The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #216 - Chael Sonnen

00:00:03.000 Yes?

00:00:04.000 Yes!

00:00:05.000 The Joe Rogan Experience Podcast is brought to you by The Fleshlight, our first sponsor.

00:00:10.000 It's been so long. 0.99

00:00:12.000 It's the best thing to fuck, Joe. 1.00

00:00:13.000 Nowadays, I think I've come to a conclusion. 1.00

00:00:15.000 No more girls for you? 1.00

00:00:16.000 It's just not the best sex toy. 1.00

00:00:18.000 It's the best thing to fuck, period, I think. 1.00

00:00:20.000 Wow. 1.00

00:00:21.000 That's sad, dude.

00:00:22.000 Sorry to hear that. 0.83

00:00:23.000 If you go to JoeRogan.net and enter in the code name ROGAN, you can save yourself 15% off the number one sex toy for men. 0.59

00:00:30.000 Yeah.

00:00:31.000 Right?

00:00:31.000 It's number one still?

00:00:32.000 It's number one for everything, and it won't give you any drama.

00:00:35.000 It won't give you any life drama?

00:00:37.000 Nope.

00:00:37.000 Hmm.

00:00:39.000 All right.

00:00:39.000 We're also sponsored by Onnit.com.

00:00:41.000 That's O-N-N-I-T, makers of AlphaBrain, the cognitive enhancing supplement that I will be giving Chael Sonnen at the end of this interview, because I suspect he will enjoy it. 0.90

00:00:51.000 If you are interested in nootropics, I suggest just Google it.

00:00:54.000 Go to Google and type in the word nootropic, N-O-O-Tropic.

00:00:58.000 And what they are essentially is nutrients that enhance brain function.

00:01:02.000 And there's a lot of interesting studies on them, and there's a lot of controversy on them, so make up your own mind about it.

00:01:07.000 But if you're interested...

00:01:08.000 Please, do your homework first.

00:01:10.000 Then, once you've done that, if you're interested in AlphaBrain, the way we have it set up, I want to make sure that nobody ever feels ripped off.

00:01:16.000 If you order the first 30 pills and you don't like it, you don't even have to send it back.

00:01:21.000 You just say, this stuff sucks and you get a 100% money back guarantee.

00:01:24.000 That's because I want to... 0.70

00:01:25.000 It's much more important to me that people don't feel ripped off than it is to make money. 0.97

00:01:30.000 And all this shit is stuff that I've used before I ever endorsed it. 0.94

00:01:34.000 And it's all stuff that I've... 0.98

00:01:36.000 I've been using nootropics for a long time now.

00:01:39.000 And I'm a firm believer in vitamins and minerals.

00:01:42.000 And you can read up all about the various ingredients that are in AlphaBrain on Onnit.

00:01:47.000 That's O-N-N-I-T dot com. 1.00

00:01:49.000 And go check that out.

00:01:50.000 Enter in the code name ROGAN. Save yourself 10% off any and all orders.

00:01:53.000 Alright, you... 1.00

00:01:54.000 Dirty bitches. 1.00

00:01:55.000 Chell Sonnen is here. 1.00

00:01:56.000 We're gonna get down to business. 0.99

00:01:58.000 We got a goddamn American hero here, folks. 0.99

00:02:00.000 How about some respect? 1.00

00:02:02.000 The Joe Rogan Experience.

00:02:05.000 Train by day.

00:02:06.000 Joe Rogan Podcast by night.

00:02:07.000 All day. 0.98

00:02:10.000 You fucked up Rory's voice though, man. 0.95

00:02:13.000 All respect to Rory McDonald. 0.94

00:02:16.000 We need to get a better copy of that recording.

00:02:18.000 Yeah, we can get one.

00:02:19.000 I'll get one from the UFC. UFC pulled all the YouTube videos down within minutes.

00:02:24.000 Oh, did they really?

00:02:24.000 Yeah.

00:02:25.000 Well, ladies and gentlemen, what is your new book called?

00:02:28.000 Voice of Reason, your VIP pass into enlightenment.

00:02:31.000 Voice of Reason.

00:02:32.000 Voice of Reason, written by this guy.

00:02:34.000 Chael Sonnen, ladies and gentlemen.

00:02:36.000 You're here.

00:02:36.000 I'm here.

00:02:37.000 And by the way, on that commercial you just gave, that has got to be the single greatest guarantee in the history of fair trade.

00:02:43.000 You don't even have to send it back.

00:02:45.000 You just call.

00:02:46.000 It's your word.

00:02:46.000 You go, listen, man, this isn't working, and they refund it.

00:02:48.000 That's amazing.

00:02:49.000 We had to make it.

00:02:50.000 The first 30 pills, because the way we had it set up was, you know, any order.

00:02:54.000 You don't even have to send it back.

00:02:55.000 So then people start selling it on eBay.

00:02:57.000 Right.

00:02:57.000 Like, all right, well, you can't be that honest.

00:02:59.000 Yeah, it's like the IRS. It's basically, you're counting on honesty.

00:03:02.000 Yeah.

00:03:03.000 You're counting on, it's for oversight.

00:03:04.000 But I like that.

00:03:05.000 I mean, I can tell you from personal experience, I wouldn't do that.

00:03:07.000 I mean, if it didn't work, I wouldn't.

00:03:08.000 I wouldn't lie to keep a couple of pills.

00:03:10.000 I think, honestly, I like it.

00:03:12.000 That's awesome.

00:03:12.000 Well, I think if you have a product and you believe in it, you would want people to buy it more than once, especially if it's something like a vitamin supplement.

00:03:18.000 Sure.

00:03:18.000 So I'm just letting them know.

00:03:19.000 You're going to like it. 0.99

00:03:20.000 It fucking works. 0.98

00:03:21.000 It's a fascinating little... 0.99

00:03:23.000 You ever get into vitamins, nootropics, anything like that?

00:03:25.000 Yes, in college.

00:03:27.000 And I was sick all the time.

00:03:29.000 I was getting sick three times a month, even if it was for a day or something.

00:03:32.000 And my mom said, look, you've got to get started on multivitamin.

00:03:35.000 Do you think this is also because of wrestling?

00:03:37.000 I think so.

00:03:38.000 Yeah, you're kind of in a good Petri dish for sickness.

00:03:41.000 You're malnourished, you're overtrained, you're not getting enough sleep with all the road trips and different time zones.

00:03:46.000 Perfect Petri dish to get ill.

00:03:48.000 And I started on a multivitamin known as Centrum Complete, which has less nutrients than dog food.

00:03:54.000 That's what my doctor told me.

00:03:55.000 But it worked for me.

00:03:56.000 Those small nutrients made a big difference.

00:03:58.000 So when I realized...

00:04:00.000 Geez, I haven't been sick in a year.

00:04:02.000 Then I really started getting involved.

00:04:03.000 And now I want some really good stuff you can't even buy over the counter.

00:04:06.000 You've got to have a doctor order it.

00:04:07.000 It's called Usana.

00:04:08.000 It's very powerful.

00:04:10.000 You know, 4,000 milligrams of vitamin D. It goes on and on.

00:04:13.000 U-S-A-N-A. Usana.

00:04:16.000 Usana.

00:04:16.000 And it's a combination of...

00:04:19.000 Vitamins, what happened?

00:04:20.000 Yeah.

00:04:21.000 Something just happened?

00:04:22.000 Some short or something.

00:04:23.000 Quick blurb, I get it too, but we're back.

00:04:26.000 Combination of vitamins.

00:04:26.000 Combination of vitamins and minerals?

00:04:28.000 Yeah.

00:04:28.000 And you can't get it in a GNC or something like that?

00:04:31.000 You cannot, no.

00:04:32.000 And again, let me tell you...

00:04:35.000 Most vitamins are 10% effective, 90% marketing.

00:04:39.000 We all know that about nutrition, GNC type things.

00:04:41.000 The ones that really work are 10% marketing, 90% goes into the lab and making them.

00:04:48.000 Now that very statement I just gave you may in of itself be the marketing that the people have put out, I don't know, but that's what Usana is doing.

00:04:56.000 You can't buy it, you've got to order it.

00:04:57.000 They don't have enough to mass produce it because it's so potent and effective.

00:05:02.000 But I have had a number of doctors with extensive readings say, listen, this is the one.

00:05:07.000 So do you have to...

00:05:08.000 You don't have to have a prescription.

00:05:09.000 You can just order it from...

00:05:10.000 No, absolutely not.

00:05:11.000 Yeah, but you just got to have a doctor's office call up and, you know, an 800 number.

00:05:14.000 A doctor's office has to call up for you.

00:05:17.000 They got to call it in for you.

00:05:18.000 You know, that's something they tried to get going years back.

00:05:21.000 They tried to label vitamins as nutraceuticals and then they were going to have it so that you needed a prescription.

00:05:27.000 To get vitamins, which gets a little weird. 0.89

00:05:29.000 I would appreciate a little regulation so we know exactly what the fuck is in everything, because right now it's a little wild west when it comes to things like supplements. 0.88

00:05:38.000 But I just think that having to go to a doctor to get some vitamin D, I don't want that. 0.97

00:05:45.000 No, I hear you.

00:05:46.000 But that comes back to my point that it's, you know, 10% effective, 90% marketing.

00:05:50.000 You know, how many things at GNC are made in the same lab, but they're packaged different, and whoever can get the word out more.

00:05:56.000 And I can tell you, you know, I've tried everything at GNC on the off chance that something might work.

00:06:02.000 I begged my dad to take me there when I was 12 years old and whoever the most muscled up guy or whoever the most handsome guy, whatever it was that attracts you when you're vulnerable at that age, that's who I'm begging my dad to put 40 bucks down and buy me the protein drink for.

00:06:16.000 So I fall for it.

00:06:18.000 I mean, people always fall for it.

00:06:19.000 So, you know, yeah, they don't have oversight.

00:06:21.000 It's trial and error.

00:06:22.000 But what's not?

00:06:23.000 Yeah, yeah, what is it?

00:06:25.000 It is kind of crazy, but there were a few things that actually did work, but they got rid of them very quickly.

00:06:30.000 There was one called Mag-10.

00:06:32.000 They used to have to go into that little glass cabinet with the key to open it up.

00:06:37.000 You couldn't even get it out of the regular part.

00:06:39.000 It's like a video game, right. 0.74

00:06:40.000 Yeah, you had to let them know you wanted some porn. 0.96

00:06:42.000 I mean... 0.96

00:06:43.000 I mean, that's... 0.99

00:06:44.000 Your porn was testosterone pills. 1.00

00:06:47.000 And MAG10 was fucking real. 1.00

00:06:49.000 They got rid of it really quick. 0.99

00:06:51.000 You would take an absurd amount of pills.

00:06:53.000 I think it was like 10 pills.

00:06:54.000 There were these clear pills.

00:06:55.000 But you would take... 0.99

00:06:56.000 Who knows what kind of fucking damage it did to your liver. 1.00

00:06:59.000 But, oh my god, you'd feel like a fucking raging animal. 1.00

00:07:03.000 Oh, it worked. 0.99

00:07:04.000 Yeah, it worked for sure.

00:07:05.000 Okay, great.

00:07:05.000 It worked.

00:07:06.000 Wow.

00:07:06.000 Yeah, I gained a lot of muscle on it, man.

00:07:08.000 I gained like 10 pounds of muscle on it in like 8 weeks.

00:07:11.000 And it was legal.

00:07:12.000 You could buy it at GNC. You could do like 6 to 8 week cycles on it.

00:07:15.000 And it was such a steroid.

00:07:16.000 It was so obvious. 1.00

00:07:17.000 Because as soon as I got off it, my dick was just crazy. 1.00

00:07:20.000 My body would crash. 1.00

00:07:22.000 I was like, wow.

00:07:24.000 I was like, wow, this stuff, even though it's something you buy at GNC, essentially it's just like doing a steroid.

00:07:29.000 Sure.

00:07:30.000 So essentially they discovered something that the government hadn't had it yet and had it banned and they got it.

00:07:35.000 That's going on.

00:07:36.000 There's a drug out there right now.

00:07:37.000 I shouldn't call it a drug because it's not, but it's a natural product known as Kratom.

00:07:42.000 I don't know if you've heard about this, but it is absolutely an opiate.

00:07:45.000 It's absolutely a painkiller.

00:07:48.000 You know those drive-thru espresso places that they've got?

00:07:51.000 We've got a place like that in Oregon, and the guy sells Kratom, and he makes $150,000 a year, and it's completely legal.

00:07:58.000 The government has not caught on that this is a painkiller.

00:08:02.000 I mean, you get a high, you get a low, you got a crash.

00:08:04.000 I got a buddy that's coming off Of painkillers.

00:08:07.000 He got addicted to the Vicodin.

00:08:09.000 And what he's doing is he's going and buying this kratom for $10 a pill.

00:08:13.000 It costs him $50.

00:08:13.000 He buys five.

00:08:14.000 He goes every Sunday.

00:08:16.000 And when he shows up at 10 a.m., Joe, there's a line waiting for this stuff.

00:08:20.000 It's a drug, but it hasn't been found illegal yet.

00:08:22.000 And I'm saying that because the story you just told about being able to buy a steroid over-the-counter, people are going to think that's not believable.

00:08:28.000 That happens all the time.

00:08:29.000 The government just hasn't caught on yet.

00:08:31.000 And I don't know that they should.

00:08:33.000 Are they going to be able to?

00:08:35.000 When Balco came out with that clear stuff, that the clear was somehow or another undetectable, how many more of those are possibly out there?

00:08:47.000 How hard is it to do something like that?

00:08:49.000 Sure.

00:08:49.000 Well, I wouldn't know, but from what I'm told, and I read about this stuff all the time, is that if you simply get yourself a good chemist, he goes in, he changes one molecule, one element, and all of a sudden the strand is something else.

00:09:01.000 You got your banned list, you change one molecule, it doesn't fall into that category.

00:09:05.000 They're looking for things in that category, and they pass.

00:09:08.000 It's Olympic year, and we see this every Games where an entire country comes out looking different than every other athlete.

00:09:16.000 The whole country looks different.

00:09:18.000 You're like, okay, guys.

00:09:19.000 You all look that way.

00:09:21.000 This whole team has gotten this much stronger and more shredded and times have picked up and everything from track to pole vault to swim.

00:09:29.000 Everybody's better from your country. 1.00

00:09:31.000 What are you doing?

00:09:32.000 And ten years later you find out and it gets added to the banned list. 0.95

00:09:35.000 It gets really creepy when you start thinking about shit like cycling and you see all these dudes getting convicted and all these dudes turning on. 0.99

00:09:42.000 I had a friend who was a professional cycler and he told me everybody was on crazy shit. 1.00

00:09:47.000 He said they all are. 1.00

00:09:48.000 He said there's no way you can compete at that level.

00:09:50.000 Oh, you're talking cycling as the...

00:09:52.000 Professional cycling.

00:09:53.000 Sure, and I'm thinking you're talking about shooting up on and on.

00:09:57.000 Off of regulation.

00:09:58.000 Okay, so we're talking Lance Armstrong stuff.

00:10:00.000 I'm at Olympic cycling.

00:10:01.000 I'm with you. 0.99

00:10:02.000 Or any high-level cycling, Lance Armstrong-type Tour de France shit. 0.99

00:10:06.000 You almost have to be on something to compete. 0.96

00:10:10.000 It's getting really weird when it comes to those type of sports.

00:10:13.000 And what about when a guy gets caught, and so then instead of just going, yeah, listen, I've got to take my medicine, he's got to bring everybody else down.

00:10:13.000 Sure.

00:10:20.000 He becomes the tattletale.

00:10:22.000 Come on, what's happening here?

00:10:24.000 That's not the way it works.

00:10:25.000 You got brought down, you got caught, you've got to take your medicine.

00:10:28.000 By Jose Canseco's, that whole book and publishing and, you know, telling how it was really going down.

00:10:28.000 Yeah.

00:10:35.000 You know, I mean, that really cost him people's love.

00:10:38.000 Sure.

00:10:38.000 Like, for his whole life.

00:10:39.000 Yeah.

00:10:40.000 Like, that guy, if you ever read his Twitter, it's not comfortable.

00:10:43.000 Right.

00:10:43.000 I never have.

00:10:44.000 He's got some dark shit in there, you know, about what it was like when he had money. 0.99

00:10:44.000 Wow. 0.99

00:10:48.000 And now that he's got nothing, he knows what people are really like.

00:10:51.000 And, you know, it's pretty dark.

00:10:53.000 And in all, a lot of it, the hate that this guy gets emanates from the fact that he ratted out his friends.

00:10:57.000 Sure.

00:10:58.000 Sure.

00:10:58.000 Well, I think there's something to that.

00:11:00.000 You know, I really do.

00:11:00.000 I mean, even as a kid, nobody likes a tattletale.

00:11:03.000 Yeah, nobody likes a tattletale, even though he was telling the truth.

00:11:05.000 Yeah, that's the other thing.

00:11:07.000 I did see a lot of stuff that he did with his book, and I did find it to be pretty genuine.

00:11:11.000 I tended to believe him.

00:11:12.000 A lot of people go, oh, he's an admitted cheater.

00:11:14.000 How can you believe?

00:11:15.000 I think he's being pretty candid right now.

00:11:15.000 I was like, well...

00:11:17.000 Well, when we start seeing guys like Mark McGuire shrink down right after he's done playing, and then admit that he was on steroids, or you see Barry Bonds and how big he got, it's almost like, man, how much regulation do we really need of the human body?

00:11:17.000 I do believe him.

00:11:33.000 What the fuck is wrong with what Barry Bonds did? 0.98

00:11:37.000 He took something that made him stronger. 0.98

00:11:41.000 Shouldn't we be interested in stuff that makes you stronger and makes you healthier?

00:11:45.000 When you look at a guy like Barry Bonds, he looks like he was 30 years old.

00:11:48.000 He got better when he was older.

00:11:50.000 As a professional baseball player, that's amazing.

00:11:53.000 Shouldn't that be something that we would look into and say, that's a good thing? 0.98

00:11:57.000 Don't you want Roger Clemens to keep throwing fucking heat deep into his 40s? 0.97

00:12:01.000 Why would you want to stop that? 0.98

00:12:03.000 Sure, but don't mix the argument.

00:12:04.000 I mean, of course we love medicine and advancements, and that's wonderful.

00:12:09.000 But if you're talking about rules within a sport and you want to just keep it out for whatever reason, but if that is the decision that we're going to keep it out, well, then the guy can't bring it in and cheat and lie about it.

00:12:18.000 I think that was the debate.

00:12:19.000 But I hear what you're saying.

00:12:21.000 I mean, if it is making people healthier and better, then good for them, and by all means, we should advance knowledge and technology in that area.

00:12:28.000 But that doesn't mean that it's okay for a sport.

00:12:30.000 That's up to the governing bodies.

00:12:32.000 Right.

00:12:32.000 Well, I mean, that's what's going on in California.

00:12:33.000 They just recently ruled on testosterone replacement therapy and also medical marijuana.

00:12:43.000 And they ruled positive on both those things.

00:12:45.000 Sure.

00:12:47.000 Doing testosterone replacement, isn't that essentially the same thing?

00:12:50.000 That's essentially the same thing as doing human growth hormone or anything along those lines.

00:12:56.000 You're doing something to stop the aging process.

00:12:58.000 You're doing something to enhance the hormonal balance of your body.

00:13:02.000 Well, it's been deemed legal then, so it shouldn't be an issue, right?

00:13:07.000 Look, if it's legal or illegal is where it all comes into play.

00:13:10.000 You know, I can tell you, I went through this in California, and they're acting as though they just made it legal.

00:13:15.000 It's always been legal here.

00:13:15.000 That's not true.

00:13:17.000 Their commission just didn't always recognize it.

00:13:20.000 You know, I went through this in California.

00:13:21.000 So what was the official designation that they recently bestowed on it?

00:13:24.000 What did That they would allow a disclosure process.

00:13:28.000 Here, let me talk about myself because, you know, I was such an expert on this because I had to go through it.

00:13:33.000 I go out, I tell them I'm on testosterone.

00:13:35.000 I say, can I compete in your state while on testosterone?

00:13:37.000 That's what you got to do.

00:13:38.000 You got to get permission.

00:13:39.000 Yes, go ahead.

00:13:40.000 I take my test.

00:13:40.000 So I do it.

00:13:41.000 They come back and they say, hey, you're on testosterone.

00:13:43.000 Well, guys, you didn't need a urine test.

00:13:44.000 I told you that well in advance in writing, and you told me I could be on testosterone.

00:13:49.000 They go, well, we don't like this.

00:13:51.000 But you made the rules, and you told me I could do it.

00:13:54.000 So it just ended up in this really weird area where they said, okay, but you didn't disclose it properly.

00:13:59.000 And they started changing the argument.

00:14:00.000 It just got really weird to where we could never narrow them down.

00:14:03.000 So they finally have come to some resolution within their own body.

00:14:07.000 And, you know, in the state of California, I don't want to turn on and throw stones at them.

00:14:11.000 I want to be pretty diplomatic with them.

00:14:12.000 But look, they are not transparent.

00:14:15.000 And for you and I, two experts and authorities in this sport, to still not be completely clear on what their ruling was, I think speaks to their lack of transparency.

00:14:25.000 And if they don't want people to keep stubbing their toe and breaking rules, just make it clear so that we know what the rules are.

00:14:31.000 Seems like they're dipping their feet in the water to me.

00:14:33.000 They constantly do that so that they can then pull back out and go, that's not what we said.

00:14:37.000 Yeah, it seems weird.

00:14:39.000 Well, I mean, they're in a tough position, too.

00:14:40.000 It's a pretty thankless job to be the head of an athletic commission, and there's very few guys that do it and do it really well.

00:14:45.000 But, you know, it's not an easy job trying to figure out what's fair, trying to figure out what the playing field is, especially as science and medicine advances.

00:14:55.000 I like the idea of a guy like Roger Clemens being able to play baseball because he's taking human growth hormone and doing testosterone.

00:15:01.000 It doesn't bother me.

00:15:02.000 It really sucks that he can't actually just say that.

00:15:07.000 He can't just do that.

00:15:08.000 Especially in a sport like baseball where, I mean, how is it going to hurt somebody?

00:15:13.000 Even if he is enhanced, he's not going to hurt somebody.

00:15:18.000 That's where it gets weird like in MMA. The real question in MMA is if you really have something in your body that makes you hyperhuman, you have hyperhuman levels, which people can do if they use testosterone replacement or something else unethically.

00:15:35.000 Sure.

00:15:35.000 You know, I'll tell you, Joe, one thing I admire about you, you are oddly comfortable in your own skin.

00:15:39.000 You know, you have no problem admitting anything and being a real open book.

00:15:44.000 And so I think that's one reason why you can't relate to Roger Clemens is because, you know, you're like, look, this is who I am and this is what I do.

00:15:51.000 But that's a very rare trait.

00:15:52.000 You possess that, but not a lot of people do.

00:15:54.000 Everybody's got their secrets, not necessarily on this topic, but in other things of their life where they keep it private.

00:16:00.000 You're rare.

00:16:01.000 This is a weird thing where his sport does not allow you to do that to your body.

00:16:06.000 But I think it's a silly argument when you're looking at a guy who's an older man like he is.

00:16:11.000 How else do you expect him to be able to do that?

00:16:14.000 Do you know anything about how the body ages?

00:16:17.000 Because guess what?

00:16:17.000 At a certain point in time, his body doesn't recover enough anymore and he can't throw the heat.

00:16:21.000 But now he can.

00:16:22.000 He can because he takes this stuff.

00:16:24.000 Doesn't that mean it's good for you?

00:16:26.000 Isn't it good for him?

00:16:27.000 Shouldn't he be looking at it that way? 0.97

00:16:29.000 It's such a weird fucking narrow band of what is cheating? 0.97

00:16:34.000 What is legal? 0.99

00:16:36.000 What do we allow?

00:16:37.000 Well, it's going to be a certain point in time where they're going to start genetic engineering.

00:16:40.000 And what is everybody going to do? 0.99

00:16:43.000 There's going to be a fucking pill that turns you into Thor. 0.99

00:16:47.000 What are you going to do? 1.00

00:16:48.000 Are you going to not take it?

00:16:51.000 Why would you not want to be like a superhero? 0.99

00:16:53.000 If I could give you a pill and it lets you fucking fly through the air and become bulletproof, you wouldn't take it? 0.99

00:16:58.000 Of course you would take it! 0.99

00:16:59.000 It would be amazing!

00:17:00.000 No, I like your argument.

00:17:01.000 And again, it's Olympic year.

00:17:02.000 Olympics are my favorite sport.

00:17:03.000 I don't watch professional sports, but I love every four years when the games come around.

00:17:07.000 So you might hear me reference it a few times today.

00:17:09.000 But, you know, listen.

00:17:10.000 Athletes used to be done at 23 years old.

00:17:12.000 That was it.

00:17:13.000 I mean, 23 was it.

00:17:14.000 22, 21, that's usually.

00:17:14.000 If you made...

00:17:16.000 Now, you know, look at the last games in Beijing.

00:17:18.000 We had Derek Torres, who was 40 years old.

00:17:20.000 We're going to have 40-year-old athletes on our Olympic team this year vying for medals, and that's a tremendous compliment to medicine.

00:17:27.000 That's a tremendous compliment to technology and what we're discovering here in America and abroad.

00:17:33.000 And then not label it.

00:17:34.000 Don't label it as drugs or label it as cheating. 0.99

00:17:36.000 Look at the fucking advancement. 0.99

00:17:38.000 Sure. 0.99

00:17:39.000 Look at what's happened.

00:17:40.000 Sure.

00:17:40.000 Well, and it's real interesting, you know, because the only time you're in hot water is if it's a banned list.

00:17:45.000 But, you know, that's junk science and it changes constantly.

00:17:48.000 Things that weren't legal are legal, that are legal, aren't legal. 0.72

00:17:51.000 You know, a testosterone replacement.

00:17:52.000 Boy, that's just got such a bullseye on it. 0.50

00:17:55.000 But there's a number of performance enhancing agents that are perfectly legal.

00:18:00.000 And, you know, you've got to still be within your limits.

00:18:03.000 Caffeine comes to mind, as a matter of fact.

00:18:05.000 You know, you want your caffeine levels as high as you can get prior to competition, in my opinion.

00:18:10.000 You know, I can tell you, for my body, that's when I do my best.

00:18:13.000 But you've still got to be within the level.

00:18:14.000 And there's a lot of things like that.

00:18:16.000 It's like a cup of coffee?

00:18:16.000 What's the legal limit?

00:18:18.000 Essentially, you know, if you compare it to no-dose, which is something you can buy at a local convenience store, you can take two of them.

00:18:24.000 Is that how you do it?

00:18:25.000 Do you regulate it that way?

00:18:26.000 That's how I regulate it.

00:18:27.000 Just because there's no problems if you do that.

00:18:29.000 It stays in your system about four hours.

00:18:31.000 You'll be tested within that, but you're fine.

00:18:33.000 But coffee can vary wildly, right?

00:18:36.000 It absolutely can.

00:18:37.000 There's people that say, and they'll block you.

00:18:40.000 An athlete, a lot of fans don't know this.

00:18:41.000 When you go in the locker room, you cannot have anything other than a closed bottle of water.

00:18:45.000 They want to see you open it.

00:18:50.000 coffee and they'll bring you in there five hours before your fight. 0.76

00:18:52.000 You come in there with some kind of a drink.

00:18:53.000 You could have something that you don't know about.

00:18:56.000 Right.

00:18:56.000 But, you know, I mean, the caffeine is just one that I'm mentioning, but there's a number of performance enhancing things.

00:19:01.000 And if a guy takes the time and gets surrounded with the right people that look into that, because often it's overlooked, but, you know, supplements, diet, vitamins, as we talked about earlier, these are, there's a very important element.

00:19:12.000 And if a guy inundates himself and finds where his level should be and he's legal, then he's legal.

00:19:18.000 Good for him.

00:19:19.000 And so many people want to point a finger and say there's something wrong about it, but there's not.

00:19:23.000 And the science continually change continually. 0.98

00:19:26.000 It's junk science.

00:19:27.000 You can't get, you bring five doctors in here, Joe, you get five different opinions. 0.97

00:19:31.000 And you know what? 0.95

00:19:32.000 It's also assuming that nature is fair, which I think is ridiculous. 0.97

00:19:36.000 There are some people that have fucking incredible genetics, and there's some people that literally can't compete with them. 0.97

00:19:42.000 Absolutely. 0.98

00:19:42.000 They just physically can't compete with them. 0.98

00:19:44.000 We both know guys who have been non-athletes that have tried to wrestle, and they just couldn't do it.

00:19:50.000 There's guys that are born with freak bodies.

00:19:53.000 There's guys that are, without a doubt, they're gifted genetically.

00:19:58.000 I mean, that's not fair either.

00:20:00.000 Should we round people up by genetically what's their disposition?

00:20:06.000 If you really want to look at what's fair, it is not fair that you can get a guy like Jonah Hill.

00:20:16.000 Yeah.

00:20:16.000 Right.

00:20:16.000 And a guy like Melvin Manhoof.

00:20:19.000 Melvin Manhoof.

00:20:19.000 Sure.

00:20:20.000 John Jones.

00:20:20.000 Exactly.

00:20:21.000 There's no way you can tell me that those dudes have the same hand. 0.99

00:20:26.000 Someone got fucked. 0.99

00:20:26.000 Sure. 0.99

00:20:27.000 Yeah.

00:20:28.000 Yeah.

00:20:28.000 The guy that you want to win is whoever worked the hardest.

00:20:31.000 Sure.

00:20:31.000 Right.

00:20:31.000 Show the most dedication, has the best skills.

00:20:34.000 And that is a fallacy.

00:20:35.000 Some guys will be born with a better skill set than other guys will be able to learn over a lifetime.

00:20:42.000 You see it with speed.

00:20:42.000 They just are.

00:20:43.000 You see it with the ability to jump.

00:20:45.000 And it's just a natural thing.

00:20:46.000 There's some guys that will take testosterone and still have a lower level than a guy that was just gifted with it.

00:20:52.000 And you see it all the time.

00:20:53.000 I get your point.

00:20:54.000 Yeah, it's not a fair playing field.

00:20:56.000 The idea is that your mind can allow you to overcome the disparaging genetics.

00:21:02.000 Your mind and strategy is important, just as important as being physical. 0.99

00:21:07.000 But that's always assuming that big, strong people are dumb. 0.99

00:21:10.000 And guess what? 1.00

00:21:11.000 A lot of them aren't. 0.99

00:21:12.000 A lot of those big, strong, naturally gifted motherfuckers are also really quick. 1.00

00:21:16.000 And they think quick. 0.99

00:21:17.000 You know?

