The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #32 with Firas Zahabi

00:00:00.000 3, 2, 1 Thank you.

00:00:08.000 Boom! 0.99

00:00:08.000 I don't want to start off like this is a commercial, dude, but this fucking thing you have, this Tim Tam thing, this is incredible! 0.99

00:00:16.000 It's sick, huh? 0.99

00:00:17.000 I've never, I've seen some of these different ones online, people using them, TheraThings, you know, I don't know what they call them, TheraGun, I think, but this fucking thing is amazing! 0.98

00:00:29.000 This is the most powerful one, it has the highest travel and it's the best price.

00:00:34.000 So, I mean, it's- Out of all the different ones of these things online?

00:00:37.000 Yeah, this is the best one.

00:00:38.000 So what this is, folks, we took the battery out.

00:00:41.000 I'll pop the battery back in real quick.

00:00:42.000 You want to pop it in?

00:00:42.000 I'll pop it in real quick.

00:00:43.000 Go for it.

00:00:43.000 Just so people can see.

00:00:47.000 That's how impressed I am by this thing. 0.97

00:00:49.000 So I've had this nagging muscle in my hip, and then, like, instantaneously, this fucking thing, you hold it, folks, and you get it, like, right on a spot. 0.97

00:01:01.000 For me, it's, like, right here. 0.97

00:01:02.000 I go... 0.99

00:01:04.000 And it just loosens that motherfucker up. 0.99

00:01:06.000 This is so much more powerful than any of those massagers that you get from a store. 0.98

00:01:12.000 Exactly.

00:01:13.000 There's no massager more powerful than this one on the market.

00:01:17.000 This is not for mom and dad.

00:01:18.000 This is for the guy playing soccer, football, MMA, CrossFit.

00:01:22.000 That's for the hardcore athletes.

00:01:23.000 And you invented this?

00:01:25.000 I started the company.

00:01:26.000 I started the company.

00:01:27.000 I bought one of those DMS. I don't know if you ever heard of those.

00:01:29.000 It's called Deep Muscle Stimulator.

00:01:31.000 We were talking about that before, and I said, save this, save this.

00:01:33.000 Yeah, yeah, exactly.

00:01:34.000 So what is that?

00:01:35.000 The Deep Muscle Stimulator, it's like a stainless steel, high-powered massager that you have to plug in.

00:01:40.000 It cost me three grand.

00:01:41.000 I bought it.

00:01:43.000 I had a really bad sciatica for two years.

00:01:45.000 I almost stopped training.

00:01:46.000 I almost had to take a...

00:01:47.000 I've got a problem with that right now.

00:01:48.000 Really?

00:01:49.000 Sciatica?

00:01:49.000 Okay, this is going to help you out.

00:01:50.000 Big time.

00:01:51.000 Yeah, it comes and goes.

00:01:51.000 Big time.

00:01:52.000 I was so bad, I couldn't sleep.

00:01:55.000 Like, I could not sleep because I was in so much pain.

00:01:57.000 Does yours go all the way?

00:01:58.000 I get mine in my calf sometimes.

00:01:59.000 Really?

00:02:00.000 No, I'm lucky.

00:02:00.000 Yeah, it goes all the way down to the calf for some weird reason.

00:02:03.000 Me, it went down to the hamstring, and it stopped there.

00:02:05.000 Like, I was able to stop the problem there.

00:02:08.000 But they say you can go all the way down to the calf.

00:02:10.000 That's getting bad, you know?

00:02:11.000 Yeah.

00:02:11.000 Ooh, let me get my calf right now.

00:02:14.000 Motherfucker. 1.00

00:02:15.000 So I bought that DMS. Ah! 1.00

00:02:17.000 There it is, you know.

00:02:18.000 That's the DMS. Great machine.

00:02:21.000 Great machine, but it overheats.

00:02:23.000 It costs three grand.

00:02:25.000 And what does that piston do?

00:02:27.000 Does it hammer you?

00:02:28.000 Yeah, it hammers you.

00:02:29.000 Just like this?

00:02:30.000 Yeah, but it has a lesser travel.

00:02:31.000 This one has a greater travel.

00:02:33.000 So that one, the DMS is a little bit too vibration.

00:02:35.000 It's not as much travel.

00:02:36.000 It's not as much percussion.

00:02:38.000 Percussion is what you're looking for.

00:02:39.000 And so when I got together with a company from the U.S., Disrupt.

00:02:44.000 We put together the TimTam.Tech company.

00:02:47.000 We went to China.

00:02:49.000 We checked out a hundred different type of guns.

00:02:51.000 We got this one going.

00:02:52.000 This was the best one. 1.00

00:02:54.000 Dude, this fucking thing's incredible. 1.00

00:02:56.000 It's incredible. 1.00

00:02:57.000 I hate to sound like you paid me to do an endorsement.

00:03:00.000 He didn't, folks. 1.00

00:03:01.000 This is this fucking thing. 1.00

00:03:03.000 These should be flying off the charts. 1.00

00:03:06.000 They shouldn't even need drones.

00:03:08.000 They should just be flying themselves.

00:03:10.000 Seriously. 1.00

00:03:10.000 Damn. 1.00

00:03:11.000 You know, the thing with the Deep Muscle Stimulator is we have to share it in the gym. 1.00

00:03:14.000 You buy your own personal gun.

00:03:16.000 Because the Deep Muscle Stimulator is $3000 to lend it out.

00:03:20.000 How much is one of these?

00:03:21.000 It's $400.

00:03:22.000 Five year warranty. 0.99

00:03:23.000 That's a fucking bargain. 0.99

00:03:24.000 For anybody who trains really hard, that's a bargain. 1.00

00:03:27.000 It's a massage for life.

00:03:28.000 It's your health.

00:03:29.000 That's nice, man.

00:03:31.000 It's like a sawzall.

00:03:32.000 Exactly.

00:03:33.000 It's like you took a sawzall and you put a little rubber ball on the end of it.

00:03:37.000 It's amazing.

00:03:38.000 We tried so many other type of machines, but they're all overheat, weak.

00:03:42.000 They're not efficient.

00:03:42.000 The most efficient has already been created.

00:03:44.000 So we just retooled it.

00:03:45.000 We just rechanged it.

00:03:46.000 We made it so that you can use it on the human body.

00:03:49.000 There's some modifications made, but that's it.

00:03:50.000 I mean, it's pretty simple.

00:03:51.000 It's the most efficient type of design they have.

00:03:54.000 Yeah, it's kind of, it's really hard to find someone who can massage you correctly.

00:04:00.000 It's very hard to find someone as good.

00:04:02.000 Exactly.

00:04:02.000 Someone who could really break up the tissue.

00:04:04.000 But even if you do, like, what this thing can do, this thing is like vibrating you and shaking everything loose.

00:04:11.000 Yeah.

00:04:11.000 I have a cone tip I gotta send you.

00:04:14.000 It goes even deeper.

00:04:15.000 So if you can handle deep tissue, I'm gonna send you a bunch of them.

00:04:18.000 Okay.

00:04:18.000 Yeah, you're gonna love it.

00:04:19.000 We have also cold tip, hot tip.

00:04:21.000 Oh, so you freeze them?

00:04:22.000 Yeah, you can freeze them because that helps kill the pain.

00:04:24.000 So if you have an acute injury and after like a week or two and you want to start working on it, the cold of the tip It helps numb the pain.

00:04:32.000 It helps manage pain a little more.

00:04:33.000 And the hot tip helps loosen up the muscle a little further.

00:04:35.000 I mostly use the cone tip.

00:04:37.000 The cone tip is for those who have, you know, your experience with massage.

00:04:40.000 You're able to go deep tissue.

00:04:42.000 And for some people it hurts.

00:04:44.000 For me it's perfect.

00:04:45.000 So you find where the scar tissue is and you can break it up.

00:04:49.000 Exactly.

00:04:49.000 The surface area on the cone tip is obviously smaller so it goes even deeper and unlocks that muscle real quick.

00:04:55.000 So for me, I don't have the time for foam rolling.

00:04:57.000 That's the main reason why I wanted a product like this because foam rolling takes forever to really loosen up a muscle.

00:05:03.000 And I'm in the gym all day.

00:05:05.000 Do I want to stay in the gym another hour rolling up and down on a foam roller?

00:05:09.000 I think you've got to do something though, right?

00:05:11.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:05:11.000 You kind of have to do something.

00:05:12.000 If you're training hard and you want to train for life...

00:05:15.000 Do you use those, well we don't have one in the room, but do you ever use those?

00:05:19.000 What do they call it?

00:05:20.000 Supernova?

00:05:21.000 Supernova wad balls.

00:05:23.000 But it's larger.

00:05:25.000 It's like a big blue one.

00:05:26.000 I love that thing.

00:05:27.000 Rogue makes it. 1.00

00:05:28.000 That fucker gets in there. 1.00

00:05:30.000 But this is even better than that. 1.00

00:05:32.000 This thing is incredible, man.

00:05:34.000 I like the ball for my back.

00:05:35.000 When I do my back, I feel like I can lie down on it.

00:05:37.000 I can get the pressure I want.

00:05:39.000 But when I do my legs, I use the Tim Tam.

00:05:41.000 Yeah, when I go on the road, I bring that ball with me and I'll put it on the ground in a hotel room and I'll bridge on it.

00:05:47.000 Just hit certain spots and pop everything loose.

00:05:51.000 You need a lot of body weight.

00:05:52.000 Sometimes I put a kettlebell on my chest and you get even deeper.

00:05:58.000 You can really unlock a muscle like this.

00:06:00.000 You can really get in there and really unlock it.

00:06:03.000 For people who train, they know.

00:06:04.000 When you get that nagging tight muscle in your neck, in your shoulder, your shoulder blades, And then you're on the mat, you do a quick movement, you know?

00:06:11.000 Yes.

00:06:11.000 That's scary.

00:06:12.000 Dude, I did it once in the shower.

00:06:13.000 I had something going on in my neck, I guess, and I didn't realize how bad it was, and I turned in the shower to get something, and it popped.

00:06:19.000 Exactly.

00:06:20.000 And then for like days, I was locked up.

00:06:22.000 I've had that done also, but it's all about keeping the muscles loose.

00:06:26.000 Yeah.

00:06:26.000 Good posture.

00:06:27.000 You know, Kelly Starr wrote a book.

00:06:28.000 You had him on this show.

00:06:29.000 Yeah, he's great.

00:06:30.000 He's a really amazing guy.

00:06:30.000 He's great.

00:06:31.000 He really changed my life, honestly.

00:06:32.000 I'm telling you, reading his book, Suppled Leopard, everybody who knows me, follows me, they know I always talk about this book.

00:06:39.000 You know, he said something so important.

00:06:40.000 He said, look, it comes down to two things.

00:06:42.000 Good alignment.

00:06:44.000 And loose muscles.

00:06:45.000 You got to keep your body aligned and loose muscles.

00:06:47.000 And I just followed those two principles.

00:06:49.000 I mean, his book is really, really excellent.

00:06:51.000 And when I read his book, that's when I reached out to him to work with George.

00:06:57.000 Because I don't know if you've ever seen when George does a backflip and he lands, his knees always kind of...

00:07:02.000 Come in together.

00:07:03.000 Have you ever seen, like, watch him do a backflip.

00:07:04.000 That's called, I was reading his book and I saw that's the vulgus fault.

00:07:07.000 He calls that the vulgus fault.

00:07:08.000 When you do a squat and your knees come close to one another.

00:07:11.000 And he's like, that can cause ACL tears.

00:07:13.000 And I'm like, I know a guy with two ACL tears and he does that all the time.

00:07:16.000 I see him do that all the time.

00:07:17.000 It's something I've always noticed about George.

00:07:19.000 His knees always bow in when we do lifts, when we do jumps, when we do hurdles.

00:07:23.000 I mean, I've watched George jump up and down literally thousands of times.

00:07:27.000 And I saw his knees bow in all the time.

00:07:29.000 And he's like, well, then I reached out to him.

00:07:31.000 I said, hey, could you help me correct George's?

00:07:33.000 There it is.

00:07:33.000 That's the vulgus fault.

00:07:35.000 And he's like, sure.

00:07:36.000 And ever since then, George's knees have been a lot better.

00:07:39.000 What did you do to fix it?

00:07:41.000 Well, what he does, it's a technical skill.

00:07:44.000 It's a skill.

00:07:44.000 So he has a few different exercises to help you correct it.

00:07:47.000 So you put a band around your knees and you kind of push out on the band.

00:07:49.000 But really what we do is we'll make George do a lift or a jump, film it, send it to Kelly, and he'll tell us how aligned we are and what directions to go.

00:07:56.000 So he kind of coaches us on how to avoid this fault.

00:08:01.000 However, really, at the end of the day, it's about keeping your knees turned to the outside.

00:08:06.000 I used to walk up the stairs and have a pain in my knee.

00:08:09.000 Do you ever have that, when you walk upstairs?

00:08:11.000 No.

00:08:11.000 I used to have pain in my knee walking up the stairs.

00:08:13.000 Just from stairs?

00:08:14.000 Just from walking upstairs.

00:08:15.000 And I didn't know why.

00:08:16.000 And then I read his book and he's like, look, when you walk up a step, you got to keep your toes straight and turn your knee out.

00:08:21.000 I was like, really?

00:08:22.000 And I started doing that.

00:08:23.000 My pain was gone immediately.

00:08:25.000 Keep your toes straight.

00:08:26.000 Straight.

00:08:27.000 Like toes forward and turn your knee out.

00:08:29.000 Turn your knee to the outside.

00:08:30.000 So he says, look, this is your ACL. See this here?

00:08:35.000 This is your ACL. Cross your ACL. That's the ACL. You put it in your kneecap.

00:08:39.000 That's your knee. 0.63

00:08:40.000 When you turn your knee to the outside, look, it tightens it up.

00:08:43.000 That takes away all the slack.

00:08:44.000 So what happens when you're going up the stairs, your ACL is just jiggling around and getting sheared.

00:08:51.000 But when you tighten it up, You go up, you're secured.

00:08:55.000 So he calls it creating torque.

00:08:57.000 He's a brilliant book, man.

00:08:58.000 He's a brilliant guy.

00:08:59.000 Incredible.

00:08:59.000 So even when you run hills, you should do that?

00:09:01.000 Absolutely.

00:09:02.000 You should always be aligned.

00:09:03.000 Whenever your body's under pressure or stress, whether you're wrestling or whatnot, you should always have torque.

00:09:09.000 So like, look, grab your shirt like this.

00:09:10.000 Okay, grab your shirt. 0.84

00:09:11.000 Okay.

00:09:11.000 He gives an example in the book.

00:09:13.000 Excellent example.

00:09:13.000 So now grab the shirt and twist it here.

00:09:16.000 Create torque.

00:09:16.000 Now look, you have a much more stable grip.

00:09:20.000 You know, a judica is always going to grab the lapels and twist them. 1.00

00:09:22.000 Right.

00:09:22.000 So when you grab the bar, let's say you're going to do a bench press.

00:09:24.000 Maybe, you know, it's not the best exercise or not, but the principle is still at work.

00:09:29.000 When you grab the bar, you should be...

00:09:31.000 Torquing the bar.

00:09:33.000 When you're doing push-ups, your hands are on the mat and you're torquing.

00:09:36.000 Even though your hands are not turning, literally, you're just torquing.

00:09:38.000 When you do that, you feel that all the slack is eaten up.

00:09:41.000 There's no more slack.

00:09:42.000 There's no more trampoline effect.

00:09:45.000 There's no more jiggling.

00:09:46.000 Everything's tight.

00:09:46.000 The system is tight.

00:09:47.000 And it's very, very important that the system be tight and that the weight be on the muscles.

00:09:52.000 So if you're properly aligned when you're doing a maneuver, the weight is on the bone.

00:09:58.000 Not on the tendons.

00:09:59.000 So if you put your weight like this on your fingers, you'll see that the bone is carrying.

00:10:04.000 If you bend your bones here, if you're unaligned and you start putting pressure, now you see your muscles are starting to work overtime.

00:10:10.000 So when I'm carrying weight, I need to have it on my bones and or my muscles, never on the tendons and ligaments.

00:10:16.000 They say that with backpackers. 0.98

00:10:18.000 You know what backpackers do?

00:10:20.000 They keep their legs as stiff as possible and they take short, like sort of short steps.

00:10:26.000 Like guys who are mountaineer guys, they don't take like big high steps.

00:10:31.000 They kind of keep their legs stiff and they walk with their skeleton.

00:10:35.000 Right.

00:10:35.000 They try to let their skeleton carry.

00:10:36.000 You see me, I'm sitting on this chair.

00:10:37.000 This chair has no muscles.

00:10:39.000 But it's holding me up.

00:10:40.000 Because of the structure.

00:10:42.000 Structure is a type of strength.

00:10:44.000 If you take an egg and you try to squeeze it in a certain way, you can't break it.

00:10:47.000 You ever seen that experiment?

00:10:48.000 Why?

00:10:48.000 Because you're actually trying to crush a cylinder.

00:10:50.000 To crush a cylinder takes a tremendous amount of force.

00:10:53.000 However, to break a stick in half takes a very little amount of force.

00:10:55.000 Why?

00:10:56.000 It has a lot to do with the structure.

00:10:58.000 If you're trying to compress matter on itself, it won't.

00:11:01.000 It would take a tremendous amount of force to do that.

00:11:04.000 Tremendous amount of power.

00:11:06.000 However, if you want to separate The material by bending it at the middle is very easy, but to compress it, to compress material on itself, it takes a tremendous amount of energy.

00:11:16.000 Right, so anytime you're going outside of your alignment, you're allowing things to compress.

00:11:21.000 Yeah, that's why it makes so much sense to keep your legs straight when you're hiking.

00:11:24.000 It's like a horse that sleeps, right?

00:11:25.000 He's sleeping.

00:11:26.000 If he aligns his legs perfectly straight, he's using structure to hold him up instead of muscular strength.

00:11:32.000 So, I mean, I remember you had him on the show and you guys had a very interesting conversation.

00:11:38.000 And he was talking about front squatting will make you have a great guard.

00:11:42.000 But I think you guys misunderstood each other, actually.

00:11:44.000 Because you were like, no, front squatting has nothing to do with having a great guard.

00:11:47.000 And I agree with both of you.

00:11:48.000 But I think you guys were not talking about the exact same thing.

00:11:51.000 He's talking about having the mobility.

00:11:53.000 To squat down really low in the front squat will help your guard.

00:11:58.000 Not necessarily having a big lift.

00:12:00.000 He wasn't talking about lifting 300 pounds in the front squat.

00:12:03.000 It's going to make you a great guard player.

00:12:04.000 That's irrelevant.

00:12:05.000 I think what he was talking about is having incredible mobility in your hips.

00:12:09.000 You ever see a child pick up something off the floor, like a newborn baby?

00:12:13.000 He's going to get into this perfect, perfect squat.

00:12:15.000 Well, if you look at guard players, the best guard players always have incredible flexibility in their hips.

00:12:20.000 Because I always tell people, the higher you can bring your hips to your chest, The harder it is for me to pass your guard.

00:12:25.000 Like if you're one of those guys where your knee is like this, you know, you're trying to re-guard and your knee is this far.

00:12:29.000 The space for me to pass your guard is huge.

00:12:31.000 Giant, yeah.

00:12:32.000 But if you can bring this foot behind your head and your hips, the window, the space that I need to cross to get to side control is so small.

00:12:40.000 Yeah, Eddie has...

00:12:42.000 Excuse me, one of his students is named Sean Bollinger, and he has crazy flexibility.

00:12:46.000 I've seen him.

00:12:47.000 I've seen him. 0.95

00:12:47.000 Crazy. 0.95

00:12:48.000 The double... 0.97

00:12:48.000 Yeah, he could do double lotus, and he could literally take his legs and put them behind his head. 0.97

00:12:53.000 Yeah.

00:12:53.000 I mean, he could just pull his legs back.

00:12:55.000 How many great guard players have you seen who can do that?

00:12:58.000 A lot of guys.

00:12:58.000 Yeah, like Ryan Hall, for instance.

00:13:00.000 Keenan.

00:13:01.000 Yeah, Keenan.

00:13:02.000 I mean, they have this flexibility to them.

00:13:04.000 Passing the guards becomes very, very difficult.

00:13:06.000 It's almost impossible.

00:13:07.000 It's like they just spin a little bit and you're back in something again and you're tied up and then you add in leg locks and you're kind of fucked. 0.99

00:13:13.000 Exactly. 0.97

00:13:13.000 Because they're spinning to your leg while you're trying to pass their guard. 0.97

00:13:17.000 Hip flexibility is so paramount in Jiu Jitsu.

00:13:21.000 For bottom game especially.

00:13:23.000 And it's so devastating when you have a hip injury.

00:13:25.000 Hip injuries and, you know, I know guys who have had hip replacements and it's like, boy, you know, then you're so severely limited in what you can do afterwards.

00:13:34.000 You got to never let it get there, in my opinion.

00:13:36.000 According to Kelly, he says your joints can last you 120 years.

00:13:40.000 Like if you take care of them.

00:13:41.000 He says there's 2% catastrophe, meaning you got hit by a bus.

00:13:44.000 Okay, that's something we can't do anything about.

00:13:46.000 98% of the time is because you didn't take care of your joints.

00:13:49.000 You haven't properly used them.

00:13:52.000 And you let muscles get tight for too long, over a long period of time.

00:13:56.000 So for me, personally, I feel like when I was 20. I feel better now than when I was 25. Because at 25, I was really beat up.

00:14:02.000 26, 27, I was really like, hey, my knees, my back, my neck, you know, training every day, twice a day, it was grueling.

00:14:07.000 But after I went through that system, I came back out fresh.

00:14:11.000 And now whenever I have a little tweak or anything like that, I take care of it immediately. 0.98

00:14:14.000 I kill it.

00:14:15.000 I don't let any tweak creep up, go any further. 0.99

00:14:18.000 And I feel much more energy.

00:14:21.000 When I keep the body healthy and loose, I feel a lot more energy.

00:14:24.000 I feel better.

00:14:25.000 My mood is better.

00:14:26.000 It's the balance between being tough And, you know, being mentally strong enough to like push through training when you're, you know, you're not feeling your best and knowing that you're fucking up your vehicle. 0.98

00:14:38.000 Knowing that you're fucking up your body. 0.98

00:14:40.000 Very true. 1.00

00:14:41.000 There's a balance.

00:14:42.000 Hard for fighters in particular because they want to be tough.

00:14:45.000 You know, so you got some weird little thing in your leg like, whatever, I'm just going to work through it.

00:14:49.000 And you say, I'm just going to go light.

00:14:51.000 Which is hilarious.

00:14:53.000 People who say they're going to go light, you go light and then you get tagged.

00:14:56.000 And then you want to get someone back, and the next thing you know, you're not going light. 0.99

00:14:59.000 And then that thing in your leg is all fucked up. 0.95

00:15:02.000 And then next thing you know, you go to a doctor, you have an MCL tear. 1.00

00:15:05.000 Oh, fuck. 0.99

00:15:07.000 And then with that tightness, it gets worse after 48 hours. 1.00

00:15:11.000 You have DOMS, delayed onset muscle soreness.

00:15:13.000 And then you're in the shower, you turn your neck, boom, something pops.

00:15:16.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:15:17.000 What do you do in terms of, do you take curcuminum?

00:15:22.000 That's how you say it, right?

00:15:23.000 Curcuminum.

00:15:24.000 Turmeric, anti-inflammatory herbs and things along those lines.

00:15:28.000 I know that Rhonda Patrick just put something up about...

00:15:33.000 I think you call it curcuminin.

00:15:36.000 Cercuminin or curcuminin?

00:15:39.000 Anyway, it's turmeric.

00:15:41.000 It's the active ingredient in turmeric.

00:15:43.000 And she just put something up on her Twitter page a couple of days ago about how important this stuff is.

00:15:49.000 And to make sure that you have bio available.

00:15:51.000 It improves memory and mood as well.

00:15:54.000 Well, I have to try it.

00:15:55.000 I haven't tried it.

00:15:55.000 Yeah, it's just turmeric.

00:15:57.000 Really?

00:15:57.000 Yeah, and that stuff is fantastic for inflammation.

00:16:01.000 People that have soreness and nagging injuries and nagging inflammation, having that as a part of your daily diet is fantastic, along with fish oil.

00:16:11.000 Fish oil is really good for that.

00:16:13.000 You know, of course, and then watching your diet and making sure you're low in inflammatory foods like sugar and alcohol.

00:16:20.000 Right.

00:16:20.000 That's huge.

00:16:21.000 Really, it's amazing how much of a difference it makes.

00:16:23.000 It's huge.

00:16:23.000 If you have any sort of back injury or inflammation.

00:16:27.000 I talked to this lady who was a therapist a few years back, and she was saying, you know, you should really try going gluten-free if you have issues with your back. 0.99

00:16:35.000 I was like, listen to this wacky bitch. 1.00

00:16:37.000 That's what I was thinking. 1.00

00:16:39.000 All I was thinking is like, oh, she's talking woo-woo crystals nonsense.

00:16:43.000 And I was like, wait a minute, really?

00:16:45.000 Gluten?

00:16:46.000 She's like, you'd be amazed at how many people...

00:16:48.000 And now that I've thought about it more, and with all I know, talking to various nutritionists and actual clinical researchers, I think it's as much gluten as it is just...

00:17:00.000 Just sugar, refined carbohydrates and sugars and all these different things just create inflammation.

00:17:06.000 There's just no way around it.

00:17:08.000 Especially the levels that normal Americans eat them in.

00:17:12.000 Oh boy.

00:17:13.000 Now you're talking about...

00:17:14.000 We're the worst.

00:17:15.000 Yeah.

00:17:16.000 It's a tremendous amount of sugar.

00:17:17.000 Yeah.

00:17:18.000 You don't know it until you get off sugar.

00:17:20.000 And then you go see everybody who's eating the standard amount of sugar...

00:17:25.000 And you're like, it blows your mind.

00:17:27.000 You don't need that much sugar.

00:17:28.000 There's no way.

00:17:29.000 It's just way too much.

00:17:30.000 And you feel sick eating that much sugar again.

00:17:32.000 It's mind-boggling.

00:17:33.000 Like a jug of Gatorade that a lot of dudes drink after practice?

00:17:36.000 I couldn't get that down.

00:17:38.000 I mean, have you ever seen those?

00:17:39.000 They have those things where they show you online.

00:17:43.000 They have, like, this is the amount of sugar that's in a can of Coke.

00:17:46.000 This is the amount of sugar that's in a 24-ounce bottle of Gatorade. 1.00

00:17:50.000 It's fucking crazy. 0.99

00:17:51.000 It's incredible. 1.00

00:17:52.000 It's a pile of sugar.

00:17:53.000 It's unbelievable.

00:17:54.000 It's like a fistful of sugar.

00:17:56.000 But it's addictive.

00:17:56.000 It gets the customer coming back.

00:17:59.000 It gets the customer coming back.

00:18:00.000 You need that next sugar high.

00:18:01.000 You need more sugar the next time around.

00:18:02.000 You need another dose of sugar.

00:18:05.000 And I think your sugar, you should get it from Whole Foods mostly.

00:18:07.000 It's released into your system naturally, slowly.

00:18:10.000 Yeah, there it is right there.

00:18:11.000 Look at that big gulp.

00:18:12.000 Wow.

00:18:13.000 That big gulp is like a kilo.

00:18:16.000 Wow.

00:18:16.000 It looks like you're bringing coke across the border.

00:18:19.000 That's just poisonous. 1.00

00:18:20.000 That's fucking amazing. 1.00

00:18:23.000 That's so much sugar. 1.00

00:18:25.000 That's impressive.

00:18:27.000 What does it say?

00:18:28.000 17 grams?

00:18:29.000 What does it say, Jamie?

00:18:30.000 37?

00:18:30.000 17 tablespoons.

00:18:31.000 17 tablespoons.

00:18:32.000 32 tablespoons for that.

00:18:34.000 This is 18. Jesus Christ, that's so much.

00:18:38.000 That's so much sugar! 0.81

00:18:40.000 That's so much sugar! 0.81

00:18:42.000 Seven.

00:18:43.000 Choco milk?

00:18:44.000 Wow.

00:18:45.000 Choco milk is supposed to be good after you train, though.

00:18:47.000 It's white milk, too.

00:18:47.000 Or maybe that's old news.

00:18:49.000 I don't know.

00:18:50.000 George used to do that.

00:18:51.000 Yeah, George used to do that.

00:18:52.000 But I'll tell you something.

00:18:53.000 George is a freak of nature when it comes to diet.

00:18:55.000 Yeah.

00:18:55.000 He's very blessed.

00:18:58.000 Look, this is just my observation, but I think some people, when they eat carbs, they spike their insulin, and they can get fat if they eat too much carbs.

00:19:07.000 And some people eat a tremendous amount of carbs, and they never get fat.

00:19:10.000 We all have a friend who eats a lot of junk food and is ripped.

00:19:14.000 There are not many in the world, but they exist.

00:19:18.000 We've all met a person like that.

00:19:20.000 George is one of those guys.

00:19:21.000 If he eats McDonald's for a week or he eats vegetables for a week, it doesn't matter.

00:19:25.000 He's going to be lean either way.

00:19:26.000 Now, he'll be leaner on vegetables, but even on McDonald's, he's going to be lean.

00:19:29.000 He's never been fat in his entire career.

00:19:32.000 His entire life, I should say.

00:19:34.000 Did he get a little heavier when he stopped training?

00:19:37.000 Look, because he took some photos for the UFC. He looked a little heavier.

00:19:41.000 Bulky, I would say.

00:19:41.000 Would you say that he's chubby or fat?

00:19:44.000 No.

00:19:44.000 If I saw him at the beach, I wouldn't say that fat guy.

00:19:46.000 He'd be like, this guy's shredded. 0.98

00:19:47.000 That guy's jacked. 0.74

00:19:48.000 This guy's jacked. 0.81

00:19:49.000 But when it's George, you hold him to the highest of standards. 0.97

00:19:52.000 If I ate the way he eats, I would be fat.

00:19:55.000 Wow.

00:19:55.000 Let's put it that way.

00:19:56.000 How many people told me, hey, I've been hanging out with George for a week.

00:19:58.000 I got fat.

00:19:59.000 I gained 10 pounds.

00:19:59.000 I'm like, yeah, that's George, man.

00:20:01.000 That's George.

00:20:02.000 Don't eat like he eats.

00:20:03.000 It won't work.

00:20:04.000 And he has his whole theories and philosophies about why he's lean.

00:20:07.000 It's like, dude, no, you're just born this way.

00:20:09.000 He doesn't get it.

00:20:10.000 I've trained thousands of people.

00:20:11.000 He's trained himself.

00:20:13.000 What he did is going to work for everyone.

00:20:17.000 And I love George.

00:20:18.000 He's a super intelligent guy, but I tell him, George, he's very gifted when it comes to food.

00:20:22.000 And he does a lot of things.

00:20:23.000 Now he's doing a lot of fasting, and he's getting even leaner.

00:20:26.000 Yeah.

00:20:27.000 But it'll be a long time before George is fat.

00:20:29.000 You see, there's various body types.

00:20:31.000 You know, you have ectomorph, mesomorph, endomorph.

00:20:34.000 And we're on the continuum of these three.

00:20:37.000 George is on the ectomorph side.

00:20:38.000 And a strong sign of ectomorph is a small waist.

00:20:42.000 Isn't that mesomorph?

00:20:44.000 No, mesomorph is...

00:20:45.000 Because he's very muscular.

00:20:46.000 He is.

00:20:46.000 I would say he's between ectomorph and muscles.

00:20:49.000 Sorry, go ahead.

00:20:51.000 George was very skinny and scrawny when he was young.

00:20:53.000 So he went crazy on the weights.

00:20:56.000 He turned his weakness into a strength.

00:20:58.000 He did so much weight training and exercise because he wanted to bulk up.

00:21:02.000 So he's a bulk ectomorph.

00:21:04.000 Now he's not a perfect ectomorph.

00:21:05.000 He's not a 100% ectomorph.

00:21:07.000 I would say he's between ectomorph and mesomorph.

00:21:09.000 But endomorph, the other end of the spectrum, you eat a little bit of carbohydrates, you get fat.

00:21:14.000 You lift a little bit of muscles, your muscles explode in size.

00:21:17.000 George wasn't like that.

00:21:18.000 George was a bit on the other side of the spectrum.

00:21:20.000 So a real mesomorph would be like Melvin Manhoof.

00:21:25.000 Yeah, like that.

00:21:26.000 I think I'm kind of...

00:21:27.000 No, no, no.

00:21:28.000 That's more endomorph. 0.83

00:21:31.000 No, endomorph is fat.

00:21:33.000 Yeah, but you can also be very muscular.

00:21:35.000 Endomorph?

00:21:35.000 Yeah, you can be very muscular.

00:21:36.000 I thought endomorph is like people that have a really hard time not being overweight.

00:21:42.000 You can gain fat and muscle really quickly.

00:21:44.000 As an endomorph?

00:21:45.000 Yeah, but ectomorphs, from what I've read, I might be wrong.

00:21:48.000 Neither one of us are biologists.

00:21:50.000 Exactly.

00:21:51.000 There's a problem with this conversation.

00:21:52.000 I always thought ectomorph was really skinny, endomorph was, they tend to lean towards being overweight, and then mesomorph was someone who's like, really, like a Francis Ngannou.

00:22:01.000 Or Brock Lesnar.

00:22:02.000 Super muscular, thick, just look like they naturally would pack a lot of muscle.

00:22:08.000 I'm sure you could pull up a chart if you can.

00:22:10.000 All these pictures just show both of them.

00:22:12.000 From what I've read, see the mesomorph is kind of in the middle.

00:22:15.000 Ectomorph is lean and hard pack on muscle. 0.97

00:22:18.000 Ectomorph looks like a skinny dork.

00:22:20.000 And mesomorph looks like he's super jacked and endomorph looks like... 0.97

00:22:24.000 Well, endomorph...

00:22:25.000 See, but endomorph does not look fat in that picture.

00:22:27.000 He doesn't have to be fat.

00:22:28.000 That's the thing.

00:22:29.000 See, now here's...

00:22:30.000 Let me tell you something, ladies.

00:22:31.000 Go for it.

00:22:31.000 When you look at those three pictures, I go with endomorph all day.

00:22:35.000 Exactly.

00:22:36.000 And those three pictures...

00:22:37.000 We love the endomorphs.

00:22:38.000 If that's what an endomorph is...

00:22:40.000 Let's take the endomorphs.

00:22:41.000 Yeah, because them ectomorphs, they need a lot of naps, and they're always tired.

00:22:45.000 And those mesomorphs...

00:22:46.000 And their egos, my goodness. 0.88

00:22:47.000 They want to choke you. 1.00

00:22:48.000 The mesomorphs always want to fucking strangle you. 1.00

00:22:50.000 But endomorphs, that's a woman. 1.00

00:22:53.000 You can have a ripped endomorph.

