The John-Henry Westen Show - Man who threw Pachamama into Tiber speaks with John-Henry Westen

00:00:00.380 Welcome to this episode of the John Henry Weston Show.

00:00:03.360 We are very pleased to bring you one of the first interviews

00:00:06.820 with the gentleman who led the effort to expel the Pachamama statues

00:00:12.260 from the Church in Rome, an act which has been proclaimed heroic

00:00:15.980 by Cardinal Brandtmiller, Bishop Schneider, and others.

00:00:19.380 I'm very pleased to bring you this interview. Stay tuned.

00:00:30.000 So, Alexander, you just came out exposing yourself as the very person

00:00:48.140 who orchestrated the expelling of the Pachamama idols from the Church 0.86

00:00:52.820 Santa Maria in Transbontina in Rome. It's great to speak with you.

00:00:56.500 Yes, thank you very much for having the interview with me.

00:01:01.500 I just released a video, that's true, and I'm very happy to see

00:01:05.900 that many people are interested in what happens there.

00:01:09.780 It is exploding all over the place here. We'll get to that in just a second.

00:01:14.100 We begin all of my shows with the Son of the Cross, so if you wouldn't mind, let's do that.

00:01:18.300 In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, Amen.

00:01:23.640 So, Alexander, tell us a little bit about yourself, first of all.

00:01:26.420 What's your full name?

00:01:28.120 My name is Alexander Chuguel. I'm from Vienna in Austria.

00:01:32.900 The last name is a little bit complicated because it origins in Tyrol.

00:01:37.760 And, yes, I'm 26 years old.

00:01:42.120 Recently, I got married in the summer.

00:01:45.260 And, yes, I'm living in the center of Vienna.

00:01:48.480 Beautiful.

00:01:49.160 Well, you're a young man with your future in front of you, and yet you've undertaken this act,

00:01:56.460 which could have cost you quite a bit.

00:01:59.120 What motivated you here?

00:02:01.140 What sort of caused you to do this?

00:02:03.900 And did you actually calculate what could possibly happen?

00:02:07.520 Yes, kind of.

00:02:10.120 What motivated me is quite easy to explain.

00:02:13.560 I was trying to inform myself quite a ton of time about what happened in Rome and about the Amazonian Synod,

00:02:22.980 and went there to attend a few conferences at the beginning of the Synod.

00:02:26.560 And around these conferences, I had the possibility to look at Santa Maria in Traspontina.

00:02:33.600 I went to the church with my wife and looked at the side chapels and everything which was on display there.

00:02:38.860 And for me, it was really bad because I saw in those statues and those pagan idols,

00:02:44.740 I saw really a break of the First Commandment.

00:02:47.960 So my main motivation was to really just bring pagan things out of a Catholic church.

00:02:54.500 This was my main motivation.

00:02:56.900 Of course, it was very symbolic doing this during the Synod.

00:03:03.260 But actually, my first and main motivation was only to put out pagan statues out of a Catholic sanctuary in a Catholic church.

00:03:11.300 Yes, and at the beginning, I knew it's going to be news, and many people are going to be interested in what happens.

00:03:19.300 But it was not clear for me that it's going to be that big.

00:03:25.160 I also could have held some potential punishment for you.

00:03:30.940 People might say you might have destroyed your future.

00:03:33.640 What were your concerns?

00:03:34.440 What were your thoughts about that?

00:03:36.700 Yeah, actually, I had my thoughts about that.

00:03:39.180 I talked to a dear friend of mine, a priest, and, of course, lots of hours to my wife about it.

00:03:48.000 And we both said, and I'm still behind that, you know, if we always think about what happens afterwards,

00:03:57.160 and if we always think that way, we will never get anything done.

00:04:01.240 There is something bad happening in the Catholic church.

00:04:04.080 There's something bad happening within a Catholic church. 0.69

00:04:06.700 We just have to act.

00:04:07.700 And so I thought, I am young, that's true, but I have tons of support of my own family and all my friends.

00:04:13.820 So I thought, whatever can happen, it can never be that bad.

00:04:17.520 The worst thing happening is if you don't manage to go to heaven.

