The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #1680 - Jakob Dylan

00:00:03.000 The Joe Rogan Experience.

00:00:05.000 Train by day.

00:00:07.000 Joe Rogan Podcast by night.

00:00:08.000 All day.

00:00:14.000 Hello, Jacob.

00:00:15.000 How you doing?

00:00:16.000 Good to see you again, man.

00:00:16.000 Good to see you.

00:00:17.000 First time we met, we were talking about earlier, you took your kids to Fear Factor.

00:00:22.000 It was a gross day, right?

00:00:24.000 Weren't they all?

00:00:25.000 No, the second day is always the gross day.

00:00:27.000 Oh, I didn't know that.

00:00:28.000 Yeah, the first day is a big stunt.

00:00:29.000 Oh, the first day is the sports day.

00:00:31.000 Yeah, and then the second day, it's disgusting.

00:00:33.000 And then the third day, it's usually something.

00:00:35.000 Well, had I had a choice, we would have picked the disgusting day anyway.

00:00:38.000 That was pretty wild.

00:00:39.000 I don't remember what it was.

00:00:41.000 Do you?

00:00:42.000 No, you know, it was downtown.

00:00:43.000 It was in an abandoned building, like a warehouse style.

00:00:46.000 And it was disgusting before you guys even started.

00:00:48.000 It was.

00:00:48.000 I do remember what looked like an exploded, melted cat on a chair.

00:00:52.000 Oh.

00:00:53.000 There was fur, there was a face, and it had been, like, for many, I don't know how long it had been.

00:00:57.000 That might be just a part of the landscape.

00:00:59.000 I'm saying that had nothing.

00:01:00.000 That wasn't you guys.

00:01:01.000 Those downtown buildings, that was when I first found out about Skid Row was working for Fear Factor.

00:01:06.000 If you're a person that just spends time in Hollywood or Beverly Hills or Tarzana or whatever, you don't know that there is this crazy spot in downtown where they've basically contained homeless people.

00:01:20.000 They've set up shelter and food and then people just camp out on the street.

00:01:24.000 And obviously that's an issue now in LA. But this was 2003. Yeah, that was mainly where you saw it then, but if you've been out there lately, it's pretty much everywhere.

00:01:34.000 Yeah, I'm excited to have escaped.

00:01:36.000 Yeah, good for you.

00:01:37.000 Yay! 0.99

00:01:38.000 You living there?

00:01:39.000 I do, just mainly because I've always been there.

00:01:42.000 I think often about going somewhere else.

00:01:44.000 You just transplanted here.

00:01:46.000 Yeah, that was my concern, too.

00:01:48.000 I've been there for so long that I was just going to stay there.

00:01:52.000 Where were you out there?

00:01:53.000 I was in Calabasas.

00:01:54.000 I was out in the suburban area, which is nice.

00:01:59.000 It's quieter, but it's not quiet enough.

00:02:02.000 I moved there in 96 or 97, something like that.

00:02:07.000 But when I moved there, it was...

00:02:09.000 No one was out there. 0.99

00:02:11.000 It's like coyotes and owls and shit. 0.99

00:02:14.000 That's what I like. 0.99

00:02:15.000 I like quiet.

00:02:17.000 Did you have to commute every day for anything?

00:02:19.000 Yeah, but you just leave on time.

00:02:24.000 When I was doing news radio, the TV shows when I first moved out there, we didn't really start until 10 a.m.

00:02:31.000 at the earliest.

00:02:32.000 By that time, traffic started to die down.

00:02:35.000 It's not that big a deal.

00:02:36.000 Yeah.

00:02:37.000 Well, it's back.

00:02:37.000 Traffic is back.

00:02:38.000 Yeah.

00:02:39.000 It's back.

00:02:40.000 Yeah.

00:02:40.000 We were just talking earlier that we thought there was an exodus of people leaving these major cities, but I haven't noticed that.

00:02:46.000 It seems like more people than ever out there.

00:02:48.000 Well, there's so many people.

00:02:49.000 Even if you lose a million people or two million people or three million people, you still have 25 million people jammed into an area where when I moved to LA in 94, I guess, It's probably, I mean, I gotta think the population was like a third of that.

00:03:07.000 Oh, yeah.

00:03:08.000 Or a third less.

00:03:09.000 A third less.

00:03:10.000 When I was growing up out there, there was traffic from, I think you didn't want to be in your car, from like 5 to 6 p.m.

00:03:15.000 Right, that's it.

00:03:15.000 That was it.

00:03:16.000 Well, morning traffic I wouldn't know about because I wasn't driving.

00:03:20.000 But, no, it's just all day long, every day now.

00:03:22.000 Sometimes I would come home from the comedy store at 1 in the morning and be stuck in bumper to bumper traffic. 0.99

00:03:27.000 I'm like, what the fuck is this? 0.96

00:03:29.000 Yeah, we landed LAX at 2 in the morning and then take two hours to get home. 0.99

00:03:32.000 Yeah, exactly. 0.85

00:03:34.000 It's ridiculous. 0.56

00:03:34.000 Or just the airport itself. 0.56

00:03:36.000 It's such a jammed up airport.

00:03:38.000 That's crazy.

00:03:38.000 I don't know whose idea.

00:03:40.000 How about just a loop where everybody's just in the same...

00:03:42.000 You go to other airports, you see how they figured it out.

00:03:44.000 They have separate terminals.

00:03:46.000 Everyone's not just log jamming into the same spot.

00:03:49.000 It's pretty crazy.

00:03:50.000 Do you like L.A. because you like to perform there?

00:03:55.000 I actually don't perform there very often.

00:03:59.000 I mean, not any more than I perform anywhere else.

00:04:01.000 I'm just there because I've always been there.

00:04:03.000 There's good people there. 0.98

00:04:04.000 I mean, there's shitty people everywhere. 0.90

00:04:05.000 I mean, it's not L.A. I don't stereotype it that way. 0.97

00:04:07.000 Have you ever thought about moving?

00:04:09.000 This is the part where I try to convince Jacob Dillon to move to Austin.

00:04:12.000 Let's do it.

00:04:12.000 I got famous people here.

00:04:15.000 Well, yeah, you know what?

00:04:16.000 At this point, if you're from L.A., yeah, I know more people in other towns.

00:04:20.000 So many people have left for a lot of different reasons, but I know more people out of L.A. than certainly that I know in L.A. Is the Troubadour still happening?

00:04:30.000 I heard that the Troubadour was about to go under.

00:04:32.000 Oh, I don't know.

00:04:33.000 You mean like right now?

00:04:34.000 Yeah.

00:04:35.000 I don't know what they're going to do.

00:04:37.000 Because I know Bill Burr was really worried about that.

00:04:39.000 He loves that place.

00:04:40.000 He's going to buy it.

00:04:41.000 Maybe he will.

00:04:42.000 He might.

00:04:43.000 Somebody bought Nate Niles.

00:04:44.000 You know Nate Niles?

00:04:45.000 Yeah, they did.

00:04:45.000 They closed that down.

00:04:46.000 They shut that down and somebody rescued that.

00:04:49.000 Oh, well that's good.

00:04:50.000 Bill needs to go rescue the troubadour.

00:04:52.000 He may.

00:04:53.000 I don't know.

00:04:54.000 He's a cautious fella when it comes to investments and stuff.

00:04:57.000 He's a wealthy guy that pretends he's not.

00:05:00.000 That's smart.

00:05:01.000 Yeah, it is smart.

00:05:02.000 He is smart.

00:05:03.000 And we were talking about how Bill has your friend Dean Del Rey opening for him, which is hilarious that you know Dean from the music days.

00:05:09.000 Yeah, I've known Dean for more than 25 years or so.

00:05:13.000 Well, he was always a great entertainer and always a funny guy, and I know you know him as well.

00:05:17.000 I was not surprised that he decided to be a stand-up, but I guess you made me aware that it's surprising to do that in your early 40s.

00:05:25.000 It's real odd, yeah, for someone to take a chance like that and shift careers because it's a risk.

00:05:31.000 It's a giant risk.

00:05:32.000 Well, how so?

00:05:33.000 Well, you know, it might not work.

00:05:36.000 Right.

00:05:36.000 You're saying if you try it in your 20s and it didn't work, you got time to go do something else?

00:05:39.000 Yeah, or you have time to make it happen.

00:05:42.000 To make it happen as a comic, it legitimately takes 10 years.

00:05:45.000 It takes 10 years to get good at it.

00:05:47.000 It really does.

00:05:48.000 In some weird way.

00:05:50.000 I don't have that kind of time.

00:05:52.000 Exactly.

00:05:52.000 That's what I'm saying.

00:05:53.000 And for Dean to just take that...

00:05:55.000 I think he was like 46?

00:05:57.000 Something like that?

00:05:58.000 Yeah, but it seemed like a pretty natural evolution.

00:06:01.000 And I know other people who've done the same thing.

00:06:02.000 It's their...

00:06:03.000 I'm not surprised.

00:06:05.000 There is a connection between guys jumping around on stage singing songs to guys doing stand-up comedy.

00:06:09.000 There is a connection.

00:06:11.000 Yeah, for sure.

00:06:12.000 Just the comfort level of being able to do that.

00:06:16.000 Just to speak in front of people, sing in front of people.

00:06:18.000 Be looked at.

00:06:20.000 Get over somehow, get the attention.

00:06:22.000 They're very similar.

00:06:25.000 This new album, when was the last time you guys had an album?

00:06:29.000 2012. Wow.

00:06:32.000 Yeah, but I did not anticipate...

00:06:35.000 I mean, time flies.

00:06:36.000 Yeah, it does.

00:06:36.000 I didn't realize that.

00:06:37.000 But I tour every year, so I'm far enough along where I don't need to worry so much about making records all the time if I'm not focused or have the ideas.

00:06:47.000 So if you don't pay attention, you just keep touring and touring.

00:06:51.000 And then I did a movie as well, a documentary, which had a soundtrack in between that, the Echo and the Canyon movie, which was an interview where we spoke to a lot of people who were around in the mid-60s, particularly 65 and 66. The bands went to Laurel Canyon.

00:07:07.000 Oh, wow.

00:07:08.000 So that took a long time to do.

00:07:09.000 And we interviewed people like Eric Clapton and...

00:07:12.000 And this was your project?

00:07:13.000 Yeah.

00:07:14.000 What was the motivation to do something like that?

00:07:18.000 Well, if you don't take a minute, you've got to get off the treadmill at some point.

00:07:23.000 My first record was 1992. Wow.

00:07:27.000 So I wanted to do something different.

00:07:29.000 And I think it actually took too long to do something different.

00:07:33.000 But those take a long time.

00:07:34.000 Documentaries don't really have scripts.

00:07:36.000 They just unravel.

00:07:37.000 So you just have to keep going until it changes.

00:07:40.000 The story keeps changing as you go.

00:07:42.000 And then you need to talk to this person to fill in that blank.

00:07:44.000 And then you have to keep doing that.

00:07:45.000 And before you know it, it took three years.

00:07:47.000 So who was in the Laurel Canyon scene in the 1960s?

00:07:51.000 Hendrix was there, right?

00:07:53.000 He may have passed through.

00:07:54.000 No, he's not an L.A. art, like a Laurel Canyon artist.

00:07:57.000 I thought he had a place in Laurel Canyon for a while.

00:07:59.000 He may have.

00:07:59.000 We really zeroed in on one year, like 65, with Buffalo Springfield and the Byrds.

00:08:04.000 These people getting together with so much talent in one group.

00:08:09.000 That dream didn't last.

00:08:10.000 None of those groups were able to stay together.

00:08:12.000 But it's not about Little Canyon in its entirety.

00:08:14.000 It's people, they wondered where Joni Mitchell was or Frank Zappa, but that was a different experience.

00:08:20.000 And Carole King, that's all down the line a little bit later.

00:08:23.000 That's more of the singer-songwriter era.

00:08:25.000 And someone can make that.

00:08:26.000 I recommend Ken Burns makes that documentary because that's going to be like a long one.

00:08:30.000 And we didn't get into the riots in the Sunset Strip and all that.

00:08:35.000 It was really about one year specifically.

00:08:38.000 Why that year?

00:08:40.000 Just because it was like when these bands, you got Buffalo Springfield, you got Neil Young, you got Stephen Stills in the same group together.

00:08:47.000 That wasn't gonna last.

00:08:48.000 It's just two giants in the same space.

00:08:50.000 So they were kind of figuring out what groups could do.

00:08:52.000 I don't think anybody imagined having jobs very long.

00:08:55.000 I don't think anybody was Looking at each other's paychecks yet and noticing how the dream is not going to probably stay together too long.

00:09:02.000 But that's what we found to be interesting.

00:09:04.000 Really, if you wanted a documentary about Laurel Canaan, I wouldn't be capable of doing it.

00:09:08.000 It's too large in its entirety.

00:09:11.000 It's probably something that you'd have to do for multiple shows, right?

00:09:15.000 Like a Netflix-style series.

00:09:17.000 Exactly.

00:09:18.000 You could.

00:09:19.000 You absolutely could.

00:09:19.000 There's a lot of different eras up there.

00:09:21.000 And there's also the CIA. There's all kinds of shit you can get into up there. 0.99

00:09:24.000 I mean, it's not just the music. 0.99

00:09:25.000 Have you read that book, Chaos?

00:09:27.000 The Tom O'Neill book about the Manson family?

00:09:30.000 No.

00:09:30.000 It's all about the CIA and about the CIA infiltrating the hippie culture and literally supplying acid to the Manson family.

00:09:40.000 Yeah.

00:09:41.000 Well, I know you like a good conspiracy.

00:09:43.000 Oh, I love a good conspiracy.

00:09:44.000 The hippie movement, you might say that was dumbing down America intentionally.

00:09:48.000 I mean, there's a lot of conspiracy in that.

00:09:50.000 Well, if not dumbing down America intentionally, this is what I think about a lot of conspiracies where people think that they're engineered.

00:09:56.000 I think more often than not, they take advantage of a moment and exacerbate a situation rather than engineer it from scratch.

00:10:04.000 Like, I don't think it's possible to engineer the hippie movement. 0.86

00:10:07.000 But I think you can take moments like that and make the people involved look more ridiculous and more stupid and dumb down America in a certain sense or make people have a, like, you know, the 70s bounce back from what the 60s represented was a lot of it was people being upset at the negative aspects of the hippie culture in the 60s. 0.70

00:10:30.000 Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't be, you know, the most informed to get into too much of that. 0.96

00:10:35.000 But we're doing it today.

00:10:36.000 It's the same thing.

00:10:37.000 It's, you know, distraction.

00:10:39.000 You know, when you give people all...

00:10:40.000 I mean, isn't it interesting, Laurel Kennedy...

00:10:42.000 Look, I mean, there's another book.

00:10:43.000 What is it?

00:10:45.000 Strange...

00:10:45.000 Oh, it doesn't matter if I can't think of the name of the book.

00:10:48.000 But that's all, you know...

00:10:49.000 None of those people, there's other conspiracies that none of those people, including Frank Zapp, wound up on the Royal Canyon for no reason at all.

00:10:56.000 It wasn't by accident.

00:10:57.000 I mean, they all have bloodlines that go back very, very far, particularly with the military and royalty.

00:11:03.000 That they all wind up in the same place at the same time is pretty much, there you go, weird scenes.

00:11:07.000 You should check that book out.

00:11:09.000 Yeah?

00:11:10.000 Weird scenes inside the canyon.

00:11:12.000 Laurel Canyon, covert ops, and the dark heart of the hippie dream.

00:11:16.000 Keep this away from Eddie Bravo, whatever you do, because he's already read it.

00:11:19.000 You might not believe everything in it, but you will think everything in it's possible.

00:11:24.000 So those artists all had a background where someone in their family was involved in the military or something along those lines?

00:11:32.000 Yeah.

00:11:32.000 They all came from very prestigious places.

00:11:34.000 I mean, all of them.

00:11:35.000 Really?

00:11:36.000 Yeah.

00:11:36.000 It's been a while since I read that book, but when you read that, That's why when I bring that up, because people ask about Laurel Canyon, it's like, I did not attempt, we did not make a documentary about Laurel Canyon, because that's the other half of Laurel Canyon that needs to be discussed as well, if you care about it.

00:11:49.000 And that's, I mean, bands are endlessly interesting to me, but that stuff, up on the hilltop, having the CIA, having like a photo, you know, they had a film place up there where they had loads and loads of film that's gone, that's burned, the building is gone, why is it gone?

00:12:04.000 I mean, you'll have fun with that book if you want to check it out.

00:12:07.000 Send me that link, Jamie, please.

00:12:10.000 It's fun.

00:12:11.000 Well, it was a strange time if you connect like the 50s and then the 60s.

00:12:18.000 The contrast of the style of the country, like just the culture.

00:12:24.000 It was so radically different.

00:12:26.000 And the music is the best representation of that.

00:12:28.000 Music and films.

00:12:29.000 Like music of the 50s versus the music of the 60s is a giant monumental shift.

00:12:36.000 Yeah, well, it was brand new.

00:12:38.000 That's why most of those bands were good.

00:12:40.000 They didn't have any bad influences yet.

00:12:42.000 I mean, not to name names, you get further down the line, I mean, as much as you might love David Bowie, he also was responsible for influencing a lot of stuff that you don't like.

00:12:53.000 Because it becomes harder and harder to find your influences, and you're You're having to sift through the muck of not only just bad influences, but bad equipment, bad guitars, bad microphones.

00:13:02.000 This all starts to change, and it becomes, instead of, I got four choices in front of me to listen to, and they're all really good, to now I got 20 choices.

00:13:09.000 It becomes more difficult to figure out which stuff is just clouding up your influences.

00:13:14.000 But anybody around the 50s, that's why you get those compilations.

00:13:16.000 Why was everybody so good?

00:13:19.000 Because they just didn't have any bad influences yet.

00:13:20.000 They were all listening to the same stuff, and it was all really good.

00:13:23.000 That's an interesting perspective. 0.97

00:13:25.000 So it was like fresh and it's almost like they didn't have a chance to fuck it up yet. 0.81

00:13:32.000 Yeah. 0.97

00:13:33.000 They didn't.

00:13:34.000 I mean, it's kind of interesting if you think about it.

00:13:36.000 I mean, even the most mildly talented person, if they were only listening to great stuff, they'd probably be pretty good just because their sources are so good.

00:13:42.000 And they were so close to the source.

00:13:44.000 I mean, rock and roll was so young.

00:13:45.000 In the 50s, it was brand new.

00:13:47.000 But even the early 60s, it's still like you don't have...

00:13:50.000 I mean, I've been making records for almost 30 years.

00:13:52.000 Wow.

00:13:53.000 If you're starting out in 1960, like, 30 years is from the 30s.

00:13:56.000 Like, there was nothing for them to be running around doing.

00:13:58.000 That's a great point.

00:14:00.000 I never thought of it that way.

00:14:02.000 That is a great point.

00:14:03.000 And then you also have to take into consideration that a genuine rock star was literally a decade old.

00:14:10.000 Yeah.

00:14:11.000 There was no real rock stars.

00:14:13.000 You had Buddy Holly, you had Elvis, you had a few, Chuck Berry, Lil Richard.

00:14:18.000 You had a few rock stars.

00:14:19.000 Yeah.

00:14:20.000 And then in the 1960s, that concept was little more than a decade old.

00:14:27.000 Yeah, and it seemed like a good option at that point.

00:14:30.000 Minus the plane crash, what if you could be one of those guys?

00:14:33.000 How big could Buddy Holly's dreams have really been?

00:14:38.000 Was he 22?

00:14:41.000 The idea of having any job I mean, I've had my job for 30 years.

00:14:46.000 That's amazing for anybody to have any line of work for that long.

00:14:49.000 So you go back to those guys starting, I can't imagine anybody wondering what kind of records we'll be making in the 60s and the 70s.

00:14:55.000 I mean, I can't imagine any kind of foresight.

00:14:58.000 Yeah, that's a really good point.

00:15:01.000 Imagine if that guy was still alive.

00:15:04.000 You know, he wouldn't be as old as you think if he was still alive.

00:15:07.000 I wouldn't do that.

00:15:09.000 I wouldn't bring a phone into a podcast.

00:15:12.000 I always use the do not disturb.

00:15:14.000 I think I did, didn't I? Probably just put it on silent.

00:15:19.000 What did you say?

00:15:20.000 You just asked me something.

00:15:21.000 Imagine if Buddy Holly stayed alive.

00:15:22.000 Yeah, you know, he wouldn't be as old as you think.

00:15:25.000 How old would he be now?

00:15:26.000 22 in the 50s. 1.00

00:15:29.000 He'd be 80 fucking years old. 0.99

00:15:31.000 Well, so is Mick Jagger. 0.99

00:15:32.000 Right.

00:15:32.000 You know what I mean?

00:15:33.000 Like that generation, they're going into their 80s.

00:15:35.000 And maybe he'd be, I don't know exactly, maybe 86, 85. Right.

00:15:38.000 But you'd think he'd be 105. He wouldn't be.

00:15:42.000 Yeah.

00:15:42.000 It's really interesting, the history of rock stars.

00:15:49.000 It's got to be a weird thing growing up being the son of literally one of the greatest musicians of all time.

00:15:57.000 How weird is that?

00:16:02.000 You have to be maybe a little more specific.

00:16:03.000 Your dad?

00:16:04.000 Yeah.

00:16:05.000 I know who he is.

00:16:06.000 I know that.

00:16:08.000 But I mean, what is it like? 0.96

00:16:09.000 It's got to be fucking bizarre. 0.95

00:16:11.000 It's all you know. 0.97

00:16:11.000 It's all you know, but in contrast to what other people know. 0.97

00:16:15.000 It's got to be very strange.

00:16:16.000 I don't think it's strange.

00:16:17.000 I never thought it was.

00:16:18.000 I mean, I was always aware it was different from the guy next to me.

00:16:22.000 But I thought his life was probably pretty weird, too.

00:16:24.000 I mean, somebody's dad being an oral surgeon was strange to me.

00:16:28.000 Right.

00:16:28.000 But I also grew up in the 80s.

00:16:30.000 It was a little bit different then.

00:16:32.000 And kids didn't really care.

00:16:33.000 My friends, the people I was growing up with didn't know or care about that stuff.

00:16:37.000 That's interesting.

00:16:37.000 It's not until later, really.

00:16:38.000 You saw people's parents act weird around you.

00:16:40.000 Oh, wow.

00:16:41.000 Kids didn't care. 1.00

00:16:42.000 No kids?

00:16:43.000 That's strange.

00:16:45.000 Wow.

00:16:45.000 Well, I'm also talking about L.A. Yeah.

00:16:47.000 Well, L.A. in the 80s was a Guns N' Roses fuckfest, right? 0.72

00:16:52.000 That's late 80s. 0.92

00:16:53.000 Yeah.

00:16:55.000 Well, I was, uh, yeah, I guess so, right?

00:16:58.000 That was, like, 87, 88?

00:17:00.000 The Guns N' Roses era?

00:17:02.000 Yeah.

00:17:03.000 Yeah, that's a little dip.

00:17:05.000 That was a quick, short era.

00:17:06.000 It was a weird era, right?

00:17:07.000 All of a sudden, everyone was wearing makeup and teasing their hair like a girl. 0.98

00:17:11.000 You know, I honestly didn't see much of that.

00:17:13.000 I only went to the Sunset Strip one time.

00:17:15.000 I didn't grow up too far from there.

00:17:18.000 And I still can't really, I mean, if it was like that every night, like, Jesus, like, I never saw that.

00:17:23.000 It wasn't the music I listened to, or none of the fashion, any of that stuff appealed to me.

00:17:26.000 But they took over that street, and it was literally, like, the street was just nothing but paper flyers, and it was pretty something, pretty wild.

00:17:34.000 Yeah, you didn't experience any of that?

00:17:36.000 You never went to like the Rainbow Bar and Grill?

00:17:38.000 No, not too long.

00:17:39.000 I was like maybe 35. Oh, okay.

00:17:41.000 No, I never went up there too much.

00:17:45.000 Those guys are still there.

00:17:47.000 Yeah, that thing is still there.

00:17:48.000 Yeah, you can still go.

00:17:49.000 It's a fun spot.

00:17:51.000 It's like a weird little, almost like, not quite a time capsule because you get to see that they've aged.

00:17:59.000 Yeah, no, it's a time capsule.

00:18:00.000 I mean, I've only been there a couple times.

00:18:04.000 I certainly didn't see that part of it, but it was a tough time coming up to bands at that time because that was pay to play.

00:18:10.000 Oh, really?

00:18:11.000 Yeah, that was very difficult.

00:18:13.000 Can you explain that to people?

00:18:15.000 Well, that's because there's so many bands in LA. You want to play.

00:18:18.000 Traditionally, you get paid to play music.

00:18:19.000 You're the entertainer.

00:18:20.000 But because there's so many bands, they'd sell you the tickets.

00:18:24.000 Now you go sell them.

00:18:25.000 So it takes the weight off the venue having to sell tickets or not.

00:18:29.000 So you buy the tickets for 500 bucks.

00:18:32.000 And now they don't care if you bring people in or not because they already made their $500 for that band and there's five bands that night.

00:18:38.000 You know what I mean?

00:18:39.000 So if you didn't have a lot of friends and you didn't want to go throw flyers around all day long, this is obviously before the internet.

00:18:44.000 So how do you get people?

00:18:45.000 So when you're going to ask your friend to go, who doesn't care about your band anyway, and then you're going to say, can you spend $15 to get in?

00:18:51.000 It just wasn't a good model for a lot of bands.

