The Glenn Beck Program - Ep 135 ｜ Mike Rowe’s Favorite Four-Letter Word ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

00:00:00.000 Today, I have a guest that is interested in the moments that changed human history, which is why he owes a special gratitude to sheep testicles. 0.97

00:00:10.640 If you're a fan of this show and the show Dirty Jobs, you know what I'm talking about. 0.98

00:00:17.740 It's ugly. You know his voice from The Deadliest Catch, How the Universe Works, and Shark Week.

00:00:23.220 His new show, Six Degrees, focuses on the synchronicity of history, the way it's all connected in its own way, from the death of Ned Kelly to a super colossal volcano.

00:00:35.800 He tells the unknown stories of people who have worked their butts off, the innovators and the everyman who followed opportunities.

00:00:44.100 He tells us stories in a way that you don't hear these days very often.

00:00:48.900 He tells American stories. He's dedicated to America.

00:00:53.220 He offers solutions to the problems of our time.

00:00:57.460 Because what's truly impressive about him is the way he has affected our society, the way he inspires individualism.

00:01:06.840 He goes on and on and on in this podcast about a virtue that most people avoid, risk.

00:01:15.080 Today on the Glenn Beck Podcast, welcome Mike Rowe.

00:01:19.800 Abortion is the leading cause of death in the U.S. and the world.

00:01:22.860 It's crazy.

00:01:23.640 Since Roe vs. Wade, over 63 million babies aborted here in the U.S.

00:01:32.460 Nearly one in four pregnancies do not choose life in the midst of this awful pandemic.

00:01:39.040 You wonder if it's too big to stop.

00:01:42.420 It's not.

00:01:43.700 You can actually make an impact yourself.

00:01:46.560 The Ministry of Preborn and Blaze Media have partnered up to help rescue babies from abortion in 2022.

00:01:53.000 Preborn is the direct competition to Planned Parenthood and the largest provider of free ultrasounds in the U.S.

00:02:00.460 And they have found that if you show a woman their baby with ultrasound, they hear the heartbeat, they're 80 percent more likely to choose life for their baby.

00:02:11.320 So that's all that preborn does.

00:02:12.660 They just provide those ultrasounds. 0.99

00:02:15.440 That's expensive.

00:02:16.580 But if we're all pitching in together over the past 15 years, preborn centers have counseled over 340,000 women considering abortion.

00:02:26.080 More than 169,000 babies are alive today because of this.

00:02:34.120 $28.

00:02:35.220 That sponsors one ultrasound to help save one baby's life.

00:02:40.240 $140 sponsorship.

00:02:42.100 Five babies a chance at life.

00:02:44.180 All the gifts are tax deductible.

00:02:47.080 You want to help?

00:02:48.300 Donate.

00:02:49.420 Dial pound 250 and say the keyword baby.

00:02:52.080 That's pound 250.

00:02:53.720 Keyword baby.

00:02:54.780 Or just go to preborn.com slash Glenn.

00:03:09.820 It's been how long since you sat on the set with me?

00:03:13.260 I think I was.

00:03:14.140 It feels like seven years.

00:03:15.700 Yeah, you were.

00:03:16.500 You were early on.

00:03:17.980 And I've watched you grow and change.

00:03:21.480 And you've grown this little empire of yours that is just remarkable.

00:03:29.380 Thanks.

00:03:30.060 You did two things that helped me double down on it.

00:03:34.380 The first was, you won't remember this, but we auctioned off a poster.

00:03:37.960 I was doing all kinds of different things to raise money for the foundation.

00:03:40.860 And I had this work smart and hard poster.

00:03:44.900 You autographed it.

00:03:45.700 I autographed it.

00:03:46.460 We put it up for auction.

00:03:47.880 And one of your viewers or listeners paid like $16,000 for it.

00:03:53.220 And that made me think, you know what?

00:03:55.140 We can raise a lot of money doing non-traditional things for the foundation.

00:03:58.380 Right.

00:03:58.480 And the second thing you said was, hey, the social media thing, it's kind of a nightmare, 1.00

00:04:04.120 but don't be an idiot. 1.00

00:04:05.560 Okay. 1.00

00:04:06.180 Get a Facebook page.

00:04:07.660 Well, I had it and I wasn't really tending to it the way I could.

00:04:13.820 Yeah.

00:04:14.080 But it was an easy transition for me because like you, I always thought my real boss were

00:04:20.340 the people who watched and listened.

00:04:22.400 And so, I just started using Facebook as a focus group of sorts.

00:04:29.500 And I woke up, I don't know, a few months later and there were 6 million people on there.

00:04:35.060 Amazing.

00:04:35.700 So, it's made a huge difference.

00:04:37.400 Yeah.

00:04:38.380 Are you ever concerned about saying something and being banished?

00:04:44.100 Because you really, you are very frank on things.

00:04:47.000 Right now, I'm thinking, yes.

00:04:51.240 I mean, I'm concerned in the sense that we're living in a time, obviously, when the consequences

00:04:59.180 for wandering too far out of your lane or saying a magical word can be dire.

00:05:05.140 Not even wandering out of your lane.

00:05:06.840 I don't know what my lane is.

00:05:08.980 You take up half the pool, my friend.

00:05:12.160 Your lane is wide and deep.

00:05:16.460 But so, you are worried about it.

00:05:18.120 Have you had a D?

00:05:19.120 Oh, sure.

00:05:20.100 Sure.

00:05:20.400 I mean, my first real brush with cancellation came before the cancel culture thing was a thing.

00:05:29.660 I narrated a Walmart commercial.

00:05:34.400 And the Walmart commercial basically announced the reopening of factories and trumpeted the

00:05:42.120 company's intention to spend a quarter of a trillion dollars over the next 10 years in supply chain.

00:05:49.640 I don't work for Walmart.

00:05:51.160 Didn't have a deal with them.

00:05:52.280 But I agreed to narrate the spot because I thought it was really simpatico with my foundation.

00:05:58.520 And I like the idea of a big American company investing in American manufacturing.

00:06:04.080 And so, I narrated this thing.

00:06:06.520 A beautiful spot aired during the Olympics, in fact, about eight years ago, I guess.

00:06:11.220 And, well, before I went to bed, I posted something, shared a copy of the spot.

00:06:19.320 Some people loved it.

00:06:20.640 But the union issue.

00:06:22.720 Oh, my God.

00:06:23.400 And people were like, how could you?

00:06:25.340 How could you get in bed with a company that treats its workers so poorly?

00:06:29.860 And so, I thought, whoa, you must be this tall to get on that ride, right?

00:06:33.900 I didn't sign on for that.

00:06:35.340 I just had a glass of wine, wrote a post, and was going to bed.

00:06:38.180 Well, I got up in the middle of the night, as men of our age do, to take care of business.

00:06:41.960 I looked again at the Facebook page, and this thing had gone around the world.

00:06:46.320 What happened next was incredible.

00:06:48.940 I was boycotted by an organization called Jobs for Justice.

00:06:55.840 And they were challenging me to come out and meet with Walmart workers.

00:07:00.700 Meanwhile, like I said, I have no relationship with the company.

00:07:03.660 I just did the voice work.

00:07:05.660 I need a labor nightmare like I need a hole in the head, right?

00:07:08.820 So, I'm like, I can't really deal with that, but they crashed my website.

00:07:13.040 They had thousands of people writing letters, and they were calling for boycotts of everything

00:07:18.320 that I was involved in.

00:07:19.580 I didn't even know who these people were.

00:07:22.060 Meanwhile, I'm out in the press defending both myself and, weirdly enough, Walmart, right?

00:07:29.620 And so, the next night, I'm on CNN.

00:07:32.260 Then I'm on Fox News.

00:07:33.400 And we're having this giant conversation about work and about...

00:07:38.820 Unions, and about manufacturing.

00:07:42.060 And suddenly, I realized, wait a second.

00:07:43.820 There's a weird upside to this because I'm in the midst of something, but I'm also using it to promote my foundation.

00:07:51.520 Meanwhile, Walmart's getting all kinds of tailwind because the Dirty Jobs guy is out there in the world

00:07:56.380 talking about the importance of revitalizing the supply chain.

00:07:59.320 Next thing you know, we got a call from the president of Walmart and his head of PR saying, in no uncertain terms,

00:08:09.480 what the hell are you doing?

00:08:10.920 You're out there speaking on our behalf. 0.81

00:08:12.580 I'm like, well, somebody should.

00:08:14.900 Right.

00:08:15.480 And I'm not really speaking on your behalf.

00:08:16.740 I'm speaking on my behalf.

00:08:18.180 Right.

00:08:18.580 So, long story...

00:08:19.860 Were they kind of mad at you?

00:08:20.880 They weren't mad because, on the one hand, they loved this commercial.

00:08:24.980 And their initiative, I believe, was sincere.

00:08:27.760 And they were getting more unearned media and attention than they ever imagined.

00:08:33.080 I was getting boycotted, on the other hand.

00:08:35.300 And so, Mary, my partner and I, we just decided, you know what?

00:08:40.000 We have to get in front of it.

00:08:41.880 We scheduled our own satellite media tour.

00:08:44.240 We called our own press people.

00:08:46.460 And I went out in the world to have the conversation.

00:08:49.480 And it was the craziest thing.

00:08:52.720 Right.

00:08:53.080 But I could...

00:08:54.360 It was like stepping off the curb and having someone grab you at the last minute when the

00:08:59.100 big blue bus goes by.

