In this episode of The Joe Rogan Experience, the host talks to retired US Air Force Col. Ryan Graves, who is a UFO expert and filmmaker. They talk about Ryan's recent encounter with aliens, drones, conspiracy theories, and more.
00:01:13.000We talked a lot of nonsense about aliens, but we also talked about the technology that he knows is state-of-the-art when it comes to drones.
00:03:35.000I was super busy, you know, had the release of the film going on, and so I was, like, trying to focus on that and getting everything lined up, and it was a huge push.
00:03:43.000And all these text messages from all around the world are pouring in, like, what the hell is going on with these drones?
00:03:47.000And I was like, ah, it's probably something conventional.
00:03:49.000I'm not going to worry about it right now.
00:03:50.000I'm just going to keep on focusing what I got at hand here.
00:03:53.000And then I started getting more information coming in, more information.
00:03:56.000Then a buddy of mine called me, and he actually went to Brazil with me a couple years ago, and he's like, bro, I live here.
00:05:52.000Why don't they just keep using UFO? Because people associate UFO with otherworldly, and they wanted to remove that baggage and make it a little less scary.
00:08:09.000They're beating big grocery stores at their own game.
00:08:11.000So, do yourself a favor, download the GoPuff app on your phone, use the code ROGAN20 for $20 off your order, and experience faster, cheaper, better shopping.
00:08:44.000I served 16 years in the United States Air Force as a technical sergeant and a military police officer.
00:08:51.000In October 2003, my coworkers and I witnessed a series of extraordinary UAP incursions at Vandenberg Air Force Base in California.
00:08:59.000The initial event is known as the Vandenberg Red Square, and it was first mentioned during the historic UAP hearing held in 2023. The case involved Boeing contractors who witnessed a huge red square-shaped object roughly the size of a football field hovering over a missile defense system.
00:09:20.000The object was silent and had no visible means of propulsion.
00:09:24.000The contractors watched in amazement as the massive object slowly drifted east and vanished over the hills.
00:09:32.000I retained official Air Force records of the event, including the blotter form entry, which includes the names and contact information of all the witnesses and provided it to select members of Congress, ARO, and the FBI. ARO is a new UAP Task Force All Domain Anomalous Resolution Office.
00:09:53.000After the initial event, several other UAP incursions took place at Vandenberg.
00:09:58.000I was on duty during many of the encounters and I investigated the incidents as they unfolded.
00:10:03.000Now, remember, this is not anonymous reporting here.
00:10:06.000They include a football field-sized craft that terrified security guards as it silently hovered over a launch facility before flying off at an unbelievable rate of speed.
00:10:19.000A brightly illuminated silent object that landed on the base flight line before accelerating instantaneously and disappearing into space.
00:10:29.000A huge triangle-shaped craft larger than a C-130 that hovered 50 feet over a police officer before it drifted slowly over the base.
00:10:37.000A blue-white liquid orb, roughly the size of his house, that hovered over his house on the base.
00:10:44.000The objects made no sound and had zero obvious means of propulsion.
00:10:50.000And he says, my experiences with UAP were awe-inspiring, exciting, and terrifying.
00:10:54.000I don't know why UAP are flying over our bases and our neighborhoods, but I do know the UAP phenomenon is of the utmost importance to all of humanity.
00:11:04.000I currently have five other military witnesses to the Vandenberg incursions that are all willing to testify tomorrow under oath that these statements are true.
00:11:14.000We need answers to this mystery and better government transparency.
00:11:18.000Thank you for the opportunity to share my story, former United States Air Force Technical Sergeant and Witness, Jeff Nusatelli.
00:11:39.000This was 2003. There was a number of incursions during that year, all the way into 2005. And he has the names, and they submitted it to the new head of Arrow.
00:11:48.000That's interesting because that coincides with the Tic Tac.
00:12:17.000It's like you can do it, but it's a pain in the ass.
00:12:19.000So maybe they only travel to Earth every now and again.
00:12:23.000How could these incursions have been taking place and, like, here we are 20 years later and we're only now really starting to talk about them?
00:12:29.000I think the reason being is if you don't understand it and you can't protect people from it because it's so beyond our capabilities that if just describing it accurately Removes all confidence that our government has everything under control.
00:13:05.000I remember, like 20 years ago, bright-eyed, bushy-tailed, totally naive, still bright, I mean, still naive, but I was meeting with a general.
00:13:17.000You know, this story is like so unifying and we had this kumbaya moment and we discovered that, you know, we're not alone in the universe and wouldn't that be amazing and blah, blah, blah, the implications for all of humanity.
00:13:27.000And he sat there almost chuckling at me.
00:13:30.000And he goes, looked at me and he goes, you got it all wrong, man.
00:13:33.000You know, you got to see this through our lens.
00:13:46.000We sit there and we say, you know, my fellow Americans, it has been brought to our attention that there are craft of unknown origin whizzing around with impunity in our airspace.
00:13:56.000They exhibit a technology that's light years advanced from anything that we have.
00:14:00.000We don't know who they are, where they come from, what they want.
00:15:24.000Okay, so the program, basically, it's funny because the last time I was on the show, We were talking about an alleged crash retrieval case that took place in Virginia, Brazil in 1996. And your documentary on it, which is...
00:15:38.000So we're talking about that, and I came off the heels of doing The Phenomenon, which touched a little bit on a potential crash retrieval program, but then it was like...
00:15:46.000Then it was the crash retrieval over in Virginia, Brazil.
00:16:06.000And then three months after I was on your show in April of 2023, the highest level intel officer, David Grush, testifies under oath That there is a crash retrieval program and the government does have definitive proof that we're not alone.
00:16:45.000And then just recently, just a couple of months ago, we had the third congressional hearing, which I actually, funny enough, got to attend.
00:16:52.000It was the first time in my 30 years investigating.
00:16:54.000I was actually sitting behind people while they were testifying under oath about legitimacy of the phenomenon as well as there's a crash retrieval program.
00:17:04.000I mean, people have to understand that Feel like maybe these things aren't happening fast enough.
00:17:10.000Just a couple years ago, they didn't even admit that the phenomenon is real.
00:17:15.000Now there's people testifying under oath that we have a crash retrieval program.
00:17:22.000They're not putting the genie back in the bottle.
00:17:24.000Do you wonder at all that you're being mindfucked?
00:17:26.000Do you wonder at all that this is a massive PSYOP and this is all just to cover up some very advanced American weapons technology?
00:17:34.000I think it's a very good question, and here's why I don't believe that.
00:17:38.000Because I have done 30 years of field research, right?
00:17:41.000So I've gone to China, I've been to Russia, I've been to Australia and Africa, South America, Canada, Alaska, all across Europe, the United States, and I've investigated close encounters of the third kind.
00:17:53.000And I'm going to ask your audience, don't take it from me, but the United States Air Force investigated and categorized Close Encounters of the First, Second, and Third Kind, right?
00:18:03.000During their official capacity, Project Sign, Project Grudge, Project Blue Book.
00:18:06.000Great fucking movie, by the way, if you haven't seen it, folks.
00:18:24.000Well, there's a guy acting his part, but actually Dr. Jalen Hynek, who's a scientific advisor to Project Blue Book all those years for the Air Force, actually has a cameo appearance, smoking a cigar during the encounter.
00:19:36.000I remember I had a buddy of mine who was a pilot over Europe in the 70s, and he used to come for family dinners, and he was always talking about it, and I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever.
00:19:43.000And then later, we're all in the life.
00:20:32.000I mean, when I put out Moment of Contact...
00:20:35.000Well, actually, when I went in to put out Moment of Contact, people were going, James, you just dropped one of the biggest, most successful UFO films in terms of transcending the UFO community and penetrating a much broader, more mainstream audience.
00:20:50.000Are you sure you want to put out a documentary that deals with an alleged crash and live aliens walking around the town of Virginia, Brazil?
00:20:57.000Like, seriously, that's what you want to put out there?
00:21:00.000You've got access to, like, Harry Reid and all these Intel insiders, and now you want to do that?
00:21:06.000You're going to tarnish your reputation.
00:21:37.000It's a phenomenal story It's one of those stories where you like if everybody's in on this This is crazy if everybody's telling and no one there's not one contrarian that comes out and goes they all told me to lie I'm not fucking lying.
