In this episode of The Joe Rogan Experience, Joe talks to physics professor and UFO enthusiast, Bob Lazar. They discuss UFOs and their impact on our understanding of the universe, and whether or not they are real. Joe also talks about his obsession with UFOs, and why he thinks they might be more than just a figment of our imaginations... and how he came to the conclusion that the existence of UFOs might not be as crazy as everyone thinks it is... and that they may not be so weird after all. Joe and Bob discuss this and much more, including the "Bob Lazar Phenomenon" and whether it's real or not, and if it's even possible to be real at all, and what we can learn from it, and how we can make sense of it... and why it's not so crazy after all... it might be real after all! If you like conspiracy theories, this episode is for you. Joe and I are working on a podcast about UFOs, so if you're interested in learning more about them, then you should check it out! If not, then join us on our FB page: . Thanks for listening and share the podcast with your friends and tell us what you think about it! Cheers, Joe and the rest of your thoughts on this episode! Timestamps: 3:00 - Is it real or fake? 4:30 - What's the truth? 5:20 - Who's the real? 6:15 - Who is the most likely to know the truth about UFOs? 7:00 8:40 - What are the most important thing about them? 9:20 10:00 | What are they really doing it? 11:30 | What do they think about? 12:15 | What would you like to know? 13:30 14:40 15:20 | Is it possible? 16:40 | What is it really? 17: Does it matter? 18:10 | How do they exist? 19:30 // Is it true? 21:30 Is it a real thing? 22:10 27:30 What do you think they're real or is it not? ? 26:10 - What does it matter to you know about it? 27:40 // What are you think it s really important? 29:00 // What would they think of it?
00:02:48.000If you had just decided that it was all horseshit, what changed your perspective?
00:02:53.000Okay, this is a really weird and interesting question.
00:02:55.000I had a different puzzle that I've been working on for years, which has to do with physics and is important to me in my work and what I care about, which is there is this crazy history between around 1953 and 1973 With an explosion of activity that sometimes goes under the name of the golden age of general relativity,
00:03:20.000where general relativity was sort of put in final form in the teens by Einstein and also Marcel Grossman, who never gets the credit for the original papers, I think, on general relativity.
00:03:34.000There's always like some guy behind the scenes that actually wrote for Shakespeare.
00:03:39.000Einstein is the genius, but he had a mathematical friend whose father saved Einstein, I think got him the patent job.
00:03:47.000And there's like a meeting called the Marcel Grossman meeting.
00:03:50.000So he's a shadowy figure on the edge of the Einstein legend.
00:03:53.000I don't think he deserves the credit Einstein did, but if you look at the first paper in General Relativity, Before Einstein says anything concrete, the first paper he says something vague.
00:04:04.000That's 1913. And that's with Grossman.
00:04:06.000The next paper he says something wrong.
00:04:27.000So then it goes silent and effectively the smart kids are all following Bohr because Bohr and the quantum – Have so many open problems, whereas general relativity seems like pretty much a closed book.
00:04:42.000And that's until 1953. And something very bizarre happens in 1953, which we can get to, but then there's 20 years of explosion in general relativity, which, you know, you've had Roger Penrose on your program before,
00:04:57.000so he comes from that era, and Stephen Hawking was interior to that era.
00:05:02.000Richard Feynman of all people was very active and gave lectures at Caltech.
00:05:09.000So my entry point was that when I was a young guy at the University of Pennsylvania, When I'd come home to L.A. for break, I'd go out to Caltech, and I would park in Feynman or Gelman's parking spaces, which I just thought was the coolest thing in the world,
00:05:25.000that these people, these gods, had little, you know, stones with their names stenciled on it.
00:05:30.000So I would go park in Feynman's space, and I would go to the Caltech bookstore, and I found that there was something that was sold there that at the time I don't think was sold anywhere else, which was like the Feynman Lectures on Gravitation, 1962 to 63. And they were It was like,
00:05:47.000Feynman says, I don't know how Einstein did his thing, but imagine that you didn't have the insight that this was all geometric based on a guy named Bernard Riemann's notion of what differential geometry is, sort of the smooth surface geometry of curvature.
00:06:02.000And Feynman says, let's just imagine this was an ordinary field theory.
00:06:05.000Am I, Richard Feynman, smart enough to figure out the geometry just proceeding as if I was a particle theorist?
00:06:13.000And this is a very strange and interesting, wonderful thing to do.
00:06:19.000My question is, what happened between 1953 and 1973?
00:06:24.000Because the reason that I'm in part really animated right now is that this month, February 1st of 2023, is the exact 50th year anniversary of the stagnation In particle theory, as measured by the movement from the standard model.
00:06:42.000So the standard model in general relativity are the two basic theories, the theory of the very small, the theory of the very large.
00:06:49.000They're incompatible in a certain level, but they're very similar looking at a different level.
00:06:53.000So this has been driving people crazy.
00:06:55.000And I say, you know, in 1973, Crocodile Rock was the number one song, or the entire yellow ribbon around the old oak tree.
00:07:04.000Imagine that song being at the top of the pops For 50 years with no respite.
00:07:21.000How did the world's smartest community stagnate this badly?
00:07:38.000And for almost 20 years, until 1947, we couldn't compute with this first quantum field theory, quantum electrodynamics, otherwise known as QED. And suddenly, in 1947, we held a conference at Shelter Island in the tip of Long Island.
00:07:56.000And they didn't invite the old people as much as they invited the young people coming after the success of the Manhattan Project.
00:08:02.000Now, the Manhattan Project gets remembered by us as a physics project, but it was really engineering because the theorists were unable to fight their way out of a paper bag.
00:08:11.000So we gave them an engineering project and they completely crushed it, right?
00:08:17.000So we had a pretty good idea of who was smart, and people like Feynman were smart.
00:08:21.000So we held this weird, cheap conference at Shelter Island at the Rams Head Inn, and Feynman figured out that, along with a guy named Julian Schwinger and another guy named Tomonaga in Japan, that there was a stupid error, like a really boneheaded,
00:08:37.000you know, I can't find my keys for 20 years, and then you realize, oh, they're in my pocket.
00:08:42.000So this thing had to do with the fact that there were two concepts of mass.
00:09:06.000It appears to be slightly more massive because it takes more force to drag a cup across wood than it does across ice because of the coefficient of friction.
00:09:15.000That number is the effective mass or the dressed mass.
00:09:19.000And we thought that that was the real mass.
00:09:21.000And we had those two numbers set equal.
00:09:23.000And when we realized that they weren't the same number, suddenly the theory yielded.
00:09:54.000And then I always set this problem this way.
00:09:57.000I say, if you subtract the screens in our lives, so there are phones, the flat screen TVs, all that stuff, and you forget about style issues because style changes.
00:10:15.000But just in terms of technology, like, the distance between 1952, where we have the first thermonuclear device in the test known as Ivy Mike, and 1902, before we even have powered flight, is like 10,000 years.
00:12:01.000Whereas with a Tesla, it's just you know that if you turn the wheel, it'll turn the actual wheels that are on the road, but you don't feel them.
00:12:21.000If you listen to John Mayer, for example, talking about what's wrong with modeling amplifiers, You know, you can get $100,000 worth of equipment in one of these little boxes, but a tube amp is hard to replace because there's something special in analog technology of a different time,
00:12:39.000where you pass current through a pickup, and that magnet, you know, there's magic that happens between wood and magnets and steel, right?
00:12:55.000You don't want to drive when in traffic, but if it's just you enjoying driving, there's nothing like a stick shift.
00:13:02.000This is where they lose the focus with computers.
00:13:06.000It's like you're taking away one of the best things about driving, which is the enjoyment of driving, and you're replacing it with tenths of a second.
00:13:15.000That no one's going to notice, and you really shouldn't notice anyway, because they're all ridiculously fast.
00:13:20.000Yeah, but this train will not slow down.
00:13:24.000Well, I get it, but people need to understand, just from a human perspective, you will enjoy driving a manual car more.
00:13:36.000If you have any fucking spark left in you, when you're on a windy road, you want to go...
00:13:42.000Even if you're not driving fast, it's so much more fun.
00:13:45.000If I'm not mistaken, the Rolls-Royce had to put sound back in because they'd subtracted so much sound through their patented insulation system.
00:14:00.000They're talking about doing that for Ferraris because they're going to make an EV Ferrari.
00:14:04.000So if they made an electrical Ferrari, they're talking about making fake Ferrari noises, which is just an atrocious thing to come out of Italy.
00:14:47.000Okay, but so getting back to the whole UFO thing and the progress...
00:14:52.000We don't realize what percentage of life was determined by physics, right?
00:14:57.000So, for example, Wi-Fi and all the communication is the electromagnetic spectrum, including radio waves.
00:15:03.000We don't realize the semiconductor, which created the logic gate.
00:15:09.000All we did was scale it up, and now it's chat GPT. The number of things that have changed the world, whether it's the World Wide Web coming out of CERN, Physics is really what has moved the dial, including molecular biology,
00:15:39.000And to have a 50-year stagnation, particularly—and I want to draw a really important contrast—1968 was the year we discovered the quark.
00:15:51.000So in every proton, there are three valence quarks, two of them named up, one of them named down.
00:15:56.000In a neutron, it's two downs and one up.
00:15:59.000So that's how we—neutrons and protons are not fundamental.
00:16:03.000When we found the neutron, it was in 1932. So my aunt, Judy, shout out to Aunt Judy in Philadelphia, is older than the neutron.
00:16:12.000And the neutron doomed us as a species.
00:16:15.000Like that one discovery more or less indicated that if we do not leave this world, we will die here in short order.
00:16:22.000Because if you throw a proton at a very heavy nucleus, It doesn't crash into the nucleus.
00:16:30.000You've got all these protons in the center that are all positively charged and this one guy is coming in, you know, at high speed and all these massive protons say, you know, like charges repel and this thing just runs away like a scaredy cat.
00:17:08.000I think it was by 38, this woman named Lise Meitner figures out the chain reaction.
00:17:14.000By 42, 10 years after the discovery of the neutron, Enrico Fermi and something called Chicago Pile 1, CP1, crazily does a controlled chain reaction under the bleachers of the University of Chicago, shout out to the University of Chicago Stadium,
00:17:30.000which could have obliterated the city of Chicago if it had gone critical, right?
00:17:37.000So we trusted the city of Chicago to Enrico Fermi's calculation.
00:17:42.000By 45, you get Trinity and the two bombs we drop on Japan.
00:17:47.000And then in 1952, game over, you have Ivy Mike and the first thermonuclear weapon based on the Teller-Ulam design, which uses the fission bomb just for foreplay as the detonator.
00:18:01.000That causes the waves to go out and radiate out against the shell.
00:18:05.000And I think we still don't talk exactly how we do it.
00:18:07.000And then they bounce off and they compress this rod and core.
00:18:10.000And then you get fusion rather than fission.
00:18:12.000And suddenly you're harnessing the power of the sun.
00:18:15.000And that's when you don't even worry about ducking cover because thermonuclear is such a leap above fission devices.
00:18:23.000And that's such a leap above conventional devices.
00:18:26.000That it takes 20 years for us to become God, right?
00:18:51.000Oh, and Francis Crick, physicist discovering the three-dimensional structure of DNA and then the transfer hypothesis where you translate DNA into messenger RNA, which gets red in ribosomes.
00:19:05.000All of these things changed the world and effectively gave us so much power that we don't know how to control it.
00:19:14.000And we were so scared for 70 years because it's six months between 1952 and 53 where we discover both the atom and the cell and how they work in terms of this forbidden knowledge.
00:19:29.000We were so scared that we behaved ourselves.
00:20:15.000We can talk about whether he got set up in a coup or who he really is, whether he was an actor, etc., etc., But at some point, I think I heard him, I had to go back to like the Russian and Ukrainian speeches in order to try to,
00:20:30.000I don't speak much Russian, I don't speak any Ukrainian, but they're closely related languages.
00:20:34.000And he calls for like preventive strikes.
00:20:43.000I thought, why is this person allowed to address Congress?
00:20:49.000You have somebody who – and I want to be very clear about this.
00:20:55.000I really find it disgusting what Vladimir Putin did invading Ukraine.
00:21:02.000But if you look historically at the killing and the borders of Eastern and Central Europe, they have gone back and forth Like, nobody's business.
00:21:13.000When you ask somebody like me, an American Ashkenazi Jew, where did your family come from?
00:21:17.000You always get the same weird response.
00:21:19.000It's like, oh, it was a part of Belarusia that went back and forth between Poland, Ukraine, Moldova, Lithuania, because it's fluid, right?