00:09:00.760 Right.

00:09:01.320 Because it could have tilted.

00:09:03.060 Right.

00:09:03.280 So, what I wound up doing was writing an open letter to Jobs with Justice.

00:09:08.420 And I explained that they crashed our website and we're a small ma and pa company.

00:09:12.700 And I further explained that the people you're representing who work for Walmart, what are

00:09:17.860 you doing?

00:09:18.200 You're trying to get them another eight or ten cents an hour.

00:09:20.580 I'm offering to train them how to weld or how to learn a skill that's actually in demand,

00:09:25.600 double, maybe triple their salary.

00:09:27.880 So, that conversation took a whole different turn.

00:09:31.100 But that's a long way of saying, yeah, I'm mindful of it.

00:09:35.880 Yeah.

00:09:36.160 I've seen your pushbacks and they're brilliant.

00:09:41.240 I mean, they're really, really brilliant.

00:09:42.840 Thanks.

00:09:43.800 Let me stay with unions for just a second.

00:09:46.800 There's a goal now of tripling the union membership in the next few years by the administration.

00:09:54.860 They're pushing good union jobs.

00:09:57.480 I don't have a problem with unions when unions are needed.

00:10:01.460 You know, it's always the balance.

00:10:03.840 Sometimes people get too greedy at the top and that's when a union needs to pull them back.

00:10:08.580 Sometimes the unions get too greedy.

00:10:10.640 They need to be pulled back.

00:10:12.320 Why is it we can't ever find the reasonable middle ground?

00:10:16.880 Because everything is always changing.

00:10:18.880 You're nailing Jell-O to a tree, right?

00:10:21.700 The times are different.

00:10:23.580 When the unions, the trade unions anyway, when they came about in the turn of the century,

00:10:28.360 I don't know that anybody would have argued or disputed their relevance from everything

00:10:33.380 from safety to working conditions, all that stuff.

00:10:36.900 They made their point in some areas, in some areas they didn't, right?

00:10:41.920 And so everything was always constantly evolving.

00:10:46.060 I wandered into this morass, this miasma, and was in a really odd position because my foundation 1.00

00:10:55.220 makes no distinction between right to work and union.

00:10:58.440 I've trained lots of people who are happy in unions and I've trained lots of people who

00:11:02.260 are working in non-union states.

00:11:03.980 But for my own self, Glenn, right?

00:11:06.580 And I think we've probably been in the same unions.

00:11:10.340 Screen Actors Guild, AFTRA, AGMA.

00:11:13.860 I've been in those unions for decades.

00:11:17.000 And I'll tell you a true story.

00:11:20.220 When I auditioned for QVC, very first job in television, unions told me not to take it.

00:11:30.620 It wasn't a union shop, right?

00:11:32.380 And they told me that there would be serious consequences.

00:11:36.680 I had no choice.

00:11:37.760 I needed to work and it was a steady paycheck.

00:11:39.760 So I violated global rule one and they didn't throw me out, but they didn't like it.

00:11:45.860 And a couple of years later, when I started a show called Your New Home in Baltimore that

00:11:49.680 ran for 15 years, they said, you can't do that.

00:11:52.020 You're not a signatory.

00:11:53.520 And I said, well, I don't really have much of a choice.

00:11:55.060 And they said, we're going to, you know, big con.

00:11:56.820 I did it.

00:11:58.100 I had to do it.

00:11:59.180 They told me not to do dirty jobs.

00:12:01.960 So look.

00:12:03.480 That's crazy.

00:12:04.160 The union has done a lot of good.

00:12:06.280 The unions I belong to.

00:12:08.400 But they affirmatively, at the three most important points in my life, affirmatively discouraged

00:12:15.620 me from taking a risk.

00:12:17.600 Risk and risk is really the four-letter word we should probably concern ourselves with most

00:12:24.420 these days.

00:12:25.340 And I feel like, you know, everybody's searching for progress, but I feel like we're being pulled

00:12:31.700 back into all of the old systems.

00:12:34.800 All the old systems are saying, no, no, we've got to do it my way.

00:12:38.080 I've got to do it my way.

00:12:38.920 I feel like our government all over the world is like living in the 1950s, mainly because

00:12:46.720 a lot of our politicians were there in the 1950s.

00:12:50.360 I feel like the big media corporations are doing everything they can to hold onto their

00:12:56.440 power.

00:12:56.840 And it's a weird thing to have progress be labeled progress when it's actually taking

00:13:07.620 us back the other direction.

00:13:09.380 Sure.

00:13:09.640 Because people are, it's water in their hands, you know, you can hold it for a while, but

00:13:15.420 look what we're doing right here.

00:13:16.760 Like 10 years ago, when a podcast wasn't a thing, like you, you built this studio, you

00:13:22.680 got out from Fox and you just said, wait a second.

00:13:26.040 It was madness when we did it.

00:13:27.920 It was risk.

00:13:29.340 You, you know, you saw the risk, but like a lot of successful people, you didn't run

00:13:35.800 from it.

00:13:36.200 You actually used it, you know, and, and that's the thing I worry most about today.

00:13:41.400 And it, it, it is germane to the union conversation, but it's also relevant to everything from masks,

00:13:48.240 our risk averse nature, I believe is the answer to your question.

00:13:55.200 And that's the thing that holds us back.

00:13:57.580 It's the, it's the fear of trying a new thing.

00:14:00.800 It's the fear of consequences.

00:14:02.820 It's our desire for certainty.

00:14:05.260 Boy, there's been a lot of certainty over the airwaves in the last couple of years.

00:14:10.320 There's a lot of certain sounding experts, a lot of certain sounding politicians, you

00:14:16.660 know, we're long on certainty, but we're very, very short in authenticity and, and in facts.

00:14:23.700 And that's funny.

00:14:24.960 I said about five, six years ago, the one thing I'm certain of is that I am no longer

00:14:29.180 certain of anything.

00:14:30.880 And you don't see that from people.

00:14:33.560 We are all, you're exactly right.

00:14:34.960 Everybody is certain.

00:14:36.320 Let me go to the mass for a second.

00:14:37.800 Cause at the beginning you were, you were, I think everybody can give a pass at the beginning

00:14:44.400 of the, of COVID because we had no idea what we were dealing with and we all wanted to do

00:14:51.900 the right thing.

00:14:52.640 You know, nobody wants to kill anybody and nobody wants to die.

00:14:56.420 When did you change on that?

00:14:58.360 What is, what's, how have you evolved on that?

00:15:01.520 Cause you were, I gave, I was the last public speaker at the last large public event in the

00:15:08.980 country started on March 9th.

00:15:11.620 It was the construction expo in Las Vegas and had it started on the 10th, they would have

00:15:17.580 canceled the whole thing.

00:15:19.100 But once you get 300,000 dirty jobbers in Vegas to buy heavy equipment, right? 0.96

00:15:24.540 Right.

00:15:24.860 That party doesn't end.

00:15:26.160 Right.

00:15:26.760 Right.

00:15:27.580 And so it was the strangest thing, you know, Monday.

00:15:30.900 Monday NFL starts canceling and then the, then the NBA and then baseball and then Broadway

00:15:37.720 closed.

00:15:38.580 And meanwhile, my job there is to shake hands.

00:15:41.400 And every 10 minutes, the loudspeaker says, avoid all contact.

00:15:45.340 Don't touch anybody.

00:15:46.460 When I went home after five days of shaking tens of thousands of hands, I was pretty sure

00:15:51.600 I was riddled with it.

00:15:52.620 You know, got home on Friday the 13th, just in time, uh, for the governor, for the governor

00:15:57.660 to lock California down.

00:15:59.080 And, uh, like everybody else, obviously I was, you know, I'm washing vegetables.

00:16:03.740 I'm looking at the news.

00:16:05.380 I'm trying to make sense of all this.

00:16:07.460 Um, and two weeks to flatten the curve made me nervous, but it also made sense.

00:16:13.820 Our healthcare system is either overrun or it's not.

00:16:17.340 Yep.

00:16:17.560 And we don't want it overrun.

00:16:18.420 So I was on board with all that.

00:16:21.180 Me too.

00:16:21.980 I participated in PSAs.

00:16:24.300 You know what I regret most, Glenn?

00:16:25.820 I said about probably very, very early in April, I was doing the first zoom show in prime time.

00:16:35.220 I was interviewing the captains on deadliest catch and we were doing it long distance.

00:16:39.380 And I thought it was terribly clever for me to tell these captains, you know, guys, for

00:16:43.160 the first time in my lifetime, anyway, we're all in the same boat and everybody nodded and

00:16:48.660 everybody agreed.

00:16:50.140 Later, I thought about it.

00:16:52.120 We're not in the same boat.

00:16:53.300 We're in the same storm.

00:16:55.440 What does that mean?

00:16:56.800 It means your boat may vary.

00:16:58.840 That guy's in a dinghy.

00:17:00.380 That guy's in a yacht.

00:17:01.720 That guy's on a barge.

00:17:03.180 That guy's holding on for dear life to a piece of floats them or jets them.

00:17:07.240 You know, that guy's on a pleasure cruise.

00:17:10.520 And the way we weathered the storm started to become really interesting to me.

00:17:16.320 And then the way we processed the risk and then like the frog in the boiling water, the

00:17:22.080 more we got used to being told by certain sounding people, you know, we are, we began

00:17:29.580 to crave certainty.

00:17:31.040 And of course, that's what happens when we're scared.

00:17:33.600 And I was scared.