00:04:22.660 So this is really not a matter for me too much.

00:04:27.520 Beautiful.

00:04:28.120 Well, tell us a little bit about your faith life.

00:04:29.920 You know, you're obviously a Catholic, you were offended by this, but what's your faith life like?

00:04:36.340 Yes, I have to admit, I was not always a Catholic.

00:04:39.620 I converted 10 and a half years ago.

00:04:41.560 I was a Lutheran Protestant, which is very rare in Austria.

00:04:46.780 Austria is normally a very Catholic country, but my great-grandfather converted.

00:04:50.440 And now I converted back.

00:04:53.160 And I'm very glad to announce it.

00:04:54.500 Also, my sisters and my parents converted back.

00:04:56.600 So we are now all Catholic.

00:04:58.300 Oh, beautiful.

00:04:58.740 And then I managed to, together with my friends, I converted when I was 15, and I got many friends, and they really awoke my interest in the Catholic religion.

00:05:11.180 So I tried to read many things and to talk with priests and to visit speeches and conferences.

00:05:17.520 And the more I got into the Catholic Church, the more beautiful it got.

00:05:20.640 So for me, the faith is something fantastic, because it really shows us the beauty God gave us, not only through his creation and the beauty we see every day in nature and other people's faces.

00:05:33.400 It's also the beauty of his religion, which is completely clear and wonderful.

00:05:39.120 And I really love to be a Catholic, actually.

00:05:42.080 I have to admit, I cannot imagine anymore not being one.

00:05:47.820 It would be just unimaginable for me.

00:05:52.200 Absolutely beautiful.

00:05:53.400 What might have gone into your preparation?

00:05:55.800 You talked about how you talked with your wife about talking with the priest.

00:05:59.120 In terms of your own spiritual preparation for this act, what might have gone into that?

00:06:05.240 Yes, actually, it took a lot of spiritual preparation.

00:06:07.960 We prayed many rosaries every day, actually, and tried to visit the Holy Mass every day.

00:06:15.980 And it was really very important for us.

00:06:20.080 You know, the spiritual preparation ended in the second where we entered the church itself.

00:06:25.100 Because when we went to the church in the morning, it was still closed.

00:06:30.120 So we decided to pray a rosary.

00:06:33.280 And after the last Ave Maria, after the last Hail Mary, we entered the church.

00:06:38.320 So the spiritual preparation went on really directly to the entrance of the church.

00:06:44.640 And of course, whilst doing it, we were praying.

00:06:47.740 So the spiritual preparation was everything.

00:06:50.840 I could not have done it without it.

00:06:52.900 It's not possible.

00:06:54.260 Wow.

00:06:54.940 Were you scared nonetheless?

00:06:56.680 I mean, this is an act that some people would say or have said is a theft, is it legal?

00:07:02.040 You know, there's authorities that could have been involved.

00:07:05.120 People perhaps would have confronted you.

00:07:08.380 What were your thoughts there?

00:07:10.400 Yeah.

00:07:11.100 Like, we didn't want to have a fight over it, of course.

00:07:15.440 Because we thought it is the best thing if the people understand what happens with these pagan idols in a Catholic church.

00:07:22.560 So we just get them out of the church and throw them into the typer to get it all done.

00:07:26.680 But of course, we thought of that.

00:07:28.560 To minimize the chance of things interrupting our plans, we went to the church in the second it opened in the morning.

00:07:40.240 And yes, we thought about the charges.

00:07:43.000 We thought about maybe being charged for theft or so on.

00:07:46.540 But first of all, I don't want to take the statues and use them by myself.

00:07:52.260 So I don't get anything by taking the statues.

00:07:57.920 And I didn't even want to do a big show with them.

00:08:03.180 I just wanted to get a pagan idol out of the church.

00:08:06.640 If there are any legal consequences, I'm going to face them with the same calm and hopefully braying way I faced the problem of some statues within the church.

00:08:21.760 So let's have a look at what really is going to happen.

00:08:25.540 I'm not frightened.

00:08:27.340 I'm not really afraid.

00:08:30.360 So let's have a look.