00:21:29.000And so when we say we respect the territorial integrity of Ukraine, We were fighting right now in Lvov, like the Ukrainians were fighting in Lvov, eight seconds by hypersonic missile from Article V territory since 1999 in Poland.
00:21:50.000I was in Providence, Rhode Island with my son and I get this alert on my phone and it says, two people are dead in Poland with a presumptive strike by a Russian missile.
00:22:04.000I'm thinking, did I read two Polish people dead in an Article 5 full NATO member since 1999?
00:22:53.000So my family basically is scattered, you know, was scattered throughout the shtetls of Ukraine.
00:22:58.000And I've been over there in 89. We Americans do not understand Central and Eastern Europe, period, the end.
00:23:09.000And for us to be making these commitments and not understanding how Russians think and how Ukrainians think and how Poles think and how the fighting works, I don't think we know what we're doing.
00:23:22.000I think we're creating a doomsday machine.
00:23:24.000And I – the reason that we – it's not like Zelensky isn't wronged by Putin.
00:25:12.000Right now, you don't realize in 2004, we let Latvia and Lithuania into NATO membership.
00:25:20.000And I remember thinking at the time, what the hell are we doing?
00:25:23.000It's not like I don't understand that we want to protect them.
00:25:26.000It's not like I don't understand that you want to say that they're independent nations.
00:25:29.000But these were former Soviet republics.
00:25:32.000And there's two ways of thinking about it.
00:25:34.000You can put on one set of glasses and say, well, these are nations that get to decide what they want and who's to tell them what to do.
00:25:40.000And then there's another thing called spheres of influence, where it's like, that's the Russian sphere of influence.
00:25:44.000If you are not playing with both of these sets of lenses, you're not playing the game.
00:25:49.000And the number of people who just have one set of these glasses on They're only seeing the infrared or they're only seeing the ultraviolet.
00:25:56.000It's like, no, you need to oscillate back and forth and understand what you're doing.
00:26:00.000So I think Zelensky, and I'm scared to say this because I know I'm going to get just nothing but hate We created a situation by pretending that we didn't understand the spheres of influence glasses.
00:26:12.000We very well understand the sovereignty glasses.
00:26:16.000And we are now creating a doomsday machine that we do not understand.
00:26:20.000And the world is going to go multipolar, and we don't have the skill to play this game, period.
00:26:25.000Do you think part of the problem is that the amount of people that have actually gone to war in this country, first of all, there's people that are in the army or in all the armed forces,
00:26:43.000There's no national requirement to join the military like there is in Israel and like there is in South Korea and many other countries.
00:26:54.000The people that have experience with the war are the ones that are telling you this is dangerous.
00:26:58.000People like yourself are telling us this is dangerous.
00:27:00.000But to the rest of the world, to the rest of this country, there's a real problem with day-to-day existence because day-to-day existence is tricky.
00:27:08.000And it gives you parameters which you exist in, but they're not real.
00:27:32.000And I don't think people that show up every day at the same Starbucks and then get on the highway and go to their office and repeat every fucking day, I don't think they think of that as a real option in the world.
00:27:49.000So you've got people walking around completely dissociated because everything in their daily environment tells them to pick up the dry cleaning.
00:29:20.000Most of them, I don't think, have figured out that they're starved for information, and I'm going to say something very heterodox to the heterodoxy.
00:29:30.000The heterodoxy was never meant to take over for the orthodoxy.
00:29:34.000The orthodoxy was something that needed correction.
00:29:37.000The purpose of the heterodoxy is to say, you're 12 degrees off, you're 3 degrees off.
00:29:42.000What do you do when you're like 168 degrees off?
00:29:47.000The fine-tuning that heterodoxy can do is not sufficient to correct the ship.
00:31:32.000When Trump created ambiguities, or now the Biden group is creating ambiguities by not telling us what's actually going on, you don't know how serious this East Palestine-Ohio spill is.
00:31:44.000Is this something that's going to burn off pretty easily, or is this getting into the corn crop that's going to be found in all processed food?
00:32:05.000Why would his derangement towards Trump?
00:32:09.000Sam made one terrible call with Trump.
00:32:13.000He said that he was the evil Chauncey Gardner, like a simpleton, like Mr. Magoo, just happens to wander into the Oval Office as the first president with zero government experience, including the armed services.
00:34:26.000Concentrate on something you get really good at it and if you concentrate on something and trying to improve on something whether it's playing chess or Whether it is business you get really good at it and in the meanwhile you might not be good at interpersonal relationships You might not be good at the way you communicate with people you might not be good at but you have some weird That you're doing that seems to be successful and you're putting all your energy into that.
00:35:46.000If they got in debate about religion, if they got in debate about certain things that Sam is, like neuroscience, certain things that Sam is very educated in, he's so good at debates.
00:35:59.000It's like being a black belt that's used to tapping people all the time.
00:36:02.000And then you see this guy, he's winning debates against people because he's calling them like, what does he call, Lion Ted, and he gives people nicknames, and I think If I was Sam, and I was as good at debate as Sam is, I would go,
00:37:10.000So this is why if you sit down with one of these, like if you and I are at the beach, right, and we've got the world's greatest beach volleyball team on one side, and the world's greatest CPAC Tuckero team on the other side, it's a ball, it's a net, and it's three dudes, okay?
00:39:32.000So if you're going to have a – and some would say, well, he's not capable of having a good faith conversation, but that's the only way to do it.
00:39:39.000The only way to do it is to have an open-ended timeframe where you could just – until this fucking thing is resolved or until we all give up, you guys can talk.
00:41:38.000Hiroge Sato's controversial- Thick sponge bat that caused a revolution in table tennis.
00:41:43.000But also, wouldn't it slow the ball down because of the softness of it?
00:41:49.000I would imagine it would give you more control.
00:41:51.000It seems like it would do both of those things.
00:41:54.000Maybe it would slow the ball down a little bit because it's got a little bit of smush to it.
00:41:58.000And I think that would almost be like a change-up in like a pitching situation, where someone's throwing a ball, you're expecting it to be 90 miles an hour instead of 60, and you're like, motherfucker!
00:44:12.000So what I wanted to know was why during the 1950s did something happen that resulted in a 70-year stagnation in a field called quantum gravity.
00:44:25.000Quantum gravity is like a startup that cannot ship a product after 70 years.
00:44:32.000And it's still taken over in theoretical physics as sort of the prestige theory field.
00:44:38.000And quantum gravity, is there an application for this that they were attempting to achieve?
00:45:29.000And around 1984, we gradually had unified field theory become sort of like a joke, old-timey expression for the future of physics.
00:45:40.000And we substituted quantum gravity for the merger of quantum theory, quantum field theory, quantum mechanics, and gravitational physics under general relativity.
00:45:58.000How is it that the field became convinced that something which clearly doesn't seem to work and has had all of the resources, all of the best minds at its disposal, it sucks up everything, and it just doesn't work?
00:46:40.000Between 1973 and 1984, or let's say 74 to 84, because we'll group 73 to 53, you have 10 years of super exciting guesses about the extension of our understanding.
00:46:56.000Things called supersymmetry, grand unified theory, technicolor.
00:47:02.000These are really responsible guesses, axions.
00:47:06.000And somebody like Sean Carroll or Neil deGrasse Tyson might talk to you about these things when they come in here.
00:47:13.000In 1984, there's an earthquake called the anomaly cancellation.
00:47:20.000And a failed theory of strong physics, the physics needed to glue two protons together in a helium nucleus because they both hate each other because of electromagnetism and want to separate, but something is binding them together like a family structure, right?
00:47:36.000That force we initially tried to fix by thinking of it as strings.
00:47:40.000We'll put like elastic bands between things and it'll pull things back together.
00:47:46.000But then we repurposed it and said, no, no, no, it's quantum gravity and...
00:47:51.000One single individual who is the most dominant mind on planet Earth at the moment, effectively Voldemort, the person whose name we are a little bit afraid to invoke and cause wrath, said in 1984, no, string theory is the way.
00:48:07.000This anomaly cancellation was unexpected and it clearly points to the fact that we are, ladies and gentlemen, we are about to quantize.
00:50:27.000Pretty weird way for a theory to start.
00:50:29.000String theory started with a clever formula written down by Veneziano in an effort to satisfy not-so-well motivated phenomenological ideas about strong interaction scattering.
00:50:40.000That was a way for a theory to start which was as strange as the way quantum mechanics started.
00:50:44.000And the way Einstein happened to have invented a theory in a It's a particularly striking triumph of reason and intuition.
00:50:56.000But most other physical theories have had more complicated history.
00:50:59.000You can tell how much is going on beyond this.
00:51:01.000And it's hard to make theories about them.
00:51:02.000You can't generalize at all of how invention will come.
00:51:06.000Anybody who makes statements like that is by his own experience.
00:51:11.000Now, that is Abdus Salam, Nobel Prize winner.
00:51:13.000...must be modified according to each situation.
00:51:17.000No, it still seems to me it's a question of whether you start with a mathematical scheme and then look for a physical interpretation or start with a physical principle which you guessed to be correct and then, on the one hand, try and prove it experimentally to be true and, on the other hand,
00:51:36.000I must admit, I've always been so admiring Einstein's procedure in general relativity of starting with a very simple physical remark based on the Galileo discovery that bodies of different mass fall at the same rate in the gravitational field of the earth.
00:51:53.000He made a simple physical hypothesis why that should be true.
00:51:56.000You have to understand, you know that old Jim Croce song about Big Jim?
00:55:40.000Yeah, he seemed like the way he was sitting there, grasping his hands, and he seemed like very uncomfortable just to be around all these people.
00:55:50.000I was at the University of Pennsylvania in like 1982 through 85, okay?
00:55:57.000And I went to a lecture that he gave, and he said things like, Well, as every schoolchild and quantum field theorist knows...
00:56:07.000Yeah, just like spontaneously laughing for no reason.
00:56:10.000The number of generations is tied to the index of an elliptic operator on a Calabi out manifold.
00:56:47.000You know, there are five string theories or whatever there are, six, four, I can't remember.
00:56:51.000And it's going to be one of them and in 10 years we'll have the whole thing wrapped up.
00:56:55.000And everybody wanted to be on the winning team knew that they weren't going to go up against this because they couldn't even figure out how he was doing what he was doing.
00:57:03.000And what was really going on was very different than people understood.
00:57:08.000Quantum field theory, which is now claimed by most physicists to be the most advanced theory we have, at the time was sort of a grab bag of different techniques.
00:57:22.000He saw that this was effectively a coherent whole with help from a couple of other people who are often not as well acknowledged, one of which would be Michael Attia, another of which would be Graham Siegel,
00:57:37.000another of which would be Dan Quillen, and my good friend and postdoctoral advisor, Isidore Singer.
00:57:44.000So there was sort of a small cabal of people who figured out That quantum field theory was not only a coherent story.
00:57:52.000It didn't really have to do with physics at all.
00:58:41.000So it's been a remarkably productive – the reason we can say how brilliant this person is is because he geometrized the quantum at a level that we didn't know was possible.
00:58:51.000On the other hand, he never made contact with physical reality the way he was expecting and promising to do.
00:58:56.000So he's both – The most accomplished of us and the person who drove physics the most off of the road.
00:59:03.000And if you attempt to give him his due and you don't – if you're not comfortable citing both of these things, you can't be an accurate historian, but he's still running around and nobody wants to go up against him.
00:59:43.000And his wife, Cecile DeWitt or Cecile DeWitt Moret.
00:59:47.000And the father-son team was Louis Witten, who is still alive, now 101 years old, and Edward Witten.
00:59:55.000And then the really weird stuff happens.
00:59:58.000And this is why I was curious about UFOs and gravity and all this stuff.
01:00:04.000The actual genesis of these two families having this outsized impact on the future of theoretical physics comes from two different people who are almost never talked about.
01:00:14.000Matter of fact, most physicists have no idea their names.
01:00:16.000One is named Agnew Bainson and the other is named Roger Babson.
01:00:21.000And these two guys were deep into anti-gravity.
01:00:26.000So the world's greatest mind and greatest living theoretical physics mind is the Sun, of the most prominent anti-gravity researcher, I swear, I kid you not, from the 1950s.
01:01:43.000And you had this guy, Nima Arkani-Hamed, who I hope you will have on this program, who is amazing, who is not a string theorist, but very string sympathetic.
01:01:57.000And this weird genesis of a high-prestige field that can't accomplish what it's setting out to accomplish is in contrast to this mixed period between 1953 and 1973, where you have the world's most prestigious physicists palling around with pseudoscience.
01:02:21.000UFO type stuff, gravity shielding, all this stuff.
01:02:55.000He, Edison, and Clarence Burdi of frozen food, you know, fame, form this sort of little intellectual collective where they're going to defeat gravity.
