00:00:24.000Why does it give you vitamin D if it's bad for you?
00:00:27.000Why do people get skin cancer if it's good for you?
00:00:30.000Yeah, it's super complicated, and the messaging has not.
00:00:34.000Sort of admitted that, and that was, yeah, a big impetus for the book.
00:00:37.000When, what was your opinion of sun exposure before you started writing this?
00:00:43.000So I had, you know, I had inherited the conventional wisdom from the institutions that it was really bad.
00:00:50.000At the same time, I will admit that my instincts were that maybe it wasn't as bad as they were leading me to believe, because whenever I was in the sun, I felt good.
00:01:37.000So, you had this idea that Sun exposure is probably giving people cancer, and sunscreen is good.
00:01:44.000You need to wear sunscreen, stay out of the sun.
00:01:47.000So, when you started going into the research, what made you shift your opinion?
00:01:52.000So, it really started for me like seven or eight years ago.
00:01:54.000I was on this science journalism fellowship, so I was just doing research.
00:01:59.000And some of those studies hit the one about opiate release in the brain, and other studies showing that when light hits skin, cognition actually improves.
00:02:09.000Like, your metabolism cranks up a little bit.
00:02:13.000When the body feels sunlight coming in.
00:03:49.000So, ultraviolet light, which is the most energy intense part of the solar spectrum, when those photons of light hit your skin, they go inside, right?
00:03:59.000We absorb all wavelengths of light to a greater or lesser degree.
00:04:04.000And that super high energy ultraviolet light, if it hits a DNA molecule, it can mess up the DNA molecule.
00:04:11.000And then that can lead to mutations and skin cancer.
00:04:14.000Then it can also indirectly cause skin cancer by creating what are called reactive oxygen species, which are free radicals basically.
00:04:23.000So it energizes these atoms that start to steal electrons from other atoms.
00:04:30.000Causes a little chain reaction, which is what a free radical is.
00:04:33.000So, ultraviolet light can increase your free radicals and it can directly damage DNA.
00:04:40.000So, that's why it could cause skin cancer.
00:04:41.000So, it was basically that learning that one fact back in like the 40s and 50s that made scientists start to say, uh oh, light skin cancer, maybe we should think about how much sun we're getting.
00:04:54.000But this wasn't universally accepted, right?
00:05:54.000It was all vitamin D. At first, they thought maybe it was vitamin A, but it turned out that was how vitamin D was discovered some doctors figured out that.
00:07:05.000So then eventually they realized that.
00:07:10.000Light hitting cholesterol molecules in the skin actually converts the molecules to vitamin D.
00:07:18.000So, vitamin D is like downstream of cholesterol, but it takes that same ultraviolet light that can screw up your DNA.
00:07:25.000It actually breaks a bond in the cholesterol molecule, which allows it to give it some movement and it flips around into a new form that's vitamin D.
00:07:35.000So, once they figure that out, then they're like, sun's really good for you.
00:07:39.000So, we had this era in like the 20s, 30s, and into the 40s when everyone thought sun would cure everything.
00:08:02.000Like the instructors are in their underwear in the mountains outside in Switzerland teaching the kids, and everyone looks really healthy, right?
00:08:10.000So there's kind of like this idea that you couldn't get too much light.
00:08:14.000So people are literally burning themselves on purpose for health.
00:08:58.000Like, Skin type is kind of everything.
00:09:00.000People who have really dark skin basically don't get sun induced skin cancer, almost never.
00:09:06.000And the authorities don't tend to talk about that because they want things to be, they want to have like these one size fits all recommendations.
00:09:15.000But those recommendations to basically always avoid the sun are written for the super fair people, especially if you have red hair, orange freckles.
00:09:25.000Then you actually have a mutation in your melanin gene that makes you super susceptible to skin cancer from sunlight.
00:09:33.000So, if you've got that phenotype, lots of moles, red hair, freckles, you do have to be really careful.
00:10:17.000And I don't know what's going on there exactly.
