The Great America Show - April 07, 2022


FIRST J6 ACQUITTAL, EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH ATTY DAN CRON


Episode Stats

Length

48 minutes

Words per Minute

129.19629

Word Count

6,318

Sentence Count

277


Summary

Matthew Martin, an Energy Department contract engineer, was the first defendant to testify in his own defense on January 6th, 2015. He said he had never been to the Capitol before and didn t know it was off limits to demonstrators. In fact, Martin said he and others were waved in by one of two police officers who were standing guard.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Hello everybody and welcome to the Great America Show and our issue of the day is the January 6
00:00:05.840 trespassing incident that occurred on Capitol Hill 15 months ago. You may have heard about that.
00:00:12.000 The radical left, the Dems, decided to turn those events that day into an opportunity,
00:00:17.360 political theater. The Biden Justice Department and FBI conducting themselves as the police state
00:00:23.460 political enforcers, I believe they've become. Speaker Pelosi in Congress creating a media
00:00:29.180 carnival and kangaroo court of partisans that have used up the manpower and resources of the FBI
00:00:35.900 and the Department of Justice for the sole purpose of serving the Democrats, the Marxist left, as well
00:00:42.140 as the deep state. At least 800 of our fellow citizens have been charged. A few broke laws that
00:00:48.280 day, but not many. A handful. The rest are victims of the overbearing state powers unleashed by
00:00:55.440 Democratic leaders. The trials have begun. Dozens remain in jail as millions of dollars have been
00:01:01.620 spent to, it seems, intimidate and break our fellow citizens who might think they're in the former
00:01:08.000 Soviet Union rather than the United States of America. Today, the first outright acquittal came
00:01:14.540 an Energy Department contract engineer by the name of Matthew Martin from Santa Fe, New Mexico.
00:01:20.760 Martin also is the first defendant to testify in his own defense. Martin said that day he had never
00:01:28.180 been to the Capitol before, didn't know it was off limits to demonstrators. In fact, Martin said he
00:01:34.540 and others were waved in by one of two police officers who were standing guard. His trial lasted a day
00:01:42.540 and a half, a bench trial decided by district court judge Trevor McFadden, appointed by President Donald
00:01:48.740 Trump. And we should point out, Judge McFadden ruled against President Trump on the issue of his tax
00:01:55.840 returns. In acquitting Martin of all charges, all misdemeanors, by the way, Judge McFadden said the
00:02:02.840 video showed, quote, people streaming by and the police officers made no attempt to stop the people.
00:02:10.160 That federal prosecutors are even bringing these misdemeanor cases against private citizens,
00:02:15.860 rally goers and demonstrators. And ultimately, a few rioters is an outrage, in my opinion. And thank
00:02:23.840 God we have a few judges like McFadden who go to the trouble and compared prosecutor recommendations.
00:02:30.520 In this case, the one sixers trials compared to recommendations made by the prosecutors in a
00:02:37.460 case against left-wing activists, the group Code Pink. The prosecutors wanted in a separate January
00:02:45.580 6 case, 75 days in jail and a year probation. For the leftists, they asked 10 days. The judge
00:02:54.400 ultimately sentenced him, the left-wing activists, that is, to six days. Well, with us now, Matthew
00:03:01.280 Martin's defense attorney, Dan Kron, a highly respected New Mexico defense attorney. And Dan,
00:03:07.460 it is great to have you with us. And we thank you for being with us here on The Great America Show.
00:03:13.220 You're welcome. It's my pleasure. It's just an extraordinarily important ruling today by Judge
00:03:18.180 McFadden to dismiss these misdemeanor charges, to acquit your client. Your thoughts about, first of all,
00:03:27.580 what happened today in that courtroom as the judge made his decision? Well, I would say the first
00:03:35.180 thing is that coming from the defense point of view, what we always hope for is just to have
00:03:46.820 a fair day in court. And, you know, a fair day isn't necessarily defined by whether you win or lose.
00:03:57.580 But whether your case is both heard and you can present the case you want to present and, you know,
00:04:08.040 that the trier of fact is attentive and, you know, listens to the details. And we were very fortunate
00:04:19.140 to have Judge McFadden do exactly that. And so the first observation is we were, you know, happy to be
00:04:31.280 able to present our case and have it listened to impartially. You know, beyond that, you know,
00:04:42.760 Judge McFadden's ruling was, he made several findings of fact. And those findings of fact were very
00:04:52.820 detailed and all were tied to specific places in the record. And so we had actually come to Washington
00:05:07.960 for Coy Griffin's trial when it happened. And that was one of the first things that struck me about
00:05:17.380 Judge McFadden was that he was very detail oriented and had the capacity to see through, you know,
00:05:27.040 hyperbole. And so we were very fortunate in that regard. And like I say, we are just all we wanted
00:05:39.940 was a fair day in court. And that's what we got. A fair day in court. The decision to have a bench trial
00:05:48.380 rather than a jury trial. Give us your your thinking and that of your client on that issue.