00:17:34.620 I was scared for my mom and dad, you know, who were in their eighties.

00:17:37.240 Who got it, by the way.

00:17:38.160 They're fine.

00:17:39.680 And I was scared for myself.

00:17:41.420 And, and, and I was scared.

00:17:43.400 I was scared because I couldn't for the life of me understand how it was going to end.

00:17:49.900 And when you take the measures that we were taking with no clear rubric for success or

00:17:57.420 termination, then it's just very, very difficult to, to feel good about the terminus.

00:18:03.540 I know there was just no terminus in this thing.

00:18:06.300 If the last two years have taught us anything, is it, is it that we have to take control of

00:18:11.680 our own health and our own lives?

00:18:13.760 We can't rely on the government or the so-called exports.

00:18:17.280 We can look to science, but not the science.

00:18:22.820 This is where Z-Stack comes in.

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00:18:30.680 It has everything in it from zinc, vitamin C, vitamin D, a whole bunch of stuff.

00:18:34.920 It has everything that Dr. Zelenko, he is, Vladimir Zelenko, is a world-renowned doctor.

00:18:40.760 He's the guy that President Trump credited with his successful early treatment protocol

00:18:45.460 and his decision to take hydroxychloroquine.

00:18:49.440 He's been studying this from the get-go.

00:18:52.820 And while everybody else wants to say, oh, you can't treat it.

00:18:56.460 You just have to have the jab in the arm.

00:18:58.680 No, that's not true.

00:19:00.520 I now take it every day.

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00:19:23.120 It's Z-Stacklife.com slash Beck.

00:19:26.380 Z-Stacklife.com slash Beck.

00:19:30.700 I remember thinking, why aren't more people saying,

00:19:33.620 why can my Home Depot open, but my local True Value hardware can't?

00:19:43.220 It was for a country that, you know, questions the big pharmaceutical companies

00:19:49.820 and questions big business.

00:19:52.220 We threw mom and pop down.

00:19:56.120 Way under the bus.

00:19:56.920 Way under the bus.

00:19:57.740 I spoke at a gathering of the, you'll laugh, because this is just one more association.

00:20:04.580 Maybe you know about them, maybe you don't, but the National Association of Hardwood Floor

00:20:08.960 and Carpet Installers.

00:20:10.600 Okay.

00:20:11.340 All right.

00:20:11.840 So 5,000 people show up at this thing, and they're all mom and pop operations, and they

00:20:16.580 do what their association's name would suggest.

00:20:19.680 But for the last two years, they couldn't work.

00:20:23.200 To your point, all the big box guys did.

00:20:25.300 Now, this association needs to hire, in the next four to five years, 180,000 people.

00:20:33.100 They're paying $25 an hour to apprentice, right?

00:20:36.800 People that have no experience putting in a hard floor, and they've got a path to a really

00:20:40.720 good career.

00:20:42.120 Glenn, they can't find anybody.

00:20:44.320 I know.

00:20:44.820 They can't find them.

00:20:46.460 And this is one association representing tens of thousands of people that have to hire a

00:20:51.420 lot.

00:20:51.640 There are so many associations in the country right now.

00:20:55.160 The energy business has its back against the wall.

00:20:58.240 The cable business, the broadband business, everybody's looking for skilled labor, right?

00:21:03.760 And nobody can find it.

00:21:05.420 So that really started to worry me, too, as this went on.

00:21:09.720 You'll laugh at this, too.

00:21:11.620 Regarding masks, I...

00:21:14.640 Safety third.

00:21:15.140 Safety third.

00:21:16.000 I love that.

00:21:16.600 This crazy mask, look at this thing.

00:21:18.760 Right now, it's become, I think, like a collector's item.

00:21:22.860 We've sold tens of thousands of these, raised over $400,000 for the Microworks Foundation.

00:21:29.020 And we started doing this, I think it was in July of 2020, when it became clear to me that,

00:21:36.620 okay, cloth masks don't work.

00:21:39.620 Don't work.

00:21:40.640 And we're being told that we have to wear a thing that doesn't work.

00:21:47.520 Correct.

00:21:47.880 That's what I believed then.

00:21:49.060 And today it seems self-evident.

00:21:51.600 And I thought, well, what do you do for people who...

00:21:57.340 Have to wear a mask but don't want to.

00:22:00.400 And who understand that just because you're in compliance doesn't mean you're out of danger.

00:22:05.620 Correct.

00:22:06.500 Right?

00:22:06.900 So, I wasn't taking the situation lightly or suggesting that the disease wasn't highly contagious

00:22:13.660 and very, very serious.

00:22:15.160 I was just saying, wait a second.

00:22:16.760 This doesn't work.

00:22:17.680 This isn't going to work.

00:22:18.840 But if you're going to make me do a thing that doesn't work, I kind of want to be able to

00:22:24.600 at least give you half the finger.

00:22:26.620 Right.

00:22:27.200 Not the whole finger.

00:22:28.540 Right, right, right.

00:22:29.900 Right.

00:22:30.580 Maybe just a pleasant reminder.

00:22:32.720 Just the tip.

00:22:34.000 Right.

00:22:34.220 And so, you know...

00:22:35.820 Explain Safety Third for people who don't know your rules.

00:22:37.980 So, Safety Third does not mean that safety isn't critically important.

00:22:43.060 It just means that there is an orthodoxy in our country that has become platitudinous.

00:22:50.620 And that is based on the old trope, Safety First.

00:22:54.560 Safety First came out of the vocational world.

00:22:58.240 And it was an attempt, and a pretty successful one, to get workers more focused on the importance

00:23:04.460 of being safe.

00:23:05.780 But like so many other campaigns, they overreached.

00:23:09.860 And in their attempt to get people more focused on safety, they said that there was nothing

00:23:17.500 as important as safety.

00:23:19.480 And everywhere on Dirty Jobs that I went for the first couple of years, you know, I saw

00:23:23.620 these Safety First banners.

00:23:24.980 My crew and I sat through dozens of mandatory safety briefings, lockout, tagout procedures,

00:23:31.000 confined space procedures.

00:23:32.500 We went through all of it.

00:23:33.400 And believe me, Glenn, we paid attention because we wanted to go home with everything working,

00:23:39.180 right?

00:23:39.380 And so, first couple of years, nobody got hurt.

00:23:43.280 Season three, it was the craziest thing.

00:23:45.620 Broken finger here, broken toe there, cracked rib, singed off my eyebrows in a blast furnace,

00:23:52.840 a couple of concussions, nothing serious, stitches, like the wheels came off the bus.

00:23:58.540 Why?

00:23:59.280 We were still going through all the Safety First machinations.

00:24:03.300 We were just not paying attention.

00:24:06.120 It was like Charlie Brown's teacher.

00:24:07.600 You sit through 50 safety briefings, right?

00:24:12.380 The idea that somebody can tell you that your safety is their top priority, the minute you

00:24:22.340 believe that, you're in danger because nobody can be more responsible for your safety than

00:24:29.560 you.

00:24:30.340 And if the real enemy is complacency, and I believe that to be true, then we have to say

00:24:37.580 something to cut through all the platitudinous garbage that lulls us into a false sense

00:24:43.760 of security. 0.83

00:24:45.040 Safety Third became the rallying cry on dirty jobs.

00:24:49.140 It simply meant, be careful.

00:24:51.460 Be careful.

00:24:52.040 I was in, uh, I was at the Grand Canyon and I went to the Native American side.

00:25:00.020 Not a fence to be found.

00:25:01.920 Okay.

00:25:02.760 They built that huge glass platform out that you walk on.

00:25:06.840 Isn't that magnificent?

00:25:08.660 It's amazing.

00:25:09.760 It's amazing.

00:25:10.320 Um, and if you've been there, you know, there's no safety anywhere.

00:25:15.920 There's no warnings.

00:25:17.420 You know, like, Hey, a couple more steps, you fall off the cliff.

00:25:20.980 And, uh, I asked one of the guides, I said, how many people fall off the cliff?

00:25:25.500 He said, we don't have any.

00:25:27.500 Correct.

00:25:28.320 There's a thing.

00:25:29.280 It's somewhat controversial, but it's actually at the root. 0.93

00:25:32.200 This isn't just me being a smart ass, right?

00:25:34.200 I actually read a paper published in Canada years ago by a guy who talked about, uh, risk 0.83

00:25:41.580 equilibrium, homeostatic risk, and, uh, compensatory, uh, behavioral.

00:25:48.680 So basically what all that means is everybody in this room has a different risk tolerance.

00:25:55.460 And when you introduce safety protocols, an interesting thing happens to your behavior.

00:26:03.580 For instance, if I, if I put a helmet on you, study after study after study shows you drive

00:26:09.880 a little faster on the motorcycle.

00:26:11.780 It's, I think that's why there's so many problems.

00:26:14.500 You don't have the problems in, uh, in rugby that you have in the NFL.

00:26:19.680 Correct.

00:26:20.560 Correct.

00:26:20.940 I'm safe.

00:26:21.960 That's right.

00:26:22.660 I'm, I'm, I'm in compliance.

00:26:24.880 I got my gear.

00:26:26.420 I can go more.

00:26:27.300 Therefore let's, let's rock it.

00:26:29.780 Right.

00:26:29.980 I'll never forget standing on the deck of a crab boat on the Bering sea in 2004.

00:26:35.840 First time we were up there for deadliest catch.

00:26:38.500 And it was sporty.

