The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #144 with Jared Cannonier

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00:00:04.000 The Joe Rogan Experience.

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00:00:13.000 Jared Karanir, ladies and gentlemen. 0.99

00:00:15.000 Hey, what a fucking crazy couple of weeks of fights there's been, man. 0.97

00:00:19.000 There's so much to talk about. 0.99

00:00:21.000 Absolutely, yeah.

00:00:22.000 You know, this last main event.

00:00:24.000 Oh, my God.

00:00:25.000 I'm still, like, in shock.

00:00:28.000 The Justin Gaethje head kick knockout?

00:00:30.000 Yeah.

00:00:31.000 Of Dustin Poirier.

00:00:32.000 I'm like, oh, my God.

00:00:33.000 I mean, we all knew that that fight was going to be tremendous.

00:00:36.000 Yeah.

00:00:36.000 Something big was going to happen in that fight.

00:00:39.000 So when it did and how it happened...

00:00:42.000 It was beautiful.

00:00:42.000 Beautiful execution of that technique by Justin Gaethje to get that head kick off.

00:00:48.000 It was beautiful.

00:00:49.000 It landed beautifully, and he followed up nicely.

00:00:53.000 Well, it wasn't a follow-up.

00:00:54.000 He was on his way.

00:00:55.000 I think the ref stopped it.

00:00:56.000 I think he did land one hammer fist.

00:00:57.000 Yeah.

00:00:58.000 But yeah, it was perfect.

00:00:59.000 It was a direct mirror image of Leon Edwards' kick.

00:01:02.000 Yeah.

00:01:02.000 On the opposite side, in the same place.

00:01:04.000 In the same arena, yeah. 0.95

00:01:05.000 Crazy!

00:01:06.000 Yeah, that's crazy.

00:01:07.000 Crazy!

00:01:08.000 Something's going on.

00:01:09.000 I'll tell you one thing, and you can tell me if you feel it as a fighter, but there's something about the energy in an arena when you go to a place that really appreciates that you're there.

00:01:21.000 We're in Vegas a lot.

00:01:23.000 You guys fight in Vegas all the time.

00:01:25.000 They get a little used to the fact that the UFC's there. 0.92

00:01:29.000 But when you bring it somewhere like Salt Lake City, they get fucking hyped up.

00:01:35.000 Those people were there for the first fight of the night the place was packed and there's this wild feeling in the air like everybody's excited.

00:01:42.000 Does it, as a fighter, does that affect you?

00:01:47.000 Well, absolutely.

00:01:48.000 You know, when you hear the crowd reacting to the fight...

00:01:51.000 Pull the mic right in front of you.

00:01:52.000 Yeah, when you hear the crowd reacting to the fight in itself, you know, you get energy from it, you know?

00:01:59.000 I get invigorated by it, or I get checked by it, you know what I mean?

00:02:02.000 If the guy's doing something good and the crowd's loving it, I'm going to put a stop to that.

00:02:07.000 So, I like to take control of it, in a sense.

00:02:10.000 But yes, it is...

00:02:13.000 It's a...

00:02:13.000 It's a factor.

00:02:15.000 Yeah, it is a huge factor.

00:02:16.000 For some.

00:02:17.000 You know, for some it is.

00:02:18.000 And some people can just stay focused and stay on the rails and handle their business, you know?

00:02:22.000 But I like it, you know?

00:02:24.000 But I like fighting in the...

00:02:26.000 Do you like the apex as well?

00:02:27.000 I like the apex as well, because I find that fighting in the apex is a bit more personal, you know what I mean?

00:02:33.000 I can hear my opponent breathing.

00:02:35.000 I can hear his exertions.

00:02:37.000 I can hear his corner.

00:02:38.000 I can hear my corner a little bit better.

00:02:42.000 There's still a crowd there, and you can hear them, so you still get the feel of a crowd.

00:02:49.000 You know, although it's not that big.

00:02:51.000 It's not as big, but you can hear everything.

00:02:53.000 You can hear the commentators too, you know?

00:02:55.000 I feel like when I'm at the Apex, I feel like lucky.

00:02:58.000 Like, oh, I'm lucky to be one of the people to be here.

00:03:00.000 Like when Francis fought Stipe at the Apex, during the height of COVID, I was like, we are so lucky.

00:03:07.000 We get to be here live for this.

00:03:09.000 There's only like 30 people in this place.

00:03:12.000 That's that thing, man.

00:03:13.000 It makes it feel personal.

00:03:15.000 I guess it's personal for those in attendance as well.

00:03:20.000 Yeah, well, yeah.

00:03:21.000 Those in attendance and even people watching at home, I think you get a sense of that from that.

00:03:26.000 It's like you're watching a fight in a gym.

00:03:30.000 You know?

00:03:31.000 It really is.

00:03:32.000 It's like a high-tech gym.

00:03:33.000 I mean, that's kind of what they did.

00:03:35.000 It's kind of what the UFC did.

00:03:37.000 They just made their own gym and they made their own arena.

00:03:39.000 A little intimate arena.

00:03:42.000 And it's great for Tuesday night fights, too.

00:03:44.000 Yeah.

00:03:45.000 And it's nice.

00:03:46.000 You can just go there and handle business and then go back to whatever else he was doing.

00:03:50.000 Yeah.

00:03:51.000 And the PI, like, putting something like that, such a high-tech, like, state-of-the-art gym where guys can do their camps there.

00:04:00.000 Yes.

00:04:01.000 The PI has been...

00:04:03.000 It's a goldmine for a lot of guys, especially those guys in Vegas.

00:04:06.000 I've used it a few times, but I don't really get up there too often.

00:04:12.000 But I can imagine if I did live there, I'd be in the P.I. all the time. 0.91

00:04:17.000 Maybe once, twice a day.

00:04:18.000 They really help guys scientifically cut weight correctly, too, and give them an assessment of whether or not they can do it and be healthy when they're doing it.

00:04:28.000 That weight-cutting game is a crazy game, and you got a wild career, man, because you started off at heavyweight, you go down at 205, and now down to 85. Has anybody else done that and been as successful as you?

00:04:41.000 I don't think so.

00:04:42.000 I don't think anybody's gone down.

00:04:47.000 Conor McGregor's gone up.

00:04:49.000 He hasn't been as successful, but he's just successful in anything he does.

00:04:53.000 Right.

00:04:54.000 But I'm saying, has anybody ever started out as a heavyweight and gotten down to become an elite middleweight?

00:05:00.000 No.

00:05:00.000 I don't think anybody's done that before, yeah.

00:05:03.000 It's what well you know well Vito has gone up.

00:05:07.000 He's fought up at heavyweight.

00:05:08.000 Oh, yeah, he did.

00:05:10.000 Yeah.

00:05:10.000 He's fought up at light heavyweight.

00:05:12.000 Middleweight would have been his correct weight class.

00:05:15.000 I think if he started today like what he wound up in I think that's the correct weight class with weight cutting.

00:05:21.000 Well, I would say the same thing about me, too.

00:05:23.000 Yeah, I'm not no natural heavyweight.

00:05:25.000 Right, right.

00:05:26.000 And I knew that While I was fighting heavyweight, I was just an undisciplined heavyweight, if you will, you know?

00:05:31.000 Well, you probably walk around in heavyweight all the time.

00:05:35.000 Well, absolutely, yeah.

00:05:36.000 I think a lot of us middleweights walk around in light heavyweight or above the light heavyweight limit.

00:05:46.000 Like, what is the heaviest you get when you're walking around?

00:05:48.000 Be honest.

00:05:49.000 As a middleweight now?

00:05:50.000 Yes.

00:05:51.000 The heaviest I've gotten was 125. No, 225. 225. Yeah.

00:05:57.000 So I'm about 220 right now, but I haven't been back to training as consistently as I would like to be.

00:06:03.000 It's so crazy that you say that so casually.

00:06:05.000 Because you look great, you look super fit, and the idea of you being able to lose that much weight is so bonkers.

00:06:12.000 Yeah.

00:06:13.000 Well, you know, water weighs a lot.

00:06:14.000 You know what I mean?

00:06:15.000 So I burn a lot of water.

00:06:17.000 Well, there's also, I guess they break it down when you do it with someone that's a real expert in dehydration.

00:06:27.000 They break it down how much muscle mass you have.

00:06:29.000 And the more muscle mass you have, you can actually, muscles mostly water. 0.99

00:06:33.000 You can suck more. 0.99

00:06:34.000 That's why guys like Yoel Romero were able to make 185 when he's up. 0.99

00:06:38.000 Big guy.

00:06:39.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:06:40.000 He's fucking big. 0.99

00:06:41.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:06:42.000 Just a thick thing, you know.

00:06:44.000 From top to bottom.

00:06:45.000 The idea that that guy's 185 for even more than 13 seconds.

00:06:49.000 Yeah.

00:06:49.000 Well, not anymore, right?

00:06:50.000 Not anymore.

00:06:51.000 He's what?

00:06:51.000 205?

00:06:51.000 Yeah, now he's doing 205. But, you know, he's a top contender at 185 for a long time.

00:06:56.000 Yeah.

00:06:57.000 Without weight cutting.

00:06:57.000 But those were hard weight cuts for him, though, right?

00:06:59.000 Yeah.

00:06:59.000 Because he was so big, I would say.

00:07:01.000 But, you know, I was never there for any of them, so what do I know?

00:07:05.000 When you do yours, how far out do you just start to change your diet?

00:07:10.000 How much time do they, like if the UFC calls you up and says, we want you to fight for a world title in two weeks?

00:07:17.000 In two weeks?

00:07:18.000 You can't get down there.

00:07:20.000 In two weeks?

00:07:21.000 I haven't done it before, but I'm sure I could.

00:07:24.000 Hell yeah, I could.

00:07:25.000 Right?

00:07:26.000 But you wouldn't want to.

00:07:28.000 Ideally, what would you want to?

00:07:29.000 How much time do you need to get all the way down to healthy?

00:07:32.000 Comfortably four weeks at the least.

00:07:35.000 You know what I mean?

00:07:36.000 But six weeks is the general consensus for fight camps.

00:07:41.000 Eight weeks for those who want to put a little extra on it.

00:07:44.000 Right, but how much of the camp is centered around being careful with your weight?

00:07:49.000 How much do you think about it?

00:07:50.000 I would say the whole camp.

00:07:51.000 You know what I mean?

00:07:54.000 When I'm not in camp and I don't have a fight coming up, I don't really pay attention to my portion sizes.

00:08:00.000 And that's the big thing is the portion sizes.

00:08:02.000 And the quality of the meat that I'm putting in my body as well.

00:08:06.000 So I change from eating less red meat for sure.

00:08:12.000 I eat more salmon, more fish.

00:08:18.000 And portion sizes, again, for me is important.

00:08:20.000 The work output, as long as I'm going to the gym making my appointments that I've made for myself and I'm going to the gym twice a day, I burn it off and I sweat off a lot too, you know?

00:08:30.000 So I can, as long as I got at least four weeks, I can make it happen.

00:08:38.000 You know, where I'm at now.

00:08:40.000 But when I'm training, you know what I mean?

00:08:42.000 I'm around 210, 215.

00:08:45.000 And all I have to do is change my diet.

00:08:48.000 I'll drop about 10.

00:08:52.000 10, 12 pounds in about 2 or 3 weeks.

00:08:55.000 And then cut the weight during fight week.

00:08:58.000 That's not that much then.

00:08:59.000 So then you really just cut in about 10 fight week?

00:09:02.000 Yeah.

00:09:03.000 So that's a healthy way to do it.

00:09:05.000 No, I'm not showing up fight week at 220. No, I absolutely do not.

00:09:10.000 There's some guys that have done some wild cuts.

00:09:12.000 Some really wild ones.

00:09:14.000 Where you're just like, did you just not prepare for this at all?

00:09:17.000 Did you just try to wing it?

00:09:18.000 Did you put it off?

00:09:20.000 How did you allow yourself to come in so big and try to cut so much?

00:09:24.000 Just miscalculations.

00:09:26.000 Or maybe just to get called with an opportunity that they couldn't refuse no matter what state they're in.

00:09:33.000 They couldn't have made it.

00:09:34.000 They don't want to be the ones that say no sometimes.

00:09:37.000 Do you ever envision a time where the sport would have no weight cutting?

00:09:41.000 Where they would just match people up by weight?

00:09:46.000 When there's no weight cutting?

00:09:47.000 No weight cutting.

00:09:48.000 What if there was more weight classes, but no weight cutting?

00:09:52.000 I think that'd be fine.

00:09:53.000 I would love that, actually.

00:09:55.000 To make it more of a natural competition, you know what I mean?

00:09:58.000 As opposed to people trying to get the edge on their opponent.

00:10:02.000 But it seems like a crazy edge to agree to.

00:10:05.000 Yeah.

00:10:06.000 I firmly believe that if weight cutting didn't exist...

00:10:11.000 And then people started doing it now, they would try to ban it.

00:10:14.000 They would try to say, don't do that.

00:10:16.000 That's dangerous. 0.99

00:10:17.000 24 hours before you're going to have a fucking cage fight, you're going to dehydrate yourself to death's door. 1.00

00:10:22.000 To death's door. 0.99

00:10:23.000 I've seen some dudes that were on death's door.

00:10:25.000 Really?

00:10:26.000 Oh, yeah.

00:10:27.000 Travis Luder, when he fought Anderson Silva, was the worst I ever saw a man when he was cutting weight.

00:10:33.000 Travis couldn't walk.

00:10:34.000 He was shuffling to the scale.

00:10:36.000 And he missed weight.

00:10:38.000 He missed weight in a world title fight and he had a real shot against Anderson because his jiu-jitsu was phenomenal.

00:10:43.000 His jiu-jitsu was phenomenal.

00:10:45.000 He took Anderson down and got caught in a triangle and got beat up.

00:10:50.000 But he was the closest I saw.

00:10:53.000 I looked at that guy and I'm like, oh my god.

00:10:55.000 If I found that guy in the desert, I'd get him right to the hospital. 0.99

00:10:58.000 I'd be like, holy shit bro, you okay? 0.99

00:11:00.000 Have some water. 0.98

00:11:01.000 We're going to get you some water, man.

00:11:03.000 Jesus Christ.

00:11:04.000 That's what he looked like.

00:11:05.000 Wow, just out of it, huh? 0.96

00:11:07.000 Just sucked in. 0.99

00:11:09.000 You're almost killing yourself. 0.99

00:11:11.000 You're taking all the water out of your body, and then you're putting it back in.

00:11:15.000 24 hours before the most extreme physical combat sport that's currently available.

00:11:21.000 Yeah.

00:11:21.000 Which is MMA. Out of your vital organs.

00:11:24.000 In America. 1.00

00:11:25.000 You know, there's some left-way shit. 1.00

00:11:27.000 They might disagree that there's more extreme. 0.99

00:11:29.000 Yeah.

00:11:29.000 But that's why I wouldn't do no extreme weight cut myself.

00:11:32.000 You know what I'm saying?

00:11:32.000 Yeah.

00:11:32.000 That's why I said middleweight is where I'm stopping.

00:11:35.000 I could probably do welterweight with a strict diet over a period of time.

00:11:41.000 Wow.

00:11:41.000 You would be a giant welterweight.

00:11:44.000 Yeah.

00:11:45.000 But that would be uncomfortable for me.

00:11:48.000 That would be uncomfortable.

00:11:49.000 I wouldn't be able to live the way I want to.

00:11:51.000 I wouldn't be able to eat the way I would like.

00:11:53.000 You know what I mean?

00:11:54.000 I remember I ran into Rumble.

00:11:56.000 Rest in peace.

00:11:57.000 I ran into Anthony Rumble Johnson in a hotel lobby.

00:12:00.000 And I go, how big are you?

00:12:02.000 And this is when he's fighting at welterweight.

00:12:04.000 He goes, I'm 230 right now.

00:12:05.000 No way no no no no no no no no no no no no no he was in town for the fights just to watch and But you couldn't believe how big he was, and then he would make it down to 170. Wow.

00:12:19.000 Even if that was fine, that would explain some of his missed weight cuts, showing up to fight week at 230. Yeah.

00:12:27.000 I don't think the UFC now would allow something like that to happen, a fight like that to go on.

00:12:31.000 Probably not.

00:12:32.000 Well, there's so much more, you know, there's some more eyes on the fighters' behavior and what they're allowed to do and not allowed to do.

00:12:39.000 Yeah.

00:12:40.000 Which I think there's a lot of it, like I was having a conversation with Jeff Nowitzki about it, like that they are trying to introduce things like peptides.

00:12:50.000 And allow fighters to use things that help them heal from injuries, give them exemptions for things like that, because it's only beneficial to the fighter and their ability to heal from injuries.

00:13:02.000 A lot of people, at least anecdotally, there are some studies on BPC-157 I don't know what the full date is, but I know that the doctors that I work with and the people that I know believe in it a lot.

00:13:14.000 And it used to be legal for UFC fighters.

00:13:16.000 Then they banned it.

00:13:17.000 They did?

00:13:18.000 Recently, yeah.

00:13:19.000 Oh, I didn't know that.

00:13:20.000 Yeah.

00:13:21.000 It's a bummer.

00:13:22.000 See, this is why I don't use supplements myself.

00:13:25.000 I only use the stuff they give us from, like, throwing supplements.

00:13:28.000 I think UFC has a partnership with them.

00:13:31.000 Right, and they're all third-party tested.

00:13:32.000 Yeah. 0.95

00:13:33.000 No bullshit in them. 0.96

00:13:34.000 Yeah. 0.77

00:13:36.000 So, there are some other things like element teas, hydration packages I'll use every now and then.

00:13:41.000 Those are great.

00:13:42.000 Rarely do I take supplements.

00:13:44.000 On top of that, I kind of even just take them consistently to get the benefit from them.

00:13:47.000 So, there's really no point in it for me.

00:13:51.000 So, do you have someone who cooks for you?

00:13:54.000 Do you have like a meal service to use?

00:13:56.000 My wife.

00:13:57.000 Your wife.

00:13:57.000 There you go.

00:13:58.000 That's perfect.

00:13:59.000 Because I see some guys, they take it so seriously.

00:14:02.000 They have stacked up Tupperware containers that they get from a company and it measures out all the carbs and the protein and it writes it down, 50 grams of carbs.

00:14:11.000 We got guys like that in the gym too, you know?

00:14:14.000 I think that's more of a convenience thing.

00:14:18.000 You don't have to stand over the stove for 30 minutes to an hour and a half cooking and preparing food and stuff like that.

00:14:23.000 Whenever I think about people that do stuff like this, I think about Fedor.

00:14:28.000 Because Fedor used to fight.

00:14:29.000 He had a big belly. 0.98

00:14:31.000 He didn't give a fuck about portion control. 0.99

00:14:35.000 He was very unassuming the way he looked physically. 0.95

00:14:39.000 But his demeanor... 0.94

00:14:40.000 He was such a beast.

00:14:42.000 I was listening to...

00:14:43.000 I can't remember who was talking about it on a podcast.

00:14:47.000 I'll try to remember.

00:14:48.000 It might have been Cejudo.

00:14:49.000 I forget who was talking about it, but they were talking about...

00:14:51.000 Oh, no, it was Rampage.

00:14:53.000 It was Rampage Jackson.

00:14:55.000 And he was talking about how Fedor was his favorite fighter, and he was recalling this moment Where Kevin Randleman suplexed him and threw him on his neck.

00:15:04.000 And Fedor's expression never changed.

00:15:07.000 I saw that clip too.

00:15:09.000 Isn't that wild?

00:15:09.000 It's so true.

00:15:10.000 He just, no matter what, in the heat of battle, just stone-faced.

00:15:15.000 Never, no emotion, no nothing.

00:15:17.000 Stone-faced. 1.00

00:15:18.000 That just says he saw some hard shit as a child, probably. 1.00

00:15:22.000 Yeah, right? 1.00

00:15:23.000 Something.

00:15:25.000 I mean, it definitely wasn't easy.

00:15:27.000 Whatever he went through was not easy.

00:15:29.000 But that dude, that is a hard man.

00:15:31.000 How did that fight end?

00:15:32.000 Look at that.

00:15:33.000 He comored him.

00:15:33.000 Like, right after that.

00:15:34.000 But look at the compression there.

00:15:36.000 I mean, look at how he's landing there.

00:15:38.000 That's crazy.

00:15:39.000 Fedor comores him?

00:15:41.000 Yeah.

00:15:41.000 Like, right afterwards.

00:15:43.000 Yeah.

00:15:44.000 You want to see it?

00:15:45.000 It's pretty dope.

00:15:47.000 See if he can find the finish.

00:15:50.000 Yeah, when he was going down, he tied up an arm.

00:15:54.000 Okay.

00:15:57.000 See, have you found it?

00:15:58.000 It's only showing the slam.

00:16:00.000 Oh.

00:16:02.000 Just go, uh, Fedor taps.

00:16:05.000 Randleman?

00:16:06.000 Yeah, Randleman.

00:16:07.000 I'm sure I've seen it at one point or another.

00:16:09.000 It was incredible.

00:16:11.000 Okay, here it is.

00:16:12.000 So Randleman slams him.

00:16:13.000 Oh, how did he flip him over already?

00:16:15.000 Oh, I skipped ahead.

00:16:16.000 Position, transition, yeah.

00:16:18.000 I want to see the transition.

00:16:19.000 So he takes him down.

00:16:25.000 Boom.

00:16:26.000 Right?

00:16:27.000 Oh, this is the start of the fight here, yeah.

00:16:31.000 Yeah, this is the start of the fight.