01:03:04.000So, for example, just because people are going to say, Eric, this is all nonsense, and it isn't.
01:03:09.000Jamie, is it possible to pull up a stone monument at Tufts University to the anti-gravity that was done there?
01:03:19.000This guy littered universities all across the country with these monuments to prove that this anti-gravity stuff was actually taking place at American universities.
01:03:38.000This monument has been directed by the Gravity Research Foundation, Roger Babson, founder, to remind students of the blessings of forthcoming when science determines what gravity is and how it works and how it may be controlled.
01:03:50.000This is about UFOs and the idea that we are going to harness the power of gravity and we are going to get a supreme advantage.
01:03:58.000And these stones are littered around the country.
01:04:11.000Hugely embarrassing because it hasn't yielded results?
01:04:14.000No, hugely embarrassing because it carries the stench of pseudoscience.
01:04:18.000See, when people don't like me coming on your program and saying things that nobody else in the world is saying, they call me a pseudoscientist or that's crackpot.
01:04:27.000And these words, like, you don't take them that seriously.
01:04:30.000We had this discussion before with, like, Tim Dillon saying something about me.
01:05:21.000Babson found something called the Gravity Research Foundation in New Boston, New Hampshire, and he gets the Glenn L. Martin Company, which is the precursor of Martin Marietta, precursor of Lockheed Martin.
01:07:08.000What was this anti-gravity thing between 53 and 73?
01:07:13.000And the reason it ends in 1973 is a guy named Mike Mansfield, I think of Montana as a senator, passes something called the Mansfield Amendment, which discontinues Army or Department of Defense military funding for blue sky research inside of our universities.
01:07:50.000We had skirt-chasing, hard-drinking, charismatic, brilliant human beings who answered to no one and walked around with swagger with their shoulders back and their chest puffed out.
01:08:03.000Because around Sputnik, we wanted the best of the best to go into science.
01:08:33.000In any era before this, Ed Witten would have won a Nobel Prize.
01:08:36.000The guy, six months older than he is from 1951, a guy named Frank Wilczek, who won the Nobel Prize, even being a tiny bit older than Ed Witten, you know, Frank is brilliant, but he's not Ed Witten-like.
01:08:52.000He got a Nobel Prize for something called asymptotic freedom in strong interactions.
01:09:03.000It's like you turned the world's most vital people into castrati.
01:09:09.000And you did it by accounting for their dollars, making them say how everything they did had a practical application, defending the purpose of blue sky research as if they were wasting taxpayer dollars.
01:09:23.000They got called welfare queens in white lab coats.
01:09:27.000The whole thing is completely ridiculous.
01:09:29.000But we have been in the process of dismantling the world's most productive, powerful scientific enterprise from really 1968. 5 or 73 till the present day.
01:09:42.000And the 65 dates from Ghislaine Maxwell's father.
01:09:46.000Robert Maxwell is basically the son of a bitch who introduced peer review, which had only really been strong in the biomedical literature, into general science because he figured out how to make a fortune hacking the universities.
01:10:03.000If you're a university, if you want to have a complete library, you have to buy all the journals that paper is appearing.
01:10:10.000I'll jack up the prices and jack up the number of journals.
01:10:13.000I'll just explode the number of journals.
01:10:16.000And every university that doesn't want to be incomplete has to buy my product.
01:10:22.000So suddenly there weren't enough good editors to edit all of these tiny microjournals, you know, Journal of Hyperspecific Thing X. So peer review comes screaming in, in 1965, through his company,
01:10:38.000Maxwell's company called Pergamon Press.
01:10:41.000So Ghislaine Maxwell's father is like the first major attack on science.
01:10:47.000And then the Mansfield Amendment comes in.
01:10:49.000There's something called the Eilberg Amendment in 1973. In 1980, there's something called the Bayh-Dole Amendment.
01:10:54.000Then there's the Immigration Act of 1990. And we're just chipping away at the vitality of American cowboy science.
01:11:01.000So right now, if you go into a science department, the whole question is, well, what have you done for diversity, inclusion, and equity?
01:11:07.000You know, let's agree that there's no lone geniuses in the world, as if we didn't have Einstein and von Neumann and Teller and all these people.
01:11:22.000So whatever it is, we have been devitalizing certainly since 1973 for 50 years but also really since 1965. How do you turn that boat around though?
01:11:34.000Like, if you're rich and you're smart and you're connected, if you're part of some secret program and you're watching this, please reach out to the Joe Rogan experience or Eric Weinstein to turn the ship around.
01:11:45.000But let's keep going because I want to get to the UFOs again.
01:11:49.000So my question was, what is going on with anti-gravity, UFOs, the world's smartest human beings between 1953 and 73?
01:12:04.000Why two families, the DeWitts and the Wittons?
01:12:07.000And let me give you the reason that I didn't want to touch this subject.
01:12:12.000The reason I didn't want to touch this subject has to do with something I learned from World War II. So you probably know the codename for D-Day?
01:12:24.000There was a companion thing called Operation Bodyguard.
01:12:28.000And in particular, Operation Fortitude, which was inside of Operation Party Guard, which was the planned invasion of Norway, which was never going to happen.
01:12:37.000But we faked an entire invasion of Norway because we had a troop buildup in England that was going to be headed into a very narrow place and was going to be outgunned by the Germans.
01:12:48.000So how do you get all of these people who have to fight, who have loose lips, probably going off and seeing prostitutes?
01:13:43.000So this entire deception had to be parallel.
01:13:49.000Overlord wouldn't have worked without fortitude.
01:13:53.000Now, if you assume that that's the basic paradigm, which is whenever we're going to do something badass, we're also going to do something fake...
01:14:02.000I thought the UFOs was the Operation Fortitude part of something real.
01:14:52.000If we're going to lie about stuff and we're doing it for a good purpose and it's not hurting anybody, I don't want to get involved and say, I'm so smart I can figure it out.
01:14:58.000I don't want to be anywhere near that.
01:15:08.000And what made you shift this perspective?
01:15:12.000So there was this weird thing that happened where we announced through the New York Times that this stuff may be more real than anyone cared to imagine.
01:15:21.000You know, and Jeremy Corbell was releasing these videos and who was leaking them, I don't know.
01:15:26.000And the New York Times was authenticating.
01:15:28.000And, you know, you get all of this, again, tons of ambiguity.
01:15:31.000So everybody's decision tree blows out.
01:15:37.000What if the old Feynman stories that I've been following are actually about something rather than about a deception?
01:15:47.000So for example, Feynman has a story where he says, Hey, there was this guy who was giving physics lectures to aerospace engineers, and they didn't like him, so I had to go out to Buffalo.
01:16:00.000You're going to Curtis Wright Aerospace.
01:16:03.000And he's got another one about, you know, give me a dollar because somebody calls him up and says, give us the nuclear patents to, like, fission-driven planes and crazy stuff.
01:16:43.000It's a cute story about how clever Feynman is, which they all are.
01:16:47.000But that was a conference sponsored by the Institute for Field Physics at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, sponsored by Agnew Bainson through Bryce DeWitt, who is the person who repurposed the Gravity Research Foundation essay,
01:17:03.000which is only supposed to be about harnessing gravity, antigravity, antigravity devices like UFOs.
01:17:09.000And he said, well, if you really want to get to antigravity, you have to do it through quantum gravity.
01:17:15.000Now, he did that, and then a couple of people from the Institute, it was Arnaud and Desser, entered and won this competition that had this stench about it, because it was, like, stigmatized.
01:17:25.000You're going to enter a competition for anti-gravity devices?
01:18:29.000Now that I've been contacted by people saying – Eric, Sam Harris and I were both contacted saying that there's a disclosure planned and it's got – there's big updates and we need you to communicate this news to the world.
01:18:45.000There's disclosure about a specific technology.
01:18:50.000I mean, more or less the way this works, it doesn't matter who you talk to.
01:20:15.000I wish I could, but I'm a team player, and if somebody says something in confidence, I'm not going to reveal it on the Joe Rogan experience.
01:20:24.000But there's some things I can say that nobody else can say, which is I had a very weird reaction to this.
01:20:29.000I think Sam was initially interested, and then they magnated him three times, and he said, I'm out.
01:21:53.000Okay, there's something called the Wilson Memo, where there's a physicist who meets a general or an admiral, and the general or the admiral is trying to figure out, I think this is at EG&G, why is there some program that I'm not allowed to know about?
01:23:41.000I've been on this for three years, and I can't find anybody who speaks this language, which now that is a huge clue.
01:23:49.000Imagine that you say that we've lost control of our airspace.
01:23:52.000We're being menaced, threats to civilian aviation, military aviation.
01:23:57.000They're seeing these things every day.
01:23:58.000They defy the physical laws and there are no physicists anywhere to be found.
01:24:02.000That smells like BS. Or it smells like a pathological level.
01:24:10.000And Marco Rubio and Kirsten Gilderbrand, if you're out there, can you please find out why there are no technically competent people on an area of national security?
01:24:22.000And please don't mumble the word stovepipe or need to know or sources and methods.
01:24:42.000There are some reports that these things come screaming in from behind our satellites that are trained at Earth along non-ballistic trajectories.
01:24:53.000I'm talking all the time to Avi Loeb with the Galileo Project, trying to help him out.
01:24:58.000He needs funding and he needs some ability to, you know, just if the government won't play ball, he's going to put out his own censors in places like Catalina Island, blanket the world, and he'll be able to say, we're seeing these things or we're not seeing these things.
01:25:11.000But right now we have a puzzle that our government won't release information to its own scientific community.
01:25:18.000And it reminds me of, you probably know Airplane, the movie.
01:25:21.000Well, there's this point where they're trying to land this airplane with these people who aren't pilots.
01:25:27.000He says, turn on the landing strip lights.
01:25:30.000And it was Lloyd Bridges or somebody says, no, that's just what they'll be expecting.
01:25:35.000Like he's trying to sabotage the people who are trying to land the plane.
01:25:42.000Do you think this is because there's a level of secrecy that's attached to this technology and they've compartmentalized themselves to death and they've gotten themselves to a point where they don't know how to proceed further because they're preventing people from sharing information?
01:25:58.000Which is one of the most important things about science, is that scientists get to share information and all work together to try to figure out what the problem is.
01:26:08.000Is that a reasonable Well, here comes the decision trees.
01:26:13.000Like, I wish I could say, yeah, that's what I think it is.
01:26:19.000If you are faking UFOs, the last people you want are the world's most brilliant physicists.
01:26:27.000You give them the data, they're going to say, oh, look, I see what you did.
01:26:31.000You put a couple of flashlights with lasers into the sky and you can move them really quickly by the angle and that creates the illusion that something is zipping through the world.
01:27:27.000How do you know that it exists if nobody told you?
01:27:29.000Well, you'd look at the number theory PhDs, and people who specialize in things like elliptic curves, and you would notice that a giant number of them after their PhDs disappear.
01:27:42.000And you'd track to see, well, where do those people live?
01:27:49.000Now, in the case of UFOs, if there was an anti-gravity project, which it's painful for me to even say these words, really what it would be is a post-Einsteinian physics project.
01:28:03.000If you had a post-Einsteinian physics project, you would want three subspecialties for sure.
01:28:09.000That would be differential geometry, which is the basis for originally general relativity, In 1976, 75, two guys named C.N. Yang and Jim Simons,
01:28:25.000who Jim Simons becomes the world's greatest hedge fund manager, figure out that quantum field theory is also based on geometry.
01:28:36.000But it's a different version of differential geometry.
01:28:38.000So that's one specialty that you would want.
01:28:41.000Second specialty that you would want would be particle theory or high-energy physics, however you want to say that.
01:28:48.000The third specialty you'd want is general relativity.
01:28:51.000So if you wanted to detect whether we had a secret Manhattan project but it wasn't identifiable, I think we're good to go.
01:29:15.000The two places that you would have a secret place would be Austin, which is the successor to the Institute for Field Physics at the University of Texas Austin Gravitational Group, General Relativistic Group, which has had John Archibald Wheeler,
01:29:36.000This is a powerhouse of a place that you happen to live in, and you should have these people who are the successors to these people on, because most of these people have died.
01:29:45.000But the more spectacular place would be Sawtucket, Long Island.
01:29:53.000The State University of New York at Stony Brook has an astounding collection of monster mines.
01:30:03.000And it's not highly regarded as a university.
01:30:07.000I mean, it's strong, but you would have no idea how strong this place is.
01:30:12.000It's got multiple Fields Medalists, It's got an institute called the Simon Center for Geometry and Physics.
01:30:23.000Sien Yang, who's arguably the greatest living theoretical physicist, is at this university.
