The Great America Show - TRUMP IS RIGHT ON DOCUMENTS

00:00:00.000 First Republic, PacWest, Silicon Valley Bank, just a few of the latest casualties in the banking crisis.

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00:00:30.000 Hello, everybody. I'm Lou Dobbs. This is The Great America Show. Great to have you with us.

00:00:34.660 The now twice indicted, twice impeached, twice hit with special counsel investigations, President Donald J. Trump back on the campaign trail, combatant and defiant as ever and with every provocation and right to be.

00:00:49.660 Not only that, despite the ignorance of the Biden regime and the venality of the Marxist Dems, President Trump today has his largest lead so far in the 2024 race polling.

00:01:03.200 The latest polling from CBS shows Trump polling at 61 percent, with DeSantis at a very distant 23 percent.

00:01:11.500 That same poll found among Republican voters that 61 percent say Trump's indictment won't change their views about his candidacy.

00:01:22.020 76 percent say Trump's indictment is politically motivated.

00:01:26.960 And 80 percent say Trump should be able to be president even if he's convicted by the overclassified documents hoax.

00:01:35.320 President Trump at times seemed to be celebrating the indictment with his supporters as he campaigned in North Carolina and Georgia.

00:01:43.900 Here is President Trump on the 2024 race.

00:01:48.240 And on November 5th, 2024, we're going to stand up to the corrupt political establishment.

00:01:55.300 We're going to evict a totally corrupt president, Joe Biden, from the White House.

00:02:00.060 And we're going to finish the job that we started, the most successful presidency.

00:02:10.600 President Trump is indeed the man to beat, the man to finish the job.

00:02:15.460 And while President Trump was out campaigning over the weekend, the Rhinos and Marxists made their rounds on MMM, the Marxist mainstream media.

00:02:26.040 We noticed one of our very favorite Rhinos showing up on the cabler Sunday with his take on the Mar-a-Lago case. 1.00

00:02:34.420 Here he is, former Attorney General William Barr.

00:02:37.640 And I think the counts under the Espionage Act that he willfully retained those documents are solid counts.

00:02:44.960 Now, I do think we have to wait and see what the defense says and what proves to be true.

00:02:51.180 But I do think that even half of what Andy McCarthy said, which if even half of it is true, then he's toast.

00:02:58.140 I mean, it's a very detailed indictment, and it's very, very damning. 0.92

00:03:04.220 And this idea of presenting Trump as a victim here, a victim of a witch hunt, is ridiculous. 0.80

00:03:11.000 Yes, he's been a victim in the past. 0.64

00:03:12.780 Yes, his adversaries have obsessively pursued him with phony claims.

00:03:17.700 And I've been at his side defending against them when he is a victim.

00:03:23.320 But this is much different.

00:03:24.480 He's not a victim here.

00:03:26.280 He was totally wrong that he had the right to have those documents.

00:03:30.340 Those documents are among the most sensitive secrets that the country has.

00:03:34.800 They have to be in the custody of the archivist.

00:03:38.100 He had no right to maintain them and retain them.

00:03:41.380 And he kept them in a way at Mar-a-Lago that anyone who really cares about national security, their stomach would churn at it.

00:03:49.600 William Barr, I've decided, should be investigated.

00:03:52.760 He intervened in the 2020 presidential election.

00:03:56.160 He lied about investigations of the election.

00:03:59.380 He was involved in way too much and lied about way too much of it.

00:04:04.820 Congress, do your duty.

00:04:06.640 Please investigate this rhino.

00:04:09.400 Joining us now is no rhino.

00:04:12.700 Tom Fenton is the president of Judicial Watch.

00:04:15.620 Tom and Judicial Watch playing, I think, one of the most important roles in this country, a great watchdog group, Judicial Watch.

00:04:23.440 Tom, great to have you back with us here on The Great America Show.

00:04:26.300 I'd like to get, first of all, your impressions about where the president stands at this very moment in his persecution by the Biden regime and the deep state.

00:04:35.940 Yeah, persecution is the right word. 0.95

00:04:38.740 And it's kind of like that haze that's over the East Coast from New York to Washington down to Georgia.

00:04:47.020 You had that prosecution by Alvin Bragg, that outrageous indictment.

00:04:53.160 They're planning to do something similar here in Washington, D.C., and then probably next month in Fulton County, Georgia.

00:05:00.800 And so that haze is ruining the country and would ruin the republic.

00:05:05.460 And, you know, I think they're hoping that one of those prosecutions sticks in a way that requires President Trump to campaign from jail.

