The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - 263. An Interview with my Father ｜ Walter Peterson

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00:00:51.000 Welcome to episode 263 of the JBP podcast. I'm Mikayla Peterson.

00:00:59.000 In this amazing episode, I will treasure forever. Dad talked to his dad, my grandpa, Walter Peterson.

00:01:06.000 They went over our family history, relationships, growing up, learning to read and write, raising children and marriage.

00:01:13.000 I hope you enjoy this as much as I did.

00:01:15.000 I never do that. You see, I hardly ever skipped school.

00:01:23.000 I never do that. You see, I hardly ever skipped school.

00:01:39.000 And every time I did, God damn it, you caught me. 0.97

00:01:42.000 I did it like three times. One time I drove to Heinz Creek. 0.99

00:01:47.000 Three times. Really? It wasn't very, I tell you, it wasn't very often.

00:01:51.000 One time I drove to Heinz Creek to get away from you.

00:01:53.000 I thought, I'll drive to Heinz Creek. He's not going to find me there.

00:01:56.000 And then on the way back from Heinz Creek, you drove by and waved at me.

00:02:00.000 I said, oh my God, he caught me again. So ridiculous. 0.99

00:02:04.000 Hello, everybody.

00:02:25.000 I decided today that I'm going to talk to my dad as the subject for my YouTube video and podcast and find out more about his life, his young life on the prairie in Saskatchewan.

00:02:42.000 About his father, my grandfather, his grandfather, my great grandfather, his mother, what it was like growing up back in the 40s, mostly.

00:02:54.000 He was born in 1937, July of 1937.

00:02:58.000 And we've talked about such things, but not that much.

00:03:02.000 And so there's lots of things I want to know.

00:03:04.000 And so that's what we're going to try to talk about today.

00:03:07.000 And I'm going to walk through his life with him and ask him a bunch of questions so that I have the answers to the questions.

00:03:13.000 And I hope you enjoy it.

00:03:14.000 Hello.

00:03:15.000 Hey, George.

00:03:17.000 How are you doing?

00:03:19.000 Just as good as it gets.

00:03:21.000 Good.

00:03:22.000 Glad to hear it.

00:03:23.000 So I thought I'd start by telling the story of this third floor that I built on my house.

00:03:28.000 And so one of the things we did, we were going to build a log cabin on the third floor of this semi-detached house right in downtown Toronto.

00:03:39.000 Tammy and I thought about that.

00:03:40.000 I guess we wanted a cabin out in the woods, but we thought we could at least build one on our third floor.

00:03:46.000 And then that sort of morphed into this Native American big house, which is all made of wood inside.

00:03:53.000 Unlike the plaster sheeting that makes up the rest of the house.

00:04:00.000 So walking up there is quite a transition.

00:04:02.000 And we built it with some local architects and with some input from Quackio to Carver, who filled it up with totem poles.

00:04:10.000 But on the walls, you and I talked about the possibility of tearing some old wood off the farmstead in Saskatchewan,

00:04:20.000 off the original buildings there that great-grandpa Barent homesteaded.

00:04:25.000 And so that happened when the totem poles came across the country on a 53-foot truck.

00:04:31.000 Joel, my brother, had helped tear a bunch of the wood off the building surrounding the original house and off the barn.

00:04:41.000 And so the wall, both walls, are done in grey wood or red wood because some of the buildings were red, that barn red.

00:04:51.000 Or they're made of doors from the buildings.

00:04:54.000 So, and you had stripped some of that wood off years ago to use in your room downstairs as well.

00:05:03.000 That was before anything like that was popular.

00:05:07.000 Yeah.

00:05:08.000 Yeah.

00:05:09.000 I took the floor out of the loft of the barn.

00:05:15.000 And I used it for flooring in the cabins at the lake.

00:05:20.000 I didn't know you used it for flooring there.

00:05:26.000 You also used it in a decorative way in the pool room.

00:05:30.000 That's pool table, by the way, not pool.

00:05:35.000 Downstairs here, you mean?

00:05:40.000 Yeah.

00:05:41.000 No, that wasn't from the barn.

00:05:43.000 That was from a friend of mine.

00:05:46.000 Oh, okay.

00:05:47.000 Okay.

00:05:48.000 Well, I think I got the idea for using the old wood.

00:05:50.000 Anyways, we did get the stuff stripped away from the old farmstead.

00:05:53.000 So, now your great, my great grandfather, your grandfather Bernd, from whom my middle name is derived.

00:06:02.000 He came to North America from Norway.

00:06:07.000 No, he was born in North Dakota or in Minnesota.

00:06:14.000 Was it his father that came?

00:06:18.000 Yeah, his father and his father-in-law.

00:06:25.000 Did you tell me they built a boat and came to Norway or came from Norway to New York?

00:06:31.000 That actually was his father-in-law that built the boat.

00:06:42.000 And the two families came.

00:06:46.000 I think there were a total of nine or 10 on the boat.

00:06:54.000 Yeah.

00:06:55.000 They left Norway and sailed all the way to New York.

00:07:01.000 Hmm.

00:07:02.000 And then they ended up in the Midwest where there were a lot of Norwegian settlers.

00:07:07.000 Well, yeah, Minnesota and North Dakota were the, well, Wisconsin too, to a certain extent.

00:07:15.000 They were just the areas where the Norwegians and the Swedes settled.

00:07:22.000 Yeah.

00:07:23.000 So, they migrated that way.

00:07:26.000 And then there was a move up into Saskatchewan.

00:07:29.000 Yeah, about 1910, I think, was the first time that they came up and homesteaded.

00:07:42.000 And then they left again, because it didn't work out as, I guess, homestead life was pretty tough.

00:07:49.000 You know?

00:07:50.000 So, they left again, but they didn't sell the place.

00:07:55.000 They did have an auction.

00:08:00.000 My grandfather's old clock was in the auction.

00:08:05.000 And when they came back to Saskatchewan, they went to an auction sale and they bought it back.

00:08:12.000 And I still have it.

00:08:14.000 So, how did they get up to Saskatchewan from Minnesota at that time?

00:08:19.000 Was it rail?

00:08:21.000 No, they drove up.

00:08:24.000 In fact, I think you have a picture.

00:08:29.000 I think you have a picture of the old car that they drove up in.

00:08:34.000 I don't know what it was.

00:08:36.000 I can remember seeing pictures of it.

00:08:39.000 They left and I presume they went back down to Minnesota, but then they came back.

00:08:43.000 No.

00:08:44.000 Or where'd they go?

00:08:46.000 North Dakota.

00:08:47.000 A place called Vang, V-A-N-G. 1.00

00:08:54.000 Both families were in that area, not separated by too much.

00:09:03.000 I think my grandfather worked in the dairy there.

00:09:09.000 And by both families, who do you mean?

00:09:12.000 Well, I mean my grandmother's family and my grandfather's family.

00:09:17.000 And they were married when they came up to Saskatchewan already?

00:09:21.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:09:22.000 And so, why did they decide to come to Saskatchewan if they were already settled in North Dakota?

00:09:29.000 Well, the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.

00:09:35.000 Yeah, except when it's in Saskatchewan.

00:09:38.000 Burr.

00:09:39.000 Free land and it's not colder in Saskatchewan than it is in North Dakota.

00:09:48.000 Right, and so the Canadian government was offering homesteaders at that time a chunk of land if they would come in and do what to it?

00:09:57.000 Well, they had to prove it up over a period of three years.

00:10:02.000 I think they had to break about 10 acres the first year.

00:10:09.000 And I think they were required to have some sort of domicile on it.

00:10:17.000 And that's probably a loose word for home.

00:10:21.000 Right, right.

00:10:23.000 And so, do you have any idea why they left the first time?

00:10:28.000 You said it was hard.

00:10:29.000 I mean, we can talk about that in a minute, but any specific reasons?

00:10:33.000 No, I really don't have.

00:10:34.000 No, I don't really have.

00:10:36.000 I imagine there were a number of factors.

00:10:40.000 I'm sure life was fairly tough in Saskatchewan.

00:10:44.000 I imagine they were homesick.

00:10:47.000 Anyway, that's the story.

00:10:51.000 They left.

00:10:52.000 And do you know how long it was before they came back?

00:10:56.000 I think it was about a matter of about a year and a half, something like that, or maybe just a year.

00:11:05.000 But I'm not sure of that, George.

00:11:07.000 They thought they'd give it another try.

00:11:09.000 And the second time they stayed.

00:11:12.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:11:14.000 Well, maybe it wasn't as bad as they thought, you know.

00:11:19.000 So what would it have meant to break 10 acres of land at that time?

00:11:25.000 What would have you had to do and how?

00:11:27.000 Well, you took your axe and you cut down the poplar that was on the place.

00:11:34.000 And I guess there were a few spruce on it as well.

00:11:39.000 And then you took your grub hole out and tried to dig the roots out.

00:11:46.000 And you used your team to pull the roots out and piled them up and burn them and cultivated the land as best you could and probably sowed some wheat on it.

00:12:00.000 So that whole area, so that was near Nakem, Saskatchewan, if anyone wants to look on a map.

00:12:07.000 Yeah.

00:12:08.000 That whole area, the prairie there, would have been covered with trees?

00:12:11.000 Yeah, there were trees there at that time.

00:12:16.000 Yeah, it was covered with trees.

00:12:19.000 So to clear 10 acres meant you had to cut down hundreds of trees, I presume, and then you had to pull the roots out of the ground one at a time with a team of horses.

00:12:29.000 That's why you could only clear 10 acres or why you had to clear 10 acres, you said, in the first year.

00:12:34.000 Because 10 acres isn't that big by farm standards.

00:12:37.000 I think it was 10 acres a year for three years to claim it up.

00:12:43.000 I don't know.

00:12:44.000 These are things we never really talked about when I was a kid.

00:12:49.000 How do you know about it at all?

00:12:52.000 Well, I guess sitting around the table listening to the adults talk, I picked up a lot of it.

00:13:04.000 So how many kids did your grandparents have?

00:13:09.000 They just had the one, Stanley, my dad.

00:13:15.000 And Stanley was adopted?

00:13:17.000 He was.

00:13:19.000 And was he adopted in the United States or was he adopted in Saskatchewan?

00:13:24.000 He was adopted in Saskatchewan.

00:13:27.000 Do you know if they knew, did they know anything about him?

00:13:34.000 Did they know anything about his family?

00:13:36.000 That I have no idea about.

00:13:39.000 That was something that was never talked about as far as I can remember.

00:13:45.000 Do you know how old he was?

00:13:47.000 I don't think.

00:13:48.000 Go ahead.

00:13:49.000 He was an infant.

00:13:50.000 He was an infant.

00:13:53.000 I don't think I knew dad was adopted until I was a teenager.

00:14:00.000 And then I probably didn't believe it the first time I was told.

00:14:04.000 Was it a shock?

00:14:08.000 I don't know whether you'd call it a shock or not.

00:14:11.000 It was, I suppose it was a bit of a shock.

00:14:16.000 Yeah.

00:14:17.000 So, and they had no other children.

00:14:20.000 They had no other children.

00:14:22.000 And so I remember going out to that farmstead and that would have been 25 years probably after you had left it.

00:14:33.000 With great grandpa Berndt, a couple of times, to ride on a potato harvester he had built.

00:14:41.000 And all the outbuildings were still out there, including the blacksmith shop.

00:14:45.000 And the, I don't remember what you called it.

00:14:48.000 It was this contraption, like an enclosed sled that you used to go to school in.

00:14:54.000 It was still intact.

00:14:55.000 A caboose?

00:14:56.000 Caboose.

00:14:57.000 Yeah, you called it a caboose.

00:14:58.000 Why was it called a caboose?

00:15:00.000 Oh, God only knows.

00:15:03.000 I don't know.

00:15:05.000 I have no idea why it was called a caboose.

00:15:08.000 That's probably a good question to ask Google.

00:15:11.000 All right.

00:15:12.000 So, all right.

00:15:13.000 So, you, Berndt and his wife, and I don't remember Berndt's wife's name.

00:15:19.000 Of course, I never knew her.