00:08:31.360 Now, media, of course, has exploded again today after having exploded when the event took place.

00:08:39.480 And you released the first videos.

00:08:41.760 There was a fellow, actually, David Fabir in Italy who claimed responsibility himself.

00:08:49.600 What have you got to say to that?

00:08:51.400 And, you know, when people ask, how do we know it was really you?

00:08:54.740 What would you respond?

00:08:56.380 Okay.

00:08:57.040 First of all, I'm happy for everybody who claims that he did it or he was with us.

00:09:03.820 Because, actually, of course, I was not alone.

00:09:06.740 I was supported by all the prayers and all the good guys out there thinking the same as I do.

00:09:11.600 So I was not alone.

00:09:12.580 But if someone really says he did it, you know, what should I do?

00:09:17.760 Then he can say this.

00:09:19.000 I have enough proof.

00:09:21.120 I uploaded now my confession video on the same channel on YouTube.

00:09:25.700 So maybe that's enough proof for the people.

00:09:28.140 And if not, I already, I think I have some pictures left of me carrying the statues where you see my face.

00:09:33.520 So if it is really necessary, I have stuff to show.

00:09:37.880 Excellent.

00:09:38.880 Now, one of the things that has been said is, of course, about Pope Francis.

00:09:46.660 Pope Francis, of course, when he was heard, overheard and then publicly released,

00:09:52.440 that he apologized in the name of the Bishop of Rome for what happened to the statues.

00:09:58.960 What was your reaction when you heard that?

00:10:00.740 My first reaction was that it was very interesting to hear the Pope saying Pachamamas.

00:10:06.940 That was actually my first reaction.

00:10:09.260 So I thought, oh, maybe so.

00:10:10.440 So I was not wrong with thinking of them as pagan idols.

00:10:15.040 I think that if he says Pachamamas too, then this is also what the Pope thinks of it.

00:10:21.440 The second thing was, you know, if he thinks that the action was really against the people of the Amazonian Synod,

00:10:29.620 then I would even be with him to excuse me for that, because that's, of course, not what we did it for.

00:10:35.600 We did it exactly the opposite.

00:10:38.160 We did it for them because we want them to have the truth of Christ too.

00:10:42.680 We don't want them to have a special not-Christian religion, which is established even by our own church. 1.00

00:10:50.240 No, we want them to get baptized and to feel and see the whole band of the whole Catholic spirituality and the world and everything, the whole teaching.

00:11:01.800 So I think it is, if he really thinks that we did it out of another reason than the reason I gave you a few minutes ago,

00:11:14.180 then I just have to tell our Holy Father, please, Holy Father, understand us.

00:11:19.160 We as Catholics, we just don't want pagan things within a Catholic church.

00:11:24.600 We want our church to be clear and pure about the faith, and we want the church to follow Jesus Christ and what he said.

00:11:33.600 That's it.

00:11:34.760 Follow the tradition.

00:11:35.820 Follow Christ.

00:11:38.120 Exactly.

00:11:38.780 Well, there's going to be a lot of people now who, now that they know you are a sort of more traditional, faithful Catholic and so on,

00:11:47.300 the kind that perhaps they think Pope Francis is against.

00:11:49.760 Here you are a young person.

00:11:51.080 He's often railed against young people who are traditional in their faith.

00:11:54.600 A lot of them would come at this and say, oh, he just did it because he hates Pope Francis and things like this.

00:12:00.380 What would you respond to that?

00:12:02.440 You know, I would never hate Pope Francis.

00:12:05.520 And I tell you something else.

00:12:06.500 I try not to hate anybody on this earth.

00:12:09.500 I think that our main duty as Catholics is to pray every day for the Pope, actually, because it's so important.

00:12:17.280 He has to follow Christ too.

00:12:19.660 It is our duty to pray for the Pope and to support him and to respect his authority, of course.

00:12:24.760 So that's not the point.

00:12:25.600 I would never, never hate the Pope.

00:12:27.660 For me, the most important example here is what Bishop Schneider and Kader Berg and all those great heroes of our days say about that.

00:12:37.400 But if we would hate the Pope, why would I pray for him?

