The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #987 - Ben O'Brien

00:00:00.000 Still out?

00:00:03.000 Okay.

00:00:07.000 Two, one.

00:00:08.000 Oh, and we're live, ladies and gentlemen, with the creator.

00:00:10.000 Are you the creator of this?

00:00:12.000 No.

00:00:13.000 Of Rybrain?

00:00:14.000 Yeah, now I'm thinking Yeti.

00:00:15.000 I was like, oh, I don't go that far.

00:00:16.000 Rybrain, though.

00:00:17.000 Rybrain.

00:00:17.000 Cheers, sir.

00:00:18.000 Thank you, sir.

00:00:18.000 The clink.

00:00:19.000 The famous...

00:00:20.000 The Yeti jingle.

00:00:21.000 The Rambler clink.

00:00:22.000 Ooh.

00:00:23.000 What a great invention.

00:00:24.000 You guys were just getting hammered and throwing anything in there.

00:00:27.000 For folks who haven't been properly introduced, my friend Ben O'Brien is here.

00:00:33.000 He was in the podcast from Paradise when we were in Lanai.

00:00:37.000 One of my all-time favorites.

00:00:39.000 I mean, the island or the podcast?

00:00:42.000 The whole thing.

00:00:42.000 It was all awesome.

00:00:43.000 The whole damn thing. 0.99

00:00:44.000 But people are drinking those Cat Ladies now. 0.99

00:00:46.000 Which is...

00:00:46.000 It's not to be advised.

00:00:48.000 That's a terrible idea, dude. 0.99

00:00:50.000 When I saw Dudley making that, I was like, what the fuck are you doing, man? 0.99

00:00:54.000 He poured tequila and Red Bull into a glass of red wine. 0.99

00:00:58.000 And we were looking at him like, what is that?

00:01:00.000 And people...

00:01:03.000 Hashtags are wrong, man, when people are hashtagging.

00:01:05.000 Of course, I do it sometimes just to poke fun at everybody, but I've had probably a dozen people like, man, I tried the cat lady last night.

00:01:12.000 Yeah, people are just drinking it just to say they drank it.

00:01:15.000 Which is just, don't do it, people.

00:01:17.000 Don't do it, but rye brain is actually pretty good.

00:01:21.000 I can get that.

00:01:21.000 There were some meat, some Traeger, some bows involved, and stuff just got put together.

00:01:27.000 I've had these before.

00:01:28.000 They actually taste good.

00:01:29.000 Yeah.

00:01:30.000 But there's like no benefit that you get from Alpha Brain when you mix it with whiskey.

00:01:35.000 Yeah.

00:01:35.000 It's like all the science we put into Alpha Brain, all the non-science from whiskey.

00:01:40.000 Out the window, folks.

00:01:41.000 It's all out the window.

00:01:42.000 Well, I mean, we've made zero leaps forward, but we're good where we are currently.

00:01:48.000 I think maybe it might balance us out, though.

00:01:50.000 It might. 1.00

00:01:51.000 Maybe it keeps you from getting too stupid. 1.00

00:01:53.000 Which, that's an achievement. 1.00

00:01:57.000 It's a big issue with whiskey.

00:01:58.000 What is this whiskey we got here?

00:01:59.000 I don't know.

00:02:00.000 Jamie just kind of threw it out there. 0.99

00:02:02.000 This is some shit that some dude gave us at the comedy store. 0.99

00:02:03.000 It's called Angel's Envy. 0.99

00:02:05.000 Oh, that sounds like a...

00:02:06.000 I think angels are really envious of whiskey, though.

00:02:09.000 I mean, you're hanging out with God.

00:02:10.000 You can fly.

00:02:11.000 You're like, God, I wish I had some of that whiskey.

00:02:14.000 Meanwhile, you buy it in a store.

00:02:15.000 Angels don't have money? 0.94

00:02:17.000 Maybe that's how it balances out.

00:02:18.000 It's got wings on the back.

00:02:20.000 Maybe they're trying to co-market with Red Bull.

00:02:22.000 I don't know.

00:02:22.000 Those are always the wings on the back of a stripper that cries a lot.

00:02:26.000 And Angel and Envy are both names of strippers. 0.59

00:02:30.000 That's true, dude.

00:02:31.000 I've never seen that.

00:02:32.000 That's a really good point.

00:02:34.000 Yeah, the wings on the back is always a weird move, right?

00:02:38.000 Listen, if you're drinking whiskey with Alphabrain, you can do whatever you want.

00:02:42.000 You can put whatever kind of whiskey you want in there.

00:02:45.000 You're very open-minded.

00:02:46.000 Yeah, the Alphabrain cancels it out.

00:02:49.000 It could be the worst whiskey in the world, and the Alphabrain makes it better.

00:02:53.000 Have you taken this anywhere, this rye brain? 1.00

00:02:56.000 I have not.

00:02:57.000 I'm really counting on your listeners and Dudley's fans to do that.

00:03:01.000 I want it to be organic.

00:03:02.000 It's going to spread.

00:03:02.000 Yeah.

00:03:03.000 It's going to spread.

00:03:04.000 The next time you go to some exotic location and they have a rye, like if you're in Nepal. 0.66

00:03:09.000 I'm going to Northwest Territories with your boys on your hat there, the Eastmans. 1.00

00:03:13.000 Oh, you really?

00:03:14.000 In like a week.

00:03:14.000 Oh, wow.

00:03:15.000 What are you doing up there?

00:03:16.000 Caribou and doll sheep.

00:03:18.000 Oh, wow.

00:03:19.000 So we're doing a film about their, a Yeti film.

00:03:22.000 Yeti presents film about their family history.

00:03:24.000 In the Northwest Territory.

00:03:25.000 It's like technically what part of Alaska is that?

00:03:28.000 So that's, it's east of Alaska, right east of British Columbia.

00:03:31.000 It's up toward the Arctic Circle.

00:03:32.000 So we'll fly into Norman Wells and go north from there up into the McKenzie Mountains, which are about as far north as you can get before you hit the Arctic Circle.

00:03:40.000 So we'll be sniffing the Arctic Circle most days.

00:03:43.000 But it's still, it's still Alaska, right?

00:03:45.000 No, no, no.

00:03:46.000 It's not?

00:03:46.000 It's its own territory.

00:03:47.000 Yep.

00:03:47.000 Really?

00:03:48.000 Oh, wow.

00:03:49.000 Same as Yukon.

00:03:49.000 I mean, you think Yukon Moose or whatever.

00:03:51.000 They're all their own territories outside of Alaska.

00:03:52.000 Oh, so Yukon is not Alaska?

00:03:55.000 We'd have to look that up.

00:03:56.000 I don't want to be...

00:03:57.000 Right.

00:03:57.000 I'd have to look at a globe and then Google it.

00:03:59.000 I'm not questioning like I know.

00:04:00.000 I don't know either.

00:04:01.000 But Northwest Territories is its own territory.

00:04:03.000 It's not Alaska.

00:04:04.000 So who owns that?

00:04:05.000 Canada, I guess.

00:04:06.000 Really?

00:04:07.000 Oh, so it's like past Alaska becomes Canada again?

00:04:07.000 Yeah.

00:04:11.000 Yeah.

00:04:11.000 God, this is getting real deep.

00:04:13.000 I should have known to come in on this package.

00:04:15.000 You're like, tell me the history of Northwest Territories.

00:04:17.000 So here it is right now.

00:04:18.000 There it is.

00:04:18.000 We're looking at it on a map.

00:04:20.000 So, Yukon Territories.

00:04:21.000 Okay, so the Yukon is slightly east.

00:04:24.000 Or east, rather.

00:04:25.000 East.

00:04:25.000 And then the Northwest Territories, of course, is further east above Alberta.

00:04:29.000 Wow.

00:04:30.000 So you're getting up there into the true Arctic.

00:04:33.000 So it is connected to Canada.

00:04:36.000 Yeah.

00:04:37.000 But it's also connected to Alaska.

00:04:41.000 It's not.

00:04:42.000 It's next to the Yukon.

00:04:43.000 It's part of Canada.

00:04:44.000 It's one of the latest provinces.

00:04:45.000 I had it right.

00:04:46.000 I'm getting confused.

00:04:47.000 I was doubting myself.

00:04:49.000 Yeah, I thought that the British Columbia section, until I saw British Columbia, I thought that was part of Alaska.

00:04:54.000 You can read the Wikipedia, and it's always really dramatic.

00:04:57.000 The wild, mountainous, and sparsely populated.

00:04:59.000 It's crazy that it's north of northern Alberta.

00:05:02.000 People are like, you know what? 0.96

00:05:03.000 It's just not fucking cold enough here in the winter. 0.94

00:05:05.000 We've got to keep going. 0.95

00:05:08.000 They have lakes.

00:05:08.000 Well...

00:05:10.000 They have lakes for like a month out of the year.

00:05:12.000 Oh my gosh.

00:05:13.000 I think when we're up there, we were talking about last week, I think when we're up there, it'll be daylight 24 hours a day.

00:05:18.000 Oh wow.

00:05:19.000 I believe.

00:05:20.000 Now when you do that, do you bring one of those eyeball cover things?

00:05:23.000 Uh, yeah.

00:05:24.000 We'll have to.

00:05:25.000 Yep.

00:05:26.000 A mask, eyeball cover things, or whatever.

00:05:28.000 Yeah, you have to, right?

00:05:28.000 You have to.

00:05:29.000 You have to, unless you're really, unless you can get in a tent and just kind of zonk out.

00:05:32.000 But it's 12, I think it's 12 or 13 days up there.

00:05:35.000 So by the time you get to day 5 or 6, you're, I mean, you're living out of your backpack, you're carrying probably 50, 60, 70 pounds in your pack, hunting, climbing every day.

00:05:44.000 So, I mean, it's, by the time you get laid down, I don't think it matters what's going on.

00:05:47.000 Now, when you do something like that, how much gear are you guys bringing?

00:05:51.000 Are you living entirely out of your backpack?

00:05:53.000 So, in the float plane, the plane takes you to base camp, which I think in this case is not a float plane, so it'll be a wheel plane.

00:06:01.000 We can take 50 pounds.

00:06:03.000 50 pounds each.

00:06:04.000 50 pounds each.

00:06:05.000 Plus your body weight.

00:06:06.000 And then six days in, they will either come in a helicopter and pick us up and move us if we're not having any luck, or they'll just drop us more gear.

00:06:06.000 Plus your body weight.

00:06:13.000 So the plan would be take 50 pounds of essential gear and then have other gear as backup back at base camp.

00:06:21.000 Oh, wow.

00:06:22.000 So you fly into base camp.

00:06:23.000 It's like, for me, it'll be like Austin to Denver, Denver to Edmonton, Edmonton to Norman Wells, hop a charter to base camp, and then from there fly out into the hunting area.

00:06:34.000 Jesus Christ.

00:06:35.000 How many days travel is that?

00:06:37.000 It's like two days and change.

00:06:38.000 Two days solid of just flying?

00:06:40.000 Just flying.

00:06:41.000 Wow.

00:06:41.000 Because you're overnighting.

00:06:42.000 I mean, they run like one, out of Norman Wells, they run like one flight a day or something.

00:06:46.000 One or two flights a day.

00:06:47.000 You have to be really dedicated, this kind of experience, to travel, just travel for two days.

00:06:52.000 I want you to do it, man.

00:06:53.000 It's like the only way to go, though.

00:06:55.000 Really?

00:06:55.000 It's not the only way to go, that's douchey to say, but it's like the best, most...

00:07:00.000 When you get back, you're like, man, that sucked, but I wouldn't want to change it.

00:07:05.000 Something happens to people when they do those exotic location hunts.

00:07:09.000 Like when they go sheep hunting and they risk their lives.

00:07:12.000 I've seen some video of you guys when you were in New Zealand.

00:07:18.000 That was gnarly.

00:07:19.000 Rescuing your lives with every step.

00:07:22.000 It's the whole time, too.

00:07:23.000 It's not just like, oh, we got up to this one area where the sheep live.

00:07:27.000 We were in New Zealand with Green Tree.

00:07:31.000 When you get up into, so there's like Beechwood Forest, so you're looking at like a 3,000, 3,500, 4,000 foot mountain, right?

00:07:37.000 We stayed in a little hut in the River Valley.

00:07:40.000 And so when you're down there, you're looking up, you're like, oh, that's where the tar live, huh? 1.00

00:07:44.000 Oh, 3,000 feet from where we are right now, vertically.

00:07:47.000 And tar, for people who don't know, is a crazy looking animal that looks like...

00:07:51.000 It looks like something out of Lord of the Rings or something.

00:07:51.000 Himalayan tar, yeah.

00:07:54.000 It really does, yeah.

00:07:54.000 Yeah.

00:07:55.000 It looks like a woolly mammoth, but just a miniature version of it.

00:07:58.000 Yeah, really crazy, wooly, furry, shaggy hair.

00:08:02.000 Yeah, goat, essentially. 0.68

00:08:03.000 Like a goat slash sheep.

00:08:05.000 But, I mean, the funny part about all that is when you first...

00:08:08.000 There it is right there.

00:08:09.000 I've seen an image.

00:08:10.000 That doesn't even look real.

00:08:11.000 They look like where we were.

00:08:13.000 You would look across these little alpine valleys and you'd see them.

00:08:16.000 It looks like a black bear.

00:08:17.000 It looks like a giant black bear.

00:08:20.000 And you're just thinking, where am I and what is that thing?

00:08:23.000 God, so it really doesn't...

00:08:24.000 Because I'm not like, you have some really cool adventurers on this podcast.

00:08:27.000 That's not me. 0.99

00:08:28.000 When I see that thing, I think, what the fuck? 0.99

00:08:31.000 And where am I? It's wild looking. 1.00

00:08:35.000 Yeah, and they live up in the Alpine.

00:08:37.000 So there you've got the Beachwood Forest, which is probably, if I would just say hiking, straight up for about an hour and a half or two hours.

00:08:43.000 And is that an invasive species for New Zealand?

00:08:46.000 They're feral.

00:08:47.000 Or not feral, no.

00:08:48.000 They're non-native.

00:08:49.000 So all the mammals on the island there are non-native.

00:08:51.000 All of them.

00:08:52.000 And they all were introduced by, and I wish I had really looked up some of the specifics, but they were all introduced by some other countries.

00:08:58.000 Europe sent animals over there.

00:08:59.000 Teddy Roosevelt sent some animals over there like, hey, here.

00:09:02.000 You're going to want these.

00:09:03.000 And so the problem over there, to get on a whole different subject, is that The people on that island, the residents of New Zealand, don't value those animals as part of the landscape.

00:09:15.000 They're just...

00:09:16.000 I mean, feral would be a good term just to the way they view them, to the value they have on them.

00:09:20.000 We have moose and mule deer.

00:09:22.000 That's part of our ethos as a country, right?

00:09:25.000 And our ecosystem.

00:09:26.000 Yeah, and our ecosystem.

00:09:27.000 They've been here before we were, at some level.

00:09:30.000 And so over there, they'll jump in a helicopter and mow down like 40 red stag on a weekend because...

00:09:36.000 They want to control the population, one, because there's no winter kill, no predation, all that stuff.

00:09:40.000 But they also just don't see a big red stag the way we see a big elk.

00:09:44.000 They just don't have the value for it down there.

00:09:48.000 Well, it's also, the weird thing about having no predators is, how do you handle that?

00:09:52.000 Do you bring in predators?

00:09:54.000 Like, if they don't, they risk disease, and there's all sorts of weird things that can happen, like they have in lanai.

00:10:00.000 Yes.

00:10:01.000 Yeah, and so that's it, right?

00:10:02.000 And we've done that in this country with bringing down the Northwest, what's it, the Timberwolf.

00:10:07.000 We brought him down and put him in the States. 1.00

00:10:10.000 While that may seem like a good solution, when we were in British Columbia hunting moose together, we saw some calf skeletons.

00:10:17.000 Yeah, I showed that picture on the podcast. 0.98

00:10:19.000 It was kind of fucked up. 0.99

00:10:21.000 See how that thing had just been decimated by those wolves. 0.99

00:10:24.000 And I saw in Montana one time, I saw them run in circles.

00:10:27.000 They run in like concentric circles.

00:10:28.000 They just run like a bullseye pattern when they're hunting, I feel like, the packs.

00:10:32.000 And I just watched.

00:10:35.000 I had killed my elk on the first day of this hunt.

00:10:38.000 And I was watching.

00:10:40.000 And you would show there would be a different wolf kill like every other day in this valley.

00:10:45.000 And it's like the wolves were just running in circles.

00:10:47.000 And I did see a couple wolves fighting in that trip.

00:10:50.000 Oh, really?

00:10:51.000 Trying to call them in, yeah.

00:10:52.000 You saw them fighting each other?

00:10:53.000 Yeah, two of them.

00:10:54.000 Wow.

00:10:55.000 And it was like 1,200 yards away and I had a rifle and I was thinking about it.

00:10:59.000 But I mean, what you see when you see a dead fawn every day you go hunting, it's pretty new.

00:11:04.000 It may be not new to that day, but new to that week.

00:11:07.000 You start to think like, How?

00:11:09.000 If this pack worked this valley for a full year, what could they do?

00:11:13.000 Right.

00:11:14.000 And there's numbers to that somewhere.

00:11:15.000 Some people have figured out how many elk a year a pack of wolves can kill.

00:11:19.000 But on the other side, before the wolves were reintroduced, there was an issue with overpopulation.

00:11:24.000 Right.

00:11:24.000 So that's where I think that's probably where hunters come in.

00:11:26.000 You know, I value that animal.

00:11:26.000 Yeah.

00:11:29.000 I'm willing to pay you for the opportunity to help you conserve that population.

00:11:33.000 Right.

00:11:34.000 But that becomes very problematic for people.

00:11:36.000 Like when you start talking about wolves...

00:11:38.000 Yes, it does.

00:11:39.000 Because wolves look like dogs.

00:11:40.000 And you don't eat them.

00:11:40.000 It does.

00:11:41.000 Wolves are another one of those ones.

00:11:43.000 Black bears, too.

00:11:44.000 I mean, I think it's, you don't eat them.

00:11:46.000 I mean, you eat bears.

00:11:46.000 I think wolves more than any animal.

00:11:48.000 Yeah, wolves way more than any animal.

00:11:50.000 I was talking to, there was a gal at my work that I was talking to, and she lives in Austin, Texas, and is very, not a hunter, but works at Yeti, and so she's around hunting.

00:11:59.000 And we were talking about wolves.

00:12:01.000 And I just said, look, I don't have a really hardened opinion on wolves.

00:12:04.000 I've not spent enough time around them.

00:12:06.000 I just know that they're meat processors on four legs. 0.99

00:12:09.000 They give no shits about anything. 0.99

00:12:12.000 They're not just eating. 0.99

00:12:13.000 They don't just eat what fills their belly.

00:12:16.000 They eat, and then they eat more, and they kill more, and that's all they're wired to do.

00:12:20.000 I've seen that in action, so that's all I really know.

00:12:23.000 I don't know whether that's good for an ecosystem, bad, whatever.

00:12:26.000 And she just said, well, I didn't really know that.

00:12:28.000 Hunting has really bad wolves.

00:12:30.000 Wolves seem to have a good PR agent, and hunting and management have a terrible PR agent.

00:12:35.000 So I think that that's part of the problem, that there's a sect of people that are really glorifying a wolf for good reason.

00:12:42.000 I mean, it's an awesome animal, a majestic animal, but at the same time, there is a juxtaposition to that that needs to be told, too.

00:12:48.000 Well, I think a big part of the issue is that people know that they virtually wiped them out in North America at one point in time.

00:12:54.000 And I think people feel guilty about that.

00:12:56.000 Yeah.

00:12:57.000 Well, then they should feel guilty.

00:12:58.000 They should feel ashamed about the mallard duck and the elk.

00:13:01.000 People don't know about the ducks.

00:13:02.000 And the whitetail.

00:13:03.000 Yeah, but we brought those back to the point where the numbers are higher than they've ever been before.

00:13:07.000 Right.

00:13:07.000 Those same people don't know how that happened, though, right?

00:13:10.000 Those same people aren't aware of how.

00:13:11.000 They just see whitetails around.

00:13:13.000 They're like, oh, that's annoying.

00:13:14.000 Yeah. 0.88

00:13:14.000 Hit one with the car. 0.88

00:13:15.000 They don't know that at the turn of the century, they were almost all gone.

00:13:18.000 Because we market hunted them to hell.

00:13:20.000 And so I think that's, there's just, it's just education, man.

00:13:24.000 I just think people need to seek the other side, which I always try to do, and you do all the time.

00:13:30.000 Just seek whatever the other side is, and hunting is not always the way to go.

00:13:33.000 Yeah, but it's inconvenient because it's hard.

00:13:36.000 Say if you're a vegetarian or a vegan, you're going to get your information from animal rights activists, and it's going to be biased in that direction.

00:13:45.000 Or if you're a hunter, you're going to get your information from hunting and conservation groups, and it might be biased in the other way.

00:13:52.000 I think wolves are a good thing because they're awesome.

00:13:54.000 You know, I don't not like wolves.

00:13:57.000 Well, and I think no hunter is like, wipe the wolves out.

00:13:59.000 I've never heard that.

00:14:00.000 I've just heard, like, what's the carrying capacity for this state, this region for wolves, right?

00:14:04.000 How many can there be?

00:14:06.000 And I know in a lot of cases, you know, the biologists would say one thing, like, okay, 100 wolves in this area.

00:14:12.000 And then when it ballooned up to 1,000, they argued for hunters to come in and help put that population down.

00:14:18.000 They were still a pushback.

00:14:19.000 Like, well, wait a minute.

00:14:20.000 We said, we agreed upon, Scientifically and biologically, you know, we...

00:14:26.000 Yeah, the problem is that it's negotiable at all.

00:14:28.000 It should have been like once the wolves hit 2,000, then you start a hunting season.

00:14:33.000 But then the real issue is it's incredibly hard to shoot a wolf.

00:14:38.000 It's not as simple as you go out and find a wolf and kill him. 0.58

00:14:41.000 They're really smart. 0.91

00:14:42.000 Think about tar in New Zealand.

00:14:44.000 If they're overpopulated in the area, you can't just walk up the hill and crack a couple.

00:14:49.000 That's a pretty big feat.

00:14:51.000 So they jump in a helicopter.

00:14:52.000 Do they gun down the tar that way too?

00:14:54.000 Really? 1.00

00:14:56.000 God damn. 0.99

00:14:57.000 So how do they determine whether or not they should be gunning them down? 0.99

00:14:59.000 It's, you know, and I don't know, like, the holistic method that they use, but I know our guide up there this year was just talking about he would go to the sheep stations or the ranch owners or some of the areas.

00:15:10.000 Some of those big mountain areas are owned privately.

00:15:13.000 And some of the areas where they were down a little bit lower, they would just say, go out today and kill 100. And that's what they would do. 0.62

00:15:20.000 And it was not...

00:15:21.000 It didn't seem to me to be too scientific in the way they went about it, but...

00:15:26.000 It's a private landowner telling you, hey, this is an infestation, essentially.

00:15:31.000 Yeah.

00:15:31.000 And my argument to them was like, why don't you just...

00:15:34.000 These animals are here.

00:15:35.000 They're not going anywhere.

00:15:36.000 They're not going to swim over to Australia.

00:15:38.000 Why don't you just treat them like we treat our wildlife?

00:15:42.000 Why don't you just accept them?

00:15:43.000 And there were some people down there that agreed with me wholeheartedly.

00:15:47.000 Some people in the guiding outfitting community.

00:15:49.000 It's like, why don't you just accept these animals as part of your landscape and treat them like that?

00:15:54.000 And I think that's a swelling opinion down there, for sure.

00:15:57.000 Well, how do they accept?

00:15:59.000 I mean, would they just treat them like they're pests?

00:16:02.000 I wouldn't say pests, because they do have some value, because hunters from around the world would go down there like we did.

00:16:06.000 But don't they have a lot of, a lot of that is on public land, or excuse me, private land, in those high-fence places?

00:16:13.000 That's basically stag.

00:16:14.000 You can't really, it's hard to high-fence for shammy and tar. 0.99

00:16:17.000 They just live in places where you'd be dumb to put a fence. 1.00

00:16:20.000 If you tried, you'd be dumb. 1.00

00:16:21.000 But stag, that's a big issue. 1.00

00:16:22.000 Stag is a whole different deal down there.

00:16:24.000 Yeah, I mean...

00:16:25.000 Is it because they're so big?

00:16:26.000 Like, people want to go there and get a big rack of antlers?

00:16:30.000 To their discredit, like, they have harvested the bad parts of our hunting culture and marketed it.

00:16:34.000 Really?

00:16:35.000 They have.

00:16:36.000 And I think there's a lot of people down there that would push back on that, on that idea, but yeah...

00:16:40.000 But explain what that means, by the bad parts.

00:16:43.000 And not just the American hunting culture, because there's a lot of Europeans that go there, too.

00:16:46.000 I think the parts of the trophy hunting, the, hey, come down here and work on this 500-inch stag, we've got it here.

00:16:52.000 And they have agents that go around and sell those deals.

00:16:54.000 And for 500-inch stag, what we're talking about, folks, is the size of the antlers, not the size of the actual animal itself.

00:17:00.000 Right.

00:17:00.000 People get super obsessed, and they fetish...