00:05:56.180 That decision. You know, we had to evaluate whether we thought we would be better off in in front of,
00:06:09.480 you know, a jury, you know, and that can cut both ways. In order for a jury to convict,
00:06:20.640 all 12 have to agree. Whereas with respect to a, you know, having a bench trial, you know, there's,
00:06:32.180 you know, one person, only one person has to find against you and, you know, and, and then it's,
00:06:41.120 you know, it's, it's a guilty finding. But, you know, in in this case, we felt that it was,
00:06:52.380 you know, there were a lot of factual issues tied to intricacies with the law. And so we wanted,
00:07:06.740 you know, to have a legal mind be the one to meld those two things together and make the decision
00:07:19.660 so that, you know, um, the decision wouldn't be based on actions of, of other people. Um, we wanted,
00:07:30.880 um, you know, uh, we, we thought that, um, a judge would be better positioned to take, um, the emotion
00:07:41.380 out of it and just deal with the facts and the law. Taking the, the emotion out the, the facts of it,
00:07:48.900 is, do you have knowledge of what other, uh, defendants are doing? Are they choosing, uh, bench
00:07:55.980 trials rather than, uh, jury trials? Or is there any predominant choice being made? I really don't
00:08:02.860 know. Um, you know, because we've just been concentrated on, uh, Matt's case and, uh, that's,
00:08:12.200 that's had us extremely busy. Yes, I'm sure it did. Uh, how long have you been working on this
00:08:18.780 case, uh, since, uh, he came to you for your, your representation? Uh, Matt came to me, um,
00:08:28.760 probably, let me think. Uh, I think he came to me six days after, um, January 6th. So I've been
00:08:38.860 working on it ever since then. It's amazing. And this is, and to remind our audience, these are four
00:08:46.300 misdemeanors. Uh, we were talking about trespass, uh, it's, uh, effectively, uh, how, how does a
00:08:56.420 misdemeanor get to this level of, uh, of expense and energy expended on the part of the prosecutors,
00:09:05.900 the investigators, and then brought to trial? This seems like a onerous, uh, burden on the taxpayer
00:09:13.000 and the resources, frankly, of our justice department, the FBI. Well, we were, uh, frankly,
00:09:20.540 surprised that they brought the charges given the circumstances. Um, and it's fair to say that,
00:09:29.940 um, they threw everything at us, uh, that they had, um, they had three lawyers who made entries of
00:09:39.740 appearance, uh, in the case. And, uh, there were, uh, also, I know other lawyers, uh, who, you know,
00:09:50.640 were not officially entered in the case, but there were working on it and, uh, many, many support staff
00:09:58.000 people. And so, um, it was, you know, it was honestly a David versus Goliath kind of a situation. Um,
00:10:09.900 and, you know, we had, there, there, there have been these huge, um, uh, dumps of, um, um, discovery
00:10:22.300 that have been made. And we ended up having to, uh, try to make our way through, uh, I think there
00:10:30.700 was something like 27,000, uh, various videos. Um, and, you know, we had to make our way through
00:10:40.740 them to be able to find the ones that were, uh, pertinent to Matt's case.
00:10:47.100 Now, did, did the justice department, did they give you your own copy of that video or did you
00:10:54.460 have to go to someplace and to see that video? Um, uh, there, there's a portal, uh, set up, uh,
00:11:02.860 that we would access. And, and how, give us a sense of that 27,000 hours. Give us a sense of how
00:11:12.880 much of it, uh, actually affected your case, uh, and Matt's appearance, uh, in that video.
