The Glenn Beck Program - Ep 273 ｜ Autistic Kids Can READ MINDS？ ‘Telepathy Tapes’ Doctor Reveals All

00:00:00.000 and now a blaze media podcast hello america you know we've been fighting every single day we push

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00:00:49.280 today's podcast promises to be unbelievable um is this based on a podcast that i listened to about

00:00:58.140 a year ago still going on and it is it will change the way you think about everything let's start

00:01:03.460 here can children with autism read our minds or see into the future can they know a foreign language

00:01:08.980 they've never been taught communicate with friends on the other side of the globe without ever leaving

00:01:13.520 their room or picking up a phone the answer my next guest says is yes this will make you reconsider

00:01:21.640 everything you think you know about autism the brain esp human consciousness um everything

00:01:30.320 welcome author researcher psychiatrist whose work has shook the nation and me personally in the mind

00:01:38.780 bending telepathy tapes this is dr diane hennessey

00:01:44.640 diane welcome to the program i am so excited to have you on i your telepathy tapes has

00:02:04.540 has totally opened my mind up into into areas that are uh not just medical advancements or

00:02:17.840 understanding um understanding and having more empathy but also spiritually i mean this your work is

00:02:27.340 touching on absolutely it's game-changing it's absolutely game-changing and i don't know why

00:02:32.940 there there aren't i don't know why you're not a household name right now with everyone i really

00:02:39.820 don't so well thank you you're welcome thank you um can can we start because i want to take people

00:02:48.160 who haven't necessarily heard about this and i want to start really kind of at the beginning so if

00:02:53.080 if you don't mind let me just kind of see if i can have you guide you through piecing all of this

00:02:58.860 together you you're educated harvard john hopkins you you study esp um and um you were at cambridge

00:03:10.920 hospital right and there was a a patient that came in they thought she was going to have a heart attack

00:03:17.740 and she said no i'm not having a heart attack what happened

00:03:20.840 well that was when i was a consult to the consultant to the medical floors and if somebody

00:03:29.840 on one of the medical floors is mentally ill they can't leave the hospital against medical advice

00:03:37.060 and this woman wanted to leave she said that she was seeing ghosts and that she was psychic and already

00:03:43.700 knew that the test would come back normal and so um she just wanted to leave and so they called me in

00:03:50.020 basically to evaluate her and sign the paperwork and keep her there and so when i went to see her

00:03:57.960 she told me she was seeing ghosts and i said yeah if there's any place there's ghosts it's probably in

00:04:04.080 a hospital and she laughed and she said you know you know i like you and she said um i'm getting a

00:04:10.660 reading about you do you mind if i share with you what i'm what i'm seeing and i said um yeah go ahead

00:04:16.920 i thought you know i'll just you know kind of you know get get a sense of you know how delusional

00:04:20.740 she was by yeah yeah sure about me and and the first thing that she said was your husband's a

00:04:26.440 chemist and my husband was a biochemist and then she said and he's applying for a position in two

00:04:33.340 different cities right now and he was he was applying for postdoctorates in biochemistry that

00:04:38.480 very week and then she told me that we'd end up in san diego which was one of the cities

00:04:44.080 wow it is where we ended up and and she told me other things about my life that that um unfolded

00:04:51.440 okay so so how deeply were you into esp and all of this and and and how much of it did you think

00:05:00.060 was real at this point oh at that point i was totally in the materialist model of neuroscience i was a

00:05:09.560 neuroscientist as an undergraduate um i trained in neuropsychiatry and in my training i mean that

00:05:16.820 we were taught that if somebody says that they can read other people's minds or if they can read the

00:05:22.880 future or if they see ghosts that that's a sign of a psychosis and that they would need medication

00:05:29.720 and so so this was totally antithetical to everything that i had believed what did that do

00:05:39.180 to you it was my i'm sorry what did that do to you well what it did to me was it raised my curiosity

00:05:47.960 because i didn't have any need for things to be one way or the other i i'm i'm i'm a really i was

00:05:55.180 basically raised to be a scientist my father was had graduate degrees in three different branches

00:06:00.760 of science he was the head of the artificial heart program at batel memorial i was raised with science

00:06:06.840 kits and i just thought at the time that i was um in my 20s the most exciting frontier was really

00:06:14.600 understanding the brain and consciousness and i already had studied physics and um was aware of

00:06:24.680 the fact that physicists over 100 years ago had told us that reality is not the way that we perceive it

00:06:32.260 right that reality is you know that you know whether you're looking at einstein's theory of

00:06:37.060 relativity or you're looking at niels Bohr and you know the quantum mechanics that you were told that

00:06:44.280 um this isn't this isn't the real reality and so i thought when i heard this i thought well

00:06:52.100 you know this is very very similar to um first of all i thought if this is true if people can uh

00:07:00.500 read minds or predict the future that has profound implications for for everything but can i tell you

00:07:08.040 this is why i like you so much um most people are they like living in the world that has been crafted

00:07:17.840 and they don't necessarily want to pursue things i mean that is a dangerous thing for you as a scientist

00:07:25.960 to and you must have known this i'm sure you did to say oh you know what i think this esp thing there might

00:07:31.940 be something to that nobody likes to go into that box because there's too many scientists that are unlike

00:07:39.820 you that are unwilling to challenge i mean that's what science is supposed to be but they're unwilling

00:07:46.960 to challenge the things that people think they know they have to keep you in this box so did you realize

00:07:55.180 how scary this was going to be for you absolutely a hundred percent i um i really made a lot of

00:08:03.100 sacrifices in order to yeah you lost your license i mean i walked i'm sorry you lost your license

00:08:10.300 why yeah well and before that i walked away from a successful academic career

00:08:15.820 i mean you know not only you know as a child was i groomed to become a scientist but i was groomed to

00:08:23.180 become you know you know at some point like a chairman of a department i mean you know here i was

00:08:28.680 you know i was on faculty at you know harvard and i and then after that i was part of a think tank that

00:08:36.200 met at the salk institute that had all these nobel laureates in science there and um and that was like

00:08:44.500 the you know like sort of like the pinnacle of you know for me was to be at a place where i was working

00:08:50.780 with great minds and when i was at johns hawkins i was trained by the best of the best i mean the person

00:08:55.980 who taught me neuroscience there was vernon mountcastle and he's the person who mapped out

00:09:01.280 the visual cortex and chimpanzees and and i went to johns hopkins precisely because i wanted to work

00:09:08.260 with the best of the best i i went to the institute of psychiatry in london and studied with sir michael

00:09:13.300 rutter back in 1987 and he was the world's expert on autism and i went to queen square which is the

00:09:21.480 mecca for neurologist you and did you ever so i so i really i really really wanted to be you know

00:09:28.640 in a you know a top scientist and then what i discovered when i got into these institutions

00:09:34.520 was that there was a certain ossification of thought they're afraid they're afraid aren't they

00:09:42.160 and and and and doesn't it and doesn't it doesn't it breed more fear because you're you want you

00:09:50.280 works look everybody wants to be popular everybody wants to be on the in crowd you know nobody is like

00:09:56.200 nobody ever says you know what i want to be a pariah you know you want to be popular um and so

00:10:02.280 everything is everything is set up in the world for you to want to be accepted especially by

00:10:09.120 whatever tribe it is you want to be a part of and when you go against that tribe but science should

00:10:17.920 be different science should be holding the people up who say you know what this is this is very risky

00:10:23.860 but it has to be said we don't know we you know for years people said there's no way you know god

00:10:30.840 doesn't play dice well look at quantum uh quantum computing right now it is real we just don't have

00:10:38.460 any idea how it works we we are we're infants playing with the universe and we have no idea

00:10:48.620 what we're doing but somehow or another we're arrogant enough just to keep saying no we know