00:17:04.000 Numbers like you know the score and what a score is for people don't know they take a tape measure and they go over very Specific sections of the antlers and they calculate all the measurements together and when they do that they come up with some number and there's these Milestone benchmark numbers like a 200 inch whitetails a huge deer or a 400 inch elk is a huge elk it is they get stags that go to 500 and more what?

00:17:33.000 That's insane.

00:17:34.000 Is it as big as an elk?

00:17:36.000 Like the animal?

00:17:37.000 Body size, not quite.

00:17:38.000 Close, but not quite.

00:17:40.000 Wow.

00:17:41.000 And one of the sheep stations we hunted with originally, they farm, they essentially farm red deer.

00:17:47.000 I mean, red deer and stag, same thing, are walking around in these...

00:17:52.000 They're the same animal?

00:17:53.000 No.

00:17:54.000 Down there, red stag, red deer's basically the same thing.

00:17:57.000 But you find red deer in Europe and they're different.

00:17:59.000 Oh, okay.

00:17:59.000 Parts of the same genus.

00:18:01.000 Why do they call them a stag?

00:18:02.000 But isn't a stag a male?

00:18:04.000 Stag and hind, hind being the female. 0.99

00:18:06.000 H-I-N-D? Yep. 0.98

00:18:08.000 But you would call the animals a red deer?

00:18:12.000 I've heard it called...

00:18:14.000 I've hunted it in Europe, and they call it a red deer there, so I'm not sure...

00:18:18.000 Those deer came from there anyway, so I'm sure it's the same species.

00:18:21.000 So they came and they dropped them off in the 1800s just to turn the whole place into a giant, like, hunting provision, right?

00:18:28.000 At some level.

00:18:28.000 Yeah, at some level.

00:18:29.000 I'd love to read the history of that.

00:18:30.000 I don't really...

00:18:31.000 I haven't gone that far back.

00:18:33.000 How crazy is it that before they came, there was no mammals there?

00:18:36.000 Yeah.

00:18:36.000 Like, what a weird patch of land.

00:18:38.000 It's a weird, like, New Zealand is definitely coming from where we come from and all the things we have, and we just find it normal that we can hunt.

00:18:45.000 How many huntable species are there on this, you know, on this continent?

00:18:51.000 Going down there is just such a weird...

00:18:53.000 And they celebrate the outdoor culture.

00:18:56.000 They celebrate hunting and fishing almost in the way that we do.

00:18:59.000 And they have public land, much like we do.

00:19:02.000 And their public land is more revered and more well-managed and better taken care of, I think, than our public lands.

00:19:08.000 And it's more usable.

00:19:10.000 And so they have all these similar properties that we have in America.

00:19:15.000 But at some level, I think they just got poor luck.

00:19:18.000 They don't have native mammals to, you know, they don't have the bald eagle to put on their mast.

00:19:23.000 They just have these, you know, essentially shammy, tar, and...

00:19:28.000 But tar, they're not native either.

00:19:30.000 No, none of those.

00:19:31.000 Shammy's not native. 0.98

00:19:32.000 None of them.

00:19:33.000 They also have Canadian geese that are not native, right?

00:19:33.000 None of them.

00:19:37.000 Did you know that they used to have the biggest eagle in the world?

00:19:40.000 Really?

00:19:40.000 Yeah, they used to have an eagle called the Host Eagle, and apparently they killed them off in the 1400s, and they were so big, there's speculation they used to eat people.

00:19:49.000 I'd kill them off, too.

00:19:50.000 They had a 14-foot wingspan, I think, is what we figured out. 1.00

00:19:53.000 I'm not exaggerating.

00:19:54.000 If you've ever been over there, it really is like, it's a place where that kind of eagle would live.

00:19:59.000 That's what it looked like. 0.99

00:19:59.000 Holy shit. 0.99

00:20:01.000 That's what a host eagle looks like. 0.99

00:20:03.000 We're looking at an eagle that's literally the size of a big person.

00:20:06.000 My lord.

00:20:07.000 Yeah.

00:20:08.000 Badass of the week. 1.00

00:20:09.000 Look at the size of that fucking thing. 1.00

00:20:09.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:20:11.000 And so this host eagle...

00:20:12.000 That can't be it.

00:20:13.000 Look, that's Gandalf.

00:20:14.000 I mean, look, if it's as big as a person, like that picture...

00:20:17.000 Go to that first picture again.

00:20:20.000 Like, yeah.

00:20:21.000 Look how big that thing is. 0.95

00:20:23.000 I mean, if that thing spreads its wings, that is what it looks like.

00:20:25.000 If you've been over there, the landscape over there in some of the alpine areas, it looks like a place where that would live.

00:20:29.000 That would kill you. 0.66

00:20:30.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:20:31.000 That thing, if they caught you hiking, you'd be fucked. 0.99

00:20:34.000 It would just pull you off the cliff and just drop you off. 1.00

00:20:36.000 Oh.

00:20:36.000 That's not a real host eagle.

00:20:38.000 The actual host eagle.

00:20:39.000 That's the problem with Google Images.

00:20:41.000 We got Gandalf riding an eagle.

00:20:41.000 We're getting all kinds.

00:20:43.000 Is that a golden eagle right there? 1.00

00:20:45.000 That one with the emus or whatever the fuck those animals are. 0.99

00:20:48.000 Is that an ostrich? 1.00

00:20:49.000 It's a fox.

00:20:50.000 Daddy's care, that one's care. 0.99

00:20:51.000 Oh, yeah.

00:20:53.000 So when did it go extinct, Jamie?

00:20:55.000 What does it say?

00:20:55.000 Look at that.

00:20:55.000 Look at the size of the fucking thing.

00:20:57.000 There's a dude standing next to what, the skeleton of a host eagle. 0.99

00:21:00.000 And who is that dude?

00:21:01.000 That dude is awesome.

00:21:02.000 Look at him.

00:21:03.000 Yeah, he looks like a wizard.

00:21:04.000 Oh, he really does.

00:21:05.000 Look at his robes.

00:21:06.000 That's an ancient intellectual.

00:21:07.000 It really is.

00:21:08.000 Back in the day, I was a scholar.

00:21:11.000 1600 A.D.? Is that what it says?

00:21:14.000 The real thing actually lived on Earth.

00:21:16.000 And of course it was known as the Tiger of the Skies.

00:21:19.000 Tiger of the Skies.

00:21:20.000 Dude, that's not that long ago.

00:21:22.000 1600? 1.00

00:21:23.000 Holy shit! 0.99

00:21:24.000 I thought it was 1400s. 0.99

00:21:26.000 The Tiger of the Skies.

00:21:28.000 Six feet tall.

00:21:29.000 Oh, it weighed only 35 pounds?

00:21:31.000 And it had a wingspan of 10 feet.

00:21:33.000 Wow, that's crazy because they're hollow bones, I guess.

00:21:36.000 35 pounds doesn't seem that much, man.

00:21:38.000 How do you go back to that picture? 0.99

00:21:39.000 How the fuck is that thing 35 pounds? 0.99

00:21:42.000 There's nothing six feet tall. 0.98

00:21:44.000 Ten foot wingspan.

00:21:45.000 That thing's only 35 pounds? 1.00

00:21:47.000 That seems wrong.

00:21:49.000 Like a turkey's heavy.

00:21:49.000 I don't know, man.

00:21:51.000 Like you pick up a turkey.

00:21:52.000 Yeah, you can get a turkey in like 25 pound range.

00:21:54.000 Yeah.

00:21:54.000 Look at the size of that thing.

00:21:56.000 Oh, no.

00:21:57.000 You see how big it is.

00:21:58.000 Every time I'm hanging around you, I hear about these like evil mystical animals and Well, I think the real concern was that the host eagle, they might have killed it off.

00:22:08.000 The local New Zealand folks might have killed it off back then because they were eating people. 1.00

00:22:13.000 I do not blame them in any way.

00:22:14.000 See if that's the truth.

00:22:15.000 That might be a lie.

00:22:17.000 We need to know about this host eagle.

00:22:19.000 I do need to know.

00:22:20.000 We hunted at a place called Haast when we were over there, so maybe there's a connection.

00:22:23.000 Maybe we're really finding.

00:22:25.000 Maybe find some ancient eagle skull.

00:22:28.000 Big ol' hook bone.

00:22:30.000 Just see if it ate people. 0.93

00:22:31.000 Relationship with humans.

00:22:32.000 You can Google that.

00:22:34.000 See where it says relationship with humans?

00:22:35.000 Yeah.

00:22:37.000 Could have been possible.

00:22:42.000 Even smaller golden eagles are capable of killing.

00:22:43.000 Yeah, they said they kill humans, which scientists believe could have been possible if the name relates to the eagle.

00:22:49.000 Given the massive size and strength of the bird, even smaller golden eagles are capable of killing prey as big as sick deer or bear cub. 1.00

00:22:58.000 Yeah, that fucking thing killed a few people. 1.00

00:23:00.000 For sure. 1.00

00:23:01.000 Like a baby.

00:23:02.000 You didn't think, yeah, like a baby.

00:23:06.000 You don't think that a predator like that did not learn what it could and could not go get.

00:23:12.000 Okay, so the sculpture's goofy.

00:23:15.000 Okay, the sculpture.

00:23:17.000 Is that the sculpture we were looking at?

00:23:18.000 Maybe.

00:23:19.000 Yeah, it was an approximation of it.

00:23:20.000 It says it's 7.5 meters, 25 feet tall.

00:23:23.000 No, that wasn't 25 feet tall.

00:23:25.000 Oh, with a wingspan of 11.5 meters.

00:23:28.000 38 feet.

00:23:29.000 Oh, okay.

00:23:31.000 That's the art park that we're looking at in New Zealand.

00:23:34.000 That's just a giant sculpture.

00:23:36.000 Of the animal.

00:23:37.000 Okay, I get you.

00:23:38.000 But there's a really cool eagle that lives in the rainforest called the Harpy Eagle that eats monkeys.

00:23:45.000 You ever seen that one?

00:23:46.000 I don't want to know about this stuff, man.

00:23:47.000 I think that's the biggest...

00:23:48.000 Because I'll probably find myself in a rainforest in a couple months, be looking up for harpy eagles all the time.

00:23:54.000 Well, there was a dude that was trying to put a camera in a harpy eagle nest, and he got attacked by a harpy eagle.

00:24:00.000 Well, that dude shouldn't have been doing that.

00:24:01.000 Well, he's a scientist.

00:24:02.000 Well, that's what he does.

00:24:04.000 Should have worked in a movie theater or something.

00:24:08.000 That's his fault, dude.

00:24:09.000 That was his thing, man.

00:24:11.000 We've got to stop looking at these terrible winged beasts.

00:24:14.000 The Harpy Eagle's cool looking because it's kind of white.

00:24:16.000 Look, and we were talking about this when we were in Lanai.

00:24:18.000 I have a problem swimming in the ocean because I feel like I look like a seal all the time when I'm in there.

00:24:23.000 And I feel like sharks will, they're like, look at that.

00:24:23.000 Right.

00:24:26.000 The guy just got both his legs bitten off yesterday in Florida.

00:24:26.000 That looks delicious.

00:24:29.000 See?

00:24:30.000 This is awareness, man.

00:24:30.000 Yeah.

00:24:32.000 Chomp.

00:24:33.000 And you're done.

00:24:34.000 So now I'm scared of the skies thanks to this.

00:24:36.000 Did you know that the bull shark swims so far upriver that they live in freshwater and they've been found as high as Illinois? 0.97

00:24:45.000 They go upriver to fucking Illinois, and they're the most aggressive sharks. 0.98

00:24:49.000 I heard that. 1.00

00:24:50.000 I've heard that before.

00:24:51.000 I used to live right on the Illinois River.

00:24:52.000 Well, they also are the reason why the movie Jaws wasn't inspired by a great white shark.

00:24:57.000 It was inspired by a series of attacks by bull sharks in freshwater rivers in New Jersey.

00:25:03.000 We gotta talk about something else.

00:25:04.000 It's freaking me out, Joe.

00:25:07.000 And they made the music?

00:25:08.000 Like, ah, it's terrible.

00:25:11.000 It gets in your psyche, that stuff.

00:25:13.000 What would the music be for one of those big eagles?

00:25:15.000 Same.

00:25:16.000 It would be death metal.

00:25:20.000 He'd be out in the field and you'd hear that death metal music.

00:25:24.000 I've seen too much.

00:25:25.000 Over in Nepal, they have these big things called longergears.

00:25:28.000 It's a Nepali griffin.

00:25:30.000 It looks like a big old vulture.

00:25:32.000 Look that thing up, see what the wingspan are on those.

00:25:34.000 But we'd be up on some mountain glassing for sheep, and there'd be a giant thing with an eight, nine foot wingspan. 0.98

00:25:41.000 And you could see, the creepiest part to me was, you could see their heads moving back and forth like they were looking for shit. 0.98

00:25:51.000 And they take and kill baby sheep. 0.99

00:25:55.000 I saw a video after I cut back and I was kind of freaking out about these things.

00:25:58.000 And it's a vulture?

00:25:59.000 Yeah, it's like a Nepali. 1.00

00:26:01.000 They call it a langergar.

00:26:02.000 And when we were there, they told us, oh, you're going to see griffins.

00:26:05.000 So it had a variety of names, like everything there seems to have.

00:26:11.000 But it looks like a vulture.

00:26:13.000 It's like a giant vulture.

00:26:14.000 I didn't know that they hunted.

00:26:15.000 That's interesting.

00:26:16.000 I watched something on like Planet Earth about them and that they showed them in packs and they eat bone marrow.

00:26:25.000 So they would get a bone off the ground, fly up into the air and strategically drop it onto the ground so it would crack open, fly down, eat the insides.

00:26:33.000 Wow.

00:26:34.000 Yeah.

00:26:34.000 I wonder how they figured that out.

00:26:36.000 The same thing, you could just see their brains churning.

00:26:39.000 A lot of times you see an animal in the sky, a bird in the sky, and you still get soaring around, but you could see the predatory brain of this Langergar as it flew above us, just churning as it looked around for what to get after. 0.99

00:26:52.000 Well, they say ravens are stupid smart, like as smart as chimps. 0.98

00:26:56.000 Well, you think about this bird. 1.00

00:26:56.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:26:57.000 I mean, this bird's brain the size of what?

00:26:59.000 I don't know, a lemon. 1.00

00:27:00.000 But it literally found out, I want to get inside that bone, I'm going to fly up and drop this son of a bitch and eat the insides. 0.99

00:27:09.000 Well, somewhere along the line, they figured a long time ago how to drop things off cliffs. 0.99

00:27:13.000 Absolutely.

00:27:14.000 They've been doing that with goats and stuff.

00:27:15.000 There's a ton of videos of them grabbing goats and pulling them out like eagles in particular.

00:27:20.000 Whoa, that's the longer guy?

00:27:21.000 What is that thing? 0.99

00:27:23.000 That thing looks fucking evil, man. 1.00

00:27:25.000 Holy shit! 1.00

00:27:28.000 Look at the face on that thing. 0.99

00:27:30.000 I think when I was over there, when we were in the mountains, I just wrote like a whole page about this longer yard we saw.

00:27:36.000 I don't remember it being that color.

00:27:38.000 It wasn't that color.

00:27:39.000 That's amazing.

00:27:40.000 That looks like one in the zoo.

00:27:42.000 Oh my god.

00:27:43.000 They were jet black, the ones we saw.

00:27:44.000 Imagine how scary that looks, but just being jet black. 0.96

00:27:49.000 Coloration?

00:27:50.000 What is that, a bone in its mouth?

00:27:52.000 A swallowing hole?

00:27:53.000 Yep.

00:27:54.000 Ugh, primitive creature.

00:27:56.000 Just no, like, complete emotionless eyes.

00:28:00.000 Yeah.

00:28:01.000 I vividly remember looking up at some point and seeing this thing floating in the breeze and looking around and thinking, that thing is savage.

00:28:11.000 How big did they get, Jamin? 0.99

00:28:14.000 What a weird name, Lumbergeier.

00:28:16.000 How do you spell it?

00:28:17.000 L-A-M-M-E-R-G-E-I-R. Over there they described it, originally our guy described it as a griffin.

00:28:26.000 But a griffin's like a mythological picture, right?

00:28:27.000 Yeah, I know.

00:28:28.000 That's why I was thinking I'm going to see this mythological picture.

00:28:30.000 That's what it was.

00:28:32.000 I was waiting for something to land and talk to us.

00:28:35.000 That's a place in New Zealand that's a perfect location if they ever decided to do some sort of a Jurassic Park type situation.

00:28:45.000 Well, even Lanai.

00:28:46.000 Right.

00:28:47.000 Four feet tall.

00:28:48.000 Nine foot wingspan.

00:28:49.000 There it is.

00:28:50.000 Wow.

00:28:51.000 Again, look at this weight.

00:28:52.000 Fifteen pounds.

00:28:54.000 That's crazy.

00:28:55.000 Nine foot wingspan.

00:28:57.000 Whoa.

00:28:57.000 What is that?

00:28:58.000 That's the wise old wizard vulture.

00:29:00.000 I don't want that.

00:29:00.000 The Egyptian vulture.

00:29:02.000 I'm going to have dreams about this podcast.

00:29:04.000 That's its closest relative. 1.00

00:29:05.000 What the fuck? 1.00

00:29:06.000 Isn't it crazy that nature just designed a really creepy, shitty looking animal to come down and eat all the dead shit? 1.00

00:29:14.000 Where's that picture from right there? 1.00

00:29:17.000 I don't know, man. 1.00

00:29:18.000 Looks old as fuck. 1.00

00:29:19.000 Whatever it is. 1.00

00:29:20.000 Looks like it could be in Nepal or Tibet.

00:29:22.000 Overhunting has led to the endangerment of the species.

00:29:25.000 Hmm.

00:29:27.000 It's weird how nature has evolved these animals, or they have evolved, to develop that weird look.

00:29:33.000 Like, vultures look disgusting.

00:29:36.000 They do. 0.95

00:29:37.000 But look at that thing's face. 0.99

00:29:39.000 There's something about the way nature has evolved, or they have evolved.

00:29:45.000 And they're not, yeah.

00:29:47.000 They've evolved to look scary.

00:29:48.000 Yeah.

00:29:49.000 Cute animals are delicious.

00:29:51.000 Right.

00:29:52.000 A rabbit.

00:29:53.000 Yeah.

00:29:54.000 Deer?

00:29:54.000 Delicious.

00:29:55.000 Deer.

00:29:55.000 Delicious.

00:29:56.000 Delicious.

00:29:56.000 Gorgeous animals.

00:29:58.000 Like if you eat a bear, like some people think bear are cute, but you got to cook the shit out of it. 0.96

00:29:58.000 Right. 0.96

00:30:03.000 Yeah.

00:30:04.000 Can we, let's address something right now.

00:30:06.000 Okay.

00:30:07.000 Bear meat is good.

00:30:09.000 It's very good.

00:30:10.000 Yeah.

00:30:10.000 It can be very good.

00:30:10.000 It's very good.

00:30:11.000 Depending upon what they eat.

00:30:12.000 Depending on what they eat and where you're at.

00:30:13.000 Like if you're going in September to Prince of Wales, Alaska and you shoot one and it's just been eating salmon for a couple weeks.

00:30:19.000 Clams on the beach.

00:30:20.000 You don't want to eat that thing.

00:30:21.000 Right.

00:30:21.000 But if you go somewhere where good vegetation and it's, well, it's got a lot of fat on it, it can be good.

00:30:29.000 I would argue it's not to be celebrated.

00:30:31.000 It's not that good.

00:30:33.000 It depends.

00:30:36.000 Apparently, if you eat a blueberry bear, it's one of the best meats ever.

00:30:39.000 Yeah.

00:30:40.000 Rinella raves about it.

00:30:41.000 See, if Rinella does, I've eaten a lot of bears, and I like eating them.

00:30:46.000 I wouldn't throw them away or whatever.

00:30:48.000 So I would continue to hunt them, but I've never had that same feeling of like an elk tenderloin or elk backstrap.

00:30:54.000 Or axis.

00:30:55.000 Or an axis.

00:30:56.000 It's not in that category.

00:30:57.000 So I feel like maybe we overcompensate a little bit because there's so much pushback on bear hunting.

00:31:02.000 We start talking about how great it is.

00:31:02.000 Right.

00:31:03.000 It's really good, but it's not like, it's not, it doesn't get to that next level.

00:31:03.000 How great it is.

00:31:07.000 Have you had smoked bear ham though?

00:31:09.000 I have.

00:31:10.000 That's pretty damn good.

00:31:10.000 It's very delicious.

00:31:12.000 But that's one of those things where it's like it's smoked, it's brined, it's treated.

00:31:16.000 And that's the biggest thing, right?

00:31:18.000 Most meats that you're going to go hunting for, you look at the cut of meat and you treat it accordingly, right?

00:31:24.000 And so there's no, you have to, obviously because of trichinosis, you have to cook a bear all the way through to a certain temperature.

00:31:32.000 So that may be, because I love rare meat, that may be my problem.

00:31:35.000 I don't know.

00:31:35.000 But I think maybe a little bit we could address the fact that hunters are a little bit overcompensated for the fact that people are pushing back on them so much.

00:31:42.000 And then they're like, I love bear!

00:31:45.000 It's good.

00:31:45.000 Right.

00:31:46.000 But I wouldn't choose it.

00:31:47.000 It's not my favorite.

00:31:47.000 I wouldn't choose it over a lot of other meats.

00:31:49.000 Not to say it's bad.

00:31:50.000 Like if someone told me you have to pick one animal forever, I'd probably say elk.

00:31:55.000 Yeah, and bear would be pretty far down the list.

00:31:57.000 Yeah, it wouldn't make it in the top three or four.

00:31:59.000 Right.

00:31:59.000 It would be all...

00:32:00.000 Well, that's, again, the thing that you just said.

00:32:03.000 Like, I like eating things medium rare or rare.

00:32:05.000 That's where they taste the best.

00:32:06.000 Yes.

00:32:07.000 Yeah.

00:32:08.000 And so, look, I'm not...

00:32:09.000 I would never put somebody down for...

00:32:12.000 I love bear meat.

00:32:12.000 I eat it all the time.

00:32:13.000 That's great.

00:32:14.000 I just...

00:32:15.000 That's a point I've always kind of thought in my head.

00:32:17.000 It's not the best.

00:32:17.000 Yeah.

00:32:17.000 I've always thought in my head like, mm, okay.

00:32:19.000 It's like people like largemouth bass fishing, but if you go to a restaurant and they have largemouth bass right next to Chilean sea bass and you pick the largemouth bass, you're kind of an asshole. 1.00

00:32:28.000 You're lying to yourself. 1.00

00:32:29.000 Yeah.

00:32:29.000 Like, come on, man.

00:32:31.000 Yeah.

00:32:31.000 It doesn't taste that good.

00:32:32.000 It's okay.

00:32:33.000 It's edible.

00:32:34.000 It's edible.

00:32:34.000 It's really good.

00:32:35.000 I mean, if you...

00:32:35.000 It's a bad example because largemouth bass tastes...

00:32:38.000 Bear tastes way better than largemouth bass.

00:32:41.000 We're going down the track.

00:32:43.000 Like, largemouth bass just doesn't taste that good.

00:32:45.000 Bear tastes better than largemouth bass.

00:32:46.000 Have you had largemouth?

00:32:47.000 No.

00:32:48.000 It's okay.

00:32:50.000 It's like there's some delicious freshwater fish.

00:32:53.000 Delicious.

00:32:54.000 You go to Alaska, and they're everywhere.

00:32:55.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:32:57.000 But yeah, I'm not much of a fish eater anyway.

00:33:00.000 John Barklow from Sitka was in Vegas this past weekend.

00:33:04.000 Love that dude.

00:33:05.000 Yeah, he's a great guy.

00:33:06.000 Him and Dave Brinker were there.

00:33:08.000 And he was talking about how...

00:33:10.000 I love that guy, too.

00:33:11.000 I know.

00:33:11.000 I don't want to leave him out.

00:33:12.000 Oh, yeah.

00:33:12.000 Love you guys.

00:33:14.000 Miss you guys.

00:33:15.000 Love you guys.

00:33:17.000 But John was talking about how he actually enjoyed brown bear meat.

00:33:23.000 And I was like, really?

00:33:24.000 And he's like, he goes, it tasted like a mule deer roast.

00:33:27.000 He goes, I made it and I gave it to people at parties.

00:33:29.000 And he said, he cut it up into cubes and put little toothpicks in it and handed it out as hors d'oeuvres at a party.

00:33:37.000 And people were eating it and they're like, wow, this is delicious.

00:33:39.000 What is it?

00:33:40.000 And he goes, it's a brown bear.

00:33:41.000 And people got mad at him.

00:33:43.000 Of course they did.

00:33:44.000 Of course they did.

00:33:45.000 It's a person.

00:33:46.000 I love that he did it.

00:33:47.000 I love that he did it, though.

00:33:48.000 I fully support that idea.

00:33:50.000 Right, but I would assume that if someone like John, who works for Sitka, this is probably the number one hunting gear clothing company in the world.

00:33:58.000 And John is a wealth of knowledge.

00:34:00.000 Yes.

00:34:00.000 All the way through.

00:34:01.000 And, you know, had a considerable amount of experience in the military.

