The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #2264 - Lenval Logan & Jason Sands

00:00:01.000 Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out.

00:00:03.000 The Joe Rogan Experience.

00:00:06.000 Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.

00:00:12.000 Okay.

00:00:13.000 Gentlemen, what's happening?

00:00:15.000 Nice to meet you.

00:00:16.000 Nice to meet you, Steve.

00:00:17.000 Both of you guys were in the program, which is a UFO, that's why I wore my Roswell shirt, UFO Disclosure.

00:00:28.000 All about what's going on behind the scenes.

00:00:30.000 Why don't you tell everybody before we get started, Jay, tell them what your background is, what you do.

00:00:35.000 I'm a retired Master Sergeant from the Air Force, worked 22 years, retired 2007. Started off as an airframe guy, ended up in Intel, and that's when things got strange.

00:00:46.000 Had my second duty assignment as an Intel guy and got introduced to the program, and that's how I ended up in the movie.

00:00:55.000 Because I had some strange experiences that I could talk about that were unclassified.

00:01:01.000 So I came forward, and that's where James founded me.

00:01:04.000 And we got along pretty good, and everything's a history from there.

00:01:09.000 And, Logan, you were in the documentary as well, so tell everybody what you do.

00:01:12.000 So I am a...

00:01:14.000 Pull this up to your face.

00:01:15.000 I'm sorry.

00:01:15.000 It's okay.

00:01:16.000 So I'm also a retired Master Sergeant from the Air Force.

00:01:20.000 Started off as a B-52 crew chief, cross-trained into Intel.

00:01:25.000 I retired after 21 and a half, and I ended up being part of the UAP Task Force, and I was one of the first people to come across Jay here and some other people.

00:01:38.000 And from that, James found out about me and said, okay, we need to talk.

00:01:45.000 So him and Leslie Keen approached me, and I was like, yeah.

00:01:50.000 But I kind of got outed by Jay Stratton.

00:01:54.000 Everybody was ganging up around him, and he was like, why are you asking me?

00:01:59.000 Logan worked for me.

00:02:00.000 And everybody went, okay, I guess I'm out.

00:02:04.000 Oh, boy.

00:02:06.000 So, let's start with you, Jay.

00:02:09.000 What was your first introduction?

00:02:12.000 To this whole concept that we are in possession of alien crafts or that we have communicated or there's been some contact.

00:02:21.000 What was your thoughts about it before you had these experiences?

00:02:25.000 I had had a childhood experience with a UFO previous to that when I was 10 years old.

00:02:31.000 So I didn't really get an interest in UFOs at all.

00:02:35.000 I just thought it was strange.

00:02:36.000 It was also a shared experience with my mother.

00:02:39.000 What was the experience?

00:02:41.000 Well, it was just a red orb that came down.

00:02:43.000 It looked like it came from the atmosphere, you know, at a distance, and then kept approaching my bedroom window and ended up kind of hovering near the bottom of my street.

00:02:53.000 And I was screaming to my parents, you know, there's a strange light outside.

00:02:59.000 Nobody responded, so I ran out to get my binoculars, my dad's binoculars, and ran out to the front lawn.

00:03:03.000 Finally, my mom was the only one that responded.

00:03:05.000 And we both got to see it taken off as it came across the rooftop of my friend Eddie's house at the bottom of the street.

00:03:12.000 And that's what she got to see, my mother and I. Did it make any noise?

00:03:17.000 Zero noise.

00:03:18.000 No, it just looked like a total mirror, completely polished mirror kind of...

00:03:27.000 How big was it?

00:03:28.000 It was about 30, 35 foot.

00:03:31.000 Really?

00:03:31.000 Maybe even 40 foot.

00:03:32.000 Yeah, it was about half the size of my friend's rooftop, if you were to measure it from front to back.

00:03:39.000 So, you know, it was pretty big.

00:03:41.000 It was enough for probably your eye to stand up in it and walk around a little bit.

00:03:46.000 Your mother has the exact same recollection of the experience?

00:03:49.000 Actually, I've been asked to write a book, so I've got her writing her part of that, and I'll have the same thing.

00:03:55.000 I've had another couple of experiences that my family members and other friends will probably write up some.

00:04:01.000 And so this was all when you were young, and so you had this memory in your head when you started working for the government, but when were you introduced to the whole idea that this is a real thing?

00:04:14.000 Well, I know it's on mission because I just kind of filed away that UFO experience at 10 years old for many years, and I just was kind of even skeptical sometimes about, well, maybe it was just something, you know, an aberration in my mind or eyes or something.

00:04:28.000 But anyway, so I got really convinced that this was real when I was at Wright-Patt on a mission, when I was in the program, and we intercepted some calls that literally were speaking about...

00:04:42.000 An NHI presence in the program.

00:04:44.000 And they were working in labs.

00:04:46.000 So Wright-Patt, for everybody, Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio, and NHI non-human intelligence, right?

00:04:54.000 That's correct.

00:04:55.000 And so they were saying...

00:04:57.000 What were they saying?

00:04:58.000 How much can you say?

00:04:59.000 Like, is any of this top secret?

00:05:01.000 I can pretty much talk about the culture and the presence of the NHI, but I can't talk about, like, weapon systems and the technology they're developing.

00:05:09.000 That's all gonna have to be national security stuff because we don't want our enemies to know what we got.

00:05:13.000 Of course.

00:05:15.000 So what was this talk of NHI? What did it entail?

00:05:21.000 When you first heard it?

00:05:22.000 Well, it was between two people that were talking about the day's interview with this NHI that they had.

00:05:28.000 They called it an Eben.

00:05:29.000 They had an interview?

00:05:30.000 Yeah.

00:05:31.000 He had had an interview with them and he was relaying what was talked about in that interview to another individual, probably his boss or somebody that is going to pass it on to the rest of the folks in the group or whatever it is.

00:05:42.000 Do you see this written down?

00:05:44.000 I did not.

00:05:45.000 I had it recorded just like you would with anything else that's, you know, it's recorded in such a way that it can stand legal, forensic.

00:05:55.000 Kind of analysis.

00:05:56.000 That's the level of stuff that you have to do with an intel guy is you have to be really specific about what you're recording and make sure it's accurate.

00:06:03.000 Even whether you believe it or not, what's going on, you have to be able to transcribe that word for word the way it goes.

00:06:07.000 So you heard the recording.

00:06:09.000 That's how you found out about this non-human intelligence thing.

00:06:12.000 Well, it was an active phone call.

00:06:13.000 That's what I did on the red team that I was on for the program because I was monitoring for the Air Force.

00:06:20.000 And in this case, I'm monitoring for the program.

00:06:22.000 Can you say how the conversation went?

00:06:25.000 How did someone bring up non-human intelligence?

00:06:28.000 Was there any discussion before this non-human intelligence of UFOs at all or aliens at all?

00:06:35.000 Yeah, there was quite a few times.

00:06:37.000 We had a scientist on the team.

00:06:39.000 There was an officer.

00:06:39.000 He was a nuclear scientist.

00:06:41.000 And he was able to give us some insights and stuff like that because we'd have some really strange things like...

00:06:49.000 Things that were turning at 90 degrees, and how do you not break that piece of machinery or not kill the occupants?

00:06:56.000 And we were hearing stuff like that.

00:06:57.000 And they had, like, very technical parameters that I cannot discuss.

00:07:01.000 But they were talking about these, and we'd get the scientists to come and talk to us.

00:07:05.000 And they'd say, oh, yeah, that's this, this, and this.

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00:08:30.000 And so how does the conversation go where the non-human intelligence gets brought up?

00:08:35.000 That was just like the two of them.

00:08:38.000 When I picked up the call and started the recording on it, there was some guy that was there at Wright-Patt, and apparently he had been talking to this Eben.

00:08:47.000 And he said, yeah, up-to-date session.

00:08:48.000 Yeah, we've got some more information you need to hear about.

00:08:52.000 This is what is going to happen.

00:08:54.000 He says that there's going to be another meeting and that if we don't return the equipment and the prisoners, there's going to be some bad things happen.

00:09:03.000 We have prisoners.

00:09:04.000 Yes.

00:09:05.000 That's what they said on the phone call.

00:09:07.000 And the other guy's like, well, hey, what if we can't get them to return all the equipment and the people?

00:09:13.000 And the guy that had given the interview, he's like, You don't want to do that.

00:09:18.000 And the guy's like, well, why?

00:09:20.000 He said, if you don't, they're going to be put to death.

00:09:23.000 And I was like, I literally stepped back for a minute and I was like, what's going on here?

00:09:30.000 So I had to finish out the call.

00:09:31.000 They talked about sundry, other things, just stupid stuff.

00:09:34.000 Can you be a little bit more clear, like, who was going to be put to death?

00:09:37.000 The program folks that are responsible for keeping the tech that's not theirs and also, you know, doing things to these.

00:09:46.000 Extraterrestrials.

00:09:46.000 How did they allegedly acquire this tech?

00:09:50.000 Retrievals.

00:09:51.000 Retrievals.

00:09:51.000 Yeah, when I was first introduced into the program, one of the very first things they asked me was, do you want to be part of the retrieval program?

00:09:58.000 And I said, well, tell me about it.

00:09:59.000 And when they said...

00:10:00.000 The things they said, I was like, no.

00:10:02.000 Number one, it sounds gross.

00:10:03.000 Number two, you probably can't give me enough PPE gear and hazmat gear to make me feel safe around these things.

00:10:09.000 And no, I'm not interested in that.

00:10:11.000 Thank you very much.

00:10:11.000 So how do they describe it that freaked you out that much?

00:10:14.000 They're talking about biological entities that are retrieved along with the crash?

00:10:18.000 Yes.

00:10:18.000 Why do they crash if they're so fucking smart?

00:10:20.000 That's always the big question, right?

00:10:22.000 Well, I think the new guy on the block, Jake Barber.

00:10:27.000 He's describing some of the ways that you can do this psionically.

00:10:30.000 I guess the psionic team is going to start showing some of that to the world, that some of these craft are manned and piloted by consciousness.

00:10:39.000 And apparently they have a psionics team that can actually get in the headspace of these craft and cause them to land.

00:10:46.000 So it's not really a forced landing.

00:10:48.000 It's just kind of a mutual thing.

00:10:49.000 So wait a minute.

00:10:50.000 The United States government?

00:10:52.000 Has the ability to contact or interact with these craft and force them to land?

00:10:58.000 Yes.

00:10:59.000 And then there's other ones that are done kinetically, which is more the scary side of it and the ugly side of the program is that what you've got here is it's not so much the military doing this, but the corporate people like Lockheed, Northrop and all these other companies, they treat this stuff as very high value target kind of stuff. they treat this stuff as very high value target kind And it's very valuable for them to get the retrievals.

00:11:19.000 So you've got really what amounts to a bunch of treasure hunters that are hired with mercenaries involved as well that go out for these retrievals.

00:11:28.000 And that's where Jake Barber comes in is that he sees some of these people that are hired to come out and retrieve this stuff and he's done that.

00:11:33.000 So the idea would be that the retrievals would be very valuable because you could back engineer the tech, figure out how it works, make weapon systems, make superior crafts.

00:11:43.000 How long has this supposedly been going on for?

00:11:46.000 Decades.

00:11:46.000 It's been going on for a very long time.

00:11:50.000 Even before I was born.

00:11:52.000 But if the tech that we have now that allows us to tell them to land didn't exist before, why did they crash before?

00:12:00.000 What is Roswell?

00:12:01.000 Well, Roswell, the most accurate account is the one where the microwave radar waveform.

00:12:12.000 Upset the onboard avionics inside these craft that these NHI were flying on that day in Roswell.

00:12:20.000 But radar is just a detection signal, right?

00:12:24.000 Right.

00:12:24.000 But if you look at some of the stuff like Gary Nolan said about how even at the very molecular level, these things are organized very minutely.

00:12:32.000 So you can imagine what even a flow of electricity...

00:12:35.000 If it affects it wrong or it's at the right wavelength, it does break down the electrical current and the electromagnetic or whatever drive that they might have.

00:12:45.000 And that seems to be what happened at Roswell is that they actually accidentally went in and were just sweeping like a radar and it caused this craft to crash.

00:12:56.000 What a shit design.

00:12:58.000 You know what I'm saying?

00:13:01.000 Imagine if you bought a Tesla and the wheels fly off when it rains out.

00:13:05.000 You'd be like, what the fuck?

00:13:06.000 You guys have this super advanced vehicle that you can come here from another planet and radar makes you crash?

00:13:13.000 That kind of stuff makes people incredulous, right?

00:13:15.000 I'd like to add something here.

00:13:18.000 Someone gave me an analogy to say, think of it as there's a type of metal that is totally non-magnetic, but as soon as you put a current through it...

00:13:29.000 It becomes magnetic, alright?

00:13:31.000 And he said, imagine this.

00:13:33.000 You're in Roswell, you're cruising along, you're checking out, everybody doing their thing.

00:13:37.000 And then, because remember, that night there was a huge electrical storm.

00:13:41.000 That's one of the big things they keep talking about.

00:13:43.000 If one of those things gets hit, and all of a sudden they slam together because now they're magnetic, and then they bounce off, and that's why you had one that landed in Roswell area and the one that landed somewhere else.

00:13:55.000 Yeah, there were two.

00:13:56.000 So that was what...

00:13:58.000 Someone told me.

00:13:59.000 Now, I've never been able to figure out if that's the actual truth.

00:14:03.000 But the two most likely possibilities is that one and what Jay just said.

00:14:09.000 There's actually another person that was approached by the same race of NHI. And this guy says that they actually recounted what happened, is that they thought they were attacked by a directed energy weapon.

00:14:22.000 And then they quickly found out that no, this was just accidental and that this was some sort of a radar system that just caused their onboard computer to go haywire for just that second enough to cause the crash to happen.

00:14:34.000 Trevor Burrus It almost doesn't make sense to me because like if you're going to go visit an uncontacted tribe in the Amazon, you would assume that they have weapons.

00:14:42.000 You'd assume they have bows and arrows.

00:14:43.000 And if you got hit with an arrow, you'd be like, this is crazy.

00:14:47.000 You know, I can't believe I got shot by an arrow.

00:14:49.000 But you wouldn't be surprised that they have arrows.

00:14:51.000 Like, you would probably write, hey, man, we should be real careful that they might have arrows.

00:14:55.000 They might shoot us.

00:14:56.000 So if you're visiting the human race, and you're so advanced that in 1947, you can come here from wherever, another planet, another dimension, whatever you're doing, wouldn't you know about radar?

00:15:07.000 And wouldn't you have, like, a system to prepare yourself for storms?

00:15:11.000 Yes, and that's something that might...

00:15:13.000 I've taken them by surprise because you're talking about 1950s.

00:15:16.000 Radars were not all that...

00:15:17.000 New, but they weren't all that old either.

00:15:19.000 When was radar invented, do you know?

00:15:21.000 It was World War II, if I remember correctly.

00:15:22.000 Yeah, it was World War II. So it was right around the 1950s, right around the same time.

00:15:26.000 Right.

00:15:26.000 So it may have been unexpected technology for them, and maybe they just didn't have their countermeasures up or something.

00:15:34.000 And there could have been some type of arrogance there, because think about it.

00:15:38.000 Based on our understanding, we believe that they've been coming here for thousands of years.

00:15:41.000 Nothing's ever happened.

00:15:42.000 And then all of a sudden...

00:15:44.000 All of a sudden this new technology and it causes their ship to crash.

00:15:48.000 So you have to think about the time frame of when this radar stuff was actually being...

00:15:51.000 And besides that, they do not always...

00:15:54.000 I intercepted a different call that states that they do have a periodicity between when they come and go.

00:16:00.000 They're not always here.

00:16:01.000 They're out doing other things, I guess.

00:16:04.000 I treat this like a segment on the Arsenio Hall show.

00:16:08.000 Things that make you go, hmm.

00:16:11.000 I'm not sure.

00:16:12.000 It just seems dumb.

00:16:13.000 It just seems dumb that Radar could take them out.

00:16:15.000 But one of the things about the Virginia crash, which is another James Fox documentary, which is excellent, which is all about the crash in Brazil, which is heavily documented, including the guy who handled the body wound up dying of some unknown bacterial illness that they have no idea what it was.

00:16:33.000 He was a young, healthy guy.

00:16:34.000 He carried this, supposedly carried this being, put it in his patrol car, took it to a hospital.

00:16:40.000 They wouldn't accept it.

00:16:41.000 Had to take it to another hospital.

00:16:43.000 And then two weeks later, this guy's dead.

00:16:45.000 And he just got unbelievably sick.

00:16:47.000 There's nothing they could do to help him.

00:16:48.000 They flooded him with antibiotics, all kinds of different things.

00:16:51.000 Nothing worked.

00:16:52.000 He died very quickly.

00:16:53.000 When you hear about that story, the big thing was that there was some sort of crazy electrical storms that night.

00:17:02.000 But again...

00:17:04.000 If you're going to have a Tesla, you would assume the wheels won't fly off when it rains.

00:17:08.000 You're going to come here from another planet. 0.96

00:17:09.000 Like, what's on that planet?

00:17:10.000 Oh, well, they occasionally have lightning.

00:17:12.000 Well, let's not fuck around if they have lightning.

00:17:13.000 Let's not go into the storm.

00:17:15.000 If you're in a plane, you can go above the storm.

00:17:17.000 You know how, like, Apollo says, we're going to take this plane above 45,000 feet to, you know, to let you know.

00:17:22.000 And then you look down, you can see lightning below you in the clouds.

00:17:25.000 It's kind of crazy.

00:17:26.000 How come they can't do that?

00:17:29.000 You got me.

00:17:30.000 I was born in 63. This happened earlier than I even got there.

00:17:33.000 I'm just trying to go off of what I heard on my missions.

00:17:35.000 I understand.

00:17:37.000 I'm just playing devil's advocate.

00:17:40.000 And I agree.

00:17:40.000 I kind of had the same thoughts.

00:17:42.000 But at the same time...

00:17:44.000 You know, we've made similar stupid decisions when it comes to battles.

00:17:48.000 I know, but I would just assume they're way better than us.

00:17:51.000 Right?

00:17:52.000 I would assume they, like you were talking about arrogance, I would assume they don't have that anymore.

00:17:56.000 Like, let's fucking work that out of the system.

00:17:59.000 We should work it out of the system.

00:18:00.000 Well, I think that that's true to an extent, but I think also they're very common.

00:18:04.000 They have things in common with us as well that they do have, you know.

00:18:08.000 The same sorts of desires to want to live their life well and all these other things are part of it.

00:18:14.000 So, yeah.

00:18:15.000 Well, it seems like if you want to go and do something, anything, like you want to explore the universe, you want to accomplish things, you want to make technology, it almost seems like some kind of self-acknowledgement or some kind of ego has to be present.

00:18:28.000 Yes.

00:18:29.000 Otherwise, there's no motivation to do anything.

00:18:31.000 This was the question about artificial intelligence.

00:18:33.000 We were talking about this and I said, but if artificial intelligence doesn't have any human needs, it doesn't have the desire to spread its DNA, it doesn't have the desire to achieve status, why would it do anything?

00:18:45.000 Why wouldn't it just sit there and just observe and just watch us be stupid?

00:18:48.000 And maybe it would say logically it would interfere if we were about to blow each other up or something crazy like that.

00:18:56.000 But other than that, why would it do anything?

00:18:58.000 Why would it have any desire to take over?

00:18:59.000 Well, look at us.

00:19:00.000 And this is where I think there's a commonality between us and the NHI. We're intelligent people.

00:19:07.000 Some of us.

00:19:08.000 Some of us, yes.

00:19:12.000 Go on TikTok.

00:19:14.000 I've seen that stupidity, you're right.

00:19:16.000 Oh, yeah.

00:19:17.000 Okay, think back to what I said.

00:19:19.000 No, obviously we're intelligent and joking.

00:19:22.000 But they probably have a desire for entertainment, which we do have a great, you know.

00:19:25.000 Oh, yeah, we're very entertaining.

00:19:27.000 We love that.

00:19:27.000 Yeah.

00:19:28.000 And they probably have a curiosity as well.

00:19:31.000 They have to, right?

00:19:32.000 If they're exploring, why else would they explore?

00:19:34.000 Yeah.

00:19:35.000 So whatever it is that made us us, you know, from ancient primates to what we are today.

00:19:41.000 A big part of that is all these needs and desires.

00:19:44.000 And you've got to wonder, like, at some point in time, does that get engineered out of the biological system?

00:19:52.000 And if it does, that system seems like it wouldn't need to explore at all.

00:19:57.000 It's facilitating a process.

00:20:00.000 There's a very delicate process where advanced life forms like ourselves are experiencing this new technology, and a lot of the people that are in possession of the technology aren't even the ones who created it.

00:20:15.000 So they have all this insane responsibility, but they've done none of the work, and they have power over this technology, which is where we find ourselves today, which is real weird.

00:20:27.000 All intelligent life goes through as it's evolving all throughout the universe.

00:20:32.000 Maybe they know this.

00:20:33.000 Maybe it's a precarious thing and maybe it has to be monitored because like, oh, you know, star 15. Remember that third planet?

00:20:40.000 Yeah, they fucking whacked the whole planet.

00:20:41.000 They got there too late.

00:20:42.000 And they realize, oh, that took like four billion years to make intelligent life that could figure out cell phones.

00:20:47.000 And these dipshits blew each other up.

00:20:49.000 And now there's nothing but microbes and it's going to take billions of years and it might not even work because they might be too far from the sun by then.

00:20:56.000 Time for another test case.

00:20:58.000 So let's prevent these territorial primates from killing each other. 1.00

00:21:04.000 Maybe that's a thing that they do throughout the universe, like farmers.

00:21:07.000 Make sure the wolves don't eat the calves.

00:21:10.000 Just protect it until it gets to this next stage.

00:21:14.000 I have to say that on mission, I did get that feeling that no matter where the NHI were mentioned, it was not a copacetic, free-for-all exchange of technologies at all.

00:21:23.000 It was very controlled by the NHI. If there was a lab environment, the NHI demanded that no human be in the lab while they're there or watch what they're doing and record what they're doing.

00:21:35.000 And then they would leave and then the humans could come in. 0.98

00:21:38.000 So it's a very precarious little game they're playing.

00:21:41.000 So how long have they supposedly been having these interactions with NHIs?

00:21:46.000 I don't like calling them NHIs.

00:21:48.000 I like calling them aliens.

00:21:49.000 I'm old school.

00:21:51.000 I like just calling them aliens or whatever.

00:21:54.000 Yeah, I think it happened in the Eisenhower days, you know, that that's when it really started to come because that's when they were saying that this...

00:22:01.000 The UFO came to Holman and landed and actually talked to the president at the time and all that stuff.

00:22:07.000 Imagine a UFO talking to Trump.

00:22:12.000 Oh, yeah.

00:22:13.000 He'd probably try to tax them.

00:22:15.000 So my biggest question, anytime someone brings up NHI aliens, my first thing is, which one?

00:22:22.000 Which one?

00:22:23.000 Because they talk about it as if it's one entity.

00:22:26.000 Oh, they did that.

00:22:27.000 Oh, they did this.

00:22:27.000 But when you break it down, we're hearing.

00:22:30.000 Some like us and want us to evolve.

00:22:33.000 Some don't like us and want us to kind of pull back.

00:22:38.000 And they want to control certain things.

00:22:40.000 So I'm like, well, which one?

00:22:41.000 And then they look at me with that deer in the headlight and look like, oh, I don't know.

00:22:46.000 Right.

00:22:47.000 So there's the idea that our superiors, that the military, the top levels of government, even they are not given all the information.

00:22:56.000 Correct.