00:22:10.000And he's like, you don't understand who's watching this right now.
00:22:12.000So I was like, okay, so I'm giving him copies, and I had absolutely no idea ever in a hundred million years that I think we're going to be having, months after the release of Moment of Contact, a congressional hearing under oath that there's a crash retrieval program.
00:22:29.000What year did Moment of Contact come out?
00:22:31.000It came out at the end of 2022. Do you think Biden watched it?
00:23:07.000He's already pardoned more human beings than any president ever, other than Carter.
00:23:12.000Listen to the advice at the end of the program by Senator Harry Reid, who's now the late Senator Harry Reid, and I said to him, What advice would you give the president?
00:23:23.000It could have been any president at the time.
00:23:25.000And he said, don't be afraid of tarnishing your legacy by addressing this issue head on.
00:23:30.000And I hope that Biden gets to see that.
00:23:32.000And I really hope that President-elect Donald Trump gets to see that.
00:27:18.000What happened, because everybody thinks the government suddenly had this epiphany to decide to be more transparent with the general public.
00:27:25.000What happened is there were a couple of intel insiders in the Pentagon reviewing some of this classified data or so-called classified data and resigned in protest of excessive secrecy.
00:28:00.000And since then, there has been this unprecedented push by a bipartisan group of lawmakers to find out what the intelligence agencies know and when they knew it.
00:28:12.000And so that started happening behind the scenes, right?
00:28:16.000So it was 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, In 2021, and then in 2022, they were like, we're having a Congressional hearing.
00:28:26.000Congressman Andre Carson, I think he's in Wisconsin, but I'm not positive, he put on, he spearheaded the first open Congressional hearing, public open Congressional hearing.
00:28:34.000And in that Congressional hearing, they acknowledged the fact that The phenomenon was real.
00:28:39.000It was slowly introduced that we were not getting told the facts.
00:28:44.000There was a document that came out called the Wilson Davis Memo.
00:28:49.000And that was about the discovery by a former DIA guy, Admiral Wilson, of the crash retrieval program that was like maybe 20, 20 plus years ago.
00:28:58.000And none of the names or anything in that document were redacted.
00:29:11.000And so a lot has gone on between 2017 and 2024. And that is what this film does, is it covers behind-the-scenes effort, bipartisan group of lawmakers' effort to find out what the intelligence agencies really know.
00:29:28.000Yeah, and people that were, you know, and in one of them, there was an encounter, and I think I remember you hearing about it, because you wanted to get a hold of David Grush, and so you contacted me, and I actually had a drone up in the air in England, and I was like, I know.
00:29:42.000And I had my phone attached to my drone thing, because that's what it was using as a controller for the screen.
00:29:49.000And I'm flying the drone, and there was a huge windmill, and I saw this windmill, and I was like, oh, that's going to make a beautiful shot for the movie.
00:30:17.000And we talked briefly, and you said, hey, can you get me in touch with David Grush?
00:30:20.000I said, yeah, I got a guy that I can put you in touch with, and that was Jason Sands.
00:30:23.000And I guess you and Jason Sands talked about this alleged encounter in 1994 with this entity, alien, whatever you want to call him, in the desert.
00:30:35.000But in any case, when you watch the movie and the program, you'll see the drone flying dangerously close to these, and that's a funny little inside thing.
00:30:57.000This is funny because when I was in Washington, D.C. with Mellon and this gentleman, Jason Sands, I'm using his name now, and Mellon looked at me and he goes...
00:31:23.000Anyway, and we were all having dinner, and Jason Sands starts telling the story about this alleged encounter in 1994, and it's one of the craziest stories, and I've been doing this for 30 years, and this story is nuts, okay?
00:32:41.000To our studio we could film you on camera and if anything happens to you it could be released and it could be a little insurance policy for yourself.
00:32:49.000So I did a whole film about it and then I'm periodically posting clips or just still frames and updates on the movie as I'm making it as I do on social media and I posted this one scene and it had a clipboard in the scene and on that clipboard if you zoomed right in it had his name.
00:33:05.000So I posted the, by accident, I posted the damn thing, and my phone starts blowing up ten minutes later.
00:33:16.000So it was out there, and he's getting all kinds of heat.
00:33:20.000So, as a result of it, I'm giving the truncated version, he basically had to go through the Dobser process, which is basically pre-publication of authorization of what you can and cannot say.
00:35:44.000Terrence Howard created this fascinating concept for like a drone where it's like propellers going all these different directions and they sync up and they link together and it looks like that.
00:37:11.000He's in a convoy, and it's early in the morning, and there's three Jeeps, trucks, Jeeps, in convoy on a dirt road heading out Nellis Test Range.
00:37:21.000And they see what looks like maybe somebody was involved in a plane crash.
00:37:26.000There's somebody that was struggling out in the middle of the desert.
00:37:40.000Their skin had a slight blue tint to it.
00:37:42.000And they're looking at this gentleman and they're like, hey, stop the convoy.
00:37:46.000This person needs help, medical attention.
00:37:47.000Maybe they had a plane crash and so we're going to help this person out.
00:37:51.000And they pull the convoy over, and this individual comes up to the car.
00:37:58.000Jason Sands gets out the right side of the door, and as he's getting out, somebody in the truck screams, he's got no effing ears.
00:38:06.000And Jason says, he turns around and he looks at this guy, and he had the same kind of uniform that they had had on, but the uniform was just immaculate.
00:38:15.000Like, there wasn't any dust on it, no dust on the boots.
00:38:18.000And he was thinking to myself, well, that's weird.
00:39:04.000He's like, no, Tantillium or something.
00:39:07.000And this conversation goes on for a bit, and then the guy just wanders back off and gets into that little craft that looked very similar to what you just saw there, and flies away, and he sort of stair-stepped away.
00:39:19.000And everybody sort of came out of this comatose state, and off they went.
00:39:24.000And we have the names of the other military witnesses that were on duty during the encounter, the alleged encounter.
00:39:31.000People are going to criticize me because I'm reporting on a close encounter with a third guy.
00:39:34.000But this, Jason Sands says he's willing to do a lie detector test like public.
00:39:41.000He's willing to testify under oath that everything he's saying is true.
00:39:46.000We have a date, we have a location, and we have the names of the other on-duty officers.
00:39:50.000So what I'm hoping is, despite the level of criticism I'm going to receive for reporting on this, is that other individuals that have more information on this are going to be inclined to come forward.
00:39:59.000I also met with people in the Senate Armed Service Committee, Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, sorry, in the House, and they said Jason Sands is who he says he is.
00:40:39.000But imagine being that person who had that experience and not have anybody believe you.
00:40:46.000Not only that, but it could actually ruin your reputation and your career to talk about this experience, which is the reality of it.
00:40:52.000And it's one of the things that stifled discourse on this until I think the New York Times really broke the ice.
00:40:59.000I think in 2017 when they published that, all of a sudden serious people who were unwilling to talk about UFOs before just for the ridicule.
00:41:07.000Now you've got the gimbal video, the go fast video, you've got fighter pilots, Commander David Fravor, you've got these people discussing these things openly and like, okay, this seems like something that a serious person can discuss now.
00:41:25.000Like when I told people the cop picked it up and carried it in the car and the cop died from some horrible bacterial infection that they couldn't cure.
00:41:34.000He was rubbing himself down with rubbing alcohol, according to his family.
00:41:37.000He was like, this is greasy stuff on my skin.
00:41:40.000And he was rubbing himself down and he had to stench, smell, grease.
00:42:04.000Like imagine, like if you go to another planet and the way to mitigate the effects of viruses and bacteria on that planet is to have skin fluid that's like unbelievably toxic.
00:42:16.000Anything that comes near you just gets cooked.
00:42:32.000We had a party the night before, and I went out to the garbage can, and I kind of heard some rustling in the garbage can, but I didn't really think anything of it.
00:42:39.000And I lifted up the thing, and then I heard some rustling again.
00:42:42.000I put my head down inside, and the skunk just turned and got me right in the face.
00:42:47.000Now, I held my breath, and I closed my eyes at the last second, and it went right through me.
00:44:06.000It's so funny, because I was getting ready for a road trip, this is a couple years ago, and I looked over, and I was like, did we walk Duke?