00:34:04.000 I would imagine the people that would come to his house for a party would be normalized.

00:34:09.000 What would happen in LA if you did that?

00:34:12.000 God, they'd go crazy.

00:34:14.000 Yeah, there'd be riots.

00:34:15.000 Yeah, you should see the look on people's faces when my kids tell them that they've eaten bear.

00:34:20.000 Because, you know, when the kids are like five and six, like, I've eaten bear!

00:34:24.000 I ate a bear!

00:34:25.000 It was awesome!

00:34:26.000 Woo! 0.99

00:34:26.000 Do they have that, like, fierce look in their eyes? 0.99

00:34:28.000 Like, you just had, like, I ate a bear!

00:34:30.000 Yeah, they think it's fun to freak people out.

00:34:32.000 I do like that part of it.

00:34:33.000 And your daughter's so cute.

00:34:35.000 That's a wonderful thing coming out of there.

00:34:38.000 It's weird, right?

00:34:40.000 The bear thing is a very strange one, and I definitely don't like hunting them like I like hunting anything else.

00:34:47.000 I struggle with that.

00:34:48.000 As a hunter, I feel like coming on and talking as a hunter, I don't want to...

00:34:52.000 Disparage.

00:34:52.000 Disparage anything, but I also just want to be 100% honest about every part of it.

00:34:57.000 And hunting is this really complex activity, and I feel conflicted about it almost every time I go.

00:35:03.000 Like, not about killing the animal or hunting, but just about little parts of what's going on.

00:35:06.000 Yeah.

00:35:07.000 And so bear hunting...

00:35:08.000 Which also, sometimes you just want to...

00:35:09.000 Like, Ranella said this once, and I never understood it until it happened to me.

00:35:12.000 He's like, I just want to watch them sometimes.

00:35:14.000 I don't really want to hunt them.

00:35:17.000 What is hunting anyway?

00:35:18.000 Is hunting killing or is hunting getting close enough to shake their hand?

00:35:21.000 Or is it the whole thing?

00:35:22.000 Yeah, it's the whole thing.

00:35:23.000 I think my opinion on that specific point is...

00:35:28.000 One I would go back to, I always ask myself two questions.

00:35:31.000 Why are you going?

00:35:33.000 And does this hunting benefit the place and the animal that you're hunting?

00:35:38.000 And if I can't answer those questions myself, and I always strip away conservation and meat from the first question.

00:35:45.000 Well, you have a very good way of looking at this.

00:35:47.000 I think it's very honest.

00:35:48.000 I think this is super important.

00:35:49.000 Is that conservation is essentially a side effect of hunting.

00:35:53.000 It's a byproduct, right?

00:35:54.000 And to pretend that it's the whole thing.

00:35:57.000 It's almost like a weird...

00:35:58.000 It's a disingenuous approach to the argument.

00:36:02.000 It really is.

00:36:02.000 People saying you shouldn't be hunting will say, well, hunting is conservation and hunters are the best conservationists.

00:36:07.000 Okay.

00:36:07.000 Part of that's true, but it's not...

00:36:09.000 Part of it is true, but it's not really why you're doing it.

00:36:11.000 And here's the biggest point to make.

00:36:13.000 There's semantic chinks in that armor, right? 0.93

00:36:15.000 Right.

00:36:15.000 We've built up over the years as hunters, like, they use organic meat and conservation as this, like, armor, right?

00:36:21.000 Right.

00:36:21.000 That insulates why we go.

00:36:23.000 Right.

00:36:23.000 And I think there's just chinks in that armor that if we don't recognize those points, especially the conservation one, I think that's a bigger deal.

00:36:31.000 Like conservation, hunting is a tool for conservation.

00:36:34.000 It's the same way as translocation is a tool for conservationists.

00:36:37.000 You can move the animal to get him away from a certain situation, reintroduce the animal.

00:36:43.000 That's one way.

00:36:44.000 Or bring in hunters and help banish the population that way.

00:36:48.000 But that first question, right, is why do I go?

00:36:52.000 And I always say it's like, We've had experiences, you and I, together in the woods that we couldn't replicate anywhere else. 0.97

00:36:59.000 Like, you've done a lot of cool shit. 0.98

00:37:01.000 And there's some, like, when you ran down the road after I shot my moose. 0.98

00:37:06.000 Like, there's just something about that for me that is way more fulfilling and enriching to my life than any other thing I've experienced.

00:37:13.000 I haven't experienced everything, but all the things that I've done.

00:37:17.000 Well, it's so primal.

00:37:18.000 Right.

00:37:18.000 And so it's that.

00:37:19.000 It's learning about animals.

00:37:21.000 You're in the woods, too.

00:37:22.000 You're also in a really almost like you're a visitor in an alien world.

00:37:26.000 Exactly.

00:37:26.000 And so you learn about these animals.

00:37:28.000 You develop skills.

00:37:29.000 I feel like you wouldn't develop any other way.

00:37:33.000 And on and on it goes.

00:37:34.000 I mean, there's probably a hundred reasons that I discover a new one every time I go.

00:37:38.000 And so I always say, like, that's the answer to the first question.

00:37:41.000 Why do I go?

00:37:42.000 It's not like, man, I'm real hungry and I want to control the population.

00:37:46.000 I'm aware as I go hunting that those two things are byproducts of my efforts.

00:37:50.000 And they're always going to be byproducts in my efforts, unless I'm poaching.

00:37:54.000 You know, there is a biologist, a state wildlife biologist, federal biologists that determine what tags go where, what animals.

00:38:02.000 They're moving pieces of the puzzle around to keep this thing the way it is, right?

00:38:06.000 Keep it healthy, keep it stable.

00:38:07.000 But they're also looking at what's the economic impact of that.

00:38:10.000 All that's going on while I'm out there thinking, I've got to kill this big buck.

00:38:15.000 But I'm not thinking, while I'm out there with my bow, I'm not thinking... 0.99

00:38:18.000 Well, I'd like to kill that one because that'll really stabilize this area. 0.99

00:38:22.000 Right. 1.00

00:38:22.000 I'm out there and I'm, ah, kill that one because I really like backstraps. 1.00

00:38:26.000 I know those two things are happening, but they're almost like, you pull that away from what's actually going on and focus on why you're there.

00:38:34.000 Like, why did you go to Lanai?

00:38:36.000 If somebody said, why'd you go, what would you say?

00:38:39.000 Two reasons.

00:38:40.000 One, to bow hunt for meat.

00:38:43.000 For sure, because I wanted to eat axis deer.

00:38:46.000 And two, because I think that it's great practice.

00:38:50.000 One of the hardest things about bow hunting is just you can practice all day on a target, but it's almost like never sparring.

00:38:58.000 Like you could practice all day hitting a heavy bag, but you've never hit a person.

00:39:02.000 Right.

00:39:02.000 Like once you're in front of a person, things get weird.

00:39:05.000 Well, and there's a chink in the armor, right? 1.00

00:39:06.000 So you say, I practice on an animal.

00:39:08.000 That's terrible.

00:39:09.000 I would say to that, like, that's just another chink in the armor that we all know is happening. 1.00

00:39:14.000 Like, if we were conservationists, we would never pick up a bow.

00:39:17.000 Yeah, but I'm not practicing on an animal like I've never practiced before.

00:39:21.000 Practicing may be being the wrong term.

00:39:23.000 Like, there's something in there that, like, the experience of stalking an animal is pretty visceral. 0.97

00:39:27.000 And if you've never done it, you can shoot in your back or the hell you want.

00:39:30.000 Well, I say practice in terms of, like, when you compete as a young martial artist, it's not really practice, but it is.

00:39:38.000 Like, you're involved in competition.

00:39:40.000 So, like, are you hunting or are you practicing?

00:39:43.000 Well, you're definitely hunting, but that hunting is practice.

00:39:47.000 For other hunts where you don't get nearly as many opportunities as you do in Lanai.

00:39:50.000 Lanai is one of the best examples of a place that has no predators and a real problem with overpopulation.

00:39:57.000 You weren't with me and Dudley that one time where me and him and his son were hanging out and we were there at last light and we were watching these axis deer come off the mountain and we saw I don't know how many hundreds.

00:40:11.000 I mean, it might have been seven, eight hundred deer coming off this mountain. 0.99

00:40:14.000 And we were like, what the fuck? 0.99

00:40:16.000 It was just crazy. 1.00

00:40:17.000 There's ten more.

00:40:18.000 There's five more.

00:40:18.000 There's six more.

00:40:19.000 There's eleven more.

00:40:20.000 There's a herd of twenty. 1.00

00:40:21.000 Like, what the fuck? 0.99

00:40:22.000 It got to the point where we're like, this is crazy. 1.00

00:40:25.000 So in a place like that, I feel like you have a great ethical argument for they are going to shoot these animals, period.

00:40:34.000 And the only other way to get around it is you bring in wolves.

00:40:37.000 And if you bring in wolves, guess what?

00:40:39.000 Then you have wolves.

00:40:40.000 Then you have wolves.

00:40:41.000 These people also have dogs running around on the streets.

00:40:44.000 You know, like pet dogs. 1.00

00:40:45.000 Those dogs would get fucked immediately. 1.00

00:40:47.000 They're going to get killed by wolves because wolves want to take out all the possible... 1.00

00:40:51.000 You can't have wolves on the nigh. 1.00

00:40:52.000 It's a stupid idea. 0.99

00:40:54.000 Hey, everybody, we're never gonna do that. 1.00

00:40:56.000 But, so, it's one of, in terms of, like, since the animals are there, and there's no talk of eradicating them because they have a real value, the people that live there live off of them.

00:41:08.000 Like, all those folks that we were hanging out with, like Roman, and a lot of the people that work at that place, they eat Axis all the time, and it is, without a doubt, not an, it is the opposite, it is the most delicious game meat in the world.

00:41:22.000 If it's not I gotta say it's number one.

00:41:25.000 If it's not number one, it's number two.

00:41:27.000 Yeah.

00:41:28.000 It's amazing.

00:41:29.000 It's so good.

00:41:30.000 Like, we ate it at the restaurant.

00:41:31.000 They served it at the restaurant.

00:41:32.000 Oh, yeah.

00:41:33.000 Remember the burger we had at that one lunch?

00:41:34.000 Oh, my gosh.

00:41:35.000 Insane.

00:41:35.000 And then the steak place at that place, terrible.

00:41:40.000 Terrible meaning good.

00:41:41.000 Terribly good.

00:41:42.000 Like, so terrible, I can't get it out of my mind.

00:41:44.000 Those sliders are insane. 1.00

00:41:45.000 Oh, yeah, that's what it was.

00:41:46.000 They were sliders, yeah. 0.78

00:41:47.000 But the restaurant serves tenderloin, and it is phenomenal.

00:41:51.000 It's so good.

00:41:54.000 So that's one thing I always try to separate.

00:41:57.000 And I try to do it only because I think...

00:42:00.000 I try to look at it from someone else who's a non-hunter and is hearing us talk or hearing me talk or whatever.

00:42:07.000 And maybe thinking, like, that's a weird part of that.

00:42:09.000 Like, that's strange.

00:42:10.000 And so I feel like if I can say...

00:42:13.000 Yes, the meat is delicious. 1.00

00:42:14.000 Yes, they gotta kill these things. 0.78

00:42:16.000 Yes, the local people value the animal because hunters exist. 0.97

00:42:21.000 They wouldn't just gun them down because hunters will pay to go out there.

00:42:24.000 All those things, I think, set aside...

00:42:28.000 What am I there for?

00:42:29.000 Like, we were, that group of hunters we had in camp was probably, I mean, I've hunted with a lot of awesome, talented folks, was probably the most skilled group of hunters I've ever been around.

00:42:40.000 Well, think about who we have.

00:42:41.000 We have John Dudley.

00:42:42.000 He's arguably, if not the best bowhunter in the world, he's in the top three.

00:42:45.000 I think it's like, it's like John, well, there's like top four.

00:42:48.000 Like, John, Cam, Remy, and Adam.

00:42:52.000 Adam Greentree.

00:42:53.000 Yeah.

00:42:53.000 Of all the people I've hunted with, that's the top four, I would say.

00:42:56.000 They might be the top four in the world.

00:42:57.000 They might be.

00:42:58.000 If they're not top four, they're in the top ten.

00:43:01.000 Yeah.

00:43:01.000 Come see us.

00:43:02.000 If you think you're better, come see us. 1.00

00:43:04.000 It's a clan of killers. 0.99

00:43:05.000 Yeah.

00:43:05.000 I mean, and then you got Shane Dorian, who's a great bowhunter, too, and the best big wave surfer in the world.

00:43:10.000 You gotta say about Shane, he's fanatical.

00:43:13.000 Oh, yeah.

00:43:14.000 I'd be like, hey, Shane, you want to go take a break and get a sandwich?

00:43:17.000 And he'd look at me like, what?

00:43:19.000 Yeah, he's like, no.

00:43:20.000 We could be hunting.

00:43:20.000 Why would we be eating sandwiches?

00:43:22.000 Yeah.

00:43:22.000 He was out there all day.

00:43:23.000 Every day, all day.

00:43:24.000 He didn't even come in.

00:43:24.000 He didn't come in during lunchtime when everybody else was in because it was 95 degrees outside.

00:43:29.000 He's out there on his hands and knees crawling through the bushes.

00:43:32.000 Just crawling.

00:43:33.000 Hoping to find one slipping.

00:43:34.000 Just crawling.

00:43:35.000 Just forever to crawl in.

00:43:37.000 So for me, one reason to do that...

00:43:40.000 Stripping away all the things that I know to be right right in my own mind Was that was those people getting them all together and then like meeting Roman and meeting Brandon and meet Alec all our guides and all the locals that were there like Those are things I and I learned more about The quick twitch muscle on a guy to hear oh my god than I've ever learned so I feel like I've learned something I spent time with these people that that made me better at not just hunting but everything and Well,

00:44:06.000 for people who've never been around an access deer before, they evolved with tigers.

00:44:10.000 So tigers hunt them. 0.84

00:44:12.000 I mean, you've never seen an animal more fast in your life.

00:44:15.000 How about that one deer that we shot?

00:44:17.000 I shot at this deer.

00:44:18.000 It was 60 yards away. 0.98

00:44:19.000 It was looking at me, and I was like, I think I'm going to shoot it.

00:44:22.000 It's just standing there.

00:44:23.000 By the time my arrow got there, it was four or five deer away.

00:44:27.000 It was swimming to Maui.

00:44:29.000 It built a boat and it was rowing over.

00:44:31.000 So 60 yards away, the arrow's going 275 feet a second.

00:44:36.000 And it was nowhere near it by the time it got there. 0.99

00:44:39.000 It's like, bitch, please! 1.00

00:44:41.000 They're so fast. 1.00

00:44:43.000 They're faster than any animal I've ever seen.

00:44:44.000 Well, that lets you say, like, what a weird scenario to be hunting an animal that has been trained by tigers to avoid you.

00:44:51.000 Yeah.

00:44:51.000 You know, what a weird thing.

00:44:53.000 So, like, that's my appreciation.

00:44:55.000 Yeah.

00:44:55.000 That little exchange of, hey, me and tigers both hunted this thing.

00:44:59.000 I know.

00:44:59.000 Like, that's something cool to me that's outside of this thing.

00:45:03.000 So, you talk about that all day.

00:45:04.000 And then the meat.

00:45:05.000 Look, if you're a person who values animal protein, if you like ethically sourced animal protein, there's no better way to get it than a place like Lanai.

00:45:16.000 All the pieces are in check. 0.76

00:45:17.000 Do they need to kill them? 0.99

00:45:18.000 Yes. 1.00

00:45:18.000 Is there an overpopulation problem? 1.00

00:45:20.000 Yes.

00:45:20.000 Does it provide jobs for locals?

00:45:21.000 Yes.

00:45:22.000 Yes, all the good things.

00:45:23.000 I mean, there's a lot of positive sides to it.

00:45:26.000 And again, if you're someone who enjoys bow hunting, like, look, it's an uncomfortable thing for some people, but I enjoy it.

00:45:32.000 I like it.

00:45:32.000 I like getting my meat that way.

00:45:34.000 I don't like, I feel bad if I get bacon from a store.

00:45:38.000 I feel like...

00:45:39.000 What are we talking about, like, as predators?

00:45:41.000 Like, we are predators.

00:45:42.000 Like, you look at, you know, it's been millions of years we've been killing and eating things.

00:45:45.000 No, humans are herbivores, and that's all a lie.

00:45:48.000 I don't know.

00:45:49.000 I've done some reading.

00:45:50.000 You don't have to be a predator.

00:45:51.000 Look, you don't have to be a predator.

00:45:52.000 You could live off of...

00:45:54.000 But aren't we, though?

00:45:55.000 Some people.

00:45:56.000 But look, you could live...

00:45:57.000 My point is, if you wanted to, I don't want to disparage the way anybody lives their life.

00:46:00.000 You could live off of just pure vegetables.

00:46:03.000 By the way, there's a real moral and ethical argument if you are a vegan to eat mollusks, folks.

00:46:10.000 Because mollusks are more primitive than most plants.

00:46:13.000 They don't communicate as much as plants do.

00:46:16.000 They don't have any sense of feeling.

00:46:18.000 They have no nerve endings that would allow them to feel pain.

00:46:22.000 They're incredibly simple organisms.

00:46:25.000 The only thing that we have against them in terms of like when we think about them as being an animal versus, you know, like a plant.

00:46:32.000 People think eating a plant is cruelty-free.

00:46:35.000 Eating a mollusk, you're killing a living creature, right?

00:46:38.000 But that's just because they move. 0.99

00:46:40.000 But a fucking Venus flytrap moves too, and it's probably ten times smarter than like a scallop. 1.00

00:46:45.000 Like, they're not smart. 0.99

00:46:46.000 It's hard to regulate that morality.

00:46:48.000 It is, but I mean, I just want people...

00:46:51.000 If you're uncomfortable with eating chicken, I get it.

00:46:54.000 But eat clams and oysters, and those things are good for you.

00:46:58.000 They really are. 0.98

00:46:59.000 And it's sustainable, and the animals themselves are not feeling shit. 0.93

00:47:05.000 Yeah. 0.72

00:47:05.000 The moral entanglements of all of it is just... 0.72

00:47:08.000 And like, you know, we say, we humans, we wake up in the morning and you consume everything.

00:47:12.000 Like, you're just consuming.

00:47:13.000 You breathe air, you pump out CO2. And every other animal does too.

00:47:17.000 They just wander around, chewing on the grass.

00:47:19.000 We're just consumption engines.

00:47:21.000 And like, for us to separate out one part of our consumption and then like, beat the crap out of it, even though we've been doing it for two million years, is in and of itself kind of weird.

00:47:31.000 Well, you know what I think happened?

00:47:33.000 Is your mic on?

00:47:35.000 That was so weird.

00:47:36.000 That was very loud.

00:47:37.000 It was weird.

00:47:38.000 It was like it was in my ear.

00:47:40.000 Jamie's on the ride brainer.

00:47:42.000 He's getting crazy.

00:47:43.000 But I think part of the issue is that people over the last hundred years or so have been so removed from where the meat comes from that when they can find a direct connection like, oh, you went and you shot a moose and then you ate that moose?

00:47:58.000 Like, you killed the moose?

00:48:00.000 Like, you didn't have to kill that moose.

00:48:02.000 Like, that becomes problematic because people aren't used to someone killing things.

00:48:07.000 People that they know in particular.

00:48:09.000 No, and I enjoy the ideological conversation.

00:48:12.000 I just enjoy the conversation.

00:48:13.000 I enjoy it because I think it's part of a human condition.

00:48:16.000 It's part of who we are and what we do.

00:48:18.000 So yeah, we should probably fight about it a little bit and disagree because it's pretty damn important.

00:48:22.000 This is an important piece of our humanity.

00:48:24.000 It is important.

00:48:25.000 That we're talking about.

00:48:25.000 So I feel very strongly that hunting is the essence of who I am as a human and has made my life better.

00:48:31.000 But I can see how somebody else would say, you're killing stuff.

00:48:35.000 I can too, and I also think that those people are important.

00:48:37.000 I think so.

00:48:38.000 I think having vegans and having animal rights activists and having to be able to have dialogue with them, it also makes sure that you keep people honest, like people that are hunters.

00:48:49.000 Yeah.

00:48:49.000 Like, you know, like...

00:48:51.000 Because we all know unethical people.

00:48:53.000 There's people that are unethical.

00:48:55.000 Absolutely.

00:48:56.000 I always think about it, you know, if you look at the trend of hunting, in the 70s, hunting was doing great.

00:49:01.000 And then in the 80s, it started to tick down. 0.99

00:49:04.000 Fucking Bambi. 1.00

00:49:04.000 That's what happened, bro. 1.00

00:49:05.000 Well, I would say three...

00:49:06.000 We talked about this before, like three things.

00:49:08.000 Bambi, maybe Walt Disney. 1.00

00:49:10.000 He was maybe a dick. 1.00

00:49:11.000 I don't know. 1.00

00:49:14.000 And then urbanization.

00:49:16.000 Right.

00:49:16.000 Which correlated with the decline in hunting.

00:49:19.000 And then hunters being the third one.

00:49:20.000 Messaging.

00:49:21.000 We're bad PR agents.

00:49:22.000 Some of them are bad PR agents.

00:49:24.000 Not all of them.

00:49:25.000 And then there's people like Grinella that are amazing at it.

00:49:27.000 We're way better now than we were five years ago.

00:49:29.000 We're better tomorrow than we were yesterday.

00:49:31.000 But I think in general, if you look at that line graph, right?

00:49:34.000 In the 70s it was going nicely.

00:49:35.000 In the 80s it started to decline.

00:49:37.000 And I think 2011 was the first time it actually went up.

00:49:40.000 Oh, really?

00:49:41.000 The number of, I think it's licensed sales or number of hunters participating.

00:49:44.000 I wonder what caused that.

00:49:45.000 I bet it's like the organic food movement.

00:49:47.000 There was a study that said Locovores, they're talking about more women, they talked about returning military members.

00:49:53.000 I remember reading the study.

00:49:54.000 I think those were the top three.

00:49:55.000 But I think Locovore was probably pushed out there as like, the way to reverse that second point, the way to reverse the suburban and urban rise, was to take that suburban male or female and say, you can hunt and get your food.

00:50:09.000 Right.

00:50:10.000 And then that's a way to kind of reverse the decline.

00:50:12.000 And I think that's probably what was happening.

00:50:15.000 Hmm.

00:50:15.000 Well, everybody wants to go with locally sourced, locally raised, grass fed.

00:50:20.000 People are trying to go to farmers markets and connect with the people that are actually growing the animals.

00:50:26.000 And this is like one step better than that.

00:50:28.000 Instead of having an animal that's in captivity, go out into the forest.

00:50:31.000 But there's a rude awakening for a lot of these people that think they're going to just go ahead and try it.

00:50:36.000 It is not easy by any stretch of the imagination.

00:50:39.000 That's the other problem.

00:50:40.000 It's the Grand Canyon.

00:50:41.000 I would love to procure my own elk meat, and killing an elk is like being on two sides of the Grand Canyon.

00:50:48.000 There's no bridge to be built there.

00:50:49.000 You've got to take it one step at a time.

00:50:51.000 And for most people, they don't have time for that.

00:50:53.000 They don't have the want to do that.

00:50:55.000 So I would say, what is it, like 14 million hunters in the world or something like that?

00:50:59.000 Or in our country.

00:51:01.000 How many non-hunters who don't either have the wherewithal to get educated or want to, or just don't fall into the anti-hunter side, like the agnostic crowd?

00:51:12.000 How many of those are there out there?

00:51:14.000 Right.

00:51:15.000 I don't know.

00:51:16.000 But it's hundreds of millions of people.

00:51:18.000 There's a lot of them.

00:51:20.000 Well, urbanization, one of the things it's done, just careers, just careers in cities, it's eliminated almost all of your free time.

00:51:27.000 Yeah.

00:51:28.000 And if you wanted to go out and procure your own meat, first of all, if you wanted to do it with a rifle, that's going to take a tremendous amount of time.

00:51:35.000 Absolutely.

00:51:35.000 But if you want to do it with a bow, multiply that by a factor of, like, maybe five or ten.

00:51:40.000 Maybe ten.

00:51:41.000 Ten is probably pretty honest.

00:51:43.000 Honestly.

00:51:44.000 And then you're talking about one of the hardest pieces is access, right?

00:51:47.000 Right.

00:51:48.000 Even if you get with John Dudley and you learn how to be a great archer, and you understand that in your suburban area there are some places where there's deer that you may kill, you've got to get access to those places.

00:51:59.000 And then when you're done with that, you've got to figure out a way to get that thing from dead deer to meat and all the other things.

00:52:05.000 It's just so complex.

00:52:06.000 How would you ever expect somebody just to have a desire?

00:52:10.000 You were like that at some point.

00:52:11.000 Well, Rinella opened the door for me.

00:52:13.000 So you're lucky as hell to have that, right?

00:52:15.000 Super lucky.

00:52:16.000 Forever grateful.

00:52:17.000 Because when he took me into a wild backcountry Montana deer hunt.

00:52:22.000 Yeah, you got kicking the nuts the first deer hunt. 0.99

00:52:26.000 In the Missouri Breaks, in October, nine degrees out, freezing your dick off every night in a tent. 0.99

00:52:32.000 It seems like lifeless Steve Rinello. 0.97

00:52:33.000 That's kind of what it's like.