00:10:52.440 exactly how it works and we don't right right and you know i think that well first of all i mean my

00:11:00.000 father was somebody who was doing really cutting-edge work i mean before he um became a cardiovascular

00:11:05.140 physiologist he was doing research at hanford he was he was doing um work to see what the biological

00:11:14.940 effects of plutonium were and his work helped to end the testing that was being done wow and then and

00:11:21.320 then so is that what gave you courage is that what gave you courage to stand you think your parents

00:11:27.160 your upbringing a lot of it a lot of it is a lot of it is my parents yeah my my father um i'll never

00:11:34.720 forget when i was in seventh grade my father wanted to see my science book and he um and he saw that it

00:11:43.240 said in there that a frog had four chambers to their heart and here my father was the head of the

00:11:48.600 artificial heart program and and and and he had a laboratory when i was a kid he had a laboratory in the

00:11:54.280 basement that um you know he would um monitor uh he would monitor animals after he had done surgery

00:12:01.400 on them and you know and when he was designing parts and and um and so i know if anybody knew

00:12:08.380 about how many chambers that there were in the right it was my father and he said but this is wrong and i

00:12:13.700 said you know i'm like how can that be and he said you can't believe everything you read you know that

00:12:18.820 there are mistakes and so i remember when i took my test and sure enough they had a question about

00:12:26.940 how many chambers were in the hearts of a frog and i had to put down three and i got it marked wrong but

00:12:34.000 i but i was at that was like uh that that says something about my personality even in seventh grade

00:12:40.280 where i i knew i had make a choice and i would choose to put down what i knew was the truth

00:12:46.600 rather than what was a lie because i knew that they were that they expected me to write down three

00:12:52.020 i mean write down four wow that it i mean that is such an important lesson for everybody today how

00:12:57.980 many people are going through school and they're just like just write down what they want you to

00:13:00.960 write down that's not the right thing to do um so let me just go back real quick um because what

00:13:07.100 you have to share is so fascinating but i'm fascinated by you um you got your license back you lost your

00:13:12.900 license and then you got your license back that's still used to discredit you by some well she lost

00:13:18.060 her license but you got your license back can you quickly just tie that story up oh sure um so what

00:13:25.800 happened is is i wrote a book titled the esp enigma a scientific case for psychic phenomena and in that

00:13:34.580 book what i did was i basically i described how incomplete the model of neuroscience was i mean if

00:13:41.440 anybody should know that it would be me having trained as a neuroscientist um i i discussed the

00:13:47.980 physics that was over 100 years old and the implications of that and then i also basically

00:13:57.180 gave a you know several um several examples of research that had been done by parapsychologists over

00:14:05.420 the past century that had positive results and results that were statistically significant

00:14:12.980 that it's so significant that they surpassed that of other branches of science that have accepted

00:14:21.500 other you know other data and so i'm just like there's a prejudice against this and so that's why i wrote

00:14:28.900 that book and what happened was after somebody reported me to the medical board for some you know

00:14:38.400 something that was really a trivial thing that i thought was going to go away i mean you know you

00:14:42.580 know a patient that um i had been taking care of had gotten a medical marijuana card and he was somebody

00:14:48.900 who if if he used marijuana it would make him become manic and he became manic and he refused to stop

00:14:55.600 smoking the marijuana and so he started doing strange things in public that embarrassed the family and

00:15:03.280 so they reported me to the board thinking i didn't know what i was doing and what happened though is

00:15:09.520 that a lot of people don't realize that medical boards are administrative law courts and they don't

00:15:15.280 work like the rest of the judicial system in in in a you know in a criminal proceeding or a civil law

00:15:24.400 you're guilty you're you're innocent until proven guilty right and in administrative law courts it's the

00:15:30.400 opposite you're guilty until proven innocent and so what happened is is that the psychiatrist reported to the board

00:15:39.080 that because i had written a book on esp and she hadn't read it she just saw the title you know because i'd written

00:15:46.400 a book on esp i must be engaging in magical thinking wow you know you know and and i think what it is is

00:15:55.200 that really you know what the board is thinking is like to even give esp any credibility at all is such

00:16:04.560 an insane thing to do this woman must be insane yeah and um and so you you really can't be mentally ill and

00:16:15.040 practice psychiatry so they're like we've got to pull her license right away because she's seeing

00:16:18.800 patients and how did you get it back so i got it back three months later at the next board meeting

00:16:26.160 and how i got it back was i underwent three days of intensive testing right you know everything from

00:16:33.520 personality testing she's testing and rorschach and i even had to see a neurologist to make sure that i

00:16:40.800 didn't have a brain tumor because you know i you know it was something medically wrong with me to

00:16:45.360 make me psychotic so i mean i i and i got a clean bill of health and um and so they really couldn't

00:16:54.160 justify keeping my license away from me based on my mental health anymore i have to tell you i don't i

00:16:59.680 mean i don't want to compare it to this at all in any way but i keep i'm reminded of the ghostbusters

00:17:05.920 where the women were the ghostbusters i don't know if you saw it but one of them wrote a book

00:17:09.920 on esp and she was discussed she had a great career and she was just discredited by it but

00:17:14.880 anyway um i digress sorry to get there more in just a second first the seasons are shifting the

00:17:21.440 air is getting cooler the days are getting shorter and while you're switching out your wardrobe or

00:17:25.600 putting an extra blanket on the bed something else is happening as well something you won't you

00:17:30.000 won't see until it's already inside out there in the leaves and the mulch and the crawl spaces

00:17:34.160 pests are on their move and spiders the ants the silverfish all of it is um you know they're coming

00:17:40.560 looking for the same thing a warm place to hide out for the winter and unless you make it clear

00:17:43.920 they're not welcome that place might be your house moxie pest control knows exactly how this plays out

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00:18:00.000 this is not about bugs this is about the line between what's out there and what belongs inside

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00:18:15.760 beck and use the promo code beck okay let me go back to you going back in the 80s you go to england

00:18:24.720 you're studying with the guy who is the leading guy on autism and you're coming back here and

00:18:32.320 you're told there's just not enough cases of autism to really do anything with this information to be

00:18:39.600 able to continue to study here right absolutely yeah it was at that time it was um you know maybe you

00:18:48.800 know one or two per 10 000 children so what has happened i know this is a big question but what

00:18:54.800 has happened since then to now are we diagnosing more is more happening i know we'll get into this

00:19:01.120 later but i know you say it's over diagnosed or or misdiagnosed in several different ways you

00:19:06.720 say there's different forms or faces of it but what has happened since then well it is so

00:19:13.920 i would say that it's it's it's a combination of everything and that's part of why it's such a

00:19:19.920 confusing um area for people i think that back in the 80s it was under diagnosed okay and i i and

00:19:30.000 because we didn't know what it was well so here's the thing okay back in the 80s we had three um we had

00:19:41.360 three subcategories of autism it was before it all was lumped together as autism spectrum disorder

00:19:48.800 so so back in the 80s we we talked about asperger's syndrome and pervasive developmental disorder and

00:19:57.440 autism and they really were three different um conditions and asperger's is really more

00:20:05.360 this sort of really kind of nerdy introverted socially awkward um sort of individual peter

00:20:14.480 teal i met him um well i'm not gonna say yeah well i met him i mean you just described it you know yeah

00:20:20.720 and and and and and and so um but but it's a diagnosis that goes back to you know you know the

00:20:27.600 world war ii actually um and um so anyway um and so then we also had autism and autism was described

00:20:36.560 by leo canner and um and and a couple of the children in in that um study of 11 children had

00:20:45.360 regressed during development and um but the others were the children of extremely bright

00:20:52.560 um highly educated individuals and we're really more kind of you know like what we think of as

00:20:59.280 asperger's and so what happened is that asperger's was not it was not pathologized you know it's just