00:12:42.960 I pray for him because I love him, actually.

00:12:45.420 I really think that our Pope needs our prayer, needs our help.

00:12:49.980 And this is very normal.

00:12:51.280 And I want to give him my help, not in an arrogant way, but in a humble way.

00:12:56.680 So I'm going to pray and I'm going to do things and say things where he knows what we think.

00:13:02.820 And so for him, it's easier.

00:13:04.160 You know, as a synod, the synod is there to be a counsel for the Pope.

00:13:08.160 And I think if the synod says many things what the faithful Catholics do not think and do not believe, 0.96

00:13:15.600 it's our duty to stand up as faithful Catholics and tell the Pope too,

00:13:20.280 so that he can get the full picture of the Catholic spirituality and the Catholic people.

00:13:24.940 It's very important.

00:13:27.120 Exactly.

00:13:28.040 Speaking of those great heroes of our day, you mentioned Cardinal Berg and Bishop Schneider.

00:13:34.600 I think your action actually encouraged them.

00:13:37.820 I've referred to your action as the beginning of the resistance, if you will,

00:13:41.800 even though there's been a lot done to this point.

00:13:44.700 Your move was actually something that I think sparked a lot of valor in a lot of the laity,

00:13:52.240 but a lot of the clergy as well.

00:13:53.520 We saw some of the strongest, in fact, not some of, the strongest statements that have ever been made

00:13:59.440 about the crisis in the church come out right after your action.

00:14:03.720 Bishop Schneider had one of the strongest statements I've ever seen from him.

00:14:08.020 Cardinal Brandtmüller as well.

00:14:09.860 And both of them called your actions heroic.

00:14:12.440 So you might see them as heroes, but they see you as heroes as a hero as well.

00:14:16.480 Yeah, I'm very flattered if I hear things like that, of course.

00:14:20.520 But, you know, I think it's not about if this is heroic or not.

00:14:27.300 It's not about my person.

00:14:28.860 It's about the thing what happened.

00:14:31.140 You know, the most important thing is when I did it afterwards,

00:14:34.400 I got all the reactions from millions of Catholics, millions of laymen, of priests, of high clergy,

00:14:42.420 of also a few bishops and even a few cardinals.

00:14:46.260 You mentioned Brandtmüller, but also Cardinal Müller spoke out loud and other high clergymen.

00:14:53.500 And so it's fantastic to see that we are all a big faithful group of people who really want to follow Christ.

00:15:00.840 And yes, of course, the act, you know, it was like one of those steam pots you use for cooking in the kitchen.

00:15:08.560 If you open it, there is a steam cloud which explodes in your face.

00:15:16.100 And I think that's the same.

00:15:17.420 The people were really thinking about all those things every day, every day.

00:15:21.320 They were all angry and so on.

00:15:22.600 And now they had a possibility to say out loud what they think.

00:15:26.460 And so the action gave us, and that's something I saw too and I recognize too,

00:15:32.080 the action gave us the possibility to say what we think as faithful Catholics.

00:15:38.220 As faithful Catholics.

00:15:39.300 I always want to stretch out that point.

00:15:41.120 We would never do it because of our own issue.

00:15:45.500 We do it because we think it is right in the eyes of God.

00:15:48.240 Because the first commandment tells us not to bow down to any graven image, which is not about God and his empire, you know, his kingdom.

00:16:00.700 So what did they do in the Vatican gardens?

00:16:03.220 They bowed down to a graven image.

00:16:06.100 Then some people explained us that these images should depict our most holy mother, the mother of God, and Elizabeth.

00:16:14.140 And then they said, no, it's not Elizabeth, and it's not the mother of God.

00:16:18.040 And then they said, no, there are only some statues.

00:16:20.960 And then at the end, they all agreed on that those are signs of fertility and of Mother Earth.

00:16:29.420 And Mother Earth is a pagan goddess because there is the misconception that God is not the creator who stands over the creation,

00:16:37.880 but as a creator is in the creation.

00:16:41.000 And I have to really disagree on that because if God would be in the creation the same way they think it is,

00:16:48.880 then every sickness, every disease, everything bad happening on Earth would be part of God.

