The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - 346. Russia⧸Ukraine, ESG, gigantism and the West ｜ Senator Mike Lee

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00:00:57.420 Hello, everyone. I have the pleasure today of speaking with Senator Mike Lee from Utah.

00:01:13.100 Mike and I have spoken before on my podcast.

00:01:16.400 We've got to know each other a little bit as a consequence of being involved in various endeavors.

00:01:21.400 And I thought he would be an excellent person to help me think through, well, what I'm interested in, not least today,

00:01:32.260 is how to understand the situation in relationship to Russia and Ukraine, because I don't understand it.

00:01:39.620 So, Mike, I'm going to ask you some questions about that situation.

00:01:43.820 What's been disturbing me most particularly, I would say, is that I don't understand what it is that the West is aiming at precisely.

00:01:54.520 You know, when you're aiming at victory, because that's hypothetically the aim here,

00:01:59.480 you need to specify what a victory would look like.

00:02:03.700 And so I've been trying to game that in my imagination.

00:02:06.200 It's like if we got what we wanted, whatever that might be, what would that look like in any realistic sense?

00:02:14.540 And so what I see being emitted from the Biden administration and for the people who are beating the pro-war drum hard, 0.99

00:02:22.660 and that would include my idiot government in Canada, is a very banal form of dimwit flag waving, 0.96

00:02:30.400 which is, well, the Ukrainians are great Democrats, and we're supporting democracy, and we're on the side of freedom. 0.99

00:02:38.300 And I heard a fair bit of that about Afghanistan, and I heard a fair bit about that relationship to Iraq,

00:02:44.860 and it isn't obvious to me that that worked out particularly well.

00:02:48.740 And I don't buy the shallow, moralizing flag waving.

00:02:53.720 And Ukraine is a country that is so corrupt that it's almost beyond comprehension.

00:02:58.540 And so the idea that there's an easy pathway to democracy there is utterly preposterous,

00:03:04.300 which isn't to say that, no, I'm without my qualms, let's say, on the Russian side.

00:03:11.260 Russia's been a very troublesome country for a good 150 years and probably before that. 0.99

00:03:17.560 And so it's not like the situation is straightforward.

00:03:20.780 But here's what I've been walking through in my imagination.

00:03:22.840 And you can help me maybe clarify where my thinking is inappropriate.

00:03:28.160 So the hawks that I've talked to on the American side have basically laid out the most reasonable case for war for me, I suppose,

00:03:37.920 and have claimed, for example, that it's in our best interest in the West to keep Russia relatively weak militarily,

00:03:47.140 to minimize the threat they might pose now and in the future.

00:03:51.420 And this war gives us an opportunity to do just that, to cull their conventional forces and to keep Russia back on its heels, 0.85

00:04:00.960 which is a different proposition than expanding democracy in Ukraine.

00:04:04.880 And so I have some problems with that approach, conceptually, because I think that's what the Allies did to Germany after World War I. 0.50

00:04:15.900 We attempted to weaken it and then to keep it weak.

00:04:18.680 And that was not a good idea.

00:04:20.980 And, you know, history doesn't repeat, but it rhymes, as they say.

00:04:24.620 And so I think it's dangerous to weaken Russia, partly because Russia has natural resources that we actually need, 0.86

00:04:32.820 especially natural gas, which produces the ammonia that feeds 4 billion people.

00:04:38.180 And they produce ammonia and they produce food, high-quality wheat in particular.

00:04:43.020 And so a devastated Russia doesn't seem to me necessarily in the long-term interests of either the West or the planet.

00:04:50.900 And then on the alternative side, well, let's say Putin is deposed because he loses this war in a conventional sense

00:04:59.480 and a new leader emerges, the probability, as far as I'm concerned,

00:05:04.140 that we'll get a new leader in Russia in the midst of chaos who's better than Putin is virtually zero,

00:05:10.640 given the historical precedence.

00:05:12.500 And then if we reduce Russia to something like a state of chaos, which also could happen, 0.65

00:05:18.000 and the country fragments in the worst-case scenario,

00:05:21.320 then we have a situation where we have a fragmented Russia with 25,000 nuclear weapons floating around, let's say. 0.61

00:05:29.860 And that also seems like a rather dismal outcome.

00:05:32.160 So, like, what the hell is our plan for victory here, as far as you're concerned?

00:05:36.420 Look, I think starting out, at least from the U.S. perspective,

00:05:39.220 the idea was first to deter Putin from invading.

00:05:42.640 Once he invaded, the idea was to weaken him and cause him to decide relatively quickly

00:05:48.540 that it wasn't worth the effort and to retreat.

00:05:51.500 With good reason, people in the United States and in many other countries

00:05:55.080 want to make sure that we stop Vladimir Putin.

00:05:57.380 He's a bad guy.

00:05:58.820 He's someone who has ambitions that aren't good.

