is the realignment that you saw?

00:06:43.280 Right.

00:06:44.100 Well, there was a number of factors.

00:06:46.600 I mean, a lot of things have changed since then.

00:06:49.320 And so, to some extent, the analysis requires its own kind of update.

00:06:53.960 But at the time, you know, you just saw the same types of refrains coming out of GOP and the messaging as though we'd never gone kind of beyond the Reagan years, as though the kind of economic philosophy represented in the Reagan years was somehow essentially connected with the various other positions, for instance, on foreign policy, on cultural policy and so forth.

00:07:21.860 And I think a lot of times because people see various political issues packaged together, they assume that there's some type of essential coherence.

00:07:30.900 When in a lot of cases, they're packaged together in an arbitrary way or maybe not entirely arbitrary, but contingent to the underlying political circumstances that existed.

00:07:41.860 And I think the way that a lot of the GOP platform in the movement conservative platform was constructed, it was very much attached to the peculiar circumstances of that Cold War period and required a certain type of substantial software update, as it were, in order to address the emerging challenges of the 21st century.

00:08:04.460 So, we have free aligned, I mean, I find myself, I've always been a freedom of speech guy, you know, First Amendment is brilliant, all of them are, but the First Amendment, especially with what I do, I've always been there.

00:08:21.400 And the left used to be the champion of that, and now we're on opposite sides.

00:08:27.900 I've always been a guy who said, well, you know, big, big corporations, what are they going to do?

00:08:33.720 Not realizing what corporations that are bigger than countries, and many countries in the cases of these corporations now combined, can do and are doing.

00:08:46.280 So, now I'm almost, I wouldn't say I'm an anti-corporous, but I'm very suspicious, and I want nothing, I want our government to do nothing with the private sector at all.

00:08:59.980 That's a huge change just in me.

00:09:04.360 We are all flipping and finding ourselves in proximity of very strange bedfellows.

00:09:12.540 Right, and I think it's simply a matter of pragmatically addressing the predominant threats to liberty that exists today, and it takes different forms.

00:09:25.540 And this is, I guess, a partial update from the issues I was focused on back during the Trump candidacy.

00:09:31.540 Back then, it was somewhat significant and even a little bit novel to suggest, oh, we need to reassess our relationship between sort of economic theory and liberty.

00:09:44.440 And there's this sort of simplified version of what free market is when really people use that term so loosely as to encompass a free market of the neighborhood lemonade stand and the free market of something like major institutions like Goldman Sachs.

00:10:02.220 But the market in which Goldman Sachs exists is not the same market as the kind of neighborhood lemonade stand, and we didn't quite have the vocabulary to recognize those important distinctions.

00:10:18.460 But I would say that at this point, we may have gone a little bit far in the other direction.

00:10:25.700 At first, it was necessary to say, look, just because these big tech companies are technically in the private sector in a very technical sense doesn't mean that we should simply ignore the overwhelming threat that they pose to free speech and the ability to deliberate in the public sphere, which is a precondition of a democratic society.

00:10:47.460 Correct.

00:10:48.460 You need free speech in order to have a democratic society.

00:10:51.460 And so I think just because everyone was sort of so fixated on this public sphere, private sector distinction, it was important to say, look, just because the threats are coming from the private sector doesn't mean we should ignore them because there is sacrosanct by virtue of not being.

00:11:09.140 But I think at this point, I'm almost inclined to kind of push back in the other direction in the following sense, is I think ultimately what big tech is, the major companies, Facebook and all these other things, you cannot understand ultimately what they are without recognizing that they are essentially extensions of the American state.

00:11:33.320 And in fact, and the government at the government at the highest levels in the State Department and other spheres, they use Google, Facebook and these other entities as an integral component of their public diplomacy operations, of their propaganda operations.

00:11:50.160 It's used to facilitate our objectives overseas.

00:11:53.540 We saw this in the, we saw this with the Arab Spring, clearly.

00:11:57.160 Exactly, exactly.

00:11:58.580 And in fact, and that's not even to mention the de facto revolving door that now exists between the high level positions at these tech companies and the government.

00:12:09.100 And also the fact that these companies are doing major contract work for the government.

00:12:14.960 So I think the ultimate position is not quite, oh, public versus private.

00:12:20.160 The ultimate, I think, recognition we need to make is at the highest level, that distinction is not very meaningful.

00:12:28.360 The public sector and the private sector blend.

00:12:31.720 And in the case of big tech, these companies are not ultimately private sector in the way that we imagine.

00:12:39.160 And I think that's important when we try to assess solutions, because you can't solve the bottleneck simply by saying, oh, we need some other kind of private sector competitor, because at that level in the economy, everything blends into the state.

00:12:56.060 And ultimately, the bottleneck to solutions is the security state, which has been a primary driver of the censorship regime that we have.

00:13:08.320 And I think that could be an interesting segue, I think, into the biggest story really of the past few years that encompasses a lot of my reporting on 1.6, which is the fact that the entire national security apparatus in this country has been repurposed and redeployed domestically.

00:13:28.660 And that includes the big tech companies insofar as their instruments of the security state.

00:13:35.260 The entire apparatus we have has now been reoriented towards silencing and suppressing precisely those insurgent populist energies that animated the Trump candidacy, but also animate other populist movements on the left as well.

00:13:51.660 And that's where we find ourselves.

00:13:53.420 I think it's a very dangerous place, and many people are still coming to realize that this is the reality and how dangerous it actually is.

00:14:01.800 What do you think it's going to take to get people to wake up?

00:14:04.620 I mean, it is so clear and obvious.

00:14:07.160 I mean, just in COP26 today, I think it was, the president announced a partnership with his administration, the United States government, and the World Economic Forum, and 20, I think it's 20 or 25 different companies, where it's a public-private partnership.

00:14:30.700 This is, this should be terrifying, especially when you see groups like, you know, Bill Gates and Microsoft standing up on the stage as well.

00:14:42.740 I mean, this is everywhere.

00:14:44.960 Is it going to be too late by the time we wake up?

00:14:48.720 That's a tough question.

00:14:52.600 I mean, it remains to be seen.

00:14:54.280 And I think partially it's a matter of political psychology on the right.

00:15:01.220 And this is why my news organization, Revolver.News, I think we're a premier organization, especially catered to the right, to illustrate the threats presented by this repurposed national security state.

00:15:16.240 And I think there's a reason that traditionally a lot of the best critiques of the security state have come from the left, because dispositionally, the left, to be generous to them, they have to think of themselves as critics of corrupt institutions of power.

00:15:35.480 Now, I think in practice, we can all see that the left overwhelmingly functions as an instrument of those powerful institutions.

00:15:42.880 But as a matter of how they need to think of themselves, they have to think of themselves as challenging, powerful, corrupt institutions.

00:15:51.000 Whereas on the right, I think there's a very different political psychology at work.

00:15:55.160 And that is people on the right want to think of themselves as venerating just institutions of authority.

00:16:01.920 And so it's a more difficult proposition to get people on the right to recognize that these institutions, many of which you've had a history of venerating and supporting, like the FBI, like the DOD at its highest levels, like the national security apparatus more broadly, that these have become extremely corrupt and are basically pointing their guns and their fingers at you.

00:16:27.120 And I have to tell you, I don't think the problem is that big getting the right to realize that I think I think when you see what happened to Donald Trump and, you know, I said this all during that, if they can do this to the president of the United States, what power do you think you have over them?

00:16:50.360 I mean, if they can destroy, lie, cheat, steal, fabricate, eavesdrop, spy on the president, the average person has no chance.

00:17:05.620 And for the very first, I've always been very pro-law enforcement and pro-FBI, et cetera, et cetera.

00:17:12.100 You know, I'm skeptical about corruption, but I've always felt like it's, you know, a few bad apples.

00:17:17.000 When it comes to Washington, D.C., there isn't an institution that I believe in now.