00:22:57.000 Because probably we're like a bunch of children.

00:23:00.000 We're like, you're too stupid to figure this out.

00:23:02.000 I'm not going to tell you what a nuclear bomb is.

00:23:04.000 Just duck and cover.

00:23:06.000 However, we could be the greatest show in this part of the universe.

00:23:10.000 Oh, sure.

00:23:11.000 We're a great show.

00:23:12.000 I mean, imagine when we talk about the things with the nuclear bombs where the missile silos, they started counting down or whatever.

00:23:21.000 Maybe it's like, hey, let's see how far they'll go if we do.

00:23:25.000 This.

00:23:25.000 Right.

00:23:26.000 And then everybody gets all excited and then I was like, okay, we're just kidding.

00:23:29.000 We'll turn it off and go from there.

00:23:31.000 Well, perhaps.

00:23:32.000 I mean, listen, we run experiments all the time on animals.

00:23:36.000 All the time.

00:23:37.000 And we have collars on bears.

00:23:39.000 We set them loose.

00:23:40.000 Like, let's follow the bear.

00:23:41.000 Where's he going?

00:23:42.000 We do that all the time.

00:23:43.000 We do that with all kinds of species.

00:23:45.000 Yeah, we do.

00:23:45.000 It only makes sense that they would do it with us.

00:23:48.000 Especially since we literally have the ability to annihilate all life on Earth.

00:23:53.000 And we're pointing at each other.

00:23:54.000 Multiple times.

00:23:55.000 Yeah, multiple times.

00:23:56.000 Yeah, mad, mad world.

00:23:57.000 It's a mad, mad world.

00:23:58.000 I had that argument with Neil deGrasse Tyson.

00:24:00.000 He was like, why would they be interested in us?

00:24:01.000 I'm like, what are you talking about?

00:24:03.000 We go to the jungle to study a frog.

00:24:06.000 You know, like, of course they would come here.

00:24:08.000 We're so strange.

00:24:09.000 And we protect the turtles in that one little area that EPA says, oh, no, you can't mess with those turtles.

00:24:15.000 Yeah, imagine Elon gets to Mars and we do find life there.

00:24:18.000 And we'd be so interested to figure out how it works, what makes it tick.

00:24:22.000 You know, they believe they found actual water on Mars, not frozen water now?

00:24:26.000 Yeah, on the poles.

00:24:27.000 Yeah, I heard about that.

00:24:28.000 That's nuts.

00:24:29.000 Yeah.

00:24:29.000 Because if there's actual water in there and they can find something in that water that's alive.

00:24:34.000 Yeah.

00:24:34.000 But if we don't...

00:24:35.000 If we're going to expand out into the universe, which is what Elon Musk says, the fact that we don't have to bring water with us, that's huge.

00:24:43.000 Bro, I ain't drinking Mars water.

00:24:45.000 I don't drink tap water and I definitely ain't drinking Mars water.

00:24:47.000 It could be better than Red Bull.

00:24:49.000 Bro, imagine if it's like filled with crazy minerals and you drink a glass of Mars water and you just feel incredible and then we have to ship Mars water from Mars back to L.A. That's a war right there.

00:25:00.000 That's a war right there.

00:25:01.000 People are going to be like...

00:25:02.000 How come they have it, we don't?

00:25:04.000 Right.

00:25:04.000 There'll be water wars.

00:25:05.000 What if Mars water just makes you go back in time?

00:25:07.000 Like, you look 20 again.

00:25:10.000 Yeah.

00:25:10.000 You know?

00:25:11.000 I mean, who knows what the fuck's in that water?

00:25:13.000 I don't know.

00:25:14.000 But those are the kind of things you write, though, that that's kind of how we are.

00:25:17.000 It's that we're very curious about what's on that planet and how we can utilize the resources that are there, like the water and everything else.

00:25:23.000 And we're going to learn some stuff.

00:25:25.000 And it's going to take a long time.

00:25:27.000 What I'm really curious about is what was Mars like before it lost its atmosphere?

00:25:31.000 Me too.

00:25:32.000 And was there a time a few billion years ago where Mars was like Earth?

00:25:36.000 It seems to be what people are saying.

00:25:38.000 That's the craziest of all theories, right?

00:25:41.000 And the most interesting.

00:25:42.000 But if, you know, Earth still exists five billion years from now and now it's cold and dead and there's nothing, how much would be left?

00:25:51.000 How much is left after a couple of billion years?

00:25:54.000 What is really left over?

00:25:56.000 What does it look like?

00:25:57.000 Does it look like Mars?

00:25:59.000 Because Mars looks completely desolate.

00:26:01.000 But we know that Mars had water.

00:26:03.000 And we know Mars had a warmer climate.

00:26:05.000 So you kind of just assume there was something growing there.

00:26:10.000 What does it look like a couple of billion years later?

00:26:13.000 Probably like Mars.

00:26:14.000 Yeah.

00:26:15.000 Which is great.

00:26:15.000 If we do find out that Mars at one point in time housed biological life or maybe there's microbial life or something like that that still exists on Mars, just the climate is so harsh it can't advance past that stage.

00:26:28.000 That alone would just change our whole view of the universe itself because we would start to consider, okay, maybe this isn't just this one thing that happened.

00:26:37.000 Maybe the Fermi paradox is just that we don't have the ability to detect all these things that are out there.

00:26:42.000 Or maybe they really do pass by and keep their doors closed.

00:26:45.000 And locks.

00:26:47.000 Right.

00:26:47.000 We're fucking shooting fireworks on Fourth of July.

00:26:49.000 We're nuts.

00:26:50.000 We're the craziest species on this planet by far.

00:26:55.000 Everything else is normal.

00:26:56.000 Everything else just kills.

00:26:57.000 What it wants to eat.

00:26:58.000 Everything else, you know, does normal stuff.

00:27:01.000 They fight over resources, but that kind of makes sense biologically.

00:27:04.000 Honestly, after my experience in the program, I found that it seems the more I think about it, the more that they are very much like us in a lot of ways.

00:27:13.000 But they have...

00:27:15.000 Probably a world government that we do not have.

00:27:18.000 In other words, they can get along in their own society much better than we can and their former government is not all broken up.

00:27:23.000 I think if you branch out into the solar system and then into the galaxy, like as you start spreading out, if you do become some sort of an interstellar species, you kind of have to be united as a planet, right?

00:27:35.000 You got to go, look at all this bullshit about this country and that country.

00:27:39.000 Let's let it go.

00:27:40.000 Let's let it go.

00:27:41.000 I mean, I don't want one world government because I don't trust the government.

00:27:44.000 But if I did trust the government, I'd be like, one world government is the way to go.

00:27:47.000 Everybody should have the same resources.

00:27:49.000 Everybody should have the same access to healthy food and water and clean air.

00:27:53.000 It should be the same for everybody.

00:27:55.000 It shouldn't be that you can make an iPhone in...

00:27:58.000 China because they can make it for 15 cents because people are working like slaves. 1.00

00:28:02.000 Exactly.

00:28:02.000 It shouldn't be like that.

00:28:03.000 It should be like the whole world has the same rules.

00:28:05.000 But the problem is you can't trust the government.

00:28:07.000 So what do you do?

00:28:07.000 Well, if you get to a point where everybody's so advanced that we don't have all of the same greed and lust and all the bullshit that ruins human society, if aliens get to that point, then it only makes sense that they would operate.

00:28:22.000 As a planet.

00:28:23.000 But then they would have their interest ahead of these fuckers on that other planet.

00:28:29.000 So along those lines, those things that you talked about, those are the things that inherently make us human.

00:28:35.000 Push that microphone a little closer. 0.93

00:28:36.000 I'm sorry.

00:28:37.000 The hand moves.

00:28:38.000 You can push if you want to sit back.

00:28:39.000 Those are the things that inherently make us human.

00:28:41.000 So the question would be...

00:28:44.000 Depending on which NHL you're thinking about, what inherently makes them them and how compatible are we in what we're looking at?

00:28:51.000 Because those could be some of the things that attract them to us or detract them away from us.

00:28:56.000 What I'm interested in is, are there things just like us?

00:29:02.000 Is this like, if you, you know, like there's similar plants that exist in similar ecosystems all over the world where ideally...

00:29:11.000 The seeds have never been able to get back and forth.

00:29:14.000 But they're similar, at least in some ways.

00:29:16.000 It's just a matter of climate, resources.

00:29:20.000 Over millions and millions of years, these same kind of plants grow.

00:29:23.000 Similar kind of animals.

00:29:24.000 There's rats all over the place.

00:29:26.000 There's a pattern to it.

00:29:27.000 Yeah, there's a pattern.

00:29:28.000 At atomic level, there's a way that things occur naturally, and they form different things.

00:29:34.000 So a bird, I agree.

00:29:35.000 I think you and I talked about it the first time we spoke on the phone.

00:29:38.000 It's that, yeah, there probably is.

00:29:40.000 A bird kind of looks like a bird on another part of the universe, but maybe it has, you know, two sets of wings.

00:29:46.000 Right.

00:29:46.000 Or two heads or something.

00:29:48.000 I don't know.

00:29:48.000 Right.

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00:31:06.000 Something similar, like...

00:31:08.000 I mean, birds vary so wide.

00:31:10.000 I mean, you can get a sparrow, you can get a fucking eagle or a condor.

00:31:12.000 There's so many different kinds of birds, too.

00:31:14.000 But I wonder, is there...

00:31:17.000 Is this the only kind of way life evolves or are there planets that are just radically different than our planet and life forms in a completely different way?

00:31:27.000 Yeah, I would think that that's true also, is that there's exceptions to the rule, just like there are here on Earth.

00:31:31.000 Right.

00:31:31.000 You've got some really strange creatures that roam around, like people are starting to say octopi and stuff.

00:31:37.000 They don't fit the normal way that things evolve around the Earth and stuff like that.

00:31:42.000 And there's no bones there, so, you know, you're not going to find any fossils anywhere.

00:31:47.000 Yeah.

00:31:47.000 But if you think about some of the things that we're being told now, 99% of all life that...

00:31:56.000 Right.

00:31:58.000 So if this is what's left, maybe some of those unique things that were out there, they're something similar.

00:32:04.000 Because one of the things that I ponder is there's got to be some grand design because when we see these aliens, whether they talk about it's a gray, it's a Nordic, it's a draconian, or if it's a mantis, they're all standing upright.

00:32:21.000 So is that a part of the grand design that is as intelligent as you get further up the food chain?

00:32:27.000 You start to stand on your two legs and whatever.

00:32:30.000 And then I think about if it's a mantis, whatever, how do they build their ships if they don't really have opposable thumbs?

00:32:37.000 Those are the things that we're always taught.

00:32:39.000 These are the things that make us unique as humans and we can build things and that's why the other animals didn't...

00:32:45.000 The only other animal out there is what?

00:32:47.000 The chimpanzee or the gorilla or something?

00:32:49.000 Primates?

00:32:51.000 But obviously, nature finds a way.

00:32:54.000 And it's not human nature.

00:32:56.000 It's something other type nature.

00:32:58.000 And they do something else.

00:33:00.000 Well, it could be genetic engineering, too.

00:33:02.000 It could be that they reach some point where they say, well, what's the best structure for a body?

00:33:09.000 A mantis structure is way better than a person's structure.

00:33:11.000 We break so easy.

00:33:13.000 Mantis are insanely strong.

00:33:14.000 You ever see a mantis catch a hummingbird at a feeder?

00:33:17.000 Yes.

00:33:18.000 It's nuts, man.

00:33:19.000 Yeah, taking out tarantulas and scorpions.

00:33:21.000 They're so little.

00:33:22.000 And they just snatch that fucker up, and he can't move.

00:33:25.000 Like, if you looked at them, like, the hummingbird's probably four times heavier, at least.

00:33:30.000 Probably more than that.

00:33:31.000 And he's just like...

00:33:32.000 Gotcha!

00:33:33.000 It's like that design, the exoskeleton design is superior in terms of like durability.

00:33:39.000 And also lobsters and crabs and all these kind of insects like that. 0.78

00:33:44.000 Do demantis regrow limbs? 0.82

00:33:47.000 Let's find that out.

00:33:48.000 All I know is that...

00:33:49.000 Because crabs do.

00:33:51.000 I know crabs can. 0.72

00:33:52.000 Yeah, lobsters and crabs, all I think of them is just armored spiders.

00:33:56.000 Yeah, they're bugs.

00:33:57.000 And if you think about when they said that the oxygen level was at 30%, 35% and some other stuff, they're saying...

00:34:04.000 Some of these spiders were the size of small dogs.

00:34:06.000 I'm like, yeah, that's not a place I'd like to live.

00:34:08.000 So they can.

00:34:09.000 So praying mantis undergo incomplete metamorphosis.

00:34:11.000 Sometimes if their cage is too dry, a mantis may have trouble shedding old skin, will lose a limb in the process of molting.

00:34:17.000 If it happens, it's possible for a mantis to regrow the lost limb, but only when they molt again.

00:34:22.000 So they molt again and then they regrow that limb.

00:34:24.000 But they do regrow their limbs.

00:34:26.000 They regenerate limbs as long as there's at least a coxa remaining, whatever that is. 1.00

00:34:30.000 It won't regenerate right away.

00:34:32.000 Maybe a tiny nub, and then they molt, I guess.

00:34:35.000 Wow.

00:34:35.000 Interesting.

00:34:36.000 That makes sense, because the harder shell would prevent that limb from continuing to grow.

00:34:39.000 But it just seems like that's a superior form of a structure.

00:34:44.000 So if you get to the point where technology is all done with the mind, right?

00:34:49.000 We've developed artificial intelligence and quantum computing and the being has been generated over genetic engineering to the point where it no longer has to have sex to recreate new versions of itself.

00:35:05.000 And so instead, the way they procreate is they do it...

00:35:09.000 Through design.

00:35:10.000 And maybe they say, look, it doesn't matter what you look like anymore.

00:35:13.000 No one's fucking.

00:35:14.000 Let's all become mantises.

00:35:17.000 That's a good point.

00:35:18.000 Right?

00:35:19.000 I need to reset now.

00:35:20.000 This soft shit on the outside.

00:35:22.000 We're like fucking water balloons.

00:35:24.000 We're so vulnerable.

00:35:26.000 Wouldn't it be better if you're hard on the outside?

00:35:29.000 We don't need to use your fingers and thumbs anymore.

00:35:31.000 We do everything with our mind.

00:35:33.000 If it gets to the point...

00:35:34.000 This is the thing that I've heard about people that have...

00:35:38.000 Supposedly worked on crafts.

00:35:40.000 One of the most remarkable things is that there's no gears.

00:35:45.000 There's no levers to turn.

00:35:47.000 There's no buttons.

00:35:48.000 There's no controls.

00:35:49.000 That everything is done somehow or another where the being and the craft are one.

00:35:55.000 Yes.

00:35:56.000 Consciously.

00:35:57.000 I've had discussions about that.

00:35:59.000 Have you talked to anybody that has said that any of the crafts have controls in them?

00:36:04.000 No, all I've heard...

00:36:06.000 Basic, yes.

00:36:07.000 Basic controls?

00:36:08.000 While I was talking to Jack Sarfati about it, there was a craft that did have some place where the hands were in there, but it was only to sort of do some minor adjustments for the craft, is what he was describing, and other people have described, you know...

00:36:26.000 That's what I was going to say.

00:36:28.000 There's just...

00:36:28.000 All I've heard is that there's been...

00:36:30.000 Two places for you to put your hands.

00:36:32.000 And maybe for other parts of the crew, but that's about it.

00:36:35.000 Maybe that's so you don't use your phone.

00:36:37.000 So you don't get distracted.

00:36:38.000 Just use your hands.

00:36:39.000 Put your hands down on the thing.

00:36:40.000 So there's no buttonology.

00:36:42.000 There's no fucking around.

00:36:43.000 Maybe they have something similar to, like, cell phone addiction.

00:36:48.000 So they're putting their hands on the thing.

00:36:51.000 Wasn't that what Lazar said as well?

00:36:52.000 Didn't he say there was something similar to that?

00:36:54.000 Yes, he did.

00:36:55.000 So no controls.

00:36:57.000 And somehow or another, putting your hand on it syncs you up, and then they're just using their mind.

00:37:03.000 Correct.

00:37:04.000 Did they try to explain how this was developed?

00:37:09.000 There's a lot of people that are looking into it now, and they're starting to see that, yes, it's possible.

00:37:15.000 And I think that's, again, some of the new whistleblowers can shed some more light on how this happens.

00:37:21.000 We need to hear a little bit more about these folks that came forward about the psionics team and what exactly is this meditation?

00:37:26.000 What are they linking up with?

00:37:28.000 Does it feel mechanical?

00:37:29.000 Does it feel like an entity?

00:37:31.000 Because when you hear Jake talk about his experiences, he had a really spiritual experience with one of these things.

00:37:38.000 While he was carrying it to the next place, he was literally crying in the interview.

00:37:42.000 This is that egg-looking thing.

00:37:44.000 Yeah, he said that he felt, well, he called it the eight-gone, I think, craft.

00:37:49.000 That one is the one he had the spiritual.

00:37:50.000 Eight-gone?

00:37:51.000 Eight-gone, like a hexagon, but it has eight sides, or octagon, I think would be the actual term.

00:37:57.000 But he said it had like an eight-sided kind of a disc.

00:38:01.000 So this is not the thing we're talking about with the helicopter?

00:38:04.000 Not the egg one.

00:38:04.000 This is a different one.

00:38:05.000 A different one.

00:38:06.000 So he encountered a different one.

00:38:08.000 Oh, okay.

00:38:08.000 I didn't see that interview.

00:38:10.000 Yeah.

00:38:10.000 Well, the detailed one, I think you can pull that one out of there.

00:38:13.000 But he mentioned that that one, he had like a real no kidding.

00:38:17.000 It was beautiful.

00:38:18.000 And he cried about it because it was so beautiful of an experience.

00:38:22.000 Wow.

00:38:22.000 And I have a question about all those things because if they can get into our minds...

00:38:28.000 My thing is that how do you know that that's not what they're putting into your head?

00:38:33.000 Because, like, what they experienced at a Skinwalker Ranch when they saw the creature on the top floor, they said as they approached it, they started feeling fear.

00:38:45.000 And as they approached it further, the fear just kept intensifying to the point where it was like a physical change in the temperature.

00:38:52.000 So if someone can put fear into you, why can't they put love into you and all these different things?

00:38:57.000 And I'm not saying that it's not genuine, but part of being on the task force, you have to question everything.

00:39:05.000 Well, we can do that to each other.

00:39:07.000 Yes.

00:39:07.000 We can do that to each other through threats.

00:39:10.000 We can put fear into people.

00:39:12.000 There's a crazy documentary called Holy Hell, and it's about this guy who was a cult leader.

00:39:18.000 And one of the things that he would do to these people, he was a hypnotist too, but one of the things he would do to these people, he called it the knowing.

00:39:25.000 And he would put his hands on them, and they would say that they would experience God.

00:39:29.000 They had to be prepared for it.

00:39:32.000 It was a thing that was very difficult to get.

00:39:34.000 He had to approve you for it and all these people wanted it and they never got it.

00:39:38.000 It was like a thing he held over your head.

00:39:39.000 And then when he actually did it, even though this guy turned out to be a complete fraud and the cult disbanded, all those people talk about that moment when they had that experience with that guy and they say it really happened.

00:39:51.000 Wow.

00:39:51.000 Because the human mind is weird, right?

00:39:53.000 And if a person can do that to you by touching you, it just makes sense that some like super advanced being would say like, what is the best?

00:40:02.000 Feeling that I could give to this primitive entity that's studying me to let me know, like, don't blow me up, don't fuck with me.

00:40:11.000 100%.

00:40:11.000 And this is the best expression that you can have in life.

00:40:15.000 What is the best expression you have in life?

00:40:16.000 It's love.

00:40:17.000 Pure love.

00:40:18.000 Just pure, just untethered love.

00:40:24.000 It would make sense.

00:40:25.000 It would put that in you so that you would protect this thing.

00:40:29.000 And that may be part of it, and I think that's what their desire is.

00:40:32.000 Just like we, you know, would try to put our best foot forward if we knew that we were similarly being scrutinized.

00:40:38.000 Sure.

00:40:38.000 You know, we'd want to do that.

00:40:40.000 When we visit uncontacted tribes, we give them free food.

00:40:42.000 We just say, we're here for you guys.

00:40:44.000 But see, that's where my fear is.

00:40:45.000 That's why I came forward, is that I was hearing stuff that actually brought concern.

00:40:51.000 And the way I kind of package that up is that the military happens to be, unfortunately, the face of humankind here in this situation when it comes to the program.

00:41:03.000 Because it's definitely not the public.

00:41:05.000 We're just, you know, errantly having people come forward with, I got abducted, or I saw this and I saw that.

00:41:11.000 But in the military, that seems to be where there is an interface going on.

00:41:15.000 Right.

00:41:15.000 And I'm just wondering, is that too heavy-handed because they're not seeing the full human race?

00:41:19.000 Right. - They're only seeing the military humans.

00:41:21.000 Right, and that's why I kind of took the tact I did instead of going through all the other channels.

00:41:25.000 I just was like...

00:41:26.000 Let me try something new.

00:41:28.000 Let me talk to the people and get to know the people, what they feel about this.

00:41:32.000 And I'll just tell my story.

00:41:33.000 Whatever happens, happens.

00:41:34.000 Yeah, I took some spears.

00:41:35.000 But, you know, for the most part, people are ready for this.

00:41:39.000 People definitely want it.

00:41:40.000 Whether they're ready for it, we'll find out if it actually becomes bigger and more profound than what we've currently experienced.

00:41:48.000 I got asked a question, and they said, if you were going to go to Congress and say, Here's what we need to know about the UAP experience.

00:41:57.000 What would you tell everybody?

00:41:58.000 That's a good question.

00:41:59.000 And my answer was, we don't need you anymore.

00:42:03.000 Because so many groups now have caught on that if they attune themselves to whatever it is, they can talk to these things directly themselves.

00:42:12.000 Now, whether it's good or bad, but because of the badness that has transpired over the years, more and more people, like you, you said you don't trust the government.

00:42:23.000 There's people, they don't trust the government at all in this other thing.

00:42:27.000 So they're like, let's reach out by ourselves.

00:42:30.000 You've got people doing, you know, RV and out-of-the-body experience and all that other stuff.

00:42:35.000 You've got people that are being contacted directly.

00:42:38.000 So now they're trying to say things.

00:42:41.000 And also, too, we're evolving.

00:42:45.000 So as we're evolving and other things start happening, you have to start questioning, why do we need the government in the middle of this?

00:42:53.000 Please don't take this the wrong way because people get angry.

00:42:57.000 It's kind of like the Catholic Church.

00:42:59.000 I was always told, if you want to talk to God, you talk to God.

00:43:04.000 But then why do I need a priest?

00:43:06.000 So the government's always been the middleman.

00:43:10.000 Do we really still need him?

00:43:13.000 So when you're saying that all these people have figured out these methods, how to communicate with the aliens, what you're talking about is like people sitting down, this is something I'm hearing a lot lately, sitting down and supposedly summoning them, putting out like an intention and that they will come.

00:43:29.000 Yes.

00:43:29.000 Does that happen with you?

00:43:30.000 You ever try it?

00:43:31.000 I haven't yet.

00:43:32.000 So...

00:43:33.000 Why wouldn't you try it?

00:43:34.000 If you think it's real.

00:43:36.000 I tell everybody I'm black and I'm afraid of the woo. 1.00

00:43:39.000 Okay?

00:43:40.000 But at some point, I know I'm going to have to embrace it because it is part of the experience.

