The Glenn Beck Program - Ep 63 ｜ Tales from 20 Years of Being Glenn’s 'Work Wife' ｜ Stu Burguiere

00:00:00.000 Most resolutions don't last at the beginning of every year because it's so hard and I'm trying to change me and I got enough and we'll do cannon supply company wants you to consider lower your expectations.

00:00:12.840 I love this because no, nobody ever says this. It's true. Just take it out a notch. I mean, relax. Okay. You got a long time to live. I mean, unless you're a really old man, then maybe you should work a little harder. But right now they're going to send you a moderate self-improvement box.

00:00:27.520 It's not a 10 step program. It's a one step program to achieve a slightly better version of yourself. It's packed with over 80 bucks of premium American made grooming goods designed to help you feel, look and smell just a little better in 2020.

00:00:43.160 And here's what you get. Some of the products you get the trench warfare, dry ice body powder, which uses activated charcoal to deodorize. You get bloody knuckles hand repair bomb. It's unscented. So you don't smell like flowers.

00:00:56.340 News anchor two in one hair wash and their working man's face wash made with vitamin C. So you can fight scurvy, I think, and fatigue.

00:01:06.720 And my favorite as an alcoholic, their bourbon solid cologne. It's inspired by the Buffalo Trace distillery and anything that smells like bourbon.

00:01:15.160 I'm in limited time. Moderate self-improvement box. 84 buck value.

00:01:19.540 It's $50 now with free shipping to the lower 48. Not available, apparently, in Alaska and Hawaii. Sorry.

00:01:26.240 You're going to have to send the dogs out to drag a box up from Canada.

00:01:29.420 All products are tested by active duty military and 5% of net profits are donated to veteran and active duty military causes.

00:01:38.960 Duke Cannon. They pride themselves in making its grooming goods work as hard as you do.

00:01:43.980 And they're the champion of builders and farmers and everybody. It's America.

00:01:48.800 Feel welcome and right at home in Duke Cannon country.

00:01:52.780 New year, slightly better you. Visit DukeCannon.com right now.

00:01:55.760 Use the promo code BECK. You get 15% off your entire order.

00:01:58.980 That's DukeCannon.com.

00:02:00.500 Welcome to the podcast. Really excited about today's guest.

00:02:25.860 This is a guy who everybody knows. Humble beginnings. As a young boy, he lived through devastating hardship.

00:02:33.320 His father would beat him. Years later, he would say, every time I got hit, every time someone said, you can't do this.

00:02:39.740 I said, this is not going to be for much longer because I'm going to move out of here.

00:02:44.460 I'm going to be rich. I'm going to be somebody. And he is.

00:02:47.880 His father fought in the Battle of Stalingrad as a member of the Nazi Party.

00:02:53.480 In fact, that would trouble my guest deeply.

00:02:55.880 Growing up, he lived in the shadow of that and his brother, who was his father's favorite,

00:03:00.940 who tragically died in a car accident while under the influence. Died instantly.

00:03:05.680 These are the experiences that would shape him and lead him down a path of tremendous accomplishments and honors,

00:03:12.420 the first of which was his career as a professional bodybuilder.

00:03:16.200 Correction. He was the bodybuilder. At 20 years old, he won the title of Mr. Universe.

00:03:23.180 He then went on to win Mr. Olympia seven times.

00:03:27.100 Now, that is astonishing accomplishment in and of itself.

00:03:30.260 But my guest today, that was only the beginning of his career.

00:03:34.920 He followed his dreams, became a Hollywood actor, became a star, an icon, starring in such blockbusters as Terminator, Predator, Total Recall,

00:03:43.620 even eked out a career in comedy movies, Kindergarten Cop, True Lies, and he literally played Conan the Barbarian.

00:03:51.800 Alongside with Bruce Willis, Demi Moore, Sylvester Stallone, he founded Planet Hollywood,

00:03:57.300 to which this day, to this day, the locations at the Forum in Las Vegas, as well as Times Square,

00:04:03.460 and both Disney World and Disneyland, Paris, are some of the most popular spots.

00:04:07.520 Then, he took a little break from acting, followed the path of Ronald Reagan, he became the governor of California.

00:04:12.920 Do I need to go on?

00:04:14.140 This is, well, actually not my guest today, but because my guest today is normally the person that writes all that crap I just said,

00:04:22.080 I just ripped that off from a website of Arnold Schwarzenegger because I didn't have a writer.

00:04:27.020 Because the guy that I do have has been my dear friend and co-host and all-around amazing guy who's just gotten his own show.

00:04:36.620 My head writer, executive producer, Steve Bregeer, otherwise known as Stu.

00:04:56.380 So...

00:04:57.020 Mr. Stu Bregeer, which is not even your real name.

00:05:01.960 It is not.

00:05:02.400 We'll get into that in a minute.

00:05:04.100 I'm looking at your resume here.

00:05:07.540 You worked in a promotions department in 1997 for a radio station.

00:05:13.140 What'd you do there?

00:05:14.680 Largely blew up balloons.

00:05:15.920 Blew up balloons.

00:05:17.280 Then, you were promoted to an intern.

00:05:20.300 So, my first job was below the internship.

00:05:22.220 Below the internship, yes.

00:05:23.860 Then, you moved on as a producer for three different talk shows, all hosted by the same guy.

00:05:32.320 Mm-hmm.

00:05:32.980 Mm-hmm.

00:05:33.400 Then, you did a show in 1999, Finny and Stu.

00:05:39.040 Mm-hmm.

00:05:39.380 Mm-hmm.

00:05:40.280 That was over by 2000.

00:05:43.420 Yeah.

00:05:43.820 He tried to get me out of there as fast as possible.

00:05:45.480 Right.

00:05:45.760 Then, you went to the Glenn Beck program, where you were the co-host, EP, executive producer.

00:05:54.640 You've done the fourth hour.

00:05:56.760 Mm-hmm.

00:05:56.940 Uh, you, uh, then was the host in the EP of, uh, Pat and Stu.

00:06:02.980 Mm-hmm.

00:06:03.440 Then, The Wonderful World of Stu.

00:06:05.400 And now, Stu Does America.

00:06:08.480 Yes.

00:06:09.260 As I'm looking at your resume, I realize you're wildly underqualified for any job.

00:06:17.000 Yes.

00:06:17.440 Mm-hmm.

00:06:17.620 And it doesn't seem you can hold a job.

00:06:20.640 I can't hold a job, and I can never work outside of this building.

00:06:24.480 Uh, like, I...

00:06:25.540 I get that impression.

00:06:26.580 Yes.

00:06:27.040 Yes.

00:06:27.320 No, that's fair.

00:06:28.260 Mm-hmm.

00:06:28.560 Um, now, I was a relatively decent server at Chili's for a time.

00:06:33.020 I scheduled some furniture deliveries.

00:06:35.180 Right.

00:06:35.480 Did some spot welding assistant work.

00:06:37.560 Um, but other than that, I really have no other qualifications in life.

00:06:40.560 How old were you when we met?

00:06:43.620 I was, let's see, 20?

00:06:46.880 20 years old.

00:06:47.840 Yeah.

00:06:48.500 And, um...

00:06:50.640 What was your impression of me?

00:06:53.020 Because you got to me at the end of my radio career, or my, you know, top 40 radio career,

00:07:00.200 where I wasn't...

00:07:04.100 I did not care about anything.

00:07:08.160 No, you did not.

00:07:09.340 Right.

00:07:09.540 Um, it's interesting because, you know, you as a national radio personality...

00:07:14.780 Mm-hmm.

00:07:15.020 Um, because you had a really successful run at one point in your career.

00:07:18.460 Mm-hmm.

00:07:18.960 Um, but I only knew you...

00:07:20.760 I mean, I grew up in Connecticut, so I knew you from your morning show at KC 101, which

00:07:25.040 is, you know, music station, the big station in my hometown, basically.

00:07:28.580 Mm-hmm.

00:07:28.760 And I knew, uh, you know, Glenn and Pat in the morning.

00:07:31.040 Mm-hmm.

00:07:31.260 It was the big show.

00:07:32.840 Um, I didn't know that, I mean, later on after Pat left, um, you know, while the show

00:07:38.620 was, I thought, still very funny, you did not care all that much.

00:07:41.820 Uh, and this was like, this was, and this is an important lesson, I think, for people

00:07:46.640 coming up, not only in broadcasting, but any industry, is find someone who's very talented,

00:07:52.460 but at the very valley of their career, like the worst possible time, um, because those

00:07:59.020 people usually have good lessons, are talented, um, but also you can kind of glom onto them

00:08:04.520 when they're at their lowest, and then you can convince them you were part of their success

00:08:08.620 later on.

00:08:09.320 So did you, I mean, because my recollection is, we first really met at a car dealership.

00:08:18.520 That's true.

00:08:18.960 I was, I was working in the promotions department.

00:08:21.020 You were blowing up balloons.

00:08:21.800 I blew up the balloons for a gig you did at a Toyota dealership.

00:08:24.980 Um, the attendance of that Toyota dealership, uh, gig was exactly zero.

00:08:28.900 Zero.

00:08:29.440 Uh, no one came.

00:08:30.260 No one.

00:08:30.700 Uh, no one.

00:08:31.240 So it was...

00:08:31.520 It was like three hours long.

00:08:32.640 Oh yeah.

00:08:32.980 And think of how awkward that is.

00:08:34.300 Yeah.

00:08:34.520 It's three hours.

00:08:35.420 Not a single...

00:08:36.400 I think we might've even had hot dogs we were giving away.

00:08:39.860 I think we were.

00:08:40.200 Yeah.

00:08:40.580 Not a sale.

00:08:40.980 I had to lay out a prize table.

00:08:42.540 Yeah.

00:08:43.280 Stickers, CDs, like all t-shirts.

00:08:46.360 No one came to collect them.

00:08:48.460 I don't think in my career, I don't think it had ever happened where we net, we didn't

00:08:53.840 get one person.

00:08:55.600 Yes.

00:08:56.020 Except for that time.

00:08:57.640 And I don't know what that says about me.

00:08:58.920 Probably something bad.

00:08:59.360 Well, I don't know if I was promoting and meet Stu.

00:09:01.820 No, definitely not.

00:09:02.600 You know, meet Stu the promotions monkey.

00:09:04.640 No.

00:09:04.980 I mean...

00:09:05.320 That was not part of the...

00:09:06.400 Right, right, right.

00:09:07.660 But you know, you were...

00:09:08.600 It was a...

00:09:09.320 It was, if I remember right, a rainy afternoon on the weekend.

00:09:11.820 I remember.

00:09:12.260 And it's like, who's going to come out?

00:09:13.520 And you know, it just wasn't one of those well-attended gigs.

00:09:16.620 So we were...

00:09:18.240 You know, when you're really bored, you'll show interest in people.

00:09:22.180 And you were incredibly bored.

00:09:24.260 And it's also awkward, right?

00:09:25.620 Like, this dealership is paying you a lot of money to do these ads.

00:09:30.280 And your ads were very successful.

00:09:31.540 But this particular appearance was not good.

00:09:34.000 It was not.

00:09:34.640 Not good.

00:09:35.180 Not good.

00:09:35.400 So, you know, it's awkward.

00:09:37.280 We're sitting around talking about radio.

00:09:39.860 And you kind of did the thing where you're like, well, what do you want to do?

00:09:42.240 Like, where do you see yourself?

00:09:43.300 What is this here for you?

00:09:44.320 Now, this is not something I don't think you were truly interested in at this point.

00:09:47.360 It was more of a...

00:09:47.860 Actually, I think it wasn't at the beginning.

00:09:50.340 Yeah.

00:09:50.920 But a few sentences into your answer, I was, because I could tell you were smart.

00:09:56.200 Well, I mean, not a lot of 20-year-olds, particularly at this moment, wanted to do talk radio.

00:10:02.800 And I did.

00:10:03.560 I loved talk radio since I was a kid.

00:10:05.160 I mean, it started with really sports radio.

00:10:07.320 And I listened to all sorts of New York sports radio.

00:10:10.800 And then later on, listened to WIOD in Miami, which is like...

00:10:15.600 Bill Hendry.

00:10:15.860 Bill Hendry and Neil Rogers.

00:10:17.980 It was a legendary radio station.

00:10:19.540 And I kind of grew to really loving, you know, talking about issues, but in a way that was

00:10:24.920 funny and entertaining.

00:10:26.440 And, you know, my belief was...

00:10:28.580 And Imus as well.

00:10:29.340 I would say Imus was definitely part of this, because he was on the station I listened to

00:10:32.260 all the time.

00:10:32.940 And they were able to make those, you know, boring healthcare policy conversations interesting,

00:10:39.940 right?

00:10:40.180 You actually wanted to listen to them.

00:10:41.440 It was funny.

00:10:42.020 And that was something I thought was totally missing, particularly from the conservative

00:10:47.520 side.

00:10:48.140 You know, I mean, there just wasn't a lot of it.

00:10:50.280 And you, you know, I had no idea, had any interest in this at all.

00:10:55.400 You know, we're thinking in your head, you know, this is time for me to get out of the

00:10:59.120 Britney Spears intro world.

00:11:00.840 And get some other super, super classic from her is legitimately how you used to say it

00:11:06.740 on the air and get into something like that.

00:11:09.140 And, you know, you already had that at the entertainment part of it, which you were kind

00:11:12.260 of well known for, but you hadn't really gone down those roads.

00:11:14.900 And, you know, usually when interns come to a station like Casey one on one, what they

00:11:20.200 want is either to get on the air and talk up music or just get a bunch of free concert

00:11:24.240 tickets and, you know, uh, you know, you know, hook up with radio groupies, uh, not really

00:11:29.700 my interest level and no one would ever, you know, be interested in me for those reasons.

00:11:33.960 So, I mean, we kind of had a, we were both kind of on that same direction.

00:11:38.520 So I don't think I've ever asked you this when you left where, because I was literally

00:11:44.380 on the air going, Oh, there's another super, super classic from her.

00:11:47.780 Yeah.

00:11:48.200 And I didn't care about the music.

00:11:50.380 I didn't, I just did whatever I want.

00:11:52.720 And I think at that time, because I had just sobered up, you never knew me drinking.

00:11:58.680 No.

00:11:59.340 I just sobered up.

00:12:00.860 And, uh, and I think probably most people in the building thought I might be insane

00:12:08.020 or just like, just didn't care so much.

00:12:13.460 I would just, just blow myself up.

00:12:16.660 Uh, yeah.

00:12:17.740 I mean, I think that it's not, I mean, I have no.

00:12:20.360 I think people saw you, saw you as a, um, around the building, I would say people saw

00:12:26.880 you as a, a big personality.

00:12:29.540 Um, but also a guy who was not always easy to get along with.

00:12:35.200 Um, because you had, you wanted to do things a certain way.

00:12:38.360 You were used to a big market.

00:12:40.220 We were in a smaller market.

00:12:41.460 You were used to these, like, you know, the things to be done right in this big way.

00:12:45.340 And like, you know, at that time, like we're in an era of consolidation where people are

00:12:49.220 losing jobs and departments are shrinking.

00:12:51.540 And the fact that I even got balloons.

00:12:53.460 I mean, anyone working in radio today, you like, you had balloons.

00:12:56.640 Oh my God.

00:12:57.800 Like that would be huge.

00:12:59.180 Um, running the station at that time.

00:13:00.900 No, you had run the station mostly into the ground for, uh, for many years.

00:13:04.640 Although when you ran the station, I loved it.

00:13:06.520 Um, it was, you turned it, you basically turned the big pop station in town into an alternative

00:13:10.300 music station for like a year.

00:13:12.040 I was one of the only pop people that played Pearl Jam and Stone Temple Pilots and all

00:13:17.720 that stuff.

00:13:18.120 Yeah.

00:13:18.420 And it was, it was a cool, you know, I was never a big pop guy.

00:13:20.960 It was a cool station though, when you were running it.

00:13:22.580 Although we still played Britney Spears, just a little less.

00:13:25.840 Yeah.

00:13:26.260 Maybe, yeah, maybe a lot less.

00:13:27.700 Um, uh, so, you know, like there was always that thing.

00:13:30.560 I think, you know, I, it was weird for me though, coming into it because, because you

00:13:34.480 had been there for a long time and, you know, for people who don't know, you had this

00:13:37.680 big, you know, morning show career.

