The John-Henry Westen Show - Malachi Martin's WARNINGS： Secret Cardinal, Fatima, & the Coming Crisis

00:00:00.000 The doctors wouldn't use the word miracle, but all they would say is we cannot scientifically

00:00:04.980 explain why last night she was at death's door and this morning she's 98% better.

00:00:13.820 Hello, my friends. Welcome to the John Henry Weston Show. I have got a super fascinating

00:00:18.320 topic for you because this is about a new book being released on the subject of our interview

00:00:26.140 today, Malachi Martin. It's called In the Shadows of the Vatican. It's just been released. We've got

00:00:31.120 the author here, Rob Morrow, who is a close friend of this hero of a priest, of a Catholic,

00:00:38.420 and I'm sure many of you remember the Art Bell interviews. You might have read Winswept House or

00:00:44.600 Hostage to the Devil, which was, oh, wow, but we're going to get into it right here. The one thing you

00:00:50.860 know that's truly stunning is that he was an impactor, a cardinal. He was a cardinal of the

00:00:57.000 Catholic Church, secretly so, and that's being revealed in the book for the first time. You're 0.92

00:01:02.820 going to want to stay tuned to this episode with Rob Morrow, author of Malachi Martin in the Shadows

00:01:06.920 of the Vatican. Rob, welcome to the program. Thank you. It's a pleasure to be here, John Henry.

00:01:11.460 Let's begin as we always do with the sign of the cross. In the name of the Father and of the Son

00:01:16.420 and of the Holy Ghost. Holy Ghost. Amen. Okay, so Rob, this is fascinating. You reveal for the

00:01:22.080 first time in this book you've just put out, that's just released, that Father Malachi Martin

00:01:26.840 is a cardinal of the Catholic Church, but an impactor cardinal, a secret cardinal. Tell us

00:01:33.820 about that. Correct. First of all, it's important to know that when I came to know Father Malachi Martin,

00:01:39.100 I was an operations officer in the CIA, the National Clandestine Service. As my confessor, he knew that.

00:01:46.860 So that's not something I was going to hide from him. And so he knew he was talking to someone

00:01:53.320 working in American intelligence. And it actually came about, the topic actually came about one day

00:02:00.620 when we were discussing over lunch, when I had been confirmed. And it was sometime in the late 1970s,

00:02:08.320 he asked me a couple of questions about the actual rite of confirmation. And he also asked me, he said,

00:02:14.020 did the bishop give you a gentle tap or a gentle slap on your cheek? And I said, no, no. He said some

00:02:23.220 words and that was it. But he said, I have grave doubts about the validity of the sacrament you

00:02:30.060 received. He said, would you like to be conditionally reconfirmed? And I said, absolutely. And we got a good

00:02:37.180 mutual friend of ours to serve as my sponsor. And I asked him, I said, who's going to be the bishop?

00:02:44.620 Who's going to do the confirming? And he just looked at me straight up and he said, I am.

00:02:50.460 Oh. And then after the confirmation, which was in the old rite pre-1962, after that, when we went out

00:02:59.380 to lunch, I said, well, you kind of hit me with pretty big two by four over the head with what

00:03:06.520 you told me about being able to confirm me. And then it was about a year and a half, two years later,

00:03:14.520 when I was driving him up to an exorcism evaluation up in Wilton, Connecticut, when we were on our way

00:03:21.340 back, I recall that Malachi said, you know, they pestered me and pestered me. And I said, 0.93

00:03:30.220 about what? Is it all very cordial? He says, no. He says, they pestered me and pestered me

00:03:35.600 because they wanted an actual Vatican cardinal present for this. And then he looks at me and he says,

00:03:43.840 and they didn't even offer me a damn cup of coffee. At that point, you know, I had to correct 0.97

00:03:51.120 myself because it was like, you know, the winding roads of North Connecticut. I had to make sure the

00:03:56.860 jeep stayed on the road when he let that one out. And then when we came to a stoplight, finally,

00:04:02.120 I just turned sideways and I looked at him and I said, that little slip you made about a cardinal

00:04:07.660 from the Vatican observing. I said, do you mean, and he just, he just, he always wore half glasses

00:04:15.420 and he just did this. He looked at me down through the, down his nose to the half glasses.

00:04:22.940 And I said, why, why are you telling me this? And he says, because I know you'll keep your mouth

00:04:29.440 shut. And I did. I did. The only thing I was told years later, like 20 years after his passing was

00:04:36.780 that death absolves one, releases one from all such commitments. I mean, what are they going to

00:04:43.540 do to him now? Yeah. Well, praise God for that. The most repeated phrase in scripture is do not be

00:04:50.780 afraid. We are called to speak the truth, to proclaim the gospel and to live our lives without fear.

