The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #79 with Vinny Shoreman & Liam Harrison

00:00:03.000 Here we go.

00:00:03.000 Liam and Vinny, my savage friends from Mother England.

00:00:07.000 Thank you for having us back.

00:00:08.000 Good to see you again, man.

00:00:08.000 What's happening?

00:00:09.000 How's it been?

00:00:10.000 All sorts of things are going on, Joe.

00:00:12.000 All sorts of things.

00:00:13.000 Happy birthday, boy, over here as well.

00:00:15.000 50 today.

00:00:15.000 Happy birthday, sir.

00:00:16.000 Thank you, sir.

00:00:17.000 I appreciate it.

00:00:17.000 You don't look a day over 49 and a half.

00:00:19.000 Looking good. 1.00

00:00:20.000 Fucking fail it. 0.99

00:00:22.000 I feel it. 1.00

00:00:23.000 I pulled a muscle in my leg bowling last night.

00:00:25.000 Oh, no.

00:00:25.000 Bad news, mate.

00:00:26.000 When you're a world kickboxing champion, you pull a muscle bowling.

00:00:29.000 Those are sad times. 0.99

00:00:30.000 It's pathetic, isn't it? 1.00

00:00:31.000 It's pathetic. 1.00

00:00:32.000 I'm looking at myself in the mirror this morning when I got up and thought, you are a loser, mate. 1.00

00:00:35.000 What have you done? 0.99

00:00:36.000 The worst neck injuries I ever got was in the shower.

00:00:38.000 I was just turning to get my shampoo.

00:00:40.000 I was just like that. 1.00

00:00:41.000 I'm like, ah, fuck, fuck. 1.00

00:00:46.000 Look at that. 1.00

00:00:46.000 Knocked over Roy McDonald and Bruce Lee with my shenanigans, my antics. 1.00

00:00:51.000 Yeah, that's a bummer, man.

00:00:52.000 Bowling?

00:00:53.000 Bowling, mate, yeah.

00:00:54.000 The thing is, well, I felt it.

00:00:55.000 I thought, I've done myself in here, but I can't lose the game and I carried on.

00:00:58.000 At least I won the game.

00:00:59.000 Well, imagine if, like, you had a workout and your trainer was like, okay, we're going to do some bowling. 0.99

00:01:03.000 You're like, how the fuck? 0.97

00:01:05.000 This isn't even an effort. 0.99

00:01:06.000 I wouldn't mind yesterday morning.

00:01:07.000 I did some hard-round sparring.

00:01:09.000 I've got a little black eye from her and stuff.

00:01:10.000 Clinching, running, fine.

00:01:12.000 No problems.

00:01:13.000 Balling.

00:01:13.000 Well, maybe it was like some residual stiffness.

00:01:16.000 Do you know what?

00:01:17.000 We've been driving around a lot.

00:01:18.000 The schedule's been hectic.

00:01:20.000 We've had seminars and stuff going over.

00:01:22.000 We've been sat in the car a lot, so my hips have been stiff.

00:01:24.000 So I think it was to do with that, to be honest, because it's right up here on my hip where I'm doing this.

00:01:26.000 Yeah, man, that's legit.

00:01:27.000 That's a big deal.

00:01:28.000 When I come out of here, when I just get up after sitting in a chair for five hours...

00:01:34.000 Everything feels weird.

00:01:35.000 You know, you've got to roll it and stretch. 0.95

00:01:37.000 I wake up as I've been fucking beat up. 0.96

00:01:39.000 I don't know what that's... 0.96

00:01:40.000 What's that about?

00:01:40.000 I don't know.

00:01:41.000 What are you doing?

00:01:42.000 Nightmare demons.

00:01:43.000 What have you been up to?

00:01:44.000 I don't know.

00:01:45.000 I haven't sleep.

00:01:46.000 What's that?

00:01:47.000 I've been asleep, so I don't know.

00:01:48.000 You've been asleep? 0.98

00:01:48.000 No, every time I wake up, I'm like, fucking hell in the morning, so I don't know what goes on. 0.98

00:01:52.000 Part of me feet, me hips, whatever. 0.99

00:01:54.000 Yeah, but you're 50. I get it.

00:01:56.000 With him, I don't get it.

00:01:57.000 Yeah, no.

00:01:58.000 You're supposed to be.

00:01:59.000 He's in his pride.

00:01:59.000 Yeah, we've had about 300 fights, aren't you?

00:02:02.000 That's true, too. 0.99

00:02:02.000 Kicking fuck out of people. 0.99

00:02:03.000 The craziest fucking record ever is probably Lomachenko, right? 1.00

00:02:06.000 Because didn't you only have one loss in the amateurs? 0.99

00:02:09.000 398 wins?

00:02:10.000 Something crazy like that.

00:02:12.000 397. 397 wins, one loss.

00:02:16.000 Which he reversed twice.

00:02:18.000 And then one loss in the pros.

00:02:20.000 He's obviously not taking too much damage either because of his style, but even making weight, 398 times making weight and stuff.

00:02:28.000 Being on a diet for that long and just being that strict for that long, it's impressive.

00:02:33.000 Well, as he's moving up, he's not cutting as much though.

00:02:36.000 Like in his third weight class.

00:02:37.000 This is his third weight class, right?

00:02:39.000 Yeah, they're on about him moving down as well.

00:02:40.000 What is his...

00:02:42.000 He's going up and down?

00:02:43.000 Yeah, that's what Bob Aron said.

00:02:44.000 But his last fight against the Englishman, what is his name, Connelly?

00:02:49.000 Luke Campbell.

00:02:50.000 Campbell.

00:02:50.000 I was there.

00:02:51.000 It was a great fight.

00:02:52.000 That kid's good.

00:02:53.000 He put a really good account of himself, because most people in England had wrote him off before it even started.

00:02:58.000 Everyone wrote him off.

00:02:58.000 To be fair, the second time he went down as well, he didn't have to get back up, because he'd already put a really good account of himself by that point, and to get Back up, finish the fight and finish strong.

00:03:09.000 You're impressive.

00:03:10.000 No, he's unquestionably that kid's a warrior.

00:03:12.000 I was impressed with his use of distance.

00:03:14.000 I mean, he gave Lomachenko some problems until Lomachenko figured out the timing and how to get inside of him.

00:03:20.000 Yeah, he's big for that weight as well.

00:03:22.000 Andy knows how to box.

00:03:23.000 He was a gold medalist himself, so he was impressive.

00:03:26.000 I was there, and then Lomachenko turned and saw it.

00:03:30.000 I felt like he looked at me.

00:03:32.000 Did you feel like that?

00:03:33.000 Yeah, I just went, yeah!

00:03:35.000 Well, you know what I'm like.

00:03:36.000 Hello!

00:03:36.000 Yeah, I bet he wasn't looking at you.

00:03:38.000 I bet it wasn't.

00:03:39.000 In my world, he wasn't.

00:03:41.000 You can't say it that way.

00:03:42.000 Does it help you at all to think that he was looking at you?

00:03:44.000 Yes.

00:03:45.000 What do you get out of that?

00:03:46.000 It was a four-hour car ride, and I was in the A&E that morning because I injured myself.

00:03:53.000 I had to go to the A&E. What's the A&E? Accident and emergency.

00:03:56.000 Oh, okay. 1.00

00:03:57.000 That's some English shit. 1.00

00:03:57.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:03:58.000 So we had to go there.

00:04:00.000 But all the way there, I was thinking, I can't not go.

00:04:02.000 How'd you get injured?

00:04:05.000 Doing weights.

00:04:06.000 Doing some weights.

00:04:07.000 What'd you do?

00:04:08.000 Pulled my groin here. 0.88

00:04:09.000 So I was like hopping about.

00:04:11.000 And then the nurse at the gym at Four Corners, I was going to train that morning.

00:04:14.000 She said, you better go to Wayne here.

00:04:15.000 So I did.

00:04:16.000 So what was wrong with you?

00:04:17.000 I was just straying my groin here.

00:04:20.000 That's it?

00:04:21.000 It wasn't fun.

00:04:22.000 It wasn't fun.

00:04:23.000 It wasn't fun at all.

00:04:23.000 But you're better now?

00:04:24.000 Yes sir.

00:04:25.000 So it couldn't have been that big a deal.

00:04:26.000 Yeah, but in my world...

00:04:27.000 That fight was like two weeks ago.

00:04:28.000 I'm not a black belt in Jiu Jitsu and I'm not an eight time world champion. 0.70

00:04:31.000 I'm a natural coward.

00:04:34.000 So any little poll, just immediately.

00:04:36.000 Yes, straight to the doctors.

00:04:37.000 That's one thing about socialised medicine, that you guys have free healthcare.

00:04:41.000 You don't have to worry.

00:04:42.000 You just go show up.

00:04:44.000 I'll tell you what, last time though, when you were on and you told me to do a bit of hot yoga, you said, I did it.

00:04:49.000 I've just started recently, my girlfriend started doing it.

00:04:51.000 I've just started doing a bit with her. 1.00

00:04:53.000 Mate, fuck me. 1.00

00:04:54.000 That is like the hardest shit I've ever done in my life. 1.00

00:04:57.000 And you said last time, well, have a joint and go do it. 0.99

00:04:58.000 It's amazing.

00:04:59.000 I had a few blasts on vape last night and I just melted into the bed.

00:05:02.000 I couldn't do that and then go do that.

00:05:04.000 No way.

00:05:04.000 Yeah, you could.

00:05:05.000 Once you get in there.

00:05:06.000 You actually, it's crazy.

00:05:07.000 It seems like you can't, but I love to get high and do it because it's like I feel everything.

00:05:12.000 I know I'm in tune.

00:05:14.000 I get like 100% transmission from all muscle fibers.

00:05:17.000 Well, the thing is, as well, though, like, the beginners all go at the back, so I went at the back, and there's, like, this little old guy on me, I thought, I'll be fucking cool next to this guy, it's all right.

00:05:24.000 I won't humiliate myself.

00:05:25.000 And he's bending around, doing it all perfect, and I'm meant to have good balance.

00:05:29.000 I've had 115 fights, so if I should have good balance, I'm stood there shaking on one leg, and it's like, don't stop, don't stop.

00:05:35.000 And you're not stopping until he stops, mate.

00:05:37.000 It took about 45 minutes in, and I was just, like, shaking all over.

00:05:40.000 I had to stop before. 0.97

00:05:41.000 It's fucking hard, man. 0.99

00:05:43.000 It's fucking hard. 0.99

00:05:44.000 Serious. 1.00

00:05:44.000 Those old ladies will make you feel stupid. 1.00

00:05:46.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1.00

00:05:48.000 100%.

00:05:48.000 It's one of those things where people look at it like it's some relaxing thing.

00:05:52.000 It's one of the most underestimated activities you can do, in terms of the amount of stress and strain that's required. 0.99

00:05:59.000 It's fucking hard. 0.93

00:06:00.000 You know what? 0.99

00:06:00.000 I've never sweat like it in my life, either. 0.99

00:06:02.000 Even when I've been in a sauna to lose weight for a fight and stuff, I've never sweat like that.

00:06:06.000 I must have gone for about five of them easily.

00:06:08.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:06:09.000 I bring a 64-gallon...

00:06:11.000 64...

00:06:16.000 What is it, liters?

00:06:17.000 No, that doesn't make any sense.

00:06:18.000 What would it be?

00:06:18.000 Ounces.

00:06:19.000 Ounces.

00:06:19.000 Is that it?

00:06:20.000 Yeah.

00:06:20.000 Yeah, 64 ounces of water.

00:06:22.000 Yeah, like a hydro flask. 0.94

00:06:23.000 I bring a big one, and I just fill it up with ice and water, and I just fucking drink the thing the entire time. 0.74

00:06:29.000 And I make sure I drink a shitload of water on the way over there, too. 0.94

00:06:31.000 You're just pouring water.

00:06:33.000 But they did a study recently, a Harvard study.

00:06:36.000 There's one of them they're doing right now, where they're trying to see if the same effects from hot yoga you get from sauna.

00:06:42.000 Like, it's very similar, because sauna does, you know, it's like...

00:06:46.000 40% decrease across all causes of mortality, heart attacks, strokes.

00:06:51.000 With people that regularly do the sauna, I think they consider it four days a week, they have incredible results health-wise because of the reduction of inflammation.

00:07:00.000 Because when you're in that heat, it just really reduces inflammation across your whole body.

00:07:04.000 They think that that's going on when you're doing yoga because your body heats up so much.

00:07:08.000 Because even though it's only 104 degrees in there, when you're fucking sweating at 104 degrees and holding those pose Yeah, 100%.

00:07:18.000 The only thing that saved me on that day, my friend came with me as well, and he's a big guy.

00:07:21.000 He's like 6'5". 0.99

00:07:22.000 So I knew that every time I was struggling, I looked across and he was fucked. 1.00

00:07:28.000 Oh yeah, big giant people. 0.99

00:07:29.000 You don't realize how badly out of balance your body is if you're a weightlifter until you do yoga.

00:07:35.000 Like especially those dudes with little toothpick legs and a big meatball body. 0.86

00:07:38.000 You know those guys?

00:07:44.000 Yeah, it's like a like a car with a giant engine and skinny back tires.

00:07:48.000 You just slide all over It's just, but I think for athletes, it's one of the very best things to keep your entire body balanced, to keep it in tune.

00:07:59.000 I was speaking to someone who was saying, how long do you want to fight for?

00:08:01.000 And I said, I want at least another three or four years out of myself yet.

00:08:03.000 I said, I still feel good at the minute.

00:08:05.000 I said, but I am getting injured more.

00:08:07.000 So he said, serious.

00:08:08.000 I know you've been told to do it.

00:08:10.000 He said, you do it.

00:08:10.000 He said, you will get another four or five years out.

00:08:12.000 Maybe it'll help just so much.

00:08:14.000 And I walked out the room.

00:08:15.000 I was dead, but I felt amazing about 10 minutes after.

00:08:17.000 Yeah, no, it's great for you.

00:08:19.000 And it's also for a kickboxer, like your coordination and your ability to have a full range of motion is so important.

00:08:27.000 Yeah, mobility, flexibility, everything.

00:08:28.000 Head kicks, you know?

00:08:30.000 You want that flexibility.

00:08:31.000 You want it to be looser so you can let those babies fly. 1.00

00:08:34.000 Yeah, I'm head kicked out really, my speciality.

00:08:36.000 Anyway, I'm more of a leg kick type of guy.

00:08:38.000 But every now and then.

00:08:39.000 Yeah, you never know.

00:08:40.000 It's good to let one go.

00:08:40.000 I'm surprised a few people every now and then.

00:08:42.000 How was your knee?

00:08:43.000 I know you had a knee surgery.

00:08:44.000 Oh, yeah.

00:08:45.000 It's all good now.

00:08:48.000 I did it in Thailand in December.

00:08:51.000 You got surgery in Thailand?

00:08:52.000 No, no.

00:08:53.000 I did the injury in December and my legs started locking all the time.

00:08:56.000 And I had a fight. 1.00

00:08:57.000 Yeah, fuck that. 1.00

00:08:58.000 No way. 1.00

00:09:03.000 So I did the injury in December, just before I was training for a fight in the end of January.

00:09:07.000 And my legs started locking, so I didn't really know what it was.

00:09:10.000 So I thought, I'll get the fight out of the way.

00:09:11.000 Then I'll go see my specialist, get an MRI, see what's what.

00:09:14.000 Did the fight, got through the fight, won the fight, didn't throw my left leg once.

00:09:18.000 And I thought, oh, it's alright now.

00:09:20.000 I went back to the gym, I threw one kick, and then meniscus tore.

00:09:23.000 It got stuck in my knee joint, so my leg locked, like totally bent, so I couldn't walk.

00:09:28.000 I've had that exact same injury.

00:09:29.000 It's crazy painful.

00:09:31.000 Honestly, they're one of the worst things I've ever felt.

00:09:33.000 I was rolling around the floor like I'd been shot.

00:09:36.000 I went to the hospital and I thought, because it was so bad and I would say, alright, it's my job, they might fast-trap me a little bit.

00:09:42.000 Went to the hospital.

00:09:43.000 Oh no, we'll let you see, we'll let you go for an MRI. We'll ring you with an appointment.

00:09:47.000 So I had to go home.

00:09:48.000 I sat at home for like four days before they'd even rang. 0.99

00:09:50.000 I thought, fuck this, I'm going private. 0.99

00:09:51.000 So I went private. 0.99

00:09:52.000 By the time I'd had an MRI, which told me what it was, And had the surgery.

00:09:55.000 I'd only just got a letter to go have an MRI from the hospital. 0.94

00:09:58.000 So they were just going to leave me there for fucking however long. 0.97

00:10:00.000 I was sat there watching my leg turn into a toothpick. 0.99

00:10:03.000 All muscle wasting away and everything.

00:10:05.000 That's the downside of socialized medicine, right?

00:10:07.000 Big lines.

00:10:09.000 Canada, it's rough.

00:10:10.000 I had a friend, she had to wait over a year to get a knee surgery. 1.00

00:10:13.000 She had a torn ACL. Over a year with a bad knee.

00:10:16.000 Just hobbling around with one, you know...

00:10:20.000 It's good and it's bad, right?

00:10:22.000 It's good and it's bad.

00:10:23.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:10:24.000 I feel all ashamed now that I went in with my pulled groin and you and your leg didn't, your leg was hanging off, I got bit by a shark, whatever.

00:10:31.000 Yeah, you fought with that.

00:10:32.000 I had the surgery and they said, oh, don't, probably after 12 weeks you'll be back to full strength, you better start fight training again.

00:10:38.000 I had a fight after 10 weeks.

00:10:40.000 Wow.

00:10:40.000 So I did like a full month, just rehab, getting it back to where it was, and then I trained for like six weeks for a fight and I fought on one championship.

00:10:47.000 I had that exact same injury.

00:10:49.000 It's called a bucket handle tear.

00:10:50.000 Yeah, yeah. 1.00

00:10:52.000 God damn it. 0.99

00:10:53.000 Honestly, I've never felt like it. 0.99

00:10:55.000 It was horrendous, man.

00:10:56.000 Now, when they removed the chunk, is your knee okay now?

00:10:59.000 Did it feel unstable at all?

00:11:00.000 Or does it feel sore?

00:11:02.000 It gets a bit sore because it's just rubbing on bone.

00:11:04.000 Now, I'm guessing there's not there.

00:11:06.000 No, I'm sure there's something there.

00:11:07.000 Oh, well, that's what it is now.

00:11:08.000 They haven't took the whole thing out, but they're just trimmed away.

00:11:10.000 You know what helps, man, is if you get some stem cells shot in there.

00:11:14.000 Yeah.

00:11:14.000 Just make your way down to Panama.

00:11:16.000 I know you told me that before.

00:11:17.000 You messaged me and said, get down there.

00:11:18.000 Yeah.

00:11:18.000 I'm going to have my look into it.

00:11:20.000 I was having real problems with my left knee because that's the one that I had, the meniscus tear.

00:11:23.000 And anytime I had to do anything rigorous, it would start swelling.

00:11:25.000 It would hurt.

00:11:26.000 And then I got one stem cell shot like five years ago.

00:11:30.000 It's never bothered me since.

00:11:31.000 Really?

00:11:31.000 Never bothered me since, yeah.

00:11:32.000 What about one session?

00:11:34.000 Is it BPC-157 as well?

00:11:35.000 That's like a new peptide type of thing.

00:11:38.000 I don't think that's for...

00:11:39.000 See, the difference between meniscus and ligaments is that that's more of something that they think is really good for tendons and ligaments.

00:11:46.000 Right, right.

00:11:47.000 But there's some real promising results.

00:11:49.000 Yeah, I've heard people raving about it.

00:11:50.000 Glenn was just telling me about it then.

00:11:51.000 One of my friends from home, he uses it on his tendonitis and stuff, and he said it's amazing.

00:11:56.000 Yeah, Dr. Mark Gordon is using that in his protocols.

00:11:59.000 He's that guy that does a lot of work with traumatic brain injuries and different, you know, people with pretty significant injuries and he's found there's some great papers that are being published right now on BPC 157. There you go, straight into the groin, man.

00:12:11.000 Yeah, it's a peptide. 0.99

00:12:12.000 Shoot it into the old groin area, fella. 1.00

00:12:14.000 Well, I've got a limited internal rotation on my left leg anyway, from kicking. 0.98

00:12:19.000 Limited internal rotation?

00:12:21.000 Yeah, can't internal rotate.

00:12:23.000 How come?

00:12:23.000 From what?

00:12:24.000 From kicking.

00:12:25.000 From kicking?

00:12:26.000 From left kicking.

00:12:27.000 And Torit doing CrossFit.

00:12:30.000 I've got a physio, Darren Henlon, Irish guy, top guy.

00:12:35.000 He's been working on it, but this was like 5%.

00:12:38.000 This was like 5% the strength of that.

00:12:41.000 5%? 1.00

00:12:42.000 Yes, it was fucked. 1.00

00:12:43.000 So this one's 100, this one's 5? 1.00

00:12:45.000 Yeah, this was absolutely fucked. 0.99

00:12:47.000 I had like 5% of that. 0.99

00:12:48.000 But what's the actual injury?

00:12:51.000 I actually don't know.

00:12:52.000 I've got a tight hip capsule.

00:12:54.000 And I ruptured my hip flexor.

00:12:57.000 That was doing thrusters. 1.00

00:12:59.000 But I didn't realize I had one leg shorter than the other.

00:13:01.000 So I've got one leg shorter than the other.

00:13:02.000 You have one leg shorter than the other?

00:13:03.000 Yeah, like a pirate.

00:13:05.000 How much difference?

00:13:07.000 About that much.

00:13:08.000 Can you put that much in your shoe and balance it out?

00:13:11.000 Yes, I've got one.

00:13:13.000 So basically I'm disabled. 0.97

00:13:14.000 Why don't you get your leg pulled on? 0.98

00:13:16.000 Have fun.

00:13:18.000 When I didn't know what it was, because he's like...

00:13:21.000 Is it the bones or is it because of the capsule?

00:13:24.000 Don't know.

00:13:24.000 Am I a doctor?

00:13:24.000 Why am I asking you these questions?

00:13:26.000 I haven't got a fucking clue. 0.97

00:13:27.000 I just go and see him and he twists it about because it's loads of pain, but it's progressively got better, so... 0.98

00:13:33.000 So how is fighting in 1FC? Are you enjoying that?

00:13:36.000 It's sick, mate.

00:13:36.000 Is it?

00:13:37.000 Absolutely, I love it.

00:13:38.000 I'm gutted that it didn't come around earlier.

00:13:41.000 I'm like 33 now, so I've only got like three or four years left.

00:13:45.000 I 100% want to finish my career with those guys and put in a good room with them.

00:13:50.000 I need to see an event.

00:13:51.000 I hear it's amazing.

00:13:53.000 Seriously, I've fought all over the world and stuff.

00:13:55.000 The production and everything there is absolutely unbelievable.

00:13:59.000 Yodh Chhatri is a top guy as well.

00:14:01.000 How do they make the rule sets?

00:14:03.000 Because some fights are with kickboxing gloves.

00:14:06.000 Some fights are with MMA gloves.

00:14:08.000 Yeah, I'm not too sure, to be honest.

00:14:09.000 I think when they send you the contract over, you can say, well, I don't want to fight in MMA. Will you fight in the kickboxing?

00:14:14.000 So I think it's the team, the management team that get a say in it.

00:14:17.000 Like my manager, Richard, he's always said, no, no, it's dangerous fighting in MMA gloves.

00:14:21.000 You'll break your hands.

00:14:22.000 You'll shorten your career. 1.00

00:14:23.000 And I'm like, nah, fuck that. 1.00

00:14:24.000 I don't want to do it before I retire. 1.00

00:14:25.000 I said, I'm old as shit anyway now for fight-wise. 0.95

00:14:27.000 I said, I'm coming towards the end. 0.98

00:14:27.000 I said, I want to do it. 0.98

00:14:29.000 I remember when I went out, first round, I went bang with a jab. 0.98

00:14:32.000 I thought, fucking hell, that felt amazing. 0.98

00:14:34.000 And then he hit me, and I went, whoa. 1.00

00:14:36.000 I went, whoa.

00:14:37.000 That wasn't a glove.

00:14:38.000 They were like in Home Alone when Marv gets smashed with iron on his face.

00:14:41.000 That's what I felt like.

00:14:43.000 How much difference is it with the little gloves?

00:14:44.000 It's weird because, obviously, the glove's spongy, so that, like, it wobbles your head a little bit.

00:14:49.000 That was just like a sharp bang.

00:14:50.000 It's like a bare knuckle, basically, because those one gloves, as well, they're tiny.

00:14:54.000 There's not much padding in them whatsoever.

00:14:56.000 But...

00:14:57.000 But boxing gloves feel more spongy than we've seen?

00:15:00.000 Yeah, when you get it with a boxing glove, if you get it on the chin, it wobbles like you're all head because it's such a big surface area to hit.

00:15:06.000 With those little gloves hitting you in one point, I got cut four times on one eye.

00:15:11.000 I took three or four right hands and every one of them cut me.

00:15:14.000 So that's how dangerous they are. 1.00

00:15:16.000 But I made a stupid mistake in that fight. 0.98

00:15:18.000 In Muay Thai with the long gloves, I'll do long guard a lot because it works with the bigger gloves on, so I can protect myself. 0.98

00:15:23.000 I did it once in that fight, got caught with an overhand right, right on my ear, and balance went, I'd stack a knee, got an eight count.

00:15:29.000 Came back up and then I was chasing the fight after that.

00:15:31.000 And then even though round three I absolutely battered him, I cut him bad and I nearly stopped him with leg kicks.

00:15:36.000 It was only a three round fight.

00:15:37.000 So I'd lost one round tonight.

00:15:39.000 So first round were even, second round him tonight, third round I battered him.

00:15:42.000 But it was too late by then.

00:15:43.000 So one mistake in them gloves and it is...

00:15:46.000 That's interesting that it makes you reassess your defense, right?

00:15:49.000 Because your defense is dependent.

00:15:50.000 You see a lot of guys like Botter always fought like this with his hands, like those earmuffs. 0.90

00:15:56.000 The first thing I did as well when I was training to do it, I was sparring with him just to get used to it and I put my fucking hands shut like in a glove of wood and did that and someone kicked me and the fucking knuckle stuck in my head like that and I'm like, oh my god, this is going to be fucking torture trying to get used to putting your hands flat and more head movement and stuff like that.

00:16:12.000 But I did that, absolutely.

00:16:13.000 I really loved it.

00:16:14.000 I really enjoyed it.

00:16:14.000 I can't wait to fight for him again.

00:16:15.000 What did you think when they had that bare-knuckle boxing event and Pauli Malignaggi fought Artem Levin?

00:16:23.000 Ah, I'm Lobov.

00:16:24.000 Yeah, I'll say Artem Lobov.

00:16:26.000 Sorry.

00:16:27.000 That's one of the more interesting cases, because you've got a guy, Pauli Malignaggi, who's a legitimate world champion, a world-class boxer, you know, a few years past his prime and hasn't really been fighting, but then you see him fight a guy like Artem Lobov, who's used to fighting with MMA gloves.

00:16:42.000 There's not much of a difference fighting bare-knuckle And Blovov actually winds up beating him in a decision, which nobody fucking talked about.

00:16:50.000 Pauly's not a puncher anyway, is he? 0.67

00:16:52.000 So to go into that against a guy that's naturally bigger as well.

00:16:56.000 But you would have still thought that he would have known enough.

00:17:00.000 You know, like a guy like Roy Jones Jr., you're not outboxing him.

00:17:04.000 You know what I'm saying?

00:17:05.000 It's just like a world-class boxer, you would imagine, even if he's a few little tricks just to get into it. 0.99

00:17:10.000 He's still going to fuck you up. 0.98

00:17:12.000 He's just going to make the adjustments. 1.00

00:17:14.000 I wonder how he trained God knows.

00:17:16.000 No idea.

00:17:17.000 You know what I mean?

00:17:18.000 Did he box with bare knuckles?

00:17:19.000 Well, he broke his hand in the second round as well, didn't he?

00:17:22.000 And he broke it bad because a few weeks ago, because he's a pundit for Sky TV and the boxing, and he had his hand still in plaster or whatever it was then, so it must have been bad.

00:17:32.000 And he's very left-handed as well, isn't he?

00:17:34.000 I think he had a bad right hand.

00:17:36.000 He never chucked right hands, really.

00:17:37.000 Anyway, he was always left-hand anyway, wasn't he?

00:17:39.000 It wasn't a lot of...

00:17:41.000 Yeah, there wasn't a lot of combinations exchanged.

00:17:44.000 But that's the case with most of those bare-knuckle fights.

00:17:46.000 It's a totally different thing.

00:17:48.000 Yeah, it's getting big in England now as well.

00:17:50.000 The BKB thing.

00:17:51.000 They're having big shows, filling out big arenas.

00:17:53.000 They've got me down in London at O2 and stuff now.

00:17:56.000 One of my friends fought on it recently.

00:17:57.000 It's like getting a really big name for itself.

00:17:59.000 Well, people like the least rules...

00:18:03.000 Violence?

00:18:04.000 Yeah, the least rules possible.

00:18:05.000 They like it.

00:18:06.000 You know, like Lethwe or anything along those lines.

