The John-Henry Westen Show - September 03, 2024


Is it biblical to say Mary is a co-redeemer with Christ？


Episode Stats

Length

28 minutes

Words per Minute

161.64738

Word Count

4,532

Sentence Count

296

Misogynist Sentences

4

Hate Speech Sentences

8


Summary

In this episode of the John Henry Weston Show, Dr. Mark Miravelle joins us to discuss the question of what is the next Marian dogma and why it is so important to the Catholic Church. We also hear from Bishop Joseph Strickland of the Archdiocese of St. Louis, who is in exile, and joins us at the Rome Life Forum in Exile this October 17-18 in Kansas City, Missouri.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Never before in the church's history, never, has Our Lady used a false apparition image
00:00:06.480 to transmit an authentic message.
00:00:17.740 You know, my friends, there's a really neat thing about the change we talked about last week with
00:00:24.580 Dr. Mark Miravelle of how the Vatican is dealing with Marian apparitions. One of the big things
00:00:30.040 that has been talked about for many, many years, in fact, over 20 years inside of the Catholic Church
00:00:37.220 has been what a lot of people refer to as a coming last Marian dogma, something like that.
00:00:42.580 But it's the formalization of what the church has believed forever about Our Lady's special role
00:00:48.620 in co-redemption, co-redemptrix, it's called. Also that she's the mediatrix of all graces.
00:00:55.080 You know, those things have been sort of taught in the church, but they've never been
00:00:58.940 formally taught as this is dogma of the church. In other words, all Catholics must believe this.
00:01:05.220 Like the last dogma was 1955 when we were told we must believe in the assumption of Our Lady
00:01:10.980 into heaven in order to be Catholic. And that question about the coming or formalization of
00:01:18.860 those teachings also is called into question by this new approach of the dicastery for the doctrine
00:01:27.640 of faith and the changes that we had a few months ago now. And I wanted to bring Dr. Miravelle back on
00:01:33.380 in order to discuss that aspect as well. Stay tuned to this episode of the John Henry Weston Show.
00:01:40.040 This October 17th and 18th, we are going to be running Rome Life Forum in Exile. We're doing that
00:01:47.320 in Kansas City, Missouri. This fine bishop, Bishop Joseph Strickland, sort of in exile,
00:01:52.200 is going to be joining us there as well as Dr. Janet Smith, as well as prophecy expert Xavier Aral and
00:01:59.780 many more, including a special guest. Hope to see you there.
00:02:03.820 Hope to see you there. God bless you. Romelifeforum.com. Sign up now.
00:02:10.020 Mark, so good to have you back again. It's my pleasure. Thanks for asking me back, John Henry.
00:02:14.340 And let's begin as we always do with the sign of the cross. In the name of the Father,
00:02:18.240 and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen. So what I wanted to ask you about this time was
00:02:25.200 really sort of the central focus sort of of your life's work. You've been promoting this idea for a
00:02:30.680 long time now that Catholics, that the church should proclaim formally, even though she sort of
00:02:36.200 taught it all throughout, but proclaim formally a dogma on the reality of Mary's role as co-redemptrix
00:02:43.140 and mediatrix of all graces. Maybe you can start with just explaining what that means anyway.
00:02:48.940 Sure. And let me start with a historical fact here that this movement for a fifth Marian dogma really
00:02:55.600 started back in 1915 with a Belgian cardinal who during World War I thought it would release great
00:03:02.260 graces and peace to the world if we involved Our Lady, if we brought Our Lady as, again, remedy for
00:03:09.400 the challenges that we're facing during World War I. And so it's exactly as you say, it's already a
00:03:16.340 doctrinal teaching of the church that Mary is the co-redemptrix, mediatrix of all graces, and advocate.
00:03:22.520 What does that mean specifically? Well, think of it in terms of a mother. A mother suffers for her
00:03:27.780 children. A mother nourishes her children. A mother pleads and protects her children. Well, that's what
00:03:34.240 Our Lady does for each one of us, for all humanity, really, John Henry, because she's a mother of all
00:03:39.640 peoples. So co-redemptrix indicates that Mary uniquely participated with and under Jesus in the redemption of
00:03:47.360 humanity. That God wanted a woman. God wanted a human woman involved in the restoration of grace
00:03:54.500 just as a human woman was involved in the loss of grace, Eve with Adam. So co-redemptrix, I find it
00:04:02.840 almost amusing how people see it controversially, but co just means with. Redemptrix is a suffix