00:13:39.140 You went, you went to Connecticut in like the middle of a big recession, kind of settled

00:13:43.100 down here or there in Connecticut.

00:13:45.740 And, um, we're at a stage in your career where you're kind of done with it.

00:13:49.880 Um, where I think you had like, you know, there's a lot of stuff that had gone on over

00:13:54.200 the years that I wasn't there for.

00:13:55.480 And you were always very nice to me.

00:13:56.860 I mean, you know, I like to make fun of you and all the time.

00:13:59.940 No, you didn't at that point.

00:14:01.220 At that point I didn't.

00:14:01.860 You didn't even say, cause your real name is not Stu.

00:14:04.920 No.

00:14:05.400 Your wife calls you Stu.

00:14:07.440 Yes.

00:14:07.780 Pretty much everybody in my life now without, with the exception of like my mom, my mom.

00:14:11.220 Yeah.

00:14:11.400 Your mom does not.

00:14:12.280 She gets kind of upset.

00:14:14.280 A little.

00:14:14.920 Yeah.

00:14:15.140 I mean, a little upset.

00:14:16.000 I mean, you know, you know, she didn't name me.

00:14:18.360 Yeah.

00:14:18.700 And also my dad's name was Steve, which is my name.

00:14:21.880 Um, so, you know, I, I do.

00:14:23.780 Would have been nice.

00:14:24.600 It would have been nice.

00:14:25.180 It was a nice piece of tribute.

00:14:26.620 So you stole it.

00:14:27.340 I know.

00:14:27.840 I didn't steal it.

00:14:29.860 Um, the way I remember it is different the way you remember it.

00:14:34.220 So you tell me how it actually happened.

00:14:37.460 Well, uh, I was working in promotions, hanging some balloons.

00:14:40.780 I was at a bar gig, um, in a new Haven Connecticut.

00:14:44.340 Yeah.

00:14:44.600 And you and Vinnie Penn, who's a great guy and he's on one of our affiliates now.

00:14:48.820 He, um, you guys went to, I believe it was a Bon Jovi concert and he was a huge Bon Jovi

00:14:53.400 fan.

00:14:53.560 I don't know if he still is, but like massive, like, you know, the biggest there is.

00:14:57.660 Yeah.

00:14:57.820 And he went to just found a picture of me at that with the long hair.

00:15:02.140 Really?

00:15:02.640 I have long hair.

00:15:03.460 Just.

00:15:04.220 Yeah.

00:15:04.500 It's.

00:15:04.780 I do remember me and I do remember the look.

00:15:06.840 I don't know if I remember the exact picture, but the look is seared into my brain, unfortunately.

00:15:10.420 Um, but, uh, you had gone there and you were not drinking, uh, but he was, he did enough

00:15:16.400 for both of you.

00:15:17.100 Yeah.

00:15:17.460 Um, and, uh, he kind of showed up at the, uh, bar gig after this kind of meet and greet

00:15:22.460 with Bon Jovi where he was really excited and everything else.

00:15:25.320 So he comes and meets me.

00:15:26.540 It's like one of my first days on the job.

00:15:28.100 And he says, you know, he's relatively friendly and he comes over and say, Hey, what's your name?

00:15:32.000 And I say, Steve.

00:15:32.800 And, and then he, you know, we have a short conversation.

00:15:35.620 He moves away later on in the night.

00:15:37.280 We kind of realized what he heard was not Steve, but he just sort of assumed the rest

00:15:43.400 of the name, which is not something you do as a human being in conversation, but thought

00:15:47.280 he heard Stu.

00:15:48.440 And so he just kind of filled in Stu, called me Stu once or twice.

00:15:52.440 I corrected him.

00:15:53.660 He had a laugh.

00:15:54.260 And then he just kept calling me Stu because he thought it was funny.

00:15:56.420 This is, you know, this is the world, right?

00:15:58.160 Yeah.

00:15:58.560 Uh, that we're living in.

00:15:59.220 We're mourning radio.

00:16:00.180 Well, you on the other hand are Mr. Oblivious.

00:16:03.100 Like at this point, that was my, why, and why is that not my nickname anymore?

00:16:07.720 That was my nickname at the time.

00:16:09.640 Yeah.

00:16:09.880 Oblivio.

00:16:11.560 I was like oblivio.

00:16:14.760 And my superpower was to be oblivious to everything, everything, all social cues, um, all personal

00:16:20.260 things from, and that's kind of where you were at that point.

00:16:23.540 I think that was just a factor of you not caring.

00:16:25.580 Like over time, this changed in a big way where you started to care so much, it was

00:16:30.400 annoying.

00:16:31.200 Um, but back then it was, you just, you know, you, you, you, you heard Stu and I think you

00:16:35.820 just filled, you never thought really to follow up on it.

00:16:39.200 Well, if somebody is introduced to Stu and somebody is calling them Stu, you're not going

00:16:42.900 to, and you're not correcting me for months.

00:16:47.160 For months.

00:16:48.000 Yes.

00:16:48.560 Months.

00:16:49.120 I'm calling you Stu for months.

00:16:53.040 To put it in perspective.

00:16:54.260 Okay.

00:16:55.040 You're the big morning show host in, in town, in my hometown.

00:16:58.340 I grew up listening to you.

00:16:59.560 Did it ever become uncomfortable to where you were like, I'm now trapped?

00:17:06.000 Well, there came a point in which, you know, you try to just kind of brush it off and you

00:17:12.060 laugh it off.

00:17:12.620 And I can tell like Vinny is joking about it still.

00:17:16.260 He knows what my name is.

00:17:17.340 Right.

00:17:17.540 So I kind of, at times think maybe you're also just in on the joke and are just joking

00:17:21.840 about it and it's part of the show.

00:17:23.120 And honestly, like when you're a 20 year old trying to get into radio, like you'll

00:17:27.100 let them light you on fire to get on the air.

00:17:29.160 Right.

00:17:29.340 They're going to say your name.

00:17:30.480 Like they're going to, you know, whatever.

00:17:31.580 They're going to shoot beanbags into your chest.

00:17:33.460 Fine.

00:17:33.840 Whatever.

00:17:34.100 And so I can't, you just go along with it.

00:17:36.480 Right.

00:17:36.740 Right.

00:17:36.860 To kind of, to move up the ladder or at least have some.

00:17:40.280 And did we ever shoot beanbags at you?

00:17:43.020 I mean, I've known, I've.

00:17:44.480 No, but I mean, I don't want to put any ideas.

00:17:46.740 I don't want to put any ideas.

00:17:47.080 I don't want to put any ideas.

00:17:47.460 Yeah.

00:17:48.020 To nudist colonies.

00:17:49.500 I didn't, I put you on a billboard to.

00:17:52.240 No, I never was on a billboard.

00:17:53.980 Never on a billboard.

00:17:54.620 No, no.

00:17:55.120 Never taped you to a billboard, to a side of a van.

00:17:58.720 That wasn't you.

00:17:59.540 That wasn't me.

00:18:00.320 Okay.

00:18:00.580 There's someone who.

00:18:01.900 There's somebody right now.

00:18:03.120 Some family is suffering.

00:18:04.000 It was me.

00:18:04.860 It was me.

00:18:06.300 But yeah, no, I mean, like you had just not, you just weren't into it.

00:18:10.360 It was one time on the air when you talk about getting trapped.

00:18:12.580 It was when we were on the air together.

00:18:15.540 And you said you, you made one of your hilarious jokes at the time.

00:18:18.680 And to give you a sense of how engaged that you were, I believe someone called me Stu.

00:18:24.720 And you said, what kind of name is Stu?

00:18:26.640 What did your mom come home and have Stu and decide to just name you after the meal?

00:18:30.800 I don't remember that.

00:18:31.660 That's not a joke.

00:18:32.500 And it was like, that's not something like that, but not that joke.

00:18:35.440 It was pretty much that joke.

00:18:36.740 No, it was not that joke.

00:18:37.680 And I was like, you do know my name isn't Stu, right?

00:18:39.880 Like, cause you made it in a way of like, he really thinks this is a good observation.

00:18:43.220 Like there's a really funny story with how I became named Stu.

00:18:46.500 And it's like, well, I'm not named Stu.

00:18:48.080 You do know that.

00:18:48.940 Right.

00:18:49.880 And of course you didn't.

00:18:51.460 And you didn't say it that way.

00:18:53.040 You did not say you do know that because you hadn't said it to me that I was calling you

00:18:59.140 you're the wrong name for, I believe, four to six months.

00:19:04.200 You were Stu.

00:19:05.880 Everyone still in your life calls you Stu.

00:19:09.120 And thank you for that, by the way.

00:19:09.960 You're welcome.

00:19:10.340 Because really, you're the main problem there.

00:19:11.900 It's not my fault.

00:19:12.500 It's your fault.

00:19:13.520 No, it's not.

00:19:13.980 It is your fault.

00:19:14.480 It's not my name.

00:19:15.600 You should have corrected me.

00:19:16.380 You disgraced the memory of my father.

00:19:18.660 Really?

00:19:19.180 Yes.

00:19:19.520 Is that where you're going?

00:19:20.180 That's where I'm going.

00:19:20.820 Okay.

00:19:21.140 Uh, so, so then Steve, as if that's your real name, uh, when you, what iteration of

00:19:34.360 a talk show were you involved in?

00:19:37.280 Were you there at the beginning when I was?

00:19:39.200 Yeah.

00:19:39.440 Cause at the very beginning, I, um, I, I always wanted to do talk.

00:19:42.660 Um, and you talked about doing it and you had like your role at the station.

00:19:48.160 You had still had a lot of power.

00:19:50.080 I would say at the station, you were able to do things.

00:19:52.160 Um, and so you wanted to go and do a talk show and they were like, thrilled.

00:19:56.080 Here's the big morning guy.

00:19:56.960 And you could have come over to WELI, which is the sister station and do a talk show.

00:20:00.540 So you started out, we started out with the, the Glenn Beck program.

00:20:03.900 I think it was called them, just your name.

00:20:05.620 Um, which was somewhat similar to what we wound up doing.

00:20:08.780 Like that one was really your personality around news stories.

00:20:12.380 Um, and you're known now kind of as a guy who has to change the set every two to three

00:20:18.700 weeks, um, because you're bored of it.

00:20:20.720 Back then it was changing the entire format of the show every two to three weeks cause you

00:20:24.440 were bored of it.

00:20:25.040 So we did that show for a little while.

00:20:27.480 Then we went on to, um, something called the impeachment of character.

00:20:31.140 That wasn't a show change.

00:20:32.780 That was, that was a show change.

00:20:34.500 No, it was not a show.

00:20:35.740 It was a show change.

00:20:36.820 No, it was, it was the Glenn Beck program and it was the impeachment of character cause

00:20:41.660 I was doing dramatic readings of the testimony.

00:20:46.160 Yes.

00:20:46.500 Which was hilarious.

00:20:47.680 Hilarious.

00:20:48.200 Probably should have been a segment on a show.

00:20:50.000 However, it was a separate show.

00:20:51.480 It was a completely different iteration.

00:20:52.960 Same time, same station.

00:20:54.320 It was shorter though.

00:20:55.100 I believe it was like the first one was like a couple hours and it was like an hour.

00:20:58.640 You were changing the stuff up all the time.

00:20:59.980 We, we, I think it was two hours.

00:21:01.760 Then it was like 90 minutes.

00:21:03.440 And then the last show was like 45.

00:21:06.000 Right.

00:21:06.260 And that was called the journey.

00:21:07.980 Yeah.

00:21:08.300 If you remember the journey, which was the softer side of Glenn Beck, the whole show

00:21:12.000 was sort of inspirational stories from Glenn Beck.

00:21:15.000 Um, and I, you know, it was a, which one was your favorite?

00:21:18.640 Well, what we wound up doing is taking all of those and kind of jamming into one thing

00:21:21.620 and be like, Hey, put us national.

00:21:23.060 Uh, and that wound up actually working because that's, I think one of the things that, that

00:21:26.300 has been good about the show over the years and different from other shows.

00:21:29.980 And other hosts where you kind of do a little bit of everything.

00:21:32.220 So it was 19 when 97, 98, 98, when we first started together, first started.

00:21:37.360 And do you remember what I said to you and, and what you said back to me when we went into

00:21:43.580 our first break, 20 minutes into talk radio for the very first time?

00:21:47.940 I do remember this.

00:21:49.500 Um, and you said, uh, that we, you got out and you were very excited about the first

00:21:55.900 break, which was very good.

00:21:56.840 And I was happy.

00:21:57.640 We just got through it.

00:21:58.340 Like we didn't know what the heck we were doing basically.

00:22:00.240 And you said, we're going to replace Dr. Laura.

00:22:03.440 Now, Dr. Laura at the time is the number two, probably biggest syndicated host, uh, in

00:22:08.580 America just behind rush.

00:22:10.020 And we've done about 12 minutes, 12 minutes and 12 minutes.

00:22:13.440 It was a good 12.

00:22:13.940 It was a good 12 minutes.

00:22:15.060 And if you project that, it's like Al Gore.

00:22:16.660 If you project the temperature rise forever, it was a hockey stick.

00:22:19.600 It was a hockey stick.

00:22:20.220 It was a hockey stick.

00:22:20.980 It was like nothing.

00:22:21.900 And then straight up for 12 minutes.

00:22:24.100 Now, this is where our memory of this, uh, this situation diverges a little bit because

00:22:28.320 your recollection of this, which you've told on the air, my embarrassment many, many times

00:22:32.520 is that I looked at you as if you were crazy.

00:22:35.740 Um, and, uh, and I basically doubted that you could ever do such a thing.

00:22:41.600 No, no, no.

00:22:41.980 You, what my memory is, is that you did look at me like a little crazy, like we've had 12

00:22:48.500 minutes on the air.

00:22:49.340 Yes.

00:22:49.580 And your goal as the producer was to get me to finish the show.

00:22:54.820 Yes, it was.

00:22:55.720 I wasn't really looking for the long-term projections at that point.

00:23:00.200 My long-term projections was we still had like four more breaks to do.

00:23:03.220 We had two minutes probably to reset for the next set.

00:23:06.700 Right.

00:23:06.840 And I took my headphones off and I said, we're going to replace Dr. Laura.

00:23:10.900 And you said, what's to your recollection?

00:23:13.800 My recollection was, oh yeah.

00:23:15.400 Okay.

00:23:15.800 So what do we have next?

00:23:16.940 And it wasn't a brush off as to whether I thought you were going to succeed.

00:23:20.120 I was there.

00:23:20.720 I was, I believed in the show enough to basically dedicate my four minutes of my

00:23:25.700 career.

00:23:26.300 Right.

00:23:26.580 12, you had 12 minutes.

00:23:27.620 I had 12 minutes of my career into making this thing happen.

00:23:30.340 So I did, you know, I did believe in the show though.

00:23:34.200 I remember you saying, how about we finish the whole show?

00:23:38.380 How about that?

00:23:39.200 How about we, how about prove it for one program?

00:23:41.840 Let's do the rest of the show.

00:23:43.360 Yes.

00:23:43.720 Yeah.

00:23:43.960 About the, you know, that, and that I think was a sensible idea at the time.

00:23:48.460 But I do realize that after a while that those moments are different than I took them.

00:23:53.820 Right.

00:23:53.980 Like, it's like you, you, you and your little pronouncements mean something because they

00:24:00.520 last for a long time.

00:24:01.380 And when you see it in your head, that's when those things wind up happening.

00:24:03.960 At the time, I just thought you were, you know, basically nuts or just like incredibly

00:24:07.920 egotistic and thought you were just going to take over the world and in a few, right.

00:24:10.960 Right.

00:24:11.260 In 12 minutes.

00:24:12.000 In 12 minutes.

00:24:13.100 Um, you have joked many times that, um, and it's funny and I, I, I get, I'll, I'll circle

00:24:21.420 back to this towards the end, but you have joked many times that you never have ever finished

00:24:30.240 any of the spaceships that you have started to build.

00:24:35.240 Explain that.

00:24:36.180 Um, well, there is a, a long-term thing.

00:24:41.160 And I think, and I've talked about this to many, many people who've come into the company

00:24:45.940 and have been frustrated by a similar dynamic, um, where Glenn has a lot of very big ideas,

00:24:51.760 I explain.

