In this episode, Dr. Dan and Aubrey talk about their first time doing cryotherapy in the sub zero temperatures, and how they feel about it. Also, the guys talk about what it's like to do 200 degrees below zero in a cryotherapy tank and how it affects your recovery. This episode is brought to you by Cryotherapy Thermoregasm, a Canadian company that specializes in cryotherapy and hypothermia treatment. They have their own brand of cryotherapy called Cryotherapy Plus, which is a full body cryotherapy treatment done in 20 below zero temperatures. They are one of the few places in the country that offer this type of treatment, and it's a great way to start the day. If you haven't done it, you should definitely check it out! If you don't have a car, you can get a car with a heated seatbelt to keep you warm in the car, and keep your head above the freezing temperatures. It's cheaper than a heated car with heated seats, but it's still better than no car. . Don't forget to like, subscribe, share, and tell a friend about this podcast and/or share it on your social media if you enjoyed this episode! It means we'll know who you're listening to the podcast and we'll be sure to send you more stuff like this in the future! ! Cheers! -The guys -Jon & Marcus Jon & Aubrey Dr. Evan Tim Dan Alyssa Joe Nick Chris Jack Jake Andrew Ben Josh Will Alex Ryan Sam Patrick Brandon Matthew Brett Chad Mike Adam Matt Zach Emily Emma Justin John Christian Julian Canfield Daniel Kevin James Brad Cassie Jordan Jared Michael Kieran And much more! Thank you so much for tuning in to this episode we hope you enjoy it! We really appreciate all the love and support we got a chance to do this one, it was so much love and respect and support you all the support we can't wait to do it like that much more than we do it in the coming episodes!
00:00:16.000It's because you're just going to talk.
00:00:18.000Be a big gong if you're going to have like a fucking Cirque du Soleil experience and a bunch of dudes come out flipping with fire and do fucking juggle flames.
00:01:15.000The difference being the other ones they pour, it's like nitrogen all over your skin, like a frozen nitrogen sort of thing, but you can't breathe it.
00:01:25.000But this, what they do is they freeze the air instead, and you go in there and it's just fucking ungodly, insanely cold, and you wear a mouth...
00:01:33.000Like a surgeon's mask over your face and earmuffs and gloves and those rubber...
00:01:39.000It's the only time we were allowed to wear rubber crocs, those croc-clog things and not feel like an asshole.
00:03:44.000Well, as a doctor, like, must have been interesting.
00:03:47.000Knowing the functions of the body intimately.
00:03:51.000Yeah, I'm always curious about health recovery, the crucible experience, putting ourselves in these really extreme situations.
00:04:00.000And then that last minute, the first one was pretty much a piece of cake.
00:04:04.000The second one, I was cold straight off.
00:04:07.000And in that last minute, I went in these involuntary shakes.
00:04:11.000And I'm watching my body just jump around like a little race car inside.
00:04:16.000I'm like, whew, maybe I can just work on tuning this down a little bit.
00:04:20.000And I'm like zenning, dropping, doing whatever Jimi Hendrix was playing in the background.
00:04:26.000And nothing was working and it was just like hyperdrive.
00:04:29.000So I'm just watching this thing going like trippy.
00:04:31.000So it was this, like, significant mind-body separation.
00:04:35.000I had no control over that experience.
00:04:38.000So as far as being put in the Crucible, like, this survival experience, like, when I came out, I definitely felt like I had crossed some kind of threshold of an experience that I wouldn't have had otherwise.
00:05:31.000But you know that feeling like you really shouldn't be warm when you get outside, because it's only like 70 degrees outside, but you're like, ah!
00:05:43.000We were discussing this about forcing the body to react to the sauna.
00:05:49.000Dr. Rhonda Patrick, who wrote that really fascinating paper on the effects of sauna...
00:05:56.000And she's a huge proponent of sauna, and the reaction that your body has to this extreme heat of the sauna, so your body compensates in some way for that, and then when it realizes it's just a temporary situation, you get the benefit of that compensation without actually being in some life-threatening position where your body has to,
00:06:17.000you know, fire up all these protection systems.
00:06:23.000You got creation of heat shock proteins, you got all of these biochemical processes going on, plus just that general thing that the body needs.
00:06:52.000Yeah, we're built to deal with whatever the fuck we have to deal with.
00:06:56.000And if you make your body deal with almost nothing, what you get is like a spoiled child that can't handle any sort of, you know, any negative or any conflict, any problems, anything that's offline where it requires character or resolve.
00:07:14.000Yeah, like you meet those people who grew up in the wilderness and they're like, They can eat more foods than you can.
00:07:24.000Like my friend Bodie who grew up in New Hampshire.
00:07:27.000It's like what he can put his body through from just growing up on a farm with no running water and hardly any electricity and just kind of cruising around from a young age, climbing mountains and skiing down even when he was freezing.
00:07:40.000He can deal with shit in a different way than someone who's just been...
00:07:49.000It's like a different level of savagery that has actually allowed him to train harder for his sport and be better because his body was used to dealing with tough shit from an early age.
00:07:59.000Yeah, it's fascinating because people, and I'm guilty of it, we want to protect our children from adversity.
00:08:07.000But adversity is what builds character.
00:08:09.000So it's like you want your kids to be safe.
00:08:29.000Well, the people that can't handle it, the ones that'll fall apart, they're the ones that their mom wiped their ass until they're 11 years old.
00:08:49.000It's beautiful and I'd love it, but it's not easy and it was never intended to be easy.
00:08:54.000And so we're designed to have to learn from these and get stronger because of our environment.
00:08:59.000We separate ourselves from the environment.
00:09:01.000The human ceases to be what it was originally designed to be, which is a being that reacts to the pressures of its environment.
00:09:07.000You isolate it and then we don't have that resistance anymore and we turn out like a blob.
00:09:12.000Well, there was a study that I tweeted yesterday about that, sort of in direct relation to that, about young men today that are addicted to pornography and video games, and they're going through this masculinity crisis.
00:09:26.000So it's this psychological breakdown of young men in our society today because they're not going through any real adversity.
00:09:34.000They're not going through any real rites of passage, pushing themselves physically.
00:09:39.000No, what they're doing is they're just beating off and playing video games.
00:09:43.000It's like this weird world that they live in where they're kind of like their symbiotic relationship with a couch and an Xbox controller.
00:10:01.000I haven't seen the study you're talking about, but that makes perfect sense.
00:10:04.000We're having like two divergent populations where some people are really seeking these kinds of experiences where they're able to stress their system, grow their potential, become their best selves.
00:10:16.000And you have other people that, because they don't have a connection to what's happening, they don't have a connection to purpose, passion, drive, inspiration.
00:11:07.000They get badass shit, like the equivalent of rims that spin, you know, on their weapons.
00:11:11.000And then they get level 40, 50, 60. And then you're really swinging a big dick out there, you know, when you're that big.
00:11:17.000So it's this seductive thing of they do feel like they're improving, but they're not actually.
00:11:23.000Yeah, how do you actualize that in the world?
00:11:25.000Well, is that the case, or are we in some sort of a transitionary period between a physical, biological, carbon-based cellular life and a digital life?
00:11:37.000Because if we really do transition to a digital life, which is a lot of speculation from legitimate scientists and people that are looking at the curve of learning and the exponential growth of technology, and they're like, look, this is inevitable.
00:11:51.000We're not going to be physical beings for that much longer.
00:11:54.000It's pretty obvious that we're going to eventually incorporate with machines to the point where the concept of living in a virtual world, a world where you can just put on these headsets and go into the world of Avatar and live out this intense,
00:12:10.000unbelievably rich existence inside this artificially created world, It's going to be so much more appealing and attractive.
00:12:18.000I think that's what we're seeing with these kids.
00:12:21.000When they're playing Call of Duty or any of these other games, it's so much better than going out and being a regular teenager with no job prospects, no skills, nothing unique about you, nothing particularly challenging in your life other than feeding yourself and getting to bed on time.
00:12:44.000You know, it's just nothing there, but they can go into this world, and there's fucking bullets flying overhead, and they're all talking on headsets and trying to set up an ambush to go get the enemy, and da-da-da-da-da-da-da, and helicopters are flying overhead, and that's way more exciting.
00:13:16.000But once it becomes something that's indistinguishable, once it's something that's going on inside your head, I mean, how many years are we really away from something where you put it on And it has electrodes that react with various areas in your brain where they can stimulate these areas and reproduce insane visual effects.
00:15:30.000When you get total control of something, it becomes boring.
00:15:33.000And so then you would want to naturally add in elements of risk, add in elements of uncertainty, because then it becomes exciting again.
00:15:42.000So actually, probably the progression will be, if you listen to that Alan Watts Inception video, the progression will be You go and you do that.
00:16:13.000Or we find out that life itself is actually just a virtual reality and that we've all this time been living in this incredibly realistic simulation.
00:16:29.000I mean, they set up all the preposterous aspects that make you question its reality.
00:16:34.000Like the Chris Christie thing we were talking about today was in the news that he spent some fucking ungodly amount of money.
00:16:42.000You know, if you don't know who Chris Christie is, he's the governor of New Jersey.
00:16:46.000He's an enormously, morbidly overweight gentleman who wants to run for president and also wants to make sure that people don't smoke marijuana.
00:17:38.000You know, one thing that they will never get right in one of these experiences, though, is like the true mystical experience.
00:17:45.000You know, in this virtual reality world, going to sit and drink ayahuasca virtually is not going to be the same as sitting down, hearing the Icaros, the sound of the jungle, and drinking that in reality.
00:19:12.000It's not like picking up an astrology book where it's going to work for most people or whatever.
00:19:18.000It's This is specific information for you that comes out.
00:19:22.000And I think that true connection with whatever that other place in your brain is or that other world, the astral world, whatever you want to call it, your vocabulary permits, that true access allows this kind of really unique message to come through that's just tailored for you and that's why it's so effective.
00:19:42.000Yeah, that is one of the weird and unique aspects of psychedelic experiences.
00:19:46.000It's almost like what you need at that time finds you.
00:19:51.000It's almost like there's an assessment of your overall predicament and go, oh, look, why do these things keep going on, Jim?
00:20:00.000I lost the connection to the HDMI to show you guys the stuff.
00:20:39.000Is that what you think it makes psychedelic research so appealing is that it's tailoring like dialing in a specific solution for each individual from a psychiatric standpoint, Dan?
00:20:50.000Yeah, I think there are a couple of different opportunities that it presents which is bringing up to the surface that very thing that we're ready to receive that we didn't realize was right there.
00:21:00.000And it also helps to rewrite the neurochemistry and reboot the neuroendocrine system to let you actualize it and move it forward into your life.