00:17:23.240 I believe in the principles that were lined up by our founders and are, you know, up for show for the little people in the archives.

00:17:32.580 But those are never used by those institutions, it seems to me.

00:17:36.560 And you don't you don't know where to turn.

00:17:39.800 You know, you can't turn to the press.

00:17:42.260 Yeah.

00:17:42.440 You can't turn to the government.

00:17:44.960 Where where does the average person turn?

00:17:47.360 And that's why I think you're reporting is is so important.

00:17:51.320 And I want to get into the way this has been used for January 6th.

00:17:59.040 And and Ray Epps, I want to get into.

00:18:03.220 But I think we should start with Whitmer and and tell that story.

00:18:10.680 Yes, no, Whitmer is a very important story.

00:18:15.380 And actually, the very first piece that kind of focused the appropriate narrative on January 6th, before the first revolver.news piece that really analyzed the charging documents in relation to the Oath Keepers and presented the thesis that there is very likely FBI involvement here.

00:18:37.020 Before that, there were disparate narratives going on like, oh, it was a bunch of people taking selfies.

00:18:43.660 And there's a lot of truth to that.

00:18:45.380 Oh, it was Antifa or something.

00:18:47.280 But there wasn't the appropriate focus before that.

00:18:53.120 And part of the reason is that, you know, we hadn't looked at the charging documents and seen this kind of reverse RICO structure whereby you have a lot of the little fish wallowing in prison where and the bigger fish heads of the militia groups in some cases just enjoying their lives, walking away free.

00:19:12.280 But also, it's just, again, I think it goes to this kind of veneration for the institutions, this trust in authority, saying like, you know, maybe they would do this, but they wouldn't do that.

00:19:25.880 The feds wouldn't, you know, go into incitement.

00:19:28.280 And of course, if you look at the long history of the FBI, it's very clear that they are capable of doing those things, and they have.

00:19:38.800 But we pointed out in this very first revolver piece that you don't need to go back to the 60s and look at the history of the FBI.

00:19:46.980 You just need to go back a couple months before the so-called siege of the national capital to this Michigan plot that you mentioned.

00:19:55.800 Now, what was the Michigan plot?

00:19:58.020 Many of your viewers probably heard about it in the context of the media ginning up this idea like, oh, the Trump supporters are terrorists.

00:20:06.020 They tried to kidnap the Michigan governor and whatnot.

00:20:10.000 Well, it turns out that out of this so-called Michigan plot, 12 of the 26 plotters were either fed agents or fed informants.

00:20:23.600 12 out of 26, which is a remarkable ratio.

00:20:27.820 Now, just a couple more.

00:20:30.580 And, you know, it's really a fed.

00:20:32.460 Right.

00:20:32.900 No, no, it's it's it's remarkable.

00:20:35.000 So that alone is a whopping statistic.

00:20:39.080 But what else?

00:20:40.060 Well, most people think of it, this Michigan plot, as the plot to kidnap the governor, which it allegedly was.

00:20:47.400 But it was also a plot to storm the state capital, to storm the state Michigan capital.

00:20:54.600 So there's an interesting similarity there.

00:20:56.700 It also involved predominantly an organization called the three percenters, which is one of the three main militia groups also imputed to the, quote unquote, insurrection aspects of one six.

00:21:12.300 And so you have the same militia group, the same plot storming the capital.

00:21:16.620 Only in this case, we know for a fact that 12 out of the 26 so-called plotters were actually feds.

00:21:23.900 And I always say the cherry on top of the Michigan case is that the FBI director of the Detroit field office, who was presumably overseeing this entire infiltration operation in Michigan.

00:21:38.500 The day after these so-called plotters were arrested, FBI director, Ray, promoted this Detroit field office guy to the D.C. field office.

00:21:51.260 His name is Stephen D'Antuono.

00:21:53.260 He was promoted to the D.C. office where he went on to oversee the one six investigations.

00:21:58.880 So there are many, many fascinating, fascinating parallels, to say the least.

00:22:05.160 Now, I like to be very precise in what I'm claiming, what I'm not claiming.

00:22:09.180 I'm not saying that the fact that the Michigan case, which involved one of the same militia groups, involved the same plot to storm a state capital and whose director was promoted to D.C.

00:22:21.240 the day after the plotters were arrested.

00:22:23.540 I'm not saying that all of those coincidences logically imply that one six was the same thing.

00:22:32.620 I'm saying that there's independent, compelling evidence for one six.

00:22:37.160 But for those who have some kind of heuristic blockage, as though this this couldn't really be plausible, we wouldn't really do that.

00:22:44.360 I'm saying, look, you don't you don't need to read a history of the FBI.

00:22:47.900 All you need to do is go months back where they're doing precisely the same thing that I'm suggesting went on in one six.

00:22:55.000 It doesn't you don't need an intuition boost from going back in history.

00:22:59.720 You just need to look at what they did a couple of months before involving the same groups in the same plot.

00:23:05.520 So let me stop here.

00:23:07.300 There was a book written.

00:23:10.560 I'm trying to remember who wrote it called Blacklisted by History.

00:23:14.100 And I read the first couple of chapters and it was kind of a red pill.

00:23:19.440 And I read the first couple of chapters and I realized if this were true, it would change me.

00:23:27.000 I would have to change a lot of the things that I believed about our history, about government, et cetera, et cetera.

00:23:33.420 And and I I closed the book and said, I've got to talk to the author first.

00:23:41.300 I want to know the author.

00:23:42.900 I want to make sure he's not a crazy man.

00:23:45.420 And, you know, and I called him.

00:23:47.700 I think he was over in England and he made perfect sense.

00:23:50.760 And so I read it and it changed my mind.

00:23:53.720 That book changed me.

00:23:55.960 I saw events in American history in a different way.

00:23:59.320 This is one of those things.

00:24:00.500 But this one, if this is now, it's not history and it involves the the most respected American law enforcement and the highest law enforcement agency in America.

00:24:17.360 And I think it's frightening to go down this road.

00:24:22.720 I would imagine if I'm listening to you, there's a big part of me that doesn't want to believe this.

00:24:29.020 Whether it's true or not, I don't want to because what it means.

00:24:35.180 Can we talk about the psychology of this just a little bit before we move on?

00:24:41.300 No, absolutely.

00:24:42.240 And it gets back to kind of what I was saying earlier, is that I think part of especially the conservative political psychology is we want to be defenders of just institutions of authority.

00:24:57.260 But what happens when those institutions are far from just and not only are they unjust, but they're hostile towards us.

00:25:08.240 That's that's a very difficult position to be in versus those on the left who are already primed to challenge unjust institutions of authority, at least according to their political psychology.

00:25:20.320 We want to be in a kind of country where we can support our law enforcement institutions, especially the FBI.

00:25:28.400 We want to be able to support our generals in the military and so forth.

00:25:33.760 And we want to be able to do this.

00:25:36.020 And so it's a tougher pill to swallow to see that they're actually not functioning anywhere near the way that we would we would want or expect.

00:25:45.360 I think it goes deeper than that.

00:25:47.300 It goes to, well, then I'm alone.

00:25:50.780 If I believe this, the power structure is now against me and all those things I used to hang on to of, you know, truth, justice in the American way.

00:26:03.960 Those are all gone.

00:26:05.320 And so now I have to chart a new course and it's completely foreign to me to not have the faith that the good guys win in the end.

00:26:19.740 Right.

00:26:20.500 And I totally understand that.

00:26:22.660 And I wish I could present some kind of optimistic rejoinder in which I kind of sincerely believe.

00:26:32.160 But it's a difficult position.

00:26:33.700 But I would say that it's better to have a sober understanding of the reality than to rest on on fiction, because it's only on the basis of a sober understanding of what you're up against, that you're actually in a position to address it, even if it's a long, hard road.