00:21:12.240 sort of like well that's just kind of you know the kid that's sort of a loner you know they're you know

00:21:17.040 they're really bright and you know a little eccentric but it wasn't you know turned into a

00:21:22.080 you know a psychiatric disorder and there's a huge difference between and so i would say that was

00:21:28.320 underdiagnosed you know we're now we're now diagnosing people like that with asperger's and

00:21:33.840 in fact it's almost become popular you know popular to say on the spectrum yeah okay so but then

00:21:40.880 the regressive form that's what's that's what's increased in in numbers that's where we've really

00:21:47.040 seen the true increase in numbers is is in that regressive form and we're also seeing more of the

00:21:52.720 asperger's because you have more and more um there's something called assortative mating where you have

00:21:58.640 uh individuals tend to be attracted to other people that are like them and so so i mean when in if you go

00:22:08.720 back a hundred years when we were less mobile and and women weren't going to college as much as they

00:22:13.840 are now you you didn't have this sort of more aspergy you know type you know male meeting a woman that was

00:22:21.920 a little more like that and and so so what you've you've had is you've had more and more of these

00:22:26.880 pairings of people and and and so you're getting you're having these children that's what i wasn't it

00:22:33.760 i'm trying to remember the author of the bell curve but i think he talks about that how

00:22:38.960 society changed and you started having pairings where it used to be maybe an intellectual but

00:22:43.840 married to somebody who wasn't an intellectual but now everybody started going to the same way

00:22:48.320 and so you think that played a role i think that that played a role yeah yeah um but but then the

00:22:55.200 other thing though is the these kids whose development is being disrupted right at the time that they're

00:23:00.880 starting to become social beings and develop language which those are the two criteria for

00:23:06.320 something being autism is that you have some developmental um you know anomaly in their

00:23:14.400 language and social skills um and and so that's that age that you know between um you know one and a

00:23:21.120 half and two and a half where we're really we're developing language we're really starting to really test out our

00:23:27.680 our separateness you know from you know that individuation separation stage of piaget and so

00:23:34.320 when something happens to interrupt development then you're going to you're you're getting somebody

00:23:39.360 who's being diagnosed as autistic but there's a lot of things that can disrupt development then i mean

00:23:45.600 you know and and there's a lot of things that are in our environment now that were not in our environment

00:23:50.800 before and and get released into the environment um without testing to see how do they affect brain

00:23:58.720 development because it's sort of like you can't really ethically do those tests right right then

00:24:02.720 when you're releasing things into the environment that can um have those effects then you know you know

00:24:09.600 it's where i believe that we're obligated to try to figure out what's what and um in that in that kind of

00:24:16.000 what we're i mean i really want to get to the telepathy part of this because it's so crazy changed

00:24:20.800 game changing but i i don't want to just brush this off this is kind of what jfk or rfk is doing now

00:24:26.960 right i mean do you have any thoughts on the on the tylenol stuff or you know our food and i don't want

00:24:33.040 to get deeply into it but that's the kind of stuff maybe not that specific but that's the kind of stuff

00:24:38.240 you're talking about we have a responsibility to look for these things right we do have a responsibility to

00:24:44.720 look at these things and um and and i appreciate that that's finally happening now right and i i think

00:24:52.640 that you know in a way what they've announced already is some of the low-hanging fruit

00:24:58.800 he's been made into a nut job for even saying if that's the low-hanging fruit wait until we get to

00:25:04.800 the hard fruit to pick because they've just torn him apart they're doing to him what they did to you

00:25:10.240 i know i know and um i you know i you know and i really you know i really respect i must say that

00:25:21.840 you know it's inspiring to see you know other people who like me are willing to you know take

00:25:26.480 the slings and arrows and um because you know you're doing the right thing and i i care deeply about

00:25:33.360 children and our future generations and um and i you know and i i really and i care about humanity

00:25:41.520 i mean i don't want us to go extinct and in many ways i think that these children with these

00:25:47.200 developmental disorders are um they're like the canaries in the coal mine so let me ask you because

00:25:53.360 there's i read something years ago that i don't remember who said it but it just stuck with me and i

00:26:00.960 wondered it as i was listening to the telepathy tapes um some researcher said that he felt there was a

00:26:09.120 possibility that some with who are diagnosed with uh with autism are actually a step ahead on the

00:26:18.400 evolutionary scale that they're that they are um they are adapting you know to something that is coming

00:26:26.000 i what i what i what i pulled from that was um uh that we are um that that autism may be

00:26:38.640 not a curse but it may be a blessing that we just don't understand yet is does that sound reasonable or is

00:26:47.040 that crazy no it's it's very reasonable absolutely um i think that one of the one of the

00:26:55.920 features of these autistic individuals is that they their cognitive style is different than ours so

00:27:03.120 so so the highest percentage of people are what are called verbal thinkers you know the the way that

00:27:10.160 they think is in a very you know analytical linear way and the autistic individuals have predominantly

00:27:20.720 either what's called visual spatial thinking or pattern recognition as their process and those

00:27:27.920 those are superior to verbal thinking and and one of the reasons why they're superior to verbal thinking

00:27:34.960 is that first of all they're faster you know it's it's it's like the difference between a digital

00:27:40.080 computer and a quantum computer it's it's gestalt thinking where you you just see the whole thing at once

00:27:46.960 as opposed to having to figure it out bit by bit um people who have visual spatial thinking they can

00:27:57.360 like nikola tesla they can design something in their mind and you know and analyze it from every

00:28:03.280 angle test it out and everything before they even build it correct and and and and then pattern

00:28:09.360 thinkers and and i'm a pattern thinker uh i think i am too they're the ones who connect the dots yes

00:28:16.960 and and and so that's what we need now we need that the verb the problem with the verbal processing

00:28:26.800 is not only is it slow but it can be deceptive yeah look at how well look at how we can talk we can

00:28:39.200 rationalize and talk ourselves into believing a lot of things that are not true yes and and so that

00:28:46.000 source of knowledge where it comes from what you um build an argument for it's it's it's like what

00:28:54.960 a lot of attorneys do and politicians do everybody you know they they they sell you on a bit of good

00:29:00.160 right goods you know they you know they and they make a rational and they and you follow it you go oh

00:29:04.800 yeah you know and that's the that's the primrose path and if that's your source of knowledge

00:29:10.720 versus knowledge where it's just like boom i see it all fits together correct all of the everything

00:29:17.200 converges into this this thing that's closer to truth so and what we need to solve the problems today

00:29:28.880 is that kind of thinking more in just a second first medicare costs are a silent thief thousands of

00:29:35.280 your dollars just vanish if you pick the wrong plan and there's a lot of americans out there

00:29:40.080 who have been you know taken in by slick advisors promising great plans only to find out later that

00:29:45.280 things like their co-pays are now bleeding them dry chapter is different i've met with these people

00:29:50.800 personally they founded the whole company specifically because their own parents got taken in with terrible

00:29:56.080 medicare programs and they just trusted and they when they found out they were like they were in

00:30:01.920 silicon valley they're like we have to turn ai into something that can help so this doesn't happen

00:30:06.640 to other people's parents um chapter is what they started and they don't just guide you they search

00:30:13.120 every single plan from every character uh carrier and it's done with technology so sharp it cuts through

00:30:19.760 all of the noise these are licensed advisors and they have no hidden agendas they're not working for

00:30:24.720 anybody any of these insurance carriers okay other american other medicare advisors cherry pick

00:30:30.880 plans that pad their pockets chapter puts you first dial pound 250 say the keyword chapter it's

00:30:36.160 pound 250 keyword chapter or go to ask chapter.org slash beck there's a book um about security um and

00:30:46.480 it's it was it's by gavin de becker um and it's called the gift of fear and i think this is what you have