00:15:21.000 Clara.

00:15:22.000 Clara.

00:15:23.000 Clara.

00:15:24.000 They built a log house on the prairie and a barn.

00:15:30.000 And there must have been eight or nine other buildings, small shed-like buildings.

00:15:35.000 One of them was a blacksmith shop.

00:15:37.000 Oh, yeah.

00:15:38.000 Well, there were, you know, there were different buildings over different periods of time.

00:15:49.000 But you're right, there were probably at least a half dozen other buildings and the house

00:15:56.000 and the barn and the shop.

00:15:58.000 And the pump, which was surrounded by a big tractor, big metal tractor wheel.

00:16:06.000 Yes, it was a wheel off a steamer that we made a trough out of.

00:16:15.000 And the cabin you grew up in, which was a log cabin, it was insulated with cardboard, if I remember correctly.

00:16:23.000 But when I knew the house, it was still standing.

00:16:26.000 Right?

00:16:27.000 We could still go in it.

00:16:28.000 It was still standing.

00:16:29.000 Well, I think it's still kind of standing.

00:16:34.000 Maybe not.

00:16:35.000 I don't know.

00:16:36.000 I haven't been there for a couple of years now.

00:16:38.000 Yeah.

00:16:39.000 The last time I saw it was a few years ago and it had collapsed a fair bit.

00:16:42.000 I don't think you could get inside it anymore.

00:16:44.000 Yeah.

00:16:45.000 But it had a central room and a bedroom on, did it face, which direction did it face?

00:16:52.000 It had two bedrooms on the east side.

00:16:55.000 Okay, so it was one room, one main room with two bedrooms on the east side?

00:17:03.000 Or was there a bedroom on the other side too?

00:17:07.000 No, there was a kitchen and a hallway and a living room is what we called it.

00:17:17.000 And then there were the two bedrooms on the east side.

00:17:21.000 The house, I guess, was long, you know, it was long north and south.

00:17:28.000 Right.

00:17:29.000 And it wasn't very big.

00:17:32.000 No.

00:17:33.000 How many square feet do you think it was?

00:17:35.000 600?

00:17:38.000 Yeah, probably about that.

00:17:42.000 Yeah, like one floor of my semi-detached in Toronto.

00:17:46.000 Probably.

00:17:47.000 Yeah.

00:17:48.000 Yeah.

00:17:49.000 And you had two sisters grow up with you there.

00:17:53.000 How many people lived in that house when you were a little kid?

00:17:58.000 Well, how old was I?

00:18:00.000 Well, how old were you when you left that house and moved?

00:18:04.000 How old were you when you left that house and moved into town?

00:18:09.000 I was probably about nine or ten.

00:18:15.000 Okay, so you should have some pretty decent memories of that place if you were that old.

00:18:20.000 Okay, so how many people lived there in that house from the time you were born until the time you were ten, generally speaking?

00:18:31.000 Well, I guess there would have been four adults and three kids.

00:18:36.000 Four adults.

00:18:37.000 So your grandfather and your grandmother, Barrett and Clara, and Stanley, your dad.

00:18:44.000 And my mother, Bernice.

00:18:45.000 Bernice, his wife, and your sister Judy and your sister Betty, both of whom were younger than you.

00:18:51.000 Right.

00:18:52.000 Okay, how did all seven of you live in that house?

00:18:55.000 There was two bedrooms.

00:18:56.000 How was that?

00:18:57.000 How did you manage that?

00:19:00.000 How did we manage that?

00:19:06.000 I really have no idea how we managed that.

00:19:09.000 Well, who slept in which bedrooms?

00:19:13.000 Were all the kids in one bedroom?

00:19:16.000 No, no.

00:19:17.000 But that would only leave one room for the adults.

00:19:24.000 Yeah.

00:19:26.000 I don't know whether I can answer that question or not.

00:19:29.000 I don't think I know.

00:19:31.000 Okay.

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00:22:20.000 You have a soft spot in your heart for that house.

00:22:24.000 A soft spot.

00:22:28.000 Yeah, well, you always go back and visit it, you know, and you're nostalgic when you go out to the farm.

00:22:34.000 Wow.

00:22:35.000 Yeah, I guess I have a soft spot for it.

00:22:39.000 I grew up there.

00:22:40.000 Yeah, well, what was it like to grow up there?

00:22:43.000 Good.

00:22:44.000 Good how?

00:22:46.000 What did you do, like, when you were a little kid, when you were just...

00:22:49.000 The earliest memories you have, what are the earliest memories you have of being out there?

00:22:53.000 Now, you only spoke, you spoke Norwegian out there, right?

00:22:57.000 Primarily.

00:22:58.000 Well, yeah, kind of a Minnesota Norwegian, I guess.

00:23:03.000 My grandfather and grandmother spoke Norwegian mainly.

00:23:08.000 They could both speak English, but mainly they spoke Norwegian.

00:23:15.000 My dad spoke Norwegian when he was with my grandfather and grandmother and English the rest of the time.

00:23:25.000 My mother, Bernice, probably could speak some Norwegian, but we spoke some English, too, because neighbors weren't always fluent in Norwegian, although a lot of them were.

00:23:44.000 So, what was life like there on the farmstead when you were a kid?

00:23:50.000 You had animals, you had horses.

00:23:52.000 We had horses and cattle, pigs, chickens.

00:24:01.000 Who took care of them? 0.90

00:24:03.000 Well, I guess we all did, or I shouldn't say we all did, but my grandfather and grandmother and mom and dad took care of them.

00:24:16.000 And what did that entail?

00:24:19.000 And how many cows were there?

00:24:21.000 Do you have any idea?

00:24:23.000 Well, I would guess that there were probably about six cows that were milk producers and then the rest were raised for beef.

00:24:34.000 Excuse me.

00:24:35.000 Horses.

00:24:36.000 We probably had four or five horses all the time.

00:24:46.000 And did you ride a lot?

00:24:49.000 Ride horse?

00:24:50.000 Yeah.

00:24:51.000 No, not very much.

00:24:56.000 I rode some, but I wouldn't say I was.

00:25:04.000 A cowboy or anything.

00:25:07.000 Any particular reason?

00:25:09.000 Were they, I mean, did you like horses?

00:25:12.000 Was it interesting to you or were they work animals?

00:25:15.000 Well, both.

00:25:17.000 They were interesting.

00:25:18.000 They were work animals.

00:25:20.000 I mean, that's what pulled the implements when I was a kid.

00:25:27.000 I can remember when we got our first tractor.

00:25:34.000 Um, and I can remember when we got our first rubber tired tractor, but I can also remember riding on implements with my grandfather driving four horses in front of it.

00:25:49.000 Plowing that and plowing and that sort of thing and harvest.

00:25:54.000 Well, I don't, I don't remember plowing as such, but I remember seeding.

00:25:59.000 Um, because on the cedar, you could stand on a, on a platform at the back of the unit and, uh, you had a good view of everything and there was something to hang on to.

00:26:12.000 So you didn't fall off.

00:26:15.000 And we had an old dog named Pooch who used to sit right up on the seed box and kind of look around the whole country while we were doing that.

00:26:27.000 He got pretty good at a bellings balancing.

00:26:31.000 How big a farm would have the family handled at that time? 0.88

00:26:36.000 I think it was, I think it was three quarters as long as I can remember.

00:26:42.000 And how many acres are in a quarter?

00:26:44.000 180, 160.

00:26:48.000 160.

00:26:49.000 So it was 480 acres.

00:26:51.000 And so the, the farm obviously expanded past the initial homestead relatively rapidly?

00:26:59.000 That I don't know.

00:27:02.000 I know who, I know who owned the quarters that were bought and brought into the farm, but I don't know the details of it.

00:27:14.000 And I don't, I don't know when.

00:27:17.000 Right.

00:27:18.000 So when, when, when Barent and Clara came back up, they made enough of a go at it the second time to establish a farmstead that was successful enough to buy other.

00:27:28.000 They're reasonably sizable pieces of land.

00:27:31.000 I mean, three quarters is not a immense farm by modern standards, obviously, but it's not no land at all.

00:27:37.000 It's.

00:27:38.000 No, it was, it was probably at its time.

00:27:43.000 Fairly average.

00:27:45.000 I mean, there were, there were families that had one quarter of land.

00:27:52.000 Uh, so three quarters was actually pretty good.

00:27:59.000 Mm hmm.

00:28:00.000 Mm hmm.

00:28:01.000 And so everything you ate, I presume pretty much came directly off the farm with the animals that you had.

00:28:07.000 So eggs and milk, you were, were you milking cows every day?

00:28:12.000 Uh, I wasn't.

00:28:14.000 My mother was a great milker. 0.96

00:28:17.000 Uh, I can remember her doing the milking a good portion of the time.

00:28:24.000 Grandma showed me one day a picture of the cabin with the firewood she had split for the winter.

00:28:33.000 And if that cabin was 600 square feet and a story high, the pile of wood that she split looked to be 1200 square feet and about at least as tall as the cabin.

00:28:46.000 When she said she split it, uh, I don't think she meant that she manually split it.

00:28:57.000 She may have had something to do with it, but we had a wood splitter, which was run by a small, uh, gas engine.

00:29:09.000 And you could split wood to beat the devil with it.

00:29:16.000 Yeah.

00:29:17.000 Well, that sounds like a lot easier than having to do it with an ax.

00:29:20.000 I know that grandma was a busy woman.

00:29:23.000 Um, but that does.

00:29:24.000 She was.

00:29:26.000 Yeah.

00:29:27.000 Well, she must've had her hands filled with three, with three kids and a whole farm to run. 1.00

00:29:31.000 And then when the threshing crews came in, if in the fall, if I also recall, she used to have to feed them as well.

00:29:37.000 And that was on wood stove. 0.98

00:29:39.000 She and my grandma.

00:29:40.000 Yeah.

00:29:43.000 And that would be 14, 15 men.

00:29:48.000 It pretty well filled the kitchen as I remember it.

00:29:51.000 Yeah, I bet.

00:29:54.000 So, and they, they were fed how many times a day?

00:29:57.000 Would she feed them three times a day when they were threshing?

00:30:00.000 Three times a day.

00:30:02.000 Right.

00:30:03.000 So that's 52 meals for very hungry men.

00:30:06.000 And that would be one of her many chores.

00:30:09.000 Yeah.

00:30:12.000 Nobody said it was easy.

00:30:14.000 No, no.

00:30:15.000 And grandpa showed me one time the, or I saw a picture of him.

00:30:19.000 I think he showed me though, the parka that he wore out in the winter to do his farm work.

00:30:25.000 And I mean, Saskatchewan is plenty cold.

00:30:27.000 It gets to be minus 40 there on no shortage of occasions.

00:30:31.000 And it also has quite the blistering wind.

00:30:33.000 And I mean, it was a wool jacket and, and jeans essentially underneath it.

00:30:38.000 It wasn't anything particularly bulky or fancy.

00:30:41.000 So, I imagine winter was pretty, well, it could be pretty brutal.

00:30:47.000 Well, I think, I think it was generally true that there weren't adequate clothes for the, for the temperatures that we did have.

00:31:02.000 I mean, the, the best you had was wool, you know, and, uh, wool, wool was the main thing.

00:31:15.000 Wool pants, wool underwear, uh, a heavy wool coat.

00:31:19.000 If you were lucky enough to have one, maybe it had canvas on the outside for a windbreak.

00:31:27.000 But those guys were tough, you know.

00:31:32.000 Yeah.

00:31:33.000 Well, I remember grandpa's arms, forearms.

00:31:35.000 I mean, they were no joke when he was a, he, you know, I remember him from about the time I was 10, I suppose.

00:31:42.000 I think that's about where his memories come from.

00:31:45.000 He would have been 50 probably at that point.

00:31:48.000 And I mean, he had, he had immense forearms.

00:31:51.000 He was, he's a very strongly built person.

00:31:53.000 And he had done a plenty of work.

00:31:57.000 So did, did, did you have a happy childhood?

00:32:01.000 Would you say?

00:32:04.000 Did I have a happy childhood?

00:32:06.000 Yeah.