00:18:53.000 And we did it one time and we ate all the money.

00:18:55.000 Oh, wow.

00:18:57.000 It didn't work.

00:18:59.000 But there were so many bands that they could get away with doing that.

00:19:01.000 Yeah, I mean, I do get it.

00:19:03.000 I do get why that was the thing that they did then.

00:19:06.000 But it certainly excluded anybody who just couldn't afford to buy $500 worth of tickets.

00:19:12.000 That band can't play.

00:19:13.000 And a lot of great artists are weirdos and they don't have friends and they can't do that.

00:19:17.000 Yeah.

00:19:18.000 Wow.

00:19:20.000 Well, that time period was almost oversaturated, right?

00:19:26.000 Well, in L.A., just in general?

00:19:29.000 Well, certainly that scene was...

00:19:31.000 I think that was the Mecca.

00:19:32.000 People came from all across the country in their...

00:19:35.000 That was the dream.

00:19:36.000 I mean, literally, Welcome to the Jungle, the video, right?

00:19:39.000 Well, yeah, you had to have a scene.

00:19:41.000 I mean, Guns N' Roses is really, that's the end of it, really.

00:19:44.000 Well, maybe it was still around, but I don't consider that group to be part of that.

00:19:47.000 They were really a fantastic group.

00:19:49.000 They still are, but the scene I'm talking about, and I think anybody who saw it would also agree, they weren't really a part of that.

00:19:56.000 Who was part of that?

00:19:59.000 A lot of bands with two X's in their names, a lot of...

00:20:01.000 Two X's?

00:20:03.000 Yeah, a lot of bands misspelled.

00:20:04.000 I don't know.

00:20:05.000 I mean, it was more on the model of groups like Poison, which I'm sure you're aware of.

00:20:09.000 Oh, okay.

00:20:09.000 That was the look, that was the sound.

00:20:12.000 And there was good music for some people.

00:20:14.000 I mean, some people still love those songs.

00:20:15.000 I mean, that's not what I'm talking about.

00:20:17.000 It was just the scene was pretty crazy.

00:20:19.000 And that scene was the dominant scene in Hollywood, right?

00:20:23.000 Did it very much?

00:20:24.000 Was there other styles of music that was coming out of that area?

00:20:26.000 I think so.

00:20:27.000 I think if you went East, you had LA groups.

00:20:29.000 Well, I mean, LA's had great...

00:20:31.000 When I was a kid out in LA, you had X and the Blasters. 1.00

00:20:34.000 You had exciting groups that I liked.

00:20:35.000 And then I think there's also Jane's Addiction later.

00:20:37.000 There's other scenes out there.

00:20:38.000 It wasn't just the Sunset Strip.

00:20:40.000 It is always fascinating when one area becomes responsible for a giant chunk of the culture when it comes to music culture.

00:20:49.000 That was one area.

00:20:50.000 It's not even a big area.

00:20:52.000 You think about Sunset Strip if you're from out of town and then you go down there and you drive two miles and it's over.

00:20:58.000 You're like, oh, that's it, huh?

00:20:59.000 Yeah, and it's funny you mention that.

00:21:01.000 I wonder if you went to New York in 1986. I never heard of it.

00:21:05.000 Did they have a glam scene?

00:21:06.000 I don't think they did.

00:21:07.000 I mean, why only LA seemed to have that?

00:21:10.000 Everybody got in their trucks and drove out to LA to be a part of it.

00:21:13.000 Well, New York was different, right?

00:21:15.000 It was a lot more punk.

00:21:16.000 It was CBGB. It was, you know, the Cro-Mags. 1.00

00:21:19.000 It was a different kind of scene in New York, right?

00:21:22.000 For sure.

00:21:22.000 Well, I guess so.

00:21:23.000 It's a grittier place, I guess.

00:21:25.000 Yeah, it's just funny.

00:21:26.000 I don't know how they dodged that glam metal scene.

00:21:28.000 They dodged it entirely.

00:21:29.000 They kind of did.

00:21:30.000 I think that if you were into that, you had to go to LA, I suppose.

00:21:33.000 By the time you get there, it's the same as anything.

00:21:36.000 By the time you get to where you're going to follow the scene, it's over.

00:21:40.000 Wow.

00:21:41.000 That's how that works.

00:21:43.000 I didn't hear about any bands who were not from Seattle who went up there with their flannel shirts and got a record deal after that explosion.

00:21:49.000 I think you kind of had to be there.

00:21:52.000 Yeah, I guess so. 0.99

00:21:53.000 I remember very clearly when Nirvana came out, because I was at a buddy of mine's house, and he goes, dude, you've got to listen to this shit.

00:22:00.000 And he put on the Nevermind album, and we were all sitting around listening to it, going, I've never heard anything like this before.

00:22:09.000 I think I remember the same thing, too.

00:22:12.000 It wasn't at your buddy's house, but I was in a van.

00:22:14.000 We were doing shows.

00:22:14.000 We heard it, and You know, it was explosive, but you also, like they said, you knew this is the beginning of something else.

00:22:21.000 Yeah.

00:22:22.000 But it was the end.

00:22:24.000 My friend Eddie always says it was the end of that hairband era.

00:22:30.000 Many of those people have said so.

00:22:32.000 Said when they were sitting there watching MTV with their sky-high hair, they saw that and they said, we're done.

00:22:39.000 That's it.

00:22:39.000 That's so wild.

00:22:41.000 That's so wild that an artist...

00:22:43.000 I mean, really, their jaw would drop, and they just said, that's it.

00:22:49.000 We're done.

00:22:50.000 Because it was everything everybody could experience at the same time.

00:22:53.000 I mean, it was real, it was live, there was no shenanigans, and that's the writings on the wall.

00:22:59.000 When that gets over, and you don't have to be an actor, like a lot of people do, to get by, it was over.

00:23:05.000 Yeah, they just nuked the whole scene.

00:23:08.000 It's incredible that something can come along that resonates that well, that just hits a nerve that well, that everybody sort of agrees.

00:23:19.000 Well, that's a wrap, kids.

00:23:21.000 Time to throw away the hairspray.

00:23:22.000 I think just across the board, everybody felt at the same time.

00:23:25.000 They didn't have to go, do you think so, though?

00:23:26.000 Really?

00:23:26.000 I don't know.

00:23:27.000 I don't think so.

00:23:28.000 Everybody at the same time was like, oh, that's it.

00:23:30.000 It's a wrap. 0.80

00:23:30.000 I remember a few years later seeing hair bands and feeling sad for them, seeing them do things, and nobody gave a fuck about it anymore. 0.80

00:23:39.000 It was so hot, and then not anymore. 0.65

00:23:43.000 Well, it's hot again.

00:23:44.000 Yeah, that's true.

00:23:45.000 Nostalgia comes around.

00:23:46.000 That's true.

00:23:47.000 People get excited about singing.

00:23:48.000 There's a lot of boats out there playing to those bands, jumping around playing.

00:23:52.000 That's so true, dude.

00:23:53.000 I live on a lake.

00:23:54.000 They drive by.

00:23:56.000 It's that and...

00:23:57.000 Well, it's those cruises.

00:23:58.000 And it's fun.

00:24:00.000 Some of those people, they meant business.

00:24:02.000 They still love it.

00:24:02.000 They still care.

00:24:03.000 So who can argue?

00:24:04.000 Well, it's one of those things when people hear those old songs, it brings it back to high school or brings it back to when they loved those songs.

00:24:11.000 No intoxicant like nostalgia.

00:24:12.000 Right, yeah.

00:24:13.000 I mean, it's the most powerful.

00:24:16.000 Nobody's void of that.

00:24:17.000 Doesn't matter.

00:24:19.000 It's fun to have a band that you used to be embarrassed about that's not embarrassing anymore, too.

00:24:25.000 I never had that problem, to be honest.

00:24:27.000 No?

00:24:27.000 That's lifestyle bands.

00:24:29.000 That's the people who, when you're growing up, they either wear a shirt or a sticker on a notebook that really just want to tell you what kind of guy or girl they are.

00:24:36.000 It's not really about the band.

00:24:38.000 It's kind of synonymous with the jeans you're wearing.

00:24:42.000 Lifestyle music.

00:24:43.000 And there were people, when I grew up, I remember you couldn't like the Smiths.

00:24:46.000 If you also like the police it's just like you got to pick a team and it's just like so childish and that's high school in general really but when you get older I think you just you realize wait a second you know what I really did like Adam the Ants and I really did like I did like The Clash at the same time but I didn't realize I was allowed to do that.

00:25:02.000 Yeah I loved Led Zeppelin but I also loved Kiss and Kiss was the embarrassing one and I had to hide it from people.

00:25:09.000 You know what, though?

00:25:10.000 I mean, I think we're pretty much the same age.

00:25:12.000 That's the badge on everybody.

00:25:13.000 I did not have a Kiss face.

00:25:15.000 I mean, I've been around those people, and I like them, and I see the merit in it, but that did not blow through my basement and knock me out when I was a kid.

00:25:23.000 When I was really young, my uncle Vinny worked for Howard Marks Advertising, and they were the ones who did the album covers for Kiss.

00:25:32.000 So I met Ace Frehley when I was like...

00:25:36.000 I don't remember how old I was.

00:25:37.000 I was pretty young.

00:25:39.000 Younger than 10, I guess, probably.

00:25:41.000 And he had no makeup on.

00:25:42.000 I met him when he had no makeup on.

00:25:44.000 He came into the office, and no one knew what he looked like.

00:25:46.000 And I'm like, I knew a secret.

00:25:47.000 As a 10-year-old, I knew some crazy secret.

00:25:50.000 I know what Ace Frehley looks like.

00:25:52.000 So, because my uncle had introduced me to them at a young age, I was a fan from 10 to all through high school.

00:26:00.000 Oh, I get it.

00:26:01.000 No, I totally get it.

00:26:02.000 The comic book thing, I get it.

00:26:03.000 They were genius.

00:26:04.000 And I'll actually tell you a funny story.

00:26:06.000 I don't think he might have seen him in a long time, but the first time I met Paul Stanley was in a studio out in L.A. probably in like 97, I want to say.

00:26:14.000 So my son was four, maybe, and he was with me at five at the studio.

00:26:21.000 The studio had a big lounge with a big fish tank, and I was...

00:26:25.000 I was small talking with Paul Stanley, and my son didn't, he didn't have makeup on of course, and we were just catching up on stuff, and an intern from the building, or somebody who worked upstairs, came down with, they just reissued the new Kiss dolls, and he came down with a box, and he was hoping Paul would sign it.

00:26:38.000 You know?

00:26:39.000 Because you gotta have it in the box, can't open it, and if he's in the building, you gotta have it signed.

00:26:43.000 So Paul notices that my four- or five-year-old is looking at the doll and looking at him and realizing that there's a person in front of me who's actually a doll also.

00:26:50.000 He'd never seen that.

00:26:51.000 And it kind of tripped him out.

00:26:53.000 His eyes were going back and forth from the doll to Paul.

00:26:56.000 You know, back and forth.

00:26:57.000 And Paul leans down and says, did you want one of those?

00:26:59.000 And my son just kind of shakes his head.

00:27:00.000 He's speechless.

00:27:01.000 Now there's like a superhero in the room.

00:27:04.000 And he says, did you want one of those?

00:27:06.000 You want one?

00:27:06.000 And my son just kind of shook his head.

00:27:08.000 And then he leans back up.

00:27:09.000 He says to me, you know, if you go up on Hollywood over by Vine, they've still got some left.

00:27:13.000 They're not too pricey.

00:27:15.000 They haven't overpriced them yet.

00:27:16.000 He tells me where I can go get one.

00:27:17.000 It looked like it was going to be the moment of like, I'm going to send you a couple of those.

00:27:20.000 But he tells me where to go get some.

00:27:22.000 Which is funny in itself.

00:27:25.000 Devastating.

00:27:25.000 Kinda.

00:27:26.000 It was like...

00:27:27.000 So he learned a couple things all at once there.

00:27:29.000 Superhero person. 1.00

00:27:30.000 Yeah, you can buy your own shit. 0.99

00:27:31.000 Yeah, it's almost like how does it feel to want? 1.00

00:27:34.000 Yeah.

00:27:34.000 Do you want one of those?

00:27:35.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:27:36.000 Yeah, how does it feel to want?

00:27:37.000 Yeah, that's kind of what it was. 1.00

00:27:39.000 Shit. 1.00

00:27:39.000 It was funny though. 1.00

00:27:40.000 I went to see KISS in...

00:27:42.000 I guess it was the 90s when they had their comeback tour.

00:27:47.000 And it was me and Kevin James.

00:27:50.000 And Kevin James was also a closet KISS fan growing up.

00:27:53.000 We shared that in common.

00:27:55.000 And we went to see him in L.A. And the nostalgia was so high.

00:28:01.000 Because they were wearing makeup again.

00:28:03.000 Because they went through that whole phase with no makeup.

00:28:05.000 And then they put the makeup back on and had the costumes back on.

00:28:08.000 And it was like, yes!

00:28:10.000 I think it was, it might have been at the Forum, some big place in LA. That's like the first reunion, to never take the makeup off.

00:28:17.000 Nah, I should have never taken it off.

00:28:18.000 I mean, well, you know, if I could do it all over again, I'd start out with makeup.

00:28:21.000 They'll never see you get old, and you can do whatever you want.

00:28:23.000 Yeah.

00:28:23.000 You know, how great is that, to be like...

00:28:25.000 Seven years old and get to jump around in makeup and I mean at some point everybody yeah, I'd like something on my face too.

00:28:32.000 Yeah, and you can sneak around that way.

00:28:34.000 I mean they went everywhere.

00:28:36.000 With makeup or without?

00:28:38.000 Without makeup they can go anywhere.

00:28:39.000 We didn't know.

00:28:40.000 Yeah, I mean the only thing was like...

00:28:42.000 Do you remember all those like...

00:28:43.000 Right, yeah.

00:28:44.000 Coming out of clubs.

00:28:45.000 Yeah.

00:28:46.000 There was a lot of that.

00:28:47.000 I remember Paul Stanley had a bandana on like COVID days.

00:28:50.000 Bandana.

00:28:51.000 It was coming out of somewhere.

00:28:52.000 Yeah.

00:28:53.000 Yeah.

00:28:54.000 It's just interesting that a band pulled that off, though, that there was a band that became huge wearing makeup.

00:29:01.000 And they were interesting in that they'd got very little airplay, but they still would sell out enormous arenas every night.

00:29:09.000 Yeah, they united these people like yourself.

00:29:12.000 And that was part of the attraction was they're not on the radio.

00:29:14.000 This is our band.

00:29:15.000 So many great rock and roll bands are like that.

00:29:18.000 Yeah, that is a thing with...

00:29:19.000 That's a weird thing that happens with certain bands where when they become more popular, the original people that got into them get upset.

00:29:28.000 Like, they go, man, I fucking knew these people when they were underground.

00:29:31.000 Sold out. 0.99

00:29:32.000 Yeah, they sold out.

00:29:33.000 It's not my band anymore.

00:29:34.000 Yeah.

00:29:34.000 That band that was your band, like, now that...

00:29:37.000 They're a lot happier now.

00:29:38.000 There's a lot more people listening.

00:29:39.000 That's what they wanted from the beginning.

00:29:41.000 They didn't just want you and your two friends.

00:29:43.000 They wanted everybody to like them.

00:29:44.000 That's a weird thing, right?

00:29:45.000 Where people don't want things to get too successful because then it's not their secret anymore.

00:29:50.000 Well, not only that, if everybody likes it, how unique can it be?

00:29:53.000 The people like to feel unique.

00:29:55.000 Then I'm the only one who gets it. 0.97

00:29:57.000 It's such a stupid inclination because, obviously, if it's good, If you like it and it's good, wouldn't you want other people to know about it? 0.96

00:30:06.000 Like, isn't it good if more people find out about- Well, you know, the goal is to be awesome and really big. 0.99

00:30:12.000 Yeah.

00:30:13.000 Like Prince.

00:30:14.000 That's the goal.

00:30:14.000 Right.

00:30:15.000 Perfect example.

00:30:15.000 Everybody thinks you're awesome and you're really, really popular.

00:30:18.000 Yeah. 0.84

00:30:19.000 If you didn't like Prince, like, what the fuck is wrong with you? 0.90

00:30:22.000 Like, everybody liked Prince. 0.97

00:30:23.000 Yeah.

00:30:24.000 Someone tells you you don't like Prince, they don't like the Beatles.

00:30:27.000 You don't trust the person.

00:30:28.000 Right.

00:30:28.000 They're either lying or you should probably just hightail it.

00:30:31.000 Yeah, I've heard people say, well, a lot of the Stones songs suck. 0.50

00:30:34.000 And you go, well, they had some great ones. 0.54

00:30:36.000 They had some great ones.

00:30:38.000 They had some songs that I'm not really into.

00:30:39.000 Everybody does. 0.97

00:30:40.000 Yeah, but you can't say the Stones suck. 0.99

00:30:42.000 No. 0.97

00:30:43.000 You're not allowed to.

00:30:43.000 Well, I used to, there was that, I don't know if they still do it anymore.

00:30:46.000 I used to hate that people would ask you, Beatles or Stones?

00:30:49.000 Oh, those questions.

00:30:50.000 I mean, it would just make me livid.

00:30:53.000 That's like saying indoors or outdoors.

00:30:54.000 Yeah.

00:30:55.000 I need them both.

00:30:56.000 Food or sleep.

00:30:57.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:30:57.000 We kind of need them both.

00:30:58.000 They're not similar.

00:30:59.000 Again, why are we picking teams?

00:31:01.000 Are you kidding?

00:31:02.000 They're not the same at all.

00:31:03.000 What is it about people that do want to pick those teams, though?

00:31:06.000 They really do.

00:31:07.000 Well, they like to argue.

00:31:10.000 There's no right or wrong answer to that.

00:31:12.000 Or I should say there's no right answer.

00:31:13.000 If you say, well, the Beatles, then you're going to get a...

00:31:16.000 That person's going to be a pro-Stone's person in a second and just won't argue.

00:31:20.000 Now, you're not...

00:31:21.000 We were talking about this before the show, that you're not a social media person.

00:31:25.000 You're not interested in any of that stuff.

00:31:27.000 But a lot of people use that as like...

00:31:34.000 As a thermometer, to read the temperature of the audience, to try to figure out what people like or what they don't like. 0.93

00:31:42.000 That influence can either be beneficial, like you can learn something from your audience and get feedback and it can help you or it can fuck you up.

00:31:52.000 The way you developed without all that stuff, is it detrimental for artists to have that much interaction with people that are into them?

00:32:04.000 And to be doing social media back and forth with fans?

00:32:09.000 Well, I would say first, if you enjoy doing it, you should do it.

00:32:14.000 There's people not unlike myself who don't actually find the joy of it.

00:32:19.000 And that's when I feel bad for people who engage in it who aren't genuinely just enjoying it.

00:32:22.000 Because it is something.

00:32:24.000 And for people like myself, if you just put up tour dates and record release stuff, that's not interesting enough to people to really get that kind of traffic you're talking about.

00:32:32.000 But is it detrimental?

00:32:34.000 I don't know.

00:32:35.000 I don't have a grip on it.

00:32:37.000 I couldn't advise anybody.

00:32:38.000 Again, if you like doing it, you should.

00:32:39.000 But if you're not good at social media, then maybe you won't get noticed.

00:32:44.000 And I'll use Prince again.

00:32:45.000 Prince wasn't into it.

00:32:48.000 You know, he was large enough that he'd probably get over anyhow, but he might stumble a while because people are expecting that format of the interaction, of closeness, of pretending to be friends, and maybe it wouldn't work for him.

00:32:59.000 Is that expected of musicians today?

00:33:01.000 Totally.

00:33:02.000 Yeah.

00:33:02.000 So is that like something that's written into with contracts?

00:33:05.000 No.

00:33:06.000 Well, if you're young and you had a band that's really good, you know, before you send your demo tape to somebody or your link...

00:33:13.000 They're going to go to your Instagram and see how many followers you have.

00:33:15.000 Because they want to know you're going to do the work with them.

00:33:18.000 And I get that.

00:33:19.000 If you've got 100,000 followers, that looks really good to a label that might want to work with you.

00:33:23.000 That means you know what you're doing, and you know how to use social media, and it's a big asset.

00:33:28.000 If your tape is really good, and you've got great music, and you don't even have instant media, or you have 200 followers, that looks bad.

00:33:36.000 And that might hinder your chances of working with people.

00:33:39.000 Do you think that would fuck you guys up if you started today?

00:33:44.000 Would you think you would adapt and just change your approach? 0.96

00:33:46.000 Maybe if I was 21 again, maybe I'd enjoy it.

00:33:50.000 You know what I mean?

00:33:51.000 Do you have anything?

00:33:53.000 I mean, I got stuff.

00:33:55.000 What do you mean?

00:33:55.000 Do you have Instagram?

00:33:56.000 Do you have Facebook?

00:33:57.000 Do you have those things?

00:33:58.000 Yeah, we use Facebook.

00:33:59.000 I have stuff.

00:34:00.000 Do you want to come to my house?

00:34:01.000 What do you mean?

00:34:01.000 I got things.

00:34:02.000 Sure you do.

00:34:05.000 I don't excel at that format, we'll say that.

00:34:07.000 Right.

00:34:08.000 But I try to.

00:34:09.000 Well, if somebody asks me, do you think Jacob Dillon's big on Instagram? 0.99

00:34:13.000 I'd be like, that motherfucker probably doesn't even touch it. 0.99

00:34:17.000 Yeah, it kind of spooks me. 0.99

00:34:19.000 That's all.

00:34:19.000 I mean, it's all.

00:34:21.000 Follow your nose.

00:34:22.000 If you like it, do it.

00:34:23.000 If you don't, don't let people pressure you to do it.

00:34:26.000 Because the reaction that you're looking for, if it's not genuine, they don't want management putting things on it.

00:34:31.000 They want to feel you.

00:34:32.000 Of course.

00:34:33.000 And if they don't get that, you look at people's Instagrams.

00:34:35.000 If you notice this pattern that starts out, whether it's people like yourself or people in bands or actors or anybody, it starts out with pictures of their plants.

00:34:43.000 It starts out with their new car.

00:34:44.000 It starts out with their foot in the air by a pool.

00:34:47.000 And then you see the traffic start to pick up.

00:34:50.000 As you get closer now to today, it's pictures of their kids and it's them at the beach.

00:34:54.000 And it becomes very personal.

00:34:56.000 But when it's more of your art pictures, your photography, nobody really cares too much.

00:35:02.000 They want to see your candid, funny moments with Kevin James at a KISS concert.

00:35:08.000 That's what they want to see.

00:35:09.000 They want something that gives them a view into your life that's not available otherwise.

00:35:14.000 And that's not for everybody.

00:35:16.000 Or they want your honest expressions, too. 0.97

00:35:20.000 They definitely know if you've got some management team fucking with it. 0.97

00:35:24.000 Yeah, that's not good. 0.97

00:35:26.000 No, that doesn't work.

00:35:27.000 I mean, it kind of worked, but there's a feeling they get.

00:35:30.000 It's a plastic feeling.

00:35:32.000 That's not really using it for what it's worth.

00:35:35.000 That's not what they're looking for.

00:35:36.000 Yeah, it's just the concern that I would have for young artists is that I think you need a lot of time developing your thoughts and thinking about things from an honest perspective.

00:35:51.000 You know what you're never going to read about me?

00:35:53.000 You're never going to see my name in a quote that says, in a now-deleted post.

00:35:59.000 I mean, everybody's gonna get their first one of those, right?

00:36:02.000 I mean, it's forever.

00:36:04.000 There's always a tweet, right?

00:36:05.000 That's true, yeah.

00:36:06.000 Well, especially if you like to drink.

00:36:08.000 Yeah, no tweeting after what, 9 p.m.?

00:36:11.000 Yeah.

00:36:12.000 Well, you could be hammered by 9. How about just don't name names?

00:36:16.000 Tell your story, be as funny as you want.

00:36:17.000 Just don't say anybody's name in your tweet that it's gonna come back to get you.

00:36:22.000 Yeah, there could be that, or your hot take on some controversial political situation.

00:36:28.000 Yeah.

00:36:29.000 Yeah.

00:36:30.000 It's not for everybody.

00:36:31.000 Well, it's a weird way to interact.

00:36:33.000 It's a good way to get information across as far as if you're a journalist or something.

00:36:38.000 I think Twitter is better for journalists than it is for anybody else. 0.91

00:36:42.000 And maybe up and coming comics, it's not bad because I've followed quite a few people while I see their posts and I go, that's a fucking funny person.

00:36:51.000 I'm going to follow them.

00:36:52.000 Just give me some more of that.

00:36:54.000 What else you got?

00:36:54.000 But how does that always benefit that person you're following?

00:36:57.000 Well, it benefits them that they tweet, I find out about them, and then maybe I meet them. 0.97

00:37:02.000 And I have had this happen, where I run into a comic and I go, hey, I follow you on Twitter, funny shit.

00:37:07.000 See, I wonder for a lot of people who have that middle level of like 30,000, 40,000 followers, how that's translating to their...

00:37:16.000 Outside of the Instagram, where are you seeing that work?

00:37:21.000 Where is it coming back to you?

00:37:22.000 Because that's why they're doing it.

00:37:23.000 Well, for stand-up, sure.

00:37:25.000 But for bands, I haven't heard those people have 30,000 followers and put their record out.

00:37:30.000 They don't sell 30,000 records.

00:37:32.000 Right, right.