00:16:33.000 This is before he body-slammed him.

00:16:34.000 Yeah.

00:16:35.000 So he took him down first.

00:16:36.000 I'd like to do a pride round. 1.00

00:16:37.000 That'd be nice.

00:16:38.000 Do you like the idea of that?

00:16:40.000 The 10-minute round?

00:16:41.000 Oh, yeah.

00:16:42.000 I think so, too.

00:16:45.000 Imagine, like, the option to...

00:16:47.000 There it is.

00:16:48.000 Boom.

00:16:49.000 Crazy.

00:16:54.000 That was knees to the head on the ground, too. 0.99

00:16:56.000 Pride was a different beast.

00:17:01.000 Oh, that was a beautiful rollover.

00:17:03.000 That was beautiful.

00:17:04.000 That was beautiful.

00:17:07.000 And then he got the Kimura off of this, I guess.

00:17:13.000 Is that Rampage?

00:17:14.000 Dude, those are hard shots from the top here. 0.99

00:17:20.000 These are fucking hard shots. 1.00

00:17:22.000 Damn. - Yeah. 1.00

00:17:39.000 Like that dude does not care about portions. 0.98

00:17:44.000 He just eats whatever the fuck he wants and smashes people. 0.99

00:17:47.000 I wish I got to see that guy live. 0.99

00:17:50.000 I have a regret.

00:17:51.000 You never seen Fader fight live?

00:17:52.000 No, no.

00:17:55.000 No, and all the guys from Pride, he was the one I would like to have seen live.

00:18:00.000 I got a chance to see Crow Cop fight live a bunch of times. 0.99

00:18:03.000 But seeing that guy in his prime in Japan must have been wild.

00:18:09.000 That must have been wild.

00:18:12.000 So you've been in this game for a number of generations.

00:18:15.000 Yeah.

00:18:16.000 If you were to map MMA as a sport, how many generations would you say we're in right now?

00:18:24.000 I guess it's the 30th year of the UFC and an elite fighter.

00:18:31.000 What's the average amount of years they can compete?

00:18:35.000 Is it probably 10?

00:18:37.000 Yeah.

00:18:37.000 Average.

00:18:38.000 8 to 12. Some guys can extend it.

00:18:41.000 Randy Couture extended it.

00:18:43.000 I actually started late.

00:18:45.000 But some guys extend that time period where you can fight as an elite fighter.

00:18:50.000 There's only a certain amount of time.

00:18:51.000 So that's kind of a generation, right?

00:18:53.000 So it's like 10 years.

00:18:54.000 So I'd say we're at least three generations in.

00:18:56.000 But it's more like four or five.

00:18:58.000 Because the generations, they change in terms of like...

00:19:05.000 The skill set.

00:19:06.000 The skill sets improve.

00:19:08.000 I was just having a conversation with a friend of mine about how people today, everything they do today, they get a chance to see all the people who've done it before, and it helps you get better.

00:19:21.000 If you want to watch MMA fights, in 1993, when the UFC 1 was around, you couldn't see anything.

00:19:28.000 What are you going to find?

00:19:29.000 I watched my first MMA fight on a VHS tape.

00:19:32.000 Yeah.

00:19:34.000 Some people watching out don't know what VHS is probably.

00:19:40.000 Yeah.

00:19:41.000 And those people that fought in those things had nothing to look at first.

00:19:46.000 They just went out there and did it.

00:19:48.000 And they just were hoping karate worked.

00:19:51.000 Wow.

00:19:54.000 You know, they were hoping that judo was enough.

00:19:56.000 They were hoping that freestyle wrestling was enough.

00:19:58.000 Talk about going in blind, huh?

00:20:00.000 I mean, those are the wildest of wild people.

00:20:02.000 I mean, respect to the pioneers, like the Hoist Gracies and the Ken Shamrocks and the Dan Severins and Don the Predator Fry.

00:20:11.000 It's like those guys, those are the pioneers, man.

00:20:14.000 Mark Coleman, there was nobody before them.

00:20:16.000 No.

00:20:17.000 Nobody before them.

00:20:19.000 So they didn't know what to expect.

00:20:22.000 They just knew that they had it.

00:20:23.000 They knew that they could get paid money to fight.

00:20:26.000 And so they were like, okay, for as long as this lasts, let's do this.

00:20:30.000 And for a while, it looked like it was going to get kicked off cable.

00:20:33.000 And then it did.

00:20:34.000 It got banned from cable, and you could only get it on DirecTV.

00:20:40.000 That's when I used to get it.

00:20:42.000 I got DirecTV specifically because it was the only way.

00:20:46.000 No, it was before Spike.

00:20:47.000 Before Spike?

00:20:48.000 Spike TV was when, that's when it really took off.

00:20:51.000 But that was like 2005, right?

00:20:55.000 Yeah.

00:20:56.000 But there was a long period of...

00:20:59.000 Struggle with the UFC. Yeah.

00:21:02.000 Both when SEG had it, there was so much suppression.

00:21:05.000 It was so hard for them to get into venues and get sanctioned to have them in certain states.

00:21:12.000 It's a grind.

00:21:14.000 When you first started watching MMA, how old were you?

00:21:20.000 How old was I? When I first started watching?

00:21:22.000 Yeah.

00:21:24.000 So when you saw your first...

00:21:25.000 I was in Alaska when I first started watching.

00:21:29.000 When I see my first fight, I was in Dallas.

00:21:34.000 I was transitioning from college into the military.

00:21:38.000 So I was about 21, 20, 21. I was 21, yeah.

00:21:42.000 So it was just a fight.

00:21:44.000 My mother, she was adopting children.

00:21:48.000 And she had this Ecuadorian, a Shaolin monk from Ecuadoria, right? 0.98

00:21:56.000 An Ecuadorian who was...

00:21:57.000 Who lived in the Shaolin Temple and trained and lived that life, you know what I mean? 0.91

00:22:02.000 And he would go outside and meditate and practice his art, practice kung fu and stuff like that.

00:22:07.000 And he found it on TV. I didn't even know it existed or anything like that.

00:22:12.000 And he was watching it one day when I came in.

00:22:15.000 And I sat down and watched it.

00:22:16.000 I think I was watching, I can't remember the fight.

00:22:20.000 I believe it was Shogun and somebody.

00:22:25.000 But anyway, I saw the fight and it didn't really peak my interest at the time, but I was interested in it because I respected the competitive aspect of it.

00:22:35.000 I definitely loved martial arts and I was just seeing these people fight and stuff, but I didn't see myself training at the time.

00:22:42.000 At that time, again, I was transitioning from college to the army.

00:22:48.000 So when I get into the Army, they have a Modern Army combattance program, which is like basic white belt jiu-jitsu, you know, minus a lot of the stuff that we do in actual jiu-jitsu.

00:22:59.000 But once I got my first hands-on experience with the martial arts, I was like, ooh, this is something I need to do with my vessel, with my body.

00:23:07.000 This is something I'm meant to do.

00:23:08.000 You know what I mean?

00:23:09.000 And even as a kid, you know, watching all the kung fu movies, the Ninja Turtles is big.

00:23:14.000 I love the Ninja Turtles.

00:23:16.000 But all the martial arts stuff, you know, it interests me and stuff.

00:23:20.000 On top of that, my daddy, whenever I would go and visit him, he has a gym in his garage, a boxing bag, and me and my brothers would throw the gloves on and play around, not really taking it seriously as a martial artist, you know?

00:23:33.000 But once I did it in the army, I knew this is something that I need to do with my vessel, something I have to throw myself, I have to ingrain into myself.

00:23:46.000 So...

00:23:49.000 That was in basic training.

00:23:51.000 And then luckily in AIT, we had my AIT phase, which is our training phase for our job in the military.

00:24:00.000 My AIT phase, one of my drill sergeants was like a level three combatives, had like a level three proficiency at combatives.

00:24:09.000 I think it goes like one to four or five or something like that.

00:24:12.000 And there was a battalion combatives tournament.

00:24:17.000 That I could participate in, you know what I mean?

00:24:19.000 So we were training for like a month, month and a half, maybe two months of training basic white belt jujitsu for the Modern Army Combatives thing.

00:24:29.000 I loved it, man.

00:24:30.000 I was having fun.

00:24:31.000 I was learning.

00:24:32.000 I was exercising.

00:24:34.000 I was applying my mental capacities to something that I wanted to apply to, not something that I was ordered to apply to or something I was trained to apply to.

00:24:44.000 Right.

00:24:45.000 It was something that I wanted for myself.

00:24:48.000 And, uh...

00:24:49.000 It was one of the best times I had in the military, you know?

00:24:52.000 One of the best aspects about the military that I liked.

00:24:55.000 And, uh...

00:24:56.000 I got all the way to second place in the tournament.

00:24:59.000 You know?

00:25:00.000 I think I had, like, four matches.

00:25:02.000 So I got all the way to second place.

00:25:04.000 And, uh...

00:25:06.000 The guy who took first place was, like, some football athlete. 1.00

00:25:10.000 Just some buck-strong motherfucker. 1.00

00:25:13.000 You know what I mean? 1.00

00:25:14.000 Who, um...

00:25:16.000 Who was just faster than me, you know what I'm saying?

00:25:18.000 My technique wasn't able to get it done, so I took second place by points in that one, so it was all good.

00:25:24.000 So that's the birthplace of your martial arts journey.

00:25:28.000 Of my martial arts journey, yeah.

00:25:29.000 And so in the Army Combatives Program, how much striking did they have?

00:25:33.000 Well, when you get up to a level three or four, I think that's when they started incorporating striking.

00:25:38.000 And that's what I wanted to do throughout my military career.

00:25:40.000 So were they essentially teaching, like, MMA? Like, how they're incorporating grappling and striking?

00:25:47.000 There wasn't MMA. I think they did, when you get to the very tip-top of...

00:25:53.000 Whatever you're training, then they have like an MMA. They combine an MMA, but usually it's separate.

00:25:59.000 Okay, so it's grappling or striking.

00:26:01.000 Or striking, yeah.

00:26:02.000 And then is it striking like Muay Thai style?

00:26:05.000 It seems a little bit like amateur Muay Thai.

00:26:08.000 You know, they have the headgear and the shin guards and there's no elbows and stuff like that.

00:26:12.000 Okay.

00:26:12.000 So they modify it so I guess soldiers don't end up getting hurt and taken out of duty and stuff like that.

00:26:19.000 Yeah, but why would you remove elbows? 0.90

00:26:24.000 They're too goddamn effective to remove. 0.92

00:26:26.000 You want people to be proficient in elbows. 0.96

00:26:28.000 You want someone in a hand-on-hand fight who breaks his hands to be able to throw elbows.

00:26:32.000 And a person with really good elbows can do that, but a person who doesn't have good elbows is doomed.

00:26:37.000 It's funny you say that because I broke my hand in the fight and I had to finish it with an elbow.

00:26:41.000 There you go.

00:26:41.000 With elbows.

00:26:42.000 Yeah.

00:26:43.000 I can't imagine why any effective system would want to remove elbows.

00:26:48.000 You could give guys elbow pads.

00:26:50.000 Yeah.

00:26:51.000 You should have them at least practicing elbows.

00:26:53.000 I mean, obviously, take care of your training partners.

00:26:55.000 Don't try to smash their face in.

00:26:57.000 Well, I think, again, you've got to think of it like the amateurs.

00:26:59.000 They don't want guys getting cut.

00:27:01.000 Right, in the fights.

00:27:02.000 Yeah.

00:27:03.000 And it's the military.

00:27:05.000 They want their soldiers to be soldiers, not world-class fighters.

00:27:09.000 Sure.

00:27:10.000 Yeah, but if you're going to teach them how to fight, teach them all the way.

00:27:14.000 Don't teach them Taekwondo.

00:27:15.000 That's what you want for your military, right?

00:27:17.000 Yeah, that's what I want.

00:27:18.000 Don't teach them Taekwondo.

00:27:19.000 Teach them Muay Thai.

00:27:20.000 Teach them MMA. It's not that there's anything wrong with Taekwondo, but if you're going to train someone to fight, why would you remove elbows?

00:27:27.000 Put that back in there.

00:27:29.000 You need to be able to stop someone that's coming towards you.

00:27:32.000 Just talk.

00:27:32.000 Some dudes, when you watch like elbow masters, you know, dudes like John Wayne Parr, dudes who know how to slice people up, you know, Sanchai, guys you just know how to step in and smash people with elbows.

00:27:45.000 There's a beauty to elbows.

00:27:48.000 I'm actually increasing my repertoire with the elbows and stuff.

00:27:53.000 I'm working with a few of the guys.

00:27:56.000 Ben throws some nasty elbows and In sparring.

00:27:59.000 He doesn't wear elbow pads, but he has such good control and awareness of his distance that, you know, sometimes...

00:28:05.000 And I'm not too spastic, so I'm not, like, running into elbows either.

00:28:09.000 So there's a little bit of control on both sides, so, you know, he can just barely, like, boom.

00:28:12.000 I'm like, oh, my God.

00:28:14.000 I can only imagine the amount of damage he could have done if we were going at it.

00:28:21.000 But I've been working with him.

00:28:23.000 He brings it out of me a lot.

00:28:25.000 Working with Ryan Diaz, who comes in and helps me out, shows me a lot of the stuff.

00:28:30.000 He knows a lot of Thais and stuff, so he's a Muay Thai specialist himself.

00:28:37.000 Did you ever see the fight between Nate Marquardt and Tyron Woodley in Strikeforce?

00:28:45.000 Oh, I did.

00:28:46.000 That was the last fight in Strikeforce, right?

00:28:47.000 Oh, my goodness.

00:28:48.000 I did see that one.

00:28:49.000 Oh, my goodness.

00:28:50.000 I don't know if that was the last fight in Strikeforce.

00:28:52.000 I think that was the last event.

00:28:54.000 The very last event?

00:28:54.000 Really?

00:28:55.000 Yeah, I think that was the last fight because that was the main event.

00:28:57.000 That fight was insane.

00:28:59.000 That stoppage was insane.

00:29:01.000 I mean, this is like video game stoppage.

00:29:03.000 Over the top elbows.

00:29:06.000 Yeah.

00:29:06.000 Then you hit him with his uppercut.

00:29:08.000 Uppercut.

00:29:09.000 Boom.

00:29:10.000 Oh my goodness.

00:29:11.000 I mean, that was a video game stoppage.

00:29:14.000 Yeah.

00:29:14.000 Like, they missed out on this Nate Marquardt era when he was at his prime.

00:29:20.000 Yeah.

00:29:21.000 And that fight is like a great example of it.

00:29:23.000 What year was that?

00:29:24.000 Boom.

00:29:25.000 God, I'm not sure.

00:29:27.000 Because I remember watching that.

00:29:28.000 I was a big fan of MMA at that point in time.

00:29:31.000 Boom.

00:29:31.000 I mean, insane combination.

00:29:34.000 Boy, I want to say, what year is that, Jamie?

00:29:37.000 That would have been like early 2010s, like maybe 11?

00:29:42.000 Yeah, I was thinking.

00:29:44.000 That makes sense.

00:29:47.000 I'm kind of bummed out that Bellator and the PFL are going to become one thing now.

00:29:53.000 I like having a bunch of different organizations, apparently.

00:29:56.000 That's what I keep hearing.

00:29:58.000 2012. Rockhold versus Kennedy.

00:30:01.000 That was a great fight, too. 0.99

00:30:03.000 Damn, a lot of great fights in Strikeforce. 0.96

00:30:06.000 Strikeforce was one of the few organizations where you could absolutely say that it stood neck and neck with some of the best UFC fights at the time. 0.98

00:30:16.000 Yeah, you know like when Nate Diaz or when Nick Diaz was running shit over there when he had that fight with Cyborg like when Nick Diaz had that That crazy fight with Paul Daly Insane fight with Paul Daly and then with Frank Shamrock and Robbie Lawler Yeah, Robbie Lawler fighting Melvin Manhoff over there.

00:30:37.000 Remember that one?

00:30:38.000 I remember that.

00:30:38.000 See, you could say that when Luke Rockhold was the champ over there and then became the champ in the UFC, you could say that the level of fighter in Strikeforce at the very peak...

00:30:49.000 Was at the level?

00:30:50.000 It was at the same level of the UFC. Josh Thompson was over there.

00:30:53.000 It was at the very same level.

00:30:55.000 It was just elite.

00:30:56.000 I mean, we just got through watching our Woodley fight.

00:30:58.000 Last event they had.

00:31:00.000 Gegard Mousasi, I mean elite. 1.00

00:31:02.000 Gegard Mousasi is a bad motherfucker. 1.00

00:31:04.000 Jacare Sousa, Tim Kennedy, Ryan Couture, who's a bad motherfucker too, who's Randy's son. 1.00

00:31:12.000 Josh Barnett, Daniel Cormier, jeez! 0.93

00:31:15.000 But Willie went on to become, what, the Westway champion after that?

00:31:19.000 After that knockout?

00:31:23.000 Yep.

00:31:24.000 Yes.

00:31:26.000 Yeah, no, Wilter, yeah, after that knockout. 0.92

00:31:28.000 He entered into the UFC after that knockout, yeah, for sure.

00:31:31.000 It was quite a bit.

00:31:32.000 That Jay Heron knockout, oh my god.

00:31:35.000 Yeah, that was a nasty one.

00:31:38.000 Yeah, it's interesting if you go back and watch the first UFC and if someone did like an analysis, like some egghead did an analysis of like what percentage better are elite athletes today.

00:31:54.000 I would be very curious.

00:31:56.000 Yeah.

00:31:56.000 I think we ought to be curious.

00:31:58.000 I think that will put into numbers, right?

00:32:01.000 Yeah.

00:32:01.000 Quantifying, you know, what we're actually doing with ourselves.

00:32:04.000 Yeah.

00:32:05.000 I think we can probably put some direction on how to direct that trajectory, maybe even accelerate it.

00:32:12.000 I wonder if you can.

00:32:13.000 I mean, it's so accelerated right now.

00:32:16.000 I mean, nobody's really focusing on it, you know?

00:32:19.000 How many of us are focused on combining all this stuff and progressing it to the level?

00:32:27.000 And then it's only going to get so far because you can only test it out against the current level of competition out there.

00:32:34.000 So there are factors, limiting factors, but if we all focused on a certain thing as opposed to If it was like a collective consciousness focusing on it, like a think tank or some shit like that, I think we could speed it up, you know?

00:32:50.000 Really?

00:32:51.000 I think so.

00:32:52.000 Like, how so?

00:32:53.000 What do you think they could use to speed it up?

00:32:56.000 Well, there would definitely have to be...

00:32:57.000 It would definitely be over a length of time.

00:33:00.000 There would be a lot of training involved, right?

00:33:03.000 Because, um...

00:33:04.000 But... 0.93

00:33:06.000 I would say with people focusing on it, like you got different experts at different fields, testing shit, trials and trial and error and stuff like that, you know, how science works, right? 0.76

00:33:18.000 You get a bunch of ideas together, you test them out, you see, you document the results. 0.90

00:33:24.000 Yeah, I see what you're saying.

00:33:25.000 But I also think that's a big part, and this is what a lot of people disagree with, about martial arts, that it's an art.

00:33:33.000 I think it is an art.

00:33:34.000 I think people disagree because they don't like arts where people get hurt.

00:33:37.000 But I think it's an art.

00:33:38.000 And I think everyone, it's something about whatever it is that draws them to that art.

00:33:45.000 Whether it's wrestling or it's Muay Thai, whatever it is that draws them to that.

00:33:50.000 And to me, like...

00:33:53.000 You're never going to be able to fix that with numbers.

00:33:56.000 You're never going to be able to quantify.

00:33:57.000 What drives someone to become elite, world-class striker and then learn how to wrestle?

00:34:04.000 It's a different animal.

00:34:06.000 It's a different thing.

00:34:07.000 And you've got to let people figure out what their thing is.

00:34:11.000 Some people, it's a jiu-jitsu thing.

00:34:12.000 They just want to take people down and strangle them. 0.98

00:34:14.000 And some people, it's like, no, they want to keep you on the feet and beat the fuck out of you. 0.98

00:34:17.000 And you've got to let them... 0.97

00:34:18.000 Figure that out.

00:34:19.000 And it's like some of the best fighters are not necessarily the most balanced where they're great at everything, but they're so good at one thing that they can impose that, whether it's grappling or whether it's striking.

00:34:34.000 It's a really interesting argument.

00:34:36.000 Like, what's the best approach?

00:34:38.000 Is it to be an elite specialist and then also an elite athlete that can pick up the other stuff quick?

00:34:44.000 Or is it better to be, like, fully well-rounded, like Mighty Mouse, who's like the most well-rounded guy ever.

00:34:51.000 Everything he can do world-class.

00:34:53.000 Ground game world-class, stand-up world-class, everything.

00:34:56.000 No holes.

00:34:57.000 That's like the guy.

00:34:59.000 If I had to look at technique for all-time technique, Mighty Mouse is the guy.

00:35:03.000 Yeah, I agree.

00:35:04.000 For sure.

00:35:05.000 He could do everything.

00:35:06.000 He was definitely the best all-around fighter.

00:35:07.000 He could do everything.

00:35:08.000 And he was a ghost. 0.97

00:35:10.000 He was in front of you, and then he was to the side of you, and then he was kicking you, and then he was shoving you, and then he was fucking dropping punches down on you, and then he had your back. 0.97

00:35:18.000 It's like, whoa! 0.96

00:35:19.000 Yeah.