00:22:55.000 Anybody can be ripped.

00:22:56.000 That guy's an endomorph?

00:22:58.000 That's Pratt, maybe.

00:22:59.000 Think about it.

00:23:00.000 Endomorph is like a short, stocky hulk.

00:23:02.000 He could be fat, and he could also be packed with muscle.

00:23:06.000 Like Kelvin.

00:23:06.000 Kelvin Gastelum.

00:23:07.000 Kelvin Gastelum.

00:23:08.000 I would put him on the endomorph side. 1.00

00:23:10.000 Yes, definitely.

00:23:11.000 Because he's never really totally ripped.

00:23:14.000 Well, Dolce, when he had him, and he was getting him down to a real 170, he really had him pretty ripped at one point in time.

00:23:21.000 Just really low body fat.

00:23:23.000 That's the thing.

00:23:23.000 You can get ripped.

00:23:23.000 It's just not as easy to get there.

00:23:25.000 Anybody can get ripped.

00:23:27.000 But an ectomorph, so think about a basketball player. 0.98

00:23:31.000 One of the signs they say is small waist. 1.00

00:23:34.000 The waist and shoulders are quite similar.

00:23:37.000 Now George has a V going.

00:23:38.000 He has very broad shoulders, which is great.

00:23:40.000 He's perfectly built for fighting.

00:23:41.000 That allows him for reach.

00:23:42.000 And his double leg, because he's got incredible legs.

00:23:44.000 It's like he's wearing shoulder pads almost.

00:23:46.000 And he's blessed with many, many genetic gifts for fighting.

00:23:51.000 No doubt about it.

00:23:52.000 And endomorphs are naturally, excuse me, ectomorphs are naturally predisposed to endurance sports.

00:23:58.000 So you'll see a lot of marathon runners or whatnot, they're tall and lanky.

00:24:01.000 They're not short, bulky, Mike Tyson type look athletes.

00:24:06.000 That's a real mesomorph.

00:24:07.000 That's a real, I would say endomorph.

00:24:09.000 Endomorph.

00:24:10.000 Because he's so short.

00:24:11.000 Short and stocky and bulky.

00:24:13.000 He could put on a lot of muscle or a lot of fat.

00:24:15.000 Now, I'll ask you, is he a little bit...

00:24:16.000 I don't want to say he's fat, but he's put on some fat since he's retired or whatnot, right?

00:24:21.000 I don't know how much he works out anymore, you know?

00:24:23.000 Exactly.

00:24:23.000 But an ectomorph, even when they stop working out, they're less likely to pack on fat.

00:24:28.000 They might have a little belly, you know, but it's not as...

00:24:32.000 Pronounced.

00:24:32.000 It's not as pronounced as an endomorph.

00:24:34.000 An endomorph will pack on fat and muscle real quickly.

00:24:37.000 And they're more...

00:24:38.000 They gravitate more towards power sports.

00:24:42.000 So they can explode, but they have less cardio.

00:24:45.000 Whereas the ectomorph is...

00:24:47.000 Like you'll see a lot of running backs.

00:24:48.000 They're short, stocky.

00:24:49.000 They're endomorph, man. 0.92

00:24:50.000 They have to explode for three, four seconds.

00:24:52.000 Is there a best body for fighting, or is there a...

00:24:56.000 You just adapt your style to whatever body you have.

00:24:59.000 Exactly.

00:24:59.000 I think there's a best body for basketball, a best body for football.

00:25:03.000 Well, it depends what position you're playing.

00:25:04.000 But fighting, everybody has a fight in their DNA. So all styles, excuse me, all body types can fight.

00:25:12.000 And that's what's so amazing.

00:25:14.000 You get a Paul Harris.

00:25:15.000 He's an endomorph, man. 0.68

00:25:16.000 But he found a way to fight that makes sense for him.

00:25:19.000 That's what I always tell people.

00:25:21.000 You gotta fight according to your body type.

00:25:24.000 And people think that's crazy.

00:25:25.000 No, Muhammad Ali fought a certain way because he had certain attributes.

00:25:29.000 He had a certain personality.

00:25:32.000 Even your personality is very important.

00:25:34.000 If he tried to fight like Tyson, it would backfire.

00:25:36.000 If Tyson tried to fight like Muhammad Ali, it would backfire.

00:25:39.000 I think everybody has to start with the basics, and then after three, four years of training, even maybe up to five years, now you gotta specialize for what your temperament is, what your body type is, what your personality is, because not everybody wants to get it done in round one, and not everybody is the type of person who's gonna take it to the cards, and not everybody has a reach and speed to jab in and out.

00:26:00.000 A lot of people think, oh, I'm just gonna jab in and out like Ali.

00:26:02.000 Dude, you have the attributes that Ali has.

00:26:04.000 He was born with certain attributes.

00:26:06.000 And everybody's born with an attribute for fighting, in my opinion.

00:26:09.000 Everybody got this far because they can fight.

00:26:12.000 Nobody got here this far without having some innate ability to fight, you know, to defend themselves.

00:26:18.000 So all our body types can defend themselves, but you have to discover what works best for that body type.

00:26:24.000 Right.

00:26:25.000 Tyson's a perfect example of that.

00:26:27.000 Exactly.

00:26:27.000 They thought he couldn't make it in the pros.

00:26:28.000 They thought, oh, he's going to get killed in the pros.

00:26:30.000 There's never been a short guy.

00:26:31.000 When Ali was dancing around, people were like, no, that's not going to work.

00:26:34.000 He's going to get tired.

00:26:35.000 When he goes to the heavyweights, heavyweights shouldn't bounce around.

00:26:39.000 And Ali used to spar a lot with lightweights.

00:26:41.000 He spar six rounds with lightweights, then six rounds with a heavyweight.

00:26:43.000 Why?

00:26:44.000 Because he would play tag with a lightweight.

00:26:46.000 It's just about speed and movement.

00:26:48.000 You move twice as much with a lightweight.

00:26:50.000 What is your thoughts on hard sparring?

00:26:52.000 Because when you see the ties and the way they spar, there's a great benefit in that. 0.99

00:26:57.000 I mean, there's a great benefit in that barely hitting each other's shit. 0.99

00:27:00.000 I do a tremendous amount of that. 0.98

00:27:03.000 You know, one thing when people spar with me, they're like, man, you move so like, you know, people are like, it's so seamless the way you move.

00:27:08.000 And I do thousands of hours of live rolling and sparring.

00:27:12.000 But a lot of those hours, I would say 80% of them is very light.

00:27:15.000 Because I know the terrain.

00:27:16.000 I just want to go through the sequences as many times as I can, and when I'm really, really warmed up, then I'll go hard.

00:27:23.000 I'll start talking smack a bit in the gym, and I'll tell the guy when it's time to go really hard.

00:27:29.000 And we're having fun with it.

00:27:30.000 For me, having fun is really, really important.

00:27:32.000 Now, that's training for longevity.

00:27:34.000 But if you have a fight, I think you need to do six weeks of hard sparring.

00:27:37.000 Why?

00:27:38.000 Because the speed of the fight is very particular.

00:27:42.000 We need to get to fight speed.

00:27:44.000 The actual speed of the fight.

00:27:45.000 Because you might get caught sleeping if you haven't done that.

00:27:48.000 Now, if you have a tremendous amount of fight experience, you need less of that.

00:27:52.000 So, for instance, Tai, who's been fighting since he's eight years old, he can tune up just on the pads and go fight.

00:27:58.000 Why?

00:27:58.000 He's been doing it since the day he can walk, you know, almost.

00:28:02.000 Like, you look at a Mayweather.

00:28:03.000 I can get Mayweather ready with just a little mitt work.

00:28:06.000 Put him in there.

00:28:07.000 He's going to be the world champion.

00:28:08.000 Why?

00:28:08.000 It's hardwired.

00:28:10.000 If you look at a baby's brain, a baby's brain is not wrinkled like an adult's brain.

00:28:15.000 It's wrinkled to a small degree.

00:28:17.000 As he goes through his experiences, especially in the first three years of his life, his brain literally gets hardwired and wrinkled.

00:28:23.000 And it gets less and less wrinkled over time.

00:28:25.000 And when you're hardwired to do something...

00:28:29.000 The likelihood of you needing to tune up is very minimal.

00:28:34.000 For instance, I remember looking at the biography of Mayweather and he was saying when he would go to picnics with his family, his father would bring boxing gloves and he would box with his cousins.

00:28:42.000 They literally would be punching each other.

00:28:44.000 For him, he's been doing it so long.

00:28:47.000 The more experienced you are, the less heart sparring you need.

00:28:50.000 Yeah.

00:28:51.000 The more seasoned you are, the less hard sparring you need.

00:28:54.000 You know what fighting is.

00:28:55.000 You just need a little tune-up at the end.

00:28:57.000 So if you look at George, George is a great example.

00:29:00.000 He's super skilled and he's super healthy.

00:29:02.000 Some guys get to the high skill level, but they're broken up.

00:29:05.000 Their body's broken.

00:29:07.000 Their knee is broken.

00:29:08.000 They can barely have three, four fights left in them.

00:29:10.000 Do you want to get really, really good and then be broken when you got there?

00:29:14.000 You finally, you know, you've been cultivating these skills for 15 years.

00:29:17.000 You get there.

00:29:17.000 You get those skills that you wanted.

00:29:19.000 Oh, I can't use them.

00:29:20.000 Why am I? The machine is broken.

00:29:22.000 You know, I'm 38. I feel like when I was 20, personally.

00:29:28.000 Because I spar.

00:29:28.000 80% of my sparring is very flow and relaxed.

00:29:30.000 Like I use a lot of...

00:29:31.000 I train a lot with purple belts.

00:29:32.000 Blue belts and purple belts.

00:29:33.000 Why?

00:29:33.000 Because they couldn't hurt me if they tried.

00:29:35.000 I just toy with them until I'm warmed up.

00:29:38.000 I'm flowing.

00:29:38.000 I'm not really working hard.

00:29:39.000 I'm just flowing.

00:29:40.000 I'm just doing my combinations.

00:29:41.000 And then when I really want to have a good challenge, I'll take one of my elite guys, one of my pros, and I'll do one or two rounds with them.

00:29:47.000 I won't burn my machine out.

00:29:49.000 Imagine driving your car in the red line all the time.

00:29:52.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:29:53.000 That's a great way of looking at it.

00:29:55.000 When you guys get ready for a fight, like say if you get George ready for a fight, how much time do you spend on working on his recovery from the workouts?

00:30:05.000 Do you bust out the Tim Tam machine and ice things down?

00:30:10.000 How aware of you are you guys?

00:30:13.000 Do you have a regimented program of how to recover from exercise?

00:30:17.000 Yeah, recovery is everything.

00:30:19.000 So it's stress plus recovery equals adaptation.

00:30:24.000 Stress plus stress equals detraining in injury.

00:30:27.000 A good trainer, he understands super compensation, right?

00:30:32.000 You have stress, you have recovery, and then you have a new level of skill or ability.

00:30:37.000 If you don't go through the recovery phase...

00:30:40.000 You will not reap the rewards of your training.

00:30:42.000 There has to be a recovery phase.

00:30:43.000 Not every athlete has a level of recovery that they can achieve.

00:30:47.000 So as you get more experience as an athlete, your body can...

00:30:51.000 As you become...

00:30:52.000 As you're more and more fit, I should say, your body can recover from more stress.

00:30:58.000 So I have to gauge...

00:31:00.000 How good my student is.

00:31:01.000 It has to be challenging but manageable.

00:31:03.000 If I make it too challenging, I'm redlining him.

00:31:05.000 He's going to break.

00:31:06.000 His knee's going to pop.

00:31:08.000 He's going to be unmotivated.

00:31:10.000 If it's too easy, he's going to be bored.

00:31:12.000 I have to find the right amount of stimulus.

00:31:14.000 So when I'm in the practice room, if I see Georgia just mauling guys and destroying them, I have to scale the workout so that it's harder. 1.00

00:31:21.000 But I don't want to scale it so high that I injure him and break him or that he made it out of practice by a hair and that he's not motivated to do another camp.

00:31:29.000 We reach those high intensity levels periodically throughout the year and they have to be done in a certain way that it's fun.

00:31:36.000 You know George was on your show and he was saying, I'll try to kill him in the practice room.

00:31:42.000 Now, it's true. 0.88

00:31:43.000 He's right.

00:31:43.000 But I do it so rarely.

00:31:45.000 I do it so periodically.

00:31:47.000 And I make it a joke.

00:31:48.000 That's why, like, what he was trying to say is that I brought in the guys in the room.

00:31:51.000 And I was watching them spar with George.

00:31:53.000 And they don't want to touch his face.

00:31:54.000 This is when he was, like, a megastar.

00:31:55.000 Like, he was the champ.

00:31:56.000 And nobody wants to try to double leg him.

00:31:58.000 Nobody wants to try to hurt him.

00:32:00.000 Because they're, like...

00:32:01.000 I'm not going to come here in his house and try to show him.

00:32:04.000 There's a respect thing.

00:32:06.000 They're starstruck, you know, these young kids.

00:32:08.000 So I would bring them in.

00:32:09.000 And I'd be like, listen, guys, I'd give a speech.

00:32:12.000 The first guy to double leg him, the first guy to put him out, I would put like a $5,000 reward.

00:32:18.000 To knock him out?

00:32:19.000 If you knock George out, I'll give you $5,000.

00:32:22.000 Jesus Christ.

00:32:23.000 If you put George on his back, if you take him down, put him on his back, I'll stop the whole practice and praise you for 20 minutes in front of everybody in the gym.

00:32:31.000 And students don't get praised by me very often.

00:32:34.000 So George would be like, oh my God, these guys, they're coming after me.

00:32:37.000 And he would get riled up.

00:32:38.000 And I would do this periodically, rarely, right?

00:32:40.000 We're talking about world title fight, you know, stuff's on the line.

00:32:44.000 And I need these guys to actually show me where George is missing something.

00:32:48.000 Because when you have this perfect practice and you win all the time, What do you work on?

00:32:52.000 Well, nothing went wrong.

00:32:53.000 There's nothing to fix.

00:32:55.000 So, I mean, there are times where we really redline him.

00:32:58.000 Have you ever had anybody knock him out in practice and take that money?

00:33:03.000 He's been dropped once in practice pretty badly.

00:33:05.000 And it's a funny story, but the money wasn't on the line that time.

00:33:09.000 There was no price for that.

00:33:12.000 One time he got dropped in practice and I wanted to pull the plug.

00:33:17.000 It was for a world title fight.

00:33:18.000 He was fighting Dan Hardy, two weeks before his fight.

00:33:21.000 I was sure he was concussed.

00:33:23.000 And I said, George, I'm pulling the round.

00:33:25.000 It was one more round.

00:33:26.000 He said to me, Coach, let me finish the round.

00:33:28.000 I'm okay.

00:33:29.000 Let me finish the next round.

00:33:31.000 And I felt that if I pulled him, I would have killed his confidence.

00:33:34.000 Right.

00:33:35.000 I would have killed his confidence, totally.

00:33:36.000 So I said, okay, you could do the next round.

00:33:39.000 And I told the other guy he was sparring with, don't land a single glove, like I whispered to him.

00:33:43.000 Not a single glove on him. 0.88

00:33:44.000 Just take a mauling. 0.99

00:33:45.000 And George went in the next round, not knowing that the other guy's not allowed to hit him at all.

00:33:51.000 And he just crushes the guy, right?

00:33:52.000 He just mauls him and gets...

00:33:54.000 And I was really, really grateful for...

00:33:56.000 The other guy was a pro.

00:33:57.000 And I was very, very grateful that he took the beating that we asked him to.

00:34:00.000 Right.

00:34:01.000 And George After was like, man, I know it went bad in round four, but round five was amazing.

00:34:06.000 I was on fire in round five.

00:34:07.000 I said, you weren't...

00:34:09.000 You were.

00:34:10.000 You were. 1.00

00:34:11.000 Sneaky shit. 1.00

00:34:12.000 He's like, round four was just a fluke. 1.00

00:34:16.000 This is what I'm going to look like.

00:34:19.000 Round five.

00:34:19.000 I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:34:20.000 And it's a good thing it's Friday because I have the day off tomorrow.

00:34:23.000 I'm like, George, today's Saturday.

00:34:25.000 He was shocked.

00:34:26.000 And he was like, today's Saturday?

00:34:27.000 I'm like, yeah.

00:34:28.000 And the UFC was there filming.

00:34:31.000 So I had to like, look guys, that footage can never air.

00:34:33.000 That footage has got to disappear.

00:34:35.000 They're like, yeah, don't worry.

00:34:36.000 We understand the fight's on the line.

00:34:37.000 He was fighting there already two weeks later.

00:34:40.000 That's why that fight, he was doing a lot of wrestling.

00:34:41.000 Because we didn't want to even chance.

00:34:43.000 I was sure he had a concussion when he went in that fight.

00:34:46.000 Now pulling the plug on that fight, a lot of people would be like, hey, you put his health on the line.

00:34:50.000 You're right.

00:34:51.000 But it's so much pressure.

00:34:52.000 First of all, George has nothing to do with UFC. We kept it from UFC. We told the camera guys, bury this.

00:34:58.000 Don't report it.

00:35:00.000 George would never want to back out of that fight.

00:35:03.000 It was two weeks from now.

00:35:04.000 Everybody's coming to watch this fight.

00:35:06.000 This fight, it's been on the prime time.

00:35:11.000 It's been three weeks they're filming.

00:35:12.000 This is happening.

00:35:13.000 This fight is happening, no matter what.

00:35:14.000 George is in that mindset.

00:35:17.000 But he went in there, honestly, after he got dropped pretty badly.

00:35:21.000 Wow.

00:35:22.000 Yeah, that's you know Forrest Griffin got knocked out twice before his fight with Anderson Silva Twice And apparently one of them was real bad.

00:35:31.000 Really?

00:35:32.000 Yeah.

00:35:33.000 That's so dangerous.

00:35:34.000 I think he was sparring with Vanderlei.

00:35:35.000 And apparently you don't spar with Vanderlei.

00:35:38.000 No, huh?

00:35:38.000 It's just fights.

00:35:40.000 Yeah.

00:35:41.000 I mean, he's old school shoot-a-box. 0.98

00:35:43.000 Especially back then.

00:35:44.000 Oh, my God.

00:35:45.000 Yeah, Forrest won't really talk about it too much.

00:35:47.000 Because he doesn't want it to be perceived as an excuse.

00:35:50.000 But he...

00:35:52.000 I mean, how many times have fighters done that?

00:35:54.000 Many, many fighters have done that.

00:35:56.000 Countless.

00:35:56.000 Yeah.

00:35:56.000 To the point where, like...

00:35:58.000 I just let the fighter decide now.

00:36:00.000 Unless I really feel like it's urgent.

00:36:02.000 Which is rare that I've actually had to intervene because at the end of the day, when are you 100%?

00:36:07.000 It really rarely happens.

00:36:08.000 There's always something.

00:36:09.000 Right.

00:36:10.000 But the thing about getting knocked out is that if you get knocked out two weeks ago, your odds of getting knocked out are significantly higher.

00:36:18.000 I know.

00:36:19.000 I know, man.

00:36:19.000 It's crazy.

00:36:21.000 And Dan Hardy is a really good striker.

00:36:22.000 Oh, my God.

00:36:23.000 That left hook? 0.94

00:36:24.000 If it would have touched George, George would have been out like a light. 0.82

00:36:26.000 He's got a crazy left hook.

00:36:28.000 Plus, George was hurt two weeks before.

00:36:29.000 Yeah.

00:36:31.000 Thank God it worked out well.

00:36:32.000 Yeah, it worked out great.

00:36:35.000 Yeah, the balancing act of being a trainer is not something that I envy.

00:36:39.000 No, it's tough.

00:36:40.000 It's tough because I care for these guys, honestly.

00:36:42.000 It has nothing to do with the business or the money.

00:36:44.000 I couldn't care less.

00:36:45.000 I could not care less.

00:36:47.000 But I know that that guy, he's on a one-way track.

00:36:50.000 So if I'm telling him, no, hit the brakes, and he's saying we're going, that break in harmony...

00:36:56.000 It's going to create a friction and create a doubt in the fighter.

00:36:59.000 Are you all in?

00:37:00.000 Are you all in?

00:37:01.000 Because if you're not all in, you're going to scare your fighter.

00:37:04.000 There's that to consider as well.

00:37:06.000 Yeah.

00:37:08.000 When you look at the crop of up-and-coming talent, this is such a crazy time for MMA. I think when you look at these new guys, like Zabit is one of my favorite guys to watch, because he's this new crop of guys that can do everything.

00:37:25.000 And they're so high level by the time you see them. 0.97

00:37:28.000 Like, the first fight I saw of Zabit inside the Octagon, you know, I've seen him on video before, but seeing him live, you're like, holy shit! 0.98

00:37:37.000 He's amazing. 0.70

00:37:38.000 But he's not just amazing, it's like...

00:37:40.000 This is this next level.

00:37:43.000 There's another level.

00:37:44.000 We've seen these elite fighters and everyone's great at jujitsu, everyone's got great takedown defense, everyone knows how to strike, but then you're seeing this new flavor.

00:37:55.000 Okay, the frequency is now higher.

00:37:57.000 And it just seems to me that every year or so, There's these new guys that jump through and you're going, okay, well now the frequency is quite a bit higher than it was before.

00:38:06.000 It's seamless.

00:38:08.000 The transitions are more and more seamless, which is amazing.

00:38:11.000 You're saying they're processing it faster.

00:38:14.000 And as they're doing the takedown, Demetrius is flowing into an armbar before the takedown is even finished.

00:38:19.000 And you're like, the next generation is watching that.

00:38:22.000 And they've adopted that now.

00:38:23.000 So they're going to flow into a transition.

00:38:26.000 It's getting more and more seamless.

00:38:28.000 Their computers are computing faster and faster information.

00:38:32.000 They're thinking what they're going to do on the ground before it hits the ground.

00:38:35.000 It is incredible.

00:38:37.000 And they know what can be done now.

00:38:39.000 They've seen it all.

00:38:40.000 The possibilities.

00:38:41.000 Yeah, so they have this database in their mind of accomplishments that have already been achieved by other fighters.

00:38:46.000 They've been awakened. 0.99

00:38:47.000 Yeah, it's fucking crazy, man. 0.98

00:38:49.000 When you stop and think about when you first got involved in the sport and then look at the level that fighters are at now, there's not really a commensurate sport in terms of modern mainstream sports. 0.98

00:39:00.000 Where people have achieved such an incredibly high level of proficiency that so far exceeds where it was a decade ago or two decades ago.

00:39:08.000 There's really no comparison.

00:39:10.000 The growth rate is ridiculous. 0.99

00:39:11.000 It's fucking incredible. 1.00

00:39:12.000 It's amazing. 0.99

00:39:13.000 And I don't think it's a...

00:39:16.000 It's a coincidence that the growth rate in this sport is incredible.

00:39:19.000 And this is the sport that has the most amount of variables in terms of combat sports.

00:39:24.000 The most amount of variables in terms of what a fighter can do to you.

00:39:27.000 There are more ways to win than any other combat sport, obviously.

00:39:32.000 Yeah.

00:39:33.000 And that's why I find it...

00:39:34.000 See, the more you limit an athlete, the more it's about torque.

00:39:38.000 So, for instance, if you look at sprinting.

00:39:40.000 If I were to race Hussein Bolt, and I had all the best trainers, the best sprint coaches, and Hussein Bolt had the most mediocre sprint coaches, and we race when we're both 20 years old in our prime, who's going to win?

00:39:54.000 You! 0.99

00:39:55.000 I appreciate the confidence.

00:40:00.000 I mean, it's a joke question, right?

00:40:01.000 He's going to win, right?

00:40:02.000 Yeah, for sure.

00:40:03.000 Put us in MMA. We're the same weight class, same height, everything's the same.

00:40:06.000 I have the best coaches, he has the worst coaches.

00:40:09.000 Who's going to win? 1.00

00:40:10.000 You're going to fuck him up. 1.00

00:40:11.000 I'm going to kill him. 1.00

00:40:11.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:40:12.000 Because coaching now has a greater influence.

00:40:16.000 Sprint coaches say, we can make you faster.

00:40:18.000 We cannot make you fast.

00:40:20.000 You have to be born fast, and we can shave off a few milliseconds.

00:40:23.000 Yeah.

00:40:24.000 In MMA, we can make you... 0.59

00:40:26.000 I can take a regular Joe and get him all the way up to UFC. I can't make him UFC champion.

00:40:30.000 I won't say I can make him UFC champion.

00:40:31.000 To be UFC champion, you need a talent.

00:40:33.000 Right.

00:40:34.000 Okay?

00:40:34.000 There's a talent there to be in the 1%.

00:40:38.000 But to get you to UFC, because there are so many possibilities, there are so many ways to trick your opponent, there are so many ways to turn the tables on him, the torque no longer matters.

00:40:46.000 Or torque is less significant.

00:40:49.000 So if we're talking about football, where I'm only allowed to do these certain maneuvers, trickery is put to the side.

00:40:54.000 You're not allowed to trick me.

00:40:57.000 But in MMA, you're allowed to trick me any which way you want.

00:40:59.000 There are very few little rules, okay?

00:41:02.000 But outside of these bard rules, these bard maneuvers, you can trick me any which way you want. 0.97

00:41:07.000 So what happens is you take your opponent into a maze.

00:41:09.000 You take your opponent into a world where torque doesn't matter so much.

00:41:12.000 And that's why the more restrictive a sport is, let's say for instance boxing.

00:41:17.000 Boxing is more restrictive than Muay Thai.

00:41:19.000 So the guys with torque are gonna do better in boxing than they will necessarily in Muay Thai, because in Muay Thai I can use more trickery.

00:41:25.000 I could be a little dweeb and just beat you with clinching, or I could beat you with a trick kick, or I could beat you with a back kick. 0.99

00:41:31.000 Now, for instance, a back kick, anybody can generate knockout power with a back kick.

00:41:35.000 However, with a right cross or left hook, not everybody's gonna have that bone-crushing power.

00:41:39.000 However, if you teach somebody how to throw a proper back kick, which you know, because you got the best back kick in the game, You could teach a regular Joe in a few years how to generate knockout power.

00:41:48.000 So now he has that element on the table.

00:41:51.000 So because MMA is so, you know, there's so few rules.

00:41:58.000 We have a greater environment for the intellect to shine.

00:42:03.000 You said something once to one of your fighters in between rounds and it really stood out.

00:42:07.000 You said, I want you to overwhelm his mind with possibilities.

00:42:12.000 You're overwhelming him.

00:42:14.000 You're making him think about all the potential variables that are coming his way.

00:42:17.000 That is a great way to put it.

00:42:19.000 We talk about variety.

00:42:22.000 So everybody's looking for a pattern.

00:42:24.000 If I do jab, jab, cross...

00:42:27.000 And I do it three, four times.

00:42:28.000 The fourth time, you're going to see it.

00:42:29.000 It's going to be slower to you.

00:42:31.000 Why? 0.99

00:42:31.000 Because your brain is... 0.99

00:42:33.000 Again, this is all hypothetical.

00:42:35.000 This is just my personal experience.

00:42:36.000 I'm basing this on my own personal experience.

00:42:38.000 When somebody does something to me a second or third time, I see it.

00:42:42.000 Personally, I feel like I'm perceiving it slower.

00:42:45.000 And I have a window to counter you.

00:42:47.000 However, when I spar with George, George is the trickiest guy, I'll tell you why.

00:42:50.000 Because he has so many tricks, he has so many attacks that he rarely ever shows you the same trick twice.

00:42:58.000 And he's the master at adapting.

00:43:00.000 So if you do a trick on him once, And you try it again, he's gonna shut you down.

00:43:04.000 So look at all his rematches.

00:43:06.000 When he rematched BJ Penn, when he rematched Matt Hughes.

00:43:08.000 Every time they rematch, it was progressively worse.

00:43:10.000 The third time he fought Matt Hughes was even easier.

00:43:12.000 Don't try the same trick on George twice.

00:43:14.000 You're gonna get crushed.

00:43:15.000 And I think that's why me, as a martial artist, I developed a lot of variety of skill.

00:43:20.000 Because every week I'd have to come up with a new trick or else George is gonna shut that down.

00:43:23.000 So after 10 years, I started becoming like a trickster.

00:43:26.000 You know, what other magic trick can I get away with one time?

00:43:28.000 Because next week I knew you had a new trick because it won't work on him again.

00:43:31.000 He's going to get wise to it.

00:43:32.000 He's a master at...

00:43:33.000 It might work once on him.

00:43:35.000 The second time, you're going to get shut down.

00:43:37.000 Well, I feel like that was a factor in Dominic Cruz losing to Cody Garbrandt.

00:43:43.000 Exactly.

00:43:43.000 Because those alpha male guys had seen that trick so many times.

00:43:49.000 Apparently Justin Buchholz can imitate Dominick Cruz in training.

00:43:53.000 Like that weird herky-jerky movement with the hands down.

00:43:56.000 He's a weird one, man.

00:43:58.000 He's one of the weird...

00:43:59.000 Out of all the fighters I've ever watched fight, Dominick might be the weirdest.

00:44:02.000 I agree.

00:44:03.000 Because you look at him and he's...

00:44:04.000 First of all, he's a great guy.

00:44:08.000 A very smart guy. 0.82

00:44:09.000 But he's crazy in a weird way.

00:44:11.000 It's like one of the things that he says is like, I'm just not very flexible.

00:44:15.000 Why are you even saying that?

00:44:17.000 That doesn't even make any sense to me.

00:44:19.000 Why not get more flexible?

00:44:21.000 It's not like saying, oh, I'm too short. 1.00

00:44:25.000 Well, you can't grow, so you're fucked. 1.00

00:44:27.000 You're never going to play basketball. 1.00

00:44:29.000 Saying I'm not flexible enough- That's an easy fix. 0.99

00:44:32.000 That's the dumbest thing to ever say. 0.99

00:44:34.000 It's like, I mean, it's so much more dumb than I'm not strong enough. 0.99

00:44:39.000 Well, if you gain weight from muscle, you might not be in that weight class anymore. 0.97

00:44:43.000 You got a real problem there.

00:44:44.000 But I'm not flexible enough.

00:44:46.000 You got zero problem.

00:44:47.000 You just have to stretch.

00:44:48.000 But he doesn't stretch.

00:44:50.000 We were talking about jujitsu techniques. 1.00

00:44:52.000 It's like, I can't play that high guard shit. 0.99

00:44:55.000 I don't have any flexibility. 0.99

00:44:57.000 I'm like, okay.

00:44:58.000 What are you saying?

00:44:59.000 Like, that doesn't make any sense.

00:45:00.000 And like head kicks and things along those lines.

00:45:03.000 He's like very stiff in his legs with throwing kicks.

00:45:06.000 That's an easy fix.

00:45:07.000 Yeah, that's an easy fix.

00:45:08.000 Why wouldn't you fix that?

00:45:10.000 That's a good question.

00:45:11.000 But also, the mindset... 1.00

00:45:15.000 Of a champion in this same guy who just, ah, fuck it, I'm not flexible. 0.99

00:45:22.000 I don't even understand how those things live together in the same mind. 1.00

00:45:26.000 If I was training him, I would make him head kick.

00:45:28.000 That's what I would insist on.

00:45:29.000 Head kicks have to be there.

00:45:30.000 Because he doesn't knock guys out with his hands.

00:45:32.000 The head kick has to always be a possibility, always a threat.

00:45:34.000 And then you will knock out guys with your hands.

00:45:36.000 Because they'll have their high guard up. 0.81

00:45:38.000 Because they don't want that kick.

00:45:40.000 And then the uppercut will come. 0.98

00:45:41.000 The body shot will come.

00:45:41.000 The back kick will come.

00:45:42.000 I'll make a back kick for sure. 0.98

00:45:43.000 If you don't have power in your hands, you need to back kick. 0.84

00:45:46.000 You need to head kick. 0.81

00:45:47.000 Those are two weapons that can always knock a guy out.

00:45:49.000 So you don't back kick, you don't head kick.

00:45:51.000 You never score knockouts.

00:45:52.000 Right.

00:45:53.000 Yeah, that's a good point, man.

00:45:55.000 Did you see this Stephen Thompson thing with Darren Till, where he wants them to outlaw that sidekick to the knee?

00:46:01.000 No, I didn't see that. 0.95

00:46:02.000 Well, apparently his knee got really fucked up in the Darren Till fight. 0.94

00:46:06.000 What do you think about that sidekick to the knee that everyone's doing? 0.94

00:46:09.000 Not even the oblique kick, just a front leg sidekick to the knee, the same way Yoel Romero used it on Robert Whitaker, fucked up his knee in the first fight, and then Whitaker used it on Romero right away in the second fight to fuck up his knee. 0.80

00:46:23.000 I think it's a legitimate kick.

00:46:25.000 Yeah.

00:46:25.000 It's a legitimate 100% kick.

00:46:27.000 It allows the smaller, weaker guy to hurt the bigger, stronger guy.

00:46:31.000 Well, and in the case of Darren Till, it allows the bigger, stronger guy to hurt the other big, stronger guy.

00:46:35.000 If it works for the smaller guy, it works for the bigger guy.

00:46:37.000 Yeah.

00:46:38.000 Right?

00:46:38.000 It's just a legit...

00:46:39.000 I think so, too.

00:46:40.000 It's a legit technique you have to prepare for.

00:46:42.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:46:43.000 You're standing in a way that...

00:46:45.000 You see, when somebody's standing sideways, they're harder to punch.

00:46:49.000 They're easier to kick.

00:46:51.000 So you're saying, look, I want to stand in this way where I'm harder to punch, but I don't want you to kick me.

00:46:55.000 So if I stand square, I'm more susceptible to back kick, more susceptible to punches, but less susceptible to leg kicks or the oblique kick or the side kick to the knee or whatnot.

00:47:05.000 Now, I'm not saying to you, don't punch me because I'm more vulnerable this way.

00:47:10.000 So whatever your vulnerability is, You chose that vulnerability by standing sideways.

00:47:15.000 Why don't the Thais stand sideways? 0.69

00:47:16.000 Because they know they're going to get chopped to the leg, right?

00:47:18.000 They're always fighting good kickers.

00:47:20.000 They're always fighting amazing kickers.

00:47:22.000 When you go to Thailand, the guy may be a good puncher, but he's for sure a great kicker.

00:47:26.000 You're not going to run into a guy who doesn't know how to kick.

00:47:28.000 They all know how to kick knee and elbow, and some of them know how to punch really, really well also.

00:47:33.000 So they stand in a way, Muay Thai has developed in a way that's very anti-kick, anti-knee, anti-elbow.

00:47:40.000 And it's not as defensive to the punches.

00:47:43.000 So if I want to avoid punches, I'll stand more bladed.

00:47:46.000 Let's say I'm fighting a BJ Penn who's very heavy-handed and more of a puncher.

00:47:49.000 He doesn't kick much.