00:37:33.000 It seems like for bands, you gotta get on something. 0.97

00:37:37.000 There's gotta be something where somebody showcases you, whether it's the Jimmy Kimmel show or something, where you play a song and go, oh, that's fucking great. 0.79

00:37:46.000 And then it catches on. 0.87

00:37:48.000 Yeah, no, it's good.

00:37:49.000 I mean, I don't participate very much in it, but there's, I mean, I look at the stuff too, I get it, you know, but if it feels natural, you enjoy it, then you should do it.

00:37:57.000 But if you don't, like, I feel bad for people who just go along with it, even though it doesn't feel good.

00:38:03.000 Well, now there's new things like TikTok.

00:38:06.000 I can't keep up.

00:38:09.000 There's always some new sort of style of social media that you're supposed to adapt to.

00:38:14.000 And I'm like, okay, that's where I draw the line.

00:38:17.000 Yeah, I don't know much about that one.

00:38:20.000 I've had it explained to me a few different times.

00:38:22.000 I don't really understand what...

00:38:24.000 How TikTok's better.

00:38:25.000 Different than the other things that are going on.

00:38:27.000 It's an assault on your attention span.

00:38:28.000 It just sucks your attention span in.

00:38:31.000 I don't need any more of that.

00:38:32.000 It grabs it and drags it. 0.85

00:38:33.000 Because the videos start playing instantaneously.

00:38:35.000 You don't play them.

00:38:37.000 They play instantly.

00:38:38.000 You open the app.

00:38:38.000 They just play video after video after video.

00:38:40.000 And you're just like, ah!

00:38:42.000 It just hooks you.

00:38:43.000 I need more of that.

00:38:44.000 I know a lot of people that will say, I'm just going to look at it for a couple minutes.

00:38:47.000 And the next thing you know, an hour and a half is gone. 1.00

00:38:49.000 I'm like, what the fuck? 0.99

00:38:50.000 Where's my day? 0.99

00:38:51.000 Yeah, there's funny stuff out there.

00:38:52.000 I mean, I don't have a problem with it.

00:38:55.000 What do you do to entertain yourself?

00:38:57.000 Do you have a specific thing that you like to do when you wind down?

00:39:00.000 Do you like to watch documentaries?

00:39:02.000 I do watch a lot of documentaries.

00:39:03.000 I read a lot of memoirs.

00:39:06.000 Really?

00:39:06.000 I like those.

00:39:07.000 Yeah, a lot of music memoirs.

00:39:08.000 I'll read most books.

00:39:09.000 I'm going to give a shout-out right now.

00:39:11.000 I don't know them.

00:39:11.000 Richard Marks.

00:39:12.000 It has a great new book.

00:39:13.000 Really?

00:39:14.000 Yeah, I was reading it on the airplane yesterday.

00:39:15.000 Oh.

00:39:16.000 So he should know.

00:39:16.000 He's a social media guy.

00:39:17.000 Is he?

00:39:18.000 Yeah.

00:39:18.000 And he should know it's working.

00:39:20.000 Countering everything I just said about my own shit. 0.98

00:39:23.000 His is working because I picked up his book and I think it's great. 0.99

00:39:25.000 It's really entertaining.

00:39:26.000 What's it called?

00:39:28.000 Oh, here he goes.

00:39:31.000 Laptop.

00:39:31.000 Jamie, you got it?

00:39:33.000 Let's see, we're going to put it up on the big screen?

00:39:35.000 Stories to tell.

00:39:36.000 Stories to tell.

00:39:37.000 Is that it?

00:39:38.000 Yeah.

00:39:39.000 Sorry, the tweet didn't blow.

00:39:40.000 That's what it's called.

00:39:41.000 Well, because I think anybody who's in my shoes in any similar capacity, they've got an interesting story.

00:39:46.000 There he is.

00:39:47.000 Look at that.

00:39:48.000 Is that live?

00:39:48.000 Hey, man.

00:39:49.000 Still got the messed up hair on purpose.

00:39:53.000 But everybody who came to L.A. to make it, I find their stories are interesting.

00:39:58.000 Or New York, wherever they went.

00:40:01.000 Do you contrast those to your own story?

00:40:03.000 Does it give you a feeling of understanding that everybody's weird little path to try to get to where they are is different?

00:40:11.000 Absolutely.

00:40:15.000 What do you mean more specific?

00:40:17.000 I mean just that your business like if you're if you're reading music memoirs that is your business and it's a strange business right and it's a business it's very much like comedy in a way that you know you're off with your first footsteps and good luck who knows where this journey is going to take you and it's fascinating to me I've read a bunch of comedians memoirs or autobiographies or biographies on comics And it's fascinating just because I contrast those to my own life and just think about this weird path that they

00:40:47.000 went on.

00:40:48.000 And I think of my own weird path and that it's a wild world you're carving out when you're carving a career in music or in comedy.

00:40:56.000 You're just kind of like hoping it works out and you have no idea.

00:41:01.000 Yeah, and that is what connects a lot of those stories is interesting.

00:41:05.000 Most people you're talking about, they come from nowhere.

00:41:06.000 They come from nothing.

00:41:07.000 And that doesn't mean they don't have a nice family life.

00:41:10.000 I just mean that no one's watching them.

00:41:11.000 Right.

00:41:12.000 It could be anybody.

00:41:13.000 Yeah.

00:41:13.000 You know, talent is not, you know, it's not a genetic thing.

00:41:17.000 You know, it's like literally just thrown up in the air and it just somewhere falls on the brand of people around the world.

00:41:22.000 You know, so how does it connect to one person who then has the ability to figure out a way to make it through, call it a dream, whatever, and get there?

00:41:29.000 Yeah.

00:41:30.000 There's no blueprint.

00:41:31.000 The blueprints don't work.

00:41:33.000 Any template you might try to follow, it worked for that person, and there's just no reason for you to think it's going to work for you, too.

00:41:38.000 You might start out chasing that, but inevitably you're going to have to find your own path.

00:41:42.000 A hundred percent, but it's really interesting watching someone's path when you know that they already did it.

00:41:48.000 There's something about that, like reading about Kinison, like knowing that he already did it, just to read the path and how it all went down.

00:41:56.000 Yeah, and it's interesting, too, if you look at like, you know, Prince had a really good book.

00:41:59.000 It was actually a collection of things he'd written with somebody just before that he passed.

00:42:03.000 You read the book and it's interesting because of course you know he's going to be Prince, one of the more talented people that may ever walk the planet.

00:42:12.000 So you're reading it and you're hearing him get denied with demo tapes and you're hearing no one's believing in him, that he's a weird kid and all that.

00:42:18.000 But you know that he's Prince.

00:42:19.000 As you read the book, you kind of have a secret that...

00:42:23.000 You're unstoppable.

00:42:24.000 This stuff doesn't really matter what you're going through in your high school and you like basketball and this person denied and that person didn't want to be.

00:42:30.000 It's interesting, but what's actually most fascinating is you literally were destined to be Prince one way or another.

00:42:36.000 This stuff is almost inconsequential.

00:42:38.000 You're going to be Prince someday.

00:42:40.000 Well, it is fascinating knowing that he did become Prince, but you kind of feel the anxiety of the journey, right?

00:42:47.000 Like when you're reading about someone, even though you know it is inconsequential, you are.

00:42:51.000 There's no denying he became Prince.

00:42:53.000 But he didn't know that.

00:42:55.000 Wow, it was all going down.

00:42:56.000 No.

00:42:57.000 That's what's cool about it.

00:42:58.000 But it's fun to read.

00:42:58.000 You can read that, and you can hear the people who don't believe in him, and you can be like...

00:43:02.000 We all have a, I miss that one kind of moment, or I didn't see that, but like, imagine being the guy who's like, yeah, you know, I had, Prince came in and I didn't hear it.

00:43:11.000 I didn't hear it.

00:43:13.000 I remember the exact moment I first listened to Prince.

00:43:17.000 I was in an Audi Fox.

00:43:19.000 I had an Audi Fox.

00:43:20.000 It was his little...

00:43:22.000 Shitty front-wheel drive car.

00:43:24.000 I was driving on the Massachusetts Turnpike, and I had a cassette that I just bought.

00:43:29.000 And I just unwrapped it, and I popped it into the cassette player, and it was, I listened to I'm Gonna Be Your Lover.

00:43:35.000 I Wanna Be Your Lover, that song.

00:43:37.000 And it was the one where, you know, the cassette where him, it's like he's got no shirt on, and it's like he's just staring at the camera. 0.76

00:43:43.000 And I remember thinking, like, holy shit, like, who is this guy? 0.50

00:43:47.000 Like, this is just different. 0.99

00:43:50.000 It's like he's singing in a falsetto about being in love with a girl and his voice is incredible.

00:43:56.000 Or you could be that outrageous if you're gonna be really good.

00:43:59.000 We get a lot of the other, which is people who are outrageous and they're compensating for not really having much to sing or say, but he was fully loaded, he had all of it.

00:44:07.000 Well, he was that guy.

00:44:09.000 I mean, that's who he was.

00:44:10.000 I mean, it was outrageous because he was an honestly eccentric human being.

00:44:15.000 I mean, that really was who he was.

00:44:18.000 An insanely talented, eccentric human being.

00:44:21.000 You know, I met him once.

00:44:22.000 Actually, I met him with Dean Del Rey.

00:44:24.000 No way!

00:44:25.000 Yeah, at a club out in New York.

00:44:26.000 Maybe it's early 2000s.

00:44:30.000 And I forget what the club was, it was crowded, and somebody, this is a true story, somebody had come to me and tapped me on the shoulder and said, you know, Prince is here, he wants you to come sit down.

00:44:39.000 And I seriously, I started, I followed, and I thought I was gonna go sit with Prince William.

00:44:44.000 That sounded more believable to me.

00:44:47.000 That sounded like, that I believed.

00:44:49.000 And then we went over and it was obviously...

00:44:52.000 Prince Rogers Nelson.

00:44:53.000 Yeah, but it was a really funny night.

00:44:54.000 I'm glad Dean was there too.

00:44:57.000 We sat in a booth.

00:44:58.000 It was Prince and it was his lawyer bodyguard.

00:45:01.000 He had a lawyer slash bodyguard?

00:45:03.000 That's what he was.

00:45:03.000 And he was a very big guy.

00:45:05.000 And we sat in a booth.

00:45:06.000 And it's hard to imagine now that like, you know, the guy, he wasn't like being swarmed with people.

00:45:10.000 It was Prince, you know, but...

00:45:14.000 It's awkward.

00:45:15.000 It's like, you know, you're sitting, the four of us from the booth, just kind of like, you know, I know what to say.

00:45:19.000 And it's kind of loud, so if I did want to really have a conversation, it'd be difficult.

00:45:23.000 The bodyguard kind of nudges me and he says, you know, it's been 25 years since Purple Rain.

00:45:28.000 And I was like, oh, that's awesome.

00:45:29.000 And then he's sitting next to me.

00:45:31.000 He goes, excuse me?

00:45:33.000 I said, that's awesome.

00:45:34.000 He goes, what's awesome?

00:45:35.000 I go, that Purple Rain is 25 years old.

00:45:39.000 What a great record.

00:45:40.000 And he goes, great record?

00:45:41.000 I say, yeah.

00:45:42.000 He goes, well, tell him.

00:45:44.000 And he's pointing at Prince.

00:45:46.000 So now I'm like, he's a very large man.

00:45:48.000 He's like nudging me.

00:45:49.000 And I'm thinking, that's amazing.

00:45:50.000 Prince, seriously.

00:45:51.000 He cannot be insecure that people don't love Purple Rain.

00:45:55.000 But I leaned over and I said, you know, Purple Rain, like, wow, 25 years, what a great record.

00:45:59.000 And he kind of fanned himself.

00:46:00.000 He's like, oh, well, you think so?

00:46:01.000 And like, even Prince needed to hear once in a while that he was awesome.

00:46:05.000 How weird is it that his bodyguard, this big giant dude's like nudging you to tell Prince that he's awesome?

00:46:10.000 I felt like I got set up.

00:46:11.000 Like he knew Prince needed a compliment maybe. 1.00

00:46:13.000 I'd be nervous and he would go, of course it's good, motherfucker! 1.00

00:46:16.000 Yeah, I was nervous. 1.00

00:46:17.000 Well, it was awkward.

00:46:17.000 Like, what is it?

00:46:18.000 It's like the night at the Rocks where you just kind of sit in the booth just like, you know.

00:46:22.000 It is Prince, right?

00:46:25.000 It is.

00:46:25.000 And then like, you know.

00:46:26.000 And so you guys aren't really interacting?

00:46:28.000 A little bit.

00:46:30.000 Not a lot.

00:46:30.000 I think he just invited me just to come sit in his booth.

00:46:33.000 Just to sit?

00:46:34.000 Yeah.

00:46:35.000 It was very loud, but that wasn't the problem.

00:46:40.000 I don't know why I was asked to sit, but he was very nice.

00:46:44.000 He was very cool.

00:46:45.000 Wow. 0.91

00:46:47.000 Yeah, I fucked up once. 0.96

00:46:49.000 Real bad. 0.98

00:46:50.000 I had an opportunity to see him live at the House of Blues in Vegas.

00:46:56.000 And he was in the foundation room, you know, that small room upstairs.

00:47:00.000 And I had a show, and my show was done by like 10 o'clock or something like that, and Prince was going to go on somewhere after midnight. 0.98

00:47:10.000 And it was like 11.30, and I was like, fuck, I'm tired. 0.92

00:47:13.000 I don't want to wait around. 1.00

00:47:16.000 And I fucked up. 1.00

00:47:17.000 Yeah, you did. 0.99

00:47:17.000 And it was like early 2000-ish, somewhere around then. 0.99

00:47:22.000 Well, you feel like you fucked up only because you never got it. 0.94

00:47:24.000 Well, it's hindsight. 0.98

00:47:26.000 You never had a chance to see him. 1.00

00:47:28.000 I was just being a bitch. 1.00

00:47:30.000 Like, stay up. 1.00

00:47:31.000 Power through.

00:47:31.000 Yeah, a lot of times you could say you couldn't see that coming.

00:47:34.000 That one you probably should have stuck around for.

00:47:35.000 You wouldn't get a lot of chances.

00:47:37.000 I think it was one of those, there was a lot of nights where I would do the UFC, and then after I did commentary, then I would do a show, and then after I did a show, I was done.

00:47:47.000 I was just beat.

00:47:49.000 But I still should have powered through. 0.99

00:47:51.000 If I had the opportunity today, I would have fucking won. 0.85

00:47:54.000 Yeah, a lot of times you do the wrong thing, but then you can say, well, yeah, but I got the story. 1.00

00:47:58.000 Your story sucks. 1.00

00:47:59.000 My story sucks. 1.00

00:48:00.000 That's not good. 0.99

00:48:00.000 I never met him. 0.99

00:48:01.000 I never saw him.

00:48:02.000 But I had a chance to see him in a small venue.

00:48:05.000 And they were setting it up for me.

00:48:06.000 They were going to hook it up.

00:48:07.000 If you're in bands traveling through Minneapolis, every time you went through there, no matter what, from like, maybe like 91 when we started...

00:48:16.000 Mostly up until he passed.

00:48:17.000 Every time your band went through town, somebody told you, you know, he's doing a private gig tonight.

00:48:22.000 Ooh.

00:48:23.000 So, woo, where's that at?

00:48:24.000 And they'd tell you, and, like, you would, like, hang out, and you'd be like, you know, well, he doesn't go on until four.

00:48:29.000 I mean, it was, like, literally every time the rumor would circulate that he's playing right around you, right around the corner, you should stick around.

00:48:35.000 And he never did.

00:48:36.000 Really?

00:48:37.000 He just wouldn't show up?

00:48:38.000 I don't think he ever was gonna.

00:48:39.000 I think it was just the Minneapolis rumor nightly.

00:48:42.000 Oh, wow.

00:48:42.000 Because he liked to do that, and he would do that sometimes.

00:48:45.000 He liked to do those gigs or he liked to tell people he was going to do gigs and not show up?

00:48:49.000 No, I think he liked to just surprise people and play.

00:48:52.000 I mean, I could do that sometimes.

00:48:54.000 We're on tour.

00:48:54.000 You can go late night to where a bar band's playing and you can ask to use the gear and play a little bit.

00:49:00.000 When you're on tour, a lot of bands like to do that.

00:49:02.000 So I'm sure he liked to do that too.

00:49:04.000 And just go downtown Minneapolis and just hijack somebody's stage and play some music.

00:49:08.000 And if you do it a couple times, from then on out, rumor circulates that you're about to do it tonight.

00:49:12.000 Yeah.

00:49:13.000 Yeah, I've done that before.

00:49:15.000 And there's a place in Toronto that I used to do where I used to do this.

00:49:20.000 It's a weed bar.

00:49:22.000 And they had weird laws in Toronto.

00:49:26.000 I forget what the law was, but it was almost like it was some sort of a club.

00:49:31.000 I don't know if it was legal or not, but they had bongs in the front, literally like a head shop.

00:49:36.000 Then you go in the back room and there's like 150 seats and a stage.

00:49:42.000 And you go in there and everyone's barbecued.

00:49:46.000 Like they're smoking so much pot that there's no more air in the room.

00:49:48.000 It's all just pot smoke.

00:49:50.000 So you're just breathing pot smoke.

00:49:51.000 So I would do a gig at like a big place and then go there after the gig and do like a late night spot there.

00:49:59.000 Are those easy laughs?

00:50:00.000 I mean, everybody's already high.

00:50:01.000 No, man, it's bizarre.

00:50:03.000 Pacing's a little slow for everybody?

00:50:05.000 You're so high.

00:50:05.000 The moment you get in there, there's no air.

00:50:09.000 It's all just pot smoke.

00:50:11.000 So you're basically in some weird altered state trying to interact.

00:50:17.000 That's it.

00:50:18.000 That's the spot.

00:50:19.000 There's a video of me on stage there with the Iron Sheik. 0.68

00:50:24.000 It's closed now. 0.92

00:50:25.000 It's a ridiculous spot. 0.70

00:50:27.000 I think it's called the Comedy Underground, is that what it's called? 0.87

00:50:29.000 It's closed now.

00:50:30.000 It's closed?

00:50:31.000 COVID took it out?

00:50:32.000 I think so.

00:50:34.000 But yeah, that's one of those things that comics like to do.

00:50:37.000 I was in Denver once, just randomly.

00:50:41.000 I was doing shows, and I get off stage and Dave Chappelle's in the green room.

00:50:46.000 And I go, what are you doing, Dave?

00:50:48.000 And he goes, oh, I just decided to fly to Denver!

00:50:51.000 And I go, do you want to go on stage?

00:50:52.000 He goes, well, should I? I go, fuck yeah, hold on a second. 0.99

00:50:55.000 So I go back to the audience, and I go, hey, come back, sit down. 0.99

00:50:59.000 I go, Dave Chappelle's here.

00:51:01.000 So everybody's calling people from outside that already made it to the street.

00:51:04.000 Come down, and Dave does another hour.

00:51:07.000 And then he takes me out on the town.

00:51:10.000 Dave Chappelle knows these little speakeasies, Where there's these weird bars.

00:51:16.000 You go down an alleyway.

00:51:17.000 It doesn't make any sense.

00:51:19.000 And then a guy's waiting with a suit and he puts his hand up and they open up a door with no sign on it.

00:51:23.000 And you go in and there's this beautiful bar that seats like 30 people.

00:51:28.000 It's like one of those weird things.

00:51:29.000 He's that guy.

00:51:30.000 You know, he's that guy that he'll show up anywhere and do a show at 1 o'clock in the morning.

00:51:35.000 He'll show up at bars on his birthday.

00:51:37.000 He'll just show up.

00:51:38.000 And then by the time he's offstage, the place is packed.

00:51:41.000 Do you intentionally try out new material when you do something like that?

00:51:45.000 Would Chappelle do that?

00:51:46.000 Or you don't do your normal bits, would you?

00:51:48.000 I think he just does it to just do stand-up.

00:51:51.000 I think he would do his normal bets.

00:51:52.000 But open mic nights are a great place to stop in to do new material.

00:51:56.000 It's good to do new material at a place where the audience doesn't exactly know that you're going to be there.

00:52:02.000 So they may not be your fans.

00:52:04.000 Do you ever just jump up and do that with no material?

00:52:06.000 Or is that not wise?

00:52:07.000 The only time I ever do that is they have shows like that.

00:52:10.000 Like they have a show in Austin called The Riff.

00:52:13.000 And there's a wheel.

00:52:14.000 And they have all these subjects that the audience members will fill out forms.

00:52:19.000 And they'll fill out like an index card with like a subject.

00:52:23.000 And they throw it into the bucket.

00:52:25.000 And then they stick the subjects on the wheel.

00:52:27.000 And you just spin the wheel.

00:52:28.000 And whatever it lands on, then you start talking about it.

00:52:31.000 What might it be?

00:52:32.000 Like what would...

00:52:33.000 What?

00:52:34.000 Music?

00:52:35.000 Pharmaceutical drugs.

00:52:36.000 It could be music. 0.60

00:52:37.000 It could be premarital sex. 0.69

00:52:40.000 It could be whatever.

00:52:41.000 That's high-flying.

00:52:42.000 That's on the wire.

00:52:43.000 That's pretty good.

00:52:44.000 But the audience knows you're doing it, so it's a safety net.

00:52:47.000 It's fun.

00:52:48.000 They know.

00:52:49.000 They're coming to see that.

00:52:50.000 Yeah, and if it's not awesome, well, nobody can be too disappointed.

00:52:54.000 It's not like you didn't take the gig seriously.

00:52:56.000 You just showed up.

00:52:57.000 We used to do that in L.A. too. 0.93

00:52:58.000 It used to be called Thunder Pussy, and they changed it to Stand Up on the Spot, which is a much more tame version of it. 0.65

00:53:04.000 Hey, wait a second. 0.95

00:53:05.000 I've got to ask you.

00:53:06.000 What about that?

00:53:07.000 Is it Byron Allen?

00:53:08.000 Byron Allen.

00:53:09.000 That show?

00:53:10.000 That show.

00:53:10.000 That's not on anymore, is it?

00:53:12.000 It's on at like 3 in the morning, weird hours. 0.99

00:53:13.000 That guy's made a billion dollars from that fucking show. 0.99

00:53:15.000 But what's up with that show? 0.99

00:53:17.000 Because he doesn't do it anymore, right?

00:53:19.000 I don't know, he might.

00:53:20.000 But it might be still around.

00:53:21.000 It's a really strange show.

00:53:22.000 Like, hey Jacob, I understand that you like guitars.

00:53:27.000 Well, exactly.

00:53:27.000 It's just like, So you just flew.

00:53:28.000 You're like Hawaii.

00:53:29.000 It's like there's no...

00:53:30.000 It makes no sense going from one thing to the other.

00:53:32.000 And obviously, like, it's a strange format, which is, like, they have to act natural.

00:53:37.000 But it's so obvious.

00:53:39.000 I mean, when you do any show, when you go to Letterman, yeah, you do an interview with somebody, and they'd have some things you're going to talk about, and it would feel kind of natural.

00:53:44.000 But that is, like, one person is going off hysterically about, you know, this car that he bought, and then it just goes right into skiing.

00:53:50.000 And, like, there's no...

00:53:51.000 There's nothing...

00:53:52.000 Natural about any of it.

00:53:54.000 Right, and Adam Carolla's talking about grilled cheese sandwiches, and then this guy's Gabriel Iglesias.

00:53:58.000 Well, that's the weirdest.

00:53:59.000 So you don't like grilled cheese sandwiches, do you?

00:54:02.000 But I wonder if it's not on it.

00:54:04.000 They don't film it anymore.

00:54:05.000 I think they might.

00:54:06.000 They might.

00:54:07.000 They might still film it.

00:54:08.000 Can we look that up?

00:54:08.000 It's one of the clunkiest shows that's ever existed.

00:54:11.000 It's so strange.

00:54:12.000 It's not good.

00:54:13.000 I've seen some really funny...

00:54:14.000 Everyone's talking over each other.

00:54:15.000 You can't...

00:54:16.000 It's strange.

00:54:16.000 But I wonder if he's not doing that anymore.

00:54:20.000 I mean, if you're a young comic.

00:54:22.000 That must have been a big arrival moment if you were cast to be on that show.

00:54:27.000 Not really.

00:54:27.000 Not really?

00:54:28.000 Ten years ago, you were nobody and they let you be on that show?

00:54:31.000 It's okay.

00:54:31.000 A big arrival moment is Letterman.

00:54:34.000 Not quite that.

00:54:35.000 Those are the big shows.

00:54:36.000 But that's a unique thing, that it was four comedians in one moment.

00:54:39.000 Yeah, but it was on at one in the morning.

00:54:41.000 Was it always?

00:54:41.000 I think it was a syndicated show, so I think it was very profitable for him.

00:54:45.000 You should do one.

00:54:47.000 The same version of it?

00:54:48.000 Like a version?

00:54:49.000 No.

00:54:50.000 No.

00:54:50.000 Not a good model.

00:54:53.000 I think you should leave all this behind.

00:54:55.000 It's not like this is going well for you anyway.

00:54:56.000 We're comedians.

00:54:57.000 Cut loose.

00:54:58.000 There was only tape for one season.

00:55:00.000 It says they added more shows in 2014, which was seven years later, and they haven't...

00:55:05.000 No updates.

00:55:05.000 Wait, so there's only two seasons of it?

00:55:07.000 Yeah, and they're like 15 years old.

00:55:09.000 What?