00:10:20.000It seems like that peptide is maybe making you.
00:10:22.000There's things called photosensitizers that make your skin super sensitive, like you just absorb solar radiation really well then, but not necessarily in a good way.
00:10:34.000And that can make you make tons of melanin to try to compensate.
00:10:37.000So I wonder, that peptide might be triggering.
00:10:41.000Like melanin as a compensation mechanism for extra protection from sunlight, or maybe it's just making melanin happen like independently of sunlight.
00:10:58.000Melanotan, synthetic peptide analog of the naturally occurring hormone A melanocyte, stimulating hormone, stimulates the body's melanocytes to produce melanin, resulting in a dark tan.
00:11:31.000Notable risks include dermatological issues, rapid and uneven darkening of existing moles, the emergence of new moles, and hyperpigmentation.
00:11:40.000Concerns that could mask or accelerate the development of melanoma.
00:13:31.000Yeah, he just got darker and darker and darker.
00:13:34.000But I wonder if, like, if I understand that it's unregulated, but if it was regulated and this is something they're trying to work with right now with peptides and make them regular, see, that's the photo's dark though.
00:13:47.000I mean, that's like a shitty iPhone 1 camera.
00:14:25.000Is that available to someone who's pale?
00:14:28.000And if someone is pale, see if you can find an example of someone who's pale who took it.
00:14:36.000Because you would think, like, oh, well, maybe that, maybe just we need to do studies and figure out what the dosage is and figure out how to activate that aspect of it.
00:14:45.000Melanin clearly protects you from skin cancer.
00:14:48.000Like, if you have super dark skin, like, you know, African ancestry, you're blocking, like, your melanin is absorbing like 97, 98% of the UV rays.
00:15:17.000But I would just also, wouldn't, if you were trying to sell some of this stuff in maybe nefarious ways, this would be an easy one to market.
00:15:29.000Look, this is part of the unregulated market problem we don't know.
00:15:33.000And also, you know, you're getting 99% bro science on this stuff.
00:15:37.000You know, like, who screams bro science?
00:15:41.000It screams it from the top of the hills.
00:15:45.000What legitimate scientist is out there injecting himself with melanotan?
00:15:50.000But the other thing is, if you do it naturally, right, if you just get a little sun every day and slowly build up, you're not just making melanin, you're also increasing your body's damage repair system.
00:16:00.000Like you have all these, like nucleotide excision repair, things that fix your DNA and fix cells that have gotten screwed up.
00:16:21.000So all those things are going to cause your damage repair system to crank up and be ready.
00:16:26.000So you could probably want those to, like the melanin and the damage repair to, to like go up together.
00:16:33.000So you would want to, if, if, let's say studies were done, let's say we found what the effective and safe dose is and how to administer it, you would want to do it along with sun exposure slowly to try to ramp up your body's.
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00:26:03.000So it's when, it seems like when your skin is totally unprepared and you shock it with a massive dose that it's not ready for, then you're in trouble.
00:26:16.000Like, that's the kind of thing that triggers trouble.
00:26:18.000Was there any pushback on this research?
00:27:12.000So everyone thought, like back in the 80s, 90s, everyone started noticing, scientists started noticing that people who naturally had lower amounts of vitamin D in their blood had higher rates of all like the classic chronic diseases.
00:27:30.000So I started thinking okay, vitamin D, it's like a magic pill almost.
00:27:34.000It'll cure, it'll reduce everyone's risk of all these diseases if we raise their rates of D.
00:27:39.000So they started recommending vitamin D pills, which I think are still like the number one supplement in the world.
00:29:11.000Like, that's how the design's supposed to work.
00:29:13.000Perplexity says vitamin D helps your body absorb calcium, build strong bones and teeth, support muscles and nerves, plays a key role in immune function.
00:29:19.000It's best absorbed when taken with a meal or a snack that contains some fat and offered paired with calcium for bone health.
00:29:28.000So, please put in what are the benefits of vitamin D taken with K2 and magnesium?
