The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #1349 - David Sinclair

00:00:03.000 David Sinclair.

00:00:05.000 Lifespan.

00:00:05.000 Why we age and why we don't have to.

00:00:08.000 I'm so happy there are people like you out there because I don't want to age.

00:00:12.000 I'm aging, clearly, but I'm not interested in it.

00:00:15.000 I don't like it.

00:00:17.000 Yeah, well, I don't know anybody who does.

00:00:19.000 Joe Rogan, thanks for having me back on Thanks for coming back.

00:00:21.000 The first one was a smash hit, man.

00:00:23.000 People loved it.

00:00:41.000 The use of metformin, DHEA, and was there something else as well that was taking two years...

00:00:49.000 Human growth hormone.

00:00:50.000 Taking two years, two biological years off of people's lives in terms of their age, which are naturally...

00:00:57.000 I'm 52. It would make me 50. Right.

00:01:00.000 Even 49.5 according to the study.

00:01:02.000 That's what I'm looking for.

00:01:03.000 Yeah, that was a good study.

00:01:06.000 You know, it's only nine people, so we have to repeat this.

00:01:10.000 Were they studs?

00:01:11.000 Did you get like nine super athletes?

00:01:13.000 Or did you get like schmoes that don't exercise? 1.00

00:01:16.000 As far as I know, these were just regular...

00:01:18.000 Schmoes? 1.00

00:01:19.000 Schmoes, yeah. 1.00

00:01:20.000 Which is good news for schmoes like me.

00:01:22.000 Yes, good news.

00:01:23.000 Yeah, I mean, that's what you want.

00:01:25.000 Some people just respond better.

00:01:27.000 They have super bodies, you know?

00:01:29.000 The great thing about that study is, first of all, I was with the main author on that paper while it came out.

00:01:36.000 I was over in Israel as part of my journey up the Great Rift of Africa.

00:01:40.000 I ended up in Israel.

00:01:41.000 Anyway, the guy there, Steve Horvath is his name.

00:01:45.000 He and I and a couple of other guys are trying to figure out not just why we age, why we don't have to, but...

00:01:52.000 Is aging truly reversible?

00:01:55.000 And that's what this study suggests, is that it's not just about slowing down aging, but one day we could be 80, but biologically, 30. Now, when we're talking about the biological age, How is that measured?

00:02:10.000 Is this measured by the length of the telomeres?

00:02:12.000 Is this measured by physical performance?

00:02:14.000 Is it measured by a combination of these factors?

00:02:16.000 It's none of that.

00:02:18.000 It's something brand new.

00:02:19.000 Most people don't know about it.

00:02:20.000 So it's called the Horvath clock.

00:02:22.000 And what Horvath and others have discovered is that if you read the DNA, and you don't just look at the letters, A-C-T-G, if you look at what's on the letter C, cytosine is called, There are chemical modifications, and those chemicals change as we get older in very linear and predictable ways.

00:02:41.000 And if you use a computer, AI, you can say, if I took your blood sample right now, I could read your DNA, look at those chemical groups on the seas, and I could say, you are, okay, you're 52, you might be 46 according to that clock, and also I could predict when you're going to die.

00:02:58.000 Whoa! 0.71

00:02:59.000 Scary thought, right?

00:03:00.000 Yeah, like a fortune teller.

00:03:01.000 Yeah, but the good news is, now that we know what's not just measuring aging, we actually think that clock is part of the aging process, we're learning how to reverse it too.

00:03:11.000 Hmm.

00:03:12.000 Now, is this just one modality, this combination of growth hormone?

00:03:19.000 Is this one way of going about it?

00:03:22.000 Are there other ways of going about it?

00:03:23.000 Growth hormone, DHEA, metformin, is there anything else?

00:03:27.000 Well, that's the first that's ever been shown to really reverse.

00:03:29.000 Just those three things?

00:03:30.000 But I'm sure there's going to be many more discovered.

00:03:32.000 We've only had this Horvath clock over the last few years in humans being used widely.

00:03:38.000 But I think as we use this clock, we're going to figure out that a whole bunch of stuff that we do and things that we can do and combine will not just slow aging but reverse it.

00:03:48.000 And not just by two and a half years.

00:03:50.000 Eventually, and some of the technology that I talk about in my book, we think could turn the clock back by a decade or more.

00:03:57.000 Whoa.

00:03:57.000 Now, what things are you talking about that could possibly turn it back a decade or more?

00:04:03.000 And who do I have to blow?

00:04:05.000 Sorry. 0.79

00:04:07.000 Yeah, you can blow me, but...

00:04:09.000 Yeah, you may have to do it a few times.

00:04:13.000 But the amazing thing about where we are now today with aging, and we're right on the cutting edge, so it's great to be able to share this with your listeners, is this clock changes on the DNA, right?

00:04:27.000 What I'm saying in my theory of aging is that it's not the DNA that we lose.

00:04:34.000 That's the old theory, you know, the old idea that antioxidants hurt the DNA. Just throw that out for a while, maybe forever.

00:04:41.000 What I think is going on is that the DNA is getting modified and the cell can't read the DNA the way it used to.

00:04:49.000 That's really important.

00:04:50.000 And so the clock is not just a clock.

00:04:52.000 It's not a clock on the wall.

00:04:54.000 It's also, if you move the hands of the clock, time changes.

00:04:58.000 That's what I think is going on.

00:04:59.000 Can we pause right here for a moment and explain what you were saying about antioxidants?

00:05:04.000 Well, antioxidants have been the biggest disappointment in the aging field.

00:05:08.000 It doesn't stop, you know, 40 million people every day buying drinks with antioxidants in them.

00:05:13.000 But antioxidants have, with very few exceptions, failed to extend the lifespan of any organism.

00:05:20.000 But you are a proponent of resveratrol, at least you used to be.

00:05:24.000 Are you still?

00:05:24.000 I still take it, and we still study it in my lab.

00:05:27.000 But you brought this up.

00:05:30.000 It's really important.

00:05:31.000 Resveratrol was originally thought to be an antioxidant, and it is a mild antioxidant.

00:05:35.000 But the way it really works, and we know this is a fact from my lab, is that it's stimulating the body's defenses against aging and disease because it's binding to these enzymes that we work on called sirtuins, and these are the defenders of the body.

00:05:50.000 And you were saying, if I remember correctly, you take resveratrol, you take a powdered form, I actually bought exactly what you take, and you mix it with yogurt in the morning?

00:05:59.000 Is that how you do it?

00:06:01.000 Yep, a teaspoon.

00:06:02.000 What's the dose that you take?

00:06:03.000 Well, it probably comes out to about a gram in the morning.

00:06:06.000 A gram?

00:06:07.000 Yeah.

00:06:07.000 Okay, so if someone's taking capsules...

00:06:11.000 Well, it depends.

00:06:12.000 Probably capsules are 250 milligrams.

00:06:14.000 That'd be four in the morning.

00:06:15.000 Okay, so you take four.

00:06:16.000 Yeah, you know, I'm still alive, so that's a good sign.

00:06:19.000 You look good.

00:06:19.000 Oh, thank you.

00:06:21.000 Is it important to take it with fats?

00:06:24.000 Is that why you take it with yogurt?

00:06:26.000 Yeah.

00:06:27.000 Yeah, either high protein, which is, you know, Greek yogurt suffices, or fat.

00:06:33.000 But water, it's like brick dust.

00:06:35.000 It won't dissolve and it won't be absorbed.

00:06:37.000 Okay.

00:06:37.000 A glass of whole milk, maybe, would be okay?

00:06:39.000 Yeah, that's great.

00:06:40.000 But it has to have something to bind to?

00:06:42.000 Is that the deal?

00:06:42.000 For sure.

00:06:43.000 Yeah, in our studies, in humans and in mice, if we didn't give them high-fat food, it barely got in.

00:06:48.000 It was five-fold less.

00:06:49.000 Now, this study of metformin, DHEA, and human growth hormone does not include NMN. Right.

00:07:00.000 But NMN is also effective.

00:07:03.000 Well, let's delve in a little bit.

00:07:05.000 Please.

00:07:05.000 If you read the paper, and I have, it turns out one of the effects of this treatment was the reduction in the levels of a protein called CD38. CD38 resides on immune cells, and it goes up as we get older.

00:07:21.000 And what they found, one of the biggest effects of the treatment was the levels of this CD38 protein went down.

00:07:28.000 So what is the CD38? This is the main enzyme in our bodies that degrades NAD. NAD is required for the sirtuin defenders to work.

00:07:37.000 So one possibility is that, and I'm sure it's complicated, but one way this could be working is by allowing your body to make NAD and store it rather than degrading it as we get older.

00:07:48.000 Interesting.

00:07:49.000 So would supplementing with NMN, which is a form of NAD, correct?

00:07:56.000 A precursor, yeah.

00:07:57.000 Precursor.

00:07:58.000 Would that enhance the effects, do you believe?

00:08:02.000 Like if they tried to do a new study?

00:08:04.000 It could.

00:08:05.000 Could?

00:08:05.000 It could.

00:08:06.000 Potentially.

00:08:06.000 Each of these patients cost $10,000 for the treatment, so it's not easy to do these studies.

00:08:11.000 $10,000 for the entirety of the treatment, and the treatment lasted how long?

00:08:17.000 I don't remember how long they treated the patients for.

00:08:21.000 But I do know that it wasn't cheap.

00:08:24.000 That's why they only did nine.

00:08:25.000 Because at first I said to my friend Steve Horvath, nine patients, are you kidding me?

00:08:29.000 Why didn't you do 50?

00:08:30.000 And I went, well, we didn't have the money.

00:08:32.000 That's the problem.

00:08:33.000 Anyway, my point really is that we need to test a lot of different combinations.

00:08:38.000 Include anemone, include, there's one called rapamycin, which is a little bit more risky and toxic, but there are better molecules in development.

00:08:45.000 The question is what is the best combination and do you use it with exercise and fasting or is it bad to combine them all together?

00:08:52.000 We don't know yet.

00:08:54.000 That's a good question too that I wanted to ask you because one of the things that came out of the podcast was input from some other people that I know that are nutrition experts and performance experts that were skeptical about metformin and they were saying that metformin, although it may have an anti-aging effect,

00:09:10.000 it actually decreases physical performance in athletes.

00:09:14.000 Well, there is a study that shows that.

00:09:16.000 And resveratrol, too, actually, can prevent the great gains from hard exercise.

00:09:23.000 So here's the solution that I think is worth trying, a solution.

00:09:27.000 And that is a theme that I have in my book and in my research.

00:09:31.000 And that is, we don't want to be doing everything every day, necessarily.

00:09:35.000 We want to pulse it.

00:09:36.000 We want to shock the body and let it recover.

00:09:38.000 We know that you can't just exercise.

00:09:40.000 I mean, some people have been on this show, run 100 miles every weekend.

00:09:45.000 Generally you want to hit it hard and let it recover.

00:09:47.000 Hit it hard and let it recover.

00:09:48.000 So what I am planning to do and actually started doing is on days that I'm exercising and recovering I don't take metformin.

00:09:55.000 And then when I'm just sitting around or on a plane I do.

00:09:57.000 And that way I think that my body can have the best of both worlds.

00:10:00.000 So when you are not exercising and you take it, you feel like it doesn't have a hit when you are exercising and not taking it?

00:10:10.000 So somehow or another, whatever performance hit it has, it's temporary?

00:10:15.000 Yeah, right.

00:10:16.000 This is all just theoretical.

00:10:19.000 It is.

00:10:19.000 We're right on the cutting edge of human knowledge.

00:10:21.000 We don't actually know what the best thing is.

00:10:23.000 But my best guess is that we want to allow the body to recover, so I don't take metformin on those days, rather than taking metformin every day like a diabetic would.

00:10:33.000 What's the hit?

00:10:35.000 What is happening?

00:10:36.000 What's the mechanism behind the performance hit from taking metformin?

00:10:40.000 Oh, we don't know.

00:10:41.000 But I can tell you the best explanation that I can give you.

00:10:46.000 So metformin is a derivative of a plant molecule, the French lilac.

00:10:51.000 So it's not a crazy molecule.

00:10:52.000 It's pretty natural.

00:10:53.000 But what it does is many things in the body.

00:10:56.000 Scientists will quite annoyingly argue about it.

00:10:59.000 They have for the past 40 years.

00:11:02.000 So there's no correct answer.

00:11:03.000 But what I think is going on is that metformin is interfering with the mitochondria in the cell.

00:11:09.000 Mitochondria, we call them battery packs.

00:11:11.000 They're basically making chemical energy.

00:11:13.000 Without that chemical energy, we'd be dead in about 20 seconds.

00:11:16.000 So we need that for life.

00:11:18.000 So metformin interrupts that energy production in the mitochondria.

00:11:22.000 But you need the mitochondria to amplify after you've exercised.

00:11:26.000 So they're antagonizing each other.

00:11:29.000 So why does metformin work?

00:11:31.000 By inhibiting the mitochondria, the body gets a signal that it doesn't have enough chemical energy.

00:11:36.000 It's not making enough.

00:11:37.000 So it expands the number of mitochondria.

00:11:39.000 These are ancient remnants of bacteria that entered our cells.

00:11:43.000 And we have less if we sit around, like we are now, and we have more if we exercise.

00:11:48.000 And metformin, by telling the body, shit, we're running out of energy, the body responds and makes more mitochondria, just like exercise does. 0.81

00:11:55.000 But I think if you're taking metformin and exercising, that inhibition is preventing the benefits somehow of what you get with exercise. 0.96

00:12:05.000 Preventing it how so?

00:12:06.000 What studies have been done and what did they reveal?

00:12:10.000 I don't remember the precise details of the study.

00:12:13.000 It was giving metformin every day to people who were in a controlled exercise.

00:12:18.000 I think it was treadmill a few times a week.

00:12:22.000 But then what they measured was the mitochondrial benefit.

00:12:26.000 And I think they measured a bit of strength.

00:12:28.000 It's so confusing that there's a mitochondrial benefit but a performance hit.

00:12:33.000 Well, no.

00:12:34.000 Actually, metformin prevented the mitochondria from amplifying up.

00:12:38.000 Oh.

00:12:39.000 So it must be interfering with the signal that you get from exercise, whatever that is.

00:12:45.000 We don't know exactly what that is. 0.97

00:12:49.000 So you'd really have to be some sort of a guinea pig to try to fuck with this stuff, to go back and forth from taking it and exercising, not taking it and exercising. 0.99

00:12:58.000 Yeah, I'm one of those guinea pigs. 0.99

00:13:02.000 No disrespect, but how hard are you working out?

00:13:05.000 Not enough.

00:13:06.000 Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

00:13:07.000 I spend three hours a week in the gym.

00:13:10.000 That's not bad.

00:13:11.000 It's all in one day.

00:13:12.000 That's maintenance.

00:13:12.000 Oh, one day?

00:13:13.000 Yeah.

00:13:13.000 Really?

00:13:14.000 One day, three hours?

00:13:15.000 Yeah, that's it. 0.99

00:13:16.000 That's ridiculous. 0.98

00:13:17.000 Why are you doing it that way? 0.99

00:13:18.000 Because I'm a smart.

00:13:18.000 But you're so smart.

00:13:20.000 That drives me crazy when smart people do dumb shit. 1.00

00:13:23.000 Like I had Peter Hotez on the podcast, who's a brilliant man from the University of Texas. 1.00

00:13:28.000 He's a researcher in tropical diseases and is obsessed with diseases and the importance of vaccination, all these different things.

00:13:37.000 Then he's talking about how his diet is terrible.

00:13:40.000 He eats junk food. 1.00

00:13:41.000 He's constantly eating Jack in the Box and shit. 1.00

00:13:42.000 I'm like, what the fuck, man? 1.00

00:13:43.000 You're so smart and you're a guy who works on diseases. 1.00

00:13:47.000 What's the number one cause of diseases? 0.88

00:13:50.000 Yeah, I don't get that.

00:13:51.000 Some of my colleagues eat the worst food and they study longevity. 0.78

00:13:54.000 Crazy!

00:13:55.000 It's crazy!

00:13:56.000 It's like they can't help their impulses.

00:13:58.000 It's like there's so many people like that that are obsessed with various aspects of health or performance, but they just can't get it together.

00:14:07.000 Well, I would work out more if I had time.

00:14:09.000 I'm usually working till midnight and after that I'm not really keen to go to the gym.

00:14:13.000 Yes, you do have an excuse.

00:14:14.000 You have a crazy work schedule.

00:14:15.000 You do have an excuse.

00:14:17.000 Yeah.

00:14:17.000 Well, I'm on planes for a bit, so I try to exercise on the planes pretty hard.

00:14:21.000 Do you really?

00:14:21.000 What do you do?

00:14:23.000 I stretch.

00:14:23.000 You go to the bathroom and do squats?

00:14:26.000 So nobody thinks you're crazy?

00:14:28.000 Yeah. 0.88

00:14:28.000 You guys got to pee a lot or you're doing blow in there or something. 0.88

00:14:30.000 Yeah, I haven't done exercise for a while.

00:14:32.000 People think you're in there doing meth.

00:14:34.000 Yeah, doing something in there.

00:14:35.000 Squats.

00:14:38.000 Yeah.

00:14:38.000 So what do you do when you work out?

00:14:41.000 I lift weights for an hour, then do a fair bit of stretching, and then I actually do some hot and cold treatment.

00:14:48.000 Oh, okay.

00:14:49.000 Yeah.

00:14:49.000 You remember we did the cryotherapy last time?

00:14:51.000 Yes.

00:14:51.000 Yeah, that was fantastic.

00:14:52.000 Yeah, you want to do it again?

00:14:53.000 Today, if you have time.

00:14:54.000 Yes, I do.

00:14:55.000 Oh, fantastic.

00:14:55.000 I'm in.

00:14:56.000 Yeah, I was planning on doing it today.

00:14:57.000 I did hot yoga earlier, so I like to do hot yoga in the morning and then cryo after a podcast.

00:15:04.000 That's how I like to do it.

00:15:05.000 All right, let's do it.

00:15:06.000 I don't have a cryo handy at my place, but I do the sauna and then the cold tub.

00:15:12.000 You should get a cryo set up.

00:15:14.000 They're not that expensive.

00:15:15.000 You can get one.

00:15:16.000 What about these infrared boxes?

00:15:18.000 Are they any good?

00:15:18.000 Oh, for saunas?

00:15:20.000 I do not know, but some people swear by them.

00:15:24.000 Laird Hamilton, who we're talking about earlier.

00:15:26.000 By the way, how good is that coffee?

00:15:27.000 It's fantastic.

00:15:28.000 Laird Hamilton, superfood coffee.

00:15:30.000 Whoa, we'll get you more.

00:15:32.000 Oh, Jeff is going off to pick up our Pablo Escobar mugshot picture.

00:15:37.000 I'm obsessed with mugshots for some strange reason.

00:15:40.000 Always collecting new mugshot pictures.

00:15:42.000 We've got a giant Pablo Escobar.

00:15:44.000 It's very nice.

00:15:47.000 The Laird Hamilton stuff, that's got turmeric, it's got coconut milk, it's organic coffee.

00:15:54.000 I'm so addicted to it.

00:15:56.000 I drink that stuff like water.

00:15:57.000 Yeah, I'm going to have to get myself some.

00:15:59.000 Yeah, it's delicious.

00:15:59.000 You don't need a machine either.

00:16:01.000 You can mix it yourself.

00:16:02.000 He has all the stuff.

00:16:03.000 You can just pour it into coffee.

00:16:04.000 Yeah.

00:16:04.000 I mean, he's a hero of mine.

00:16:06.000 He's a stud.

00:16:07.000 What is he, he's 50-something now?

00:16:08.000 He's a thousand years old. 0.99

00:16:10.000 Guy runs mountains, fucking surfs things as tall as the Empire State Building. 0.99

00:16:14.000 He's a very interesting character. 0.96

00:16:17.000 The last I saw him, I was watching something on Instagram, and I saw him in a sauna with oven mitts on, riding a bike, like one of those... 0.98

00:16:28.000 Echo bikes, like those rogue, you know, those aerosol bikes, riding one of those fucking things in a sauna. 0.98

00:16:34.000 I was doing his sauna routine. 0.99

00:16:35.000 I did not like it.

00:16:37.000 I was cranking the sauna up to 220 degrees, and I think I cooked my lungs a little bit.

00:16:43.000 Not bad, but people who listened to the podcast afterwards, my apologies, because I was coughing like that for like...

00:16:51.000 Four or five episodes! 1.00

00:16:53.000 And then I had decided, okay, this is fucking stupid. 1.00

00:16:56.000 Like, I don't think this is good for me. 1.00

00:16:57.000 Right.

00:16:58.000 Well, you know hormesis.

00:16:59.000 Yes.

00:16:59.000 What doesn't kill you makes you live longer.

00:17:01.000 That's not exactly true.

00:17:03.000 You can push it a little too far sometimes.

00:17:04.000 Yeah, how about booze?

00:17:06.000 Booze doesn't kill you, but it definitely doesn't make you live longer.

00:17:08.000 That is true. 1.00

00:17:09.000 If you drink hard every night, you look like shit. 1.00

00:17:11.000 If you look at two people, one that drinks hard and their brother who just drinks water and runs all the time, boy, that water-drinking guy looks fucking fantastic, doesn't he? 1.00

00:17:21.000 In comparison? 0.81

00:17:23.000 Well, yeah.

00:17:23.000 That's probably another one of my vices.

00:17:25.000 I've got to lay off the alcohol.

00:17:26.000 Booze?

00:17:26.000 Yeah.

00:17:27.000 Well, how much do you drink?

00:17:29.000 I probably have one or two a day.

00:17:31.000 When I'm on vacation like you, I overdo it.

00:17:33.000 I just got back from vacation.

00:17:34.000 My body's way out of shape.

00:17:36.000 Yeah, I get fat on vacation, man.

00:17:38.000 Last time I was on vacation, I was doing this.

00:17:39.000 I was grabbing my sides.

00:17:40.000 I was in Italy.

00:17:42.000 I went hard...

00:17:44.000 I was drinking wine every night.

