In this episode of The Joe Rogan Experience, the host talks with filmmaker Jeff Sagansky about his new documentary, "I Know What I Saw: The UFO Crash in Brazil" and how he became a believer in the possibility that aliens crashed in the Brazilian city of Belo Horizonte in the late 80s and early 90s. In this episode, Jeff talks about his journey to becoming a filmmaker, how he got into the UFO field, and what it was like being on the set of his first UFO documentary. He also talks about what it's like to be a UFO skeptic, and why he thinks aliens crashed a UFO crash in Brazil in the 1980s and why it's a good thing it happened in a place where people claim to have seen something like that before. Joe also shares some of his thoughts on the Roswell incident, and how it changed the way he thinks about UFO's and the conspiracy theories that have been floating around since 1947. You won't want to miss this episode! Check it out! -Joe Rogan Podcast by day, by night, all day. All day long. -The Joe Rogans Experience by Night, All Day. Thanks for listening, Joe! XOXO, All Day! Cheers, Cheers. -Jon & James -Jon and James - The Crew at the UFO Project - The UFO Project, by Night and Day, by Day and Night, By Night, all Day, By Day and All Day by Night. Jon and James at the Podcast by Night by Day & All Day, All By Day by Day - By Night by Night - by Night , All Day All Day by Night & All By Night by Day, Jon & James at The UFO Podcast by Day by By Night All Day By Night - By Day & By Night By Day - All Day , By Night , By Day - By Evening, By Morning, By Late Afternoon, By By Day By Day, The UFO Experience, By Any Other - By Late Night, by Late Night By Late Nights, By Early Morning, by Any Other, By Evening - By Any Day, Day & Early Nights, by Evening, by Sleep, By Even After Evening, , By Any Time, By Bedtime, By Sleep, By Anytime, by Rest, By Their True Belongings, By Then, By A Night, Then By Anyday, By Grayspace, By They'll Have A Chance To Sleep, by They'll See Them Sleep, Then They'll Hear Them Listen To Hear Them, By Listen To Them, They'll Learn More, By Having A Good Night,
00:00:21.000I loved your first documentary, but when someone says there's a documentary about a crashed UFO and it happened in Brazil, I'm always like, man, people tell stories, you know?
00:00:40.0001947. You know, I think some shenanigans are going on, but what what was it really and how much of this is just people tell stories and those stories grow and change over the years and and You know almost like the story becomes their real memory after a while because they've been doing it for you know So many so many years,
00:00:58.000but then this one this one just right away the way you captured all the the information and the evidence and the The eyewitness accounts, the photographs that people got, the depictions of the actual being,
00:01:16.000the fact that there was live beings Everyone that didn't even know each other having these really similar stories about what they saw and when people got a hold of the wreckage.
00:01:28.000When you first started making this documentary, did you have any apprehension like, oh, this one, how do I sell a documentary on a crashed UFO? What's the best way to put this together?
00:01:40.000Because that's part of the art of what you do, right?
00:06:07.000Because one of the things that the critics of Lazar always bring up is his education at MIT. I can explain that to you off air in the way that he explained it to me.
00:07:34.000And I was interviewing this guy out at Area 50. He lived on the outskirts of the base in a place near the Little Ailey Inn in Rachel, Nevada.
00:07:46.000And Chuck, this guy's name is Chuck Clark, and he had found all these, and the relevance of what I'm telling you will come to light in a second here, he'd found all these vantage points on the mountaintops that he could spy on the base down below with high-powered telescopes with cameras.
00:08:01.000And he was taking photographs of exotic airplanes coming out of the hangars and stuff like that.
00:08:06.000He wrote a book called, like, UFO Area 51 Handbook and Guide or something.
00:08:15.000And he had a couple of really cool sightings out at Area 51 that were really, like he saw these, it's in my movie, he saw these lights doing things that they shouldn't be doing, right?
00:08:25.000Like traversing and then stopping and then taking off really fast.
00:08:29.000So anyway, so I'm covering his story, because I was intrigued.
00:08:32.000I mean, in the early 90s, the Bob Lazar thing was everywhere.
00:08:35.000I was making a doc on UFOs, so I was kind of looking into it.
00:09:16.000This must have been, I'm going to guesstimate 95, 94, 95. Get to his house, and he's got a double wide right near the little alien, and he pops in this VHS tape.
00:09:30.000And it was like two guys on the quintessential road trip just to Area 51. You know, the surrounding areas, Rachel and the extraterrestrial Lonely Highway, and they're goofing off the alien taking videos of each other.
00:09:44.000Just the typical road trip out to Area 51, right?
00:09:50.000And then they're goofing off next to the photographs of the alien in the crashed disk, and then they're inside the little alien, and I'm like, okay, where's this going?
00:09:58.000And all of a sudden, and I saw this with my own eyes, all of a sudden, the car's parked, and it's parked out by the black mailbox in the desert, and it's dusk.
00:10:09.000The camera is on the armrest between the two seats, and it's slightly cocked, like it's not level.
00:10:18.000And it's filming the dashboard and the screen, the windscreen, windshield.
00:10:24.000And there's two guys in there sounding like, you can't see them, sounding like they're trying to crawl under the seats.
00:10:50.000Like if you can imagine, I've never seen anything like this.
00:10:53.000If you could put a pendulum with a light source above a vehicle, like above the car, like this, but very slow in fluid motion, like rocking back and forth, the shadows and the lights on the inside of the car are doing this really eerily.
00:14:02.000Because I went on a couple of podcasts and I said, screw it, I don't care anymore.
00:14:05.000I saw this video, I'm going to start talking about it.
00:14:07.000Chuck Clark said, if you ask me again after like 10 years or 12 years, I'm never talking to you again.
00:14:12.000So I was like, I of course asked him again.
00:14:14.000I said, I'll give you 30 grand for the video and he's not talking to me.
00:14:17.000So, I went on like a concrete podcast and I went on this guy Julian Dorian's podcast and I went on a bunch of other podcasts and I gave the whole story.
00:14:26.000Let's let somebody else pick up the ball and run with it.
00:14:29.000I'm just telling you what I saw, okay?
00:14:33.000I get contacted a couple years ago by a guy who goes, I saw that video too.
00:14:39.000Then another guy contacts me and he goes, I'm a private investigator and I find people.
00:14:49.000Right at that time, I'm going on the Impulsive podcast with Logan Paul, and I tell Logan Paul the story, and he has exactly the same response you have, and I don't blame you, okay?
00:15:01.000I'm not here to convince anybody of anything.
00:16:25.000So Logan Paul's like, alright, well this guy doesn't want to, you know, he's gonna die with it, so let's get, you know, let's get this thing on camera.
00:16:32.000So Logan's like, well let me see it at least.
00:16:35.000So Logan like looks at it with this thing and, oh could you show it to me again?
00:16:38.000Gets another angle, gets another angle, and then he leaves.
00:16:44.000So Logan's like, I don't know if I want to go public.
00:16:52.000So I said, look, you know, this is a story that might be of interest to Bob Lazar, because maybe Bob Lazar should see this video, and he could make a determination.
00:17:50.000And I'm not out here attacking Lazar or nobody else.
00:17:52.000I'm just saying maybe he was used as a disinformation plant that cedes some real information and some bogus information, just to kind of test the waters and the reaction of the public.
00:18:08.000Also, I would imagine if you're going to give people access to classified information like that, you'd be very careful and you would probably add in some stuff that's not true.