00:21:18.000 I mean, look, a guy like Mike Tyson, people would always talk about how Mike Tyson wasn't bright. 0.99

00:21:23.000 Mike Tyson was a fucking boxing historian. 0.96

00:21:26.000 And maybe he wasn't educated, but he figured out the best style for his body. 0.99

00:21:31.000 He figured out how to break a man down.

00:21:34.000 He figured out how to put up a pace. 0.99

00:21:36.000 That other guys just couldn't deal with, and if he could just punch faster than everybody else could, that no one could fuck with him? 1.00

00:21:42.000 He figured all that shit. 1.00

00:21:44.000 There's an intelligence to that. 1.00

00:21:46.000 To get excellent at anything requires an intelligence.

00:21:49.000 That's what's really scary about a genetically gifted guy.

00:21:53.000 Because they could easily be really smart.

00:21:54.000 Burt Sugar just touched on that same topic with Mike Tyson, and he said he is very smart.

00:21:59.000 He goes, I'm not saying he's intelligent.

00:22:00.000 I'm calling him smart.

00:22:01.000 He's very smart.

00:22:02.000 Now, I don't personally know what the distinction is that he was getting at.

00:22:05.000 I think it meant, you know, some of the bad decisions that Tyson made around town.

00:22:08.000 Have you seen Tyson, by the way, the show?

00:22:11.000 You know, he's doing this new show.

00:22:12.000 I heard it's amazing.

00:22:13.000 Do you know anything about it?

00:22:14.000 I've known nothing.

00:22:15.000 Oh, I got to tell you one story.

00:22:16.000 He gets up and tells stories.

00:22:17.000 Oh, I got to tell you one story.

00:22:18.000 So let me set the scene real fast.

00:22:19.000 Dana White went and saw this.

00:22:20.000 Dana got invited.

00:22:21.000 He and Mike are buddies.

00:22:22.000 So Dana, you know, he's backstage.

00:22:23.000 She's having a great time.

00:22:25.000 All it is, is Mike Tyson goes out, he's got a microphone, he tells stories of his life, and they've got a production.

00:22:30.000 So if he says, you know, Don King in a story, boom, Don King's face pops up behind him on a big movie screen.

00:22:35.000 So he's telling this story, and he brings up the Robin Givens era, where, you know, where he's beating Robin Givens, and he's doing these horrible things, and he's going, listen...

00:22:43.000 The one thing Robin never told anyone is that I was seeing her the whole time.

00:22:47.000 You know, the whole time we were still seeing each other.

00:22:49.000 Now, he didn't use the word seeing.

00:22:51.000 I'm sure you can fill in the blank, but he's seeing her the whole time.

00:22:54.000 So he says, you know, one morning at 1 a.m., I drive over to Robin Givens' house.

00:22:58.000 My mansion that I bought her that I'm not allowed to go to and I'm ringing the doorbell and this isn't all that uncommon because I do this a lot except today she doesn't come to the door.

00:23:06.000 So he says I'm walking around the house I'm looking in the windows about 15 minutes later I see her pulling up the driveway in a Bentley that I bought her that I'm not allowed to drive. 0.98

00:23:14.000 So she's driving my car she's coming to my mansion it's 1 in the morning she gets out of the car she brought someone home with her.

00:23:21.000 So she brought a guy home to see her into my mansion in my car that I'm not allowed to be at.

00:23:26.000 And when the guy gets out of the car, do you want to know who it is?

00:23:29.000 And on the screen, up pops Brad Pitt.

00:23:33.000 He was a waiter and she picked him up that night.

00:23:36.000 It's before he ever made it into the movies.

00:23:38.000 So Brad Pitt's sitting there going, hey man, hey buddy, I don't really know much about this.

00:23:45.000 I know who you are.

00:23:46.000 We were going to watch some TV, man. 0.99

00:23:50.000 And Mike Tyson says, I could kill you right now. 0.91

00:23:52.000 And nobody would. 0.98

00:23:53.000 And Tyson walked away.

00:23:55.000 He did the right thing.

00:23:56.000 He got in his car and he walked away.

00:23:57.000 But how great is that story?

00:23:59.000 That's a great story. 1.00

00:24:00.000 Holy shit, Brad Pitt. 1.00

00:24:03.000 Somewhere his production crew found an old picture of Brad Pitt. 0.99

00:24:07.000 Some of them are out there where he's in the chicken suit somewhere in LA trying to make it.

00:24:11.000 It was one of those old school pictures before he ever got his break.

00:24:15.000 Robin brought him home to Mike Tyson's house.

00:24:18.000 Terrifying that must have been.

00:24:19.000 Jesus Christ.

00:24:20.000 Hey man, let's be cool, man. 0.99

00:24:23.000 Isn't it crazy that someone can get married to someone, just marry someone really rich for a couple years and you can just get fucking paid. 0.99

00:24:32.000 You can just get fucking paid. 0.99

00:24:35.000 A girl can do that. 1.00

00:24:36.000 A girl can meet a guy like Mike Tyson, trick him, marry him, manipulate him, rope him in, ride it for a few years, and then just... 1.00

00:24:44.000 Reap the rewards.

00:24:46.000 Yeah, and in this era of reality TV, we all know when that's happening.

00:24:51.000 It's just the guy does, like, does Chris Humphrey really think he was in a real relationship?

00:24:55.000 I mean, God bless him.

00:24:56.000 I hate to see that he got his heart broke, but I'm watching it from my couch on a, you know, bi-weekly basis when the girlfriend's forcing me.

00:25:02.000 I'm like, Chris, this isn't an actual romance, man.

00:25:05.000 This isn't how this works.

00:25:06.000 Do you really think you're getting married to Kim here?

00:25:09.000 I think he thought it was real.

00:25:10.000 The whole rest of the world's going, you gotta be kidding me. 1.00

00:25:13.000 Well, he would say insulting shit to her that you should never take from a meat. 0.99

00:25:18.000 You know, he said something, and I was on a soup with Joel McHale. 1.00

00:25:24.000 That's his name?

00:25:24.000 Oh, yeah.

00:25:25.000 Talented guy, by the way.

00:25:25.000 Funny, funny dude.

00:25:26.000 Very funny guy.

00:25:27.000 And he's got this sketch they're doing about Kim Kardashian and Chris Humphries.

00:25:32.000 He said, why would you care?

00:25:35.000 You know, he said something there on the air, like, why would you care in a few years from now?

00:25:38.000 No one's going to care about you anymore anyway.

00:25:41.000 Yeah, and everybody clapped and we laughed and I cried, you know, fake for TV. But for real life, I look at it and I go, well, man, could you imagine saying that to your friend?

00:25:51.000 What a cunt move that would be to say to your friend. 1.00

00:25:53.000 If my friend said that to me, I'd be like, bitch, what the fuck am I doing hanging around with you? 1.00

00:25:57.000 I would cut that guy out of my life instantly. 1.00

00:26:00.000 Because I'm not capable of saying something like that to a friend. 0.96

00:26:03.000 It's accurate, but it's mean-spirited.

00:26:05.000 But it might not even be accurate. 0.98

00:26:06.000 Who the fuck would have figured out that she would be able to do what she's doing right now? 1.00

00:26:09.000 That girl's making $60 million whatever a year. 1.00

00:26:12.000 I mean, it's incredible.

00:26:13.000 What he's going to see that she's not going to be able to figure out how to ride the tide?

00:26:18.000 Maybe she can. 1.00

00:26:19.000 Maybe she can, stupid. 1.00

00:26:20.000 She already did. 1.00

00:26:21.000 Look what she did. 1.00

00:26:22.000 I mean, look, she's no genius. 0.98

00:26:24.000 But there is genius in what she's done.

00:26:26.000 There's genius in making a living by just being a person.

00:26:29.000 Yeah.

00:26:30.000 Oh, absolutely.

00:26:31.000 I mean, you see it all the time.

00:26:31.000 It's very rare.

00:26:33.000 America always has to have somebody.

00:26:34.000 It's usually some famous blonde. 1.00

00:26:36.000 She pulled it off as a brunette. 1.00

00:26:38.000 You know, she's usually your Pam Anderson, your Marilyn Monroe's. 1.00

00:26:41.000 Well, she also pulled it off with a fuck tape with a black dude. 1.00

00:26:44.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:26:45.000 Which is very powerful.

00:26:47.000 I've heard that.

00:26:47.000 Get out of here.

00:26:48.000 You've heard.

00:26:49.000 I don't know much about that.

00:26:50.000 Yeah, well, it's okay.

00:26:51.000 Speaking of, and it wasn't the gentleman involved, but Reggie Bush was at the last UFC. It was kind of cool to see him out there supporting him.

00:26:56.000 Reggie Bush has my car.

00:26:58.000 Right, the second?

00:26:59.000 He's literally in your car?

00:26:59.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:27:00.000 I sold my Barracuda and the owner that I sold it to, sold it to Reggie Bush.

00:27:05.000 Well, that sounds like that's his car.

00:27:07.000 You do know how a sale works.

00:27:08.000 Well, yes.

00:27:09.000 Well, it was my car, I should say.

00:27:11.000 I should have phrased it better.

00:27:12.000 I apologize.

00:27:13.000 You got me.

00:27:15.000 I had a 1970 Barracuda. 1.00

00:27:17.000 I wish him luck with that fucking thing. 0.99

00:27:18.000 Yeah, well, you need to be clear. 0.99

00:27:20.000 You've got a lot of tough guys as friends.

00:27:22.000 I mean, I see Reggie Bush rolling around in that car.

00:27:23.000 I'm going to go take it back in honor of you.

00:27:25.000 But now that I know, it's okay, it was a fair sale, and he's got the title.

00:27:29.000 Not only that, I didn't even change hands with him.

00:27:32.000 I didn't even change hands with him.

00:27:33.000 Yeah, he was dating Kim Kardashian.

00:27:36.000 I know this.

00:27:37.000 Why do I know this?

00:27:38.000 I know not who the president of Poland is.

00:27:41.000 I have no idea.

00:27:41.000 But yet I know who Kim Kardashian was dating before she married this other fellow.

00:27:46.000 Yeah.

00:27:46.000 And I'm doing my best to act like, oh, I barely watched that show.

00:27:49.000 But yeah, I knew it too.

00:27:50.000 I guess I should be ashamed as well.

00:27:52.000 Well, you are so good at promoting online and promoting in interviews.

00:27:57.000 Have you ever thought about doing some sort of a limited version of a reality show?

00:28:00.000 No.

00:28:01.000 Not too intrusive?

00:28:02.000 I appreciate the compliment.

00:28:04.000 No, I never have.

00:28:05.000 Reality TV is still pretty new, and to some generations, they don't know that.

00:28:10.000 I like it.

00:28:12.000 I'm a big fan, but I got asked to do The Ultimate Fighter, our reality show in our industry, and I just passed.

00:28:19.000 It just wasn't something I wanted to do.

00:28:20.000 You didn't want to coach?

00:28:21.000 I love coaching.

00:28:23.000 What I didn't want to do was go to Vegas for five weeks, and now, with the new format of live every Friday night on FX there, it's...

00:28:23.000 I coach a kid's team.

00:28:30.000 It's a 13-week process.

00:28:32.000 That's what Dominic and Uri are going through.

00:28:34.000 That's a long time.

00:28:35.000 It's a long time, you know, and it's the little thing.

00:28:37.000 You can lose chunks of your soul in that place.

00:28:39.000 For example, I have a dog.

00:28:41.000 I can't bring him.

00:28:41.000 Where am I going to put him in Vegas?

00:28:42.000 Is Dana going to get me a yard somewhere?

00:28:44.000 You know, that's kind of too much to ask of anybody.

00:28:46.000 I can't go 13 weeks without the little guy.

00:28:48.000 He'd forget who I was.

00:28:50.000 He's the smartest dog.

00:28:51.000 That's cute.

00:28:53.000 What kind of dog is it?

00:28:54.000 Oh, that's cute.

00:28:55.000 It is cute.

00:28:56.000 Please say poodle.

00:28:57.000 I love dogs, man.

00:28:58.000 He's a rescue dog.

00:28:59.000 He's a terrier.

00:29:00.000 He's a mix.

00:29:01.000 I actually don't know what completely he is.

00:29:04.000 How long have you had him?

00:29:05.000 He's a cute dog is what he is.

00:29:06.000 Three years.

00:29:07.000 So you wouldn't...

00:29:08.000 You could get a place.

00:29:09.000 You could rent a place with a yard.

00:29:10.000 I guarantee you.

00:29:11.000 Yeah.

00:29:11.000 No, you probably could.

00:29:12.000 There's probably some fancy schmancy high roller gambler type dude that would love to rent his house out to Chael Sonnen for a couple months.

00:29:18.000 All right, well...

00:29:19.000 Well, there you go.

00:29:20.000 Then maybe I will coach the reality show after all.

00:29:22.000 You've saved the day.

00:29:23.000 It would be fun to watch.

00:29:24.000 I'll tell you that.

00:29:25.000 Yeah, I appreciate that.

00:29:26.000 I think that show picks up.

00:29:29.000 The one problem I have with the show, because there is some reality TV I like.

00:29:33.000 For example, Big Brother I got pretty into.

00:29:35.000 There was this crazy guy in there named Will for one season.

00:29:37.000 If you ever watched it, I'm not seeing any nods.

00:29:40.000 I'm assuming nobody said it.

00:29:41.000 He was fantastic.

00:29:42.000 He was absolutely fantastic because he'd go into the darkroom and he would just tell the truth. 0.89

00:29:45.000 You know, I'm I'm going to tell this girl this and I'm going to stab her in the back on Friday and I'm not even going to clean up the bloody mess.

00:29:51.000 You know, he would say these crazy things and then he would do it and then he won the whole show.

00:29:55.000 At any rate, the problem the ultimate fighter is they put him in teams, but there is no team.

00:30:02.000 And so, you know, they'll go have a...

00:30:04.000 The team will do a fight.

00:30:05.000 And if your team wins, you need to win something.

00:30:08.000 You know, on The Apprentice with Donald Trump, if your team wins, boom, you get a night out of dinner.

00:30:12.000 You know, or whatever it is.

00:30:13.000 Or you get to go meet with this guy or you all get some money.

00:30:15.000 There's no team concept.

00:30:17.000 Why am I cheering for my opponent?

00:30:18.000 I want whoever the toughest guy is, whether he's on my team or their team, to lose.

00:30:23.000 And then I want the next toughest guy to lose.

00:30:25.000 I'm in this to win this for myself.

00:30:27.000 And it's really important that those guys start to get that.

00:30:31.000 And so they either need to do away with the team concept or they need to have a team reward.

00:30:34.000 So there's a reason you would cheer for one side or the other.

00:30:37.000 At this point, there's no point.

00:30:38.000 So they're just camaraderie for the sake of camaraderie now.

00:30:41.000 And then as the numbers dwindle down, all of a sudden, hey, you were on this guy's team, now you're over here, and they mix it up.

00:30:41.000 Right.

00:30:46.000 And I'm a supporter of our show.

00:30:47.000 The last thing I'm trying to do is put down the show.

00:30:50.000 But I mean, from a critical standpoint, I'd like to see a reason to cheer for a specific team, or just don't even put them in teams. 0.96

00:30:56.000 I think it's just fun because the guy who's the coach, especially this one right now that's going on with Uriah and Dominic Cruz, what I like about it is they're constantly talking shit to each other, and it's just another way to try to win.

00:31:06.000 It's another way to try to win with a team. 0.74

00:31:08.000 And people love to be a part of teams, man.

00:31:11.000 They like to pick team windows.

00:31:12.000 I'm on team Apple, and people love that.

00:31:15.000 I only get droids.

00:31:17.000 I like the droid platform.

00:31:19.000 People love to be on teams. 1.00

00:31:22.000 You say soccer, but I hear that ice cream sandwich is the shit. 1.00

00:31:24.000 Actually, I saw, have you seen the, what is that, the note? 1.00

00:31:26.000 Yeah, it's amazing.

00:31:27.000 How crazy, that thing is like this big.

00:31:29.000 I love it.

00:31:30.000 Are you going to urinate, Chael Sonnen?

00:31:32.000 Chael Sonnen is healthy. 1.00

00:31:33.000 That motherfucker drinks water. 1.00

00:31:36.000 I'm sure. 1.00

00:31:37.000 Mike Dolce, by the way, just texted me.

00:31:41.000 Go right down there to the left.

00:31:43.000 Mike Dolce, who's a fitness expert.

00:31:45.000 He was a former fighter and a professional bodybuilder, I think, at one point in time, or powerlifter, something like that.

00:31:51.000 Super smart dude when it comes to nutrition.

00:31:53.000 So he's going to come on the podcast and I'm going to have your diet straightened out, kid.

00:31:57.000 Mine?

00:31:58.000 Yeah, I need to address certain issues with you.

00:32:00.000 We're going to get you on all vegetables from now on and do some yoga. 0.93

00:32:05.000 I ate animals last night.

00:32:06.000 What'd you eat?

00:32:07.000 I had foie gras.

00:32:10.000 That's only for a couple more weeks in California.

00:32:13.000 I know, but this place I went to, it was called Animal, and I highly recommend it.

00:32:16.000 It's in Hollywood, and it's just...

00:32:18.000 It's every single crazy... 0.97

00:32:18.000 Animal. 0.97

00:32:20.000 They had veal brains.

00:32:21.000 Whoa. 0.99

00:32:22.000 They had, you know, pig...

00:32:24.000 Sliced pig head. 1.00

00:32:25.000 I don't even know what that is.

00:32:26.000 My uncle used to cook lamb brains.

00:32:29.000 He used to cook it on the grill.

00:32:31.000 What's Brains taste?

00:32:31.000 Ew.

00:32:32.000 It doesn't seem like a good idea to eat Brains, right?

00:32:34.000 It was okay.

00:32:34.000 It was really inexpensive.

00:32:37.000 It's like peasant food.

00:32:38.000 It was peasant food, and then slowly it became sort of chic, fascinating that you're eating organs and brains and stuff like that.

00:32:46.000 But it's not the best tasting stuff, but Fogwa is.

00:32:51.000 That's amazing.

00:32:51.000 You got me addicted to it right before it's about to get banned.

00:32:54.000 Yeah, I took Brian to this place, Noir, that's right down the street, and they have...

00:32:58.000 They have full guac there. 1.00

00:32:59.000 For only two more weeks, these motherfuckers, these silly bitches. 1.00

00:33:03.000 You silly liberals, what have you done? 1.00

00:33:05.000 You got rid of the best tasting food. 1.00

00:33:07.000 You're going to kill the duck. 0.99

00:33:08.000 Do you really care if someone overstuffs this duck before you kill it? 0.99

00:33:12.000 Did you even watch the videos?

00:33:13.000 You ever see them force feed a duck? 1.00

00:33:15.000 They take the duck, they stick its stupid head under this faucet, they pour some grain down its throat, and then they pull it off. 1.00

00:33:22.000 It takes five seconds. 1.00

00:33:23.000 And you think that that's terrible? 0.87

00:33:24.000 That's terrible to an animal that you're going to kill and eat? 0.65

00:33:27.000 Really?

00:33:28.000 It takes five, ten seconds.

00:33:29.000 It's not screaming in pain.

00:33:31.000 For a human, it would totally suck to have food shoved down your throat.

00:33:35.000 But they have a completely different capacity to absorb grains and stuff.

00:33:39.000 I mean, it makes their liver swell up.

00:33:41.000 It's not good for them.

00:33:43.000 But it makes delicious food.

00:33:44.000 Is there a humane way to do it?

00:33:46.000 That is a humane way to do it.

00:33:47.000 It takes five or ten seconds a day, if that.

00:33:50.000 It's really quick, man.

00:33:52.000 I've watched them do it. 0.98

00:33:54.000 It's ridiculous. 0.96

00:33:54.000 They take the thing. 0.96

00:33:56.000 This is what we do. 0.94

00:33:57.000 We grab them by the neck and you stick its mouth on it.

00:33:58.000 And they get sort of used to it after a while.

00:34:00.000 They just kind of like step there.

00:34:02.000 They pump grain down their throat and then they let them go.

00:34:05.000 And then they're done for the rest of the day.

00:34:06.000 They wander around. 1.00

00:34:07.000 Eventually they're going to fucking kill them. 1.00

00:34:08.000 I mean, that's why they raise them. 1.00

00:34:10.000 I mean, are we going to slowly regulate that away?

00:34:13.000 I mean, this is not real cruelty.

00:34:15.000 Veal to me is far more cruel and legal.

00:34:19.000 And I'm more attached to veal because it's a mammal. 0.99

00:34:22.000 I don't give a fuck about ducks. 0.98

00:34:24.000 You know, if you take a duck and you stick it in there and you fill it full of grain, I don't feel bad. 0.99

00:34:29.000 Ducks, I don't really like them.

00:34:31.000 I'm not like a fan of ducks.

00:34:32.000 I'm not a fan of any birds.

00:34:33.000 I don't really feel like any affection for birds.

00:34:36.000 But animals I do.

00:34:37.000 So we can do that for little baby cows and bend them up and feed them milk and keep them in the dark.

00:34:42.000 And they never get to move around.

00:34:44.000 Yeah, veal sad.

00:34:45.000 That's legal.

00:34:45.000 Veal's a tough thing.

00:34:46.000 And I really like veal.

00:34:48.000 But if you see how that's done, it is tough after that.

00:34:51.000 I want you to know.

00:34:51.000 I tend to agree with where you're at because I'm from the country.

00:34:54.000 I see this stuff all the time.

00:34:56.000 People are just trying to get by and support their families.

00:34:59.000 But I am surprised to see you take that stance.

00:35:02.000 I'm very impressed by that.

00:35:03.000 I didn't know you had an open mind.

00:35:04.000 I thought you were narrowed in.

00:35:05.000 I've misread you, Joe.

00:35:06.000 What did you think I was, like, narrow, like, hippie style?

00:35:09.000 Yeah, narrow, hippie style.

00:35:10.000 Yeah, very liberal.

00:35:11.000 No, I'm a Second Amendment.

00:35:11.000 You know, I heard that you moved to Colorado at one point, and I thought, well, what's Joe doing there?

00:35:15.000 That's a...

00:35:16.000 I don't really...

00:35:17.000 You know, that's where I really learned to not like hippies, when I lived in Boulder.

00:35:21.000 Sure.

00:35:22.000 That's when the reality of the hippie truly set in. 0.99

00:35:25.000 You know, it's like, if you're around hippies, at least seven out of ten of them are not going to have their shit together. 0.99

00:35:32.000 Sure. 0.99

00:35:33.000 Sure.

00:35:33.000 Seven out of ten of them are always going to need to borrow sugar.

00:35:36.000 Seven out of ten of them, their car breaks down, they need to borrow yours. 0.98

00:35:41.000 They just can't quite fucking get it together.

00:35:44.000 Well, you know, the eco movement's a tough movement because if you go all the way with that, if you go all in... 0.99

00:35:50.000 You gotta start killing people. 0.96

00:35:51.000 You're anti-human. 1.00

00:35:52.000 Yeah.

00:35:53.000 Right.

00:35:53.000 Because the human's the only thing that hurts the environment.

00:35:55.000 We're fucking the craziest parasite of all time. 1.00

00:35:57.000 Right. 1.00

00:35:57.000 We're sucking all the fish out of the ocean. 1.00

00:36:00.000 They say within like a hundred or something years, there'll be no more wild fish in the ocean.

00:36:03.000 I mean, it's incredible.

00:36:04.000 So we're sucking all this... 0.99

00:36:06.000 And then we're throwing all our trash in there. 0.98

00:36:08.000 So there's this gigantic...

00:36:09.000 Like, island of floating plastic as big as Texas in the middle of the Pacific.

00:36:14.000 And it gets bigger every day.

00:36:15.000 I mean, we're crazy. 0.73

00:36:16.000 If you look at us from, like, if you were an alien species and you were observing Earth, you'd be like, look at this one thing just fucking everything up. 0.96

00:36:24.000 Like, wow! 0.62

00:36:25.000 Yeah, for sure. 1.00

00:36:26.000 If you really wanted to go eco, you'd have to start killing people. 0.62

00:36:28.000 You'd have to shut down power.

00:36:30.000 Everybody gets a bike.

00:36:31.000 Either you take a bike there or that's it.

00:36:34.000 And hopefully you don't get stuck somewhere north. 1.00

00:36:37.000 You didn't build your stupid house somewhere where it fucking freezes in the winter. 1.00

00:36:40.000 Because if you did, well, guess what? 1.00

00:36:42.000 That's just where you are.

00:36:43.000 That's where you're going to be walking around now.

00:36:44.000 And I hope your food supply lasts.

00:36:46.000 I hope there's plenty of animals around you. 1.00

00:36:48.000 You've got to make sure you keep them coming because you don't have cars anymore, stupid. 1.00

00:36:51.000 Right. 1.00

00:36:52.000 Cars are bad for the environment.

00:36:53.000 Yeah.

00:36:53.000 I'm glad that you recognize that, though.

00:36:55.000 Because I hear this eco-freeco talk all the time.

00:36:58.000 It's like, you know, be real careful because...

00:37:00.000 You're anti-human.

00:37:01.000 If you want to go all the way with that, and most topics that you get passionate about, a guy that's willing to chain himself to a tree to stop construction, gets pretty wacko.

00:37:09.000 It's like, make sure what you recognize, you're turning on us.

00:37:12.000 You're choosing us over a plant.

00:37:13.000 Make sure that you at least acknowledge that. 0.99

00:37:17.000 Yeah, well, you know, my issue that I've always had with people who are not just vegetarians and vegans, but are really kind of aggressive about it in the way they fuck with you. 0.99

00:37:27.000 Sure. 0.95

00:37:27.000 You know, and they, you know, hey man, I just want you to reconsider. 0.95

00:37:30.000 I just want you to think about what you're doing. 1.00

00:37:33.000 You're killing life too, stupid. 1.00

00:37:35.000 I fucking love plants. 1.00

00:37:36.000 They're beautiful and gorgeous. 1.00

00:37:38.000 And you have to kill acres of them every year just to keep your stupid fucking fat face alive. 1.00

00:37:43.000 That's an animal. 1.00

00:37:45.000 That's a life form.

00:37:47.000 You're eating life.

00:37:48.000 You're eating plant life.

00:37:50.000 You can't get by without eating life.

00:37:52.000 Life eats life, period. 1.00

00:37:54.000 So shut the fuck up. 1.00

00:37:55.000 I got a chapter in my book on this very topic about cutting down trees, and it's like, listen, the older and bigger the tree, the better with me if you're going to cut it down. 1.00

00:38:04.000 You know, let it go, let it make some sunlight, and let a couple of new trees pop up.

00:38:08.000 That's the way that it works, and we use those trees, and we build our houses and paper, and it's an absolute necessity, but those are here for us, not the other way around.

00:38:17.000 And, you know, you hear these eco-frecos, you know, of course, they only come out when CNN or some local camera crew is there.

00:38:23.000 It's often about them, not about the environment, and that's where real frustration comes in.

00:38:28.000 But, no, I hear what you're saying, you know, in fact, we were talking about Kardashian a minute ago.

00:38:31.000 Somebody just recently threw flour or something on her over in England.

00:38:35.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:38:35.000 She's pressing charges.

00:38:36.000 You know, it's like, hey, there's other ways to do it.

00:38:38.000 You know, anything you do needs to be nonviolent.

00:38:41.000 If there's anything we learned from Gandhi or Martin Luther King, it's you don't come around using violence to get attention.

00:38:48.000 That's where the Unabomber went off course.

00:38:49.000 When people were spraying people's fur coats with red paint.

00:38:54.000 You know, I mean, come on, man.

00:38:54.000 Sure.

00:38:55.000 Now you assaulted someone and this very thing, one of the resources of that animal's body is now you fucked it up and ruined it. 0.99

00:39:05.000 And people quit listening to your argument. 0.97

00:39:07.000 Once you do that list, I'm out. 1.00

00:39:08.000 They listen to your argument and you have made that animal's death really kind of worthless now because they're going to have to throw this coat away because you spray painted it like a fucking asshole. 1.00

00:39:19.000 I mean, it's ridiculous. 1.00

00:39:20.000 Now they're going to have to go get another one to replace that one. 0.77

00:39:20.000 Interesting point. 0.77

00:39:23.000 So, right, the punishment becomes the crime. 1.00

00:39:25.000 Well, the whole thing is stupid. 1.00

00:39:25.000 I get it. 1.00

00:39:27.000 It's stupid to try to enforce your opinion so aggressively with pain. 1.00

00:39:31.000 You know, that's assault. 1.00

00:39:33.000 You're a fucking asshole. 1.00

00:39:34.000 You'd be an asshole no matter what side of the argument you were on. 1.00

00:39:36.000 Sure. 1.00

00:39:37.000 You picked a side and you went full asshole with that argument. 1.00

00:39:39.000 Well, you run out and try to assault Ted Nugent. 1.00

00:39:43.000 It's like that kind of shit. 1.00

00:39:44.000 It's like, oh, he likes to shoot animals. 1.00

00:39:46.000 Well, why don't you go down the fucking... 1.00

00:39:48.000 Go down to the butcher. 1.00

00:39:49.000 Go down to that place where a thousand cows a day have to stick their head into a metal trap and a fucking piston slams through their head. 1.00

00:39:57.000 Go after them. 1.00

00:39:58.000 What are you saying?

00:40:00.000 Are you saying that every animal that's ever lived should just live forever and take over the earth? 1.00

00:40:04.000 This is stupid. 1.00

00:40:06.000 You've got to eat some of them. 1.00

00:40:07.000 Well, it's the food chain.

00:40:08.000 It's natural selection.

00:40:09.000 There's no way around it. 1.00

00:40:10.000 And unless you want wild predators roaming around keeping the populations down, you're going to have to fucking kill them. 1.00

00:40:15.000 So few people understand that. 1.00

00:40:16.000 They don't understand how important hunting is for population control.

00:40:21.000 They don't get that.

00:40:21.000 They don't understand how important it is for traffic safety.

00:40:24.000 Sure.

00:40:24.000 People who don't live in rural areas don't...

00:40:26.000 I drove home once.

00:40:27.000 I had a gig in western Massachusetts, and I was living in New York, and you have to drive down...

00:40:32.000 I forget the name of the turnpike, but...

00:40:33.000 I had to go 20, 30 miles an hour because deer would just dart in front of the car, dart in front of the car.

00:40:39.000 I mean, it was an infestation.