00:24:53.240 Um, and, uh, there are a lot of times great ideas, but there is a limit about how many

00:24:59.900 different great ideas you can do.

00:25:01.840 The only person I know who's doing things like this, like a Zeylon Musk, right?

00:25:04.400 Like, it's like, I want a flamethrower company, a car company and a space company, all of

00:25:07.700 them.

00:25:08.080 And you're like, well, right.

00:25:09.440 Most people are going to say, let's just pick one.

00:25:12.180 Right.

00:25:12.560 And we'll try to do that.

00:25:13.780 And so you, you, one of the things I think is your strength and has been one of the things

00:25:17.860 that's made you successful is your, I, your ability to be super engaged in these big ideas.

00:25:23.300 And it's different than a lot of hosts.

00:25:24.660 Like, you know, a lot of times my temptation is to come in and just, I want to do a good

00:25:28.160 show every day.

00:25:28.660 I want listeners to be able to enjoy the show and like it and then be able to go on

00:25:33.160 with their day after learning something and enjoying their time.

00:25:35.940 And that's something obviously we try to do every day.

00:25:38.120 However, you always want to do these big grandiose things.

00:25:40.880 You know, we, I want 500,000 people on the mall in Washington.

00:25:43.520 That's an insane idea.

00:25:45.020 Um, it's also insane when you're trying to do six of those other things that are generally

00:25:48.900 the same scale.

00:25:49.760 We're launching a network.

00:25:50.660 We're doing this, we're doing this and we're doing this.

00:25:52.040 And there's never a shortage of Glenn Beck ideas.

00:25:53.920 Never.

00:25:54.320 Um, there's always a new spaceship to build.

00:25:57.340 So what we would joke about is like, okay, in the backyard, there's about six or seven

00:26:01.940 half built spaceships that can't take off because we all went and tried to build one.

00:26:07.060 And then we all had to move on to the next one.

00:26:09.400 Um, and you know, it's tough because it's, you know, a big part of my job and my career

00:26:15.540 has been trying to execute your vision.

00:26:18.100 Like what you want to do, what you think is the most important, what you think is the big

00:26:22.180 idea that can move the show to the next area or change the country or whatever it is.

00:26:26.180 Um, and at times I feel like we have these great ideas.

00:26:28.600 We get halfway down those roads and then you're like, I've got a new big idea.

00:26:33.460 Dump that one.

00:26:34.220 We're going this way.

00:26:35.180 And so that takes a lot of getting used to.

00:26:37.520 I mean, it was, you know, it was really frustrating at times at the beginning.

00:26:40.120 And I've talked to you a little bit about this before, but like, you know, we would write

00:26:43.060 speeches and work our asses off to make a great speech at a huge venue.

00:26:47.920 That was a big moment in your career.

00:26:49.440 And we'd work on it together.

00:26:51.220 We'd write the thing together.

00:26:52.260 You'd have this awesome speech that had a beginning, a middle and end.

00:26:55.380 It had stories.

00:26:56.160 It had points.

00:26:56.700 It had facts.

00:26:57.320 All these great things, jokes.

00:26:58.680 It was amazing.

00:26:59.340 It was interesting.

00:27:01.080 People would have liked it, but they don't know that because you would walk up to the

00:27:04.720 podium and you'd see like some guy wearing a shirt that reminded you of a story from

00:27:11.460 your childhood.

00:27:12.080 And then it would go that direction.

00:27:13.900 And what sucks about it is that speech would be really good.

00:27:17.620 So I couldn't go afterwards and say, what did you do?

00:27:20.940 You blew that one because you didn't.

00:27:22.260 It was great.

00:27:22.740 It was a great speech.

00:27:23.440 And you're usually really good at those things.

00:27:25.740 But it can get frustrating.

00:27:27.220 You can see that from the other side of that where you work your ass off to try to make

00:27:29.960 something good.

00:27:30.640 And then it just winds up in the trash afterwards.

00:27:34.120 So that takes some getting used to.

00:27:35.640 And after a while, I sort of realized that part of your process is having that backup that

00:27:42.320 you know is there and good.

00:27:43.640 And when you feel confident enough and secure enough in knowing that there's something good

00:27:49.280 you could go to if you wanted to, it seems to free up your ability to just connect on

00:27:54.780 another level.

00:27:56.000 So after a while, I don't know if this is me just justifying how meaningless my career

00:28:00.480 has been.

00:28:00.960 But eventually I got to the point where I thought that was really an important role.

00:28:04.560 So did you, it was, did you ever think to yourself, uh, I mean, first, how long did

00:28:13.500 it take you before you stopped being pissed?

00:28:16.620 Uh, and did you ever think to yourself, I'm just not going to do that.

00:28:21.240 I'm just not going to write it.

00:28:22.340 I'm not going to spend, I'll just write gibberish.

00:28:24.660 Right.

00:28:24.800 Yeah, I mean, there's a, I think when it first started, I was just happy to be involved

00:28:30.960 in it, you know, and after a while, you know, you're like, well, I really feel like we did

00:28:34.440 some really good stuff that wasn't used and it would get disappointing, um, that it wouldn't

00:28:38.060 get used.

00:28:38.840 Sometimes we'd be able to reuse it in other places or whatever, but it was, it would get

00:28:42.180 frustrating.

00:28:43.220 Um, and I, I don't think there was ever, like, I always felt that like, you know, you were

00:28:49.340 paying me a salary.

00:28:50.660 Like it was my job to just do the best thing that I could do, whether you use it or not.

00:28:55.060 Um, but still that can be creatively frustrating.

00:28:57.560 Um, and it wasn't until I kind of understood, I think the dynamic of you and the way you work

00:29:03.880 at your best, right?

00:29:05.340 Like my, you know, I used to talk about this to interns that would come in.

00:29:09.100 Cause when I started with you, I wasn't, you know, I was legitimately an intern and like

00:29:12.720 half of my job, uh, if you know, Glenn, probably three quarters of the job was to go to like

00:29:16.920 Dunkin' Donuts and get egg sandwiches, right?

00:29:18.920 Like, I mean, I, that was really like where you, where you started and people would come

00:29:21.800 in and a lot of times over the years, I think this has been a big change in radio and probably

00:29:26.020 television as well.

00:29:26.780 It's like, people don't want to do that stuff anymore.

00:29:28.860 Like that stuff's below you.

00:29:30.240 You know, I went to college and I don't, I studied X, Y, and Z.

00:29:32.840 I'm not going to go get an egg sandwich.

00:29:34.400 And like our philosophy around here has always been like what everybody's job is everybody's

00:29:39.040 job.

00:29:39.320 Like if you can help out, like if you're getting egg sandwiches, one day you're getting

00:29:41.960 egg sandwiches.

00:29:42.480 And over time, the way I, I thought about all of these things was, you know, my job

00:29:49.220 is to make the show better.

00:29:50.200 It's to put you in a position where you can, you can do your best work.

00:29:53.640 And so sometimes I know this now because I'm hosting a lot more and doing all these other

00:29:58.200 things.

00:29:58.480 Like sometimes an egg sandwich is key to that, right?

00:30:00.860 Like sometimes I need a freaking soda and I need it right now.

00:30:03.900 And it's going to make me very happy to do a much better show.

00:30:05.840 And that seems silly, but I think the same thing happens with when it comes to, you know,

00:30:11.300 building the rocket ship halfway.

00:30:12.980 Like we don't know the rocket ship is going to go halfway and then you're going to come

00:30:15.920 up with a better idea later on.

00:30:17.880 Like that, that might've been the big idea that we, you know, if you didn't really push

00:30:22.620 those things all the way to their end, you wouldn't know where they go.

00:30:25.000 You wouldn't know that 500,000 people could be gathered in Washington, D.C.

00:30:28.460 If you didn't go down those roads and they don't always work.

00:30:30.780 But I mean, I think in a way it's like, it's looking at it almost like a, an inventor

00:30:34.320 or, um, you know, um, uh, you go back and you look at, you know, how many times an Einstein

00:30:38.800 fail and not that I'm comparing you to Einstein by any means.

00:30:41.120 That's what I heard.

00:30:41.800 That's what America heard.

00:30:43.300 No, but like, that's what you do.

00:30:44.320 That's the process, right?

00:30:45.180 You try all these things.

00:30:46.080 A lot of them wind up not working.

00:30:47.580 A lot of them wind up, you look back later and you're like, God, that seemed like a good

00:30:50.180 idea.

00:30:51.100 But in reality, it kind of sucked, but that's okay.

00:30:54.100 As long as you really, you know, if you're getting value out of what I was doing, I was happy.

00:30:59.220 Um, and you know, that like, as long as I was able to do some of my own creativity

00:31:03.780 and, and, and jump into that world, I mean, it is rewarding.

00:31:06.440 It's just like, you have to understand the rules that you're working under.

00:31:10.320 All right, back to the podcast in a second.

00:31:11.920 Let me tell you about our sponsor.

00:31:13.220 It is Ashford university flipping the calendar creates endless possibilities.

00:31:18.880 It's a new year, new and exciting opportunities can come your way.

00:31:23.000 You just have to be ready for them.

00:31:24.740 And it all starts with earning your master's degree at Ashford university.

00:31:28.540 A benefits to going back to school or getting your master's degree are unlimited.

00:31:34.140 Once you have that education, nobody can take it from you.

00:31:37.240 And it's convenient.

00:31:38.100 It's flexible.

00:31:39.220 Ashford university's online master's degree program allows you to learn at your own pace.

00:31:44.640 You can study wherever you're comfortable learning one course at a time also helps Ashford

00:31:50.840 university's six week long courses allow you to take one course at a time.

00:31:54.960 So being enrolled in one class at Ashford means that you're considered a full-time student,

00:32:00.360 but it's so much easier on your already busy schedule, easy enrollment, the, uh, GRE, the

00:32:06.640 GMAT and other standardized test scores are not required for enrolling at Ashford university

00:32:11.900 and Ashford university is fully accredited by W a S C senior college and university commission.

00:32:18.740 So get ready to grab your new opportunities this year, get your master's degree, start working

00:32:23.180 on it right now, enroll at Ashford.edu slash Beck.

00:32:28.640 That's Ashford.edu slash Beck.

00:32:31.980 Get your master's degree, change your life.

00:32:33.960 You're worth it.

00:32:35.040 Ashford.edu slash Beck.

00:32:37.740 So you, uh, the, uh, the head of the company now is Tyler.

00:32:45.940 And, um, he has, uh, he said to me after one of our last specials, which took three weeks

00:32:57.280 to write and, uh, he said, he, he called you about four minutes before airtime.

00:33:04.800 Do you know this?

00:33:05.460 Mm hmm.

00:33:05.740 And, uh, or maybe texted you and he said, how are you doing?

00:33:10.420 And you said, Glenn just kind of threw out the script.

00:33:15.020 Yes, I do remember.

00:33:15.840 And, uh, I'm not sure how we're going to get there, but we've pulled a thousand rabbits out

00:33:25.040 of the hat.

00:33:25.780 No, no cause to worry.

00:33:28.200 Another rabbit isn't on the way.

00:33:29.820 Do you remember that?

00:33:31.240 I do.

00:33:31.720 This, was it this socialism special?

00:33:34.400 No, it was on the, um, uh, it was, uh, the first impeachment special on Ukraine.

00:33:41.440 Yeah, that's right.

00:33:42.760 Um, very complex chalkboard.

00:33:44.980 Very complex.

00:33:45.860 And that was a great example of what we're talking about.

00:33:48.800 Um, because you know, not, I mean, you know, people worked a lot on that.

00:33:54.040 A lot of late nights, a lot of, I mean, the guy who wrote that, um, had been here every

00:33:59.800 night until, you know, 11 o'clock at night.

00:34:02.380 And you obviously had outlined all the vision and where you wanted to go, but like the actual,

00:34:06.440 like execution of a show like that is insanity.

00:34:09.680 I mean, there's so many moving parts, so many things.

00:34:12.560 And, you know, we're trying to do it with, you know, you've always, I think, been a proponent

00:34:15.980 of a sort of a small tight knit staff where people are like really good at what they do.

00:34:21.340 They can do a lot of different things and they don't mind working their butts off to get

00:34:25.540 there.

00:34:26.320 Um, and that's kind of the situation here now, um, to this day.

00:34:29.800 And so, you know, Jason, who put a lot of his heart and soul into that had gone through

00:34:35.220 this and it was supposed to be executed a certain way.

00:34:38.640 I believe I sat in 20, 30 meetings in which you agreed to do it this way.

00:34:43.580 And then of course, five minutes before the show, more than that, a little bit, maybe

00:34:47.080 an hour before the show actually starts, you decide, no, I'm going to throw this out.

00:34:50.220 I don't want to do this this way.

00:34:50.980 I'm just going to go up to the board and improv this.

00:34:52.300 I'm going to do this and like, you know, the human instinct in a moment like that is

00:34:58.380 like, wait a minute, you have to protect what you've done.

00:35:00.600 Like, and this is, I've worked my butt off on this.

00:35:02.900 We had this plan this way.

00:35:04.140 We don't have fact checks ready for whatever you're going to blurt out in an improv hour

00:35:10.040 of stuff.

00:35:11.800 Um, and you know, you and Jason looked at each other.

00:35:14.140 I thought at one point you were going to get into a fist fight and that was not going to

00:35:17.260 work out for well for you.

00:35:18.420 Cause he was like special forces, so you were going to get your ass kicked.

00:35:21.340 Um, but, uh, you know, that, that is a perfect example of that moment where, and Jason is

00:35:27.440 totally understands this.

00:35:29.040 And so does everybody.

00:35:29.740 I think like that led to you being able to, once you got all of that internalized, it

00:35:36.100 helps you come out and explain it in a way that, that can explain a massively complicated

00:35:41.040 story like Ukraine to the average person.

00:35:43.300 I mean, you know, they would be somewhat of your superpower, right?

00:35:46.780 Like you're able to kind of take that stuff and break that down in an interesting way

00:35:49.760 where most people just want to, you know, hang themselves listening to it.

00:35:53.140 Um, and it, that whole process of everything being written and everything being lined out

00:35:58.440 on the chalkboard and all of those elements lined up in order is all part of the thing

00:36:02.940 that gets you to the show.

00:36:04.680 That was one of the biggest specials we ever did.

00:36:06.920 Um, it's hard to understand.

00:36:08.260 And I think like I've, at some point you just need to stop trying to understand it, put you,

00:36:12.900 you try to put yourself in the position, do your best work, put yourself in a position

00:36:15.700 where you can do your best work and then it, you know, you go and you do it.

00:36:19.840 And if it fails, it's totally your fault and we had nothing to do with it.

00:36:23.620 Well, it would have been, it would have been, it would have been.

00:36:28.560 What's the biggest fight we've ever had?

00:36:33.560 God, uh, I mean, there haven't been many.

00:36:36.300 I mean, I can only think of two.

00:36:38.460 You think of two.

00:36:40.640 Um, what our biggest fights are ever.

00:36:45.640 I mean, like, you know, when I decided to not go to Florida, there was a, I think you

00:36:49.860 were disappointed.

00:36:51.920 Yeah.

00:36:52.320 Um, cause I, I wouldn't consider that a fight.

00:36:54.000 I don't remember it being a fight.

00:36:55.260 Like, but I mean, it was, you know, I remember how it happened.

00:36:58.740 Uh, I remember in the car, in the car.

00:37:00.360 I remember being in the car with you.

00:37:01.860 Uh, cause we were, you know, basically I was, I, we had planned this whole thing.

00:37:05.660 We had made, done the whole show, the whole shows, all three of them, all the tapes.

00:37:09.980 Yeah.

00:37:10.620 But we did shows on WABC in New York.

00:37:12.860 I mean, we had a lot of, uh, big things going into the Rush Limbaugh studio.

00:37:16.440 Remember that first time doing it with, you did a show on the golden EIB microphone.

00:37:21.500 Um, you know, it was a lot, it was a lot and it happened fast and you were able to get,

00:37:25.040 you know, a syndicate or a, uh, uh, actual show.

00:37:27.740 And they had a couple, we had several stations we were choosing from at the time and wound

00:37:32.160 up choosing Tampa, uh, 970 WFL, a station.

00:37:35.280 We loved the city.

00:37:35.920 I loved eventually.

00:37:37.420 But at the time I, you know, I was in Connecticut.