00:21:09.000So the psychedelics right now, the whole resurgence of psychedelic research is showing how well they work for the very aspects that psychiatry is really weak at.
00:21:22.000Addiction recovery, treatment resistant depression, chronic severe PTSD, end of life transition issues.
00:21:31.000All the areas that psychiatry is really stuck at, the psychedelics are very good at.
00:21:39.000And there's a wide breadth of the psychedelics that are available.
00:21:43.000And then we get really crafty in being able to recognize because of what this person is going through, what might be the best psychedelic to use for them in the right setting.
00:21:53.000So in the right setting, you get this opportunity to really actualize your best self.
00:21:58.000To realize what you weren't looking at, to face your shit, to work through that, and then to see the path of becoming even better.
00:22:07.000The drug addiction one is a really good point.
00:22:09.000The end-of-life transition is another really good point.
00:22:12.000And PTSD, even, you know, traumatic stress, I mean, it could be as horrific as war or as seemingly simple but unbelievably traumatic as a breakup.
00:22:27.000You know, there's some people that go through breakups and they think their fucking life is over.
00:23:00.000We were talking just the other day about the prevalence of Of suicide in young teenage girls in certain communities, particularly in native cultures.
00:23:12.000And there's studies that show that young adolescents, both girls and boys, but particularly with girls, they have a significant resolution of anxiety that's related to how they view themselves going through only one session of ayahuasca.
00:23:34.000So that's really, we're talking about like rites of passage, those ceremonies, those experiences really help people mature, self-actualize, be able to recognize who they really are and not have so much that's invested in.
00:23:47.000And who they think they need to be and these relationships that when they fall away, like this crazy thing that happens with internet bullying online, and it just really shatters these young people's self-esteem, and they end up checking out.
00:25:29.000We've been so effective at taking away all of the really challenging things and expecting not to have challenging things that I think it's going to take intention to intentionally put those back through rituals, through rites of passage, through these terrifying, scary ordeals that you have to go through.
00:25:45.000In order to get used to that paradigm again.
00:25:48.000I think we're getting to the point now where we're so good at removing the environmental ones, we're going to have to go with intention to put them back.
00:25:56.000And even back in scary times, they had intentions to do that.
00:25:59.000You go to some tribes who live in the jungle, which is a hard-ass place to live, and they're still sticking their hands in oven mitts of bullet ants.
00:26:07.000They're still Fashioning bungee cords out of vines and moldy ropes and stuff and jumping off towers to show their fearlessness.
00:26:17.000And even in our day, we have everything easy, so we have nothing environmental, and we're not doing anything else intentional.
00:26:23.000Yeah, and this is definitely not to imply that bullying is in any way good.
00:28:12.000Obviously, bullying is this really insidious kind of, you know, psychological attack that's really hard to see and really hard to look at as a stress like that.
00:28:22.000But yeah, I mean, building those things in your life.
00:28:51.000And you're finding a weakness or finding a deficit in their strength and attacking it.
00:28:57.000Well, you're doing it to yourself, you know, in the truth, you know, as the platinum rule would say, you're really doing it to you living a different life.
00:29:05.000And that's really difficult for the higher self, you know, the conscious self to deal with because you're hurting yourself in a very real way.
00:29:15.000You don't appreciate who you are because you don't respect it.
00:29:18.000Because you know you're kind of a bitch.
00:29:20.000Fucking with people that don't deserve it.
00:29:22.000But you know, it's a weird instinct that children have.
00:29:26.000Because having children and seeing it on the playground, watching little boys push other little boys for no reason, watching how it goes down.
00:30:33.000And that's exactly why humans have had these rituals before, you know, these different rites of passage.
00:30:38.000Will this person buckle under pressure?
00:30:41.000You know, will they fold when it comes to...
00:30:43.000It's like that person you walk up to on a water slide and you wait in line for a goddamn hour with them and then they get to the top of the water slide.
00:31:12.000And I think that's what we got to bring back, but we can't do it in these, like, anonymous Facebook bullying, cyber.
00:31:21.000It's too complicated a stress for the human brain to handle because we're not equipped evolutionarily to handle that kind of stress.
00:31:29.000Like, I think we should call each other to courage and call each other To face these different things, but not in that way, not in a mean way, not in a way like, come on, let's go, let's see what we can do together here.
00:31:44.000Yeah, the other thing about the idea of the cyber world, the idea of virtual worlds, is that the people that are playing, you know, fill in the blank, Halo, or any of these crazy games, getting really good at it, they're not experiencing the character development that someone would have if they got really good at,
00:32:07.000Or, you know, fill in the blank, something incredibly difficult, you know, where you see, like, when you meet someone who's really, truly great at something, anything where they put in an incredible amount of hard work and out of that hard work has emerged as a truly unique talent that's something fascinating to watch.
00:32:26.000Like, there's a quality that those people have that you don't get from cyber game players.
00:32:32.000and that's weird I wonder what that is because it's obviously difficult to get really good at playing a video game it's obviously there's something rewarding about it because they love to do it they love to kick other people's asses in those video games but I don't necessarily think it translates into that character development in the real world like as in a personality sense and in fact There's like a lot,
00:32:59.000I mean, when you talk about like people that are like cyber game players, one of the big characterizations, whether it's fair or not, is that they're really awkward dorks, right?
00:33:12.000Like that's the number one way you think of, like someone who plays video games all day, oh Jesus Christ, what's this guy like to hang out with when, you know, get him outside?
00:33:21.000And you're seeing a different type of player now.
00:33:25.000I know some people we've worked with, they'll do yoga and they'll try to focus on that.
00:33:31.000So you're starting to see a different type of that.
00:33:32.000But I do agree for sure with your initial point.
00:33:35.000And I think the idea is that real consciousness, its home is in the body.
00:33:41.000People think of mind and consciousness and body as all separate.
00:33:44.000Really, when you're truly conscious, it's when everything is...
00:33:50.000It's a true presence of being, where you're physically embodying your consciousness.
00:33:55.000And when you're just using your mind and your thumbs, it's almost like you're separating yourself from a key element of consciousness, which is embodied consciousness.
00:34:04.000So you're working on a level of mastery that's really very narrow.
00:34:14.000What it must be is like you're neglecting your body because you're sitting on a couch all day and your fucking back is hunched at the end of the day.
00:34:22.000I mean, how many video game players have fucking horrible backs?
00:34:39.000I mean, I know you worked with people that have addictions.
00:34:42.000Have you ever worked with people that have non-chemical addictions or non-chemical in the traditional sense, like video game addictions or gambling addictions?
00:35:09.000And that pathway is set up for an addictive profile.
00:35:12.000It doesn't matter what the addiction is, it's the same chemical pathway.
00:35:17.000And that addiction could be heroin, methamphetamine, cocaine, it could be work, sex, video games, whatever.
00:35:26.000It's that same chemical pathway that's also associated with what Csikszentmihalyi called flow states.
00:35:33.000It's that dopamine, neurochemical pathway.
00:35:36.000So when you channel that focus, that prime directive into a productive way, that can elucidate the flow state and that flow states essentially like your prime focus on the current experience to the exclusion of everything else.
00:35:53.000That's just like any kind of addiction that the mind can't rewrite.
00:36:12.000So it's doing something over and over and over even though you know that there's a bad consequence.
00:36:16.000So is an addiction essentially almost like a side effect of the process that's involved in us getting good at something?
00:36:26.000Because I've always found that in getting anything that I become obsessed with, anything that I really start wanting to get good at, it starts to permeate my life, oftentimes in an uncomfortable way, where it's going on.
00:36:42.000Eddie Bravo and I used to talk about this all the time with Jiu Jitsu.
00:36:46.000That you would have like This underlying operating system that was always doing jujitsu.
00:36:53.000That you would be, if you're in a conversation with somebody and they wanted to talk to you about, well, what the Democrats got to do is, you know, highlight the fact that we've created all these new jobs.
00:37:02.000You just start thinking about choking people.
00:37:04.000It's always just thinking, like, this is boring as fuck.
00:37:06.000I'm going to concentrate on positions in my head.
00:40:35.000And that's the biggest thing for people going through heroin on their own is to kick it because they're just deathly afraid of the withdrawal that's going to come.
00:40:43.000So they just keep getting stuck in the cycle.
00:40:45.000So if you can offer them something held in the right set and setting that gives them the opportunity to rewrite it with very little discomfort.
00:41:45.000Just 12 hours where it feels like you're in a high-voltage shed, and you're puking, and you're spinning, and there's a 1,000-pound pancake on you, and you're just hoping that this misery will end.
00:41:55.000Please, what do I have to do in my life that I never have to do iboga again?
00:42:00.000But it's also, you're examining, like, every aspect of iboga.
00:42:04.000So for me, going through iboga, I didn't have a drug addiction.
00:42:09.000I wanted to know the psychospiritual implications, and I also was trying it on because clients that I kept interfacing with, I would do a lot of one-on-one work with clients, and I knew Iboga or Ibogaine was the right direction for them, and they would ask me, what's the experience like?
00:42:24.000And as opposed to me saying, well, I've heard it's like X, Y, and Z, I need to actually go in the lab, try it on for size so I can speak about it first-person perspective.
00:42:33.000So I did Iboga twice, and then when I came on board with Crossroads, they worked with Ibogaine, same kind of thing.
00:42:39.000I needed to experience what it was like.
00:42:41.000For me, actually, Ibogaine was more intense than Iboga, and for most people, it's the other way around.
00:42:47.000But suffice it to say, when you know that you're...
00:42:51.000Most people going through heroin or some kind of really bad addiction, they're at a crossroads.
00:42:58.000They're at a crossroads where they have hit rock bottom.
00:43:02.000And they know they're at that level of desperation that if they don't make a significant shift, then something really bad is going to happen, like they're going to die.
00:43:12.000They're going to completely annihilate their entire family system, whatever.
00:43:17.000So they're coming with some motivation.
00:43:19.000So when you let them know that, yeah, the experience can be potentially difficult and At Crossroads, it's the safest Ibogaine experience that you can have anywhere because it's in a hospital clinical environment.
00:43:32.000It's in Tijuana right next to Angeles Hospital.
00:43:34.000There's doctors on call right next door.
00:43:38.000You're wearing a Holter monitor, 24-hour EKG monitor because people do die with Iboga and Ibogaine.
00:43:46.000And usually it's because they weren't truthful and that they were using Something long-acting like Suboxone or Methadone when they came in, and you cannot be on a long-acting opiate when you take Iboga.
00:43:59.000You can be on a short-acting, and then when that washes out, you start the Iboga or Ibogaine.