01:30:30.000He's 101 years old, so he's pretty much on his way out, but this is where he's called home.
01:30:36.000And it's not advertised as the powerhouse that it is.
01:30:42.000So shout out to the State University of New York at Stony Brook.
01:30:45.000If I was going to locate a Manhattan Project in plain sight and get U.S. News and World to report this as a minor player in research, that's where I'd go.
01:30:56.000But more importantly, and this is the really weird thing, and again, I don't want to spread this as a rumor, but I am saying...
01:31:04.000If you wanted to imagine that the government wasn't incompetent and we actually had great people on this project, my friend and advisor who's now died, Isidore Singer, once said to me, he said, the world's greatest mathematics and physics department is renaissance technologies.
01:32:17.000And I guessed that Bernie Madoff had a legitimate business and an illegitimate business, and he was front-running the legitimate business with his illegitimate business.
01:32:27.000So he was effectively stealing from his own clients in one division.
01:33:03.000Renaissance has existed in its medallion fund for decades, has turned in a performance never seen by anything else remotely, effectively just a money printing machine.
01:33:18.000I've met with Jim Simons one-on-one for three hours, and because his wife is an economist, my wife is an economist, I'm a differential geometer, he's a differential geometer, I gave him this entire theory that all of modern neoclassical economics is actually differential geometric.
01:33:36.000Three hours later, he's been chain-smoking, smokes like a chimney, never wears socks, very eccentric guy, brilliant as the day is long, still alive, go get him for a guest.
01:34:09.000And Jim is having dinner at his brother's house.
01:34:14.000And what you guys don't know about Jim Simons is that with a guy named S.S. Churn, he came up with something called the Churn-Simons Function or Churn-Simons Functional.
01:34:26.000Where if you differentiate this thing, the way you differentiate the Einstein-Hilbert functional, you get an equation that looks very similar to the Einstein field equation for gravity, only it looks a lot more like particle theory.
01:34:40.000So I told Jim, I said, I don't know if you know this or you don't know this, but I think you're sitting on top of of a piece of the puzzle that supersedes general relativity.
01:34:52.000And on the spot, he asked me whether I wanted to come out to the State University of New York at Stony Brook for a year to work on this.
01:35:05.000Jim Simons is potentially, I mean, beyond brilliant, But also has a claim on a part of what I believe is going to supersede general relativity by imitating the Einstein-Hilbert action from which the Einstein field equations are derived.
01:35:22.000This thing generates something which you would call the Chern-Simons equation.
01:35:27.000Ed Witten gets the Fields Medal for quantizing this thing that looks like gravity but is actually sort of particle theoretic.
01:35:35.000And I can't get into it because we don't have the common language to do it.
01:35:46.000What has happened is Stony Brook is ground zero for the explosion in mathematical physics that came through something called the Wu-Yang Dictionary, where suddenly the quantum became as geometric as general relativity.
01:35:59.000Then it got more geometric through something called geometric quantization.
01:36:02.000Then it got more geometric through something called geometric quantum field theory, or topological quantum field theory, or conformal quantum field theory.
01:36:09.000I don't know whether Satakit Is the locusts.
01:36:51.000First of all, I would correct this thing in a million different ways.
01:36:55.000But you see the Atiyah-Singer index theorem, equation for the curvature tensor, Maxwell's equations in geometric form, written out in differential form, equations for string theory...
01:37:08.000This thing, E8, the 248 largest simple league group in the world, this is like almost a religious pilgrimage site.
01:37:20.000What's wrong with that that you would correct?
01:37:47.000That thing should be expanded to something called the Atiyah-Potodi Singer Index Theorem for Manifolds with Boundary.
01:37:55.000Above that, you see the Dirac equation, id slash minus m times psi equals zero.
01:38:03.000Actually, if I'm correct, it should be a hybrid between the Rurita-Schwinger and the Dirac equations based on a three-complex tensor with a spinner.
01:38:12.000Above that, you have a non-relativistic equation, which is the Schrodinger equation, because there's only one derivative in terms of t, but there's that nabla, that triangle squared, which is Different in terms of space, so you can't treat space and time asymmetrically.
01:38:26.000Above that, you have the Einstein field equations, R mu nu minus one-half R times g mu nu.
01:38:31.000There should be a cosmological constant in there, which is missing.
01:38:37.000To the right, you have the E8 diagram, should be the Titz-Freudenthal magic square.
01:38:43.000So I don't know whether this is like a Straussian communication in the sense that if you're smart enough, you should know that there are tons of Errors, limitations, and bad choices.
01:38:52.000I would not write out the Maxwell above that.
01:38:56.000You've got these Nabla B, Nabla E equals zero.
01:38:59.000What's the other possibility in terms of these errors?
01:39:01.000Somebody hired somebody to do something impressionistic and it got too far in the process, carving Indiana limestone before they figured out that you should really do this better.
01:39:10.000But this is gorgeous and it's the only place in the world This is my language, Joe.
01:39:17.000If you ask, like, what language does Eric speak and why does he act weird when he comes on my show?
01:39:44.000So my question is, is there some – do we have a project?
01:39:49.000If it's not – if we're not doing something in Sawtucket or we're not doing something at the University of Texas at Austin, I'm worried we're not doing something anywhere.
01:39:57.000I went to the Institute for Advanced Study to visit friend acquaintance, Nima Arkani Hamed, who I think very, very highly of.
01:40:10.000He's the most bizarre thing in that he's an unbelievable salesman showman who's pathologically honest in a weird way.
01:40:18.000So that's very unusual characteristics.
01:40:21.000He made the point, he said, the Casimir effect is an example of negative energy, negative mass energy, where you take two plates that are so close together that quantum waves...
01:40:33.000Many of the frequencies can't fit between these two plates, and so the pressure outside of them is not counterbalanced by pressure between them, so they get forced together when they're very, very close.
01:40:43.000And his point is, that's an example of actual negative mass, negative energy, where we pretend that that's not true.
01:40:50.000He says geckos actually use this when they climb up a wall.
01:40:56.000Now, the question, can you harness it?
01:40:58.000This is always that, you know, you've got UFOs.
01:41:00.000People who try to think about how you could get physics to do these things focus on the Casimir effect, or they'll focus on negative energy solutions.
01:41:10.000Now, if you look at that 1957 conference at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, one of the most eminent mathematician physicists, a guy who was first Wrangler at Cambridge, was a guy named Herman Bondi, an Austrian, I think, Mathematician.
01:41:23.000And his paper is about negative mass in general relativity.
01:41:29.000Now, I don't know if you've ever heard of this stuff.
01:41:47.000You change the force law, F equals MA, and you change the gravitational law, G, you know, F equals GM, first mass times second mass over R squared.
01:41:58.000So when you change both of those, oddly, the negative mass is still attracted just the same way to the positive mass as if there was no difference.
01:42:06.000But the positive mass is always repelled.
01:42:08.000So you get this weird solution where the negative mass chases the positive mass And they go off to like, you know, unbounded acceleration.
01:42:18.000So Bondi was thinking about why is it that we've got these artificial conditions in general relativity, which we impose by hand.
01:42:27.000They're not the same beautiful marble that Einstein used for his field equations, but we throw some extra crappy stuff in called positivity conditions to stop general relativity from giving us madness.
01:42:40.000So Bondi started asking the question, Maybe we shouldn't.
01:42:44.000Maybe what you think of his madness has meaning.
01:42:49.000And this is why this conference, which is a confluence of the two families, the Wittens and the DeWitts, with Feynman and Wheeler and all of these unbelievable characters and attendants, Is this pivotal, strange experience, is that people are smoking the ganja on extending general relativity to places that it's never been extended.
01:43:11.000And the highbrow version of this doesn't work, and the lowbrow version of this doesn't work so far as we know.
01:43:17.000The lowbrow version is called pseudoscientific antigravity, gravity shielding.
01:43:27.000The highbrow version of this is called quantum gravity.
01:43:30.000And all the most respectable people are in it, and it doesn't work.
01:43:33.000And you can't say, why are we doing this if it doesn't work?
01:43:37.000Why can't I say Ed Witten's great, but he made a terrible blunder?
01:43:42.000David Gross and Ed Witten should be in front of the community explaining, why did you take all the smartest people, all the resources, all the attention, Michio Kaku.
01:44:32.000No, you put a lot of people's careers in the shredder in order to have this quantum gravity experiment, which is like, you know, the people bowing and praying to this thing that doesn't work.
01:44:56.000I'll debate anybody with the possible exception of Ed Witten, who still scares me, but I'll probably debate him too.
01:45:02.000In open forum, we have got to purge The physics community of its quackery, and the quackery is coming from the high-prestige version of this.
01:45:12.000The high-prestige version of antigravity is called quantum gravity, and it just doesn't work.
01:45:17.000So, to get back to the UFOs, why is this stuff important?
01:45:25.000One, I don't know, four years, five years ago, and I was doing this riff on the twin nuclei problem.
01:45:32.000I said, we've got to get off this planet.
01:45:33.000I said, we've now become God's butt for the wisdom, and I just threw it off.
01:45:43.000The COVID in your lungs probably came out of the Wuhan Institute of Virology, and we're lying about it.
01:45:49.000That is engineering the nucleus of the cell, the nucleic acids that we found the structure of in their functions.
01:45:57.000Right now, we are screwing around with Vladimir Putin, with nukes, pretending that the sacred borders of Ukraine, which have been fluctuating for centuries, are somehow sacrosanct.
01:46:08.000And yes, it's terrible that he's invaded.
01:46:12.000And I do think that the borders shouldn't move, but we really shouldn't have been antagonizing Russia by pretending that there's no concept of a sphere of influence, because I'll tell you, when somebody puts nukes on our border with Mexico in Monterey or Baja, California, we're going to be plenty upset.
01:47:10.000You're not going to terraform the Moon and Mars in the next three years or 30. The only way to really get off this planet is to leave the solar system because those are the only two rocks that are even halfway viable.
01:47:23.000And if you think about how far away everything is, we've got this thing that I call the Einstein moat.
01:47:28.000The nearest star, if we took a human traveling at the top speed a human has ever gone at, I think is 100,000 years away at that top speed.
01:47:39.000So you can fantasize about, oh yeah, we just come up with huge ships and people have multi-generational experience.
01:47:44.000All of Jewish history is 5,000 years and you're talking about 100,000 years.
01:47:48.000No way you're going to do this on a ship.
01:49:21.000I have not been in a relativistic context for years.
01:49:25.000And the reason that you get to leave relativity is that you recover relativity from another theory.
01:49:30.000If you have a theory that includes relativity, You can say, okay, yeah, I know how to see relativity inside the theory, but I can also see other stuff beyond it.
01:49:39.000And so that's where I work, someplace called geometric unity, because the geometry underneath the standard model and the geometry underneath general relativity is two different geometries called Riemannian and Erismanian.
01:50:47.000If you want to go a very long distance, one possibility is that you do something very energetically expensive.
01:50:55.000But the other possibility is grow the ruler to shrink the distance.
01:51:00.000If the rulers and protractors that Einstein used, and he chose one through his equation, are instead variables and you have full access to them, if I wanted to go a very long distance, the first thing I'd do is grow the ruler to shrink the distance, then go the distance under that ruler,
01:51:19.000So when you talk about things like, oh, these things are behaving like nothing I've ever seen, Well, there are a couple of things that I'm worried about if these things are real.
01:51:29.000One is, does somebody else know how to grow rulers and shrink rulers and grow watches and shrink watches, speed them up, slow them down, in order to get in control of the thing that we thought was space-time?
01:51:44.000The next issue is, are there multiple temporal dimensions?
01:51:49.000So Eric, your friend who's had too much coffee, believes that there are either six or four extra temporal dimensions, and whatever isn't temporal is spatial.
01:52:00.000So it's either four plus six or six plus four extra dimensions split between time and space.
01:52:06.000If that's true, try to imagine Extra-dimensional engineers who have full access to something where there's no arrow of time.
01:52:19.000The only time there's an arrow of time is if time is one-dimensional.
01:52:23.000If time is two-dimensional, you have a whirlpool of time, which is either clockwise or counterclockwise.
01:52:30.000If it's three-dimensional, you have a right-hand rule of time, and there's a left-hand rule of time.
01:54:06.000Towards the end of the turntable time...
01:54:09.000The stylus would pick up, and it would skip over all the stuff that you didn't want to hear again, and it would go back to some track that you did.
01:54:27.000I'm sort of at the edge of where I can actually say things.
01:54:30.000But you see, all of physics proceeds from the assumption that time is one-dimensional.
01:54:36.000We have this thing called deterministic propagation.
01:54:39.000So if you take quantum mechanics, There are really two rules.