00:06:02.980 And so everyone sees in him this bad person, which he is,

00:06:08.240 who could do a whole lot of bad things.

00:06:10.340 The problem is, I think we're long past the moment

00:06:13.940 where what we're doing is going to do anything to stop him from aggressing.

00:06:20.620 If anything, we've made it worse.

00:06:22.460 We've driven him into the arms of China. 1.00

00:06:25.140 And that loving embrace, that alliance that's resulted from it,

00:06:29.200 economically, with energy, in many respects, ultimately, I think militarily,

00:06:36.160 that could create a much bigger problem than existed prior to the beginning of this war.

00:06:43.320 And so, look, he is a bad guy.

00:06:46.340 I wish he would go away.

00:06:48.480 But I'm not sure that the U.S. involvement in it

00:06:52.220 is necessarily going to inure to the benefit of the American people.

00:06:57.140 And I think we've lost sight of that,

00:06:58.660 precisely because of the factor you described.

00:07:02.020 I don't think there is a coherent, cogent game plan

00:07:05.880 and end result of peace that we're trying to get at.

00:07:10.020 Nor do I think that what we've done so far has brought us peace.

00:07:13.720 Quite to the contrary, it's continued the effort.

00:07:17.260 Okay, so you brought up the China argument.

00:07:19.340 So here's a way of conceptualizing that.

00:07:21.860 I mean, China has its problems, to say the least.

00:07:24.420 They're facing a demographic collapse.

00:07:26.580 Their real estate market is, to call it shaky, is to say almost nothing.

00:07:30.500 They're actually facing, by Chinese standards,

00:07:33.380 quite the rebellion on the home front.

00:07:35.580 I mean, things don't look that bright for the Chinese Communist Party.

00:07:39.060 And having them ally with Russia, I would say,

00:07:42.720 seems to be something that could be in their favor economically,

00:07:45.760 because it gives them access to the immense resources of Russia.

00:07:49.700 And if you think China is a good ally of the West, 0.98

00:07:55.860 then you've got another thing coming.

00:07:58.200 Anything that's done to help them survive in their current form,

00:08:02.220 the CCP in particular, the Chinese Communist Party,

00:08:04.620 is definitely not in our best interest.

00:08:06.460 So having Russia establish an alliance with China

00:08:09.580 that helps China limp along into the future,

00:08:12.900 I mean, that's a country that supports North Korea, 0.93

00:08:15.080 which is about all you need to say about the Chinese Communist Party.

00:08:18.180 And so that seems like a dim-witted strategy in the long run, 0.59

00:08:21.480 especially because China is at least as much of a threat.

00:08:24.900 No, it's more of a threat in any reasonable sense than Russia should be. 0.95

00:08:31.220 I mean, talk about systems out of alliance.

00:08:34.160 We're not allied very well with the Russians, philosophically, let's say,

00:08:38.300 but we are absolutely not aligned with the Chinese.

00:08:41.120 So that seems like a preposterous endeavor.

00:08:43.360 And it's an uneasy alliance between the Chinese and the Russians.

00:08:47.420 It's not a natural alliance.

00:08:49.160 We'd really have to force both the Chinese and the Russians into a corner, 1.00

00:08:53.440 in some real sense,

00:08:54.680 in order for them to be able to hammer out something approximating an agreement. 0.99

00:08:58.400 So that seems rather dim-witted.

00:09:00.840 So, and then let's also talk about the cost of war. 0.57

00:09:04.640 So, first of all,

00:09:05.840 how much money do you think the U.S. has poured into Ukraine so far?

00:09:10.420 One hundred and thirteen billion dollars to date.

00:09:13.760 One hundred and thirteen million dollars.

00:09:16.880 It's an enormous sum of money.

00:09:19.140 This represents a sum of money that's, I think,

00:09:21.680 between 20 and 25 times what Ukraine typically spends on defense in a typical year.

00:09:27.880 This is a sum of money roughly double, nearly double,

00:09:32.780 of what Russia spends on defense in a typical two-year period.

00:09:37.940 And I believe it's even 30, 40 percent larger than what Russia spent on defense last year,

00:09:44.660 given that, you know, they had a significant war effort going on.

00:09:47.980 What concerns me there, Jordan,

00:09:50.580 is that we're getting into this with our funding

00:09:54.160 and with our contribution of weapons.

00:09:57.660 If we're going to get involved through what could fairly be described by some

00:10:03.220 or perceived by some as a proxy war,

00:10:06.140 we need to understand what our objective is.

00:10:08.740 And if the United States,

00:10:09.920 we're supposed to have a declaration of war before we get involved in that.

00:10:14.840 This becomes especially important,

00:10:16.620 especially important when you're dealing with a near-peer nuclear-armed geopolitical adversary.

00:10:23.640 These guys have got nukes.

00:10:25.120 And to say they've got nukes is a vast understatement.

00:10:29.740 They've got a lot of nukes.