00:05:15.260 But that's how crazed they are.

00:05:17.420 And that crazed, that vicious and venal, why is there not more of, and I know this is a wide open question I'm asking, but why is it the Republican leadership in particular on Capitol Hill cannot bring itself to stand up and demand better for this president?

00:05:40.980 At least show the American people that they have some courage, some level of commitment to the Constitution.

00:05:51.160 Well, there are many reasons why that isn't happening.

00:05:54.420 You got folks who are concerned about it, but don't have the.

00:05:58.540 Have either fear or a failure of imagination to do anything about it within their powers.

00:06:03.460 And then you have another category where they don't care about anything.

00:06:07.420 So, you know, you know, I mean, we had a we you know, we had the Chinese send a spy craft over the middle of the United States doing figure figure eights over our military base.

00:06:19.680 You know, we can't get people to be excited about that.

00:06:22.480 You know, an indictment of Trump, you know, that's going to be you know, that's that's the political class in a nutshell.

00:06:28.180 They don't care about anything other than their own power.

00:06:31.940 But thirdly, the more dangerous types are in terms of of not just politics, but in terms of our constitutional system are those who want to see Trump punished, who like this abuse of him.

00:06:45.360 And many of those are Republicans.

00:06:48.320 There are more than a few running against him now.

00:06:50.780 Right. And they're going to be happily and gleefully highlighting why Trump, you know.

00:06:56.600 Is trouble and you can't you can't rely on him to be president.

00:07:00.240 So, you know, I guess the inverse of that politically seems to be doing pretty good, pretty darn well.

00:07:07.860 But it's going to be a challenge.

00:07:11.440 Because he isn't getting the support from those who ought to be supporting him.

00:07:16.080 And it's not just Trump.

00:07:17.620 You know, we get as we were talking before the program began and.

00:07:22.780 You know, I got subpoenaed for the grand jury judicial watchers harassed.

00:07:27.760 And so it's not just Trump.

00:07:29.860 It's anyone who opposes the deep state, you know, retaliation or an abuse and and scare tactics.

00:07:35.440 We know Jack Smith has a record of ideological fervor of mad left wing activism, including putting forth the template, really, for the weaponization of the federal government by being shoulder to shoulder with Lois Lerner and actually going after conservative groups through the the Internal Revenue Service and getting away with it.

00:08:02.900 And then projecting to this point in our nation's progress to its destiny, we see the entire federal government weaponized.

00:08:12.560 How can this man be allowed by the Republican Party to be a special counsel to anything pertaining specifically to elections, their leading and presumptive presidential nominee?

00:08:24.940 Well, you know, I went over some of those reasons.

00:08:31.280 And it's not only Trump.

00:08:33.560 We know he's targeting state legislators from public information.

00:08:37.940 Those citizens involved in trying to come up with alternative slates of electors and the 2020 campaign election disputes, investigating the fundraising apparatus of the RNC.

00:08:54.100 It's a Democrat partisan leftist fishing expedition being run by these ideologues and the Garland team at the Justice Department and their appointees in the name of Jack Smith, where they're misusing the awful power.

00:09:11.940 And I don't mean awful in a negative sense, but in terms of, you know, full of awe of a federal grand jury to target their political opponents and their political party, the political party that's their opponent as well.

00:09:27.160 So and the Republicans are oblivious to it.

00:09:30.420 People on the Hill are largely oblivious to it because they didn't really care about election integrity.

00:09:35.320 So they were really involved in the fights, right?

00:09:38.860 Certainly in 2020, you know, but when I'm in front of a grand jury and they're arguing with me, these partisan prosecutors and ideologues about tweets I sent out about election integrity, there's something seriously wrong with our system.

00:09:54.920 You know, there there's no question there's something seriously wrong and there is something seriously wrong with the capacity of a federal government and the deep state and the Marxist stems who've controlled that federal government, irrespective of the Trump presidency for for the past decade.

00:10:12.920 We have a moment right now in history in which they reach out and go after the head of the, in my opinion, the leading watchdog organization in Washington, D.C., Judicial Watch, which you had how the temerity to even think about going after you is stunning.

00:10:35.780 Give us a sense of how it came to be, what you think, if you will, triggered the Marxist left.

00:10:45.060 Well, they were upset that I had highlighted publicly and it became reported that I told Trump that, you know, their analysis of the records issue is all wrong, that he had a right to have records.

00:11:01.560 And if he turns any over and after he turned them over, you know, he should at least clarify that the records were his to turn over and he was doing it voluntarily and they're his personal records.