00:16:54.280 And that's not right because God created everything 100% perfect.

00:16:59.720 So that's why I see, you know, that's not the point.

00:17:03.680 That's not the point.

00:17:04.480 We have to stand up here.

00:17:05.700 And it is about all of us fighting.

00:17:08.660 It was all of us.

00:17:10.640 Now, you've actually been following the Synod very closely.

00:17:15.260 So what I ask then, what are your thoughts on the Synod, the way it progressed, and the outcome?

00:17:21.300 Yeah, my thoughts on the Synod, of course, I was very disappointed.

00:17:25.180 When I first heard of the Synod, I was really afraid because I thought, oh my God, what's happening next, you know?

00:17:31.760 So, and then I saw the Synod will be about women being ordained.

00:17:36.220 The Synod will be about an own Amazonian rite that will be about married priests and so on.

00:17:42.880 So I already saw, okay, the points, we all know the issues that are being brought up by fellow Christians who are unfortunately not on our side,

00:17:52.320 but rather leftist in the Church, they are coming again.

00:17:57.280 Then I thought, you know, why are they talking about the priesthood, for example?

00:18:01.460 John Paul II said everything to it, what had to be said.

00:18:06.000 And the Church tradition already had, you know, already fixed that for us, so we don't have to discuss it anymore.

00:18:13.100 So I was very suspicious.

00:18:14.320 And then when I got more into it, I saw that there is also a big political perspective of it.

00:18:19.500 There's a big political perspective, too.

00:18:21.160 You see, for example, our Holy Father said a few weeks before the Synod, we have to obey the United Nations in everything they tell us.

00:18:29.500 And I saw, okay, this is not only about the faith.

00:18:33.860 It is a political thing, too.

00:18:35.480 So it is about the whole green climate change ideology, even though I, you know, I don't want to talk about this detail right now,

00:18:45.480 but I saw it all comes together.

00:18:47.440 It's kind of a mixture of everything happening on Earth right now.

00:18:50.040 It's social justice.

00:18:51.660 It's a little bit, you know, some people who defend communism even went there.

00:18:56.400 The liberation theology came up again.

00:18:58.440 And all the liberation theologians were present on pictures standing next to the table where even our Holy Father sat during the Synod.

00:19:07.200 So I saw that this is a big mixture of wrong ideas.

00:19:11.400 And even though I expected it to be even more of a bomb at the end when I saw the document,

00:19:20.000 they brought, they tried to bring through a few points.

00:19:22.780 And I know the Synod is only there to give advice to the Pope.

00:19:26.600 But, you know, for example, in Germany, they already said we now have to use the Amazon paper and try to establish it in Germany, for example.

00:19:36.640 And in Germany, there is no jungle.

00:19:39.060 We don't have indigenous people running around. 1.00

00:19:41.200 So you see that there is another purpose of the Synod and there is another issue behind it.

00:19:46.780 And we'd like to point out that issue and show the people it is not only about all those grave sins they try to establish.

00:19:55.880 It's also about a political action.

00:19:58.140 So it goes hand in hand with the globalist agendas, too.

00:20:03.060 So you, from this, have taken on something you've announced this morning, a St. Boniface Institute that you've begun.

00:20:13.500 What is that?

00:20:14.480 Where can people learn about it and sign up to it?

00:20:16.760 Yes, we founded it directly after we did what we did.

00:20:21.840 The St. Boniface Institute has the purpose to be the voice of Catholic laymen and, of course, also clergy, but mainly laymen who want to speak up, who want to live, who want to have the church living a traditional way of our faith.

00:20:37.960 The way the Catholic Church was always built, so up on the tradition and the scripture, not only the scripture.

00:20:45.340 And therefore, we founded this institute.

00:20:48.460 We already have a homepage, but the homepage is very easy and not too elaborated right now.

00:20:53.600 So I will provide you the link and then you can click on it.

00:20:57.520 And we have a Patreon page for people if they say they want to help us financially, you know, because maybe they tried to charge us and so on.

00:21:06.140 And it would be very nice if we see that we have the support from all the world, of course.