00:10:31.640 And so we've got to be really, really careful when approaching that monster.

00:10:35.580 And I don't think we're showing caution in that regard.

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00:12:17.420 Okay, so a couple of things there.

00:12:19.500 The first thing, we might want to make these numbers reasonable, realistic for people.

00:12:25.080 So $113 billion is $1,200 per four-person family in the U.S.

00:12:31.760 So that's what every family in the U.S. is now spending $100 a month on the Ukraine war.

00:12:37.420 Now, there's an additional problem with that, too, because Ukraine, by everyone's standards, including such reliable sources, let's say it has the New York Times.

00:12:48.560 Everyone knew perfectly well before we started flag-waving how corrupt Ukraine was. 0.99

00:12:53.480 And now $113 billion has been dumped into that economy with what I presume has been an extraordinary lack of oversight.

00:13:04.620 And so my sense is strong that God only knows what proportion of that money has been funneled into truly reprehensible criminal enterprises.

00:13:13.600 And if you think it's none of it, then you're naive beyond comprehension.

00:13:17.360 And so when the government spends money like a drunken sailor, which is what it's doing in Ukraine, you can be bloody sure that most of that money isn't ending up where it's supposed to.

00:13:27.540 It certainly didn't on the COVID front, for example.

00:13:30.740 I think 40% of COVID government claims for subsidy were fraudulent, something like 40%.

00:13:37.400 And if it's only 40% of what we're spending in Ukraine that's going to criminals, that would be a bloody miracle. 1.00

00:13:43.240 It's probably more like 95%.

00:13:45.220 And then there's kickbacks to what Eisenhower described as the military-industrial complex, which he warned about back in, what, 1960?

00:13:54.720 Was it three?

00:13:55.680 Something like that.

00:13:57.580 A little earlier, but you're close.

00:13:59.080 Something late 50s, early 60s, pointing out that that emergent collusion at the upper echelons between, let's say, defense contractors and government was what he believed would pose the most signal threat to the stability of, well, American democracy, certainly, but also the world in the decades moving forward.

00:14:20.780 And so some people are making an awful lot of money off this war, and they might consider that extraordinarily advantageous in the short term.

00:14:30.160 But we're facilitating criminal enterprises on a scale pretty much unheard of in the past.

00:14:36.460 And we have no idea exactly what our money is being spent on in relationship to the furtherance of the military-industrial complex.

00:14:45.840 And so that's also a negative consequence of the war, that this false, you know, democracy flag-waving masks.

00:14:56.480 And that strikes me as additionally naive over and above the fact that we're flirting with, like, as far as I'm concerned, we're already in World War III.

00:15:07.300 The issue is how far we're going to take it.

00:15:10.020 The notion that this is a war between Russia and Ukraine, it's like, is there anybody who believes that?

00:15:15.980 And then you also pointed out something that people should be jumping up and down and screaming about in the United States, which is that, well, there's no declaration of war here.

00:15:27.320 And so, but you're in a war.

00:15:29.460 And so, how the hell did that happen?

00:15:32.360 Well, we're pretending it's not a war.

00:15:34.160 Well, I don't know if that's sufficient reason to bypass the constitutionally, is it constitutionally mandated requirement that war is declared by Congress?

00:15:43.680 Yes.

00:15:44.220 It's one of the things that changed in our form of government after we left the United Kingdom.

00:15:50.940 One of the things that we made sure was that the people's elected representatives in Congress and not the chief executive would have the power to take us to war.

00:15:59.800 Now, to be clear, Congress did appropriate this money.

00:16:03.160 So, it's not as if Congress were bypassed and deciding to send money to Ukraine.

00:16:08.740 My point is not that it happened entirely by the executive.

00:16:12.720 It is rather that what we're doing is tantamount to war.

00:16:16.360 It has many of the same consequences as war. 0.70

00:16:18.720 And so, I fear that we're not adequately debating and discussing, as Congress funds these endeavors, the fact that this puts us in a de facto position of war.

00:16:28.400 And then, to your point about the corruption, the possibility of waste, fraud, abuse, and other corrupt developments with this money, just last weekend, Zelensky was quoted.

00:16:41.960 I don't speak Ukrainian, so I'm relying on interpreters.

00:16:44.940 But he was quoted as suggesting it was somehow dangerous for Americans to question how that $113 billion was being spent in Ukraine.

00:16:54.580 That's dangerous.

00:16:55.860 Well, I think that suggestion that it's dangerous is itself beyond dangerous.

00:16:59.280 And we ought to be very, very leery of anybody who describes it that way.

00:17:04.360 Okay, so when this money is spent, we're talking about a tremendous amount of money.

00:17:08.780 What exactly?

00:17:10.460 You know, it's not like there's bales of money being sent on aircraft transport with aircraft transport to Ukraine.

00:17:20.960 The money is being spent on goods, services, military equipment.

00:17:26.820 Who exactly are the recipients of this money?