00:17:45.000 I was drinking about a half a bottle of wine every night.

00:17:47.000 I was eating pasta all day long. 1.00

00:17:49.000 But when I'm on vacation, I just go, fuck it. 1.00

00:17:53.000 And also, it kind of gives me a little project when I come back. 1.00

00:17:57.000 You know?

00:17:57.000 Like, alright, now it's time to get serious.

00:17:59.000 Right, right.

00:18:00.000 Well, look...

00:18:01.000 I was in Africa recently, and I've got to tell you, when you see a wildebeest get attacked and chewed on for 45 minutes by a crocodile, nothing better than going back to the camp and having a beer to calm down.

00:18:15.000 So I did a lot of that.

00:18:17.000 So when you were on safari, are you in one of those open jeep deals?

00:18:24.000 Yeah, a lot of that.

00:18:25.000 We did also some hiking.

00:18:26.000 We had Maasai leaders that would go out with a federal officer with a gun to protect us.

00:18:32.000 Oh, Christ.

00:18:33.000 Oh, it was fun.

00:18:33.000 It's so different than being in a jeep to walk among the cats.

00:18:37.000 Oh, yeah, man.

00:18:38.000 For sure. 0.87

00:18:39.000 You're almost dead. 0.95

00:18:40.000 Yeah.

00:18:40.000 It's like you're right there.

00:18:41.000 You feel like you're alive.

00:18:42.000 You know how you get the feeling of what it was like to be an early human.

00:18:46.000 I've never encountered anything other than bears in the woods that are terrifying.

00:18:51.000 I've never seen a mountain lion while hunting.

00:18:54.000 I've only seen two mountain lions ever.

00:18:56.000 One was from my back porch in Colorado, and one was in the street in Santa Barbara.

00:19:02.000 I was driving, and I saw one run across the street.

00:19:04.000 I didn't realize it was a mountain lion until I saw the tail. 1.00

00:19:07.000 I was like, oh, shit! 0.99

00:19:08.000 I thought it was a coyote or something, and then I saw that long tail. 0.99

00:19:12.000 But while hunting, the only thing I've ever seen is a grizzly bear.

00:19:16.000 I saw a grizzly bear once.

00:19:17.000 I've seen black bears.

00:19:19.000 Black bears are unnerving.

00:19:21.000 Grizzly bears are terrifying.

00:19:22.000 They look at you like this.

00:19:24.000 You could shoot at them and they'll still come. 0.99

00:19:25.000 They just look right through you. 1.00

00:19:26.000 They look like, am I eating you?

00:19:28.000 What's going on with you?

00:19:28.000 Am I going to eat you?

00:19:30.000 Black bears are like, should I get out of here?

00:19:33.000 Should I run?

00:19:34.000 Am I the boss or are you the boss?

00:19:35.000 They're not sure. 0.99

00:19:37.000 Grizzly bears are fucking sure they're the boss. 0.99

00:19:39.000 They're just trying to figure out whether or not they should eat you. 0.99

00:19:42.000 Right.

00:19:42.000 And actually, one of the things you realize when you're amongst these animals, it's a huge privilege for us to go for a walk without getting eaten.

00:19:49.000 Yes.

00:19:49.000 Yeah.

00:19:50.000 We don't think about it that way because we're so used to being in parks and, oh, I'm out in nature. 1.00

00:19:55.000 The fuck you are. 1.00

00:19:56.000 You're not really in nature. 1.00

00:19:57.000 You're in some weird sort of nature preserve that we've sort of set up inside cities.

00:20:02.000 Right.

00:20:02.000 And people ask me about my work.

00:20:04.000 Oh, isn't what you're doing unnatural? 1.00

00:20:06.000 Fuck natural. 1.00

00:20:07.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:20:08.000 What about our world is natural anyway?

00:20:09.000 Brushing your teeth isn't natural either. 1.00

00:20:11.000 Stupid. 1.00

00:20:11.000 Right. 1.00

00:20:12.000 You're born with a toothbrush in your hand? 1.00

00:20:14.000 Shut up. 1.00

00:20:14.000 Right, right. 1.00

00:20:15.000 So dumb. 1.00

00:20:15.000 I flew over here. 1.00

00:20:16.000 What?

00:20:16.000 At 30,000 feet, drinking a cocktail, surfing the internet.

00:20:20.000 Not so natural.

00:20:21.000 None of that's natural.

00:20:23.000 You're getting bombarded by solar radiation.

00:20:25.000 You're boozing it up.

00:20:27.000 You're also somehow or another online.

00:20:30.000 No way that anybody's ever going to be able to explain to me that my puny brain's going to understand.

00:20:34.000 Right.

00:20:34.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:20:35.000 Well, yeah, don't give me the argument that aging is natural, therefore it's acceptable.

00:20:39.000 I don't buy any of those natural things because everything on Earth is natural, even chemicals.

00:20:44.000 We're not getting them from the stars.

00:20:46.000 We're not pulling them out of other dimensions.

00:20:48.000 Like, what are you talking about?

00:20:49.000 It's all from Earth.

00:20:50.000 Everything.

00:20:51.000 Right.

00:20:51.000 Even pharmaceuticals, most of them are derived from plants.

00:20:54.000 Sure.

00:20:54.000 In Africa, I was hanging out with the Batwa tribe.

00:20:57.000 These are the pygmies. 1.00

00:20:58.000 They used to be in the forest, and I had the chief take me through the forest, and he was showing me all the drugs they used to take.

00:21:04.000 There's this clostidinium, I think I'm saying it right.

00:21:07.000 It was a leaf they used to chew on.

00:21:09.000 They'd smoke a bit of weed.

00:21:10.000 They'd go a little dizzy.

00:21:11.000 They'd crouch down.

00:21:12.000 After about 15 minutes, they'd stand up, and they felt invincible. 0.97

00:21:16.000 They'd go kill one of those elephants in the jungle. 0.98

00:21:18.000 Jesus.

00:21:19.000 Pygmies killed elephants?

00:21:21.000 Yeah, mini elephants.

00:21:22.000 Oh, the smaller elephants.

00:21:23.000 Yeah, but now they can't.

00:21:24.000 Because they're smaller people.

00:21:25.000 Right, it's all mini out there.

00:21:26.000 They can't anymore?

00:21:27.000 Except for the worms.

00:21:27.000 The worms were about this long.

00:21:29.000 My buddy Justin Wren, we're a big supporter of Fight for the Forgotten charity.

00:21:33.000 It's a charity that my friend Justin Wren set up and they build wells for the pygmies in the Congo. 1.00

00:21:38.000 And through this application called the Cash App, and I personally donated to, and we also, we're doing benefits for them.

00:21:45.000 We're doing a big benefit in LA coming up soon, that'll be announcing soon.

00:21:49.000 But he goes over there all the time, and he's had malaria three times.

00:21:55.000 And just recently has acquired some unknown parasite that is just devastating his health.

00:22:04.000 He's trying to figure out what it is.

00:22:06.000 So he's got to go through a battery of tests and they've got to, you know, examine him.

00:22:09.000 But the next time he goes over there, apparently he's going to bring his own food. 0.98

00:22:13.000 But, I mean, the fucking poor guy's got malaria three times. 0.98

00:22:17.000 Yeah, well, he should be taking his medicine more often, I think. 0.99

00:22:20.000 Well, no, it recurs.

00:22:21.000 Does it really?

00:22:22.000 No, because you can't get rid of it.

00:22:23.000 Well, it becomes systemic.

00:22:25.000 Right.

00:22:25.000 It's horrific, man.

00:22:27.000 I mean, the way he describes it.

00:22:28.000 And he's a gorilla. 1.00

00:22:30.000 I mean, a fucking gorilla. 1.00

00:22:32.000 He's a huge man. 1.00

00:22:33.000 He fights for Bellator.

00:22:34.000 He's one of their heavyweight contenders.

00:22:37.000 So he's this, you know, 250-pound stud of a guy who goes over there and catches these horrific diseases and just, like, barely survives.

00:22:46.000 Right.

00:22:47.000 And gets the medication and comes back.

00:22:49.000 But then when he gets sick, sometimes it'll kick back in again.

00:22:51.000 It's kicked back in twice.

00:22:53.000 Another reason you don't want to go back to natural way of life.

00:22:55.000 But you're a good man, Joe, for supporting the pygmies. 1.00

00:22:59.000 Oh. 1.00

00:22:59.000 Justin is such a fucking angel. 1.00

00:23:02.000 When you talk to him and you see his documentaries that he's put out and his films that they've done with Waterfor and now just with his organization Fight for the Forgotten, you can't help but help. 0.99

00:23:12.000 Oh, gosh.

00:23:13.000 I was on the Ugandan side of the volcano rift and...

00:23:16.000 The way they live was just shocking.

00:23:19.000 And we're going to help rebuild a school for them, but they need help.

00:23:23.000 And they're right on the edge of civilization.

00:23:25.000 The Batwa tribe, the pygmies, are in the worst situation than anybody. 1.00

00:23:29.000 And they're the lowest of the low.

00:23:32.000 They're picked on racially.

00:23:33.000 They were kicked off their land to save the gorillas and these elephants.

00:23:37.000 And they don't know what to do.

00:23:40.000 Everything they knew how to live is gone.

00:23:42.000 Isn't that crazy?

00:23:43.000 They're kicked off their land to save animals.

00:23:45.000 Yeah, but there's no way out.

00:23:49.000 You've got to do that.

00:23:50.000 Well, isn't there a way to not kill the animals and have them all coexist?

00:23:55.000 I guess you could have kept them.

00:23:57.000 It's a national park, so you can't easily have humans living in the national park.

00:24:01.000 I suppose you could, but they are trying to modernize them.

00:24:05.000 So they put them on this small few acres of land, which they're trying to learn how to farm.

00:24:09.000 And the way they subsist is through tourism.

00:24:12.000 So I would recommend anyone who's interested, go see them, support them, buy a lot of stuff.

00:24:18.000 I think we brought up a quarter of the village.

00:24:19.000 They love that.

00:24:20.000 But we're going to go back and do something meaningful.

00:24:23.000 That's awesome.

00:24:24.000 That's awesome.

00:24:26.000 Natural.

00:24:27.000 So we got off sidetracked.

00:24:29.000 So you were in Africa, which is the most realistic environment.

00:24:35.000 I mean, if you want to really know what nature is all about, you were in the most realistic environment.

00:24:39.000 It's all tooth, fang, and claw.

00:24:41.000 It's like whatever survives, survives, and whatever doesn't becomes food, and there's just this constant cycle going on, and you're walking around.

00:24:51.000 Yeah.

00:24:51.000 Were you walking when you saw the crocodile eat the wildebeest?

00:24:54.000 No.

00:24:55.000 You're in the jeep.

00:24:56.000 I was in the jeep for that.

00:24:57.000 How does a jeep thing work?

00:24:59.000 Why don't they just jump in the jeep?

00:25:00.000 I don't understand that.

00:25:02.000 Good question, and I asked myself that as they were walking by.

00:25:06.000 Same with the gorillas. 0.98

00:25:07.000 They've been habituated to humans.

00:25:09.000 They literally don't even see the jeep.

00:25:12.000 Well, the gorillas don't... 0.99

00:25:13.000 They're not aggressive unless they think you're a threat.

00:25:17.000 They don't eat meat.

00:25:18.000 They're just eating plants all day.

00:25:19.000 Yeah, they're still pretty dangerous.

00:25:21.000 One swipe from a gorilla.

00:25:22.000 Oh my god.

00:25:23.000 Greyback, silverback.

00:25:25.000 Yeah, it's interesting that the Jeeps have been around for so long, they just go under the Jeep.

00:25:30.000 They're going under?

00:25:32.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:25:33.000 It's as though the Jeeps aren't there.

00:25:34.000 You might have six Jeeps looking.

00:25:35.000 We saw some lions rip apart an Impala right in front of us.

00:25:40.000 And they're just going about their daily lives.

00:25:42.000 Did you see it catch it?

00:25:44.000 Just missed that.

00:25:45.000 We saw them running away. 0.99

00:25:47.000 God, if I saw them running in real life, I'd shit my pants. 0.58

00:25:51.000 Well, they were running towards our camp, so we were running the other way. 0.79

00:25:55.000 I heard a horrible story about these people that were on safari camp, and this person went to use the bathroom in the middle of the night.

00:26:02.000 Apparently, you know, there's cabins, and you have to leave the cabin to go to the bathroom.

00:26:06.000 And the cats went in the bathroom and got them and dragged them out. 0.91

00:26:11.000 You're kidding.

00:26:11.000 No.

00:26:12.000 That's the worst way to go.

00:26:14.000 Yeah.

00:26:15.000 It's the hyenas you've got to watch out for because they'll actually eat you alive. 1.00

00:26:18.000 Oh, fuck. 1.00

00:26:19.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:26:19.000 The locals don't like the hyenas. 1.00

00:26:21.000 They don't have respect.

00:26:22.000 Any animal that eats another animal while it's still screaming.

00:26:24.000 Oh, yeah. 0.99

00:26:25.000 They don't give a fuck. 1.00

00:26:25.000 They don't try to kill you. 1.00

00:26:26.000 They just eat.

00:26:28.000 Yeah, that wildebeest had a broken leg.

00:26:29.000 It got away from the croc, but it's bushmeat at that point.

00:26:34.000 Yeah.

00:26:34.000 But there were people in the jeep, some other Americans, cheering.

00:26:38.000 It was like a sport for them.

00:26:39.000 Oh, no.

00:26:40.000 I didn't appreciate that. 1.00

00:26:41.000 Fucking Americans. 1.00

00:26:41.000 It was a solemn moment. 1.00

00:26:43.000 This animal's going to die, and they're like, woo-hoo!

00:26:46.000 Ew.

00:26:46.000 Guys must be men, right?

00:26:49.000 It was mixed.

00:26:50.000 If it was girls, I'd be super concerned. 1.00

00:26:53.000 I think it was a few. 1.00

00:26:55.000 If girls were cheering, yeah, fuck him! 1.00

00:26:58.000 Might have been. 1.00

00:26:59.000 I think it was the guys cheering, but they were chasing this poor animal.

00:27:02.000 Its hoof had been broken off, and it was running on a broken leg, and they were chasing it.

00:27:07.000 The people were?

00:27:08.000 The jeep, and the people in the back of the jeep.

00:27:11.000 Yeah, my kids were with me.

00:27:12.000 They were screaming and crying.

00:27:14.000 It was emotional.

00:27:15.000 I don't want to see that.

00:27:16.000 Yeah, I've never seen anything take anything out in the real world.

00:27:21.000 It's shocking.

00:27:21.000 You can see it on BBC or whatever as much as you want, but when you see it live...

00:27:26.000 My friend Johnny Hamilton, he works at a ranch in Colorado.

00:27:30.000 Shout out to Johnny.

00:27:30.000 He was following the trail of this gigantic elk.

00:27:35.000 They'd seen all these footsteps, and then they'd seen mountain lion footsteps.

00:27:39.000 And then there was no more mountain lion footsteps.

00:27:42.000 And then they followed it about 100 yards or so and they found the cat on top of the elk.

00:27:49.000 It had jumped on the elk's back and killed the elk.

00:27:54.000 It's a 150 pound cat, a 900 pound elk, a big bull.

00:27:59.000 Yeah.

00:28:18.000 And at some point, they just can't chew anymore, so they have to find really soft stuff.

00:28:21.000 Eventually, they die.

00:28:22.000 And that gives rise to this legend that there's this graveyard for elephants.

00:28:27.000 It's not a graveyard.

00:28:27.000 It's just where the soft food is.

00:28:29.000 But I was thinking, if elephants had technology, they could easily solve aging.

00:28:32.000 They'd just get dentures and leave them alone. 0.99

00:28:33.000 Yeah, why can't we just trank them and give them some implants? 1.00

00:28:37.000 Yeah.

00:28:38.000 They do it with people, right?

00:28:39.000 I think in the zoo they might do something like that.

00:28:41.000 Do they?

00:28:42.000 They do it with dogs.

00:28:44.000 My teeth rebuilt.

00:28:45.000 They were wearing out.

00:28:46.000 Yeah.

00:28:46.000 I've seen that before with people.

00:28:48.000 It's cool.

00:28:49.000 It made sense.

00:28:50.000 They fixed my daughter's teeth. 0.99

00:28:51.000 But I said to the dentist, I know we're changing the topic here, but it's funny.

00:28:55.000 I said to the dentist, can you fix my teeth?

00:28:57.000 You just did my daughter.

00:28:58.000 They went, oh no, you're almost 50. We don't fix teeth at 50. Excuse me?

00:29:03.000 Do it!

00:29:04.000 Because they feel like you're on your way out.

00:29:05.000 Exactly.

00:29:06.000 Yeah.

00:29:06.000 Someone said that to me in terms of meniscus.

00:29:10.000 I had a meniscus tear.

00:29:11.000 And they said, well, when you're younger, you have more blood flow to your meniscus and we would just surgically repair it and hope it would fix or perhaps today use stem cells.

00:29:22.000 But most likely because of your age, it's not going to heal correctly.

00:29:26.000 And I'm like, okay, I'm confused.

00:29:28.000 Because you're talking about blood flow?

00:29:30.000 Like blood flow.

00:29:31.000 Like what is happening that's different?

00:29:33.000 I think this is like some old medicine nonsense.

00:29:37.000 Is blood not flowing?

00:29:40.000 Well, it's flowing, and someone with your fitness is flowing probably as much as a 30-year-old anyway.

00:29:45.000 I'm in better shape than I was when I was 30. I do more shit. 0.99

00:29:48.000 I do more running. 1.00

00:29:49.000 I've got a lot of blood flowing around, man.

00:29:52.000 I think they compare you to sedentary people.

00:29:55.000 For sure they do.

00:29:56.000 That's the problem with most medicine is that it's tailored to the average person.

00:30:00.000 We've got to fix that.

00:30:01.000 It's got to be personalized, tailored, measured. 0.99

00:30:04.000 I think if I wanted to go on safari like that, like you did, I would have to make sure that I wasn't around any cheering assholes like that. 0.92

00:30:12.000 I would have to take some sort of a solo trip and I'd have to be heavily armed. 0.97

00:30:17.000 And then wearing armor.

00:30:19.000 Some sort of armor.

00:30:20.000 Well, so that was in Tanzania.

00:30:22.000 And a flamethrower.

00:30:23.000 I bring the Elon Musk flamethrower with me.

00:30:26.000 Right, right. 1.00

00:30:26.000 Fuck those things, man. 1.00

00:30:29.000 Did you ever see Survivorman? 1.00

00:30:30.000 Do you know Survivorman?

00:30:31.000 Yeah, sure.

00:30:31.000 Yeah.

00:30:32.000 Les is a great guy.

00:30:33.000 But he's committed to finding Bigfoot now.

00:30:36.000 That's all he's doing these days.

00:30:37.000 All right.

00:30:37.000 Yeah, but anyway, Les did an episode where he did Survivorman in Africa, and the scenario, he would create these fake scenarios, you know, just man-made scenarios.

00:30:49.000 Like, what if you were in a hot air balloon, and the hot air balloon...

00:30:54.000 Got a hole in it and crash-landed in these lion-infested territories.

00:31:00.000 So he literally did that.

00:31:02.000 That's insane.

00:31:03.000 In the basket. 1.00

00:31:04.000 So he had a few items in the basket and the flamethrower for the hot air balloon with him to ward off the fucking lions. 0.99

00:31:14.000 So here he is. 0.99

00:31:15.000 It's nighttime in Africa.

00:31:16.000 And by the way, he self-films everything.

00:31:18.000 You know, the reason why they came out with that other show, with that...

00:31:22.000 Who's that other dude?

00:31:24.000 The other dude that got busted sleeping in the Holiday Inn.

00:31:27.000 He was going to the Four Seasons at night.

00:31:32.000 He's like, this is how you could do it.

00:31:33.000 But I'm not going to do it.

00:31:35.000 He would show you how to do it.

00:31:37.000 You could sleep in an igloo. 1.00

00:31:38.000 But meanwhile, he was getting room service and eating steaks and shit. 0.99

00:31:42.000 Yeah, that's what I did. 0.99

00:31:43.000 But Les Stroud really does it.

00:31:45.000 I mean, he brings a series of cameras.

00:31:47.000 So this is him.

00:31:48.000 And Les went, and he pretends the thing crash-landed.

00:31:54.000 So this is his scenario that he's created for himself.

00:31:56.000 But the reality is, he really is surrounded by lions.

00:32:00.000 And so he has a limited amount of propane, and he would fire up...

00:32:03.000 Look, look, look, look.

00:32:04.000 He would fire up that thing, which is what you use to get in the hot air balloon and scare the shit out of lions.

00:32:11.000 So through the night, he would hear... 0.99

00:32:15.000 He would hear that, look at the fucking zebras and shit, so he'd hear it in the middle of the night, and he'd have to fire that thing up to scare everybody the fuck away, and then after an hour or so, they'd be like, oh fuck, time to fire it up again. 1.00

00:32:28.000 And so he was out there sleeping in this basket, trying, yeah, so crazy, he's so crazy. 0.99

00:32:35.000 And he would also do these things where he would have virtually no food for seven, eight days, you know, and just really just get super, super skinny.

00:32:45.000 And almost starved to death.

00:32:47.000 That's the opposite of being in a jeep.

00:32:50.000 He's got like a bottle of water.

00:32:51.000 I got a pocket knife.

00:32:52.000 I got some rope.

00:32:53.000 Like this is how you do it.

00:32:54.000 I got a stick.

00:32:55.000 What is that?

00:32:55.000 Some sort of a machete type thing?

00:32:57.000 Fucking crazy. 0.99

00:32:58.000 Yeah, we went up in a balloon. 0.99

00:33:00.000 Which was beautiful, by the way.

00:33:01.000 It's fun, isn't it?

00:33:02.000 I did that in Italy recently.

00:33:04.000 Really wild.

00:33:05.000 Anyone who's afraid of heights, don't worry.

00:33:07.000 It's beautiful.

00:33:08.000 But we had a truck underneath us with people with guns, just in case that happened.

00:33:12.000 Oh, that's good.