00:18:38.000And the one that sticks in my mind, and I know this probably shouldn't because it's possible to do, is that it's been consistent.
00:18:46.000His story's been absolutely consistent since the late 1980s.
00:18:50.000Now that's possible to develop a narrative and if your discipline is obviously very intelligent, you could just like craft the longest con the world has ever known and make no money from it and turn your life upside down and have the feds search your property, which they did.
00:19:08.000If they thought that he really was in possession of element 115, and that there really is a stable version of this element that we discovered in a particle collider, or we accurately, they predicted it and then proved it to be real in a particle collider.
00:19:31.000I want to say, was it like 2011 when they officially discovered particle 115 or element 115?
00:19:39.000But this element, he said, was stable wherever these beings are from, and they use it to propel their craft through a means of Bypassing normal propulsion systems with some insanely sophisticated method where they can pick points in space and they essentially just instantaneously traverse these points in space.
00:20:13.000And it's about April 1966. And the reason why I'm bringing this up is because I did a segment on a landing case that happened at Westall in 1966, which is a suburb,
00:20:28.000Westall Primary School, which is a suburb of Melbourne.
00:20:32.000I just covered a section of it in the phenomenon.
00:20:36.000And during my time in Australia, I'd heard about this guy, James Kibble, that shot a Polaroid of a disc a couple of kilometers away, two days prior to the landing at the school.
00:20:48.000A lot of times when you have mass sightings like that, they're in and around the area for several days.
00:20:53.000So it's very likely that those two are connected.
00:21:43.000And when I interviewed all the children, now adults, that watched this thing land at this Westall Primary School in 1966, They said the same thing.
00:21:54.000They got up to, I think, around 10 feet away from it, which is pretty remarkable.
00:21:57.000When you talk to witnesses, especially that many witnesses, I mean, there were roughly 300 kids, I didn't meet all 300 of them, in the playground when this happened, and including the science teacher, this guy Greenwood, which I got him on camera for the first time in history and the phenomenon.
00:22:13.000They said it got off the ground and then it went like this.
00:22:29.000This is 1966. So, and I'm going to get to this later.
00:22:33.000We can go back to a moment of contact.
00:22:34.000But I'm going to make the argument that That some, and I cannot emphasize how many times we need to underline the word some, UFOs, UAP, originate from a non-human intelligence.
00:22:50.000And I'll start off in 45, and I'll take us up to modern day.
00:22:54.000Just a handful of cases that I have personally investigated.
00:22:59.000I have personally met the witnesses, gone to their houses, dating back to 45, 47, 52, 57, 55, 60s, 64, like all these cases, okay?
00:23:10.000So basically what I'm going to do is we all know We know that the vast majority of these cases can be explained in conventional terms.
00:23:20.000All this noise about Chinese balloons and weather balloons, that's all noise.
00:23:29.000Yeah, we know that all this stuff exists.
00:23:30.000But what about the core 5% or 10% of cases, and I'm going to give you some samples today, that truly, after extensive and exhaustive investigation, not because of a lack of data, That defy a conventional explanation,
00:23:46.000and those are the cases that I'll share with you today when we're ready.
00:23:50.000But we can go back to a moment of contact if you want.
00:23:59.000I got a much better copy outside, but see the way it turns sideways?
00:24:03.000Now, let me tell you, if you ever see a photograph of a UFO, and I've talked to NASA's analysis about this, And it has a clearly defined edge.
00:25:11.000And we can get into my argument that I'm gonna put forth as if I'm presenting a case to a jury.
00:25:20.000See, my number one problem always with these things is that I want it to be true so bad that I worry that my rational, logical mind It ignores all the possibilities of it being bullshit.
00:25:35.000Don't look at any one particular case.
00:27:55.000That's Rex Heflin, Santa Ana, California.
00:28:01.000And there are several Polaroids from Rex Heflin.
00:28:05.000You can look up Rex Heflin, it's a pretty damn good case.
00:28:07.000All jokes aside, how many of these do you think are fake?
00:28:10.000Well, I'm showing you the ones that have been scrutinized to death, and no one has made any serious claims of being a hoax on the cases that I'm giving you right now.
00:28:21.000So that image right there, could you bring me that again, Jamie?
00:28:24.000That image right there, it's like, I feel like someone could fake that.
00:28:28.000Well, you've got to listen to the testimony of Evelyn Trent and her husband Paul, and you've got to listen to the analysis that Condon Committee did on this.
00:28:47.000I think, listen, if you had a unique experience, if you were out in the desert and you're driving to Nevada, and all of a sudden your engine lights went off, closed the counters of the third kind style, and you got out and there was a fucking disc, And it hovered over you for a second, and it took off at an insane rate of speed,
00:29:02.000and you're just left there alone with this memory.
00:29:05.000I sympathize with those people because in the vast universe that we exist in, it's entirely possible that something like that has the power to get here.
00:29:42.000But I also think, God, if you wanted to get someone that you could easily discredit, if you had a propulsion system that was baffling you, and you had some wizard who likes to make hydrogen-powered Corvettes, and he put a rocket engine in the back of a Honda.
00:30:22.000And he's walking around there, and he's like, what the fuck is this?
00:30:26.000Like, that's the kind of guy you'd, if you're at the end of your rope, if you know, especially if you're a brilliant person, if you're a brilliant person, and you happen to be a general, or happen to be someone who's in charge over there, and you're thinking, like, we gotta look outside the box,
00:30:41.000like, we gotta do something, we gotta bring in other perspectives, And you've got to bring in someone that's not going to be able to communicate with other scientists.
00:31:15.000Oh, you got this guy at Los Alamos Lab.
00:31:17.000He puts fucking rocket engines in the back of some Hondas, and he's a propulsions expert.
00:31:21.000He's kind of nuts, but maybe bring him in.
00:31:24.000Yeah, so I'll get back to my domain, because this is the stuff that I know, and I know primarily because I went and interviewed the witnesses.
00:31:39.000The reason why I shared that video story is not because I'm sitting there telling you that's the definitive piece of evidence that the world's been waiting for, but it's very compelling.
00:31:47.000It's never been released, and I'm giving you guys a lead on that.
00:33:55.000The biggest archive you could spend the rest of your life in there.
00:33:58.000So he gave me a bunch of stuff that was archive interviews of primarily people at White Sands, Holloman Air Force Base, different areas in Texas.
00:34:08.000And I was just putting it in, it's kind of like a little montage in the piece of just giving the illustration that these things are going on kind of all over.
00:34:15.000And my buddy goes, hey man, let's put a map on the wall and put pins in the map for all these different locations.
00:34:21.000So I was like, oh, okay, sure, let's do that.
00:34:23.000So we put a map on the wall in the edit room when we're doing the phenomenon.
00:34:27.000And we were putting pins in, and we looked at each other after like a day or two, and we were like, look at proximity to Trinity Site.
00:34:44.000So anyway, we didn't really take it much further than that, but we definitely took notice.
00:34:49.000And then I met with Senator Harry Reid.
00:34:51.000Thank you, George Knapp, for helping make that happen.
00:34:54.000Former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, who started the AATIP program.
00:34:57.000And during the interview, I didn't think about asking him this, but at the end, and he had like, I'll have 47 minutes with you, and then I gotta go, and he's got all the security guards and...
00:35:08.000Big guys with earpieces looking at me.