00:17:30.220 Like, it's not the brave Ukrainian people. 1.00

00:17:33.160 It's not like there are Americans on the ground.

00:17:35.000 They're handing out dollar bills to starving Ukrainians in the street, right? 0.98

00:17:38.900 Which is, I suppose, the naive image of the same kind of flag-waving pro-democracy idiocy that we're seeing the propagandists generate. 0.81

00:17:47.720 Where do you think this money is going? 0.83

00:17:49.680 And does anyone know?

00:17:51.940 Yeah, so it's outlined in the legislation.

00:17:54.680 We don't know the particulars of exactly where it's going.

00:17:57.580 But the generalities of it are laid out in the three or four pieces of legislation that have been passed in order to keep the funding going.

00:18:07.760 In some instances, the money goes to the U.S. military in order to acquire weapons so that they can send weapons over to Ukraine.

00:18:18.600 And in other instances, it goes to other U.S. agencies that are providing some form of relief or another to the Ukrainian people.

00:18:27.080 It's spread out in myriad ways.

00:18:30.680 And I think some of those expenditures are more defensible than others.

00:18:34.300 But in the final analysis, it is a huge sum of money.

00:18:38.180 And that's money that has the ability to be corrupted.

00:18:41.220 Even where it's not cash, in some instances, they're getting money.

00:18:45.860 In other instances, they're getting material.

00:18:47.920 But regardless, that material has a value attached to it.

00:18:53.200 And so that's not to suggest there's no corruption possible there.

00:18:58.020 Right, right.

00:18:59.060 So if you had to make a strong case for the kind of NATO involvement, because it's obviously not just the U.S., although the U.S. is the primary mover here, probably followed by the U.K., I would say.

00:19:13.040 That's how it appears to me.

00:19:14.800 If you had to make a strong case for what NATO is doing, what would the case be?

00:19:20.420 I mean, we talked about the necessity of deterring Russian aggression, especially in relationship to Ukraine.

00:19:27.280 Do you believe that it's reasonable to assume that Russia presents a credible threat to the integrity of the NATO alliance or the West outside the specific case of Ukraine?

00:19:41.180 And I mean, we should point out that Ukraine and Russia have been integrally tied together for the entire history of both countries.

00:19:49.800 There's less separation there than there is between Canada and the U.S.

00:19:55.740 And we're two countries that are very tightly tied together.

00:19:58.460 So the relationship between Russia and Ukraine is not of thoroughly independent, sovereign states with an immense history of political and cultural difference.

00:20:09.980 So the involvement of Russia in Ukraine is unbelievably complex and vice versa.

00:20:18.360 But we might say, well, Russia is an expansionist state in the style of the Soviet Union and therefore poses a potential threat to the integrity of Eastern and Western Europe. 0.69

00:20:28.920 And of course, the Russians made all sorts of incursions into Eastern Europe.

00:20:31.760 So there's some historical precedent for that.

00:20:34.160 But and so we could say, well, you can make a case for keeping that threat at bay.

00:20:39.520 Is there another case that can be made for our involvement in this war?

00:20:45.400 Yeah.

00:20:46.120 So, look, the mindset of the objectives of NATO here.

00:20:51.240 There has been a legitimate viewpoint that suggests that if Putin moves into Ukraine, if he takes over some or eventually all of Ukraine or even just part of it, that this could reflect the fact that he's hellbent somehow on expansionist ambition and that that expansionist ambition is going to spill over into other NATO countries.

00:21:19.460 So Ukraine isn't in NATO, but it is, as some describe it, NATO adjacent.

00:21:24.680 And so there is concern that this could spill over into those countries.

00:21:29.140 I get that.

00:21:30.000 And I understand that we have an obligation as the United States to defend our NATO allies and protect them.

00:21:35.900 The problem with that is it's at once very speculative.

00:21:39.480 We don't know that to be the case.

00:21:40.900 And as you point out, there is a lot more history between Russia and Ukraine, especially parts of Ukraine.

00:21:47.420 A lot more of a cultural, historical connection, in some cases a linguistic connection between Russia and Ukraine than there is a lot of these other countries.

00:21:58.200 But secondly, we could just as easily, it seems to me, be bringing about the very thing we're trying to avoid.

00:22:06.040 Now, I don't count myself as an expert in this area by any means.

00:22:10.340 I'm just trying to outline the two viewpoints because the other viewpoint is also valid, which is that if we get involved in this, if we fund a proxy war against that same adversary, Russia, we could be inviting more of the same.

00:22:24.840 Especially if, as I suspect, I don't know that the United States has the intestinal fortitude to go into a full-blown war with Russia.

00:22:33.920 And if it doesn't, then what happens?

00:22:37.560 Then what have we done?

00:22:38.480 Have we provoked Russia to become even more expansionist?

00:22:41.460 Could that undermine the security of our NATO allies even more than just staying out altogether would have done?