00:55:09.000 Yeah, that's according to the Wikipedia.

00:55:11.000 What?

00:55:12.000 Because he went on to, like, his company just bought the Weather Channel a couple years ago.

00:55:16.000 Okay.

00:55:17.000 I'm telling you, Byron Allen is one of, like, the most undercover billionaire characters in all of show business.

00:55:24.000 Yeah, he's made a shitload of money, and he made a lot of money off of that show.

00:55:28.000 Because it's a syndicated show, so you could sell it, and they always needed something.

00:55:31.000 But you don't think there's a spot for updating that format and having somebody do it?

00:55:34.000 It's a terrible way to do jokes.

00:55:36.000 Yeah, it's terrible.

00:55:37.000 Yes, I agree.

00:55:40.000 Let's do it.

00:55:43.000 Are you secretly harbored ideas about doing stand-up?

00:55:45.000 Am I selling it?

00:55:45.000 How well have I sold this idea?

00:55:47.000 Pretty good.

00:55:47.000 I'm getting sweaty.

00:55:49.000 Are you in?

00:55:49.000 I'm in, man.

00:55:50.000 I've got goosebumps.

00:55:51.000 Yeah, alright, bad idea.

00:55:53.000 You just can't.

00:55:56.000 It's crazy.

00:55:57.000 You can pull it off.

00:55:58.000 If you're a good comic, you can pull it off and be funny in those little chunks.

00:56:02.000 But it's so obvious that this is set up.

00:56:05.000 It's like...

00:56:07.000 It's like a bad acting gig.

00:56:09.000 Yeah.

00:56:09.000 It's obvious you're acting.

00:56:11.000 Yes.

00:56:11.000 You like that.

00:56:12.000 Why do you like that?

00:56:13.000 Look at your smile.

00:56:15.000 What about the rap battles?

00:56:16.000 Those ones, when they insult each other, it's kind of a similar thing.

00:56:20.000 There's no other natural format for this.

00:56:24.000 I'm not going to go down the road of telling you I know what is happening in that world, but it's kind of similar.

00:56:29.000 It's an unnatural environment to have people doing their Whatever it is that they like doing in competition, basically.

00:56:37.000 Yeah, but rap battling is kind of an art in and of itself.

00:56:40.000 That's a different thing.

00:56:41.000 Have you seen Roast Battle?

00:56:43.000 Do you know about Roast Battle?

00:56:44.000 No.

00:56:45.000 Roast Battle is one of the best shows at the Comedy Store.

00:56:48.000 And it became a show on Comedy Central, but they kind of fucked it up because they watered it down.

00:56:51.000 Roast Battle is a show that's at the Comedy Store that is...

00:56:58.000 It's my friend Brian Moses' show.

00:57:00.000 Him and Jeff Ross is a part of it, too.

00:57:02.000 And what it is is they'll have comics, and they'll let them know in advance they're gonna duke it out.

00:57:07.000 So, like, say if you and Jamie were gonna duke it out, you would know, like, hey, on the 14th, you guys are gonna have your night.

00:57:14.000 And so you would write jokes about Jamie for weeks.

00:57:18.000 And Jamie would write jokes about you for weeks.

00:57:21.000 And then you'd stand next to each other, and Jamie would be like, Jacob is Bob Dylan's son.

00:57:26.000 I think I've seen that. 0.98

00:57:27.000 Yeah, it's fucking great. 0.93

00:57:28.000 But then it's not happening anymore. 0.97

00:57:30.000 Oh, it still happens, yeah.

00:57:31.000 Oh, but you mean live, not a show.

00:57:32.000 It's live.

00:57:33.000 It's not a show.

00:57:33.000 It's better live anyway.

00:57:35.000 It's one of those things where they fucked it up turning into a show.

00:57:37.000 Look, I'm glad they did it as a show because I'm glad those guys made money and Comedy Central, you know, put a highlight.

00:57:43.000 It just...

00:57:44.000 Maybe, do they do that anymore?

00:57:45.000 Roast Battle's not a show anymore, right?

00:57:46.000 Is that correct?

00:57:47.000 It is.

00:57:47.000 Not on Comedy Central, I don't believe, no, but they're doing it online now from the Comedy Store, so it's sort of, yeah.

00:57:53.000 Perfect.

00:57:54.000 As long as they just leave it alone and broadcast it live. 0.66

00:57:57.000 The problem is Comedy Central, they wanted to get their greasy little PC fingers all over it and fuck it up, because it is literally the most ruthless show I've ever seen in my life. 0.66

00:58:06.000 Yeah.

00:58:07.000 Brian Moses, who's the host of it, is one of the nicest guys ever.

00:58:09.000 And one of his things is everybody's got a hug at the end. 0.93

00:58:13.000 You talk shit about each other and then hug it out. 0.97

00:58:15.000 Well, most often I imagine those comedians are friends going into it, right? 0.99

00:58:18.000 Yes.

00:58:19.000 So did you see some at the end of it they weren't friends?

00:58:21.000 Yes.

00:58:21.000 Really?

00:58:22.000 100%.

00:58:22.000 Yeah, you see some of the lines that people would hit people with that hurt so bad.

00:58:27.000 And they would be talking about it like weeks later. 0.99

00:58:29.000 Can you believe that motherfucker said that about me, man? 1.00

00:58:31.000 Like... 0.99

00:58:32.000 But obviously you know going into this that's probably what's going to happen.

00:58:35.000 That is what's going to happen 100% of the time.

00:58:37.000 I've seen some of those, you know, the roast that Jeffrey Ross does.

00:58:41.000 What do you call it?

00:58:42.000 What roast?

00:58:43.000 What roast is that? 0.95

00:58:45.000 Yeah, like just roast.

00:58:46.000 The roast?

00:58:47.000 Yeah, like the roast of Rob Lowe or something like that.

00:58:49.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:58:49.000 I mean, that's like, I'm happy you guys have that format and you guys deserve to always have that to just say whatever the hell you want.

00:58:57.000 But some of it is like, I can't imagine those two people are going to be friends again after.

00:59:01.000 I'm not a roaster.

00:59:04.000 Why not?

00:59:05.000 It's not my style.

00:59:06.000 I'm not interested.

00:59:07.000 I don't like being mean like that.

00:59:09.000 I definitely want to be mean while someone's sitting right there.

00:59:12.000 It's just like, if I don't like someone, I don't want to be around them. 0.98

00:59:14.000 And if I like them, I don't want to say mean shit to them. 0.96

00:59:18.000 And if you don't say mean, it's not going to be as funny. 0.97

00:59:21.000 The people that are willing to go hard in the paint, they're the best at it.

00:59:26.000 Tony Hinchcliffe's probably the best at it ever.

00:59:28.000 He's the most vicious.

00:59:30.000 Yeah, but I guess also if you allow yourself to be roasted, I mean, I don't care how invincible you think you are, nobody's bulletproof.

00:59:37.000 Some of that's got to hurt.

00:59:38.000 Oh, for sure.

00:59:39.000 Yeah, yeah, for sure.

00:59:41.000 But, you know, if you can take it, it could be a fun time.

00:59:47.000 Yeah, I know.

00:59:48.000 They're not calling me anyway, but no, I don't think I can take it.

00:59:51.000 It's not fun.

00:59:52.000 It's not for everybody.

00:59:53.000 But it's a style of comedy, you know?

00:59:55.000 It's like the dozens. 0.99

00:59:56.000 You're talking shit about people, you know? 0.99

00:59:59.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:59:59.000 I've seen, of course, some wild ones. 1.00

01:00:01.000 Sometimes you cringe and feel terrible.

01:00:03.000 Yeah.

01:00:04.000 Well, that is one of the things that brought me back to the Comedy Store.

01:00:06.000 When I went to the Comedy Store in 2014, the first time I saw that, I hadn't been in the Comedy Store in like seven years, and I saw that and I was like, wow.

01:00:13.000 It's really a joke-writing show.

01:00:17.000 Obviously, you're insulting each other, but it's all new stuff.

01:00:20.000 And one of the things that I told comics, I'm like, there's so many guys that are doing this, that are writing, and girls and whatever, that are writing these bits.

01:00:29.000 That they're doing such a good job crafting this material, but then when you watch the regular act, they're not taking any chances.

01:00:36.000 They're not writing any new things.

01:00:37.000 Right.

01:00:38.000 Because they've known that there's this deadline, this looming date of doom that's on two weeks from now.

01:00:46.000 Did the internet change that for acts, for music acts?

01:00:51.000 The internet, being filmed every night, changed their ability to do the same shtick every night and set up songs at the same stores.

01:00:57.000 I mean, they can still do it, but I would think there's some amount of self-conscious, I wouldn't say embarrassment, that...

01:01:04.000 Your fans who have been watching every show of this tour, they're watching you introduce this song with the same story.

01:01:09.000 It's an act.

01:01:11.000 Now you know.

01:01:12.000 I mean, you always kind of thought so, but now you know because you just watched this person set up the song the same way the last ten nights.

01:01:18.000 Because there's great storytellers who set up songs.

01:01:22.000 Bono would tell.

01:01:23.000 He would like to talk a lot.

01:01:24.000 And then what happens when suddenly the magic of I know for bands, a lot of people brought that back a little bit.

01:01:36.000 They curtailed that because it's just not a good look.

01:01:39.000 You've basically scripted your bits to set up songs.

01:01:44.000 But it's been fascinating to me Watching you guys do that, that I watch...

01:01:49.000 For me, it's the first time watching, but you've got friends on the side of the stage, and you're telling jokes you've told before, and they'll come up to you afterwards and say, you killed it tonight.

01:01:56.000 But you're telling a joke you know they've heard 20 times, but it's kind of like a singer, songwriter, or anybody in a band who had a great performance of that song tonight.

01:02:03.000 You know the song, but you killed it tonight.

01:02:05.000 It seems so interesting to me that you can do that with comedians.

01:02:07.000 You'll tell your friend, even though you knew those jokes, boy, you nailed it tonight.

01:02:11.000 And you, the person telling the jokes, is not self-conscious that my friends are over here having heard me tell this bit 20 times.

01:02:17.000 No, they know that we know.

01:02:19.000 So it's like they're fine with that.

01:02:22.000 If the audience had seen the bits, that would be a real problem.

01:02:26.000 But you're not self-conscious telling this joke for the 20th time with your friend over here.

01:02:29.000 No, not at all.

01:02:30.000 That's interesting to me.

01:02:31.000 No, because the comics will tell you, I like how you're setting that up this way.

01:02:34.000 I like how you cut that part out.

01:02:36.000 I like this new tag you added.

01:02:38.000 And that's part of the reason you probably do it, too.

01:02:40.000 Some feedback from other joke tellers.

01:02:42.000 For sure, for sure.

01:02:43.000 Yeah, it helps a lot when someone's there and they could say, you know, last night you said it this way, but tonight you said it that way, and that way's better.

01:02:50.000 Or it's also, there's a thing that happens with comedy where you really don't know what works until you do it in front of an audience.

01:02:58.000 Like, I would imagine you could write a song completely without any audience member, just you and the band members, and you guys could put it together and record it and not have any feedback from anybody else other than you guys, and then it would be an amazing song.

01:03:11.000 That's impossible.

01:03:12.000 Right.

01:03:13.000 There's no gratification to tell a joke and just, you know it's funny.

01:03:16.000 Yeah.

01:03:16.000 Well, not just that.

01:03:17.000 It won't be done.

01:03:19.000 Right.

01:03:19.000 It needs to be performed.

01:03:20.000 But you can write a song, like you just said.

01:03:22.000 Yeah.

01:03:23.000 And it is better to share it with somebody, because that is a lot of the motivation.

01:03:26.000 Yeah.

01:03:27.000 I don't write songs for me to just listen to my mixtape of my own music in my bedroom.

01:03:30.000 Of course.

01:03:31.000 Yeah.

01:03:31.000 So you do want...

01:03:32.000 It doesn't matter who you are.

01:03:33.000 Anybody tells you that they don't, they're not into that, there's lying.

01:03:36.000 People want...

01:03:36.000 Positive feedback.

01:03:37.000 Sure.

01:03:38.000 And that's part of the exchange is I wrote it, I created it, and now I want to see how people react to it.

01:03:43.000 Even Prince.

01:03:43.000 But I can record in the studio.

01:03:45.000 Yeah, of course, even Prince.

01:03:46.000 We can record it, and I can hear it come out of the speakers, and I can get a rush of how that's what we wanted to do, and that sounds good.

01:03:52.000 You don't get any rush unless you tell the joke.

01:03:54.000 No rush unless it's in front of an audience.

01:03:56.000 And you don't know.

01:03:57.000 There's many times where I wrote a bit and I've got it set up.

01:04:01.000 I've got like the beats.

01:04:03.000 I've got the concept.

01:04:04.000 I've got a point I'm trying to make.

01:04:06.000 But then I go on stage and parts that I didn't think are going to be funny at all are the funniest part.

01:04:11.000 I'm like, wow.

01:04:12.000 And then you realize, like, oh, they're seeing it for the first time in a different way.

01:04:17.000 They don't know what's coming next, so they're seeing it.

01:04:20.000 It's almost like you don't have the ability to see the joke.

01:04:24.000 You're constructing it blind.

01:04:26.000 You're putting it together, and you kind of know how it's going to go out, but you don't really know until you're performing in front of people, and then when they see it for the first time, they decide.

01:04:36.000 And then you have bits you thought were going to be the strongest part of the set and nobody getting it.

01:04:40.000 Absolutely.

01:04:41.000 And the thing you thought was just one joke to get to the next joke was actually...

01:04:44.000 But those stories are countless for people.

01:04:48.000 I would say almost every record I've done, my favorite song I thought was going to be the best that nobody noticed.

01:04:53.000 And then the songs are like, really?

01:04:55.000 That one?

01:04:55.000 That's the one that surprised me.

01:04:56.000 Because you don't know.

01:04:57.000 How could you know?

01:04:59.000 Yeah, you don't know what it's going to be like to hear that song for the first time when you have no idea what the lyrics are.

01:05:04.000 And you don't know what kind of...

01:05:05.000 The people who are listening don't know what kind of work you put into it.

01:05:07.000 They don't know if it was easy or hard.

01:05:09.000 Warren Zevon's Where Was London is apparently like that.

01:05:11.000 Oh, really?

01:05:12.000 Yeah, that was like an afterthought of the session, and it's his signature song.

01:05:17.000 That's crazy.

01:05:18.000 If I'm wrong, forgive me on that, but that's a story I've heard.

01:05:21.000 And there's other stories like that.

01:05:23.000 People have countless stories of the song that got over was the last one anybody really cared about.

01:05:28.000 Is there any one of yours like that, that you thought were going to be giant and they didn't pop?

01:05:32.000 I thought they were all going to be giant.

01:05:34.000 I'm still surprised they're not all giant.

01:05:38.000 I wouldn't say so.

01:05:39.000 I mean, I don't get too involved.

01:05:41.000 I never have gotten too involved with that, like going to record companies and telling them I think this should be a single.

01:05:47.000 I can tell you what my favorite song is, but that's what they do for jobs.

01:05:52.000 They have hopefully good experience in knowing how to do that.

01:05:56.000 I'm hopefully gonna like all of them.

01:05:58.000 So if somebody wants to promote one or the other, it's never mattered to me too much which one.

01:06:02.000 So what is the process when you bring an album to the record company and they hear it for the first time?

01:06:10.000 They're not involved at all until you slap it down on wax and you bring it to them, right?

01:06:15.000 For me, that's how it's all.

01:06:17.000 I've never had a record company with their hands in a record.

01:06:21.000 I've never been uncomfortable or been told to do one thing or the other.

01:06:25.000 And I've worked with lots of different people, different labels.

01:06:28.000 And you hear those stories of people who feel like the record company made them do this or that, or they went more commercial.

01:06:33.000 No one's ever been in my business making records like that, from a record label, no.

01:06:37.000 So when you bring it to them, it's a completed project?

01:06:42.000 Mostly.

01:06:42.000 I mean, usually you have an A&R person who hopefully you like who comes around the sessions and work together.

01:06:48.000 So they know what's going on.

01:06:49.000 And so they give you some feedback or they talk to you about it?

01:06:52.000 Yeah.

01:06:53.000 And from my experience, it's always if I disagreed with the feedback, that was fine.

01:06:56.000 Sometimes they have good ideas.

01:06:59.000 It's better off to see them as an asset in a team rather than anything else.

01:07:03.000 Otherwise, it's bad for everybody.

01:07:05.000 That's what authors say about editors, that you have to have some sort of a working relationship where you trust that person and appreciate them.

01:07:13.000 Yeah, and hopefully they can be really helpful to you.

01:07:15.000 And people in your student studio are not different than editors really in a way too.

01:07:19.000 That's what record producers maybe could do for you.

01:07:21.000 I use record producers.

01:07:22.000 I don't really need one because I know how to make records on my own, but it's somebody else, the different set of ears that can help you edit and be honest with you.

01:07:29.000 And so you bring the music to them, and then they will say, hey, Jacob, this is a single.

01:07:36.000 Yeah.

01:07:37.000 Well, I call them focus tracks now.

01:07:39.000 Focus tracks?

01:07:40.000 I mean, I'm not in the world of singles.

01:07:42.000 When does that shift?

01:07:43.000 I don't know.

01:07:44.000 It just happened recently, I think.

01:07:46.000 Focus tracks?

01:07:47.000 Yeah.

01:07:47.000 Well, because a single, you know, doesn't that bring up the picture of like a 45 and go on radio stations and like, I got some wax, I got to play this?

01:07:54.000 Yeah.

01:07:54.000 You know, and then videos and all that.

01:07:56.000 That's...

01:07:58.000 I think they just call them focus tracks now.

01:08:00.000 I like that term.

01:08:01.000 That's a cool term.

01:08:02.000 It's really passive aggressive and it's really not here nor there.

01:08:06.000 How's it passive aggressive?

01:08:08.000 Just like it's a single because you think you're making singles, but we don't really do singles anymore.

01:08:13.000 So we're not going to look at it that way.

01:08:15.000 We'll call it a focus track.

01:08:17.000 And then you wonder, well, who's focusing on what?

01:08:19.000 I don't understand.

01:08:20.000 I'm confused.

01:08:21.000 So how does it work now?

01:08:25.000 What's important?

01:08:26.000 Radio exists, but is it important?

01:08:31.000 Well, it's not the same.

01:08:32.000 Right.

01:08:33.000 Than what you and I grew up with.

01:08:34.000 And that's okay.

01:08:35.000 Is serious still?

01:08:37.000 I mean, is that valuable?

01:08:38.000 What's valuable?

01:08:39.000 Streaming?

01:08:40.000 Streaming.

01:08:41.000 Streaming.

01:08:41.000 And is it because...

01:08:43.000 Because you make so much money when they stream your songs.

01:08:45.000 You're lying.

01:08:46.000 Oh, yeah, man.

01:08:48.000 Well, you know, that talk about something happened.

01:08:50.000 Somebody's making a lot of money.

01:08:51.000 Yeah, I don't know how that happened.

01:08:53.000 Somehow they figured that out. 1.00

01:08:54.000 These motherfuckers are clever. 1.00

01:08:56.000 You know, and some of the people who, like, I mean, put anybody in this chair does what I do. 1.00

01:09:00.000 Like, they can probably explain to you, like, how it happened, but we don't know when it happened and how it stuck.

01:09:05.000 That, like, we're just going to take your music and, you know, you're going to make zero, zero, like, 0.5 cents per 50 streams.

01:09:12.000 I mean, like...

01:09:13.000 That's really affected a lot of people greatly.

01:09:15.000 It's got to.

01:09:16.000 But when you say, you ask, what does count?

01:09:19.000 What does matter?

01:09:20.000 Streaming.

01:09:20.000 But in that world...

01:09:22.000 But it doesn't count in the same sense that record sales counted 20 years ago.

01:09:28.000 I don't think so.

01:09:29.000 I mean, honestly, like...

01:09:32.000 20 years is wrong, too, right?

01:09:33.000 It's more like 25, right?

01:09:34.000 Since what?

01:09:35.000 Since people were selling loads of records?

01:09:38.000 Napster.

01:09:38.000 Like, that was the...

01:09:39.000 Like, 2000?

01:09:40.000 Yeah.

01:09:41.000 Yeah.

01:09:41.000 No, that changed everything.

01:09:42.000 Record company had a chance to really not screw that up.

01:09:45.000 You know, those guys at Napster, they wanted to, like, party together.

01:09:48.000 They wanted to, like, do business together.

01:09:50.000 Record business said no.

01:09:51.000 And don't ask me how the film business, you know, figured that out and protected themselves better, but...

01:09:56.000 I remember being around and hearing those conversations about the Napster stuff, and record business put the finger to them.

01:10:03.000 I mean, nobody could see what was coming, except the Napster people. 0.58

01:10:06.000 It was just gonna all dissipate, and the record business never recovered.

01:10:09.000 I remember finding out about it that you could just download almost any album You just hit that button.

01:10:17.000 Hopefully you don't get interrupted for the next three days and you got that right. 0.98

01:10:19.000 Yeah, I was like, this is the craziest shit I've ever seen in my life. 0.98

01:10:22.000 And I had them all on one of them old wheel-style iPods. 0.96

01:10:25.000 Yeah, remember like your friend would like, you know, hey, you want to download my hard drive?

01:10:30.000 Yes!

01:10:30.000 And you'd borrow it and like...

01:10:31.000 Yeah, I saw that.

01:10:32.000 I mean, I wasn't that defiant about it.

01:10:35.000 I wasn't going to, you know...

01:10:36.000 I just thought...

01:10:37.000 I wasn't maybe the size of an artist that could really object or, you know...

01:10:42.000 I saw it happening and if...

01:10:43.000 If Metallica can't shut it down, I don't think I'm going to be able to shut it down.

01:10:46.000 Right.

01:10:47.000 You know what I mean?

01:10:48.000 And in trying to shut it down, they really developed...

01:10:51.000 It's a very bad taste they put in everybody's mouth.

01:10:53.000 Yeah, they recovered, but I don't think they were totally wrong, to be honest.

01:10:56.000 They weren't wrong, but I think Lars, the tone that he had about it was incorrect.

01:11:02.000 Well, they seem to be drawing a line between the artists and the fans, and that's what was upsetting to people.

01:11:06.000 And everybody was really just...

01:11:08.000 No one had any idea.

01:11:10.000 And Metallica, I think, themselves have...

01:11:12.000 I don't know how they word it, but they're not proud of that moment.

01:11:15.000 But they weren't wrong for trying to stop the avalanche.

01:11:18.000 They saw where it was coming.

01:11:21.000 And to some degree, they couldn't stop it.

01:11:24.000 And then you have loads of artists who can't work.

01:11:26.000 I'm sorry.

01:11:27.000 People like to say they don't want to hear about art and commerce being connected.

01:11:31.000 But young bands don't make a living.

01:11:33.000 They've got to go get jobs.

01:11:34.000 They can't play for you.

01:11:35.000 Yeah.

01:11:37.000 For a lot of acts, you know, selling CDs out of your car or whatever, that was enough to make a nice little living for themselves.

01:11:44.000 And with that gone, those people have regular jobs now.

01:11:46.000 Do you think it's possible for someone to develop a YouTube-style streaming service where the artist can upload directly to it and then they can profit off of it and they can maybe split the profits?

01:11:58.000 You know, the way YouTube does it with content creators, like say if you decide to be a content creator and you want to make some videos, you're splitting the revenue with YouTube, but you can make a tremendous amount of money.

01:12:07.000 That doesn't exist with streaming, right?

01:12:09.000 It's not the same kind of situation.

01:12:11.000 I think, you know, again, I'm not an expert in this, but you're talking about such a small little file.

01:12:15.000 Like, yeah, in concept, what you're saying makes sense, but how are they not just going to steal that and it'll be up somewhere else for free within five minutes?

01:12:22.000 But doesn't YouTube have a music service?

01:12:24.000 They have YouTube music.

01:12:26.000 Do they do that with YouTube music?

01:12:28.000 Do they share revenue with the artists?

01:12:30.000 The way they do it with video?

01:12:31.000 What they do with video is...

01:12:33.000 But is that exclusive? 1.00

01:12:35.000 A lot of people give YouTube shit about their censorship, and they deserve that shit. 0.99

01:12:41.000 But they also deserve accolades for the way they've allowed content creators to make money. 1.00

01:12:46.000 They've kind of said, look, we'll work with you.

01:12:48.000 We have this crazy platform, the biggest video platform in the world.

01:12:51.000 You can upload your videos, and you can make a considerable amount of money off of this YouTube platform.

01:12:57.000 It's pretty nice that they do that.

01:12:58.000 If they could have something similar with music, and then people just adopt it, because I know a lot of people, they're using, there's a YouTube music app now.

01:13:07.000 You know, they can have that sort of same sort of similar situation.

01:13:11.000 Artists can become very popular inside of that world.

01:13:15.000 But is that exclusive?

01:13:16.000 Would that be exclusive with that artist?

01:13:18.000 The only way it could be is if you would have a copyright on that.

01:13:21.000 Like if you have a copyright on a video, like say if you upload a video on YouTube and then someone else puts it on their channel, you could have that struck.

01:13:29.000 You have a copyright strike, you can take it down.

01:13:31.000 I think at the end, you know, you're talking about...

01:13:34.000 Asking a younger people today specifically to go pay for stuff maybe getting for free for a long time I don't think but that's not what it is You don't ask them to pay the revenue comes from advertising So you you you ask people to pay for the service the same way they pay for Spotify the same way they pay for Apple music It's not an exorbitant amount of money.