00:35:20.000 He was a speed demon man with perfect technique and a library of information and that relationship that he had with Matt Hume.

00:35:29.000 Matt Hume is a very, very intelligent guy and very interesting guy when he talks about martial arts.

00:35:34.000 He knows a lot about martial arts.

00:35:36.000 And he was another one of those guys that was like early on he was fighting in MMA. He fought Pat Militech.

00:35:43.000 In an MMA fight that I watched, one of those weird organizations that was emerging that we forgot the name of, like World Combat something or another, you know? 0.97

00:35:53.000 But like that relationship between like a great coach and a fighter, like a DJ and a Matt Hume or, you know, a George St. Pierre and Farah Sahabi, like this kind of relationship that happens with certain athletes, that shit is so important. 0.95

00:36:10.000 It really is.

00:36:11.000 I mean, you've got to have a coach that's going to be able to communicate with you, and then you'll be able to communicate back with your coach.

00:36:17.000 So you go from Army combatants, and what is the next gym that you join?

00:36:21.000 When do you start taking MMA as a path?

00:36:25.000 Well, after I get out of the Army.

00:36:27.000 Well, I was trying to do it in the Army, but that wasn't a priority.

00:36:31.000 So after I get out of the Army...

00:36:36.000 I relocate to Alaska.

00:36:37.000 I use my skills that I acquired in the Army to get a job with the FAA, and I get hired on in Alaska.

00:36:43.000 So I relocate up there, me and my wife, and so we relocate up there.

00:36:49.000 And as soon as I get up there, I mean, there's a lot of time in between my exit from the Army.

00:36:54.000 I exited, what, 2008, December, and I'm in Alaska July 2009. So, in between that time, you know, I just, I found it, I had the bug, so I found the judo gym, you know what I mean?

00:37:07.000 I'm broke as a joke right now, you know what I mean?

00:37:10.000 I'm on unemployment because I just got out of the military, and my wife is pregnant, you know, we're, we found out two days before we had to clear post that we're pregnant, so, uh...

00:37:19.000 It was a pretty harrowing time for us, you know what I mean?

00:37:22.000 But I still wanted to train, so I found myself a judo gym.

00:37:26.000 And I trained judo for about a month and a half, two months, and tried to pick up as much as I could.

00:37:32.000 In between that time, I was applying for the job with the FAA. Eventually, going through all that hiring process of interviews and a bunch of other things, we relocate up to Alaska.

00:37:48.000 And as soon as we get settled up there, me and my wife and my newly born daughter...

00:37:54.000 I'm looking for a gym, you know what I mean?

00:37:55.000 And I find Gracie Baja, Alaska that's up there.

00:37:59.000 And I get into it, you know, I start doing jiu-jitsu.

00:38:02.000 I'm like 300 pounds, you know what I mean?

00:38:03.000 Training and stuff.

00:38:04.000 In between this time, in between my army time and Alaska, I put on a bunch of weight, put on a bunch of baby weight.

00:38:11.000 So I'm training jiu-jitsu, you know what I mean?

00:38:14.000 300 pounds up there.

00:38:17.000 Throwing myself into this martial art.

00:38:19.000 You know, I didn't even know about MMA. I wasn't concerning myself about being a UFC fighter or anything at that time.

00:38:23.000 But one of these days, I look up and see these guys are striking.

00:38:27.000 You know what I mean?

00:38:28.000 So that goes on for about a month or two.

00:38:30.000 And I'm interested in it, and I wanted to get in shape first.

00:38:33.000 So I didn't just throw myself into everything the gym had.

00:38:37.000 I just wanted to focus on jiu-jitsu.

00:38:39.000 So I just did jiu-jitsu for a couple of months.

00:38:41.000 And then opportunity came up, and I just did a couple of the MMA classes.

00:38:47.000 And it was fun.

00:38:49.000 I was hooked.

00:38:49.000 One thing led to another.

00:38:51.000 I found out they had a MMA promotion in Alaska, the AFC. So I trained for about a year from like the end of 2009, early 2010 to about early spring.

00:39:08.000 It was about March 2011. So where were you getting your striking in?

00:39:13.000 You were getting your striking in?

00:39:14.000 At Gracie Baja, Alaska.

00:39:15.000 So the guys that were striking there, you just joined in with them?

00:39:18.000 Yeah, I just joined in with them.

00:39:19.000 Was anybody like a...

00:39:21.000 Well, it was an MMA team.

00:39:22.000 Oh, so it was an MMA team.

00:39:23.000 Yeah.

00:39:24.000 Yeah.

00:39:24.000 So they had an actual MMA team, and there was an MMA promotion.

00:39:27.000 There was a few other gyms in the town as well.

00:39:30.000 So I just threw myself in.

00:39:35.000 I couldn't do it at first because of work and stuff like that, and just being home with my daughter.

00:39:40.000 But...

00:39:44.000 Eventually I trickled my way into it and got hooked.

00:39:48.000 It caused some friction at first, but me and my wife made the adjustments we needed to, which was either be close to work.

00:39:55.000 Me personally, I either have to be close to where I work at or close to the gym, because that's where I'll be spending most of my time at.

00:40:02.000 How crazy is it when you think of that moment then, when you first started doing this, when you had to convince your wife, and now you're one of the top middleweights on planet Earth?

00:40:15.000 It is crazy to think about.

00:40:17.000 Crazy?

00:40:18.000 Yeah.

00:40:18.000 Crazy.

00:40:19.000 What a journey that is.

00:40:20.000 And it's hard to think about it as it being crazy because, you know, I'm in the driver's seat, so it just seems like the road that I've been on, you know what I mean?

00:40:28.000 Right.

00:40:28.000 So a lot of people are astounded by it, you know?

00:40:32.000 So to go from, I guess, a regular guy to, like you said, the top middleweight in the world...

00:40:38.000 But I don't really see a scene in the transition.

00:40:42.000 To me, it's just been, like, this is what I want to do.

00:40:45.000 This is what I need to do.

00:40:46.000 This is something personal for me.

00:40:48.000 You know what I mean?

00:40:49.000 So, like, people go to church, it's personal for them.

00:40:52.000 You know what I mean?

00:40:52.000 This is personal for me.

00:40:53.000 This is personal development.

00:40:55.000 Not only just doing martial art and what you see on the outside, learning how to do a move and, you know, be stronger than the next man, but the internal aspects of it is what really drew me to it, of being a martial artist, you know?

00:41:07.000 So, um...

00:41:10.000 It makes sense when you watch you fight because you're constantly improving.

00:41:14.000 You always are on the path, which I think is very admirable and very difficult to maintain for a lot of fighters, to maintain their enthusiasm for the path.

00:41:24.000 They'll have some setbacks.

00:41:27.000 And then maybe they lose a little bit of enthusiasm from the setbacks, and it's hard for them to, like, re-gear up.

00:41:32.000 But you always stay on the path.

00:41:34.000 And, like, all of your fights, like, the Marvin Vittori fight was super impressive, man.

00:41:38.000 That was a super impressive performance.

00:41:40.000 And it's just, like, you're getting better.

00:41:43.000 It's like we knew that you were elite as a middleweight, but you, even through the fights that you've lost, you come back and you're better.

00:41:50.000 Every time you're better.

00:41:51.000 It's like you keep seeing that the path and the hard work is paying off with every fight.

00:41:56.000 Yeah.

00:41:57.000 And, you know, that's interesting because Coach said it in a very interesting way that once you get to that top level, the improvements are incremental at best.

00:42:07.000 You know what I mean?

00:42:07.000 So it's hard to see them.

00:42:08.000 Yeah.

00:42:09.000 And that's one of the things he's impressed by with me as well.

00:42:11.000 He said, because I'm making...

00:42:14.000 Semi-drastic, I don't want to say drastic improvements, but I'm making some big improvements that are noticeable.

00:42:20.000 The movement in the Vittori fight was noticeable.

00:42:22.000 That was very impressive.

00:42:24.000 Your movement was like, there was much more activity going on.

00:42:28.000 It was really technical, setting him up really well.

00:42:32.000 And it's only going to get better, I promise you that.

00:42:34.000 I believe you.

00:42:35.000 For me, it's already gotten better, because I've moved on from that.

00:42:39.000 Right.

00:42:40.000 But with a big fight like that and a big win, is there also like this feeling like almost like you've leveled up, like you've gone through, like you got affirmation.

00:42:50.000 You knew it, you thought you were going to beat him.

00:42:52.000 Vittori's one of the best in the division for sure.

00:42:54.000 He's a beast.

00:42:55.000 That's another dude. 1.00

00:42:56.000 How the fuck does that guy make 185 pounds? 1.00

00:42:59.000 He's a beast. 1.00

00:43:00.000 He's a house. 1.00

00:43:01.000 I always stand next to him like, how the fuck do you do that? 1.00

00:43:04.000 He's so big. 0.99

00:43:05.000 His head's gotta be like 40 pounds, right?

00:43:07.000 Pajedo, who just fought at 205 this weekend to beat Jan Blachowicz.

00:43:12.000 When you're standing next to him, you're like, what are you really weighing?

00:43:15.000 Bro, you're 230 pounds.

00:43:18.000 You're huge.

00:43:19.000 He's gigantic.

00:43:20.000 He looks like he's 225 pounds when he's standing there.

00:43:22.000 And I think he is something like that, right?

00:43:24.000 They tested them the day of the fight to see how much weight he put back on.

00:43:29.000 It was like 22 pounds or something like that.

00:43:30.000 Something bananas like that, yeah.

00:43:32.000 What did he weigh, Jamie?

00:43:34.000 I think they'll show it.

00:43:35.000 They show the before and after. 1.00

00:43:38.000 That fucking dude's good. 1.00

00:43:39.000 He's good. 1.00

00:43:40.000 And now that he can defend on the ground, too.

00:43:43.000 Look at that.

00:43:44.000 228. Bananas.

00:43:48.000 Homeboy gained 23 pounds.

00:43:50.000 And had full endurance, man.

00:43:52.000 He looked fantastic in that fight.

00:43:54.000 That was a good fight.

00:43:55.000 When you think about it, though, is that really...

00:43:57.000 I mean, that's like, what, two gallons of water?

00:44:00.000 Plus some food.

00:44:01.000 A gallon of water is like eight pounds.

00:44:03.000 Is it?

00:44:05.000 Yeah, I guess.

00:44:06.000 How much does a gallon of water weigh?

00:44:07.000 I never even thought of that.

00:44:08.000 A gallon of water is like over eight pounds, I think.

00:44:11.000 8.34.

00:44:12.000 8.34.

00:44:13.000 Okay.

00:44:14.000 So yeah, you're right.

00:44:15.000 A little bit over two.

00:44:16.000 Two gallons.

00:44:17.000 Maybe close to three gallons of water.

00:44:18.000 We're definitely drinking that much.

00:44:20.000 We're definitely getting that after cutting weight.

00:44:22.000 Yeah.

00:44:23.000 So with him being that big, that's not really that big drastic of an increase when you think about The fact that he may not be as dehydrated as he was at middleweight, but I'm sure he's dropping his weight, especially to get back up to 220. I think when you dehydrate yourself, you can really put down some water.

00:44:47.000 Yeah, no, I agree, for sure.

00:44:49.000 And I think when you're a real big guy like he is, the benefits of that weight cut are, without a doubt, I was like 215 when I fought Vittori.

00:45:02.000 Were you really?

00:45:03.000 Yeah.

00:45:04.000 That's the most that I've put on.

00:45:05.000 Yeah?

00:45:06.000 Yeah.

00:45:06.000 That's the most.

00:45:07.000 Did you do it on purpose, or is it just happening?

00:45:09.000 No, it just happened.

00:45:10.000 I didn't do anything intentionally.

00:45:12.000 I was just...

00:45:13.000 The only thing I did intentionally was prepare a big jug of tea with some electrolytes and stuff in it that I carried around with me.

00:45:22.000 That was the first time I've done that.

00:45:24.000 When you do something like that, do you sip it slowly when you first start taking it in?

00:45:28.000 Because you're dehydrated for like how long?

00:45:30.000 I don't sip.

00:45:32.000 No, because I cut the night of.

00:45:36.000 The most dehydrated I am, I cut the night of late that night so I can just try to go to sleep and then wake up and go to the early weigh-ins.

00:45:43.000 And that's how I do it.

00:45:45.000 And I wake up and if I need to cut extra, there's still time to cut because I wake up early.

00:45:50.000 I can't sleep the night of a weight cut.

00:45:52.000 That makes sense.

00:45:53.000 Yeah, I've heard different people do it different ways, but I think people are realizing now it's better to just get up early.

00:46:00.000 To get up early and do it?

00:46:01.000 Yeah.

00:46:01.000 I think it would be better.

00:46:02.000 You know what I mean?

00:46:03.000 You want to sleep.

00:46:03.000 You just wake up.

00:46:04.000 Yeah, you want to sleep hydrated.

00:46:05.000 You definitely want to sleep hydrated.

00:46:06.000 Otherwise you're missing a night of sleep, for real.

00:46:08.000 No, you're absolutely right.

00:46:09.000 Yeah, it's like you're gonna always dehydrate yourself, but you're gonna miss a night of sleep because you want to be dehydrated earlier.

00:46:16.000 Don't do that. 1.00

00:46:16.000 You need that fucking sleep. 1.00

00:46:18.000 It's just I really wish that there was a way around it because I just don't think it makes any sense. 0.99

00:46:22.000 And I know it's tradition and I know it's the fight before the fight like John Anik always likes to describe it as.

00:46:27.000 But I just think it's unnecessary and dangerous.

00:46:30.000 And I think it's dangerously unnecessary.

00:46:33.000 Like, there's no reason to have people almost kill themselves a day before a fight.

00:46:37.000 Yeah.

00:46:38.000 Well...

00:46:39.000 I think it affects guys' chins, and Josh Barnett was saying that.

00:46:42.000 Josh Barnett and I were having a tax conversation about this, and he said it absolutely affects your chin.

00:46:47.000 When you get dehydrated, your brain doesn't hydrate as much.

00:46:51.000 You're not just dehydrating yourself.

00:46:52.000 You're dehydrating your brain, your liver, your kidneys, your heart.

00:46:54.000 Yeah, you can't take a shot as well.

00:46:56.000 Yeah.

00:46:58.000 So it's one of those things, man.

00:47:01.000 I feel like it's a legacy thing in the sport that I wish wasn't there anymore.

00:47:06.000 But I do like to see a guy like you go from heavyweight all the way down the middleweight. 0.98

00:47:10.000 I do like that, because when you fight, I go, God damn, he's big. 0.97

00:47:13.000 It's worth it. 0.99

00:47:14.000 It's worth it, because you could really be a bully in there sometimes.

00:47:17.000 You're a big middleweight, and it has its advantages.

00:47:21.000 It has its advantages in durability, too, I think.

00:47:24.000 You're absolutely right.

00:47:25.000 I'm able to absorb a lot more, even though my goal is to not absorb anything in there.

00:47:31.000 But it's the nature of the beast.

00:47:32.000 You can't really block them all, I suppose.

00:47:37.000 Same for guys like Vittori.

00:47:38.000 It's like one of the things he's famous for.

00:47:40.000 Yeah, look at this man.

00:47:41.000 He can take shots. 0.97

00:47:41.000 Yeah, because I'll put some heavy leather on that guy. 0.97

00:47:44.000 He was just looking at me like...

00:47:45.000 Yeah.

00:47:46.000 Like, yeah.

00:47:48.000 No, he's a warrior.

00:47:49.000 But that was a really intriguing fight for me.

00:47:53.000 Because I know he's elite, and I know you're elite, but, you know, you just beat Sean Strickland, and then you went right into that fight, and I was like, this will show.

00:48:02.000 You know, this will show where he's flying colors, man.

00:48:06.000 You just dominated him.

00:48:08.000 That was, I think, your most technical performance.

00:48:11.000 Do you agree with that?

00:48:15.000 I think the Anderson Silva fight was pretty technical as well.

00:48:19.000 That was very technical.

00:48:20.000 That was very technical.

00:48:24.000 But that was mostly leg kicks, predominantly leg kicks in that fight. 0.99

00:48:30.000 I think I was more disciplined in that fight, to be honest, because the goal was he's going to be hard to hit in the head.

00:48:36.000 Right.

00:48:36.000 Whereas, well, I think I'm comparing this one to the Strickland fight, not to the Vittori fight.

00:48:44.000 But I was able to make that adjustment.

00:48:47.000 Okay, his head's going to be hard to hit right off the bat, so I'm just going to touch you down here.

00:48:51.000 And I stayed to that, and it only took one round to cause that injury.

00:48:57.000 Yeah, Anderson is...

00:49:00.000 As far as I know, the only guy who's successfully come back after that shin break.

00:49:06.000 Yeah.

00:49:06.000 No one else is really...

00:49:07.000 No one else was able to do it.

00:49:09.000 Well, didn't McGregor...

00:49:11.000 Well, Tyron Spong...

00:49:13.000 Did McGregor fight...

00:49:16.000 No, he hasn't fought since the injury.

00:49:18.000 Oh, okay, he hasn't fought the injury.

00:49:19.000 But Tyrone Spong, he's done it.

00:49:20.000 He injured, yep.

00:49:21.000 He had a horrible one against Gokhan Saki.

00:49:24.000 Horrible.

00:49:25.000 Same thing as Chris Wybin, Uriah Hall, same check.

00:49:28.000 Horrible snap.

00:49:30.000 Isn't he about to come back, though?

00:49:32.000 Well, Tyrone Spong became a boxer.

00:49:34.000 He'll still do MMA. I know he had at least one MMA fight since then.

00:49:38.000 But, you know, he was an elite kickboxer.

00:49:40.000 He was elite, man.

00:49:41.000 He was so good. 0.99

00:49:43.000 And to see his shin snap like that, you're like, God damn. 0.98

00:49:47.000 I mean, you would always think about it before you went to throw a shot. 0.99

00:49:51.000 You would always think about the two years it took you to fucking regrow your bone back where you could throw kicks with it again. 0.97

00:49:57.000 Yeah. 0.97

00:49:57.000 I wouldn't say it slowed my kicks down. 0.97

00:50:00.000 Checks have done that enough.

00:50:01.000 You know what I mean?

00:50:02.000 Checks hurt enough or are deterring enough.

00:50:06.000 But...

00:50:09.000 Yeah, it definitely gives you something to think about, you know?

00:50:12.000 It's definitely a scary fact of it.

00:50:14.000 It's one of the most horrific injuries in the sport.

00:50:16.000 Yeah.

00:50:17.000 That shin injury.

00:50:18.000 And it's happened.

00:50:19.000 There's so many versions of it now on Instagram.

00:50:21.000 Yeah.

00:50:21.000 You can find so many small shows where guys are doing it, accidentally breaking their legs.

00:50:26.000 I think Noguera getting his arm snapped was pretty horrific as well.

00:50:29.000 Oh, that was horrible.

00:50:30.000 That was horrible.

00:50:30.000 I saw another girl get her arm snapped in a jiu-jitsu tournament.

00:50:34.000 Yeah.

00:50:34.000 Same thing.

00:50:35.000 Oh, goddammit, tap!

00:50:37.000 I remember when Khabib had Michael Johnson, and I remember thinking, just please tap.

00:50:43.000 Please tap.

00:50:44.000 Please tap.

00:50:44.000 Just please tap.

00:50:45.000 Don't make me see this, man.

00:50:46.000 Don't make me see this.

00:50:47.000 Tap.

00:50:48.000 He got you.

00:50:49.000 Fight another day.

00:50:50.000 Please tap.

00:50:51.000 Please tap. 1.00

00:50:51.000 That fucking spiral arm fracture from that Kimura is so nasty. 1.00

00:50:57.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:50:57.000 Ugh. 1.00

00:50:58.000 And I hear those are, from doctors, I hear those are really hard to repair and stuff.

00:51:03.000 Yeah, hard to repair.

00:51:04.000 You know, who knows if your arm's ever going to be the same again.

00:51:07.000 That's a rough one to come back from.

00:51:10.000 My friend Tom broke his arm playing basketball, like, what was it, like two years ago, Jamie?

00:51:14.000 Two years ago. 0.99

00:51:15.000 It's still fucked. 1.00

00:51:16.000 He's still struggling with it. 1.00

00:51:18.000 What part did he break?

00:51:19.000 He broke the top.

00:51:21.000 It broke the top bone, like up here.

00:51:23.000 Oh, that's a humerus.

00:51:25.000 It was big.

00:51:26.000 Big fracture.

00:51:27.000 Nerve damage in his hand.

00:51:29.000 I can imagine that one being painful because not only is the break painful, but you got the weight of the arm pulling on that thing.

00:51:37.000 And that can make it hard for it to heal as well.

00:51:39.000 Yeah, dude.

00:51:40.000 Injuries.

00:51:42.000 What's the worst injury you've had in MMA? In MMA? I've torn...

00:51:46.000 Well, I didn't...

00:51:48.000 In my MMA career, I've torn my pec training.

00:51:51.000 You know what I mean?

00:51:52.000 I think the worst one I had in competition...

00:51:55.000 I mean, I've broken my hand in competition.

00:51:57.000 Did you tear your pec in drilling or sparring?

00:51:59.000 It was just...

00:52:00.000 We were initiating a warm-up.

00:52:02.000 So it was a warm-up roll.

00:52:03.000 Me and Ben was like a warm-up roll.

00:52:05.000 And I was passing his guard.

00:52:07.000 Ben Henderson?

00:52:08.000 Ben Henderson, yeah.

00:52:09.000 Yeah.

00:52:11.000 Shout out to the lab.