00:35:11.000I said, well, sir, would you mind if we could do a quick walk and talk?
00:35:16.000He goes, yeah, I'll give you 45 seconds.
00:35:18.000So I figured, well, while I'm walking with Senator Reid, I'm going to ask him what was one of the more astonishing aspects of the phenomenon that they uncovered during this Pentagon UFO program.
00:35:27.000And right away, without hesitation, he goes, the fact that there are incursions over our nuclear missile facilities, nuclear-armed facilities, that is of grave concern.
00:35:39.000That was a shocking aspect of the phenomenon.
00:35:41.000And I thought back to that map that we'd done in the edit room.
00:35:44.000So I was like, I gotta go back to the drawing board.
00:36:07.000I tell you what, you can have all my archives, all the videos that I shot.
00:36:10.000So I went through all of it and I put together just like a five or ten minute segment in the phenomenon, that connection.
00:36:16.000And you got all these like missile control launch officers and people at Malstrom Air Force Base, Minot Air Force Base, talking about these incredible incursions.
00:36:24.000And keep in mind, You're talking about people that we entrusted with the securement and deployment of nuclear weapons, okay?
00:36:35.000So if these guys are lying, that's a problem.
00:36:38.000And if these guys are hallucinating, When they've got nuclear weapons at their disposal, that's terrifying.
00:37:01.000Robert Sallis is Lieutenant Robert Sallis, launch control officer, United States Air Force, has this incredible encounter in Malmstrom, his people do, and UFO sighted, a disk, and then his nukes start shutting down.
00:37:17.000He said to me, I'll never forget this, and this is like 2002. This is part of Out of the Blue.
00:39:07.000I put 15, 20, 25. Let me give you another example.
00:39:12.000Joint Base, Rendlesham Forest, December 1980. It's a joint British-U.S. base.
00:39:20.000It's called the Rendlesham Forest Incident.
00:39:23.000There was a landing, December 1980. You've got Jim Penniston, John Burroughs, and this guy Ed Kabansag thinking that, like, something crashed in the forest or something.
00:39:34.000They went out to investigate, and there's an object sitting on the forest floor.
00:40:39.000I don't know, maybe six feet high, and it was black, and he said it was warm to the touch, and it didn't make any sound, very little sound, and then it lifted off the forest floor, maneuvered up through the trees, and shot off at a high rate of speed.
00:40:49.000Now, these are people that are responsible for the security of our nuclear weapons, saying this.
00:40:54.000The deputy base commander, Colonel Charles Halt, saying this.
00:40:58.000Gordon Williams, the general of the entire base, I interviewed him as well.
00:41:02.000He talks about how the fact that this got out.
00:41:04.000It was a memo that was written by Deputy Base Commander Colonel Charles Holt that leaked, and the whole story got out.
00:41:09.000But those are the cases that I'm talking about that represent that 5 or 10 percent core.
00:41:15.000That cannot be explained away in conventional terms.
00:41:44.000Yeah, so most likely they just said...
00:41:46.000And then one of the things that Colonel Charles Halt said, the deputy base commander, is that a plane came in, and there was some unknown government, U.S. agency.
00:41:55.000I know you guys are probably thinking I'm crazy now, but don't take it from me.
00:41:58.000I'm just telling you what they told me.
00:42:01.000That they came in and kind of sanitized the whole case.
00:42:04.000But that's a very good case, and it's one of the top cases that is extremely...
00:42:09.000It's been investigated in England, it's been investigated in the United States, and a lot of the witnesses have come forward on the record.
00:42:15.000So it's quite possible that somewhere in some archive this photo exists, or some photos exist.
00:42:24.000If the government keeps coming out and telling us that we may begin to face threats from outside of this world, if they're telling us that when they're discussing these things that they behave in a way that we can't describe and no propulsion systems that we know of,
00:42:41.000if they're telling us all this, why wouldn't they release all that other stuff too?
00:42:45.000Why wouldn't they release those photographs for us?
00:42:52.000But what's in it for them to even admit?
00:42:54.000I mean, just the way they're addressing it now.
00:42:56.000People think that there was a sudden epiphany with the U.S. government that they wanted to be more transparent and they wanted the general public to know more about this phenomenon.
00:43:09.000What happened is a couple of insiders in December of 2020 Of 2017, walked some evidence out of ATIP, found a loophole, and put it on the front page of the New York Times.
00:43:27.000I actually got a phone call when the film was coming out and I got a phone call from Leslie Kane and she goes, Christopher Mellon told you that he was the one that walked the footage out of the Pentagon?
00:44:02.000I was investigating a landing case in Socorro, New Mexico.
00:44:06.000It was April 24th, 1964. I spent five years on this case.
00:44:11.000It was the case that turned around Dr. Jalen Hynek.
00:44:15.000Dr. Jalen Hynek investigated UFO reports for the United States Air Force as a scientific advisor from 47 to 69. He's the one that coined all the term close encounter of the first kind, close encounter of the second kind, close encounter of the third kind.
00:44:34.000Close encounter of the first kind is when you see a UFO at close range.
00:44:37.000Close encounter of the second time, you see a UFO and somehow it interacts with the environment, whether like Richard Dreyfuss's face got burnt or it leaves marks on the ground or it burns trees or whatever.
00:44:55.000Close encounter of the third kind is when beans are reported by the witnesses.
00:44:59.000So beans associated with the craft are reported.
00:45:02.000One of the best, most well-documented cases in U.S. history took place at Core New Mexico, April 24th, 1964, at 5 o'clock with a police officer that was on duty by the name of Lonnie Zamora.
00:46:00.000The Air Force wanted him desperately not to talk about the beans.
00:46:07.000They discouraged him to talk about the beans, and I'll tell you why.
00:46:11.000It's one thing when you see an unknown object like David Fravor saw up in the sky, exhibiting a technology that seems to defy conventional propulsion.
00:46:22.000And it's another thing altogether when you've got beans on the ground.
00:46:26.000The Air Force didn't want him talking about that, and that was one thing that his daughter and his wife told me clearly.
00:46:31.000And his wife said Lonnie was never the same after that case.
00:47:43.000Lonnie had passed a couple years prior to that.
00:47:45.000And I... I don't know how far down the rabbit hole you want to go in this case, because we could talk on this case for three hours, but whatever.
00:47:52.000I could tell you that I got access to, he had this black duffel bag, and it was with his wife's permission.
00:47:58.000He had kept all the original news prints from, like, the articles that had come out, and that's where I got the details.
00:48:04.000And he also talked about it in some recordings that I got from his family and other researchers.
00:48:48.000It starts making some weird noise, and it has a blue flame that comes out.
00:48:54.000And he said it was not like a rocket flame where it would hit the ground and dust everything up, but it pierced the ground like a knife through warm butter.
00:49:02.000And then when it got about 20 feet off the ground, it went completely silent with no flame, no nothing.
00:49:09.000There was a symbol on the side of the craft.
00:49:11.000It was in yellow, and it was about three feet tall, and it was like a V like this, two lines and a line on top.
00:49:18.000Let's get a photo of that symbol that he recreated.
00:49:21.000Yeah, you'll see fake symbols because Richard T. Holder asked him to draw a different symbol.
00:49:27.000I actually have the original symbol on a document from Dr. Hunter.
00:49:31.000Why did someone ask him to draw a fake symbol?
00:49:34.000Because he said that if anybody else claimed to see the same craft with that symbol, they would immediately be able to identify a hoaxster.