00:47:50.000 Well, I'm going to stand bladed.

00:47:51.000 Like you see with George, we made him drop one hand.

00:47:53.000 Why?

00:47:54.000 So he can use his jab from down to up, right?

00:47:56.000 Because it's faster, has a greater reach, and it's harder to counter.

00:48:00.000 Whereas if you would have stood more square in Muay Thai, it would have been useless because BJ doesn't kick.

00:48:04.000 But then you'd be more open to punches.

00:48:06.000 Right.

00:48:07.000 So the way you're standing, the way a Wonder Boy is standing, the antagonist to that, the antidote to that is that kick.

00:48:14.000 Right.

00:48:14.000 So how could you stand that way?

00:48:16.000 Just switch the way you're standing.

00:48:18.000 Okay, now you're more open to punches, but that's adaptation.

00:48:20.000 That's what fighting is about.

00:48:22.000 It's rock, paper, scissors.

00:48:23.000 If I use rock, I don't outlaw paper.

00:48:25.000 I don't say, hey, nobody is allowed to use paper.

00:48:27.000 No, but that's the antidote to what you're doing.

00:48:29.000 Yeah, and when the Thais fight, they have that very light front leg, which would prevent that front leg sidekick to the knee.

00:48:35.000 Exactly.

00:48:36.000 Because they're always very light.

00:48:37.000 So if you kick their knee, it's just going to go backwards anyway.

00:48:40.000 But to stand that way, they're standing that way at a cost.

00:48:42.000 Yes.

00:48:42.000 The punches.

00:48:43.000 And also the cost, they don't have the ability to use that movement, that front leg movement the way that Wonderboy does too.

00:48:51.000 Wonderboy is the master of the front leg.

00:48:55.000 He's the best at standing, completely sidekick.

00:48:58.000 When he fought Johnny Hendricks, a good example, he threw a sidekick to the body, Hendricks stood there, and then he went to a roundhouse kick to the face with the same leg.

00:49:06.000 Masterpiece. 0.99

00:49:07.000 And Hendrix, you could see, was like, fuck, what is this guy doing? 1.00

00:49:10.000 He's like, thump, okay, back, oh shit. 1.00

00:49:13.000 He thought, yeah, you got me with that, but that's not a big deal, and then pop, he gets roundhouse kicked in the face. 1.00

00:49:18.000 That was a masterful performance.

00:49:21.000 Yeah, it was one of his best, for sure.

00:49:22.000 It was incredible.

00:49:23.000 Well, it just shows you the difference between a guy who is, you know, just trying to like kind of plot in with a limited movement and a guy like Wonderboy who's just one of the most difficult guys to sort of pin down.

00:49:36.000 Yeah, incredible.

00:49:37.000 Yeah, his style is very unique and I'm fascinated with him and I'm really fascinated right now with Michael Venom Page.

00:49:44.000 Been watching, do you see his pro boxing fights?

00:49:47.000 No, I didn't see.

00:49:47.000 Right now he's a can crusher.

00:49:49.000 I saw one, yeah.

00:49:50.000 He's a can crusher.

00:49:51.000 He's fighting these guys, and they're setting him up for these spectacular knockouts.

00:49:56.000 But it's still that blitz point karate style that Raymond Daniels has, that a lot of these guys have, and Raymond's obviously adapted very well for kickboxing.

00:50:05.000 I've cheered with Raymond quite a bit.

00:50:06.000 He's a beast.

00:50:07.000 You gotta get him on the show, man.

00:50:08.000 He's such a great guy.

00:50:09.000 I would love to.

00:50:09.000 Yeah, I have to connect you two.

00:50:10.000 Okay.

00:50:10.000 He's amazing.

00:50:11.000 Yeah, we talked a little bit in the past about perhaps doing something on Twitter.

00:50:15.000 He knocks guys out in about 90 seconds on a regular basis.

00:50:20.000 And how does he do it?

00:50:22.000 He does it with the back kick.

00:50:23.000 He's the master at finding a place for the back kick.

00:50:25.000 You don't want to get hit with his back kick.

00:50:26.000 Like, I know you got an incredible back kick.

00:50:28.000 I bet you it's more powerful than his.

00:50:30.000 Okay?

00:50:31.000 But I'll tell you one thing.

00:50:32.000 He will fit that back kick...

00:50:34.000 Everywhere.

00:50:35.000 Everywhere.

00:50:35.000 And he'll do it in a way...

00:50:36.000 You won't see it coming.

00:50:38.000 It's going to hurt so much more.

00:50:40.000 He rarely knocks guys out with his hands.

00:50:41.000 He does surprise guys with his hands every so often.

00:50:43.000 But that back kick, you don't want to be there.

00:50:44.000 Well, it seems like he's getting better with his hands.

00:50:46.000 Yes, yes.

00:50:47.000 His hands are improving.

00:50:48.000 He trains a lot.

00:50:49.000 He trains a lot, that guy.

00:50:50.000 I'm sure.

00:50:50.000 He's still at it.

00:50:52.000 And he's, what, 35, 36 now?

00:50:53.000 I would say, around there.

00:50:55.000 That one...

00:50:56.000 Was it...

00:50:57.000 What's his name?

00:50:58.000 Ombang? 0.88

00:50:59.000 Is that the guy he knocked out with that touch front leg side kick and then jumped up in the air and hit him with a spinning back kick to the face?

00:51:06.000 Woo! 0.99

00:51:07.000 That was some video game shit. 1.00

00:51:08.000 That's unbelievable. 0.99

00:51:09.000 He just jumps up top, pop, and then hits him with a second kick.

00:51:12.000 That's a standard kick.

00:51:13.000 Yes, it is.

00:51:14.000 You know, for Raymond Daniels.

00:51:16.000 But he does it the best I've ever seen, personally.

00:51:17.000 No, no one better.

00:51:19.000 You know, you gotta go back to like Rick the Jet Rufus.

00:51:21.000 Oh, my. 0.99

00:51:22.000 You know, when he fought that really classic fight where he fought that Thai fighter and he got his legs chopped out and everybody was like, oh, shit. 0.98

00:51:29.000 People really got to understand the Muay Thai. 0.98

00:51:31.000 Muay Thai.

00:51:32.000 But he hit that guy with that same kick, that front leg side kick and then spun in the air and hit him with a turning side kick in the face.

00:51:38.000 Yeah.

00:51:38.000 Yeah, man.

00:51:39.000 I love watching that point karate style, that blitz style.

00:51:44.000 I love it. 0.95

00:51:44.000 I love watching that enter into MMA because I used to spar with a lot of those guys and it's fucking hard to deal with. 0.95

00:51:51.000 Those guys that are really good at that fast sprint at you, blitz. 0.99

00:51:56.000 And when you do that, and then you also have takedown defense and Muay Thai skills and Jiu Jitsu, it's like, fuck man, that's a lethal skill to have. 0.92

00:52:04.000 I love doing boxing, Muay Thai, karate, taekwondo. 0.98

00:52:07.000 I love blending it all.

00:52:09.000 I believe all of it is good.

00:52:10.000 Here it is right here.

00:52:10.000 Boom!

00:52:11.000 Play that back again.

00:52:13.000 I mean, come on, man. 1.00

00:52:15.000 This is fucking crazy shit the way he does it, too. 1.00

00:52:18.000 He just hops up, touches you with the front leg. 1.00

00:52:21.000 Bang! 1.00

00:52:22.000 And the second one... 1.00

00:52:22.000 And look, he looks down like he's in a fucking video game. 1.00

00:52:26.000 I mean, that is crazy that this guy is pulling that off. 0.99

00:52:30.000 That was when he was in glory.

00:52:32.000 Look at this.

00:52:32.000 Tap.

00:52:33.000 Boom! 0.99

00:52:33.000 I mean, come on, man. 0.99

00:52:35.000 Who the fuck does that? 1.00

00:52:38.000 And he does that all the time, eh? 1.00

00:52:39.000 All the time!

00:52:40.000 That's not like a one-off.

00:52:41.000 No, no, he could do that all day, yeah.

00:52:43.000 I mean, there's a lot of those karate guys that have that skill set.

00:52:47.000 They can do, like, you know, those braking demonstrations where they hold up pads and they'll do 360 wheel kicks and brake pads.

00:52:54.000 I mean, there's some legitimate karate and traditional martial arts techniques that are finding their way into MMA. Absolutely.

00:53:02.000 You just have to know how to use it.

00:53:03.000 Yeah.

00:53:04.000 And just because a karate guy got beat up by a grappler doesn't mean all the karate he's trained is not good.

00:53:09.000 Right.

00:53:09.000 Exactly.

00:53:09.000 He needs to learn how to grapple.

00:53:11.000 Exactly.

00:53:11.000 He needs to know how to stay on his feet.

00:53:12.000 He needs to learn how to grapple.

00:53:13.000 He needs to learn to set that kick up in a way.

00:53:16.000 Because the thing is, if you're always fighting another karate guy...

00:53:19.000 And then you fight a boxer.

00:53:20.000 The boxer's behavior is just different.

00:53:22.000 It's like what we were saying before.

00:53:23.000 You have to get used to it.

00:53:24.000 And then all of a sudden, you saw the same movie a hundred times.

00:53:27.000 You know how to deal with it.

00:53:28.000 It's like you watch the same movie over and over again.

00:53:30.000 You start predicting what the scene is going to be.

00:53:33.000 You're not caught by surprise.

00:53:34.000 When you're caught by surprise, you're done.

00:53:36.000 You've never done jiu-jitsu before.

00:53:37.000 And I'm doing an arm bar, a basic arm bar.

00:53:39.000 You're getting caught with it.

00:53:40.000 That's why I believe you've got to know everything out there.

00:53:42.000 But you've got to specialize.

00:53:43.000 Don't try to master everything.

00:53:46.000 Know everything.

00:53:48.000 Like, I like to know darts, triangle, heel hook, even though I'm not necessarily a darts guy.

00:53:52.000 But I want to know everything about darts.

00:53:54.000 I don't want to drill it all day long.

00:53:55.000 I just want to know about it.

00:53:56.000 Right.

00:53:57.000 Because when you're trying to put your darts on, I know what you're trying to do.

00:53:59.000 I'm familiar with what you're going for.

00:54:01.000 I can break out of it.

00:54:02.000 You don't go for darts?

00:54:03.000 I do.

00:54:04.000 But, I mean, I wouldn't say it's my best submission.

00:54:07.000 I do do darts.

00:54:08.000 No doubt about it.

00:54:09.000 Well, you don't have the longest arms in the world.

00:54:11.000 Exactly.

00:54:11.000 Yeah.

00:54:12.000 Exactly.

00:54:12.000 Do you ever try a Japanese necktie?

00:54:15.000 Yes, I don't use them that much, but I'm familiar with them.

00:54:17.000 It's the solution for guys who don't have long arms. 0.96

00:54:20.000 I have short arms too, but the Japanese necktie became a specialist at that.

00:54:24.000 Really?

00:54:25.000 Yeah, you get that clamp over the top of the neck and then you drop down with the left shoulder and you tuck the head into the forehead and you hook one of the legs with your leg and you crank that neck up so it's a You're pushing in with your chest and then cranking.

00:54:38.000 It comes quick too.

00:54:40.000 It's a nasty, nasty neck crank.

00:54:42.000 I love it.

00:54:43.000 It's just so good.

00:54:44.000 And it's also, it's there a lot.

00:54:47.000 It's one of those techniques that people, they're not aware of the danger that one position. 0.99

00:54:52.000 There's a few guys that are really good at it, and whenever you feel that arm going underneath your neck, you're like, fuck, I gotta get out of here. 0.95

00:54:59.000 Because it's such an easy one to cinch up. 0.98

00:55:02.000 The darts is hard.

00:55:03.000 It's hard to cinch and to get all the way up.

00:55:05.000 For us.

00:55:06.000 I remember working with Marcelo.

00:55:08.000 I got to train Marcelo Garcia.

00:55:10.000 And we were doing just a one-on-one training session.

00:55:13.000 And he was telling me he doesn't like darts.

00:55:16.000 And I was like, he doesn't teach darts, doesn't believe in darts.

00:55:18.000 And I'm like...

00:55:20.000 But your arms are short, you know?

00:55:21.000 If you have this monstrously long guy, you won't tell him to do darts.

00:55:24.000 No, no, no, don't do darts.

00:55:25.000 It's not good.

00:55:25.000 It's not a good submission because your arm's in the way.

00:55:27.000 I'm like, dude, there's some guys with the most devastating darts.

00:55:30.000 You don't want to be in their darts.

00:55:32.000 Tony Ferguson.

00:55:33.000 Exactly.

00:55:34.000 He doesn't like leg locks.

00:55:35.000 He says, no, leg locks are no good.

00:55:36.000 Oh, that's so crazy.

00:55:38.000 Imagine a Paul Harris walks into your gym and you're like, no, don't do leg locks.

00:55:41.000 It's like, dude, that's his game.

00:55:42.000 But he tapped out Rico Rodriguez with a heel hook in Abu Dhabi.

00:55:46.000 He would tell you it's not a good submission.

00:55:48.000 It shouldn't have worked.

00:55:49.000 Oh, that's hilarious.

00:55:50.000 He was telling me he doesn't like his guys to wrestle.

00:55:52.000 I'm like, why?

00:55:53.000 I'm like, when you fought Jake Shields, you did a single leg and you took him down.

00:55:56.000 He's like, he shouldn't have fell.

00:55:58.000 So Jake Shields shouldn't have fell, he said.

00:55:59.000 But I'm like, your wrestling is good.

00:56:01.000 He's like, no, no, no.

00:56:02.000 You shouldn't wrestle a wrestler at all.

00:56:04.000 What?

00:56:04.000 And I was like, I get what you're trying to say.

00:56:07.000 But there's a time and place where I wrestle a wrestler, when I see a good vulnerability.

00:56:10.000 Yeah.

00:56:11.000 And I don't know, he's very, I think he's changed over the years, but when I rolled with him, he was like at the top, you know?

00:56:16.000 I wouldn't question him, I wouldn't like, you know, who am I to tell him I don't agree, you know?

00:56:21.000 Like, he doesn't like Kimura.

00:56:22.000 He would tell me, no, don't do Kimuras. 1.00

00:56:23.000 Too much muscle, right?

00:56:24.000 That's what he said.

00:56:24.000 It's a power move.

00:56:25.000 Yeah, it's a power move.

00:56:26.000 Yeah.

00:56:26.000 But when you look at his career, all the things he doesn't like, that's what he's been caught with.

00:56:30.000 Like Braulio caught him with the darts.

00:56:32.000 Jacare caught him with the kimura.

00:56:36.000 That's right, Braulio caught him with the darts.

00:56:38.000 Who else caught him with the darts?

00:56:40.000 Braulio caught him once or twice.

00:56:41.000 Once, I think.

00:56:44.000 Drysdale caught him with the darts.

00:56:46.000 Darts work real good, man.

00:56:48.000 They do.

00:56:49.000 If you have the attributes, they're great.

00:56:51.000 Yeah, why would he say he doesn't teach the darts?

00:56:52.000 That's so crazy.

00:56:53.000 I think he's got short arms, and for him it doesn't work.

00:56:56.000 He doesn't like arm triangle.

00:56:57.000 He says, no, forget the arm triangle.

00:56:58.000 What?

00:56:59.000 Yeah, I'm like, dude.

00:57:00.000 That's my specialty.

00:57:00.000 You ever feel George's arm triangle?

00:57:02.000 Arm triangles are nasty.

00:57:03.000 Yeah, arm triangles are destructive.

00:57:05.000 Well, a guy like George is such a crusher.

00:57:06.000 He's got long arms, too.

00:57:07.000 Yeah, and he's heavy.

00:57:08.000 Oh, my.

00:57:09.000 He's just heavy, puts that weight on you.

00:57:11.000 He knows how to control and squish.

00:57:12.000 I will never let my arm get across my body, because I know it's over.

00:57:15.000 There's two things you never want to give George.

00:57:17.000 Kimora, because he'll rip your arm off. 1.00

00:57:20.000 And two, arm triangle.

00:57:23.000 Katakatami.

00:57:24.000 Yeah, there's Rafael Lovato. 0.99

00:57:27.000 He's got a nasty fucking arm triangle. 0.98

00:57:30.000 He's competing in Bellator now. 0.99

00:57:32.000 I'm always fascinated when I see super, super high-level jiu-jitsu guys that enter into MMA. Because I'm like, okay, for sure, these guys who are used to just training MMA, they are not going to know what the fuck hits them when a guy like Hodger Gracie grabs them. 0.92

00:57:50.000 Or like a guy like Damien Maia. 0.89

00:57:51.000 And we've seen it time and time again.

00:57:53.000 There's a difference in the level.

00:57:55.000 And so the argument is always, should you be just, what's the best way to be?

00:58:00.000 Is the best way to be an elite specialist at one particular thing, like a Raymond Daniels or a Wonderboy?

00:58:06.000 Or is it to be a guy who can kind of do everything really well, like George?

00:58:11.000 So here's my perspective on that.

00:58:13.000 That's such a great question.

00:58:14.000 I mean, that's the heart of training.

00:58:17.000 You could flood your system.

00:58:19.000 So what does that mean?

00:58:20.000 When you flood your system, you're giving your student too many things to master.

00:58:23.000 He's just really not good at anything.

00:58:25.000 Right.

00:58:26.000 Or you can bottleneck him.

00:58:28.000 You're giving him too few skills that people know what he does.

00:58:31.000 Like for instance, a classic example is Chuck Liddell.

00:58:33.000 He went on a tear for a while, but he's still the same guy.

00:58:35.000 And after a while, the next generation, they understood what he does.

00:58:38.000 They understood the pockets where you're safe, where you're in danger.

00:58:40.000 Like Mishida is a great example. 0.99

00:58:42.000 Early on, it was such a mystery.

00:58:44.000 Now we're like, okay, we get what he does.

00:58:46.000 We've understood his patterns.

00:58:47.000 Patterns are huge in fighting and in life, period.

00:58:50.000 Human beings are pattern-detecting machines.

00:58:53.000 Whether they know it or not, whether they can verbalize it or not, we are pattern-detecting machines.

00:58:58.000 That's why I like sparring a lot, because sparring, I've had a thousand people throw a right hand at me.

00:59:03.000 When you throw your right hand, my mind, the subconsciously, is going to compare that right hand you're throwing to a thousand different right hands I saw.

00:59:09.000 And it's going to say it matches this one the most.

00:59:11.000 Again, this is my narrative.

00:59:13.000 And this is what I see.

00:59:14.000 And this has personally been my experience, right?

00:59:16.000 When I train somebody who's new and you throw a punch at them, they flinch. 0.71

00:59:20.000 Why?

00:59:21.000 You've overwhelmed them with information.

00:59:23.000 But after a while, they see a punch and they're relaxed and they see it and it seems slow motion because at first it was too fast for them.

00:59:29.000 It's too much to compute.

00:59:31.000 So my students, what I do is I give them a small amount of technique and when they get better, I give them a new technique.

00:59:36.000 So I want them to get a certain level of competence with that technique and my standard is it has to be instinctual.

00:59:43.000 If the technique is instinctual, I've taught it to you well.

00:59:46.000 Meaning if you've done it live on the mat...

00:59:49.000 On a regular basis.

00:59:50.000 You execute on a regular basis.

00:59:51.000 It's time for me now to give you another gem.

00:59:54.000 Because if I don't give you another gem, I'm going to bottleneck your art.

00:59:57.000 You're going to become too predictable.

00:59:59.000 But if I give you a gem too early, if I give you another technique too early, I'm flooding your system.

01:00:03.000 I'm flooding your game.

01:00:05.000 Your game is just diluted.

01:00:08.000 It's just too weak.

01:00:08.000 So with George, we're always reinventing George for the next fight.

01:00:11.000 We're always adding one new or two new gems, depending on how much time we have.

01:00:15.000 But there's always a next factor.

01:00:16.000 When you fight him, he's not going to do the same patterns we did the last fight.

01:00:19.000 You could watch his tape.

01:00:21.000 That's why I told George, why is it harder to be champion than to become champion?

01:00:25.000 Because when you're champion, everybody's watching you and studying your patterns.

01:00:28.000 It's a matter of time before you're old news.

01:00:32.000 So you gotta reinvent yourself before the next fight.

01:00:35.000 That's why I didn't want him fighting three times a year.

01:00:37.000 I told him you fight twice a year.

01:00:39.000 And they were making comparative with Chuck.

01:00:40.000 I got a lot of heat for that.

01:00:42.000 They're like, Chuck fights three times a year.

01:00:43.000 George should fight three times a year.

01:00:44.000 We're like, we'll see how our careers go.

01:00:46.000 I want George to fight twice a year.

01:00:48.000 Because to reinvent him takes six months.

01:00:51.000 We're gonna do that twice a year.

01:00:53.000 That way he'll be champion longer.

01:00:55.000 I used to tell him when he became champion, I said, I want you to be champion for 10 years.

01:00:58.000 It happens in boxing.

01:00:59.000 It's going to happen in MMA for the first time.

01:01:01.000 There's going to be a champion for 10 years.

01:01:03.000 I used to tell him that when he first won the belt.

01:01:05.000 And he was like, really?

01:01:06.000 How are we going to do that?

01:01:07.000 We're going to do only training camps that last six months.

01:01:11.000 You can only really do a training camp every six months if you want to hit a new level.

01:01:14.000 It takes six months.

01:01:16.000 Every fight you're going to be at a new level and you're going to do something nobody knows.

01:01:19.000 They haven't seen it before.

01:01:21.000 How did you come up with these numbers?

01:01:22.000 What made you decide?

01:01:23.000 I read one very influential book called The New Power Program by Michael Cogan.

01:01:29.000 I don't know if you've ever heard of it.

01:01:30.000 I have heard of the book.

01:01:31.000 I have not read it.

01:01:32.000 He says, look, there's two programs. 1.00

01:01:34.000 He says, look, if you can do a training program shorter than six months, you're either Superman or you're dumb. 0.99

01:01:43.000 He formulated it in a way. 0.98

01:01:44.000 He says, I never met Superman.

01:01:46.000 A real training program is six months long.

01:01:49.000 So that just always really influenced me.

01:01:51.000 I think his book was really, really basic, and this was one of the first books I read on training, and it really influenced me.

01:01:56.000 He teaches in the book periodization, but he dumbs it down really, really well.

01:02:00.000 So if you read Tudor Pompa's book on periodization, it's just too much intellectual jargon.

01:02:05.000 It's hard for a regular Joe, especially at the stage I was then, to read that book and understand what he's trying to say.

01:02:11.000 Today I can understand it.

01:02:13.000 But Michael Kogan made it really simple for me.

01:02:15.000 And he's like, look, if you want to train and reach a new level, it takes six months.

01:02:19.000 This is the body's natural process.

01:02:22.000 So it would be like trying to plant a seed and have an apple tree in three months.

01:02:27.000 And he says, no, the apple tree grows at a certain rate.

01:02:31.000 So, a human body does things at a certain rate.

01:02:33.000 There's no way around it.

01:02:34.000 You need stress, you need recovery, then you have adaptation.

01:02:38.000 Here's the cycles you have to go through to reach a new level.

01:02:40.000 And it ends with a plyometric cycle.

01:02:42.000 Now, today, I don't really use that system anymore because I've found better ways over the years.

01:02:45.000 It ends with a plyometric cycle?

01:02:47.000 Yes.

01:02:47.000 Why does it end with a plyometric cycle?

01:02:49.000 Because you have to hit the speed of your sport.

01:02:51.000 So, for instance, let's say you do a lot of back squatting.

01:02:55.000 Okay, let's see you do back squatting. 1.00

01:02:56.000 And your numbers on the back squat go up.

01:02:58.000 Do you think that's going to make you a better fighter?

01:03:00.000 No.

01:03:01.000 No.

01:03:02.000 Why?

01:03:02.000 So why do the squatting?

01:03:04.000 Because it'll make you stronger.

01:03:05.000 Okay, but does it make you stronger on the field?

01:03:08.000 In the octagon?

01:03:09.000 It can make you stronger in certain positions.

01:03:11.000 In certain positions?

01:03:12.000 Yes.

01:03:13.000 Now, I think Michael Cogan would say it can make you stronger in certain positions if you can apply that force over a certain time.

01:03:20.000 So power and strength are two different things.

01:03:22.000 Strength is, can you lift that bar?

01:03:24.000 It weighs 500 pounds.

01:03:25.000 You can lift it?

01:03:26.000 Okay, good.

01:03:27.000 Can you get that bar off the ground and locked out in 1.5 seconds?

01:03:30.000 That's the question we want to ask for sports.

01:03:33.000 How fast can you apply the force?

01:03:34.000 That's power.

01:03:36.000 Force over time.

01:03:37.000 Strength over time.

01:03:39.000 So when you want to shoot a double leg, you have to do it in the window.

01:03:43.000 So that's why the plyometric phase is the last phase.

01:03:45.000 It's very important that you need to take all that strength you cultivated and translate it to a level of speed.

01:03:50.000 So I need George to change level and explode in a fraction of a second.

01:03:55.000 So that's why I like things like sprinting, track and field, etc.

01:03:58.000 These are things done in a short period of time.

01:04:00.000 The ground contact, the ground force reaction, the time you spend on the ground, applying force into the ground.

01:04:05.000 So when you want to apply force on a person, you first have to apply the force in the ground.

01:04:10.000 And then that reaction is applied into your opponent, right?

01:04:14.000 So every action has an opposite equal reaction.

01:04:16.000 How fast can you apply that force into the ground?

01:04:19.000 Now squatters, if I take you and I make you squat, A slow squat, down and up.

01:04:24.000 I'm training you like a tow truck, right?

01:04:26.000 Then I measure your vertical jump.

01:04:28.000 Your vertical jump is going to have gone down after you've done six months of squatting.

01:04:31.000 It's not going to have gone up.

01:04:33.000 Why?

01:04:33.000 Because you're training like a tow truck.

01:04:35.000 You're telling your body, look, I need to lift lots of heavy weights in a slow fashion.

01:04:40.000 However, if I make you do plyometrics or I make you do Olympic lifting, You know, Olympic lifting is very fast.

01:04:45.000 It's 1.5 second contraction on the hamstring.

01:04:48.000 1.5 second.

01:04:50.000 And there's a certain point where it's 0.5 seconds.

01:04:53.000 Then I make you test your vertical.

01:04:55.000 Now your vertical has gone up.

01:04:57.000 So there's an element of speed.

01:04:58.000 So Michael Cogan, at the end of the program, he does a four-week or three-week phase of, he calls it the link cycle, where you're doing plyometrics.

01:05:06.000 This is very important.

01:05:07.000 That's fascinating.

01:05:08.000 I've never heard it put that way, and I like the thought process behind it.

01:05:13.000 I think there's a lot of people that are using a lot of plyometric drills now, and it's way more common when you see training montages of guys hopping over hurdles.

01:05:25.000 But I really have to think that George was one of the first guys I ever saw do that stuff.

01:05:28.000 I used to tell him, do you want to train like a tow truck, or do you want to train like a Ferrari?

01:05:31.000 Which one do you want to be?

01:05:33.000 If you look at Damien Maia, he's like a tow truck.

01:05:35.000 Yeah.

01:05:36.000 He's stiff.

01:05:37.000 Even when he throws a punch, he's very stiff.

01:05:38.000 Yeah.

01:05:39.000 Why?

01:05:39.000 Because years of gi training is like...

01:05:41.000 Yeah.

01:05:42.000 I've trained my body to make an isometric hold. 0.63

01:05:44.000 And now your body behaves isometrically.

01:05:47.000 Why are you asking it to do anything different?

01:05:49.000 Right.

01:05:49.000 I never asked my body to do something in practice that I don't want it to do on fight night.

01:05:53.000 So I do believe squatting is important.

01:05:55.000 Squatting is important to develop a general strength.

01:05:58.000 Yeah.

01:05:59.000 So let's say, for instance, you're always doing plyometrics.

01:06:01.000 You might have an overuse injury.

01:06:03.000 Certain muscles are not being activated.

01:06:04.000 You go on the squat rack, you do a few squats.

01:06:06.000 And I believe you've got to do squats, not too heavy, about 70% of your max, and do it fast.

01:06:12.000 You'll still get all the benefits.

01:06:14.000 What about lowering it?

01:06:16.000 Lowering it how?

01:06:17.000 Do you lower it fast or do you lower it slow?

01:06:19.000 Lower it fast and up fast.

01:06:21.000 Really?

01:06:21.000 Yeah.

01:06:21.000 So for instance, Fred Hatfield, he's probably said it best.

01:06:24.000 He said he's the first man to officially squat 1,000 pounds.

01:06:28.000 He said, look, throw a paper.

01:06:31.000 You take a paper, you crumple it up, and you throw it.

01:06:34.000 It's too light for it to go anywhere.

01:06:36.000 You throw it really hard, but because it's so light, it doesn't go anywhere.

01:06:40.000 Take a bowling ball.

01:06:41.000 A bowling ball's too heavy.

01:06:42.000 You throw it, it doesn't go anywhere.

01:06:44.000 You take a baseball, that's the right amount of resistance.

01:06:47.000 It's the right amount of weight.

01:06:48.000 Now you're going to apply more force on that baseball.

01:06:50.000 You're going to get more force out of it.

01:06:52.000 Why?

01:06:52.000 It's in the Goldilocks range.

01:06:54.000 So for instance, let's make it really simple.

01:06:58.000 Let's say you weigh zero pounds.

01:06:59.000 I put you on a scale, you weigh zero pounds, you have a bar on your back, the bar weighs 100 pounds.

01:07:04.000 Okay, so we're looking at the scale now.

01:07:06.000 The scale says 100 pounds.

01:07:08.000 The bar is on your back.

01:07:10.000 Let's take away your weight just to make it really simple.

01:07:13.000 You go down and up.

01:07:14.000 The scale is going to read 101. That's the minimum amount of power you have to put into that scale for it to come up.

01:07:23.000 So when you go down, the scale is going to say 100, 100. As you come up, it's going to say 101. For it to have a positive trajectory, you have to apply 101 pounds upwards.

01:07:33.000 Sorry, downwards, and then the reaction will be upwards.

01:07:36.000 If I put that weight on my back, if I put 70 pounds, if I take 70% of the weight, and I go up and down really fast on the scale, the scale is going to read 101. Minimum.

01:07:48.000 If I explode up really fast, it's going to read 100, 100, 200, 300. Now, I got the benefits of a maximum contraction.

01:07:57.000 Let's say 100 pounds was the maximum you can lift.

01:08:00.000 But I don't have the weight...

01:08:03.000 Of 100 pounds on me.

01:08:04.000 You know somebody who really made this popular is Louie Simmons.

01:08:08.000 He learned it from the Russians. 0.54

01:08:09.000 You know Louie Simmons?

01:08:10.000 Have you had him on your show?

01:08:11.000 Yes.

01:08:12.000 He's a brilliant trainer.

01:08:13.000 He's a fascinating guy.

01:08:14.000 He's a brilliant human being. 1.00

01:08:15.000 He's out of his fucking mind too. 1.00

01:08:16.000 He's out of his mind? 1.00

01:08:17.000 We interviewed him in his gym.

01:08:19.000 Really?

01:08:19.000 Yeah, in Columbus.

01:08:20.000 It was great.

01:08:21.000 But he's a genius when it comes to lifting.

01:08:23.000 He's a genius.

01:08:24.000 He knows what he's talking about.

01:08:25.000 He read Super Training.

01:08:26.000 I also read Super Training.

01:08:27.000 And Super Training is about...

01:08:29.000 Lowering the weights to the right amount and doing a plyometric with it.

01:08:32.000 You get the same benefits as using maximum weight, but you don't get the side effects, the soreness, the injury, the redlining.

01:08:38.000 You don't get any of that.

01:08:39.000 So the Russians found a great way to apply maximum force on a bar, but they also get speed. 0.99

01:08:44.000 They're not training like tow trucks.

01:08:46.000 They're training like Ferraris.

01:08:46.000 That's actually where I got the term from Louis Simmons.

01:08:48.000 He really clarified it for me, made it really simple.

01:08:51.000 So, like, what kind of, like, say if you could bench press 315 pounds, what would you use?

01:08:57.000 Use between 65 to 80% of that weight, and then just do it quick.

01:09:00.000 Boom! 0.99

01:09:02.000 Boom! 0.99

01:09:02.000 You'll get the same amount of resistance if you do it quickly as if you had maximum weight on it. 0.99

01:09:07.000 So he doesn't use maximum weight except for once a week.

01:09:10.000 And the reason why he explains it is he says, look, you have proprioceptors in your system.

01:09:14.000 Proprioceptors is like, it's what tells you if your arm is up or down, if your arm is bent to your chest.

01:09:18.000 If I close your eyes and I lift your arm, you'll be like, you lifted my arm.

01:09:21.000 How do you know that?

01:09:22.000 Proprioceptors.

01:09:23.000 He says, let's say you're working with 75 pounds and your maximum is 100. When you go to lift that day on the competition day, when you get 100 on your bones, your body's going to be like, hey, I've never felt that amount of weight.

01:09:38.000 There's an arthrokinetic reflex.

01:09:40.000 Shut the muscles down.

01:09:40.000 We've never felt that weight.

01:09:42.000 This is the narrative that he gives us.

01:09:44.000 He says, because you've never felt that weight, your body is not going to allow you.

01:09:47.000 There's a safety mechanism in your body.

01:09:48.000 It says, look, we're not used to this.

01:09:50.000 Let's not take a chance.

01:09:52.000 And he says if you get your body used to that, the arthrokinetic reflex will quiet down and allow you to lift.

01:09:58.000 There's an inner mechanism, a safety mechanism in the human body.

01:10:01.000 So he says to bypass that, we do heavy weights once a week to numb that reflex.

01:10:09.000 But the majority of the work is done with lighter and fast, 75%.

01:10:14.000 What do you think of, like, Pavel Tatsulini's principles?

01:10:19.000 Strong first principles of, like, say if you could do 10 reps of something, you don't do 10, you do 5. That's exactly right.

01:10:26.000 100%.

01:10:26.000 I've read all of Tatsulin's works, almost all of them.

01:10:29.000 He's a brilliant trainer.

01:10:30.000 I agree with that 100%, outside of competition.

01:10:32.000 Let's explain it to people.

01:10:34.000 Yeah.

01:10:34.000 Okay, so, yeah, let me, okay, so let's say, for instance, let's say, you know, I'm a big believer in never being sore.

01:10:40.000 You should train, and the next day you should wake up feeling good.

01:10:43.000 Okay, now why?

01:10:44.000 How's that possible?

01:10:45.000 Well, because...

01:10:46.000 Look, if...

01:10:47.000 Okay, that's a great example.

01:10:49.000 Let's say...

01:10:49.000 Let's say your energy levels...

01:10:51.000 We're talking about fit people, by the way, right?

01:10:53.000 Every human being.

01:10:54.000 So guys never worked out before?

01:10:56.000 Even first day.