00:52:13.000 Oh yeah, all day long.

00:52:14.000 Lab all day.

00:52:15.000 You all know that.

00:52:16.000 Everybody knows what we do.

00:52:19.000 It's a great gym.

00:52:20.000 It really is.

00:52:21.000 That's the whole reason why I quit my six-figure job and moved to Phoenix, Arizona.

00:52:26.000 But yeah, he had a whizzer on my left arm, and I was passing to the right side, so I cleared his leg, and I went to pass his guard, and I was extended with my left arm, because he had the whizzer, and I went to get strong to collect him up into side control, and as soon as I contracted that peg...

00:52:48.000 It tore just like that.

00:52:49.000 Three little rips. 0.97

00:52:51.000 And it tore.

00:52:52.000 That was February.

00:52:53.000 I think that was during the...

00:52:55.000 That was fight week for Jon Jones versus...

00:53:00.000 Who did his last fight at Light Heavyweight?

00:53:02.000 Dominic Reyes.

00:53:03.000 Dominic Reyes.

00:53:04.000 Yeah.

00:53:05.000 So that happened in Houston at the hotel.

00:53:07.000 Wow.

00:53:08.000 And then I came back and fought...

00:53:11.000 Yeah, that was 2020 before COVID. And then I came back and fought Robert Whittaker in Abu Dhabi.

00:53:17.000 Was it still fucked up? 0.99

00:53:18.000 No, the peck was fine. 0.99

00:53:19.000 Okay.

00:53:19.000 Shout out to Ares Physical Therapy.

00:53:21.000 Now you got me running all my shout outs now.

00:53:23.000 Shout out to Ares Physical Therapy.

00:53:25.000 I've been hitting them up since the Anderson Silva fight.

00:53:30.000 You know what I mean?

00:53:31.000 I've been working out with them, working out there.

00:53:34.000 As well as working out at the lab, those two combined, you guys see my cardio, those two combined has really propelled my career.

00:53:43.000 But I came back after the peck tear to fight Robert Whittaker, and not a minute into the fight, he throws his patented Reaper combo, one-two head kick, and breaks my left ulna.

00:53:56.000 Oh, man.

00:53:57.000 So...

00:53:58.000 I ended up fighting this guy for, what, another two rounds plus four minutes of the first round with a broken owner and I almost got him too.

00:54:10.000 You should see the other guy, right?

00:54:12.000 That's one of those crazy freak injuries that, like, it can always happen when you're blocking kicks.

00:54:17.000 But it was my fault.

00:54:17.000 I extended my arm to block, more reactionary as opposed to being grounded and prepared and bracing and ready to absorb the kick.

00:54:26.000 Like, oh shit, kick. 0.99

00:54:27.000 And the reason being because I was slipping his initiation. 1.00

00:54:32.000 Typical shit. 1.00

00:54:33.000 We all see it happen all day long with Robert Whittaker. 1.00

00:54:36.000 We all know that combination.

00:54:39.000 Were you surprised at the Dracus Duplessis fight?

00:54:42.000 Who wasn't, right?

00:54:44.000 I wouldn't say I was surprised as if he doesn't have the capability to do what he did, but it was still surprising to see it happen, right?

00:54:51.000 Yeah.

00:54:52.000 Because we all think so highly of Robert and his ability to go in there and fight at the highest level, but...

00:54:58.000 It was shocking. 0.68

00:54:58.000 I'm sure, you know, Drakus, he fucking opened some eyes there with that one. 0.68

00:55:03.000 Yeah. 0.88

00:55:03.000 But to be honest, when I look at that fight, when I was looking at that fight in the lead up to it, that fight went exactly how I thought it could have gone. 0.88

00:55:10.000 Really?

00:55:11.000 I either thought Robert was going to be the tactician that he is and pick him apart, you know what I mean?

00:55:16.000 Maybe hurt him with some shots and get a finish or take him to a decision.

00:55:21.000 Or Drakus, who was a buzzsaw, my words exactly, the dude's a buzzsaw, he keeps going.

00:55:28.000 You know what I mean?

00:55:28.000 He doesn't slow down.

00:55:29.000 He may look from the outside, look tired, but he probably doesn't feel tired to his opponent in there.

00:55:35.000 I'm pretty sure he's putting some pressure on.

00:55:37.000 And that's exactly what he did.

00:55:38.000 And Robert began to wilt in the first round from what I saw.

00:55:42.000 Well, he got his nose fixed now.

00:55:43.000 He could breathe out of his nose.

00:55:44.000 So for the longest time, the reason why he had his mouth open, he had no nose.

00:55:47.000 So his nostrils are completely closed off.

00:55:49.000 So he won't look exhausted, slack-jawed.

00:55:51.000 Always look slack-jawed.

00:55:52.000 But he also would fight awkward, too.

00:55:55.000 I think it affected his cardio quite a bit.

00:55:57.000 I would say that's his style.

00:55:59.000 It is, but he used to get a little too overeager and he would like blitz, just run forward, which you can't do with a Whitaker. 0.98

00:56:06.000 You can't do with Pajera. 0.98

00:56:08.000 You can't do with an elite guy.

00:56:10.000 But he tightened all that up, man.

00:56:11.000 And he specifically tightened all that up for the Whitaker fight.

00:56:14.000 That was a very technical fight.

00:56:17.000 Someone broke it down on Instagram, one of those breakdown sites.

00:56:21.000 I forget who it was, whether it was Lawrence Kenshin or one of the other ones.

00:56:24.000 But they were talking about his use of the right hand, like stopping Whitaker in the right hook, stopping Whitaker as he was coming forward.

00:56:34.000 And that Whitaker has this like leap in style and that, you know, they had figured out the distance for that.

00:56:41.000 And that's when he started putting it on him.

00:56:42.000 It was very technical, man.

00:56:44.000 What he did was, you know, it was a very interesting fight.

00:56:48.000 I'm going to have to find him. 0.97

00:56:49.000 Because Whitaker is so fucking good, man. 0.98

00:56:52.000 For him to beat him down like that, it's like, wow, you got to take that guy for real. 0.98

00:56:57.000 You got to take that guy serious.

00:56:59.000 Yeah.

00:56:59.000 But that's what I saw.

00:57:01.000 What I saw Dracus do to Whitaker, I personally feel was the effect that I had on Vittori.

00:57:11.000 Because I was in his face, putting pressure on him.

00:57:14.000 I was hitting him too.

00:57:17.000 I think...

00:57:19.000 That could be a bit of a difference, but I think the pressure, the fact that Robert had to stay on, you know what I mean?

00:57:26.000 Yeah.

00:57:26.000 That does something to guys.

00:57:28.000 Guys aren't used to being on the whole time, like in their feet.

00:57:32.000 Right.

00:57:32.000 Getting chased.

00:57:33.000 Yeah.

00:57:33.000 Sprinting.

00:57:34.000 Yeah.

00:57:34.000 It's like sprinting.

00:57:36.000 He can fucking crack, too. 0.99

00:57:38.000 So, Drakes can sprint in there. 0.99

00:57:40.000 Yeah.

00:57:40.000 That's a good time.

00:57:41.000 I'm going to keep that one.

00:57:42.000 Well, it's going to be interesting to see, you know, what happens with him and Adesanya.

00:57:47.000 Yeah.

00:57:48.000 I mean, he's not a fight in September, right?

00:57:51.000 Yeah.

00:57:51.000 So, I don't know.

00:57:54.000 I hear rumors that they're going to go with the Strickland fight.

00:57:56.000 Well, I think that is happening now.

00:57:59.000 I'm sorry.

00:58:00.000 That is definitely happening now.

00:58:01.000 I'm sorry.

00:58:01.000 Because Strickland...

00:58:02.000 They're in negotiations still, though.

00:58:05.000 Because I think Strickland wants more money.

00:58:07.000 You know, I think...

00:58:09.000 I don't know.

00:58:10.000 I hope they work it out.

00:58:11.000 That'll be a good fight.

00:58:12.000 Well, I don't want to be Mr. Steal Your Girl here, you know what I mean?

00:58:16.000 I know.

00:58:16.000 I was thinking that when you came on here.

00:58:20.000 But, you know what I mean?

00:58:22.000 Are you preparing for something like that?

00:58:24.000 The possibility to something like that?

00:58:25.000 Well, when I get back after this, my diet is going to change.

00:58:28.000 I'm going to prepare for somebody.

00:58:29.000 How many weeks is Australia?

00:58:31.000 September 29?

00:58:32.000 That's like five, six weeks, right?

00:58:33.000 I think it's September night.

00:58:34.000 It'll be just enough time for Jared Cannoneer to get popping again.

00:58:38.000 So that's what I'm preparing for.

00:58:39.000 I'm preparing for the stars to align and me to go in there and win my title.

00:58:48.000 Who knows what's going to happen?

00:58:49.000 If Sean is being difficult, you know what I'm saying?

00:58:51.000 Mick, you know who to call.

00:58:53.000 Dana, you know who to call.

00:58:55.000 You know what I mean?

00:58:56.000 Y'all know Lou.

00:58:57.000 Y'all know first round.

00:58:58.000 You know how we handle business.

00:58:59.000 Y'all know I'm not difficult.

00:59:01.000 You know what I mean?

00:59:02.000 I think you guys pay me good.

00:59:04.000 I'm not going to ask for too much extra to go to Sydney.

00:59:06.000 I've never been there.

00:59:07.000 I think my contract is something that we agreed upon prior to these events occurring.

00:59:14.000 I think we can make something happen.

00:59:17.000 That's what I'm going to be getting ready for.

00:59:19.000 I definitely want to see you fight for the title for sure. 0.84

00:59:22.000 Yeah, it's going to be a different thing.

00:59:23.000 You know, everybody, you know, we all saw the first one and nobody was too entertained by that.

00:59:28.000 Not especially me.

00:59:30.000 So I've made the adjustments not only to make it more entertaining, because I know that's what people want, to be entertained, but...

00:59:37.000 Do you have to balance that out in your head sometimes?

00:59:39.000 Like be entertaining?

00:59:40.000 I don't concern myself for being entertaining or anything like that.

00:59:44.000 It's not as...

00:59:45.000 Well, you are.

00:59:47.000 You are, fortunately.

00:59:48.000 Your style is very entertaining, so you don't have to worry about that.

00:59:50.000 Well, it's just coincidental, right?

00:59:52.000 Right.

00:59:52.000 Yeah.

00:59:53.000 I like the hippie.

00:59:54.000 If anything, I'm entertaining myself because this is fun for me.

00:59:58.000 You know what I mean?

00:59:58.000 I'm going in there having fun.

00:59:59.000 Right.

01:00:00.000 You know what I mean?

01:00:01.000 And this is something I tell people all the time.

01:00:03.000 You know, I don't think of this as...

01:00:06.000 A job.

01:00:07.000 It is a career.

01:00:08.000 And I do get paid.

01:00:09.000 It is my livelihood.

01:00:10.000 But I don't approach this as my job or anything.

01:00:12.000 Like, I have to go to work now.

01:00:14.000 You know, this is something...

01:00:15.000 Me fighting is merely a part of my training.

01:00:18.000 You know what I mean?

01:00:19.000 It's like the test you take.

01:00:21.000 You know what I mean?

01:00:22.000 Every couple of weeks you take a test in school or you challenge yourself somehow.

01:00:27.000 And for me, that's what this is.

01:00:29.000 This is the challenge.

01:00:30.000 Marvin Vittoria is the challenge.

01:00:32.000 Israel Adesanya is the challenge.

01:00:36.000 I'm here to conquer these challenges, you know what I mean?

01:00:39.000 That's a beautiful approach.

01:00:41.000 That's probably why you just keep getting better.

01:00:43.000 That's why you keep getting better.

01:00:44.000 It's a fantastic mindset for an elite fighter.

01:00:48.000 A mindset of constant growth.

01:00:50.000 I'm always trying to learn.

01:00:51.000 That's the thing I love about it because I get to go into study, you know what I mean?

01:00:58.000 Right.

01:00:59.000 So something that I want to learn, something that I want to dissect and analyze and break down and Not only do it with my mind, but do it with my body as well.

01:01:08.000 That's something you can't really do a lot, you know what I'm saying?

01:01:11.000 Operate a field of thought with your mind and your body.

01:01:17.000 Well, it's also very impressive and very inspirational to people that you're doing it at like, I think you're 39 now?

01:01:25.000 Yeah, 39. You're getting better at an elite...

01:01:29.000 Athlete's level.

01:01:30.000 You're getting better at one of the most difficult jobs. 0.99

01:01:34.000 Combat sport athletes, that's one of the hardest fucking jobs on earth. 0.98

01:01:38.000 In terms of physical demands. 0.98

01:01:40.000 And you're getting better at 39. It's amazing.

01:01:43.000 I've mitigated a lot of the wear and tear through my years. 0.96

01:01:47.000 I didn't grow up jumping big hills on bicycles and shit like that.

01:01:52.000 Or anything like that. 0.98

01:01:53.000 On top of that...

01:01:57.000 I find my body to be valuable, so I didn't grow up destroying my body or anything like that.

01:02:04.000 When I finally started training, I was like 25 years old in Alaska, so I got into it relatively late.

01:02:11.000 I didn't grow up doing martial arts or anything like that.

01:02:16.000 I wouldn't say that I regret it, but I would like it to be the other way around.

01:02:19.000 I would have loved to have done martial arts as a child.

01:02:21.000 Yeah.

01:02:22.000 But it is what it is.

01:02:23.000 You know what I think, though?

01:02:24.000 I think one of the best—I mean, especially a guy like you that's maintained your peak athleticism into your late 30s.

01:02:31.000 You don't have the wear and tear that someone who started doing it when they were like 13, 14. But, you know, by the time you're 25, 26, you got— Ten plus years of getting kicked and punched and taken down, your knees twisted and your neck cranked.

01:02:45.000 Like, everybody gets banged up within ten years. 0.95

01:02:48.000 I mean, I had a friend who was 22 when he had his first nerve blockage where his fucking arm wasn't working correctly because his nerves were getting pinched in his neck. 0.98

01:02:59.000 In his neck, yeah. 0.98

01:02:59.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:03:00.000 I mean, so his neck was starting to get fucked when he was a young, young man. 0.99

01:03:05.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:03:05.000 So by the time, you know, you enter into martial arts later in life, but you're already a mature man. 0.98

01:03:11.000 And one of the things I think about like a big guy that cuts down is like your body thinks you're 300 pounds still.

01:03:17.000 You know what I'm saying?

01:03:18.000 So but you have all the tendons of a guy who was 300 pounds for a while.

01:03:23.000 Yeah.

01:03:23.000 But meanwhile, you know, you're competing at, you know, 210, 215. Yeah.

01:03:28.000 I like it into Goku training in Hyperbaric Chamber.

01:03:31.000 As Super Saiyan, I just want to be regular Super Saiyan all the time.

01:03:34.000 So here, let me just get heavy, train Super Saiyan, and then when I lose weight, it'll be like regular.

01:03:39.000 Yeah.

01:03:40.000 Well, you seem to have got it down to a science.

01:03:42.000 It sucks when people don't make weight.

01:03:44.000 Like this past weekend, Michelle Pereira and Wonderboy, they canceled the fight.

01:03:49.000 That's a bummer to me, man.

01:03:50.000 That's such a bummer.

01:03:52.000 That dude's so big, though.

01:03:54.000 He is big.

01:03:55.000 He's gigantic.

01:03:56.000 That's a gigantic 170. He's fucking huge. 1.00

01:04:00.000 So I could see it because Darren Till missed weight with Wonderboy in the past and Wonderboy always felt like that was a factor. 0.99

01:04:07.000 Yeah.

01:04:07.000 That he came in heavy.

01:04:09.000 I was going to sub for one of his fights.

01:04:11.000 I think they were concerned either.

01:04:13.000 I think it was visa issues.

01:04:14.000 Visa and weight issues.

01:04:15.000 The Darren Till one?

01:04:16.000 Yeah.

01:04:19.000 Man, it's interesting watching these guys come and go and come in with so much promise and it doesn't quite go the way.

01:04:30.000 Darren Till had a bunch of knee injuries.

01:04:32.000 Well, you know, the UFC is a promotion machine.

01:04:35.000 So they sell the world a dream for each and every one of us.

01:04:39.000 You know what I mean?

01:04:39.000 So a lot of people out there in the world have this idea of me.

01:04:43.000 That, you know, could be completely wrong, you know what I mean?

01:04:47.000 So, we all have these expectations.

01:04:51.000 Everybody has these hopes and dreams and stuff like that.

01:04:54.000 And us, as far as, especially with the mics in front of our faces, are allowed to share ours.

01:04:59.000 So everybody definitely believes us when we say, believes me when I say I'm going to be a champion one day.

01:05:05.000 You know what I mean?

01:05:06.000 I seriously believe myself when I say that.

01:05:08.000 So, yeah.

01:05:12.000 But a very few of us are going to make it to that level, you know what I mean?

01:05:16.000 A very few percentage of us are going to make it.

01:05:19.000 So that's the reality of it, you know?

01:05:23.000 And that's the reality I had already come to terms with when I first started this.

01:05:26.000 So when I first started doing MMA, I already had a full-time job, a good, comfortable job, you know what I mean?

01:05:34.000 I was able to take care of my family, so I was good.

01:05:37.000 And I was able to go train, so I was happy.

01:05:39.000 I just told myself, I'm just going to go as far as I can go.

01:05:43.000 You know what I mean?

01:05:46.000 Pretty much make myself no promises, you know what I mean?

01:05:48.000 Because I understand that.

01:05:49.000 I understand my ability, and I had confidence in myself, which is why I did it in the first place, but I understand the reality of it.

01:05:56.000 And I was blessed to already have a full-time job to be able to Take care of myself because there's a lot of fighters.

01:06:03.000 A lot of fighters out there are broke trying to fight.

01:06:06.000 The majority of fighters are in broke situations trying to fight.

01:06:14.000 When I was training, it wasn't my goal to be a UFC fighter.

01:06:18.000 I just wanted to go as far as I can, learn as much as I can while I have this time here on Earth.

01:06:25.000 This is as far as I've gotten. 0.93

01:06:27.000 Well, you've gotten pretty fucking far.

01:06:28.000 You've got a great approach, man. 0.96

01:06:30.000 You get a great approach to life, a great approach to this path that you're on to be a better martial artist and a better person.

01:06:39.000 It's a fascinating approach.

01:06:41.000 It's very samurai-like.

01:06:43.000 It is.

01:06:45.000 For me, I like to take energies from all places and try to create this, I don't want to say character, but create this avatar.

01:06:54.000 And equip this avatar with all these different perks and stuff that I find admirable, that I find moral, and things that's going to make me a bigger, stronger, better, what am I? A human?

01:07:05.000 A man?

01:07:06.000 A black man? 0.83

01:07:08.000 If you want to use those labels and terms, you know what I mean?

01:07:11.000 But, uh, for me being who I am, and, uh, That's a great way to think about it.

01:07:16.000 Yeah.

01:07:17.000 And not necessarily try to distinguish myself from any and everybody else.

01:07:20.000 You know what I mean?

01:07:22.000 Look to any and everybody else to see the potential that I have because we're all human.

01:07:26.000 We all have the potential to do great and wonderful things or terrible and...

01:07:33.000 Bad things, you know what I mean?

01:07:35.000 This is one thing I tell my children.

01:07:37.000 We have the ability as humans, this is what makes us unique from any other species on this planet, that we have the ability to be an animal.

01:07:47.000 Or we can be something better than that.

01:07:49.000 We have the ability to be a demon or a devil.

01:07:52.000 Or we can be a celestial or a god or a goddess, you know what I mean?

01:07:57.000 Not that we would physically embody our definitions of these things.

01:08:01.000 These are just conceptualizations, but...

01:08:05.000 I think for me, that allows me to take the trajectory of my life and point it to where I want.

01:08:11.000 I want to ascend, you know what I mean?

01:08:14.000 To use the word that has been so conceptualized, to Godhood.

01:08:19.000 And I realize that I'm not the Almighty, but I am living an aspect.

01:08:30.000 I am Generating a perspective.

01:08:34.000 I am so many different ways to put it.

01:08:39.000 Living an experience.

01:08:41.000 You know what I mean?

01:08:42.000 That God can look back and say, yep, I've done this.

01:08:45.000 You know what I mean?

01:08:46.000 Maybe this has already been done.

01:08:47.000 Maybe it hasn't.

01:08:48.000 But for me, I just want to go up.

01:08:52.000 Be better. 0.97

01:08:52.000 I want to be able to levitate and shit like that. 0.97

01:08:54.000 You know what I mean? 0.99

01:08:55.000 Yeah.

01:08:56.000 Do things that nobody else does, which is probably one of the reasons why I joined the Army and do martial arts in the first place, because everybody where I'm from, where I grew up, definitely wasn't joining the Army, and nobody was doing martial arts that I knew of.

01:09:09.000 So, I guess I was just born a nonconformist, if you will, and I just like taking the route that I find best suits me.

01:09:23.000 You feel me?

01:09:23.000 Yeah, I do feel you.

01:09:25.000 No, that's a fascinating path.

01:09:27.000 I like what you just said.

01:09:29.000 I like what you just said a lot.

01:09:31.000 I think if people could adopt that mindset and adopt that way of thinking, I think that would be very, very beneficial to a lot of people.

01:09:39.000 It's very admirable.

01:09:40.000 Sometimes when you hear someone's philosophy, the way they think about things and the way they approach their life, you go, oh, that's admirable.

01:09:47.000 And that's what I just felt when you were saying that.