00:43:46.000 So, like, I'm good friends with Travis Taylor.

00:43:49.000 And when we first started talking, he was like, okay, I'd like to talk to you about coming out to the ranch.

00:43:56.000 You and some of your friends, your intel guys.

00:44:00.000 And we just, you know, we talked about it.

00:44:02.000 And then I kind of put it up in the room and said, hey guys, if we had a chance to go out to the ranch, here we go.

00:44:09.000 And all the white people put their hands up right away.

00:44:11.000 And all the black people were like in the corner going, now let's think about this. 1.00

00:44:14.000 What are you actually asking?

00:44:16.000 And I sat there and I go, why is it that we're so, you know, reserved about going?

00:44:23.000 And I remember something that someone told me was, when the woo happens, you embrace it.

00:44:30.000 You don't run towards it because whatever that experience is, it was probably meant for somebody else, and now you're interfering when you run towards it.

00:44:38.000 Right, so if you summon the UFO, like if they come to visit you, that's meant to happen to you.

00:44:43.000 What if you're summoning them?

00:44:45.000 Yes.

00:44:45.000 You may be causing a distraction.

00:44:49.000 Do you really want that in your life?

00:44:52.000 People say that, yeah, if I could experience UFO contact, I would.

00:44:56.000 Well, would you really?

00:44:57.000 Because that might fuck up the whole rest of your life.

00:44:59.000 Like, what if it does happen and then it never happens again?

00:45:02.000 And then you have a wife and kids and a house and you just sit in your fucking living room trying to pay attention to this football game.

00:45:08.000 When you're thinking about, I've seen a fucking alien.

00:45:11.000 I've seen UFOs.

00:45:12.000 They've come down and communicated with me telepathically.

00:45:15.000 I know they're real.

00:45:17.000 Yeah.

00:45:18.000 Well, it would ruin your whole life.

00:45:21.000 Remember that movie with Ben Affleck?

00:45:23.000 I think it was called Chasing Amy.

00:45:27.000 Chasing Amy.

00:45:27.000 I remember the name.

00:45:29.000 I don't remember the movie.

00:45:30.000 Not that Amy.

00:45:31.000 But there was something that was said in there that always made me think.

00:45:35.000 After you have a first experience, and in this particular case there was talking about your first orgasm, you're always chasing after that first...

00:45:43.000 Best feeling that you ever had.

00:45:45.000 You're never going to get there, but you're chasing it.

00:45:48.000 They say that about heroin, too.

00:45:50.000 They call it chasing the dragon.

00:45:52.000 Yes.

00:45:52.000 So if you're one of those people that had a really profound experience with a creature from another world, you can't really explain it to everybody else.

00:46:03.000 So you're looking for something else to make it seem real because you start questioning everything that you know.

00:46:10.000 You know?

00:46:10.000 And that's how I was.

00:46:12.000 My first experience was when I was a kid in England, and me and a friend were just throwing the ball back and forward.

00:46:19.000 And you know, in the old days, people used to wrap the sneakers around the telephone lines.

00:46:23.000 So I just happened to see that there were some sneakers up there.

00:46:27.000 And then all of a sudden, I look off in the distance, and there's this UAP UFO that looks like an iron that you would iron your clothes with.

00:46:35.000 The whole bottom part was glowing.

00:46:37.000 The top part was just...

00:46:39.000 Dullish gray because, you know, England, gray skies, whatever.

00:46:41.000 Was the shape the top like an iron as well?

00:46:43.000 Yes.

00:46:44.000 So it had like a hump to it?

00:46:45.000 It kind of had a hump to it.

00:46:46.000 So I'm sitting there going, well, what is that?

00:46:48.000 And he goes, that's got to be a helicopter because it's just standing there.

00:46:51.000 And I was like, but I don't hear any noise, you know?

00:46:54.000 And then next thing you know, we saw, I believe it was two F-4 jets coming because you could hear them.

00:47:01.000 Those engines are loud.

00:47:02.000 And these two jets come out and this thing just goes...

00:47:05.000 And this is when I was living in Nottingham, England, because I'm British by birth.

00:47:09.000 So, you know, our parents were like, eh, too much imagination, da-da-da-da-da-da-da.

00:47:15.000 And I just kind of kept it in the back of my head.

00:47:17.000 And then I saw things later, and I just kept questioning them.

00:47:19.000 And finally I was like, I'm really going to have to look into this.

00:47:23.000 So how old were you?

00:47:25.000 I was about 10. And you said you were like 10 as well?

00:47:29.000 This is one of the things that I keep hearing about this idea that...

00:47:34.000 Children and their innocence, they don't have this blockade in their head to keep them from...

00:47:43.000 They don't think it's ridiculous to think about aliens.

00:47:47.000 They're open to it more.

00:47:49.000 We talked about this.

00:47:50.000 We're programmed as we mature.

00:47:53.000 We don't want to be fools.

00:47:54.000 So I believe, and this is just my belief, not anybody's, but I believe from the mid-19...

00:48:04.000 All the way up to the mid-1990s, I think there was a deliberate attempt by these entities to reach out to school children and going to the schools.

00:48:15.000 Because remember the rule of Zimbabwe?

00:48:17.000 That one's crazy.

00:48:18.000 That's crazy because all those years later, they all have the same story.

00:48:21.000 They all drew the same thing independently.

00:48:23.000 They pulled them aside.

00:48:24.000 All the way to adulthood.

00:48:24.000 They remember it.

00:48:25.000 Yeah.

00:48:25.000 And then there's the stuff in Australia.

00:48:27.000 There's the stuff in England.

00:48:28.000 There's the stuff in France.

00:48:30.000 The Australian one's real similar too, right?

00:48:32.000 Yeah, I think his name was Preston Dennett.

00:48:35.000 He wrote a book.

00:48:36.000 I hope your viewers read it or take a look at it.

00:48:39.000 It's like the top 100 school sightings.

00:48:43.000 And half of it is based on just the sighting.

00:48:48.000 Another part of it is based on the actual thing landing and trying to communicate with the kids.

00:48:52.000 And I sat there just thinking, were they doing that to prepare us for now for when they do come back so we're not so afraid?

00:48:58.000 The kids are more open-minded.

00:49:00.000 I'm not sure, but...

00:49:02.000 You have to think about those things and go, hmm.

00:49:05.000 Aren't you a Arsenio Hall thing?

00:49:06.000 Things that make you go, hmm.

00:49:08.000 So those were some of the things that we just started thinking about and going, well, what if?

00:49:14.000 And then I hate to play what if games because my favorite what if is what if worms had machine guns, birds wouldn't mess with them.

00:49:22.000 But you have to play that game sometime and just kind of draw it out and then see if it...

00:49:29.000 If you have a hypothesis that can start repeating itself and then you go, hey, there is something to this.

00:49:34.000 Well, the real question is how long have entities been visiting us and are the same entities visiting us over and over again?

00:49:42.000 Or like the Zimbabwe incident, is that like the first time that species has ever been here? 1.00

00:49:48.000 And did they just seek contact and didn't know that they're dealing with little children in a school?

00:49:54.000 They just knew they were dealing with a group of intelligent beings that they could communicate with?

00:49:58.000 They probably don't even have the concept of a school, right?

00:50:00.000 So if they're landing, I mean, they probably understand basic culture for human beings.

00:50:05.000 But as they land and interact with people, this might be the first time this species has interacted with anybody.

00:50:11.000 We don't know.

00:50:12.000 I mean, we're dealing with hundreds of billions of stars just in this galaxy alone.

00:50:18.000 Definitely from just my belief in it is that we have millennia of these sorts of encounters all through manuscripts.

00:50:26.000 Even George Washington's got his story.

00:50:28.000 George Washington had his story?

00:50:30.000 Yeah.

00:50:30.000 He met a green somebody before.

00:50:34.000 He actually went into a battle.

00:50:35.000 Yo, pull that up, Jamie.

00:50:38.000 George Washington had a UFO encounter?

00:50:40.000 Or an entity encounter?

00:50:42.000 An entity.

00:50:43.000 He just said that this was...

00:50:44.000 George Washington also had lead poisoning.

00:50:47.000 Shane Gillis has the best bit about George Washington.

00:50:51.000 I don't know if you've ever seen it.

00:50:51.000 It's fucking hilarious.

00:50:53.000 About going to the George Washington Museum and seeing George Washington's teeth.

00:50:57.000 And George Washington's teeth...

00:50:58.000 They're all wooden.

00:50:59.000 Well, no, they were slave teeth.

00:51:01.000 First of all, they knocked some of the teeth out of slaves' mouths, and the other ones were from horses.

00:51:06.000 Oh, my gosh.

00:51:06.000 And it was set in—it was all in lead.

00:51:09.000 I never knew that.

00:51:10.000 So he had lead in his mouth.

00:51:12.000 I almost thought they were wooden.

00:51:13.000 So his joke is all about, like, George Washington being fucking mad with lead poisoning.

00:51:18.000 Like, fucking killing everybody.

00:51:20.000 That's why he's at the front of the boat.

00:51:21.000 He was out of his fucking mind.

00:51:23.000 It's a great bit.

00:51:24.000 But the point is, like, George Washington was being poisoned by, you know— Medical science at the time.

00:51:29.000 They didn't know that lead was bad for you.

00:51:31.000 Which is crazy.

00:51:32.000 He kept lead in his mouth.

00:51:34.000 Well, they didn't know.

00:51:35.000 I know, but it makes you wonder, what are we doing right now that the future people are going to go, these fucking idiots were doing that?

00:51:42.000 But George Washington, have you found his account, Jamie?

00:51:49.000 I mean, it's from Ancient Aliens about the Founding Fathers.

00:51:51.000 Good enough.

00:51:52.000 Solid reference.

00:51:53.000 Ancient Aliens.

00:51:54.000 If it's on Ancient Aliens, it's legit.

00:51:58.000 Yeah.

00:51:59.000 Get Giorgio Tsoukalos to say it was wild hair.

00:52:02.000 So all those things that happened to those kids, we don't know if it was...

00:52:07.000 I mean, we're hearing stories now that they can mess with your mind.

00:52:11.000 We don't know if they're...

00:52:13.000 Pushing these kids forward mentally.

00:52:15.000 We don't know if they're, you know, dumbing them down because they know that these kids are going to be the ones that are going to make a difference.

00:52:21.000 Because it all depends on which...

00:52:22.000 Well, they're all adults now, right?

00:52:24.000 Yes.

00:52:24.000 Are any of them, like, real exceptional?

00:52:25.000 Are any of them, like, PhDs or something like that?

00:52:28.000 I have not gone to check any of that.

00:52:32.000 But one of the things that coincides with that, that I kind of...

00:52:35.000 I think there was...

00:52:39.000 Exceptional people usually have to do some exceptional things to get noticed.

00:52:43.000 And I think even if you're exceptional, you may not have fit the right block to get noticed.

00:52:50.000 So that someone would sit there and go, hey, what's going on in your past?

00:52:53.000 And then there's a lot of these people they just don't want to talk about.

00:52:57.000 Right.

00:52:58.000 Because of whatever the stigma.

00:52:59.000 But now that the stigma is being lifted, you know, who knows?

00:53:03.000 The stigma is being lifted, but people still live with the haunting memory of the stigma being a part of their life.

00:53:10.000 So I think people that have had an experience a long time ago, even though the stigma is lifted, they're still reluctant to talk about it.

00:53:16.000 It's like there's still people that are in the closet.

00:53:20.000 Like homosexuality is like... 1.00

00:53:22.000 Way less taboo than it's ever been in modern history, right?

00:53:26.000 But yet there's still people that have been in the closet for 20 years and then trapped.

00:53:31.000 And they're just like, fuck!

00:53:32.000 And they can't be themselves.

00:53:34.000 They can't get out.

00:53:34.000 I think for a lot of people that have had these crazy experiences, they probably had some moments where they told people, friends, and they got mocked, and people called them liars.

00:53:44.000 They felt like an idiot.

00:53:45.000 I'm just not telling anybody this anymore.

00:53:47.000 Yep.

00:53:48.000 Which totally makes sense.

00:53:49.000 Yep.

00:53:50.000 It's the same thing that's happening on X and other platforms as well.

00:53:53.000 It's just people coming forward trying to speak their truth.

00:53:56.000 And they get shut down by people that have never been there.

00:53:59.000 They're just opinionating.

00:54:00.000 Yeah, but that's just toxic internet. 1.00

00:54:05.000 100%.

00:54:05.000 I agree with you.

00:54:06.000 It's just human beings online, they're just not good at it.

00:54:10.000 We're not good.

00:54:11.000 It's too new.

00:54:12.000 We suck at it.

00:54:13.000 We're real shitty to each other.

00:54:14.000 And too many people, it's like they're mentally ill.

00:54:17.000 And what I mean by mentally ill is like if you're on Twitter 12 hours a day and you're constantly tweeting before you go to bed, you're mentally ill. 0.56

00:54:25.000 You might not think you're mentally ill.

00:54:26.000 Just like when you're an alcoholic, you're mentally ill.

00:54:28.000 If you're a gambling addict, you're mentally ill.

00:54:30.000 You're not well.

00:54:31.000 Right.

00:54:32.000 You're fucking trying to bet your house on a football game.

00:54:34.000 You're out of your fucking mind.

00:54:35.000 You're addicted.

00:54:36.000 Yeah, you're mentally ill.

00:54:37.000 You're mentally ill if you're on Twitter all day just arguing with people.

00:54:40.000 It's just the nature of the technology and the very crude way that people interact with each other, which leads you to think that as technology evolves and it gets to the point where we're communicating.

00:54:52.000 Through telepathy, telepathically, like supposedly they can.

00:54:56.000 It sort of eliminates the need to even know our language.

00:54:59.000 They can just come and give us thoughts and express things in a pure way without the need to decipher it through syntax.

00:55:08.000 But there's still the worry of misinterpretation because my family was pretty religious.

00:55:14.000 And when I was growing up, they were like, God is omnipotent.

00:55:17.000 God knows everything.

00:55:18.000 God doesn't make mistakes and everything.

00:55:19.000 And then I was like...

00:55:21.000 That's not exactly true, but if you think that God is omnipotent and he's communicating with everybody, how is it that all the leaders that serve a church have different views on how we're supposed to talk to God?

00:55:33.000 If God is...

00:55:34.000 Right.

00:55:34.000 Why isn't he just saying...

00:55:35.000 And it's a personal experience, really.

00:55:36.000 Yeah.

00:55:37.000 And it's the same thing with, I think, the NHI, is that, like you're saying, you'd like to put a pattern to it, but maybe there's not.

00:55:45.000 There's some, you know...

00:55:46.000 Very random things that have happened in other encounters, but there's some of them that do seem to have a concerted effort, a prolonged effort for maybe even millennia, because we do see old stone, ancient monuments and monoliths that do have these depictions of what look exactly like greys.

00:56:04.000 Yeah.

00:56:05.000 The craziest one, is it in Australia?

00:56:07.000 The one that's on the wall where there's all these dudes with the big eyes?

00:56:10.000 I forget where.

00:56:11.000 There's a couple of places where that is.

00:56:13.000 There's a couple of those cave paintings that are like that.

00:56:16.000 Where are those from?

00:56:16.000 Do you remember?

00:56:17.000 I think there's some down in South America.

00:56:21.000 I saved one.

00:56:22.000 I'll send it to you, Jamie, because I saw it the other day online and it freaked me out so much I saved it on my phone.

00:56:27.000 I was like, this is so crazy just to look at.

00:56:30.000 Yeah, and there was one on the side of a hillside or a cliff face.

00:56:34.000 May I ask why it freaked you out?

00:56:37.000 I think that was Arizona.

00:56:38.000 Well, because...

00:56:39.000 I just sent it to Jamie.

00:56:41.000 We take a look at it right here.

00:56:42.000 Jamie, you can run that through a Google search.

00:56:44.000 You can find out where it is.

00:56:45.000 Or I'll do that while you put it up on the screen.

00:56:48.000 It freaks me out because these people were starving.

00:56:51.000 These people were like barely getting by, right?

00:56:54.000 They have stone tools.

00:56:56.000 And they took the time to draw these things with these like weird...

00:57:01.000 Helmets on and these big black eyes, which is very similar to so many different encounters that people have.

00:57:09.000 They all describe a very similar thing, a big head with giant black eyes.

00:57:16.000 So those are the typical grays, but I heard in South America there were people that they showed that picture to, and they called them the ant people because they said they came from underground.

00:57:26.000 Yo! 1.00

00:57:28.000 Well, that's the other question.

00:57:30.000 Like, we're just sort of assuming that these things are definitely from another planet.

00:57:36.000 That they're not here and they haven't been here all along.

00:57:39.000 Isn't that the Anasazi and the Navajo? 1.00

00:57:42.000 Yeah.

00:57:42.000 So yeah, these are aboriginal drawings or aboriginal paintings.

00:57:46.000 Yes.

00:57:47.000 Yes.

00:57:47.000 So this is from Australia, which is just wild.

00:57:50.000 And you get them all over the world.

00:57:51.000 All over the world.

00:57:52.000 And real similar all over the world.

00:57:54.000 You got them in Ireland, Europe, you got them in the United States.

00:57:57.000 United States, Central America, everywhere.

00:57:59.000 And the vast majority of those children that saw UAP? That came down near their school.

00:58:03.000 If there was an entity that was there, it was usually the typical gray-looking ones that were there.

00:58:09.000 Well, the ones that they saw in Varginha, Brazil, are kind of similar, but they seem like a darker color.

00:58:14.000 It was almost like a purple, right?

00:58:16.000 Yeah, it was reddish-purple or something like that.

00:58:18.000 But they did have the black eyes and the large heads.

00:58:21.000 They had horns, though. 0.67

00:58:22.000 They had horns. 0.95

00:58:23.000 There was a very specific thing that they said.

00:58:25.000 The pictures that we're seeing for Varginha...

00:58:27.000 This one had red eyes. 0.99

00:58:29.000 And the reason why I'm bringing that up is because a friend of mine contacted me, a mutual friend that we talked about.

00:58:38.000 He was talking about something known as the Dover Demon, and it's over by Dover, Delaware.

00:58:44.000 And there was supposed to be an incident where a UAP came down and there was a creature, and it looked a lot like the Varginia creature with the red eyes and whatever.

00:58:54.000 So he was asking...

00:58:56.000 That's what the Varginia thing? 1.00

00:58:57.000 Oh, that's the Dover Demon?

00:58:59.000 That's the Dover.

00:58:59.000 Yeah, that looks like a shoebill bird, that crazy bird.

00:59:02.000 Yeah, but he said it had bright red eyes.

00:59:06.000 Oh, fun.

00:59:06.000 Imagine that.

00:59:07.000 Imagine running into that.

00:59:08.000 That thing in the night.

00:59:09.000 Right, so the question was...

00:59:10.000 Never sleep again.

00:59:11.000 Never sleep again.

00:59:12.000 All I know is, like Travis...

00:59:15.000 That does look a lot like the Virginia one, though.

00:59:17.000 Yeah, it does.

00:59:17.000 Go back to that last drawing you drew, Jamie.

00:59:20.000 You pulled that further?

00:59:22.000 Now, if you can, will you pull up the image of the Virginia drawing?

00:59:26.000 Because they had an artist who talked to the little girls that saw that.

00:59:30.000 And those women, and, you know, the really... 1.00

00:59:32.000 Look at it.

00:59:33.000 Come on, man.

00:59:34.000 That looks...

00:59:35.000 Exactly the same.

00:59:36.000 And there's those bumps on the head, though.

00:59:38.000 That's exactly the same fucking thing, man.

00:59:41.000 Like, literally, exactly.

00:59:42.000 So I told Travis, if you ever get me to come to Skinwalker Ranch, I said, know that I've got a plan.

00:59:52.000 And he was like, what are you talking about?

00:59:53.000 And I said, I will not be the slowest runner.

00:59:57.000 However, I will not be the fastest runner because I don't know what's really going on there.

01:00:03.000 I don't want to run from one thing into another, so I'm going to make sure I have an escape plan.

01:00:08.000 I went to Skinwalker Ranch.

01:00:09.000 Oh, you did?

01:00:10.000 Yeah.

01:00:11.000 How did that go?

01:00:11.000 Well, I was doing it for a television show, and we interviewed a bunch of people that lived there, and one guy.

01:00:18.000 There was a lot of people that they wanted to be interviewed, and then when we got there, they chickened out.

01:00:23.000 It seemed like there might be some drug use going on in the surrounding areas.

01:00:27.000 A few people seemed like a little on tilt, but I think that's a good part of America.

01:00:32.000 I think there's a lot of people.

01:00:34.000 You could find some packets of people in America that are just doing drugs.

01:00:38.000 So I wouldn't say that that was what it was, but this one guy that I talked to didn't seem like that at all.

01:00:42.000 He seemed very respectable.

01:00:44.000 I don't remember what he did, but he was a very smart guy, blue-collar guy, and lived in this very modest house, and he had this story of this thing that flew into his yard and through his house, and he said it was a small orb, and he said it seemed to be communicating with him.

01:01:05.000 Wow.

01:01:05.000 This guy didn't have any other bullshit stories.

01:01:08.000 He didn't have any claims of just this one experience that he said was beautiful.

01:01:13.000 He said it was incredible that this thing seemed like it was alive.

01:01:16.000 It seemed like it was communicating with him.

01:01:18.000 And it went right through the walls.

01:01:20.000 And it went through the wall again and disappeared.

01:01:22.000 I've had a similar case.

01:01:24.000 Every March I go to Seaside, Oregon because they have a paranormal conference.

01:01:28.000 And I'm not into the paranormal stuff, but my friends are.

01:01:31.000 So I want to listen and I want to learn.

01:01:33.000 Because this is me trying to get over my fear of going in there.

01:01:37.000 You have a fear of paranormal or a fear of being around the people that believe in paranormal?

01:01:41.000 No, the paranormal because of certain things that I've heard from when I was a kid.

01:01:45.000 And you have to overcome some of those childhood fears and stuff like that.

01:01:48.000 Okay.

01:01:49.000 So when I was there, I was giving us...

01:01:52.000 Talking about my app and all this other stuff.

01:01:55.000 And these two Asian ladies were watching me walk on the stage. 1.00

01:01:57.000 And I was like, why are they looking at me like that?

01:02:00.000 And I was like, is my fly down or something?

01:02:01.000 What did I do?

01:02:03.000 And as soon as I stepped off the stage, I said, Mr. Logan, what are they?

01:02:06.000 What are they?

01:02:07.000 And I was like, what do you mean?

01:02:10.000 She pulls out on her phone the most beautiful, pristine picture of an orb sitting in a doorway.

01:02:18.000 And I'm like, what happened there?

01:02:20.000 And she said it was my birthday.

01:02:23.000 And she said, all my family was there.

01:02:24.000 And she said, but I got tired, so I was laying down.

01:02:27.000 And she said, I heard like this electrical discharge going on.

01:02:31.000 And she said, it came right through her wall, started floating across her room.

01:02:36.000 She said, it got to her doorway.

01:02:37.000 She screamed. 0.67

01:02:39.000 And all her family came.

01:02:40.000 And the son, I guess it was, took the picture of the orb.

01:02:44.000 And I was so amazed by her story, I even forgot to ask her to give me a copy of the picture.

01:02:48.000 How long ago was this?

01:02:49.000 This was like...

01:02:50.000 Two years ago.

01:02:52.000 So, fairly modern phone.

01:02:54.000 Yeah.

01:02:54.000 It was an iPhone.

01:02:57.000 They were from Northern California and they drove up to this thing.

01:03:01.000 And I'm just like, so what happened?

01:03:05.000 She said it actually sat there and did this like a heartbeat, getting bigger and smaller.