01:54:42.000One is completely deterministic with no probability theory.
01:54:45.000You've got a system, you know its initial conditions, and you say, if I know the laws of physics, I should be able to figure out where this is.
01:54:52.000You know, I take this lighter, and I throw it up, and I catch it, and it described a parabola.
01:55:52.000I think that part of the story is that gravity is the observer through something called a pullback operation.
01:56:00.000And when you realize that, you realize that you don't naively quantize gravity the way you quantize everything else.
01:56:06.000In fact, gravity is the only field living on the successor to spacetime, if I'm correct.
01:56:12.000There are two spaces called X and Y. All the cool stuff in here, the electrons, the quarks that make up everything that you and I are, It's living on Y, except for the metric, the rulers and the protractors, which lives on X, which is how you keep gravity separate.
01:56:29.000And the unification is the unification of these two things in a structure called a bundle.
01:56:33.000Now, people will go over this, and I'm sure professors will say, well, this is what Eric was saying.
01:56:40.000No, no, no, he's actually making a point.
01:56:43.000This story about space-time engineering where you don't use the Einstein field equations because you're using the successor theory rather than...
01:56:53.000In the Einstein theory, the entire planet was pulling on you when you needed to go pee.
01:56:58.000And your legs, I mean, they're obviously buff, you're fit.
01:57:02.000You just pulled against an entire planet to get out of your chair.
01:57:24.000If somebody's space-time engineering and they can get here from very far away, they're not using general relativity in the standard model, my friends.
01:57:33.000They're using a successor theory and we have become pussies.
01:57:36.000We are not going to look at successor theories because we've all learned the lesson that everybody who tries to bet against the standard model loses.
01:57:45.000Everybody who bets against general relativity loses.
01:57:47.000And this is that speech that Morpheus has to give.
01:57:50.000It's like, I'm not going to lie to you, Neo.
01:57:52.000Everyone who's ever faced an agent who stood his ground, you know, has died.
01:58:36.000But I know that if I were the federal government, if I was the Department of Energy, and if I were DARPA, and if I were any of these people, and somebody went on the Joe Rogan experience with millions of viewers and listeners, And started talking like this,
02:00:03.000I get occasionally called by somebody from inside.
02:00:08.000What I think they're doing, first of all, one, we may be faking a UFO situation for reasons that I don't understand.
02:00:15.000If we are faking a UFO situation, do you think that there's technology that's available to people in the United States that is beyond our current understanding of what's possible?
02:01:46.000I think we are playing paintball rather than going to war and we're giving prizes for generals who command the best paintball army.
02:01:55.000And then we're referencing everyone else who's actually trying to figure out how to fight to, well, have you submitted to the paintball competition?
02:02:04.000It's like, no, I don't want to do paintball.
02:02:07.000I understand that it keeps your skills up.
02:02:09.000I understand that some of them are transferable.
02:02:11.000But I mean like you've been in street fights?
02:03:36.000You're already taking risks that you shouldn't be taking.
02:03:40.000So, if You think 90% sure that this is not coming from here?
02:03:48.000You believe this because you don't think that the proper science in order to achieve these kind of results is being done by the people that you believe are capable of doing it?
02:03:58.000I know that, for example, when I talk to Nima or when I talk to Juan Maldesena or when I've talked to Natty Cyberg, these people are absolutely brilliant and they don't know the answer unless they're the greatest actors I've ever seen.
02:04:11.000So the most brilliant physicists are looking at these supposed videos.
02:04:22.000They're not talking about things that can extend Einstein.
02:04:27.000Therefore, to get back to your technology question, might have engineering applications, because it's the engineering applications that are terrifying.
02:04:36.000The discovery of the neutron was one thing.
02:04:38.000The Teller-Ulam design was its weaponization.
02:04:42.000So suddenly, you know, you can do the Tsar bomb or Castle Bravo, these unbelievable explosions, which...
02:05:12.000People have forgotten how terrifying, important, wonderful, jaw-dropping and awesome physics is because it hasn't done anything that completely screws your mind.
02:05:28.000That was the test in the Pacific where we thought it was going to be like controlled and like or was starfish where we did an atmospheric explosion over Hawaii and then the Russians like hold my beer.
02:05:42.000You know, we remember I'm the guy five years ago who was saying we need above-ground nuclear tests because all you people have lost your fear like yes Eric is crazy, but he's correct.
02:06:58.000If somebody is listening to these tests that we did...
02:07:02.000My belief is, very shortly before you get the ability to traverse the cosmos, if that is possible, if that is possible, you let off and nuke.
02:07:27.000That's a big part of UFO, that once they drop those, that's when all the UFOs started appearing.
02:07:33.000So the question is, you know, the analogy I give, so I talked to Avi about the following thing.
02:07:41.000I am a fan of something I call the doubly scientific method.
02:07:45.000The usual scientific method makes a hidden assumption that it never voices, which is if we're going to study orcas, we assume that we are smarter than orcas.
02:07:53.000Or if we're going to study cephalopods, right, like an octopus, we think we're smarter.
02:08:05.000We do all sorts of crazy things based on the fact that we're smarter than what we study, from everything from rocks to orcas.
02:08:13.000The doubly scientific method says, okay, assume that you're studying a rat in a maze, but you yourself are the rat in somebody else's maze.
02:08:21.000Now you have to look up the intelligence scale, not just down.
02:08:26.000And in the doubly scientific method, you have to assume that whatever is studying you is hiding from you the way you are hiding from your subjects.
02:08:33.000So if you see somebody in a duck blind, for example, and he's studying ducks, you understand that somebody may be hiding from you.
02:08:40.000And they might be able to use multiple dimensions of time.
02:08:43.000They might be able to cloak themselves and disguise themselves.
02:08:45.000Or, for example, if you take microscopic UFOs, this glass, this cup, It has a radius of r and a circumference of 2 pi r.
02:08:56.000The disk that it spans is pi r squared in area.
02:09:00.000But if you look at this cup, it's much larger than pi r squared because we pushed it out.
02:09:05.000You could have a sphere where if you could cheaply engineer spacetime, not through the Einstein field equations, but through the successor theory that recovers Einstein, you could have an entire stadium inside of a tennis ball.
02:09:19.000Just the way this cup doesn't blow your mind until you realize that its area is much greater than pi r squared.
02:09:26.000Why look for a giant floating thing in the sky?
02:09:29.000If you could bend space and time and you could play with the rulers the way I'm saying, I would put this in a tiny little profile.
02:09:51.000All that stuff where if it didn't exist.
02:09:54.000If somehow or another we lived in some contained environment and we had no concept of space whatsoever and then we gained access to it, we would be unbelievably overwhelmed.
02:10:03.000If you lived in some sort of underground facility your entire life and then one day you got a chance to go outside and see the Keck Observatory in Hawaii in a clear night with no moon, you would be overwhelmed.
02:10:17.000You wouldn't be able to believe that the world was as big as it really was or that the universe was as big as it was.
02:10:35.000The problem, as you know, from the default mode network, right, is that mostly what your brain is doing is not communicating information but screening information.
02:10:46.000Your eyes, your fovea is precious because that's the thing that can resolve at very high levels.
02:10:51.000But I can barely see Jamie out of the corner of my eye because my peripheral vision can't be at the same level as my fovea.
02:11:00.000So we're talking about tapping in to a picture of the world that we are not...
02:11:05.000Our brain is not prepared for the idea that time is multidimensional.
02:11:10.000That was the whole point of giving Lex another watch.
02:11:14.000We don't have a way to think about it.
02:11:15.000I'll meet you at 5.15 and 12.30 according to two different scales of time.
02:11:21.000Or, for example, time and space, if I'm correct, the 14-dimensional manifold that has all the quantum going on on it is split probably seven in seven dimensions because we have six extra time dimensions and four extra space.
02:11:34.000Add six to one and three to four and you get seven.
02:11:59.000So, do you think, now when you were talking about these people that keep manana-ing you and not giving you access to whatever they're talking about, do you think they're talking about some sort of an engineering solution to this type of technology?
02:12:17.000I haven't met anyone in striking distance in three years.
02:12:20.000So, how could they have something that's going to change your way of looking?
02:12:25.000Is it possible that you've missed something?
02:13:25.000Really what I am is an academic who realized that you can't do academics inside of the university system and watch it disintegrate into madness as we speak.
02:14:02.000If we can leave, anything else can visit.
02:14:06.000If you look at the entirety of the universe and you imagine that ultimately there are societies that destroy themselves because they get atomic weapons before they figure out how to leave, some societies are smarter than that.
02:14:19.000And they'll be able to leave and colonize the cosmos.
02:14:22.000And for them not to be here would be madness.
02:14:47.000We don't know if there's 39 or 300. They kill everybody who lands there, essentially.
02:14:53.000There's a story that we actually buggered them.
02:14:55.000An English person buggered them, which is why they don't want anyone landing.
02:14:59.000There actually are some very weird videos where we throw them coconuts because coconuts don't occur in their island, and we actually have non-hostile contact.
02:15:06.000But the most important part of it is India.
02:15:10.000They do not know that they are claimed by something called India.
02:15:14.000And they don't know that they have a Fermi problem because India won't let anyone land unless they break the law.
02:15:20.000So the great filter of North Sentinel Island is a model for why don't we see anybody?
02:15:27.000Does India exist at some sort of UFO level?
02:15:32.000Now, this is the doubly scientific method.
02:15:34.000You can laugh at it, but then would you laugh at the North Sentinelese who are smart enough to say, I wonder if there's another society that's screening everybody from landing here?
02:15:44.000Now, what happens on North Sentinel Island if you're watching it and all these people with loincloths or no loincloths and spears and arrows and stupid stuff, suddenly you start hearing radio signals coming out of North Sentinel Island.
02:15:58.000Then you see a little mushroom cloud in the northeast of the island.
02:16:01.000Then you see little boats that start exploring around that seem to be propelled internally.
02:16:06.000You're like, are they burning the leaves?
02:16:07.000Have they invented internal combustion?
02:16:09.000At some point with the mushroom cloud, India says enough is enough.
02:16:12.000We cannot afford to let the North Sentinelese be treated as some sort of backwards people who don't have anything developed that scares us.
02:17:00.000Who's monitoring what's going on and they're not going to be infinitely patient if they exist.
02:17:06.000Now, if that's true and we can leave and we can't civilize ourselves and we bring this mad technology with us, this ability to destroy, I personally feel responsible in a way that my colleagues don't.
02:17:19.000They have these ideas like, oh, I'm a physicist.
02:18:18.000Because there are these two singularities.
02:18:20.000There's this singularity at the beginning of time, which we call the Big Bang, assuming that time were one-dimensional.
02:18:25.000And it's part of something called the Friedman-Robertson-Walker space-time model.
02:18:30.000And there's another one at the bottom of the black hole called the Schwarzschild singularity.
02:18:34.000And the fact that space and time kink at these two points is an indication that we have something wrong to a mathematician or a physicist.
02:18:43.000It says, your equations work pretty well right up into the point Where there's some error that you have that you don't understand and you have a division by zero error.
02:18:54.000And if you could figure out your error, you don't know what sin you committed, but the way that you know you committed a sin is that you have a singularity.
02:19:00.000So they know that there's some successor theory.
02:19:03.000And they'll give lectures about space-time is doomed and I'm going to talk about non-commutative geometry.
02:19:08.000But these are all ways of avoiding the fact that you haven't done your homework for 50 years.
02:19:36.000You're not thinking about recovering Einstein, or Einstein is what we would call an effective theory.
02:19:40.000You're thinking that you really live in space-time, so you know what you can do.
02:19:44.000And then you fold your arms and say, well, that's impossible.
02:19:46.000It's like, no, you have a limited map.
02:19:49.000You think that Greenland is the same size as South America.
02:19:55.000Okay, then as far as its application, What could you imagine would be a way that someone could actually apply these laws, these theories?
02:20:09.000So imagine for the moment – this goes back to – let me put my Eric, the science person, doing his own theory, right?
02:20:19.000This is my thing that I tried to give you last time I was here.
02:20:25.000If we imagine that there are two spaces, and one of them is 14-dimensional, and one of them is 4-dimensional, and gravity connects them, that is the metric, the gadget, think of a phonograph.
02:20:39.000The record is like the 14-dimensional world.
02:21:07.000You're listening to that record in four dimensions, but it's a 14-dimensional record.
02:21:12.000So you and I are playing back a 14-dimensional quantum world, but we're only playing back slices of it.
02:21:20.000So the illusion is that we're having a four-dimensional conversation because the Victrola part, that phone, his master's voice, is the four-dimensional thing.
02:22:05.000You don't have to scratch your way back.