00:22:47.400 I don't know the answer to these questions, but the fact that they're not being seriously asked and debated and discussed in the halls of Congress is deeply troubling to me.

00:22:56.720 As is the fact that whenever anybody, including me, raises questions like this, we're immediately tagged on Twitter, for example, as Putin lovers, which is absurd and preposterous.

00:23:09.420 I have a distinct loathing for the man.

00:23:12.140 I think he's awful, but it's because he's awful, not in spite of it, that I've got real concerns about our involvement here.

00:23:21.140 I'm not sure it's going to do anything like what those advocating it believe it will do for us, or our allies for that matter.

00:23:31.020 So Putin as well, this is an additional complication.

00:23:35.520 Putin is actually quite popular among Russians as far as anybody can tell.

00:23:39.240 And part of the reason for that, and I've read a lot of his speeches over the last 10 years trying to understand how he thinks, because my sense of people generally is that they do what they say they're going to do.

00:23:50.780 It's very hard to generate a facade of continual lies for decades to say one thing publicly and even privately in speeches, and then to go off and conjure up an entire new theory of the world and operate within those confines.

00:24:05.700 Putin is popular partly because he's been presenting this war against Ukraine as a defense of the traditional values, not only of Russia, but also of the West. 0.98

00:24:16.320 And because Putin is no fan of, let's say, the woke idiocy that's gripped the West.

00:24:22.700 And that's a sentiment that's echoed quite profoundly among the Eastern Europeans who would otherwise be our staunch allies and who generally are. 0.98

00:24:31.120 And so that's the drum he's been able to beat to keep himself popular in Russia.

00:24:36.980 And you can be cynical and say that that's merely maneuvering, propagandistic maneuvering on Putin's part.

00:24:43.880 But I think the simpler explanation is that he actually believes that the West have become untrustworthy on that front and he isn't interested in the incursion of that kind of ideology into the Russian sphere.

00:24:58.260 And so I'm not exactly sure what to make of that.

00:25:03.360 And then the notion that we're enabling the very conflict that we're trying to avoid brings me back to the problem I had at the beginning of our discussion, which is I can't figure out what the hell constitutes our victory here.

00:25:18.780 It's like, even if we do win, what in the world does that mean?

00:25:23.540 We want a permanently weakened Russia on the Eastern front and do we want them so weak that they start to lose their integrity as an economy?

00:25:32.340 And then what do we do on the energy front, for example, or on the fertilizer or food front?

00:25:36.980 And I don't see, as you just said, I don't see anybody talking about these things with any degree of seriousness.

00:25:42.520 It's actually quite jaw-dropping to me that what we are getting is something like governance by single pixel tweet.

00:25:54.280 You know, we're in it with the freedom-loving Ukrainians.

00:25:58.100 And like, as far as I can tell, there aren't a hell of a lot of those, by the way.

00:26:02.180 We're in it with the freedom-loving Ukrainians till the end.

00:26:06.040 It's like, well, what do you mean the end here?

00:26:07.740 I don't understand what a Russian loss would look like.

00:26:13.240 I mean, if the Americans were on the other side, there's no damn way, there's no way you guys would lose.

00:26:19.360 Like, you might not win, and maybe no one will win, but you certainly wouldn't lose.

00:26:24.060 So am I missing something here, or is this discussion as shallow as it appears?

00:26:30.000 Your comment that whenever you say anything that questions the story that's being laid forth about the war,

00:26:37.600 you get immediately labeled, you know, as a satanic Putin worshiper, so to speak.

00:26:43.220 All that is, to me, is evidence that this debate is being handled at a very juvenile level.

00:26:49.480 That's what happened in World War I, by the way. 0.94

00:26:51.660 I mean, people reacted incredibly stupidly as World War I unfolded and got their arm caught in the bandsaw, let's say,

00:27:00.440 and tore the entire continent apart for four years for basically no gain whatsoever. 0.98

00:27:06.520 That's right.

00:27:06.740 And so it looks to me like that's the right historical analog here.

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00:28:19.400 No, that's exactly right.

00:28:21.260 I think we have a very high potential here of everyone losing a lot.

00:28:27.260 And what disturbs me greatly is that I have yet to have anyone articulate to me

00:28:32.180 any sound argument for what the end looks like,

00:28:37.020 how this culminates in making the world a better place, in added peace to the world.

00:28:45.600 You certainly don't hear that within the U.S. government.

00:28:49.140 I haven't heard that.

00:28:50.520 Nor do you hear peace talks going on.

00:28:52.960 Let's find a way to resolve this so that we have as few people dying at the end of the day as possible.

00:29:02.180 And we don't hear that at all.

00:29:03.600 What you do hear, it hasn't been that long since you heard Zelensky and other people in his government

00:29:10.460 talking about things like, you know, this is going to end with our tanks,

00:29:14.720 Ukrainian tanks on Moscow's Red Square.