00:04:57.720 For the past three years, we've brought this mission to the very heart of the church. At the Rome Life

00:05:04.460 Forum, you won't just hear truth proclaimed. You'll have the chance to ask your questions directly to

00:05:10.500 the speakers. This is your opportunity to engage, to challenge, and to go deeper into the battles

00:05:16.420 we face today. Fear not, her immaculate heart will triumph. So tell us about that. He was made

00:05:25.580 cardinal then by John Paul II, or what was that? No, it was prior to John Paul II. It was back

00:05:32.900 in the mid-1960s, I believe. Because today, a lot of people who are alive don't really realize what

00:05:42.940 the atmosphere was like back then, when the United States was going toe-to-toe with the Soviet Union.

00:05:49.640 And, you know, you had Khrushchev banging his shoe in front of the TV cameras saying,

00:05:55.780 we will bury you. And the threat of atomic warfare, as they called it, was very, very real. The United

00:06:02.460 States and the Soviet Union almost came to nuclear blows over the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962, I believe.

00:06:09.200 Yes, the Missiles of October, they called it. It gave the Vatican a big shock. And they decided

00:06:14.760 that had a nuclear war occurred, and the Soviets bombed Rome, that they would have decapitated 0.53

00:06:23.320 not just the Italian government, but the Roman Catholic Church as well.

00:06:27.000 So what they did was, they took 12 cardinals in various regions of the world, and they wouldn't be 0.98

00:06:38.000 called like mini-popes or replacements. They were called to be called apostolic administrators

00:06:42.580 for their regions of the world. And Malachy's was for the United States. And he would have been the

00:06:50.880 apostolic administrator for the United States in the event of a nuclear war. And I asked him the obvious

00:06:56.880 question, but Malachy, what good did that do if they also hit New York or Washington?

00:07:05.280 And he just kind of said to me rather elliptically, he says, I would have had notice. I would not be

00:07:11.580 in New York City. I didn't push because I already sensed I was kind of on the ground where angels

00:07:16.340 fear to tread. Yeah. So in the book, you come across this neat thing because you have

00:07:25.600 an accounting of Malachy Martin. So we need to back up for a sec because it's so stunning that

00:07:34.180 this is, A, he was an in-Pictoria bishop, let alone a big in-Pictoria cardinal. And then you have

00:07:40.440 this situation. So for people who might not remember Malachy Martin, as a lot of us do,

00:07:46.740 give us like the 30-second summary of who is Malachy Martin?

00:07:50.640 Well, he was born in Ireland in 1921. He, as an Irish Boy Scout, he met with his entire troop.

00:07:58.860 He met both Adolf Hitler and Benito Mussolini prior to the outbreak of World War II.

00:08:03.880 In the 1940s, he joined the Jesuits as an older teenager. He was very well-versed in 12 separate

00:08:13.240 languages, which is why he went to the Pontifical Biblical Institute later.

00:08:17.040 He worked on the Dead Sea Scrolls in the early 1950s in Egypt, not coincidentally where he

00:08:25.120 participated assisting in his first exorcism. And in the mid-1950s, after his ordinations of priests

00:08:34.620 in 1954 by Cardinal Suenens in Belgium, he was sent on diplomatic missions covertly behind the Iron

00:08:43.700 Curtain after the death of Stalin, a couple of years after Khrushchev had taken the reins of power

00:08:50.360 in the Soviet Union to assist and nurture the underground church behind the Iron Curtain.

00:08:58.260 He was tortured there. He was ultimately released by pressure from the Vatican. Shortly thereafter,

00:09:05.140 he became secretary to Augustine Cardinal Bea, the German Jesuit and senior most Jesuit in the church

00:09:12.400 at the time. And he was that, he functioned in that role through the Second Vatican Council

00:09:19.220 when he approached Paul VI because he saw that the Jesuits were not just in left field. I like to say

00:09:26.560 this aphorism all the time. They weren't in just left field. They were outside the ball stadium at that

00:09:31.500 point. And he went to Pope Paul VI and he said, I see the trajectory there on your holiness. I cannot

00:09:39.580 be part of this organization anymore because they are evolving inevitably into an enemy of the papacy.

00:09:47.660 I wish to go, I wish to, to leave the Jesuits, remain a priest, but I wish to go pursue a career

00:09:54.380 career in the West in communications as a writer. And that's how he ended up as religion editor for

00:10:02.360 William F. Buckley's National Review. He was on William F. Buckley's firing line a number of times.

00:10:08.660 Stanford University still maintains the tapes that you can look up on YouTube. He was also an editor

00:10:14.480 for the Encyclopedia Britannica and the author of 17 books and an exorcist. So there.