00:04:10.660 regarding to a woman with Redeemer. So the term just means the woman with the Redeemer.
00:04:16.320 You want a simple definition of co-redemptrix, it means Mary helped Jesus save souls like no one else,
00:04:23.000 but it's entirely, completely, absolutely dependent on our Lord Jesus. I mean, do you think St. Paul
00:04:29.380 would have a problem with that, or St. Peter or St. John would say, no, I actually think I helped Jesus
00:04:33.380 more than Mary. It's not really so controversial. So that's co-redemptrix.
00:04:39.680 Let's go into that co-redemptrix for a second, because I mean, in a way, don't we all participate
00:04:46.100 in redeeming? When you fast and you pray for your brother, your sister, your father, your mother,
00:04:52.400 whatever, aren't you helping in some way? Co-redemptrix in some way? I understand co-redemptrix
00:04:57.920 means a special place, and she does that uniquely. Totally understood, but that concept isn't
00:05:03.520 controversial at all. Not at all. This is basic Christian revelation. I mean, St. Paul calls us
00:05:12.420 to be co-workers with God. Does that mean equal? Of course not. That's blasphemy. Colossians 1.24,
00:05:19.580 we're called to make up what is lacking in the sufferings of Christ for the sake of his body,
00:05:24.000 which is the church. Or let's go domestic, John Henry. What did we do when we were kids and we
00:05:28.680 fell and we hurt our knee? What did our mom say? Offer it up. Offer it up, honey. What does that mean?
00:05:34.840 I mean, patiently endure it, because there's a supernatural value there. Right. Before you
00:05:39.700 continue there, the kids will go, wait a minute, that seems like you're uncaring. No. It totally
00:05:45.760 acknowledges your hurt and pain, because if we see in Jesus that unbelievable suffering, no one says of
00:05:51.800 Jesus, hey, you don't really hurt, just offer it up. No, they're saying you do really hurt,
00:05:56.220 and that hurt paid our way for salvation. And so we're actually saying, when we say offer it up,
00:06:01.580 we love you. We know you're in really bad pain, and it hurts us to see you in bad pain,
00:06:05.020 but you know what? That pain can be redemptive. Anyway, I don't want to get in trouble with my kids.
00:06:10.480 It's not free of suffering with the person you love that's suffering, but it's a, let's make this
00:06:17.900 supernatural. Let's help someone get out of purgatory. Let's help someone be baptized. And
00:06:24.360 St. John Paul II brilliantly explains that the redemption of Jesus is creatively opened up to
00:06:30.300 us in virtue of our baptism. So John Paul II called us all to be co-redeemers in Christ.
00:06:36.900 Pius XI before him said, you're all co-redeemers in Christ. And listen to this from Benedict XVI.
00:06:42.020 He's blessing people at Fatima with the Eucharist. He's blessing the sick. And he says,
00:06:47.540 quote, I call you all to be redeemers in the redeemer, not a co-word. That's either blasphemy,
00:06:57.260 or it's the truth that we're all called to participate in the salvation of each other,
00:07:03.080 of others who are not in the church. But no one like the mother, no one who gave birth to the word
00:07:08.780 made flesh. I mean, who else can say that, that I gave flesh to the redeemer? I have to tell you,
00:07:14.500 John Henry, I was talking with Mother Teresa about this years back down in Calcutta. And I said,
00:07:20.020 Mother, do you believe Mary's co-redemptrix? She said, of course she's the co-redemptrix.
00:07:24.940 She gave Jesus his body and his body is what saved us.
00:07:28.520 You did say something pretty controversial, though, when you quoted the scriptures. And I know that might
00:07:33.440 seem weird, but you said, you quoted St. Paul, but this is a hard saying. He said, I make up
00:07:40.720 in my own body what's lacking in the sufferings of Christ. Can you unpack that? Because that sounds
00:07:47.200 weird. What do you mean lacking in the sufferings? How can there be a lacking in the suffering of
00:07:51.880 Christ? Yeah. So it sounds, to use a proper theological term, it sounds weird for two reasons.
00:07:57.740 First of all, it sounds weird because it sounds like Jesus didn't do enough. Secondly, it sounds weird
00:08:02.200 because thank God we're around to save and make up what Jesus didn't do. Both of those possibly be
00:08:08.500 right. John Paul II brilliantly unpacks this. And you want to read a beautiful document on the
00:08:13.840 Christian meaning of human suffering. It's John Paul's 1984 document on suffering. And he says
00:08:20.340 that objectively, Jesus paid an infinite price on Calvary, which is completely super abundant.
00:08:29.180 At the same time, out of love for us, he allows us to participate in his greatest historic universal
00:08:39.860 act, which is redemption. So it's the generosity of Jesus who allows us to be co-redeemers and