00:21:11.060 So this is what we did and our idea is not to be quiet anymore.

00:21:14.340 You know, when we first did the video, we said we don't want to come out with our faces because we wanted the people to talk about what happens in the video and what we do and not about who did it.

00:21:28.980 And now, after the Synod, we think it is very important that the people know who did it because as a Catholic, I think we should always fight with our faces seen.

00:21:39.440 Because the people should know who we are and the people should know that we fight there with our whole personality, not only in anonymity.

00:21:49.460 So that's very important.

00:21:50.560 And the St. Boniface Institute tries to take care of that.

00:21:54.260 We just settle up everything.

00:21:56.800 And I think in one or two weeks, everything will be ready and then we will have more content on the homepage.

00:22:02.540 But till now, it's more content.

00:22:05.840 Excellent.

00:22:06.380 Well, last question, Alexander.

00:22:07.780 Just, you're a young person who has really moved from sort of thought to action.

00:22:14.680 A lot of people are thinking about doing something right now.

00:22:18.660 The faith is in grave crisis.

00:22:20.880 But you moved in a, you know, from this thought of something to do something to action in a very hard thing to do.

00:22:29.760 How would you encourage other young people to move from sort of thought to action in this way of something that is spiritually good and a good thing to do, but they might be reticent to do because of the hardship or something that it would cause?

00:22:44.640 Yes, yes.

00:22:46.960 Nowadays, we have tons of possibilities to do that.

00:22:51.400 You know, it is not only fighting for God if you throw out Pachamamos of a Catholic Church and throw them into the Thai, but there are other possibilities too. 0.99

00:22:59.860 The first thing is, visit your local traditional church.

00:23:05.960 The best you can get is the most traditional you can get.

00:23:09.660 It's the best what you can get.

00:23:11.200 Visit them, pray tons of rosaries and really try to get into a good prayer and good people telling you about the philosophy and the history of the church.

00:23:20.080 Try to really know what you are talking about.

00:23:23.160 Then go out there and talk with other people.

00:23:25.680 Go to maybe your home parish, your family, your friends.

00:23:29.320 Join the local bro life team.

00:23:32.100 Join the local bro family team.

00:23:34.700 You know, help your priests and all the other guys.

00:23:38.540 And now mainly, speak up.

00:23:40.700 If anything happens which is not Catholic, go there and speak personally. 0.92

00:23:46.660 Make a statement online.

00:23:48.380 Go there, write letters.

00:23:50.660 The most important thing is, don't sit at home and think about what you could do.

00:23:56.920 Think about it clearly.

00:23:58.340 Then go to the priest and ask him about if this is really in the range of Catholic action.

00:24:05.340 And if he says yes, then just do it.

00:24:07.720 Go there and take your own action.

00:24:09.520 You know, we are Catholics.

00:24:11.440 As Catholics, we are part of the Iglesia Militans.

00:24:14.100 And Iglesia Militans means fighting because on earth we fight.

00:24:19.420 It's a fight between the kingdom of God and the prince, perhaps, you know, how do you say this in English?

00:24:28.780 And the principality of Satan.

00:24:29.980 Yeah, of the devil.

00:24:31.040 You know, the reign of the devil.

00:24:32.560 So, you have to be on one side.

00:24:35.980 And I'd rather be on St. Michael's side than on Lucifer's side, I have to admit.

00:24:41.120 So, now go out there, join St. Michael's side and try to really, really act.

00:24:47.540 Amen.

00:24:48.380 Amen.

00:24:49.000 Alexander, it's been an honor for me to have you on the John Henry Weston Show.

00:24:52.140 God bless you and thank you.

00:24:53.520 Thank you very much, John Henry.

00:24:54.700 God bless you and all your work that you do for me.

00:24:57.040 You know, all my friends, we all read Lifeset News.

00:24:59.320 We all love it.

00:25:00.580 So, it's fantastic.

00:25:01.340 Awesome.

00:25:01.400 Thank you.

The John-Henry Westen Show - November 04, 2019

Man who threw Pachamama into Tiber speaks with John-Henry Westen

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