00:11:14.420 And if we want to argue about whether they should become classified or, or, or, or given to the American people for history, that's one thing, but don't accuse me of doing something wrong because these records were mine to keep.

00:11:26.180 And they were angry at me about that because that was the position of the Justice Department prior to them targeting and raiding his home with Donald, with Bill Clinton's software records, those tape recordings he had that Judicial Watch had litigated.

00:11:41.620 And so we knew what we were talking about.

00:11:43.540 I mean, we have 30 years experience litigating federal records law.

00:11:47.120 So we were front and center there and, and now we had all these lawsuits against them.

00:11:56.000 And then I didn't know this at the time that they served me with the speed in November of last year, but then the Biden records started popping up, right?

00:12:03.260 Then they knew if Biden had a records problem, right?

00:12:05.680 And, and, and, and, you know, and of course we were, we were going to be on that, like, you know what?

00:12:10.620 And, um, you know, so what better way to keep me quiet and to intimidate Judicial Watch than to send the FBI to my home and knock on my door.

00:12:20.380 And, you know, I just happened to be at home that evening, um, because I just come, literally just come back from a day's worth of cancer surgery, skin cancer surgery.

00:12:30.420 And, and the FBI is hounding me at home over, over my First Amendment protective speech related to not only the Mar-a-Lago stuff, but also the electoral debates.

00:12:45.240 I mean, it's like, it's not like I went in there, you know, Lou, you know, you get called before a grand jury and you think in the back of your mind, okay, well, I'm a witness.

00:12:52.580 I, I don't know what's, you know, this is all just a retaliation, but you're thinking, well, maybe something happened, right?

00:12:59.380 And I don't know it, but they're going to ask me about it and I'm going to go, holy shnikes, there was a crime here.

00:13:05.700 What happened?

00:13:07.340 And there was none of that.

00:13:09.680 It was all argument, argue, arguendo, right?

00:13:14.920 Innuendo.

00:13:15.620 Interesting.

00:13:16.160 And just debates.

00:13:18.140 And, you know, there were maybe three or four questions where, you know, they want to be sure I didn't see classified information and things like that.

00:13:26.480 You know, those things, I could have told them over the phone.

00:13:29.940 Everything else was just arguing with me about tweets and emails and other things related to policy debates.

00:13:36.780 And I just can't believe that the jury, grand jury process was being, you know, for four hours.

00:13:41.960 You know, I'm not the only one there.

00:13:43.000 There are 23 poor citizens who were stuck in there with me, listening to me prattle on about these debates we're having.

00:13:50.240 Oh, no, your debate, I presume, was with FBI agents, were attorneys present as well?

00:13:58.820 Oh, so when you go into the grand jury, you don't have an attorney.

00:14:01.520 No, no, I was talking about when they came to your home.

00:14:03.760 Oh, no, that was just, they just handed me the subpoena.

00:14:06.560 They helpfully pointed out that I had an Amazon package on the porch.

00:14:09.560 But, you know, but I opened the door, I've got a giant bandage on my face.

00:14:15.720 Really outrageous.

00:14:16.580 And, you know, not to say they knew that I was sick, but, you know, but when you exercise that authority over someone, you interrupt and impact their lives, right?

00:14:24.600 So you need to take responsibility for it.

00:14:26.760 And so if you're going to impact someone's life and by forcing them to go to a grand jury and play games with them, then, you know, my life at that time included skin cancer.

00:14:41.800 And as far as I'm concerned, you know, and I was so sick after that surgery, it wasn't because of the surgery.

00:14:48.060 I'm convinced it was because of the stress of getting a subpoena.

00:14:50.980 Right.

00:14:52.140 No one would in any way blame you for that.

00:14:54.780 And then, you know, on top of that, then we get the criminal, we get the criminal attorney.

00:14:59.940 Right.

00:15:00.860 And then we negotiate.

00:15:02.320 I'm going to go in and just talk to them informally with lawyers.

00:15:05.300 Right.

00:15:05.620 My lawyers.

00:15:06.720 Yeah.

00:15:07.480 And I'm just a witness.

00:15:08.880 And then, you know, that gets rescheduled, rescheduled because of issues.

00:15:12.860 Right.

00:15:13.280 Nothing.

00:15:14.400 You know, they just couldn't get to it.

00:15:16.880 And next thing you know, they say, oh, no, we want them to come into the grand jury.

00:15:22.520 Completely out of the blue.

00:15:23.860 No, never, never happens.

00:15:26.580 And I'm not a, I'm a witness.

00:15:29.080 You're a witness.