00:52:34.000 He loves it.

00:52:35.000 He loves suffering.

00:52:36.000 He loves it.

00:52:36.000 But I love that he loves it.

00:52:38.000 He's as legit as they come.

00:52:39.000 He really is.

00:52:40.000 I think that's it, right?

00:52:42.000 There is just this big gap, and my father got me into it, but my brother doesn't hunt, but he has respect for it and understands what's going on.

00:52:51.000 I think at the time that I was introduced to hunting, my brother was more interested in going out with his friends than Saturday mornings were not for getting up early.

00:52:59.000 And so we're essentially the same person, but I just went this way, and he didn't go that way.

00:53:05.000 Right.

00:53:05.000 So it's a weird...

00:53:07.000 So you could be in the same house with somebody and go a different way.

00:53:10.000 Well, Rinella has a real good way of looking at it, too. 0.60

00:53:12.000 He's like, I don't expect people to go out and get rid of their own sewage.

00:53:16.000 Why should I expect them to go out and hunt their own food?

00:53:19.000 Like, you don't have to.

00:53:20.000 Well, I think he probably said this at some point, or somebody smart did.

00:53:25.000 It was, like, I choose, I believe it, I choose for meat to be the one thing that I grabbed a hold of to bring into my skill set.

00:53:33.000 I don't knit my own clothes.

00:53:35.000 I don't make my own shoes.

00:53:37.000 I don't build my own houses.

00:53:39.000 We were just looking at some construction stuff a little bit earlier.

00:53:42.000 I'm like, dude, what?

00:53:44.000 Yeah, what are they doing?

00:53:45.000 What are they doing?

00:53:46.000 I couldn't do that.

00:53:47.000 I just picked this one thing because it's also part of my passion.

00:53:50.000 You couldn't just ask someone who's a construction worker to go hunt, get some meat.

00:53:57.000 I know you have a desire for that.

00:53:59.000 That's just another hard part about hunting, and non-hunters by proxy are essential to hunting, always.

00:54:06.000 In industry, in opinion, because we could legislate ourselves out of being able to hunt.

00:54:11.000 That could happen.

00:54:12.000 Hunting is a privilege, man.

00:54:13.000 That's not a right in a lot of ways. 0.73

00:54:16.000 So that's another whole nother can of worms, but it could it could go away Yeah, I think the the issue is that so many people are opposed to it because they're so removed from the realities of the wild and They just feel some sort of moral superiority by either not eating meat entirely or by not killing their own meat They're not killing their own meat is really ridiculous.

00:54:38.000 Like my wife was having a conversation with someone They were out to dinner with a bunch of people while I was on an elk hunt and The guy was eating a steak.

00:54:46.000 A guy from England.

00:54:47.000 In England, they don't hunt.

00:54:48.000 Or they do hunt. 0.99

00:54:48.000 They use, like, foxes and horses and shit. 0.99

00:54:51.000 They wear, like, tweed pussies. 1.00

00:54:53.000 Yeah. 0.98

00:54:53.000 No, sorry, England. 0.98

00:54:54.000 We love you.

00:54:54.000 This guy's carving a steak, and my wife goes, he's actually out elk hunting.

00:54:59.000 And the guy goes, he hunts?

00:55:01.000 That's deplorable.

00:55:02.000 The guy said, that's deplorable.

00:55:03.000 While he's carving a steak.

00:55:05.000 I was saying something the other day, like...

00:55:07.000 And I got a lot of, like, people were looking at me like I was weird at work.

00:55:11.000 One of my buddies at work was eating a chicken sandwich from Chick-fil-A. And I look on the bag and there's a cartoon chicken on the bag.

00:55:18.000 And in my mind, I'm like, that's like building a swimming pool by the lake. 0.91

00:55:21.000 It's fucking weird and irony that we're like... 0.93

00:55:25.000 Saying, hey, I'm eating a chicken, but here's a cartoon version of it so we can celebrate the fact that we just murdered this chicken and we fried it up. 0.99

00:55:32.000 That doesn't make sense.

00:55:33.000 Like a swimming pool with a lake is probably smart because there's parasites in the lake. 0.72

00:55:36.000 The rye brain's wearing off. 1.00

00:55:39.000 Time for a refill.

00:55:41.000 Yes.

00:55:41.000 We can put chlorine in the lake.

00:55:43.000 As long as you know what I mean.

00:55:44.000 Well, we definitely like to cartoonize these weird...

00:55:49.000 Is that a word?

00:55:49.000 Not really.

00:55:50.000 Cartoonize?

00:55:51.000 Personalize?

00:55:52.000 No.

00:55:52.000 Well, anthropomorphize is you take an animal and you give it human characteristics.

00:55:56.000 Personify?

00:55:57.000 No.

00:55:58.000 Cartoonification.

00:55:59.000 Is that a word?

00:56:00.000 Let's just go with it. 1.00

00:56:01.000 Just turning it into a fucking cartoon. 0.99

00:56:03.000 We're creating drinks, we'll do what we want. 1.00

00:56:04.000 A sweet little cutie pie, when really a chicken is a ruthless little fucking dinosaur that lays eggs for you every day. 1.00

00:56:10.000 But is it weird to be eating a chicken, and like, there is on the bag where that chicken came from, it's like a picture of the chicken. 0.98

00:56:19.000 Right.

00:56:19.000 It seems like a weird way to handle it.

00:56:22.000 It is weird, but we like cartoons.

00:56:24.000 People love cartoons.

00:56:26.000 Well, that's like the personification of animals, I think, is part of the bear situation.

00:56:30.000 Yes.

00:56:30.000 Because my kid, my son's nine months old, and from before he was born until now, there's cartoon bears everywhere, and there's like this, you know, personification of these cute little creatures that come along with being a little baby.

00:56:45.000 Right.

00:56:45.000 And then you look at so many Pixar and DreamWorks films that personify animals.

00:56:51.000 Yeah.

00:56:52.000 I think that's, I mean, there's some indoctrination into that, right?

00:56:55.000 There has to be.

00:56:56.000 There is, because in those magazines, or rather those movies and books even, those animals are never like eating each other.

00:57:05.000 Pooh Bear never goes up.

00:57:07.000 I mean, if Yogi killed a hiker, if a hiker fucked up on one of the episodes of Yellowstone and just took a wrong turn and Yogi's eating his ribcage, 0.98

00:57:22.000 a bunch of people show up and- Like Pooh Bear and Yogi are just fucking going at it. 0.99

00:57:26.000 Just ripping it apart. 0.99

00:57:27.000 Eating cubs. 1.00

00:57:28.000 Yeah, eating some dude asshole first while he's screaming and- Swatting at it with his fucking hiking sticks. 1.00

00:57:36.000 And they're playing the circle of life in the background? 1.00

00:57:37.000 Yeah.

00:57:39.000 Yeah, I feel like there's some indoctrination, and maybe that's what happens.

00:57:45.000 I just don't know.

00:57:45.000 I have no idea why bears get this thing, because bears are around.

00:57:49.000 It's not like there aren't bears around.

00:57:51.000 They're in almost all states, aren't they?

00:57:53.000 Yeah, but what it is is people that don't experience them firsthand, and when they do experience them firsthand, usually they're in their car like, look, a bear, and they drive by.

00:58:02.000 My friend Tommy...

00:58:03.000 That one bear that was walking on its hind legs, and that was cute.

00:58:06.000 Oh, that one that had a broken front paw?

00:58:08.000 Yeah, I've been friends with that bear.

00:58:09.000 They called them, like, petals or something like that?

00:58:11.000 That's awesome.

00:58:12.000 There was, um, my friend Tommy, who lives in Connecticut, sent me a picture of these bears that were in the middle of the street duking it out, uh, in Connecticut.

00:58:22.000 Like, they're invading Connecticut now, and they don't have any pressure.

00:58:26.000 So here's the thing about bear hunting as opposed to anything else.

00:58:30.000 Like, California's weird in that they don't hunt mountain lions, but what's good about that is California has very little deer. 0.99

00:58:40.000 Now, it's not good if you like to hunt deer, but it is good if you like to drive down the street and not slam in a fucking deer. 0.97

00:58:46.000 Like, Iowa doesn't have mountain lions. 0.99

00:58:49.000 But they do have a shit ton of deer. 0.99

00:58:51.000 And when you drive late at night in Iowa, you gotta have your foot on the gas, ready to hit that fucking brake at any second. 0.99

00:58:57.000 Nah, you just get the ranch hand grill guard and just plow them up. 0.99

00:59:01.000 Mad Max grill.

00:59:02.000 People, like, everywhere you look, in, like, Iowa and Montana, these people have pickup trucks with these battering ram front grill things that they put.

00:59:10.000 Well, how many deer did we kill in Lanai?

00:59:12.000 Were you in any of the deer?

00:59:14.000 We must have hit...

00:59:15.000 With a car?

00:59:16.000 Oh yeah, with Brandon's truck, I think we hit at least two or three deer.

00:59:19.000 Did you?

00:59:20.000 While we were on Lanai.

00:59:21.000 We were there for five days.

00:59:21.000 We never hit any.

00:59:22.000 Roman's a better driver than Brandon.

00:59:23.000 He must be.

00:59:24.000 That's what's going on.

00:59:25.000 Brandon, if you're listening...

00:59:26.000 We never hit any.

00:59:27.000 We didn't even hit one.

00:59:28.000 Yeah, we hit multiple.

00:59:30.000 But they were telling me about them.

00:59:31.000 They were like, people just slam into them all over the place.

00:59:33.000 So there you are.

00:59:34.000 I'm sure the insurance industry would really enjoy.

00:59:37.000 Well, in Cam's town, last year, a guy died because a guy in front of him hit a deer.

00:59:43.000 Oh, right.

00:59:43.000 And the deer flew through the air and went through his windshield and brained him.

00:59:48.000 Oh, that's poor luck. 1.00

00:59:49.000 That's a shit luck. 1.00

00:59:51.000 That's like having a longer guy. 0.99

00:59:52.000 Do you hear a story like that?

00:59:53.000 You're like, I would have ducked.

00:59:55.000 Do you hear that?

00:59:56.000 You're like, pssh, I would have ducked. 1.00

00:59:57.000 That guy's a pussy. 1.00

00:59:58.000 I'd have been like, I don't know. 1.00

01:00:01.000 People think stupid shit like that, right? 1.00

01:00:03.000 In the moment, I would have been driving my car and I would have seen this deer flying through there and I'd be like, well, it was a good run. 1.00

01:00:09.000 Like, there's a...

01:00:12.000 There's nothing I can do about an airborne deer.

01:00:16.000 Like, that's just bad luck.

01:00:17.000 Yeah, 150-pound blacktail.

01:00:19.000 Yeah.

01:00:20.000 Hurling through the air. 0.97

01:00:21.000 What the hell? 0.94

01:00:22.000 Full of antlers and hooves. 0.95

01:00:23.000 Yeah, I'd have been like, well, I lived all these years without this happening.

01:00:27.000 That was lucky.

01:00:28.000 That's probably more lucky, right?

01:00:31.000 Yeah.

01:00:32.000 But that's, I mean, you know, you start to, like, break down those things.

01:00:36.000 Like, more animals, less animals, the value of them, and all these things.

01:00:39.000 What a complex freaking thing to have to figure out.

01:00:42.000 I always just get, the more you read, the more you jump in, the more you go, you know, going to New Zealand.

01:00:50.000 Going to, you know, Northwest Territories, going to Nepal, you go to these places and you just realize that everybody has the same essential problem.

01:00:59.000 Like, how do we cohabitate?

01:01:00.000 How do we live with these things that we were in some ways meant to consume?

01:01:05.000 Like, there's evidence of two million years ago in Tanzania.

01:01:10.000 Humans, early humans, hunting.

01:01:13.000 And so 100,000 generations of people have lived on a hunter-gatherer diet.

01:01:20.000 Then you had the Industrial Revolution.

01:01:22.000 A couple generations of people kind of were introduced to a new diet.

01:01:25.000 And then the last couple generations, you have processed foods.

01:01:28.000 Right.

01:01:29.000 And so everywhere that I've ever been, you find people struggling with that thing.

01:01:35.000 It's just not us in America.

01:01:37.000 Right.

01:01:37.000 Right, but you can exist on a plant-based diet.

01:01:40.000 I mean, I know a lot of people that do it.

01:01:42.000 Absolutely.

01:01:42.000 It can be done.

01:01:43.000 And I'm sure in those 100,000 generations, there was plenty of people that didn't, you know, exist on the hunter-gatherer diet alone, but the majority of humans...

01:01:51.000 I wonder how many there were, honestly, because I feel like people were just really super opportunistic back then.

01:01:56.000 I mean, if you were just trying to survive and struggle, I don't think you could say, like, hey, I don't want to eat that rabbit because I feel bad.

01:02:03.000 No, that rabbit is...

01:02:05.000 The way I live.

01:02:05.000 And then you have to wear its pelt, and that's a different deal.

01:02:09.000 I was writing a piece one time, and I got into reading about these basket weaver people that were in Valley of Fire State Park in Nevada, which is really close to Vegas.

01:02:20.000 And you should go if you've never been up there.

01:02:22.000 Basket weavers? 0.86

01:02:23.000 Yeah.

01:02:24.000 Basket maker or basket weaver people.

01:02:26.000 Are they like Native Americans? 1.00

01:02:27.000 Yeah, they were essentially a roving band of nomadic hunters.

01:02:31.000 I can't think of the year.

01:02:33.000 You can probably look it up and find it.

01:02:34.000 But there was different generations of this essentially roving band of tribes.

01:02:39.000 In that area, next time you're in Vegas, it's like an hour drive north.

01:02:43.000 There's a bunch of petroglyphs there that depict deities and sheep and all these different things there.

01:02:49.000 And you could just go visit them?

01:02:50.000 Oh, yeah. 0.98

01:02:51.000 You know what's fucked up about those petroglyphs, man? 0.98

01:02:53.000 They're not protected. 0.94

01:02:54.000 There's a ranch in Texas that a buddy of mine went to, and he's like, you could just go over there and touch these things, and they might be 5,000 years old.

01:03:02.000 I did that when my wife and I went up there.

01:03:04.000 You could have had a can of spray paint. 0.99

01:03:05.000 How fucked up is that? 0.99

01:03:07.000 It's strange. 0.99

01:03:08.000 It's strange that you wouldn't find a way, but also probably...

01:03:11.000 It's probably okay because it's a natural place.

01:03:15.000 You don't want to put fences up or have a guard standing there.

01:03:18.000 It's actually pretty badass that no one's fucked with it so far. 0.98

01:03:22.000 You go up there and you see these things and you're like, holy crap. 0.95

01:03:24.000 I started reading a little bit about those people and they were part of a nomadic We're good to go.

01:03:50.000 Oh my gosh, agriculture and hunting.

01:03:52.000 Which one is better?

01:03:53.000 What do we do?

01:03:54.000 And so the whole story of that interaction is interesting to me because it's kind of the evolution of our culture, right?

01:04:00.000 Hunting has created this social structure, ways for us to communicate.

01:04:04.000 It's created all these things, ways for our body to grow and expand as we were, you know, early humans.

01:04:10.000 Ways for our brain to expand and grow and function differently.

01:04:14.000 And then you have this like, oh, it's a lot easier to plant crops in the ground than it is to go kill a sheep, right?

01:04:21.000 Guys?

01:04:22.000 Anybody?

01:04:23.000 Is this easier?

01:04:24.000 So then you get into this weird thing about what do we do now?

01:04:27.000 And so I think their story was very much like the Anasazi Indians.

01:04:32.000 They go in, and they cultivate this area, and as long as they can grow crops, that's what they did.

01:04:37.000 So this nomadic band of hunters kind of settled in this area.

01:04:43.000 I'm sure they still hunted to get meat, because they have to, because you can't grow.

01:04:47.000 A whole year's worth of food for a valley like that.

01:04:51.000 But I think agriculture kind of won out a little bit in that scenario.

01:04:55.000 And as it would, it's an easier way to live.

01:04:57.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:04:58.000 That's an evolutionary, easy way to live.

01:05:00.000 I mean, the whole thing is filling your belly.

01:05:01.000 That's the whole thing.

01:05:02.000 And everything, you know, you can do to do it, whether it's with deer, or whether it's with corn, or whether it's with tomatoes, or whatever you can grow.

01:05:10.000 And, you know, you just have to eat.

01:05:12.000 I mean, that's the whole picture of staying alive back then.

01:05:16.000 That's not our whole picture today.

01:05:18.000 So that's where it gets really complicated.

01:05:20.000 And that's where I think that hunters have done a really good job over the last...

01:05:25.000 X amount of years, describing to people, like, if you're going to eat meat, this is the most ethical, the most cruelty-free, and the most natural way to do it.

01:05:36.000 And you're talking about an animal that literally, like, okay, here's a perfect example.

01:05:41.000 That deer, that mule deer that you're looking at right here, that deer had no idea I was alive until it died.

01:05:47.000 And it died instantly.

01:05:49.000 It was boom, one shot, it dropped. 0.64

01:05:52.000 Right where I shot it, and that's it.

01:05:54.000 And then it becomes steak.

01:05:56.000 You know, and it becomes delicious food that we ate.

01:05:58.000 And that's way better than any other animal that you're ever going to buy in a store.

01:06:03.000 I don't care if you're talking about farm-raised, grass-fed, you know, locally sourced.

01:06:09.000 I feel like your evolution as a hunter has been accelerated more than most, probably because that's how you do everything.

01:06:13.000 But you went from, when I first, when you first hunted in British Columbia, it was three years ago.

01:06:18.000 Three years ago?

01:06:19.000 Yeah.

01:06:20.000 To where you are now, I mean, you've evolved in this, like, what you see as hunting and in our community and in our world and doing different things.

01:06:27.000 And in some ways, you evolve from, when I was a kid, we just shot deer.

01:06:31.000 Oh, here's a spike.

01:06:32.000 Here's a four-point.

01:06:33.000 You shoot this deer, and that was a great day.

01:06:35.000 We drag it off and eat it, and it's great.

01:06:37.000 Now, I understand way more about what I was doing then and what I'm doing now.

01:06:42.000 And I think what, at Hunters, we need to be cognizant of and comfortable with is you change.

01:06:47.000 Your sensibilities change over time.

01:06:48.000 You don't become a trophy hunter.

01:06:50.000 You're not a trophy hunter, but you do appreciate The difference between a small antlered animal and a large one, in terms of its maturity and how awesome it is to see a 380-inch elk or a 200-inch deer, your pursuit is different than it was when we shot that moose.

01:07:07.000 It is also, but also part of the pursuit that's different is that I understand that the benefit of going after mature animals is if you're getting a mature deer, you're talking about a deer that's five years old, that deer has had five breeding seasons,

01:07:22.000 has spread Spread its genes.

01:07:24.000 And by killing it, you're going to give a chance to the younger bucks that are coming up to breed. 1.00

01:07:29.000 So it's done its part. 0.99

01:07:31.000 It's spread its genes.

01:07:32.000 It's created its progeny.

01:07:34.000 And now you'll take it out of the mix.

01:07:36.000 And this is the right way to do it because then you ensure a healthy herd.

01:07:40.000 Especially for bear.

01:07:42.000 That's the big argument.

01:07:44.000 You want to take out the dominant males.

01:07:46.000 Because the dominant males actually eat the cubs. 0.98

01:07:49.000 They're marauders. 0.61

01:07:50.000 Animals.

01:07:50.000 That's the craziest part about it is, by shooting a boar, you're going to save the lives of many bears.

01:07:57.000 In many ways, it's kind of a catch-22 because you're talking about controlling populations.

01:08:02.000 Well, isn't it a catch-22 that a younger deer tastes better?

01:08:06.000 Yeah.

01:08:07.000 And so you're out there like, I really love access to your meat, but when we're over there, they're like, we have certain call bucks and there's certain things you want to shoot.

01:08:14.000 It's like, I really love access to your deer, and if I was out there just for meat, I would have shot the youngest deer.

01:08:18.000 Probably not the youngest, but I would have picked a certain age group.

01:08:21.000 Yeah, but I'll tell you, here's the argument against that with axis deer.

01:08:23.000 That deer I shot was not young. 1.00

01:08:25.000 That was a big-ass deer, and that fucking thing's delicious. 1.00

01:08:29.000 It's delicious. 1.00

01:08:29.000 Like, if they're better than that when they're younger, I don't even need that. 1.00

01:08:33.000 It's a fact that a younger animal is more tender and is a better cut of meat than an older animal, for sure.

01:08:38.000 In most cases.

01:08:39.000 It's not all cases, but that's the general...

01:08:42.000 That giant elk that I shot where you saw the antlers back there?

01:08:45.000 They're all delicious.

01:08:45.000 That's amazing!

01:08:47.000 I've been eating that thing for eight months now.

01:08:49.000 It's fantastic.

01:08:50.000 Yeah, I do the same thing.

01:08:51.000 Elk is great no matter what.

01:08:53.000 Yeah.

01:08:54.000 Even a seven-year-old elk.

01:08:56.000 Yeah, you're talking about two animals that it'd be hard to mess it up.

01:08:58.000 Yeah.

01:08:59.000 But in general...

01:09:00.000 That's the fact of the matter, right?

01:09:03.000 See, I don't like that argument, though.

01:09:05.000 You know why I don't like that argument?

01:09:06.000 I don't mind chewy meat, and I like eating what I kill.

01:09:10.000 So, like, it feels good to me on top of it tasting good.

01:09:13.000 Like, if I eat a deer that's a six-year-old deer, there's two things going on.

01:09:18.000 One, there's a satisfaction that I know that a six-year-old deer is very difficult to hunt.

01:09:22.000 Yes.

01:09:23.000 We're good to go.

01:09:40.000 You're eating this animal that you have this connection with, so it tastes good because of that.

01:09:45.000 I like meat that tastes like meat.

01:09:48.000 I don't want filet mignon.

01:09:51.000 I like a deer steak.

01:09:54.000 It's the best.

01:09:55.000 A sirloin from a mule deer.

01:09:57.000 I'd prefer that.

01:09:58.000 It's the best.

01:10:01.000 Right.

01:10:18.000 You know Eduardo Garcia, the chef in Montana? 0.99

01:10:21.000 He gets shit from other hunters because he'll shoot a spike on purpose. 0.99

01:10:26.000 He's like, look, I'm here for the meat, guys. 1.00

01:10:28.000 He goes, I'm grocery shopping.

01:10:30.000 That should be, in general, that should be okay, but there's principles that say shooting a mature animal is more beneficial to the herd.

01:10:38.000 So...

01:10:39.000 That's yet another complexity that we should all just say, like, man, this is here, and we've just got to continue to talk about it.

01:10:45.000 That's important.

01:10:46.000 I think the way you approach it is very important, because you're entirely honest about the good and the bad and the bear thing.

01:10:53.000 It's not the best meat.

01:10:55.000 It's good meat.

01:10:56.000 It's good.

01:10:56.000 But it's not as good as elk.

01:10:58.000 Yeah, I'm not going to stand up and be like, hey... 0.99

01:11:00.000 Pussies. 1.00

01:11:01.000 Eating a bear is the best thing ever. 1.00

01:11:02.000 It's not.

01:11:03.000 Some people love it, though.

01:11:04.000 I don't know if they're telling the truth.

01:11:06.000 They're telling the truth, but I would assure them if they would dabble in some other meats, they'll find one that's better.

01:11:13.000 I'm pretty sure.

01:11:14.000 Well, I guess it depends entirely about the way to preserve it.

01:11:18.000 And taste.

01:11:18.000 Prepare it, right?

01:11:19.000 Taste or whatever.

01:11:19.000 But the thing about this, an argument for hunting bears is different than the argument for hunting any other animal because you do eat them and you need to kill them because they don't have a natural predator.

01:11:28.000 The problem with bears is, especially if we went in Alberta, Jesus Christ, they are everywhere.

01:11:34.000 People that think there's a shortage of bears need to go to Alberta.

01:11:39.000 People that want to have one of those experiences where you walk away from that and be like, Did I just do that? 0.98

01:11:44.000 Yeah, are there 20 fucking bears hanging out over here? 0.97

01:11:46.000 I've been sitting there with Cam. 0.99

01:11:47.000 Like, I wish we could get Cam.

01:11:49.000 Call Cam.

01:11:49.000 Cam, please text in.

01:11:50.000 He's at work right now.

01:11:51.000 Quit your job, Cam.

01:11:52.000 Quit your job, Cam.

01:11:53.000 Been telling you for years, quit your job.

01:11:55.000 You're too cool to have a nine-to-five.

01:11:57.000 Uh, it's...

01:11:59.000 He's got a seven-to-five.

01:12:00.000 Oh, my lord.

01:12:01.000 Takes two hours lunch to go work out and run the mountains.

01:12:04.000 Well, that's...

01:12:05.000 Savagery.

01:12:06.000 It is savagery.

01:12:06.000 He does pretty good for having a 7 to 5. He's a goddamn savage.

01:12:09.000 I gotta get my ass together. 1.00

01:12:11.000 He's a legit savage. 1.00

01:12:12.000 I know.

01:12:12.000 Every time I'm complaining about anything, I think about Cam Haynes getting up at 4 o'clock in the morning to run.