00:33:13.000 You've got to take along, people. 1.00

00:33:16.000 There's a whole industry in keeping people alive that want to do stupid shit. 1.00

00:33:19.000 Yeah, right. 1.00

00:33:20.000 You can imagine, oh, sorry, the Serengeti burnt down.

00:33:23.000 Yeah, it was some kind of balloon.

00:33:24.000 How many days did you go there for?

00:33:27.000 We traveled for 16 days.

00:33:29.000 I took my whole family, my brother, his kids.

00:33:32.000 How old are the kids?

00:33:35.000 Two nephews, and my kids are 16, 14, 12. Perfect age for this.

00:33:38.000 And they don't recommend you being under a certain age if you're going to take malaria medication, right?

00:33:45.000 They all did.

00:33:46.000 Whoops.

00:33:47.000 Really?

00:33:47.000 I think 12 might be okay, but I think it's like under 10 or something like that.

00:33:53.000 The stuff is heavy duty. 0.99

00:33:54.000 Did it fuck with you? 1.00

00:33:55.000 Did you have crazy nightmares? 1.00

00:33:57.000 I took the one that doesn't give you nightmares, but my other siblings had that.

00:34:02.000 My father came, so he's 80. And that was actually the reason we went.

00:34:06.000 It's his 80th birthday present.

00:34:08.000 Oh, wow.

00:34:09.000 That's cool.

00:34:10.000 What a cool present.

00:34:11.000 16 days.

00:34:12.000 It was awesome.

00:34:13.000 We went Kenya, Tanzania, Uganda.

00:34:16.000 What did you like best?

00:34:17.000 Tanzania is supposed to be gorgeous.

00:34:19.000 Yeah, Serengeti was incredible.

00:34:21.000 It was all good.

00:34:22.000 I really liked hanging out with human beings too.

00:34:25.000 They're an interesting species.

00:34:27.000 Oh, for sure.

00:34:27.000 Yeah, I enjoy humans.

00:34:29.000 Yeah.

00:34:29.000 So it was the origins journey, I called it.

00:34:31.000 And so we went to – we started in Olduvai Gorge, which is where humans – the original fossils were found going back a few million years.

00:34:39.000 Wow.

00:34:40.000 And started there and then just went through looking at the various animals.

00:34:45.000 So we saw the gorillas.

00:34:46.000 And we ended up – a few days ago, I was in Jerusalem looking at where we come.

00:34:50.000 Oh, wow.

00:34:52.000 A real origins tour.

00:34:53.000 Yeah.

00:34:54.000 Up the crack of Africa. 0.96

00:34:55.000 That's exciting, man.

00:34:55.000 That's exciting.

00:34:57.000 Wow.

00:34:57.000 That is so cool.

00:34:58.000 So what was the most unusual thing?

00:35:03.000 Besides Jerusalem?

00:35:04.000 Was that the most unusual thing? 0.99

00:35:06.000 That's the most insane thing, where all the religions are on top of each other, touching rocks and blessing the spring, and humans are crazy. 1.00

00:35:14.000 They'll worship anything. 0.91

00:35:15.000 Well, I'm sure you've seen – I was in Germany once.

00:35:18.000 And I was there for UFC, and I was flipping through the channels of the television, and there was this live feed from Mecca.

00:35:26.000 And this was pre-Instagram.

00:35:30.000 I was not on Instagram.

00:35:30.000 I definitely would have, because I watched it for hours.

00:35:33.000 I just sat there in my room, drinking a cocktail with my feet up, watching these people circle around this, what is that square-shaped thing in the center of Mecca?

00:35:46.000 Yeah.

00:35:47.000 Yeah, I forget what it's called.

00:35:48.000 The religious object that I believe, I think, says something to do with an asteroid.

00:35:53.000 Like, there's a piece of some...

00:35:55.000 Find out if that makes sense.

00:35:56.000 This is important to people.

00:35:58.000 But the watching people circle, they're all wearing the religious garb, this Islamic garb that they have to wear, and they're all circling around this thing, like, for hours and hours and hours.

00:36:11.000 It's oddly appealing.

00:36:13.000 Like, part of you wants to go...

00:36:16.000 I recognize that there's got to be a very strong sense of unity and community in everybody agreeing that we are all going to treat this.

00:36:27.000 This is a sacred object.

00:36:29.000 This is a sacred place.

00:36:30.000 We're going to wear sacred clothes.

00:36:32.000 We're all going to follow this path and we're all going to be together in this.

00:36:38.000 Like, this, like, super reinforced sense of community that's actually ordained by God himself.

00:36:43.000 Well, we all need that feeling.

00:36:45.000 For me, it's science and the fossils that I and my colleagues believe were the origins.

00:36:50.000 Everyone needs an origin story.

00:36:51.000 Here it is.

00:36:53.000 How would you say that?

00:36:55.000 Kabah? 0.78

00:36:56.000 Kabah? 0.78

00:36:56.000 It's built around a sacred black stone, a meteorite that the Muslims believe was placed by Abraham and Ismail Ishmael in the corner of the Kaaba, a symbol of God's covenant with Abraham and Ishmael, and by extension with the Muslim community itself. 0.78

00:37:14.000 So it is actually a meteorite.

00:37:18.000 How incredible, right?

00:37:20.000 Like a little bit of science and a little bit of religion all wrapped up together.

00:37:25.000 There's a discovery.

00:37:25.000 So this is what it looks like.

00:37:27.000 So you're watching this.

00:37:29.000 The channel that I was watching in Germany, again, this is probably like More than 10 years ago.

00:37:35.000 12 years ago, perhaps.

00:37:36.000 And watching this circle around this religious spot is very, very captivating.

00:37:44.000 Yeah, the one that I remember most from, I think it was Jerusalem, yeah, was people touching the stone where the crucifix was thought to be, and they were lined up for hours to just touch it for a few seconds.

00:37:56.000 Meanwhile, the origin of humans, the fossils, there's maybe two or three people hanging out.

00:38:01.000 No one really cares.

00:38:02.000 Admittedly, it is out of the way.

00:38:04.000 It's not in the Middle East. 0.98

00:38:06.000 But still, it struck me that humans are more focused on these icons of religion rather than where I believe we really came from.

00:38:15.000 Africa, yeah.

00:38:16.000 Oh, I mean, if you look at it and you see it, you touch it, you feel it, it's the only sensible explanation.

00:38:21.000 I mean, you can still have religion, that's fine.

00:38:23.000 But, you know, don't tell me those fossils were put there by somebody.

00:38:26.000 No, I mean, obviously not.

00:38:28.000 But it is – the idea that a human being came from some lower hominid which came originally from a shrew – It's so, so hard to follow.

00:38:40.000 Like, if you go all the way back to 65 million years ago, to the asteroid hitting the Yucatan, and you're like, wait, what happened?

00:38:47.000 Like, yeah, yeah, yeah, big rock, smashed, killed everything, except, like, these little rodent things, and they just eventually evolved.

00:38:54.000 Yeah, but that's what I love about science.

00:38:56.000 It's amazing.

00:38:57.000 It's not only amazing, it's actually true.

00:38:59.000 Yes.

00:38:59.000 We can prove it.

00:39:00.000 Yeah, I mean, you can really follow the fossil record.

00:39:02.000 That's one of the funny things when people go, oh, what about the missing link?

00:39:06.000 There's holes in the fossil record.

00:39:08.000 Well, there's holes in your education.

00:39:10.000 It's fatigue.

00:39:11.000 It's not holes.

00:39:12.000 I mean, they go out to Australopithecus.

00:39:15.000 Explain Australopithecus.

00:39:16.000 Explain the various other human beings.

00:39:21.000 Explain Homo Florensis.

00:39:25.000 Explain the Neanderthal.

00:39:27.000 Explain all these different... 0.99

00:39:28.000 There's a whole slew of different fucking things that were human. 0.99

00:39:32.000 Like, what was that? 0.99

00:39:33.000 God's experiments? 0.99

00:39:34.000 Was God fucking around? 1.00

00:39:35.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:39:36.000 I was like, let's try to make them super short and wide and thick and heavy.

00:39:41.000 Like a 5'7", 200 pound person that's way stronger than a person.

00:39:45.000 Ah, those are no good.

00:39:46.000 Listen, let's get a taller, skinnier one, but with bigger brains. 0.94

00:39:50.000 Aha! 0.94

00:39:50.000 Right. 0.94

00:39:50.000 And let's have them breed. 0.94

00:39:52.000 That's what we did. 1.00

00:39:53.000 Let's bang them. 1.00

00:39:53.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:39:54.000 Everybody bang.

00:39:54.000 I don't know if it was marriage or rape, but something happened.

00:39:57.000 I think most rape, mostly, most breeding was rape until about like 500 years ago. 0.92

00:40:03.000 I agree with you.

00:40:04.000 Do you know that to this day, there's a country, is it Kurdistan?

00:40:08.000 There's a country that 20% of all marriages begin in kidnapping.

00:40:15.000 So there's a shame to the female being kidnapped and she ultimately has to marry her captor. 0.99

00:40:23.000 Is it Kurdistan?

00:40:26.000 Kyrgyzstan?

00:40:27.000 I'm not saying that.

00:40:28.000 Yeah, how do you say that?

00:40:30.000 Kyrgyzstan.

00:40:31.000 I think it's Kyrgyzstan.

00:40:33.000 One in five girls and women kidnapped for marriage in Kyrgyzstan. 1.00

00:40:39.000 How fucking crazy. 0.99

00:40:40.000 This is 2019. Religion. 1.00

00:40:43.000 Shame. 1.00

00:40:44.000 But the fact that you could kidnap someone, rape them, and then they get shamed into marrying you. 1.00

00:40:50.000 Well, I was shocked in Jerusalem.

00:40:52.000 I'm going to probably have a lot of hate mail for saying this, but it's a fact that when you go to the Wailing Wall, as I did and put a little note in the wall, which was a great experience, by the way, there is a space for men and women.

00:41:04.000 They're separated.

00:41:05.000 But the space for men is four or five times bigger than the one for women.

00:41:08.000 Good!

00:41:09.000 No, sorry.

00:41:10.000 I couldn't help myself.

00:41:12.000 Yeah, it's all this disparity.

00:41:14.000 Anyway, so are there a similar amount of women that are going to this wall and they're just jammed into a smaller area? 1.00

00:41:20.000 Yeah.

00:41:21.000 Still, 2019. Is this ordained?

00:41:24.000 Is this some sort of a religious?

00:41:26.000 Yeah, the Orthodox.

00:41:27.000 Apparently behind that, I checked it out.

00:41:29.000 So there's an actual scripture that says men are supposed to have this area?

00:41:34.000 Oh, gosh, I doubt that.

00:41:35.000 So it's just ancient sexism?

00:41:38.000 Well, yeah, and even the wall is just tradition.

00:41:41.000 Yeah, right.

00:41:43.000 But anyway, the history of humankind is interesting, and I did that because- Oh, that's the wall right there?

00:41:48.000 What's all the black spots?

00:41:49.000 Yeah.

00:41:50.000 That's like grass.

00:41:52.000 That's like plant material, I think.

00:41:54.000 Is it?

00:41:54.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:41:55.000 The plant's growing out of the wall.

00:41:56.000 Oh, it is.

00:41:57.000 Okay, they're not black. 0.94

00:41:58.000 We're just looking at low resolution.

00:41:59.000 That's the women's side. 1.00

00:42:00.000 That's the men's side. 0.55

00:42:01.000 Do you remember the scene in...

00:42:04.000 What is the...

00:42:05.000 World War Z? When all the zombies climb up the wall, they pile on top of each other like a...

00:42:10.000 Did you see World War Z? No.

00:42:12.000 Fucking great movie. 0.99

00:42:13.000 I gotta see it. 0.99

00:42:14.000 There's a crazy scene.

00:42:15.000 It's a Brad Pitt zombie movie where all the zombies pile up on top of each other and make it to the top of the wall.

00:42:22.000 You got it?

00:42:23.000 Yeah, Jamie's gonna pull it up. 0.99

00:42:25.000 So they get to the wall and look at these fucking zombie people are climbing up. 0.99

00:42:30.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:42:32.000 Oh, it's pretty gnarly, man.

00:42:34.000 You've never seen this movie?

00:42:35.000 I've wanted to.

00:42:36.000 The novels are supposed to be excellent.

00:42:38.000 Weren't the novels written by some famous guy's son?

00:42:44.000 Who wrote the novel?

00:42:45.000 But this is a great scene.

00:42:47.000 See, they're all piling on top of each other, and they're just reckless.

00:42:55.000 We're good to go.

00:43:14.000 It's a wild movie, man.

00:43:16.000 It's one of those zombie movies where the zombies move fast.

00:43:21.000 The slow zombie movies, which...

00:43:24.000 Come on, man. 0.98

00:43:25.000 Like, that's why Walking Dead, like, I feel like you could fuck those things up. 0.95

00:43:29.000 I mean, they can only last so long.

00:43:31.000 They don't move fast.

00:43:32.000 Like, how are they surviving?

00:43:33.000 They're just kind of, like, shuffling towards you.

00:43:35.000 I feel like if you just have a big sword, you can just start hacking away.

00:43:40.000 Yeah.

00:43:40.000 So there are zombie cells in the body.

00:43:42.000 And I make that segue because people are going to say, why the hell aren't we talking about aging?

00:43:46.000 Oh, we will.

00:43:47.000 Okay.

00:43:47.000 We're here forever.

00:43:48.000 Max Brooks, the son of Mel Brooks.

00:43:50.000 Aha! 0.94

00:43:51.000 There you go.

00:43:51.000 Shout out to Max Brooks and Mel Brooks.

00:43:56.000 Sorry.

00:43:56.000 Aging.

00:43:57.000 Well, we don't have to.

00:43:58.000 Zombie cells.

00:43:59.000 Yeah.

00:44:00.000 So what are they?

00:44:01.000 Are we done talking about Africa and your trip?

00:44:03.000 It's your show.

00:44:04.000 Because it's pretty exciting.

00:44:04.000 Yeah, but it's your show too.

00:44:06.000 Thank you.

00:44:07.000 When you're on it, it's your episode.

00:44:09.000 Anything else?

00:44:10.000 I recommend everybody go to Africa, not just to come back a different person, a better human being, but also to support them.

00:44:17.000 They really need our help over there.

00:44:19.000 When you were in the area where the oldest human-like fossils were found, what's the feeling like when you're in this area?

00:44:28.000 You really are where the origins of humankind...

00:44:34.000 Or from?

00:44:35.000 I mean, that has got to be a pretty profound feeling.

00:44:38.000 Yeah, it was spiritual.

00:44:40.000 Unfortunately, the people who drove us there were saying, hurry, hurry, we have to go see some zebras.

00:44:44.000 This is more important than the zebras. 0.60

00:44:46.000 These are the people that are the guides?

00:44:48.000 Yeah.

00:44:48.000 They don't know what was important to us.

00:44:50.000 Fair enough.

00:44:50.000 But I would have loved to have spent a whole day there.

00:44:55.000 Apparently, there are still fossils sticking out of the walls of the gorge.

00:44:57.000 Really?

00:44:58.000 Yeah.

00:44:59.000 So the reason that it's- Are you allowed to do anything with them?

00:45:01.000 I don't know.

00:45:03.000 What happens if you find a fossil? 0.99

00:45:04.000 Do you have to contact the university or do you just like, shut the fuck up? 0.95

00:45:08.000 Well, actually, I probably shouldn't confess this on live media. 0.99

00:45:12.000 Don't do it, bro.

00:45:14.000 Tell me later.

00:45:15.000 It's not so bad.

00:45:16.000 Okay.

00:45:17.000 You can actually find a whole bunch of stuff in Africa that's interesting if you look down rather than out.

00:45:22.000 And my oldest daughter, our oldest daughter, Alex, she looked down.

00:45:27.000 She's a scientist.

00:45:28.000 And so she's a 16-year-old scientist.

00:45:30.000 She found a whole bunch of stone tools.

00:45:32.000 Whoa! 0.71

00:45:33.000 Not there.

00:45:34.000 Not in Olduvai Gorge.

00:45:35.000 That's sacred.

00:45:36.000 But, you know, just out on the Serengeti or wherever.

00:45:39.000 Did you get them analyzed?

00:45:41.000 Not yet.

00:45:43.000 They recently found stone tools in the United States that they've brought back to 16,000 years ago.

00:45:52.000 The oldest known stone tools of any human being.

00:45:57.000 They're slowly but surely pushing back the dates of human civilization in America.

00:46:03.000 Mm-hmm.

00:46:03.000 And one of the more recent discoveries was stone tools that are from 16,000 years ago.

00:46:08.000 So people had made their way over here, or here it is.

00:46:12.000 I remember I asked you about this.

00:46:14.000 You said you never saw it.

00:46:15.000 I don't know if you saw it yet.

00:46:18.000 I don't know if they have video of it, but they said they saw this monkey sharpening that stone before it was actually breaking the glass with it.

00:46:25.000 Monkey shattered, zoo glass with sharpened stone, impressive prison break attempt. 1.00

00:46:29.000 Man, fuck keeping monkeys in a cage. 1.00

00:46:32.000 That drives me so crazy. 1.00

00:46:34.000 I hate it.

00:46:36.000 I took a pot edible once, like a real strong one, and I went to the zoo.

00:46:40.000 It was so depressing, staring at the chimps.

00:46:43.000 I sat across and watched the chimp cage.

00:46:45.000 I'm like, oh my god, these things are in hell.

00:46:47.000 They're just in prison.

00:46:49.000 Even keeping little birds in little cages like this.

00:46:51.000 Yeah, but the monkeys are wailing.

00:46:53.000 That's worse, right.

00:46:53.000 They're wailing.

00:46:54.000 Wah! 0.94

00:46:55.000 They had some type of monkey that was in a smaller cage than the chimps and was just wailing.

00:47:01.000 It's just in hell.

00:47:02.000 Yeah, it is.

00:47:04.000 It's brutal.

00:47:05.000 Actually, the stone tools are interesting because, again, getting to what's natural.

00:47:10.000 What's natural for primates is to change their environment, to take tools.

00:47:14.000 So what we're doing, genetic engineering.

00:47:19.000 Well, I don't want to say engineering, but we're using genetics to understand why we age and why we don't have to.

00:47:24.000 It is natural.

00:47:25.000 Of course.

00:47:25.000 That's what we do.

00:47:26.000 All of science is natural.

00:47:29.000 You could even argue that an iPhone in your pocket is natural.

00:47:32.000 Sure.

00:47:32.000 Humans have created it.

00:47:33.000 They exist all over the world.

00:47:35.000 I've argued that cities are natural.

00:47:37.000 It's a completely normal thing for humans to do, to create cities, to say that cities are unnatural.

00:47:43.000 Well, why are they everywhere?

00:47:44.000 And why are human beings making it?

00:47:46.000 Are you saying beehives are unnatural too?

00:47:47.000 Right.

00:47:48.000 Are clothes unnatural?

00:47:49.000 Yeah.

00:47:50.000 Animal habitat.

00:47:52.000 I mean animals like beavers create beaver dens and they're very uniform.

00:47:56.000 They're real similar everywhere they go.

00:47:58.000 Exactly.

00:47:59.000 Yeah, the other day someone said humans tamed fire 500,000 years ago and I said that can't be true.

00:48:05.000 500,000 years ago?

00:48:06.000 That's too long ago.

00:48:08.000 I checked it out.

00:48:09.000 It's true.

00:48:10.000 And these weren't even humans.

00:48:11.000 These were pre-human.

00:48:13.000 I think it was probably one of the two species back.

00:48:16.000 We've been doing this.

00:48:17.000 We've been changing the environment using tools, using fire for that long.

00:48:21.000 The fire one is crazy, right?

00:48:22.000 Because it's not just manipulating a physical thing.

00:48:24.000 It's changing the state, right?

00:48:26.000 You're doing something, whether it's with flint and something to spark and some tinder.

00:48:32.000 You're really creating, changing the state of matter.

00:48:36.000 Well, we are.

00:48:37.000 And we'll continue to do that.

00:48:38.000 We'll continue to evolve.

00:48:39.000 And one of the reasons that I wanted to see human origins is in my book I talk about we've evolved to our natural lifespan.

00:48:47.000 We're now at a maximum.

00:48:48.000 122 is the longest-lived human that ostensibly is on record.

00:48:53.000 So without intervention, we've reached our maximum.

00:48:56.000 But why not now give us what evolution failed to give us?

00:49:00.000 Why can't we be like other species that are at the top of their game?

00:49:03.000 Are there any factors when you look at the oldest people that are alive?

00:49:07.000 Are there any common factors?

00:49:10.000 Actually, not really.

00:49:10.000 They do seem to have a collection of gene variants that predispose them to get to that long.

00:49:16.000 There's one called FOXO3 that if you've done your genome, we can have a look.

00:49:21.000 23andMe.

00:49:22.000 Have you done it?

00:49:23.000 I have.

00:49:23.000 We should look at it.

00:49:24.000 We can tell.

00:49:25.000 You need an A or a T at a certain position.

00:49:29.000 I've got one of them out of two.

00:49:33.000 Two of my kids out of three have both.

00:49:35.000 So if they look after themselves, they might have a better chance of living longer.

00:49:38.000 But anyway, these long-lived people, they tend to live a long time no matter what they do.

00:49:45.000 Often they smoke till 90 years old.

00:49:49.000 Really?

00:49:49.000 Yeah.

00:49:51.000 They quit at 90?

00:49:52.000 There's a few cases of that.

00:49:54.000 And they live another 12 years?

00:49:55.000 Right.

00:49:56.000 Or more, 22 years, right?

00:49:58.000 You said 122 years?

00:49:59.000 That lady. 1.00

00:50:00.000 That's one lady in France. 1.00

00:50:01.000 But one of my friends, his name is Nir Barzilai.

00:50:05.000 He was with me in Israel.

00:50:06.000 He's got a story of when he asked the centenarian lady, the lady that lived over 100, that he knew, why didn't you quit smoking?

00:50:14.000 And she said, all four doctors I went to told me to quit smoking, and they've all died.

00:50:19.000 So keep going.

00:50:24.000 That's hilarious.