00:18:10.000 Headbutts with Lethwe, I mean, they take it to another level, right? 1.00

00:18:12.000 Yeah, that's crazy shit. 0.99

00:18:14.000 Wouldn't your guy come over to England and did some seminars on that? 1.00

00:18:17.000 And he was headbutting pads and all sorts of stuff.

00:18:18.000 David Ledoux?

00:18:19.000 Yeah, probably.

00:18:19.000 Yeah, he's coming on the podcast soon.

00:18:23.000 I was a big proponent of no gloves with MMA. I was like, well, if you don't have gloves on your shins and your knees and your elbows, why the fuck do you have them on your knuckles? 0.98

00:18:31.000 Yeah. 0.98

00:18:31.000 I changed my mind. 0.98

00:18:32.000 I saw those cuts.

00:18:34.000 Yeah, that's the two worst things.

00:18:36.000 I got cut four times on one eye and my hands after the fight.

00:18:39.000 Yeah.

00:18:40.000 Because we had like a bit of a war and I just started swinging all over placing around free trying to KO him.

00:18:44.000 I wasn't really picking my shorts properly like I should have been.

00:18:47.000 I've got bad problems with this one.

00:18:49.000 I've got a metal plate with this one.

00:18:51.000 The day after I flew back to England, I went to the gym, I put the gloves on just to try and hit the pads, and I couldn't even make a fist properly for about a week and a half, two weeks.

00:18:57.000 To swelling?

00:18:58.000 Yeah, it felt like all my wrist tendons and stuff around here, and I couldn't squeeze a fist properly. 0.99

00:19:04.000 They were awful, but that was my own stupid fault. 0.95

00:19:07.000 When I was chasing the fight, I wasn't picking my shorts properly. 0.99

00:19:09.000 I was just swinging around, hitting the top of his head and trying to KO him. 0.98

00:19:12.000 Yeah, it was fucking good though. 0.99

00:19:13.000 Everyone loved it. 0.99

00:19:14.000 It was fucking great. 0.94

00:19:15.000 I loved it when I was in there doing it. 0.98

00:19:17.000 It is exciting.

00:19:19.000 One mistake, it's going to change the fight, you know what I mean?

00:19:22.000 I've learned that now as well.

00:19:24.000 Well, we've seen that with MMA fighters, really top flight kickboxers like Gokan Saki.

00:19:29.000 When Gokan Saki fought Khalil Roundtree and Khalil just cracked him with one left hand and dropped him.

00:19:34.000 It's a different world with those little gloves.

00:19:36.000 100%.

00:19:37.000 I mean, you thought Gokhan Saki, man, he is one of the elite of the elite in kickboxing.

00:19:41.000 He's in MMA. If anybody's going to beat him, it's going to be on the ground.

00:19:44.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:19:45.000 You don't expect anyone to beat him.

00:19:46.000 Anybody can get caught with those little gloves. 1.00

00:19:48.000 Like I said as well, I did like long guard like that, which was stupid. 0.99

00:19:51.000 I trained the whole time as well not to do that. 0.99

00:19:55.000 Instincts.

00:19:55.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:19:56.000 You got back to what feels comfortable, don't you?

00:19:57.000 Right.

00:19:57.000 It cost me.

00:19:58.000 That's one of the craziest things about fighting, right?

00:20:01.000 Is that you train for years and years and years and then you have this style and you try to make adjustments during the fight.

00:20:08.000 But as soon as things get crazy, you go right back.

00:20:11.000 That's why I always felt like it's definitely worse to learn things wrong and then relearn them than to not learn anything at all and then start With a blank slate. 0.97

00:20:23.000 Like if you could teach someone and they were 25 and they had no martial arts experience whatsoever versus teach someone and they have five years of some bullshit. 0.99

00:20:33.000 The five years of some bullshit, that's going to be in their head. 0.99

00:20:37.000 Yeah, muscle memory and you've got to iron it out, haven't you? 0.98

00:20:39.000 That's why we get a lot of people who come to the gym as well who have done karate for years and then you try and teach them how to kick the Thai way and you just can't do it.

00:20:46.000 You take it over and over and over because they've been taught that way for so long.

00:20:50.000 It's just so difficult to get them out of that old habit.

00:20:52.000 You know, some guys were effective even with the karate weight.

00:20:55.000 Like, because of the amount of power they could generate.

00:20:58.000 Like, Crow Cop was a great example. 1.00

00:20:59.000 He kicked karate style. 1.00

00:21:01.000 But the fucking power that guy could generate. 1.00

00:21:04.000 Yeah, that head kick. 1.00

00:21:06.000 Disgraceful, man. 0.71

00:21:07.000 Body kicks. 0.99

00:21:07.000 Do you remember that there's a fucking picture when he kicked Heath Haring? 0.99

00:21:11.000 It is, to this day, one of the most... 0.99

00:21:14.000 TO THIS DAY! I was just thinking that.

00:21:18.000 That guy owns that expression forever.

00:21:20.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:21:21.000 To this day! 1.00

00:21:22.000 When he took his glasses off, I was like, fuck. 1.00

00:21:24.000 I got terrified. 0.99

00:21:25.000 I wasn't even in the room when I got scared.

00:21:27.000 But there's a shot of Crow Cop with his shin halfway into Heath Haring's body. 0.94

00:21:33.000 Look at this picture.

00:21:34.000 This picture.

00:21:35.000 Oh.

00:21:36.000 Yeah.

00:21:36.000 Right.

00:21:37.000 Dude!

00:21:38.000 That's a big old leg to be ripping through you as well.

00:21:41.000 Dude!

00:21:42.000 Oh my god. 1.00

00:21:44.000 That fucking body shape. 1.00

00:21:47.000 Who's that? 1.00

00:21:48.000 Jesus Christ.

00:21:49.000 I don't know who that is, but that's horrific.

00:21:52.000 Is that a head kick as well there that's landing on his head?

00:21:54.000 Yeah.

00:21:55.000 I don't think that's the one with Heath Herring.

00:21:58.000 The one with Heath Herring is...

00:22:00.000 That's it.

00:22:02.000 Upper left-hand corner.

00:22:03.000 That's it.

00:22:04.000 That's it. 1.00

00:22:04.000 Oh, that's full of shit. 1.00

00:22:05.000 Yeah, look at that one. 1.00

00:22:06.000 Look at that one.

00:22:07.000 Oh, my God.

00:22:08.000 Go full screen on that. 1.00

00:22:09.000 Look at the fucking penetration. 1.00

00:22:13.000 That is horrific. 1.00

00:22:14.000 And that's all liver.

00:22:15.000 Liver.

00:22:15.000 That is all liver.

00:22:16.000 And that's proper technique.

00:22:17.000 His arms, back and everything.

00:22:18.000 Oh my god.

00:22:19.000 That guy could generate so much force with that left kick.

00:22:22.000 It's insane.

00:22:23.000 But that one right there. 1.00

00:22:25.000 I mean, fucking A. Yeah, nah. 0.99

00:22:27.000 The most horrific body shot I've ever seen in all of MMA. Yeah, it's not even foot. 0.99

00:22:31.000 It's full shin as well.

00:22:32.000 Full shin.

00:22:32.000 For perfect.

00:22:34.000 Just, it's like a textbook.

00:22:35.000 Ugh! 0.97

00:22:37.000 But he, again, karate style.

00:22:39.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:22:40.000 Initially.

00:22:40.000 When you've got it down to an hour to fight like that as well, you can mix and match with the style when you're as gifted as Iwo as well.

00:22:46.000 It's Kyokushin, isn't it?

00:22:48.000 Kyokushin karate, they knock down karate, isn't it?

00:22:51.000 Kyokushin?

00:22:51.000 I don't know if he had a Kyokushin background.

00:22:53.000 I know he had a traditional martial arts background when he got into kickboxing.

00:22:58.000 See, he was a good example of a guy who made that transition well into MMA because he was so explosive.

00:23:03.000 Whereas there's other guys, like if you had a guy like Peter Ertz who wasn't as explosive, he was more of a technician and methodical, or Ernesto, Ernesto Hust.

00:23:14.000 They probably wouldn't have had the same sort of success in MMA as Mirko did.

00:23:20.000 Yeah, definitely.

00:23:20.000 Like, remember when Ernesto fought Bob Sapp?

00:23:23.000 Oh, he lost that one, didn't he?

00:23:25.000 Twice, he got stopped by him. 0.98

00:23:26.000 He couldn't keep him off of him, where Mirko fucking murked him. 0.58

00:23:31.000 If you're going to do that in MMA, a wrestler trying to grab hold of him, he's done money, do you know what I mean? 0.87

00:23:35.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:23:37.000 You need to have that...

00:23:38.000 Mirko had that explosiveness that those guys didn't have.

00:23:41.000 It's interesting how so many variables change what a fight is.

00:23:46.000 No gloves versus gloves.

00:23:48.000 Change is what a fight is.

00:23:49.000 Change is your ability to defend yourself.

00:23:51.000 And then whether or not there's takedowns or grappling.

00:23:56.000 That's one thing about kickboxing versus Muay Thai.

00:23:59.000 It's like people say, well, I like kickboxing because it's more action, because you can't clinch.

00:24:03.000 I'm like, yeah, but... 0.96

00:24:04.000 Yeah, but you're not going to get fucking elbowed straight and face.

00:24:06.000 Yeah, and the knees to the body, and from the clinch, and trying to escape from the clinch is an art in itself. 0.95

00:24:11.000 It depends who it is.

00:24:12.000 I mean, now that the generic Dutch style, like you have Carmen and Ernesto Hoos, now the Dutch style's changed, especially the Moroccans, the guy that's training Baddahari now, Saeed El-Badoui, different style altogether.

00:24:28.000 How so?

00:24:29.000 They use more leg kicks and throw knees up the middle. 0.91

00:24:32.000 They're really quick with knees now.

00:24:36.000 They'll hook you in the body and the right knee up your middle. 0.99

00:24:39.000 It's just a different angle.

00:24:41.000 It's like the attack with more of an eclectic mix of stuff.

00:24:46.000 This gentleman who's trained in Badr Hari, who has he trained before?

00:24:50.000 Ilyas Ballade, who's a fantastic fighter.

00:24:53.000 He's signed for Bellator.

00:24:54.000 He's from N-Fusion. 1.00

00:24:56.000 He trained Melvin for his last fight.

00:24:58.000 Melvin looked good in his last fight as well.

00:24:59.000 He did look good in his last fight.

00:25:00.000 A lot of people thought Melvin was done.

00:25:03.000 I really like him and he's a good guy as well.

00:25:05.000 He's from El Otmarni gym.

00:25:06.000 Nordin El Otmarni was a good coach as well.

00:25:08.000 He's got some good fighters.

00:25:09.000 But there's these kids that you don't get to see because of an infusion. 0.98

00:25:13.000 I work for, they have like an infusion talent, so I see all the new kids coming through, and they are fucking lethal, these Moroccans. 1.00

00:25:20.000 You've seen them, Nabeel Harouli, Tyson, you've seen him, you like him. 0.97

00:25:25.000 He's a wild group of people, those Dutch Moroccans. 0.89

00:25:29.000 They're dangerous. 0.93

00:25:32.000 It's so wild.

00:25:33.000 And that's like Badr Hari.

00:25:35.000 That's his whole deal.

00:25:37.000 He's just this wild, technical guy.

00:25:39.000 He's fighting Rico.

00:25:40.000 He's fighting Rico.

00:25:41.000 Rematch with Rico.

00:25:42.000 That's a tough fight for him.

00:25:43.000 Of course it is, yeah.

00:25:44.000 And Rico is so active.

00:25:46.000 For how long he's had out as well.

00:25:48.000 How long has he been out?

00:25:48.000 Two years?

00:25:49.000 Three years?

00:25:49.000 He's been out since...

00:25:51.000 Yeah, but Rico was calling bullshit. 0.92

00:25:53.000 Rico said he just wanted out of the fight. 0.51

00:25:55.000 When Rico was on the podcast, he's like, you look at him, he goes, he looks at one elbow, and then he changes his mind and looks at the other.

00:26:00.000 Yeah, I watched that.

00:26:01.000 Yeah, he said he wanted out.

00:26:02.000 He said he wanted out. 1.00

00:26:03.000 He was getting fucked up. 0.99

00:26:04.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:26:05.000 And he said he knew that I was tuning him up, you know?

00:26:07.000 And I don't know. 0.99

00:26:09.000 I mean, that's also Rico trying to fuck with him. 0.99

00:26:11.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:26:11.000 Getting his head. 1.00

00:26:12.000 100%.

00:26:12.000 But, yeah, it's like...

00:26:15.000 I would have loved to see Botter have a few fights and get real sharp.

00:26:19.000 He had like one, right?

00:26:21.000 Didn't he have one?

00:26:22.000 He fought Hedzie, right?

00:26:23.000 Yeah, he fought Hedzie Gerges, yeah.

00:26:26.000 Who else did he fight?

00:26:27.000 Did he fight one other person?

00:26:28.000 I think he fought Lontz.

00:26:31.000 Do me a favor and pull up Botter Harries.

00:26:33.000 He fought Lontz as well.

00:26:35.000 He didn't fight anybody else, just Hedzie?

00:26:37.000 Just Hedzie Gerges. 0.99

00:26:37.000 In glory, yeah, but he fought Lontz. 0.99

00:26:40.000 That was the last fight in Lontz since he did his stretch on holiday.

00:26:44.000 Mmm, so Hedzi, Rico, he hasn't fought since?

00:26:48.000 No, he fought before he fought.

00:26:50.000 Does that say he doesn't fought since?

00:26:52.000 Oh, that's Glory, bro.

00:26:53.000 Yeah, but in Glory, but he did fight Ishmael Lont.

00:26:57.000 Pull up his Wikipedia record.

00:26:59.000 His Wikipedia record, he's definitely had at least one fight since.

00:27:02.000 Yeah, Lont it was.

00:27:03.000 Yeah, I think he's had two.

00:27:05.000 Somewhere, I don't know.

00:27:06.000 I think he fought Hedzie again.

00:27:08.000 Did he fight Hedzie again?

00:27:09.000 Does that make sense?

00:27:10.000 He fought Hedzie.

00:27:11.000 The first time he fought him, I was commentating because he kicked him in the face, didn't he, on the floor.

00:27:14.000 That was a long time ago.

00:27:15.000 It was a long time ago and it's showtime.

00:27:17.000 Okay, what has he got?

00:27:18.000 Okay, so he did fight Hedzie.

00:27:19.000 Yeah, that he is.

00:27:20.000 Ishmael Lunt, yeah.

00:27:21.000 So, he had a no contest against Hedzie the last fight?

00:27:26.000 What is that?

00:27:27.000 It says decision unanimous.

00:27:30.000 Why does it say no contest?

00:27:32.000 Did someone test positive?

00:27:33.000 When did he kick him on the floor?

00:27:36.000 In the show timeline.

00:27:38.000 But look at this.

00:27:38.000 It says decision unanimous, but it says result no contest.

00:27:42.000 What the fuck is that? 0.99

00:27:43.000 In blue as well. 1.00

00:27:44.000 I've never seen that.

00:27:44.000 Can you click on that?

00:27:46.000 What does it say?

00:27:48.000 Oh, right, yeah.

00:27:49.000 Both fighters testing positive.

00:27:51.000 Let him go there.

00:27:52.000 Let him go.

00:27:54.000 Both fighters.

00:27:55.000 Why are you testing Badr Hari?

00:27:57.000 Just look at his Instagram.

00:27:58.000 That's enough.

00:27:59.000 You should just give him a suspension based on his Instagram.

00:28:02.000 Like, listen, bro.

00:28:03.000 He's jacked.

00:28:06.000 I mean, go to Badr Hari's Instagram.

00:28:09.000 He's about as shredded as, like, a professional fighter is ever.

00:28:13.000 Yeah, he's in ridiculous shape, isn't he?

00:28:14.000 So with this Rico fight, are they going to test him? 0.53

00:28:17.000 I wonder.

00:28:20.000 Shredded!

00:28:22.000 Shredded!

00:28:24.000 Yeah, I mean, he's obviously in incredible physical condition, but the thing, like, look at him. 1.00

00:28:29.000 Dude, look at that fucking picture. 1.00

00:28:30.000 Get the fuck out of here, man! 1.00

00:28:32.000 Come on, son. 1.00

00:28:33.000 He's on all the Mexican supplements.

00:28:36.000 All of them.

00:28:37.000 He should be wearing a sombrero in that picture.

00:28:42.000 Looking good, Botter.

00:28:44.000 I'm really excited about that fight.

00:28:45.000 Please don't test them.

00:28:46.000 I think it's in December.

00:28:47.000 I think it's December 12th.

00:28:49.000 Please don't test them.

00:28:50.000 Just stop, Glory. 1.00

00:28:51.000 Stop testing people.

00:28:52.000 Let it go.

00:28:53.000 Let it go.

00:28:54.000 But Saeed is a good coach.

00:28:56.000 And he's some really good coaches in Holland.

00:28:59.000 Osama El-Gaoui.

00:29:02.000 Really good coaches, man.

00:29:04.000 And it's just different pad style.

00:29:06.000 Old Dutch style was right hand to the head, left up to the body, leg kick, left up, leg kick, high kick.

00:29:11.000 Leg kick, high kick, but these guys are really intricate.

00:29:15.000 These guys now are all like pro boxers who've been taught a few kicks and knees. 0.98

00:29:18.000 They're fucking that good with their hands. 0.97

00:29:20.000 Yeah, they're amazing with their hands. 1.00

00:29:21.000 Do you think that that is the way to go?

00:29:24.000 But look at the success that a lot of the Thai guys have had in Glory.

00:29:28.000 Yeah, they have, yeah.

00:29:29.000 You know, I mean...

00:29:33.000 I think it's because a lot of the time, when they have a class, they all train the same.

00:29:39.000 I think they lead off the lead hand a lot, and I think it's very difficult with a Southpaw heavy kicker tie who can step off.

00:29:46.000 So do you think it's a Southpaw issue?

00:29:48.000 Honestly, I think Southpaw's style is a completely different game altogether.

00:29:54.000 For sure, but what about when it's Southpaw or Southpaw?

00:29:56.000 I think what the ties are good at is a lot of the Dutch fighters, they fight in rhythms, so it's like they're bouncing with their feet in and out, in and out, and then they explode into the combination.

00:30:06.000 Fighters like City Chai and Superbon and guys like that, they're so good at breaking your rhythm and timing, little off-balancing stuff.

00:30:11.000 Keeps putting them out of their rhythm, then they're scoring with their shots, stepping off and stuff like that.

00:30:15.000 They're so good, even something like a little teet at front leg, they'll just stop them subtly for a minute.

00:30:19.000 They'll kick them hard, score, and they'll move, and they're always having to reset themselves, which I don't think the Dutch are used to, really, because when they're fighting other Dutch or Moroccans, they're just standing in front of each other. 0.92

00:30:28.000 You go, I go, you go, I go, and they're just having a complete war.

00:30:30.000 Something subtle like that, what the ties are doing, they're just breaking their rhythm, and they're able to score.

00:30:35.000 The trouble is as well, though, there's a flip side to it because a lot of ties start very slowly.

00:30:40.000 You can't do that with these kids.

00:30:41.000 Because these Moroccans fight like you've nicked something off them, don't they? 1.00

00:30:44.000 They fight every week as well.

00:30:45.000 They get to like 23 of that 100 fights. 0.99

00:30:46.000 And the sparring's just fucking... 0.97

00:30:52.000 We've seen that with so many I think there's a different sort of, I think they have a more ingrained, especially the Moroccans, they have a more ingrained sort of, they refuse to lose anything even. 0.99

00:31:18.000 I think it's sort of a massive pride thing.

00:31:19.000 But the problem is, like, they love fighting, right? 0.90

00:31:22.000 Well, you're fucking yourself over and you're going to limit your ability to fight for long periods of time. 0.96

00:31:28.000 I've done that. 0.99

00:31:29.000 The older I've got, I've changed my training.

00:31:31.000 We used to spar hard.

00:31:32.000 Quite a lot of bad company.

00:31:33.000 We don't do that.

00:31:34.000 Well, I don't myself.

00:31:35.000 Maybe once a week, headguards on, just hard boxing sparring, but I don't do any hard kick sparring at all anymore.

00:31:42.000 Really?

00:31:43.000 No.

00:31:43.000 How come?

00:31:44.000 I just don't want to save myself.

00:31:45.000 I don't want to injure myself.

00:31:46.000 Is it knees?

00:31:46.000 You're worried about your knees?

00:31:47.000 Yeah, a little bit.

00:31:48.000 And even just picking up knocks now, the older I've got, it's harder to check off.

00:31:51.000 I don't think I need to do any hard kick sparring now.

00:31:53.000 I can play sparring.

00:31:54.000 It still gets my eyes working.

00:31:55.000 working as long as I've done some good boxing sparring, hard boxing sparring with the head guards on with James France who is one of our top fighters and he's a really good boxer.

00:32:03.000 If I can hold my own with him I know I'm ready to fight.

00:32:07.000 What is the difference in the amount of damage you take with hard kick sparring versus hard The thing is, when you start going hard in sparring, especially with how competitive we all are at my gym, because lots of top-level fighters start going hard, and the tighter you get, so you get to around 6, 7, you miss a kick, you kick an elbow, you kick a knee, you do stupid shit, then you've hurt your foot, and then bang knees, you've class knees, and stuff like that.

00:32:30.000 When I was younger, I could just check them injuries off, it doesn't matter, I'll just spar again tomorrow.

00:32:33.000 But the older I've got, I don't want to even put myself in a position where I need to do that.

00:32:37.000 I don't feel like I need to anymore.

00:32:38.000 Anyway, I've worked out that play sparring, like...

00:32:41.000 Not like 50% sparring.

00:32:43.000 He's just as good.

00:32:43.000 He still gets his eyes working.

00:32:44.000 He's still doing all the same things.

00:32:46.000 Just not getting hurt.

00:32:47.000 Well, the Thais really have that down. 0.98

00:32:49.000 Yeah, they do.

00:32:49.000 It's such a wise thing that they learned.

00:32:52.000 And when you see guys like San Chai, when he's sparring, it's like he's just slapping.

00:32:57.000 Well, when I go to Thailand, I train with him at the same gym.

00:33:01.000 And that's all I need.

00:33:02.000 As soon as I get there, he'll call me in the ring.

00:33:03.000 No shin pads to play a spa. 1.00

00:33:05.000 He'll fucking humiliate me. 0.99

00:33:06.000 But I learn so much in about... 0.99

00:33:08.000 Three minutes off him and stuff like that.

00:33:09.000 Play to learn, don't they?

00:33:10.000 The thing is, do that as well. 0.99

00:33:11.000 The Cubans, when they box, they don't punch fuck out of each other either. 0.94

00:33:14.000 Well, that's also jiu-jitsu. 0.90

00:33:16.000 I mean, Henner Gracie, his whole thing was always keep it playful.

00:33:19.000 He would tell people, you want to learn jiu-jitsu, want to get really good, be playful. 1.00

00:33:23.000 Don't be fucking stupid. 1.00

00:33:26.000 Flow! 1.00

00:33:27.000 You get caught, you get caught.

00:33:28.000 It's play.

00:33:29.000 You're playing a game.

00:33:30.000 If you're playing basketball and someone scores in you, it's not the end of the world.

00:33:33.000 Exactly.

00:33:33.000 You know, a ball goes in the...

00:33:34.000 You don't get to your knees and start crying.

00:33:38.000 But if you get caught in an arm bar, it's like your life is over.

00:33:41.000 It's not.

00:33:42.000 You got caught.

00:33:43.000 You know, if you don't think the guy who you're sparring with can catch you, you're sparring with the wrong people.

00:33:49.000 Yeah, 100%. 0.74

00:33:49.000 You know, if you're fucking tapping everybody, either you're Hicks and Gracie, and you're just so good, you're better than everybody else, or you're sparring Yeah, that's a wise thing, man. 0.74

00:34:17.000 It's wise, and I really wish more young fighters would appreciate that early in their career because I think so many of them are compromised by the time they get to the big leagues. 0.91

00:34:25.000 You know, by the time they get to Bellator or MMA with UFC or, you know, even kickboxing guys, by the time they get to big fights, they've already been dinged up too much.

00:34:34.000 They can't take a shot anymore.

00:34:36.000 Yeah, 100%.

00:34:36.000 I've seen that load recently as well.

00:34:38.000 Like, fighters who are like 27, 28 should be just starting the prime now for the next four or five years, and they're already punchy as fuck. 0.98

00:34:44.000 Do you know what I mean? 0.89

00:34:44.000 I think you said an interesting thing. 0.89

00:34:45.000 Sorry.

00:34:46.000 Usyk.

00:34:47.000 Alexander Usek.

00:34:48.000 Yes.

00:34:49.000 You know I'm boring and I'm always watching fights, even if it's in Russian and reading the subtitles.

00:34:56.000 You're saying he's boring?

00:34:57.000 No, I'm boring.

00:34:58.000 I just sit there watching fights all the time.

00:35:00.000 That's just what I do.

00:35:01.000 But there's a video of Usek and he was saying about now people aren't moving their feet.

00:35:07.000 He said, you watch the American Styles and the British, they're all like doing this and the Philly Shell and stuff like that.

00:35:13.000 They're not moving their feet anymore, which I found was really interesting because if you look, their footwork is so superior to a lot of people.

00:35:20.000 Him and Lomar.

00:35:21.000 When he fought Tony Bell, you put up a great performance against him, but he just put him in a position and at the end of it, he was fucked. 0.98

00:35:28.000 Yeah, not many people realised what he'd actually done either as well. 0.98

00:35:30.000 He'd put him there and they were waiting and waiting and waiting and when they got him there, he knew he couldn't get out and bang!

00:35:35.000 It would have been amazing if we got a chance to see Floyd vs.

00:35:38.000 Loma when Floyd was in his prime.

00:35:40.000 That would have been fucking incredible to see which style is superior.

00:35:44.000 Because Floyd would move towards you like this. 0.96

00:35:46.000 He would just get right up on you.

00:35:48.000 And he'll be trying to move on the back of him.

00:35:50.000 It would have been amazing.

00:35:51.000 I think it was when you said he was talking to someone where...

00:35:55.000 He was Mayweather, Pretty Boy Floyd and Money Mayweather.

00:36:00.000 It's like two different fighters really.

00:36:02.000 Because Money Mayweather, Pretty Boy Floyd was more on his feet, sharper on his feet.

00:36:08.000 More aggressive.

00:36:08.000 Yeah, more aggressive as well.

00:36:10.000 Especially with them right hands when he fought Philipp N. Doing it with like six right hands.

00:36:14.000 Yeah, and what he did to Gatti and stuff like that.

00:36:15.000 He went right up to the body with the right hand.

00:36:18.000 That was a horrific massacre. 0.99

00:36:20.000 I remember watching that, I was only young as well, when I watched that, I remember thinking, fucking hell, he's bad, yeah. 0.99

00:36:25.000 He was executing him. 0.99

00:36:27.000 No business being in the ring with him.

00:36:30.000 We'll just show you how good Floyd really is.

00:36:34.000 People just, because of the fact that he's won decisions by playing it safe, people just don't get excited about him and they recognize him with the all-time greats, he's the best ever.

00:36:45.000 He really is.

00:36:46.000 Look what he did with Canelo.

00:36:47.000 He absolutely schooled him.

00:36:49.000 Shut him down.

00:36:51.000 Absolutely.

00:36:52.000 Changed Canelo's style.

00:36:53.000 Yeah, he did.

00:36:53.000 You look at the way Canelo fight Daniel Jacobs.

00:36:56.000 Fucking so much head movement and so elusive now. 0.98

00:36:59.000 He learned. 0.99

00:37:01.000 What do you think about Canelo going up and fighting Kovalev?

00:37:04.000 Kind of crazy.

00:37:05.000 Kovalev's big, man.

00:37:06.000 So big.

00:37:07.000 I don't think I'm rubbish at predicting fights.

00:37:11.000 I am. 0.99

00:37:11.000 You're rubbish at predicting fights. 0.99

00:37:13.000 For Americans, that means he's not good. 0.99

00:37:16.000 Sorry, I'm terrible about that. 1.00

00:37:17.000 He's rubbish. 0.98

00:37:19.000 No, I'm really bad at predicting fights. 0.99

00:37:22.000 We have a boxing group on WhatsApp, the boxing team it's called.

00:37:25.000 And I always get it wrong.

00:37:27.000 You guys use WhatsApp. 0.99

00:37:28.000 That is such a fucking British thing. 0.99

00:37:30.000 No one in America uses WhatsApp. 0.99

00:37:32.000 We have groups. 0.90

00:37:33.000 No one knows what the fuck that is. 0.97

00:37:35.000 And I think... 0.98

00:37:37.000 I think the key for Kovalev is his jab.

00:37:40.000 I think the thing is everyone thinks that he's easy to hit to the body.

00:37:44.000 But Andre Ward was amazing.

00:37:48.000 And slipping underneath that jab, he was so good at that.

00:37:51.000 He's just a king amongst normal people.

00:37:54.000 But he was tested in his last fight.

00:37:56.000 What's that dude's name?

00:37:57.000 Anthony Yard.

00:37:58.000 In round eight, he was gone in round eight.

00:38:00.000 He did well to recover from that, to be fair. 0.99

00:38:02.000 He got a fucking tag in round eight. 0.98

00:38:03.000 I mean, it looked bad. 0.99

00:38:04.000 It looked like he was a couple punches away from being stopped.