00:29:56.000Taking vitamin D together with vitamin K2 and magnesium can make each of them work more effectively, especially for bones and heart, as long as the doses are appropriate for you.
00:30:05.000The trio mainly improves how your body handles calcium.
00:30:09.000D helps you absorb it, magnesium helps activate D, and K2 helps send calcium into bones instead of arteries.
00:30:18.000D increases calcium absorption from your gut and supports bone, muscle, and immune function.
00:30:24.000Magnesium required to activate vitamin D. Low magnesium can blunt vitamin D's effect and also directly support bone structure and many enzymes.
00:30:32.000K2 activates proteins that move calcium into bones and teeth and keep it out of the arteries and soft tissues, helping bone and cardiovascular health.
00:30:43.000Potential benefits of the combo better bone support, heart and artery protection, more efficient vitamin D use.
00:31:26.000Because I'd never heard that D on its own was not effective at all.
00:31:30.000I've just heard that it was minimally effective, that you had to take it with other.
00:31:34.000It seems like it only helps people who are really deficient.
00:31:38.000Like, if you're super low, like below, like, 16 nanograms per milliliter, then probably it's a good idea.
00:31:45.000But, like, for people who already had, like, at least 20 nanograms per milliliter, it didn't seem to have any of these benefits that they were seeing in people who naturally had high rates through sun exposure.
00:31:56.000It says yes, vitamin D on its own has several well proven health benefits, especially for bones, muscles, and immunity.
00:33:03.000So the hope was that raising everyone's D to those levels would.
00:33:08.000Would have the same effect, and it didn't.
00:33:10.000Like, the New England Journal of Medicine did a actually did an editorial in 2022 saying stop prescribing D, it doesn't work, which is sad.
00:33:21.000God, that seems incorrect, though, because if you're taking it with magnesium and K2, it seems that they do work synergistically, and there seems to be proven health benefits.
00:33:31.000That one of the problems I think is like I think people generally want to avoid recommending supplementation for some reason.
00:34:05.000I mean, it's so hard to take seriously a guy with a gut when, well, just he looked terrible.
00:34:11.000And he was telling me that I just need a healthy diet.
00:34:13.000And I'm like, okay, I do have a healthy diet, but also I feel different when I take vitamins, and my blood work reflects that.
00:34:22.000I noticed that when I started going to all the conferences of the Sun researchers, and they're all in the basements of hotels, and those guys all are as pacey as it gets.
00:34:36.000How strange is it that human beings, with all of our knowledge, with obviously there's much more to learn, we're still confused about how we interact with our environment?
00:35:09.000Like it seems like there's the sense in biology that light didn't matter.
00:35:13.000It's like just ephemeral, which, you know, the quantum physicist 100 years ago.
00:35:20.000Understood that light and matter are just like two halves of the same coin, right?
00:35:24.000And that light totally affects the behavior of molecules.
00:35:27.000We're made of molecules, light's gonna matter.
00:35:29.000So, I actually think that's where I eventually got to with the book.
00:35:32.000I was like, we need to think about our light diets and our lightscapes that we're surrounding ourselves with more seriously than we have.
00:35:40.000Well, it seems like your work is based entirely on the data.
00:35:44.000So, what did these dermatologists have to say about the data if they're denouncing you and they're saying that this guy should not be listened to, the things you're saying are dangerous?
00:36:46.000But they're all observational studies, right?
00:36:50.000You look at populations, you're like, oh, these people have more sun exposure, lower blood pressure, lower rates of cardiovascular disease.
00:36:56.000But then, you know, the other side will say, you know, correlation does not prove causation.
00:37:02.000Like, prove, show us that it's, you know, do your giant clinical study.
00:37:07.000Where you stick half the people in the sunlight and they live longer, which is not going to happen.
00:38:50.000You know, I mean, caffeine, I think it's caffeine, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's other stuff in coffee that's contributing because, you know, like tea doesn't seem to quite like deliver the goods like coffee does.