00:37:39.540 It was my hometown station and you were leaving and they offered me the slot to kind of come

00:37:43.940 in and do the show.

00:37:45.040 And I was, you know, it's like, I'm 20, 20, 21, 22 years old.

00:37:48.920 Like I'm doing the morning show on my hometown station where all the, you know, all my high

00:37:53.800 school friends that are like coming back from college because I'm me, uh, and they would,

00:37:58.600 you know, you know, I'm doing a show and it was, it was cool.

00:38:00.700 And I, you know, it was a good opportunity and it helped me learn a lot of things.

00:38:04.340 Um, but you know, I always felt like we did our best work together, you know, and that

00:38:08.400 was one of the things that eventually convinced me to kind of come back down there.

00:38:10.860 Cause I, I just felt like that was, you know, where you're able to do, we were able to

00:38:14.500 do a lot of special things, I think, um, through that period.

00:38:16.920 And I mean, it died obviously a long time ago.

00:38:19.280 Um, but, uh, you know, I mean, at that time it was, it was good.

00:38:22.120 Um, and, uh, but, uh, I, I don't, I didn't think of that as a fight by any means.

00:38:26.780 It was more like, you know, I think it would have been fun to, to do together and we've

00:38:31.460 eventually did do it.

00:38:32.440 Yeah.

00:38:32.780 Um, fights.

00:38:33.400 I don't know.

00:38:33.740 What do you do?

00:38:34.520 If you're thinking of fights, what are you thinking?

00:38:36.720 Do you have examples?

00:38:37.580 There's only two in my mind.

00:38:39.200 I was right in both of them, by the way.

00:38:40.620 You were, you really were.

00:38:42.620 Really?

00:38:42.900 You really were.

00:38:43.440 Um, uh, the first one is when your wife, cause no, most people don't know your wife

00:38:51.000 is famous too.

00:38:52.600 Um, she was with, uh, what was his name?

00:38:56.380 Uh, uh, Peter Strzok, I think.

00:38:59.180 No, not, she's not famous for that.

00:39:02.360 No, that's a different Lisa Page.

00:39:03.560 Her name is Lisa Page.

00:39:04.900 It is, it is spelled differently.

00:39:06.360 She's a radio host.

00:39:07.140 She's a radio host.

00:39:07.920 She's a national radio show and, and, and famous in her own right.

00:39:11.320 Um, and, uh, she was going to go up and work with radio legend, uh, John Lander.

00:39:19.180 Yeah.

00:39:19.480 In Boston.

00:39:20.120 In Boston.

00:39:20.400 And we were just at the place where I knew I was saying it all the time.

00:39:27.620 It's coming.

00:39:28.760 It's coming.

00:39:29.460 It's coming.

00:39:29.960 It's coming.

00:39:30.620 I mean, it was, it was, I mean, we'd gone from 18th place to first place on the ratings

00:39:35.080 in Tampa.

00:39:35.640 Well, with a side trip to 18th.

00:39:37.260 We went 18th to 23rd.

00:39:38.360 23rd.

00:39:38.780 Then you went up.

00:39:39.320 Yeah.

00:39:39.540 Um, yes, I agreed with you, right?

00:39:42.300 I went, this was, we were, we were in a, I, and I didn't think you did.

00:39:46.020 And I was mad because you had just come back and getting you onto FLA was, if I remember

00:39:54.340 right, not easy.

00:39:56.200 Was it?

00:39:57.260 You mean getting you, meaning me to come down?

00:39:59.560 Yeah.

00:39:59.780 Yeah.

00:39:59.920 Yeah.

00:40:00.060 No, it was, it was, I mean, it was a, it was a fun job to do at my hometown.

00:40:03.980 So I didn't, but I mean, I, I knew I wanted to leave.

00:40:07.180 No, no, no.

00:40:07.480 I'm saying when you left KC 101 to come join me in Florida after I had already done six

00:40:14.220 months or whatever, and you were like, okay, this is not good.

00:40:18.880 Uh, and I want to come back.

00:40:20.880 I wanted you back.

00:40:22.380 But if I remember right, it wasn't easy.

00:40:24.300 It wasn't easy.

00:40:25.180 No.

00:40:25.420 I mean, it was a lot of moving parts.

00:40:26.820 I was, uh, currently, I guess not engaged, but pretty serious with her.

00:40:33.100 And, and then you guys got married and then she got this great job for her.

00:40:38.560 Yeah.

00:40:38.840 And all I see was you saying, I might leave.

00:40:43.040 I'm leaving you again.

00:40:44.260 There I am.

00:40:45.060 Departing again.

00:40:45.820 That bastard.

00:40:46.820 Uh, it will look, I think, uh, you know, as much as I like you and respect.

00:40:50.420 No, no, no, no, no.

00:40:51.160 It was also a, you know, a question of, it was important to me to be able to take my wife's

00:40:57.240 dreams seriously, even though I did, uh, very much not want to go.

00:41:01.440 Um, you know, she got a very good offer at the time.

00:41:04.780 It was considerably, you know, more money than I was making and considerably higher,

00:41:10.160 uh, profile job.

00:41:12.120 We were still, we weren't even national show by any means at that point.

00:41:16.360 Um, so it was, did you believe at that time?

00:41:20.060 Yeah.

00:41:20.360 Oh yeah.

00:41:20.700 I was, I look, I, you know, as, as much as we make fun of each other on this, I mean,

00:41:24.740 I really believe the show could, was something special.

00:41:27.340 I had listened to a lot of really good talk radio.

00:41:30.120 I had listened to a lot of really good personalities over the years.

00:41:33.040 I mean, I came in through, you know, I listened to the number one market in America.

00:41:36.160 It's where I, you know, I grew up listening to that station.

00:41:38.020 I listened to, I mean, that station in Miami is a legendary talk radio station.

00:41:42.220 IOD.

00:41:42.700 Um, and they did things differently and I knew there was something special about what we

00:41:46.820 were doing.

00:41:47.460 It was just a matter of like, I, I, you can't be dismissive of your spouse or spouse to be

00:41:53.200 and their dreams as well.

00:41:54.540 And it was something we, we had to take seriously.

00:41:56.420 So the other argument that we had that you were absolutely right on, and I think I've

00:42:03.100 said this to you, um, since, uh, was the day that it was, it was happening at the time

00:42:11.840 of Fox, which I don't think people can understand the pressure that we were under.

00:42:17.400 Insane.

00:42:17.580 You know, people are, you know, they're doing drugs and killing themselves at, at Saturday

00:42:22.920 night live.

00:42:23.620 We literally laughed at Saturday night live and nobody laughs at Saturday night live

00:42:29.820 anymore.

00:42:30.640 Um, but we had, you were the writer, Dan was writing, Pat was writing, um, and we would meet

00:42:40.920 in the morning and have to churn out an hour television show, all monologue.

00:42:46.000 Um, and nobody had ever done it.

00:42:49.960 Remember when we tried to hire a producer from NBC and they said, you'll never keep this pace.

00:42:53.700 It'll never, you can't do it.

00:42:55.900 And that was 20 minutes of the show being a monologue.

00:42:59.780 Um, and, uh, I was getting beat up from everyone and, uh, it was before it got to be crazy, crazy.

00:43:10.960 There was something that came up in the news about the damn birth certificate and it wasn't

00:43:18.120 even about the birth certificate.

00:43:19.960 It was about freedom of speech.

00:43:22.580 Yeah.

00:43:22.940 Right.

00:43:23.160 And it, and you were like, you're going to get killed.

00:43:26.820 And I'm like, why can't a human being question?

00:43:31.920 And it became, we, that was the only real fight I think we ever had, but we weren't fighting

00:43:39.300 the same thing.

00:43:40.460 We were fighting calmly, rationally.

00:43:44.860 Don't even touch them.

00:43:46.560 And, and I was fighting, I'll touch whatever the hell I want to touch.

00:43:51.540 Oh yeah.

00:43:52.200 And I do remember that.

00:43:53.600 It was a fun morning.

00:43:55.240 Um, and it, you know, it's very true.

00:43:57.620 You weren't a believer in the theory by any means, but you were frustrated at that.

00:44:01.860 The fact that, you know, it was one of these things that anyone who said anything about

00:44:04.880 it was just being shut down and destroyed.

00:44:07.140 Um, and you know, I think it wasn't something you had looked into seriously, right?

00:44:10.980 It was just on the fringes of conspiracy and you were just voicing, I think.

00:44:14.780 I can't, I can't question.

00:44:15.960 Right, exactly.

00:44:16.900 Why can't someone say, I mean, cause, and had we gotten in trouble yet for, what was

00:44:23.780 the conspiracy that we debunked and then it became our conspiracy somehow or not?

00:44:28.220 Oh yeah.

00:44:28.700 The, uh, oh gosh.

00:44:30.440 Fema Camp.

00:44:30.600 Fema Camp.

00:44:31.200 That's right.

00:44:31.600 Which we did a huge special on debunking it.

00:44:33.640 Debunking.

00:44:33.900 It was, it was because like that was, I mean, now it seems totally rational to do things like

00:44:38.180 that because, you know, the conspiracy stuff bubbles under online and blows up to real

00:44:44.000 things that people believe, huge chunks of the population.

00:44:46.580 And we took that seriously from the very beginning, which is why we did that.

00:44:49.760 We paid attention to the internet.

00:44:51.660 Yeah.

00:44:52.100 Very early, obviously.

00:44:53.440 Um, but, uh, yeah, that particular thing, like, and I think this is an interesting thing

00:44:57.020 to highlight, um, something that has, has always been a reason why, um, we've worked well together

00:45:04.280 and that like, it's, you know, it's been, it's something that I've liked doing is because

00:45:09.240 you were never someone who just wanted, uh, what you were saying spouted back to you.

00:45:16.720 Um, because I, that's dull.

00:45:18.700 That's not why I got into this.

00:45:19.740 You know, I, I want to be able to say what I want to say and, you know, and you want to

00:45:25.720 work with someone who actually wants to hear pushback.

00:45:28.460 And I can't tell you how many times have we done this and it's happened both ways, certainly,

00:45:31.560 but like where you think X is correct and we go over and talk about it.

00:45:36.480 And at the end, we kind of realized thinking maybe Y is correct.

00:45:39.840 Um, or at least at the very least you'll consider, you know, what I'm bringing to the table

00:45:44.060 and maybe dismiss it or whatever.

00:45:45.580 But that's an important part of that.

00:45:47.400 And it's, it keeps me sane.

00:45:48.980 I know, because if I, if, if every time I came in here, I was afraid to bring up a different,

00:45:53.100 um, a different point or something that disagreed with you because you were going to blow up

00:45:57.120 on me.

00:45:57.460 Well, you know, I wouldn't want to work in that environment.

00:45:59.040 Right.

00:45:59.900 Um, and that one, I do remember being like, it was just one of those intense days.

00:46:03.480 Those days at Fox were freaking crazy.

00:46:05.660 Uh, everything.

00:46:06.620 Can you believe we did it?

00:46:07.580 No, I'm looking back at it.

00:46:09.280 I mean, I, there's so many big, huge things.

00:46:14.360 Things that we have done together.

00:46:18.260 And it's, there's so many of them so close.

00:46:23.320 You're like, I don't even know.

00:46:25.600 I don't even know.

00:46:26.420 Yeah.

00:46:26.520 Sometimes people bring up, do you remember when you did X, Y, and Z and this person in

00:46:30.220 the white house reacted and, and this happened?

00:46:32.580 And no, that wasn't a big deal at the time.

00:46:34.260 What?

00:46:34.520 I don't really remember it.

00:46:35.580 And then you go back and you watch it and the monologue and you're like, oh my gosh,

00:46:37.940 yeah, I remember that now.

00:46:38.800 It was just another week at that point.

00:46:41.540 Um, and that's why it was, you know, it was important to have that dynamic where you can

00:46:46.520 be honest with each other.

00:46:47.760 You can argue those points out and like come out with where you stand and then go out and

00:46:51.940 do the show every day.

00:46:53.400 But it was never something where we were trying to balance, you know, all of these factors.

00:46:58.140 It was, it was like trying to figure out, okay, this is, this is what our principles

00:47:01.340 are.

00:47:02.180 We don't have time to think about how, whether we should be doing this or not, right?

00:47:06.640 Like you just got to go out in there and do it because, uh, and you get up, make sure

00:47:10.320 you just stay consistent with what you believe.

00:47:11.840 Cause at the end of the day, if you do that, you can always defend it.

00:47:14.300 You always know where you are.

00:47:15.200 As long as you're consistent with those principles, you can always at least explain to the audience.

00:47:18.580 This is what I was thinking.

00:47:19.500 This is why I was thinking of it.

00:47:20.940 This is why I was thinking it.

00:47:22.080 And that's, uh, I think one of the things that's made the show really good.

00:47:26.000 Um, and it goes back to the beginning of it when, you know, things that we've talked about

00:47:29.320 Terry Schiavo before, uh, you know, woman who was in the vegetative state and you initially

00:47:33.660 came out and said, yeah, let her die.

00:47:35.080 No big deal.

00:47:36.140 Flippantly on a Friday afternoon.

00:47:37.840 And you got a call from somebody who said, Hey, are you, I list, I've been listening to

00:47:42.560 you.

00:47:43.020 You're pro-life thought about this.

00:47:45.320 Have you actually taken any time to think about it?

00:47:48.520 And you took that seriously, spent the weekend thinking about it and realized you believe you're

00:47:54.380 on the wrong side of it and like the typical talk radio thing to do is to come out on the

00:47:59.980 other side and say, either ignore it completely that you even were on the other side, brush

00:48:04.680 it off and say, well, you know, never make a big deal about it or just move on to other

00:48:09.600 stories and not cover that one anymore.

00:48:11.680 And what you decided to do was, was just stand up and say, I was wrong.

00:48:16.080 I talked to a caller, made me think about it.

00:48:18.280 I've changed my opinion on it.

00:48:19.380 Here's why it was wrong.

00:48:21.200 That people want that anymore.

00:48:23.100 I don't know.

00:48:28.280 In my pessimistic moments, I think, no, I have to be honest with you about that.

00:48:32.500 And it's one of the things that, you know.

00:48:34.600 So one thing we've prided ourselves on, you know, the 2008 collapse, when did we start

00:48:39.300 talking about that?

00:48:40.040 Oh God.

00:48:40.540 If it wasn't 2006, it was very early 2007 when.

00:48:44.180 I think it was, I think it was even earlier.

00:48:46.260 Maybe.

00:48:46.660 I mean, cause it was when everything was raging, you know, like the economy's going fantastically

00:48:51.600 well, uh, everything looks like it's hot, you know, everything's going well.

00:48:55.500 And you're a stat person.

00:48:56.720 You, you and I make such a good balance, I think, because you are, you are calm, rational,

00:49:07.200 um, highly intelligent, um, and you like statistics.

00:49:15.340 So you're almost at times C-3PO.

00:49:19.600 Our chances of survival, sir, I just want to point out, are.

00:49:22.980 26.35%.

00:49:24.280 Yeah.

00:49:24.620 Right.

00:49:25.480 Um, and it's a good balance.

00:49:29.140 Once I, maybe five years into it, we started, I started trusting you.

00:49:35.020 You started trusting me.

00:49:36.540 Yeah.

00:49:36.820 In our areas of expertise.

00:49:38.260 Like mine is fly by the seat of the pants.

00:49:42.780 Trust me.

00:49:43.460 I got it.

00:49:44.500 Never tell me the odds.

00:49:45.420 Yeah.

00:49:45.640 Never tell me the odds.

00:49:46.780 And you are the, I don't think we can fit through that space.

00:49:53.300 And here's why.

00:49:55.000 Uh, uh, and we always prided ourselves.

00:50:01.100 I mean, remember how much heat we took for the crash?

00:50:05.860 Oh yeah.

00:50:06.380 I mean, and that was, that was one, I mean, you think about, think about today.

00:50:10.340 Uh, I mean, George W. Bush was a very popular guy among Republicans.

00:50:16.780 It's kind of easy to forget that now.

00:50:18.760 Um, but at the time he was highly supported.

00:50:20.820 No one said critical things about the guy, uh, on talk radio.

00:50:24.000 And you were, you were critical of him in many ways.