01:09:49.000 I was like, that's very admirable.

01:09:51.000 I like when someone has a very clear, disciplined sort of view of what their life is and what they're trying to accomplish.

01:10:01.000 And you have, especially with this mindset that you have about constant growth, about looking at it like that, like you're always on the path.

01:10:08.000 And to approach that as a martial artist and then, you know, be a martial artist while you're still an elite fighter in the UFC. You're still a martial artist and I think that's why you're so good.

01:10:21.000 I think that's why you keep getting better too.

01:10:24.000 I'm a martial artist first.

01:10:25.000 It's awesome.

01:10:26.000 That's awesome.

01:10:27.000 And I think that, you know, there was a lot of people that felt like that was kind of lost, along with all the trash-talking part of the sport, the pro-wrestling style sport, which, you know, I think the first person to do it really good was Chael Sonnen.

01:10:39.000 But to me, it was funny, man.

01:10:41.000 I loved it.

01:10:42.000 So it's like I'm conflicted.

01:10:44.000 I like it, too.

01:10:44.000 You know what I mean?

01:10:45.000 Who didn't love it?

01:10:46.000 Who didn't love the Conor McGregor era, right?

01:10:48.000 How could you not love it?

01:10:49.000 Man, he came on the mic saying some... 1.00

01:10:52.000 Some wild shit. 1.00

01:10:53.000 Some wild shit, right? 1.00

01:10:54.000 How about when Jerry Stevens was talking shit to him and he goes, who the fuck is that guy? 1.00

01:10:58.000 Yeah, right? 0.99

01:10:59.000 He's had so many iconic one-liners that...

01:11:02.000 So yeah, man, I can understand it.

01:11:05.000 I can understand the entertainment aspect of it.

01:11:07.000 And I can understand the business aspect of the UFC catering to that because apparently that's more profitable, you know?

01:11:16.000 But...

01:11:18.000 I necessarily don't cater to that, you know what I mean?

01:11:21.000 I keep it clean.

01:11:23.000 Not that I keep it clean.

01:11:24.000 I keep it real, for lack of a better word.

01:11:27.000 You just are you.

01:11:28.000 You are you, no matter what.

01:11:29.000 This is how you feel about the matchup.

01:11:31.000 Yep.

01:11:31.000 I'm excited.

01:11:32.000 My only goal is to be as honest.

01:11:35.000 With myself.

01:11:36.000 And in doing so, I'll be honest with any and everybody else.

01:11:39.000 You know what I mean?

01:11:40.000 Yeah.

01:11:40.000 So, and that, for me, that keeps me in check.

01:11:43.000 Because I don't want to have to tell you some crazy fucked up shit I didn't do, you know what I mean? 0.99

01:11:47.000 Right, right, right. 0.99

01:11:48.000 So, I don't want to have to be like, mama, mama, you know, you know what I mean?

01:11:53.000 Right, right, right.

01:11:54.000 It was at one point where I was getting ready to leave a previous job of mine.

01:12:00.000 I'm not going to say which one specifically.

01:12:03.000 But I was doing things that I shouldn't have been doing.

01:12:06.000 And let's just say I got put in a position to where...

01:12:14.000 I can't even say it.

01:12:16.000 Don't say it.

01:12:17.000 If you think you should say it, tell me afterwards.

01:12:20.000 Don't get sued, Jared.

01:12:22.000 Don't get sued.

01:12:23.000 I won't get sued because no damages, nobody was hurt, nothing happened or anything like that.

01:12:27.000 If you don't think you should say it, don't say it.

01:12:29.000 Yeah.

01:12:30.000 But anyway, it was wild.

01:12:32.000 And there was a moment where I was going to call my wife and be like, baby, I just want you to know I love you, but something happening may make our future a little rainy in the future.

01:12:43.000 You know what I mean?

01:12:44.000 Something bad may just, you know.

01:12:46.000 Well, I'm glad you didn't do whatever you were thinking about doing.

01:12:48.000 Yeah.

01:12:49.000 I was going to call her, and then I just didn't call her, too.

01:12:52.000 And I just...

01:12:54.000 I'll tell you about it afterwards.

01:12:55.000 Okay, tell me afterwards.

01:12:56.000 Tell me afterwards.

01:12:57.000 So when you were competing, you first start competing in Alaska, how did you wound up in Arizona?

01:13:03.000 Like, what was the path to get down there?

01:13:06.000 Like, how many years in were you?

01:13:07.000 Well, I was training from...

01:13:10.000 I began competing in 2011 and I moved to Phoenix in 2017. On our team, Joe Murphy and Lauren Murphy.

01:13:19.000 Lauren Murphy's in the UFC. Joe Murphy, we're all familiar with.

01:13:22.000 Some of us should be familiar with that pair.

01:13:25.000 They were some of my first training partners.

01:13:27.000 Joe's a really good friend of mine.

01:13:28.000 I love that guy.

01:13:28.000 He's my guy.

01:13:29.000 I love him.

01:13:30.000 And I love Lauren, too.

01:13:31.000 Some of my first training partners.

01:13:34.000 But they had moved.

01:13:35.000 Lauren, they had moved to Florida.

01:13:37.000 Joe was in the Air Force, went from Florida to Texas, and eventually landed in Phoenix early 2010s.

01:13:45.000 And...

01:13:48.000 When they came back to visit in Alaska, they told me, hey, we're in the lab, you know what I mean?

01:13:52.000 They have a really good program there.

01:13:54.000 I think you can go there and, you know, really be good, you know what I mean?

01:13:59.000 As opposed to staying up here in Alaska, you know what I'm saying?

01:14:02.000 If you want to take your MMA career to the next level, the MMA lab can get you there.

01:14:09.000 At that time, I was just now getting signed with the UFC. I was 7-0 as a heavyweight in Alaska.

01:14:16.000 I fought my last fight January 2014. I had my first fight in the UFC January 2015. So a year later, I had my first fight.

01:14:29.000 So in the summertime, fall time, I was getting managers, getting in with the UFC. And I contacted them.

01:14:36.000 They said, come on down.

01:14:37.000 You can stay with us for a little bit.

01:14:38.000 You know what I'm saying?

01:14:39.000 Do your camp here.

01:14:41.000 And, you know, go from there.

01:14:43.000 And I went down, did the camp, and got my toes wet, as they say.

01:14:46.000 And I really like the temperature of the water.

01:14:49.000 You feel me?

01:14:50.000 So it was a two-month camp.

01:14:52.000 I did my debut.

01:14:55.000 You remember that card.

01:14:56.000 It was Jones-Cormier 1. And they first fought in Vegas.

01:15:01.000 So I fought Shawn Jordan on that card.

01:15:04.000 And those who don't know Shawn Jordan, I was lucky in my heavyweight career in the UFC. I didn't get to fight any of these 6'4", 6'5", giants, behemoths.

01:15:14.000 Shawn Jordan was like 5'10", 5'11".

01:15:17.000 He was a crazy athlete. 0.64

01:15:18.000 But he was a crazy athlete. 0.79

01:15:20.000 He would do backflips after all of his wins and knockouts and stuff.

01:15:24.000 Did he stop Derrick Lewis with a hook kick?

01:15:25.000 After he stopped me in the first round, he stopped Derrick Lewis with a hook kick.

01:15:29.000 Yeah, that dude was a freak athlete.

01:15:30.000 That was his next fight because I was watching.

01:15:31.000 I was like, let's see how this guy goes.

01:15:33.000 Because I'll be watching.

01:15:34.000 Let's see how guys do after we meet in the octagon.

01:15:36.000 Win or lose.

01:15:36.000 He was a freak athlete.

01:15:38.000 He was.

01:15:39.000 He holds a, I think it's a bench press or a squat or deadlift record.

01:15:43.000 Something crazy like that.

01:15:45.000 At LSU. And he played for LSU. I think it was a fullback for them when they, when the Tigers won, when they won a championship way back when.

01:15:52.000 When you see a dude who's built like the Hulk and he does a backflip, you're like, what the fuck, man? 0.99

01:15:57.000 Yeah, yeah. 0.99

01:15:58.000 He's built like a tank.

01:15:59.000 He's built like a tank.

01:16:01.000 Like the Hulk.

01:16:02.000 For real. 1.00

01:16:03.000 When you see that guy do a backflip, you're like, that's a fucking athlete. 0.99

01:16:05.000 That's a lot of weight to throw around. 0.99

01:16:08.000 So yeah, he knocked me out in the first round.

01:16:11.000 TKO. He didn't knock me out.

01:16:12.000 It was a TKO. Did you already know at that time you were going to go down at least to light heavyweight?

01:16:20.000 Not at that time.

01:16:21.000 You thought you were going to fight as a heavyweight?

01:16:22.000 I thought I was going to win this fight and make millions of dollars and quit my job.

01:16:28.000 I could just fight and train now.

01:16:30.000 That wasn't the reality of it.

01:16:33.000 I lost the fight and went back to Alaska.

01:16:36.000 That was early 2015, so I spent another two years up there doing my career.

01:16:42.000 I fought again in heavyweight.

01:16:43.000 I'm sorry, let me get on this mic.

01:16:44.000 I fought again in heavyweight and won that one.

01:16:47.000 That's the fight I won in Croatia.

01:16:48.000 That was my last fight in heavyweight.

01:16:50.000 And interestingly enough, on that fight, that fight in Croatia, there was like four or five other heavyweights on that card.

01:16:56.000 And all those heavyweights are the guys who look at it and say, oh, that dude, that's the man.

01:17:01.000 You know what I mean?

01:17:02.000 It was Francis Ngannou.

01:17:04.000 Everybody knows him.

01:17:06.000 And Curtis Blades was on that card.

01:17:08.000 It was Derrick Lewis and Gabriel Gonzaga.

01:17:13.000 Ben Rothwell, he fought.

01:17:16.000 Who did Ben Rothwell fight?

01:17:19.000 Did he fight Junior Dos Santos?

01:17:21.000 I think he fought Junior Dos Santos.

01:17:23.000 But those are just three behemoths, four, six behemoths of men.

01:17:29.000 Yeah.

01:17:30.000 Jan Blachowicz was on that card?

01:17:32.000 I didn't even know that.

01:17:32.000 Oh, Timothy Johnson, Martin Tabora.

01:17:39.000 Yeah.

01:17:41.000 Interesting.

01:17:41.000 So all these big dudes was on this card, and I'm, you know, standing next to him, walking next to him, and I, you know, I went by knockout in the first round, so I'm a big dog too, you know what I mean?

01:17:53.000 But...

01:17:53.000 You started thinking...

01:17:54.000 I started thinking, not that I was afraid of any of these fools, but for the sake of my career, if I wanted to be able to compete and give myself... 0.88

01:18:02.000 As best a chance as possible to make this career work. 0.91

01:18:05.000 Right.

01:18:05.000 When I see guys like Jon Jones and...

01:18:07.000 Francis Ngannou.

01:18:08.000 Francis Ngannou.

01:18:09.000 It was Cain Velasquez at the time, you know what I mean?

01:18:13.000 Right.

01:18:13.000 Who I was getting prepared for.

01:18:15.000 That's a guy, when I did my training, coming up, I was looking at him.

01:18:18.000 I gotta get ready for that guy.

01:18:20.000 That guy had cardio.

01:18:23.000 That's another aspect of my training right there.

01:18:25.000 Cardio Cain, that's what they call him.

01:18:26.000 So that's why my conditioning is...

01:18:29.000 Where it is now, because that's one thing I focused on early on in my career.

01:18:32.000 So huge.

01:18:33.000 Yeah.

01:18:34.000 It's so huge.

01:18:35.000 Having a giant gas tank.

01:18:36.000 Oh yeah.

01:18:37.000 That's the last place you want to be.

01:18:38.000 I always talk about primetime BJ Penn.

01:18:40.000 When BJ Penn was at his best, he was training with Marv Marinovich.

01:18:44.000 And Marv Marinovich, I don't want to paraphrase, I don't want to fuck this up, but I'm pretty sure their philosophy was it's more important for strength and conditioning for an elite fighter than even fight training.

01:18:53.000 Yeah, sure.

01:18:54.000 It's water and there's filtered water in that too.

01:18:57.000 So their philosophy was they would get BJ to have the most insane gas tank.

01:19:02.000 He already knows how to fight.

01:19:03.000 They're like, just do your drills or whatever you want to do, but the most important part of your day is plyometrics.

01:19:08.000 We're going to give you the most insane ability.

01:19:11.000 So you do eight weeks of this, by the time that fight comes, you'll be a totally different kind of human.

01:19:17.000 With a crazy gas tank.

01:19:19.000 Crazy ability to change distances, to change positions, move back and forth. 1.00

01:19:23.000 All the plyometric shit they did and box jumping shit. 0.99

01:19:26.000 That was like all the work they did. 0.98

01:19:27.000 Everything was like high intensity Tabatas and all these different endurance work and all these different things they would do for explosivity and strength and conditioning that's just purely for like your ability to just generate fast twitch muscle fibers and throw them into action for fighting.

01:19:44.000 And he was a beast during that time man.

01:19:47.000 I dare say he was training with one of my training partners, Rob Emerson.

01:19:52.000 Yes.

01:19:53.000 Because Rob Emerson has brought a whole bunch of good stuff he did working with BJ and his team.

01:19:59.000 Yeah.

01:19:59.000 He's brought it over.

01:20:00.000 He always has us doing explosive stuff, you know what I mean?

01:20:03.000 It's always plyometric oriented type stuff with him.

01:20:08.000 It's fascinating stuff, man.

01:20:10.000 It's fascinating stuff because there's so many different philosophies.

01:20:12.000 And then George St. Pierre, when he was at his best, he didn't do any strength and conditioning.

01:20:16.000 No.

01:20:17.000 He said he just wanted to work on efficiency and fight training.

01:20:19.000 So he was just constantly training fight specific stuff.

01:20:22.000 He didn't do any of the gymnastics stuff either?

01:20:24.000 When he got to a certain point in his career, he was incorporating gymnastics at one point in time. 0.95

01:20:30.000 But I think towards the end, maybe he did a little bit of that still, but I think towards the end when we had this conversation on the podcast, he was saying that he doesn't do any of the shit that he did when he first started out. 0.92

01:20:39.000 He was doing like box jumps and all this crazy shit and cleans and presses. 0.99

01:20:44.000 Traditional shit. 1.00

01:20:44.000 Traditional shit that you see I've seen the countdown show. 1.00

01:20:46.000 It gets excited. 0.99

01:20:47.000 It gets you hyped up.

01:20:48.000 But he stopped doing that.

01:20:49.000 And he was just concentrating on efficiency.

01:20:51.000 So it was just all technique.

01:20:54.000 Well, that makes perfect sense, especially when you become a person like GSP. You know what I mean?

01:20:59.000 Yeah, but I'm saying there's two totally different schools of thought there, right?

01:21:02.000 There's the BJ Penn School of Thought under Marvin Marinovich, where it's all strength and conditioning.

01:21:07.000 You already know how to fight.

01:21:08.000 Just get yourself to this insane gas tank. 0.99

01:21:10.000 And then there's the George St. Pierre, where it's all fight-specific stuff.

01:21:13.000 You're fight-drilling wrestling, fight-drilling takedowns, fight-drilling jujitsu, fight-drilling stand-up.

01:21:19.000 Everything's fight.

01:21:19.000 Fight, fight, fight.

01:21:20.000 Technique.

01:21:21.000 Well, I guess that approach can be attributed to the person, right?

01:21:25.000 Right.

01:21:25.000 GSP is more of the martial artist.

01:21:27.000 You know what I mean?

01:21:29.000 More of the traditional martial artist.

01:21:31.000 You're right.

01:21:31.000 Yeah, BJ's a real martial artist, too.

01:21:33.000 But he's a jiu-jitsu guy, though, right?

01:21:35.000 Yeah.

01:21:35.000 Jiu-jitsu martial artists are different from traditional karate martial artists.

01:21:39.000 That's true.

01:21:40.000 You know what I mean?

01:21:40.000 Sure.

01:21:40.000 So, I would say...

01:21:44.000 That could be attributed to their training style.

01:21:47.000 I would say BJ Penn, you know, he's from Hawaii.

01:21:50.000 I think you got some dogs out there, you know what I mean?

01:21:52.000 So I would say he's got more of a dog in him than BJ would carry around, than GSP would carry around.

01:21:59.000 I'm not saying GSP got a dog in him.

01:22:01.000 Ain't got it in them.

01:22:02.000 I know what you're saying.

01:22:03.000 Like, BJ will fight you in the street.

01:22:04.000 Yes.

01:22:05.000 Exactly.

01:22:06.000 You know what I'm saying.

01:22:06.000 Yes.

01:22:07.000 Exactly.

01:22:08.000 I think that could be attributed to the character of the person doing the work and the coaches and the corner men around you and stuff like that, so...

01:22:17.000 I mean, it's also, the gas tank wouldn't do any good if BJ didn't have spectacular technique already.

01:22:23.000 Right.

01:22:23.000 That's the thing.

01:22:23.000 No, you're absolutely right about that.

01:22:24.000 He had spectacular technique.

01:22:25.000 Yeah.

01:22:26.000 He was only one of the first jiu-jitsu guys who was striking. 0.99

01:22:30.000 It was like fucking world class. 0.97

01:22:32.000 If he got you to the ground, he kind of won the Mundial's three years into jiu-jitsu. 0.99

01:22:37.000 Huh.

01:22:38.000 That's nuts!

01:22:39.000 The what now?

01:22:39.000 The Mundials, the World Championships.

01:22:41.000 BJ won the World Championships three years in his jiu-jitsu.

01:22:44.000 Three years consecutively.

01:22:46.000 Yeah.

01:22:46.000 He got his black belt in three years, entered the Mundials, and won.

01:22:50.000 Three years in.

01:22:51.000 Okay.

01:22:52.000 Obsessed, training every day.

01:22:53.000 Oh, and doing jiu-jitsu.

01:22:54.000 Three years in.

01:22:55.000 Oh, okay.

01:22:55.000 So he's a white belt, and then three years later, he's a black belt, and he wins Mundials.

01:23:00.000 Okay.

01:23:01.000 That's how talented BJ Penn was.

01:23:03.000 BJ Penn was a phenom.

01:23:05.000 He was a phenom. 1.00

01:23:07.000 Damn. 0.99

01:23:07.000 I just got my brown belt after being a purple belt for like seven years. 0.99

01:23:11.000 I was a brown belt for eight years.

01:23:13.000 Eight years?

01:23:14.000 Eight years.

01:23:14.000 Yeah.

01:23:16.000 I wasn't consistent enough.

01:23:20.000 Yeah.

01:23:21.000 God, I wish they could just fix injuries.

01:23:23.000 All of them.

01:23:23.000 So you'd never have to worry about them again.

01:23:25.000 Like 100% just fucking... 1.00

01:23:27.000 I would do jiu-jitsu till I died. 1.00

01:23:30.000 I'd be like Elio Gracie on those mats.

01:23:32.000 Oh, man.

01:23:33.000 That dude was rolling when he was in his 90s.

01:23:35.000 That's my plan, man.

01:23:37.000 Yeah.

01:23:37.000 I mean, everybody talks about, you're 30 years old, 39 years old.

01:23:41.000 First of all, I said I'm level 39. I'm a level 39 Jack Cannon.

01:23:47.000 I'm a level 39 killer gorilla.

01:23:48.000 I'm a level 39 badass.

01:23:50.000 So, first and foremost, I'm a level 39. 39 years of experience in life.

01:23:56.000 Yeah, exactly.

01:23:57.000 And when I see myself as 60, 65, I see myself big, chiseled, jacked, Gray beard, gray afro with a battle axe in one hand.

01:24:10.000 You know what I mean? 0.98

01:24:11.000 Ready to fuck up anybody who's finna step foot. 0.99

01:24:14.000 You know what I mean? 0.99

01:24:14.000 Who's finna cross that threshold. 0.99

01:24:17.000 That's how I envision myself.

01:24:20.000 I don't see 39 the same way as most people see 39. You know what I mean?

01:24:24.000 I do know what you mean.

01:24:25.000 I want to be...

01:24:27.000 120-something years old, you know what I mean?

01:24:29.000 Finally getting on the dance floor, because I don't dance now.

01:24:32.000 But it'll be something new when I'm old.

01:24:34.000 It's interesting, elite athletes that are able to compete at a higher age, they almost all have one thing in common.

01:24:43.000 Extreme discipline.

01:24:44.000 Like Bernard Hopkins.

01:24:46.000 One of the most disciplined guys ever in boxing.

01:24:48.000 Never got out of shape.

01:24:50.000 Never ate bad.

01:24:51.000 Always ate clean.

01:24:52.000 Always ate organic.

01:24:53.000 Never drank.

01:24:54.000 Never smoked. 0.58

01:24:55.000 Never fucked around. 0.96

01:24:56.000 Never fucked around. 0.96

01:24:57.000 And competed deep, deep into his 40s at a world-class level. 0.94

01:25:02.000 I think he beat his last world champion when he was, I think he was 50. 50. Crazy.

01:25:10.000 Crazy. 0.94

01:25:11.000 He competed at 51 and then he lost, right? 0.67

01:25:13.000 Yeah.

01:25:13.000 Joe Smith Jr. knocked him out.

01:25:15.000 Yeah.

01:25:15.000 Knocked him out of the ring.

01:25:16.000 It was horrible.

01:25:17.000 Out of the ring, yeah.

01:25:17.000 Horrible because he fell on his head.

01:25:18.000 He fell right on his head.