01:03:12.000 And then she said it just kind of went back out the way it came in.

01:03:16.000 And she goes...

01:03:18.000 What are they?

01:03:19.000 You were on the task force.

01:03:21.000 Don't you know about these things?

01:03:22.000 And I was like, whoa, you know, we're not omnipotent.

01:03:25.000 We're trying to learn just like you are.

01:03:28.000 And every year I've been back there twice now.

01:03:32.000 And every year I go, hey, if those two Asian ladies are in here, can we talk? 1.00

01:03:37.000 And they haven't shown back up.

01:03:39.000 But he sounded just like your story of what happened to this other individual.

01:03:43.000 Yeah, he was the only guy that was compelling.

01:03:44.000 There was a bunch of other people that had goofy stories of bulletproof wolves that appeared out of the mist and like, okay.

01:03:50.000 It just seemed like some people just wanted to be on TV, which is normal, right?

01:03:55.000 Right.

01:03:55.000 Show up with cameras.

01:03:56.000 People tell stories.

01:03:57.000 And this is another show that I worked on once.

01:03:58.000 It was called Game Show in My Head.

01:04:00.000 And this is pretty funny.

01:04:01.000 We told people.

01:04:03.000 So the game show was we would take a contestant.

01:04:07.000 The contestant knew that they were going to pull pranks on people.

01:04:09.000 But they didn't know what the prank was going to be.

01:04:11.000 And so we had a piece in their ear.

01:04:13.000 And we would put them out in the public.

01:04:16.000 And my thing was that I had to tell them that they are a news reporter.

01:04:23.000 And that someone had just seen a UFO and had an encounter with an alien right there in Hollywood, but the person who was the witness took off.

01:04:36.000 Would you be willing to go on camera and say it was you?

01:04:40.000 And everybody said yes.

01:04:41.000 They all did.

01:04:42.000 And people had crazy stories.

01:04:45.000 They talked about being abducted and being on the ship and experience, and they were communicating with me.

01:04:50.000 They just fully made up stories.

01:04:53.000 And that was an eye-opener for me.

01:04:56.000 I was like, wow, you put a camera on people.

01:04:58.000 They just are so hyped to be on TV that just bullshit you.

01:05:01.000 Yeah, they can.

01:05:02.000 Because the guy who was in on it was shocked, too.

01:05:06.000 Because he was like, I couldn't believe that these people just started fucking lying.

01:05:09.000 Yeah.

01:05:09.000 When you get aggrandized like that, that's where you kind of have people that do that.

01:05:13.000 It's just to aggrandize or enlarge themselves.

01:05:15.000 Sure.

01:05:16.000 Everybody wants to – especially when you put a camera on people.

01:05:18.000 But then you get in with other people like the whistleblowers I know.

01:05:21.000 They've pretty much given up everything like me.

01:05:23.000 Well, this guy was not interested in much attention.

01:05:27.000 He just wanted to tell us his story and he was a regular dude.

01:05:30.000 Like we talked about all kinds of stuff.

01:05:32.000 He had a big trout on his wall.

01:05:34.000 He had a trout – like when they make trophies out of fish, they don't really make – Game show in my head.

01:05:54.000 Yeah, that's it.

01:05:56.000 Wow.

01:05:56.000 A long time ago.

01:05:57.000 But the point is, this guy was a sincere dude.

01:06:01.000 He was telling me how he caught the fish.

01:06:02.000 You know, when I'm asking people questions about stuff, I want to know how you think.

01:06:07.000 When I'm talking to some guy that tells me he had an encounter with an orb...

01:06:10.000 I want to hear what you talk about.

01:06:12.000 How do you talk about you at work?

01:06:14.000 How do you talk about you with your kids?

01:06:16.000 How do you treat your dog?

01:06:18.000 You know what I'm saying?

01:06:19.000 I'm trying to get a gauge of this guy.

01:06:21.000 He seems super sincere.

01:06:23.000 Just a regular good guy, very accommodating, very friendly.

01:06:26.000 You would have made a good analyst.

01:06:28.000 Maybe.

01:06:29.000 Because the thing that we're trying to do as the all-source analyst is to look at all aspects of what happened.

01:06:35.000 And sometimes people just go in there, well, I mean, the thing that...

01:06:39.000 What really upsets me when I was part of the task force was someone just handing me a picture and just going, so what is it?

01:06:46.000 No context, no nothing.

01:06:48.000 You're just like, okay.

01:06:50.000 It can be fake.

01:06:52.000 I don't know what the fuck that is.

01:06:53.000 Let me put it through the image analyzer.

01:06:55.000 I don't know if you've had any mental issues.

01:06:58.000 I mean, someone showed me something that it was a button on a glass.

01:07:04.000 And at first I was like, That looks really intriguing.

01:07:07.000 But there was something about it that was just, it wasn't quite right.

01:07:11.000 And I'm like, I think this is fake, but I don't know why.

01:07:15.000 And then finally the guy said, you know, button on a glass, you know.

01:07:18.000 That's the thing that, do you know that feeling?

01:07:21.000 Have you ever seen photos of miniature cars?

01:07:24.000 Yes.

01:07:25.000 There's that autistic kid that does those really good pictures.

01:07:28.000 I was just looking at that yesterday, yeah.

01:07:28.000 Yeah.

01:07:29.000 But what I was getting at, there's something wrong with the car that even in a photo you know it's not a real car.

01:07:35.000 Yes.

01:07:36.000 You know it's a miniature car.

01:07:37.000 Your brain is very good at that.

01:07:39.000 That's a real weird one because it doesn't make sense.

01:07:44.000 There's a perception.

01:07:46.000 You look at it like, oh, that's a miniature car.

01:07:48.000 That's a fake.

01:07:49.000 That's like a Hot Wheel.

01:07:50.000 Because they're really good now.

01:07:52.000 Pull up a photo of a miniature Mustang.

01:07:58.000 There's an autistic kid out there.

01:08:01.000 That's all he does.

01:08:02.000 That's all he does.

01:08:03.000 He gets miniature cars and puts them in a real background.

01:08:07.000 Oh, I've seen that.

01:08:07.000 Yeah, I've seen that.

01:08:08.000 So these are miniatures?

01:08:10.000 Okay, well, that's really good.

01:08:13.000 That's really good.

01:08:14.000 That's a lot better than normal.

01:08:15.000 Yeah, but you can see the tires are not resting, you know, flat like there's weight to the car.

01:08:20.000 Oh, that's a good point.

01:08:21.000 That's a good point.

01:08:23.000 See, those are the things as an analyst you look at in the image.

01:08:26.000 It's just you're looking at, you know.

01:08:28.000 Things like that.

01:08:29.000 Actually, yeah, that's the kid.

01:08:30.000 Thirteen-year-old kid.

01:08:31.000 There you go.

01:08:31.000 Oh, okay.

01:08:32.000 So he's really good at it.

01:08:33.000 He's really good.

01:08:34.000 Because these look, other than what you said, Jay, that you don't see the weight of the tires.

01:08:39.000 But, like, okay, that one right there, that Nissan.

01:08:41.000 Click on that one, the blue one.

01:08:43.000 Yeah, that's a Nissan GTR. I'm looking at that, and I'm like, that's a fake car.

01:08:47.000 I don't know why.

01:08:49.000 Yeah, that looks like a model.

01:08:50.000 But why does it look like a model?

01:08:51.000 It's got to be that driver's window.

01:08:53.000 It's the decals to me.

01:08:54.000 But everything looks pretty fucking good.

01:08:57.000 Yes.

01:08:57.000 Well, yeah, it looks good, but there's just little details that your mind is picking up on going, eh, it's not quite right.

01:09:02.000 Right.

01:09:03.000 I mean, there's something about it, right?

01:09:05.000 Like, what is that something about it?

01:09:08.000 This kind of falls into the area, too, of when you do see a UAP, something about it is what's telling you that it's a UAP, but you're also looking in your mind's memory bank to say, This is fake.

01:09:22.000 This can't be real because it's not doing X. It's not doing whatever.

01:09:27.000 And then sometimes you end up going, it's just not real.

01:09:31.000 I'm throwing it out of my head.

01:09:32.000 And then all of a sudden someone either tells you something that makes you go back and go, oh my God, that thing did that.

01:09:38.000 So maybe it was real.

01:09:39.000 Or you see something about it, something weird about it that just triggers you and you're like, oh, OMG. And now...

01:09:48.000 Your whole view on the whole universe is changing because you're like, I did see that.

01:09:54.000 That's one of the litmus tests I give people because I have a lot of people that ask me, can you vet this guy?

01:09:59.000 He says he's had an encounter and then I kind of go through the experience because the one that I had in the desert, there was a telepathic kind of a thing that happened during that conversation I had with that gentleman in the desert and there's parts of that that people...

01:10:14.000 I've only really experienced it.

01:10:16.000 They actually know about, like the residual data or information that's left behind in your own mind because you're sharing a mind space and things like this.

01:10:25.000 And there are certain things that when I ask questions of people that, you know, sometimes I can tell right then and there, you weren't there.

01:10:32.000 You know, that's not a real experience.

01:10:34.000 But the people that do describe it, and I know that they're telling the truth, there's certain characteristics about that communication type that you only get when you've been talking, no kidding, telepathically.

01:10:45.000 Right.

01:10:46.000 Well, especially you as a person who's had an experience.

01:10:49.000 Correct.

01:10:49.000 You have something to gauge.

01:10:51.000 There's certain things, like, in your field, like if you ran into a dude at the airport that was a faker, you know, there's a lot of guys who have put on, like, fake military outfits and pretend, and then they get questioned by real military.

01:11:03.000 Stolen valor.

01:11:03.000 Yeah.

01:11:04.000 It's weird.

01:11:05.000 It is.

01:11:06.000 But people are weird.

01:11:07.000 People will make up crazy stories.

01:11:09.000 So when you're dealing with the craziest of crazy stories, which is UFOs have been in contact with me.

01:11:14.000 I'm special.

01:11:15.000 They chose me to talk to me.

01:11:17.000 I don't feel special at all.

01:11:18.000 I was accidental.

01:11:19.000 Well, that's probably because it was a real story.

01:11:22.000 So when he first showed up, I was one of the first people to get his...

01:11:26.000 He knows my whole history, man.

01:11:28.000 When he first showed up, first thing I read through everything, I was like, hmm.

01:11:35.000 I'm going to have to run a background check on this guy.

01:11:38.000 Right, he might be kook. 0.97

01:11:39.000 Right, and then I was like, so I did the basics, and then I called up David Grush, and I was like, boy, do I have a doozy for you.

01:11:49.000 I can't do anything with this guy because there's not enough here for me to do a thorough background check, but boy, you've got to listen to what this guy has to say.

01:11:59.000 And from there, David took it on, and I was like, he came back to me and goes, Well, this guy looks to be the real deal.

01:12:06.000 And I was like, holy crap.

01:12:08.000 So we kind of teased that then.

01:12:10.000 So let's get to your experience.

01:12:12.000 Why don't you tell everybody what happened?

01:12:16.000 Just doing my job at Nellis.

01:12:18.000 We had two things we did.

01:12:20.000 We did the telephone monitoring.

01:12:21.000 Where's Nellis?

01:12:22.000 It's in Nevada.

01:12:23.000 So I'm working at Nellis there for a space for the Debt 3. And that's where the program they have.

01:12:31.000 I shopped at four guys, that was one of them, that would go out and monitor for the program.

01:12:38.000 So anyway, the other side of my job was also doing monitoring for everybody else that wasn't in the program.

01:12:45.000 And when you say monitoring, what do you mean by that?

01:12:46.000 You're actually plugging into, just like you heard, tapping, telephones, all the telecommunications type.

01:12:55.000 We made sure that we listened to radios, we listened to radio waves, all that.

01:12:58.000 And we gather it all in.

01:13:01.000 Task to do is, you know, say a commander at Wright-Patterson, you know, we went to do, it's always a two-week mission mostly, unless it's part of an operation like Desert Storm, and you stay for a month or two, and then you change out teams.

01:13:14.000 But two weeks is the standard.

01:13:16.000 So we go two weeks to Wright-Patterson.

01:13:18.000 We gather all the information we can on all the telecommunications means, and we also have an OSI team that's trying to sneak in the doors and get into the facilities they shouldn't be at just to test the security.

01:13:29.000 And that's all we're there for.

01:13:30.000 And at the end of the day, on the last Friday, we go in and we talk to the staff.

01:13:35.000 And then about 90 days later, we put in a final report and give that again back to the staff.

01:13:41.000 And that's kind of how we rolled.

01:13:46.000 We're going up range.

01:13:47.000 For those kind of things, we don't do the telephone monitoring.

01:13:50.000 When we go up range to the test range at Nellis, that was what we called red forcing.

01:13:57.000 And what our job was there is we were also trained to do combat ops against our own pilots so that we could help them survive in a wartime environment.

01:14:07.000 And that was done at the top of Black Mountain.

01:14:10.000 It was a little schoolhouse there.

01:14:12.000 And then if you walk up another...

01:14:14.000 A few yards, there's really those big golf ball-looking radars or satellite dishes were up at the very top.

01:14:21.000 But anyway, that's where we were heading this one day.

01:14:24.000 So we all packed up.

01:14:25.000 We're in Beatty, Nevada, which is the borough in.

01:14:29.000 I can tell you that's where we always hold up at.

01:14:31.000 And we take off from there every morning to go do the a.m.

01:14:34.000 and the p.m.

01:14:35.000 push.

01:14:35.000 That's what you call it when the war is on.

01:14:38.000 You call it the push.

01:14:39.000 So we had one in the morning called a.m.

01:14:41.000 push, one in the afternoon p.m.

01:14:43.000 push.

01:14:44.000 So we were all heading up for the AM push in a convoy.

01:14:47.000 There's three vehicles, probably about three to four people per vehicle.

01:14:51.000 I'm in the lead vehicle with the ranking guy.

01:14:53.000 He's driving, and I'm right behind him.

01:14:56.000 And then there's another gentleman in the passenger seat across from the driver, and then there's a young lady next to me.

01:15:01.000 And we're all going up.

01:15:03.000 And the ranking guy had been there the week before, and he had seen the craft fly by.

01:15:11.000 And that one's out there on the internet.

01:15:14.000 You can pull down the video.

01:15:15.000 There's a report that goes along with it.

01:15:17.000 There's a video that we can watch right now?

01:15:19.000 Right now, yeah.

01:15:19.000 What would he search?

01:15:21.000 Search for...

01:15:22.000 Let me think.

01:15:24.000 Nellis Test Range UFO 1994. Who filmed this?

01:15:32.000 This was filmed by the operators on the range because we're putting these pilots in a...

01:15:39.000 Risky situation by playing war with them, but we're training them.

01:15:43.000 So if there is any kind of a mishap or a pilot or plane goes down, everything needs to be recorded.

01:15:50.000 This is it right here?

01:15:52.000 Yes.

01:15:53.000 So this is being taken, this video is being taken by one of these cameras that's up on the range.

01:15:58.000 And along the bottom you see that this is also trying to lock on to the craft so it can...

01:16:04.000 You know, follow it as it goes in and out because this is the kind of way that you want to track if there's a craft that is having problems.

01:16:11.000 This is moving very radically.

01:16:13.000 Right.

01:16:14.000 So this is what the ranking guy saw.

01:16:17.000 Can I pause you for a second?

01:16:18.000 This tracking, is this manual or is this like some sort of automated system?

01:16:21.000 It's an automated system.

01:16:22.000 So the automated system is having a hard time locking on.

01:16:25.000 Locking on to it.

01:16:26.000 Yeah, if it locks on, you'll see a big spike.

01:16:28.000 And that means that it finally locks on.

01:16:30.000 Right now it's trying to, but something is stopping it from locking on.

01:16:35.000 And they think it was the craft.

01:16:37.000 It's moving like crazy, side to side, all over it.

01:16:40.000 There's actually a recording that goes with it where you hear the guys going, hey, does anybody know what this is?

01:16:46.000 What's going on here?

01:16:46.000 Can we hear that?

01:16:47.000 Okay, the sound is terrible. the sound is terrible.

01:17:13.000 They need better mics.

01:17:15.000 Honestly, it has to be a podcast mic.

01:17:18.000 Oh, I'm sure.

01:17:18.000 But he's saying, what is that?

01:17:20.000 I don't know.

01:17:20.000 We're having a hard time locking on to it.

01:17:22.000 Right.

01:17:23.000 This is the video operator.

01:17:24.000 So the following week after this happens, this video is taken, the ranking guy who had been there the week before and saw this thing flying.

01:17:34.000 He takes us in this, when you go on the range through this one gate here, it goes up a little ways, and then there's a cantonment area.

01:17:41.000 It's got a very small place where you can change your tires, get gas, you know, minor maintenance to get your butt home if you have a car that's busted.

01:17:51.000 And then in the back of that cantonment area, there's two huts that look like campers, really, glorified campers.

01:17:57.000 So the video operators are in the one that's off to the north.

01:18:02.000 East of the cantonment, in the very corner of it.

01:18:06.000 And the ranking guy just says, we all have to go in here.

01:18:09.000 We're going to go talk to the video operators.

01:18:11.000 We have to do this.

01:18:12.000 And this was because the week prior, everybody came back to garrison, or back to our unit, and they had seen this thing, and they were all talking about this UFO. So we go in there, and there's the video operator.

01:18:25.000 He has us all write our names down, whether we were there and saw it the first.

01:18:30.000 Weak or not.

01:18:31.000 Then he makes us all sit down and watch that video.

01:18:34.000 And he says, do you know what this is?

01:18:36.000 And we're like, no.

01:18:38.000 And then he just said, okay, thank you.

01:18:39.000 And then after everybody that was there saw it and wrote their name down, we were allowed to leave.

01:18:47.000 And that was all that was required.

01:18:51.000 So I was like, well, what was that all about?

01:18:52.000 But then as I'm exiting, this lady that had been sitting against the wall on the far part of this little hut that we were in, And she, like, grabs my arm and she just says, there's somebody on the range.

01:19:05.000 Don't talk to them.

01:19:06.000 And she was really, really freaked out.

01:19:08.000 And I'm like, thanks, strange freaky lady.

01:19:10.000 I got it.

01:19:11.000 And I'm like, whatever.

01:19:13.000 So we all hop out, we get in the vehicles, and then start taking off towards Quartz Mountain because right at that cantonment area, there's a hard right.

01:19:20.000 There's a hard right that goes off to Quartz Mountain.

01:19:23.000 And about a mile, half a mile to a mile down that road, it's all dirt road, by the way.

01:19:31.000 There's this guy.

01:19:32.000 It looks like he's wearing a uniform like we are.

01:19:34.000 He got battle dress uniform on.

01:19:36.000 So he sees us and he starts to look like he's running and he's got this really weird run like his arms are kind of flailing behind him.

01:19:45.000 It's like he was running against the hurricane wind and it was like he was going to fall over at any time.

01:19:49.000 And I was like, yeah, it's a bit windy today, but it ain't that bad.

01:19:52.000 So it looked really strange and then I began to notice his skin tone looked like he might be hypothermic.

01:19:57.000 And I'm thinking, oh crap, this dude's been out here.

01:19:59.000 It's freaking freezing out here.

01:20:01.000 Because it was a very cold day.

01:20:02.000 And the wind was blowing.

01:20:03.000 It was, you know, those cold days where it didn't matter how many layers you had on.

01:20:07.000 And so as we're getting closer, I'm talking to the ranking guy.

01:20:11.000 Hey, we need to slow down.

01:20:13.000 So anyway, I'm thinking, this guy's...

01:20:17.000 Probably in big trouble.

01:20:18.000 I need to pull off my jacket.

01:20:19.000 I need to give him something to get warm real quick.

01:20:21.000 So I'm starting to do that, and we're approaching, and by the time I get my jacket most of the way off, he's right there at the corner of the front of the car.

01:20:32.000 So he looks pale?

01:20:33.000 Is that what you're saying?

01:20:34.000 He looks like an albino with a very bluish kind of undertone.

01:20:38.000 So you're immediately associating that with he's freezing.

01:20:43.000 Yeah, because that's all I could equate it to.

01:20:46.000 And then as I'm starting to open my door to try to administer aid to this guy, the dude in the front passenger seat screams he's got no ears.

01:20:58.000 And I thought that was pretty rude.

01:21:01.000 Because I was like, the guy's in trouble.

01:21:02.000 Does he have a hat on?

01:21:04.000 He's got a hat on.

01:21:05.000 And he's got BDUs that look absolutely clean, pristine.

01:21:08.000 And when you're uprange, you do not wear your cleanest uniform.

01:21:11.000 You're in a dirty environment.

01:21:13.000 You wear your scuffed up boots.

01:21:15.000 You don't take them with you.

01:21:16.000 So he's got a clean battle dress uniform.

01:21:18.000 United States military uniform.

01:21:20.000 Very out of place.

01:21:20.000 Yeah, it looks very out of place when I finally do it.

01:21:22.000 But anyway, I step out onto the roadway.

01:21:24.000 And this guy screams that he's got no ears.

01:21:27.000 And I just think it's really rude.

01:21:29.000 And then I close the door and I look up and he's got no freaking ears.

01:21:32.000 And his eyes are twice as big.

01:21:34.000 And I just am like, yeah!

01:21:35.000 What the hell did I just walk into?

01:21:38.000 This guy's not from around here.

01:21:39.000 How far away from him are you?

01:21:41.000 Probably from me to Logan.

01:21:43.000 Just a few feet?

01:21:44.000 Yeah, just talking distance.

01:21:46.000 Okay.

01:21:46.000 And I'm starting to freak out, but then he starts to talk to me, and it's not my language, but the understanding is coming into my mind about every word he's saying.

01:21:57.000 So he's actually saying words.

01:21:59.000 He's saying words, but it doesn't sound like anything I've heard before.

01:22:03.000 But you're understanding what he's saying.

01:22:04.000 But I'm understanding.

01:22:05.000 So I know there's a telepathic thing going on here, and it calms me down at the same time because I'm having to respond to him.

01:22:12.000 And he's like, hello, I'm having trouble with my craft.

01:22:15.000 I need some repair material.

01:22:17.000 Do you know where I could find some trintium?

01:22:20.000 And this is what he's talking to me about.

01:22:22.000 And I'm like, you mean titanium?

01:22:24.000 Because I didn't know anything about trintium at the time.

01:22:27.000 But titanium, he's like, no, it's not it.

01:22:31.000 And I'm like, well, at this point in my career, I had just left the program.

01:22:37.000 So I knew where Dreamland was.

01:22:38.000 And I pointed to the mountain range because you can see for days in the desert.

01:22:43.000 But I pointed towards the mountain range and I said, Dreamland's just over there.

01:22:47.000 And this wave of emotion hit me like disgust.

01:22:52.000 Like, I am not going to talk to those barbarians and murderers. 0.99

01:22:56.000 Wow.

01:22:56.000 So he was saying that to you?

01:22:59.000 Yeah.

01:22:59.000 Like, his reaction to going to the military base was...

01:23:02.000 Exactly.

01:23:03.000 But he did not like it.

01:23:05.000 He said, I am not going to talk to those people.

01:23:08.000 And I was like, well, shoot.

01:23:09.000 And it was barbarians and murderers? 1.00

01:23:11.000 He literally...

01:23:12.000 That was what he called them, yes.

01:23:15.000 Mentally, that's what it was.

01:23:16.000 But the emotion...

01:23:17.000 Is this trintium?

01:23:17.000 Is this a real thing?

01:23:19.000 Well, that's what...

01:23:20.000 I've had a lot of friends.

01:23:22.000 There's analysts also that were on the Top Secret network that were trying to help me understand what material...