00:32:07.000 Well, like I said, you're attached to the farm.

00:32:10.000 I would say, yes, I had a happy child.

00:32:14.000 Okay.

00:32:15.000 And up, up, up to what age?

00:32:17.000 Well, I suppose, teen years.

00:32:24.000 So what, what made it a happy childhood?

00:32:29.000 Well, what, what wouldn't have made it a happy childhood?

00:32:33.000 Well, I mean, you were free as the breeze.

00:32:38.000 You had acres and acres to wander around in.

00:32:44.000 There was lots of wildlife.

00:32:49.000 There were some chores.

00:32:52.000 It was just a good life.

00:32:55.000 What chores did you have to do?

00:32:57.000 Oh, you had to bring in wood.

00:33:01.000 Occasionally you had to bring in a pail of water.

00:33:04.000 Usually it was only about a half a pail because you couldn't carry a whole pail.

00:33:10.000 You had to go with the pump and pump the water into the pail and then it wasn't very far to carry it, but it had to be carried occasionally.

00:33:20.000 So you weren't overwhelmed with, you weren't overwhelmed with chores by the sounds of it?

00:33:27.000 No, I wouldn't say, I wouldn't say I was overwhelmed with it at all.

00:33:34.000 No.

00:33:35.000 So you had a lot of.

00:33:36.000 I had something, I had some things to do.

00:33:40.000 Right, right.

00:33:41.000 And you did them.

00:33:43.000 Yeah.

00:33:45.000 And if you didn't do them, what happened?

00:33:47.000 Or did that just not happen?

00:33:48.000 Oh, I imagine it happened.

00:33:54.000 I would imagine a scolding was probably the main thing.

00:34:00.000 Who from?

00:34:03.000 Well, the scolding would probably have come from my mother or my grandmother.

00:34:11.000 Dad was pretty strict.

00:34:13.000 He didn't scold much.

00:34:18.000 So in what way was he strict?

00:34:21.000 Well, let's just say he was strict.

00:34:26.000 Well, I'm curious about your, I'm curious about your relationship with your great grandfather and your father, because you've intimated that in many ways you were raised by your great grandfather.

00:34:41.000 And I remember when I was about, I think, great grandfather Barrett died when I was about nine, ten?

00:34:49.000 Nine or ten, yeah.

00:34:51.000 Yeah.

00:34:52.000 Well, that was the first brush I really had with loss.

00:34:54.000 And I wasn't so upset with his loss because I didn't know him that well.

00:34:59.000 I mean, I was sad about it because I liked him.

00:35:01.000 You know, when, but you were really broken up by that.

00:35:06.000 And so that was the first time I think I ever remember seeing you like emotionally distressed.

00:35:18.000 And it lasted at least a week, you know, which isn't a tremendous amount of time, but it was a tremendous amount of time as far as I was concerned.

00:35:24.000 Yeah, well, it was, he was pretty important.

00:35:32.000 Yeah.

00:35:33.000 So who, why was he so important to you?

00:35:39.000 What was it about him and your relationship with him?

00:35:42.000 I think kids have a, have a real relationship with their grandparents if they are fortunate enough to have them around.

00:36:00.000 And, you know, I can remember walking three steps behind him all over the farm.

00:36:08.000 So, so you trailed around behind him?

00:36:10.000 Day in and day out.

00:36:12.000 Uh-huh.

00:36:13.000 And, and that was fine with him?

00:36:16.000 Yeah.

00:36:17.000 Or was it more?

00:36:18.000 I think it was fine with him.

00:36:19.000 Was it more than fine?

00:36:20.000 He had to go home and wait.

00:36:22.000 Yeah.

00:36:23.000 Okay.

00:36:24.000 Well, that's something.

00:36:25.000 I mean, I remember the day, for example, we went out and rode on this.

00:36:29.000 Now, he was quite a handy person and quite a creative person, mechanically.

00:36:35.000 I mean, this potato harvest.

00:36:36.000 Yeah, he was.

00:36:37.000 This potato harvest here, he built it.

00:36:40.000 Well, you could drive it.

00:36:41.000 And I don't really remember how it harvested potatoes, but he had built it pretty much from the ground up, if I remember correctly.

00:36:48.000 Well, it didn't really harvest potatoes.

00:36:52.000 It was built so that you could drive it in a potato patch without driving over the rows.

00:37:02.000 It had quite a bit of clearance and outrigger wheels on it.

00:37:07.000 Right.

00:37:08.000 Right.

00:37:09.000 And mainly it pulled implements that harvested potatoes.

00:37:14.000 I see.

00:37:15.000 I see.

00:37:16.000 So it was a custom built tractor in some sense.

00:37:19.000 It was a custom built tractor.

00:37:21.000 Right.

00:37:22.000 Right.

00:37:23.000 And he did work in the blacksmith shop.

00:37:25.000 Oh, he was a good blacksmith.

00:37:28.000 He was a good blacksmith.

00:37:29.000 Yeah.

00:37:30.000 And it was probably one of his, I guess you'd call it a vocation.

00:37:37.000 Because if it was raining or if it was miserable, it was pretty easy to find grandpa and me in the shop.

00:37:44.000 Because there was usually a fire on in there and the building wasn't very large.

00:37:52.000 So it was warm and there was always lots to do.

00:37:56.000 What did you do?

00:37:57.000 Especially for him.

00:37:59.000 Yeah.

00:38:00.000 What did you do in the blacksmith shop?

00:38:02.000 Oh, hell, I can't remember now.

00:38:07.000 There was always stuff to do in there.

00:38:09.000 There was, you know, there was lots of, there was lots of junk pieces lying around.

00:38:15.000 And we had a, we had a, I don't know what you'd call it.

00:38:26.000 It was a wheel mounted on a, on what was like a stationary bicycle.

00:38:33.000 And you used to be able to get onto it and pedal so that the wheel went around.

00:38:39.000 And then you could sharpen your sickle or your axe or your knife or a stick or whatever you had.

00:38:47.000 And you could spend a lot of time at that when you were seven or eight years old.

00:38:52.000 And what, what sort of tools did he make in the blacksmith shop?

00:38:59.000 What sort of tools?

00:39:02.000 Well, I can remember him building a grain elevator.

00:39:07.000 Uh, we'd call it, we'd call it like an auger for grain.

00:39:13.000 And I think as I remembered, he built almost all of it out of, out of pieces.

00:39:22.000 He bent a tin or the galvanized metal that built a shoot and wasn't awfully big.

00:39:32.000 It probably only lifted the grain, maybe 12 feet, something like that.

00:39:38.000 But it worked sort of like, it didn't work like an auger.

00:39:42.000 It had a, it had a belt in it.

00:39:45.000 So they had just picked up the grain and moved it along on a belt that had, uh, I don't know what you'd call them even paddles of foot type on them.

00:39:57.000 Mm hmm.

00:39:58.000 Yeah.

00:39:59.000 And he was always building something.

00:40:02.000 So was it from him that you learned how to use tools and to appreciate tools?

00:40:07.000 Because you like to build things.

00:40:08.000 I mean, you've gunsmithed.

00:40:10.000 Oh, I think, I think, yeah, I think it probably was to a large extent due to him.

00:40:17.000 Did he teach you explicitly?

00:40:19.000 I'm sure he kept, pardon?

00:40:21.000 Did he teach you explicitly or did you pick up most of it by watching?

00:40:26.000 Oh, well, both.

00:40:28.000 I'm sure that he probably, uh, made sure that I was kept busy and out of trouble while I was in the shop.

00:40:39.000 And, uh, you know, that probably involves straightening nails and God knows what else.

00:40:46.000 Right.

00:40:47.000 So you had small productive jobs to do while you were hanging about with them.

00:40:52.000 Well, they, they were, I, you know, a job is what the body is obliged to do.

00:40:59.000 Mm hmm.

00:41:00.000 Yeah.

00:41:01.000 Yeah.

00:41:02.000 So this wasn't a job.

00:41:03.000 If it's not obliged to do it, then it's fun or play.

00:41:09.000 Mm hmm.

00:41:10.000 And so that's kind of how you remember that as play.

00:41:14.000 Well, I remember that as a good time.

00:41:18.000 Yeah.

00:41:19.000 Right.

00:41:20.000 So he was a, he was easy to get along with for you.

00:41:24.000 He was good.

00:41:25.000 Yeah.

00:41:26.000 Yeah.

00:41:27.000 Very good to me.

00:41:28.000 How about your grandma?

00:41:30.000 Grandma was great.

00:41:32.000 Yeah.

00:41:33.000 How?

00:41:34.000 What was great about it?

00:41:36.000 Well, well, she was extraordinarily kind.

00:41:41.000 Uh, I can't ever remember her disciplining me other than maybe shaking her head or something.

00:41:52.000 She taught me how to read at an early age.

00:41:56.000 Uh, we used to do homework together.

00:42:03.000 There were always treats.

00:42:08.000 Who knows?

00:42:09.000 She was very kind.

00:42:11.000 She taught you to read.

00:42:13.000 So that was how you learned to read.

00:42:16.000 Yeah.

00:42:17.000 I don't really remember learning to read.

00:42:22.000 I mean, I always had people reading to me.

00:42:25.000 My grandfather read to me a lot.

00:42:28.000 So did mom.

00:42:29.000 So did my grandmother.

00:42:31.000 Uh, I can remember reading the comics.

00:42:35.000 That was very important.

00:42:37.000 You know, the cats and jammer kids and little Abner and that kind of thing.

00:42:45.000 You know, for a long time, I didn't read it.

00:42:48.000 They read it.

00:42:49.000 But after a while, well, I don't know.

00:42:52.000 You kind of pick it up.

00:42:54.000 So I can remember.

00:42:57.000 Go ahead.

00:42:58.000 Did people in your house read a lot when they were, when they had some leisure time?

00:43:06.000 I wouldn't say a lot because there wasn't all that much leisure time.

00:43:11.000 And, uh, you know, for, for many years when it got dark, it was dark inside the house too.

00:43:20.000 Kerosene lamps didn't throw very much light.

00:43:23.000 Right.

00:43:24.000 Did you, was there ever electricity in the cabin that you grew up in up till the time you left?

00:43:30.000 No.

00:43:31.000 So that was all kerosene.

00:43:34.000 Kerosene and later, uh, gas lamps.

00:43:38.000 Right.

00:43:39.000 Which were a little brighter.

00:43:40.000 Yeah.

00:43:41.000 Yeah.

00:43:42.000 And they were considerably brighter.

00:43:44.000 Right.

00:43:45.000 And so it never had, it never had power.

00:43:49.000 Right.

00:43:50.000 So people were up at dawn, I presume.

00:43:52.000 And then, well, in bed, well, when it was dark and in the winter, that would be pretty early.

00:43:58.000 Yeah.

00:43:59.000 So you had a lot of time to spend by yourself if you wanted to wander around out into the fields and into the nearby woods and lake nearby?

00:44:14.000 No.

00:44:15.000 No slews, uh, which aren't as deep as lates, I guess similar, but, uh, there were lots of slews around and slews always had, wildlife around them.