00:44:04.000And if everything's clean on board, like they're not taking other drugs, not only in their psychiatric medications, the only other problem that people typically run into, which isn't very common, but it has happened, Maybe 1% of the time, people will have an arrhythmia or a heartbeat irregularity because it drops your blood pressure and it drops your heart rate.
00:44:26.000And if you're not wearing a monitor and you're not really paying attention to what happens, then you can get in some trouble there.
00:44:33.000So if you have a crash cart on site, it's a fairly clinical setting, then all those bases are covered.
00:44:37.000So in that setting, it's extraordinarily safe.
00:44:41.000And you offer the people opportunity to come through.
00:44:44.000So when you're looking at it from a Western addiction medicine perspective, what are the numbers people go in?
00:44:50.000What are the numbers of success rate people coming through an average rehabilitation setting like up in Malibu?
00:44:58.000Those numbers are like maybe 15% plus or minus depending on the setting.
00:45:02.00015% versus 60, 65, 70% depending on the setting with Ibogra Ibogaine.
00:45:10.000And the difference being many factors.
00:45:14.000The difference being that there's actually some physiological changes that this drug is doing to your body, and then also one inescapable fact of it is that these psychedelic experiences, pretty much all of them, have that insane transcendent moment where you are Whatever the world that you were living in before you took that drug you were kind of basing your own experiences like here's the range Here's a spectrum of experiences in life from my dog died to I got laid
00:45:48.000This is the awful and then you part the doors To the psychedelic experience and it's just like you stepped outside like you thought the roof Was the ceiling of the universe you stepped outside and realize oh my god, it's infinite You know, it's like whoa So like the perspective change because the experience is so intense and so broad and so literally all-encompassing So you got those two things going on you've got the physiological change that something like Ibogaine can do and And
00:46:18.000then you've got the actual experience itself, which is so transcendent, and none of those things are available in Malibu.
00:46:35.000I was just checking out different people's feeds and it was one from a rehab place, like a house where these guys are all living together in rehabilitation.
00:46:44.000And I'm like, this is like a weird social support system that they're trying to...
00:46:49.000And they were talking about how great it is to not be drinking and, you know, I'm getting my life in order.
00:46:53.000And I'm like, this is like a very small shift that they're doing.
00:46:58.000They try to cling on to this small shift and hang on and...
00:47:03.000Blow fire, blow smoke, blow air on the fire, try to get those embers to become a flame.
00:47:14.000The thing about a boga, all these psychedelic experiences, and I've done many of a variety of different durations, from very short, couple minutes, to very long, like a boga.
00:47:25.000Particularly with the plant medicines, it seems to know how long it has.
00:47:30.000Like the half-life of the medicine seems to be something that's already calculated in your brain, and so you get messages depending on how long you have.
00:47:38.000A lot of times it's like a remarkable fact that I've noticed.
00:47:42.000But with a boga, you have so much time that a boga just really takes its time and relentlessly showing you all of the steps that you took to lead you to different situations that you're not happy with.
00:47:55.000I mean, I remember when I did it the last time, it took me like, it spent about five hours showing me the hypothetical possible scenarios that I could go with my life that wouldn't be beneficial, that would be harmful to the world.
00:48:09.000And it was like five hours of that, whereas like with ayahuasca, you'll get maybe, you know, half an hour of that, and then I'll be like, okay, but that's not reality.
00:48:38.000And I'd be like, nope, not this way, because of this.
00:48:40.000And it would show me the reasons why my logic was flawed.
00:48:44.000And then I just come back again, try another way.
00:48:46.000It's like, nope, not that way because of this.
00:48:48.000You see, you forgot point A, blah, blah, blah.
00:48:49.000And it's just such a stern taskmaster when it comes to that.
00:48:53.000And it has seemingly infinite amount of time to just go through all of your rationalizations, all your justifications, and be like, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit.
00:49:01.000Is it showing it to you in a visual sense?
00:49:04.000Iboga is a funny one because it's not as visual as the other ones.
00:49:08.000Like the DMT experience is particularly visual.
00:49:14.000And when a vision needs to, at least for me, when a vision needed to have a visual explanation, like it needed a visual cue, it would come.
00:49:22.000But a lot of times it's just directly thought-based, almost like I was talking to a much smarter version of myself.
00:49:30.000You know, it was a really interesting way that it interacts because the visions were pretty mild.
00:49:35.000I would think the iboga in a sensory deprivation tank would be the ultimate.
00:49:40.000Well, that might be a one to work up to.
00:49:45.000And prior to that, because like oftentimes people ask me the question like, okay, I'm ready to have an experience.
00:49:52.000So step number one is float, and just float by yourself.
00:49:55.000Because a lot of people haven't even floated yet and really looked at their stuff because, interestingly enough, it starts to promote our own DMT-like experience.
00:50:03.000We see what's in the default mode network now comes online.
00:50:06.000We're able to look at more introspective analysis and see what was just behind the curtain that we didn't notice was there, and now that comes onto the stage.
00:50:14.000We can wrestle with that, we can be with that, see what comes up, make sure that we're okay with the unknown, that kind of sense of dissolving back into the void.
00:50:22.000And then you can start stacking therapies, like doing something in the tank.
00:50:27.000And so your more entry-level psychedelics would be like MDMA, DMT... Edible weed...
00:50:40.000And then beyond that, then you get into psilocybin, I would put in that entry level point.
00:50:44.000And then beyond that, you get into the second level, and that's more like the peyote, huachuma, San Pedro, ayahuasca, iboga.
00:50:52.000And so it's nice to be able to know where people can start, how to progress them through.
00:50:57.000That's a lot of the psychedelic research that's happening now is the correct screening to know who the experience is good for, who it's not good for.
00:51:05.000People with a history of psychosis and mania, not good for.
00:51:09.000People currently on psychiatric medications, not good for.
00:51:12.000Because most of the medicines and psychiatric medications don't work well together and there's an energetic clash and you can have a real bad trip.
00:51:20.000Where you could have physiologically dangerous things happen.
00:51:24.000So, when we know, you know, we've got this whole arsenal to work with, and then it becomes alchemy knowing which medicine to use at which person at which time, and in which sequence, which order.
00:51:38.000If your target symptoms are anxiety associated with chronic pain, well great, then it might be something like Iboga is helpful, because Iboga is really helpful for pain.
00:51:49.000Because it's associated with that opiate pathway.
00:51:53.000And also, let's prep with flotation and let's integrate with flotation.
00:51:58.000Because flotation itself is also very good for pain.
00:52:06.000And I've seen clients and I've had clients that have...
00:52:08.000That have done a series of seven to ten floats and all of a sudden now they're off of all their opiates before with resolution of their underlying symptoms, whether it's PTSD, anxiety, insomnia.
00:52:19.000And then they do maintenance floats after that.
00:52:22.000So two to three a week for like three or four weeks and then you do booster floats, like one a month.
00:52:28.000And some of the psychedelics are kind of similar.
00:52:30.000When you go through a big experience, you have a long period of integration, and then maybe you do a booster shot.
00:52:36.000Now, the whole psychedelic experience here in the States is under a renaissance.
00:53:23.00083% success rate for curing chronic severe PTSD after only two to three sessions of MDMA-supported psychotherapy.
00:53:32.000So it's not just taking a drug and having your trip and all of a sudden now you come out the other side resolved.
00:53:37.000No, it's like actually working with a trauma-trained therapist in a really supportive, safe environment to work through that because MDMA is so good at the de-armoring That happens when people are traumatized.
00:53:51.000And the data is just so iboga with addictions and psilocybin even with addictions.
00:54:00.000There's just a recent pilot study that came out.
00:54:02.00080% of people with chronic addiction to tobacco Resolved after one time use of psilocybin.
00:54:40.000I just don't understand how we are here in this day and age with the thousands of years of people who have been writing books.
00:54:51.000It's just amazing to me that they've been able to suppress some of the most beautiful aspects of being a human being for so long.
00:54:59.000And it seems like during our lifetime, all this stuff is emerging like some sort of a strange flower that refused to be stuffed under the dirt.
00:55:07.000It's just the pop, you know, the buds are just popping through the surface of the ground.
00:55:12.000No matter how much pressure was put on it, dropping, you know, rocks on it and stacking up shit and trying to hold it down with lies and nonsense and pharmaceutical drugs and lobbyists and all the pressure that they put to keep this stuff down.
00:55:29.000And then Johns Hopkins study comes out, and it's like, well, you can't really refute.
00:55:35.000I mean, these are like some of the best minds in the world when it comes to these subjects.
00:55:39.000And then all the work that MAPS has done.
00:56:28.000You've got to talk to some fucking guy who runs a church and maybe does good work and he wants 10% of your money and wants you to sing and talk about Jesus.
00:56:50.000I think they've started something in motion that now can't be stopped.
00:56:53.000What I think we're going to have to be careful of is, you know, with everything, there's a certain point where medicine becomes poison.
00:56:59.000And that happens with every single psychedelic, you know, where it crosses the threshold where it's no longer beneficial and it's dangerous, or the setting is wrong, or the conflict is wrong.
00:57:09.000And what's going to happen and what we need to be careful of is, That there will be these bad incidents that come out, just inevitably.
00:57:17.000You hear about some of them from these pretty shady centers down in South America where people die during ayahuasca.
00:57:24.000When that happens on U.S. soil, which inevitably it will, You know, there's going to be this backlash and they're going to make one final push to try and, you know, to try and stomp this out.
00:57:37.000And we just have to, you know, really adhere to truth and stay calm and try and put out as much good science as possible because that's going to be the last card that they can play.
00:58:09.000Doesn't make sense, but it just works that way.
00:58:12.000It doesn't mean we should pull all the shrimp from all the markets.
00:58:14.000It's just there's going to be negatives because we just have so much biodiversity.
00:58:19.000There's so much difference in all the aspects that you were talking about that could be problematic.
00:58:24.000People with psychosis, history of mental health issues and drugs that they've been taking for these mental health issues for long periods of time that have done All sorts of really weird things to brain chemistry that takes a long time to normalize from.
00:58:50.000Yeah, the consumer-driven movement has pushed it into the limelight, and you've had people that kept the torch, like Rick Doblin with maps.
00:58:57.000And the next evolution of that now With a few really different key organizations is to come up with a standard of a guideline for best practices.
00:59:08.000And that's not to say that everybody has to adhere, you know, rock solid to these practices.
00:59:13.000But generally, what are the guidelines for practices?
00:59:16.000You should be screening clients for these issues.
00:59:18.000And if anybody has these issues, then they shouldn't go into the experience.
00:59:22.000This should be the general setting of the right environment.
00:59:26.000And this should be the ethical altruistic intention that people are coming to that experience and facilitation that have.
00:59:36.000That they're not doing it for profit and they're not doing it as some charlatan, that they have a background, they have a pedigree.