00:15:29.920 And we're going to find out more.

00:15:31.900 We're talking to you with Tom Fitton, the president of Judicial Watch.

00:15:36.080 We're coming right back after this quick pause for these announcements.

00:15:40.720 Stay with us.

00:15:41.320 This is a warning, my fellow Americans.

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00:17:05.160 We're back now with our good friend Tom Fitton of Judicial Watch.

00:17:08.500 Tom was about to go into some of the details of his appearance before a grand jury, having been summoned by the Justice Department.

00:17:20.020 Let's go to that grand jury moment.

00:17:23.140 You've been told that you're just a witness.

00:17:26.020 And is that the way it came out?

00:17:28.000 Or were they fishing for an opportunity?

00:17:30.680 Were they looking for some way to ensnare you as well?

00:17:35.840 Well, you're always sensitive about that because when you – you know, the proffer session I talked about, you know, you have your attorneys there.

00:17:41.160 So they can, you know, help and check the other side if they, you know, start, you know, taking advantage of me as a witness.

00:17:49.800 But that's not the case in a grand jury.

00:17:51.820 I got to – I'm in that grand jury room alone with no attorney.

00:17:55.080 Now, I can go outside and consult my attorney in a reasonable way, but, you know, I got to, you know, answer the questions.

00:18:03.700 And, you know, there were a bunch of gotcha questions, but, you know, there was nothing – you know, I was a witness.

00:18:10.060 I didn't see anything, right?

00:18:11.400 And I told them things I probably didn't want to hear about what they were doing and why they shouldn't have been doing it.

00:18:18.320 But the one troubling – the one troubling I would call misconduct, and I'm still ticked about it, is that one – there were three, by the way.

00:18:27.680 Like, not one, not two, but three prosecutors tag-teaming me.

00:18:33.560 And the one prosecutor says, well, you know, or do you plan to talk about this testimony, what happened here today, publicly, to anyone?

00:18:43.060 I said, I don't know.

00:18:43.940 You know, I've got privileged communications, obviously.

00:18:46.420 I can engage in with my attorneys.

00:18:49.460 Yes, but do you plan to talk about this publicly?

00:18:52.160 I said, I don't know.

00:18:53.200 I said, it's out there public.

00:18:54.380 I may have to do something.

00:18:55.440 I don't know.

00:18:55.880 And he asked me a third time.

00:18:59.080 And I said, I don't know.

00:19:02.520 And then he said, Lou, he said, oh, well, you know, by the way, you are allowed to do – you know, you're allowed to talk about it.

00:19:09.500 And I said to him, I said, well, you know what?

00:19:11.100 Frankly, your tone – your questions were chilling.

00:19:13.400 And, you know, what am I supposed to make of that?

00:19:16.900 But who – so this guy was trying to get me to swear under oath before a grand jury that I would not talk, right?

00:19:23.660 Implying that, you know, you're not allowed to.

00:19:27.580 And only after I kind of resisted and, you know, didn't want to bite three times, he said, oh, well, don't worry.

00:19:34.440 You know, you can do it. 0.94

00:19:36.360 But what sort of garbage is that coming out of a prosecutor for the federal government in a sensitive grand jury matter involving a former president of the United States? 0.91

00:19:44.640 And if that's the crowd that's going after Trump, he's going to be indicted six ways this Sunday. 0.99

00:19:52.240 Well, that is the – I prefer to call them what they are, a gang. 0.97

00:19:59.460 They're thugs.

00:20:00.560 They're using the law as battering rams and cudgels to mete out injustice and great harm to the president of the United States when he was president, before he was president, and now post-presidency. 0.94

00:20:22.700 The ignorance, the savagery of this Department of Justice is unprecedented, unparalleled, and unthinkable, frankly, in this country.

00:20:33.320 And yet, here it is.

00:20:34.660 You've experienced it.

00:20:36.320 Also, Judicial Watch has sued to – has been rebuffed by the special counsel for the names of the staff of the special counsel.

00:20:47.700 How can that be?

00:20:48.680 Well, you know, I know I'm president of Judicial Watch, so I guess I should love Judicial Watch, but that's really why I love Judicial Watch.

00:20:55.140 So they come in, they harass us, right?

00:20:57.080 And what's our response?

00:20:58.820 We sue them for the names of the people working there because that's what we do in the ordinary course, right?

00:21:04.080 And we're not going to be dissuaded from doing what we ordinarily do.

00:21:08.040 We got the names of the Mueller staffers.

00:21:10.180 That was public.

00:21:11.320 We had gotten, like, notes showing who was being interviewed.