00:44:31.000 wildlife around them yeah i wandered around a lot when i was a kid

00:44:37.200 i think i i think i knew every bush within about five miles of home pretty intimately

00:44:48.020 do you mean every tree well not every tree but i wasn't about to get lost in it

00:44:57.960 hmm yeah well there's something about that exploration you do when you're a kid that

00:45:03.360 really familiarizes yourself deeply with a place i don't know if you ever do that again in your life

00:45:10.760 when you move you know like i can remember the houses around the house i grew up in in fairview

00:45:18.820 far better into my imagination than i can picture the houses in this neighborhood like far better

00:45:26.720 even though i only lived there for eight years and i've lived here for almost 20

00:45:33.360 i still have a much better map house by house in my head of the immediate neighborhood i think when

00:45:40.140 you're a kid you pay attention to things in a different way than you do when you're an adult

00:45:44.820 because everything's so new

00:45:46.680 yeah yeah and well i believe you're right i think kids pay attention to what's going on

00:45:59.220 yeah i think what happened well you kind of your your perceptions get kind of generic you know after

00:46:06.300 you've seen 300 houses you sort of know what a house is and you don't have to look at it anymore

00:46:11.600 you just sort of replace it in your imagination with an image of a house you know and that works

00:46:16.080 as a placeholder but you don't know

00:46:18.080 you don't know the back alley in detail like you did when you were a kid

00:46:23.120 and you know i think you really lose a sense of familiarity because of that

00:46:27.220 that deep sense of belonging to a place is associated with that

00:46:30.980 really detailed exploration like i've noticed in

00:46:34.920 the houses i've moved into and apartments that unless i any corner that i haven't cleaned

00:46:42.120 any drawer that i haven't organized is kind of foreign territory in some sense it's not

00:46:47.980 it's not friendly to me but if i get in there into the details and explore completely the house

00:46:54.600 which i'm trying to do with this house you know we renovated it through two years ago three years ago

00:47:00.100 but i was so sick i couldn't remap it and it seems really foreign to me and i'm not happy in the house

00:47:06.700 because i don't really understand the house you know it's alien to me and so yesterday i spent

00:47:11.260 eight hours cleaning out a closet that was full of stuff i hadn't been able to touch for three years

00:47:16.360 and that was a great relief you know now i like kind of like my closet now i know exactly what's in it

00:47:21.680 i know exactly where everything is i put it there like i sort of touched everything it's mine now

00:47:28.580 whereas before it was just this place that was full of stuff i didn't understand and a bunch of

00:47:33.460 work that i hadn't done and you know it was leery of it there's still a lot of the houses like that

00:47:39.200 so i'm still not comfortable here but but i will be i'm before i leave in january we're going to go

00:47:47.980 through every square inch of it and hopefully put it in order it makes you much calmer to know

00:47:53.940 where are you going in january i'm going on tour oh oh okay going to washington first for

00:48:02.400 week or 10 days right i understand hey and i talked to joe rogan the other day

00:48:09.440 yeah yeah so i'm booked on his show in austin on the 24th

00:48:14.820 24th of 24th of january just just before the tour starts it starts are you good on the 25th yeah it

00:48:23.560 was really good to talk to him i always enjoyed listening to those yeah well rogan he's quite the

00:48:31.320 guy he's uh yeah he's done a lot of things he's tough he's smart he's funny uh doesn't take any

00:48:39.080 nonsense he's nobody's fool uh and he's even-handed with people and generous and he's a good guy like

00:48:47.200 he really is a good guy he deserves his success you know he's been a successful martial arts fighter

00:48:52.840 he was a successful host on a couple of tv shows he's been a successful stand-up comedian and then

00:48:58.920 he's been this ridiculously successful youtube interviewer and podcaster you don't get successful

00:49:04.800 at five different things without being pretty competent so so yeah i'm looking forward to seeing

00:49:11.520 him and he's a courageous sort too so and he's fun to have a conversation with because he has this great

00:49:16.500 sense of humor so so back to your to your grandfather you spend more time with your grandfather than with

00:49:23.140 your dad oh yeah way way more and why was that dad

00:49:29.180 why was it yeah why do you think it was i mean was was that par for the course in those days i mean

00:49:40.940 sometimes kids spend more time with their grandparents if if their well i think i think

00:49:46.960 i think grandfathers probably have more patience than fathers do at times

00:50:00.160 i don't really remember spending very much time with dad at all

00:50:10.800 did you get along with him

00:50:16.320 i guess i must have got along with them when i was young but as a teenager i would have to say no

00:50:35.200 i didn't get along with them very well why

00:50:39.520 well i guess i was probably i was probably as headstrong as he was

00:50:47.040 who knows what sort of things caused conflict

00:50:55.520 i guess down near everything

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00:52:20.040 now you were you were at the farmstead until you were nine and then the family moved into nakem and how big was

00:52:31.520 nakem at that time oh it probably was 400 people maybe and how much different was nakem when i got to know

00:52:44.660 it when i was a kid from from the nakem you grew up in well i don't think it was i don't think it was an

00:52:57.200 awful lot different um i guess there probably were some things you wouldn't do anymore when you were

00:53:08.880 there uh that we did it commonly every day uh never thought anything about it like what uh well

00:53:22.320 uh can you imagine uh uh how old were you 12 sure younger than that too but yeah 12 okay 11 11 12 year

00:53:37.100 old walking downtown with a 22 in his hand to the co-op store to buy some ammunition taking the gun

00:53:47.460 into the store and saying i need a box of shorts 22 shorts and the uh people behind the counter

00:53:57.660 wouldn't even blink an eye they just give you a box of shorts and take your 50 cents from you

00:54:03.900 i wouldn't try that one when you were there even you know no nobody was doing that then

00:54:11.240 no no so that's part of that freedom that you described

00:54:15.460 yeah freedom in common sense i think is uh was a little bit more

00:54:24.320 common then yeah well i wonder to some degree i wanted to some degree i thought that tried to

00:54:31.900 think that through i mean people were working physically and directly in a way that they don't

00:54:40.180 so much now you know you're on that farm you're contending with animals well you're contending

00:54:46.320 with the cold you're contending with the heat you're contending with the light for that matter

00:54:50.560 i mean everything's work but you're directly related to that work right i mean there's an

00:54:56.300 immediate payoff you you go out and and the chickens are there and you have eggs and you go out milk the

00:55:01.340 cows and you have milk and you churn it and you have butter and you turn the kerosene light on and you

00:55:06.600 have light and you light a fire and you have heat you know what i mean is that it's hard work in some

00:55:11.100 sense but the reward is instant plus it's really real it grounds you to to the to the actualities

00:55:17.120 of things and then you know people were younger when they had their families and so i think they

00:55:22.920 were more likely to grant their kids because they were a little more wild let's say being young

00:55:28.940 more likely to grant their kids a certain degree of independence because they were still young and

00:55:34.060 wanted to have fun and then most people had more siblings than they do now you know and i think

00:55:40.800 one of the reasons that people are more helicoptery around their kids now is because they they wait till

00:55:45.740 they're 35 to have them and so they're older that by then and let and more cautious and then they only

00:55:52.960 have one or maybe two and so they don't have 10 you know it's like you're not going to stay on top of

00:56:00.180 10 kids that's not going to happen i don't think you can stay on top of four and so that means to

00:56:05.880 some degrees the kids raise themselves right in sibling groups and the parents supervise but sort

00:56:11.960 of from a distance and i think you probably get a lot more realistic view of the world and your place

00:56:18.820 in it when you're wrestling for position with like six siblings

00:56:24.480 yeah hard to be hard to be it's hard to be special in that situation i mean your siblings aren't going

00:56:32.480 to like that

00:56:33.140 so you never know what these shifts cause and and that that that common sense it seems to me that's

00:56:42.360 associated with like a grounding in real things and and not this tendency we have now to sort of

00:56:48.280 float off into abstractions

00:56:50.340 yep

00:56:53.320 yeah because when you're even when you're trying to build something and you're building it out of wood

00:56:59.460 let's say because i built lots of things out of wood it either works or it doesn't

00:57:04.720 you know it's really the proof of the pudding so to speak is right there in front of you

00:57:09.840 and you can't delude yourself into thinking your table top is flat and straight when it's not it's

00:57:17.940 either flat and straight and the table is stable and looks half decent or it isn't

00:57:24.260 so true yeah yeah i even thought saw you know in my generation a lot of the young men tinkered with

00:57:32.260 cars because you could yeah right you could understand a car with a certain amount of work

00:57:37.200 and you could figure out how all the parts worked and you could even repair them they're like

00:57:41.380 yourself sometimes you had to buy a part but sometimes you could repair them and you had to

00:57:45.460 take them apart and put them back together and if you didn't put them back together correctly they

00:57:48.700 didn't work and now cars are so sophisticated that well they never get the hood open no well they

00:57:55.900 never break down virtually i mean they run well they run a long times but you certainly can't toy

00:58:04.080 with them like you once did they're they're not immediately at hand in the same way so i like

00:58:12.020 nakum you know i thought nakum was a fine town it was it was quite a nice town it had a lot of brick

00:58:17.800 buildings when i was a kid in the early 70s the downtown was still thriving there was a butcher store

00:58:25.520 that was thriving there was a movie theater um there was a dairy that sold milk and if i remember

00:58:31.560 correctly at that time there wasn't anybody who ran the dairy there was just a refrigerator

00:58:36.000 and if you wanted milk you just got the milk and you put your money in it in it basically what was

00:58:41.120 a tin can there were no locks on the door or anything like that that's just how people did it

00:58:46.100 and that would have served a community of probably 2 000 people something like that

00:58:50.860 not that well but surrounding nakum as well maybe you're right maybe you're right yeah

00:58:57.760 no then but by that time there was no dairy in nakum though that that milk came from melfort which

00:59:07.680 was 30 miles away right but that's still how it was sold oh that's that's exactly how it was sold

00:59:14.960 yeah the proprietor of the theater was ralph smith and he had a great trust in people i guess and he

00:59:24.920 said he lost very little money that he was aware of yeah well he'd know if he made a profit at least

00:59:33.300 and certainly he didn't cost him in staff so maybe and you never know maybe you know any it's conceivable

00:59:41.460 but probably not the case that the odd pilferer might have actually needed something to eat i

00:59:46.260 suspect no because that isn't necessarily what drives people to pilfering but yeah i thought nakum

00:59:52.580 was a real nice little town and so and it it was you know the streets were nice and straight and the

00:59:59.520 houses were well built it was it was quite a thriving little community it had a nice brick school

01:00:04.700 that's where you went to school so um so who everyone moved into nakum at the same time your

01:00:13.800 your grandfather no but no oh how okay how'd that work

01:00:17.900 well my grandfather and grandmother were the ones who moved into into fairview

01:00:26.120 and nakum or yeah nakum they moved into nakum and i'm not sure why i ended up there but it probably

01:00:42.080 had something to do with my grandfather and grandmother anyway i was in about grade three i think

01:00:49.340 when i joined them in in nakum and went to school there and mom and dad and the girls stayed on farm

01:01:01.740 and you know it it sounds like we were really separated but you know the distance was about

01:01:08.120 four and a half miles and it wasn't as though you didn't see them every day because most days you did see

01:01:16.700 them and was that was that an okay separation for you were you were you unhappy about moving from

01:01:24.920 the farm were you happy to be moving into nakum with your grandparents yeah i told you i got along

01:01:33.340 with my grandfather and my grandmother exceptionally well and what about you probably mom i got along quite

01:01:42.180 well with mom she was very kind too and what did she think about you moving into town away from her

01:01:52.060 i really don't know jordan uh

01:01:59.560 i don't know i know what she thought about well it was clear that she loved you beyond belief i mean i

01:02:09.520 remember one time we were playing cards up at the lake in saskatchewan and um grandma was up there

01:02:14.900 this isn't that many years ago maybe 15 years ago something like that and so you would have been 70

01:02:21.360 i guess 68 something like that and grandma would have been well in her late 80s and we were playing

01:02:27.460 cards and oh you were getting teased i think julian was teasing you and i think maybe i was teasing you

01:02:33.340 and grandma said don't you pick on my wally and she meant it and i thought oh this is so funny

01:02:39.960 she wouldn't have said wally she just said walter yes that's right that's what she said don't you pick

01:02:48.300 on my walter well really cracked this up you know because well you know you're 70 year old grandfather

01:02:53.780 by that point and she's in her nearly 90 and it was just like listening to a 20 year old woman

01:03:00.860 maybe talk about her four-year-old kid it's like don't pick on my wally mom mom definitely spoiled me 1.00

01:03:08.480 yeah well so she probably missed you when you left yeah she probably did but like i said

01:03:16.440 you know it wasn't as though we were gone for any length of time

01:03:22.640 at the very most it would have been a school week you know and probably well for a good part of the

01:03:33.260 year it probably wouldn't have been that because my grandfather always went to the farm every day

01:03:40.500 uh-huh uh-huh oh you know honest there was something extraordinary going on so do you did they

01:03:49.320 move into town because they finally had the financial resources to have two houses