00:59:51.000And do they have the ability to work as a spiritual EMT? Like if the shit goes down, do they know how to pull the ripcord?
00:59:59.000If somebody's going through the midst, you know, in the midst of some really bad experience, do they know how to talk them down, bring the medicine down, intervene in a way so that the experience doesn't itself become traumatizing?
01:00:42.000So there's a whole movement in a variety of addiction circles around moderation, even with alcohol.
01:00:50.000There's a movement in moderation where, like, you know, the sponsor or the person helping coach somebody going through sobriety will go to the bar and they'll have one drink and they'll talk about what it's like to have one drink and then they'll leave together after only having like one or two drinks.
01:01:04.000Without really reaching that point of significant detriment and be able to process that whole experience so that you're not trying to make this polarity statement like you went from this crazy addiction to now you can have anything.
01:01:19.000And so if you're defining success, As being completely abstinent, well then maybe you're actually not appreciating the benefit of successive steps along the way.
01:01:30.000Like if somebody has a heroin addiction and they're not taking care of their family and they can't hold a job, and they go through some kind of recovery program where now they're using something else as maybe a transition addiction, but they're holding a job now, they're better with their family and wife and kids.
01:01:46.000There's very significant milestones and markers to where they have improved their life.
01:01:52.000In my experience, that's success because you're moving towards ongoing improved benefit.
01:01:59.000I had Dr. Andrew Hill on the podcast who has a similar sort of a treatment approach.
01:02:05.000And one of the things that he does is they will go to a bar with a patient and have the patient have a drink and talk them through it and make sure that they are only having one drink and that they don't, you know...
01:02:18.000Yeah, because the goal should be normalcy, not this shaky dam that if it leaks, the whole thing floods.
01:03:09.000A weakness in a particular enzyme that breaks alcohol down, alcohol dehydrogenase, and actually turns alcohol into acetaldehyde and it becomes this really toxic substance.
01:03:19.000You have long-stream detriments and ramifications in neurochemical Complexity.
01:03:25.000So you have a physiologic predisposition towards alcohol being really bad for you.
01:03:31.000And then you have the addiction, neurochemistry itself, like we were talking about before.
01:03:35.000And then you have everything underneath that, which is the psycho-emotional, psycho-spiritual implications, like what is empty from that person's life that keeps them addicted to a substance that they're trying to fill a void or numb a pain.
01:03:48.000There's always these interplay of factors, and it's important to look at all of them.
01:03:53.000And so, whether it's alcohol or we were talking before about sugar, sugar is one of the most addictive substances and it's really difficult to get completely away from.
01:04:04.000You have to be really mindful about all the sugars that are added in fruit juice.
01:04:08.000Fruit juice seems healthy, yet when you look at the sugar load, it's massive.
01:04:13.000And my experience going with Ibogaine is that I didn't appreciate that I had this long-standing sugar addiction.
01:04:22.000And looking back, I've had that for a long time.
01:04:27.000And even looking back further, I know now where it came from because I just kind of like did this retrospective analysis.
01:04:33.000I was in and out of the hospital for the first two years because I had recurrent pneumonia.
01:04:38.000And in recurrent pneumonia, they put you on a lot of steroids, and they put you on a lot of antibiotics, and it completely screws up your gut flora.
01:04:44.000And it predisposes you to Candida a long time down the road.
01:04:51.000So after, you know, I was addicted to alcohol for a while, And kick that and then I became addicted to pot for a while and then I kicked that and then I became addicted to work and kind of more monastic practices, meditation, those sorts of things.
01:05:07.000And I lived in the jungle and these kind of like extreme experiences but sugar was always in the background.
01:05:11.000And then when I went through Ibogaine, I came out and I have like zero charge around sugar now.
01:05:19.000Because you recognize what it really is.
01:05:21.000Because it shifted the neurochemistry.
01:05:24.000So without even knowing going in that there was this addiction there because I just wasn't registering it consciously.
01:05:31.000Sugar addiction for somebody with a weak metabolic load or maybe they're susceptible they have adrenal fatigue or they're susceptible to hold on to weight.
01:05:41.000Maybe a sugar addiction is a really bad thing because now you can see that they've got this metabolic syndrome and they're moving into type 2 diabetes or whatever it might be.
01:05:49.000For me, it was always kind of in the background, but it was always there.
01:05:53.000Like, I have a sweet tooth that's insatiable.
01:05:59.000And so, on the other side of Ibogaine, there's no charge on sugar now.
01:06:04.000And I didn't even know that was going to come out the other side.
01:06:07.000I just ended up, everybody was feasting on sugar at this party I was at like a few days later, and I had this kind of like, I was just, I just kind of looked at it and glanced away and I thought, whoa, that's different.
01:06:20.000I remember that there would be this charge before.
01:07:22.000It's not necessarily because the Candida is going away, it's because of all the things that the Candida released.
01:07:27.000So you have to be mindful about how you detox in stepwise fashions.
01:07:31.000It can get a little bit complicated, but we can do it well.
01:07:34.000So that's just a long way to say, for me personally, and I've seen this with other clients too, say that same thing, but until I had the experience myself, I really wasn't putting in a first-person perspective and really appreciated the fact that just by itself,
01:07:50.000you can see this too with people coming off the streets on heroin, just by itself, there is a neurochemical addictive rewrite, a reboot in that system that helps people.
01:08:01.000That's why it's an addiction interrupter.
01:08:03.000There's a really good documentary called Ibogaine Rites of Passage.
01:08:07.000I think it was maybe eight years ago or so.
01:08:10.000And it's really well done, kind of like Neurons to Nirvana, which was more recent, also another really good one, that talks about that addictive neurochemical rewrite.
01:08:19.000Floatation does that too, it's just not as big, and you have to do a lot of floats.
01:08:25.000So when that neurochemical rewrite is happening and that interruption occurs, then you do the ongoing supportive work.
01:08:34.000And so like addiction recovery coaching, like, okay, what was underneath that?
01:08:37.000And through the experience, through this mystical experience, now you're reframing so much of the childhood trauma.
01:08:44.000Trauma and addiction are extraordinarily interwoven.
01:08:49.000Trauma, ADHD, and addiction are extraordinarily interwoven.
01:08:53.000So when we understand the neurological implications, the trauma implications, the transgenerational implications, Right?
01:09:01.000So if people have problems with their genetics, there's a whole now burgeoning field called nutrigenomics or detoxigenomics, where you do these genetic profiles and it shows you what your ability to detox certain things are.
01:09:15.000So when we were talking about heavy metals, like where do heavy metals come from?
01:09:19.000It's kind of like when people are exposed to the flu.
01:09:21.000The flu is everywhere, but some people express it because some people's immune system is weakened.
01:10:00.000Because that was a great podcast she did with TBI, and she was talking about the predisposition towards Alzheimer's, you know, these ApoE type 4 genetics.
01:10:08.000Well, if you put that genetic profile on top of a traumatic brain injury, now you just have an increase in your Alzheimer's risk tenfold.
01:10:18.000Do you think that people are hesitant to look at sugar the same way you're describing it?
01:10:27.000When you say that sugar is more addictive in some studies than heroin, people will go, that's fucking horse shit.
01:10:34.000But it's because the effect of sugar doesn't have the profound effect on the body that heroin does.
01:10:40.000But I think people might confuse that with the addictive properties of it.
01:10:45.000Because I know a lot of fucking people that are addicted to sugar, and they don't want to admit it, and they want to pretend that it's just normal.
01:10:53.000But they take a day off of sugar, and they feel like they did a great thing.
01:12:07.000That that's, you have to halt the momentum with what the Native Americans would call the sacred silence, which is anything that brings you to a point of presence where you can really access free will and just kind of stop all this momentum that's going on.
01:12:38.000There's this guy who lives in the woods with a wizard, and this wizard has a demon that can accomplish any task.
01:12:44.000So the guy wants to capture this wizard and get the demon because he wants to accomplish any task.
01:12:49.000So he finds the wizard in meditation down by the stream, throws a rope around him, cinches it tight, and the wizard looks at him and says, you've come for my demon, haven't you?
01:12:58.000He says, yes, I've come for the demon.
01:14:55.000And many of these techniques that we use, they liken to the hair.
01:15:00.000It's something that allows the mind, gives it a moment of distraction, gives it something to occupy it, puts it to sleep, so that we can use the mind as a servant instead of our master.
01:15:12.000And so all of these things, from meditation to floating to psychedelics, you know, they're hairs.
01:15:17.000Even nature itself is in its way a hair, because if you need nature to find that calm, that's, you know, that's the hair.
01:16:19.000I like that the idea though because it is kind of true that like especially ambition You know ambition can get out of control It's like we were discussing earlier today about rich people and there's a certain amount of rich people that never feel like you know what I've made plenty of money I don't have to gouge and and fuck over all the the people that I do business with and try to rip off everyone who is You know,
01:17:16.000Those things become a part of who you are as a human being, how you interface with this reality and your self-worth and the way you appreciate yourself and the way you feel about yourself.
01:17:29.000Your confidence is oftentimes based entirely on how those numbers are moving.
01:17:35.000And when it's all just about business, you know, about selling computers or whatever the fuck you're doing, like Steve Jobs, I think, completely lost the script.
01:17:44.000I mean, you're talking about a guy who got into this idea of creating computers and figuring out something to fix the world through psychedelics.
01:17:54.000He got into it through LSD. And these LSD experiences that he had, he said, were some of the most powerful experiences of his life.
01:18:04.000Well, it led to a guy who was a fucking nut who was working 20 hours a day just making computers all the time and trying to stop the competition and shut down anyone that would oppose him and...
01:18:16.000Yelling at his employees screaming at them even for not working as hard as he worked like Not recognizing that they're just individuals that are working for him.
01:18:24.000They're not going to share that same sort of psychotic passion Yeah, I mean, I think we're all hungry for more.
01:18:42.000And the problem is that there's a hunger inside ourselves that oftentimes we don't know where the mouth is to feed it.
01:18:51.000And that's this true peace, this Alignment and reconciliation with our consciousness.
01:18:57.000That whatever higher self that is, call it spirit, call it whatever you want.
01:19:00.000I prefer to call it your consciousness.
01:19:03.000And the problem is that it's really close to the other stomachs, but it's not it.
01:19:07.000So people try to feed it with accomplishments, with money, and they feed it with Relationships and status and all of these other things, but they're not actually nourishing what that real hunger is.
01:19:19.000And that's the hunger to be what we're capable of being on a true consciousness level and a being that can help make the lives of everyone else around us better, you know, improve the quality of life for the earth and everybody around.
01:19:33.000Yeah, it's so hard to grasp if you're not in that mindset.