00:50:25.000 What did she do for a living? 1.00

00:50:27.000 Jean-Calmaine.

00:50:28.000 I forget.

00:50:29.000 The French lady, I don't remember what she did. 0.99

00:50:31.000 I would imagine that would play a part, like how stressful your occupation is.

00:50:35.000 Yeah, she had a great sense of humor.

00:50:36.000 That was probably part of it.

00:50:38.000 She used to make jokes with reporters all the time. 0.72

00:50:41.000 One was, how many wrinkles do you have?

00:50:44.000 She says, I've only got one and I'm sitting on it.

00:50:48.000 The other one I think is even better is a reporter who was young said, you know, you're 116. I hope I see you next year for your birthday.

00:50:57.000 She says, I don't see why not.

00:50:58.000 You seem pretty healthy to me.

00:51:01.000 Wow.

00:51:02.000 And she made it to 122. Now, have there been any anecdotal reports of people that live longer?

00:51:08.000 Well, Methuselah and biblical figures.

00:51:22.000 Sure.

00:51:23.000 There's a few of those.

00:51:24.000 But even John Calment at 122, there's a big argument now between us researchers whether that's even true.

00:51:31.000 Oh, really?

00:51:32.000 Yeah.

00:51:32.000 It's a massive debate.

00:51:34.000 I've got an inbox full of long, angry emails from scientists.

00:51:37.000 What's the evidence point to the contrary?

00:51:40.000 That to – so the hypothesis is that she – her identity was subsumed by her daughter to avoid paying taxes.

00:51:51.000 And there's photos of them and there's a blotch on one photo that matches the daughter.

00:51:56.000 So there's a lot of forensics going on and people want to subsume the grave.

00:51:59.000 And the French government's not – or French researchers aren't giving up the blood samples.

00:52:03.000 They don't want to know.

00:52:04.000 They don't want to know.

00:52:05.000 Exactly. 0.98

00:52:06.000 So it's probably horseshit. 0.73

00:52:08.000 She's probably like 100 years old. 0.99

00:52:09.000 It could be horseshit. 0.95

00:52:11.000 I would say it doesn't actually matter. 1.00

00:52:13.000 Goddamn French. 1.00

00:52:14.000 It doesn't matter. 0.99

00:52:15.000 People have lived to 117, and that's still pretty good.

00:52:18.000 That's what we know.

00:52:19.000 If we can all live that long, who's going to complain?

00:52:23.000 Wouldn't you like to get one of them old, old, old, old, old people and start doing work on them? 0.99

00:52:27.000 Yeah.

00:52:28.000 Just pump them up with NAD, get them on a drip.

00:52:30.000 Well, my dad's experimenting on himself, so he's not 100 yet, but he's 80. How's he look?

00:52:36.000 Well, I wouldn't say he looks young, but his fitness is like a 30-year-old.

00:52:39.000 Really?

00:52:40.000 He's stronger than me.

00:52:41.000 We tested it out in the gym the other day.

00:52:42.000 No way.

00:52:43.000 That's embarrassing.

00:52:44.000 He can lift more.

00:52:45.000 He's fitter.

00:52:46.000 We were going across the Serengeti, and he was leading the charge.

00:52:49.000 If you saw him, if you didn't see his face because he's got gray hair and whatever, physically, he'd put a bag on his head.

00:52:55.000 You'd say he's 30 the way he moves.

00:52:57.000 People are very aware to put a bag on your dad's head.

00:53:00.000 Yeah, I shouldn't do that.

00:53:01.000 Sorry, Dad.

00:53:02.000 You would think he's 30, really?

00:53:04.000 Well, he's reinvigorated in life.

00:53:07.000 So in my family, we've got some Ashkenazi bad genes. 0.99

00:53:10.000 We tend to die young.

00:53:12.000 And my grandmother died.

00:53:13.000 My grandmother is actually only 15 years older than my dad, and she died a few years ago.

00:53:17.000 The last 10 years of her life, horrible.

00:53:19.000 So we know what's going to happen in my family, probably, to all of us.

00:53:23.000 So your grandmother had your father when she was 15 years old?

00:53:27.000 Right.

00:53:28.000 Whoa.

00:53:30.000 Yeah.

00:53:30.000 Back in the early days of World War II, she apparently was playing around with her boyfriend.

00:53:36.000 She claims to be a virgin at that point, but something got somewhere that she shouldn't have.

00:53:41.000 And so it was during high school.

00:53:44.000 Right.

00:53:44.000 So I was raised by my grandmother.

00:53:45.000 She was in her 40s when I was a kid.

00:53:47.000 And she was the one that taught me to always stay young, keep your, you know, adults ruin everything.

00:53:53.000 That's probably why I work on aging.

00:53:55.000 Right.

00:53:56.000 Adults ruin everything. 0.99

00:53:58.000 What was her advice in terms of how do you avoid what adults are doing wrong? 0.96

00:54:04.000 Well, you know, she'd grown up during the Depression and then World War II and then the communists came into Hungary and raped a lot of people.

00:54:14.000 She had no respect for humanity. 0.64

00:54:19.000 So by the time I came along, first of all, she put all of her energy into me, and I was a spoiled brat as a kid.

00:54:26.000 So that wasn't helpful to me, I think, now as an adult.

00:54:32.000 But more importantly, she wanted me to do the best I could with my life.

00:54:38.000 She said, David, do what you can to make this world a better place.

00:54:41.000 Make sure that you leave this place better than you found it.

00:54:44.000 And that's what I'm trying to do.

00:54:46.000 Wow, what a profound piece of advice for a grandchild.

00:54:50.000 She was a rebel. 1.00

00:54:51.000 She taught me, forget the rules. 0.62

00:54:54.000 Kind of like you do.

00:54:55.000 I'm going my own way and we'll see how this goes.

00:54:58.000 So she went to Australia. 1.00

00:54:59.000 She said, fuck Europe. 1.00

00:55:00.000 I'm out of here. 1.00

00:55:01.000 She went to Australia, the furthest place she could find from Europe.

00:55:04.000 Never went back.

00:55:05.000 She went on Bondi Beach in Sydney in a bikini, which was rebellious.

00:55:11.000 She got taken off the beach by the police.

00:55:14.000 What did you have to wear back then?

00:55:15.000 Oh, the full little British thing. 0.95

00:55:18.000 Down to your knees?

00:55:19.000 Oh, down to your knees?

00:55:20.000 I think so.

00:55:21.000 What did they look like?

00:55:22.000 Maybe it was a one-piece.

00:55:24.000 You wanted them to show your belly. 0.79

00:55:26.000 That's what I think.

00:55:27.000 But she was a rebel. 0.96

00:55:28.000 She went to New Guinea by herself in the 60s.

00:55:30.000 What year was this where she was wearing a bikini? 0.98

00:55:32.000 Oh, that would be 56. You couldn't wear a bikini in the 50s?

00:55:36.000 Wow.

00:55:39.000 Okay, like those pin-up girls, right? 0.58

00:55:41.000 When you see them, they always had one-piece suits on.

00:55:44.000 Yeah.

00:55:46.000 So imagine New Guinea in the 60s as a woman on her own up in the Highlands.

00:55:50.000 She claims to have eaten human flesh.

00:55:52.000 I'm sure she spent most of the time drunk as well.

00:55:54.000 Did you see that article that was yesterday where they were interviewing an Australian...

00:56:00.000 A guy who's a doctor or a scientist, he was talking about climate change, and he was saying that we have to start eating human bodies, and that human bodies are very nutritious, and that we just put them in the ground.

00:56:16.000 I was reading it and I was like, okay, is this guy trolling?

00:56:19.000 Like, what is he doing here? 0.78

00:56:21.000 Is he a completely insane person?

00:56:23.000 But his advice was, our dependence on meat is ruining, like in some places where they're stripping the rainforest to make room for cattle grazing.

00:56:37.000 He was saying that we're getting rid of perfectly good meat every time we put someone in the ground.

00:56:43.000 Well, we are, but to suggest that sounds insane to me.

00:56:47.000 Yeah.

00:56:47.000 Because we throw away half our food anyway, at least in this country.

00:56:50.000 It was a mainstream publication that this guy was talking about.

00:56:53.000 It's like, the last thing you want to encourage is people getting used to eating people.

00:56:57.000 I think he's been watching World War Z. Maybe.

00:57:01.000 It is meat, but come on.

00:57:04.000 I was going, is this guy just trying to get attention?

00:57:07.000 Or was he joking?

00:57:10.000 It's hard to tell in text.

00:57:14.000 Not every Australian is sensible. 1.00

00:57:18.000 I found the article, but I don't see anything about him saying wasting human bodies or meat.

00:57:22.000 There's been more than several articles written on it.

00:57:25.000 Maybe somebody extrapolated.

00:57:26.000 But the idea was he was saying that people should eat meat.

00:57:29.000 And if they want to eat meat, they should eat human meat because it's going to waste.

00:57:33.000 Well, maybe he's an animal rights activist. 1.00

00:57:35.000 Might be just an idiot. 1.00

00:57:36.000 Eat your relatives, yeah. 1.00

00:57:38.000 Yeah, but just the last thing you want is people getting the taste.

00:57:41.000 Yeah.

00:57:42.000 Of people, you know?

00:57:44.000 Right.

00:57:45.000 No, I do not need to go that far.

00:57:48.000 Not yet.

00:57:49.000 Speaking of the food supply, one of the things people worry about if we all live longer is we're going to run out of food and run out of space.

00:57:55.000 And one of the things I address in the book is what really will happen.

00:57:58.000 If you do the calculations, if you look at human history, that is not going to happen.

00:58:03.000 I'm of the strong belief that we can engineer our way out of just about any problem.

00:58:08.000 Probably the only thing we can't engineer our way out of is if we get hit by a five mile wide meteorite.

00:58:13.000 But everything else I think we're going to be...

00:58:15.000 You think climate change we're going to be able to engineer our way out of that?

00:58:18.000 Well, I don't think we can stop climate change at this point.

00:58:20.000 It's definitely happening.

00:58:22.000 You can see it all around.

00:58:23.000 But will it wipe us out?

00:58:25.000 No.

00:58:25.000 Will it cost us trillions of dollars?

00:58:27.000 Yeah.

00:58:28.000 And so I don't think it's going to be the end of us, but it's going to be a challenge to continue to survive and proliferate as a species in the face of all of those costly things.

00:58:42.000 And that's the biggest problem of climate change, besides species losses, the expense.

00:58:47.000 And there's only a certain amount of human capital that we have to spend, and we call that money.

00:58:52.000 And that's one of the reasons that I'm excited about extending people's health and lifespan is that that'll save tens of trillions in the globe each year.

00:59:01.000 And that's money that can be put to combating global warming, saving species, besides wonderful people who donate their earnings as well.

00:59:11.000 But really, to solve the big problems on the planet, one of them is to solve what we can do with all the frail elderly people that are coming every year more and more. 1.00

00:59:21.000 Make them productive, like my father.

00:59:23.000 He could be in a nursing home like his mother was, whereas now he's hiking in the jungles looking at watching gorillas with his five grandkids.

00:59:30.000 How cool is that?

00:59:31.000 That's pretty cool.

00:59:32.000 Now, what kind of protocol is he on?

00:59:35.000 Pretty much the same as me, although he does more exercise.

00:59:38.000 So it's a combination of NMN, metformin, and resveratrol.

00:59:44.000 And what kind of exercise?

00:59:47.000 I'm not sure of his protocol.

00:59:49.000 We're going to post that on social media once we get that written.

00:59:54.000 But I know it involves a fair amount of aerobic exercise.

00:59:57.000 He does rowing and walking upstairs.

01:00:00.000 So he managed to climb, I think it was 40 flights of stairs in 15 minutes, which for an 80-year-old was quite a record.

01:00:10.000 Forty flights of stairs in 15 minutes? 1.00

01:00:13.000 Holy shit! 0.99

01:00:14.000 Yeah, the guy's a phenomenon. 0.99

01:00:16.000 What has happened though is that his outlook on life has changed.

01:00:20.000 He was depressed, not just because he was fearful of getting old and my mother was sick at the time, but now he's looking forward to another 10 years of vigorous life, traveling.

01:00:30.000 And when you're healthy, you're happy.

01:00:33.000 So when he was depressed, was he sedentary?

01:00:37.000 No.

01:00:37.000 No, he was depressed because he was worried about his health.

01:00:41.000 He figured he's going to be like all his other friends, getting frail, can't walk, losing your mind.

01:00:48.000 And it hasn't happened to him.

01:00:49.000 So just a few years ago, he went back and started a new career.

01:00:53.000 Whoa.

01:00:53.000 Oh, we talked about this last time, I believe.

01:00:55.000 What's his new career again?

01:00:57.000 He's on a committee that evaluates clinical trials for ethics.

01:01:01.000 Wow.

01:01:02.000 Which is what you want older people to do. 1.00

01:01:04.000 Use their wisdom and knowledge to...

01:01:05.000 Be excited about something as well.

01:01:07.000 Right.

01:01:07.000 Something that stimulates you and keeps you going and gives you something to be interested in.

01:01:11.000 And talk about wasting human flesh. 1.00

01:01:14.000 What a waste it is for someone with that knowledge to die prematurely.

01:01:17.000 Right.

01:01:18.000 That's the more interesting thing to me about longevity is...

01:01:23.000 Look, I'm so much wiser at 52 than I was at 42. I just am.

01:01:29.000 I make less mistakes.

01:01:30.000 I'm more aware.

01:01:32.000 Just across the board.

01:01:34.000 And I'm wiser at 42 than I was at 32. And at 22, I was basically a chimp.

01:01:39.000 As time goes on, you understand how you're interfacing with the world.

01:01:45.000 You communicate with people better.

01:01:48.000 You know how to get by.

01:01:51.000 You know what you have to do and what the consequences are of not doing what you have to do.

01:01:56.000 In terms of being disciplined and being healthy and just meditation and making sure you understand the consequences also of not doing the work that you're supposed to do in terms of the way you feel about yourself, your self-respect.

01:02:12.000 The way you just feel about your sense of self-satisfaction.

01:02:17.000 To me, it takes a big hit when I'm lazy.

01:02:20.000 It takes a big hit when I don't get things done.

01:02:23.000 And I don't expect everybody to do the same things that I do or have the same sort of work ethic.

01:02:29.000 I don't want to say work ethic because that implies some sort of...

01:02:34.000 Superiority.

01:02:35.000 It's more of just the idea of what you want to accomplish, like your tasks.

01:02:40.000 Everyone has their own idea of what… But if you enjoy doing something and you're working towards something, I feel like… There's more purpose to life.

01:02:51.000 You have more satisfaction in accomplishing tasks.

01:02:54.000 And that's one of the things that's been highlighted when you read books on happiness and studies on happiness.

01:03:00.000 One of the things that seems to be most important is goal setting.

01:03:03.000 Goal setting, working towards those goals, and achieving progress.

01:03:07.000 These are critical components to happiness for human beings and without them, there's this aimless sort of drifting of life.

01:03:14.000 People, for the most part, obviously everyone's different, but for the most part, people don't find satisfaction in just an aimless sort of drifting existence.

01:03:22.000 Yeah, 100%.

01:03:23.000 I just turned 50 while I was over in Africa or just before that.

01:03:28.000 You know, imagine being 80 and healthy like my dad or 90 or 100. It just keeps getting better.

01:03:34.000 Of course.

01:03:35.000 I'm so less stressed than I was in my 20s and 30s. 0.80

01:03:39.000 And anyone who's listening who's in their 20s and thinks that they're, you know, way better than a 50-year-old, I can tell you from experience, like you, Joe, when I was in my 20s, I thought I knew everything, or at least I looked at myself as a 50-year-old and I thought, what an old fart. 0.94

01:03:54.000 Yes! 0.94

01:03:54.000 Yeah. 0.94

01:03:55.000 It's not like that at all, especially with today's, you know, health and, you know, 50-year-olds are just like they were, like a 30-year-old was.

01:04:04.000 There was no 52-year-olds like me when I was 20. They didn't exist.

01:04:09.000 Maybe Jack LaLanne.

01:04:11.000 Right.

01:04:11.000 Well, it's been talked about, I think it was in The New Yorker, that this movie Cocoon, I don't know if everyone's seen it, but it's a pretty interesting movie where these 50, 60-year-olds were given the fountain of youth, and they still look old, but it was really supposed to be quite funny to see these older people with gray hair jumping in the pool and acting 30 years old.

01:04:33.000 But a 50-year-old isn't old anymore.

01:04:35.000 A 50-year-old is just getting going.

01:04:36.000 Yeah, that's what's crazy about it.

01:04:38.000 You know, I mean, if you see old movie stars from, like, the 1960s when they were, like, 50, they looked like they were dead men.

01:04:46.000 You know, like, we were...

01:04:49.000 We were looking at, I forget what the movie was, but it was a movie where I was like, how old was he when they made that movie?

01:04:54.000 It turned out he was 44. I'm like, that guy looks 100 years old.

01:04:57.000 Looks like he's never worked out.

01:04:59.000 He probably smoked cigarettes all day long.

01:05:01.000 Never exercises.

01:05:02.000 He drinks constantly. 0.58

01:05:04.000 He just looks like a dead man.

01:05:06.000 It's crazy.

01:05:07.000 Right.

01:05:08.000 So in the future, 90 will feel like 50 and 40. Well, we were talking about Laird earlier.

01:05:13.000 And Laird, I think, is 55 years old and just as fucking fit as a human being can be. 0.99

01:05:19.000 And he's doing crazy shit where he's got this whole exercise routine that he does inside the pool where he brings like 70-pound dumbbells. 0.99

01:05:29.000 And he carries it with one arm and swims across the pool in the other. 0.99

01:05:33.000 You know, he does two-handed dumbbell things at the bottom of the pool and leaps to the surface, catches a breath of air, drops back down to the bottom again, leaps to the surface while he's carrying these dumbbells.

01:05:42.000 I mean, just ruthless, rigorous exercise at 55 years old.

01:05:47.000 Well, there'll be a time when you can't really tell how old somebody is, especially when we figure out how to reprogram the body to be young again.

01:05:53.000 Yeah.

01:05:53.000 And it's going to be such a great world when people with 80 years of experience can continue to run companies and be teachers and educate the young people.

01:06:03.000 Now, there's a bias, though, against the elderly.

01:06:05.000 We've always had this in society, and we have to overcome that.

01:06:08.000 My dentist was biased against...

01:06:10.000 Me as a 50-year-old.

01:06:11.000 Didn't want to fix your teeth. 1.00

01:06:12.000 You're dead, bro. 0.99

01:06:12.000 I'm not fixing your teeth. 0.99

01:06:13.000 Not worth the money.

01:06:14.000 Screw it.

01:06:14.000 I'll pay for it.

01:06:15.000 Just do it.

01:06:15.000 So it was a 20-minute argument.

01:06:17.000 Do it.

01:06:18.000 20 minutes.

01:06:18.000 It was a lot.

01:06:19.000 In fact, the time ran out, and she said, fine, I'll do one tooth just to check.

01:06:22.000 Because she had all these reasons why she shouldn't do it.

01:06:25.000 It'll break off.

01:06:26.000 I have to polish back your original teeth.

01:06:29.000 And I said, look, I'm not going to get angry if it doesn't work.

01:06:32.000 Just try it.

01:06:33.000 And she did it.

01:06:34.000 And first of all, she said, I have to eat crow after it. 1.00

01:06:37.000 And then my wife came a week later and she said, man, your husband's a pain in the ass. 1.00

01:06:41.000 But he's onto something. 0.99

01:06:42.000 And actually, she's offering this as a service now to people our age.

01:06:46.000 Yeah, she's trying to make money. 1.00

01:06:48.000 I guess.

01:06:49.000 But it hasn't cracked off, and I'm pretty happy with teeth that are...

01:06:52.000 And if it does, fix it again.

01:06:53.000 Right, why not?

01:06:54.000 We fix everything, and we should do that.

01:06:56.000 But here's the problem with some aspects of medicine.

01:06:59.000 When we're young, we don't get the medicines that'll prevent us getting sick when we're old.

01:07:03.000 So drugs like metformin, you're not going to give to a 20, 30-year-old.

01:07:08.000 But when you get old, you don't get the medicines that they give the young.

01:07:12.000 But everyone should be treated equally, in my view, as long as we know it's safe.

01:07:16.000 For sure.

01:07:17.000 You know, there's the cost.

01:07:18.000 But some of these treatments, like metformin, that's probably less than a dollar a day, a cup of coffee, and might extend your lifespan.

01:07:25.000 Where are you getting a cup of coffee for a buck?

01:07:27.000 I get free coffee from here, from Laird Hamilton's superfood machine.

01:07:31.000 But coffee's even more expensive than that.

01:07:34.000 Yeah, it's the limited idea of what you should or shouldn't do to fix people as they get older.

01:07:40.000 My friend got his ACL torn, and he's 60. And he said his doctor recommended he just rehab it and don't get it fixed.

01:07:47.000 I go, what the fuck are you talking about? 0.99

01:07:49.000 Get it fixed, man. 1.00

01:07:49.000 You want to have a bum knee that just buckles on you all the time? 1.00

01:07:53.000 Go get it fixed.

01:07:54.000 Six months later, it'll be done.

01:07:56.000 Like, you'll go through the rehab. 0.98

01:07:57.000 Otherwise, six months later, you still have a shitty knee. 0.93

01:08:00.000 It's like, your call, man, but I'd just get it fixed. 1.00

01:08:03.000 Bite the bullet. 0.85

01:08:04.000 Go fix it. 0.71

01:08:05.000 But his doctor was like, come on, Bruce.

01:08:08.000 Come on, Bruce.

01:08:10.000 Let's be honest.

01:08:11.000 We're at the end of the movie.

01:08:13.000 You're not 20 anymore.

01:08:15.000 Yeah.

01:08:16.000 That limited thinking is so frustrating to me.

01:08:20.000 Yeah.

01:08:21.000 I first encountered this when I was 29, actually.

01:08:23.000 I have high cholesterol.

01:08:25.000 They were telling you at 29 it's a wrap?

01:08:27.000 Well, they were.