00:38:07.000 Saved by Belly, 20 more seconds he might have gone.

00:38:10.000 I think you're getting him at the right time.

00:38:12.000 But Kovalev's still in it with his jab.

00:38:14.000 He's better now with Buddy McGirt because he beat Alvarez after that.

00:38:18.000 He got lost to Alvarez and he fought Alvarez again and he looked great.

00:38:21.000 But against Yard, young, eight round eight.

00:38:25.000 Yard is massive as well compared to Canelo.

00:38:27.000 And Yard didn't have enough experience here.

00:38:29.000 That's really what it is.

00:38:31.000 In 18 fights, 18 knockouts, just white floor with everyone, never been in that deep water, never been at world level, and he put in a good account of himself, but like... 0.99

00:38:39.000 He'll be dangerous as fuck after that fight. 0.93

00:38:42.000 He's going to learn from that experience and understand, like, wow, his conditioning is probably a little off. 0.99

00:38:47.000 Maybe he needs to lose a little bit of muscle mass, maybe he needs to put in more running, but goddamn he's good. 0.98

00:38:53.000 He's scary. 0.99

00:38:54.000 Powerful kid.

00:38:55.000 Yeah.

00:38:56.000 Really powerful.

00:38:57.000 Very powerful.

00:38:57.000 You know, I mean, even Crusher said it afterwards, he's like, this guy's a future champion, for sure.

00:39:02.000 And I felt sorry for his coach, because his coach is not, you know, a lot of people, they find him unsavory in many ways, because of what he says and stuff, because he said a few things about, he said his skill level was better than Andre Ward's, which is nonsense, no way.

00:39:14.000 He said yard skill levels better than Andre?

00:39:16.000 Yeah, he did.

00:39:16.000 He said that.

00:39:16.000 Ward was like, there's a bit of back and two between them.

00:39:20.000 But I do think it's a little bit unfair that he got so much shit. 0.99

00:39:25.000 But then again, if you say stuff, people are going to hear it and want to give it your back. 0.99

00:39:27.000 Yeah, true.

00:39:28.000 But I think yards, yeah, definitely a future champion.

00:39:31.000 But it's a hard division.

00:39:33.000 Oh, yeah, man.

00:39:33.000 Baturviev, what's the other guy called?

00:39:35.000 He's another Russian, and they're fighting in a unification fight soon.

00:39:39.000 It's all Russian.

00:39:40.000 Yeah, it's a Russian division.

00:39:41.000 I mean, I had Andre Ward on, and we were talking about it.

00:39:43.000 Look at the... 1.00

00:39:44.000 It's fucking Russian. 1.00

00:39:46.000 It's crazy. 1.00

00:39:47.000 And then Yusek is going up to...

00:39:49.000 Heavyweight.

00:39:50.000 He's fighting Tyron Spong.

00:39:52.000 Very interesting.

00:39:54.000 Very interesting.

00:39:55.000 That's a big step up for Spong.

00:39:57.000 Yeah, he's going to be a bit too smart, I reckon, Yusek, but Spong won't be afraid to...

00:40:00.000 Throw it down, will he?

00:40:02.000 He's dangerous.

00:40:03.000 Yeah, if you touch him, you can bank at him.

00:40:06.000 Left hook especially.

00:40:07.000 I think he's a left on the door.

00:40:08.000 He won't be afraid to go at him either.

00:40:10.000 He won his last fight by split decision, though, in Suriname.

00:40:15.000 I don't know who he fought.

00:40:17.000 I think he fought again.

00:40:19.000 Tyrone did?

00:40:20.000 Yeah, only a couple of weeks ago.

00:40:21.000 Yeah?

00:40:21.000 Yeah, because I think it was based on...

00:40:25.000 Because I messaged you, and I was saying, I've heard it's Tyrone Spong, and then I think he...

00:40:29.000 Had another fight to keep sharp.

00:40:31.000 Yeah, but I think...

00:40:33.000 I like Tyrone.

00:40:34.000 I remember years ago at Showtime, Tyrone was saying that he said, hey man, I want to fight this David Hay.

00:40:41.000 I fight him, no problem.

00:40:43.000 I don't think the Dutch really have got much respect for boxers because every year the kickboxers and the boxers fight.

00:40:50.000 Do they?

00:40:51.000 Yeah.

00:40:51.000 I never knew that.

00:40:52.000 Once a year they fight and the kickboxers always win.

00:40:55.000 Really?

00:40:55.000 Yeah, they fight boxing rules and the boxers lose.

00:40:59.000 That's what I was saying about it before, the kickboxers there now are pro boxers who've been showing some kicks in these, basically.

00:41:05.000 And they can fight at South Porn Orthodoxy.

00:41:07.000 It's not from that big.

00:41:09.000 They just chuck stuff about.

00:41:10.000 I'm sorry, I've got to make a text that I forgot about.

00:41:14.000 *mwah* Thank you.

00:41:17.000 Don't.

00:41:17.000 Keep talking.

00:41:20.000 Anyway, about me, buddy.

00:41:22.000 I'm thinking that with Tyron Spong, what's interesting is that, you know, he had this really big career as a kickboxer.

00:41:30.000 He was one of the best.

00:41:31.000 And he has that fight with Gokhan Saki and snaps his knee and his leg in half.

00:41:34.000 The worst thing I've ever seen.

00:41:35.000 It still gives me nightmares.

00:41:37.000 I've seen that in person twice.

00:41:39.000 Yeah, so have I. Anderson and there was another gentleman, Corey Hill.

00:41:44.000 Was it Corey Hill?

00:41:45.000 I think it was Corey Hill. 0.99

00:41:47.000 It's just a rough fucking break, man. 0.98

00:41:50.000 That's a terrible injury because then you're always going to be thinking about that when you throw it. 0.99

00:41:54.000 Yeah, 100%.

00:41:55.000 And then they also say that when you have those metal plates, like Paige Van Zandt is dealing with that.

00:42:00.000 The area where the metal meets the bone, sometimes it compromises that bone.

00:42:05.000 And so it snaps.

00:42:08.000 It's like she's had, I think, three different surgeries on her forearm. 0.99

00:42:12.000 She broke her forearm throwing a spinning back fist Fucking hell. 1.00

00:42:16.000 That's the way Paul Felder broke his too. 0.98

00:42:19.000 He threw it and you know, you land like this, like with your forearm instead of your fist, you know, and just your arm snaps.

00:42:27.000 I think what happens to Savas, Michael Savas?

00:42:29.000 Oh, he got, he fought in one and he fought Lursula and he got his leg caught and he lifted him up and swept him and he tried to put his hand down and his elbow dislocated and like twisted the other way.

00:42:39.000 Horrendous.

00:42:40.000 He's a good kid, isn't he?

00:42:40.000 Yeah, he's a great fighter, but he's back home in Cyprus now, recuperating.

00:42:45.000 It's a shame that as well, because the kid's 20 years old.

00:42:47.000 He's a massive star in Thailand.

00:42:49.000 They were going to give him a stadium title shot.

00:42:51.000 He's just making a name for himself on one. 0.96

00:42:53.000 He'd smashed his first fight, so I think they were in line for a one title shot as well, which is fucking big money when you're going to be 20 years old. 0.84

00:42:59.000 And then that happened to him, so...

00:43:01.000 Is it the elbow joint though?

00:43:02.000 Is it just the joint?

00:43:03.000 I'm not sure.

00:43:04.000 I've not spoke to him for a while yet.

00:43:06.000 I spoke to him a long back and he was in rehab doing some really light exercises trying to get back.

00:43:11.000 But it looked like in the fight itself...

00:43:13.000 Yeah, it's got like a frame thing on it.

00:43:14.000 Yeah, it looked like the elbow...

00:43:15.000 His arm was like...

00:43:16.000 Twisted around.

00:43:17.000 It was horrendous.

00:43:18.000 Dude, I was in Utah recently.

00:43:19.000 I was in Park City and my family and I were driving down the street.

00:43:23.000 We saw this lady fall down on her bike. 1.00

00:43:25.000 She was on the other side of the street and she was crossing and something happened.

00:43:29.000 She slipped and she fell and she was just yelling for help and so we looped around. 0.90

00:43:36.000 I parked the car, I get out, and her fucking elbow was like, the bone went like this, and the elbow went like that, and I'm like, stop moving. 0.95

00:43:45.000 What are you meant to do there? 1.00

00:43:47.000 She can't do shit. 0.99

00:43:48.000 They were like, let's take your backpack off. 1.00

00:43:51.000 I'm like, don't touch her.

00:43:52.000 Don't touch her backpack.

00:43:53.000 I'm like, grab my hand.

00:43:54.000 I'm going to help you up.

00:43:55.000 We're not going to move your arm.

00:43:56.000 Your arm is broken.

00:43:57.000 I've never had a broken bone.

00:43:58.000 She was freaking out.

00:43:59.000 She was 50. Never had a broken bone.

00:44:01.000 Never had a broken bone.

00:44:02.000 Like, you know, the lucky thing for her, the cops were there. 0.71

00:44:05.000 But it's like, seeing you're a bone of a person that's just clearly snapped, and seeing the elbow just kind of hanging loose, it makes you realize how fucking fragile we are. 0.99

00:44:14.000 When I used to play football, soccer, I've seen it all the time, you know, like, in 50-50 challenges where you used to, and you think, oh, someone's brought the leg there, and you don't look, but then you do look, oh, fucking hell. 0.99

00:44:25.000 Yeah, it's bad, man. 0.93

00:44:26.000 It's just, we're so fragile, but then you think about, look, what we enjoy.

00:44:30.000 We enjoy sports that are designed to break your fragile body. 0.99

00:44:38.000 Like that fucking thing with Mirko and Heath Herring. 0.99

00:44:42.000 Who would ever engage in an activity where that's possible? 1.00

00:44:46.000 Where someone can do that to your ribcage and, ah! 1.00

00:44:49.000 We're not meant for shit like that, but we find the way to fucking persevere. 0.99

00:44:53.000 And then you rewind it and watch it again. 0.99

00:44:55.000 That is weird, right?

00:44:57.000 The enjoyment of watching someone get smashed.

00:45:00.000 Rewind that, put it back. 0.99

00:45:01.000 God damn, it's so enjoyable. 0.99

00:45:04.000 It is. 0.99

00:45:05.000 It's the most fun.

00:45:06.000 It is enjoyable when you're in there actually doing it.

00:45:09.000 I've had the most fun in some fights that I've lost as well.

00:45:12.000 Even when I've lost and I've been getting hurt myself, I've had some of the most fun in those fights.

00:45:16.000 They've been some of the best fights that I'll take away with me.

00:45:19.000 The second time I fought Sanchai, we absolutely battered each other that fight.

00:45:23.000 I cut him really bad with an elbow and he hit me with a body shot in round three.

00:45:26.000 And I remember thinking, oh my god, I didn't think he could punch that hard.

00:45:29.000 And I was just...

00:45:30.000 I took about four more in a row and I thought, I'm going to have to take a knee, yeah? 0.99

00:45:33.000 And then he ran in to do it again and I elbowed him and then cut him and I thought, fucking hell, this is amazing. 0.99

00:45:37.000 Now, I remember at the time thinking, this is fucking amazing. 0.99

00:45:40.000 Like, looking at him and he was bleeding. 0.99

00:45:41.000 I couldn't breathe and I remember thinking, fucking yes! 0.99

00:45:46.000 Well, that's why people love you. 1.00

00:45:48.000 Because you have that sort of lust for combat.

00:45:52.000 You either have that or you do not.

00:45:55.000 Some people, they look for a way out, and some people look for a way in.

00:45:59.000 That really is the difference between people who, win, lose, or draw, love a real epic scrap.

00:46:07.000 And I think that towards this end of my career now, When I was younger, a few times I'd gone back foot and try and point score and not get hurt and stuff like that.

00:46:16.000 Now I'm just seeing it as I'm an entertainer now, do you know what I mean? 0.94

00:46:19.000 People pay their hard money, they go out and work, and if they're buying a ticket to come watch me fight, they're going to get a fucking fight, do you know what I mean?

00:46:24.000 Win, lose or draw, I will go out on my shield and I'll give them what they want to see. 0.71

00:46:28.000 That's how I look at it now.

00:46:29.000 And even my last couple of fights, Vinny said, don't fight like that.

00:46:32.000 And I'm like, you know I'm going to.

00:46:34.000 And you know I'm going to enjoy it.

00:46:35.000 You know, you go through all these things and he comes and trains at the boxing club right near my house.

00:46:40.000 Four Corners.

00:46:40.000 John does great work.

00:46:41.000 Have you done it?

00:46:41.000 John Gilley's down there.

00:46:42.000 And he's like, yeah, I've got him to slip and he's doing all this and he looks great on the pads.

00:46:46.000 And he just goes...

00:46:49.000 You know, it's interesting.

00:46:51.000 I wonder how many fighters' careers could be extended if they took a different approach to the way they recuperated between fights.

00:47:01.000 Because I think so many fighters, they'll have a fight, they recuperate a little bit, and then they have another fight, and they recuperate a little bit.

00:47:06.000 And there's a lot of benefit to that in terms of your timing.

00:47:10.000 And then your relaxation inside the ring because you're so used to competing.

00:47:14.000 It's like you get that moment.

00:47:15.000 But then your body, I feel, gets compromised after a while.

00:47:18.000 You see, like, they're throwing punches different.

00:47:21.000 There's not a lot of fluidity to it.

00:47:24.000 You wonder, like, if they did a lot of physical rehab or preparation in terms of, like, weightlifting and stretching and yoga and maybe even Pilates and chin-ups and push-ups and just strengthens their body more.

00:47:36.000 And, you know, it's like...

00:47:38.000 Everyone's concentrating on fighting techniques.

00:47:40.000 It's fighting techniques, sparring, getting in condition, making the weight.

00:47:45.000 But physical training is not...

00:47:47.000 I've only just realized this now towards back end of my career and stuff as well.

00:47:50.000 That's why all ties, a lot of them are retired by the time they're 25, 26. Yeah.

00:47:54.000 I've had two, 300 fights.

00:47:55.000 The bodies are just ruined.

00:47:57.000 Yeah.

00:47:57.000 And none of them are...

00:47:58.000 When I lived there, no one did strength and conditioning, S&T. That wasn't even a thing there.

00:48:03.000 Now, all the gyms, especially the mainstream gyms, are bringing an S&C coach in.

00:48:08.000 A lot of them are doing a lot more stretching and stuff like that.

00:48:10.000 And they're all getting smart about it now.

00:48:12.000 That's why TIE fighters now are getting into the 30s and they're all lasting longer.

00:48:16.000 We'll get Sanchai.

00:48:17.000 Sanchai's 40 now, 39, 40. And he's the best.

00:48:20.000 He's still five twice a week.

00:48:23.000 Twice a month, sorry.

00:48:23.000 Twice a month.

00:48:25.000 Destroying everyone.

00:48:26.000 I know, he was like, and he's smiling.

00:48:27.000 He puts it on his Instagram page.

00:48:29.000 I fight tonight.

00:48:30.000 Like, knuckles, dynamite, emojis.

00:48:34.000 And then, you know, afterwards, big smile.

00:48:37.000 You know, I won. 1.00

00:48:38.000 Of course you won, bitch. 1.00

00:48:39.000 You always fucking win. 1.00

00:48:41.000 He didn't beat Warren, did he, at Scissor Paper Stone? 0.99

00:48:44.000 Oh my god, mate, in Italy.

00:48:46.000 What's that?

00:48:46.000 We got a friend called Warren Brown.

00:48:48.000 He's an actor.

00:48:49.000 He was a two-time world Muay Thai champion himself.

00:48:52.000 And we played Scissor Paper Stone at the after party at Yokau when Sanchai fought.

00:48:58.000 And Warren beat him.

00:49:00.000 The thing is though, the one having a stick of beer.

00:49:02.000 Wait a minute, he beat him in rock, paper, scissors?

00:49:03.000 But I don't think we're talking about that, Vinny. 0.99

00:49:05.000 That doesn't mean jack shit. 0.97

00:49:07.000 Yes, but he's still working. 0.97

00:49:08.000 Me and Sanchai fought on that show that night.

00:49:10.000 So we went to the after party.

00:49:12.000 If you lose, you've got to take a shot of your beer or whatever.

00:49:14.000 But they didn't have beer. 1.00

00:49:15.000 They had fucking wine. 1.00

00:49:16.000 So they were drinking pints of wine. 1.00

00:49:18.000 Mate, you should have seen it.

00:49:20.000 Why didn't they have beer?

00:49:21.000 Where were you?

00:49:22.000 Italy.

00:49:23.000 In Italy, they didn't have beer?

00:49:24.000 I think we ran out. 0.99

00:49:25.000 At that time, the fucking after party had finished. 0.99

00:49:27.000 All the Thai fighters there, we'd all drank them out. 1.00

00:49:30.000 And then all we had left were wine.

00:49:31.000 So they're playing...

00:49:32.000 Kickboxing is big there, too, right?

00:49:34.000 Yes.

00:49:34.000 I mean, you know, obviously, Giorgio Petrosian, he's probably the most popular guy ever from Italy.

00:49:42.000 Yeah, definitely.

00:49:44.000 He's still doing big fees.

00:49:45.000 He's fighting for a million dollars next month on one championship.

00:49:48.000 Is he really?

00:49:48.000 Yeah, we're in the 170-kilo tournament.

00:49:51.000 He's fighting...

00:49:51.000 What do you think about that fight where he lost and they reversed the decision?

00:49:55.000 What do you think about that?

00:49:56.000 We're split with this.

00:49:57.000 Liam thinks Giorgio lost.

00:50:00.000 I think he won.

00:50:01.000 I mean, because of the punching and because of the scoring where you're not allowed to clinch that long.

00:50:07.000 I think it's very unfair, though, that if you lose, you lose.

00:50:11.000 And that's it.

00:50:12.000 I don't think it should have been reversed.

00:50:13.000 Well, I watched the thing where they were saying that he clinched too long.

00:50:15.000 I didn't see it.

00:50:16.000 No, no.

00:50:17.000 It seemed like a normal fight to me.

00:50:19.000 Yeah, but I still think he landed more punches, but nevertheless, that's open to conjecture, but I honestly think they shouldn't have reversed that.

00:50:25.000 I felt sorry for the tie.

00:50:27.000 And then they fought again, and Georgia won a pretty clear decision.

00:50:32.000 What do you think was the adjustment?

00:50:33.000 Leg kicks.

00:50:34.000 Yeah, he did.

00:50:35.000 The first thing he started, the first 10 seconds, he smashed his leg with about three solid kicks straight away and obviously when your leg's starting to go a little bit, the rest of your game's going out a window as well.

00:50:45.000 It was interesting with Giorgio though because he was really jumping in with his right hook.

00:50:49.000 So he obviously wanted it, he's obviously wound up about it as well.

00:50:53.000 I've never seen him aggressive like that.

00:50:55.000 I've never seen him like that before now because he's not only clinical, isn't he?

00:50:57.000 I think he probably realized that there was a lot of stink on the first fight being reversed, too.

00:51:04.000 I mean, he put it to bed with the second fight.

00:51:08.000 But when you're Giorgio Petrosian, you really kind of have this...

00:51:12.000 I mean, the one knockout that he lost in glory to Risti. 0.98

00:51:16.000 Risti just hit so fucking hard, man. 0.97

00:51:19.000 But that was very shocking. 0.98

00:51:20.000 Yeah.

00:51:21.000 You know, it took a while for him to rebound from that, right?

00:51:24.000 He didn't fight for a long time.

00:51:25.000 He didn't see that, even like Liam was saying about the long guard.

00:51:27.000 If you watch, he got caught with an uppercut.

00:51:29.000 He put his arms out of the long guard.

00:51:31.000 But I know that his hand was fractured in that as well.

00:51:34.000 His chin wasn't, but you know.

00:51:35.000 His hand was fractured going into that fight.

00:51:37.000 He always fractured.

00:51:38.000 He's had ten operations on his hand.

00:51:40.000 Oh my God.

00:51:40.000 Ten.

00:51:40.000 You should see scars all over it when you see it.

00:51:42.000 It's so bad.

00:51:43.000 Oh my God. 0.99

00:51:44.000 But once they put the bolts in there and the fucking plates, doesn't it just strengthen up? 0.99

00:51:50.000 Still kept going? 0.99

00:51:51.000 I thought that.

00:51:52.000 How's yours?

00:51:52.000 Mine's fine.

00:51:53.000 I've got to play it there.

00:51:54.000 Mine's stronger than this one.

00:51:56.000 When I broke this one before, I broke this probably three or four times, and twice we're in Thailand and I didn't go to hospital because I just didn't trust what they'd do with it. 0.99

00:52:02.000 I just fucking let it heal like an idiot. 0.94

00:52:04.000 So now I've got this big, like, claw that I can't even... 1.00

00:52:06.000 Oh, so it was broken and you never even went to a doctor?

00:52:09.000 I never went.

00:52:09.000 I just iced it and then left it.

00:52:10.000 Oh, no.

00:52:10.000 Yeah, so this one, I broke it and I went straight to hospital, play it in, stronger than ever.

00:52:14.000 This one's just all, like, you can see a big lump on it and stuff.

00:52:17.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:52:17.000 It's fucked. 1.00

00:52:18.000 And it still hurts when you punch people? 1.00

00:52:19.000 All the time, yeah.

00:52:20.000 I just have to get on with it in training and stuff.

00:52:22.000 I would imagine if it's probably jagged in there, right?

00:52:25.000 Yeah, it's got like a big ganglion on it and stuff like that.

00:52:28.000 I try and take lots of CBD, turmeric, stuff like that, inflammation and stuff like that.

00:52:32.000 Does it help?

00:52:32.000 A little bit, but it's just one of them things.

00:52:34.000 Yeah, but you don't tap anything, do you?

00:52:36.000 You know, if you hold pads for him, he doesn't tap anything.

00:52:38.000 Everything's like, bang, bang, bang.

00:52:40.000 Everything's screaming.

00:52:41.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:52:43.000 It's very exciting.

00:52:44.000 It's very exciting to watch.

00:52:46.000 But I always wonder about your joints.

00:52:48.000 I'm like, Jesus Christ, his shoulders.

00:52:50.000 Everything's like...

00:52:50.000 It's like so much torque.

00:52:55.000 But that's the thing about strength and conditioning that I wonder.

00:52:59.000 how many guys are overusing their body by just continuing to throw, you know, like full power kicks, full power punches at the pads, at the bag, you know, and sparring.

00:53:11.000 Whereas like maybe you could extend your career and maybe your body would work more efficiently if you had like a really good strength and conditioning coach who actually understands combat sports and the rigors.

00:53:24.000 Well, the one I use in Leeds, Steve Campbell now, he recently, well, because he's training a lot of fighters, he took himself off on a strength and conditioning coach.

00:53:32.000 It's a fight seminar, so he's learnt a lot more about that now.

00:53:35.000 I've got another one as well, Dan Mitton, who Vinnie uses.

00:53:38.000 He's more of a movement and agility coach.

00:53:41.000 Doing stuff with him has been fucking amazing, like shoulders, hips, everything like that.

00:53:46.000 It's a real art to it. 0.81

00:53:47.000 I train with Dan.

00:53:50.000 Twice a week, sometimes for two hours in the session.

00:53:53.000 I do a lot of gymnastic rings now because of my hip.

00:53:55.000 I can't run or do much like that.

00:53:57.000 Can't they fix your hip? 1.00

00:53:59.000 Isn't there something they can do about it?

00:54:00.000 It's a very, very slow process, so it's going to take a while.

00:54:06.000 It's weird because I can't...

00:54:08.000 I seem to get it into my head out to run.

00:54:10.000 Because I've learnt to walk in such a different way.

00:54:13.000 Because your one leg is shorter.

00:54:14.000 Because your long leg is shorter.

00:54:15.000 Maybe you're probably better off doing something that's low impact.

00:54:19.000 Have you seen that zero runner thing that I have out there?

00:54:21.000 No.

00:54:22.000 It's very interesting.

00:54:23.000 It's weird.

00:54:24.000 You've got to learn the gait of it, but once you learn the gait of it, it mimics running, but there's no impact at all.

00:54:31.000 Right.

00:54:32.000 It's real weird, because most people, when they get on it, their legs just start swinging. 1.00

00:54:35.000 And you're like, this is stupid. 0.99

00:54:37.000 Then I'm like, I had to show my wife. 1.00

00:54:39.000 I was like, no, no, don't swing.

00:54:40.000 Like, lift your legs up.

00:54:42.000 Like, bounce like you're running.

00:54:43.000 And then once you do that, you go, oh, okay.

00:54:46.000 And then you get a swing of this.

00:54:47.000 Feel like you're gliding.

00:54:48.000 Yeah, and you could run, but it's actually harder than just running.

00:54:52.000 So it's like...

00:54:53.000 Have you got one here?

00:54:54.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:54:56.000 It's interesting.

00:54:56.000 I've used it a few times, and I'm, you know, it's...

00:55:00.000 It's kind of a torturous device.

00:55:01.000 You don't look convinced.

00:55:03.000 I do, but I use everything. 0.99

00:55:05.000 I have a gang of shit out there, right? 0.99

00:55:07.000 I have a rower. 0.99

00:55:08.000 I have that Echo Bike from Rogue.

00:55:11.000 I have the Versaclimber. 0.99

00:55:12.000 Oh, that bike is fucking... 0.99

00:55:13.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:55:13.000 And then the self-powering trail... 0.99

00:55:18.000 The treadmill thing from Air Runner.

00:55:21.000 It's Air Runner, right?

00:55:21.000 Because that one made you sprint on it, that one.

00:55:23.000 Yeah, but you're powering it.

00:55:25.000 And that's the best for running, for real running, because it's actually 13%, something like that, harder than actual running, because you're propelling the treadmill as you're running.

00:55:35.000 So when you do that, and then you go to regular run, you have more pep in your step.

00:55:41.000 Yeah.

00:55:41.000 Because you're used to running at a mechanical disadvantage because of that thing.

00:55:46.000 But it's actually therapeutic.

00:55:47.000 And it's also got a bounce to it.

00:55:49.000 So it's not a lot of pounding.

00:55:51.000 It gives.

00:55:52.000 And you're running on this thing and you're actually pushing it with your feet.

00:55:56.000 You're almost like pulling it as you're running.

00:55:58.000 Did you try it?

00:55:59.000 That's another thing I've stopped doing as well.

00:56:01.000 I don't run outside anymore now.

00:56:02.000 Really?

00:56:02.000 Yeah, just to save my knees and stuff.

00:56:04.000 I do all my running on the treadmill in like 15 minute high intensity sprint work.

00:56:08.000 Because obviously when you fight, you're not like fighting at a slow pace like when you go for a long jog, which is what they've always said to do in Thailand.

00:56:16.000 Get up, go run 10k slow, route park on the concrete.

00:56:19.000 You're fighting in bursts, so it's more sport specific really to be working like that.

00:56:24.000 Like high interval stuff.

00:56:25.000 There's a lot of fighters that they ruin their knees and they can't run anymore and they have to figure out what to do Like Kamaru Usman UFC welterweight champion.

00:56:33.000 He's got some of the most incredible cardio of anybody and he can't run His knees are destroyed.

00:56:37.000 Oh my god. 0.99

00:56:38.000 He said his knees were so fucked up that he has to walk on grass Really? 0.99

00:56:45.000 My cousin, Andy Housen, he was one of the most insane fighters to ever come from England. 0.99

00:56:49.000 He's got a massive rep for being a warmonger.

00:56:52.000 His fight name's Lord of War.

00:56:53.000 He didn't run because he couldn't.

00:56:55.000 He just refused to run.

00:56:56.000 He went, I'm not running.

00:56:56.000 I don't like it.

00:56:57.000 I'm not doing it.

00:56:58.000 And some of the fights he had were absolutely insane.

00:57:01.000 And he never blew.

00:57:02.000 I've never seen him blow, did you?

00:57:03.000 No, never.

00:57:04.000 Never gasped, never...

00:57:06.000 It's totally possible to get in an amazing shape without running, but running helps a lot.

00:57:12.000 Yeah, I believe so.

00:57:13.000 I believe.

00:57:13.000 I used to like it, to be honest.

00:57:16.000 I used to love it.

00:57:17.000 It was fun.

00:57:19.000 A perfect example is Colby Covington.

00:57:21.000 Colby Covington, he's got insane cardio. 0.99

00:57:24.000 That Robbie Lawler fight, his fucking cardio is insane. 0.94

00:57:28.000 And he trains with my friend Cam Haynes, who's an ultramarathon runner. 0.99

00:57:31.000 And they run Mount Pigsaw in Oregon.

00:57:35.000 If you run with a person who's like a real runner, like someone who does, like Cam does 240 mile races.

00:57:43.000 They last three days.

00:57:44.000 Yeah, and you sleep for like 14 minutes in three days.

00:57:47.000 I'm not joking.

00:57:49.000 The woman who won it, Courtney Dowalter, she slept, one time she slept for a minute.

00:57:54.000 One minute, they woke her up, she said she felt amazing.

00:57:57.000 After that one minute sleep.

00:57:58.000 Really?

00:57:58.000 Yeah, watch that.