01:25:19.000 Yeah, that was horrible.

01:25:20.000 That's so bad for you.

01:25:22.000 Yeah.

01:25:22.000 That's worse even than the knockout because a lot of the...

01:25:25.000 I mean, he was getting clipped but the ropes were loose and he just went right through the ropes. 0.99

01:25:29.000 It was a shitty job by whoever put together that fucking ring for a... 0.99

01:25:33.000 A world championship fight with a guy like Bernard Hopkins and to go through the ropes like that, and to not have any protection for the athletes below the ropes, just concrete. 0.99

01:25:42.000 That's crazy.

01:25:43.000 That's crazy.

01:25:45.000 At the very least, they should have wrestling mats all around the base in case of the worst case scenario.

01:25:52.000 Someone falls out of the ring.

01:25:53.000 Yeah.

01:25:55.000 Man, it's funny you mention that.

01:25:56.000 I would like them to have wrestling mats inside the ring. 0.89

01:25:59.000 You think that would be better than the canvas?

01:26:01.000 Yeah, I don't like the canvas.

01:26:02.000 The canvas gets slippery, especially when they put the logos on it.

01:26:05.000 You're right.

01:26:08.000 Last fight I didn't slip.

01:26:09.000 I had a pretty good foot in my last fight, but I had made some adjustments.

01:26:12.000 But when I fought Strickland and when I fought out of Sonya, it was a few times when I was slipping and I was getting ready to go.

01:26:18.000 And it's the logos, because they get wet.

01:26:19.000 It was the logo I slipped on, but even the canvas in itself.

01:26:23.000 Right, you have to wet it and then step on your feet.

01:26:25.000 Yeah.

01:26:26.000 Why do you think they continue to use canvas?

01:26:29.000 Because canvas also fucks your skin up.

01:26:30.000 I would say because of the logos.

01:26:31.000 I would say so they can have logos on it.

01:26:33.000 But can't you do logos on MMA mats?

01:26:36.000 I don't think they will come off a whole lot easier due to friction.

01:26:40.000 Imagine if they had...

01:26:44.000 You want to have no seams though, right?

01:26:48.000 You can't have a seam.

01:26:50.000 I mean, there are seams on the canvas.

01:26:54.000 Yeah, there's so seams.

01:26:55.000 There's like a seam every, what, two, two and a half, three feet, there's a seam.

01:26:58.000 But you can't have like tatami mats where they're like stuck together.

01:27:01.000 You can't have the possibility of a toe getting in a crack.

01:27:04.000 No.

01:27:04.000 That's why I was thinking like a wrestling mat.

01:27:07.000 Right.

01:27:08.000 Maybe not as thick as those thick ones.

01:27:10.000 Right, but not the surface of a wrestling mat because they're wearing shoes.

01:27:14.000 You want the surface of like tatami mats where you have that texture to it so you can dig in.

01:27:19.000 Because I remember we switched to a smooth mat at one time in my gym, my old studio, and I couldn't use it.

01:27:26.000 Because as soon as I got sweaty, every time I went to throw a kick, I'm slipping all over the place.

01:27:30.000 I'm like, this sucks.

01:27:31.000 And that's another reason why they use the canvas. 0.93

01:27:34.000 Because it's absorbent.

01:27:35.000 Right.

01:27:35.000 It does absorb.

01:27:36.000 But if your feet are dry, it's real slippery.

01:27:39.000 And if they do get the logos, the logos, I don't know how they apply them.

01:27:43.000 But if they're just like... 0.99

01:27:45.000 What's that shit when you do with the iron? 1.00

01:27:47.000 What's that called, Jamie? 1.00

01:27:49.000 Do you know what I'm talking about?

01:27:50.000 Like a heat transfer.

01:27:51.000 What is it called, though?

01:27:52.000 They used to iron on?

01:27:53.000 Yeah, heat transfer.

01:27:54.000 So if you get a cheap t-shirt from someone and it's real thick, this is a nice t-shirt.

01:28:00.000 There's not so much material that it's thick.

01:28:03.000 If you have that on a canvas where it's real thick, water's not going to go through there.

01:28:08.000 It's going to puddle up on that.

01:28:09.000 Right.

01:28:09.000 This is going to be right on top of it.

01:28:11.000 If you lose a fight or get an injury, just specifically because of that, that's a shame.

01:28:16.000 That's a shame.

01:28:17.000 It feels like, to me, there's a better way. 0.95

01:28:20.000 I mean, how many people are buying something because they see someone get the fuck beaten up on top of it? 0.96

01:28:26.000 Yeah. 0.70

01:28:27.000 I've seen those, right?

01:28:28.000 They got those cards that have pieces of the match in them to commemorate the event.

01:28:34.000 That makes sense, actually, if you're a big fan.

01:28:36.000 And also, it does make sense that people find out about products.

01:28:40.000 I just wish there was a way to do it where it didn't fuck with the performance.

01:28:44.000 Speaking of shirts...

01:28:46.000 You got Jared Cannoneer merch?

01:28:48.000 Yes.

01:28:48.000 Nice.

01:28:49.000 I was gonna give it to you for one of my fights, but I don't think...

01:28:53.000 That's a perfect example.

01:28:54.000 Like, do you see how shiny that is?

01:28:56.000 There's no way water's getting through that.

01:28:58.000 Right.

01:28:58.000 If that was on a canvas, that would suck.

01:29:00.000 It would definitely...

01:29:01.000 But how do they do it on a canvas?

01:29:02.000 I would imagine they've thought about this.

01:29:04.000 So I'm sure this one was, like, they put, like, a press on it with this one.

01:29:08.000 Right.

01:29:08.000 If the canvas, they just do dye.

01:29:10.000 Yeah.

01:29:11.000 Can't they just do it with dye? 0.54

01:29:12.000 Yeah.

01:29:13.000 Let me give my shout-out in real quick.

01:29:14.000 Go ahead.

01:29:14.000 Sorry.

01:29:15.000 Shout-out to Nelson for hooking me up.

01:29:16.000 He hooked me up with the artwork for this shirt, right?

01:29:19.000 And I put it on the shirt, so I really like this one.

01:29:21.000 And what's the website where people can buy these?

01:29:25.000 Thank you very much.

01:29:27.000 You don't know?

01:29:28.000 I don't know.

01:29:30.000 It's a link in my bio.

01:29:32.000 Do you have a personal website?

01:29:33.000 It's a link in my bio and it links it to a square.

01:29:37.000 There you go.

01:29:38.000 Killer Gorilla.

01:29:38.000 Merchandise.

01:29:39.000 Okay.

01:29:40.000 Beautiful.

01:29:41.000 Okay.

01:29:41.000 It's in your Instagram.

01:29:42.000 There you go.

01:29:43.000 Bam.

01:29:44.000 Nice.

01:29:45.000 This one is not on sale yet, right?

01:29:48.000 When's it going to be on sale?

01:29:49.000 Huh?

01:29:49.000 When's it going to be on sale?

01:29:51.000 Probably soon after this podcast releases.

01:29:53.000 All right.

01:29:53.000 Good.

01:29:54.000 Let it go.

01:29:55.000 But yes, I have my homeboy.

01:29:57.000 You're wearing it.

01:29:57.000 You can just show me what's on your shirt.

01:29:59.000 Oh, there it is.

01:30:00.000 Yeah.

01:30:00.000 So I'm giving you this one.

01:30:01.000 Oh, thank you very much.

01:30:02.000 Thank you.

01:30:03.000 And this one's actually a little bit different.

01:30:04.000 It's not as thick.

01:30:06.000 No, it's not.

01:30:07.000 The thing on top isn't as thick as that one.

01:30:08.000 Yeah, it's printed differently.

01:30:09.000 Well, the other one's like a graphic image.

01:30:11.000 Yeah.

01:30:11.000 But this one is exactly what I'm talking about.

01:30:14.000 Yeah.

01:30:14.000 This kind of stuff.

01:30:15.000 If sweat hits this and you have to move your feet around on it, you've got to slide all over.

01:30:19.000 Absolutely.

01:30:20.000 Yeah.

01:30:20.000 Did you ever compete in the crazy days where people were allowed to wear wrestling shoes?

01:30:25.000 Was that all phased out by the time you were in?

01:30:27.000 No.

01:30:27.000 My first fight was in 2011. Ah, there you go.

01:30:30.000 So I was way out of that.

01:30:31.000 I remember when dudes wore wrestling shoes all the time.

01:30:34.000 Yeah.

01:30:35.000 I mean, there were some venues, I'm sure, right?

01:30:37.000 Some local promotion that...

01:30:38.000 I wonder.

01:30:39.000 ...that ain't gonna, like, strictly adhere to...

01:30:44.000 UFC's standard of martial arts, right?

01:30:45.000 That seems so dangerous, though.

01:30:47.000 Wrestling shoes, like a head kick with wrestling shoes.

01:30:49.000 Like, if the foot goes in the eye, it's kind of a weapon.

01:30:52.000 Or submissions.

01:30:52.000 Yeah?

01:30:53.000 Oh, yeah. 0.99

01:30:53.000 Submissions, especially heel hooks and shit. 0.99

01:30:55.000 Yep. 0.99

01:30:55.000 For the person who's wearing them. 0.99

01:30:56.000 Or wrestling.

01:30:57.000 That's a huge...

01:30:59.000 Huge factor.

01:31:00.000 Yeah, a huge factor.

01:31:00.000 Huge factor.

01:31:01.000 That grip and traction.

01:31:02.000 Mm-hmm.

01:31:03.000 Yeah, that's gigantic.

01:31:03.000 Both in defense and offense.

01:31:05.000 Yep.

01:31:05.000 Imagine somebody wearing wrestling shoes against DC, right?

01:31:08.000 Right.

01:31:09.000 Or Khabib. 1.00

01:31:09.000 They're getting taken down. 1.00

01:31:10.000 Yeah.

01:31:11.000 Right off the top.

01:31:11.000 It's also the thing about generating power in punches.

01:31:14.000 Like, you get more traction.

01:31:16.000 They grip, yeah.

01:31:16.000 Yeah, you're really digging in with your feet.

01:31:18.000 Now, I've injured my toes naturally from kicks or whatever.

01:31:22.000 And I've had to wear wrestling shoes for training.

01:31:25.000 Now, one thing wearing wrestling shoes for me has done is helped...

01:31:31.000 Sort of increase, make better, enhance my footwork, right?

01:31:39.000 It makes me be more cognizant of how I'm placing my feet as opposed to dragging my feet across the mat or the surface of whatever surface I'm moving on.

01:31:48.000 Oh, because there's traction in the bottom of it?

01:31:50.000 Yeah.

01:31:50.000 So you can't slide as easily?

01:31:51.000 Exactly.

01:31:52.000 Interesting.

01:31:52.000 So it's...

01:31:54.000 So I have to use precise footwork, precise foot placement.

01:31:58.000 And I actually use that as a teaching technique.

01:32:01.000 I teach a class at the lab Saturdays at 10 p.m.

01:32:05.000 at the MMA lab.

01:32:07.000 And that's one of the things in an analogy that I use was imagine anybody who's seen the Kung Fu Panda movie or any old Kung Fu movie where they have those training setups where there's a bunch of logs standing on in and they just have like that small two, three inch surface, round surface to stand on, to move around on and do all these Kung round surface to stand on, to move around on and do all these Kung Fu training and Kung Fu Panda is the one that comes to mind big time for me.

01:32:32.000 But that would facilitate precise foot placement, precise footwork.

01:32:37.000 You have to place your foot in a precise position and of course maneuver your body in accordance.

01:32:43.000 But it all starts with the feet.

01:32:46.000 So that's one thing that's a huge thing that I ingrained in myself is footwork.

01:32:54.000 Where are you taking the footwork from specifically?

01:32:58.000 Where are you learning from?

01:32:59.000 Self-talk.

01:33:00.000 Self-talk?

01:33:01.000 Educated.

01:33:02.000 Just what you like.

01:33:03.000 Things that work for you when you're sparring and fighting.

01:33:06.000 Things that I find that I can find that are accessible for me.

01:33:11.000 You know what I mean?

01:33:12.000 Things that I know work.

01:33:13.000 I watch.

01:33:14.000 For me, I'm like Rogue.

01:33:15.000 You know what I mean?

01:33:16.000 Rogue from the X-Men.

01:33:17.000 I see something.

01:33:18.000 And you imitate it.

01:33:19.000 And I can imitate it.

01:33:20.000 You know what I mean?

01:33:21.000 Or like Kakashi.

01:33:22.000 Yeah.

01:33:23.000 I'm an anime guy too.

01:33:24.000 There you go. 1.00

01:33:24.000 I'll see something and I can do that shit. 1.00

01:33:26.000 Do you know how much it bums out some dudes that killers are anime nerds? 1.00

01:33:30.000 Yeah.

01:33:31.000 Well, you know, those guys are missing out, right?

01:33:34.000 They're missing out if you enjoy it.

01:33:35.000 I wouldn't say I'm an anime nerd because there's a lot of anime that I don't watch and I can't watch.

01:33:41.000 Speaking of footwork, did you watch the Terrence Crawford-Earl Spence Jr. fight?

01:33:46.000 Yes, I did.

01:33:48.000 Yes, I did.

01:33:48.000 And I just saw so many different levels.

01:33:52.000 In both fighters, but mostly in Terence Crawford.

01:33:55.000 I saw him change his tempo, change his approach to the fight.

01:34:01.000 You know what I mean?

01:34:01.000 Make those adjustments.

01:34:03.000 And the ability to land hard shots in so tight.

01:34:06.000 In tight. 0.55

01:34:07.000 Crazy.

01:34:08.000 Really tight positions.

01:34:09.000 And so accurate.

01:34:10.000 Just inches away from him, and he's landing these right hooks. 0.83

01:34:14.000 Oh my god, what a performance.

01:34:16.000 Yeah.

01:34:16.000 What a performance.

01:34:17.000 It was beautiful.

01:34:18.000 Amazing.

01:34:19.000 We see it there.

01:34:21.000 It was one of the knockdowns.

01:34:24.000 Yeah, boxing is one of the sports that I continue to watch after getting into MMA. And a lot of people, for whatever reason, are sort of trying to come up with reasons why Earl Spence didn't perform as well as they thought he was going to.

01:34:39.000 But I think you just have to say Terence Crawford is that good.

01:34:44.000 I think he's just that good.

01:34:46.000 And I think we found it.

01:34:48.000 It doesn't mean that Errol Spence isn't amazing.

01:34:49.000 He is.

01:34:50.000 But I think Terence Crawford, I think you're looking at an all-time great.

01:34:54.000 I really do.

01:34:56.000 He's, in my opinion, the best switch hitter in boxing since Marvin Hagler.

01:35:00.000 And he might be better.

01:35:01.000 He's so good, man.

01:35:03.000 He's so good.

01:35:05.000 He's so good.

01:35:08.000 I think Boots Ennis is his mandatory.

01:35:11.000 Oh, really?

01:35:12.000 Yeah, which is an amazing fight.

01:35:14.000 That's an amazing fight.

01:35:16.000 See, pull up some Boots Ennis because this dude's movement is next level.

01:35:22.000 And he's another one that is a brilliant switch hitter.

01:35:28.000 Yes, Jerron Boots Ennis.

01:35:31.000 They have to fight him soon if he plans on keeping the title.

01:35:33.000 Go to a video of Boots Ennis because that dude, yeah, highlights.

01:35:40.000 That dude is phenomenal.

01:35:42.000 He's fantastic.

01:35:43.000 When you watch him fight, man, he's so precise and so slick.

01:35:52.000 He's really, really good.

01:35:54.000 And he's also undefeated.

01:35:55.000 I mean, come on, son.

01:35:57.000 This dude...

01:35:58.000 And this is, you know, early on in his career.

01:36:04.000 I mean, from the moment people first started seeing this guy fight, they're like, this guy is super talented.

01:36:11.000 Something special.

01:36:12.000 You know, and so that's a big test, man.

01:36:15.000 This guy's good.

01:36:16.000 like world championship good dude I mean is he ready for Terrence Crawford or I don't know.

01:36:28.000 We're gonna find out.

01:36:30.000 And it's gonna be interesting.

01:36:31.000 Go like a little further up ahead in his highlights.

01:36:34.000 I mean, look at that movement, man.

01:36:36.000 Look at that.

01:36:37.000 Oh, play that again.

01:36:38.000 Play that again.

01:36:39.000 Come on, son.

01:36:40.000 Look at this.

01:36:44.000 I mean, that head movement is a thing of beauty.

01:36:49.000 And to do that while you're wearing shorts like that?

01:36:51.000 Yeah.

01:36:52.000 You know Duke feeling himself.

01:36:53.000 He wears shorts like that, fighting like that, too.

01:36:55.000 Look at that right hand.

01:36:56.000 He just landed.

01:36:57.000 Oh, my goodness.

01:36:59.000 Oh, my goodness.

01:37:01.000 So talented.

01:37:03.000 Yeah.

01:37:07.000 So that's interesting.

01:37:08.000 That's very interesting.

01:37:09.000 Yeah.

01:37:10.000 I like watching guys like this, you know?

01:37:12.000 Because I pick up so much just from watching fights like these.

01:37:16.000 Yeah.

01:37:17.000 And I'll watch a fight, and I'll go back and watch a round, like three, four times. 0.97

01:37:22.000 I'll watch a certain part of the round, like, damn, you see that technique? 0.95

01:37:25.000 And then I'll go back and watch the whole round. 0.95

01:37:27.000 And then I'll maybe watch the round...

01:37:29.000 In front of that to see if there was something like a tail that the fighter may have seen.

01:37:35.000 Do you watch all kinds of things?

01:37:37.000 Do you watch kickboxing?

01:37:40.000 Do you watch other MMA organizations?

01:37:42.000 Anything combat related.

01:37:43.000 You know what I mean?

01:37:44.000 It can even be, you know, I wouldn't say the gimmicky stuff, but...

01:37:50.000 The less conventional MMA stuff.

01:37:52.000 You feel me?

01:37:53.000 Like what kind of stuff?

01:37:54.000 Like Capoeira.

01:37:56.000 You know what I mean?

01:37:57.000 I study Capoeira.

01:37:58.000 And I have a few what I call my $50,000 moves that are Capoeira based.

01:38:03.000 That's funny.

01:38:05.000 Fight night bonus.

01:38:06.000 Exactly.

01:38:06.000 If I break them out in a fight, if I land, you know what I mean?

01:38:10.000 These moves are pretty much finishing moves.

01:38:13.000 You know what I mean?

01:38:14.000 If I land this in a fight, I'm pretty much going to guarantee a bonus.

01:38:19.000 So, Capoeira's a risky martial art, though.

01:38:24.000 But it can work.

01:38:25.000 Oh, absolutely.

01:38:26.000 I've seen it work.

01:38:27.000 How about that Sanchai cartwheel kick? 1.00

01:38:31.000 That shit works. 1.00

01:38:32.000 He pulls that off all the time on people. 1.00

01:38:34.000 He kicks people in the face with that.

01:38:38.000 It's unorthodox stuff sometimes you don't see coming. 0.97

01:38:41.000 It can work.

01:38:42.000 And that's a lot of force behind those kicks.

01:38:45.000 And I would also imagine that learning capoeira would be just like when George Chapier got really into gymnastics.

01:38:50.000 It would help your athleticism.

01:38:52.000 Yeah, I've made that same correlation.

01:38:54.000 So yeah, it really does.

01:38:56.000 Yeah, it makes sense.

01:38:57.000 Just like yoga does.

01:38:59.000 Just like anything that's requiring you to flip your body around like that and throw kicks into the air.

01:39:03.000 That's got to be good for everything.

01:39:05.000 Or just be able to hold your weight up on the ground and stuff like that.

01:39:09.000 Yeah.

01:39:09.000 So are you in kind of like a holding pattern right now just to see what happens with Australia, whether or not they signed Strickland?

01:39:18.000 Have they contacted you and said, hey, Jared?

01:39:21.000 Nobody said anything to me.

01:39:23.000 Maybe after this podcast.

01:39:25.000 I would hope so.

01:39:27.000 It's good timing.

01:39:28.000 I would hope so, right?

01:39:30.000 Like I told them, I'm here.

01:39:31.000 I'm waiting.

01:39:32.000 I'm ready.

01:39:32.000 Well, I personally hope that they...

01:39:36.000 This Strickland thing gets worked out because I think that's an interesting fight and I would like to see you fight whoever wins that fight.

01:39:44.000 And I think that you're right in line, man.

01:39:47.000 It's a it's a real fun time for the division.

01:39:50.000 There's so much talent in that division Yeah, with Trekkas Duplicy just beating Robert Whitaker like that and Whitaker was always the guy that was like right below Adesanya and like creeping up on him.

01:39:59.000 Yeah, like in the last fight he got closer Like it was a unanimous decision loss, but he had his moments in that fight It was a much much much better performance in his first fight where he got taken out quick Yeah, so you everybody was thinking that that's the guy now you watch Trekkas Duplicy beat him down You're like wow Yeah, it's gonna open some eyes.

01:40:17.000 Definitely bring a lot of attention.

01:40:19.000 A lot more attention back to the middleweight division after what he did that was a couple weeks ago.

01:40:25.000 Mm-hmm.

01:40:25.000 There's just so much talent now.

01:40:28.000 So much talent in the sport.

01:40:29.000 There's these guys that are just jumping in that are UFC debuts and you're watching a fight.

01:40:34.000 That guy looks like a world-class contender.

01:40:35.000 Yeah.

01:40:36.000 See, when I see stuff like that, right?