01:19:40.000It's so hard to leave the momentum of your current mindset, whether it's a current mindset that loves to gamble or the current mindset loves to stuff your fat face with cake.
01:19:50.000Whatever it is, those mindsets, those patterns of behavior are incredibly difficult to escape from.
01:19:58.000And it's one of the reasons why I wanted to ask you about food addictions, because it seems to me that I don't really have a food addiction, but I would imagine that they're probably one of the hardest to kick because everybody has to eat.
01:20:13.000So, while you're eating, you're like, yeah, this celery is good, but fuck, it would be awesome if I had some chocolate ice cream right now with some whipped cream and chocolate fudge.
01:20:30.000Longing, lustful, sort of intense cravings that some people have towards food.
01:20:36.000I've seen friends that have food addictions that when they do get that food, like, you know, we're maybe driving somewhere, maybe we're hungry, maybe we just landed and we're on our way from the airport to get food.
01:20:47.000When they finally get that food, it's like a fucking guy who's been holding his breath at the bottom of the ocean.
01:20:56.000It's like like you just you just did something like you you kept yourself from my precious for so long then when you finally in the in the presence of it you just Engorge in it.
01:21:20.000You were beating, your heart was beating, you were breathing, you were walking your feet, and all of a sudden that chicken parm sub comes your way, and you're just stuffing it into your fucking maw.
01:22:05.000Well, when you transition off of something that's so ubiquitous, it's super helpful to have motivation because it's not going to be an easy journey.
01:22:14.000It's super helpful to have a guide and a plan, and it's super helpful to integrate that plan and stay, you know, stick to it.
01:22:21.000So sugar, there's a, JJ Virgin is a really well-known author in the whole addiction realm, particularly in regards to sugar.
01:22:36.000And then transitioning from sugars that are really crappy to sugars that are better and then less of those sugars that are better to eventually on an extraordinarily or no sugar diet.
01:22:56.000But if your motivation is like, wow, I just went to the doctor and I've got like, you know, 90% stenosis on one of my heart arteries and I'm really close to having another heart attack or I'm morbidly obese and I just got that major self-reflection about how my life's just horrible right now or I'm in this,
01:23:15.000you know, suicidal depression or whatever people's motivation is, that crisis point can actually help people motivate them to a new trajectory.
01:23:25.000So that's why I often have you here with anybody going through an addiction, particularly with alcoholics, they haven't hit rock bottom.
01:23:32.000And once you've motivated and you've come up with a plan, whatever that plan is, to be able to stick to it is also important then to have ongoing support, especially if these are dangerous addictions.
01:23:43.000Like my sister committed suicide a year and a half ago after she relapsed on alcohol and no one saw it coming and she shot and killed herself.
01:23:57.000And it really helped remind me of the importance of ongoing support and being consistently interfacing with conscious people in our family and supportive tribe and our brothers and sisters,
01:24:12.000like really watching out for each other, really checking in, making sure there's not anything going on on a deeper level, having that honest inventory Versus just playing on the surface and ignoring everything that's in the background.
01:24:28.000So when we engage it in a good way and we're becoming our best self, then we have the opportunity to really create massive and beneficial change in the world.
01:24:37.000And many people are playing on the surface and we don't exactly even know how to get in touch with ourselves or what we want to do or what our mission is here in life.
01:24:46.000And so, coming back to that whole addiction rewrite, there's steps, there's very clear steps along the path.
01:24:54.000And sugar is one of those that is because it's so ubiquitous, or like technology.
01:24:59.000I used to help run a clinic called Alternative to Meds in Sedona, and another place called The Sanctuary in Sedona.
01:25:06.000Two different centers, but often times people come for addiction recovery.
01:25:10.000And one of the trickiest ones that we ever saw was this addiction to technology.
01:25:15.000Whether it's pornography or just being on the internet for so long or whatever kind of addiction profile in the technology arena because it's like sugar.
01:25:25.000It's not like you're going to just say no and I'm never going to do that again.
01:25:28.000So at that point it's even, coming back to that moderation plan, it's even more helpful to have an ongoing support System and person in place and recovery coach move you through that process so Sugar is one of those that because it's a physiologic addiction the body does get used to it or caffeine it does get used to it so if people are jacked up on coffee you transition a black tea and you transition a green tea and you transition to no caffeine Really set somebody up for success versus saying,
01:25:58.000well, you're on coffee, then stop at cold turkey and suffer for, you know, a week to 10 days.
01:26:04.000Most people aren't going to want to do it that way.
01:26:05.000And it doesn't actually have to go that way.
01:26:07.000You can actually come up with a pretty successful plan.
01:26:10.000You just have to be rock solid and committed to it.
01:26:12.000When you're talking about Candida and gut bacteria, when you try to help someone get off that, how much emphasis do you put on probiotics?
01:26:23.000Because there's going to be a die-off, and that die-off and that toxicity that the Candida is going to release, or if you're clearing parasites, same thing.
01:26:32.000So parasites are another buffer, and we have grown, and we were talking about this before, we've grown over generations in traditional cultures to be symbiotic with parasites in our environment.
01:26:48.000And you see these traditional cultures that are very untouched by Western food, and by Western marketing, and by Western influence.
01:26:58.000And when you look at their microbiome or you look at their gut flora, they have the most rich and diverse gut flora.
01:27:05.000And the ones that we usually have in like probiotic strains are just a fraction of everybody who's playing.
01:27:12.000And so you've got these massively complex and extraordinarily sophisticated Gut probiotic populations that help us metabolize and even produce a lot of the micronutrients that we need for our most vital living.
01:27:32.000And when you look at the long-term ramifications of being able to re-infiltrate, and so there's this whole movement now around fecal transplants and being able to identify somebody who's got a really healthy microbiome or healthy gut flora.
01:27:46.000They have a healthy neurological system.
01:27:51.000As a source for a potential gut fecal transplant, and when you look at people who are kind of the opposite of that, they have long-standing irritable bowel syndrome or Crohn's disease or some kind of autoimmune infection, there's a whole science around using parasites as actually a beneficial step.
01:28:17.000Into the system and the hookworms kind of move everything else out and lower the inflammatory load and help to rewrite some of that autoimmune cascade.
01:28:27.000So then once that autoimmune cascade is rewritten, then you bring in the healthy probiotics.
01:28:34.000So there's a whole science to the gut-body and mind interface.
01:28:41.000That's why there's a really good book I think by getting Gerson called The Second Brain.
01:28:46.000And it's this whole deep scientific look.
01:28:50.000At the gut-brain connection and how many of the neurotransmitters and what build the neurotransmitters, that actually starts in the gut.
01:28:59.000Like most of the serotonin system comes from the gut.
01:29:03.000It's produced in the gut and it's transported to the brain for activity.
01:29:07.000So people that talk about feeling like shit, it's because they're full of shit.
01:29:14.000Right, so we need to actually start with the gut.
01:29:16.000Isn't it amazing how much diet and what you take into your body has an effect on your mind itself?
01:29:23.000I mean it really really truly is amazing how much what you put into your body has an impact on how your brain functions and the fact that we never get taught that our bodies are essentially A biological ecosphere.
01:29:39.000I mean, your bodies are essentially not one thing.
01:29:43.000Your bodies are like a host of untold billions of little tiny microscopic life forms that exist.
01:29:53.000And if they're in an unhealthy state, you'll be in an unhealthy state.
01:29:56.000But if they're in a healthy state, you'll feel better.
01:29:59.000The studies that they've done on probiotic gut content and the effect that it has on depression...
01:30:55.000The difference between cocaine and heroin and rats, and that if you give these rats cocaine, they'll do cocaine until they die.
01:31:01.000The problem with that study has been brought up, I forget who it was on the podcast that brought it up, was that you're talking about rats in a fucking cage.
01:31:12.000The cage itself is a part of the study.
01:31:14.000And the follow-up study to that showed that when they're put in a rat park, And they're still given unlimited supply of cocaine.
01:31:22.000So, in isolation, rats with unlimited supply of cocaine, more than 75% will be heavy users and a lot of lethality.
01:31:31.000When that same unlimited supply of cocaine is put in the setting of what's called a rat park, Where now you're like hanging out with a rat friend.
01:31:50.000And when you've got all this great stuff and stimulation around you, you've just went from over 75 heavy users to less than 25% heavy users and no lethality.
01:32:35.000So when decriminalization happened and they shifted all their money from the war on drugs into social infrastructure and started to boost up the social milieu and started to destigmatize the addiction Nomenclature and that label,
01:33:03.000So, we're recognizing just more and more in these, like, we as these, like, you know, monkeys walking around in these suits, we are built for a connection.
01:33:13.000And that's why, you know, the first part of our whole discussion today around people doing, you know, thumb desk jockey and getting really absorbed into that whole gamification arena and the whole video gaming industry, I get concerned about the social developmental ramifications.
01:33:30.000Like, what's the potential end result?
01:33:37.000Is that beneficial for the evolution of our species, so to speak?
01:33:43.000Or is it going to end up being like idiocracy, where generations down the road, we just get dumber and dumber, and then the president is a WWF title holder.
01:33:54.000I think it really just depends on just how much addiction you have, whether it crosses that threshold.
01:33:59.000Because I've played a lot of video games.
01:34:00.000They kind of sucked back when I was a kid.
01:34:02.000But, you know, it was always the balance was, alright, play some video games and then run around outside, play basketball or kick a ball around or do whatever.
01:34:10.000But I played, I mean, I played a good amount.
01:34:12.000There was days I'd play six, eight hours of Dragon Warrior or Final Fantasy or one of these super old school games.
01:34:19.000Yeah, but in the big grand scheme of things, you were probably doing much more athletics than social.
01:34:25.000And I think, again, that same message, if we demonize video games, the kids are going to be like, fuck you, because they know that that's inherently not the problem.
01:34:33.000The problem is identifying when something good, like sex, becomes something not good, like addiction to sex, if that thing is even real.
01:35:24.000But that's more of an anxiety spectrum disorder versus a primary addiction disorder because those ritualized behaviors have to be done in order to arrest some underlying compulsion and need for perfection, a need to have a corrective experience,
01:35:42.000And so the energy around it is a little bit different, but at the same time, The intervention for success and recovery from that might be pretty similar.
01:35:51.000Because everybody's a little bit different.
01:35:53.000When you look at the data, people that have significant anxiety, this actually came up with floating too.
01:36:00.000Two years ago, Justin Feinstein talked about, at the float conference, he was talking about the benefits of flotation for anxiety.
01:36:08.000And people with generalized anxiety disorder after 10 floats had significant reduction in their symptoms, like by the order of like 30%.
01:36:15.000And people with obsessive compulsive disorder, significant improvement in symptoms when going through a psychedelic experience like ayahuasca.