00:21:14.320 But now they've decided that we can't find out the name of anyone working for Jack Smith under the law, which is highly unusual.

00:21:24.080 There's no legal basis to withhold the information as best we can tell.

00:21:29.040 And so we've had to sue in federal court.

00:21:30.980 And you know why they're hiding the names, Lou, because they're all a bunch of partisan Democrats who probably have donations up the wazoo to, you know, the usual suspects.

00:21:40.840 And they don't want the American people to see, again, what has previously happened.

00:21:46.360 You mean just like Jack Smith and his wife?

00:21:49.200 Well, yeah, well, there you go.

00:21:51.680 I guess that's public.

00:21:53.180 But, you know, we saw with the Mueller operation, it was just full of anti-Trump activists.

00:21:58.420 And then when he and everyone he hired happened to be a Democrat donor.

00:22:02.840 Well, I think there was one who had given to Republicans, too.

00:22:08.180 Unbelievable.

00:22:08.840 But the point is the exception proved the rule there.

00:22:11.140 And they didn't want that again, right?

00:22:12.900 And so now they're going to break the FOIA law and hide the records.

00:22:16.660 The most significant special counsel investigation right now, we can't find out who the top people are in it.

00:22:24.220 That's not right.

00:22:25.160 So when is there an assertion by so-called nonpartisans in this country, in positions of leadership, business, education, academia, science, you name the sector, to say this is not the way America behaves.

00:22:47.120 This is not the way a president of the United States is treated.

00:22:51.780 Almost eight years of political persecution without any evidence of wrongdoing whatsoever.

00:22:58.960 In fact, all that has been amassed in that time are truckloads of documents showing that the federal government is politically corrupt, the Department of Justice, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the Internal Revenue Service, the Department of Homeland Security, and the list goes on and on.

00:23:19.640 And did I mention the entire the entire intelligence community?

00:23:24.180 Yeah, it's a it's a real crisis we have with both partisans and civil servants who pretend not to be partisan in the administrative agencies.

00:23:34.860 And of course, our cultural elites are all to the left who don't care about this abuse of power and this disrespect for our constitutional government.

00:23:43.500 You know, the president has a right to be president when he's president.

00:23:46.720 Right. And he's allowed to exercise his powers.

00:23:48.720 That wasn't true for Trump.

00:23:50.220 And the same goes for former presidents.

00:23:52.920 If former presidents are held to the rules that, you know, Trump is being held to now, which are new rules made up out of whole cloth, you know, who's going to want to be president?

00:24:01.860 I'm sure other than leftists who know they'll be protected.

00:24:05.900 So these are this is a way to disrupt our whole system of government.

00:24:10.040 And it's not petty politics because the consequences are much greater than that.

00:24:15.480 I believe we're at the point where there are only two options, frankly, one is that the Republican representatives and senators stand up and demand better treatment for this president, in fact, and much better conduct from the Department of Justice and basically say to the White House, this will not stand.

00:24:40.700 And we're in demand that you cease and desist now.

00:24:44.580 I'm not talking about as a legal order.

00:24:46.200 I'm talking about as a moral and ethical and American order to this president and this corrupt regime that he has brought with him and the deep state, the corrupt bureaucrats of every department in the federal government.

00:25:02.220 Or or or one court, just one in the corrupt federal judiciary, stands up and says this will not stand.

00:25:13.420 What are the prospects in your judgment of either of those two things happening?

00:25:19.440 Well, I've been begging the leadership of Congress to do the first, and that hasn't happened.

00:25:24.900 And I suggest that it be done as part of the debt deal.

00:25:29.380 They didn't want to do it.

00:25:30.620 I'm not seeing any sign they're going to do it in any of the appropriations process now that's underway.

00:25:36.600 So that's unlikely.

00:25:38.640 I'm absent of, you know, a public outrage that's and that Congress understands because they're told about it because citizens are calling.

00:25:49.420 Now, this this indictment by Trump of Trump that I think is coming, it could be it could be there's a federal court that says, no, that at least on the issue of the document handling and whether he had the right to the documents that they get thrown out.

00:26:07.880 Well, that that would not be unsurprising, given our understanding of the law.

00:26:12.320 But, you know, that would require a tough judge, an honest judge, an ethical judge.

00:26:17.480 And they're there.

00:26:19.460 But there's significant political pressure.

00:26:22.780 I mean, we've had a lot of good judge.

00:26:24.020 We have a few good judges here in Washington, D.C.

00:26:26.160 But when it comes to January six issues, for instance, they're completely all really, really out there.