00:47:55.000So, like, all the other animals have to worry.
00:47:58.000Like, mountain lions kill quick because wolves will steal from mountain lions.
00:48:01.000And apparently in the areas where wolves have been introduced, it's actually become a problem because mountain lions are killing much more than they normally do.
00:48:10.000Because mountain lions will kill, like, a deer, two deer a week, something like that.
00:49:21.000California still kills mountain lions.
00:49:23.000They kill as many mountain lions as they would if they gave tags out to people to kill them, because you have to kill certain numbers of them for depredation, because they'll start killing livestock, they'll start killing dogs.
00:49:36.000In the Bay Area, the problem cats that they wound up killing in San Francisco, half their diet was pets.
00:50:12.000I'm not there to protect my little feller.
00:50:14.000You know, one time I was hiking up this mountain, and I had my son with me at the time, and he was in that little pouch, you know, that little pouch that you put in the front?
00:50:23.000He was probably like maybe two, two and a half.
00:50:26.000And I was hiking this mountain pretty daily.
00:50:28.000It's funny, actually, because when I went up there without him, I was like, well, this is why people hike with weights on.
00:50:34.000Anyway, I was going to the mountain, and I had my dog, my little Duke, and I had my son walking up this mountain, and I come around this, like, go to the left hand.
00:50:44.000It's pretty exposed, not too many trees, some bushes, and it's a hot, sunny day, and I see this leg of a deer, like, just fresh kill with blood on the ground.
00:51:27.000I was like, shit, I... So I grabbed my dog, and I turned around, and I started running, and I knew that I shouldn't be running.
00:51:34.000So I'm running going, I shouldn't be running, I shouldn't be running, I know I shouldn't be running, but I wanted to get around the corner and get out of its line of sight.
00:51:58.000But I remember looking at him, and I was looking at my dog going, oh, man, this is a horrible decision I have to make, but if it comes down to it, I'm going to have to sacrifice you, buddy.
00:53:14.000You know, it was, first of all, it was dusk.
00:53:18.000So the sun was going down and the lights of the truck, even though it wasn't quite dark yet, the lights of the truck were making his eyes glow.
00:55:07.000I'm sitting here today because the American people are being lied to.
00:55:12.000We are the American government, and we are open, and we're going to be open about this.
00:55:17.000What has been revealed, non-human intelligence exists, non-human intelligence has been interacting with humanity, is only part of the story.
00:57:29.000Okay, so there was a guy, Nick Pope, who investigated as part of the UFO desk at the Ministry of Defense of England in the late 90s, mid to late 90s.
00:58:17.000And they came upon, in this relatively remote area, I know because I hiked out to the exact spot, and it's in the movie, but And they came upon this diamond-shaped or disc-shaped object that was quite large that was hovering silently really close.
00:58:36.000And they were scared to death and they were kind of hiding out underneath this tree and they're looking at this thing like, what the are we looking at?
00:58:44.000And they're looking at this thing as it's silently hovering.
00:59:02.000And it came out into the scene and it flew all the way around the disc.
00:59:07.000And as it did so, the guy mustered up the courage, came out from under the tree, and he snapped five or six photographs of this object suspended in the air, and it went...
00:59:18.000So the disc is here, and the plane is flying around.
00:59:26.000And the reason why I know this is because the individual who kept one of the prints, thank you very much, Craig Lindsay, RAF Press Officer, and thank you, David Clark, for uncovering this because it's the most amazing picture ever.
00:59:40.000And the two hotel workers just outside the town of Calvine, Scotland, Came back and they were like telling their co-workers, oh my god, we encountered this thing, we don't know what it was.
00:59:51.000So they go to the local newspaper and they were like, hey man, we just filmed something in the sky.
01:00:16.000The local newspaper was like, they're about to go public with it, print the story, and they were like, well, we need a statement from the RAF. So they contacted the press officer, Craig Lindsay, and they were like, hey, what do you make of this UFO these guys took?
01:00:29.000And Craig Lindsay goes, I don't know what you're talking about.
01:00:38.000Sends him a print, big print like this, the one you see today, and he's like, holy shit, the hell is this?
01:00:47.000He's an RAF press officer, Craig Lindsay, and he's like, so he starts getting in touch with the MOD and he goes out and he investigates this, go talk to the witnesses, talk to the witnesses, and they were telling him, And he goes, well, they tell him what happened, and he goes, well, what kind of noise did it make?
01:01:01.000And they say, it didn't make any noise.
01:01:18.000So he takes a color Xeroxing machine, and he sends it to the MOD in London, and he says, hey, there's a case that you might want to look into, and here's a Xerox, which is really crappy.
01:01:30.000It's just a scanned Xerox, like a fax machine, over to MOD. He said he went from the office where the Xerox machine was, and before he can get back to his office, his phone was ringing off the hook.
01:01:41.000MOD. And the MOD basically stepped in, took over the investigation.
01:01:46.000They said, you can step down to Craig Lindsay.
01:02:01.000So, 30, and we'd rumored about it because Nick Pope had talked about this case in a book he wrote called Open Skies, Closed Minds.
01:02:10.000And then I talked to him about it in late 90s, then I talked to him about it again in the early 2000s, and I was like, Nick, especially in 2007, I was like, tell me about this photograph.
01:02:50.000So David Clark found Craig Lindsay, and the way he found Craig Lindsay, the guy that kept one of the prints, is that he got a declassified government document out of the MOD's office that had redactions on it.
01:03:04.000And one of the things it said was, it was 1990, and they said, RAF press officer in Scotland, blacked out, you know, said that blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
01:03:53.000I met with Craig Lindsay, the RF press officer, gave me the first and only on-camera interview about it, what astonished him about it, the analysis work they did on it, what the witnesses said.
01:04:44.000But I was like, well, I'm almost done with the movie.
01:04:46.000And if this is something I can include in the movie about the case, please let me know.
01:04:49.000So long story short, this guy, Richard Greaves, who was one of the hotel cooks, worked in the kitchen with the photographers, with the two witnesses that took the photograph.
01:04:59.000And Richard Greaves came forward on print.
01:05:05.000I was like, hey, can you get me an interview with this guy?
01:05:09.000So he kept putting it off, putting it off, putting it off, and then finally, I didn't want to be persistent, but I didn't want to annoy the guy to the point where he's like, hey, you know what?
01:05:22.000But I got it right up to that point, where I was like, I was wrapping the movie.
01:05:27.000The movie's done, and I want to get this movie out, because all the people that participated wanted it out.
01:05:31.000And then I finally sent him one final text, and I was like, look, I'm really sorry to pastor you, and I know you're probably really busy, and I really appreciate the fact that you even said that you'll meet me, but that you'll give me an interview.
01:05:41.000And then probably about 10 o'clock that night, I'm in the edit room buttoning the film up, and all of a sudden I get a phone call, and he's like, I've just come out of the pub, and I'm ready to go.
01:05:49.000I was like, okay, grab a camera, roll it, let's record this.
01:05:54.000And he reveals that he knew the witnesses.
01:06:03.000And then he said that two or three nights, four nights after they took that photograph, they were all on a cigarette break at the hotel early evening, pissing rain.
01:06:16.000There were three guys in it, a driver and two men in suits in the back.
01:06:19.000They roll up, they come out, they say cigarette breaks over, they pull the two witnesses aside, and they grill him.
01:06:27.000And you got to hear it directly from the horse's mouth.
01:06:29.000Richard Greaves said that when they were all, the people that were not involved with the incident were told to go back inside the hotel, which they did, but they looked through the window and they saw in the pissing rain, he said they were out there for 10 or 15 minutes in the pissing rain, And that these guys, they came back inside and they were white as a...
01:06:46.000He literally goes, they came back inside and they were white as a fucking ghost!
01:07:57.000Well, like I said, in the other prints, according to Craig Lindsay, the RAF press officer, he said the other six prints or five prints had that Harrier jet in a different position.
01:08:07.000So he said it was as if the Harrier jet flew around checking that out.
01:09:28.000I mean, again, I think it's one of the best photographic cases because you're not dealing with just a UFO. You've got a military jet in the background.
01:09:36.000And if you have a date and a location, guess what?