01:36:26.000So you've got these, again, really novel treatments and therapeutics.
01:36:30.000And honestly, more people are going to float than are going to do psychedelics.
01:36:35.000But again, it just becomes a really wide array of our tool belt.
01:36:39.000And knowing how to meet people where they're at, recommend the right approach for them at that time.
01:36:45.000Oftentimes, floating is a gateway to do other things, like clean up the diet, clean up your social environment.
01:36:51.000Get more on track with your purpose and your passion.
01:36:53.000Because when you're driving your purpose and your passion, all of a sudden there's less bandwidth that even has room to play with other behaviors and other addictions that might not be getting you to that point.
01:37:06.000Yeah, I've got to think that momentum plays a huge factor in a lot of people's lives and their decisions, both good and bad.
01:37:16.000When people are on the bender momentum, they're getting drunk every night and they're fucking up every night, it becomes their life.
01:37:24.000Whereas the momentum of positivity, that becomes their life.
01:37:29.000When you start talking about expressions and sayings like one day at a time, the issues that I have with that, I'm talking completely out of ignorance because I'm not an alcoholic and I never have been, but if I was, I would like to think that I could just get rid of it.
01:37:47.000It doesn't have to be one day at a time.
01:39:12.000And it's just, they've just substituted whatever it is that they were trying to fill with the booze.
01:39:19.000They've substituted it now with caffeine or with nicotine or with whatever.
01:39:24.000It becomes like an identifying part of their story.
01:39:27.000You know, that's part of their identity.
01:39:29.000And I think one of the lures and the problems with this is when you have this kind of ascetic principle that's part of your identity, you think you're doing great things, but you're really just focused entirely on yourself.
01:39:53.000Well, vegans have kind of an argument for that because the less carbon footprint, less of an impact on the environment with no factory farming or no vested interest in that.
01:40:06.000So there's a modicum of actual benefit.
01:40:09.000In any kind of ascetic practice, whether it's not drinking or whether it's not eating meat or whether it's not not doing something, not engaging in sex, you know, you could talk to somebody who's celibate and you find these in some yoga communities like, yes, you know, I've not engaged in sex in a month.
01:40:26.000And they act like they're doing some great service for humanity when really it's a selfish thing that they're doing.
01:40:35.000But the lure is that because it's a struggle, you feel like you're doing something great when really you're just focused entirely on yourself.
01:40:41.000Well, there's also competition going on, and there's comparing yourself to others, which is a natural human instinct.
01:40:48.000It's a natural human instinct to gauge your progress based on how you stack up with the people that you surround yourself with.
01:40:58.000Very few people like to do that in the negative sense.
01:41:02.000You don't like to look at that in a negative sense.
01:41:05.000You like to look at it in a positive sense.
01:41:07.000If you've turned vegan, one of the things that people like to do is they get really shitty, especially online.
01:41:15.000Like, the ability to communicate with people with no social repercussions, no cues, no interaction, no looking at each other eye to eye.
01:41:22.000There's these shitty, nasty things that people say to each other through that.
01:41:27.000And this vegan thing that so many people love to do, where they're really fucking angry and nasty and aggressive.
01:41:36.000Towards people who aren't vegan and towards people who enjoy meat or towards people who hunt and they somehow or another feel like they're justified in releasing this anger on you and because you're cruel to animals.
01:41:53.000Like I saw something today or someone was talking about there's bears in Yellowstone Park that were chasing tourists.
01:42:01.000These people were all on this bridge, and these black bears started chasing these people.
01:42:09.000It's really kind of fucked, because there's quite a few people on this bridge, and they got on a bridge that unfortunately a mother and her cubs got on.
01:42:16.000And the mother's kind of freaking out, and she's chasing people off.
01:42:20.000And so someone was like, man, fuck those bears.
01:42:46.000That bear will eat your dick off and not give a shit.
01:42:50.000It's living in nature, and it's trying to keep its babies alive, which, by the way, if it runs into a male bear, the male bear is going to eat the babies.
01:42:58.000So please shut the fuck up with people are worse than bears, because it's ridiculous.
01:43:02.000If bears had cars, they would never get their oil changed.
01:43:06.000They would fucking drive right over babies.
01:43:13.000The idea that somehow or another you have transcended your need to consume animal protein and so this has transferred in your being somehow to this anger towards people that do consume animal protein.
01:43:30.000It's really short-sighted and it does more harm than it does good because there's some really good ideas that are attached to living a vegetarian life.
01:43:41.000And what you're just talking about in regards to both of those groups, like you had the guy who was recovering from alcohol.
01:43:48.000Now he was judging you for drinking a beer.
01:43:50.000And you've got vegans who are judging you for eating meat.
01:43:53.000It's the same under both of those is that same projected bias.
01:44:00.000It's that same judgment that what I'm doing is right and what you're doing is wrong.
01:44:05.000And when we do that, we polarize the discussion.
01:44:09.000I mean, some people good and some people bad.
01:44:12.000As opposed to Western medicine has done that to chiropractic medicine or naturopathic medicine.
01:44:16.000I mean, or the Palestinians have done that to the Israelis.
01:44:19.000I mean, the inherent conflicts that are downstream that cause all the major discourse in the world is all about People judging one another and believing in their bones that their position is right versus coming to the table and saying,
01:44:41.000So if I'm a recovering alcohol and I'm judging you for your alcohol, let me own the fact that I'm actually envious of you.
01:44:49.000Because I'd really love to have a beer.
01:44:51.000But for me, because of my chemistry or my background or whatever, because of who I am and what I'm going through right now, me having a beer is a bad thing.
01:45:09.000You can put the mask on any way you want, but underlying that, it's people's own inherent ability to be real and okay with themselves and judging each other as being bad or wrong.
01:45:25.000It's a very good point, and I think it speaks to what we were talking about earlier about competition, and that this is the only arena where they're keeping score, and that some people, they're keeping score with their moral score.
01:45:39.000Like, I am a more moral, more ethical person of you because I choose to live my life in this way, even though I do all sorts of damage to people's psyche by being shitty to them.
01:45:49.000Because, you know, because of the fact that they're not living the same moral life that I do.
01:45:53.000This is the issue that I've had with, you know, the quote-unquote social justice warriors of the world.
01:45:59.000The people that shame and attack people for having what they believe to be disparaging belief systems or people that may be sexist or homophobic or what have you.
01:46:11.000Instead of treating these ideas with rational discourse and love.
01:46:19.000They're aggressive and angry and they try to get people fired and they try to shame people for their ideas.
01:46:26.000Human beings don't work like that and you can't communicate like that.
01:46:29.000And what you're doing is essentially the same thing that we're talking about.
01:46:32.000You are now keeping score by shaming or by...
01:46:38.000Writing horrible things about these people or by attacking them or organizing groups of like-minded fuckheads to go out and attack these people.
01:46:48.000And instead, you're just creating a competitive, sort of antagonistic, combative environment.
01:48:31.000You now like the internal scorekeeper.
01:48:34.000I'm not looking at you to get my own validation, so I don't need to...
01:48:39.000Aggressively try and sell my approach.
01:48:41.000I don't need to prove to you that I'm right and then get your feedback so I feel better about myself.
01:48:47.000Essentially, we internalize over time.
01:48:49.000Some people have it kind of out the gate because of good parenting or good genetics or a whole host of other things.
01:48:54.000Some people develop it over time through their own personal mastery to be able to walk in the world with that self-confidence.
01:49:01.000You use the word a lot, which I appreciate, which is impeccability.
01:49:07.000We're already walking an impeccable life.
01:49:09.000We're already aligned with everything that we feel is important for us to do in the world.
01:49:15.000We've internalized that self-referencing ability to be content, whether it's content in the tank or content across the discussion platform.
01:49:25.000I think you have to have varying disciplines in your life as well.
01:49:28.000I don't think concentrating on one thing for any long period of time, although I've done it many times in my life, I don't think it's ultimately healthy.
01:49:36.000I think it's very good short term to achieve great success in a small amount of time or a relatively small amount of time.
01:49:44.000But I think that ultimately that is one of the things that can trip you up.
01:49:48.000If your whole world, say, you know, back to what we're saying, like a computer company, if you own a computer company, if your whole world is that computer company, I think that's ultimately very unhealthy.
01:49:57.000But if you have this computer company and then you start getting into jiu-jitsu, you might relax a little bit about the fucking computer company and realize, like, oh, okay.
01:50:05.000There's a lot of different things I can kind of put this energy towards, and some of them actually enhance my human potential.
01:50:13.000They actually develop me as a human being and not getting so caught up in those numbers.
01:50:18.000There's a lot of people that will look at things, this is a really common thing to say.
01:50:22.000Like, you'll see a guy like Bill Gates.
01:50:25.000If I had his money, I wouldn't fucking work at all.
01:50:26.000Yeah, that's why you'll never have his money.
01:50:29.000It's just like the type of guy that becomes a Bill Gates is a fucking obsessed dude.
01:50:35.000You have to have this insane mindset towards progress.
01:50:43.000And towards continuing to move the number, continuing to move that needle, and that's the only way you get to develop a company like Microsoft.
01:50:51.000You have to hire like-minded folks, and you have to all compete together as a team to try to achieve world dominance in something as lucrative as the computer market.
01:51:22.000Because he's put all of his energy into creating this Microsoft monolithic empire that's unstoppable at this point.
01:51:31.000And it's probably really sort of semi-retired now, but I think a lot of that has to do with age, you know, and Once you got ninety fucking billion dollars in the bank there also comes to this point where like I don't I can't even spend this like I literally can't spend this so I think that Having varying disciplines.
01:51:51.000I do a lot of different things, and I didn't always, but in doing a lot of different things, doing martial arts and playing pool and doing meditation and getting in the tank and doing stand-up comedy and doing...
01:52:05.000Podcasts and fight commentary and all these various things.
01:52:08.000None of those things have a lot of weight to me.
01:52:11.000They're all very significant and important, but if one of them went away, I'd be fine.
01:52:15.000Like, if the UFC called me up today and said, hey, you can't do the UFC anymore, I'd be like, well, I had a great time.
01:53:08.000If your life is completely revolving around one thing, but then there's other places where that is bad advice, like fighting.
01:53:17.000I think you should have some few things that you do outside of fighting, but if you're going to engage in something like martial arts, the amount of time that you have to do to compete, the amount of time that you have to dedicate to it, It's almost impossible to have any other sort of life.
01:53:31.000Well, I think one of the key things is there's the development of skills, which is important to diversify, but you're really developing your identity.
01:53:38.000And then if your sole identity is as a fighter, what happens when you break your arm or you can't fight?
01:54:51.000But if you have your soul identity wrapped up in that, and you get in some kind of accident...