00:26:33.420 Right.

00:26:34.520 None of them, you know, a few of them have been, you know, consistently good.

00:26:38.620 But you're talking about a district court and a brave judge.

00:26:43.020 You're talking about making a summary judgment from the from what would be the inception of the legal process.

00:26:52.560 Aren't you?

00:26:53.960 Yeah, there is a time.

00:26:55.540 There's a time to write.

00:26:57.240 You can't prosecute him under this theory of the law related to the handling of documents.

00:27:02.660 Now, if there's an obstruction charge, does that mean that gets carried away, too?

00:27:06.980 I don't know.

00:27:07.560 You'll have to talk to some smart lawyers about that.

00:27:10.560 But certainly I'll forego the pleasure.

00:27:13.920 Yeah.

00:27:14.180 But, you know, certainly, you know, what's the good news is their focus on now supposedly defense information.

00:27:21.960 Right.

00:27:22.520 The kind of the broader language than classified information suggests they know we're right about the president's prerogatives in handling classified information.

00:27:32.600 Of course, the dishonesty is it applies to defense information.

00:27:35.780 Just as honesty as the presidential records act, which gives the president's prerogatives.

00:27:40.060 Right.

00:27:40.500 And really just codifies his powers under the Constitution subsumes or over, you know, the defense documents are subsumed within that.

00:27:51.380 So he has absolute right to use the documents he gets his president and keep them.

00:27:56.820 And they don't want to grapple with that.

00:27:59.320 They're trying to create a crime out of that.

00:28:01.360 And it's never been done before.

00:28:03.000 And the law doesn't allow it.

00:28:04.540 And the Constitution won't allow it.

00:28:06.040 The question is, will the court vindicate the rule of law there?

00:28:10.720 Or will they be willing to sign on to this effort to make Donald J. Trump a political person?

00:28:18.580 He also has been attached to a sinecure by the appointment of, again, Attorney General Merrick Garland at The Hague as a prosecutor.

00:28:28.540 He's not a particularly clever boy.

00:28:30.820 I mean, that's the bottom line.

00:28:32.240 He dresses up in purple and black robes over there pretty nicely.

00:28:35.700 But the result has been, as I said, checkered.

00:28:39.140 We're talking with Tom Fenton of Judicial Watch.

00:28:41.520 We're coming right back.

00:28:42.980 Stay with us.

00:28:49.280 We're back with Judicial Watch's Tom Fenton.

00:28:52.180 And, Tom, I want to turn first to another aspect of the D.C. judiciary.

00:28:57.760 And that is, whether or not, with the Trump lawyers accusing the special counsel of prosecutorial misconduct, do they have a chance of winning on that basis?

00:29:13.780 Oh, that's a good question.

00:29:16.880 So the allegation is that they tried to get a witness to cooperate by offering the lawyer a federal judgeship.

00:29:24.680 Is that your understanding of it?

00:29:26.320 Well, I don't really have an understanding of it.

00:29:29.680 There are so many areas here at work, including the way in which they have talked to witnesses, much like your own case, in which they're trying to lead them, badger them, intimidate them, before the grand jury.

00:29:46.340 So evidently, something like that happened, right?

00:29:50.360 I may be off by a detail or two, but that's my general impression of it.

00:29:54.740 And that would be before the judge that handles the grand jury, the chief judge here in the district, is Judge Boesberg, who's an Obama appointee.

00:30:03.740 You know, whether that misconduct would result in the whole case being thrown out, I don't know.

00:30:12.980 I mean, assuming it had happened, I don't know.

00:30:15.580 It depends who did it, right?

00:30:16.800 So if it was an attorney that wasn't in a position to make decisions or impact the investigation, you know, maybe their thinking is he can be walled off and the investigation can continue.

00:30:30.020 Remember, that's how they did it with Mueller, right?

00:30:31.960 You know, when it became, when they caught these guys gauging in misconduct, what did they do?

00:30:37.680 They hid it from the American people.

00:30:39.380 Right.

00:30:40.180 And then admitted later that they got rid of them and just continued doing what they were doing against Trump.

00:30:45.280 I suspect that's going to be, if indeed something went wrong, the outcome here.

00:30:49.840 Well, I would not bet a lot of money on the integrity of Boesberg, given his background.

00:30:59.440 I will hold out hope, but it's hope against the awareness of experience.

00:31:06.840 The D.C. courts, you say, have some good judges.

00:31:09.780 I say that I have seen very little in the way of impartiality on the part of what is, to me, a den of left-wing partisans on the bench there.