00:26:39.980 I mean, 15 foot seas sideways sleet and we're still working at it, right?

00:26:46.620 We're hauling up pots.

00:26:48.760 We're doing the whole thing.

00:26:49.600 Horrible.

00:26:49.760 And I walked into the wheelhouse at one point and I'm like, Hey, captain, OSHA.

00:26:55.100 And he like, looks at me.

00:26:56.400 He got a cigarette burning in his mouth.

00:26:58.960 He's got one behind his ear.

00:27:00.440 Also lit.

00:27:01.260 Cigarettes everywhere.

00:27:02.120 And he's looking out the window and green water's coming over the bow.

00:27:05.100 And he says, ocean, ocean.

00:27:08.980 I'm like, no, I get it.

00:27:10.800 We're all terribly brave.

00:27:11.960 But I mean, at what point, at what point do we kind of wrap this up?

00:27:15.140 I got cameraman out there.

00:27:16.260 I got all sorts of stuff.

00:27:17.520 It's going off the rails.

00:27:19.080 And he says, son, calls me.

00:27:21.300 He's my age, basically.

00:27:22.540 He says, son, look, I'm the captain of a crab boat.

00:27:25.160 My job is not to get you home safe.

00:27:29.520 My job is to get you home rich.

00:27:32.640 You want to be safe?

00:27:34.240 Be safe.

00:27:35.580 That's on you.

00:27:37.620 Now, nobody in the lower 48 would ever talk to anybody like that.

00:27:41.760 And I'm not even saying this was a good thing.

00:27:44.100 I'm just making the point that when somebody who you think is primarily concerned with your safety reminds you that they're not, you make sure your life jacket is on properly.

00:27:58.440 You make sure you've got three points of contact all of the time.

00:28:02.440 And it's just like being at the edge of the Grand Canyon.

00:28:05.760 There's no fence to lean against.

00:28:07.800 Right.

00:28:08.380 And so somewhere in all of that, again, I'm not.

00:28:11.940 But see, this goes back to that because it goes back to risk.

00:28:14.900 Everything goes back.

00:28:15.660 Yeah, I mean, if you're not, you know, there's there's people who I'm sure will say this to you.

00:28:21.980 Oh, you got a great job.

00:28:23.320 I wish I had your job, blah, blah, blah.

00:28:25.160 Do you?

00:28:25.500 Because I can sit down and I can tell you about what I do.

00:28:29.500 Yeah.

00:28:29.860 And the risks that I have to take every day and and everything else.

00:28:35.220 And you'll probably say, I don't want to do that.

00:28:38.720 You know, that's correct.

00:28:39.660 Right.

00:28:40.360 With everything, there is risk and there's a bunch of dirty jobs you don't want to do.

00:28:47.820 But that's what takes you there.

00:28:50.420 Correct.

00:28:50.780 Look, if anybody takes anything from this, I think the whole safety third conversation really comes down to just rattling your cage and doing doing something to break your pattern.

00:29:02.540 Something that scares you.

00:29:04.080 Right.

00:29:04.660 Like I probably have signed 200.

00:29:10.020 Well, probably a thousand general releases.

00:29:12.980 You know, you're on a TV show.

00:29:13.920 You got to sign a release.

00:29:15.340 Although you didn't give me one.

00:29:16.740 That's weird.

00:29:17.340 That's right.

00:29:17.900 What are we doing here?

00:29:20.120 That's right.

00:29:20.780 No, you you have to sign the release.

00:29:22.620 And and the more hazardous the activity, typically the thicker the release, the release and the finer the print.

00:29:29.360 Correct.

00:29:29.780 Right.

00:29:30.460 When I tested a shark suit, we made a stainless steel shark suit a few years ago with the inventor.

00:29:36.700 And then we chum the water.

00:29:39.640 Dozens of reef sharks come in and I'm dressed up like Ivanhoe and this guy's dressed up like Sir Galahad.

00:29:44.620 And we and we jump in to deliberately get bitten to test the suit.

00:29:49.020 Crazy job. 0.99

00:29:50.000 Well, his release said, I blank do hereby understand that I'm about to engage in an activity that is stupid on its face. 0.99

00:30:00.500 The idea that I'm going to survive this is wishful thinking. 0.97

00:30:04.900 It's going to hurt.

00:30:06.600 I'm going to get bit by a shark.

00:30:08.020 I know this is going to happen.

00:30:10.360 Sincerely.

00:30:10.800 Right.

00:30:11.120 I mean, it was the most straight up.

00:30:13.280 It should be.

00:30:13.860 I was like, huh.

00:30:15.780 So if I sign this now, I'm I'm very, very, very clear headed about it.

00:30:21.680 We would be so much better off just doing that to tell the truth and releases to tell the truth about safety.

00:30:27.540 And if you if you if you if you look at our relationship to risk over the last couple of years, the whole notion of covid zero, the whole notion of eliminating it.

00:30:36.980 You know, it began with what's his name?

00:30:39.860 That genius.

00:30:40.640 Cuomo.

00:30:41.340 Right.

00:30:42.500 Genius.

00:30:43.300 This guy.

00:30:44.000 I mean, look, I again, I'm trying to stay in my lane, but we're on this.

00:30:47.640 Right.

00:30:47.960 I know.

00:30:48.280 I know.

00:30:48.740 No, I know.

00:30:49.280 You'll remember the moment.

00:30:51.360 No measure, he said, no matter how draconian can be deemed an overreach if it saves a single life.

00:31:00.440 That is when I started making safety third masks, honestly, because good grief.

00:31:06.820 The number of people who believe that, Glenn.

00:31:09.720 Oh, that is incredible.

00:31:11.980 We've lost all sense of balance between freedom and safety.

00:31:16.960 All sense.

00:31:17.760 So where is it?

00:31:19.280 How do we gain that back?

00:31:21.400 I want my freedom.

00:31:22.680 You know, it's not where in the Constitution does it say the government's supposed to keep us safe, except for guarding our borders, which they don't do, and making sure that we have a military for anybody that comes in to evade.

00:31:38.600 That's it.

00:31:39.600 Right.

00:31:40.060 That's all.

00:31:40.580 Well, it's almost as if we realized at some point over the last couple of years that we were mortal.

00:31:50.620 It's like, what do you mean?

00:31:52.380 No, no, no.

00:31:53.240 We're living forever.

00:31:55.100 Right?

00:31:55.280 This is, what are you telling me about this new danger thing?

00:32:01.820 It was the novelness of the novel coronavirus that also made me say, wait a second, what's really novel here?

00:32:09.600 I suspect you're a fan of C.S.

00:32:12.680 Lewis.

00:32:13.000 Mm-hmm.

00:32:13.500 He wrote, and this is worth a Google, too, if you haven't seen this.

00:32:18.560 In 1948, he answered a question, and the question was, how am I to live in the atomic age?

00:32:25.300 And people were just getting their heads around the novelness of the fact that a bomb, a missile could land.

00:32:33.700 I mean, a terrible, terrible thing.

00:32:35.400 And I didn't live through it, but can you imagine the anxiety of living in a world where you suddenly realized that there was a nuke pointed at you?

00:32:45.940 Right?

00:32:46.840 We're freaked out with masks and kids in schools right now.

00:32:49.520 They were diving under chairs.

00:32:51.440 I remember, Mike, you and I are approximately the same age.

00:32:55.380 I remember waking up in terror because we'd have these instructional films shown at school, and I'd be like, wait, the whole world can be gone tonight in 11 or 18 minutes?

00:33:07.540 That's crazy.

00:33:08.740 I remember that, too.

00:33:09.740 We would have been in grade school, right?

00:33:13.220 But our parents, in 1948, were three years after Hiroshi.

00:33:18.780 Correct.

00:33:19.080 And they were all grown up, and they were looking around going, that was a big bomb.

00:33:24.120 And it's only a matter of time until the Soviets get it and so forth. 0.88

00:33:30.020 And so what C.S. Lewis says in this is how to live in the atomic age, it's the same way you lived when at any moment the Vikings could arrive on the shore, rape and plunder and do whatever the way. 0.65

00:33:43.120 The same way the next smallpox could come, the next black death. 1.00

00:33:46.400 He goes down the list. 0.81

00:33:48.320 He says, look, it always feels different.

00:33:52.240 It always feels new, especially when you give it a new name, the novel coronavirus, COVID-19.

00:34:00.640 Well, guess what?

00:34:01.220 Now it's 22.

00:34:03.400 Right?

00:34:04.260 Right.

00:34:04.420 And people are starting, I think, to—I think it's only a matter of time until you get bored with being scared.

00:34:14.560 You're still there.

00:34:15.300 We're already there.

00:34:16.200 I think America has changed.

00:34:17.500 I think the whole world has changed.

00:34:18.780 Enough.

00:34:19.280 Enough.

00:34:19.640 We got it.

00:34:20.520 You know, when you get to the point—because, you know, as a student of history, I know what happened in 1918.

00:34:25.580 And it was much worse than what just happened.

00:34:28.400 And when this was coming down, I was one of the first people talking about it really early in January.

00:34:33.820 And I said, don't fear the virus.

00:34:36.840 Even though we don't know what it is, they're welding people into their houses. 0.98

00:34:40.560 Don't fear the virus.

00:34:43.440 Fear what the consequences are of the virus economically and to our nation.

00:34:50.280 And that's what we've seen.

00:34:52.280 You know, you're going to deal with it.

00:34:54.420 We're going to deal with it.

00:34:55.680 And we're going to survive.