00:57:59.000 It was good. 0.97

00:58:00.000 She's a savage, that lady. 1.00

00:58:02.000 That lady is... 1.00

00:58:02.000 The mental strength of someone like that. 1.00

00:58:05.000 Because she can't... 0.99

00:58:06.000 She's not a tough... 0.99

00:58:07.000 She's not like a tough girl. 1.00

00:58:08.000 Like, I'll kick your ass. 1.00

00:58:09.000 Like, she's all smiley and happy. 1.00

00:58:11.000 But the real strength. 1.00

00:58:13.000 Like, when the fucking rubber hits the road. 0.99

00:58:16.000 Like, are you going to quit? 1.00

00:58:17.000 That lady ain't quitting for shit. 1.00

00:58:19.000 You ain't getting her to quit. 1.00

00:58:21.000 She won a race when she was blind. 0.99

00:58:22.000 She was having some sort of bleeding in her retinas and she couldn't fucking see. 1.00

00:58:28.000 I feel fucking pussy all of a sudden. 1.00

00:58:29.000 So do I. I went to the hospital. 1.00

00:58:32.000 Yeah.

00:58:33.000 205 miles in one run.

00:58:35.000 Courtney Dowalter is an ultra-addict. 0.98

00:58:37.000 That's her. 0.88

00:58:38.000 She just won a new race, I think.

00:58:39.000 Of course she did. 0.98

00:58:39.000 She's a savage, man. 0.98

00:58:41.000 This lady's a savage. 1.00

00:58:43.000 She won that 240-mile race, and she beat the second-place person by 10 hours. 0.76

00:58:50.000 What?

00:58:51.000 10 hours.

00:58:51.000 Do you know that?

00:58:52.000 10 hours.

00:58:53.000 I never knew that. 1.00

00:58:54.000 Fucking animal, dude. 1.00

00:58:55.000 She just doesn't, she just, she can push through things that other people can't push through. 1.00

00:58:59.000 That's a special kind of fucking human being, that to be able to, even when you're that far up front, to still push and push and push. 0.98

00:59:05.000 Yeah, she could have taken an eight hour to sleep. 0.99

00:59:07.000 And still one by two hours.

00:59:09.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:59:10.000 Which is madness.

00:59:11.000 Yeah.

00:59:11.000 Madness!

00:59:12.000 That's a special person, that's her. 1.00

00:59:14.000 Yeah, and again, like, she eats fucking candy and drinks beer and nachos and shit. 1.00

00:59:19.000 Like, her diet's not like... 1.00

00:59:21.000 It's not like she's Drago from Rocky who's got her strapped up machines and...

00:59:25.000 Nope, just tough.

00:59:26.000 Going back to the cardio and stuff, though, like, the MMA guys, I think a lot of theirs from, like, wrestling and grappling and stuff like that, their cardio is, like... 0.92

00:59:33.000 Really fucking something else.

00:59:35.000 I did a bit of work with Brian Ortega the other day. 0.99

00:59:37.000 He was just hitting pads for an hour, non-stop.

00:59:40.000 Non-stop, not getting tired. 0.70

00:59:41.000 Crazy.

00:59:42.000 Yeah, and we did like nearly two hours amount of work, and he was still not tired by the end of it.

00:59:46.000 They're fit, fit guys.

00:59:48.000 Well, I also think he's really ramped it up since the Max Holloway fight.

00:59:51.000 Yeah, true.

00:59:52.000 He faded in that fight.

00:59:53.000 Yeah, true.

00:59:54.000 Max started battling.

00:59:55.000 Yeah, he was saying he's not fighting for another couple of months, but he's still doing all the work now.

01:00:00.000 Yeah, well, you know, that's what happens with, you know, Bryan is a championship-caliber fighter. 0.94

01:00:06.000 He never won a title, but he was beating world champions like Frankie Edgar, like really elite guys, and, you know, he just ran into the best guy in the fucking business at 145. And the thing as well, they were telling us what he did to his body in that fight.

01:00:19.000 I think he fractured both his hands.

01:00:20.000 Oh, wow.

01:00:21.000 He dislocated his foot or something.

01:00:22.000 Yeah, his ligaments went in his knee.

01:00:24.000 And it was a crazy fight, though, wasn't it?

01:00:26.000 It was a great fight. 0.97

01:00:26.000 I'm not fucking surprised. 0.97

01:00:27.000 It was one of the best fights I've seen in that. 0.97

01:00:28.000 Well, to me, Brian Ortega's got great stand-up for sure, but his best skill for sure is his ground game.

01:00:37.000 Yeah, and for him to not emphasize that as his strategy in the fight to me just seems, I feel like it's short-sighted because I think he could tap anybody in the world at 145 pounds.

01:00:48.000 I really do. 0.95

01:00:49.000 He's fucking massive, I couldn't believe it. 0.99

01:00:50.000 He's a big fella. 1.00

01:00:51.000 Big for that weight.

01:00:52.000 He's huge compared to you, isn't he?

01:00:53.000 Compared to me, when we fight a similar weight, I couldn't believe it.

01:00:55.000 He's coming down on Monday.

01:00:57.000 He's going to do some hypnosis and Liam's going to work with him as well.

01:00:59.000 Oh yeah?

01:00:59.000 Nice.

01:01:00.000 Well, his fucking triangles. 0.99

01:01:02.000 I mean, that's his nickname, T-City. 0.99

01:01:03.000 Yeah, T-City. 1.00

01:01:04.000 He throws triangles up like a fucking world beater. 1.00

01:01:07.000 It's crazy when you watch... 1.00

01:01:09.000 Real nice guy, man.

01:01:10.000 Sharp.

01:01:11.000 Sharp technique, man.

01:01:12.000 But, you know, again, guys fall in love with their hands.

01:01:15.000 Yeah.

01:01:16.000 You know, they fall in love with the ability to punch people.

01:01:18.000 I just think that jiu-jitsu and MMA, I mean, one of the things about MMA in general is that there's so many different ways to win.

01:01:25.000 Yeah.

01:01:25.000 And when you do win by knockout a few times, you kind of get into that, and you kind of look to do that all the time.

01:01:32.000 The crowd sort of expect that from you, and then you want to fucking... 0.93

01:01:34.000 That's the scary thing about MMA is, like you said, there's so many ways to win, but there's so many ways to fucking lose, too. 0.97

01:01:39.000 Yeah. 0.50

01:01:40.000 You see these guys stand up, lighten someone up, and all of a sudden just go...

01:01:43.000 And that's it. 1.00

01:01:43.000 You're fucked. 1.00

01:01:45.000 So, so dangerous, man. 1.00

01:01:46.000 It happened to Gaston Bolanos.

01:01:48.000 He got caught with a guillotine in his last fight.

01:01:50.000 Yeah, we're doing a seminar at CSA on Coach's Clinic on Saturday.

01:01:53.000 No, this Saturday?

01:01:54.000 I love Gaston.

01:01:55.000 He's a nice guy.

01:01:57.000 He's spinning elbow. 1.00

01:01:57.000 He's fucking ridiculous. 1.00

01:01:58.000 Oh my God. 1.00

01:01:59.000 Yeah, he's crazy. 0.51

01:02:00.000 Girion's a good coach, man. 0.89

01:02:01.000 He's excellent.

01:02:02.000 He's a very good coach.

01:02:03.000 Every time you see anyone from his gym, they're on point.

01:02:08.000 He's got some really good girl fighters. 1.00

01:02:10.000 Yeah, really good girl fighters as well.

01:02:11.000 Yeah, Zoyla and Stephanie Fraust.

01:02:14.000 And that's another gym that really emphasises strength and conditioning.

01:02:16.000 They have a whole CrossFit gym attached to it.

01:02:19.000 Yeah, they do.

01:02:20.000 It has to be done.

01:02:21.000 Like I said earlier, even the Thais are doing it now because they don't want to start getting left behind anymore.

01:02:26.000 It has to be done. 1.00

01:02:27.000 What kind of shit do you do? 1.00

01:02:29.000 When I was a bit younger, I used to absolutely smash it. 1.00

01:02:32.000 I do a lot more flexibility and mobility stuff now, like the exercise bands and stuff like that, instead of just smashing my body with heavy weights and stuff.

01:02:39.000 I still do the odd set of high-intensity explosive lifts, like high pulls and a bit of deadlift and stuff like that.

01:02:47.000 But I do a lot more on the bands, like...

01:02:49.000 Activating my glutes and workouts like that, really.

01:02:52.000 How many times do you do strength and conditioning a week?

01:02:55.000 Twice.

01:02:55.000 Twice?

01:02:55.000 And is that when you're in camp for a fight as well, or just normally?

01:02:59.000 No, when I'm in fight camp, I'll do it twice.

01:03:02.000 When I'm not, I'll probably do it once.

01:03:03.000 Once, yeah.

01:03:04.000 Just to conserve your body?

01:03:06.000 Yeah, just to keep...

01:03:06.000 I lose my mind if I don't train.

01:03:08.000 Right.

01:03:09.000 I'll teach, but I can't sit around doing... 0.98

01:03:11.000 No, even when I'm fucking injured, it's my own... 0.98

01:03:12.000 That's one of my worst traits. 0.98

01:03:14.000 I cannot do nothing.

01:03:16.000 Yeah, but that's also one of your best traits.

01:03:18.000 Yeah, true.

01:03:19.000 That's why you're so exciting.

01:03:21.000 It's because you have this drive to succeed.

01:03:24.000 The interesting thing about strength and conditioning to me is that there's no clear blueprint.

01:03:29.000 It's what works for you.

01:03:31.000 There's no established protocol.

01:03:33.000 You have to do this, and then you do this, and then you do that, and then two days a week you do this.

01:03:38.000 Everybody does it differently.

01:03:40.000 And then you've got the Nick Kurson school of thought, the Marv Marinovich school of thought, which was those guys just concentrated almost entirely on strength and conditioning.

01:03:50.000 And their thought was that strength and conditioning is everything.

01:03:52.000 You already know how to fight.

01:03:53.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:03:54.000 So when you're in camp, you should just be doing box jumps and rope skips and all these fucking explosive things with balls and medicine balls and shit. 0.99

01:04:02.000 And their idea is like, get your engine so you have the most incredible gas tank, the most powerful engine. 0.99

01:04:09.000 You already know how to fight.

01:04:10.000 And then skill work is secondary while you're in camp.

01:04:14.000 And then when you're at a camp, then you work on all your skills.

01:04:17.000 Then you hit the pads, you do all these different things.

01:04:20.000 You do less of the strength and conditioning, but you maintain a base.

01:04:23.000 But then when you go into camp, the camp, like when BJ Penn was at his best, he was training with Marv Marinovich, like when he fought Diego Sanchez, when he fought Sean Shirk, that was the best BJ Penn we ever saw.

01:04:33.000 And he was in insane shape.

01:04:36.000 Insane shape.

01:04:37.000 It's because they brutalized him.

01:04:39.000 I mean, they just made him go through these absolutely insane strength and conditioning workouts, so they gave him this cardio base and this conditioning base that was just through the roof.

01:04:50.000 Yeah, my thing with that would be, the closer the fight gets, one of my main weapons I want to know is working through my eyes, so if I've not sparred enough close to the fights, and I can tell that as well if I'm The closer the fights get when I'm sparring, if I'm getting caught with stuff, that should be seen.

01:05:05.000 I can tell, so I'll spar a bit more and stuff like that, so that's my only worry a bit.

01:05:09.000 Well, that was the thing with Anthony Yard, when he fought Kovalev, he didn't spar at all.

01:05:13.000 So they say.

01:05:14.000 I mean, that's what they say.

01:05:15.000 You think they're lying?

01:05:16.000 No, I don't know, because I heard he was sparring, but that's so they say.

01:05:23.000 I couldn't do a fight, can we not sparring?

01:05:25.000 No.

01:05:27.000 I think when he watched, when he fought Kovalev, He was that concerned here.

01:05:32.000 He didn't move his feet.

01:05:33.000 And Kovalev was just a couple of inches out, but Kovalev's smart with his jab.

01:05:37.000 Well, clearly Kovalev was the best fighter he's ever fought.

01:05:40.000 It just takes a while to understand as a fighter.

01:05:45.000 You know there's levels to the game, but when you're used to just putting knuckles to face and putting people to sleep, you just think, I'm going to put this guy to sleep too.

01:05:52.000 And when it doesn't work out, you're like, okay.

01:05:54.000 I did that. 0.84

01:05:55.000 I had my first 28 pro fights unbeaten, and my fight 29, I fought a Thai champion called Duel, and I dropped him in round two and thought, fucking easy this. 0.97

01:06:05.000 And he got up and fucked me up, like worse than I have. 0.99

01:06:08.000 I was pissing blood and all sorts. 0.99

01:06:09.000 He absolutely battered me for three rounds.

01:06:12.000 And I'm like, wow, maybe it's not that easy.

01:06:14.000 What was the difference?

01:06:14.000 What did he adjust?

01:06:16.000 He took me into clinch.

01:06:17.000 And I were only 18. And he was like mid-20s.

01:06:20.000 And the first time I'd ever fought a Thai champion.

01:06:22.000 He took me into clinch.

01:06:22.000 He cut me with an elbow.

01:06:23.000 He kept throwing me on the floor. 0.99

01:06:25.000 He'd fucking knee me around the back. 0.99

01:06:26.000 I know my kidneys. 0.99

01:06:27.000 I was pissing blood and stuff after.

01:06:28.000 And that's when I fought after that.

01:06:30.000 No, I'm right.

01:06:30.000 I need to go to Thailand and fight how they fight.

01:06:33.000 Train how they train.

01:06:33.000 Do what they do if I'm going to ever be able to...

01:06:35.000 Because I can punch. 0.95

01:06:36.000 I can kick a knee.

01:06:36.000 I need to be able to do what they're good at to get on their level.

01:06:39.000 What was it like going to Thailand?

01:06:42.000 I loved it.

01:06:43.000 Like...

01:06:44.000 Two years I was there.

01:06:45.000 What I used to do is I'd go for six months, come home for a month, go back for six months, come home for a month.

01:06:49.000 So stay in Thailand for six months?

01:06:50.000 Yeah, that's what I used to do.

01:06:52.000 It was amazing. 0.99

01:06:53.000 I've got some fucking ridiculous stories. 1.00

01:06:55.000 Like crazy shit used to just happen all the time there. 1.00

01:06:57.000 I remember one time I went back. 0.96

01:06:59.000 I've been, this is a bit long-winded, this one, but it's a funny one.

01:07:02.000 I've been there about three days and some promoter came in gym and my coach went, you want you to go fight pro boxing in Cambodia?

01:07:09.000 I said, I've never fought pro boxing.

01:07:11.000 I said, I'm not doing that.

01:07:12.000 Pro boxing in Cambodia.

01:07:13.000 I said, I'm not going to go in there.

01:07:14.000 I said, I don't even want to go to Cambodia.

01:07:16.000 He went, no, no, it's good money.

01:07:17.000 I went, no, I'm not doing it.

01:07:19.000 Came back the next day with his camera.

01:07:21.000 I said, what are you doing?

01:07:22.000 I said, I'm not fighting.

01:07:23.000 He said, I need your picture took, you've got to go fight. 0.87

01:07:24.000 And JT knew that I wasn't going to say no.

01:07:26.000 He said, listen, it's double the money you're going to get for Thai boxing.

01:07:28.000 Do you want to go do it? 1.00

01:07:29.000 I went, fuck it, all right then. 1.00

01:07:30.000 So the fight were in about 10 days. 1.00

01:07:32.000 I'd never fought anything other than Muay Thai.

01:07:35.000 The fight were in 10 days.

01:07:37.000 I started doing a bit of work with the boxing coach in the gym.

01:07:39.000 But this is like ties for you.

01:07:42.000 JT said, you're not fit.

01:07:43.000 Train Thai boxing.

01:07:44.000 It's harder.

01:07:44.000 You'll be fitter when you fight.

01:07:46.000 So he made me kick the pads, knee the pads, do all my clinching, everything like that.

01:07:50.000 That's what he made me do.

01:07:50.000 After I'd done all my Thai boxing, then I got to work with the boxing coach.

01:07:53.000 He said, you need to be fit.

01:07:55.000 So that's what they made me do.

01:07:57.000 But just before the fight, I went, right, when we're flying to Cambodia, Jay, he went, I can't come.

01:08:01.000 I said, what do you mean?

01:08:01.000 He went, they want it to make it look like they've flown you in from England for their news and stuff, so you're going to have to go to other Westerners.

01:08:08.000 I said, yeah, but none of these elite-level cornermen are like, what am I going to do?

01:08:13.000 So I took my friend with me.

01:08:14.000 And we got there.

01:08:16.000 We got off this little propeller plane from Bangkok to Phnom Penh. 0.97

01:08:20.000 And the first thing that went in my head, I thought, they think I've thrown from fucking England on a propeller plane to know who's going to buy this. 0.95

01:08:27.000 I said to JT, I said, who am I fighting as well? 0.97

01:08:29.000 He said, oh, you don't even have to lose weight.

01:08:31.000 You can fight at 67 kilos.

01:08:32.000 At the time, I was fighting at 135. I said, you can fight at 147. You don't have to lose weight.

01:08:36.000 I said, the guy's rubbish. 1.00

01:08:37.000 Don't worry. 0.99

01:08:38.000 Got off the plane and all the news people were there with the news cameras and all sorts. 1.00

01:08:42.000 I thought, it can't be this fucking rubbish. 0.99

01:08:43.000 I thought news people were there looking pictures and everything. 0.99

01:08:48.000 Got in the back of this pick-up thing, opened the paper, big spread of him on the paper, got to the weigh-in and went, you're too light, what are you doing?

01:08:56.000 I went, I'm 67. The fight's at 69. So we're at 154, not 147. I said, this is fucking bullshit.

01:09:03.000 The whole thing is absolutely ridiculous. 1.00

01:09:06.000 First round, I got absolutely battered. 1.00

01:09:08.000 He was fucking massive. 0.99

01:09:09.000 He was well bigger than me. 1.00

01:09:10.000 Round two, he pinned me on ropes and I just put my head down and I threw a fucking left hook. 1.00

01:09:13.000 It hit him straight on chin. 0.99

01:09:14.000 He went down, starfished.

01:09:16.000 I'm running around the ring, jumping on the ropes, celebrating.

01:09:20.000 I must have been jumping around for about 20-25 seconds.

01:09:23.000 I got off the rope and the count were only on three.

01:09:25.000 So the ref's going, three! 0.99

01:09:29.000 Four! 0.99

01:09:30.000 Waiting for him to get up.

01:09:31.000 In the end, he picked him off the floor.

01:09:33.000 What?

01:09:34.000 They're serious.

01:09:35.000 I've got it all on video as well.

01:09:37.000 I'll put it online.

01:09:37.000 Is it online?

01:09:38.000 No, I'll put it online and I'll send you it.

01:09:40.000 It's serious.

01:09:40.000 I ran back out with him.

01:09:41.000 I pinned him on ropes.

01:09:42.000 I dropped him again.

01:09:43.000 The ref picked him up because his nose started bleeding.

01:09:45.000 Took him to his corner.

01:09:47.000 Wiped his nose.

01:09:48.000 Give him a drink.

01:09:49.000 Restarted the round, then the bell rung.

01:09:52.000 But luckily, it was only a six-round fight.

01:09:54.000 I dropped him again in round four and again in round six, so there was no way they could, like, rob me at all.

01:09:58.000 I dropped him, like, four times in six rounds, but still...

01:10:00.000 Did they still make it close?

01:10:02.000 Probably.

01:10:02.000 Well, I just wanted to get out of there.

01:10:04.000 I thought I wanted to get fucking lynched here. 0.98

01:10:05.000 But yeah, it's like crazy shit like that happened all the time, and all living in Thailand, just like, mad stories, like, promoter coming, Jim, do you want to fight tomorrow? 0.99

01:10:11.000 No. 0.99

01:10:12.000 Next thing, I'm just fighting, my hands wrapped going, what the fuck's going on here? 0.99

01:10:15.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:10:15.000 You know what I mean? 0.98

01:10:17.000 But like, Wayne Parr's got loads of crazy stories and that as well.

01:10:21.000 And I wouldn't change any of it.

01:10:23.000 It's got me to where I am today.

01:10:25.000 The whole culture of fighting over there, the fact that they get those kids to fight, you know, they take them from their parents, essentially, when they're like five, six years old.

01:10:33.000 And they spend most of their time in the gym and then they have their first fights when they're little tiny kids And then by the time they're 15 16 years old they might have a hundred fights Well, I remember I fought a fight called singdam and it was my hundred fight Which is a big thing for a westerner and I said to him before the fight Well, it's just hundred fight a lot for a western.

01:10:53.000 What do you think about it went that one out 15? 0.92

01:10:55.000 He didn't give a shit Just stop and think about how crazy that is Like, how many... 0.99

01:11:06.000 What? 0.99

01:11:07.000 What are you doing?

01:11:08.000 You fight 25 times a year?

01:11:10.000 Yeah, every week.

01:11:12.000 They think Thai oil kills everything, don't they?

01:11:14.000 Oh, no problem.

01:11:15.000 More gear.

01:11:16.000 What is that liniment?

01:11:18.000 Tiger Balm and liniment.

01:11:19.000 But what is that liniment?

01:11:20.000 Does it do anything?

01:11:21.000 Someone actually told me over there, one of the main ingredients is aspirin or something like that.

01:11:25.000 Aspirin?

01:11:25.000 Is it?

01:11:26.000 Someone told me that over there.

01:11:27.000 I never knew that either.

01:11:28.000 I don't know if it's true or not, but that's what someone told me. 0.99

01:11:29.000 I think there's an issue with people using that shit though in the clinch because they use it on their body and then they clinch with you and they get it on your face. 0.96

01:11:36.000 I've had fights before where people have put it on the gloves and stuff and rubbed it on the gloves with Vaseline so they pour it in a tub of Vaseline. 0.98

01:11:42.000 Scoop it and rub it on the gloves.

01:11:44.000 And I've had that before.

01:11:45.000 It's awful. 1.00

01:11:46.000 That's so fucked up that someone would do that. 1.00

01:11:48.000 Did you complain about it? 1.00

01:11:50.000 Yeah, I was sat in a corner when I can't fucking see. 0.97

01:11:53.000 And Richard, my coach, he had to tell them to go over the corner and wipe his gloves down. 0.92

01:11:57.000 And then they did it at the end of every round and started every round and wiped his gloves just to make sure that.

01:12:01.000 But he 100% put some on his gloves.

01:12:03.000 100%.

01:12:03.000 I'd had about 50 fights by that time and I'd never ever had it before, do you know what I mean?

01:12:07.000 Dirty people.

01:12:08.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:12:08.000 That's so dirty that people cheat like that. 0.99

01:12:11.000 That makes me so sick.

01:12:13.000 Like, that goes against everything that fighting is supposed to be about.

01:12:17.000 It's supposed to be about you're at your best, they're at your best, you touch gloves, you're the best man.

01:12:22.000 I was told when Giorgio Petrosian fought Nonathan Popramuk, He only lost his wristy and nonathan.

01:12:31.000 And I heard that Giorgio told me that he was poisoned.

01:12:35.000 He gave him a drink.

01:12:35.000 Because there were a big side bet on the fight.

01:12:37.000 He gave him a drink and then he said he felt all dizzy and stuff like that.

01:12:40.000 That happens a lot in Thailand whenever there's a fight with a side bet.

01:12:43.000 So like the gyms.

01:12:45.000 So the gym, I think Petrosian's camp and Bukhau's camp, they had like a 20 grand side bet or something like that.

01:12:51.000 So whenever there's big bets like that, it happens regular now.

01:12:54.000 With the poison and stuff like that.

01:12:56.000 What kind of poison do they use?

01:12:58.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:12:58.000 It's stuff that makes you feel really poorly and that, but sometimes it's like your stomach and you want to spew and you're fucking shitting everywhere and stuff like that. 0.99

01:13:05.000 But I've seen sometimes where they must have overdosed and the fighters ended up getting taken to hospital and been in a really bad way and stuff. 0.94

01:13:10.000 So the fight, they're just trying to get an advantage to win the bet. 0.90

01:13:13.000 But the fight hasn't even ended up happening because they've fucked them up so bad. 0.86

01:13:16.000 It's like fighting in Thailand's like a Jean-Claude Van Damme movie. 0.99

01:13:20.000 It's like, there's also a fuckery afoot. 0.96

01:13:23.000 Yeah. 0.87

01:13:24.000 Depends on who's looking after you, because on the island, I only go to Costa Mary.

01:13:27.000 I go to Super Pro.

01:13:29.000 When I go over there, it's not really like that over there.

01:13:32.000 It's not as rough.

01:13:33.000 I love the gambling culture, though.

01:13:35.000 I love the fact that you see all the guys in the background passing money around. 0.99

01:13:40.000 Waving their arms and shit. 0.96

01:13:41.000 When I used to live there, because I was fighting for money, what I used to do is if I ever got short money, I'd bet on myself. 0.99

01:13:47.000 And I got told I was fighting this guy who I'd lost to previously before.

01:13:51.000 But I was so close to knocking him out, I was 100% certain I was going to beat him and I was going to knock him out.

01:13:56.000 So, I bet my entire wage, I bet all the money I had, everyone in the gym put loads of money on me to win as well.

01:14:01.000 And I hit him with a left hook in round three, his legs went, I ran in to finish him, he bounced off the rope and kneed me.

01:14:06.000 And he didn't drop me a rope, but all my power just went, and I was trying to finish him. 0.98

01:14:10.000 I went and sat down at end of round three in my corner, I went, what are you fucking doing, might you finish him? 0.97

01:14:13.000 I went, I can't breathe, I can't breathe. 0.99

01:14:15.000 I went out round four.

01:14:16.000 All my power had gone.

01:14:17.000 I lost round four, which is the money round.

01:14:19.000 Then I was chasing the fight in round five.

01:14:20.000 No money.

01:14:21.000 Why is round four the money round?

01:14:23.000 In Muay Thai, in Thailand, round three and four are the big rounds.

01:14:26.000 Round one and two, they're just easing in.

01:14:27.000 It's basically scored as if it's a marathon, not a sprint.

01:14:30.000 Even if you win round one and two, if you lose round three and four, you've lost the fight.

01:14:34.000 Really?

01:14:34.000 Interesting.

01:14:35.000 You don't know that.

01:14:36.000 I lost all my money.

01:14:39.000 I didn't get a purse.

01:14:40.000 All my other money.

01:14:42.000 I had to fight again three days later.

01:14:43.000 Because I was fighting for money.

01:14:44.000 Three days later.

01:14:45.000 I had to put me on a plane and went down to Phuket and it was an easier fight.

01:14:48.000 But I was still really banged up because it was a tough fight.

01:14:50.000 I just had...

01:14:51.000 I had to fight three days later just to get some money.

01:14:54.000 Now, when you have to fight three days after you fought, do you train at all in between those fights?

01:14:58.000 I couldn't.

01:14:58.000 I was injured.

01:15:00.000 I had to go do it.

01:15:01.000 Do you know what I mean?

01:15:02.000 Because you needed money.

01:15:02.000 Either that, I'll go home.

01:15:03.000 I'll ring my mom and go, Mom, give me some money.

01:15:06.000 And I'd already tapped her up a few times, I think.

01:15:09.000 So that's what I had to do.

01:15:11.000 Luckily, down on the islands in Phuket, where I went to fight, the fighters are as strong as in Bangkok.

01:15:15.000 So I won that fight.

01:15:16.000 I knocked him out, but still.

01:15:18.000 What is the difference between fighters that trained in Phuket and fighters at the time?

01:15:23.000 In Bangkok, they're all there to make a name for themselves on the elite-level stadiums.

01:15:28.000 Rajat Amnur, Lumpini, Channel 7, Omnoy, these are the elite of the league.

01:15:32.000 These are the guys who are going to get scouted and go on to stuff like one championship, who are going to win titles and get money and become massive names.

01:15:38.000 In Phuket, it's just like they're probably just fine for a bit of extra money just to...

01:15:42.000 No, just to cap off the wage or something at the end of the week.

01:15:45.000 You get a lot of them who've got another job and they just might fight at the end of the week.

01:15:48.000 Or they're a pad man.

01:15:49.000 They'd be a trainer in a gym.

01:15:51.000 They won't train.

01:15:51.000 They won't bother doing all other than just holding pads all day.

01:15:54.000 And they think, oh, you know what?

01:15:55.000 I can get an extra 10,000 baht, which is probably about, what, $200 at the end of the night.

01:15:59.000 I might just go have a fight.

01:16:00.000 $200?

01:16:01.000 Something like that, yeah.

01:16:02.000 So they'll just go do that.

01:16:03.000 They'll take a few shots and they'll probably fall down.

01:16:06.000 But in Bangkok, where the elite are fighting the elite, you know you're not going to get any of that.

01:16:10.000 You know people are there just to make a name for themselves, especially in those stadiums.

01:16:15.000 That's a crazy place in the world, Bangkok.

01:16:19.000 You have to think of this one place where this one style of fighting became the most popular and it's used as gambling.

01:16:28.000 If you think of the rest of the world, there's no place where you go where people wrestle for money, where everybody's gambling on wrestling, right?

01:16:34.000 There's no place you know where people are throwing money in the air for Western boxing.

01:16:37.000 Well, gambling's illegal in Thailand.

01:16:38.000 Only thing you don't have to bet on is fighting.

01:16:40.000 Really?

01:16:41.000 Yeah, it's illegal.

01:16:42.000 You can only bet on fighting?

01:16:43.000 You can only bet on fighting in the stadiums.

01:16:45.000 Wow, I didn't know that.