01:08:28.000 No, actually, this is the problem with the other end of the spectrum, which is I was too young to get a medicine that could help me when I get older.

01:08:34.000 Oh, wow.

01:08:35.000 This was cholesterol medicine, the statins.

01:08:38.000 And my doctor said, why do you want to get on this drug?

01:08:41.000 I know you've got high cholesterol, but you're only 29. Come on.

01:08:44.000 And I said, look, why wait till I get the disease to treat it?

01:08:49.000 Now people use statins more, but in those days...

01:08:51.000 Aren't statins very controversial, though?

01:08:53.000 They are.

01:08:54.000 They apparently have a huge health hit.

01:08:57.000 Well, I haven't noticed, and I have high cholesterol, and I think it's worth it.

01:09:00.000 But yeah, if there's nothing else wrong with you, you wouldn't take them.

01:09:03.000 But do you have arterial plaque?

01:09:05.000 No, not yet.

01:09:06.000 I'm perfectly clean.

01:09:07.000 Right, but shouldn't – isn't – but isn't there some – there's doctors that are arguing that the idea of high cholesterol, whether it's LDL, HDL, whether it's good cholesterol, bad cholesterol, this sort of uniform approach – People with high cholesterol need to take something that lowers their cholesterol.

01:09:26.000 And doctors that I've talked to are saying, well, not necessarily.

01:09:30.000 You could be incredibly healthy, especially if you're not sedentary, with relatively high cholesterol if everything balances itself out.

01:09:40.000 If you have the appropriate ratio of HDL to LDL, do you have the appropriate ratio or is it out of whack?

01:09:46.000 Now I do.

01:09:46.000 But when I was 29, I was off the charts.

01:09:49.000 I had blood that looked more like cream.

01:09:51.000 And that's where one of the things, apparently, where dietary cholesterol does make a hit.

01:09:57.000 It does have an effect on people with genetic predisposition to high cholesterol in certain ways, right?

01:10:05.000 Is that correct?

01:10:06.000 Right.

01:10:06.000 Yeah.

01:10:07.000 Right.

01:10:07.000 But changing my diet had a big impact as well.

01:10:09.000 What did you do that was different?

01:10:11.000 I went more...

01:10:14.000 Well, I ate less.

01:10:15.000 I lost weight.

01:10:15.000 That helped.

01:10:16.000 Do you do intermittent fasting?

01:10:19.000 Yeah.

01:10:20.000 As much as I can.

01:10:22.000 One of the other guys that was on this tour of Israel with me is Volta Longo, and he's arguably the world's expert on this.

01:10:28.000 What a great name.

01:10:29.000 Isn't it?

01:10:30.000 He's an Italian guy.

01:10:31.000 Volta Longo.

01:10:33.000 Longo.

01:10:33.000 Yeah, like the coffee.

01:10:35.000 Sounds like a guy you call in when you've got a real problem.

01:10:38.000 You know?

01:10:39.000 Yeah.

01:10:40.000 Well, he's written a book and he is probably the world's expert in human periodic fasting.

01:10:48.000 For everyone who wants to know about what the best periodic fasting protocol is, there isn't one.

01:10:54.000 We don't know yet.

01:10:55.000 We're right on the cusp.

01:10:56.000 There haven't been enough studies, but there are a few types.

01:11:00.000 I go through them in my book because we won't have time to go through all of it.

01:11:04.000 But there's the 18 hours.

01:11:10.000 If you can skip breakfast, have a late lunch, that's a good start.

01:11:13.000 That's what I try to do every day.

01:11:14.000 It's not always possible when you're in Africa and they're feeding you massive meals three times a day.

01:11:19.000 But that's what you want to do.

01:11:21.000 Be hungry for part of the day.

01:11:23.000 Or you can go a little more extreme and skip two days a week.

01:11:26.000 What's the benefit of being hungry?

01:11:28.000 Great question.

01:11:30.000 And this is what my lab and others figured out in the first few years of the 21st century.

01:11:37.000 We figured out that these genes that extend lifespan, these sirtuin genes, are activated by being hungry, in part by raising NAD levels, which NMN will mimic the effect of.

01:11:50.000 So being hungry actually raises your lifespan in some sort of way.

01:11:54.000 Right.

01:11:55.000 So caloric restriction is what we used to talk about a lot.

01:11:59.000 If you restrict the calories of a rat, it was actually discovered back in the early 20th century, will make them live up to 30% longer.

01:12:06.000 Not in an old state, but it prevents them getting old.

01:12:09.000 So the rats don't get cancer, heart disease, and all of these other good things.

01:12:13.000 And that was the only thing that we knew up until about 20 years ago, even 10 probably.

01:12:19.000 And so we used to think you had to be hungry all the time.

01:12:22.000 And there was a, still is, a society called the Calorie Restriction Society.

01:12:27.000 And they were hungry all the time.

01:12:29.000 They had very small meals, which is pretty tough.

01:12:31.000 I tried that and gave up after a week.

01:12:33.000 But this new paradigm is that you don't have to always be hungry.

01:12:38.000 Similar to you don't always have to be on a treadmill.

01:12:40.000 You can do it for a short time, make it intense, and then you can let your body recover and go back to a normal life for a little bit.

01:12:48.000 And that's great news.

01:12:49.000 That means that we can have our cake and eat it too, so to speak, as long as the cake doesn't have a lot of sugar in it.

01:12:55.000 Now, when you are on this protocol of restricted eating plus metformin, when do you take what, and when do you exercise, and how do you balance it out?

01:13:08.000 When do you know what to do what?

01:13:11.000 I use my body as a guide.

01:13:12.000 Now that I'm 50, I have a pretty good...

01:13:14.000 You know how your body feels and reacts.

01:13:16.000 I'm also measuring it, a ring that measures my pulse and my sleep.

01:13:21.000 Is that the aura?

01:13:22.000 Yeah.

01:13:23.000 Yeah.

01:13:23.000 How do you spell that?

01:13:25.000 O-U-R-A? Yep. 0.98

01:13:28.000 Isn't Kevin Rose a part of that company?

01:13:32.000 Is he?

01:13:33.000 Is that it?

01:13:33.000 Yeah.

01:13:33.000 Jamie says yeah.

01:13:34.000 Okay.

01:13:35.000 From Digg.

01:13:35.000 You know, Digg.com.

01:13:37.000 You don't know Digg?

01:13:38.000 No.

01:13:38.000 How dare you?

01:13:39.000 Sorry. 1.00

01:13:40.000 It's a good place to go find cool shit. 0.99

01:13:41.000 Okay. 0.99

01:13:42.000 I'll go.

01:13:42.000 Digg.com.

01:13:43.000 Shout out to Digg.

01:13:44.000 Yeah, I go there every day because real interesting stories on the internet.

01:13:48.000 You're always finding cool, weird videos and just fascinating science stories.

01:13:53.000 Stories, human nature, human interest stories.

01:13:56.000 Sounds good.

01:13:57.000 I have a watch.

01:13:59.000 What kind of watch are you using?

01:14:00.000 The Apple Watch.

01:14:01.000 Okay, how does that measure?

01:14:03.000 By the way, they just released Apple Watch 5 today.

01:14:08.000 Apparently it's better.

01:14:09.000 You might want to get it.

01:14:10.000 What does it do?

01:14:11.000 What does the Apple Watch do?

01:14:14.000 Well, it changes songs in my headphones.

01:14:18.000 It tells the time occasionally.

01:14:20.000 But yeah, what's useful with it is pulse and activity.

01:14:24.000 And if I haven't moved enough during the day, I've got a standing desk and that's been helpful to make me move around a little bit more.

01:14:31.000 But mainly it's, and I also do occasional blood tests to make sure that my body's optimized as best I can, personalized.

01:14:39.000 And using all those measures.

01:14:41.000 You read the data off your watch?

01:14:42.000 Like how do you read it?

01:14:43.000 What application are you using?

01:14:45.000 Nothing special, just on my phone, have a look.

01:14:48.000 Okay, so you just have a look at what your resting heart rate is, how much activity, how far you're walking, how many calories you're burning, that kind of deal?

01:14:56.000 Yeah.

01:14:57.000 Yeah, pretty simple.

01:14:58.000 And I'm happy to say my resting heart rate's really low, which means things are going okay so far for me, even though I don't do enough exercise, as you rightly point out.

01:15:08.000 I think my resting heart rate's 46. That's very good.

01:15:13.000 It's pretty amazing for a guy that barely does exercise.

01:15:16.000 Yeah, you must have good genetics.

01:15:17.000 Well, obviously you do.

01:15:18.000 Your dad's in phenomenal shape at 80. No, we have terrible genetics.

01:15:21.000 Well, how's he in such great shape at 80?

01:15:24.000 Well, we don't know.

01:15:25.000 But it could be that he's been exercising and he's also been on this paradigm.

01:15:29.000 So one of the effects in mice at least of NMN, which is what we're taking, is improved blood flow.

01:15:36.000 You get the benefits of exercise without having to exercise, if you're a mouse.

01:15:39.000 And those mice, they were running on a treadmill for 50% further because the blood flow and the lactate was reduced.

01:15:46.000 Really?

01:15:47.000 So maybe that's happening.

01:15:48.000 That's incredible.

01:15:49.000 Now, what is the difference between the effects of NMN and IV NAD, which is very popular?

01:15:58.000 There's people that take IV NAD, and I've never done it, but we've talked about doing it many times and having it brought in here, and sometimes people do it, and they do it very quickly.

01:16:08.000 When you do it, it only takes 10 minutes, but it hurts like hell.

01:16:11.000 Apparently, it gives you, like, stomach knots, and you feel terrible.

01:16:15.000 Right.

01:16:15.000 All right.

01:16:16.000 Have you done it?

01:16:17.000 I haven't admitted publicly that I've done it.

01:16:19.000 Do it.

01:16:20.000 But I try everything once.

01:16:22.000 Pull up that microphone.

01:16:23.000 I try everything once.

01:16:25.000 Yeah.

01:16:25.000 And so last time I was out here in LA, I gave it a shot, so to speak.

01:16:31.000 Yeah?

01:16:31.000 How was it?

01:16:33.000 It was fine.

01:16:34.000 It was fine. 0.98

01:16:35.000 Now, let's get to the science in a minute, but what I found was, so it was a shot in the butt with some NAD. So why didn't they do it intravenously? 0.69

01:16:44.000 I thought that was the move.

01:16:45.000 They did it intramuscularly?

01:16:46.000 Right.

01:16:47.000 Right.

01:16:47.000 This doctor is experimenting.

01:16:50.000 Oh, Jesus.

01:16:51.000 Yeah.

01:16:52.000 It was a friend of a friend, so I had a...

01:16:55.000 He's like, I got an idea.

01:16:56.000 Come here.

01:16:57.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:16:57.000 Come here, dammit. 1.00

01:16:58.000 But here's the thing. 0.99

01:16:59.000 It felt...

01:17:00.000 I had tingles in my legs.

01:17:01.000 I felt a little different for a few minutes, maybe 10 minutes, and then it went away.

01:17:08.000 But the science, we don't know yet.

01:17:10.000 We're still trying to figure out if that actually works or not.

01:17:13.000 So instead, I'm taking the molecule that we've studied in my lab, which is taken as a pill.

01:17:18.000 Now, there are a lot of people that swear by the IV version of NAD, and when they do it intravenously, apparently you feel phenomenal.

01:17:27.000 And there's quite a few people I know.

01:17:29.000 My friend Kyle Kingsbury has done it several times, and he's very big on the latest and the greatest of health crazes.

01:17:37.000 Well, I know it's being used widely, especially down in Florida, to treat addiction.

01:17:42.000 NAD. Interesting.

01:17:44.000 IV. And I get emails all the time, which is best.

01:17:47.000 But, you know, I'm a scientist.

01:17:48.000 I'm at Harvard Medical School.

01:17:49.000 So I have to always be based on facts.

01:17:51.000 And the fact is, we don't know if it works yet.

01:17:54.000 Right.

01:17:55.000 Anecdotes are anecdotes.

01:17:56.000 My father's story is not a clinical trial, right?

01:17:58.000 We need to do more.

01:18:00.000 But what's interesting about this field is that because people have access to information through podcasts like yours and through the internet now that papers...

01:18:08.000 You can go to what's called PubMed Central and find papers.

01:18:11.000 People are educating themselves just like scientists used to and they can go to the doctor or go to the internet and try experiments on themselves.

01:18:21.000 Now, I don't condone that.

01:18:23.000 I can't.

01:18:24.000 I'm a researcher, not a doctor.

01:18:25.000 But I find it really interesting that we're in a new phase of society where people can learn more in many cases than their doctors actually know.

01:18:34.000 Sure, in particular when it comes to nutrition, because that's one of the things that I've found that's shocking when you talk to some doctors and you talk to them about nutrition, particularly supplementation, and they'll say things like, well, you can get everything from a good diet.

01:18:48.000 Like, can you really?

01:18:50.000 Can you really? 1.00

01:18:51.000 Like, how much time did you spend in school, motherfucker? 1.00

01:18:54.000 Like, how much time did you study nutrition? 1.00

01:18:55.000 This is nonsense talk.

01:18:57.000 You can get everything from a good diet.

01:18:59.000 What's your good diet?

01:18:59.000 Tell me what a good diet is.

01:19:00.000 What are you getting from that good diet?

01:19:02.000 How are you getting that vitamin B12 in high doses?

01:19:04.000 Where are you getting your C? Where are you getting your D3? What are you getting, huh?

01:19:08.000 Where are you getting your essential fatty acids?

01:19:10.000 What's the optimal level of essential fatty acids? 0.99

01:19:13.000 And they don't have a fucking clue what they're talking about. 0.92

01:19:16.000 You know, there's so many doctors that go through their entire medical, you know, orthopedic surgeons or what have you, they go through their entire medical school with like maybe four or five hours of nutrition research. 0.99

01:19:28.000 Right.

01:19:28.000 I have to be careful what I say.

01:19:29.000 I work at the medical school, but I do...

01:19:31.000 I love doctors.

01:19:32.000 Don't get me wrong.

01:19:33.000 Right.

01:19:33.000 We need them.

01:19:33.000 We're not going to do surgery on ourselves.

01:19:36.000 Right.

01:19:37.000 That said, some doctors will listen to their patients and do research.

01:19:40.000 Those are the great doctors that actually stay on top of things, but it's really hard, right?

01:19:44.000 They're already working 12, 14 hours a day.

01:19:47.000 So let's be fair to doctors.

01:19:49.000 Plus, they have to work within the insurance system.

01:19:51.000 I understand that.

01:19:51.000 The only problem that I have is when they say things like, you get everything you need with a good doctor.

01:19:56.000 You remember, three square meals a day. 1.00

01:19:58.000 That's bullshit too. 0.99

01:19:58.000 Make sure you follow the food pyramid and eat a lot of grain. 0.99

01:20:02.000 Right, right.

01:20:02.000 Remember that?

01:20:03.000 Well, and don't eat eggs, don't drink milk.

01:20:05.000 Hilarious.

01:20:06.000 Eat margarine.

01:20:07.000 Yeah, hilarious.

01:20:08.000 Well, milk is a sketchy thing, quite honestly, because you're drinking this dead liquid.

01:20:13.000 It's been homogenized and pasteurized.

01:20:16.000 I find my body reacts very differently to raw milk than it does to milk that has been processed.

01:20:24.000 I wonder if anyone studied the microbiome, that might be helpful too.

01:20:27.000 It just makes sense that it's got all the enzymes in it.

01:20:30.000 That's how the human being or a body, any animal is supposed to naturally process that milk.

01:20:37.000 Yeah, I guess it's mostly sterile.

01:20:39.000 Yeah.

01:20:39.000 But yeah, I use whole milk in my day.

01:20:42.000 It's surprising, right?

01:20:43.000 Because I'm trying to avoid calories, but the benefits in the taste and how I feel, that yogurt, I make myself out of whole milk.

01:20:50.000 You make yogurt?

01:20:51.000 Yeah.

01:20:52.000 What are you, a wild man?

01:20:53.000 Why don't you buy it?

01:20:54.000 You're so short on time.

01:20:56.000 What are you doing?

01:20:56.000 Are you making your own butter too?

01:20:58.000 You got one of them churners?

01:20:59.000 Yeah.

01:21:00.000 Yeah, well, you know, we all have our hobbies.

01:21:03.000 One of my hobbies.

01:21:04.000 That's your hobby?

01:21:04.000 Not really.

01:21:05.000 That's a cool hobby.

01:21:06.000 No, here's the problem.

01:21:07.000 I got so hooked on this type of yogurt, which I first made for my son, trying to help him.

01:21:13.000 He has a weight and eating issue.

01:21:16.000 I was thinking that would help him, but I got addicted to the yogurt, and so is everyone in my family now.

01:21:21.000 So if I don't make the yogurt, they're like, Dad, where's the yogurt?

01:21:24.000 Yeah.

01:21:24.000 Oh, no kidding.

01:21:25.000 So how do you do it?

01:21:26.000 Oh, it's really easy.

01:21:26.000 You get packets.

01:21:28.000 There's three different packets.

01:21:29.000 You rip them open, put them in whole milk, shake it, and stick it in the oven on defrost for 24 hours.

01:21:38.000 Really?

01:21:39.000 In the oven?

01:21:40.000 So what is defrost?

01:21:41.000 Like, what temperature is that around?

01:21:43.000 It's 35 Celsius, whatever that is, 95. What is that?

01:21:46.000 Is that 90?

01:21:47.000 95?

01:21:47.000 So you're using like a Dutch oven or something like that?

01:21:50.000 No, it's regular oven.

01:21:51.000 But I mean in terms of the pan that you put in the oven.

01:21:54.000 Oh, you mean what's the bottle?

01:21:55.000 Yes.

01:21:56.000 It's just a large mason jar.

01:21:59.000 Okay.

01:22:00.000 And just heating it up with the probiotics inside of it, the bacteria inside it, it just starts to coalesce?

01:22:08.000 Yeah, and I've perfected it.

01:22:09.000 The first few ones were not great, but now it works every time.

01:22:13.000 And actually the protocol on the internet said you have to boil it, measure the temperature, get it all right, sterilize it.

01:22:18.000 And I just pour it straight in, shake it, stick it in, it's fine.

01:22:21.000 Really?

01:22:22.000 Yeah, so far.

01:22:24.000 Huh.

01:22:24.000 Did you ever get it analyzed?

01:22:26.000 No.

01:22:26.000 No?

01:22:27.000 But you're a scientist.

01:22:29.000 You want to send a little cup of it to somebody and go, hey man, take a look at this.

01:22:33.000 What are you worried about?

01:22:34.000 I'm not worried.

01:22:35.000 I'm not worried at all.

01:22:37.000 I'm just curious as to how potent it is.

01:22:39.000 There's various levels of acidophilus that you're getting from yogurt.

01:22:44.000 Yeah, I researched it before I started and this is a company that makes a yogurt that matches a healthy microbiome.

01:22:52.000 It's the only one I'm aware of.

01:22:54.000 That's great.

01:22:55.000 And you use whole milk.

01:22:57.000 You don't use raw milk.

01:22:59.000 Right.

01:22:59.000 I don't have good access to raw milk.

01:23:01.000 Where do you get it?

01:23:02.000 Like a health food store, like Sprouts or something like that.

01:23:07.000 I should try that.

01:23:08.000 Yeah, I think they have it at Air One.

01:23:10.000 Maybe Whole Foods has it.

01:23:13.000 It's really tricky because you...

01:23:15.000 It's not even legal in some places to have whole milk.

01:23:19.000 In fact, people have been arrested and just locked up for having whole milk.

01:23:25.000 Yes.

01:23:25.000 Google that because it's pretty preposterous.

01:23:28.000 When you think about how easy it is to buy whiskey, right?

01:23:31.000 And then think about people buying whole milk.

01:23:35.000 That whole milk is apparently for some people.

01:23:38.000 I mean, it might have just something to do with skirting FDA regulations and things along those lines.

01:23:44.000 It gets very complicated, for sure.

01:23:46.000 And then the reason for homogenization and pasteurization is obviously health, right?

01:23:52.000 We're trying to protect people, and also it's shelf life.

01:23:54.000 It stays on the shelf longer.

01:23:56.000 Mm-hmm.

01:23:57.000 But I've definitely bought it.

01:23:58.000 Yeah, there's a small...

01:23:59.000 What is it called?

01:24:01.000 A small food group?

01:24:03.000 Raw Food Club?

01:24:04.000 They were raided in 2011 for sharing raw milk or something.

01:24:10.000 The latest raw milk raid.

01:24:11.000 An attack on food freedom?

01:24:22.000 Yeah, like Twinkies?

01:24:24.000 I mean, how hard is it?

01:24:26.000 Look, you can, I'm sure, get food poisoning from spoiled milk, right?

01:24:32.000 But isn't spoiled milk yogurt, ultimately?

01:24:35.000 Right?

01:24:36.000 Well, here's what I do with food.

01:24:38.000 If it stinks, I don't eat it.

01:24:40.000 Good move, bro.

01:24:41.000 And I think milk, you smell pretty quickly if it's going bad.

01:24:45.000 This involved unwashed room temperature eggs.

01:24:48.000 The other count.

01:24:50.000 Unwashed room temperature eggs.

01:24:51.000 A storage method Rossum members prefer.

01:24:54.000 By the way, when we had chickens, one of these nasty coyotes killed all my chickens, we would store our eggs at room temperature.

01:25:02.000 We'd put them in a bowl.

01:25:03.000 We would wash the outside of the egg and put them in a bowl and they would sit on the counter and I was eating them all day long.

01:25:10.000 Nothing happened. 0.99

01:25:11.000 Healthy as fuck. 0.99

01:25:13.000 Agents dumped gallons of raw milk and filled a large flatbed with the seized food, including coconuts. 1.00

01:25:19.000 We seized your fucking coconuts. 1.00

01:25:21.000 Watermelons and frozen buffalo meat. 1.00

01:25:24.000 What the fuck? 1.00

01:25:25.000 Like, what is this, agents? 1.00

01:25:27.000 Who are these assholes that are getting paid government money from... 1.00

01:25:33.000 Our taxes to steal frozen meat. 1.00

01:25:39.000 Jesus Christ.