01:10:48.000Here, there's that one, and there's flip left to right on it.
01:10:52.000But, you know, it just goes to show the lengths that the Intel community, the Ministry of Defense, the DOD go to hide the more compelling photographic data, because it's so easy to complain, like, oh, well, if they were real, there would be good...
01:11:08.000Well, there are some really good prints.
01:11:10.000Bro, you got Joe Exotic in your phone.
01:13:12.000And he, in an official capacity with a high-level clearance, he had been investigating UFOs ever since the New York Times article in 2017. So he was behind the scenes 2017, 2018, the tail end of 2017. 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 22, 23, 24, and then he stepped down.
01:14:29.000And then I showed up at a wing across the street from the Pentagon.
01:14:33.000And I had to go through the metal detector, and then there are these, kind of exciting for me, because I had never had this kind of experience before.
01:14:39.000There were these, like, glass tube-type things that were lined up, like, in a row, and only one person can go in at a time.
01:14:46.000The doors open, just like in Star Trek, and you walk in, and that door closes, and another one opens, and you go through the other side.
01:14:51.000Then I had to get rid of my phone and everything and leave it outside, and then I go into a skiff.
01:14:56.000Which is a sensitive compartmented information facility.
01:15:00.000It's gifts, all super top secret, whatever.
01:15:03.000And I got to meet with the new head of Arrow, John Koskowski.
01:15:07.000I was like, I can't believe I'm in the belly of the beast.
01:15:27.000And I said, and you know what we're ultimately dealing with.
01:15:30.000I mean, obviously, the vast majority of UAP or UFOs can be and have been explained away in down-to-earth conventional terms, right?
01:15:38.000But there's a stubborn core 15%, 20% that really defy conventional explanation, not because of a lack of data, because they truly can't explain what these things do.
01:15:45.000And you know well, you've had many people on.
01:15:48.000These objects exhibit a technology that's just light years advanced from anything that we have.
01:15:52.000And it's been well-documented since the 1940s, and possibly some people would say way before that.
01:16:13.000I said to the gentleman, very candidly, you know, we're probably dealing with a small percentage of NHI, and what's the plan to tell the general public?
01:16:23.000And he looked at me and he goes, James, I can't part my hair without approval from the DOD. And you can quote me on that.
01:16:32.000And that was him, in my opinion, telling me, hey, this is structured in a way that my hands are tied.
01:16:39.000I can uncover all the things in the world, but I can't tell the general public or even Congress without the DOD approving it first.
01:16:46.000So that's what's kind of happening right now.
01:16:48.000And one of the reasons why we were so fortunate to get the number of, I say, whistleblowers or potential whistleblowers or people to come forward in the program is because they were super frustrated with the previous head of era, which is a guy named Sean Kirkpatrick, Which basically just kind of blanket, you know, denied pretty much almost everything.
01:17:07.000And people were extremely disappointed with that.
01:17:36.000Like, you know, I'm going back to Brazil and I thought, you know, I'm obviously going after, you know, additional eyewitness testimony.
01:17:41.000I'm going after the photographic stuff.
01:17:43.000And those of you out there that are, like, tired of hearing about it, well, I spent...
01:17:48.00020 plus years in search of the photograph that I featured just now, that one with the background story on it, Providence, that sort of thing.
01:17:54.000Jamie, go look at the one that I sent you.
01:18:27.000It started going fast, faster, faster, faster, and then it was gone.
01:18:32.000Yep, that was Craig Lindsay, who interviewed the witnesses, who told me that.
01:18:36.000And it's so weird though, according to Richard Greaves, in Scotland, the Americans got involved.
01:18:42.000Of course, we get involved in everything.
01:18:44.000Yep, they showed up and they intimidated the shit out of the witnesses.
01:18:47.000And I know people can criticize me for reporting on these alleged men in black, but it's not me saying it, it's the witnesses that are saying it.
01:18:54.000And I did it full bore for the first time, full bore for the first time in Moment of Contact, because I remember hearing these stories for decades, and I finally was like, everyone's going to think I'm crazy if I report on this, but this lady who was the mother of the two daughters that had these visits and the intimidation, and I was like, screw it, I'm just going to report on this, and I'll just take the criticism, you know?
01:19:16.000And then I wasn't expecting this to be the case with this photograph, but lo and behold, it was.
01:19:29.000In my opinion, they can't put the genie back in the bottle.
01:19:31.000It's coming out, and it's drip, drip, drip.
01:19:33.000But I have to remind your audience, people that are feeling impatient, that we've had three open congressional hearings in the last three years.
01:19:41.000We hadn't had any in over 50 years prior to that.
01:19:43.000It's definitely, even though it's still difficult to get information and figure out what's actually going on, there's way more open mainstream discussion of it.
01:19:53.000People are like, oh, well, why all these people?
01:19:56.000Why can't they just say, why can't David Grush just tell us?
01:19:59.000Well, I can remind people that the DOD has stripped David Grush of his clearances and won't allow him to get into a skip.
01:20:05.000This is one of the things that I talked to this guy, Brian Benner, who appears in the movie Politico, and he goes, if Congress finds out about it, one thing we know on the Hill is that you're going to find out about it.
01:20:16.000So they've been doing everything they can, I imagine it's the DOD, to prevent Grush from going into a skip with members of Congress to release and reveal The classified details necessary to verify his claims, okay?
01:20:30.000If you've been keeping this under wraps for 60 plus years or whatever they've been doing, would you really tell AOC? Would you really pull her aside and tell her?
01:20:39.000Well, I mean, any members of Congress with the proper clearances and feel like they want to have that information, I mean, you've got...
01:20:57.000That's probably why they won't let Grush get into a skimp.
01:20:59.000So here's another thing I'd like to mention is that David Grush claims that he gave even a street address to the ICIG, which is Thomas Monheim.
01:21:06.000That's the Intelligence Community Inspector General.
01:21:09.000So I'm asking members of Congress to support all their efforts.
01:21:13.000You know, Burchett, who's been amazing, regardless of what your politics, the guy's a phenomenon.
01:21:17.000He's been really pushing for transparency.
01:21:26.000Garcia from California, AOC, New York, Luna, and then of course you got the Senate side, you got Rubio, who totally knows where this stuff is, Rounds, Schumer, and if you look at the NDAA, you can see the language in plain sight.
01:21:45.000I mean, it's phenomenal what's going on, and I I think that our elected officials that are really pushing for transparency need to hear from us, need to hear from the citizens and know that we support their efforts and that we have their backs and continuing to push for transparency, to push to find out what the hell is going on.
01:23:03.000I mean, if you could put a nuke on one of those things, I mean, the exhibited technology that people say, people that have witnessed this stuff say it goes from a standstill to out of sight in the blink of an eye.
01:23:28.000And the way Ryan explained it in terms of like the amount of force you would need is equivalent to how many nuclear bombs did he say?
01:23:38.000Something insane, like the entire nuclear arsenal has to be done to generate that kind of power.
01:23:44.000Whatever it is, if these stories are true, it's doing something that we don't understand.
01:23:52.000So if it's ours, I kind of get why they wouldn't want to spill the beans.
01:23:58.000My thought once was, what if this is not weaponizable with our current technology?
01:24:04.000What if these things are our drones, but they don't know how to put a weapon on it yet?
01:24:11.000Because whatever you do, it moves at a speed.
01:24:14.000I have a problem with that theory, and the problem I have is that the United States government has documented close encounters of a third kind.
01:24:25.000So it's not just these objects exhibiting revolutionary technology for at least 80 years, right?
01:24:32.000No wings, no tail, no visible means of propulsion, the ability to hover, accelerate, out of sight in the blink of an eye, right angle turns at high speed, no wake, no sonic boom.
01:24:53.000The whole thing, like, just because something's written down somewhere doesn't mean that someone didn't write it down as a psyop, someone didn't write it down to discredit other people with a ridiculous story.
01:25:03.000One way to discredit a credible story is to attach it to a bunch of ridiculous stories.
01:25:09.000So if I was going to hide some sort of technology, one thing I would do is connect it to a bunch of kooky stuff, a bunch of psychic stuff and remote viewing, just a bunch of things that people very easily dismiss.
01:25:21.000UFO abductions, UFO encounters, encounters with an actual being.