01:16:46.000 The closest casino is on the border in Cambodia.

01:16:49.000 So if anyone wants to gamble in a casino, they go up to the border up there.

01:16:53.000 Oh, that makes more sense.

01:16:54.000 That's why it's so crazy.

01:16:55.000 That's why everyone...

01:16:56.000 But it's just... 0.98

01:16:57.000 They fucking figured something out that other people didn't figure out. 0.97

01:17:01.000 I mean, you think about the one part of the world. 0.99

01:17:03.000 It's an island.

01:17:04.000 They figured out about how to kick the legs better than anybody.

01:17:07.000 It's really crazy.

01:17:08.000 They figured out how to work the clinch and knee to the body better than anybody.

01:17:12.000 To dump people and trip them.

01:17:14.000 Elbows as well.

01:17:14.000 Yeah.

01:17:15.000 Drop them and sweep them.

01:17:16.000 Better than anybody.

01:17:17.000 That's the thing when you're fighting the ties, when you're clinching with them, that's why I had to go live where, because you cannot clinch with one of them who's been doing it since we were five, six years old. 0.99

01:17:25.000 Even like the tall, thin, lean ties, who've got that like wiry strength for still like some of the strongest people, who you'd look at in the middle of the street and think, I'll fuck him up. 0.97

01:17:34.000 No, you wouldn't. 1.00

01:17:35.000 The nicest people who aren't here as well, they're really nice, natured people, they seem so, but you get him in that ring and you're fucked. 0.97

01:17:42.000 How is Sanchai able to keep up this high level of skill and performance at 40 years old? 0.51

01:17:50.000 I think his awareness is better than everybody else's.

01:17:54.000 I think he's got a sense of awareness that I think special elite people have.

01:17:59.000 You know, he's distancing, Giorgio Petrosian or Floyd, they just seem to have this ingrained sort of congruence with the self, you know?

01:18:07.000 He also is very agile in terms of his footwork.

01:18:11.000 Yeah.

01:18:11.000 He doesn't take no damage.

01:18:13.000 That's why he's fighting twice a month still.

01:18:15.000 He's not getting hurt.

01:18:16.000 He doesn't really train much either.

01:18:17.000 He'll come into the gym, do a couple of rounds of pads.

01:18:19.000 Just to make sure he's sharp.

01:18:21.000 That's me done.

01:18:21.000 Or a few rounds play spa.

01:18:23.000 Really?

01:18:23.000 Yep, or a few rounds play spa.

01:18:24.000 We know shin pads on.

01:18:26.000 Right, that'll do.

01:18:27.000 Do you know what I mean?

01:18:27.000 Just to make sure that he's...

01:18:28.000 He doesn't train out.

01:18:28.000 No, not anymore.

01:18:29.000 He doesn't train hard?

01:18:30.000 No, not anymore.

01:18:31.000 Really?

01:18:32.000 Not anymore, no.

01:18:32.000 When he was in stadiums as a champion, he would train like no one I'd ever seen, do you know what I mean?

01:18:37.000 But like, now, no.

01:18:38.000 Obviously, the gym where we train is where he is.

01:18:41.000 So when I'm in Thailand still, I'm training alongside him, so...

01:18:44.000 I see what he does, and that's what's even more impressive about it.

01:18:46.000 He'll come in two, three rounds on pads, or two, three rounds, play a spar, no shin pads, nothing strenuous, no S&C. He'll only run a little bit before the fight just to lose weight as well.

01:18:56.000 He's got a great sense of humour as well, aren't he?

01:18:58.000 He's quite humorous and quite playful.

01:19:00.000 How is he able to get away with such little work?

01:19:03.000 Because I think a lot of time, when he's fighting now, he's not fighting ties anymore, he's fighting Westerners, and I think a lot of time, when these guys are... 0.58

01:19:11.000 Right.

01:19:11.000 So they're a bit starstruck before they even get in there, I think, a lot of the time.

01:19:15.000 Right, that makes sense.

01:19:16.000 Even when they try and put it on him, he's so smart, and like Javini was saying, his awareness and his footwork and stuff is so good, he can move off, kick your skull at the point.

01:19:22.000 Only really lost to clinchers, didn't he?

01:19:24.000 Yeah.

01:19:24.000 Mainly clinchers who people can grab and knee him.

01:19:26.000 And that was only because what they used to do is make Sanchai weigh in at five pounds lighter than them, just so it'd be even for the betting.

01:19:33.000 Oh, really?

01:19:34.000 So they'd make him drop down to 130 and then his opponent would be 135 just so he'd be even on the betting.

01:19:39.000 Because if you put them both at the same weight and Sanchai's press, no one's going to bet because you know Sanchai's going to win.

01:19:43.000 So they dehydrated him to bring him down just so the gamblers would be like, right, ooh, he might have been done by round four.

01:19:49.000 Interesting about Sanchai as well is that his style is so light on his feet, and he doesn't kick full blast.

01:19:57.000 Even when he's hitting the pads, like, hey, hey, it's like he's slapping the pads. 0.93

01:20:02.000 He's not fucking digging in. 0.91

01:20:04.000 Some guy's Dig in. 0.98

01:20:05.000 And he's got that internal rotation as well.

01:20:07.000 He can just whip his leg over. 0.93

01:20:10.000 He can fake your leg kick and then whack you around the neck. 0.97

01:20:15.000 He's a special guy. 0.95

01:20:17.000 Question mark kicks off the charts.

01:20:19.000 And he also does stuff like he'll land head kicks at a really close distance by stepping off to the side.

01:20:26.000 Remember that one time?

01:20:27.000 It was like a crazy head kick.

01:20:29.000 Yeah, against the ropes.

01:20:30.000 And he steps off to the side and lands almost a straight up and down left high kick.

01:20:35.000 Yeah, I remember that one.

01:20:36.000 But just the ability to land a high kick in that tight, it's crazy.

01:20:40.000 It's his southpaw footwork as well.

01:20:42.000 One minute he stood in front of you and the next he's done something and he's shifted off and then he's there.

01:20:45.000 And that's when that kick's going to come up.

01:20:47.000 Is he influencing younger TIE fighters to fight more light on their feet and to have more movement?

01:20:53.000 Because...

01:20:54.000 The Thai fighters, it's so common to see guys standing right in front of each other and exchanging techniques. 0.99

01:21:00.000 He's not doing any of that shit. 0.98

01:21:01.000 There's not many who can do it like him, to be honest. 0.99

01:21:03.000 He was a special kind of fighter.

01:21:05.000 I've never seen anyone who's got the same style as him in Thailand.

01:21:08.000 A lot of the gyms in Thailand...

01:21:10.000 Clinch gyms, so they'll be doing more clinching than anything else.

01:21:13.000 And even for the ones who are similar to his style, they're still nowhere near him, to be honest.

01:21:17.000 I think it's one of those things, though, as well, where if you see someone like Sanchai and you try and mimic it, a lot of coaches put you off it.

01:21:25.000 You know, like the stuff that Lomachenko does. 0.95

01:21:26.000 If you say to a coach, an old-school boxing coach, oh, I want to start juggling, I want to start standing on one leg, I want to start doing the Schultz test or the numbers, and they seem to go, oh, that's shit, you're doing that. 0.94

01:21:37.000 Do you know what I mean? 0.91

01:21:38.000 I think it's sometimes people are stifled from learning because of the way that their mindset is, you know?

01:21:44.000 Yeah, I think that coaches always want you to fight the way they know how to teach you how to fight.

01:21:51.000 It's a rare, talented coach that can see what you can do and move around it.

01:21:56.000 One of the interesting things to me in coaches is Dwayne Ludwig.

01:21:59.000 Because Dwayne Ludwig teaches so different than he ever fought.

01:22:04.000 He realized at the end of his career, you know what the best way to fight is?

01:22:10.000 The best way to fight is to give your opponent so many different looks and overload their brain with possibilities.

01:22:16.000 Switching stances to all these different...

01:22:19.000 And then he put it all down into a system.

01:22:22.000 But if you go back to watch the way Dwayne fought...

01:22:25.000 Dwayne fought real, standard, Dutch kickboxing style.

01:22:29.000 That was his style.

01:22:30.000 He fought Decker, didn't he?

01:22:31.000 He fought Ramon Decker.

01:22:32.000 Yeah, he did.

01:22:33.000 Decker late in his career, when Decker's ankles were completely shot, he still looked awesome.

01:22:39.000 I wouldn't want to teach anyone to fight like how I fight, really.

01:22:43.000 You've got to work to what their advantage is and see what's going to work best for their style, because everyone's got a different style.

01:22:49.000 Yeah.

01:22:49.000 Mm-hmm.

01:22:59.000 Like, at a bad company where we train, all our top-level fighters are all different. 1.00

01:23:04.000 We've got someone who's a boxer, someone who's a clincher, someone who's a kicker, someone who's an idiot. 1.00

01:23:09.000 Do you know what I mean? 0.99

01:23:10.000 It's like, all the styles are just totally different.

01:23:12.000 Right, yeah.

01:23:13.000 That's what makes a good coach as well, being able to bring that out of a fight and add bits of your style to theirs, but mainly let them flourish with their own style.

01:23:22.000 But you would also think, how many people can teach you how to fight like Sanchai?

01:23:26.000 Yeah.

01:23:26.000 I mean, how many people even can move like that guy?

01:23:28.000 Not many. 1.00

01:23:29.000 He does weird shit. 0.99

01:23:30.000 He's got that sliding push kick that's like a sidekick that he does a lot to. 1.00

01:23:35.000 He throws it...

01:23:37.000 Off his front legs.

01:23:38.000 He trained a lot with Thingy though, didn't he?

01:23:39.000 What's his name?

01:23:40.000 Somrat Kamsing.

01:23:41.000 Somrat Kamsing had an elusive sort of loose style.

01:23:44.000 Yes.

01:23:45.000 And he moved his head and he was an Olympic gold medalist when I think it was 1996, I think.

01:23:50.000 But he had that elusive style, the head movement and stuff like that.

01:23:53.000 And then Samart Payakarone, who's known as the best Thai ever.

01:23:56.000 Thai fighter ever, I think.

01:23:57.000 Super elusive, right?

01:23:58.000 Yeah, super elusive, moved the head and stuff like that.

01:24:01.000 So...

01:24:02.000 Yeah, I just think it's like you say, though.

01:24:04.000 I think it's the generic camps.

01:24:05.000 You know how strict they are in Thailand. 1.00

01:24:07.000 Fucking fight like that. 1.00

01:24:08.000 I don't fight like that. 1.00

01:24:08.000 Do you think that the guys Sanchai's fighting now are just like a little lower level? 1.00

01:24:13.000 Yes.

01:24:14.000 100%.

01:24:15.000 The idea is, like, everybody knows he's a legend, so you could pay him to fight someone who's not...

01:24:20.000 Pretty much.

01:24:21.000 They're paying for Sanchai's name, do you know what I mean?

01:24:24.000 So, not like...

01:24:25.000 Pain to see a fight where it's going to be, oh, he's going to win this, who's going to bet on this.

01:24:28.000 No one's betting.

01:24:29.000 Everyone knows what's going to happen.

01:24:30.000 He's earned his stripes.

01:24:31.000 He's done everything that not many people will ever do.

01:24:34.000 And that's what it is now.

01:24:35.000 It's just like other Westerners and stuff trying to make a name for their self now. 0.99

01:24:38.000 Yes. 0.88

01:24:39.000 I might be the one who beat Sanchai, but unless something ridiculous happens. 0.84

01:24:43.000 I mean, most of them are just trying to do a cartwheel kick, don't they?

01:24:45.000 If they get a cartwheel kickoff, he's like, hey, I've won.

01:24:47.000 Then they get battered.

01:24:48.000 You know what I mean?

01:24:49.000 Now, do you think that, like...

01:24:52.000 Has he gotten an offer to fight in something like One?

01:24:55.000 Because One is not going to let him fight.

01:24:58.000 It might have done.

01:24:59.000 Guys at the level that he's competing at, right?

01:25:01.000 They would want him to fight.

01:25:03.000 Yeah.

01:25:04.000 The only people One have got signed are elite level.

01:25:06.000 There's no easy ways out or anything on there.

01:25:09.000 All the ties that were signed to him are all elite.

01:25:11.000 All the Westerners are the best Westerners.

01:25:14.000 He might have got an offer, but to be fair, he can fight twice a month and he can fight all over the world and he's still getting paid good money every time he fights.

01:25:20.000 So I don't think it really matters to him, to be honest.

01:25:22.000 He's done all that already and fought all them best guys and beat them all even with the weight disadvantage of being pulled down.

01:25:28.000 So I don't think he'll really have to worry about that.

01:25:30.000 So he's just right now just sort of getting paid and having fun.

01:25:34.000 I wonder how much longer he could do it.

01:25:36.000 Well, the level he's fighting at and if he keeps himself in shape, then people lose when they get in with him, don't they?

01:25:43.000 You know what I mean?

01:25:44.000 They pick it right, yeah.

01:25:46.000 Is he?

01:25:46.000 Yeah, doing seminars.

01:25:47.000 For how long?

01:25:48.000 I think he's just gone off to...

01:25:50.000 I can't remember where he's gone today.

01:25:51.000 I was looking on his Instagram early.

01:25:52.000 He's been taken off somewhere else today, though.

01:25:54.000 So they've drove in a bus from the East Coast to the West. 0.99

01:25:57.000 Holy shit. 0.98

01:25:58.000 I think he's done about 20, 25 seminars so far all over the place. 1.00

01:26:01.000 Oh, my God. 0.68

01:26:01.000 So he's obviously earning ridiculous money. 0.68

01:26:03.000 One of them had a hundred people in and stuff, do you know what I mean?

01:26:05.000 Oh, wow.

01:26:05.000 He's earning money from other stuff, so he doesn't need to be putting himself in an elite level against young, hungry, killer ties who are going to want, oh, I'm going to beat Sanjay, so he's earned his stripes, hasn't he?

01:26:16.000 Yeah, and he's earned it the hard way, hasn't he?

01:26:18.000 Let's be honest.

01:26:19.000 Yeah, no, he certainly has.

01:26:20.000 How good is his English?

01:26:22.000 The first time I fought him ten years ago, he couldn't speak a word, but obviously in the gym he's at now in Thailand, there's lots of Westerners coming there just because they know he's there, and he's doing more seminars, so he's learned a lot more now.

01:26:34.000 You can have a good crack with him now, you can have a laugh with him.

01:26:36.000 Oh, that's cool.

01:26:37.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:26:38.000 That is cool.

01:26:38.000 He's a proper cool guy, and he spends a lot of time with Spencer as well.

01:26:41.000 Spencer's our friend from Scotland.

01:26:42.000 He lives at the Yokau camp, and he's a nice kid, and they converse a lot.

01:26:46.000 I follow him on Instagram.

01:26:48.000 Do you think that what One is doing is kind of like the future of the sport?

01:26:53.000 Because they're introducing elite-level Muay Thai fighters to a gigantic Asian audience.

01:26:58.000 100%.

01:26:59.000 Especially the way they've got the shows set out as well, where you've got top-level MMA, top-level kickboxing, top-level Thai, the summit for everyone.

01:27:06.000 And it's still going out to these massive numbers.

01:27:08.000 So, yeah, I do.

01:27:10.000 I believe so.

01:27:11.000 They even have grappling competitions.

01:27:13.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:27:13.000 They've got everything.

01:27:15.000 I love that they just do whatever the fuck they want, you know? 0.97

01:27:18.000 I mean, they've got, you know, really interesting talent. 0.98

01:27:22.000 Yeah, he's been saying as well, your chapter, that they've got some TV deals in America and stuff coming up and then, so they're going to try and bring it over this side as well.

01:27:29.000 And there could be, like, some rival to the UFC in the future, hopefully.

01:27:32.000 Well, I certainly saw, I don't remember what network it was, but one of their more recent events was on television.

01:27:39.000 Like, I was flipping through the cable channels, it said 1FC. I was like, what?

01:27:42.000 And it was a recent event.

01:27:44.000 It was like right after the event had happened, then they were airing it.

01:27:46.000 Well, there you go.

01:27:47.000 He's getting out there now.

01:27:48.000 Because they've already got Asia locked down, so if they can get into America and in Europe... 1.00

01:27:52.000 And they're giving chances to other people like from the Philippines and that.

01:27:56.000 There's a lot of MMA fighters from the Philippines coming through and stuff like that.

01:27:59.000 Them guys are good as well.

01:28:01.000 You'd never see it other than we've wanted to give him a platform.

01:28:04.000 That's it.

01:28:05.000 Yeah, it's cool.

01:28:07.000 I mean, they're taking some of the top talent from Glory as well, right?

01:28:12.000 A lot of those guys are going over there.

01:28:14.000 And some from Ilyas Anashi, who was with Infusion, who I work for.

01:28:18.000 He's just gone on to one and then one knocked out the tie.

01:28:21.000 Who did he knock out?

01:28:22.000 I said he'd do that, didn't I? Yeah, yeah.

01:28:24.000 One of these.

01:28:24.000 He did Dutch-Moroccan.

01:28:25.000 Yeah, and he trains with Saeed El-Badoui, the same coach as batters training as well.

01:28:30.000 How do you get...

01:28:32.000 Kickboxing to be big in America.

01:28:35.000 Why can't they figure that out? 0.88

01:28:38.000 It doesn't make any goddamn sense to me. 0.89

01:28:40.000 I think, in my opinion, I think because MMA, I think because there's college wrestling, I think it's stuck as well. 0.90

01:28:50.000 You know the boxing, America's always had great boxers and always had boxing fights, but I think it may be because of the college wrestling and because it's more of what you're used to.

01:28:58.000 College wrestling?

01:28:59.000 What do you mean?

01:28:59.000 Well, they wrestle, don't they?

01:29:00.000 Wrestling's popular, you know what I mean?

01:29:02.000 In colleges and stuff like that.

01:29:03.000 So I think they've kind of touched that.

01:29:05.000 Or, maybe it's a new sport and they've grabbed onto it and they've kind of got it as theirs.

01:29:09.000 Because MMA is really...

01:29:10.000 UFC's like...

01:29:11.000 If Wynne got over here, though, with their MMA and mixed show, and then...

01:29:17.000 If you're sat there waiting for MMA to come on, but in between that you see some fucking crazy tie fight with two people going at it in four-ounce gloves, having a proper war, that might help if they did something like that, do you know what I mean?

01:29:26.000 Then you've got like the average Joe who's never seen it before thinking, whoa, what was that?

01:29:31.000 And I've never seen that before, I liked that.

01:29:32.000 So maybe something like that, like some...

01:29:38.000 Well Muay Thai and kickboxing hasn't took off in England either.

01:29:41.000 It hasn't?

01:29:42.000 It's got a lot better over the years, but it's still not as mainstream as it should be.

01:29:46.000 It's not the platform that it should be.

01:29:47.000 I mean, Yoko, your fight with Haseen Benue is just crazy, you know what I mean?

01:29:51.000 Or one FC, one championship fights.

01:29:54.000 We're always glued to it.

01:29:56.000 As soon as it's on, we're striped with our phones and watching it.

01:29:59.000 It's a shame, really.

01:30:01.000 It's a bummer in America.

01:30:03.000 Dana White had a really interesting point.

01:30:06.000 He said, we got ruined in the 1980s with PKA karate.

01:30:12.000 They used to have PKA karate. 0.99

01:30:14.000 There were some guys that were really exciting, like Rick Rufus, but a lot of it was bullshit. 0.99

01:30:20.000 It was boring. 0.99

01:30:21.000 Kicks above the waist.

01:30:22.000 Yeah, and they weren't that good. 0.94

01:30:24.000 They would just throw a couple kicks and then shitty boxing. 0.92

01:30:27.000 Wasn't the guy called Steve Superkick Wick? 0.76

01:30:30.000 He was good.

01:30:31.000 I don't know who that was.

01:30:32.000 Bill Superfoot Wallace.

01:30:33.000 Yeah, Superfoot Wallace, but there was something called Superkick Wick.

01:30:37.000 What happened in England, though, we got some airtime on TV, and I don't know who it was who chose the fights. 0.98

01:30:43.000 They chose shit fights to put on. 0.98

01:30:45.000 Oh, really? 0.99

01:30:45.000 So, obviously, no one's going to be interested in watching them. 0.99

01:30:47.000 If you're going to get a spot, you need to put out there pre-recorded shows of the best fights and put them on just to get some interest.

01:30:54.000 And then maybe people will just start taking a bit more notice. 0.96

01:30:57.000 But we had a few plots on Sky Sports and they put shit fights on. 0.99

01:31:02.000 That's a bummer. 0.98

01:31:04.000 Because there's so much great talent out there.

01:31:07.000 Whenever I watch Glory, I stop and think, I'm like, how is this not enormous?

01:31:12.000 There's so many boxing fights that are kind of boring.

01:31:16.000 And then you watch this and like, Jesus Christ, this is so much more exciting.

01:31:20.000 Exactly.

01:31:20.000 I got mad around it.

01:31:22.000 And even after that fight in Cambodia, I had an headache for six days or something after that.

01:31:27.000 That was only a six-round fight.

01:31:28.000 That's why I thought, one, that was boring.

01:31:30.000 I didn't like it.

01:31:31.000 I hated it.

01:31:32.000 And two, got an headache for six days.

01:31:33.000 I'm never doing this again. 0.91

01:31:34.000 Because you're taking more shots to the head?

01:31:36.000 Yeah, even when you're hitting your gloves and stuff, it's all like...

01:31:39.000 It just didn't do it for me at all.

01:31:41.000 I appreciate boxing.

01:31:42.000 I do love watching it and stuff, but...

01:31:45.000 Muay Thai and kickboxing is way better. 0.99

01:31:47.000 It's also, the reality is, if any elite boxer decided to fight an elite Muay Thai fighter with Muay Thai rules, they're getting fucked up. 0.92

01:31:56.000 You have a couple seconds to close the distance, Mike Tyson style, and put that dude away. 0.99

01:32:02.000 Otherwise you're getting your leg blasted off. 0.94

01:32:03.000 You're getting your leg blasted.

01:32:04.000 I mean, I would have loved to see a guy like Mike Tyson in his prime if there was a guy like Rico or some elite level kickboxer who could... 0.99

01:32:15.000 Potentially fuck him up on the way in, you know?

01:32:18.000 Someone like Rico's got good kicks and good knees for such a big guy as well. 0.99

01:32:21.000 It'd be fucking no chance, I don't think. 0.90

01:32:24.000 Mike Tyson can always close that distance, though. 0.97

01:32:26.000 You never know.

01:32:27.000 Well, did you see when Mike Tyson and Jon Jones was messing about?

01:32:30.000 Like, play sort of sparring thing.

01:32:33.000 And you could see the right hands going, boom!

01:32:34.000 And you could see what you're doing. 1.00

01:32:36.000 Jon Jones was like, fucking hell. 1.00

01:32:37.000 You know, whoa, yeah. 0.99

01:32:38.000 And also that's a 50-year-old Mike Tyson.

01:32:41.000 Yeah, true.

01:32:42.000 It's just when he was young, like when, you remember the Marvis-Fraser fight?

01:32:46.000 Yeah.

01:32:46.000 That was like an execution.

01:32:50.000 Yeah.

01:32:50.000 Just stepped in and just, I was thinking like, what if someone wasn't an elite kickboxer?

01:32:55.000 Would you be able to hold that guy off?

01:32:57.000 Like that one.

01:32:59.000 The Mike Tyson in his prime when he was storming his way towards the title.

01:33:03.000 Yeah, true.

01:33:04.000 You'd have to clinch.

01:33:05.000 Yeah.

01:33:05.000 You'd have to clinch and tie him up an elbow and knee and not let go.

01:33:08.000 It was that quick.

01:33:09.000 It was that short and fast.

01:33:12.000 You try and grab him that's coming off the top.

01:33:13.000 But some guys did manage to make it to the final bell with him.

01:33:17.000 There were some guys that managed to survive.

01:33:20.000 Yeah, Tony Tucker.

01:33:21.000 Yeah, Tony Tucker.

01:33:21.000 Bone Crusher Smith.

01:33:22.000 Yeah, there's a few guys.

01:33:24.000 There was a few guys.

01:33:24.000 guys Bon Crusher Smith wobbled him as well yeah towards the end that was a right hand and then he just wobbled dipped his legs a little bit Bon Crusher Smith was a powerful dude yeah he was he beat Frank Bruno didn't he he was the first person to knock out Frank Bruno Frank Bruno was up and coming heavyweight then yeah Frank Bruno had the most preposterous body ever He was the original Anthony Joshua.

01:33:45.000 That's why a lot of people in England say that.

01:33:47.000 Yeah, but Joshua's clearly a better fighter, you know, who's definitely more talented.

01:33:52.000 But what did you think about that Andy Ruiz fight?

01:33:55.000 I couldn't believe it, to be honest.

01:33:56.000 I'd seen Ruiz fight Parker, and he wasn't that really exciting fighter out, so I didn't even watch it because I thought it was going to be a whitewash. 0.99

01:34:04.000 And then when I went to the boxing group that we talked about earlier and I seen what had happened, I was like, fucking hell no way.

01:34:09.000 But I'm not sure what did actually.

01:34:10.000 Some of it weren't right there.

01:34:12.000 He just didn't look comfortable from being on the first belt at all.

01:34:16.000 Even on his ring walk, he didn't look comfortable, Joshua.

01:34:18.000 Well, the rumor was that he had gotten KO'd in training.

01:34:21.000 Yeah, I've heard that.

01:34:22.000 I heard that too, but also, I heard he hurt his neck.

01:34:26.000 I mean, I'm not making excuses.

01:34:28.000 You get in there, you get beaten, that's it.

01:34:29.000 And he's never said it, but you can see that the corner's rubbing his neck.

01:34:34.000 It's weird because Robert McCracken's trying to talk to him.

01:34:37.000 And he's just elsewhere.

01:34:38.000 Yeah, he didn't seem with it at all.

01:34:39.000 He didn't seem with it, but, you know, props to Andy Ruiz.

01:34:42.000 Yeah, no, Andy Ruiz looked amazing, but if he had been KO'd in training, if that was the case, then it kind of makes sense.

01:34:49.000 Yeah, but even before that, though, he dropped him.

01:34:52.000 What round did he drop Ruiz in?

01:34:52.000 He dropped Ruiz in round three.

01:34:54.000 Round two or three, yeah, and usually he's a good finisher, Joshua, isn't he?

01:34:57.000 Yeah.

01:34:57.000 But he went in.

01:35:01.000 The whole style of it was weird.

01:35:03.000 The way he was boxing was weird.

01:35:07.000 I'm not going to say any excuses for anyone, but he just didn't look the same.

01:35:13.000 But the rematch will say it all, really.

01:35:16.000 Which is interesting to me about Ruiz is how fluid his combinations are. 0.98

01:35:19.000 I started watching him on pads after that and watching him train and stuff and I'm like, fucking hell, he is actually fucking really good. 0.99

01:35:26.000 Why didn't we look at him and go, he's fucking dangerous. 0.98

01:35:28.000 Yeah, his efficiency with his punches, like, everything's so fluid and he throws high volume stride. 0.99

01:35:35.000 Ba-ba-ba-ba-bam!

01:35:36.000 Ba-ba-ba-ba-bam!

01:35:37.000 He's got power as well.

01:35:38.000 Whereas Joshua is on the outside, he's a one-two big shot guy.

01:35:43.000 It's like Ruiz is, you know, it's a dangerous combination of two styles because if Ruiz gets in tight, he's going to land.

01:35:51.000 You know, he's going to land and he's going to land like a middleweight.

01:35:55.000 The weird thing was, when he was sitting in a picture with the belts, he gave him Ruiz to hold.

01:36:01.000 I thought it was really weird.

01:36:03.000 There's a press conference somewhere, London maybe.

01:36:08.000 No, it was New York, wasn't it?

01:36:09.000 And they give Ruiz his belts to hold.

01:36:13.000 Joshua's belts.

01:36:14.000 Yeah, and I didn't get that.

01:36:15.000 Before the fight.

01:36:17.000 Because Lomachenko went, there was a picture of Luke Campbell holding the WBC belt.

01:36:22.000 And he grabbed it. 0.99

01:36:23.000 And he was like, what are you fucking doing? 0.99

01:36:25.000 That's mine. 1.00

01:36:26.000 He hadn't won it yet, but already in his mind was like, that's fucking mine. 0.99

01:36:29.000 It was strange. 0.97

01:36:29.000 Yeah, I wouldn't ever be doing that if I were defending the title. 0.97

01:36:30.000 No, exactly.

01:36:31.000 You wouldn't do that, would you?

01:36:32.000 If I were defending the title, I'd be like, hands off.

01:36:33.000 Luke looked like he was having fun with them, Lomachenko.

01:36:36.000 They were being friendly with each other before the fight.

01:36:39.000 Luke's a great guy, man.

01:36:40.000 He did a great job, but got massive respect for him.

01:36:43.000 Yeah, he hurt him with some body shots, too.

01:36:45.000 He really did.

01:36:46.000 Yeah, he did.

01:36:46.000 And he hurt him with a long left hook, but Lomachenko just adjusted, adjusted, and that was it then.

01:36:50.000 He was looking inside Lomachenko.

01:36:52.000 I was watching it with my friend, and I was saying, you can see him looking inside the jab.

01:36:56.000 There was a gap in Campbell's hands here, and you could see him just dipping all the time, looking for that gap, and then get that, and then...