00:34:57.280 Or fear both.

00:34:58.700 But prudence, right?

00:35:01.540 Prudence.

00:35:02.240 You don't drive at 55 miles an hour simply because the sign says you can when it's snowing.

00:35:09.980 But see, this is the thing, right?

00:35:12.380 But this is the thing.

00:35:13.400 We weren't.

00:35:14.720 People were already self-isolating.

00:35:17.000 They were already saying—I remember when the president said, we're going to close everything for 15 days.

00:35:22.480 And I was like, well, join the club.

00:35:25.060 I mean, because we were already self-isolating.

00:35:27.720 People, that made sense to people.

00:35:32.340 What didn't make sense is how long it went on and still going on in some places.

00:35:37.040 Canada.

00:35:38.760 Look, if there's no exit strategy, then there's no exit.

00:35:41.860 Talk to the people as we're here on fear for a second.

00:35:47.180 We're entering a time that we haven't seen maybe since World War II, the Civil War, Revolutionary, where there are right now serious consequences for going against the accepted narrative.

00:36:07.100 Whatever that narrative is, it's changed I don't know how many times here.

00:36:10.300 But Canada, we have a woman who was one of the main organizers. 0.94

00:36:15.640 She's facing 10 years in prison in Canada.

00:36:21.140 They've lost their livelihood.

00:36:22.860 They lost everything they had in the bank.

00:36:24.680 They lost their truck.

00:36:26.160 Because she contributed a couple hundred bucks to a GoFundMe? 0.99

00:36:28.880 No, because she was an organizer. 0.99

00:36:30.120 But it was peaceful.

00:36:33.160 Right.

00:36:33.360 You know, everything she did was square within the law, except maybe parking fines. 1.00

00:36:39.000 That scares a lot of people.

00:36:41.040 You see this government come down.

00:36:43.360 Canadians right now, but we're having it here, too.

00:36:46.660 The government comes down.

00:36:48.000 They're coming down to make sure you understand.

00:36:52.100 Don't screw with us.

00:36:53.240 How do you how do you what would you say to people about the fear of government coming down on you at this time, losing your job, losing everything?

00:37:06.920 There's no mask to protect you from that.

00:37:09.700 There's no PPE to protect you from that.

00:37:13.080 There's no vaccine to protect you from that.

00:37:15.740 The only thing that can protect you from that are your neighbors and your willingness to stand up.

00:37:23.800 It's very, very hard, as you know, to be the first one to stand up.

00:37:28.260 And so much of what we've seen over the last couple of years down here, I think, reminds me that old Hans Christian Anderson, you know, the emperor's new clothes.

00:37:37.580 Oh, yeah.

00:37:38.000 When the emperor is told that his garments are fantastic.

00:37:42.980 And, of course, the tailors haven't made any garments at all, but they convince him that he's clothed and he sits there in his chair and he's paraded through town naked.

00:37:51.800 And all the towns people are like, oh, yes, those are amazing clothes.

00:37:55.380 Who went on?

00:37:56.500 It was the kid.

00:37:57.900 It was a kid who finally says, hey, that dude is naked, man.

00:38:02.760 And then some adults started nodding like you are going.

00:38:04.900 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:38:05.400 He's naked.

00:38:05.880 And then pretty soon, OK, we all see it.

00:38:09.060 And, you know, you can't arrest the whole town.

00:38:12.220 Right.

00:38:12.840 So I don't know where it tips exactly.

00:38:15.940 But I would say to people that in so many ways, speaking only for myself, I have felt like that kid.

00:38:23.900 And I've also felt like a bystander in the crowd.

00:38:28.220 You know, I wasn't the first to do or say anything.

00:38:30.980 I had a lot of pushback on Safety Third.

00:38:32.920 I bet you did.

00:38:33.820 I bet you did.

00:38:34.360 And had I not donated the proceeds to my foundation, I'm not quite sure how I would have positioned that publicly.

00:38:42.080 But to answer your question, I just think that when it tips is when we can no longer bear to be told the thing we're looking at is not the thing that's happening.

00:38:54.100 We that's happening a lot now.

00:38:57.320 Every where you look everywhere.

00:38:59.260 It's happening with the language.

00:39:00.660 It's happy.

00:39:01.620 That protest was mostly peaceful.

00:39:04.280 I saw someone on CNN.

00:39:06.200 It was in the it was on a Saturday morning.

00:39:09.320 It was completely peaceful.

00:39:11.160 I mean, the birds were chirping in the background.

00:39:14.020 I'm practically nothing happening.

00:39:16.640 And they said, this may look like a peaceful rally. 0.99

00:39:21.420 But don't be fool.

00:39:22.540 But don't be fooled. 0.99

00:39:23.480 Yeah, this is sacrificing virgins around the corner. 1.00

00:39:26.620 And it was the exact opposite of when they were reporting with five whole city burning down.

00:39:32.280 It's mostly peaceful.

00:39:33.560 But it's not just that the border's secure.

00:39:36.680 Never mind the thousands of people you can see running over it.

00:39:40.820 Afghanistan was a success.

00:39:42.520 Pay no attention to those bodies falling from the sky. 0.58

00:39:44.920 And don't worry about the 14,000 still over there with green cards who are screwed, right? 0.95

00:39:49.960 On and on and on and on and on.

00:39:51.820 You know, that's actually that's what I think the let's go Brandon thing was.

00:39:57.500 That's not what it was about when it started, but that's what it became.

00:40:01.660 Because everybody in that crowd could hear what was being chanted.

00:40:07.400 Yes.

00:40:07.720 But the nice lady in front of the camera said, oh, can you hear them? 0.85

00:40:11.480 They're saying, let's go, Brandon.

00:40:12.740 And you're sitting right there, awash in a level of cognitive dissonance that's almost impossible to overstate.

00:40:19.980 And you say, no, actually, that's not what they're saying.

00:40:23.880 So what we're going to do now, it was kind of a C-3-3 move. 1.00

00:40:27.220 Do you think that's what she heard?

00:40:29.300 Or do you think that was a brilliant, I mean, that was a brilliant cover?

00:40:32.640 It was a nice cover.

00:40:33.980 And I thought she did it with kind of a smile and a wink, as if to say, I guess we all know what's happening.

00:40:39.300 But she sold it.

00:40:40.780 Right.

00:40:41.040 And if you look at the transcript, she's clearly saying, and the crowd is so behind you, let's go.

00:40:47.640 Oh, yeah.

00:40:48.280 Let's go, Brandon.

00:40:48.780 Yeah, yeah.

00:40:49.420 And so the people I've talked to since that happened have adopted that expression, not to say F. Joe Biden.

00:40:56.760 They adopt that expression whenever they're asked to be a townsperson in the emperor's new clothes.

00:41:04.580 Correct.

00:41:04.800 And just nod and go, yep, those clothes sure are pretty.

00:41:08.540 Let's go, Brandon.

00:41:09.280 Let's go, Brandon.

00:41:10.260 Because here we go again.

00:41:11.400 Yeah.

00:41:11.680 We're being asked to believe the unbelievable.

00:41:15.340 If you're one of the millions in America that suffer.

00:41:21.200 From daily pain, I mean, real bad pain.

00:41:26.140 Listen up.

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00:41:31.640 Every day I see testimonials of people who have tried Relief Factor for their pain, gotten their life back.

00:41:36.740 I've got, in fact, do I have?

00:41:39.380 I have my package for today.

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00:41:48.500 It has changed my life.

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00:42:12.480 ReliefFactor.com.

00:42:13.580 That's ReliefFactor.com.

00:42:16.600 I had a job for you to do.

00:42:18.480 And I think it's a dirty job.

00:42:19.780 But I think you'd be great at it.

00:42:22.160 I think that you should become the new CNN ombudsman.

00:42:28.960 That you just watch CNN.

00:42:30.800 And every couple of weeks, you just come in and tell them what they've done.

00:42:36.420 You know, it's so funny you said that.

00:42:38.340 Somebody the other day was talking about, like, they didn't really replace Larry King.

00:42:45.320 No, they didn't.

00:42:46.040 You know, and part of the reason, I think, was because they were pretty sure that people

00:42:52.000 didn't have the attention span or the appetite for a longer form.

00:42:57.120 Hello, Joe Rogan.

00:42:58.460 Hello, podcasting.

00:42:59.680 Oh, I know.

00:43:00.220 People are starving for it.

00:43:02.720 They're starving for it.

00:43:05.380 And so it's...

00:43:06.600 It's not just the long form, but they're starving for authenticity.

00:43:10.160 Which is really hard to do in short bursts.

00:43:13.000 Yeah.

00:43:13.880 And very hard to fake.

00:43:15.820 But if you can...

00:43:16.840 You can fake it.

00:43:18.300 It's great.

00:43:19.080 Once you do that, Glenn, the world's your oyster.

00:43:21.400 I have an epigram in my book that's a quote from my favorite fictitious character, Travis

00:43:30.920 McGee, who lives on a houseboat and solves crimes.

00:43:34.580 John D. McDonald created it back in 1964.

00:43:37.460 And among many other quotable things, McGee said in a big, thick paragraph full of all

00:43:43.340 the things he's suspicious of and all the things he's wary of.

00:43:46.080 It ends with, but most of all, I am wary of all earnestness.

00:43:52.500 And that right now, we were talking about certainty before, being long on certainty.

00:43:58.380 Um, this is...

00:44:00.920 There's never been a time, in my view, when Americans should be more skeptical of every

00:44:07.620 single thing.