00:39:01.000But caffeine is actually, the plants are making it to kill bugs.
00:40:50.000And dermatologists are kind of positioned to be like the leaders on that stuff because, like, skin is the primary interface with light for our bodies.
00:41:00.000And, you know, they should be experts on all this.
00:41:03.000You know, red light therapy is a big thing now.
00:41:06.000And dermatologists are doing that, even though the evidence isn't great for that.
00:41:10.000But I think there's probably something there.
00:41:12.000But they should basically, I think they need to be thinking more about all these different wavelengths of light as healing modalities and how to work them into regular programs.
00:41:25.000I've talked about this before, so I apologize to anybody listening.
00:41:28.000But I've essentially completely stopped my macular degeneration with red light therapy.
00:43:51.000That these dermatologists aren't willing to say, maybe we're looking at just an insufficient amount of data, maybe we're looking at this wrong, maybe the whole thing is much more nuanced, and maybe there's benefits if it's done correctly.
00:44:05.000I just don't understand why they're not.
00:44:07.000If there's all this data, which clearly you show in your book that there's a tremendous amount of data, why?
00:44:13.000You know, like, so there's this saying attributed to Max Planck, who's this quantum physicist science advances one funeral at a time, right?
00:44:23.000I think we got to let the old guard die off a little bit, but I guarantee there's a young generation coming in who's going to be really interested in light and how they can use it.
00:44:33.000Well, I think there are so many conversations available online now from actual researchers and people that have put in the time and put in the work and explored things from this position that, like, hey, maybe the old guard are not correct.
00:44:47.000And the data seems to show that that's true.
00:44:51.000I mean, playing with light, it's super fun.
00:44:53.000So, like, this is a way you can make your.
00:44:57.000World a little bit richer is starting to think about this stuff.
00:45:00.000Well, it's also like, don't you want to be informed?
00:45:03.000And if we do understand that it has an effect on mitochondria and there is all this evidence that red light seems to have some benefits, I just don't understand how someone could be an expert in skin and ignore that.
00:45:17.000Well, I think that, and they won't object to the red.
00:45:19.000Some of them are using red light therapy because there's no risk of skin cancer from red.
00:45:23.000It's only the UV and maybe a little bit of the blue that contributes to skin cancer.
00:45:29.000So, it's the UV where they get a little wigged out.
00:46:05.000Yeah, we've had those discussions too with scientists that are super frustrated, especially when they try to get interdisciplinary groups together to study one particular thing and everyone's resisting because they have their own work that they're working on and they don't want to get involved.
00:46:18.000And it's just like, guys, this is what you're here for.
00:46:31.000And if you're out there relying on old, insufficient data, or you have this very small data set that shows that there's negative outcomes to sunlight, and so you just throw the baby out with the bathwater, like you're doing the whole field a massive disservice.
00:46:50.000And the other part of it is that science, it's sort of very self reinforcing.
00:46:56.000Like if you're a scientist, you want to do a study, you have to apply for a grant to get the money to do the study.
00:47:01.000There's generally a handful of entities that are like handing out the grant money, and it's the old guys waiting to die who are going to approve what they think is the truth.
00:47:12.000They're going to fund the study that fits with what they already know about the world.
00:47:16.000So it's this kind of crazy system where the only way you can get money to do a study is if you're already telling them what they know.
00:47:35.000It's a giant part of it because if they've based their entire career on telling you one thing that turns out to be incorrect, they're very reluctant to correct themselves.
00:47:43.000It's very rare to find the individual who's well known in the field and is eager to self correct, you know.
00:47:52.000So, have you had any conversations with any of these dermatologists?
00:48:10.000Well, and the one that really, that I think has got to change is the skin color question.
00:48:16.000Because Fine to go with the recommendations for avoiding sun for people with fair skin.
00:48:24.000But for people with dark skin who have almost no risk from sun induced skin cancer and can benefit hugely from things that will lower blood pressure and lower cardiovascular disease, it seems like you're not being fair to those people.