01:13:52.000 It's a small amount of money per month, but in that you get an unlimited amount of music or I'm for any experiment.

01:13:58.000 I think that's a good experiment.

01:13:59.000 Because it's free-falling right now.

01:14:02.000 And I'm okay.

01:14:04.000 If I was coming up today, I don't know how you'd get started. 0.99

01:14:07.000 Well, I have friends that are artists that are musicians today, and it's a fucking grind. 0.96

01:14:11.000 Like, really talented ones that are barely getting by. 0.98

01:14:14.000 And it drives me crazy.

01:14:16.000 And I don't understand it.

01:14:17.000 And we're all missing out.

01:14:18.000 Yeah, we are.

01:14:18.000 We're missing out on great talent.

01:14:20.000 Yes, we're missing out on their work.

01:14:21.000 Yeah, because they...

01:14:22.000 First of all, record labels don't...

01:14:24.000 I came up with the days where the record label wasn't expecting your first record to do anything.

01:14:30.000 Maybe the second one would, but it's the third one they really want.

01:14:33.000 They're building you.

01:14:34.000 Yes.

01:14:35.000 And that might take seven years.

01:14:36.000 Right.

01:14:37.000 But that's unheard of now.

01:14:40.000 So again, we miss out just because a lot of those people that need that time to develop, need the support, need the funding, they've got to have jobs and they can't devote all their time to doing it for us.

01:14:50.000 So we're the ones who miss out on the end.

01:14:52.000 There's always been that situation, too, where you have these really hungry, talented artists and they get taken advantage of by whether it's executives or whoever is the money people that figure out how to lock these people into some long-term contract where the lion's share of all their work and creativity is going to be enjoyed by the company and not by the artists themselves.

01:15:13.000 You always have these crazy...

01:15:15.000 That part of the models, I mean, hopefully there's enough pie to go around everybody.

01:15:19.000 It's kind of okay with that.

01:15:20.000 I mean, there's a certain number you get to where you probably don't care anymore how much they're making because you're making so much also, you know.

01:15:26.000 But...

01:15:29.000 But that model, that's not a mystery, especially if you're coming up the times when I came up.

01:15:35.000 We already knew all that.

01:15:36.000 If you got locked into a bad record contract or somebody screwed you over, it's kind of on you a little bit.

01:15:41.000 It's not the 50s or the 60s where we stepped into things and didn't know.

01:15:46.000 And it has nothing to do with my background.

01:15:48.000 I never got screwed over, though.

01:15:50.000 The worst people I've ever met in this business were in the bands.

01:15:52.000 They were not the labels because you know who they are.

01:15:55.000 You know what they're doing.

01:15:56.000 They don't really change.

01:15:57.000 You won't be fooled.

01:15:59.000 It's the people that you have camaraderie with that you think are in the trenches with you that you find out.

01:16:03.000 Those are the people that let you down more, that you get hoodwinked by.

01:16:06.000 The business people, there's no secret what they're doing.

01:16:09.000 Have you been hoodwinked by other artists?

01:16:11.000 Well, everybody has.

01:16:12.000 Really? 0.97

01:16:12.000 Yeah, I just, I'm not making a point about artists are shitty. 0.97

01:16:15.000 I'm just saying the big bad record business, like, not for me, not my days.

01:16:19.000 I've worked with some great people.

01:16:20.000 You know, some really supportive, positive people who've been a great part of my career.

01:16:27.000 You know, I actually can't, I can only name, like, I can name out of 30 years, maybe like one or two people I came across who I hope I never see again in that end of the business.

01:16:35.000 Otherwise, like, that's a pretty good ratio.

01:16:36.000 That is a very good ratio.

01:16:38.000 So, essentially, there's always going to be people that take advantage of people that don't really understand or are too eager and accept a bad contract.

01:16:47.000 Yeah, but there's no excuses for not reading that.

01:16:49.000 We're just too far along.

01:16:51.000 It shouldn't be that easy to fool someone today.

01:16:53.000 I've been offered a lot of bad contracts, but I didn't sign them either.

01:16:57.000 It's that same kind of situation.

01:16:59.000 And I've been in situations where I've looked at a contract, and that's the nature of most business deals is someone's going to do better than somebody else.

01:17:04.000 So when you look at that and you realize it looks like you're, no matter what, going to do better.

01:17:08.000 This isn't a good situation.

01:17:09.000 I don't take that as a personal attacker.

01:17:12.000 Okay, well, this isn't good for me.

01:17:13.000 I'll go find somewhere else to do this.

01:17:15.000 They're just establishing shitty rules for the game for you.

01:17:19.000 But there's no connection.

01:17:19.000 Yeah.

01:17:19.000 But they're in business.

01:17:21.000 Right.

01:17:22.000 It's like, again, Prince, what did he say?

01:17:25.000 They owned his name, right?

01:17:27.000 I think it was something, I'm going to get the quote wrong, but somewhere around the time where he changed his, just the symbol.

01:17:34.000 Somebody said something to him about the record business.

01:17:36.000 He said, no, I'm not in the record business.

01:17:38.000 You're in the record business.

01:17:39.000 I make music.

01:17:40.000 And that's kind of it.

01:17:42.000 It's true.

01:17:43.000 But there's no similarities to them.

01:17:46.000 There's no reason that you're a great talent that you should also have a great understanding of the business side of things.

01:17:51.000 You're not really interconnected for most people.

01:17:53.000 But we are far enough along now where hopefully you have somebody with you and things are more transparent that you shouldn't get locked into these horrible deals anymore.

01:18:00.000 Do you remember when Courtney Love wrote that piece where she was explaining the music, I think it was in Spin Magazine, where she was explaining the music business in terms of where the money goes and how they fuck over artists?

01:18:14.000 Do you remember that?

01:18:15.000 I don't remember that, but then don't get in the music business.

01:18:18.000 That's not new.

01:18:19.000 I mean, is that a revelation?

01:18:21.000 Did you read that?

01:18:22.000 You're like, wow.

01:18:23.000 It was shocking to me because I'm not in the music business.

01:18:26.000 So to me, I was like, wow, so that's how they do it?

01:18:28.000 Yeah.

01:18:28.000 I was confused when it went into how much- You know, if you're a band, bands don't do this anymore.

01:18:33.000 If your band sells two million records, everybody in that band's probably making a lot of money buying houses, right?

01:18:38.000 Mm-hmm.

01:18:38.000 And that CD cost $18.

01:18:40.000 You're making your money, you're pretty happy.

01:18:42.000 It's only down the road where someone says, okay, you guys, you did buy a house.

01:18:45.000 Did you see how much that they made?

01:18:47.000 And you are shocked for a second to realize you take that CD and divide it up between yourselves, your band, and with the record.

01:18:53.000 Yeah, they make a lot more than you.

01:18:55.000 That's why they're in the record business.

01:18:57.000 And some of them are too smart to be in the bands.

01:19:01.000 Or not smart enough.

01:19:02.000 Well, it depends on what you can handle.

01:19:04.000 I couldn't handle that kind of lifestyle myself.

01:19:08.000 I invent things out of nothing.

01:19:11.000 My whole livelihood is reactionary to other people creating something that I can now work with.

01:19:17.000 I want to make it from scratch.

01:19:19.000 Yeah, that's a weird situation to be in, relying upon other people's creativity for you to make a living.

01:19:25.000 Yeah, but you can do that when you don't have a creative bone in your body.

01:19:31.000 Some people are really good at numbers and math.

01:19:32.000 Some people are really creative.

01:19:34.000 And if you recognize early on, well, I would like to be...

01:19:36.000 I mean, that's a lot of the great people who work outside of bands once wanted to be in a band, but realized, like, I don't have it.

01:19:43.000 I love music, but I want to be a part of it anyway.

01:19:45.000 I want to help someone else do great things.

01:19:47.000 But I'm not the guy to be in the band or the girl.

01:19:50.000 If you have your own music and you own your music, what does a record label do for you in 2021?

01:20:00.000 Well, what do you mean?

01:20:01.000 If you own your own music?

01:20:03.000 If you create your own music, right?

01:20:05.000 Say you hire...

01:20:06.000 What could a record label do for you?

01:20:08.000 Well, they have money that you don't have to promote and spend and put you on tour.

01:20:12.000 You know, young bands need...

01:20:13.000 They can't...

01:20:14.000 Van or no van.

01:20:16.000 It costs money to tour.

01:20:17.000 A lot.

01:20:19.000 So they basically loan you the money.

01:20:22.000 Yeah.

01:20:23.000 That's how they can be good for a young band, really.

01:20:25.000 Or any band.

01:20:27.000 You don't have the tools, the assets to get your music in lots of places.

01:20:30.000 I mean, there's more opportunities with social media, of course.

01:20:35.000 The good news is anybody can do it now, and the bad news is anybody can do it now.

01:20:38.000 It just means it's crowded, and it's hard to know what anybody's up to.

01:20:42.000 But record labels, they have a great purpose, of course.

01:20:47.000 Some people say they're banks.

01:20:49.000 They're just funding your trip, and you have a big bill at the end.

01:20:53.000 And they have a connection to streaming services.

01:20:55.000 Yeah, they have all those contacts that you wouldn't have on your own.

01:20:59.000 Now, when a person is like, say if you're a new band, and you get signed by a record company, how does someone find out about you?

01:21:07.000 I mean, what is the primary way they find out about you?

01:21:10.000 If it's not the radio, which it always used to be, do they find out about you through streaming services?

01:21:15.000 Like, are there channels that are sponsored that people get excited about because they know that this channel is where new interesting music gets broken?

01:21:23.000 We're both gonna do some homework after this, and if I find out, I'll let you know.

01:21:27.000 I mean, really, that's the question.

01:21:29.000 I don't know.

01:21:30.000 I mean, because it's just jammed up everywhere.

01:21:33.000 So a lot of great things about the way things work now.

01:21:36.000 The models that we had before were really effective, too, and at least you could put yourself on a path that if you did X, Y, and Z, maybe your band would get a shot.

01:21:44.000 Play your clubs, get your demo tape together, maybe a rec company wants to work with you, and they're gonna give you some money to practice.

01:21:50.000 You know, you make that record, you make a video, and they give you some money to go on tour.

01:21:53.000 Like, this was a path to maybe being a band that was successful.

01:21:56.000 So you take that away, you know, it is just every man and woman for themselves just, you know, trying to find a way to quote-unquote kind of get lucky.

01:22:05.000 If you're an established act, you got opportunities.

01:22:08.000 If you're doing it the other way, it's really everybody who's trying to get lucky.

01:22:13.000 And when someone sees what that person did, by the time you figure it out, it's too late.

01:22:16.000 It's got to do something else.

01:22:18.000 That's what it is.

01:22:19.000 I mean, as far as I know.

01:22:21.000 But I'm also not brand new.

01:22:24.000 If I was 21 years old, I'd probably understand this better than I do.

01:22:28.000 The way I came up was just a different...

01:22:31.000 It was just a different model.

01:22:33.000 And that's okay that a lot of that's gone.

01:22:34.000 I mean, it's changed so drastically.

01:22:37.000 I mean, you remember in the late, like, 90s, you know what the Diamond Award was?

01:22:40.000 No.

01:22:41.000 That's when they had to invent it.

01:22:42.000 It was, you know, gold record, platinum record.

01:22:44.000 It wasn't enough.

01:22:45.000 People were going, like, 12 times platinum.

01:22:47.000 So they invented the Diamond Award, which was 10 million.

01:22:50.000 Whoa.

01:22:50.000 The Diamond Award, yeah.

01:22:51.000 That's how much money was going around in those days before the internet, really.

01:22:57.000 How many people buy CDs today?

01:22:59.000 Do they still sell?

01:23:02.000 I don't know where you buy one.

01:23:03.000 Online, I guess?

01:23:04.000 I guess.

01:23:05.000 Amazon?

01:23:06.000 Yeah, I mean, I guess where are you going to play it?

01:23:10.000 I mean, let's find- Laptops don't even have hard drives.

01:23:12.000 I think vinyl sells more than CDs right now, but I'm going to get a breakdown real quick.

01:23:15.000 That's interesting.

01:23:16.000 Oh, for sure.

01:23:17.000 No, no, it actually flopped.

01:23:19.000 It was for a while like a bonus if your company wanted to spend some money to make vinyl with you.

01:23:23.000 Now it's kind of like, you can throw in CDs, but the production of that is like, you know, it's the cardboard you put around it.

01:23:29.000 It's cool now to have vinyl.

01:23:32.000 CDs, they don't seem cool.

01:23:34.000 But why would you have CDs?

01:23:35.000 I mean, streaming is one thing.

01:23:37.000 I mean, CDs are...

01:23:38.000 Uh-oh.

01:23:40.000 Wow.

01:23:41.000 Streaming's 83% of music industry venue.

01:23:44.000 Wow.

01:23:45.000 Sync.

01:23:46.000 What is sync?

01:23:47.000 That's getting your songs in TV and commercials and you get licenses.

01:23:51.000 That's 2%.

01:23:52.000 Physical.

01:23:54.000 9% is physical.

01:23:56.000 So that's live performances?

01:23:57.000 No, physical is a combination of CDs and LPs.

01:24:00.000 Oh, physical things.

01:24:01.000 Oh, I get it.

01:24:02.000 And then digital downloads are 6%.

01:24:04.000 So physical copies are just 9%.

01:24:07.000 So it's taking up the bulk of that pie right there.

01:24:11.000 Streaming.

01:24:12.000 Streaming takes up the bulk of the pie.

01:24:13.000 So, yeah.

01:24:14.000 Oh, interesting.

01:24:15.000 So CDs, and it's kind of in 2020. What is happening in 2020, it says what?

01:24:22.000 It's more vinyl than it is CD. What are we looking at?

01:24:27.000 The green and the blue, that's CD, vinyl.

01:24:29.000 The green is vinyl, which is the largest amount.

01:24:31.000 Vinyl's not like blowing up.

01:24:32.000 Anybody who tells you it's back, it's not buying Kiss records in those days.

01:24:37.000 Right.

01:24:37.000 It's a boutique-y kind of thing, and it's cool.

01:24:40.000 And what's cool, it costs a lot.

01:24:45.000 Some people buy it from Urban Outfitters and just put the thing on the wall, like decorations.

01:24:50.000 I guess you could do that.

01:24:51.000 But vinyl's like $28.

01:24:53.000 Do you enjoy the sound of vinyl better?

01:24:55.000 It's absolutely better.

01:24:57.000 But at the end of the day, I don't really care.

01:24:58.000 Really?

01:25:01.000 That question, like, what's your, is it vinyl, mp3s, or, you know, CDs?

01:25:05.000 Well, no, yeah, vinyl sounds the best.

01:25:07.000 But I don't have a vinyl player in my car.

01:25:09.000 I can't take it hiking, so, like, I'll listen to an mp3.

01:25:11.000 Like, yeah, I just want to hear the song at the end of the day.

01:25:13.000 I'm caught up in that.

01:25:14.000 I bought this digital machine thing that attaches to your iPod. 0.98

01:25:21.000 I never fucking used it. 0.97

01:25:22.000 Digital machine thing. 0.97

01:25:23.000 Yeah, I don't know the name of it.

01:25:25.000 I'm trying to describe it.

01:25:26.000 I guess not.

01:25:27.000 I'm sorry.

01:25:28.000 But it attached.

01:25:30.000 It was like a brick that attached.

01:25:32.000 It was as large, if not larger, than my iPod.

01:25:36.000 And it attached to the iPod.

01:25:38.000 And what it did was it changed the sound and tried to make it more true to what the actual vinyl recording was like.

01:25:46.000 What year is this?

01:25:47.000 Is it recently or this is like 20 years ago?

01:25:48.000 No, at least 15 years ago. 1.00

01:25:50.000 And I remember holding this stupid fucking thing in my hand and going, why did I buy this? 1.00

01:25:53.000 And you're listening to it on what? 1.00

01:25:55.000 Listening to it with a nice set of earbuds?

01:25:58.000 No, I had it over the ears.

01:25:59.000 Well, it does, yeah.

01:26:00.000 It's just, you know, look, you ever go online, you want him to go crazy, you ever go look at like, you know, turntables that cost $20,000.

01:26:06.000 Really?

01:26:07.000 Yeah, and the speakers and the cables, I mean, that's...

01:26:10.000 You know, different kinds of gram for your vinyl.

01:26:13.000 What are you going to use?

01:26:14.000 But, you know, then you ask yourself, whatever you were listening to with that gadget, like the record you were listening to, was it even made analog?

01:26:19.000 Was it made on digital equipment to begin with?

01:26:21.000 Right.

01:26:21.000 Because a lot of people do...

01:26:22.000 I mean, what's...

01:26:23.000 People are...

01:26:24.000 They make digital records on Pro Tools and then they put them on vinyl.

01:26:26.000 Like, it's...

01:26:27.000 Isn't that a little peculiar?

01:26:29.000 Yeah.

01:26:30.000 What is that?

01:26:31.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:26:32.000 Holy shit, a $50,000 turn. 1.00

01:26:33.000 That's fucking dope as shit. 1.00

01:26:35.000 Isn't it? 1.00

01:26:35.000 Oh, you get lost looking at these things. 1.00

01:26:38.000 God, that's so pretty.

01:26:39.000 You could buy that for $50,000.

01:26:42.000 What a bargain.

01:26:43.000 But then you have to have your room tuned.

01:26:45.000 You have to have somebody set the acoustics in your room, put baffles.

01:26:48.000 I mean, you'll never be done.

01:26:49.000 Well, Henry Rollins, who's a gigantic record collector, showed us his setup and he has these enormous towers in his living room that are like six feet tall and they're a quarter million dollars plus of just- Where those are speakers?

01:27:04.000 Just the speakers, yeah.

01:27:06.000 Oh, it's awesome if you got the bread and you got the room because it takes up a lot of space.

01:27:10.000 I mean, you can't have your cables on the floor.

01:27:12.000 Yeah, that's what he's got.

01:27:14.000 That's his setup.

01:27:15.000 Oh, he's got ATM machines.

01:27:17.000 It looks like a robot.

01:27:19.000 Oh, well, you see, he's good.

01:27:20.000 Yeah, well, that's pretty awesome. 0.89

01:27:22.000 Yeah, well, he's a freak.

01:27:24.000 He's got a lot of CDs over there, too, though.

01:27:26.000 Is that him?

01:27:27.000 That's his setup.

01:27:30.000 That's awesome.

01:27:31.000 But he just loves the sound.

01:27:32.000 But it's all in.

01:27:33.000 You have to go all in.

01:27:34.000 See those cables?

01:27:35.000 I mean, the speakers are off.

01:27:38.000 You don't just take your desk and throw a turntable on it.

01:27:42.000 You have to do all this.

01:27:43.000 Those speakers are out of control.

01:27:44.000 I can't even imagine what's going on with those.

01:27:46.000 I think those are, like I said, I think they're a quarter million dollars, right?

01:27:50.000 Isn't that something?

01:27:50.000 Something like that, yeah.

01:27:51.000 Look at that fucking thing. 0.99

01:27:53.000 Hold on, scroll down, what does it say? 1.00

01:27:54.000 200k.

01:27:55.000 200 grand, yeah.

01:27:57.000 Oh, really? 1.00

01:27:57.000 Wild shit, man. 1.00

01:27:58.000 Look at that. 1.00

01:27:59.000 It looks like exercise equipment.

01:28:01.000 Yeah, you gotta be really into sitting there and listen to that stuff.

01:28:05.000 And look at what's on the front of the amps there.

01:28:07.000 Yeah, what are those things?

01:28:08.000 I think you have to turn them on, you do like the superhero three finger.

01:28:13.000 That's pretty wild.

01:28:14.000 Yeah, well he doesn't do music anymore, he just listens to it.

01:28:18.000 Most of what he does when he performs, he does spoken word tours.

01:28:22.000 He's sort of shifted into his own version of stand-up comedy.

01:28:25.000 It's very humorous stuff and interesting takes on things, but he's not imprisoned by that format where he has to get...

01:28:33.000 If you're doing stand-up, people want it to be funny, funny, funny, funny.

01:28:36.000 They want to leave laughs.

01:28:37.000 Yeah, he does spoken word stuff.

01:28:38.000 He's got memoirs.

01:28:39.000 He's very smart.

01:28:40.000 It's really good, though.

01:28:40.000 Yeah, he's very smart.

01:28:41.000 Very interesting stuff.

01:28:42.000 I've always liked his stuff.

01:28:43.000 I like him as a person.

01:28:45.000 He's a fascinating cat.

01:28:46.000 The way he's managed his life.

01:28:48.000 He has no relationships.

01:28:50.000 He's like, it's too hard.

01:28:52.000 It's too much work.

01:28:53.000 That's funny.

01:28:54.000 It is funny. 0.90

01:28:55.000 But when you talk to him and you realize how nuts he is in a good way.

01:29:01.000 I don't know when last time he did do an actual music.

01:29:03.000 I don't think he could put his body through that.

01:29:05.000 That's a young man's game when he was doing it.

01:29:07.000 Oh yeah, like that song, Liar.

01:29:09.000 Yeah, when he would get red in the neck.

01:29:11.000 That was also back in his powerlifting days, too. 0.98

01:29:13.000 We had this fucking neck that started at the top of his head and came straight down to his shoulders. 0.99

01:29:18.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:29:19.000 But that's a very physically...

01:29:22.000 It's hard to age, we'll say, when so much of your show is physical.

01:29:26.000 I mean, Iggy Pop does that. 0.91

01:29:27.000 He still gets around, but...

01:29:28.000 Well, my friend John Joseph from the Cro-Mags, John's gotta be 60 years old, or close to it, and he still performs.

01:29:38.000 He wraps up his ankles and warms up like he's about to get into a fight.

01:29:42.000 Yeah, it is.

01:29:43.000 But he also does Ironmans.

01:29:45.000 He's constantly training for Ironmans, and he's very strict with his diet.

01:29:49.000 Look, there's guys my age who are getting their knees replaced and hips replaced.

01:29:52.000 They jump around a lot on stage.

01:29:54.000 25 years later, it's like any athlete that's wear and tear.

01:29:57.000 Yeah.

01:29:59.000 Maynard blew his hip out that way.

01:30:01.000 He's got a fake hip.

01:30:03.000 Well, I mean, just the simple jumping off the riser.

01:30:05.000 Oh, yeah.

01:30:06.000 20 times a night. 1.00

01:30:07.000 Oh, fuck yeah. 1.00

01:30:09.000 Yeah, so you have to find a way to, if you want to keep doing it. 1.00

01:30:13.000 Some people just age out.

01:30:14.000 They don't want to do it anymore.

01:30:15.000 Right.

01:30:15.000 And that's okay, too.

01:30:16.000 You can change your mind to go do something else.

01:30:18.000 No one says you had to be in a band on stage your whole life.

01:30:20.000 There's no contract you ever made that I'm aware of.

01:30:22.000 That said so.

01:30:23.000 You can do something else.

01:30:24.000 But if you want to keep going, you have to adapt.

01:30:28.000 But I think for many people, and it's the same in the world of comedy too, the thrill of performing, it just makes everything else seem so boring.

01:30:38.000 Any other kind of job that you would have, even if it's satisfying and you enjoy it.

01:30:43.000 There's many times where I've come off stage with my friends where we're like, can you imagine if you could never kill?

01:30:48.000 There's people out there in this world who've never gone on stage and killed.

01:30:52.000 They don't even know what this is like.

01:30:53.000 They don't get it.

01:30:54.000 They're missing Yeah.

01:30:57.000 Well, that's right.

01:30:58.000 And you deserve that.

01:30:59.000 I mean, the people who don't allow themselves to figure out what that is are obviously missing out.

01:31:03.000 But the world won't work if everybody figures that out.

01:31:06.000 There's going to be a lot of things that don't get done.

01:31:08.000 That's true.

01:31:09.000 That's true.

01:31:09.000 But the point is, once you've already experienced that, for many of these people, you've been a rock star.

01:31:14.000 It's got to be really hard to not be a rock star anymore.

01:31:18.000 Well, you just don't want your life to be just about getting it done and just having a...

01:31:22.000 I mean, that's like, what kind of life is that?

01:31:23.000 And live for the summers or when you can get a few weeks to go skiing or something.

01:31:27.000 I think most people wouldn't like that.

01:31:30.000 And most people don't have the opportunity to not have those kinds of jobs and go to a high-rise.

01:31:35.000 But like, you know, I won't say the lucky people, but if you do what you do, yeah, it's impossible to imagine that kind of life.

01:31:43.000 Yeah, I just imagine a guy like Mick Jagger that is pushing 80 years old, who is still, like, we played a video the other day of him doing his, like, dance routine, like, at a dance studio, going over his stuff and dancing, and still got the moves!

01:31:58.000 I mean, can you imagine?

01:31:59.000 And what you thought, like, go ahead and picture yourself at 25 years old and someone says, you know, gonna come go see a show.

01:32:05.000 It's this guy, he's 80. I mean, even like the Vegas crowd was done by 80. You know what I mean?

01:32:12.000 Like the Rat Pack, they weren't doing that kind of stuff at 80. Well, they were always drunk.

01:32:16.000 But it's a different, yeah, but at 80 is not what it was.

01:32:18.000 No.

01:32:18.000 I mean, 80 is like, I don't know, what's 80?

01:32:20.000 Maybe 80 is the new 65?

01:32:23.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:32:25.000 But even then, at 65, who the fuck is dancing like Mick Jagger is? 0.99

01:32:29.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:32:30.000 That's what's crazy.

01:32:30.000 Well, that's one of the few.

