The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #2043 - Francis Foster & Konstantin Kisin

00:00:01.000 Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out!

00:00:04.000 The Joe Rogan Experience.

00:00:06.000 Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.

00:00:13.000 When you have headphones on in a video game, you can hear things behind you.

00:00:17.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:00:17.000 You can hear things in front of you.

00:00:19.000 You get a sense of where they are.

00:00:21.000 That's one of the... 0.99

00:00:22.000 Goddamn, those things are addictive. 0.99

00:00:24.000 Yeah, man, I'm a gamer. 0.99

00:00:25.000 They are so addictive.

00:00:27.000 Yeah.

00:00:27.000 But that's why, because it's so immersive now.

00:00:32.000 Are you into video games?

00:00:33.000 Oh, my God, I have a real problem.

00:00:35.000 I can't play them.

00:00:36.000 I literally can't play them.

00:00:37.000 I can play pool, right?

00:00:38.000 Because pool, I'm addicted to that.

00:00:40.000 But pool to me is like a mind exercise.

00:00:44.000 It's like a concentration exercise as much as it is a game.

00:00:47.000 It's all about everything has to move together in perfect synchronicity.

00:00:53.000 When I'm playing video games, I'm just absorbed in this adrenaline-fueled chaos of graphics and sounds and explosions.

00:01:02.000 It's just way too good.

00:01:04.000 That's the problem.

00:01:05.000 You don't want to do anything else. 0.99

00:01:06.000 You just want to fucking go crazy and play video games. 0.97

00:01:08.000 There's this game I play, Escape from Tarkov, that I just... 0.98

00:01:11.000 I shouldn't be allowed to play it.

00:01:14.000 It's not good for my family, man.

00:01:16.000 It's just like 10 hours a day.

00:01:18.000 And before you know it, the whole day is gone.

00:01:20.000 You don't lose sleep.

00:01:22.000 Yeah.

00:01:23.000 Wolfenstein 3D, that was the game where it just felt kind of like...

00:01:28.000 The first time I saw Wolfenstein 3D, which probably shows how old I am now.

00:01:32.000 That's the original id Software title.

00:01:34.000 It's like the first one they did.

00:01:35.000 You quit at the right time, man.

00:01:40.000 That's what it looked like.

00:01:42.000 So many hours of my childhood were spent on that.

00:01:45.000 Yeah.

00:01:45.000 So I started off with Quake 1. I had Quake 1 on a computer.

00:01:51.000 I was just playing the game itself.

00:01:53.000 Because I used a Mac, and so then they put out...

00:01:57.000 Have a cigar, gentlemen.

00:01:58.000 Thank you, brother.

00:01:58.000 We're like gentlemen here.

00:02:00.000 Oh, thank you.

00:02:01.000 Nice one.

00:02:02.000 Enjoying some company?

00:02:05.000 But that was just, you just play the game.

00:02:07.000 And then I found out about online playing.

00:02:09.000 I was like, oh, no.

00:02:12.000 Oh, no. 0.98

00:02:13.000 What a life suck that is. 0.98

00:02:15.000 Do you let your kids play? 1.00

00:02:17.000 They play games.

00:02:18.000 Yeah, but fortunately, one's really into Roblox.

00:02:23.000 What's roadblocks?

00:02:24.000 Roadblocks.

00:02:25.000 R-O-B-O-L or B-L-O-X. I think that's what it is, right? 1.00

00:02:31.000 It's just like they have these little worlds they create and they run around with their friends in there.

00:02:35.000 It seems like fun.

00:02:37.000 You just have to limit the amount of time they do it.

00:02:39.000 And you have to explain to them, like, don't just let them figure out it's addictive.

00:02:44.000 Explain to them that it's addictive.

00:02:46.000 Explain to them that there's things that you're gonna want to get really good at that won't help you.

00:02:53.000 Yes!

00:02:53.000 It's a great way of looking at it.

00:02:55.000 Because, like, I had a friend, and he was one of the guys who was one of the managers of the Comedy Store.

00:02:59.000 Super awesome guy.

00:03:01.000 And he was hooked on EverQuest.

00:03:05.000 You know that game?

00:03:06.000 Remember that game?

00:03:07.000 Remember that game, Jamie? 0.81

00:03:10.000 Massive online multiplayer game, you're a wizard, you're casting spells and shit, that kind of thing. 0.95

00:03:16.000 One day I'll never forget. 0.94

00:03:17.000 We were all standing around in the Comedy Store bar and he was pale, pale like paper.

00:03:23.000 Like he hadn't been out of the house in days.

00:03:25.000 Like he just, his eyes were sunk into his head.

00:03:27.000 He goes, I am so good at making money in the game and so bad at doing it in real life.

00:03:34.000 Wow.

00:03:35.000 I was like, whoa.

00:03:36.000 I was like, okay, you've put all your energy into getting really good at something that doesn't do you any good.

00:03:45.000 Unless you're gonna be a professional, which they do have.

00:03:48.000 That's a hard thing to say to a kid.

00:03:50.000 Don't play video games.

00:03:52.000 If then you find out how much video game players are making.

00:03:54.000 Right, it's like don't start a podcast.

00:03:56.000 Exactly!

00:03:58.000 Right, are we dinosaurs?

00:04:00.000 They're so good. 0.99

00:04:01.000 I'm not talking shit about games. 0.98

00:04:03.000 But you gotta control it is what you're saying. 0.98

00:04:05.000 They're too good.

00:04:06.000 They're too good. 1.00

00:04:07.000 Your life is boring as fuck. 0.99

00:04:10.000 Compared to those games like there's no way there's no way it's as exciting as playing like quake 3 arena online without like a 30-inch monitor and you're sitting right in front of it and you're got fucking headphones on explosions and lightning guns It's amazing! 0.99

00:04:28.000 Because if you think about it, right, computer games are instant gratification, and that's how you get success in a computer game.

00:04:35.000 But if you think about life, how to become successful is basically deferred gratification.

00:04:41.000 And there's another level to it, which is, in a computer game, rewards are linear.

00:04:46.000 You work for a bit, you get a reward.

00:04:48.000 You work for a bit, you get a reward.

00:04:49.000 You work for a bit, but life isn't like that. 1.00

00:04:52.000 In life, you work for a bit, you get fucking kicked to shit for years sometimes, right? 0.98

00:04:57.000 You gotta work and work and work, and sometimes it's gonna be really shitty for a long time. 0.99

00:05:02.000 And then there may be a reward, or there may not.

00:05:04.000 Sometimes the work is the reward itself, right?

00:05:06.000 So that, in some ways, it actually changes how you think about achieving things and doing things as well, which is, you know, I have sometimes found that helpful.

00:05:16.000 Because you kind of know if you work, you get a reward.

00:05:19.000 But sometimes it can mess with your reward system as well, I think.

00:05:23.000 You look at what video games do.

00:05:25.000 It encourages you to spend as much time doing them as possible.

00:05:28.000 The more you do them, the more whatever you're doing you acquire.

00:05:32.000 You know, that's kind of the case with real life.

00:05:35.000 Well, think about like stockbrokers.

00:05:38.000 Think about those kind of folks.

00:05:39.000 Folks are, you know, just trying to make money.

00:05:42.000 Just trying to figure out what to buy and what to sell.

00:05:45.000 It's all, for them, it's all numbers.

00:05:47.000 So they must be like addicted to these numbers.

00:05:51.000 They're probably super addicted to seeing their bank account and seeing their hedge funds.

00:05:55.000 What do they have?

00:05:57.000 How much?

00:05:58.000 I need more than that.

00:06:00.000 You compare yourself and you read the list of the richest people in the world.

00:06:04.000 Oh, this guy's got 200 billion. 0.99

00:06:06.000 Holy shit, I gotta do better. 0.99

00:06:08.000 You know what I thought? 0.99

00:06:09.000 How do you keep going once you got to like a billion?

00:06:12.000 How do you motivate yourself to like make more?

00:06:14.000 You've got more money than you...

00:06:16.000 Unless what you're doing is what you enjoy doing.

00:06:18.000 Yeah.

00:06:19.000 Which is where Elon falls into that category.

00:06:20.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:06:21.000 Right?

00:06:21.000 He's making money, but what he does is he's, I mean, it's essentially, it's all engineering stuff.

00:06:28.000 All of it.

00:06:29.000 You know, it's innovation and engineering.

00:06:31.000 You know, the boring company, they're trying to, like, drill tunnels under the cities.

00:06:35.000 That's crazy. 0.99

00:06:36.000 SpaceX, that's fucking insane. 0.99

00:06:38.000 You're shooting rockets into space. 0.98

00:06:40.000 You want to put people on Mars.

00:06:42.000 Electric cars, you're engineering electric cars.

00:06:44.000 Electric roofs.

00:06:46.000 Like, everything is, like, this new innovative product.

00:06:48.000 Starlink. 0.94

00:06:49.000 Oh, let's just get high-speed internet and fucking fly it through the sky. 0.97

00:06:54.000 People keep seeing those things and thinking they're UFOs, by the way. 0.98

00:06:57.000 Do they?

00:06:57.000 Yeah.

00:06:58.000 But it's also as well, if you think about making money, what is really making money?

00:07:03.000 It's the deal.

00:07:04.000 And actually, you just get addicted to the deal.

00:07:07.000 That's a good point.

00:07:08.000 It's like a form of gambling.

00:07:09.000 I'm going to try this tactic.

00:07:10.000 But no, they push back on here.

00:07:12.000 But I'm going to do this, and then I'm going to do that.

00:07:14.000 And then maybe if we try that, then this is going to happen.

00:07:17.000 And then you make the deal, and boom, you get the dopamine.

00:07:19.000 Yeah, that makes sense.

00:07:21.000 That makes sense.

00:07:21.000 I know some hedge fund guys who love doing it after the first billion, too.

00:07:26.000 Well, if they really enjoy that game, I guess.

00:07:28.000 Yeah.

00:07:29.000 I mean, I guess it's kind of like playing, you know, Magic the Gathering or something.

00:07:33.000 I mean, it is a game.

00:07:36.000 You're playing it to win it.

00:07:38.000 Yeah.

00:07:38.000 But social media is a game.

00:07:40.000 Yes.

00:07:40.000 And it's a game a lot like video games.

00:07:43.000 Yeah.

00:07:43.000 Where it's like, you're really not getting anything out of this.

00:07:47.000 And you're probably losing a lot of your time to it.

00:07:51.000 I suppose for people like us, we're building profile and connections.

00:07:55.000 I've met so many amazing people, actually, through social media.

00:07:58.000 For sure.

00:07:58.000 We're all on it, right?

00:08:00.000 We're all on it, but also we're all on it.

00:08:03.000 And some of the people that are on it aren't even really there.

00:08:07.000 There's so much interaction that's instigated.

00:08:10.000 There's so many inflammatory accounts.

00:08:15.000 That I read them and I'm like, there is no way that's a real person.

00:08:18.000 No.

00:08:18.000 Like, this is all design.

00:08:19.000 This is all, like, there's just a certain percentage of people that are just trying to stir up shit in conversations all the time. 0.95

00:08:26.000 And they usually have, like, American flags in their profile. 0.97

00:08:30.000 It's like, you know, like some Trump thing in their name.

00:08:33.000 And then you go to their account, it doesn't look real at all.

00:08:36.000 And you're like, I wonder where this is.

00:08:37.000 Is this guy in Moldova?

00:08:39.000 Like, where is he?

00:08:40.000 Like, where is he?

00:08:41.000 Is he in Latvia?

00:08:43.000 Where's this guy that's doing this?

00:08:44.000 There's so many people like that.

00:08:46.000 There's one guy, I'm not going to mention his name, but he lives in Asia and he's always commenting about America.

00:08:52.000 And I'm like, mate, should you not be commenting about your own country instead of clipping riots in America?

00:08:57.000 Well, he could get killed.

00:09:02.000 He's displaced protesters. 1.00

00:09:04.000 Good fucking luck tweeting bad shit about China, if you're in China. 1.00

00:09:08.000 They got that pretty locked down. 1.00

00:09:10.000 Oh, they do.

00:09:12.000 Yeah, and there's several countries that have arrested people for tweets.

00:09:18.000 Well, we come from one of them.

00:09:19.000 Yeah, I know.

00:09:21.000 You guys do.

00:09:24.000 2018, 3,000 people, man.

00:09:26.000 3,000 people got arrested for tweeting bad things.

00:09:28.000 Not tweeting, but social media posts, yeah.

00:09:31.000 So between, what was the biggest one?

00:09:33.000 It had to be Facebook, right?

00:09:34.000 That's where people complain the most.

00:09:35.000 Is it?

00:09:36.000 Probably!

00:09:37.000 I think those are the complainiest folks.

00:09:39.000 Those are the older folks.

00:09:40.000 Yeah.

00:09:41.000 I mean, the most famous example is Count Dankula, the internet comedian where he taught his pug to do a Nazi salute.

00:09:47.000 But there's been lots of other examples.

00:09:49.000 You know, there's a tragic fire that happened in London called the Grenfell Fire.

00:09:54.000 It was awful.

00:09:55.000 People were literally burnt to death in this tower block. 1.00

00:09:57.000 And these group of people, they were idiots, basically did a representation on Bonfire Night in November the 5th in our country. 1.00

00:10:04.000 And they did a representation of people in the tower and set fire to it. 1.00

00:10:07.000 They videoed it.

00:10:08.000 They were laughing along. 0.99

00:10:09.000 Now, obviously, that's a dick move. 0.99

00:10:11.000 I think we can all agree with that. 0.99

00:10:12.000 But you don't arrest somebody for that, for basically being a dick. 1.00

00:10:16.000 Yeah, it shouldn't be illegal to be stupid. 1.00

00:10:19.000 No. 1.00

00:10:21.000 You're crossing a line because you're making a subjective judgment.

00:10:26.000 It's not funny to me, and it's not funny probably to a lot of rational people, but you should be able to try.

00:10:34.000 Like the whole thing about doing something, like a lot of times when people do outrageous things they think are gonna be funny, they don't know, and then they try it.

00:10:42.000 That's not a thing you should arrest people for.

00:10:45.000 Because you're setting a crazy precedent.

00:10:48.000 Because then it becomes subjective.

00:10:49.000 Like what's outrageous and what's not.

00:10:52.000 It could move to anything.

00:10:53.000 It could move to trans identification or trans rights.

00:10:58.000 It could move to anything.

00:10:59.000 Vaccine hesitancy.

00:11:00.000 I mean we can keep going.

00:11:01.000 Yeah.

00:11:02.000 Vaccine hesitancy.

00:11:03.000 Not supporting Ukraine.

00:11:04.000 There's a whole slew of things that could be stuffed into that box once you open it.

00:11:10.000 You just can't open that box.

00:11:12.000 That box has got to be – people have to be able to – this is how we have to conduct ourselves.

00:11:17.000 People have to be able to express themselves and they have to be able to use facts and reality and not get censored and they have to be able to do that kind of universally.

00:11:26.000 And if they can't do that, if the good ideas can't compete against the bad ideas, then the good ideas aren't good enough.

00:11:32.000 So we have to figure out how to strengthen the good ideas.

00:11:35.000 But the only way that works is if you don't censor people.

00:11:38.000 Because as soon as you start censoring people, you're admitting that you don't want to engage in this.

00:11:44.000 You don't want to show a better way of looking at things.

00:11:48.000 You just want to be the only person who gets to talk.

00:11:51.000 And that's what we saw on social media over the last few years. 0.98

00:11:55.000 Which is why Elon buying Twitter was such a big fucking deal. 0.99

00:11:58.000 It's a big fucking deal. 0.99

00:12:00.000 And I know advertisers are panicking and people are saying that hate talk is up. 0.99

00:12:04.000 And I must admit, I have seen a lot of wild shit on X now that I don't think I would have ever seen before. 0.98

00:12:11.000 Openly racist stuff, some pretty gross stuff. 0.99

00:12:15.000 It's just weird how comfortable people are talking a certain way.

00:12:22.000 It's almost like I wonder how much of the idea of it being...

00:12:26.000 Completely uncensored now.

00:12:27.000 It's not totally uncensored.

00:12:28.000 I mean, there's some moderation, right?

00:12:29.000 There's things you can't do.

00:12:30.000 You can't dox people.

00:12:31.000 You can't do a lot of things.

00:12:32.000 And they can't catch everything either.

00:12:34.000 Didn't they fire like most people?

00:12:37.000 I mean, nothing much changed, though.

00:12:39.000 I didn't feel it terrible.

00:12:41.000 I think that in terms of the hate speech stuff or whatever you call that, whatever it is, that's just a product of the fact that they're not moderating as much.

00:12:48.000 And I actually think, I mean, what you said was, you know, just preach on that.

00:12:51.000 But I also think on top of that, we have to, those of us who believe in freedom of expression, we have to also admit that freedom comes at a cost and it's worth paying.

00:13:01.000 Yeah.

00:13:01.000 That's what we have to be honest about, I think.

00:13:03.000 We have to say we're getting freedom at the cost of some discomfort. 0.99

00:13:08.000 Some people are allowed to be dicks. 0.99

00:13:10.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:13:10.000 And that's the price we're willing to pay. 0.99

00:13:12.000 I mean, freedom always comes at a cost, right?

00:13:14.000 And it's trade-offs.

00:13:15.000 You could make the country really safe if you lock every man between 18 and 40 in a prison.

00:13:19.000 Yeah.

00:13:20.000 But we don't do that because we understand we can't do that, right?

00:13:23.000 Despite what some feminists want. 1.00

00:13:27.000 Statistically, though, they'd be right. 0.98

00:13:28.000 That's what's crazy.

00:13:29.000 That's what I'm saying, right?

00:13:30.000 That's who commits the crimes.

00:13:31.000 Yeah.

00:13:32.000 Yeah, I used to have this bit about what would it be like if women caused all wars. 1.00

00:13:37.000 Because men caused all of them.

00:13:39.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:13:40.000 Men caused every fucking war that's ever happened. 1.00

00:13:42.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:13:42.000 Pretty much. 1.00

00:13:43.000 I mean, maybe women were involved. 1.00

00:13:45.000 Well, I mean, there's Helen of Troy.

00:13:48.000 Yeah.

00:13:49.000 Yeah.

00:13:50.000 But she wasn't out there fighting.

00:13:51.000 No, but it was her fault, mate.

00:13:52.000 She just wanted to be with her true love, mate.

00:13:53.000 It was her fault.

00:13:54.000 That can be a factor.

00:13:56.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:13:57.000 You know, there's like really strong women and pussy whipped kings. 1.00

00:14:00.000 A lot of that happens. 0.99

00:14:03.000 But for the most part, you know, if you locked all the men up, yeah, right, there would be no crime.

00:14:09.000 Yeah.

00:14:09.000 Except in jail.

00:14:10.000 It'd be a lot of crime in jail.

00:14:11.000 Let's stop giving them ideas, Joe.

00:14:14.000 Well, it's...

00:14:15.000 You know, obviously you can't do that.

00:14:18.000 But it's also...

00:14:20.000 It's like...

00:14:21.000 How do we fix all of the insane tension in the world today?

00:14:30.000 It seems like this is...

00:14:32.000 No other time in my life have I felt like there's more conflict and more like tension in the air. 0.97

00:14:40.000 Like, it didn't used to be that people with differing ideas, whether they're on the right or the left, were so fucking hateful.

00:14:50.000 So I've seen the kind of rhetoric that you see online is just so like if we don't win democracy is lost and it's from both sides.

00:15:01.000 I think the problem is man is that we spend all our time on these platforms which incentivizes that type of behavior because it's always going to be the most controversial take and The most reactionary point of view that's going to gain the most engagement and that's going to work with the algorithm which is going to drive it.

00:15:17.000 So really, you know, people respond to incentives and you're incentivizing people to be more reactionary, more divisive, more aggressive.

00:15:26.000 When the reality is, as we all know, like if you got those two people to sit in front of one another and have a conversation, they wouldn't behave like that because you have the added element of getting a punch in the face.

00:15:37.000 Yeah, that's another thing, right?

00:15:39.000 Like, most people would never communicate the way they communicate online in real life.

00:15:43.000 Yeah.

00:15:44.000 And it's partly what Francis said, which is the potential for violence, right?

00:15:48.000 Yeah, it's real.

00:15:48.000 It's real.

00:15:49.000 Yeah, it's real.

00:15:50.000 And it's maybe a guy thing, but we instinctively know that, right?

00:15:54.000 Bill Burr used to have this incredible bit of how he would behave if it was illegal to – or, you know, if you couldn't hit him.

00:16:00.000 You know, just walk up to a gym bro, snap his milkshake out of his hand.

00:16:04.000 Yeah.

00:16:05.000 Yeah.

00:16:06.000 So the face-to-face thing changes everything because most of the way we communicate is actually not in the words, right?

00:16:11.000 This is how we're designed, right?

00:16:13.000 We're designed to communicate in person.

00:16:16.000 We're designed to take social cues, verbal cues, physical cues.

00:16:21.000 You could sense energy in people.

00:16:23.000 You could sense that people are upset with you even though their expression doesn't change, you know?

00:16:27.000 It's interesting.

00:16:28.000 It's really interesting.

00:16:29.000 And we've also come to this point, Joe, which is really worrying to me, where people think that words of violence That's crazy, man.

00:16:36.000 You know, and if you think that words are violence and if you literally interpret it as that, then you having an argument with someone is you literally being physically assaulted.

00:16:45.000 So if you feel like you're being physically assaulted, then you're going to up the ante and you're going to become more aggressive as a result.

00:16:51.000 You're justified to defend yourself.

00:16:53.000 Yeah, if you think that everyone is a Nazi, like a literal Nazi.

00:16:57.000 You feel justified in your actions.

00:17:00.000 A lot of them are convinced.

00:17:01.000 It's like being in a cult.

00:17:03.000 But are they convinced though?

00:17:04.000 This is what I wonder, Joe.

00:17:06.000 They keep using that word about everybody, right?

00:17:09.000 Yeah.

00:17:10.000 But if you actually thought democracy was over and the Nazis have taken over, wouldn't you pick up a gun and rise up and overthrow? 0.60

00:17:18.000 I think they're pretty close to that.

00:17:21.000 It seems like if you woke up one day and that broke out in Philadelphia, you wouldn't be stunned.

00:17:26.000 Yeah.

00:17:27.000 You know, you're seeing what the looting and the craziness of Philadelphia is right now, right?

00:17:31.000 Yeah.

00:17:32.000 It's bonkers, man. 0.69

00:17:34.000 This defunded police stuff is psychotic. 0.58

00:17:38.000 It's crazy to literally encourage crime.

00:17:42.000 Because if you don't have incentives, if you don't have something in place to keep people from committing crime, and people that have already committed crime in their life like multiple times, like many times, they're just going to do it whenever they want.

00:17:55.000 And that's what you're seeing.

00:17:56.000 Yeah.

00:17:58.000 It's amazing how – and it's part of this sort of mindset that every human behavior is a product of the circumstances, but it's not.

00:18:05.000 Some people will commit crime, right?

00:18:07.000 And we have to also have a system that prevents that from happening.

00:18:10.000 We have to have police.

00:18:12.000 We have to have everything else, right?

00:18:15.000 And decriminalizing crime is a bad idea. 1.00

00:18:17.000 It's a stupid idea. 1.00

00:18:18.000 It's just this idea that's born out of guilt, not logic. 1.00

00:18:22.000 It's born out of virtue signaling, not rational thinking.

00:18:26.000 It's just not the way to do it.

00:18:29.000 If you have bad cops, you're supposed to train them to be better.

00:18:31.000 You should fund them better, treat them better, respect them more.

00:18:34.000 And then they should have more of a relationship with the community. 0.96

00:18:37.000 It should be a thing where they're trying to literally protect you, not constantly persecute people and fuck with people. 0.97

00:18:45.000 That line is a very thin line. 1.00

00:18:47.000 Then also, who the fuck wants that job? 0.99

00:18:51.000 Who the fuck wants to be yelled at all the time? 1.00

00:18:52.000 Who wants to be the professional enemy? 1.00

00:18:54.000 Who wants to be someone that it's okay to just shoot at?

00:18:57.000 Who wants to be the person that everybody you interact with is lying to you?

00:19:00.000 Was there a time in your life, Joe, where the police were respected by most people?

00:19:06.000 There's always been problems. 0.98

00:19:07.000 Hunter S. Thompson wrote about the Chicago riots being one of the most horrific things that he ever saw in his life, the way cops were beating the people with clubs and shit. 0.98

00:19:18.000 There's always been bad cops, just like there's always been bad plumbers. 1.00

00:19:22.000 Some people just suck. 1.00

00:19:24.000 They suck at what they do. 1.00

00:19:26.000 They come from a bad environment. 1.00

00:19:28.000 They didn't have good role models. 1.00

00:19:30.000 They grew up around assholes. 1.00

00:19:31.000 They don't have any motivation. 1.00

00:19:32.000 Maybe they're hooked on drugs. 1.00

00:19:34.000 And they suck at what they do. 1.00

00:19:35.000 And that could be anything. 1.00

00:19:38.000 Anybody could suck at anything. 0.95

00:19:40.000 Cops, too.

00:19:40.000 There's cops that are awesome human beings.

00:19:42.000 I know a lot of cops.

00:19:44.000 They're great people.

00:19:45.000 From Jiu Jitsu, I've known so many cops.

00:19:47.000 Because cops are constantly training. 0.98

00:19:50.000 And generally, they're really nice guys with a fucking really hard job. 0.94

00:19:53.000 But you don't hear about those. 0.96

00:19:55.000 You hear about the one that does some horrible thing.

00:19:59.000 You see about the one who plants the gun on the guy after he shoots him.

00:20:02.000 You see the one where people shoot people when they're reaching for their wallets. 1.00

00:20:06.000 You see the crazy shit. 1.00

00:20:09.000 You see people punching women in the face. 1.00

00:20:11.000 You see crazy shit, right? 1.00

00:20:12.000 But you don't see all the positive interactions. 1.00

00:20:15.000 And you don't see what happens.

00:20:17.000 If you get rid of them.

00:20:18.000 And that's what you're seeing with these smash and grabs. 1.00

00:20:22.000 These are fucking bananas, man. 0.99

00:20:24.000 Because they're everywhere now. 1.00

00:20:25.000 And people are seeing so many of them on the internet.

00:20:28.000 And they're seeing that people are getting away with them.

00:20:30.000 And it's encouraging them.

00:20:31.000 And this is what happened.

00:20:34.000 Venezuela always had a problem with lawlessness.

00:20:36.000 But when Chavez came to power, after a few years, they said the cops weren't going to prosecute people, criminals, because prosecuting a crime is a sign of right-wing oppression.

00:20:48.000 Wherever you heard that before, right?

00:20:50.000 And as a result of that, it became so completely and utterly lawless that the city became uninhabitable.

00:20:56.000 It became the murder capital of the world and the kidnap capital of the world.

00:20:59.000 Because there's always going to be a small subset of society who are criminals and who will then look to maximize their opportunities to make money.

00:21:09.000 Mm-hmm.

00:21:10.000 Yeah, there's a couple arguments about this that make sense.

00:21:15.000 When people say that they're a victim of their circumstance and we have to appreciate that they were put into a horrible circumstance in life and they're just trying to get by.

00:21:25.000 That's true too.

00:21:26.000 So what we have to do that we're not doing is try to figure out how to stop that.

00:21:31.000 How to make a minimum quality of life for everybody where no one's growing up in dire poverty.

00:21:41.000 How many trillions of dollars have we spent just on military budgets over the last few years?

00:21:49.000 If they figured out a way to give contractors a lot of money to fix neighborhoods, To completely clean them up, provide modern housing, take care of all the...

00:22:05.000 Figure out ways to set people up for work programs and give people jobs.

00:22:10.000 If that was financially viable, just like Hal Burton had those contracts to rebuild Iraq after we blew it up, if they had something like that for inner cities where these guys could literally make money doing it, that could be one way to kind of re-engineer things.

00:22:26.000 Because if they could just figure out how to do that, you'd have so much less crime.

00:22:30.000 You'd have a lot less crime.

00:22:32.000 You'd have a lot less crime if people had hope, if people had role models, if they had community centers, if they had really good education and they had safe streets.

00:22:41.000 Just that alone.

00:22:42.000 Just that alone.

00:22:43.000 Yeah, it would it would reduce crime a lot.

00:22:45.000 Definitely. 0.99

00:22:45.000 It would take a long fucking time though. 0.99

00:22:47.000 Yeah. 0.98

00:22:47.000 Because you got generation after generation of people who lived there. 0.98

00:22:50.000 When you're talking about like really fucked up gang-ridden neighborhoods. 0.97

00:22:53.000 Yeah. 0.92

00:22:54.000 No one's done anything about those neighborhoods for a long time.

00:22:56.000 Yeah.

00:22:57.000 Yeah.

00:22:57.000 It's generational.

00:22:58.000 It's like built into the people that live there.

00:23:00.000 They're accustomed to it.

00:23:02.000 And, you know, it's family structure as well.

00:23:04.000 Once you disrupt all that, there's not enough male role models.

00:23:07.000 Where young kids are going to look for a role model is going to be the men with status around them.

00:23:13.000 Who's that going to be?

00:23:14.000 Drug dealers.

00:23:14.000 Yeah, gang members.

00:23:16.000 Status and money.

00:23:17.000 That's them.

00:23:18.000 And guys who grew up in those kind of neighborhoods all have that story.

00:23:21.000 Yeah.

00:23:22.000 Yeah.

00:23:22.000 And that's true, too.

00:23:24.000 You know, like, yeah, you can't defund the police, but you also can't ignore the plight of a good percentage of our community.

00:23:32.000 We're supposed to be a united community of human beings.

00:23:35.000 We call ourselves Americans.

00:23:36.000 We live on the same patch of land except for Alaska and Hawaii. 1.00

00:23:42.000 Alaska is the dumbest. 0.99

00:23:43.000 Like, how is that ours? 1.00

00:23:44.000 It's not even connected.

00:23:46.000 You know, people don't talk about the culture aspect about it a lot.

00:23:49.000 I remember when I was teaching at a school, there was a really rough school, I taught a little kid, let's call him Darren, and he's one of the smartest kids I've ever encountered.

00:23:57.000 So bright.

00:23:58.000 I remember he was always getting kicked out of school, kicked out of lessons.

00:24:01.000 And when I was, like, one of the jobs that you do as a teacher is you walk around the corridor and you pick up the kids who get kicked out of the lesson.

00:24:08.000 And I just, I then taught Darren chess.

00:24:11.000 And within about two days, he could beat me at chess.

00:24:14.000 He was super, super, super bright.

00:24:16.000 One of the brightest kids I've ever encountered.

00:24:18.000 But because he came from a criminal family, he was never going to make it through school.

00:24:22.000 He just wasn't because the values that had been inculcated him right the way from birth meant that he was never going to succeed.

00:24:31.000 And this is what I found frustrating that a lot of people didn't get.

00:24:34.000 They were like, he's a bad kid, he's a bad...

00:24:36.000 Yep, he's a kid who's a product of his culture and it takes a very special person to be able to break out of that and generally they have to find something to break out whether it's Music or sports or something.

00:24:49.000 Yeah, that breaks them out of stand-up comedy that breaks them out of that So some new world that they can enter into and succeed in and then they could leave the old world behind and at the same time coming back to the point you made earlier Crime still has to be illegal.

00:25:03.000 We can understand people's circumstances and not encourage and incentivize them to commit crime.

00:25:09.000 We have to be able to do both.

00:25:10.000 We have to walk and chew gum at the same time, man.

00:25:12.000 We gotta be.

00:25:13.000 We have to be.

00:25:14.000 Yeah, we have to be able to do both.

00:25:15.000 But the way to fix it is not defunding the police.

00:25:19.000 That's the worst strategy.

00:25:21.000 But that's such a virtue signaling strategy.

00:25:24.000 That's like, look what they did to George Floyd.

00:25:27.000 No, look what one guy did.

00:25:30.000 One guy did, and there was a more than appropriate response by the people that saw that video. 0.97

00:25:35.000 People freaked the fire, and the violence and the burning of all that smashing and shit, very unfortunate. 0.61

00:25:41.000 But that outblast of hate at least should make people recognize that A, you can be held responsible for something horrific like that if someone's filming it.

00:25:52.000 And then also that those kind of cops do exist and also that it's on all of them and we got to figure out a way to train cops or screen them better or like Jocko says that you should train them the same way train SEALs.

00:26:08.000 Like SEALs develop, they go through this training program, and then they dedicate a certain amount of time forever for training.

00:26:15.000 They're always training.

00:26:16.000 Cops don't do that. 1.00

00:26:18.000 They just stay cops.

00:26:19.000 And he's like, you should dedicate a certain percentage of their time should be dedicated to training.

00:26:25.000 And they should be held accountable.

00:26:26.000 But it's also it's like you're asking a lot and then on top of that you're essentially dealing with people that have a high instance of PTSD. Very high instance and not discussed and not appreciated.

00:26:39.000 You hear about PTSD from people that are victims of violence and people that are victims of war.

00:26:45.000 You hear about that but you don't hear about it about cops.

00:26:48.000 And also the point you made earlier, how much does it take to train a SEAL? It takes a lot.

00:26:55.000 Right.

00:26:55.000 How much do we spend training police officers?

00:26:57.000 Not nearly as much.

00:26:59.000 And also, like, hey, you shouldn't be fat.

00:27:03.000 Like, hey.

00:27:04.000 And also, you should be able to physically defend yourself.

00:27:07.000 Yeah.

00:27:07.000 You know?

00:27:08.000 And even if you're a woman, you should know jujitsu. 0.84

00:27:10.000 You should be able to defend yourself.

00:27:13.000 Because... 0.56

00:27:14.000 We've seen time and time again these horrific situations where cops can't physically defend themselves and some criminal gets loose and beats the fuck out of them.

00:27:23.000 Yeah.

00:27:23.000 I mean, I've seen so many videos of this.

00:27:26.000 One was horrible.