01:37:05.000 I was watching him training to see what I could see and he was throwing up a body shot.

01:37:09.000 He threw a body shot and then he was looping left hand.

01:37:11.000 It was so fast.

01:37:12.000 It's interesting also, he dropped him with a jab and that's the same punch that Kovalev dropped Yard with.

01:37:19.000 He stopped him with a jab. 0.55

01:37:20.000 Which is kind of crazy.

01:37:22.000 I think he was more exhausted by that point.

01:37:24.000 That did the damage.

01:37:28.000 That's what Ward used to do, the damage with that.

01:37:30.000 Well, Ward had one arm.

01:37:32.000 That's really crazy.

01:37:33.000 I couldn't believe it.

01:37:34.000 When we were talking about it on the podcast, he was saying his shoulder was basically half hanging on.

01:37:38.000 You know about him, the fight I watched the most is Kovalev and Ward, both the fights.

01:37:47.000 But I must have watched it about 15 times now.

01:37:52.000 It's Jorge Linares and Lomachenko.

01:37:54.000 Yeah, that was a great fight. 0.99

01:37:55.000 That's a fucking good fight, man. 0.99

01:37:57.000 Jorge Linares is class. 0.99

01:37:59.000 Absolute class act.

01:38:00.000 He's very good.

01:38:01.000 Yeah, awesome.

01:38:02.000 And the thing about Lomachenko that's so interesting to me is that his father made him take four years off of boxing just to concentrate on dance for his footwork.

01:38:12.000 It's like, wow! 0.80

01:38:14.000 Crazy.

01:38:14.000 Like, what kind of insight did his father have?

01:38:16.000 That's the thing now, though.

01:38:17.000 When I'm watching him, I don't know where to look.

01:38:19.000 I don't know if I watch his feet or watch what he's doing.

01:38:21.000 Either he's really interesting to watch, especially if you're like a purist who's looking for stuff like this.

01:38:26.000 I don't know where to look when I'm watching him.

01:38:28.000 And his dad won't have interviews.

01:38:30.000 He can't interview his dad.

01:38:32.000 He won't?

01:38:32.000 He won't, no.

01:38:33.000 He said, I will speak after his career's finished.

01:38:35.000 Wow!

01:38:36.000 So he said, I will talk after his career's finished.

01:38:38.000 You know what I'm like?

01:38:39.000 I'm like, tell me!

01:38:40.000 Can you just tell me?

01:38:41.000 Well, I mean, he obviously has a winning formula.

01:38:44.000 I mean, the guy's in the shortest amount of time ever has won world titles in three different weight classes.

01:38:50.000 I mean, it's just results speak for themselves. 0.85

01:38:52.000 Ridiculous.

01:38:53.000 And, you know, there's, I mean, the argument of who's best pound for pound is always an interesting argument. 0.74

01:38:58.000 In my eyes, it's him, there's Terrence Crawford, there's a couple other guys that are in the running, but those are the two big ones.

01:39:06.000 Yeah.

01:39:06.000 Yeah, I would.

01:39:07.000 I'd say Crawford, Lomachenko, Usyk's up there now because he unified the division and he's going up.

01:39:17.000 But it's a lighter division in terms of talent-wise.

01:39:20.000 Yeah, I think Crawford's a great fighter.

01:39:24.000 Eamon Errol Spence is just the same.

01:39:25.000 Yeah, that's going to be the one.

01:39:27.000 That's incredible.

01:39:28.000 That'll be a great fight.

01:39:29.000 Porter next weekend.

01:39:31.000 Yeah.

01:39:31.000 That's a hard fight.

01:39:33.000 Because Porter will come to fight.

01:39:35.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:39:36.000 But I think Spence body shots will wear it down later on.

01:39:38.000 Body shots and uppercuts because he gets close, Porter.

01:39:40.000 Yeah, when he fought Mikey Garcia, Garcia was just a little too small.

01:39:44.000 Yeah.

01:39:44.000 We're a lot too small, really.

01:39:46.000 Yeah, just really wasn't in that weight class.

01:39:48.000 And you see Earl Spence is such a...

01:39:50.000 Earl's just such a powerful guy and big at that weight class.

01:39:54.000 He's a middleweight, isn't he, really?

01:39:55.000 Yeah, he's huge. 0.99

01:39:56.000 He's a fucking banger, man. 1.00

01:39:57.000 He hits so hard. 1.00

01:39:57.000 But he's his southpaw body shots that's difficult to prepare for, especially that long... 1.00

01:40:02.000 He throws that...

01:40:02.000 He's got such a good heavy jab that he can get that left body shot in so sweet.

01:40:07.000 He's just such a good fighter, him.

01:40:09.000 Yeah, he's got skill, too.

01:40:11.000 I mean, he's very skillful on top of having that great power and size, and he's got so many good attributes.

01:40:17.000 The thing about Crawford, though, is his ability to switch stances.

01:40:21.000 Yeah.

01:40:22.000 He'll start a fight orthodox and then just switch southpaw and just stick to southpaw.

01:40:26.000 It's almost like he's figuring you out as orthodox, just trying to give you a different thing to get accustomed to, and then all of a sudden...

01:40:34.000 Yep, done.

01:40:34.000 And that he's better as a southpaw.

01:40:36.000 He's got power from Eva Stantz and stuff as well.

01:40:38.000 Just as good.

01:40:40.000 Just as good.

01:40:40.000 And he gives you no chances.

01:40:42.000 Only since Hagler was the last guy who was really able to do that.

01:40:45.000 Switched stances as well as Crawford.

01:40:47.000 And Hagler wasn't really effective in orthodox.

01:40:49.000 He wasn't that as effective.

01:40:50.000 That's what they say that he lost the fight with Sugar Ray Leonard because he went orthodox to prove a point in the first six rounds.

01:40:57.000 But I think Leonard had done his head in by then.

01:40:59.000 I didn't think he lost that fight.

01:41:02.000 I thought Hagler won that fight.

01:41:04.000 I'm a Sugar Ray Leonard fanboy.

01:41:05.000 Are you?

01:41:06.000 Go to his Instagram.

01:41:08.000 Change your mind.

01:41:11.000 Just watch him and just the way that he slips under shots only for Hagler and the way he just glided about.

01:41:18.000 It's just so beautiful.

01:41:21.000 There was a video he posted recently of him when he stopped Floyd Mayweather Sr. I'm like, man, you forget how good Sugar Ray was.

01:41:28.000 It was incredible.

01:41:29.000 Yeah, he beat him up, didn't he?

01:41:30.000 But my god, his Instagram is hilarious. 0.98

01:41:32.000 He does the most ridiculous workouts. 0.91

01:41:34.000 Like, you know, he's an older guy, but he's like, you know, we're working hard. 0.99

01:41:39.000 I've seen him fucking unload on bag not long ago as well and he was still faster than me. 0.93

01:41:43.000 Really? 0.99

01:41:43.000 He's like 60. Yeah, he does like ladder workouts, like the step ladder on the ground. 0.99

01:41:49.000 Yeah, I've seen that.

01:41:49.000 The press-up one, yeah, yeah.

01:41:50.000 He's like, he's always, he's obviously an older guy, you know, you could tell, but, you know, still active, still pushing.

01:41:57.000 See, I watched, the other day, I watched Maldrick Taylor and Chavez, you know, the first one?

01:42:00.000 Oh, yeah.

01:42:00.000 Class.

01:42:01.000 But it...

01:42:01.000 Did they fight twice?

01:42:02.000 Yeah, they fought twice and it was at welterweight and...

01:42:05.000 Was the second one on brutality?

01:42:06.000 Yeah, he stopped him in round eight.

01:42:07.000 He'd already lost to...

01:42:09.000 That first fight changed his life, man.

01:42:12.000 It was such a beating.

01:42:13.000 And the fact that he made it to that final round.

01:42:16.000 He's one of the worst examples ever of a guy being punch drunk.

01:42:20.000 If you listen to Meldrick Taylor talk, it's so sad.

01:42:24.000 I mean, you can't understand a word he's saying.

01:42:28.000 But the funny thing was, Leonard said how to beat him, how to beat Chavez.

01:42:33.000 He said if he listens and not get involved in a fight and keeps it on the outside and keeps doing what he can do, he'll win the fight.

01:42:40.000 And clearly, because he's from Philly, apparently he liked to fight, he liked to scrap, and then it was just tragic.

01:42:46.000 His story's tragic, because he was my idol at one time.

01:42:51.000 Well, Richard Steele was criticized heavily for stopping that fight with like two seconds to go, but he was correct. 0.93

01:42:57.000 The guy was done.

01:42:59.000 The thing is as well, Duva came on the ropes.

01:43:01.000 This is the story.

01:43:03.000 Meldrick was getting the kick out off Richard Steele, and if you look, Meldrick looks to his right, and apparently Lou Duva was on the ropes shouting his name, and he looked at him, and then Richard Steele went.

01:43:14.000 But I mean...

01:43:16.000 One punch too late or, you know.

01:43:18.000 Well, it's like...

01:43:19.000 He was, wasn't it, in his case.

01:43:20.000 Does a referee have an obligation to recognize that this fighter can survive and if he does survive, he's probably going to win in decision?

01:43:28.000 I mean, does he have an obligation?

01:43:29.000 Or if he looks and he says, the guy's done, the guy's done.

01:43:32.000 He's done, yeah.

01:43:32.000 Whether it's five seconds to go or two seconds.

01:43:36.000 I mean, it's... 1.00

01:43:37.000 But for people watching that wanted Meldrick to win, they're like, fuck. 0.99

01:43:41.000 But for people who wanted Chavez to win... 0.99

01:43:43.000 Look, when he dropped him, I mean, it looked like Meldrick was done.

01:43:47.000 And then from that fight on, he was never the same again.

01:43:50.000 No, never again.

01:43:51.000 And then when he fought Terry Norris, that was horrific.

01:43:53.000 Yeah, he got smashed in four rounds, didn't he?

01:43:55.000 Well, Terry's another one, like severely compromised now.

01:43:59.000 Like you hear Terry talk now, it's really hard to listen to.

01:44:02.000 He was trained by Abel Sanchez, wasn't he?

01:44:05.000 Terry Norris, yeah.

01:44:06.000 Orlin Norris and Terry Norris.

01:44:08.000 He had a brother called Orlin, didn't he?

01:44:10.000 Yes.

01:44:11.000 Orlin was a heavyweight.

01:44:12.000 Yeah, but he beat Ray Leonard, and I didn't like that.

01:44:14.000 And Terry Norris beat Sugar Ray Leonard. 0.98

01:44:16.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, he fucked him up. 0.99

01:44:17.000 Yeah, beat him up, man. 1.00

01:44:18.000 Yeah, Sugar Ray had no business being in there with him.

01:44:21.000 But, you know, Terry took his knocks, man.

01:44:24.000 I mean, the really big one.

01:44:26.000 Well, he had quite a few fights where he was hurt, you know, real bad.

01:44:30.000 But Julian Jackson.

01:44:32.000 One shot, one kill.

01:44:33.000 Yeah, when Julian Jackson stopped him. 1.00

01:44:34.000 One shot, one kill him, man. 1.00

01:44:35.000 Fuck, you know. 1.00

01:44:36.000 Crazy power. 1.00

01:44:36.000 I mean, they're going about Golovkin, don't they? 1.00

01:44:38.000 But Julian Jackson was one shot.

01:44:41.000 No, Golovkin hits hard, but it's a volume thing.

01:44:44.000 Julian Jackson would thump you one time in the face and your whole body would stiffen up like you got hit by lightning.

01:44:49.000 You see him when he knocks out Dennis Milton.

01:44:51.000 You think he hits him with a left-up bang, and as he's falling, he goes...

01:44:53.000 at the same time.

01:44:55.000 Really?

01:44:55.000 He's like...

01:44:55.000 bang, yeah.

01:44:57.000 Hey Golovkin will break you up with his jab first before he does open like that and break you down slowly.

01:45:01.000 Still can't find him though, can we?

01:45:06.000 Every year I come here, 100% say to Brian Dolber, our friend from Double Dose Muay Thai, Brian, can we go to Big Bear?

01:45:16.000 Alright, sure guys, we'll take each other to Big Bear.

01:45:18.000 Is that your Brian impression?

01:45:20.000 That's the deepest I can go.

01:45:22.000 And I'm looking out the window and we never, ever, we went to his restaurant where he goes to eat, but not down again.

01:45:27.000 That's so stalker-like, though.

01:45:29.000 Isn't that weird that you're doing that?

01:45:30.000 I am a weird guy. 0.85

01:45:32.000 I just don't fucking mind admitting that, you know what I mean? 0.93

01:45:34.000 If you find him, what are you going to do, get a selfie? 0.97

01:45:36.000 I would just go, it's him!

01:45:39.000 I don't know what I'd do. 0.99

01:45:40.000 You said to me, Joe said that Andre Ward was coming on and said if he was going on at the same time, he said, fucking hell, I'll have to pick you up because you'll fern. 0.98

01:45:48.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:45:49.000 He wouldn't be so Andre Ward.

01:45:51.000 He would faint 100%. 0.99

01:45:52.000 I fucking love Andre Ward. 0.98

01:45:53.000 Andre's such a nice guy. 0.98

01:45:54.000 Class guy, man.

01:45:55.000 Well, he's also one of the only guys ever to walk away at the top.

01:46:01.000 Undefeated.

01:46:02.000 Gold medalist in the Olympics.

01:46:05.000 Two weight classes.

01:46:07.000 Carl Zaghi did the same.

01:46:08.000 Yeah, Carl Zaghi did the same.

01:46:10.000 Carl Zaghi doesn't get his due.

01:46:11.000 No, he doesn't.

01:46:12.000 For whatever reason.

01:46:12.000 No, he does not.

01:46:13.000 Why do you think he doesn't get his due?

01:46:16.000 I've no idea, to be honest, because he beat all big names.

01:46:19.000 He beat everybody.

01:46:20.000 Yeah, a few of them might have been a little bit past the sale by day.

01:46:22.000 So what?

01:46:23.000 He beat everybody.

01:46:24.000 I mean, he had some massive wins.

01:46:26.000 He beat whoever we put in front of him.

01:46:28.000 I don't know why he didn't get his due.

01:46:29.000 I didn't trash talk either, did he?

01:46:30.000 No.

01:46:31.000 I mean, when he beat Jeff Lacey, I mean, Jeff Lacey was like the Tyson of the Super Middleweight at the time.

01:46:38.000 Because I used to, my amateur club, I used to, with the same club as Robin Reid, Robin Reid on a WBC Super Middleweight title, and then he boxed, Jeff Lacey got smashed, I think it was in seven rounds, and he said afterwards, Calzaghe will beat him. 0.79

01:46:51.000 And then when he was at MEN, it was just like, I thought, fucking hell, Calzaghe's going to get smashed here, but no, he was absolutely class. 0.75

01:46:59.000 He beat everybody! 0.86

01:46:59.000 It's an interesting situation because he's never discussed when you talk about greatest of all time. 0.86

01:47:05.000 He's the best British of all time.

01:47:07.000 Oh, yeah, of course he is.

01:47:08.000 But worldwide, he's not in the conversation.

01:47:11.000 I don't understand why.

01:47:13.000 He did what you're supposed to do.

01:47:16.000 He retired undefeated.

01:47:17.000 I think predominantly, though, he boxed in England.

01:47:20.000 I think he only had two fights in the United States.

01:47:22.000 Yeah, but he was on television.

01:47:23.000 He was scared of flying.

01:47:24.000 Apparently, yeah.

01:47:25.000 Really?

01:47:26.000 Yeah, you should have seen me.

01:47:27.000 I would have sorted that out easy.

01:47:29.000 Scared of flying, but apparently he had a sports psychologist as well who used to work with him.

01:47:34.000 Really?

01:47:34.000 Yeah.

01:47:35.000 So it had nothing to do with the flying?

01:47:37.000 No, but back in the day he used to have a sports psychologist as well.

01:47:39.000 So he was probably one of the first guys to do that, though.

01:47:41.000 Yeah, possibly, yeah.

01:47:42.000 I know Tyson did some hypnosis that he spoke about as well.

01:47:46.000 Oh, yeah.

01:47:47.000 He did some hypnosis when he was a little kid, which is really weird.

01:47:49.000 Yeah, it's a bit strange.

01:47:51.000 Yeah, well, the way he would say that you don't exist, just the task, the task exists.

01:47:56.000 You step into that man and you break his body down and you're like, man, you teach that to a 13-year-old that's never experienced any love in his whole life?

01:48:06.000 That's programming that.

01:48:06.000 That's a different thing altogether.

01:48:08.000 That's a different thing.

01:48:09.000 It worked.

01:48:10.000 Is it good?

01:48:11.000 You're shaking your head like you don't like it as a hypnotherapist.

01:48:15.000 I'm quite...

01:48:16.000 Some people can't fight.

01:48:19.000 I'm not going to lie.

01:48:20.000 Some people do come to me and they say, I want to do this.

01:48:22.000 And I know.

01:48:23.000 I know that it's not going to...

01:48:25.000 I don't work with everyone because I just think, well, maybe you should do something else.

01:48:30.000 You know who can and who can't.

01:48:32.000 You know that.

01:48:33.000 What is the difference, though?

01:48:34.000 I mean, we all know when people can or can't.

01:48:38.000 It's not just with fighting.

01:48:40.000 I think it's with kind of everything that's difficult.

01:48:42.000 Yeah, I agree.

01:48:42.000 I think it's a thing where it's so glamorous to see someone like him.

01:48:47.000 You see Liam Harrison, you see him smash pads, and you see him. 0.99

01:48:50.000 But the actual physicality of the pain, of the nerves, of all the shit you have to go through, I think that as men, We want to be like, yeah, fucking oh, blah, blah, blah. 0.95

01:48:59.000 But when you actually have to go through that, there's a difference in this. 0.98

01:49:03.000 You'll go where other people won't go in his mind or through the pain and stuff like that.

01:49:08.000 And I think it's very difficult for people to actually comprehend men, especially when they think that being a man is defined by that.

01:49:15.000 That's what my opinion is, you know, instead of wanting to be the soldier or whatever it is, you know?

01:49:22.000 Well, it's also that people have physical limitations.

01:49:24.000 That's one of the reasons why Malignaggi is so interesting to me, because he's clearly got a physical limitation.

01:49:29.000 His body is not the most stout body.

01:49:32.000 He doesn't have the best frame.

01:49:34.000 He doesn't have the best genetics.

01:49:36.000 He just doesn't.

01:49:37.000 No, he's never had that knockout point.

01:49:39.000 No, I mean, even he doesn't look like an athlete. 0.99

01:49:42.000 He's just smart as fuck and figured it out. 0.98

01:49:46.000 Whereas Yard, Jesus Christ, you look at him at the way and you're like, that guy's a fighter. 0.99

01:49:50.000 He looks like an athlete.

01:49:52.000 Canelo looks like an athlete.

01:49:55.000 Well then Danny Bill didn't, did he? 0.99

01:49:56.000 Danny Bill didn't look like an athlete, but his fucking skill level was insane. 0.92

01:50:02.000 Yeah, well, there's some guys that just aren't physically impressive looking like Chavez and it was never physically impressive looking. 0.97

01:50:07.000 But he'd break you down.

01:50:09.000 He was such a beautiful fighter to watch because his style, this relentless fucking move forward style, ripped the body, and he never gave you any air. 0.96

01:50:19.000 You didn't have any air. 0.97

01:50:20.000 And he never did pots. 1.00

01:50:22.000 I didn't even know how to hit the fucking speed bag. 0.99

01:50:25.000 Really? 0.99

01:50:25.000 Didn't do any pots. 0.99

01:50:27.000 They had him hit the speed bag once.

01:50:28.000 It was hilarious.

01:50:29.000 He was going to the speed bag like this.

01:50:31.000 It's like... 0.99

01:50:35.000 No one's head's on a fucking swivel. 0.99

01:50:37.000 Why am I hitting this thing? 1.00

01:50:39.000 Sparring hit the bags.

01:50:40.000 Sparring hit the bags.

01:50:40.000 He never did pads.

01:50:41.000 He only did pads when he went to Emanuel Stewart, and that was for the rematch against...

01:50:45.000 Who did he lose to?

01:50:47.000 Frankie Randall.

01:50:48.000 Frankie the Surgeon Randall.

01:50:50.000 I watched that, because I didn't really smoke weed, but I watched that stoned, and I was watching it.

01:50:55.000 Why?

01:50:55.000 I don't know why I don't smoke weed.

01:50:58.000 No, why did you watch it stoned?

01:50:59.000 What happened?

01:50:59.000 Because me and my mate was stoned one night.

01:51:02.000 And then he said, oh, Chavez, he's on.

01:51:03.000 And I was like, oh, no, he's fighting.

01:51:04.000 Because it was before internet and all that sort of business. 0.99

01:51:07.000 And then when he got dropped, what I did notice, because Chavez got dropped with the right hand, all the Mexicans jump up and go, put their hands on their face and went, fucking hell, he's got to drop me, mate. 0.99

01:51:17.000 Went, did he? 1.00

01:51:18.000 Fuck. 1.00

01:51:18.000 And then... 1.00

01:51:20.000 And the rest is history.

01:51:21.000 Well, Randall had that timing, man, with that right hand.

01:51:23.000 He really knew how to time it.

01:51:25.000 And he just had his number.

01:51:27.000 And it was also the perfect storm of Chavez at the end of his rope, you know, long career, like, had a lot of wars, and that style was so...

01:51:37.000 How many fights did he have as well?

01:51:39.000 I think he went 87 on B1. But he didn't beat Penel Whittaker, no fucking man. 0.99

01:51:44.000 He didn't beat Penel Whittaker that time when he was a draw. 0.99

01:51:47.000 No, it was. 1.00

01:51:48.000 That was horse shit. 1.00

01:51:49.000 Yeah, that was horse shit. 1.00

01:51:51.000 Brunel Whitaker was a special talent, man. 1.00

01:51:53.000 He was special.

01:51:54.000 Talk about awareness.

01:51:55.000 Oh, my God.

01:51:57.000 Defensively, he was just genius. 0.99

01:51:58.000 Well, that whole 1984 Olympic team, like, holy shit. 0.98

01:52:03.000 I mean, think about how good that team was. 0.97

01:52:05.000 Vander Holyfield, Brunel Whitaker, Meldrick Taylor, Mark Breland, Tyrell Biggs.

01:52:11.000 I mean, what a talented group of people that came out of that Olympic team.

01:52:15.000 I never realised they were all on the same team that year.

01:52:17.000 They say that it was an easier run for them because the Cubans didn't go to the Olympics that year.

01:52:22.000 But I mean, even so, they'd beat them in the World Championships anyway.

01:52:26.000 But if you watch Taylor, Maldrick Taylor, in the World Championships, he gets dropped and has a scrap in that.

01:52:31.000 So it was in him anyway.

01:52:33.000 He had that dog in him.

01:52:35.000 Well, he was so slick.

01:52:37.000 I mean, that guy was as slick as they come. 1.00

01:52:40.000 He got hit by a fucking car. 1.00

01:52:42.000 That's so sad. 1.00

01:52:44.000 I knew he did like a drink, I was old.

01:52:47.000 Was he hammered when he got hit?

01:52:49.000 I don't know, but I did hear that he did like a drink. 0.99

01:52:52.000 I remember him watching Harold Brazier, and he slipped side to side, got around him and slapped him on the arse and walked off. 1.00

01:53:00.000 How the fuck do you do that? 0.99

01:53:01.000 You're the proper men who can fight properly. 0.99

01:53:03.000 He was so gifted, man.

01:53:06.000 Yeah, there's only a few guys that were capable of humiliating you like he was.

01:53:12.000 Him and Roy.

01:53:13.000 Roy Jones, in his prime, was capable of humiliating people.

01:53:18.000 Glenn Kelly won it.

01:53:19.000 Well, I still think against Vinny Pazienza, it's the only round in CompuBox history where the opponent didn't score a single punch.

01:53:27.000 Which is insane.

01:53:28.000 Because he was fighting a world champion.

01:53:30.000 Yeah.

01:53:30.000 Especially someone aggressive like that who was going to be throwing as well.

01:53:33.000 God damn, he was good. 0.98

01:53:34.000 And then he left uppercourt, right uppercourt, and he stepped aside, left uppercourt, and just finished. 0.99

01:53:38.000 Vinny Pazienza was rock hard.

01:53:40.000 Nigel Benz fighting again.

01:53:42.000 I know.

01:53:42.000 How old is he?

01:53:43.000 He's 80,000 years old.

01:53:46.000 850,000 years old.

01:53:47.000 I think he's 55. Really?

01:53:49.000 55, 54, yeah.

01:53:50.000 How is he doing that?

01:53:51.000 Who's he going to fight?

01:53:52.000 I've heard it's Saki Obika. 0.89

01:53:54.000 Really?

01:53:55.000 John Wayne Powell lost to him.

01:53:56.000 I remember him when Bika is how old?

01:53:58.000 Don't know.

01:53:59.000 Don't know.

01:54:00.000 He's probably in his 40s.

01:54:01.000 I think Roy Jones knocked him out, didn't he?

01:54:03.000 Did he?

01:54:04.000 Back in the day.

01:54:05.000 Yeah, and an old thing you boxed him as well, Joe Calzaghe.

01:54:10.000 See if there's footage of Nigel Benn training recently.

01:54:14.000 I want to know what his body looks like.

01:54:16.000 55, man.

01:54:17.000 He's in shape, though, but I mean...

01:54:19.000 But you remember that fight with Gerald McClellan way back in the day, back when he used to have the dreads.

01:54:24.000 Yeah.

01:54:25.000 And that was like the defining fight where people realized, like, oh, God, a guy who's the elite of the elite, like Gerald McClellan...

01:54:32.000 Everyone was terrified of him as well.

01:54:34.000 ...can get brain damage.

01:54:34.000 Well, that's why I got into hypnosis for boxing and sport is because Nigel Benn, after he fought Gerald McClellan, he said, I'd like to thank Paul McKenna for hypnotizing me and making me believe in myself.

01:54:46.000 Really?

01:54:46.000 Wow!

01:54:47.000 I went to an evening with Nigel Benn and I said I got into the job, the career that I do now, through you.

01:54:53.000 Your influence.

01:54:55.000 Well, he certainly needed it in that fight.

01:54:58.000 Belief in himself.

01:54:59.000 If that had got stopped in round one when he fell out of the ring, no one would have complained.

01:55:03.000 Yeah, it could have easily been stopped. 0.98

01:55:05.000 McClellan was a murderer. 0.99

01:55:07.000 He was a murderer. 0.96

01:55:08.000 Is this day one back? 0.93

01:55:10.000 He posted this on his Instagram.

01:55:12.000 Let's see. 1.00

01:55:12.000 Oh, shit. 1.00

01:55:15.000 Damn. 1.00

01:55:15.000 He looks fucking great. 1.00

01:55:17.000 Fuck's sake. 1.00

01:55:17.000 That's crazy. 1.00

01:55:18.000 All these old guys make me feel like shit, man. 1.00

01:55:19.000 Yeah, me. 1.00

01:55:20.000 That's crazy.

01:55:21.000 Except me.

01:55:22.000 The only thing is, can he hold a shot at that age?

01:55:26.000 Do you know what I mean? 0.97

01:55:26.000 Well, he looks fucking great when you watch him throw punches. 0.97

01:55:30.000 You've seen him with Ricky Hatton on pads. 0.99

01:55:32.000 Look at the speed, man.

01:55:33.000 A 55?

01:55:33.000 That's crazy.

01:55:35.000 And he could punch hard as well, couldn't he?

01:55:36.000 So if he's still carrying a bit of snap in them shorts, which it looks like he is. 0.98

01:55:39.000 I'm going to need you to piss into this cup, sir. 0.72

01:55:42.000 We're buying into it though, aren't we?

01:55:44.000 I'm not watching it.

01:55:45.000 Coming from someone who's on TRT, I ain't buying it.

01:55:50.000 That's amazing, man.

01:55:52.000 That really is another video of him.

01:55:53.000 Let me see here.

01:55:55.000 They're working on some combinations here.

01:55:57.000 But I mean, it don't look bad at all.

01:55:59.000 Like if someone told you that guy was 30, yeah.

01:56:02.000 Someone told you that guy was 30, you'd be buying it.

01:56:04.000 I mean, it's crazy that he's able to maintain that speed.

01:56:08.000 He's got a son called Conor Banu Boxes as well.

01:56:10.000 He's up well away.

01:56:11.000 He's unbeaten as well.

01:56:12.000 55 is old though, man. 1.00

01:56:14.000 That's fucking old. 1.00

01:56:16.000 He used to be fighting another man like that type of... 1.00

01:56:19.000 Yeah.

01:56:20.000 The only thing that I would think is, well, one thing going for him is that he did not fight for a long ass time.

01:56:26.000 Mm-hmm.

01:56:27.000 You know, I want to see what he looks like without a shirt on, too. 0.98

01:56:30.000 That sounded gay.

01:56:32.000 But it's not.

01:56:34.000 I'm just purely as a person analyzing athletes.

01:56:39.000 But even back when he did used to fight, all his fights were crazy wars.

01:56:42.000 I know you've had a long time off, but do you ever recover from that?

01:56:45.000 Right.

01:56:46.000 And how much do you recover when you get hit?

01:56:48.000 Is it all come right back?

01:56:49.000 I mean, he last fought, I want to say 15 years ago.