01:40:39.000 I'm like, yes, they look good, especially in the first round, right?

01:40:42.000 Don't we all look good in the first round?

01:40:44.000 Right.

01:40:44.000 So, yeah.

01:40:48.000 And on top of that, I think having your fighting debut fights is completely different from fighting top five, top ten fighters, you know what I mean?

01:40:57.000 Yeah, of course.

01:40:58.000 So, those, like even with, there's so many different examples.

01:41:04.000 Johnny Walker is a big example.

01:41:05.000 He came in Wild, blazing, guns are blazing.

01:41:08.000 He was successful until he got to that top level and realized, hey, let me settle down a little bit.

01:41:14.000 These men are older up here.

01:41:15.000 These are some grown men up here.

01:41:16.000 You can't just come wild.

01:41:18.000 No.

01:41:18.000 It might work.

01:41:19.000 It might work.

01:41:20.000 Yeah.

01:41:20.000 I mean, it works on a lot of people.

01:41:22.000 Yeah, but you can't...

01:41:23.000 It doesn't always work.

01:41:24.000 But at the top level, you can't take those risks.

01:41:26.000 You don't want to be taking...

01:41:29.000 Those type of risks.

01:41:30.000 You want to take risks.

01:41:31.000 Yeah.

01:41:32.000 But those type of risks are sort of...

01:41:34.000 You don't have to take that type of risk.

01:41:36.000 You know what I mean?

01:41:36.000 The thing is, in that flashy style where he's taking those risks, occasionally he has the most insane knockouts.

01:41:45.000 Because the guy generates crazy power.

01:41:47.000 Yeah.

01:41:48.000 That Khalil Rountree knockout, that elbow from In Tight, another vote for elbows there.

01:41:54.000 Yeah.

01:41:54.000 Because that was insane.

01:41:56.000 That was nasty.

01:41:56.000 His power is great.

01:42:02.000 Which was his last fight? 1.00

01:42:04.000 Fuck. 1.00

01:42:08.000 Who did he just fight? 1.00

01:42:09.000 God damn it. 0.99

01:42:10.000 It's at the tip of my tongue. 1.00

01:42:11.000 Fuck. 1.00

01:42:16.000 I hate when this happens. 1.00

01:42:21.000 Anyway, he won by knockout.

01:42:25.000 He's so big, too.

01:42:27.000 He looks like he should be a heavyweight.

01:42:28.000 He's another guy.

01:42:29.000 He's just tall.

01:42:30.000 205. He's enormous.

01:42:32.000 And that's one of the reasons why I was like, here, man, let me go down the middleweight, too, because everybody I was fighting was like 6'4", 6'2", 6'3". 0.87

01:42:40.000 I'm like, damn, I thought... 0.63

01:42:41.000 Paul Craig. 0.98

01:42:42.000 That's who it was.

01:42:43.000 That's who it was.

01:42:44.000 Why can't I remember that?

01:42:45.000 Yeah, he was...

01:42:46.000 Paul Craig was grabbing a single.

01:42:48.000 He was beating him up, caoling him while he was holding onto his leg.

01:42:52.000 Yeah, when he started hammer fisting him, he was standing, yeah.

01:42:54.000 Crazy, he could generate that kind of power.

01:42:56.000 Yeah.

01:42:57.000 Yeah, but...

01:42:59.000 Yeah, right?

01:43:00.000 I would imagine...

01:43:00.000 A world beater right out of the gate, but what happens when he fights the more elite guys?

01:43:04.000 But I think he probably does Capoeira, right?

01:43:06.000 I would assume he moves around.

01:43:08.000 Yeah, he could do that.

01:43:09.000 I'm sure.

01:43:09.000 He's probably done it for sure.

01:43:11.000 You know?

01:43:11.000 So, I mean, he's able to generate...

01:43:13.000 That was his whole body.

01:43:14.000 He was able to generate power for that position, so...

01:43:19.000 But when you get to a level like Jamal Hill, that's not...

01:43:23.000 Yeah, you can't...

01:43:24.000 You don't want to be doing that. 1.00

01:43:25.000 Doing wild shit with that guy. 1.00

01:43:26.000 You... 1.00

01:43:27.000 If you want to take risks, I mean, by all means, do your thing, you know what I mean?

01:43:31.000 But it's not a high percentage of success.

01:43:34.000 Yes, the margin of error goes down drastically.

01:43:40.000 So that's one thing I've realized, especially after fighting...

01:43:44.000 Fighting Robert, fighting Kelvin, and Israel.

01:43:51.000 The marginal error is much finer up here.

01:43:58.000 Not only do I have to be better, but I even have to get better at getting better.

01:44:05.000 I have to think about...

01:44:12.000 I gotta just look at these techniques through a microscope, you know what I'm saying?

01:44:16.000 There's so much that goes on when you extend for a punch or when you step to move or step to fan.

01:44:23.000 There's so much of an effect that it has.

01:44:26.000 Not only on my position, but the way my opponent is going to respond and may reposition himself.

01:44:32.000 Do you write down things that you've learned?

01:44:35.000 I don't really write down things.

01:44:36.000 You just keep them in your head?

01:44:37.000 I just keep them in my head, fill it with my being, my vessel.

01:44:41.000 Sometimes, rarely though, will I write some things down.

01:44:45.000 Like if I'm in camp and I need to keep this stuff on my mind.

01:44:48.000 If it's something that I'm like, I need to just keep this on my mind.

01:44:51.000 As long as I can keep it conscious, I'll do it.

01:44:55.000 So without having my coach to tell me, this is what we got to do.

01:44:59.000 This is what we got to do.

01:45:02.000 But it's hard.

01:45:06.000 There's just not enough time to train everything.

01:45:08.000 Not enough time to get good everywhere.

01:45:11.000 Right.

01:45:11.000 Not enough time to recover from all the workouts.

01:45:13.000 Not to mention that, right?

01:45:15.000 Yeah.

01:45:16.000 Do you do anything unique for your recovery?

01:45:21.000 I am...

01:45:24.000 I do have a plunge.

01:45:27.000 Cold plunge?

01:45:28.000 Yep, I use a cold plunge.

01:45:29.000 I ice bath.

01:45:30.000 I mean, I have some salt.

01:45:33.000 I stretch.

01:45:35.000 Stretching is huge, especially post-workout.

01:45:38.000 I think that is...

01:45:41.000 One of the bigger things, one of the more prominent things that I do to help with my recovery.

01:45:47.000 I get massages, you know.

01:45:51.000 Other than that, nothing else really.

01:45:53.000 When do you do the cold?

01:45:55.000 Especially during fight camps.

01:45:58.000 Do you do it after workouts?

01:45:59.000 I would do it after workouts.

01:46:00.000 But I also know the benefits of doing it like first thing when you wake up.

01:46:04.000 You know what I mean?

01:46:08.000 I just hadn't gotten that far in my journey with this cold plunge yet.

01:46:14.000 But I definitely love using it, using it prior to this fight, and it helped me out because when I got to the PI and used the plunge there, it was very nice having the hot tub right next to the plunge so I can go out of one and into the other.

01:46:30.000 And use that one extreme to the next for some mental training.

01:46:34.000 You know what I mean?

01:46:35.000 And I felt great. 0.99

01:46:37.000 They got a bitch-ass cold plunge at the PI. You said a bitch-ass cold plunge? 1.00

01:46:40.000 It's a bitch-ass cold plunge. 1.00

01:46:42.000 What was it saying? 0.99

01:46:42.000 I think it was up to like 40. I thought it was up to like 45 or something like that. 0.99

01:46:46.000 Is it 45?

01:46:47.000 Yeah.

01:46:48.000 It felt colder than mine. 1.00

01:46:49.000 I got a bitch. 1.00

01:46:50.000 34. Well, I said my cold plunge to bitch then. 1.00

01:46:54.000 Yeah, don't do it. 0.99

01:46:55.000 Don't give in.

01:46:56.000 You want it cold.

01:46:57.000 I'm incrementing my way down.

01:46:59.000 I'm making my way down.

01:47:01.000 The thing is, once you start doing it at 34, you'll get used to it.

01:47:04.000 You will get used to it.

01:47:05.000 You'll get used to it.

01:47:06.000 Yeah.

01:47:06.000 Exactly.

01:47:07.000 And that's how I felt. 0.99

01:47:08.000 I hear about people cold plunging at 52 degrees and they're like, shut the fuck up. 0.99

01:47:12.000 Don't even... 0.99

01:47:13.000 Yeah, I'm not cold plunging.

01:47:14.000 Don't ask me what mine is.

01:47:15.000 You're lukewarm water plunging.

01:47:17.000 So what do you do yours at?

01:47:19.000 34. 34?

01:47:20.000 Yeah.

01:47:22.000 For how long? 0.99

01:47:23.000 It sucks. 0.99

01:47:23.000 Three minutes. 0.99

01:47:23.000 Just one session? 0.99

01:47:24.000 Yeah.

01:47:25.000 Well, sometimes two.

01:47:26.000 Sometimes what I'll do is I'll do it before the workout and then after the workout I'll do a sauna session and then after the sauna I'll go back in for a few minutes.

01:47:33.000 You go before your workout?

01:47:34.000 Yeah, I do it in the morning first thing.

01:47:35.000 Okay.

01:47:36.000 And then I work out.

01:47:37.000 And I use the, because I'm in the cold for so long, for three minutes and I'm freezing when I get out, I do a lot of my working out outside.

01:47:44.000 I'll do like body weight stuff, like push-ups and Okay, some plyos.

01:47:48.000 Bodyweight squats and stuff like that, pulling the sled.

01:47:50.000 I'll do that outside.

01:47:51.000 Nice. 1.00

01:47:52.000 And then I get inside and do the rest of the shit. 0.99

01:47:54.000 Okay. 0.99

01:47:55.000 But I think there's something to cooling your body down and then making your body reheat back up.

01:48:03.000 That's supposed to be real beneficial to testosterone levels.

01:48:05.000 Yeah.

01:48:06.000 And there was this, I think it's a Japanese study about that.

01:48:09.000 A lot of people have used that.

01:48:10.000 It just feels good, too.

01:48:11.000 It just wakes you up first thing in the morning.

01:48:13.000 Woo! 1.00

01:48:14.000 I get in that motherfucker and I don't want to be in there. 1.00

01:48:16.000 I'm like, God damn it! 1.00

01:48:18.000 But I think everybody should do something like that. 0.98

01:48:21.000 Just a little something like that.

01:48:22.000 Just a little something for yourself.

01:48:24.000 I think my... 0.94

01:48:26.000 Closest experience to that was in the Army, having to wake up and it's cold as shit outside, and you're freezing balls, sitting in formation, and then you start running, like, oh, finally. 0.90

01:48:36.000 At first, you're a little, you know, creakety-crackly a little bit, and then you loosen up, and you get that runner's high, or some shit like that, or you get a good drift sergeant called Canis to pump you up, motivate you, some shit like that. 0.85

01:48:48.000 Yeah, I figured all about the cold then. 0.60

01:48:51.000 Yeah, people just have to be active.

01:48:53.000 If you really think it sucks to be outside in cold weather, guess what?

01:48:57.000 Once you start hiking, you start sweating.

01:49:00.000 That's the thing if you go hunting.

01:49:02.000 One of the things about it is layering correctly.

01:49:05.000 You want to actually be a little cold while you're hiking.

01:49:08.000 Because if you're not, you're going to heat up.

01:49:10.000 You want to be a little cold.

01:49:12.000 You want to have a minimal amount of layers on.

01:49:14.000 Because if you have a lot of layers on, you have to stop, take them off, now you're wet.

01:49:18.000 Unless you're wearing merino wool or some Top-notch synthetics, it sucks bad if you're sweaty and it's cold out. 0.60

01:49:26.000 That sucks. 0.99

01:49:28.000 That's how a lot of people get really fucked up. 1.00

01:49:30.000 Oh, man. 0.97

01:49:32.000 I remember when I moved to Alaska the first time, I had to do this learn-to-return training for my job, right?

01:49:37.000 Because we would fly out to remote places and work on their traffic control equipment.

01:49:41.000 So, just in case some shit happened, it'd be like a reenactment of a Grey, with that movie Grey, with the wolves, and was it Liam Neeson that had to fight off the wolves?

01:49:51.000 Yeah. 0.96

01:49:52.000 It'd be something like that.

01:49:54.000 They'll teach you how to survive, you know what I mean?

01:49:56.000 And I was not prepared for this class, bro. 0.82

01:50:00.000 It was wintertime, so it was snow all over the damn place in Anchorage, Alaska, and they took us to some BLM land, some BLM land. 0.91

01:50:10.000 And I had on steel-toed boots, right? 0.93

01:50:12.000 You used to be wearing steel-toed boots out in the cold, right?

01:50:15.000 So that's a big no-no right there.

01:50:17.000 It gets colder because the steel gets cold?

01:50:19.000 Yeah, the steel gets cold and you'll lose toes like that. 1.00

01:50:21.000 Oh, shit. 0.99

01:50:24.000 I didn't wear layers. 1.00

01:50:26.000 I had on steel-toed boots, some jeans, a button-up Polo shirt.

01:50:34.000 Oh, no!

01:50:35.000 And a Carhartt jacket, man.

01:50:37.000 No way.

01:50:37.000 That's it.

01:50:38.000 And I think I had a beanie.

01:50:39.000 I can't remember.

01:50:39.000 I think I had a beanie on my head.

01:50:41.000 Oh, my God, dude.

01:50:41.000 But that was it, right?

01:50:43.000 And we were supposed to go out there in the middle of the wilderness to simulate a fucking plane crash. 0.99

01:50:48.000 And luckily... 0.99

01:50:51.000 I lost a shoe.

01:50:52.000 Luckily, I lost a shoe.

01:50:54.000 They taught us how to make a makeshift shoe out of an airplane seat cushion.

01:50:58.000 And the airplane seat cushion was way more comfortable than the other steel-toed boot that I didn't lose.

01:51:04.000 And it was warmer, you know what I mean?

01:51:06.000 How'd you lose a boot?

01:51:08.000 Airplane crash simulated situation.

01:51:12.000 And it was able to stay on top of the snow a lot better than my boot was.

01:51:19.000 Needless to say, I was not prepared to live in Alaska.

01:51:22.000 And it was slow going at first because I didn't have money to buy all the gear you need to live in the cold weather environment.

01:51:29.000 So I'm up there and I'm going outside, clearing snow off of my vehicle in freaking flip-flops, gym shorts, and a t-shirt.

01:51:38.000 Well, a jacket, of course, because you can have jackets.

01:51:41.000 Oh, no.

01:51:42.000 Yeah, I wasn't prepared to live up there at first.

01:51:44.000 Which part of Alaska were you in?

01:51:45.000 Anchorage.

01:51:46.000 Anchorage. 0.99

01:51:47.000 Did you see a lot of moose and bears and shit? 0.99

01:51:49.000 You did see moose. 0.99

01:51:50.000 I think I saw a bear like...

01:51:52.000 Three or four times while I was up there in town.

01:51:56.000 Grizzly bear?

01:51:57.000 No, no grizzly bears.

01:51:58.000 Black bears.

01:51:59.000 No, we don't see grizzly bear in town.

01:52:01.000 Jesus.

01:52:01.000 Thank God for that.

01:52:02.000 Thank God.

01:52:03.000 So, yeah.

01:52:04.000 I have a friend who lives in BC, like way up in BC, and he had to shoot a bear from like three feet away.

01:52:13.000 What?

01:52:13.000 A brown?

01:52:14.000 Yeah, a brown bear that was trying to get into a cabin.

01:52:17.000 He was in the cabin?

01:52:18.000 Yeah.

01:52:18.000 And he had to shoot through the window, or what?

01:52:20.000 No, I think the thing was coming through the door, and he had to open the door and shoot it in the head. 0.97

01:52:25.000 Ooh. 0.97

01:52:26.000 What'd he shoot it with?

01:52:27.000 A rifle, I believe.

01:52:28.000 I forget the story totally.

01:52:30.000 He told me a while ago.

01:52:30.000 He's had multiple encounters with bears up there.

01:52:33.000 There's, like, the high areas of, you know, like, when you get up into B.C. into real heavily wooded areas.

01:52:42.000 They have, like, real...

01:52:43.000 Grizzly problems.

01:52:44.000 There's a lot of grizzly bears up there.

01:52:46.000 And they recently made it illegal to hunt them.

01:52:49.000 You can hunt black bears still, but you can't hunt grizzly bears anymore.

01:52:52.000 Because the people that live in the city voted it out.

01:52:55.000 So the people that live in Vancouver are like, don't kill the grizzly bears. 0.79

01:52:59.000 And the people that are up there are like, hey, you've got to kill them or there's going to be too many of them.

01:53:03.000 Like, what are we doing? 0.99

01:53:04.000 You've got to manage their population. 0.99

01:53:06.000 They come into town and sometimes they fucking open up people's cabins. 0.97

01:53:10.000 That's scary stuff, man. 0.99

01:53:13.000 Scary stuff.

01:53:14.000 There was a video recently somebody put me onto of this grizzly bear that tears open this cabin and pulls out like a leg of a moose and is dragging it out, but it went through the wall of this cabin.

01:53:29.000 They're so strong, they just tore the wall apart. 0.99

01:53:32.000 Just tore a hole through the wall, and it smelled the meat through there, and it's like, I gotta get you this fucking wall. 0.98

01:53:39.000 So the bear was motivated then, to say the least. 0.99

01:53:43.000 It's a scary animal to live around.

01:53:45.000 I just came from Alaska, and we were up there.

01:53:47.000 We went camping, stayed in the camper for a little bit, and there was...

01:53:52.000 Where were we?

01:53:53.000 There wasn't...

01:53:54.000 No, this isn't a bear scare.

01:53:55.000 It was a tsunami scare, is what it was.

01:53:57.000 Oh, Jesus.

01:53:58.000 But they cleared.

01:53:59.000 They gave us all clear.

01:54:02.000 What happens?

01:54:02.000 You get like a horn blows off or something?

01:54:04.000 Well, we were in a camper right there on the beach.

01:54:06.000 And then on your phones, you get an alert.

01:54:09.000 Just like an Amber Alert or something like that.

01:54:10.000 On your phones, you get an alert saying tsunami warning for this area.

01:54:15.000 You know what I mean?

01:54:16.000 Get to high ground. 1.00

01:54:17.000 Shit like that. 1.00

01:54:19.000 So we were... 0.99

01:54:21.000 So we packed up our stuff and we had to leave.

01:54:24.000 You can look on the internet and see where the effects, where places are actually affecting.

01:54:29.000 And it wasn't us.

01:54:30.000 We were just really close to it, but they hit the whole area.

01:54:35.000 Tsunami scared the fuck out of me.

01:54:37.000 When I lived in California, I was always worried that a big one was going to hit and a tsunami was going to wash over the whole city. 0.92

01:54:42.000 I was always worried about that.

01:54:44.000 But I started telling the story because we went up to Alaska a couple of weeks ago, but a few days before we went to Alaska, I heard about this black bear pulled this man out of his truck and killed him.

01:54:57.000 Out of his tent and killed him.

01:54:59.000 I think I was in Arizona.

01:55:01.000 So I'm in Arizona and I hear about this and we're about to go to Alaska.

01:55:05.000 In the camp, right?

01:55:06.000 It came right into the camp.

01:55:07.000 Yeah, the bear came right into the camp, pulled him into a brush and mauled him, killed him.

01:55:11.000 Yeah.

01:55:12.000 And...

01:55:14.000 So I'm worried because the last time I went to Alaska, we was in a camper.

01:55:18.000 There was a bear come through town. 0.99

01:55:19.000 I could see the bear running in the distance and shit. 0.99

01:55:21.000 It was a little black bear. 1.00

01:55:22.000 But still, so I'm like, ah, you know how black people are. 1.00

01:55:26.000 We don't play around in the wilderness and shit, man. 0.99

01:55:27.000 We don't do bears and bobcats and stuff like that. 0.99

01:55:30.000 Did you have a gun or anything on you?

01:55:31.000 The last time we had a gun, but not this last time we went, we didn't have a gun.

01:55:35.000 But the time we saw the bear, we had a gun and some bear mace and stuff like that.

01:55:40.000 So this time we had the bear spray, but no gun.

01:55:43.000 I only saw a grizzly bear one time in the wild.

01:55:46.000 When you were hunting?

01:55:47.000 Yeah.

01:55:48.000 They look at you so different.

01:55:49.000 Yeah.

01:55:50.000 A black bear looks at you like, who are you?

01:55:52.000 Are you going to hurt me?

01:55:52.000 What are you doing here?

01:55:53.000 What are you?

01:55:55.000 Maybe they've never seen a person before, but they're like, what is this?

01:55:57.000 A grizzly bear looks at you like this.

01:55:59.000 Can I eat you?

01:56:00.000 Can I eat you?

01:56:01.000 Like these cold, dark eyes, man.

01:56:04.000 The eyes just are...

01:56:06.000 Feeling this.

01:56:07.000 Like, you realize that the primal energy of this killing machine is locked on you.

01:56:11.000 A real live grizzly bear in the wild.

01:56:13.000 It wasn't a big one either.

01:56:14.000 The one that I saw was only like six feet tall.

01:56:16.000 Small.

01:56:16.000 But they know.

01:56:17.000 A young bear.

01:56:18.000 They know.

01:56:18.000 Right away, looking at me.

01:56:20.000 They'll know when they're being that.

01:56:21.000 Yeah.

01:56:22.000 Yeah.

01:56:23.000 It's just a different sort of wiring, I guess.