00:10:22.300 Yeah. Yeah. Unbelievable. There's lots of fun. I'm sorry. I ran, I ran 92 seconds there. No,

00:10:29.480 no, that's great. You can't do justice even minimally. So in 30 seconds of that was incredible.

00:10:34.180 So this is an incredible man. If you don't know about Malachi Martin, you really should.

00:10:38.440 I think Rob's book is an excellent entree because it gives you the most fascinating accounts from a

00:10:44.540 personal friend. Now, I want to get into some of the controversies because some people are old enough 0.98

00:10:50.460 to remember seeing Malachi Martin, at least on film, you'll notice he appears in Clerics. So he got

00:10:56.800 out of the Jesuits and just decided not to wear a collar anymore. It's some of the reason why a lot 1.00

00:11:02.240 of people would dismiss him. In fact, there was another rumor about him living with a landlady and

00:11:07.720 stuff like this. Can you clear up some of those discrepancies that might throw people off about

00:11:13.760 accepting him as someone who was really faithful? One anecdote I can give you is that I told him back

00:11:19.520 in 1995 that I was going, this was in May 1995, I told him I was going to Rome and that a friend of

00:11:27.320 mine had done a beautiful pen and ink rendition of the Virgin of Fatima. And I showed it to him and I said,

00:11:33.220 I would like to present this to His Holiness the Pope. And he said, let me see what I can do. Meet me back

00:11:38.320 here tomorrow for lunch at the same time. And I should have something for you. He, I met him for

00:11:44.020 lunch. He slid an envelope across the table to me. He said, take this to Monsignore so-and-so at the

00:11:49.140 Pontifical Liberal Institute, and he will get you into a semi-private audience with His Holiness Pope

00:11:54.720 John Paul II before the main audience that he has on Wednesdays in the Nervy Hall. And I did.

00:12:04.180 I went with a friend of mine from New Jersey. Of course, he had to be named Vinny. But we went,

00:12:12.520 we got there at 7.30 the next morning and we waited. We were in a group of about 20 people

00:12:17.420 and His Holiness came in. And I was about as close to His Holiness as you are to the backdrop behind you.

00:12:25.800 And I guess it was either Monsignor or Bishop Jivish was walking with him. And the Pope's,

00:12:34.360 His Holiness saw it. It's in the book. You see me handing something to the Pope. And His Holiness

00:12:39.720 then gave me a set of those white papal rosaries John Paul II was fond of giving out. So, I mean,

00:12:46.440 he had access to get me in right to the Pope, right to the top. Do not pass go. Do not collect

00:12:53.340 $200. You know, that's one anecdote I'd like to say. People ask me, well, did he have credibility?

00:12:59.020 Did he have access? He placed one phone call and 10 days later, I was shaking hands with Pope St.

00:13:05.800 John Paul II. Now, people ask about his landlady, Mrs. Kakia Lavanos. Mrs. Lavanos,

00:13:12.500 I believe, was several years older than Malachi. She was a widow. She was actually Greek Orthodox.

00:13:20.780 And she had an extremely icy demeanor. Once she accepted you as someone who was not out to

00:13:27.460 manipulate Malachi, she treated you like a member of the family. But until you passed through the 0.90

00:13:33.180 Kakia Lavanos crucible, she always had her guard up around you. She was his gatekeeper because so 0.93

00:13:38.620 many people wanted to be in touch with him. So, I was there at the apartment more times than I can

00:13:46.160 count. I got to know the Lavanos family well. And I can say with absolute swear on my eternal soul's

00:13:55.220 destiny, I never saw a single inappropriate moment between the two of them. If there was love,

00:14:02.020 it was the love defined with caritas, charity. There was never anything inappropriate. Never.

00:14:09.180 And I would die on that hill, as they say. She was extremely protective. But a lot of people don't

00:14:14.860 know, and I think you and I were chatting about this off camera, was that years ago in Europe, it was not

00:14:21.860 uncommon for more aristocratic or upper-class families to have a priest in residence. And we were

00:14:29.660 talking about how the von Trapp family actually had Monsignor Wassner as their live-in priest who

00:14:38.200 said Mass for them, dispensed the sacraments, but also gave their children a thoroughgoing education in

00:14:45.700 music. He was omitted from the sound of music, but there is almost a direct one-to-one parallel you can

00:14:51.880 draw there. So, there was never anything inappropriate. She was his landlady. He lived in a completely

00:14:58.120 separate, tiny apartment that was within. They had the floor of the third floor, sixth floor. It was

00:15:08.040 a floor of 116 East 63rd Street, one of those giant pre-war apartment buildings. And his apartment

00:15:16.680 was nestled like a cubby inside that floor, the third floor of that apartment house. So, he had his own

00:15:25.460 bath, you know, his own facilities. Let's not give the impression it was a luxurious place. It was maybe

00:15:33.800 14 feet by 15 feet in total. And books took up most of it, along with a small bed for sleeping,

00:15:42.480 a desk for writing, and he had a small portable altar there that he said Mass on every day.