00:08:47.400 co-workers. It's not out of strict necessity. It's out of generosity. So that's what's called
00:08:53.200 subjective redemption. So Jesus paid the price. The storehouse of graces are infinite. But by our
00:08:59.700 prayers, our sacrifices, and as the kids at Fatima are told, accepting things you cannot change,
00:09:06.420 you can release those graces already merited by Jesus, the new Adam, and secondarily by Mary,
00:09:13.880 the new Eve. She also had a role in acquiring and obtaining the graces, St. John Paul II tells us. But
00:09:20.580 you're absolutely right. It's a call for every single Christian.
00:09:23.780 Something you just said before that was really beautiful too. You talked about how it's true.
00:09:28.740 God didn't need, he had no absolute need of Mary to redeem the world. He could have come as God.
00:09:36.280 But in order to suffer, in order to do what sacrifice he wanted to make for us,
00:09:44.120 he needed Our Lady to give him that body to suffer. Those hands to be pierced, those feet to be nailed,
00:09:51.340 that head to be crowned with thorns. It's an amazing participation.
00:09:54.480 It's so very true. And St. Augustine says, God created us without it, but he did not will to save us
00:10:03.400 without us. And that's a statement. And so we are called to cooperate with God's plan,
00:10:11.220 both for our own salvation and also for the salvation of others. Our Lady does it uniquely.
00:10:17.420 No one else gave flesh to the word. No one else was, as John Paul says, spiritually crucified
00:10:23.400 with her crucified son at Calvary so that she could be co-redemptrix for us. And really,
00:10:30.700 you know, as we talked about in our first session, the apparitions, the private revelation
00:10:36.560 really tries to call us to be more generous in places where perhaps we need a little encouragement,
00:10:43.720 like prayer, like rosary, like fasting, reparation. These are all things that are true. And that's why,
00:10:51.520 again, I see the importance of these messages. And I think, again, it's very important that the
00:10:58.720 Dicastery for the Doctrine of Faith understand this importance and champions the doctrines that are
00:11:04.900 really behind these truths rather than in any way to minimize that she is, in fact, the co-redemptrix
00:11:12.400 and mediatrix of all graces. Because ultimately, John Henry, I think some of the statements more
00:11:17.680 recently regarding some of the apparitions really seem to be a concern, a caution about these
00:11:25.080 traditional doctrines. And I would just say there's no reason to be concerned about co-redemptrix
00:11:29.900 and mediatrix of all graces, because they're in fact embedded in three to four centuries of papal
00:11:35.360 teaching. Indeed. I think the advocate is pretty clear. Advocate everybody knows is someone who
00:11:40.000 speaks for you, like your lawyer and someone who represents you. And everybody can see that with
00:11:44.320 Our Lady pleading on our behalf to her son, who is still her son, and therefore wants very much to
00:11:51.700 listen to his mother, to acquiesce to her wishes the way he did on earth when she was like,
00:11:55.660 they have no wine, by the way. But what's this mediatrix of all graces? I think there's some
00:12:02.060 confusion there. What is a mediatrix of all graces? The lists are really beautiful. Many people maybe
00:12:07.680 don't get a thrill out of reading, you know, papal texts. But when you read these texts of the last
00:12:13.200 three centuries of Popes on Our Lady that tell us over and over and over again that every single grace
00:12:20.380 of Jesus Christ that we receive comes to us through the mediation of Our Lady. And that's what the
00:12:28.640 church means, why basically you have an unbroken line of Popes from Benedict XIV back in the middle
00:12:37.180 of the 18th century to our present Holy Father, Pope Francis, who have all referred to Our Lady as
00:12:44.100 mediatrix of all graces or made reference of that role or have honored that title. So this is a
00:12:52.440 doctrine that's not going away. This is a central Catholic doctrine that every single grace we receive
00:12:58.160 from Jesus, we receive through the mediation of Our Lady. Yeah, I remember my dad when I was growing up
00:13:04.140 used to say very simply, well, the scriptures say all grace and truth come through Jesus Christ
00:13:10.000 and Jesus Christ came through Mary. So for me, it was pretty simple. It's a beautiful truth. I'm very
00:13:16.100 much into true devotion to Mary. And in there, he unpacks that in such a beautiful way.
00:13:21.540 Pope Pius XI said, men must look for the peace of Christ in the kingdom of Christ. And he urged that
00:13:29.320 the faithful give public honor to Christ the King so that individuals and states would submit once more