00:26:51.780 Versus, I think, in terms of the implications, many people, again, on the right are so, I think, inordinately focused on winning elections.

00:27:05.060 Not to say that it's a bad thing to win elections.

00:27:07.600 Obviously, it's a great thing.

00:27:08.960 And we had a great result in Virginia the other day.

00:27:12.380 But I think it's important to note that winning elections can only get you so far if you have the security apparatus against you.

00:27:21.260 And I think that the story of the Trump administration illustrates that very well, is that you can have the people on your side.

00:27:31.720 But if every major institution is against you, there's only so much you can accomplish, and especially when the national security state is against you.

00:27:40.320 When you have organizations like the FBI, Army counterintelligence, and so forth, looking at right wing groups as national security targets to infiltrate and to set up, that is a profound political bottleneck that is not captured in this kind of narrow focus on winning elections.

00:28:00.660 So I've been inclined to say that unless and until we bring this national security bureaucracy to heel and back within its appropriate place, pretty much all of electoral politics will be fake and performative because it will run up on this bottleneck.

00:28:20.720 And because there's this feeling of being so alone and helpless when you recognize the institutions that are right against you, there's this strong urge to just kind of suck on electoral victories like a pacifier and to pretend that this is the answer to it.

00:28:39.860 But the answer, I think, it needs to be much more robust, much more difficult.

00:28:44.040 It requires narrative focus, which I think I'm very happy that our reporting has provided some narrative focus.

00:28:54.740 But the solution is much more difficult than simply, oh, we need to win the next election because, yeah.

00:29:02.460 So let's go to the solution after we talk about the issue.

00:29:06.580 Let's start with January 6th.

00:29:09.180 What most people will tell you happened is they were, you know, verifying the vote and people went to go to a speech.

00:29:20.380 Some people went.

00:29:21.440 They got out of hand.

00:29:23.060 Some of them were were dangerous or crazy.

00:29:27.520 And most people there were not.

00:29:31.660 The police were completely surprised by it.

00:29:35.380 Nancy Pelosi hadn't done anything to make sure that we had more security there, but she was surprised by it.

00:29:43.240 And it took everybody by surprise.

00:29:46.160 And and then we I'm not sure if we got the bad guys.

00:29:49.960 I know we I know we've got a lot of grandmas, but I'm not sure if we got the bad guys.

00:29:54.220 That's pretty much the narrative that I think you would hear from the average person that, you know, is middle of the ground or leaning right.

00:30:02.580 Right. And yes.

00:30:07.920 So what what's important about the narrative of one and how much and how much and how much of that is how much of that is even true?

00:30:16.520 What I just said.

00:30:18.260 Right. Well, some of it, some of it is true.

00:30:21.220 I think the the general truth about the people that you see in the footage and everything is that there were people there for Trump rally, that there were some things that the Capitol Police did that sort of incited the energy of the crowd unnecessarily.

00:30:38.720 And a lot of people got caught up in sort of crowd psychology that was, I think, ginned up by various provocateurs, which we can get to.

00:30:47.820 But people did get caught up in the crowd psychology.

00:30:51.480 In many cases, the doors at the Capitol were open.

00:30:54.820 And so all of these factors combined, you get what you see.

00:30:58.980 The notion that any of the criminal activity on one six elevates anywhere near nine eleven, which is now the preferred comparison in the government and the regime media is totally absurd.

00:31:15.180 The only person killed in cold blood was a Trump supporter veteran called Ashley Babbitt.

00:31:20.500 So so in that respect, that's basically what the narrative is.

00:31:26.580 As for the infiltration, that's a very specific subgroup.

00:31:32.640 And that involves some of the militia organizations that, as you'll note in the reporting on one six, it's the militia groups that did this, quote unquote, military stack.

00:31:43.680 And which was, you know, not very impressive in the first place.

00:31:47.540 But there is a very narrow group of sort of militias that are being charged with conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding.

00:31:56.020 Those are the most serious charges.

00:31:58.560 The Oath Keeper militia group specifically is the most prosecuted group associated with one six.

00:32:03.820 And when you look at the militia groups, especially at the leadership level, that's when it starts to get very suspicious as to what role did the feds play.

00:32:14.780 And as I mentioned, in the very first Revolver's thesis piece presenting this, we looked at the charging documents related to the militia groups.

00:32:23.920 And what we found is.

00:32:26.240 In many cases.

00:32:28.960 The people referenced in those charging documents who were occupied a more senior position than those people charged, whose behavior is more egregious than the people charged.

00:32:41.300 They're referenced, but they're not indicted.

00:32:43.980 And so we said, here's a real question that the feds have to answer.

00:32:48.940 How do you account for the selective non-prosecution of more senior militia members who, if the other people are indicted, they're doing just as much, if not more?

00:32:59.200 How do you account for that?

00:33:00.860 And in a follow-up piece, we zeroed in on a very specific person.

00:33:04.800 That is Stuart Rhodes, who's the founder and head of the Oath Keepers.

00:33:08.220 And we pointed out the extraordinary degree of federal protection that he seems to enjoy, that is very difficult to provide an innocent explanation for.

00:33:18.720 And so I'm happy to go into details.

00:33:20.560 So let's go there.

00:33:21.420 To details of that.

00:33:23.120 But this is, this is, I think, an important part of the story.

00:33:28.640 And there are two sort of narrative possibilities.

00:33:33.560 When Klobuchar, Senator Klobuchar, asked FBI Director Wray, she said, don't you just kick yourself that you didn't have any informants in there and you just weren't ready?

00:33:44.020 You weren't ready for the event. 0.95

00:33:45.560 So don't you just kick yourself? 0.72

00:33:47.300 And he said, oh, yeah, we will try to do better next time and so forth. 0.90

00:33:51.960 She set up the question for him to deflect.

00:33:54.320 She didn't say, did you have?

00:33:56.220 She said, don't you kick yourself that you didn't have?

00:33:59.160 Well, now we know for a fact that they did have.

00:34:01.920 In fact, there was a New York Times piece that came out essentially vindicating some of our original reporting at Revolver News.

00:34:08.940 And the New York Times piece talked about a proud boy who was in the Capitol that day texting his FBI handler contemporaneously throughout the entire day.

00:34:21.040 Now, it's one thing if the feds had informants.

00:34:24.860 What that means is that the feds would have been informed in advance and they simply, for whatever reason, decided to do nothing to provide the requisite security to prevent it.

00:34:36.000 So they sit back and just let it happen on purpose, presumably for political reasons.

00:34:42.360 But there's an even darker possibility, which I think the evidence points to strongly, which is more than just that they were informed and they did nothing.

00:34:51.100 But some of the key, most proactive players in some of the most egregious elements of 1-6 were actually government affiliated or government people.

00:35:03.700 And that is to say there's a distinction between the government knowing in advance and doing nothing and the government taking a more proactive participatory role in inciting the event.

00:35:15.400 And the latter category is precisely what we saw happened in Michigan.

00:35:19.960 And I think it's also what we see in 1-6.

00:35:25.560 Well, that would explain why they did nothing.

00:35:28.300 Let's go back prior to 1-6.

00:35:30.520 When did this plot, do you think, started?

00:35:33.100 Do you have any idea?

00:35:36.220 I don't.

00:35:37.040 Now, what I do know is that there is in the mountains of documentary footage and all the video that exists related to 1-6, there's footage of one person who explicitly and repeatedly calls for going into the Capitol the evening before.

00:35:57.120 And that person is Ray Epps.

00:35:59.460 And this is not just some random crazy in the crowd who comes up with an idea, you know, maybe on drugs and say, oh, let's go into the Capitol, guys, and then that's it.

00:36:10.180 No.

00:36:11.320 He's going from group to group on the 5th, the evening before.

00:36:17.000 And, you know, there are different people on the streets there for different reasons.

00:36:20.920 Some people were pissed off about the election.