01:56:26.000 Like polar bears.

01:56:27.000 I would hear stories because I worked up there. 0.98

01:56:29.000 We would go to remote areas to work on airfields and shit. 0.56

01:56:35.000 And further north you get, you can come into encounters. 0.96

01:56:38.000 And I've heard stories.

01:56:40.000 One of the guys who I work with was up in Barrow, which is way up north Alaska.

01:56:45.000 And he was working on his thing.

01:56:48.000 And...

01:56:52.000 Out in the distance, way out in the distance with the binoculars because they're always watching.

01:56:56.000 There's a polar bear out there.

01:56:57.000 You know what I mean?

01:56:59.000 And so they have to keep an eye on this thing.

01:57:01.000 And they just notice this bear is getting closer and closer.

01:57:03.000 So this bear is freaking honing in on them.

01:57:05.000 You know these bears?

01:57:06.000 Yeah.

01:57:07.000 You know, see he lift his nose and then put his nose down and start coming closer and closer.

01:57:13.000 And they noticed these bears hunting them, so they had to abort mission and leave because these bears would break down the door and get whatever they want.

01:57:19.000 You know what I mean?

01:57:19.000 They hunt anything.

01:57:21.000 They hunt everything.

01:57:23.000 Everybody.

01:57:24.000 Yeah.

01:57:24.000 So, yeah, we don't mess around with polar bears and stuff when you're on the job, at least.

01:57:31.000 I don't know what people do on the outside of the job, but I don't mess around with polar bears anymore.

01:57:34.000 Period.

01:57:35.000 A friend of mine is a veterinarian, and he was explaining how when they work with little baby polar bears, he goes, they're like the predator right out of the womb.

01:57:42.000 They're like the alien, you know, from the womb.

01:57:44.000 Wow.

01:57:46.000 Like right out of the womb. 0.65

01:57:47.000 He's like, you're looking at these little cute killers. 1.00

01:57:49.000 Damn. 1.00

01:57:50.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:57:51.000 Polar bears don't eat anything but meat.

01:57:53.000 There's no vegetables up there.

01:57:54.000 There's no vegetation. 0.99

01:57:55.000 There's no fucking blueberries. 0.99

01:57:57.000 We're lucky that these... 0.99

01:57:58.000 That's like the thing about salmon and the brown bears.

01:58:01.000 The brown bears and the coastal bears.

01:58:03.000 Plenty of food.

01:58:04.000 That's why you see all those videos of people sitting there taking pictures of these things catching salmon out of the river.

01:58:10.000 They say the Indian ones are more dangerous. 1.00

01:58:12.000 Yes, that's what they say.

01:58:13.000 Because they hunt most of the time.

01:58:15.000 Or they eat berries. 1.00

01:58:17.000 That's wild seeing these big bears run down a fucking moose. 1.00

01:58:21.000 They're so fast. 1.00

01:58:23.000 They're so powerful.

01:58:24.000 They're powerful.

01:58:25.000 Did you see that video that some guy captured recently of these two bears duking it out for a long time?

01:58:31.000 Yeah.

01:58:31.000 A long time, man.

01:58:32.000 Like a pride round. 0.96

01:58:34.000 Yeah. 0.90

01:58:34.000 The dude was like, this is going to get good or some shit like that. 0.90

01:58:37.000 Then they just like standing up and I was like, whoa. 0.96

01:58:40.000 They go hard, man.

01:58:42.000 Got them by the ear, had one by the leg at one point.

01:58:45.000 I was watching it like, ooh, what kind of wrestling move these bears from the dude?

01:58:48.000 They do have a little jujitsu.

01:58:50.000 They got something, man.

01:58:51.000 Yeah, they do use a little wrestling. 0.99

01:58:54.000 And they bite each other so fucking hard. 0.99

01:58:56.000 Snapping. 0.99

01:58:56.000 You see him? 0.99

01:58:57.000 He got that overhook.

01:58:58.000 He got that wizard right there.

01:58:59.000 Their coat is so impressive.

01:59:01.000 They pull giant chunks of hair out of each other.

01:59:03.000 Mm-hmm.

01:59:04.000 Did you ever see the movie Grizzly Man?

01:59:06.000 No, not Grizzly Man.

01:59:07.000 Oh, my God.

01:59:07.000 You have to see it.

01:59:08.000 That's the documentary, right?

01:59:10.000 Yeah.

01:59:10.000 It's about this crazy dude.

01:59:11.000 Is that the dude who died?

01:59:12.000 Yeah.

01:59:13.000 I think I might have seen that, who died at the end.

01:59:15.000 It's a Werner Herzog movie, and I swear to God, he's trying to make it a comedy.

01:59:18.000 Yeah.

01:59:18.000 I think it's a comedy.

01:59:20.000 I really do.

01:59:21.000 I would call it an unintentional comedy, but he's too brilliant for it to be unintentional.

01:59:25.000 I think he did it on purpose.

01:59:26.000 It's a comedy movie, man.

01:59:28.000 Grizzly man.

01:59:28.000 It's a tragedy for sure.

01:59:30.000 It's sad that this guy got eaten by a grizzly bear and his girlfriend, too.

01:59:33.000 But it's also, it is a bananas movie.

01:59:36.000 Yeah.

01:59:37.000 Because this guy just, he thought he was protecting these grizzlies.

01:59:40.000 He's like, I'm here to save them, to save all the grizzlies. 0.99

01:59:42.000 And he's like, you're not saving jack shit. 0.99

01:59:44.000 Like, what are you talking about? 0.96

01:59:46.000 You're merely accommodating them for the time being.

01:59:48.000 You're just around them because they don't know what you are.

01:59:50.000 If they knew who you are, they would just eat you.

01:59:53.000 And that's what one of them eventually did.

01:59:54.000 He's like, I think I can eat this guy. 0.99

01:59:55.000 And he just fucking ate him. 1.00

01:59:56.000 Damn. 1.00

01:59:57.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:59:57.000 Well, he stuck around too long, too. 1.00

01:59:59.000 And most of the bears were already in hibernation when he was in there.

02:00:02.000 So the bears that weren't hibernating yet didn't have enough food.

02:00:05.000 So they were desperate.

02:00:06.000 So like maybe a desperate old male. 0.91

02:00:08.000 And so then he just said, I'll just eat this dude. 1.00

02:00:11.000 I've been seeing this annoying motherfucker saying he's saving me. 1.00

02:00:16.000 You're like, no, I'm saving you for later, motherfucker. 1.00

02:00:18.000 But there's a scene in it where they talk to this sheriff, and the sheriff's like, I thought he was retarded. 1.00

02:00:23.000 And then he just cuts, smash cuts after that.

02:00:26.000 I'm like, that is comedy.

02:00:28.000 Like he's doing this on purpose.

02:00:29.000 He knows what he's doing.

02:00:30.000 He knows what he's doing.

02:00:32.000 But it's a crazy movie of this guy who's just... 0.99

02:00:35.000 He seems like an in-the-closeted gay man. 0.94

02:00:38.000 Because there's part of the movie where he's like, I wish I was gay, because if I was gay, I'd just meet a guy, but I'm not gay. 0.82

02:00:45.000 It's like, okay.

02:00:46.000 Yeah.

02:00:47.000 What?

02:00:48.000 What are you doing, man?

02:00:49.000 Like, what's going on up there? 0.88

02:00:51.000 Well, I doubt you'll find many gay people they're loving out there. 1.00

02:00:54.000 Maybe. 0.62

02:00:55.000 Maybe that guy.

02:00:57.000 Pretty sure.

02:00:57.000 But I mean, I think it's a thing where people attach themselves, like that they're there to help and save this magnificent creature, which is a magnificent creature.

02:01:10.000 And then it gives their life so much more meaning because they're attached to something bigger than them, so important, so huge, because their whole identity is wrapped around protecting these bears.

02:01:23.000 But the people that are the wildlife biologists up in Alaska, they know what they're doing.

02:01:28.000 Those bears aren't in danger.

02:01:30.000 They're not in danger at all.

02:01:31.000 They have to monitor their populations very carefully.

02:01:33.000 They go out there with rifles.

02:01:35.000 They'll use them if they have to.

02:01:36.000 Yeah, they have to sometimes.

02:01:38.000 And especially if a bear starts eating people.

02:01:41.000 Like there was a hiker.

02:01:42.000 They're going to put their bear down.

02:01:43.000 Or a bicyclist in Montana.

02:01:44.000 She got pulled out of her tent.

02:01:46.000 Yeah.

02:01:47.000 Yeah.

02:01:48.000 Apparently she had had an encounter with that same bear earlier and scared it off and the bear came back.

02:01:53.000 I think that's the case.

02:01:55.000 See if you can find that store.

02:01:56.000 But that's in Montana.

02:01:58.000 And that was like real close to town.

02:02:01.000 So it freaked everybody out that this lady got... 1.00

02:02:05.000 Just dragged out of her fucking... 1.00

02:02:06.000 And killed. 1.00

02:02:07.000 Yeah, she got killed. 0.95

02:02:08.000 She got killed.

02:02:09.000 I don't think it takes much for...

02:02:11.000 It's a rare exception when a grizzly bear doesn't kill you.

02:02:14.000 Yeah.

02:02:14.000 And you see some of those dudes, they stitch them back together again.

02:02:16.000 You're like, yikes.

02:02:18.000 Respect.

02:02:20.000 Respect, dude. 1.00

02:02:21.000 That sin of the shit right there. 0.99

02:02:22.000 That's that reverent. 1.00

02:02:23.000 Yeah.

02:02:24.000 Yeah.

02:02:24.000 That's a true story, man.

02:02:25.000 It was?

02:02:26.000 Yeah.

02:02:26.000 It's based on a true story.

02:02:28.000 Yeah.

02:02:29.000 Based on a true story.

02:02:30.000 That was a wild scene.

02:02:31.000 Yeah.

02:02:31.000 That bear attack.

02:02:33.000 Yeah, I forget who the Reverend is based on.

02:02:35.000 What were we just looking up?

02:02:37.000 The lady getting the bear, the hiker.

02:02:40.000 Oh yeah, the story about the hiker.

02:02:43.000 The bicyclist.

02:02:44.000 Did she run into it?

02:02:45.000 I think she did.

02:02:47.000 There could be different articles.

02:02:48.000 Either way, the bear pulled her out of her tent.

02:02:52.000 That's the scariest way to die.

02:02:54.000 That's why I don't do animals, man.

02:02:55.000 I respect them.

02:02:57.000 Oh, I've seen this one.

02:02:59.000 This bear showed up in a cabin and starts rubbing his body on it.

02:03:02.000 That's got to be like a miniature cabin, right?

02:03:04.000 No, he's just huge, man.

02:03:05.000 Some of those bears are 12 feet tall.

02:03:09.000 Jeez!

02:03:13.000 That thing is huge.

02:03:16.000 Revenant, yeah.

02:03:17.000 What is the dude's name who it's based on?

02:03:19.000 Apparently the real story, the author of the book on it was on Steve Rinella's podcast, Meat Eater podcast, was a really good story.

02:03:29.000 Hugh Glass.

02:03:30.000 Hugh Glass is the author.

02:03:31.000 It's an amazing episode where he talks about, you know, there's a difference between the Hollywood version and the real version, but it is based on a true story.

02:03:40.000 Mm-hmm.

02:03:41.000 That was a good movie, man.

02:03:42.000 Bro, imagine living back then. 0.98

02:03:44.000 You get worried about bows and arrows flying at you, and you're trying to make your way through the woods, and what the fuck are we doing here? 0.97

02:03:51.000 Woo! 0.99

02:03:52.000 Hard people, man.

02:03:57.000 What was that?

02:03:57.000 That wasn't The Reverend.

02:03:58.000 That was, uh, was it The Predator?

02:04:01.000 The newest Predator.

02:04:02.000 The newest one, yeah, with the Comanches.

02:04:05.000 Prey.

02:04:05.000 And they had the French over there.

02:04:06.000 That was good.

02:04:07.000 That was a really good one.

02:04:09.000 It was fun.

02:04:10.000 It was fun.

02:04:10.000 It was a fun Predator movie.

02:04:12.000 Like, I was a little skeptical.

02:04:14.000 I was like, yeah, you got a girl.

02:04:15.000 On the streaming side, yeah. 0.99

02:04:16.000 You got a girl who's gonna kill it. 1.00

02:04:18.000 Come on, shut the fuck up. 1.00

02:04:18.000 But it was good. 1.00

02:04:19.000 It was still cinematic for the story.

02:04:21.000 You know, some...

02:04:22.000 Suspension of disbelief.

02:04:24.000 Yeah.

02:04:24.000 Yeah, but still, they nailed it.

02:04:27.000 They did it good.

02:04:28.000 It was good. 0.99

02:04:28.000 I enjoyed the shit out of it. 0.99

02:04:29.000 It was a lot better than Aliens vs. 0.91

02:04:31.000 Predator.

02:04:31.000 Yeah, that wasn't so good.

02:04:32.000 No.

02:04:33.000 What do you do to unwind?

02:04:35.000 Are you like a video game guy?

02:04:36.000 What do you do to relax?

02:04:37.000 Well, I play video games.

02:04:39.000 There you go.

02:04:40.000 I knew it.

02:04:40.000 With the anime, I was like, it's a shot in the dark.

02:04:43.000 But, you know, since having children, man, it's few and far in between.

02:04:48.000 But I still get my gaming time in right now.

02:04:50.000 Right now, I'm playing Final Fantasy XVI. I don't play much online.

02:04:56.000 My daughter is...

02:04:57.000 She's big into... 0.99

02:05:01.000 What is it, Roblox and shit like that? 0.99

02:05:02.000 Roblox, mine too. 1.00

02:05:03.000 So the battle is, nah, too much of that shit. 1.00

02:05:05.000 Get off of that shit, get off of those things. 1.00

02:05:07.000 You know how it is with kids, you know what I mean? 1.00

02:05:09.000 Yeah, we played Wanted, Dead or Alive, you know that karate game?

02:05:13.000 Wanted Dead or Alive?

02:05:14.000 You don't know that karate game? 1.00

02:05:16.000 Oh man, it's the shit. 1.00

02:05:18.000 Yeah? 1.00

02:05:18.000 Yeah, it's a karate game. 1.00

02:05:19.000 I fuck everybody up in that game. 0.99

02:05:20.000 Nobody in my house wants to play me. 1.00

02:05:22.000 It's a newer game?

02:05:24.000 No, it's one of those ready, fight!

02:05:26.000 Oh, okay.

02:05:27.000 You know those games?

02:05:28.000 I remember that.

02:05:29.000 I had Karate Champ growing up.

02:05:31.000 That was on Nintendo.

02:05:32.000 It was just like that.

02:05:33.000 You had a red one and a dude in white.

02:05:36.000 Yeah, that's the game.

02:05:37.000 Wanted.

02:05:37.000 Dead or Alive.

02:05:38.000 Oh, just Dead or Alive.

02:05:39.000 Okay, I remember Dead or Alive. 0.96

02:05:41.000 I fucked it up.

02:05:42.000 But Dead or Alive, yeah. 1.00

02:05:44.000 Dead or Alive is the shit. 1.00

02:05:45.000 That game was fun. 1.00

02:05:46.000 Dead or Alive is the shit. 0.99

02:05:47.000 You'll knock somebody off of a platform, and they'll fall, and then you'll jump down and continue fighting. 1.00

02:05:51.000 I keep trying to coach my kids how to do it, but I keep fucking them up. 0.99

02:05:55.000 You can't help yourself, huh? 0.99

02:05:57.000 I can't help myself.

02:05:57.000 I get very competitive when it comes to that game.

02:05:59.000 They don't like playing it, they get mad!

02:06:02.000 When's the last time you played it?

02:06:03.000 A couple days ago.

02:06:04.000 Who's your character on that one? 0.99

02:06:05.000 I pick whoever the fuck. 1.00

02:06:06.000 I don't give a shit. 1.00

02:06:07.000 Okay. 1.00

02:06:07.000 Yeah, I don't give a shit. 1.00

02:06:09.000 Each one of them has some specific moves you can do, a combination you can do to knock a person back and just keep landing it. 0.99

02:06:18.000 See, my favorite fighting game was Bloody Roar.

02:06:21.000 I don't know if a lot of people don't know what Bloody Roar is.

02:06:24.000 Bloody Roar.

02:06:24.000 I think I've heard that name.

02:06:26.000 What does that look like?

02:06:28.000 Well, it was a 3D fighting game.

02:06:30.000 But you have fighters who could transform into beast-like apparitions.

02:06:36.000 Ooh, okay, similar kind of thing.

02:06:38.000 Oh, I remembered this.

02:06:40.000 Yeah.

02:06:41.000 So I was good with a lot of them. 0.90

02:06:43.000 Have you fucked around at all with VR? Have you done any of those VR games? 0.91

02:06:47.000 I've played Thrill of the Fight.

02:06:49.000 Is it Thrill of the Fight?

02:06:50.000 Is that a boxing one?

02:06:51.000 Yeah, it's a boxing one.

02:06:52.000 Those are great, aren't they?

02:06:53.000 Yes.

02:06:54.000 You can kind of move around with that a little.

02:06:56.000 Yes.

02:06:56.000 That was fairly realistic as far as the sensors and responsiveness goes.

02:07:01.000 And I was using that to cut weight for my last fight. 0.99

02:07:03.000 And for the Adesanya fight, I was using it to, you know, because I start pouring sweat on those damn things. 0.99

02:07:08.000 Yeah. 0.98

02:07:09.000 And then the eyes will fog up.

02:07:10.000 I was surprised that, like, we did it on the concrete.

02:07:12.000 I was like, my feet hurt.

02:07:14.000 Because I'm, like, pushing off my feet and moving my body around.

02:07:17.000 Which one were you playing?

02:07:18.000 Which one were we playing, Jamie, on the HTC Vive?

02:07:20.000 It could have been this.

02:07:21.000 I don't remember at that time.

02:07:22.000 I don't remember, but I do remember, I love the fact that when he pops you, the screen goes white.

02:07:26.000 Okay.

02:07:26.000 Like, you get hit.

02:07:27.000 Yeah.

02:07:28.000 Like, it feels like you get your, you know, like you see stars.

02:07:30.000 Yeah.

02:07:30.000 Like, that's cool.

02:07:31.000 Yeah.

02:07:32.000 It's like, it gives you like a real feeling of what it looks like when punches are coming at you.

02:07:36.000 You get a real good workout.

02:07:37.000 Yeah.

02:07:38.000 It was really good.

02:07:39.000 I was...

02:07:39.000 If you can do...

02:07:41.000 That's what I always tell people.

02:07:42.000 If you can find something you enjoy doing, working out is so much easier.

02:07:46.000 People say, well, I'm going to get in shape.

02:07:48.000 I'm going to go to the gym. 0.99

02:07:49.000 God damn it, that's boring. 0.99

02:07:50.000 That's so boring. 1.00

02:07:51.000 Just learn jujitsu.

02:07:53.000 Learn kickboxing.

02:07:54.000 Do something.

02:07:55.000 And if a video game...

02:07:57.000 There was a while where they were talking about...

02:07:59.000 And I think some people still...

02:08:01.000 They are doing it.

02:08:02.000 But doing VR games on a unidirectional treadmill or a multidirectional treadmill.

02:08:08.000 So they have this treadmill that can go all different ways, and it's propelled by your movement.

02:08:14.000 So as you're moving, you're harnessed into this circle.

02:08:18.000 But this treadmill can go in 360 different ways.

02:08:23.000 I've seen those. 0.99

02:08:23.000 Yeah, it's fucking cool. 0.99

02:08:24.000 I want one of those. 0.99

02:08:25.000 That's fucking cool. 0.99

02:08:26.000 So you're running around and shooting things. 0.99

02:08:28.000 It's like you're getting exercise while you're also playing a fun game.

02:08:33.000 Like, if you could do something like Dance Dance Revolution, a lot of people lost weight doing that, because that's fun.

02:08:38.000 That thing's revolutionary right there, though.

02:08:40.000 Yeah!

02:08:40.000 I didn't get into it, because I'm not a big dancer.

02:08:44.000 But, you know, I like my games.

02:08:46.000 But I gotta use the bathroom.

02:08:47.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

02:08:48.000 Well, you can just wrap this up.

02:08:49.000 Let's wrap this up.

02:08:50.000 We're about the end of the line, anyway.

02:08:53.000 Thank you very much, man.

02:08:54.000 I hear you.

02:08:55.000 Let's wrap it up, Pete.

02:08:56.000 Tell everybody your Instagram so they can follow you.

02:08:59.000 I'm on Instagram, KillerGorillaMMA.

02:09:02.000 So give me a like, follow.

02:09:05.000 You guys will see all this cool stuff that I'm doing.

02:09:07.000 I'm going to get more active.

02:09:08.000 I'm not super active, but I will be more active.

02:09:11.000 I'm definitely active during fight weeks.

02:09:14.000 But I'm...

02:09:15.000 Slowly spreading my wings.

02:09:16.000 Well, I'm just happy when you're active in the octagon.

02:09:18.000 Yeah.

02:09:18.000 And I'm glad we got to do this.

02:09:20.000 I really enjoyed your perspective on things.

02:09:22.000 I think it was great.

02:09:23.000 Thank you, man.

02:09:23.000 I enjoyed it very much.

02:09:24.000 My pleasure.

02:09:25.000 Let's do it again.

02:09:25.000 All right.

The Joe Rogan Experience - October 04, 2011

JRE MMA Show #144 with Jared Cannonier

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Summary

Transcript