01:03:53.640 well again jordan i honestly don't know i would suspect that that might have been the case

01:04:04.360 yeah well those are pretty cramped those are pretty cramped living quarters

01:04:10.060 did you get along with your did you get along with your sisters

01:04:13.280 well i can i could say yes and i could probably say no depends on the whole i think we got along

01:04:28.460 relatively well how much age difference was there well betty was two years younger than me 0.57

01:04:36.260 and judy was seven years younger than me yeah well seven years is a long gap

01:04:44.060 and she was very spoiled with betty or judy 0.71

01:04:52.280 judy was very spoiled because she was the youngest 1.00

01:04:58.000 you know betty was the in-between girl right 1.00

01:05:01.920 all right so when you were out in the farm did you have a lot of friends or was it mostly activity

01:05:10.520 that centered around the farm

01:05:11.940 oh had friends but you know they weren't they weren't right next door right you know they were

01:05:23.740 they were miles away but you had you know you had you had the occasional friend that would come over

01:05:31.380 and uh i had a i had a good school friend called helmer wunderboom and

01:05:41.980 helmer could really ride

01:05:46.960 and he used to ride over on his horse every once in a while and

01:05:52.560 we would go for a ride you know with with around with him

01:05:58.960 me on my me on the horse that i rode

01:06:03.240 not very well and helmer clinging to it like a comanche

01:06:08.040 so how was it that he got to be a better rider than you just more practice

01:06:15.240 more practice i guess yeah and so well helmer helmer was probably more of a cowboy than i was too

01:06:24.780 so what made you not a cowboy i mean you'd like to carry your 22 rifle downtown into nake and that

01:06:31.620 sounds like a pretty cowboy thing to do so what was the difference

01:06:34.640 difference in differences people

01:06:49.280 so you could read before you went to school

01:06:53.160 yep

01:06:54.440 did you like to read

01:06:56.040 obviously

01:06:58.700 why obviously stayed with it

01:07:01.620 what do you mean by that

01:07:03.580 well i don't think you do things that you don't like for very long do you

01:07:11.440 if you like it you do more of it

01:07:14.240 so i read

01:07:15.420 were you were you a reader in comparison to your friends

01:07:21.360 or was that a rather common pastime because my when i grew up

01:07:26.340 most of my friends didn't read

01:07:28.520 you know

01:07:29.700 not much

01:07:31.380 so i was very

01:07:32.840 different

01:07:34.200 well

01:07:34.660 yeah the difference though

01:07:37.420 was that

01:07:38.920 i didn't know what my friends were like at home very much you know

01:07:43.160 i even when i went to

01:07:47.360 to nakem to school

01:07:49.460 i can't say that

01:07:51.900 i really knew very much about

01:07:54.380 very many of my friends as far as their reading went

01:07:58.480 one maybe

01:08:01.120 anyway yes i could read before i went to school i can tell you one

01:08:09.100 thing that i can remember quite well i had learned how to

01:08:14.100 uh do cursive writing

01:08:17.260 and this was before i went to school too

01:08:20.640 my grandmother had a really lovely hand

01:08:23.980 and so did my grandfather

01:08:26.540 uh you could tell that they

01:08:28.980 were taught how to write

01:08:31.020 anyway

01:08:32.320 uh i was copying

01:08:34.800 a comic

01:08:35.940 and i was doing it from

01:08:39.460 from the print

01:08:42.020 to cursive writing

01:08:43.720 but what i didn't know was

01:08:47.020 that you stopped

01:08:49.140 between each word

01:08:50.800 that sounds pretty damn simple

01:08:54.480 but

01:08:54.820 i can remember that

01:08:56.400 asking my grandmother

01:08:57.820 uh

01:08:59.280 how does this work now

01:09:01.100 how do i

01:09:01.700 how do i

01:09:02.580 how do i do

01:09:04.720 when i come to the end of this word

01:09:06.520 and start the next one

01:09:07.700 just connect them

01:09:08.720 and keep going

01:09:09.600 anyway

01:09:10.540 just an aside

01:09:12.020 well it's simple when you learn it

01:09:13.960 but it's not necessarily obvious when you haven't learned it

01:09:16.940 that's right

01:09:18.260 did you like school

01:09:19.760 yep

01:09:21.200 did you like school all the way through school

01:09:25.000 oh no i'm sure there was

01:09:28.480 periods of time and

01:09:29.980 when i was a teenager that i would sooner have been out farming or

01:09:34.780 out helping on the farm

01:09:37.040 in fact i think i've got one report card that says something to the effect that if

01:09:42.860 if walter attended

01:09:44.740 more regularly he would do much better

01:09:48.100 ah

01:09:48.880 and that would have been junior high

01:09:50.540 yeah that was probably about grade nine

01:09:54.220 somewhere in there

01:09:55.860 so what did you do when you skipped school

01:09:58.300 that's

01:09:58.820 i never do that

01:09:59.640 you see i hardly ever skipped school

01:10:01.320 and every time i did 0.94

01:10:03.200 god damn it 0.96

01:10:03.920 you caught me 0.99

01:10:04.720 i did it like three times

01:10:07.360 one time i drove to heinz creek

01:10:09.500 oh three times

01:10:10.760 really it wasn't very

01:10:11.840 i tell you it wasn't very often

01:10:13.480 one time i drove to heinz creek to get away from you

01:10:16.160 i thought i'll drive to heinz creek

01:10:17.400 he's not gonna

01:10:17.980 find me there

01:10:18.960 and then on the way back from heinz creek

01:10:20.520 you drove by and waved at me

01:10:22.680 i said oh my god

01:10:23.760 he caught me again 0.96

01:10:24.680 so ridiculous 0.99

01:10:25.860 oh yeah 0.97

01:10:27.520 you weren't very

01:10:28.280 you weren't very in phantom

01:10:30.140 not not in that regard

01:10:32.060 that's for sure

01:10:32.900 no

01:10:33.760 no

01:10:34.460 so why did you stay with school

01:10:36.480 you graduated

01:10:38.200 was that combo

01:10:38.960 was that the standard routine

01:10:40.460 was what did most people graduate

01:10:42.160 or did most people drop out

01:10:43.540 grade nine or grade ten

01:10:44.620 i again i don't really know

01:10:51.400 i would think that the majority

01:10:54.500 of kids of my generation

01:10:57.480 probably finished school

01:11:00.940 by going by that i mean go went to grade 12

01:11:05.380 not all i mean i can remember several of my friends dropping out

01:11:10.860 prior to graduation you know in in the grades before

01:11:16.480 but a good many of them finished school

01:11:20.220 yeah almost all my friends from junior high

01:11:23.360 dropped out

01:11:24.800 you know while most of them went many of them went worked on oil rigs