01:32:32.000 They can pull it off because he's still fit and he loves doing it, obviously.

01:32:35.000 But that's a big part of the show.

01:32:37.000 Nobody really wants to go see the Rolling Stones sitting in chairs.

01:32:41.000 I would still go, but it's not the show that the reputation is.

01:32:46.000 And it's amazing that...

01:32:49.000 It's pretty astonishing to do that.

01:32:50.000 It's hugely astonishing.

01:32:52.000 I mean, he is the canary in the coal mine.

01:32:54.000 But if he couldn't, they'd be done.

01:32:56.000 Because it's a touring band now.

01:32:57.000 Yes.

01:32:57.000 It's not a record-making band, really.

01:32:59.000 That's the thing, right?

01:33:00.000 And I wanted to get into that.

01:33:02.000 With a lot of bands, especially classic bands like The Stones, people don't necessarily want to hear their new stuff.

01:33:09.000 They really want to hear this entire catalog of amazing songs that goes back decades.

01:33:15.000 So what is that like when a band stops making new music and they just sing the old music?

01:33:22.000 That's got to be a very different feeling as an artist because isn't part of being an artist creating and isn't that part of the thrill of being an artist?

01:33:30.000 You can't name anybody that's not true of.

01:33:32.000 It doesn't matter.

01:33:33.000 Even the Rolling Stones.

01:33:35.000 They want to hear your hits.

01:33:36.000 And even they are disappointed that there's not a lot of enthusiasm for a new record.

01:33:41.000 Nobody is free of that.

01:33:43.000 You cannot name anybody who's been around for any amount of time.

01:33:46.000 The 30 or 40 years into their career, people are as amped up as the quote-unquote glory days.

01:33:51.000 That's just part of the arc.

01:33:52.000 And hopefully your ego accepts that so that you can be a performer and put stock in that you have a catalog that people like, even if you're disappointed that it's from 20, 30 years ago.

01:34:02.000 But there's an alternative.

01:34:04.000 There's nobody who's been hot for like 40 years.

01:34:07.000 Well, they had an album that came out.

01:34:10.000 I guess the last one that people wanted to hear their new stuff was in the 80s.

01:34:15.000 It's Tattoo You. 0.51

01:34:16.000 It's 1981. But I think after that...

01:34:18.000 I like Voodoo Lounge.

01:34:20.000 There's been records, but you want to talk about going into the stadium, that's tattooed.

01:34:24.000 It's a long time.

01:34:25.000 But what was in the 80s?

01:34:26.000 What did they have in the late 80s?

01:34:27.000 Steel Wheels.

01:34:29.000 Steel Wheels.

01:34:31.000 Even the Stones, that's how it works.

01:34:36.000 Has anybody dodged that?

01:34:40.000 I couldn't tell you.

01:34:42.000 It's the nature of it.

01:34:43.000 If you're lucky, you burn hard and fast.

01:34:45.000 That's your ride.

01:34:47.000 And then maybe you can have a career because of it.

01:34:50.000 And that's that intoxication that a lot of people just can't get out of their mouth is just being the center of attention and the prom king.

01:34:59.000 You can't for your whole life.

01:35:00.000 You get one graduating class, this is your turn, and you're going to make room for somebody else and move on down and have a good career.

01:35:05.000 But you can't sustain that.

01:35:07.000 I can't think of anybody who has it.

01:35:09.000 Yeah, I can't think of anybody who has seen that.

01:35:10.000 You might have your favorite artist that you think continue to do great things after people stop listening.

01:35:15.000 But in reality, as far as their popularity, it's a pretty predictable arc.

01:35:20.000 But it also seems that there's a point in time where they just stop producing new stuff.

01:35:25.000 Almost all of them.

01:35:26.000 It's hard making records.

01:35:28.000 Is that what it is?

01:35:29.000 Well, it can be.

01:35:30.000 And right now, a lot of them don't want to make records because what's the point?

01:35:34.000 Right.

01:35:34.000 There's no money in it anymore.

01:35:35.000 Well, yeah.

01:35:36.000 Stevie Nicks has said that.

01:35:37.000 And I get it.

01:35:37.000 She's like, it takes a lot.

01:35:39.000 I got to work really hard.

01:35:40.000 And it's expensive.

01:35:40.000 And nobody buys them.

01:35:41.000 Why would I go do one of those?

01:35:43.000 Hmm.

01:35:44.000 But that's a different era that she's maybe speaking from.

01:35:47.000 But I do get that feeling that nobody wants to feel like they're working really hard and turning themselves inside out.

01:35:52.000 And there's no opportunity for anybody to get this.

01:35:55.000 And the attention span is so little.

01:35:56.000 I don't think she's saying she doesn't want to do it again if she can't do rumors again.

01:36:00.000 I don't think that's what she's saying.

01:36:01.000 She's just saying, like, I put everything I got into this.

01:36:04.000 And I want it to be noticed.

01:36:06.000 And that's...

01:36:07.000 I want to go do a show and I want people to care about the new songs, but they don't buy records, and I get it.

01:36:13.000 So why did a lot of the more established, older acts just not do it so much anymore?

01:36:19.000 There's no bigger budget for them than it is for anybody else in the record business.

01:36:22.000 Because nobody's selling records, you know what I mean?

01:36:24.000 And Paul Simon, I love one of his most recent records, his wristband song.

01:36:27.000 I thought that was just fantastic.

01:36:29.000 When was that?

01:36:30.000 We looked that up a year.

01:36:31.000 It's maybe six, seven years ago or so.

01:36:35.000 But the point is, it was great.

01:36:38.000 If you like Paul Simon, this is Paul Simon.

01:36:40.000 It sounds great.

01:36:40.000 These songs, he's never going to let you down as a songwriter.

01:36:42.000 But did it react in the way that the earlier stuff did?

01:36:46.000 Like, no, of course it didn't.

01:36:47.000 It's not his fault.

01:36:47.000 It's just not the world we live in anymore.

01:36:49.000 Yeah, it's unavoidable.

01:36:51.000 And there's also a thing, there's a limitation in time, right? 0.99

01:36:55.000 If you go to see a band, go to see Bruce Springsteen, that guy's got so many fucking hits. 0.81

01:37:01.000 Even though he does like four-hour concerts, it's going to take four hours to get through half the hits. 0.96

01:37:09.000 Yeah, he makes records people still really care about, I think.

01:37:12.000 But he's got a very large audience, even if a small portion of them are coming to the table.

01:37:18.000 He's, I think, stayed relevant.

01:37:20.000 He's one of the rare ones, right?

01:37:21.000 He is.

01:37:22.000 I only thought of that because you mentioned him.

01:37:26.000 But that's not easy.

01:37:27.000 And part of his, you know, I think that what works for him is that he is willing to do whatever it takes to make a record regardless of who it's meant for or the popularity.

01:37:37.000 I mean, he's got one of the biggest rock records of all time.

01:37:39.000 I mean, you don't have to do that twice.

01:37:40.000 Right.

01:37:41.000 You know what I mean?

01:37:42.000 How many times can you reinvent rock and roll?

01:37:44.000 Yeah.

01:37:44.000 And is it your job to do that for everybody again?

01:37:46.000 Right.

01:37:47.000 You know, so...

01:37:47.000 But his shows are so dynamic and exciting.

01:37:51.000 And those songs, unlike most acts, when we're going to Bruce's shows, people do want to hear the new songs.

01:37:57.000 Interesting.

01:37:57.000 They really do.

01:37:59.000 So we found the exception.

01:38:01.000 Yeah, but how prevalent are the records?

01:38:03.000 I don't know.

01:38:03.000 I couldn't answer that.

01:38:04.000 But I do know he's very unique as a performer.

01:38:08.000 I mean, the difference, too, with him and other people is...

01:38:11.000 He writes songs in his career is really about a relationship with his audience.

01:38:15.000 He keeps them in mind, I think, when he writes these songs.

01:38:18.000 He doesn't want to let them down.

01:38:19.000 But it's this really nice line that he rides of pleasing himself, but also respecting the relationship he's built with these people for many years.

01:38:27.000 He's not one of the guys who says, or artists in general, who says, I'm doing what I'm doing and I don't care who does or doesn't like it.

01:38:33.000 I think he really respects his audience very much.

01:38:37.000 And he's found a way to make the records he really wants to make.

01:38:39.000 It's some kind of sleight of hand trick that he pulled.

01:38:43.000 Well, he's authentic, right?

01:38:45.000 That's the thing that's always come through about Bruce Springsteen.

01:38:48.000 He's very authentic.

01:38:50.000 Everything he does, the way he talks about things, it's very thoughtful.

01:38:54.000 You can tell he's being genuine.

01:38:56.000 He's really thinking about what he's saying.

01:38:58.000 Me too.

01:38:59.000 Yeah, you too, man.

01:39:03.000 As long as you're buying what we're selling and think it's real.

01:39:06.000 You too, man.

01:39:07.000 You too.

01:39:08.000 When was the last time Bruce put out an album?

01:39:10.000 He had a Western...

01:39:12.000 No, he has his most recent one.

01:39:17.000 For you, what's it called?

01:39:18.000 Letter to You?

01:39:21.000 Is that right?

01:39:21.000 Am I saying it right?

01:39:23.000 Yeah, yeah, letter T. How long ago was that?

01:39:25.000 October 2020. Oh, wow.

01:39:27.000 Yeah, that was during the pandemic, I think, yeah.

01:39:28.000 Oh, wow.

01:39:29.000 And it was great.

01:39:31.000 I'm sure it's great.

01:39:31.000 It's great.

01:39:32.000 It's always great.

01:39:32.000 Yeah, no, he's one of the most prolific guys ever in terms of high-quality stuff.

01:39:38.000 Yeah.

01:39:39.000 He's got a song on There's a Ghost.

01:39:40.000 It's as good as any song he's written.

01:39:42.000 Really?

01:39:42.000 He has very few people that can keep that level of quality high.

01:39:48.000 Most people have a shitty record. 0.92

01:39:50.000 They just do. 0.99

01:39:51.000 Expect it.

01:39:52.000 Plan on it.

01:39:54.000 Nobody gets out for free.

01:39:56.000 You can't be inspired every year.

01:39:58.000 You just can't be.

01:39:59.000 You can't be your best every year.

01:40:01.000 Now, having this gap of nine years, has it been about nine years since your last album?

01:40:06.000 Uh, yeah.

01:40:08.000 But, you know, I was done.

01:40:09.000 We could have had it out before, in the shutdown, we waited.

01:40:12.000 Right.

01:40:12.000 And so it would have been eight years.

01:40:14.000 But this, uh, during this gap, was it always in the back of your mind to put something else out?

01:40:20.000 Or did you have to accumulate enough ideas where you felt like you could...

01:40:25.000 Well, you're always accumulating.

01:40:27.000 Always.

01:40:28.000 But, you know, like I said, we...

01:40:29.000 Record 2012, I tour every summer, minus these times where you just can't right now.

01:40:35.000 Um...

01:40:37.000 So there's a point when you're starting out that you just feel like if you're not touring, then you better be writing.

01:40:41.000 And when you're done writing, you better be making that record.

01:40:44.000 And you can get off that ride for a minute.

01:40:48.000 But I never made records that speedily.

01:40:51.000 I mean, in the 1960s, people made two records a year.

01:40:55.000 We don't do that anymore.

01:40:56.000 Typically, it's like a record every three years.

01:40:58.000 But I've had longer gaps than that.

01:41:00.000 Two records a year seems insane.

01:41:02.000 It's totally insane.

01:41:03.000 And they were great.

01:41:05.000 You know?

01:41:06.000 Look at the Beatles.

01:41:07.000 Their whole career is eight years.

01:41:08.000 Yeah.

01:41:08.000 I know.

01:41:09.000 Isn't that crazy?

01:41:09.000 It took me nine to get this record out.

01:41:11.000 Wow.

01:41:12.000 So isn't that crazy?

01:41:13.000 But nobody should beat themselves up for that.

01:41:15.000 There's something in the air.

01:41:16.000 It was a totally different thing.

01:41:19.000 It does not relate.

01:41:21.000 No one can look at that model and think, should we be doing that, too?

01:41:23.000 You're not the Beatles, for starters.

01:41:26.000 And take some time.

01:41:27.000 Don't give me every song you wrote this year either, by the way.

01:41:30.000 Just pick your 10 favorite ones.

01:41:32.000 I don't need 18 songs.

01:41:34.000 Pick the 10 best ones.

01:41:35.000 What do you listen to when you're...

01:41:38.000 I mean, do you have a range of kind of music that you listen to?

01:41:43.000 Do you have particular genres that you enjoy only?

01:41:48.000 No.

01:41:48.000 Anybody would say the best of any genre.

01:41:53.000 I like songs the best.

01:41:55.000 And I feel that same way when I was younger.

01:41:58.000 We were talking earlier about the lifestyle music.

01:42:00.000 I never really... 0.99

01:42:02.000 Anybody who had a great song, it didn't bother me what kind of jacket they were wearing or what shit they put in their hair. 0.51

01:42:08.000 I like the song, and I still like music that has the best songs. 0.97

01:42:12.000 That's what moves me the most.

01:42:13.000 It's not the beats, it's not the vibes, it's not the stage diving, it's none of the peripheral stuff that can be pretty cool.

01:42:19.000 It's really just, I like good songs.

01:42:21.000 And you like them in all genres?

01:42:24.000 I think so.

01:42:24.000 Do you listen to country?

01:42:25.000 Yeah, yeah, sure.

01:42:26.000 What are you into?

01:42:29.000 Well, you say country, that's a very broad term now.

01:42:32.000 It is now, right?

01:42:33.000 I don't know what it is now, but when you say country, to me, I still think of George Jones and Johnny Cash.

01:42:40.000 So the newer stuff, I'm not saying it is or isn't country, but I don't identify so much.

01:42:44.000 I don't think most people do.

01:42:46.000 Well, it's kind of corporate country, a lot of it is.

01:42:49.000 It is.

01:42:49.000 It's just continuing to sell you what you already like.

01:42:51.000 Right.

01:42:51.000 They found a formula and they just keep hammering it.

01:42:54.000 Most businesses do that anyway.

01:42:56.000 They just keep selling you what they know you already like.

01:42:58.000 Why mix it up?

01:42:59.000 Right.

01:43:00.000 But it's interesting.

01:43:01.000 I did hear a couple songs just maybe yesterday flying out here.

01:43:04.000 I came across just two different times countries.

01:43:07.000 And it was interesting that the two songs I heard seemed so...

01:43:10.000 Typical of a lot of it, which is no one's really singing about themselves.

01:43:13.000 They're singing to you, the listener.

01:43:15.000 They're talking about your life.

01:43:17.000 You've got very wealthy people talking about all they need is a pickup truck and a shack and you.

01:43:23.000 And everything's awesome.

01:43:24.000 It's like, well, I don't think you're living in a shack and I don't think your pickup truck's probably pretty tricked out.

01:43:31.000 It's kind of telling you about your life and maybe that's what they like about it.

01:43:34.000 Maybe there is something that is similar to country music that's always done that, but I'd rather have Merle Haggard or Carter Family or any of those.

01:43:45.000 I'm not the first one to...

01:43:47.000 It's not my revelation, it's pop music.

01:43:49.000 You can't just put a fiddle on it and call it country.

01:43:51.000 Right, but there's guys out there like Jason Isbell and Sturgill Simpson.

01:43:56.000 There's people that are doing...

01:43:58.000 There's country elements to those things.

01:44:01.000 That's almost more like Tom Petty rock.

01:44:04.000 Some of it.

01:44:05.000 And actually, Tom Petty's music, that world bit his music pretty good, and they turned that into, particularly his Wildflowers record.

01:44:14.000 That's like a model for new country music, which I don't think he had any say in one way or the other.

01:44:20.000 That is true if you really think about a lot of his music.

01:44:22.000 It is kind of almost like American Girl.

01:44:25.000 That's kind of almost a country song.

01:44:28.000 Yeah, it's no mystery that they identify and they've kind of shortened that gap, the close in the distance, because it's rock, essentially.

01:44:35.000 And then the Eagles, are they country?

01:44:36.000 They're not country music either, but there's country elements.

01:44:38.000 Yeah.

01:44:40.000 I have no problem with any of it.

01:44:42.000 You like it, you like it.

01:44:43.000 I just mentioned it because you asked me, do I like country music?

01:44:45.000 So it's important to solidify what is the different kinds of country music.

01:44:49.000 A lot of these genres are kind of open-ended, right?

01:44:54.000 Yeah, well, country and rock certainly is very blurred.

01:44:59.000 But there's lots of different kinds of rock, so it's easy to put those two pretty close together.

01:45:05.000 But do you take time to just sit down and listen to music?

01:45:09.000 Or do you just listen to music?

01:45:10.000 Do you consume music while you're doing other things?

01:45:14.000 Yeah, unfortunately, like most people do, even if you thought you were hanging on to that thing for long, over time it's just slipped away.

01:45:20.000 You just showed us Henry Rollins' studio.

01:45:22.000 Like, yeah, if I had that studio, that situation, and I had it, yeah, I'd go in there and just shut the door and listen to music.

01:45:29.000 And I can't shed a new light on that experience with music, how it is different with vinyl.

01:45:36.000 It is something about it that's different.

01:45:37.000 And we all know what that is.

01:45:39.000 No one needs to hear me say what the difference is.

01:45:42.000 But I don't know.

01:45:43.000 I don't have a situation.

01:45:44.000 But you don't do that anymore when you get older as much anyhow.

01:45:48.000 Records cost a lot.

01:45:49.000 I used to buy records we did when you liked one song and you might like the rest.

01:45:53.000 If you bought it for $6.99 and it sucked, you just didn't care.

01:45:57.000 Sorry, I think your band's pretty cool, but I'm not spending $28 to help you out.

01:46:01.000 It's a lot.

01:46:03.000 You're going to come home with four records for over $150, $125 or something.

01:46:09.000 It doesn't matter how much money you have.

01:46:10.000 I just don't think the format is worth it.

01:46:13.000 It's difficult.

01:46:13.000 Because you can just get it in a digital format.

01:46:16.000 Unless you have that connection to the experience of putting on a turntable, that's worth the money.

01:46:22.000 Right.

01:46:22.000 Because that's an admission to a theme park almost.

01:46:25.000 Right.

01:46:25.000 You know what I mean?

01:46:26.000 You're getting something out of that.

01:46:27.000 And bands, they do, when they make vinyl, they really care a lot now.

01:46:31.000 We do honor whoever's going to bother to spend money on these things.

01:46:36.000 Give them everything you've got.

01:46:37.000 Think about it.

01:46:38.000 Work hard and make this something special for whoever does decide that they want it.

01:46:41.000 And appreciate that instead of streaming it, they're gonna go have the experience of buying a piece of vinyl.

01:46:46.000 Part of the process of Tarantino writing, he was explaining, was that he goes into his record room.

01:46:53.000 He has a record room in his house.

01:46:54.000 He goes in there and just locks himself in there and starts playing songs and playing actual physical records.

01:47:01.000 And then through that, he gets inspiration for scenes and inspiration for moments and characters.

01:47:07.000 It means something to a lot of people to put that needle down on that record.

01:47:12.000 Well, the investment's different, obviously.

01:47:16.000 But it goes deeper than that.

01:47:18.000 You're talking about vinyl.

01:47:20.000 Vinyl had very important parts of that vinyl.

01:47:23.000 There was the first song you're going to start your record with, and then there was how you're going to close out side one, right?

01:47:28.000 And then how you're going to open side two, and then what's the last song on the record?

01:47:32.000 There's like four out of ten spots that were really crucial.

01:47:36.000 It wasn't just a collection of your best songs first, like CDs.

01:47:39.000 When we started sequencing for CDs, it was just typically your best song first, your shittiest song goes last, because that's all anybody's going to do.

01:47:47.000 They're going to listen to it in one straight order.

01:47:49.000 They're probably going to leave the room within three songs.

01:47:51.000 So they may never even get to the end of the CD. Do they still have...

01:47:54.000 Sorry, go ahead.

01:47:54.000 No, records you can live with one side or the other.

01:47:56.000 It's not just that they sound better.

01:48:00.000 And I still make records...

01:48:03.000 Recordings with that in mind.

01:48:05.000 Because we used to make records, when you listen to records, your favorite records, sometimes there's purposely a shitty song on the record.

01:48:14.000 Because you can't have 10 singles on a record.

01:48:17.000 I mean, thriller maybe.

01:48:18.000 There was an arc to it.

01:48:20.000 And sometimes you'd throw in a waltz to kind of clear the palette for the next song.

01:48:24.000 You'd set up the next one with something here.

01:48:25.000 It was like a show.

01:48:27.000 You know what I mean?

01:48:28.000 Right, hills and valleys.

01:48:29.000 Yeah, and that's why a lot of what they call deep cuts or something on records.

01:48:33.000 Yeah.

01:48:34.000 A deep cut to me when I was younger meant like, that's for me.

01:48:38.000 That's not going to be a hit song.

01:48:39.000 That's going to be something that the artists work really hard on.

01:48:42.000 It's not going to be a hit.

01:48:43.000 That's going to be for me.

01:48:44.000 Now a deep cut means nobody heard your song.

01:48:45.000 Nobody cares.

01:48:47.000 Do they still have those record players where you stack records on top of each other?

01:48:51.000 That was a good few records.

01:48:52.000 Terrible, right?

01:48:53.000 That's a good few records.

01:48:54.000 That was a thing that they did for a while, though, right?

01:48:56.000 Yeah, but you also know how when your needle went to the end of the record and then picked up and came back?

01:49:00.000 Yeah.

01:49:00.000 That was a sign of, like, you don't have a good turntable.

01:49:02.000 Oh, really?

01:49:02.000 Yeah.

01:49:03.000 I didn't know that too long ago.

01:49:05.000 So the turntable's not, the needle's not supposed to do anything other than play?

01:49:09.000 Yeah, it just goes to the end and it's just going to sit there and make that skipping.

01:49:11.000 And then you pick it up.

01:49:12.000 So if it does it for you? 1.00

01:49:14.000 Piece of shit. 1.00

01:49:15.000 Probably. 1.00

01:49:16.000 Because I remember being a kid at parties and they would stack records on these things and like, this is the wildest shit ever. 0.94

01:49:25.000 You don't even have to touch it. 0.95

01:49:26.000 It'll just keep playing a new record.

01:49:28.000 Yeah.

01:49:28.000 But then they're sitting on top of each other, chewing each other up.

01:49:32.000 Yeah, it was shitty vinyl, too, though. 0.99

01:49:33.000 The vinyl you were buying as a kid was garbage. 0.99

01:49:35.000 Oh, it's a different vinyl? 0.99

01:49:36.000 Oh, yeah.

01:49:37.000 The real good vinyl, you know, was, like, I think that ended, like, maybe mid-60s, 70s.

01:49:42.000 Take your records when you were a kid, and they'd go like this, and you could, like, fan yourself, and, like, you know, you could make a noise.

01:49:48.000 Yeah.

01:49:50.000 That's not great vinyl.

01:49:51.000 Oh, what's it like?

01:49:53.000 It's like shaking a book, yeah.

01:49:55.000 Oh, so it's stiff.

01:49:56.000 Yeah, it's just more gram vinyl.

01:49:58.000 It's just better.

01:49:59.000 But it wasn't a problem listening to those records when we were kids.

01:50:02.000 I had no problem with it.

01:50:03.000 They sounded great.

01:50:05.000 No, they did.

01:50:05.000 Well, there was also the experience that people don't get today, where you open up that album, and a lot of them, especially a double, like Kiss Alive 2, or Kiss Double Platinum, like, ooh.

01:50:17.000 You open it up, and it was a book.

01:50:21.000 It was like there was images in there.

01:50:23.000 There was pictures of them on tour.

01:50:25.000 There was all kinds of stuff that would draw you into the band.

01:50:29.000 Long gone.

01:50:30.000 Long gone.

01:50:30.000 But, you know, I don't hold a torch for it.

01:50:33.000 No?

01:50:33.000 I mean, you miss it.

01:50:36.000 That's nostalgia.

01:50:37.000 But, you know, I don't like being in conversation with people who just dislike how it is now.

01:50:43.000 Like, whatever, man.

01:50:44.000 Let's move on.

01:50:45.000 There's other stuff.

01:50:46.000 I mean, what are you going to do?

01:50:47.000 Yeah, for sure.

01:50:48.000 Just going to be that unhappy guy just sitting around talking about how things were better when you were a kid?

01:50:52.000 You're right.

01:50:52.000 They probably were.

01:50:53.000 But, like, nobody cares.

01:50:54.000 Move on.

01:50:54.000 Let's go.

01:50:56.000 Because what's the alternative is you don't do anything.

01:50:58.000 You don't buy anything anymore.

01:50:59.000 You don't listen to anything.

01:51:00.000 You don't enjoy anything.

01:51:00.000 Right.

01:51:01.000 And there is still plenty to enjoy.

01:51:02.000 It's just we're getting it in a different way.

01:51:05.000 Yeah.

01:51:05.000 But there is more of it.

01:51:07.000 And you're a cliche, by the way.

01:51:08.000 Every generation said the same thing.

01:51:10.000 Of course, right?

01:51:11.000 Yeah.

01:51:11.000 Every generation's saying that the good old days were better.

01:51:14.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:51:15.000 And they're going to do that about this generation because, oh, before you fuckers with your holograms, we used to actually watch music videos. 0.99

01:51:22.000 Now you're inside of them. 0.99

01:51:25.000 Have you seen a hologram show?

01:51:26.000 I have not.

01:51:27.000 I have not.