01:10:57.000 First day, never trained.

01:10:57.000 How is it possible to work out and not be sore?

01:10:59.000 No problem.

01:11:00.000 Beautiful.

01:11:00.000 Okay, here we go.

01:11:02.000 So, let's say there's something called rate of perceived exertion.

01:11:07.000 Okay?

01:11:08.000 So, let's say I make you do pull-ups. 0.98

01:11:10.000 And let's say the maximum amount of pull-ups you can do, the maximum amount of pull-ups is 10. Let's keep a nice round number.

01:11:17.000 At 11, you couldn't do 11. If I pointed a gun at you, you couldn't do 11. Should I make you do 10 pull-ups on our workout?

01:11:25.000 No.

01:11:26.000 I'm going to make you do 5. Why?

01:11:28.000 Because I'm setting you up to work the next day.

01:11:29.000 The next day we're going to do 5. And the next day we're going to do another 5. And then we're going to do 6. When 6 is really easy, we're going to do 7. Why?

01:11:37.000 If you count, if you did 10 pull-ups on Monday, you're going to be sore until Thursday.

01:11:41.000 Let's say it's really your max.

01:11:44.000 So Thursday, you've only done 10 pull-ups.

01:11:45.000 From Monday to Thursday, you've only done 10 pull-ups.

01:11:47.000 Me, I've been doing 5 pull-ups every day.

01:11:49.000 So I'm at 20 pull-ups already.

01:11:50.000 25 pull-ups.

01:11:51.000 I have more volume than you.

01:11:53.000 Now, if you add up at the end of the year, who trained more?

01:11:57.000 I've trained way more than you.

01:11:59.000 So let's say I go to jiu-jitsu practice.

01:12:01.000 I'm doing jiu-jitsu every single day, 3 rounds, 5 days a week.

01:12:04.000 That's 15 rounds.

01:12:05.000 You go in twice a week, but you kill yourself.

01:12:08.000 You do five rounds each day.

01:12:09.000 You push yourself those last two rounds and you burn yourself out.

01:12:11.000 I still did 15. You're at 10. At the end of the year, I've done countless rounds.

01:12:16.000 I've had so much more training than you.

01:12:18.000 So how much training can we pack in in the week?

01:12:23.000 That's the real question.

01:12:24.000 How much volume can you expose your athlete to?

01:12:27.000 So I always tell people, look, exercise can produce energy.

01:12:32.000 So let's say I'm feeling like a 7 out of 10. 10 being I'm really energized.

01:12:36.000 One, I'm really lethargic, feeling like I need to lay down.

01:12:40.000 And seven, I'm feeling good.

01:12:42.000 If I get up and I do the right amount of exercise, the right amount, I can feel like an 8.5.

01:12:49.000 Exercise can give me a tonic effect like drinking this coffee.

01:12:52.000 So let's say I just do some jumping jacks.

01:12:53.000 I hit the back for a couple of rounds.

01:12:54.000 I'm feeling good.

01:12:56.000 Once you get that high, shut it down.

01:12:58.000 Don't go into the phase where your body's beat up, tight, broken up.

01:13:02.000 Don't redline the body.

01:13:03.000 That's only for training camps for a small period of time.

01:13:08.000 Why?

01:13:08.000 Because you get a little bit more from the system.

01:13:10.000 But in the long run, you get less.

01:13:12.000 In the long run, you've taxed the system.

01:13:15.000 So if you do that regularly, by the time you actually get good, you'll be broken up.

01:13:19.000 That's why I do a lot of flow trading.

01:13:20.000 Have you ever heard of Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi's flow?

01:13:25.000 No.

01:13:25.000 Okay, so, Jamie, can you look up a flow chart?

01:13:28.000 It'll be so much simpler.

01:13:30.000 Like, just put in flow, flow in the workplace, or flow chart.

01:13:33.000 This is pure genius.

01:13:35.000 This guy is a pure genius.

01:13:36.000 Basically, he went...

01:13:37.000 And he coined the term flow.

01:13:39.000 So when you're in a state of flow, we've all been in a state of flow.

01:13:41.000 The number one way to know that you're in a state of flow is time flies by.

01:13:46.000 I'm sure sometimes you've done podcasts and you're like, whoa, is it three hours already?

01:13:49.000 It was a great podcast.

01:13:52.000 The one where you have the worst guest or you're having the worst workout, it feels like every minute is an hour.

01:13:57.000 That's a bad...

01:13:57.000 You're not in a state of flow.

01:13:59.000 A state of flow is you're having the right amount of difficulty, but it's not so difficult that you go into stress, and it's not so easy that you're bored.

01:14:06.000 It's the right amount of challenge.

01:14:08.000 So let's say, as simple as playing Tetris, if I put you on a level that's too high, you're going to play for five minutes and you'll be like, I'm done.

01:14:16.000 If I put you on a level too easy, you're going to be like, this is boring.

01:14:20.000 If I put you at the right amount of level, see that's the flow channel.

01:14:23.000 So if the challenge is too high, you'll meet anxiety.

01:14:27.000 If it's too low, you're bored.

01:14:29.000 When I go in the practice room, I'm trying to create flow.

01:14:31.000 I'm having fun.

01:14:33.000 Training should be addictive.

01:14:36.000 Imagine training was addictive.

01:14:38.000 Everybody would train, everybody would be fit.

01:14:39.000 But people always go into anxiety.

01:14:41.000 They go and they kill, they slam their body.

01:14:43.000 Then I have to convince you to do it again three days later, two days later.

01:14:46.000 And you're like, dude, the mental energy is going to take me to get there.

01:14:50.000 It shouldn't be, it should be, training should be a pulling force.

01:14:53.000 It should be pulling you.

01:14:54.000 You want to go training.

01:14:55.000 If you don't want to go training, it's not fun.

01:14:57.000 If it's not fun, you're not going to do a lot of it.

01:14:59.000 And if you're not going to do a lot of it, you're never going to reach mastery.

01:15:02.000 So how do I make it pleasurable?

01:15:03.000 How to make it fun?

01:15:05.000 I have to be in a flow state.

01:15:06.000 And you can get into a flow state in almost anything.

01:15:08.000 But when you're out of that flow state, cut it.

01:15:11.000 We're gonna get further.

01:15:13.000 We're gonna do more training if we cut it today and come back in tomorrow.

01:15:16.000 Because I'm a big believer in consistency over intensity.

01:15:20.000 Intensity should be done once in a while.

01:15:22.000 Because by nature, intensity can only be done once in a while.

01:15:25.000 If you're going hard every day, you're not really going hard every day.

01:15:28.000 You can't go your max every day.

01:15:29.000 There's a cost to going to your max.

01:15:32.000 Can you sprint every single day?

01:15:34.000 You cannot sprint every single day. 0.95

01:15:36.000 It's ludicrous.

01:15:36.000 You can sprint once or twice a week.

01:15:38.000 The best sprinters in the world, they sprint once or twice a week.

01:15:40.000 Nobody sprints every day.

01:15:41.000 Because intensity, by nature, entails that you need to take a break.

01:15:46.000 Because if you don't need to take a break, you didn't really go to your maximum intensity.

01:15:49.000 If you lift your maximum lift, the maximum amount of reps, the maximum weight you can lift.

01:15:56.000 If you do two reps, that wasn't your max.

01:15:59.000 Because if it was, you wouldn't have a second rep in you.

01:16:02.000 You understand?

01:16:03.000 I would have to give you a break for you to have a second rep. 1.00

01:16:05.000 So we didn't find your true max, right?

01:16:08.000 Intensity, maximum effort entails you have to stop.

01:16:11.000 Because it's the maximum.

01:16:12.000 There was no more reserves.

01:16:14.000 There are no more reserves.

01:16:15.000 So what do you think about people that say there's no such thing as overtraining?

01:16:20.000 Here's the John Dennerhart narrative.

01:16:23.000 He coins it really, really well.

01:16:25.000 He says, look, it's under rest.

01:16:28.000 So he says, look, you couldn't overtrain if you didn't give your body the rest later.

01:16:32.000 Yeah.

01:16:32.000 But he says, look, no matter how I push in practice, if I didn't kill myself, I can rest from it and recover and have super compensation.

01:16:40.000 I agree with that. 0.51

01:16:41.000 Some guys have made great strides with just mental fortitude and mental strength overtraining the shit out of themselves.

01:16:47.000 Okay, but can I ask you this?

01:16:49.000 Yes.

01:16:49.000 They were successful, yeah?

01:16:51.000 Yeah, but their bodies break down.

01:16:52.000 Right.

01:16:53.000 But could they have been better?

01:16:55.000 If they used flow.

01:16:56.000 Exactly.

01:16:57.000 As good as they were.

01:16:58.000 Dan Gable, for example.

01:17:01.000 Dan Gable essentially was done in his 20s, right?

01:17:04.000 In terms of his body's broken down, knee replacements, hip replacements, that kind of deal.

01:17:10.000 Let me ask you this.

01:17:10.000 Who wins more often, Russians or American wrestlers?

01:17:13.000 Russians.

01:17:13.000 Every time an American wrestler wins, he's like some prodigy.

01:17:17.000 It does happen, but it's rarely he's a technical master.

01:17:21.000 However, you have these Russian guys that win gold medals.

01:17:23.000 You've never heard of them, and they're like Michael Jordans of the sport.

01:17:26.000 There's just so many of them.

01:17:28.000 They train long, consistent practices.

01:17:31.000 Whereas in America, we do Monday, Wednesday, Friday hard. 0.95

01:17:33.000 We kill it.

01:17:34.000 And then you rest Tuesday, Thursday. 0.98

01:17:36.000 The Eastern Bloc had a totally different understanding.

01:17:39.000 They're like, it's volume, volume, volume, near the fight, short and intense.

01:17:43.000 Only near the competition phase.

01:17:45.000 But before that, it's the maximum amount of volume you can...

01:17:48.000 Imagine me and you, we're two athletes, A and B. You're A and B. You're training jiu-jitsu three times a week really, really hard.

01:17:54.000 You're going all out.

01:17:56.000 I'm training jiu-jitsu every single day.

01:17:59.000 My average practice is two hours.

01:18:01.000 Your average practice is two hours.

01:18:02.000 But when you go in, you kill it. 1.00

01:18:03.000 You go with all the black belts and you kill it. 1.00

01:18:07.000 At the end of the year, I'm averaging two practices more than you.

01:18:12.000 So I've had 100 practices more than you by the end of the year.

01:18:15.000 104 practices.

01:18:16.000 Let's give two weeks for vacation.

01:18:18.000 100 practices more than you.

01:18:20.000 200 hours more than you I've been training.

01:18:22.000 When we roll, your intensity that you put on the mat is going to be irrelevant.

01:18:26.000 Why?

01:18:26.000 Because I've also tasted that intensity periodically.

01:18:29.000 It's not that much of a factor now.

01:18:30.000 When you go super aggressive on me, when you attack me aggressively, I have felt that.

01:18:35.000 I know how to deal with it.

01:18:36.000 Plus I have an extra 100 hours on you.

01:18:38.000 200 hours.

01:18:39.000 So I'm going to mangle you. 0.93

01:18:40.000 You know what I'm saying?

01:18:41.000 The volume is far more important than the intensity.

01:18:45.000 The intensity by nature needs to be done periodically.

01:18:49.000 If you do it every day, it's not intensity.

01:18:51.000 So how do they structure their training?

01:18:54.000 They're more playful.

01:18:55.000 They kind of warm up.

01:18:57.000 They kind of flow roll.

01:18:58.000 They do a lot of technique, high emphasis on technique.

01:19:00.000 Now a lot of people hearing this are going to be like, well the Russians also are funded by their government.

01:19:04.000 Their government supports them a lot more than maybe an American wrestler.

01:19:08.000 I agree with that.

01:19:09.000 There are many factors.

01:19:10.000 However, we cannot deny that they're technically...

01:19:13.000 I hate to say the word superior, but they're technically more advanced, technically, when it comes to wrestling.

01:19:17.000 They have more of a flow understanding.

01:19:19.000 They play around and the practice gets more and more intense, more and more intense, until you see them going really, really hard.

01:19:25.000 They're going live, you know?

01:19:26.000 They're going really, really rough.

01:19:27.000 But they were playing.

01:19:28.000 They have a more playful attitude.

01:19:29.000 Look at the Cubans. 1.00

01:19:30.000 You ever see Cubans sparring? 0.96

01:19:33.000 They're like 50 guys in a room.

01:19:34.000 They're just touch sparring.

01:19:35.000 There's no headgear.

01:19:36.000 There's no mat on the floor.

01:19:37.000 They're literally sparring on concrete.

01:19:38.000 You think they're really trying to drop each other?

01:19:40.000 They're on concrete.

01:19:40.000 I mean, the Cubans are the top boxers.

01:19:44.000 They consistently win gold medals.

01:19:46.000 But in practice room, they're playful.

01:19:47.000 Nobody gets hurt.

01:19:47.000 Like you're seeing the ties.

01:19:49.000 The ties are just...

01:19:49.000 If you go in there and you kick a tie really hard, he won't spar with you anymore.

01:19:53.000 He'll be like, this guy's too amateur.

01:19:56.000 There's a time and place for intensity.

01:19:58.000 I'm not anti-intensity.

01:19:59.000 I think there's a time and place.

01:20:00.000 Angelo Dundee was probably arguably the greatest boxing trainer in history.

01:20:04.000 He says, look, fighting is for fight night.

01:20:06.000 In practice, it's only practice.

01:20:09.000 George Champion has that attitude and I think that's why he's so good and so healthy today.

01:20:14.000 Because he never hurts his sparring partners.

01:20:15.000 People line up to want to spar with him.

01:20:17.000 It's a joy to spar with him.

01:20:19.000 Yeah, I love this idea and I love this approach.

01:20:22.000 I think that we have this attitude that you have to be tough.

01:20:26.000 We have this attitude that you have to work hard.

01:20:29.000 And I mean, I've fallen prey to that many, many times in my life where you just got to be tougher.

01:20:34.000 You got to work out harder.

01:20:35.000 You got to push harder.

01:20:36.000 But when I read Pavel's stuff, one of the first things that struck me is like, well, yeah, of course, if you just do five reps every day, and then you won't be sore, you could do it more often, and then your body, like, you get farmer strength.

01:20:50.000 Exactly.

01:20:51.000 Where's farmer strength come from?

01:20:52.000 Farmers aren't, they're not going to exhaustion.

01:20:54.000 No!

01:20:54.000 You know, they're not, like, throwing hay bales to the point where, you know, they literally, they're heaving, they put their hands on their knees, like, come on, five more!

01:21:03.000 Exactly.

01:21:04.000 You should never be sore.

01:21:05.000 If you're sore, you overdid it.

01:21:07.000 Whoa.

01:21:07.000 Because I can't train the next day if I'm sore.

01:21:09.000 But I overdo it every time I work out then.

01:21:12.000 What's that?

01:21:12.000 I said I've overdone it every time I worked out.

01:21:14.000 You may have.

01:21:16.000 You gotta...

01:21:17.000 There's a lot of people listening to this right now going, wait a minute.

01:21:19.000 What? 1.00

01:21:20.000 How the fuck... 0.99

01:21:22.000 Make your workouts a 7 out of 10 and do them every day. 0.99

01:21:24.000 You're going to get far more training hours.

01:21:26.000 You're going to spike your metabolism far more often.

01:21:30.000 Your energy levels, your mood is going to be far more up.

01:21:35.000 And training is going to be more addictive.

01:21:38.000 Now, what kind of training do you do at this stage?

01:21:40.000 Like, you're not competing, but you're constantly in there sparring with guys who are professionals, and you're constantly training them.

01:21:46.000 Like, what kind of stuff do you do?

01:21:48.000 I do jujitsu, wrestling, Muay Thai, and a small amount of conditioning after practice.

01:21:53.000 I'm too bored.

01:21:54.000 I find jumping hurdles and doing weights and stuff...

01:21:58.000 Me, personally, I don't have to take that much enjoyment of it.

01:22:02.000 I can do 5 to 20 minutes in a practice.

01:22:05.000 Isn't that because sparring is just so fun? 0.63

01:22:07.000 It's so much fun.

01:22:08.000 I'm in a flow state.

01:22:08.000 We're having fun.

01:22:09.000 We're wrestling.

01:22:10.000 I think conditioning, you can't get away with it.

01:22:12.000 You need it.

01:22:13.000 We've got to talk about what George was saying on your podcast, that he doesn't do strength and conditioning.

01:22:16.000 There's a language issue there.

01:22:18.000 There's a language issue.

01:22:19.000 We've got to talk about that because we've done tremendous amounts of strength and conditioning, me and George.

01:22:24.000 Barrels full.

01:22:26.000 But he has a different definition.

01:22:28.000 There's a misunderstanding.

01:22:29.000 I really want to clarify that.

01:22:32.000 But if we roll for an hour, for me it passes like this.

01:22:36.000 Because it's so fun.

01:22:37.000 It's so fun.

01:22:37.000 We're having a good time.

01:22:38.000 I'm fascinated.

01:22:39.000 I'm fascinated.

01:22:41.000 I'm always learning new things.

01:22:43.000 To swing a kettlebell, to do push-ups, pull-ups, I can only do that for a fine amount of time.

01:22:48.000 So I'll put a timer, three rounds, two minutes, and I'm doing it.

01:22:50.000 And I bite the bullet and I do it.

01:22:52.000 It keeps me healthy.

01:22:53.000 But I don't go and practice to just do that.

01:22:55.000 That I never do.

01:22:56.000 It's always after my workout, after I do jiu-jitsu.

01:22:59.000 So you never have a day where you say, today I'm going to do Olympic lifting?

01:23:02.000 No, I don't think Muhammad Ali ever did that.

01:23:04.000 Muhammad Ali never, he boxed and then he did his conditioning.

01:23:07.000 Mayweather does his conditioning, then he boxes.

01:23:10.000 It always came together.

01:23:11.000 Why?

01:23:11.000 When I go to the gym, I'm going to go have fun.

01:23:13.000 I'm going to go wrestle.

01:23:14.000 I'm going to go box.

01:23:15.000 I'm going to have a blast.

01:23:16.000 Then I'm going to grab the kettlebell.

01:23:18.000 I'm going to do a few presses.

01:23:19.000 I'm going to do a few Turkish get-ups and I'm done. 0.70

01:23:22.000 Because I need to have some general fitness.

01:23:24.000 You have general fitness, then you have specific fitness.

01:23:27.000 Specific fitness is to get better at my sport.

01:23:29.000 General fitness is to keep me healthy, strong, and allow me to reach new levels of athleticism that later, in the long term, can translate to my sport.

01:23:37.000 Later.

01:23:38.000 But if you just do your sport, in my opinion, your system is going to break down.

01:23:42.000 Your back is going to break down.

01:23:43.000 Your knee is going to break down.

01:23:44.000 Your shoulder is going to break down.

01:23:45.000 You need to stimulate certain muscles that are not getting stimulation in your specific sport.

01:23:51.000 You create atrophy in certain muscles because you're not using them really.

01:23:54.000 I need to work my stabilizers.

01:23:56.000 I need to swing the kettlebell.

01:23:57.000 I need to squat.

01:23:58.000 I need to do certain exercises.

01:24:00.000 What are the standard cores?

01:24:02.000 Kettlebells?

01:24:03.000 Is that like your main...

01:24:04.000 Triple extension is number one.

01:24:05.000 So any type of squatting maneuver.

01:24:06.000 I don't particularly use the squat.

01:24:08.000 Triple extension?

01:24:09.000 Triple extension.

01:24:09.000 So your knee, hip, and ankle are bending.

01:24:12.000 So like a squat.

01:24:13.000 Your knee, hip, and ankle are bending.

01:24:14.000 I like to jump.

01:24:15.000 I like to throw the med ball a lot against the wall.

01:24:18.000 I like to do hurdles.

01:24:19.000 I like to do box jumps.

01:24:20.000 I like to do very low impact plyometrics.

01:24:22.000 I like sprinting.

01:24:23.000 Sprinting is huge.

01:24:24.000 You ever do the beep test?

01:24:25.000 What's that?

01:24:26.000 Oh, you got the space for the beep test here.

01:24:28.000 You got to implement beep test.

01:24:29.000 What is it?

01:24:29.000 It's the best way to do cardio.

01:24:31.000 Really?

01:24:31.000 You ever hear the soccer players use it a lot?

01:24:32.000 It's a beep, right?

01:24:33.000 You run, you beep, and then it beeps back.

01:24:35.000 And the faster the beeps go, the faster you have to run.

01:24:38.000 That's really amazing.

01:24:39.000 Because what I do is I set a timer for five minutes.

01:24:41.000 I put it on a high pace, like I'll put it at 10 or 11, and I'll just shuttle back and forth.

01:24:45.000 And it tells you how fast to run, the beep test.

01:24:48.000 And some days I'll feel really good, I'll do 11. Because I know how fast I have to run to keep up with the beats.

01:24:53.000 And that just, it's amazing for cardio.

01:24:55.000 It's short, sweet, painless.

01:24:58.000 And it's very, it translates very well to sports.

01:25:01.000 Do you do Tabatas?

01:25:03.000 Do you ever do Tabata?

01:25:03.000 Tabatas are good, yeah.

01:25:04.000 I think Tabatas are good.

01:25:05.000 If they're done well, they're good.

01:25:07.000 But again, you have to do it in a way it doesn't create soreness.

01:25:09.000 Because Tabata can create soreness.

01:25:11.000 You have to be very, I wouldn't do Tabata kettlebell swing.

01:25:13.000 That'll cook my hamstrings. 1.00

01:25:15.000 I'll probably do like hurdle jump.

01:25:17.000 Like you take a small hurdle and you just hurdle over it for 20 seconds.

01:25:20.000 Now what you're saying though, like there's got to be a bunch of CrossFit people out there right now that are screaming into their phones.

01:25:26.000 They're wrong.

01:25:26.000 All due respect.

01:25:28.000 They're wrong.

01:25:28.000 How long can you say all due respect?

01:25:30.000 With all due respect, they're wrong.

01:25:31.000 Let me tell you why.

01:25:31.000 Okay.

01:25:32.000 And look, if you like CrossFit, do it.

01:25:33.000 Whatever motivates you, do it.

01:25:35.000 Okay.

01:25:35.000 CrossFit's problem is it's fatigue seeking.

01:25:38.000 Yes.

01:25:39.000 It says, look, go out there and burn yourself out.

01:25:40.000 That's totally wrong.

01:25:42.000 They're not building any skill.

01:25:44.000 Show me a guy who's a champion in CrossFit, champion in Jiu-Jitsu.

01:25:47.000 That guy would need two lifetimes to reach mastery in both of those.

01:25:51.000 Why?

01:25:52.000 Because my CrossFit workout is going to tax me so much.

01:25:54.000 I cannot learn armbar sweep, triangle choke, double leg takedown, underhook.

01:25:59.000 I've taxed my whole system.

01:26:00.000 My system is in recovery.

01:26:02.000 When your system is in recovery, what can you do but rest?

01:26:05.000 You understand?

01:26:06.000 Okay, Hafa Mendez.

01:26:07.000 Do you think Hafa Mendez, arguably one of the greatest pound-for-pound jiu-jitsu guys in the world, do you think he's got a great crossfit workout that he's really mastered, he's really good at?

01:26:16.000 Do you think he has a great back squat?

01:26:17.000 Do you think he's a great deadlifter?

01:26:18.000 It doesn't look like it.

01:26:19.000 No, he doesn't.

01:26:20.000 Believe me.

01:26:20.000 Do you think Gordon Ryan, he's a great Olympic lifter?

01:26:25.000 No.

01:26:26.000 They're always going to be at an amateur level in the fitness world.

01:26:29.000 Why?

01:26:30.000 Because if they were experts, they would have taken so much from their jiu-jitsu.

01:26:34.000 Like, look at George.

01:26:35.000 He does gymnastics.

01:26:35.000 And I'm the one who...

01:26:36.000 I twisted his arm a little to put him in gymnastics.

01:26:38.000 Why?

01:26:40.000 Because I thought it would give him tremendous benefit because of the amount of...

01:26:44.000 First of all, they use a lot of body weight, so it doesn't cost us anything neurologically.

01:26:48.000 Body weight exercises are very easy to recover from.

01:26:53.000 Bodyweight exercises are very easy on the nervous system.

01:26:57.000 They use leverage instead of weights.

01:27:00.000 Plus, the stabilizer strength is unbelievable.

01:27:02.000 So, and of course, I wanted coordination.

01:27:04.000 I felt George was a little bit stiff, mechanical.

01:27:06.000 And the tumbling makes you more fluid.

01:27:10.000 I thought I would create more efficiency this way.

01:27:14.000 So we get him there, and there's difficulties from A to F. We're still at A and B, and he'll always be at A and B. Maybe he'll touch C in his career, but he'll never get to F. You'd have to start really young, and you'd have to do it full-time.

01:27:28.000 Imagine somebody trying to get good at jiu-jitsu, doing it part-time.

01:27:31.000 He'll never get good.

01:27:32.000 He'll be so-so.

01:27:33.000 He'll reach such a level.

01:27:35.000 CrossFit is too fatigue-seeking for an MMA fighter.

01:27:39.000 Now, if CrossFitters followed, if they just followed that 70% rule, they periodically went to their max, periodically, as opposed to every single workout, go totally out.

01:27:50.000 I bet you their top, top guys don't go all out every day.

01:27:53.000 I bet you if you watch what their top guys do, they taper off the workout.

01:27:57.000 They make the workout between 70 and 85% of their true max and they work volume.

01:28:02.000 And then closer to competition, they go higher in intensity.

01:28:04.000 I guarantee you that's what the best CrossFitters do.

01:28:06.000 There's no way that the guy who goes balls out every day is going to add up as much workout and as much training time as the guy who's going 70 to 85% of his max.

01:28:14.000 There's just no way.

01:28:15.000 But when they do those classes, like say they do a CrossFit class, and I'm speaking out of ignorance, honestly, because I only watch them on video, I've never done a CrossFit class, but it seems to me they're competing against each other.

01:28:24.000 Yeah, they're going all out, trying to set up PR. Every class.

01:28:27.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:28:28.000 That's ridiculous. 0.96

01:28:28.000 All due respect, I mean, it just doesn't make any sense. 0.96

01:28:31.000 But why is it so popular?

01:28:33.000 Because people think that's right.

01:28:35.000 Because why?

01:28:35.000 Because when you watch a prime time or a fight, the guy's at the peak.

01:28:38.000 He's at a point in his training camp where he's at the high end of intensity.

01:28:44.000 So people are always watching the last part of your camp.

01:28:48.000 The part where you're peaking.

01:28:49.000 And then you're going to go taper off for 10-15 days.

01:28:51.000 They don't see that part and they don't see the months before where you ramped up to that level.

01:28:55.000 They just see the last two, three weeks where it's the last few sparrings and we're mimicking fight speed to the maximum as we can.

01:29:02.000 We're flirting with danger here.

01:29:03.000 We're only doing it a little bit, but that's the part everybody's watching.

01:29:06.000 So they think, oh, if you want to become really good, you have to flirt with danger every day.

01:29:10.000 That's what their workouts are.

01:29:11.000 If you see George train throughout the year, you'd be like, hey, that wasn't so intense.

01:29:15.000 That wasn't so intense.

01:29:16.000 There's another really mellow practice.

01:29:18.000 I remember when I was younger, I was training at the Grant Brothers gym and I would see Otis Grant.

01:29:21.000 He's a world champion boxer.

01:29:23.000 Everybody knew him in Canada.

01:29:24.000 He's the man.

01:29:25.000 And he was training really relaxed.

01:29:27.000 I was like, dude, I'm training harder than him.

01:29:29.000 But that's his millionth workout.

01:29:31.000 It was my 10th.

01:29:32.000 He's doing it in the long run.

01:29:34.000 He's added way more years of training.

01:29:35.000 So that's when I started to understand that the champion, the best guy, He's training for the long run.

01:29:40.000 It's far more intelligent.

01:29:42.000 He's getting far more workouts in than me that's burned out and the next day I need a rest.

01:29:47.000 So it's consistency over intensity.

01:29:50.000 Intensity entails you need to take a break.

01:29:52.000 There's no way around it. 0.99

01:29:53.000 So if you're a young person listening to this and you've got a coach that's trying to burn you out every day, what the fuck do you do? 0.98

01:30:03.000 Um... 0.99

01:30:03.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:30:04.000 If you go into the gym and go, you know what? 1.00

01:30:06.000 I was listening to Farasa Hobby the other day and Farasa is saying, you're a retard. 0.97

01:30:13.000 Here's my, you know, when I roll with guys, I think they feel, when I grab them, I'm grabbing them gently, and they realize it. 0.98

01:30:19.000 And I'll let them, like, I'll let guys pass my guard.

01:30:21.000 Like, I'll just go ahead, start set control.

01:30:24.000 And I'll just get, they'll get the message that we're just kind of playing around.

01:30:27.000 Right.

01:30:28.000 And then later, when we're going more intense, you know, they'll feel it.

01:30:31.000 They'll feel the intensity.

01:30:32.000 But I don't always roll hard.

01:30:34.000 If you see me rolling, I usually will roll with blue belts and purple belts.

01:30:37.000 Why?

01:30:37.000 Because I need to warm up.

01:30:38.000 I need three, four rounds of warm up.

01:30:40.000 Right.

01:30:40.000 I don't want to even have a tight shoulder or tight hamstring.

01:30:44.000 Of course.

01:30:45.000 I don't want anything tight.

01:30:46.000 Of course.

01:30:47.000 So I warm up with them really good.

01:30:49.000 When I'm really warm, then I go and I wrestle.

01:30:51.000 I like to go wrestle.

01:30:52.000 I like to stand up.

01:30:53.000 Okay, who wants to wrestle now?

01:30:54.000 Let's go.

01:30:55.000 Because I'm really warm now.

01:30:56.000 I can wrestle.

01:30:56.000 I can hit the ground.

01:30:57.000 But you're in a position where you can sort of determine and dictate what kind of exercises you do.

01:31:03.000 Right.

01:31:03.000 But the question was like, if you're a young person and you're entering into an MMA gym and the instructor, those to be kind, is a meathead, right?

01:31:13.000 Which there's a lot of them out there.

01:31:14.000 There is.

01:31:15.000 Yeah.

01:31:15.000 What do you do?

01:31:16.000 What do you do? 0.91

01:31:17.000 You might have to take a few beatings as a white belt. 0.92

01:31:20.000 You might.

01:31:20.000 I mean, I grinded my gears when I was younger, but as you get older and more skilled, now you can take the VIP lane.

01:31:27.000 Now's the time.

01:31:27.000 You've got the skill and you've got the knowledge.

01:31:29.000 But early on, you have less miles on you, so you'll survive more of a beating.

01:31:33.000 You ever see those?

01:31:34.000 There's a lot of jujitsu classes where they go through an extremely rigorous conditioning routine before they ever do any training.

01:31:42.000 And I've always disagreed with that.

01:31:43.000 I agree.

01:31:44.000 Totally right.

01:31:45.000 Yeah, I feel like...

01:31:46.000 Show me one world champion that did it that way.

01:31:48.000 Well, I don't know.

01:31:49.000 Maybe it's possible that they did.

01:31:51.000 Who?

01:31:52.000 I don't know.

01:31:53.000 I don't know who did what.

01:31:54.000 I've trained with a lot of the greatest jiu-jitsu guys in the world.

01:31:58.000 And they all warm up with technique.

01:32:02.000 Yeah.

01:32:03.000 All of them.

01:32:03.000 You think Ryan Hall gets up and does his burpees before practice?

01:32:06.000 You think he goes and he runs five miles and he does weights?

01:32:09.000 I know that a lot of the old school guys, they were into that.

01:32:14.000 Isn't Ralph Gracie famous for those conditioning drills they do?

01:32:18.000 I don't know, but he never won...

01:32:20.000 He was in a time and place where very few people knew jiu-jitsu.

01:32:24.000 Now the secret's out.

01:32:26.000 Who are the top guys?

01:32:27.000 What are they doing?

01:32:29.000 Yeah, I feel like there's also a thing where people want to be really tired from workouts.

01:32:33.000 They feel like they're getting a great workout in if you beat them down.

01:32:38.000 Yeah, I agree with that.

01:32:40.000 There's a disconnect.

01:32:42.000 There's like, I want to feel pain. 0.94

01:32:43.000 Punish me.

01:32:44.000 Yeah, you're retarding growth, though.

01:32:47.000 People don't like that word retard anymore, because they think you're talking about someone with a disease.

01:32:52.000 But the real term of retarding, you're slowing down growth.

01:33:00.000 And that's really what retarded action is. 0.99

01:33:04.000 Like, you have an issue in that the way you're approaching things is uniquely damaging to your ultimate goal of progress.

01:33:14.000 I agree.

01:33:15.000 But it's so common! 0.99

01:33:18.000 Someone right now is listening to thousands of people that are going to class and they know that they're going to have to do all these crazy burpees and all this crazy shit before class. 1.00

01:33:29.000 It's so fucking common. 0.98

01:33:31.000 Icarus, you fly too close to the sun, what happens to you? 0.99

01:33:33.000 You burn, baby.

01:33:34.000 And you drown. 0.98

01:33:35.000 Stay in the middle.

01:33:37.000 Stay in the middle.

01:33:38.000 So if you're going to do those conditioning exercises, can I half-ass them?

01:33:40.000 Half-ass them a bit.

01:33:41.000 Yeah.

01:33:42.000 I give you permission.

01:33:42.000 That's why I like to do my conditioning after.

01:33:46.000 Yeah.

01:33:46.000 Because my body's warm.

01:33:47.000 I agree, too.

01:33:48.000 And I don't need...

01:33:49.000 Because the thing is, look, when you do conditioning before, you weaken your stabilizers.

01:33:52.000 The prime mover...

01:33:53.000 The muscles in your body that are prime movers have more endurance than your stabilizers.

01:33:58.000 So if you weaken the stabilizers...

01:34:00.000 Your joint is less stable while you're rolling. - Yes.

01:34:03.000 - The element of fatigue can put your joints in danger.

01:34:06.000 That's why I only do, because when you're doing exercises, you're in control.

01:34:11.000 You're not in a live roll with somebody trying to tug on your arm.

01:34:13.000 - Right. - So I need maximum strength when somebody's trying to tug on my arm in case I'm in a bad position.

01:34:18.000 I need to make sure that I have my strength levels are there to protect my joints.

01:34:21.000 Joint protection is huge.

01:34:23.000 You need to make sure your joints are healthy.

01:34:24.000 It's huge.

01:34:25.000 What kind of exercises do you do to make sure your joints are protected?

01:34:28.000 Well, I do the supple leopard.

01:34:30.000 I do a lot of mobility work, and I do low-impact plyometrics.

01:34:35.000 Low-impact.

01:34:36.000 So, for instance, that's why I like the med ball, throwing the med ball against the wall.

01:34:39.000 I like to do steps, you know, like you have a block, like a 12-inch block, and I like to jump, like do steps over, back and forth.