01:25:40.000 Christopher Darden, who helped prosecute O.J. Simpson, appeared at Stewart's arraignment just in time to lower his bail.

01:25:46.000 Alright, so Christopher Darden's out there helping people.

01:25:49.000 Whatever. 0.92

01:25:51.000 Gross.

01:25:52.000 I mean, I don't think you should, you know, we should somehow or another find out Whether there's a way to test if this raw milk is fresh enough for people to eat.

01:26:06.000 But if it is, people who live on farms have been drinking raw milk since the beginning of time.

01:26:11.000 It's normal and healthy.

01:26:12.000 It tastes better.

01:26:14.000 It's way easier for you to digest.

01:26:16.000 I get a little weird when I drink straight...

01:26:19.000 If I have milk and cookies...

01:26:21.000 Which I love.

01:26:23.000 I don't know.

01:26:24.000 Maybe it's the cookies or the milk.

01:26:25.000 Hmm. 1.00

01:26:25.000 I might be full of shit here. 1.00

01:26:27.000 Now that I'm thinking about it, the cookies might be what's messing with my stomach. 0.99

01:26:31.000 I don't think so, though.

01:26:32.000 Because you get this feeling from the milk.

01:26:35.000 It's probably both.

01:26:36.000 Now that I think about it, it's both.

01:26:39.000 Well, in France, you get the unpasteurized cheese.

01:26:42.000 Yes.

01:26:43.000 My friend Jean-Marc used to bring it back in his luggage.

01:26:47.000 He would smuggle back for a raclette.

01:26:50.000 You know what that is?

01:26:51.000 Yeah.

01:26:52.000 It's like a dish that he would make with meat and cheese.

01:26:56.000 Yeah, that's good.

01:26:57.000 But I don't hear the French dying in droves either. 0.99

01:26:59.000 They seem to be healthy as fuck, and they're not as fat. 1.00

01:27:01.000 Right. 0.99

01:27:02.000 Yeah, their bread is better.

01:27:03.000 They have bread that is not from, they don't have modern wheat.

01:27:09.000 So the wheat that they have is not engineered to have more complex glutens and higher yield like we do.

01:27:17.000 So we don't buy bread in my family.

01:27:18.000 My wife makes it.

01:27:20.000 Oh, nice.

01:27:20.000 Yeah.

01:27:22.000 Sourdough?

01:27:23.000 Yeah.

01:27:23.000 A lot of sourdough.

01:27:24.000 The yeast is even wild.

01:27:26.000 She got that from Belgium.

01:27:28.000 A friend of ours hung some yeast, what is it, some stuff in a tree, collected the yeast, brought it back to the U.S. and shared it with us.

01:27:37.000 Caught it?

01:27:38.000 Like caught some yeast?

01:27:39.000 Well, he put some wet dough up in a tree and left it there for a few days and caught this wild yeast up in the I think?

01:28:01.000 Well, I'm trying to keep my blood glucose levels steady, not spike too much.

01:28:06.000 That's pretty clear that that's not healthy.

01:28:08.000 And just eating a bunch of bread will be a good way to spike that.

01:28:12.000 One of the things that I've heard about the French and Italians in general is that they eat their bread with either butter or olive oil.

01:28:20.000 And that these healthy fats that you're getting along with the bread is one of the reasons why it doesn't have the same sort of health hit.

01:28:30.000 And then the complex glutens, you know, the engineered wheat that we have.

01:28:37.000 When you eat pasta in Italy, it has a different effect on your body.

01:28:41.000 It just feels different.

01:28:42.000 Yeah, exactly.

01:28:44.000 So there are a number of people that I know, maybe people you know too, who are putting glucose monitors on their arm here to see what foods they react to.

01:28:53.000 Rhonda Patrick's been doing this for a while. 0.70

01:28:55.000 And actually, I asked her, what's the worst food you've seen in your body to spike glucose?

01:29:00.000 She said, grapes.

01:29:01.000 Avoid grapes.

01:29:02.000 Really?

01:29:03.000 Yeah.

01:29:03.000 Avoid grapes.

01:29:06.000 Yeah, I wish I hadn't asked her that.

01:29:07.000 That's so counterintuitive, right?

01:29:09.000 You think you're eating healthy when you're having some fruit.

01:29:11.000 As I said, what was the biggest surprise?

01:29:13.000 She said potatoes aren't so bad.

01:29:15.000 Well, there's a thing that you can do with potatoes, right, where you boil them and then cool them off and then reheat them and apparently has a profound effect on the way it impacts your blood sugar levels.

01:29:27.000 That it's far healthier when you...

01:29:30.000 There's some sort of a process.

01:29:31.000 See if you can find out what that process was.

01:29:33.000 Who explained that to us?

01:29:34.000 Do you remember?

01:29:35.000 Was it Rhonda?

01:29:36.000 Probably was.

01:29:37.000 99% of my nutrition knowledge I get from Rhonda Patrick.

01:29:42.000 But I believe it's something to do with the way the potato reacts to being boiled and then chilled and then reheated again.

01:29:54.000 There's something about it.

01:29:56.000 So the starches are less available somehow?

01:29:59.000 Somehow.

01:29:59.000 And it has a much more healthy effect on your blood glucose levels and doesn't spike you in the way that just a straight up baked potato would.

01:30:11.000 This would be coming from Chris Kresser.

01:30:12.000 Aha! 0.94

01:30:13.000 That's the other 1% of my nutrition knowledge.

01:30:16.000 It's probably like 60-40.

01:30:18.000 Potatoes for gut health and weight loss.

01:30:20.000 The potato hack.

01:30:21.000 It says the potato intervention is a short-term tool to check the reactivity of the gut to resistant starch.

01:30:27.000 Reset the hedonic system.

01:30:29.000 Create metabolic flexibility.

01:30:31.000 Resolve inflammatory conditions and provide the patient with an empowerment tool.

01:30:37.000 To increase the fat loss of their dietary plan.

01:30:40.000 It's not meant as a standalone diet, but rather a dietary tool to decrease hunger.

01:30:46.000 Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. 0.83

01:30:47.000 Scroll up there so we can find out what the fuck the potato hack is. 0.98

01:30:50.000 Explanation. 0.95

01:30:50.000 Poor potato has been maligned. 0.95

01:30:55.000 Here's an explanation of functional medicine.

01:30:56.000 Chris Kresher on the Joe Rogan Show.

01:30:58.000 Ha! 0.89

01:30:59.000 Right here.

01:30:59.000 Look at that.

01:31:00.000 Scroll up.

01:31:02.000 The magic of this plan leads to its clinical efficacy is the amount of resistant starch.

01:31:08.000 Resistant starch is a type of starch that is indigestible to us but feeds our microbiome.

01:31:13.000 When a potato is heated and then cooled, a significant amount of its starch is retrograded into resistant starch.

01:31:21.000 This means that the effect on blood sugar is greatly dampened.

01:31:25.000 The potato can even be reheated and it will still retain its resistant starch content.

01:31:31.000 The nourishment to our gut biome and the subsequent metabolic benefits cannot be overstated.

01:31:37.000 I've seen this be crucial in some patients who have stalled on a low-carb or keto eating plan, but still have significant body fat left to lose.

01:31:48.000 Historically, resistant starch would have been present in most roots, tubers, unripe bananas, plantains, etc., but is often devoid in our current diets.

01:32:00.000 Chris Krasher in the house.

01:32:05.000 Yeah, so there you go.

01:32:06.000 So when I was in Africa, you reminded me, they eat a lot of blueberries.

01:32:09.000 And so these colored foods are also good to eat.

01:32:12.000 So resveratrol comes on when...

01:32:14.000 Yams, dark things, right? 1.00

01:32:16.000 Beets.

01:32:17.000 Well, yeah.

01:32:17.000 Leafy vegetables, but also fruits that are very colored.

01:32:21.000 Colorful.

01:32:22.000 So why is that?

01:32:23.000 Why is that?

01:32:24.000 Well, I'm glad you asked.

01:32:27.000 So we have this idea called xenohormesis.

01:32:29.000 And it's a terrible name for something that's quite simple.

01:32:31.000 And that is that these molecules from plants are produced to make the plants healthier.

01:32:36.000 These are stress response chemicals.

01:32:40.000 And if you stress plants, they turn colored.

01:32:42.000 Turn on a UV lamp or put a plant in the sun, it'll turn reddish, you know.

01:32:46.000 Those are stress chemicals to survive.

01:32:49.000 And I believe that we've evolved to sense those chemicals in our food supply.

01:32:53.000 Oh, so we're attracted to juicy red tomatoes as opposed to pale tomatoes.

01:32:59.000 We're not just attracted to it.

01:33:01.000 I think we're attracted to it because they're colorful.

01:33:03.000 But what our bodies get out of it is that these chemicals go into our bloodstream and they turn on our defenses against disease to survive.

01:33:11.000 Why is that good?

01:33:12.000 Why did that evolve or potentially evolve?

01:33:16.000 I think because when our food supply was stressed, we need to get ready for adversity because we probably run out of food.

01:33:22.000 And if you're a bird or some other dumb animal, dumber animal, or even a yeast cell, how are you going to know if your food supply is going to run out? 0.84

01:33:31.000 You've got to know it chemically. 0.98

01:33:32.000 So these chemicals are a heads up that adversity is coming.

01:33:36.000 So if you eat a lot of these chemicals through, say, red wine, which is stressed grapes and other things like that, blueberries, these chemicals, they're probably not working mainly through antioxidant activity.

01:33:47.000 They're giving us this stress heads up.

01:33:49.000 Isn't there, there's, that's a controversial thing, the red wine thing, correct?

01:33:54.000 Like whether or not red wine, the actual compound of resveratrol is where we're getting our benefit from because it's apparently a very small amount of resveratrol in red wine.

01:34:06.000 Yeah, sure.

01:34:07.000 It's not really controversial except when people exaggerate and say that it's all resveratrol.

01:34:12.000 Resveratrol is a component of dozens of healthy molecules in red wine.

01:34:16.000 Quercetin, which is good for a number of things.

01:34:19.000 There's a whole bunch of polyphenols they're called.

01:34:22.000 And so resveratrol is part of that cocktail.

01:34:26.000 Is this due to the fermentation process?

01:34:28.000 Because we're talking about grapes themselves with the high sugar content actually being something we should avoid, right?

01:34:34.000 Right.

01:34:34.000 So don't eat the grapes.

01:34:35.000 But wine, if you don't have too much of it, will have a concentrated amount of these xenohermetic molecules like resveratrol and quercetin.

01:34:44.000 Is this apparent in red wine?

01:34:47.000 It's really only in red wine.

01:34:49.000 So white wine is just for chicks, right? 0.96

01:34:52.000 Not as healthy.

01:34:53.000 Not as healthy.

01:34:54.000 Actually, that's a joke for my friend Bud.

01:34:56.000 Yeah, you'll get in trouble for that one.

01:34:58.000 No, it's just for my friend Bud.

01:34:59.000 He always loves white wine.

01:35:00.000 I'm like, that's for chicks, bro.

01:35:02.000 I'm joking, folks.

01:35:03.000 Just jokes.

01:35:05.000 Don't get touchy.

01:35:06.000 Yeah.

01:35:07.000 So when we treated mice with resveratrol, they were immune to the effects of a high-fat diet, Western diet.

01:35:14.000 And we've traced this down to a single genetic pathway that we work on, these sirtuins I talked about, these NAD-responsive pathways.

01:35:23.000 Really? 0.84

01:35:23.000 So they were immune to eating shitty food, like the negative aspects of eating shitty food? 0.84

01:35:28.000 Yeah, this was 2003. That's why it hit all the newspapers, because it was the first molecule that was safe and could mimic the effects of fasting or caloric restriction without actually having to be hungry. 0.57

01:35:39.000 Wow.

01:35:40.000 And what kind of dose were you giving these mice?

01:35:43.000 It was the equivalent of about 250 milligrams a day in a human.

01:35:48.000 Okay, so it was one quarter of what you recommend people take.

01:35:53.000 Right.

01:35:53.000 I don't recommend people take anything.

01:35:55.000 Okay, what you take.

01:35:57.000 Let's just say that.

01:35:58.000 No recommendations.

01:35:59.000 Sorry, folks.

01:36:00.000 Yeah.

01:36:01.000 I'm taking a higher dose because I've looked at human clinical data and I think that a higher dose may be required to have an even better effect on longevity.

01:36:10.000 But the results are very clear.

01:36:13.000 When we opened up these mice, maybe I shouldn't have said that, when we examined those mice, carefully put them to sleep for scientific purposes, It was clear that they were healthier.

01:36:25.000 Now, they were still fat.

01:36:26.000 That was interesting.

01:36:27.000 They were still fat, so we figured the experiment didn't work.

01:36:29.000 But their arteries were clean.

01:36:31.000 Their livers were like a healthy, lean, young mouse.

01:36:35.000 And when we looked at their metabolism, it was like a younger mouse.

01:36:39.000 So let me ask you this then, because you take statins.

01:36:42.000 If you are fairly convinced because of the research of the positive benefits of resveratrol in healthy aging and healthy metabolism in their arteries, why are you taking statins?

01:36:54.000 Because you know that there are some negative effects of statins.

01:36:59.000 Right.

01:36:59.000 Well, if I had five lifetimes, I'd probably try that experiment, but I don't want to take the risk.

01:37:03.000 You just don't want to risk it.

01:37:05.000 Yeah.

01:37:06.000 Is there enough – I mean, have you looked through the papers, the research papers on statins?

01:37:11.000 A little bit.

01:37:13.000 There is some correlations with dementia, and the brain does need cholesterol, so that might be one of the problems.

01:37:19.000 Is your dad on statins?

01:37:20.000 Yes.

01:37:21.000 Really?

01:37:22.000 We have a whole bunch of genes that predispose.

01:37:25.000 23andMe said basically give up now.

01:37:28.000 Wow.

01:37:29.000 It's pretty horrible.

01:37:30.000 So yeah, if I make it to 80, I'm doing pretty well. 0.99

01:37:33.000 Damn. 0.97

01:37:35.000 Interesting. 0.98

01:37:37.000 Because Bourdain, when he was alive, he had made a decision to take statins versus change his diet.

01:37:45.000 This was before he got into jiu-jitsu. 0.64

01:37:48.000 When he was traveling the world and eating the finest foods and drinking wine to excess every night and enjoying the shit out of it. 0.72

01:37:56.000 You know, we had a conversation about it. 0.97

01:37:58.000 He's like, I would rather eat well.

01:37:59.000 He said, I'd rather eat well and take these drugs.

01:38:01.000 He goes, I know the side effects.

01:38:02.000 I know they're dangerous.

01:38:04.000 So then we have a conversation maybe two years later.

01:38:07.000 He gets really into jiu-jitsu.

01:38:09.000 His wife at the time was into jiu-jitsu and she had convinced him to try it.

01:38:14.000 And he went and tried it and immediately got hooked.

01:38:17.000 And he had an addictive background.

01:38:23.000 First it was heroin and some...

01:38:26.000 Other unfortunate substances.

01:38:28.000 And then cigarettes for a while.

01:38:30.000 He quit that.

01:38:31.000 And then jujitsu became his new addiction.

01:38:33.000 And he got ripped.

01:38:35.000 I mean, he really...

01:38:37.000 I think he started training at...

01:38:42.000 58 or 59?

01:38:44.000 He started.

01:38:45.000 And then by the time he was 62, he had a full six-pack.

01:38:48.000 It was crazy to see.

01:38:49.000 I'm like, look at you, man.

01:38:50.000 This is nuts. 0.98

01:38:52.000 This is an image of him walking down the street, and he has no shirt on, and he's fucking shredded. 0.98

01:38:57.000 Got off all the statins, got off everything. 0.97

01:39:00.000 Changed his whole issue with cholesterol.

01:39:03.000 Yeah, good on him.

01:39:04.000 Just through daily exercise.

01:39:06.000 Yeah, I should try.

01:39:07.000 Yeah, you should.

01:39:08.000 Yeah, a little bit of shame that I haven't been able to get off the statins, but...

01:39:11.000 They just scare me, man.

01:39:12.000 I've just read too many things.

01:39:15.000 Well, you know, I could have gone off them when I was on a really lean diet.

01:39:19.000 I tried this Okinawa diet from...

01:39:21.000 Okinawa?

01:39:22.000 Okinawa, yeah.

01:39:23.000 So just fish mostly and...

01:39:25.000 And tofu.

01:39:27.000 How'd that go?

01:39:28.000 That was great, but then I had kids.

01:39:30.000 Oh.

01:39:30.000 You can't feed tofu to kids every day.

01:39:32.000 Right.

01:39:33.000 You can't have separate food just for yourself?

01:39:35.000 I'm not going to bother.

01:39:36.000 I understand.

01:39:38.000 That's the thing.

01:39:39.000 You're so limited by time.

01:39:41.000 You have such an involved research schedule and life schedule and travel schedule.

01:39:46.000 I'm a pretty average guy.

01:39:48.000 I'm not militant about what I eat.

01:39:51.000 I try my best every day to do what I can.

01:39:53.000 But this statin thing, I just haven't had the chance to do it.

01:39:56.000 But resveratrol, I don't think, is sufficient to keep these cholesterol levels down.

01:40:01.000 So, combination so far.

01:40:03.000 How long have you been on statins?

01:40:06.000 Since 29. Oh, wow.

01:40:08.000 So you really have been on them for 21 years.

01:40:10.000 Not only that, super high dose.

01:40:11.000 So it's 80 milligrams.

01:40:14.000 What's a normal dose?

01:40:15.000 10. That's crazy.

01:40:17.000 Yeah, my doctor, one of the best at Harvard, looked at my genetics and said, you're fucked. 1.00

01:40:23.000 Wow. 0.99

01:40:24.000 Yeah, I've got all the wrong genes, these tiny little lipoprotein particles, the ones that oxidize.

01:40:29.000 So the fact that my artery is apparently clean is good news for me.

01:40:34.000 Well, that's good news.

01:40:35.000 Like I said, you look good.

01:40:36.000 Oh, thanks.

01:40:38.000 Obviously, there's a lot of biodiversity when it comes to human beings and some things that are bad for others.

01:40:44.000 Good for some.

01:40:45.000 Well, I'm not losing my mind yet.

01:40:46.000 It's still pretty functional.

01:40:47.000 When it starts slipping away, what are you going to do?

01:40:51.000 Are you going to ask your wife or your friends, or what are you going to do?

01:40:53.000 Yeah, what am I going to do?

01:40:55.000 What if your dad's the one to tell you?

01:40:56.000 Yeah, that could happen. 1.00

01:40:58.000 Fuck! 1.00

01:40:58.000 Right. 1.00

01:40:59.000 He's 85. Yeah, my dad's changing my diapers.

01:41:02.000 David, sit down.

01:41:03.000 David, you asked me the same question three times in a row.

01:41:07.000 The way it's going, that could definitely happen.

01:41:09.000 Well, do you get a lot of sleep?

01:41:11.000 I do now.

01:41:12.000 Now that I'm monitoring it, yeah.

01:41:15.000 What's a lot of sleep for you?

01:41:17.000 Between six and seven hours.

01:41:19.000 Oh, that's good.

01:41:21.000 Dr. Matthew Walker was a guy that I had on my podcast who studies sleep and he was fascinating and it changed my entire opinion about what's necessary.

01:41:31.000 There's a direct correlation between limited amounts of sleep and Alzheimer's.

01:41:34.000 Direct correlation.

01:41:36.000 He's like, it's one of the most established links that you can see between a disease and a cause.

01:41:43.000 I'm misquoting it, I'm sure.

01:41:44.000 It's an association.

01:41:46.000 I'm a scientist, I always have to be skeptical as to whether if you're predisposed to Alzheimer's, you have trouble sleeping.

01:41:54.000 Oh, interesting.

01:41:55.000 And you start taking Ambien, now people say, well, Ambien and Alzheimer's are correlated.

01:41:59.000 Well, yeah, maybe it's the other way around. 0.90

01:42:02.000 Yeah, Ambien scares the shit out of me. 0.90

01:42:05.000 You don't take that, do you? 0.80

01:42:06.000 Tiny bits.

01:42:07.000 Oh, that stuff's nuts.

01:42:10.000 Because people take it and they say things and they don't know what they're saying.

01:42:13.000 Right.

01:42:13.000 Well, the recommended dose, at least it used to be for men, is 10 milligrams, which is massive.

01:42:18.000 I nibble on it.

01:42:19.000 I take maybe a milligram just to nod off if I'm desperate with jet lag.

01:42:23.000 But yeah, doctors, many I know, say that 10 milligrams is probably too high.

01:42:27.000 But check with your doctor. 0.99

01:42:28.000 Yeah, well, Matthew Walker says, stay the fuck away from that stuff, period. 0.96

01:42:32.000 He said, you're not getting real sleep anyway. 0.98

01:42:34.000 You're not going in through full sleep cycles.

01:42:36.000 You're just drugging your brain into a state of unconsciousness.

01:42:40.000 Probably with 10 milligrams, that makes sense.

01:42:41.000 For me, because I'm monitoring it, I know that I'm getting good deep sleep.

01:42:44.000 Have you tried other, like melatonin, things along those lines?

01:42:49.000 Oh, sure.

01:42:50.000 Not effective?

01:42:52.000 Not as much.

01:42:53.000 Sometimes melatonin with...

01:42:56.000 Milligram of ambient is necessary.

01:42:58.000 But a big change for me has been just don't stay up watching TV. Get the screens off.

01:43:03.000 Wear the glasses.

01:43:03.000 They really help.

01:43:05.000 Yeah, the screens. 1.00

01:43:06.000 Watching those goddamn screens before you go to bed. 1.00

01:43:09.000 I love doing it, though. 1.00

01:43:10.000 I love watching a TV show before I go to sleep.

01:43:13.000 It's probably the worst time to do it, though, right?

01:43:16.000 Yeah, it is.

01:43:16.000 Really.

01:43:17.000 I mean, you can watch the shows.

01:43:18.000 Just put the yellow glasses on.