00:40:41.000 I mean, I've never seen anything like it since.

00:40:43.000 I might have seen two, three hundred deer in a night driving down this road.

00:40:48.000 It was incredible.

00:40:49.000 Maybe I'm exaggerating.

00:40:50.000 Let's say 50 deer.

00:40:51.000 Let's say 20 deer.

00:40:52.000 If I saw 20 deer, I'd be shocked. 1.00

00:40:54.000 I saw a lot of fucking deer. 1.00

00:40:56.000 I saw them all over the place. 1.00

00:40:57.000 If you saw three deer, most people can't relate to that.

00:40:59.000 And that's where our votes come from, is the city.

00:41:02.000 You've got to listen to these folks in the country that are dealing with these actual things.

00:41:06.000 Those things can fuck your car up, man.

00:41:08.000 Real dangerous.

00:41:09.000 People die all the time. 1.00

00:41:10.000 There's a fucking wild video. 1.00

00:41:12.000 Recent one of a kid who's on a motorcycle. 1.00

00:41:14.000 He's going 80 plus miles an hour and he hits a deer.

00:41:17.000 And somehow or another, he hits it perfect dead on, so he doesn't even lose control of the bike.

00:41:21.000 He just...

00:41:22.000 Boom! 0.99

00:41:24.000 And he pulls his bike over, and his friend comes over.

00:41:27.000 He's like, dude, you could have died!

00:41:29.000 You could have died!

00:41:30.000 Did you just see what that...

00:41:31.000 He goes back, and the deer is just cut in half.

00:41:34.000 Literally, like, the deer exploded on impact.

00:41:36.000 That is amazing.

00:41:37.000 I have not seen...

00:41:38.000 That is absolutely amazing.

00:41:39.000 I'm glad the guy didn't die.

00:41:40.000 I thought that's what you were going to say.

00:41:41.000 No, the guy didn't even waver.

00:41:43.000 I mean, he didn't even lose control.

00:41:45.000 He never lost control of the bike.

00:41:45.000 It was like...

00:41:47.000 The bike was so narrow, just cut it in half like a saw, you're saying, basically.

00:41:49.000 Yeah, basically. 0.99

00:41:50.000 At 80 fucking miles an hour. 0.99

00:41:53.000 The one time speeding saves a motorcyclist in a wreck. 1.00

00:41:56.000 Yeah, no kidding, right?

00:41:58.000 That'd be interesting to talk to a physicist.

00:42:00.000 If he was slowed down, what would have happened?

00:42:03.000 Would have he not cut it in half?

00:42:04.000 It would have been him.

00:42:04.000 I don't know.

00:42:05.000 Well, because, yeah, it's like 80 miles an hour.

00:42:07.000 It's like a bullet.

00:42:08.000 You know, just bang!

00:42:09.000 To run right into that.

00:42:11.000 Which is probably just exploded.

00:42:13.000 Well... 0.63

00:42:14.000 But the kid lived, and there was another video of a guy, and it's another helmet cam, same thing, and another one where a guy on a motorcycle hits a deer, but he loses the bike, and he was wearing full leathers with pads, like racing shit, where they have those really hard plates in the body, and he got up and he was fine, and he was telling people, look, this is the reason why you need to wear all this shit, because something like this can happen, and this just saved my life. 0.77

00:42:40.000 Sure. 0.52

00:42:42.000 Oh, that's the video.

00:42:43.000 It's about 30 seconds in when he hits the deer.

00:42:46.000 Oh, wow.

00:42:48.000 See that?

00:42:49.000 That was it.

00:42:50.000 No.

00:42:50.000 Oh, you're kidding me.

00:42:51.000 Back it up a little.

00:42:52.000 Wow, he does keep control of that bike. 0.99

00:42:54.000 Yeah, well, he's a good fucking rider, too. 0.99

00:42:56.000 You can totally tell. 0.99

00:42:57.000 Because he didn't lose it at all. 1.00

00:43:00.000 He's a bad motherfucker. 1.00

00:43:01.000 Because when that deer hits him, he has a little jiggly moment. 1.00

00:43:03.000 See that?

00:43:04.000 See that? 0.99

00:43:06.000 Little jiggly moment, going 80 fucking miles an hour, he hits a deer. 1.00

00:43:10.000 That guy's a bad motherfucker. 1.00

00:43:11.000 Is this a YouTube sensation? 1.00

00:43:11.000 I mean, did this go viral? 1.00

00:43:13.000 Do people probably know what we're talking about here?

00:43:14.000 Yeah, a lot of people know about this.

00:43:16.000 I got a bunch of tweets about it.

00:43:18.000 And so then his friend comes running over, and they go back to see it, and it's just splattered.

00:43:21.000 Well, I sure am glad that guy's okay.

00:43:23.000 That would not have been pleasant.

00:43:25.000 I love bikes, but I can't do that. 0.99

00:43:27.000 I can't fuck with crashing. 0.99

00:43:29.000 No. 0.99

00:43:30.000 You know, there's something about riding on something that you have to balance.

00:43:33.000 No.

00:43:33.000 Are you a rider?

00:43:33.000 Do you have a bike?

00:43:34.000 Ooh, see that?

00:43:35.000 Do you see the deer?

00:43:35.000 I took my safety lessons, and I was ready to get a bike, and I saw one accident, and two friends saw two other accidents in the course of three days involving a bike.

00:43:47.000 Wow. 0.93

00:43:48.000 Yeah, one of them, someone like on a phone hit a car or hit a bike, just fucking nailed it, wasn't even paying attention. 0.98

00:43:54.000 Guy goes flying off the bike. 0.89

00:43:56.000 Another one, a friend of mine was riding through the canyons. 0.87

00:43:58.000 He hit some salt or some gravel or whatever the fuck it was, lost his bike, ripped his shoulder apart.

00:44:04.000 And then it was actually right around the same time that Frank Mir got hit too, when Frank got hit by a car and broke his femur. 0.61

00:44:10.000 He was like on his honeymoon, I think.

00:44:12.000 Wasn't Frank on his honeymoon?

00:44:13.000 He was definitely on vacation.

00:44:14.000 I know he's on vacation.

00:44:16.000 I thought he was on his honeymoon.

00:44:17.000 I'm pretty sure it was in Vegas that it actually happened.

00:44:19.000 I thought it was overseas, like the Bahamas.

00:44:22.000 I might just be adding that element.

00:44:24.000 I used to be a historian, Joe.

00:44:25.000 You used to not need to consult an internet if you had me around.

00:44:28.000 And now there's been so many shows I've lost track.

00:44:31.000 You're thinking about Tito Ortiz.

00:44:32.000 Tito Ortiz was in Jamaica, and he got hit by a bus.

00:44:37.000 Yeah.

00:44:37.000 Him and his wife were on vacation.

00:44:38.000 I thought that's what happened to Frank.

00:44:39.000 I thought Frank was hit by a bus on a motorcycle.

00:44:42.000 No, no, no.

00:44:42.000 Tito and his, I think it was his wife, they were hit by a bus.

00:44:48.000 I think he was on like a moped or some shit like that. 0.97

00:44:51.000 I thought that was Frank. 0.93

00:44:52.000 Combine the stories.

00:44:52.000 His wife was hurt.

00:44:54.000 That happens, man.

00:44:55.000 There's only so much data holding your brain.

00:44:58.000 After a while, those stories get a little squirrely.

00:45:00.000 Frank was hit, I think, right in Vegas. 0.98

00:45:03.000 And some guy just fucking ran a red light and slammed right into him. 0.93

00:45:07.000 Broke his thigh, sent him flying through the air. 0.98

00:45:11.000 And it took a long time for him to come back.

00:45:13.000 You know, he's a really impressive case of a comeback.

00:45:16.000 Yeah.

00:45:16.000 You know, he's gone.

00:45:17.000 Well, because it didn't go real smooth.

00:45:19.000 It didn't go smooth at all.

00:45:20.000 You look at, like, the Brandon Vera fight, the Petipano fight, you know, it's like, wow, like, what happened to the, you know, the former champ?

00:45:26.000 Right.

00:45:26.000 You know, what happened to the dynamic Frank Mir that burst onto the scene, you know?

00:45:31.000 The one that beat Pete Williams with that crazy arm bar for the guard.

00:45:34.000 I remember.

00:45:35.000 You know, Frank Mayer was a beast.

00:45:36.000 And so that set him back, man.

00:45:38.000 That was a pretty grueling injury.

00:45:40.000 He's one of my favorite guys.

00:45:40.000 Yeah.

00:45:41.000 I really like him.

00:45:42.000 Very smart guy.

00:45:43.000 I enjoy Frank a lot.

00:45:44.000 His wife's real nice. 0.99

00:45:45.000 You know, he's a local Vegas guy.

00:45:47.000 He's a great commentator, too.

00:45:48.000 Second Amendment guy.

00:45:49.000 He's a very good commentator.

00:45:50.000 Very much a Second Amendment guy.

00:45:51.000 He commentates better than the interviews that he cuts.

00:45:54.000 Sometimes he does an interview and people are turned off by him.

00:45:57.000 They think he's putting out an attitude.

00:45:59.000 I don't see it, but I read and hear about these things.

00:46:01.000 But he doesn't do any of that.

00:46:02.000 He's a totally different persona when he's commentating.

00:46:05.000 And I like that.

00:46:06.000 If he doesn't see it, he doesn't say it.

00:46:08.000 He's pretty fair.

00:46:09.000 He's a smart dude.

00:46:10.000 He's a very smart dude.

00:46:11.000 He has a kindle with him all the time.

00:46:13.000 Guy's constantly reading.

00:46:14.000 I've had some really heavy conversations with Frank Mayer.

00:46:17.000 And that's why he's so good at Jiu Jitsu. 0.99

00:46:20.000 He's got so much technique too because he's like an encyclopedia for shit. 0.98

00:46:23.000 The fact that he caught Noguera in that Kimura and broke his arm, the Jiu Jitsu world just exploded when that happened. 0.98

00:46:30.000 Frank Mir, not only did he, he did it when Noguera instigated the ground game because he had Frank Mir hurt and he wanted to finish him off. 0.99

00:46:38.000 And that just shows you what a bad motherfucker Frank Mir is. 0.98

00:46:40.000 That's crazy that he bested Noguera on the ground and finished him. 0.99

00:46:44.000 While dizzy.

00:46:45.000 While dizzy.

00:46:46.000 I mean, if that guy's not underrated... 0.99

00:46:49.000 Damn! 0.99

00:46:50.000 That's really fucking impressive. 1.00

00:46:51.000 Oh, he's got his positions for sure. 0.98

00:46:53.000 You know, I was cheering for Frank in that fight.

00:46:54.000 I was happy to see him win, you know, as a fan.

00:46:56.000 But I took no pleasure in seeing Noguera injured at all.

00:46:59.000 Not like that.

00:47:00.000 That was a rough one.

00:47:01.000 That was a really hard one to watch.

00:47:02.000 But Noguera's back.

00:47:03.000 Somebody told me Noguera's booked for a card coming up.

00:47:06.000 He's booked for a card coming up against Czech Congo.

00:47:08.000 Yeah, against Czech Congo. 0.66

00:47:09.000 So he shook it off, you know, against Noguera.

00:47:11.000 I don't care.

00:47:11.000 Yeah, I don't know how.

00:47:12.000 Wow, that's amazing, isn't it? 0.99

00:47:13.000 I mean, how the fuck did... 0.99

00:47:15.000 I don't know what they did. 0.99

00:47:16.000 They used plates or what.

00:47:17.000 I don't know how they put it back together again.

00:47:19.000 Yeah, that was fast, but good for them.

00:47:21.000 And Muir, he's going to go fight for the world title against Dos Santos, who I will never underestimate again.

00:47:26.000 I thought Dos Santos was dead in the water with Velasquez.

00:47:29.000 I thought it was a waste of a fight.

00:47:30.000 I couldn't believe...

00:47:31.000 I will never underestimate Dos Santos again.

00:47:34.000 He can throw heat, man.

00:47:35.000 He can throw heat.

00:47:36.000 You know, and I was really looking forward to him against Alistair.

00:47:39.000 Alistair and him would have been a very interesting fight, man.

00:47:42.000 Because Alistair is such a pure stand-up guy.

00:47:45.000 And Alistair is so good at incorporating leg kicks and knees.

00:47:50.000 He's got a real tight guard, especially now that he's so big.

00:47:53.000 He kind of like punches everything over, protects himself well.

00:47:57.000 He's a dangerous guy to anybody that has to enforce a stand-up strategy.

00:48:01.000 If you want to just go and box with that guy, he's got so many other tools other than just boxing.

00:48:06.000 And he's so technical with his attacks.

00:48:09.000 It's just, it sucks that he, you know, whatever his issue was, you know, he's saying I think that he got some medication that, you know, some doctor gave him that had testosterone and he didn't realize it and it fucked up his testosterone, the epitestosterone. 0.64

00:48:22.000 I don't know what happened.

00:48:23.000 I don't know the story behind it, but I guess he's suspended for like nine months now.

00:48:27.000 Something along those lines.

00:48:28.000 Well, that was interesting.

00:48:29.000 That whole case was interesting.

00:48:30.000 Yeah, let's jump off that topic as quick as we can.

00:48:32.000 But one thing about that, he took a substance test.

00:48:35.000 He took four.

00:48:36.000 Two of them were surprise tests.

00:48:37.000 No substance was ever found.

00:48:39.000 And he came forward later and kind of volunteered, hey, it looks like I might have taken some testosterone.

00:48:43.000 But that wasn't what the test showed.

00:48:45.000 The test didn't show anything.

00:48:46.000 It just said, hey, there's something with your TD ratio.

00:48:48.000 Let's try to figure out why this happened.

00:48:50.000 The media really got that wrong.

00:48:52.000 Well, here's what you've got to understand, Joe.

00:48:54.000 And I'm really glad you asked this.

00:48:56.000 Here's your T and E. Okay, here's your T and here's your E. So they're very close to epitestosterone.

00:49:00.000 And they're very close.

00:49:02.000 You know, they're usually even, one-to-one.

00:49:05.000 Some commissions allow a four-to-one or even a six-to-one difference.

00:49:08.000 But the reality is most are one-to-one.

00:49:10.000 Now, if your testosterone went up or if it went down...

00:49:16.000 That gap is your ratio.

00:49:18.000 With the same set, if your epi testosterone went up or went down, that gap is your ratio.

00:49:25.000 That's why it's a very disingenuous test.

00:49:27.000 So when a guy has a T to E that's elevated, the media immediately assumed that he took T. His T could have been in the gutter, his epi was at the norm, and he could have been unhealthily low.

00:49:40.000 Really?

00:49:41.000 There's no distinction?

00:49:43.000 It's extremely disingenuous.

00:49:45.000 You will never find an endocrinologist, not one in this country.

00:49:48.000 This is a challenge.

00:49:49.000 You won't find one.

00:49:51.000 No matter how disgruntled, you won't find one to come on and tell you that it's anything other than a disingenuous test for testosterone.

00:49:59.000 And these commissions are missing this left and right.

00:50:01.000 Really?

00:50:02.000 And it's absolutely horrible.

00:50:03.000 In some commissions, they give you just enough rope to hang yourself.

00:50:06.000 They say, listen, you're allowed.

00:50:07.000 Go ahead, take testosterone. 0.75

00:50:09.000 But make sure you're within the levels.

00:50:10.000 No, wait a minute.

00:50:11.000 That's not how it works.

00:50:13.000 There's a testosterone level.

00:50:14.000 You need to figure it out through taking blood.

00:50:16.000 Well, we can't afford that.

00:50:18.000 Well, you can't tell a guy he can take testosterone, but he can't elevate his T to E. So it's a financial issue as far as the accuracy of testing?

00:50:25.000 You have to understand this.

00:50:26.000 Alistair was 14 to 1. A guy could be 100 to 1 and still be within the legal limits.

00:50:34.000 A T to E ratio does not pertain to anything, and you won't find one expert.

00:50:39.000 Now, I didn't say a doctor.

00:50:40.000 I said an endocrinologist, not one expert, to tell you differently.

00:50:40.000 I didn't say a doctor.

00:50:44.000 Really? 0.99

00:50:45.000 It's absolute junk science. 0.98

00:50:47.000 And it's only urine recognition that does this? 0.98

00:50:50.000 Yeah.

00:50:50.000 It's where they look for it?

00:50:51.000 Yeah, it throws off your T to E. Well, his T could have been up, his T could have been down.

00:50:55.000 His E could have been down.

00:50:56.000 But listen, a guy has every right to manipulate his testosterone.

00:51:00.000 Every right.

00:51:01.000 The question is, how did he manipulate it?

00:51:03.000 Did he use a legal substance or an illegal substance?

00:51:06.000 And Alliser's test, four of them, two that were surprised, showed no substance was found.

00:51:13.000 Now, I understand if you and I's format right here, we're just two guys talking.

00:51:18.000 We can share our opinion.

00:51:19.000 But if you're a media member, if you sit behind a desk, you wear the suit, you collect a paycheck at the end of the night, you're branded an analyst by your affiliated network, you can't come out and say that he took testosterone when the test didn't show that.

00:51:31.000 He was never even accused of that.

00:51:33.000 And, you know, from Mark Cuban's tax write-off that nobody watches, those guys couldn't have missed the boat anymore.

00:51:38.000 They took pleasure in coming out and outing him for something that the commission never accused him of.

00:51:43.000 ESPN missed the boat.

00:51:44.000 Everybody got this wrong, and they were quick to say that, oh, he's taking testosterone.

00:51:48.000 Well, not according to the test.

00:51:49.000 In HDNet, I don't think it was anyone other than Boss.

00:51:53.000 Boss was pretty sure that he'd taken something.

00:51:57.000 And he's got his own thing, you know, Boss, with Golden Glories.

00:52:01.000 He's very loyal to Golden Glory, which I really admire with him.

00:52:04.000 But man, don't let that cross over. 1.00

00:52:06.000 If you're behind that desk, you've got to tell the story the way it happened, and they didn't.

00:52:11.000 It's hard, you know.

00:52:12.000 It's hard.

00:52:13.000 I've done commentary before for friends, and they didn't like what I said, you know, and they got mad at me.

00:52:19.000 And I would go, listen, man, I have to say what I see.

00:52:22.000 And if I see you're doing something, and then you get caught doing that, it's because I have to say it.

00:52:27.000 I have to tell people what to look for.

00:52:30.000 That's what commentary is.

00:52:31.000 I can't pretend that something different is happening so that you feel better about it when you listen to it, but then the million people who hear it are not getting an accurate account of what's going on.

00:52:40.000 That's...

00:52:41.000 We had this conversation, Joe, in a bar, you and I, in Boston, and you told me a line, and I've stolen it.

00:52:47.000 I've used it all the time because it's very accurate, where you simply said, if you don't see it, you can't say it.

00:52:52.000 You can't go out trying to hype a fight and go, this guy's stand-up looks great, if it doesn't.

00:52:57.000 If his stand-up looks shoddy, well, then his stand-up looks shoddy.

00:52:59.000 It's not your job to try to cover for him as an analyst.

00:53:02.000 And I've taken that with me.

00:53:04.000 And now I'm behind a desk in the suit.

00:53:06.000 And I took that one line, and I've educated other people to just simply with that one line, if you don't see it, don't say it.

00:53:13.000 Yeah, you have to let people know what your real opinion of it is while being respectful.

00:53:18.000 And that's where people don't understand.

00:53:20.000 If I'm accurate about something, it's not disrespectful.

00:53:23.000 It's just uncomfortable.

00:53:25.000 It might be uncomfortable for you, but to label it disrespectful, you're not saying...

00:53:30.000 I'm not saying there's anything wrong with you as a human.

00:53:33.000 I'm saying you might do a technique wrong.

00:53:35.000 You might have an opening.

00:53:38.000 It's not a disrespectful thing, but to a lot of fighters, your entire identity is wrapped up in what you do.

00:53:47.000 But you owe that to the viewer.

00:53:49.000 That's who's paying to hear you, not the fighter.

00:53:52.000 I can tell you, I thought I beat Michael Bisping.

00:53:55.000 I thought it was pretty clear.

00:53:56.000 You had a different opinion, and I never sent you a text or was upset with it.

00:53:56.000 It's very close.

00:54:00.000 You have your opinion, and when you're on the mic, it's your job to share that opinion.

00:54:05.000 You know, my opinion, but I should clarify that, my opinion actually changed when I watched it again.

00:54:10.000 When I watched it again, I thought your takedowns would have won it.

00:54:15.000 Yeah, I appreciate it.

00:54:15.000 You know, I had it the same way, and I'm pretty objective.

00:54:17.000 I'm not afraid to go, look, I pulled one out.

00:54:19.000 It's hard, though, when you're watching it live.

00:54:21.000 You know, quite honestly, I honestly get a better view of fights a lot of times from watching it at home. 0.96

00:54:26.000 The experience of watching it on pay-per-view is fucking great. 0.55

00:54:29.000 I mean, they always get to the right angle immediately. 0.94

00:54:32.000 It's never like, you know, sometimes I'll look up, and, you know, Herb Dean's right in front of me.

00:54:36.000 I can't see what's going on, or someone's in a post.

00:54:38.000 I don't know what's going on in the box.

00:54:40.000 Like when Alan Belcher and Husamar Paul Harris went at it.

00:54:44.000 When they first went to the ground, I didn't know that Belcher, he instigated that position from the shot.

00:54:52.000 He's the one who pulled him into that position, and I didn't realize it.

00:54:55.000 I thought that Paul Harris was diving on him, because I couldn't quite see what was going on.

00:54:59.000 So you do sometimes get a better view of a fight from watching it at home.

00:55:03.000 Sometimes you get hyped up in the moment, too.

00:55:05.000 It's hard to...

00:55:06.000 And off-topic, but speaking of Belcher, Dana gives a fight of the night.

00:55:11.000 Fight-er of the night easily was Alan Belcher.

00:55:15.000 You know, Pelhoris is scary.

00:55:17.000 He's flat-out scary.

00:55:18.000 Nobody wants to fight him because if it doesn't go well, you're going to sit out for six to eight months. 0.85

00:55:22.000 He's going to rip your legs apart.

00:55:23.000 Yeah, it can go really, really bad.

00:55:25.000 For the folks who don't know anything about the UFC or jiu-jitsu and you're just listening to this podcast, Paul Harris is one of the weirdest specialists in all of the UFC because his number one thing is ripping guys' knees apart.

00:55:39.000 It's terrifying.

00:55:40.000 Weird build, weird technique, hard to deal with.

00:55:42.000 Huge Hulk-looking dude.

00:55:43.000 Yeah, sure. 0.72

00:55:44.000 5'8 and just built like a brick shithouse and just dives on your leg and rips it apart. 0.97

00:55:49.000 Yeah. 0.57

00:55:50.000 The way he wins, people are screaming in agony.

00:55:50.000 Horrific.

00:55:53.000 Yeah.

00:55:54.000 And, you know, Alan, God, Alan did a great job.

00:55:56.000 Amazing!

00:55:57.000 I was happy for him.

00:55:57.000 And I'd like to see Pal Horace win, too, because, you know, of his backstory.

00:56:01.000 Everything he's overcoming, he's a great story, too.

00:56:03.000 Well, I'm a huge fan of technique.

00:56:05.000 It's good job.

00:56:06.000 Paul Horace's technique.

00:56:06.000 It's not just his physical strength.

00:56:08.000 His technique is masterful.

00:56:09.000 He laces up leg locks on guys.

00:56:11.000 The way he hit Masenzio, the way he laces them up, it's so pure.

00:56:15.000 There's no fat in that technique.

00:56:17.000 I'm a fan of that, but I'm also a fan of a guy like Alan Belcher who just figures out how to deal with it.

00:56:22.000 I love that.

00:56:23.000 I love that he just works specifically with guys like Dean Lister. 0.99

00:56:26.000 Instead of saying, we want to avoid this, he was like, fuck this. 0.99

00:56:29.000 I'll go to the ground with this guy. 1.00

00:56:30.000 I don't care. 0.98

00:56:31.000 I'll go to the ground with him.

00:56:32.000 I think he blew his mind by doing that. 0.53

00:56:33.000 He blew his mind.

00:56:35.000 He blew mine. 0.99

00:56:36.000 When he started going for the Twister, I was like, if he taps Paul Horace, this would be the craziest fucking thing I've ever seen. 0.97

00:56:41.000 Yeah, because he talked about that in his interviews leading up. 0.97

00:56:44.000 I'll put him in an ankle lock.

00:56:44.000 I'll go to the ground.

00:56:46.000 I was like, sure.

00:56:47.000 How many guys say?

00:56:47.000 And then he went out and did it.

00:56:49.000 I mean, he didn't go for the ankle lock, but he went out and did it.

00:56:51.000 He backed up what he said.

00:56:52.000 You know, Belcher's had moments where I watch him and go, you are amazing.

00:56:52.000 Good for Belcher.

00:56:56.000 Yeah, he's a great guy, too.

00:56:57.000 And on a bad night, he's still very good.

00:56:59.000 But on a good night, that guy's amazing.

00:57:01.000 Good for Belcher.

00:57:02.000 Yeah, and he's had some tough times, you know, with his detached retina he had for a while, which is very scary, you know?

00:57:08.000 Imagine, I mean, you're a professional fighter and you start to lose your vision because of fighting, so they have to repair your eyeball.

00:57:15.000 And then, you know, you have to have the confidence and the courage to go back out there.

00:57:18.000 The drive.

00:57:18.000 And keep throwing leather and letting people punch you in that surgically repaired eyeball.

00:57:23.000 So he was off for a long time.

00:57:25.000 I mean, you know how hard you have to work to make up that ground of those six months you lost and now you've got another four before.

00:57:30.000 You've got to work double time, triple time.

00:57:32.000 It's incredible.

00:57:33.000 Just to catch up?

00:57:34.000 How long does it take just to catch up?

00:57:35.000 So happy to see Belcher doing well.

00:57:37.000 Yeah, just to get back to where you were.

00:57:40.000 No improvement in technique, no improvement in conditioning, just to try to catch up.

00:57:45.000 How long, like, does it take to develop the win for a five-round fight?

00:57:49.000 To, like, for a real, like, your rematch with Anderson Silva that you're training for, how long are you in, like, Peak, ridiculous, hard training to gear up for a five-round fight.

00:58:00.000 You know, the answer I give is a lifetime.

00:58:03.000 It's a lifetime.

00:58:04.000 I worked so hard until I was 23 and finished wrestling to go six minutes.

00:58:08.000 And it was so difficult to go six minutes at that pace of a wrestling match.

00:58:14.000 You know, now 15 minutes.

00:58:15.000 Oh my goodness, it's so hard.

00:58:17.000 When you start to break into those 25 minutes, I don't know if the human being is meant to do that.

00:58:21.000 You know, St. Pierre keeps taking a lot of criticism.

00:58:23.000 Well, the reality is you're asking him to do a monumental task, which is to go hard for 25 minutes.

00:58:31.000 It's an impossible task to ask somebody.

00:58:34.000 And there's a saying in boxing that if you go for the knockout, you will not win a decision.

00:58:39.000 And you need to make your choice now.

00:58:42.000 If I go for the kill, you know, Dan Henderson style, and you don't get it, and then you realize that Shogun's still alive and you've got to hang out for 25 minutes, it's not going to be a pretty 25 minutes.

00:58:51.000 What a crazy fight that was.

00:58:53.000 Yeah, you've got to pace, and a lot of people go, well, Dan Henderson's not in shape.

00:58:55.000 Well, that's not the case.

00:58:56.000 Dan Henderson's a human being.

00:58:58.000 And human beings get very tired when they go for the kill.

00:59:01.000 So you've got to plan it right.

00:59:03.000 And George does plan it right.

00:59:05.000 Now if you want to see an exciting fight, shorten the rounds.

00:59:07.000 And George will go crazy.

00:59:08.000 I guarantee it.

00:59:09.000 He did before.

00:59:10.000 So you think it's just a matter of the human body has to work too hard to fight at a high clip for five rounds?

00:59:16.000 You know, 25 minutes is just too much.

00:59:18.000 Nobody sprints for 25 minutes.

00:59:20.000 How would you have it?

00:59:21.000 I always felt like it's kind of interesting.

00:59:23.000 There's two schools of thought.

00:59:25.000 One of them is that MMA is more difficult than boxing, and maybe the rounds should be in shorter length.

00:59:32.000 But then the other school of thought is, but it takes a grappler a long time to get his opponent down.

00:59:37.000 To work so hard for a takedown and then only have like five seconds left on the clock, that's ridiculous.

00:59:42.000 You need a five-minute round at least.

00:59:45.000 You take a guy down within the first couple minutes, you have time to work.

00:59:47.000 You hold him down, you finish him.

00:59:49.000 You have time to work.

00:59:50.000 I hear you, but you know, the competitors in no sport set the rules.

00:59:53.000 It's the fans.

00:59:54.000 It's the audience that sets the rules.

00:59:56.000 But I mean, you are a fan as well.

00:59:58.000 You are a fan as well.

00:59:59.000 So as a fan, I mean, taking yourself out of the equation, just objectively with all the knowledge that you have, what would you think would be the better format?

01:00:06.000 Well...

01:00:07.000 This is how I would answer you.

01:00:09.000 Professional boxing is viewed to be very boring.

01:00:12.000 So they call boxing very boring.

01:00:14.000 Ah, boxing's so boring.

01:00:15.000 Well, that's not true.

01:00:16.000 Boxing's fantastic.

01:00:17.000 Go watch the amateurs.

01:00:18.000 It's three three-minute rounds.

01:00:20.000 They throw punches and flurries non-stop for nine minutes.

01:00:23.000 So boxing is very pleasing.

01:00:26.000 Professional boxing, where you're asking a guy to do 20...

01:00:28.000 12 rounds at 3 minutes.

01:00:30.000 36 minutes is unpleasing.

01:00:32.000 Commentators have developed this feeling out process.

01:00:35.000 There is no such thing.

01:00:36.000 It's an unwritten agreement.

01:00:38.000 You and I are going to go box.

01:00:40.000 You and I both know we can't go 36 minutes.

01:00:42.000 So I'm going to stand around and move around a little bit.

01:00:44.000 You're going to stand around and move around a little bit.

01:00:46.000 Once we get to round 5, Now we both can do seven rounds.

01:00:49.000 Let's go ahead and fight.

01:00:50.000 There is no such thing as a feeling out process in boxing.

01:00:53.000 I've boxed for years.