00:44:09.060 Everything.

00:44:09.860 Everything.

00:44:10.360 Including everything I'm saying right now.

00:44:12.780 Every single thing ought to be held up, weighed and measured, and evaluated as best an individual

00:44:19.220 can do it.

00:44:20.400 But rather than being encouraged to be skeptical, we are told by our journalists to trust us.

00:44:29.300 Trust us.

00:44:30.380 And certain sounding people in a crisp, well-modulated baritone will sit behind their microphone and

00:44:36.340 tell you the way it is.

00:44:37.560 Trust us, they say.

00:44:38.680 And the experts in the lab coats, they say, trust us.

00:44:41.800 It's science.

00:44:42.700 I'm science.

00:44:43.980 Right?

00:44:44.880 It's not science.

00:44:45.980 Notice, there's the science.

00:44:48.020 Whenever, yeah, you know what, whenever you put the in front of something, somebody's

00:44:52.100 trying to sell you something.

00:44:53.040 Yeah, exactly right.

00:44:54.120 So, instead of being wary of earnestness, we are told, we are cajoled, we're challenged.

00:45:03.480 If you question, Glenn, you're a denier.

00:45:08.140 Skepticism, which is not cynicism, by the way, or insanity, it's just skepticism.

00:45:14.340 Healthy.

00:45:14.600 Here we are, surrounded by ambiguity and experts that can't agree on all sorts of things.

00:45:21.720 And we are told that if we're skeptical of anything, then we're just a denier.

00:45:26.820 A fill-in-the-blank.

00:45:28.260 A science denier.

00:45:29.420 A climate denier.

00:45:30.760 A mask denier.

00:45:31.880 So, rather than encouraging a skeptical mind, we seem, our institutions in particular, seem

00:45:39.800 convinced, seem dedicated to the proposition of erasing that, right?

00:45:48.220 That quality, that's what I think is under siege, and that worries me.

00:45:54.380 I saw an article this week in the New York Times, it was about the scandal of spying on

00:46:03.140 the president, and the reason why the New York Times hasn't covered any of that.

00:46:09.400 And, first they said, it was all misinformation.

00:46:12.400 And then the very next sentence was, and to be able to really tell this story, it's very

00:46:19.760 complex with a lot of different names that people don't know, and it would require an

00:46:25.700 enormous effort on the side of the reader to understand that, which makes us question

00:46:34.620 whether things like this should be covered at all.

00:46:38.720 That's incredible.

00:46:41.100 The infantilization, infantilization, that's what it is.

00:46:45.680 It's, look, we're not children, and we shouldn't be treated like children.

00:46:52.960 And the idea that somebody somewhere doesn't trust us to sift through conflicting views, this

00:47:02.380 business with Rogan fascinated me, you know, because the two doctors that caused all the

00:47:07.300 problems, I don't know them, you know, but Robert Malone holds nine patents on mRNA vaccines.

00:47:17.740 I know.

00:47:17.940 And the other guy, McCullough, is the most published cardiologist in the world. 0.99

00:47:26.020 Now, maybe they're nuts. 0.93

00:47:27.740 Maybe they're wrong. 0.95

00:47:29.400 We should have caught that before.

00:47:31.000 But, but, but, but if you can't talk to people who are that credentialed.

00:47:36.940 Who can you?

00:47:37.940 Right.

00:47:38.500 And so for all of that pushback that he got, I, I, I found that kind of chilling because

00:47:47.040 somebody, Neil Young doesn't think I'm capable of listening to ideas that might be incorrect.

00:47:55.940 And Mike, when did, when did rock and roll become, become the man?

00:48:01.760 Yeah.

00:48:02.900 It's amazing to me.

00:48:04.360 All these, especially these aging hippies that were like, Hey, fight the power, man. 0.78

00:48:09.320 You got the right. 0.98

00:48:10.420 And now all of a sudden they're like, Hey, shut up. 0.99

00:48:13.880 We'll put you in jail. 0.99

00:48:15.380 It's crazy. 0.99

00:48:15.940 Crazy.

00:48:17.480 Misinformation, disinformation, mal-information. 0.89

00:48:20.700 Oh, is that, is that the, mal-information.

00:48:23.020 You know what mal-information is?

00:48:24.500 Had to look it up.

00:48:25.500 I, enlighten me.

00:48:26.840 It is when somebody knows that it's a lie and is spreading it just for malice.

00:48:33.400 Oh.

00:48:33.960 So misinformation is somebody who doesn't know that it's true, that it's not true.

00:48:40.400 Disinformation is somebody who knows it's not true.

00:48:43.440 And, uh, mal-information is somebody who knows it's not true and has a heart full of malice.

00:48:49.600 But don't forget the fourth.

00:48:50.860 Yeah.

00:48:51.280 The noble lie.

00:48:53.180 Okay.

00:48:54.040 The noble lie.

00:48:55.280 The noble lie is what we say when your best interests might be compromised by the truth.

00:49:02.680 If let's assume masks work to tell people that masks don't work at a time when there

00:49:09.880 was a shortage of mask was deemed a noble lie in order to make sure it was just, it was

00:49:15.520 just a lie.

00:49:16.220 It was just a lie.

00:49:17.160 And we knew it was a lie.

00:49:18.280 And it infuriated me at the time.

00:49:20.620 Cause I'm like, you sons of it, you don't trust the American people.

00:49:24.620 I had a bunch of masks.

00:49:26.620 You know what I did?

00:49:27.320 I didn't hoard them.

00:49:28.500 I brought them to my local hospital and I know I'm not alone.

00:49:31.780 There were millions of people who did that.

00:49:34.420 You just didn't trust us.

00:49:36.660 When you don't expect the best from people, you're never going to get it.

00:49:41.280 Nope.

00:49:41.540 You're never going to get it.

00:49:42.960 Yeah.

00:49:43.360 It's a, it's a self-fulfilling kind of, kind of prophecy.

00:49:47.720 And it, it, it impacts public policy, but it also impacts the way we disseminate risk.

00:49:58.400 And I, I will always come back to that because it's our relationship with fear.

00:50:04.180 Do you think you are more of a risk taker because I think your heart's always been into performance.

00:50:11.820 I mean, you are an opera singer.

00:50:13.680 So do you think, I mean, you have to risk if you're going to be good at something you have to risk.

00:50:18.580 Well, I told you earlier on, on your radio show, when I was a host, Dick Clark gave me some really, really great advice, which was don't walk out and say hi, everybody, even though you're broadcasting, talk to one person at a time.

00:50:32.640 And so for 10 years or so, I, I worked really hard at being the best host I could be.

00:50:40.120 And I got pretty facile at it, but I didn't really have any success until I learned another lesson in the sewers of San Francisco where I realized I was a better guest.

00:50:51.960 So if I could, if I could be the titular figure in a program, but think of myself as a guest instead of a host, that's, that was a risk, right?

00:51:03.200 It was a big risk because on dirty jobs, if, if there was a pie in somebody's face, it was their pie in my face, right?

00:51:12.040 I, if there's a brunt of a joke, it's me.

00:51:14.320 I'm the new guy every day working with an expert who has never been on TV before, but who is quite good at his or her job.

00:51:24.540 And so for me, the, the willingness to be humbled on international television was the proximate cause of whatever success I've, I've had, but that was a risk.

00:51:38.180 And that's something I, I've wanted to ask you about too, as a, as a performer, you know, but there's a lot of risk in dirty jobs visually, but like the risk of leaving Fox, the risk of building this, right?

00:51:54.180 The, the risk of going, of taking the reverse commute in your chosen field that, you know, you, you were rewarded for it, but you could have just as easily been crushed.

00:52:06.580 You have to not want something so much, you know, um, uh, this building, I bought it for 4.9 million.

00:52:20.900 You know, we started negotiating at 19, 19 took a year, but I didn't want it that much.

00:52:28.620 And they were like, eh, it's worth 19.

00:52:30.400 I'm like, well, go find that person that thinks it's worth 19.

00:52:33.100 Is it?

00:52:33.720 Yeah.

00:52:33.960 And I started it, I said, it's worth five.

00:52:36.240 And they said, no, and I didn't want it that badly.

00:52:39.340 And they kept coming back and I'd go, okay, it's really great.

00:52:43.580 You've, you're offering 12, five.

00:52:46.680 And I got it for four, nine.

00:52:48.540 They got to five.

00:52:49.640 I said, no, now it's four, nine.

00:52:51.480 Now is the, is the operative word, right?

00:52:53.900 How much time did it take to get them where you, where you needed to get them?

00:52:58.200 Year?

00:52:58.600 A year, year, year, couple months, maybe.

00:53:01.820 Yeah.

00:53:02.260 But it's, it's the, the concept is, and this happens to TV people and stars, I think all

00:53:07.520 the time, and you can see it in them.

00:53:11.120 They get some success and then they want it and they want it to stay.

00:53:16.980 And so they'll start compromising and doing anything to get it.

00:53:20.880 And that's, I think what is happening in all over the world.

00:53:24.040 People are willing to compromise because they just want this.

00:53:27.940 And what they don't realize is you're not going to have this.

00:53:31.360 It's not going to be the same.

00:53:33.180 Once you start compromising, you not only lose that, you lose everything.

00:53:37.680 It's to my mind, it's not just the compromise.

00:53:40.540 It's the, it's the duplicativeness.

00:53:44.840 Why does so much news look the same?

00:53:47.840 Why does so much FM radio sound the same?