01:56:54.000 How long has it been?

01:56:55.000 The last time he fought was against Steve Collins.

01:56:57.000 What year was that?

01:56:59.000 He lost twice.

01:56:59.000 About 20 years ago.

01:57:00.000 20 years ago?

01:57:01.000 20 years ago, yeah. 0.99

01:57:02.000 Fucking crazy. 0.99

01:57:03.000 Because he's been in, he got into, he's heavily into the church and the police system like that. 1.00

01:57:09.000 Him and his wife, I think her name's Caroline, they live in Australia.

01:57:13.000 Yeah, because we used to be a party animal, didn't we, back in the day?

01:57:16.000 In his book and that it says he'd have a fight and then he'd go out on a Friday night and he wouldn't come back home until Monday.

01:57:21.000 He used to do DJing and stuff like that, so he was popping pearls and doing all sorts, out all weekend, and he wouldn't stop until the promoter rang him and said, right, you've got to fight in ten weeks.

01:57:30.000 Yeah, and he used to smoke twenty cigarettes a day.

01:57:31.000 Then he'd stop and then go back into camp straight away.

01:57:33.000 But his hands are like that.

01:57:34.000 I've met him and I've been picturing him.

01:57:36.000 His hands are like that big.

01:57:38.000 He's massive.

01:57:38.000 His hands are huge.

01:57:40.000 That certainly helps.

01:57:41.000 Yep.

01:57:42.000 But what I'm seeing there that's so shocking is his speed.

01:57:45.000 Yeah.

01:57:46.000 That at 55, he's still got that kind of speed.

01:57:48.000 And he eats what he wants, he says.

01:57:49.000 I eat what I want.

01:57:50.000 I don't eat anything.

01:57:51.000 He's not on a good diet?

01:57:52.000 No, he says I eat what I want, what I feel like.

01:57:55.000 But he trains all the time.

01:57:57.000 Wow.

01:57:57.000 He runs like 10 miles a day.

01:57:59.000 Yeah.

01:58:00.000 I'm interested.

01:58:02.000 It's got me going now.

01:58:05.000 I'm a little confused though when he says he eats whatever he wants.

01:58:08.000 He's not following a good diet.

01:58:10.000 I would imagine that if you're going to be like Bernard Hopkins late in his career, he was an anomaly, but you attributed it to his discipline.

01:58:19.000 He lived the life unlike anyone else. 0.97

01:58:23.000 I wonder, I mean, if Nigel's not doing that, how the fuck is he able to, I mean...

01:58:28.000 I mean, he might be doing it now, but he said he looked well, and if he's fighting for a fight camp, yeah, he might do it now, but when I've been to see an interview, he goes, oh, your fish and chips carry, I'm not bothered, you know, and he's like, he eats what he wants, doesn't he?

01:58:40.000 His fight with Eubank got me into, like, boxing, that first fight, one of the best fights I've ever seen.

01:58:45.000 I hated Eubank forever because of that.

01:58:46.000 I loved him as well.

01:58:47.000 I hated him.

01:58:49.000 Eubanks was a great fighter.

01:58:50.000 I thought he was a great fighter, yeah.

01:58:51.000 You know, it's just so weird to see a guy come back at 55. It's so confusing.

01:58:56.000 I don't understand what for.

01:58:59.000 Bored!

01:59:00.000 Bored him, yeah. 0.99

01:59:01.000 Fucking bored. 0.99

01:59:02.000 And obviously he can still crack. 0.99

01:59:04.000 You know, he's probably like, I can think I can do this.

01:59:07.000 Yeah.

01:59:07.000 I'd probably be like that, though.

01:59:08.000 If I got to that age and I hit the pad, you know what?

01:59:10.000 That felt alright.

01:59:11.000 I'm thinking of you then.

01:59:13.000 Vinny, I'm coming back.

01:59:14.000 I'll be lying to no people.

01:59:17.000 He's coming back.

01:59:18.000 Yeah, you can see the wheels spinning around.

01:59:20.000 You know what?

01:59:21.000 I can't wait till I'm dead old.

01:59:25.000 Who's the oldest ever guy who came back in Muay Thai? 1.00

01:59:29.000 My fucking cousin Andy Allison. 0.98

01:59:31.000 He's had about 10 comebacks, but he's like 40 and he's coming back again. 0.99

01:59:34.000 But I don't know about the oldest.

01:59:36.000 He's retired about five times.

01:59:37.000 How does he look?

01:59:39.000 My Padman, you'll probably see me on Instagram with him.

01:59:41.000 He's the one who's always holding the pad to me and stuff.

01:59:43.000 So he's still in good shape because he's always training with me all the time.

01:59:45.000 But he's literally retired.

01:59:46.000 How many times?

01:59:46.000 Five.

01:59:47.000 He's fucking insane. 1.00

01:59:48.000 Honestly, I'll have to send you one of his fights, mate. 1.00

01:59:50.000 You've never seen it like it.

01:59:51.000 I was in Japan with him and he fought against Torado.

01:59:54.000 There were five lockdowns in a minute and a half.

01:59:55.000 Dropped him.

01:59:55.000 And I was like, yeah, dropped him again.

01:59:58.000 And then I got back into the corner and I said, you all right?

02:00:03.000 He went, my foot's broke.

02:00:04.000 I went, do you want to sort the fight? 1.00

02:00:05.000 He said, nah, fuck it. 1.00

02:00:06.000 I'll kick him with it anyway. 1.00

02:00:07.000 I was like, Jesus. 0.65

02:00:08.000 And then he went out, and then the next round there were five knockdowns in a minute and a half, so Andy dropped the kid twice, ran in to finish him, then got knocked down three times himself and lost some point.

02:00:15.000 Oh my God.

02:00:16.000 He did people with body shots and we worked on his counter-left hook and it worked sweet.

02:00:19.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:00:20.000 And it was as if he went, hey, fuck it! 1.00

02:00:22.000 I'll do it again and again and again. 1.00

02:00:25.000 And then he just got caught.

02:00:25.000 Went to the well too many times.

02:00:27.000 You saw the Stipe DC fight?

02:00:29.000 Stipe Miocic versus Daniel Cormier?

02:00:32.000 Yes.

02:00:32.000 The body shots, yeah.

02:00:33.000 When was the last time you saw that many beautiful left hooks landed to the body in an MMA fight? 1.00

02:00:38.000 In MMA, it's unheard of, really, isn't it?

02:00:41.000 Unheard of.

02:00:42.000 And the way he was landing it was so clean.

02:00:44.000 But so short, too.

02:00:46.000 It was no wind-up and craziness.

02:00:49.000 It was just...

02:00:50.000 It was hard to watch DC get beat up.

02:01:01.000 He seems a good guy.

02:01:02.000 He's a great guy.

02:01:04.000 He's a beautiful person.

02:01:05.000 But for me, there was also part of me that was very happy for Stipe because Stipe was denied.

02:01:11.000 They weren't even talking about him fighting again for the title. 0.86

02:01:16.000 He was the fucking most successful UFC heavyweight champion ever. 0.93

02:01:19.000 Four victories in title fights. 0.98

02:01:23.000 Won the fight against Fabrizio Verdum.

02:01:28.000 KO'd him in Brazil.

02:01:30.000 Won the title.

02:01:31.000 Then defended the title three times.

02:01:32.000 So he won four world championship bouts.

02:01:35.000 Nobody had ever done that before in the heavyweight division because it's such a crazy division.

02:01:39.000 It's so easy to get knocked out.

02:01:40.000 And then he goes and loses and then no one's talking about a rematch.

02:01:44.000 How will you not They were talking about a rematch.

02:01:46.000 They were talking about him fighting Brock Lesnar. 0.91

02:01:49.000 I know there's a lot of money in Brock Lesnar fighting, but get the fucking right to the title. 0.72

02:01:54.000 When this guy defended the title three times, he was the man.

02:01:59.000 And then he proved that that was the case, and he comes back and beats DC in the rematch.

02:02:04.000 So good for him to get that shot and then capitalize on it.

02:02:08.000 He's the greatest heavyweight of all time.

02:02:10.000 One of my clients was just signed for UFC, Chai Mills.

02:02:14.000 Not Chai Mills, that's his name.

02:02:16.000 Chai Perry?

02:02:18.000 Chai.

02:02:19.000 You don't even know your fucking clients. 1.00

02:02:21.000 I know. 1.00

02:02:22.000 Is it a kickboxer?

02:02:23.000 It's that big cloud of weed we just had to walk through.

02:02:25.000 I forgot who I am.

02:02:26.000 You walked through it, though.

02:02:28.000 You didn't even smoke it.

02:02:29.000 You didn't smoke through it.

02:02:30.000 You mean Chai Perry Lewis?

02:02:32.000 Yes.

02:02:32.000 Yeah, Chai Perry Lewis.

02:02:33.000 Okay, the kickboxer from Glory that's now.

02:02:37.000 Yeah, that's right.

02:02:37.000 He's a dangerous man.

02:02:38.000 You know what?

02:02:39.000 He's such a sweet human being.

02:02:42.000 They said that about Eddie Alvarez.

02:02:43.000 Eddie Alvarez is a great guy.

02:02:46.000 I was so happy when he won.

02:02:49.000 I was so happy because we did some work and I said to him, watch Rikki-Tikki-Tavi, which is a story about a mongoose fighting two snakes.

02:02:58.000 And it's a metaphor.

02:03:00.000 It's a really cool metaphor if anyone wants to watch it on YouTube.

02:03:03.000 It's a 1975 cartoon.

02:03:04.000 It's a story by Rudyard Kipling.

02:03:06.000 And there's just lots of metaphors as to not...

02:03:09.000 Going down certain areas because his stakes were like gonna kill this manga.

02:03:12.000 It's a long story.

02:03:13.000 People want to watch it.

02:03:13.000 It's good.

02:03:14.000 And I told him about that and then did some work with him and stuff like that.

02:03:18.000 And he's such a nice guy.

02:03:19.000 He's a great guy.

02:03:20.000 Such a nice guy.

02:03:21.000 And you know, him going over to 1FC was a gigantic deal.

02:03:24.000 You know, former UFC champion in his prime, heads over to 1FC after a win streak in the UFC. But that Timothy Nostiukin guy is no fucking joke. 0.97

02:03:34.000 They don't fuck around him. 1.00

02:03:35.000 That guy's a straight-up murderer. 1.00

02:03:37.000 He's a murderer, man. 0.99

02:03:38.000 I was super impressed with him. 0.76

02:03:40.000 I'm like, how many guys like that are out there that the general public maybe is not aware of, but they're elite, world-class talent?

02:03:47.000 There's a lot on that one roster as well. 0.99

02:03:49.000 When I look at him, I think, fucking hell. 0.99

02:03:51.000 That's what's crazy about going over there. 0.99

02:03:53.000 Because you're going over there, like if you're a guy from the UFC, if you say, literally, if you're a Conor McGregor or someone like that, and you're a world champion, you're known throughout the land, everybody knows you, guess what? 0.96

02:04:04.000 They might have somebody over there that can fucking murk you. 0.96

02:04:07.000 100%. 0.99

02:04:07.000 There's so many of them. 0.99

02:04:09.000 There's so many badass Russians.

02:04:10.000 Yep.

02:04:10.000 So many.

02:04:11.000 He said that as well, but he said, oh, he's a third world guy, he's got nothing to lose.

02:04:15.000 I said, but yeah, but you've got first world experience.

02:04:17.000 So you've got first world experience.

02:04:19.000 He hasn't. 0.99

02:04:20.000 And when he won, I was at Super Pro Samui in Thailand where I'd go training and I went, fucking yes! 0.92

02:04:27.000 And it was about half eleven at night and all the lights come on, you know, people are fighters and that looking out the doors. 0.94

02:04:32.000 I was like, Sorry.

02:04:34.000 But I was so happy you won because he's such a good guy.

02:04:37.000 He's a great guy. 1.00

02:04:38.000 And that style that he has, like, holy shit. 0.98

02:04:41.000 Like, if there's ever been more of a blood and guts fighter. 0.99

02:04:43.000 Yeah.

02:04:43.000 You know?

02:04:44.000 And the fact that he was able to persevere against Justin Gaethje.

02:04:49.000 Yeah. 0.99

02:04:49.000 And that fucking crazy war. 0.99

02:04:50.000 Like, holy shit. 1.00

02:04:51.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:04:52.000 That kid is hilarious to watch.

02:04:55.000 Gaethje, in the best way.

02:04:57.000 He's so...

02:04:57.000 Did he just beat?

02:04:58.000 Cowboy.

02:04:59.000 Yeah, cowboy.

02:04:59.000 Knocked him out.

02:05:00.000 Fuck, that kid's violent. 1.00

02:05:02.000 Yeah, yeah. 1.00

02:05:04.000 Is he gonna fight McGregor then?

02:05:05.000 Is that what they reckon?

02:05:06.000 Oh, please.

02:05:07.000 Please, God, it's a fight.

02:05:09.000 Please let that happen.

02:05:09.000 Is that happening on 14th of December, McGregor?

02:05:11.000 He put someone in Dublin 14th of December, didn't he?

02:05:15.000 I thought he was gonna box, I heard.

02:05:18.000 McGregor?

02:05:18.000 Yeah, he's gonna box some other Irish kid that he's got beef with.

02:05:20.000 Oh, is that what that is?

02:05:21.000 Yeah, yeah. 0.99

02:05:22.000 Look, he might get knocked the fuck out in that. 0.99

02:05:24.000 That would ruin everything. 0.98

02:05:26.000 I think a fight versus Gaethje would be the fight to make.

02:05:30.000 There's two big fights to make in the lightweight division.

02:05:33.000 It's Justin Gaethje versus Conor McGregor, which is huge, and then it's Nurmagomedov versus Tony Ferguson. 0.99

02:05:39.000 That's the fucking fight. 0.98

02:05:40.000 That's number one. 0.99

02:05:41.000 If I had to give all my blessings to the gods, like for one, I'd say please, Nurmagomedov and Tony Ferguson, please.

02:05:51.000 You know, I'm not really versed in, you know, MMA sort of, you know, things that they do and stuff.

02:05:57.000 But even I, who's not educated in any way, shape or form, I've been kickboxing, Thai boxing and stuff. 0.95

02:06:03.000 But I watch that Khabib and I'm just, I can't help but fucking go, wow. 1.00

02:06:07.000 Because when he got back to the corner, Pettis got to the corner, I like to listen to what they're saying to him. 0.88

02:06:11.000 And he said, I can't keep him off.

02:06:12.000 He said, I can't get him off me.

02:06:14.000 You mean Tony Ferguson, not Khabib.

02:06:16.000 No, Khabib.

02:06:17.000 Against Pettis?

02:06:17.000 Yeah, against Pettis.

02:06:18.000 No, he didn't fight Pettis.

02:06:19.000 No, he didn't fight Pettis.

02:06:20.000 Khabib didn't fight Pettis.

02:06:21.000 No, Tony Ferguson fought Pettis, and then Khabib fought Dustin Porter.

02:06:26.000 Oh, sorry, I apologize.

02:06:27.000 Yeah, well, that's obviously not often, is it?

02:06:28.000 Well, Khabib's last fight.

02:06:30.000 And he went back to the corner and he said, I can't get him off me. 1.00

02:06:34.000 He's just like so fucked. 1.00

02:06:36.000 He's strong. 1.00

02:06:37.000 The thing is with the Ferguson fight, though, it has to happen now because surely he hasn't got many left in him doing what he does.

02:06:42.000 Surely he can't have.

02:06:43.000 He only wants two more fights.

02:06:44.000 Yeah, there you go.

02:06:45.000 I think the plan is Tony Ferguson and then George St-Pierre.

02:06:49.000 Right.

02:06:49.000 That's big, big, big, big, big, big money.

02:06:51.000 Come on, baby. 0.97

02:06:52.000 There you go.

02:06:53.000 I mean, that's the biggest money of all time.

02:06:55.000 What, where would he fight St-Pierre?

02:06:56.000 George thinks he can get to 55. 155. Well, I'm sure I've read someone on the internet that he'd done like a mock wake-up and got himself right down, and I saw that before, and he looked in decent shape.

02:07:07.000 George is smart as fuck. 0.99

02:07:09.000 He's so intelligent. 0.99

02:07:11.000 Yeah, I remember him being on here talking about how intermittent fasting and stuff changed all his life.

02:07:15.000 I remember that.

02:07:16.000 If he thinks he can do it, he can do it.

02:07:17.000 I mean, he wouldn't even be considering it if he didn't.

02:07:20.000 And, you know, he's also training with Kevin Lee now.

02:07:23.000 Kevin Lee's up there training at 155, and, you know, he's decided to go back down to 155 as well.

02:07:28.000 I spoke to Kevin Lee.

02:07:28.000 He's a nice guy.

02:07:29.000 He's a great guy.

02:07:30.000 Great guy.

02:07:30.000 Did you work with him?

02:07:31.000 A little bit, but he was bouncing around to find out where he was settling the most.

02:07:36.000 Yeah.

02:07:36.000 So I kept in contact with him just to not really do anything, but just keep my eye on him.

02:07:42.000 You all right?

02:07:42.000 How's it going?

02:07:43.000 You know, just encouragement, really.

02:07:46.000 He's a great guy.

02:07:46.000 We'll see what happens in the future with him.

02:07:48.000 But I think...

02:07:50.000 If anything trips him up at all, it's like he has this belief that he's the best, and that belief doesn't get shaken by losses, but it also doesn't seem like he makes the proper adjustments.

02:08:05.000 That's why I recommend that he goes to Ferasa Hobby.

02:08:08.000 I'm like, listen, man, if there's ever a guy who could put...

02:08:10.000 I still think he could be a world champion.

02:08:12.000 I really do.

02:08:13.000 But...

02:08:14.000 I think Firas Zahabi is the guy to really hone his skills properly because who did he bring to the world title?

02:08:22.000 Georges St-Pierre.

02:08:23.000 Who does Kevin Lee fight like?

02:08:25.000 Georges St-Pierre.

02:08:26.000 If there's one guy he fights like, he's unpredictable whether the attack's going to be striking or wrestling, mixes it up beautifully.

02:08:33.000 Who does that better than Georges St-Pierre?

02:08:35.000 Nobody.

02:08:36.000 He's the best ever at it.

02:08:37.000 And Kevin Lee does that style.

02:08:39.000 His last fight, Sempierre, Bisping his last fight, because I wouldn't expect him to punch his lights out like that.

02:08:44.000 Yeah.

02:08:44.000 Like how he did, and just, yeah, he'd really...

02:08:46.000 Well, Bisping had a bunch...

02:08:48.000 He had issues going into that fight.

02:08:49.000 He had a real problem with his ribs.

02:08:52.000 Like, he was in the bathroom about to shoot lidocaine into his ribcage.

02:08:57.000 Right.

02:08:57.000 And he was going to have his doctor on FaceTime.

02:09:00.000 And he just decided, like, the problem was, if he fucked up the injection, he could have punctured his lung. 0.99

02:09:06.000 And if he punctured his lung, he was like, fuck, what am I doing here? 0.99

02:09:10.000 So he decided not to do it. 0.99

02:09:12.000 In the bathroom, he talked about it, had his doctor on FaceTime, and he was going to, like, lidocaine his ribs.

02:09:19.000 So he decides not to do that.

02:09:20.000 And also, the reality is, he had one eye. 0.99

02:09:24.000 His right eye is fucking blind. 0.99

02:09:26.000 He can't see anything. 1.00

02:09:27.000 And George knew it, so George stepped to that side, and that's where he caught him with that left hook.

02:09:32.000 Blindsided.

02:09:32.000 Literally.

02:09:33.000 Literally blindsided, yeah. 0.99

02:09:35.000 I mean, look, Bisping is as tough as a fucking human being has ever been. 0.99

02:09:39.000 He is a warrior. 0.99

02:09:40.000 But by the time he got to that fight, god damn, that guy had been through the ringer. 0.99

02:09:45.000 Been through the ringer. 0.99

02:09:46.000 Another one that deserves what he got.

02:09:48.000 Put the hard work in and took his legs.

02:09:51.000 Yeah, and got there through mental toughness.

02:09:53.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:09:53.000 He's as mentally tough as any fucking human being that's ever lived. 1.00

02:09:56.000 When he fought Silver as well, when that knee, the knee, the jumpy knee as well, because everyone thought that was done. 0.99

02:10:01.000 Then he wins the next round.

02:10:02.000 Yeah, there you go.

02:10:03.000 Yeah, I mean, look, Silver walked away like it was a KO. And really, it was kind of a cheap shot because his mouthpiece was out, and he was saying, hey, put my fucking mouthpiece out, we're separated. 0.99

02:10:13.000 And then Silver's like, check this out. 0.99

02:10:17.000 Catches him.

02:10:18.000 It's come back like he did from that, and he still won the fight as well.

02:10:20.000 Yeah.

02:10:21.000 Did a little bit with him as well, Mike Bispin.

02:10:23.000 Flying knees in MMA is like, when one lands, you know, you're seeing guys land them now, like the Masvidal fight with Ben Askren is the best example of it of all time. 0.99

02:10:35.000 Like, god damn! 0.92

02:10:37.000 But in Muay Thai, that is so rare! 0.99

02:10:40.000 It's hard to land it clean in Muay Thai as well.

02:10:43.000 I've tried myself quite a lot of times when I've been fighting, it is hard to land a clean one to the face.

02:10:47.000 You see like the Dutch, what Vinny were on about earlier, they've got it down because what they do is to unload with their hands, make you cover tight, and then drive it straight through a mid-league guard. 1.00

02:10:56.000 So they've got it down to an art then, but for an actual flying, jumping one right across the ring, it is hard to land in Muay Thai.

02:11:02.000 Jordan landed one on Borcal though, didn't he?

02:11:04.000 Yeah, he did.

02:11:05.000 Beautiful.

02:11:06.000 Classic picture.

02:11:07.000 Yeah.

02:11:08.000 There's just so...

02:11:09.000 In MMA, it's like you never know if a guy's gonna shoot.

02:11:13.000 And with wrestlers, that desire to go and dive on your legs and then boom, you get caught with that flying knee.

02:11:20.000 That Masvidal one was scandalous, man.

02:11:22.000 I remember watching your reaction on Fingers. 1.00

02:11:26.000 Fucking five seconds. 0.98

02:11:28.000 But, you know, when you realize that he planned for that, and then he actually set it up by moving to his right to force Ben to definitely lead with that left leg forward. 0.99

02:11:38.000 I mean, he really went to that side and then came at him.

02:11:42.000 So Ben's instinct, he couldn't avoid it.

02:11:44.000 It's like, that's his thing, is to get a hold of you. 0.97

02:11:46.000 and like here it's right on him and then bang that knee comes right up the middle god damn and then it got another one in there and all the shit talking that went on before that fight that was just a devastating loss Yeah, big time. 0.62

02:12:01.000 And he's coming back really quickly against Damian Maia. 0.99

02:12:05.000 And that's an interesting fight because Damian Maia is a fucking strangler. 0.99

02:12:10.000 They're a bad KO as well, right? 0.99

02:12:12.000 Yeah.

02:12:13.000 He was out when he was KO proper.

02:12:16.000 It was a bad KO, right?

02:12:17.000 So to have him fight just four months later, it's like, hmm...

02:12:21.000 Brave.

02:12:22.000 Yeah, and maybe not...

02:12:24.000 I mean, what if Damien Maier decides to stand and bang with him?

02:12:26.000 Yeah.

02:12:27.000 I mean, if anybody...

02:12:28.000 Look, Damien Maier can take you out with his hands, no doubt about it.

02:12:31.000 And if anybody is capable of stuffing takedowns or reversing position as a grappler, Damien Maier is a spectacular grappler.

02:12:40.000 Yeah.

02:12:40.000 Yeah, true.

02:12:41.000 It's going to be brave or stupid, one or two. 0.99

02:12:43.000 That's a right show, though, wasn't it, November 2nd? 1.00

02:12:46.000 Madison Square Garden.

02:12:47.000 Is that on the card?

02:12:49.000 I don't know, but there's a right show.

02:12:50.000 That's one with Till on it, Masvidal and Diaz.

02:12:53.000 I don't think Damien Maia and Ben Askren's on that card.

02:12:55.000 I feel like it's on a December card.

02:12:58.000 It should be.

02:12:59.000 Till versus Gasly.

02:13:02.000 Till versus Gasly.

02:13:03.000 That's a tough fight, yeah.

02:13:04.000 Another tough fight.

02:13:05.000 So Till's going up.

02:13:06.000 That's it.

02:13:07.000 185, huh? 0.99

02:13:07.000 Yeah, we're at my last fight and I said, I said, mate, you are fucking humongous. 0.99

02:13:11.000 I said, what have you been doing? 0.97

02:13:12.000 I'm growing.

02:13:13.000 He's still young, isn't he?

02:13:14.000 So he's still like filling out into his body.

02:13:16.000 Yeah, he's getting thicker.

02:13:17.000 You know, I've got a lot of love for Till because I've got a lot of love for Till because I've known him a long time ago.

02:13:23.000 He stood and all the people...

02:13:25.000 Is it on that card?

02:13:26.000 No, no.

02:13:26.000 Oh, it's on the fight night.

02:13:27.000 Oh, so is it the main event?

02:13:29.000 Is it the main event of the fight card?

02:13:31.000 Yes.

02:13:31.000 Oh, okay.

02:13:32.000 Interesting.

02:13:32.000 Singapore.

02:13:33.000 Oh, okay.

02:13:33.000 Cool.

02:13:34.000 Yeah.

02:13:35.000 And they all bombarded Till, didn't they? 0.94

02:13:36.000 Yeah.

02:13:36.000 And he stood for an hour and a half having pictures told with all the kids, and he was wicked, man.

02:13:40.000 He was brilliant with the people, wasn't he, in Ireland?

02:13:42.000 Well, when he got knocked out by Miles Vidal, that was shocking.

02:13:45.000 It was.

02:13:45.000 Yeah.

02:13:46.000 And the way Masvidal did it, again, his fight IQ is so high.

02:13:51.000 He's so clever at figuring out how to fight his chin.

02:13:54.000 It's going to be a sick fight with him and Diaz. 0.99

02:13:56.000 God damn, it's going to be a sick fight. 0.98

02:13:59.000 If he stops Diaz, then there can be nothing next except for a title fight. 0.99

02:14:06.000 It has to be.

02:14:07.000 It has to be.

02:14:08.000 But I'm just very disturbed by this whole Colby Covington situation.

02:14:11.000 Because I guess, you know, he just feels like they're giving him a shitty deal, and then they're trying to set up someone else to fight Usman next.

02:14:18.000 And he's very upset.

02:14:19.000 First of all, he's got a real grief, a real grievance, because they took his title away.

02:14:26.000 He won the interim title, and they took it away because he wasn't willing to fight immediately afterwards.

02:14:30.000 And he's like, look, I need time. 0.99

02:14:31.000 I fought five rounds of a fucking war. 0.99

02:14:33.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:14:33.000 Then he comes back and looks incredible against Robbie Lawler. 1.00

02:14:36.000 It's like, well, surely now he's going to get the next title fight.

02:14:39.000 And they offered it to him, but they offered it to him as a challenger with, like, challenger money. 0.97

02:14:43.000 It's like, hey, I'm the fucking interim champion. 0.96

02:14:45.000 I have one loss in the UFC. It was a loss early on in my career. 0.98

02:14:49.000 I fought injured and lost.

02:14:51.000 Like, this is, I've proven myself. 0.98

02:14:54.000 And he also puts, people fucking hate that guy, right? 0.97

02:14:57.000 But that's by design. 0.99

02:14:58.000 I mean, he puts asses in seats and he puts eyeballs on the screen. 0.98

02:15:02.000 Yeah, I'll see him lose or I'll see him win. 0.98

02:15:04.000 It's just one or the other, isn't it?

02:15:07.000 You've still got to watch either way.

02:15:08.000 Like Floyd!

02:15:09.000 Like Floyd!

02:15:10.000 Exactly. 1.00

02:15:11.000 I mean, what Floyd did that's so smart is talk shit, show you his money, and everybody's like, oh, kill him, kill him. 1.00

02:15:17.000 And you can't even hit him. 1.00

02:15:18.000 And it's like, number 24-7 would convince you that someone really shit might beat him. 0.98

02:15:23.000 You're like, 24-7, he's done this and that, he's done loads of other things. 0.99

02:15:27.000 You go, he's hard chancy. 1.00

02:15:28.000 I'd be like, that's you here.

02:15:30.000 Yeah.

02:15:30.000 Well, there's also these, there was moments like Maidana when he clipped him at the end of that one round.

02:15:35.000 Yeah, we wobbled him a little bit.

02:15:37.000 You're like, maybe, maybe Maidana.

02:15:39.000 Moseley wobbled him a little bit as well.

02:15:40.000 But then when Maidana fought him in the rematch, he couldn't even come close.

02:15:43.000 And then after that, when Moseley wobbled him in round two of that fight, he just got to school for rest of the fight.

02:15:47.000 He just adjusted like that.

02:15:50.000 Yeah.

02:15:50.000 Third round just went out.

02:15:52.000 He woke up too.

02:15:53.000 You know, Maidana's apparently coming back again.

02:15:55.000 Yeah, you heard that, yeah.

02:15:56.000 How does he look?

02:15:57.000 He was going to...

02:15:58.000 I think he stopped again.

02:15:59.000 He was going to and then he stopped again.

02:16:00.000 Oh, really?