00:11:20.200 Well, that was part of the challenge, uh, was trying to figure out, um, which of those videos
00:11:28.120 were pertinent to our case. And, you know, it, it took a long time. I mean, we spent hundreds of hours,
00:11:35.600 uh, working our way through, uh, uh, to find the evidence that, uh, we ultimately presented in court
00:11:47.780 that resulted in his acquittal. How did, how did Matthew react, uh, uh, when the judge made his,
00:11:57.360 uh, ruling? Well, to tell you the truth, we're both so exhausted
00:12:02.440 that, uh, it's been, uh, um, um, we, we really haven't had the time to process it yet. So,
00:12:11.160 you know, it goes without saying that, uh, Matt, uh, uh, you know, and I, uh, are very grateful
00:12:19.000 for it. Um, and, you know, frankly, it, it hasn't set in yet. Well, it is certainly, uh, as you know,
00:12:27.980 well, uh, America is watching this very carefully. Uh, we have so many of hundreds of our fellow
00:12:35.080 citizens, uh, being treated, uh, in ways in which we have not, we haven't seen the likes,
00:12:40.860 uh, in this, uh, in modern history, certainly in this country. Uh, it is, how, how long was the
00:12:48.700 sentence, uh, how long a sentence could he have gotten for, had he been convicted and the judge
00:12:55.000 thrown the book at him? Uh, there was a total of three years of exposure. Oh my gosh. For 10 minutes
00:13:02.880 inside the Capitol. Yes. It doesn't, it is, as a well-known legal practitioner, I I'd like to just
00:13:14.480 get your sense. First of all, uh, in this of, uh, how do you react to this kind of prosecutorial?
00:13:21.380 Well, I'll be kind. I'll call it zeal. Uh, we know it's far more than zeal, but your reaction to
00:13:28.500 just the conduct of the attitude of the prosecutors. Well, um, this is, um, uh, there, there are many
00:13:39.260 cases that I have been involved with over the years where, um, it's, it's been difficult to
00:13:46.940 understand, uh, you know, the zeal with which, uh, the prosecution has come after a client and, and
00:13:55.660 the, this, this was just one of them. I mean, this isn't something that, uh, um, I haven't experienced
00:14:02.940 before. Uh, the country though, really hasn't experienced this before. Uh, we've never seen an
00:14:10.140 instance where our private citizens, our fellow citizens are being charged with, uh, for, and I
00:14:16.360 understand that there were serious felonies committed by some, but it's such a small number
00:14:22.120 within that entire group of rally goers and demonstrators and protesters, and then the rioters
00:14:29.780 that it, it, it, it just doesn't, it seems there is no countervailing influence here. No reason, no
00:14:38.520 judgment, uh, from any form of leadership, either in the legal profession in, uh, I don't know the
00:14:45.960 community, uh, in, in which we protest this kind of conduct, uh, by prosecutors because it is
00:14:54.460 overreaching, it is overbearing, uh, and it is devastating, uh, to people like your client.
00:15:01.900 I, I can't even imagine what this has done to his life. Well, it's turned it upside down. That's for
00:15:08.500 sure. Um, you know, um, when, uh, when all of this first happened and Matt first contacted me,
00:15:20.400 we, uh, spent, uh, a lot of time, um, going through, uh, what had happened and what, you know,
00:15:31.500 what his experience was that day. And, um, you know, something that, uh, folks probably don't
00:15:41.300 understand is that, um, there, the, the experience that people had, uh, was quite different, uh,
00:15:53.440 from the West side of the Capitol to the East side of the Capitol. Uh, the images that, uh, you see
00:16:02.540 on television, uh, came from, um, you know, uh, the, the images of the violence and, and, you know,
00:16:12.140 the, the truly bad stuff that happened, happened on the West side. Matt was never on the West side.
00:16:18.960 Uh, he never, he was only on the East side and he never, uh, witnessed, uh, any of, of that violence.
00:16:28.020 And so really it wasn't until he got back into his hotel room and started watching the news that,
00:16:36.380 uh, he started to realize, uh, what had gone on, on the other side. And as I say, it, it was, um,
00:16:44.980 uh, I think that most people don't understand that it was almost like it was two separate events,
00:16:51.620 uh, in, in terms of, uh, what they experienced was, uh, on the West side, as opposed to the East side.
00:16:59.760 What was the difference? Why was one side, uh, violent and the other side also entering the Capitol,
00:17:07.820 but doing so in an orderly fashion, uh, even lackadaisical fashion. What was the difference?
00:17:15.900 Uh, actually, I think it was just proximity, um, you know, because the,
00:17:21.400 um, um, the rally happened, uh, uh, close to the white house by the, uh, uh, well,
00:17:31.540 it was actually at the ellipse and then there was a spillover crowd over by the Washington monument.
00:17:37.960 And so the crowd then went up, um, Pennsylvania Avenue, um, and they, uh, you know,
00:17:48.320 the side that was closest was the West side, which is where the inaugural stand was being built.