01:11:28.020 and you can understand that to some degree

01:11:30.140 but

01:11:30.360 i had a completely different group

01:11:33.360 jobs

01:11:33.820 jobs

01:11:34.960 jobs probably weren't that plentiful

01:11:36.940 at

01:11:37.260 the time i got out of

01:11:39.660 uh

01:11:41.560 got out of school

01:11:42.640 or

01:11:43.280 was in school

01:11:44.900 anyway

01:11:47.180 great grandpa had a band

01:11:49.320 yeah

01:11:51.520 you know i wouldn't say he had a band

01:11:54.120 he was in a band

01:11:55.340 what was the band

01:11:56.940 do you remember the name of the band

01:11:58.220 no hell no i don't know that

01:12:00.980 that's way before my time

01:12:03.080 well they still played

01:12:05.240 i can remember seeing them play in the living room

01:12:07.980 once or twice

01:12:09.400 you can remember some of them playing

01:12:12.460 uh-huh

01:12:13.360 i think the majority of the ones that he played with in the band

01:12:17.540 were probably

01:12:18.540 long

01:12:20.180 gone

01:12:21.880 disappeared

01:12:22.960 was it

01:12:24.020 i don't know that

01:12:25.080 was it a big band

01:12:26.820 oh hell i have no idea

01:12:29.300 i don't even know if you'd

01:12:30.780 call it a band

01:12:31.920 i'd call it a bunch of guys

01:12:33.680 that got together to play for dances

01:12:35.760 yeah well

01:12:36.920 dad was a pretty good guitar player

01:12:39.340 and he could sing

01:12:41.260 yeah well i can remember grandpa singing

01:12:44.860 i mean we don't have

01:12:46.180 i don't think we have any recordings of him singing

01:12:48.880 which is too bad

01:12:49.880 but i can remember him singing

01:12:52.360 yeah he had a pretty plaintive country voice

01:12:55.140 and he was a pretty good guitar player

01:12:56.800 you made me a guitar grandpa

01:12:59.340 yeah

01:13:01.720 i've still got it

01:13:03.380 it's downstairs here

01:13:04.660 i know it's in two pieces

01:13:06.600 what happened was that

01:13:08.120 in the closet

01:13:08.940 um

01:13:10.440 it was strung too tight

01:13:12.040 and the neck

01:13:13.880 eventually worked loose from the body

01:13:16.800 oh

01:13:19.880 i don't think i knew that

01:13:22.280 yeah that's what happened to it

01:13:24.300 and i guess you're not supposed to leave a tightly strung guitar

01:13:27.200 like that for too long

01:13:28.620 or perhaps i'd strung it too tightly

01:13:30.340 knowing very little about

01:13:31.880 very little about guitars

01:13:33.440 yeah

01:13:35.220 so anyway it's sitting behind the chair down in the basement

01:13:38.780 when did you meet mom

01:13:42.460 i would imagine that i probably met her when i went to

01:13:54.820 into grade three in natham

01:13:57.620 what do you think of her

01:13:59.620 i think

01:14:02.700 that i thought she was wonderful right off the bat

01:14:06.580 you think that

01:14:08.000 well yeah i kind of do

01:14:11.360 i thought that about tammy

01:14:13.780 yeah well

01:14:15.820 yeah

01:14:16.180 i was right too

01:14:18.540 haha

01:14:18.960 yeah

01:14:19.740 so was i

01:14:20.900 well good

01:14:21.920 good for us

01:14:23.060 yeah

01:14:24.140 what the hell do you think accounts for that

01:14:27.100 good luck

01:14:32.300 yeah

01:14:36.040 she told me she kind of knew too

01:14:40.540 well i don't know

01:14:44.960 i don't know that beverly knew

01:14:47.840 i mean we weren't

01:14:50.640 we weren't always

01:14:51.740 uh

01:14:53.520 good friends even

01:14:56.620 but

01:14:59.520 were you in the same grade

01:15:01.920 or was she one grade lower than you

01:15:03.640 she was one grade lower than me

01:15:05.960 right

01:15:06.840 tam and i were in the same grade

01:15:09.280 so

01:15:09.580 she was a year older than me

01:15:11.260 because i was younger for the grade

01:15:12.880 but

01:15:13.100 so we were

01:15:14.060 that facilitates a friendship

01:15:16.120 being in the

01:15:16.800 same grade

01:15:17.900 oh yeah

01:15:19.080 yeah definitely

01:15:20.000 but

01:15:20.500 but don't forget

01:15:21.920 we were in

01:15:23.360 the same room

01:15:25.480 oh right

01:15:26.160 as the other grade

01:15:27.340 because

01:15:27.740 there were

01:15:28.200 at least three grades in a room

01:15:31.440 so

01:15:32.340 uh

01:15:33.460 we were probably

01:15:34.460 in the same room

01:15:35.660 much of the time

01:15:36.980 when did you start going out

01:15:42.140 well

01:15:46.040 i think the first time we went out

01:15:49.040 we had been to a birthday party

01:15:51.200 across the road

01:15:52.580 from

01:15:53.420 where we lived in

01:15:55.020 in nakum

01:15:55.760 and

01:15:56.860 some kind of a game

01:15:59.780 she had to walk me home 0.66

01:16:02.400 which really entailed

01:16:04.000 walking across the road

01:16:05.600 and a little bit farther

01:16:06.740 hmm

01:16:07.680 so if you count that one

01:16:09.400 we were probably

01:16:11.000 10

01:16:14.820 11

01:16:15.520 maybe

01:16:16.000 hmm

01:16:17.600 and obviously you count

01:16:20.500 obviously you count that one

01:16:22.660 yeah

01:16:25.640 when was the first time

01:16:27.500 we went out

01:16:28.340 i think

01:16:34.180 probably

01:16:35.180 it was

01:16:38.180 i think i must have been

01:16:41.320 through school

01:16:42.520 grade 12

01:16:43.840 or

01:16:45.340 past grade 12

01:16:46.680 and

01:16:48.320 for some reason

01:16:49.560 i knew that

01:16:50.520 beverly was

01:16:51.340 babysitting

01:16:52.600 at her

01:16:54.860 brother's place

01:16:56.140 that evening

01:16:58.880 and

01:17:00.860 so i went

01:17:03.440 and knocked

01:17:04.540 on the door

01:17:05.440 and

01:17:05.960 uh

01:17:07.580 said something

01:17:09.180 witty

01:17:09.580 like 0.99

01:17:09.980 to dumb 0.97

01:17:10.460 i'm here 0.99

01:17:11.100 or

01:17:11.460 i don't know what

01:17:12.400 anyway

01:17:13.400 i think

01:17:13.940 that's the first time

01:17:15.020 i

01:17:15.180 that

01:17:16.460 we were together

01:17:17.580 that way

01:17:18.420 and

01:17:22.820 then

01:17:23.220 i think

01:17:25.300 we were together

01:17:26.120 most of the time

01:17:27.660 after that

01:17:28.600 what drew you together

01:17:31.420 do you think

01:17:32.020 why was she attracted

01:17:33.960 to you

01:17:34.480 do you know

01:17:35.720 oh god only

01:17:36.820 knows that

01:17:37.720 well you were

01:17:39.360 you were pretty good looking

01:17:40.700 oh yeah

01:17:42.580 i was

01:17:43.140 really handsome

01:17:45.200 that

01:17:45.600 yeah

01:17:47.820 no i don't

01:17:49.100 i don't

01:17:49.580 well maybe

01:17:50.260 that was it

01:17:51.060 no i don't know

01:17:52.120 she probably 0.99

01:17:53.800 made a big mistake

01:17:55.220 but anyway

01:17:56.680 well you

01:17:57.660 you have your good

01:17:58.540 qualities

01:17:59.020 yeah

01:17:59.880 fair enough

01:18:01.080 what drew you to her

01:18:02.300 yeah

01:18:03.680 hey

01:18:05.360 what drew you to her

01:18:06.620 what

01:18:08.140 what drew you to her

01:18:10.900 what drew me to her

01:18:14.280 well i told you

01:18:16.100 i i

01:18:17.780 always thought she was something

01:18:19.840 special

01:18:21.280 and

01:18:22.900 uh

01:18:23.540 i probably

01:18:27.420 followed her

01:18:28.620 into saskatoon

01:18:29.820 when she

01:18:30.780 when she went

01:18:32.860 to take nursing

01:18:34.520 that was probably

01:18:36.940 my main

01:18:37.660 motivation

01:18:38.420 so

01:18:39.380 you said

01:18:40.260 that you

01:18:40.860 graduated high school

01:18:42.360 and then you basically

01:18:43.380 followed mum

01:18:44.420 to saskatoon

01:18:45.460 were you planning

01:18:46.220 to go

01:18:46.760 on to further

01:18:47.840 education

01:18:48.420 yeah i think

01:18:52.880 i was

01:18:53.580 when did you

01:18:56.360 decide you wanted

01:18:57.020 to be a teacher

01:18:57.740 oh

01:19:00.520 i don't know

01:19:05.760 i had a

01:19:09.920 you know

01:19:10.380 i had a couple

01:19:11.080 of really good

01:19:11.940 teachers

01:19:12.420 in high school

01:19:13.520 and maybe

01:19:16.220 that was part

01:19:17.060 of it

01:19:17.320 i don't know

01:19:18.020 joe

01:19:20.540 fafanoff

01:19:21.380 and

01:19:21.960 and

01:19:23.800 uh

01:19:24.380 frank

01:19:25.500 dupland

01:19:26.180 what made

01:19:27.520 them good

01:19:27.980 well

01:19:29.440 they were just

01:19:30.140 they were just

01:19:31.020 they knew their

01:19:33.020 subjects well

01:19:34.120 they taught

01:19:34.820 well

01:19:35.260 and they

01:19:36.780 were good

01:19:39.320 people

01:19:39.760 you know

01:19:40.620 they were easy

01:19:41.340 to get along

01:19:42.060 with

01:19:42.400 and

01:19:42.780 yeah

01:19:43.720 did you

01:19:44.620 i did a lot

01:19:45.300 of i

01:19:45.740 i did a lot

01:19:46.640 of marking

01:19:47.280 for

01:19:48.080 frank

01:19:49.200 um

01:19:52.480 on the

01:19:54.580 weekends

01:19:55.060 and that kind

01:19:55.720 of thing

01:19:56.080 maybe that

01:19:56.740 was part

01:19:57.240 of it

01:19:57.460 i don't

01:19:57.760 know

01:19:58.000 these were

01:19:59.020 men you

01:19:59.380 respected

01:19:59.900 yep

01:20:01.320 yep

01:20:02.320 still do

01:20:03.480 what made

01:20:04.880 them good

01:20:05.200 teachers

01:20:05.680 well i told

01:20:08.060 you

01:20:08.240 oh yes

01:20:08.660 they

01:20:09.200 they really

01:20:10.220 knew their

01:20:10.760 subject matter

01:20:11.720 they were

01:20:12.820 interesting to

01:20:13.780 listen to

01:20:14.480 and

01:20:15.460 they were

01:20:16.800 just good

01:20:17.360 people

01:20:17.860 and so

01:20:21.060 you moved

01:20:21.500 to the

01:20:21.800 city

01:20:22.060 how often

01:20:23.480 had you

01:20:23.780 been to

01:20:24.160 saskatoon

01:20:24.560 before

01:20:25.080 i mean

01:20:25.560 that was

01:20:25.860 that's

01:20:26.160 a pretty

01:20:26.360 big city

01:20:26.860 by

01:20:27.200 nakum 0.87

01:20:27.560 standards

01:20:28.160 how many

01:20:30.560 times

01:20:30.980 had i

01:20:31.340 been

01:20:31.640 there

01:20:31.960 before

01:20:32.540 oh

01:20:34.620 i would

01:20:35.200 guess

01:20:35.660 you could

01:20:36.420 probably

01:20:36.820 count it

01:20:37.420 on one

01:20:37.940 hand

01:20:38.500 so what

01:20:39.900 do you

01:20:40.020 think of

01:20:40.300 saskatoon

01:20:40.840 it was

01:20:44.820 fine

01:20:45.220 were you

01:20:46.780 excited to

01:20:47.280 be in

01:20:47.520 the city

01:20:47.820 or were

01:20:48.180 you would

01:20:48.640 you prefer

01:20:49.180 what have

01:20:49.640 you preferred

01:20:50.100 the small

01:20:50.560 town and

01:20:50.960 the farm

01:20:51.380 oh at

01:20:54.620 that time

01:20:55.120 i think

01:20:55.580 i preferred

01:20:56.220 the city

01:20:56.860 i mean

01:20:59.160 there was

01:20:59.520 lots of

01:21:00.000 you know

01:21:00.440 there was

01:21:00.800 lots going

01:21:01.500 on and

01:21:02.040 that kind

01:21:02.600 of thing

01:21:03.080 did you

01:21:05.180 have a

01:21:05.380 good time

01:21:05.760 in university

01:21:06.340 did i have

01:21:10.580 a good

01:21:10.860 time

01:21:11.240 yeah i

01:21:11.740 think so

01:21:12.340 i had a

01:21:17.140 car that

01:21:17.600 wouldn't

01:21:17.920 start when

01:21:18.720 it was

01:21:19.120 cloudy but

01:21:19.920 yeah most

01:21:20.960 of the time

01:21:21.440 it was

01:21:21.780 good

01:21:22.120 why wouldn't

01:21:24.120 it start