01:51:27.000 I mean, like...

01:51:28.000 Well, I'm thinking about really...

01:51:29.000 I should have said augmented reality more than holograms.

01:51:32.000 I'm back at, you know, the tent where there's 30,000 people jumping up and down to a guy with a laptop.

01:51:37.000 I'm still trying to figure that one out.

01:51:40.000 So the hologram...

01:51:41.000 You need to get more ecstasy.

01:51:43.000 Maybe, I don't know.

01:51:44.000 That's all it is.

01:51:45.000 Yeah, if you go to those shows...

01:51:47.000 Those shows, if you go to an electronic music show...

01:51:49.000 There's no amount of ecstasy...

01:51:50.000 There's some people that love to dance, and that's why they're doing that.

01:51:53.000 And some people just love to be out and partying. 1.00

01:51:55.000 But a lot of those fucking people are tripping balls. 1.00

01:51:57.000 I would say 100% of them. 1.00

01:52:00.000 That's what it is.

01:52:01.000 Not a lot of people sit around listening to reggae music if they're not high either.

01:52:04.000 That's true.

01:52:05.000 That's okay.

01:52:06.000 The interesting thing about these electronic music concerts is that that's one of the things that revitalized Vegas. 0.98

01:52:12.000 It's because people could go to these electronic music concerts and this guy was just pressing play on a laptop and doing this shit. 0.94

01:52:19.000 Everybody was going crazy. 0.93

01:52:21.000 Millie Vanilli helps everybody.

01:52:22.000 That guy, what a life those guys had.

01:52:25.000 Until they got busted.

01:52:28.000 Isn't that funny to you though?

01:52:30.000 This is okay.

01:52:31.000 Hit the button.

01:52:32.000 This guy makes like $50 million a year being a DJ hitting the space bar.

01:52:35.000 And then Milli Vanilli, they danced, they worked their ass off, they tried.

01:52:38.000 You bought a real record.

01:52:40.000 There were real people singing on that record.

01:52:42.000 It wasn't them.

01:52:43.000 But they humiliated those guys.

01:52:45.000 Okay, they got caught.

01:52:46.000 But now, I mean, I watch a little bit of the 4th of July stuff.

01:52:50.000 Nobody was singing or playing.

01:52:51.000 Nobody.

01:52:52.000 Nobody cares anymore.

01:52:54.000 And we shouldn't care.

01:52:55.000 Technically, it's too big of a feat to pull that off at times, like Super Bowl.

01:52:59.000 No one's ever going to sing.

01:53:00.000 It's just too big.

01:53:01.000 Too many things can go wrong.

01:53:02.000 But go back for a minute and think about how everybody's minds were blown and they were angry burning Milli Vanilli records.

01:53:09.000 Because they found out that those were not the two guys who sang on the record.

01:53:12.000 But you know what?

01:53:12.000 Somebody did sing on the record.

01:53:14.000 You were buying a record that people wrote and sang.

01:53:17.000 Whereas today, you're often not buying anybody's anything.

01:53:21.000 And you're okay with that.

01:53:22.000 I wonder what happened to those dudes.

01:53:23.000 Well, one of them, I believe, killed himself.

01:53:25.000 Oof.

01:53:26.000 Yeah, no, I found it really sad.

01:53:29.000 And I found the irony totally crazy that like...

01:53:32.000 You still bought the record, you liked it, and somebody was singing on it.

01:53:36.000 Yeah.

01:53:36.000 Okay, you feel a little fooled that it wasn't them, but should these guys be sent out to pasture for their whole lives and be humiliated because you still got something that was pretty good that you liked?

01:53:45.000 I feel like one of them put out an album where he did sing.

01:53:49.000 They did.

01:53:49.000 They went out...

01:53:52.000 Yes, I know a lot of stuff, you might be surprised.

01:53:54.000 I think they did go out, and they wanted to dance, and they wanted to sing.

01:53:58.000 They had very heavy accents.

01:54:00.000 And they learned to sing, and they tried.

01:54:02.000 And I don't think it was even possible that they could turn that thing around.

01:54:08.000 And they had these accents that were really heavy, but it's a terrible story. 0.99

01:54:12.000 Well, it used to be a thing if you got caught lip-syncing at a concert, people were pissed off, but now they don't give a fuck anymore. 0.99

01:54:19.000 No. 0.98

01:54:20.000 I mean, it's a lot of what happens.

01:54:22.000 And then you put, unfortunately, the tables have turned where bands have to tell you, you know, we play live, we don't use tapes.

01:54:29.000 It's like, you have to defend that.

01:54:31.000 You want people to know that we're not doing that, you know?

01:54:33.000 Yeah.

01:54:34.000 But, you know, it has a...

01:54:36.000 A lot of bands do that.

01:54:37.000 And, you know, whatever moves you should do, but remember when people do that, when they play with tapes on it, they're restricted by these tapes.

01:54:44.000 So they can't go off the script at all.

01:54:46.000 And imagine yourself as a comedian.

01:54:47.000 What if you just had to do that?

01:54:48.000 You could not go off script.

01:54:50.000 Right.

01:54:50.000 Which is when you play with tapes, I'm sorry, when you go see, you know, Def Leppard, they do not use tapes.

01:54:56.000 You know those stacked vocals you hear on those famous records?

01:54:59.000 They're not young men and they go out there and they insist on, from what I understand, insist on It'd be so easy to have just fly in those walls of background vocals.

01:55:09.000 But from the time they came up and from their integrity, they seemed to refuse to do that.

01:55:13.000 But they're alone in doing that.

01:55:15.000 Really?

01:55:15.000 Most bands do...

01:55:16.000 No, I'm not gonna...

01:55:18.000 I mean, I just watched this Fourth of July thing and it was just like...

01:55:20.000 You got like four people playing guitars and I'm hearing like a million sounds.

01:55:25.000 It's just like there's nobody here.

01:55:27.000 And I'm not surprised, but then my mind just goes back to this was so...

01:55:31.000 20 years ago, this was so insulting and you want to destroy these bands for how dare you? 0.92

01:55:36.000 The only justification that I've ever heard for using the lip sync is some artists do a lot of physical shit on stage where they're like dancing and jumping around and doing... 0.98

01:55:47.000 That's the first time. 0.90

01:55:48.000 That's right away you can tell.

01:55:49.000 In those award shows, when people have this big dance thing, By the second verse, if they're not huffing and puffing, there you go.

01:56:01.000 It was limited before.

01:56:04.000 You had to maximize and minimize your dance routine to what you could sing.

01:56:09.000 People have been dancing and singing for a long time.

01:56:11.000 It's not a new thing.

01:56:15.000 Tina Turner.

01:56:17.000 James Brown.

01:56:18.000 They had to work together with You're singing and you're dancing and you had to know, well, if I do that stuff, I'm probably going to be winded and can't sing.

01:56:25.000 So they had to work balance.

01:56:26.000 Now it's just like, don't worry about the singing.

01:56:29.000 We got that.

01:56:29.000 We got the record.

01:56:30.000 Let's get a good dance routine together. 0.98

01:56:32.000 But if someone does sing and dance together, the impact of watching them pull it off, like James Brown when he was in Zaire opening up for the Muhammad Ali fight, holy shit.

01:56:42.000 That video is one of the most iconic videos of a person performing ever.

01:56:47.000 Yeah.

01:56:47.000 Pink does that.

01:56:48.000 She flies around upside down and sings.

01:56:50.000 And when you see that, you can see things next, you can feel it, and it's moving.

01:56:55.000 That's what separates some people from other people.

01:56:58.000 If you can't sing and dance, then just pick one or the other, but don't pretend you can do both, because some people can. 0.99

01:57:04.000 And she really does hang from those fucking things, and she fell once and really fucked herself up. 0.98

01:57:09.000 But you've got a superior voice, and you've got somebody who really can trapeze-style maneuvers. 0.99

01:57:17.000 It's just interesting when you just think about how people were so punished 20 years ago when you found out there was one little tambourine in the background that wasn't live and real and people just felt like you fooled them and they were pissed.

01:57:28.000 And you might still feel like that and I might because you were around them, but if you're young today, you wouldn't know the difference.

01:57:33.000 You're not expecting the act to just give you what they're able to do.

01:57:37.000 What happened?

01:57:39.000 I don't know.

01:57:41.000 I mean, at some point they just let it slip out, just let it go.

01:57:46.000 At some point, everyone just collectively thought, like, I don't care.

01:57:49.000 They accepted some fakeness.

01:57:51.000 Yeah, but it is showbiz.

01:57:54.000 It's not surprising.

01:57:55.000 And there are parts of it where it's technically just not possible.

01:57:58.000 Have you been paying attention to this Britney Spears conservatorship thing?

01:58:03.000 I know of it.

01:58:04.000 I don't know.

01:58:05.000 It's very bizarre.

01:58:06.000 I just started paying attention to it this past weekend because a bunch of artists started hashtag Free Britney.

01:58:15.000 And I was like, okay, what's the story here?

01:58:18.000 And apparently her father has a conservatorship over her where she's not even allowed to get pregnant. 1.00

01:58:28.000 Like, she can't take her IUD out, allegedly.

01:58:31.000 I don't know.

01:58:32.000 I want to make sure this is true.

01:58:32.000 Allegedly.

01:58:33.000 I've heard that.

01:58:34.000 I've also heard that's not true.

01:58:35.000 I don't know.

01:58:35.000 Well, I hope it's not true.

01:58:37.000 But the other thing is that...

01:58:38.000 You still think...

01:58:39.000 What?

01:58:41.000 I think she has a partner.

01:58:42.000 I think you should back off that one.

01:58:44.000 She has a partner? 0.99

01:58:45.000 I'm sorry.

01:58:46.000 Wait.

01:58:47.000 Did I lose?

01:58:47.000 I just lost.

01:58:48.000 Did you lose me?

01:58:49.000 No, I didn't lose you at all.

01:58:50.000 I hear you.

01:58:50.000 Sorry.

01:58:50.000 Go ahead.

01:58:51.000 Yeah, I don't know much about that.

01:58:53.000 I know what it means, but I don't know why she can't get out of it.

01:58:56.000 I don't understand it, because the judge just denied her to be free of this conservatorship.

01:59:02.000 Her father has control over her finances, and her father is in control of her career, but she's 36 years old.

01:59:13.000 I would need a lot more information just on...

01:59:15.000 I mean, how much time has to go by before you can prove that she can take care of yourself?

01:59:18.000 I don't know.

01:59:19.000 I mean, why...

01:59:20.000 She's clearly...

01:59:21.000 How long has it been? 0.94

01:59:22.000 She's clearly loony, but there's a lot of male artists that are loony, too. 0.52

01:59:27.000 Like, they're not in control by their father. 0.97

01:59:30.000 Like, just because you're loony doesn't mean... 0.87

01:59:33.000 I mean, we have a long history of loony people. 1.00

01:59:36.000 We can make a list right now of some loony guys out there who, like, hope they probably could use it.

01:59:40.000 But, yeah...

01:59:41.000 I mean, come on.

01:59:42.000 Looney's got nothing.

01:59:43.000 Looney's great.

01:59:44.000 We love Looney.

01:59:45.000 The idea is that it's to protect her.

01:59:48.000 This is the idea, is that if you don't have some sort of control over her life, she'll go nuts. 0.99

01:59:57.000 Isn't that part of being a person?

02:00:00.000 That's growing up, right?

02:00:02.000 How does a grown adult have a conservatorship over someone who...

02:00:05.000 Obviously, she's not incapacitated.

02:00:07.000 How is she going to hurt herself or lose money? 1.00

02:00:11.000 She's just going to go nutty and spend all her money, but it's her fucking money. 1.00

02:00:14.000 Isn't it? 0.99

02:00:14.000 Yeah, if you're a band and you want to go to Vegas and gamble all your money away, you're 100% allowed to do that. 0.99

02:00:20.000 You talked to MC Hammer?

02:00:21.000 Yeah.

02:00:22.000 There's a lot of guys.

02:00:23.000 Mike Tyson, that's your prerogative.

02:00:25.000 Yeah.

02:00:25.000 You make a dollar, it's your prerogative to blow it.

02:00:27.000 Yeah, that's why I don't understand this.

02:00:29.000 If it's physically going to hurt yourself, that's a different story, of course.

02:00:32.000 Right.

02:00:33.000 But I haven't heard that.

02:00:33.000 But she could do that.

02:00:35.000 Yeah, you could do that anytime you're alone.

02:00:36.000 Of course.

02:00:37.000 Yeah, this has something to do with her finances.

02:00:39.000 It has something to do with control over her life.

02:00:43.000 Yeah, I don't know.

02:00:44.000 I mean, I know enough to know that it sounds really crazy, and I know she just recently tried to end it and it was denied.

02:00:51.000 Well, the judge denied it, which is crazy.

02:00:53.000 I don't know what case you'd have to prove about somebody to have them stay in that situation.

02:00:59.000 Right. 0.94

02:00:59.000 I mean, if you can talk and you can eat and you can go on stage and kick ass like she does, she still performs on a regular basis. 0.94

02:01:07.000 I don't know.

02:01:08.000 It seems to me like if she wants to go throw all her money off a cliff tomorrow, she should be allowed to do that.

02:01:13.000 Right.

02:01:13.000 That's what's weird.

02:01:14.000 Who gets to say she can't do that?

02:01:15.000 I've never heard of a situation like this before.

02:01:17.000 No.

02:01:18.000 Well, that's a money-making machine, right?

02:01:20.000 That's the problem.

02:01:22.000 They want that cash to keep coming in.

02:01:24.000 Whatever it is, it begins with that.

02:01:26.000 She hasn't performed since January of 2019. I saw that today.

02:01:36.000 She's retiring because she can't get out of the conservatorship? 0.98

02:01:43.000 She's been trying to get out of it for a long time, right?

02:01:46.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

02:01:47.000 I'm trying to read through it to see if there's anything that makes sense that we haven't said, but I can't find anything that makes sense.

02:01:53.000 So this is just pre-COVID, just a couple months before the pandemic hit and everything locked down.

02:01:58.000 No, a year before.

02:01:59.000 2019. January of 2019. Okay.

02:02:02.000 Yeah, so that full year, right.

02:02:06.000 Yeah, I don't know.

02:02:07.000 I don't know much about that, but nobody ever retires anyway.

02:02:12.000 No.

02:02:13.000 Well, not if they're having a good time.

02:02:16.000 How many rock stars?

02:02:17.000 You know what's a great story?

02:02:19.000 Is that Searching for Sugar Man story.

02:02:21.000 What's that guy's name?

02:02:23.000 Rodriguez?

02:02:24.000 Yeah, Rodriguez.

02:02:24.000 Yeah.

02:02:25.000 That's interesting.

02:02:26.000 What if it was just made up?

02:02:28.000 It'd be crazy if it was.

02:02:31.000 What are you saying?

02:02:32.000 I mean, I don't know.

02:02:33.000 What are you saying?

02:02:34.000 I don't think about that movie.

02:02:35.000 Well, I have a friend from South Africa who told me he was injured over there.

02:02:38.000 That would be the way you'd know.

02:02:39.000 Otherwise, plenty of people, it could have been, it was this close to being maybe Spinal Tap. 1.00

02:02:43.000 I saw Spinal Tap when it came out, and I fell asleep because I didn't get it, and I thought these guys were assholes. 0.99

02:02:47.000 So maybe it was that good. 0.96

02:02:49.000 No offense to the artist, because I learned about him from that documentary, but it did occur to me at some point, like, wait a minute.

02:02:55.000 How would I know?

02:02:56.000 This is, you know, maybe it's...

02:02:58.000 Is this a real...

02:02:59.000 Because we never heard of him here.

02:03:01.000 We never heard of him here.

02:03:02.000 But the stories that were most compelling is people in South...

02:03:04.000 He was like Van Morrison to them.

02:03:05.000 Yes.

02:03:06.000 That's interesting.

02:03:07.000 I knew a guy from South Africa who told me when he was a kid...

02:03:10.000 They had heard all these crazy rumors about him, that he died in a car accident, that he committed suicide, this conflicting story, but he was a huge hit over there.

02:03:19.000 Well, that's interesting.

02:03:21.000 You can't do that now.

02:03:22.000 No.

02:03:23.000 If you're big anywhere, you're big all over.

02:03:24.000 Yes.

02:03:25.000 Because it's just a universal radio system, which is streaming, and we're all listening to the same thing.

02:03:29.000 But isn't that amazing?

02:03:29.000 You could be that size of an artist in South Africa, right?

02:03:35.000 It was South Africa.

02:03:36.000 And then the rest of the world really hasn't heard you.

02:03:39.000 Not only is the rest of the world not heard of you, but you don't know you're a big artist in South Africa.

02:03:43.000 Exactly.

02:03:43.000 Was he painting houses?

02:03:45.000 He was a construction worker.

02:03:46.000 He was living in poverty.

02:03:49.000 And then he goes over there and performs in front of sold-out arenas.

02:03:53.000 You saw the documentary, right?

02:03:55.000 Yeah.

02:03:55.000 It's a wild documentary, man.

02:03:57.000 There's a lot of us sitting around wondering.

02:03:59.000 I wonder how I would do in South Africa.

02:04:01.000 Maybe I don't know.

02:04:02.000 Maybe no one's telling me.

02:04:04.000 Maybe there's a huge thing on it.

02:04:05.000 But today, no.

02:04:06.000 You'd know today.

02:04:07.000 Well, that's the thing, right?

02:04:08.000 There's always some artists that do really well overseas.

02:04:11.000 There's a guy named Arge Barker, who is one of the biggest stand-up comics in all of Australia. 0.83

02:04:16.000 He's fucking huge in Australia. 0.73

02:04:19.000 Sells out theaters multiple nights in a row. 0.99

02:04:21.000 But in America, he's just a regular comic.

02:04:23.000 But in Australia, he's like their top dog.

02:04:25.000 It's just weird.

02:04:27.000 Yeah, I'm surprised, just because the internet connects everybody.

02:04:30.000 But maybe he's there playing his act more there, physically.

02:04:34.000 Well, he is, definitely.

02:04:35.000 But it's just, for whatever reason, he caught fire over there.

02:04:40.000 But the live experience has a lot to do with it.

02:04:42.000 You can still have a large presence in America if you don't go to Europe as an act, as a band, and put that time in.

02:04:49.000 The songs being streamed, that's not going to be enough to translate to a show.

02:04:53.000 If that's the case, why did Rodriguez take off in South Africa when he'd never been there?

02:04:57.000 Well, that's a fluke.

02:04:58.000 Yeah, but it can happen.

02:05:00.000 It did happen.

02:05:01.000 You know he gave all his money away?

02:05:06.000 Talk about Looney, right?

02:05:07.000 You're going back to Looney.

02:05:08.000 Yeah, he likes being...

02:05:09.000 They should have locked him up, right?

02:05:11.000 You can't do that. 1.00

02:05:12.000 Give him a concert or shit. 1.00

02:05:13.000 His kids should have locked him up. 0.99

02:05:14.000 Yeah.

02:05:15.000 Keep singing.

02:05:15.000 How dare you give away your own money?

02:05:17.000 That album is good, though, man.

02:05:19.000 I bought the album.

02:05:20.000 It is.

02:05:20.000 Well...

02:05:22.000 It is good, but Spinal Tap was good too.

02:05:24.000 Was it?

02:05:25.000 That's what made it so believable and good was the songs were really good.

02:05:29.000 So when you hear the story about Rodriguez and you hear the songs, I do believe that.

02:05:32.000 You seem incredulous.

02:05:33.000 No, but I hear the songs and I'm like, no, these are good.

02:05:35.000 I do believe the story because the songs are good.

02:05:38.000 That makes it believable.

02:05:39.000 Yeah.

02:05:40.000 But it's just so crazy to think that this guy lived his whole life not knowing that he was a gigantic star on another continent.

02:05:47.000 Well, if I remember correctly, the story itself wasn't that unique, just in terms of getting that record deal, getting your songs in the late 60s, whenever he was starting, and that dream doesn't work for most people.

02:05:58.000 And then you go back to your life and not knowing, quietly over here, something just took off.

02:06:02.000 It's kind of wild.

02:06:03.000 And if they hadn't made the documentary, it would have been a great movie with a script, also, because...

02:06:08.000 This parallel universe, you're a giant and you would never know.

02:06:11.000 Yeah.

02:06:13.000 It's just, yeah, if it was a movie, it would be hard to buy.

02:06:18.000 If it was just a fiction, it would be hard to buy.

02:06:22.000 But as a documentary, it made me cry.

02:06:26.000 No, it was good.

02:06:27.000 It was good.

02:06:28.000 And that did get the music documentary ball rolling, that film.

02:06:34.000 And then I guess the streaming thing, everybody's...

02:06:36.000 There's a lot of people.

02:06:37.000 I mean, I haven't seen it.

02:06:39.000 I don't think it's out.

02:06:40.000 There's Sparks.

02:06:41.000 They have a documentary.

02:06:42.000 And that's what that medium is really good for.

02:06:46.000 Because a lot of people are going to learn about Sparks now that didn't know much about them.

02:06:49.000 Because I've seen the trailers.

02:06:51.000 Yeah, Sparks.

02:06:52.000 They were the two brothers, male brothers.

02:06:54.000 Do you know who that...

02:06:56.000 Do you know that?

02:06:56.000 Mostly late 70s, 80s.

02:06:58.000 Cult kind of band.

02:06:59.000 Oh yeah?

02:07:00.000 Two brothers, yeah.

02:07:01.000 You'll recognize them.

02:07:02.000 Yeah, the Sparks.

02:07:03.000 You'll recognize it as soon as you bring up a picture.

02:07:05.000 You'll be like, I know who that is.

02:07:06.000 Oh, okay.

02:07:07.000 But anyway, it's going to work.

02:07:10.000 I have no idea who those guys are.

02:07:13.000 Jamie?

02:07:13.000 See, the one on the middle left, that one, and this side, middle left, that right there, that's more the typical image that you might recall.

02:07:23.000 Well, they were kind of art house.

02:07:24.000 There was nowhere to put them.

02:07:26.000 But they made a documentary, and I think what I've seen in the trailer looks like it's going to be good.

02:07:31.000 But, boy, a lot of patience, and then they will gain a much larger, I think, audience from it.

02:07:39.000 Hmm.

02:07:40.000 Because that's how people hear their music and they learn things now from, obviously, television.

02:07:45.000 They could never really be on the radio, so this will bring a new audience. 0.55

02:07:48.000 There's a documentary about Leonard Skinner that is fucking phenomenal.

02:07:54.000 Yeah. 0.83

02:07:54.000 There's a couple. 0.83

02:07:55.000 Which one is it?

02:07:56.000 I don't know which one I saw.

02:07:58.000 I watched a couple.

02:08:00.000 I forget which channel.

02:08:01.000 There's one of those streaming channels that has tons of documentaries and they're just not good.

02:08:04.000 Oh, was it that?

02:08:05.000 Because you've got to get the rights to the music.

02:08:07.000 You've got to get real interviews.

02:08:08.000 And if it's just...

02:08:09.000 They have bands who just kind of sound like Skinner playing in the background.

02:08:12.000 Like, that doesn't work.

02:08:13.000 Oh, no.

02:08:13.000 Oh, they do that all the time.

02:08:15.000 It's expensive.

02:08:16.000 Because they don't have the rights to the music?

02:08:17.000 That's terrible.

02:08:18.000 And they get, like, the brother of a guitar tech, he's in it.

02:08:22.000 Like, it's not really...

02:08:22.000 Oh, no.

02:08:23.000 But the one you're talking about, no, their history is amazing.

02:08:25.000 It's incredible.

02:08:26.000 I mean, what about the album cover itself?

02:08:27.000 There it is. 0.96

02:08:28.000 If I leave here tomorrow, it's fucking phenomenal. 0.96

02:08:31.000 Yeah, that's the one from 2018. It's so good. 0.97

02:08:34.000 It's so good. 0.99

02:08:35.000 It's like they're the greatest fucking thing that ever came out of Florida by a long shot. 0.99

02:08:39.000 Tom Petty. 0.99

02:08:40.000 That's true too. 1.00

02:08:41.000 Damn it. 1.00

02:08:42.000 That's right. 1.00

02:08:43.000 I forgot Tom Petty came from fucking Florida. 1.00

02:08:45.000 Both from Gainesville. 1.00

02:08:46.000 Really?

02:08:46.000 I used to live there.

02:08:48.000 Lived in Gainesville for a little bit.

02:08:49.000 I teach you about your hometown heroes.

02:08:50.000 I was only there for three years.

02:08:52.000 Yeah.

02:08:54.000 That's crazy.

02:08:56.000 Yeah, that band, Leonard Skinner to this day, they still have some songs where you just go, oh, I forgot about Curtis Blow.

02:09:04.000 Curtis Lowe, that song, Sing Me a Song, Curtis Lowe.

02:09:09.000 People forget about that song.

02:09:10.000 Well, they have their staples.

02:09:12.000 Yeah, well, their history is amazing.

02:09:17.000 I'm facing from Blackfoot, the guitar player who's back in the group right now, Can we bring that up real quick?

02:09:26.000 Blackfoot, that band.

02:09:29.000 He's one of the original...

02:09:30.000 There's nobody left in the group.

02:09:32.000 I think they retired.

02:09:33.000 Maybe they're coming back.

02:09:34.000 Yeah, Ricky Medlock.

02:09:35.000 He was the original...

02:09:37.000 Do you know the story?

02:09:38.000 It was probably in that film.

02:09:39.000 He was the original guitar player.