00:15:48.320 So, very much still an active priest. What was his reason for not wearing clerics in the street?

00:15:54.060 First of all, he did not want to draw attention to himself. He believed in wearing traditional Roman

00:16:01.840 clerics, cassock and surplice. Well, not a surplice in the street, but a cassock. And he didn't want to

00:16:07.820 draw attention to himself. And he had the option of not dressing like a layman. So, he didn't. He did

00:16:14.560 not want to draw attention to himself dressing a cassock. However, I did serve Mass for him,

00:16:21.060 the traditional Latin Mass many times. And every time I served Mass for him, he was dressed like a 1.00

00:16:30.300 traditional Roman priest, Roman Catholic priest, cassock surplice, you know, all the clerical

00:16:37.820 vestments you assume you associate with the traditional Latin Mass. That's right. We should 1.00

00:16:42.480 mention, too, he wasn't known as a priest in the Archdiocese of New York as well.

00:16:47.740 Correct. Correct. People on the street knew him as Dr. Martin.

00:16:52.320 Yeah. Here's this fascinating character, one of the anecdotes you share, and it was known about him

00:16:59.620 that he was an exorcist. But he had some kind of spiritual gifts in that regard. Tell us what those

00:17:05.940 were. He had a very close relationship with his guardian angel. I mean, he told me many times that

00:17:13.420 that was one of the most overlooked traditions of the post-conciliar church was devotion to and

00:17:20.860 cultivation of your guardian angel. He was taken under the wing of an organization called Opus

00:17:29.540 Angelorum. And I believe they're still around.

00:17:32.000 They are, in fact. Bishop Athanasius Schneider belongs to that organization.

00:17:35.220 Okay. Then Bishop Schneider would have been enrolled. He would have had the same training

00:17:40.260 courses, meditations, prayers. It's not just a flip the switch and fill out the form and,

00:17:48.000 you know, you're automatically in. It takes a while, as I recall. And Malachi joined that organization,

00:17:55.980 and he cultivated his guardian angel. In fact, the prayer of dedication to his guardian angel is

00:18:04.160 something I included at the back of the book. It's in there. And it's in his own handwriting.

00:18:09.260 And you can see that he was actually accepted into the organization of the guardian angels by

00:18:15.500 his so-called sponsor within the organization, a Carmelite named Father Zachary Monet. He has now

00:18:23.120 gone to his eternal reward. One of the things with Father Martin was, or Cardinal Martin, I guess you

00:18:28.680 could say, but was the miraculous that you tell in your book that I had never heard of before.

00:18:36.340 Tell us about that. I had a friend whose sister-in-law was pregnant. And she found out in her, 0.57

00:18:46.440 towards the end of the fifth months of pregnancy, that she was diagnosed with stage three AML leukemia,

00:18:55.480 which to my understanding is the most virulent kind of leukemia there is. It's the kind that,

00:19:01.500 you know, lays waste to the body's immune system and blood cells. And she was told by the doctors

00:19:08.260 at Mount Sinai in New York, in order for us to treat you successfully for this condition in your bone

00:19:14.140 marrow, you will have, you will have to lose the child. It was basically, they would induce abortion.

00:19:20.960 And she said, no, I'm not willing to do that. I don't want to harm the baby. So she carried the 0.72

00:19:27.980 baby to term, but they were very, very clear that in doing so, she ran the risk of having the disease

00:19:34.740 progress to the point where they could not save her life. The baby would be okay, but they would not

00:19:40.640 be able to save her life. They would try. After the baby was delivered, it was immediately taken out

00:19:46.340 of the room because just the natural microbes that a newborn infant carries could have proved lethal to

00:19:53.580 her with her diminished immune system. I'm not going to claim to be an expert in immunobiology.

00:20:01.120 However, there is a certain threshold in a milliliter of blood that there has to be so many white cells

00:20:09.100 per milliliter in order for the body's immune system to function properly. I think it's in the

00:20:17.320 tens of thousands range per milliliter of blood. And she was down, I believe in the hundreds. The

00:20:24.720 doctors actually told her husband, you need to prepare yourself for your wife's passing.

00:20:30.940 I mean, that's a very heavy slap across the face.