01:00:54.000 There's such a thing as surviving a ridiculous time frame that's put on you of a half of an hour. 1.00

01:01:01.000 And so if you have a guy hurt, but he's got a good chin, and you go for it, you're fucked. 1.00

01:01:06.000 You're screwed. 1.00

01:01:06.000 I mean, that is the saying. 1.00

01:01:08.000 That doesn't mean you're not going to find exceptions to the rule.

01:01:10.000 But yeah, the basic belief in boxing, and I believe it too, if you go for the finish, you will not win a decision.

01:01:16.000 Eddie Alvarez, does that name ring a bell?

01:01:18.000 He's over in Bolotar.

01:01:19.000 Eddie Alvarez talks about this.

01:01:20.000 You know, you got five rounds.

01:01:22.000 How are you going to do it?

01:01:23.000 Eddie says, I don't train for five rounds.

01:01:24.000 I train for two.

01:01:25.000 And Eddie Alvarez was like 32-2.

01:01:28.000 He had an amazing record, and he finished guy after guy, but he also had a totally different approach.

01:01:32.000 I'm going to go for the kill.

01:01:33.000 If I don't get it, yeah, I acknowledge I'm in trouble. 0.95

01:01:36.000 That's pretty wild.

01:01:36.000 But 32 men didn't have an answer for it.

01:01:38.000 And I really liked when Eddie said this.

01:01:40.000 He and I were in Bodog together, and I heard him say that and thought, ah, that's hyperbole.

01:01:44.000 I said, no, he's serious.

01:01:44.000 And I started watching it.

01:01:45.000 He trains to sprint and finish you, and he does guy after guy, and when it doesn't work, well, he's got problems.

01:01:51.000 Melvin Manhoff, I heard you bring him up earlier.

01:01:53.000 Melvin would do the same thing.

01:01:54.000 He's training for three minutes.

01:01:56.000 Yeah, three minutes of fury.

01:01:57.000 Well, that's one of the reasons I love K-1.

01:02:00.000 I love watching high-level kickboxing.

01:02:03.000 It's three rounds.

01:02:04.000 Big matches are three rounds.

01:02:05.000 I used to love watching those three-round K-1 fights, because It's about all those guys could take.

01:02:12.000 The way they were going at it, the clip that they were fighting at. 0.86

01:02:14.000 I mean, if you go back and watch Jerome LeBanner versus Peter Ertz, they're just fucking swinging at each other. 0.89

01:02:21.000 And they take turns knocking each other down. 0.89

01:02:23.000 Ertz knocks down LeBanner with a high kick, and then LeBanner starches Ertz with a left hook. 0.98

01:02:29.000 Both guys had just got fucking waylaid on each other. 0.99

01:02:32.000 They kick like you'd swing a baseball bat. 0.99

01:02:34.000 I mean, it's just violent.

01:02:35.000 You know, hey, speaking of the K-1 and guys that did well, what's up with Bob Sapp?

01:02:38.000 Now, these aren't real fights he's going to do in these countries, right?

01:02:41.000 Is the opponent in on the gag?

01:02:42.000 Like this guy that hits him after the bell for five seconds?

01:02:45.000 You know, Puginowski's a gentleman.

01:02:46.000 He's a sportsman. 0.63

01:02:47.000 He's going to punch somebody after the bell.

01:02:49.000 Unless in the back you worked it out. 0.89

01:02:51.000 Hey, let me cover up and then act mad about it.

01:02:52.000 I mean, come on.

01:02:53.000 That whole thing looks so fugazi.

01:02:55.000 That couldn't be real.

01:02:56.000 Bob Sapp gets a paycheck.

01:02:57.000 I mean, this is my opinion.

01:02:58.000 It doesn't look good.

01:02:59.000 The whole thing was bad.

01:03:01.000 And I think what made it worse was when Puginowski kept hitting him after the bell.

01:03:04.000 Like, come on, Puginowski.

01:03:05.000 You're not going to do that.

01:03:06.000 Unless you know this looks awful.

01:03:09.000 It's like when Dan Severn and Shannon Rich did their work.

01:03:13.000 You know, Dan...

01:03:15.000 Come on, man.

01:03:16.000 You're caught on this.

01:03:17.000 This is brutal.

01:03:18.000 This is brutal.

01:03:19.000 And your interviews after the fact are worse than the poor job you did in the ring at fooling people.

01:03:25.000 I didn't see that fight.

01:03:26.000 Do you know what a roundoff is from gymnastics?

01:03:26.000 Oh, you didn't see it?

01:03:30.000 It's a gymnastics.

01:03:31.000 It's a handspring and you'll usually turn.

01:03:31.000 It's like a handspring.

01:03:33.000 Dan Severin hit one of those in the fight.

01:03:35.000 I'll just let you know that.

01:03:36.000 Shannon did something, and Dan Severin hits a round off in the middle of the ring, and he stumbles.

01:03:40.000 Oh, God.

01:03:40.000 It was so bad, Joey.

01:03:42.000 What?

01:03:43.000 And then after the match, they do their interviews, and Dan Severin's cover-up of the work was worse than the work.

01:03:50.000 Well, I was just fortunate to get over on Shannon Rich.

01:03:53.000 He's such a great competitor.

01:03:55.000 You know, Shannon Rich has never won a fight.

01:03:56.000 Dan Severin was a former multiple-time world champion.

01:03:59.000 You know, absolutely legendary in our sport.

01:04:01.000 I was just fortunate to have a good enough training camp to get...

01:04:05.000 Wow.

01:04:06.000 Dan, you gotta stop, man.

01:04:07.000 You gotta stop.

01:04:08.000 We've all been in the locker room and Shannon Rich walks in and says, who wants the night off?

01:04:12.000 Alright, Shannon, I guess I'll take you.

01:04:15.000 This isn't a secret in the industry, Dan.

01:04:17.000 Come on.

01:04:19.000 You got caught.

01:04:20.000 Just call it what it is.

01:04:21.000 Wow, that's weird.

01:04:22.000 He always did a lot of pro wrestling as well, didn't he?

01:04:25.000 Yeah, horribly.

01:04:26.000 I mean, he got a stint in the WWE and they just couldn't use him.

01:04:29.000 They said, look, you gotta go.

01:04:30.000 Just not entertaining enough.

01:04:32.000 He just didn't get it.

01:04:33.000 He couldn't work.

01:04:34.000 If you watch his Shannon match and you see how bad he did it, it was so bad, man.

01:04:41.000 It was so bad.

01:04:42.000 This was the brilliance of pride.

01:04:44.000 And I get heat when I talk about Vandalay and Crow Cop doing their fake matches. 0.96

01:04:49.000 In America, if you're going to do a pro wrestling match, both guys will sit in the back and they'll come up with what they're going to do.

01:04:55.000 They call it their spots.

01:04:56.000 Okay, you do this and I'll do that.

01:04:58.000 In Pride, what they would do is the promoter would visit one locker room.

01:05:03.000 So if you're going to take on Vandelay or Cro Cop, you know, you're...

01:05:06.000 Promoter shows up.

01:05:07.000 Boom, here's your $10,000 and here's how this fight's going to end.

01:05:10.000 Vandelay isn't privy to that.

01:05:12.000 So when the guy goes down, his celebration is genuine because he doesn't know that the guy got his locker room visit.

01:05:19.000 It's the same thing with Krokop that thought one leg cemetery and one leg hospital.

01:05:22.000 No, Krokop, your legs aren't knocking people out.

01:05:25.000 The promoter visited the back beforehand.

01:05:28.000 That's what's knocking out.

01:05:29.000 And then I made this public.

01:05:30.000 I outed these guys because I don't like either one of them.

01:05:32.000 There were absolutely some legit knockouts. 1.00

01:05:36.000 For sure.

01:05:36.000 Like Vandele and Krokop, the second fight.

01:05:39.000 Oh, sure, when he kicked his head.

01:05:40.000 Yeah, I remember that fight.

01:05:41.000 I enjoyed their first fight, too, when Vandele won.

01:05:43.000 I think they called it a draw.

01:05:44.000 It was a draw.

01:05:45.000 But Vandele won, you know, per our scoring system.

01:05:48.000 Yeah, I agree.

01:05:48.000 You know, but as soon as I said, also, Goodridge and Coleman, all these guys going, yeah, he's right.

01:05:52.000 It was a bunch of payoffs.

01:05:54.000 Well, there had to be Takata and Coleman.

01:05:56.000 It's like, yeah, I mean, come on.

01:05:57.000 Remember Takata and Coleman?

01:05:58.000 You didn't have to put on your Columbo rain jacket to figure this out, you know.

01:06:02.000 Excuse me.

01:06:03.000 Pardon me.

01:06:04.000 Excuse me, how come I'm 22-0 in Japan and can't win two straight in America?

01:06:07.000 They offered Eddie a fixed fight.

01:06:09.000 Let me let you know.

01:06:10.000 Eddie Bravo got offered by a...

01:06:10.000 Eddie Bravo?

01:06:12.000 To win or lose?

01:06:14.000 To win, rather.

01:06:15.000 To beat Tokoro.

01:06:17.000 They were going to have it set up. 0.99

01:06:19.000 Meanwhile, it could have been a double cross where he goes there and he thinks Tokoro is going to lay down and Tokoro beats his shit out of him. 0.99

01:06:25.000 That's what we call the screwjob finish, Joe. 0.99

01:06:28.000 The Montreal screwjob is what we call that. 0.89

01:06:31.000 Yeah, there's a word for it in the professional pool, too.

01:06:33.000 I think it's a double dump.

01:06:35.000 I think you dump both ways.

01:06:37.000 Ah, I see.

01:06:38.000 Is that what it is?

01:06:39.000 Yeah, because pool has a real hard problem with that. 0.67

01:06:41.000 Like, say, if I'm a pool player and you're a rich guy, I say, listen, Chael, I got a fucking game and I can't go wrong here, buddy. 0.89

01:06:48.000 I am robbing this guy. 0.97

01:06:50.000 Come on, let's put up 500 bucks and let's make some money. 0.67

01:06:52.000 And I go to him and I go, listen, here's the deal. 0.99

01:06:56.000 I'm going to lose and we'll just fucking... 0.98

01:06:58.000 Split this 70-30 and cut it up right now. 0.98

01:07:00.000 We got ourselves a big chunk of cash.

01:07:02.000 Wow.

01:07:03.000 And so there's no real match going on in the first place.

01:07:06.000 They had already decided that they were going to dump and they were going to split up this guy's money.

01:07:06.000 Sure.

01:07:11.000 That's him and a friend got together and they pretended to be rivals so they could gamble.

01:07:15.000 And he would dump to this guy. 0.99

01:07:16.000 I can't fucking make a ball. 0.99

01:07:17.000 I don't know what's going on. 0.99

01:07:18.000 Sure, sure.

01:07:19.000 They just cut up that dude's money.

01:07:20.000 Typical Diggstown hustle. 0.99

01:07:21.000 And then, you know, the two of them get together after the show and split up half that guy's money.

01:07:24.000 Or 70%, whatever they agreed upon.

01:07:27.000 Different guys would make different deals.

01:07:29.000 But it was always a big problem to the point where they had...

01:07:32.000 The only time Vegas allowed them to gamble on pool ever, they set it up so it was one of their big tournaments.

01:07:39.000 And all they did was they found who was the number one guy least likely to win.

01:07:44.000 Okay.

01:07:44.000 41 odds?

01:07:45.000 We're all going to let that guy win. 0.99

01:07:47.000 We're just going to gamble all of our money and fucking get paid. 0.99

01:07:50.000 Right. 0.99

01:07:51.000 Allegedly.

01:07:52.000 Yeah.

01:07:52.000 Allegedly.

01:07:53.000 Well, that's unfortunate that happens.

01:07:54.000 I mean, I can see where that would happen.

01:07:56.000 But that is unfortunate, because in some weird walk of society, that is sport.

01:08:00.000 That does involve timing and accuracy and training.

01:08:02.000 So it's unfortunate when guys do that.

01:08:05.000 I mean, I guess I understand it.

01:08:05.000 But I think I get it.

01:08:07.000 I can understand betting on yourself. 0.99

01:08:10.000 I can understand if you're some wild motherfucker like Bernard Hopkins who says, I'm going to go bet $100,000 on myself. 0.99

01:08:16.000 Because that's how much I know I'm going to win this fight. 0.99

01:08:19.000 I like that.

01:08:20.000 I don't like the option of doing it the other way.

01:08:24.000 Betting on your opponent and taking a dive.

01:08:24.000 Betting on your opponent?

01:08:26.000 The fact that that's possible...

01:08:28.000 You know, the fact that you could get your friend to do it.

01:08:31.000 The fact that there have been unethical dumps before, without a doubt.

01:08:34.000 No doubt about it.

01:08:35.000 I mean, we all know of them.

01:08:37.000 I don't know if you've ever bet on a UFC fight, but I don't know if you haven't, then you wouldn't know this.

01:08:41.000 But the way it works, you know, in a lot of gambling halls, you would imagine, well, if I show up, it's four to one odds, and I put 50 grand down, I got 50 grand at four to one.

01:08:48.000 It doesn't work that way.

01:08:49.000 If you go to bet at a sportsbook in Vegas on a UFC, this isn't the same for everything, but for UFC, because there's not enough money coming in, you can only bet X amount at a time.

01:08:58.000 Then they reset the line, and then you've got to bet it again.

01:09:01.000 How much is the number?

01:09:03.000 Well, I bet on Henderson when he fought Vandele.

01:09:05.000 Now, this was a number of years, I think 2006, could have been 2007. They only let me bet $500.

01:09:11.000 Henderson was a 3-to-1 underdog, so I go $500, $500, and I got to my $3,000 limit, and I had to go to three different casinos.

01:09:18.000 Now, I'm quite sure with the influx of the sport that it'd be closer to $10,000, but I'm quite sure it's not over.

01:09:25.000 How confident were you, though? 0.95

01:09:27.000 That's pretty fucking badass. 0.99

01:09:28.000 Just keep going to casino after casino. 0.99

01:09:30.000 I felt good.

01:09:30.000 It was good, you know.

01:09:32.000 And, you know, that's when Vandal, I mean, nobody could beat Vandal.

01:09:34.000 He had that reputation like Mike Tyson was hanging on to for a while.

01:09:37.000 You know, but you're talking about Dan Henderson.

01:09:38.000 You're talking about one of the baddest dudes to ever live. 1.00

01:09:41.000 He's a fucking tank. 1.00

01:09:42.000 He's something else, man. 1.00

01:09:44.000 And I knew it was going to be a good fight, too.

01:09:45.000 I didn't know it was going to be a walk in the park.

01:09:47.000 But you've got to bet on your guy.

01:09:49.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:09:49.000 Well, you know, Henderson is a fucking tank, man. 1.00

01:09:52.000 He's a tank. 1.00

01:09:52.000 He's one of those dudes where you pat him on the back and it feels like there's something wrong. 1.00

01:09:56.000 Like, why are you so dense?

01:09:58.000 Right. 1.00

01:09:58.000 Like, what the fuck is this? 1.00

01:09:59.000 And he turns around to look at you all stiff. 1.00

01:10:01.000 You can hardly move.

01:10:03.000 If his teeth are out.

01:10:05.000 Oh, hey, what are you doing?

01:10:06.000 You know, gives you some insult of some sort that's his way of saying hello.

01:10:10.000 You know, some mean-spirited knock that for some reason is charming when he does it.

01:10:15.000 That's how I saw him. 1.00

01:10:16.000 He goes, what, did you get another fucking tattoo? 1.00

01:10:18.000 I go, you sound like my mom's. 1.00

01:10:20.000 He always has something mean as his greeting.

01:10:24.000 This is my favorite Dan Henderson story.

01:10:26.000 We were in Caroline's Comedy Club in New York, and there was this guy that was heckling. 0.98

01:10:30.000 He wouldn't shut the fuck up. 1.00

01:10:31.000 And I go, listen, man, if you don't shut the fuck up, I'm going to have Dan Henderson come over here and hold you down while he fucks your girlfriend. 1.00

01:10:37.000 The crowd goes nuts. 1.00

01:10:38.000 And Dan goes, why would I hold him down when I could just stare him down? 1.00

01:10:44.000 I'm telling you, the fucking place erupted. 0.99

01:10:47.000 The fucking place erupted, and it was like one of the creepiest things I ever heard a man say to another man ever. 1.00

01:10:55.000 Like, you could see the dude just wanted to crawl out of the room and just hide somewhere. 0.99

01:11:02.000 The feeling of looking over at that fucking savage after he just says something like that to you, and you're like, oh, let it change. 0.97

01:11:09.000 Let me get out of here. 0.99

01:11:10.000 Well, and Henderson broke etiquette.

01:11:12.000 There's an etiquette amongst men.

01:11:13.000 If one guy's with a girl and one guy's not, you're always wrong.

01:11:17.000 You let him look like a hero.

01:11:19.000 Then it comes back to you someday. 0.99

01:11:21.000 Well, I think in that situation, there was 350 fucking people in that crowd. 1.00

01:11:25.000 That guy was a jackass. 1.00

01:11:26.000 He was drunk. 1.00

01:11:27.000 Dan Henderson was there, and he was like, I'll shut this fucking dummy up. 1.00

01:11:30.000 Oh, I like it. 1.00

01:11:31.000 It's a beautiful line.

01:11:32.000 Yeah, essentially trumped my heckler comment.

01:11:36.000 I had shut him down.

01:11:38.000 And then Henderson came along and put the nuclear bomb on top of it.

01:11:41.000 Right.

01:11:41.000 He put the verbal H-bomb.

01:11:44.000 The verbal H-bomb on top of it.

01:11:45.000 That's good work by Dan.

01:11:46.000 It was very good work.

01:11:47.000 On the spot like that, the best line you could have ever written.

01:11:50.000 You can't write anything creepier than that.

01:11:52.000 Why would I hold him down when I could just stare him down?

01:11:55.000 A guy has to think like that.

01:11:57.000 In order to have that thought in his head, in order to be able to say that verbally, I mean, if you're going to be a writer and you're going to come up with that, it might take you six hours alone doing cocaine and drinking coffee to pretend you're the type of guy that would think that way, to have that line come out of your character's mouth.

01:12:14.000 It took Dan Henderson one half of one second.

01:12:16.000 He just waited forever.

01:12:18.000 Well, this is the same guy that volunteered to fight Dos Santos three weeks ago to move up arguably two-way.

01:12:23.000 You know, because truly, he's a middleweight.

01:12:25.000 Yeah.

01:12:25.000 He chooses to fight at light heavyweight.

01:12:27.000 Yeah.

01:12:27.000 He doesn't like cutting weight.

01:12:29.000 Right.

01:12:29.000 So truly, he'd be going up two-way.

01:12:31.000 Yeah, anyway.

01:12:32.000 Yeah, he's great. 1.00

01:12:33.000 He's a fucking animal. 1.00

01:12:33.000 He's something else, man. 1.00

01:12:34.000 He's an animal.

01:12:36.000 And those guys, they almost all come from wrestling.

01:12:39.000 The guys like that Henderson stock, there's guys that can push through pain and then there's wrestlers.

01:12:45.000 There's another level of mental strength, of the ability to endure. 0.78

01:12:50.000 And what you were talking about going through when you were a kid, like being malnourished and fucking traveling on buses and wherever the hell you're going to these different wrestlers. 0.98

01:12:58.000 Not getting enough sleep. 0.98

01:12:59.000 Not getting enough sleep.

01:13:00.000 And you have to do schoolwork as well.

01:13:02.000 Sure.

01:13:02.000 And how difficult all that is.

01:13:04.000 The mental toughness that wrestlers develop from that ridiculous... 1.00

01:13:08.000 First of all, from fucking cutting weight all the time. 1.00

01:13:11.000 Just to be able to... 0.99

01:13:12.000 People like to feel good when they compete.

01:13:14.000 They like to feel great and charged up and confident.

01:13:17.000 I had so many friends when I was wrestling that would be like...

01:13:20.000 There was this kid named Mark Collins who was a really good wrestler.

01:13:22.000 Really, really good.

01:13:23.000 But he would cut down to like 118 pounds.

01:13:27.000 He was a little guy anyway, but he would cut down like, maybe I'm exaggerating, maybe it was like 120 something. 0.99

01:13:32.000 We were in high school, whatever the fuck it was. 0.95

01:13:33.000 It used to be 118. Was it 118? 0.98

01:13:35.000 It used to be. 0.99

01:13:36.000 But the fucking guy was never happy. 1.00

01:13:38.000 He would always just have this dour look on his face. 1.00

01:13:40.000 Life sucked. 0.99

01:13:41.000 He was just walking around, just always hungry. 0.98

01:13:46.000 It stunted my friend Steve's growth. 0.99

01:13:48.000 My friend Steve, all of his brothers are like 6'2", 6'1", 6'3", big fucking guys. 0.98

01:13:53.000 He's 5'6". 1.00

01:13:54.000 Because all throughout high school, just fucking dieting. 0.99

01:13:57.000 Going through regular wrestling and then going off to camps and never allowed to actually eat full meals for a normal long period of time and grow like a normal man. 0.99

01:14:08.000 It's like he essentially grew up impoverished.

01:14:10.000 Right.

01:14:11.000 You know?

01:14:11.000 Yeah, and it's tough.

01:14:12.000 You know, you talk about how hard the weight cut is, and for us, for our sport of MMA, it's a 24-hour weigh-in.

01:14:18.000 I mean, you weigh in, the show starts 24 hours later.

01:14:20.000 In wrestling, it's a one-hour weigh-in.

01:14:23.000 And not only that, Joe, the national tournament, the whole reason you wrestle, is a three-day tournament with three weigh-ins.

01:14:31.000 So you weigh in, you do two matches, you cut weight that night, you weigh in again, you do two matches, you cut weight that night, you come back for the championship.

01:14:38.000 God.

01:14:38.000 Yeah, so you're talking guys that aren't sleeping.

01:14:41.000 They're cut, wait, non-stop, boom, time to wrestle.

01:14:44.000 I mean, how do you do it?

01:14:45.000 And it really is where the rubber meets the road.

01:14:48.000 Sometimes the best wrestler that had the best season, 35-0, will not even place at the national tournament because where he used to weigh in, have 24 hours, get on the mat, he'd win a dual meet.

01:14:59.000 Tournament style, one hour weighing, you're on the mat.

01:15:01.000 Next morning, weighing again.

01:15:03.000 And so is that indicative of a style of competing?

01:15:07.000 Some guys, like Frankie Edgar, don't cut any weight at all.

01:15:10.000 Other guys, is that the case in wrestling as well?

01:15:12.000 Some guys would try to cut the most amount of weight, but other guys would think that the best way to do it was be entirely healthy and just be natural and deal with a guy who's larger.

01:15:20.000 Yeah, you see that all the time.

01:15:22.000 And there's some guys that, well, I got a little bit more speed.

01:15:25.000 This guy, he's going to come in the ring at 220. I'm going to come in at 204. But I'm going to be a little bit faster than him.

01:15:31.000 And that's where Dan Henderson's made a living.

01:15:33.000 Dan Henderson's beat multiple heavyweight world champions.

01:15:36.000 One from Big Nog to Fedor.

01:15:40.000 Those are heavyweights, but he used that little bit of speed.

01:15:44.000 Didn't he get armbarred by Big Nog? 1.00

01:15:46.000 Yes, he absolutely did, but that was the rematch.

01:15:48.000 He fought him in a tournament called King of Rings.

01:15:50.000 Okay, so that wasn't really MMA? Like, you weren't allowed to do certain things, like strike on the ground, right?

01:15:56.000 Well, there was some stuff that was held back, and you could strike on the ground.

01:15:59.000 I want to say it was open palm.

01:16:00.000 You know, open palm.

01:16:02.000 Definitely no soccer kicks or pride rules.

01:16:04.000 But, I mean, it was considered...

01:16:05.000 I considered MMA, absolutely.

01:16:07.000 He fought Gilbert Ivoque, because when you're on your feet, you can do everything.

01:16:10.000 Right, right.

01:16:10.000 It was something about, with the takedown, I believe it was an open palm to the head.

01:16:13.000 Isn't that crazy when you see old Boss Rutten-style pancrease fights?

01:16:16.000 Sure. 0.99

01:16:16.000 What a weird fucking hybrid of the two. 0.99

01:16:18.000 For folks who don't know, you were allowed to kick with, you know, you had these boots on that had shin pads on them, but you weren't allowed to punch to the face. 0.99

01:16:27.000 Instead, you could slap people. 0.94

01:16:29.000 Full blast!

01:16:30.000 And Boss Rutten figured out a way how to pull his hand back.

01:16:33.000 Way far.

01:16:34.000 And when he would throw, I don't know, I can't even bend my hand back the way he would do it.

01:16:38.000 And he would essentially be punching you with his palms.

01:16:42.000 Yeah, he got so good at just punching, throwing, like, punching techniques in the palms.

01:16:42.000 Yeah, the palm strike.

01:16:47.000 Whereas everybody else had kind of, like, they hadn't figured that out yet.

01:16:50.000 And they were slapping each other.

01:16:51.000 Yeah, Boss was a master of that.

01:16:53.000 I loved watching Boss's old fights over there.

01:16:55.000 But some of those were fugazi, too.

01:16:57.000 You know, some of that pancreas stuff you'd watch.

01:16:58.000 You'd go, no, wait a minute.

01:16:59.000 Yeah.

01:17:00.000 Come on.

01:17:00.000 No doubt.

01:17:01.000 No doubt.

01:17:01.000 There was definitely some fixed fights.

01:17:03.000 It's weird that some guys don't want to admit that, but now I think they should.

01:17:06.000 I think they kind of owe it to history.

01:17:08.000 You know, we know that there was a lot of real fights for sure, but there was no question about it.

01:17:12.000 There were some that were a little funky.

01:17:13.000 You know, but that goes back to the point I made earlier that both guys aren't necessarily in on it in Japan.

01:17:19.000 Right.

01:17:19.000 You know, Krokop, those guys really think they won, and if you tell them they did it, I mean, you're talking about really hurting a guy's feelings.

01:17:25.000 He'll get fighting mad over that, and you go, hey, listen, Eventually, history will come out and show itself for what it is.

01:17:34.000 That's really hard because I don't know all those guys' names, but Krokop fought one guy that wore a pro wrestling mask.

01:17:39.000 He is a pro wrestler.

01:17:40.000 He wrestles under the name of...

01:17:42.000 Dos Karos?

01:17:44.000 Yes, Alberto Del Rio.

01:17:47.000 But of course, you already know that.

01:17:49.000 That's what he comes out and says.

01:17:50.000 He's a very funny guy.

01:17:51.000 And he's talked about it a lot.

01:17:52.000 Yeah, they brought me around.

01:17:53.000 I've got to fight this Crow Cop. 1.00

01:17:53.000 I don't think about it. 1.00

01:17:55.000 Eventually, he's going to throw a head kick and I've got to make it look real.

01:17:57.000 Crow Cop, he'd be stunned to hear that.

01:17:57.000 You know, he's talked about it.

01:18:00.000 I believe.

01:18:01.000 I believe Crow Cop did not know. 1.00

01:18:04.000 Now, I didn't have that realization when I first outed him.

01:18:04.000 That these were fake.

01:18:07.000 I came to, when he responded, I thought, you know what?

01:18:11.000 He's either an Academy Award winner or he truly doesn't know.

01:18:15.000 And then you start to hear from some other guys where they go, look, you didn't always know.

01:18:18.000 The promoter come to your locker room. 0.98

01:18:19.000 So that wrestling guy, when Krokop kicked him though, he really fucking kicked that guy in the head. 0.95

01:18:24.000 It's just the guy sort of like just took it? 0.93

01:18:26.000 Yeah, and the guy's just got to go down and boom, the referee was bleeding.

01:18:29.000 Remember when blood was coming through the mask?

01:18:30.000 Well, is that the same guy? 0.98

01:18:32.000 Yeah, and if it wasn't, if it was fake, what a fucking great touch. 0.97

01:18:36.000 Because the mask, if they had like a little blood packet there, and when Krokop slaps it, blood comes out. 0.97

01:18:41.000 I mean, what a great touch that would be.

01:18:42.000 But, you know, you see a kick come and you go, okay, this is the one I got paid for.

01:18:45.000 You take it.

01:18:46.000 It can cause a kick.

01:18:48.000 I had a buddy that went down.

01:18:50.000 He was by no means doing a dive.

01:18:51.000 He was just ready to quit.

01:18:52.000 He just wanted out of there.

01:18:54.000 And fighters will do this a lot where something's not going right and it's time to go home.

01:18:58.000 And, you know, usually the rear naked choke is the big one for, hey, get me out of here.

01:19:03.000 So my buddy decides that he's going to go down on a fake knockout.

01:19:07.000 So we're in Bodog in Costa Rica.

01:19:09.000 Dan, this guy named Dan Stevenson, the big Viking guy, used to fight in the UFC a couple times.

01:19:09.000 Ha, ha, ha.

01:19:14.000 Dan Christensen, is that what his name was?

01:19:16.000 Anyway, Dan throws the punch.

01:19:17.000 My buddy Jeremiah goes down.

01:19:19.000 The punch missed.

01:19:20.000 Jeremiah goes down.

01:19:21.000 But the referee, Troy Waugh, doesn't catch it in time.

01:19:24.000 So now my buddy who's out cold, well now Dan Christensen is going to come down for the finish because the ref hasn't called it.

01:19:30.000 So my buddy who's pretending to be, has to come back to life.

01:19:32.000 He has to come back to life to lay there and go for TKO. So when you watch the replay, you're like, wait a minute.

01:19:37.000 Thought you were out cold.

01:19:38.000 How come when he came down?

01:19:40.000 It was pretty bad.

01:19:42.000 You see that stuff all the time.

01:19:43.000 And that's not to say the sports fugazi.

01:19:46.000 That's competition.

01:19:47.000 What you're trying to do, what I'm trying to do when I'm fighting, is make the other guy quit.

01:19:51.000 What he has to do when he's ready to quit is make it look like he got...

01:19:55.000 That's just part of it.

01:19:56.000 And nobody wants to talk about that.

01:19:58.000 In fact, one guy did.

01:19:59.000 One guy talked about it in Ohio.

01:20:01.000 I can't think of what his name was.

01:20:02.000 A former UFC fighter Rashad kicked him in the head.

01:20:05.000 Sean Salomon.

01:20:05.000 That's what his name is.

01:20:06.000 Sean talked about this.

01:20:08.000 This wasn't my night.

01:20:09.000 I gave him an arm and I tapped out and got out of there.

01:20:11.000 He was very candid.

01:20:12.000 He got in trouble for it.

01:20:12.000 He got in candid because they thought he was throwing a fight.