01:23:28.000 We were throwing everything at him.

01:23:30.000 We're like, is it this?

01:23:31.000 Is it this?

01:23:31.000 And he's like, no.

01:23:32.000 That's the one.

01:23:33.000 When they hit trintium, I was like, that's what it was.

01:23:36.000 That's what he said.

01:23:37.000 And what is trintium?

01:23:38.000 It's a type of...

01:23:40.000 Can he bring it up on the...

01:23:42.000 Yeah, sure.

01:23:42.000 Yeah, because it should pop up on Wikipedia pretty quick.

01:23:45.000 But it has some properties that probably would work.

01:23:49.000 Are you saying tritium?

01:23:50.000 Yeah, tritium is, that's the stuff that's in Loom.

01:23:53.000 Like in your watch, when your watch glows, that's, you know, they make those where they, they're basically radioactive isotopes that stay lit.

01:24:03.000 So like if you get like a Marathon watch, Marathon makes military watches and it doesn't need, like this watch, you need the light.

01:24:12.000 And the light charges the loom.

01:24:14.000 And then when it's dark out, you can read the hands for like a few hours.

01:24:17.000 It's the thing that they used to put on the end of the guns, right?

01:24:19.000 Exactly.

01:24:19.000 They still do.

01:24:21.000 A lot like Sig has on their guns.

01:24:22.000 Look up Trintium also.

01:24:23.000 I did that.

01:24:25.000 That's not giving me much.

01:24:27.000 So Trintium.

01:24:29.000 Chunky glow in the dark glitter.

01:24:31.000 What is that?

01:24:31.000 These are all like...

01:24:32.000 These are game websites.

01:24:34.000 Oh, I see.

01:24:34.000 I don't know.

01:24:35.000 Okay, so it was tritium, then I may be mispronouncing it.

01:24:38.000 But tritium, that's that radioactive isotope.

01:24:41.000 That's the stuff that emits light.

01:24:43.000 Yep.

01:24:44.000 So it emits a weak form of radiation.

01:24:46.000 Yes.

01:24:47.000 A rare radioactive isotope of hydrogen with a half-life of 12.3 years.

01:24:51.000 Mm-hmm.

01:24:52.000 Okay.

01:24:53.000 So this is what he's asking me for.

01:24:55.000 So he's asking you for that stuff?

01:24:56.000 Tritium?

01:24:57.000 Yep.

01:24:57.000 And I'm like, I don't know where to get...

01:24:59.000 Oh, look at that.

01:25:00.000 It's used in boosted fission weapons and thermonuclear weapons.

01:25:03.000 Oh, great.

01:25:05.000 That sounds pretty sure.

01:25:07.000 I wonder what the fuck it's doing on your wrist.

01:25:10.000 This is what the best image that we have of what he could have looked like.

01:25:15.000 Oh, boy.

01:25:17.000 Can you send that to Jamie?

01:25:19.000 Yeah, I don't know Jamie's number, but we'll find a way to...

01:25:22.000 Is that an iPhone or an Android?

01:25:23.000 Yeah.

01:25:24.000 Is that an iPhone?

01:25:25.000 If I had my phone, I would, but it's out there, I think.

01:25:28.000 Yeah, airdrop it to Jamie.

01:25:29.000 Do you know how to do that?

01:25:31.000 How dare you not know how to do that?

01:25:32.000 And there's a three-dimensional...

01:25:33.000 Your guy works with UFOs.

01:25:34.000 You better know how to do that.

01:25:35.000 Well, there's a three-dimensional image of the craft as well that is really spot on from what I saw that day.

01:25:41.000 Yeah?

01:25:42.000 Because not only did I see this guy running towards us and talking to him, but off the shoulder on the north side of the roadway, that's where the craft was just resting on the desert floor.

01:25:53.000 And I got a really good look at it at that point.

01:25:56.000 And this guy did a 3D rendering of the description.

01:26:02.000 And it's like, it's spot on as I've ever seen.

01:26:04.000 It's almost perfect.

01:26:06.000 So he asks you for tritium.

01:26:08.000 You tell him, this is what it looked like.

01:26:11.000 This is what the guy looked like.

01:26:13.000 Pretty close to it.

01:26:14.000 Yo.

01:26:14.000 The nose was a little bit rounder on the end, but that was a really good rendition.

01:26:19.000 Fuck.

01:26:20.000 But yeah, his eyes almost came out to here on the temple.

01:26:24.000 Wow.

01:26:25.000 And that would freak me out.

01:26:28.000 It freaked me out.

01:26:29.000 I mean, honestly, I'm not an easy guy to get freaked out, but that really put that, like, you just saw an alligator pop up out of the water kind of thing.

01:26:38.000 Right.

01:26:39.000 So when you tell him, go to Dreamland, it says, I'm not going to go where those murderers and barbarians are. 0.99

01:26:44.000 And then what happens?

01:26:47.000 And he said, no.

01:26:49.000 So I was like, well, where else can I possibly point him to?

01:26:52.000 Because I'm like, I don't know any metallurgists or whatever.

01:26:55.000 So I'm thinking to myself, and I related to him, I said, well, I'm taking college classes down in the city of Vegas, Las Vegas, at the community college, but I have a geophysical professor that I'm taking a class from.

01:27:13.000 Maybe he has a metallurgist friend, and he's like, oh.

01:27:15.000 So you're thinking at this time, though, it's a metal.

01:27:17.000 I am, yes.

01:27:18.000 Right, because you're thinking it's some kind of like titanium, some type of...

01:27:22.000 Right, right.

01:27:22.000 And there's also when he...

01:27:24.000 This is the 3D image of what the craft looks like?

01:27:26.000 That is almost as spot on as I've ever seen.

01:27:28.000 That is about it right there.

01:27:30.000 That's almost exactly what I saw resting on the desert floor.

01:27:33.000 And so you're trying to find different people that you can connect this being to?

01:27:39.000 Yeah.

01:27:39.000 And what is it saying to you while you're...

01:27:41.000 He thought that that was a good idea, I think, or he was like, hmm, I mean, he had that...

01:27:46.000 That kind of, hmm.

01:27:48.000 And he wanted to take action, so he just, he doesn't really even say goodbye.

01:27:51.000 He just kind of turns and off he goes back to his craft.

01:27:54.000 And I'm thinking, well, okay.

01:27:57.000 And I get back in the car, and sometime during that conversation with this entity, I remember looking over at my friends in the car, and they had the weirdest look on their face, like they were all zonked out.

01:28:09.000 Totally zombied.

01:28:11.000 Like they couldn't even...

01:28:13.000 They were just drooling on themselves. 0.62

01:28:14.000 Were they just because they were flabbergasted?

01:28:17.000 Or was it because something was going on?

01:28:20.000 Well, I figured out that maybe it was done by this entity because none of them seem to even remember the incident.

01:28:28.000 Only a few people seem to remember that we stopped, that we had talked to somebody on the roadway, but it was mainly the people that were in the back of the convoy.

01:28:35.000 So they didn't see it up close like you did?

01:28:38.000 Right, like we did.

01:28:38.000 So how far away would they be?

01:28:40.000 They'd probably be a good two car lengths behind us.

01:28:43.000 That's still enough to detect whether or not someone looks blue, though, right?

01:28:47.000 Correct.

01:28:47.000 And that's probably what they saw.

01:28:48.000 But you know me.

01:28:49.000 I'm kind of wide and I'm big.

01:28:51.000 I was very muscular back then.

01:28:53.000 And you're standing in front of this thing?

01:28:55.000 So they'd have a difficult time because this guy stood about a good half foot shorter than me.

01:28:59.000 And so they probably could see his arms from time to time, maybe a glimpse of his face or something.

01:29:04.000 So they probably didn't get a very good view because if you're looking at me, I'm standing right next to my door.

01:29:10.000 And they're behind me kind of almost obfuscated by just the angle that they're looking at him.

01:29:16.000 So all the windows are tinted in those vehicles.

01:29:20.000 And they can't just see through the windows right to whatever's on the left-hand side.

01:29:24.000 And the people that were in the car with you, you feel like something happened to them that, like, froze them?

01:29:30.000 They did look like that, yeah.

01:29:31.000 Like you said, just a look of just utter, like, ugh.

01:29:34.000 The guy who said he has no ears, does that guy have a recollection?

01:29:38.000 That guy, they can't find.

01:29:40.000 They can't find him?

01:29:41.000 No.

01:29:42.000 I was asked by the UEP task force, David Grush, to reach out to these folks, the people in the car.

01:29:48.000 I got a hold of one, got a hold of him on LinkedIn, and we started talking.

01:29:52.000 And, you know, just, hey, how's the wife?

01:29:55.000 How's the kids?

01:29:55.000 That kind of stuff.

01:29:56.000 How about that UFO we met?

01:29:57.000 And as soon as I did that, the guy just disappears and ghosts me.

01:30:01.000 And I can't, I don't know what happened.

01:30:04.000 But he was the ranking guy in the car.

01:30:06.000 The guy that was the passenger, nobody can seem to find him because they did try to verify the people in the car and I gave the names.

01:30:13.000 And the young lady that was off to my right, I don't know if they contacted her, but I've heard from other people that were part of this background investigation about my story.

01:30:23.000 They found two people that verified my story.

01:30:27.000 And I don't know who they are.

01:30:29.000 They've been told to keep their mouths shut by somebody.

01:30:32.000 And I'm kind of pissed about that.

01:30:35.000 But I think James Fox knows who they are and knows exactly who told them to shut up as well.

01:30:44.000 What was that incident where James Fox and you were on a show?

01:30:48.000 What's that?

01:30:49.000 I shouldn't have said that James Fox knows the guy who told him to shut up because I'm not sure if that's true.

01:30:54.000 You think you might know.

01:30:55.000 So this thing...

01:30:58.000 Does it tell you why it needs a tritium?

01:31:00.000 It just says it needs it to fix its craft?

01:31:03.000 Yeah.

01:31:03.000 Well, along with that, this is the other part that was telepathic, when he mentions this metal and the part that is needed.

01:31:10.000 But it's not metal, right?

01:31:11.000 Do we think it's not metal, or do you think maybe it's a metal that we don't have?

01:31:15.000 I think it's something or an alloy that we don't particularly make a lot of and or just can't make.

01:31:21.000 But when he...

01:31:24.000 The telepathic image was almost like he opened a Sears catalog in my head that had all the specs for this part that he was needing fixed.

01:31:31.000 And it was the strangest thing.

01:31:33.000 It described some of the nano-channeling of electrical and electromagnetic stuff that was flowing through it that caused these toroidal...

01:31:43.000 Energies to emanate on both sides of this piece of the equipment.

01:31:47.000 So you, because it was describing it to you, you all of a sudden had access to all this information, like you downloaded it into your head.

01:31:55.000 It was like me, if you and I were telepathic and we were talking about a science project.

01:31:59.000 And he just uploaded all the information.

01:32:01.000 Yeah, and I could just give you all that instead of talking it out.

01:32:04.000 That's what he did.

01:32:04.000 Did you then try to talk to someone and relay that information and like download it?

01:32:11.000 I've had, well...

01:32:14.000 Because in the forum, we have scientists and stuff like that that, yes, were very interested to get me in a room and talk to me about this.

01:32:23.000 I had people from DARPA wanting to talk to me, people from threats, departments all over the place that wanted to know more.

01:32:33.000 And even when I talked to Jack Serafati and Gary Nolan about this stuff, I was telling them things before they even opened their mouth about, like when I talked to Gary and Nolan, I just said, you got that part and you know that it has that nano-sized atomic level layering that can't be reproduced unless you actually physically are putting these atoms one at a time next to each other.

01:32:57.000 And he's like, yeah, yeah, that's it, you know.

01:33:00.000 So I'm telling him this and he already knew.

01:33:03.000 But that was the first thing.

01:33:05.000 And so that's why I knew that.

01:33:07.000 What I'd been given in my head, he was giving me that high sign that, yes, that's exactly what I analyzed, is that piece of material I had.

01:33:15.000 It sounds just like what this guy described to you and gave to you telepathically, that there's these really minute little things that create toroidal forces.

01:33:24.000 They're doing things at a very small level.

01:33:28.000 And then I talked to Jack Serafati later, and he's got all these fantastical physics equations about how things work.

01:33:36.000 And I'm looking through his documents, and no, I can't do the math, but I can understand what he's doing with it.

01:33:42.000 And I just flat out asked him, I said, so the smaller you get, because there's always that resistance level when it comes to, you know, putting in energy and then losing it due to, you know, atrophy and all these other, or is that the right word for it?

01:33:57.000 Anyway, the whole thing was just that when you get smaller, it actually reverses itself.

01:34:03.000 Is that now you get even more power out of things if you have a small enough energy source that works at a very...

01:34:10.000 It's kind of like miniaturizing a fusion device of some kind.

01:34:15.000 And so did you talk to someone from DARPA? You said these people wanted to talk to you?

01:34:20.000 I emailed back and forth.

01:34:21.000 I gave them what information I could.

01:34:22.000 They didn't want to interview you?

01:34:24.000 They wanted to just email?

01:34:26.000 At the time, that's the way it went, yeah.

01:34:28.000 I've had a couple of meetings, though, with...

01:34:30.000 At different places that I can't discuss, but they did talk to me, yes.

01:34:37.000 And is that information still in your head?

01:34:39.000 Yeah.

01:34:40.000 So does it seem like a memory, or what does it seem like in your head?

01:34:45.000 To me, it's like a very clear, like, this is, it's just like a picture that never goes away.

01:34:54.000 Could you draw that picture if someone gave you a pad and a pen?

01:34:57.000 Yeah, I've already done it, yeah.

01:34:58.000 Is that available online?

01:34:59.000 Can someone see that?

01:35:00.000 I don't know if I pulled that down off the Top Secret network, but I can reproduce it.

01:35:06.000 All I did was just recreate it in a PowerPoint draw.

01:35:12.000 But does it remain in your head like normal memory?

01:35:15.000 Like, you know, like you learn certain things in school and they stay in your head.

01:35:18.000 The telepathy felt absolutely normal.

01:35:20.000 I mean, there was no headache, there was no dizziness, no buzzing.

01:35:23.000 What I mean is, is the memory the same as a regular memory, or is it clear?

01:35:27.000 No, I remember it as just being part of the conversation, just like a normal conversation.

01:35:32.000 That's what it feels like.

01:35:33.000 But it just somehow or another, in that conversation, he put this information in your head.

01:35:39.000 And then it just leaves?

01:35:41.000 And then he leaves when he realizes that, you know, maybe there's some other venues, maybe me mentioning that there might be a metallurgist on staff somewhere that maybe that prompted him to think, oh, yeah, maybe I should go research this or that, and then maybe I'll find somebody that I could talk to.

01:35:57.000 Something like that may have happened.

01:35:59.000 Did you get a sense of where this thing was from?

01:36:03.000 Yeah, there was a star map from that day, but it also relates to the lunch hour after we started going back up to Black Mountain.

01:36:10.000 I had a very strong compunction to go eat my lunch outside, even though it was deathly cold.

01:36:16.000 And I don't know what prompted me to do that again.

01:36:19.000 Maybe he was giving me a telepathic message.

01:36:21.000 But after I walked about 150 feet down the road, the dirt road, from the top of Black Mountain, I don't remember what happened after that.

01:36:28.000 All I have are two images that keep on flashing back.

01:36:31.000 I remember seeing the schoolhouse from about 150 feet above or 200 feet above the schoolhouse.

01:36:36.000 I remember looking at the rooftop.

01:36:38.000 And the only other memory is I've got this star map in my head.

01:36:42.000 And David Grush made me reproduce that on a PowerPoint slide.

01:36:47.000 And I handed that in to him because I have no idea what it was.

01:36:53.000 But he's like, do you understand what this is?

01:36:55.000 And I was like, no, I have no idea.

01:36:57.000 He's like, do you know what star constellations are?

01:36:59.000 I said, I know what the Big Dipper is.

01:37:01.000 That's about it.

01:37:02.000 And he's like, this is the constellation Leo.

01:37:05.000 And I'm like...

01:37:06.000 Oh, I didn't know that.

01:37:08.000 And so he's like, yeah, this is a really close rendition of that.

01:37:12.000 And I'm like, well, that's kind of cool that I could reproduce it just out of my head and not even know what the heck it was.

01:37:19.000 But I did know it was a star system.

01:37:21.000 And for some reason you just felt compelled to draw this particular star system.

01:37:25.000 Well, just after...

01:37:26.000 David Grush asked me to, yes.

01:37:28.000 And was there a specific planet in that star system?

01:37:32.000 Yeah, the red star that's kind of like, you know, there's a part of the Leo system that has like this very sharp turn into it.

01:37:41.000 I guess it looks like a nose or part of a triangle.

01:37:46.000 And at the tip of that is the red star and its reticuli, I think.

01:37:51.000 But anyway, that one seems...

01:37:52.000 Wasn't that what they always say about aliens?

01:37:54.000 Zeta reticuli?

01:37:55.000 Yeah.

01:37:56.000 And then the strangest thing about this, this is what I'm talking about when it comes to telepathy, when you're sharing that mind space, there's some residue memory there.

01:38:04.000 Because Dave kept pressing me on it, and he said, can you tell me about the red star?

01:38:10.000 And at first I'm like, well, no.

01:38:11.000 And all of a sudden some memory came back, and I was like, holy crap.

01:38:17.000 Yeah, that's where he's from.

01:38:19.000 That's his home star system.

01:38:23.000 And he came from there.

01:38:25.000 That's his home.

01:38:27.000 And then we just went on from there and he said, did you know that they've actually just now discovered a few years ago that there are exoplanets around that star?

01:38:35.000 And I was like, no, I had no idea.

01:38:36.000 So all these things started coming together at that point.

01:38:41.000 And that's when they started saying, okay, well, we're going to do some more vetting.

01:38:46.000 And within about a month or so, they were bringing me to Congress and everything else happened after that.

01:38:51.000 Now, what is the rest of your life like after that day?

01:38:57.000 So you have life before you experience this creature and then now you know that this is a thing.

01:39:04.000 It's a thing, yeah.

01:39:05.000 And it changed me.

01:39:09.000 How do you explain this?

01:39:11.000 If you can imagine the entire human race, you and me, you don't have to talk to me, but you can feel my presence.

01:39:18.000 You can feel who I am, my personality, and share in all of that.

01:39:26.000 Then imagine that by millions, the entire planet, you can actually commune with them.

01:39:32.000 It brings with that a level of civility in the control of your thoughts because right now we don't read each other's minds.

01:39:40.000 So our minds are like, oh, look at that girl.

01:39:43.000 Oh, look at that, you know, the sports over here.

01:39:46.000 There's a football game on.

01:39:47.000 We're so distracted.

01:39:48.000 But this guy's, when I was engaged with him telepathically, it was like civility.

01:39:55.000 To the maximum.

01:39:56.000 It was like very courteous.

01:39:59.000 He waited for me to say.

01:40:02.000 He'd talk.

01:40:03.000 And it was just like we do.

01:40:05.000 We have certain etiquette.

01:40:06.000 But on top of that, there was this part of him that he left me with that was part of the community of the consciousness that he is able to feel all the time.

01:40:15.000 And that has never left me, is that there's a community of consciousness out there that when they've been living for so many years, With this sort of ability, it has changed them for the better because their minds are under control finally.

01:40:32.000 Their emotions aren't running them like you were talking about addictions and things like this.

01:40:35.000 They don't run their lives like that anymore because of it.

01:40:38.000 And if you do, they end up on a criminal list somewhere, I would imagine.

01:40:43.000 But ever since then, that feeling of peacefulness and civility is what I've strived for.

01:40:50.000 Never has left me.

01:40:51.000 Never has left me.

01:40:53.000 Whoa.

01:40:57.000 It stays with you, but what is your experience trying to relay these thoughts in this experience?

01:41:05.000 That had to be weird in the sense that it's very hard to believe.

01:41:10.000 I mean, I believe you, but it's one of those things where, you know, what?

01:41:15.000 You talk to an alien?

01:41:16.000 Most people are going to think you're ridiculous.

01:41:19.000 Well, yeah, and honestly, that's why I need people to back me up on it, because...

01:41:23.000 This is the thing that we're trying to do with the whistleblowers.

01:41:26.000 We all kind of know each other, just like Lowe would tell you, or not Lowe, but just like Logan would tell you, just that I call them Lowe for short sometimes.

01:41:36.000 It's a slip-up.

01:41:37.000 Understandable.

01:41:38.000 Anyway, so anyway, we get to talking about stuff, but we don't know what's going on daily with each other.

01:41:43.000 It's like I've brought whistleblowers forward to Congress since I went forward, but I don't know their lives.

01:41:50.000 I don't talk to them every day like I do some of them.

01:41:52.000 And it's a strange thing.

01:41:54.000 But the more we seem to be coming out now that we've got these few weeks now where we've got folks like, you know, Jake Barber and folks like that coming forward.

01:42:01.000 Now I'm starting to piece things together in my mind because now I'm hearing his side of the story because I didn't want to be part of the retrieval.

01:42:07.000 Well, guess what?

01:42:07.000 He was on it.

01:42:08.000 And he's telling that part and I'm like, oh, no wonder they did that to me.

01:42:11.000 Oh, that makes sense.

01:42:13.000 You know, now I'm making those conclusions now because of what he said.

01:42:18.000 But then if you try to put us all in a room...

01:42:21.000 We're all deathly scared that, you know, some jerk is going to come out of the Department of Defense and shoot us all or do a drone strike on us and kill us all and just have done with it and then get on with our lives again.

01:42:33.000 So you've got this problem here with us coming forward in a group.

01:42:39.000 You're really worried that much that someone would try to take you out?

01:42:42.000 They've already messed with my clearance.

01:42:43.000 They've already shown me that they can break into my car on the NSA campus.

01:42:48.000 They're letting me know.

01:42:49.000 They were trying to intimidate me.

01:42:51.000 Because they don't want you talking about this?

01:42:53.000 Exactly.

01:42:53.000 But do you know why they don't want you talking about this?

01:42:56.000 Yeah.

01:42:57.000 Why?

01:42:58.000 It's because they know that what they have done, that there are some parts of it that were really bad decisions in the long run.

01:43:04.000 And they don't want anybody to crack open any part of this because they know it's going to cause questions to happen.

01:43:10.000 And they're going to get put on the spot.

01:43:13.000 Okay.

01:43:14.000 So you finally are coming clean on the fact that we've got NHI here, but we've got other whistleblowers that have these concerns.

01:43:20.000 That's what they're going to have to face.

01:43:22.000 And when you say bad decisions, like, what do you mean by bad decisions?

01:43:25.000 Well, think about it.

01:43:26.000 If Roswell did happen, what did they do?

01:43:28.000 They'd chop up some, you know...

01:43:30.000 Think about it.

01:43:32.000 You'd have etiquette if it was a Russian craft that fell.

01:43:35.000 You'd catalog every part of that craft site, and you'd repatriate the dead bodies to...

01:43:43.000 Where they came from.

01:43:44.000 We give them back to the Russians in honor. 1.00

01:43:47.000 And here we are.

01:43:48.000 We've got a civilization just crashed there in Roswell.

01:43:51.000 And look at what kind of crap we did to them.

01:43:54.000 And we took all their stuff like it was some kind of a treasure trove.

01:43:57.000 And now we own it?

01:43:59.000 Hell no.

01:44:00.000 You're talking about a craft that was manufactured on another part of the galaxy or something that they can't explain.

01:44:06.000 Nobody knows where it came from.

01:44:08.000 And here they are treating these people like they're just some kind of a lab experiment.

01:44:13.000 Let's chop him up a little more, you know?