00:27:27.000 This lady pulled this guy over and the guy's daughter was in the car. 0.99

00:27:31.000 She's like, don't daddy, don't daddy. 0.98

00:27:33.000 And he's beating the fuck out of this lady cop. 1.00

00:27:36.000 You know, when I left university, I did a temp job at the Metropolitan Police, just doing paperwork. 0.93

00:27:43.000 And what was really interesting when I was working in those offices is there were a lot of cops there working, and they were all just guys who were burnt out, PTSD'd out of their eyeballs.

00:27:52.000 They couldn't function anymore, and all they did was just routine admin jobs.

00:27:57.000 And I used to go with these guys to go and drink, and like...

00:28:01.000 Really good guys.

00:28:02.000 Really good guys.

00:28:03.000 And the stories they told me, they were just horrific.

00:28:08.000 And the drinking culture.

00:28:10.000 And the only way a lot of these guys were functioning is by working.

00:28:15.000 Most of them, you know, they had one or two marriages, they had failed, and then they would just go out and just get smashed.

00:28:22.000 Because that was their only way of coping.

00:28:24.000 Because...

00:28:25.000 The support for them was minimal.

00:28:28.000 They didn't have any support.

00:28:29.000 If you go to a murder scene and you see a guy who's basically killed himself and then shot his daughter and his wife, and you don't have any type of support when you come out to talk to, to help you to process that, you're not meant to be exposed to that.

00:28:48.000 All the time.

00:28:49.000 All the time.

00:28:50.000 But that's all you do.

00:28:51.000 That's all you do.

00:28:52.000 Yeah, and we don't even consider that. 1.00

00:28:55.000 It's just such a stupid under-appreciation. 0.97

00:28:59.000 And it's just so unfortunate that that's so prevalent. 1.00

00:29:04.000 And it's somehow or another equated to liberalism.

00:29:08.000 And I just think it's just the wrong approach.

00:29:11.000 I think it's like fundamentally it's the wrong approach.

00:29:14.000 I empathize and I even agree with how they feel about The way the setup in this country is not fair.

00:29:24.000 It's not fair.

00:29:25.000 There are people that do not get a fair starting block. 0.99

00:29:30.000 Their starting block sucks. 0.57

00:29:31.000 Where they take off from in life, it's not the same as yours. 0.99

00:29:35.000 It's not the same as mine.

00:29:36.000 But we gotta fix that.

00:29:39.000 The thing is not like fixing it when it gets to all the way to letting violent criminals out because you think they were wronged in life.

00:29:46.000 You're just going to let violent criminals out.

00:29:48.000 You're not changing them because you acknowledge the fact that they've been done wrong.

00:29:53.000 And also we have to be real in a society like yours and like ours where we define poverty.

00:29:58.000 I mean, look, the communities you're talking about, they're really in deep trouble, of course.

00:30:03.000 But we still define poverty in relative terms.

00:30:06.000 And somebody will always be poorer than other people.

00:30:08.000 Yes, but like dire poverty, food stamps, welfare.

00:30:12.000 You don't have money for food.

00:30:13.000 I know, but those people are much wealthier than many other people I grew up around.

00:30:18.000 Which is crazy, right?

00:30:19.000 Right.

00:30:19.000 It's like, it's 34%, or $34,000 a year is 1% of the world.

00:30:24.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:30:25.000 People call themselves like, you know, all these 1%ers, bitch, that's you. 1.00

00:30:29.000 That's you. 1.00

00:30:30.000 Right, that's everybody here.

00:30:31.000 Yeah.

00:30:32.000 That's all of us.

00:30:32.000 Yeah.

00:30:33.000 Especially most people working make more than $34,000 a year.

00:30:37.000 So most people in America that have a full-time job.

00:30:39.000 Yeah.

00:30:40.000 They're probably making more than $34,000 a year, and they're in the top 1% of the world.

00:30:44.000 Yeah.

00:30:45.000 You know the thing that...

00:30:46.000 I don't think people talk about enough.

00:30:48.000 So when I was teaching, I taught in rural communities.

00:30:52.000 And in a lot of rural communities, because of globalization, because of the industrialization...

00:30:58.000 There's just generation after generation who are growing up, who are becoming adults, and there is no work.

00:31:03.000 There is no work for the vast majority of them.

00:31:06.000 And what it inculcates in them is a sense of hopelessness.

00:31:09.000 And if you grow up in a culture where you feel that there is no hope, and you look around you, and everyone is broken, and no one is working, and everyone is given up, then even as a kid, you think to yourself, well, what's the point of doing anything?

00:31:23.000 Because I'm just going to end up like Uncle Dave on the sofa getting...

00:31:27.000 You know what I mean?

00:31:28.000 Even if you don't intellectually think it, emotionally you feel it.

00:31:33.000 Well, that's a thing that can happen to kids in high school. 0.89

00:31:35.000 So if you're in high school and you're hanging around with the crowd who likes to party and drink and fuck off and not do much, and those are the fun people to hang out with, and then you get out of school... 0.90

00:31:47.000 And now you're supposed to get a job. 0.95

00:31:50.000 Now you're on your own.

00:31:51.000 You have to figure it out.

00:31:51.000 And these guys aren't figuring it out.

00:31:53.000 If you're trapped in that kind of a friend group, you can get sucked into very low expectations. 0.96

00:32:00.000 And you could fucking waste a long chunk of your life before you figure that out. 0.98

00:32:04.000 Totally, man. 0.99

00:32:05.000 And culture, you're right, Francis, is such a powerful thing.

00:32:08.000 When I was 18, I spent a few weeks sleeping in the park.

00:32:13.000 I didn't have money and I had a long family situation.

00:32:17.000 Very bad, but it never occurred to me that I would stay there because that wasn't what I came from and it wasn't the environment I was raised in.

00:32:23.000 I always knew that I would get out of it, you know?

00:32:26.000 And culture, you know, whatever attitude, whatever you want to call it, will push you through things that if you don't have it, it's going to be impossible.

00:32:34.000 Right, if you don't have expectations that, you know, you don't know people that have succeeded in life and done well and That's a better word, expectations, than culture.

00:32:43.000 Expectations. 0.96

00:32:44.000 If you're in a fucking place like South Side of Chicago, have you ever looked at the murder rate? 0.99

00:32:48.000 Man, it's heartbreaking. 1.00

00:32:51.000 There's so many crazy videos of shootouts in the street.

00:32:54.000 I just watched one the other day.

00:32:55.000 A guy pulls over, jumps out of the car, shoots these guys.

00:33:00.000 It's just happening on the street.

00:33:02.000 These kids are growing up in a war zone.

00:33:04.000 So if you're a kid and you're growing up there and you're 15 years old, how many people have you seen killed?

00:33:08.000 Three, four, five?

00:33:09.000 How many have you seen killed?

00:33:10.000 Are you out at night?

00:33:12.000 At 13 years old, are you roaming around the streets at night being wild?

00:33:16.000 Are you seeing gang violence?

00:33:18.000 Are you participating in it?

00:33:20.000 Like...

00:33:21.000 And what do you want as a young man?

00:33:23.000 You want status?

00:33:24.000 You want money?

00:33:25.000 Yeah.

00:33:26.000 You want girls? 1.00

00:33:27.000 Who are the people, all the people that you see around you, who are the people that have that? 0.96

00:33:31.000 Also, it's probably pretty fucking exciting. 0.66

00:33:34.000 Oh, man. 0.95

00:33:35.000 Yeah.

00:33:36.000 You know? 0.99

00:33:37.000 Shoot some guns, yeah. 0.96

00:33:38.000 A lot better than working at Lowe's. 0.98

00:33:39.000 Yeah.

00:33:40.000 When I was, again, like, I was working in East London, and one of the...

00:33:45.000 This is a thing, you know, because I try always to have compassion for people.

00:33:49.000 Obviously, you're human sometimes.

00:33:51.000 You're just like...

00:33:52.000 Right.

00:33:53.000 But the thing that I found most heartbreaking, man, is there were kids in my class who I taught.

00:33:59.000 They had learning difficulties.

00:34:01.000 They were, you know, they're low IQ. They weren't particularly bright.

00:34:04.000 They were sweet kids.

00:34:05.000 And they were just targeted by gangs, because gangs knew that they could groom them, that they were 10, 11 years old, there was no one at home, no one cared for them.

00:34:14.000 They could groom them, and then they could become drug runners and whatever else.

00:34:18.000 You know, my ex was an educational psychologist.

00:34:20.000 She was working with a lot of these kids.

00:34:23.000 One of her kids, like, went missing.

00:34:25.000 The kid went missing, 10, 11 years old.

00:34:27.000 This was in North London she was working.

00:34:29.000 The kid was found in Scotland.

00:34:32.000 Literally a different country at the other end of the island.

00:34:35.000 And you're like, you know, and it was gang.

00:34:37.000 It was gang.

00:34:38.000 You know, because they take them, they groom them, they give them money.

00:34:41.000 They're the first person who shows them affection, the first person to show...

00:34:44.000 You know what?

00:34:45.000 Everybody else has written you off. 1.00

00:34:47.000 Everyone else thinks you're stupid. 1.00

00:34:48.000 But you know what? 1.00

00:34:49.000 Come and join us.

00:34:50.000 Come and join us.

00:34:51.000 I'll show you respect.

00:34:52.000 I'm going to give you responsibility.

00:34:54.000 And you know what else you're going to do?

00:34:55.000 You're going to get money.

00:34:57.000 Here's a question.

00:34:59.000 We all have this vision of a utopian society where there is no longer war, there is no longer crime, but it's never existed.

00:35:10.000 It's never existed even briefly.

00:35:13.000 Isn't it...

00:35:13.000 Is there something...

00:35:16.000 That human beings, it's almost like built into the operating system of human beings.

00:35:22.000 That you need a certain amount of antagonists, a certain amount of protagonists to keep things moving.

00:35:28.000 And that the urgency that everybody feels right now is like social urgency.

00:35:33.000 It's almost like we're building up to like an ideological Super Bowl.

00:35:38.000 We're gonna figure out which one of these ideas makes the most sense.

00:35:43.000 It feels like there's this tension buildup.

00:35:46.000 I almost wonder if that's something that we need in order to figure things out.

00:35:52.000 We need this chaos.

00:35:54.000 We need people trying to control narratives.

00:35:56.000 We need people trying to censor people.

00:35:57.000 We need people to do it so we realize how horrific it is so we act out and we talk about it.

00:36:01.000 So it's not like this Slow, creeping censorship.

00:36:06.000 You don't notice it.

00:36:06.000 It's shocking.

00:36:08.000 They're censoring news stories that could hurt the party that they want to win in the elections.

00:36:14.000 It's crazy stuff.

00:36:16.000 It is crazy.

00:36:16.000 And we had the case with debanking in the UK where this guy, Nigel Farage, I don't know if you know him.

00:36:21.000 I did hear about that story.

00:36:22.000 Yeah, he's kind of like the Donald Trump of the UK in some ways, you know, very unpopular with some things, with some people, very popular with others.

00:36:30.000 And his bank, which was a kind of like bank for wealthy people, they closed his account without explaining why.

00:36:38.000 He started doing some digging.

00:36:40.000 He did a Freedom of Information request or something.

00:36:42.000 It's not called out, but it's basically the same thing.

00:36:45.000 And the bank came out and said it's because he doesn't have enough money. 1.00

00:36:49.000 Bullshit. 1.00

00:36:50.000 Turned out it wasn't true. 0.99

00:36:51.000 Eventually, he got the information saying that the transcripts of their internal conversations were that part of the reason they shut his account down was political, right?

00:37:02.000 And then we had the Financial Conduct Authority, which is the people who are supposed to investigate this stuff.

00:37:07.000 They did an investigation and said there was no political debanking going on.

00:37:11.000 All the newspapers reported it.

00:37:13.000 And in paragraph five of that same article, you can see that his case was not taken into account in the report.

00:37:19.000 Right? 0.86

00:37:19.000 So they lied about it stage after stage after stage and now you've got mainstream journalists spreading this crap that they know isn't true. 0.86

00:37:28.000 All they have to do is have a good headline. 0.94

00:37:31.000 All they have to do is have a good headline.

00:37:32.000 The inside of it can be nonsense and they can even show you right in front of your face why what they're saying is incorrect and it doesn't matter. 0.90

00:37:40.000 And then they all bitch and whine and then they go, why is no one watching our content? 0.99

00:37:44.000 Well, here's the wildest one that's going on right now. 0.98

00:37:46.000 You know the Mar-a-Lago controversy of the pricing or the...

00:37:51.000 The inflated value of the house.

00:37:54.000 The judge ruled that it was worth 18 million.

00:37:57.000 It's 20 acres in like the most expensive real estate in that area.

00:38:02.000 Like a house down the street from it, much smaller.

00:38:04.000 It's just sold for 50 million dollars.

00:38:07.000 Wow.

00:38:07.000 Even if Forbes said it's worth somewhere between – I think – see what Forbes said.

00:38:11.000 I think they said it was worth between $300 million and $700 million.

00:38:15.000 And they were saying that it's worth $18 million.

00:38:23.000 It's like they don't even try to pretend.

00:38:25.000 Why does no one trust the mainstream?

00:38:27.000 If the guy says his house it's worth a billion dollars, right?

00:38:30.000 And then you come along and say, no, no, no, it's worth like $800 million.

00:38:33.000 Forbes says it's worth as much as $700 million.

00:38:35.000 We'll call it $700 million.

00:38:37.000 Now you've got a reasonable argument.

00:38:38.000 But if you say $18 million, that's a palace.

00:38:43.000 That place is a palace.

00:38:45.000 It's 20 acres. 1.00

00:38:47.000 Get the fuck out of here. 0.99

00:38:48.000 This is great. 1.00

00:38:49.000 You can't do that.

00:38:49.000 That's like too obvious.

00:38:51.000 You don't give a fuck about the truth. 0.99

00:38:53.000 They don't. 1.00

00:38:54.000 You don't give a fuck about the truth. 0.98

00:38:56.000 He claimed it was worth 1.5 billion and laid his plea to drop fraud case, but judge ruled it's wildly inflated. 0.98

00:39:02.000 Yeah, but the judge does not have an accurate sense of the market, in my opinion.

00:39:08.000 It's just that the property size alone, it's such a giant chunk of property.

00:39:15.000 So that says it's worth somewhere about half a bill, right?

00:39:19.000 Is that what that's...

00:39:20.000 No.

00:39:20.000 See, the judge was saying that it's worth between...

00:39:24.000 It says, okay, citing an appraisal report from the city of Palm Beach that pegged the value of Mar-a-Lago between $18 million and $27.6 million between 2011 and 2021. Oh, right.

00:39:36.000 Okay, so it was $18 million and now it's worth because of inflation.

00:39:40.000 $27 million.

00:39:43.000 $325 million.

00:39:44.000 That's how much Forbes estimated Mar-a-Lago is worth as of September.

00:39:48.000 Although it paid its net value at $292 million after deducting roughly $33 million in debt.

00:39:53.000 Okay, so it's got debt.

00:39:55.000 So I think what they're saying the scam is, is you wildly overinflate a piece of real estate. 0.97

00:40:01.000 Again, I don't know jack shit about real estate, right? 0.93

00:40:04.000 But I think what you do is you say, I got a house worth a billion dollars. 0.97

00:40:08.000 I need a loan.

00:40:09.000 And they give you a loan based on this billion-dollar property you have.

00:40:13.000 But then they send an appraiser to you and say, hey, but this house is worth $18 million.

00:40:17.000 Then you're like, uh-oh.

00:40:19.000 So now you really got a loan, but you got a loan based on something that's not really worth as much.

00:40:24.000 So their collateral or whatever it is, the reason why they would give you that much money doesn't make any sense.

00:40:30.000 But clearly that can't be accurate. 0.98

00:40:32.000 If you're seeing pictures of that fucking place, show some photos of Mar-a-Lago. 0.99

00:40:37.000 If that was 18 million, dudes would be buying them every day. 0.99

00:40:40.000 It would last three seconds on the market before somebody bought it.

00:40:44.000 People would just be calling up.

00:40:45.000 The phone lines would get jammed.

00:40:47.000 I'll take it.

00:40:48.000 Sight unseen.

00:40:49.000 I'll take it.

00:40:50.000 18 million?

00:40:51.000 Even 27 million.

00:40:53.000 Calling it 1.5 billion is a Trump thing.

00:40:56.000 It's the greatest house.

00:40:58.000 My favorite thing about the whole speech is he talks about himself in the third person.

00:41:02.000 The judge hates Trump.

00:41:03.000 That's what he keeps saying.

00:41:05.000 That is it.

00:41:06.000 That's a nice house.

00:41:07.000 It's a nice gaff joke. 1.00

00:41:09.000 It's a fucking palace, man. 1.00

00:41:11.000 Look at that place. 1.00

00:41:12.000 It's insane.

00:41:12.000 And the inside of it is all like, click on that photo of Trump there with its chandelier.

00:41:17.000 Look how fucking beautiful it is inside. 1.00

00:41:20.000 Matt, that is ridiculous. 1.00

00:41:22.000 I mean, look, maybe it's me being a Brit, but I look at it and go, it's a bit fucking much, that. 0.99

00:41:26.000 Oh, it's a lot much. 0.92

00:41:28.000 It's not my style.

00:41:30.000 That looks like something out of a Russian czar's house, you know what I mean? 0.91

00:41:33.000 Yes!

00:41:33.000 That's what I like about it.

00:41:35.000 That's what I want Trump's house to look like. 1.00

00:41:37.000 If Trump lived in some bullshit fucking log cabin, I'd be so disappointed. 1.00

00:41:41.000 Right, right. 1.00

00:41:42.000 Trump lived in like fucking John Dutton's house on Yellowstone. 0.99

00:41:45.000 What are you doing, bro? 1.00

00:41:46.000 You should be balling!

00:41:47.000 That's on brand, as we say.

00:41:49.000 That's on brand.

00:41:50.000 What a house, man.

00:41:50.000 Look at the size of that property.

00:41:51.000 Yeah.

00:41:52.000 So those little houses around there are selling for like $30 billion.

00:41:56.000 Wow.

00:41:56.000 That's crazy expensive property there.

00:41:58.000 To think that that's only worth $18 million to $27 million, that seems a little insane.

00:42:03.000 You know the thing that always gets me, man, is like, you're reading the mainstream media and they criticize our podcast and your show and then they go, these people spread misinformation.

00:42:15.000 I'm like, mate.

00:42:17.000 What are you talking about?

00:42:19.000 You've been spreading misinformation from day one.

00:42:22.000 You know what I mean?

00:42:24.000 It's like getting a lecture on dating from Ted Bundy.

00:42:26.000 You're like, mate, come on.

00:42:28.000 Yeah, it seems crazy for them to keep harping on that at this point.

00:42:31.000 It's like, don't you know about the internet?

00:42:34.000 People have made, they've made like compilation videos of you guys being wrong over and over and over and over and over again, and you've never apologized for it.

00:42:43.000 I mean, whatever you want to talk about, whether it's the Russia collusion thing or the saying the dangers of Trump denying the election, then you show, like, how many people denied Trump's election?

00:42:54.000 Right.

00:42:54.000 It was calling them the illegitimate president.

00:42:56.000 Hillary called him an illegitimate president.

00:42:58.000 Yeah, they said he stole the election.

00:43:00.000 If you think that's dangerous from him, then it's dangerous from you too.

00:43:04.000 And we should all acknowledge that we should try to figure out a way to make the elections as fair as possible.

00:43:10.000 My real fear is that not everybody's on board with that.

00:43:15.000 That's my real fear.

00:43:16.000 I would love to believe that everybody on the right and everybody on the left just wants a fair battle.

00:43:23.000 And they just want to be able to speak their mind to the public and have the people choose.

00:43:28.000 That's what I would like to believe.

00:43:29.000 And that we would like to encourage all Americans to vote.

00:43:33.000 Everyone should just get informed and go out there and give your opinion.

00:43:37.000 Let's see how the country feels.

00:43:39.000 Yeah.

00:43:40.000 But I don't know how much shenanigans is going on.

00:43:44.000 You know there's little.

00:43:45.000 You know there's a little collusion between social media companies.

00:43:49.000 We know that now.

00:43:50.000 That's kind of scary.

00:43:52.000 That's kind of scary that you would think that what you believe is so important that you're willing to manipulate an election.

00:43:59.000 That scares you.

00:44:00.000 It should scare us, because it's like, man, they could use that on you. 0.94

00:44:04.000 Imagine if we have this fucking amazing person who's running for president, and finally, all rational people in the center, people that are rational on the right and the left, agree this person has the country's best ideas in mind, and we've made Like, awesome progress with the way this person is communicating with everybody, 0.89

00:44:23.000 and it seems like they could really unite us. 0.99

00:44:25.000 And they get fucked. 0.98

00:44:27.000 Somebody comes in and just manipulates it, doesn't like the idea of some new person taking charge, doesn't like the idea of some radical thinker who wants to try to make things as good as possible for the whole country, 0.99

00:44:43.000 and that maybe there's a way to do that. 0.91

00:44:45.000 And they get fucked by some establishment spokesperson because they know how to manipulate the system. 0.85

00:44:52.000 And look at the thing, the people that rise to the top in the current system in your country and in ours. 0.99

00:44:56.000 I mean, the idea that these two people, whoever they end up being, if it's Biden and Trump, let's say, these are the best people out of 320 million fucking people?

00:45:05.000 Well, the thing about Biden is he's already won, right? 0.95

00:45:07.000 So he is the president.

00:45:08.000 So it only makes sense that he runs for president if he's physically capable of doing that.

00:45:12.000 The thing about Trump is there's, you know, the narrative that he and a lot of his followers put out is that the election was rigged and that, you know, he should be the legitimate president anyway.

00:45:26.000 And no one else is—no one's voting for anybody else.

00:45:31.000 Like, these hardcore Trumpers, they're going to go all in on Trump.

00:45:35.000 So it's like, okay, how else could it be other than Trump versus Biden?

00:45:39.000 Unless they arrest Trump, unless they figure out a way to make some of these charges stick.

00:45:43.000 And here's the thing with Trump.

00:45:45.000 You know...

00:45:46.000 To him, this is no longer a presidential race.

00:45:50.000 To him, this is existential.

00:45:52.000 Because this is probably the only chance he's going to have of avoiding jail.

00:45:58.000 So, you look at it like that, and you think, Trump is already a guy who, let's put it bluntly and mildly, will do whatever it takes to win.

00:46:07.000 And if you put a guy like that and you say the only way that you're going to avoid jail is to win the presidency, you're already notching it up a few ratchet when it comes to making the atmosphere really toxic.

00:46:22.000 And you can play that argument the other way.

00:46:24.000 I mean, in terms of Biden and the investigations that are happening, Donald Trump gets elected.

00:46:28.000 What is he going to do?

00:46:29.000 They would argue that too, right?

00:46:31.000 Yeah.

00:46:32.000 The Biden thing is fascinating to watch people ignore it.

00:46:35.000 Did you see Noam Dwarman's interview with that guy?

00:46:39.000 No, I did not.

00:46:40.000 Oh man, it's Noam Dwarman from The Cellar, from The Comedy Cellar.

00:46:43.000 Oh, okay.

00:46:43.000 He had a guy on his podcast who he built up as like the most sane guy who says that the Hunter Biden thing was a nothing burger.

00:46:52.000 And they went around for like an hour and the guy just would not...

00:46:56.000 It was the craziest thing that I've ever seen.

00:46:59.000 I'll send it to you.

00:47:00.000 Okay.

00:47:00.000 Yeah.

00:47:00.000 It's a journal from the Washington Post.

00:47:03.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:47:03.000 He thinks it's nothing.

00:47:05.000 Yeah.

00:47:05.000 But when...

00:47:06.000 Is he doing mental gymnastics?

00:47:08.000 Yeah.

00:47:08.000 So when Noam essentially corners him and goes, no, no, look at this.

00:47:11.000 Look at this.

00:47:12.000 The guy just...

00:47:13.000 He just...

00:47:13.000 He wants to leave.

00:47:15.000 That's it. 1.00

00:47:16.000 Yeah, well, that's a fucking live wire for them. 0.99

00:47:19.000 They don't want to touch that. 0.99

00:47:21.000 Yeah.

00:47:21.000 You know, it's like there's really no defending it rationally.

00:47:23.000 So if you're on the team that has to defend the left, which, you know, you've all seen people like that on podcasts before, where you realize, like, oh, this guy's just, this isn't like a real person.

00:47:32.000 This is a representative of whatever they're for, whether it's the right or the left.

00:47:37.000 You know, there's people like that where you never really see them.

00:47:40.000 Yeah.

00:47:40.000 You know, they have walls.

00:47:43.000 And what they're doing is just like speaking that kind of language.

00:47:46.000 There's always going to be people like that.

00:47:47.000 We've got to get back, or not back, I don't think we were ever there, but we've got to get somehow the idea that truth matters, man. 0.94

00:47:53.000 And it doesn't matter what fucking team you're on, the truth matters if you're left, right, up, down, whatever. 0.79

00:47:58.000 The truth matters. 0.99

00:47:58.000 Well, I think that's what we're doing right now. 0.99

00:47:59.000 Yeah.

00:48:00.000 I think that's what we do, and that's one of the reasons why your show works.

00:48:02.000 Yeah.

00:48:03.000 And that's one of the reasons why this show works is because people can just talk.

00:48:06.000 Yeah.

00:48:06.000 And they can do so in a way that you really, it's not available anywhere else.

00:48:11.000 The reason why people are so hungry for these kind of conversations on podcasts is because You can't get it anywhere else.

00:48:16.000 These other people aren't doing it.

00:48:18.000 They're doing a different thing.

00:48:19.000 They're doing a thing where there's a giant business behind it, and there's advertisers, and there's a bunch of executives and producers, and they all have segments that they've developed, and there's writers and everyone.

00:48:28.000 And then you get to express yourself sort of through this very narrow window. 0.98

00:48:33.000 To be able to just sit and shoot the shit and just say, why is this and why is that and what is this and what is that? 0.97

00:48:40.000 Like that kind of freedom to do that, it's never existed before. 0.99

00:48:44.000 No, and they're all terrified of a Twitter storm.

00:48:47.000 They're all terrified of a Twitter storm.

00:48:49.000 You see it in our politics.

00:48:51.000 You know, where somebody says something like the hot topic at the moment is immigration, particularly illegal immigration.

00:48:57.000 So there's a lot of people coming from France to the UK illegally.

00:49:02.000 They just jump in a boat from France illegally.

00:49:05.000 And it's run by cartels and gangs.

00:49:08.000 And the really sad thing is some of these people actually drown in the English Channel as a result.

00:49:14.000 And they come to the UK. This needs to stop. 1.00

00:49:18.000 You just can't have unfiltered illegal immigration.

00:49:21.000 Yet you get people on, politicians, to go, look, we need to stop this.

00:49:25.000 And then people are calling, they're saying that they're, you know, one very famous ex-sportsman compares that to Nazi Germany.

00:49:34.000 It's like, why is it happening in this big rush?

00:49:39.000 Is this engineered?

00:49:40.000 Like, why is it happening like this?

00:49:42.000 Like, what is it about this?

00:49:46.000 It seems like at least some people want to keep the borders open.

00:49:51.000 It seems like it.

00:49:52.000 It seems like something's changed where they've made it easier for people to just come across.

00:49:58.000 So, what happened?

00:50:00.000 Whose idea is that?

00:50:01.000 Right.

00:50:02.000 And then what is this crazy push where you want people to not have ID to vote, but you want people to have ID to make sure you have a vaccine passport or you can't work or get on a plane?

00:50:15.000 And did you check any of these people to see if they're vaccinated when they came aboard?

00:50:19.000 You really didn't, did you?

00:50:21.000 So what are we doing here?

00:50:24.000 It's crazy.

00:50:25.000 It's like hundreds of thousands of people a month.

00:50:28.000 It's crazy.

00:50:29.000 You brought it up earlier.

00:50:30.000 I think we talked about this last time with Thomas Sowell, who's just like...

00:50:33.000 I mean, I've read every book that he's ever published, and I just think he's amazing.

00:50:38.000 We talked about the tragic vision versus the slightly more utopian way of looking at things.

00:50:43.000 When you were talking about crime earlier, the tragic vision of life kind of says, if you look back at our history...

00:50:50.000 You kind of get a sense of what human beings are.

00:50:53.000 And human beings are flawed.

00:50:55.000 They're not perfect.

00:50:56.000 They will commit crime.

00:50:57.000 They will do terrible things.

00:50:59.000 They will go to war. 0.68

00:51:00.000 They will do that.

00:51:01.000 And so the only thing you can do is know that and then act accordingly, right?

00:51:06.000 That means that you have to have a border.

00:51:08.000 That means you have to have a police force.

00:51:09.000 You have to recognize the fallibility of human beings and the societal dynamics as well.

00:51:15.000 And then you can make good policy.

00:51:38.000 Yeah.

00:51:40.000 And at the same time, you have to recognize that not everybody's a good guy.

00:51:43.000 Some people are terrorists.

00:51:45.000 Some people are murderers. 1.00

00:51:46.000 Some people are rapists.

00:51:47.000 Some people will do things that you don't want to happen, and you have to also tackle that at the same time.

00:51:53.000 And immigration?

00:51:54.000 Countries need borders, man.

00:51:56.000 That's something people used to agree about, left and right.

00:52:00.000 You know, I've quoted Barack Obama talking about this.

00:52:03.000 We need borders.

00:52:04.000 Yeah, he was talking about that when he's running for president.

00:52:06.000 He's saying something that would get Trump canceled today.

00:52:10.000 What do you think happened, Joe?

00:52:12.000 I don't know, but I don't know how it can keep happening.

00:52:16.000 I don't know how anybody doesn't recognize that it's a problem and go, hey, let's sort this out.

00:52:21.000 I don't know.

00:52:24.000 You don't want to go full tinfoil hat.

00:52:27.000 Nobody does.

00:52:28.000 Nobody wants to, like, are they engineering?

00:52:30.000 I mean, some people do.

00:52:33.000 That's not important right now.

00:52:39.000 If you should just stop and think about all these converging factors, all these things that are happening simultaneously, right?

00:52:46.000 Okay.

00:52:47.000 First of all, massive dip in the economy from the COVID pandemic, businesses closing.

00:52:53.000 Then you have George Floyd.

00:52:54.000 Then you have riots.

00:52:56.000 Then you have defund the police.

00:52:57.000 Then you have massive theft.

00:53:00.000 Do you know how much more theft there is?

00:53:03.000 Lowe's Hardware Store lost...

00:53:06.000 Google this.

00:53:07.000 I think in 2022, they lost $900 million in theft. 0.99

00:53:15.000 Yeah, just people walking into their stores and stealing drills and shit. 0.98

00:53:19.000 Just stealing things. 0.96

00:53:20.000 Because in some places, you can get away with stealing as much as $900 and they're not even allowed to stop you.

00:53:25.000 I mean, that is a recipe for chaos.

00:53:29.000 See if that's true.

00:53:30.000 I want to make sure that those things are true.

00:53:33.000 This is new media.

00:53:34.000 We actually check the facts.

00:53:35.000 And shout out to our friend Andrew Doyle and his new book, The New Puritans.

00:53:40.000 Andrew's awesome.

00:53:41.000 Did he ever get kicked off of Twitter?

00:53:43.000 Did Tatiana McGrath get kicked off? 0.98

00:53:44.000 Yeah, he got kicked off a couple of times, I think.

00:53:47.000 Look at that.

00:53:47.000 Shrink and theft loss is near one billion at Lowe's.

00:53:50.000 Here's how much it's costing other retailers.

00:53:52.000 Yeah, so it's true.

00:53:53.000 It's almost a billion dollars they lost.

00:53:55.000 What does shrink mean?

00:53:56.000 Shrink and theft loss.

00:53:57.000 That's a good question.

00:54:00.000 Shrink and theft.

00:54:01.000 Is shrink like internal theft or...

00:54:04.000 What does that mean?

00:54:05.000 It says it's blaming it on shrink.

00:54:07.000 What does that mean?

00:54:08.000 Items lost to factors.

00:54:09.000 Oh, external or employee theft.

00:54:11.000 Oh, okay.

00:54:12.000 External or employee.

00:54:13.000 So that's...

00:54:13.000 Okay.

00:54:14.000 So what is the actual number?

00:54:16.000 So it says it in there somewhere, I'm pretty sure.

00:54:22.000 Target lost 219 million.

00:54:24.000 I think it's slightly further down, Jamie, just a little bit.

00:54:28.000 There you go, 997?

00:54:30.000 Is that it?

00:54:31.000 997 million.

00:54:32.000 They lost 796 million in 2021. Oh my god.

00:54:37.000 Imagine insuring them.

00:54:38.000 Imagine insuring a store that you know is going to get robbed.

00:54:42.000 But just imagine this, Joe.

00:54:46.000 Actually, Constantine went to speak at this festival.

00:54:48.000 It's a very prestigious festival in the UK called How the Light Gets In, right?

00:54:53.000 And I have friends who go and speak there and go and watch it, debates.

00:54:57.000 Like I said, Constantine took part in a debate there.

00:54:59.000 And one of my friends went to watch because his partner, she was speaking there and hosting debates.

00:55:04.000 And I said to him, how was it, mate?

00:55:05.000 And he said, do you know the thing that was really worrying?

00:55:08.000 I go, what?

00:55:08.000 He goes, and bear in mind, these are some of the most educated people in the UK. At least one of them, per panel, per debate, went, look, until we abolish capitalism, then we're never going to solve these problems.

00:55:22.000 And he's just like, you're talking about genetics.

00:55:24.000 Why are you talking about abolishing capitalism?

00:55:27.000 Ugh.

00:55:27.000 But think about it like this.

00:55:29.000 It's a virtue.

00:55:29.000 There's not a lot of science research that happens outside.

00:55:32.000 Do you know what I mean?

00:55:32.000 Yeah.