00:13:34.860 to the rule of their savior. And that is why LifeSite News is raising up the image of Christ
00:13:40.620 the King across the United States. And you can help us reach millions more. Please pledge your support
00:13:47.140 today for these billboards at lifefunder.com slash Christ is King. But I think we need to get to the
00:13:57.100 other issue, and that is this beautiful teaching of our church, which has been around forever,
00:14:01.840 but not yet made into a dogma. And as you said, since 1915, that I had no idea. But anyway,
00:14:06.840 the move to get it to dogmatic status has been around since like 1915, as you said.
00:14:13.180 Okay, what do these new regulations do to this? And where do you see your concern about this?
00:14:20.080 In a certain sense, the new norms should have no impact on what is a pre-conciliar and post-conciliar
00:14:29.380 official teaching of the papal magisterium, that Mary is the mediatrix of all graces,
00:14:34.900 and that Mary had a unique role with and under Jesus in the redemption of all humanity. Now,
00:14:40.680 not every pope used the title co-redemptrix. John Paul II did on seven occasions, but the title
00:14:46.160 is just connecting with the doctrine. My concern came in one of the commentaries, this is July 8th of
00:14:55.320 2024, by the DDF. It was actually on the Rosa Mystica apparitions, very beautiful apparitions.
00:15:04.660 And in this document, the DDF, if you recall what we talked about in our last program,
00:15:10.220 the DDF gave permission for the local bishop to make a declaration of Neil Obstokt.
00:15:16.000 That's the highest new level, right? Among the new levels, which before it used to be that the
00:15:21.620 local bishop could make that determination of this is supernatural, they've eliminated that
00:15:25.920 altogether. The bishop doesn't have any local permission himself to do anything, but they've
00:15:29.760 also eliminated that category altogether. So the highest level of approval now is this
00:15:33.900 Neil Obstokt or there's like, what, no errors inside this thing.
00:15:37.880 Then it gradates down about other problems with kind of unusual titles of oculus preabitor,
00:15:45.620 which means essentially keep your eyes on this, and then curatu, careful, and then prohibitor anyway.
00:15:51.520 So it doesn't give the overall impression of a great appreciation. Of course, that always
00:15:57.540 is dependent on the individual call. But I want to read just one reference, John Henry, that I think
00:16:02.360 is particularly concerning and has called many a Mariologist to write to the DDF just for
00:16:09.100 clarification. And this is on their statement, their commentary regarding Rosa Mystica. And they
00:16:16.360 actually quote, because the Rosa Mystica message is packed with references of Our Lady as mediatrics
00:16:21.720 of all graces. But then the DDF quotes this line. It says, quote, at the same time, it must be
00:16:28.180 maintained that only the Lord can act in people's hearts by bestowing sanctifying grace that uplifts and
00:16:35.000 transforms, because sanctifying grace is first and foremost the gift of the Spirit who justifies
00:16:40.480 and sanctifies us. In this action, which only God can do in the depths without overlooking our freedom,
00:16:47.860 there is no other possible mediation, not even that of the Blessed Virgin Mary. Now, once again,
00:16:56.820 my task is not to judge hearts, but it's just to state facts. To say that Mary doesn't have a role
00:17:04.360 in the mediation of graces, again, is just a contradiction of three to four centuries of
00:17:10.700 papal teaching. Perhaps it was an error by one of the writers. Perhaps it passed through. Perhaps
00:17:15.460 it was intended to something else. But as that stands, that cannot be a legitimate position. And
00:17:21.720 I find it in the Rosa Mystica commentary. I also find it potentially in the statement that came out
00:17:30.880 over the summer regarding the Amsterdam apparitions. And not to get into a lot of detail here, but just
00:17:36.520 quickly stating the facts, that in 1974, these apparitions were given the status of non-konstat.
00:17:44.260 And remember, non-konstat means we don't confirm, we don't deny, but we're not establishing it as
00:17:49.300 supernatural yet. Well, then, in the early 80s, it was the congregation itself that talked to the local
00:17:58.840 ordinary in Amsterdam about allowing some level of devotion. Still apart from making a declaration
00:18:07.960 of authenticity, but it was actually the CDF that initiated that. And then in 1995, there was a meeting
00:18:15.580 in Rome, which confirmed that the bishop could make a statement about the devotion. And the bishop at
00:18:23.360 that time, Bishop Bowmers, said that you can have veneration to the Lady of All Nations, and you can