01:20:16.000 But what he was doing was he was letting people into the psyche of an athlete who's breaking.

01:20:21.000 He's breaking, and it's an ugly, deep secret, and we've all done it as athletes, whether it's in practice or in the ring, and we're greatly shameful of it.

01:20:29.000 So what he did is he just let people in and go, look, this is what happened.

01:20:32.000 I broke down mentally.

01:20:33.000 The commissioner comes out and suspends him for it.

01:20:36.000 He's like, well, commissioner, obviously you've never competed.

01:20:38.000 We can see that. 0.98

01:20:40.000 Yeah, that's ridiculous. 0.62

01:20:42.000 That is exactly what it is when a guy gives up an arm. 0.96

01:20:44.000 He's trying to save himself.

01:20:46.000 Yeah, he's trying to save himself.

01:20:46.000 He's saving a little dignity.

01:20:47.000 Oh, I got caught.

01:20:49.000 Yeah, that is an issue.

01:20:52.000 The real issue of people regulating athleticism where they don't understand the psychology behind being an athlete, especially a combat athlete.

01:21:00.000 There was an issue that I had, and we don't want to name any names here, but it was when someone had questioned you about you fake tapping against Paul Ophelia.

01:21:17.000 My take on that is for you to ask a man what he's thinking right then in the middle of an incredibly emotional situation where he's losing a fight, he knows it's over, he got locked up in it, and he's thinking there's got to be a fucking way out of this.

01:21:37.000 There's got to be a way.

01:21:38.000 You want to win so bad, you say something that you're ashamed of later.

01:21:42.000 But to say that...

01:21:45.000 That thing that you were ashamed of that you did represents your character or your sensibilities or your honesty, I think is a bit disingenuous.

01:21:53.000 To be judged in that moment, in that vulnerable, awful, devastating moment, is not right.

01:22:00.000 Especially for someone who has...

01:22:02.000 When you have competed at a high level for a number of years like you have, it's almost like you could be considered almost like a slightly crazy person.

01:22:12.000 Like your fanaticism for victory, your need to compete and excel. 0.99

01:22:18.000 The only way to get really fucking good is you've got to be a little crazy. 0.99

01:22:21.000 You just have to be. 0.99

01:22:22.000 And you've got to want to fucking win. 0.98

01:22:24.000 You can't be happy with any other result. 0.98

01:22:26.000 You cannot be happy or you won't achieve success.

01:22:29.000 Your full potential. 0.98

01:22:30.000 And that sometimes equates to people fucking up. 0.99

01:22:34.000 It sometimes equates to breaking. 0.99

01:22:35.000 It equates to mental lapses.

01:22:38.000 It equates to a lot of different things.

01:22:39.000 You know, I had to respond to that.

01:22:41.000 I had a person, again, let's make sure we keep him on name, but he wanted a response to that.

01:22:45.000 I'm going, geez, you know, if I'm to be candid with you...

01:22:48.000 If I get tapped out in front of a sold-out audience that was aired on live, worldwide television, and I then lie about doing it, the only person I'm lying to is myself.

01:23:01.000 That's it.

01:23:02.000 If I'm trying to fool someone, if I'm in denial, and me, I could be anybody.

01:23:06.000 I could be Chael, or I could be Fighter X. But if he's doing that, if a person, look, the only person you're lying to is yourself.

01:23:11.000 Did the guy file a complaint with the commission?

01:23:14.000 Well, that's within the rules.

01:23:16.000 You know, what did the guy do?

01:23:17.000 If he's forcing you to make a ruling, go ahead.

01:23:19.000 But, you know, like you said, and let's also not forget.

01:23:22.000 When you file a complaint, how much of that is gamesmanship because you're trying to get a rematch anyway and the whole game is about making more money?

01:23:30.000 I'll tell you what, Joe, in my entire career, I couldn't name one person that's ever filed a complaint.

01:23:34.000 I know they've been filed, but I literally couldn't tell you one guy that's done it.

01:23:37.000 And I know some guys think, hey, listen, there was a misapplication of the rules.

01:23:41.000 I really like a review, and I understand that.

01:23:43.000 But again, I couldn't state a case for you.

01:23:45.000 But there's other things, like the First Amendment.

01:23:48.000 I've got the right to say I didn't tap in any single fight that I want.

01:23:53.000 The second one fight ends, the marketing for the next fight begins.

01:23:58.000 And if a fighter chooses to do that, he's got everywhere.

01:24:01.000 There's nothing within the rules of a commission to say what a guy is going to say in his post-fight interview. 0.64

01:24:08.000 That's silly.

01:24:09.000 So you will say, you're essentially admitting that you will say untruthful things just in order to keep the hype going. 0.54

01:24:16.000 And that people should not misinterpret.

01:24:18.000 This is a blurry line.

01:24:19.000 Yeah, for me...

01:24:20.000 Me?

01:24:20.000 No.

01:24:20.000 The pro wrestling blurry line there.

01:24:22.000 I'm not saying that for me.

01:24:23.000 But if I'm saying me, I just mean an athlete in general.

01:24:26.000 It could be any sport.

01:24:27.000 But first off, an athlete is not under oath.

01:24:30.000 So he can come out and say whatever he wants.

01:24:32.000 He's just a person.

01:24:33.000 And secondly, if one competition ends, it could be baseball or fighting or whatever.

01:24:39.000 The makings and the matchmaking and the shuffling and the politicking for the next event begins.

01:24:45.000 And for somebody to come in and want an answer for that and try to attempt to regulate you is beyond inappropriate.

01:24:53.000 I would want to say it's illegal.

01:24:54.000 Again, it comes down to First Amendment.

01:24:56.000 The guy can say whatever he wants.

01:24:57.000 In a post-fight interview or post-match interview or game or whatever it is.

01:25:00.000 I want to take myself out of this now, person in general.

01:25:04.000 Come on, he can say whatever he wants.

01:25:05.000 Especially if you're considering that part of you as an athlete to be sort of performance art.

01:25:13.000 You're actually, you have an act.

01:25:15.000 I mean, and that act enhances your overall brand. 0.95

01:25:19.000 I mean, when you go out there and you talk a bunch of crazy shit, whether or not you believe in it, and people start talking about you, it becomes monetarily advantageous to do that. 0.97

01:25:28.000 You make more money that way. 0.98

01:25:29.000 Brock Lesnar.

01:25:30.000 I think a perfect example, UFC 100, all of his fights.

01:25:33.000 Brock was always fun to listen to.

01:25:35.000 You want to know who else is fun?

01:25:36.000 It's Quentin Jackson.

01:25:37.000 Yes.

01:25:38.000 Quentin finishes a fight.

01:25:39.000 We all sit there in the living room.

01:25:41.000 Wait, wait, wait.

01:25:42.000 Quentin's about to talk.

01:25:42.000 And he says something funny, whether he gives you a hard time or inviting people to an after party.

01:25:49.000 It's funny, and that's part of the show that people paid for.

01:25:52.000 So that's not to say a fighter or, again, any athlete has to do that.

01:25:56.000 But if he chooses to, he's got to be considered outside the scope of the regulatory body.

01:26:02.000 I mean, talk about them overstepping.

01:26:04.000 That's beyond inappropriate. 0.98

01:26:06.000 Well, I certainly think you should be able to ask a guy after he's fucking taking a shower and tell us what happened. 1.00

01:26:12.000 I fucked up. 0.99

01:26:13.000 I said I didn't tap. 1.00

01:26:14.000 I was just losing my mind in there.

01:26:16.000 Sure.

01:26:16.000 But even if he doesn't, if he wants to take it to the grave, let's not forget the guy doesn't owe you anything.

01:26:21.000 He's not under a subpoena.

01:26:22.000 He owes you nothing, including the truth, if that's his choice.

01:26:26.000 So for a government official, because that's how this started.

01:26:29.000 You were talking about a government...

01:26:30.000 For a government official to get involved and act as though he's going to suspend or uphold somebody's license because he didn't like something that he said in the media is inappropriate.

01:26:41.000 I agree.

01:26:42.000 Now, what happened to you?

01:26:44.000 I'm fascinated personally by...

01:26:49.000 Big leaps in development. 0.96

01:26:51.000 I'm always fascinated when you hear about a guy, well, yeah, he was a blue belt, and then something happened, and he went to a few seminars, and before you know it, he's fucking killing everybody at the Mundiales. 0.99

01:27:02.000 You went from, was it UFC 60 that you fought Jeremy Horn?

01:27:07.000 Yeah.

01:27:08.000 You were having some tough fights, man.

01:27:10.000 I'm very impressed that you know that, by the way.

01:27:12.000 Good job.

01:27:12.000 Thank you.

01:27:13.000 You see a lot of shows. 0.97

01:27:15.000 I can't remember where my fucking car keys are, but I'll tell you a random UFC fact. 0.96

01:27:19.000 I have no idea where I put my cell phone. 0.98

01:27:21.000 But you fought Jeremy Horn and then was...

01:27:25.000 Something happened between then and when you had a resurgence, which was, say, what do you attribute your resurgence to?

01:27:35.000 Like, what year do you think it really started?

01:27:36.000 I know where you're going with this, and let me jump ahead.

01:27:39.000 You know, what you're saying is, hey, I had some major submission problems, and all of a sudden I started submitting some guys.

01:27:43.000 Well, not just that, man.

01:27:44.000 You became a more confident guy.

01:27:48.000 I don't want to say...

01:27:50.000 I mean, the way you presented yourself, I should say. 0.95

01:27:55.000 You got way better at marketing yourself, and you started fucking dominating top five. 1.00

01:28:00.000 It's like you hit your own, you had a personal wall, and you got through that fucking thing. 1.00

01:28:05.000 You got through that fucking thing, and you made a big leap. 0.99

01:28:08.000 When you fought Nate Marquardt, I think that was the fight that really opened up a lot of people's eyes. 1.00

01:28:13.000 It's like, whoa, Chael Sonnen's a motherfucker. 0.97

01:28:16.000 I remember me and Eddie Bravo had dinner after that, and everyone was like, How about that power double? 1.00

01:28:22.000 Goddamn! 0.90

01:28:22.000 It's like Nate could not keep you off of him, and we were thinking about it, and it was like, wow, what a nightmare. 0.90

01:28:27.000 It's like you had figured out a way to get all of your potential out inside the octagon.

01:28:34.000 What happened?

01:28:34.000 I appreciate that.

01:28:35.000 And, you know, you don't know in training either.

01:28:37.000 For me, I had a fight with Yushin Okami.

01:28:40.000 He was ranked number two in the world, and I was just one of those guys that was kind of looked at as a top ten.

01:28:44.000 That was right before I fought Nate Morka, and it gave me a lot of confidence.

01:28:47.000 But here's what happened, Joe.

01:28:48.000 I have never lost a round of fighting.

01:28:51.000 And when I say that sometimes, a guy will laugh, you know, because I've lost some fights.

01:28:55.000 But I've never lost a round.

01:28:57.000 I've never had a fight where a judge ever scored a round against me until my last match with Bisping.

01:29:02.000 So at the point of your story, though, I sit down one day and I'm looking at it.

01:29:06.000 I'm at SureDog.com.

01:29:07.000 I bring myself up.

01:29:08.000 I'm looking at my record.

01:29:08.000 I've won every round I've ever fought.

01:29:10.000 I've never been in a tough fight.

01:29:12.000 I've never had stitches.

01:29:13.000 I've never broken it.

01:29:14.000 I've dominated everybody.

01:29:15.000 And I've lost eight fights.

01:29:17.000 And I lost all of them by submission.

01:29:18.000 And I lost all of them in the second round.

01:29:21.000 And I'm staring at that on the computer.

01:29:23.000 I'm staring at these numbers like a CEO would his spreadsheet.

01:29:26.000 And I'm saying, there's something going on here, and it's not physical.

01:29:29.000 There's something going on that I can dominate eight minutes of a fight, seven minutes of a fight, nine minutes of a fight, and find a way out time after time after time in the same round with the same move.

01:29:41.000 And so I went and got help.

01:29:43.000 I went and got professional help.

01:29:44.000 And I sought out a doctor, Ed Versteg.

01:29:48.000 I hate talking about this because this was a real turning point for me is when I went in, worked on sports psychology, got hypnotized.

01:29:55.000 I was never the same.

01:29:57.000 I was never the same in practice.

01:29:58.000 My attitude was different.

01:30:00.000 Controlling my diet, being disciplined, falling asleep, the way I approached battle, the way I approached the second round.

01:30:08.000 Everything changed.

01:30:09.000 And it changed to the point where I hate to say what I just said and now it's too late.

01:30:15.000 Because I felt like it was my secret.

01:30:16.000 I discovered something.

01:30:17.000 And I don't want other people to know.

01:30:19.000 I'll write about it someday in a book.

01:30:20.000 I'll talk about it when I'm retired.

01:30:23.000 But I'm not going to tell anybody because it's competitive edge.

01:30:26.000 And when I started seeing a sports psychologist, when I finally came clean, it was like being an alcoholic.

01:30:32.000 Before you can get help, you've got to admit you have a problem.

01:30:34.000 And when I finally admitted I got a problem, when I finally said it, when I finally could acknowledge and look somebody and tell them, this is what's going on.

01:30:41.000 I'm finding a way to lose as opposed to win.

01:30:44.000 I work harder than these guys.

01:30:45.000 I've been at this longer.

01:30:48.000 I know how to stop submissions.

01:30:48.000 I'm losing.

01:30:50.000 I'm finding my way into them.

01:30:51.000 I'm finding a way out.

01:30:52.000 And that's what's happening.

01:30:53.000 And I had to acknowledge that.

01:30:55.000 And once I did it, I never lost again.

01:30:57.000 I lost to Paulo, which was the controversial one.

01:31:00.000 I lost to Anderson after dominating him.

01:31:03.000 I've never been beat since I saw this doctor.

01:31:05.000 That's incredible.

01:31:06.000 Now, Joe, let me ask you a question.

01:31:07.000 Are you ever allowed to give a shout-on in the show?

01:31:09.000 Like, do you ever say hi to anybody?

01:31:10.000 Like, if I was to say, hi, Brittany, because my girlfriend just texted me since she's watching the show, and I mention the name Brittany to earn myself special points, is that going to tick you off?

01:31:19.000 Not at all.

01:31:20.000 I'm not even going to say Brittany if it's going to be like a cheap plug and you're going to get mad.

01:31:23.000 I'll do it.

01:31:24.000 Hello, Brittany.

01:31:25.000 Thanks for tuning in.

01:31:26.000 Thank you, buddy.

01:31:26.000 You're welcome, pal.

01:31:27.000 That's a beautiful story, man.

01:31:27.000 Very nice of you.

01:31:29.000 I knew there must have been something on the mental side.

01:31:31.000 Because, you know, I remember, as you do, that the Yushin Okami fight was an excellent performance.

01:31:37.000 And I remember being real impressed with that, but even more so impressed with the Nate Marquardt fight.

01:31:43.000 I knew that Yushin was a grappler, and I wasn't surprised that you were a stronger grappler than him, but I was surprised that Nate Marquardt just couldn't stop you from taking him down.

01:31:52.000 He just could not stop you. 0.96

01:31:53.000 And the way you were doing it, you were ragdolling him to the point where you were like, Jesus, this guy's a fucking nightmare for a lot of dudes, man. 0.96

01:32:00.000 And then we started doing the matchups. 0.94

01:32:02.000 You start thinking in your head, what about him?

01:32:04.000 But when you fought Anderson, man...

01:32:06.000 Woo! 0.99

01:32:06.000 That was a crazy fight, man. 0.99

01:32:09.000 For four minutes, or for four rounds, and how many minutes into the fifth round?

01:32:13.000 Four minutes and 31 seconds, but who's keeping track?

01:32:16.000 Four minutes and 31 seconds of a five-minute round.

01:32:23.000 What was that like?

01:32:24.000 What was that like when it happened?

01:32:25.000 It was devastating.

01:32:26.000 I'll tell you what.

01:32:27.000 I had no idea what was happening in that fight.

01:32:29.000 None.

01:32:30.000 And when the fight was over, I was devastated.

01:32:34.000 And I came to and I said to the ref, you know, the typical thing, like a doofus, what happened?

01:32:40.000 Right.

01:32:40.000 The referee, Josh Rosenthal, is a fantastic referee, simply says, you tapped out.

01:32:45.000 And he looks at me for a response like I was going to argue.

01:32:47.000 And I simply say, I believe you.

01:32:50.000 Now, I knew that because ESPN zoomed in on that and showed it.

01:32:54.000 But that's all I said.

01:32:54.000 I said, I believe you.

01:32:55.000 Do you remember what happened?

01:32:57.000 When you were...

01:32:58.000 Did you think of tapping and you went out?

01:33:01.000 Like, what happened?

01:33:02.000 I remember...

01:33:04.000 Falling asleep.

01:33:05.000 You know, it's a very weird experience if you've ever been, and I know you practice it, so you have been, but it's a very weird experience, you know, when you're actually going to sleep, but you're trying to stay within reality.

01:33:16.000 And I remember having a dream thinking, well, if I tap, I could get out of this.

01:33:19.000 Nah, let's not tap.

01:33:21.000 The fight was over.

01:33:22.000 So you had already tapped and you didn't even know.

01:33:24.000 I'd already tapped.

01:33:24.000 I hit his foot.

01:33:25.000 And I didn't fully know what happened.

01:33:26.000 When it was over and I came to, I didn't fully know what happened.

01:33:28.000 I'm trying to figure out what just happened.

01:33:30.000 Most people, by the way, who have never been choked out will never be able to understand that.

01:33:34.000 They'll call fake tap and this and that.

01:33:37.000 Unless you've been choked, you really don't understand how confusing it is.

01:33:41.000 There's a lot of guys who don't know what happened right when they wake up.

01:33:44.000 It's a mess.

01:33:45.000 And I'm one of those guys.

01:33:47.000 I was with the other people where I would always see fighters and go, what happened after they got knocked out?

01:33:51.000 Come on, dummy, you know what happened.

01:33:52.000 No, you don't. 0.99

01:33:53.000 You sure don't.

01:33:53.000 Especially from a concussion.

01:33:54.000 Especially from chaos.

01:33:56.000 You absolutely don't know.

01:33:57.000 So aside from being choked, don't forget I've got fatigue issues.

01:34:01.000 I've got blood and Vaseline in my eyes.

01:34:03.000 I've got exhaustion.

01:34:04.000 I've got anxiety.

01:34:06.000 I'm a normal human being.

01:34:08.000 I feel every emotion.

01:34:09.000 So many people say to me, you're never scared.

01:34:11.000 Come on, I'm a human.

01:34:12.000 Fill it all.

01:34:14.000 So I lose the fight.

01:34:16.000 We go in the back and they bring me the fight of the night check.

01:34:19.000 They pay you immediately if you get a bonus.

01:34:21.000 Boom, here's your check.

01:34:22.000 And I remember thinking, you gave me that out of sympathy because that was such a boring fight.

01:34:27.000 Nothing happened.

01:34:28.000 You gave me that out of sympathy.

01:34:29.000 I'll take it.

01:34:30.000 I'm fighting back the tears.

01:34:32.000 I'm just devastated.

01:34:33.000 I'm absolutely devastated by this defeat.

01:34:36.000 And later the fight gets named not only Fight of the Night, it was called Fight of the Year.

01:34:40.000 We won the award from Fighters Only Magazine, which puts on the award show for Fight of the Year.

01:34:46.000 So it ended up being a really good fight, but my point that I'm trying to get at is that's how out of touch I was with what was happening in the ring.

01:34:53.000 You know, at one point my corner man told me it's round four when it was round five or he told me it was round four when it was round three.

01:34:59.000 Whatever it was, the corner had the rounds off.

01:35:02.000 You know, the instruction I was getting was a little bit off.

01:35:04.000 And I just didn't fully know what was going on.

01:35:08.000 And in this next fight I'd like to, you know, as I visualize and plan for it, that's one of the things I'd like to be a little more aware and a little more in touch with what's happening.

01:35:18.000 But it's hard.

01:35:19.000 It's hard on the Octagon, man.

01:35:21.000 A lot of stuff goes out the window.

01:35:22.000 You get hit, you get kicked, you get...

01:35:24.000 It's tough.

01:35:25.000 It's tough to stay focused.

01:35:27.000 How tough is it to describe to someone who's never had that experience?

01:35:30.000 It's almost impossible.

01:35:32.000 You know, I almost can't do it.

01:35:34.000 It's like when, you know, an executive director comes at you and wants to know, like we were talking about earlier, hey, why'd you do this?

01:35:39.000 And you're kind of going, you know, I don't really know how to put it into words, and I don't mean this condescendingly, but obviously you've never been in that spot.

01:35:48.000 Because it's one of those indescribable feelings.

01:35:51.000 And when you have victory...

01:35:53.000 That's also an indescribable feeling.

01:35:55.000 When you make that walk in front of 17,000 people screaming, cheering, booing, whatever it is, that's also an indescribable feeling.

01:36:03.000 So it's a very unique sport, and people will always ask me on game day, are you ready?

01:36:09.000 Are you excited?

01:36:10.000 And are you scared?

01:36:12.000 You'll get these questions, and the answer is no.

01:36:15.000 But I can't tell you what I am either.

01:36:17.000 For all the human emotions that have definitions, I don't know how to describe what it's like on fight day.

01:36:22.000 It's a combination of many things.

01:36:25.000 And if we're going to be truthful, most of them are unpleasant.

01:36:28.000 It's a very stressful situation.

01:36:31.000 You know, you're walking into battle.

01:36:33.000 You've prepared for this and it's all on the line and it's on the line in front of everybody.

01:36:37.000 And there's a great relief if you have victory and a great despair if you have defeat.

01:36:42.000 Absolutely.

01:36:43.000 Proportionately.

01:36:43.000 You used a very interesting word there that surprised me.

01:36:46.000 You said relief.

01:36:48.000 You didn't say happy.

01:36:49.000 You said relief.

01:36:50.000 And Joe, you could not be more correct.

01:36:52.000 I had a fight with Brian Stan after I was out for 14 months dealing after the Anderson loss.

01:36:58.000 I had to deal with the commission.

01:36:59.000 I had to go back and deal with these guys.

01:37:00.000 I got this suspension.

01:37:02.000 Everything puts me out for 14 months.

01:37:05.000 It was eight days later before I was back to myself emotionally because all I was for that week plus was relieved.

01:37:13.000 It was the ultimate exhale of my life.

01:37:16.000 I wasn't happy I won.

01:37:18.000 I wasn't excited.

01:37:19.000 I was relieved it was over.

01:37:22.000 I was just relieved that I made it through.

01:37:25.000 You know, from the weigh-in to the process to the licensing to the battle, I made it through and got out of there.

01:37:31.000 That's very interesting that you used that word.

01:37:33.000 Well, I used to experience that relief from Taekwondo tournaments, which in comparison to MMA is absolutely benign.

01:37:41.000 I mean, it's not even remotely as draining, as physically demanding, as scary, you know, all of the above.

01:37:48.000 But I still would get a great relief when I was done.

01:37:53.000 You know, I'd go through a tournament.

01:37:54.000 It'd be over.

01:37:55.000 I could rest for a couple weeks.

01:37:56.000 I wouldn't have to think.

01:37:57.000 And then when I finally stopped competing completely, it was the weirdest feeling ever.

01:38:01.000 This weird feeling of not worrying about six months in the future.

01:38:05.000 Like, don't have a drink now because if you do, what if you wind up getting drunk and then you can't train as well tomorrow? 0.98

01:38:09.000 And then six weeks in the future, you're off and you lose because you fucked up and you slacked off. 0.94

01:38:15.000 There was always this impending doom cycle. 0.98

01:38:17.000 With MMA, it's got to be a hundred thousand times that.

01:38:20.000 Now, Joe, last time I tried to sneak out of here to go to the bathroom, you made an announcement, chill, you're going to urinate.

01:38:25.000 Don't tell anybody.

01:38:26.000 It embarrasses me.

01:38:27.000 I like to sneak out like a little kid.

01:38:28.000 I'm sorry.

01:38:29.000 So don't mention it.

01:38:30.000 I won't say anything.

01:38:30.000 Okay, I'm going to run out of it, but I don't want you to tell everybody.

01:38:32.000 I won't even talk about it.

01:38:33.000 Are you going to snap one off?

01:38:34.000 Okay, now, Joe, I want to tell you this, though.

01:38:35.000 Okay.

01:38:36.000 When I come back...

01:38:37.000 Yes.

01:38:37.000 Because I don't know what our timeline is, but I have a story that I want to make sure I tell.

01:38:42.000 Do you know who D.B. Cooper is?

01:38:44.000 Yes, I do.

01:38:44.000 Bring him up when I come back.

01:38:46.000 Okay, I will do...

01:38:48.000 Powerful Chelsun and ladies and gentlemen.

01:38:50.000 Is he making a poopy?

01:38:51.000 I don't know what he's doing.

01:38:52.000 I don't ask a man.

01:38:54.000 Ask a man what kind of movements he's doing.

01:38:58.000 So that note, that Samsung Galaxy Note or whatever.

01:39:01.000 Oh, we're talking about that giant cell phone.

01:39:03.000 It's amazing.

01:39:04.000 As no one's seen it, it's pretty much maybe this big.

01:39:09.000 It's 5.3 inches.

01:39:10.000 5.3.

01:39:11.000 So it's almost like a small Kindle or something.

01:39:13.000 It's a small tablet and it's a phone and it slips into your pocket and it has a Crazy processor.

01:39:19.000 Really ridiculously fast.

01:39:21.000 Giant screen. 1.00

01:39:22.000 You can draw on pictures like, suck it, I'm here with stupid. 1.00

01:39:25.000 You can take pictures and like, you can draw on them. 1.00

01:39:27.000 When you watch web pages on it, it's incredible.

01:39:30.000 It's the best cell phone web experience ever.

01:39:33.000 There's been a lot of talks that the iPad is going to have a smaller version, like a 7-inch version. 0.99

01:39:38.000 Unless it's a phone, I don't give a fuck. 0.97

01:39:40.000 They should make a 5-inch phone. 0.99

01:39:42.000 Just make it.

01:39:43.000 Stop it. 1.00

01:39:44.000 We like big shit. 1.00

01:39:45.000 I use my phone half the time to look at my email, half the time to, you know, I mean, between... 1.00

01:39:52.000 50 and 60% of the time is not making phone calls. 0.96

01:39:55.000 It's doing other cool shit. 0.93

01:39:56.000 Getting online. 1.00

01:39:57.000 You don't think a pocket thing is going to be a pain in the ass? 0.99

01:39:59.000 I bet that note is just a pain. 0.99

01:40:01.000 Like having an old trio in your pocket or something.

01:40:04.000 I'm glad you asked this, Brian, because I have recently gone back to the fanny pack.

01:40:07.000 I got a new one.

01:40:08.000 I ordered one from Roots because Andrew Dice Clay had it when we were doing the podcast with him the other day.

01:40:14.000 Remember that?

01:40:14.000 Yeah, you got it.

01:40:15.000 Yeah, I got Dice Clay.

01:40:16.000 I did get a little jealous of his fanny pack.

01:40:19.000 Fantastically designed fanny pack. 1.00

01:40:21.000 I was like, that's a real goddamn fanny pack. 0.98

01:40:23.000 So I ordered one online, and two days later I got it. 0.99

01:40:25.000 I'm very happy.

01:40:27.000 So I'd carry that note around, gladly, inside my fanny pack.

01:40:32.000 I'm bringing back the fanny pack strong.

01:40:34.000 By the way, shout out to Chris Lieben.

01:40:35.000 There was photos of Chris Lieben in Hawaii wearing a fanny pack.

01:40:38.000 Way to go, Chris.

01:40:39.000 Well done.

01:40:40.000 Keep on rocking in the free world.

01:40:42.000 You know, you bring up Chris Lieben, if I can jump in here real fast.

01:40:45.000 I don't know if I'm interrupting something, but I threw an event.

01:40:49.000 I threw an event.

01:40:50.000 It was like an after-party with Chael.

01:40:52.000 And it was a colossal failure.

01:40:54.000 Nobody shows up.

01:40:55.000 We've got 18 people.

01:40:56.000 We've got this whole bar to ourselves.

01:40:57.000 We've got drinks.

01:40:58.000 We've got a DJ. It's a massive failure.

01:41:00.000 So we ended up turning the radio off, and we all just ended up sitting down and talking.

01:41:04.000 And by the end of the night, it couldn't have gone any better.

01:41:06.000 I know everybody.

01:41:07.000 Okay, this guy's on his...

01:41:08.000 You know, his honeymoon.

01:41:10.000 This guy's wife bought him presents.

01:41:11.000 These guys, it's their anniversary.

01:41:13.000 I know everybody in the room.

01:41:14.000 I know them by name.

01:41:15.000 I know what city they're from.

01:41:16.000 We spent about three hours talking.

01:41:18.000 And I'm telling them stories.

01:41:20.000 I'm telling them stories of UFC, behind-the-scenes stuff, you know.

01:41:24.000 And I'm running out of stories.

01:41:25.000 They're like, tell us another story.

01:41:26.000 And I'm like, you know who has great stories?

01:41:28.000 It's Chris Lieben.

01:41:29.000 The problem is he never answers his phone.

01:41:32.000 So they're like, call Chris, you know.

01:41:33.000 So I'm getting peer pressured here.

01:41:34.000 So I'm calling Chris on speaker.

01:41:36.000 He answers his phone.

01:41:36.000 I call him.

01:41:37.000 I go, Lieben, it's jail.

01:41:38.000 I'm at an after party.

01:41:39.000 You're on speaker.

01:41:40.000 I got about 20 people here.

01:41:41.000 They can all hear you.

01:41:43.000 I've been telling stories and I'm out.

01:41:44.000 I need you to tell one.

01:41:45.000 And he's like...

01:41:46.000 You want to tell them a story?

01:41:48.000 Why don't you tell them about the time that my mom hit a deer, load it in the back of her hatchback, forgot about it for two weeks, then her and my uncle come over, throw it on the kitchen table, cut it up with chainsaws.

01:41:59.000 I've been in my room.

01:42:00.000 I've been punished because I got sent home from school in a detention, so they make me sample the meat to make sure it's not rancid, and I end up in the hospital for three weeks with E. coli.

01:42:09.000 Why don't you tell them that story?

01:42:10.000 He doesn't miss a beat.

01:42:12.000 He just rattles this story off.

01:42:13.000 He puts this whole party on its head.

01:42:16.000 I mean, these people, nobody left.

01:42:18.000 They are in shock, including me.

01:42:20.000 I'm in shock.

01:42:21.000 Wait a minute.