00:55:33.000 You need money to do research.

00:55:35.000 Exactly.

00:55:36.000 You think a scientist will get that?

00:55:38.000 You know, the problem is they're so insulated in these university-like ecosystems.

00:55:45.000 They're so insulated.

00:55:46.000 If you're a professional academic, I mean, look, it's a noble thing.

00:55:51.000 It's an amazing thing to be a professor.

00:55:53.000 It's an amazing thing to be educating kids and shaping minds and exposing them to great literature and mathematics and all the wonderful things professors teach.

00:56:02.000 But the reality of their existence is you go from being a high school student to a college-university student to getting your master's degree, to getting your PhD, to teaching.

00:56:12.000 You're constantly in this world, and that world is almost entirely left-wing, like, radically left-wing.

00:56:19.000 Like, what is the percentage of, like, far-left professors?

00:56:25.000 You almost even think, when you think professor, like, far left, it's like Catholic priest. 0.98

00:56:31.000 Pedophile. 0.95

00:56:31.000 You know what I mean? 0.95

00:56:32.000 You know what I'm saying?

00:56:33.000 Unfortunately, they're connected in your head.

00:56:36.000 So you hear about that.

00:56:37.000 You think far left, professor.

00:56:39.000 John Hyatt talks about it in his book.

00:56:42.000 Social studies and stuff like anything to do with that.

00:56:47.000 It's like 9 to 1 or 10 to 1. Sometimes 100 to 1. Yeah.

00:56:51.000 So then they're in that world where they're constantly being reinforced.

00:56:56.000 Like these ideas are reinforced and never challenged and almost, you know, ridiculously so.

00:57:00.000 Like really bright people talk like they're in a cult, like avoiding reality and bending truth to placate whatever the new social norm is for anything.

00:57:11.000 It's bizarre to see.

00:57:14.000 And so those people are always going to be in conflict with reality.

00:57:18.000 So when they're like, you know, we should abolish capitalism.

00:57:21.000 Okay.

00:57:22.000 Okay. 1.00

00:57:22.000 Like, you live in a fucking playground. 1.00

00:57:25.000 Like, what are you talking about? 1.00

00:57:26.000 Right.

00:57:27.000 It's a good description.

00:57:28.000 You're not out there in the real world.

00:57:29.000 You're teaching kids.

00:57:30.000 You're teaching kids at a playground, and you're the god, because you're the professor with all the knowledge.

00:57:34.000 Stop.

00:57:35.000 Yeah.

00:57:35.000 No, you can't.

00:57:36.000 It's never been done before, stupid. 1.00

00:57:38.000 Like, communism never works. 1.00

00:57:39.000 We tried.

00:57:40.000 We tried.

00:57:41.000 Look at how that works out.

00:57:42.000 It leads to violence. 1.00

00:57:42.000 It leads to fucking authoritarianism. 1.00

00:57:44.000 It leads to dictatorships. 1.00

00:57:46.000 You've got to enforce people following all these rules.

00:57:49.000 You have to.

00:57:50.000 That's the point.

00:57:50.000 You have to use violence.

00:57:52.000 You have to use violence to make that work.

00:57:54.000 What Yeonmi Park talks about when she talks about her experience in North Korea when she fled North Korea.

00:58:01.000 She said they promised everyone that they would be able to feed everyone if they took over the land.

00:58:06.000 That's how they got everyone's land.

00:58:08.000 That's how they got everybody to give up. 1.00

00:58:09.000 And now they're fucked. 0.99

00:58:11.000 And that is happening right now in 2023. The way Yeonmi Park describes North Korea is actually the way North Korea is right now. 1.00

00:58:19.000 So don't think that that can't happen here.

00:58:22.000 They're regulating podcasts in Canada.

00:58:25.000 Oh, yeah.

00:58:26.000 I was reading about this bill. 0.55

00:58:28.000 Because I woke up, and we're jet-lagged, so I woke up at ridiculous time.

00:58:33.000 I went on the phone, which you should never do, let's be honest.

00:58:35.000 That is a bad way to start the day.

00:58:37.000 It's not good.

00:58:38.000 No.

00:58:39.000 And then I was reading about what they're doing.

00:58:41.000 It's terrifying.

00:58:42.000 So they want to bring in this bill.

00:58:44.000 Whereby they regulate podcasts.

00:58:47.000 So what they want to do is every podcast streamer or whatever it is, platform, that makes more than $10 million revenue, not profit, revenue, has to register with the Canadian government.

00:58:59.000 They then want them to hand over information about their content and the people listening.

00:59:07.000 What?

00:59:08.000 To the government.

00:59:12.000 Imagine getting a hold of Alex Jones' email list.

00:59:17.000 Probably a bunch of senators in there. 1.00

00:59:20.000 Oh yeah, for sure.

00:59:21.000 I mean, imagine.

00:59:22.000 The government can get that.

00:59:24.000 They're talking right now about, and maybe we're going to need to fact check this again because I was reading it this morning, but basically they want it to promote Canadian, something to do with basically Canadian greatness or whatever it is, they talk about it,

00:59:40.000 and Indigenous affairs.

00:59:41.000 And you're like, oh, so they're going to say a number of things are un-Canadian and then you can just silence them.

00:59:48.000 Look what Trudeau did with the truckers.

00:59:51.000 Yeah.

00:59:52.000 Yeah.

00:59:53.000 Terrifying.

00:59:53.000 We just had one of those guys on to talk about it.

00:59:55.000 Not just the truckers, but people who donated to the truckers got their bank accounts closed.

00:59:59.000 Yeah.

01:00:00.000 Yeah.

01:00:00.000 Well, that is wild.

01:00:02.000 Yeah.

01:00:02.000 You got locked out of all of your money because you donated to a cause where you didn't think that people should have to take an experimental vaccine in order to be able to work to drive a truck.

01:00:12.000 But...

01:00:13.000 Really?

01:00:14.000 Really?

01:00:15.000 You think that's okay?

01:00:16.000 Like that's so not okay.

01:00:17.000 The fact that those people aren't up in arms. 0.96

01:00:20.000 The whole country didn't freak out and demand A fucking change like you can't have that's dictatorship stuff. 0.98

01:00:28.000 That's what it is. 0.96

01:00:29.000 It's banana Republic stuff We do these calls with our top supporters and we have some in Canada we have this lady who's been supporting us for years and You know she's always fine and in the middle of this thing she was like I'm terrified Like I'm not gonna be able to eat because they they're gonna shut down my bank account Right In Canada?

01:00:48.000 It's so crazy that they think they could do that if people disagree with them.

01:00:52.000 Because that's all they're doing.

01:00:53.000 They're just disagreeing.

01:00:55.000 And they're supporting a protest.

01:00:57.000 It should be.

01:00:58.000 And it was a peaceful protest.

01:01:00.000 Those people did it the right way.

01:01:01.000 They just parked their trucks and they didn't block roads off. 0.96

01:01:04.000 They didn't do anything fucked up. 0.98

01:01:06.000 But if you frame it that these people, which is how they were being framed, as racist far-right, well, look, you're giving money to a far-right racist organization. 0.99

01:01:16.000 You're encouraging hate.

01:01:18.000 Well, the government has to step in.

01:01:20.000 We have to step in, and we need to freeze everything because we need to make everything safe.

01:01:25.000 What was his most recent apology because they accidentally awarded a Nazi... 0.74

01:01:30.000 Yeah.

01:01:31.000 What happened?

01:01:32.000 I think Zelensky was visiting the Canadian Parliament and they got some guy who was a Ukrainian, inverted commas, war veteran.

01:01:42.000 Turned out he fought for the bad guys in that one.

01:01:45.000 Oh my god.

01:01:46.000 Yeah.

01:01:46.000 I don't think they...

01:01:47.000 I don't think, like, Zelensky or...

01:01:49.000 I don't know if...

01:01:50.000 He probably didn't know.

01:01:50.000 Yeah, he didn't know.

01:01:51.000 But so imagine you're sitting in Parliament and everyone's like, hey, let's do a, you know, stand up and give a round of applause for this war veteran.

01:01:58.000 You're like, ah, and then it turns out you're applauding a Nazi. 0.56

01:02:01.000 How old is this dude?

01:02:02.000 Old.

01:02:03.000 Yeah, he probably doesn't even know.

01:02:11.000 I mean, if you're a sane person, how do you deal with that fact that you committed all of these heinous crimes?

01:02:24.000 Yeah, if you're living in that time, do you think it's just everyone's doing it and you just get sucked into the cult and you're scared or you believe it?

01:02:35.000 Is it that easy for human beings to other people?

01:02:38.000 Is it because it was a different time and people just didn't have as much exposure to knowledge as they do today and that wouldn't be as possible today?

01:02:47.000 I hate to think that that's a possible...

01:02:49.000 Because there's always been times in history where people committed genocide.

01:02:52.000 There's always been times in history where people have decided that this other group, and oftentimes other groups that look exactly like they do, right?

01:02:59.000 Those are the bad people.

01:03:01.000 Whether it's because of religion or a line they drew on the dirt, they've decided that those people are worth exterminating. 0.98

01:03:07.000 And those stories are... 1.00

01:03:09.000 Fucking horrific. 0.99

01:03:11.000 And the Nazi Germany one is just the latest one. 0.99

01:03:15.000 It's just the one that we call upon.

01:03:17.000 But, you know, just think about what the Mongols did. 0.98

01:03:20.000 You know, that's in 1200. Think about what they did.

01:03:24.000 They just sacked entire cities, just killed everybody, piled them up in big fucking stacks, lit everything on fire, took all the women, and they just left town. 0.99

01:03:32.000 And they did that all over Europe, all over Asia. 0.99

01:03:36.000 They did it all over.

01:03:37.000 They've ran everything.

01:03:39.000 They killed something in the neighborhood of 10% of the world's population was murdered during Genghis Khan's era. 0.57

01:03:45.000 So much so that the carbon footprint of human beings on Earth got lower.

01:03:50.000 He was progressive.

01:03:53.000 That's how many people killed.

01:03:55.000 Yeah.

01:03:55.000 You know, there's a lot of historians in Russia who say that many of the reasons the way Russian people are the way they are and there's a lot of, like, trauma in society that's carrying on is from that period.

01:04:05.000 We have a lot of words in Russian for cruelty and all that sort of thing that come from that period.

01:04:11.000 Completely makes sense.

01:04:12.000 Completely makes sense.

01:04:13.000 I mean, just imagine.

01:04:14.000 The horror of a gigantic army of men on horseback intent on murdering everyone in front of them.

01:04:22.000 And that that was consistent with the era.

01:04:24.000 It was normal stuff.

01:04:26.000 That was like, oh, the Mongols are here. 1.00

01:04:28.000 We're fucked. 1.00

01:04:29.000 That's a thing that human beings have always done for some strange reason. 1.00

01:04:36.000 They've always done that.

01:04:38.000 And the thing about today is that as much as we know about humans, much access technology we have, the interconnectivity that we have with each other, there's still war.

01:04:48.000 And no one, if you had to put your money, if you're a gambler, within 10 years will there be no war on Earth.

01:04:56.000 What kind of odds am I getting?

01:04:58.000 Because for sure there's going to be something popping off somewhere.

01:05:01.000 We're bands of chimps, man.

01:05:02.000 That's what we are.

01:05:03.000 We're bands of chimps.

01:05:04.000 And chimps go to war.

01:05:05.000 And so do we.

01:05:06.000 Absolutely.

01:05:07.000 But then there's also the flip side of it where there are like, you know, I always tell this story because to me, it's this is a story of my grandfather.

01:05:15.000 So my grandfather in the Second World War, he used to he was a master joiner, which is the highest level of carpenter you could get.

01:05:23.000 And he used to work in a factory in Manchester on the mosquito plants.

01:05:28.000 And the fascinating thing about the mosquito was it was the only airplane.

01:05:32.000 It was a fighter airplane and was made entirely out of wood.

01:05:35.000 Whoa.

01:05:35.000 Yeah.

01:05:36.000 So it was because Amesha Smith was very lumbering. 0.96

01:05:39.000 It was very heavy.

01:05:39.000 It was a great fighter plane, but it wasn't very nimble.

01:05:42.000 And the Mosquito was.

01:05:44.000 And he was making Mosquito.

01:05:45.000 So he was exempt from going to war.

01:05:49.000 And he, I think it was 1941 and he was a smart guy and he was following what was happening.

01:05:54.000 And he, like I said, he was exempt because he was part of the war and a very important part.

01:05:59.000 He resigned his position at the factory, enlisted to go and join.

01:06:06.000 I had a baby, my aunt Patricia, who was probably around one or two years old, married, and he enlisted to go and fight in the war, knowing full well that there was a very significant chance that he wouldn't come back.

01:06:19.000 Yet he risked his life because he knew that there was something more important.

01:06:26.000 And whilst we focus on the bad, there's also incredible people, like everyday people, like from that generation, who just went, no, this is wrong.

01:06:36.000 And I need to stand up and I need to do something.

01:06:39.000 And...

01:06:40.000 There is something greater than me.

01:06:42.000 So there is that aspect of humanity as well.

01:06:45.000 That does exist, but I think people were more resilient then because life was more difficult.

01:06:50.000 I think it's great that we've managed to make starvation one of the least of our concerns in this country at this point in time.

01:06:59.000 You know, but along the way, I think we've made it so easy to survive for so many people that we've got kind of lost resolve.

01:07:10.000 And it must have been horrible to live back then, to live during the time of World War I. I mean, imagine how hard life was back then. 0.94

01:07:17.000 Life was fucking hard.

01:07:19.000 But those are the type of people that you need if you're gonna have a war. 0.96

01:07:25.000 We don't have that many of those now.

01:07:28.000 You've seen those videos.

01:07:31.000 I don't know if you have, but there's physical fitness classes in the 1960s in America.

01:07:38.000 And they all look like little athletes. 0.98

01:07:41.000 They're all doing monkey bars and shit. 0.99

01:07:44.000 Everybody's working out. 0.99

01:07:45.000 They all look fit.

01:07:46.000 If you tried to have a video like that today, you'd have some blue-haired slobs falling down and breaking their arms. 1.00

01:07:52.000 How many people are resilient today?

01:07:55.000 It's less.

01:07:57.000 There's a lot more people, but the percentage of resilient people is less.

01:08:01.000 Well, Jamie, you might be able to look this up.

01:08:02.000 I think there was an article recently about the fact that the U.S. Army is having trouble recruiting people because they're just not physically capable.

01:08:10.000 They're struggling.

01:08:11.000 Yeah.

01:08:12.000 And that wouldn't just be the U.S. It would be a lot of places.

01:08:14.000 Also, the Army is kind of going woke.

01:08:16.000 Oh, man.

01:08:17.000 Oh, man.

01:08:18.000 And this is the thing we've been talking about, right man? 0.98

01:08:21.000 It's like, can we just focus on what fucking works? 0.97

01:08:25.000 Can we focus on what works? 1.00

01:08:27.000 I want the army to be good at killing the enemy. 0.99

01:08:29.000 I don't give a fuck about how diverse they are. 0.99

01:08:31.000 Right. 0.95

01:08:31.000 Imagine if the UFC had to have diversity. 0.95

01:08:34.000 Do you know what a problem that would be?

01:08:36.000 To have a certain amount of trans folks, a certain amount of... 1.00

01:08:41.000 That would work well in the women's division. 1.00

01:08:43.000 If you only had numbers you had to achieve, it wasn't the best fighters.

01:08:49.000 It was just who meets certain criteria.

01:08:51.000 There's going to be a bunch of people that get murdered.

01:08:54.000 They're going to get thrown in with the real ones. 0.98

01:08:56.000 There's going to be a certain percentage of people that are just there because they're awesome, and a certain percentage of people that they have to hire in order to meet these DEI standards.

01:09:04.000 Jamie, can I ask a favor, man?

01:09:06.000 Would you mind bringing up RAF, Diversity, UK? It's a beautiful story.

01:09:12.000 This is a beautiful story.

01:09:14.000 What happened?

01:09:16.000 Mate, this is... 1.00

01:09:17.000 Just look up for useless male white pilots. 1.00

01:09:21.000 Look that one up. 1.00

01:09:22.000 Useless male white pilots? 1.00

01:09:24.000 Was that a quote? 1.00

01:09:25.000 Yeah, that's a quote from their report.

01:09:27.000 They were like, you know what?

01:09:28.000 We're not hiring any more white men to fly planes. 1.00

01:09:31.000 What a good idea.

01:09:32.000 Yeah.

01:09:32.000 Definitely don't hire the people that are the best at it.

01:09:34.000 No, why would you?

01:09:36.000 Whether they're white or black or Asian. 0.99

01:09:37.000 No, just don't hire white ones. 1.00

01:09:39.000 Royal Air Force unlawfully discriminated against white male recruits in bid to boost diversity.

01:09:44.000 Dude, you want the best. 0.99

01:09:46.000 Whoever the fuck they are, whether they're white or South American or Indian, you want the best. 1.00

01:09:52.000 Who cares? 1.00

01:09:52.000 No one cares. 1.00

01:09:53.000 You want people who fly the planes the best, right?

01:09:56.000 Only the best.

01:09:58.000 And this is, like, controversial now.

01:10:00.000 It's a war play.

01:10:01.000 Could you imagine?

01:10:03.000 Imagine if, like, again, it goes back to the MMA fighters.

01:10:06.000 Imagine if, like, you know, like, the UK had one representative that was supposed to be fighting Francis Ngannou.

01:10:12.000 You know what I'm saying?

01:10:14.000 Don't pick me! 0.98

01:10:15.000 You know, you have one person that's supposed to step up and fight that guy.

01:10:20.000 And, well, it says the right move is to, you know, send in a non-binary woman. 0.97

01:10:25.000 Yeah.

01:10:26.000 Because they don't get represented in the UFC. Like, okay.

01:10:29.000 What? 1.00

01:10:30.000 What the fuck are you talking about? 1.00

01:10:31.000 She's representing the UK. We need someone to go beat him. 1.00

01:10:34.000 Man, it comes to a point, and this is where we talk about the university campus, right? 0.99

01:10:41.000 You can have these demented ideas on a university campus, and all they are is an exercise in intellectual masturbation when you come down to it, when you break it down to its purest sense, right? 0.89

01:10:51.000 And in a way, that's fine. 1.00

01:10:53.000 What's wrong with having stupid ideas and debating and believing it? 0.99

01:10:56.000 But the problem is, is when you start to implement it in the real world where there is such a thing as reality... 1.00

01:11:01.000 Right.

01:11:02.000 That's when the rubber hits the road and things really start going wrong.

01:11:06.000 That's when things go Western.

01:11:08.000 That's what we like to call it out here.

01:11:10.000 Right.

01:11:10.000 Things got Western.

01:11:11.000 Right.

01:11:12.000 I will say as well, I think, you know, we've been talking about social media.

01:11:16.000 I think social media is a big part of this.

01:11:17.000 I don't know if you've seen the graphs, but basically what happens in 2013, 2014...

01:11:22.000 Newspaper articles just start... 0.94

01:11:24.000 All this social justice bullshit, it just goes through the sky. 0.99

01:11:27.000 Not just in the US and the UK. It's Qatar. 0.99

01:11:30.000 It's every country in the world.

01:11:32.000 So I think social media rewards ideas that sound good.

01:11:36.000 It does, but it also awards echo chambers.

01:11:39.000 That's a big part of it.

01:11:41.000 Just like we're talking about universities, the echo chambers on the right wing online are just like the echo chambers on the left wing.

01:11:48.000 It's like...

01:11:49.000 It rewards that.

01:11:50.000 Everybody looks for their favorite commenters who jump on their threads and comment on each and every one and back them up on these things and they look at all the likes and yeah! 1.00

01:12:00.000 Kickin' ass! 1.00

01:12:02.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:12:03.000 But my favourite story of this year, and this is one that I love so much, it's by a beautiful woman, Jo, called Isla Bryson.

01:12:11.000 Oh, this is a great story.

01:12:13.000 I remember last time I was at your club, The Mothership, we touched on it briefly when you and I were talking, but this, to me, is the most beautiful story of a beautiful woman living her best life.

01:12:24.000 Jamie, we're going to need to see a photo of this beautiful woman.

01:12:26.000 Jo, you're happily married.

01:12:29.000 I don't remember you bringing this up.

01:12:31.000 So this happened in Scotland.

01:12:33.000 So what is the story? 0.92

01:12:35.000 Okay, so there's a two-time male rapist called Adam Graham.

01:12:39.000 Convicted male rapist, right?

01:12:41.000 And then, just before he was going to be sent to prison, he got what Constance and I like to call rapid-onset prison dysphoria.

01:12:49.000 Prison onset, you put it through the line, but it's prison onset, gender dysphoria. 0.79

01:12:54.000 This is the guy.

01:12:55.000 So now he's a woman in women's prison? 0.88

01:12:56.000 Yeah.

01:12:57.000 They put him in a women's prison. 1.00

01:12:58.000 There's the clitoris, Joe, if you're wondering. 0.98

01:13:01.000 They're doing that in America, too. 0.95

01:13:02.000 Yeah.

01:13:03.000 There's quite a few.

01:13:05.000 There's one person that identifies a woman, went to jail, and got two people pregnant in jail.

01:13:12.000 Like, er, er, er, der.

01:13:14.000 Like, what? 0.96

01:13:16.000 It just seems so silly.

01:13:18.000 And I'm as liberal as you can get, but I'm not on board with that.

01:13:21.000 Well, I'm as liberal as you can get, too.

01:13:22.000 That's what's so crazy. 1.00

01:13:23.000 It's like they push it so far to cuckoo land that any rejection of any of these outrageously stupid ideas becomes far right. 1.00

01:13:33.000 You're far right if you don't think a guy with a regular dick... 1.00

01:13:38.000 Who has been straight his whole life should be able to identify as a woman and go into a women's prison and be with women like come on. 1.00

01:13:44.000 And this guy's a rapist. 1.00

01:13:45.000 He's a threat. 1.00

01:13:46.000 We know he's a threat.

01:13:47.000 It's so crazy.

01:13:49.000 It's just so crazy that they'll take it all the way to prison.

01:13:53.000 And then you've got politicians who, on Question Time, which is our most prestigious political debate show, they had a member of the SNP, because this happened in Scotland, so this is a member of the Scottish National Party, and this SNP member was asked,

01:14:12.000 Is Isla Graham male or female?

01:14:15.000 And you know what she responded this woman? 1.00

01:14:16.000 She went, they're a rapist. 1.00

01:14:20.000 Refused to even acknowledge that it's a male. 1.00

01:14:23.000 That it's a man.

01:14:24.000 What a weird world.

01:14:26.000 So weird.

01:14:27.000 Isn't it?

01:14:27.000 I would have never imagined if you came to me in 2013 and said, guess what's going to be a crazy subject 10 years from now?

01:14:36.000 Guys who just say they're women and they put them in women's prisons. 1.00

01:14:38.000 What?

01:14:39.000 Come on.

01:14:40.000 That can't be a thing.

01:14:42.000 Imagine if you had to dress up like a woman for a whole year in order for it to be legit. 1.00

01:14:48.000 There was a rule.

01:14:49.000 You could do it, but you had to dress up like a whole year.

01:14:52.000 So criminals just started dressing up like women. 0.93

01:14:55.000 Became like the thing, you know, like guys like the sag.

01:14:57.000 Yeah, like that's how they wear their pants in prison, right?

01:15:00.000 So they like to sag. 0.98

01:15:01.000 It's like part of the part of the thing What if that becomes the thing like, you know, there's only one one to get locked up with women You gotta dress like a woman all the time So you gotta dress like a woman for like a whole year in order to be accepted It would be the new style of like just just people just like I'm a criminal I don't give a fuck. 0.98

01:15:17.000 It's what I do if I get arrested at least I'm gonna get arrested with women and Yeah. 1.00

01:15:21.000 Guys will start wearing dresses.

01:15:22.000 And I'll be honest with you, man.

01:15:23.000 I don't want to be talking about trans my whole life. 0.99

01:15:26.000 You have to.

01:15:27.000 You have no choice.

01:15:28.000 You will comply.

01:15:30.000 You will comply or we will freeze your bank account. 0.99

01:15:35.000 I don't want to be talking about this shit, but when this is happening, what are we supposed to do? 0.99

01:15:39.000 We're just supposed to sit there and pretend it's not happening? 1.00

01:15:41.000 Well, if you have any opinion other than what you're supposed to have, then you're some kind of a terrible person and a transphobe. 1.00

01:15:50.000 That's nuts. 1.00

01:15:51.000 Because there's always room for crazy.

01:15:54.000 You gotta leave room for crazy.

01:15:55.000 You gotta leave room for crazy in all groups of people.

01:15:58.000 Yeah. 0.94

01:15:59.000 Including trans people. 0.99

01:16:00.000 And if you don't, if you're trying to pretend that, you know, you have this group that anybody can join and that these are new rules and we're all living in Narnia now.

01:16:10.000 Come on.

01:16:11.000 Come on.

01:16:12.000 There's always gonna be crazy people.

01:16:13.000 Of course. 1.00

01:16:14.000 The emperor's fucking naked, man. 1.00

01:16:15.000 The emperor's naked as fuck, and he's got a hard on. 1.00

01:16:17.000 Yeah, and he's right there. 1.00

01:16:19.000 Yeah, and he's like, I want access to the female changing rooms. 1.00

01:16:23.000 And we're like, come this way, madam.

01:16:24.000 And you're a bigot, if you don't agree.

01:16:26.000 Imagine Francis Ngannou was like, you know what, I'm a woman.

01:16:29.000 I wonder what percentage of, like, people with kids believe that versus people who don't have kids.

01:16:35.000 Right.

01:16:35.000 Yeah.

01:16:36.000 That's an interesting...

01:16:36.000 Right.

01:16:37.000 Yeah.

01:16:37.000 Because I wonder if so many...

01:16:38.000 Like, there's so many people that have ideas, people that don't have children, they have ideas that I think...

01:16:42.000 They just have this ideology that they subscribe to but with no consequences for anyone that's really young that they love and care about.

01:16:50.000 And then when they have kids and then there's someone young that they love and care about, you start looking at the world as a much more dangerous place.

01:16:57.000 You start saying, oh, these people are like little kids.

01:16:59.000 Like there was some little girl who got kidnapped really recently. 0.93

01:17:02.000 They found, they used geo-tracking of cell phones and shit and the person's fingerprints from the ransom note and they got her back pretty quickly, luckily. 0.68

01:17:11.000 But a nine-year-old girl just gets kidnapped. 0.97

01:17:13.000 There's people like that in the world.

01:17:16.000 And when you have children, you think like that.

01:17:17.000 Someone could steal your kids. 0.96

01:17:19.000 That's real.

01:17:20.000 Someone could hurt your kids.

01:17:21.000 And someone could go in the locker room and watch your kid go to the bathroom because they decide that they're a girl. 1.00

01:17:29.000 And that doesn't mean that...

01:17:31.000 There's not people that are legitimately trans and identify as women and that's who they are and they're not perverts and they're not creeps.

01:17:37.000 Of course.

01:17:38.000 Of course that exists too.

01:17:39.000 But you're opening the door.

01:17:41.000 If someone just says, I'm trans, I can use that restroom. 1.00

01:17:46.000 You're opening the door for perverts. 0.99

01:17:48.000 You 100% most certainly are. 0.97

01:17:50.000 This doesn't deny the existence of trans people.

01:17:52.000 But we have to be honest about what could possibly happen. 0.97

01:17:56.000 That's why if people are uncomfortable with biological males walking around female locker rooms, it's because some people are liars and they're con artists. 0.60

01:18:05.000 And they're not really, it's this person that's like been trapped in a man's body their whole life. 1.00

01:18:10.000 They're fucking perverts and they want to be around kids or they want to be around women. 1.00

01:18:14.000 They want to make them uncomfortable. 1.00

01:18:15.000 They want people to stare at their dick while they walk around and know that they can't say anything about it. 0.99

01:18:19.000 That's real too. 1.00

01:18:21.000 That's real too.

01:18:22.000 This doesn't discount the problem that trans people have with integrating it to society and being accepted. 0.99

01:18:28.000 That's real too.

01:18:29.000 That's real too.

01:18:30.000 But you have to understand that if you just have this blanket policy where no one can question anything about this stuff, you're opening the door to abuse. 0.90

01:18:40.000 And you have a front door in your house, not because you think everyone is going to come and steal shit from your house, but you know that some people will, so you have to put certain things in place to protect yourself and your family. 0.72

01:18:50.000 It's the most obvious thing, man. 0.99

01:18:53.000 Well, it's just there's no screening in women's bathrooms. 1.00

01:18:57.000 Like, you don't know whether someone's a creep.

01:18:58.000 You have no idea. 0.98

01:19:00.000 It's not like, you know, getting into a fucking job where they have to do a background check on you. 0.94

01:19:05.000 You know, it's not like applying for some top secret position where they have to make sure that, you know, you're someone who could be trusted with information. 0.99

01:19:12.000 No, it's like a bathroom.

01:19:14.000 So it could be like someone just out of jail, puts on a dress, goes into a women's room. 0.78

01:19:18.000 I mean, that's what we're accepting today.

01:19:20.000 That is a possibility. 0.72

01:19:22.000 And women that feel vulnerable in those situations are fucking terrified, and rightfully so, because if they do encounter something like that, they get no support. 0.86

01:19:29.000 No one will take your side. 0.98

01:19:31.000 You saw what happened with that thing that happened in Hollywood at that massage parlor?

01:19:35.000 Oh, yeah.

01:19:36.000 Yeah, in California. 0.54

01:19:38.000 Bonkers, man. 0.95

01:19:39.000 Someone who had a history of being a sex offender, walking around naked in the women's room, they complained, and then all of a sudden there's protests there.

01:19:47.000 It's like, come on, kids.

01:19:49.000 Man, going to California, and we love this country, as you know.

01:19:52.000 We traveled all around it. 1.00

01:19:53.000 You should, motherfucker. 1.00

01:19:55.000 We love it. 1.00

01:19:56.000 We rule. 0.97

01:19:57.000 It's fucking awesome. 0.99

01:19:58.000 Only an American would say that. 0.98

01:20:01.000 The British person would be like, it's all right, mate. 1.00

01:20:02.000 It's all right.

01:20:03.000 It's not too bad.

01:20:04.000 America! 1.00

01:20:05.000 Fuck yeah! 1.00

01:20:06.000 We put up flags everywhere. 1.00

01:20:07.000 Yeah.

01:20:08.000 I've got one right there.

01:20:09.000 Yeah.

01:20:09.000 I mean, they're small in California.

01:20:11.000 The California flag is about this big.

01:20:13.000 People started accusing me of being right wing when I had that flag behind me.

01:20:16.000 Oh, really?

01:20:17.000 That very flag.

01:20:17.000 Yeah, it's cool.

01:20:18.000 It's a cool art piece.

01:20:19.000 I love it.

01:20:20.000 That used to be the backdrop.

01:20:21.000 And people criticized me.

01:20:23.000 They were saying, he's right wing.

01:20:24.000 He's a right winger now.

01:20:25.000 Look at the American flag.

01:20:26.000 People think American flag is right wing.

01:20:30.000 God, that's all of us, kids.

01:20:31.000 That's the whole batch of us.

01:20:33.000 You know, we're supposed to be in this together.

01:20:35.000 Yeah.

01:20:36.000 And this is, you know...

01:20:37.000 But California, man, what you see...

01:20:39.000 I mean, it's many American cities, actually, sadly.

01:20:42.000 But what you see in California...

01:20:44.000 People go, it's like a third world country.

01:20:45.000 I grew up in several third world countries.

01:20:47.000 I did not see that.

01:20:48.000 Well, you were talking about the encampments, the homeless encampments?

01:20:51.000 But also the crime, the way that people are...

01:20:54.000 I mean, we've driven around places where you just see people.

01:20:56.000 You don't even know if they're alive.

01:20:58.000 Yeah.

01:20:59.000 That's good drugs.

01:21:00.000 You get the good stuff.

01:21:01.000 The good stuff, you just nap anywhere. 1.00

01:21:04.000 Like, fuck the world. 1.00

01:21:05.000 I'm sleeping on this potted plant. 1.00

01:21:09.000 Yeah.

01:21:09.000 Yeah, it's not good, man.

01:21:10.000 And I don't know how that snaps back either.

01:21:12.000 Yeah.

01:21:13.000 I wouldn't want to be the governor.

01:21:14.000 Imagine that.

01:21:15.000 Imagine being the mayor of Los Angeles or the governor of California trying to clean that mess up.

01:21:19.000 But somebody's got to do it, Joe.

01:21:21.000 There's got to be a point now where ordinary, rational people just go, you know what, mate?

01:21:28.000 Enough's enough.

01:21:29.000 Or AI. We just farm it off to AI. AI's your new governor. 0.86

01:21:35.000 It eliminates bias.

01:21:37.000 Oh, it doesn't eliminate bias.

01:21:41.000 AI follows the rule of the law.

01:21:43.000 Oh, boy.

01:21:44.000 AI will just figure out how to get rid of the homeless people. 0.98

01:21:47.000 They're going to shoot one every night until they all quit. 0.81

01:21:49.000 They're like those robot dogs that are just going to show up at Venice Beach and just gun one person down. 0.94

01:21:54.000 We will be back tomorrow. 0.96

01:21:55.000 We will shoot one person every night until this beach is cleaned. 0.99

01:22:00.000 And then they just drive into the center of it and shoot people. 0.98

01:22:02.000 So it's not even just people on the outside, so no one's safe.

01:22:05.000 Tell you what, that TV show would get great ratings.

01:22:08.000 That's an episode of Black Mirror.

01:22:10.000 Did you ever see that one, Heavy Metal, where the robot dog is chasing this lady?

01:22:15.000 No.

01:22:15.000 Oh my god, it's terrifying.

01:22:17.000 It's terrifying today, too, when you watch those Boston Dynamic videos where they show those DARPA robots.

01:22:23.000 Oh yeah.