00:17:55.540 And, um, you know, I personally, I, I, I just think that that's why, uh, you know,
00:18:01.640 the West side was the first side that they got to now in Matt's case, he actually had gone back to
00:18:07.720 his hotel room, um, um, and, you know, was not, uh, part of that initial crowd that went there.
00:18:16.860 And, um, he was aware that there were supposed to be, uh, you know, some other, um, um, rallies
00:18:27.980 going on in between the Supreme court building and, uh, the Capitol. And it's the, uh, the,
00:18:37.780 the East side, the, the Supreme court building faces the East side of the, uh, Capitol. And so
00:18:45.500 that's why when Matt went there, he took a route to take him to the East side.
00:18:52.940 And to get, to get some sense of this, let's, let's, let's go back in time to when Matt made
00:19:00.100 a decision to go to the Trump rally. Uh, did he go as part of a group or did he do this just
00:19:06.960 himself? Uh, what were his circumstances? Uh, he's a, he's a contract engineer for the energy
00:19:13.140 department, uh, in Los Alamos, uh, New Mexico, a beautiful community, a beautiful place. Uh,
00:19:21.280 what, what prompted him to do it? Well, he saw, um, the, the tweet from, uh, president Trump,
00:19:29.600 um, uh, that was on, I believe it was December 19th. Um, and you know, he, um, wanted to exercise his,
00:19:42.680 uh, first amendment right to show support, uh, to the president. And so he, uh, completely
00:19:50.820 on his own, uh, booked a ticket, um, that same day, uh, to come to Washington. Um, he arrived
00:20:01.920 here on, uh, January 5th and left on January 7th. And his sole purpose in coming here was,
00:20:10.660 uh, to attend the rally, to show support to the president and vice president. And so, um,
00:20:18.020 he was not a part of any group. Uh, he came here alone. Uh, he did not meet up with anybody while
00:20:25.360 he was here. Um, you know, apart from just casual, um, um, interaction, you know, with,
00:20:34.740 with other people, uh, he did not collaborate with anyone and he was, uh, simply, uh, a citizen here
00:20:43.660 to, um, express his, you know, first amendment rights. Yeah. Yeah. I, it, and he was working
00:20:53.340 at Los Alamos, uh, the energy department facility, uh, there, uh, actually he was, uh, he was actually
00:21:03.020 working for a contractor, um, and, uh, it was a contractor that was, uh, uh, basically stationed
00:21:12.760 at a different site, but, uh, uh, from the main site in Los Alamos. Yeah. And, and, uh, you know,
00:21:21.780 the, the, the contractor then would, uh, their business collaborated with the lab. It really was,
00:21:30.280 uh, mischaracterized, uh, as him working for the lab because he didn't. Okay. Uh, and so,
00:21:38.940 and his, does he have a family? Does, uh, what are his personal circumstances? Well, his personal
00:21:46.480 circumstances are that, uh, he's a single man, um, his, uh, brother and mom, uh, live in Albuquerque
00:21:55.600 and, uh, you know, I, they're, they're his main support system. Right. And, and suddenly he's back on
00:22:04.120 the 7th of January, uh, after going to the rally. Uh, and when does he learn that the federal government
00:22:12.540 has a strong interest in convicting him of these misdemeanors? Well, when, um,
00:22:22.740 you know, his, uh, employer knew that he was going to be, uh, coming, uh, his supervisor knew that.
00:22:32.900 Right. And so, uh, I mean, it was no secret. Um, you know, he, he did not come to Washington with
00:22:41.580 any ill will or any ill intention. And, uh, so it's not as though there was some sort of, uh, some
00:22:50.320 sort of a secret thing. And then when events, uh, unfolded as they did in, um, in Washington on the
00:23:01.080 6th, uh, you know, uh, of course his, um, uh, supervisor knew, uh, that he had been here.
00:23:11.040 And, um, after he got back to New Mexico on the next work day, he let his supervisor know that he
00:23:20.680 had been inside the building. And of course, uh, uh, that then got reported, uh, you know, to security.