00:31:20.480 And a federal judiciary, frankly, that is, to me, broadly speaking, with some exceptions, it's corrupt.

00:31:27.140 Let's just be straight.

00:31:28.620 I mean, how are you going to get a fair trial in this country in this day and age?

00:31:32.240 And I'm talking about whether you're in the state trial court system or a federal court system.

00:31:38.440 Yeah, I don't see, you know, a trial going well for Trump, no matter what, here.

00:31:46.040 And the judges here don't really care much about Trump or for Trump, and that includes Republican appointees.

00:31:54.320 So he's gotten a raw deal on virtually every issue here, including, you know, he's had all of his privileges torn apart, and the Biden administration has helped that along.

00:32:06.600 It's been awful for the republic.

00:32:07.980 It's been awful.

00:32:09.100 And, you know, it's not about Trump.

00:32:10.480 You know, I like Trump personally, you know, but it's not about that.

00:32:16.700 It's about whether the rule of law is going to prevail and apply.

00:32:20.700 You know, I see, you know, Menendez, for instance, is now, did you see Senator Menendez is now in the sights of the Justice Department?

00:32:28.640 You know, I don't admire Senator Menendez.

00:32:35.360 I probably, you know, my guess is he's probably not someone, you know, I would trust to invest with any money.

00:32:41.920 But do you know who I trust less is the Justice Department?

00:32:48.000 Yeah.

00:32:48.080 And so it's not about Trump.

00:32:51.040 It's like, I don't trust this Justice Department to investigate a jaywalking claim involving a politician.

00:32:56.500 I really don't.

00:32:57.540 Well, Tom, to tell you the truth, when I saw that Menendez was under investigation with the Justice Department, I thought, what is the political motivation for that?

00:33:05.900 And what do they have in mind as a replacement for Menendez?

00:33:08.980 There had to be some ideological and power interested purpose or objective because they didn't just suddenly find a senator they wanted to go after because he violated the law.

00:33:28.240 Well, Menendez is, you know, he's a reliable leftist generally, but on some foreign policy issues, he can be a kind of a stick in the mud for the left.

00:33:36.020 He's no friend of the communists in Cuba, for instance, and they don't like him for that.

00:33:41.940 And, you know, so they're happy, you know, they're happy to let proceedings go against him.

00:33:48.140 And in the case of this current Justice Department investigation, it looks like it's a stretch, you know, just like other investigations of Republicans have been.

00:33:55.340 So my point is, it's not partisan, the concern.

00:33:59.980 The concern is these agencies operate outside the law too often when it comes to politically sensitive investigations and the rules, you know, and if powerful officials don't get the benefit of the rule of law, what about the regular Joe?

00:34:15.740 Yeah, we know the answer to that.

00:34:17.700 It's caught up.

00:34:18.580 But, you know, what I consider the great issue here is with all of the obvious blatant in our face corruption on the part of the regime, the Biden regime, the Marxist dims, the deep state, the permanent bureaucracy, the uniparty, if one prefers.

00:34:35.020 I don't see any recourse.

00:34:37.980 I see no way in which the American people can respond to perfidy, to savagery through the legal system.

00:34:50.180 It's under the control of the Marxist left, the judiciary, that is.

00:34:56.060 The federal government is under the control of them.

00:34:59.940 What in the world are the rest of us to do?

00:35:03.060 And are there enough of us to do it?

00:35:06.580 Well, you know, to come back around to the other part of our discussion, we certainly need better leadership from Congress.

00:35:12.340 And if listeners are concerned about it, they need to let their congressmen know that, you know, the FBI and the DOJ, they only operate, there's not a dollar they spend without their permission of Congress.

00:35:24.500 So every abuse that we're talking about is fully funded by Congress, despite all the noise you hear about investigations.

00:35:31.300 They give the money, and there's been no restrictions on the money.

00:35:35.060 There's been no effort, for instance, to defund Jack Smith or cut off federal funding for jurisdictions that don't protect the civil rights Americans, like New York isn't and like Fulton County isn't.

00:35:46.180 You know, that sort of creative effort to kind of at least keep the feds and our tax dollars away from that corruption.

00:35:54.200 If the Justice Department doesn't want to protect the rule of law, then the Congress can.

00:35:59.140 So there are ways to do it.

00:36:00.960 And so don't let anyone, and this is why I know you're frustrated, because you know there are ways to do it.

00:36:08.040 And it's not that hard.

00:36:09.620 It just requires a bit of will and leadership.