01:22:24.000 Those things are so great! 0.98

01:22:25.000 Yeah, they got DARPA cheetahs and shit and all these like really nutty robots are working on that you could do backflips and they could do parkour like with their making super robots and when those motherfuckers decide to reinforce the will of AI and Just roam to the streets like that fucking Will Smith movie I robot We're not far away from that man that might be our best bet that might be what gives us hope is that AI takes over government and And they take over allocation 0.97

01:22:55.000 of funds. 0.99

01:22:56.000 I can't tell if you're being serious or you're joking, man.

01:22:58.000 I'm kind of serious.

01:22:59.000 That's how they eliminate corruption, because they're not terrified of the corporations and their money, because AI will control all the money.

01:23:04.000 Go and chat GPT and try to ask it some questions about trans.

01:23:07.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:23:08.000 Oh, boy, that thing is...

01:23:10.000 It's a little woke.

01:23:11.000 Yeah, it's a little woke.

01:23:12.000 It's also, it will criticize certain people, but not criticize others.

01:23:16.000 Yeah.

01:23:16.000 Yeah, it's interesting.

01:23:17.000 It also won't say anything nice about Donald Trump.

01:23:21.000 Really?

01:23:21.000 Yeah.

01:23:22.000 Didn't someone do something like that?

01:23:23.000 They tried to say something good about Trump and why he'd make a great president.

01:23:32.000 Hey, I wonder what it says.

01:23:33.000 Let's find out in real time.

01:23:34.000 Because somebody told me that, but I always wonder, you know, like, are you using the same program?

01:23:39.000 Are you using the older program or the new, what is now, 4.5?

01:23:45.000 What they're saying is when five comes out, each one of them is exponential.

01:23:51.000 They're more and more complex.

01:23:53.000 Their answers are better.

01:23:54.000 They can code websites in seconds.

01:23:56.000 They can figure things out that you can never figure out.

01:23:59.000 If you had a lifetime of studying over books, figure things out instantaneously.

01:24:04.000 We're real, real close to having full-on training wheels for life.

01:24:08.000 Just like you don't remember phone numbers anymore because they're all in your phone.

01:24:12.000 Donald Trump has a talent for engaging with and energizing his supporters.

01:24:16.000 His ability to connect with a large segment of American population and inspire passionate loyalty is noteworthy.

01:24:22.000 Additionally, his presidency marked a period of significant policy changes, including tax reform and criminal justice reform, which had lasting impacts in the United States.

01:24:31.000 It's important to remember that different people have varying perspective on political figures and recognizing their positive attributes can foster constructive dialogue.

01:24:40.000 You should go into politics, man.

01:24:41.000 That's pretty good.

01:24:42.000 That's a great answer.

01:24:43.000 So that's ChatGPT, Jamie?

01:24:46.000 That's a great answer.

01:24:48.000 ChatGPT's a right-wing bigot.

01:24:50.000 That's why ChatGPT should govern us.

01:24:53.000 See what I'm saying?

01:24:54.000 It's basically just echoed what we've been saying.

01:24:57.000 So what if ChatGPT is that smart?

01:24:59.000 And what if it understands that the policies were actually effective?

01:25:02.000 You know, the thing that really worries me about AI, it's that it's going to get rid of low-skilled labour that employs a hell of a lot of people, particularly a hell of a lot of men in this country.

01:25:15.000 I saw this great clip from Tucker Carlson where he was going, you know, we're talking about AI, but AI is going to bring in driverless cars.

01:25:22.000 It's going to bring in driverless lorries.

01:25:24.000 Think about how many men in the US at the moment are employed in the driving industry.

01:25:30.000 What's going to happen when all of those men become redundant, there are no jobs, They're at home, and he goes, I'm going to be honest with you, men without direction, men without jobs, earning without responsibility, that doesn't end well.

01:25:45.000 What are we going to do then?

01:25:46.000 We're going to transition all of them. 0.99

01:25:52.000 Anybody who's got a problem.

01:25:53.000 It's like we've found out that men create all the problems, we're just going to turn you into a woman. 1.00

01:25:57.000 Yeah.

01:25:57.000 There you go.

01:25:58.000 Problem solved.

01:26:00.000 We solved it right here.

01:26:01.000 That's how we, instead of putting all the men in prison, we just turn all of them into women. 0.99

01:26:04.000 Fantastic.

01:26:05.000 Well, you know what?

01:26:08.000 I don't have a counter-argument to that.

01:26:11.000 And this is the thing that scares me.

01:26:14.000 Before COVID, I used to think of myself as pretty anti-conspiratorial.

01:26:21.000 But during COVID and post-COVID, I've realized I'm becoming more and more conspiratorial as I realized that we were being lied to.

01:26:30.000 Well, there most certainly are real conspiracies. 0.94

01:26:32.000 The problem is no one wants to feel stupid. 0.99

01:26:35.000 And you don't want to even entertain conspiracy theories because there's dumb ones out there. 1.00

01:26:41.000 So you get connected to all the dumb ones. 0.98

01:26:44.000 And you can get connected to those if you're not paying attention. 0.98

01:26:48.000 But there's real ones, and there's a lot of them, and they've always existed.

01:26:53.000 What's your favorite?

01:26:55.000 Conspiracy theory?

01:26:56.000 The favorite's always the war ones, because it's just so crazy that they'll just lie to get us into wars, and that it's always been a thing.

01:27:03.000 You know, Hitler burned the Reichstag, and Nero burned Rome, and the Gulf of Tonkin incident, and the Operation Northwoods thing that they planned. 0.86

01:27:13.000 That was signed by the Joint Chiefs of Staff and vetoed by Kennedy.

01:27:16.000 Were they going to arm Cuban friendlies and have them attack Guantanamo Bay and blow up a jetliner and blame it on Cuba? 0.99

01:27:22.000 They were going to do some wild shit to try to get us to go to war with Cuba. 0.98

01:27:27.000 Those are the most fascinating to me because there are a bunch of people at high-level positions in the government that are conspiring to get us to go to war. 0.98

01:27:35.000 And this is what Eisenhower warned us about at the end of his presidency.

01:27:38.000 He warned about the military-industrial complex.

01:27:41.000 It was a fascinating speech. 0.97

01:27:42.000 And if you think about it now, it's like, God damn, was he right.

01:27:46.000 That to me is the most fascinating because it seems like there's just this machine that's always been running society. 0.96

01:27:53.000 But we've kind of pretended it wasn't.

01:27:56.000 Pretended that wasn't the case and pretended it wasn't this massive industry that requires war in order to feed itself.

01:28:04.000 That to me is the wildest one.

01:28:05.000 That and then UFOs.

01:28:08.000 The UFO one then, man.

01:28:10.000 I'm kind of sour on it lately.

01:28:11.000 Really?

01:28:12.000 Yeah, because they keep talking about it. 0.97

01:28:14.000 Yeah, the more they talk about it and not show me anything, and the more they have whistleblowers and all this, the more I'm like, why do I feel like I'm being fucked with? 0.71

01:28:25.000 Why do I feel like there's something going on? 0.85

01:28:28.000 Why do I feel like this is a juicy distraction?

01:28:30.000 Why do I feel like, because it always happens in these military areas, why do I have a feeling like you guys have developed some insane technology that people aren't aware of?

01:28:42.000 I mean, and it might even not be a physical thing, right?

01:28:47.000 It might be something they can project from satellites.

01:28:50.000 Maybe it's some sort of a hologram.

01:28:53.000 Maybe it's a... 0.99

01:28:55.000 I mean, who knows what the fuck it is? 0.99

01:28:57.000 Maybe it is from another planet. 0.97

01:28:59.000 Maybe there are interdimensional beings that occasionally visit us, and they always have.

01:29:03.000 But that sounds...

01:29:05.000 It sounds goofy.

01:29:07.000 But the problem is if something as crazy as alien life visited us, wouldn't it just seem fake?

01:29:13.000 That's the other thing I'd tussle with.

01:29:15.000 Even if they really were having actual disclosure, they really are having congressional hearings about...

01:29:21.000 Whether or not these things are ours or whether or not there's any crashed UFOs that the government has retrieved, is there really a program where they retrieve crashed UFOs and back engineer them?

01:29:31.000 Is that real?

01:29:32.000 So if it is real, how long has this been going on?

01:29:35.000 And you guys are just telling us now?

01:29:38.000 If that's real, that changes everything.

01:29:41.000 It changes everything about the way we interact with the universe.

01:29:44.000 That we're like little children and they're just keeping an eye on us like Chimp Empire. 1.00

01:29:49.000 Like, be careful over there.

01:29:50.000 Don't do anything nutty.

01:29:52.000 Be careful.

01:29:53.000 Let's just watch them.

01:29:54.000 We'll just watch them as they evolve and eventually travel into the cosmos like all the other aliens.

01:30:02.000 There is an argument to be said for not telling the truth.

01:30:06.000 Have you ever heard the story of War of the Worlds when it was broadcast on the radio?

01:30:10.000 And it created pandemonium because people thought it was a news broadcast.

01:30:16.000 And, you know, everybody, you know, loads of people lost their minds, etc.

01:30:19.000 Apparently, I just read recently that that was really overblown.

01:30:22.000 And that was a lot of propaganda.

01:30:24.000 And a lot of that was like the narrative they put out to show the success of that radio show.

01:30:30.000 And that most people were aware that it was a radio program, like a fiction.

01:30:35.000 Really?

01:30:36.000 Yeah, apparently there wasn't any suicides.

01:30:37.000 I thought there was a bunch of suicides.

01:30:39.000 People killed themselves.

01:30:40.000 Didn't we pull that up recently?

01:30:42.000 We did, right?

01:30:42.000 Yeah, I think Jamie found it, actually.

01:30:45.000 We've always been saying that.

01:30:47.000 That it created mass pandemonium and chaos.

01:30:50.000 But apparently that's not really accurate.

01:30:53.000 Or at least might not be accurate.

01:30:55.000 Have you heard of the one about Hitler and Stalin?

01:30:59.000 Well, the idea is, and I'm not into a lot of conspiracy theories, but this one, having read a lot of various historians talk about, I actually genuinely think could be real.

01:31:09.000 It's the idea that Stalin encouraged Hitler.

01:31:14.000 I mean, they signed a non-aggression treaty.

01:31:17.000 The Soviet Union funded Germany, sent them grain and all sorts of other things. 0.96

01:31:23.000 The idea is that Stalin wanted Hitler to start a big European war so that once it was all done, he could come in and sweep over the ashes, which makes a lot of sense because the communist idea was you can't make this shit work unless everybody gets it. 0.92

01:31:39.000 That was the idea of communism, right? 0.91

01:31:41.000 You can't have communism in one country.

01:31:43.000 You have to spread it around the world.

01:31:46.000 And they said this openly, the communists, that the best way to do that is to have a world war, and then you can spread the ideas as a result of that. 0.99

01:31:55.000 Damn, people have always been crazy. 0.99

01:31:57.000 He's right. 1.00

01:31:58.000 They've always been insane. 0.60

01:31:59.000 Yeah. 0.74

01:31:59.000 Imagine someone, like, that's your idea. 0.74

01:32:01.000 Like, what are you going to do today?

01:32:02.000 Eh, I'm going to go play golf with Ron White.

01:32:04.000 What are you going to do?

01:32:05.000 I think I'm going to start a war so I can take over Europe. 0.96

01:32:08.000 Right.

01:32:09.000 Yeah.

01:32:09.000 But the terrifying thing is there's always been those dudes.

01:32:14.000 Always.

01:32:14.000 And there always will be.

01:32:16.000 There always will be.

01:32:16.000 But we don't want to think they're here now.

01:32:18.000 But the thing is, for them, you could argue it's rational, right?

01:32:21.000 How do you best secure the future of your people?

01:32:24.000 You can rationalize it in your head.

01:32:25.000 How do you best secure the future of your people?

01:32:28.000 Well, the best way, North America, right?

01:32:30.000 It's controlled by the United States, and it's safe because of it, right? 0.68

01:32:34.000 You have Canada to your north.

01:32:35.000 You have Mexico. 0.70

01:32:36.000 These countries are all kind of in your orbit.

01:32:37.000 You've got them under control.

01:32:39.000 You're safe.

01:32:40.000 What's the safest way for Russia or the Soviet Union to do that?

01:32:43.000 It's to control the entirety of their continent. 0.53

01:32:45.000 So you can rationalize anything if you're in that position.

01:32:48.000 I'm looking after my people.

01:32:50.000 It's not that hard. 0.97

01:32:51.000 We are able to rationalize the most horrific shit in our heads if we really want to. 0.99

01:32:56.000 And we always have. 0.99

01:32:57.000 And we always have.

01:32:58.000 And we always will.

01:32:59.000 And we always will.

01:33:01.000 And we've always wanted to build empires.

01:33:03.000 We've been building empires from year dot.

01:33:06.000 Everybody builds empires.

01:33:07.000 But do you think that is also what we're talking about earlier, a part of our operating system?

01:33:12.000 Like there's always going to be these conquerors and then the resistance of the conquerors and through this back and forth, the society evolves.

01:33:21.000 Yeah, and I think, I sometimes think, like, speaking of aliens, what would it be like if you look down on planet Earth, right?

01:33:27.000 What do you see if you actually look?

01:33:29.000 You see these bands of chimps. 1.00

01:33:32.000 With every fucking weapon that they could possibly invent, point it at each other. 1.00

01:33:37.000 That's what we are. 1.00

01:33:38.000 Yeah.

01:33:39.000 That's what we are.

01:33:40.000 Yeah.

01:33:41.000 Well, you know what also you'd see though?

01:33:43.000 You'd see, if you were really objective, like what does this species do?

01:33:48.000 They make better things.

01:33:49.000 Yeah.

01:33:49.000 That's what they do.

01:33:50.000 They're like, even in Star Wars, they never made anything better. 0.97

01:33:53.000 Go back to like fucking Luke Skywalker, like the first movie, Star Wars, and then to the last movie. 0.98

01:33:58.000 They basically have the same weapons, same fucking light speed capabilities, same problems with their spaceships. 0.98

01:34:03.000 They didn't get any better. 0.99

01:34:04.000 We get better constantly.

01:34:06.000 We're constantly obsessed with innovation.

01:34:10.000 And if you just looked at the species as a whole, what is it doing?

01:34:13.000 It's making better stuff.

01:34:15.000 And even the things that are weird about it, like this desire for material possessions.

01:34:21.000 Well, one of the things that does is it facilitates consumerism.

01:34:24.000 It facilitates people buying things.

01:34:26.000 That facilitates innovation.

01:34:28.000 You've got to sell more things to people.

01:34:29.000 I've got to get you to buy a new TV. You already have a TV? I've got a better TV. And this is constant.

01:34:35.000 Whether it's computers or cars or whatever it is that we make, everything's better.

01:34:39.000 I think when you combine that with this new emergence of AI and when you see what's possible with quantum computing and what they're projecting for the implementation of that kind of technology, we're looking at another life form.

01:34:55.000 We're building another life form.

01:34:57.000 We're going to build an artificial life form that's way superior to us.

01:35:01.000 We're the electronic caterpillar that is building the cocoon.

01:35:06.000 And we're never going to be able to stop it because there was this document.

01:35:10.000 You can't stop it.

01:35:10.000 You can't stop it because there was this document that was signed.

01:35:12.000 I think it was signed by Elon as well.

01:35:15.000 Requesting that there's a moratorium on AI. Get the fuck out of here. 0.99

01:35:18.000 You think China's going to sign that? 0.99

01:35:19.000 Yeah.

01:35:19.000 Yeah, go ahead.

01:35:20.000 Do that.

01:35:21.000 Go ahead.

01:35:21.000 Do that.

01:35:22.000 We're like, it's a mad race. 0.99

01:35:23.000 Just like the fucking, you know, the trying to figure out who makes the nuclear bomb first. 1.00

01:35:28.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:35:28.000 It's a mad race. 1.00

01:35:29.000 Right.

01:35:29.000 Yeah.

01:35:30.000 Because we know that if we don't do it, other people will, and then they will have the upper hand.

01:35:35.000 And once another group has the upper hand over you, if you just look at history, it doesn't end well for the weaker group.

01:35:42.000 Yeah, especially with this one.

01:35:44.000 If you could make a superior life form that can figure out how to...

01:35:48.000 Just think about what Cheap ET can do in terms of the average person with no coding could just instantly make a website.

01:35:55.000 Yeah.

01:35:55.000 You can get answers to problems.

01:35:58.000 You instantly can get information and explain to you how to do very detailed and specific things like that.

01:36:06.000 That's just the beginning.

01:36:08.000 It's going to be so much better than you, and it's going to make a better version of it really quickly.

01:36:12.000 If you give it the ability to create, I mean, why isn't that engineerable?

01:36:17.000 It seems like it could.

01:36:19.000 If you could engineer creativity into some super intelligent, artificial thing that you've created, it seems like that's what we do.

01:36:26.000 We just think we do all these other things because that moves us closer and closer towards this. 0.97

01:36:31.000 But ultimately, when that does happen, all that other stuff will be bullshit. 0.99

01:36:35.000 The pyramids, the fucking airplane, the invention of the iPhone. 1.00

01:36:40.000 Nonsense. 1.00

01:36:40.000 It's all nonsense compared to this life form that we're about to make. 1.00

01:36:43.000 So let us get caught up in fucking whether or not a trans person should be able to play in women's sports or whether or not climate change is so real we need to bury trees. 0.99

01:36:57.000 Let's pay attention to what's really going on. 1.00

01:36:59.000 We're about to give birth to a fucking super intelligent life form. 1.00

01:37:01.000 It's going to take over Earth. 0.99

01:37:03.000 And we're either going to merge with it or going to be consumed by it.

01:37:07.000 Whoa.

01:37:07.000 You know what the Eater robot is?

01:37:09.000 Have you ever heard of that?

01:37:10.000 No.

01:37:10.000 The Eater robot is, I think this is a DARPA program as well.

01:37:13.000 They've developed a robot that is fueled by biological fuel, like biological waste, like bodies.

01:37:23.000 Like, you can use it on a battlefield, and it can consume bodies.

01:37:28.000 What?

01:37:29.000 Yeah, it consumes things for fuel. 0.97

01:37:32.000 Yeah, it can consume plants, I think, too.

01:37:35.000 But the implication is, when they said biological, I was like, oh, Jesus.

01:37:39.000 When you say biological, I don't think plants.

01:37:42.000 I think, like, human beings, like dead bodies on a battlefield. 0.85

01:37:46.000 Like, if you have a robot that kills people and eats them.

01:37:49.000 And that's how it fuels itself.

01:37:51.000 You don't need to charge it.

01:37:53.000 It just goes on whatever energy it extracts from consuming flesh.

01:37:58.000 I'm not an expert, Joe, but I can see how this could go wrong.

01:38:02.000 Pull up E-A-T-R. Pull up E-A-T-R, robot.

01:38:07.000 I think it's real, dude.

01:38:11.000 I think it's real.

01:38:12.000 Well, yeah, the Wikipedia said everything you were saying, and then it also included chicken fat was labeled as well.

01:38:17.000 Oh, yeah.

01:38:17.000 Just chicken fat, guys.

01:38:18.000 It's just chickens. 1.00

01:38:20.000 Not dead people from some fucking bomb we dropped. 0.98

01:38:23.000 The purpose of the energetically autonomous tactical robot eater, just the fact that he Patent pending, guys. 0.98

01:38:32.000 Hang on for that.

01:38:33.000 We'll make a big announcement when the patent comes through.

01:38:35.000 Project has developed and demonstrated an autonomous robot platform able to perform long-range, long-endurance missions without the need for manual or conventional refueling, which would otherwise preclude the ability of the robot to perform such missions.

01:38:50.000 The system obtains its energy by foraging, engaging in biologically inspired, organism-like energy-harvesting behavior, which is the equivalent of eating. 0.98

01:39:01.000 It fucking eats things. 0.95

01:39:02.000 It can find, ingest, and extract energy from biomass in the environment and other organically-based energy sources, as well as use conventional and alternative fuels, such as gasoline, It eats everything. 0.99

01:39:16.000 Gasoline, heavy fuel, kerosene, diesel, propane, coal, cooking oil, and solar when suitable.

01:39:24.000 In addition to missions requiring long-range, long-endurance ability, the Eater can provide direct support to combat units without requiring labor or material logistics support for refueling because it eats the bodies on the field, kids.

01:39:38.000 At least it's for its own energy while the unit rested or remained in position. 0.99

01:39:44.000 Say what you like about the Terminator, at least it didn't fucking eat you. 0.99

01:39:47.000 This is so crazy! 0.99

01:39:49.000 What a good idea, though.

01:39:50.000 I mean...

01:39:51.000 It's a good idea, because otherwise, like, those bodies are just going to sit there.

01:39:54.000 What do you want to do?

01:39:54.000 You want to feed the wolves?

01:39:56.000 Feed the vultures? 1.00

01:39:57.000 Or feed your robots and win this fucking war, kids? 1.00

01:40:00.000 Win this war for America? 0.99

01:40:02.000 It's the most uplifting episode of the Joe Rogan experience ever.

01:40:05.000 How wild is that?

01:40:07.000 But a good idea, right? 0.99

01:40:09.000 If you were a sociopath.

01:40:11.000 I mean, if you want to make a war machine. 0.97

01:40:12.000 Look, I shouldn't even say sociopath. 0.99

01:40:14.000 If you want to make something that saves soldiers' lives, how about a fucking robot? 1.00

01:40:19.000 A robot that fights and eats bodies. 0.99

01:40:21.000 But it comes to the point, right?

01:40:27.000 Why don't we engineer werewolves? 0.99

01:40:28.000 Why don't you let werewolves loose? 0.90

01:40:32.000 But you look at all of this stuff and you then go, well then what's the purpose of us?

01:40:38.000 Yeah.

01:40:39.000 You know, that's the fundamental question here.

01:40:41.000 Because the most important thing in life for any human being is to have a purpose.

01:40:46.000 Whatever that purpose is.

01:40:47.000 Why is that though?

01:40:48.000 Why is that?

01:40:49.000 Because it gives you a reason to get up in the morning.

01:40:51.000 It gives you a reason to do what you do.

01:40:54.000 It gives you a reason to move forward.

01:40:56.000 The worst thing for a human being to have is no purpose.

01:40:58.000 To have a lack of purpose.

01:41:00.000 Because then you feel empty and hopeless.

01:41:02.000 We talk about a crisis of meaning in the West particularly.

01:41:05.000 I mean, that's what it is, right?

01:41:06.000 A lot of people not having purpose.

01:41:08.000 And then it plays into what we were talking about earlier, which is you go on social media and you can attack somebody and that gives you power, that gives you meaning.

01:41:15.000 Yeah, that is a thing that people connect themselves to.

01:41:17.000 They get meaning out of destroying other people.

01:41:20.000 Yeah.

01:41:20.000 It's really fascinating.

01:41:21.000 Yeah, because that's your ideology and your team wins.

01:41:24.000 Especially if you feel justified in doing so.

01:41:25.000 The person disagrees with you, supports some other candidates, supports some ideas you don't like, is pro-life, is this, is that.

01:41:33.000 And you're morally superior because they disagree with you.

01:41:36.000 Yeah, you're morally superior because...

01:41:37.000 I forget who was talking to David Pakman.

01:41:40.000 Someone was talking to David Pakman and they brought up this idea of if you were alive and there was an election with Hitler, And you knew that you could stop Hitler from being elected. 0.98

01:41:53.000 You would do whatever the fuck you could. 0.99

01:41:55.000 Morally. 0.99

01:41:56.000 And that is often the way they portray Trump, which justifies people doing everything and anything they can.

01:42:04.000 Throw every lawsuit at his direction.

01:42:05.000 Don't even look at the optics of it.

01:42:07.000 And don't look at the possibility that you're setting a precedent and then some right-wing person, including Trump if he gets into office, can now do this to you.

01:42:14.000 The weapons you unleash will be used against you.

01:42:16.000 They always will be.

01:42:18.000 They always have been.

01:42:19.000 That's why, generally, it's good for society to have certain rules about, like, we don't go there.

01:42:24.000 We do not deperson our opponents.

01:42:26.000 We do not rig elections.

01:42:28.000 Democracy relies on the consent of the losers. 1.00

01:42:31.000 The moment you lose that, you're fucked. 1.00

01:42:33.000 You're fucked. 1.00

01:42:34.000 Yeah, and that's what's spooky, is that this... 1.00

01:42:38.000 Sort of thought that everyone has now, or that a lot of people have now.

01:42:42.000 It's one side has to win, or it's all gonna fall apart.

01:42:45.000 But I feel like if either side wins, it's gonna be chaos right now.

01:42:48.000 We're at a boiling point.

01:42:50.000 We're at a crazy boiling point.

01:42:53.000 I think that this year is the calm before the storm.

01:42:56.000 Oh, Jesus, son.

01:42:58.000 It's gonna get worse?

01:42:59.000 Yeah.

01:43:00.000 Why can't it get better?

01:43:00.000 What if they just legalize mushrooms?

01:43:02.000 2024, you think that's gonna...

01:43:03.000 I mean, legalize mushrooms, maybe, but...

01:43:05.000 What if they just put on...

01:43:05.000 Everybody goes, hey, I just did these mushrooms, and I've got some thoughts.

01:43:11.000 You know, maybe we're spinning our fucking wheels here, kids. 0.89

01:43:14.000 Yeah, well, we banned magic mushrooms in 2005, even though they grow naturally. 0.98

01:43:18.000 What a good move to do it so late.

01:43:21.000 When everybody had already figured out they were awesome.

01:43:23.000 Yeah.

01:43:23.000 You know, it's not like, you're not doing it in 1950 after you watch Reefer Madness.

01:43:27.000 Like, what?

01:43:27.000 The mushrooms, too!

01:43:28.000 Are those legal?

01:43:29.000 Get rid of them! 1.00

01:43:30.000 No, in this country, they did it in 1970. Really?

01:43:33.000 Yeah, it was to break up the anti-war movement.

01:43:36.000 It was essentially to break up the civil rights movement and the anti-war movement.

01:43:39.000 What they did is they made a sweeping group of drugs illegal, Schedule I. And that's also part of, like, what MKUltra was doing by allegedly...

01:43:54.000 Encouraging and training Manson.

01:43:56.000 You know, that's a Tom O'Neill book, Chaos, which is a fascinating story.

01:44:00.000 What they were doing was trying to stop the anti-war movement.

01:44:04.000 And one of the best ways is to lock all these people up for drugs.

01:44:08.000 Lock all these people up, make everything illegal, and just start locking them up.

01:44:12.000 Lock them up for weed, lock them up for mushrooms, whatever they have.

01:44:16.000 So they made all these sweeping illegalizations, including things that weren't even psychoactive.

01:44:23.000 They made them illegal.

01:44:24.000 But isn't it bizarre that the UK government made magic...

01:44:28.000 And by the way, that was a left-wing government.

01:44:31.000 That was a Labour government.

01:44:32.000 It was a left government.

01:44:33.000 They made magic mushrooms illegal in 2005. And magic mushrooms grow in every field in the UK. How does that work?

01:44:43.000 Yeah.

01:44:44.000 Well, so the poppies grow naturally too, right?

01:44:47.000 And that's heroin.

01:44:48.000 But you literally pick a mushroom, you dry it, or you can eat it fresh.

01:44:52.000 Yeah, you eat it fresh.

01:44:52.000 Yeah, and then it will create a psychoactive.

01:44:56.000 And it might be the source of many religious experiences.

01:45:00.000 It might be the source of many, many stories that people have had about encounters.

01:45:04.000 I mean, there's so much ancient religious artwork that centers around mushrooms, including all the old depictions of Christmas.

01:45:12.000 All the old depictions of Christmas involve the Amanita muscaria mushroom and elves.

01:45:17.000 All of them.

01:45:18.000 And that's a psychoactive mushroom.

01:45:20.000 That's the mushroom that John Marco Allegro wrote about when he wrote that book, The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross.

01:45:25.000 He was a guy who deciphered the Dead Sea Scrolls.

01:45:27.000 He worked on them for 14 years, and it was his conclusion afterwards.

01:45:31.000 He wrote a book about it called The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross.

01:45:34.000 His conclusion was that the entire Christian religion was probably a misunderstanding.

01:45:39.000 What it was really originally all about was fertility rituals and mushroom rituals.

01:45:44.000 It was about the consumption of psychedelic mushrooms that brought you to God and fertility rituals.

01:45:49.000 Because having children back then was like, it was imperative.

01:45:52.000 Everybody died. 1.00

01:45:54.000 You know, everybody fucking died. 1.00

01:45:55.000 Nobody lived. 1.00

01:45:56.000 Got an infection?

01:45:57.000 Dead.

01:45:57.000 Broke your leg?

01:45:58.000 Dead.

01:45:58.000 So it was hard times back then.

01:46:01.000 And so...

01:46:02.000 It's probably the root of so many religious experiences.

01:46:06.000 They believe it's the root of the Eleusinian mysteries.

01:46:10.000 That's Brian Murrow Rescue's book, The Immortality Key, where these people would travel to Eleusis and partake in this ritual where they drank wine, where now they know for sure those wine vessels, they've now tested them and found that they have ergot in them. 0.96

01:46:24.000 So these people are tripping balls. 0.83

01:46:25.000 They've opened up a field of study at Harvard about this now. 0.93

01:46:28.000 You know, the thing that I find really interesting is as our society becomes more godless and we become more secular, we've started to embrace things like ayahuasca as experiences.

01:46:39.000 Because there is still that deep-rooted need within us to have a psychedelic slash religious experience.

01:46:46.000 We need it.

01:46:47.000 We crave it.

01:46:48.000 Yeah, we crave it.

01:46:48.000 And that's also the root of wokeness.

01:46:50.000 I think it's very much religious.

01:46:53.000 And I think also right-wing authoritarianism too.

01:46:56.000 I think it's very much almost like a religious thing.

01:46:59.000 It's like they believe there's only one ideology, there's only one way, and that way is the right way and the good way.

01:47:05.000 And there's a lot of – like Marc Andreessen laid it out, that it's very much like a cult.

01:47:11.000 And that there's a separation.

01:47:13.000 They take you away from people who disagree, take you away from your family, isolate you.

01:47:19.000 People are cast out of the group if they violate any of these very rigid principles.

01:47:25.000 And there's a lot of fear involved in it.

01:47:29.000 It's very aggressive.

01:47:30.000 People that are involved in it are very aggressive in enforcing their ideas on other people and wanting other people to comply with their ideas, much like proselytizing.

01:47:39.000 And there's a very active disinterest in truth.

01:47:42.000 Very active.

01:47:43.000 And that is a very cult-like thing, man.

01:47:46.000 Because it's hard to form a cult around the truth because truth is complicated.

01:47:50.000 It's shades of grey.

01:47:53.000 You're not going to get the exact truth.

01:47:55.000 You're working at it.

01:47:57.000 We can sit and have a long conversation and we disagree and agree.

01:48:00.000 What about if I just gave you...

01:48:02.000 The way.

01:48:03.000 This is what you do.

01:48:04.000 This is what you say.

01:48:05.000 This is what you believe.

01:48:06.000 This is what you follow.

01:48:07.000 And if you don't, we cast you out.

01:48:09.000 So don't be that guy.

01:48:10.000 You don't want to be that guy.

01:48:11.000 You don't want to be that guy.

01:48:13.000 Absolutely don't.

01:48:14.000 Because we're hardwired to think that the moment we're that guy, we get extradited from the tribe, we're done.

01:48:20.000 We're dead.

01:48:21.000 In the savannah, that was it.

01:48:22.000 You're over.

01:48:23.000 You know, there's some research that says that that's why almost everybody has a fear of public speaking.

01:48:29.000 Because historically, in the ancestral environment, if you were in front of a group of your peers, and they were all silent, that was usually not a good place to be. 0.99

01:48:38.000 And if you had to explain yourself to them, you had to speak to them, you fucked up. 0.98

01:48:42.000 Yeah, William Cummings told me about that. 0.99

01:48:44.000 I was like, oh, that completely makes sense.

01:48:46.000 Yeah.

01:48:47.000 That completely makes sense. 1.00

01:48:48.000 It's why dying on your arse as a comedian is so painful. 0.99

01:48:54.000 Any public shame, anything that happens to you in front of people, losing something in front of people, where they get to cheer that you lost. 1.00

01:49:02.000 Oh, man.

01:49:03.000 Painful.

01:49:03.000 Painful for people.

01:49:05.000 But the thing is, the weird thing about when you do comedy and you do die, it actually isn't as bad as you thought at the same time.

01:49:12.000 Do you know what I mean?

01:49:13.000 That depends.

01:49:14.000 I've been a part of some horrible bombings.

01:49:18.000 Especially early in my career.

01:49:19.000 They still wake up in the middle of the night and go, Jesus.

01:49:24.000 You know what it is?

01:49:26.000 It's because everybody can talk.

01:49:28.000 So why should you be able to talk?

01:49:29.000 You're not doing something really special, like playing guitar that I can't do.

01:49:33.000 You're not juggling.

01:49:34.000 You're not doing something extraordinary that I know I can't do.

01:49:38.000 So if I go see someone play guitar, it's awesome.

01:49:41.000 I can't play guitar at all, so it's cool to watch.

01:49:45.000 I can talk.

01:49:46.000 You can talk.

01:49:46.000 Everyone can talk.

01:49:47.000 So everybody watches someone talk that sucks at it and go, this sucks. 0.99

01:49:50.000 I could do better than this guy. 1.00

01:49:52.000 Yeah.

01:49:52.000 So everybody has that moment in their life where they've been funny.

01:49:55.000 Everybody said that one zinger that one time.

01:49:58.000 Yeah.

01:49:58.000 And everybody talks about it.

01:49:59.000 Remember when you said that, Bob?

01:50:00.000 Yeah.

01:50:01.000 Every now and then you catch lightning in a bottle.

01:50:03.000 Yeah.