01:12:17.000 You think about that, like, 198th mile. 1.00

01:12:20.000 You're like, fuck. 1.00

01:12:22.000 205th. 1.00

01:12:23.000 He's gonna do 234 this summer.

01:12:25.000 It only gets worse.

01:12:26.000 My dad was an ultramarathon runner growing up, and it just gets worse.

01:12:29.000 It's like smoking crack.

01:12:30.000 Oh, they just get deeper and deeper into how much they can endure.

01:12:33.000 That's probably a terrible analogy.

01:12:35.000 Dude, I'm scared of it because I keep running further and further distances.

01:12:38.000 I'm like, what am I doing?

01:12:40.000 And I'm doing it more and more often.

01:12:41.000 What am I doing?

01:12:42.000 You're feeling the runner's high.

01:12:44.000 Well, it's a little bit of that, but it's also like I feel improvement, and I'm an improvement junkie.

01:12:49.000 Yeah, I feel you on that.

01:12:50.000 I know that I can keep...

01:12:51.000 I'm pushing further.

01:12:52.000 I'm going further distances.

01:12:53.000 I feel better when I hit the top of the hill.

01:12:56.000 Yeah.

01:12:56.000 But my dad, like when I was a kid, I remember my dad just being, you know, a regular...

01:13:01.000 He must have been mid-40s, maybe.

01:13:03.000 Late 40s.

01:13:04.000 And he mowed...

01:13:05.000 We had a fairly small backyard, and he mowed a little circle.

01:13:08.000 And he would go out after working his jeans and his loafers and jog around this circle.

01:13:13.000 What?

01:13:14.000 I remember looking out there and being like, what are you doing, man?

01:13:17.000 How big was the yard?

01:13:18.000 It was like...

01:13:19.000 Maybe an acre?

01:13:20.000 I don't know.

01:13:20.000 It wasn't very big.

01:13:21.000 He was running, like, just little circles in this yard.

01:13:24.000 Let me get to the end of the story.

01:13:26.000 You'll get it eventually.

01:13:27.000 But that was his way to run.

01:13:30.000 Right.

01:13:31.000 And so, after a while, he started running, you know, got running shoes and started to get into the actual sport of running.

01:13:39.000 And then it seems to me, like, three or four years later, he was like, I think I'm going to run this 50-mile race in the mountains of Maryland.

01:13:46.000 JFK 50-miler.

01:13:47.000 And had he run marathons?

01:13:48.000 No!

01:13:51.000 No!

01:13:53.000 So a 50 mile race is like what?

01:13:55.000 It was not like- Six hours?

01:13:56.000 Seven hours?

01:13:57.000 If you're in really good shape?

01:13:58.000 Eight or nine hours, I think.

01:14:00.000 Eight or nine, I think, when he started.

01:14:02.000 Or maybe ten.

01:14:03.000 I think 12 is like the cutoff.

01:14:05.000 Isn't it interesting?

01:14:05.000 Like 8 hours for 50, for 100, it's 24. Of course it is.

01:14:09.000 It's like, listen, bitch. 1.00

01:14:11.000 75 miles in. 1.00

01:14:13.000 Fuck this. 1.00

01:14:15.000 My dad used to run. 1.00

01:14:17.000 He used to run in places.

01:14:19.000 It was like the JFK 50-Milers up over this mountain. 0.98

01:14:21.000 It's not like...

01:14:22.000 I remember he used to tell me stories of people falling and busting themselves all up on these rocky cliff trails.

01:14:28.000 Yeah.

01:14:29.000 And he would come in and...

01:14:30.000 This is going to make my dad sound weird.

01:14:31.000 He's not.

01:14:32.000 He's awesome.

01:14:33.000 But he would, like, save his toenails.

01:14:35.000 All his toenails would fall off during the race.

01:14:37.000 And he would, like, save them, put them in a little jar.

01:14:39.000 Oh, God.

01:14:40.000 His memories.

01:14:40.000 Did he save his boogers, too?

01:14:41.000 No, no.

01:14:42.000 Just toenails.

01:14:43.000 And he was almost like this, like, I can take that.

01:14:46.000 Right.

01:14:46.000 I could take this thing and then he ran 50 and then I think one time he ran 100 and then he ran the entire C&O Canal one time 183 miles and I was like I think it was in maybe a senior in high school and I had like had to drive to the checkpoints and like give him food and stuff.

01:15:02.000 So he never started until he was in his 40s?

01:15:04.000 God maybe 50s it was 40s probably I would say yeah late 40s.

01:15:09.000 So what did he keep does he still do it how old is he now?

01:15:12.000 He would still do it if his knees would allow him to.

01:15:13.000 He's mid-60s now, 65. His knees are fucked up. 1.00

01:15:16.000 But he'll still bike and he hikes all the time now. 0.99

01:15:20.000 So he still has that need to push.

01:15:24.000 And when he gets around one of his buddies in particular that they ran together, they're like old army buddies and talking about this experience that they shared together.

01:15:33.000 Like, remember that one time on Mile 94 when you trip and fail and And it's just like they're telling old war stories.

01:15:40.000 It's like this visceral thing that they share.

01:15:43.000 It's really cool.

01:15:44.000 He did it past...

01:15:47.000 I mean, maybe it's a midlife crisis, man.

01:15:48.000 I don't know.

01:15:49.000 Yeah.

01:15:50.000 He wasn't predisposed to run 100 miles until he decided that he wanted to.

01:15:56.000 Yeah.

01:15:57.000 It's weird, right?

01:15:58.000 That compulsion is a very odd one.

01:16:01.000 The need for suffering.

01:16:03.000 Cam's got it bad.

01:16:04.000 It becomes a thing.

01:16:06.000 Yeah.

01:16:06.000 He's got it bad in a weird way.

01:16:08.000 I remember my dad, he got a knee surgery.

01:16:10.000 What kind?

01:16:11.000 It was ACL, I think it was.

01:16:13.000 Or was it the scope of his knee?

01:16:14.000 He had knee surgery.

01:16:15.000 Oh, scope.

01:16:15.000 Scope's an easy one.

01:16:17.000 They cut his knee open.

01:16:18.000 I can't remember what.

01:16:19.000 I don't want to say the wrong one.

01:16:20.000 But he had knee surgery in there.

01:16:21.000 Like, give it four or five days before you're up and moving around.

01:16:24.000 And he was like jogging around the backyard on day two.

01:16:27.000 Limping around.

01:16:28.000 You could just tell he was in pain.

01:16:29.000 Oh, that must have been meniscus.

01:16:31.000 Yeah.

01:16:31.000 Something like that.

01:16:32.000 Some tendon of some sort.

01:16:33.000 But it was just like you could just see.

01:16:35.000 This dude is...

01:16:36.000 If he can't do this, man, it's not good for his psyche.

01:16:40.000 If he can do it, he's a happy guy.

01:16:42.000 Well, there's something that happens to you when you push yourself like that, where it makes regular life easier.

01:16:47.000 And that's part of the addiction.

01:16:49.000 That's real.

01:16:50.000 When I went to Nepal, man, that's exactly...

01:16:52.000 When I came back, I was like...

01:16:54.000 I brought back a sheep, I killed and all that stuff, but the perspective was what?

01:16:57.000 It was real.

01:16:59.000 When you were telling me how you were hallucinating when you saw a baby.

01:17:03.000 I did.

01:17:04.000 Tell me about that.

01:17:05.000 Alright.

01:17:06.000 So, how high were you?

01:17:08.000 We got, we'll have to start.

01:17:09.000 We were, there we were like 13,000 maybe.

01:17:12.000 13 or 13.5.

01:17:13.000 13,000 feet above sea level.

01:17:15.000 Yep. 0.99

01:17:16.000 Which gets sketchy as fuck. 0.99

01:17:17.000 It's sketchy. 0.98

01:17:18.000 It's not something to mess around with, I found.

01:17:20.000 Yeah.

01:17:20.000 Especially on this trip.

01:17:21.000 So we were hunting blue sheep in Nepal.

01:17:24.000 Blue sheep?

01:17:24.000 Blue sheep.

01:17:25.000 What does that look like?

01:17:25.000 Look it up.

01:17:26.000 Look it up.

01:17:27.000 It looks kind of like an all-dad.

01:17:28.000 It's got these like...

01:17:28.000 Oh, wow.

01:17:29.000 It's got really, really...

01:17:32.000 You can really see their annuli, like the age rings and their horns.

01:17:36.000 They go straight out.

01:17:38.000 They're short and stocky.

01:17:39.000 It'd be...

01:17:40.000 Cool to look at them.

01:17:41.000 They're a cool animal.

01:17:41.000 And it's one of those things where we went to hunt them and I didn't really have much of an idea of what blue sheep was until we started getting into the thing.

01:17:48.000 There's one.

01:17:48.000 Oh, wow.

01:17:49.000 A boral is what they call them over there.

01:17:50.000 Wow, what a cool looking animal.

01:17:52.000 Yeah.

01:17:53.000 Yeah, mine wasn't quite that big.

01:17:55.000 And that one looks like it might be at a farm.

01:17:58.000 Because it's mowed grass?

01:17:59.000 Yeah, maybe.

01:18:00.000 But don't the goats mow the grass?

01:18:02.000 That looks like more...

01:18:03.000 I saw a very disturbing video of a goat eating a whole bucket of chicks.

01:18:10.000 Of little baby, uh, baby chickens.

01:18:13.000 Yeah, it was on...

01:18:15.000 What were you watching?

01:18:16.000 It was on an Instagram page.

01:18:17.000 I think it was...

01:18:18.000 Okay. 0.54

01:18:19.000 Either it was Jimmy Jew or Clown and the Homie. 0.92

01:18:22.000 Yeah, that's it right there. 1.00

01:18:23.000 Look, this fucking goat is just sitting there eating... 0.99

01:18:27.000 This is on YouTube and what's the name of the video, Jamie, there? 1.00

01:18:31.000 Um...

01:18:32.000 Amazing goat-eating, alive baby chicken.

01:18:36.000 So there's several bins of baby chicks, and this goat is just standing there, and it just reaches in, chews one down, and the goats aren't carnivorous, so they don't have the teeth for this. 0.94

01:18:49.000 And this baby chick's trying to fucking claw its way out. 1.00

01:18:52.000 Look at this. 0.99

01:18:52.000 Watch, watch, watch, watch. 0.99

01:18:53.000 He reaches in.

01:18:54.000 Oh, he's just like, I'll get one.

01:18:55.000 Oh, I can't catch it.

01:18:56.000 He lost that one.

01:18:57.000 That one lived.

01:18:58.000 But look, he gets one.

01:18:59.000 Here we go. 1.00

01:19:00.000 I got you, bitch. 1.00

01:19:00.000 And he just starts chewing. 1.00

01:19:02.000 Just starts chewing.

01:19:03.000 Like, what?

01:19:04.000 What is happening?

01:19:05.000 Oh, look at this one.

01:19:07.000 Wild Impala fights back as its guts fall out.

01:19:10.000 I feel like we're really making the case to be Predator Hunter.

01:19:13.000 Yeah, look at this.

01:19:14.000 This Impala is getting chewed apart by this wild dog.

01:19:17.000 Oh, my God.

01:19:19.000 Don't do it.

01:19:19.000 Don't stop it.

01:19:21.000 Oh my god, but it's just lying.

01:19:22.000 Oh, it's in, it's in the cavity.

01:19:23.000 Yeah.

01:19:24.000 Oh, Jesus Christ.

01:19:26.000 That's like where the bacon is.

01:19:28.000 Oh, now it's up on his feet.

01:19:30.000 It's terrible.

01:19:31.000 Oh my god.

01:19:35.000 Africa. 1.00

01:19:36.000 You're a dirty mother. 1.00

01:19:38.000 Look at this. 1.00

01:19:38.000 This Impala's like, come on, bitch. 1.00

01:19:40.000 You ain't eating me. 1.00

01:19:41.000 I'm stabbing you, motherfucker. 1.00

01:19:42.000 I know I got weapons on my head. 1.00

01:19:44.000 He's like, look at your tail.

01:19:46.000 Look at this showdown.

01:19:49.000 His guts are literally hanging out to the ground.

01:19:53.000 And it's standing up.

01:19:54.000 How tough are these things, man?

01:19:56.000 I mean, I would not want to get gored by that impala and horn. 0.99

01:20:00.000 The dog doesn't either.

01:20:01.000 Are they on a road?

01:20:02.000 Yeah, they sure are.

01:20:04.000 There's a road right there.

01:20:04.000 Paved road.

01:20:05.000 Look how it just circles them, too.

01:20:07.000 Looking to catch them on the flank.

01:20:08.000 Isn't it just messed up that, like, wolves and coyotes, they hit the back legs first?

01:20:12.000 Yeah.

01:20:12.000 They cause that shock and blood loss?

01:20:14.000 I'm a big fan of cats, because at least cats will grab you by your neck and kill you.

01:20:18.000 They really will. 1.00

01:20:18.000 This motherfucker is not doing that. 1.00

01:20:21.000 This is weird. 1.00

01:20:23.000 There's a whole minute 30 left of this.

01:20:26.000 Oh, there's more!

01:20:27.000 A bunch more come in.

01:20:29.000 He's like, that's it.

01:20:30.000 That's a wrap.

01:20:31.000 Oh, and they just grab the guts.

01:20:32.000 Look how much more is falling out now.

01:20:34.000 Oh, how can it be alive?

01:20:36.000 Oh, I have no idea.

01:20:37.000 I don't understand.

01:20:38.000 And they're just going after the legs. 0.52

01:20:39.000 Here comes another one.

01:20:41.000 Yeah.

01:20:42.000 Oh, no.

01:20:43.000 It doesn't know what to do, man.

01:20:45.000 Oh, God.

01:20:45.000 It's so crazy.

01:20:46.000 Why are we watching this?

01:20:49.000 We're having some vegan dinner tonight.

01:20:52.000 Oh, Jesus.

01:20:52.000 There's like, what, six of them?

01:20:54.000 Three, four, four, six, seven?

01:20:57.000 Seven wild dogs.

01:20:58.000 It's dead now. 0.99

01:20:59.000 Hopefully it's dead. 0.95

01:20:59.000 Look at the chunks. 0.95

01:21:01.000 Oh, they just pulled the guts out in one hunk. 0.98

01:21:03.000 There's one watching. 1.00

01:21:04.000 Look how fast they tear that fucking thing apart. 1.00

01:21:07.000 Look at that. 1.00

01:21:08.000 It's just body cavity now. 1.00

01:21:11.000 Holy shit. 0.99

01:21:12.000 What is the head? 1.00

01:21:12.000 Did they drag the head off? 1.00

01:21:13.000 Yeah, man.

01:21:14.000 They're no jokes.

01:21:15.000 And those guys are nothing compared to hyenas.

01:21:18.000 Yeah.

01:21:19.000 It's hard out there, is the point.

01:21:21.000 Like, if you get hit by an arrow, it's way better than that, folks.

01:21:23.000 That was like three minutes of terror.

01:21:25.000 Yeah.

01:21:25.000 We're going for the vitals.

01:21:26.000 We're going for double lungs.

01:21:28.000 We're going for a heart.

01:21:28.000 It's going to end nice and quick.

01:21:30.000 See, now this is the biggest problem with the internet. 1.00

01:21:31.000 You get from like, what's a blue sheep to that shit? 1.00

01:21:34.000 Like, two clicks? 1.00

01:21:36.000 Yeah, well, you can go way deeper than that, you know?

01:21:39.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:21:39.000 I saw a guy chop his dick off the other day. 1.00

01:21:42.000 What? 0.99

01:21:43.000 Just for a goof, I was looking at different hashtags online, and I looked for hashtag triggered.

01:21:51.000 I think I might have wrote hashtag triggered in something, so I looked for hashtag triggered thinking I could find a post that I wrote.

01:21:57.000 Oh, good luck.

01:21:58.000 There's millions. 0.99

01:22:00.000 One of them was this one dude chopping his own dick off, and they somehow or another got on Instagram. 0.99

01:22:07.000 And I was like, how did that- It got on Instagram? 0.99

01:22:08.000 Yeah, nobody caught it before they pulled it down. 0.96

01:22:11.000 Look, there's no way they can take down everything fucked up. 0.97

01:22:16.000 Just hashtagging it though, that's savage. 0.97

01:22:19.000 You think the guys were like, they're like, well...

01:22:22.000 We're getting ready to get this done.

01:22:23.000 What do we do for the hashtag?

01:22:25.000 Because we've got to market it.

01:22:26.000 Like, we've got to have people...

01:22:27.000 Triggered.

01:22:28.000 Hashtag triggered.

01:22:29.000 Yeah, they have to market it.

01:22:30.000 Isn't that funny?

01:22:31.000 Marketing.

01:22:32.000 Marketing is a big thing, right?

01:22:34.000 You know what?

01:22:34.000 I was reading some...

01:22:35.000 Self-mutilation? 1.00

01:22:36.000 Some fucking YouTube... 1.00

01:22:38.000 Not even YouTube, rather. 1.00

01:22:40.000 Some Instagram person was talking about what they do to market their brand.

01:22:46.000 And all they were like a fitness person. 1.00

01:22:48.000 I was like, get the fuck out of here, man. 0.98

01:22:50.000 You have a brand? 0.99

01:22:51.000 You have 10,000 followers.

01:22:53.000 Are you a brand?

01:22:55.000 Or are you just some dude who does squats?

01:22:57.000 Yeah, you can't be like Tuesdays, arms and back.

01:22:59.000 That's my brand.

01:23:00.000 That's my brand marketing scheme.

01:23:02.000 Working hard on my brand.

01:23:04.000 It's like those kind of phrases, people use those a lot.

01:23:09.000 They won't do something because it's off-brand.

01:23:12.000 That's an extra level of douchiness, I feel like.

01:23:16.000 Really?

01:23:16.000 It's not like my brand?

01:23:17.000 I won't put that up because it's off-brand for me.

01:23:20.000 Oh, it's not like my brand.

01:23:22.000 Right, exactly. 0.99

01:23:23.000 That'll fuck with their... 0.98

01:23:24.000 They're putting out there. 0.99

01:23:25.000 Yeah, that seems quite preposterous.

01:23:27.000 Social media.

01:23:28.000 So, tell me about seeing the baby in Nepal.

01:23:31.000 Oh yeah, let me finish.

01:23:31.000 So you go up there, you're looking for this blue sheep.

01:23:34.000 Yeah, so we're looking for the blue sheep.

01:23:36.000 So I'll start off by saying that we were hunting in a very rural, when I say rural, it's like six days walk from the nearest road where we were at.

01:23:45.000 Six days were the walking.

01:23:47.000 And I said, how many days walk to the paved road?

01:23:49.000 And they're like, I don't know what you're talking about.

01:23:51.000 We don't know.

01:23:52.000 We couldn't gauge that.

01:23:54.000 And so we're in this remote region of Nepal, in this district called the Rokum District.

01:23:59.000 And to say that the Rokum District is full of this, like, primal, these primal people and animals, I mean, it is really just out their place.

01:24:09.000 I think...

01:24:10.000 You know, to be out away from civilization, that was the furthest I think you could feel.

01:24:16.000 I mean, we were out there.

01:24:18.000 And the people there were part of a civil war, the Nepali Civil War, from 1996 to 2006. This district was maybe the epicenter of the rebellion.

01:24:30.000 There was a Communist Party rebellion against the government, against the monarchy.

01:24:35.000 And so the people there are...

01:24:40.000 Amazing, because they've lived in this abject poverty for their entire lives.

01:24:44.000 And not only that, they've lived through this Civil War in recent times.

01:24:50.000 I think we think about Civil War as this, like, thing we go to see at a national park.

01:24:55.000 So anyway, we're with these people, we're hunting, we go into, we get helicoptered into 10,000 feet, which is this just knob in the middle of nowhere.

01:25:05.000 We hike about a full day to our base camp, which is this little village called Dule Yarsa in the middle of, of course, nowhere.

01:25:12.000 It's like this terraced village.

01:25:14.000 And we meet our Sherpas and meet a bunch of locals.

01:25:19.000 And from there, we go up.

01:25:21.000 We're going to do, I think we had two or three more days of hiking just to get to the area where the blue sheep live.

01:25:26.000 So you're hiking from about 10,000 feet.

01:25:28.000 And at our highest, we are probably 16 or 16 and some change.

01:25:34.000 And so the first day, we go up and we acclimate.

01:25:36.000 We sight in our rifles.

01:25:37.000 We're hanging out.

01:25:39.000 And we go into this lady's little mud, dirt hut, essentially. 1.00

01:25:46.000 It's just like probably half the size of this room with a goat standing in the corner and a little fire pit.

01:25:54.000 We're sitting around this fire pit.

01:25:56.000 And she starts telling this story about how right where we were sitting during the rebellion, the police, the government police came in and shot six men right where we were sitting and buried them out back.

01:26:07.000 Jesus Christ.

01:26:08.000 And this is like, this lady must be in her mid-50s and she looked like she was 80. I mean, she's just like, it was this transformative thing for me sitting there listening to this being translated like, holy crap, where are we? 0.83

01:26:23.000 And in the midst of that story they were passing around, they had made this moonshine, which they called Roxy.

01:26:28.000 It's just like made in a ceramic thing outside of where we were at.

01:26:33.000 And so we were all just drinking it.

01:26:34.000 I wasn't thinking much about drinking it.

01:26:36.000 And then we had one more day before we left.

01:26:38.000 The next day, everybody was sick but me. 1.00

01:26:41.000 I'm talking shit your pants, puke out the tent. 1.00

01:26:44.000 We had two or three people shit their pants the next day. 1.00

01:26:47.000 It was the Kathmandu flu.

01:26:50.000 Everybody that wasn't native to that area got sick.

01:26:54.000 I didn't on the first day.

01:26:56.000 So everybody recovers.

01:26:57.000 The next day we're going up the mountain.

01:26:59.000 We're going up.

01:27:00.000 We had probably climbed about 2,000 feet.

01:27:02.000 We go over this pass and I'm feeling good.

01:27:06.000 I feel like everybody else is probably feeling pretty crappy.

01:27:09.000 And we're going down this ravine and this river valley to go.

01:27:14.000 We're on these like two or three foot wide goat trails probably.

01:27:18.000 It's like if you go to the right, you're dead.

01:27:20.000 If you step two feet to the right, you're dead.

01:27:22.000 You fall off and you're dead.

01:27:23.000 We've got 24 Sherpas and porters.

01:27:26.000 We've got three or four mules with all our camp gear going up this mountain in a string of people, probably 30 people long.

01:27:33.000 I'm generally in the middle, and we stop at some point after we had crested this high point.

01:27:40.000 And we're going down.

01:27:41.000 And I remember feeling pretty good.

01:27:42.000 I got my trekking poles.

01:27:43.000 I'm going.

01:27:44.000 It's warm outside.

01:27:45.000 And I'm going.

01:27:46.000 I'm like enjoying the view and looking around just thinking, oh my god.

01:27:50.000 And then I remember pretty quickly being laying in the snow.

01:27:54.000 Oh, I'm laying in the snow.

01:27:56.000 That's cool.

01:27:57.000 I had no recollection how I got there, what was happening.

01:28:01.000 So you're hiking, and then you wake up.

01:28:04.000 I was laying.

01:28:05.000 I don't know that I lost consciousness, but I just didn't...

01:28:07.000 I don't think in my mind I understood what was going on.

01:28:09.000 I kind of maybe stumbled back against this rock wall and then just slumped down in the snow.

01:28:14.000 I don't think anybody saw it.

01:28:17.000 And so I kind of stood up, and I'm like...

01:28:19.000 You're okay.

01:28:20.000 You're good.

01:28:22.000 You fell down, whatever.

01:28:23.000 Maybe you're getting a little weird.

01:28:25.000 And I keep going.

01:28:26.000 And we had a little problem with the mules.

01:28:28.000 These mules were going over this snow pass, and the mules couldn't get through it.

01:28:32.000 So they had to turn these mules around and send them back.

01:28:34.000 They couldn't get through it because the snow was too deep?

01:28:36.000 Yeah, I got videos of snow's too deep, and you're talking a trail half as wide as this table, maybe.

01:28:41.000 And they're trying to get these, and you're, you know, a thousand feet down to the river.

01:28:46.000 And so, we stop.

01:28:49.000 We all stop a second time to let these mules go back by, and I had to hang onto a bush on the side of the trail as they went by.

01:28:55.000 And I got back up on the trail.

01:28:57.000 You're hanging onto a bush for dear life.

01:28:59.000 Well, I mean, you had footing. 0.96

01:29:01.000 But we had filmmakers with us that were doing all kinds of crazy shit, like hanging off cliffs and doing stuff I would do. 0.86

01:29:08.000 To make video? 0.96

01:29:08.000 Yeah, to make film. 0.96

01:29:10.000 Dedicated.

01:29:10.000 They were.

01:29:12.000 And so we stopped.

01:29:14.000 We start going again.

01:29:16.000 Most everybody gets out in front of me.

01:29:17.000 I'm slowing up and I'm feeling dizzy.

01:29:19.000 And I'm like, man, okay, maybe I just stood up too fast.

01:29:21.000 Probably didn't eat enough today.

01:29:24.000 I'm going.

01:29:25.000 We're going.

01:29:26.000 And at some point, I just, like, it snapped in the room.

01:29:30.000 It was just, like, spinning like crazy.