01:44:14.000 And then, you know, if they ever got approached by the people that came to look for them afterwards, I wouldn't want to be the person that answered them.

01:44:22.000 Well, I'm sorry we chopped up your buddy.

01:44:24.000 We had an interesting talk about this.

01:44:26.000 There's a video online where it shows like some gray kind of strung up and they're asking him questions and whatever.

01:44:34.000 And I was asking him, I said...

01:44:37.000 If you were in NHI and you saw that, and this is what the humans are broadcasting, sorry, and this is what the humans are broadcasting, I said, I'd be like, yo.

01:44:52.000 They got Jimmy.

01:44:53.000 Look what they're doing to Jimmy.

01:44:55.000 Right.

01:44:55.000 It's on.

01:44:56.000 We're going to Earth.

01:44:57.000 We're going to go get Jimmy back.

01:44:58.000 But that video of the alien, that's fake, right?

01:45:00.000 The video where they're interrogating some gray? 0.99

01:45:02.000 I truly believe it is fake because like we've- It looks so fake.

01:45:06.000 Everybody says- It looks like a puppet.

01:45:07.000 Yeah.

01:45:08.000 They talk telepathically and here he is.

01:45:10.000 Oh, here's this voice coming out and whatever.

01:45:12.000 Yeah.

01:45:13.000 Yeah.

01:45:14.000 But we've always assumed that they've got the same type of- Some type of emotions a lot like us, but maybe they're much more controlled, much more refined.

01:45:26.000 Kind of like how we can...

01:45:29.000 Kind of like us now versus us 50,000 years ago.

01:45:32.000 Yeah.

01:45:33.000 Well, honestly, when I had the telepathic experience, it was very difficult for me to distinguish what emotions and feelings were coming from me as opposed to him.

01:45:42.000 It was very obvious when he felt disgust about going to ask about things because I was like...

01:45:47.000 Well, I'm not disgusted at him.

01:45:48.000 And I had that ability to go, that's not me feeling that.

01:45:52.000 It must be coming from him.

01:45:53.000 Right.

01:45:53.000 But it was your emotions.

01:45:55.000 Right.

01:45:55.000 But everything else felt like we were sharing literally not only the thoughts but the emotions that went along with it.

01:46:00.000 It was a true sharing of a mind space.

01:46:03.000 And he felt just like me.

01:46:05.000 His inner voice is just like my inner voice.

01:46:07.000 His feelings are just like our feelings.

01:46:09.000 He feels sadness.

01:46:10.000 He feels all the things that I do.

01:46:13.000 What is the general consensus in the people in the program about Roswell?

01:46:18.000 They don't like talking about it.

01:46:20.000 I think that was where they probably are trying to bury it even amongst themselves because they know they made some very bad mistakes about that first confrontation that could have been a lot better than what happened.

01:46:32.000 So the general consensus is that this is a real event.

01:46:35.000 Yep.

01:46:37.000 And they don't like talking about it, but does everybody sort of agree?

01:46:42.000 Or are there people that are dissenting?

01:46:44.000 Do they have dissenting opinions about whether or not it was a crash UFO? I've never heard of dissension.

01:46:48.000 I've heard people say, I don't want to talk about it.

01:46:50.000 They don't want to talk about it, but that it wasn't ours.

01:46:54.000 Right.

01:46:54.000 Well, the only thing is, again, when we talk about the intel analysts and everybody else that was on that forum, it's...

01:47:02.000 Totally weird that you can go through all these different things as an intel analyst and say, okay, it's not China.

01:47:08.000 All right, it's not them.

01:47:09.000 All right.

01:47:09.000 Let's look at Russia, anything.

01:47:11.000 Nope, it's not Russian. 0.90

01:47:12.000 Is it one of ours?

01:47:13.000 Well, hell no, it's not one of ours.

01:47:15.000 Well, who the heck is it then?

01:47:17.000 Does anybody talk about it?

01:47:19.000 Is there anybody that has shared information about Roswell to you?

01:47:25.000 Yeah.

01:47:26.000 Is there anything that you could talk about?

01:47:28.000 No.

01:47:30.000 It's all top secret.

01:47:31.000 I just gave the person the confidence that I would not mention it.

01:47:35.000 Got it.

01:47:36.000 And, Logan, have you had personal experiences other than the one when you were a child?

01:47:40.000 Yeah.

01:47:42.000 But I didn't know what I was seeing.

01:47:43.000 But, you know, like, after the program came out, I mean, not came out, but after James Fox finished editing everything, he said, well, you haven't seen everything.

01:47:58.000 Put together, so here you go.

01:48:00.000 And tell me if you don't like the way you look or whatever.

01:48:03.000 And I'm going through it, and he starts showing.

01:48:06.000 I see the stuff about Calvin, the Calvin Scotland image.

01:48:11.000 Have you seen that one?

01:48:12.000 Yes, yes.

01:48:13.000 So that image was taken, if I remember correctly, in August 1990. Pull that image up, Jay.

01:48:20.000 Thank you.

01:48:21.000 You can just type in Calvin, UFO, whatever.

01:48:27.000 I had just cross-trained from, yeah, that one.

01:48:30.000 I had just cross-trained from maintenance into intelligence, and I was going to my first intel assignment.

01:48:40.000 And I'm flying from Philadelphia to Frankfurt, Germany, to Rhein-Main Air Base.

01:48:49.000 Somewhere between Iceland and Scotland, this thing is zipping around in the clouds.

01:48:56.000 Doing this ziggy-zaggy thing.

01:48:58.000 I don't know what he was doing, but he was doing this.

01:49:00.000 The sun was just coming up, and I'm eating a Philly cheesesteak, and the other guy with me is eating a hoagie, and the other guy that's standing up over the top, I'm like, anybody know what that is?

01:49:13.000 And they're like, dude, what is that?

01:49:16.000 And then all of a sudden in my head, I'm like, oh, this is my first Intel assignment.

01:49:20.000 I'm going to get clued into some cool-ass shit.

01:49:23.000 But I don't know what the hell that is.

01:49:25.000 But I'm just thinking...

01:49:26.000 And it looks just like that.

01:49:27.000 It looks just like that.

01:49:28.000 And the way it was moving into clouds, it was like...

01:49:30.000 Because the shadowing was going from that color to dark.

01:49:34.000 And then light again as it was moving in.

01:49:36.000 And it would go into a cloud on one vector and come out on another vector.

01:49:39.000 And I'm like, what is that?

01:49:42.000 So I didn't know what was going on.

01:49:44.000 So I called James back.

01:49:45.000 I was like, dude, dude, where is this?

01:49:46.000 Talk to me.

01:49:47.000 We're all excited.

01:49:49.000 And he goes...

01:49:50.000 Explain to me everything.

01:49:52.000 And what happened was I got to my unit and I talked to them and I go, we have a weapons tactics guy.

01:50:00.000 You know, they're the best of the best and they're leading the group.

01:50:04.000 And I was like, so what is that thing out there?

01:50:06.000 And he goes, I have no idea what you're talking about.

01:50:09.000 Now, this is in January of 1990. That picture is August of 1990. And what I didn't realize was that the Belgian wave, I don't know if you're familiar with that, a whole bunch of triangular devices were seen over Belgium for almost a whole year.

01:50:25.000 So they just call it the Belgian wave.

01:50:27.000 Police officers saw it.

01:50:28.000 They launched F-16s after them, whatever.

01:50:30.000 Are there photographs of that at all?

01:50:32.000 No, but the general that's in charge actually gave a briefing to everybody and showed what the F-16 radar was seeing.

01:50:40.000 And I guess...

01:50:41.000 Every time they tried to get close to it, it would just pull away just far enough, you know, that they couldn't catch it.

01:50:48.000 And then when they would try to cage it in the radar system, it would move to the left.

01:50:52.000 You know, it was playing with them.

01:50:54.000 So, but I didn't know any of that.

01:50:56.000 So I just kind of was like, eh, okay, I'm stupid.

01:51:01.000 Maybe it was part of my imagination, but what I saw as a kid kept coming back into my head.

01:51:07.000 So dead of storm happens, whatever.

01:51:09.000 And I'm at my base and British AWACS shows up.

01:51:13.000 And they're looking at me.

01:51:15.000 I still had my accent, my British accent.

01:51:17.000 They're looking at me going, what are you flying with the Yanks for?

01:51:21.000 And I go, what do you mean?

01:51:23.000 And I told them my family thing.

01:51:25.000 They said, why don't you come fly with us?

01:51:28.000 I'm like, sure.

01:51:30.000 Let me ask my boss.

01:51:31.000 My boss says, you ain't got nothing going on.

01:51:33.000 Go fly with them.

01:51:34.000 So we're flying around and finally I go, hey guys.

01:51:39.000 What's that thing in the sky that does the ziggy-zaggy thing?

01:51:42.000 Do you know what I'm talking about?

01:51:43.000 And they're like, you know.

01:51:45.000 And I was like, no, I don't know.

01:51:47.000 Don't play with me.

01:51:48.000 And they're like, come on, Logan, you know.

01:51:49.000 And then finally they pull out this tape and they plug it in and it shows Europe, all the aircraft flying around.

01:51:57.000 And you see this thing go through the middle of it real fast.

01:51:59.000 Like all the other aircraft, the sweep of the radar, you've just seen these minute movements.

01:52:03.000 This thing is like, it's gone.

01:52:06.000 And I was like, who's that?

01:52:09.000 And they go, you know.

01:52:10.000 I was like, look, stop playing with me.

01:52:12.000 Come to find out, they said, well, that's your SR-71.

01:52:16.000 And I was like, well, that ain't him.

01:52:17.000 And they're like, okay.

01:52:19.000 And then he looks at the other guy and he said, show him the other one.

01:52:23.000 And they show me this radar scope again.

01:52:26.000 And this time there's a target in the middle of, not in the middle of the screen, but off to the side.

01:52:30.000 It was like, could have been like East Germany or whatever.

01:52:33.000 But every sweep of the radar, he was somewhere else.

01:52:37.000 And I was like, I was so excited.

01:52:39.000 I said, that MF right there, yeah, who's that guy?

01:52:42.000 And they go, you know.

01:52:44.000 I was like, look, stop this.

01:52:45.000 I don't know.

01:52:47.000 And they finally said, we don't know either.

01:52:50.000 They said, we just assumed it was you Americans playing with us.

01:52:54.000 That's what happens a lot of times.

01:52:56.000 We don't know who this guy is.

01:52:58.000 Everything's America if they can't explain it.

01:52:59.000 Right.

01:53:00.000 Did you see the Trump administration address the drones today?

01:53:04.000 We heard about it, but I didn't see it.

01:53:06.000 Yes, I had a friend tell me they made an announcement, but we were getting in the car at the time.

01:53:10.000 Essentially, they said it was all ours, and there was some sort of scanning that was done that was approved, and the other ones were hobbyists.

01:53:19.000 Hobbyists?

01:53:20.000 And there was some sort of test that they were doing, but they were saying that it's ours, which is very...

01:53:27.000 The whole thing stinks.

01:53:28.000 It does.

01:53:29.000 It stinks.

01:53:30.000 It's a poor explanation.

01:53:32.000 Yeah.

01:53:33.000 I actually had a person that was up there and she said one of those things came down low and slow over our house.

01:53:42.000 And she said it had the sound of a helicopter.

01:53:44.000 So she was like, her and her husband were like, oh, you know, it's a helicopter.

01:53:48.000 But then all of a sudden they realized, she said, Mr. Logan, were you ever air crew?

01:53:52.000 I said, yeah, I was in special ops and I flew on helicopters and da-da-da-da.

01:53:56.000 And she goes, when it came down low, it had the sound of a helicopter.

01:54:01.000 But you couldn't feel it.

01:54:02.000 And I go, huh?

01:54:03.000 She goes, you know when you can feel the rotor wash and it's hitting you in your chest like boop, boop, boop, boop?

01:54:08.000 She said there was none of that.

01:54:09.000 She said it came down slow, low over her house, and then it went back up, and then she said it looked like it went back into formation with something else.

01:54:17.000 And she said, that's not any drone I know of.

01:54:21.000 And she said it sounded like the actual noise of the helicopter and several of the other noises from the drones were all prerecorded.

01:54:29.000 Just to make them sound like they were a conventional aircraft.

01:54:33.000 And those are the same things I've been hearing, too, because a lot of people are shoving videos at me a lot in their descriptions of things.

01:54:40.000 And some of the stuff, you know, looked like maybe it could be a spotlight from a helicopter, and then when the light moved, then you could finally see the helicopter behind the light.

01:54:49.000 Then there was these other ones that was like, this is really weird.

01:54:53.000 My friend Mark saw one.

01:54:55.000 Mark Norman, how did he describe it, Jamie?

01:54:57.000 He said it was triangular, right?

01:54:59.000 I just remember saying SUV size.

01:55:01.000 Yeah, he said it was the size of an SUV. He said it was triangular.

01:55:05.000 He said it moved really fast.

01:55:06.000 So when they initially came out, they said, oh, they're all manned, all right?

01:55:11.000 I think it was John Kirby who was the speaker.

01:55:14.000 And I used to work at the FAA. So my first thing was, well, if they're manned, you just call them up and say, cut it out.

01:55:21.000 Right.

01:55:21.000 Simple.

01:55:22.000 Right.

01:55:23.000 But it kept going on.

01:55:24.000 And then later on, there was a report that DHS said, Oh, one of the drones has come down in a mall parking lot, but DHS has assessed it's just a regular drone.

01:55:38.000 So when you hear that, what are you thinking?

01:55:40.000 DJI Mavic, something small, whatever.

01:55:45.000 Someone on X is on a train going by that exact same spot, and they show a drone next to two police cars, and this thing is as big as the police car.

01:55:56.000 And I'm like, so I have no way of confirming if that's what it really was.

01:56:01.000 Right.

01:56:02.000 But I have no reason to believe that this particular person was leaving.

01:56:05.000 He said, he goes, I don't know what you guys are thinking, but I'm passing that mall right now, and take a look.

01:56:12.000 And it's like maybe a 30-second clip or something, and you see this thing.

01:56:16.000 It's as big as the SUVs.

01:56:18.000 - And what does it look like? - It looked like, kind of like a gondola with like large blades on the four corners.

01:56:30.000 So it looks like a very large conventional drone.

01:56:33.000 Very large conventional drone.

01:56:35.000 And so I'm sitting there thinking, was this a test that nobody knew about?

01:56:42.000 What is going on for this to...

01:56:44.000 And nobody got any answers.

01:56:46.000 Well, the other thing is they stay in the sky for like five hours at a time.

01:56:50.000 That's what puzzles me is that that takes industrial-sized...

01:56:54.000 Power generation.

01:56:56.000 What are you using?

01:56:57.000 What is that thing using?

01:56:59.000 Jamie, can you see the...

01:57:00.000 Cold fusion.

01:57:01.000 Can you find the video of the disclosure today?

01:57:08.000 While he's talking about the disclosure, the one thing I do want to mention is when I talked to that AWACS group, I thought it was kind of interesting because I said, so how many know about this?

01:57:21.000 And he goes, the whole squadron knows about it.

01:57:23.000 And I was like, what?

01:57:24.000 He says, yeah, but we just don't talk about it because people lose their jobs over this.

01:57:28.000 And I was like...

01:57:29.000 I've heard that as well.

01:57:30.000 And I was like, so this is an AWAC. And I said, am I to assume that if you're British AWACS, then American AWACS can see it, French AWACS can see it, NATO AWACS can see it.

01:57:41.000 And he just kind of, yeah.

01:57:43.000 And everybody doesn't know what it is.

01:57:44.000 No one's talking about it.

01:57:45.000 And everybody just says, it's got to be America.

01:57:47.000 Let's hear what this lady says. 1.00

01:57:49.000 And before I turn to questions, I do have news directly from the President of the United States that was just shared with me in the Oval Office.

01:57:57.000 From President Trump directly, an update on the New Jersey drones.

01:58:01.000 After research and study, the drones that were flying over New Jersey in large numbers were authorized to be flown by the FAA for research and various other reasons.

01:58:13.000 Many of these drones were also hobbyists, recreational, and private individuals that enjoy flying drones.

01:58:20.000 In time, it got worse due to curiosity.

01:58:24.000 This was not the enemy.

01:58:27.000 A statement from the President of the United States to start this briefing with some news.

01:58:34.000 The part that gets me is the hobbyists being included in that.

01:58:38.000 Well, they definitely were hobbyists, too, because there was hobbyists in Austin around that time.

01:58:43.000 There was a ton of drones.

01:58:45.000 People were like, whoa, it's a drone party!

01:58:48.000 Everybody with drones was just flying around.

01:58:50.000 Okay, well, that kind of makes sense.

01:58:52.000 It kind of makes sense, because there was so much drone activity talk.

01:58:54.000 Here's the thing that I got to look at it from an analyst's point of view.

01:58:57.000 The first thing that came up, I was like, so they knew this the whole time.

01:59:03.000 Why couldn't they have said that from the very beginning?

01:59:05.000 It's a different administration.

01:59:07.000 Right?

01:59:07.000 Right.

01:59:08.000 And then two, why were they required to have a SCIF briefing on drones?

01:59:15.000 Nobody's ever answered that.

01:59:17.000 At one point, Congress guys all went into a SCIF and got a SCIF briefing on drones.

01:59:22.000 And then they didn't have a press conference about the results.

01:59:24.000 Right.

01:59:25.000 Which would have been – could it be that they wanted to see what happens?

01:59:30.000 When you fly things over a metropolitan area and you fly a bunch of drones over highly populated parts of the country?

01:59:37.000 There's only a few reasons why I would say that you include both federal and hobbyist drones in any kind of an activity.

01:59:45.000 Well, the hobbyists are including themselves, right?

01:59:47.000 Yeah, and that could just be that they're accidentally there.

01:59:50.000 But the feds, what were they doing?

01:59:52.000 Yeah.

01:59:53.000 And why would they have a SCIF? That's my point.

01:59:56.000 Explain a SCIF to people that don't know what we're talking about.

01:59:58.000 A SCIF is a place for information above secret.

02:00:02.000 And it's a special compartmented intelligence facility where we can go in there and talk about things that are above the secret law.

02:00:08.000 And there's no recording devices.

02:00:10.000 Right.

02:00:10.000 No phones, no nothing.

02:00:12.000 Right.

02:00:12.000 But the thing is this.

02:00:15.000 I mean...

02:00:16.000 Most of us that are in the intelligence community or whatever, we're going to look at it and say something's not quite right here because this is something domestic happening over the U.S. So would it really require a SCIF? Especially if it's authorized.

02:00:31.000 Right.

02:00:31.000 Correct.

02:00:32.000 So would it really require that level of security to go on and have these guys talk?

02:00:40.000 It just doesn't make any sense.

02:00:41.000 The federal presence.

02:00:44.000 To me, dictates the fact that if this was innocuous and unclassified, like you're saying, why was there not a press conference that described it and said the hobbyists are out there flying too and they're just kind of interfering with our lanes where we go and fly normally between one place to another?

02:01:04.000 That never came out.

02:01:05.000 So why was the SCIF even mentioned?

02:01:09.000 That's something that they did release in the press.

02:01:12.000 They were receiving briefings that were in a classified environment.

02:01:17.000 Why?

02:01:18.000 Yeah, there's still the problem with these drones popping up all over the world, especially over military facilities, and that part's not being addressed.

02:01:27.000 It's just the other stuff that they...

02:01:29.000 Right.

02:01:30.000 That was Wright-Patterson Air Force Base had to get closed down, right?

02:01:33.000 Wright-Patterson, Langley Air Force Base.

02:01:35.000 There's others.

02:01:36.000 And then there's reports of stuff in Australia.

02:01:38.000 There's reports of things in other places in the world.

02:01:40.000 Let me ask you this and tell me if this makes sense.

02:01:43.000 If you were the government and you knew that there were non-human intelligence that were operating vehicles above our cities, would a way to sort of obfuscate that, to launch a bunch of our drones as well?

02:01:59.000 And have some shit that you could explain and then tell people, don't worry about it.

02:02:02.000 It was just drones.

02:02:03.000 It was our drones.

02:02:04.000 Like, see, here's our drone.

02:02:05.000 Here's a drone that crashed.

02:02:06.000 Look, it's got propellers. 0.96

02:02:07.000 Normal drone.

02:02:08.000 Yeah, it's big, but it's normal.

02:02:10.000 You have no idea how many people have said that already.

02:02:13.000 Yeah.

02:02:14.000 You're going in the right direction.

02:02:16.000 Yeah, you've heard that one.

02:02:17.000 You've heard the other theory.

02:02:18.000 They're looking for a dirty nuke.

02:02:20.000 Right.

02:02:20.000 They're looking for HVTs.

02:02:21.000 That one scared the shit out of me.

02:02:23.000 Yeah, I did too.

02:02:23.000 Honestly, I thought that's what it was about.

02:02:25.000 And then they have, what, looking for HVTs like... 0.94

02:02:29.000 Looking for terrorist groups because I think at that time it went through the press that there was over a thousand of these jihadists that were in our midst.

02:02:39.000 We don't know where they're at.

02:02:41.000 Maybe they're looking for those.

02:02:43.000 So those are just some of the theories that you come up with this kind of a scenario.

02:02:47.000 And then there was the congressman that said, oh, there's an Iranian mothership out there.

02:02:50.000 And we were like, what?

02:02:53.000 In the ocean.

02:02:54.000 Yeah.

02:02:54.000 None of this stuff was making any sense.

02:02:58.000 You have to wonder, where was he getting his intel?

02:03:03.000 Because if it's that crappy, those people need to be fired.

02:03:06.000 Well, you've got to take another thing into the calculus, and that is, wasn't this worldwide?

02:03:11.000 I mean, we got reports from China, even, that this stuff was happening.

02:03:15.000 And they don't just have hobbyists flying stuff around in their country.

02:03:18.000 Maybe they have a much tighter control over their media, so they don't have to obfuscate.

02:03:24.000 They don't have to...

02:03:26.000 Trick us.

02:03:27.000 That's the one part that I find very confusing is just like if it's happening in Europe and China and all these other places, what really is going on?

02:03:33.000 You could have just did a NOTAM and just said, hey, we're going to be doing a test in this area.

02:03:37.000 Don't want to scare anybody, whatever.

02:03:40.000 But we're just going to test in this area.

02:03:41.000 If it's just ours.

02:03:43.000 Yeah.

02:03:43.000 Right.

02:03:43.000 But if it's not ours and there's a bunch of shit flying around there and we want to confuse people.

02:03:48.000 Wouldn't you have a bunch of conventional drones and fly them low over cities so people could clearly see them?

02:03:54.000 Could have been done a totally different way and not had all this hubbub going on.

02:03:57.000 So, yeah, you're right.

02:03:58.000 But why would you, if you know the truth, why would you leave the Americans afraid of what's flying over their head?

02:04:06.000 I think they're still...

02:04:08.000 Look, assuming you guys are completely accurate about all this, if they have had this information for a long time...

02:04:15.000 I would assume that there's a lot of pressure to never release it.

02:04:19.000 I think there's probably a lot of problems with lying to Congress, lying to Congress about budgets and allocation of resources for these programs that are all top secret.

02:04:30.000 Like, how have you done this?

02:04:32.000 What have you done?

02:04:33.000 Who's responsible?

02:04:33.000 Who made that call?

02:04:34.000 Is that even legal?

02:04:36.000 And who are you?

02:04:38.000 That if you've been in contact with non-human intelligence and you have retrieved crafts, who are you to keep that from the rest of the world? 0.86

02:04:45.000 Exactly.

02:04:46.000 And speak for the American government for that if you're not officially part of it.

02:04:50.000 Right.