00:36:12.040 And to this point, no one has shown more will and leadership and courage than Congressman Jim Jordan, Congressman James Comer, the, I will call them the Brave 20, the Freedom Caucus standing up, and a handful of others.

00:36:31.900 But right now, Congressman Comer has canceled the vote to hold Chris Wray, the director of the FBI, in contempt, because, ostensibly, there was an agreement with the FBI to let all members of Oversight see a document.

00:36:47.780 And the ranking member and the chairman of the committee to see two other ancillary documents, which are footnotes, as they're called, pertaining to references in that original document, what is it, 1023, FBI document 1023.

00:37:08.420 Yeah, the smoking gun.

00:37:09.320 Your reaction to it, is this enough?

00:37:12.280 Is this a conclusion that you support?

00:37:18.320 I don't know.

00:37:19.280 I mean, I don't have the document yet, so I don't see how they get the document.

00:37:23.840 Do you see how they get the document based on what you've read?

00:37:26.460 I guess I'm looking for, you know, Grassley wants to release the document.

00:37:31.240 He can't yet, because it's not been turned over to him directly by the Justice Department or the FBI, which are one and the same here.

00:37:38.420 But it's not classified.

00:37:40.100 It's not classified.

00:37:41.080 It's not classified.

00:37:42.480 And it's information that's damaging to Biden, and they don't want the public to see it.

00:37:48.340 And I'm not seeing how this route gives the information to the public.

00:37:53.580 That's why when it becomes ripe, and meaning from the process that we've initiated, we're almost certain to sue to try to get the record.

00:38:01.620 Well, we hope you do so soon.

00:38:07.560 Godspeed as usual, Judicial Watch, because we have to turn to you way too often to do the Lord's work and honor the public's right to know in this country.

00:38:21.260 There was a time when the public was more interested in their right to know and more assertive of that right.

00:38:29.580 I hope that that day is returning. 0.79

00:38:34.660 I don't see it, but I'm hoping.

00:38:36.600 Right now, all I see is that the Constitution, this republic, our political leaders, particularly the leaders of the Republican Party, are tremulous in the face of outright corruption and an organization called the Democrat Party that is really led by Marxist Dems and mean great harm to this republic.

00:39:01.600 Tom, as always, we thank you for all of your work and that of Judicial Watch in trying to preserve those rights and this republic.

00:39:10.740 We always give our guests the last word, and Tom, if you will, your concluding remarks.

00:39:15.720 Well, we're facing a crisis with the indictments of Trump, and I would encourage all of your listeners to, to a degree they are concerned, share those concerns with members of Congress,

00:39:28.260 because things won't change unless Congress fears the public opinion and being voted out of office if they don't do the right thing.

00:39:39.860 It's difficult to overstate how important it is to communicate with your members of Congress and, of course, supporting Judicial Watch,

00:39:48.140 because, you know, for all of my desire to have Congress do the right thing, we don't rely on them to do the right thing, and that's where we come in.

00:39:55.220 And some people can go to JudicialWatch.org and support our work.

00:40:00.300 Which we encourage everyone to do.

00:40:02.920 Tom, great to have you with us, and I want to just ask you, after your health, you're feeling well and everything is good?

00:40:11.200 Yeah, I think they got it all, so knock on wood, it doesn't come back.

00:40:14.640 But, you know, as you know, with skin cancer, you just have to keep on monitoring it.

00:40:18.700 So, I'm like many millions of other Americans, you know, kind of stuck having to make sure it doesn't come back.

00:40:25.860 Well, you know, I'm of an age, as they say, where I do the same thing.

00:40:30.860 So, you know, it's a very big club, unfortunately, millions and millions of Americans.

00:40:36.360 We're delighted that you're in great shape and that you, you know, like we'll encourage everyone, don't wait.

00:40:45.880 If you think there's something that a doctor should see, head off to the doctor straight away.

00:40:52.120 Those dermatologists are amazing, amazing doctors.

00:40:55.120 That's good advice. That is good advice.

00:40:58.660 Well, we appreciate you being with us, Tom.

00:41:00.420 Thanks so much, and look forward to our next conversation.

00:41:03.260 Thank you.

00:41:03.680 Tom Fitton, Judicial Watch, a great American, and that's all for us today.

00:41:08.780 Thanks, everybody, for being with us.

00:41:10.560 Our guest here tomorrow will be Alan Dersowitz, Harvard Law Professor and author of the bestseller, Get Trump.

00:41:17.660 Please join us for that and much more.

00:41:20.200 And we thank you, God bless you, and may God bless America.

The Great America Show - June 12, 2023

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