01:29:33.000 And I was thinking, and I knew about altitude sickness, and I knew that I live in a place that's basically sea level, and I was at a place that was 13,000 feet, and I've never done that before.

01:29:43.000 Did you prepare for it at all?

01:29:45.000 If you can, I mean, there's not really any...

01:29:47.000 I trained, I did, for about...

01:29:49.000 We didn't really know we were going to go until later, so I trained for about a month and a half.

01:29:53.000 But not...

01:29:53.000 You can't train, like, there's no...

01:29:55.000 They told me before we go, like...

01:29:57.000 Altitude sickness, there's no predictor.

01:29:59.000 You could be a rookie or you could be a veteran.

01:30:01.000 You can get it like that.

01:30:03.000 It's part of the way your brain loses oxygen at those altitudes, and there's no real predictor for it.

01:30:10.000 And so I don't think physically I was having any problems.

01:30:13.000 And I don't know that I had altitude sickness.

01:30:16.000 But anyway, the effects were...

01:30:18.000 I kind of sat down.

01:30:19.000 I just couldn't go anymore because I couldn't get...

01:30:21.000 I wasn't about to walk on this trail and I couldn't freaking stand up.

01:30:24.000 And so our medic slash interpreter slash...

01:30:28.000 Uh, producer, cameraman, um, Ben Ayers comes back to me and starts talking me through.

01:30:35.000 He's, you know, this dude's climbed everywhere, been everywhere, um, and is a medic.

01:30:40.000 And so he's talking me through a little bit of the situation.

01:30:42.000 He's like, this is not good.

01:30:43.000 Like, if you're too dizzy to walk, no good.

01:30:47.000 So let's get some water in you, let's rest, let's get some food in you, see what happens.

01:30:52.000 Meanwhile, up the valley go the rest of the crew to the next camp.

01:30:57.000 So him and I spent like 20 minutes just going really slow and I just couldn't do it.

01:31:00.000 I was like, I can't stand up, dude.

01:31:01.000 I can't catch my...

01:31:03.000 I can't get my head to get back on my shoulders.

01:31:06.000 And so we sit down and we're sitting there and I look across this little bowl in this valley and I see this wolf.

01:31:13.000 I'm like, oh, cool, man.

01:31:14.000 That's a wolf.

01:31:14.000 Get my binos out.

01:31:15.000 I'm looking.

01:31:16.000 I can't find it.

01:31:16.000 Put them back.

01:31:17.000 Look over.

01:31:18.000 I was like, Ben, there's a wolf over there.

01:31:21.000 I think I see it.

01:31:22.000 This thing is laying down. 1.00

01:31:23.000 He goes, shit. 1.00

01:31:25.000 I was like, crap. 1.00

01:31:27.000 There's no wolves here, man. 0.99

01:31:29.000 I was like, oh.

01:31:30.000 There's no wolves in all of Nepal?

01:31:33.000 He's like, you're not going to see a wolf here.

01:31:35.000 Basically, I don't know.

01:31:37.000 They don't exist there.

01:31:37.000 They don't exist where we were in that district, in the hunting area where we were.

01:31:40.000 It's like, that's not, nope.

01:31:42.000 So you were hallucinating.

01:31:43.000 I was hallucinating, but it was not one of those, like, you see it and then you shake your head and it's gone.

01:31:47.000 It was like, uh, looking at it. 0.58

01:31:51.000 And it was, you know, just this, like, what could have been a stump, but in my mind it was a freaking wolf. 0.99

01:31:56.000 And I was losing my shit a little bit at that point. 0.99

01:31:59.000 I'm like, this is not good. 0.99

01:32:00.000 And so then, I'm sure in his mind, he's thinking Diamox is a pill you can take to help with altitude sickness.

01:32:07.000 And he's thinking about, okay, are we helicoptering this guy out of here on day two?

01:32:11.000 What are we going to do?

01:32:13.000 Because it's, you know, pulmonary edema, cerebral edema.

01:32:16.000 That's nothing to mess around with.

01:32:17.000 And it was only day two.

01:32:18.000 Yeah.

01:32:19.000 Well, day two of the actual trip.

01:32:21.000 We were four or five days into being in Nepal, but day two of the trek in.

01:32:26.000 And so we sat there for a while and I'm just looking and I remember just looking after like 10 minutes and still being there. 0.99

01:32:32.000 Like, fuck. 0.99

01:32:34.000 This is not good. 1.00

01:32:35.000 And so we get up to go and I'm like, I can do it, man.

01:32:38.000 I'm going to do it because I don't want to leave.

01:32:40.000 I want to hunt.

01:32:41.000 And we get going a little further down this trail.

01:32:44.000 And at this point I'm trying to like find some levity in the situation.

01:32:47.000 Joking with him.

01:32:48.000 He's joking with me.

01:32:49.000 We're just like trying to be normal.

01:32:50.000 And when I know that my head's not normal.

01:32:53.000 We're going real slow. 1.00

01:32:55.000 And I look on this, like, side hill of this trail, and there's a fucking baby. 0.99

01:32:59.000 And I thought, that's... 0.99

01:33:01.000 I thought, come on, baby!

01:33:05.000 Like, I didn't say anything to Ben about...

01:33:07.000 Was it naked? 0.96

01:33:08.000 I feel like it was a really big, naked baby. 0.84

01:33:10.000 It might have had a diaper on. 1.00

01:33:11.000 Ha ha ha!

01:33:13.000 Like, how big?

01:33:14.000 Like, as big as me?

01:33:15.000 I mean, like, it's like three feet tall.

01:33:18.000 I don't know, Joe. 0.99

01:33:20.000 This is some dark shit we're getting into. 0.97

01:33:23.000 So it was unusually sized... 0.99

01:33:24.000 It was like a baby that...

01:33:26.000 If you saw it on the street, you'd be like, whoa.

01:33:29.000 What a whopper.

01:33:29.000 That's a serious baby.

01:33:31.000 Science should be studying this baby. 0.99

01:33:34.000 I didn't get that baby.

01:33:35.000 So this baby's just on the side of the road.

01:33:37.000 And so I'm thinking like, I'm not saying nothing to Ben because this baby is like my ticket at home.

01:33:42.000 Like this baby.

01:33:43.000 If I'd be like, hey Ben, there's a baby right there.

01:33:46.000 He'd be like, cue the chopper.

01:33:48.000 Right.

01:33:49.000 See you, buddy.

01:33:50.000 Right.

01:33:50.000 You can't make it.

01:33:51.000 And this baby, it wasn't like the wolf.

01:33:52.000 It wasn't like I saw it and I stared at it.

01:33:54.000 Like, I saw it and then I looked back and it was there and I looked back and it wasn't there.

01:33:58.000 So I kept going.

01:33:58.000 I'm like, you know what, baby?

01:34:00.000 If you're really there, fuck you. 1.00

01:34:02.000 You shouldn't be up here anyways. 1.00

01:34:03.000 It's not my fault.

01:34:04.000 Wow.

01:34:04.000 You got harsh?

01:34:05.000 Yeah, I got harsh with it. 0.54

01:34:07.000 What a fake baby? 0.74

01:34:08.000 What a fake baby.

01:34:09.000 I'm like, I'm just going, man.

01:34:10.000 I'm not...

01:34:10.000 Whatever, baby.

01:34:11.000 Stay there.

01:34:12.000 Wow.

01:34:13.000 So I didn't say anything to Ben about the baby, like, right off, and we're getting going, and eventually I just kind of collapsed, and I'm like, look, man, you know, I was talking positively, and I wasn't hallucinating any more than the baby and the wolf, which is enough.

01:34:27.000 And we get down, we get going down this ravine, and the camp, you can start to see camp, guys putting camp together.

01:34:33.000 And, um, essentially he was like, just give me your pack, give me your trucking poles, give me everything.

01:34:38.000 And he held my shoulders and just kind of one step, one step, one step.

01:34:41.000 Wow.

01:34:41.000 For a solid hour and a half or so until we got to camp.

01:34:44.000 Wow.

01:34:45.000 A lot of breaks, a lot of just him and I talking about, well, here's the scenarios.

01:34:49.000 Are you, is this really, you know, is it acute mountain sickness or are you, you know, what's going on?

01:34:55.000 Did you get sick like the other people got sick?

01:34:56.000 Yes. 0.99

01:34:57.000 So that happened the next fucking day. 0.99

01:34:59.000 So do you think it was because of drinking that moonshine? 0.99

01:35:02.000 I think we got sick because of the moonshine.

01:35:04.000 It could have been water in Kathmandu.

01:35:06.000 It could have been anything.

01:35:07.000 How were they making that moonshine?

01:35:08.000 I have no...

01:35:09.000 I have a picture of it.

01:35:10.000 It looked like in this big ceramic thing.

01:35:12.000 Probably spitting in it.

01:35:14.000 Yeah, the goat was walking over there licking out of it. 1.00

01:35:17.000 But we all did it.

01:35:19.000 Everybody in there got some level of sickness that wasn't used to that area.

01:35:24.000 It wasn't used to being in Nepal and eating the food and drinking the moonshine and all that.

01:35:28.000 So who knows if it was the moonshine.

01:35:29.000 That was my guess.

01:35:31.000 Could have been anything.

01:35:32.000 So we finally make it to camp, and we're doing a film, so they're filming me while I'm all messed up.

01:35:38.000 And I was kind of out of it.

01:35:40.000 I remember coming down this switchback trail to go into camp, and I remember not...

01:35:47.000 Much like when I fell, I was like, I'm aware that my feet are hitting the ground, and these trekking poles are hitting the ground, and I'm aware that I'm doing this, but I feel like I can't control it.

01:35:56.000 I feel like I could be floating through the air just as well as walking.

01:35:58.000 It was a weird, like, head-detached-from-body feeling.

01:36:01.000 Wow.

01:36:02.000 It was gnarly.

01:36:05.000 At the end of the day, I think what they thought was like it was the sickness that everybody else got coming on at the same time as altitude and it was just my body was fighting this battle against itself.

01:36:17.000 So we got back to camp.

01:36:19.000 I think I just kind of sat in a chair for a while and said a lot of weird stuff, and they filmed me.

01:36:25.000 What did you say?

01:36:27.000 I think I said, like, at one point I think I said, what's the name of this mountain?

01:36:31.000 Because you've got to know the name of what's going to kill you or something weird, like, dark. 0.66

01:36:36.000 Whoa.

01:36:36.000 Like, this mountain's out to get us, Joe.

01:36:37.000 Were you thinking about your family?

01:36:39.000 Yeah.

01:36:39.000 Hell yeah.

01:36:40.000 Right?

01:36:40.000 That's the first thing you think about is you're in a bad situation in the woods.

01:36:44.000 Like, why did I come here? 1.00

01:36:46.000 Why do I have to be this adventuring asshole? 1.00

01:36:48.000 Yes. 1.00

01:36:49.000 That, 100%.

01:36:50.000 I think I was more focused on levity and more focused on, like, making jokes and, like, making it seem okay.

01:36:57.000 Right.

01:36:57.000 Because that's the only way that my mind could wrap itself around.

01:37:00.000 Like, oh, hey, you dumbass. 1.00

01:37:01.000 You trained for a month. 1.00

01:37:02.000 You went to Nepal.

01:37:02.000 What are you doing?

01:37:03.000 You're an idiot. 1.00

01:37:04.000 Right. 1.00

01:37:04.000 Like, you got a kid. 1.00

01:37:06.000 You live in Texas.

01:37:07.000 This is not it. 1.00

01:37:11.000 What the fuck? 1.00

01:37:12.000 What the fuck are you doing? 1.00

01:37:13.000 This is your brain and body telling you, like, hmm, dummy, don't do this. 1.00

01:37:17.000 Right.

01:37:18.000 But at the same time, like, I'm here.

01:37:20.000 It's amazing.

01:37:21.000 These people, this place, the feeling, the spirit, like, you know, you got to get through it.

01:37:25.000 Like, if there was anything to get through, then you, it would be this.

01:37:28.000 Right.

01:37:30.000 And so I got hardened to that fact.

01:37:32.000 And I think, you know, eventually I had some water and I went to sleep.

01:37:35.000 And I woke up in the middle of the night and Ben, the medic, was in the tent clutching his little medical bag and was sleeping in there with me.

01:37:42.000 So I feel like that's serious.

01:37:43.000 And I think they had a discussion while I was sleeping about, do we just, does he wake up in a helicopter?

01:37:47.000 You know, does he wake up going back to Kathmandu?

01:37:51.000 Which was probably the right conversation to have.

01:37:53.000 That's a Bob Seger song.

01:37:55.000 Waking up in Kathmandu. 1.00

01:37:56.000 Damn! 0.99

01:37:59.000 That's a good song. 0.99

01:38:00.000 That's really, really where I'm going to.

01:38:02.000 A baby and a wolf.

01:38:06.000 Did you tell anybody about the baby?

01:38:08.000 Yeah, they knew about the baby eventually.

01:38:10.000 Eventually.

01:38:11.000 But right at the moment when the baby was there, I'm like, listen, baby.

01:38:14.000 Wow.

01:38:14.000 Let's make a pact.

01:38:16.000 I'm going to keep you under wraps for a while. 0.99

01:38:18.000 So you're basically tripping balls. 0.98

01:38:21.000 Yeah, I don't know the science of it. 1.00

01:38:22.000 Somebody smarter than me could tell you what actually was going on, whether I was just a pussy or there was some actual scientific stuff going down. 0.99

01:38:32.000 I gotta fork a joint since it's illegal. 0.99

01:38:34.000 It's legal here in California.

01:38:36.000 This is hitting me hard.

01:38:37.000 Keep going.

01:38:37.000 I'll keep going while you're doing that.

01:38:41.000 So, the next day...

01:38:43.000 There's more to the story to tell.

01:38:46.000 There's probably so much to tell.

01:38:49.000 But the next day...

01:38:51.000 We get up, and I'm feeling okay.

01:38:55.000 Feeling pretty weak.

01:38:56.000 It's like, ah, this is not...

01:38:57.000 I'm still not...

01:38:58.000 Pretty poisoning weak?

01:38:59.000 Yeah.

01:39:00.000 Like that weird thing where you feel like you can't really make a fist?

01:39:03.000 Yeah, like achy.

01:39:04.000 Yeah.

01:39:04.000 Kind of.

01:39:05.000 So we did a little bit of filming in the morning, and it was like, hey, O'Brien, can you make it up for this acclimation hike, right?

01:39:13.000 Can you go up this hill right here?

01:39:15.000 What it was?

01:39:15.000 Okay.

01:39:18.000 Uh...

01:39:20.000 Can you make it up this hill right here?

01:39:21.000 If you can, we'll let you keep going.

01:39:22.000 So they give you a test.

01:39:25.000 Yeah, I could test you, O'Brien.

01:39:27.000 And so, I get up there.

01:39:29.000 I go with one of the guides, Raju.

01:39:30.000 Let me get up.

01:39:31.000 We start hiking.

01:39:33.000 We get up over this rise.

01:39:34.000 I'm feeling pretty good. 1.00

01:39:35.000 I'm like, shit. 1.00

01:39:35.000 Okay. 1.00

01:39:36.000 That was a bad moment in time.

01:39:38.000 I'm going.

01:39:39.000 But we're back.

01:39:40.000 Sheep.

01:39:40.000 Come on, sheep.

01:39:41.000 Let's do it.

01:39:42.000 And we're going.

01:39:43.000 I think we probably had a five or six hour hike into the next camp.

01:39:47.000 We started getting into sheep country at that time.

01:39:49.000 And we're hiking.

01:39:53.000 And I'm feeling pretty good.

01:39:54.000 And we get to a spot where our main guide, Mon, had spotted some sheep and so we get to where he had spotted some sheep and I'm feeling tired I'm like that we're going up as we go so we may be there 14,000 feet or 13.5 at that point and We sit down,

01:40:14.000 and he's glassing his sheep, and I remember glassing them, and like, oh, okay.

01:40:17.000 They're like, so far up, you can't imagine going that far to get them.

01:40:21.000 And then my stomach just like, oh, no.

01:40:24.000 Oh, God.

01:40:25.000 My stomach is completely screwed. 1.00

01:40:29.000 Does your butt start going? 1.00

01:40:31.000 You get that muscle, that butt muscle. 0.96

01:40:33.000 You know that butt muscle, like when you're holding a weight that you're going to drop?

01:40:36.000 Yeah.

01:40:38.000 That's what I was doing.

01:40:40.000 Like, oh Jesus! 0.99

01:40:41.000 Let me say this about shitting your pants. 0.98

01:40:47.000 Everybody on this trip was okay with it, because it was happening. 0.99

01:40:51.000 Right. 0.97

01:40:51.000 It was, shitting the pants was like a... 0.97

01:40:53.000 It's not like you're on a plane. 0.96

01:40:54.000 Yeah, and it was like, our camera guy, one of our main camera guys, Renan, who's an amazing person, a whole other podcast about that guy, he shit his pants, I think, during, like, day one. 0.96

01:41:07.000 And I don't know how many pairs of pants he had, but I remember watching him scrubbing the shit out of his pants, thinking, oh shit, that's going to get interesting. 0.93

01:41:15.000 But by the time we got into sheep country, we were all okay with the occasional shart or whatever's going on. 0.99

01:41:20.000 Right.

01:41:20.000 I think it's fine.

01:41:21.000 Because your body's just like, you're realizing that your mind has a directive, but your body is dealing with some pretty extreme conditions.

01:41:28.000 And I wonder, I always wonder now looking back on it, like how well I would have done if there wasn't sickness.

01:41:33.000 And like I had some stuff like go to Kathmandu and it's just dust and dirt and all this craziness.

01:41:38.000 And I had going into it like respiratory issues and then sickness and then visions of things. 0.99

01:41:43.000 And so by the time you get in there, you're like, shit. 0.99

01:41:47.000 You know, it really makes you respect the fuck out of Jim Shockey. 1.00

01:41:51.000 Oh, yeah. 0.54

01:41:52.000 For people who don't know who Jim Shockey is, Jim Shockey is extremely respected in the hunting world, but let's just step aside with that.

01:42:02.000 He's an amazingly accomplished hunter.

01:42:04.000 But maybe even more important than that, he's got a show called Uncharted.

01:42:08.000 And his Uncharted show is so good.

01:42:13.000 It's so good that it really shouldn't be considered a hunting show.

01:42:17.000 Because what it really is is him exploring cultures in the most remote parts of the world.

01:42:23.000 Jim goes to these strange villages in the middle of Russia that no one goes to.

01:42:29.000 I've got all kinds of stories.

01:42:30.000 Like, last time I was at Jim's place up in Cannon, I'm like, what you doing this weekend?

01:42:34.000 I'm like, ah, fly home, hang out with the family.

01:42:36.000 What are you doing?

01:42:36.000 He's like, ah, bison in Poland.

01:42:40.000 They have bison in Poland?

01:42:41.000 I think that's what he said.

01:42:43.000 I could be mislabeling.

01:42:44.000 Not that it freaking matters.

01:42:46.000 But it's the same kind of thing.

01:42:47.000 Right, and when I was...

01:42:49.000 I saw Jim about a month before we left for Nepal, and Jim had been...

01:42:53.000 If you can find the full episode of Jim's Nepal hunt with his crew, it is...

01:43:00.000 They film, they're like doing self-filming, and it's kind of...

01:43:03.000 It's how I felt, just like you're just a...

01:43:05.000 You're just a mess. 0.99

01:43:06.000 You're just a mess. 0.61

01:43:08.000 And I said to him, I was like, I'm going to Nepal, Jim, in like a month.

01:43:12.000 And he goes, what?

01:43:14.000 I was like, what can I expect? 1.00

01:43:15.000 He's like, it sucks. 1.00

01:43:18.000 It sucks. 0.99

01:43:19.000 And when somebody like Jim Shockey, who's traveled the world... 0.99

01:43:23.000 Literally the world.

01:43:24.000 ...it says, it's going to be terrible for you, little fella.

01:43:28.000 I was like, oh no.

01:43:29.000 This is real now.

01:43:31.000 I'm going to be in trouble.

01:43:32.000 Yeah, Jim Shockey has a...

01:43:36.000 A video or an episode of his show where he went to, I think it was Mozambique, where they were hunting crocodiles.

01:43:44.000 The crocodile one.

01:43:44.000 Because the crocodiles eat all the people that live and work in this village.

01:43:48.000 Yeah.

01:43:49.000 It is so crazy.

01:43:50.000 These poor people.

01:43:51.000 These people live under the threat of monsters on a daily basis.

01:43:55.000 Like, half the people in the village are either missing arms or they have a chunk taken out of their leg.

01:44:00.000 And while they were there, they lost a woman.

01:44:01.000 She was going down there either to fetch water or to wash her clothes.

01:44:06.000 And she got taken out, and these people were screaming and weeping.

01:44:10.000 It was so hard to watch, man.

01:44:12.000 To watch a bunch of people wailing.

01:44:15.000 Just wailing.

01:44:17.000 Because they knew this woman that they loved got taken under by a monster.

01:44:22.000 Do you remember the end of that?

01:44:24.000 Yeah.

01:44:24.000 The end of it where they cut the croc open and pulled, what was it, like a shoe or something out of the croc's belly?

01:44:30.000 Something like that.

01:44:31.000 A shirt or a shoe?

01:44:32.000 Yeah, something like that.

01:44:32.000 I remember we were talking about that.

01:44:34.000 Later on, and they're like, that should be on a different channel.

01:44:39.000 Yeah, it's so good.

01:44:40.000 It should be on Discovery or whatever.

01:44:43.000 What's his son's name that films it?

01:44:44.000 Branlon. 1.00

01:44:45.000 Branlon is a bad motherfucker. 1.00

01:44:47.000 He is a bad motherfucker. 1.00

01:44:48.000 The whole family. 1.00

01:44:49.000 Eva, their daughter.

01:44:50.000 But you know how...

01:44:51.000 Here's my criticism of outdoor, in air quotes, TV. There's episodes like Rinella's that are just brilliant.

01:44:59.000 I mean, Rinella's show...

01:45:00.000 Or shows, rather, like Rinella's.

01:45:02.000 Rinella's show is just a brilliant show.

01:45:04.000 I mean, it easily could be on any other network.

01:45:06.000 It's shot by 0.0.

01:45:09.000 The same people that shoot Anthony Bourdain's show.

01:45:12.000 The same people that shoot a ton of award-winning, Emmy-award-winning shows.

01:45:16.000 It's a brilliant show.

01:45:17.000 And then you got these... 0.99

01:45:19.000 Things that look like they shoot them with trail cams, a bunch of dipshits. 0.98

01:45:22.000 You know, the Lord blessed me when this bull came over the ridge. 0.98

01:45:27.000 You're like, okay.

01:45:29.000 There's a rampant anti-intellectualism, like an embraced...

01:45:35.000 Sort of like fake simplicity to it.

01:45:40.000 Yeah, there's like heartland pandering that goes on all the time.

01:45:43.000 It's pandering.

01:45:44.000 Pandering is a good way to look.

01:45:45.000 But then you've got Jim Shockey, who has this like legitimate appreciation for these cultures.

01:45:51.000 That he visits all over the world.

01:45:54.000 I mean, he goes to these incredibly remote places and communicates with these tribespeople that live in the jungle or in the mountains or wherever it is.

01:46:03.000 And you could tell that this is a guy, Jim is like, what is he, probably 60 or so?

01:46:07.000 He's getting up there, yeah.

01:46:09.000 And he realizes that he's lived a long life, he's experienced a lot of wild and amazing things, and now at this point in life, what he really desires are extreme experiences.

01:46:20.000 Of a human kind and also of a wild kind, like in nature.

01:46:25.000 And there's like a different level to him.

01:46:28.000 The outdoor TV thing is funny just because I do appreciate and have friends that fall into that...

01:46:34.000 Bubba zone.

01:46:36.000 Bubba zone.

01:46:36.000 Yeah.

01:46:37.000 And I appreciate what they do.

01:46:39.000 It's not for me.

01:46:40.000 I don't watch it and I'm a fan of it, but I appreciate other Bubbas like it and it's a thing.

01:46:46.000 It's hunting.

01:46:47.000 Right.

01:46:48.000 But, I will agree with you.

01:46:49.000 He's on another level.

01:46:50.000 There's just a different level.

01:46:52.000 You could watch Rinella's Coos Deer episode, where he just kind of like, the whole theme is like sitting in silence.

01:46:58.000 And like, if you're looking for the right...

01:46:59.000 And talking about his dad, talking about growing up, and there's no music.

01:47:03.000 It's one of those brilliant episodes.

01:47:05.000 Oh, it's wonderful.

01:47:05.000 And so you could watch something like that, and then every once in a while you'll see one where you're like...

01:47:11.000 What the fuck is going on here?

01:47:14.000 And it's like there's such a juxtaposition between what Steve and Jim and some of these other, like Heartland Bowhunter, these guys are able to even cinematically produce. 0.99

01:47:22.000 Yeah, Heartland Bowhunter, they do a really good job with their editing and their footage.

01:47:26.000 They do a really good job.

01:47:28.000 And Remy, like Solo Hunter is really great.

01:47:30.000 Tim Burnett.

01:47:31.000 Yeah, Tim Burnett.

01:47:32.000 And so there is this really good, and I don't know if they're pulling up The ones that aren't so good or they're being brought down.

01:47:41.000 I'm not sure.

01:47:42.000 I don't think it's either or.