00:51:04.000In fact, Lonnie, I've got an interview with Lonnie where he says that one of the officers who arrived on the scene...
00:51:10.000Actually saw it fly off in the distance, and it was witnessed by other people in the town that saw the thing flying.
00:51:16.000Didn't the Tic Tac, the people who saw the Tic Tac, including Commander Fravor, didn't he say that there was some sort of thing that almost looked like landing gear?
00:51:24.000No, there was something that protruded out in the front of it or something.
00:51:28.000But apparently the video, I think it was according to Fravor, the video is...
00:51:33.000The one that's been out, the resolution is a lot worse than what other people had seen at the time.
00:51:39.000I remember, I'm pretty sure David Fravor said that to me.
00:51:42.000So I just recently went, I'm filming a new doc, and I went to Washington, D.C. for a month to get kind of caught up on what's been happening, because a lot's been happening.
00:51:52.000While I'm doing Moment of Contact, there's an unprecedented effort in Washington, D.C. to push for further government transparency.
00:52:02.000Marco Rubio, Senator Gillibrand, Andre Carson, Representative Andre Carson, who got the congressional hearings that happened last year, Gallego, Representative Gallego, and Gallagher have all been involved in others.
00:52:14.000And so I got introduced to some intelligence folks on the inside, and they wanted me to read this to your audience, okay?
00:52:40.000The UFO, UAP activity and the authorities response to them.
00:52:44.000I can assure you there's a lot more evidence behind the curtain that hasn't been released.
00:52:49.000First, our military are and have been seeing remarkable things in the sky, in the oceans and on the land for years.
00:52:57.000Of those reported, where does all this information get stored?
00:53:01.000Authorities would have you believe that this data is destroyed, but unique data is stored somewhere to be reviewed later.
00:53:08.000And as someone that has seen the classified holdings, I am very disappointed in the fact that Dr. Kirkpatrick showed some of the most mundane videos to the public.
00:53:18.000I do understand that there are security factors to be considered, so I'm hoping that Senator Gillibrand saw something much more interesting in her closed-door hearing with Kirkpatrick.
00:53:27.000And why did only two senators show up for the hearing?
00:53:30.000Have they lost faith in Kirkpatrick already?
00:53:32.000I applaud Senator Gillibrand's efforts to find the truth, but I am more sure than ever that Kirkpatrick is not the one.
00:54:29.0004K? Just think about as good as you can imagine of craft.
00:54:32.000And to know that, and I spoke to five other people that are part of the program or had the top secret clearances to access this, and they all confirmed...
00:54:43.000And it's like they're just on the other side of that curtain.
00:54:45.000Could somebody just get those out here, please?
00:55:46.000I found out in China, just a couple years ago, there's a case that happened in 1994, the same time as Rua, called Meng Zhaogua in the Black Forest of China.
00:55:55.000And these guys, in the middle of nowhere, relayed the same telepathic message that the children received in Rua, Zimbabwe, in 1994 at Ariel's school.
00:56:06.000And by the way, I did include a piece of that in the film that I did with the girls.
00:56:10.000I don't know, it's only like 10 minutes long.
00:57:20.000Or, a UFO crashed, live aliens were recovered, and the Americans, it was captured by the Brazilian authorities, and the Americans stepped in and flew some of that back to the United States.
00:59:38.000Could you think of a more extraordinary...
00:59:40.000Let's just say, hypothetically for a moment, it happened.
00:59:43.000As all the witnesses stated, it happened.
00:59:45.000How big of a story do you think that is?
00:59:46.000It's an immense story because it means that they're real.
00:59:49.000If it's true that it means they're real.
00:59:51.000It means something that we don't understand was in the sky, got hit by lightning, got caught up in a furious lightning storm, and wound up crashing.
01:00:01.000And that these things survived and they got out.
01:00:04.000And the fact that one guy handled one of them and got this insane infection and died very quickly afterwards.
01:00:12.000And he was very young and healthy military man.
01:00:15.000And the fact that all these people have the same story.
01:00:19.000They all have the same depiction of the disc, the craft.
01:00:23.000They have the same depictions of seeing these beings?
01:00:29.000We had to track down every one of those witnesses, and there's a story behind each and every one of them that I could go on for an hour for.
01:01:37.000Unless that guy is a Daniel Day-Lewis quality actor...
01:01:41.000We don't need Brad Pitt anymore, nor Leonardo DiCaprio.
01:01:44.000That guy, if he's full of shit, he's one of the best actors ever because that moment when he gets to that spot and he's overwhelmed with emotion, he starts tearing up and he's freaking out.
01:01:54.000Just imagine if 25 years ago you experienced something that literally destroyed your understanding of life itself in the universe.
01:02:04.000That there's a thing out there that can visit us that's different than us and it's probably been here forever.
01:02:10.000My DP, David West, has been shooting for over 40 years, and he's like, I've never seen anything like that.
01:03:47.000Imagine being these people in this small city of 150,000 people, and then something happens, and a fucking UFO crashes in a field, and people witness it.
01:03:58.000And everyone is just stuck there, then the military shuts the town down.
01:04:53.000So anyway, we do the interview, and I was like, well, I'm not going to ask him, I guess, but when the camera stopped rolling, I was like, please.
01:05:00.000I mean, Marco and I were begging and pleading with this guy, and I remember I looked him dead square in the eyes.
01:05:05.000I said, I swear on my life, there are no recording devices.
01:05:41.000Now, the reason why I share that is because that's not something that I can put any weight on for the documentary for people like you, right?
01:05:49.000But as a personal message for me, knowing that level of validation, On the inside, it kept us going.
01:05:58.000It was like, okay, why on earth would he have done that?
01:08:01.000And I asked Katya, and I asked all the girls, During that moment of contact, when you lock eyes, I know it's only a brief second, but during that moment of contact, what did you feel?
01:08:51.000But this time, when the mother said that these men showed up and tried to get the daughters to say they were lying and offered her a briefcase full of $100 bills and they could relocate...
01:09:08.000You can hear the mother talking about it, and she's so emotional.
01:09:10.000And the mother came back to the location where it happened, the smell, that stench, and the footprint on the ground.
01:09:17.000I mean, everybody talks about that stench that was so...
01:09:20.000They said, if you ever take, like, a skunk, multiply that by, like, 100,000, that would give you some indication of the level of, like, how putrid and nasty.
01:09:49.000The guy said that he had to close off that wing in the hospital while they were sanitizing it, because it was so intense.
01:09:54.000You know, so, I... How long did it last for?
01:09:59.000I heard days and weeks is what I heard from people.
01:10:02.000And even the mother said when she went to where the creature was, she said that the stench, even there after the creature was gone, got in her nasal cavities and she tried to flush it out with water and saline or whatever and she couldn't get it out of her nasal cavities.
01:11:15.000On the last trip I came back, I was just like, I was so rocked.
01:11:18.000I couldn't reintegrate back into culture.
01:11:21.000Joe, I was just like, It's the biggest story ever.
01:11:27.000So people were asking me, even my neighbor who runs that Make-A-Wish Foundation, he was like, James, he goes, bro, I like you a lot and I got a lot of respect for you, but you lost me on this one.
01:13:35.000I've been shouldering that burden for 26 years, and I've so desperately wanted to tell somebody, to share that story with the rest of the world.
01:13:43.000And you meet these people, and you think, why on earth?