01:54:56.000You're going to have a fucking hell of a time.
01:54:59.000Because if all you look at yourself is your physical ability and you haven't cultivated anything else, your spiritual ability or your emotional connection to other people or these other things, you're putting all your eggs in one basket.
01:55:11.000It's a dangerous place to be because the universe loves to go around and play gotcha on any type of thing that we have too much attachment to.
01:55:19.000It's crazy how that's such a catch-22.
01:55:21.000It's like in order to achieve great success, it has to literally become your world.
01:55:51.000And then you almost have to get through that in order to realize that there does need to be some sort of diversification in your interests.
01:55:59.000Miyamoto Basashi wrote about that in the Book of Five Rings.
01:56:02.000One of the things that he talked about that was really important was that A great fighter, a great samurai, had to also be a great philosopher, had to also be a great artist.
01:56:13.000There was a balance that had to be achieved where there was never any ridiculous anger.
01:56:50.000If your identity is too wrapped up in one thing, you will crave the success in a way in which you need it because you need that to support you in that.
01:56:58.000And the second that you need something or crave something, it belies a certain underlying fear that you're not going to get that.
01:57:05.000And the minute you have fear that you're not going to get it, you're not going to be performing at your best ability, you know?
01:57:10.000So, you know, I heard a great poker player who told me that, you know, his mentor who'd won some World Series of Poker said, you know, you'll win the World Series of Poker when it isn't a big deal if you win the World Series of Poker.
01:57:20.000Like, you've just gotten to the point where you've mastered that art to such a degree that you don't crave that to form your identity.
01:57:29.000You're not afraid of not getting that.
01:57:31.000It's just like, yeah, this is what I do.
01:57:32.000I'm one of the best in the world, and this is what's going to happen.
01:57:36.000Yeah, you can be stoked, but it's not this deep need.
01:57:39.000Because anytime you need something, whether it's a girlfriend, whether it's something in your career, if you really need it to the point where if you don't get it, you think you're going to freak out, you're going to be too afraid to actually get it.
01:57:50.000This is also that very important transition for when you actually do achieve that thing, now what?
01:57:56.000Look at a guy like Mike Tyson in his prime.
01:58:04.000I remember watching this video of Mike Tyson describing his early morning runs, that he could wake up later and run, but he got a little bit of an edge knowing that as he was running his opponent was sleeping.
01:59:24.000I mean, that is the warrior-poet concept that we lost somewhere along the way.
01:59:28.000We started celebrating people in the extremes.
01:59:31.000And you celebrate that with extreme amount of money, too, which is the allure.
01:59:37.000Like a laser, someone who can be really good at one thing, can achieve a lot of financial success, but they're not generally going to achieve happiness.
01:59:44.000But that's not what's celebrated or measured.
01:59:49.000I think I've talked about it on here before.
01:59:52.000That in ancient Greece, in Rome, in ancient Japan, and this idea of the Bushido and this way of cultivating many different skills and talents, calligraphy along with swordsmanship, philosophy along with holding the shield line, all of these different things.
02:00:09.000Lost a little bit along the way and I think that's a huge part of bringing back an embrace of what it is to be a man and for for women you know what it is to be a woman holding their own you know special magic in whatever field it is not just attractiveness not just how good you look not just how sexy you are but what other things that you can cultivate you know what emotional intelligence what other skills maybe it is on the more masculine side whatever but rounding out the spectrum Of everybody,
02:00:39.000I think, will really yield much, much more positive results.
02:00:42.000Because again, going back to these tragedies you see with bullying and all the suicides, so much is attached to, their identity is attached to attractiveness and social status on these networks.
02:00:54.000Where if they were a great poet or a great painter or a great basketball player or a great soccer player, you know, there would be one element of truth That they could always rely on, even when the world seemed to take away that.
02:01:06.000And let's say they were good at multiple things.
02:01:08.000Let's say they were good at caring for an animal and good at soccer and good at, you know, writing.
02:01:19.000So I think that's a key thing, you know, if you look at developmentally, ideas to instill in young people is having multiple things that they can draw esteem from when everything looks like it's collapsing and say, ah, I can sort it out, you know.
02:01:32.000I think counterintuitively also the idea that bullying is just a natural part of people growing up.
02:01:40.000I think it's a natural part of people growing up that never learned how to fight.
02:01:43.000You know where you see very little bullying or very little tolerance of bullying?
02:01:48.000It is very, it is looked at as one of the worst character traits a true martial artist, a true master can have.
02:01:57.000You know, like one of the easiest things you could do, like say if you want to do jujitsu, if you want to roll with a guy like Marcelo Garcia, you're not going to get hurt.
02:02:30.000I think the best way to stop bullying in school would be to make martial arts available to everyone and to explain to them that this isn't about becoming a tough guy.
02:02:41.000It's about overcoming your own self, overcoming your own insecurities, your own ego, which is a battle that is constant.
02:02:49.000There's an expression about inspiration.
02:03:07.000You know, I mean, it's the same thing with developing your mind, controlling your ego.
02:03:14.000Controlling your fears, reassuring your anxieties, and assessing the objective view or assessing an objective view of your life and your perspective on the world.
02:03:26.000And I think it's very difficult to do without some discipline, without some sort of task-oriented discipline.
02:03:34.000And in my opinion, one of the best ones Is martial arts.
02:03:37.000And it's one of the best ones for dealing with interpersonal conflict because we want to pretend that no one's going to fight.
02:03:44.000We want to, like, well, we don't want bullying.
02:03:52.000One of the reasons why you have it, you're not addressing the underlying problems of what it means to be a person, especially what it means to be a developing man, growing up and having all these...
02:04:02.000Thousands of years of instincts and DNA ingrained in your biological system, and then you're supposed to just ignore them.
02:04:11.000And you wonder why men gravitate towards toxic masculinity, like, you know, video games and fucking watching the Avengers.
02:05:06.000And to pretend that we're there now is ignoring our biological system.
02:05:11.000And that's ensuring they're going to have these same issues over and over and over again.
02:05:16.000I think that some of the nicest people I've ever met have been martial artists.
02:05:19.000And I really believe that if we taught that in school from the time when children were little, so it's not some scary, freaky thing that you have to enter into as an adult, but it's a part of a normal, everyday management of life program, I think we would be a lot better off.
02:06:56.000And they have actually more pro-social sexual engagements because people are talking about it.
02:07:02.000You could say the same thing about the psychedelic experience, like the island, which is a crowd favorite of ours by Aldous Huxley.
02:07:09.000He talks about the rites of passage ceremonies that includes moksha medicine, which is probably psilocybin.
02:07:15.000That is done in the group setting for kids as a rites of passage going into their adulthood that's supported and stewarded by those that have already gone through it.
02:07:26.000So like your dojo master working with people in the early stages of martial arts training or somebody that's medicine positive and experienced working with kids going into psychedelic altered states of consciousness to be able to expand their worldview.
02:07:44.000So all these things where we repress information—sexuality, antigenics, physical engagement—anytime we were repressing those things, they're going to come out anyway.
02:07:56.000And they usually come out in these distorted, destructive ways.
02:08:01.000Yeah, so set the bar with really good practices in all of these areas.
02:08:05.000Sexuality, physicality, and spirituality.
02:08:08.000Like really, if you're nurturing somebody young, you've got to hit those areas in a really conscious way and not be scared of them.
02:08:41.000You know, not just think about baseball, but there's like tantric practices that can help you like different breathing techniques that can put that like actionable information.
02:08:49.000So kids are like, okay, I can calm down a little bit in this situation.
02:08:53.000Maybe this can be instead of this short, violent experience that leaves everybody feeling like Ah, what was that?
02:08:59.000You know, teach them how to make it a positive experience so they don't get all this baggage attached to these sexual encounters.
02:09:07.000People who've had really caustic and damaging sexual encounters with people where it's like so much tension built up, so much ignorance around it, and then something happens and it's just short and violent and it's terrible.
02:09:31.000These are some techniques that can help out.
02:09:33.000And celebrate that, just the same as you would teach martial arts, just the same as you would steward people through true experiential spirituality where they get in touch with that other thing, either inside themselves or in the other astral, in the light world, whatever you want to say.
02:09:48.000Steward them in positive ways through those main categories.
02:09:51.000And it's a different fucking world at that point.
02:09:53.000There's also a lot of confusing and conflicting signals that are out there.
02:09:59.000People expressing themselves in ways that aren't necessarily honest, but instead they're trying to calm their own anxieties or distort...
02:10:11.000Distort other people's perceptions of reality to match up with the way they identify themselves.
02:10:18.000I mean, you see this all the time with homophobic people who will talk very horribly about gay sex, and then you find out that they're actually gay.
02:10:26.000I mean, it's so common, like this mixed signal, this wire, this confusion going on.
02:10:32.000People that don't feel sexually attractive, don't feel awkward, or feel awkward, rather, and don't feel like they want to...
02:10:41.000Defuse or deny or demean the idea of the importance of sexual contact.
02:10:48.000I read this piece the other day where someone was saying that there is no such thing as the urge for sex.
02:11:57.000And if you've ever seen elk fight, they have holes all over their chest and their cape, all over their neck area, where they jam their fucking, these swords that grow every year out of their head when it's time to fuck.
02:12:10.000When it's time, their urge is so strong that their body grows swords out of their fucking head.
02:12:15.000And then when they're done fucking, they drop off.
02:12:23.000But this was a whole article by some chubby dummy that has shitty hormone balance, never goes jogging, I'm sure, and just feels completely...
02:12:34.000unattractive sexually so they're in denial about the urge and the need and whether or not it's a core component of life because it's so weighted because you use sex to sell Jaguars and lipstick and fucking buildings and you know there's always a woman with her legs and long legs and a man with abs and a fucking Calvin Klein commercial and all the sex sex sex sex sex you know there's people that just feel like I'm out of that game like that game does not apply to me I'm here eating donuts My gut looks like a fucking beanbag chair,
02:13:05.000and I'm not that guy, or I'm not that girl.
02:13:10.000And if you show a picture of yourself looking hot, you're fat-shaming, which is one of my all-time favorite of all the retarded social justice warrior sayings.
02:13:53.000When people are married and their wife is kind of dumpy and they're kind of dumpy and they just, no one ever touches them and no one's attracted to them and then they see some chick with dark red lipstick on and her breasts are plumped up and she's in some fucking outfit and she's selling Burger King or something like that and you're like,
02:14:45.000Yeah, I mean, in a healthy relationship, I suppose it would be like, you know, it's not to not celebrate beautiful women.
02:14:52.000Beautiful women are inherently going to be something that people are going to enjoy seeing, just like a great, beautiful bouquet of flowers.