00:20:37.020 And I just asked my friend who was her sister-in-law, I said, you know, along the lines of

00:20:42.980 any port in a storm would, and she knew Malachi, by the way. I said, would you mind if Malachi just,

00:20:47.940 if I asked him, would he come up to Mount Sinai Hospital and give a blessing? And she said,

00:20:52.840 if he would, please, yes. So about a day and a half later, Malachi and I went up and we both went

00:21:01.600 in the room. And her condition was such that the doctors were like, look, you don't have to wear

00:21:06.720 masks or anything because of her condition. It's terminal. It was that far from being on hospice care.

00:21:15.400 But we were just allowed into the room. And he took out a small pix, but it's the kind of pix that

00:21:22.340 holds the little swab of holy oil in cotton in it. And he just took that and he blessed her on her

00:21:31.020 forehead with it. He said a prayer in Latin. And then from his inside jacket pocket, he took another

00:21:37.760 small reliquary and held it to her forehead. And he said a prayer in Latin with his eyes closed.

00:21:43.760 And I remember her looking at him very plaintively. And she asked him straight out,

00:21:48.280 am I going to die? And he looked right back at her and said very directly, no, ma'am,

00:21:56.460 you're not going to die. You may think that the antics of your teenage son many years from now is

00:22:02.220 going to drive you to an early grave, but this is not going to kill you.

00:22:05.760 And we left shortly thereafter. It was not a prolonged meeting. Maybe if it lasted six,

00:22:13.000 eight minutes, it was a long time. We're on our way down the elevator.

00:22:18.380 And I asked Maliki, you know, when she asked you, is she going to die? And you said, no.

00:22:23.720 I said, were you saying that kind of in the way people always try and

00:22:27.460 cheer up a terminally ill patient at a hospital when they say, don't worry,

00:22:31.220 they're always researching new medicines and therapies.

00:22:33.900 Were you just trying to keep her spirits up? And he just gave me the dirtiest look. It didn't answer,

00:22:41.780 but he gave me the dirtiest look of, Rob, you're asking me that question. You purport to be a

00:22:49.880 believing Roman Catholic. You've known me for how, and you're asking me that. And then the next day,

00:22:57.860 I get this overjoyed call from her sister-in-law saying that they ran two separate panel,

00:23:06.240 blood panels at Mount Sinai. The doctors could not find a trace of leukemia and that her T cell count

00:23:14.920 was thoroughly in the middle of the normal range, which is why they waited three hours between both

00:23:21.780 blood panels because they wanted to make sure they were not getting a false reading.

00:23:26.220 It's very interesting. The doctors wouldn't use the word miracle. They wouldn't use the word,

00:23:30.500 but all they would say is we cannot scientifically explain why last night she was at death's door

00:23:38.840 and this morning she's 98% better. This just doesn't happen. AML leukemia doesn't spontaneously go away.

00:23:48.560 So let's talk about probably what Malika Martin is most famous for in people's minds today who still

00:23:56.240 hear him because those Art Bell interviews, they made the rounds back in the day in the 90s that

00:24:03.580 such that they're remembered today. It's on the internet. You can go listen to it on YouTube.

00:24:09.000 Oh yes. First of all, what were they about and why the big stir?

00:24:12.300 Well, I think the big stir is because of Art Bell's base of guests. If it was strange, odd, provocative,

00:24:26.100 pick your appellation. He was interested because he was an entertainer and he was concerned with

00:24:34.640 generating ratings. Maliki appeared on his show because Maliki saw a way to reach a population 0.79

00:24:43.900 of people who otherwise would not hear these things about the traditional Roman Catholic Church.

00:24:49.940 And he dealt with a lot of the strange and odd questions with grace and understanding. He never

00:24:57.460 compromised on the Catholic faith. And he saw that as reaching a different segment of a national and

00:25:05.000 potentially worldwide apostolate via radio. His more technical Roman Catholic theological-based

00:25:12.220 discussions with Bernard Janssen of Triumph Communications, I believe up in Canada,

00:25:18.300 are still available at triumphcommunications.com. And they show a side of Maliki that is much more

00:25:27.760 formally doctrinaire, I guess. Whereas it was kind of a wild west on the Art Bell show.

00:25:36.400 Indeed. Indeed. He did talk though, a lot about prophecy. And obviously that was the subject there.

00:25:43.040 They spoke of Three Days of Darkness and all the stuff that you would figure Art Bell would be

00:25:48.240 into covering. And Maliki didn't shy away from it at all. But what was his connection to prophecy? Did

00:25:54.520 he study Fatima? What was his connection there? He had a direct connection to the third message of

00:26:00.880 Fatima. He was the secretary, the executive assistant, as it were, to Augustine Cardinal Bea.