01:34:46.000 So you kind of jump up in the air, but you never leave the ground because the block is also high.

01:34:49.000 So you never get the negative contraction.

01:34:51.000 You never get the impact of hitting the ground.

01:34:53.000 I like sprinting.

01:34:54.000 So explain that.

01:34:55.000 How are you not getting the negative impact?

01:34:57.000 So let's say, for instance, this is a block.

01:35:00.000 And this is my feet right here.

01:35:01.000 So I'm like this.

01:35:02.000 I'll jump.

01:35:03.000 Okay, so I'll jump.

01:35:06.000 Okay, so you touch the block.

01:35:07.000 I'm touching the block.

01:35:08.000 So when I jump off the ground, I'm landing on the block.

01:35:12.000 So I'm stepping down, jumping up.

01:35:14.000 Stepping down, jumping up.

01:35:16.000 I see.

01:35:16.000 So I'm always exploding up, but landing on the block softly.

01:35:20.000 Because when you jump up, it's the landing that kills your joints.

01:35:24.000 If I put up a 50-inch box and I make you jump up, the landing's going to be very soft.

01:35:30.000 If I tell you you jump over a hurdle, now you're in mid-air and you're crashing down towards the ground and you land, you gotta absorb that shock.

01:35:37.000 But that's why I like hill sprints.

01:35:39.000 Hill sprints are great because your foot never leaves the ground.

01:35:41.000 Even though you're exploding upwards, the ground is coming up with you.

01:35:44.000 So it's a very soft landing.

01:35:46.000 The soft landing is key.

01:35:48.000 Yeah.

01:35:49.000 That makes a lot of sense.

01:35:50.000 That makes a lot of sense.

01:35:52.000 But what about hitting a bag then?

01:35:54.000 It's the best.

01:35:55.000 Cardio is the best.

01:35:55.000 I do a lot of Dutch drill for cardio.

01:35:57.000 Dutch drills?

01:35:58.000 What's that?

01:35:59.000 Left hook, right kick, right hand, left kick.

01:36:00.000 Three minutes.

01:36:01.000 Just ba-ba-boom.

01:36:02.000 Ba-ba-boom. 0.87

01:36:04.000 Sometimes I do a three-punch combo, two-punch combo, and I finish with a kick or a double kick.

01:36:07.000 And I just spike my heart rate.

01:36:09.000 That way I'm developing my skill, developing my cardio.

01:36:11.000 I get very lean when I do that.

01:36:13.000 And I feel great.

01:36:15.000 I feel my energy levels are up.

01:36:16.000 It's better than doing bike or running personally because I'm developing my skill and I'm also spiking my heart rate.

01:36:21.000 A Dutch drill can be very intense on the heart rate.

01:36:24.000 It's low impact and it's a plyometric.

01:36:25.000 It's everything I need.

01:36:27.000 Yeah, what weight heavy bag do you use?

01:36:30.000 I use the Fertex, the giant pole bag, they call it.

01:36:34.000 Like a big, big giant bag.

01:36:35.000 It touches the ground, so when I kick it, it doesn't move. 1.00

01:36:37.000 Oh, that's heavy as fuck. 0.99

01:36:38.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:36:38.000 That's like a 300 pound bag, right? 1.00

01:36:40.000 Yeah.

01:36:40.000 Why do you like that one?

01:36:41.000 Because when I kick it, the bag doesn't swing, so I don't have to reset.

01:36:45.000 Oh.

01:36:45.000 So I can keep that pace really high.

01:36:47.000 So I'm going pop, pop, pop.

01:36:49.000 And are you hitting it full blast or are you just sort of...

01:36:52.000 As I get warmed up, I hit harder and harder until I'm full blast.

01:36:55.000 Wow.

01:36:55.000 So I might start really relaxed, kicking low to the leg.

01:36:57.000 Then as the workout gets warmer and warmer and hotter and hotter, I'm sweating more, I start kicking to the head.

01:37:03.000 Everything is gradual warm up.

01:37:05.000 You know, and when I've had enough, I stop.

01:37:07.000 Like, I'm not going to make myself sick because I'm working out tomorrow again.

01:37:10.000 Right.

01:37:11.000 Now, what about stretching?

01:37:13.000 Stretching I like, but I prefer mobility.

01:37:15.000 So mobility is the element of stretching your muscle, but also creating motion.

01:37:19.000 The joint has to be in a type of rotation, in or out.

01:37:23.000 Why?

01:37:23.000 Because you're creating synovial fluid to the joint.

01:37:26.000 The joint is really more important to me than the muscle.

01:37:28.000 Because the muscle rejuvenates itself.

01:37:30.000 The joint doesn't.

01:37:31.000 It does at a lesser degree.

01:37:33.000 So I gotta always be oiling up the joints.

01:37:34.000 This is very important to me.

01:37:36.000 Very important.

01:37:37.000 Now, when you say, like, mobility, like, what do you do, like, for your hamstrings and things like that if you're trying to stretch them out and also do mobility?

01:37:45.000 So, let's say I stretch out my leg.

01:37:46.000 I'll be just kind of Moving around.

01:37:48.000 Bending at the hip, in and out.

01:37:50.000 I won't just leave it out there static.

01:37:52.000 There has to be a type of motion.

01:37:54.000 I see.

01:37:54.000 It's very important because when I'm wrestling or I'm doing jiu-jitsu, my leg's out there and I'm creating motion.

01:37:58.000 I have to move.

01:37:58.000 I'm not just putting it out there.

01:37:59.000 Right.

01:38:00.000 There's always a type of movement because when I stretch my leg out to stop you from passing the guard, I'm going to be moving my body at the same time.

01:38:06.000 That's mobility.

01:38:06.000 That's the difference between stretching and mobility.

01:38:08.000 There is a stretch element to mobility, but in stretching, there's no mobility element.

01:38:12.000 Now what about yoga?

01:38:14.000 I think yoga is good for relaxation and range of motion.

01:38:18.000 I think it's very good.

01:38:19.000 I just don't personally have the time and energy for it because I'm always in the gym.

01:38:21.000 So for me to find time for yoga is just a little bit difficult.

01:38:24.000 But I think it does allow for a great range of motion and relaxation and centering.

01:38:28.000 If you have the time in your schedule, it's good.

01:38:30.000 I just personally, with three kids and everything that I do, I'm in the gym already too much.

01:38:36.000 Right, right, right.

01:38:37.000 Yeah, I just wonder, like, for fighters, I mean, I'm hearing more and more fighters incorporate yoga into the training sessions to try to create more balance and also stability, joint stability in particular, because you're holding these static positions for long periods of time, balance and...

01:38:55.000 It's a brilliant art.

01:38:56.000 Your core as well.

01:38:57.000 Yeah, it's a brilliant art.

01:38:58.000 If you can have the time and energy to do it, it's great.

01:39:01.000 Now, what about nutrition?

01:39:03.000 Nutrition is huge.

01:39:04.000 Huge.

01:39:05.000 How do you eat?

01:39:07.000 Right now, I just finished Ramadan, so I've been eating a lot of processed foods.

01:39:11.000 Ramadan is the time of the year where I gain a lot of weight.

01:39:14.000 Because normally throughout the year, I eat very little processed foods.

01:39:16.000 I eat natural foods.

01:39:18.000 But during Ramadan, because I have such a small window to eat, to fit my calories in, and I'm very busy all year round.

01:39:23.000 I always have projects, fights, traveling.

01:39:26.000 I eat processed foods.

01:39:27.000 Why processed foods?

01:39:29.000 Because there's more calories in them.

01:39:33.000 If I'm going to go the whole day after no water, no food, I need to have eaten a certain amount of calories in the night.

01:39:41.000 So if I eat a salad and some fruits, I'm going to be at zero by afternoon in a hot gym with a bunch of guys who need to drill and work.

01:39:51.000 And I'm sweating in the gym just standing there.

01:39:53.000 I haven't even started yet.

01:39:53.000 I'm sweating.

01:39:54.000 I got to hold pads.

01:39:55.000 I got to wrestle this guy.

01:39:56.000 This guy needs these positions.

01:39:58.000 I'm working.

01:39:59.000 And at zero.

01:40:00.000 So I need that density of foods that I get from processed foods.

01:40:06.000 But I take a serious loss in energy and I gain weight for sure, no doubt about it.

01:40:14.000 Wow.

01:40:14.000 Processed foods is the worst.

01:40:15.000 So for Ramadan, for the month, in the moment you wake up until the sun goes down, you can't have any food and any water?

01:40:23.000 No, from sunrise.

01:40:25.000 Sunrise.

01:40:26.000 So you wake up before sunrise, you eat.

01:40:29.000 Most people do that.

01:40:31.000 By midway of Ramadan, I stopped doing that because I just can't get up anymore.

01:40:34.000 I just can't wake up.

01:40:35.000 My body's a bit of a wreck.

01:40:37.000 But from sunrise to sunset, you're not consuming anything.

01:40:44.000 No food, no water.

01:40:45.000 If you can have water, it would be easy.

01:40:47.000 I know people who do water fasts.

01:40:48.000 I've done water fasts.

01:40:49.000 It's quite easy.

01:40:49.000 You have the energy.

01:40:50.000 But when you cut the water, it becomes a problem.

01:40:53.000 Especially if you're in a hot gym and you're just sweating standing there.

01:40:56.000 And now it's in the summer.

01:40:58.000 Ramadan's in the summer.

01:40:58.000 It's very humid in Canada and it's hot.

01:41:00.000 It's very hot.

01:41:02.000 So I have to be very careful.

01:41:03.000 And that's why at night, even just to resist eating processed foods, it's too difficult.

01:41:07.000 You've got to eat.

01:41:09.000 So, do you have a specific calorie number that you try to hit?

01:41:13.000 No, not really.

01:41:14.000 Honestly, no.

01:41:15.000 What kind of foods are you eating when you say processed foods?

01:41:17.000 Whatever my mom or wife is going to make. 0.99

01:41:19.000 I'm going to eat a pasta.

01:41:21.000 I'm going to eat bread.

01:41:23.000 I'm going to eat a dessert after.

01:41:27.000 I'm going to have a cheesecake.

01:41:27.000 I'm going to eat all the stuff I don't eat.

01:41:29.000 I'm going to eat all the stuff I never eat.

01:41:31.000 I'll make myself an omelet.

01:41:33.000 I'll just...

01:41:34.000 So you just crush it at night?

01:41:36.000 I crush it at night.

01:41:37.000 I crush it at night. 0.84

01:41:37.000 But I pay the price. 0.84

01:41:38.000 After Ramadan, I got to lose the weight.

01:41:40.000 I got to get back in shape.

01:41:41.000 It's funny because a lot of people would think that if you're not eating all day, that you would lose weight.

01:41:45.000 Yeah, most people do, Ramadan. 0.99

01:41:47.000 They lose weight.

01:41:48.000 Everybody's like, I lost weight, I lost weight.

01:41:49.000 I'm like, guys, I gain weight.

01:41:50.000 Why?

01:41:51.000 Because the thing is, I know what I'm doing the next day.

01:41:53.000 It's going to be rough.

01:41:54.000 I'm not just working in an office.

01:41:56.000 I got to move.

01:41:58.000 I got to move my body.

01:41:59.000 Yeah.

01:41:59.000 So I pack the calories in the night before.

01:42:02.000 I hydrate.

01:42:02.000 And then I go in the gym and I try to make it like...

01:42:05.000 I try to do my routine as usual.

01:42:07.000 The hydrating part's got to be the most difficult.

01:42:10.000 That's got to be exhausting.

01:42:11.000 Yeah, it's tough.

01:42:12.000 Some fighters have actually gone through training camps while they're...

01:42:16.000 I know.

01:42:17.000 Bilal Muhammad.

01:42:18.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:42:19.000 Muhammad Bilal.

01:42:20.000 Yeah.

01:42:20.000 Very dangerous in my opinion.

01:42:22.000 And risky.

01:42:23.000 Well, he won.

01:42:24.000 He won.

01:42:24.000 God bless him, man.

01:42:25.000 He's the man.

01:42:26.000 Yeah, crazy.

01:42:26.000 I have one of my fighters now.

01:42:27.000 He was doing Ramadan.

01:42:28.000 I was telling him off.

01:42:29.000 I was like, listen, you can't book a fight and do Ramadan. 1.00

01:42:31.000 It's one or the other.

01:42:32.000 You either do your Ramadan after the fight, but not during the camp.

01:42:35.000 Because it's too risky.

01:42:36.000 It's too dangerous.

01:42:37.000 Right.

01:42:37.000 And that's one of the things.

01:42:37.000 He was literally sparring.

01:42:39.000 He was literally sparring.

01:42:40.000 I was like, dude, why you look so flat today?

01:42:41.000 He's like, I gotta confess to you.

01:42:42.000 I'm like, what is it?

01:42:43.000 I'm doing Ramadan.

01:42:44.000 I said, dude, you either do Ramadan and cancel your fight or you book your fight and you do Ramadan after. 0.98

01:42:50.000 The two is dangerous.

01:42:52.000 Ramadan is not about putting yourself in danger.

01:42:54.000 Can you do Ramadan anytime you want? 0.96

01:42:56.000 If it interferes with your work, you can do it after when it's convenient.

01:43:02.000 Okay, so you don't have to do it uniformly when everyone else is doing it.

01:43:06.000 No, because he has a fight booked.

01:43:08.000 It's his career.

01:43:09.000 That's how he puts food on the table.

01:43:10.000 Okay.

01:43:10.000 So you have an exception here.

01:43:12.000 Okay, do your Ramadan after your fight.

01:43:14.000 Like for instance, Bektik, Mirzad Bektik, he's doing his Ramadan after he just fought.

01:43:18.000 He's doing it afterwards.

01:43:18.000 Why?

01:43:19.000 Because during the camp, I was like, look, you're either doing Ramadan and we're canceling the fight or...

01:43:24.000 You're going to do your job, and you do Ramadan after. 1.00

01:43:27.000 And he was like, okay, I understand.

01:43:28.000 That's the way it's done.

01:43:29.000 He looked fantastic.

01:43:30.000 He did.

01:43:31.000 Against Lomas.

01:43:33.000 Lomas, rather.

01:43:34.000 Lomas is a very tough veteran.

01:43:37.000 Ricardo's been around.

01:43:39.000 He's fought the best of the best.

01:43:41.000 He's fought for the title.

01:43:42.000 And that was a really, really professional performance by him.

01:43:47.000 Yeah, Ricardo came to win also.

01:43:48.000 And he had that creepy mustache, too.

01:43:50.000 What's up with Beck Dick's creepy mustache?

01:43:53.000 I think he's young, he's exploring his looks, you know?

01:43:57.000 Experimenting with the creepy mustache.

01:43:58.000 Yeah, he's such a good kid though.

01:44:00.000 I love him.

01:44:00.000 He seems like a very, very nice guy.

01:44:02.000 But I was just super impressed with the way he handled Lamas.

01:44:05.000 Because Lamas is...

01:44:06.000 I mean, Lamas is as well-rounded as you're going to get.

01:44:10.000 He's a wrestler.

01:44:11.000 He's got great striking, great submission skills.

01:44:13.000 And he's seen so much that for him to win and win down the stretch, like he was overwhelming him deep into the second and the third.

01:44:22.000 I was like, well, this is a guy that's clearly hitting his stride and hitting the next level.

01:44:28.000 Yeah, he did a great job.

01:44:29.000 Now, when a guy like that is coming off of a fight like the Darren Elkins fight, how do you build him back up after that fight?

01:44:37.000 Well, you know what?

01:44:38.000 I feel like he was trying to do too much and he wore himself out.

01:44:41.000 And Elkins is one of those guys where if you give him a window, the fight's over.

01:44:44.000 He's one of those guys who's dangerous.

01:44:47.000 He knows what to do in a particular situation.

01:44:49.000 He's not going to panic.

01:44:50.000 And he found the right moment to beat Mirzad.

01:44:52.000 But I think just Mirzad overworked himself.

01:44:55.000 And he didn't find pockets to...

01:44:57.000 Because the thing is, you cannot exert yourself at a maximum pace forever.

01:45:00.000 You've got to find pockets of recovery and get back to it.

01:45:02.000 I felt like he just overextended himself in the fight.

01:45:05.000 Yeah, I feel like that was the case too, but it's how do you know when to, I mean, how do you know when to push?

01:45:11.000 The idea is like you want to break your opponent.

01:45:13.000 Right.

01:45:13.000 So how do you know when you're breaking yourself?

01:45:15.000 How do you know when your opponent has too much gas and you're not going to, like a guy like Elkins is famous for his durability and his heart.

01:45:22.000 So he's an interesting case.

01:45:24.000 Yeah, I think the master of that is George.

01:45:26.000 George recovers in the round.

01:45:28.000 We always talk about recovering in the round.

01:45:30.000 And never showing the guy your maximum point.

01:45:32.000 Like, let's say we're fighting me and you, and I see you back off because you're tired.

01:45:36.000 You're huffing up.

01:45:37.000 I know you're breaking point now.

01:45:38.000 I know that if I push this pace a little bit more, you're going to break.

01:45:41.000 There's no more reserves.

01:45:42.000 However, if you get to about 70% of your fatigue, and then you start circling, and I see you're circling, but I don't see your fatigue.

01:45:48.000 You're just doing that as a decoy.

01:45:51.000 You're playing mind games with me.

01:45:53.000 But really you're recovering.

01:45:55.000 You're playing mind games with me.

01:45:57.000 You're circling.

01:45:58.000 You're tying me up in ways.

01:45:59.000 You know that I'm never going to go over 70%.

01:46:01.000 I'm never going to redline in a fight.

01:46:03.000 Only at the last bit of the fight am I going to redline.

01:46:06.000 Because I have a reserve in case things go wrong.

01:46:08.000 I have a reserve to explode out of a position that I might need.

01:46:11.000 So the only times I will redline is if I'm in trouble in the fight.

01:46:15.000 And I have to go all in because the fight's going to be over.

01:46:17.000 Or it's the end of the fight.

01:46:19.000 Guys who go all in in round one, for me, eventually they will lose because some guy's going to weather that storm, sidestep, and he's going to put the kill on you when you're in recovery mode.

01:46:28.000 Or like Francis Ngannou and Stipe Miocic.

01:46:31.000 Right.

01:46:31.000 Francis came out, guns blazed in that first round, blew his wad, and then in the second and the third, Stipe took over.

01:46:38.000 When you go for the kill, you're risking...

01:46:41.000 Losing the decision or losing afterwards if you don't get the kill.

01:46:44.000 If you go all in and there's no reserve, you better get that kill.

01:46:49.000 Because if you don't...

01:46:50.000 What's amazing is that when guys go all in in the first round, even if they're in great shape, sometimes they don't recover enough to complete the fight.

01:46:56.000 Right.

01:46:57.000 If the guy they're fighting is skilled enough to not allow them that...

01:47:02.000 You know, if you roll with a blue belt, you'll never get tired.

01:47:04.000 He doesn't have the skill to make me work.

01:47:06.000 Right.

01:47:07.000 However, if I'm with a black belt, and I get exhausted, and now he's making me work, I may never recover.

01:47:13.000 Right, right, yeah.

01:47:15.000 Well, it's not just...

01:47:16.000 It's also...

01:47:19.000 The way you go out, if you go out full clip in that first round, you have essentially sprinted yourself into a position where you're just so diminished.

01:47:28.000 There's so many fighters that are like that, right?

01:47:31.000 Like, Conor is kind of a good example of that.

01:47:34.000 Conor is fantastic in the beginning of a fight, but, man, he gets to them third, fourth, and fifth rounds, and he takes, like, the Nate Diaz fight, the second fight, he becomes human.

01:47:44.000 He turned and walked away from him.

01:47:46.000 He becomes very human.

01:47:47.000 He needed that break so badly.

01:47:49.000 When you see that, do you think that that is a case of...

01:47:53.000 And I don't want you to give away too much because, you know, George potentially wants to fight Connor.

01:47:57.000 Right, right, right.

01:47:58.000 Do you think that that's a case of poor conditioning?

01:48:03.000 Do you think that is a lack of experience in handling those moments because he's so used to overwhelming people and taking them out early?

01:48:11.000 What do you think that is?

01:48:12.000 I think it's partly genetic.

01:48:14.000 Really?

01:48:15.000 Yes, because you see, I call it the touch of death.

01:48:18.000 You know, he's got that left hand.

01:48:18.000 It's the touch of death.

01:48:19.000 Yeah.

01:48:20.000 That touch of death comes at a cost.

01:48:22.000 Okay, how do you have the touch of death?

01:48:23.000 Where does power come from?

01:48:24.000 Okay, well, if you look at Michael Kogan, what we were talking about earlier, he has the criteria for power.

01:48:29.000 To the best of his knowledge, this is where he believes power comes from.

01:48:32.000 Okay, so I can't teach Hussein Bolt to be powerful.

01:48:34.000 I can only make him faster.

01:48:36.000 But where did that initial power come from?

01:48:39.000 Number one on the list, number one, is where your muscle is attached to your bone.

01:48:44.000 It's genetic.

01:48:45.000 So Tyson has a powerful left hook.

01:48:47.000 Not because his coach taught him how to hit a left hook.

01:48:49.000 He could have hit a left hook like that if he had a mediocre trainer.

01:48:52.000 It has to do with the leverage of his bones.

01:48:56.000 So for instance, imagine a really heavy pole that weighs 100 pounds.

01:49:02.000 And I want to stand it up.

01:49:04.000 Well, depending on where I grab it, I'm going to have more resistance or less resistance.

01:49:08.000 If I grab it near the end, I have more leverage.

01:49:10.000 So where your muscles attach to your bone is going to dictate how much leverage you get out of it.

01:49:16.000 Second most important element is the type of muscle fiber you have.

01:49:19.000 The type.

01:49:20.000 So if you have a fast twitch muscle fiber, you can hold less oxygen, but it can twitch faster.

01:49:26.000 Hence the name.

01:49:27.000 So if you're a slow twitch muscle fiber guy, you can metabolize more oxygen, but you can't twitch as fast.

01:49:33.000 So there's a give and take.

01:49:34.000 Nick Diaz.

01:49:35.000 Exactly.

01:49:36.000 So you have a guy, Nick Diaz, who needs to knock you out with volume.

01:49:39.000 He can knock you out with one shot.

01:49:40.000 Like, look at BJ Penn.

01:49:41.000 If round one he doesn't knock you out, likelihood of knocking you out in round two is less.

01:49:44.000 Right.

01:49:45.000 Diaz is the opposite.

01:49:46.000 The likelihood of him knocking you out in round three is higher than round one.

01:49:49.000 Yeah.

01:49:49.000 Because of the cumulative attack.

01:49:51.000 Yeah.

01:49:52.000 McGregor, look at his stats.

01:49:53.000 It's all round one knockout, round one knockout, round two knockout.

01:49:57.000 He's fast twitch, high leverage, left hand.

01:49:59.000 Yeah.

01:50:00.000 If you take him into deep waters, his fast twitch muscle fibers cannot metabolize with Mayweather.

01:50:05.000 Mayweather's so smart.

01:50:06.000 He let him work.

01:50:08.000 He let McGregor work for three rounds.

01:50:10.000 Yeah.

01:50:11.000 And you're getting excited.

01:50:12.000 Keep working.

01:50:13.000 Keep working.

01:50:13.000 And when you have nothing left, I'm going to put you out.

01:50:16.000 You know, that was such a brilliant strategy.

01:50:18.000 It was.

01:50:18.000 And it was so obvious how much more efficient he was.

01:50:21.000 Exactly.

01:50:21.000 You know, and more relaxed.

01:50:23.000 Conor had his moment early in the fight where he hit him with some unorthodox punches and some weird movement.

01:50:30.000 But after a while, it was just...

01:50:32.000 I found both of them had a brilliant performance because what McGregor did to go in his world.

01:50:35.000 Oh, incredible.

01:50:36.000 It was brilliant.

01:50:37.000 It was brilliant.

01:50:37.000 Just crazy.

01:50:38.000 Crazy that it even happened.

01:50:40.000 If you really stop and think about it, it was almost like the world got a magic trick pulled out.

01:50:44.000 It was unbelievable.

01:50:45.000 I want George to fight Mayweather.

01:50:46.000 I keep bothering George.

01:50:47.000 You fight Mayweather.

01:50:47.000 You fight him.

01:50:49.000 He's like, it's crazy.

01:50:49.000 I know it's crazy.

01:50:51.000 I bet Mayweather would do it.

01:50:53.000 That's what I'm saying.

01:50:54.000 That's what I'm saying.

01:50:54.000 But George might have to lose a shitload of weight.

01:50:56.000 They'll find a catch weight.

01:50:57.000 Do you think Mayweather is worried that he's going to get concussed?

01:50:59.000 He's fought all the top punchers in the world.

01:51:01.000 Right.

01:51:02.000 He's just going to have to worry about George's volume and reach.

01:51:04.000 But he can handle himself, and George can handle himself.

01:51:07.000 But the whole world is going to tune into that one.

01:51:09.000 You know what I'm saying?

01:51:10.000 Look at you, you're selling it.

01:51:11.000 Yeah, man.

01:51:11.000 George, do it, man.

01:51:12.000 Do it.

01:51:13.000 But George doesn't want to fight a smaller guy.

01:51:15.000 He doesn't want to call out a smaller guy.

01:51:16.000 So it's going to have to come from Mayweather.

01:51:18.000 It's going to have to come from him.

01:51:19.000 Wow.

01:51:20.000 There's another big money fight.

01:51:22.000 Yep.

01:51:22.000 But is it as big a money fight?

01:51:23.000 That's the thing.

01:51:24.000 The real big money fight is in somehow or another McGregor convincing the world that he could beat him in a second fight.

01:51:31.000 Mayweather?

01:51:32.000 Yes.

01:51:33.000 Oh, that's a hard sell.

01:51:34.000 That's a hard sell.

01:51:35.000 We bought that one already.

01:51:36.000 Yeah, we bought that one.

01:51:38.000 They need George to fight McGregor.

01:51:40.000 There was the one thing of doing it in the octagon and doing it with small gloves and no kicks.

01:51:45.000 Remember, there was some talk of that and people were like, well, where's this talk coming from?

01:51:49.000 I don't know if it was legit or not.

01:51:50.000 I called Dana. 1.00

01:51:51.000 Dana said it's 100% bullshit. 1.00

01:51:53.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:51:54.000 Because the state can't enforce that.

01:51:56.000 So if McGregor wants to throw a kick, he'll throw a kick.

01:51:58.000 Right.

01:51:59.000 It'd have to be gentleman's rules.

01:52:00.000 Do you remember when that happened with Tim Sylvia and Ray Mercer?

01:52:04.000 No.

01:52:04.000 Tim Sylvia fought Ray Mercer, and they had originally been scheduled to fight a boxing match.

01:52:09.000 Gentlemen's rules.

01:52:10.000 But the commission said they wouldn't sanction the fight because Tim Sylvia doesn't have any pro boxing experience.

01:52:16.000 Ray Mercer, Olympic gold medalist, former world champion.

01:52:19.000 And they decided to have an MMA fight, but they had a gentleman's agreement to not throw kicks.

01:52:25.000 Tim opens up with an inside leg kick.

01:52:28.000 Of course you did.

01:52:28.000 You ever see the fight?

01:52:29.000 Yeah, I did.

01:52:30.000 Here he goes.

01:52:30.000 Watch this.

01:52:31.000 I just forgot about the kick.

01:52:32.000 It starts off, and Tim Sylvia immediately...

01:52:35.000 Oh, this is...

01:52:35.000 Go before this.

01:52:36.000 Go before this, because that's the KO. If you go before this, they open up, and Tim kicks him right away.

01:52:42.000 And look, see Ray puts his hands down. 1.00

01:52:44.000 Like, you motherfucker. 1.00

01:52:45.000 I can't believe this shit. 1.00

01:52:47.000 Oh, that's why he gave a look. 1.00

01:52:49.000 And then boom!

01:52:50.000 And then he hits him when he's down.

01:52:51.000 He just KO's him.

01:52:54.000 Let me see that one more time.

01:52:55.000 Wow.

01:52:56.000 Boom! 0.99

01:52:57.000 I mean, come on, son.

01:52:59.000 And that's like a 50-year-old Ray Mercer at the time.

01:53:01.000 Wow.

01:53:03.000 Crazy. 0.76

01:53:04.000 That's why he gave that look. 0.89

01:53:05.000 Yeah.

01:53:05.000 He couldn't believe it.

01:53:06.000 He's like, I thought we weren't kicking, man.

01:53:08.000 So they made a gentleman's agreement.

01:53:10.000 And Tim Sylvia's like, yeah, whatever, dude.

01:53:14.000 But he paid for that.

01:53:16.000 I mean, he got starched.

01:53:19.000 It's also the difference in skill level.

01:53:22.000 You see a guy like Ray Mercer who's seen all these patterns, and a guy like Tim Sylvia who's just so used to MMA fighter striking.

01:53:31.000 It's a different speed also.

01:53:33.000 It is.

01:53:33.000 How much does it help fighters to cross-train in these different disciplines and how difficult is it to take those skills and then to put them into their overall MMA game?

01:53:44.000 I think it's beneficial if you do it to a certain degree because if you go too much, let's say you're always sparring with pro boxers, there's a distance that's not realistic.

01:53:51.000 Because in MMA, you're further away from each other.

01:53:54.000 Yeah.

01:53:54.000 So when I get to that distance, the guy's going to grab me.

01:53:57.000 However, because there's more punches per second, it's more of an intensive training.

01:54:03.000 So if you can deal with that speed of training, then later when I put you in MMA zone, it's slower a little bit.

01:54:07.000 So there's that element.

01:54:08.000 There's a balancing act.

01:54:09.000 There's boxing with pro boxers, but then there's doing it too much.

01:54:12.000 Then when you're sparring with MMA fighter, it's harder to hit the MMA fighter than it is for me to hit the boxer.

01:54:16.000 Right.

01:54:17.000 Because we're in a different pattern.

01:54:18.000 We're a different world.

01:54:19.000 I want to do just a bit of that.

01:54:20.000 Not too much.

01:54:22.000 Are there any patterns that people pick up in boxing that become a real problem when you add in elbows?

01:54:28.000 Yeah.

01:54:29.000 Yeah, when you duck down, some guys just start, okay, you throw right hand, I'm going to duck down.

01:54:32.000 Dude, you do that once with me, I'm throwing a left kick right after my hand.

01:54:35.000 I'm throwing a shallow right hand, and the left kick's coming upstairs.

01:54:38.000 And when you slip, you're slipping right into the kick.

01:54:40.000 John Jones, Daniel Cormier.

01:54:41.000 Exactly.

01:54:42.000 I mean, that was a pattern that John had seen, and they even talked about it beforehand, where Daniel said, don't think you're going to hit me with that left high kick.

01:54:50.000 Which is kind of crazy when you see how it went down.

01:54:54.000 That's a weird thing when people just develop a sort of pattern that they just keep repeating over and over again.

01:55:00.000 And then it's instinctual.

01:55:01.000 You want to take it out now.

01:55:03.000 Good luck.

01:55:03.000 Good luck taking it out.

01:55:06.000 That's one of the things that when you see people learning technique, one of the more difficult things is to relearn something.

01:55:15.000 Once you learn it one way, like with kicking in particular, when they get tired or when they get nervous, they revert back to their old way of kicking and you see it.

01:55:28.000 Especially if they learn it young.

01:55:29.000 It's hardwired.

01:55:31.000 Yeah.

01:55:31.000 How do you get a guy out of that?

01:55:32.000 I haven't been very successful.

01:55:34.000 Like, for instance, if I take a guy who's been kicking taekwondo his entire life, and then I try to teach him a Thai kick, it's not that easy.

01:55:39.000 It's really difficult.

01:55:40.000 Really?

01:55:40.000 Yeah.

01:55:40.000 That's why I believe when you're young, you have to have a diversity.

01:55:42.000 You have to learn how to kick like a Thai, like a taekwondo guy, like a karate guy, like a kickboxer, the variety.

01:55:47.000 And then you can go out there and you can morph your style.

01:55:50.000 You can exchange from one style of kicking to another.

01:55:53.000 However, if you've done 10 years of one way, And you are hardwired that way, it's very difficult, almost not worth it to redo it.

01:56:00.000 Just let him kick the way he kicks. 1.00

01:56:02.000 Really?

01:56:02.000 Yeah, it's not worth it.

01:56:03.000 Not worth it?

01:56:04.000 No, because you're going to train him for so many hours, then he's going to go in there, he's going to revert back.

01:56:07.000 Like you said, when he's under the pressure and the stress, he's going to revert back to what he normally does.

01:56:11.000 When he's a little bit tired, because it's more efficient for him.

01:56:15.000 So you're asking him now to do something new.

01:56:18.000 Is there any way to rewire a person's brain?

01:56:21.000 Not that I know of.

01:56:22.000 Of course you can change someone's behavior, absolutely.

01:56:26.000 But if it's hardwired from a young age, we're talking about it's a long-term project.

01:56:30.000 Do you have the amount of time?

01:56:32.000 You could do it, but it's a lot of time and energy.

01:56:34.000 And it's painful.

01:56:35.000 It's painful to undo an old way.

01:56:39.000 It's a lot of energy.

01:56:40.000 The guy will feel tired, the guy will feel sluggish, the guy will feel uncomfortable because he's doing something inefficient.

01:56:46.000 You see those patterns, though, where you watch a guy fight and you go, man, why does he always do that?

01:56:52.000 He's always throwing these wide, looping punches.

01:56:55.000 Like, why can't he throw efficient, smooth, technical punches?

01:56:59.000 He might have learned.

01:57:00.000 I've had that problem.

01:57:01.000 They learned it wrong early on in their career.

01:57:03.000 Then when they get to you, they're good enough to get to you.

01:57:05.000 They're good enough to, you know, come near the UFC. Now they want that extra level.

01:57:09.000 And you're working with this new athlete who has so many inefficiencies.

01:57:13.000 You gotta remove them one by one, gently.

01:57:15.000 If you try to rehaul him, you just confuse him.

01:57:18.000 He just doesn't know what to do anymore.

01:57:19.000 What do you want me to do, coach?

01:57:20.000 Like, I'm totally lost.

01:57:22.000 It's like a scientific experiment, right?

01:57:24.000 You isolate one variable.

01:57:26.000 If you change too many things, we don't know what caused what anymore.

01:57:28.000 And you're in a chaotic now.

01:57:30.000 Now you're in a world of chaos.

01:57:31.000 He doesn't know what works anymore.

01:57:33.000 You don't know what's wrong anymore.

01:57:35.000 One thing at a time.

01:57:36.000 We don't want to flood you.

01:57:37.000 And we don't want to bottleneck you.

01:57:39.000 Well, we're taking you from one place to another, one step at a time, gently.

01:57:42.000 And you have to ask yourself, what's the one thing I can help this guy with?

01:57:45.000 The one thing.

01:57:47.000 They'll change the rest of the system.