00:23:29.100 And, um, it was at that point that, um, you know, he was, uh, contacted, uh, by the FBI,
00:23:38.640 which was then when he contacted me. And, um, after we sat down and, and talked about everything,
00:23:47.240 um, it didn't appear to, to me, uh, and certainly not to him, uh, that he had done anything wrong,
00:23:56.720 you know, which ultimately was born out, um, uh, by the end of today. And so, um, we fully cooperated
00:24:07.300 with the FBI. Um, we met with them, um, uh, on January 15th, um, and provided them with all the
00:24:19.720 information they wanted. And, you know, part of the reason why I said that, uh, I was surprised
00:24:26.040 that he was charged is that, you know, despite having all of that information, um, they, um,
00:24:34.660 uh, he didn't get charged then until, um, April 22nd. My goodness. Uh, you know, I, I have to say
00:24:44.440 this looks political from beginning to end throughout, uh, does it seem to you to be
00:24:52.960 outright political? What are your thoughts as defense attorney and a very good one when you
00:24:58.120 were dealing with prosecutors, uh, and the way they behaved, the conduct of your client, you are,
00:25:04.680 have to be well known to the FBI, uh, to law enforcement with your career. Uh, this just your
00:25:13.660 thoughts, how political is this? Well, you know, I never really have looked at this, uh,
00:25:21.020 so much through that lens as I have through a factual lens. And, um, you know, I, I, I just
00:25:30.080 believed and, uh, it, it turned out correctly. Uh, I just believe that the facts would speak
00:25:38.920 for themselves. And so, you know, we did not approach this case from, uh, a political point
00:25:46.000 of view, um, you know, because, uh, a, a, a, a person, um, uh, should be held accountable for what
00:25:58.880 they do and not what they think. And so, um, you know, there's a difference between thought and
00:26:05.920 action. And, um, we felt strongly that Matt's actions were lawful. And, uh, so that was our
00:26:16.860 approach on the case. And when Matthew has talked to you throughout this, and I mean, you were
00:26:23.180 obviously involved from the very, almost the inception, what does he think about, uh, January
00:26:29.920 6th itself and all that has exploded from that, uh, that one day? Well, Matt, uh, Matt had, um,
00:26:42.520 you know, a very positive experience, uh, at, at the rally. Um, he had, uh, a positive experience
00:26:52.920 on his way to, uh, you know, to the Capitol. Um, it was, um, uh, you know, before anybody reached the
00:27:05.280 Capitol, uh, it, it was, you know, from his perception and his experience, uh, it was a, uh,
00:27:14.680 you know, uh, uh, uh, a festive event. And so, um, you know, he, you know, he enjoyed that part of it.
00:27:24.860 Um, and then once he, um, made his way to the Capitol, um, I mean, by the time he got there
00:27:34.840 and unbeknownst to him, uh, you know, Congress had recessed and, um, the, uh, the building itself
00:27:45.340 had already been breached, but it was breached from the West side. Um, and so when, when he made
00:27:53.540 his way around to the East side, um, you know, there, and, and the judge observed this as well,
00:28:01.460 there were, um, police officers on the, uh, North steps on the Senate side, uh, of the East side.
00:28:12.820 And, um, you know, uh, nobody was telling, uh, the people on the East side that they weren't allowed
00:28:21.000 to be there. Um, when Matt then made his way up to, uh, the, the center steps, um, he was,
00:28:31.460 up on, on that level, uh, for a while, um, you know, for anybody who would be facing the East side
00:28:40.820 of the Capitol, the doors that, that lead into the rotunda, there are columns on each side. And he
00:28:47.740 was between the second and third column. As you face the East side, uh, to the right, the crowd then,
00:28:55.020 uh, started, um, uh, migrating towards the door. And then it was at, uh, by the time he got to the
00:29:04.700 door, you know, he was just following the flow of the crowd. And, um, you know, part of the, um, video
00:29:14.000 that we presented in court, uh, we were able to locate, uh, a camera angle that, uh, showed
00:29:23.640 the people coming in and then, um, zoomed in on that. And, um, you know, it was, it was clear
00:29:33.780 from what we presented in court that, uh, uh, there was a, um, uh, Capitol policeman standing
00:29:41.680 on, um, uh, each side of the entrance, uh, each of them basically propping over a door. Now,
00:29:49.580 you know, to be fair to them and unbeknownst to Matt, um, you know, uh, that, that door had
00:29:58.220 been breached, uh, previously. And, you know, it's, it's understandable that the, uh, Capitol,
00:30:07.520 uh, policeman there, um, you know, by that point, um, they couldn't keep people out. And so they
00:30:16.260 were just trying to, um, you know, uh, see to it that things were peaceful, but from Matt's
00:30:23.920 perception, uh, by the time he got up there, um, and, and we were able to, you know, zoom
00:30:33.240 in on, uh, this video. And, you know, what you saw was that, uh, there, the, the Capitol
00:30:42.660 policeman on nearest to him actually motioned with his left hand, you know, uh, signaling to,
00:30:52.560 you know, in Matt's perception come in. And then with his right hand, uh, the policeman extended that
00:31:00.000 out, um, you know, which once again, and, and the judge found, you know, that it was reasonable
00:31:06.960 for Matt to have believed that that was an invitation to come in, um, once he was inside,
00:31:14.460 um, and, you know, I'm not telling any tales out of school. This was all presented, uh, uh, in court.