01:25:26.000But put a bunch of stuff in there that makes people go, what?
01:25:38.000And again, I've said this earlier in the show, and I'll say it again, is like, the reason why I believe David Grush, who testified, not just because he testified...
01:25:47.000Oh, I believe David, but David doesn't have first-hand experience that he's talked about.
01:25:50.000I know, but the reason why I believe him is because it aligns with my research in the field.
01:25:56.000Remember, I spent over 12 years investigating on and off with my buddy Marco Leal in Virginia, Brazil, That UFO crash case and only found out last minute, the last time I was there, that the Americans were involved.
01:26:10.000So I was like, oh my God, the rumors are true.
01:26:38.000One of the craziest stories is that there's a building somewhere that's an enormous building that was actually built around the UFO because the UFO was too big to move.
01:27:51.000It was from a correspondence he had with a high-level government official back in 2020. It just got approved for release, I don't know, maybe a year ago.
01:28:02.000And in it, it has the names of not just the gatekeeper, but other names who found the gatekeeper to the crash retrieval program.
01:28:11.000I'm told that unredacted versions of that have been handed to select members of Congress and people that are investigated in an official capacity for the government.
01:28:18.000But in it, they specifically mention a case, not crash, a landed case that happened in 1953 at Cayman, Arizona.
01:28:27.000So I've made some inquiries with aerospace folks that I've been meeting with quietly, and I'm like, what's this case that you guys keep talking about with the King in Arizona?
01:28:35.000They're like, oh, it was like they just landed and left.
01:28:38.000I was like, well, how do you know they landed?
01:28:41.000And they're like, well, the doors are open and nobody home, and they walked off.
01:28:46.000I said, you mean somebody just flew this thing down, it landed on the ground in the desert, and came in Arizona in 1953, and they left the doors open and left, and they were like, yep, that's pretty much what happened.
01:31:15.000So he took his jacket off, and he very insistently put the jacket on this individual, because he was thinking, this person's really, really cold.
01:31:21.000He's been out in the desert, probably had a plane crash or whatever.
01:31:24.000And so he's putting his jacket, and the person was kind of resistant, but Jason said, I insisted.
01:31:28.000I took one layer of my jacket, and I put around this individual, and that individual left with the jacket on.
01:31:34.000So I jokingly say, where do you think your jacket is now?
01:31:38.000He's probably out there to help Zatari or God only knows.
01:32:53.000And I actually spoke to Rear Admiral Tim Gallaudet on a couple of occasions recently.
01:33:01.000And I thanked him for coming forward and testifying.
01:33:04.000And he said, you know, I felt an obligation to do so because a lot of my men, the pilots, were coming forward and I wanted to back them up.
01:33:12.000And so that's why he stepped forward and testified.
01:33:16.000Well, if you're coming here from somewhere else and you wanted to hide in plain sight, you would hide in the ocean, especially if you have the technology to completely negate any of the effects of the water and the pressure.
01:33:51.000Definitely not a homemade one like the one those people died in.
01:33:55.000Yeah, but that was there's another thing about that case when the people went down that submarine apparently I Guess it's the Navy has some sort of very sophisticated underwater audio sensors And they heard the implosion and they knew about it like immediately and didn't report on it Well, I mean I think the problem with reporting on is that you have to report on your technology now So I don't even know if this has been confirmed, but this is what I had heard and Methods and means?
01:34:25.000Well, it's also, it's got to be top secret.
01:34:29.000It's got to be one of those things where if you're going to reveal that you heard that, you have to have clearance to do it.
01:34:33.000You probably have to run it up the ladder.
01:34:35.000One of the reasons why we know about overhead satellite imagery of UAP is because of Ratcliffe, who was former head of ODNI. And he came forward.
01:34:44.000And I remember it's funny, actually, because it was classified.
01:34:46.000And Christopher Mellon participated in this latest production with me because of Ratcliffe revealing it on Fox News.
01:34:54.000And Ratcliffe basically says, yeah, we have overhead collection satellite data of UAP that are pretty fucking far out.
01:35:16.000As somebody who's been chasing this story for 30 years, I too want access to the better, more compelling data.
01:35:22.000That's why I chased after that photograph I just shared with you earlier on for as long as I did, because I hear about something and I go after it.
01:35:28.000But I want to remind your audience, You can't go after something without knowing that it exists.
01:36:13.000And this is where to find the more compelling data.
01:36:15.000I'm going to read this because it's important that people know that.
01:36:17.000He's saying, look, I've seen it, and this is where it is.
01:36:21.000It's called, the official UAP data is kept either in CIPR, Secret Internet Protocol Router Network, or JWICS, Joint Worldwide Intelligence Communication System, that's used by the DoD and only available in a SCIF. And a SCIF is a sensitive compartmented information facility.
01:37:02.000I want to get back to what I was talking about earlier.
01:37:05.000Logistically, if you're letting something go from the ocean, if you're flying it out of the ocean, logistically, you would have to have some sort of a large craft out there that's going to house these things, or it's going to launch from.
01:37:20.000If it is actually coming from the ocean.
01:37:22.000Oh, you see, the drones you're talking about right now.
01:39:26.000That it's unaccounted for and that they think it's headed to the United States.
01:39:30.000If you were trying to find that thing, Like a dirty bomb?
01:39:33.000Yeah, or like just a regular nuke, that if you're looking for gamma rays, you could devise a drone that could search for that, and you'd fly it over an area, and you wouldn't care whether people freaked out, because it's more important to find this goddamn thing.
01:39:48.000So if you have this technology, it's some skunkworks technology.
01:40:07.000People in the FBI, people that I communicate with often, I'm like, what is going on?
01:40:11.000It almost seems too sexy that the United States has that kind of ability and they're just flying these things around and that they're doing it for that specific reason, to find a nuke.
01:40:21.000It's like that we have this kind of technology that none of us are aware of.
01:40:25.000That we have these drones that can shut off when you come close to them.
01:40:42.000He was saying that's above what we can do right now.
01:40:45.000But they're not moving in a way necessarily.
01:40:48.000That's not possible with drone technology that is mainstream.
01:40:52.000But there's some aspects of the way they move and what they're doing that doesn't lead them to believe that this is current state-of-the-art technology as far as we know it.
01:41:01.000Yeah, even I had some people tell me, like, even if it's conventional, it's highly advanced conventional.
01:41:11.000We were talking about this as well, that the bottleneck in America was the FAA. The FAA put a lot of restrictions on the manufacture of drones and how you can do them, what you can do.
01:41:23.000China doesn't have any of that, so they're full steam ahead with innovation.
01:41:27.000Drone manufacturers in the United States have been able to do and then imagine untethered if they weren't fucked over by all these regulations that got in the way of innovation.
01:41:38.000Obviously you have to have one because if you have some commercial drone that someone can buy that can move 500 miles an hour and fly through the air and stay up there for six hours at a time and film video of everything and anything, Well, and you can't control it.
01:42:35.000Langley Air Force Base did experience incursions of unauthorized, unmanned aerial systems in last year, December 2023, says Sabrina Singh, Pentagon spokeswoman.
01:42:45.000The number of those UAS incursions did fluctuate, but they didn't appear to exhibit any hostile intent.
01:42:50.000It's something that we have kept our eye on.
01:42:52.000Well, thank God you're keeping your eye on it.
01:42:54.000Yeah, and we have no idea what they are, but they're fine.
01:43:03.000One of the reasons why I wanted you guys to hear that account by the guy at Vandenberg Air Force Base, this is not anonymous reporting.
01:43:09.000The guy's giving his name, and he's talking about objects that are the size of a football field, hovering over a silo, launch control area.
01:44:11.000He's like, there were these, on the belly of it, there were these reverse, like, recessed cones.
01:44:17.000It's, like, bigger, and then they got smaller as it went up into the belly of the craft.
01:44:22.000He's looking up at it and his finger's on the trigger and he's like, man, I wonder if it wasn't that hard.
01:44:26.000I go, I wonder what would happen if I just pulled the trigger here and I bet it would ricochet off or hit the belly or something.
01:44:31.000So he's looking at it and he's just about to pull the trigger to check it out and he goes, hmm, maybe this isn't such a good idea.