02:04:50.000 Especially if you're not officially...

02:04:54.000 I mean, you don't have the clearance to do what you're doing.

02:04:57.000 Right.

02:04:57.000 I mean, they're making decisions for the entire human race.

02:05:00.000 Not just America, but the whole race. 0.84

02:05:01.000 And that's what my beef was.

02:05:03.000 In the film, when James Fox asked me about that, well, why are you doing it, you know, kind of a thing.

02:05:08.000 And I was like, well, I feel like this is the right of every man, woman, and child on the face of the earth to know the truth about we're not alone.

02:05:16.000 That has nothing to do with the weapon systems and the classified parts that I know of.

02:05:20.000 But the fact that we're not alone, shouldn't that be something that everybody should be invited to make their own decision on?

02:05:27.000 Yeah, I would imagine that.

02:05:28.000 But I would also imagine if you wanted to keep your job, if you have a high intelligence clearance and you're working for the government and you're a long-time career employee of the government, you want to keep moving up the ladder and keep your fucking mouth shut.

02:05:40.000 Right, and that's where people have to make that decision on their own.

02:05:43.000 Have they seen enough malfeasance to want to report it?

02:05:49.000 Or not.

02:05:50.000 And they're going to throw their whole life into a tizzy if they do that.

02:05:52.000 And that's what happened to me.

02:05:53.000 Yeah.

02:05:54.000 And what has it been like since then?

02:05:58.000 Have you gotten support from more people than you thought you would?

02:06:01.000 Or have more people thrown you under the bus than you expected?

02:06:04.000 I actually feel more support than I expected.

02:06:10.000 I've made it through.

02:06:11.000 It's not been easy financially for me.

02:06:15.000 When they messed with my clearance, I haven't gotten a job since.

02:06:18.000 I've been out of work since August of last year.

02:06:21.000 So that's not been fun.

02:06:23.000 Was there a reason why they said they messed with your clearance?

02:06:26.000 No.

02:06:26.000 They just made it sound like, oh, it's just an administrative error.

02:06:29.000 Sorry.

02:06:30.000 Yeah, we still have your clearance here.

02:06:32.000 Everybody that wants to employ me, I've had quite a few employers want to hire me.

02:06:37.000 And they say, yeah, we can see your clearance over here.

02:06:39.000 It looks like DOD is trying to reactivate it.

02:06:45.000 By month, by month, it just sits there.

02:06:48.000 And they won't pass it to the employer.

02:06:52.000 Somebody is just sitting there going, oh, another request for Jason.

02:06:55.000 Goodbye.

02:06:56.000 Delete.

02:06:57.000 That's what's happening.

02:06:58.000 Because you've stepped down a line.

02:07:00.000 That's what it feels like to me.

02:07:01.000 Okay.

02:07:02.000 Logan, have you experienced the same kind of situation?

02:07:04.000 No.

02:07:06.000 He's in a different class than me.

02:07:09.000 He's an official whistleblower.

02:07:11.000 Me, I just step forward to say, That I don't think we need the government to do this.

02:07:18.000 I think we as the public need to do this.

02:07:21.000 And I created an app to do that.

02:07:23.000 I was hoping that...

02:07:24.000 What is your app?

02:07:25.000 My app is called FINA. It's an app to report UAP, paranormal, encrypted events.

02:07:33.000 And the idea is that we can get multiple people to see the same thing recorded and then look for the outliers and get people like Jacques Vallée.

02:07:42.000 Dr. Eric Davis and Hal Putoff and others, the graybeards, to look at it and say, okay, here's what we can figure out. 0.89

02:07:48.000 You know, Gary Nolan and all these people, let's get them the information that they need.

02:07:53.000 And then after we get them the information they need, let's get it out to academia so we can have kind of like a more organized approach to finding out what's going on.

02:08:02.000 I wanted people to use my app on the drones.

02:08:05.000 Some people did, but not enough.

02:08:08.000 And I had a little bit of a problem because...

02:08:11.000 When I put it out on Android, there was only one other app that was close to it that was in the same name.

02:08:18.000 Go back there, there's like almost 10 apps with the same name, so people didn't know what was going on.

02:08:22.000 They're getting confused.

02:08:23.000 But anyway, to answer your question about the support, yes, I do get a lot of support.

02:08:27.000 There's people like Stephen Diener, there's Digby Furneau and Tom Thompson, there's UFO Sarah that's on X. There's a ton of people that I can mention, let alone how much support James Fox is throwing at me.

02:08:41.000 That's what's getting me through this.

02:08:45.000 How many different versions of these life forms have been discussed with you?

02:08:51.000 On mission, I can say three I know of.

02:08:56.000 Two mainly, tall whites, grays.

02:08:59.000 Those are the main ones.

02:09:00.000 Are the tall whites like this one that you encountered?

02:09:02.000 The one with the big eyes?

02:09:04.000 Yes, yes.

02:09:04.000 But that wasn't that tall, you said.

02:09:06.000 Right.

02:09:07.000 But apparently, have you seen the...

02:09:10.000 Video for Mr. Hall, the guy that was supposed to be the weatherman and actually interfaced with the tall whites. 0.98

02:09:16.000 No.

02:09:16.000 Yeah, I totally believe.

02:09:18.000 I've seen too much.

02:09:19.000 But anyway, he says he's...

02:09:20.000 It goes in and out of my brain.

02:09:21.000 Well, I can verify the fact that what he said about his position there as a weatherman, that he could walk around anywhere he wanted to because that's what the base commander told me when I got my orientation drive-through on.

02:09:32.000 On Dreamland, and he mentioned the weather site, and that person can walk wherever they want to.

02:09:38.000 And what do they report?

02:09:40.000 Well, just, what, Mr. Hall?

02:09:42.000 Yeah.

02:09:42.000 Yeah, he says that the tall whites go through a growth cycle where they're kind of normal height, but they're very long-lived.

02:09:50.000 They live like 800 years or more.

02:09:51.000 But when they start getting older, then they get very tall, like seven, eight foot tall.

02:09:56.000 And then they begin to, you know, their bodies begin to not function properly and they die.

02:10:02.000 Kind of like somebody who has a growth problem.

02:10:05.000 Oh, like a giant.

02:10:06.000 Exactly.

02:10:07.000 And their vital organs just can't pump enough anymore.

02:10:10.000 Like large dogs that die early because of the heart problem?

02:10:14.000 Right.

02:10:14.000 So the guy that I saw was probably a young person, you know, probably only like 70 years old or something like that.

02:10:22.000 Which is kind of an adolescent to them or a young adult.

02:10:24.000 Oh, okay.

02:10:25.000 So, um...

02:10:27.000 And this was explained to him?

02:10:29.000 Through some sort of telepathy?

02:10:31.000 Well, he would actually, as the weather, if you listen to that video, I really encourage you to do that, but Mr. Hall also published some books on it, but he claims that when he was there at this one place that, you know, I can verify it's there, that on the other side of that mountain or that hillside, that's where the trail goes off into where the tall whites are apparently have been given an annex of land to live, where they don't get bothered.

02:10:58.000 I mean, it's part of the military complex.

02:11:00.000 Is that on Google Earth?

02:11:01.000 There is parts of it, yeah.

02:11:03.000 Can we, like, look where the tall whites live? 1.00

02:11:05.000 I tried to, yeah.

02:11:06.000 I'd have to get my laptop out, but yeah.

02:11:08.000 What does it look like?

02:11:10.000 It does look like there's some circular patterns.

02:11:12.000 It does look like there's some possibility that there are some, like, doors inside the mountain that is...

02:11:19.000 It looks like it's camouflaged to look like it's part of the mountainside.

02:11:22.000 So the idea is that that's a base for them when they visit us?

02:11:26.000 Yeah, because apparently, according to Mr. Hall, they come here for a five-year stint, I guess, and they have to refuel, and then they have another ship come through, and the other one's refueled, and it takes off.

02:11:38.000 So they're closer in the evolutionary chain to us than some of the other ones.

02:11:44.000 That's my assumption.

02:11:46.000 Yeah.

02:11:46.000 Now, the other third type that got mentioned on mission was reptilians.

02:11:49.000 But every time that they were mentioned, it was really quickly hushed up by whoever else was on the other end of the line.

02:11:56.000 Shut up. 0.95

02:11:57.000 Don't say that, is what they were doing.

02:11:59.000 They don't want to talk about the reptilian presence at all.

02:12:02.000 They would talk about the tall whites and the grays being in the lab of the armaments.

02:12:07.000 You know, not a lot, but some.

02:12:09.000 But these reptilians, it was like...

02:12:12.000 Nobody wanted to talk about it.

02:12:13.000 Was there any sort of an explanation that anybody give you of why they don't want to talk about it?

02:12:18.000 No.

02:12:19.000 The only time I got any inkling was that when I was out of the program and other people started to talk to me about all the different things.

02:12:26.000 They're like, well, how many races are there?

02:12:27.000 I don't know.

02:12:28.000 But some people talked about the reptilians.

02:12:30.000 They're like, do you realize that these are evil?

02:12:34.000 And I had to listen to that.

02:12:35.000 And the thing is...

02:12:37.000 We don't know if it's because of their appearance.

02:12:39.000 You know, you would assume something that's reptilian is maybe a demon or whatever in the Nordic, where the blonde-haired blue-eyed is considered like an angel, or is it that's just our perception?

02:12:49.000 But that's what you hear.

02:12:52.000 Well, every reptile here is evil.

02:12:56.000 Right?

02:12:57.000 You ever seen a Komodo dragon eat a goat?

02:12:59.000 It's horrific.

02:13:00.000 They're fucking monsters.

02:13:01.000 Every single reptile is a monster.

02:13:05.000 That's here.

02:13:05.000 There's not one cuddly reptile you can hang out with.

02:13:08.000 Coddles with you.

02:13:09.000 He brings you your newspaper in the morning.

02:13:11.000 I thought that was funny because the lady was like, my snake sleeps with me every night. 1.00

02:13:16.000 And the guy says, no, it's laying next to you because it's sizing you up for eventually a chance when it's going to eat you.

02:13:23.000 One day it's going to eat you.

02:13:24.000 You have a monster that you feed.

02:13:26.000 And as long as you keep feeding, it won't eat you.

02:13:29.000 People with pythons are pests.

02:13:31.000 Well, to give it some credibility, I did do some research after that person talked to me.

02:13:35.000 Because I did see that there is a reptilian race that is very malign like that. 1.00

02:13:40.000 And they even have, according to what I read, this one race has a penchant for blood for some reason. 1.00

02:13:47.000 It's like a shark frenzy with them.

02:13:49.000 Like a real reptile.

02:13:50.000 It's a euphoric experience for them.

02:13:52.000 Yeah, a reptilian race that does that. 1.00

02:13:54.000 It just makes you wonder about human history, about the stories of demons and angels.

02:14:00.000 And this is what Tucker Carlson believes, that they've always been here, and that this idea that they're coming from another planet, it's not that simple.

02:14:09.000 No.

02:14:09.000 That it's more complicated.

02:14:10.000 And he thinks that it's the demons and the angels from the Bible.

02:14:15.000 Yeah.

02:14:15.000 So they could be seen that way, but here's something that we were just talking and throwing ideas at each other.

02:14:22.000 He said if humans have actually been on the earth, like, say, this long, when the dinosaurs were here, they were like...

02:14:30.000 Yeah.

02:14:30.000 This long.

02:14:31.000 So is it possible that some of them could have evolved to a certain point, know that something bad's going to happen?

02:14:38.000 They're so advanced, they go off-world, and then they come back and go, hey, what happened here?

02:14:42.000 Or is there a place where the Yucatan impact never happens?

02:14:49.000 And so those dinosaurs eventually evolved to become super intelligent.

02:14:53.000 Yes.

02:14:53.000 Because remember back in the day, there used to be an Omni magazine?

02:14:56.000 Mm-hmm.

02:14:57.000 All right?

02:14:57.000 One of those hypotheses was, If mammals like us hadn't shown up, what would we have looked like?

02:15:04.000 And it shows a lizard walking upright and doing, you know, everyday things.

02:15:10.000 But wouldn't you think that it would have done that already?

02:15:13.000 Like, they were around for like 100 million years, 200 million years.

02:15:17.000 Yes.

02:15:17.000 Like, in that time period, they didn't evolve at all.

02:15:19.000 Those fuckers, they just kept eating each other in a safe way. 1.00

02:15:22.000 That's the assumption.

02:15:24.000 Right.

02:15:24.000 But now we're going back and looking at all kinds of different things.

02:15:26.000 Like, they said that maybe it wasn't.

02:15:29.000 The asteroid that took out the dinosaurs.

02:15:30.000 Maybe it was a combination of things like there was some kind of mutation, something that they drank in the water, and all at the same time, maybe the asteroid was the catalyst to start it.

02:15:42.000 And then all these other things that happened after, you know, the fireball, all the other stuff.

02:15:48.000 But if there was a group that was so advanced that they could sit there and go, that's an asteroid.

02:15:53.000 It's going to kick our butt.

02:15:54.000 Let's get the fuck out of here. 0.85

02:15:55.000 Or let's go under, you know, because there's some little looking things that can go underwater and do their thing.

02:16:02.000 Live underground, that kind of thing, yeah.

02:16:03.000 Because I heard a story.

02:16:05.000 Oh, I know.

02:16:07.000 Anyway, go ahead.

02:16:08.000 You heard a story?

02:16:09.000 Yeah.

02:16:09.000 Okay.

02:16:10.000 I just heard a story that someone just said, imagine this.

02:16:15.000 The aliens are coming down.

02:16:16.000 There's another society here that lives on the ground, highly advanced.

02:16:20.000 And they like to keep things the way they are.

02:16:23.000 So they're going to direct all their energy to make sure that the NHI that we're seeing are paying attention to us and not them.

02:16:30.000 And I was like...

02:16:31.000 But see, for me, the way I look at all this reptilian presence is just like I've read in the Bible.

02:16:40.000 For some reason, I feel like this whole experience I've had in my life actually increased my faith.

02:16:49.000 In the Bible.

02:16:50.000 In God.

02:16:51.000 Because even in the Bible it mentions the serpents and that Lucifer being the head of that genre or species did cause the fall of mankind and all this other good stuff.

02:17:03.000 So to me, I feel like I just got experience with the reality of the fact that these things exist.

02:17:09.000 And even though they try to keep it all hidden, that I got exposed to the program where I could see some of it.

02:17:16.000 And I think that...

02:17:18.000 There's some credence also to that side of it as well.

02:17:20.000 So to give credence to the whole thing is just to say that that's what I believe, but at the same time I wasn't there.

02:17:28.000 This Eben thing that you talked about initially, this creature, what did that thing look like?

02:17:34.000 They didn't really describe the Eben.

02:17:37.000 They didn't?

02:17:38.000 Nope.

02:17:38.000 They just said that it was just like them reporting on something for that day.

02:17:43.000 So it was kind of like a daily thing with them.

02:17:45.000 So they had already described it.

02:17:46.000 You just weren't privy to it.

02:17:47.000 And so they were just going on the assumption that everybody who's talking about it knows.

02:17:51.000 It's kind of like, you know, somebody asked me what you look like today.

02:17:54.000 After the first time they asked me, they're never going to ask me about that again.

02:17:56.000 So it was like that was just not a topic.

02:17:58.000 Got it.

02:17:58.000 So this Eben, was it here against its will?

02:18:02.000 Was it here to interact with us?

02:18:04.000 It sounded like it was imprisoned.

02:18:06.000 It sounded like an interrogation result.

02:18:08.000 Is what it sounded like.

02:18:09.000 If you hear any of the stories, they make it sound like he was one of the survivors and he got stuck here and he started working with us and eventually he died in the natural causes.

02:18:23.000 But it's all speculation because we're hearing all this stuff but we don't have any way to verify.

02:18:29.000 And how many other stories that are similar to that, like the interactions and a thing being here with us, have you heard?

02:18:40.000 There's another one that actually escaped from captivity.

02:18:43.000 Yo! 1.00

02:18:44.000 But he actually convinced his interpreter or his interrogator to help him escape because the program was trying to get him to open a portal for them and they wanted the control of it.

02:18:58.000 And the guy eventually, the interrogator actually pushed him into the portal and had surreptitiously given him back to his own home world.

02:19:09.000 And it ended that guy's career, probably.

02:19:12.000 A portal?

02:19:13.000 Yeah.

02:19:14.000 And what kind of portal are we talking about?

02:19:16.000 You're talking like it's kind of like a way of opening a wormhole that you can control.

02:19:21.000 And did they say where this thing was accomplished and how?

02:19:24.000 I think it was also in reticuli.

02:19:26.000 I think it was another being from the reticuli system.

02:19:29.000 Right, but the portal.

02:19:30.000 Where is this portal?

02:19:31.000 How is it accomplished?

02:19:32.000 Oh, the portal, I thought...

02:19:35.000 I was trying to think, where was that call from and to?

02:19:38.000 Because you always get the originating location, but you're always trying to figure out who the distant end is.

02:19:44.000 I'm trying to think all the parameters, because you have to write down the phone number and every stuff sometimes.

02:19:52.000 It sounded like it might have been on the Pacific Northwest or the West Coast area is where this was taking place.

02:20:00.000 And did they say how the portal was made?

02:20:03.000 Was this made by them?

02:20:05.000 They had recovered parts of one, and they were trying to complete it, and they were trying to get this being to help them complete the portal so that they could use it for their advantage.

02:20:17.000 Like a Stargate.

02:20:18.000 Yeah.

02:20:18.000 Like a real Stargate.

02:20:19.000 Correct.

02:20:20.000 Remember when I was telling you that story about, you know, let's go get Jimmy?

02:20:24.000 Yeah.

02:20:26.000 The rumor that I heard surrounding this was that He convinced his interpreter that if he didn't get back and if he didn't get home, really bad things were going to happen.

02:20:41.000 And that guy just kind of felt like, you know, hey, I got kids.

02:20:46.000 Right.

02:20:46.000 I don't want society to destroy.

02:20:48.000 Plus he had some compassion for him because he's been working with him for a while.

02:20:52.000 Yeah.

02:20:52.000 So when he got the chance, he was just like...

02:20:55.000 You know, get him in there.

02:20:57.000 I can't remember all the things.

02:20:58.000 I think they had to keep this entity tied to a chair or something so he couldn't do anything.

02:21:03.000 And that's why he needed the help of the guy that was the interpreter.

02:21:07.000 He had to push him into the portal on the chair that he was tied to.

02:21:11.000 So the rumors I heard, I didn't hear the portal part.

02:21:14.000 I just heard that somehow he was able to get him outside.

02:21:19.000 And just as he got him outside, they just showed up above and did a snatch and grab.

02:21:25.000 He was gone, and next thing you know, he's out there by himself.

02:21:27.000 So there's different versions of the story.

02:21:28.000 Right, there's different versions.

02:21:29.000 I'm just telling you that that's the only other one I've heard that you're mentioning that you wanted me to describe.

02:21:34.000 Was there any other entities that we had captured and had something similar?

02:21:36.000 That's the only other story I've heard.

02:21:38.000 Do you know the Richard Nixon story?

02:21:40.000 Yeah, where he went with Jackie Gleason?

02:21:42.000 Yeah.

02:21:42.000 Do you think that's bullshit?

02:21:45.000 Actually, not for that time frame, no.

02:21:47.000 I could see Jackie Gleason and Richard Nixon.

02:21:50.000 Soaking some suds down.

02:21:51.000 That I definitely could say.

02:21:53.000 And also, Jackie Gleason did become obsessed with UFOs afterwards and even had a house built the shape of a UFO. I remember that.

02:21:59.000 It's a wild-looking house that was apparently for sale recently.

02:22:02.000 Yes.

02:22:03.000 Really?

02:22:03.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

02:22:04.000 It wasn't in Palisades, was it?

02:22:06.000 No, no.

02:22:07.000 It was in upstate New York.

02:22:09.000 It did look like a...

02:22:10.000 It's a very bizarre-looking house.

02:22:12.000 Like you see, you're like, why would Jackie Gleason build it?

02:22:14.000 Want to see it?

02:22:14.000 Pull it up.

02:22:15.000 You look at it, you're like, why would Jackie Gleason build a house like this?

02:22:19.000 But then you hear that story, you go, well, maybe that's why he did it.

02:22:22.000 Because the word was that he had become obsessed with UFOs at one point in his life, and this story came out, I think, as told by his wife.

02:22:30.000 Oh, wow, yeah.

02:22:31.000 This was Jackie Gleason's house.

02:22:34.000 Which is so weird.

02:22:35.000 Yeah.

02:22:36.000 Spaceship-like house.

02:22:37.000 Very strange.

02:22:38.000 Very fucking strange.

02:22:39.000 For someone to do something like that...

02:22:42.000 I would have to believe they had something profound.

02:22:46.000 Or they were me.

02:22:47.000 I would build that.

02:22:49.000 I've never had a UFO experience.

02:22:50.000 I've built that fucking house.

02:22:52.000 I love that house.

02:22:54.000 I kind of like those, too.

02:22:56.000 It's like down at Navarre Beach where I have a home down there in Florida, but there's a UFO house down there.

02:23:02.000 Oh, really?

02:23:02.000 Yeah, and it looks just like a UFO. I think there's a UFO house in California somewhere.

02:23:08.000 I think there's one in the hills above...

02:23:12.000 Studio City.

02:23:13.000 I think there's one.

02:23:15.000 It's like a famous UFO house.

02:23:17.000 I think they've filmed things.

02:23:18.000 I think it's like on stilts and it looks like a UFO. I mean, people are always going to want things that look like that.

02:23:25.000 It doesn't necessarily mean that the Jackie Gleason...

02:23:27.000 Yeah, that one.

02:23:28.000 That's in the Hollywood Hills.

02:23:30.000 It's called the Chemosphere.

02:23:31.000 That one actually is pretty cool.

02:23:32.000 Fucking dope.

02:23:34.000 That house is cool as shit.

02:23:35.000 But I'd be terrified living in California with earthquakes in it.

02:23:39.000 Stupid place to live.

02:23:40.000 You wouldn't want it as your main house.

02:23:44.000 That's a house you visit every now and then when you want to get drunk.

02:23:47.000 Let's get drunk at the UFO house.

02:23:49.000 Have a party.

02:23:50.000 Have a little cocktail party at the UFO house.

02:23:52.000 There you go.

02:23:52.000 That's exactly how I treat it.

02:23:54.000 Yeah, it's like fun.

02:23:58.000 So the grays, the tall whites, the reptilians, but then there's the mantis too, right?

02:24:03.000 Right.

02:24:04.000 And those are things, honestly, I've had, we've only discussed a part of my life.

02:24:09.000 I've had experiences all the way from three years on.

02:24:13.000 And even after I was out of the program and I was just working in Florida and I've seen the Delta or triangular craft like three times.

02:24:25.000 One of those times it was with my daughter when we were coming back from her gymnastics class.

02:24:30.000 Pretty, well, just before I retired.

02:24:33.000 And what did that look like?

02:24:34.000 It was like the size of a three-story home, but it was, you know, pointed.

02:24:40.000 And on the top it was kind of angular, kind of like what you see the F-117 look like, where it's angular.

02:24:47.000 It kind of looked like that.

02:24:48.000 It had pale.

02:24:51.000 Grayish white lights on the underside, on the cardinal corners.

02:24:56.000 And then in the back, there was a flat panel that looked like a grill where there was a light that there was like these stack of straight up lights like fluorescent lights are that would go to the right and then to the left.

02:25:09.000 And did it make noise?

02:25:10.000 Zero noise.

02:25:11.000 Zero noise.

02:25:12.000 And they're just flying through the air?

02:25:14.000 Yep.