01:57:48.000 This is the most important thing.

01:57:49.000 And let's do that one thing at a time.

01:57:52.000 So when you see a guy and say like he's got a Kyokushin background or something like that and you see he throws kicks but he keeps landing with the instep, you just let him keep doing it like that? 0.96

01:58:03.000 Yeah.

01:58:04.000 It depends how many years he has and how much time we have before the next fight.

01:58:07.000 Because I believe it can work.

01:58:08.000 It works.

01:58:08.000 The reason why karate is still here is because it worked.

01:58:10.000 Guys won.

01:58:11.000 It exists.

01:58:13.000 Karate is not a bad spot.

01:58:14.000 It works.

01:58:14.000 If you can make it work.

01:58:15.000 I might teach a karate guy some boxing and then his karate will shine even more because he can box.

01:58:21.000 Yeah, that does seem to be the problem.

01:58:25.000 Taekwondo guys in particular, they don't punch to the face.

01:58:28.000 So when they get into sparring situations and they're first learning how to do it.

01:58:32.000 We saw that with Raymond Daniels early in his career as well.

01:58:34.000 Just have the hardest time with the hands.

01:58:38.000 So do you take a guy like that and just have him only box?

01:58:42.000 I would make him box a lot and that'll open up his kicks even more. 0.86

01:58:45.000 Definitely, no doubt about it.

01:58:46.000 Especially with his reach and his distance, his footwork that he has, he could do a lot more, I think.

01:58:53.000 Do you write all this stuff down, like your thoughts on these things?

01:58:56.000 I know you do your YouTube series, but have you ever considered putting out a book on your ideas about MMA? I'm writing a book, but it's more of a philosophy book.

01:59:04.000 I have a background in philosophy.

01:59:06.000 I have a degree in philosophy.

01:59:07.000 So I spend a lot of time just contemplating things.

01:59:09.000 So I do a lot of fight philosophy stuff.

01:59:11.000 I write it down.

01:59:12.000 Publish a book.

01:59:13.000 Not really interested in that, to be honest with you.

01:59:15.000 I'm more interested in going into philosophy, writing about philosophy.

01:59:18.000 Not so much MMA. Like philosophy?

01:59:21.000 More about truth, reality, paradigms, you know, how we see the world.

01:59:25.000 You know, what is truth?

01:59:27.000 What is reality?

01:59:27.000 Those kind of things.

01:59:28.000 I know it sounds weird that it's coming from an MMA coach, but I do a lot of philosophy in my own personal life.

01:59:32.000 I don't think it's weird at all.

01:59:34.000 I mean, I think that what you do is essentially you're taking fighters and preparing them for one of the most difficult challenges in all professional sports.

01:59:43.000 I don't think there's a more difficult challenge outside of war.

01:59:48.000 Yeah, exactly.

01:59:49.000 Or being a firefighter or a police officer where you're actually putting your life in danger.

01:59:54.000 I think combat sports are just...

01:59:57.000 It's extremely difficult to do.

01:59:59.000 And to be able to do what you've done with George and what George has done as well.

02:00:04.000 I mean, what you guys have done together.

02:00:05.000 It's just an incredible accomplishment.

02:00:07.000 And especially him coming back after four years off and looking better than he ever looked in the past.

02:00:14.000 That was what was crazy.

02:00:16.000 When he came back and...

02:00:19.000 The fluidity of his combinations, the way he looked, and the way he sunk that rear naked choke, that was a rare rear naked choke in MMA, where the blade of the hand was on the back of the neck and it was just fully sunk in.

02:00:32.000 You know how you see guys get the choke, but you're seeing that old school Ken Shamrock style back of the...

02:00:39.000 I'll never tap to this.

02:00:40.000 I'll never tap to this.

02:00:41.000 You put me on.

02:00:42.000 If the hand's not behind...

02:00:44.000 You'd rather get put out?

02:00:46.000 It's funny, I was rolling with one of my students yesterday.

02:00:49.000 And I let him take my back.

02:00:50.000 I was just kind of toying with him.

02:00:52.000 And I let him take my back.

02:00:53.000 And he was stronger than I thought he was.

02:00:55.000 I haven't wrestled with him in 10 years.

02:00:57.000 I just put out a YouTube video of me and him.

02:00:58.000 If you guys want to put it up, it would be funny.

02:01:01.000 But we were rolling off camera.

02:01:02.000 And I kind of let him take my back.

02:01:04.000 I never give out my back.

02:01:05.000 But sometimes he's purple belt.

02:01:06.000 So I was just kind of toying with him a little.

02:01:08.000 And he put a choke in.

02:01:10.000 And I was like, okay, let's see if he can finish.

02:01:11.000 I didn't think he could finish it.

02:01:13.000 But then all of a sudden, it got in deeper.

02:01:14.000 And he didn't have the hand behind my head.

02:01:16.000 So I was like, I'm not going to tap.

02:01:17.000 No way I would tap to this.

02:01:19.000 Impossible.

02:01:19.000 First of all, he should know better.

02:01:21.000 If I let him tap me with this, he's going to think he did it right.

02:01:23.000 So I was like, no.

02:01:24.000 But I was like, and then when he took a breather, I just took his hand out.

02:01:27.000 Because I could reach your hand, right?

02:01:28.000 If it's not tucked away behind, I got out.

02:01:30.000 I'll never tap to this, man.

02:01:31.000 Never.

02:01:32.000 So he's doing this?

02:01:33.000 Yeah, his hand is like here.

02:01:35.000 Okay.

02:01:36.000 It has to be here.

02:01:37.000 MMA gloves or...

02:01:39.000 No, no.

02:01:40.000 Floor rolling.

02:01:41.000 Yeah, he's a good purple belt.

02:01:43.000 He's a tough guy.

02:01:43.000 Very good shape.

02:01:44.000 Strong.

02:01:44.000 And the choke's not in this.

02:01:46.000 That was off camera.

02:01:47.000 But, I mean, I would never tap to this.

02:01:50.000 Like, even in practice.

02:01:52.000 Because it's not on.

02:01:53.000 The choke is not on.

02:01:54.000 Right, right, right.

02:01:55.000 Yeah, there's definitely a difference.

02:01:57.000 But some guys have gotten it, even in the UFC, with just a gable grip.

02:02:01.000 The guy who's being choked?

02:02:04.000 Oh, with the gable grip works.

02:02:06.000 Yeah.

02:02:06.000 Because I can't grab your hand.

02:02:08.000 I see what you're saying.

02:02:09.000 Like, if your hand is here and I can grab it, why would I choke?

02:02:12.000 Why would I tap?

02:02:14.000 I can hold your hand.

02:02:15.000 I can grab onto it.

02:02:16.000 Right, right, right.

02:02:17.000 Yeah, it's funny that in the early days that was how everyone did a rear naked choke.

02:02:23.000 But it was more panic.

02:02:24.000 It's more panic.

02:02:24.000 Okay, oxygen is lower.

02:02:27.000 And you're tapping, but you're not going to go out.

02:02:29.000 People just didn't know any better.

02:02:30.000 They thought that that was okay to do.

02:02:33.000 Right.

02:02:33.000 They thought that that palm in the back of the head was okay to do.

02:02:35.000 I don't know who figured out to do this.

02:02:37.000 No, the palm behind the head is okay.

02:02:39.000 I'm not against that.

02:02:40.000 It's when the hand is here.

02:02:42.000 Right.

02:02:43.000 It has to be unreachable.

02:02:44.000 If I can reach it, I'm not tapping.

02:02:46.000 Right.

02:02:46.000 I'm not tapping.

02:02:47.000 Forget that.

02:02:48.000 Why would it happen?

02:02:49.000 It's an experience if you tap.

02:02:50.000 It's like you panicked a bit. 0.98

02:02:52.000 What's your feeling though on tapping because here's the thing about tapping like this I've had some injuries where like fuck I should have just tapped and I got out of it and I kept rolling with it and then my elbows fucked and I can't do chin-ups for a couple months. 0.98

02:03:06.000 I tap quick. 0.97

02:03:08.000 I don't tap to strangleholds easily.

02:03:10.000 Except for guillotings, I feel like it could torque my neck.

02:03:13.000 But a rear naked, there's no joint issue. 0.98

02:03:15.000 So I won't tap.

02:03:15.000 I'm as stubborn as the next guy.

02:03:17.000 My joints, I tap right away.

02:03:19.000 I don't put any miles on my joints.

02:03:21.000 I want to be as good as I can be, as healthy as I can be.

02:03:25.000 Because I want to roll till I'm, you know, like the week before I die, I want to be rolling the week before.

02:03:31.000 Well, that's the ultimate goal that very few people ever achieve.

02:03:36.000 I know so many jujitsu guys that are so busted up.

02:03:40.000 Like Eddie Bravo has an artificial disc in his lower back. 0.98

02:03:44.000 Both of his shoulders are completely fucked and he's trying to avoid surgery in his shoulders. 0.98

02:03:48.000 And his knee too, right? 0.99

02:03:49.000 Because I was just with him in Vegas.

02:03:51.000 Yep.

02:03:52.000 His ACL, he had a tear in his ACL and then he just got his knee operated on.

02:03:56.000 He had a bucket handle tear so he got his meniscus repaired.

02:04:00.000 But his ACL was at least partially torn and he's letting it heal, but I'm very skeptical about people that just let partial tears and ACLs heal.

02:04:11.000 Because I feel like, yeah, you let it heal, but it healed with like 60% of its original strength.

02:04:16.000 Like, you might have let it heal, but how much did you actually do?

02:04:20.000 There's a weakness.

02:04:20.000 Yeah.

02:04:20.000 You know what they're doing now, which is really fascinating.

02:04:22.000 Dr. Roddy McGee out of Las Vegas, who...

02:04:25.000 Does a lot of work with UFC fighters.

02:04:27.000 He's showing me that they're taking torn ACLs, completely torn, and instead of replacing it now with a cadaver graft or a patella tendon graft, they actually take that ligament and can reattach it.

02:04:38.000 Really?

02:04:39.000 And in three months they had someone competing in the Olympics.

02:04:42.000 Really?

02:04:43.000 Yes.

02:04:43.000 What's his name?

02:04:44.000 Dr. Roddy McGee.

02:04:46.000 Wow.

02:04:46.000 Yeah, cutting edge sheds.

02:04:48.000 In America, here in the US. Yep, latest and greatest.

02:04:50.000 And they're doing, it's a crazy operation.

02:04:53.000 They're taking this broken ligament, and they obviously have to do it quick before it pulls back and disintegrates. 0.59

02:04:59.000 But when it gets to, they get the tear in it, they reattach it, and they sew the shit out of this thing.

02:05:06.000 They've got like stitches in it, and it's all weirdly bound up, and then it reattaches.

02:05:11.000 It reattaches and actually grows.

02:05:13.000 Impressive.

02:05:14.000 Your original ligament as well.

02:05:16.000 It's not something that your body can reject or something that you don't have to compromise your patella tendon.

02:05:23.000 I don't know how George had his done.

02:05:25.000 Did he do the patella tendon graft?

02:05:27.000 I feel like he did with at least one of them.

02:05:29.000 Did he do hamstring?

02:05:30.000 Did he do hamstring?

02:05:30.000 I can't remember.

02:05:31.000 He didn't take cadaver.

02:05:33.000 He took his own.

02:05:34.000 Did he do it both times the same way?

02:05:37.000 I think so, yeah.

02:05:38.000 Think so?

02:05:38.000 Yeah.

02:05:39.000 If I remember correctly.

02:05:40.000 Matt Brown just did hamstring.

02:05:44.000 He just had his done, and they did a hamstring, and he said he feels pretty good already.

02:05:49.000 Yeah?

02:05:49.000 Yeah.

02:05:50.000 It's a scary injury.

02:05:52.000 Oh, I've had both done.

02:05:53.000 Really?

02:05:53.000 Yeah, I've had one with a patella tendon graft and one with a cadaver.

02:05:57.000 The cadaver was much easier for me.

02:05:59.000 Really?

02:05:59.000 Yeah.

02:06:00.000 It took...

02:06:01.000 Yeah.

02:06:02.000 See, the thing about it taking or not taking, what happens with a cadaver is people think that your body takes it like an artificial heart.

02:06:11.000 No, or like a transplanted heart.

02:06:13.000 It actually uses it as a scaffolding to re-proliferate with your own cells.

02:06:19.000 And I think part of the problem is it gives you the feeling that it's stronger than it is early on.

02:06:25.000 You're like, yeah, I'm ready to go.

02:06:26.000 I'm ready to go.

02:06:27.000 And you start, I mean, everybody wants to start rolling again.

02:06:30.000 Everybody wants to start training again.

02:06:31.000 And so I think some guys just get in there a little bit too early and they do something and it pops and they go, oh, it didn't take.

02:06:38.000 Well, is that really the case, or did you just put too much stress on it too early on?

02:06:44.000 I thought the fear was it can reject, your body can reject it.

02:06:47.000 I've heard of that, but I think that's extremely rare.

02:06:50.000 I think what's more common is that they say it doesn't take, like that it didn't.

02:06:57.000 But I think...

02:06:58.000 When I hear it from MMA guys, it's like, I know you're a meathead. 0.99

02:07:02.000 I know you guys are savages. 0.98

02:07:04.000 You get in there and you're training hard way earlier than you should be, and then it fucks up again.

02:07:09.000 I mean, there's a bunch of guys that have gotten ACL surgery and then in the recovery process blew it out again.

02:07:15.000 It happens really common.

02:07:16.000 And then they're back to square one again.

02:07:18.000 Right.

02:07:19.000 It's all narratives.

02:07:20.000 I mean, to explain something, it's really just narratives.

02:07:26.000 Our explanations are 99% of the time just narratives.

02:07:29.000 And to weed out narratives and not use them is very difficult.

02:07:32.000 What do you mean by that?

02:07:34.000 I mean, there's a difference between logical arguments, empirical observations, and then there are narratives.

02:07:40.000 We tell ourselves why things are happening around us all the time, and 99% of the time it's wrong, but we believe it.

02:07:46.000 We tell ourselves that, and to try to work around that is actually quite difficult.

02:07:50.000 So like, for instance, when the field of philosophy, if you give an argument...

02:07:55.000 If you give a deductive argument, your argument has to conclude.

02:07:58.000 The conclusion has to have no other possibility.

02:08:00.000 There can be no other possibility.

02:08:01.000 All your premises have to be valid and sound, and there can be no other possibility.

02:08:06.000 When I say, hey, my ligament didn't take, that's an explanation.

02:08:12.000 It's one of many possible narratives.

02:08:16.000 It's one of many, many possible explanations I couldn't give why my knee is injured now.

02:08:22.000 Including that you didn't let it rest enough.

02:08:25.000 Right, exactly.

02:08:26.000 Let's say I'm walking and I trip over my shoelaces.

02:08:29.000 I tripped over my shoelaces.

02:08:31.000 That's why I fell.

02:08:32.000 Well, if your shoelaces were tied, maybe you tripped anyway.

02:08:36.000 Maybe it was something else.

02:08:37.000 You haven't eliminated every other possibility.

02:08:39.000 If you haven't eliminated every other possibility, it's just a narrative.

02:08:43.000 It's not actual fact. 0.98

02:08:45.000 The Tony Ferguson injury was the most fucked up one I've ever heard ever. 0.98

02:08:50.000 Right. 0.98

02:08:50.000 The week of the fight, doing press, trips on some cables, and rips his knee apart. 0.98

02:08:56.000 For sure he had an injury before he's not aware of.

02:08:58.000 You think so?

02:08:59.000 There had to be a small rip, a small tear, a small weakness somewhere.

02:09:06.000 He could withstand tripping on a cable.

02:09:10.000 But it was hanging by a thread.

02:09:11.000 Is that the case?

02:09:12.000 Or did it... 0.98

02:09:14.000 Did he just fall at a really fucked up angle? 0.98

02:09:16.000 I didn't see the fall. 0.98

02:09:17.000 Yeah.

02:09:18.000 But I assume he's such an athletic guy.

02:09:21.000 He can catch himself falling in a way that is athletic.

02:09:27.000 Maybe when you're sparring, you hurt yourself.

02:09:30.000 You don't feel it.

02:09:31.000 So much is going on.

02:09:32.000 Maybe he hurt himself when he cooled down.

02:09:33.000 He didn't feel it.

02:09:34.000 There's not many pain sensors there or whatnot.

02:09:36.000 Again, this is just a narrative.

02:09:38.000 Then he goes in there.

02:09:39.000 It's hanging by a thread.

02:09:40.000 He tugs it.

02:09:40.000 Boom.

02:09:41.000 The whole thing breaks apart.

02:09:42.000 It's...

02:09:43.000 It's such a violent injury if you see how bad it was.

02:09:47.000 Did you see the surgery photos?

02:09:49.000 No.

02:09:49.000 I saw actually a little bit.

02:09:50.000 Craziest photos I've ever seen. 0.98

02:09:52.000 I mean, it's a fucking enormous scar. 0.99

02:09:54.000 Wow. 0.99

02:09:54.000 To have that kind of a scar in 2018 with the surgery techniques they have today, it's very rare that you see someone who's just, I mean, you're looking at like a 12-inch scar. 0.99

02:10:04.000 Really?

02:10:05.000 That I didn't see.

02:10:05.000 I just saw him.

02:10:06.000 He posted a, oh my god.

02:10:08.000 Wow.

02:10:08.000 That's huge.

02:10:09.000 That's incredible.

02:10:10.000 I mean, that is a giant scar.

02:10:12.000 It goes well below his knee to above the knee.

02:10:15.000 And they opened him up and...

02:10:18.000 What is this?

02:10:18.000 Is this pre-surgery?

02:10:20.000 What is that?

02:10:21.000 Oh, it's just a different angle.

02:10:22.000 Was it ACL? What was it?

02:10:23.000 No.

02:10:24.000 His MCL... Or is it PCL? Which one is it on the outside?

02:10:29.000 Outside is MCL. So his MCL was ripped completely off the bone.

02:10:34.000 Wow.

02:10:36.000 Yeah, man.

02:10:38.000 Go to his Twitter, his Instagram page now.

02:10:41.000 Does he have any updates?

02:10:45.000 Because a guy like that, you gotta wonder, like, when is he going to be...

02:10:48.000 That's the photo I saw.

02:10:50.000 The one with the suction cups.

02:10:51.000 The cupping.

02:10:52.000 Is that...

02:10:52.000 Okay, let me ask you this.

02:10:53.000 Yeah.

02:10:54.000 Because I was just having a conversation with someone. 0.99

02:10:55.000 Who was it that just said cupping was bullshit? 0.99

02:10:57.000 Who was that? 1.00

02:10:59.000 Was it? 0.73

02:11:00.000 I was having a conversation with someone there saying cupping is essentially almost total nonsense, but so many people do it and it just puts your mind that you're doing something and healing and doing something, you know, in addition to standard procedures that's helping you out but really ain't doing shit.

02:11:20.000 I would say that's probably more psychological.

02:11:23.000 But everybody does it.

02:11:25.000 Yeah, it's fun.

02:11:25.000 It's psychological.

02:11:26.000 You feel like you're taking care of yourself and it makes you feel good.

02:11:29.000 It's psychosomatic. 0.99

02:11:30.000 It's fucking weird. 0.98

02:11:31.000 Go back up. 0.98

02:11:31.000 Hold on. 0.98

02:11:32.000 Go back up to that image, Jamie.

02:11:34.000 I mean, look at that. 0.98

02:11:36.000 That is fucking crazy looking. 0.99

02:11:37.000 Yeah, it is. 0.99

02:11:39.000 Yeah.

02:11:40.000 Yeah, but, you know, psychosomatic medicine can help you.

02:11:44.000 But here it says, insurance covers acupuncture treatment because it's effective.

02:11:48.000 I was skeptical the first time I tried it.

02:11:50.000 But yeah, see, I don't know. 1.00

02:11:53.000 You are a complete moron then. 1.00

02:11:55.000 Even insurance covers acupuncture. 1.00

02:11:58.000 Well...

02:11:58.000 Does acupuncture work?

02:12:01.000 I have no idea.

02:12:02.000 Never tested it. 0.98

02:12:03.000 Never fucked with it? 0.98

02:12:04.000 I've had it done to me. 0.99

02:12:05.000 I didn't particularly enjoy it.

02:12:06.000 Yeah, I only had it done once and the guy was kind of a quack.

02:12:09.000 Yeah.

02:12:10.000 And I was like, alright, buddy.

02:12:12.000 Once they start talking about toxins, you know, we're cleansing you of toxins.

02:12:16.000 Again, see, that's a narrative.

02:12:18.000 It's possible, but it's not proven.

02:12:20.000 Right.

02:12:20.000 It's just a possible story you tell yourself.

02:12:22.000 Yeah, but that term, toxins, is so, that is like, there's certain things that people say where you know you're dealing with woo. 0.99

02:12:31.000 This is some woo-woo bullshit here. 0.96

02:12:33.000 And toxins is one of them. 0.99

02:12:35.000 Cleansing and toxins.

02:12:36.000 I'm going on a cleanse, and I'm getting the toxins out of my system.

02:12:41.000 Dude, scientists are just as guilty of woo-woo as every other guy.

02:12:45.000 You think so?

02:12:46.000 Oh yeah, big time.

02:12:47.000 In what way?

02:12:48.000 Oh my god, man.

02:12:49.000 There's scientists, then there's philosophers of science.

02:12:53.000 There's so much woo-woo in science.

02:12:55.000 Even the most popular guys have woo-woo.

02:12:57.000 They just never study the philosophy of science, so they don't really understand what they're saying, per se.

02:13:01.000 Give me an example of woo-woo in science.

02:13:03.000 I'll give you a great example.

02:13:07.000 There's this guy named Isaac Newton.

02:13:09.000 I heard of that dude.

02:13:10.000 And you're asking him, hey, Isaac, why don't I fall off the face of the earth?

02:13:13.000 And he's going to be like, well, Joe...

02:13:15.000 There's this gravity, there's this force of gravity pulling you down to the earth.

02:13:19.000 The earth has a greater mass than you, therefore there's this force pulling you down.

02:13:23.000 We call it gravity.

02:13:24.000 And then some guy comes around, his name is Zahabi, and he tells you, no, Joe, don't listen to that guy. 0.98

02:13:29.000 I have another theory, way more, it's truer than his.

02:13:33.000 I believe there are gremlins pulling you down to the earth.

02:13:36.000 They have lassos, these infinite long lassos, and every time you're falling off the earth, they pull you.

02:13:40.000 Every time you jump up and down on the earth, they pull you back down to the earth.

02:13:43.000 You don't see these gremlins, they're invisible, but that's what's pulling you down to the earth.

02:13:47.000 Now, how do you know who's right and who's wrong?

02:13:49.000 Who's telling you the truth, me or Isaac?

02:13:53.000 Isaac lived a long time ago before they actually had provable studies that could show you why gravity works.

02:14:00.000 Name me one of those studies.

02:14:01.000 Well, I'm not a scientist.

02:14:02.000 Well, let me break it to you this way.

02:14:04.000 No scientist has a study to prove us that gravity works.

02:14:07.000 Really?

02:14:07.000 That's the whole thing.

02:14:08.000 That's what's scary about how we talk about the universe.

02:14:11.000 But they understand that gravity is in relation to the size and mass of objects.

02:14:16.000 So the moon is smaller, therefore it has one-sixth Earth's gravity because it's one-quarter the size of the Earth.

02:14:21.000 Very true.

02:14:23.000 There's a correlation.

02:14:25.000 Now, my theory of gremlins, which obviously I don't believe in, right?

02:14:28.000 I'm using mythological language to make it really simple.

02:14:31.000 Don't somebody misquote me that I believe in gremlins.

02:14:35.000 He doesn't believe in gravity.

02:14:36.000 He's a gravity denier.

02:14:37.000 Exactly.

02:14:38.000 Well, there's less mass, there's less atoms, the moon has less atoms, therefore less gremlins, less of them pulling you.

02:14:46.000 My gremlin theory correlates with the gravity theory exactly.

02:14:51.000 But I'm using a mythical language just to point out that every type of force we're talking about is an inference.

02:14:58.000 It's something we project out there.

02:15:00.000 We don't actually see gravity.

02:15:01.000 And you know, later on, Einstein debunked gravity, right?

02:15:04.000 Well, what do you mean by he debunked gravity?

02:15:07.000 Isaac was totally wrong.

02:15:08.000 In what way?

02:15:09.000 Isaac's explanation of why you don't fall off the earth was totally wrong.

02:15:12.000 Well, what did Einstein do to debunk it?

02:15:15.000 Einstein taught us that a new theory, a new hypothesis, that gravity is a pushing force, not a pulling force.

02:15:22.000 See, Isaac Newton, he debunked Aristotle.

02:15:28.000 First we used to believe what Aristotle used to say.

02:15:30.000 Aristotle used to say, look, this thing has a natural place.

02:15:36.000 It has to be stuck to the earth.

02:15:37.000 That's its natural place.

02:15:38.000 The force is within that one thing.

02:15:40.000 That's why it doesn't fall off the earth.

02:15:41.000 So when Aristotle saw a bird fly, he said, look, it has levity.

02:15:46.000 Its natural state is to be in the air.

02:15:48.000 The force that carries it up in the air, it's within it.

02:15:50.000 It's within the bird itself.

02:15:53.000 Isaac Newton came around and said, no, that's totally wrong.

02:15:56.000 No entity can move itself.

02:15:59.000 It's only a force that's applied.

02:16:01.000 So let's say you're walking.

02:16:02.000 Isaac Newton would say, you're not pushing yourself forward.

02:16:04.000 You're pushing the ground beneath you backwards.

02:16:09.000 And the ground is pushing you forwards.

02:16:13.000 So every action is the opposite equal reaction.

02:16:15.000 So when I run, I'm really pushing the ground behind me.

02:16:18.000 It sounds like he's splitting hairs, but he's saying something actually very profound.

02:16:21.000 He's saying, you're pushing the earth behind you, and the earth is pushing you forward.

02:16:25.000 There's a reaction there.

02:16:26.000 So what they do to illustrate that to kids...

02:16:28.000 Is they take like a train track, they elevate it, and they turn on the train.

02:16:31.000 And then you see the train track starting to spin underneath the train.

02:16:35.000 And it's showing you, look, the train is pushing the train tracks back.

02:16:39.000 And the train tracks are pushing the train forward when they're connected to the ground.

02:16:43.000 So when I put you on a treadmill, you're pushing the treadmill behind you.

02:16:47.000 The treadmill is not pushing you forward because it's spinning along with you.

02:16:51.000 But if I put you on the ground, the ground is pushing you forward now.

02:16:55.000 So, for every action, there's an opposite equal reaction.

02:16:57.000 I'm sure you've heard this.

02:16:58.000 Then Einstein comes along and says, no, that's totally wrong when it comes to gravity, subject to gravity.

02:17:03.000 He says, because Isaac Newton says this, look, he says, look, the force of gravity is in the earth.

02:17:07.000 The earth has this invisible force, this magical woo-woo thing.

02:17:11.000 And that's what his contemporaries said about him.

02:17:13.000 That's what his peers said.

02:17:14.000 He said, oh, you're appealing to magic.

02:17:16.000 What is this gravity thing?

02:17:17.000 It's non-comporeal.

02:17:19.000 It's not material.

02:17:20.000 It's not made of a substance.

02:17:22.000 Is this magic?

02:17:23.000 And he was like, yeah, it's this force.

02:17:24.000 You can't feel it.

02:17:25.000 You can't detect it.

02:17:25.000 It's just observable in nature.

02:17:28.000 And for 300 years, everybody believed that.

02:17:30.000 And then Einstein comes along and says, no, you guys are totally wrong.

02:17:33.000 There is no mythical force called gravity.

02:17:36.000 It's a pushing force.

02:17:37.000 So really what he says is...

02:17:39.000 Oops, sorry.

02:17:39.000 Let me get a sheet of paper here.

02:17:41.000 Make it really, really simple.

02:17:42.000 And I'm going to put it in a nutshell here, okay?

02:17:44.000 Okay.

02:17:45.000 He says, look, Einstein says, look, space and time are one.

02:17:49.000 Space is actually a thing out there.

02:17:52.000 The space between me and you is an actual physical thing.

02:17:55.000 He says, the sun is so heavy that it dents it.

02:17:58.000 It makes like a toilet bowl.

02:18:00.000 And the earth is bumping around in that toilet bowl because space is actually curved.

02:18:05.000 It's curved like this.

02:18:06.000 Space is curved because the sun, imagine I put a bowling ball on your bed.

02:18:09.000 Your bed's going to indent.

02:18:11.000 Right.

02:18:12.000 That toilet bowl shape, the earth is flooring around that toilet bowl shape.

02:18:17.000 So it's a pushing force, no longer a pulling force.

02:18:20.000 So the weight of the earth is pushing down on space.

02:18:24.000 Exactly.

02:18:25.000 It's bending space, literally.

02:18:26.000 It's masses bending space.

02:18:28.000 Now Isaac Newton thought light travels in a straight line only.

02:18:31.000 And to prove this, Einstein said, look, light will bend.

02:18:35.000 If I'm right, light will bend.

02:18:37.000 So they observed the sun during an eclipse and they saw that the light bends.

02:18:40.000 Light does not travel in a straight line.

02:18:41.000 This is another belief that was debunked.

02:18:44.000 I mean, how many scientific beliefs are debunked?

02:18:48.000 Countless.

02:18:48.000 Or overturned.

02:18:49.000 Because a scientific fact is not a mathematical fact.

02:18:52.000 They're two different things.

02:18:53.000 A scientific fact can never go higher than hypothesis.

02:18:57.000 Right?

02:18:58.000 If somebody understands the philosophy of science, he understands that every single scientific fact is not equivalent to a mathematical fact.

02:19:06.000 One plus one equals two.

02:19:07.000 A scientific fact is always subject to cross-examination and new evidence.

02:19:13.000 Have you ever heard of Thomas Kuhn?

02:19:14.000 He's very famous for that, right?

02:19:16.000 We have a paradigm.

02:19:17.000 So during Aristotle's time, he had a paradigm.

02:19:19.000 He thought the sun goes around the earth.

02:19:21.000 It was an observational, scientific fact.

02:19:23.000 Every day he saw the sun go around the earth, literally.

02:19:26.000 He said, look guys, I'm using my senses to observe the sun go around the earth.

02:19:30.000 And then one day we find out, no, that's an optical illusion.

02:19:33.000 It's not true that the sun goes around the earth.

02:19:35.000 It's the earth goes around the sun.

02:19:37.000 Scientific revolution.

02:19:39.000 Every scientific fact we have, or theory, Including gravity, because gravity became the law of gravity.

02:19:45.000 It was no longer the theory of gravity.

02:19:46.000 It was so accepted, it became the law of gravity.

02:19:48.000 Today, we don't understand gravity as Einstein understood it.

02:19:52.000 Excuse me, as Isaac Newton understood it.

02:19:54.000 We understand it completely backwards, literally backwards now.

02:19:56.000 And that's true with every scientific theory, because science is always subject to new evidence coming to light. 0.59

02:20:01.000 Right, but the difference between Isaac Newton living whenever the fuck he lived a long-ass time ago. 0.82

02:20:07.000 300 years ago. 0.95

02:20:07.000 Versus the science that we're dealing with today. 0.95

02:20:10.000 It's the same.

02:20:10.000 But what woo-woo do you see in the science of today?

02:20:14.000 The biggest culprit?

02:20:16.000 Yes.

02:20:17.000 Randomness.

02:20:18.000 See, it's funny because I heard you in this conversation with Sam Harris on randomness, which I loved, by the way.

02:20:23.000 You did a great job.

02:20:24.000 Thank you.

02:20:24.000 I thought it was a great conversation.

02:20:25.000 However, he was giving you, in my opinion, two contradictory ideas.

02:20:28.000 He was telling you, look, the world is determined.

02:20:30.000 But also there'll be random events.

02:20:32.000 Well, he was actually talking about determinism versus free will.

02:20:36.000 Right.

02:20:36.000 So the idea being that you don't necessarily have free will, that everything about your decisions and what you're going to do is based on your life experiences, your genetics, all these variables that are essentially out of your control.

02:20:49.000 So this idea of free will is an illusion, which is a really complex concept.

02:20:54.000 Conversation.

02:20:55.000 And I think you can see it in both ways.

02:20:58.000 I think you do have a certain amount of control of your decisions.

02:21:02.000 And I think you are also shaped very much so by your past and your genetics and your interpretation of those.

02:21:09.000 Events.

02:21:11.000 What are those interpretations of those events, though?

02:21:13.000 And why do you make those determinations?

02:21:16.000 Who's in your head pulling the gears?

02:21:19.000 What are you?

02:21:21.000 I'm a hard determinist.

02:21:22.000 I'm a very hard determinist.

02:21:24.000 I'm a determinist extremist.

02:21:27.000 But do you believe in free will?

02:21:28.000 I also believe in free will, which is tricky.

02:21:32.000 But I think that's...

02:21:33.000 It's true.

02:21:34.000 I think they're both true.

02:21:36.000 There is something that allows people to...

02:21:41.000 What takes a guy who's 500 pounds and all of a sudden he goes on a keto diet?

02:21:45.000 And starts running and starts walking and then he sends you a picture on Twitter.

02:21:49.000 I lost 179 pounds in six months. 1.00

02:21:52.000 You're like, holy shit! 1.00

02:21:53.000 How the fuck did you do that? 1.00

02:21:55.000 Like, that guy has some fucking will, man. 1.00

02:21:57.000 To say that that's his whole life and his life experiences and his genetics, it's like, yes, I could see what you're saying. 0.99

02:22:04.000 I could see that he had enough because of his life experiences and that it led to him making this change.

02:22:10.000 But there's a tremendous amount of will involved in that.

02:22:13.000 And to deny that seems like you're denying the spirit of human beings.

02:22:17.000 Well, let's look at it this way.

02:22:19.000 Okay, real quick.

02:22:19.000 Let's look at it.

02:22:20.000 Okay, let's say I crumple up this piece of paper.

02:22:23.000 And I'm going to catapult it.

02:22:25.000 Okay.

02:22:26.000 And it landed there.

02:22:27.000 Right.

02:22:27.000 And now I'm going to reset the entire universe.

02:22:30.000 I'm going to reset every molecule of air, every fiber in this paper.

02:22:34.000 You're going to be in the exact same spot.

02:22:36.000 The whole universe has been reset.

02:22:37.000 And I fired it again.

02:22:39.000 Is it going to land exactly where it landed the first time?

02:22:43.000 Or is it going to land somewhere else?

02:22:45.000 I've reset the universe.

02:22:46.000 The Earth, every molecule of matter, every particle of matter in the universe has been reset.

02:22:54.000 With the same amount of force.

02:22:56.000 Everything is identical.

02:22:57.000 I would assume if the same amount of space and the same amount of air, you would land the same spot.

02:23:03.000 Infinitely precisely?

02:23:05.000 I don't know.

02:23:06.000 Well, I've reset everything perfectly.

02:23:08.000 If infinitely precisely you throw it the exact same way and it lands in the exact same dirt with the exact same resistance.

02:23:16.000 It's the same thing.

02:23:17.000 I would assume it's infinitely precisely going to land the same spot.

02:23:20.000 If randomness is a force at work in nature, why didn't it Factor itself into our little experiment here because your little experiments impossible, but that's irrelevant.

02:23:30.000 It's a thought experiment, but it's not a thought experiment because you're recreating the whole universe, but it's not logically impossible, right?

02:23:37.000 Well in that case though with the variables that you presented, yes Okay.

02:23:41.000 But where's randomness?

02:23:42.000 Where's this force?

02:23:43.000 There's no randomness if you're recreating the entire Earth in a very duplicatable way.

02:23:48.000 That's not randomness at all.

02:23:50.000 What is randomness?

02:23:50.000 That's the thing.

02:23:51.000 There is no randomness.

02:23:52.000 Randomness is when a human being can no longer compute all the factors.

02:23:56.000 And we use an expression called randomness, meaning, okay, I rolled this dice, it landed on seven randomly.

02:24:01.000 Why?

02:24:02.000 Because I couldn't compute all the variables.

02:24:05.000 Okay, I see what you're saying.

02:24:06.000 So randomness is kind of a, it's an illusion that we project onto the world.

02:24:10.000 So Laplace, one of the greatest physicists in history, Simon Laplace, he says, look, look at a billiard ball table.

02:24:17.000 If you tell me which way you're going to break the billiard balls, if you tell me what velocity and what angle you're going to hit the cue ball, I could tell you where every single ball is going to be on the pool table.

02:24:29.000 That's what Laplace says.

02:24:30.000 He's a phenomenal thinker.

02:24:32.000 And he says, why?

02:24:33.000 Because I'm going to take that table, I'm going to turn it into a math.

02:24:35.000 I'm going to take the weight of the ball, the friction of the table, the density of the bands, the gravity of the earth.

02:24:41.000 I'm going to take all those variables.

02:24:43.000 I'm going to put them up on this board here.

02:24:45.000 All I need to know is how hard you're going to hit the ball.

02:24:47.000 And I'll tell you precisely where every ball is going to land.

02:24:50.000 Now somebody who doesn't know mathematics or geometry is going to look at that table when he sees the break.

02:24:55.000 To him it's going to seem random.

02:24:57.000 But randomness is really a reflection of his ignorance.

02:25:00.000 He's not able to compute all this information.

02:25:02.000 That's why Laplace says, to God the world is not random.

02:25:05.000 To somebody who has information, the world is not random.

02:25:09.000 That's why he says, it's very important, that's why we're so determinist, because we believe that what's happening right now is a byproduct of the past.

02:25:17.000 The past caused this happening right now.

02:25:19.000 The past was out of your control.

02:25:22.000 If I reset the universe and let it play all over again, identical circumstance, You would drink that exact same amount of coffee you had today.

02:25:29.000 You would have married the same woman. 0.74

02:25:31.000 You would have had the same kids.

02:25:32.000 You would have had the same t-shirt on right now.

02:25:34.000 You would have the mic at the same distance.

02:25:36.000 Everything would be reset.

02:25:37.000 So when we look at the world through the eyes of physics, they say the causal line is complete.

02:25:44.000 The causal line is complete, meaning where is this space for randomness or free will?

02:25:50.000 We don't factor it in.

02:25:51.000 The only time we do factor it in is when we look at ourselves inwardly.

02:25:56.000 But when we look at the world objectively as a third person.

02:25:59.000 So there's two views.

02:26:01.000 There's the internal view, first person experience.

02:26:03.000 We don't believe in determinism.

02:26:06.000 We have free will.

02:26:08.000 That's first person experience.

02:26:09.000 Third person experience, I'm studying Joe.

02:26:12.000 All I see in Joe is billiard balls.

02:26:14.000 So when you have a thought, it's all billiard balls hitting one another.

02:26:17.000 And if I had an infinitely precise calculator, according to Laplace, I could tell you where you're going to be five years from now, what you're going to be doing.

02:26:25.000 Why?

02:26:25.000 Because I'm seeing one billiard ball hit another.

02:26:27.000 It's just take that pool table experiment and make it the greatest pool game in history.

02:26:33.000 There are countless atoms.

02:26:35.000 There are countless billiard balls striking into one another.

02:26:37.000 Somebody can calculate the world of physics.

02:26:40.000 And tell you where your hand's going to be.

02:26:42.000 Laplace says, I'm going to tell you where your hand's going to be in five years from now.

02:26:45.000 But you don't know my personal choices I'm going to make.

02:26:47.000 That's irrelevant.

02:26:48.000 He'll tell you that's irrelevant.

02:26:49.000 Why? 0.67

02:26:50.000 Because he sees the billiard balls moving inside your mind, so to speak.

02:26:54.000 Now, Leibniz reconciled the two.

02:26:56.000 See, for instance, when I'm living in the first person, this is my intuition.

02:27:01.000 I'm like, hey, I grabbed that cup of coffee.

02:27:03.000 I had this internal experience that's outside of physics.

02:27:07.000 So, Leibniz gives a great example.

02:27:09.000 He says, look, If I was really, really tiny and I'd walk around your mind, I would see blood flow.

02:27:16.000 I would see neurons firing.

02:27:17.000 I would see all sorts of biological interactions.

02:27:22.000 But I wouldn't see anything of consciousness.

02:27:24.000 I wouldn't see your thoughts.

02:27:25.000 I wouldn't see you thinking about your wife, hearing your child's voice, thinking about what you want to have for dinner.

02:27:30.000 I wouldn't see any of that. 0.73

02:27:32.000 I would just see billiard balls hitting one another.

02:27:35.000 However, Now that I'm having this first-person experience, there's something we call intuition, this first-person experience itself, you're having this spiritual type of transcendent experience.

02:27:46.000 What it's like to have a thought, what it's like to be me.

02:27:49.000 So for instance, I see that cup of coffee, I desire the cup of coffee and I drink it.

02:27:56.000 Science has no information about my conscious experience, my intuitive experience.

02:28:01.000 Science is not absolute.

02:28:02.000 It cannot tell me everything about the universe.

02:28:04.000 It can only tell me about the billiard balls.

02:28:06.000 It can only go so far.

02:28:08.000 At that point it has to stop.

02:28:10.000 Because it doesn't have...

02:28:11.000 Our senses cannot sense the conscious experience that we're having.

02:28:16.000 The conscious experience is only known intuitively.

02:28:19.000 So first-person experience.

02:28:21.000 So Leibniz says this, he says, look, you look at the world, when we study the world, we're all seeing billiard balls hitting one another.

02:28:26.000 Nobody argues about that.

02:28:27.000 However, our intuition is telling us that's all untrue.

02:28:30.000 We have the ability to move our own hand, desire something, grab something, eat something, consume something, make a choice.

02:28:37.000 And he says, how could they coexist?

02:28:41.000 Because remember, in reason, for me to accept something as logically true, I have to eliminate every other possibility.

02:28:47.000 So he found one possibility.

02:28:49.000 One possibility that, till today, has never been refuted.

02:28:53.000 He calls it the twin trains.

02:28:56.000 So picture two trains, okay?

02:28:58.000 They're going up and down, side by side, traveling at the same speed.

02:29:03.000 They look like they're connected to one another, but they're not.

02:29:06.000 They're just synchronized.

02:29:08.000 Every time one goes left, the other one goes left.

02:29:10.000 One goes up, one goes down.

02:29:12.000 And so when Leibniz tells you, he says, look, when you reach for that cup of coffee, the universe had already decided millions and billions of years ago that that was going to happen.

02:29:21.000 Your intuitive sense just coincides with it perfectly.

02:29:26.000 And he says, that's what he calls the twin trains theory, the correlation theory.

02:29:30.000 That your desire to grab that cup of coffee...

02:29:34.000 Doesn't affect your hand.

02:29:35.000 Does not move your hand.

02:29:36.000 That would be impossible.

02:29:37.000 That would be something non-physical moving something physical.

02:29:40.000 So he says that they're just correlated perfectly.

02:29:42.000 When you ask them, how do they correlate so perfectly?

02:29:44.000 He says, well, God, it's like God took the greatest pool shot in history.

02:29:50.000 This is Leibniz.

02:29:52.000 He's the guy who invented calculus, the binary code.

02:29:56.000 All our computers today work because of Leibniz.

02:30:01.000 That, to me, is a hard sell.

02:30:04.000 Yeah.

02:30:04.000 Most people can't wrap their mind around it.

02:30:06.000 Yeah, it's a hard sell.

02:30:08.000 First of all, a woman created the first computer code. 1.00

02:30:13.000 He invented the binary code.

02:30:15.000 Binary code.

02:30:16.000 Binary code, not computer code, but it's based on binary.

02:30:18.000 Now, when he's saying this, that your desire coincides with the universe having this, that seems like a lot of woo.

02:30:27.000 That seems like quite a bit of a stretch.

02:30:29.000 That's the interesting part.

02:30:30.000 Tell me why.

02:30:30.000 Well, why would the universe have a plan for you and your movement?

02:30:35.000 Well, he's saying God.

02:30:35.000 He's saying God, directly.

02:30:36.000 Go ahead.

02:30:38.000 Prove that.

02:30:39.000 Okay, that's a great argument.

02:30:41.000 That's a great objection.

02:30:42.000 Why would you say that it would be God?

02:30:44.000 This argument wasn't to prove God.

02:30:46.000 This argument was to tell you That this is a possibility.

02:30:50.000 While you have free will is true, and so is determinism.

02:30:54.000 Yes.

02:30:54.000 Because can you deny free will?

02:30:56.000 Aren't you having a direct experience of free will?

02:30:58.000 Well, the only denial of free will would be determinism.

02:31:02.000 The only denial would be that your idea of free will is an illusion.

02:31:05.000 You are really shaped by the momentum of your past, your genetics.

02:31:10.000 Life experiences, all the variables and the way you've absorbed emotions and interactions with people and that these are flavored.

02:31:18.000 Your very being to the point when, when presented with an obstacle or an opportunity or a thing, there is a predetermined solution in your mind for whatever the situation is.

02:31:27.000 That's determinism.

02:31:30.000 I should say action rather than solution.

02:31:32.000 Let's take a step back and look at what Leibniz is trying to say.

02:31:36.000 He's trying to say, look, there's three ways of knowing something.

02:31:38.000 This is a brilliant human being.

02:31:40.000 Many men have said the same thing throughout history.

02:31:45.000 Let's just at least entertain him.

02:31:47.000 He says, look, you know something empirically through your senses.

02:31:52.000 You touch fire, it's hot.

02:31:54.000 Then you can know something deductively.

02:31:56.000 One plus one equals two.

02:31:58.000 Via logic.

02:31:59.000 Then you can know something intuitively.

02:32:02.000 Meaning direct first experience.

02:32:04.000 Okay?

02:32:05.000 So let's say...

02:32:08.000 Let's say you tell me, I don't know, I've had coffee taste great.

02:32:14.000 You don't know that deductively or empirically.

02:32:16.000 The sensation of coffee tasting great is known intuitively direct, meaning there is no interpreter.

02:32:26.000 In philosophy, we have something called the egocentric predicament.

02:32:29.000 So right now, you're experiencing this entire room within your consciousness, right?

02:32:35.000 Mm-hmm.

02:32:37.000 I might be outside of your ego, but I'm occurring right now in your consciousness.

02:32:42.000 Do you see the difference?

02:32:44.000 I'm perceiving you in my consciousness.

02:32:46.000 Yes.

02:32:47.000 Or with my consciousness, which is connected to my senses.

02:32:51.000 Is there anything you can perceive outside of your consciousness?

02:32:58.000 That's a weird way of saying something.

02:33:00.000 It's impossible.

02:33:01.000 But perceiving outside of my consciousness, meaning being not conscious, but yet still perceiving.

02:33:08.000 No, when you perceive something, it has to be within your consciousness.

02:33:12.000 Right.

02:33:12.000 Or with your consciousness.

02:33:15.000 Right.

02:33:15.000 It cannot be outside of your consciousness.

02:33:17.000 Right.

02:33:17.000 So even if something touches your skin, you're consciously recognizing that it touches your skin.

02:33:24.000 The egocentric predicament is more about your whole universe is made up of your consciousness.

02:33:29.000 You cannot sense anything or experience anything or get any information outside of your consciousness.

02:33:33.000 Like Kant was very big on this.

02:33:34.000 He's like, look, this is called idealism.

02:33:37.000 The whole world is happening inside your head, right?

02:33:40.000 Supposedly.

02:33:40.000 Like, for instance, you see this cup of coffee.

02:33:42.000 They're going to say, oh, light clusters hit the cup of coffee.

02:33:45.000 It goes in your eye.

02:33:46.000 Your eye gives your brain a signal.

02:33:48.000 Your brain interprets the signal and creates this universe around you.

02:33:51.000 It creates this image.

02:33:52.000 The theater of your mind, yeah?

02:33:54.000 Can you experience anything outside the theater of your mind?

02:34:01.000 Very difficult to argue that you could.

02:34:03.000 It's impossible.

02:34:04.000 Yeah.

02:34:05.000 According to all the philosophers in history, we cannot.

02:34:08.000 This is called the egocentric predicament.

02:34:10.000 But what about subconscious?

02:34:12.000 That would be still happening inside your conscious mind.

02:34:14.000 So subconscious is still somewhat conscious in some way.

02:34:20.000 Yes.

02:34:21.000 Whatever you would perceive would be happening in your conscious mind.

02:34:25.000 It would just be outside of your standard awareness.

02:34:28.000 Now, the scary thing is that we make a lot of inferences.

02:34:31.000 And that's where the woo-woo comes in. 0.51

02:34:33.000 Everything is woo-woo.

02:34:34.000 You think just everything outside of science is woo-woo?

02:34:38.000 Science is just as woo-woo as everyone else.

02:34:39.000 You keep saying that, but I don't understand why you're saying that because you haven't made a good example.

02:34:43.000 The only example that you said was that they changed the way they look at gravity when new information was presented.

02:34:49.000 That doesn't equal woo-woo.

02:34:50.000 Gravity was woo-woo.

02:34:52.000 It was a magical force.

02:34:53.000 You're talking about gravity in terms of people that didn't have phones, they didn't have cars, they didn't have paved roads.

02:35:02.000 I mean, you're dealing with a very primitive notion of what gravity was.

02:35:07.000 It was a very interesting idea that has since been proven to be true.

02:35:11.000 False.

02:35:13.000 Gravity...

02:35:14.000 Newtonian gravity?

02:35:15.000 Okay.

02:35:15.000 Has been proven to be false.

02:35:16.000 But gravity is still real, right?

02:35:20.000 Not...

02:35:20.000 We're using the same word for a completely different idea.

02:35:22.000 Okay.

02:35:23.000 So Newton's gravity was magical.

02:35:26.000 It was an appeal to magic.

02:35:27.000 Okay.

02:35:28.000 Here it is.

02:35:29.000 Here it is.

02:35:29.000 Let me make it clear.

02:35:30.000 Newton's gravity is different than Einstein's gravity, and that Einstein's gravity is what's been proven, right?

02:35:35.000 We know now that light does bend around the mass of the sun, which is one of the reasons why we have a hard time seeing asteroids that are coming from behind the sun, because the mass of the sun actually bends space-time around it to the point where it distorts our view.

02:35:49.000 It's our new narrative.

02:35:50.000 It's not proven.

02:35:51.000 You can never prove a scientific fact past the level of hypothesis.

02:35:56.000 I know it sounds strange.

02:35:58.000 What do you mean past the level of hypothesis?

02:35:59.000 If you can prove it in studies and tests, you still don't buy it?

02:36:05.000 You have not eliminated every other possibility.

02:36:07.000 So it's not the same as a logical fact.

02:36:09.000 But how is that woo?

02:36:10.000 This is understood in the philosophy of science.

02:36:15.000 It's comfortably accepted.

02:36:17.000 It's not anti-science.

02:36:18.000 I'm not trying to say anything else.

02:36:19.000 No, I know you're not, but you're saying that science has so much woo, and I'm not seeing the woo part.

02:36:24.000 What I'm seeing is the necessary testing and the idea of incorporating new data and changing beliefs and ideas.

02:36:35.000 Again, it's a bit of a difficult thing to wrap your mind off in one day, but you have to think about it, and throughout time it comes clearer and clearer.

02:36:42.000 When we observe the universe, all we see is pattern and regularities found in nature.

02:36:46.000 That's it.

02:36:47.000 We don't see actual physical laws.

02:36:49.000 The physical laws are bookmarks inside our mind.

02:36:52.000 We see the same pattern over and over again, and then we attribute a physical law.

02:36:57.000 But that physical law doesn't exist out there.

02:37:00.000 So here's a great example.

02:37:02.000 Okay, let me give you a great example.

02:37:05.000 Okay, let's say I'm about to flip a coin.

02:37:06.000 Okay?

02:37:08.000 Now, you're gonna tell me it's probably gonna land on heads or tails.

02:37:11.000 Yeah?

02:37:13.000 Do you know that logically, or is it based on your history with coins?

02:37:18.000 I know it logically and based on my history of coins.

02:37:21.000 Perfect.

02:37:22.000 I'm arguing you don't know it logically.

02:37:24.000 You only know it on your past history.

02:37:26.000 Pay attention to this.

02:37:28.000 This is a little bit weird.

02:37:29.000 We've got to go slow.

02:37:30.000 It's very weird.

02:37:31.000 It goes against our instincts.

02:37:34.000 Erase all your history with coins.

02:37:36.000 You've never seen a coin before.

02:37:37.000 And I flip it.

02:37:39.000 And now it turns into a butterfly.

02:37:41.000 You've never seen a coin before.

02:37:42.000 It doesn't surprise you.

02:37:43.000 You're like, whoa, it turned into a butterfly.

02:37:45.000 Then I flip a coin a hundred times in front of you.

02:37:48.000 A hundred times it turns into a butterfly.

02:37:50.000 Now I'm going to flip the coin a hundred and one time.

02:37:53.000 You're going to be like, I bet you it turns into a butterfly.

02:37:56.000 That's how we express science.

02:37:58.000 We see the patterns and regularities, then we predict them.

02:38:02.000 Science, this is a good way to put it, science is the faith that the future will behave like the past.

02:38:14.000 Science is faith that the future will behave like the past.

02:38:19.000 So now you've developed a faith that this coin will flip into a butterfly and now you can predict it.

02:38:26.000 Wouldn't you say that science is the use of measurement to understand matter and things around us?

02:38:35.000 I wouldn't say that it's Using the past to predict the future.

02:38:40.000 I would say that if you know that fire melts lead at a certain temperature, and this is provable, and then you can show this over and over again.

02:38:51.000 Here's what we know about fire.

02:38:53.000 It reaches a certain temperature.

02:38:55.000 When lead reaches a certain temperature, it melts.

02:38:58.000 It changes its form.

02:39:00.000 Whereas if you want to do that same test to...

02:39:03.000 Carbon-based steel, it requires far greater temperatures, and then we know that there's variables in matter.

02:39:10.000 This is something that you can prove and show.

02:39:14.000 There's no woo to that.

02:39:16.000 Okay, water boils at how many degrees?

02:39:18.000 I think it's 250?

02:39:20.000 In Celsius, it's 100 degrees Celsius.

02:39:22.000 I don't know about Fahrenheit.

02:39:24.000 Oh, you Canadians. 1.00

02:39:25.000 With your wacky metric system.

02:39:27.000 Is that a scientific fact?

02:39:30.000 Is it a scientific fact that water boils at a certain temperature?

02:39:33.000 Yes.

02:39:34.000 Actually no.

02:39:35.000 It's not?

02:39:36.000 They can boil water now.

02:39:38.000 Water can resist boiling up to 200 degrees Celsius.

02:39:41.000 If you put in a certain atmospheric pressure and suspend it in a certain liquid, if you change the circumstance...

02:39:49.000 Suspend water in liquid?

02:39:50.000 They suspend in a particular liquid that's not heated or cooled.

02:39:54.000 It doesn't affect the temperature of the water itself.

02:39:58.000 And now water can boil at 200 degrees.

02:40:00.000 Okay, so you're doing something different to water.

02:40:03.000 You're taking it outside of the normal Earth environment.

02:40:06.000 So the variables also include Earth environment.

02:40:09.000 Agreed.

02:40:10.000 But water doesn't inherently boil at 100 degrees.

02:40:16.000 It's not a fact.

02:40:16.000 But we believe it to be a scientific fact.

02:40:18.000 We believe that water, if it gets 200 degrees, is boiling.

02:40:20.000 It's going to behave this way.

02:40:21.000 As a matter of fact, no.

02:40:22.000 There are many other things.

02:40:24.000 That fact has been debunked.

02:40:25.000 And there's countless amount of facts.

02:40:26.000 But wait a minute.

02:40:27.000 Is that the fact's been debunked?

02:40:29.000 Or is that when you add in sufficient external variables, then water takes longer to boil because of these variables playing into the properties that we already observed with water?

02:40:41.000 That's why whenever we have a scientific fact, there might be new information coming to change our view.

02:40:46.000 Change our view of this fact.

02:40:48.000 Right, but this is not necessarily new information.

02:40:50.000 What this is is new additional...

02:40:51.000 More precise.

02:40:52.000 More precise information.

02:40:53.000 But what you're talking about with water, you're talking about additional variables.

02:40:57.000 Like, that's just more science.

02:40:58.000 That's not woo.

02:41:00.000 Okay, well, here's some woo.

02:41:01.000 Okay, there's some woo.

02:41:02.000 Because we talked about gravity was woo.

02:41:04.000 Okay, randomness was woo.

02:41:05.000 Because we cannot find one instance of actual randomness.

02:41:09.000 The causal line is complete, as Laplace would say.

02:41:11.000 There's no randomness in the world.

02:41:13.000 So the randomness idea is just our inability to calculate unbelievably difficult variables.

02:41:18.000 Exactly. 0.95

02:41:19.000 But it's a projection of your ignorance. 0.99

02:41:22.000 If you knew, you wouldn't be random.

02:41:24.000 So for instance, I can't remember who coined the term, but they say, the man who says the tallest mountain I've ever seen is the tallest mountain.

02:41:32.000 He's making himself the measure of truth.

02:41:34.000 I measure truth.

02:41:35.000 If you take that perspective, you're the center of truth.

02:41:38.000 I'm truth.

02:41:38.000 There's nothing outside of me that's true.

02:41:40.000 Then you see randomness everywhere.

02:41:42.000 However, if you believe in correspondence theory, that truth is independent of me and you, which I think most of us will agree, then randomness doesn't exist in that context because randomness only depends on you.

02:41:52.000 And when things are true outside of your beliefs.

02:41:55.000 Let's take another classic Wu term.

02:41:58.000 Again, this is a very advanced philosophy.

02:41:59.000 I know it sounds crazy, but this is what the greatest thinkers in history report, what they've written down.

02:42:06.000 Okay, you see a knife.

02:42:10.000 Let's look at Aristotle's theory of knives.

02:42:12.000 He says, look at this knife.

02:42:13.000 I show you a plastic knife.

02:42:14.000 I show you a wood knife.

02:42:15.000 I show you a metal knife.

02:42:16.000 I show you five different knives.

02:42:18.000 And you're like, they're all knives.

02:42:19.000 All of them are knives.

02:42:20.000 You point to them and say they're knives.

02:42:23.000 Aristotle says, look, they all share in one something, let's call it the essence, that makes them all knives.

02:42:30.000 Would you agree?

02:42:31.000 The form.

02:42:32.000 They all share...

02:42:33.000 If I draw a knife on a paper, you'd be like, he just drew a knife.

02:42:36.000 Okay.

02:42:36.000 That knife on the paper shares something with a knife made of steel, the knife made of plastic, the knife made of wood.

02:42:42.000 The form.

02:42:43.000 There's something about it.

02:42:44.000 We call it the essence in philosophy.

02:42:45.000 Okay.

02:42:46.000 The form might be confused with what Plato says, because Plato had a whole thing about forms.

02:42:50.000 But let's call it, for now, essence.

02:42:52.000 Okay.

02:42:53.000 If you change the essence, you change the thing.

02:42:55.000 So if I take that plastic knife and I melt it, you'll be like, it's not a knife anymore.

02:43:01.000 Why?

02:43:02.000 What did I do?

02:43:02.000 You change that thing about it.

02:43:05.000 That essence, right?

02:43:07.000 Now, that essence, does it exist out there in the world or is it only in your head?

02:43:10.000 You made it up.

02:43:13.000 Well, by calling it essence, you're confusing me.

02:43:16.000 So I would call it the form.

02:43:17.000 The form of it, it exists in culture.

02:43:20.000 It exists in our understanding of these objects and their useful shapes.

02:43:24.000 It's your idea of knife conforms to that knife out there.

02:43:29.000 Where's that knife?

02:43:30.000 Oh, here.

02:43:30.000 That's a great, yeah.

02:43:31.000 Bring it out.

02:43:31.000 You can see it.

02:43:32.000 Great.

02:43:33.000 That's obviously a knife.

02:43:34.000 Yes.

02:43:34.000 Right?

02:43:35.000 You recognize it.

02:43:36.000 I recognize it.

02:43:37.000 That's a knife.

02:43:38.000 Yeah, I totally agree.

02:43:39.000 My model of knife...

02:43:40.000 That's a knife.

02:43:41.000 Yeah, my model of knife, that fits my model of knife.

02:43:44.000 Yeah, mine as well.

02:43:44.000 Beautiful.

02:43:44.000 But there's some weird looking knives out there too.

02:43:46.000 Sure.

02:43:47.000 And there might be a knife where we don't agree that's a knife.

02:43:49.000 You think it's a knife, I don't agree, I think that's a sword.

02:43:51.000 I've reached the level of sword.

02:43:52.000 Right, yeah, like a bowie knife.

02:43:54.000 We might have a different...

02:43:55.000 That's great evidence that it's something in our minds.

02:43:57.000 It's not actually objective.

02:43:59.000 Right, right, right.

02:43:59.000 They get to the certain length and you're like, ooh.

02:44:01.000 It's subjective.

02:44:01.000 Yeah, it's subjective, right?

02:44:03.000 Okay, let's look at matter now.

02:44:06.000 Matter is an inference of the mind.

02:44:08.000 Just like the knife is an inference of the mind.

02:44:11.000 In terms of subatomic particles and atoms and...

02:44:15.000 Watch this.

02:44:16.000 You see this cup?

02:44:17.000 You see this bottle?

02:44:18.000 Yes.

02:44:19.000 You see this clock?

02:44:20.000 Yes.

02:44:20.000 You made an inference.

02:44:21.000 They all share one thing.

02:44:22.000 What do they share?

02:44:23.000 All of them share one thing.

02:44:24.000 What is that thing they share?

02:44:25.000 They share this thing called matter.

02:44:28.000 But that was an inference.

02:44:30.000 Just like we inferred the essence of a knife.

02:44:32.000 Matter has never been observed in nature.

02:44:35.000 Matter is a byproduct of our mind.

02:44:39.000 So when you see a tree, you're not seeing matter.

02:44:43.000 There's no matter.

02:44:44.000 Not that I'm inferring matter, I'm observing an image, but I'm inferring the matter.

02:44:49.000 The matter is a mental construct.

02:44:51.000 Is it a mental construct or is it...

02:44:55.000 Our inability to see things smaller than what is necessary for our survival.

02:45:01.000 Like we can't see atoms.

02:45:02.000 We can't see subatomic particles.

02:45:04.000 We can't see them with the naked eye.

02:45:06.000 But we understand through science that they exist.

02:45:10.000 How do you understand that they exist?

02:45:12.000 Are you saying that matter exists out there independently of your mind?

02:45:16.000 Is matter objective or is it dependent on your mind to exist?

02:45:20.000 It's not dependent on your mind to exist.

02:45:23.000 It's dependent upon your mind to observe.

02:45:25.000 You need your mind to be able to observe matter.

02:45:29.000 But if you didn't exist, do you think this table would exist?

02:45:32.000 That I don't know.

02:45:34.000 Right.

02:45:34.000 But what would you guess?

02:45:36.000 I would guess that all I know, if I'm going to use Occam's razor, if I'm going to go to the extreme with Occam's razor, I'm just gonna believe what I observe.

02:45:45.000 Okay. 0.99

02:45:46.000 And kill all the woo-woo. 1.00

02:45:47.000 Kill it all. 1.00

02:45:48.000 You have had loved one die, right? 1.00

02:45:50.000 Yeah.

02:45:50.000 Everyone has, right?

02:45:52.000 Do you assume that when they die, the universe is still the universe?

02:45:56.000 What do you mean, still the universe?

02:45:57.000 It's like the world is the way they are.

02:46:00.000 I mean, the way it is, there's trees and grass and dirt, and this person dies.

02:46:05.000 The trees and grass and dirt, they don't change.

02:46:07.000 They're still the same thing.

02:46:10.000 What do you mean?

02:46:11.000 The nature of the tree would change?

02:46:12.000 No, I'm saying if you love someone and you know this person and they are no longer with us, all the things around you, like this coffee cup and this knife, they remain the same.

02:46:23.000 They don't change.

02:46:24.000 No, they don't change.

02:46:25.000 Why would you assume that it would be any different for yourself?

02:46:28.000 If you weren't here, why would you think that this table would not exist or the microphone would not exist?

02:46:34.000 That's a great argument.

02:46:35.000 I'm not saying that it wouldn't.

02:46:36.000 This is what we call hard objectivity.

02:46:38.000 Something that's hard objectivity exists without any human mind in existence.

02:46:42.000 If all human minds were dead, whatever exists still is what we would call, philosophers called hard objectivity.

02:46:49.000 Now we have objectivity.

02:46:50.000 So for instance, let's look at George Berkeley's example because that's such a great question.

02:46:55.000 Look at a triangle.

02:46:56.000 Picture a blue triangle.

02:46:59.000 Picture a green one.

02:47:00.000 Picture a black one. 1.00

02:47:01.000 Picture a white one. 0.86

02:47:02.000 Can you picture one with no subjective elements?

02:47:05.000 Meaning because color is subjective, right?

02:47:07.000 Color is a construct of the mind.

02:47:09.000 So if I was colorblind, this shirt would be a different color to me than it is to you.

02:47:13.000 However, there would still be one shirt.

02:47:15.000 It would be objective to a certain degree.

02:47:18.000 So a triangle has three sides, three corners.

02:47:22.000 It adds up to 180 degrees.

02:47:24.000 We all agree.

02:47:25.000 Whether you're colorblind, it doesn't matter.

02:47:27.000 There's no subjective element to how many points does it have.

02:47:30.000 Nobody's going to come in and say, to me, triangles have four sides.

02:47:34.000 You'd be like, that's not a triangle.

02:47:36.000 There's not three angles to that.

02:47:38.000 You've gone past analytical understanding.

02:47:42.000 Okay, so, George Berkeley says, can you picture a triangle without any subjective element, without any color?

02:47:49.000 Let's call it color to make it really simple, really obvious.

02:47:52.000 Can you picture a triangle without any color?

02:47:55.000 You would have to have it in contrast to something so that you could see it.

02:47:59.000 Say if you had a purple curtain, like what we have behind us, and out of that purple curtain we cut a triangle, even if there was no color, even if it was just clear.

02:48:13.000 You would be able to see, you'd be able to differentiate between that shape.

02:48:16.000 But you needed that purple curtain.

02:48:18.000 To differentiate, yes.

02:48:19.000 So we cannot have it without subjective element.

02:48:22.000 This was Berkeley's point, exactly what you said.

02:48:24.000 I see what you're saying.

02:48:24.000 Beautiful.

02:48:25.000 Every objective thing we've observed in the universe is made up of subjective elements.

02:48:31.000 Even when you draw the number one on a blackboard, it has to be a color.

02:48:35.000 It has to be something.

02:48:36.000 It has to be a contrast, like you said.

02:48:37.000 It's beautiful.

02:48:38.000 You said it beautifully.

02:48:41.000 All our objective elements are mental constructs.

02:48:45.000 Three sides.

02:48:46.000 The idea of side is a mental construct.

02:48:48.000 The idea of a point is a mental construct.

02:48:50.000 The idea of 180 degrees is mathematical.

02:48:53.000 It's happening in your mind somewhere.

02:48:55.000 It's not out there being observed.

02:48:57.000 You can draw it, and I can see it, and I can repeat it, and you can teach it to me, and I can teach it to someone else.

02:49:03.000 They may be mental constructs, but they're provable mental constructs that are repeatable.

02:49:08.000 So we think of them as a real thing.

02:49:11.000 We're in agreement that mathematics is a mental construct and it's true.

02:49:15.000 It's by definition true.

02:49:17.000 So it's both, a mental construct and true.

02:49:19.000 Yes, but it's not outside, out there in the world.

02:49:22.000 It's within.

02:49:24.000 But if you make a triangle on the ground, it's in the world.

02:49:30.000 The numbers are in your head and the subjective element is in the world.

02:49:34.000 There's a two-way streak.

02:49:36.000 The subjective element is in the world, but it's a triangle.

02:49:40.000 So how's it in your head?

02:49:42.000 Because when you look at a triangle, the subjective elements...

02:49:49.000 When you observe them in your mind, your mind points out different objective elements of that triangle.

02:49:55.000 But it's dependent on your mind.

02:49:57.000 By that argument, the entire universe is dependent on your mind.

02:50:00.000 Absolutely, no doubt about it.

02:50:01.000 If we're going to use Occam's razor, not everyday language.

02:50:04.000 We're using Occam's razor.

02:50:05.000 Let's take away everything we're not sure of.

02:50:06.000 Everything that has a doubt, get rid of it.

02:50:08.000 Okay.

02:50:09.000 Get rid of everything with a sliver of doubt.

02:50:10.000 The problem is matter itself has a sliver of doubt.

02:50:14.000 Absolutely.

02:50:15.000 Well, when you have subatomic particles that exist in two different states simultaneously, they're both spinning and still.

02:50:23.000 They're in super states.

02:50:24.000 Berkeley would tell you those are images of subatomic particles.

02:50:27.000 They're not subatomic particles independent of your mind.

02:50:32.000 Well, I had a conversation with Sean Carroll about it.

02:50:36.000 He was a physicist and he made it even more muddy to me.

02:50:41.000 I thought it was crazy before I talked to him and then when I talked to him...

02:50:45.000 He's brilliant.

02:50:46.000 He's brilliant.

02:50:47.000 He's essentially saying that subatomic particles don't blink in and out of existence.

02:50:53.000 It's just we...

02:50:55.000 It's the way we're looking at them.

02:50:57.000 And that they exist in this just bizarre state.

02:51:01.000 But they exist in this state in a way that it's very difficult for us to use normal language to sort of explain.

02:51:07.000 Exactly.

02:51:07.000 That's the true issue.