02:16:00.000 He was training to fight and then he stopped again.

02:16:02.000 When did he stop?

02:16:04.000 I don't know, but I read that he was training to fight and then he stopped again.

02:16:08.000 Go to Maidana's Instagram.

02:16:11.000 He wasn't training with...

02:16:12.000 What's he called?

02:16:15.000 Robert...

02:16:15.000 Garcia?

02:16:18.000 Yeah, Robert Garcia.

02:16:19.000 In Oxnard?

02:16:20.000 Yes.

02:16:21.000 Yeah?

02:16:21.000 He wasn't training with him.

02:16:23.000 He was training in Las Vegas somewhere, so we're training with him because that's in Oxnard.

02:16:27.000 Yeah, because he looked like he dropped loads of weight because he put all that Mayweather money weight on, didn't he?

02:16:31.000 He was just loving life.

02:16:32.000 He was just loving life. 0.99

02:16:33.000 Posting photos of his guns and cigars and all that shit. 0.97

02:16:36.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0.99

02:16:37.000 Living the dream.

02:16:38.000 But then he'd lost loads, but then I read somewhere as well that he'd stopped to come back with him. 0.69

02:16:41.000 Well, that kind of lifestyle, when you only have, like, one chunk of money, and it's just sitting there, you're chewing through that shit every day, buying Rolexes and Cuban cigars, and next thing you're like, hey, bro, you got about 100 grand left. 0.99

02:16:56.000 Oh, shit. 0.99

02:16:58.000 Can't make a sweatsuit. 1.00

02:16:59.000 Yeah.

02:17:01.000 I'm 55, I'm coming back.

02:17:04.000 Yeah, I mean, he's not too old, though.

02:17:06.000 My Don is probably 35, 36, right?

02:17:09.000 You got his Instagram?

02:17:11.000 Chino Maidana.

02:17:12.000 It's from March.

02:17:13.000 It's not recent at all.

02:17:14.000 Oh, really?

02:17:15.000 March 30th.

02:17:16.000 This is a picture of him.

02:17:18.000 That's his last Instagram post?

02:17:20.000 Yeah, that's what I remember looking at.

02:17:22.000 Then I read after that.

02:17:24.000 Clarence Bones Adams, isn't it?

02:17:26.000 He trained recently at American.

02:17:28.000 So that's it, huh?

02:17:30.000 Let me see what's going on before that.

02:17:32.000 March is a long-ass time.

02:17:34.000 Let me see that.

02:17:35.000 That's what I want to see. 0.99

02:17:36.000 But I want to see him hit. 0.98

02:17:38.000 He looks thin there though. 0.98

02:17:40.000 That's Maidana looking so much better than he looked. 1.00

02:17:43.000 I mean, a year ago he was fat as fuck. 1.00

02:17:46.000 Yeah, ridiculous. 1.00

02:17:47.000 Like Burt Kreischer fat. 1.00

02:17:50.000 Damn, he looks good. 0.98

02:17:52.000 I don't know why the comeback's been... 0.99

02:17:54.000 Well, who knows, man?

02:17:56.000 Who knows?

02:17:57.000 It's hard.

02:17:58.000 I mean, when you're out for so long to decide you're a warrior again and you're back to being a professional athlete again, the commitment is so significant.

02:18:08.000 Go before that.

02:18:10.000 Not that one.

02:18:11.000 That right there. 0.99

02:18:12.000 Look at that fat face. 0.98

02:18:13.000 Look at that face. 1.00

02:18:15.000 He's so fat. 1.00

02:18:16.000 That's a fat face. 0.73

02:18:17.000 It's hard enough when you've had like two or three weeks off after a tough fight.

02:18:21.000 Yeah.

02:18:21.000 In that first couple of weeks back, getting yourself back into eating clean in the gym every day, getting back into routine and being like...

02:18:27.000 Look at that picture, Jamie, that your cursor's on right now.

02:18:30.000 Look at that.

02:18:31.000 That's what he's doing.

02:18:32.000 Yeah, pimping.

02:18:33.000 Smoking cigars, drinking.

02:18:36.000 Look at his shoes.

02:18:37.000 Yeah.

02:18:37.000 But I mean, how much money did he make on those Floyd fights?

02:18:40.000 A few million.

02:18:41.000 Yeah.

02:18:42.000 Maybe 20. Because the people demanded, didn't it, the second one?

02:18:45.000 Yeah.

02:18:45.000 They demanded the second one.

02:18:46.000 But, you know...

02:18:47.000 When he beat Barona down, though, that would class that one.

02:18:49.000 That was good.

02:18:51.000 That was a good fight. 1.00

02:18:52.000 Yeah, how many people went, fucking yes! 0.99

02:18:54.000 That guy is so... 1.00

02:18:55.000 It's so interesting because he had so much potential, but for whatever reason, he's just, like, stepped on his dick so many times. 1.00

02:19:03.000 Yeah, I think he's... 1.00

02:19:04.000 Oh, look at him.

02:19:04.000 There he was.

02:19:05.000 There he was at his fattest.

02:19:07.000 Let me drop down here. 1.00

02:19:09.000 Damn, man. 1.00

02:19:10.000 He got pretty goddamn slim. 1.00

02:19:11.000 He got close to... 0.94

02:19:13.000 But what is he doing now?

02:19:15.000 Doesn't say?

02:19:17.000 That.

02:19:19.000 Stacks of cash eating cheesesteaks. 1.00

02:19:24.000 Having a good fucking time. 1.00

02:19:25.000 Yeah, that was great when he beat Broner in that fight. 0.99

02:19:27.000 When Broner got right back of him and fucking did that behind him and then he did it behind after he knocked him down as well. 0.61

02:19:32.000 Yeah. 0.96

02:19:32.000 He dropped him twice and he dropped something late on as well. 0.96

02:19:35.000 Well, Broner should have been a superstar.

02:19:38.000 Yeah.

02:19:39.000 He should.

02:19:40.000 But his whole flashy lifestyle.

02:19:43.000 It's just his choices that he's made as well. 1.00

02:19:46.000 Stupid shit like fighting in the street in the middle of Las Vegas, stripping and stuff, thinking no one's going to see it. 1.00

02:19:50.000 I think it's too much too soon as well, I think. 1.00

02:19:52.000 You get that much money, you've still got that immature sort of mindset that he's not really around.

02:19:59.000 They're so talented, but there's no one around them to either they don't look, they don't get looked after, or they don't listen to who's looking after them.

02:20:07.000 Yeah.

02:20:08.000 It's a shame.

02:20:09.000 Some parts of it is a shame, you know what I mean?

02:20:12.000 And he had slow feet.

02:20:13.000 He didn't have very quick feet.

02:20:15.000 Well, I think that was his style, was that Philly shell.

02:20:18.000 That shell style was his...

02:20:21.000 Pacquiao beat him up, didn't he?

02:20:22.000 Yes, he did.

02:20:23.000 And then he burned it after that as well.

02:20:25.000 Well, how crazy.

02:20:26.000 After the Pacquiao fight, he was trying to say that he got robbed. 0.99

02:20:28.000 Ridiculous.

02:20:29.000 Even his corner was saying he was saying, you've got it in the back. 0.98

02:20:31.000 Yeah.

02:20:32.000 And his corner is smart guys.

02:20:35.000 That were terrible corner work.

02:20:36.000 What do you think that was about?

02:20:37.000 I don't know.

02:20:37.000 Because that wasn't close, in my opinion.

02:20:40.000 Maybe somebody poisoned them.

02:20:41.000 Yeah.

02:20:42.000 Yeah.

02:20:44.000 Bit of LSD in your drink.

02:20:45.000 Enjoy.

02:20:46.000 Vinny, what is like when you've worked with so many different people and there's so many different psychological issues that fighters deal with.

02:20:54.000 What do you think is like one of the primary causes?

02:20:57.000 One of the primary things, the psychological missteps that fighters make that you maybe could help them correct?

02:21:05.000 Things from the past, I think.

02:21:07.000 I think it's...

02:21:09.000 Down to what goes on in their lives before they may become fighters.

02:21:13.000 Yeah?

02:21:13.000 Yeah.

02:21:14.000 How so?

02:21:15.000 Because I don't think you can have any relationship with anxiety unless something's triggered it from the past.

02:21:20.000 So I like to go deeper than just the surface.

02:21:25.000 I like to go back and talk to them about the childhood and stuff like that.

02:21:28.000 It seems to work.

02:21:29.000 But the thing is my job, Joe, it's so interesting.

02:21:33.000 Because everyone's different.

02:21:35.000 You know, one's got the same DNA or the same fingerprints and everybody's different to work with.

02:21:40.000 So to say one thing can be very difficult.

02:21:44.000 It's just about keeping them...

02:21:49.000 Where they are completely at one with themselves or they understand themselves.

02:21:53.000 You know what I mean?

02:21:54.000 And not go down certain avenues of getting carried away.

02:21:57.000 A simple example, Eddie told me that before one of his fights in Mexico City, I think it was, he was like, he was just praying or he was that nervous. 0.88

02:22:06.000 He was praying that he just, I want to go to sleep because his mind was so fucking overactive.

02:22:14.000 Things like that.

02:22:15.000 I'm now working with Cody Nolove, Cody Garbrandt, and they're all so different.

02:22:20.000 They're all so talented and brilliant at what they do, but it's all so different.

02:22:24.000 To nail it down to one thing would be difficult.

02:22:27.000 But many times it's memories of failure?

02:22:31.000 Yeah, or just a reminder because in the unconscious, this is my belief that people might argue with it, but I think that you have to have a certain connection with something else in the past to get yourself a reference.

02:22:44.000 It's like I believe that anxiety is something from the past, thought about now, projected into the future.

02:22:51.000 Projected into the future is ultimately who you are that defines you.

02:22:55.000 Or projected into the future as in, you're going to believe you're going to lose.

02:22:58.000 Or you're going to do this.

02:22:59.000 So what we've done now is just lead it on to what we've both been doing.

02:23:04.000 I've got a new thing called the Shoreman Solution where people can go, an interactive website where they can go on videos and there's quite a lot of videos of different techniques.

02:23:14.000 What's the URL? TheShowmanSolution.com.

02:23:18.000 Yeah, it's not out yet.

02:23:19.000 It'll be released when this comes out.

02:23:21.000 Let me know so I can send people there.

02:23:23.000 Yes, please.

02:23:24.000 The idea behind it is you can't just do it in one session, right?

02:23:29.000 You need a bunch of...

02:23:30.000 It's like mental training.

02:23:32.000 That's what pisses me off about fighters.

02:23:34.000 They get contacted me two weeks before, help me out, I need help, blah, blah, blah, you know, or on the fight day.

02:23:41.000 I worked with Molly McCann who had two fights recently, she won on, but I had to stop Starbucks, throw my kids in the thing and get FaceTime and say blah, blah, blah, but I have worked with Molly anyway.

02:23:51.000 But people hire me.

02:23:54.000 After they lose.

02:23:57.000 Hire me before you lose so you can get the best out of your training and stuff.

02:24:01.000 But I think that's the nature of the job.

02:24:02.000 I think it makes you question yourself when you lose.

02:24:05.000 Right.

02:24:06.000 But that can be great.

02:24:08.000 Yeah, it's great for me.

02:24:09.000 But no, I mean even for them.

02:24:11.000 It can be great to lose because it can give you a wake-up call.

02:24:15.000 And so many fighters have done their best work after they've lost and made adjustments.

02:24:20.000 Mighty Mouse is a great example.

02:24:22.000 When Mighty Mouse, well, he beat Ian McCall, but honestly, that is a real questionable decision.

02:24:29.000 Ian was beating the fuck out of him. 0.96

02:24:30.000 Ian had his back, and he's pounding him in the head. 0.73

02:24:33.000 I mean, it was definitely his worst performance, or one of his worst performances. 0.97

02:24:37.000 And then, from then on, Mighty Mouse and Matt Hume had a conversation, like, hey, you can't just fucking half-ass this anymore. 0.97

02:24:45.000 You've got to be all in. 0.74

02:24:46.000 And he became all in and then became the best ever.

02:24:49.000 He looked great as well.

02:24:51.000 He's amazing.

02:24:53.000 He's amazing.

02:24:54.000 But he got tested in that first fight by a guy that no one in America knew.

02:25:00.000 They're all over there.

02:25:01.000 They're all waiting, them guys.

02:25:02.000 Well, they're all, like, waiting, right?

02:25:04.000 Like, all these people...

02:25:05.000 Look, you think about how talent arises, right?

02:25:09.000 When you get to be in Anderson Silva, when you step into the UFC and fight Rich Franklin, he's the champion. 0.99

02:25:13.000 A lot of people didn't know who Anderson Silva was, unless you followed him outside the U.S. And you'd go, holy fucking shit, is this guy good? 0.99

02:25:21.000 This could be crazy. 0.99

02:25:21.000 If you saw his Cage Wars fights, like, oh my god. 0.99

02:25:25.000 Like, he was incredible.

02:25:26.000 If you saw his fights in Pride, you're like, Jesus Christ.

02:25:28.000 Yeah, his Pride fight was intimate.

02:25:29.000 He was amazing.

02:25:30.000 Yeah.

02:25:30.000 I mean, Anderson, before he got to the UFC, I was letting everybody know, bet the house on this guy.

02:25:35.000 Because he's on a completely different level.

02:25:38.000 But there's a million of those guys out there.

02:25:40.000 There's so many of those guys out there in these other countries that no one's seen.

02:25:44.000 They don't get any press, but they've been lighting people up in these amateur competitions and on the small circuit.

02:25:50.000 Just waiting for their chance.

02:25:52.000 Like Timothy Natsiukin.

02:25:54.000 People didn't know who he was until he fought.

02:25:55.000 You see that guy, you're like, Jesus Christ, I like that guy against a lot of people. 0.99

02:26:00.000 He's fucking good. 0.99

02:26:01.000 Dangerous, very dangerous. 1.00

02:26:02.000 Big guy.

02:26:04.000 And that's also the thing about the no weight cuts at 1FC that makes things very interesting. 0.98

02:26:09.000 Yeah, that was fucking hard. 0.85

02:26:10.000 The first time I ever did it. 0.97

02:26:12.000 My first fight, for one, I fought way out of my weight class.

02:26:15.000 I got called on eight days' notice and I took a fight at like 154, which I never fight at.

02:26:20.000 What do you weigh right now?

02:26:22.000 Right now, I've been enjoying America, so I'm probably about 160. But when I'm training, even not in fight camp, I'm walking around at about 155, 156. And you fought 1-5-4.

02:26:34.000 What kind of hydration test do they give you guys to make sure that you're not cutting weight?

02:26:39.000 Say if we fight on the Saturday.

02:26:41.000 On the Wednesday, you've got to weigh in on the scales just so they can see where you are.

02:26:45.000 It has no meaning on it, on anything.

02:26:48.000 But on the first day, you'll have your first weight check.

02:26:50.000 You'll have to weigh in on weight, hydrated, because obviously they'll piss test you.

02:26:55.000 So you're weighing bang on weight and hydrated.

02:26:57.000 If you fail either, then you're going to have to do it again on the day of the fight.

02:27:01.000 So basically, you're going to have to weigh in three times if you don't do it correctly.

02:27:05.000 Mmm.

02:27:05.000 So then you do it again on the Friday, weighing hydrated, on weight, and then on a Saturday.

02:27:09.000 Then you can put all your weight back on, or whatever you're going to do, and fight.

02:27:12.000 Do they test your body to make sure that you're not cutting any water?

02:27:16.000 No, they just make sure that, like, just check your piss. 0.95

02:27:19.000 Basically, they put, like, a little thing in it just to check how hydrated it is.

02:27:22.000 So if you're under, I think, if you're under 250, you're good.

02:27:24.000 And if you're over 250, that's a fail.

02:27:26.000 Interesting.

02:27:27.000 Mmm.

02:27:27.000 So they'll know that you're dehydrated.

02:27:29.000 Yeah.

02:27:29.000 So your weight is not representative of your actual weight if you're healthy.

02:27:32.000 Yeah, yeah, basically, yeah.

02:27:33.000 And so by making you do it several times, they're saying, like, we know what you are.

02:27:38.000 Yeah, and you're not going to, like, go weigh in and then put on 25, 30 pounds overnight and be a giant the next day, you know what I mean?

02:27:44.000 So you're both going to be the same size.

02:27:46.000 Yeah.

02:27:47.000 Why doesn't the UFC do that?

02:27:49.000 Why doesn't everybody do that?

02:27:50.000 I don't know.

02:27:51.000 It's the grossest thing in fighting is the weight cut.

02:27:54.000 Yeah.

02:27:54.000 Because it puts guys through horrendous internal damage.

02:27:58.000 Yeah.

02:27:58.000 Kidney damage.

02:27:59.000 The way the MMA guys do it as well.

02:28:01.000 Like me now, when I'm walking around, I will be seven, eight pounds.

02:28:08.000 They're losing 20 pounds in a week of a fight and stuff like that.

02:28:11.000 It's crazy.

02:28:11.000 Well, with grappling, it's such a giant advantage.

02:28:13.000 Yeah, exactly.

02:28:14.000 If you're going to lay on someone and So big.

02:28:16.000 Such a huge advantage.

02:28:17.000 If you can actually regain your strength, then because of the real experts like George Lockhart, guys are really good at getting guys rehydrated and weighing you in, sucking all that water out of your body, and then putting it back slowly and correctly.

02:28:29.000 It's a science learn, really.

02:28:30.000 It really is.

02:28:31.000 And if you understand that science.

02:28:33.000 But it's just, to me, it's the most heartbreaking part of MMA is to watch those guys with their faces sucked in like zombies.

02:28:40.000 They can barely even stand on scales and stuff, like getting lifted on their scales. 0.98

02:28:42.000 I've been like that before in fights, and I thought to myself, fuck it, I never want to do that ever again. 0.99

02:28:46.000 I'd rather just diet and let them be a little bit bigger than me. 0.94

02:28:50.000 But now, if I finish my career with 1FC, I never have to worry about that again.

02:28:53.000 That's great.

02:28:54.000 I just think that's the smartest way to go.

02:28:56.000 I really wish everybody would do that.

02:28:58.000 I mean, I think it's legal cheating.

02:29:02.000 Like you say, if you've got someone who's lost 5 pounds and someone who's lost 20 pounds and the next day they're putting 30 pounds on, which is just crazy.

02:29:12.000 Vinny, are you seeing a rise in people that take this mental training seriously and take things like mindset training seriously?

02:29:19.000 Yeah, and in different sports as well.

02:29:22.000 Thank you for having us on here because it does get us a lot of attention, doesn't it?

02:29:27.000 So thank you for that.

02:29:28.000 My pleasure.

02:29:28.000 Thank you, brother.

02:29:29.000 And thank you for hypnotizing me.

02:29:30.000 Now I know it's real.

02:29:32.000 You know what? 0.99

02:29:33.000 That was the worst, most nerve-wracking hypnotherapy I've ever I've ever done in my fucking life. 0.99

02:29:38.000 Why? 0.99

02:29:38.000 Well, imagine it. 0.99

02:29:39.000 If I'd nematise you and it didn't work, I'd have to sit here for two hours going, that was shit. 0.99

02:29:45.000 Well, I treated it with respect, and I treated it with full attention, and I didn't go into it skeptically. 0.98

02:29:51.000 I went into it with an open mind, you know, and it's real.

02:29:55.000 I tried to explain the state of mind that you achieve when you're hypnotized.

02:30:00.000 It's very hard to describe, you know, without experiencing it, because it's different than any other state of mind that I've ever had, but you are awake.

02:30:06.000 That's the other thing that weirds people out.

02:30:08.000 They think, oh, you're in dreamland.

02:30:10.000 He's going to take your pants off.

02:30:11.000 You're not even going to know.

02:30:12.000 And it's not a power over either.

02:30:14.000 No.

02:30:14.000 And I'm carrying on continuing to learn more.

02:30:16.000 I'm learning quantum linguistics and time, space, matter, and energy with Colin McKay, who's an amazing guy with linguistics.

02:30:22.000 I trained with Bob Burns.

02:30:24.000 I went down to Scotland.

02:30:25.000 When you say linguistics, you mean by using special language, words in combination?

02:30:30.000 Yeah, and listening to how people's language patterns are.

02:30:32.000 A lot of hypnotherapists now on my Instagram and stuff, they're all like, sleep, hey, look at me, and blah, blah, blah, and you're out, and I don't like that.

02:30:41.000 I can do that, but there's more subtle ways of doing it.

02:30:45.000 And I've been working with different people, Bob Burns.

02:30:47.000 Okay, but what do you mean when you're saying linguistics?

02:30:50.000 You mean like people using negative language that they need to stop?

02:30:53.000 And language to try and get them out of the model of the world. 0.98

02:30:57.000 So inside, to try and move them through their model of the world or their understanding of what they think their problem is.

02:31:04.000 So once you think about a problem and if you linguistically guide them, when they go back to it, it's not the same.

02:31:12.000 When you keep saying linguistically, give me an example.

02:31:15.000 Words.

02:31:16.000 So using inside a problem, outside of your control, when you're above it, instead of feeling like it's on top of you anymore.

02:31:25.000 I'm not completely au fait with it yet, because I'm still learning advanced linguistics with him.

02:31:31.000 And you can see the changes in people.

02:31:34.000 They start to question or consider it.

02:31:36.000 And I think a lot of hypnotherapists don't listen.

02:31:39.000 I listen intently and think, that doesn't make sense.

02:31:42.000 I mean, you do in your work.

02:31:44.000 You have to listen to people and to get where they're coming from and then ask them questions.

02:31:48.000 When you start questioning the belief of what their problem is, it changes.

02:31:53.000 Interesting.

02:31:53.000 What did you experience when you first started doing it?

02:31:56.000 Well, I did it after I'd lost a fight, which we were talking about earlier.

02:32:01.000 I was a bit sceptical, but I knew Vinny did it.

02:32:03.000 I knew he was good at his job, but I've always thought, well, I'm that strong in my own mind.

02:32:07.000 I don't ever need anything like this.

02:32:09.000 But then when I were having the rematch with a guy who just beat me, and not only beat me, smashed me to fucking pieces, you know, first time that had ever happened, and we were getting brought to England and we were fighting in one of the biggest stadiums in England in front of everyone, so I thought, why not go use Vinny and try and make my mind as strong as my body's going to be?

02:32:26.000 You can't ever be overprepared, so I thought, I'll just try and do both.

02:32:29.000 What was the difference?

02:32:30.000 What was the adjustment?

02:32:31.000 So I trained as hard as I always do.

02:32:33.000 I trained the same for every fight.

02:32:34.000 But I went to see Vinny and we talked about it in the last one.

02:32:37.000 We instilled some code words into my head.

02:32:39.000 One of them was warrior.

02:32:41.000 My coach and a few others were saying that in the corner and Vinny were commentating at the time.

02:32:45.000 And I remember him saying in round two, I heard him outside the ring, he went, oh Liam Harrison's a warrior!

02:32:51.000 And I remember him in that fight just like triggering.

02:32:54.000 He stopped me in the first fight because he smashed my legs to pieces, he hurt me every time he hit me.

02:32:58.000 In the second fight I didn't get hurt once, he was like I was in a bit of a...

02:33:01.000 A trance state really because my concentration levels were just like through the roof and everything just worked perfectly for that fight.

02:33:09.000 It was weird to explain how it worked but it did clearly.

02:33:13.000 We did some work recently as well because he felt like he was having a dip in his whatever way he was thinking.

02:33:20.000 So we did some work recently and he even said the other day that he's getting his best performances now because you can...

02:33:26.000 You can forget it.

02:33:28.000 Well, mindset is so important to anything that's difficult.

02:33:31.000 You go into it with a wishy-washy mindset, and you're not going to have the best performance.

02:33:38.000 Look at David Goggins.

02:33:41.000 That's all about the mind.

02:33:42.000 That's where he's going, and that's where he's going, and that's it.

02:33:44.000 Your body can scream. 0.94

02:33:45.000 His Instagram is so fucking important for people. 0.99

02:33:48.000 I fucking love it. 0.98

02:33:48.000 I love it. 0.98

02:33:49.000 It's so important for people.

02:33:51.000 Because you realise that, like, he's saying these gems of wisdom, but he's actually doing it.

02:33:56.000 Yeah.

02:33:57.000 You know, he's doing it.

02:33:58.000 He's not just some... 1.00

02:33:58.000 There's a lot of these motivational speaker guys out there that can go fuck themselves. 1.00

02:34:03.000 Because all they're doing is, like, giving you motivational speaking, but they're not doing anything. 1.00

02:34:07.000 He's up there doing it.

02:34:08.000 He's running in front of the camera. 0.99

02:34:10.000 Yeah, it's fucking class that. 0.99

02:34:10.000 I love it. 0.99

02:34:11.000 I love it.

02:34:11.000 Yeah, I mean, he's telling you stories about, like, mental toughness while he's running.

02:34:16.000 There's something undeniably effective about that.

02:34:20.000 He's better than somebody that just stood on a stage saying, oh, we'll do this, this, and this, and this will happen, and he's there doing it in front of you.

02:34:26.000 It's evidence.

02:34:26.000 Yeah.

02:34:27.000 People need evidence.

02:34:28.000 And his book is excellent, man.

02:34:30.000 Yeah, I've read it, and the audio book's good as well. 1.00

02:34:32.000 Fuck! 0.99

02:34:33.000 The audiobook's even better than the book because you get to hear him talking about each individual chapter, like on these unreal stories in between the chapters. 1.00

02:34:42.000 Like, the book is great.

02:34:43.000 The audiobook is better.

02:34:44.000 Imagine him hunting you. 1.00

02:34:46.000 You've got no fucking chance. 1.00

02:34:47.000 You just go, find me, you found me. 1.00

02:34:49.000 He's never going to get tired.

02:34:51.000 He's going to keep going forever.

02:34:52.000 It's like Terminator, isn't it?

02:34:52.000 It's like T-1000.

02:34:54.000 But it's just important to know that there are people like that out there that are going to take it to the top level of human physical potential.

02:35:02.000 And that's what he's doing.

02:35:03.000 There's a lot of those guys out there, like my friend Cam Haynes, like Courtney Dowalter. 1.00

02:35:08.000 There's people that can do shit. 0.99

02:35:10.000 You have this idea of physical limitations. 1.00

02:35:13.000 Everybody does.

02:35:14.000 Well, they lead ways, don't they?

02:35:15.000 I mean, Roger Bannister did it, didn't he?

02:35:16.000 He broke the four-minute mile and then everyone else started doing it.

02:35:19.000 Wim Hof. 0.67

02:35:20.000 Yeah.

02:35:20.000 But what I like about this show and what I like about you is you give people understandings of things that you wouldn't really look into, like David Sinclair, Matthew Walker...

02:35:29.000 You know, these people that give us information and that.

02:35:32.000 It's invaluable, man.

02:35:33.000 To us and to everybody else.

02:35:34.000 Well, to me too, man.

02:35:35.000 It's great.

02:35:35.000 I'm very fortunate that I have this platform and these guys are willing to come and tell us about these things.

02:35:41.000 Because it's just, you could learn so much that just was not available to us when we were kids.

02:35:46.000 It didn't exist.

02:35:47.000 There was no outlet like we have now with podcasts.

02:35:51.000 Yeah, Elon Musk, all them guys.

02:35:52.000 It's incredible.

02:35:53.000 There's so many people that are thankful to you for what you do.

02:35:57.000 Like me, I wasn't.

02:35:58.000 Thank you, man.

02:35:59.000 I'm thankful to them.

02:36:00.000 I'm thankful to you guys, too.

02:36:01.000 I enjoyed this conversation as well.

02:36:04.000 Thank you, sir.

02:36:04.000 We did it.

02:36:05.000 Alright.

02:36:05.000 Thank you, gentlemen.

02:36:06.000 Anything to say?

02:36:07.000 Anything plugs?

02:36:08.000 Anything before we go?

02:36:09.000 Just to plug the Watchers group that had a seminar of mine the other day, Zach.

02:36:14.000 Zach Foldman and Chase Hero.

02:36:17.000 I'm working with them at the moment.

02:36:18.000 They're two guys.

02:36:19.000 In this mindset training thing?

02:36:21.000 Yes.

02:36:21.000 Yeah, the mindset training thing.

02:36:23.000 What's the URL going to be and when's it going to be live?

02:36:25.000 They just have a watchers group.

02:36:27.000 No, your thing.

02:36:28.000 Oh, mine, I apologise.

02:36:29.000 The Shoreman Solution.

02:36:30.000 And when is that going to be available?

02:36:32.000 That's going to be available when this show is finished.

02:36:34.000 Right at the end?

02:36:35.000 Yes.

02:36:35.000 Okay.

02:36:35.000 My website's up and running now if anyone wants to learn any Muay Thai.

02:36:39.000 It's an online course.

02:36:39.000 Over 300 technique videos on there.

02:36:41.000 LiamHarrisonTraining.com.

02:36:43.000 Beautiful.

02:36:43.000 Thank you, gentlemen.

02:36:44.000 Thank you, sir.

02:36:45.000 Fun times.

02:36:45.000 Thank you, mate.

02:36:45.000 Cheers.

02:36:46.000 Woo! 0.99

02:36:47.000 Woo! 0.99

02:36:48.000 Thank you, Joe.

The Joe Rogan Experience - February 10, 2011

JRE MMA Show #79 with Vinny Shoreman & Liam Harrison

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Transcript