00:53:50.260 Why does so much music sound the same?

00:53:51.820 You know, it's once you have a little bit of success as a, as a producer, as an executive

00:53:58.580 producer, somebody who can make a call, right?

00:54:02.720 Dirty Jobs has been on the air 20 years.

00:54:05.180 The first three episodes that aired were the highest rated of the week, but the show was

00:54:12.400 put on the shelf for a year because it wasn't consistent with what the network saw at the

00:54:19.020 time as their core audience.

00:54:21.060 Right.

00:54:21.840 This is not on brand.

00:54:23.580 So they, so they put it on the shelf.

00:54:27.140 Now that was a safe bet for somebody to do, but.

00:54:32.960 And probably made sense somewhat at the time.

00:54:35.800 It doesn't make sense now.

00:54:37.400 But somebody later took a risk and they put it back on the air knowing it wasn't quite

00:54:42.800 consistent with the brand.

00:54:44.620 And guess what?

00:54:46.000 It became the brand.

00:54:47.780 39 shows have evolved out of Dirty Jobs over the legend.

00:54:52.160 39 shows.

00:54:53.020 That's crazy.

00:54:54.040 It became the brand.

00:54:55.120 The whole construct of, of a host as a guest or a guest as a host.

00:55:00.220 You, you see it all the time.

00:55:01.740 Now the whole device of bringing the behind the scenes guys into the show.

00:55:06.940 That was Dirty Jobs, right?

00:55:08.800 That level of authenticity, that kind of shooting was risky.

00:55:14.380 We didn't do second takes.

00:55:16.660 That was one of my mandates.

00:55:18.420 It's like, look, if back then I figured reality TV meant reality, right?

00:55:25.000 So let's, let's show you a day on the job exactly as I see it.

00:55:29.400 Now, of course we can edit, but I wanted the viewer to see a, a linear chronological

00:55:34.160 look at my day, not a montage of some stuff and fast cuts and everything else.

00:55:39.220 And you know what take two is take twos are performance.

00:55:42.900 So yeah, I, I had a, I called it the truth cam.

00:55:46.720 It's just a behind the scenes camera, like a doc cam, but the mandate was simple mandate.

00:55:52.440 Like, geez, am I even allowed to say that?

00:55:54.600 The mandate was simple.

00:55:56.500 You never stop rolling.

00:55:58.540 So whatever else happens here, you know, happens camera goes down, plane flies over.

00:56:03.020 I could always look to the truth cam and tell the viewer what was happening in the moment.

00:56:09.060 And you use the word before, if you're looking for authenticity, you find it in those little

00:56:15.380 moments and it's worth its weight in gold.

00:56:21.160 Um...

00:56:22.440 Part of the problem with, um, with what we're facing, and I think it's happening to our children,

00:56:32.540 and, um, if we keep paying people to stay home, we're going to have more and more problems.

00:56:40.380 Um, I think meaning has to change.

00:56:45.200 A lot of people get their meaning from their jobs.

00:56:48.840 I think it's why a lot of guys die after they, you know, retire.

00:56:52.560 Mm-hmm, I think you're right.

00:56:53.000 Yep.

00:56:53.700 So what, where, how do we find meaning?

00:56:56.680 And talk about the meaning of a job and the meaning beyond the job.

00:57:01.220 Well, on the long list of things we can't control is virtually everything.

00:57:10.740 On the short list of things we, we can is, is that.

00:57:14.920 Like, there's no, you, you can't find meaning in a job.

00:57:19.620 There's no meaning in a job.

00:57:21.440 There's a meaning in you.

00:57:22.500 And the thing to which you assign your meaningfulness is 100% in your control. 1.00

00:57:31.440 This is why we have wretched garbage men and happy garbage men. 1.00

00:57:37.760 Mm-hmm. 1.00

00:57:38.260 And wretched actuarial accountants and happy actuarial accountants. 0.75

00:57:42.820 The job. 0.98

00:57:44.060 And wretched billionaires and happy billionaires.

00:57:46.920 Correct.

00:57:47.680 There is nothing inherently transformational about a job beyond its existence.

00:57:55.260 Now, if they don't exist, then you don't have the opportunity to assign your meaning to a pursuit.

00:58:01.780 Mm-hmm.

00:58:02.120 And, and that's tragedy, right?

00:58:05.020 But in the wide world of work, what we've done, I think somewhat stupidly, is, is elevate certain jobs at the expense of other jobs.

00:58:15.400 It's precisely what we've done with education.

00:58:17.800 We've said, look, there's higher education, and that's the thing we want to encourage people to do.

00:58:25.100 And then it's like there's this ellipses, right?

00:58:28.020 Because, well, if there's higher education, ipso facto, there must be lower jobs.

00:58:34.360 Higher jobs, but lower education.

00:58:36.760 Yeah, yeah.

00:58:37.200 Right?

00:58:37.660 No, we don't call it lower education.

00:58:39.300 We call it alternative, right?

00:58:41.380 So maybe the four-year thing is not for you.

00:58:43.640 So we've got a lovely trade school over here for you.

00:58:45.860 Or maybe this community college program, right?

00:58:48.460 Which seems like, you're right, it does seem like that's a consolation prize.

00:58:53.080 It's a vocational consolation prize.

00:58:54.920 These safety third masks led to an apprenticeship program at a little company that was on the verge of closing in North Carolina.

00:59:03.760 And the woman, Donna Bryn, who runs it, went to the community college, hired four or five seamstresses, taught the craft. 0.93

00:59:13.340 Their whole business came back on its feet, starting around these goofy little masks as a fundraiser for my foundation.

00:59:21.520 So, look, elevating work, celebrating work, looking for opportunities in places where we're told that they might be subordinate, it's important to do that.

00:59:32.600 That's why Dirty Jobs is still on the air. 1.00

00:59:35.100 Nobody knows it, because I never talk about it, but the number of multimillionaires on that show that we profiled?

00:59:41.860 Oh, I bet.

00:59:42.560 40, maybe 50?

00:59:43.980 I bet. 1.00

00:59:44.480 You just didn't know it, because they were covered in crap or something worse, right? 0.98

00:59:48.040 And so, they didn't look like success. 0.98

00:59:50.340 So, this is our fundamental problem.

00:59:52.520 You know, if a good education can happen in a trench or through an apprenticeship program, well, then that is perceived as a threat to people who are trying to control what higher education ought to mean.

01:00:07.740 And then, of course, you just follow the money.

01:00:09.380 So, what are the secrets to success?

01:00:16.220 Well, there's no real shortcut, in my view, like the old Horatio Alger stuff, and my foundation talks a lot about it.

01:00:25.040 And I know I sound like an old wealthy white guy screaming from his porch at the kids.

01:00:29.840 I don't mean to, and I try really hard not to go there, but there's just no substitute.

01:00:34.760 You know, delayed gratification, a decent attitude, a sense of humor.

01:00:41.560 Why sense of humor?

01:00:43.140 Well, because if you're not laughing, as my pop said, the joke's on you.

01:00:46.620 Yeah, okay.

01:00:47.260 Right?

01:00:47.600 I mean, that was such an important part of Dirty Jobs.

01:00:51.160 It still is.

01:00:52.100 You know, I don't want to go to job sites where there's no lightness.

01:00:58.580 It doesn't matter how grim the work is or how difficult or how dangerous.

01:01:02.940 The vast majority of those sites that I've been to always have this element of camaraderie, this band of brothers, which is humor's neighbor, right?

01:01:14.600 And so, it was really important for me on that show to make sure that we captured that in some way, shape, or form.

01:01:21.480 Because, I mean, whatever version of success you have, how can it not include joy, cheerfulness, probably the most important scout law, cheerful, right?

01:01:34.780 So, again, that's in your control.

01:01:38.040 Your work ethic is in your control. 0.95

01:01:39.940 The affirmative decision to show up early, stay late, take a bite of the crap sandwich when it comes around to you, and laugh through it, those are all choices.

01:01:49.500 So, our work ethic scholarship program specifically looks for people who have those traits.

01:01:57.020 Those traits won't make you successful.

01:02:01.000 But they go a long way.

01:02:02.080 I don't know any successful person who doesn't have them, you know, absent some lotto winners and trust fund babies, but, you know, that doesn't count.

01:02:11.060 Yeah.

01:02:12.940 Let me take you two places.

01:02:15.560 First of all, your favorite storyteller.

01:02:21.320 Well, I mean, Paul Harvey.

01:02:25.500 Paul Harvey took risks.

01:02:27.920 He, as you know, he's a radio guy, showed up every day in a suit and tie.

01:02:33.780 Yeah.

01:02:34.380 Every day.

01:02:35.060 At his own office with just him.

01:02:36.700 That's right.

01:02:37.260 Early.

01:02:37.800 Early.

01:02:38.140 Chicago days.

01:02:38.740 Really early.

01:02:39.500 Typed his own stuff, you know.

01:02:41.360 He and his boy developed the rest of the story.

01:02:44.260 Yeah.

01:02:44.620 Which inspired my podcast the way I heard it.

01:02:47.140 Still does.

01:02:49.420 You know, Harvey, Studs Terkel.

01:02:54.500 Oh, gosh, Donald Blank.

01:02:56.060 CBS This Morning.

01:02:58.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:02:58.680 On the road.

01:02:59.440 Yeah, yeah.

01:03:00.220 Corralt.

01:03:00.800 Charles Corralt.

01:03:02.360 Even George Plimpton.