00:29:19.140 Now, that raises all sorts of questions like, how is that going to happen?

00:29:24.040 Whose tanks will those be?

00:29:25.620 Will those be American tanks?

00:29:27.840 That's certainly not a vision shared by Americans, I don't think.

00:29:32.020 I've never heard our president or any of my colleagues in the Senate

00:29:34.820 or counterparts in the House of Representatives envision that kind of outcome.

00:29:40.060 I don't know what victory looks like under their plan.

00:29:43.000 And that's deeply concerning because if you don't have an end in mind,

00:29:47.000 you're going to be taken in all sorts of strange directions.

00:29:50.320 I guarantee you Putin's got an end in mind and it's not favorable to us.

00:29:55.220 Well, so what do you suppose Putin would be willing to settle for?

00:29:59.900 And what do you think he could sell his people as a sufficient victory if peace talks were to proceed?

00:30:08.000 Now, I also know, by the way, as far as it's possible to know these things,

00:30:11.920 and I've been told by very reliable observers who should be in a position to know

00:30:17.420 that there were peace negotiations on the table last March

00:30:21.820 and that those were scuttled primarily on the American side by the Biden administration.

00:30:26.660 So that's rather disturbing.

00:30:29.020 And so it would also be very useful for me to be able to conceptualize something

00:30:34.320 approximating what the West might accept as terms for peace,

00:30:39.000 given that, as you pointed out, the ultimate extension of the war

00:30:43.540 in the direction that Zelensky's more extreme statements have indicated,

00:30:47.300 well, it's just a non-starter.

00:30:48.840 First of all, many people have tried in the last 200 years

00:30:52.840 to advance their tanks all the way to Moscow,

00:30:55.400 and that tended to end very badly for anyone who tried to do it.

00:30:59.240 And that happened a minimum of three times,

00:31:01.800 and the same thing happened every time.

00:31:04.000 And then we should also point out with 100% certainty

00:31:08.000 that there isn't a chance in hell of Ukrainian tanks,

00:31:12.460 say, made in the West, ending up in Red Square

00:31:15.180 without the Russians doing everything that's in their power 0.96

00:31:18.400 to make absolutely certain that that never happens.

00:31:21.480 Yeah, go ahead.

00:31:26.680 Well, I'm interested in the fact that there seems to be

00:31:31.120 virtually no negotiation whatsoever on the peace front.

00:31:34.820 You know, this should be Biden's number one concern,

00:31:36.980 as far as I'm concerned.

00:31:38.020 It's like, what the hell are we doing here in the West?

00:31:40.200 Why aren't we negotiating for peace?

00:31:42.640 You know, on our terms, let's say,

00:31:44.580 because I think the Russians are in a bit of a corner,

00:31:46.620 with 100% purposeful intent.

00:31:52.820 And then, so let's talk about that.

00:31:55.760 Why aren't we negotiating?

00:31:57.980 And then let's also talk about

00:32:00.040 how this war escalates as it moves forward,

00:32:03.920 and when it actually moves from a proxy war,

00:32:07.500 which it is now,

00:32:08.620 to whatever we now are willing to define as an actual war.

00:32:13.160 So let's start with the,

00:32:14.900 why are,

00:32:15.840 do you know of any negotiations

00:32:17.280 that are occurring in good faith on the peace front?

00:32:19.740 And if not, like, why not?

00:32:21.660 No, I don't.

00:32:22.580 And it's perplexing.

00:32:23.480 You know, in the early months of this conflict,

00:32:27.160 there was speculation in Washington.

00:32:29.320 I don't know how much truth to it,

00:32:30.480 but there was some speculation in Washington

00:32:32.080 that a negotiated peace could look something like

00:32:35.900 formal recognition by the West

00:32:39.560 of the Russian occupation

00:32:44.140 from eight or nine years ago in Crimea,

00:32:48.120 and then perhaps a partial partitioning

00:32:51.160 of parts of the Russian-speaking areas

00:32:53.880 of the Donbass region,

00:32:55.280 and that there would be perhaps

00:32:57.080 not formal recognition there,

00:32:58.880 but a negotiated ceasefire of Russia's occupation

00:33:02.700 of some of those areas.

00:33:04.400 But no one has been talking about

00:33:06.340 any of those outcomes for many months.

00:33:09.420 If there aren't peace negotiations going on,

00:33:12.100 which I really hope they are,

00:33:14.800 I haven't heard any of them.

00:33:16.600 I haven't heard about them.

00:33:18.000 And they're certainly not inclined

00:33:21.080 to talk about them in public.

00:33:22.980 And that's one of the things

00:33:24.160 that's most concerning about this,

00:33:25.900 is that you're picking a fight

00:33:27.420 with a huge bear.

00:33:29.660 And look, people are fond in the United States

00:33:31.900 of saying Russia's economy

00:33:34.320 can't support a full-blown war.