01:44:39.000I interviewed him in 2008 when this was going down, and then about a year later, I was doing some follow-up interviews for a film I did, I Know What I Saw, and I had this gentleman walk up to me, and I was filming in the downtown square in Stephenville, or it might have been Dublin, and...
01:44:56.000This gentleman looks at me and he goes, you Mr. Fox?
01:45:33.000We were sitting in our patrol cars and this object was like a floating department storm.
01:45:37.000It was absolutely colossal like a city.
01:45:40.000Took out my radar gun, pointed at it, and it was doing 22 miles an hour.
01:45:45.000And then he said it drifted off and one of the officers, I don't remember the name of the gentleman, took his dash cam and he flipped it up and he filmed it.
01:45:54.000And apparently one of the biggest mistakes this individual made, this police officer made, was that he didn't make a copy of it because the local Air Force base requested that film footage and got it.
01:46:04.000And so I've been telling people to go after that stuff exists.
01:46:07.000But my point is, this object was so big, people claimed that witnesses, the first-hand witnesses, that you had landed an airplane on it.
01:46:25.000Like, if I saw it, if I was outside in the desert, and I was just chilling, and something so big that I couldn't see the edges of it flew overhead, I don't know what I'd say.
01:46:35.000He said when it took off, It was like this.
01:46:49.000He goes, It went from this, a complete standstill, and it went straight up, like at a slight angle, but straight up and gone.
01:47:01.000He goes, James, I said, describe the acceleration.
01:47:03.000He goes, hell, I'll tell you, the best way I can describe it is that had I blinked, I would have missed it.
01:47:12.000He had helicopters hovering over his—I know this sounds crazy, but people are going to be like, oh, this big—but he had helicopters flying over his property for a while, right around the time that I was trying to get him to go on camera.
01:47:25.000He came out in his underwear and his shotgun late at night with his helicopter spotlighting him up, and he ended up calling the local Air Force base and said, stop flying over my house at night.
01:47:33.000And they said, we suggest you stop talking about what you saw.
01:48:03.000But there's more sightings in the United States than anywhere else, right?
01:48:06.000There seems to be an attraction almost like a moth to a flame with nukes.
01:48:12.000Somehow they're interested in our nuclear capabilities.
01:48:15.000And I remember interviewing Robert Salas, who was a launch control officer, who described this whole event at Malmstrom Air Force Base in the 60s.
01:48:23.000Where these UFOs were witnessed on the base, and then all their Minutemen missiles started getting shut down.
01:48:31.000And I remember saying to him, like, well, what's your take on that?
01:48:37.000Like, what kind of, you know, and he goes, and I realized why this individual was a launch control officer, because he was so measured and so calm and so cool.
01:48:46.000And he goes, well, James, the message I got was kind of clear.
01:48:50.000It's almost like taking matches out of the hands of a baby.
01:49:09.000But you also look at what they don't do.
01:49:12.000Because if the phenomenon wanted to end this, like, you know, secrecy once and for all, all they'd have to do is hover over the Macy's Day Parade or the next big Super Bowl and it's game over.
01:49:24.000They've done some pretty brazen things, right?
01:49:26.000I mean, case in point, March 13th, 97, over the state of Arizona, including the governor, Fife Simon, witnessed that massive—there were a number of UFOs witnessed, but the main one, you know, was this big boomerang-shaped craft.
01:49:40.000And even the governor said it must have been at least a mile across from wingtip to wingtip that floated.
01:49:45.000And I actually interviewed people that worked at Luke Air Force Base at the time, and they said that they scrambled jets to intercept this thing.
01:49:52.000And I interviewed a number of people that saw that craft.
01:49:55.000I mean, that stood on their, that light down on their lawns and watched it float over the top of them.
01:50:00.000And apparently, according to this individual that I met in the late 90s at Luke Air Force Base, they scrambled a military jet to intercept this thing.
01:50:08.000He came up on it, could have landed on the damn thing.
01:50:17.000When the jet came back to the base, Luke Air Force Base, they had to carry him out of the plane, I'm told, because he was so shaken by what he saw.
01:50:26.000Yeah, I can imagine you wouldn't handle that well.
01:50:28.000Can you imagine having to keep that secret?
01:50:53.000I was the one that got him to break his silence after 10 years.
01:50:57.000And he told me, and I don't necessarily know that I fully believe it...
01:51:02.000But he told – because initially when it happened in March – remember, the vast majority of people were out under the night sky to get a glimpse of the Hellbomb comet.
01:51:10.000So it was witnessed all the way across the state of Arizona and even in Nevada, southern Nevada.
01:51:18.000Fife told me that it was growing hysteria.
01:51:20.000But initially he had set out – And he said, we're going to find out.
01:51:25.000I'm contacting Luke Air Force Base, reached out to the Pentagon, and all these various services, and we're going to get to the bottom of it.
01:51:32.000And then, I don't know how much longer it was.
01:51:34.000Was it later that day, or was it the next day?
01:51:36.000He held an unscheduled press conference, and that's when he had his aides dressed up in an alien suit and made a mockery of it all.
01:51:43.000And I can assure you, pissed the hell off his constituents and the witnesses all across the state of Arizona.
01:53:56.000I'd have to really do a deep dive into it, but let me tell you what happened, because this is brilliant.
01:54:00.000So what happened was, you got this massive object from around 5.30 at night in the southern Nevada, and then it drifts down very slowly from north to south across the entire state of Arizona, and right around 7.30, 8, 8.30, the Berry-Goldwater mountain range, which is the direction it was heading in, the military decides to drop a bunch of flares.
01:54:26.000And so people were like, oh, there it is!
01:54:29.000And a bunch of people filmed the flares.
01:54:31.000So in my opinion, it was a diversionary tactic that was brilliantly done, because why the military suddenly decided to drop flares in the shape of, somewhat of the shape.
01:54:41.000So I think that some of the footage that you've seen out there is military flares, but there's And there was an effort, I don't know if you want to get into it right now, but there was an effort by the so-called MIB, these men in black, or whatever unknown government agency they come from, that took some footage that I was learning about.
01:55:05.000During my investigations in the 90s and then you're looking at me like I'm crazy.
01:55:09.000So the first time I really heard a really credible report of the MIB and I decided not to report on it was when I was in touch with a woman who was councilwoman, Frances Barwood, who was one of the few officials in Phoenix area that was saying, hey, let's investigate what these people are claiming to have seen.
01:55:50.000He was a Vietnam vet, and he was on the roof of his house with a tripod and a camera, and he was trying to get a glimpse.
01:55:55.000He was trying to film the pale bob comet.
01:55:57.000And he had walkie-talkies, and he was monitoring the truck drivers driving up Interstate 10 from Tucson to Phoenix.
01:56:03.000And so he's monitoring this, and he hears these truckers talking about a massive UFO, and he's like, shit, that's heading right towards my house.
01:56:24.000So they made arrangements where he was going to drop it off at her office.
01:56:27.000Either later that day or first thing the next morning, two representatives, and it was July at this point, and it was very hot, two men in dark suits showed up at his house, and they said, hey, um...
01:56:39.000He was apparently relieved that's all he wanted.
01:56:41.000He said they were quite menacing looking.
01:57:32.000But hearing those cases over and over and over, it's like, there we go.
01:57:36.000Once again, the so-called evidence that could prove or disprove one way or the other that something truly extraordinary took place in the skies over Phoenix back in 1997 vanished.
01:57:46.000But there is some that slip between the cracks that's out there.
01:58:12.000I talked to another woman, Stacy Rhodes, and her daughter Emily, and they said they were driving on Interstate 10, and she goes, look, James, I'm going to tell you how big this thing was.
01:58:21.000She goes, first of all, there were people stopped on the freeway, just like stopped as this thing.
01:58:26.000It was like close encounters floating over there.
01:58:28.000She goes, I could have held up a newspaper like this and looked to the left, looked to the right, looked at that, and she said, I couldn't block this thing out.
01:58:36.000That's how big it was, and it didn't make a sound.
01:58:50.000Well, when you get thousands of people seeing the same thing, if you see thousands of people saying the same thing, including the governor, the governor...
01:59:30.000There is so much evidence in terms of...