01:43:20.000 Oh, like blue light emitting, yeah, blocking glasses.

01:43:23.000 One of my sponsors, Movement Watches.

01:43:26.000 They have blue light emitting glasses.

01:43:30.000 Need to get those, huh?

01:43:31.000 Blocking or emitting?

01:43:33.000 Blocking.

01:43:33.000 Blue light blocking.

01:43:34.000 Yeah.

01:43:35.000 Yeah, not emitting.

01:43:36.000 How can a glass emit?

01:43:38.000 You know, blocking blue light emitting signals.

01:43:41.000 Yeah.

01:43:41.000 Well, you can have blue light emitting glasses, too.

01:43:43.000 That'd be good.

01:43:43.000 Really?

01:43:44.000 Well, for the middle of winter.

01:43:46.000 Oh, if you're getting depressed.

01:43:47.000 Yeah.

01:43:48.000 Well, where you live.

01:43:49.000 There's no real middle of winter here, buddy.

01:43:51.000 Where you used to live, too.

01:43:52.000 Yeah.

01:43:53.000 Not too far from where I live.

01:43:53.000 I escaped.

01:43:54.000 Yeah, it's pretty tragic. 0.94

01:43:56.000 Middle of winter, I want to kill myself.

01:43:58.000 Do you get that seasonal affected disorder? 0.84

01:44:01.000 Oh, for sure.

01:44:02.000 Do you?

01:44:02.000 Yeah.

01:44:03.000 Yeah, because I'm working indoors.

01:44:04.000 I don't see sun for months.

01:44:07.000 Well, that gray sky, when it's every day is gray, over and over again, you see no real sky for so long.

01:44:14.000 It's so weird.

01:44:16.000 Yeah.

01:44:17.000 I miss Australia for that reason.

01:44:19.000 I get reinvigorated if I come out to LA and there's blue sky.

01:44:22.000 You really feel different.

01:44:23.000 Oh, for sure. 0.99

01:44:24.000 There's a reason why there's a fucking billion people out here. 0.89

01:44:27.000 But what is your strategy for mitigating the impact of seasonal affected disorder? 0.95

01:44:34.000 What I do, I try to go outdoors and get some sun in my eyes when I can.

01:44:39.000 Do you take vitamin D? Oh, for sure.

01:44:41.000 Does that have a difference?

01:44:42.000 It seems to have helped.

01:44:43.000 Make a difference?

01:44:44.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:44:44.000 So, yeah, vitamin D, it's questionable whether it's as healthy as people thought it was.

01:44:50.000 That said, I think it, at worst, doesn't hurt you.

01:44:54.000 Some people do sunlamps for that reason.

01:44:56.000 They'll go into a tanning booth for that reason, right?

01:45:00.000 They will.

01:45:00.000 I actually found this season, I went to the sauna in the cold shock bath, and that really helped a lot.

01:45:06.000 I don't know if it's related, but I needed to shock my body. 0.99

01:45:10.000 In the middle of winter, if you're just sitting by a fire and barely moving around, I just felt like I was a sack of shit. 0.99

01:45:16.000 Yeah, a lot of people get fat in the winter, too. 0.99

01:45:18.000 That's another thing.

01:45:19.000 They get indoors because it sucks outside, and they never wind up doing anything.

01:45:23.000 And then you're dealing with the depression of being a little bit heavier, too.

01:45:29.000 Oh, for sure.

01:45:29.000 And then you're drinking by the fire, all that kind of stuff.

01:45:32.000 But it's all about shock your body, get your body out of complacency.

01:45:35.000 And our lifestyle, everything we do, everything we buy, everything on TV that's being advertised to make your life better is shortening your lifespan by making it easier for our bodies to exist.

01:45:46.000 You don't want that.

01:45:47.000 You've got to stress it.

01:45:49.000 Yeah.

01:45:51.000 What other things do you think that people should be doing on a daily basis that most folks aren't?

01:45:59.000 Well, we covered a lot.

01:46:01.000 So there's the be hungry, get the exercise.

01:46:05.000 There's all sorts of exercise which are good, but the main ones are stretching and running and lifting.

01:46:12.000 Cold and hot we've talked about.

01:46:14.000 And then there's the supplements that mimic the benefits of those plus probably more things.

01:46:20.000 That's my regimen.

01:46:22.000 There's some other little tidbits that I put in my book, which it's a laundry list of things that I found work for me.

01:46:29.000 But those are the main things we've covered.

01:46:32.000 This sounds probably pretty boring, but I'll say it again.

01:46:37.000 Wear sunscreen?

01:46:38.000 For two reasons.

01:46:39.000 I mean, you'll look better anyway.

01:46:41.000 Not that probably young people care, but it'll make a difference by the time you're our age.

01:46:45.000 But also, because DNA damage does age you, we think that it's breaking the chromosomes, and that's the major driver of aging.

01:46:54.000 That sun will do that, x-rays will do that, maybe even airport scanners.

01:46:59.000 Certainly, I'm not a devotee of getting scanned.

01:47:03.000 I thought there were radio waves.

01:47:05.000 The millimeter, and they don't penetrate very deeply, so they're probably not too bad.

01:47:09.000 But I've looked into it.

01:47:10.000 It's about the same radiation as you get on the flight.

01:47:12.000 And given that I'm doing probably a million miles a year, I don't want to double the amount of exposure.

01:47:16.000 So when you go through that radio scanner, then the more modern TSA scanners, they give you the same amount of radiation as a flight?

01:47:23.000 Because a flight gives you the same amount of radiation as multiple x-rays, right?

01:47:29.000 I don't think it's that bad.

01:47:30.000 I believe it is.

01:47:31.000 Well, let's find out how much...

01:47:34.000 What radiation do you get on a five-hour flight, and is it comparable to multiple x-rays?

01:47:42.000 Because I believe that's what I read.

01:47:44.000 Well, the x-rays, I can say definitively, based on our research, would age you, age your tissues.

01:47:51.000 What's it doing to you?

01:47:52.000 Well, it's breaking your chromosome and causing that clock that I was talking about earlier, that biological clock.

01:47:59.000 To accelerate.

01:48:00.000 Is there something you can do to mitigate that?

01:48:02.000 If you know you have to get an x-ray, should you do something right afterwards?

01:48:07.000 Potentially.

01:48:08.000 You could take NMN, which we've shown in mice, protect them against the effects of radiation.

01:48:13.000 And that's one of the things we've talked to NASA about for getting to Mars and back safely.

01:48:18.000 So when I'm on a flight, I take some NMN in the expectation that it's going to boost my body's ability to prevent those changes to the clock.

01:48:26.000 Now, is there a commercially available NMN that you would suggest if someone wants to purchase it somewhere?

01:48:34.000 Well, so I don't divulge company names, and there's two reasons for that.

01:48:39.000 One is I haven't tested them, so I actually literally don't know.

01:48:42.000 But the other is that I want to stay above the fray and not get involved.

01:48:48.000 But there are, if people want to go Google and go look online, they can find commercially available NMN? Right.

01:48:56.000 So yeah, again, I've got a number of pages in the book on that, so it's all laid out.

01:49:01.000 But in summary...

01:49:02.000 This book right here, ladies and gentlemen.

01:49:04.000 Look at that.

01:49:06.000 Lifespan, why we age and why we don't have to.

01:49:11.000 Thanks, Joe.

01:49:12.000 That's my NPR voice.

01:49:13.000 Yeah.

01:49:13.000 You can donate.

01:49:14.000 If you enjoy programming like this...

01:49:17.000 You're putting me to sleep.

01:49:19.000 That's what they do, man.

01:49:21.000 Something happened with people.

01:49:22.000 They thought, to be intelligent, you have to talk like you're ready to put people to sleep.

01:49:27.000 It's time to get sleepy.

01:49:30.000 Anyway, so the NMN. Yes.

01:49:32.000 So there are people who are selling it on the internet.

01:49:34.000 Just to get the facts straight, I don't sell anything.

01:49:37.000 I understand.

01:49:38.000 My name is all over the internet.

01:49:39.000 If you see my name with a company, it's BS. Aha.

01:49:43.000 Beautiful.

01:49:44.000 That's good.

01:49:45.000 Anyway, so the NMN, there are companies that sell it.

01:49:48.000 It's more expensive than another molecule that's related called NR or nicotinamide riboside, which is also what the body can use to boost NAD levels.

01:49:57.000 And that's a little bit cheaper.

01:50:00.000 And they've both been shown in animals to boost the sirtuins and help those animals be healthier in old age and reverse some aspects of aging like endurance, loss of endurance, that kind of thing.

01:50:11.000 Protect the eye, protect the hearing as well.

01:50:14.000 So we don't know if it works in humans.

01:50:16.000 Let's be honest.

01:50:17.000 We don't know if these things work.

01:50:19.000 But let's also be honest.

01:50:21.000 We know what's going to happen if we don't do anything.

01:50:22.000 And that's not pretty either.

01:50:24.000 Yeah.

01:50:24.000 Do you have any high hopes for things like CRISPR? Things where there's going to be genetic alterations, and they are starting to do some experience.

01:50:35.000 You have a big smile on your face right now, so I'll let you talk.

01:50:37.000 Go ahead.

01:50:38.000 Tell me what's up.

01:50:39.000 Well, so I'm a geneticist, and I'm just down the hall from George Church, who's in my department at Harvard.

01:50:46.000 I'm a big believer in CRISPR in the sense that it will revolutionize medicine.

01:50:51.000 Can you explain it to people who don't know what it means?

01:50:54.000 So CRISPR is an acronym for basically a system that is from bacteria that they use to kill and destroy the DNA of invading organisms like a virus.

01:51:08.000 But we can now use that system to cut and change our own genomes.

01:51:13.000 It's basically a DNA cutting enzyme that doesn't cut randomly.

01:51:19.000 You can give it a barcode in the form of what's called RNA molecule that tells where that enzyme will cut in the genome.

01:51:26.000 Let's say you, Joe Rogan, have a terrible gene that's causing heart disease.

01:51:33.000 We take this CRISPR system.

01:51:35.000 We say, here's where you need to go to cut.

01:51:38.000 We can tell the enzyme to go and cut it.

01:51:41.000 Put it into your cells.

01:51:42.000 It'll go cut it and destroy that enzyme and delete it. 0.98

01:51:45.000 And you can also use it to cut the genome and insert new pieces.

01:51:48.000 So you can both subtract and add DNA at will now.

01:51:52.000 Not just randomly, but what's important is you can tell it where to go.

01:51:55.000 And that's the big breakthrough.

01:51:58.000 And they're doing some experiments on human beings.

01:52:02.000 I know there was something that they were doing, I believe, somewhere in Asia, if I remember correctly, I believe it was China, where they had done some manipulation to people to help prevent AIDS. And in the process of doing so, 0.74

01:52:19.000 they may have boosted intelligence, or the potential for intelligence.

01:52:24.000 Which was so convoluted that my puny little brain cannot understand the study. 0.98

01:52:29.000 I had to go over the same paragraph like four or five times just to try to figure out what the fuck they were saying. 0.97

01:52:34.000 Am I making any sense? 0.99

01:52:36.000 Yeah, you are.

01:52:37.000 You are.

01:52:37.000 And that was a study that I don't believe has been published but it's been reported that he is his name, his last name is he.

01:52:45.000 He took embryos and engineered them to delete CCR5 gene which is required for HIV to infect cells.

01:52:54.000 Now, most of us scientists think that that was reckless for the fact that, first of all, HIV isn't a huge risk in China.

01:53:03.000 It's a one in a thousand chance of getting HIV. There are plenty of other things that you could do that could be more helpful.

01:53:09.000 Let's say, why not mutate what's called PSK9 to prevent heart disease, which would probably have 50% to kill a boy.

01:53:17.000 So anyway, it wasn't the most risk-benefit ratio modification.

01:53:25.000 That's one thing.

01:53:26.000 But the other is we don't know what happens when you cut genes in embryos.

01:53:30.000 Does it have changes to the DNA clock?

01:53:32.000 Did it accelerate their aging?

01:53:34.000 Did it mess with other genes?

01:53:35.000 Did it cut in other places and screw up those genes?

01:53:38.000 We don't know that yet.

01:53:39.000 And so that's why the scientific community had a negative reaction to it.

01:53:43.000 But what's interesting is that the scientific community and the press has pretty much gone quiet on this.

01:53:49.000 Imagine if this happened during the Bush era.

01:53:51.000 We'd have protesters all over the place.

01:53:53.000 It'd be outlawed.

01:53:54.000 And that hasn't happened.

01:53:55.000 And I think it's because we live in a world with a 24-hour news cycle.

01:53:58.000 But isn't that also because it's being – if it was during the Bush world, I mean, the protests would really take place if it was done here.

01:54:06.000 The thing about things that are done in China or overseas, like, huh, it's like it's so far away, like, well, let's keep an eye on them.

01:54:13.000 Yeah, that's true.

01:54:14.000 There is the fear that some country is going to engineer an army of clones.

01:54:19.000 I mean, we have the technology to do that right now.

01:54:22.000 We believe we understand how to slow aging.

01:54:25.000 There are genes that predispose you to long life.

01:54:28.000 We could make...

01:54:30.000 Offspring, a family that would potentially live a lot longer.

01:54:34.000 But is this something that can only be manipulated in embryos or in fetuses?

01:54:40.000 No.

01:54:40.000 Now we can do it in adults.

01:54:42.000 Actually, there are drugs that are in development to actually correct genetic diseases, such as vision loss.

01:54:49.000 Really?

01:54:50.000 Yeah.

01:54:50.000 Dude, my eyes are gone.

01:54:53.000 I can barely read, like, print on a laptop.

01:54:55.000 I need glasses to read my laptop.

01:54:58.000 All right.

01:54:58.000 So we just put up a study online on a site called BioArchive.

01:55:02.000 Anyone can go there and see it.

01:55:04.000 Just Google my name in BioArchive, B-I-O-R-X-I-V. The reason that's interesting is that what we're showing is, in mice at least, we can reverse the age of the retina and restore the vision of old mice.

01:55:19.000 What do I have to do?

01:55:22.000 Well, I think you have to blow me a few more times.

01:55:24.000 Hey, come on, man.

01:55:26.000 You're going to lose your job.

01:55:27.000 You've got to let me crack those kind of jokes.

01:55:29.000 Sorry.

01:55:30.000 Harvard, I was joking.

01:55:31.000 I started it, folks.

01:55:33.000 It's not his fault.

01:55:36.000 So is this going to be available to the general public any time in our lifetime?

01:55:42.000 I'm trying my best.

01:55:44.000 We're hoping to do clinical trials starting in two years from now.

01:55:47.000 Really?

01:55:48.000 And what would you do in those clinical trials?

01:55:50.000 So we'd reprogram the eye to be young again.

01:55:52.000 So we now know that there's a set of genes called reprogramming factors.

01:55:55.000 Also known as Yamanaka factors that are named after this Japanese fellow who won the Nobel Prize in 2012. These factors are used all over the world, even probably in high schools, to reprogram skin cells, other cells to be what we call pluripotent stem cells.

01:56:11.000 These are cells that can be used to make new organs or new blood cells.

01:56:15.000 But what people hadn't tried until recently was, can you do this in a living animal or are you just going to mess it up?

01:56:23.000 And what we found out is that if you do it the wrong way, you mess up the animal and it'll die.

01:56:27.000 But what we've shown for the first time in this paper is you can do it in a safe way.

01:56:32.000 And not only that, reverse the clock, make the cells young and restore how they work and get back vision.

01:56:40.000 And what's the methodology?

01:56:41.000 Right.

01:56:42.000 Good question.

01:56:42.000 So the current method is using a virus that's on the market.

01:56:46.000 These are called AAVs, adeno-associated viruses.

01:56:50.000 You put them in the eye.

01:56:51.000 There are already patients getting this on the market.

01:56:54.000 Really?

01:56:55.000 Yeah.

01:56:55.000 Spark Therapeutics is an example of a company that is curing genetic diseases in the eye with viruses.

01:57:01.000 We're in a new world.

01:57:02.000 Most people don't know about it.

01:57:03.000 Wow.

01:57:03.000 So what is the company again, Jamie?

01:57:05.000 Look up this.

01:57:06.000 Spark Genetic Engineering?

01:57:07.000 Jamie's already got it.

01:57:08.000 Look at that. 1.00

01:57:09.000 Bam, motherfucker. 1.00

01:57:10.000 Jamie Vernon in the house. 1.00

01:57:13.000 So these folks are already doing this to people.

01:57:17.000 So is this for people that are sort of desperate and they'll try something experimental?

01:57:22.000 Right.

01:57:23.000 Well, they're desperate in the sense that there's no other choice, no other cure.

01:57:27.000 I mean, we're now curing genetic diseases.

01:57:29.000 Someone was just treated and cured of sickle cell anemia.

01:57:32.000 That's phenomenal.

01:57:33.000 And that, you know, I learned that that comes from...

01:57:37.000 Malaria, right?

01:57:38.000 That was the idea that people were, the resistance to malaria was that trait from people that evolved in the area where they would get malaria was also what led to people getting sickle cell, correct?

01:57:50.000 Correct.

01:57:51.000 So that, I learned that from Tiffany Haddish, by the way.

01:57:54.000 Amazing.

01:57:55.000 Tiffany, shout out to Tiffany. 0.95

01:57:56.000 That Lux Turner stuff, is this something that someone like me could take right now?

01:58:03.000 No, not easily.

01:58:04.000 Your doctor would need to prescribe it.

01:58:06.000 And so if he did prescribe it, I could literally get vision back?

01:58:10.000 Well, this is not the same technology that I'm talking about from my lab.

01:58:13.000 This is inherited retinal diseases, our commitment to IRDs.

01:58:18.000 This is gene replacement, not reprogramming the body to be young.

01:58:22.000 But it's the same virus that we'd use to correct aging.

01:58:26.000 So they're using this for certain retinal diseases?

01:58:30.000 Where they're correcting it.

01:58:31.000 Now, how is this bacteria fixing your vision?

01:58:36.000 Well, the viruses are just a way to get the genes into the cells.

01:58:40.000 That's all.

01:58:41.000 And these are benign viruses.

01:58:43.000 They don't hurt you.

01:58:44.000 But they're a carrier.

01:58:45.000 And maybe eventually we'll have other ways to do this.

01:58:47.000 But right now, the virus is the best way.

01:58:49.000 And in the mice, to restore the vision, we have this three-gene combination of these Yamanaka reprogramming genes.

01:58:55.000 We put them into the eye.

01:58:58.000 And then we turn them on with a drug.

01:59:00.000 In fact, the same drug that I took when I was in Africa, called doxycycline, is the same drug we can feed to the mice, turns on the reprogramming genes for a few weeks, restores their vision back to a young mouse, and then we just take away the doxycycline, an antibiotic, and the mice have their vision back.

01:59:16.000 And how long does it take before it starts deteriorating again?

01:59:19.000 We don't know yet, but we think that it's permanent.

01:59:22.000 Because the age of the cells has gone back.

01:59:25.000 Those are young eyes again.

01:59:26.000 So you might have a whole full cycle from like 20 or 10 to 40 years old again.

01:59:34.000 That's the future.

01:59:35.000 That you'll get a delivery of this virus, you'll take the antibiotic for a few weeks, be fully rejuvenated, and the doctor says, come back in a couple of decades.

01:59:44.000 We'll fix you again.

01:59:45.000 We'll give you some antibiotic in a couple of decades.

01:59:47.000 But then it gets really weird if you engineer your children to have this system.

01:59:52.000 If that ever happens, let's imagine it could.

01:59:54.000 We could do this right now with technology.

01:59:56.000 And you have people engineered to be able to be reversed in their age.

02:00:00.000 Or let's say they have an accident and their optic nerve gets damaged or they lose their hearing from a bomb or something, a spinal injury.

02:00:09.000 Give them an IV of antibiotics, and they become just like an embryo.

02:00:14.000 They can rejuvenate, they can regrow their optic nerve, regrow their spine, fixed, back like new.

02:00:20.000 The vision thing, do you think that we're going to see that in our lifetimes?

02:00:23.000 I mean, is this something that you're going to see that's going to be available to the general public?

02:00:27.000 Well, so I'm an entrepreneur, as we discussed before.

02:00:32.000 And so one of the companies that I've started is exactly that, raised money to be able to make this virus.

02:00:37.000 We're making it now.

02:00:38.000 It takes a few million bucks.

02:00:40.000 And we'll hopefully, with the FDA's approval, inject it into people's eyes.

02:00:44.000 Now, first, it won't just be guys like you.

02:00:47.000 First of all, we have to go into an area where it's FDA-approvable, which is a disease like glaucoma, which is pressure in the eye, or macular degeneration.

02:00:56.000 That's our first goal.

02:00:58.000 But then if it's safe, why not do old eyes?

02:01:01.000 Wow.

02:01:03.000 That's incredible.

02:01:03.000 Now, what about people with injuries?

02:01:04.000 Yeah.

02:01:05.000 Well, yeah, you could theoretically put it into the spinal cord or give an IV. But people with eye injuries?

02:01:12.000 Oh, for sure.

02:01:13.000 So one of the things we also did in this paper that we've put online Is we pinched the optic nerve and what normally happens is it just degrades.

02:01:21.000 I mean nerves don't grow back, right?

02:01:22.000 Unless you're a baby mouse or a baby human.

02:01:25.000 But we made those cells so young that the optic nerve grew back to the brain.

02:01:30.000 Wow.

02:01:31.000 First time that's been able to have it.

02:01:33.000 I know a guy from fighting.

02:01:34.000 He's got a detached retina, detached so bad that his vision and his right eye is extremely poor.

02:01:41.000 Shout out to Michael Bisping.

02:01:43.000 Do you think that that's something that inside of his lifetime they could see something, the use of this technology that could regenerate his eye?

02:01:50.000 Well, I get a lot of emails, so I'm not really trying to over-promise anything.

02:01:55.000 What I think is possible is that initially it'll be used for disease, a chronic disease.

02:02:01.000 Then it'll be used for injuries like that, but fresh injuries.

02:02:04.000 I think it's probably likely to work better if it's fresh.