00:30:53.040 you read it have you read it okay um and he talks about fear is a gift if you you begin to listen to

00:31:01.360 it not not over fear but it dogs bark for a reason we will always say you know what that serial killer

00:31:12.160 lived next door to me for years and yeah they were a little off but i just never saw this coming but the

00:31:16.240 dog probably barked every time because there's a gift of fear but we rationalize it out and so we

00:31:23.040 dismiss too many of the scene too many of the things that are actually important not to dismiss but i think

00:31:32.400 that's kind of what you're you're talking about here so when when you have somebody and and let's talk

00:31:38.560 specifically how you got in with this group and started finding these what you found these these

00:31:46.480 kids or people that that you have been studying is it that is it that they they couldn't speak and so

00:31:56.000 it's kind of like when you're you know if you're blind they say your your your hearing becomes more

00:32:01.680 acute because you just you have to is it that they couldn't speak and so they found different ways or

00:32:08.480 did they find different ways for some reason and that just caused them to not communicate that way

00:32:14.080 does that make sense to you yeah yeah yeah no absolutely yeah so i mean during the first um

00:32:22.080 i mean our brain remains what we call plastic for our whole life in terms of its ability to remodel

00:32:27.760 itself but it is really you know plastic in the beginning at you know those first four years and so and

00:32:35.360 you know really what you're doing in the learning process is you're basically sculpting your brain

00:32:40.160 and there are certain things that are essential you you know functions that one of them is um

00:32:47.840 navigation you know and and so that's why if you have people that are born blind they'll oftentimes be

00:32:54.400 able to navigate using their auditory system they they you know there's right famous uh echolocator

00:33:01.440 uh named daniel case who basically he he emits clicks and it and and then he's able to map out

00:33:10.480 crazy the world and even you know mountain climb ride a bike and all this stuff

00:33:16.240 using the information he gets from the waves you know the coming back bouncing off his environment and so

00:33:23.440 you know and that's that's really what we do is we you know our brains decode information that's

00:33:30.240 contained in waves you know whether they're sound waves or light waves and so another essential

00:33:37.120 function is communication and and when you are a child you're independent upon you know the other for

00:33:47.280 for everything um communication is critical correct and and and you know being social you know we want

00:33:55.040 to know kind of what are other people thinking you know and and so so like navigation communication is

00:34:03.280 that um that important and if you don't if you're deprived of the typical communication then you use what i

00:34:10.720 i think is a default system and i think that i think that what they're using is a if you could think of

00:34:18.800 it as almost like a proto language that you know that they're able to access information just like for

00:34:29.280 example you know dogs can pick things up you know it's it's a more primal sense that i think we all

00:34:36.160 have but it's but it's but what happens is it gets buried it gets buried in it in it and it atrophies

00:34:42.160 to some extent because you don't use it because they're using it is that how they grow because they

00:34:47.120 you talk in the and you demonstrate it's amazing what you demonstrate they know history they know

00:34:52.400 philosophy things they never learned they were never exposed to so is that just because they

00:34:58.880 they they didn't filter all these things out and so this this skill grew or or what where is that

00:35:08.240 coming from well okay so what you're talking about is um something called savant syndrome which comes

00:35:15.680 from the latin savar which means to know and there are cases that go back hundreds of years we used to

00:35:23.360 call them idiot savants right i'm sure that's not used to yeah but that just meant we didn't

00:35:28.640 understand them but once you understood them they were way ahead of everybody else yeah i mean the

00:35:34.720 the yeah that name came from the fact that it's it's not it's different a savant is different from a

00:35:40.640 genius and in in the sense that they usually have deficits somewhere so it's sort of like you

00:35:51.120 you've robbed peter to pay paul okay okay yeah you've given up something okay okay but now you've got

00:35:57.920 you've got this you know superpower and um and so most savants are autistic and uh the second most uh

00:36:10.480 common category of savants are people who are blind and and so in both of those cases you have something

00:36:18.240 that as i said it it takes you away from you know the uh it takes you away from the normal path to

00:36:27.200 meeting those basic functions of navigation and communication and puts you back into something

00:36:32.800 that precedes that um and so with savants um i mean there was this boy who back in the early 1800s

00:36:44.080 um he was like five years old hadn't even been to school and he was like spouting you know mathematical

00:36:50.160 equations and solving them and and um and he even went around and demonstrated this to people in

00:36:57.760 public where do you think this is coming from because you're you're well that's what i've been

00:37:03.200 working on i've been working on a theory for that because see that because that's the thing is that

00:37:08.000 besides knowing about modern physics i knew about savant syndrome because of having met oliver

00:37:14.400 sacks back in 1986 when i was at johns hopkins and he had just published this book the man who mistook

00:37:22.000 his wife for a hat and he talked in that book about these two identical twins who were institutionalized

00:37:28.480 who were autistic that he had evaluated who could just spit out prime numbers in six digits consecutive

00:37:37.920 ones back and forth and there was no good algorithm for prime numbers and they and they were the

00:37:42.800 kids said that they weren't deriving the numbers that they just appeared to them they just saw the

00:37:47.120 numbers and oliver sacks tested them and validated their prime numbers up to 12 digits the kids actually

00:37:55.680 generated them even in 20 digits but sacks couldn't validate that because the computers in the 60s couldn't

00:38:02.800 do it and yet so they exceeded computational capacity and when i heard about savant syndrome and i of course

00:38:12.240 heard about that before i met this patient at cambridge i was thinking okay this is another

00:38:17.040 example even though it was shocking to me i still was i was like this is another example of somebody

00:38:22.560 knowing information that we think we shouldn't have access to that that we don't it doesn't fit the

00:38:29.680 model and i was like well if i'm going to have a complete model of how the brain works then i can't just

00:38:37.760 dismiss certain yes i have to be able to include them too yes and and so so the reality is that i

00:38:48.480 think that what these autistic savants are showing us is that we have a lot of things inverted in terms

00:38:55.600 of the way that we think about things it's almost like so you think of plato and the platonic realm

00:39:00.720 you know you know that that that that you know these idealist you know philosophers talked about

00:39:06.880 how you know that that that precedes you know the the the the manifestation of something it gets back

00:39:16.720 into like you know a lot of scriptures and esoteric um things where they say first was the word yes

00:39:24.400 you know and so it's sort of like you know so it's all about kind of the art of creation the art of

00:39:29.920 manifestation but it also but it also goes to more of a uh lack of a better term a universal mind you

00:39:41.280 know it's always struck me that we invented airplanes on three different continents almost at the same

00:39:48.160 time you know i mean it's almost like there's these things where you all of a sudden people can

00:39:53.360 pierce through into a universal knowledge set absolutely absolutely and so my model for um and

00:40:03.280 and my next book will be coming out in in uh fall of 26 um is really uh looking at the brain as being

00:40:10.720 more like a device like like my smartphone that that that enables me to surf the cloud that that information

00:40:18.000 is really not you know it's not in here yes this is just my this is just my tool and that there is

00:40:27.920 that that the actual the part of the brain the hippocampus that's involved in memory and involved

00:40:35.360 in navigating physical space i mean you know somebody you know people got a nobel prize you know for

00:40:40.080 discovering the cells and the hippocampus that are involved in our navigation of space well the hippocampus is

00:40:45.760 also involved in laying out memory and and i think that what we're what what what it it it helps us

00:40:51.040 navigate both physical and mental space and that mental space can be our own personal sort of field

00:40:58.080 of consciousness but we can also then depending upon um you know our own you know practices and filters and

00:41:07.600 what that that we can actually go beyond that and and and gain access to um you know you know uh the

00:41:16.640 universal field if you so let me um why don't you spend a few minutes just talking about the telepathy

00:41:27.280 tapes and these kids that you you found and started finding them all over the world and what they can do