02:09:41.000 Then he comes back Yeah, he left, and then after the plane crashed.

02:09:44.000 But he's not a part of the lineup that made those records that people really are aware of.

02:09:49.000 Yeah, I mean, if you look at this, only Gary Rossington left.

02:09:52.000 I mean, from the original lineup, we should say.

02:09:56.000 Well, some guys survived the plane crash, right?

02:10:00.000 Yeah, I think it was four people who died.

02:10:03.000 Yeah.

02:10:05.000 Ed King just passed.

02:10:06.000 He wrote, I believe, Sweet Home Alabama.

02:10:10.000 That was his riff.

02:10:11.000 Ed King.

02:10:12.000 He was only in it for a minute.

02:10:13.000 They didn't get along.

02:10:14.000 Oh really?

02:10:15.000 Yeah.

02:10:16.000 It's a long history band.

02:10:17.000 That documentary was good.

02:10:20.000 By the time that band was really popular, people were already come and gone.

02:10:23.000 It already evolved from different members.

02:10:27.000 That's gotta be one of the hardest things about a band is getting all the personalities to sync up and get along with each other while you're touring, while you're making albums, while you're putting music together.

02:10:39.000 That's not easy.

02:10:42.000 And your chances of really sustaining that for very long are not very good.

02:10:46.000 Because generally bands are put together when you're kids.

02:10:50.000 It's kind of a young person's dream being a rock band at 21. But you don't really have any experience and you don't have any needs yet other than Rent or something.

02:10:58.000 So to be together by the time you guys are now 41 or 42, 20 years later, that's not really a normal arc.

02:11:04.000 It's hard.

02:11:05.000 It's hard.

02:11:06.000 And the things that bind you when you're starting, you don't even know who you are yet.

02:11:12.000 Music, that's what's binding you right now.

02:11:14.000 But over the next couple years, you're just going to start going, you can't help it.

02:11:17.000 It usually doesn't work.

02:11:20.000 The best ones, that's why people don't start great groups in their 40s or 30s.

02:11:25.000 No one knows?

02:11:26.000 I mean, what great group really...

02:11:28.000 You can do side projects, but not the all for one, one for all thing in your 30s, because you all know too much now.

02:11:34.000 You know that this model's not going to really work.

02:11:36.000 Right.

02:11:37.000 And you might have kids, and you might have wives. 0.79

02:11:40.000 Yeah, it's naturally looking out for your own self a little bit more.

02:11:43.000 But when you're starting out, the music is the most important thing to you, and reality hasn't really shaped anybody yet.

02:11:52.000 In that way, it's very similar to comedy that when you're starting out, all you want to do is just go out there and do it.

02:11:59.000 You just want to make it.

02:12:01.000 You want to somehow or another make a living.

02:12:02.000 You want to somehow or another be able to figure out how to, this is my job.

02:12:07.000 I tell jokes or I sing songs.

02:12:09.000 How can I do this?

02:12:10.000 Is this possible?

02:12:12.000 It seems impossible.

02:12:13.000 And your overhead's very low.

02:12:14.000 Yeah.

02:12:14.000 You don't need much, right?

02:12:16.000 You don't need much.

02:12:17.000 And you're just...

02:12:17.000 You're running...

02:12:18.000 And that's how...

02:12:19.000 It's very similar to how bands start.

02:12:21.000 You know?

02:12:22.000 But then...

02:12:23.000 How many guys from your early days are you with today?

02:12:26.000 None.

02:12:27.000 Zero.

02:12:27.000 Yeah.

02:12:28.000 Wow.

02:12:28.000 Good for you.

02:12:30.000 Yeah, well...

02:12:32.000 You know?

02:12:33.000 Somebody...

02:12:33.000 I had the same conversation a couple years ago with a producer who just...

02:12:38.000 I've made solo records also, and he asked, I think I had to go do shows with my band, and he was like, you still have the band?

02:12:44.000 And I said, yeah, in the summertime we do go and do some shows, and he kind of was stumped.

02:12:48.000 He goes, bands are for kids.

02:12:49.000 He didn't mean for kids to come to the show.

02:12:52.000 He meant being in a band?

02:12:53.000 You still want to be in a band?

02:12:55.000 You didn't grow out of that yet?

02:12:56.000 Because it really is for kids.

02:12:58.000 It's a sustained immaturity level that just travels across the country and has two hours a night that they get a lot of affection.

02:13:07.000 And it's not really a normal course of life, really.

02:13:09.000 So it hits a wall at some point.

02:13:11.000 Yeah.

02:13:12.000 But sometimes when artists are in a band and then they leave to do a solo project, it's just never the same.

02:13:19.000 They're not the same thing without the band.

02:13:22.000 No.

02:13:23.000 Mine was never that kind of band.

02:13:24.000 There are bands like what you're talking about.

02:13:27.000 Nobody wants to see The Edge leave U2, it just won't be U2 without them.

02:13:30.000 But you did put up with a couple of changes in the Rolling Stones.

02:13:34.000 Brian Jones died, or he was fired, and then McTaylor came in, and now you've got Ron Wood.

02:13:40.000 Some bands, if we do it a little bit at a time, it's like, don't steal all the money at once, just take a dollar at a time, no one's gonna notice.

02:13:49.000 That might work.

02:13:51.000 But those groups, you know, they're far and few between.

02:13:54.000 The ones that really matter, you take one person out, it doesn't work.

02:13:57.000 There's not that many, really.

02:13:58.000 Really, like, you can do it.

02:14:00.000 It's not that hard to do.

02:14:02.000 And then he has some, like you mentioned, Led Zeppelin.

02:14:04.000 They refuse to ever go on without John Bonham, understanding that there is no Led Zeppelin without him.

02:14:09.000 But, you know, they lost Keith Moon and they put in Kenny Jones.

02:14:12.000 I like that record.

02:14:13.000 It wasn't the same.

02:14:15.000 You know, you can't replace Keith Moon.

02:14:18.000 But Kenny Jones was pretty good, too.

02:14:20.000 I like that record.

02:14:21.000 You know, so it can work.

02:14:22.000 You can do both.

02:14:23.000 I mean, but there are some groups.

02:14:25.000 Undoubtedly, you take one personality.

02:14:27.000 It's just never the same.

02:14:28.000 Yeah, with Kiss, it's got to be Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley.

02:14:32.000 With the Stones, it's got to be Keith Richards and Mick Jagger.

02:14:37.000 Yeah, well, and now, well, you've had Ron Wood for, what, 45 years?

02:14:44.000 I don't know.

02:14:46.000 And Charlie Watts, of course.

02:14:47.000 But you've seen, there's like 40 people on that stage.

02:14:50.000 Yeah, there's a lot of people up there, right?

02:14:52.000 Yeah, so, but what used to work doesn't work all, you know, you can't, like with Zeppelin we're around, I'd like to think they wouldn't have...

02:15:00.000 You know, auxiliary members.

02:15:03.000 But, you know, if you have a long career, like the Stones, and you've got your disco records from the 70s, and you've got a lot of percussion, yeah, people kind of want that full show, as long as the core people are up there.

02:15:13.000 Bill Wyman's been gone.

02:15:14.000 Do you know how long he's been gone already?

02:15:16.000 How long?

02:15:16.000 Like 35 years or something.

02:15:18.000 He's been gone forever.

02:15:18.000 Wow.

02:15:19.000 Yeah.

02:15:21.000 Do you get together with other rock stars and just have a conversation about the business?

02:15:27.000 We're doing that.

02:15:27.000 Well, you're a rock star.

02:15:28.000 I'm a comedian.

02:15:28.000 It's the same thing, isn't it?

02:15:30.000 Sort of.

02:15:31.000 You're funnier than most guys in bands.

02:15:36.000 You know what's nice about you?

02:15:38.000 You don't play guitar better than me.

02:15:39.000 Ah, that's nice.

02:15:40.000 That's refreshing for me.

02:15:43.000 Well, yeah, I have friends who are musicians.

02:15:48.000 One of the things about comedy is we all get together and we talk about the art form a lot.

02:15:53.000 One of the beautiful things about podcasts is we've had so many conversations with comics where we talk about how you do it, what's the process.

02:16:02.000 Do you guys do that?

02:16:03.000 Do you get together with other musicians?

02:16:06.000 Yeah, we do, but there's a certain amount of it that you can have a dialogue about and then there's a certain amount of it that none of us know what the hell we're doing.

02:16:14.000 Yeah, just going by feel.

02:16:16.000 Well, yeah, and you just, you know, if anybody ever asks me, like, well, any advice on how to write songs?

02:16:21.000 Like, no, I don't, no.

02:16:23.000 Do you have inspiration that comes out of nowhere, or do you have specific times where you sit down and write?

02:16:29.000 Your best ideas come out of nowhere when you're not ready for it.

02:16:32.000 That's the stuff that's gonna be your song.

02:16:34.000 But the rest of it, you gotta go home, you gotta go to work.

02:16:36.000 You know what I mean?

02:16:37.000 You might have an idea for a bit.

02:16:39.000 Ooh, that's funny, but you just heard something came to you.

02:16:42.000 But now you can already, immediately, you're aware of how much work it's gonna take to surround this thing and make it your bit.

02:16:48.000 And that's what songs are like.

02:16:49.000 You get this idea, and it's thrill.

02:16:54.000 Of like, that could be a great song.

02:16:56.000 But the rest of it's not gonna just fall on your head.

02:16:58.000 The rest of it, you gotta go home and now you gotta put it all together, make it become something.

02:17:05.000 But do you ever just sit down and try to have a writing session with just a blank piece of paper?

02:17:11.000 Yeah, it's the worst.

02:17:13.000 Well, right, we're just like, you know, hey, listen, you got that flight in two hours, here's some paper, you need some jokes.

02:17:19.000 Like, it's hard, isn't it?

02:17:20.000 I mean, it's forced, it's difficult.

02:17:22.000 I can do that, I have to do this sometimes.

02:17:24.000 But the stuff that's lasted longer for me or been more enjoyed, we'd say, is the stuff that was not like that.

02:17:32.000 I used to hear that when I was younger.

02:17:33.000 Keith Richard would say that he doesn't write songs, he's an antenna.

02:17:37.000 And I was just like, what are you talking about?

02:17:39.000 Or some people receive them as gifts like maybe God, I don't know.

02:17:43.000 I don't think God's writing songs for anybody in a pop band anytime soon.

02:17:46.000 I don't think that's how it works.

02:17:48.000 I had more of a cynical idea about it.

02:17:51.000 I do kind of get the receptor antenna bit now a little bit more.

02:17:55.000 Yeah.

02:17:56.000 Because that part of your brain that your automatic writing is?

02:17:59.000 Mm-hmm.

02:18:00.000 Have you heard of that?

02:18:01.000 Yeah.

02:18:01.000 You have to be in a certain state to do it, and I've done it when I didn't expect it.

02:18:04.000 It's crazy that you actually just shut down.

02:18:06.000 You could be so inside that these things will come out, you'll write them down, and like, They literally will make you into some kind of zombie phase and it happened.

02:18:15.000 It's real.

02:18:15.000 It's a real thing.

02:18:16.000 I believe it.

02:18:17.000 I'd heard about it for a long time and then it happened to me.

02:18:19.000 The best songs are kind of like that.

02:18:21.000 If you're open, you kind of leave your brain clear.

02:18:26.000 These ideas will come to you and they're going to come to only you probably.

02:18:29.000 So that in itself makes it a unique idea.

02:18:32.000 And then hopefully you've got some level of ability and skill set to put that together in the song that you or yourself or someone else might want to listen to for three and a half minutes.

02:18:41.000 Like they're coming out of something that's not your conscious mind.

02:18:45.000 They're coming out of some form.

02:18:46.000 Exactly.

02:18:47.000 Well, those ideas.

02:18:48.000 Connecting these thoughts.

02:18:49.000 Maybe the germ, the idea.

02:18:50.000 I mean, most songwriters you talk to will tell you the same thing.

02:18:53.000 When you have to sit down and really focus on it, you can do that.

02:18:56.000 We all have to at times.

02:18:59.000 But the better ones are the ones you just can't explain why you got that.

02:19:02.000 But don't over-intellectualize it that it's a gift from anybody.

02:19:05.000 Right, right, right.

02:19:06.000 It's not.

02:19:06.000 It's just a song.

02:19:07.000 That's all it is.

02:19:08.000 Okay?

02:19:10.000 Don't make a big deal out of it.

02:19:12.000 You're not special.

02:19:13.000 Let's leave it with that.

02:19:14.000 Yeah.

02:19:14.000 Let's end with that.

02:19:15.000 Okay.

02:19:16.000 Don't make a big deal out of it.

02:19:17.000 You're not special.

02:19:18.000 Yeah.

02:19:19.000 Well, thanks, man.

02:19:19.000 I appreciate it.

02:19:20.000 Likewise.

02:19:21.000 Hey, real quick before I go, is this a Stormtrooper or is it just- It's a lighter.

02:19:24.000 I know, but is this supposed to be a Stormtrooper?

02:19:26.000 It could be.

02:19:27.000 Has no one else mentioned that before?

02:19:30.000 No, but I thought it does.

02:19:32.000 Definitely Stormtrooper-esque.

02:19:34.000 Okay.

02:19:34.000 I think that new Lamborghini, is it a Lamborghini that has the SUV? Yes.

02:19:39.000 That looks like a Stormtrooper too.

02:19:40.000 It does a little bit.

02:19:41.000 Yeah.

02:19:41.000 If you get a white and black one.

02:19:42.000 That's what I'm talking about.

02:19:43.000 That's what I'm talking about.

02:19:44.000 Do you drive anything crazy like that?

02:19:46.000 No.

02:19:46.000 What do you drive?

02:19:47.000 You seem like maybe an old Volkswagen type guy or maybe something cool.

02:19:53.000 Like an old BMW or something like that.

02:19:55.000 No, I have a 67 Firebird.

02:19:57.000 Ooh, now you're talking my lingo.

02:19:59.000 A show car.

02:20:00.000 You don't drive it?

02:20:01.000 No, I mean, it's not a jacked up car.

02:20:03.000 There's no, like, you know, there's no, like, eight ball gear shifting.

02:20:07.000 It's a show car, meaning it's all original.

02:20:09.000 They're all original and restored.

02:20:11.000 Yeah, and then when I actually want to go places and also go home, I have a Jeep.

02:20:14.000 Oh, okay.

02:20:15.000 It was vintage cars. 0.99

02:20:17.000 Yeah, because when you were talking about Lamborghinis, I'm like, there's no way Jacob Dillon drives a fucking Lamborghini. 0.98

02:20:22.000 No. 0.98

02:20:23.000 No, there's...

02:20:24.000 I mean, a cool car is a cool car.

02:20:25.000 I got no problem with them.

02:20:27.000 I just...

02:20:27.000 More practical than that.

02:20:28.000 If it moved me, I'd get one.

02:20:30.000 Did you ever get a Rockstar car?

02:20:31.000 Something crazy?

02:20:32.000 My 67 Firebird.

02:20:32.000 That's it?

02:20:33.000 That's a Rockstar car, isn't it?

02:20:34.000 It is a Rockstar car.

02:20:35.000 I used to actually...

02:20:36.000 I had another 67 Firebird.

02:20:38.000 You've had more than one?

02:20:39.000 Well, yeah, I had one 20-something years ago, a red one that I'd...

02:20:43.000 Wasn't the best one, and then a couple years ago got another one. 0.99

02:20:45.000 It's a great fucking car. 0.99

02:20:46.000 It's cool. 1.00

02:20:47.000 I mean, you know those cars? 0.99

02:20:49.000 Oh, fuck yeah. 1.00

02:20:49.000 Oh my God, I'm a collector. 1.00

02:20:51.000 You know what?

02:20:51.000 But that car, the Firebird, obviously you know you could have the Camaro, but isn't the guy who noticed that the Firebird is the one you want?

02:20:58.000 That's the guy.

02:20:59.000 Because that's like...

02:21:01.000 When we drive it, if somebody says, you know, nice Mustang, it's like, okay, thank you.

02:21:07.000 Or if they say, nice Camaro, right on.

02:21:10.000 And if somebody says, nice Firebird, it's like, oh, you're in the know.

02:21:13.000 You know, yeah.

02:21:14.000 It's cool, because it just kind of slipped right through those muscle cars, but it's the one.

02:21:18.000 Yeah.

02:21:18.000 Oh, it's a great car.

02:21:19.000 Yeah, it's cool.

02:21:20.000 It's one of many.

02:21:21.000 It's not the one, though.

02:21:22.000 Which would be yours from that era.

02:21:25.000 I'm talking the muscle cars, you know, not the jacked-up ones.

02:21:29.000 Because that's that sweet year right in there, the late 60s.

02:21:32.000 Yeah.

02:21:32.000 The 67 stuff I always liked because they were messing with the future.

02:21:36.000 Everything had a Jetsons vibe.

02:21:39.000 I have a 1965 Corvette convertible. 1.00

02:21:42.000 That's the shit. 1.00

02:21:43.000 I like those. 1.00

02:21:44.000 I like the early 70s ones too.

02:21:45.000 Those are great.

02:21:46.000 That's a great shape.

02:21:47.000 It was like 68, I think they changed over to the third body shape.

02:21:53.000 It might have been 67. You know what's the one I really like?

02:21:55.000 I wish they made a convertible.

02:21:56.000 Some people have chopped them, but I wouldn't do that.

02:21:58.000 It's the Riviera, like the 65. Oh, yeah.

02:22:02.000 I mean, that's a beautiful car.

02:22:03.000 That's a beautiful car.

02:22:04.000 And they did not make a convertible.

02:22:05.000 No.

02:22:06.000 Well, if they did, it would be so floppy anyway.

02:22:09.000 It wouldn't have any agility.

02:22:09.000 Yeah, I mean, if you look them up, you'll see one and you'll think they did, but those are modded.

02:22:12.000 Somebody cut the top off.

02:22:14.000 Yeah, that era of cars was, in a lot of ways, like that era of music.

02:22:18.000 It was beautiful and wild and so different than anything that came before it.

02:22:23.000 Yeah, and you know what I did not know is John DeLorean had a lot to do.

02:22:25.000 You know, he designed the Firebird.

02:22:26.000 Did he really?

02:22:27.000 Yeah.

02:22:27.000 DeLorean did?

02:22:29.000 Wow.

02:22:30.000 Yeah, you can look that up.

02:22:30.000 Actually, the coolest car is what he designed, I forget what it was called, late 60s, and it didn't take off.

02:22:38.000 They did make like maybe six of them, and it looks exactly like a Firebird and a Corvette combined.

02:22:44.000 What's it called?

02:22:45.000 Can we look that up?

02:22:46.000 Because I want you to see that.

02:22:47.000 If you look up DeLorean, like his first...

02:22:51.000 It's like late 60s.

02:22:53.000 Let's see what we can get on that.

02:22:54.000 You should see this car.

02:22:56.000 I mean, it looks like a fake car.

02:22:58.000 Because it's just like, how come I never saw that before?

02:23:01.000 And why didn't they make that?

02:23:03.000 But then there was...

02:23:04.000 Well, this had nothing to do with his ultimate demise, John DeLorean.

02:23:08.000 But if we could find that car, are you seeing anything?

02:23:11.000 I was looking through an article.

02:23:12.000 I thought it was going to have it.

02:23:13.000 It didn't.

02:23:17.000 How would you look that up?

02:23:19.000 John DeLorean 60s...

02:23:21.000 And there's the Firebird, but...

02:23:23.000 No, that's...

02:23:24.000 There's the Firebird...

02:23:26.000 Oh, look, bottom right...

02:23:26.000 What's that?

02:23:27.000 This thing?

02:23:28.000 What's that?

02:23:29.000 Oh, what is that?

02:23:30.000 That's it?

02:23:31.000 That's not it.

02:23:32.000 What is that?

02:23:32.000 High output?

02:23:33.000 What the fuck is that thing? 0.99

02:23:34.000 That looks weird. 0.99

02:23:35.000 69 Pontiac Farago.

02:23:37.000 Oh, it's right there.

02:23:39.000 The Banshee.

02:23:40.000 64 Banshee.

02:23:41.000 Look at that.

02:23:42.000 Whoa! 0.71

02:23:43.000 That's not a Corvette?

02:23:44.000 No.

02:23:48.000 64 Pontiac Banshee.

02:23:50.000 Isn't that cool?

02:23:51.000 Oh, so it's a concept car.

02:23:52.000 Yeah, I don't think the...

02:23:54.000 No, but there are like...

02:23:55.000 God, that's so pretty.

02:23:56.000 Isn't that cool?

02:23:57.000 That's beautiful.

02:23:58.000 It actually looks like a fiber in a Corvette.

02:24:00.000 Is it a metal Corvette looking?

02:24:02.000 I mean, it's a metal shape.

02:24:03.000 It's not fiberglass, right?

02:24:04.000 I don't know, though.

02:24:05.000 God, it's so similar to the Corvette.

02:24:07.000 Look, it's real.

02:24:07.000 There it is.

02:24:08.000 Isn't that cool?

02:24:09.000 Yeah, it's pretty sweet.

02:24:11.000 Look at how it opens up.

02:24:13.000 And it has kind of like Firebird-esque rear, what is it looking like from the rear?

02:24:18.000 The tail lights, yeah.

02:24:19.000 If you can see those, those are like the Firebird.

02:24:21.000 Right there.

02:24:22.000 Oh, wow. 0.99

02:24:23.000 That's fucking beautiful. 0.99

02:24:25.000 Wild that they never made that. 0.99

02:24:26.000 Yeah, Joey, you make some money, you should try to track one down.

02:24:30.000 No.

02:24:32.000 There are a handful.

02:24:33.000 Yeah, but those are...

02:24:35.000 I don't like old cars with old brakes and old engines.

02:24:39.000 Oh, no.

02:24:39.000 I like restobots.

02:24:40.000 Yeah, I'm with you on that.

02:24:41.000 You want like a 54 pickup truck with a laptop under the hood.

02:24:45.000 I want something where there's brakes that work and a suspension that turns.

02:24:50.000 No, I'm with you on that.

02:24:51.000 Look at the back of a Firebird.

02:24:52.000 Beautiful.

02:24:53.000 Yeah.

02:24:55.000 No, I'm with you on that.

02:24:56.000 There's certain things, but we got better at some things.

02:24:58.000 Yeah.

02:24:59.000 Our brakes got better.

02:25:00.000 Yes, yes.

02:25:00.000 They're still tricky to drive because they're not really designed for it, but there's some companies now that take old cars like that and they do a different chassis.

02:25:09.000 Yeah.

02:25:09.000 So they'll put on a different frame and a different modern suspension.

02:25:13.000 I mean, I get it, but something cool about driving an original one, it's a pain in the ass to maintain at times, that's for sure.

02:25:20.000 $750,000, woo!

02:25:23.000 Wow.

02:25:24.000 It was whack to save Corvette.

02:25:26.000 Oh.

02:25:27.000 What does that mean?

02:25:28.000 It's a Corvette killer.

02:25:30.000 Because Chevrolet threatened Chevrolet with performance potential.

02:25:35.000 Yeah, I mean, it looks a little bit too much like a Corvette, too.

02:25:38.000 Yeah.

02:25:39.000 Quite honestly.

02:25:40.000 Let's not get one.

02:25:41.000 Let's not.

02:25:41.000 Jacob, thank you very much for being here, man.

02:25:43.000 I really enjoyed it.

02:25:44.000 Likewise.

02:25:44.000 I really appreciate it.

02:25:45.000 And your new album is out.

02:25:47.000 It is July...

02:25:48.000 What's this Friday?

02:25:50.000 Is this Friday?

02:25:51.000 Okay.

02:25:51.000 So is that the 8th or the 9th?

02:25:52.000 Yes.

02:25:52.000 Today's the 6th.

02:25:53.000 We're recording this in the 6th.

02:25:54.000 Yeah, and I should say that we are...

02:25:56.000 I'm not going to be getting in the bus doing the full summer touring, but we are out there playing in August.

02:26:01.000 You have a list, though.

02:26:01.000 You do have a list.

02:26:02.000 Yeah, I'm not going to sit here to read this.

02:26:03.000 They wanted me, but...

02:26:04.000 They wanted you to?

02:26:05.000 Look, I mean, can you even read that?

02:26:06.000 No.

02:26:07.000 Yeah, I mean, look.

02:26:07.000 Can you even read that?

02:26:09.000 I can't without glasses.

02:26:10.000 I don't know if I could with glasses.

02:26:13.000 Anyway, we are going to be playing.

02:26:16.000 The record's out this Friday.

02:26:17.000 There you go.

02:26:17.000 Jamie's found it.

02:26:18.000 Oh, I'll have to read over it.

02:26:18.000 Okay, so you're in Huntington, New York, Lexington, Massachusetts, East Greenwich, Rhode Island, Alexandria, Virginia, Brooklyn, New York, a lot of places.

02:26:28.000 Is there a website?

02:26:29.000 Yeah.

02:26:30.000 It wasn't on and whatnot I could find.

02:26:32.000 How'd you find this?

02:26:33.000 I got sent that in an email.

02:26:34.000 Oh, the email.

02:26:35.000 Okay.

02:26:36.000 Yeah, we got a street team.

02:26:38.000 Street team will holler at you folks. 0.94

02:26:40.000 Thank you.

02:26:41.000 All right, buddy.

02:26:41.000 Thanks, brother.

02:26:42.000 Appreciate it.

02:26:42.000 Bye, everybody.

The Joe Rogan Experience - July 07, 2021

Joe Rogan Experience #1680 - Jakob Dylan

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Transcript