01:14:13.000And it was like this kind of sketchy area.
01:14:16.000You know, it's like when you get out of your car and you could see, like, people drawing the curtains back and looking at you and you're standing out.
01:14:23.000Like, dude, I still had like a sore thumb, man.
01:14:26.000And then we walked up and I had Marco with me, thank God, and we had camera crews and stuff.
01:14:32.000And Marta appears, and her husband appears in this big, he's a big guy, and he's got like a white beater shirt on, and he looks like he wants to rip my fucking head off.
01:14:43.000And I'm like, and she's looking at me, and he's just looking at her going, Marta's looking, Marta's looking at her husband, and her husband's looking at Marta like, give me the signal and I'll kill this guy.
01:14:53.000That's the fucking, and I was looking at Marco, and I was like, James, you need to think quick on your feet right now.
01:14:59.000And I said immediately, please translate this.
01:15:01.000I'm here to give your brother justice.
01:16:33.000And he said, first time in the history of my career, I took the x-rays and I couldn't even verify that they were good because they took them immediately.
01:16:41.000And then they said, this event never happened.
01:16:43.000He said, the stench in the hospital was overwhelming.
01:16:47.000And he goes through the different x-rays that he took.
01:16:52.000The abdomen, the head, the arms, the legs, the thorax, you know.
01:17:36.000These are people that I really want to meet.
01:17:37.000I mean, people are coming forward in droves right now.
01:17:40.000We just got two forensic pathologists for the first time ever working together to come forward to make statements, and they're providing documentation of the autopsy reports done on the deceased military officer.
01:17:52.000That's the first time ever these guys are coming forward.
01:17:56.000Let's explain what happened to people who haven't watched the documentary to the deceased military officer.
01:18:00.000So right after the three girls came within eight to ten feet of this creature or being or entity or ET, whatever you want to call it, about an hour later, that was about three o'clock in the afternoon, I would say probably maybe around five o'clock,
01:18:16.000There were two military guys on patrol, on the lookout for something unusual, is what they were told.
01:18:57.000So they went to regional hospital and then ultimately it went to Humanitas Hospital.
01:19:02.000And so we have testimony from Military X that when he drove it from Humanitas Hospital, it's in the movie, but he drove it from Humanitas Hospital.
01:19:12.000As a military base where it spent the night in the truck for one night, and then it went from there to Esposix Campinas.
01:19:19.000It's where all the intellectual scientific heavyweights reside.
01:19:22.000And then it was there, I think, under examination, according to the witnesses that we talked to, for a day or two, and that's when the Americans flew in to Campinas.
01:19:30.000And we have the radar military control officer who came forward last year, actually two years ago, when we were there filming for the last time.
01:19:38.000His name is Marco Feres, F-E-R-E-S. And he came forward for the first time and said, yeah.
01:19:44.000In January of 1996, this plane came in, USAF, he kept calling it, United States Air Force, came in and didn't have the authorization of the Brazilian government.
01:20:27.000One of the most exciting aspects for me to getting invited on your show is that you've got a huge platform of a lot of people listening.
01:20:37.000I want to know, we all want to know desperately what happened when the United States took over, where did this stuff go, who was involved, who flew that airplane, the flight records, all of these things.
01:20:50.000And so I'm asking you, please, please, if you're listening to this, to come forward and talk to us.
01:20:58.000If you're too afraid to talk to me, There's new whistleblower protection that Senator Gillibrand and Rubio and a handful of others just signed into law.
01:21:08.000You can go and contact someone like Representative Andre Carson, and there's a process you can go and testify and tell everything we know without fear of prosecution or violating any NDAs.
01:21:21.000Now, excuse me, there are a handful of Congress people and senators that I believe are sincerely trying to get down to the bottom of this stuff.
01:21:30.000I've met with some of them, and I've continued to try to meet with someone else.
01:21:32.000I'm working with a guy named Brian Bender.
01:21:35.000He's kind of consulted on the project.
01:21:36.000He worked for Politico, and he's got great access as well.
01:21:41.000We're trying to address the evidence, the photographic evidence, the potential debris evidence, the potential body evidence...
01:21:51.000Where is it and who has the authority to release it?
01:21:56.000You know, I've never really covered and I know that I put my reputation on the line, Joe, and I totally understand for your audience that are listening to this right now and thinking that I've lost my marbles and I completely respect that.
01:22:08.000I had the same reaction myself, and I'm not out here trying to sell crazy.
01:22:12.000I don't have a GoFundMe asking for money on evidence that I don't have.
01:25:23.000And look, there were up to accounts of possibly five.
01:25:28.000And this is another thing that a lot of people don't even realize when they watch the movie, and it was shocking to me, was that We rented this house in this kind of gated community, and it was owned by a doctor, and they had fellow doctor friends.
01:25:43.000And they were like, oh, what are you doing in Brazil?
01:26:59.000So I'd shot my drone over the whole area.
01:27:01.000I shot my drone over the point where the girls had the contact.
01:27:05.000The point where Marco Sruzzi and Eric Lopes captured the creature.
01:27:09.000And the point where the military blockades were.
01:27:13.000And I realized, I took my drone straight up and I filmed straight down, and I show it in the film, the proximity to all those events is within a few blocks.
01:27:21.000The house that the entire family witnessed, very credible people that didn't want to come forward, that was just a few blocks away from the incident.
01:27:30.000It looks to me like that was a recovery mission, a rescue mission that was going down.
01:27:40.000And I'm putting my 30-year reputation on the line.
01:27:44.000Do you know what my reputation, when I finished the phenomenon, I had a level of government access that I never thought I could possibly have as a complete independent Joe Public guy, me, right?
01:27:55.000I'm meeting with senators and just all kinds of intelligence folks.
01:28:33.000And then you're confronted with what you've uncovered.
01:28:36.000And imagine if someone hadn't gone through the exhausting work that you've gone through going back and forth to Brazil over a period of 12 years to make this documentary.
01:29:13.000The sitting mayor, Verge, excuse me, thank you, by the way, for coming forward and sharing that information with us, Mayor Verge.
01:29:21.000Mayor Verge helped us find, it was really funny, we were interviewing with him, and I was like, is this guy going to say, what is he going to say?
01:29:45.000He's the only living survivor of the second capture.
01:29:49.000He was the driver of Marco Chirizzi, right?
01:29:52.000The family of the deceased military officer, Marta, her mother, could not get statements from Eric Lopes.
01:29:59.000She said every time they'd pressure him, he'd be smoking cigarettes and drinking and getting really nervous and just wouldn't say anything.
01:30:42.000So this little voice, as we're all getting in our cars and driving off to go see this guy, this little voice in my head goes, you know, maybe I should get him to walk up the door with me.
01:30:53.000So I jumped out of my car and I flagged down the Mercedes, that black Mercedes that we followed.
01:30:58.000I told Homolo with the translator, Hey, is there any chance you'd consider just walking up the door with me?
01:31:04.000I honestly think that had I not done that, he might have just opened fire on me immediately.
01:31:09.000Because who's this gringo guy walking up to his door on his property, asking questions about something he does not want to talk about?
01:31:19.000And when we got up to the door, I remember I heard talking as we walked up and it was a pretty intense moment because I'd heard about this guy for years, but nobody could find him.
01:31:56.000And I saw a face, this does not translate in the film, I saw a face that I've never seen before.