01:42:22.000 Your mother...

01:42:23.000 I gotta go.

01:42:24.000 Chris, I gotta go.

01:42:25.000 Thanks.

01:42:25.000 And I just hang up the phone.

01:42:26.000 Oh, my God.

01:42:27.000 And because he did that for me, because he told the story to this disaster party that I threw, I've always been grateful and indebted to him.

01:42:35.000 You know, you saved me.

01:42:35.000 Like, Chris, I owe you one.

01:42:37.000 So there's my shout-out to Chris Lee.

01:42:38.000 But how's that for a great story? 0.99

01:42:40.000 That's a fucking great story. 0.99

01:42:41.000 Oh, it's insane. 1.00

01:42:42.000 Holy shit, what a childhood... 1.00

01:42:44.000 Wow. 1.00

01:42:45.000 Oh, he can go on and on.

01:42:46.000 Chris has some other great stories, you know?

01:42:48.000 Wow.

01:42:49.000 Some guys have a rough, man.

01:42:50.000 That's rough.

01:42:52.000 Wow. 0.99

01:42:52.000 That sucks. 0.99

01:42:53.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:42:56.000 Chris's aunt and uncle greatly raised him.

01:42:58.000 So he goes out on, what do you call it, jet skiing or whatever.

01:43:02.000 Whatever you do on the water skiing.

01:43:04.000 And he's out with his uncle, and his uncle is drinking.

01:43:07.000 And they T-bone a boat. 0.94

01:43:09.000 And his aunt, the uncle's wife, is back on the shore sunbathing.

01:43:13.000 She doesn't go out with him.

01:43:14.000 They T-bone a boat, and they hurt the people.

01:43:17.000 So the people, the wife goes over, and they're helping.

01:43:20.000 The wife of the other boat is going over. 0.99

01:43:22.000 So they get the husband and the wife on the boat. 0.79

01:43:23.000 And, you know, she's not that bad, but she fell over, and her boat doesn't run anymore.

01:43:27.000 So the uncles tell him, listen, listen, I've been drinking.

01:43:29.000 I don't have insurance, but I really will make this up right with you if you just don't call the police.

01:43:35.000 So as a matter of fact, here's my name.

01:43:37.000 Here's my number.

01:43:39.000 Please call me and let's settle this.

01:43:41.000 Yeah, anything.

01:43:42.000 Just get us to shore.

01:43:43.000 I got to get to the hospital, have my leg looked at.

01:43:44.000 They pull up to the shore.

01:43:46.000 The aunt stands up because she sees there's some woman on the boat. 1.00

01:43:50.000 She wants to know what the hell's going on.

01:43:51.000 So she gets a little bit closer and she sees this woman is holding Chris's uncle's, a piece of paper with his name and number on it.

01:43:58.000 She has no idea she's been T-boned.

01:44:00.000 She has no idea they've rescued him, taken him to the hospital and it's her husband's fault. 0.99

01:44:04.000 And she sees the number with his name on it and says, that's my husband, bitch, and slaps the woman who's on her way to the hospital because she She got T-boned by the uncle. 1.00

01:44:13.000 So this is Chris's childhood. 0.98

01:44:15.000 So, you know, you like the Chris Lieben story.

01:44:17.000 I could go on and on and on.

01:44:19.000 As a matter of fact, I bought for $100, I bought a bunch of Chris Lieben stories, but they backfired.

01:44:24.000 Yeah, but then he started telling people that these were his stories.

01:44:27.000 It's like, Chris, that's not your story.

01:44:29.000 That's my story.

01:44:31.000 That didn't happen with your uncle.

01:44:32.000 My uncle did that.

01:44:34.000 And I got the idea from a Seinfeld where Kramer bought a bunch of Peterman stories.

01:44:39.000 So I paid Chris and everything.

01:44:41.000 He took the money.

01:44:42.000 And then he still was trying to claim this stuff happened to him.

01:44:45.000 So it didn't really work out for me.

01:44:49.000 How did you keep this story straight in your head?

01:44:51.000 Well, I just knew because he's got three crazy stories.

01:44:55.000 How many did you buy?

01:44:57.000 I bought them all.

01:44:57.000 I bought the whole gamut.

01:44:59.000 We went to Japan together.

01:45:00.000 It's a nine-hour flight.

01:45:02.000 And so he told story after story.

01:45:04.000 So I bought it.

01:45:04.000 I said, I'll give you $100 for those stories.

01:45:06.000 But he didn't know how it worked.

01:45:08.000 He apparently thought this was some funny deal where he takes my money and goes buys a little sake and sushi.

01:45:13.000 No, no, no.

01:45:14.000 Those are now my stories.

01:45:15.000 He didn't get it.

01:45:15.000 He didn't get the gig.

01:45:16.000 So he double-crossed me, took the money, and he took the stories back.

01:45:20.000 I got nothing.

01:45:20.000 I had to write my own book.

01:45:21.000 I had to write my own stories.

01:45:22.000 Chris Lieben's stories would have been better. 0.99

01:45:25.000 Oh, that's fucking hilarious. 0.91

01:45:27.000 I've never heard of anybody buying someone's stories before. 0.98

01:45:30.000 Yeah, I paid $100 for it.

01:45:31.000 That was a lot of money, but I only got $1,000 for the fight over there. 0.99

01:45:35.000 Holy shit, that's funny. 1.00

01:45:37.000 Oh my god, that is ridiculous. 1.00

01:45:39.000 Now, what the fuck was it like going to Brazil? 1.00

01:45:42.000 You went to Brazil recently. 0.99

01:45:43.000 You know. 0.99

01:45:44.000 After all the shit that you talked about Brazil and Minotauro and the Nogueira brothers. 0.99

01:45:49.000 Okay, now that's funny. 0.99

01:45:50.000 Thinking that a bus was a horse.

01:45:51.000 That's funny you say that because, good for you, because sometimes when you talk about Nogueira, people forget there's two.

01:45:56.000 Right.

01:45:56.000 And there are brothers.

01:45:57.000 You know, you need to be specific.

01:45:58.000 You know, are you talking about the big one or the little one? 0.79

01:46:00.000 Are you talking about the fat one or the bald one?

01:46:02.000 Are you talking about the one that used to be good or the one that never was?

01:46:06.000 And it's important that you say that.

01:46:08.000 So good for you for saying there's brothers.

01:46:10.000 Because a lot of people just think it's the same guy filling in.

01:46:12.000 But there's actually two.

01:46:13.000 What was it like when you went to Brazil?

01:46:14.000 Awesome.

01:46:16.000 You want to know what?

01:46:17.000 I had a great time.

01:46:18.000 Did you really?

01:46:19.000 Brittany got to go.

01:46:20.000 We go out with Dana.

01:46:23.000 And we were only there for four hours.

01:46:25.000 And first off, Rio's beautiful.

01:46:28.000 And I've been to Brazil before.

01:46:29.000 In fact, I was at Abu Dhabi, one that you were at.

01:46:30.000 I don't know if you would have known who I was back then.

01:46:32.000 But when Eddie beat Hoyler.

01:46:36.000 What was it?

01:46:37.000 2003, I believe, in Sao Paulo.

01:46:39.000 In fact, I was there.

01:46:40.000 Ryan Parsons was with us.

01:46:41.000 At any rate, I've been to Brazil before.

01:46:43.000 Were you there with Matt Lindland?

01:46:44.000 And I loved it.

01:46:44.000 I wrestled myself.

01:46:46.000 I lost to Kakariko.

01:46:48.000 Mr. Guillotine.

01:46:49.000 Remember that guy?

01:46:50.000 Yeah.

01:46:50.000 Big and strong?

01:46:51.000 Anyhow.

01:46:51.000 Luta Livre.

01:46:52.000 Speed up the story.

01:46:53.000 So we get there, and we've got our own security detail, and it's tight.

01:46:57.000 I mean, these are some bad-looking dudes.

01:47:00.000 And I'm surrounded with tough-looking guys all the time.

01:47:03.000 This was a whole other level, man.

01:47:04.000 These guys got the scars.

01:47:05.000 These guys got the bullet holes.

01:47:07.000 These guys got the stitching and the whole bit.

01:47:10.000 Anyway, we got this bad team.

01:47:13.000 Now, I've never been on a helicopter, but I love carnivals.

01:47:16.000 I love rides.

01:47:16.000 So we go everywhere by helicopter, which apparently is extremely common in Brazil.

01:47:21.000 It's like the number one Heliport country in the world.

01:47:25.000 So these are good helicopters with pilots.

01:47:27.000 They're very reputable.

01:47:28.000 And next thing I know, we're up in the air.

01:47:30.000 So this is the ultimate carnival ride.

01:47:31.000 Now we're there on a gorgeous day in Rio, which is a gorgeous city, and we've got it from a bird's eye view.

01:47:37.000 I mean, I would take that whole trip, all the risk, all the danger, everything that I had to go through for that 15 minute helicopter ride.

01:47:45.000 I'm a Catholic.

01:47:46.000 I went over this church that's like one of the wonders of the world.

01:47:49.000 It's not quite as, you know, eighth wonder of the world like the pyramids, but it's close, where you look at it and go, how in the heck did you build that hundreds of years ago up on this cliff?

01:47:59.000 There's no roads up to it.

01:48:00.000 It's just incredible.

01:48:00.000 You've got to walk.

01:48:02.000 Well, there's a lot of speculation about the history of Brazil that's come into light recently.

01:48:06.000 I think there's some Roman artifacts they found, some really ancient stuff, and there's some dispute about they found some offshore wreckage or something like that.

01:48:16.000 So they're now thinking that maybe the Romans had even visited Brazil even before the Portuguese.

01:48:22.000 Pretty amazing country when you stop and think about the history of it.

01:48:26.000 Yeah, you know, so...

01:48:27.000 Beautiful place.

01:48:27.000 I have a feeling when you ask me what was it like, I mean, how were we received?

01:48:31.000 Yeah.

01:48:31.000 Was there any threats?

01:48:32.000 And, you know, the way I like to tell it is that it was a scene, man.

01:48:38.000 We were down in the trenches over there, but...

01:48:41.000 You know, the reality, I really liked it there.

01:48:44.000 And it's interesting.

01:48:46.000 Everybody knows who we are there.

01:48:47.000 You know, if I want to be famous in America, Joe, I got to go to a fight.

01:48:50.000 If I go to a fight, I'm a big deal.

01:48:52.000 If I'm not at a fight, I'm not.

01:48:53.000 I'm just a regular guy, which is just fine.

01:48:56.000 But I mean, you know, sometimes people lose sight of that.

01:48:58.000 And in Brazil, they all knew who we were.

01:49:01.000 You know, they definitely knew Dana, and they all knew who I was, and I mean all of them, from the bus drivers to the people, to the people working the desk, to the cops, everybody, the people at the airports.

01:49:11.000 And here's how Dana described it to me.

01:49:12.000 He goes, chill.

01:49:13.000 Everybody watches a playoff game for the NFL in America, right?

01:49:17.000 Everybody watches.

01:49:17.000 I go, yeah, everybody watches a playoff.

01:49:18.000 He goes, okay, that everybody is 15 million Americans.

01:49:21.000 He said in Brazil, 80 million Brazilians tuned in when Anderson and Vitor fought.

01:49:30.000 So those are the kind of numbers.

01:49:31.000 That's how inundated people are with this sport.

01:49:34.000 And that's prior to us bringing them this new Ultimate Fighter with Vandalay and Vitor that's airing.

01:49:39.000 So what I'm getting at is this sport's huge over there.

01:49:42.000 And until you're there, you don't realize it.

01:49:47.000 So at any rate, you know, I'm getting recognized left and right.

01:49:50.000 And that's fun.

01:49:51.000 That's fun for my ego.

01:49:52.000 I'm having a good time.

01:49:53.000 You know, I'm somebody and they want to talk to me.

01:49:55.000 They want an autograph.

01:49:56.000 They're all very nice.

01:49:57.000 Now, I didn't really have time to exhale and enjoy this because I've got so many death threats that are very legitimate.

01:50:04.000 You know, guys not only tell me they're going to kill me, they're telling me how.

01:50:07.000 They're telling me when.

01:50:08.000 They're telling me the lake they're going to drag my body into.

01:50:12.000 I've got this security team because the UFC's been warned.

01:50:15.000 So I'm on edge constantly, and I see some kid.

01:50:19.000 Is that the kid?

01:50:20.000 Is this the guy?

01:50:21.000 I'm constantly looking around.

01:50:22.000 I'm only human.

01:50:23.000 This is how my mind's working.

01:50:25.000 So by the time we left, the experience was great looking back.

01:50:28.000 At the time I was there, you're on edge.

01:50:31.000 You know, you're looking around.

01:50:32.000 Who's the guy?

01:50:33.000 Who's the guy?

01:50:34.000 You know, my dad had a real basic rule when you thought you were in trouble.

01:50:36.000 Don't let anybody within arm's reach.

01:50:38.000 If the guy comes within arm's reach, hit him. 0.99

01:50:41.000 Don't wait for this first punch crap. 0.99

01:50:43.000 If you feel you're in danger and he gets within arm's reach, you strike first and get out of there. 0.99

01:50:47.000 Everybody's on you like this.

01:50:48.000 So I'm going against the most basic rule my own father taught me when I'm seven years old, and that's let people in close when you're scared.

01:50:56.000 So I've got my back up against the wall.

01:50:58.000 I'm following his second rule, but the first one's completely broken, but we had a good time.

01:51:04.000 The fight was supposed to take place, for people who don't know, the rematch between Chael and folks who aren't following MMA. A lot of people that listen to this podcast aren't even MMA fans.

01:51:15.000 After the Anderson Silva fight, you said a bunch of crazy shit about Brazil, about You insulted them quite a bit. 0.51

01:51:24.000 And then they were going to have the rematch in an 80,000-seat soccer arena in Brazil. 0.93

01:51:30.000 But unfortunately, because the UN is having a visit there two days before, there was no hotels.

01:51:36.000 It was logistically almost impossible to bring that many people into an 80,000-seat arena.

01:51:41.000 It wasn't going to happen.

01:51:42.000 So it's been moved to Las Vegas.

01:51:45.000 Was that good?

01:51:46.000 Were you happy when it was moved to Vegas?

01:51:48.000 You know, if I have to answer you yes or no, the answer is yes.

01:51:52.000 But there's also a tremendous no.

01:51:54.000 And the no is simply that I was going to get to be part of history.

01:51:58.000 And the current record is Toronto.

01:52:02.000 St. Pierre versus Shields, 55,000 live.

01:52:06.000 We were going to do 80,000 to 100,000 live.

01:52:10.000 And that would have been very hard to beat.

01:52:12.000 So I could have taken that record for not only currently, but maybe into my future years and pass that story down to generations.

01:52:20.000 And, you know, again, that's an ego boost.

01:52:22.000 And there's something to be said for that if we're being candid that I'd want.

01:52:26.000 The other side of it is, geez, I don't want to fly 14 hours anywhere while I'm cutting weight.

01:52:31.000 Now, somebody has to.

01:52:33.000 Anderson did it the last time, and we fought in California.

01:52:36.000 So, in fairness, I'll go out there.

01:52:38.000 How much does Anderson cut?

01:52:39.000 I don't know.

01:52:40.000 He probably weighs about 220. I've been next to him, and he looks as big as me.

01:52:43.000 I'm right around 220. He's a little taller, so it's hard to judge.

01:52:47.000 But, you know, look, Anderson lives in California, so he flies two hours to Vegas.

01:52:51.000 I'm in Oregon.

01:52:52.000 It's two hours to Vegas.

01:52:53.000 We both got home field advantage.

01:52:54.000 What's the difference?

01:52:56.000 In that aspect of it.

01:52:58.000 Yeah, the cutting weight is a very strange aspect of MMA, isn't it?

01:53:02.000 It's really almost like an art and a discipline in and of itself.

01:53:05.000 And a battle.

01:53:06.000 You could be a black belt in cutting weight or you could be a white belt.

01:53:10.000 And to compare it to being like martial arts, like you said, it is.

01:53:13.000 Some guys are skilled in it.

01:53:15.000 Some guys are experts.

01:53:16.000 You got your Mike Dolce.

01:53:17.000 They got more secrets than you could imagine to get weight off.

01:53:20.000 And other guys aren't.

01:53:21.000 Other guys starve because they don't know what else to do.

01:53:24.000 Or they miss weight.

01:53:25.000 You know, we see guys miss weight, too.

01:53:27.000 And that's a big deal.

01:53:27.000 When you sign a contract, that's part of it.

01:53:30.000 You've got to honor that.

01:53:31.000 How much of your thought process would have been dedicated if there was a fight?

01:53:37.000 How much of it would have been just to be worried about your safety constantly?

01:53:41.000 Worried about your food being poisoned? 0.99

01:53:43.000 Worry about someone fucking with you? 0.99

01:53:45.000 I mean, what would it have been like to compete under that sort of an environment? 0.99

01:53:49.000 Folks who don't know...

01:53:50.000 I've never seen a crowd more nationalistic than Brazil.

01:53:53.000 It's amazing how patriotic they are.

01:53:55.000 That's the way you should be.

01:53:55.000 They get it right.

01:53:56.000 They get it right. 1.00

01:53:57.000 They fucking get it right. 0.96

01:53:58.000 You should back your guy. 0.98

01:53:59.000 I like that.

01:54:00.000 They do that in England, but in England, they also, when a fighter wins, a guy wins, they applaud his skill.

01:54:06.000 Even if a guy beats a hometown guy.

01:54:08.000 I've seen it in London.

01:54:09.000 I've seen them applaud when a fighter beat a local English guy when they were talking afterwards.

01:54:14.000 But, man, that doesn't happen in Brazil.

01:54:16.000 Mike Pyle won.

01:54:17.000 He beat Ricardo Funch. 0.98

01:54:18.000 And they were all together chanting some sort of gay slur. 0.98

01:54:22.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:54:23.000 Portuguese gay slur. 0.89

01:54:25.000 No, I'm aware. 0.72

01:54:25.000 Yeah. 0.72

01:54:25.000 And I was like, wow. 0.72

01:54:26.000 You know, that's unfortunate when that happens.

01:54:27.000 You know, you don't want to behave like a savage or uncivilized.

01:54:30.000 I mean, we are in a society here.

01:54:31.000 And if you're a fan and you buy a ticket, you can cheer or boo whoever you want.

01:54:34.000 But that's where it ends.

01:54:35.000 Don't touch a guy.

01:54:36.000 I won't touch.

01:54:36.000 Yeah.

01:54:37.000 I don't like all the fans.

01:54:38.000 I like most of them.

01:54:38.000 I don't like them all.

01:54:39.000 But I never touch one.

01:54:41.000 But the same thing goes for them.

01:54:42.000 If you're a fan, you don't reach over that rail and slap at a guy and throw your drink on him.

01:54:46.000 What do you think it would have been like, though, if you had won in Brazil in front of 80,000 people?

01:54:51.000 It would have been a scene.

01:54:51.000 I don't think they could have controlled it.

01:54:53.000 They swore that they could.

01:54:55.000 They'd have presidential security there.

01:54:56.000 They were planning to have the president of Brazil there, so they'd have their secret service.

01:55:00.000 It's like, guys, you can't do it.

01:55:01.000 There was just a soccer game.

01:55:03.000 There was just a soccer game and 73 people were trampled to death.

01:55:07.000 You know, you can't control crowds when they decide to storm.

01:55:11.000 It's displaced responsibility.

01:55:11.000 You just can't.

01:55:13.000 I'm a sociologist.

01:55:13.000 I've studied this.

01:55:15.000 I've written papers on displaced responsibility.

01:55:17.000 You can't control that, especially when I'm the main event.

01:55:21.000 And the relevance to that is it means the beer started pouring five hours earlier.

01:55:26.000 So now you're not only talking to an insightful crowd, you're talking about a drunk crowd.

01:55:30.000 And what I'm referring to is if I beat Anderson up.

01:55:33.000 I go into Brazil, I stomp their hero, and then I'm going to do an interview with you.

01:55:37.000 And it's not going to stop, and I'm not going to apologize to any one of them.

01:55:41.000 So how they thought they were going to control that, I don't know.

01:55:46.000 What did you think was going to happen?

01:55:48.000 I think it would have been bad.

01:55:50.000 I think it would have been very, very bad.

01:55:52.000 And I would not have backed off one bit.

01:55:55.000 Why is that?

01:55:56.000 Because I'm not going to change.

01:55:58.000 I'm going to dance with the one that brought me.

01:56:00.000 I'm going to be aggressive.

01:56:01.000 I'm going to be in your face. 0.69

01:56:02.000 I'm going to get my mind right, my approach right.

01:56:04.000 I'm going to do my job as soon as Bruce Buffer gets out of my way.

01:56:08.000 And that's it.

01:56:09.000 And I can't change.

01:56:10.000 I mean, I don't know how to change.

01:56:11.000 This is what I'm programmed to do. 0.79

01:56:13.000 And, you know, I hate to talk like one of those maniacs. 0.87

01:56:16.000 I'd have given my life, blah, blah, blah.

01:56:18.000 But, Joe, I swear to your hand to God, I'd have given my life to win that championship if I had to.

01:56:24.000 Whoa.

01:56:27.000 I mean, let's not forget, this isn't tough guy talk.

01:56:29.000 I signed the contract to go to Brazil to do the fight.

01:56:32.000 And in my heart, I thought, I don't know how this is going to go.

01:56:34.000 I made my mother promise she wouldn't go.

01:56:36.000 My mother doesn't get it.

01:56:38.000 She's an older woman.

01:56:38.000 She's got a ruby or a diamond on every finger.

01:56:41.000 You don't go into South America like that, let alone a fight.

01:56:44.000 It was just one of those deals, but look, this is what I'm going to do.

01:56:50.000 That's a crazy stance, man.

01:56:52.000 That's a crazy mindset.

01:56:53.000 I agree.

01:56:55.000 I don't know that I'm proud of that.

01:56:56.000 I don't mean to sit here and sound like a big tough guy.

01:56:58.000 That's not really what I'm doing.

01:56:59.000 I'm just trying to be candid, but this is what I'm going to do.

01:57:01.000 I've worked my whole life for it, and if this is how it ends, this is how it ends, but I'm going to get that before I go.

01:57:05.000 You can't really discount the amount of a boost the hometown fighter would get from a crowd like that or the amount of shock the opponent would get from 80,000 people booing you.

01:57:18.000 And you were ready to jump right into that.

01:57:20.000 Well, that was one of my favorite things.

01:57:21.000 Some guys beg for applause.

01:57:23.000 I've seen some fighters.

01:57:24.000 It hurts their feelings.

01:57:26.000 John Jones, gosh, he hates if anybody boos.

01:57:29.000 I'm on the other side of that, man.

01:57:31.000 I like it.

01:57:33.000 I like it.

01:57:34.000 And I love it when they cheer, too.

01:57:35.000 I'm not the guy that feeds off negativity, but I do feed off of it.

01:57:38.000 If a guy will pay $3.50 for an overpriced drink at the MGM and throw it on me, that's a compliment to me.

01:57:46.000 If I've incited him that much, he's a fan.

01:57:49.000 How often does that happen?

01:57:50.000 It's happened a few times, you know, where they've thrown something.

01:57:53.000 I've actually never had a drink.

01:57:55.000 I had one guy so mad he took his own hat off his head and threw it at me.

01:57:58.000 But, you know, you get the point.

01:57:58.000 He missed.

01:58:00.000 I kind of felt like I always wanted to hand it back to him.

01:58:04.000 You know, it's one of those deals.

01:58:05.000 But, you know, they get so insightful.

01:58:07.000 But, you know, don't forget the other side of that coin.

01:58:08.000 Not only are they upset with me, but they're cheering their guy.

01:58:12.000 You know, if you want to back your guy, you're a fan, man.

01:58:16.000 You work hard for that money.

01:58:17.000 You took the night off.

01:58:18.000 You know, you talk dad into bringing you out to the fight.

01:58:22.000 Don't touch anybody, but be a fan.

01:58:24.000 Even if that means to boo, so what?

01:58:27.000 That's interesting.

01:58:27.000 That's a very interesting point of view.

01:58:29.000 I would prefer people not boo because it's kind of cunty and it's disrespectful for someone who is doing what is essentially the most difficult sport known to man and doing it for your amusement. 1.00

01:58:41.000 And just because it doesn't go the way of the fighter that you like, you're going to boo and hiss and say stupid shit. 0.99

01:58:47.000 That shows a massive level of immaturity that I don't necessarily think we need in this world. 1.00

01:58:52.000 I think it's 2012 and you stupid asses need to catch up. 1.00

01:58:56.000 Sure. 1.00

01:58:56.000 That's what I think. 1.00

01:58:57.000 I think that's a fair opinion. 1.00

01:58:58.000 When I hear people boo at a good fight, I'm like, that can't be anybody other than a fucking moron. 1.00

01:59:04.000 And I hear that. 1.00

01:59:05.000 I'll hear that at places.

01:59:06.000 And sometimes I bite my tongue and sometimes I don't.

01:59:08.000 But sometimes people are booing a good fight, a good positional battle.

01:59:13.000 They don't understand it, so they're booing.

01:59:15.000 Or it goes to the ground, so they're booing. 1.00

01:59:17.000 It's so stupid and disrespectful. 1.00

01:59:19.000 Meanwhile, these same dumb fucks will sit there and watch baseball. 1.00

01:59:23.000 They'll watch a live baseball game. 1.00

01:59:25.000 One of the most boring events known to man.

01:59:28.000 Something that you could never introduce to another country in 2012. You could never bring baseball today.

01:59:34.000 They'd be like, bitch, that's boring as fuck. 1.00

01:59:36.000 Good for you for saying that. 1.00

01:59:37.000 Silly hit the ball with a stick game. 0.99

01:59:39.000 You look at football, and people just adored in this country. 0.98

01:59:42.000 Again, good for them, but in a four-and-a-half-hour NFL game, there's seven-and-a-half minutes of action.

01:59:48.000 If you start the time and you turn it off, I can't play along that that's exciting.

01:59:53.000 I don't know that I have ADD, but I do for that.

01:59:57.000 And then you're going to take a break.

01:59:59.000 And then these big, large, they're all muscled up, and they run to their mailbox.

02:00:03.000 They've got to stop at the neighbor's kid's lemonade stand.

02:00:06.000 They're so out of shape.

02:00:07.000 These guys, for seven and a half minutes, you know how many times they go to the water bucket?

02:00:11.000 What are you doing, guy?

02:00:12.000 How are you possibly tired?

02:00:14.000 I've been sitting there doing your show for several hours.

02:00:17.000 I don't need anything to drink.

02:00:19.000 They're drinking.

02:00:20.000 I don't get it.

02:00:22.000 Some people cheer these guys.

02:00:23.000 It's like, good for you.

02:00:24.000 I know I'm the minority.

02:00:25.000 I'm the one missing out.

02:00:27.000 My life would be better if I could really get into sports and have something to do on Sunday.

02:00:30.000 Why would it be better?

02:00:31.000 Because I'd have something to do.

02:00:33.000 Go fishing.

02:00:34.000 I used to have to count down UFCs, which were five a year.

02:00:38.000 Six a year, and then Pride would do four or five.

02:00:40.000 I would count those days down.

02:00:42.000 Literally count them down.

02:00:43.000 Me and my dad would be talking, Tank Abbott's going to fight this guy.

02:00:46.000 Let's not miss it.

02:00:46.000 We're going to have a party.

02:00:49.000 So what I'm saying is if I could get in that same passion for other sports, I'd have a better life.

02:00:53.000 I'd have hobbies.

02:00:54.000 I'd have something to do.

02:00:54.000 Like my friends that sit up and they watch SportsCenter and somehow they're entertained by that.

02:00:58.000 I don't get it.

02:00:59.000 I don't think that's good.

02:01:00.000 I think you're better off without it.

02:01:02.000 I don't think it's bad to have one or two sports that you're into.

02:01:04.000 There's nothing wrong with that. 0.99

02:01:06.000 But I know guys who their whole life is just following other people doing shit. 0.99

02:01:10.000 I hear you. 1.00

02:01:11.000 I hear you.

02:01:11.000 That happens a lot.

02:01:13.000 I can't get behind football.

02:01:14.000 I appreciate it.

02:01:15.000 I respect them as athletes.

02:01:16.000 Some incredible athletes in football.

02:01:17.000 But to me, it's just...

02:01:19.000 I don't care what you do with that ball.

02:01:20.000 It doesn't mean anything to me.

02:01:22.000 No, I understand.

02:01:23.000 I mean, I was on Jim Rome earlier today, and it's like, you know, Jim, how many times have you had to sit here and interview a golfer or a tennis player or a NASCAR guy?

02:01:33.000 Could you imagine being a NASCAR?

02:01:34.000 You push your foot down, and you make left turns all afternoon long, and somehow that's some meaningful event to society.

02:01:42.000 And I'm scratching my head going, you know, I wish that I was one of those guys that enjoyed this, but I don't get you're making left turns all Sunday afternoon.

02:01:51.000 So what?

02:01:52.000 damning appraisals of America.

02:01:54.000 Yeah, and I don't understand it. 0.98

02:01:56.000 I'm talking to Jim Rome, and it's like, you know, Jim, good for you.

02:01:58.000 You finally got somebody, and you're welcoming.

02:02:02.000 He is very welcome.

02:02:03.000 He's an absolute ally to the UFC. Dana White went on a rant one time.

02:02:07.000 It was great against ESPN, where Dana was mad. 1.00

02:02:10.000 And then he finishes by going, the only thing good is Jim Rome.

02:02:14.000 He made sure to give Jim that prop, because Jim deserves it.

02:02:17.000 He's one of those leaders that came out, and he embraced martial arts and the UFC, to be specific.

02:02:23.000 Yeah.

02:02:23.000 Yeah, good for him.

02:02:24.000 I'm glad he did that.

02:02:25.000 Now I want to tell you this story.

02:02:27.000 Please.

02:02:27.000 Okay.

02:02:28.000 So I wrote this book, The Voice of Reason, which comes out tomorrow.

02:02:31.000 Let me give myself a cheap book.

02:02:32.000 A VIP pass to enlightenment.

02:02:33.000 Thank you very much.

02:02:34.000 VIP pass to enlightenment.

02:02:35.000 Hits the bookshelves tomorrow.

02:02:36.000 It's available right now at Amazon.com.

02:02:38.000 This isn't a plug for the book.

02:02:39.000 That was the plug.

02:02:40.000 I'm done.

02:02:40.000 Okay.

02:02:42.000 I want to tell you a story, and I've only told this story twice in my life, so I don't know if I'm good at telling it.