00:26:06.960 And in 1960, Cardinal Bea told him to meet him on such and such a day at the entrance of the apostolic

00:26:16.480 palaces in St. Peter's Square. He did. It was early in the morning. And he said he accompanied Cardinal

00:26:23.500 Bea up to the apostolic palaces and was told to wait and cool his heels in like an antechamber to the papal

00:26:30.340 apartments. And he said, he saw and recognized a number of senior cardinals, like Cardinal Suenens,

00:26:37.940 Cardinal Ottaviani, Cardinal Martini, who would become Paul VI. And he says they went into the

00:26:44.260 Pope's apartments. The doors were closed. There was a Swiss guard outside. And he said it became very

00:26:49.760 obvious that after about 45 minutes, the discussion inside the apartments had elevated to the level of

00:26:57.560 shouting, because he could hear it indistinctly through the door. Finally, he said Cardinal Bea came

00:27:03.640 charging out, didn't even look at him, just said, as he was muttering under his breath, he just said,

00:27:09.440 Maliki, kommen Sie. This was German. They went back down. They got in the back of Cardinal Bea's car, 0.79

00:27:16.080 which was waiting downstairs. And Maliki looked at him, said to him in German, you know,

00:27:23.660 Eminenzia, was los, what's wrong? And Cardinal Bea told him in German, those fools have just condemned 0.98

00:27:32.500 millions upon millions of people to a horrible fate. And Maliki said, what do you mean? And he said, 0.99

00:27:41.740 Cardinal Bea pulled a single sheet of paper out from inside his clericals and told Maliki,

00:27:48.400 if you read this, you may not reveal the full contents unless you are released from the pontifical

00:27:56.780 secret by the Pope himself. Do you accept this under those conditions? And Maliki said, yes. And he said,

00:28:03.860 Cardinal Bea handed it to him. It was a German language translation on one sheet of paper of the

00:28:09.880 third message of Fatima. He said he read it, handed it back to Cardinal Bea, and that's how he came to know

00:28:18.080 the message of the third message of Fatima. Whoa. Okay. So then all of this talk, then the hinting

00:28:28.240 was based on real knowledge of... Oh, first hand knowledge of the secret. Yes.

00:28:34.820 Wow. He didn't even shy away from another apparition that is not nearly as accepted as Fatima. And that's

00:28:44.440 Garabandal. And it's interesting because I know Padre Pio was a huge fan of Garabandal, but

00:28:48.800 the Garabandal phenomenon, especially today is kind of, it's controversial because, you know,

00:28:55.340 there's these seers and the stuff they predicted, the warning and miracle stuff hasn't happened yet.

00:29:01.540 Where did Father Maliki Martin stand there? He came down firmly in favor of Garabandal. He arranged a 0.88

00:29:08.680 meeting for me back in 1996 at Conchita Gonzalez's, I believe it was Thursday evening holy hour that she

00:29:18.060 would have with a rosary for the intentions of the Pope. Yes. Yes. She was a lovely lady, very demure,

00:29:26.740 almost on the shy side. No one asked her about Garabandal. You just kind of got the vibe that

00:29:33.640 it's off limits. We're here to pay worship and, you know, honor to the mother of God and her son.

00:29:41.320 We're not here to try and pry details out of Conchita. But he arranged that for me. It was lovely.

00:29:48.520 He said he, you know, he thought that Garabandal was the natural extension of the message of Fatima.

00:29:56.640 And he brought out something that I never really thought of before. He said, you notice that in

00:30:01.660 1960, everyone was expecting that the Pope would reveal the third message of Fatima. Then comes out

00:30:09.840 the famous message from the Vatican press office, not going to happen. And then what happens almost

00:30:16.940 right afterwards? Our Lady begins appearing in Garabandal, Spain, as if she is not going to let

00:30:24.360 the direness of her message be thwarted by what Malachi called the fecklessness of the Roman 1.00

00:30:32.460 Curia. I asked him straight up, can you tell me what's in the third secret? I would try and I would

00:30:38.220 try and Hem and Hodges come at it from different angles, different days, different angles. It's like

00:30:43.400 when they give you the Myers-Briggs personality test, they ask the same question, but they ask it six

00:30:49.380 different ways at different points in the test. And that's what I would do with the third secret of

00:30:53.840 Fatima. And finally, he said to me, go look up what Pope John Paul II said in Fulda, Germany in 1980.