00:36:23.640 Some people just wanted to support Trump.

00:36:25.660 Some people just wanted to see what was going on.

00:36:28.320 There are people clashing with Black Lives Matter.

00:36:30.920 There's a lot of different people, different energies.

00:36:33.800 And he went to the various groups refocusing them on his stated mission, which was we need to go into the Capitol.

00:36:44.940 And he was not received very well.

00:36:47.460 People, in fact, you know, explicitly said, no, this guy's a Fed.

00:36:51.620 He didn't give up and he didn't disappear.

00:36:54.500 In fact, he was there.

00:36:55.940 It was a veritable where's Waldo situation.

00:36:59.400 On the 6th, he is literally everywhere, all sides of the Capitol seeming to persist with his Michigan, directing people to the Capitol, saying we need to go into the Capitol.

00:37:12.880 That's where our problems are.

00:37:15.220 And then, remarkably, but not surprisingly, given his past statements, the very first breach of the Capitol grounds, the barriers, which occurred as Trump was speaking.

00:37:26.920 It's important to point out, this was before the main crowd went to the Capitol at all.

00:37:32.380 There were people by those barriers who broke them down.

00:37:34.940 And the very first breach of the Capitol grounds a guy called Ryan Samsell, who's in jail and has been persecuted in jail under pretty horrible conditions.

00:37:48.560 But he was the guy who first broke down the fence.

00:37:53.360 And Ray Epps was standing right by him and whispered in his ear two seconds before he breaks down the barrier.

00:38:02.720 And where is he?

00:38:06.400 He's at his ranch right now.

00:38:08.800 Initially, the FBI put his face on its 20 most wanted people for January 6th.

00:38:14.720 They said they did their whole spiel where they say, we need the public's help in identifying this man.

00:38:20.800 The Internet, being the remarkable sort of crowdsourced research tool that it is, came up with his identity within days.

00:38:28.980 The feds did nothing with it, just crickets.

00:38:31.420 Until finally, like four months later, the day after Revolver News ran its piece on Oathkeeper founder and leader Stuart Rhodes, the day after that, the FBI quietly scrubbed Ray Epps' face from its most wanted database.

00:38:47.920 And ever since then, they've had nothing to say about this guy, who, of all people, from the video evidence seems to be if there's anyone who's one of the main orchestrators of the initial breach, it's this guy.

00:39:02.680 And he is riding around in the golf cart by his ranch.

00:39:06.520 And other people, the grandmas, are rotting away in Abu Ghraib style conditions in D.C. prisons.

00:39:13.860 That doesn't add up.

00:39:15.080 So tell me it doesn't. Tell me who he is.

00:39:18.180 What do we know about him?

00:39:21.040 Well, we know that he is a veteran.

00:39:24.360 He's a Marine veteran.

00:39:25.560 He is, I would say, in many ways, quite impressive.

00:39:29.940 I was particularly impressed by his professional demeanor throughout the fifth and the sixth.

00:39:34.920 There is a lot of, you know, a lot of energy in the crowds, a lot of people like calling him a fed.

00:39:40.400 Like he's the equanimity that he demonstrated was professional and quite impressive.

00:39:46.860 He was there.

00:39:48.140 He it looks like he was there to do a job and he was focused on that job.

00:39:53.220 He had a natural kind of command over the crowds.

00:39:56.360 It's remarkable how he's just standing there saying people go here, people go there.

00:40:00.300 People listen to him because he seems like a he has an authoritative presence in that respect.

00:40:07.760 But he was very focused, very cool, very detached and professional, which, again, I think is a big red flag.

00:40:14.120 Because one of the things that you typically see in provocateurs is this bizarre, this kind of bizarre combination of emotional detachment with kind of radical suggestions.

00:40:27.420 Whereas there are a lot of people who got emotionally kind of wrapped up in in the event and they were not cool and detached.

00:40:35.480 And whereas he was so, you know, cool as a cucumber, let's go into the Capitol, radical suggestions combined with a detached demeanor.

00:40:45.900 So that's another interesting thing about him.

00:40:48.540 Another thing which might explain why the FBI decided to scrub his face the day after the Revolver News report on Oath Keeper Stuart Rhodes is that he is a former president of the Arizona chapter of the Oath Keepers.

00:41:09.280 So that's kind of interesting.

00:41:11.140 And in our piece, we present all kinds of footage from the past of him palling around with Stuart Rhodes and such, his former boss, his former Oath Keeper boss.

00:41:21.920 So that's also an interesting thing about him.

00:41:25.520 And that's that's basically that's basically it.

00:41:30.040 All right. So, I mean, we had a nationwide search.

00:41:33.580 This was I mean, they were.

00:41:36.600 They took the military down, put it on, you know, stand, you know, stand by to be able to get anybody who might be a radical.

00:41:44.760 You have this guy that they identified early.

00:41:47.520 There's tape of him orchestrating.

00:41:51.200 And he's on the most wanted list.

00:41:53.880 And then they don't arrest him.

00:41:55.520 They don't question him.

00:41:57.700 Nothing.

00:41:58.140 Not that I know of, like, it's possible that they questioned him and we just don't know about it.

00:42:04.600 But he's he's not indicted.

00:42:06.960 He's not indicted.

00:42:08.180 Now, there's a possibility that they questioned him and he agreed to kind of cooperate.

00:42:13.040 And that's why they're not touching him.

00:42:14.820 I don't find that explanation terribly persuasive simply because of the seemingly professional,

00:42:21.980 professional, provocative role that he played on January 5th and January 6th.

00:42:27.800 And the fact that in my judgment, looking at the footage of him, he appears to be the one of the primary orchestrators of the initial breach.

00:42:39.060 So who could he be?

00:42:40.640 Who could be he be informing on?

00:42:42.520 He seems to be a major player in that.

00:42:44.480 And so the idea that they would just kind of leave them after putting him on their top 20 most wanted is very bizarre.

00:42:52.400 And so I think the case of Ray Epps is is hard to present an innocent explanation for.

00:43:01.260 And similarly, I think the case of Stuart Rhodes, which if we have time, I get it.

00:43:07.300 Let's go there now.

00:43:08.040 Let's go there now.

00:43:09.080 So what did your what should your audience know about him?

00:43:13.740 We've we've done so much extensive reporting on him.

00:43:16.680 So for the full stuff, go to revolver.news, read the full report.

00:43:20.000 It's incredibly comprehensive.

00:43:21.620 But what are the cliff notes with this guy?

00:43:23.980 So here is the founder and the leader of the Oath Keepers, which is the most prosecuted militia group associated with one six. 0.62

00:43:34.560 The Oath Keepers is involved in all of the boogeyman type reporting on one six of the military stack of the conspiracy, all of this stuff.

00:43:46.620 All of the boogeyman reporting is really most concentrated in the Oath Keepers.

00:43:53.460 And Stuart Rhodes is the founder of the Oath Keepers.

00:43:56.540 And when you look at the charging documents, I'll take a specific one.

00:44:01.020 So there's an individual called Thomas Caldwell, who is presented in the media as the leader of the Oath Keepers.

00:44:07.620 It's in fact, he's not a leader far from it.

00:44:09.820 He's not even an official member.

00:44:11.320 He's someone who Stuart Rhodes met at a at a some kind of political rally before and they got to talking.

00:44:21.940 And basically, that's how Caldwell got wrapped up in it.

00:44:24.980 He's a 60 year old disabled military vet.

00:44:31.540 He's not terribly threatening in any capacity, but he's indicted.

00:44:37.520 He faces very serious charges, conspiracy charges.

00:44:40.580 And the remarkable thing is, if you look at the documents in his charges, the government's case, when they argue for the existence of this conspiracy, rely overwhelmingly to the point of near exclusivity on Stuart Rhodes' statements and actions.

00:45:00.840 And again, to give the full account, you have to look at the article or we need more time.