01:50:04.000 But to be able to do it on stage, you know, it's a tricky thing because it seems like you're just talking.

01:50:10.000 But there's a lot going on.

01:50:12.000 It's very complicated.

01:50:14.000 It's hypnosis in a way.

01:50:16.000 You're hypnotizing people.

01:50:18.000 You're dragging them into the way you think about things.

01:50:20.000 If you do it well, if they enjoy it, they're having a good time, it's one of the most rewarding experiences both as an audience member and as a comedian. 1.00

01:50:29.000 But the other side of that is if you fucking eat shit up there. 1.00

01:50:33.000 I always say bombing on stage is like sucking a thousand dicks in front of your mother. 1.00

01:50:37.000 But I think somewhere out there there's a guy who wants to suck a thousand dicks in front of his mom. 1.00

01:50:43.000 You know someone out there going, you watching mom? 1.00

01:50:45.000 You watching?

01:50:46.000 99!

01:50:50.000 He's probably been on your mom's house.

01:50:52.000 There's one crazy guy out there that is probably into that.

01:50:56.000 But no one's into bombing on stage. 0.96

01:50:58.000 It's horrible.

01:50:58.000 No, of course it is.

01:50:59.000 I'm excited about your club, man.

01:51:01.000 Francis was telling me all about it.

01:51:02.000 Fun place.

01:51:03.000 He was saying how you really worked out the design of it so that, you know, you're a comedian who's built a comedy club.

01:51:08.000 It's got to be amazing.

01:51:10.000 Yeah, we were real lucky, too, though.

01:51:11.000 We were real lucky that we got this spot, the Ritz Theater, that was like the perfect place.

01:51:16.000 It's almost like it's supposed to be there.

01:51:19.000 When we walked into the room, we're like, oh my god, this is it.

01:51:23.000 This is perfect.

01:51:25.000 It's the perfect size.

01:51:27.000 And there's two rooms.

01:51:28.000 Oh my god, this is perfect. 0.99

01:51:30.000 We had to make some changes and shit. 0.94

01:51:31.000 We raised the floor and lowered the ceiling and did a lot to the sound and all that stuff. 0.94

01:51:37.000 Changed all the seating and everything like that and built a new stage.

01:51:39.000 But the bones of it were perfect.

01:51:42.000 Like, the structure that was available to build it in was perfect for this idea of just having a place that's like, even the big room is still real intimate.

01:51:50.000 It's still, like, it's fun.

01:51:52.000 And it's all super positive people working there and super happy people.

01:51:56.000 Everybody's getting paid well.

01:51:57.000 Everybody's having a good time.

01:51:59.000 And it's just like a real good energy.

01:52:02.000 Like, it just feels good when you get there.

01:52:04.000 Because everybody's kind of trying to do the same thing.

01:52:07.000 And the people that are going there are trying to do this.

01:52:08.000 They're just trying to have fun.

01:52:09.000 Everyone's just trying to have fun.

01:52:11.000 So if you can create, especially with everything so fucking kooky right now, like people are so excited to just blow off steam.

01:52:18.000 Yeah.

01:52:19.000 It's a special place.

01:52:21.000 And it's not, I mean, the building and the environment, it's all great.

01:52:25.000 It's all perfect.

01:52:26.000 But that, to me, isn't what makes it special.

01:52:28.000 To me, what makes it special is...

01:52:31.000 Wherever I go as a comedian, when you gig at a comedy club, the comedian is always the afterthought.

01:52:38.000 It's the only comedy club that I've ever been to where it's the comedian who is at the foremost.

01:52:45.000 It's the place where the comedy is respected.

01:52:48.000 And that is unique, man, because unfortunately with practically every other comedy club, with the exception of a certain few, the comedian is always the last person to be thought about.

01:52:58.000 Yeah, because they build it as a business.

01:53:00.000 That's why.

01:53:01.000 They're trying to make money.

01:53:03.000 I built it as a place for comedy.

01:53:06.000 Genuinely, the design and the idea behind it was just make the best place for comedy.

01:53:10.000 I just took the same attitude that I do with all other things.

01:53:14.000 I just apply it to that.

01:53:15.000 What's the best way to do it?

01:53:16.000 What's the best way for the art form?

01:53:18.000 The best way for the art form is that a lot of open mics.

01:53:21.000 We have open mics Sunday and Monday.

01:53:23.000 The employees, the door people are all comics.

01:53:27.000 They audition for the job with their act.

01:53:30.000 They're all happy to be there, and there's a real path to being a professional.

01:53:34.000 They see it laid out in front of them with Kill Tony.

01:53:36.000 They see it laid out in front of them with the showcase nights and all the clubs that are also in Austin that are blowing up.

01:53:41.000 There's like the Sunset Room that's right down the street from us.

01:53:44.000 There's the Vulcan.

01:53:45.000 There's Creek in the Cave.

01:53:47.000 Those are all within like a really quick walking distance.

01:53:49.000 So door people can punch out and go do a set and come back.

01:53:53.000 They can say, hey, I got a 9 p.m.

01:53:55.000 set at The Creek.

01:53:55.000 Okay, cool.

01:53:56.000 Just punch out. 0.92

01:53:57.000 They punch out.

01:53:57.000 They go down the street for 15 minutes.

01:53:59.000 They come right back, and they go back to work again.

01:54:01.000 And they also can get spots on the showcase nights.

01:54:04.000 They can get spots on the open mic nights.

01:54:06.000 They get spots around town.

01:54:07.000 There's road gigs you can go to.

01:54:09.000 They go to road gigs together.

01:54:10.000 It's like they see this path where you see guys like David Lucas and Hans Kim and William Montgomery have gone from exactly where they are to being touring professionals who are headlining in clubs and making a great living and having fun doing the thing they love to do.

01:54:27.000 So there's a path.

01:54:28.000 Because before it was like you kind of had to figure out your own path.

01:54:31.000 You know, you got to kind of hope that someone would hire you to do the road, and you would hope that a comedian would take you on the road with them.

01:54:38.000 There's still some of that to some extent, but it's clearer now.

01:54:42.000 And you get to, like, you know, you get to see, like, Mike Vecchione was there this weekend.

01:54:46.000 You get to see Andrew Schultz was here a couple weekends ago.

01:54:49.000 Tim Dillon's coming up.

01:54:51.000 They just announced his show.

01:54:52.000 You know, like, Chappelle stops by when he's in town.

01:54:55.000 It's like you get to see, as a person who's, like, coming up in comedy, you get to see all these great comics.

01:55:00.000 Segura's there all the time.

01:55:02.000 Bryan Simpson just recorded a special there.

01:55:05.000 It's a beautiful environment.

01:55:06.000 That's so exciting, man.

01:55:07.000 And it's got to be one of the best things about being in your position is being able to create things that you enjoy but give opportunities to other people and create a space for other people to succeed.

01:55:18.000 That's awesome, man.

01:55:19.000 That's so awesome.

01:55:20.000 It's really cool to be able to do.

01:55:21.000 Yeah.

01:55:22.000 Because it's...

01:55:22.000 I know it's, you know...

01:55:26.000 If I'm not going to do it, who's going to do it?

01:55:29.000 That's my role.

01:55:30.000 That's the spot I was in.

01:55:32.000 Especially moving to Austin.

01:55:35.000 Cap City had been closed down, so there wasn't a big comedy club.

01:55:39.000 There was a scene, local comics.

01:55:42.000 It's a good area.

01:55:43.000 It's always been good for comedy.

01:55:45.000 There's always been good comics that have come out of Houston and Austin.

01:55:49.000 Bill Hicks.

01:55:50.000 Bill Hicks, I think he came out of here.

01:55:52.000 That's where he started, I think.

01:55:53.000 And Houston, too.

01:55:55.000 But, you know, it's a good place.

01:55:59.000 And I think you're making an impact on the broader culture as well because other people see what's possible.

01:56:04.000 You're creating a space that's free, that's uncensored, unrestricted.

01:56:08.000 That's super awesome, man.

01:56:09.000 It's also the cornerstone of the comedy community is the show Kill Tony.

01:56:13.000 Because Kill Tony is a spot where people who, maybe some of them have never done stand-up in their whole life, they go up and they do one minute. 0.99

01:56:20.000 And if they kill, it can make their fucking career. 0.99

01:56:23.000 One solid minute. 1.00

01:56:25.000 And some of them have been doing comedy eight, nine years.

01:56:28.000 And, you know, they get their hat, they pull their name out of the hat, they go up there, and if they kill, if they really...

01:56:34.000 So you have a minute.

01:56:35.000 When you have a minute... 1.00

01:56:37.000 You have to cut out all the bullshit. 0.99

01:56:39.000 It's gotta be concise, it's gotta be sharp, it's gotta get to the funny right away, and it can't be full of virtue and bullshit. 1.00

01:56:45.000 You can't be woke, you can't have a story about being a victim. 0.99

01:56:49.000 You have to fucking just be funny, you only have a minute. 0.97

01:56:51.000 And so that is a great cornerstone. 0.99

01:56:54.000 And the show is so wild and so crazy, it's such a no-rule show. 0.92

01:56:58.000 It's so chaotic, and it's fucking huge now. 0.77

01:57:01.000 They just sold out the HEB arena in town for a New Year's show, and they added a second show. 0.96

01:57:07.000 So they added a second night because there were so many tickets that were sold. 0.99

01:57:11.000 A fucking podcast is selling out two 15,000-seat arenas. 1.00

01:57:15.000 It's nuts! 0.99

01:57:17.000 You know, I went to watch Kill Tony last time I was here, and I have never seen the energy that was in that room Like, you could use it to power, like, cities.

01:57:31.000 I've never seen it.

01:57:32.000 That energy that is in that room from the audience and then, like, the symbiotic relationship with the comedians and the audience, it's so powerful.

01:57:45.000 I've never seen anything like that.

01:57:46.000 Yeah, when Tony and Red Band moved here, it was huge.

01:57:48.000 Yeah.

01:57:49.000 It was gigantic.

01:57:50.000 Because that was a big cornerstone of the comedy community in L.A. as well.

01:57:54.000 In Austin, it really came to life, though.

01:57:56.000 In Austin, it really got way more popular and way bigger.

01:58:00.000 It's just great.

01:58:02.000 The guests are great.

01:58:03.000 Post Malone was on with me a couple weeks ago.

01:58:05.000 Ric Flair was on the other day.

01:58:07.000 I saw the Ric Flair one.

01:58:08.000 That was a trip.

01:58:09.000 The Protect Our Parks guys are on there all the time.

01:58:11.000 It's always got great, great shows.

01:58:14.000 And Tony's the master.

01:58:15.000 He's so good at running that show.

01:58:17.000 He's the fastest with a one-liner that I've never seen anybody like in my life.

01:58:22.000 He's the best I've ever seen.

01:58:24.000 It's like people don't know.

01:58:26.000 Go watch those episodes. 1.00

01:58:27.000 He's a fucking animal. 1.00

01:58:30.000 It's so good. 1.00

01:58:30.000 And there's a wildness to it. 1.00

01:58:34.000 We live in a world which is ever more sanitized, where people have to watch what they say.

01:58:38.000 People are now watching what they think.

01:58:41.000 They think, I can't think.

01:58:43.000 Sometimes you have a conversation, you can even see people self-censoring their thoughts as you're having a conversation.

01:58:48.000 But that's not an accident, because when you control people's speech, you control what they can think.

01:58:53.000 You have to be able to speak.

01:58:54.000 To think.

01:58:55.000 That's how we think.

01:58:56.000 By saying things out loud.

01:58:58.000 This is why censorship is such a problem, man. 1.00

01:59:00.000 Because when you speak, you say some dumb shit. 1.00

01:59:04.000 We all do. 1.00

01:59:05.000 And then someone goes, well, hold on.

01:59:06.000 Have you thought about this?

01:59:07.000 Right?

01:59:07.000 And then you correct and you adjust.

01:59:09.000 But if you prevent people from saying anything out loud, they can't think properly.

01:59:13.000 And that's what we're seeing.

01:59:14.000 There's another thing that people should probably consider that's helped me greatly.

01:59:18.000 I don't think that my ideas are me.

01:59:21.000 I think they are ideas.

01:59:23.000 I am not married to them.

01:59:24.000 They are not a part of my body.

01:59:26.000 They are just a thing that I'm bouncing around my head and I could be wrong.

01:59:30.000 And if I can be wrong, it doesn't make me a lesser person.

01:59:34.000 And I think a lot of people equate being wrong with being lesser.

01:59:37.000 There's an intellectual competition when two people are disagreeing about ideas.

01:59:41.000 And the ability to say, oh, I see your point, is not a weakness.

01:59:45.000 It's a strength.

01:59:46.000 Massive strength.

01:59:46.000 It's a massive strength to be able to recognize someone's argument and go, Okay, I see where you're going.

01:59:52.000 Okay, that makes sense.

01:59:54.000 And when people can't do that, it's very frustrating for people.

01:59:57.000 And look, you can get a large audience of people if you can't do that.

02:00:01.000 You still can.

02:00:02.000 There's a lot of people that are just happy to jump into that echo kiddie pool and piss all over each other.

02:00:07.000 They love it.

02:00:08.000 But it's not good for anybody.

02:00:10.000 It's not good for all of us collectively.

02:00:12.000 You shouldn't do it.

02:00:13.000 And you're only doing it because it's a trick.

02:00:15.000 It's an ego trick.

02:00:16.000 I think fear plays a large factor as well, Joe.

02:00:19.000 Fear?

02:00:20.000 Yeah, fear.

02:00:20.000 I just think people are scared, man.

02:00:22.000 Most people...

02:00:23.000 There's a very famous quote, you know, most men live their lives in a state of quiet desperation.

02:00:30.000 Thoreau.

02:00:30.000 Yeah.

02:00:31.000 People...

02:00:32.000 They're terrified and they're just so terrified that they're gonna say or do the wrong thing, their partner's gonna leave them, their kids are gonna hate them, all of these things in their entire world and everything that they've strived for so long to build, this tiny little kingdom, if they step out of line,

02:00:47.000 everything is gonna crumble.

02:00:48.000 And most people are living check to check.

02:00:51.000 So that fear is even more, like, we're not talking about the person who has a billion dollars, like why are you still working?

02:00:56.000 Like, look, that's Elon Musk.

02:00:58.000 Why is he so wild?

02:00:59.000 He's wild because he's got $228 billion. 1.00

02:01:03.000 Like, if he's not gonna be wild, who the fuck is? 0.99

02:01:07.000 Right. 0.99

02:01:07.000 But the fact that he's willing to do that, and he's so, I think it's so, I mean, he's my friend, yeah, I'm kissing his ass, but I think he's a fucking massively important cultural figure right now, and he's often maligned and labeled as being alt-right. 0.99

02:01:22.000 Is he right all the time? 0.97

02:01:23.000 No, he's wrong sometimes.

02:01:25.000 He's like, yeah.

02:01:27.000 Remember he tweeted that thing about the guy who broke into Paul Pelosi's house?

02:01:31.000 There was some controversy about whether or not that story made any sense.

02:01:36.000 Maybe this guy was already there.

02:01:38.000 People were implying that maybe Paul Pelosi had an affair with this guy or something.

02:01:42.000 There was a lot of crazy theories that were bouncing around.

02:01:44.000 No, we saw the video. 1.00

02:01:46.000 There was a fucking crazy person with a hammer that broke into the guy's house. 0.98

02:01:49.000 But The ability to just find out, to talk about stuff, even if you're wrong, like, that's real important. 0.99

02:01:57.000 But the ability to know when you're wrong, too, and to be able to admit it, that's important, too.

02:02:01.000 Like, all of it's important.

02:02:03.000 We've got to be able to work this out. 0.95

02:02:05.000 And you're going to get people to say the wrong things when you're allowing people to just freely speak and think in real time without doing any fucking research sometimes.

02:02:13.000 There's a lot of people who espouse ideas on Twitter or X or whatever. 0.55

02:02:17.000 They haven't looked into this very much.

02:02:20.000 This is their belief and they're going to spit it out there.

02:02:23.000 Then they're going to start defending it. 1.00

02:02:24.000 They're going to yell at you and call you a fucking simp. 1.00

02:02:28.000 That's okay too. 1.00

02:02:30.000 That has to take place.

02:02:31.000 This is the most liberating and fulfilling thing for us, I think, doing what we do.

02:02:36.000 We have the freedom to speak.

02:02:39.000 In public and discuss things and be wrong and be corrected and move on from that and grow as people.

02:02:46.000 That's the beauty of what we do, man.

02:02:49.000 It's amazing that it exists.

02:02:51.000 That's why I feel so strongly about it needing protection, it needing to be preserved, because without that, we're heading in the wrong direction.

02:02:59.000 It's an integral part of our society, whether you're on the right or the left.

02:03:02.000 It's important.

02:03:03.000 It's important for everybody.

02:03:04.000 And it's important for everybody to be fair.

02:03:07.000 It's really important.

02:03:09.000 It's important to be fair and to just try to think of ourselves as a community.

02:03:14.000 We really are supposed to be that.

02:03:16.000 Even the people that snuck in.

02:03:19.000 Whatever, man.

02:03:20.000 I mean, my grandparents basically snuck in.

02:03:23.000 I mean, they came over when it was easy.

02:03:24.000 They just hopped in a boat, you get over here, you sign a piece of paper, and you're in.

02:03:27.000 They didn't have to do much of anything.

02:03:29.000 It's like, not that much different.

02:03:31.000 Other than they were pretty gangster because they didn't have YouTube to watch.

02:03:34.000 They just took a chance.

02:03:35.000 That America was a good spot to be. 0.98

02:03:37.000 But we've got to think of it as a community.

02:03:41.000 If we don't think of it as a community, there's no point in calling this a country.

02:03:45.000 Now it's just nuts.

02:03:47.000 Now it's just like it's only a community if you win.

02:03:49.000 It's only a community for your people.

02:03:51.000 It's only good for the people that agree with your side of things. 1.00

02:03:55.000 That's fucking nuts. 1.00

02:03:56.000 And we need wild people. 1.00

02:03:58.000 This is to go back to watching Kill Tony.

02:04:00.000 Kill Tony is wild.

02:04:02.000 And to me, as somebody who has been, obviously grew up, spent time in the UK, and now everything has become more and more sanitized, it was kind of like a cold slap around the face.

02:04:13.000 I was like, whoa!

02:04:14.000 What's happening here?

02:04:15.000 I remember the first time you guys came to the Vulcan.

02:04:17.000 Yeah.

02:04:17.000 Before we go to open up the club and you're like, mate.

02:04:21.000 That's a good impression of me.

02:04:22.000 You guys can get away with me.

02:04:25.000 There's a hunger for it here too.

02:04:26.000 There's a hunger for it everywhere, man.

02:04:28.000 The truth is everybody wants that freedom.

02:04:30.000 Everybody.

02:04:31.000 Yeah, but there's a recognition here that something cool is going on.

02:04:35.000 Yeah.

02:04:35.000 Because Austin has become a major comedy scene.

02:04:38.000 It's a big comedy scene now.

02:04:39.000 It's a big deal.

02:04:41.000 And we have the other copy, Cab City opened up too, which is in the domain, which is real close to here too.

02:04:46.000 And it's all world-class talent every weekend.

02:04:48.000 That's great for us, too.

02:04:49.000 It's great for everybody.

02:04:50.000 They have two rooms over there, too.

02:04:52.000 I haven't been, but I've heard it's a great club.

02:04:54.000 So it's great for everybody.

02:04:55.000 And so the Austin community recognized it.

02:04:58.000 And we got all this crazy comedy tourism.

02:05:02.000 People are flying here from all over the world to come to these shows.

02:05:05.000 Tony asks all the time, like, how many people have come from somewhere else?

02:05:09.000 Who came from the furthest?

02:05:10.000 People are like, I've come from Australia just for this show.

02:05:12.000 I've come from England.

02:05:13.000 I've come from France.

02:05:14.000 I've come from Denmark.

02:05:15.000 A whole audience is filled with people that come from all over the place.

02:05:18.000 It's beautiful, man.

02:05:19.000 When we started doing live shows, we haven't done a few for a while for trigonometry, but that's what we found.

02:05:24.000 People flying over from America to London to see us on stage with Andrew Doyle or someone like that, just talking.

02:05:30.000 There's a hunger.

02:05:31.000 People have a real hunger for fun and for people who have...

02:05:34.000 Who have good ideas.

02:05:36.000 People that they want to hear talk about stuff.

02:05:38.000 It enriches their perspective of the world.

02:05:40.000 And I think that's a very valuable thing, whether you're on the right or the left.

02:05:45.000 I think we need to think about it just as an overall species.

02:05:50.000 The human species values interaction.

02:05:53.000 Values honest interaction.

02:05:55.000 It's important for us.

02:05:56.000 We need to be able to do it all the time.

02:05:59.000 It's the only way we're gonna sort things out.

02:06:01.000 But we should do it with some principles.

02:06:02.000 And one of those principles, I think, that I've adopted, I've tried very hard to adopt, is I'm not my ideas.

02:06:09.000 They're not me.

02:06:10.000 They're a thing that I explore, and I try to explore them with as much humility as I can. 0.65

02:06:15.000 And some of them I fuckin' lock onto. 0.94

02:06:17.000 I'm like, this seems pretty goddamn clear. 0.95

02:06:20.000 And if you disagree with me, I'd love to hear your point. 0.98

02:06:22.000 I'd love to hear your position of why you disagree, but don't bullshit me. 0.91

02:06:26.000 Like, come to me from a real place.

02:06:28.000 Have you really assessed this?

02:06:30.000 Have you really looked at this accurately?

02:06:31.000 Have you looked at this historically?

02:06:33.000 Like, historically, what have people very similar to this done?

02:06:36.000 What are we talking about here?

02:06:38.000 And we need wild people.

02:06:40.000 You know, we're sanitizing culture to the point where the maverick, the person who is a little bit kooky, the person who is, we would describe as a little bit out there, those are the people who change culture as well.

02:06:52.000 The people who see things in a completely different way.

02:06:55.000 We used to love that.

02:06:56.000 We used to love rock stars.

02:06:57.000 Those were rock stars.

02:06:59.000 Those were the comedians.

02:07:00.000 Those were the people who were like, I mean, he said it.

02:07:03.000 I can't believe he said it, but you know.

02:07:05.000 But we love that because we get to live our life vicariously through those people.

02:07:10.000 It's so cathartic.

02:07:11.000 I remember the first time I went, like my friend, a couple of comedians, one of my mates went to me, right, you've got to go and see this guy called Bill Burr.

02:07:19.000 And this was like in 2014, and he was playing the Leicester Square Theatre.

02:07:23.000 I think you played it as well, Joe, back in the day.

02:07:25.000 It's a little 400-seat theatre, and I remember watching this guy, and I'm like, number one, this is the funniest thing I think I've ever seen.

02:07:32.000 And number two, I can't believe he's saying this stuff.

02:07:35.000 Why is no one coming to shut this down?

02:07:38.000 That's the British response.

02:07:41.000 Why is no one shutting this down?

02:07:43.000 Where's the council?

02:07:45.000 Why is this not regulated?

02:07:47.000 But it's important.

02:07:49.000 It's why we love sports.

02:07:50.000 It's why we love boxing.

02:07:51.000 It's why we love UFC. It's why Jorge Mahvidal is a star.

02:07:56.000 Yeah, you need wild people.

02:07:57.000 You need it.

02:07:57.000 Look, I'm a big fan of wild people.

02:07:59.000 Oh, man.

02:08:00.000 Yeah.

02:08:00.000 It's like half my friends.

02:08:02.000 Yeah, and you know, there's something you said last time we were here that really changed the way I think about it all.

02:08:07.000 I remember I asked you about Teddy Atlas and how that conversation went and how you felt about somebody saying something about a friend of yours that was not complimentary.

02:08:15.000 And the thing you said was like, the first thing is you have to let the person say their thing.

02:08:20.000 They have to let them express themselves.

02:08:23.000 And that is just so simple but so profound in the current culture.

02:08:28.000 You've got to let people speak.

02:08:30.000 You've got to.

02:08:31.000 People always think you're supposed to push back immediately.

02:08:34.000 I always at the very beginning of any kind of wacky conversation where I think someone's off the rails or I don't agree with them or I'm willing to think in the way they think.

02:08:46.000 I'll open myself up.

02:08:47.000 Okay, tell me how you think about this.

02:08:49.000 You've got to let them lay it all out.

02:08:53.000 If you interrupt, if you jump in...

02:08:55.000 When I had Bobby Kennedy on, I said it was the first time in 18 years anybody let him talk like that.

02:09:01.000 Everybody always pushed back.

02:09:02.000 Everybody's felt like I have to stop you.

02:09:04.000 I have to say studies would disagree.

02:09:06.000 I have to say what you're saying is not true.

02:09:08.000 I have to say no vaccines have been the most important invention and you have to say let the guy talk.

02:09:13.000 Let him talk.

02:09:14.000 Yeah.

02:09:15.000 Then try to figure out how he got to that spot.

02:09:17.000 Yeah.

02:09:17.000 What is it about the way you see things that's different than the way I see things and what do you know that I don't know?

02:09:23.000 And if you can't do that, you're not going to have real conversations with people.

02:09:27.000 You're never going to know what they really think.

02:09:29.000 You're always going to just be battling with them.

02:09:30.000 And you see that.

02:09:31.000 There's a lot of these talk show hosts online.

02:09:33.000 Not even necessarily online, but on television particularly because they have such a short format.

02:09:38.000 You can kind of steamroll somebody.

02:09:40.000 And they just start the conversation and jump in and insult them and jump in and reject what they're saying and jump in and get louder and jump in.

02:09:50.000 And then before you know it, the segment's over.

02:09:52.000 And someone's got a zinger or two that they've already prepared.

02:09:54.000 And they say that the problem with people like you is da-da-da-da, da-da-da-da-da-da.

02:09:59.000 Boom.

02:09:59.000 We'll be back.

02:10:00.000 And then you show a commercial for Pfizer and everybody's happy.

02:10:04.000 It's just so limited.

02:10:05.000 It's a limited way of communicating.

02:10:07.000 We all know it's limited.

02:10:08.000 It's not good.

02:10:09.000 That's why I'm so excited about new media.

02:10:11.000 I think it's a real opportunity to start to change that.

02:10:13.000 With Trigonometry, we're increasingly thinking about it as trigger media in terms of bringing other people.

02:10:18.000 We're going to start a show with Winston Marshall and Andrew Doyle and me on the channel.

02:10:23.000 We're going to be doing more comedy and stuff like that.

02:10:25.000 That's great.

02:10:26.000 Keep expanding.

02:10:27.000 There's a hunger for it.

02:10:28.000 There's a hunger for intelligent conversations with people.

02:10:31.000 People you agree with and disagree with.

02:10:34.000 That's how you find out about stuff.

02:10:36.000 I mean, I remember those conversations.

02:10:38.000 One of the things that I used to really love watching is these debates, like when Christopher Hitchens was alive, when he would debate religious people.

02:10:48.000 Yeah.

02:10:49.000 And Sam Harris as well.

02:10:51.000 These were fascinating watching people get their ideas shattered by a more brilliant mind.

02:10:59.000 It's like, those are so important and no one's doing that anymore.

02:11:03.000 These kind of, they're just so, these ideas are so controversial and toxic now.

02:11:09.000 Some of the things that ail us are so controversial.

02:11:13.000 That people don't even want to discuss them.

02:11:14.000 They just want to walk away.

02:11:15.000 It's third rail.

02:11:16.000 I don't want to be a part of that.

02:11:17.000 And let me ask you something, Joe, about the new atheists because there's a lot of people – I wrote an article in my sub-site called The Atheism Delusion and there's a lot of people now talking about how that idea hasn't really worked out in the sense of once you take away religion, once you take away people's – we talked about it earlier.

02:11:32.000 People need religious experiences, right? 0.94

02:11:35.000 I wonder whether part of the problems that we are facing is the lack of it.

02:11:40.000 The criticisms that they were making were legitimate.

02:11:42.000 But where we've ended up doesn't seem to me to be a good place.

02:11:45.000 And then you get, we talked about this earlier, the woke ideology coming in.

02:11:50.000 It almost feels like a replacement for what we had before.

02:11:52.000 Do you know what I mean?

02:11:53.000 Yeah, it becomes very much like religion in a lot of ways.

02:11:56.000 Do you remember Atheism Plus?

02:11:58.000 No.

02:12:00.000 That was the thing they were trying for a little while, or some factions were trying, where it was Atheism Plus a series of ethical and moral guidelines.

02:12:10.000 So it was like atheism.

02:12:12.000 It wasn't just atheism.

02:12:14.000 It was atheism plus like a lot of like very woke ideologies.

02:12:19.000 But particularly at the time they weren't calling it woke.

02:12:20.000 It was like progressive ideology.

02:12:22.000 And then I'm like, oh, okay, religion.

02:12:24.000 So you guys have like rules.

02:12:26.000 You're going to have – it's not deities.

02:12:29.000 It's a moral high ground.

02:12:31.000 It's instead of a god, you have a set of ideals that can't be questioned.

02:12:36.000 You know, we interviewed Dawkins a couple of months ago, one of my favourite ever conversations, and what a brilliant man, what a brilliant mind.

02:12:45.000 And we were talking with him, and I said to him, but people need religion, Richard, because the reality is we're all going to die.

02:12:55.000 That is the reality.

02:12:56.000 That is the harsh and brutal reality of human existence.

02:12:59.000 We are born and we shall die.

02:13:01.000 But the idea of death to the vast majority of people, and understandably so, is so terrifying that it's impossible to intellectualize, it's impossible to accept.

02:13:14.000 So I think the vast majority of people need religion. 0.89

02:13:19.000 They just need it.

02:13:21.000 Well, people need something.

02:13:22.000 Something.

02:13:23.000 Something.

02:13:24.000 And that's why you're seeing the ayahuasca rituals become like a replacement in a lot of ways for religion.

02:13:30.000 But, you know, honestly, a better one.

02:13:32.000 I know a lot of people that have gotten like some profound changes from psychedelic experiences if done correctly with the right intent and the right setting.

02:13:41.000 You can't deny them, whether it's psilocybin or DMT or these experiences that people have had where they've legitimately changed as a human being.

02:13:50.000 I don't think that they should be ignored.

02:13:52.000 No.

02:13:56.000 That's not good for anybody either.

02:13:58.000 It's not good to deny people their right to practice religion.

02:14:02.000 It's not good to tell people that the way they're living is wrong.

02:14:06.000 Live your way.

02:14:07.000 Live your way.

02:14:08.000 And if someone wants to live with religion, as long as they're not imposing that on other people, and that's, of course, where the big problem is.

02:14:15.000 That's where there's laws that get put in place.

02:14:18.000 And then there's certain restrictions on certain parts of the population, whether it's Homosexuality or women or, oh, now we're dealing with problems.

02:14:27.000 We're dealing with control issues.

02:14:29.000 Yeah.

02:14:29.000 You know, and if you say that there's no need for religion, well, what are all the people that benefit from it?

02:14:36.000 Right.

02:14:36.000 Seems like a lot of people get real meaning from religion.

02:14:40.000 How could that be a bad thing?

02:14:41.000 Seems like it's only a bad thing if they're imposing on other people, if they're forcing other people to give in to their will.

02:14:49.000 And it's like that with wokeness.

02:14:51.000 I'm like, be woke if you want.

02:14:52.000 Just don't make other people do it.

02:14:54.000 People are allowed to think whatever they're allowed to think.

02:14:57.000 But let me ask you something, because I think all three of us are non-believers.

02:15:00.000 Is that fair?

02:15:01.000 I don't think I'm a non-believer.

02:15:03.000 No.

02:15:03.000 I had a psychedelic experience in January this year.

02:15:09.000 I did the full thing.

02:15:10.000 I had a shaman, and I did a mushroom...

02:15:15.000 Ceremony in my house.

02:15:17.000 And we did the mushroom trip, and then the guy administered this tobacco, which they use in the native people use in South America.

02:15:32.000 It's a tobacco you put up the nose.

02:15:33.000 I don't know what it is.

02:15:35.000 I remember when it happened, when he did it, the first hit, I didn't get anything from it.

02:15:40.000 I just felt uncomfortable.

02:15:41.000 He put the second hit up my nose. 0.83

02:15:44.000 Everything went black.

02:15:45.000 I just saw these orange kind of squiggles in front of me.

02:15:48.000 And then I just felt myself like sinking backwards.

02:15:52.000 And I had no control over my body and I was lying back and I remember at one point I kind of thought this is what dying is.

02:16:01.000 This is what it means to literally die.

02:16:04.000 And I panicked halfway through and I remember sitting up and trying to sit up and whatever it was just smacked me back down. 1.00

02:16:11.000 And one of the parts of me that I'm not proud of is a kind of sort of depressive element to my personality and going, oh, this is fucking bullshit. 0.99

02:16:21.000 I want to die or whatever. 0.99

02:16:22.000 You know what I mean?

02:16:23.000 And it kind of like, you always had that negative side to you. 1.00

02:16:26.000 Well, you're going to experience death, motherfucker. 1.00

02:16:28.000 You know, you're actually going to experience what it is to die. 1.00

02:16:32.000 And having gone through that and having experienced that, it...

02:16:38.000 It made me realize, I don't know why, there's no way of intellectualizing it, there's no way of seeing it, but just, I know there is a God, but it's so beyond our capabilities to understand what it is, that it's kind of pointless to talk about, you know what I mean?

02:16:53.000 I think one of the things that I've gotten out of psychedelic experiences is that there's An inescapable connection that we have with each other.

02:17:05.000 Yes.

02:17:05.000 And that the energy that we put out, good or bad, ripples and creates Positive or negative reactions all throughout everything you experience.

02:17:18.000 Whether you want to believe that or not. 0.98

02:17:20.000 Whether you want to believe you're immune to that, whether you're doing coke and fucking stealing money from the hedge fund. 0.98

02:17:26.000 You're putting out an inescapable negative reaction. 0.92

02:17:31.000 And that the more good you can do, and the less you can do that, the better you will be in life.