01:03:04.100 You know, Plimpton was a guy who wanted to experience the thing before he wrote about it, which I admire a lot.

01:03:10.860 Corralt was a guy who would rather take the back road than the highway, which I admire a lot.

01:03:16.980 Paul Harvey was a guy who would tell you the end in the beginning, which I thought was great.

01:03:23.380 He was, there's just nobody.

01:03:26.340 Did you ever meet him?

01:03:27.600 No, I never did.

01:03:29.100 But I'll tell you, it's funny.

01:03:30.300 I got, I had a fun conversation with his son, you know, because when I started my podcast, I said, look, this is, this is straight up inspired by Paul Harvey.

01:03:39.640 He called it the rest of the story.

01:03:41.280 I call it the way I heard it.

01:03:42.700 And I wanted to tell stories about people you knew, but I wanted to share something you didn't know about them in that inside out way.

01:03:51.180 So it was, it was his formula, you know, and the podcast went up and we were up for about a year and we were doing really great.

01:03:59.380 I mean, it was killing it.

01:04:01.140 And, um, my partner, Mary called me one day and she's like, uh, we got a, uh, got a FedEx here from, uh, Paul Harvey jr.

01:04:09.220 You know, it was dropped off.

01:04:10.520 And I'm like, Oh God, it's going to be, it's an injunction.

01:04:13.500 It's a cease and desist.

01:04:14.600 It's a lawsuit.

01:04:15.320 It was a very generous check from my foundation with a note that said, my dad is looking down at this right now.

01:04:23.680 Oh, he's great.

01:04:25.600 He's loving it.

01:04:27.220 How great.

01:04:28.740 I'm not a sentimental fool.

01:04:30.340 I'm wary of all earnestness, but I brought a tear to my eye, you know, because, um, the rest of the story was probably as much Paul Harvey jr.

01:04:41.380 Oh yeah.

01:04:41.940 As his dad.

01:04:42.580 Oh yeah.

01:04:43.060 He pushed that thing forward.

01:04:44.140 Oh yeah.

01:04:44.680 You know?

01:04:45.220 Yeah.

01:04:45.820 So yeah, it made me think of my own dad and the things we had worked on and you know, all the stuff we're talking about right now.

01:04:51.940 Some days you think you're going to get sued and they send you a check.

01:04:55.680 Some days you think you're getting a check.

01:05:01.920 Let me, let's end it on, uh, on this.

01:05:06.100 The two or three times that you thought you were going to be the host of the daily show.

01:05:12.940 Yeah.

01:05:13.240 It was twice in those days.

01:05:15.460 I was still masquerading as a host and, and, and determined, you know, I hadn't had my dirty jobs epiphany in the sewer.

01:05:23.400 I was, I was a good host.

01:05:25.420 And, and this, this audition came along and they saw everybody.

01:05:30.100 They auditioned over 15,000 people.

01:05:32.280 And Oh my gosh.

01:05:33.360 In New, in New York and LA, it was going to be a big show.

01:05:36.040 And yet still in the end, they've ended up with Trevor Noah.

01:05:39.180 Hey, look, you know, these are uncertain times, but back then in the late nineties, you know, I didn't know what it was.

01:05:47.940 I just knew that comedy central sounded like a fun place to work.

01:05:51.120 Sure.

01:05:51.580 And the daily show sounded like a show that was on every day.

01:05:55.320 Right.

01:05:55.660 So I'm thinking, okay, there's some job security and you know, I can impersonate a news anchor and you know, they're, they're in on the joke.

01:06:02.380 I auditioned, they called me back.

01:06:04.660 I went back again, auditioned some more.

01:06:06.920 They called me back for a third time.

01:06:09.780 And I got the job.

01:06:11.260 They told me on a Friday, congratulations, come in Monday, meet the writers.

01:06:16.000 So I was very excited.

01:06:16.960 I was living in New York and had a great weekend, celebrated all weekend, went in Monday to meet the writers.

01:06:22.660 And there was just this one woman sitting in this room and she didn't look happy. 0.93

01:06:26.500 And I'm like, is this comedy central?

01:06:28.420 She's like, yes, but here's, here's what happened.

01:06:30.660 And long story short, um, Doug Herzog, who was running the place at the time, really wanted Craig Kilbourne, who was working at ESPN.

01:06:39.120 They wouldn't let him out of his contract, but over the weekend they relented.

01:06:42.560 They hired Craig.

01:06:43.560 I was out.

01:06:44.580 And that Glenn, that, that, I mean, rejection is important, but wow.

01:06:51.560 Yeah.

01:06:51.900 I was like, man, I could taste that one.

01:06:54.020 Yeah.

01:06:54.340 So, um, but they called me and they said, look, you know, you really, you got something kid.

01:07:00.660 You know, don't quit this.

01:07:01.920 You're good at this.

01:07:02.880 And we think our paths will cross again.

01:07:05.280 Well, son of a gun, a year later, old Craig Kilbourne gets the call, winds up doing the late show at CBS, I guess it was.

01:07:12.260 And, um, they call me back and they say, look, this job is basically yours.

01:07:17.780 We've looked at your tape from a year ago.

01:07:21.140 We'd like you to come in again, meet the folks, say hi.

01:07:24.680 So I did.

01:07:25.560 Were you, were you skeptical the second time?

01:07:27.820 No, that's the second.

01:07:29.280 No.

01:07:29.760 It was, it was like, look, I mean, I just thought.

01:07:33.120 There it is.

01:07:33.880 I thought it was destiny.

01:07:34.920 I'm like, well, obviously this is maybe, I come in, I meet everybody and, oh, the writers were so great.

01:07:41.820 And I met the director and I actually did a show.

01:07:44.280 It never aired, but they said, let's just sit down and have some fun.

01:07:47.060 And, you know, here's the prompter and maybe you can write some stuff.

01:07:50.120 And I, I wrote a fun thing and it, I just crushed it.

01:07:53.760 It was one of those days when you go home, you're like, this is it.

01:07:56.980 You just know you did your best.

01:07:59.720 Yeah.

01:07:59.940 It's like, if you're at the bat, you got every piece of it, you know, it just felt so right.

01:08:05.660 And as I was leaving, Madeline Smithberg said to me, she said, look, the only way this gig isn't yours is if this network, if this, her words, cheap ass network coughs up a few million dollars for the likes of Norm Macdonald. 1.00

01:08:23.200 Or, um, oh, who was the other guy, uh, Dennis Miller or Jon Stewart, but that'll never happen.

01:08:32.620 He says, that'll never happen.

01:08:34.640 So that's great.

01:08:36.240 Three days later, Jon signed a $4 million contract.

01:08:39.420 Right.

01:08:39.880 Do you think he'd even be considered now?

01:08:42.660 Oh, probably not.

01:08:45.280 I mean, I'd be, it wouldn't be funny, you know, to have a third whack at the apple.

01:08:50.900 I mean, I, I'm tempted.

01:08:52.600 I'm trying to think who I know over there that could give you a call and say, well, but Mike, we've got, we've got a gig for you.

01:08:59.580 Are you sitting down?

01:09:01.060 Unless we can get anyone else.

01:09:04.040 Here's the truth.

01:09:04.780 And this is probably a good place for me to land the plane.

01:09:07.620 Um, I don't think I'd take it, you know, if they offered.

01:09:12.380 And, and I, and I don't say that because I think I'm above it or anything.

01:09:15.580 I, a daily show is a priceless opportunity to, to influence and to push the rock up the hill and to do whatever it is you want to do.

01:09:25.140 God bless Trevor Noah.

01:09:26.400 You know, if he's having fun and everybody's happy, I think it's great.

01:09:30.040 Never.

01:09:30.440 I mean, I went from that rejection to working for Dick Clark where I learned some interesting things and then I had maybe a hundred other jobs, but it wasn't until the sewer in San Francisco when I realized I was a better guest than I was a host.

01:09:44.360 And it wasn't until the risk came together and the stars lined up and dirty jobs, got on the air and then off the air and then back on the air.

01:09:53.520 That's when my life changed.

01:09:55.160 That's when the foundation evolved.

01:09:58.360 That's when every good thing that's happened over the last 20 years, that's when the die was cast, you know?

01:10:05.560 And so it's, I haven't had the most glamorous career, but I've.

01:10:10.740 You've had a great career.

01:10:12.340 I've had a terrific run.

01:10:13.900 And, and I have a, a very unusual business with a really unique set.

01:10:20.300 My best friend from high school is the producer on my podcast and is deeply embedded in my foundation.

01:10:26.600 Mary, who, you know, has been with me from the start.

01:10:29.660 That woman managing partner at a, at a high end law firm with a lot of clients. 0.94

01:10:35.500 She left to work with a guy who crawled through a sewer as a guest in order to build a business that ultimately let me sit here with you talking about safety third and various other concepts that have allowed my foundation to give away a million dollars every year for work ethic scholarships.

01:10:56.060 So, yeah, the daily show would have been great.

01:10:59.440 We wouldn't have gotten you here.

01:11:00.280 Not here.

01:11:01.660 Mike, thanks.

01:11:02.440 Anytime.

01:11:02.700 Just a reminder, I'd love you to rate and subscribe to the podcast and pass this on to a friend so it can be discovered by other people.

01:11:15.740 We'll see you next time.

01:11:33.920 We'll see you next time.

The Glenn Beck Program - February 26, 2022

Ep 135 ｜ Mike Rowe’s Favorite Four-Letter Word ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

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