00:45:05.200 I'm just giving the cliff notes.

00:45:06.980 But if you look at those documents, the government relies overwhelmingly near exclusively on Stuart Rhodes' statements and actions to constitute the conspiracy that they're charging Thomas Caldwell for.

00:45:21.020 Which is very strange, because if it were a Rico type situation where they go their way around, guys, yeah, they go up to the little guys to get the big guys.

00:45:32.380 They only do that when they don't have enough to go after the big guys. 0.95

00:45:36.280 Whereas in the case of Rhodes, there's evidence of him trespassing on the Capitol, which is a stupid and trivial charge. 0.97

00:45:44.740 But others have been charged for it. 0.96

00:45:46.180 And if they're as desperate as they claim to be for him, they could have gotten him for that.

00:45:50.980 Furthermore, if they're charging Caldwell for this conspiracy and they're using Rhodes' statements and actions to constitute that very conspiracy, they could have, you know, it's very puzzling why they haven't gone after him.

00:46:05.920 And perhaps even more puzzling than the fact that Stuart Rhodes, after eight or nine months, remains unindicted while a lot of the underlings and fellow travelers remain indicted, is the fact that Rhodes hasn't even been properly searched.

00:46:22.160 So a lot of people, even people who aren't charged with 1-6 related things, people who have the remotest association with it, have received the full kitchen sink treatment by the FBI in terms of the feds going to people's houses, knocking down the door.

00:46:42.980 Yeah, I know a couple in Alaska that, you know, early in the morning while they're laying in bed, they come knocking on the door and throw them down.

00:46:53.540 And I mean, exactly.

00:46:55.040 And they take everything, every single electronic device in the house they take.

00:46:59.780 There's even cases of them taking like some 11-year-old girl's tablet because it happened to be in the house.

00:47:05.800 So that's the full treatment.

00:47:07.200 And that's the treatment that people get who aren't even charged.

00:47:10.160 The feds are just saying, oh, they might have communications with people who that we might want to charge.

00:47:15.620 And yet in the case of Stuart Rhodes, whose phone calls are everywhere in the charging documents, who's the founder and head of the most prosecuted group associated with 1-6, the extent of the search that they conducted on him was they took a single cell phone from him when he was in his car four months after January 6th.

00:47:37.160 Four months after.

00:47:40.620 How do you, how, how does, or do they just not answer?

00:47:44.340 How does somebody logically.

00:47:45.620 They don't answer.

00:47:46.420 They don't answer.

00:47:47.440 They don't answer.

00:47:48.440 But I would offer a possible explanation.

00:47:52.320 And that is this, that they don't want his electronic communications, because as we saw in the story of New York Times story of this proud boy in the Capitol texting his FBI handler.

00:48:05.320 And as we saw in the Michigan case, one of the key informants basically got outed because of a leaked text message between the informant and the handler.

00:48:15.680 The feds don't want the electronic evidence because there's something called the Brady rule that obliges the prosecution and the government to hand over all potentially exculpatory evidence to the defense.

00:48:31.620 And that would certainly include evidence regarding informants and undercover agents.

00:48:36.620 So if, if it is the case that Rhodes has some type of undisclosed relationship with the feds, they would have every incentive not to collect his electronics, give him four months to dispose of whatever kind of incriminating communications he might have.

00:48:54.700 And then do just a total, just total performance art type search where they take a single cell phone four months after.

00:49:04.980 And even in that case, according to a lawyer for, for Rhodes, she suggested that that search pertained to their investigation into someone else.

00:49:15.180 So that may not even be an investigation to Rhodes.

00:49:17.780 And yet all of the left wing media, all of the mainstream media, they're the ones now who want to trust the authorities.

00:49:26.180 They're saying any minute now, any minute now they're going to get Rhodes because he's the big bad orchestrator of the whole thing any minute now.

00:49:33.940 And they're just afflicted with this profound cognitive dissonance because the most parsimonious and persuasive explanation for why he enjoys such federal protection is not one that these mainstream and left wing journalists want to entertain.

00:49:50.000 Because then they'd have to acknowledge that they are serving these powerful and corrupt institutions rather than challenging them.

00:49:57.660 And that this whole narrative that's been set up not just to throw grandmas in prison for trivial offenses, but in a larger sense, the whole narrative that's been set up to cast over 70 million Americans as domestic terrorists for their political beliefs, that that whole narrative is based on not just a lie, but a malicious lie and a malicious scheme by their own government.

00:50:24.340 The very national security institutions that want to prosecute this false domestic war and terror were responsible for setting up the false narrative in the first place.

00:50:36.780 This is so crazy. I mean, this is the Reichstag fire.

00:50:40.780 And I think we found out, didn't we find out in the end that it was the the communists that said it, but it could very well have been, you know, the Nazis who said it and blamed it.

00:50:52.060 I remember on January 6th, when this was happening before the break in before the speech, I said, if you're going, please watch who you're standing next to.

00:51:02.000 I mean, this just feels like the perfect opportunity to have a Reichstag fire.

00:51:07.680 When I first when I first saw it, it didn't seem to me that it was.

00:51:12.620 I mean, I've been around conservatives for a very long time.

00:51:17.440 They're not the ones that burn up the Capitol, you know what I mean?

00:51:21.620 Right. And there's yeah, there's a remarkable record of of all the Trump rallies.

00:51:29.200 How many of there have been riots like zero? Right.

00:51:32.060 And that's and that's why it was so obvious when someone like Ray Epps said we need to go into the Capitol.

00:51:38.620 It was so obvious that he wasn't part of the group.

00:51:42.120 And and that's why people literally started chanting Fed, Fed, Fed after he said that, because it was so out of keeping with the ordinary conduct of of those Trump supporters, of those, you know, Americans who just wanted to express their beliefs peacefully in a an organized demonstration.

00:52:02.820 So. So. So. So let me go back to because you've you've made this point a couple of times that the prison situation or the jail situation is atrocious.

00:52:13.500 Right. You can't hear this except from one of their attorneys.

00:52:19.280 You know, there's Congress just said, hey, you got to go look.

00:52:23.620 And they came back and said, oh, no, there's nothing bad there.

00:52:26.500 It's it's fine. Other parts of the jail are worse.

00:52:30.660 But they're part of the jail seem to be OK.

00:52:34.220 What's the truth on how these people are being held?

00:52:38.100 Well, this is a subject on which I'm, you know, I've taken an interest, but I can't claim to be a subject matter expert.

00:52:44.680 And there's a great reporter who sort of my partner, comrade in reporting this called Julie Kelly.

00:52:55.680 And she's an expert on the conditions in these prisons, which I can only say from what I've what I've read are really atrocious.

00:53:05.460 There are people being held in solitary confinement.

00:53:07.860 There are people in all types of horrible conditions.

00:53:10.360 There's, you know, mold and, you know, a lot of these people are old and they're not in a position health wise to to live under these kind of squalid and difficult conditions.

00:53:22.540 And there are some cases of direct physical abuse on the part of guards.

00:53:27.460 In fact, Ryan Samsell, the person who allegedly is the first person to break the barrier after Ray Epps whispered in his ear two seconds before he was beaten up by guards.

00:53:43.660 And I find his case actually very interesting because, first of all, he knows what Ray Epps whispered in his ear.

00:53:53.380 Hmm.

00:53:54.480 I find that very interesting.

00:53:56.160 He knows.

00:53:56.760 I don't think that he is a fed. 1.00

00:53:59.260 I think he's someone who is just kind of foolish and suggestible, who did something very stupid and unstable. 0.99

00:54:07.700 Uh, that doesn't mean he deserves to be brutalized by prison guards, but, um, he certainly would know what Ray Epps said, and he might have more insight into the other people who are orchestrating the initial breach. 0.99

00:54:22.600 And it could be an intimidation factor.