00:50:27.180 And even when it wasn't about him, there was all of these people, callers, program directors,

00:50:31.960 tons of people around the country that would, would say, you're talking down the economy.

00:50:35.540 You're hurting the Republicans and you know, you just didn't care.

00:50:40.360 Right.

00:50:40.540 And as a stat person, that must've driven you crazy for part of it.

00:50:45.040 Yeah.

00:50:45.240 Because of, especially at the beginning, cause there really wasn't a lot of evidence of

00:50:48.800 it showing up.

00:50:50.180 It really wasn't until the last year.

00:50:52.080 Maybe.

00:50:52.580 Maybe.

00:50:53.020 Maybe.

00:50:53.240 I mean, there started, the weakness started in probably 2007 to be slightly visible, but

00:50:57.260 still had historical, uh, echoes of, of, of periods we had seen before and then seen

00:51:03.500 recovery on.

00:51:04.120 We didn't, you know, the 2008 thing didn't seem obvious to a lot of people who were really

00:51:11.280 smart and not just like dumb liberals that we didn't know, you know, were annoying us

00:51:14.880 on MSNBC, but like smart conservatives who were looking at this and saying like, no, this,

00:51:18.380 this is okay for X, Y, and Z.

00:51:20.520 Um, so yeah, I mean, at the beginning, I remember telling, telling you like, it did not seem like

00:51:24.060 the right place to go, uh, and that it could, you know, it was damaging us with listeners

00:51:30.260 at times and program directors.

00:51:32.220 I mean, it really, we lost money big time.

00:51:34.280 We lost affiliates.

00:51:35.400 We lost a lot of money.

00:51:36.360 And that is, and that must've seemed crazy to you.

00:51:39.300 It, yes, though.

00:51:41.240 I will say it's also part of the thing I always liked about the show.

00:51:44.500 Um, to me, there was always a, an acceptable amount of, of risk for standing up for what

00:51:51.000 you think is right.

00:51:52.220 Even in like, you know, and this has happened a million times throughout the show where the

00:51:57.840 right thing to say for the show, as far as generating revenue and, and, and getting listeners

00:52:03.340 for the next quarter is one thing.

00:52:06.540 And we were saying the other thing.

00:52:08.040 And my belief, uh, the entire time from the very beginning, even before we started the

00:52:13.860 show together was that's the person I want to listen to.

00:52:17.280 The person I want to listen to is the person who knows it's going to cost them money is going

00:52:20.980 to say it anyway, because that's when, you know, they really mean it and they're sticking

00:52:24.500 by it no matter what.

00:52:25.480 And, and also who will admit when they really believe something and now they believe the

00:52:30.880 other thing.

00:52:31.260 And here's how I got there.

00:52:32.540 That's an interesting person to me.

00:52:34.180 Right.

00:52:34.940 Um, I don't.

00:52:36.040 And there used to be a value to that.

00:52:38.500 Yeah.

00:52:39.000 And I, I think there may be a value to that still, but I don't think anybody believes that

00:52:45.340 somebody actually does that.

00:52:47.200 Yeah.

00:52:47.980 Now it's, you only said this for this reason.

00:52:51.500 You only switched because of this reason.

00:52:54.180 What people don't know is your super genius, colossal failure somehow or another that has

00:53:01.500 planned all of this stuff out.

00:53:03.180 So you, there's no, there's only downside.

00:53:07.320 Right.

00:53:07.600 No, I, I, I think that's probably true.

00:53:11.180 And I, that has changed to me, uh, over the years in that I think my belief was always like

00:53:17.260 you take those short term hits because longterm your audience is going to know they're going

00:53:22.040 to know they can trust you in those tough moments.

00:53:24.860 And, um, and I think there's an argument to be made that it's taken a while with some

00:53:29.720 of these things, but that's happened here.

00:53:31.500 You know, I mean, I think like, you know, like, you know, you were obviously, uh, and

00:53:34.920 we both were not big fans of Donald Trump during the primary.

00:53:37.980 Um, but like, doesn't that give you a lot more credibility on your stance with him in

00:53:42.000 Ukraine now?

00:53:43.140 No, because they'll say I'm only doing it.

00:53:46.080 I don't know if you read this.

00:53:47.360 It was in, it was, I got a Google alert.

00:53:50.100 I'm still failing.

00:53:51.500 You are.

00:53:52.200 Congratulations.

00:53:52.760 I'm still failing.

00:53:53.280 Congratulations.

00:53:53.680 It's an awful big room to be failing.

00:53:55.320 Yeah, I know.

00:53:55.780 But I'm still failing.

00:53:57.100 So, uh, I see, I, to me, like if I, if I'm a listener and I hear you be very critical

00:54:02.040 of Donald Trump over the entire time as we're in the primary and then as he's president,

00:54:06.640 you say, okay, well, you know what?

00:54:08.220 These things he's doing right.

00:54:10.240 And I was wrong on those things.

00:54:12.900 And here's why I was wrong.

00:54:14.200 And here's why I think what he's doing is really working.

00:54:16.360 Like, that's the ultimate credibility to me.

00:54:18.560 Someone who is willing to say, you know what?

00:54:20.420 I blew it last time.

00:54:21.520 Nothing.

00:54:21.780 I mean, I think I understand all of your sort of arguments on them.

00:54:25.200 And I had, you know, most of them, if not all of them myself.

00:54:28.760 Um, but you know, both of us have said, like, I think, you know, he's actually done a

00:54:31.760 great job with judges.

00:54:32.580 I didn't think that was going to happen at all.

00:54:33.800 I mean, to be honest with you, I thought he might name not only his sister, but like, uh, you

00:54:37.760 know, like people who were on the apprentice for Supreme Court justices.

00:54:40.260 I would have, I would have totally bought that at the time too.

00:54:42.100 And he's gone the totally opposite way, but like someone who can actually say, yes, he

00:54:46.680 not run from what they used to say, say exactly what I used to say.

00:54:50.340 Here's why it changed.

00:54:51.560 Here's the difference of that gives you credibility on those things.

00:54:54.160 You know, there are some hosts that go out there and have said every single thing Donald

00:54:57.240 Trump has done since he walked into the public eye was the best thing that anyone has

00:55:00.480 ever done.

00:55:01.840 Why would you listen to that person when there's a divisive or questionable issue about something

00:55:07.600 like Ukraine?

00:55:08.340 When that's breaking, why would you listen to the person who no matter what has told

00:55:11.900 you the same thing about this person every single time?

00:55:14.520 I want someone who's thinking about these things individually, who's actually going through

00:55:17.860 their thought process.

00:55:18.620 Those are really the only ones you tell your friends about.

00:55:21.900 Yeah.

00:55:22.520 You know, you only tell your friends now about people who are like, no, no, no.

00:55:26.820 I know you hate this person because you think this, but even they are saying X, Y,

00:55:32.740 Y, and Z.

00:55:33.200 Exactly.

00:55:33.760 And that's, that is lost now.

00:55:37.920 And, you know, I don't know.

00:55:40.600 I mean, I think you could make a lot of the sort of standard arguments on things like social

00:55:44.400 media and our attention span and news cycles and all of those things.

00:55:47.720 But like it, there's an argument to be made now that the better long-term philosophy is

00:55:53.580 just saying whatever is best at this moment.

00:55:56.500 I know.

00:55:56.680 And I'm not going to do that.

00:55:57.640 I don't care if it works or not.

00:55:58.720 I mean, I just don't want, I want no part of it, but I think you can make the argument

00:56:02.060 that financially, that's the better way to go now.

00:56:04.260 So we've had this argument, not argument.

00:56:07.480 We've had this discussion over and over because we both feel the same way.

00:56:11.360 I'm not, I don't want to do the show.

00:56:12.680 I mean, that's, that's not worth why I got into this.

00:56:15.320 It's just not worth it.

00:56:16.580 It'll be empty and ugly and awful.

00:56:18.380 And I don't want to be a part of it.

00:56:20.460 But how do you do your job as an executive producer?

00:56:23.280 Uh, when one of your biggest job is to save me from myself, honestly, it really is.

00:56:33.080 Wouldn't you say?

00:56:34.040 Yeah, no, I think, I think a lot of times you and I have such a pattern together.

00:56:38.100 Now I can look at you.

00:56:40.820 I, you don't have to make a face.

00:56:42.400 I can look at you and I know he is not sure this is accurate.

00:56:48.440 Don't play too hard on this or don't go any further than that.

00:56:52.920 And I'm usually right.

00:56:55.080 You know, we know each other so well.

00:56:57.440 When I start opening my mouth, you're usually right.

00:57:01.600 Before I say anything, if I have a look on my face, you're just like, oh dear God.

00:57:06.920 Yeah.

00:57:07.780 We could detect those things at this point.

00:57:10.460 And so how do you, how do you make that decision now in your role as executive producer?

00:57:21.280 I, my job is to expand and to protect.

00:57:28.320 How do I do that when not only am I not willing to do that, but the host doesn't want to do

00:57:34.340 that?

00:57:34.580 Yeah, uh, that is, that is, that is a tough thing to figure out.

00:57:41.540 Um, I, I, you know, I think, you know, politicians face the same thing, right?

00:57:45.020 Someone who's a strict constitutionalist is going to get a kick out, you know, kick back

00:57:48.860 to his district that all of his voters want.

00:57:51.120 And he knows he has to win the next election or he's not going to be able to, to, uh, to

00:57:55.460 do any good.

00:57:56.020 Right.

00:57:56.400 We, how many times have we heard that argument behind the scenes from people in Washington?

00:57:59.460 Like, look, I, of course I agree with you on that constitution, but we got to get this

00:58:03.480 done if I, cause I'm going to get thrown out of office and then there's going to be

00:58:05.540 no one there to protect the constitution anymore.

00:58:07.660 You know, part of the reason why I went into this and not politics is because I don't want

00:58:12.200 to have to make those calculations.

00:58:13.760 I think the things that we can do is always be consistent in what we actually believe

00:58:19.340 and never, never change that for success or money.

00:58:25.300 However, what you can do, and I think we've done over the years is to look at those issues

00:58:31.320 and say, number one, how can, how can I present this in a way that is actually number one, most

00:58:39.280 effective at times?

00:58:40.740 I think we've lost sight of that in that, look, we believe we were righteous in a particular

00:58:46.280 point and, and it may have been even wrong on the issue, but may have also been right

00:58:50.280 on it, but we're not presenting it in a way that was most likely to, to win someone over

00:58:56.300 to the argument.

00:58:57.100 Arrogance.

00:58:57.980 Yeah, we all have it.

00:58:59.580 I mean, you know, I mean, I think at some level and I don't think it's, it's, I don't

00:59:02.660 think it's an arrogant, well, partially it's an arrogance thing.

00:59:05.100 It is.

00:59:05.440 We, we think we know, we thought we knew when it comes to, uh, Donald Trump and this

00:59:15.140 is not your call.

00:59:16.200 It's mine.

00:59:17.480 Um, I thought I knew for sure what he was going to do and how it was going to play out.

00:59:24.300 And some of it, if you'd be better cause you keep the record, I think I said it would end

00:59:30.360 in impeachment in his first term.

00:59:32.640 Yeah.

00:59:32.960 I think you did say that.

00:59:33.860 Um, which is, you know, I mean, uh, for the reason that it happened is, is totally different

00:59:40.020 than I thought.

00:59:40.760 Right.

00:59:41.040 Right.

00:59:41.200 So I was right in some ways, absolutely wrong in, in other ways.

00:59:47.680 Yeah.

00:59:47.860 And I think like a part of this is like being able to, to, to communicate these things that

00:59:54.280 are true and not being afraid of them.

00:59:57.680 You know, we talked about, you know, for example, Donald Trump's spending record is atrocious.

01:00:02.680 It's atrocious.

01:00:03.840 And we can sit here and say that he's the greatest president has never done anything wrong.

01:00:07.260 Well, the way we do that is by ignoring a thing we held as a fundamental principle before

01:00:12.400 this, which is ignoring the idea that spending is a really, a really big problem.

01:00:17.380 And our debt is a huge problem.

01:00:19.140 Um, and that can't be set aside.

01:00:21.760 We still have to talk about that.

01:00:23.900 But I think, you know, because, especially because so much of the conservative media does

01:00:29.240 not hit you with it.

01:00:30.200 It's shocking to people.

01:00:31.440 I mean, I've, you know, we don't sound a lot of times like other shows do.

01:00:34.480 Um, and if you think about the average listener who's listening to talk radio all day, they

01:00:38.500 might hear six shows in a row that are saying something very similar.

01:00:40.840 And that seventh show is us.

01:00:42.480 And so if we go in there and just try to berate them with our points, number one, it shows

01:00:47.860 that we have not learned any lesson about the problems with certainty, right?

01:00:51.320 You still have to still understand that, you know, you, you might be wrong on certain

01:00:55.320 things.

01:00:55.640 And you might not be wrong about something, but you may be wrong on how to handle it because

01:01:03.640 you're not listening to the people.

01:01:06.180 They're coming from it at a completely different place.

01:01:10.420 We were coming from intellectually, here's what, this is what this is going to mean.

01:01:15.060 This is the kind of chaos that's coming our way.

01:01:17.020 They were coming from it at, you don't know what my life is like anymore, right?

01:01:22.980 I'm really struggling and, and everything is on fire and you, Mr. Beck have a voice, but

01:01:29.680 I don't have a voice.

01:01:31.240 This guy will speak for me.

01:01:34.060 That's huge.

01:01:34.920 I think we're saying that play out, not just, you know, you know, talk shows, one thing,

01:01:38.100 but like, you know, this sort of internal, um, debate among conservatives between, you know,

01:01:42.780 common good conservatism and, and rights-based conservatism where these two things are kind

01:01:47.640 of going at each other right now.

01:01:49.020 And a lot of really good, smart people are looking at this and saying, common good, uh,

01:01:53.520 conservatism is the way to go.

01:01:54.840 Like the, we should have policies implemented by the federal government that will further

01:02:00.000 the goals of conservatism generally.

01:02:02.120 And that should be the, we should be focusing that on that as the ends and not worry as much

01:02:07.120 about the process, whether it comes to the government or whether it comes to the churches

01:02:09.860 or whatever.

01:02:10.400 The bottom line is our goal is to make, is do something for the common good.

01:02:14.180 Um, where I see that as really as an example of, uh, collectivism, um, with, I guess, a

01:02:19.580 small C, but you know, where I think the rights are the end.

01:02:23.860 I mean, rights-based conservatism is the way that I am.

01:02:26.620 However, like realizing that it's not just like some, you know, some person who's not even

01:02:32.720 giving conservatism a fair, uh, shake.

01:02:35.260 It's not those people, uh, making those arguments when they're people who are smart and that you

01:02:39.320 respect on a lot of different issues.

01:02:41.060 It's number one, interesting to listen to them and actually consider their viewpoint and

01:02:46.340 think about what they're saying, um, and how it meshes with your philosophy.

01:02:49.540 And number two, it, there's a, there's a way of explaining it to people who are with

01:02:53.840 you on 85%, 90% of the stuff.

01:02:56.380 Um, if you can explain it that way in an entertaining way, um, and not berate them, right?

01:03:02.960 Like that is going to be a much more, uh, successful thing for your business and for the success of

01:03:09.300 your argument.

01:03:10.120 Back to the podcast.

01:03:10.880 Just a second.

01:03:11.940 First, if you're somebody who's losing your hair, I think everybody hates their own hair.

01:03:16.700 I hate my hair.

01:03:18.340 And mainly because I don't know if you can see it, but it gets a little thin.

01:03:21.480 And when your hair starts to thin, that's all you think about.

01:03:24.880 I don't think women understand it.

01:03:26.160 And I don't think guys understand what women go through when they're starting to lose their

01:03:29.360 hair.

01:03:29.860 66% of us will experience hair regrowth.

01:03:34.640 If you go to keeps losing your hair sucks.

01:03:37.500 So do something about it.

01:03:38.840 Go to keeps.com slash save keeps offers the generic versions of the only two FDA approved hair loss

01:03:46.280 products out there.

01:03:47.340 They're the generic versions that are going to save you a bundle of money.

01:03:50.700 So what are you waiting for?

01:03:51.720 Just go to keeps.com right now.

01:03:54.000 You can save your hair without ever leaving your couch.

01:03:57.220 You just answer a few questions, take a few pictures of your hair.