02:22:07.000You can do these weird moves where you can alight the stylus in different places and shrink things and grow things and change the angles and all this stuff.
02:22:17.000And you have engineering possibilities.
02:22:19.000I will say what I believe the internal properties of the particles that we have yet to find, the dark matter, if you will.
02:22:29.000I will tell you places that I believe the standard model is wrong.
02:22:32.000And I'm happy to go down on the ship and move on with my life if I'm wrong.
02:22:49.000When I... In 1987 around, I proposed a set of equations that were like the junior version of geometric unity.
02:23:00.000I was told that those equations were insufficiently nonlinear, that they involve spinners, and spinners have nothing to do with something called self-duality, that I'd violated the spin statistics theorem, a whole bunch of things.
02:23:47.000Ed Witten is giving a lecture in the main seminar room in Building 2 in the MIT Math Department, where I am now a postdoc under a National Science Foundation Fellowship.
02:24:00.000So I had gone through huge trouble and I crawled back on top.
02:24:06.000And Ed Witten says the self-duality revolution, which is related to Jim Simon's work, which I was saying before, He says, theoretically, you don't have to deal with these super complicated equations anymore.
02:24:21.000A guy named, I think, Alan Knudsen, who's now at Cornell, I think raises his hand like a punk and he says, do you want to tell us what equations we would use instead?
02:24:32.000Ed Witten writes down these two sets – these set of two equations.
02:24:37.000I look at them and I say, Those are the equations that I proposed at Harvard in like five years ago or seven years ago.
02:24:46.000And I said, huh, that's really interesting.
02:24:49.000He's about to get told that they're insufficiently nonlinear, that they involve spinners, which can't possibly involve self-duality, and that he's violated spin statistics.
02:24:57.000And I'm looking forward to watching what happens when Ed Witten is told this.
02:25:03.000A couple weeks later, I'm at the MIT commissary with Is Singer and the math physics group, and a guy named András Senes, a Hungarian brilliant guy, now in Geneva, I think, says, have you heard the news?
02:26:19.000But FA plus equals I. I had written these things down in a slightly different form and had been effectively laughed out of Harvard for this.
02:26:29.000And it turns out that what was going on was Ed Witten had written these things down and now all of these people were converted.
02:26:40.000And a lecture is given at room 507 in the Harvard Math Department on the fifth floor across from the office of a guy named Raoul Bott, who is absolutely not my advisor, but the internet is determined to make him my advisor.
02:26:53.000Raoul Bott is my hero, but he was not my advisor.
02:26:57.000He's a great man, and you shouldn't do that to him, and you shouldn't do that to me.
02:27:02.000So I go to this lecture, and the person giving it was really the closest thing I had to an advisor, if it's not a guy named Jor Barnatan, is the brother of somebody you've had on your program.
02:27:13.000You've had Gary Taubes on your program.
02:28:22.000And he says, excuse me, Cliff, didn't we have a student at some point who told us to look at the spinner bundles and maybe these equations?
02:28:31.000And Cliff goes white as a ghost, and I'm picking my nose, right nostril, and the entire room swivels and looks at me.
02:28:38.000And then I realize, like, everybody actually remembers what I was saying, and my thesis is on the spinner bundles, all this stuff.
02:28:46.000And I have this question, do I tell them the whole theory?
02:28:51.000And I left mathematics at that moment.
02:28:54.000I just decided, I can't trust you people.
02:29:23.000But Massachusetts actually had an entrant in that game, and that was me.
02:29:29.000And then Isidore Singer writes somewhere in one of his papers, you know, I learned about this years ago before from Eric Weinstein, a paper with Cano and Ballyu.
02:30:38.000Those things, the Cyborg-Witten equations, is the barest thumbnail of what's coming.
02:30:45.000And If we don't use this stuff, we're doomed here with Xi and Biden and Kamala and Trump and Putin and Zelensky and Khomeini and all of these idiots.
02:31:11.000Do you notice how everything that you love gets destroyed?
02:31:14.000Jordan Peterson, Brett Weinstein, Sam Harris, even Lex Friedman.
02:31:19.000They go after Lex Friedman after I warn Lex they're going to come for you because of his reading list and because they misportray him as if he's claiming to be an MIT professor, which he's never claimed in his life.
02:31:30.000They destroy all of us if we don't sing from the hymnal.
02:31:35.000This is so important to me because it's hope.
02:31:37.000If I'm wrong, then maybe we don't have a way off this planet.
02:31:41.000Maybe we don't have a way to the solar system, out of the solar system.
02:31:47.000What would be the technology that would harness this?
02:31:51.000You would figure out how to do the stuff on the record rather than the phonograph, the Victrola.
02:31:59.000You would start to move the space-time metric, you would move along the directions of the metric not using the Einstein field equations.
02:32:07.000So you would try to figure out, okay, if we're in flatland here, a four-dimensional slice of a 14-dimensional world, how do I go what we – I have to say it in my own language – along the 10-dimensional normal bundle?
02:32:20.000In other words, 14 equals four dimensions we know plus 10 we don't.
02:32:23.000Call the 10 we don't the normal bundle.
02:32:25.000You'd start navigating in the normal bundle.
02:32:28.000You'd stop thinking about the sound coming out of the Victrola.
02:32:33.000There's a stylus, there's a horn, and there's a record.
02:32:37.000And you'd engineer around that so that you had a really efficient way to go very far or to circle back in time without going back through time.
02:32:46.000You'd try to figure out, what can I do with the stylus?
02:32:49.000Where can I put the stylus on the record to get different...
02:34:01.000Everything you see here is spun left-handed if it's matter and spun right-handed if it's antimatter.
02:34:09.000My claim is we are decoupled from matter that spins right and antimatter that spins left, but in a low gravitational environment.
02:34:19.000It's like my left and my right hand don't know each other.
02:34:22.000So you have the asymmetry of a hand, which is you say, oh, digits two and four look like each other.
02:34:29.000The middle finger is the axis of symmetry.
02:34:32.000And unfortunately, the pinky and the thumb look wildly different.
02:34:35.000But let's fudge it and imagine there's a symmetry.
02:34:38.000Suddenly you realize neurologically you're disconnected and it's thumb to thumb on a different hand you didn't know anything about.
02:34:45.000So my claim is I believe that this world that appears to have a left-handed or right-handed nature, like Cindy Crawford has a beauty mark so you know whether a photo is of her or her mirror image.
02:34:56.000There's like another Cindy Crawford with the beauty mark on the other side.
02:35:14.000Normally, we get additional forces through something called grand unification, where we use theories called SU5 and spin 10 or SO10. And those are the wrong flavors of the right idea.
02:35:25.000The right flavor would be called spin 6, 4, and SU5 would be replaced by SU3, 2. So there would be new unifications, new forces.
02:35:35.000It would produce new problems, because when you put that comma, you know, 3, 2...
02:35:40.000You create something that is more space-timey than particle physics.
02:35:44.000So there's stuff we don't know how to deal with.
02:35:47.000But you see, there's nothing in the laws of physics that say the rules of the universe will conform to what particle theorists currently know how to handle.
02:35:57.000Nature seems to know things we don't know how to do.
02:36:00.000And the time has ended for us to tell nature, you can't have this or you must have that because we don't know how to handle you otherwise.
02:37:12.000So what wouldn't be involved is getting an entire planet to put a tiny dent in space-time, because that's not going to work.
02:37:21.000It would be a question of saying, I know about more degrees of freedom.
02:37:25.000Are those degrees of freedom accessible?
02:37:27.000And to give you an idea of what's involved, if you take a proton with two up quarks and a down quark, so put two U's and a D inside of a ball you call a proton, you're tempted to say, okay, if those are hard little balls inside, I want to pull one out.
02:37:43.000The equations have something that used to be called slavery, but we're not allowed to say the word slavery because of diversity, equity, inclusion.
02:37:50.000I'm going to say slavery because I'm here.
02:37:52.000You cannot pull a quark out of a proton.
02:37:55.000So what looks like a degree of freedom is not accessible to you.
02:38:00.000In the equations, you see up quarks and down quarks.
02:39:00.000If I'm right, then it splits into a second level of the decision tree.
02:39:05.000Maybe the new degrees of freedom are things we can play with at the engineering level, and maybe they're inaccessible just the way we can't play with up quarks and down quarks directly.
02:39:14.000If we can play with it, then we've got so many new toys you have no idea.
02:39:19.000New forces, new matter, new possibilities to flit in and out between dark and light matter.
02:39:25.000But from an engineering perspective, how would you make any of this happen?
02:39:33.000Build something based on new plans that did something that nothing else could do.
02:39:53.000Take a tube that's perfectly insulated almost and run current through it and then pass an electron beam from like a cathode ray tube and reflect it off mirrors and see when it comes back and interferes with itself, how it interferes.
02:40:09.000If it's perfectly insulated, it shouldn't be able to tell whether there's current running through the center of the solenoid, of that tube.
02:40:20.000Turns out when you turn on the tube and you run current through it, the electron beam can detect whether there's current running through it through magic.
02:40:30.000Technically, magic here means something called holonomy.
02:40:34.000We didn't know that the electromagnetic fields are not where electromagnetism really happens.
02:40:41.000It's something called the electromagnetic potential.
02:40:43.000It's a precursor that actually determines the universe.
02:40:46.000It determines the electromagnetic fields, but this weird thing where somehow the current inside a perfectly insulated tube is influencing the world outside of it was like, holy smokes.
02:40:58.000We've been living with this stuff for how long?
02:41:02.000The way you do this is we get together with a bunch of people and we'd say, if Eric is correct or somebody else is correct, and you started to play with this extended model of both general relativity and the standard model,
02:41:17.000what are some experiments we could run That you think would have no actual content, just the way the Aronoff-Bohm experiment looks like it's not going to do anything.
02:41:41.000And it's one of the reasons I keep talking to Brian Keating, who's an experimentalist, because what you see here in the studio is 100% theorists.
02:41:49.000You only invite theorists from physics.
02:41:53.000I don't know how to talk to the experimentalists, but that's why I go down to the University of California, San Diego, and play down there, because I want to talk to people who are like, how do we build this?
02:42:05.000Tell me what I'm saying In terms that we can build something and actually see if it has consequences.
02:42:11.000And what could it be in terms of like building something?
02:42:15.000Imagine for example that you look at the equivalence principle, right?
02:42:20.000So the equivalence principle says that the inertial mass, how much mass something appears to have when it's moving, how resistant it is to force...
02:42:29.000That's the same, according to Einstein, as the gravitational force, right?
02:43:03.000It's that thing about the molasses causes the mass to feel heavier even though the mass of the cup hasn't changed because it's requiring more and more force to push.
02:43:16.000If what we have is a bunch of different kinds of mass, we might be able to break some of these things, like the equivalence principle.
02:43:22.000We might be able to generate negative mass, which is not technically excluded, but is incredibly hard to think about.
02:44:22.000But that's in part because it's a stupid piece of equipment.
02:44:25.000What we're really doing is banging rocks together, except the rocks are called protons.
02:44:30.000So you're thinking there could be an engineering solution where you could generate something like that, but from a much smaller footprint?
02:44:39.000100% that's a possibility, because right now what we're doing is we're using electromagnetism only.
02:44:44.000The only force that we actually have engineering power over is electromagnetism.
02:44:50.000Like when we do chemistry, so you fertilize your lawn, you're using electron orbitals based on electromagnetism between the proton and the electron in an atom or molecule.
02:45:01.000We don't know how to interfere with the weak force or the gravitational force.
02:45:06.000Both of those are so weak that they're impossible.
02:45:07.000And the strong force is crazily nuclear and super short range.
02:45:11.000So we've got control of one out of four forces.
02:45:15.000I can tell you what I believe the additional forces are, but what I need is I need people who are closer to engineering, experiment, and standard theory.
02:45:24.000I mean, I'm not even a physicist, Joe.
02:45:57.000For the same reason that I don't go into a Scientology center and spend all my time thinking about Xenu, I'm not going to spend all my time worried about space opera.
02:46:35.000You know, I ended up in San Marino at Lou Elizondo's invitation, and then Lou couldn't come, so I ended up speaking in Lou's place at a UFO meeting.
02:47:41.000I think Gary told me a story where he's, like, dealing with a subject.
02:47:44.000He's a medical guy, and that's how he got involved with this.
02:47:47.000And, you know, somehow the medical person that he is is talking to a subject who says, you know, I encountered a spinning disc in the sky or whatever, and a ball of light comes in.
02:47:57.000You know, brother, another one of these stories.
02:48:33.000More indirect evidence than you can possibly imagine, with sober normal people claiming things that I can't believe, first-hand stuff.
02:48:44.000And then it gets weirder and worse from that.