00:54:25.920 It could be why they're beating him up because they say, look, you know, if you, if you go public with what you might or might not know about Ray Epps or these other people, you're going to have hell to pay.

00:54:38.200 And additionally, it's interesting that whereas all these other people, the government prefers to charge like multiple charges with conspiracy charges.

00:54:48.140 Samsell is charged as a standalone case.

00:54:52.600 Which also doesn't make any sense because there was like coordinated activity leading to that initial breach.

00:54:59.800 So why in so many other cases, including the Oath Keepers cases, they charge a bunch of people in conspiracy and they hit this guy with standalone cases.

00:55:08.440 It seems like they're deliberately constructing things so as to cordon him off from the other people that he was coordinating and communicating with leading up to that initial breach in order possibly to protect, uh, people like Ray Epps.

00:55:22.600 So is there such a thing as a fair trial here?

00:55:26.580 Is there, is there such a thing as getting to the bottom of this?

00:55:31.800 Well, those are two different questions.

00:55:33.840 Um, I hope that there's a possibility of a fair trial.

00:55:37.100 There's, it's, it's a dubious prospect, um, in DC, that's for sure.

00:55:43.320 So the jurisdiction will matter.

00:55:45.620 Other factors will matter.

00:55:46.880 In some cases, these people have, um, incompetent, uh, legal counsel.

00:55:52.760 And in some cases it might even be worse than incompetence, uh, which is something I'm looking into, but is too speculative at this point to go into greater detail.

00:56:03.400 Um, but as for, will the truth come out?

00:56:07.720 Well, I did mention a, uh, this thing called the Brady rule.

00:56:12.040 And, and that does oblige the government to hand over potentially a sculptatory information that could involve information about informants.

00:56:20.320 In the Michigan case, the lead defense counsel in that case, I believe his name is, uh, Blanchard, has made this a key part of the defense strategy to point out the extent of infiltration and the nature of what the informants were doing.

00:56:40.180 It's one thing if it's just, they have informants passively sitting around.

00:56:43.880 It's another, if the informants provide such proactive support for the plan that it wouldn't have happened had it not been for the feds involvement.

00:56:54.120 And it looks like that's the case in Michigan and that's become a key part of the defense strategy.

00:57:00.400 I think similarly, the defense counsel in the one six cases, they need to get up to speed.

00:57:08.260 They need to wake up.

00:57:09.480 They need to take some cues from the Michigan case and they need to make the infiltration, the federal involvement in one six, a key part of their defense strategy.

00:57:20.320 I think that will help their, uh, uh, their, their, their, uh, the defendants and also will help the American public get the full truth or at least a fuller truth about exactly what happened on that day.

00:57:33.320 Why do they not want us?

00:57:34.520 Why do they not want us to see the tapes?

00:57:36.640 What do you think is on the tapes?

00:57:40.160 That's another great question.

00:57:41.920 Um, I don't know.

00:57:43.540 I can only speculate.

00:57:44.560 I, I, I would imagine that if the tapes were made available, you'd see a lot more interest instances of, uh, provocateur type activity.

00:57:54.280 I think even more so you'll see instances of, uh, maybe, uh, Capitol police officers letting people in the building and so forth.

00:58:03.480 And that would discredit the narrative that people are just bashing, bashing in and going in.

00:58:09.120 Most people went in when it was already, uh, inviting them with, with open doors.

00:58:14.100 And as for the people who are bashing down the windows and so forth, they appear to be coordinated and they're dressed all in black.

00:58:23.200 And we still don't know who these people are.

00:58:25.260 And I suspect that maybe the government has footage of that type of activity that they don't want the public to have.

00:58:32.840 So, um, so those are just some possible reasons.

00:58:37.380 In the, in the, in the aftermath, we had, um, uh, we had the Capitol police go silent with the police officer that shot, which is bizarre.

00:58:49.740 Cause you know, the name of the police officer within five minutes of a discharge of a gun in almost all cases.

00:58:55.580 Um, and then you had the, uh, the, uh, Nancy Pelosi authorize the Capitol police to get, uh, Pentagon equipment to become an intelligence agency and listen and track people in DC.

00:59:15.740 Tell me about that.

00:59:16.920 Well, it's an interesting development and the Capitol police seem to be expanding their operations.

00:59:23.780 They're opening up, uh, uh, a shop and base in Florida.

00:59:28.520 They're expanding.

00:59:29.960 It's, it's, it's strange, uh, but they enjoy certain advantages.

00:59:35.160 For instance, Capitol, uh, police as a, uh, legislative institution, they're exempt from FOIA,

00:59:41.560 which is an advantage for a, uh, uh, uh, an institution of that sort.

00:59:47.420 Yeah.

00:59:47.960 Um, it's, but yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's very bizarre.

00:59:51.940 Um, it's, it's disturbing that that would happen to any kind of, um, sort of enforcement organization, the kind of militarization that you see,

01:00:02.160 especially when the militarization now is basically pointed at 70 plus million Americans who happen to object to the direction of the,

01:00:11.860 the Biden regime and otherwise.

01:00:13.800 So it's, uh, it's just part of this new trend, this new domestic war on terror, uh, aimed, aimed at all of us.

01:00:25.340 Trump in the involvement, any involvement, what's that any involvement from Donald Trump?

01:00:32.160 Um, in terms of what?

01:00:34.700 Any of the stuff that happened on January 6th?

01:00:39.080 Well, I mean, he gave, he gave a speech, but I think that's entirely, uh, appropriate as a speech.

01:00:45.380 I wish that he would, um, uh, lend his voice toward the narrative of potential FBI involvement, potential government involvement.

01:00:55.820 And just generally, um, I would say, I wish he had taken a kind of more active role in, uh, expressing concern for the people who have been, uh, unjustly, uh, prosecuted, uh, as a result of, uh, 1-6. 0.74

01:01:12.980 As for the kind of the idea that, uh, Trump was sort of incited or is part of the conspiracy, I think that's very far-fetched and ridiculous.

01:01:22.620 But I will point out that it's, it's an interesting tie-in that the head of the January 6th commission in Congress, his name is, uh, Benny Thompson.

01:01:33.720 Now, Benny Thompson, in his personal private capacity, uh, initiated a lawsuit against Donald Trump, against Roger Stone, against the Proud Boys, and against the Oath Keepers.

01:01:51.720 And in this lawsuit, he presents his own theory of the case. 0.51

01:01:57.180 And in this theory of the case, the Oath Keepers and Proud Boys were coordinating with Trump's inner circle to plan this riot in advance, which I think is fairly ridiculous.

01:02:11.280 But what's interesting about this is that the Oath Keepers appear, they're, there's, they have a star role in Benny Thompson's personal lawsuit presenting his theory of the case.

01:02:24.420 And he even sent this, uh, lawsuit to Rhodes to notify him of it and had like a big, you know, bold letters, attention, Stuart Rhodes.

01:02:34.660 Now, Benny Thompson is the chair of the 1-6 commission, and he hasn't said a word about Stuart Rhodes.

01:02:42.380 He has no interest in Stuart Rhodes.

01:02:44.320 He's just as uninterested in Stuart Rhodes' communications as the FBI and government are.

01:02:51.180 And, and the commission is demanding the communications record of seemingly anyone who set foot in the Capitol within a month of 1-6, everyone except for Rhodes.

01:03:01.720 So I just think that's an additional detail that's quite remarkable that the head of the commission did a lawsuit presenting a theory of the case in which Stuart Rhodes takes a key role.

01:03:14.500 And now that this guy runs the entire January 6th commission, he's expressed zero interest in Stuart Rhodes.

01:03:21.500 So, uh, so, so tell me, you, you said earlier that maybe that, you know, that we had, uh, we had a way out, uh, that you had some suggestions on what could be done.

01:03:33.580 What are those?

01:03:35.920 Well, um, there are some, uh, historical precedents for bringing the national security state to heal.