01:04:00.080 A licensed doctor is going to review your information, recommend the right treatment for you.

01:04:03.760 And then it's shipped discreetly to your door.

01:04:05.900 Like discreetly, like you're, like you're ashamed.

01:04:08.620 Oh, the shame of hair loss.

01:04:10.920 It's the happy new hair deal.

01:04:13.100 Go to keeps, K-E-E-P-S dot com slash save and get your first order of keeps hair loss

01:04:20.200 treatment for 50% off.

01:04:22.240 But you have to go to that web address, keeps.com slash save.

01:04:28.200 Do it now.

01:04:28.980 Is there ever been a time in the last 20 years that you have been physically afraid?

01:04:37.700 Not just of losing your job.

01:04:44.860 I mean, we, like I can remember going on, on, if you go, if you watch some of the footage

01:04:52.160 back of the Washington DC rally, I remember, you know, we had tons of threats going into

01:04:59.300 that in really serious ways.

01:05:03.560 And, you know, we were again, working on, you know, working on the speech together, which

01:05:08.580 you wound up throwing out and then doing a completely different one.

01:05:11.740 And, and I remember, you know, we're driving up to this event and there is security everywhere.

01:05:17.600 I mean, it was, it was serious.

01:05:19.040 It was diapers.

01:05:19.640 Yeah.

01:05:19.820 Oh yeah.

01:05:20.940 And I remember walking out on the stage with you because I was like basically carrying the

01:05:26.380 speech.

01:05:26.760 Like you're walking on a stage, you're waving to everybody.

01:05:29.020 And like, you know, the footage in the very background, there I am, like carrying a book

01:05:32.800 and putting it on the podium.

01:05:35.220 And I remember thinking like, there was a chance at that point, it felt legitimately possible

01:05:39.880 that someone could just take a shot at you the second you walked down on that stage to

01:05:43.480 the point of like the, you know, we're talking bulletproof vests and all these things.

01:05:46.620 Now, of course I didn't have one on.

01:05:48.520 So apparently no one cared if I got shot, which is something to think when you think about

01:05:52.060 your life, something to consider.

01:05:53.220 Uh, but like, I remember in that moment in particular that those times in particular were

01:05:56.980 really rough because we were at the point where like you would do a monologue and someone

01:06:01.000 would be fired from the white house.

01:06:03.140 Like this is not, it was not like a, it wasn't even your intent.

01:06:06.720 You weren't trying to get people fired.

01:06:07.880 But as soon as people were alerted to the things you were talking about, you know, the nation

01:06:12.120 would, was rising up and calling, you know, making thousands of phone calls.

01:06:15.820 And then there was op-eds and there was follow-ups and documentaries and all of these things.

01:06:19.080 And then people were just like leaving their jobs.

01:06:21.160 I mean, you know, Van Jones is obviously maybe the best well-known example.

01:06:25.080 And a lot of conservatives have looked at, uh, it from our perspective, right?

01:06:29.060 Where, you know, here's this guy, he's basically a communist in the white house and we should

01:06:33.020 have known this and it shows who Obama was and all this stuff I think, you know, was true.

01:06:36.840 But on the other hand, think of it from Van Jones's perspective, right?

01:06:39.980 Like here's a guy who is a, uh, even in his own words, a radical activist, right?

01:06:44.420 A guy who is a proponent for communism and, and he is able to take that world.

01:06:49.860 And he says himself, I got rid of the radical, uh, uh, means to get the radical ends.

01:06:54.800 He's able to finagle himself into the boardroom of every major company in the United States

01:07:00.160 talking about green initiatives.

01:07:01.500 He rises from this, you know, nobody to the white house, this incredible, uh, you know,

01:07:09.420 uh, skyrocketing career path.

01:07:11.960 And he's, he's making a difference in the, in the ways he wants to make a difference.

01:07:15.640 And then just some guy, some talk show host says, you know, brings out a couple of things

01:07:20.340 that I said a long time ago.

01:07:21.460 And now all of a sudden I have to resign.

01:07:23.420 These people were, you know, Van Jones, you know, has gone on to be a, you know, a big,

01:07:27.600 you know, uh, cable news guy and all of these other things.

01:07:30.780 Um, but you know, there are people in those movements who did not take kindly, uh, to you

01:07:37.520 bringing these things up.

01:07:38.580 They were able to, uh, to change the way America looked at itself fundamentally, fundamentally

01:07:45.060 transform America.

01:07:46.560 Um, the things that we experienced at both CNN and Fox that I don't think, I think both

01:07:57.060 of us went in to both of those thinking, ah, there's not some cabal.

01:08:03.160 It's not like that.

01:08:04.660 You know, it's just, they have a different point of view.

01:08:09.320 What was the biggest thing you learned first from CNN?

01:08:14.500 Well, you know, it was interesting that we even got hired there.

01:08:17.440 I mean, I remember thinking there was no chance that was going to actually happen.

01:08:20.280 Um, and they put us on and I was, you know, they were, I bought a house, if I'm not mistaken,

01:08:25.260 before they made the offer.

01:08:27.120 Yes, I believe that's true.

01:08:28.120 We were happy about that, by the way.

01:08:29.480 Uh, that was really exciting for us.

01:08:31.560 Uh, that was, that's the way every move happens.

01:08:33.760 Glenn makes, goes and buys a house before we lock it in.

01:08:36.820 And then we were like, oh, well now we, I guess we have to go home there.

01:08:40.560 Um, yeah, I mean, it was, uh, cause we, there was some conflict internally, I think at that

01:08:46.080 point as to whether a cable news show was the right thing, you know, I mean, we, the

01:08:50.140 show was doing really well on radio.

01:08:51.880 We were growing quickly.

01:08:53.360 You were pretty well known.

01:08:55.020 And I remember thinking like, gosh, really like cable news, like we're going to go on

01:08:58.940 there and do this thing that everybody, you know, that's what you're supposed to do.

01:09:01.420 We all hate it.

01:09:01.980 Yeah.

01:09:02.200 None of us really liked the idea.

01:09:03.840 And I think, I think, you know, looking back in retrospect incorrectly because it was, it

01:09:08.300 was a way to, it really did change the level of your profile.

01:09:12.820 But we changed it.

01:09:14.800 Yeah.

01:09:15.120 No, cause we did something different and we knew we were going to do something different

01:09:17.940 and we weren't going to do it unless, unless we could.

01:09:20.480 I didn't want to go in there and do the same old blah, blah, blah, talking heads type of

01:09:23.800 thing.

01:09:24.560 Um, so when we went into CNN, I mean, I remember doing things that were, it helped shape my

01:09:34.260 understanding of the media in a way.

01:09:35.940 I don't know that like the audience necessarily always connects with and that like, we would

01:09:39.820 do things on the air that were really basic knowledge for the average talk radio listener,

01:09:46.660 you know, things that were like, okay, remember this quote from this guy and you'd bring that

01:09:50.240 up in passing.

01:09:51.500 And especially when we first started, we would get hit from standards and practices, which

01:09:55.640 is like the branch of CNN.

01:09:57.380 This is interesting to me.

01:09:58.440 Most people may not even know this or believe this, but I was on the floor and sometimes it

01:10:03.880 would take us two or three hours to cut an hour long show.

01:10:08.560 Yeah.

01:10:09.000 Um, you should be able to cut an hour long show in about 50 minutes.

01:10:13.340 Yeah.

01:10:13.600 Right.

01:10:14.160 It sometimes took us three hours to cut and I was never privy to the stalls.

01:10:22.000 Yeah.

01:10:22.200 I would just be told, uh, break down the computer or, you know, break down in the control room.

01:10:28.120 This is happening.

01:10:29.120 This is happening.

01:10:29.500 Don't worry.

01:10:30.040 We'll catch it.

01:10:30.780 But you were actually in the control room with standards and practices along with all

01:10:36.240 the others.

01:10:36.940 Yeah.

01:10:37.200 My staff, you know, that worked for Mercury.

01:10:39.880 That was the smartest thing we did.

01:10:42.100 Uh, that we're having to have these battles.

01:10:46.220 Yeah.

01:10:46.360 And they would be like on really basic things like we, you know, cause I talk radio, like

01:10:49.740 there, there's a, these certain things will become part of the conversation and everyone

01:10:55.440 sort of understands them.

01:10:56.360 You don't need to explain them every single time.

01:10:58.500 And we'd make points and they would push back on them.

01:11:00.740 And I'm like, do you not know this?

01:11:03.080 Do you not know this person said this?

01:11:04.680 And that really, that enlightened me into the way the media actually works because, uh, a

01:11:10.220 lot of times they don't know it.

01:11:11.320 You know, a lot of times they will, they're under the, um, they are so in their bubble

01:11:16.500 and have convinced themselves, uh, that they are the only source of valid information.

01:11:23.180 So when these things don't break through to them, they never happened.

01:11:27.260 And a lot of times we'd be able to, to be fair, we'd be able to talk them into it.

01:11:31.860 We'd say like, wait a minute, let me show you this.

01:11:33.660 And we'd have to go back to them.

01:11:34.780 It wasn't like, I don't remember times where we had to change, change scripts or anything

01:11:38.740 like that was just always, they stopped us almost every word, every line, particularly

01:11:44.540 at the beginning, because they didn't know whether to trust you.

01:11:47.400 I mean, if you remember, like we had people like Christiane and Amanpour going to board

01:11:50.900 meetings and basically global broadcast, global broadcasted board meetings and trashing you

01:11:55.700 in front of the company, because how can we be considered a credible news source when

01:11:59.260 we've got this guy hired?

01:12:00.540 We were in that world.

01:12:01.680 Um, and you know, I mean, but we go into the point where we were doing specials on global

01:12:06.360 warming and they wouldn't even find anything wrong.

01:12:10.140 And we got, you know, I think it made us better broadcasters.

01:12:13.640 Totally agree.

01:12:14.180 Because I mean, by the time we went to Fox, we were so buttoned up.

01:12:18.260 Yeah.

01:12:18.600 We didn't need it to be.

01:12:19.900 Yeah.

01:12:20.220 Again, we were dead.

01:12:21.520 We make a mistake over at Fox.

01:12:23.140 We would have been dead.

01:12:24.060 Yeah.

01:12:24.340 God has a plan, right?

01:12:25.240 I mean, because I mean, it was really annoying for a while at CNN for those reasons, because

01:12:31.200 you know, when you're on talk radio, it's a conversation and it's not a scripted news

01:12:38.500 broadcast and, and it's opinion and it's opinion and it is like, excuse the expression, diarrhea

01:12:44.060 of the mouth.

01:12:44.840 Yeah.

01:12:45.280 Right.

01:12:45.520 You're trying to fill three hours and you know, usually you have stuff to say.

01:12:48.360 Sometimes you're kind of like, you're entertaining a new idea for the first time.

01:12:52.920 Um, and especially with somebody like me who thinks out loud.

01:12:56.100 Yeah.

01:12:56.300 Things out loud.

01:12:56.760 And that's how we used to always explain it.

01:12:58.140 We're thinking out loud.

01:12:58.740 I think going to CNN, because they were so strict on every little thing, at least when

01:13:04.980 it came to the conservative side, like, I mean, you know, I don't know how they are.

01:13:09.600 You know, we see a lot of mistakes they're making today.

01:13:11.160 I don't know if things have changed over there.

01:13:12.880 Um, it seems like it.

01:13:14.480 Um, but when we were there, you know, a lot of times it was with good intent.

01:13:17.260 The people think we're making mistakes.

01:13:18.460 They were trying to protect us sometimes.

01:13:19.640 Sometimes they thought we were just totally nuts.

01:13:21.120 Whenever we'd say anything positive about Israel, uh, we would have it.

01:13:24.420 They came down really hard, um, and they would always push back from, you know, this, this

01:13:29.380 other side and we'd have to explain it, but it helped us understand that nothing was going

01:13:33.780 to get through unless we were buttoned up.

01:13:35.420 And the same thing I think happened with them in which they at first saw you as this sort

01:13:40.280 of like rogue guy who's in there just spouting nonsense.

01:13:44.340 And after the third, fourth, fifth, 500th, 600th, 700th time, we had to come back to the table

01:13:49.700 and say, this is what it's based on.

01:13:51.540 And you might not agree with the analysis that he's making, but this is factually based.

01:13:55.480 And here's why.

01:13:56.860 Eventually they became to the point where they would trust you a lot more.

01:13:59.420 And it, and only the hardest special we ever did though, was the first special on what

01:14:07.120 was happening in the Islamic world.

01:14:09.380 What was that called?

01:14:10.380 Do you remember?

01:14:11.500 Expose the extremist agenda.

01:14:14.380 And, uh, it beat Bill O'Reilly.

01:14:16.540 That was huge.

01:14:17.160 It was a huge thing.

01:14:18.200 Did not happen on CNN headline news.

01:14:19.700 And had never, uh, been done.

01:14:23.280 Anything like it had never been done.

01:14:24.940 It was before the internet was really powerful.

01:14:27.800 Um, and so a lot of this stuff had never been seen.

01:14:30.980 And that I think is the hardest we ever had to fight for anything on any platform.

01:14:37.140 If there was one single issue that was really difficult, particularly at CNN, it was the

01:14:42.460 Israel, um, Palestinian, um, Islamic extremism, that whole side of it.

01:14:48.700 You know, and you think of CNN as a really an international organization.

01:14:51.660 They see themselves as not as an American news source, but as an international news source.

01:14:56.240 And, uh, you know, taking in what Al Jazeera was pitching at the time was important, uh,

01:15:01.740 to them apparently.

01:15:02.840 Uh, and so we got in a lot of fights, particularly with the international desk on, on who was right

01:15:07.180 and who was wrong.

01:15:07.800 And they really, you know, my impression of all of that was they really did just believe

01:15:12.880 Israel was wrong and evil and they were doing terrible things.

01:15:16.240 And so they, that was always the lens.

01:15:18.880 They saw everything.

01:15:19.440 But as long as you don't have to go through the rigors that we had to go through, it's

01:15:25.980 easy to just live there.

01:15:28.060 Yeah.

01:15:28.660 You know what I mean?

01:15:29.160 Exactly.

01:15:29.360 Everybody around you is like, oh yeah.

01:15:31.580 Oh yeah.

01:15:32.100 I mean, you think about the average person who's going to work at CNN, who, you know,

01:15:35.320 goes to some left leaning college and, and learns all of these points as if they're fact

01:15:40.940 from professors, they're not going to challenge it when they get in there.

01:15:44.060 And that's, you know, I think that's changed honestly in the media today where when we were

01:15:48.660 there, I think it was more of that where it was just sort of ingrained in the, in the

01:15:52.860 world.

01:15:53.200 Like it was in, in the works.

01:15:55.440 It got, it had already gummed up the works, everything, you know, it was like you had a,

01:15:59.480 you had a glass of punch and then you pour it out and you try to, you know, pour a glass

01:16:02.660 of milk in there.

01:16:03.180 It's still going to taste a little bit like punch, no matter what happens, it was always

01:16:05.980 going to be flavored that way.

01:16:07.040 It does seem like there's been a change at a lot of these organizations from we're left

01:16:12.380 leaning and trying to tell the truth, but you know, we're definitely leaning and left

01:16:16.360 and you notice it to today, which seems like really straight out left wing advocacy because

01:16:21.320 they believe this one's just too important.

01:16:22.980 No, we had people who we've worked with several people who are left, left wing and they were

01:16:28.800 honest.

01:16:29.580 And when they found out that their side was wrong, they were like, holy cow, wait, why

01:16:33.180 what?

01:16:33.480 Yeah.

01:16:33.920 You know?

01:16:34.880 But they held our feet to the fire, but they were honest.

01:16:37.120 Yeah.

01:16:37.320 I don't know if that happens.

01:16:38.560 I don't know if it does.

01:16:40.040 So do you remember the, when I filled in for Larry King, were you in the control room?

01:16:46.680 Because they were saying to me in my ear as they were counting me down, his producer

01:16:51.960 just said, please, please stick to the script.

01:16:56.280 And I remember saying, as they were about at the count of four, I said, not going to happen.

01:17:03.540 I, that was a, uh, that was amazing because I mean, Larry King at the time was big, was

01:17:09.420 the guy, you know, he, they wanted to get, I guess, some more eyes on you at that time.