02:02:08.000 I don't know where this technology is going.

02:02:10.000 I can imagine a lot.

02:02:12.000 We can all imagine that you could get vision back and people walking again.

02:02:16.000 But that's where this technology is going.

02:02:18.000 So I described the discovery in the book.

02:02:21.000 Actually, what happened while I was writing the book is we were making these discoveries and they were remarkable.

02:02:25.000 And so I wrote them down in the book as we went along so people can see how it feels to be a scientist to make these discoveries.

02:02:32.000 But it's only been a year or less that we've known about this.

02:02:35.000 So imagine 50 years from now what we can do, even 10. It's going to be a remarkable future.

02:02:40.000 It's very exciting.

02:02:41.000 Now what kind of a timeline are you anticipating for bringing this to, you know, people with injuries?

02:02:49.000 Well injuries, already we have a study plan for spinal injury in mice and that we'll probably know the results in less than a year.

02:02:58.000 And then we could, you know, as fast as the FDA allows us, go into a clinical trial.

02:03:03.000 Now, is the same scenario applicable for people with spinal injuries as vision?

02:03:09.000 Like people that have a more recent spinal injury would be more likely candidates than people that have had older spinal injuries?

02:03:16.000 I think so.

02:03:17.000 That would just be my guess, that it's easier to fix a recently damaged system, anything in the body that's fresh.

02:03:23.000 But I wouldn't rule out anything.

02:03:25.000 When we first discovered this, the experiment was to have a fresh injury, the pinching of the optic nerve.

02:03:32.000 But then I said to my student, why don't you just try old mice?

02:03:34.000 And he said, come on, old mice, are you kidding me?

02:03:36.000 How's that going to work?

02:03:37.000 Just try it.

02:03:38.000 Just try it.

02:03:39.000 So he did it in collaboration with another lab at Harvard.

02:03:42.000 So they're the experts.

02:03:44.000 And so Bruce Cassandra is his name.

02:03:46.000 So Bruce called me, the professor at Harvard.

02:03:48.000 It's 10.30 at night.

02:03:49.000 I just got off a plane.

02:03:50.000 He said, David, you won't believe it.

02:03:52.000 I didn't believe it.

02:03:53.000 I just looked at the data.

02:03:54.000 It freaking worked.

02:03:56.000 Wow.

02:03:56.000 Old mice are seeing again.

02:03:58.000 He said, I want to go down to the FDA and tell them about it.

02:04:00.000 Because right now, eye diseases typically, all you can do is slow them down, and here's actually a reversal of lost function.

02:04:06.000 Now, does this apply to injuries as well, do you believe?

02:04:09.000 Old injuries or just old macular degeneration?

02:04:12.000 We haven't tried old injuries.

02:04:14.000 Now, we've done glaucoma, which is an old injury.

02:04:18.000 So theoretically, what we could do is, at least with the existing nerves, if they're still attached, we should be able to rejuvenate those and make them work better.

02:04:26.000 Because he has some vision in his eye.

02:04:28.000 So yeah, so that's possible.

02:04:30.000 That makes more sense.

02:04:31.000 But very little.

02:04:32.000 Very limited in one eye.

02:04:34.000 Yeah.

02:04:35.000 Well, we'll have to see.

02:04:37.000 Interesting, because you didn't think it was going to work on the old mice.

02:04:39.000 I did, but no one else did.

02:04:41.000 Wow.

02:04:42.000 Crazy.

02:04:43.000 Well, we're literally reversing not just the effects of aging, but aging itself.

02:04:48.000 So if I gave you those retinas, very little retinas, here you go, Joe, and you were a scientist, you could look at that retina and analyze it molecularly, measure its clock.

02:04:57.000 And you'd say, those are young eyes.

02:04:59.000 And you wouldn't know the difference.

02:05:00.000 Now, do you feel like this kind of technology is also going to be applied to people's skin?

02:05:06.000 Because, you know, one of the things that, for women, it's devastating when they develop wrinkles. 1.00

02:05:11.000 You know, they fucking hate it. 0.98

02:05:12.000 Men get a few wrinkles, they kind of look distinguished. 1.00

02:05:15.000 You know, but, man, when women get wrinkles, they freak the fuck out. 1.00

02:05:19.000 They don't like it. 0.90

02:05:20.000 Yeah, we're going to try it on aging on the skin.

02:05:24.000 Though, you know, when I talk about making people walk again, potentially, it's probably a higher priority.

02:05:30.000 Oh, for sure.

02:05:30.000 But I think it's feasible.

02:05:32.000 So there's a lab at the Salk Institute, Juan Carlos Belmonte.

02:05:35.000 Who may win the Nobel Prize for his work on this.

02:05:38.000 In 2016 and a couple of years since, he's been showing that it doesn't just rejuvenate old mice, it actually is also rejuvenating the skin.

02:05:48.000 If he puts it on a wound that's in an old mouse, that mouse will heal better.

02:05:53.000 Now that doesn't prove wrinkles, but it does prove the skin can be rejuvenated as well.

02:05:59.000 So there could be possibly some sort of a treatment to skin, maybe a re-injuring.

02:06:05.000 There's this thing that they do, I think it's called a vampire facial.

02:06:08.000 Have you ever heard of that?

02:06:09.000 They take platelet-rich plasma and then they micro-needle your entire face and then they somehow or another apply this platelet-rich plasma on To the areas that have been micro-needled and it has some sort of an effect in increasing collagen and elasticity of the skin and tightening of the skin.

02:06:29.000 Have you heard of this?

02:06:31.000 I've heard it for hair loss.

02:06:33.000 I didn't realize people get it all over their face.

02:06:34.000 For hair loss as well, they're doing that?

02:06:36.000 Sounds painful.

02:06:37.000 So to me, it makes sense that it might work.

02:06:40.000 The PRP, as it's called, is full of factors that we know some of these are rejuvenating in mice.

02:06:48.000 You know, this system where you can hook up an old mouse and a young mouse circulation.

02:06:52.000 Yes.

02:06:53.000 And you get rejuvenation.

02:06:54.000 There are factors that many of which we haven't discovered or identified that exist that you can rejuvenate.

02:07:00.000 And I would bet that they're working most likely through this reversal of the clock.

02:07:06.000 And so one of the things we're doing in my lab is taking what are called exosomes which exist in these preparations and seeing if they reverse the clock.

02:07:14.000 I've had exosomes shot into injuries.

02:07:17.000 For stem cell procedures.

02:07:20.000 Did it work?

02:07:20.000 Yes.

02:07:20.000 Yes, it did work.

02:07:21.000 That makes sense.

02:07:22.000 Yeah, I had a full-length rotator cuff tear that's completely gone.

02:07:26.000 Yeah, so maybe what's going on is you've reprogrammed your body there.

02:07:29.000 Yes.

02:07:29.000 Well, it's a weird thing, the exosomes and stem cells, and there's a new product called Wharton's Jelly that's also very effective and potent because there's not a lot of papers on these things.

02:07:43.000 The research on it, some of it's a little shaky, but the efficacy, at least anecdotal efficacy, is pretty substantial, and I'm one of those pieces of anecdotal evidence.

02:07:55.000 I've had A bunch of shots.

02:07:57.000 Whenever I get injured, I'm like, shoot it up. 0.80

02:07:59.000 Yeah.

02:07:59.000 Well, your listeners may not know about exosomes.

02:08:02.000 So exosomes are little compartments that are pinched off from cells and put into the body and communicate between cells across.

02:08:10.000 So your liver can communicate with your brain through exosomes.

02:08:13.000 And within these little cargos, there are things that we're just discovering, little proteins, RNA, and they're full of goodies.

02:08:19.000 And drug companies are being built on these exosomes.

02:08:22.000 Yes.

02:08:23.000 I'm glad you brought up the study of the old mice and the young mice where they put the blood in the old mice and then the old mice started behaving like young mice and the blood of the old mice and the young mice and the young mice started behaving like they were tired.

02:08:38.000 Because there's a company in Northern California that's supposedly doing this with humans, where they're injecting people with the blood of old people, or young people rather, some sort of transfusion.

02:08:52.000 Not anymore.

02:08:53.000 Are they out of business?

02:08:53.000 Well, my understanding is the FDA sent them a letter and said, stop it.

02:08:57.000 That's it?

02:08:58.000 Just a letter?

02:08:58.000 That's all it takes?

02:09:00.000 Oh yeah, you don't want to go to the next step?

02:09:01.000 Can't you just move down the street and change your name?

02:09:03.000 Oh, I got another letter.

02:09:04.000 Move down the street and change my name.

02:09:07.000 I think that's risky.

02:09:08.000 Is it?

02:09:09.000 Check to see if that company's under...

02:09:10.000 Alka?

02:09:12.000 I do not remember the name of it, but I remember they were erroneously linked to Peter Thiel, and then Peter denied that he's ever used that.

02:09:20.000 You know, the billionaire founder of PayPal, who I've met, who's a wonderful man.

02:09:25.000 They...

02:09:28.000 Erroneously, there's some story linked that said that he's getting it. 1.00

02:09:32.000 He's like, actually, shut the fuck up. 0.99

02:09:33.000 No, I'm not. 0.99

02:09:34.000 Don't say that.

02:09:36.000 I've never done it.

02:09:37.000 Not doing it.

02:09:38.000 So it was one of those things where there was a lot of legend to it because of these mice studies.

02:09:43.000 These mice studies got people super excited about the idea that all you have to do is get young people's blood.

02:09:48.000 So you get a bunch of young people that are healthy, disease-free, drug-free, donating their plasma...

02:09:54.000 Doing their blood for X amount of dollars, a quart.

02:09:57.000 Right, you have a blood boy.

02:09:58.000 Hook yourself up.

02:09:59.000 Yeah, blood boy.

02:10:00.000 Hey man, when I was young, I needed some cash.

02:10:02.000 I was healthy.

02:10:03.000 Come on. 1.00

02:10:05.000 Regenerate that shit. 1.00

02:10:07.000 Take a quart of blood, I get it back in a couple hours. 1.00

02:10:09.000 I think it might work.

02:10:10.000 It's just that we don't know the consequences and the FDA's job is to protect us. 0.99

02:10:14.000 Yeah, just like they're protecting us from raw milk, bunch of pussies. 1.00

02:10:17.000 Just recently shut down about a month ago. 0.99

02:10:19.000 I missed the boat.

02:10:21.000 Could have been in there, man.

02:10:22.000 But if you did that, that's something you'd have to do on a routine basis, right?

02:10:25.000 It's not like something you do in one shot.

02:10:28.000 It'd probably give you a little boost for a short amount of time.

02:10:30.000 Yeah.

02:10:31.000 Well, that's what's different about this reprogramming.

02:10:33.000 You do it once, you come back years later.

02:10:35.000 Yeah.

02:10:35.000 The eyeball thing is very enticing to me because it's so weird watching my eyes deteriorate.

02:10:41.000 Like, slowly but surely, I'm watching it happen.

02:10:44.000 It's really... 0.99

02:10:45.000 It sucks. 0.99

02:10:46.000 And it's a short sign you're getting older. 0.99

02:10:48.000 Yeah, age-related macular degeneration just seems pretty standard. 0.99

02:10:52.000 Except my friend Cam Haynes, that motherfucker, he's 52 years old. 0.99

02:10:56.000 He could see... 0.99

02:10:57.000 He's got, like, 2018 vision at 52. It's crazy.

02:11:00.000 He could see anything.

02:11:01.000 I drop my phone on the ground.

02:11:03.000 He's like, oh, you got a crack.

02:11:04.000 He saw it from, like...

02:11:06.000 I go, where?

02:11:07.000 Where's the crack?

02:11:08.000 I'm trying to look at it in the light.

02:11:09.000 It's like right there.

02:11:10.000 And I put reading glasses on. 1.00

02:11:12.000 I'm like, son of a bitch. 1.00

02:11:13.000 I'm like, how the fuck did you see that? 1.00

02:11:15.000 He saw it from like where you are. 0.98

02:11:17.000 Like looking at the phone.

02:11:18.000 I'm like, that is crazy.

02:11:19.000 Well, so let's keep in touch.

02:11:22.000 We will.

02:11:22.000 And if we get this on the market, then yeah.

02:11:26.000 Yes.

02:11:27.000 It turns out he has started up again pretty recently, but it's not being sold as young blood for plasma.

02:11:34.000 It's just plasma.

02:11:36.000 Oh, just give it a shot, bro.

02:11:37.000 Just here's some.

02:11:38.000 Just no promises.

02:11:40.000 What do you think?

02:11:41.000 Want to go in there with me?

02:11:42.000 Right after we do the cryotherapy treatment, go get some blood?

02:11:45.000 Some young blood?

02:11:47.000 Doctors behind failed anti-aging blood clinic tries again.

02:11:51.000 We tried to ask him some questions, but he was very evasive.

02:11:54.000 Good for you, sir.

02:11:55.000 Duck and move. 0.83

02:11:57.000 Do the old Muhammad Ali rope-a-dope.

02:12:00.000 Be like Pernell Whitaker, sir.

02:12:04.000 Yeah, I hope he stays evasive.

02:12:07.000 I mean, it's also like, maybe it's nonsense.

02:12:10.000 Maybe it's not.

02:12:11.000 Would you like to do studies on people that are doing that and find out?

02:12:14.000 I mean...

02:12:15.000 Well, what they should do is measure the clock now that we can do that.

02:12:18.000 Yes.

02:12:18.000 Right.

02:12:19.000 Yes.

02:12:19.000 That would be interesting.

02:12:21.000 But based on what we know about how it works with mice, you think it's likely that there is some effect?

02:12:29.000 It's possible.

02:12:30.000 It's possible.

02:12:31.000 I like how you're very cautious.

02:12:33.000 You're a real professor.

02:12:34.000 I like that.

02:12:35.000 I try.

02:12:35.000 You're the real deal.

02:12:38.000 I'd like to keep my job.

02:12:39.000 You should. 0.99

02:12:40.000 Stop making those blowjob jokes. 0.99

02:12:45.000 Funny that that is actually controversial. 0.99

02:12:48.000 Two friends can't just joke.

02:12:51.000 Is there anything else that you think is promising that is on the horizon or that's being discussed or it's theoretical at this point?

02:13:00.000 Yeah, there's something that is really interesting and that's called senolytics.

02:13:06.000 Senolytics. 0.73

02:13:07.000 Yeah.

02:13:08.000 So senolytics are drugs that kill off senescent cells.

02:13:12.000 So what are senescent cells?

02:13:14.000 These are often called zombie cells.

02:13:16.000 Back to World War Z. Yes. 0.62

02:13:19.000 A lot of zombies, this podcast.

02:13:21.000 So senescent cells we've known for decades exist in the body, but what was not clear was whether they cause aging.

02:13:28.000 Now it's pretty clear, from animal studies at least, is that we get lots of these accumulating and that they do cause aging.

02:13:35.000 And one of the best experiments that was done from Mayo Clinic was to genetically delete the senescent cells that accumulated in an old mouse.

02:13:43.000 And it became young again.

02:13:45.000 Or at least it delayed its aging by a fair bit.

02:13:47.000 Now, senescent cells are pretty rare.

02:13:50.000 There's not a lot of them.

02:13:51.000 But they cause havoc.

02:13:52.000 Because they don't just sit there in the body, but they send out these inflammatory markers and they cause cancer, we think.

02:13:58.000 So you want to get rid of these.

02:14:02.000 I want to mention that in the biological clock, when I was saying that the clock is part of the aging process, what we think is that as we get older, and it's detailed a lot more in my book, so if people read it, they'll understand a lot more what I'm saying,

02:14:17.000 but this clock is messing up the cell's ability to be what it used to be.

02:14:23.000 What do I mean by that?

02:14:24.000 Let's take your eye. 0.91

02:14:26.000 In your retina, your nerves are getting older.

02:14:28.000 But your nerves, we think, are losing the ability to read the nerve genes.

02:14:32.000 So they're forgetting that they're nerves.

02:14:34.000 So now they're starting to behave actually more like a skin cell.

02:14:36.000 And having a skin cell in your eye is not going to really work very well.

02:14:40.000 So we call that epigenetic noise, epigenetic aging.

02:14:43.000 Reprogramming resets that.

02:14:47.000 So why is that interesting? 0.98

02:14:49.000 We think that the ultimate problem for the cell, when it loses its total identity or gets a long way towards that, is it shuts itself down because it says, fuck, I don't even know what I am anymore. 0.97

02:15:00.000 I'm not a nerve cell. 0.98

02:15:01.000 I'm not a skin cell.

02:15:02.000 I'm not a liver cell.

02:15:03.000 Senes.

02:15:04.000 Senes means stop dividing. 1.00

02:15:06.000 Just sit there and tell the body, come kill me. 0.99

02:15:10.000 So now they're putting out these panic factors. 1.00

02:15:13.000 There's a problem.

02:15:14.000 You get inflammation.

02:15:15.000 The problem is that as we get older, the body's not very good at clearing out these cells.

02:15:20.000 They sit there and they wreak havoc.

02:15:22.000 You get inflammation.

02:15:23.000 We think you get aging.

02:15:24.000 So getting back to senolytics, these drugs are designed to be a pill or an injection into your joint to kill off these zombie cells, these senescent cells, and theoretically rejuvenate the tissue and reverse that aspect of aging.

02:15:38.000 And that's another treatment, like reprogramming, that could be a one-shot delivery and take you back a decade.

02:15:45.000 Wow.

02:15:45.000 And how far away are we from seeing those?

02:15:48.000 Much closer, actually.

02:15:49.000 There's a few companies.

02:15:52.000 There's one called Unity.

02:15:53.000 There's one that I'm involved with, in full disclosure, called Senolytic Therapeutics in Europe.

02:15:58.000 And at least Unity is in clinical trials right now for osteoarthritis.

02:16:04.000 Really?

02:16:04.000 Now what about the company in Europe?

02:16:06.000 Preclinical, still a mouse.

02:16:08.000 Wow.

02:16:09.000 So we're looking at like a decade from the general public?

02:16:12.000 Well, for Unity, they hope not.

02:16:15.000 Usually when you're in a Phase II study, which they're in, it's a few years away if it works.

02:16:21.000 Oh, wow.

02:16:24.000 Amazing stuff.

02:16:25.000 It's such a cool time to see all this medical innovation and scientific innovation.

02:16:31.000 Well, my head's spinning.

02:16:32.000 There's CRISPR and then the reprogramming, which is new stuff.

02:16:35.000 This is stuff that we dreamed of for thousands of years.

02:16:39.000 I don't think it's a dead end, and it may not be as – we're not going to go back to being 20 anytime soon.

02:16:48.000 That said, I think we've had a major breakthrough.

02:16:51.000 The equivalent I like to use is we figured out how to fly.

02:16:54.000 We're the right brothers, the right sisters.

02:16:57.000 We've got to include all sexes now, my daughter will tell me.

02:17:01.000 Right non-binary people.

02:17:02.000 Yeah.

02:17:03.000 So my daughter changed her name, by the way.

02:17:04.000 To what?

02:17:05.000 To Alexander.

02:17:07.000 She was Madeline.

02:17:08.000 She didn't think that was appropriate.

02:17:09.000 Why?

02:17:10.000 She's a tough chick. 1.00

02:17:12.000 She's a they. 1.00

02:17:14.000 So I'm not allowed to call her a she, I don't think.

02:17:17.000 She doesn't want to be identified as one or the other.

02:17:19.000 Interesting.

02:17:20.000 Is she 16?

02:17:21.000 Yeah, she changed it at 11. Whoa! 0.99

02:17:24.000 She's a tough girl.

02:17:26.000 You know, in my family we tend to be rebels and unfortunately it passed a long time.

02:17:31.000 I'm getting everything back.

02:17:32.000 Fortunately or unfortunately.

02:17:34.000 Well, I guess I'll be proud of her, but raising her in the last few years has been pretty annoying at home.

02:17:38.000 Can't say anything without the PR police.

02:17:42.000 That's hilarious.

02:17:43.000 So PC police or PR? Did I say PR? I meant PC. Yeah.

02:17:48.000 That's interesting.

02:17:50.000 What was I saying about my daughter?

02:17:52.000 Oh, about the name change.

02:17:54.000 Yes.

02:17:54.000 Why was I talking about a name change?

02:17:55.000 I don't know.

02:17:56.000 You tell me.

02:17:57.000 Jamie, do you remember?

02:18:00.000 Man, we've got a million people screaming at us.

02:18:02.000 Yeah, well, you were talking about so many exciting things on the horizon.

02:18:07.000 True, yeah.

02:18:08.000 And so it's just head spinning.

02:18:10.000 And so much is happening in our lifetime that I thought was just imaginary, or for the future.

02:18:16.000 Now the question is, are we going to reap all the benefits of this, or are we going to be the last generation to lead a normal human lifespan?

02:18:21.000 And I don't think we are.

02:18:22.000 I think that we already have things we can do in our daily lives, just in lifestyle and in molecules you can take, that give us a very good chance of living beyond what's naturally possible.

02:18:32.000 This is amazing, man.

02:18:35.000 It's so exciting.

02:18:36.000 And the last time you were here was about a year ago, somewhere around that range?

02:18:40.000 Yeah.

02:18:40.000 I mean, and think about how many new things you have to discuss now versus then.

02:18:45.000 It's really interesting, man.

02:18:47.000 And I'm so happy there's people like you that are out there doing this.

02:18:51.000 It's just so exciting.

02:18:54.000 And it makes me very happy to know you're out there.

02:18:57.000 Thanks, John.

02:18:58.000 So thank you.

02:18:58.000 And your book.

02:18:59.000 People can find out all this stuff in detail.

02:19:02.000 Much more detail than you can get in a two and a half hour conversation.

02:19:05.000 Lifespan.

02:19:05.000 Why we age and why we don't have to.

02:19:07.000 David A. Sinclair, Ph.D. Thank you, brother.

02:19:11.000 Always a good time.

02:19:12.000 We'll do it again next year?

02:19:13.000 Deal.

02:19:14.000 Yes!

02:19:15.000 Bye, everybody.

The Joe Rogan Experience - September 10, 2019

Joe Rogan Experience #1349 - David Sinclair

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