01:03:42.840 I think we're somewhat, uh, uh, uh, at a distance from being able to achieve this in the same way, but we should focus our efforts toward that end.

01:03:54.800 There is something called the church committee that you might recall, uh, that was, uh, set up a big kind of congressional commission that, uh, basically detailed the, uh, excesses and abuses of the intelligence community, the CIA, the FBI,

01:04:10.700 and attempted with some degree of success to bring them back under the kind of fold for a little while of appropriate democratic control.

01:04:20.600 Um, I think for various reasons, it would be difficult to replicate that now, but I think it should be a focus.

01:04:29.620 And I think people on the right should understand the, uh, corruption and abuses and basically the current configuration of the national security state as the predominant bottleneck to any kind of true political victory can win elections.

01:04:51.040 You can have electoral victories, but you won't have political victories until this national security bottleneck is somehow addressed.

01:05:00.860 And the first step of that, I think is, um, delegitimizing these, uh, institutions in the eyes of the right, because they still maintain a certain degree of implicit, uh, authority.

01:05:14.900 And it's very important that they be exposed for what they are and their corrupt activities be exposed.

01:05:22.380 And I think it ultimately, it does matter.

01:05:25.040 It doesn't get us everywhere, but it does matter if these institutions are no longer viewed as essentially legitimate by the 70 plus million people that they've effectively declared war upon.

01:05:39.180 And from there, I think there needs to be a real political focus.

01:05:44.460 There's such a kind of phantasmagoria of the news cycle.

01:05:50.000 There's a certain kind of ADD element of how conservatives process media.

01:05:55.860 It's like, this is a big story.

01:05:57.240 And then the next day, um, AOC will wear a dress that we don't like, and that will be the news story.

01:06:04.420 And then something else, Biden will do some outrage, but it's really important to have persistence and focus on this in particular.

01:06:12.980 And, um, I think we have to a large degree, we have not let this narrative go away.

01:06:19.340 And I'm very proud of my news organization, revolver.news for sticking to it.

01:06:25.580 We are going to keep sticking to it.

01:06:27.200 And this wasn't supposed to happen.

01:06:29.820 Like this narrative wasn't supposed to get out of Pandora's box.

01:06:33.980 We're still supposed to be disjointedly talking about, oh, there were Antifa there.

01:06:39.160 It wasn't supposed to get to the stage where now every major conservative populist, uh, uh, person in the country is talking about this narrative, including, you know, including you and a lot of other very major voices in the, uh, uh, in the conservative media space.

01:06:58.900 It wasn't supposed to develop like this.

01:07:01.140 And so I think they're very scared.

01:07:03.140 Uh, that explains the, yeah.

01:07:05.740 I think the same could be said for the reporting from the daily wire, which I think it should be nominated for a Pulitzer.

01:07:13.360 It won't be, but should be, uh, on what was happening in Virginia with the school district.

01:07:18.880 And I mean, it's the same apparatus being used by the same people.

01:07:25.040 Um, and if, if a journalist wouldn't have exposed that, the narrative would be completely different.

01:07:32.800 And once it's exposed, the problem with this one is it's very complex.

01:07:38.760 Um, yes.

01:07:39.880 Even though it, even though it's, it's not, I mean, we, we, um, I guess we just need to find out.

01:07:48.880 You know, who these guys really are, how, how did, you know, how did they, how did Ray Epps get rolled up into this?

01:08:02.240 Well, that's a very interesting question.

01:08:04.260 And there's a broader history and context to this.

01:08:07.200 And I'm glad, I'm glad you mentioned that, um, that in fact, the, uh, government began its sort of robust infiltration efforts,

01:08:17.640 specifically into right-wing militia groups that all kicked off in earnest in the early nineties.

01:08:23.740 Now, I think it's important to mention in this context that this is not Merrick Garland's first rodeo.

01:08:30.760 In fact, in the early nineties, Merrick Garland was working for the DOJ and the Clinton administration and his portfolio was the domestic extremism portfolio.

01:08:42.800 He was in charge right around with that first major infiltration operation called PATCON.

01:08:48.760 Okay.

01:08:49.760 That, that, that led in, led, led into Oklahoma city.

01:08:52.840 And I think part of the reason that the government and the regime media, they're freaking out so much about, uh, this kind of, uh, revolver news narrative of one six is not just for what it exposes about one six, which is huge enough.

01:09:10.340 But once people see that they're going to start saying, what other events have we been?

01:09:16.720 I saw one this, I saw one this morning about Timothy McVeigh.

01:09:19.620 Cause you remember that there, there was a third man that no, I mean, tons of witnesses saw.

01:09:27.560 Yes.

01:09:28.220 No, this is so huge.

01:09:29.960 It's so dark.

01:09:31.780 I've looked into this extensively.

01:09:33.680 I'm not, uh, uh, ready to report on it fully.

01:09:37.240 There's been a lot of reporting out, you know, going back to nineties, but I think the public is now just starting to get prepared to hear the full truth about these things.

01:09:47.320 And it's absolutely true.

01:09:48.800 There's so many dark details about Oklahoma city.

01:09:53.740 And it's no coincidence that Merrick Garland was one of the key hatchet men was one of the key janitor cleanup guys for this event.

01:10:03.920 And they're getting the old band back together.

01:10:07.260 Now Merrick Garland is head of the justice department, just as the government is kicking off, it's new and improved and perhaps even more aggressive, uh, domestic war on terror to address the threat posed to the corrupt elements of government.

01:10:25.920 By the resurgence of a kind of, uh, uh, populist, uh, element, uh, within the American politics.

01:10:37.040 The internet sure changed everything.

01:10:41.480 Uh, absolutely.

01:10:42.720 That's why they need to censor it. 0.63

01:10:44.340 Yeah, absolutely.

01:10:45.340 That's why they need to censor it. 0.63

01:10:46.700 So can I ask you just real quick and we'll have you back on, um, you know, a later date for an update, but also I'd like to talk to you about this.

01:10:53.340 Are you familiar with Alexander Dugan?

01:10:54.820 Yeah.

01:10:55.920 Yes, I am.

01:10:57.760 And his fourth political theory.

01:11:00.440 Yes.

01:11:01.020 Yeah.

01:11:01.400 Where do you, what do, what are your thoughts on that?

01:11:05.160 Well, that's, that's not something that I really have the expertise on.

01:11:10.060 As I mentioned, I'm, uh, uh, political, uh, theorist by former profession.

01:11:16.020 Um, and I wrote my dissertation on a German philosopher, Martin Heidegger, who is someone that Dugan has, uh, commented on and wrote a book on.

01:11:25.440 Um, I've read his book on Heidegger.

01:11:27.560 Uh, some of it is interesting.

01:11:30.700 Um, other parts of it, I would critique.

01:11:34.280 Uh, Dugan is kind of an interesting, uh, interesting voice in sort of interpreting this, uh, transitional phase that we find ourselves in geopolitically.

01:11:44.460 Uh, in, uh, but, um, uh, that's pretty much, that's pretty much all I would say in generic terms.

01:11:54.840 But if you have this, what specifically about the fourth political theory, are you, um, the way that, um, uh, the language that he uses is very appealing, uh, to people who feel like a lot of conservatives do right now.

01:12:14.260 Um, you know, they, they're, they're, they've lost something.

01:12:18.420 They're being told their country is no good.

01:12:20.380 They're, uh, told that they're no good, et cetera, et cetera.

01:12:23.580 It's corrupt.

01:12:24.760 Uh, and it's very appealing and, uh, is a, uh, is, is another leg on the table that, um, I watch.

01:12:36.080 Um, interesting because I think that, uh, there are other, there are other forces out there that would like to.

01:12:44.260 Keep people under control or to destroy, uh, the nation.

01:12:48.940 And, um, and I think he's one of them, quite frankly.