00:48:41.000Not only that, it makes you feel better, which is very important just for sanity.
00:49:19.000I stood outside, I closed my eyes, I like stretched my arms wide, like I was just taking it all in.
00:49:25.000And I called my friend Steve up and I said, Dude, because we were in the rain for like a week, I go, I'm in LA right now in the sun and it feels amazing.
00:49:33.000I never felt the sun like this before.
00:49:37.000It's just like my body was saying, You didn't get enough of this for a week.
00:49:42.000Now take it in and we're going to reward you with all these amazing endorphins and good feelings.
00:49:47.000Like if that was a drug, that drug that I took, like if depressed people, Could take whatever I felt when I was out in the sun after a week in the rain, they would take it every day.
00:52:14.000So, what we're referring to is there's a photo of this trucker, and the left side of his face from the sun coming in from the window looks like he's 20 years older on his left side than it is on his right side.
00:52:53.000Now, so this photo and that study got used to scare the shit out of a lot of people, try to keep them out of the sun.
00:53:00.000Especially people that are vain and don't want that fucked up, wrinkly face.
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00:54:15.000So, what they're showing back and forth is they're just taking the skin from the left side of the face and switching sides so you can see how much damage he's.
00:54:25.000Received on that side, the driver's side.
00:54:28.000And so there's a couple of interesting things there.
00:57:16.000No, it doesn't seem like the same person, but might be.
00:57:20.000It's hard to say because of different lighting.
00:57:22.000But so the thing is, those sunscreens that were acting kind of like window glass in the 70s and 80s and even into the 90s before we got the broad spectrum sunscreens, they're blocking the UVB, so you weren't going to ever burn.
00:57:36.000And that's what SPF actually measures is how many more times you can be out in the sun without burning.
00:59:32.000But they're about to get phased out anyway.
00:59:33.000Like, just as of a couple months ago, the government changed the rules and is going to let in, for the first time in 30 years, new ingredients, which they've been using in Europe and Asia and Australia for decades.
00:59:51.000And the sensory companies have been asking to use them and haven't been allowed to, but now they're finally going to get to use one of the main ones.
01:00:00.000So it's called like Bemotrizanol or something.
01:00:04.000And there's another one that you see in Europe called like Maxaril 400, but they're way better.
01:00:10.000Like, basically, U.S. sunscreens are a generation behind everyone else because in the U.S., sunscreens are regulated as over the counter drugs.
01:00:19.000Bemotrizanol, highly effective broad spectrum UV filtered blocks both UVA and UVB, approved by FDA as an over the counter sunscreen ingredient in June of 2026.
01:00:31.000Celebrated for being highly photo stable, doesn't break down the sun, transparent on the skin without leaving a white cast, and gentle on sensitive skin.
01:00:44.000So, this other stuff that has been in there, why didn't it get examined if Europe and Asia and all these other places were using these different safer versions?
01:00:55.000Yeah, they all bailed on it long ago because it was all we had.
01:01:54.000With the traditional sunscreen ingredients that we used to use, is there any negative health consequences of using them that they've shown?
01:02:01.000Is there any diseases that occur more readily or more frequently?
01:02:17.000That's one of the things they found after COVID, right?
01:02:21.000They used to think that it was the warming of the environment.
01:02:23.000This was one of the things that climate change people used to say.
01:02:26.000The climate change was destroying the coral reefs.
01:02:29.000And then it turns out, actually, it's all these people that have sunscreen all over their body and they jump in the ocean and they're essentially poisoning the reef.
01:02:37.000I mean, it's all of the above, I'm pretty sure.
01:02:39.000But yeah, the sunscreen at that kind of concentration, if you've got a bazillion snorkelers in the water, Can definitely mess up the car pretty badly.
01:02:48.000Wasn't there some sort of a study that examined what happened to the reef after COVID?
01:02:53.000There was one particular reef that was in a highly visited area where people would jump in.