00:18:31.160 believe the messages according to conscience. Well, 2002, the new bishop, because he was being, you know,
00:18:38.040 stormed by petitions from people all over the world, saying, is this true? Is this apparition true or not?
00:18:42.920 So he made a very moderate opinion, a very moderate statement on this, John Henry, which has to be
00:18:48.420 emphasized. He said, I approve, in essence, the authenticity, but he made very clear that not every word
00:18:57.140 is necessarily approved, that there's still the human filter involved. It was a very wise, a very prudent
00:19:03.980 statement. Jump to 2020, the congregation at that time for the Doctrine of Faith asked the new local bishop
00:19:10.800 to change the status from constat, which the bishop said in 2002 that it was relatively supernatural,
00:19:19.180 essentially supernatural, to now non-constat. And then finally, on July 11th of this summer of 2024,
00:19:27.640 the DDF came out and said, constat de non. So, of course, that's its present status. Constat de non
00:19:36.680 means that at this point, it's established as not being supernatural. But you can see in the history
00:19:44.160 of this, it's gone from non-constat to being approved to now being back to non-constat to constat de non.
00:19:53.580 So I simply want to state the facts regarding that. That's the present status. But I want to say this
00:19:58.680 very clearly. Its own history shows you that disciplines can change. It was the CDF that initiated
00:20:05.760 a new openness to veneration. And so we obey disciplines, but by the very nature, they can
00:20:12.240 change. I always think of Padre Pio. Padre Pio was prohibited by his local bishop with the approval
00:20:18.280 of Pius XI, and he went from prohibition to canonization. Divine Mercy, 20 years, was prohibited
00:20:25.100 with the approval of John XXIII. Went from prohibition to a liturgical feast on Sundays.
00:20:31.960 Most recently, Rosa Mystica, the ones we're talking about in northern Italy, had five different
00:20:37.580 negative judgments before July 8th of 2024. Now the DDF has allowed it to be Neil Obstatt. So
00:20:47.320 I'm simply saying disciplines by their nature can change. Presently, Amsterdam is constat de non,
00:20:53.140 but that's always possible to be changed. And again, remember, personal belief can always remain
00:20:59.000 while still obeying what the church says. It gets really weird about Our Lady of All Nations,
00:21:05.160 which is this Amsterdam apparition, because that's tied into Akita, which is approved. If you can
00:21:12.480 explain that, please. Yeah, well, in fact, it is a statue of the Lady of All Nations in Akita, Japan,
00:21:23.000 which wept over a hundred, well, 101 times specifically, but that's not 101 tears, that's 101
00:21:29.060 occasions. And it was from that statue that the, at that time, deaf religious sister Agnes, who just
00:21:37.880 passed away on August 15th of 2024, great day to go, right, on the Assumption of Our Lady. But it was
00:21:43.780 through that statue that she heard locutions from Our Lady. And in fact, she, the sister, had the
00:21:52.460 stigmata in the form of a cross on her left hand, but the statue had it on the right hand of the statue.
00:21:59.360 So I would simply raise the point that since Akita is an approved apparition, never before in the
00:22:06.000 church's history, never, has Our Lady used a false apparition image to transmit an authentic message.
00:22:15.800 And it wouldn't make too much sense, right, to do that. You wouldn't take a false apparition
00:22:19.700 and then use it as the very instrument, the visible sign of a true apparition. So there's still some
00:22:25.820 significant inconsistency with Akita as approved, based on this image of the Lady of All Nations,
00:22:31.900 and the present status of Amsterdam as constate non. But we'll see. We'll see what happens in the
00:22:38.940 future. So where does that bring us then with regard to the declaration of co-redemptrix and
00:22:45.040 mediatrix of all grace as an advocate? That movement, which again has, just in the last 25 years,
00:22:50.360 8 million petitions from 180 countries. If you want to talk about synodality, that's a pretty
00:22:55.880 synodal message. There's never in the history of the church been bigger per annum support for anything
00:23:05.020 in the history of the church than this proclamation. And so the theology is there. There's over 25
00:23:11.780 volumes. In fact, back in 1925, there were three theological commissions, one in Belgium, Spain,
00:23:18.480 and Rome. The Roman commission was never released, but they produced over 2,500 pages of support for this
00:23:24.460 dogma before 1930. And now we've had another 25 volumes of theology. So everything is really ready.
00:23:32.520 I encourage people to pray for the heart of the Holy Father, because ultimately, it's the Vicar of