01:12:53.820 That would, that he's one of the forces who would destroy this nation.

01:12:59.300 Yeah.

01:12:59.900 That is looking to start a whole new order, uh, a whole new, um, uh, not just this nation, but this nation and the West.

01:13:11.440 I mean, he is, he's pretty clear on that.

01:13:14.260 Um, well, um, yes.

01:13:17.940 And I, I guess what I would say that's not specific to Dugan, but because Dugan can kind of be thought of as a sort of political philosophical archetype for sort of, uh, Eurasia or Eurasianism as a, an alternative to America.

01:13:40.480 I think that, um, we really need, and especially with the rise of, uh, of China, which is in some ways involved with that.

01:13:49.580 Although the relationship between Russia and China is a very complicated one and not necessarily configures to, uh, the presentation that Dugan gives.

01:13:59.300 But just to keep it, uh, uh, generic, I would say that the rise of China is a very important thing going on right now.

01:14:14.360 And it's important not simply as to say, oh, we need to demonize the Chinese and point to all of their abuses. 1.00

01:14:21.420 I think the, uh, uh, dissipation of America's prestige is something that should really give us pause and not occasion us necessarily to criticize our rivals, but to use it as a mirror to hold up to ourselves.

01:14:45.540 Because, um, it is going to be the case that if we are no longer a serious country, which I think we've become largely a joke country, not only a joke, but an evil country.

01:14:58.600 Yeah.

01:14:58.820 And what do we, what do we represent geopolitically?

01:15:02.400 What do our armed forces represent?

01:15:04.520 It represents disseminating the very woke poison that we inflict on our own domestic population and the rest of the world is going to be just as tired of it as a lot of us are.

01:15:19.000 But unlike the conservatives who are relatively impotent politically within the United States to challenge the dominant American regime, there are going to be major competitors with real self-sufficiency that present legitimate alternatives to the woke prison that the United States has become.

01:15:41.220 And so, uh, and so, uh, and I, and I, I, I think that in certain ways, multi polarity geopolitically is something to be cautiously welcomed because I view China certainly not as a free nation, but I don't view the United States as a free nation either.

01:16:03.680 And I would rather have competing authoritarian regimes with different taboos than a one world situation with the same taboos.

01:16:14.560 And for all of China's faults, you can, there's actually a popular tweet that I had, um, Senator Marshall Blackburn tweeted a photo of Winnie the Pooh saying, look how free we are in America that I can tweet Winnie the Pooh.

01:16:31.920 Whereas in China, it's an insult to President Xi, so you can't do that.

01:16:37.220 Look at me, I'm showing how we have free speech in the United States by tweeting Winnie the Pooh.

01:16:41.880 And I responded to her, great.

01:16:44.060 Now do George Floyd.

01:16:47.920 You can't do it.

01:16:49.240 In China, you can, it's, it's not that we have free speech here and they don't in China or vice versa. 0.92

01:16:54.920 They're just different taboos.

01:16:55.920 And I think increasingly, one thing that people on the right, especially if they're labeled as dissidents by their own government, will take advantage of is something that I call taboo arbitrage, which is basically taking advantage of the fact that there are different taboos in different parts of the world.

01:17:17.560 And in fact, it sounds crazy, but it might be the case that in the future, professors who are fired for violating the diktat of wokeness in the U.S. will be hired at Chinese universities.

01:17:31.300 And so it's just one of those things.

01:17:36.660 I think, again, we want to be in a position where we say America is the best, America is the freest, but we're kidding ourselves if we're there.

01:17:44.780 And we should look at the rise and the increasing competence of countries like China, not as an occasion to just saber rattle and say how bad they are, but to honestly look at ourselves and say, are we really going in the direction where we're going to be capable of controlling the 21st century?

01:18:06.020 And are we going to be deserving of controlling the 21st century?

01:18:10.260 And I think the answer to both of those questions at this point is a resounding no.

01:18:15.440 I agree.

01:18:16.500 I agree.

01:18:17.920 I have said for a long time, if we don't face up to our past and we also don't stop this spin away from, you know, the founding principles,

01:18:34.280 we're going to we're going to make the Germans look like rookies. 0.93

01:18:38.260 I mean, our technology alone could enslave the entire world.

01:18:42.020 And if it's not us, it's going to be China and we'll be in bed with them. 1.00

01:18:46.140 I mean, we're doing some really frightening things that I never expected my country to be involved in.

01:18:52.260 We've been involved.

01:18:53.500 You know, I've had a problem with ghost, you know, ghost planning people. 0.99

01:18:56.840 If you're going to torture, at least have the the balls to say we're going to do it. 0.98

01:19:02.440 Don't ship it off to a third country and then say your hands are clean. 0.97

01:19:06.400 But I think Americans are ready for those tough conversations to say, look, this is what we have done in the past.

01:19:14.100 This is what we're doing right now.

01:19:15.920 And stop it.

01:19:17.520 I mean, I think Afghanistan was a very good example of this.

01:19:21.340 People watch that and they they recognize dishonor.

01:19:25.480 And that's why they stood up, because that's not who we are supposed to be.

01:19:31.640 That's what the left says we are.

01:19:33.880 That's what the rest of the world says we are.

01:19:36.480 But that's not what the average American thinks of when they think of an American soldier.

01:19:41.620 That was dishonorable on so many levels.

01:19:45.300 And that was a good sign to me that Americans saw that and went,

01:19:50.320 I don't want anything to do with that.

01:19:52.140 Right, right.

01:19:54.020 No, it's absolutely true.

01:19:55.340 And as much of a disaster as the entire Afghanistan affair was, 1.00

01:20:01.460 I think, you know, those types of resounding global embarrassments,

01:20:06.780 I would hope could at least have the silver lining of forcing that type of radical, critical self-reflection

01:20:14.420 that our country really needs.

01:20:16.480 But unfortunately, it doesn't even seem like Afghanistan is enough.

01:20:22.140 It might require something even more humiliating before we really say, like, wow, we need a profound course correction in this country,

01:20:31.060 because the hierarchy of taboos and the nature of accountability in the United States of America now

01:20:38.780 is such that a general will suffer more severe repercussions if it comes out that 20 years ago he used the N-word than it will if he loses a war.

01:20:51.480 Correct.

01:20:52.020 A nation with that kind of priority of accountability is a joke nation that will not predominate in the 21st century.

01:21:02.560 Well, we were a joke in 2000.

01:21:05.740 We had just gotten back.

01:21:06.900 Our financial institutions had just gotten back, wagging our finger at them in 2006 in China,

01:21:11.900 saying you have to adopt the American banking standards.

01:21:14.880 Look at this.

01:21:15.440 You're going to collapse.

01:21:16.660 And then we collapsed and they laughed at us.

01:21:18.800 The same thing happens with Afghanistan.

01:21:21.900 And what are we doing today?

01:21:23.420 Today, we have our president trying to lead the globe in climate change, which is just the Great Reset is the next, I think, slave tactic from the big corporations.

01:21:38.920 So thank you so much for being on the program.

01:21:42.080 And thank you for having me.

01:21:43.480 You bet.

01:21:44.060 Thank you very much.

01:21:45.220 Appreciate it.

01:21:45.980 You bet.

01:21:46.260 Just a reminder, I'd love you to rate and subscribe to the podcast and pass this on to a friend so it can be discovered by other people.

01:21:59.040 Thank you.

The Glenn Beck Program - November 06, 2021

Ep 124 ｜ Did Jan. 6 & Ray Epps Expose a Corrupt FBI？｜ Darren Beattie ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript

The Glenn Beck Program - November 06, 2021

Ep 124 ｜ Did Jan. 6 & Ray Epps Expose a Corrupt FBI？ ｜ Darren Beattie ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript

Ep 124 ｜ Did Jan. 6 & Ray Epps Expose a Corrupt FBI？｜ Darren Beattie ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast