The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #71 with Rico Verhoeven

00:00:02.000 And boom!

00:00:03.000 Right when you take a drink of water, that's when we go live, always.

00:00:05.000 That's when we go live.

00:00:06.000 What's up, my friend?

00:00:07.000 Good to see you.

00:00:08.000 Good to see you.

00:00:09.000 Thanks for having me, bro.

00:00:09.000 My pleasure.

00:00:10.000 I'm a big fan.

00:00:11.000 I've been a fan for a long time.

00:00:12.000 Thank you so much.

00:00:12.000 And I'm very excited about this Badr Hari rematch.

00:00:14.000 So we were just talking about it.

00:00:16.000 That's going to be in December.

00:00:17.000 Yes, sir.

00:00:17.000 Yeah.

00:00:18.000 It's going to be huge.

00:00:19.000 I think it's going to be the biggest fight in kickboxing history.

00:00:22.000 I think it's already.

00:00:23.000 I mean, you were just saying that the tickets go on presale today, I think?

00:00:27.000 yeah today or tomorrow so yeah um where is it going to be held is it in holland yeah it's going to be in holland yeah so it's um it's called the the gelder dome and how many seats is that I believe around 25,000-30,000.

00:00:43.000 Wow.

00:00:44.000 It's crazy how big kickboxing is in Holland as opposed to America.

00:00:48.000 Yeah, but Holland, Europe, it's a lot bigger than it is here.

00:00:52.000 So I do not, for the life of me, understand why it hasn't taken off in America.

00:00:57.000 I don't get it.

00:00:58.000 Well, I think...

00:01:01.000 The step of going to MMA than to kickboxing is so much closer.

00:01:07.000 For example, from high school, it's so much more logical.

00:01:10.000 When you do wrestling, you do a little bit of boxing, well, let's jump into MMA then because it's so close to each other.

00:01:16.000 And when you go to kickboxing, it's totally different.

00:01:20.000 It's totally different.

00:01:21.000 So many people in America, when they watch MMA, they want guys to stand up.

00:01:26.000 Yeah, I know.

00:01:27.000 That's why it doesn't make any sense.

00:01:28.000 But still, I think every country is very patriotic.

00:01:32.000 They want their own guys to be very good at something.

00:01:36.000 Sort of, but when Anderson Silva was at the top of the heap in MMA, everybody wanted to see him fight.

00:01:43.000 It didn't matter that he was from Brazil.

00:01:45.000 Yeah, that's true.

00:01:45.000 In America, they still wanted to see him fight.

00:01:48.000 They want to see high-level stuff.

00:01:49.000 Yeah.

00:01:50.000 Everyone here is such a fan of knockouts and striking, high-level striking.

00:01:55.000 I just don't understand it.

00:01:57.000 Muay Thai, too.

00:01:58.000 Muay Thai doesn't sell at all.

00:02:00.000 There's no big Muay Thai events.

00:02:03.000 They had a pro Muay Thai league event here, and it was Nikki Holtzkin fought on it, and Bokau, and a few other big-name guys fought on it.

00:02:17.000 But it was like, you know, nobody in the crowd.

00:02:19.000 No, but also Muay Thai is also with the clinching and they hold too long.

00:02:26.000 I think it's a little bit boring.

00:02:27.000 What we do with Glory now is more commercial.

00:02:33.000 You can hold just for three seconds and then break and then continue fighting.

00:02:40.000 In the end, that's what people want to see.

00:02:42.000 I get that, but I like clinch work too and I like elbows.

00:02:47.000 Elbows and knees in the clinch.

00:02:48.000 You don't like it?

00:02:49.000 I like the knees, but the elbows...

00:02:52.000 Too many cuts?

00:02:53.000 That nasty, yeah.

00:02:54.000 Very nasty.

00:02:55.000 Cuts are nasty.

00:02:56.000 Yeah.

00:02:57.000 What do you think about how the amateur Muay Thai guys have elbow pads?

00:03:02.000 Yeah, I think that's good.

00:03:03.000 And all that's preventing for people who don't understand what we're talking about.

00:03:07.000 It's weird that, like, you can see with bare-knuckle boxing, there's a lot of bare-knuckle boxing matches now, and you see these guys' faces are just getting destroyed.

00:03:16.000 I mean, they're just ripped apart.

00:03:17.000 It's crazy.

00:03:18.000 It's not healthy.

00:03:20.000 No, it's definitely not good for the longevity of your career.

00:03:23.000 No.

00:03:24.000 And so in amateur Muay Thai, they have these elbow pads that they wear.

00:03:27.000 And that would mean you still can knock guys out just as easily.

00:03:31.000 Yeah, for sure.

00:03:31.000 But you're not going to get the cuts.

00:03:32.000 Exactly.

00:03:33.000 So I think that's a good thing.

00:03:35.000 Yeah.

00:03:36.000 But I'm just not a big fan of the elbow work.

00:03:40.000 But I love to see it, but I don't like to get it.

00:03:44.000 I remember.

00:03:45.000 I remember.

00:03:46.000 I was, where was I was?

00:03:48.000 I think I was training with the Black Zillions like years ago.

00:03:51.000 I think it was even before I became champion.

00:03:54.000 And I was training there, doing a little bit of MMA, helping some guys out.

00:03:58.000 And I was training, and somebody just, he said on accident, he just, pop, threw an elbow right on the nose.

00:04:06.000 And he just opened it up just a little bit.

00:04:09.000 And I was like, What the hell are you doing?

00:04:12.000 Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

00:04:14.000 Yeah.

00:04:15.000 Just an accident?

00:04:16.000 Yeah, an accident.

00:04:17.000 So, I gave him a few extra low kicks after this.

00:04:21.000 In MMA, I mean, it's such a staple technique.

00:04:24.000 Yeah.

00:04:24.000 You know, it's probably hard to not do it.

00:04:26.000 Yeah.

00:04:27.000 You've had a couple MMA fights, right?

00:04:28.000 One.

00:04:28.000 One, just one?

00:04:29.000 Yeah.

00:04:29.000 And you mounted the guy.

00:04:31.000 That was what was crazy.

00:04:32.000 He took it to the ground.

00:04:33.000 I was like, let's give it a try when we're in there.

00:04:37.000 We've got to try everything.

00:04:38.000 But when I saw it, I was like, damn, if he makes his way to MMA, because the heavyweight division, particularly in the UFC, is extremely shallow.

00:04:46.000 Extremely shallow.

00:04:47.000 I mean, you have some great talent, but there's like four or five really good fighters.

00:04:51.000 You know, it's like, there's obviously Cormier, there's Stipe, Francis Ngannou, there's a few other guys, but it's, you know, with a couple of wins, you're in the mix for a heavyweight title shot.

00:05:03.000 Yeah.

00:05:04.000 You know, have you ever thought about doing that?

00:05:06.000 I thought about it.

00:05:07.000 Thought about it?

00:05:08.000 You're still young, right?

00:05:09.000 How old are you?

00:05:09.000 Yeah, 30. Yeah, see, which is crazy because you've had a lot of fights, right?

00:05:14.000 Yeah, I had about 60, 70 fights.

00:05:16.000 Yeah, that's crazy.

00:05:20.000 But the thing is, as a European, fighting in glory, that's what people don't understand.

00:05:27.000 It is enormous overseas.

00:05:30.000 It's crazy.

00:05:31.000 It's hard for people in America to be like, what?

00:05:33.000 Kickboxing?

00:05:33.000 But if you go to see those events, I mean, I watch all of them.

00:05:36.000 You watch the events on television, it's like fucking crazy packed crowds.

00:05:39.000 Yeah, it's always full.

00:05:40.000 The first fight you had with Botter, holy shit was that crowd hot.

00:05:44.000 That was a wild crowd.

00:05:45.000 They even jumped to the ropes and everything went crazy.

00:05:51.000 Well, it ended in a fucked up way.

00:05:54.000 Botter said his arm was hurt.

00:05:57.000 Did he get an MRI or anything like that?

00:06:00.000 I have no clue.

00:06:01.000 Not from the organization or something.

00:06:04.000 Yeah, he did some bandage or something over his arm because that's what he posted on Instagram.

00:06:10.000 But I don't know.

00:06:12.000 I don't know.

00:06:13.000 For me, it was...

00:06:14.000 Yeah, you know, it was like an anti-climax.

00:06:18.000 That wasn't the way I wanted to end that fight.

00:06:21.000 But I think for the rest, for him, this was the perfect way to end the fight because this is the way you could get a rematch.

00:06:30.000 Because if he would have lost...

00:06:33.000 No point in doing a rematch.

00:06:34.000 If you would get knocked out, no point in doing a rematch.

00:06:38.000 So...

00:06:38.000 Unless it was a really close fight and then you eventually won.

00:06:42.000 Yeah.

00:06:43.000 You know, but for my feeling, everybody's like, yeah, but Rico walked into the jabs the first round and everything.

00:06:51.000 That's true.

00:06:53.000 but i was pressuring him i was pressuring him the whole time and i was trying to feel like where is my distance where i can hit and where i can where i get hit so of course that's right you get tagged yeah you get tagged sometimes so my my nose was already uh during training my nose opened up so when he hit it it opened up again so i was like yeah it is what it is you know i'm not really bothered by it so i was pressuring pressure and i was like okay Now I got it.

00:07:23.000 So after that first round, then we jumped into the second round.

00:07:27.000 I was fit.

00:07:28.000 I was ready for this fight.

00:07:30.000 And that's what I like to do.

00:07:32.000 I like to drag people into the deep waters.

00:07:35.000 Well, you're very fit for a heavyweight.

00:07:37.000 You have crazy cardio.

00:07:39.000 That's one of the things that I've always admired about your fighting style.

00:07:42.000 You put insane pressure on guys.

00:07:44.000 For a heavyweight, because heavyweights, bigger guys tend to fight at a slower pace and with less volume.

00:07:50.000 But you push a pace, and when the fight gets to the third, fourth, and fifth rounds, you fucking pile it on, man.

00:07:57.000 Yeah, because I've been training with light guys for my whole career.

00:08:03.000 So when I started at the gym, I started it with the Super Pro Sports Center.

00:08:07.000 With Dennis Carrello, he had Albert Kraus.

00:08:10.000 He was the first K1 Max champion.

00:08:13.000 And he had Alvier Lima, like multiple middleweight champion, world champion.

00:08:19.000 So I was working with those guys, like every day.

00:08:23.000 And they just kept on pressuring me.

00:08:27.000 I was getting my ass whooped like almost every day by like guys that weigh like 75 kilos.

00:08:35.000 So, I was like, I can keep hitting those guys hard or just go with less power and pressure them like they try to pressure me.

00:08:47.000 And of course, in the beginning, it's like, still you get tired, but at a certain moment, you get like, hey, this is going better.

00:08:53.000 And just don't try to hit them hard, but just try to keep the work like a machine gun.

00:09:00.000 Is that something that happens in a fight as well, where you have to balance out how hard you swing versus, like, not going full blast, but going technical, knowing that you can start unloading in the third, fourth, and fifth rounds and you start to see them fade?

00:09:17.000 I'm playing a game.

00:09:18.000 For me, we always say, fighting is a thinking man's game.

00:09:22.000 Because fighting, everybody can fight.

00:09:25.000 When they have to, everybody can fight.

00:09:27.000 It doesn't matter what person, when you put them in a corner and it's life or death, everybody can fight.

00:09:34.000 But it's so much more than that.

00:09:38.000 It's so much more than just fighting.

00:09:40.000 And that's how I try to step into the ring with that mentality.

00:09:45.000 People don't understand that, who've never competed.

00:09:48.000 The managing of the resources is a big factor.

00:09:52.000 When do you decide to hit the gas?

00:09:55.000 In MMA you see it with a guy like Nick Diaz.

00:09:58.000 Nick Diaz is famous for not hitting guys hard.

00:10:01.000 He just stays on you.

00:10:02.000 He just stays on you with a lot of volume.

00:10:04.000 And then you get tired, and then he starts unloading.

00:10:07.000 Exactly.

00:10:08.000 You know, with big shots.

00:10:08.000 And that's what I like to do.

00:10:12.000 The biggest compliment I could get from an opponent, and I had it for my last six opponents.

00:10:18.000 I got it like three or four times.

00:10:20.000 They said, like, Rico, now I understand why you are the champion.

00:10:24.000 I fought everybody, but this I've never felt before.

00:10:29.000 And you're on a different level.

00:10:31.000 And that's the biggest compliment I could get because I'm in the ring for five rounds with this guy and they got every opportunity to do everything they've trained for.

00:10:44.000 With me for five rounds.

00:10:45.000 So I didn't knock them out.

00:10:47.000 We just fought for five rounds, but they just did not know what to do.

00:10:52.000 And that's, yeah, for me, the biggest compliment I could get.

00:10:54.000 Yeah, to be technical and to just play your game.

00:10:57.000 Exactly.

00:10:58.000 I really loved your rematch with Jamal Ben Sadiq.

00:11:02.000 That was one of my favorite fights of yours.

00:11:03.000 I believe that.

00:11:04.000 It was a great fight.

00:11:05.000 That was like the full Rocky version of a fight that people would love to see.

00:11:11.000 You get tagged in the beginning, and then you...

00:11:14.000 Overwhelmed him, and then when you put him away, I was like, holy shit, what a fight.

00:11:18.000 What a fight that was.

00:11:19.000 That guy's a big motherfucker, too.

00:11:21.000 Yeah, he's a big guy.

00:11:23.000 I lost against him back in the days when I was just a little kid.

00:11:31.000 And so this fight brought something with it as well.

00:11:34.000 He's like, yeah, he's the champion now, but I beat him.

00:11:37.000 But it was like six, seven years ago.

00:11:38.000 I'm a totally different fighter than I was back then.

00:11:41.000 So I said, let's go.

00:11:42.000 I'm ready for you.

00:11:44.000 So yeah, this was the best thing.

00:11:47.000 And he spit in my face during a press conference.

00:11:49.000 So I got some extra motivation for that fight.

00:11:54.000 Well, you played it out perfectly, too, where even when he hit you and hurt you early in the fight, you stayed calm, you didn't get emotional, you used good defense, and then once you got him into the deep water, you stopped him in the fourth?

00:12:08.000 In the fifth.

00:12:09.000 Fifth round.

00:12:09.000 Yeah.

00:12:09.000 Once you got him into deep water, then you piled it on and then put him away.

00:12:13.000 But then again, it's the same thing for me.

00:12:16.000 How did you do that?

00:12:18.000 You got tagged.

00:12:19.000 And I said, but then again, like I said, it's a thinking man's game.

00:12:24.000 So I got hit.

00:12:26.000 From my point of view, I made a mistake.

00:12:29.000 I switched the south pole, but instead of switching and stepping outside of his front leg, I was right in front of his leg, and he was just throwing a left-right, and I walked straight into that.

00:12:44.000 That's what happened.

00:12:45.000 It's not that, from my point of view, that he timed that.

00:12:50.000 So it happened, and from that moment, I can do two things.

00:12:54.000 I can think, okay, I can jump into the fight and try to get that point or whatever, that moment back, or just think in my mind like, okay, fuck it, you lost this round.

00:13:06.000 Take it and let's go fresh into the second.

00:13:10.000 That's what I did.

00:13:11.000 So just think about, okay, I lost this round, but I got four more to go, and I got back into the corner, and my trainer says, hey, you back?

00:13:19.000 I said, yep, okay, he's tired now.

00:13:23.000 Yeah, when he tried to unload on you, he emptied out a lot of the gas tank when he had you hurt.

00:13:28.000 Yeah.

00:13:29.000 Yeah.

00:13:30.000 So that's the game, right?

00:13:31.000 Trying to figure out when you can finish and when you can't.

00:13:34.000 Exactly.

00:13:34.000 Yeah.

00:13:35.000 Just stay focused, stay relaxed.

00:13:37.000 And, of course, he hit me with some good shots, but...

00:13:40.000 Well, he's a big, powerful guy.

00:13:41.000 Yeah.

00:13:42.000 He's always a dangerous fighter.

00:13:43.000 That guy's huge.

00:13:44.000 What is he, like 6'9", 6'10"?

00:13:46.000 Yeah, something like that.

00:13:46.000 Yeah.

00:13:47.000 Yeah.

00:13:48.000 And then, yeah, he's huge in, like, 200. 70 pounds, I think.

00:13:53.000 Yeah.

00:13:53.000 That's a big motherfucker.

00:13:55.000 That's a big motherfucker.

00:13:56.000 So, and then he's like, yeah, now it's 1-1.

00:13:59.000 I said, come on, man.

00:14:00.000 You beat me like six, seven years.

00:14:03.000 I beat you less.

00:14:04.000 Oh, he wants another fight?

00:14:05.000 Yeah, he wants another fight.

00:14:05.000 How many fights has he had since then?

00:14:07.000 I don't know.

00:14:08.000 He won a tournament last year.

00:14:10.000 So maybe that fight is going to come.

00:14:13.000 But like I said, last year, the 31st of December, my contract was finished with Glory.

00:14:22.000 So we've been in negotiations ever since.

00:14:25.000 So, from that moment on, I said, in my last contract, you guys told me the butter fight was going to happen, and it didn't happen.

00:14:33.000 So, that's what I want first.

00:14:35.000 Give me the butter fight, and from that moment on, we're going to discuss.

00:14:38.000 Yeah, for people who don't know the sport, Badr Hari is one of the biggest names in the sport, like, forever.

00:14:45.000 He's...

00:14:45.000 He's a guy who...

00:14:46.000 He's stopped Alistair Overeem.

00:14:50.000 He's fought in K1. He fought everybody.

00:14:52.000 Semi-Shield, Peter Artz, whatever.

00:14:54.000 He's a fucking wild man, too.

00:14:56.000 But he hasn't fought in high-level competition for a long time.

00:15:01.000 And then he fought you.

00:15:02.000 Yeah.

00:15:03.000 Yeah, so the thing was, everybody was...

00:15:07.000 I was beating everybody.

00:15:09.000 I was champion and I was beating everybody.

00:15:11.000 People said...

00:15:11.000 Yeah, Rico's good.

00:15:12.000 He's the champion, but he hasn't fought better.

00:15:17.000 So our national television said, hey, if he wants to fight, let's go.

00:15:22.000 But he had been dealing with a bunch of legal troubles.

00:15:23.000 Yeah, he had a lot of problems.

00:15:25.000 He broke someone's leg in a club.

00:15:27.000 Yeah, a lot of shit.

00:15:29.000 Crazy shit.

00:15:29.000 There's a video of him slapping some guy's face in a hotel.

00:15:33.000 Yeah.

00:15:34.000 Imagine that guy slapping your face.

00:15:36.000 You're some poor dude working behind the counter.

00:15:38.000 Bonner comes in like, yikes!

00:15:40.000 Yikes, yeah.

00:15:40.000 Do whatever you want.

00:15:41.000 Here, take the keys, sir.

00:15:44.000 Which room would you like?

00:15:45.000 The hotel is yours.

00:15:47.000 So yeah, he had a bunch of problems, but then eventually the fight happened because that's the fight that people wanted to see.

00:15:53.000 But for me, it was just like another fight.

00:15:57.000 And then the fight ended that way.

00:16:01.000 Yeah, that was too bad.

00:16:02.000 But now we can do it again.

00:16:04.000 Yeah.

00:16:05.000 So the fight was quite a while ago.

00:16:07.000 How long ago was that?

00:16:08.000 2016. Yeah.

00:16:10.000 Why did it take so long for the rematch?

00:16:13.000 Yeah, there was a bunch of stuff going on in between.

00:16:16.000 And, like, last year he fought Hesdy Gerges, also a good kickbox.

00:16:20.000 I believe he's now doing MMA in Bellator.

00:16:24.000 And...

00:16:24.000 He's fought Hesdy before, right?

00:16:26.000 Yeah, he fought Hesdy before, but got disqualified.

00:16:29.000 Oh, that's right.

00:16:29.000 He stomped him with him on the ground?

00:16:31.000 Yeah, stomped him, yeah.

00:16:32.000 But after that fight...

00:16:34.000 He's so crazy.

00:16:34.000 Yeah, he's crazy.

00:16:36.000 He's such a wild dude.

00:16:38.000 Yeah.

00:16:38.000 And then after that fight, they both got caught.

00:16:43.000 With using whatever.

00:16:44.000 Oh, steroids.

00:16:45.000 Yeah.

00:16:46.000 Oh.

00:16:46.000 So they both got suspended.

00:16:50.000 I believe Hestie wasn't suspended.

00:16:53.000 I don't know.

00:16:53.000 But he got suspended until December this year.

00:16:56.000 So that's why.

00:16:58.000 How did the fight go when you fought last year with Hestie?

00:17:02.000 He won.

00:17:03.000 It wasn't easy, but he won.

00:17:05.000 Was it a loss?

00:17:06.000 I mean, a decision?

00:17:08.000 It was a decision, yeah.

00:17:08.000 Yeah.

00:17:09.000 Yeah, so for him, that was the first fight since your fight with him in 2016?

00:17:14.000 Is that it?

00:17:16.000 Yeah.

00:17:17.000 Because he's had a bunch of leading problems.

00:17:21.000 And now he's not training at Mike's gym anymore as well, right?

00:17:24.000 No, no, no, no.

00:17:25.000 Do you know who he's training with?

00:17:27.000 Yeah, I don't know his name.

00:17:28.000 I know the guy, but...

00:17:31.000 Don't know who he's training with.

00:17:32.000 Well, he looks good on Instagram.

00:17:34.000 For sure.

00:17:34.000 Looks very fit.

00:17:36.000 Jacked.

00:17:37.000 A lot of people look good on Instagram.

00:17:38.000 You know that.

00:17:39.000 When you see him in real life, he looks totally different.

00:17:42.000 Well, I'm sure he looks the same.

00:17:44.000 Yeah.

00:17:44.000 But what's interesting is when you're in high-level competition like he was, of course, in the days when he fought Alistair, before Alistair made the transition full-time to MMA, Before he came to Strikeforce and all that stuff, that's a long time ago.

00:18:01.000 It's probably hard to get back and to jump straight into top-level competition like Headsy or especially like fighting you as a champion.

00:18:12.000 That's a big leap, right?

00:18:14.000 Yeah.

00:18:15.000 So, but that's the thing now, we both have, so he fought last year, March, and I fought last year, September.

00:18:23.000 So, because I was in negotiations, and still am in negotiations with Glory for a new contract, so it's both been a while for us, but I've been, before that, I was like in a crazy, crazy active flow.

00:18:38.000 Yeah, you definitely have much more momentum, and just, there's a thing about fighting, too, when guys take a long time off, it's almost like, They lose the feel for it.

00:18:49.000 Obviously they know how to kick, they know how to punch, they know what to do, they're in shape.

00:18:54.000 But there's a feel that they have for the ring.

00:18:57.000 Exactly.

00:19:00.000 Where people don't understand, like, hey, you step in the ring and that's what you do.

00:19:04.000 That's what you were born to do.

00:19:05.000 That's true, but you need that tension.

00:19:09.000 You need that vibe of walking towards the ring, stepping into the ring.

00:19:14.000 All those people looking at you at that moment, that's a certain type of feeling that you get.

00:19:20.000 You got to be comfortable with it.

00:19:22.000 Yeah, and that's exactly what it is.

00:19:24.000 You got to feel comfortable.

00:19:25.000 And the only way you can...

00:19:26.000 Be comfortable and stay comfortable is being active.

00:19:29.000 Yes, being active is so critical for a fighter.

00:19:32.000 When a guy takes a year off or two years off, the more the time is, the more it becomes problematic.

00:19:40.000 And the older you get.

00:19:42.000 How old is Baader now?

00:19:44.000 35 I think.

00:19:47.000 Does Glory drug test?

00:19:49.000 Yeah.

00:19:50.000 They do?

00:19:50.000 That's how they got caught.

00:19:52.000 Was it him or was it an athletic commission?

00:19:54.000 I mean, was it Glory or was it...

00:19:56.000 No, it's not Glory.

00:19:57.000 It's a local Dutch athletic commission.

00:20:00.000 And so they're going to drug test for this fight as well?

00:20:02.000 Yeah.

00:20:02.000 Yeah, for sure.

00:20:03.000 So I got tested like every time.

00:20:07.000 Is it like water testing, like the same standards?

00:20:10.000 A world anti-doping agency?

00:20:11.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:20:12.000 So they like wake you up like 7 o'clock in the morning.

00:20:15.000 Hey, Rico.

00:20:16.000 Oh, no.

00:20:16.000 No, no, no.

00:20:17.000 That's not the testing.

00:20:18.000 They just test at the events.

00:20:20.000 Oh.

00:20:20.000 I would even rather have that.

00:20:22.000 Yeah.

00:20:23.000 They just wake up and random come test, but that's not what they do.

00:20:26.000 But they test like really strict when you're there.

00:20:29.000 Yeah, that's a little bit easier to pass though.

00:20:33.000 That's true.

00:20:33.000 No, that's a lot easier to pass, I should say.

00:20:35.000 I have no clue.

00:20:36.000 I don't know what to do or what ways there are to.

00:20:40.000 I'm not on it.

00:20:41.000 I don't want to stay busy.

00:20:42.000 I don't want to think about it.

00:20:44.000 But whatever, you know, I just jump in there and just do what I got to do.

00:20:49.000 But that's why I told Glory now again after this whole issue because a lot of people were caught last year.

00:20:57.000 And they didn't expect that.

00:20:59.000 I was like, hey, we got to keep doing this because this is the way we make the sport clean.

00:21:06.000 Yes.

00:21:06.000 And I think that's what we deserve because we...

00:21:09.000 Yeah, we are a good sport.

00:21:11.000 We are all athletes.

00:21:13.000 But I want to be safe in the ring.

00:21:15.000 And what do you mean with safe?

00:21:16.000 You're going into a fight, I understand, but...

00:21:19.000 Somebody that uses whatever can maybe just punch a little bit harder in the beginning of the fight or whatever.

00:21:26.000 Have a little more endurance.

00:21:27.000 Exactly.

00:21:28.000 Hit you with some punches they wouldn't be able to hit you with.

00:21:30.000 They're not on some shit.

00:21:31.000 Exactly.

00:21:31.000 So that's what I mean with telling Glory I want to be safe when I'm in the ring.

00:21:36.000 Well, for sure.

00:21:37.000 I mean, if one person's on it and one person's not, that's, you know, it's a giant advantage.

00:21:44.000 Anybody who says it's not is just lying to themselves.

00:21:46.000 Yeah.

00:21:47.000 Yeah.

00:21:48.000 But in the end, I just go in there and I'm not even thinking about it.

00:21:53.000 Well, it is the fight to make in kickboxing, too.

00:21:56.000 And if there's a fight that I can tell people, hey, you really want to know what kickboxing is all about?

00:22:01.000 Watch this fight.

00:22:02.000 That is the fight.

00:22:03.000 Because Bodder is such a wild man.

00:22:05.000 He's such a knockout artist.

00:22:06.000 And you're obviously one of the most successful heavyweights ever.

00:22:09.000 I mean, your kickboxing record in glory, just the highlight reel is amazing.

00:22:14.000 You've had so many great fights over there.

00:22:16.000 Yeah, I've been doing so good.

00:22:17.000 I really enjoy myself.

00:22:18.000 And that's what I said.

00:22:19.000 I want to bring kickboxing to a new level.

00:22:23.000 Especially when you go now in Holland.

00:22:26.000 Normally, in Holland, it was like soccer or whatever, cycling or ice skating.

00:22:33.000 That's where parents would bring their kids to and do that, do kickboxing.

00:22:37.000 And now, they're like, hey, kickboxing, this is cool.

00:22:40.000 When did that change?

00:22:41.000 I think like...

00:22:43.000 Two, three years ago.

00:22:44.000 What made it change?

00:22:46.000 I think because of the barter fight.

00:22:50.000 So we were getting more air time and after the barter fight and everything that happened around him and it was surrounding him, like the things you said, what happened outside in the club and this and that.

00:23:03.000 He was like the national asshole.

00:23:06.000 Right.

00:23:07.000 And I was like, the national good guy.

00:23:10.000 And that was like the perfect clash.

00:23:12.000 And then, of course, I beat him.

00:23:15.000 So everybody was like, oh, shit, he's our hero.

00:23:19.000 Right.

00:23:19.000 So that's how everything a little bit exploded.

00:23:23.000 But again, for you, it's unsatisfying the way it happened, though.

00:23:26.000 He gets his arm injured.

00:23:28.000 Yeah.

00:23:28.000 In whatever way, reason, or whatever he thinks happened.

00:23:33.000 But...

00:23:34.000 Because you're suspicious about it.

00:23:35.000 I'm suspicious about it.

00:23:37.000 Because he's looking at one arm, then looking at the other arm, and it's a fake thing for me.

00:23:42.000 But that's what I have with this whole thing that he tries to create.

00:23:47.000 It's like...

00:23:49.000 When he's getting announced and everything, he's like, yeah, butter, hurry, 110-something fights and 90 knockouts.

00:23:58.000 But I'm obsessed with what I'm doing.

00:24:02.000 When I fight and when I have an opponent and I'm fighting, I'm looking for everything.

00:24:08.000 I want to know everything about you.

00:24:11.000 And everything these days you can find on the internet.

00:24:15.000 So when I'm looking on the internet, for example, you look at Wikipedia and you're looking at all the fights from back in the days, K1 days and even before that, you maybe get to 60, 70 fights.

00:24:28.000 So, where are the other fights?

00:24:30.000 Does that mean like when you were younger, in the youth period, you did like 40-something fights?

00:24:37.000 Did you knock everybody out?

00:24:39.000 I don't know.

00:24:40.000 My trainer's been there for years, even before that, and he doesn't know about it.

00:24:44.000 So, that's strange because everything is documented on the internet.

00:24:49.000 Everything you can find on the internet.

00:24:52.000 So, you think his record's inflated?

00:24:54.000 I think so.

00:24:55.000 He's got some crazy knockouts, though.

00:24:58.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:24:59.000 That's Stefan Leco, the wheel kick.

00:25:01.000 Yeah, the wheel kick's crazy.

00:25:02.000 But that's what I said.

00:25:04.000 He's got that.

00:25:06.000 He's got amazing records, but I think it's not as crazy as they make it to be.

00:25:13.000 Which is crazy because the reality is pretty crazy.

00:25:16.000 I mean, you don't need to hype it up any more than it really is, right?

00:25:20.000 No, but it's been there for years.

00:25:21.000 Like, hey, you did 100-something fights and so many knockouts.

00:25:24.000 But when I look at it, I can't find it.

00:25:28.000 I see what you're saying.

00:25:29.000 But maybe it's there.

00:25:31.000 Maybe it's there.

00:25:31.000 Maybe it's from years ago or whatever.

00:25:33.000 I don't know.

00:25:34.000 But that's all that I'm looking at.

00:25:35.000 You're suspicious.

00:25:36.000 I'm suspicious about it because when I look at Wikipedia and I'm looking at when he was around...

00:25:40.000 It starts from when he was around 16 till now.

00:25:43.000 It's like 60-70 fights.

00:25:45.000 It's funny when you look at him in the early days too.

00:25:46.000 He was so skinny.

00:25:47.000 Yeah.

00:25:48.000 Like even when he fought Stefan Leco.

00:25:50.000 Yeah.

00:25:50.000 And then now he's just fucking jacked.

00:25:53.000 Yeah.

00:25:53.000 But he put so much time into strength, strength and conditioning workouts.

00:25:57.000 You can see like he's always doing some crazy strength routine.

00:26:00.000 Yeah.

00:26:01.000 Yeah.

00:26:02.000 So do you do a lot of strength and conditioning?

00:26:05.000 Like what are your workouts like as opposed to like how much skill work do you do and how much strength and conditioning work?

00:26:10.000 I think it's pretty even balanced out.

00:26:13.000 I think I train strength like three times a week.

00:26:16.000 But even my strength routine is so balanced out with doing strength and in the same muscle group I also do conditioning.

00:26:27.000 So first I do low reps and then I do a lot of reps.

00:26:31.000 Because these muscles for me aren't supposed to be big.

00:26:36.000 They need to be strong, and they need to be making the same punch 50 times with the same strength.

00:26:43.000 So not 10 times really hard, no, 50 times on the same strength, the same level.

00:26:48.000 So that's how we approach that.

00:26:50.000 And then, yeah, we got skill training like two, three times a week, like pad work.

00:26:58.000 I got explosive training, so I try to always look also at different sports.

00:27:04.000 At soccer, at American football, at ice skating.

00:27:09.000 And they all have a certain type of explosiveness that they train in a certain way.

00:27:15.000 So I tried to pick everything from everywhere and work with that.

00:27:20.000 So we created a training that we just used for being explosive.

00:27:25.000 So it has nothing to do with endurance.

00:27:28.000 Because it's maybe like 45 minutes and it's just a few seconds.

00:27:32.000 You go.

00:27:34.000 Go back.

00:27:35.000 Go!

00:27:36.000 You come back.

00:27:37.000 Because logically, for a big guy, you're slow.

00:27:41.000 When something is big and heavy, it's slow.

00:27:44.000 That's what we try to do.

00:27:45.000 We try to be as fast as possible for a big guy.

00:27:49.000 So a lot of plyometric type stuff, explosive type stuff.

00:27:52.000 Speed letters and stuff like that.

00:27:54.000 Okay, yeah.

00:27:55.000 So when you do this kind of stuff, when you were saying that you lift low reps and then high reps, so you do heavy weights first to try to max out or get the muscles very tired and then really wear them out with reps?

00:28:09.000 Yeah, but we never go max, max.

00:28:13.000 So you don't go to failure with heavy, heavy weights?

00:28:18.000 What kind of stuff are you doing?

00:28:19.000 Are you doing like dumbbells, kettlebells?

00:28:21.000 A lot of dumbbells.

00:28:23.000 Yeah.

00:28:24.000 As much loose weight as possible.

00:28:26.000 Like a few with the barbell, but as much with the dumbbells because that's when you got to keep in balance and work on that core and stuff like that.

00:28:35.000 So what about sparring?

00:28:37.000 How often do you spar a week?

00:28:39.000 Normally like twice to three times a week.

00:28:42.000 And when you do it, are you doing hard sparring?

00:28:45.000 You're from Holland.

00:28:46.000 Those fucking Holland guys like to spar hard, man.

00:28:49.000 Do you do a lot of hard sparring?

00:28:50.000 Is it more technical?

00:28:51.000 How do you balance it out?

00:28:54.000 It depends.

00:28:55.000 It depends on who's in.

00:28:57.000 Because now, in preparation, we're going to fly guys in.

00:29:01.000 Yeah, it's going to be pretty tough sparring because that's what you get the guys for.

00:29:07.000 But in the end, I'm always thinking about, hey, we do hard sparring, but we don't want to injure each other.

00:29:14.000 There's no point for me in knocking guys out during sparring Because then I don't have any sparring partners anymore.

00:29:22.000 Right.

00:29:23.000 So I do hard sparring, kick him hard on the legs, kick him hard on the body.

00:29:28.000 And of course, people get knocked down.

00:29:32.000 Not knocked out, but knocked down.

00:29:33.000 But you don't go full blast to the head.

00:29:36.000 No.

00:29:36.000 That's a Holland thing, right?

00:29:38.000 I mean, there's a lot of Dutch guys.

00:29:39.000 A lot of guys do it, yeah.

00:29:40.000 Spar like that, yeah.

00:29:42.000 We go pretty tough.

00:29:44.000 We go pretty tough to the head, black eyes, bloody nose, but I'm always like 90%.

00:29:52.000 I'm always looking at like, hey, when I'm making a move and I can make a head kick, I always try to, when I see I'm going to make a full hit, Try to keep it back just a little bit.

00:30:05.000 So I think, yeah, but just being controlled, I think it's very important.

00:30:09.000 So I train with all the guys, all the heavyweight guys from Glory I trained with, and of course we do hard sparring, but we do not.

00:30:18.000 From my point of view, I don't want to injure them.

00:30:21.000 Right.

00:30:22.000 Yeah, I mean, it only makes sense.

00:30:24.000 I mean, that's one of the most valuable things, right, is to have high-level training partners.

00:30:28.000 Exactly.

00:30:28.000 And if guys think you're going to put them to sleep all the time, they're not really interested in sparring with you.

00:30:32.000 No, for example, I trained with Benny Adekbui.

00:30:34.000 He's like the number two and number three in glory.

00:30:37.000 And I fought him twice.

00:30:40.000 But we trained together.

00:30:41.000 He's now at my gym.

00:30:43.000 And I try to make him better.

00:30:45.000 I say, hey, try this, try that.

00:30:48.000 Because if he's better, you're better.

00:30:50.000 Exactly.

00:30:50.000 And people are like, no, no, no.

00:30:52.000 I don't want to train with competition because then they know what I'm going to do.

00:30:55.000 That's true, but you also know what they're doing.

00:30:58.000 So it just depends on how you approach things.

00:31:01.000 Every negative thing has a positive thing at it as well.

00:31:05.000 I'm always looking at the positive things and always trying to surround myself with people that are positive.

00:31:14.000 Yeah, that's the vibe that I'm going with, because that's what works.

00:31:18.000 Well, that's also the mark of a confident fighter.

00:31:21.000 You know that you're the best, so if you help him, he's just going to help you become even better than you are currently.

00:31:26.000 Yeah, but you've got to be...

00:31:28.000 You've got to be comfortable with that because you also see a lot of guys that are like, hey, no, I'm not going to do that.

00:31:34.000 I'm not going to do this.

00:31:35.000 I'm not going to help that guy.

00:31:36.000 I'm not going to tell him whatever because it's not going to be good for me.

00:31:39.000 But in the end, everybody that gets better can help me get better as well.

00:31:44.000 So I always position myself as a sponge to try to get this.

00:31:51.000 Much info in wherever I am.

00:31:54.000 So, for example, I'm now really going into acting.

00:31:57.000 I want to act.

00:32:00.000 Now, Kevin was on your show as well.

00:32:02.000 Kevin Hart?

00:32:02.000 Yeah, I saw you were training with him.

00:32:04.000 Yeah, so it was a lot of fun.

00:32:05.000 The first kick he ever threw, he threw with you.

00:32:07.000 Yeah, so it was crazy.

00:32:09.000 He's a great guy.

00:32:10.000 Yeah, he's such a good guy.

00:32:11.000 But so much...

00:32:15.000 positivity and he has such a great vibe and he's such a great mentor and i was just sitting there we were talking and like i said i was just positioning myself as a sponge i was just trying to get as much information in there as possible and yeah now i've been i'm here now in l.a for about a month I've been training with Mark Wahlberg and also the same thing.

00:32:38.000 And Anthony Hardonk is here.

00:32:39.000 And Anthony Hardonk is here.

00:32:40.000 So it's amazing because when you're in LA and you want to do Dutch kickboxing, that's the place where you've got to go.

00:32:47.000 Hardonk's awesome.

00:32:47.000 I love that guy.

00:32:48.000 Yeah, he's amazing.

00:32:50.000 So every time I'm in LA, I'm going to...

00:32:51.000 We should tell people where he goes.

00:32:53.000 Dynamics MMA, which is in Santa Monica.

00:32:57.000 He just said they're opening up another one that he's going to run in West LA. When he used to fight in the UFC, I used to love watching him fight because he was probably one of the best leg kickers ever in the heavyweight division.

00:33:09.000 He would just fuck guys' legs up.

00:33:12.000 So technical.

00:33:14.000 Yeah, so much fun.

00:33:15.000 Last Saturday, we started sparring a little bit.

00:33:18.000 Yeah, I'm looking for a little bit of sparring.

00:33:21.000 He said, I didn't do anything for 10 years, but I want to do it.

00:33:25.000 Just want to help you out.

00:33:26.000 I said, it's good, but I just want to move around.

00:33:29.000 I don't want to kick nobody's ass.

00:33:30.000 I just want to move around.

00:33:31.000 So that's what we did.

00:33:32.000 We had a lot of fun.

00:33:33.000 And then you still see he has that feeling, has that Dutch kickboxing touch.

00:33:38.000 So it's amazing.

00:33:39.000 Yeah, no, there's not a lot of, like, real high-level Dutch kickboxing that you can get in California, especially out here.

00:33:46.000 No, no, no.

00:33:46.000 He's definitely the guy to go to.

00:33:48.000 But just heavyweights is difficult.

00:33:50.000 Heavyweight sparring is hard.

00:33:52.000 Yeah.

00:33:52.000 Good level heavyweight sparring, so...

00:33:55.000 Yeah, we just keep going around, and that's why I love being here.

00:33:59.000 So actually, I'm here for a vacation, but when I'm here, I got to work as well.

00:34:04.000 So the fight is in December, you were saying, right?

00:34:07.000 Yeah, it's going to be in December.

00:34:08.000 When, December?

00:34:08.000 The 21st.

00:34:09.000 Ah, okay.

00:34:10.000 So right before Christmas.

00:34:11.000 Merry Christmas.

00:34:12.000 Yeah.

00:34:12.000 So that's what I said.

00:34:13.000 They said, yeah, maybe we'll do it in January.

00:34:16.000 Fuck, I wish it was in America.

00:34:18.000 I wish it was in America.

00:34:19.000 I would love to see that shit.

00:34:20.000 Why?

00:34:21.000 Well, I don't want to go to Holland.

00:34:22.000 Why not?

00:34:22.000 I'm busy.

00:34:23.000 I love Holland.

00:34:24.000 I'm too busy.

00:34:26.000 I don't want to go to Holland.

00:34:27.000 That's not that I don't love Holland.

00:34:29.000 I'm just busy.

00:34:30.000 You want to come to Holland.

00:34:31.000 That's a lot of fun.

00:34:32.000 I'm sure.

00:34:34.000 I'm sure.

00:34:35.000 But if it was in Chicago or some shit, I'd fly out.

00:34:38.000 Oh, that's a lot of flying.

00:34:40.000 Yeah, it's a lot of time.

00:34:41.000 11 hours, yeah.

00:34:42.000 11 hours on a plane, you can jet lag, stay for a couple days.

00:34:46.000 I don't have a week to spare.

00:34:48.000 No?

00:34:48.000 I wish.

00:34:50.000 You're a busy man.

00:34:51.000 So you're out here trying to act too?

00:34:53.000 That's what you're going to try to do?

00:34:54.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:34:54.000 So you get an agent and meeting with people and stuff like that?

00:34:57.000 Yeah, yeah, exactly.

00:34:58.000 So I'm with Paradigm.

00:35:01.000 It's my American management.

00:35:03.000 Now, you obviously speak fluent English, but are you taking lessons to get better at it so you can act and all that jazz?

00:35:10.000 So that's your next goal.

00:35:11.000 Exactly.

00:35:12.000 So I'm still an active athlete, but I'm still looking at like, hey, what can I do next?

00:35:20.000 Because I can't and I don't want to do this for like 10 more years.

00:35:25.000 When do you want to retire?

00:35:26.000 Do you have a thought in your head?

00:35:28.000 I don't know.

00:35:29.000 It depends on what...

00:35:30.000 Well, right now you're in your prime.

00:35:31.000 Yeah.

00:35:32.000 So it depends on what comes on my route.

00:35:36.000 So...

00:35:36.000 Yeah.

00:35:36.000 I'm still looking at...

00:35:37.000 So now I'm in negotiations with Glory.

00:35:39.000 How is Glory doing as an organization?

00:35:42.000 Are they doing well?

00:35:43.000 Yeah, they're doing...

00:35:43.000 Because I know they were struggling a little bit in America.

00:35:45.000 They were trying to...

00:35:46.000 Yeah.

00:35:47.000 But do they still have events here in America?

00:35:50.000 Yeah, but less.

00:35:51.000 Less than in the beginning.

00:35:52.000 Because Europe is so much more successful.

00:35:55.000 So there we fill up like arenas.

00:35:57.000 Here we can get like...

00:36:00.000 I went to the last man standing in LA when Joe Schilling was there.

00:36:05.000 Holy shit, was that crazy.

00:36:07.000 It was awesome.

00:36:08.000 But I always tell people, you want to see real high-level striking.

00:36:12.000 You see high-level striking in MMA, but with MMA, there's all the other variables.

00:36:16.000 There's takedowns and small gloves, the whole deal.

00:36:19.000 You really want to see high-level kickboxing.

00:36:22.000 Glory's where it's at.

00:36:23.000 Exactly.

00:36:24.000 So that's for me now where I'm at.

00:36:27.000 I'm still in negotiation with Glory for a new contract.

00:36:31.000 And if we, in what way or the other, we can't get out of it, so maybe I'm going to do something else.

00:36:38.000 Or, I don't know, I'm looking at the sport like a totally different way.

00:36:44.000 I think the sport can totally be elevated in all certain ways, in all different ways.

00:36:51.000 Because how crazy would it be to do mixed fights?

00:36:56.000 It's fun to go from one guy, go to the other sport.

00:37:00.000 But how cool would it be that the other guy would go to the other sport as well?

00:37:03.000 So someone from MMA coming to kickboxing?

00:37:06.000 And the other way around.

00:37:07.000 Yeah.

00:37:08.000 Well, the other way around...

00:37:09.000 See...

00:37:10.000 I mean, I could see, like, Francis Ngannou.

00:37:13.000 I think he would do really well in kickboxing.

00:37:16.000 Yeah, I think so, yeah.

00:37:16.000 Because he's such a fucking ridiculously powerful striker.

00:37:19.000 Yeah.

00:37:19.000 He would do really well.

00:37:20.000 But I don't think there's a lot of other...

00:37:22.000 Well, I mean...

00:37:23.000 Obviously Alistair, if Alistair really dedicated himself to it, but he's chasing the goal of being a UFC heavyweight champion.

00:37:31.000 The only other organization is ONE, and ONE has, they do kickboxing as well now.

00:37:40.000 They do kickboxing and Muay Thai, and they do Muay Thai with little gloves, which is kind of crazy.

00:37:44.000 That was pretty crazy.

00:37:45.000 Have you thought about doing that?

00:37:47.000 No?

00:37:47.000 Not really.

00:37:48.000 You like the big gloves?

00:37:50.000 That's crazy, yeah.

00:37:51.000 But I don't mind doing the small gloves, but kickboxing with small gloves is pretty insane.

00:37:57.000 How come?

00:37:57.000 Pretty intense.

00:37:58.000 Because there's no way to block anything anymore.

00:38:03.000 Right.

00:38:04.000 Stand up and fight.

00:38:05.000 You can just put the gloves out and just do bare knuckle fight because it's almost the same.

00:38:10.000 Right.

00:38:10.000 So in terms of like, for people who don't understand, when you have big gloves on, there's more, you can protect yourself more.

00:38:17.000 Exactly.

00:38:17.000 You can shell up better.

00:38:19.000 Yeah.

00:38:19.000 And defensively, you know Liam Harrison?

00:38:22.000 Yeah.

00:38:22.000 He fought in one with little gloves in Muay Thai and he was like, holy fuck.

00:38:26.000 He sent me a message like, fucking brutal, man.

00:38:29.000 He's like...

00:38:30.000 He's like, I can't believe how hard it is.

00:38:32.000 It's so much different.

00:38:33.000 Yeah, it's totally different.

00:38:34.000 You can't clinch, you can't do whatever.

00:38:36.000 So, yeah, that's pretty insane.

00:38:39.000 So, but like I said, you know, it's so much fun.

00:38:40.000 I don't know why one's doing that.

00:38:41.000 I mean, because I know they do have some matches where they wear big gloves, too.

00:38:44.000 Yeah, just to push the limit again.

00:38:47.000 Well, they have so many different kinds of matches over there.

00:38:50.000 They even have grappling matches, like straight grappling.

00:38:53.000 Yeah, I don't know.

00:38:54.000 Have you been to one at all?

00:38:55.000 No.

00:38:55.000 They're gigantic.

00:38:57.000 Yeah?

00:38:58.000 In Asia, fucking huge, man.

00:39:00.000 You've been there?

00:39:01.000 No, but a bunch of friends have gone over there to coach and even to fight.

00:39:05.000 And a couple people from the UFC, Misha Tate, she has some executive position over there right now.

00:39:11.000 Rich Franklin does as well, who used to be the middleweight champion.

00:39:14.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:39:14.000 So they have a bigger audience worldwide than the UFC does.

00:39:20.000 They're huge in Asia, just gigantic.

00:39:22.000 And they keep getting bigger and bigger, and they got really high-level fighters too, so it's really interesting.

00:39:27.000 But I know they're doing a lot of kickboxing as well.

00:39:29.000 Yeah, so who knows?

00:39:32.000 More the better, right?

00:39:33.000 More competition, the better.

00:39:34.000 Yeah, exactly, exactly, because that's what brings the whole sport up to a new level.

00:39:39.000 So that's perfect, and that's cool.

00:39:41.000 But like I said, I just like to do different stuff.

00:39:45.000 Yeah.

00:39:46.000 And now, like I said, I don't want to fight for another 10 years.

00:39:51.000 So let's see what's going to happen.

00:39:54.000 I'm going to make a movie either way.

00:39:56.000 So I'm going to start filming a movie in the beginning of next year.

00:39:59.000 So that's pretty cool.

00:40:01.000 What's the movie?

00:40:03.000 It's gonna be, it's like totally from blank we started it.

00:40:08.000 So it's been written now.

00:40:09.000 I got the first draft of the script and it's crazy.

00:40:13.000 Can you tell me what you do?

00:40:15.000 Yeah, so I'm like a black ops kind of guy.

00:40:19.000 But something happens during the operation and I stop.

00:40:23.000 Because I think what happens is crazy.

00:40:26.000 I told them not to do this and still this happens so I'm gonna stop.

00:40:32.000 But they bring you back.

00:40:34.000 I get back.

00:40:35.000 You gotta go back and kick some ass.

00:40:37.000 Shoot some people and kick them.

00:40:39.000 You get to kick people?

00:40:40.000 Of course.

00:40:41.000 Of course.

00:40:42.000 But that's the thing.

00:40:43.000 I don't want to be a fighter.

00:40:45.000 Because people already know me from fighting.

00:40:47.000 So I want to do something else.

00:40:48.000 I want to really show my acting skills.

00:40:51.000 So this is going to be so much fun.

00:40:53.000 And that's what I get my excitement from.

00:40:56.000 Because I love doing new stuff.

00:40:58.000 I'm doing kickboxing since I was six years old.

00:40:59.000 I've been doing this forever.

00:41:01.000 I want to do something else as well.

00:41:04.000 This is going to be a lot of fun.

00:41:05.000 It's a hard transition.

00:41:07.000 Not a lot of people have been successful at it.

00:41:09.000 Randy Couture is probably the most successful at it.

00:41:12.000 He's got a real career as an actor now.

00:41:14.000 He acts in a bunch of movies, man.

00:41:16.000 Obviously, he's in The Expendables, but he's always working.

00:41:20.000 In the end, when you look at the history, a lot of athletes did it.

00:41:24.000 Yeah, sure.

00:41:25.000 Not a lot.

00:41:26.000 We're, like, really good.

00:41:27.000 But in the end, we got, like, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Charlotte Van Damme.

00:41:32.000 Sure, sure.

00:41:33.000 It's possible.

00:41:34.000 And I like the challenge.

00:41:36.000 Is there ever a worry of being, like, one foot in, one foot out with your fighting career?

00:41:43.000 Like if acting starts to take off, but you're still fighting, is there a worry about not being 100% all in?

00:41:50.000 No.

00:41:50.000 No, because then the thing we said, and I also discussed this with my trainer, because he's really cautious with that.

00:41:56.000 He's like, hey, when we focus on making a movie, that's what we're going to focus on.

00:42:02.000 And if we're going to have a fight, we're going to fully focus on that.

00:42:06.000 So no side things or, oh, let's do this for a second and then we go back.

00:42:11.000 No, just going to focus on that.

00:42:13.000 Because that's what does fighters in.

00:42:16.000 Exactly.

00:42:16.000 I mean, you've seen it like that.

00:42:17.000 That happened with Ronda Rousey.

00:42:19.000 It's happened with other fighters where they just get too spread thin.

00:42:22.000 They get spread too thin and they have too many different projects going simultaneously.

00:42:25.000 Exactly.

00:42:27.000 People still say that about me now at this moment.

00:42:30.000 Like Rico's not focused.

00:42:31.000 He does everything.

00:42:32.000 I say, hey, but I train every day.

00:42:35.000 I'm focused in what I'm doing.

00:42:36.000 I'm focused in kickboxing, but I just like the acting part.

00:42:40.000 I just want to gain my knowledge and get better at it.

00:42:46.000 So you got to train it.

00:42:47.000 It's the same as kickboxing.

00:42:50.000 You just got to stay focused.

00:42:51.000 Do you ever do any jujitsu?

00:42:53.000 I did some.

00:42:54.000 I did some, yeah.

00:42:55.000 I like it.

00:42:56.000 I like it.

00:42:56.000 It's a lot of fun.

00:42:57.000 But now the last two years have been so busy with kickboxing and everything that happens on the side.

00:43:05.000 It's just no time.

00:43:06.000 So you don't have any real designs of eventually transferring to MMA? Yeah.

00:43:12.000 you know like i said for me um when i look at it because people ask me ask me this a lot like rico would you why don't you go to mma yeah yeah it could be it could be possible but like from if i look at it honestly it's not my basic uh ambition to go there because my ambition my next ambition because when i look at it it's like if you jump into something different You should have

00:43:43.000 the will and want to be the best.

00:43:46.000 Right.

00:43:47.000 And I don't necessarily have the will to be the best at MMA, but if you get a crazy Offer.

00:43:57.000 That's what I was going to say.

00:43:58.000 Someone comes along with the real shackles.

00:44:00.000 You can think about some stuff.

00:44:02.000 Starts laying some paper out.

00:44:03.000 Come on, Rico.

00:44:05.000 Okay, okay.

00:44:06.000 Keep it going.

00:44:07.000 Just a little bit more.

00:44:08.000 Okay, let's go.

00:44:10.000 I got this.

00:44:11.000 I'm motivated.

00:44:12.000 No, so that's exactly what you said.

00:44:16.000 But if you did decide to do that, how much time do you think you would legitimately need?

00:44:20.000 For like a real high-level opponent to work on.

00:44:24.000 A year.

00:44:25.000 Take down a year.

00:44:26.000 Yeah.

00:44:26.000 Take down defense.

00:44:28.000 I know what to do.

00:44:29.000 I've trained this for like two, three years.

00:44:31.000 So I know, but my body just needs to work on it, have a fight in between, maybe another fight, and then I'm going to be able to do a high-level fight.

00:44:43.000 Now, do you do any other kind of cardio?

00:44:44.000 Do you run?

00:44:45.000 Of course.

00:44:45.000 Yeah?

00:44:46.000 Do you?

00:44:47.000 I hate it.

00:44:47.000 You hate it?

00:44:48.000 You have to do it.

00:44:50.000 But it's also for a big guy.

00:44:52.000 It's more of a pain in the ass, too.

00:44:53.000 What do you weigh, about 250, somewhere around there?

00:44:57.000 260. 260. So when you're running, that's a lot of weight.

00:45:00.000 That's a lot of weight on your joints.

00:45:02.000 Yeah.

00:45:02.000 Because of the pressure.

00:45:04.000 But in the end...

00:45:07.000 How much I hate it, it works for me because it's also for me a mental training because I hate it so much and I jump on the treadmill or I go outside and I just run and go, come on, come on.

00:45:23.000 You got to keep going, you got to keep going because when you have that feeling, like 90% of the people would stop.

00:45:32.000 But you're not that person.

00:45:35.000 You gotta keep going.

00:45:36.000 And that's what motivates me, just to do things different than everybody else does.

00:45:42.000 Being comfortable being uncomfortable.

00:45:43.000 Yes, exactly.

00:45:44.000 The grind.

00:45:45.000 The grind is...

00:45:47.000 I think that's the moment when it when it starts when you get that feeling shit is gonna hurt your body starts hurting and That's when like a lot of people give up and that's where we as champions we continue It's interesting too because a lot of fighters they'll do all sorts of high intensity training and interval training and all these different plyometrics and cardio and different things but Many of them will tell you that one of the more important things is just long-range running.

00:46:16.000 Because when you do this long-distance running where you're on 5, 6, 7 miles, when you do that, you develop this cardio base where you can just keep working and you recover faster.

00:46:29.000 I mean, that's one of the things that if you go back and look at old-time fighters...

00:46:32.000 You know, back to Muhammad Ali, Sugar Ray Robinson, all those guys.

00:46:35.000 Everybody ran.

00:46:36.000 Rocky Marciano, everybody ran.

00:46:38.000 There wasn't an option.

00:46:40.000 It wasn't like, you don't have to run, we could do a bunch of other things.

00:46:43.000 Like, no, no, no.

00:46:44.000 Fighters run.

00:46:44.000 Yeah, that's what we do.

00:46:46.000 Yeah.

00:46:46.000 But it's just...

00:46:47.000 I always feel like running is not the...

00:46:51.000 It's not the base of your...

00:46:54.000 It's not most important, but it's like a really important factor of the total package.

00:46:59.000 Right.

00:47:00.000 So it's just your...

00:47:02.000 The oxygen you have for keeping the same pace for a longer time, then of course the explosiveness that we use during a fight is important, but also just your basic lung capacity should be big as well.

00:47:20.000 What about heavy bag work?

00:47:22.000 Yeah, we do it, but...

00:47:24.000 Not that much?

00:47:25.000 Yeah, I think like once a week.

00:47:27.000 So more pad work, more technical things?

00:47:30.000 Yeah.

00:47:31.000 It's really interesting how different camps, different fighters, different trainers prefer different preparation methods.

00:47:38.000 And some swear by intervals on the heavy bag.

00:47:42.000 Some swear by doing rounds on the heavy bag.

00:47:44.000 You know, and some don't think it's that critical.

00:47:47.000 Yeah, I think for everybody it's different but like for me throughout all those years I've been trying different stuff and I think now I created the right combination of different trainings just polishing everything and I think I found the right way to get fit because I don't need to get I need to get better.

00:48:08.000 I'm always looking to get better, but you get better by putting in the work.

00:48:13.000 But I'm always looking at how can I change my training up?

00:48:18.000 What would be an add-on in what I already have?

00:48:23.000 Right.

00:48:23.000 So now I think I created the right combination and still I'm looking to add stuff on but I think I created the right way to get fit for a fight because I've shown that throughout all those years.

00:48:38.000 I've shown that I'm fitter than all the rest and that's a part but I still I think the biggest difference is that everybody is strong and everybody is fit and everybody can fight.

00:48:55.000 But the biggest difference is mentally.

00:48:58.000 What happens to you mentally when you get to the fourth and fifth round?

00:49:03.000 I think that's the most important thing.

00:49:05.000 How strong are you mentally to continue fighting?

00:49:13.000 For the people that do not understand what this fighting game is or what happens to you when you're in the ring or in an octagon.

00:49:24.000 I always compare it with driving a car.

00:49:27.000 You're driving a car and the last 40-50 miles the gas light comes on.

00:49:37.000 Hey, you gotta get gas.

00:49:39.000 That's the same thing that happens to your body.

00:49:42.000 When you get tired, whatever happens in your mind or your head, hey, you're tired.

00:49:49.000 When you're tired, you need to rest.

00:49:52.000 And we as athletes, we do not listen to that light that goes off in your car.

00:50:00.000 And even in my car, I don't listen.

00:50:02.000 I always go.

00:50:03.000 I had a few times I was on the side of the road without gas, so I'm sorry, but...

00:50:09.000 Is that psychological?

00:50:10.000 Do you do that?

00:50:11.000 Because you think of your car like a body?

00:50:15.000 Like you try to fuck your car.

00:50:17.000 Don't be a pussy.

00:50:19.000 Thanks, Joe.

00:50:20.000 Thank you.

00:50:20.000 Appreciate that.

00:50:21.000 But that's, yeah, I think that is what it is.

00:50:24.000 You know?

00:50:25.000 It's like the same game you're playing.

00:50:26.000 You're playing that game with your car.

00:50:30.000 It's so stupid.

00:50:31.000 But for me, it works.

00:50:33.000 Because I... I always push my car to the limit.

00:50:36.000 That's funny.

00:50:36.000 That's what I do to myself as well, you know?

00:50:39.000 And that's what I luckily have a great team of people around me for because even when everything is hurting and tired and I almost get overtrained, my people have to pull me back and say, Rico, there's no point in training now because you're going to get overtrained and you're going to fuck yourself up.

00:50:59.000 Right.

00:51:00.000 That's the fine balance, right?

00:51:01.000 It's hard to figure out.

00:51:03.000 I don't have the balance.

00:51:04.000 Right.

00:51:04.000 I don't have it.

00:51:05.000 I try to have it.

00:51:06.000 And every time in preparation, I think I got it.

00:51:10.000 Now I got it.

00:51:11.000 I don't got it.

00:51:13.000 So you need other people around you that are objective, that can tell you.

00:51:16.000 Like, hey, Rico, you got to step back.

00:51:18.000 Because for me, in my mind, I don't know what it is.

00:51:22.000 But when I'm not working, I'm standing still or going down.

00:51:29.000 That's what happens in my mind.

00:51:31.000 So I gotta keep working.

00:51:33.000 I gotta keep grinding.

00:51:34.000 Right, but that's also because of your style, because of the fact that you do push such a tremendous pace that you constantly feel like you have to have your foot on the gas.

00:51:43.000 Yeah.

00:51:43.000 Right?

00:51:44.000 That's interesting.

00:51:44.000 So you've been with the same coach for a long time?

00:51:46.000 Yeah.

00:51:49.000 Since I was like 17. Oh, so that's great.

00:51:52.000 So they know you.

00:51:53.000 Yeah.

00:51:55.000 When I come in, they know what's going on.

00:51:57.000 So critical, right?

00:51:58.000 And then the whole team.

00:51:59.000 So my power coach.

00:52:00.000 Oh, okay.

00:52:01.000 So the same team the entire time.

00:52:03.000 Can you imagine like in the beginning of when we were working for three, four years and then I come in Monday morning, power training.

00:52:15.000 And my trainer walks up to me and looks at me.

00:52:18.000 What the hell?

00:52:19.000 What the hell did you do this weekend?

00:52:21.000 What do you mean?

00:52:23.000 What have you been eating?

00:52:26.000 Yeah, Saturday night I went to the McDonald's.

00:52:29.000 What's the problem?

00:52:31.000 Look at your blown head, man.

00:52:33.000 You know, fat holds the water in your fluid.

00:52:38.000 He could tell from one McDonald's meal?

00:52:41.000 Really?

00:52:42.000 That's how close we were.

00:52:44.000 He sees me multiple times a week.

00:52:47.000 So he saw me like Friday.

00:52:50.000 So he just knows you.

00:52:51.000 He just knows how it works.

00:52:53.000 He knows everything.

00:52:53.000 Did you monitor your heart rate or anything like that?

00:52:56.000 Yes, every morning I check my blood pressure, stuff like that, get my temperature.

00:53:04.000 Do you do it with a computer?

00:53:05.000 Do you have a program to run?

00:53:06.000 No, no, no.

00:53:07.000 Just write it down?

00:53:08.000 Yeah, just write it down and then send it to the doctor.

00:53:12.000 So if your heart rate is a little bit too high in the morning, do you just do it like an active recovery day, just relax?

00:53:19.000 Yeah, we now check it more through the temperature than through the heart rate.

00:53:25.000 Really?

00:53:25.000 Yeah.

00:53:26.000 Temperature?

00:53:27.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:53:27.000 Interesting.

00:53:28.000 So, when my temperature is up, I gotta watch out.

00:53:32.000 So you might be fighting off a cold or something like that?

00:53:36.000 Something like that.

00:53:36.000 Fighting off a cold.

00:53:37.000 Or you still...

00:53:39.000 Your body is still recovering from...

00:53:41.000 From the last workout.

00:53:42.000 From last trainings.

00:53:43.000 So from that we can...

00:53:46.000 So I've been doing it now for a few years.

00:53:49.000 And that's exactly when I feel like, hey...

00:53:52.000 When my temperature goes up and it goes there...

00:53:55.000 This doesn't feel good.

00:53:57.000 And then every time when we...

00:53:58.000 In the end...

00:53:59.000 We always look back at it and analyze stuff.

00:54:01.000 And then my trainer says, hey, exactly there.

00:54:04.000 Because this training was shit.

00:54:06.000 So you take...

00:54:08.000 Do you use this...

00:54:09.000 Do you make a log during your training and compare it to your last camp?

00:54:15.000 And you look at the numbers and make sure that everything lines up?

00:54:17.000 Yeah.

00:54:18.000 So you kind of have to be, right?

00:54:19.000 At this point in time, if you want to really get everything dialed in, you kind of have to be scientific about everything, right?

00:54:24.000 Yeah, because...

00:54:25.000 There's so much more than just fighting and good training.

00:54:29.000 It's like good nutrition and this and that.

00:54:33.000 Everything has to be balanced out.

00:54:35.000 I was going to ask you about that.

00:54:36.000 Do you have a dietician or someone who cooks for you?

00:54:39.000 Yeah, in camp.

00:54:43.000 I think two years ago I started with that.

00:54:47.000 Do you eat horse meat?

00:54:49.000 Yeah, not necessarily.

00:54:50.000 Isn't that a big thing over there?

00:54:52.000 Alistair is a big horse meat guy.

00:54:55.000 I think that was a good excuse for the things that he did next to fighting.

00:55:01.000 That's what everybody said, too.

00:55:03.000 Everybody was like, yeah, horse meat.

00:55:04.000 Yeah, horse meat, yeah.

00:55:05.000 Hey, it works!

00:55:06.000 Yeah, look at the size of him.

00:55:08.000 Gotta get him some horse meat.

00:55:11.000 Yeah.

00:55:11.000 So, no, so that's, no, I have no clue.

00:55:16.000 It's not like in my diet or something.

00:55:18.000 What do you eat?

00:55:20.000 A lot.

00:55:21.000 A lot?

00:55:22.000 Yeah.

00:55:22.000 Multiple meals a day?

00:55:23.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.

00:55:25.000 So, but that's the fun.

00:55:26.000 People are like, oh, How much do you eat?

00:55:30.000 It's crazy.

00:55:31.000 But I burn a lot as well, so I have to.

00:55:36.000 For me, the fun thing with that is the fun and the strange thing when I tell people, when I get closer to the fight, I'm eating myself slim.

00:55:47.000 So the more I'm eating, the slimmer I'm getting because I'm training very hard and your body's just in a burning process.

00:55:55.000 And when the food is gone, it's going to start burning fat.

00:55:58.000 So I get slimmer the closer I get to the fight.

00:56:01.000 But when you see what I eat, it's like, how do you do that?

00:56:04.000 But it's just all...

00:56:05.000 Because you're just training so much.

00:56:07.000 Yeah.

00:56:07.000 So what kind of foods do they prepare for you?

00:56:10.000 Do they have those pre-prepared packets and you just heat them up or something like that?

00:56:16.000 How does that work?

00:56:17.000 Yeah.

00:56:18.000 Like a meal prep company does?

00:56:19.000 No, it's just like a private cook.

00:56:21.000 Okay.

00:56:22.000 A private chef that runs with me.

00:56:25.000 And just make sure every day I get...

00:56:27.000 And they check the macros and make sure that you get the right amount of protein, the right amount of carbohydrates.

00:56:32.000 Yeah, so it's not really like everything is put on a scale or something like that.

00:56:38.000 We don't do that because, yeah, in certain things I just want a little bit more or I'm still a little bit hungry.

00:56:46.000 It's not like you need to lose weight or anything.

00:56:48.000 No, but still I have in my mind always a certain type of fight weight that I like to fight on.

00:56:54.000 What is that weight?

00:56:55.000 Like 118 and a half.

00:56:59.000 118 and a half kilos.

00:57:00.000 What is that?

00:57:01.000 I think it's around 258, I think.

00:57:10.000 Well, it's 2.2 pounds, 2.2 kilos or 2.2 pounds per kilo.

00:57:14.000 118 is 260 pounds.

00:57:16.000 260. So that's right around there, huh?

00:57:18.000 Yeah.

00:57:19.000 So, okay.

00:57:19.000 Then I'm lying.

00:57:20.000 Then I'm now a little bit heavier.

00:57:24.000 Guys, come on.

00:57:25.000 I'm in LA. Yeah.

00:57:27.000 I get it.

00:57:28.000 I went in and out a few times.

00:57:30.000 How could you not?

00:57:31.000 So it's got to be around 265. Do you try to stay pretty healthy in terms of your diet, though, even when you're not in camp?

00:57:39.000 Yeah.

00:57:40.000 Yeah.

00:57:40.000 So for me, people are like, Rico, how do you do it?

00:57:43.000 I say, for me...

00:57:44.000 Fighting is a lifestyle.

00:57:45.000 It's not like when I wake up, this morning, I go to the gym, think about the fight, focus, focus, focus, go out to the gym, and my focus is all over.

00:57:58.000 I wake up with it, I go to bed with it, and when I'm in bed, I'm dreaming about it.

00:58:03.000 This is 24-7.

00:58:05.000 Every day, I'm thinking about it.

00:58:07.000 Every meal, every thing you do is just thinking about what's coming.

00:58:13.000 That's why you're the champ.

00:58:14.000 Yeah, I think so.

00:58:16.000 But for me, it's like such a crazy thing that goes on in my mind because I train twice a day, and then at night when I'm at home, I think like, you know what?

00:58:27.000 I'm in front of the television with my wife on the couch, and I'm like, I'm going to do some stretching.

00:58:31.000 I'm just going to sit on the ground and just stretch or do some more ab work.

00:58:36.000 I don't know.

00:58:37.000 I feel like I'm obsessed.

00:58:40.000 You have to be obsessed.

00:58:41.000 I mean, you're in one of the most dangerous combat sports in the world and you're the world champion.

00:58:47.000 So it's constantly that pressure and I'm just thinking, hey, my opponent probably now is resting or whatever he's doing.

00:58:53.000 I don't care, but I need to do something extra.

00:58:56.000 Right.

00:58:56.000 So constantly that's running through my mind.

00:58:59.000 Everything that I'm doing, he's not doing.

00:59:01.000 Now, do you take vitamins and supplements?

00:59:03.000 Yeah.

00:59:03.000 What kind of stuff do you take?

00:59:07.000 It's really like all natural stuff and I go to the doctor so he takes my blood and then from there on he always looks at how does it look.

00:59:19.000 Is it looking good?

00:59:20.000 Maybe you need some more iron or whatever.

00:59:22.000 So he fills it up whenever it's needed.

00:59:28.000 And during the period I'm training, I just take the normal stuff.

00:59:34.000 Magnesium, iron, whatever.

00:59:36.000 Vitamin C, stuff like that.

00:59:37.000 Just to keep everything on the right level.

00:59:39.000 And then once a month I go to him.

00:59:42.000 Or the closer we get to the fight, maybe go twice a month, and then you just check it, like, okay, it's good.

00:59:48.000 Or now, oh, you got a lot of white blood cells, so you're getting close to being, your muscles are tired, you know, maybe getting overtrained, so look at that.

00:59:57.000 Maybe get some more protein, you know, stuff like that.

01:00:02.000 So that's how we try to do that.

01:00:03.000 What else do you do for recovery?

01:00:04.000 Do you do any cryotherapy or things along those lines?

01:00:07.000 Yeah, so I've been starting that, like, one and a half year ago or something and it works i like it do you do it um do you do ice baths or like how do you what do you do no i just do literally the cryo the the machines oh something like frozen yeah yeah yeah so i did like uh two different uh in holland now it's like really starting to to to to be a hype so now they get like uh different uh places Do you go on the one that is from the neck down

01:00:37.000 or the one that gets your whole body in there?

01:00:39.000 Yeah, so first I started with the one with the neck down.

01:00:44.000 The whole body is the better one though, right?

01:00:45.000 Yeah.

01:00:45.000 There's a place out here, cryotherapy.

01:00:47.000 It's the fucking shit.

01:00:48.000 I love it.

01:00:49.000 Yeah, it's nice.

01:00:50.000 It's 240 degrees below zero and you just get in there for three minutes, you motherfucker.

01:00:54.000 Motherfucker.

01:00:55.000 But it's also free.

01:00:56.000 I'll get in there like a mental training.

01:00:58.000 I'm like, come on.

01:00:59.000 You gotta go.

01:01:00.000 So that's what I started with.

01:01:02.000 But I think the only one we have now is in Amsterdam, like the full body.

01:01:09.000 And Amsterdam is like two hours.

01:01:11.000 Oh, yeah.

01:01:12.000 Well, from the neck down is good enough.

01:01:13.000 Yeah.

01:01:14.000 So now I get one.

01:01:16.000 I get one in my own gym.

01:01:18.000 So just I can jump in, in and out, easy.

01:01:22.000 So just start with that.

01:01:24.000 And then from there, I'm going to see how it works.

01:01:27.000 What about sauna?

01:01:29.000 Yeah, I use it, but not too often.

01:01:32.000 So good, man.

01:01:33.000 I know.

01:01:34.000 So good for recovery.

01:01:36.000 You don't like it?

01:01:37.000 I like it for the first two minutes.

01:01:41.000 And then afterwards, again, it's like a training.

01:01:46.000 Mental training.

01:01:46.000 I know.

01:01:47.000 But my wife's enjoying it.

01:01:51.000 I love it.

01:01:52.000 It's so nice.

01:01:57.000 Because you're playing a game with yourself.

01:02:00.000 You can't just enjoy it.

01:02:01.000 Your opponent will probably get out now.

01:02:04.000 You're not going to stay in.

01:02:05.000 Come on.

01:02:06.000 It's like really a sweat just dripping off.

01:02:10.000 It's like really a fight.

01:02:11.000 I was fucking myself up because I was trying to crank it up.

01:02:14.000 I had Laird Hamilton on the podcast.

01:02:16.000 He's a surfer, big time surfer.

01:02:18.000 And his wife, Gabriella Reese, was telling me that he cranks his up to 220 degrees.

01:02:24.000 So I did that for a little bit.

01:02:26.000 I got up to like 210, 218. But I think it was burning my lungs.

01:02:31.000 Yeah.

01:02:32.000 I think I was cooking in there.

01:02:33.000 I really do.

01:02:34.000 I would feel like shit.

01:02:36.000 And then I would get out and I'd be so fucking tired.

01:02:39.000 I was like, I don't think this is good for you.

01:02:41.000 So then I dropped it down.

01:02:42.000 Now I do normal.

01:02:43.000 Now I do it like 180, which is normal.

01:02:46.000 180 degrees Fahrenheit.

01:02:47.000 I don't know what that is, Celsius.

01:02:49.000 Yeah, I think like...

01:02:51.000 Like 80, 85. Yeah, but that's normal.

01:02:54.000 That's like a normal hot sauna.

01:02:56.000 Good enough.

01:02:56.000 20 minutes, I'm in and out.

01:02:58.000 It's pretty hot.

01:02:59.000 It's pretty hot for me.

01:03:00.000 It's hot, man.

01:03:01.000 It's hot.

01:03:01.000 But it's very good for you, those heat shock proteins.

01:03:05.000 And they did these studies that showed a 40% decrease in mortality for all causes.

01:03:10.000 Heart attack, stroke, cancer.

01:03:12.000 40% decrease for people who use the sauna for four times a week or more.

01:03:16.000 That was in, what was that, Sweden, Jamie?

01:03:18.000 Do you remember?

01:03:19.000 Dr. Rhonda Patrick.

01:03:20.000 Oh, really?

01:03:21.000 Nice.

01:03:21.000 That's interesting.

01:03:22.000 She was talking about it.

01:03:23.000 I didn't know that.

01:03:23.000 Yeah, it's phenomenal for you because of heat shock proteins.

01:03:27.000 It makes your body, reduces inflammation throughout your whole body, as does cryotherapy.

01:03:32.000 Anything where you're dealing with extreme cold or extreme heat, your body develops either heat shock proteins or cold shock proteins.

01:03:39.000 Yeah.

01:03:39.000 So, I also have...

01:03:42.000 So there was this place where I went for the cryo and he said, oh, we also got something else.

01:03:48.000 I don't know what it's called.

01:03:50.000 I can't remember.

01:03:51.000 So you just get like put in a cocoon or something and just go to sleep.

01:03:59.000 But you're in water, so you're like floating.

01:04:02.000 So the water is like...

01:04:04.000 You're floating.

01:04:05.000 Yeah, the water is floating.

01:04:06.000 It's called floating.

01:04:07.000 That's what it's called.

01:04:07.000 I was like, what the hell?

01:04:09.000 I'm floating?

01:04:09.000 That's what the fuck it's called.

01:04:10.000 You mean like a float tank?

01:04:13.000 Yeah, but it looks like a cocoon.

01:04:16.000 Okay, I know what you're talking about.

01:04:17.000 And then they just close it and they put you in there for...

01:04:20.000 Sensory deprivation tank, yeah.

01:04:22.000 For an hour.

01:04:22.000 I have one right here.

01:04:23.000 Oh, really?

01:04:24.000 Yeah.

01:04:25.000 It's awesome.

01:04:25.000 I'm going to sleep for an hour.

01:04:28.000 It's a big one, too.

01:04:29.000 You can fit in it.

01:04:30.000 It's huge.

01:04:31.000 The one I have here is huge.

01:04:33.000 Why?

01:04:33.000 You're so small.

01:04:34.000 Yeah, but that's the best one they have.

01:04:37.000 I just wanted one that anyone can come in.

01:04:39.000 So it's like seven feet long and nine feet high.

01:04:42.000 Yeah, it's amazing.

01:04:43.000 And they said when you finally get to the point where you know how to work with it mentally and relax, it's the same as one hour, like four or five hours of sleep or something.

01:04:55.000 Of sleep, yes.

01:04:55.000 Yeah, you relax.

01:04:57.000 And it's also your body absorbs magnesium.

01:04:59.000 Yeah.

01:04:59.000 Because it's Epsom salts, so all the salt that's in the water is a thousand pounds of salt in the water.

01:05:04.000 All that Epsom salts, the magnesium, gets through your skin into your bloodstream, so it's really good.

01:05:09.000 It's almost as good or better than taking a magnesium supplement.

01:05:15.000 Really good for your muscles, too.

01:05:16.000 Everything gets loose and relaxed, and it feels like everything stretches out.

01:05:21.000 What about...

01:05:22.000 I also tried that.

01:05:23.000 I love that.

01:05:24.000 I'll show you when you get out of here.

01:05:25.000 What about massage?

01:05:26.000 Do you get massage?

01:05:27.000 Yeah, like daily.

01:05:29.000 Daily, yeah.

01:05:29.000 So my physiotherapist comes in to the house and just keeps the blood flowing and just makes sure...

01:05:39.000 Yeah, everything.

01:05:40.000 Not just for recovery, but also just for the injuries.

01:05:45.000 Just keep checking, like, oh, what's this?

01:05:46.000 What's that?

01:05:47.000 What's hurting?

01:05:49.000 So, luckily, I've been doing pretty good.

01:05:51.000 Not too many injuries.

01:05:52.000 Yeah, having a good one, a good massage therapist to deal with injuries is just gigantic, right?

01:05:58.000 Yeah, it's so important.

01:05:59.000 They can prevent things, fix things.

01:06:03.000 Things that are starting to go south, they can stop it in its tracks and loosen everything up.

01:06:08.000 Because sometimes when you get an injury, everything around it tightens up.

01:06:12.000 And then when you're training, it gets even more fucked up.

01:06:14.000 But if someone can loosen that up, then it has time to relax and heal.

01:06:18.000 Yeah, or else it's just getting more tense and then you're going to rip something or whatever.

01:06:23.000 So, yeah, that's so important.

01:06:24.000 And I think that's...

01:06:27.000 One of the key factors in being a pro athlete is the people you have around you and the team that helps you balance everything out.

01:06:37.000 And they say, hey, Rico, yeah, you're the fighter.

01:06:39.000 I say, yeah, I'm Rico the fighter.

01:06:41.000 I'm Rico the champion because of all those people that are around me.

01:06:47.000 So still, in the end, you're doing an individual sport.

01:06:50.000 But you have a great team around you to be that person that you are in the ring.

01:06:55.000 And at the highest level, I think you have to have that.

01:06:58.000 You have to have all the ducks in line, right?

01:07:00.000 Yeah.

01:07:00.000 You have to have everything in line if you want to be at the very top of the heap.

01:07:03.000 Yeah, you have to.

01:07:05.000 What about psychology?

01:07:06.000 Do you have a mental trainer or anybody who's like a sports psychologist?

01:07:11.000 Well, that's the fun thing.

01:07:12.000 I started off with the guy I was telling you about, Alvio Lima.

01:07:17.000 He's also kickboxing world champion in different weight divisions.

01:07:22.000 And I was training with him and he took me with his training.

01:07:27.000 He took me to his training and I was working with him in his prime.

01:07:32.000 And without him knowing, he was teaching me so much about mental training because I was training with him and he was never giving up.

01:07:43.000 And the moment when I just showed something like, He gave even more gas.

01:07:50.000 So when you started slowing down.

01:07:52.000 Yeah.

01:07:53.000 He was even pushing the pace even more.

01:07:55.000 And that's what I was seeing in his fights.

01:07:57.000 I was just studying him.

01:07:59.000 And from that I learned so much.

01:08:02.000 And I respect him.

01:08:03.000 I'm still so thankful for that.

01:08:05.000 And he's still my mental coach.

01:08:08.000 So, he's in my corner, and every time when he says something, I just think about, I don't want to disappoint this man because he knows how important this is.

01:08:18.000 And I think from the start of last year or something, I was really like a little bit skeptical about talking to people like a psychologist or something.

01:08:31.000 I was like, I don't know.

01:08:32.000 Let's talk about personal stuff, you know, that's pretty deep.

01:08:37.000 With somebody you don't know is...

01:08:39.000 I don't know.

01:08:40.000 Maybe in my mind it just doesn't add up.

01:08:43.000 It doesn't feel good.

01:08:45.000 But still, I got in the situation that I had to.

01:08:50.000 I just had to.

01:08:51.000 And I went there.

01:08:53.000 And it actually felt pretty good.

01:08:55.000 So from that moment on, I just kept on doing it.

01:08:59.000 Just talk about it.

01:09:00.000 Just talk about stuff.

01:09:03.000 You're like no other.

01:09:05.000 Know how many things happen, everything that happens in your life.

01:09:11.000 And you just got to process all that stuff.

01:09:14.000 But sometimes you just...

01:09:15.000 So many things happen in your life that you just can't process.

01:09:19.000 And you put them away.

01:09:20.000 And you don't think about it.

01:09:21.000 And they're fucking with you in the back of your head.

01:09:23.000 Exactly.

01:09:24.000 And then when you just have the time or take the time to talk about this stuff...

01:09:30.000 It just feels a lot better.

01:09:32.000 It feels like a bag of bricks on your back.

01:09:36.000 You just fall off.

01:09:38.000 It feels good.

01:09:40.000 I think of it the same way you were talking about physical therapy.

01:09:43.000 If you have little injuries, nagging injuries, you get it massaged out and everything loosens up.

01:09:48.000 I think of it the same way.

01:09:49.000 If you're not taking...

01:09:51.000 A good account of what's going on in your mind, you can develop little mental injuries.

01:09:57.000 Yeah, exactly.

01:09:58.000 But for me, and maybe a lot of people have, maybe not nowadays, but from back in the days, people said, when you're talking to a psychologist, you're crazy.

01:10:08.000 Right, right, right.

01:10:10.000 Or you're weak.

01:10:11.000 Yeah, that's how people in Holland...

01:10:14.000 Yeah.

01:10:14.000 Approached it.

01:10:15.000 Well, for a long time here for fighters, it was the same thing.

01:10:19.000 Most fighters didn't need a psychologist.

01:10:21.000 That's not for winners.

01:10:23.000 Winners know how to win.

01:10:25.000 You just don't be a pussy.

01:10:26.000 Go out there and fucking fight.

01:10:27.000 Yeah.

01:10:27.000 But that's nonsense.

01:10:29.000 There's no pussies in professional fighting.

01:10:32.000 No.

01:10:32.000 But there is edge.

01:10:34.000 You can get an edge.

01:10:36.000 You can get an advantage.

01:10:37.000 Whether you get that advantage from getting massage or cryotherapy or from a sports psychologist, there's advantages to be had.

01:10:44.000 Yeah.

01:10:45.000 But I think that's what I got from my dad is just...

01:10:49.000 Being tough.

01:10:50.000 Being tough and being hard on yourself in whatever situation you're in.

01:10:55.000 Just be tough on yourself and just...

01:10:58.000 Because that's what he was.

01:10:59.000 He was tough on himself.

01:11:01.000 And so that's what I got from him.

01:11:05.000 But now I just think like, okay, just do...

01:11:08.000 Tweak everything up and just get mentally imbalanced and especially when he passed away like almost two years ago.

01:11:15.000 It's just...

01:11:15.000 Yeah, it was tough.

01:11:17.000 It was tough, especially when the relationship we had wasn't like...

01:11:21.000 It was like on and off, on and off.

01:11:24.000 And when it was on, it was like a lot of discussion and it just hurts.

01:11:28.000 And then things happen in your life and you just try to process everything and give it a certain...

01:11:36.000 But it's hard sometimes, and you just need somebody outside of your comfort zone to talk about that.

01:11:45.000 That really worked and helped for me, so I'm very thankful for that.

01:11:52.000 I think always how I approach things is that everything in life happens for a reason.

01:11:59.000 Whatever.

01:12:00.000 Positive or negative.

01:12:02.000 And sometimes you know what happens and why it happened.

01:12:07.000 And sometimes you probably know it after like a few years.

01:12:10.000 And maybe you never know it.

01:12:12.000 But in my opinion, everything in life, positive or negative, happens for a reason.

01:12:17.000 And you just...

01:12:19.000 Yeah, it's on you.

01:12:21.000 Well, whether it does or doesn't, if you decide that it does, that it happens for a reason, and you can find benefit in good or bad things, then it does happen for a reason.

01:12:31.000 But you make that distinction that it's going to be for your benefit, that it can help you in the long run.

01:12:37.000 That's the difference between a person who takes Things that happen, adversity in life, and decides that the world is against them.

01:12:46.000 I can't catch a break.

01:12:47.000 The world's fucking me over.

01:12:49.000 Those people wind up becoming losers versus someone who says, you know what?

01:12:52.000 We're going to be fine.

01:12:53.000 This is going to make me better.

01:12:55.000 It's going to make me stronger.

01:12:56.000 This is going to make me understand.

01:12:57.000 Even though I'm more vulnerable right now, this is going to make me understand myself better.

01:13:01.000 It's going to ultimately make me better at everything I do.

01:13:04.000 If you decide that, then things do happen for a reason.

01:13:08.000 Exactly.

01:13:09.000 And that's one of the reasons I love watching your podcast because that's what you bring.

01:13:16.000 And especially what I think for people that maybe sometimes struggle with certain things or like to just explain in a situation where you think like, fuck, what the fuck did I do to life that constantly everything just backfires on me?

01:13:31.000 I always think like, you are responsible for the choices that you make in your life and nobody else.

01:13:38.000 You're also responsible for how you accept or how you focus on your life.

01:13:43.000 Exactly.

01:13:43.000 How you think about things and how you process it.

01:13:47.000 You're responsible for it.

01:13:48.000 Yeah.

01:13:49.000 And those are things that are so important to me.

01:13:55.000 And that's what I mean with, I try to surround myself with people that boost my flame.

01:14:02.000 Yeah.

01:14:03.000 I just look at my phone and go through it like, who did I text or who did I call?

01:14:09.000 Those people need to boost my flame.

01:14:11.000 They need to be important in one way or the other.

01:14:15.000 It doesn't mean that they have to be important in business or in work or it can be in love or in family or whatever.

01:14:24.000 They need to be important in some kind of way.

01:14:26.000 I just need to have Positivity around me because I've seen so many negative things from my family side that it's like it doesn't work.

01:14:36.000 It drains you.

01:14:37.000 It drains you and I believe like it's like karma.

01:14:41.000 If you're negative you will Attract more negative things.

01:14:47.000 If you're positive, all positive things will come your way.

01:14:52.000 100%.

01:14:53.000 I believe that as well.

01:14:54.000 Do you have a visualization plan when you go into a fight?

01:15:00.000 Like, say, this rematch with Badr Hari.

01:15:02.000 Are you going to sit down and visualize certain scenarios?

01:15:06.000 Do you train your thought process to go over scenarios or to have a game plan in your mind, execute the fight the way you would like to imagine it?

01:15:16.000 Of course.

01:15:17.000 Of course.

01:15:18.000 I think every fighter does.

01:15:21.000 Is this something you set aside?

01:15:23.000 Do you meditate and set aside time to do that or do you just do that all the time?

01:15:26.000 No.

01:15:26.000 It just happens.

01:15:28.000 You're just doing it all the time?

01:15:29.000 Yeah.

01:15:30.000 You're in the car or whatever.

01:15:33.000 It just happens when you're on the treadmill or whatever.

01:15:37.000 It happens when you think about what's going to happen in the upcoming months.

01:15:45.000 You just know that this is going to be next level.

01:15:48.000 But how are we going to approach this fight?

01:15:51.000 What is going to happen?

01:15:53.000 What might happen if he does this?

01:15:55.000 I do that.

01:15:56.000 But this could happen and that could happen.

01:15:58.000 And in my mind, before going into the fight, I fought it already like a thousand times.

01:16:02.000 Maybe even more.

01:16:04.000 Because you're thinking about this This person and this fight for so long and for like three or four months, that's a long time.

01:16:14.000 So that happens.

01:16:17.000 And what I always feel like what's fun for people to realize is that my confidence level during a period of like three or four months into a fight goes like...

01:16:33.000 Up and down, up and down.

01:16:34.000 And people are like, how is that possible?

01:16:36.000 You are the fucking best at what you're doing.

01:16:38.000 You're smacking the shit out of everybody in training and in camp.

01:16:43.000 And how does that happen?

01:16:45.000 I don't know, but that is what happens.

01:16:48.000 I think that happens to everybody.

01:16:50.000 So you just accept the process?

01:16:51.000 You just accept the process, but it's such a fucking frustrating process that when you're here, Just try to get back up there again.

01:17:02.000 But you know that is part of the process.

01:17:05.000 Because I've been doing this my whole life.

01:17:07.000 So I know it's part of the process, but still it's frustrating.

01:17:11.000 And that's what, for example, a mental coach and a psychologist can help you with.

01:17:19.000 Cope with that at that moment so that you don't stay here.

01:17:23.000 You do climb back up again.

01:17:26.000 And then you say, but where does that come from?

01:17:30.000 It can come from anywhere.

01:17:32.000 You know, from your body being tired.

01:17:35.000 Like, hey, why can't I cope with this training?

01:17:37.000 Or why is this training getting to me?

01:17:39.000 Or during sparring, why did I get hit five times with the right hand and didn't block or react or whatever?

01:17:48.000 So it can come from anywhere.

01:17:50.000 And then the monotony of training as well, right?

01:17:54.000 So now this fight that's going to be happening December 21st, how can people get it?

01:17:59.000 Is it going to be available on UFC Fight Pass?

01:18:03.000 Yeah, it's going to be UFC Fight Pass and I believe it's on ESPN as well.

01:18:09.000 Okay.

01:18:10.000 Is it ESPN2? I think so, but I'm not 100% sure.

01:18:14.000 Well, I'll find out and we'll make sure we tell everybody when it's taking place.

01:18:18.000 So we'll make sure we get a bunch of people to watch that, man.

01:18:22.000 Of course.

01:18:22.000 I'm fucking very pumped.

01:18:23.000 This is going to be kickboxing history.

01:18:25.000 It is.

01:18:26.000 It really is.

01:18:27.000 Like you said, probably the biggest fight in kickboxing history.

01:18:30.000 Yeah.

01:18:31.000 And then, of course, back in the days we had so many great fights and we had the K1 tournament.

01:18:37.000 It was amazing.

01:18:39.000 But this is just the biggest one-on-one fight from this time.

01:18:45.000 From this time, yeah.

01:18:46.000 In this era.

01:18:47.000 Yeah, from this era that everybody wants to see.

01:18:49.000 Well, I hope a million fucking people watch it or more.

01:18:52.000 And I hope it really does open up the door for bigger and bigger fights.

01:18:56.000 Because I think that it's...

01:18:57.000 Look, Glory's amazing.

01:18:58.000 You guys have so many incredibly talented fighters.

01:19:02.000 And so many high-level fights.

01:19:03.000 I fucking love it, man.

01:19:05.000 I'm just such a huge fan.

01:19:07.000 I don't understand why it's not...

01:19:08.000 Bigger in America.

01:19:10.000 I know it's bigger in Europe.

01:19:11.000 Yeah, but that's, yeah, for us the same thing.

01:19:14.000 So we just hope that during the years, you know, we just keep building it up, building it up, and hope, like, for example, with Anthony opening up more gyms, more great American kickboxers and American fighters will stand up and compete.

01:19:33.000 That would be amazing.

01:19:34.000 Who knows?

01:19:34.000 This might be it, man.

01:19:36.000 This one might be the one that changes the tide.

01:19:38.000 Exactly.

01:19:38.000 Well, good luck to you, brother.

01:19:39.000 And thank you very much for coming in.

01:19:40.000 Thank you so much, man.

01:19:41.000 Really appreciate you.

01:19:42.000 Appreciate your time.

01:19:43.000 Oh, let everybody know your Instagram, your Twitter.

01:19:45.000 What is it?

01:19:46.000 How do they get out?

01:19:47.000 My Instagram and Twitter, it's all the same.

01:19:49.000 Just Rico Verhoeven.

01:19:52.000 And spell it out for people so they just know how to spell Verhoeven.

01:19:55.000 Okay.

01:19:57.000 So it's R-I-C-O. It says Rico.

01:20:00.000 And then V-E-R-H-O-E-V-E-N. All right.

01:20:04.000 Beautiful.

01:20:05.000 That's it.

01:20:06.000 Bye, everybody.

01:20:06.000 Thanks, guys.

The Joe Rogan Experience - January 13, 2011

JRE MMA Show #71 with Rico Verhoeven

Episode Stats

Length

Words per Minute

Word Count

Sentence Count

Misogynist Sentences

Hate Speech Sentences

Summary

Transcript