02:14:59.000Like, you have a beautiful bouquet of flowers on your table, you know, you're going to look at that, and you're going to say, oh man, that's beautiful.
02:15:29.000It'd be beautiful in a variety of different ways.
02:15:31.000We can fully celebrate that, but just not manipulate that urge into something that's not helpful.
02:15:37.000But it's one of those weird things where when things are suppressed, they gain so much energy and so much power that they're almost unavoidable.
02:15:45.000I mean, this is like this momentum and energy behind them that, like, the Catholic priest that is forced into celibacy, and now nobody trusts that fuck, because he's just barely hanging on, clinging,
02:16:01.000just clinging like a piece of cheesecloth holding back the ocean.
02:16:07.000You know, just, you know, you know, you know it's not natural, you know it's not normal, and that's why the image or the depiction of the Catholic priest as being some sex-crazed pervert, pedophile, why it exists.
02:16:21.000It's completely, totally unnatural to repress yourself sexually.
02:16:25.000It has nothing to do with homosexuality.
02:16:27.000Like, people will say, oh, Catholic priests are all really gay, and that's why they go into the priesthood.
02:16:31.000Gay and molesting kids are completely unrelated.
02:17:18.000You have to exist as a human being under the confines of being a human being.
02:17:24.000When you deny your humanity because it doesn't fit your ideal or your aesthetic or your ridiculous notions of what you should be, well, you're going to run into problems, son.
02:17:36.000We should all aspire to greater heights, but in doing so, you've got to address the reality of what the fuck you are.
02:17:45.000That's, again, going back to the definition of consciousness.
02:17:55.000It's being a human in your body and bringing that home and bringing the The unity of that whole system together, that's what it really boils down to.
02:18:05.000That's what's gonna lead the happiest, most fulfilled life and make you someone who society can lean on like an anchor.
02:18:12.000That creates these people that are just the pillars, the leaders, the people who can be there when the shit hits the fan, you know?
02:18:19.000I mean, that's who everybody should aspire to be, an embodied being of consciousness, not just a consciousness being and not just a body.
02:18:28.000And there should be a bunch of us around, so it's normal.
02:18:31.000I mean, I don't say us like we've got it nailed, but I mean a bunch of humans that are like that around so that we could all sort of feed off each other and imitate our atmosphere in a very positive way.
02:18:40.000And I think, you know, there's a lot of people running through life that they don't have anyone around them that is living a life that they would aspire to.
02:19:42.000You know, like, you're in your cubicle and you just want to grab that image, that famous video of a guy who's in his cubicle who just starts punching his keyboard and then just smashes his computer monitor and picks it up and smashes on the ground.
02:19:55.000It was all caught by a security camera.
02:20:13.000They numb themselves with alcohol or medications or television or all of these things to dampen these and make it possible instead of just really looking at Let's go for the fucking win.
02:21:56.000She's not really doing the 250 degrees below zero.
02:21:58.000She only gets down to like 90. But she does it for way longer, so it's different.
02:22:06.000When you were treating patients in the clinical pathology thing, what were some of the patterns that you saw that were some of the real challenges that people face growing up?
02:22:20.000What were the main themes that were the hardest to deal with and bring into a healthy adult life?
02:23:02.000It's not really dealt with above board, whether it's people being traumatized sexually because the perpetrator, the person actually doing the traumatic event, they weren't integrated in their own sexuality, so it came out in a perverse way.
02:23:17.000Or it was the internalization of something that seemed mild But because they didn't have the languaging and the opportunity to connect with somebody, that it held and seeded over time.
02:23:30.000Like if you see animals in the wild, when they get traumatized, like if you were driving a car and you hit a deer, The first thing that deer is going to do when it gets to the side of the road is going to shake it out.
02:23:41.000It's going to just move that somatically out of its body because trauma gets imprinted into the somatic infrastructure, like Prongi was talking about, into the fascia.
02:24:24.000So we are, and that's what the Native Americans talk about.
02:24:26.000Our actions right now do affect seven generations down the line because it takes that long to bleed it out of the genes unless you clear it.
02:25:09.000I can't tell you how many times I've gone to dinner with friends that are in their 30s and 40s and five people are at a table and everyone's staring at their phone.
02:25:20.000And that gets recapitulated and it builds particularly because kids are little sponges and their social milieu is really developing its foundation when they're really young that way.
02:25:30.000So if it starts so young, then it solidifies over time until there's a massive interjection of some new kind of thing.
02:25:38.000And so it's important for kids to be absorbed in nature.
02:25:41.000It's important for them to have like the correct mentorship about not shaming, not blaming, bringing everything up to the surface.
02:25:49.000And then the whole way that we work with, for example, like the penal system, the whole judicial system is completely backwards.
02:25:58.000We label the perpetrator and the victim and then the whole legal system is set up against that way.
02:26:24.000Like, I'm going to get paid for being a victim.
02:26:27.000And that perpetrator is going to go off somewhere and not get rehabilitated.
02:26:32.000And people don't typically get better in prison.
02:26:35.000And when you look at like the whole just downstream effect of that victimhood, there's a really good article by the Simontons, they were a man and wife couple in the 80s.
02:26:46.000They had some of the first early mind-body studies that showed the importance of what you think, how it affects your body.
02:26:54.000He was an oncologist and she was a research psychologist.
02:26:57.000And there were four things that, no matter what level of cancer, like stage, or what type of cancer, there were consistent measures that showed people getting better and people getting worse.
02:27:09.000And one of those that consistently showed people getting worse was victimhood.
02:27:13.000Like, they didn't believe that they had any empowerment to change their situation.
02:27:18.000Also, inability to give and receive love, resentment, and low self-esteem or self-worth.
02:27:23.000When you had all four of those, you were like, fucked.
02:27:26.000That's a crazy thing, the connection between the immune system and your perceptions of the environment.
02:27:57.000So they were told whatever they were doing, cleaning, fixing things, they were told that that was healthy.
02:28:04.000There was a group that was told that that was good exercise and another group that wasn't told anything.
02:28:09.000And after a period of weeks, they did biologic, physiologic markers and showed that the women that had the idea that they were exercising more had less weight gain.
02:28:24.000Actually, their weight started to redistribute.
02:28:26.000They had better blood pressure and heart rate measures.
02:28:30.000Their whole physiology shifted because of their belief Not because they changed their activities at all.
02:28:36.000So when you look at the other side of that equation, you had certain things that, because of the way you thought, made the illness continue to seed, that cancer profile.
02:28:46.000The two things that consistently helped people get better was their faith Their belief in a reason that this was happening, or some level of empowerment that they could utilize this experience for benefit,
02:29:02.000like the housekeepers, and visualization.
02:29:05.000That you could actually visualize yourself becoming better.
02:29:10.000And they've also shown that with kids.
02:29:11.000And kids are extraordinarily good visualizers.
02:29:14.000When you can, you know, kids that are, maybe it's an oncology department at like one of the pediatric hospitals.
02:29:19.000When you can help them visualize their immune system actually working against the cancer or overcoming something, or you can project yourself into the future healed.
02:29:30.000Happy, well, and you engage with that and you feel into that and you project that into the future.
02:29:36.000That perspective shifts the physiology.
02:29:39.000The psycho-neuro-immunological triad shifts towards healing just because of the power of the mind.
02:29:51.000Well, it wasn't just about being a housekeeper, it was about being athletically engaged in what they were doing.
02:29:57.000Yeah, they told one group of housekeepers that the exercise that they were doing met the Surgeon General's quota for a healthy exercise for an individual.
02:30:10.000And then they told the other people nothing.
02:30:12.000And then they watched the difference in the groups between, and they were all cleaning hotel rooms, and it was randomized.
02:30:18.000And the people who felt that they were meeting the Surgeon General's requirement for exercise had all of these dramatic improvements in weight loss and all these physiological markers.
02:30:52.000Peeling back layer and layer and layer and just we're slowly starting to unveil the power and the properties and subsequently a management system for this incredible engine that we have to construct our environment.
02:31:06.000Yeah, Joe Dispenza just wrote a book, You're the Placebo, and he's got all, he's got the great scientific background.
02:31:22.000D-I-S-P-E-N-Z-A. And he was the one who cites all of these examples of these placebo surgeries, these sham surgeries, like arthroscopic knee surgeries that they did where they did a placebo knee surgery and a real knee surgery and found that the outcomes were identical.
02:31:39.000And in some cases, the people with the placebo knee surgery where they basically cut the skin and sewed it back up.
02:31:45.000They had better outcomes than the people who had actual knee surgery.
02:31:48.000Like things that you think should not have a placebo effect, like if you're going to have knee surgery, it's probably pretty important that you're going to do that.
02:31:55.000No, you can actually cut the skin, tell somebody, yep, surgery went great, and they'll recover better than the people who actually got the surgery in some cases.
02:32:03.000Wasn't that dude in that video, What the Bleep Do We Know?
02:33:22.000I was having a conversation with a friend of mine about this guy that we know that is clearly in some ways a weasel.
02:33:30.000He's just, he's weasely and he's super ambitious and you can't trust him and he's not, he's just not cool and he had a bunch of like really bad interactions with other people that I know.
02:33:41.000That came to me independently and said, look, this guy's a fucking fraud.
02:34:17.000He's an exercise in recognizing how much of these qualities are positive.
02:34:22.000And how much of what he is is just douche.
02:34:25.000I think I've seen that when I've dealt with different shamans and spiritual teachers, you know, where people tend to want to put them on a pedestal as this being that's this perfect being.
02:34:35.000And then as soon as they see something a little flawed, they're like, oh my God, my holy savior is not the holy savior I think.
02:34:44.000It's like, no, he's just not perfect like everybody else.
02:34:47.000He's still really good at this and this.
02:34:49.000And just accept him for that and watch out for this little shitty part that he's still working on.
02:35:27.000If you have any psychedelic curiosity and you listen to this unbelievably free thinker, this guy who's just like really willing to put himself out there in some sort of a...
02:35:37.000And, you know, maybe he missed the mark occasionally, but he's shooting a lot of fucking arrows.
02:36:58.000Like recognize within yourself, ourselves, what's behind the curtain.
02:37:04.000Like being able to see those aspects of myself that I haven't fully integrated, fully accepted.
02:37:10.000Because it's only my projection and judgment of somebody else is only a reflection of the shadow material that I haven't integrated myself.
02:37:18.000And usually it's those things that I project onto others that I'm so emotionally connected to or people that really piss me off in a particular way.
02:37:27.000That's related to my own shadow work in that other side of the coin.
02:38:37.000And remember to don't concentrate only on the finger, because then you'll miss, I forget the quote, Bruce Lee, all the heavenly groin that lies beyond.