01:59:36.000Eyewitness testimony and radar, some photographic, not as much as we'd like, that something truly inexplicable is taking place in our aerospace, right?
01:59:47.000Something that, after careful examination, something that, not because of a lack of data in some instances, but that after careful analysis and research, investigation, that comes out the other end and says...
02:00:00.000I can't explain this as going to have to be one of those unknowns or, you know, falls into that 15% category of cannot provide a terrestrial or conventional explanation for.
02:00:13.000And those are the cases that I've so desperately have been going after for a long time.
02:00:18.000So is all this disclosure and those discussions on television now and all these meetings and hearings, so you think we're on an accelerated path?
02:00:31.000But do you think that there's a real possibility, like within the next few years, that they just completely drop all the bullshit and come clean about this stuff?
02:00:39.000Or would it take some sort of extraordinary event where they had to admit it?
02:00:43.000Something much bigger than this drone thing?
02:00:46.000Well, in some respects, there has been...
02:00:49.000I remember I interviewed this guy, Nick Pope, at the MOD years ago, and I was like, this is a time when we were pushing for transparency there.
02:00:57.000France was releasing previously classified documents on UFOs, les ovnis, as they'd say.
02:01:04.000They were releasing previously classified documents, slowly putting it out there.
02:01:07.000And at the time, it was rather exciting.
02:01:09.000I just did a big event at the National Press Club with Leslie Kane, and And it was like this whole movement.
02:01:13.000It was like, oh my God, it's happening, right?
02:01:15.000But it kind of petered out a little bit.
02:01:19.000And I remember asking this guy that used to work the UFO desk at the MOD, Nick Pope, and I said, Nick, do you anticipate any type of disclosure?
02:01:26.000This is like 2009 or something, 2008, 2009. And he goes, James, no.
02:01:31.000He goes, it's going to be disclosure with a small d.
02:01:34.000Not a big D. It's going to trickle out slowly.
02:01:36.000Condition people, get people prepared, test the waters.
02:01:40.000You know, one of the things that we explore in the program, and I've never done that, is the politics of disclosure.
02:01:44.000It's a far more complex—let's just suspend judgment for a moment and assume that it's real, okay?
02:01:50.000That there really is an NHI or non-human intelligence aspect to the phenomenon, right?
02:03:11.000In fact, they said to me at the time, if you're here...
02:03:15.000To discuss whether or not the UFO phenomenon is real, the door's right over there.
02:03:19.000We're here to create an international coalition, an international exchange of information, and to talk about the implications of the phenomenon, which I thought was amazing.
02:03:59.000Look, whether you believe it or you don't believe it, if you can just imagine for a moment if it is true and if the U.S. government does in fact have irrefutable evidence that we're not alone in the universe, that's so significant.
02:04:14.000That we all have a right to that information and that we should continue to support this unprecedented push for transparency with our elected officials and get to the fucking bottom of it.
02:04:59.000People that are concerned about their secrecy, concerned about their safety, concerned about the implications of them coming forward and going public, that they don't quite have, and this comes from a very good source of information, that the Witness Protection Program and the legislation that they've created around that is not quite there yet.
02:05:53.000You go from a teenager, suddenly you're 30, you always think like 30. And I was talking to him not too long ago, Jesse, and I said, he's like, yeah, I feel a little old.
02:05:59.000I was like, dude, you are just getting into your prime, baby.
02:06:03.000But I really wanted to, this is a guy who's young, Julian Doria is also doing some amazing work on this in podcasts, but he was young and is doing a deep dive into the implications and into...
02:06:26.000He's documented it with these podcasts, and he's doing a fantastic job, and I just got to tip my hat to the guy because...
02:06:32.000He's ten times smarter than I'll ever be and he's young and he's a force to be reckoned with and he's really doing he's answering all the questions that you and I are exploring all these issues that you and I are talking about.
02:06:43.000Well, I'm glad there's people out there pushing it, and I'm glad there's guys like Grush that are sticking their neck out, and guys like you who are making documentaries about it.
02:06:50.000The subject is much more open to discussion, like I was saying, amongst serious people, where it didn't used to be before.
02:06:57.000And now I think with this drone thing, I think there's so many people that are going, okay, even if they're ours, or they're China's, what's going on?
02:09:01.000And for some reason, they want to keep people in suspense.
02:09:04.000I can't imagine it's the enemy, because if it was the enemy, they'd blast it out.
02:09:08.000Even if they were late, they'd blast it out.
02:09:12.000Something strange is going on for some reason they don't want to tell the people and they should because the people are really I mean they happen to be over Bedminster They're very close to Bedminster.
02:09:24.000I think maybe I won't spend the weekend in Bedminster.
02:09:27.000I've decided to cancel my trip Yeah, I think I won't spend the weekend in Bedminster.
02:09:33.000Yeah Wow I bet someone told him Mr. President it's pretty important that you don't go to the golf course.
02:10:35.000At James C. Fox on X, formerly known as Twitter.
02:10:39.000The Reddit community is banding together for a huge grassroots campaign for government transparency.
02:10:45.000So basically all the various platforms on Reddit, like Paranormal, UFO, they don't usually get along too well, but they're all combining their resources and they're getting together for the first time ever.
02:10:56.000And to push for government transparency, there's a couple of government insiders that appear in my film that will be appearing on this to answer questions and what steps need to be happening, what's going on today, and this is happening on the 20th of December.
02:11:11.0003 p.m., and I'll be posting more information, the very specific details on X at James C. Fox.
02:11:17.000I just wanted to get that out there before because...
02:11:21.000Well, the more this stuff that happens, the better.
02:11:23.000The more people demand it, the better.
02:11:25.000The more politicians hear from the people and want to...
02:11:28.000I mean, especially politicians that are up for reelection, and they want to show that they're doing what the people want them to do.
02:11:35.000Yeah, I'd like to know more, but obviously I'm very happy that we're hearing much more about the subject in a serious way.
02:11:50.000I went bent over backwards to put together and explain everything in layman terms, what's happened from 2017 to today, because it's unprecedented.
02:11:59.000We're living in an unprecedented moment in history.
02:12:01.000There's an unprecedented push for government transparency.
02:12:05.000And I want to continue supporting our elected officials' bipartisan effort to get to the bottom of this.
02:12:10.000And I especially want to throw a shout out to Representative Burchette because you're killing it, buddy.
02:13:01.000They found no evidence suggesting threat to national security or public safety.
02:13:04.000Despite these assurances, some local officials and residents remain concerned.
02:13:08.000For instance, Belleville Mayor Michael Melham...
02:13:11.000Speculated the increased drone activity might be related to the search for missing radioactive material from the medical facility in New Jersey.
02:13:17.000Additionally, the public figures like Bethany Frankel have shared unverified theories about the drone's purposes, further fueling speculation.
02:13:25.000The situation is evolving and authorities continue to monitor and investigate new reports.
02:13:30.000Residents are advised to report any suspicious drone activity to local law enforcement and avoid taking matters into their own hands like shooting them down.
02:15:49.000While it's possible to imagine scenarios involving drones searching for dangerous materials such as a nuclear bomb, there's no verified information suggesting such an extreme situation.
02:17:25.000If you're concerned about potential nuclear incident, here's a list of safest options based on geographic, environmental, and strategic factors.
02:17:32.000Montana, Colorado, Wyoming, Idaho, sparsely populated, vast distances from major cities and military targets.
02:17:40.000Towns like Bozeman, Jackson Hole, Sandpointe are beautiful remote and away from the fallout paths.
02:19:40.000Craft describes smooth, white, oblong, resembling a tic-tac, no visible propulsion, wings or exhausts, played extraordinary flight characteristics, accelerated instantly from a hovering position, descended from 80,000 feet to near sea level in seconds.
02:19:53.000Fravor reported the object mimicked his movements during their engagement and then vanished at extreme speed.
02:19:59.000It's possible the craft was an ultra-secret military project, either U.S.-based experimental aircraft, aerospace technology, or developed by another nation.
02:20:07.000However, the extreme flight performance raises doubt.
02:20:10.000Such advanced technology would suggest a significant leap beyond publicly known capabilities, which is inconsistent with current engineering limits.
02:20:19.000Sensor anomaly or perception issues...
02:20:21.000I asked the heads of Arrow if they could explain that one, and they said no.