01:32:02.000It was a face, Joe, that like was harboring a deep, deep, deep, like burdened with something so disturbing and profound that I just got lost looking at this guy's eyes.
01:32:17.000I was like, oh my god, I've never seen a face like this before.
01:32:22.000And he's looking out there and the whole time he's threatening to shoot everybody and I didn't know what he was saying.
01:32:26.000And the translator, everything was so chaotic.
01:33:31.000And I asked him, I was like, was he serious like that guy?
01:33:35.000Look, all he had to do was come outside and be like, you know, guys.
01:33:38.000And the first thing he says is, The first thing he says, all we say is, Eric Lopes, Eric's not going to talk about the ET. That was the first thing out of his mouth.
01:34:30.000And I'm going to hang my hat on this, that if I have the right help, and we're all in this together, if there's enough compelling eyewitness testimony, To make one think, this very well might have happened.
01:34:45.000Doesn't that merit further investigation?
01:34:47.000Doesn't that merit further efforts to solve this riddle once and for all?
01:34:51.000This debate's been going on for 80 years.
01:34:54.000I'm handing this case to the world on a silver platter and saying, help me, let's get this one done.
01:35:02.000Imagine if some of that autopsy photos got out, some video.
01:35:07.000Well, I'm talking to the doctors, and I can tell you right now that the doctors all talked to each other.
01:35:11.000And there were doctors that shot video of that creature.
01:35:20.000Apparently the doctors were left alone in the room for a while with this thing.
01:35:24.000And here's something that I really want to put out there.
01:35:27.000Hopefully this gets translated into Portuguese and the people of Brazil will hear this.
01:35:32.000The doctors that were written about in Dr. Roger Lear's book, one of my biggest regrets, I was filming in Los Angeles, 2013, I was covering the Rua Zimbabwe case and I had flown in all these witnesses with the help of this guy, Randall Nickerson.
01:35:47.000I'd flown on all these witnesses to the landing case that happened in Africa and As adults.
01:35:53.000And I was doing this really intense shoot down there.
01:35:55.000I had Kim Arnold, the daughter of Kenneth Arnold.
01:35:58.000That's when Paula Harris helped me lock that one.
01:36:00.000It was a nightmare, trying to get her on camera.
01:36:04.000And meanwhile, I'm getting phone calls from this guy, Roger Lear, Dr. Roger Lear, and he's going, I understand you're investigating Varginia.
01:36:22.000He goes, well, what he didn't tell me was I've got cancer and I'm dying.
01:36:26.000And please get me on camera because there's aspects of the story that you need to know that I know.
01:36:31.000So anyway, he gives me these tapes, and then he dies.
01:36:35.000Actually, I sent the tapes back to him, and then he died.
01:36:37.000And I got his book, too, and I was reading his book when I'm putting the film together.
01:36:42.000And in the book, it's basically a transcription of all the tapes that I have.
01:36:46.000I could see that, because I have the tapes.
01:36:49.000And he's got a professional translator, and he's got this guy, Uba Dejada Rodriguez, going around the countryside with him and introducing all these witnesses.
01:36:58.000The meeting with, according to his book, that took place in the Humanitas Hospital with two doctors, I couldn't validate this, and I didn't put it in the movie.
01:37:07.000But if there's two doctors who are listening to this, apparently the creature was alive.
01:37:11.000The one that Marco Chirizzi brought into Humanitas Hospital was alive.
01:37:16.000And according to Dr. Roger Lear's book, everything else is accurate.
01:37:19.000I can't say if this was accurate or not, but he put it in his book, so I'm assuming that it is.
01:37:32.000Now, I'm not telling your audience that that's true.
01:37:34.000I'm telling your audience that it might be true.
01:37:37.000We know that that entity, that creature, that being, that ET, whatever you want to call it, went to Humanitas Hospital.
01:37:43.000We know that, because we have testimony from the people that took it there.
01:37:46.000We have testimony from people on the inside that claimed it was there, but we don't have any testimony from the doctors that claimed there was a telepathic communication.
01:37:55.000Do they talk at all about what it said?
01:37:58.000It said that they felt sorry for the human species, not realizing their potential, who they really are.
01:38:05.000Like, we don't realize as a race who we really are.
01:39:40.000And they started instantaneously picking up these things that were just defying physics that they didn't have the ability to detect before because the systems weren't as good.
01:39:47.000Just interviewed him in Washington, D.C., and you know one thing that he told me that I was fascinated by?
01:39:52.000He said that the Admiral came in, I think it was in 2015, when they'd just gotten that one object that was kind of rotating, kind of like a disc-looking thing.
01:40:01.000He said that the Admiral came in, and he was like, oh, God, the Admiral's here, and they had a debriefing on it, and they were showing the videos, and the Admiral stepped in.
01:40:09.000And he took a look at it for five seconds, and it's much longer than five seconds.
01:40:13.000He shrugged his shoulder, and it's kind of like, oh boy.
01:40:53.000And I'd also like to put out there, if there are any pilots, any military personnel that have any photographic evidence and you'd like to come forward with it, please do so.
01:41:06.000I've got a new project and you can do it anonymously.
01:41:09.000Hopefully you'll do it not anonymously.
01:43:04.000And the reason why Roswell is so relevant, that most people don't understand, is that you had the 509th Bomb Squadron.
01:43:11.000The most elite squadron, hand-select unit in the world, exclusively responsible for the deployment of atomic weapons, announced that they recovered a flying saucer.
01:43:25.000Then, they recant and say, oh, terribly sorry.
01:43:30.000It was just a common everyday weather balloon.
01:43:35.000Jesse Marcel, the first person at the debris field with Mack Brazel, and thank you Don Schmidt and Kevin Randall for all your work.
01:43:45.000We wouldn't talk about this if it hadn't been for them, and Stanton Friedman.
01:43:49.000Mack Brazel takes Marcel and another guy, intelligence officer, out to the debris field.
01:43:54.000Mac Brazel says this stuff was, the material was clearly not of Earth origin.
01:43:59.000I know weather balloons inside and out.
01:44:01.000He described the material like tin foil that you crumple it up and it regains its thing.
01:44:05.000These eye beams that are purple with hieroglyphic writings, things of that nature.
01:44:11.000He takes it back to his son, who I met, Jesse Marcel Jr. I knew him well.
01:44:15.000Went on Larry King with the guy a bunch of times.
01:44:17.000He described the same material that he handled personally in his hands, okay?
01:44:22.000The press conference they had with Colonel DuBose, Roger Ramey, and Jesse Marcel, two out of three of those went on the record on camera, said the original story was true.
01:44:50.000You've got astronaut, Apollo 14 astronaut Edgar Mitchell, who just so happened to grow up in Roswell.
01:44:56.000And when he came back on the outskirts, and when he came back from his mission to the moon in the 70s, Apollo 14, Sixth Man to Walk on the Moon, he gets back and he knows all those ranchers, and those ranchers tell him, yeah, that was not of Earth origin.
01:45:08.000He's gone on the record saying this, and he also confirmed that his intelligence sources, he's an astronaut, he landed on the moon, told him that that Roswell was real.
01:45:17.000So based on just that alone, That's extremely compelling.
01:45:22.000And I know that Sheila Widnall, the former Secretary of the Air Force in the 90s under the Clinton administration, she went after that case because Clinton went after that case.
01:45:32.000And they weren't happy with the answers they were getting.
01:45:35.000And then the Air Force comes up with Project Mogul.