02:51:08.000 But you know what? 0.99

02:51:09.000 I might have fucked... 0.99

02:51:10.000 He's probably listening to this. 1.00

02:51:11.000 He's like, you fucking dummy. 1.00

02:51:13.000 You ruined what I said again. 1.00

02:51:15.000 You know what?

02:51:16.000 One great conversation.

02:51:18.000 I heard a conversation between Jordan Peterson and Sam Harris.

02:51:21.000 Oh, that conversation about truth?

02:51:23.000 I loved it.

02:51:23.000 Oh, that drove me crazy.

02:51:24.000 I think we could do better, though.

02:51:26.000 Yes, I think they could have done better, too.

02:51:28.000 They needed a moderator.

02:51:29.000 Yes, exactly, exactly.

02:51:30.000 I think they need to get to know each other personally first.

02:51:32.000 Yes.

02:51:33.000 They never met, by the way.

02:51:34.000 Right.

02:51:35.000 That's fireworks, right?

02:51:38.000 That was such a great conversation, but here's my question.

02:51:41.000 What's the difference between knowledge and belief?

02:51:44.000 Because a lot of what we said is kind of muddy.

02:51:46.000 Okay, let's make the waters crystal clear as much as possible.

02:51:49.000 Okay.

02:51:51.000 What is the difference between knowledge and belief?

02:51:54.000 Well, the belief that the gremlins are pulling down on people, which is why we have gravity, that would be a belief.

02:52:01.000 No, they're both beliefs.

02:52:02.000 Gravity is not knowledge, it's belief.

02:52:04.000 Okay, but we're talking about gremlins.

02:52:06.000 I was going to say, that's knowledge, or that's a belief.

02:52:10.000 Belief.

02:52:11.000 Knowledge is, if I throw water on you, you get wet.

02:52:15.000 I would say that's a belief.

02:52:16.000 It's a belief?

02:52:17.000 Yes.

02:52:17.000 So maybe one day I throw water on you and you show me that you're Jesus and the water just goes right through you and it doesn't exist.

02:52:24.000 The reason why you believe water will make me wet is because it happened in the past.

02:52:28.000 And you think that the future is going to behave like the past.

02:52:30.000 Just like Aristotle saw the sun go around the earth and he thought that this is going to happen every day.

02:52:33.000 But he didn't understand.

02:52:35.000 I understand.

02:52:35.000 It's optical illusion.

02:52:36.000 But what I understand is what water is though.

02:52:38.000 It's H2O. I throw it at you, you get wet.

02:52:40.000 All flamingos are pink.

02:52:41.000 They're not.

02:52:42.000 They're not.

02:52:43.000 We didn't know that all the time, did we?

02:52:44.000 Then we went to Australia.

02:52:45.000 They don't have the same food source.

02:52:47.000 They don't have the same food source. 0.56

02:52:48.000 They're black here. 1.00

02:52:48.000 They're white here. 1.00

02:52:49.000 They have a different food source.

02:52:50.000 Flamingos are not inherently pink.

02:52:53.000 A scientific fact can always be overturned.

02:52:56.000 Oh, look at this!

02:52:58.000 You threw water and didn't get wet!

02:53:00.000 Yeah, but this is just because it's a certain coating.

02:53:04.000 Right, I got you.

02:53:06.000 But if he's got that over his body, he's not going to be able to breathe.

02:53:08.000 Okay, how about this?

02:53:10.000 You've never seen fire before.

02:53:11.000 You've never seen fire.

02:53:12.000 Okay.

02:53:13.000 You've been being warmed by electric blankets your entire life.

02:53:17.000 Okay.

02:53:17.000 Then you see a flame.

02:53:19.000 Can you know that that flame is going to burn you if you touch it logically or is it only via experience through history?

02:53:24.000 Developing a history, a relationship with fire.

02:53:26.000 It burns you once.

02:53:27.000 It burns you twice.

02:53:28.000 You're like, hey, I think the future is going to behave like the past.

02:53:31.000 There's people who know that fire burns you and they've never been burned by fire because they went to school and they learned from people who explained the properties of fire, what it is, how it works, what temperature it operates on, how it's different depending upon the color of it or what's burning.

02:53:47.000 Borrowed history.

02:53:49.000 It's still history.

02:53:50.000 Borrowed history?

02:53:51.000 How so?

02:53:52.000 You learn from my mistakes of touching fire.

02:53:54.000 Okay.

02:53:54.000 But it's still known via experience, via history.

02:53:58.000 Well, it's known via science if you explain exactly what the elements of the fire are and how it works and what it burns at and what temperature specific things need to burn at.

02:54:08.000 You don't have to get burned to know that it will burn you.

02:54:12.000 No.

02:54:12.000 No, but that's how we discovered fire burns, by testing it.

02:54:15.000 Right.

02:54:15.000 Not via a logical deduction.

02:54:17.000 Okay, I see what you're saying.

02:54:18.000 It's only history.

02:54:20.000 Science is patterns and irregularities found in nature.

02:54:22.000 We observe nature, we see these patterns and irregularities.

02:54:25.000 Right.

02:54:26.000 We have no idea what's causing them.

02:54:27.000 Well, wasn't that Descartes' original idea about science in the first place was using measurement to sort of understand nature?

02:54:38.000 Right.

02:54:39.000 Was that one of his original concepts of establishing science in the first place?

02:54:43.000 No, his original concept was, look, science is doubtable.

02:54:47.000 He said that, science is doubtable, no doubt.

02:54:48.000 It's called Cartesian doubt, an extreme level of doubt.

02:54:51.000 He says, those are all beliefs.

02:54:53.000 I don't have any knowledge.

02:54:54.000 What do I know?

02:54:55.000 Because knowledge means zero chance of being wrong.

02:54:58.000 Okay.

02:54:59.000 Zero chance of being wrong.

02:55:00.000 Give me one scientific fact you truly trust 100%. 1.00

02:55:03.000 Okay, if I take a match and I take a yellow piece of paper from this particular notebook, I will light that motherfucker on fire with that match. 1.00

02:55:14.000 That's a fact. 1.00

02:55:15.000 Okay, that's a scientific fact?

02:55:17.000 Is it?

02:55:18.000 No, it's a scientific fact, but it's not higher than hypothesis.

02:55:21.000 It's just hypothesis you have.

02:55:22.000 Why?

02:55:23.000 Because every time you've seen a fire, touch a piece of paper, it burned it.

02:55:27.000 So you're relying on your historical experiences.

02:55:30.000 Okay.

02:55:30.000 Okay, so you're essentially saying there's no scientific fact possible.

02:55:35.000 Only to the level of hypothesis.

02:55:37.000 This is not me talking, this is Thomas Kuhn.

02:55:39.000 He's saying, look, we have two phases in science.

02:55:44.000 Standard science and then a scientific revolution.

02:55:47.000 What's standard science?

02:55:48.000 Well, whatever the flavor of the day is.

02:55:50.000 Let's say today it's evolution.

02:55:54.000 And then he says, look, every piece of information we receive, we interpret it through that lens.

02:55:59.000 He called it a paradigm.

02:56:00.000 We look at the information through the lens of evolution.

02:56:04.000 So it makes sense.

02:56:04.000 It fits right here in our story of evolution.

02:56:07.000 Right.

02:56:08.000 And then he says, look, a small amount of contradictory information is going to pool slowly.

02:56:15.000 It's inevitable, he says.

02:56:17.000 And then this, we're going to ignore it.

02:56:19.000 We're going to sweep it under the rug.

02:56:20.000 Everything doesn't make sense.

02:56:21.000 We're going to sweep it under the rug.

02:56:23.000 And then one day that level of information, that amount of information that doesn't fit in any way with our theory, our current theory, is going to pull and pull and pull and pull until one guy comes around and says, no, we had it backwards or we had it wrong.

02:56:36.000 It's this.

02:56:36.000 Now all this new information fits in the new theory.

02:56:39.000 All the old stuff fits and all the new stuff fits.

02:56:42.000 And that's called the scientific revolution.

02:56:44.000 And he says science is always going through a normal phase and then a revolution phase.

02:56:48.000 And man is becoming more and more precise.

02:56:50.000 But we'll never reach the level of past hypothesis.

02:56:53.000 Why?

02:56:54.000 Because science is based on our faith that the future will behave like the past.

02:57:02.000 We only know things via experience, via our history.

02:57:06.000 So when I flip that coin, you have no idea what's going to happen.

02:57:09.000 Until I flip many coins in front of you.

02:57:11.000 Or I give you my...

02:57:12.000 If you trust me and I tell you what...

02:57:13.000 Listen, I did this experiment.

02:57:15.000 Here are my results.

02:57:15.000 And you trust me.

02:57:16.000 You just take it for granted.

02:57:17.000 You take it on way of authority.

02:57:18.000 I agree with everything you said.

02:57:20.000 I still don't see where you're saying science has so much woo.

02:57:24.000 Okay.

02:57:24.000 Or science has as much woo as healers or crystal suckers or...

02:57:29.000 Listen, I don't believe in crystals in any of that.

02:57:31.000 I know you don't.

02:57:32.000 I don't.

02:57:32.000 I just...

02:57:33.000 I have a higher standard of skepticism.

02:57:35.000 I'm missing the woo though.

02:57:36.000 Okay.

02:57:37.000 The woo is when we project physical laws.

02:57:41.000 Combustion, electricity, gravity.

02:57:43.000 These are all appeal to magic.

02:57:45.000 Can you demonstrate these physical laws?

02:57:47.000 Or are they byproducts?

02:57:51.000 Are they inferences you made in your mind because you've seen a certain pattern over and over again?

02:57:57.000 That law doesn't exist out there in the universe.

02:58:01.000 It's only a bookmark.

02:58:02.000 It's only a name we have for a pattern we've observed in nature.

02:58:06.000 It's pretty heavy stuff, I know.

02:58:08.000 It's only a name for a pattern.

02:58:10.000 Exactly.

02:58:11.000 That we've observed that exists in nature.

02:58:13.000 Exactly.

02:58:13.000 So that means you can't label anything ever.

02:58:15.000 Because everything is just a pattern that we've observed in nature.

02:58:18.000 Everything is a pattern.

02:58:19.000 So there's no things.

02:58:20.000 There's no logic behind it.

02:58:21.000 Nothing is real.

02:58:21.000 There's no logic.

02:58:22.000 We give an explanation.

02:58:23.000 We give a narrative to it.

02:58:24.000 Okay.

02:58:25.000 But that narrative is just our paradigm.

02:58:29.000 Kamis Kuhn would say, that's the shades you're wearing.

02:58:31.000 Okay.

02:58:32.000 You kind of said it beautifully.

02:58:34.000 He said, look, you have pink tinted glasses.

02:58:36.000 You could have blue tinted glasses, but whatever glasses you're wearing, that's the song and dance.

02:58:41.000 That's the story you tell yourself of why those things are happening the way they're happening.

02:58:45.000 Okay.

02:58:47.000 The truth of the matter is, all we're seeing is one pattern happening over and over again.

02:58:51.000 So what this is essentially is an intellectual exercise, but the reality of our ability to come up with the very technology that we're using right now to broadcast this podcast It means that they have figured things out that they're provable and that you can use science to determine what frequency things need to be,

02:59:16.000 how much electricity you need, what kind of components can take the image and project it through the power lines and through the internet cables and all the different things that we need to be in place to provide the electricity, to provide the internet connection.

02:59:33.000 That's all science.

02:59:35.000 It's predictive.

02:59:36.000 Science is predictive.

02:59:37.000 Right, but these are all things that are not just observable, but they're repeatable.

02:59:41.000 Right.

02:59:42.000 So where's the woo?

02:59:44.000 Here's where the woo is, okay?

02:59:46.000 Our explanation for why it happens, the laws of nature, our woo.

02:59:51.000 It's not woo.

02:59:53.000 It's our words that we use to describe repeatable things.

02:59:58.000 Okay, which force of nature are you referring to?

03:00:04.000 Let's pick one.

03:00:04.000 Okay, randomness.

03:00:05.000 Can you show?

03:00:06.000 I don't think that's a force of nature.

03:00:07.000 I agree with you that randomness, the idea of randomness.

03:00:11.000 Okay, pick one.

03:00:12.000 Because they use it.

03:00:13.000 They say it's evolution, a natural section via random selection.

03:00:19.000 Temperature.

03:00:20.000 Temperature.

03:00:21.000 Okay.

03:00:22.000 I observe temperature like you.

03:00:24.000 I believe temperature exists.

03:00:25.000 What causes temperature?

03:00:27.000 We don't know.

03:00:29.000 That's true.

03:00:30.000 We don't know.

03:00:31.000 We, you and I don't know.

03:00:33.000 They don't have any idea what causes that friction causes certain things, that the magnetic pull of the sun on the earth causes certain temperature shifts, and these are recognizable and repeatable, and they understand how to measure them.

03:00:51.000 These are all just patterns and regularities found in nature.

03:00:54.000 And they're giving them names and explanations.

03:00:57.000 I see what you're saying.

03:00:58.000 These names and explanations can be debunked later on.

03:01:00.000 I put them in the maybe pile, plausible pile.

03:01:03.000 But this is, listen, I know it's frustrating, but the philosophy of science, this is it.

03:01:08.000 The cause and effect, we do not observe cause and effect.

03:01:12.000 We do not observe one thing causing another.

03:01:14.000 We just see A and then we see B. It's a bit difficult, but imagine this.

03:01:19.000 We see A and we see B. We don't see the causal connection.

03:01:22.000 Because if we did see the causal connection, you would know what happens when I flip that coin.

03:01:27.000 You could have predicted it.

03:01:28.000 You could predict what's going to happen when I touch fire.

03:01:30.000 I would have to know exactly how much force you're exerting on your thumb to flip that coin.

03:01:34.000 I would have to know what altitude we're at to understand what I would have to know the atmosphere that this coin is going through.

03:01:39.000 I would have to know the weight of the coin.

03:01:41.000 I would have to know the position of your thumb on the thing.

03:01:44.000 It's like what you said about the billiard balls.

03:01:46.000 It is true that if you could calculate the exact amount of friction on the cloth and the table, the amount of polish that are on the balls, the amount of force, you'd have to have all the balls in exactly the same spot.

03:01:58.000 But this is not possible today.

03:02:01.000 Today, if you set up a table and you set up, let's just say nine balls, and you told me you were going to know where every ball was to the millimeter, I would say, I will bet you a million dollars you're wrong.

03:02:15.000 And I would be right every time.

03:02:17.000 You're never going to get it.

03:02:19.000 Why?

03:02:20.000 Because you don't have the ability to calculate all those variables.

03:02:23.000 But it's theoretically possible.

03:02:24.000 And it's also the physical change of the amount of force that you drive when you break those balls varies.

03:02:31.000 And if it varies even slightly, it's going to change the way.

03:02:34.000 So a person just doing it with their body is not capable of that kind of precision.

03:02:40.000 If we got a robot to break. 0.53

03:02:42.000 Even if you got a robot to break, you would have to have those balls in exactly the same spot.

03:02:47.000 And they don't usually sit that way because the cloth has fiber in it.

03:02:51.000 And it's wool.

03:02:52.000 It's a worsted wool.

03:02:54.000 And that worsted wool moves and shifts and bends and it flattens out in some spaces.

03:02:59.000 In other spaces it gets dirt and debris and chalk.

03:03:02.000 There's too many variables.

03:03:03.000 So because we cannot compute all the variables, I'm with you.

03:03:07.000 We can create it with a slight margin of error.

03:03:10.000 Right.

03:03:10.000 There'll still be a margin of error.

03:03:12.000 That's why Laplace said, I need a divine calculator.

03:03:14.000 He says, I would have to even round off the numbers.

03:03:16.000 So I'll be slightly wrong.

03:03:18.000 Right.

03:03:19.000 But the argument is that if we had all the variables, and that's a big if, it's logically possible.

03:03:24.000 It's logically coherent with the reality that we see.

03:03:27.000 Yes.

03:03:28.000 Randomness is by the wayside.

03:03:30.000 It's a figment of our imagination.

03:03:31.000 We project it when we cannot compute.

03:03:34.000 But if we could...

03:03:36.000 This is objective outside of us.

03:03:39.000 The truth is outside of us.

03:03:40.000 It's not dependent on me and you, how we see the world.

03:03:43.000 So randomness is based essentially on our inability to calculate variables.

03:03:47.000 It's not on an actual law itself.

03:03:49.000 Yes.

03:03:49.000 Yeah, that makes sense.

03:03:50.000 So when we say that's random, it's woo-woo.

03:03:52.000 It is, in the strictest way of the word.

03:03:54.000 Now, every logical law, now this is what hurts people, but I love science.

03:03:58.000 Look at me, I'm a lover of science.

03:03:59.000 No, I believe you do.

03:04:00.000 I'm a science addict.

03:04:02.000 I read all the books.

03:04:03.000 I'm fascinated by science.

03:04:05.000 Let's say I take object X and I throw it at a window.

03:04:09.000 What's going to happen?

03:04:11.000 I don't know.

03:04:12.000 You don't have any experience with Object X. I don't know what Object X is.

03:04:15.000 Why can't you deduce it?

03:04:17.000 Why can't you deduce what's going to happen?

03:04:18.000 Well, if I had more information...

03:04:20.000 You need a history with Object X. You need to get to know Object X, interact.

03:04:26.000 You cannot deduce it.

03:04:28.000 Well, you would write down all these different variables.

03:04:31.000 You would find out what people have learned from the past about these variables, and that would be science.

03:04:37.000 Exactly.

03:04:38.000 Science is the history.

03:04:40.000 Of patterns and regularities.

03:04:41.000 It is not deduction.

03:04:43.000 It is not logic.

03:04:44.000 It's a type of logic.

03:04:45.000 We call it inductive logic.

03:04:47.000 This logic is the faith that the past, that the future will behave like the past.

03:04:53.000 So the patterns and regularities we see in nature We say, look, if these happen often enough, we can recreate these circumstances often enough, we predict it'll happen in the future.

03:05:03.000 We have a faith that it'll happen again in the future.

03:05:05.000 There is no logical reason why it does.

03:05:08.000 There is not one single logical reason why we don't fall off the face of the earth.

03:05:13.000 Every explanation we give ourselves is just a narrative.

03:05:17.000 It is always subject to reinterpretation.

03:05:20.000 However...

03:05:20.000 With a change in variables.

03:05:22.000 Like a shifting of the Earth's magnetic poles or...

03:05:25.000 I gave you a ridiculous narrative. 0.97

03:05:28.000 The gremlin one. 0.99

03:05:29.000 Just to show you.

03:05:30.000 Look, I know you don't believe in mine.

03:05:31.000 I don't believe in mine either.

03:05:32.000 But I'm doing the same thing Isaac did.

03:05:35.000 And I'm going to correlate my Gremlins theory as far as he can correlate his gravity theory.

03:05:40.000 He used the word gravity.

03:05:41.000 He made it sound better. 0.74

03:05:43.000 He made it sound less ridiculous. 0.70

03:05:45.000 But the truth of the matter is, he's throwing his hands up in the air saying, look, I don't know. 0.55

03:05:48.000 Let's just call it gravity.

03:05:49.000 This is a way to think about it.

03:05:50.000 Now, his contemporaries laughed at him.

03:05:52.000 They said it's an appeal to magic.

03:05:54.000 And then when people started wearing those shades, those paradigms, they're like, hey, it makes sense.

03:05:58.000 If you just believe in gravity for a second, it explains all this ballet of celestial bodies and how they move.

03:06:07.000 But really what he discovered was a pattern.

03:06:09.000 And he gave that pattern a name.

03:06:11.000 But does that force exist out there?

03:06:13.000 Well, not according to Einstein.

03:06:14.000 He came up with a different narrative that fits the evidence even better than Isaac Newton did.

03:06:18.000 But it's still a narrative.

03:06:20.000 It hasn't removed all the other possibilities.

03:06:22.000 For something to be true without a doubt, for it to be knowledge, not belief, there has to be zero doubt, meaning no other possibility whatsoever.

03:06:30.000 That's knowledge.

03:06:31.000 So can you know something that's untrue?

03:06:34.000 You cannot know something that's untrue.

03:06:35.000 You can believe something that's untrue.

03:06:38.000 Knowledge means...

03:06:40.000 That this is known.

03:06:41.000 There is no possibility of doubt.

03:06:42.000 That's why Descartes was such an important philosopher.

03:06:44.000 Because he gave us one thing that we know.

03:06:47.000 The cogito.

03:06:48.000 Have you heard of the cogito?

03:06:49.000 I don't remember what it is.

03:06:51.000 I think, therefore, I am.

03:06:52.000 Oh, okay.

03:06:53.000 That's what it is.

03:06:54.000 So, what is it that we know for sure?

03:06:56.000 Because...

03:06:57.000 You know, it's funny.

03:06:57.000 There's two great philosophers that I've read that went through a crisis in their life.

03:07:00.000 One of them was Imam Ghazali, a great Arabic philosopher, and one of them was René Descartes.

03:07:04.000 And both their writings are very, like, it's amazing.

03:07:07.000 Why?

03:07:08.000 Because they go through this crisis.

03:07:09.000 They go through, what do I actually know?

03:07:11.000 Because they came to this exact same conclusion that, hey, it's all explanation.

03:07:16.000 It's not proof.

03:07:19.000 It's all a narrative.

03:07:20.000 It's all a point of view.

03:07:21.000 Science keeps getting refined and changed.

03:07:23.000 With more information.

03:07:24.000 What we believed yesterday gets taken out from underneath us.

03:07:27.000 Today's paradigm is going to be shifted again a hundred years from now, a thousand years from now.

03:07:31.000 What can I grab and be like, this is true.

03:07:33.000 Nobody can ever take this from me.

03:07:35.000 That's going to be called knowledge.

03:07:37.000 So it all comes down.

03:07:38.000 At the end of the long journey of Cartesian doubt, it was so extreme.

03:07:43.000 The philosophers gave it a new name.

03:07:45.000 They call it Cartesian doubt.

03:07:46.000 They call it modern philosophy.

03:07:48.000 So philosophy is thousands of years old.

03:07:50.000 Descartes comes, writes a book.

03:07:51.000 He wrote six chapters in six days.

03:07:54.000 And he was like, what do I actually know?

03:07:56.000 100% without a doubt.

03:07:57.000 Nobody could ever question me.

03:07:59.000 And he said, look, I believe in the cogito.

03:08:00.000 What's the cogito?

03:08:01.000 I think therefore I am.

03:08:03.000 So he goes through a long process.

03:08:04.000 You know, if we have the time, we'll go through a little nutshell of it.

03:08:08.000 So he says, look, he says, look, when I put a straw in a glass of water, my eyes tell me that the straw is bent.

03:08:15.000 Right?

03:08:16.000 Because the reflection of the water is bent.

03:08:18.000 The reflection of the light off the water is bent.

03:08:21.000 He says, look, my eyes lie to me.

03:08:23.000 Aristotle thought the sun goes around the earth.

03:08:25.000 His eyes lie to him.

03:08:26.000 Our senses lie.

03:08:28.000 He talks about if I put my hand in cold water, then I put it in tepid water, it'll seem warm to me.

03:08:33.000 But that's just my bias, my inability to tell you what my instruments are not accurate enough.

03:08:43.000 So he said, okay, let's put empiricism or senses by the wayside.

03:08:49.000 It cannot give us truth.

03:08:51.000 It cannot give us truth.

03:08:53.000 He said, what about deduction?

03:08:54.000 What about math?

03:08:55.000 Analytical knowledge.

03:08:56.000 One plus one equals two.

03:08:58.000 Believe it or not, philosophers also disagree with a lot of mathematical beliefs.

03:09:03.000 So for instance, here's a big critique of math.

03:09:07.000 One plus one equals two.

03:09:08.000 We all believe it.

03:09:10.000 But the critique is that one plus one is another way of saying two.

03:09:14.000 There's no actual information you ever gave me.

03:09:18.000 Mathematics is just one way to sum up a lot of information.

03:09:22.000 It helps me give you an epiphany.

03:09:25.000 It helps me make you understand what's happening on the billiard ball table.

03:09:28.000 Right.

03:09:28.000 So by calling one plus one, two, you're not changing the objects themselves.

03:09:33.000 No.

03:09:34.000 It's always been two things.

03:09:35.000 It's always been two.

03:09:36.000 Yeah.

03:09:37.000 It's a tautology.

03:09:38.000 You're just explaining to me something that's out there, already existing.

03:09:42.000 So if I tell you a triangle has three points.

03:09:44.000 Well, when I said the word triangle...

03:09:46.000 I already told you it has three points, but maybe you didn't pick that up.

03:09:48.000 Maybe I had to point it out to you.

03:09:50.000 So, Bertrand Russell said it beautifully.

03:09:52.000 He said, look, first in his career, Bertrand Russell is a great thinker.

03:09:57.000 He said, look, mathematics is the thing we're most sure of.

03:10:00.000 By the end of his career, he was like, guys, I'm not even sure about math anymore.

03:10:03.000 Why?

03:10:04.000 He's like, I think math is just another way of saying a four-legged animal is an animal.

03:10:09.000 But you said that when you said it's a four-legged animal.

03:10:12.000 And you just repeated yourself by saying it's an animal.

03:10:14.000 If I say, there's my wife.

03:10:16.000 I married her.

03:10:18.000 When I said my wife, I told you I married her.

03:10:19.000 That's what math is doing.

03:10:21.000 Math is giving you the information again in a simpler form that you can understand.

03:10:25.000 And you think, oh, I've deduced this information.

03:10:27.000 No, actually, the information was there in the question.

03:10:29.000 Right.

03:10:31.000 Some philosophers disagree with this.

03:10:33.000 They said, no, math brings you, like Kant.

03:10:34.000 Kant said, no, math tells you something.

03:10:36.000 Okay, let's put that on the wayside.

03:10:38.000 Here's another critique.

03:10:39.000 One I personally could never get around.

03:10:42.000 He says, look, all the greatest thinkers in history, this is actually an Ibn Taymiyyah critique of logic.

03:10:48.000 He says, look, all the greatest thinkers in history all disagree.

03:10:50.000 Like Plato and Aristotle, you know, Plato tutored Aristotle.

03:10:53.000 Mm-hmm.

03:10:55.000 Two of the greatest thinkers in ancient history.

03:10:57.000 They don't agree with one another.

03:10:59.000 They both say, you're wrong, and the other guy says, I'm wrong.

03:11:03.000 Okay.

03:11:04.000 Fast forward.

03:11:05.000 Every generation, their greatest thinkers disagreed.

03:11:08.000 Leibniz didn't agree with Voltaire.

03:11:10.000 Today, Sam Harris and Jordan Peterson, okay, maybe they're not the top, top intellectuals on Earth today, but they're among the elite.

03:11:19.000 They don't agree on what is true.

03:11:21.000 When you ask them, what's truth?

03:11:23.000 You guys are talking about truth all day long.

03:11:24.000 Can you define it for us?

03:11:25.000 We don't agree.

03:11:27.000 So if logic is something that tells us about the world, if it is, let's say we grant that.

03:11:33.000 Descartes is saying, look, we can't use it.

03:11:35.000 Nobody is good enough to use it and get to a conclusion that everybody agrees upon.

03:11:41.000 So he's saying, look, even that doesn't help me.

03:11:44.000 So he came up to the Kagito. 0.72

03:11:46.000 He says, look, He doubted everything.

03:11:49.000 He even went to the point where he said, what if I'm dreaming?

03:11:53.000 What if there's an evil demon out there always tricking me?

03:11:56.000 He went really out there.

03:11:58.000 Well, that's one of the reasons why simulation theory is terrible.

03:12:01.000 People really do, like serious people, consider the potential that not only is it possible that we are in a simulation, but that there are many, many simulations inside of simulations.

03:12:14.000 Because we couldn't...

03:12:15.000 That's what the egocentric predicament we were talking about earlier is.

03:12:18.000 You cannot experience anything outside of your consciousness.

03:12:21.000 Right.

03:12:21.000 So you could be plugged into a machine right now.

03:12:23.000 And this is just a big old dream.

03:12:25.000 Could be.

03:12:26.000 And that's why Descartes wanted to know what would be true, even if I was in a simulator.

03:12:30.000 And that's, I think, therefore I am.

03:12:31.000 Therefore I am.

03:12:32.000 Because for me to have thoughts, I'd have to exist.

03:12:35.000 If you doubt the cogito, you've proved the cogito.

03:12:38.000 Because to object to it, you first have to have existence.

03:12:40.000 Right.

03:12:42.000 He refined it.

03:12:43.000 I think thinkers refined it later on and before him also.

03:12:46.000 Many thinkers came to this conclusion.

03:12:47.000 He just did it really famously.

03:12:48.000 Well, he did it in one sentence too.

03:12:51.000 He did it in one sentence.

03:12:52.000 He summed it up.

03:12:53.000 That's why if you, you know, I've heard of Occam's razor.

03:12:56.000 If you use Occam's razor to an extreme, if you go to an extreme degree, everything with a doubt, you chop it.

03:13:06.000 Everything that might be imaginary, inferred, logical, empirical, you chop it.

03:13:12.000 What happens?

03:13:13.000 You have a transcendent experience.

03:13:15.000 If you take off all your paradigms, this takes a very brave human being to do.

03:13:20.000 To remove everything that anybody's ever told you and have the experience of the one thing.

03:13:26.000 What you would know, what you would come to, mystics, that's why I believe that there's a place where you can get where religion is true and science is faith.

03:13:35.000 And I know it sounds crazy, but there is a point, and I believe in science, don't get me wrong, I can't praise science enough, but there is a transcendent experience a human has, and that transcendent experience is consciousness itself, not the content of consciousness.

03:13:49.000 This is where people make a mistake.

03:13:52.000 Consciousness itself, reality, your world is nested in consciousness.

03:13:56.000 People think consciousness is within my brain.

03:13:58.000 It's the opposite.

03:13:59.000 Your brain, your body, your self is in consciousness.

03:14:02.000 And when we get to this point, then all our paradoxes disappear.

03:14:05.000 There's no more paradoxes, logical paradoxes.

03:14:08.000 Maybe if we have time, we can talk about logical paradoxes.

03:14:10.000 They never end.

03:14:11.000 But when we understand that...

03:14:13.000 Our world is nested in consciousness.

03:14:15.000 There's nothing happening in the world around you that's outside of your consciousness.

03:14:19.000 It's only outside of your ego.

03:14:20.000 The thing you associate with Joe Rogan is also happening inside your consciousness.

03:14:28.000 Your brain is within consciousness.

03:14:29.000 No brain has ever been observed outside of consciousness.

03:14:33.000 See, in materialism, they have this philosophy called epiphenomenalism, that the consciousness is a byproduct of this physical brain.

03:14:44.000 We have this physical brain and your consciousness is like a byproduct.

03:14:50.000 It's like a smoke.

03:14:51.000 Now we ask them, how do you know about this physical brain?

03:14:54.000 Oh, we know it because of our consciousness.

03:14:58.000 So if your consciousness is fake, unreal, then so is your brain.

03:15:02.000 The reason why we all know about brains is because of consciousness.

03:15:05.000 Consciousness tells us about brains.

03:15:07.000 So brains are dependent on consciousness, not consciousness dependent on the brain.

03:15:12.000 So I know this is a bit of a tricky thing, but this is what idealism is all about.

03:15:16.000 There is no physical object outside of consciousness.

03:15:21.000 It's all mental construct. 0.92

03:15:23.000 We started this podcast talking about MMA and we ended on a mindfuck. 0.96

03:15:29.000 Yeah, seriously. 0.99

03:15:30.000 This is a serious mindfuck. 0.99

03:15:31.000 The egocentric predicament. 0.99

03:15:32.000 Not an easy one.

03:15:33.000 Well, it's...

03:15:36.000 It's a fascinating yet impractical exercise.

03:15:40.000 Because you will do it to the end of time.

03:15:42.000 You'll be sitting here debating and discussing and dissecting the very...

03:15:48.000 But, you know, that's also how you gain a greater and deeper understanding of all the things. 0.99

03:15:51.000 You have no idea what the fuck they are. 0.98

03:15:53.000 Exactly. 0.99

03:15:55.000 But it's still amazing to me, like, how much...

03:16:03.000 Is to be explored about what is real around us.

03:16:06.000 The reality of the world around us is greater than any mystery in existence.

03:16:12.000 That's why for me, I can't read fiction.

03:16:14.000 I only study science, history, philosophy.

03:16:16.000 That's the only thing.

03:16:17.000 Science, history, philosophy, religion.

03:16:18.000 Because it's weird enough.

03:16:20.000 No, because they're all trying to tell me They're all trying to explain the world around us.

03:16:26.000 And that's such a hard thing to do, to sum up.

03:16:28.000 What's reality?

03:16:29.000 Hey, all these philosophies and theories are trying to sum it up.

03:16:32.000 This is reality.

03:16:34.000 And to cross-examine them, for me, is far more entertaining than watching a movie or hearing a fictional story.

03:16:39.000 Yeah, no, I get it.

03:16:41.000 I mean, it's definitely fascinating and entertaining.

03:16:43.000 And I like fictional stories, too, though.

03:16:46.000 I like observing creativity because I'm fascinated by the human experience.

03:16:51.000 And I'm fascinated by what people are able to...

03:16:55.000 Create out of their own mind something like we were talking yesterday about Stephen King about how amazing it is that this guy just keeps Continuing to create these bizarre stories and that someone can do that your consciousness and by putting so much emphasis on creativity and your ability to just Write down things that never really happened and paint a picture inside someone's mind.

03:17:20.000 You know, let me ask you this if he is if determinism is true Who wrote those stories?

03:17:26.000 When you write a story on a computer, did the computer write the story?

03:17:33.000 No, you wrote the story.

03:17:35.000 But if determinism is true, Steven is just a computer.

03:17:38.000 And his buttons are being pushed by past events.

03:17:42.000 So that's why one student asked me, hey, you should read a book by Sam Harris on determinism.

03:17:46.000 I'm like, well, can you ask Sam who wrote the book?

03:17:48.000 You know, who wrote the book and determines them?

03:17:50.000 He's going to say, well, he did.

03:17:51.000 No, he can't write anything.

03:17:52.000 He's determined.

03:17:53.000 So these are old philosophical questions that need to be explored, but they are, like you say, mind-bending, you know?

03:17:59.000 Very mind-bending.

03:18:01.000 Feras, I'm glad we finally did this, man.

03:18:02.000 It seems like we could do about a hundred of these.

03:18:05.000 Sure.

03:18:05.000 Let's do it again, man.

03:18:06.000 Yes, sir.

03:18:06.000 How often are you in town?

03:18:07.000 Rarely, but next time I'm in Vegas for UFC or something, I might take a trip over here.

03:18:11.000 Let's do it.

03:18:12.000 Thank you, sir.

03:18:12.000 I really appreciate it, man.

03:18:13.000 It was great.

03:18:14.000 Thank you.

03:18:14.000 Awesome.

03:18:15.000 Feras Ahabi, ladies and gentlemen.

The Joe Rogan Experience - July 28, 2010

JRE MMA Show #32 with Firas Zahabi

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