01:21:24.480 when it

01:21:24.720 was cloudy

01:21:25.360 don't ask

01:21:28.780 me it

01:21:30.400 was the

01:21:30.760 most perverse

01:21:31.640 beast i

01:21:32.380 ever had

01:21:33.060 so how

01:21:36.700 old were

01:21:37.120 you when

01:21:37.900 you asked

01:21:38.240 mom to

01:21:38.580 marry you

01:21:39.160 you mean

01:21:41.540 the first

01:21:42.020 time how

01:21:43.220 many times

01:21:43.660 did you

01:21:43.920 have to

01:21:44.220 ask oh

01:21:45.720 hell i

01:21:46.180 must have

01:21:46.660 asked her

01:21:47.380 i have no

01:21:49.680 idea how

01:21:50.440 many oh

01:21:51.180 yes i bet

01:21:51.780 you know

01:21:52.080 exactly how

01:21:52.780 many how

01:21:53.400 many no i

01:21:54.320 don't i

01:21:54.880 don't know

01:21:55.540 i i tried

01:21:57.560 to talk her

01:21:58.400 into marrying

01:22:00.540 me

01:22:01.400 a number

01:22:05.240 of times

01:22:06.120 and she

01:22:09.780 wanted to

01:22:10.380 be a nurse

01:22:11.140 and that

01:22:12.140 was

01:22:12.480 that was

01:22:15.040 the first

01:22:15.600 thing to

01:22:16.180 get done

01:22:16.840 and but

01:22:18.800 yeah no i

01:22:20.000 asked her i

01:22:20.940 asked her more

01:22:21.660 than once i'm

01:22:22.580 sure i think i

01:22:23.940 asked tammy five

01:22:24.920 times

01:22:25.480 well i i don't

01:22:28.720 think you have

01:22:29.840 the record but

01:22:30.900 i'm not sure

01:22:31.840 she asked me

01:22:32.800 once too so

01:22:33.840 that worked out

01:22:34.800 okay the final

01:22:35.800 analysis

01:22:36.260 oh well i

01:22:39.440 don't

01:22:39.760 she actually

01:22:40.600 she actually

01:22:41.940 well she had

01:22:42.840 come to montreal

01:22:43.460 to live with

01:22:44.040 me and we

01:22:44.940 had discussed

01:22:45.500 getting married

01:22:46.060 but she felt

01:22:47.620 it was time

01:22:48.060 and she

01:22:48.320 actually asked

01:22:49.120 me on

01:22:49.920 isn't it

01:22:51.220 sadie hawkins

01:22:51.900 day isn't

01:22:52.480 that yeah

01:22:54.000 yeah that we

01:22:55.120 didn't even know

01:22:55.720 it we didn't

01:22:56.620 even know it

01:22:57.280 it just happened

01:22:58.360 that way

01:22:58.800 no it

01:22:59.340 no yeah

01:23:00.200 that was pretty

01:23:00.780 funny little

01:23:01.560 little abner

01:23:02.580 little abner was

01:23:04.100 just as real as

01:23:05.120 santa claus you

01:23:05.960 know

01:23:06.180 yeah

01:23:06.600 yeah so

01:23:09.520 and i said yes

01:23:11.080 good deal

01:23:11.580 it was it was a

01:23:12.580 good deal

01:23:13.000 yeah

01:23:13.420 yeah it's a

01:23:14.620 good would you

01:23:15.120 would you say

01:23:15.840 that you've had a

01:23:16.540 happy marriage

01:23:17.180 yep i would say

01:23:20.880 i have had a

01:23:21.620 happy marriage

01:23:22.600 what was more

01:23:24.000 important to you

01:23:24.660 your family or

01:23:25.460 your career

01:23:26.060 no doubt

01:23:30.760 at all

01:23:31.960 family

01:23:32.920 what was the

01:23:35.180 best part of

01:23:35.880 what was the

01:23:36.520 best years you

01:23:37.300 spent with your

01:23:38.040 family

01:23:38.440 well i i think

01:23:44.160 the best years

01:23:45.240 were the years

01:23:46.860 that you guys

01:23:47.620 were home and

01:23:48.440 growing up

01:23:49.340 they were great

01:23:51.400 years

01:23:51.960 and of those

01:23:52.800 years

01:23:53.280 younger kids

01:23:55.780 older kids

01:23:56.500 what was better

01:23:57.680 for you

01:23:58.060 oh

01:23:58.500 i i can't say

01:24:01.400 that because it

01:24:02.580 was all good

01:24:03.740 uh

01:24:08.560 no

01:24:09.900 there's no doubt

01:24:12.060 that was the

01:24:13.300 best time of my

01:24:14.320 life

01:24:14.820 why

01:24:15.960 oh

01:24:18.400 who knows

01:24:19.980 why

01:24:20.540 come on

01:24:21.240 i think it's

01:24:21.960 it's instinctive

01:24:23.740 for some

01:24:25.820 people

01:24:26.300 yeah well you're

01:24:27.940 really good with

01:24:28.460 little kids

01:24:29.080 well i was

01:24:31.640 no doubt

01:24:32.700 you seem to

01:24:34.980 trust them

01:24:35.620 well i seem to

01:24:39.380 be relatively

01:24:40.280 good at that

01:24:41.400 yeah

01:24:41.720 and most

01:24:43.900 little kids

01:24:44.600 trusted me

01:24:45.760 yeah

01:24:47.640 not not

01:24:48.940 very many

01:24:49.580 that i

01:24:50.120 had shy

01:24:51.500 away from

01:24:52.300 me

01:24:52.580 so you

01:24:53.180 spent a lot

01:24:53.780 of time

01:24:54.120 with me

01:24:54.460 when i was

01:24:54.860 little kid

01:24:55.300 yeah

01:24:57.440 what do you

01:24:58.660 what do you

01:24:59.320 remember about

01:24:59.960 that particularly

01:25:00.740 well

01:25:04.800 what can i

01:25:06.320 say

01:25:06.700 what do i

01:25:09.060 remember

01:25:09.600 about

01:25:10.160 i don't

01:25:16.160 know

01:25:16.420 i remember

01:25:18.240 quite a few

01:25:19.760 things but i

01:25:20.600 don't know

01:25:21.160 if any of

01:25:22.080 them are

01:25:22.480 god-awful

01:25:23.220 important

01:25:23.840 you know

01:25:24.420 well pick

01:25:24.960 one

01:25:25.240 there

01:25:25.560 well

01:25:27.240 i remember

01:25:28.480 the time

01:25:29.160 that we

01:25:29.660 hatched

01:25:30.560 those chicks 1.00

01:25:31.560 in the

01:25:33.020 porch

01:25:33.520 in nip

01:25:34.320 one

01:25:34.580 in nip

01:25:36.020 one

01:25:36.320 yeah that

01:25:36.700 was cool

01:25:37.120 that was

01:25:38.340 that was

01:25:38.760 interesting

01:25:39.180 pretty good

01:25:39.760 yeah

01:25:40.460 uh

01:25:42.820 i remember

01:25:46.360 driving home

01:25:47.980 with you

01:25:48.700 to nakem

01:25:49.660 a number

01:25:50.900 of times

01:25:51.620 and talking

01:25:52.980 the whole

01:25:53.560 time because

01:25:54.700 you'd never

01:25:55.240 stop asking

01:25:56.220 questions

01:25:56.980 yeah well

01:25:58.120 hasn't changed

01:26:00.120 much

01:26:00.560 much

01:26:00.580 no i

01:26:02.060 know

01:26:02.360 you kind

01:26:04.100 of are

01:26:04.360 who you

01:26:04.720 are

01:26:05.080 yep

01:26:06.360 that's

01:26:07.040 right

01:26:07.380 no there

01:26:09.160 were lots

01:26:09.840 of good

01:26:10.160 times jordan

01:26:11.000 all good

01:26:12.240 times

01:26:12.980 i think

01:26:15.620 i remember

01:26:16.200 mostly

01:26:16.740 when i was

01:26:18.020 little kid

01:26:18.580 reading with

01:26:19.800 you

01:26:20.100 oh yeah

01:26:21.780 yeah

01:26:22.600 well that

01:26:23.380 was great

01:26:24.040 that was

01:26:24.920 so much

01:26:25.380 fun

01:26:25.800 i thought

01:26:27.280 so

01:26:27.660 because what

01:26:28.860 i remember

01:26:29.380 i was pretty

01:26:29.920 little but

01:26:30.460 what i

01:26:30.900 remember is

01:26:31.560 that well

01:26:32.540 first of all

01:26:33.040 we had a

01:26:33.420 dr seuss book

01:26:34.320 come

01:26:34.700 every week

01:26:36.400 or something

01:26:36.840 like that

01:26:37.280 because we

01:26:37.600 were in a

01:26:38.180 book club

01:26:38.620 and used

01:26:41.120 to come

01:26:41.360 home every

01:26:42.000 every night

01:26:43.560 and after

01:26:45.320 dinner we

01:26:46.100 would sit

01:26:47.120 lay on

01:26:48.080 the rug

01:26:48.540 we had a

01:26:49.120 hooked one

01:26:49.700 of those

01:26:49.900 hooked rugs

01:26:50.520 and we'd lay

01:26:52.060 on the rug

01:26:52.460 and you'd put

01:26:52.880 your arm

01:26:53.180 around me

01:26:53.660 and way

01:26:55.260 we go

01:26:55.740 through one

01:26:56.280 or two

01:26:56.540 books

01:26:56.920 and you

01:26:58.100 taught me

01:26:58.400 to read

01:26:58.840 no and

01:27:00.360 i remember

01:27:01.020 that going

01:27:02.060 on for quite

01:27:02.580 a long

01:27:02.880 time

01:27:03.300 and it

01:27:04.720 was wonderful

01:27:05.800 to have

01:27:06.620 the attention

01:27:07.340 and uh

01:27:09.420 well and

01:27:10.140 to be given

01:27:10.620 that gift

01:27:11.320 of literacy

01:27:11.960 as well

01:27:12.540 and have

01:27:13.640 it instilled

01:27:14.180 in me

01:27:14.520 at such

01:27:15.100 a young

01:27:15.440 age

01:27:15.860 you know

01:27:17.140 i mean

01:27:17.360 i loved

01:27:17.740 reading

01:27:18.180 it's really

01:27:19.860 shaped my

01:27:20.500 life in

01:27:20.940 every possible

01:27:21.580 way

01:27:21.960 so you

01:27:24.100 know and

01:27:24.340 i remember

01:27:24.900 you know

01:27:26.280 one of the

01:27:27.280 things that

01:27:27.600 was different

01:27:28.040 about you

01:27:28.560 we had our

01:27:29.200 differences

01:27:29.560 when i was

01:27:30.040 a teenager

01:27:30.520 sounds kind

01:27:31.680 of like the

01:27:32.040 ones you had

01:27:32.520 with your

01:27:32.820 dad you

01:27:33.280 know both

01:27:34.140 stubborn

01:27:34.600 and i you

01:27:35.680 know i had

01:27:36.180 hanging around

01:27:37.020 with rough

01:27:37.480 kids

01:27:37.920 and we

01:27:40.060 misbehaved a

01:27:40.780 lot a lot

01:27:42.040 of drinking

01:27:42.560 and that sort

01:27:43.120 of thing

01:27:43.420 you know and

01:27:44.080 i you you

01:27:45.380 put up with

01:27:45.920 them that's

01:27:46.900 about all you

01:27:47.340 should have

01:27:47.620 done really

01:27:48.120 i suppose

01:27:49.000 but most

01:27:51.840 of my friends

01:27:52.320 you know they

01:27:52.660 didn't have a

01:27:53.060 good relationship

01:27:53.660 with their

01:27:54.060 fathers they

01:27:55.160 had no

01:27:55.500 respect for

01:27:56.160 them

01:27:56.400 that was

01:27:57.500 i know

01:27:57.900 yeah yeah

01:27:59.500 it was really

01:27:59.980 rough on them

01:28:00.560 those those

01:28:01.400 my friends those

01:28:02.360 are my teenage

01:28:02.880 friends or you

01:28:03.600 know the ones

01:28:03.960 in junior high

01:28:04.560 yeah

01:28:05.340 i know

01:28:06.440 and uh

01:28:07.480 you know when

01:28:08.800 when we were

01:28:09.520 alone with my

01:28:11.240 friends they'd

01:28:12.980 have a bad

01:28:13.440 interaction with

01:28:14.060 their dad or

01:28:14.520 something and

01:28:14.920 they'd be pretty

01:28:15.980 hard on them

01:28:16.580 bad mouth them

01:28:17.440 and i could tell

01:28:18.240 they were mad

01:28:19.200 bitter resentful

01:28:20.420 angry about it

01:28:21.460 and they had

01:28:22.240 their reasons

01:28:22.760 or hurt by it

01:28:24.180 or a combination

01:28:24.840 of all those

01:28:25.480 things disappointed

01:28:26.320 but i never felt

01:28:27.760 that way i mean

01:28:28.500 even when we

01:28:29.000 had altercations

01:28:30.120 yeah i knew

01:28:39.200 that fundamentally

01:28:40.000 despite whatever

01:28:41.880 altercations we

01:28:42.740 might have that

01:28:44.660 you were on the

01:28:46.600 side of my

01:28:47.140 better angels

01:28:47.960 let's say

01:28:49.500 well

01:28:52.500 yeah well that's

01:28:53.480 a tricky thing

01:28:54.020 to manage you

01:28:54.720 know

01:28:54.920 yeah but it's

01:28:56.340 a tricky thing

01:28:56.780 to manage because

01:28:57.600 when you have

01:28:58.380 kids you kind

01:28:59.000 of on the one

01:29:00.060 hand you want

01:29:00.500 to like the

01:29:00.960 kid you know

01:29:01.800 but on the

01:29:03.180 other hand you

01:29:03.680 want to like the

01:29:04.300 kid that they

01:29:05.040 could be even

01:29:05.660 better

01:29:06.000 so you have to

01:29:07.520 kind of balance