00:31:21.900 Right. Um, once he got inside, um, there, uh, there were nine, uh, Capitol, um, um, policemen who,
00:31:34.820 uh, were standing in front of, uh, the entrance to the Senate side off, uh, the rotunda blocking
00:31:43.900 that path. And, uh, Matt saw them and, and was close to them and, um, none of them were telling
00:31:53.520 people, uh, you know, to, that they couldn't be there. Um, and, you know, by implication,
00:32:00.480 since they were blocking that pathway, uh, and not, uh, saying anything, uh, you know, to the folks
00:32:09.400 inside that they weren't permitted to be there, that they needed to leave. Um, you know, I think
00:32:15.940 Matt reasonably, uh, drew the inference that it was okay for him to be in the rotunda. Um, now, uh,
00:32:24.080 shortly after he got in there was when the Metro police, uh, came in, um, on the other side of
00:32:31.780 where Matt was and formed a line and then, um, started herding people out, um, you know, towards
00:32:40.900 the, the entrance door. And at that point, um, Matt left. And so it was, it was, um, uh, pretty
00:32:50.600 much that simple. Um, and you know, I mean, that's, that's what he did at any point. Was there a
00:32:59.320 discussion? Uh, I mean, it sounds so, so casual and indeed, as I look back on that, on that video
00:33:07.740 that day at what we were watching, a part of it, just as you said, looked like it was a walk in the
00:33:14.420 park and other parts of it looked far more, uh, violent, but they were violent there. There was
00:33:22.200 plenty of violence that went on on the West side and that's undeniable. And how many people of the
00:33:29.900 800, uh, because it's interesting how difficult it is to get straight answers from our federal
00:33:35.960 government on this. Uh, how many have been charged? I mean, do you have a sense of how many remain in
00:33:41.640 jail? Uh, we have estimates, uh, of that, but it's really peculiar how little regard there is on the
00:33:50.260 part of the justice department, uh, to informing the American people. Yeah. I can't speak to that
00:33:56.460 because I don't know either. Did you have any problems getting all the information that you wanted
00:34:01.780 from the justice, uh, department? Well, um, the difficulty, uh, was,
00:34:11.640 in, in wading through the massive, uh, amount of data that we were given access to that. That's what
00:34:24.700 the real challenge was. Um, I'm sorry, go ahead. And, and, you know, I, I suspect, uh, I, I would be
00:34:34.660 surprised if other lawyers on the case, uh, have not had the same experience.
00:34:42.500 So as we, we know that they had to be thorough and search out that video and why would it not
00:34:50.920 have made some sense for the justice department to, uh, just have a discrete section of videotape
00:34:58.340 that pertains to your client. Uh, it could all be encoded. It's, there's nothing complicated about
00:35:03.960 that in terms of digital editing that couldn't have been done. Uh, because inversely when dumping
00:35:11.620 video like that, voluminous video that I, I, I mean, that's a stunning amount, uh, a video to
00:35:18.440 credit go to see a simply watch if it's entertainment, but for, for business and with a
00:35:24.060 practical purpose, it's looking for what effectively are needles and haystacks. It sounds like they were
00:35:30.000 trying to intimidate you or get you to give you the opportunity to miss something salient and very
00:35:35.400 important to your client. Um, I think it would be fair to say that, um, given the fact, uh, I
00:35:47.640 mean, basically what we did was, um, we poked around at different camera locations to look at, um, the
00:35:57.260 footage. Um, and part of the reason why we were able to, um, persuade the court, um, in terms of what
00:36:09.600 Matt's actions were, uh, is that we basically strung together, um, um, the videos, uh, that showed Matt
00:36:21.320 from, uh, from, uh, the time that he was on first Avenue heading down constitution and then wrapping
00:36:30.200 around, uh, so that, um, he, uh, you know, so that the judge was able, the judge didn't have to speculate
00:36:39.220 what he was doing. Um, you know, because we, like I say, were able through a ton of work to, um, isolate
00:36:50.420 Matt, uh, and chart his path. Matt, uh, is in a difficult position simply because he had a, he had a
00:37:01.580 federal government clearance. Uh, he was doing contract work for the federal government. What is, what is
00:37:09.780 the possibility of having his clearance reinstated now that he's been acquitted, uh, and returning, uh, to his
00:37:18.700 previous, uh, previous job or one like it? Well, okay. So let's, uh, let's split that into two separate
00:37:25.620 questions. So the first thing is, and I have done, um, um, um, substantial work, uh, for clearances.