01:17:14.660 And they, or, or they felt like desperate, like the homeless guy they had to show up.

01:17:20.960 I don't know.

01:17:21.560 And they put you on and like putting you into that world.

01:17:25.080 Again, it's that clash of cultures, right?

01:17:27.420 Where the typical person who listens to Larry King every night never hears your opinion,

01:17:34.000 never hears a conservative articulate an opinion.

01:17:36.520 Well, right.

01:17:37.740 All they hear are people spouting the same opinions in the same order over and over and

01:17:42.320 over again.

01:17:43.020 So that was jarring.

01:17:44.460 I'm sure to a lot of people as it was jarring just internally in the CNN culture.

01:17:48.440 People weren't used to hearing people like you.

01:17:50.860 And they, when they, when they heard people like you, it was because of the craziest thing

01:17:54.860 you said in an 18 month, 18 month period.

01:17:57.940 You speaking of that, and then I want to come back to the no script thing.

01:18:01.700 Um, you have always, you are like my work wife, um, well, Tanya, thank you, Tanya sometimes

01:18:14.220 is more mad than I am when people come after me.

01:18:19.140 Yeah.

01:18:19.860 And there have been times where you have been mad.

01:18:26.800 Um, and, uh, and have said, you've looked at me and said, I'm answering it.

01:18:34.800 I'm answering.

01:18:35.380 I'm like, don't, it's not a big deal.

01:18:37.080 Don't know.

01:18:37.960 Got to answer it.

01:18:39.620 Any of those pop to your head, the one that pops to my head that still bothers me today

01:18:45.840 deeply.

01:18:46.760 Um, and nothing can be done because the individual is no longer with us is the Breitbart, Shirley

01:18:56.100 Sherrod craziness.

01:18:59.500 Hmm.

01:19:00.260 Gosh, that was a, that's a throwback.

01:19:02.460 Yeah, no, that was a, that was a weird one because a lot of these fights were, cause I

01:19:06.020 could think of like you getting in a fight with, um, someone like, uh, I think it was

01:19:10.020 Freed Zakaria maybe about, you said about 10% of, uh, Islam, uh, have terrorists or terrorist

01:19:16.580 sympathies.

01:19:17.480 And you got just lit up by the media over that.

01:19:21.660 And I just remember going through and just proving it with poll after poll.

01:19:25.840 It's like 45% in many regions.

01:19:27.340 It's much, much higher than that.

01:19:28.820 And, you know, going by the dictionary definition of the word terrorism, we like, I remember

01:19:34.240 spending hours and hours just lighting that up and you were completely, you know, completely

01:19:37.920 right on that.

01:19:38.560 I mean, I remember going back and forth with, uh, uh, uh, Obama's, uh, spiritual advisor,

01:19:42.740 um, uh, about, uh, about leaving your church and, and, and, uh, uh, social justice, social

01:19:51.860 justice.

01:19:52.200 Right.

01:19:52.460 And going through and I had to write something for the Washington post about, uh, about one

01:19:56.340 of their sites about, um, you know, what social justice was, where did it come from?

01:20:00.640 Here's the actual history of it.

01:20:01.980 Why aren't they telling you that?

01:20:03.420 Um, and, and those things were like, some of them blew up into massive controversies to the

01:20:07.760 point where we were constantly, you know, you hear about them all the time from not

01:20:10.420 only listeners and everything else, but like companies and, and, you know, every getting

01:20:15.220 inquiries from media organizations.

01:20:16.600 And that stuff was like, it became in the Fox era, a real big part of our job, pushing

01:20:21.240 back against that stuff.

01:20:22.540 Um, and wound up being, you know, fighting back to make sure that people, they didn't

01:20:26.680 successfully paint you as this lunatic, right?

01:20:31.480 Like just saying crazy things all the time because that's what they wanted to do.

01:20:34.700 That was their out.

01:20:35.440 This was their sort of, you know, the, a well worn path where they would be able to kind

01:20:41.980 of take a conservative who was rising, get rid of them.

01:20:46.180 So you never have to hear them again.

01:20:47.040 You can always easily dismiss what they're saying because they're a conspiracy theorist

01:20:50.220 or a lunatic or whatever.

01:20:51.320 And that became a big part of what we had to do, particularly in that period.

01:20:55.220 The, the, the, the Shirley Sherrod thing was a weird one because, um, and we still hear

01:20:59.420 about that occasionally from, uh, people who, well, it is the, it is the separation from

01:21:05.660 a lot of people.

01:21:06.800 I mean, originally with me and Ben Shapiro, I mean, this is a long time ago, me and Ben

01:21:11.420 Shapiro, uh, uh, Dana Lash.

01:21:14.840 I mean, people that were working there at the time, it was a really big deal.

01:21:18.760 It was a very big deal.

01:21:20.320 And they hated me at first until we sat down and we talked.

01:21:24.940 Yeah.

01:21:25.240 Yeah.

01:21:25.680 But Andrew and I never had that opportunity.

01:21:27.840 No, no.

01:21:28.400 I mean, Andrew was, uh, obviously a, you know, uh, a huge personality, right.

01:21:33.420 And he did a lot of things that, uh, you know, were pretty remarkable.

01:21:36.820 Um, and so, and we had a good relationship with him.

01:21:39.660 He had broken a couple of his big stories on the show.

01:21:43.200 Um, he had, um, uh, you know, some of those big, like the James O'Keefe stuff that was

01:21:48.420 happening at the time of the very beginning of that.

01:21:50.580 Um, you know, we were tied into that and he was coming on the show and some of the people

01:21:54.360 he was with were coming on the show.

01:21:55.500 So, so he had a good relationship with him and, and, and found the stuff that he had

01:21:58.700 been doing to be, you know, pretty trustworthy.

01:22:01.960 Like it was, it all seemed to be, I mean, we all, you know, if I remember, if I remember

01:22:05.760 right, because of our experience at CNN, we knew if we didn't have everything buttoned

01:22:11.400 up ourselves, we were in trouble.

01:22:13.940 And so the, the trouble is, uh, um, uh, Andrew had done all of this work on acorn and we

01:22:22.120 were on acorn, but he had the goods to crack it open and he had called me, I don't remember

01:22:29.520 even when.

01:22:30.400 And he said, I remember I was on a boat, might've been July 4th.

01:22:34.400 I was in the New York Harbor on a boat and he called me and he said, I have this stuff

01:22:40.440 explosive and it's explosive and I said, can you get it to me?

01:22:45.340 And he said, yeah, do you want it Monday?

01:22:47.960 And I said, yeah, if it is what you say it is, yes.

01:22:51.420 And I asked at that time, I need the unedited tape.

01:22:55.700 You remember this?

01:22:57.140 And so he said, I'll get it to you.

01:22:59.180 Then he had one, then he had another one and he had a third one.

01:23:02.260 And by the time we got to the fourth one, I still hadn't had the unedited tape and you

01:23:08.560 and everybody else breathing down my neck going and Joel Cheatwood saying, we got to

01:23:14.620 have the unedited tape.

01:23:16.220 I believe him.

01:23:17.320 But if we don't have the unedited tape, we don't know what's real.

01:23:22.780 Right.

01:23:23.540 And so then we got the tape of Shirley Sherrod and I believed it.

01:23:28.760 Yeah.

01:23:29.260 So that one, I don't remember us being tied into it beforehand.

01:23:33.460 Maybe we were.

01:23:34.340 No, it was in the, but it was in the morning, the morning that it was over the morning that,

01:23:40.880 you know, by five o'clock it had, it had collapsed.

01:23:44.380 Yeah.

01:23:44.640 So it was, it was posted on a site and we had just found his stuff to be generally reliable

01:23:48.640 and we didn't have the full report and we kind of hit it briefly.

01:23:53.180 I think at the end of an hour, it's kind of a throw in like this Obama official said something

01:23:57.820 I think we hit it.

01:23:59.460 I think we hit it harder than that.

01:24:00.640 Cause I remember going into Joel's office and saying, is this real?

01:24:03.960 And he says, it looks like it.

01:24:06.260 I'm on the phone with the people that know the videotape, know the full videotape, know

01:24:12.560 the speech.

01:24:13.560 And he's like, I think so.

01:24:15.400 And I think I said, join us at five.

01:24:17.960 We'll have a lot on this.

01:24:19.600 And I thought we were going to fall with Breitbart at that time.

01:24:25.140 Yeah.

01:24:25.420 And, and, um, you know, we, once we got to the break, I remember, I remember going off

01:24:30.620 the air and we hit, this is the time Pat and I are doing the, what was at the time called

01:24:33.880 the fourth hour where we would do an hour after the show.

01:24:36.800 And, uh, I remember just thinking about it and just listening to the tape and it just,

01:24:40.440 it just seemed weird.

01:24:41.540 It just seemed like they're so obviously wrong.

01:24:44.100 It seemed out of context, like we were missing context on it.

01:24:47.600 Um, and so we went on, I remember going on the fourth hour and saying like, I think there's

01:24:51.300 something like, I want to know what's, what's after this.

01:24:53.900 And we eventually were able to track down what she said after it.

01:24:56.400 And at this point, I don't even remember what it was, but it was something basically like

01:24:58.920 she, she really wasn't saying the thing that was insinuated in the headlines.

01:25:04.300 Um, and it was kind of, I, you know, probably our mistake to even mention it, you know, without

01:25:08.560 that.

01:25:08.900 But at the time we had never seen an issue with a Breitbart story or anything like that.

01:25:12.340 So we kind of assumed, uh, that it wouldn't be reported if it wasn't in complete context.

01:25:17.980 Um, and, uh, we got off and I remember questioning that on the fourth hour, which is not broadcast

01:25:23.700 to the nation.

01:25:24.380 It was just broadcast to subscribers.

01:25:26.420 And the white house fired Shirley Sherrod.

01:25:29.740 Yeah, that's right.

01:25:30.440 And so you, you're like, okay, it was like, obviously this must be really bad.

01:25:33.680 And I remember about halfway.

01:25:35.080 Pat and I were talking about it and we were questioning it.

01:25:36.940 And then you came in on the fourth hour and started saying like, yeah, this doesn't seem

01:25:40.840 right.

01:25:41.560 And we kept tracking it down.

01:25:42.520 Eventually got to the point where we realized, okay, the context is wrong here.

01:25:46.480 She really didn't say that.

01:25:48.200 And it was kind of the opposite.

01:25:50.080 It was like a, I can't remember.

01:25:51.300 She was explaining a story like someone else's opinion or something.

01:25:54.220 I don't even remember exactly what it was.

01:25:56.060 Um, but I do remember thinking to myself, like immediately we get off the air.

01:25:59.520 We, we kind of go through that process of trying to understand the story kind of come

01:26:02.360 on the side of like, well, it's not, not as stated, but we never were like critical

01:26:05.900 of Breitbart over it because, you know, Breitbart was like, uh, you know, he was kind of a big,

01:26:11.660 you know, it was conservative, like a big name in the conservative circles.

01:26:14.880 We had a relationship with him.

01:26:16.440 We had no real reason to believe it was anything intentional or anything like that.

01:26:19.580 It just seemed like it might've been a mistake.

01:26:21.620 Um, and my, if my recollection is right, he thought we set him up or something like

01:26:26.860 that.

01:26:27.120 Yeah.

01:26:27.460 And I remember the only reason we did go on the air and we hit it hard that she should

01:26:32.400 not have been fired and this story was wrong because that's who, that's what we've always

01:26:38.660 believed in.

01:26:39.620 Right.

01:26:39.800 If we say something or if we don't want to take scalps to count scalps, we want it to be

01:26:46.400 right.

01:26:47.280 Yeah.

01:26:47.560 And I think, um, there was, you know, look, it was a, probably a very intense time for

01:26:52.440 them.

01:26:52.860 Yeah.

01:26:53.080 And so he saw us maybe as dogpiling.

01:26:55.420 Right.

01:26:55.820 That's probably true.

01:26:56.660 And like, you know, I, uh, I do remember though, um, you know, the reason why we even

01:27:02.380 mentioned it is because we actually thought he was credible.

01:27:05.540 Like it was actually, I always thought it was a strange way that got spun by, um, you

01:27:10.200 know, some people in sort of the conservative media who didn't like us that, you know, you

01:27:15.820 were out there trying to take down Breitbart or like it really was the opposite of that.

01:27:19.560 I mean, I, you know, um, I know eventually like it wound up kind of blowing up into a thing

01:27:23.600 and you guys never really did, uh, you know, uh, make up on that one.

01:27:27.660 Um, but I've always found it to be a strange sort of, uh, story because, you know, look,

01:27:34.540 the bottom line is, and it's, it's almost part of that sort of extreme sort of, uh, partisanship

01:27:39.640 thing, teams and tribes that we're in now.

01:27:42.140 And that like a lot of people looked at that as whether we were right or wrong, we shouldn't

01:27:47.260 be critical of our own side.

01:27:49.440 And it's like, well, we were, I didn't even look at that as being critical of them for

01:27:52.760 like, you know, I, I didn't think the story was presented correctly that time, but

01:27:56.040 like whatever, like, you know, think about it now there was, you know, there's a million

01:27:59.560 stories that come out every day and a lot of them are, are, are presented incorrectly.

01:28:03.940 It was, it's, you know, it's not that big of a deal.

01:28:05.900 You go back, you look at it, you correct what you got wrong.

01:28:07.940 You say what you got right.

01:28:08.940 I mean, it's not that big of a deal, but people look at it as this weird, like loyalty

01:28:12.400 thing.

01:28:12.820 It's like, you know, it's like you're at the meme and you're with your girlfriend and you're

01:28:15.940 turning around checking out the girl behind her and, and she's horrified.

01:28:19.060 It's like, whether it's the context or the content is right.

01:28:22.480 People look at it as this like lack of loyalty.

01:28:24.820 And it's like, to me, like I, you know, you can't get sucked into that when it comes

01:28:30.000 to parties, right?

01:28:31.940 You have to only do it when it comes to the truth.

01:28:33.760 And I think it makes you more credible when you say, Hey, our side blew it on this one,

01:28:37.400 but we were right on these other 25 things.

01:28:39.180 You're going to look at those two.

01:28:40.460 Let me ask you, let me just, I'm just going to go through these cause we're going to run

01:28:43.540 out of time.

01:28:44.740 Let me just, if you have any thoughts on these, otherwise just say pass.

01:28:48.840 Deterioration of the Fox news relationship in 2009.

01:28:50.820 2009, we never got to also what you learned from Fox, what you took away.

01:28:55.820 Cause you were not, it was the opposite of CNN.

01:28:58.920 You were not allowed in any of the, most my staff was not allowed in the big meetings

01:29:06.580 that I had.

01:29:07.340 So I was going in and you guys were waiting like, good God, what's going to happen now?

01:29:11.340 Yes.

01:29:11.720 Yes.

01:29:11.880 It was a different, we were, we did most of the show outside of, we did not go to their

01:29:15.520 building.

01:29:16.480 It was separate.

01:29:17.220 The one thing I would think that one thing I think people get wrong all the time is that

01:29:20.800 you were, they wanted you back.

01:29:23.840 They offered you a contract to continue to do the show.

01:29:27.240 We should look in our files, see if we have that.

01:29:28.940 I know.

01:29:29.520 Interesting.

01:29:29.960 Yeah.

01:29:30.180 We, we wanted to leave.

01:29:31.620 We felt it was the right time to leave.

01:29:33.720 Sort of.

01:29:34.940 We really struggled on that.

01:29:36.140 I questioned that one a lot just because I thought, I thought we had, I thought one

01:29:39.160 more contract was probably the right move for a long time because, uh, you know, two

01:29:43.300 more years because it probably would have, because we were on the blaze was on the bleeding

01:29:47.580 edge.

01:29:48.000 We were too, I thought we were too early with the technology for enough people to be able

01:29:52.080 to come over and just get their internet TV from the internet.

01:29:55.120 People was buffering and our audience didn't know what the heck it was.

01:29:58.080 What do you mean?

01:29:58.320 I got to buy what?

01:29:59.120 And a Roku and sign up for what?

01:30:01.060 And like way too early.

01:30:01.800 It was so early.

01:30:02.620 So I felt like, you know, but I, I think that the, the relationship,

01:30:06.140 had deteriorated in a way that it probably wasn't plausible, but I always was hoping

01:30:10.020 we could get a couple more years there before we did something like this.