01:45:38.000Well, if you look at Project Mogul, Project Mogul is just exactly the same explanation as the first one, except it's a bunch of these balloons stringed together.
01:45:49.000If the Air Force really wanted to squash it, Show us that material that the first-hand eyewitness testimony, the people that have gone on camera described, show us that material that crumples up from 1947. Show us those eye beams with hieroglyphics on them.
01:46:40.000And Jackie Gleason told my buddy, Jeff Sagansky, don't listen to what anyone ever tells you.
01:46:46.000I had 100% confirmation these things exist.
01:46:49.000He didn't say that the President Nixon drove me out to a base in Florida, but he told him, don't listen to anybody who says I know for a fact these things exist.
01:47:42.000What happened was Lawrence Spellman Rockefeller was pressuring the Clinton administration.
01:47:45.000I know this because I talked to John Podesta about it and other people.
01:47:49.000And he was basically saying that if you don't push for government transparency on this topic to Clinton, then I'm going to expose the fact that you're not doing it in every newspaper journal across the country.
01:48:18.000I mean, Podesta basically said, yeah, we looked into it, and they eventually came back with that report, Roswell case closed, and they talked about this stupid weather balloon.
01:48:49.00052. You've got the two consecutive weekends in July of 1952 where you've got UFOs over the White House and UFOs over the Capitol.
01:48:59.000We have testimony, thank God, to a guy that was in the radar room that night that heard the transmission between the pilots that were scrambled to intercept these things, Al Chop, and a guy named Tom Tullian of Project Archives.
01:52:01.000The more credible the witnesses, the less likely you'll ever hear about this, okay?
01:52:05.000Fast forward 1957, Edwards Air Force Base.
01:52:09.000I personally interviewed Mercury astronaut Gordon Cooper.
01:52:12.000Gordon Cooper told me on camera that they were supervising the installation of a new runway for F-86 fighter jets at Edwards Air Force Base.
01:52:22.000He was not present, but his camera crew was.
01:52:26.000A disk in broad daylight came into view, and it landed on the dry lake bed.
01:52:32.000The guys turned their cameras on it, they filmed it, they walked towards it, it lifted off, and it shot off at a high rate of speed.
01:52:37.000It was 1957. He said he had the film footage developed.
01:53:08.000The Air Force tells Lonnie's the moral of the witness.
01:53:11.000Do not talk about the beans, because that is incredibly difficult to explain, right?
01:53:17.000In fact, they don't want to talk about the case at all, but particularly don't talk about the beans.
01:53:22.0001966, you got UFOs landing in Michigan.
01:53:26.000You got then-Congressman Gerald Ford gets involved because that's when the Air Force, Dr. Hynek, explains the whole thing away as swamp gas, pisses off then-Congressman Gerald Ford.
01:53:39.000As the hearings are ending, April, I think it's April 4th or April 5th, 1966, there's UFOs landing in On the other side of the world, at Westall Primary School.
01:54:44.000With a Japanese pilot by the name of Kenju Chirachi.
01:54:48.000And fortunately the reason why we know about this case is because FAA official John Callahan kept records of the cockpit recordings, the radar recordings, The voice recordings of the actual pilot talking about what he's seeing is absolutely mind-boggling,
01:55:06.000that directly correspond to all the radar data which he has.
01:55:09.000He went on the record about it a number of times.
01:55:12.000And he said there was a meeting with the CIA stepped in.
01:55:14.000I'm just reporting what this guy said, okay?
01:55:17.000You guys, believe me or not, believe me, the data's out there, go look at it.
01:55:20.000It's a thing I did call, I know what I saw.
01:55:22.000He testified at the National Press Club in 2007 with Leslie Kane and I organized.
01:55:36.000It did maneuvers that were impossible.
01:55:38.000It made his airplane so small, and he was in a 747, and 747's got an elevator in it.
01:55:44.000That was 1986. Now let's jump to 1989, 1990. You've got Belgium.
01:55:50.000And I've personally investigated this case.
01:55:53.000Belgium, the general, the Brazilian, the Belgian Air Force, General Wilfrid de Brouwer, said there was objects that were the size of a football field, triangular in shape, didn't make any sound, and then a slight buzzing, shooting beams of light down to the ground.
01:56:12.000I flew him out from Belgium to the United States to testify at the National Press Club in 2007. He said that two men from an unknown government agency in the U.S. requested the radar data, the tapes.
01:56:22.000He said, Sure, I'll make copies for you, but I needed an official request.
01:56:45.000He's actually getting funded by also Lawrence Spellman Rockefeller.
01:56:49.000He was doing a major funding in the 90s about this stuff.
01:56:53.000One of the best cases, Rua, Zimbabwe, 1996. You got the crash in Virginia, Brazil.
01:56:58.000Now let's jump to 1997. You've got Phoenix, Arizona, March 13th, 1997. You've got a number of objects.
01:57:08.000One in particular that caught my interest was a boomerang-shaped craft that, according to the witnesses, and everyone was out under the night sky to get a glimpse of Hell Bob Comet at the time, so a lot of people saw it, that floated across the state of Arizona roughly around 5 o'clock to 8.30, from north to south.
01:57:25.000I interviewed families that were lying on their backs.
01:58:40.000There's a guy, John Hillencotter, I think his name is John something.
01:58:43.000He wrote an article about it and he actually sent a FOIA request and got the tapes.
01:58:47.000from the tower you hear them talking about it while they're looking at it some fate amazing case when the disk according to the United Airlines people personnel left the area it punched a donut hole in the cloud Brilliant case.
02:00:51.000I'm interviewing other police officers.
02:00:53.000And I'm investigating this case for a couple of years.
02:00:56.000I put a lot of it in the part I'm about to share with you right now.
02:00:59.000I didn't put in the film because I couldn't.
02:01:03.000But the guy who's going to come, he's going to come forward next year.
02:01:05.000And that's the police officer that pulls me aside.
02:01:08.000And I'm filming in downtown Plaza, Stephenville, probably in 2009. And I was standing there doing some filming with Ricky Sorrells, and it was kind of like on our lunch break, and this guy walks up to me, I'll never forget it, and he whips out his badge.
02:01:59.000He said, one of my mates took dash cam footage of it, and one of his biggest regrets was it ended up at the local Air Force base, and they took it.
02:02:11.000But I'm saying that the reason why I'm saying this is because those people out there that are possibly, hopefully, listening to this podcast...
02:02:19.000If they know where this evidence is, or if they were involved in this in any way, shape, or form, and they want to come forward, please come forward.
02:02:42.000I'm trying to remember the name of the gentleman.
02:02:44.000John something that wrote the article.
02:02:46.000It was exploded all over the headlines.
02:02:48.000You are so good at recall with all this stuff.
02:02:52.000You can really tell that you've been obsessed with this for so long.
02:02:55.000It's so fascinating to watch your mind like go through these cases and Remember all these details with barely even looking at notes.
02:03:05.000It's all just I have Every time I get up and I do something like this Joe I'm representing all the witnesses that have trusted me and Sorry.
02:04:14.000Listen, man, if you're right and if this is real, this is one of the most important things to talk about, and if it wasn't for documentaries like yours and Jeremy Corbell's and a few of the other ones that are out there, it wouldn't be as big of an issue with people.
02:04:29.000They wouldn't think that this was real, that there's weight to this.
02:04:33.000And, you know, like I said, when I heard about the Varginia case, I remember thinking, oh, come on, people lie.