02:48:47.000I would love to keep this just at metallic flying objects.
02:48:52.000But like, no, it's always going to be like, no, they go into the water and then, you know, the next level is like cattle mutilation.
02:49:00.000It's like, oh, please don't bring in cattle mutilation.
02:49:02.000Oh, yeah, the stapes, you know, the smallest bone in the body, the three bones that make mammals mammals, you know, one of them seems to be frequently missing.
02:49:11.000And then, like, Paul Hellyer and Chaim Eshed and Ben Rich Then there's this, like, crazy level where the former Canadian defense minister believes that there's a galactic federation, the humans are in contact, and the head of the Israeli...
02:49:42.000But I don't know how this amount of indirect evidence occurs because I don't think the government is capable of faking this.
02:49:49.000On the other hand, If we go by the indirect evidence, how is it that none of us have, like even the center of mass coordinates of this Tic Tac?
02:49:58.000You'll never hear me talking about the Tic Tac or the Zimbabwe kids or whatever.
02:50:39.000You're claiming it's something you can't understand and you have the 3D coordinates and I can't play with it in a model on like Google Earth or SketchUp or something?
02:51:30.000And every time I asked her out, she's like, I really want to go out with you, but I really have to wash my hair or I really have to hang out with my family.
02:51:36.000I was like, this is not going very well.
02:51:40.000At some point, somebody pulls me aside and said, Eric, you're Jewish.
02:51:58.000Do you think that they don't want to release the information because they're still trying to digest it themselves and they don't want it to get out publicly and get into the hands of China?
02:52:06.000I'm not smart enough to figure this out.
02:53:05.000Um, one possibility is we did a lot of bad stuff and we cannot get out of the fact that if we release what it is that we actually know and what has been going on, there's going to be a lot of consequence.
02:54:05.000So, hey, don't blow up this city because Biden's going to be there.
02:54:10.000And there are three systems that stop the first scene in The Matrix where the agents show up and local law enforcement is like, I think we can handle one little girl.
02:54:20.000No, Lieutenant, your men are already dead.
02:54:38.000We don't know about these things because this is only for grown-ups in the government.
02:54:43.000So they have to, like, file what it is that they're doing and then, oh, we've got an undercover agent who's posing as a Colombian drug lord.
02:54:52.000Don't bust him because we have got, like, 10 years invested in this thing.
02:55:25.000We're having a conversation and we may be stumbling on something the government doesn't want us to know, which is what happened when COVID maybe spilled out.
02:55:40.000So this is how they play keep away from the rest of us, where they tell each other what they're doing and the rest of us can't know what's going on.
02:55:49.000Now, when you say blue on blue, there's a situation that I want to give a name to because it doesn't have a name, which I'm going to call baby on cobalt and cobalt on baby.
02:55:59.000Baby and cobalt are two forms of blue.
02:56:01.000Cobalt is government and baby is like civilians, like you and me.
02:56:06.000What happens when a civilian stumbles on one of these operations?
02:56:11.000They're not allowed to use these systems.
02:56:14.000I called up the South Florida, I think, Case Explorer, had a half an hour conversation.
02:56:19.000They were telling me all sorts of stuff.
02:56:20.000And I said, I'd like to hear about Jeffrey Epstein.
02:57:06.000Now you've got a situation where they don't know what to do because you've got a civilian and you've got some sort of super secret dark thing that isn't supposed to exist.
02:57:14.000My claim is that conspiracy theorist is basically cobalt on baby.
02:57:21.000In other words, the government warning a private citizen, get away from that thing.
02:57:26.000We will start to destroy your reputation if you do not cease and desist.
02:57:38.000There's no troops under that army designation.
02:57:42.000You'd be a threat to this incredible operation because you have free speech and nobody knows how to shut you up.
02:57:48.000So consider that none of us know the answer to what does the government do When private citizens start to figure out statecraft narratives are bullshit.
02:57:58.000So, for example, Jeff Sachs was called in to supervise the investigation into the origin of COVID at The Lancet.
02:58:07.000And he puts in place all of the people who were involved with this through Peter Daszak.
02:58:13.000He later figures out, oh my god, I just put the foxes in charge of the hen house.
02:58:19.000So what if we have like a, since the 1970s, a 45-year-old workaround of the Biological Weapons Convention In Wuhan, we've created this thing called One Health and the EcoHealth Alliance we took over as a hippie charity.
02:58:34.000And if you ever take a look at the board of advisors of EcoHealth Alliance, it's wildly overpowered, including my old mentor, who's the head of the Sloan Foundation and the ex-head of the National Science Foundation.
02:58:44.000None of you guys look at the board of directors?
03:00:27.000I think many of us have figured out that we originally believed that it was Lee Harvey Oswald acting alone, and now we're not quite so sure.
03:00:35.000Do you know that it was Lee Harvey Oswald?
03:00:38.000Certainly the Warren report doesn't hold a lot of water with me anymore.
03:00:42.000A lot of us are going to have to deal with the fact that a lot of what we've been taught is crazy, is not crazy.
03:00:48.000Like the fact that this virus seems to have come out of a lab where we were trying to figure out how to put a furin cleavage site into a humanized coronavirus.
03:00:58.000And we're leaving in place the exact architecture that got us into this meth.
03:01:04.000There's no way we would do this without hearings.
03:01:07.000So what we're seeing is we're seeing an explosion, a collision between social media-empowered humans who are smart, trying to figure out the story, and the government's stonewalling us so that we can't figure out our own lives.
03:01:19.000Like, did my children get injected or infected with something that came out of your stupidity because Ralph Baric and Peter Daszak can't do their goddamn jobs?
03:01:30.000Are we going to have a tribunal about the fact that you infected planet Earth and you decreased human life expectancy by causing us to fight a different COVID infection every year?
03:01:56.000And I think we're not prepared to take responsibility for ruining the lives of ordinary Americans who were smart and honest because we couldn't do our jobs in the intelligence and defense communities.
03:02:06.000What do you think is responsible for the shift in communication about this stuff now?
03:02:11.000Because in the past, no one would acknowledge it.
03:02:20.000When I think about things like that, I go, well, there's a cynic in me that says, oh, if they're saying this, then it's probably horseshit.
03:02:26.000They're probably covering up for some drones they've created.
03:02:31.000In other words, the UFO phenomenon is multiple things.
03:02:34.000We know that it's a cover story for things like the stealth bomber.
03:02:38.000We also know that it's a cover story for our inability to take action against surveillance over flights of dirigibles and balloons.
03:02:47.000We also know that it's people misseeing things.
03:02:50.000Like, I've seen two UFOs recently that fooled other people.
03:02:57.000But I was able to figure out partially one with the help of Mick West, who is my antagonist, but also we're sort of, we're frenemies, kind of.
03:03:04.000And the other one was like a Mylar balloon that looked like a spherical fireworks display off the coast between Malibu and Catalina.
03:03:12.000The way it was being reflected by the sunlight?
03:03:14.000You know, the thing people don't understand about mylar balloons is that at night, a mylar balloon is a very confusing object to encounter because all you're seeing is like randomly scattered light.
03:03:22.000And it's like, oh my god, you know, this is like the Phoenix Lights.
03:03:25.000And I have like video of people in line at a Thai restaurant saying, oh my god, I've never seen anything like this.
03:03:32.000Of course, I go across the street to investigate and it says happy birthday.
03:03:36.000So there's no question that it's a certain amount of people wanting to see things that aren't there.
03:04:39.000So you're trying to find things on your phone?
03:04:41.000But in part, it's like I do this thing where I take license plates and every time I see a license plate with three letters, like NSA or MIT, I take a picture of it.
03:04:51.000So I have a huge number of these things because I'm trying to train my brain.
03:04:57.000Like in other words, it's not telling you to do something.
03:05:00.000If it says BTC, I shouldn't go out and buy a bunch of Bitcoin.
03:05:04.000People don't realize that you have to train yourself because you're going to see lots of patterns once you start looking for them.
03:05:10.000In finance, I used to build random number generators that had the correlation of the markets and I would generate pictures and the financial professionals would say, oh, we've got to buy.
03:05:19.000This is a classic head and shoulders pattern and there's going to break out.
03:05:22.000It's like I generated this out of a simulator written in Python.
03:05:55.000At the end of the day, once you've pulled out all the mundane things, the question is, is there a residue left of things that actually are mind-blowing?
03:06:05.000I can't tell you until I actually see stuff that somebody's willing to say, we captured this, it looks like this, but I can tell you that I am assured repeatedly by people who seem incredibly sober, who do not seem to be great actors, That they have seen amazing things.
03:06:22.000We have data that is as clear as you can imagine.
03:08:41.000You and him together would be so fascinating.
03:08:46.000His story hasn't fucking changed since 1989, man.
03:08:50.000If he's telling the truth, if he really was this propulsions expert from Los Alamos labs who they brought in because they were kind of trying to figure out what the fuck is going on, and everything's compartmentalized so no one can talk to anyone, so no real science can be done.
03:09:03.000And they're saying, tell me what you know.
03:09:44.000Yeah, but I think the claim is different.
03:09:46.000The claim is that this element must have some property or that...
03:09:49.000He said it's a stable version of this element and that in wherever these beings are from, they have access to a stable version of this element that we don't have access to here.
03:11:04.000So I interview Hal Puthoff, and we're talking about this stuff, and it goes to remote viewing.
03:11:09.000I'm like, oh, brother, I have to do remote viewing.
03:11:12.000Now, but if you think about it, When you get a FaceTime call from your wife who's traveling on business or something, or you're traveling on business, it doesn't matter, that's remote viewing.
03:11:24.000So you don't realize it, but something completely mundane to you, like a video call, It is a version of this insane sounding thing.
03:11:34.000It's just done through a device, much like a camera lens sees things, much like your eyes see things.
03:12:01.000We did not have a comfortable interaction.
03:12:03.000I was respectful, but I certainly communicated that for a guy who's trying to prove that this stuff is real, wouldn't you like to invite me to your private island if this stuff works rather than making exactly $26,000 or whatever the target amount was?
03:12:24.000It's like, well, I understand being too busy to make money because I've certainly exhibited that behavior.
03:12:30.000But if making money is the best way of advertising that this stuff is real, why wouldn't you actually do it?
03:12:39.000So that was a very uncomfortable interaction that I had with Hal.
03:12:43.000That doesn't necessarily mean that he doesn't do it.
03:12:46.000You know, there could be this thought that...
03:12:48.000And this is, you know, what people would say about psychic ability as well.
03:12:52.000There could be that thought that some people feel that abusing that power or using the power for personal gain would somehow or another diminish its effectiveness.
03:13:03.000I so much want to make money from geometric unity.
03:15:06.000Do you think that it's possible that there are states of consciousness that can be achieved through Some form of meditation or some form of training the mind to get into a very specific focus that would allow you to access information that is otherwise unavailable.
03:15:36.000So I would imagine it can't be done because I can't do it or haven't done it.
03:15:41.000But isn't it possible that there are states of mind that can be achieved through whether it's holotropic breathing or whether it's meditation, there's states of mind that are measurably achievable.
03:15:55.000That are very different from the current consciousness where two people are just talking.
03:15:59.000Is it possible that there's a way that some people have of occasionally tapping in to information that's unavailable to you or are right now?
03:16:08.000So let's do a junior version and then get to your question.
03:16:11.000The junior version is, is there a way that we can look inside your body without opening your body up to figure out whether you have pancreatic cancer?
03:17:12.000It's three bones in the ear, if I'm not mistaken.
03:17:15.000And those three bones have to do with insectivore ancestors who probably needed their ears detached from their jaws so they could hear high-pitched whining.
03:17:29.000Now, those three little bones that mean so much, what they do is they transmit sound through the tympanic membrane to the organ of Cordy so that the cilia in this rolled up seashell in your ear vibrate at particular frequencies.
03:17:45.000So when I'm talking to you and I say...
03:18:24.000However, it's not outside of the realm using the doubly scientific method which is You imagine that there's intelligence on the other end of this thing, and it's going to use every trick in the book because it's smarter than we are to figure out how to communicate with us.
03:19:22.000And my claim is that there are plenty of opportunities using the doubly scientific method.
03:19:29.000If something is much smarter than us and is able to communicate these things, Maybe it said to Hal, look, we can't interfere with you because we have a prime directive, but we can give you indirect hints.
03:20:01.0001987A, the supernova, I believe that the photons and the neutrinos were screaming at us and have arrived almost at the same time because the neutrinos we now know have a tiny mass, so they wouldn't be traveling at quite the speed of light.
03:20:16.000Now, the point is, let's imagine that we had Neil deGrasse Tyson on.