00:37:37.900 Um, you know, I, I mean, I've, I've, I've been dealing with DOE clearances for probably 30 years.
00:37:45.900 Um, and, um, you know, uh, I don't think that it'll be difficult for him to get, uh, uh, uh, a clearance back
00:37:57.020 because, um, one of the things that, um, you know, affects, uh, you know, when someone has criminal charges,
00:38:09.100 uh, from DOE's eyes is if you go to trial and you're acquitted, then, you know, that, that clears
00:38:16.220 the issue. So, um, I don't perceive that, um, that that's to be an obstacle. Um, what we are hoping
00:38:25.980 now at this point is that since he's been acquitted is that he'll be hired back. He, he was at that job
00:38:34.220 for 18 and a half years. Oh my gosh. And, um, you know, and, and he didn't get fired, um, until
00:38:44.540 the charges were brought in April. And so we, uh, are hopeful that, uh, he'll be able to get his job
00:38:53.020 back and, you know, really at this point, uh, you know, that's, that's job one to try to get him,
00:39:00.140 uh, you know, to help him put his life back together because as you can well imagine, uh,
00:39:06.940 this has, uh, uh, turned it upside down. Yes. Uh, and if you will give him our best regards, uh,
00:39:14.380 and, uh, uh, heartfelt congratulations, uh, in, as he starts putting his life back together,
00:39:21.980 uh, the disruption of his life, uh, over this period of time, the expenses of this in terms of,
00:39:29.340 uh, legal fees, uh, what it has cost him in terms of his income. Uh, can you give us a sense of,
00:39:38.300 well, first of all, is he getting financial help of some kind? Is there fundraising going on to help
00:39:45.260 those who've been charged here, uh, with, in my opinion, or absolutely an asinine
00:39:53.100 prosecution by the federal government of, of, uh, Matt? Well, um, I really can't speak to that
00:40:00.460 without Matt's permission, you know? And so, um, I, I don't feel comfortable in addressing that issue,
00:40:07.100 you know, except to say that, you know, it, it, um, would be apparent to anyone that, um, you know,
00:40:16.140 the financial burden, uh, uh, to, you know, I mean, basically, you know, even though the system is set up
00:40:25.180 to where, um, you know, it's the government's responsibility to prove you guilty, you know,
00:40:32.540 uh, practically speaking, this is the kind of case where we had to prove it innocent.
00:40:37.660 Yeah. It, it really, that is well put. Uh, let me ask further on the, on the question of cost. And
00:40:46.780 is there, do you know of, and not referring to your client, but do you do, do you know of an organization
00:40:53.080 broadly that is raising money, uh, to help those who've been caught up in this web,
00:40:59.100 uh, much as, uh, Matt was certainly, uh, but who were, uh, on the right side of the building,
00:41:05.020 uh, if you will, who conducted themselves appropriately. And we all also who watched,
00:41:11.500 uh, the events that day saw police officers, if not waving them in almost welcoming them,
00:41:17.820 uh, just by their body language, uh, into the building. Is there such an organization?
00:41:23.740 You know, uh, I think that there are some, uh, groups out there that, uh, raise funds. Um,
00:41:33.820 but, um, I, I, I can't be any more exacting than, than that.
00:41:39.660 We are looking at a judge, uh, and, uh, McFadden, who I, based on my reading of what he did, uh,
00:41:48.300 today and how he conducted this trial, uh, through argument, uh, he was, as you put it,
00:41:54.220 fair-minded, straightforward. Uh, I, I don't think that's going to be the result for a lot of people,
00:42:00.860 depending on their, uh, on the draw. Uh, what is your sense of what the country could do better
00:42:07.580 here to avoid spectacles like this, where prosecutorial, you and I've agreed on the term
00:42:13.420 zeal, prosecutorial zeal overwhelms, uh, uh, really, uh, honorable conduct, I think on the
00:42:21.100 part of the legal profession, uh, and certainly the prosecutors, uh, I, I'm referring to.
00:42:27.500 Yeah, I really don't have the answer to that. Um, you know, I mean, looking at it from our
00:42:33.980 perspective, all that we can do, um, you know, all that we could do in this case was to defend Matt.