01:47:44.000 You know what another one of my favorite is Western Hunter?

01:47:47.000 Yeah.

01:47:47.000 That's an amazing show.

01:47:49.000 And Nate Simmons is fucking so good on that. 0.98

01:47:53.000 And I would say as a hunter, it's hard. 0.99

01:47:56.000 All you care about is hunting.

01:47:57.000 You just want to read, read, read.

01:47:59.000 There's a lot of bad information.

01:48:00.000 On television, you mean?

01:48:03.000 Television.

01:48:04.000 But then you've got Western Hunter, which is a lot of really good information.

01:48:07.000 It's public land, and what he does is go deep into the backcountry, hiking, sets up camp, and does it the hard way.

01:48:14.000 That's the real hard way.

01:48:16.000 There's a lot of...

01:48:17.000 Man, it's hard to tell people to tune into a show if they've never had any appreciation whatsoever for hunting.

01:48:24.000 It'd be hard, yeah.

01:48:25.000 What show do you tune into?

01:48:29.000 There's three.

01:48:30.000 I feel like Western Hunter...

01:48:32.000 There's a few Into the Backcountry's really good, too.

01:48:34.000 But Meat Eater's probably the one I would send them to.

01:48:37.000 I'd be like, the narration that you're going to get and the intellectual understanding of how to present these subjects and how to...

01:48:48.000 Yeah, you know I mean that's what's important to me like as I get along in my life and career and like I have a son now and I'm trying to figure out what I want him to know and It's important to me that there's people like Steve Rinella out there representing my thoughts and feelings in a way that I probably couldn't.

01:49:06.000 So I don't want to struggle with that.

01:49:09.000 If he says, hey dad, let's watch an outdoor channel, I don't want to be like, oh, I don't know, man.

01:49:14.000 So I do appreciate Steve for what he does, and there's a bunch of them that are really good.

01:49:21.000 I guess I would say, at the end of the day, I've always struggled with Being in a room full of hunters and watching the Outdoor Channel because we're hypercritical of every little thing.

01:49:31.000 Yeah.

01:49:32.000 Like, why'd he draw?

01:49:33.000 Why didn't he draw?

01:49:34.000 Well, there's that, but that's different to me.

01:49:37.000 You don't think that flows into the actual, like, the quality of the content and how you enjoy it?

01:49:42.000 No, because I feel like if I'm watching Nate Simmons or Steve Ranallo or Remy Warren or any of those guys, I don't think anybody should be second-guessing what those guys do in the field.

01:49:49.000 Because you have a level of proficiency.

01:49:52.000 Right.

01:49:52.000 To me, that's like the layman watching a UFC fight and go, why didn't Conor punch him there?

01:49:58.000 And I'm like, listen, bitch. 1.00

01:49:59.000 Are you fucking crazy? 1.00

01:50:02.000 You don't think he knows when to punch and when not to punch? 1.00

01:50:04.000 Like, this is a stupid way of looking at things. 0.99

01:50:06.000 So if you would compare UFC to hunting television, there is no meter for how you get on hunting television. 0.99

01:50:11.000 You have money and you buy airtime.

01:50:13.000 You're there.

01:50:14.000 There is no qualifier.

01:50:17.000 Well, explain that because most people have no idea.

01:50:19.000 So, on the Outdoor Channel and Sports Channel.

01:50:20.000 If you want to put a show on Comedy Central, you have to make a deal with Comedy Central.

01:50:25.000 They've got to be like, oh, this is good.

01:50:26.000 For real producers, for real writers, you have to package it.

01:50:30.000 They're going to invest in it.

01:50:31.000 It's a big deal.

01:50:32.000 They're going to launch it right after Tosh.0.

01:50:35.000 And they're going to be invested in it, too.

01:50:37.000 They're like, if this goes good, we do good.

01:50:39.000 Everybody can buy it.

01:50:40.000 And the cable channels that are...

01:50:43.000 Outdoor and Sportsman's channel is that the business model is not that.

01:50:46.000 You pay the network for the airtime, essentially, and you deliver them content.

01:50:52.000 They have very little oversight over what you deliver them.

01:50:54.000 There's rules, you know, how many times you can show a kill shot, there's like, there's, there's...

01:50:58.000 What?

01:50:58.000 They have rules?

01:50:59.000 Yeah.

01:50:59.000 Oh, there's rules.

01:51:00.000 What?

01:51:01.000 Yeah.

01:51:02.000 Hold on.

01:51:02.000 They have rules on how many times you can show a kill shot?

01:51:05.000 I'm fairly sure.

01:51:05.000 So you can't, like, shoot a deer two minutes into the episode and just...

01:51:10.000 For 30 more minutes.

01:51:13.000 Just watch the close-up on the deer's eyes as the arrow goes to its body.

01:51:17.000 Close-up on the arrow as it hits the rib cage.

01:51:19.000 It's a good thing we brought that red camera, Jim.

01:51:23.000 All death metal and deers dying.

01:51:26.000 Feet up in the air, kicking.

01:51:27.000 Chicken over the egg.

01:51:32.000 There could be a show like that. 1.00

01:51:34.000 I mean, there's a lot of nutty fucking shows. 0.97

01:51:37.000 There's a few that are kind of metal-inspired, like Fear No Evil. 0.98

01:51:40.000 But so there are...

01:51:41.000 Oh, God.

01:51:42.000 Right?

01:51:42.000 There are...

01:51:43.000 I'm trying to be diplomatic here, Rogan.

01:51:47.000 There are some really good shows, but you pay...

01:51:51.000 And there are some shows that are owned by the network.

01:51:52.000 But that is the minority.

01:51:55.000 The majority of shows are people who are paying for airtime, and then companies come in and sponsor their show and pay that for their...

01:52:01.000 Isn't that weird, though, that a network on actual regular DirecTV, like you can get to a channel 605, 606, 604. You know what's interesting?

01:52:11.000 The hunting channels, which are, like, I would say... 0.98

01:52:17.000 Overwhelmingly Christian, like in terms of viewership and in terms of the people that are on the show, are literally two or three channels away from black dicks and white chicks on DirecTV. 1.00

01:52:29.000 The porn channels are like 596, 597, and then you go 604. It's like, hey, y'all, we're out here representing God's great earth and the beauty and the bounty of Jesus Christ out here in the forest. 0.95

01:52:45.000 Well, you're always two clicks away from something terrible.

01:52:51.000 Black poles and white holes.

01:52:53.000 Next on DirecTV.

01:52:54.000 Click, click, click.

01:52:56.000 Jesus has blessed me with this turkey. 0.51

01:53:00.000 We were two clicks away from Longergeier and a freaking hyena massacre. 0.99

01:53:06.000 That's true. 0.83

01:53:07.000 You're always two clicks away.

01:53:08.000 But that's the internet.

01:53:09.000 This is television.

01:53:10.000 That's true.

01:53:12.000 Those lines are gonna get super blurred.

01:53:15.000 They're gonna get super blurred.

01:53:16.000 They're more blurred now than ever before. 1.00

01:53:18.000 Stephen Colbert said that the president of the fucking United States uses Putin's dick, like he uses his mouth as Putin's cock holster. 1.00

01:53:26.000 What? 1.00

01:53:27.000 Yes.

01:53:28.000 But Stephen Colbert is very religious, right? 0.74

01:53:29.000 He is.

01:53:30.000 He said that?

01:53:30.000 When did he say that?

01:53:31.000 He said it on television recently.

01:53:33.000 Yeah, his idea was he was going to...

01:53:36.000 This is the inside story.

01:53:37.000 He was baiting Trump to respond to him.

01:53:40.000 And finally, after he said that, Trump did respond, called him second rate, not funny, all these things.

01:53:45.000 Ratings dying, ratings bad, all this stuff.

01:53:47.000 And then Colbert gets on TV and he goes, Mr. Trump...

01:53:50.000 Out of all the things that I know you don't understand, the one thing I thought you did understand was show business.

01:53:55.000 Oh, he's trolling him.

01:53:56.000 He's like, you responded to me.

01:53:58.000 That means I win.

01:54:01.000 He trolled the president.

01:54:03.000 He did!

01:54:04.000 He trolled the president.

01:54:05.000 The fact that the president is trollable is an issue.

01:54:08.000 He's trolling as well as being trollable.

01:54:11.000 Yeah, that's true.

01:54:11.000 Like, Joe Scarborough and his fiancee, do you know that whole story where the president tweeted that the woman came to Mar-a-Lago, but she had facelift surgery, and she was bleeding very badly, and he did not hang out with them.

01:54:26.000 He tweeted that last week.

01:54:29.000 I gotta get back on Twitter.

01:54:30.000 It's so bad that Scarborough left the Republican Party.

01:54:33.000 What is happening in the world?

01:54:35.000 Scarborough's like, look, if you guys are gonna support this, he goes, I'm not a Republican anymore.

01:54:39.000 He goes, I'm going independent.

01:54:40.000 He goes, I still have Republican values.

01:54:42.000 I still belong to the GOP. Economically and socially.

01:54:45.000 But I'm not gonna do this.

01:54:46.000 We live in strange times.

01:54:49.000 The strangest...

01:54:50.000 The strangest of times, Joe Rogan!

01:54:52.000 That's why my tour is called Strange Times.

01:54:54.000 Go to JoeRogan.net for its house tour.

01:54:56.000 See you in Utah this weekend.

01:54:57.000 We'll be there.

01:54:58.000 Oh, you're gonna be there.

01:54:58.000 I'll be there.

01:54:59.000 Yeah, we're gonna be there for a total coincidence, my wife doesn't believe it, but the total archery challenge is actually there at the same time.

01:55:07.000 All hunting is total coincidence.

01:55:09.000 Total coincidence.

01:55:09.000 Joe's wife.

01:55:10.000 I can't believe this, baby.

01:55:12.000 It's amazing.

01:55:13.000 Can't believe I'm doing a show in the wilds of New Mexico in September.

01:55:17.000 I always wanted to visit this Native American reservation, and it turns out that they invited me to hunt bison there.

01:55:23.000 I mean, I don't want to go, but I don't want to...

01:55:26.000 There's 75 people coming to the show.

01:55:27.000 I don't want to be disrespectful.

01:55:29.000 Well, strange times it is.

01:55:32.000 I do every once in a while flick on CNN or something, but I'm not one of those people.

01:55:39.000 I've seen people in my life that get so wrapped up in that stuff that it becomes their reality.

01:55:44.000 I've never been affected by anything Donald Trump has done in my daily life.

01:55:48.000 The healthcare thing is a different deal, but...

01:55:51.000 But I think in my daily life, there's few things that directly affect me other than something that seems existential, other than the environment and freaking healthcare.

01:56:00.000 Right, but that doesn't even affect you where you feel it.

01:56:02.000 You don't feel it if you ignore it.

01:56:04.000 That's part of the problem is that we don't, like on a day-to-day basis, it doesn't touch your skin.

01:56:09.000 It doesn't make your nerve endings respond.

01:56:12.000 So you can choose.

01:56:13.000 There's a choice, right, man?

01:56:14.000 You can choose to not...

01:56:21.000 I don't know if I'm always doing it, but I don't just turn it on and sit there and watch CNN and think, ah, Russia.

01:56:31.000 Right.

01:56:32.000 Oh, man. 1.00

01:56:34.000 If I see a Russian on the street, I'll punch him right in his face. 1.00

01:56:36.000 Well, you saw that news report where the reporter, he admitted that this whole Russian thing is kind of bullshit and it's just for ratings? 1.00

01:56:43.000 Yeah. 0.97

01:56:44.000 And I was like, well, I'm a journalism major.

01:56:46.000 I'm like, of course it is.

01:56:48.000 Yeah.

01:56:48.000 Of course it is.

01:56:50.000 Of course it is.

01:56:50.000 If it bleeds, it leads, Ben.

01:56:54.000 Yeah, I don't know what's real anymore.

01:56:57.000 I really don't.

01:56:59.000 I don't want to ever say, I mean, I want to look into things for sure.

01:57:02.000 It's not that I'm not thinking about it, but man, I watch House of Cards too much.

01:57:09.000 What you drinking there, Joe Rogan?

01:57:10.000 This is not a sponsor, is what's important.

01:57:13.000 It's Zevia. 0.94

01:57:14.000 Do you know what Zevia is?

01:57:15.000 I do not.

01:57:15.000 I would like to know.

01:57:16.000 It's a Stevia-flavored soft drink.

01:57:19.000 Mmm.

01:57:20.000 Yeah, it's 100% no sugar.

01:57:22.000 This one is their energy drink.

01:57:25.000 I think it has 120 milligrams of caffeine, which is like a good cup of coffee.

01:57:32.000 Not a Starbucks venti, I think it has 200. So it's not quite a Starbucks venti.

01:57:38.000 Not even a grande, but it has zero sugar, and it actually tastes really good.

01:57:42.000 Would you like one?

01:57:43.000 I would, yeah.

01:57:44.000 Oh, young Jamie.

01:57:45.000 Let me chug down this Rybaran. 0.99

01:57:47.000 Let me get this motherfucker a Zevia. 1.00

01:57:48.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:57:50.000 They make really good soft drinks too.

01:57:52.000 Do we have any soft drinks in the fridge or just the energy drink?

01:57:55.000 Throw some of those soft drinks in the fridge for the next... 0.97

01:57:57.000 I feel like as the first time visiting California, I gotta do shit like drink this Zevia. 0.99

01:58:02.000 Yeah, people in California just don't respect you if you haven't been here. 0.96

01:58:05.000 They're like, oh, you don't even know what to do here.

01:58:07.000 I've been to your many great airports, but never...

01:58:10.000 Like this morning, I went out and got like a parfait.

01:58:13.000 Ah.

01:58:14.000 Yes.

01:58:15.000 With granola?

01:58:15.000 Yeah, there was some granola in there.

01:58:17.000 And then I got, I went to the pool a little bit and did some emails.

01:58:22.000 Nice.

01:58:22.000 And drank a sparkling water.

01:58:24.000 Did you see any hoes? 1.00

01:58:27.000 There were, no, they were in different areas.

01:58:31.000 You've got to travel.

01:58:32.000 If you're going to travel, next time you've got to land in Beverly Hills, or at least go to a hotel in Beverly Hills.

01:58:37.000 Well, we have the rest of today.

01:58:38.000 I really need to see the comedy store.

01:58:41.000 I poke my head in there. 0.98

01:58:43.000 Damn it, I can't go there tonight, though. 0.99

01:58:45.000 Unfortunately. 0.99

01:58:47.000 Yeah, we would have been...

01:58:48.000 Are those cold or no?

01:58:50.000 Oh, they are?

01:58:50.000 Oh, beautiful.

01:58:51.000 So it is grape soda, but it's zero sugar.

01:58:54.000 Try one of those.

01:58:54.000 It's good.

01:58:55.000 They're delicious.

01:58:57.000 And by the way, not a sponsor.

01:58:59.000 I was gonna say. 1.00

01:58:59.000 Man, I get in trouble all the time for shit. 1.00

01:59:01.000 They're not in trouble, but people accuse me. 1.00

01:59:03.000 Send me one of those bitches. 1.00

01:59:05.000 They always think that for whatever reason, I'm getting paid for stuff. 1.00

01:59:08.000 People got mad at me about that Yeti thing that I did.

01:59:11.000 Which, by the way, my friend Ben worked for Yeti.

01:59:14.000 I'm gonna be honest here.

01:59:15.000 This is a Yeti Rambler.

01:59:16.000 He'll send me some Yeti things. 0.99

01:59:18.000 But I bought Yeti shit before he even worked for Yeti, and I was telling people how amazing Yeti You made that very clear to me, too. 0.98

01:59:24.000 I was like, man, I work for Yeti now. 0.99

01:59:26.000 You need a cooler or something?

01:59:29.000 Yetis, bro?

01:59:30.000 I already had two Yetis. 0.83

01:59:32.000 Big-ass ones.

01:59:33.000 Back off, O'Brien. 0.90

01:59:34.000 I already got Yetis.

01:59:36.000 They're the best. 0.97

01:59:37.000 If you've never had one and people go, they're so fucking expensive. 0.91

01:59:41.000 You're right. 0.96

01:59:42.000 You're right.

01:59:42.000 You don't have to have one.

01:59:43.000 But I'm telling you, if you have the money and you want a crazy fucking cooler, they are the shit. 1.00

01:59:48.000 This is very good. 1.00

01:59:49.000 How do you feel about the ones that...

01:59:51.000 There's one that...

01:59:54.000 That totally copied Yeti, like in every way.

01:59:57.000 But I mean, they copied the way...

01:59:59.000 It's very flattering.

02:00:00.000 The way the logo is, and someone was saying, hey man, this one is like half the price, and it does just as good.

02:00:07.000 I'm like, okay.

02:00:07.000 And then there was like this battle after I posted that in the comment section of Instagram where people are like, they're copycats.

02:00:14.000 You know, that's...

02:00:14.000 There is debate.

02:00:15.000 I mean, it's a good, robust debate on what's the better cooler.

02:00:19.000 It's funny that Yeti has kind of...

02:00:21.000 Well, yeah.

02:00:22.000 I created the premium, cooler category, and when you create a category like that, and become a business like Yeti is, you're going to have people that follow along.

02:00:33.000 Copy, for sure.

02:00:33.000 And they kind of need us, and we kind of need them, and it's whatever, but as long as they're not infringing on the things that are intellectual property and things of that nature.

02:00:41.000 Patents and shit, yeah.

02:00:42.000 As far as that goes, I know as a company, man, we look forward. 0.98

02:00:46.000 We have stuff we're coming out with now, things we're doing.

02:00:49.000 We're not worried about people that are copying us because I'll just continue to follow along.

02:00:54.000 Yeah, I mean, look, coolers are coolers.

02:00:57.000 It's all good, but when I find something that I like that's good, I like to tell people about it.

02:01:04.000 And for whatever reason, people always assume...

02:01:06.000 Why is that such a hard thing to get their heads around? 1.00

02:01:08.000 Well, because they're cynical, and they should be, because people are full of shit. 1.00

02:01:12.000 There's a lot of people that are full of shit. 1.00

02:01:14.000 There are. 1.00

02:01:14.000 But I swear to fucking God, if there's ever a time where I have an ad, like the ads for my podcast, everybody knows their ads. 1.00

02:01:20.000 People pay for those ads. 1.00

02:01:21.000 When we were talking about it, that was my argument.

02:01:23.000 I'm like...

02:01:24.000 People pay for ads and Joe reads the ad.

02:01:27.000 He never just throws in during a podcast like, ah, let me just pull out this.

02:01:31.000 No, no, no.

02:01:32.000 It doesn't happen.

02:01:33.000 And that's why people listen.

02:01:34.000 If I talk to Zevia, I have zero. 1.00

02:01:35.000 I bought this.

02:01:37.000 I ran out.

02:01:38.000 I ordered these all on Amazon.com.

02:01:41.000 I paid for them.

02:01:42.000 It's very delicious. 0.99

02:01:43.000 Yeah, they're fucking great. 1.00

02:01:44.000 I drink this shit all the time. 1.00

02:01:46.000 You know why? 1.00

02:01:46.000 It's good for you. 1.00

02:01:46.000 Because it tastes good, and it doesn't have any bullshit in it. 1.00

02:01:50.000 Like, this is all just zero calories, zero sugar, you know? 0.96

02:01:54.000 I mean, it's grape soda, but it's clear because you don't have any...

02:01:57.000 Look, see, it's grape, but look, clear. 0.99

02:01:59.000 It looks like fucking water. 0.99

02:02:00.000 It's like the Zima, right? 1.00

02:02:01.000 Yeah, it's great.

02:02:02.000 I used to love Zima.

02:02:03.000 It's not a Zevia ad. 0.99

02:02:04.000 I don't have any fucking... 0.99

02:02:05.000 Nothing to do with that company. 0.99

02:02:06.000 They're not a sponsor.

02:02:07.000 But isn't that the whole world?

02:02:09.000 Like, facts are...

02:02:10.000 You know, people assign their motives to facts and, like, everything.

02:02:13.000 I could say...

02:02:14.000 I work for Yeti.

02:02:15.000 I could say Yeti's a great cooler.

02:02:18.000 It's the best I've ever used.

02:02:19.000 I use him all the time, more than any normal person.

02:02:21.000 It's my job.

02:02:22.000 And I've found it to be...

02:02:24.000 I'm proud to work for the company because it's something I can stand behind.

02:02:27.000 I've still had people be like, ah, whatever, man.

02:02:29.000 Right, you're just shilling for your company, bro.

02:02:31.000 I'm like, I just...

02:02:32.000 But isn't it smart, though, that people are that cynical?

02:02:35.000 I mean, look, but here's a perfect example.

02:02:37.000 I rant and rave about the glory of a 1965 Corvette.

02:02:41.000 I don't work for 1965 Corvettes, okay?

02:02:44.000 It's just like there's a reality about certain things that are awesome that people have created that I celebrate.

02:02:50.000 And I don't say, I'm not going to talk about Zevia because they're not a sponsor, or I'm not going to talk about Yeti because they're not a sponsor.

02:02:58.000 It's interesting to me.

02:02:59.000 It's all interesting.

02:03:00.000 I like...

02:03:01.000 I like when people get it right.

02:03:02.000 You have this podcast where you're closing 1,000 episodes and if you remove all consumer products from the conversation, it would suck.

02:03:10.000 The problem is people boil down innovation to a consumer product.

02:03:17.000 They boil it down to...

02:03:18.000 A material possession that somebody has to purchase.

02:03:21.000 Right.

02:03:22.000 I'm not looking at it that way.

02:03:23.000 I'm being honest.

02:03:24.000 When I'm looking at something that someone creates, some new innovation, I'm looking at it like, oh, look what they did.

02:03:31.000 Oh, yeah.

02:03:33.000 I wish I could have figured that out. 0.97

02:03:35.000 I don't even think that because I'm not an inventor, but I do get excited about cool shit. 0.93

02:03:40.000 On the archery side of things, Bluetooth. 0.96

02:03:43.000 I heard about that.

02:03:44.000 Is that real?

02:03:44.000 See that link I sent you?

02:03:45.000 That is real.

02:03:46.000 It's real.

02:03:47.000 What's it called?

02:03:48.000 What's the name of the company?

02:03:50.000 Breadcrumb Tech?

02:03:52.000 Bluetooth Nox.

02:03:53.000 The problem is, I'm shooting 86 pounds, son. 1.00

02:03:57.000 You're too strong for that shit. 1.00

02:03:59.000 I'm blowing right through animals. 1.00

02:04:01.000 Look, man, listen.

02:04:02.000 There's not going to be any Nox poking out where you can track those things.

02:04:04.000 I've had a lot of people tell, you know, through me to tell you just to dial it down a little bit, Joe.

02:04:10.000 Do they?

02:04:10.000 Yeah, a little bit.

02:04:11.000 For real?

02:04:12.000 Yeah, for real.

02:04:12.000 I've had a couple people say, like, Joe, you can't be promoting shooting that much poundage.

02:04:17.000 I just want you motherfuckers to check out the gun show. 1.00

02:04:20.000 My ears go this way. 1.00

02:04:21.000 I don't understand why people don't...

02:04:24.000 It doesn't factor into their mind that some people are stronger than them.

02:04:28.000 It's true.

02:04:29.000 Like, if you pull 60 pounds, I don't feel bad about...

02:04:32.000 I'm not upset at you.

02:04:34.000 Look at these things.

02:04:35.000 Look.

02:04:36.000 So they shoot this arrow, and then with your phone, you can track the knock through a Bluetooth device that has some sort of a GPS locator on it.

02:04:48.000 Oh, you shoot it in the grass, which I do often.

02:04:50.000 He missed it.

02:04:51.000 That's Brandon Bates.

02:04:52.000 Brandon Bates from RMEF, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.

02:04:56.000 Good man.

02:04:57.000 I think he's got an America hat on.

02:04:58.000 America.

02:04:59.000 I got an America case for my phone.

02:05:01.000 America.

02:05:02.000 America.

02:05:03.000 Nothing better than that.

02:05:04.000 Wait till we have the new studio and have America flag in the background.

02:05:07.000 That flag we got sitting back there, Jamie? 0.98

02:05:10.000 Goddamn glory! 0.98

02:05:11.000 Have you previewed the new studio? 0.99

02:05:13.000 Nobody knows anything.

02:05:14.000 Oh, okay.

02:05:15.000 There's not a new studio.

02:05:16.000 When it comes, it will be epic.

02:05:18.000 You guys don't worry about it.

02:05:20.000 But these knocks, it's going to be a good way to find arrows for sure, but what's interesting is it'll be a good way to track animals if you shoot an animal.

02:05:32.000 Like a lot of times, People shoot an animal, and the animal runs, and it's in thick cover, and you can't find it.

02:05:39.000 It's dead.

02:05:40.000 It died quick.

02:05:41.000 An animal can run 200 yards inside of a few seconds and die immediately, and you might never find it.

02:05:49.000 So if you shoot exactly where your aim and you put a hole in each of its lungs?

02:05:51.000 Yeah.

02:05:52.000 With a two inch diameter range broadhead or one and a quarter, whatever it is, it can run 100 yards.

02:05:58.000 Perfect example is that place we were at in Texas.

02:06:01.000 Oh, yeah.

02:06:02.000 This place had these scrub oaks that were six feet tall and you could not get into.

02:06:07.000 And the animals, you would shoot one.