02:25:14.000 Fast?

02:25:15.000 Slow?

02:25:15.000 It was going fairly slow.

02:25:17.000 And then when it banked, it turned, and then that's when it sped up a little bit, and then I lost it in the trees.

02:25:24.000 Then I saw it two other times.

02:25:26.000 One time was going to work, and the other time was in 2022 when I reached out to some of the program folks that I used to know to tell them, hey, there's a space on the top-secret J-Wish computers that they're talking about UFOs.

02:25:41.000 And I pointed them directly to this delta-shaped craft because I was like, I know what this is and I know what they know it is.

02:25:52.000 So I was trying to let them know that you need to look at this imagery that we have our hands on.

02:25:59.000 And ends up, they ended up showing up with it.

02:26:02.000 And they showed me flying in flight.

02:26:04.000 They followed me home.

02:26:06.000 The next night, and it was right there above my car, and I'm looking kind of like...

02:26:11.000 So is this ours?

02:26:13.000 It's ours, yeah.

02:26:14.000 It's a hybrid, or it's ours.

02:26:15.000 I've always told people...

02:26:17.000 A hybrid meaning what?

02:26:19.000 Well, here it is.

02:26:19.000 The whole thing is that in the 90s, I know they were on mission with me at Wright-Patt, and we saw a Delta-shaped craft.

02:26:26.000 It had different nacelles at the time, or engines at the time.

02:26:29.000 That's what a nacelle is.

02:26:31.000 And then...

02:26:33.000 So this new version looked very similar in shape.

02:26:36.000 However, it had these glowing orbs that looked like they were part of the propulsion system.

02:26:41.000 So they had upgraded part of it.

02:26:43.000 And now it looked fully functional and operational because back in the 90s it was not.

02:26:47.000 So this is the other thing that I keep hearing is that we are in possession of technology that is many, many years ahead of anything that anybody could anticipate.

02:26:56.000 And when we get that, I call that exotic material and or whatever you want to call it.

02:27:02.000 But we get our hands on that, and about every 10 years, we get a breakthrough on it because we do study it, and sometimes somebody is smart enough to figure something out.

02:27:12.000 And the next thing you know, we've got fiber optics.

02:27:15.000 We've got cell phones.

02:27:16.000 We've got transistors.

02:27:17.000 Now we're nanotech.

02:27:19.000 Where'd all this stuff come from?

02:27:20.000 It's some of this part of this NHI presence in that they've taken a patent that was developed inside the program, and now these people from Lockheed and Northrop are...

02:27:31.000 Patenting this stuff and then making lots of money on the outside.

02:27:36.000 Other than the beings that we described, are there other ones that people have talked about?

02:27:41.000 Yes.

02:27:41.000 I've actually, like I said, as a young adult, I probably encountered more of a spiritual sense, but they were Nordic-looking.

02:27:50.000 You know, platinum hair kind of a look, blue eyes.

02:27:53.000 Like the tall whites or different?

02:27:55.000 No, different.

02:27:56.000 How many documented different species have you heard of?

02:28:02.000 If I'm talking about my mission days, it's only that handful.

02:28:05.000 And then if you're talking about other things that I've had other people tell me about, I think I've heard enough from enough people that I trust that I think our concept of life in this universe is totally off.

02:28:19.000 I think there are literally trillions of other life forms.

02:28:23.000 And anything you can imagine is probably true.

02:28:27.000 That's an interesting thing because I always, one of the things that I wondered when we used to talk in the task force was if this is the, you know, we're the alpha species here on Earth.

02:28:37.000 So what if what we're seeing is the alpha species from another planet?

02:28:42.000 Think about what other critters and other things are running around.

02:28:45.000 And maybe if we see something wild and crazy over here, what if it's somebody...

02:28:50.000 You know, who's got a dog like Psycho.

02:28:53.000 You know, all of a sudden something goes, you're like, what was that?

02:28:56.000 You know, we just don't know.

02:28:57.000 So, you know, we can speculate and everything and build all these hypotheses up, but we're constantly looking to add to what we think is out there so we can figure out.

02:29:09.000 Here's what we figured out.

02:29:10.000 Here's what we haven't.

02:29:11.000 Now, is the conventional explanation that these things are from other planets?

02:29:16.000 Or is there speculation that they're interdimensional?

02:29:20.000 Is there speculation that they live in the water?

02:29:23.000 Yes.

02:29:24.000 All of that.

02:29:25.000 All of the above.

02:29:26.000 I would say that the way they appear and disappear is interdimensionalism.

02:29:34.000 I've had other friends that have had encounters that have talked to me that they could see a larger craft, and then it turned, and all of a sudden there was a door opening and a creature coming out, and yet this other part of the craft seemed to be like a long way off.

02:29:50.000 So it was like interdimensionally large, however, you know.

02:29:55.000 When it turns, it's not like our four-dimensional world.

02:29:58.000 I've heard of a craft that you go inside of it and it looks like a couple hundred feet on the outside.

02:30:04.000 You go inside of it and it's bigger than a football field.

02:30:06.000 Yeah, Dr. Who style.

02:30:08.000 Because it's going into this other dimension and there's actually more space to that.

02:30:13.000 Yes, and that's what this guy was describing.

02:30:15.000 So we've all heard that too.

02:30:18.000 The other thing too about the dimensional thing...

02:30:22.000 Because of the speeds that they're moving at, it could be that they're moving so fast it looks like they slipped into a dimension.

02:30:28.000 Because sometimes you'll see these things go off into the sky and then do some weird whatever and then they're gone.

02:30:34.000 And then other times what you're seeing is this thing is moving slowly and then all of a sudden it's gone.

02:30:40.000 And you're like, did they just slip into another dimension or is that they're...

02:30:43.000 Is the speed so fast that you can't track it with your eye?

02:30:47.000 I have heard...

02:30:49.000 Yes.

02:30:49.000 I have heard people...

02:30:51.000 Tell me that they were seeing some of these things moving at 16,000 miles per hour plus, and we're still accelerating.

02:30:59.000 I've never been able to verify that, obviously, but these are some people that seem to know what they're talking about, and, you know, they just kind of come forward.

02:31:09.000 I would just have, when I was on the task force, I would just get a phone call and just say, hey, are you Mr. Logan?

02:31:15.000 Yeah.

02:31:16.000 And they're like, uh...

02:31:19.000 Check your email in about five minutes.

02:31:20.000 Or, you know, hey, there's something I want to tell you.

02:31:23.000 And I have no way of verifying it.

02:31:25.000 But the idea would be to put it in a little box somewhere to say, hey, this is an unknown.

02:31:30.000 And maybe someone like Jason would come along and verify what this guy just told me or verify what I just saw in a video that maybe he can corroborate on.

02:31:41.000 We would look at primarily for the task force, we were looking at the safety of the pilots.

02:31:47.000 Because they were having so many problems.

02:31:50.000 And they kept filling out all those safety reports.

02:31:54.000 And I remember asking the task force director, Jay Stratton, I was like, what about all the commercial stuff that's going on?

02:32:01.000 And he says, I want to incorporate that, but I can't because with their stuff, we don't have a good chain of custody on what's happening.

02:32:09.000 And if someone's manipulating the data with the stuff that's coming directly from the pilots, we can.

02:32:17.000 What the pilots told me they saw.

02:32:20.000 And then me and several others in and outside of the task force were looking through the commercial stuff to see if we could find the same exact thing.

02:32:30.000 Because that's how I, when I first got it pulled into the task force, it was, I talked about my app and...

02:32:38.000 I was going to do this just to figure out just something for a hobby when I get older, you know, when I grow up.

02:32:43.000 And then Lou Elizondo came out with Leslie Keen and their story, and I went and found Lou, and I said, if you're serious about what you're talking about, stop by my office, because I just wanted to see if he could do it.

02:32:56.000 And he showed up with the gang, and they presented their story about the pilots and everything, and we were like...

02:33:05.000 And I said, well, what about this weird thing over here?

02:33:08.000 And they're like, how do you know about that?

02:33:10.000 And I was like, I got friends in low places.

02:33:12.000 Kind of like you.

02:33:15.000 And they looked at me and they said, don't worry.

02:33:20.000 That one's...

02:33:21.000 We've been told that something mundane is nothing important.

02:33:25.000 And I was like, I beg to differ.

02:33:28.000 And I was able to show them a video.

02:33:32.000 The same thing, seeing somewhere in the world through civilian stuff.

02:33:38.000 And I remember when they were leaving after they heard everything, and all of a sudden, Lou just turns back around and goes, you're in.

02:33:46.000 And I was like, in what?

02:33:47.000 And he goes, you'll see.

02:33:49.000 And next thing you know, I was in the task force.

02:33:52.000 And for me, I was like, oh, my life just came full circle.

02:33:55.000 I saw some things, and now I'm actually going to investigate these things?

02:34:01.000 Kind of pressed ahead.

02:34:03.000 And then, just to add, on top of that, remember I said when Jason showed up, I called David Grush, right?

02:34:11.000 But the funny thing was, I hadn't even been in the task force that long, and I was trying to look at things.

02:34:18.000 All of a sudden, I get a phone call, and I'm like, yeah, how can I help you?

02:34:22.000 And he goes, my name is David Grush.

02:34:25.000 Are you serious about all this stuff you're tracking?

02:34:28.000 And I go, yeah.

02:34:29.000 He goes, I want in.

02:34:31.000 And I was like, huh?

02:34:33.000 And he goes, I think I have something that can help with you guys.

02:34:38.000 And I was like, well, I'm not in charge of this.

02:34:41.000 I've got to introduce you to Stratton and Company.

02:34:46.000 And so I introduced him, and every now and then I would say hi to him, and we'd talk, and he'd call me on the phone.

02:34:52.000 But who else?

02:34:55.000 I mean, I'm going to Stratton.

02:34:56.000 I'm going to all the people in the task force.

02:34:59.000 And he pops up and I'm like, oh my god, what do you do with that?

02:35:03.000 I don't have the resources.

02:35:04.000 I didn't get invited like he did.

02:35:06.000 I didn't have the resources to check out everything that he did.

02:35:08.000 One of the things that we keep hearing, Christopher Mellon's talked about this, many people talked about this, is there is evidence that's been classified that is high-resolution video and photographs that are very distinct, very different than some of the blurry stuff that we've seen.

02:35:26.000 Have you guys seen any of that?

02:35:28.000 Yes.

02:35:28.000 You have.

02:35:29.000 Can you talk about it?

02:35:30.000 Nope.

02:35:32.000 All I can say is that there's some really, really good, clear, high-def stuff out there that...

02:35:42.000 Can't explain.

02:35:43.000 You can't explain.

02:35:44.000 You're just sitting there going...

02:35:46.000 We went through the whole rigmarole on these objects.

02:35:48.000 You had people on one side of the fence, people on the other side of the fence, people in the middle of it all.

02:35:55.000 And nobody could draw a conclusion.

02:35:57.000 The first thing we're trying to do is go, okay, could that be Russia?

02:36:01.000 Could that be China?

02:36:02.000 Okay, who else is there?

02:36:04.000 And you go through your whole list.

02:36:06.000 Then once you put that off to the side, you go through, now, what are we observing?

02:36:11.000 And some of the things, you know, like Lou said, the five observables plus the six, which is, you know, the psychological effect on that.

02:36:17.000 But you're kind of going through those, looking for all those.

02:36:20.000 They're not always there.

02:36:21.000 Yeah.

02:36:22.000 But they're super clear.

02:36:23.000 And some of them, You're like...

02:36:27.000 I mean, you look at it and you just keep saying, how can that be?

02:36:31.000 Yeah, because you've got...

02:36:32.000 Also, you've got to understand that these are professionals.

02:36:35.000 We had imagery analysts go through looking for false positive, like, camera artifacts that look like something they're not.

02:36:43.000 They could do AI analysis of images now.

02:36:46.000 They're pretty accurate.

02:36:47.000 Exactly.

02:36:47.000 And we had a whole database of all these false positives to go through, and it wasn't matching any of that.

02:36:52.000 We were going through the imagery analysis of the video, looking for flaws like artifacts.

02:36:58.000 Couldn't find anything about that.

02:36:59.000 And you're talking about a high-resolution video.

02:37:01.000 Yeah.

02:37:01.000 Like it's much clearer than the stuff we're seeing?

02:37:03.000 Exactly.

02:37:03.000 And what's the resistance to that stuff getting out there to the general public?

02:37:07.000 It's just classification.

02:37:08.000 It could be where it's at, those type things.

02:37:11.000 It could be anything.

02:37:11.000 Yeah, because one of the things that I think the community really gets hung up on when it comes to the intel community is that the classification is one thing, but when you don't know if something is a threat...

02:37:22.000 You automatically assign a value to that as being credible or not credible.

02:37:26.000 And right now they can't draw a conclusion.

02:37:28.000 Therefore, they don't want to declassify it.

02:37:30.000 Therefore, it will not be divulged in public because of those reasons.

02:37:33.000 I was telling him in my – my first thing as an Intel analyst is to go friend or foe.

02:37:42.000 And then the next thing I'm trying to do is break down all the characteristics.

02:37:47.000 And we would sit there and you're looking.

02:37:51.000 When I first joined the task force, I remember there was a group that I used to walk in their office because they're smarter than me.

02:37:58.000 So I want to make sure I'm getting the best input.

02:38:01.000 And the first couple of times I showed up, everybody pulled out the aluminum hats.

02:38:06.000 They started playing the X-Files music.

02:38:09.000 And I'm like, okay, guys, but what about this?

02:38:12.000 And I throw it out there and they're like, oh, yeah, what is that?

02:38:15.000 After about the fourth or fifth visit...

02:38:17.000 No more music.

02:38:19.000 I come in, everybody's already hunched over what I've already sent them.

02:38:22.000 They're like, yeah, what is that?

02:38:24.000 Because we would, Jay Stratton asked us, he said, lean forward and get out there and use an all-source approach to looking and gathering all the information on what we can find.

02:38:37.000 So I would capture, like, I would call up a drone guy and say, I need you to come to my office.

02:38:44.000 Take a look at this.

02:38:46.000 And he would look at it, and he was like, holy crap, how big is that?

02:38:51.000 What?

02:38:52.000 How?

02:38:53.000 And I was like, yeah, I need answers.

02:38:55.000 Can you take a look?

02:38:56.000 And he would, Logan, I'll get back to you.

02:38:59.000 A couple weeks later, he's like, dude, I got nothing.

02:39:02.000 And then, you know, we would have an imagery guy look at it, and, you know, sometimes they could sit there and say, dude, that's this.

02:39:07.000 If you had one piece of footage or image to release, would there be one that really stands out?

02:39:14.000 Like if they said, look, you could release this one, just one of these classified, high-resolution videos, is there one that really stands out as being unique?

02:39:24.000 It's a group for me.

02:39:26.000 Can you describe any of it?

02:39:28.000 I think Lou Elizondo described one.

02:39:32.000 There's the story that he talks about, I think Commander Fravor discusses about the torpedo.

02:39:40.000 Do you remember that one?

02:39:43.000 The story is that they were launching torpedoes and, you know, they blew the ballast on the torpedo.

02:39:49.000 The torpedo came up to the top and the divers came to hook the torpedo. 1.00

02:39:54.000 And just as they were about to hook it, something very large, like an island, came up underneath them.

02:40:03.000 All right.

02:40:06.000 So I get this weird call and it's...

02:40:12.000 You have to play devil's advocate because when you're trying to tell guys that they were the observer and you're trying to say, hey, well, you know, it could have been this.

02:40:21.000 Some of these guys get downright angry.

02:40:23.000 They're pissed because you're questioning their ability to discern what's going on.

02:40:28.000 They were there.

02:40:29.000 You weren't.

02:40:30.000 And you've seen something life-changing.

02:40:32.000 Right.

02:40:32.000 So you have to be careful because after a while, nobody will want to talk to you again because, oh, Logan's an asshole.

02:40:38.000 So you're very careful.

02:40:40.000 So this guy just sends me this thing.

02:40:42.000 And I'm looking at it, and I just, maybe a couple weeks before I'd heard this story with Fravor and Elizondo, so I'm like, what is this?

02:40:52.000 And there was this, all I can say was there was something very, very, very large moving under the water, but not too far that you can't see it, but it's moving under the water, and it's passing objects that...

02:41:09.000 I know are really large and this thing is bigger than them.

02:41:13.000 Right.

02:41:13.000 And I'm sitting there going...

02:41:14.000 Well, I think they mentioned one of them and that was the oil tanker one.

02:41:18.000 Yes.

02:41:19.000 That one confused the hell out of me.

02:41:21.000 And there were people saying it was just a shadow.

02:41:24.000 That's the one that was going 500 knots. 0.97

02:41:26.000 Yeah, I think so.

02:41:28.000 But some people were saying, oh, it's just some kind of a round object.

02:41:31.000 The sun is just making a large...

02:41:33.000 The shadow of the moon going across the face of the Earth.

02:41:35.000 Somebody did another analysis and they looked at the wavetops and they're like, this is not a shadow, otherwise we show up on the wavetops.

02:41:40.000 This is under the surface.

02:41:42.000 And this thing...

02:41:43.000 And it's disturbing the water underneath it as it's going by.

02:41:45.000 This thing made this oil rig out in the ocean look.

02:41:49.000 It dwarfed it.

02:41:50.000 I mean, this is like three or four times bigger.

02:41:52.000 So the speculation is that they're hiding in plain sight in the water?

02:41:55.000 Or is the speculation that there's always been a civilization down there?

02:41:59.000 I'd say in my opinion...

02:42:02.000 Yes?

02:42:02.000 No, in my opinion, I would say that they have been here a very long time and that underneath the ocean and underneath the ground are two of the best places to stay hidden and out of the way of prying eyes.

02:42:16.000 You go out in the booty somewhere or you go...

02:42:19.000 There's a whole bunch of activity going on around Puerto Rico.

02:42:23.000 Puerto Rico?

02:42:24.000 Yeah.

02:42:24.000 There's a whole bunch of activity that is going on where the Nimitz incident happened.

02:42:32.000 So there's things that we want to verify because you hear stories about things like you've heard of the Baltic anomaly.

02:42:39.000 So the first thing you want to know is, well, first of all, is it actually there?

02:42:43.000 Once you verify that it's there, you want to know...

02:42:46.000 What's his composition?

02:42:48.000 What's his composition?

02:42:49.000 All those things.

02:42:49.000 There's another thing on there.

02:42:51.000 You can look it up right now.

02:42:52.000 It's called the Cuban Atlantis.

02:42:53.000 It's supposed to be 13 nautical miles west of Cuba.

02:42:57.000 And it looks like there's triangles and everything else there.

02:43:01.000 And I'm like, from the moment that thing came out, I've never heard anybody else say, we've been there.

02:43:08.000 We've checked it out.

02:43:10.000 We've verified it.

02:43:11.000 It's there.

02:43:12.000 Let's send a dive team down. 1.00

02:43:14.000 The thing on the right there.

02:43:17.000 That's under the water?

02:43:19.000 That's supposedly 13 miles off the coast of Cuba.

02:43:22.000 Well, that's what we want to know.

02:43:24.000 We want to verify that.

02:43:25.000 That's crazy.

02:43:27.000 Whatever that is.

02:43:28.000 Where's the National Geographic documentary on that?

02:43:31.000 Wait a minute.

02:43:32.000 Is that for real?

02:43:33.000 Why have I never even seen that before?

02:43:35.000 All the other ones I'm thinking are fake, but this one up top right there where the thing is.

02:43:40.000 Click on that, Jamie.

02:43:41.000 Ancient origins.

02:43:43.000 Is it a crackpot site?

02:43:45.000 No, it just doesn't give the vibes of a place to start looking for relevant information.

02:43:50.000 Right.

02:43:50.000 That's a good way to put it, Jamie!

02:43:52.000 There's no vibes.

02:43:53.000 Bad vibes, man!

02:43:55.000 There was some people doing something, coming across the water, and they saw it.

02:44:00.000 So could it be that the Caribbean...

02:44:03.000 We analyzed this one.

02:44:04.000 Yeah, the Caribbean's hot, and there's something out there, you know?

02:44:10.000 It eventually goes in the water.

02:44:12.000 Yeah.

02:44:12.000 It's very weird.

02:44:14.000 Even this one, we've looked at it.

02:44:17.000 We argued over this for months.

02:44:18.000 How fast is this thing supposedly going?

02:44:20.000 It's not going that fast.

02:44:23.000 It's kind of quick like a Learjet would.

02:44:27.000 But it just went right in the water.

02:44:30.000 The two things that stick out about this.

02:44:32.000 That's what's nuts is it goes in the water.

02:44:33.000 It does.

02:44:34.000 There's no rooster tail.

02:44:34.000 It's going fast in the water.

02:44:36.000 Yeah, there's no rooster tail that comes off it.

02:44:38.000 And the other thing is, at one point near the end, it actually looks like it splits in two.

02:44:43.000 There's, like, one's a holograph and one's...

02:44:45.000 Right, and now there's some other imagery guy that's saying, oh, it didn't actually go in the water.

02:44:49.000 It's just an artifact.

02:44:50.000 Yeah, see, it splits up.

02:44:51.000 Yeah, there you go.

02:44:52.000 See, that's the part that you can't...

02:44:53.000 And what are we seeing with the drone?

02:44:55.000 Some of these are splitting, right?

02:44:56.000 Yes.

02:44:58.000 And these are the ones that I find very curious because those are the ones that get sent, and they're like...

02:45:03.000 It's an orb, but now there's three of them, you know?

02:45:05.000 How do I explain that?

02:45:07.000 Well, listen, I want to thank you guys for having the courage to even talk about this because I know it brings with it a lot of ridicule.

02:45:13.000 And for people like me that have no idea what's going on, it's very fascinating.

02:45:17.000 You know a lot more than most.

02:45:19.000 Well, I still don't know anything, though, so that's not good.

02:45:24.000 Because I know more than most.

02:45:25.000 Wait a minute, wait a minute.

02:45:26.000 I mean, all I know is what people have told me, so I don't know what's real and what's not real, you know?

02:45:31.000 True, yeah.

02:45:31.000 But I appreciate you guys very much, and thank you for being here.

02:45:34.000 If you've got social media, tell everybody where they can get a hold of you.

02:45:37.000 I'm on XSpace mainly.

02:45:39.000 Just my name, Jason T. Sands, is my moniker.

02:45:43.000 Logan?

02:45:44.000 I am at phenom.earth.

02:45:46.000 Just look it up and you'll see information about my app and a little bit about my background.

02:45:51.000 Okay.

02:45:52.000 And I've got a first-hand fund.

02:45:53.000 I'm trying to get further whistleblowers to come forward as well.

02:45:56.000 Okay.

02:45:57.000 James Fox did ask me to pass you something.

02:45:59.000 He said if you could put out a shout-out to anybody that...

02:46:05.000 He has information on the Varhenia stuff because he's found some new information and he needs to start corroborating.

02:46:11.000 Ah, okay.

02:46:12.000 Where did they get a hold of James?

02:46:14.000 He's James Fox director, I think, on Instagram.

02:46:16.000 I believe so.

02:46:17.000 And his ex-space is also a good way.

02:46:19.000 Okay.

02:46:19.000 All right.

02:46:20.000 Beautiful.

02:46:20.000 Well, thank you, gentlemen.

02:46:21.000 Appreciate it.

02:46:21.000 Thanks for being here.

02:46:22.000 It was very fun.

02:46:22.000 Thank you, Joe.

02:46:23.000 Very good to meet you.

02:46:24.000 All right.

The Joe Rogan Experience - January 29, 2025

Joe Rogan Experience #2264 - Lenval Logan & Jason Sands

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