01:29:08.120 that acceptance

01:29:09.140 for and

01:29:10.220 appreciation for

01:29:11.000 who they are

01:29:11.500 right now with

01:29:12.360 a desire to

01:29:13.260 foster further

01:29:15.060 development

01:29:15.620 and i think

01:29:17.500 mothers sort of 0.91

01:29:18.400 specialize in the

01:29:19.200 former and dads

01:29:20.060 to some degree

01:29:20.700 specialize in the

01:29:21.560 latter it's not

01:29:22.900 that cut and

01:29:23.420 dried obviously

01:29:24.220 but the fact

01:29:26.380 that you had

01:29:27.080 belief

01:29:27.620 in my potential

01:29:32.420 was has always

01:29:35.960 been of

01:29:37.320 inestimable value

01:29:39.580 and one of the

01:29:41.200 things that really

01:29:41.800 hurt me when i

01:29:42.540 went on tour

01:29:43.680 and talked to

01:29:44.460 so many people

01:29:45.200 was that

01:29:46.340 that was so

01:29:47.940 lacking for so

01:29:48.840 many people

01:29:49.440 you know they

01:29:50.520 didn't have

01:29:50.900 someone who

01:29:51.520 really had their

01:29:52.640 back like really

01:29:53.700 when the chips

01:29:54.620 were down both

01:29:55.400 you and mom i

01:29:56.140 knew of that

01:29:56.620 i knew that that

01:29:59.460 was true and

01:30:00.400 that gives you

01:30:00.820 kind of a

01:30:01.380 foundation underneath

01:30:02.420 you you know

01:30:03.080 well you obviously

01:30:03.820 had it with your

01:30:04.600 with your

01:30:05.500 grandparents and

01:30:06.680 your mother

01:30:07.060 yep i don't

01:30:09.780 know what it

01:30:10.120 would be like to

01:30:10.640 grow up without

01:30:11.120 that you know

01:30:12.640 you'd be pretty

01:30:13.760 lost pretty

01:30:14.760 alone yeah

01:30:16.140 well it's

01:30:17.500 there's no

01:30:18.300 doubt it

01:30:18.840 would be

01:30:19.300 tough

01:30:19.840 anyhow we

01:30:22.760 always mom

01:30:25.300 and i always

01:30:26.120 said we were

01:30:26.940 young and 0.99

01:30:27.600 dumb so 1.00

01:30:28.620 everything goes 1.00

01:30:31.800 well

01:30:32.440 yeah well

01:30:33.920 what's been the

01:30:35.040 most challenging

01:30:35.680 part of your

01:30:36.380 marriage dad

01:30:37.180 what's been the

01:30:40.520 most challenging

01:30:41.020 part of being

01:30:41.640 married

01:30:42.020 because you've

01:30:43.060 been married how

01:30:43.560 long now

01:30:44.140 i don't know

01:30:47.600 60 i don't

01:30:50.640 know 64 years

01:30:52.220 something like

01:30:53.080 that yeah well

01:30:53.920 that's a long

01:30:54.460 time we got

01:30:55.620 married in 60

01:30:56.820 what does that

01:30:57.560 make it

01:30:58.240 61 61

01:31:02.100 yeah it just

01:31:02.840 feels like 64

01:31:04.000 yeah it just

01:31:05.560 feels like 64

01:31:06.780 yeah yeah

01:31:08.100 uh most

01:31:10.380 challenging

01:31:11.060 thing

01:31:11.760 jesus

01:31:14.000 i don't

01:31:20.380 know

01:31:20.740 i guess maybe

01:31:23.400 the most

01:31:23.960 challenging

01:31:24.580 thing is

01:31:25.480 trying to be

01:31:27.440 a decent

01:31:27.980 person because

01:31:29.180 i have a lot

01:31:30.040 of trouble

01:31:30.540 with that

01:31:32.860 what do you

01:31:34.120 mean

01:31:34.400 well

01:31:36.080 just

01:31:37.160 that

01:31:38.540 what do

01:31:40.500 you have to

01:31:40.880 control

01:31:41.320 well

01:31:44.140 i

01:31:44.920 i'm very

01:31:50.580 stubborn

01:31:51.260 i guess

01:31:55.860 probably

01:31:56.600 quite

01:31:57.140 opinionated

01:31:58.080 and very

01:32:02.440 vocal

01:32:03.080 all those

01:32:07.220 things

01:32:07.640 can cause

01:32:10.940 problems

01:32:11.780 and i

01:32:12.360 know

01:32:12.780 that they've

01:32:15.400 caused

01:32:15.760 problems

01:32:16.400 for your

01:32:16.960 mom

01:32:17.220 yeah well

01:32:19.540 mom's kind

01:32:20.220 of gentle

01:32:20.700 person although

01:32:21.540 she's got

01:32:22.160 a spine

01:32:22.800 yep

01:32:25.300 she's a

01:32:26.100 good person

01:32:26.720 yeah she

01:32:27.300 is a good

01:32:27.700 person

01:32:28.060 she's easy

01:32:28.700 to get along

01:32:29.180 with she

01:32:29.580 laughs a lot

01:32:30.360 friendly

01:32:31.300 outgoing

01:32:31.840 yeah i

01:32:32.940 can't i

01:32:33.340 can't ever

01:32:33.720 remember really

01:32:34.540 having a fight

01:32:35.400 with mom

01:32:36.000 you know

01:32:36.500 and when the

01:32:38.660 kids when we

01:32:39.220 were kids and

01:32:39.760 we used to

01:32:40.140 make her upset

01:32:40.900 you know

01:32:41.280 because we

01:32:41.580 were rambunctioning

01:32:42.320 around too

01:32:42.800 much

01:32:43.100 um

01:32:44.540 and we made

01:32:45.940 her upset

01:32:46.280 that always

01:32:46.660 made us feel

01:32:47.180 guilty because

01:32:47.980 you know

01:32:48.560 mom didn't

01:32:49.840 get upset

01:32:50.340 if you

01:32:51.420 if you

01:32:51.720 made mom

01:32:52.100 upset you

01:32:52.580 were probably

01:32:53.000 being bad

01:32:53.720 so we

01:32:55.620 just feel

01:32:56.000 guilty about

01:32:56.560 it so

01:32:57.940 yeah well

01:32:59.640 you know

01:33:00.060 being stubborn

01:33:02.380 and opinionated

01:33:03.260 and assertive

01:33:04.460 has its

01:33:04.920 virtues too

01:33:05.740 well

01:33:09.020 they have

01:33:11.660 its virtues

01:33:12.400 but they

01:33:13.340 are making

01:33:14.000 it very

01:33:14.520 difficult

01:33:14.960 for us

01:33:15.900 yeah

01:33:20.400 yeah well

01:33:20.660 it's not

01:33:21.200 easy to

01:33:21.640 negotiate

01:33:22.040 continually

01:33:22.640 with someone

01:33:23.240 under the

01:33:24.180 same house

01:33:24.660 and you

01:33:25.260 and mom

01:33:25.540 are quite

01:33:25.920 different

01:33:26.280 in many

01:33:26.680 ways too

01:33:27.260 so you

01:33:28.920 have those

01:33:29.320 temperamental

01:33:29.940 divides to

01:33:30.620 get to

01:33:31.560 to cross

01:33:32.700 I mean

01:33:33.100 she's more

01:33:33.960 extroverted

01:33:34.520 and social 0.91

01:33:35.040 than you

01:33:35.500 are

01:33:35.940 yeah I

01:33:38.000 wouldn't say

01:33:38.500 I was

01:33:38.940 extroverted

01:33:39.700 and social

01:33:40.740 no well

01:33:41.900 you took

01:33:42.400 my personality

01:33:43.120 test right

01:33:43.900 and I

01:33:44.500 mean you

01:33:45.140 were

01:33:45.420 assertive

01:33:46.500 on the

01:33:47.040 extroverted

01:33:47.580 scale but

01:33:48.440 low in

01:33:49.580 enthusiasm

01:33:50.300 whereas mom 0.84

01:33:51.640 is high in

01:33:52.240 enthusiasm

01:33:52.740 and not as

01:33:54.340 assertive

01:33:55.500 you remember

01:33:57.940 things

01:33:58.500 too long

01:33:59.600 yeah well

01:34:00.500 I was

01:34:00.760 curious

01:34:01.100 you know

01:34:02.580 yeah

01:34:04.840 well

01:34:05.660 it's probably

01:34:06.660 true

01:34:07.200 yeah well

01:34:10.820 I didn't

01:34:11.560 you know

01:34:11.900 I gotta say

01:34:12.600 when I

01:34:13.100 when I grew

01:34:13.960 up I never

01:34:14.360 saw you

01:34:14.740 really back

01:34:15.240 down

01:34:15.680 so that

01:34:18.220 was something

01:34:18.620 no

01:34:19.080 you

01:34:20.880 I don't

01:34:24.420 back down

01:34:24.980 very often

01:34:25.820 and I'll 0.98

01:34:33.080 be damned

01:34:33.620 if I'm 0.98

01:34:34.120 going to

01:34:34.560 back down

01:34:35.360 to this

01:34:35.860 government

01:34:36.360 or whatever

01:34:39.120 in the

01:34:39.440 hell we've

01:34:40.060 got

01:34:40.440 so when

01:34:45.020 are we

01:34:45.220 going to

01:34:45.460 see each

01:34:45.820 other again

01:34:46.340 do you

01:34:46.580 think

01:34:46.840 well

01:34:49.620 I guess

01:34:51.760 when you

01:34:52.200 come to

01:34:52.700 see me

01:34:53.500 because I

01:34:54.600 can't go

01:34:55.280 anywhere

01:34:55.740 and I

01:34:59.840 can't see

01:35:00.600 I can't

01:35:02.300 see it

01:35:02.680 changing

01:35:03.280 yeah I'm

01:35:04.820 not very

01:35:05.160 happy about

01:35:05.680 that

01:35:06.120 no I'm

01:35:08.320 not neither

01:35:08.960 but I

01:35:12.000 gotta live

01:35:12.440 with me

01:35:12.980 too

01:35:13.420 yeah I

01:35:14.480 know

01:35:14.700 I'll

01:35:17.660 come up

01:35:18.080 I got

01:35:20.160 my tour

01:35:20.560 routing

01:35:20.860 pretty soon

01:35:21.540 yep

01:35:23.000 I'll figure

01:35:23.880 out how to

01:35:24.220 come up

01:35:24.660 good

01:35:26.500 got anything

01:35:30.080 else you want

01:35:30.580 to say

01:35:30.960 what

01:35:32.640 what

01:35:33.180 what's

01:35:34.320 the best

01:35:34.660 relationships

01:35:35.280 you've ever

01:35:35.760 had in your

01:35:36.160 life

01:35:36.520 the best

01:35:40.160 relationship

01:35:41.040 yeah

01:35:42.100 oh

01:35:45.060 I guess

01:35:47.160 for me

01:35:47.820 your mother

01:35:48.480 you

01:35:50.820 bond

01:35:54.320 joel

01:35:56.980 yeah well

01:35:59.620 you know

01:35:59.940 in our

01:36:00.680 culture

01:36:01.040 kids

01:36:02.660 they get

01:36:03.860 a bad

01:36:04.200 rap

01:36:04.660 you know

01:36:05.080 but one

01:36:06.520 thing

01:36:06.980 if you're

01:36:08.000 careful

01:36:08.400 you can

01:36:09.840 have the

01:36:10.120 best

01:36:10.340 relationships

01:36:10.880 you've

01:36:11.240 ever had

01:36:11.600 in your

01:36:11.780 life

01:36:12.040 with your

01:36:12.360 kids

01:36:12.740 that's

01:36:16.320 really

01:36:16.500 something

01:36:16.940 the thing

01:36:18.500 is they

01:36:18.860 pay you

01:36:19.260 back for

01:36:19.820 you know

01:36:20.360 people think

01:36:20.940 of kids

01:36:21.360 as this

01:36:21.900 like

01:36:22.660 interruption

01:36:23.440 in their

01:36:23.760 life or

01:36:24.260 an inconvenience

01:36:25.140 sir

01:36:25.420 no

01:36:28.160 no

01:36:29.280 that's

01:36:32.720 not right

01:36:33.180 they're the

01:36:34.620 best thing

01:36:35.000 that ever

01:36:35.280 happens to

01:36:35.820 you if

01:36:36.140 you're

01:36:36.280 careful

01:36:36.640 you're

01:36:39.120 right

01:36:39.600 anyway

01:36:42.180 off to

01:36:44.500 the UK

01:36:44.940 yeah

01:36:46.800 yeah

01:36:47.920 before we

01:36:48.460 can't talk

01:36:49.100 before we

01:36:50.780 can't talk

01:36:51.520 yeah

01:36:51.820 off to

01:36:52.780 the UK

01:36:53.140 tomorrow

01:36:53.660 yeah

01:36:55.120 well

01:36:56.080 we wish

01:36:56.680 you luck

01:36:57.220 thank you

01:36:58.040 I don't

01:36:59.460 think you

01:36:59.880 need it

01:37:00.360 but

01:37:00.680 it never

01:37:02.280 hurts to

01:37:02.980 have a

01:37:03.320 little

01:37:03.540 it's good

01:37:04.520 to have

01:37:04.780 some luck

01:37:05.240 too

01:37:05.560 yeah

01:37:06.620 it's going

01:37:06.900 to be

01:37:07.060 an incredibly

01:37:07.820 exciting

01:37:08.340 trip

01:37:08.700 ridiculously

01:37:09.660 exciting

01:37:10.300 trip

01:37:10.680 it's a

01:37:12.180 ridiculously

01:37:12.660 privileged

01:37:13.260 trip

01:37:13.660 I will

01:37:14.100 I'll call

01:37:15.200 you

01:37:15.500 I'll call

01:37:16.560 you

01:37:16.660 yeah

01:37:16.760 yeah

01:37:26.040 yeah

01:37:26.880 yeah

01:37:27.480 you

01:37:28.060 yeah

01:37:29.540 yeah

01:37:30.200 yeah

01:37:30.980 yeah

01:37:32.100 Amen.

The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - June 20, 2022

263. An Interview with my Father ｜ Walter Peterson

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