00:31:00.260 And this was when the internet was in its infancy. At the time, I was, you know, I was a functioning CIA

00:31:05.720 officer and I was able to research that, find it out. And apparently a group of German pilgrims in 1980

00:31:14.000 asked Pope John Paul II, prior to the assassination attempt, holiness, why hasn't the third message of

00:31:20.360 Fatima been released? And he said, the Pope said this, he said, my predecessors in the seat of Peter

00:31:27.680 have diplomatically preferred to withhold its publication so as to prevent the worldwide power

00:31:33.500 of communism from undertaking certain movements against the West. And then he said, if you're only

00:31:42.540 interested in what the message says to satisfy either prurience or a thirst for the sensational, then is there

00:31:54.280 really, he asked a rhetorical question, is there really any point in wanting that secret released anymore

00:31:59.980 anyway? And then he held up his rosary and he said, it should be enough for all Christians to know this. And this is

00:32:08.040 the quiet part out loud. If there does exist such a message that talk about great earthquakes, that talk

00:32:16.100 about oceans flooding huge parts of the planet from one minute to the next, and you're only interested in

00:32:23.480 that message because it's so sensational and you're convinced nothing can be done about it, what's the

00:32:31.200 point of publishing? And he held his rosary up higher and he said, here, here is your weapon. Pray this and ask

00:32:38.000 the mother of God for nothing else. He said, how many times has the renewal of the church been

00:32:45.380 affected in the past in the blood of the faithful? He says, this time it will not be otherwise. We can

00:32:52.820 perhaps mitigate it through our prayer, but it's something that must happen. So to me, that's saying the

00:33:00.760 quiet part out loud. I used to be, when I was first in the agency, I used to be a military analyst for the

00:33:07.540 agency. And I studied the Soviet Union, the ground forces of the Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact.

00:33:15.880 Every day, we had to look at the film to see whether or not there was any disposition change.

00:33:22.680 And these pilgrims, they met with the Pope at Folger, Germany, which

00:33:28.940 back in the bad old days during the Cold War,

00:33:33.740 on one side, you had the U.S. Army 5th Corps.

00:33:37.480 And on the other side, you had the elite Category A

00:33:41.260 Soviet tank divisions, the guards divisions,

00:33:45.260 they called them. And they were the divisions that were supposed to be

00:33:49.440 ready to invade the West on 24 hours standing notice.

00:33:52.860 It was a flashpoint. The Fulda Gap is what it was called. It was a flashpoint

00:33:58.220 in the Cold War. And that's why the Pope went there, to undermine the seriousness

00:34:03.800 of the message of what Our Lady said.

00:34:06.600 Last question for you, Rob. Today, we've started to hear a lot about

00:34:10.800 one of the other prophecies at Fatima, if you will, the diabolic disorientation,

00:34:16.260 a kind of confusion in the Church that would last. Did Malachi tell you anything about that?

00:34:21.480 Yes, he did. He was very blunt about it. His final two books,

00:34:28.080 The Keys of This Blood, and then followed up immediately by

00:34:31.300 Winswept House a couple of years later. The Keys of This Blood was the graduate-level text

00:34:36.780 about what Pope Sean Paul II was trying to do against the capitalist West

00:34:41.180 and, at the same time, Mikhail Gorbachev. Winswept House was a faction,

00:34:48.020 a fictional story telling real facts, a factional novel that put into practice what he wrote about

00:34:56.600 in The Keys of This Blood. And he said to me many times that the goal of the modernists

00:35:04.620 who were seeking to take control of the Church, and he said by the 1990s, they were already firmly

00:35:10.700 in control of most of it. And he said the Church would have to go underground. And I said, why?

00:35:16.900 And he said, because in their rush to build man's world, as Paul VI said when he came to the United

00:35:24.320 Nations in New York, that he wanted to cooperate in building man's habitat on Earth. Nothing about

00:35:31.120 death, judgment, heaven, hell, the four last things. Totally this worldly phenomena in which

00:35:37.540 transcendence was completely lost. Malachi said, in the not-too-distant future, and I said, how far?

00:35:44.620 He said, not long after I'm playing R, he said the Church would have the appearance of being just

00:35:49.360 another NGO, and it would start to lose its credibility. So that's what he said about

00:35:54.000 diabolical disorientation. And he also said that there would be an underground Church,

00:36:00.220 which Catholics who believed in their authentic faith, because he said the one thing the conciliar

00:36:06.760 Church had lost, and I think this is important to stress to your audience, is the concept of what

00:36:12.420 he called intimacy with the divine. He said, we have that intimacy when we receive our Lord,

00:36:19.800 body, blood, soul, and divinity, at a valid mass. He says, for the time that the host,

00:36:26.380 until our body breaks it down. He says, we are actually physically united with Jesus Christ,

00:36:32.700 as if we were walking with him on the shores of the Sea of Galilee 2,000 years ago. He says,

00:36:40.540 and the modern church, that's why I wrote in my book, in the part of the introduction,

00:36:45.520 when I was in first grade, and it was the traditional Latin Mass in Elizabeth, New Jersey,

00:36:52.700 and poor Monsignor Heimbach, the pastor, he dropped the host. Now, when a priest in 1965 dropped the host,

00:37:02.320 you would have thought that World War III had been declared over the school PA system. I mean,

00:37:07.060 you had brigades of altar boys coming out with all kinds of special implements, and cleaners, and cloths.