01:03:01.000And they showed a massive increase in the reef after COVID.
01:03:24.000But it doesn't look like, I don't think it has much impact on us unless you're using a ton of it, which of course now some people are.
01:03:32.000So it's not great for you, but it's not the worst.
01:03:35.000Yeah, there's been a bunch of studies that just looked at lifespan, and sunscreen doesn't seem to have any impact whatsoever, like positive or negative on lifespan.
01:03:44.000So it just might have some sort of an impact on hormonal function?
01:03:53.000There's a guy named Graham Peasley at Notre Dame who.
01:03:58.000Found that many, many cosmetic products of all kinds are actually contaminated with forever chemicals.
01:04:09.000And even if they don't have it on the ingredients, like anything that's water resistant or super smooth is quite possibly going to have forever chemicals in it.
01:04:20.000And some of it is actually coming from the plastic containers because those get, they basically get.
01:04:28.000Like fluorinated with this, like fluorine gas before they get anything in them, which is supposed to make them like a little smoother, the inside of the containers.
01:04:38.000But it turns out that actually leaks forever chemicals into the product, whatever's in there.
01:05:52.000People don't think of the skin as an organ.
01:05:54.000And I was explaining to a friend of mine the other day, he was using hand wash, that fucking hand sanitizer stuff.
01:06:02.000And I'm like, man, I don't think that's good for you.
01:06:04.000I think if you want to wash your hands, you should just use soap and water.
01:06:08.000And then I read this article about it.
01:06:10.000Like, oh, yeah, that's a toxic chemical.
01:06:12.000Like, hand sanitizer, when you're using it every day, you're essentially exposing your skin, your organ, to this.
01:06:20.000Like, what exactly is in hand sanitizer, and is it bad for you?
01:06:26.000Because I remember this article, but I just went over the headline and briefly started reading it, and then I had to do something, and I put a bookmark to it that was going to go back to it later, and I never did.
01:08:24.000Skin biome is turning out to be really important.
01:08:26.000Like, there's, you know, they call it the gut skin axis, where your skin microbiome and your gut microbiome are like chatting all the time.
01:08:35.000And you can change the composition of your skin microbiome based on all kinds of stuff like products, sun exposure, you know, everything you do.
01:17:28.000So, skin cancer is a factor, but that sunlight is actually benefiting Australians more than it's hurting them compared to the UK.
01:17:38.000I wonder if that's a healthy user bias as well, because one of the things about Australia is a lot of outdoor activities, a lot of people are doing stuff outside.
01:17:51.000And actually, that's one thing I come.
01:17:53.000You know, come down to in the book is it's really hard to disentangle all of these factors, but what's really obvious is just outside good, too much inside bad.
01:18:05.000So, whatever, like, you don't even have to like break it down too much.
01:18:10.000More outside, covered up, whatever you want is probably going to be good for you.
01:18:13.000One of the things a friend of mine who's a doctor said that he, when he was working in New York City in the wintertime, he would find people with undetectable levels of vitamin D.
01:18:23.000And he said it was a particular problem with people with darker skin.
01:18:37.000Like, yeah, if you have dark skin, you need five to ten times as much sunlight to make the same amount of vitamin D.
01:18:46.000So, you're really, if you have really dark skin, you're kind of designed for a very bright, you know, tropical environment where you're outside all the time.
01:18:53.000Outside all the time, you can handle 12 hours a day of sunshine.
01:18:57.000And in fact, you're going to benefit from it.
01:18:59.000You get moved to a really dark environment, that's not going to be good for you.
01:19:04.000So, you probably need to compensate in other ways.
01:19:49.000And with skin tone, it's clearly like very, very specific reactions to that environment and trying to figure out what's best in each situation.
01:19:57.000But there's so much racial identity that's tied to these characteristics of your appearance and where your ancestors are from.
01:20:06.000And it's going to be very weird if all of a sudden you could, like, people get like dark, thick.