02:06:09.000 The guys were talking to us about pigs. 0.96

02:06:11.000 Like, yeah, we had a pig contest. 0.88

02:06:13.000 We shot three, lost two.

02:06:14.000 Like, what?

02:06:15.000 What?

02:06:16.000 What's wrong with you?

02:06:17.000 And it didn't make sense until you go there.

02:06:19.000 You go, oh yeah, how are you going to find that?

02:06:21.000 You can't even get in there.

02:06:22.000 Why would we go there?

02:06:23.000 Why would we do that?

02:06:24.000 Well, they just needed to trim that stuff.

02:06:26.000 Yeah.

02:06:27.000 We should have talked to them about that.

02:06:29.000 I think they kind of knew, but they were putting it off.

02:06:31.000 But it was just like, Jesus Christ.

02:06:33.000 We have so much bush.

02:06:35.000 Well, any place you hunt, especially when you think about a recovering game, even in Lanai, you think it's a fairly flat place.

02:06:42.000 If I shoot a deer, I'll see it go down or whatever. 0.84

02:06:44.000 It goes behind a bush or it goes over a rise and you go and you're like, oh, crap.

02:06:48.000 Well, how about the place that we were at the last day where the grass was six feet high and the animals were in the grass?

02:06:54.000 When you were trying to dropkick deer and stuff.

02:06:56.000 They were waiting.

02:06:57.000 What's crazy was, Ben and I were there, I shot at this one deer, and other deer that were like 30 feet away from us jumped out of the bushes.

02:07:06.000 Like, they were hiding.

02:07:07.000 They heard us talking, they knew we were there, and they just laid low.

02:07:11.000 Yeah.

02:07:12.000 Well, they, like, they laid low, and then you shot an arrow, and they were like, I know what that sounds like.

02:07:17.000 Yeah.

02:07:18.000 And they ran off, and we knew they didn't cross into the next little paddock, like, the next across this road, so I circled around and got up on this, like, mound so I could see into the grass, and I could see them in there. 0.63

02:07:28.000 They're just, like, talking to me, like, shit, what do we do? 0.95

02:07:31.000 Like, that's Joe Rogan. 0.98

02:07:34.000 And I was trying to get you to go in there, but you were what, like six feet away from these things by the time...

02:07:40.000 By the time we got to them, I was no further away than 15 feet.

02:07:44.000 Yeah.

02:07:44.000 And you're talking an axe deer that has swords growing out of its head.

02:07:47.000 Yeah.

02:07:47.000 Multiple points.

02:07:48.000 It was pretty crazy.

02:07:49.000 But they're just...

02:07:50.000 Animals evolved to experience whatever the...

02:07:53.000 Dangers of their environment are and their dangers are 100% people. 0.68

02:07:57.000 Yeah, that animal is probably four or five years old been around people for four or five years It's like oh I get it when people around they're trying to eat you man people have never got me in this grass Yeah.

02:08:09.000 Nobody has ever been able to do it.

02:08:11.000 So how did you, how did the Nepal thing end?

02:08:14.000 Did you get it together?

02:08:16.000 I did get it together.

02:08:17.000 I think we left off at, I started to get sick.

02:08:19.000 Well, the whole next day I was puking, shitting, and just, I had the flu everybody else got, but I just got it like two days later.

02:08:28.000 And so, it was that day, it was the first day we'd seen sheep.

02:08:34.000 So we were three, I think, four days into the trek.

02:08:37.000 And we were camping somewhere at 14,000 feet.

02:08:44.000 The next day, the other guy that had a tag, Cole, goes up, shoots a sheep.

02:08:48.000 They climb up 2,000 feet, 60-mile-an-hour wind bursts, microbursts, frostbite conditions.

02:08:57.000 These guys, when they came back, looked beaten.

02:09:01.000 Cole Kramer, who we went with as a Kodiak Alaska bear guide and a mountain hunter and is hardcore as he gets.

02:09:07.000 And I looked at his face when he got back, and I had just been in my tent all day puking and trying to stay alive.

02:09:13.000 And I looked at his face, and he's like, oh my god.

02:09:16.000 And I thought, I can't make it over there to the latrine, let alone up this mountain to kill a sheep.

02:09:23.000 And so I kind of had resigned myself to like, this is it, man, I can't.

02:09:27.000 I wish I was healthy enough to do it, but I don't want to get up there and then have issues and not be able to get a helicopter rescue.

02:09:34.000 And so, we talked about it, but the worst part, and I'll just have to tell this just because it's like the low point of my trip there.

02:09:45.000 The third night in it, when we got to camp, I was puking in the vestibule of my tent, and all the Nepali guys were, are you okay? 1.00

02:09:55.000 You okay?

02:09:56.000 You okay?

02:09:57.000 No, I'm not okay.

02:09:58.000 I'm puking.

02:09:59.000 And then I fell asleep, woke back up.

02:10:02.000 I had to go to the bathroom.

02:10:03.000 Ben, the medic, is there.

02:10:04.000 He's kind of helping me to the bathroom.

02:10:05.000 I'm like, I'm not going to make it.

02:10:07.000 I can't stand up.

02:10:08.000 So I literally just kind of like huddled over in the snow and pulled my pants down and just right in the middle of camp.

02:10:14.000 Just let it go.

02:10:19.000 And I just remember just thinking, oh my god.

02:10:23.000 And I look up and there's all these porters and sherpas with their headlamps.

02:10:27.000 So I'm like, you okay, Mr. Ben?

02:10:28.000 You okay?

02:10:28.000 I'm like, look at me!

02:10:31.000 I'm dying.

02:10:33.000 And so that was the lowest point of the trip.

02:10:36.000 And that, I think the next day, Cole killed his sheep.

02:10:41.000 The day after that, I went up the mountain in midday just for another acclimation.

02:10:48.000 Could I make it?

02:10:48.000 Thank you.

02:10:50.000 We got into a group of sheep, didn't make it happen, but I went up the mountain, basically.

02:10:53.000 Probably 1,200 feet, just a good climb.

02:10:56.000 Went back down, they're like, okay, tomorrow is kind of the last chance because we're almost out of areas to hunt these sheep.

02:11:02.000 And we went up the valley, I want to say like eight miles?

02:11:06.000 I got it written down somewhere.

02:11:08.000 Wow.

02:11:09.000 Eight miles.

02:11:10.000 After being on death's door two days before.

02:11:12.000 And I wasn't, to be 100% honest, I wasn't carrying a pack or anything.

02:11:16.000 I just had trekking poles and a bino harness, and I was just like...

02:11:19.000 One foot, one foot.

02:11:20.000 And we got into these mountain passes in these valleys where there was like, you know, two, three feet of snow and it was frozen on the top and you were just like, every step you would crunch two feet down.

02:11:30.000 Like, boom, boom.

02:11:31.000 And it was just hours of that.

02:11:34.000 And there was a time during that where we, we summited this, probably the highest peak we were at, which was mid-15s, close to 16. And I was just like, I can't, this is, I hope the sheep are right there because this is it.

02:11:47.000 Like, this is as far as I can go.

02:11:49.000 And we rested and we glassy sheep and there they are like a mile and a half away.

02:11:54.000 Down this other giant ravine and up on this other flat.

02:11:58.000 And I remember even the guys we were with looking like, he's not going to be able to go over there.

02:12:03.000 And I just remember thinking like, this is what, I'm doing it.

02:12:06.000 Like, I'm just going to go.

02:12:07.000 And we slid on our butts like down the side of this mountain, me and two guides.

02:12:12.000 Slid on our butts down the side of this snowy, icy bank.

02:12:15.000 Got up, walked a half a mile, popped up over this ridge, there at the sheet bar within 300 yards. 0.97

02:12:21.000 In about 20 minutes, I got on a big ram and shot him. 0.93

02:12:25.000 Wow. 0.97

02:12:26.000 And there was no celebration.

02:12:29.000 There was no...

02:12:30.000 I wasn't even happy, I don't think.

02:12:32.000 Because you were so out of it.

02:12:33.000 Yeah, I think I just kind of slumped over on my pack.

02:12:35.000 I was laying prone.

02:12:36.000 I just slumped over my pack.

02:12:38.000 Okay.

02:12:39.000 Did you eat it that night?

02:12:41.000 Yeah, they ate the whole thing.

02:12:43.000 Not all that night, but...

02:12:45.000 Did you eat any of it?

02:12:46.000 Oh, yeah.

02:12:46.000 I was too sick.

02:12:47.000 Like, the spices, those curry spices, even the smell of that curry spice, I couldn't even take.

02:12:51.000 Really?

02:12:52.000 So I ate a good bit of it.

02:12:53.000 Oh, they curried up your sheep?

02:12:55.000 They put that on everything.

02:12:56.000 But even the tent smelled like that.

02:12:57.000 So, like, the cook tent, I couldn't even really be in there.

02:13:00.000 It was...

02:13:00.000 I ended up just eating rice for a couple days.

02:13:02.000 I just couldn't...

02:13:03.000 Wow.

02:13:03.000 I couldn't stomach...

02:13:04.000 It was just such a gnarly experience.

02:13:07.000 So everybody ate your sheep?

02:13:09.000 Like, you didn't even bring it back?

02:13:11.000 No, you can't bring the meat back here anyways.

02:13:13.000 So the point was, so they had mostly already eaten Cole's sheep within a day and a half or two days.

02:13:19.000 What are wolves?

02:13:19.000 How many people are there?

02:13:20.000 There's 24, 25 of them.

02:13:22.000 Oh, wow.

02:13:22.000 Oh, yeah, they're burning through that thing.

02:13:24.000 And not only did they eat eyeballs, so Cole had shot a sheep and he was caping out the head, taking the hide off the head.

02:13:31.000 Pop the eyeballs out and I think jokingly handed to one of the porters like ha ha eat this and I watched that dude put it on the end of a stick and put it over fire and eat it.

02:13:42.000 Yeah, why wouldn't they?

02:13:43.000 I mean, that's meat.

02:13:44.000 So they I didn't see this personally, but they were picky.

02:13:47.000 Yeah, they took the punch that the gut sack and and cut it open flapped out the insides and And took it back and cooked that too, you know?

02:13:56.000 It's kind of like a haggis, tripe kind of thing.

02:14:00.000 And so, I mean, they just like, they just devoured the thing.

02:14:05.000 Would you go back?

02:14:08.000 Yeah.

02:14:08.000 Really?

02:14:09.000 Yeah.

02:14:10.000 I'm going to Northwest Territories. 0.98

02:14:12.000 That's going to suck. 0.91

02:14:13.000 There won't be altitude involved. 0.91

02:14:14.000 Will it suck as bad, though?

02:14:15.000 Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

02:14:16.000 No, and I think about, like, I often think about, like...

02:14:18.000 What if?

02:14:19.000 I'm glad it happened the way it did because I got so much perspective.

02:14:22.000 Like on the way back, because we still had two days to hike out to get back to get picked up to go back to Kathmandu.

02:14:29.000 It was two and a half, three days hike out.

02:14:31.000 And hiking out, the first day we were hiking out, after I shot my sheep and I had a night's rest.

02:14:35.000 And I remember getting back at like midnight, I don't know, we got back at like 10 p.m.

02:14:40.000 and had left at 6 in the morning from killing my sheep. 0.99

02:14:43.000 And I was just so like emotionally, spiritually just, I'm fucked. 0.98

02:14:47.000 And I remember thinking, well, tomorrow they're going to give us a rest day. 0.98

02:14:51.000 And the guide was like, nope.

02:14:53.000 It's too hot.

02:14:55.000 We're all getting sunburned.

02:14:56.000 I had blisters on the roof of my mouth.

02:14:58.000 From the sun, my whole...

02:15:00.000 The roof of your mouth?

02:15:01.000 Yeah, from like...

02:15:03.000 Going up and the sun bouncing off the snow hitting the roof of your mouth.

02:15:07.000 What?

02:15:07.000 Yeah, blisters on the roof of your mouth.

02:15:08.000 So you got sunburned on the roof of your mouth?

02:15:11.000 I did.

02:15:12.000 That's insane.

02:15:13.000 I've never even heard of that before.

02:15:14.000 Yeah, I feel like that's a pretty common thing for guys that go to that elevations, hikers and stuff.

02:15:18.000 Wow.

02:15:18.000 It might not be.

02:15:19.000 So do you have, like, sunscreen on your lips and your face and all that jazz?

02:15:23.000 Halfway through I did.

02:15:23.000 But, like, I didn't really think about that.

02:15:26.000 Because I was hot, but I was in the field burning up.

02:15:29.000 But, like, there's photos I look at now and I'm like, my lips are cracking open and bleeding.

02:15:33.000 Wow.

02:15:34.000 Like, it was, yeah.

02:15:35.000 And if you watch Shockey's episode when he was in Nepal, it's similar.

02:15:38.000 Like, they're self-filming and it's like this...

02:15:41.000 Pretty visceral.

02:15:42.000 Did you get something out of that though?

02:15:44.000 Other than the survival?

02:15:46.000 Yeah, I got so much out of that.

02:15:48.000 I've written this now.

02:15:50.000 I probably wrote like 20,000 words on the trip, but I got this amazing feeling.

02:15:56.000 First...

02:15:59.000 We're good to go.

02:16:28.000 Their spirit was so infectious.

02:16:31.000 Like, they're happy people.

02:16:32.000 And you have these Sherpas and porters who, you know those big Sitka bags, the big roller top bags?

02:16:40.000 We took one to base camp because they told us, oh, we can leave it.

02:16:42.000 We won't take it in the hunt.

02:16:44.000 These guys would take, like, a 90-pound suitcase, put it on top of their head, and just go walking up these trails I was describing like it was nothing.

02:16:51.000 Put it on their head?

02:16:52.000 Yeah, they'd balance everything in a basket on their head, all these porters.

02:16:55.000 A 90-pound bag.

02:16:56.000 And they would do more than that, 200 pounds.

02:16:58.000 What?

02:16:58.000 Yeah.

02:16:59.000 On their head. 0.50

02:16:59.000 Head strap, basket back here. 0.50

02:17:02.000 200 pounds.

02:17:03.000 Yeah, if not more than that.

02:17:04.000 What kind of disc issues do those guys have?

02:17:06.000 They don't care.

02:17:07.000 I mean, like, and they're wearing, like, these guys are wearing, like, sandals, and some of them will be wearing, like, old sneakers, and they're just wearing, like, whatever clothes that they would be able to gather.

02:17:19.000 And they're doing these amazing things, and when they take a break from something that you or I could never conceive of doing, they're like, happy as could be.

02:17:27.000 Their perspective on life is only hardship and poverty.

02:17:32.000 That's all they know.

02:17:33.000 That's the only thing they'll ever know.

02:17:35.000 But yet, they're happier than I think maybe I could ever be.

02:17:39.000 That's a big part of Sebastian Junger's book, Tribe.

02:17:45.000 A big part of it is how living easy and not sustaining massive amounts of difficulty, like most people do in these impoverished communities, is one of the reasons why people aren't happy.

02:17:57.000 Is that people actually need struggle, which is very counterintuitive for a lot of people.

02:18:02.000 It is.

02:18:02.000 And I remember coming back, there was a bunch of moments, and I could describe all these moments where I'd be at my wits end just thinking, I'm just a regular dude.

02:18:10.000 I'm not some adventurer.

02:18:12.000 What am I doing?

02:18:13.000 Right.

02:18:14.000 And I'd get to a point where I'd be just completely exhausted.

02:18:17.000 And I would look over and here would come this porter, this, you know, 25-year-old kid with a basket strapped on his head with, you know, 100 pounds of stuff, wearing sneakers, and I got $400 Italian boots on and sick gear, and I'm like... 0.95

02:18:32.000 And it would always come at these opportune moments where I'd look over and I'd see that and be like, oh, crap.

02:18:36.000 Like, this person is... 0.64

02:18:38.000 Here I am.

02:18:39.000 I am in physical pain and things are happening, but, like, to have the mental fortitude that those people have...

02:18:45.000 And they don't even know they have it.

02:18:46.000 That's just how they're wired.

02:18:48.000 And so I came back after the whole thing.

02:18:50.000 And I remember hiking out, being in the front of the group all of a sudden, really feeling good.

02:18:53.000 My pack's back on my back.

02:18:55.000 I'm energized again, thinking, this is the best feeling in the world.

02:18:59.000 That feeling of overcoming that thing and being on the downhill slope.

02:19:03.000 I'd go back just for that feeling if I could catch it again.

02:19:06.000 I think a big part of the thing of that is just you don't really appreciate what it feels like to be healthy until you're not healthy.

02:19:14.000 I don't advise anybody to get food sickness or food poisoning.

02:19:18.000 But one of the things about it is, man, once it's over, you realize, you go, God.

02:19:24.000 Being healthy is so critical.

02:19:26.000 It's like everything.

02:19:27.000 It doesn't matter your status, your money, your friends. 0.99

02:19:31.000 None of that means shit if you're unhealthy. 1.00

02:19:34.000 Yeah. 0.98

02:19:34.000 I mean, the people in Nepal live in this... 0.98

02:19:36.000 They just went through a civil war in the recent decades.

02:19:39.000 And these people were at the epicenter of it.

02:19:42.000 And they're, you know...

02:19:45.000 Our trip gave them jobs.

02:19:47.000 It gave them purpose.

02:19:48.000 It gave, like, there's a lot of things.

02:19:50.000 Our main guide, Mon Bahador, didn't have shoes until he was, like, 13. And they used to go hunting, and they would build their own guns.

02:19:58.000 And he described to us a couple times where, like, he remember hiking and hunting sheep, and, like, the gun would blow up on his back and blow his shirt off.

02:20:06.000 Stuff like that.

02:20:07.000 They were, like, making primitive muzzleloaders and using matchsticks as powder, I feel like.

02:20:15.000 So there was all these stories like that.

02:20:19.000 Perspective.

02:20:20.000 Perspective.

02:20:20.000 And like, you can't...

02:20:21.000 And look, people say, oh, you trophy hunted that sheep.

02:20:24.000 Maybe.

02:20:25.000 But there was so much more to it that if anybody would ever want to...

02:20:28.000 What does that mean, though?

02:20:29.000 You ate it.

02:20:30.000 We ate it.

02:20:31.000 Yeah, I mean, what does that mean?

02:20:33.000 What it means is people make a distinction that you did not have to bring that animal back in order for you to survive.

02:20:39.000 That's right.

02:20:40.000 So that's the only way they allow you to hunt.

02:20:41.000 Well, they're assigning motive to me then, right?

02:20:42.000 If they call me a trophy.

02:20:43.000 And I would say this.

02:20:44.000 I would say, look, you go into a war-torn area of the world where after the war...

02:20:50.000 They don't have a lot of chance to make money.

02:20:53.000 Like, the tourism has kind of died once you've been through a war.

02:20:56.000 It's really not a happy place to be.

02:20:59.000 And plus, the place we were hunting in the...

02:21:01.000 I think the Doropatan Hunting Reserve is like the only hunting reserve in Nepal.

02:21:06.000 And it's heavily regulated.

02:21:08.000 Like, there's 19 blue sheep tags a year.

02:21:11.000 So you're thinking, like, everybody that goes...

02:21:13.000 How many people a year go to Mount Everest Base Camp?

02:21:15.000 Thousands.

02:21:16.000 I don't know what the number is, but it's thousands.

02:21:19.000 I think we were probably within a couple of dozen Westerners that had been to that area post-war and had brought 24, 25 jobs, plus the people that prepped that, plus all that stuff.

02:21:30.000 So, like, seeing that is pretty powerful to me. 0.98

02:21:34.000 And shooting that sheep and not even giving a shit whether the horns made it back or not. 0.99

02:21:40.000 I mean, somebody could question my motive all they want. 0.99

02:21:44.000 But within the system and the structure that's set up there now, hunting is one of the more valuable things that they...

02:21:50.000 one of the more valuable tools they have to get better at everything.

02:21:55.000 Their lives, that they're having...

02:21:59.000 It's their resource.

02:22:00.000 Yeah, it's their resource.

02:22:01.000 Yeah, and we can look down upon that, but it is a natural resource along the same veins as if you live in an area that has fracking, that's a natural resource.

02:22:12.000 If you live in an area that they dig minerals out of the ground, that's a natural resource.

02:22:17.000 It's not a good or a bad thing.

02:22:19.000 It's just the reality of their environment.

02:22:21.000 And so there's so many, I think that there is arguments against what we did.

02:22:25.000 If somebody like broke it down, like I always try to break it down from the other side, I think people say like, why don't you just take pictures of it?

02:22:30.000 What are you doing?

02:22:31.000 You just go up there, pay 20 grand or whatever you pay for a hunt like that.

02:22:35.000 Take some pictures.

02:22:36.000 Well, part of it is the challenge.

02:22:38.000 People don't understand how difficult it is to do what you did.

02:22:41.000 To do what you did and then have this final accomplishment, which is to get close enough to an animal where either it doesn't know you're there or you get in a good place where it can't wind you, it doesn't smell you, and you can take it out and kill it.

02:22:54.000 It's hard to do.

02:22:55.000 It's insanely hard to do. 0.97

02:22:56.000 I've got all my own personal reasons for wanting to kill that sheep. 0.64

02:22:59.000 And I would also say, like...

02:23:01.000 Present a better plan, then.

02:23:03.000 Are you going to pay what hunters are willing to pay?

02:23:06.000 And are you going to be a part of conservation regulation the way that hunters are, as a trekker and a photographer?

02:23:13.000 Like, give me a better idea.

02:23:15.000 Okay, but here's the problem with that.

02:23:16.000 Their response to that could easily be, you know, what about if you decided to hunt people?

02:23:22.000 If you paid a million dollars to go hunt a person, and that money fed all these tribespeople in Mozambique, is it okay to go out and hunt people? 0.50

02:23:30.000 No, you surely still have an ethical and moral obligation to do it.

02:23:34.000 But to them, to animal rights activists, you have an ethical and moral obligation to let that sheep live.

02:23:39.000 Yeah.

02:23:40.000 I'm on your side, but I'm just saying...

02:23:42.000 No, I like to see both sides.

02:23:43.000 Like, I really do, like...

02:23:46.000 Because we only ate it there because we didn't have a freezer full of back straps and because That thing didn't occur the way it normally occurs for me.

02:23:54.000 There was like some complexity in that of that Yeah, my mind right crap man, you know Am I really over here just to collect this sheep and bring it home and show people but you're also filming yeah, we may oh we made what will be hopefully an awesome film and so At the end of the day,

02:24:09.000 I check myself, and I said, did you do it for the right reasons?

02:24:13.000 And after I look back at the trip, I'm like, man, there are a hundred reasons why I did it, and they're all good.

02:24:18.000 And what we did was a good impact on the place we went, on the animals that we hunted.

02:24:24.000 To me, it's all good, and I would love to have arguing with somebody that feels differently about that. 0.88

02:24:30.000 Plus, you go to trip balls and see a fake baby and a fake wolf. 1.00

02:24:34.000 People pay a lot of money for that shit. 1.00

02:24:36.000 Yeah, man. 1.00

02:24:37.000 Mushrooms are expensive.

02:24:38.000 And you might not see a wolf.

02:24:39.000 You might not.

02:24:40.000 You might not see a baby on the road.

02:24:42.000 I'm sure there's still a wolf-shaped log in Nepal or something.

02:24:47.000 Somewhere.

02:24:48.000 Some rock that looks like a baby.

02:24:49.000 It had to be something.

02:24:51.000 It was a wolf.

02:24:52.000 I'm not crazy.

02:24:53.000 We've got to wrap this up, man.

02:24:55.000 Let's do it.

02:24:56.000 Ben O'Brien, what is your Twitter that you don't use again?

02:24:59.000 My Twitter's at BenjaminOB, but I never use that.

02:25:03.000 So Instagram's always the better way to...

02:25:04.000 And it's BennyOB...

02:25:06.000 Yeah.

02:25:06.000 B-E-N-N-Y-O-B-3-0-1.

02:25:09.000 How did you get to 3-0-1?

02:25:11.000 That's area code where I grew up.

02:25:12.000 Oh, holla! 1.00

02:25:13.000 Holla! 1.00

02:25:13.000 Shout out to 3-0-1. 1.00

02:25:15.000 Yeah, man.

02:25:15.000 I created that handle when I didn't know it would be a thing.

02:25:17.000 I thought that nobody would ever see that.

02:25:19.000 Oh.

02:25:20.000 Well, now it's a thing.

02:25:20.000 Now it's a thing.

02:25:21.000 Let's do it.

02:25:21.000 Well, we blew you up when you had that competition with the people you work with.

02:25:24.000 I did.

02:25:26.000 All right, folks, we're out.

02:25:28.000 We're out for a while.

02:25:30.000 We'll be back next week with a one podcast with my friend Ari Shafir on July 18th, which is the release date of his new Netflix special, which is going to be fucking amazing.

02:25:41.000 It's a two-part special, Childhood and Adulthood.

02:25:44.000 Right?

02:25:45.000 Is that what it is?

02:25:45.000 That's what he calls it?

02:25:46.000 What does he call it?

02:25:48.000 Ari Shafir.

02:25:49.000 Look up Ari Shafir on Netflix.

02:25:50.000 All right.

02:25:51.000 See you soon.

02:25:51.000 Bye.

The Joe Rogan Experience - July 13, 2017

Joe Rogan Experience #987 - Ben O'Brien

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Transcript