00:41:35.200 do sure so um so what happened was is that i after i wrote my book the esp enigma i was invited to

00:41:45.920 india to meet these savants because i i said in the book that i thought that um that basically what

00:41:52.880 savants were doing was the same as esp and i knew that savant syndrome was accepted by science so i saw

00:41:58.560 that as my sort of my you know my you are good yes you're good you can connect the dots i see that

00:42:09.920 yeah and and and so um so i went over there to study these savants and um and they had you know

00:42:16.320 these skills that were really remarkable um you know this one boy um but but a lot of the skills were

00:42:22.480 like we're we're esp as far as i'm concerned this this one boy he would he would see illness in other

00:42:30.080 people and he would like so for example the the doctor told uh the story of where the the boy touched

00:42:36.320 this woman's breast and and and he said ma'am he says i you know i want you to know you better get a

00:42:42.080 mammogram because he doesn't touch people unless they have illness somewhere and she had a mammogram

00:42:46.800 and sure no she had breast cancer breast and um and and you know and then another you know another

00:42:54.320 child who was your sort of more typical savant who he's like five years old and he he knew a lot of

00:43:00.160 things in in math and science that i mean he'd never been taught um and just as i was getting ready to

00:43:08.000 leave india this the woman who had worked for the government there um with these children um who had

00:43:15.040 invited me over there she said oh by the way they're all telepathic and um they're telepathic

00:43:19.440 with one another and i'm like what wow i'm like well i would have loved to have tested for that but

00:43:24.960 i was literally i was getting ready to leave and so i came back to the states and i was on various you

00:43:33.040 know interviews and we i mean we podcast back then we're you know what they are today you know this

00:43:39.440 was like um you know back in 2013 and um but people were familiar with my work and i said i really

00:43:50.320 wanted to test you know children who were autistic who might be telepathic and i was contacted by this

00:43:57.600 family and they had a a daughter that they said we have we have a daughter who's telepathic with two

00:44:04.880 different therapists who come to the home to work with her and so daryl trefford and i both evaluated

00:44:13.760 this child in a scientific fashion it was really in a scientific way you did it just brilliant very

00:44:20.480 good for you yeah but go ahead yeah yeah and so so the story of this girl was that her her her father

00:44:27.520 who was familiar with the idea of mathematical savants thought she was a mathematical savant because

00:44:32.480 even though she had she she didn't do regular arithmetic she could solve very complex mathematical

00:44:39.680 problems and so the therapist was working with her in the home one day and her calculator died and so

00:44:46.880 she used a different means of doing the calculation and this she used an ipad and it wasn't in this girl's

00:44:54.720 um line of vision at all and it gave the answer in logarithmic notation and haley spelled on her

00:45:04.480 talker she had a you know a device where you you you it's like a keyboard that then gives you an

00:45:09.920 electronic voice she typed onto it the logarithmic notation instead and and and the therapist is like

00:45:17.440 how wait a minute wait a minute how did you know that you know and and she said well i can i can

00:45:24.480 see the numerators and denominators in your head you know she's basically i'm reading your mind and

00:45:28.400 then and then the therapist started asking her questions that that she knew the answers to and

00:45:32.640 she's like blown away and then then similarly a second therapist who was working in the home discovered

00:45:38.160 it through some you know accidents and so so when i went there to to evaluate them i um i put a

00:45:47.920 barrier a visual barrier between the child and the therapist and i had cameras through you know all

00:45:55.920 over the room i had them you know above and on all the walls and um and then the cameraman and i were in

00:46:03.200 another room you know getting a feed you know from you know the cameras that we could monitor

00:46:08.800 everything and i had already taken numbers and words and pictures and everything and had randomized

00:46:16.960 them and and and given them to the the therapist as a stack for her to one by one you know turn over

00:46:23.440 and see what it was and then think it and say to haley okay you know type you know type in your talk

00:46:31.520 yeah yeah yeah and um and these tests came back and this is stunning to me these tests come back

00:46:39.840 10 out of 10 you ask 10 questions you get 10 right answers right i mean if it was

00:46:46.080 it was close i mean it's it's it's between 90 it's between 97 you know

00:46:53.040 but if you had if you had 70 right you would think that would be on the front page of every

00:46:58.080 page of every paper you have 97 of the time it's right that's way beyond statistic anything

00:47:07.680 absolutely absolutely and that's the reason why so so back up a bit um so you know after i got my

00:47:17.280 license back from the medical board i i was determined to do two things and the first thing was

00:47:23.040 i was going to find evidence that would be convincing okay to the skeptics and i knew that

00:47:28.560 there was all this evidence that was out there that was even though it was statistically significant

00:47:34.640 it wasn't like knock your socks off you know so let's say if chances that you get 25

00:47:41.840 of the answers right right and you're scoring at 35 right i mean nobody's going to lose sleep over

00:47:48.160 that right um 97 changes you that changes you and and i realized that these autistic savants that

00:47:58.480 there's there they're a whole order of a magnitude better than than any of the other you know psyche

00:48:06.800 and their literature out there and and and i i realized that with the savant skills and then you know just

00:48:12.560 ergo if you know if if if that's true for the savant skills why couldn't i then do that with you know

00:48:18.240 these esp skills and and sure enough i you know i found that they could in if i'm not mistaken i mean

00:48:24.640 it's been a long time since i listened to it um but moms were were connected more than anybody else

00:48:31.280 right or they would read their mothers maybe i'm remembering it that incorrectly but there was a

00:48:37.600 there was something with the mothers that were thinking my child can read my mind and it was the

00:48:45.040 moms that were either the first to discover or there was a bigger a higher percentage that could

00:48:50.320 do it with their mom is that right well that well that's yeah i i'd say that um typically you know it

00:48:57.040 is a mother but it but it can also be somebody who's not related at all at all either speech therapist

00:49:02.960 or you know the um you know the aba you know person that's working with them right but i mean

00:49:09.280 first it's someone they develop a bond with right usually and it was and if i'm not mistaken it was

00:49:14.000 first moms thinking this is correct right that's not even possible that we're reaching out to you

00:49:20.240 saying i i know i'm not crazy but this sounds crazy right yeah so the the so the people that reach out to

00:49:28.480 me are um they're typically extremely well educated and they're reaching out to me not only because they

00:49:38.720 have a child who's telepathic and they had some experience where they're going oh my god could

00:49:44.720 an autistic kid be telepathic and then they do a google search my name gets pulled up but a lot of

00:49:50.800 them the reason why they're contacting me is that this it was a shock to them it's not that they were you

00:49:57.920 know themselves you know came from a family where everybody's psychic or they're woo-woo or you know

00:50:02.960 they're into it was you in at cambridge yeah yeah exactly you know they they're having it in their own

00:50:09.840 home they can't escape from it and they don't know what to do with it and they're really desperate to

00:50:15.840 um understand what's going on and and then also they want to know how do i raise a kid like this

00:50:23.520 because they're like you know these kids one of the things that's funny is that um they you know

00:50:29.600 they can cheat so easily in their schoolwork wow you know and and and so the parents are like how do i

00:50:37.360 get them an education when all they have to do is just read it just yeah all they have to do is just

00:50:46.400 you know read the teacher's mind or whatever that's so funny you know it's it's kind of like what we're

00:50:51.760 faced with now with ai you know people are like how do we get these kids to learn how to think you

00:50:57.520 know if they're just using ai to do the thinking for them the thing that i was really struck by and

00:51:04.640 it's always bothered me with um stephen hawking i love stephen hawking's work and uh i was a big

00:51:12.480 fan of reading just the way his mind worked the way he was willing to see things differently

00:51:16.880 and i thought you know 40 years ago uh if he would have lived 40 years earlier everybody would

00:51:25.920 have been talking to him about putting in a very childlike voice and he would have been trapped in