03:20:41.000He's not ready to do great science because great science has an element of irresponsibility to it.
03:20:49.000And what we don't understand, I think, about it is that when we decide that everybody has to do good science, it's like you doom yourself.
03:20:56.000Many of the greatest scientists of all time were borderline quacks The belief, for example, that Watson and Crick had that DNA had to be a helix.
03:21:07.000I mean, Jim Watson, somebody I know, and I dealt with four days straight.
03:21:12.000The reason he beat Rosalind Franklin is that she couldn't spend one day not being a good scientist.
03:21:18.000She was a good scientist, and he admitted he was not.
03:21:23.000But he was convinced it had to be a helix.
03:21:25.000And from her perspective, it's like, oh, you want to be Linus Pauling who figured out the alpha helix in protein.
03:21:30.000So you're going to take Linus's work and you're going to superimpose it on DNA and explain my Maltese cross.
03:21:36.000And it's not about male versus female.
03:21:39.000Absolutely, Jim Watson claims that if Rosalind Franklin had spent one afternoon thinking it was a helix, she would have gotten it before he did.
03:21:47.000That's an extremely generous, kind, feministic belief.
03:22:30.000You can be very technically proficient.
03:22:35.000Or you can figure out a way to do something someone hasn't done before and do it in a way where you're using creativity and science together.
03:22:54.000If you look at, for example, Jeff Beck's version of Drown in My Own Tears with Jules Holland, that is one of the greatest vocal performances I've ever heard.
03:25:33.000You ever heard Eva Cassidy get sick and sing Stormy Monday and something about the sickness causes her voice to do something that no voice has ever done?
03:26:51.000By the way, I just want to say something that you're not going to want me to say, but fuck you.
03:26:58.000I was hanging out with his bass player Tal Wilkenfeld, and she got COVID. And I heard that you sent a nurse with an IV with all of this sort of stuff to get Tal Wilkenfeld, this unbelievable bass player that just...
03:28:09.000So it's Incubus with Mike Einziger and Brandon Boyd.
03:28:13.000And that was Costa Rica where they were getting blown away and that she couldn't even see properly because her hair was getting blown into her eyes.
03:28:43.000In terms of vocal performance, I did not understand what this guy was able to do multidimensionally with that whammy bar and using the slide as a plectrum.
03:28:55.000This guy was developing techniques not to flash you, not to...
03:29:03.000But it was just like, I'm going to spend my entire life not becoming a rock star, but becoming the ultimate technician because of the things I feel in my soul that I want to share with you people.
03:30:44.000But I did have this envy, which is I want to be the gays and get you to work up actually what's going on with Jews and money and take the William Tell shot and Where you get past this sort of dime store stupid shit and actually,
03:31:02.000like, basically the thing about Jews and money is the Jews that had money survived.
03:31:08.000And the Jews that didn't have money died in the camps.
03:31:12.000And every diaspora community, whether it's the overseas Chinese, or you have the Parsis in India, or you have the Gujaratis in the east of Africa...
03:31:34.000What I found about you and the gays and professional wrestling thing, just for people who don't know, I was sitting there at the comedy store and Joe says, I was watching professional wrestling and it is so gay.
03:31:48.000That is definitely not how I set it up.
03:32:18.000And then, if I was sitting next to a gay guy and I started the evening homophobic, I guarantee you by the end of that act, which you figured out over multiple times that I saw, We were sitting there ready to hug each other.
03:32:29.000And I want you to do the same thing for us Jews.
03:32:33.000I want you to figure out your fucking money and Jewish thing and do for us what you did for the gays because that was a transformative experience.
03:32:43.000When I saw Chappelle take that shot on behalf of Kanye, I have to take a Kanye detour.
03:35:49.000And I get this call from Kanye the next day, because I'm not I'm just thinking I'm going to be killed in a drive-by shooting because I can't get home to my wife because I'm hanging out with Kanye.
03:36:09.000Eric, I can't tell you how amazing this all is.
03:36:11.000I was just at TMZ and I was explaining the theory about slavery and how this whole thing works and Jews and Passover and I was explaining how much I love Hitler.
03:38:59.000Your problem, Joe, to be honest with you, is that you and Dave Chappelle are held in such high regard by me, And I completely defended you 100%.
03:39:11.000This man has nothing to do with anti-Semitism.
03:39:53.000There is an aspect to Carlin's comedy, for example, or Richard Pryor's or Lenny Bruce's that is timeless and immortal because comedy is so much more than getting a belly laugh.
03:40:11.000I expect you guys to work – to keep – I want you to keep workshopping that thing until it finds its actual highest level.
03:40:20.000I'll tell you the joke about pizza's money in Jews, right?
03:40:26.000I used to go to the Harvard School in Los Angeles, which was the top, most exclusive Episcopalian school in L.A., And I was sandwiched between these two beautiful, muscular Aryan men, and they would make the following joke.
03:40:43.000Hey, Eric, what's the difference between pizzas and juice?
03:40:48.000A pizza doesn't scream when you put it in an oven, right?
03:44:28.000You wanna know who built America as a superpower?
03:44:31.000It's Edward Teller, it's Stanislav Ulam, it's Robert Oppenheimer.
03:44:36.000When you allow Jews into your country, we pay more taxes, we do more philanthropy, we make tons of fucking money, we do some criminal shit that's stupid, we've exploited people, which is unfair.
03:44:49.000It's a complicated equation, but that's our equation for survival.
03:44:53.000On balance, we over-contribute, over-succeed, and we love you.
03:46:32.000So we do do this thing where in some sense you have to understand how traumatized we are as a people.
03:46:41.000When I hear we aren't oppressed because we drive fancy cars, it's like my first cousin once removed died on the train out of Kiev when the Germans invade, froze to death.
03:46:52.000My cousin is a Mengele twin who forgave Mengele, which is what Kanye was trying to do.
03:47:57.000He stopped returning my phone calls because he felt manipulated.
03:48:01.000But the fact of the matter was I wanted Kanye to persist and I didn't want his comment about I love Hitler and TMZ to take him out because I thought he was a force for good.
03:48:11.000So, yes, there may be Jews that are exploiting him financially, but there are also Jews who are trying to save him, as I believe Lex tried to do a million times.
03:51:04.000Most people have no idea what's going on, which is good, because you just want them to have fun.
03:51:09.000But there's a thing going on where you're trying to sculpt it.
03:51:12.000If he wanted to take that subject and advance it to this Dave Chappelle, you know, coral belt and jujitsu level, because that's what he is, he would figure out a way to do it.
03:51:25.000And he would have it in a way that wouldn't be objectionable to you.
03:52:21.000And there are probably a few other people that I trust to do it, but it's not many.
03:52:25.000And the point being, which is that when other people were like quick to say, you know, this is anti-Semitic, this is uncomfortable, this is this, I had a different response, which is, and I think you're teaching me, it's not the monologue that you want, you want the routine that is workshopped and perfected.
03:54:42.000It's also there's too many fascinating people from all walks of life.
03:54:46.000The idea that you would categorize people by what geography they're from or what color their skin is...
03:54:52.000That to me seems so ridiculous and so stupid that I don't entertain it.
03:54:57.000It's not a thing that bounces around my head.
03:54:59.000So even to workshop it and defend it, to me it's like, oh my god, there's so many more interesting things about people.
03:55:05.000What's interesting to me about people What is the individual human beings take and the accumulation of all of our takes together when we try to work through this thing?
03:55:15.000What is this thing that we're experiencing together?
03:56:16.000Whether you can feel it or not, like if you look at, there's a guy named, what is it?
03:56:21.000Oh, he's figured out Leather Apron Club, which is both the name for the Junto that Benjamin Franklin established, which is something that we revere, and Leather Apron was the name for Jack the Ripper, so it's very clever, Martin Bailey, right?
03:56:34.000But he tracks, like, how many Jewish people does Joe Rogan have on his program, you know?
03:56:43.000It's incredibly important that all of us who are in a position to do this, who don't have to necessarily worry about, like, our next paycheck at a company, help everyone come together.
03:56:57.000Because right now our government isn't helping us come together.
03:57:00.000We're all sort of vaguely suspicious of each other.
03:57:03.000And nobody wants the assignment, in my opinion, Of like doing work?
03:57:15.000Like our differences are what empowers us because if it wasn't for all the different cultures that exist in the United States, it's one of the reasons why it's so fascinating here is because this is a country of immigrants.
03:57:28.000You know, with me, it's my grandparents.
03:57:30.000And, you know, with other people, they're direct descendants or they've come over here from somewhere else.
03:58:02.000I wish I could communicate, Joe, how much fear I have right now as a Jewish person on Twitter with the well of hatred that I feel coming up, which has been suppressed.
03:58:26.000You have two choices in a society like this.
03:58:28.000You can either try to control what people think and what they say, or you can have a cultural penalty for saying something that is horrible.
03:58:36.000And I want us to have free speech with a cultural penalty for these things, as opposed to having to regulate what you can and cannot say.
03:59:17.000And the issue is, I don't want a Jewish...
03:59:25.000Well, you don't want any rifts, right?
03:59:28.000Not just Jewish, but any rifts at all.
03:59:30.000And if we take it to the thing that you were talking about in the beginning with the fear of what's going on right now with Russia and Ukraine.
03:59:42.000In the absence of this idea that we're supposed to be opposed to other people, people that we don't even fucking know, why would there be any conflict at all between Russia and Ukraine?
03:59:53.000Why would there be any conflict at all between us and them?
04:00:50.000There is money that flows through Ukraine because it is a place where there are chemical labs and biological labs and there's bakshish and payment and all this kind of stuff.
04:01:01.000And my feeling is we're not allowed to know.
04:01:14.000You're going to potentially create a nuclear holocaust over something where you're getting paid in a way that I'm not.
04:01:20.000And if we don't fundamentally figure out how to love each other and to coexist and to celebrate each other, and this is another thing about, like, I'll tell you a Jewish thing.
04:01:31.000We have this one story we repeat every year in the Passover story, which is our name for Egypt is Mitzrayim.
04:01:39.000And Mitzrayim means the narrow places, and it's literally like the birth canal.
04:01:44.000It's the second birth of the Jewish people.
04:01:47.000And right now, all of earth is Mitzrayim.
04:01:59.000We view ourselves as chosen, not because like we're the best, because we're responsible.
04:02:05.000We believe that we are responsible for this planet.
04:02:08.000And we unleashed, we Jews, Edward Teller and Stanislav Ulam, both Jews, unleashed the power of the sun on the planet, which is dooming us to a very bad end.
04:02:19.000And I believe that we are chosen in the sense that it is our responsibility, not our privilege, not our this, not our that, not that we're on top, but it's our responsibility to shepherd the birth of the human race into an interstellar species.
04:02:36.000And, like, does that sound far-reaching?
04:02:45.000In my opinion, we feel responsible, not for ourselves, not to save ourselves, but for the entire planet.
04:02:51.000And I hope that other cultures feel the same responsibility and that they feel chosen in the same way.
04:02:56.000But right now, if you want to ask me, I forgo all sorts of financial opportunity because I feel like we unleashed holy hell on Earth that may be a civilization-ending thing.
04:03:10.000If we are open, we have to realize that what we unleashed to take care of Hitler and Nazism and the barbarity of Japan, like the rape of Nanking, we now have to deal with for all time.
04:03:24.000And this is like really important to us.
04:03:26.000We need to shepherd civilization to safety.
04:03:30.000And if you think about the Passover story, It's a tremendous question.
04:03:35.000Why repeat this one story that seems bizarre?
04:03:38.000Like you're enslaved in Egypt, you follow some crazy leader, you go through the Red Sea, you wander around the desert for 40 years, and you find the Promised Land.
04:03:48.000This is the story of where we are exactly at this minute.
04:03:52.000Like an old-fashioned, stupid fairy tale.
04:03:55.000It's like you've been telling this story every year for a reason because the people who waited for the bread to rise, that's why we eat unleavened bread, died.
04:04:06.000And the people who understood early, okay, this sounds completely crazy, but you're going to have to make a break for it through the Red Sea, wander around in pain before you actually get to safety.
04:05:11.000It's like, this is Shackleton's story.
04:05:13.000Shackleton stepped up when any normal human being would say, look, take whatever resources you have and have a good time because you're done.
04:05:39.000And whether you know that this is the time or not, we have to come together.
04:05:44.000And that's one of the reasons that like...
04:05:49.000I wanted you to understand how much I appreciated what you've done for underprivileged groups, people who are hurting.
04:05:55.000People don't really understand how big your heart is because you hide it.
04:05:59.000And that's one of the things I wanted for the Jewish people and I wanted from you, which is like more Chappelle, more Joe Rogan, more humor, more love.