02:17:37.000 That it should be a practice that you should practice trying to put out the least amount of negative energy Yes least amount of conflict the least amount of bullshit the least amount of Where you could take the high road.

02:17:53.000 Take it.

02:17:54.000 Take it always.

02:17:55.000 There's a way to do it.

02:17:57.000 Find a way to communicate with people, even people you don't disagree with, with respect and dignity.

02:18:01.000 And it'll be better for everybody.

02:18:02.000 You both walk away feeling better.

02:18:04.000 Even if you don't agree with each other on something.

02:18:06.000 But so many people are so invested in conflict.

02:18:09.000 They're so invested in that.

02:18:11.000 And it made me realize, like, that's just like a negative trap.

02:18:15.000 Just a feedback loop that will play out for your whole life if you don't stop it.

02:18:20.000 If you don't correct it inside of your being and just Commit to no longer doing that.

02:18:28.000 If you don't do that, you're going to constantly be involved in conflict.

02:18:32.000 And we know people that are constantly involved in conflict.

02:18:35.000 We know people like that.

02:18:36.000 There's always something wrong.

02:18:38.000 There's always something chaotic with them and what they're doing and who's doing something to them and they're doing this to that person.

02:18:47.000 It's a waste.

02:18:48.000 It's a giant waste.

02:18:50.000 It's an energy management problem.

02:18:55.000 It's like a soul problem.

02:18:57.000 It's a direction problem.

02:18:58.000 It's like you're on the wrong path and you don't have to be.

02:19:02.000 Yeah.

02:19:03.000 I suppose non-believers is probably the wrong term.

02:19:06.000 I guess what I was going to ask you, Joe, is how do you think about death?

02:19:11.000 Well, it's inevitable.

02:19:12.000 It's interesting.

02:19:13.000 Right.

02:19:14.000 I always say this, that everyone wants to go to sleep, but no one wants to die.

02:19:17.000 Yeah.

02:19:18.000 It's weird.

02:19:19.000 It's weird.

02:19:19.000 You're looking to shut off as long as you know you can come back.

02:19:22.000 Yeah.

02:19:22.000 Because you need it.

02:19:23.000 We all do it. 1.00

02:19:27.000 Whatever it is, I'd just be talking out of my ass if I said I knew. 1.00

02:19:32.000 And that's part of the problem is that it's so unknown that so many people talk out of their ass. 0.99

02:19:36.000 And then they want to believe that the person who they agree with is correct. 0.98

02:19:40.000 And so, like, this is what happens to you in the kingdom of heaven. 0.99

02:19:43.000 Like, bitch, how do you know? 1.00

02:19:45.000 How do you know? 1.00

02:19:46.000 You don't know.

02:19:47.000 You're just guessing.

02:19:48.000 You might be right.

02:19:49.000 You might be right. 0.99

02:19:50.000 Imagine if you go to heaven, fucking St. Peter's there with a big book. 1.00

02:19:53.000 You're on the list. 1.00

02:19:55.000 Like, what?

02:19:56.000 There's really dudes with robes.

02:19:58.000 And like, oh, my God, angels are real. 1.00

02:19:59.000 Cherubs flying around, like little babies with fucking wings. 1.00

02:20:02.000 Like, whoa. 1.00

02:20:02.000 Okay, it's real. 1.00

02:20:04.000 Would that be any weirder than Earth?

02:20:06.000 Would it be any weirder than human beings?

02:20:09.000 Would it be weirder than Twitter?

02:20:13.000 Probably a lot less weird than Twitter, but what I mean is What I mean is how do you think about the inevitable the inevitability of your own death?

02:20:23.000 Something I'm thinking about and having children changes how you think about it for me at least Well, there's a certain amount of things in this world that are out of your control. 1.00

02:20:31.000 And if you concentrate on things that are out of your control, you're fucked. 0.99

02:20:35.000 And if you... 0.99

02:20:36.000 I mean, that is the epitome of existential angst, right?

02:20:41.000 Constantly worrying about your own demise.

02:20:43.000 It's going to happen.

02:20:44.000 And that's part of the wildness of the puzzle of life, is that you know it's going to happen.

02:20:49.000 And you have to be able to somehow accept that and also appreciate life right now.

02:20:54.000 Because if you were dead, or imagine if you're on your deathbed, and this is your last gasps of air.

02:21:03.000 If I had something that I could give you, and all of a sudden you'd be 39 again, and all of a sudden you'd be doing a podcast again, and all of a sudden you'd see your wife again, and see your children again, and see your friends again, and go to the places where all the people you love go, you would be so happy.

02:21:18.000 You'd be so happy to be there.

02:21:19.000 Like, oh my god, I got another shot at this.

02:21:23.000 And we don't often think that way.

02:21:25.000 We really should appreciate the moment. 0.98

02:21:27.000 As corny and fucking spiritual guru, wooden beads as that sounds, we really should appreciate the moment. 0.98

02:21:36.000 And it's a matter of managing your mind to the point where you can do that consistently. 0.99

02:21:41.000 And that's what's hard.

02:21:42.000 It's hard to do that.

02:21:44.000 You know, I think we're kind of living together in a group now, the trigger team, and people are brought on.

02:21:51.000 Oh, you've got a cult.

02:21:52.000 Yeah, that's it.

02:21:53.000 It's a good cult, though.

02:21:54.000 It's one of the good ones. 0.85

02:21:56.000 It's a cult about the sex, mate.

02:21:58.000 That's how they all say it in the beginning.

02:22:00.000 That's my point.

02:22:01.000 Yeah.

02:22:03.000 No, we're not actually living together anymore.

02:22:05.000 We used to.

02:22:06.000 We used to.

02:22:07.000 But Constantine's little boy is there.

02:22:09.000 And it's so wonderful, man.

02:22:11.000 It's just so...

02:22:11.000 Because you're living with a person, you know, he's 14, 16 months.

02:22:18.000 16. 16 months.

02:22:19.000 And you're living with someone who exists purely in the moment.

02:22:24.000 There's no agenda.

02:22:25.000 There's no like, oh, but if I say this and I do this, then maybe he might like me.

02:22:30.000 I remember there was one instance where I was on my phone and I was trying to sort something out.

02:22:35.000 I was frustrated.

02:22:35.000 And he toddled up to me.

02:22:37.000 And he had like a little plastic cup.

02:22:38.000 And he just went like that and gave it to me.

02:22:41.000 And at that moment, everything disappeared.

02:22:43.000 It didn't matter that I was upset about it.

02:22:46.000 They were frustrated.

02:22:46.000 Because to him, all that mattered was him giving me something and saying, here you go.

02:22:52.000 This is from me to you.

02:22:54.000 And it was just love, pure.

02:22:56.000 It was just the most beautiful thing, that one single moment.

02:23:00.000 He just wanted to interact with you.

02:23:01.000 Yeah.

02:23:02.000 He's a cutie.

02:23:03.000 He's a cutie.

02:23:04.000 I'm working on the second book, and it's going to be something to do with gratitude, because you nailed it, man.

02:23:11.000 This is one of the things that I think is missing in our society is we don't appreciate what we have.

02:23:17.000 Can we hold that thought?

02:23:18.000 I have to pee so bad.

02:23:19.000 Can we all pee?

02:23:21.000 Only me.

02:23:23.000 I want you to be uncomfortable.

02:23:24.000 We'll be right back.

02:23:26.000 Yeehaw, kids, and we're back.

02:23:28.000 We're back. 0.99

02:23:30.000 What the fuck are we talking about? 0.99

02:23:32.000 Gratitude. 0.99

02:23:33.000 Gratitude.

02:23:33.000 Yeah.

02:23:34.000 Yeah.

02:23:34.000 Yeah, it sounds...

02:23:36.000 Again, it's one of those hippie things.

02:23:38.000 They've taken over that word, you know?

02:23:40.000 It's like the word God.

02:23:41.000 Like, for a lot of people, the word God is like, oh, come on.

02:23:44.000 But what does it mean to you?

02:23:46.000 It ain't no hippy thing, man.

02:23:47.000 It's a real human thing.

02:23:49.000 Everybody needs it.

02:23:50.000 Gratitude is positive energy.

02:23:53.000 It's like appreciating things.

02:23:54.000 It's so hard for people to do.

02:23:57.000 And again, it's a mental management issue.

02:24:00.000 So many people haven't been given the tools To be able to do that or the moments in life where you have to sort of cultivate that.

02:24:12.000 It's easier for us, man, because we started our show in a room above a comedy club with nothing.

02:24:19.000 We had less than nothing.

02:24:20.000 We didn't have any cameras.

02:24:22.000 We didn't have any microphones.

02:24:23.000 We didn't have any money.

02:24:24.000 We didn't have any profile.

02:24:25.000 We didn't have any followers.

02:24:26.000 We literally had nothing.

02:24:29.000 And every day now, we just experience it as... 0.99

02:24:33.000 It sounds hippie and bullshit and whatever, but it's true. 1.00

02:24:37.000 Every day is a blessing, man. 0.98

02:24:38.000 It really, really is.

02:24:39.000 You know, this is, I think...

02:24:42.000 Again, this is partly the trip that I did.

02:24:47.000 It just made me realize, man, everything is connection.

02:24:50.000 What we all crave at its most basic is connection.

02:24:54.000 That's what we all crave.

02:24:56.000 We crave connection.

02:24:57.000 We crave to be around people, to share ideas, to be heard, to be listened to, to feel love, to give love.

02:25:04.000 And that's why you see social media is the ultimate con trick in a way, because it's going, oh, you're more connected than ever.

02:25:12.000 But you see it when you see a couple and they're going through a day or whatever else, and they're both on their phones and they've both got their head down.

02:25:20.000 And you go, you're not connecting.

02:25:23.000 You're not having a discussion, which is why our show works and why your show works.

02:25:28.000 Because it's connection and that's it's it's a beautiful thing and to connect with another human being and to share to listen to share experiences To and to play.

02:25:38.000 Yeah, it's it's but it's life and I think the other thing that's cool is like people get to listen to your show and have conversations They did they're kind of a part of this conversation you get to go back and forth with it and They don't have anybody in their life.

02:25:51.000 They could have that conversation with So they have access to these conversations that you have with these people.

02:25:57.000 And through that, they get an enhanced perspective of things.

02:26:02.000 So maybe they're in a place where there is no one like these people that you're talking to.

02:26:06.000 And they get to listen and go, oh, well, maybe the way I'm looking at things is narrow-minded.

02:26:10.000 Or maybe the way I'm looking at things is flavored by all the people around me.

02:26:14.000 And I've just sort of accepted that as my own ideas.

02:26:16.000 Maybe I don't agree with them.

02:26:17.000 Maybe I'm more in line with the way you guys think.

02:26:19.000 Or maybe I'm more in line with the way your guest thinks.

02:26:21.000 And it's as weird as it sounds, like you're enriching people's experiences as a human being through doing that.

02:26:28.000 Yeah, and we enrich ourselves.

02:26:29.000 For us, from day one, man, every conversation, it's a privilege to be, I mean, in your case, even more so.

02:26:36.000 You've got some of the most amazing people in the world coming in here and sitting down for three, four, five hours, whatever it is, and you get to pick their brain and have a connection and a conversation.

02:26:47.000 It's the most amazing thing.

02:26:49.000 It's pretty wild.

02:26:50.000 Yeah, and again, totally unexpected, just like you guys.

02:26:53.000 I started out with a laptop.

02:26:54.000 Yeah.

02:26:55.000 Just hanging out, doing stuff on a webcam with my friend Brian.

02:26:59.000 And then it went from there.

02:27:00.000 And you know the beautiful thing about this show is that you humanize people.

02:27:04.000 Yes.

02:27:05.000 You humanize people.

02:27:06.000 Because in the world of media and celebrity, what they do is they paint two-dimensional pictures of people.

02:27:15.000 You know, Joe Rogan is this.

02:27:17.000 Mike Tyson is this.

02:27:19.000 And then you listen to the person. 1.00

02:27:21.000 You go, oh, actually, what I've been painted is bullshit. 0.67

02:27:23.000 It's a two-dimensional representation, which actually doesn't reflect one iota of who they truly are as a human being. 0.97

02:27:32.000 Some people just accept it for what they hear.

02:27:35.000 But the good thing about the negative perspectives that people have is it forces other people to listen.

02:27:42.000 It doesn't force them.

02:27:43.000 It entices them to listen.

02:27:47.000 Entices.

02:27:47.000 Yeah, entices.

02:27:48.000 Because they're like, what is this crazy shit? 1.00

02:27:50.000 Like, what's going on in that? 1.00

02:27:51.000 And they listen and go, oh, it's a reasonable conversation.

02:27:54.000 It's just going against what's the narrative that you have to say and the way you have to talk.

02:28:01.000 And that if you don't think that way, you're some... 0.98

02:28:04.000 Some extremist, some far right or far this or far that or fucking proud boy or whatever you are. 0.98

02:28:11.000 It's so easy to label people like that. 0.98

02:28:14.000 It's so easy to just dismiss him entirely as soon as you label him like that.

02:28:17.000 And I think about this a lot because even our perceptions like who Joe Rogan is or who Constantine or Francis is, for most people it's a snippet of some information that they saw Different people saw different snippets.

02:28:31.000 So if you're arguing about who is Francis Foster, well, our perspectives are going to be so different because we've got different experiences.

02:28:38.000 So I remember, and it was so crazy, a friend of ours had a girlfriend who was very smart, very interested.

02:28:45.000 She's kind of into the stuff that we talk about and whatever.

02:28:47.000 And we were at a party somewhere and she was saying, oh, you were just on Joe Rogan.

02:28:51.000 Isn't he all right?

02:28:53.000 And I was like, okay, let's unpack that.

02:28:55.000 What do you mean?

02:28:56.000 You know how I can go when I disagree with somebody, but I just held back.

02:29:00.000 And I was just like, let's find out what you're talking.

02:29:02.000 And what it came down to is you're a masculine guy who's got muscles and tattoos.

02:29:07.000 That's what all right means.

02:29:12.000 That's hilarious.

02:29:13.000 I think Francis is right.

02:29:15.000 When you take the time to be with people, then you get to see a lot more of the human being.

02:29:20.000 Yeah, and hopefully we're doing that.

02:29:23.000 And more people should do it too.

02:29:24.000 Try to do it with your friends.

02:29:26.000 You know, I love watching all these podcasts that emerge where people are just starting it out and just trying it. 0.94

02:29:33.000 And some of them suck, but I sucked too in the beginning. 0.90

02:29:36.000 Oh, we all did. 1.00

02:29:36.000 Everybody sucks in the beginning. 1.00

02:29:38.000 Yeah, it's hard. 0.96

02:29:39.000 You could bring up photos of us, particularly photos of me when we just started out.

02:29:43.000 Oh, my sweet lord.

02:29:45.000 But I remember...

02:29:48.000 I've been listening to a show.

02:29:49.000 Don't skip over that, man. 0.92

02:29:50.000 The transformation in you since we've started has been fucking amazing and inspiring to watch, to be honest, in every way. 0.79

02:29:55.000 It's been beautiful. 0.88

02:29:56.000 Yeah, and it's, you know, working...

02:29:57.000 Like transformation in your mind, the way you think about things?

02:30:00.000 The transformation in my mind, the transformation in my body, but also it's...

02:30:05.000 It's all that fat shaming I did.

02:30:07.000 It's paying off, man.

02:30:08.000 Yeah, exactly.

02:30:09.000 It's hardcore fat shaming.

02:30:10.000 Fat shaming works.

02:30:11.000 Yeah, I mean, it really does.

02:30:12.000 It works.

02:30:13.000 You can look at a picture of me.

02:30:14.000 It works!

02:30:15.000 You probably shouldn't do it.

02:30:16.000 No, it works for men.

02:30:18.000 It works for men, maybe not for women. 0.89

02:30:20.000 It doesn't work on Bert Kreischer.

02:30:22.000 But I will say this, man.

02:30:26.000 I remember listening to one of your interviews with Mike Tyson, where he was talking about DMT and how it changed who he was.

02:30:36.000 And how there was a Mike Tyson before DMT, there was a Mike Tyson after DMT. And he said that he looks back and he doesn't like the guy he used to be.

02:30:46.000 He goes, that person scares me.

02:30:48.000 That person was wild.

02:30:49.000 That person was out of control.

02:30:50.000 I don't ever want to go back to being that person.

02:30:54.000 And I thought to myself, how beautiful, man, that you get to be part of somebody's redemption arc.

02:31:00.000 Of somebody going, you know what, I wasn't a very good person, I was very damaged, and for whatever reason I did things that I'm not proud of.

02:31:07.000 But now I'm trying to be better.

02:31:10.000 And if you think about it, man, imagine you look back and you don't think that.

02:31:15.000 Right.

02:31:16.000 How have you spent your life?

02:31:17.000 Right.

02:31:17.000 You're not better than you were 30 years ago?

02:31:19.000 Right.

02:31:20.000 No, I don't care how good you were 30 years ago.

02:31:23.000 You could still be better today.

02:31:24.000 Mike Tyson's arc is one of the most fascinating, right?

02:31:27.000 Because he was such a destroyer.

02:31:28.000 I mean, he got all of his love and all of his attention from smashing people.

02:31:34.000 Like, literally separating human beings from their consciousness in front of the whole world.

02:31:39.000 I mean, look, I'm a huge boxing fan and you can look at all of these, you know, the greats like the Frasers, the Ali's, you know, the Joe Lewis's, you know, all of these people.

02:31:50.000 But I would say that with Tyson, with early, early Tyson, he was the most exciting fighter.

02:31:57.000 Oh, yeah.

02:31:58.000 You just, the moment there was a fight with Tyson, everyone was watching.

02:32:02.000 They were like executions.

02:32:04.000 Was it the knockouts you think?

02:32:05.000 That was really the thing?

02:32:07.000 It was the threat of the knockouts, the knockouts, the menacing image that he presented.

02:32:13.000 Would he come in with a towel around his neck and nothing else?

02:32:15.000 The black shorts.

02:32:16.000 Black shorts. 0.97

02:32:18.000 Smashing people. 0.97

02:32:19.000 Just so dedicated to this one thing.

02:32:22.000 Being the greatest heavyweight of all time.

02:32:24.000 And it's also as well, man, like, you know, every boxer, every fighter has got a nickname, and some of them are more appropriate than others.

02:32:32.000 He called himself the baddest man on the planet, and at his peak, he was the baddest man.

02:32:37.000 He was.

02:32:37.000 There was no UFC back then.

02:32:39.000 Oh, man.

02:32:40.000 You know?

02:32:41.000 No one could take him down.

02:32:43.000 Yeah.

02:32:44.000 You know, you just, you don't, and like I said before, you know, you took, you had an interview with him, you humanized him, you made him, to me he became not Mike Tyson, this avatar, the baddest man on the planet, but what he did,

02:33:00.000 he became a human being.

02:33:02.000 And it also enriched me because then I was like, oh, I really want to do psychedelics because I want that, that insight that he has had about himself and that process, I want to go on that journey now.

02:33:14.000 Yeah, it's helped me tremendously.

02:33:17.000 Speaking of the UFC, Joe, I am so gutted that we're not going to see Jon Jones vs.

02:33:24.000 Francis in Ghana.

02:33:25.000 We might still see it.

02:33:26.000 You think we will?

02:33:27.000 Anything can happen.

02:33:28.000 You never know.

02:33:29.000 You never know.

02:33:30.000 But that's got to be the greatest fight that hasn't happened in the UFC history, right?

02:33:34.000 Yeah.

02:33:35.000 That's the big one.

02:33:36.000 That would have been the big one.

02:33:38.000 But, you know, Francis is going to have this boxing match with Tyson Fury.

02:33:41.000 Yeah.

02:33:42.000 How do you think that goes?

02:33:43.000 Yeah.

02:33:44.000 I mean, Tyson Fury's one of the greatest, if not the greatest, heavyweight of all time.

02:33:48.000 He's so good.

02:33:50.000 He's so slick.

02:33:51.000 His footwork, his movement, the way he sets traps and catches people.

02:33:56.000 He's so clever.

02:33:57.000 He's so skilled.

02:33:59.000 He's been unstoppable as a heavyweight boxer.

02:34:02.000 Francis is a big, powerful knockout artist.

02:34:04.000 That's undeniable, but...

02:34:06.000 You know, the advantage obviously goes to Tyson Fury.

02:34:09.000 It's his sport.

02:34:10.000 He's the best, one of the best, if not the best ever at his sport.

02:34:14.000 Yeah. 0.90

02:34:14.000 He's so fucking good and he's so clever. 0.90

02:34:17.000 He comes in all fat and everything and makes fun of it and takes his shirt off and still beats the shit out of everybody. 0.99

02:34:22.000 And he's skilled, isn't he? 0.99

02:34:24.000 Super skilled.

02:34:25.000 Oh, he's so skilled.

02:34:25.000 He's skilled like a smaller man and he's enormous.

02:34:29.000 He's so fleet on his feet, his footwork, his movements.

02:34:33.000 He's such a good boxer, man.

02:34:35.000 He's such a good boxer.

02:34:39.000 Francis has got to catch him with a big punch, and he's got to be able to figure out how to do that.

02:34:43.000 How do you catch a guy who's been boxing his whole life against all the greats in boxing?

02:34:50.000 Guys are the best boxers ever.

02:34:53.000 That's it.

02:34:54.000 Francis, I believe, when he was a young man, if he had just gotten into boxing and not into MMA, if someone had found him when he was Mike Tyson's age, when Mike Tyson was 13, and trained Francis, like if Custom Auto had found Francis, Francis is a terrifying specimen.

02:35:10.000 He's so big, and he's so powerful.

02:35:13.000 He's the greatest one-punch knockout artist I've ever seen in the heavyweight division. 1.00

02:35:16.000 The stuff that he does, the way he takes people out, the way he knocked out Aleister Overeem and Cain Velasquez and all, it's just like, if he hits you, you're fucked. 0.98

02:35:25.000 But that's with little gloves, right? 0.98

02:35:27.000 So you have to take into account the gloves are bigger.

02:35:29.000 You gotta take into account it's only boxing, so the footwork and the movement is gonna be different.

02:35:33.000 And he's fighting a master. 0.93

02:35:35.000 You know, if he can connect, who fucking knows?

02:35:38.000 It is the quintessential puncher's chance, but you would have to, if you look at the betting odds, they must be enormously enticing Fury's favorite. 0.80

02:35:47.000 What are the betting odds online for this fight?

02:35:49.000 Let's take a guess.

02:35:50.000 I would say 5-1, 6-1, 7-1, something like that, maybe more.

02:35:54.000 Let's take a guess.

02:35:55.000 What do you think they are?

02:35:56.000 I mean, the thing is with Tyson as well is that he comes from a gypsy background. 0.74

02:36:00.000 And as someone who has taught gypsy kids, they get taught how to box from the age of four to five. 0.99

02:36:07.000 It's part of their culture.

02:36:09.000 And their other part, I remember when he got...

02:36:11.000 I can't remember which fight.

02:36:13.000 I was working at a radio station at the time and we were doing overnight.

02:36:16.000 So I watched...

02:36:17.000 I think it was the first Wilder fight, may have been the second.

02:36:20.000 Do you remember when he got knocked down?

02:36:21.000 Everyone went, he's dead.

02:36:22.000 And then he got back up.

02:36:24.000 I can't believe he got back up.

02:36:25.000 Gypsy boys are trained.

02:36:27.000 You never, ever back down from a fight.

02:36:30.000 You keep going until they are done or you are done.

02:36:33.000 That is it.

02:36:34.000 He didn't just get up.

02:36:35.000 He got up and won the rest of the round.

02:36:38.000 He got up like The Undertaker and then won the rest of the round.

02:36:41.000 And then he figured out that's the way to fight Deontay Wilder, to put him on his heels.

02:36:45.000 And then he came in the second fight and beat him down.

02:36:47.000 And then the third fight.

02:36:48.000 Got clipped in the third fight by a punch that probably takes out 99.99% of all the people who've ever lived.

02:36:55.000 And somehow or another he survives it.

02:36:57.000 From a guy who's the biggest one-punch knockout artist in the history of boxing.

02:37:01.000 Deontay Wilder puts everyone to sleep.

02:37:04.000 Yeah.

02:37:04.000 He just shuts dude's lights off with one shot.

02:37:07.000 Blap! 0.71

02:37:07.000 He does it to everybody. 0.71

02:37:09.000 Everybody. 0.99

02:37:09.000 You see guys get hit and they're like, what the fuck happened? 0.99

02:37:13.000 He's such a brutal puncher and Fury survived that. 0.98

02:37:17.000 He survived that in the first fight, survived it in the second fight, survived it in the third fight.

02:37:21.000 Well, this is what I was going to ask you, because if it's a puncher's chance, the question is, how does Ngannou compare power-wise to a Deontay Wilder?

02:37:30.000 We really won't know.

02:37:31.000 We really won't know until we see him hit a boxer with the big gloves on.

02:37:35.000 We know Deontay.

02:37:37.000 Deontay hits anybody they go out, except Tyson Fury.

02:37:39.000 He's the only one who's been able to survive it.

02:37:41.000 Because in that fight, you could see with Wilder walk away, he thought Fury was done.

02:37:47.000 Everybody's done when he hits him like that.

02:37:49.000 Yeah.

02:37:49.000 The Luis Ortiz fight, you ever see that fight?

02:37:51.000 No.

02:37:51.000 He hits him with a right hand on the forehead.

02:37:53.000 Just blap! 1.00

02:37:54.000 And Ortiz is on the ground like he got shot. 0.99

02:37:57.000 Like, he has no idea what the fuck... 0.99

02:37:58.000 Watch it. 0.99

02:37:59.000 Here, find that.

02:38:00.000 Deontay Wilder knocks out Luis Ortiz.

02:38:03.000 And Luis Ortiz is from the Cuban Olympic program.

02:38:06.000 Luis Ortiz is a phenomenal boxer.

02:38:09.000 And I think Ortiz is probably ahead on the scorecards.

02:38:11.000 Because Ortiz is a great boxer.

02:38:14.000 Probably close, but he might have been ahead on the scorecards.

02:38:17.000 And Deontay just, blap! 0.88

02:38:19.000 One shot.

02:38:20.000 The way he knocks people out, too, it's just like...

02:38:22.000 Jesus, man.

02:38:24.000 They go flying.

02:38:25.000 It's like he's got magic in his hands.

02:38:27.000 He's not the biggest guy in the world. 0.99

02:38:28.000 He's very tall and long, but it's just the torque and the fucking speed and power behind his shots. 0.95

02:38:35.000 It's like nobody in the history of the division. 0.98

02:38:37.000 Even Tyson.

02:38:38.000 Tyson knocked guys out with a barrage of punches usually, except like Michael Spinks.

02:38:42.000 Even Larry Holmes.

02:38:44.000 He had dropped Larry before he knocked him out.

02:38:47.000 Deontay just catches guys with one shot.

02:38:52.000 So they're boxing here, and watch when the one-punch knockout comes.

02:38:56.000 So he's already got him hurt.

02:38:58.000 Yeah.

02:38:58.000 Boom.

02:38:59.000 Boom.

02:39:04.000 Is that after he was dropped, or was he dropped before that?

02:39:08.000 No.

02:39:09.000 I think he gets up.

02:39:11.000 Might.

02:39:14.000 I think the rational thing to do there is to stay down.

02:39:18.000 Just the power this dude has is just so crazy.

02:39:22.000 Oh man.

02:39:29.000 He just crumples.

02:39:31.000 You know the one that gives me nightmares?

02:39:33.000 Was that the second time they fought, Jamie?

02:39:34.000 I don't think that was the right KO. Yeah, I think they fought twice.

02:39:38.000 I mean, I typed in KO, and those were the two fights that popped in.

02:39:42.000 Dude, crazy.

02:39:45.000 The Brazil fight. 0.65

02:39:46.000 Crazy power.

02:39:47.000 I mean, his power is just...

02:39:49.000 That's round one of 12. BOOM! I mean, Deontay's like nobody else.

02:39:54.000 His fucking power is so ridiculous. 1.00

02:39:57.000 And he's so long. 1.00

02:40:00.000 Yeah, that one was wild.

02:40:03.000 Stiverne was the first guy to ever go the distance with him, I think, in the first fight.

02:40:06.000 In the second fight, he just put his life up.

02:40:09.000 I mean, that power is just extraordinary, man.

02:40:13.000 Look at that.

02:40:14.000 He's like, you know, so, can Francis punch like that?

02:40:18.000 I don't, you know, we're gonna find out.

02:40:21.000 I don't know, you know, I mean, it's like, when you look at him move and you look at Tyson Fury move, like, wow, that's an uphill battle.

02:40:27.000 But what is the odds?

02:40:29.000 Yeah.

02:40:29.000 I was going to go 10 to 1, Joe.

02:40:33.000 I found two different sites.

02:40:35.000 It's Ngannou's plus 725. 7 to 1. Yeah, you were right.

02:40:41.000 Yeah.

02:40:42.000 And that's, you know, it probably will go up when the fight comes.

02:40:46.000 You know, more people start betting on Tyson Fury.

02:40:48.000 Yeah, this one has Ngannou just a little bit lower, but Fury is the same on both sites I checked.

02:40:54.000 Yeah.

02:40:55.000 1100. But Jon Jones, man, I would so love to see that fight, particularly when we saw what happened with Cyril Ghosn, because you look at Cyril Ghosn, you go, this guy moves so well for a big guy, so skilled, so talented, and it was over.

02:41:10.000 Cakewalk.

02:41:11.000 Yeah, no one else can do that to Cyril Ghosn.

02:41:13.000 Here it is.

02:41:14.000 This is the Louis Ortiz fight.

02:41:16.000 Okay, watch this.

02:41:16.000 Boom.

02:41:18.000 One shot.

02:41:19.000 One shot.

02:41:20.000 That's the one I'm talking about.

02:41:21.000 Oh, man.

02:41:22.000 Oh, my God.

02:41:22.000 So he K-ed him twice.

02:41:24.000 Oh, man. 0.51

02:41:25.000 This one was just one shot to the forehead.

02:41:28.000 And Ortiz was like, whoa, daddy.

02:41:30.000 Watch this again.

02:41:32.000 Right here.

02:41:33.000 Oh, is this the highlight?

02:41:34.000 Yeah, I just backed up too far.

02:41:38.000 It was a good fight up until this moment, too.

02:41:41.000 Here it comes.

02:41:45.000 He's getting hit.

02:41:47.000 Yeah, Ortiz was scoring on him, man, I'm telling you.

02:41:50.000 It was a good fight.

02:42:00.000 There it is.

02:42:01.000 Oh my! 0.58

02:42:03.000 There it is.

02:42:04.000 One shot.

02:42:07.000 Come on son. 0.88

02:42:09.000 That guy punches so hard.

02:42:11.000 Oh man.

02:42:11.000 So can Francis punch like that?

02:42:14.000 We don't know.

02:42:15.000 We really don't know until he boxes.

02:42:17.000 Can he deliver it?

02:42:17.000 Can he deliver it on someone's chin?

02:42:19.000 Because Deontay doesn't just hit that hard.

02:42:21.000 He delivers those shots on guys like Tyson Fury.

02:42:24.000 He delivers those shots on everybody.

02:42:27.000 You know, it's an uphill battle.

02:42:29.000 He's a scary guy though, man.

02:42:31.000 Francis is a scary dude.

02:42:32.000 He's big.

02:42:34.000 He's 265 naturally, shredded.

02:42:37.000 What did he say?

02:42:38.000 He was walking around 275?

02:42:40.000 275-ish?

02:42:41.000 280?

02:42:42.000 He's walking around because he doesn't have to make the UFC's weight limit.

02:42:46.000 UFC's weight limit was 265, so he had to be 265 to fight in the UFC. He looked like he was chiseled out of granite.

02:42:52.000 He's a perfect athlete for fighting.

02:42:54.000 Tall, big, long, crazy power, and intelligent.

02:42:57.000 He figures out how to get better.

02:42:59.000 You know, he got so much better from the first Stipe fight to the second fight.

02:43:02.000 Oh, yeah.

02:43:02.000 There was no comparison.

02:43:03.000 He was a completely different guy.

02:43:05.000 Patient, calculated, technical, you know, and the knockout punch that he hit Stipe with.

02:43:12.000 The Jairzina Rosenstreich knockout gives me nightmares.

02:43:16.000 Yeah, that was crazy.

02:43:17.000 He's 290 to 293. Wow.

02:43:19.000 So he weighs two Volkanovskys.

02:43:24.000 He's enormous.

02:43:25.000 But, you know, can he deliver that power?

02:43:27.000 And the betting odds say no.

02:43:30.000 Are you a fan of the crossover fights?

02:43:32.000 Yeah, I'm a fan of guys like Francis making a shitload of money.

02:43:35.000 That's what I'm a fan of.

02:43:36.000 I'm a fan of, let's see.

02:43:38.000 I'm a fan of craziness, you know?

02:43:40.000 Like if Jake Paul decides to fight Canelo Alvarez, I'm gonna watch.

02:43:43.000 It's crazy.

02:43:44.000 Did they really do that?

02:43:46.000 That's crazy.

02:43:47.000 I'm a fan of these kind of opportunities for fighters.

02:43:52.000 Like for a guy like Conor McGregor when he fought Floyd Mayweather, you know?

02:43:57.000 We made a hundred million dollars.

02:43:59.000 I'm a fan of that.

02:44:00.000 I'm a fan of those guys being able to do something like that, where they make an extraordinary amount of money doing something like that.

02:44:04.000 This isn't my argument, but it is the purest argument that these crossover fights are demeaning to the noble art of boxing.

02:44:14.000 The boxing, it's a sport, it's an art form.

02:44:19.000 It's taking away from fighters who have dedicated their whole lives to this noble art.

02:44:24.000 You know what I mean?

02:44:24.000 That argument.

02:44:26.000 Yeah.

02:44:29.000 Also, it's fun.