00:33:36.140 Yeah, well, that's true.

00:33:37.260 But as you pointed out,

00:33:38.500 there's no end to their nuclear stockpile.

00:33:41.540 And their weapons do pose

00:33:43.820 a formidable threat to the entire world,

00:33:47.760 should they choose to use them.

00:33:49.500 And that's why we've got to be so careful here.

00:33:50.940 So to enter into that without a strategy

00:33:53.580 for achieving peace,

00:33:54.820 for a resolution of it, 0.85

00:33:56.100 is a fool's errand, 0.91

00:33:58.420 if ever there were one. 0.99

00:34:00.920 Right.

00:34:01.300 So, OK, so here's what we've established so far,

00:34:03.840 is we're spending money like a drunken sailor

00:34:06.060 and facilitating an endless degree

00:34:10.660 of criminal enterprise

00:34:11.680 and also funneling money

00:34:13.100 into the military industrial complex

00:34:15.080 at a heretofore unprecedented rate.

00:34:18.080 We have no vision for victory

00:34:20.280 that's laid out,

00:34:21.220 that's realistic in any real sense.

00:34:23.100 And we also have no vision

00:34:24.520 for what might constitute peace.

00:34:27.040 So then, again,

00:34:28.620 you have to throw up your hands

00:34:29.700 and think,

00:34:30.140 just what the hell is going on here?

00:34:31.860 And I really can't understand it

00:34:33.380 as much as I try.

00:34:35.380 Like, what in the world are we doing?

00:34:37.300 Is it truly as shallow

00:34:38.620 as posturing morally

00:34:40.600 in this opinion-pull-driven way

00:34:43.320 that says,

00:34:43.880 well, once again,

00:34:44.780 we're champions of democracy and freedom.

00:34:46.820 And, you know,

00:34:47.600 we're putting our military might

00:34:49.020 behind these wonderful freedom fighters,

00:34:51.500 which, as I said,

00:34:52.740 are in genuinely short supply in Ukraine.

00:34:56.000 It's hard for me to believe

00:34:57.240 that we could possibly be 1.00

00:34:58.860 that preposterously shallow and stupid, 1.00

00:35:01.220 but, and venal and greedy as well. 1.00

00:35:04.460 But it does seem to be

00:35:06.040 the simplest explanation

00:35:07.400 for what's going on.

00:35:10.480 How do you see,

00:35:11.960 like, the other thing I'm seeing

00:35:13.400 is that we are getting dragged

00:35:14.700 into the bandsaw

00:35:15.720 like one inch of cloth at a time, right?

00:35:19.040 And there's movements forward

00:35:21.440 incrementally towards the abyss

00:35:23.200 with the continued provision

00:35:25.120 of more and more sophisticated weaponry

00:35:27.520 to the Ukrainians.

00:35:28.860 Now, at some point,

00:35:30.080 that becomes war.

00:35:31.380 And I suppose that,

00:35:32.940 that the point of no return

00:35:34.480 is reached when,

00:35:35.720 when it's,

00:35:36.460 when aircraft are being supplied

00:35:37.860 or when there's, what,

00:35:39.160 there's movement of NATO troops

00:35:40.520 on the ground.

00:35:41.360 It's something like that.

00:35:42.980 How do you see this,

00:35:44.760 if this doesn't cease,

00:35:46.960 if it doesn't move towards peace,

00:35:49.540 even if the Ukrainians do advance

00:35:51.780 and the Russians retreat,

00:35:53.060 so we're winning,

00:35:54.280 how do you see this war escalating

00:35:56.900 in the most realistic sense

00:35:58.340 over the next few months?

00:35:59.900 Well, look,

00:36:00.720 the early hope was that Putin

00:36:02.240 would get bored

00:36:02.940 or Putin would get frustrated

00:36:04.860 or he'd get worried

00:36:05.900 and then that he would withdraw.

00:36:07.240 I don't see any of this

00:36:08.280 happening right now.

00:36:09.160 And so I,

00:36:12.260 unless the United States

00:36:13.760 and other serious outside actors

00:36:17.360 who have played a serious role

00:36:18.780 in it so far

00:36:19.620 dedicate their efforts

00:36:22.060 to trying to resolve this,

00:36:23.820 trying to achieve

00:36:24.540 a peaceful resolution,

00:36:26.420 it's hard for me to see

00:36:28.040 how this doesn't culminate

00:36:29.220 in at least a significant regional war

00:36:31.680 and, heaven forbid,

00:36:33.500 a world war.

00:36:34.860 That's why we've got to turn this around.

00:36:36.640 As far as why it's happening,

00:36:38.260 as far as why there continues

00:36:39.580 to be U.S. support for it

00:36:42.240 in the absence of a peace plan,

00:36:44.200 the only thing I can speculate here

00:36:45.980 is that for whatever reason,

00:36:48.760 it's popular.