01:20:12.000Curly hair, and there used to be gingers.
01:20:16.000I wonder how people are going to react to that.
01:20:23.000Yeah, I just wonder how many people are going to be claiming cultural or racial appropriation with people just deciding to have a healthier skin tone that protects them from the sun more.
01:22:21.000But When your skin gets hit with sunlight, that melanin that's just been produced is at the bottom of the epidermis where the melanocytes are.
01:22:30.000So it has to migrate to the surface and then it kind of acts like little umbrellas.
01:22:35.000It'll cover the nucleus of the cell and protect it.
01:22:38.000So, you get these little umbrellas, a line of umbrellas on the very top of your epidermis, but it has to migrate up because of sunlight.
01:22:47.000If melanin is lower in your skin, then it's going to absorb all that radiation farther down, and actually, it can cause more free radicals deeper in the skin.
01:23:18.000So, this lady might be exacerbating the problem if she's just getting the melanin that way.
01:23:23.000So, yeah, I don't know because I don't know about this specifically, but you probably, yeah, you don't want to just be like messing around with melanin, like to the extent that she is.
01:25:09.000If you're like a full on ginger, like true redhead, then you have a type of melanin called theomelanin, not eumelanin, which is what everybody else has.
01:25:20.000And theomelanin just does not do a good job of absorbing sunlight.
01:28:41.000Up here, down there, you know, the stuff that happens during purity.
01:28:45.000So I didn't immediately notice that my hair had gotten much darker.
01:28:49.000It was actually other people asking me what the hell I had done to my hairline, you know.
01:28:54.000On this picture, it's probably much clearer.
01:28:57.000That's a picture of me and my brother.
01:28:59.000We have the same genetics in regards to skin color and the color of our hair.
01:29:03.000And as you can see, my hair is now completely different from his.
01:29:07.000We used to have the same skin and the same hair, especially the color.
01:29:11.000Now, this is only from using one vial of melanotan II in the Span of a year, even more than a year, and it was at low dosages.
01:29:20.000But with our genetics of big, tall, white ginger, Belgian gingers, it completely changed the color of my hair and my skin, and the effects were very strong.
01:29:32.000So the effects are permanent, so he still has dark hair.
01:29:35.000But what's interesting is that in the beginning, he had gray hair.
01:34:22.000Doesn't sound like other than dealing with boners, doesn't seem like there's any real problems.
01:34:28.000I keep going back to this you getting attacked thing, and I don't understand how someone could attack you with the data that you're showing because you're not making any dangerous or any claims or any.
01:34:46.000You're not advising people to do anything that's reckless.
01:34:50.000Yeah, no, I mean, I purposefully have.
01:35:11.000Unless you have really dark skin, then you can probably get away with a lot.
01:35:15.000So yeah, just a little bit of sun exposure doesn't seem like a crazy recommendation.
01:35:20.000But it's just because the messaging has been sort of so extreme and unyielding.
01:35:27.000Like they've worked for so hard to sort of scare people away from any sun exposure that I think backing that up a little bit is sort of uncomfortable, you know?
01:35:42.000I understand, but I mean, isn't history filled with new discoveries and changing courses?
01:35:50.000Yeah, and I think it'll change, but one funeral at a time.
01:35:57.000When you do this kind of work, have you discovered any other things that people thought were unhealthy that turned out to actually probably be good for you, at least if used correctly?
01:38:10.000And people can wrap their heads around that one because we now, I think a lot of people understand that low carb really works well for them.
01:38:16.000I mean, they completely flipped the food pyramid.
01:38:19.000Right, which was a beautiful thing to do.
01:38:34.000But also that all these healthy fats that you're getting from milk, that you're getting from eggs, eggs in particular, we've been told eggs are bad for you, the cholesterol in eggs.
01:39:16.000You get free food, you take care of them, you feed them, and they eat all the bugs in your yard and you get these delicious, healthy eggs from them.