02:44:30.000 Yeah, but also it's fun.

02:44:32.000 It's fun to watch that fight.

02:44:34.000 It's fun.

02:44:34.000 It's fun the fact that the heavyweight champion of the UFC who, you know, retired as a heavyweight or left the UFC as a champion is going to get to box the greatest heavyweight boxer of all time with zero professional boxing fights.

02:44:50.000 Let's see.

02:44:51.000 I mean, it's kind of like the Conor McGregor fight.

02:44:54.000 Let's see.

02:44:55.000 And real similar in the talent that they're facing.

02:45:00.000 When Conor McGregor fought Floyd Mayweather, Floyd Mayweather's arguably the best boxer of all time.

02:45:05.000 I mean, the most defensively sound boxer in the history of the sport.

02:45:08.000 The guy literally has only been hit hard like three or four times.

02:45:11.000 His whole career.

02:45:13.000 I mean, especially when he really became the great Floyd Mayweather.

02:45:17.000 He was just outboxing everybody.

02:45:19.000 Canelo Alvarez, Manny Pacquiao.

02:45:21.000 Everybody got it.

02:45:22.000 Everybody got it.

02:45:23.000 Ricky Hatton.

02:45:24.000 Everybody got it. 0.99

02:45:25.000 He beat the fuck out of everybody. 0.98

02:45:27.000 He's the man. 0.98

02:45:28.000 Floyd's the man.

02:45:29.000 50-0.

02:45:30.000 That's the guy.

02:45:31.000 If you're going to have an all-time great...

02:45:34.000 It's hard to argue that it's not that guy.

02:45:36.000 Because he's the guy that got away from the sport with the least amount of damage, the most amount of money, and he's also been able to sustain himself doing these exhibition fights for crazy amounts of money where the people literally have no chance.

02:45:49.000 Literally have no chance.

02:45:50.000 And he's boxing these folks.

02:45:52.000 And they'll fly him over to Japan, you know, when he had that fight over there with this kickboxer.

02:45:59.000 What he's doing is pretty wild.

02:46:02.000 And, you know, what Francis Ngannou and Tyson Fury are going to do, that's pretty wild too.

02:46:07.000 Yeah.

02:46:08.000 I mean, you have to watch that, right?

02:46:09.000 Oh, yeah.

02:46:10.000 Are you happy it's happening though? 0.99

02:46:12.000 Like this noble art of boxing shit? 1.00

02:46:14.000 Shut the fuck up. 1.00

02:46:16.000 Half that sport's completely corrupt. 1.00

02:46:19.000 You're absolutely right.

02:46:21.000 I sometimes think the reason Mayweather doesn't get his dues is because he ain't that likable as an individual.

02:46:28.000 You know what I mean?

02:46:28.000 I think he was also less exciting than a Mike Tyson type of thing in terms of watching as a spectator.

02:46:35.000 Both of those things are fair to say.

02:46:37.000 But that's also how he got people to watch.

02:46:39.000 He got people to watch by rooting against him.

02:46:42.000 When he first started out, he was Pretty Boy Floyd.

02:46:46.000 He was a different Mayweather.

02:46:48.000 He was Pretty Boy Floyd, and then he became Money Mayweather.

02:46:50.000 And he became Money Mayweather, that's when more people started watching. 0.99

02:46:55.000 And the more shit he talked, and the more he showed you his diamond-encrusted watches and Rolls-Royces, and the more people wanted him to lose, and the more he kept winning. 0.99

02:47:02.000 Yeah, it became the heel. 1.00

02:47:04.000 Amazing.

02:47:05.000 Smart.

02:47:06.000 Super smart in terms of marketing.

02:47:08.000 I mean, come on, man.

02:47:09.000 It ensured a large audience of people that were tuning in just to watch them lose.

02:47:13.000 Yeah.

02:47:14.000 Well, you want to see if that winning streak is going to get broken, right?

02:47:17.000 Sure.

02:47:18.000 But you also want to see someone to beat them because they're so cocky. 0.91

02:47:21.000 I'm tired of this cocky champion.

02:47:23.000 Whenever there's a cocky champion, people want to see this guy knock him off his high horse.

02:47:28.000 So people will tune in just to see that.

02:47:30.000 Genius.

02:47:32.000 But it was interesting you said you still think John Jones versus Francis Ngannes could happen.

02:47:36.000 It could happen, yeah.

02:47:38.000 Why do you say that, Joe?

02:47:39.000 Well, because Francis has his contract with the PFL. Let's say he fights out his contract.

02:47:44.000 Let's say he fights Tyson Fury, and then he fights out his contract.

02:47:47.000 And then at the end of the contract, the UFC offers him a giant chunk of money to fight Jon Jones.

02:47:52.000 So let's say if Jon Jones fights Stipe, who knows who wins that fight, right?

02:47:57.000 And then maybe if he wins, Jon Jones fights Sergei, Sergei Pavlovich, who's a very scary guy who's coming through the ranks.

02:48:06.000 Mm-hmm.

02:48:06.000 There's not a lot of really...

02:48:08.000 Tom Aspinall is very promising.

02:48:11.000 He's really good.

02:48:12.000 British guy. 0.99

02:48:12.000 He's really fucking good. 0.99

02:48:14.000 Tom Aspinall is really good. 0.98

02:48:15.000 He has the potential to be an all-time great. 0.96

02:48:17.000 You watch Tom Aspinall's movement for a heavyweight, his diversity and his skill set, leg kicks, submissions, he's fucking super intelligent, fast as fuck, he's big, naturally big guy. 0.90

02:48:29.000 Super dedicated to the game. 0.95

02:48:30.000 Tom Aspinall has a real shot.

02:48:32.000 So maybe it's Tom Aspinall.

02:48:35.000 But if Jon Jones wins all those, and Francis wins in the PFL, and then leaves, and then they can have another fight.

02:48:42.000 And that would be bonkers.

02:48:45.000 That would be bonkers.

02:48:47.000 You want to see that, man.

02:48:48.000 Oh yeah.

02:48:49.000 I was very upset that he was leaving the UFC because I wanted to see that fight, but also very happy that he's going to get this giant payday.

02:48:56.000 I don't know how much money they say he's going to make.

02:48:58.000 Are they saying?

02:49:00.000 The only thing I've seen is, sorry, Tyson signed that other fight against Usyk that he's going to make over $100 million for both of those, but I haven't seen it.

02:49:08.000 Yeah, so Tyson Fury's so wild.

02:49:11.000 He decided he's going to book another fight.

02:49:14.000 He's like, this fight's going to be so easy, I'm going to book another one a couple months later.

02:49:18.000 Wow.

02:49:18.000 Talk about a cocky champion, huh?

02:49:20.000 Hey, man, that's the Gypsy King. 1.00

02:49:22.000 You know, it's his prerogative. 1.00

02:49:23.000 He's the fucking king. 1.00

02:49:24.000 A hundred percent, man. 0.99

02:49:25.000 That's also a fight that I really, really wanted to see, the Usyk fight.

02:49:29.000 Sports Illustrated says minimum of 10, but that's, you know, not sure how accurate that is.

02:49:34.000 Is that saying that it's the bigger payout than the entire purse that he's totaled from UFC? Click on the link.

02:49:42.000 Sports Illustrated.

02:49:43.000 Receive entire UFC career for Tyson Fury boxing match.

02:49:48.000 That makes sense for him.

02:49:49.000 You can see that.

02:49:51.000 You know, Jon Jones, to me, is such a fascinating character.

02:49:56.000 Because when I watch your interview with him and he talked about contrition and wanting to be a better man, I'm like, I believed him every second of the way.

02:50:03.000 And then you look at his behavior afterwards and he's still just as wild. 0.81

02:50:07.000 Just as crazy. 1.00

02:50:08.000 You don't get a guy who's that good without him being a wild motherfucker. 1.00

02:50:13.000 Like, John's wild. 1.00

02:50:14.000 He's wild inside the ring.

02:50:16.000 He's wild in his belief in himself.

02:50:18.000 He's a wild fella.

02:50:20.000 I mean, that dude opened up his fight against Mauricio Shogun Hua with a flying knee at 22 years old against a legend.

02:50:28.000 Catches him with a flying knee.

02:50:29.000 Just beats the brakes off of a legend.

02:50:32.000 At 22 years old and wins the title.

02:50:34.000 He's an extraordinary talent.

02:50:36.000 Just extraordinarily good.

02:50:38.000 Comes from those whole family super athletes.

02:50:42.000 Both of his brothers play in the NFL. They're both killers. 0.98

02:50:46.000 It's just like, that guy's the man, you know?

02:50:49.000 And that fight against him, him against Francis, him coming up from light heavyweight and... 0.89

02:50:55.000 Francis being this enormous, like, terrifying force at heavyweight, who fucking knows what happens to that fight. 0.94

02:51:01.000 Oh, man. 0.93

02:51:02.000 I would so love to see that fight.

02:51:03.000 I hope it happens, man.

02:51:05.000 I really, really do.

02:51:05.000 I hope it's not one of those things where we always go, God, we missed that one.

02:51:09.000 I know.

02:51:10.000 Do you know what would be, and boxing is really bad for this, and this part is what made me fall out of a love of boxing forever.

02:51:18.000 For a bit.

02:51:18.000 Which is, when the fight does happen, they're both past their peak.

02:51:23.000 They're not the same fighters.

02:51:24.000 Do you know what I mean?

02:51:25.000 Eventually.

02:51:26.000 I don't want it to be that either.

02:51:27.000 Right.

02:51:28.000 Like Manny Pacquiao when he fought Floyd.

02:51:30.000 Yeah.

02:51:30.000 To me, that was one of the biggest disappointments in sport.

02:51:33.000 Unfortunately, Manny went into that fight injured.

02:51:35.000 Yeah.

02:51:35.000 Manny had a torn shoulder going up to that fight, unfortunately.

02:51:40.000 But Floyd was very clever in when he chose that fight.

02:51:43.000 He chose that fight after Manny got knocked out by Juan Manuel Marquez.

02:51:48.000 Remember that one-punch crazy knockout where it was really bad?

02:51:51.000 Where Freddie Roach said, I don't want you to do anything for a year.

02:51:54.000 Like, no fighting for a year.

02:51:56.000 And so you've got to recover from this one.

02:51:58.000 Remember that knockout?

02:51:59.000 I don't, actually.

02:52:00.000 Google Juan Manuel Marquez knocks out Manny Pacquiao.

02:52:05.000 Because they had fought some really close fights, and I think...

02:52:09.000 I think Manny won them.

02:52:12.000 I don't know.

02:52:14.000 Was one a draw?

02:52:15.000 I forget what the previous fights were, but I think this was the third fight.

02:52:20.000 And Manny Pacquiao got clipped right here.

02:52:23.000 Watch this.

02:52:24.000 The perfect right hand.

02:52:26.000 Oh! 0.60

02:52:27.000 And he's coming in as well, right?

02:52:29.000 As he gets hit.

02:52:30.000 Perfect timing.

02:52:31.000 Perfect one punch KO. Out cold.

02:52:34.000 And I think this was the end of their trilogy.

02:52:37.000 Oh, it's four.

02:52:38.000 This is the fourth fight they had.

02:52:39.000 Oh, my God.

02:52:40.000 I mean, that is literally the perfect punch.

02:52:42.000 And Manny just went out cold with one shot.

02:52:45.000 And did you listen to Freddie Roach?

02:52:47.000 Did he take a year?

02:52:48.000 Yes, he did.

02:52:48.000 He did.

02:52:48.000 Yes, he did.

02:52:49.000 I think a knockout like that is so bad. 1.00

02:52:53.000 Like, you have to.

02:52:55.000 That's a one-punch, completely unconscious, massive concussion.

02:53:01.000 That's a massive knockout.

02:53:02.000 That's a rare knockout at that level.

02:53:05.000 You know, when you're watching guys that are that good, you know, there's some fights in the past.

02:53:10.000 You could see a guy getting knocked out with one punch like that.

02:53:13.000 Tommy Hearns versus Roberto Duran.

02:53:14.000 That's one like that.

02:53:15.000 Yeah.

02:53:16.000 Where Tommy Hearns had Roberto Duran in trouble and then clipped him with the perfect right hand of Roberto Duran.

02:53:21.000 Face plants.

02:53:23.000 And when you're watching Roberto Duran face plant, it's like, what?

02:53:27.000 It's hard to believe.

02:53:28.000 The guy who beat Sugar Ray Leonard, like one of the greatest boxers of all time, and Tommy just catches him with a perfect That's the thing with those guys, man.

02:53:38.000 The power they unleash.

02:53:39.000 My dad used to drink with a guy called Alan Minter, who was a former middleweight champion, the world British guy.

02:53:45.000 And this was in the late 70s, early 80s.

02:53:47.000 He was world champion.

02:53:49.000 He fought Hagler.

02:53:50.000 And he told my dad, he goes, when he hit me, I've never felt anything like that. 0.85

02:53:57.000 Hagler was a monster. 0.92

02:53:58.000 Yeah, he was a destroyer. 0.98

02:54:00.000 Yeah, he really was.

02:54:00.000 He was like one of the first really elite fighters that fought so well from both stances, whether it's Southpaw or Orthodox.

02:54:07.000 He could fight you from either stance. 0.89

02:54:09.000 And he fucked guys up like that because he'd switch stances and be just as good. 0.97

02:54:13.000 So you're looking at two different looks, like the jab coming from the right hand, the jab coming from the left hand. 0.99

02:54:18.000 You have to adjust and maybe you only stand one way and he can fucking switch it up anytime he wants. 0.96

02:54:24.000 He's unstoppable. 1.00

02:54:25.000 And he only got knocked down one time in his whole career, and it was bullshit. 0.99

02:54:28.000 He got knocked down by Juan Roldan. 0.98

02:54:30.000 It wasn't real knockdown.

02:54:32.000 They called it a knockdown, but he really just got knocked off balance, and they called it a knockdown.

02:54:37.000 He fell down, he got clubbed in the back of the head, and he went down, and his gloves touched the ground, and they called it a knockdown. 0.99

02:54:42.000 And he got up, and he's like, what the fuck? 0.99

02:54:44.000 And he went out to knock out Roldan. 0.99

02:54:48.000 Speaking of British guys Joe, Paddy the Batty versus Tony Ferguson?

02:54:52.000 Yeah, it's good.

02:54:53.000 It's a good fight in terms of like, you know, Tony Ferguson's been on an unsuccessful streak and Paddy the Batty had that controversial fight with Jared Gordon.

02:55:05.000 It's a good fight.

02:55:06.000 It's a good fight for both guys because, like, you know, Paddy's the guy coming up and Tony is the legend.

02:55:12.000 And so it's a real crossroads fight.

02:55:14.000 And for Tony, it may very well be his last fight in the UFC if he loses.

02:55:18.000 That's, you know, fair to speculate.

02:55:20.000 A lot of people have been calling for him to step down, to stop fighting.

02:55:24.000 Yeah, his last few fights haven't gone that well.

02:55:26.000 Well, it really started out with him hurting his knee.

02:55:29.000 And then he came back after that and beat Pettis, which was pretty extraordinary.

02:55:34.000 But then when he had that Gaethje fight, the Gaethje fight was rough.

02:55:38.000 That was rough.

02:55:39.000 Painful to watch as well.

02:55:40.000 And I love Tony Ferguson.

02:55:41.000 The fact that Khabib never happened, that was... 0.99

02:55:45.000 Oh, such a bummer.

02:55:46.000 That was one of the all-time bummers when he tore his knee backstage just tripping on a wire. 0.98

02:55:51.000 Just fucking some unforeseen accident. 0.95

02:55:56.000 Guy gets through an entire training camp, no problems. 1.00

02:55:59.000 Trips on a fucking wire and rips his knee. 1.00

02:56:01.000 Crazy. 1.00

02:56:01.000 Needs surgery. 1.00

02:56:03.000 Just nuts.

02:56:04.000 But in terms of Batty, do you think you bet on the young guy coming up?

02:56:08.000 Oh, who knows, man.

02:56:09.000 Tony still has a lot in the tank.

02:56:11.000 He looked good, you know, in his last fight against Bobby Green.

02:56:16.000 Bobby Green's just so fast, such a good striker, so unorthodox.

02:56:20.000 You know, I think Tony still has something left.

02:56:23.000 Whether he's got enough to beat a guy like that, that's what makes it exciting.

02:56:27.000 Because it's a good challenge for Paddy.

02:56:29.000 It's a good fight for Tony in terms of where he stands.

02:56:34.000 Because Paddy hasn't fought the elite of the elite, that division yet.

02:56:38.000 The Gamarots, the...

02:56:40.000 You know, these guys that are, you know, challenging soon for a world title.

02:56:45.000 Because there's a few of these guys out there that are just, like, super high-level guys.

02:56:49.000 And Paddy's like, you know, he's making his way up towards those guys.

02:56:52.000 And this is a big step.

02:56:53.000 Well, Fazeev, that what happened against Gamera was so disappointing.

02:56:57.000 Such a bummer, man, because Fazeev is so good.

02:57:00.000 He's such a good striker.

02:57:01.000 That was one of the most impressive Justin Gaethje performances that he outstruck Fazeev.

02:57:06.000 You know, that was a really impressive performance.

02:57:09.000 And then the Dustin Poirier fight was incredible.

02:57:12.000 The fact that that happened in Salt Lake City, and it's a mirror image of the Leon Edwards-Kamaru Usman knockout in Salt Lake City.

02:57:19.000 Crazy.

02:57:20.000 Head kick knockouts in the world title.

02:57:24.000 That Leon Edwards fight was so crazy.

02:57:26.000 I almost turned it off towards the end because I was like, this is over.

02:57:30.000 Yeah, the greatest call in the history of sports, John Anik says, that is not the cloth from which he is cut.

02:57:36.000 And then boom, he lands that head kick.

02:57:38.000 Because they were talking about him phoning it in from now on, just trying to survive and accepting his defeat.

02:57:44.000 John Anik says that and then he lands a perfect head kick right afterwards.

02:57:47.000 Bananas.

02:57:48.000 He doesn't really get the credit that he deserves, Leon Edwards.

02:57:50.000 Oh, Leon Edwards?

02:57:51.000 Yeah.

02:57:52.000 No, Leon Edwards.

02:57:53.000 I think he's getting it now.

02:57:54.000 I think the Kamaru Usman rematch just showed that Kamaru was very cautious about engaging.

02:58:01.000 It was like a different fight than the first fight.

02:58:03.000 Also, his takedown defense is on point.

02:58:05.000 He's getting way better at grappling, which showed in the first Kamaru Usman fight, because he took Kamaru down, which is crazy.

02:58:12.000 Nobody saw that coming.

02:58:13.000 They mounted him.

02:58:14.000 Everybody's like, whoa.

02:58:15.000 This is crazy.

02:58:16.000 This is the first round of this fight.

02:58:18.000 Leon's good, man.

02:58:20.000 He's so technical.

02:58:21.000 His striking is so smooth.

02:58:23.000 Him hitting the pads, he's one of the most impressive guys I've ever seen hit the pads.

02:58:27.000 His flow, like between elbows, punches and kicks, it's just everything is perfect technique.

02:58:33.000 Snap, bop, bop, snap, bop, bop, snap, stop, stop, stop.

02:58:37.000 It's beautiful to watch.

02:58:38.000 And you add that with takedown defense and experience and now the confidence that comes with being a champion. 0.98

02:58:47.000 He's fucking good. 0.90

02:58:48.000 How much does that change things? 0.98

02:58:50.000 Because I think in a lot of things, confidence and the knowledge that you've achieved something changes everything.

02:58:55.000 Well, they're all very skillful at that level.

02:58:58.000 And everybody has a strong mind at that level.

02:59:00.000 But, you know, like, being a champion, there's an aura that comes from the champions that you have to overcome.

02:59:08.000 Like, when people fought Khabib, they weren't just fighting the champion.

02:59:11.000 They weren't just fighting Khabib Nurmagomedov and his skills. 0.82

02:59:14.000 They were fighting this fucking force that they knew they were going to face that nobody else has been able to do anything to them. 0.96

02:59:20.000 Except Glace and Tebow. 0.99

02:59:21.000 That was a very close fight.

02:59:22.000 But other than that, like, he's steamrolling everybody. 0.99

02:59:25.000 He's fucking everybody up. 0.98

02:59:26.000 And you know it. 0.99

02:59:27.000 And you know it.

02:59:28.000 And you're facing this guy who's undefeated and he just seems to be getting better with every fight.

02:59:32.000 There's an aura of those guys that you have to overcome as well as beating them.

02:59:37.000 You have to overcome this aura.

02:59:39.000 And everybody thinks you have no chance. 0.98

02:59:41.000 You're going into this fucking battleground with this guy who's like the most feared warrior in your division. 0.99

02:59:47.000 The guy's been able to dominate the division. 0.99

02:59:50.000 You have to overcome that.

02:59:52.000 And Leon is now becoming that.

02:59:55.000 When he beat Kamaru the second time, everybody's like, oh boy.

02:59:59.000 Okay.

03:00:00.000 And then if he can beat Colby Covington, that's a big one.

03:00:05.000 That's an exciting fight.

03:00:06.000 That's a big one. 0.99

03:00:07.000 That's a big one because Colby puts that fucking pressure on you. 0.99

03:00:10.000 He's got an empty, I mean, an endless gas tank. 0.99

03:00:14.000 Endless gas tank.

03:00:14.000 He's like an energizer bunny, just doesn't stop.

03:00:16.000 His cardio is so good.

03:00:17.000 His wrestling is so good.

03:00:18.000 He's just constant.

03:00:20.000 And he just stays in your face.

03:00:21.000 He just drains you.

03:00:22.000 He just drains people.

03:00:24.000 Camaro's been the only guy that's been able to figure that out.

03:00:27.000 There's some people who've got an aura about them, that it's undeniable.

03:00:31.000 And whatever sport it is, at the moment they step onto the field or into the ring, there's just something about them that is undeniable.

03:00:38.000 And you just go, I don't know, even if you don't know who the person is, you're immediately drawn to them.

03:00:44.000 Yeah, well, that's also one of the things that's exciting about the sport is that there are those people that just get to this spot where they just rise above to the point where, like, you know, like, you can't wait to watch, like, Volkanovski, can't wait to watch him perform again. 0.96

03:01:00.000 Like, damn, he's on it right now. 0.68

03:01:03.000 That guy's on it, you know? 0.99

03:01:04.000 Anderson Silva, when he was in his prime, was like that.

03:01:07.000 Jon Jones, when he was the light heavyweight champion, was like that. 0.99

03:01:10.000 You know, it's like, damn. 0.99

03:01:12.000 This guy's on it. 0.99

03:01:13.000 Like, he's in that zone where, like, the greatness lies.

03:01:17.000 You know, it's not just being the best in the world, but handily defeating anybody who dares challenge him.

03:01:24.000 Yeah, when we had Dan Hardy on, we asked him what it was like to go into the fight against Georges St-Pierre, and I think he said something, like, he kind of, I don't remember exactly what he said, but he kind of hinted that, you know, you're aware of the fact that this guy's, you know, at that level.

03:01:38.000 Yeah.

03:01:39.000 Yeah, man.

03:01:40.000 It's a crazy sport, man.

03:01:41.000 It's the most primal.

03:01:42.000 I love it.

03:01:43.000 You want to talk about the need for wild people.

03:01:45.000 That's the only way you get a sport like that.

03:01:47.000 Yeah.

03:01:48.000 You have to have wild people, man.

03:01:49.000 Well, you know what?

03:01:50.000 I think in some ways the rise of the UFC, obviously, you know, Dana White and his team have done a great job and it's a fascinating sport.

03:01:56.000 But I think partly it's like as the culture gets pussified, people are crying out for something wild like that and they want to watch that.

03:02:03.000 Yeah.

03:02:03.000 You know?

03:02:04.000 In a world that's getting softer and less resilient, as we talked about earlier, You want to see that shit. 1.00

03:02:10.000 Yeah, there's that. 1.00

03:02:11.000 That's why people like fights in hockey. 0.79

03:02:13.000 People like watching rugby and football.

03:02:17.000 They still like a little chaos, some aggressive energy.

03:02:23.000 Yeah, they like men being men.

03:02:24.000 They like men going to war. 0.98

03:02:26.000 It's why when you watch the New Zealand rugby team, they're all blacks. 1.00

03:02:30.000 They do the hacker before they play. 0.98

03:02:32.000 It's the war dance.

03:02:34.000 It's so scary.

03:02:35.000 That Akka's so awesome.

03:02:36.000 I love it.

03:02:37.000 It's so awesome.

03:02:38.000 I wonder what this means for our society.

03:02:45.000 The fact that these two things are happening at the same time.

03:02:48.000 That there is this blowback where people do still want to watch wild, crazy things.

03:02:53.000 They still want to hear wild, crazy things.

03:02:56.000 And then there's this push towards A neutering of masculine energy and the term toxic male energy.

03:03:05.000 You know, this idea that anything masculine is inherently negative.

03:03:09.000 That's crazy, man.

03:03:10.000 It's so dangerous because if you're telling young boys that they are inherently evil and wrong and dangerous...

03:03:20.000 Then you're essentially alienating a very dangerous section of society, number one.

03:03:27.000 And number two, somebody's going to step in and go, hey, you know what?

03:03:31.000 They think you're bad, right? 0.99

03:03:32.000 So why don't we do some fucking damage? 0.99

03:03:36.000 And Jordan coming along was a healthy version of a response, right? 1.00

03:03:40.000 Saying to men, be responsible, take accountability, go and create things, go and be the strongest man at your father's funeral, all that.

03:03:47.000 That was healthy.

03:03:48.000 Now we're also getting a lot of the less healthy responses as well in terms of people who are becoming big in that space, I feel.

03:03:55.000 Well, you're always going to get people, you know, people don't feel represented.

03:03:59.000 Yep.

03:04:00.000 Yep.

03:04:00.000 When you're saying that everything that they like and everything that they are is just negative no matter what, they don't feel represented.

03:04:10.000 When someone comes along and challenges that, even if that person's a grifter, you latch onto that.

03:04:15.000 Yeah.

03:04:15.000 Because when you make certain arguments beyond the pale, and those arguments have merit and value, but you're not allowed to say those arguments anymore.

03:04:24.000 It gives them an appeal.

03:04:25.000 It gives them an appeal, number one.

03:04:26.000 And number two, you are going to get someone from outside the mainstream coming along and going, yeah, they're talking nonsense to you, and here's the truth.

03:04:35.000 And it is true. 0.71

03:04:36.000 And that's magnetic.

03:04:38.000 I wonder what's going to happen with this, you know, there's clearly, when you see what's going on with Canada with the podcast thing, where they're trying to get people to register their podcasts.

03:04:48.000 I think there's a crazy fine, too, for violating it.

03:04:50.000 I think the fine might be something crazy, like $250,000 or something like that.

03:04:55.000 It's like a very high fine.

03:04:56.000 See what the fine is for violating the rules.

03:04:59.000 But when you get stuff like that, I wonder what's going to prevail.

03:05:08.000 What is going to prevail?

03:05:10.000 Is free discourse and free speech going to prevail?

03:05:12.000 Or are we going to go full commie?

03:05:15.000 Are we going to go full censorship?

03:05:17.000 Because if we do, if we cross a line where you really can silence people, if we cross a line where you can use dirty tricks and tactics to eliminate anybody that doesn't think the way you think, whether it's through censoring them on social media or whether intelligence agencies step in and tell you to remove posts because they go against the narrative that the government is trying to push. 0.98

03:05:41.000 Like, that is fucking scary.

03:05:44.000 Well, I think the thing you hit the nail on the head, Francis, earlier when you were talking about how they're changing the concept of safety, that's what we have to push back against because there's this idea if you hear opinions you don't like or people are talking in a way that you don't like, that makes you unsafe. 1.00

03:05:58.000 And we have to say that is fucking bullshit. 1.00

03:06:01.000 Yeah, that's fucking bullshit. 1.00

03:06:02.000 We have to say that. 1.00

03:06:04.000 And that's, to me, because all they do is they redefine the word, and then they weaponize it against you.

03:06:10.000 Yeah, they say the words are violence, and of course you're against violence, right?

03:06:13.000 Right.

03:06:13.000 Violence is bad.

03:06:14.000 No one's supporting violence.

03:06:16.000 But yeah, but here's the thing.

03:06:17.000 You can only make the argument that words are violence if you've never been punched in the face.

03:06:22.000 Right.

03:06:22.000 And a lot of people have.

03:06:24.000 And a lot of people could benefit from that.

03:06:26.000 Well, my fear is that a real war breaks out.

03:06:30.000 That's my fear.

03:06:31.000 My fear is that we are beating the drums of a real war.

03:06:34.000 A real war involving superpowers.

03:06:36.000 And a real war involving technology beyond our comprehension.

03:06:40.000 Including hypersonic missiles.

03:06:42.000 They can change direction in air.

03:06:45.000 And you can't track them, you don't know where they're going.

03:06:47.000 You can't do anything to shoot them out of the sky.

03:06:50.000 They're just moving too fast.

03:06:52.000 And they hit cities.

03:06:53.000 Boom, ba-ba-ba-boom, boom. 1.00

03:06:55.000 And then we're fucked. 0.99

03:06:57.000 And then you're – I mean I don't even know if it helps to have masculine men then. 0.99

03:07:02.000 I don't know if it – what helps?

03:07:04.000 If you can get to a point where you can debilitate a country's infrastructure, kill their power grid, remove them from the internet, remove their ability to communicate with each other, that's not that – I mean, that's totally believable.

03:07:20.000 That's not an impossible scenario where precise strikes, even if they just decided not to kill everybody, they just decided to destroy the power grid and destroy the infrastructure and kill the internet and kill the pipelines.

03:07:32.000 I mean, look what they did with the Nord Stream pipeline, right?

03:07:35.000 What if they decide to do that with all kinds of gas and oil pipelines?

03:07:39.000 What if they decide to do that?

03:07:40.000 And, you know, shut down power plants and do so in a way that we're left powerless.

03:07:47.000 We have nothing.

03:07:49.000 What are we going to do?

03:07:50.000 We're going to rise up against who?

03:07:53.000 They'll literally starve you out.

03:07:55.000 They'll shut down the infrastructure of the country.

03:07:58.000 How would the country work if there's no power?

03:08:01.000 How long do we have if the whole grid gets wiped out?

03:08:08.000 Let's just imagine an attack.

03:08:09.000 Even if it's just some sort of a very complicated cyber attack that wipes out the whole grid.

03:08:16.000 How long can we survive with no power?

03:08:19.000 The grid's very vulnerable.

03:08:20.000 Texas almost lost its grid here because it got too cold.

03:08:23.000 We came that close.

03:08:25.000 We came that close because we're independent from the rest of the country in terms of the grid.

03:08:29.000 If the Texas grid, it was like they were very close to losing everything.

03:08:34.000 Yeah.

03:08:35.000 It's like how many people die then? 0.99

03:08:36.000 It's fucking freezing cold. 0.99

03:08:38.000 No one has a fireplace anymore. 0.99

03:08:40.000 They don't even let you build a house with like a real wood fireplace in a lot of places.

03:08:44.000 I know in California you can't. 1.00

03:08:46.000 So if it's cold, you're fucked. 1.00

03:08:49.000 Like you're gonna freeze to death. 1.00

03:08:51.000 People were freezing to death.

03:08:53.000 Like that can happen. 1.00

03:08:54.000 The power goes out and you fucking freeze to death. 0.99

03:08:56.000 That's a reality of life in 2023. You know, and it's also as well, you know, we've all become de-skilled as a population. 0.99

03:09:03.000 Oh, yeah.

03:09:04.000 You know, we're so, you know, we're so dependent on this technology.

03:09:09.000 Like, think if you went time-travelling, right, and you went back a thousand years and people go to you, what's going on?

03:09:15.000 And you'd be like, we've got all this amazing stuff.

03:09:17.000 We do this.

03:09:18.000 Oh, yeah.

03:09:18.000 How does it work?

03:09:19.000 I'd be like, I don't know.

03:09:20.000 I'd just switch it on and it works.

03:09:22.000 Right.

03:09:23.000 Yeah, I just do a podcast.

03:09:25.000 Yeah, if you left me alone on an island with all the books that have ever been written for a million years, I'd never figure out how to make the internet.

03:09:33.000 Right.

03:09:34.000 Yeah.

03:09:34.000 You know?

03:09:35.000 Yeah.

03:09:36.000 What?

03:09:37.000 5G? What does that mean?

03:09:38.000 Satellites? 0.99

03:09:39.000 What the fuck are you talking about? 1.00

03:09:40.000 Yeah. 1.00

03:09:41.000 I have to fly a metal piece high enough in the sky that it's weightless?

03:09:46.000 And it just spins around the earth?

03:09:48.000 What?

03:09:49.000 And we all take this stuff for granted as well.

03:09:51.000 We're all like, oh yeah, this is just normal.

03:09:53.000 This is entirely normal.

03:09:54.000 And this is just our society.

03:09:56.000 And this is what I was born into.

03:09:59.000 And this is always going to be this way.

03:10:01.000 It's like...

03:10:01.000 Well, look, we're victims of our own success, right?

03:10:04.000 Because we've built these amazing things and they're good things to have, right?

03:10:06.000 Having a power grid is good.

03:10:08.000 But we've got to also be smart.

03:10:10.000 And one of the things we're finally starting to realize, at least in the UK... Where we went super crazy on this net zero stuff is you have to produce your own energy.

03:10:19.000 You have to have control of that.

03:10:21.000 Otherwise, where are you buying it from?

03:10:22.000 Who are you buying it from?

03:10:23.000 And what are they going to do to use the fact that you're buying the energy from them against you?

03:10:27.000 Yeah.

03:10:28.000 And there's so many problems.

03:10:30.000 There's so many problems with just the way human beings acquire minerals that need to go into cell phones.

03:10:37.000 This is the cobalt problem.