02:20:32.000If all accounts of the capabilities of the Tic Tac craft are true, what are the possibilities that what are the possibilities that it came from another planet?
02:20:56.000What are the possibilities that it came from another planet?
02:21:17.000Okay, so if the accounts of the Tic Tacs craft capabilities are accurate, instantaneous acceleration, hypersonic speeds without visible propulsion, no heat signatures and defiance of inertia, then the possibilities of origin being extraterrestrial or from another planet become a viable hypothesis.
02:21:51.000In Newtonian physics, achieving this would require manipulating gravity or space-time itself.
02:21:56.000Silent operation, no sonic booms, despite hypersonic speeds, points to a technology that likely eliminates air resistance, such as surrounding itself in an electromagnetic field or bubble.
02:22:08.000This level of technological advancement far surpasses anything developed on Earth.
02:22:13.000If true, such capabilities would suggest a highly advanced civilization, perhaps thousands or millions of years ahead of us scientifically.
02:22:21.000If true, where do you think it came from?
02:22:43.000If the Tic Tac UAP is real and the accounts are accurate, then its origin may very well be extraterrestrial or involve unknown physics and technology that we haven't begun to comprehend.
02:22:53.000The extraordinary nature of the case suggests an equally extraordinary explanation.
02:23:38.000Identifying where they might come from involves exploring nearby stellar systems, known exoplanets, and plausible scientific ideas about interstellar travel.
02:23:47.000Here are the most likely possibilities.
02:23:48.000Nearby star systems with habitable zones.
02:23:51.000Alpha Centauri system 4.37 light years away the closest star system to Earth Proxima Centauri Potentially habitable planet exoplanet Orbiting Proxima Centauri within the habitable zone if life developed there might be technologically advanced enough for interstellar exploration Bernard so it's giving me a list of all the potential possibilities possible star systems that This one's only 39 light years away.
02:24:16.000What was the closest one Alpha Centauri was at?
02:24:18.000Was that four light years or something?
02:24:35.000twins, right, as kids, say one's 10, they're both 10, and you put one in a spaceship that travels the speed of light for one year, he would come back with an atomic clock on board that spacecraft, a year older, CB-11, and his brother would be an old man.
02:25:11.000So I think the idea is that instead of a rocket that goes 5 million miles an hour and just shoots off of Earth and keeps going until 5 million years from now, it runs into this planet.
02:25:24.000I think if I had to guess where something can manipulate gravity and space, what it would do is instantaneously appear in these new places.
02:25:38.000And you've talked to a lot of physicists about this kind of stuff, huh?
02:25:41.000And the way they explained it is baffling.
02:25:44.000And Bob Lazar's version of it is baffling.
02:25:47.000Because Bob Lazar's version of it, that he told in 1989, kind of makes sense when you talk to people that are trying to develop some sort of a gravity or a warp drive.
02:25:59.000And the way Bob Lazar explained it is that...
02:26:02.000This element, when bombarded with radiation, creates this...
02:26:10.000Gravity field that allows it, the way he described it, like, if you took a mattress, a very soft mattress, and put a very heavy bowling ball in the middle of the mattress, it pushes the mattress down to that area, and that this, like, folds time.
02:26:23.000Right, so you go from here to here, but when you stretch it down, suddenly those two points connect.
02:26:41.000If you think about how technology scales, and if we do, I mean, Ryan brought up this yesterday as well, that there was research and there was papers written about the idea of having some sort of a gravity drive.
02:26:56.000Or having some sort of a gravity propulsion system, something that doesn't rely on conventional, you know, rockets, pushing gases out the back.
02:27:05.000And he said that this was something that was discussed a long time ago, but then it just stopped.
02:27:09.000And, you know, we brought it up quite a while ago, there was an episode that we brought up, a paper that was written in the 1960s about gravity drives.
02:27:20.000Because he's like a propulsion expert in terms of the physics behind UFOs.
02:27:25.000And I tried to get him to explain it to me in sort of conventional, layman terms, and of course my tiny little brain.
02:27:32.000But I felt like I almost grasped it for a moment, but the amount of power that it would take to create that gravitational field Around the object.
02:27:40.000And he said that's why you see them doing these maneuvers that look like it defy physics, right?
02:27:45.000And then everything inside the craft would just splatter.
02:27:48.000That you're immune from that on the inside, according.
02:28:23.000It allows it to just pass through things.
02:28:25.000I remember Kirk McConnell, the Senate Armed Service Committee, who investigated UFOs from 2017. I talked about them earlier.
02:28:31.000But he said that they were picking up...
02:28:33.000Aegis radar systems were picking these objects up basically from space.
02:28:37.000And they were shooting down from space all the way down.
02:28:40.000They'd loiter for as long as they wanted to, go in the water, come back out again, shoot back up into space, and they would just do it all day long.
02:28:54.000If there's someone in the military that does have some super advanced satellite reconnaissance imagery of these things, I could see why they would hold that back.
02:29:07.000I could see why they would think that people aren't ready for that.
02:29:38.000Everybody talks about, I mean, even Ratcliffe talked about the satellite imagery of UAP. I mean, if they're picking it up, why wouldn't his systems pick it up?
02:29:46.000He hasn't said a peep about the drone thing.
02:30:34.000We already know that AI systems, like Mike Baker explained to us, that AI systems with fighter jets beat actual fighter jet pilots 100% of the time.
02:30:46.000When they have these simulated dogfights, when they take AI fighter jets that we have right now, they beat our fighter jet pilots, the best of the best, 100% of the time.
02:30:56.000So, they don't have any biological limitations in terms of what they can deal with the chief forces.
02:31:37.000And so, neither side is air superiority and tanks are easily destroyed by missiles, so that leaves infantry and artillery, basically World War I. Drones are not yet available in sufficient numbers to matter, much like aircraft in World War I. A defense in depth trench war means, and then some modern example.
02:37:15.000And then another friend of mine saw someone get hit, saw someone get rear-ended, someone not paying attention in their car, rear-ended a bike, and had the guy flying through the air at a red light.
02:38:16.000It's got a bit of a buzz, a bit of a connection to it.
02:38:19.000A push for government transparency on this topic, right?
02:38:22.000If you had to say something truly inexplicable that most likely would lead to NHI or non-human intelligence or not conventional, What would you pick, ultimately, that you think there is possibly a non-human intelligence behind this or that there is not?
02:38:38.000I wish I could be definitive like that.
02:39:03.000Is there a propulsion system available in 2004 that's that far advanced?
02:39:08.000And if so, how come there's so little evidence of it in, like, In a practical use, like how come that technology, you would think that technology would take so much money to develop that you would do something with it in 20 years.
02:39:23.000You wouldn't just have it and just be flying it around like a drone every now and again.
02:39:27.000It would seem like there would be some sort of a practical application for something like that.
02:39:31.000And it seemed like the Manhattan Project and like the stealth bomber, eventually you find out that it's a real thing, right?
02:39:38.000So 20 years is a long Time to not find out that something's real.
02:39:42.000Well, how about if we take it up to a lot longer than that?
02:39:46.000What about the 1952, two consecutive weekends in July over the White House in the Capitol?
02:39:52.000And that was, we had a press conference about that.
02:40:37.000And if they really have always been here and they've always been visiting us, that's probably how you would describe it.
02:40:43.000You would describe it like Ezekiel did in the Bible.
02:40:45.000Yeah, you know, I was in Africa investigating the alleged landing and closing kind of the third kind at Rue Zimbabwe Aerial School in 1994. I wasn't there in 94. I was there much later.
02:40:56.000And the teacher, Judy Bates, who's now the head principal, and she was sharing with me these drawings that children did of the alleged creatures.
02:41:05.000And they were amazing, these drawings, big eyes and big heads, almond-shaped eyes, blah, blah, blah.
02:41:11.000And I'm looking at these drawings, one after the other, from all these school children.
02:41:18.000And then a month later, I went to Australia, and I was investigating an alleged landing that happened at Westall Primary School in 1966. And that was incredible.
02:41:28.000I was there investigating, and I was showing some of the drawings of the alleged aliens that I just had investigated in Africa.
02:41:35.000And some of the people were like, oh, wow, these drawings are amazing.