00:51:32.160 his body doing three-dimensional models of the universe and he had to be in screaming my my grandfather had

00:51:41.200 strokes and i remember he could not speak but i remember he would try and a tear would come down

00:51:47.440 his cheek and i i was very young and i remember you can be trapped in your body my grandfather is in a

00:51:54.960 prison of his own body and and the same thing when i saw stephen hawking i'm like oh my gosh thank god for

00:52:03.760 technology because he would have spent his whole life people talking down to him like he was you know

00:52:09.840 not there at all and that's the thing that these kids are saying the first thing they say is i'm a

00:52:15.520 human i'm smart absolutely thank you for bringing that up because it's such an important piece of this um

00:52:25.840 when i met hayley and and you know and saw this telepathy i i really wanted to understand um

00:52:34.720 um you know her brain and and understand what was going on and so i wanted to understand how she

00:52:41.680 learned to communicate doing the the typing and so i i i took a workshop with a couple of different

00:52:52.240 people who teach that technique just so that i could see what are you what are you doing here

00:52:56.160 and and and and a light bulb went on for me when um this this woman who um uh is a speech therapist

00:53:05.280 um on faculty um at a university and um somewhere on the east coast i don't remember right now um

00:53:12.640 when she said that these these children the issue is really in their motors their sensory motor system

00:53:20.400 it's not in their ability to understand speech and i knew having trained as a neuropsychiatrist

00:53:28.720 that people can have a stroke in what's called brocus area which is in the left frontal lobe

00:53:34.720 and that affects your expression of speech which it also affects your expression of language in general

00:53:41.840 so also your ability to type is impaired as well and um and that there's another part of the brain called

00:53:49.440 wernicke's and that's the understanding of language and that's that's in more posterior part of the brain

00:53:58.480 and then there's this cable if you will yeah um that connects the two that is not fully formed until

00:54:06.560 we're seven years old where you know we're myelinating the brain and you know developing pathways

00:54:11.600 so anyway so it's that pathway that gets disrupted

00:54:19.600 in these autistic kids who regressed during develop the development so so and and and so

00:54:25.840 so they can't express the language but we're in a keys area the ability to understand language

00:54:34.320 is already formed when you're born so so it's so you so that that didn't get disrupted

00:54:41.200 it it's it's it's it's like you have the it's like having the um it's like having the app is installed

00:54:50.320 wow you know but you can't use it yet uh because you need some kind of cable that enables it to

00:54:57.360 link to something else and so so so it made sense to me that these children were just like these other

00:55:06.240 individuals who i knew who'd had strokes the problem is is because it happened so early in

00:55:11.680 their development they're not given the benefit of doubt the way we would somebody that oh we see

00:55:16.480 in the ct scan they've got you know they've got the stroke here and therefore um we'll put them in

00:55:21.920 occupational therapy well speech therapy we'll try to get their speech back and you presume

00:55:27.920 that they're still intact in these other ways but you still don't like we don't give these children

00:55:32.800 that benefit of doubt you know um my daughter had strokes at birth and um and you know they said

00:55:40.160 she would never walk or feed herself or anything else and she's fine she went to college and but she

00:55:45.120 has a very difficult time with incoming and outgoing speech that's that's where she was hit um and

00:55:54.160 i feel for these parents because honestly i feel like the worst parent in the world at times because

00:56:04.800 i don't know how to communicate i don't it it's so different and i don't honestly i have spent

00:56:16.400 35 years praying every day help me help me help me i don't know how to communicate

00:56:23.120 and all of these parents that i know that have autistic children they are so they don't they're

00:56:33.040 lost and they love their children they just don't know what to do how do you have any advice what what

00:56:41.520 do we do

00:56:45.440 well yeah i you know

00:56:47.360 i'm i am somebody who i'm not just a scientist i'm a clinician and my heart really you know has

00:56:58.000 been so touched by these families you know and looking at the challenges that they have and so

00:57:03.200 you know they're they're they're it's like on the one hand there's these amazing gifts and then yet at

00:57:07.920 the same time there are these um you know significant you know heart-wrenching challenges

00:57:13.760 that a lot of these children have yeah and and and so so i have a new you know i've just recently

00:57:21.360 started a new non-profit you know research institute because what i want to do is not only

00:57:27.040 continue to research their gifts i want to see how can we help them live to their fullest human

00:57:33.040 potential and it's weird when you say that isn't it i really believe that we can do that i really

00:57:39.680 do i mean there are certain things that um i want to investigate that i think could really really help

00:57:46.720 these children um when you and because the pain it goes both ways because the i have mothers who say

00:57:53.680 to me i want to know my child yeah it's not just the heartache of the child saying oh no i know i know

00:58:02.480 i know but when you say you know we want to help them live to their fullest i have to tell you i i did

00:58:09.120 a lot of work with special olympics um when i was younger and i walked away from that experience

00:58:17.120 saying they're not the ones with special needs i'm the one with special needs the way they connect

00:58:27.120 with love and the world and everything else i wish i was more like that so when when you say

00:58:35.120 you know i want them to live their fullest human experience

00:58:40.320 you know i'm a little afraid of that in a way because you don't want to

00:58:44.240 take you know i don't want i the worst thing we can do is teach our kids how to live like wheat

00:58:50.560 if they have this special gift to teach them how to live like us you know what i mean oh no that's

00:58:55.520 right and that yeah and and i am not saying at all that i want them to be like us right at all right

00:59:01.920 okay what i'm talking about is that a lot of them um have physical pain

00:59:08.160 yeah you know they're not that they're they you know and so they they have really bad days sometimes

00:59:15.920 because they're in so much pain that they will engage in self-destructive behaviors just to make

00:59:24.000 the pain go away yeah yeah yeah just to have a different pain to focus on yeah and um and so that's

00:59:30.480 what i mean i i i i know that they um so you know you have you can't lump them all together

00:59:38.160 no i know i know some children that you have some children that don't have physical pain

00:59:42.080 okay and and and and so what i'm talking about is that um they have medical issues you know underlying

00:59:51.360 medical issues that i really believe that we could address their medical issues and not take away their

00:59:58.080 gifts i i think that their gifts are um and and and i have you know i have reason to you know believe

01:00:06.400 that i mean it's not just it's not just theoretical i mean there are children who've gotten their medical

01:00:12.320 conditions you know under better control yeah and um and they and what they have is they have more

01:00:19.760 autonomy you know like for example this one boy um he had a fecal transplant because oftentimes the

01:00:28.240 problem is in the gut with the microbiome and he had a fecal transplant um that when one of his older

01:00:34.400 siblings is the donor and and now he can like he can go in the kitchen and cook himself something

01:00:40.960 that's huge that's huge you know be able to ride a bike you know it's huge you know and um and so that's

01:00:47.440 the kind of thing i'm talking about he's still telepathic with his mother um because a lot of

01:00:52.640 these children want to have they don't want to be like us right but they they still desire some of the

01:00:58.480 same things they want to get married they want to have children they want to get an education every

01:01:04.000 it's like we were saying at the beginning nobody wants to be an outcast you want to be like everybody

01:01:08.800 else to some degree final segment uh with the good doctor here in just a second first one of the things

01:01:15.440 that i have learned is that the simplest solutions are usually the best and when it comes to hearing

01:01:20.960 simplicity really matters um i have heard from friends who are so frustrated with hearing aids

01:01:27.680 the tiny little buttons that you hear or the apps on their phone and you're constantly i mean technology

01:01:32.800 just doesn't make sense sometimes finally somebody has fixed it it's called the atom x and it's from

01:01:38.800 audion this is the world's first over-the-counter touch screen hearing aid a real touch screen

01:01:44.880 built right into the case no fiddling no squinting just you know no little gadgets tap the screen