00:42:41.340 And so I, I, I really don't know. Uh, certainly, uh, well, will the outcome of
00:42:48.620 today's events, will it affect other cases? Will it influence the proceedings? Uh, will it leaven,
00:42:56.140 if you will, prosecutorial zeal? Well, um, I mean, I certainly hope that, um, um,
00:43:04.860 um, I, I, I mean, one, one of the things that I think this case illustrates is that these, um,
00:43:14.220 these prosecutions are not a one-size-fits-all, uh, kind of a proposition. And so my hope, uh, for
00:43:23.980 other people who, whose conduct is similarly situated to Matt's, uh, is that, uh, there would be
00:43:34.860 a, um, you know, um, uh, a closer attempt, uh, to, to ferret out, uh, cases, uh, you know,
00:43:47.820 like Matt's that, you know, as I said, at the beginning, I, I frankly was surprised that they
00:43:54.060 ended up charging him, uh, based on what his conduct was.
00:43:57.900 Well, he made a terrific choice of, uh, attorney, uh, and representation, uh, and, uh, we appreciate
00:44:07.420 you, uh, sharing your thoughts, uh, with us here today. I know it's been a long day for you.
00:44:12.700 We appreciate your time. Uh, and, uh, again, our, our, our best, uh, to, to Matt, uh, with our
00:44:19.900 congratulations and, uh, thank you so much for being with us. We have a tradition on this, uh,
00:44:25.340 on this podcast. We give the guests always the last words. I'll turn to you for that counselor.
00:44:31.740 Oh, well, um, I, I, I guess all I can say is that, um, we're, uh, just grateful that we had, um,
00:44:43.660 the opportunity to present our case and that, uh, Judge McFadden, uh, listened intently and, um,
00:44:54.220 you know, for anybody who was in that courtroom and listened to the judge's decision, um, he spent
00:45:01.100 a long time, um, um, giving the specific findings of fact, um, and they were all based in the evidence.
00:45:12.700 And so we're just, at the end of the day, grateful that we've come to the end of this
00:45:19.580 odyssey. And, um, you know, at, at, at this point, um, we, we just want for Matt to get his life put
00:45:30.460 back together. Dan Cron. Thanks so much for being with us. And our, again, our best to Matt. Thank
00:45:36.540 you. Thank you. And I'll pass that along. God bless you, Dan Cron. Thank you everybody for being with us
00:45:43.340 today. A bit of a footnote on the prosecutions of hundreds of our fellow citizens and what we
00:45:49.820 can expect in the weeks and months ahead as these clearly political persecutions of Americans
00:45:55.820 continue. In Matthew Martin's acquittal today, justice was served, but as you heard his attorney's
00:46:02.460 account, Matt was fully cooperative with the FBI, had video proof of his lawful behavior
00:46:08.300 behavior and his orderly conduct on January 6th. And three months after they interviewed him,
00:46:15.340 they charged him still with four misdemeanors amounting to trespassing and disorderly conduct.
00:46:22.620 Politico's Josh Gerstein reported judge McFadden said of Martin that his conduct that day
00:46:28.300 was as quote minimal as I can imagine in quote judge McFadden has given short probation sentences to
00:46:36.940 defendants when DOJ prosecutors were asking for jail terms. And the judge has questioned
00:46:43.580 prosecutors for bringing charges at all against nonviolent defendants. We thank you judge McFadden
00:46:51.260 for being fair. Hundreds of cases remain. And as we learned today, the list of cases will grow
00:46:58.620 by hundreds of more cases. Thanks to so-called citizen sleuths, sedition hunters, as they call themselves,
00:47:05.980 online sleuths. But they are likely to also be left-wing activists. And now DOJ is asking for
00:47:13.820 millions more for its budget to add more lawyers and to continue their investigation for what could be
00:47:21.660 years more. We all know what the DOJ has become, what the FBI is, and only a powerful commitment to
00:47:29.980 reform and a purge of ideological motives will ever make the department worthy of the word justice in
00:47:37.180 its name again. Elections have consequences and Republicans and independents have seven months to
00:47:44.540 invest their energy and time to restore integrity and security to our elections. Only our direct
00:47:51.900 involvement and participation as active citizens will assure those much-needed reforms. And here tomorrow,
00:48:00.220 one of the strongest, most fearless advocates for our constitutional republic, she's pro-life, she's America
00:48:07.900 first, and she speaks her mind. Our guest is Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene. Please be with us. We want to
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