02:07:17.000And there are certain things that don't add up.
02:07:20.000Like Carlos de Sousa, and I love him to death, but there was a statement, I think, I haven't seen it, but I've heard that he made that one time was that the military trucks arrived within minutes of him getting there, but he's also made a statement that they were there or they were pulling in when he got there.
02:07:37.000So there's a couple of minutes discrepancy.
02:08:07.000That's not as important as what he saw.
02:08:09.000No, and then I'll give you another example.
02:08:13.000Carlos de Sousa is convinced that that was on the 13th because he's an ultralight pilot.
02:08:18.000He's also a history or geography professor in Sao Paulo.
02:08:22.000That it was the 13th of January, and the girls saw the creature on the 20th of January.
02:08:26.000How did those creatures get from the crash site to the town?
02:08:30.000Well, there's a river, and I've talked to some researchers that think that that's a possibility, because the river goes from the crash site right to the area where the creatures were found.
02:09:23.000And the plane lands without authorization from the Brazilian government, and it lands in Campinas.
02:09:31.000And then the helicopters go from Campinas to Virginia.
02:09:34.000And then they go from Virginia back to Campinas.
02:09:37.000They load something on the airplane, and the United States Air Force takes off again.
02:09:40.000All without any authorization from the Brazilian government.
02:09:43.000And that's what these guys are saying.
02:09:45.000Every single military person that we met with, we put a lot of little nuggets in the credits at the end, they all said the Americans were involved.
02:11:37.000And he goes right to ET. I'm like, nobody's screaming from the hilltop, ET has landed.
02:11:42.000We're saying that there are structured craft of unknown origin, exhibiting a technology far beyond anything that we comprehend, according to the military people I've talked to around the world.
02:11:53.000And we don't know where they come from.
02:13:06.000There's a physical phenomenon taking place, nuts and bolts, craft, that are flying rings around our fastest jets That have left imprints on the ground.
02:13:15.000They're picked up by radar sensor, photographic sensors, FLIR sensors.
02:13:45.000They've got things that fly without wings, without visible means of propulsion, without making any sound, any air disturbance, that can do right-angle turns at high speed.
02:13:54.000Everything we know would shatter on the inside of that cockpit, particularly humans.
02:14:45.000If you're an alien life form that is interested in the development of intelligent life in the universe, you would realize it's probably a precarious balancing point when they reach this apex of technology, especially when it comes to nuclear power.
02:14:58.000And especially when it comes to what we have available here on Earth in terms of natural resources and we battle for it and we control.
02:15:18.000So, I mean, I think they're probably beyond our ability to interact with them in that way.
02:15:26.000They're probably so sophisticated that they're well aware of guns and things that could damage them and injure them.
02:15:36.000But when you think about things like storms, like the Varginia case, like how do you account for, I mean the amount of energy in a lightning storm is fucking insane.
02:15:46.000If they just plan it wrong, which is possible, something shifts.
02:15:50.000I mean, we're assuming they don't have control of the weather.
02:15:53.000We're assuming they perhaps miscalculated or got bad data.
02:16:17.000There's probably the potential for a crash.
02:16:20.000All right, so speaking of crash, this is something I really wanted to read to your audience.
02:16:24.000This is the recent UAP amendment or legislation that was signed into law.
02:16:29.000I'm reading this directly verbatim, okay?
02:16:32.000And I'd like to know what prompted this language.
02:16:37.000Thank you, Senator Gillibrand and Rubio and others.
02:16:42.000Any activity or program by a department or agency of the federal government or a contractor of such a department or agency related to unidentified anomalous phenomena, including with respect to material retrieval.
02:16:59.000Material Analysis, Reverse Engineering, Research and Development, Detection and Tracking, Development or Operational Testing.
02:18:10.000Listen, if it wasn't for people like you, I mean, in your documentaries, it just spurs so much interest and it gets people so excited that, you know, when I watched it, I immediately had to talk to you about it.
02:18:21.000I know, I got your text and I was in a workout room.
02:18:23.000We have this old dad, it's called Dad Bod Class with this guy Marty, he's an Australian, and we're in there listening to, like, what's that song, Rocky Balboa?
02:19:27.000And you just imagine being a person who has this extraordinary once-in-a-million-lifetimes event where something from another world, something you can't believe is real, something crashes down and you're there to experience it.
02:21:01.000I said, well, let me ask you a question.
02:21:05.000If there was tangible evidence being withheld, I'm not saying this is a fact, I'm just saying hypothetically, if this was going on, and if it was being kept in the general public, that there's evidence that suggests we're not alone, how significant of a story would you give that?
02:21:20.000And immediately he's like, oh my god, if that was true, that would be the most important thing ever.
02:21:24.000I mean, that's what we all want to know.
02:21:27.000And I was like, well, I'm convinced it's happening, so how do I walk away from it?
02:21:31.000It's almost like what you love kills you, you know?
02:22:21.000It's impossible to even wrap your mind around how big it is.
02:22:25.000And if something out there is like Earth, where intelligent life has evolved to a very significant point, but then keeps going for a thousand years, ten thousand years, a million years, what if they live in a more stable environment where they're not getting pelted by asteroids like we are?
02:23:06.000I mean, it's almost impossible for us to even imagine the variations that could be out there because you're talking about a truly infinite universe.
02:23:16.000And the areas, they've already identified Goldilocks planets, more than one, multiple Goldilocks planets in the known universe.
02:23:26.000My son came up to me a couple days ago and he goes, Daddy, I've been thinking a lot about this.
02:23:46.000I like for the next generation, I love the idea of, like, not having all this secrecy, and look, we know for sure there's secrecy surrounding this topic.
02:23:59.000Well, don't you think that once it begins with secrecy?
02:24:02.000So if you take us back to 1947 to Roswell, New Mexico, if it begins in secrecy, if the first ever crashed UFOs, if that begins in secrecy, like what...
02:24:23.000Especially the way that the government has treated us always when it comes to matters of international conflict, when it comes to virtually anything.
02:24:36.000And they always come up with a narrative that, you know, is very loosely based on facts, and they spoon-feed the American public what they want us to hear.
02:24:46.000Anything that would take away their agency...
02:24:51.000Like, if you want to pretend that you're in control of the United States, the United States is in control of the world.
02:24:56.000But all of a sudden, there's these beings from another planet that behave in a way and move with their crafts in a way that's impossible for us to replicate.
02:25:05.000We don't even understand the technology.
02:25:07.000We have no idea where they're from, how they got here.
02:25:10.000They communicate with us telepathically.
02:25:32.000That they make the determination, after a careful review of the data, the data that you and I don't have access to, that some of these things represent or originate from a non-human intelligence.
02:27:16.000Probably on iTunes and Amazon, I'm guessing.
02:27:19.000But it has a cast of characters that deal with potential recovered materials.
02:27:25.000And it's a little bit, you know, like the artwork and stuff is not my cup of tea, but I did watch it, and I was like, oh, this is interesting.
02:27:32.000Anyway, I thought I'd mention that since we're on the topic of recovered materials, so...
02:27:37.000Et cetera, furthermore and henceforth.
02:27:39.000Listen, man, what you're doing is very important.
02:27:44.000And if this turns out to eventually get released, you're a real trailblazer.
02:27:49.000And I think the amount of labor and just the intense focus that you put into just to make this one documentary, forget about the phenomenon, too.