00:23:37.500 Christ that can make this proclamation. But I believe, John Henry, once this dogma is proclaimed,
00:23:43.640 what you're doing is you're acknowledging Our Lady's roles as co-redemptrix, mediatrix, and advocate.
00:23:48.600 That allows her to fully activate these roles. And that's what Cardinal Mercier believed at the
00:23:55.180 beginning. That's why he started this movement in 1915. But I think we all realize we can use
00:24:00.000 a historic release of grace right now in the church and in the world, and it's only going to come from
00:24:06.740 Our Lady. So the more we acknowledge her roles, the more she can activate those roles. And there's no
00:24:12.560 greater way of acknowledging them than a solemn definition, a real dogmatic crowning to Our Lady
00:24:18.260 as the mother of all peoples. When you study the Fatima apparitions, and our Lord's want to
00:24:25.640 establish devotion to his immaculate heart, her immaculate heart, the immaculate heart of his own
00:24:30.060 mother, because of her sufferings and the way in which Christians, his people have disregarded his
00:24:38.760 mother. You can see that the doing of this would please our Lord so much. He's sort of asking for
00:24:49.280 this, and we in our slowness are sort of, whatever. What do you think's the holdup? Why? I mean,
00:24:56.440 we've had such great Marian popes over the last century, and yet this hasn't happened. Do you have
00:25:02.340 any understanding of that?
00:25:03.080 Well, I think the most recent holdup has been a, in fact, the major objection is always ecumenism,
00:25:09.980 that if we declare this truth about Our Lady, that it will violate the church's responsibility
00:25:15.740 to Christian unity. But I respectfully disagree on a couple fronts. First of all is the understanding
00:25:22.140 of what ecumenism is. John Paul defines ecumenism, John Henry, as prayer and a dialogue which unite
00:25:32.560 Christians ultimately in the one holy Catholic and apostolic church. So if that sounds like it's
00:25:39.140 saying ultimately ecumenism is supposed to lead everyone to become Catholic, that's exactly right.
00:25:44.260 We don't do it with capitalization, we don't do it with force, but we do it with invitation. That's
00:25:49.040 why we pray and dialogue. The late John O'Connor from New York, the cardinal who was really kind of a
00:25:56.680 special figure in the United States, he sent a letter to Rome and he said this dogma would help
00:26:02.580 ecumenism because it would specify what Catholics do believe regarding Mary, but also what they don't
00:26:09.320 believe, that we don't think she's the fourth person of the Trinity. We don't think she's equal to Jesus.
00:26:14.140 So there's two reasons historically for a dogma. One is just to highlight the truth, like the assumption
00:26:19.760 in 1950. The other is during a time of controversy. I think both of those needs are present right now.
00:26:27.180 We need more clarification for people who don't understand what the church means when they call her
00:26:31.480 co-redemptrix, mediatrix, and advocate. And at the same time, we need to solve controversy, but articulate
00:26:37.860 it in the greatest theological precision possible, who our mother is. Because here's the reality.
00:26:43.740 It's true. She is these things. And if it's true, what could be wrong with proclaiming this truth?
00:26:52.660 And for our Protestant brothers and sisters, I think we insult them when we say, we believe this,
00:26:57.880 we're just not going to tell you about it. We believe this, but we're not going to emphasize
00:27:01.820 it because we don't think you can handle it. I actually had a Catholic convert once say to me,
00:27:06.800 so I was Pentecostal. I love Our Lady now, but I would never accept this stuff. I can guarantee you.
00:27:12.800 I said, well, but you just said you love her now. Yeah, but, and then he just stopped because it was
00:27:16.520 a contradiction. It's not for us to mince out the gospel to the extent we think people can handle it.
00:27:23.180 We're called to give the full truth about Mary. And that's what John Paul II did. That's what
00:27:27.780 DeMontra did. That's what Colby did. That's what St. Bernard did. And that's what we're called to do
00:27:33.360 today. And then we trust the mother to unite Christians in ways that we can't unite ourselves,
00:27:39.360 because that's what mothers do best. Indeed, indeed. It's so eminently scriptural. So
00:27:45.640 Dr. Mark Mirvalli, I want to just thank you so very much for your time, for sharing with us your
00:27:51.380 hard-earned wisdom, which you elucidate for us so very simply. God bless you. Thank you.
00:27:56.800 It's my great pleasure. Thank you, John Henry. God bless.
00:27:59.200 And God bless all of you. And we'll see you next time.