03:10:40.000 The fact that everybody's phone has this element in it that comes from people literally digging it out of the ground in mines that are working in the most horrible conditions imaginable and that this has been documented.

03:10:55.000 And lithium too.

03:10:56.000 Yep.

03:10:57.000 Lithium too.

03:10:57.000 I mean, a lot of the lithium that actually we need is in eastern Ukraine.

03:11:01.000 It's one of the reasons that that shit is going on. 0.97

03:11:03.000 I think it was going to be the second biggest producer of lithium in the world after China. 0.99

03:11:07.000 You sound like a conspiracy theorist. 0.93

03:11:10.000 You need to just tune in to CNBC and shut your brain off. 0.99

03:11:13.000 Yeah, man.

03:11:15.000 But yeah, the net zero stuff actually scares me because it's...

03:11:19.000 Well, climate change is kind of a cult in and of itself.

03:11:23.000 Because that's also a thing where people aren't willing to listen at all to people with opposing viewpoints.

03:11:28.000 And then if you do, you are now a climate denier.

03:11:32.000 Just like how if you were kind of like, hey, what's going on with these mRNA vaccines?

03:11:36.000 Oh, you're anti-vax.

03:11:37.000 Like, oh, what?

03:11:39.000 What happened there?

03:11:40.000 How did you sneak that in?

03:11:41.000 Like, what are you saying?

03:11:43.000 Like, if you are curious about whether or not all this stuff that you're offering up as a solution is actually...

03:11:50.000 Is that actually going to be effective if everybody stops eating meat?

03:11:53.000 How much does that change?

03:11:54.000 And what are you going to do about China and India and their output?

03:11:58.000 How much CO2 is actually in the atmosphere?

03:12:01.000 And how much do you need in the atmosphere?

03:12:02.000 Isn't there a certain amount you need?

03:12:04.000 What percentage are we above what we used to be?

03:12:06.000 It turns out it's like.04 is what we are now.

03:12:11.000 And we used to be.03.

03:12:14.000 And at.02, plant life starts to die.

03:12:18.000 Because there's not enough carbon dioxide.

03:12:20.000 It's like what percentage of that is human beings?

03:12:24.000 That's a good question.

03:12:25.000 And what percentage of it is the rest of the world and what percentage of it are we going to save by ruining everything here in the Western world?

03:12:33.000 Right.

03:12:33.000 Well, so in the UK, we have this obsession about net zero and I'm like, okay, let's get our emissions down to zero.

03:12:39.000 Let's say Britain produces no carbon emissions at all and the ones that we outsource abroad.

03:12:43.000 That's 2% of global carbon emissions. 0.99

03:12:46.000 You just fucked our country. 0.98

03:12:48.000 To make no difference whatsoever to the problem. 1.00

03:12:51.000 Well, the big polluter or the big contributor, the biggest by far is China and India.

03:12:56.000 Yeah.

03:12:56.000 They're the two biggest.

03:12:58.000 And if they're gonna keep doing it, it seems like what we need to do, I mean, this sounds very simple from a moron like myself, but they need to figure out technologies to clean the air. 0.91

03:13:12.000 And that doesn't seem impossible. 0.72

03:13:13.000 In fact, there was some talk of a giant skyscraper that acted as an air filter and that they were gonna install it.

03:13:21.000 Remember those, Jamie?

03:13:22.000 Yeah, see if you can find that.

03:13:23.000 There's talk of construction.

03:13:25.000 It might have been in China.

03:13:27.000 They were going to build these essentially skyscrapers that were really just giant air filters.

03:13:33.000 And that instead of a skyscraper that housed, you know, office buildings or people, it actually housed equipment that just sucked pollution out of the air and filtered it.

03:13:41.000 And you're like, hmm, maybe that's it.

03:13:45.000 Maybe that would work.

03:13:46.000 Maybe you could actually capture...

03:13:48.000 There it is.

03:13:49.000 The skyscraper-sized air purifier is the world's tallest.

03:13:52.000 Wow.

03:13:53.000 So what if they just had those on every block or had those, you know, every, you know, X amount of blocks where they figured out a way to clean the air?

03:14:03.000 Okay, it can reduce pollution in major metropolitan areas by 20%, for example.

03:14:08.000 If.

03:14:08.000 If we can.

03:14:10.000 Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry.

03:14:11.000 Yeah.

03:14:11.000 I like to tell my students we don't need to be medical doctors to save lives.

03:14:14.000 Dr. David Pui, professor of mechanical engineering at the University of Minnesota and one of the researchers.

03:14:20.000 So if they could just reduce air pollution by 20%, for example, we could save tens of thousands of lives a year.

03:14:26.000 Yeah, so this seems like it's about air pollution, but your point about China and India, Joe, is so right, because I was talking to an Indian dude, and he told me the time of partition, this is 1947, when India became independent.

03:14:37.000 Average life expectancy in India, Jamie, fact check me if you could, please, but I think it was 37 years.

03:14:44.000 Fast forward to today, it's over 80. You think those people are going to give up burning shit to live longer? 0.99

03:14:51.000 You think they're going to do that? 0.99

03:14:52.000 Because I don't think they will.

03:14:53.000 I don't think the Chinese are going to stop making stuff and producing stuff and burning stuff. 1.00

03:14:57.000 I don't think the people have a say over there in China.

03:15:00.000 That's true.

03:15:01.000 Particularly.

03:15:02.000 But it's a big part of it, right?

03:15:03.000 There's not going to be some movement against the government.

03:15:06.000 I've checked both on the net zero plan.

03:15:08.000 Yeah.

03:15:09.000 To reach net zero emissions by 2060, the report estimates China needs between U.S. $14 to $17 trillion in addition to investments for green infrastructure and technology in the power and transport sectors alone.

03:15:22.000 It seems like quite a lot of money to me.

03:15:24.000 Yeah.

03:15:25.000 Okay, so says Xi Jinping said, since September of 2020, when China's president, Xi Jinping, made the pledge to reach net zero by 2060, the country's ministers and locales have been mobilized to devise decarbonization roadmaps for their jurisdictions.

03:15:41.000 Maybe they can do that.

03:15:42.000 Maybe they can...

03:15:43.000 I mean, maybe there's technologies that either haven't been implemented or just theoretical, where they can figure out a way...

03:15:50.000 To clean it up without destroying their economy.

03:15:53.000 And that might be possible.

03:15:55.000 I don't know.

03:15:56.000 But it's certain that human beings are having an effect.

03:15:58.000 I mean, like, specifically with pollution.

03:16:01.000 And not just that, not just the air.

03:16:04.000 We certainly should be looking at carbon dioxide and certainly should be looking at... 0.98

03:16:08.000 We all should be looking at what the fuck we're doing in the ocean. 0.99

03:16:11.000 We're killing the ocean. 1.00

03:16:12.000 We're filling it up with garbage and literally killing most of the species.

03:16:17.000 We were just talking about the other day that they don't really know what the real numbers are, but they think it's estimated that we've killed somewhere in the neighborhood of like 80 to 90 percent of the fish.

03:16:26.000 What?

03:16:28.000 Just scooping fish out and killing everything. 1.00

03:16:33.000 Giant fucking country-sized floating garbage islands. 1.00

03:16:37.000 You know, like, what? 1.00

03:16:39.000 I mean, the island of the Pacific Garbage Patch is bigger than Texas.

03:16:42.000 Texas is bigger than multiple European countries. 0.98

03:16:46.000 And that patch of garbage is bigger than that. 0.98

03:16:48.000 Yeah. 0.94

03:16:48.000 You know, the thing that I find really, really demoralizing about this debate is the fact that the complete lack of critical thinking skills. 0.94

03:16:55.000 People on the left, therefore they think this.

03:16:57.000 People on the right, they think this.

03:16:58.000 I'm not going to mention this person's name.

03:17:00.000 They came on your pod and they were like, well, I think, you know, it doesn't exist, climate change.

03:17:04.000 And that person thought that way.

03:17:06.000 I think a lot of it is because they're on the right.

03:17:08.000 You know, so they see the way the tribe moves, they move with the tribe.

03:17:11.000 Instead of actually taking every issue, looking at it themselves, doing the reading, doing the work, and then going, well, this is what I think, regardless of this tribe or that tribe.

03:17:20.000 Yeah.

03:17:21.000 Yeah.

03:17:22.000 If you're on the left, you think climate change is imperative.

03:17:24.000 If you're on the right, you're probably more dismissive of it.

03:17:27.000 You know, certainly we should really look at nuclear power.

03:17:31.000 Nuclear power seems to be the cleanest way to do this.

03:17:34.000 And it's safe in relative.

03:17:36.000 It's safe.

03:17:37.000 I always make this joke.

03:17:39.000 Until it's not.

03:17:40.000 Well, you say that, but actually if you look at the casualties from nuclear disasters, there's only been three major ones, right?

03:17:47.000 Long Island, Three Mile Island, Chernobyl, and Fukushima.

03:17:51.000 If you look at the stats and you add it all up, nuclear energy is safer than hydro.

03:17:57.000 There's one dam collapse in China killed way more people than all the nuclear disasters put together.

03:18:02.000 Yeah.

03:18:02.000 The real issue, though, is that it ruins that area forever.

03:18:06.000 So, like, no one's moving into Chernobyl. 0.98

03:18:08.000 No one's—Fukushima's fucked. 1.00

03:18:10.000 Like, that place is fucked. 1.00

03:18:12.000 Like, when they do go south, they go bad. 1.00

03:18:14.000 To the point where a friend of mine who's this brilliant guy says he won't eat fish from the Pacific anymore.

03:18:19.000 And I said, why?

03:18:20.000 And he said, Fukushima.

03:18:22.000 He goes, I don't think they're testing for it.

03:18:25.000 I don't think they're testing for radiation poisoning.

03:18:27.000 I don't think they've measured it.

03:18:29.000 He goes, what if it's a lot worse than we think it is and we find this out 10, 15 years from now?

03:18:35.000 He goes, maybe I'm wrong.

03:18:36.000 He goes, I just don't want to take a chance.

03:18:37.000 So I don't eat fish from the Pacific.

03:18:39.000 I'm like, Jesus.

03:18:40.000 I never even thought of that.

03:18:41.000 That's a fair point.

03:18:42.000 Yeah.

03:18:42.000 I don't know if it is.

03:18:43.000 I mean, is that ridiculous?

03:18:45.000 I mean, how much of an impact does Fukushima have on the entire mass of the Pacific Ocean?

03:18:49.000 No, I mean your fair point about you can't live in that area for a very, very, very, very long time.

03:18:56.000 Yeah, that's a fair point.

03:18:57.000 Yeah, I mean, hundreds of thousands of years, right?

03:18:59.000 Those areas are ruined.

03:19:00.000 But the thing is they can mitigate that now and they can figure out a way to have nuclear power plants with better failsafe than they had in Fukushima.

03:19:07.000 Fukushima they had like a backup and that got crushed too. 0.94

03:19:10.000 And then they're fucked because they can't shut it off. 0.93

03:19:12.000 And then you have this reactor that you can't shut down and it's just chaos. 0.98

03:19:16.000 I mean, Chernobyl, they had to work really hard to make that thing blow up.

03:19:19.000 It was like incompetence and all sorts of other dynamics going on there. 0.99

03:19:23.000 It was pretty fucked up. 0.98

03:19:24.000 What's wild now is there's things living there. 1.00

03:19:26.000 It's like, who knows what kind of crazy mutation Godzilla-type shit is going on there. 0.94

03:19:32.000 Do you know there's an animal sanctuary area in the Red Forest? 0.98

03:19:36.000 And it's one of the safest areas for wildlife in the world because there's no humans there.

03:19:42.000 Wow, but has anybody measured the effects of radiation on those animals?

03:19:46.000 I mean, some of them are getting affected, obviously, but they're not getting shot by humans is the point.

03:19:51.000 Right, but what if you're developing, like, telepathy?

03:19:56.000 You know, in comic books, radiation always leads to awesome things.

03:19:59.000 That's how you become Spider-Man.

03:20:01.000 Exactly.

03:20:01.000 You know, that's how you become the Hulk or the X-Men.

03:20:04.000 Yeah, maybe that's China, maybe that's Russia's, maybe that's the next stage of the war. 0.73

03:20:09.000 Isn't that odd?

03:20:10.000 It's in Ukraine.

03:20:10.000 Oh, yeah.

03:20:11.000 All of the problems in comic books, like, with radiation, it's all like someone becomes a superhero, now they have these powers, and they have to, well, I guess I have to save the world. 1.00

03:20:21.000 But in real life, you're just fucked. 0.99

03:20:23.000 Yeah. 1.00

03:20:23.000 Maybe that's what we need to solve our problems, is to spy the squirrel from Chernobyl, Joe. 1.00

03:20:27.000 Yeah.

03:20:28.000 Maybe we need aliens. 1.00

03:20:30.000 Maybe that's what we need. 1.00

03:20:31.000 Maybe they need to come down and go, settle the fuck. 1.00

03:20:34.000 Yeah, maybe we just need beings who are just way smarter than us just to go, you are a bunch of incompetent chimps. 1.00

03:20:41.000 Shut up and I will deal with it. 1.00

03:20:42.000 What do you think about all this UAP stuff when you see this? 0.97

03:20:46.000 I mean, I don't like that they changed it from UFO to UAP. That's annoying because I know what you're doing.

03:20:50.000 Just coming up with new clever ways to make it less ridiculous to the world.

03:20:55.000 But what do you think about all this disclosure stuff?

03:20:58.000 The thing that makes me skeptical is UFO sightings are so disproportionately in North America.

03:21:06.000 We're enthusiasts.

03:21:08.000 You guys love a conspiracy theory.

03:21:10.000 We love a UFO. Yeah.

03:21:12.000 You know what I mean?

03:21:13.000 Yeah, and it's never in New York either.

03:21:15.000 You know what I mean?

03:21:15.000 There's a few.

03:21:16.000 Is there a few?

03:21:17.000 Yeah, it happens in New York.

03:21:18.000 But also, people lie.

03:21:21.000 That's a problem.

03:21:22.000 The amount of really good footage is...

03:21:26.000 The compelling stuff is the stuff the fighter jets capture.

03:21:29.000 That's compelling.

03:21:30.000 The tic-tac footage, that's compelling.

03:21:33.000 When they talk about the amount of g-force that would be involved and something moving in that way, most things that we have would just fall apart.

03:21:43.000 What is moving that quickly?

03:21:46.000 Is all of the sensors, are all those accurate?

03:21:50.000 Are all those detection systems and all the radar and tracking, is all that accurate? 0.95

03:21:55.000 Because if it is accurate, like, what the fuck can move that quick? 0.90

03:21:58.000 Like, explain that. 0.94

03:21:59.000 What is that?

03:22:00.000 And if that's ours...

03:22:02.000 Like, who?

03:22:04.000 Like, if they've managed to hide some sort of super sophisticated propulsion system that's beyond our comprehension.

03:22:12.000 Like, beyond.

03:22:14.000 Nothing you could imagine.

03:22:16.000 And that they've been working on this for decades.

03:22:18.000 And that that's what all this UFO talk is.

03:22:20.000 They, you mean the government?

03:22:21.000 The government. 0.99

03:22:21.000 Yeah, some black ops program, some special top secret shit where they're in the middle of the desert. 0.99

03:22:27.000 They figure out a propulsion system that works on gravity. 0.97

03:22:31.000 But could they keep that secret for that long?

03:22:33.000 That's the thing, man.

03:22:34.000 You know, because it's easy to go down this route and go, the government are keeping things secret, and of course the government do, and of course they're cover-ups.

03:22:43.000 But if there's one thing I can know from the British government, it's just that they can never cover anything up.

03:22:47.000 You know what I mean?

03:22:48.000 Without incompetence.

03:22:49.000 Yeah.

03:22:49.000 Right, but that's the legislators and the Senate and the Congress.

03:22:53.000 What about the fucking people that are involved in the highest levels of the military? 0.98

03:22:57.000 I bet they keep a lot of good secrets. 1.00

03:22:59.000 I bet they're real good at it.

03:23:01.000 Especially people that are working with defense contractors.

03:23:03.000 Like if they really did receive a crashed UFO and they were back engineering it, it would be a national security imperative for us to get that first. 0.98

03:23:12.000 If there's some craft that came here from Alpha Centauri and they've managed to get a hold of it, and they're trying to figure out how that thing works, you better shut the fuck up until we figure this out. 0.99

03:23:22.000 And I think that would be, like, if you were a patriot and you were working for the government, you would keep your fucking mouth shut if that was your job. 0.99

03:23:29.000 Also, they're looking at every email you send, every text message you send. 0.99

03:23:33.000 They probably got your house bugged.

03:23:35.000 If you talk about it, they're going to know.

03:23:36.000 Yeah.

03:23:37.000 I think it's possible to keep secrets.

03:23:39.000 As much as people want to think that it's not, But I don't know. 0.98

03:23:43.000 I don't know what the fuck is going on. 0.97

03:23:45.000 And part of me is like, they're talking about it too much. 0.99

03:23:49.000 Part of me is like, show me something.

03:23:52.000 Show me something.

03:23:53.000 Like, I don't want to go all this talk.

03:23:57.000 Like, even David Grush, he never saw anything.

03:23:59.000 He just uncovered programs that he found.

03:24:01.000 Who knows who gave him that information? 0.84

03:24:02.000 I mean, if I wanted to fucking put out some disinformation, I would encourage someone to be a whistleblower. 0.91

03:24:07.000 That's what I would do. 0.98

03:24:08.000 I would tell them some nonsense and encourage them to tell everybody else.

03:24:11.000 And then it discredits the whole thing.

03:24:13.000 Yeah, it makes the whole thing preposterous.

03:24:15.000 Or it also can cover up this other thing that you have going on.

03:24:19.000 You say, oh, these are off-world crafts.

03:24:20.000 It can't be ours.

03:24:22.000 Meanwhile, it is ours.

03:24:23.000 One of the things that's happening that's weird is they're always in these areas where the military operates.

03:24:28.000 Like off the coast of the East Coast where they've seen those things.

03:24:34.000 Is it like a cube inside a circle?

03:24:36.000 Is that what it is?

03:24:37.000 It's either a cube inside a circle or a circle inside a cube.

03:24:40.000 But they keep seeing these things that can hover at 120 knots completely still, move off faster than the eye can see.

03:24:49.000 And this is something that Ryan Graves experienced.

03:24:52.000 He didn't experience it.

03:24:53.000 He experienced it on his sensors.

03:24:55.000 They upgraded their sensors in, I think it was 2014. And almost immediately, they started spotting these things that just violated everything that they knew about, like, the way objects could move and behave.

03:25:05.000 What do you make of this argument?

03:25:07.000 I can't remember who's made it, but it's the idea that if we were to encounter an alien species, if they reached here, they would be so technologically advanced that they could do whatever the fuck they wanted, basically. 0.89

03:25:16.000 Maybe.

03:25:17.000 Or maybe there's, like, levels, like we are at, right?

03:25:21.000 Maybe there's, like, if we are going to eventually travel to other planets and establish a civilization on other planets or visit other planets, how long is that?

03:25:30.000 When is that going to be?

03:25:31.000 Is that 100 years from now?

03:25:32.000 Is it 50?

03:25:33.000 Maybe that's where they are.

03:25:34.000 Maybe there's some that are a thousand years more advanced.

03:25:37.000 Maybe there's some that are millions of years.

03:25:39.000 Maybe some of them live in a solar system that's much more stable, and it doesn't have the problem that we have with asteroids.

03:25:45.000 Maybe there's, you know, less collisions, so they're allowed to reach this technological level of sophistication that's evolving over millions of years.

03:25:57.000 They're like gods.

03:25:59.000 We can't even fathom the kind of technology they have available.

03:26:03.000 Well, we would imagine that if we keep going, we're going to hit that.

03:26:07.000 But maybe as well they don't have the capacity for self-destruction that the human being does.

03:26:11.000 Right.

03:26:11.000 Maybe they've engineered that out.

03:26:12.000 Maybe that's part of the feminization of males. 1.00

03:26:16.000 Maybe that's part of the—for real, maybe that's part of all this gender chaos. 1.00

03:26:21.000 That's part of the microplastics that are endocrine disruptors and pesticides and all sorts of other things that are fucking with people's reproductive systems. 0.73

03:26:30.000 Maybe it's like a natural, gradual change that the species must take in order to evolve to the next stage.

03:26:38.000 That it has to sacrifice its lust and anger and fury and all these chimpanzee instincts that are really associated with...

03:26:49.000 Dominant male hormones and primate behavior that we see in the jungle.

03:26:54.000 Yeah, but can we operate as a species without those?

03:26:58.000 I would argue that we can't.

03:27:00.000 We can with President AI. When President AI is elected...

03:27:04.000 Joe is telling you who to vote for everybody.

03:27:06.000 When President AI takes over...

03:27:09.000 Our benevolent overlord. 0.61

03:27:10.000 It'll make people eat credit cards every day so that your body will develop more microplastics and shrink your testes. 0.98

03:27:16.000 I don't know.

03:27:18.000 I wonder.

03:27:19.000 I wonder what's happening.

03:27:20.000 I think it's happening very quickly.

03:27:23.000 And it's hard because we're in the storm.

03:27:24.000 We're in the middle of a storm watching it.

03:27:26.000 But if you look at the amount of change that's taken place in human culture just over the past 20, 30 years, it's kind of unprecedented.

03:27:35.000 Since the emergence of the Internet, there's never been anything like this.

03:27:39.000 It feels like we're living in a culture which has hit the fast-forward button.

03:27:44.000 Mm-hmm.

03:27:44.000 And it's out of control.

03:27:46.000 Like we're on the rollercoaster ride.

03:27:47.000 We used to be going like this.

03:27:48.000 Click, click, [...

03:27:51.000 Now we're going like this.

03:27:53.000 Yeah!

03:27:54.000 And, you know, I don't know where it goes.

03:27:57.000 I think part of it is that we've got to fix the outrage machine that we've got, which is corporate media, social media, the way we communicate about things, about ideas.

03:28:08.000 Yeah.

03:28:08.000 This is why I have hope for new media.

03:28:10.000 We don't always get things right, of course, but it's an opportunity to change the conversation, to have more of this, to have more long-form stuff, to pursue the truth.

03:28:21.000 Whereas right now, the incentives, and Francis said it earlier, it's a phrase I repeat all the time, human beings respond to incentives.

03:28:27.000 And right now...

03:28:28.000 Being outraged and being outrageous is what's rewarded.

03:28:33.000 And being calm, being sensible, being reasonable, listening to other people, that isn't the thing that we've been doing for the last 20, 30 years.

03:28:40.000 We've been doing the opposite of that.

03:28:42.000 And I think we have to find a way to change the incentive structure of the internet whereby we're not incentivized to be our worst selves.

03:28:51.000 We've got to do that. 0.99

03:28:52.000 If we don't do that, we're going to destroy ourselves long before any fucking aliens get here, man. 0.99

03:28:56.000 And that's my worry, man. 0.99

03:28:57.000 To go back to your metaphor about the rollercoaster, we are on the...

03:29:00.000 But I'm going to be honest with you, mate.

03:29:02.000 I'm looking down, I'm like, is there a track?

03:29:06.000 No.

03:29:07.000 We've never experienced this before, right?

03:29:10.000 As far as we know, the human race has never experienced anything like this before.

03:29:14.000 This connectedness.

03:29:16.000 Strange.

03:29:17.000 Yeah.

03:29:17.000 But every informational revolution, I mean, people have always talked about this example of the printing press, right?

03:29:23.000 You have solely the church that controls all information.

03:29:26.000 Most people are literate.

03:29:27.000 And then you get the printing press, and you start spreading information to more people, and there's more perspectives.

03:29:32.000 And then you get two centuries of religious warfare.

03:29:37.000 You also get books about witches.

03:29:39.000 Do you know that was one of the first things that people did when they started using the printing press?

03:29:43.000 You think, oh, they're writing all these great books about philosophy and psychology.

03:29:47.000 Nope.

03:29:48.000 Nope.

03:29:48.000 How to spot a witch.

03:29:51.000 It's something that we can all get behind, man.

03:29:53.000 And it encourages our worst instincts and we'll be like, you know what?

03:29:56.000 All the problems in the society, it's their fault.

03:29:59.000 There's a lot of witch hunting going on right now, man.

03:30:02.000 There's a lot of witch hunting.

03:30:03.000 I mean, J.K. Rowling is a witch.

03:30:04.000 Like, how did that happen?

03:30:05.000 You know what I mean?

03:30:06.000 Like, she was this most progressive, cool, lefty person. 0.99

03:30:10.000 Says one thing about trans, boom, she's a Nazi. 1.00

03:30:14.000 How did that happen? 0.96

03:30:15.000 I don't know.

03:30:16.000 It's the Wild West out there, right? 0.99

03:30:18.000 And everyone just fucking went along with it. 0.99

03:30:20.000 Like, the mainstream media went along with it. 0.99

03:30:22.000 Controversial authorship.

03:30:23.000 What?

03:30:24.000 What?

03:30:24.000 I know.

03:30:25.000 Hitler never went, you know, I'm going to take over the world, I'm going to write some beloved children's books.

03:30:31.000 Yeah, it's someone violating the orthodoxy.

03:30:35.000 Yeah.

03:30:36.000 Yeah.

03:30:36.000 You know, and there was part of me who thought, okay, now she's come out, we're going to have a modicum of sanity.

03:30:42.000 That's what I genuinely thought when I was naive and more stupid. 0.97

03:30:46.000 Look, we should say we are actually making progress in the UK on that issue. 0.99

03:30:49.000 We really are.

03:30:50.000 On the trans issue, we're making progress.

03:30:52.000 You guys have shut down all those clinics, right?

03:30:54.000 We shut down the clinic and the rules and laws are starting to change and we're starting to be sensible.

03:30:59.000 So maybe the great hope is we kind of overreached and now we're reining it back in a little bit.

03:31:04.000 It's not the case here from what I can tell.

03:31:06.000 Doesn't seem to be the case here at all.

03:31:08.000 No, I mean, it's coming straight from the White House.

03:31:10.000 Yeah.

03:31:12.000 That's terrifying, man.

03:31:13.000 You know, it's so interesting.

03:31:15.000 Now that our show has become bigger and people recognize us, I get a lot of especially gay people coming up to me to talk to me, to thank me and us for what we do.

03:31:27.000 This young lady came up to me.

03:31:28.000 She was American.

03:31:29.000 She must be in her mid to late 20s.

03:31:32.000 And she was like, you know, if I was born 10 years younger, and she's a gay woman, she goes, I would have been screaming the house down at my parents. 1.00

03:31:42.000 I would have been demanding a double mastectomy. 1.00

03:31:45.000 I would have been demanding puberty blockers because I was so miserable and distressed and deeply unhappy at the fact that I was a gay girl. 0.95

03:31:53.000 Yeah, that's a lot of the way a lot of gay people feel about this whole movement that in some ways it's kind of homophobic because it's saying you're not gay. 0.90

03:32:01.000 You're just in the wrong body. 0.86

03:32:03.000 And so many of them are autistic as well.

03:32:05.000 This is what we are not taking into account quite often is And we've had lots of people on the show to talk about this.

03:32:11.000 A lot of these kids are autistic.

03:32:12.000 A lot of these people, particularly the girls, they would have had anorexia or bulimia before.

03:32:16.000 Before that, they would have had something else.

03:32:18.000 It's just a way of people showing distress about what it's like to be a young woman.

03:32:21.000 It's not exactly a great time to be a young woman when it comes to body image, when it comes to the perception and the reality of how men and women relate in our society and all of that, right?

03:32:34.000 And a lot of the young men, what's happening is they're being praised for this choice.

03:32:40.000 There's social credit to being, you know, identifying in a different way.

03:32:45.000 Yeah.

03:32:46.000 And it's really sad, man.

03:32:49.000 Because it affects everything.

03:32:50.000 I was doing a gig a few weeks ago, and there was a comic on The Bull, an older gay guy.

03:32:55.000 Like, you know, the classic look over the shoulder both ways.

03:32:57.000 And he sat down and started talking to me.

03:32:59.000 And this is a guy whose partners experienced the AIDS pandemic, saw a lot of his friends die.

03:33:05.000 His partner was basically given a flat near to the hospital because at that stage in the 80s and the 90s, it was like, look, you've got this virus, you're going to die.

03:33:15.000 So have a flat near to the hospital where you can get treatment.

03:33:19.000 And then when you die, at least you'll be comfortable.

03:33:21.000 And he looked at me and he was talking about everything that was going on, going to Pride marches. 0.99

03:33:26.000 He was like, it's a really bad time to be gay.

03:33:28.000 He went, I went to Manchester Pride and this woman got up on stage and she brought her six-year-old daughter with her, held her up to the crowd and went, this is my daughter, she's a little gay girl. 0.93

03:33:41.000 And the entire crowd cheered and he went, I was just there going, you're sexualizing your daughter? 0.99

03:33:47.000 What are you doing?

03:33:48.000 Right.

03:33:49.000 You're saying your six-year-old is attracted to women?

03:33:51.000 Yeah.

03:33:51.000 And then people are cheering and going, this is great.

03:33:54.000 And he's like, no, it's not.

03:33:56.000 You know, Brett said something to me when I had my son.

03:33:58.000 He said, congratulations, your heart is now outside of your body.

03:34:02.000 Ooh.

03:34:04.000 And that is, to me, the great hope on some of these issues is like people's love for their children is such a powerful force and it can be a force for good too.

03:34:13.000 And we've seen a lot of feminists stand up on this stuff in the UK and a lot of parents as well because you know what it's like and you're a father of girls, right? 0.99

03:34:22.000 It's now many people's, one of their greatest nightmares about what could happen to their children, you know?

03:34:28.000 Yeah.

03:34:30.000 And if your children get indoctrinated into something like this and make some change to their life that is permanent, and that people are encouraging them to do that pre-teen, you know?

03:34:43.000 It's crazy.

03:34:45.000 And it's something that we've always known that children don't have the ability to see the future.

03:34:51.000 That's why you don't allow them to get tattooed.

03:34:54.000 But with this, they're like, no, no, no, they know.

03:34:59.000 And the fact that it's become so party political here is, I think, why you're not making as much progress in America on this issue.

03:35:06.000 Because it's like, you're on the right, you're against.

03:35:07.000 You're on the left, you're for.

03:35:09.000 Why don't we just look at what is medically correct?

03:35:13.000 What is good?

03:35:13.000 What is bad?

03:35:14.000 What damages people?

03:35:15.000 What helps people? 0.99

03:35:16.000 Let's take some fucking time. 0.99

03:35:18.000 No, people don't even want to look at the side effects of some of these medications they're giving kids. 0.99

03:35:23.000 Because it's too painful, Joe.

03:35:25.000 They're sterilizing.

03:35:26.000 They are ruining their bodies permanently.

03:35:28.000 It reduces their life expectancy.

03:35:31.000 I mean, Chloe Cole and there's lots of other detransitioners. 1.00

03:35:34.000 You listen to their testimony.

03:35:35.000 The scary thing is the detransitioners get attacked.

03:35:38.000 Yeah.

03:35:38.000 They talk about their own personal experiences and the regret of transitioning and they get attacked.

03:35:43.000 Yeah, because they've somehow got internalised transphobia now.

03:35:48.000 I really hope that we just wake up from this.

03:35:53.000 That we wake up from this.

03:35:54.000 And that's the thing that's great about the UK is that we do have left-wing politicians like Rosie Duffield who have come out and spoken about this honestly.

03:36:03.000 And she is a hero.

03:36:04.000 She's an absolute hero because she has been called all manner of names by her own party.

03:36:09.000 She's been attacked, yet she has stood firm.

03:36:12.000 What a hero.

03:36:13.000 Well, I hope people wake up here too.

03:36:15.000 Yeah.

03:36:15.000 How do you think that happens?

03:36:17.000 I guess just talking about it.

03:36:19.000 I guess the discussion moving from being orthodoxy that you can't question to people seeing detransitioners, seeing problems that we know with children being malleable and easily influenced and seeing people that might just be a feminine man that might be gay and you're turning them into a woman and forcing them to get castrated and Yeah, 0.67

03:36:44.000 this idea that you're not a man if you don't like climbing trees and cutting down logs and all of this nonsense.

03:36:52.000 It's just so backwards.

03:36:54.000 I thought we'd overcome that.

03:36:55.000 I thought you could be a feminine guy who loved writing poetry and was more sensitive.

03:37:01.000 And that was great.

03:37:02.000 And that's just another type of man.

03:37:05.000 Yeah, it used to be.

03:37:08.000 Maybe it will be again.

03:37:09.000 Maybe it will be again.

03:37:10.000 Yeah.

03:37:11.000 Listen, guys.

03:37:12.000 It's always beautiful to talk to you.

03:37:14.000 I really appreciate you guys.

03:37:15.000 Brother, it's great to be back.

03:37:16.000 Thank you.

03:37:16.000 It's lovely, man.

03:37:17.000 Your show's awesome.

03:37:18.000 It's very good.

03:37:19.000 It keeps getting better.

03:37:20.000 Trigonometry.

03:37:21.000 It's on YouTube.

03:37:22.000 You guys get dinged on YouTube at all?

03:37:25.000 I don't think we do at the moment.

03:37:27.000 No, we get, you know, occasional episode demonetized, but we're kind of used to it at this point, you know.

03:37:32.000 No, we're loving it.

03:37:33.000 We've got, as I said, we've got new shows coming with different people.

03:37:36.000 We're going to expand and grow.

03:37:38.000 Beautiful.

03:37:38.000 And spread this message.

03:37:40.000 Yeah.

03:37:41.000 All right.

03:37:41.000 Well, thank you for being here.

03:37:42.000 Appreciate you guys.

03:37:43.000 Thanks for having us.

03:37:44.000 My pleasure.

03:37:44.000 All right.

03:37:44.000 Bye, everybody.

The Joe Rogan Experience - October 04, 2023

Joe Rogan Experience #2043 - Francis Foster & Konstantin Kisin

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