01:01:50.640 adjust and you're instantly hearing better the atom x it was designed by audiologists to understand real

01:01:56.320 people it's simple it's clear it's ready right out of the box no prescription no waiting no frustration

01:02:03.040 traditional hearing aids they cost thousands of dollars audion hearing aids start at 98 and they'll

01:02:10.160 give you the clarity you need for family dinners church tv whatever don't wait visit audionhearing.com

01:02:17.760 take control of your hearing today can you can you take us to the hill

01:02:26.320 sure

01:02:28.960 yeah yeah so so the hill is a concept that i first heard about when i was in atlanta um and i met

01:02:38.160 um houston um and he used this um in his early 20s you know this autistic boy that um you know very

01:02:47.680 telepathic with his mother katie and and they're they're in the telepathy tapes and um and they were

01:02:53.200 friends with libby who is a speech therapist who had an autistic son named john paul and john paul and houston

01:03:06.160 both said that they went to the hill and their mother said that they go into their room and they'll

01:03:14.560 you know they'll put like pillows over their head or whatever and and then they'll go and they'll talk

01:03:18.560 with all of these other non-speaking autistic kids on this hill and you know and it's a it's a not the way

01:03:26.080 it was described is it's this non-physical place so it's it's more um it's more in the um spiritual

01:03:35.760 realm it's in the spiritual realm yeah and they they say it's guarded by angels and that they go there

01:03:43.520 and they they're taught by the angels and they teach each other and um and that it's a lot of fun sounds

01:03:49.520 very blissful and um and peaceful and i thought when i first heard of it i thought oh well that's

01:03:57.680 really interesting but you know i just thought it because john paul and houston knew each other

01:04:02.720 you know i the fact that they were both talking about it didn't really mean that much to me but

01:04:07.120 then what happened was is that these other individuals in totally different parts of the

01:04:11.680 country started saying you know mentioned their kid going to the hill and so then it then it became

01:04:19.360 obvious that this is a thing and if you if you look at um spiritual traditions um the eastern spiritual

01:04:31.280 traditions they talk about a place that sounds just like the hill and it and it really is a spiritual

01:04:39.600 realm that you can that you can go to when you reach a certain um level of spiritual development yeah

01:04:51.760 and and so you know and and and so that's what i think you know it's like in a way i think that we all

01:04:58.880 come from the hill okay and what happens is is as we identify more and more with this identity

01:05:10.400 that you know as diane or glenn or whoever it identify with that we become more and more

01:05:16.880 disconnected from the source that we come from we become you know whether you want to say that we

01:05:22.560 become disconnected from god or we become disconnected from you know whatever you want

01:05:27.920 to call that we become disconnected from the divine and we we become more and more um

01:05:34.080 immersed in the minutiae of daily life and thinking about what i want what i you know right i think

01:05:42.320 what i this and it's this divisive sort of mentality and so i see it is that we're sort of we come from

01:05:50.400 the hill and we sort of descend down the hill and now what we what we need to do is we need to learn

01:05:56.400 how to climb the hill back up we need to learn how to and i think that these autistic kids it's almost

01:06:02.800 like there are sherpa guides to the hill it's um i've always i believe my faith teaches too that that

01:06:13.520 we're born forgetful but we know who we are you know um but

01:06:20.640 but but but our goal in life is to remember just remember and everything in life is crowding it out

01:06:32.880 and and and and and help you forget and you can get really lost but it it's it's it's i found the i

01:06:42.720 found your work to be extraordinarily spiritual don't know exactly how i feel about things on everything

01:06:49.280 but i found it to be extra it just all rang true to me did you get to a point to where you're like

01:06:57.760 this is i don't know how i know this but i know this to be true

01:07:02.640 oh 100 i mean there's um yeah there's a certain the way that everything just all fits together it

01:07:14.240 it it there's a confidence that i have that's that's a knowing i mean a lot of these things

01:07:19.520 it's not just a belief you know it's a knowing i and i i've been a truth seeker my whole life and

01:07:26.720 i i started out as you know um you know in the scientific paradigm and the deeper i got into science

01:07:36.320 the more and more spiritual i became because i i i i i just saw how exquisite

01:07:46.400 god has here is i don't understand how science doesn't understand that it god has got to be the

01:07:54.720 world's greatest scientist if god exists it's he is unbelievably precise what how do you miss that

01:08:03.840 they go hand in glove it it's it's tremendous hubris for us to think that we could ever design

01:08:10.960 anything like it that is better yeah you know we've designed things that are poor imitations up

01:08:19.360 and and and so one of the things that's so sad to me is that what i'm really so many of us who become

01:08:28.000 scientists we get attracted to science because of the basic sciences and and you know and that's

01:08:33.840 really studying you know the nature of reality okay and then what happens is is that we then when you go

01:08:39.920 and you get a job you have to apply that science and and usually you're not getting paid unless the

01:08:46.160 the application results in some product that's gonna make money for somebody right and so the people who

01:08:51.120 are who fell in love with chemistry are then having to be you know they're going to pharmaceutical

01:08:56.800 industry or you know people that fall in love with physics have to go into the defense industry or

01:09:01.920 you know we get channeled into these applications and the basic sciences are poorly funded just like the

01:09:13.600 just like the arts and and and i think that it's because of both of those trends in our educational

01:09:21.920 system that we have the world that we have today that that it you know if we if we brought back more

01:09:31.280 arts into the educational system then we would have a more balanced brain i think it's not just focused

01:09:38.720 on left hemisphere kinds of processing and and and similarly if we if we taught if we if we taught the beauty of

01:09:48.320 nature and what not we'd have more of an appreciation for the natural world i i have to tell you i i i agree

01:09:54.880 with you i think i agree with you um uh i think it is i mean science has hurt itself so horribly in the last

01:10:04.720 five years six years with the rigid it's this way don't even question science um it's the hubris that i

01:10:13.360 think hurts science it's science should be all about discovery and oh my gosh what if this is true

01:10:22.080 what else is possible you know we we we learn something about the brain and then that's absolutely

01:10:29.840 true and you're like no you know have you not learned anything from science it's only true until

01:10:35.280 it's not true until we learn the next step and then that doesn't make that not true it just means you're

01:10:41.600 on the road to truth science is always on the road to truth there is no destination

01:10:48.160 you know what i mean it's you're never you never arrive stop saying you've arrived at the truth

01:10:55.920 absolutely absolutely it's it's a process yes it's a it's a process and you're always you put a theory

01:11:03.760 out there as your best best approximation of the truth and then and then your job as a scientist is

01:11:09.280 actually to try to disprove it you know the null hypothesis and the scientific method is that you

01:11:14.320 say okay can i disprove this and and so a lot of science moves forward by saying well i can't

01:11:20.720 disprove that right so that's still that's still the operating theory well when you start getting

01:11:25.760 some of these exceptions that tell you that something's wrong with your theory it's no longer

01:11:30.320 science i know right exactly right and and it's it's more what like rubert sheldrake calls scientism

01:11:38.800 you know it's it's it's it's it's as dogmatic as some of the most dogmatic religions because it

01:11:44.880 because they become more more wedded to to that belief system than to what you know what really is the

01:11:56.720 the truth and i don't i i agree with you i don't understand how science doesn't understand they've

01:12:02.480 become they're no longer galileo they're the catholic church you know what i mean that locking

01:12:08.000 him up in the tower you know you can't say that well you you want the truth or you don't want the

01:12:14.320 truth i'm not going to change it but i mean it's weird how we always we always seem to lose the balance

01:12:21.040 of things and i think that's arts and science is what you were talking about yeah yeah we we really

01:12:27.520 need to have um we we need to be also stimulating curiosity and kids you know they i mean school is

01:12:37.120 not a pleasant experience for them and for for me i mean my father um i i you know i may have been i