02:02:47.000 I told this.

02:02:48.000 See, when you write a book these days, you don't actually have to write anything.

02:02:52.000 You talk it all out.

02:02:53.000 It all goes into the stents of whatever they call it, and then they go back and they type it out for you.

02:02:59.000 So I tell this story, and I know who D.B. Cooper is.

02:03:05.000 My whole family knows, and it's been like a family secret for a number of years.

02:03:12.000 So you know who the guy is?

02:03:13.000 I know who he is.

02:03:14.000 He's alive and well.

02:03:15.000 And a lot of times over the past few years, somebody will be on their deathbed.

02:03:19.000 You know, this just happened about four years ago.

02:03:21.000 A guy's on his deathbed, and he comes out and says, I'm D.B. Cooper.

02:03:23.000 And he tells his whole family, and they go to the media.

02:03:25.000 And the media jumps behind and says, well, it must be true, because why else would you want to go down as a criminal on your deathbed?

02:03:32.000 And I'm sitting there, and I told everybody that would listen, when they look into these facts that this guy's putting out, I assure you, that won't be D.B. I told everybody, but I never told them why.

02:03:41.000 I never told them how I was so confident.

02:03:43.000 It's my big, big worldwide news.

02:03:44.000 D.B. Cooper case, finally saw.

02:03:46.000 And then they unraveled it, and sure enough, it wasn't.

02:03:48.000 But I told everybody that wasn't him.

02:03:49.000 Well, the reason I knew it wasn't him is I know who D.B. Cooper is.

02:03:52.000 My whole family knew, and it was a secret, and my father passed away.

02:03:55.000 So now my oath to keep it a secret has also passed away.

02:04:00.000 I don't feel that I can't reveal this story.

02:04:04.000 He's alive and well.

02:04:05.000 I know exactly who he is, so I tell the story in my book.

02:04:07.000 And, you know, there's a lot of things that happen in the D.B. Cooper case, and so I need to really make this short or I could take up your whole show with this.

02:04:14.000 For folks who don't know who D.B. Cooper is, why don't you explain that?

02:04:17.000 Very famous.

02:04:18.000 He's the world's most famous hijacker.

02:04:20.000 And I believe he's the most famous, one, because he was never caught, but two, he may have been the first hijacker.

02:04:26.000 And I want to say this happened like in the 70s.

02:04:29.000 And D.B. Cooper hijacks a plane.

02:04:31.000 He makes it through security.

02:04:32.000 Security's totally different back then.

02:04:34.000 Gets on board.

02:04:34.000 He's in a cheap disguise.

02:04:36.000 He orders the plane to be touched down.

02:04:38.000 Says he's got a device, a bomb.

02:04:40.000 A bomb in his bag.

02:04:42.000 Shows it to a flight attendant.

02:04:43.000 They touch down.

02:04:45.000 There he is.

02:04:46.000 Now, that's a sketch deposit.

02:04:48.000 Of course, nobody knows what he actually looks like.

02:04:50.000 But that's the sketch deposit, if the viewers can see that.

02:04:53.000 So, at any rate, they touch the plane down.

02:04:55.000 They bring him his $200,000 in cash and unmarked bills, and they go back up.

02:04:58.000 Well, while they're up, he parachutes.

02:04:59.000 They don't know he's got a parachute.

02:05:01.000 Now...

02:05:02.000 Where the story gets interesting is he was never found, but the money wasn't either.

02:05:06.000 No sign of him was found.

02:05:08.000 His parachute wasn't found.

02:05:10.000 His body wasn't found.

02:05:11.000 And one of the things that was a problem is where he jumped was a mass forest.

02:05:16.000 I mean, miles upon miles.

02:05:19.000 Hundreds and hundreds of thousands of square acres of nothing but forest.

02:05:23.000 So basically, what any expert would say is, look, he didn't make it.

02:05:26.000 If he even made the fall, he would have been eaten by coyotes or bears.

02:05:30.000 There's good reason why we never found his body, and it's not because he made it out of there alive.

02:05:35.000 Okay, now you need a couple of those details.

02:05:38.000 So, how do I know him?

02:05:40.000 A family friend.

02:05:42.000 And I put this all in the book.

02:05:43.000 I put all of this in the book.

02:05:44.000 And the publisher didn't use it.

02:05:46.000 And the reason he wouldn't use it is because I won't tell the name.

02:05:50.000 I tell the whole story.

02:05:51.000 I'm about to do that for you now.

02:05:52.000 But I don't reveal the name.

02:05:53.000 He goes, without a name, I can't use it.

02:05:56.000 I go, wait. 0.97

02:05:56.000 That's ridiculous. 0.97

02:05:57.000 I can touch on every single detail. 0.88

02:05:59.000 And I'm telling my publisher, going, hey, I don't think you know who D.B. Cooper is.

02:06:03.000 I think you should Google him.

02:06:05.000 There's movies made on him.

02:06:07.000 Prison Break just had a character pretending to be D.B. Cooper.

02:06:09.000 Folklore has been made out of this guy.

02:06:12.000 Well, where this guy jumped was government land, but that land backed up to Indian land, and this gentleman was part Indian, and he grew up in this forest.

02:06:24.000 This is where he spent his summers.

02:06:26.000 Months after months, they would go out and camp in there, you know, in between school breaks.

02:06:30.000 From the time he was a little kid all the way on, he knew right where he was jumping, and if anybody could have made it, It was this guy.

02:06:37.000 Now, my dad grew up with this guy.

02:06:38.000 He was a family friend.

02:06:40.000 And back then, parachuting, well, much like now, is very uncommon.

02:06:43.000 If somebody does it, you go tell all your friends, ah, I found this parachuting class, and I'm going to do it.

02:06:47.000 And they take pictures, and they show it up.

02:06:48.000 This guy was taking parachuting lessons.

02:06:50.000 He didn't tell anybody.

02:06:52.000 And he started taking motorcycle classes and stuff.

02:06:55.000 He wasn't telling anybody.

02:06:56.000 He was racing these bikes.

02:06:57.000 And that's what my dad personally believes, though he never got the story, that he parachuted, had a hidden motorcycle, and rolled it out.

02:07:03.000 That's my dad's personal theory.

02:07:05.000 So, you know, all this stuff comes down, and many years later, the statute of limitations is up, and all of a sudden, this guy starts collecting a pretty good assortment of toys, from shotguns to four-wheelers to motorhomes.

02:07:19.000 My dad's known him his whole life.

02:07:20.000 He knows what the guy does for a living.

02:07:21.000 He knows what his wife does, and he, what the heck's going on here?

02:07:24.000 You know, where are you getting all this money?

02:07:26.000 And the guy says, well, you know, I'm an Indian, and And when you reach a certain age, you get some Indian money.

02:07:31.000 And there's some truth to that.

02:07:32.000 There is Indian money that's given out if you're a native living in America.

02:07:36.000 But you're talking about like $1,800 a year.

02:07:39.000 And when you get older, about $3,000 a year.

02:07:41.000 This guy came into a wide assortment of money.

02:07:45.000 Well, the sketches came out of D.B. Cooper, and it's a spitting image of the guy.

02:07:50.000 That picture that we looked at?

02:07:51.000 Yeah.

02:07:52.000 Well, there was different ones of him in the disguise with the mustache and the whole bit.

02:07:56.000 But they're going, hey, wait a minute.

02:07:57.000 This looks just like you.

02:07:59.000 So, you know, one night my aunt asks them.

02:08:03.000 They're at dinner.

02:08:05.000 My parents are there.

02:08:05.000 They're all family friends.

02:08:06.000 My aunt and uncle are there.

02:08:07.000 This guy and his wife are there.

02:08:08.000 My aunt looks across the table and flat out says, are you D.B. Cooper?

02:08:12.000 And he said no.

02:08:14.000 But the way that he said no told everybody there that he was, and they never brought it up again, ever.

02:08:21.000 Now, as it came out, and my uncle asked him a little bit in private, hey, well, you know, that other night we were having some Chinese food, and you...

02:08:28.000 Well...

02:08:29.000 My parents and uncles weren't the only one that thought he was.

02:08:33.000 The government did too.

02:08:34.000 So the FBI had visited this guy, and he even moved away for a while, went to Arizona, and then slowly came back.

02:08:41.000 But he was talked to by the FBI. They thought he was D.B. Cooper as well.

02:08:44.000 So when my dad was on his deathbed, he and I had a...

02:08:51.000 You ask me whatever you want, I'll ask you, and I'll tell you how the story really happened.

02:08:55.000 It's a bit of a fun moment between father and son.

02:08:58.000 Everybody leaves the room and says, hey, what really happened that night when you came in at 2 a.m.

02:09:02.000 smelling like bourbon?

02:09:03.000 What really happened that day the principal called and claimed that you and your friends were...

02:09:07.000 So we kind of go back and forth, and I ask him flat out, is blah, blah, blah D.B. Cooper?

02:09:12.000 And my dad said, well...

02:09:14.000 All the evidence is saying that he is.

02:09:16.000 Your uncle believes it, your aunt believes it, and your mom believes it.

02:09:19.000 I don't think he had the courage.

02:09:21.000 I don't think he was.

02:09:22.000 So my dad's final ruling on his deathbed was no.

02:09:25.000 He said he wasn't.

02:09:27.000 But he's D.B. Cooper.

02:09:30.000 Really?

02:09:31.000 Absolutely.

02:09:32.000 There was another theory that D.B. Cooper was a serial killer.

02:09:35.000 That he was a guy who had killed his family, I believe.

02:09:39.000 Let's see if you can find that.

02:09:40.000 What are you looking up?

02:09:41.000 Ted Cooper's?

02:09:42.000 Is it some chick who's clamming? 1.00

02:09:43.000 How is he looking this up so fast?

02:09:45.000 It's like you or I have the thought and he's got it on the screen.

02:09:48.000 How is he doing that?

02:09:49.000 He's got nimble fingers.

02:09:50.000 That's very impressive.

02:09:52.000 But I tell the story and they don't put it in the book.

02:09:54.000 He goes, listen, I can't put it in the book if you won't say the guy's name.

02:09:56.000 I go, well, it's my father's story and I can't do it.

02:09:59.000 I can't do it. 0.83

02:10:00.000 It's a pretty goddamn good story. 0.96

02:10:01.000 That's one of those rare folklore type stories where it just gets passed on and on. 0.96

02:10:06.000 And the guy jumped in Washington State.

02:10:08.000 You know, the jump, D.B. Cooper, and he jumped in Washington State.

02:10:11.000 The guy lived in Oregon.

02:10:12.000 You lived in Oregon most of your life, right?

02:10:12.000 That's where he went.

02:10:14.000 Yeah, I'm still there.

02:10:15.000 Bigfoot, yes or no?

02:10:17.000 Well, absolutely yes.

02:10:19.000 Yeah, but, you know, the Bigfoot makes it sound like you're some conspiracy theorist.

02:10:19.000 Really?

02:10:23.000 I believe they're a Sasquatch, and I believe this because people that I believe and trust, including a doctor, has said, look, I know where they are.

02:10:31.000 He knows where they are.

02:10:32.000 Yeah, he says it's very hard to get to, and he's got this plan.

02:10:34.000 He's got this big grand plan.

02:10:35.000 He's a survivalist.

02:10:36.000 He's got this whole plan lined up about how we can get to him, and his personal belief, and, you know, it's just a theory, but he lives in that part because Bigfoot's supposed to be from the Northwest.

02:10:45.000 Yeah.

02:10:45.000 He lives in those hills where all these Bigfoot stories come from.

02:10:48.000 And he's like, look, it's not a Bigfoot like it's some wild monster living out there.

02:10:52.000 I believe there's a pack, a family of Sasquatch that just haven't been discovered.

02:10:57.000 We haven't photographed and learned about them.

02:10:59.000 I believe there's an entire tribe of these Bigfoot.

02:11:01.000 Wow.

02:11:02.000 Well, how come no bodies, no nothing, no good pictures? 1.00

02:11:04.000 All the pictures are bullshit. 1.00

02:11:06.000 All the stories have holes in them. 1.00

02:11:08.000 Oh, tremendously.

02:11:10.000 Tremendously.

02:11:10.000 Have you ever watched Finding Bigfoot or any of those shows?

02:11:12.000 I'm embarrassed to admit to you that I think there is a Sasquatch, you know, because I know the kind of people that that attract.

02:11:12.000 Yeah, I do.

02:11:18.000 Well, I'm asking because you lived up there, and that's where most of the Sasquatches are. 0.93

02:11:22.000 Northern California.

02:11:23.000 You know, they talk about the bodies, but the truth is, what bodies do you ever find?

02:11:26.000 You know, bears are out there, coyotes are out there.

02:11:28.000 Do you ever walk through the forest and find bear carcasses or coyotes?

02:11:31.000 You know, you sure don't.

02:11:32.000 To your point, there's a number of hoaxes. 0.99

02:11:35.000 There's a number of guys dressed up in a stupid outfit that you could buy any Halloween, run through while his buddy records it, and they stick it on the internet. 0.91

02:11:43.000 I get that there's hoaxes, but there is some pretty good footage. 0.99

02:11:46.000 You said there was none.

02:11:47.000 There's some very good footage.

02:11:48.000 As a matter of fact, I've done a lot of work in the movie business and stunts and stuff.

02:11:52.000 And this topic comes up on Hollywood sets.

02:11:55.000 And these are the best guys on earth for designing things to look like humans.

02:12:00.000 And they've said that there is one video where as he moves, the muscles and the body part move.

02:12:05.000 And stunt coordinators and makeup and costume people in Hollywood say there is no costume created to do that.

02:12:14.000 Okay.

02:12:15.000 They don't all say that.

02:12:17.000 Some of them do say that. 1.00

02:12:18.000 Some of them do say that, and I think they're idiots. 1.00

02:12:21.000 And I think if you look at that, that's a man in a fucking monkey suit. 1.00

02:12:24.000 And it's not even a good monkey suit. 0.99

02:12:26.000 And the man who did it, this guy Patterson.

02:12:28.000 Look up the Patterson Bigfoot footage.

02:12:31.000 The guy, Patterson, was a con artist.

02:12:33.000 Not only was he a con artist, he was arrested for writing a bad check to buy the very camera that made that video.

02:12:39.000 Him and another guy conveniently went looking for Bigfoot and found a video.

02:12:44.000 I would be embarrassed if you break this right in front of me, because I've looked into this too, because I live in that area.

02:12:48.000 I find it fascinating.

02:12:49.000 I believe it's very possible.

02:12:51.000 You know one of the reasons why I believe it's possible?

02:12:52.000 Because Jane Goodall said it's possible.

02:12:54.000 Yes, this is the exact video.

02:12:56.000 That's a guy in a monkey suit, bro.

02:12:57.000 That doesn't even look good. 1.00

02:12:58.000 It looks stupid. 1.00

02:13:00.000 Look at his big fat stupid fucking shirt he has on. 1.00

02:13:03.000 Big hairy fucking shirt. 1.00

02:13:04.000 And big stupid looking shoes. 1.00

02:13:06.000 That's a terrible monkey suit. 1.00

02:13:08.000 And he's just hunched over.

02:13:09.000 And see, that looks good to me.

02:13:10.000 Eh, come on, man. 1.00

02:13:11.000 Back that shit up again. 1.00

02:13:13.000 There's other ones, Brian, that have been leveled. 0.99

02:13:16.000 See, that's the footage of him falling down.

02:13:20.000 Some people have sent it through computers.

02:13:22.000 There you go.

02:13:23.000 That's a better video of it.

02:13:25.000 No, no, we just saw back then.

02:13:26.000 You just had it in the middle.

02:13:28.000 It's better.

02:13:30.000 Now, again, I do want to be clear before I become the conspiracy theorist.

02:13:33.000 Oh, that's what it is.

02:13:34.000 I'm sorry.

02:13:34.000 The beginning of it is Zoom.

02:13:35.000 I don't believe that there's one monster.

02:13:38.000 I believe that there's a Sasquatch family.

02:13:40.000 Yeah, and I was told this by a guy that I trust.

02:13:42.000 That's how everything works. 1.00

02:13:43.000 Look at the skinny-ass fucking legs. 1.00

02:13:45.000 Well, I got to tell you. 1.00

02:13:46.000 That is not... 1.00

02:13:47.000 That's so stupid looking. 1.00

02:13:48.000 You're making a pretty darn good case right now, Joe. 1.00

02:13:50.000 Pause that shit. 1.00

02:13:51.000 I'm going to have to say... 1.00

02:13:52.000 I'm starting to rethink...

02:13:54.000 But this is actually the video I was referring to.

02:13:55.000 Come on. 0.99

02:13:56.000 Look how dumb that looks. 1.00

02:13:57.000 It's got tits, too. 1.00

02:13:58.000 What's that? 0.99

02:14:00.000 They have double Ds?

02:14:01.000 Is that what gorillas have? 1.00

02:14:03.000 Get the fuck out of here, bitch. 1.00

02:14:04.000 That's fake. 1.00

02:14:05.000 That's fake as fuck. 1.00

02:14:06.000 I have a good fake meter and he looks at that thing. 1.00

02:14:09.000 I look at his big stupid looking shoes that he's wearing. 1.00

02:14:11.000 Those aren't feet. 1.00

02:14:12.000 Get out of here. 1.00

02:14:13.000 That's a fucking monkey suit. 1.00

02:14:15.000 It's not even a good one. 1.00

02:14:16.000 They took a video of a guy.

02:14:18.000 The guy just so happened to be out there looking for Sasquatch.

02:14:22.000 Sure.

02:14:22.000 I fell off my horse and immediately while I had my camera ready, we saw the Bigfoot just strolling along, not a care in the world.

02:14:32.000 Let's make sure in fairness that if we dissect that video and we decide that video's garbage, that doesn't make the whole theory garbage.

02:14:41.000 I do not not believe in Bigfoot.

02:14:44.000 And one of the reasons why is because the area where most Sasquatch sightings are is right at the end of the Bering Strait.

02:14:51.000 And between Alaska and the northern coast of the United States, or excuse me, the northwestern coast of the United States, that's where all of the Sasquatch sightings, a huge majority of them, were for a long time. 0.97

02:15:02.000 They started spreading out all throughout the country, and who knows how many of them are bullshit. 0.91

02:15:06.000 I mean, the number is weird, but... 0.99

02:15:07.000 The American Indians had over 200 different names for Sasquatch.

02:15:13.000 Or 20. Something with the two.

02:15:15.000 A bunch of them.

02:15:16.000 And they don't have a lot of mythical animals.

02:15:18.000 This was a real thing that they thought lived amongst people.

02:15:23.000 And it's a real animal that used to actually live, if you follow the Bering Strait, in Asia.

02:15:28.000 It's called Gigantopithecus.

02:15:30.000 It was an 8 foot tall, like, good pronunciation.

02:15:32.000 A huge Bigfoot.

02:15:32.000 You're right.

02:15:34.000 It was essentially Bigfoot.

02:15:35.000 It is the exact animal.

02:15:38.000 Now, I want to tie this school of thought that I said, yeah, I think there's a Sasquatch.

02:15:42.000 And then we both agreed on this video.

02:15:43.000 We have differing opinions of the video.

02:15:45.000 However, if we prove the video one way in my favor or your favor, it doesn't prove the answer to our original thesis, which is, is there a Bigfoot?

02:15:56.000 And you see this flaw, this pitfall, as we like to call it, in human thinking when it comes to alien encounter.

02:16:02.000 How many times have we seen somebody that says, hey, guess what?

02:16:05.000 I was abducted by aliens and I was given a special power.

02:16:08.000 In fact, to prove it, I'm going to go ahead and make that light turn off by sitting in my chair and not touching it.

02:16:14.000 And that will prove to you that I was abducted by aliens and given this power.

02:16:17.000 So now I sit here, I make that light turn off.

02:16:19.000 Okay, I've got a power to turn that light off.

02:16:21.000 But having that power does not prove that I was given that power by being abducted by aliens.

02:16:26.000 But there's a pitfall in human thinking.

02:16:28.000 And oftentimes if you can get people to believe one thing one way or the other, they can then connect that to a completely isolated and separate incident.

02:16:36.000 Which is what I don't want to happen with the video because I'm realizing right now I'm looking like a real doofus after looking at that video.

02:16:43.000 I'm going to need to get my evidence together and come back.

02:16:46.000 That video was actually, not only was it proven a hoax, but the guy who played Bigfoot wound up confessing.

02:16:54.000 So, yeah.

02:16:55.000 Or is that the conspiracy?

02:16:57.000 Yeah, it could be.

02:16:58.000 It could be just a guy.

02:16:59.000 Look, anytime there's some sort of a serial killer, people will come out of the woodwork to...

02:17:03.000 Like the D.B. Cooper thing, the same thing.

02:17:04.000 People are full of shit. 1.00

02:17:06.000 People are crazy. 1.00

02:17:07.000 Absolutely. 1.00

02:17:07.000 But that just stinks to me. 1.00

02:17:09.000 I look at it, it looks stupid. 1.00

02:17:10.000 I hear people, experts talk about it. 1.00

02:17:12.000 I'm like, bitch, what are you talking about? 1.00

02:17:13.000 That doesn't even look remotely real. 1.00

02:17:15.000 Sure.

02:17:15.000 It just...

02:17:15.000 It looks dumb.

02:17:16.000 And the way it was... 0.99

02:17:19.000 It's just the odds of this guy finding it.

02:17:21.000 No one else has gotten a good photo of it.

02:17:23.000 But that doesn't mean that it can't be real.

02:17:25.000 If you fly over the Pacific Northwest and you see how dense that part of the world is, I don't think a lot of people really truly understand the amount of acreage of really almost impassable rainforest you deal with in the Pacific Northwest.

02:17:38.000 When you fly over these areas where these people are talking about sightings, and they don't just have sightings, by the way, they also have real sound effects, these sounds that are some sort of primate that's screaming out, and they've sent these things to experts, you know, people who are trying to detect hoaxes, you know, and these people that have been on camping and hunting trips have recorded these things, and these are primate noises.

02:18:02.000 They don't know what the fuck it is, but it's a primate noise.

02:18:05.000 And one of the guys that I think is a real credible guy that has had an encounter is Les Stroud. 0.98

02:18:12.000 You know the survivor man?

02:18:13.000 Yep.

02:18:14.000 That guy was staying in Alaska.

02:18:16.000 He was doing one of those survivor things in Alaska.

02:18:18.000 And he said that he was asleep.

02:18:21.000 And he was inside his tent or trying to sleep.

02:18:23.000 And in the middle of the night, he heard primate noises.

02:18:26.000 He heard primate noises in the woods near him.

02:18:29.000 And he got out of his bed to try to look and he heard just something running and crashing through the trees when it heard him. 0.97

02:18:37.000 And to this day, he has no idea what the fuck it could be. 0.97

02:18:40.000 He said it couldn't have been a bear. 0.99

02:18:41.000 He goes, it was very clear primate-type noise.

02:18:46.000 Something along those lines.

02:18:47.000 Something that's just not a bear. 0.99

02:18:49.000 And whatever the fuck it was, he said it was enormous. 0.98

02:18:52.000 It might be possible. 0.99

02:18:54.000 There's enough dense forest that there might be just a few animals.

02:18:58.000 I mean, try finding a fox.

02:18:59.000 Good luck.

02:19:00.000 Go try to find a fox.

02:19:02.000 The other day I was driving in Studio City, I saw a coyote. 1.00

02:19:05.000 This motherfucker just wandering around. 1.00

02:19:06.000 Just go try and find a coyote in the wild. 1.00

02:19:09.000 Just go look for one. 0.99

02:19:10.000 And there's millions of those cunts. 0.99

02:19:12.000 Coyotes are everywhere. 0.96

02:19:13.000 To live in the Pacific Northwest, to be a primate, it might be possible.

02:19:17.000 Sure.

02:19:17.000 Well, and then when you talk about the theory of evolution, so you're talking about a Sasquatch, you're talking about a derivative of a human, so you've got to assume that they're a little bit more intelligent than, say, a coyote.

02:19:25.000 If it's hard to find a coyote, it's going to be very hard to find a Sasquatch.

02:19:28.000 If it's true, I mean, I'm just fueling the fire again.

02:19:30.000 I don't want to come up with the guy.

02:19:31.000 I believe it because the guy I happen to trust just says, look, I think it's true, and so I'm choosing to believe him more than I believe the evidence.

02:19:38.000 How many people do you know that have seen one?

02:19:40.000 Me at zero.

02:19:41.000 Zero.

02:19:41.000 Yeah, I'm at zero.

02:19:42.000 Even the guy I trust has never claimed that he's seen one.

02:19:45.000 He just said, look, I've looked at the evidence.

02:19:46.000 I just think they're there.

02:19:48.000 Jane Goodall, she's a monkey expert. 1.00

02:19:51.000 She said 100%.

02:19:52.000 Really?

02:19:53.000 100%, son.

02:19:55.000 So there.

02:19:56.000 Why are you shaking your head?

02:19:56.000 You don't think so?

02:19:57.000 No.

02:19:57.000 What do you think?

02:19:58.000 No.

02:19:58.000 What's the number you think?

02:19:59.000 I think the whole thing's bullshit. 1.00

02:20:00.000 100% bullshit? 1.00

02:20:01.000 But that comes back to Alien Encounter. 0.99

02:20:02.000 You get people who used to work at the Pentagon and NASA that come out and claim there's aliens.

02:20:06.000 Of course so.

02:20:07.000 And again, it's a flaw in human thinking because the guy works at NASA. NASA's got 3,800 desks.

02:20:12.000 You don't think a crazy person can get a desk there every now and then?

02:20:15.000 The same thing goes for the Pentagon.

02:20:16.000 I used to work at the Pentagon.

02:20:17.000 The Pentagon's never employed a madman.

02:20:19.000 Get out of here.

02:20:20.000 Who cares what you used to do?

02:20:21.000 Show me an alien!

02:20:23.000 Don't give me a pitfall in human things.

02:20:26.000 I actually cover this in my book.

02:20:27.000 It's on page 92 in The Voice of Reason.

02:20:29.000 I talk about human pitfalls, and it's why we're able to believe such outlandish and crazy things.

02:20:35.000 Do you remember year 2000, Y2K? We all went into a panic.

02:20:38.000 I stayed home with water.

02:20:40.000 With water and canned foods.

02:20:41.000 I stayed in as well.

02:20:42.000 I didn't have my supplies.

02:20:43.000 I should have.

02:20:44.000 I didn't have money for the water and canned foods.

02:20:44.000 I was at college.

02:20:47.000 But yeah, we all buy into it.

02:20:49.000 It's this hysteria with no evidence.

02:20:51.000 Real loose evidence.

02:20:53.000 2012, December 21st.

02:20:54.000 End of the Mayan calendar.

02:20:55.000 That's another one, huh?

02:20:57.000 Except recently they found newer versions of the Mayan calendar that they had never discovered before that were more complete that go far past December 21st, 2012. 10 more years of money making.

02:20:57.000 Nah.

02:21:10.000 Yeah.

02:21:11.000 Ballin'. 0.86

02:21:11.000 You know what I mean? 0.86

02:21:12.000 You got 10 more years of ballin', son.

02:21:13.000 How do you feel about that?

02:21:14.000 You know, thank you for that line.

02:21:15.000 You finally contributed to today's show, besides setting the whole thing up.

02:21:18.000 Nice to see you.

02:21:19.000 Pipe in over there.

02:21:20.000 You look like an intelligent guy.

02:21:22.000 You just haven't said much today.

02:21:24.000 Do you think he looks like an intelligent guy?

02:21:26.000 I was really saying, Chael Sonnen, he knows how to read them, man.

02:21:29.000 Right up until that.

02:21:30.000 He's got all these wires, man.

02:21:31.000 I know he's done something today that we couldn't.

02:21:34.000 He's got an odd form of intelligence.

02:21:36.000 It's true.

02:21:37.000 What would you describe it as?

02:21:39.000 What I meant by the Mayan calendar is that it was 10 more years for the people that are behind the whole thing to make more money.

02:21:45.000 Oh, to say, oh, we said 2012, we made 2022. There's, what, books?

02:21:50.000 There's fucking products? 0.98

02:21:52.000 Well, do you remember that one when we had Pinchback in and he's like convinced that something's happening? 0.99

02:21:56.000 It's like, anytime you're convinced of anything, I'm like, what?

02:21:59.000 You know it's going to go down.

02:22:01.000 The economy is falling apart right before our eyes.

02:22:02.000 Can't rebound?

02:22:04.000 Hasn't it been around a long time?

02:22:06.000 Exactly, yeah.

02:22:06.000 Isn't it kind of flexible?

02:22:08.000 Isn't there a bunch of people like fucking with it right now and trying to put it back together again? 0.89

02:22:11.000 You think they're not going to be able to figure it out? 0.97

02:22:12.000 Meanwhile, they figured it out in the first place.

02:22:14.000 And do you even barely understand it?

02:22:15.000 Because I barely do.

02:22:16.000 I watched the stock market scroll across my screen.

02:22:19.000 It might as well be Mayan hieroglyphs. 0.98

02:22:21.000 I don't know what the fuck that means. 0.98

02:22:21.000 Right. 0.98

02:22:22.000 Do you know what any of that stuff means?

02:22:23.000 No.

02:22:24.000 And yet, one's without us.

02:22:24.000 Yeah.

02:22:26.000 No, the bottom line is relax.

02:22:26.000 Yeah.

02:22:28.000 You know, it'll work itself out.

02:22:30.000 Yeah, things might get tough, but how spoiled are we anyway?

02:22:32.000 You know, I always hear these debates on education.

02:22:34.000 It's like, well, look, when my father went to school, and that wasn't all that long ago, not my great-grandfather, my father, just my dad, when he went to school in high school, if you went for four years, you graduated.

02:22:43.000 That was it.

02:22:44.000 There were not standards that you must pass this class, you've got to have algebra, and you've got to have geometry, and you've got...

02:22:48.000 If you show up for four years, you get a degree.

02:22:51.000 And, you know, back in the olden day, there was no first grade, second grade, third grade.

02:22:55.000 They all went to school together.

02:22:57.000 Everyone in the neighborhood showed up to the same school and the teacher taught them all.

02:23:01.000 And those are the same people that have now built our bridges and our churches and brought us technology and evolved into Steve Jobs and Apple and Microsoft and Bill Gates and these wonderful things.

02:23:12.000 So apparently the education system It doesn't necessarily need this great revamping.

02:23:18.000 I mean, before we even had textbooks and computers, people were learning and people were doing great things in this country.

02:23:23.000 So, you know, we've gotten so spoiled and we've turned weak.