01:30:13.680 And you probably would have been right.

01:30:15.140 I think what I'm getting from this podcast is I should listen to you because you probably

01:30:19.000 would have, you probably would have been right.

01:30:21.160 That's what I just, I just saw the, I saw the opportunity, uh, at the blaze.

01:30:27.940 I just, you know, I'm, I'm really bad at timing.

01:30:31.220 Yeah.

01:30:31.600 You were ahead.

01:30:32.040 I mean, look, you were ahead of the game now.

01:30:33.300 That's the, even cables collapsing, you know, all that's really happening.

01:30:37.900 And that's what I was saying at the time.

01:30:38.880 Oh yeah.

01:30:39.060 It's all going to burn to the ground.

01:30:40.420 And you were right, but it was pretty early.

01:30:42.200 Um, the tough times at the blaze, it was tough.

01:30:47.320 Yeah.

01:30:47.900 You know, some of that really sucked.

01:30:49.600 I have to tell you, thank you for being my friend and thank you for being so loyal to

01:30:58.240 me and, um, not, not so loyal that you wouldn't tell me the truth or you wouldn't, you were.

01:31:06.160 But I never, ever had to doubt about you and Pat.

01:31:11.000 And it was hard because we, the knives were out for us.

01:31:16.100 Yeah.

01:31:16.520 All around.

01:31:17.000 Oh, thank you for that.

01:31:18.220 And the same as well.

01:31:19.640 Um, you know, it was, that was really hard.

01:31:21.320 I mean, for a lot of reasons, I mean, you know, um, we had, it grew really fast and, uh, you

01:31:27.740 know, uh, it's always bad.

01:31:29.040 We went from 50 employees to 300 in like six, six months.

01:31:32.740 Really fast on a lot of, you know, like a lot of really understandable decisions.

01:31:35.780 And, you know, and like we had a lot of people were here that were, were, you know, are no

01:31:41.400 longer here.

01:31:41.960 And I love a lot of them, you know, I mean, to this day.

01:31:45.040 And then, so it was really hard to have people leave.

01:31:47.820 Uh, it was, you know, it was a lot of that stuff really sucked to be honest about it.

01:31:51.400 Um, you know, because like, unlike, you know, you could certainly, I've been to worked at

01:31:55.980 plenty of places where you people leave and they come and you're like, you know, whatever.

01:31:59.600 But this is, you know, this was something we all built sort of together to, so to see like

01:32:03.660 a lot of the, of the, the big names and faces from the past leave really sucked and was really

01:32:10.220 hard for a long time.

01:32:11.240 I mean, you know, look, as we always say with the economy, right?

01:32:13.520 Like people go and they find other things that they're, that they do and they're, and

01:32:17.300 they're happier now, I'm sure for it.

01:32:18.820 I'm thrilled at how, I mean, look at how much success, so much success has come from those

01:32:24.240 people who, who were really nobodies when they joined us.

01:32:28.880 I'm not saying we built them, but gave them their, their chance to grow into

01:32:33.540 themselves.

01:32:34.100 And it's amazing how many people you're like, well, they used to be with the blaze and they

01:32:38.200 were with the blaze and they were on air, off air.

01:32:40.420 I mean, we've seen this all over the place and that's one of the, the best things that's

01:32:43.300 come out of that.

01:32:43.860 It just, you know, at times it's sucked to go through.

01:32:46.420 I'll tell you that.

01:32:46.900 The, uh, Warner brothers, uh, pilot that's never been, do they, I don't think so.

01:32:53.160 Warner brothers came to us, big name at Warner brothers came to us and said, want you to

01:32:57.680 do a pilot, uh, uh, an Ellen style pilot.

01:33:01.460 Yeah.

01:33:02.020 Which is funny because I mean, of course that's a big part of your personality too, that,

01:33:05.980 uh, people like to overlook because you like lower taxes and things like that.

01:33:10.520 Um, but yeah, we did a pilot for Warner brothers.

01:33:12.920 Um, that was going to be a daytime, uh, for sure.

01:33:15.900 I mean, they were like, this thing's going to sell like gangbusters.

01:33:18.800 Yeah.

01:33:19.020 And it was really, I mean, it was really good.

01:33:20.780 Like it was, it did came out great and would have been an interesting addition to that landscape

01:33:25.320 because there's no, there would be nothing like it.

01:33:27.700 Uh, but it never really got over the hump of, you know, Glenn Beck set this thing in 2003,

01:33:34.100 you know, it never really got there.

01:33:35.540 So understand that really, um, shocked that the animated pilot written by one of the best

01:33:45.460 writers, he's, he produces stuff all the time.

01:33:48.000 Were you in that meeting?

01:33:48.800 Oh yeah.

01:33:49.000 Yeah.

01:33:49.680 A guy who, uh, every show he works on, you know, its name, like it was one of the biggest

01:33:55.060 guys.

01:33:55.440 And, and, you know, like we got to pretty serious discussions about it.

01:33:58.400 And the fact of like, think of like a, almost like a family guy with Glenn Beck as Peter Griffin.

01:34:02.560 Yeah.

01:34:02.960 And my next door neighbor was going to be Bob Saget.

01:34:05.560 Yeah.

01:34:05.980 I wasn't, but yeah, there's a couple of names that were in that role.

01:34:09.020 I remember Bob Saget being one of them.

01:34:10.960 Um, that would have been an amazing show.

01:34:13.140 Um, and you know, it's another one of those things that I don't know.

01:34:15.740 I mean, like it could that have been a really, I mean, that would have been really funny.

01:34:20.040 Um, because you know, you, unlike a lot of hosts and a lot of people in media, like you

01:34:24.420 are willing to get the crap beat out of you, especially if it's going to make people laugh.

01:34:28.220 Oh, it's funny.

01:34:28.800 Yeah.

01:34:29.040 I mean, it's like you, I'll be a punching bag all day long for funny.

01:34:32.140 Whenever we do like, um, you know, a museum here or we have doing these appearances where

01:34:35.560 we're meeting a lot of listeners, a lot of them are like, you'd say, I mean, you're tough

01:34:38.680 on Glenn sometimes.

01:34:39.500 And I'm like, he loves it.

01:34:40.600 Like he, I, we get off the air and Glenn is the one encouraging me to go further.

01:34:44.480 Um, you know, and that, that's been one of the things that's been really fun about that.

01:34:47.280 It's like, you, you know, that you sense it, you know, Jeffy is the same way, right?

01:34:51.300 Like Jeffy knows that, you know, him getting beat up is a, is a, uh, a good thing.

01:34:56.220 At least that's how I sleep at night.

01:34:57.560 Um, and, uh, but it's true.

01:35:00.700 Like if you can get yourself in that mindset and it's happened to me, it's happened to Pat.

01:35:03.740 We all get in that place where you're the guy that day that's getting, uh, you know, getting,

01:35:07.620 uh, the foot on.

01:35:08.780 I've always loved the fact that we could be in one break punching me real hard and triangulating

01:35:14.780 one person.

01:35:15.720 And then the next very next break, it all of a sudden just goes and wait a minute, I'm on

01:35:20.240 the receipt.

01:35:20.680 How did that happen?

01:35:21.420 How did that happen?

01:35:21.700 It's sometimes in the middle of a conversation.

01:35:22.860 Um, I, I want to ask you, made a, you know, I started with your, your resume, which is

01:35:35.240 a joke and you'll never work in this business again.

01:35:39.120 Although I've had an offer from seven 11 that I know writer, producer, performer, analyst.

01:35:47.800 What would you add to the list of what you think you're good at?

01:35:54.360 I think you're the, you're the, by far the best radio writer, maybe one of the best, um,

01:36:00.560 writers in the country.

01:36:02.780 Most people don't know that.

01:36:04.820 Um, producer, uh, you don't like confrontation, but you are one of the, you, I think you are,

01:36:11.300 I know you are the best radio producer in the country, um, performer, uh, and yeah, we'll

01:36:22.180 see.

01:36:22.500 And, and analyst, you are, there's just nobody better because you live stats.

01:36:29.240 I do.

01:36:30.120 Yeah.

01:36:30.500 What would you add to that list?

01:36:32.560 And how would you prioritize that list?

01:36:34.940 What are you first?

01:36:36.180 That's a great question.

01:36:39.020 I, I have, I don't know.

01:36:40.980 I mean, I think, I think all of those things, and this goes to not only writing, but producing

01:36:47.400 and, uh, and even the comedy stuff comes from analysis, right?

01:36:53.360 Like the analyst thing is something where I think you, you're always looking at taking

01:36:58.080 a situation, trying to break it down into its fundamental elements, and then you can rebuild

01:37:01.440 it in whatever way you want.

01:37:03.120 Um, and that comes to, you can build it into a joke, you can build it into a point, you

01:37:06.960 can, you know, it's understanding, you know, like, like understanding the relationships between

01:37:12.680 people when you're, when you're, you know, producing a show, you're met, you know, having

01:37:17.540 to manage a bunch of different people with a bunch of different personalities and you

01:37:20.800 have to understand how to kind of make those personalities work.

01:37:23.860 Sometimes you do have to be tough on them.

01:37:25.500 Sometimes you have to be understanding and move them in a different way.

01:37:28.580 I think a lot of that comes back to that same fundamental thing.

01:37:31.140 And I think it's a, um, you know, we did that thing with the Jonathan height thing.

01:37:36.240 Remember that?

01:37:36.860 And we went through and we read the book and we, we, we interviewed him and, you know,

01:37:40.800 and he breaks down the mind, uh, and the, and the ways that people think.

01:37:45.620 And that is, I would always come out when they had those little things, they always come

01:37:49.700 out on that analysis sort of side because, you know, this is something that goes back to

01:37:55.740 when I enter a room, I'm, I'm taking it in.

01:37:59.800 I'm trying to understand the dynamics that are going on.

01:38:02.080 What is this, you know, where, you know, where does this person think?

01:38:05.300 Where's, what's the right place to, to, to, to be or the best way to make this point.

01:38:09.380 And I think that that is, we all do that at some level.

01:38:12.940 Um, but I think that's kind of the, the way I approach those issues.

01:38:16.800 And I, you know, with this new show, I think it's going to be a big part of it, right?

01:38:20.400 Like, you know, one of the things I think we do really well is taking a, you know, a

01:38:26.220 complicated story and trying to break that down so that everybody can kind of take it

01:38:30.480 in easily and understand it and, and when their arguments on Facebook and when they're

01:38:35.260 at their offices.

01:38:36.500 Um, and you know, that is, I think like taking that, taking those issues, breaking them down,

01:38:41.920 explaining exactly how, not only that there's, that they're lying, but how they're lying,

01:38:47.660 why they're lying this way, who they're trying to move by using this type, type of, you know,

01:38:51.860 terminology.

01:38:53.000 Um, how do we fight back against that with people who might not understand the basics

01:38:57.720 that we all think we get, you know, they might come at it from a completely different perspective.

01:39:01.360 How do you move those people?

01:39:02.560 All those things I think are important.

01:39:04.080 And if you don't sit there and really understand the landscape you're going up against or the

01:39:08.620 place, the room that you're in, you're not going to be able to do that well.

01:39:11.180 But being C3PO, you know, the chances of survival, especially doing that logically, doing it with

01:39:18.840 real stats, having it really backed up.

01:39:22.420 Yeah.

01:39:22.920 Uh, I mean, it's one of the reasons why most people don't know they're surprised now, which

01:39:27.940 is kind of sad on how, when meeting me, how funny, um, you know, I am or my family and,

01:39:37.580 and they don't expect that.

01:39:40.260 And it's because I've intentionally, cause it's not worth the price of admission.

01:39:47.740 However, it is worth the price to be able to affect people because you can do it, but

01:39:58.020 you're going to also be on YouTube with a large audience.

01:40:01.460 Now on YouTube, you ready for the, were you ready for it to be you?

01:40:07.960 I mean, one of the joys of working with you all this time is that I got to watch you take

01:40:14.080 all the arrows and then that was, it's, it's actually, it's true.

01:40:18.620 You said to me once, I don't want to ever be you.

01:40:21.620 No, I don't.

01:40:22.740 I don't.

01:40:23.240 For many reasons.

01:40:23.980 I mean, thousands.

01:40:24.360 People think it's, oh, I'd love to do that.

01:40:26.020 That's great.

01:40:26.760 That's, you know, you make so much money.

01:40:28.860 No, you, you do, but you pay a very high price.

01:40:32.580 Yeah.

01:40:32.720 Well, you do if you succeed.

01:40:34.140 I mean, you know, but that's, that was at the end of a very long road for us, you know?

01:40:39.100 Um, you know, I, I think that is, that is, uh, daunting in some ways, you know?

01:40:44.620 I mean, cause I've seen it happen to you and I don't, I don't want to be even Crowder.

01:40:47.840 Oh yeah.

01:40:48.120 God, the stuff that Crowder goes through is, is insanity.

01:40:50.640 And sanity, um, part of it is like, you know, you don't get into, you don't go into the

01:40:54.920 circus to walk on a tight rope to stay a foot off the ground.

01:40:58.200 Right.

01:40:58.560 So like, you know, you want to be able to take on those challenges.

01:41:01.140 Why?

01:41:01.720 One of the reasons I'm here.

01:41:02.840 I mean, like, you know, we've been doing this together for a very long time.

01:41:06.300 Um, but like that is, I think part of it, you know?

01:41:10.600 And part of it is, I think you have to look at, at making sure that, you know, you are able

01:41:17.500 to be consistent with who you are, um, while not being, you know, flippant and ridiculous.

01:41:24.440 Like it's easy to score points saying certain things that, uh, you know, with your own audience

01:41:29.820 that, you know, like that are maybe not so buttoned up, or maybe they're the, the, the

01:41:34.480 taking what you have and going a little further than what you have.

01:41:37.420 And, and, you know, you've seen a lot of voices, I think in conservative media and certainly

01:41:41.200 on the left who have just basically made their careers on being the person on Twitter who

01:41:45.820 says the most explosive thing.

01:41:47.880 And I've always felt one of the reasons the show has worked for a long time is we've never

01:41:52.240 treated our audience as if they want to read the weekly world news, right?

01:41:56.160 We've treated them as they, they wanted that they're intelligent and they want to actually

01:42:00.020 know.

01:42:01.080 They actually believe at the end of the day, even if it comes up, uh, on, uh, as part of

01:42:06.780 the argument that doesn't back up where they are, they still want to know.

01:42:10.440 And if they, if you have a relationship with them, where, as you've done over the years,

01:42:13.900 be honest with them about the things, uh, that you care about, be honest about where

01:42:17.980 you are, you're able to say, uh, you know, to the audience, look, you might not agree with

01:42:22.980 me here, but I think because of our relationship, uh, you'll take what I'm saying seriously.

01:42:29.260 And, you know, worst comes to worst, you're going to have an entertaining time listening

01:42:32.240 to it.

01:42:32.660 You might totally disagree at the end of the day, but at least you're going to, you're

01:42:35.280 going to understand it.

01:42:36.180 And that's on us as well to do the same thing with the audience as, as you kind of talked about

01:42:39.660 earlier, we had to take where they're coming from seriously as well.

01:42:42.140 Stu does America now on YouTube and the blaze.

01:42:48.300 And, uh, I've seen you white walk the tightrope before, and, uh, I've never seen you fall, but

01:42:57.540 it's an honor to be your unused safety net on this venture.

01:43:01.800 Well, thank you.

01:43:02.620 It's going to be great.

01:43:03.280 And I, I plan a, uh, a devastating fall from grace for ratings.

01:43:08.040 If the show's not working about six months in, I'm willing to provide those.

01:43:11.900 Okay, good.

01:43:12.520 Because you're good at them.

01:43:13.260 Yeah, I am.

01:43:13.740 I've been doing them forever.

01:43:14.360 Thank you, Stu.

01:43:14.820 Thank you.

01:43:15.000 Thank you.

01:43:15.480 Thank you.

01:43:20.620 Thank you.

The Glenn Beck Program - January 18, 2020

Ep 63 ｜ Tales from 20 Years of Being Glenn’s 'Work Wife' ｜ Stu Burguiere ｜ The Glenn Beck Podcast

Episode Stats

Length

Words per Minute

Word Count

Sentence Count

Misogynist Sentences

Hate Speech Sentences

Summary

Transcript