00:37:13.540 And now, you know, fast forward 30 years, they find, it's not unusual to find hosts

00:37:20.320 in the pew, on the ground. You take it up to, I took one up to a priest, and he said, oh, thank you.

00:37:27.000 He put it in his pocket. The intimacy with the divine has been lost. If you really believe,

00:37:33.600 if you really believe, I once asked a priest recently, a Novus Roto priest, I said, Father,

00:37:38.440 why don't you use Eucharistic prayer number one, based on the old Roman canon? And he says,

00:37:45.720 if I use that Eucharistic prayer, I start to get dirty looks from the people in the front pews,

00:37:50.840 and they make a point of looking at their watches.

00:37:52.840 So, I'm thinking to myself, okay, so your mentality is, get them in and get them out, 0.90

00:38:02.360 and keep those collections coming. And I'm thinking to myself, does this priest really believe

00:38:09.740 that he is re-presenting, in a bloodless manner, the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus on Calvary?

00:38:18.360 Does he really believe if he's got to shave eight minutes off the service so he doesn't annoy some

00:38:24.960 of the people in the pews? Look at what you're doing. Look at what you're doing. There is no

00:38:31.460 intimacy with the divine. Our lives back in the 1940s, 50s, and early 60s were suffused with it.

00:38:40.240 Being Catholic meant something very unique. And now it's go along to get along. There are two

00:38:48.060 churches. I'm not going to put words in your mouth, but right now, I think we can arguably say

00:38:53.100 Fulton Sheen's prophecy about the ape of the church is coming true. There's the synodal church, 1.00

00:38:59.440 which I don't even know what the heck it means, and the Roman Catholic church. And sooner or later,

00:39:06.500 they're going to have to choose. People are going to have to choose. That's why your guest the other

00:39:11.160 day is Zavir Ibral. He was talking about the next iteration of what the ecumenical liturgy is going to

00:39:18.160 look like. Malachi told me back in 1998 that there were voices in Rome working on something that would

00:39:25.300 be ecumenically acceptable to most Protestant denominations, including the evangelicals.

00:39:31.700 And I said, how is that possible? He said it would be called the retus simplex in Latin,

00:39:38.460 the simple right. He said, but it would gut the words of our Lord's consecration.

00:39:45.240 And it would mean it would not be the sacrifice of the mass. It would not be a valid mass because it

00:39:51.660 would not include hoc es enum corpus meum. This is my body. And it would not include the hic ex 0.89

00:39:59.700 colics sanguinis mei, et cetera, et cetera. Novi etterini testamenti, et provobis et promoltis,

00:40:08.860 et cetera, et cetera. It will not contain that. It'll be something similar, but it'll be Vatican

00:40:18.240 weasel wording, but the Protestants will be able to completely buy off on. He says, that's when you'll 0.87

00:40:24.140 know. That will be the ultimate sign. But the people that reject that in the Catholic Church,

00:40:30.520 they will be called the schismatics because they will see them. They will be said of them, 0.98

00:40:37.080 well, you're not in union with the Holy See and what the National Catholic Bishops Conference is

00:40:42.400 doing. The USCCB, you have to accept this. And that's going to have to be a hill that,

00:40:47.840 parenthetically, again, I don't want to sound corny. People are going to have to choose whether or not

00:40:52.200 to die on. Rob, thank you so much for being with us. Ladies and gentlemen, Malika Martin

00:40:57.100 in the shadows of the Vatican, Robert Morrow Jr., wherever good books are sold. Pick it up. I would

00:41:01.580 very much encourage it. It's a boost to your faith. And you'll get to know, if you don't know him

00:41:05.900 already, a heroic figure in the church, one of the early canceled priests, as it were. And gosh,

00:41:13.940 he gives a good credit to that name. Secret cardinal in the church, no less. Thank you so much,

00:41:20.700 Rob. God bless you. God bless you. Thank you. And God bless all of you. And we'll see you next time.

00:41:28.600 Aloha, everyone. This is Jason Jones for Lifeside News. We hope you enjoyed this video.

00:41:33.900 For more content like this, check the link in the description. You can also connect with us on

00:41:39.480 social media to stay up to date with the latest news on life, faith, family, and freedom.

00:41:45.760 Thanks for watching. And may God bless you.

The John-Henry Westen Show - December 03, 2025

Malachi Martin's WARNINGS： Secret Cardinal, Fatima, & the Coming Crisis

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