02:23:27.000 You know, we've become feminized and our masculinity's gone in a lot of things, such as having grit and digging deep.

02:23:34.000 And if the economy sucks and you've got to find a better way and you've got to cut back, then that's what you've got to do. 0.94

02:23:39.000 but grin and bear you know you don't go build a a hole in a cave somewhere and wait for the end of the world man up well one of the issues with you know trying to get by in today's society and bringing your kids into schools is that there's a lot of fucking people out there that have done a real shitty job of raising kids a real shitty job and when you put your kids around them your kids are in danger and you 0.99

02:24:05.000 There's liabilities and there's all kinds of bullying and stupid shit that goes on and crime. 0.96

02:24:11.000 And if you can't figure out a way to get your kids out of those situations, they never even have a chance to let the system work on them. 0.99

02:24:19.000 A big part of what school is is sending your kid to some sort of an awkward fucking prison that they're stuck at for many hours a day, especially if you lived in any sort of economically compromised situation, any sort of place where there's a lot of poor people, any place where there's a lot of people that are down and out, and there's a lot of fucking shitty parents, and you got to go to school and deal with gangbangers and all kinds of other craziness while just trying to stay alive, trying to stay healthy. 0.97

02:24:44.000 Fuck learning. 1.00

02:24:45.000 Good luck. 1.00

02:24:47.000 Half this country, good fucking luck trying to learn something in public school. 0.99

02:24:51.000 And how much energy are our politicians putting on that? 0.98

02:24:53.000 How much has anybody changed budgets where they're enhancing school budgets and paying teachers much more?

02:25:00.000 Try to make it commensurate for what it's worth.

02:25:02.000 Make it commensurate, rather, for what it's worth.

02:25:05.000 Like a doctor.

02:25:06.000 Like having a good teacher is just as important as having a good doctor. 0.99

02:25:10.000 You're having someone that develops the way you fucking think about life. 1.00

02:25:13.000 Not just shows you information that you need to memorize for some stupid fucking test that you're not going to absorb anything out of. 1.00

02:25:19.000 They show you how to think. 1.00

02:25:22.000 They show you how to live your life.

02:25:24.000 They show you good examples of people who have lived quality lives and they get you to think and pattern your thoughts in a certain direction.

02:25:32.000 And most kids aren't even getting that today. 0.99

02:25:35.000 Most kids are getting a shit-fucking experience in public school. 0.99

02:25:38.000 That's what the problem is. 1.00

02:25:40.000 Sure, people need to man up. 0.99

02:25:42.000 Absolutely, fucking for sure. 1.00

02:25:43.000 But it also comes with having kids and raising your fucking kids. 1.00

02:25:47.000 And being a man in the first place. 1.00

02:25:49.000 Raising your kids properly and correctly.

02:25:51.000 Well, how many people are doing that, man?

02:25:52.000 It's a small percentage.

02:25:54.000 It may be 30%.

02:25:55.000 Let's put a number on it.

02:25:57.000 Let's go crazy and say it's 30%. 0.89

02:25:58.000 That means you're dealing with 70% possible fuck-ups. 1.00

02:26:02.000 And not every kid that comes from a fucked-up household becomes an asshole, but goddamn, a lot of them do. 1.00

02:26:07.000 How many times did you have to deal with kids in high school and in college even that were just a fucking mess all the time? 1.00

02:26:13.000 And it was always because of the way they grew up. 1.00

02:26:15.000 It was always because their brother fucked them over, their parents fucked them over, nobody paid attention to them, and that poor asshole just gets jutted into the school system and has to fucking figure out his own way to the surface of the water. 1.00

02:26:26.000 That's the problem. 1.00

02:26:27.000 It is partly because people are weak and sissified in this country, but it's also because the system is run by cunts. 1.00

02:26:32.000 The system is run by a bunch of greedy cunts that don't pay attention to the most important resource this country has. 1.00

02:26:38.000 It's children. 0.99

02:26:39.000 The most important resource.

02:26:40.000 You want to have a great, powerful country? 0.98

02:26:42.000 You've got to have a smaller percentage of losers. 0.98

02:26:44.000 And how do you have a smaller percentage of losers? 1.00

02:26:47.000 Well, you have to go into the fucking places where there's the most losers economically and help those fucking kids. 1.00

02:26:53.000 Joe, you are on fire right now, man. 1.00

02:26:55.000 It's true, right?

02:26:55.000 Keep going.

02:26:56.000 I'm a sociologist.

02:26:57.000 This is what I got my degree in.

02:26:58.000 You are on fire right now.

02:26:59.000 You're saying this in a simple manner, but this is actually very deep.

02:27:02.000 You know, the first time I ever came to one of your comedy shows, you know, I went through school.

02:27:05.000 I went and got certified smart.

02:27:06.000 I sit in on lectures.

02:27:07.000 I've written papers.

02:27:08.000 I read every book and get my hands on.

02:27:10.000 I left your first comedy show.

02:27:12.000 I've never thought more than I did at your show.

02:27:16.000 And I thought, I can never tell him that or he's going to go, you're listening to a high comedian. 0.77

02:27:19.000 You know, I'm going to look like a fool if I tell this, but I couldn't disagree with you more.

02:27:23.000 But when you say very simple things like, marijuana's never killed anybody, and 14 people died last year because coconuts fell on their head. 0.97

02:27:30.000 150. We're not making coconuts illegal.

02:27:33.000 I can't help but look at that and have to think and rethink my stance.

02:27:37.000 And I'm like, I don't want to agree with Joe.

02:27:39.000 I'm on the right.

02:27:40.000 He's on the left.

02:27:40.000 I don't like this.

02:27:41.000 But why don't I like it? 0.89

02:27:43.000 Because he's making a damn good point.

02:27:45.000 And what you just said could be two or three chapters in any sociological book, and you are right on the money.

02:27:51.000 Well, I mean, I'm not on the right or the left. 0.99

02:27:54.000 I'm on the right about a lot of shit. 0.99

02:27:55.000 I'm on the right about guns. 1.00

02:27:57.000 I'm on the right about punishment.

02:27:58.000 I'm on the right about a lot of things. 0.99

02:28:00.000 I'm on the left when it comes to people having fucking freedom. 0.98

02:28:04.000 Maybe you're a libertarian. 0.99

02:28:06.000 I'm much more of a libertarian than I am a liberal.

02:28:09.000 I believe in a certain amount of social Darwinism.

02:28:13.000 But I don't think it should ever apply to children. 0.99

02:28:15.000 I think if you want to be a fucking loser and you want to go out in your life and fuck it up, that's one thing. 0.99

02:28:21.000 But I think a tribe protects its children. 1.00

02:28:23.000 And if we are anything in America, I think we're a tribe.

02:28:27.000 We're a community. 1.00

02:28:28.000 We're one gigantic fucking tribe. 0.99

02:28:30.000 And if we have any kids that are out there that aren't getting taken care of, then we're failing. 0.99

02:28:35.000 We're failing.

02:28:36.000 So that's our foundation. 0.99

02:28:37.000 So it doesn't matter what the fuck we do at the very top of the apex with, you know, traveling to the fucking moon and working on the Star Wars program. 1.00

02:28:44.000 That doesn't matter if our foundation is full of shit. 1.00

02:28:48.000 So the very way our society is constructed, it's to let you know that the people running it are fools. 1.00

02:28:54.000 It's like a road map to retardation. 1.00

02:28:57.000 You see it real clearly, connect the dots. 1.00

02:28:59.000 Oh, you're just a bunch of greedy douchebags. 1.00

02:29:02.000 This is it. 1.00

02:29:03.000 Real simple.

02:29:04.000 Again, that's sociology.

02:29:05.000 You're not talking psychology.

02:29:06.000 You're talking sociology right now.

02:29:08.000 I'm completely with you.

02:29:09.000 If you were the president, how would you fix all this, Joe Sonnen?

02:29:12.000 How would you fix this world?

02:29:13.000 Well, that's such a deep question, and I think about that a lot.

02:29:17.000 I ran for office.

02:29:17.000 Do you?

02:29:18.000 I know you did.

02:29:19.000 I'm involved.

02:29:19.000 I'm a statesman.

02:29:21.000 You know who I want to be president is Brian Stan, and he's got the resume. 0.99

02:29:24.000 He can fucking do it. 0.97

02:29:25.000 He literally could become the president of the United States. 1.00

02:29:28.000 I'd vote for him in a heartbeat.

02:29:29.000 Yeah, absolutely.

02:29:30.000 And he's got a guy that corners him named John Bartis.

02:29:33.000 John Bartis helped to get Newt Gingrich elected.

02:29:35.000 He's out of Georgia.

02:29:37.000 Brian's out of Georgia.

02:29:38.000 And that isn't to brag on Newt Gingrich.

02:29:40.000 What I'm saying is Brian has the people around him that know how to do this.

02:29:43.000 I mean, this guy's an All-American from the Naval Academy.

02:29:45.000 He's a war hero.

02:29:46.000 He's a sports hero.

02:29:47.000 And he's as squeaky clean as they come.

02:29:49.000 Oh, yeah.

02:29:51.000 And he's intelligent, articulate, thoughtful.

02:29:53.000 Great guy.

02:29:53.000 People love him.

02:29:54.000 When I make that comment of he could be president, people don't understand.

02:29:56.000 No, no, no.

02:29:57.000 He really could be the president, and he should run.

02:30:00.000 And I like to throw these plugs out there so that the right amount of people will push him.

02:30:03.000 That's how we got George Washington.

02:30:05.000 It's not a job he wanted to do.

02:30:06.000 People came to him, and he was finally willing to do it.

02:30:08.000 So, anyway, I have no idea what we're even talking about.

02:30:10.000 Oh, what would I do if I were the president?

02:30:13.000 You'd elect Brian Stanton.

02:30:14.000 Yeah, I would definitely bring Brian Stanton into a cabinet role.

02:30:18.000 He would be somebody that you would listen to, a true leader of men.

02:30:22.000 But, you know, look, there's so many things that need to be done, but the first thing that I would do as president...

02:30:26.000 Could you imagine if you had Rampage as a vice president?

02:30:28.000 You know what I would put you on?

02:30:29.000 I would quit lying.

02:30:31.000 And every politician in the country, from the state level to the federal level, have all, in the last four years, which is two cycles if you're in the House, have all ran on the same thing.

02:30:41.000 Every one of them, unanimously, in the country, all 50 states, jobs in the economy.

02:30:46.000 They gotta quit.

02:30:47.000 No politician has ever created a job.

02:30:50.000 Ever.

02:30:50.000 Unless it's a state job.

02:30:51.000 And don't bring up state jobs where you're taking from doers and giving to non-doers.

02:30:55.000 Where you're taking tax dollars from hard workers and giving it to people in a state job.

02:31:01.000 And I'm not saying those aren't important.

02:31:02.000 But don't count that as creating a job.

02:31:04.000 Look, if you're a lawmaker, Joe, you can do two things.

02:31:07.000 And two things only.

02:31:08.000 Tax and regulate.

02:31:10.000 And neither taxation nor regulation is good for job growth.

02:31:14.000 And they need to come clean and just say that.

02:31:16.000 So you think state jobs are bad for job growth because they didn't come about organically?

02:31:21.000 Yeah, I just don't think you can count it.

02:31:22.000 You know, when you're talking about creating jobs, what you've done is grow the size of government.

02:31:26.000 So now we've got more Big Brother, we have more regulation, more people looking over. 0.91

02:31:30.000 What's an example of like a bullshit state job that they can create? 0.95

02:31:32.000 I don't think... 0.98

02:31:33.000 Well, okay, let's look at the Department of Education.

02:31:35.000 Let's look at the Department of Health.

02:31:36.000 What are these guys doing?

02:31:38.000 You can't get two nutritionalists to agree.

02:31:41.000 You can't get them to agree.

02:31:43.000 There's so much done on nutrition.

02:31:46.000 There's books written on blood type.

02:31:48.000 Some people need more saturated fats.

02:31:50.000 They love to do this whole thing about...

02:31:52.000 They're doing it right here in California.

02:31:54.000 You can't give out a Happy Meal if it's over 500 calories.

02:31:56.000 It can't include a toy.

02:31:58.000 They're coming down to McDonald's as opposed to telling parents, hey, take responsibility and regulation.

02:32:03.000 Now, what if your kid's an athlete?

02:32:05.000 What if your kid's, you know, wrestling like I had to do as a kid?

02:32:07.000 I need calories, and I also happen to need fat.

02:32:10.000 So don't come out and tell me that it's not important. 1.00

02:32:11.000 If you want to have a Big Mac, you should be able to have a fucking Big Mac. 0.99

02:32:13.000 I should be able to have two Big Macs. 0.99

02:32:14.000 And if it comes with a toy and it helps me to pull through your drive-thru as opposed to your competitors, that's called capitalism.

02:32:19.000 And for the government to get involved is beyond inappropriate.

02:32:23.000 You brought up Barry Bonds earlier and Mark McGuire, and I don't care what those guys did either because I don't follow baseball.

02:32:29.000 But what I do care about is the government got involved.

02:32:32.000 They had a congressional hearing for Congress to get involved with sport Is beyond inappropriate.

02:32:41.000 And that's what they should have said.

02:32:43.000 And if I was a congressman up there and my fellow congressman, it's my turn to Spock.

02:32:47.000 I'm going to say shame on you and shame on you to the fellow congressman.

02:32:50.000 I'm going to say get out there and do something relevant.

02:32:53.000 And if people want to quit going to the ballgame, capitalism will fix that sport and nothing else. 0.93

02:32:58.000 Exactly.

02:32:59.000 The market will dictate where that silly sport is. 0.57

02:33:02.000 And it's a self-regulating sport, too.

02:33:04.000 They choose to agree on what is in the contract.

02:33:07.000 There's a reason why the NBA doesn't test for marijuana.

02:33:10.000 It's because everybody would be tested positive.

02:33:12.000 Those dudes are blazed to the gills.

02:33:14.000 So it's not like, well, we're going to eliminate all illegal aspects of any basketball game. 1.00

02:33:19.000 No, they have shit they agree on and shit they don't agree on. 0.97

02:33:22.000 And they put things in contracts just to make sure that they can... 1.00

02:33:25.000 You know, each side enforces their point, but a lot of it is ridiculous. 0.98

02:33:30.000 Completely ridiculous. 0.98

02:33:31.000 And congressional here. 0.98

02:33:33.000 Congress?

02:33:34.000 You're going to sit down with the people that are involved at the highest level of our government, and you're going to debate the hit-the-ball-with-the-stick game.

02:33:40.000 Sure.

02:33:41.000 Oh, the guy's too good at it.

02:33:42.000 He's taking some extra chemicals and it makes him really good if they hit the ball with a stick game.

02:33:46.000 And those little kids that are watching at home are going to be real disappointed, man.

02:33:50.000 They find out that that guy took some extra stuff that makes him better if they hit the ball with a stick game.

02:33:55.000 Right. 1.00

02:33:55.000 What the fuck? 1.00

02:33:56.000 No, I think it's shameful. 1.00

02:33:59.000 I think it's shameful that Congress got involved in that. 0.94

02:34:01.000 And I think, you know, to call a congressional hearing, they call it a number of ridiculous things.

02:34:05.000 They call it on the poor guy from BP because they got an oil leak out in the ocean.

02:34:09.000 Now, that's horrible, and I don't want to see the ocean get a leak, but I assure you, BP, who's making money, doesn't want to see a leak either.

02:34:15.000 They want to see that taken care of.

02:34:16.000 They want to get that cleaned up. 0.72

02:34:17.000 They want their shareholders happy.

02:34:19.000 Well, it actually turned out in the BP case that they had actually cut corners to save money and made a shoddy product. 0.99

02:34:24.000 That was a real fucking disaster. 0.98

02:34:26.000 That's a different situation. 0.99

02:34:27.000 That's a company that was, you know, they're responsible for that. 1.00

02:34:31.000 They fucked up. 0.99

02:34:32.000 They didn't build the... 1.00

02:34:33.000 There's two different ways to build that valve, and they didn't build it.

02:34:37.000 They took a shortcut to make it happen quicker.

02:34:40.000 And they'd been warned about that, too. 0.99

02:34:42.000 That was a fucking tremendous disaster. 0.98

02:34:44.000 We had members of Congress going on shows and telling pundits, hey, listen, we need to get the military out there. 0.99

02:34:44.000 Yeah. 0.99

02:34:51.000 Now, of course, they don't say what the military is going to do.

02:34:54.000 What's the military going to do?

02:34:55.000 They're going to shoot at the oil?

02:34:57.000 What are they possibly going to do?

02:34:57.000 Well, they were talking about dropping a nuke.

02:35:00.000 Somebody was talking about dropping a nuke and closing on.

02:35:02.000 That's how they're going to close off the oil, drop a nuke on it. 0.98

02:35:05.000 It's ridiculous. 0.86

02:35:06.000 Could you imagine what that would look like? 1.00

02:35:09.000 Just dolphins and whales flying into the fucking sky. 0.99

02:35:13.000 Have you ever seen the photograph of that bomb that they blew off in the ocean? 0.99

02:35:18.000 Brian, pull that picture up.

02:35:20.000 It's Nuclear Test Ocean Pacific something.

02:35:25.000 It was incredible.

02:35:27.000 I don't know what year this was.

02:35:28.000 It was a long time ago.

02:35:29.000 But the actual explosion from this nuclear bomb that they dropped in the ocean, the water was so much bigger than they thought it was going to be.

02:35:37.000 They set all these battleships around it like they were going to monitor this thing and see what the impact was.

02:35:43.000 The battleships just got flying. 1.00

02:35:44.000 Fuck! 1.00

02:35:44.000 They get flown sideways. 1.00

02:35:46.000 It's like miles high, water straight up into the air.

02:35:49.000 It's incredible.

02:35:50.000 Now, while we're waiting for the video, I'm going to play the one-up game.

02:35:53.000 And I don't one-up you.

02:35:54.000 I'm going to come in second here, but I want to relate.

02:35:56.000 I had a friend that had to do two years in a military prison because when he was in Iraq during the war of 92, way back, but he was in my neighborhood, he shot a camel with a law.

02:36:08.000 And a law is a rocket launcher.

02:36:10.000 Oh.

02:36:10.000 So they're out in the desert.

02:36:11.000 They got nothing to do.

02:36:12.000 A camel goes by and he shoots his thing.

02:36:14.000 So you're talking about wanting to see a picture.

02:36:15.000 I don't like that the camel had to give his life.

02:36:16.000 And, you know, as the rumor goes, they're quite coveted over there.

02:36:19.000 I don't say this to be disingenuous or denigrating.

02:36:23.000 But I'm told you, you can even marry one over there.

02:36:26.000 Whether that's true or not, I don't know.

02:36:27.000 But it's that serious.

02:36:29.000 He shot it with a rocket launcher.

02:36:30.000 Now, I don't want that poor camel to have to die, but I do want to see that.

02:36:34.000 If there was a video or a footage and my buddy had to do it, a guy in my neighborhood has to go to military prison for two years, I at least need to see what happens when a rocket meets a camel in the desert.

02:36:43.000 Why did they put him away for so long?

02:36:45.000 Two years is a long ass time. 0.97

02:36:46.000 Extremely disrespectful. 0.95

02:36:47.000 I mean, you're really talking about offending people in that part of the world.

02:36:50.000 See, we don't understand that.

02:36:51.000 I don't get it either.

02:36:53.000 I watched one of those Anthony Bourdain shows, those reservation shows where they cooked a camel.

02:36:59.000 Anthony Bourdain style.

02:37:00.000 They killed a camel and cooked it.

02:37:01.000 Yeah, they slow cooked it underground.

02:37:03.000 It's like, whoa, you're eating a camel?

02:37:05.000 I didn't even know they ate camels.

02:37:07.000 I guess when you're stuck out there and there's nothing but camels, you've got to make do.

02:37:11.000 But it was like a special dish that they would only have at certain times.

02:37:14.000 I was in trouble because I talked about the people on the streets of Manus in Brazil eating monkey. 0.66

02:37:19.000 Well, it's true.

02:37:20.000 They do.

02:37:20.000 And it's like, listen, now, before you think I'm making fun of you, you might want to know what we put in hot dogs right here at Yankee Stadium here in America.

02:37:27.000 We eat some pretty weird stuff, too.

02:37:28.000 But it happens to be a true story that they do eat monkey in Brazil.

02:37:31.000 But the point that I'm getting at is they eat weird stuff around the world, man.

02:37:35.000 Right.

02:37:35.000 And I think I personally like it when I travel.

02:37:38.000 I like to try some of that weird.

02:37:39.000 I don't want to eat snails.

02:37:41.000 I eat pig intestines and turkey, but I didn't know that's what I was eating.

02:37:44.000 I think the mere word intestine is disgusting.

02:37:46.000 And I was pretty upset when I found out I did.

02:37:48.000 You never had snail?

02:37:50.000 Like escargot?

02:37:50.000 Yeah, I've had escargot on a cruise ship as a kid.

02:37:53.000 Delicious.

02:37:53.000 My dad tricked me.

02:37:54.000 I don't like it.

02:37:55.000 I do like caviar.

02:37:56.000 Now that I've gotten older, I didn't like it as a kid.

02:37:58.000 But when the Russians come over for a wrestling or a dual meet, or even the Russian fighters, they all bring caviar that you can trade with them.

02:38:05.000 Trade means you give me money, I give you caviar.

02:38:07.000 Is it worth a lot of money, their caviar?

02:38:09.000 Yeah.

02:38:10.000 Russian caviar is the most famous kind of caviar.

02:38:12.000 It's kind of like a Cuban cigar.

02:38:13.000 If you can get a hold of Russian caviar, especially back with the USSR before the breakup of the Soviet Union, it was almost impossible to get Russian caviar.

02:38:22.000 That's one of those weird things.

02:38:23.000 So we deemed it to be a little better than it actually is, but it is coveted.

02:38:26.000 If you can get it and it says Russian on the label, you'll be the head of your neighborhood party.

02:38:31.000 It's like, yeah, like you said, like Cuban cigars.

02:38:33.000 I've always thought it was weird that it's an acquired taste.

02:38:36.000 It's so expensive and it's an acquired taste.

02:38:38.000 Like, why would you want to acquire a taste for something that's really expensive that you initially don't like?

02:38:43.000 Sure.

02:38:43.000 It tastes like salt, you know.

02:38:45.000 I happen to like it because now they've eased us into it because they roll all of our local sushi rolls in a type of caviar, real cheap, that yellowy stuff.

02:38:53.000 But, you know, I've learned to like it as I've gotten older.

02:38:56.000 There you go, ladies and gentlemen.

02:38:57.000 I would like to just tell people that I have caviar.

02:38:59.000 Great American.

02:39:00.000 Loves caviar.

02:39:01.000 Russian caviar.

02:39:02.000 Anything else? 1.00

02:39:03.000 We're going to wrap this bitch up and bring it home. 1.00

02:39:05.000 I had a great time. 0.99

02:39:06.000 I've got to tell you, I had a really good time.

02:39:07.000 I learned some things about you today.

02:39:09.000 You're not just that pothead comedian I thought you were.

02:39:13.000 You've got Second Amendment and some deep thoughts.

02:39:15.000 And whether you know it or not, you're a sociologist.

02:39:17.000 Listen to some of your arguments today, whether you've been certified in it like I went to school or not.

02:39:22.000 You're a sociologist and I admire that.

02:39:23.000 Well, I'm just a stand-up comedian.

02:39:25.000 I think as a stand-up comedian, you have to understand human beings to understand yourself in order to move forward, to advance, to evolve.

02:39:32.000 You've got to understand human beings.

02:39:33.000 You've got to understand yourself.

02:39:36.000 My observations are just a part of life.

02:39:38.000 Cool.

02:39:39.000 Just like yours.

02:39:40.000 Just like your book.

02:39:42.000 VIP Pass to Enlightenment.

02:39:43.000 What's the first part of it?

02:39:44.000 Voice of Reason, which you can get right now on Amazon.

02:39:44.000 Voice of Reason.

02:39:48.000 You can just go if you have a Kindle and get it. 0.92

02:39:50.000 And you should get a Kindle because they're fucking awesome. 0.93

02:39:51.000 They are great. 0.98

02:39:52.000 That's how I bought my mother's day present.

02:39:54.000 I just sent her a Kindle.

02:39:56.000 No, just sent her a book.

02:39:57.000 So now I can just send her books now.

02:39:58.000 Oh, you can buy it for somebody else?

02:40:00.000 Oh, that is a great service.

02:40:02.000 And it's amazing. 1.00

02:40:02.000 The fucking battery lasts forever. 1.00

02:40:04.000 I have a Kindle. 1.00

02:40:05.000 The battery lasts forever.

02:40:06.000 It looks great.

02:40:07.000 It looks like printed word.

02:40:08.000 You can even make the print larger or smaller.

02:40:11.000 Like me, I'm going blind, so I have to make the print larger.

02:40:13.000 It's amazing.

02:40:14.000 It's an amazing product.

02:40:15.000 I have an iPad, and I'll watch books on that too.

02:40:18.000 I like the effect more, the scrolling, but it's better on the eyes, the Kindle.

02:40:22.000 I think the Kindle is a superior device.

02:40:24.000 I'm an audio book guy myself.

02:40:25.000 I like audiobooks.

02:40:26.000 I love audiobooks if they're read well, but every now and then, like, I bought a couple Stephen King books that were written or read by Stephen King. 0.99

02:40:34.000 Those are fucking terrible. 0.91

02:40:35.000 Yeah, Roger Ebert's new book is not... 1.00

02:40:38.000 He shouldn't have done it himself.

02:40:40.000 Roger Ebert?

02:40:41.000 He's kidding.

02:40:42.000 That's a bad joke.

02:40:44.000 The guy's got no jock.

02:40:45.000 Right, I know who he is.

02:40:47.000 Don't do that, dude.

02:40:48.000 That's some bad karma.

02:40:49.000 That's like that show that takes you out, JFK, so I was at the Tom Likens show, and they...

02:40:54.000 Come on.

02:40:56.000 Yeah, how rude.

02:40:57.000 How rude.

02:40:57.000 Anyway, that's the end of this show, ladies and gentlemen.

02:40:59.000 If you want to follow Chael on Twitter, it's SonnenCH.

02:41:03.000 How did you get that one?

02:41:04.000 Why not just Chael Sonnen?

02:41:05.000 I didn't know much about Twitter when I set it up.

02:41:08.000 I bet they could change it.

02:41:09.000 Yeah, and I wish it was Chael.

02:41:11.000 Somebody else told me.

02:41:12.000 Tell the UFC to go after that.

02:41:13.000 No, just somebody's got it.

02:41:15.000 Unless it's an actual Chael Sonnen, which I doubt.

02:41:18.000 How many Chael Sonnens have you ever met in life?

02:41:19.000 I've met a few Joe Rogans.

02:41:20.000 No Chael Sonnens. 0.93

02:41:22.000 It's unusual. 1.00

02:41:22.000 You can get that shit on Twitter. 1.00

02:41:24.000 That's SonnenCH. 0.99

02:41:25.000 Yeah, and you say tell the UFC to go.

02:41:27.000 What is the UFC having a department?

02:41:28.000 Who do I call?

02:41:29.000 The Twitter department.

02:41:29.000 Say go after that?

02:41:31.000 I'll call Donna.

02:41:31.000 Call Donna.

02:41:32.000 Hey, Joe said go after that.

02:41:33.000 The Twitter department.

02:41:34.000 I bet someone, I bet whoever has the Chael Sonny, he would probably be happy to give it to you. 0.99

02:41:39.000 Hey, hey douchebag, you squatter. 0.97

02:41:42.000 Stop hiding and holding on to Chael Sonnen's thing. 0.99

02:41:45.000 Just give him the password.

02:41:46.000 Well, I take it from when I could just stare at him.

02:41:48.000 I was going to say the same thing.

02:41:50.000 Actually, it wouldn't work that way because you want to get all your followers and bring them over there.

02:41:54.000 How many followers you got?

02:41:55.000 I got 152,193.

02:41:58.000 Not that I keep track or anything.

02:41:59.000 You can't not have that.

02:42:01.000 So you've got to have to figure out a way to get Twitter to merge the two.

02:42:04.000 They did with me.

02:42:05.000 I had a different Twitter name.

02:42:07.000 And they merged it and made it Joe Rogan.

02:42:09.000 Yeah.

02:42:09.000 Oh, excellent.

02:42:10.000 I think I bought it.

02:42:11.000 No.

02:42:12.000 Did I buy it?

02:42:13.000 No.

02:42:13.000 I bought MySpace.

02:42:14.000 Oh, that's right.

02:42:14.000 I bought my...

02:42:15.000 What a waste.

02:42:16.000 My crony Nick over at Tap Out is friends with the creator of Twitter, so maybe we can put him on there.

02:42:21.000 Maybe we can have him go after it.

02:42:22.000 Let's make it happen.

02:42:24.000 All right, so it's sunnch for now on Twitter, and thank you to everybody that tunes in.

02:42:29.000 Of course, thank you to The Fleshlight, our sponsor.

02:42:32.000 Go to joerogan.net, click on the link for The Fleshlight, enter in the codename Rogan, and you will save yourself 15%.

02:42:39.000 There you go, Skipper.

02:42:41.000 Aha! 0.94

02:42:42.000 We're also brought to you by Onnit.com, makers of Alpha Brain, New Mood, Shroom Tech Sport, and Shroom Tech Immune.

02:42:49.000 For all information on all of those products, go to Onnit.com.

02:42:53.000 That's O-N-N-I-T. Use the code name ROGAN and save yourself 10%. 0.63

02:42:58.000 Tomorrow, we're going to be here with Michael Rupert.

02:43:00.000 That's right, Michael Rupert.

02:43:02.000 A former LA narcotics officer who busted the CIA selling drugs in the hood.

02:43:08.000 That's D-A-H-O-O-D. And he'll be back to spread more what, Brian? 1.00

02:43:13.000 Fox magic.

02:43:14.000 Fox magic.

02:43:15.000 We'll see you guys tomorrow.

02:43:15.000 That's right.

02:43:16.000 Chael Sonny, you're the fucking man. 0.99

02:43:18.000 And good luck to you, sir, in your rematch for your title, right? 1.00

02:43:21.000 It is my title.

02:43:21.000 Thank you, brother.

02:43:21.000 Is it your title?

02:43:22.000 Undefeated and Undisputed.

02:43:23.000 That's it, folks.

02:43:24.000 Boom.

The Joe Rogan Experience - May 14, 2012

Joe Rogan Experience #216 - Chael Sonnen

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Summary

Transcript