01:40:19.000So it's like, yeah, you're getting these darker eggs because people like that, and the darker eggs come from turmeric, but still, you're getting turmeric then.
01:42:50.000I completely, I problem is, I own a comedy club and I was there a lot, and so everybody's like, Have a drink, have a drink, let's do shots.
01:42:58.000And then next thing you know, you look, I was in the gym the next day feeling like I got tired of doing that to myself, and so I said, I'm just gonna stop drinking.
01:43:06.000Not because I'm an alcoholic, it wasn't hard to stop, it was super easy.
01:43:09.000I just stopped, and then I started feeling way better.
01:43:11.000I was like, God, why was I drinking for so long?
01:43:14.000This is so bad, and then uh, I Out to dinner with my wife, had a margarita like eight months later.
01:45:04.000So they have wheat that hasn't been optimized to have a higher yield.
01:45:07.000So it doesn't have as much complex wheat glutens.
01:45:10.000And there's a lot of issues with our food, unfortunately.
01:45:14.000And if you eat American bread, you know, the bromine, all the different additives, all the shit that we put in our food, that's so disturbing.
01:46:35.000I've heard that, and this is a, I think, Controversial as well, but it's cigarettes taken along with olive oil, and that a lot of these people have high olive oil rich diets, and that cigarettes along with olive oil that the olive oil tends to balance out whatever damage that the cigarettes are doing.
01:46:59.000And it's going to be like everything is going to be something like that where it's bad in a certain context and then it seems to have been okay for people in a different context.
01:47:17.000I've, like, my first sort of big magazine story, Outside Magazine, sent me to the Amazon on this, like, crazy hunt to, like, with this German guy.
01:47:28.000It was basically Apocalypse Now with chocolate.
01:47:30.000This German guy was going upriver into the Amazon to try to find this wild cacao, like, to work with some of the indigenous groups to harvest wild cacao and make, like, the world's first wild chocolate.
01:47:46.000But yeah, I sort of fell in love with cacao on that trip.
01:47:51.000But it was like we landed, we took a small plane and we were going to land on this river and meet a canoe that was going to take us upriver to meet with these indigenous groups.
01:48:17.000And then these four guys with guns come out of this little cabin and were like, This is actually a landing strip that our Colombian boss owns, and we're guarding it for him.
01:48:30.000And what are you two white dudes doing here?
01:48:32.000So, all the cocaine traffic comes through this part of the Amazon.
01:48:37.000And we had just done what people actually have been killed for, which is if a couple of white guys drop in there, they assume you're DEA or something.
01:49:12.000Bolivia, which, you know, Bolivia, you think of like mountains, La Paz, but they have these lowlands, which are like straight up like tropical rainforest.
01:51:42.000And it's more bitter, less interesting, but way cheaper.
01:51:48.000So then there's this movement that started like 10, 15 years ago of people trying to go back to Latin America to find the like ancient heirloom varieties that had this great flavor and make like better chocolate than had ever been made before.
01:52:03.000Sort of the most ancient is the stuff in the Amazon, which is where cacao originated, still growing wild.
01:52:10.000So it's kind of cool if you can go back to the primordial days and make chocolate.
01:52:16.000I mean, the example of tomatoes is a perfect example because heirloom tomatoes are sensational.
01:55:43.000But I think we haven't figured out why.
01:55:45.000You're eating like a little living being.
01:55:47.000So I think there's some chi factor there where the reason people get so excited and feel so good when they eat oysters, it's not because of the nutrients.
01:55:57.000It's like there's something else that's in there.
01:58:11.000But I do love oysters, but I do get nervous when I eat them because every now and then you hear like Houston man dies from food poisoning from oysters.
01:58:29.000Or bacteria responsible for the contamination are highly contagious and can easily spread from person to person through poor hygiene or shared surfaces.
01:59:32.000So, good luck to all those haters shouting into the void.
01:59:37.000I've long suspected that sun exposure is probably good for you, and then it's really just a matter of how much and mitigating the damage that you could get if you get burnt.