01:12:45.520 you know it's hard for me to separate out you know what was like my natural nature versus how much of it

01:12:50.240 it was the influence of my father but i i i just know that i was always curious and um

01:12:59.520 and i still am i mean and and i when i went to medical school at johns hopkins one of the things

01:13:08.160 they said to us and johns hopkins was a very very unusual medical school i mean um they um very they

01:13:17.680 they wanted people who would be the ones who were going to be doing cutting edge stuff you know

01:13:23.600 that that's the reputation of johns hopkins and i remember being told very early on half of what

01:13:30.240 you're going to learn here by the time your career is over you'll find out it's incorrect

01:13:35.840 and it's your job to try to figure out which house right which house wrong that is great and i thought

01:13:40.960 that that that is not a message that is taught to most medical students um and it's one of the

01:13:48.400 reasons why a lot of people i stayed at johns hopkins for you know i was there for eight years and one of

01:13:53.520 the reasons why people um often times never leave is because you're you're in that kind of uh an environment

01:14:02.720 where um you're you're encouraged to um do something novel you know and and and usually people don't

01:14:13.680 you know like for me i i made a big reach you know um you know usually people will do something that's

01:14:19.520 novel that's not quite such a earth-shaking kind of you know paradigm shift but for me it was like i

01:14:28.640 i i didn't set out thinking i was going to change the paradigm like this right it just presented

01:14:33.920 itself to me and i couldn't walk away can i ask you a phrase that i read from emmanuel kant when i was

01:14:40.480 probably 30 that really opened my eyes and and i didn't understand it at the time i do now i think

01:14:46.240 the society has changed so much i do understand this now but i want to ask you the question i'm not

01:14:50.720 going to ask you for details i just emmanuel kant said there are many things that i believe that i

01:14:56.560 shall never say but i shall never say the things that i do not believe

01:15:02.960 are there things that you are you either believe but you're not ready to say or are there things that

01:15:09.840 you think you're on the cusp of going i think a massive change of my thinking is coming that uh

01:15:19.680 uh you haven't said yet well um there are things that i haven't said yet publicly only because i'm

01:15:36.560 reserving them for when my book comes okay good may i have you on the show then when you

01:15:42.400 and your book comes back out i would love to talk to you then um are there things that maybe you can't

01:15:50.000 put your finger on yet um but you you have a feeling they're they're coming that that will be discovered

01:16:00.800 or what's what's the next big thing that you think you might see in your lifetime coming from all of this

01:16:11.120 oh wow um that's a big question i know um you know it's it's

01:16:22.960 what i'm what i'm doing right now is i dream at night in ways that inform my theory i mean i'm

01:16:33.600 that deeply steeped in trying to understand how it all works

01:16:40.800 and so i'm and i get this information in my dreams that are it's like eureka moments you know and

01:16:50.800 and um so i'm in a constant i've been in kind of a constant state of discovery like that are you are you

01:16:58.400 and so i it's like it's like i'm right i feel like i'm i'm i'm like a fountain in that sense um

01:17:05.680 and um so um i know this stuff is coming i mean i know more stuff will come you know that's part of

01:17:12.240 what keeps life so exciting and but it's it's it's when when we're in dreaming sleep that's when it's that

01:17:19.520 right hemisphere dominant and and and so the kind of processing that it's doing is um it's it's it's

01:17:28.880 very very profound and so when i wake up you know i'll either already have an insight or i'll analyze

01:17:34.400 my dream and go oh my god yeah that's what this means and um and then i'll look things up and i'll

01:17:41.120 find i'll find concordance in the literature you know i'll because i'm a multi-discipline

01:17:45.920 um you know a scientist i you know i'm i'm weaving together all of these different branches

01:17:53.360 of science that i had to study in order to become a medical doctor you know whether you're talking

01:17:57.920 about biology or physiology or anatomy or biochemistry or biophysics or you know i'm bringing together all

01:18:06.400 of those things and i'm also bringing together what i know from being a parapsychologist who studies

01:18:14.320 the fringe stuff that people report that they're you know yeah yeah they've either witnessed or

01:18:19.520 capable of doing and then i'm marrying that also with what do we know about what ancient wisdom

01:18:27.200 traditions and scriptures felt was so important for us to know that they that they put the time and

01:18:36.320 effort that it took back then to encode it you know whether it's engraved on stones or painted with

01:18:43.040 their own blood in a cave or um you know carefully you know recorded as scrolls that were you know

01:18:51.440 placed in you know somewhere where you know they could be safe from the elements it's like so so i'm

01:18:59.360 i'm i'm so i'm i'm integrating all of these different streams and and seeing how they all are sort of

01:19:07.360 informing one another and and it's really really a um i just i feel i feel privileged to be in in in

01:19:16.480 in the position you know to be able to do this you know and and i i think in this way this is one of

01:19:23.600 the most exciting times to be alive because it's so much easier to get information now than when i first

01:19:29.440 started out as a scientist i mean my gosh you know you know it was before computers yeah have you ever

01:19:36.320 read worlds in collision by uh velikovsky scientist from uh einstein's era he was wildly wrong about

01:19:44.240 many things but his theory reminds me of you he said instead of science just rejecting everything

01:19:50.800 why don't we look for the myths and the religious traditions all around the world and see if they're

01:19:58.400 saying the same things at the same time that would then tell us maybe not how they interpreted it but

01:20:07.280 would tell us something that oh this was probably happening in the in the world at this time this

01:20:13.120 was happening in the skies at this time etc etc it's fascinating i just i thought he was very brave for

01:20:18.720 thinking out of the box um uh i want to uh uh

01:20:28.400 i want to invite you to come back when you're when your book is out i think you're

01:20:33.680 a remarkable person and i i i'm i'd like to know before i let you go we spoke at the beginning that

01:20:46.720 there's times when we invented the airplane three separate continents people didn't know but you pierced

01:20:53.920 into that have you found the people who are maybe going in the same exact direction as you are uh and

01:21:03.760 are having these kinds of insights around the world is there anybody that you know of that has pierced this

01:21:13.920 universal mind if you will

01:21:15.280 um what i would say is that there are people who have contact there have been a couple of people

01:21:27.360 who've contacted me or who've attended some of the lectures that i've been giving um and they're they're

01:21:34.560 they're they're literally shaking like this they're so excited because i came to insights that they came to

01:21:45.280 and and and and and and they um you know when you find out that that's that's more confluence you

01:21:54.000 know but when you find out that you're not the only one who's like seeing how these dots all connect

01:21:58.800 together someone else is actually you know it's connecting the same dots but they're not they're not as

01:22:07.520 public of a figure as i am um and they're they're thrilled that that someone is doing this work and

01:22:14.960 so so i yeah that that is happening and so i think that there's something in the you know you know

01:22:20.400 whatever you you know in the ether in the water or whatever whatever whatever there's something

01:22:26.880 happening here that that that there's that it's like there's a pressure for the paradigm to shift

01:22:32.160 and and and it's coming in a space that's being created for that to happen so there's there's both

01:22:38.800 the pressure for it and the space that's allowing it and um so we're we're we're really at a really

01:22:47.200 exciting time um i think i'm i'm a big fan i can't thank you enough for coming on i know this has been

01:22:54.800 like pulling teeth my schedule your schedule has been like pulling teeth to get this interview but i'd love

01:22:59.040 to have you back on again when your book comes out very special work and and i thank you for sharing

01:23:04.160 it oh you're very welcome thank you i've really enjoyed it just a reminder i'd love you to rate

01:23:15.520 and subscribe to the podcast and pass this on to a friend so it can be discovered by other people

01:23:29.040 so

The Glenn Beck Program - November 08, 2025

Ep 273 ｜ Autistic Kids Can READ MINDS？ ‘Telepathy Tapes’ Doctor Reveals All ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

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