00:36:49.380 It's popular with the American people.

00:36:51.500 Many see it as a conflict

00:36:53.320 between good and evil.

00:36:55.600 Russia is the villain. 0.97

00:36:57.700 Ukraine is the innocent victim, 1.00

00:37:01.440 the virtuous victim,

00:37:02.400 and the United States is the hero.

00:37:05.200 It can, from a vantage point

00:37:07.860 thousands of miles away,

00:37:09.240 use its immense force,

00:37:10.940 its immense resources,

00:37:12.180 financially and militarily,

00:37:14.220 to try to influence this

00:37:15.720 supposedly without a single American life

00:37:18.180 being put at risk.

00:37:19.400 The problem with this narrative,

00:37:22.020 this story,

00:37:23.140 that allows the effort

00:37:24.560 to be so popular,

00:37:26.100 as popular as it has been so far,

00:37:28.620 is that I don't think

00:37:29.360 the American people

00:37:30.060 are being told the whole story.

00:37:31.480 I don't think they're being

00:37:32.440 adequately advised

00:37:33.780 as to the risks.

00:37:35.280 You know, if you go to a doctor,

00:37:37.980 you go to a surgeon

00:37:38.840 who proposes a surgical

00:37:40.120 intervention of some sort,

00:37:42.840 usually there will be

00:37:43.920 a series of benefits

00:37:46.040 and risks

00:37:46.900 that the doctor

00:37:47.780 would weigh out with you.

00:37:49.740 Going to war should involve 1.00

00:37:51.360 nothing less than that, certainly.

00:37:52.900 And I don't think

00:37:53.920 the American press

00:37:55.400 is reporting on

00:37:56.620 what the risks are.

00:37:57.980 Many politicians

00:37:58.740 are very content.

00:38:00.440 In fact,

00:38:00.920 they're really eager

00:38:02.580 to continue

00:38:04.800 to perpetuate

00:38:05.620 this villain-victim-hero

00:38:09.760 paradigm

00:38:11.300 because it sells.

00:38:15.020 It's swelling.

00:38:16.340 It rings a certain

00:38:17.580 populist chord within us.

00:38:21.780 But I think over time

00:38:22.840 that's going to fade.

00:38:24.160 It's going to fade

00:38:24.760 because among other things,

00:38:25.760 we've got problems here

00:38:27.240 that are becoming apparent.

00:38:28.240 You know, Jordan,

00:38:28.660 last year in the United States,

00:38:30.640 just 2022 alone,

00:38:32.500 we lost 110,000 Americans

00:38:35.640 to fentanyl poisoning.

00:38:37.600 That fentanyl

00:38:38.080 is being manufactured

00:38:39.160 in Mexico,

00:38:40.380 being flooded

00:38:42.000 across our borders 0.73

00:38:43.180 by the drug cartels

00:38:44.380 as they traffic humans

00:38:46.140 and with them drugs,

00:38:48.260 including fentanyl.

00:38:49.640 110,000 Americans

00:38:51.960 died of that last year.

00:38:54.240 Looked up

00:38:55.120 a U.N. report recently.

00:38:57.080 You know how many civilians

00:38:58.360 have been killed

00:38:58.880 in Ukraine

00:38:59.320 since this conflict started?

00:39:01.240 If the source

00:39:02.400 from the U.N.

00:39:03.220 is accurate,

00:39:04.080 it's less than 8,000

00:39:06.220 since this war started.

00:39:09.000 And so,

00:39:09.720 it's not to say

00:39:10.440 that that isn't tragic.

00:39:11.420 It's not to say

00:39:11.980 that they are the same.

00:39:12.920 They are not.

00:39:13.480 They are very different.

00:39:14.780 But I think

00:39:15.980 the American people

00:39:16.900 are starting to see,

00:39:18.520 number one,

00:39:18.940 that there are grave risks

00:39:20.040 to what we're doing

00:39:22.220 in Ukraine

00:39:22.760 and that unless

00:39:23.740 we decide not to,

00:39:24.820 we're going to get drawn

00:39:25.980 into a massive war.

00:39:28.040 Yeah, well, it's okay.

00:39:29.220 So, you have a convenient

00:39:30.360 distraction hypothesis there.

00:39:32.300 I mean, one of the things

00:39:33.060 that really appalled me

00:39:34.260 in recent weeks,

00:39:35.740 you know,

00:39:36.020 I was remembering

00:39:36.920 that speech

00:39:37.700 that Biden gave

00:39:38.700 in front of the red stage,

00:39:41.280 you know,

00:39:41.860 with the military people

00:39:42.920 behind him.

00:39:43.540 Not creepy at all.

00:39:44.440 Not creepy at all.

00:39:45.760 No, no, no.

00:39:46.620 Well, and I have some insiders

00:39:48.080 in the Democrat Party

00:39:49.620 talking to me

00:39:50.320 about why such things happen.

00:39:51.720 And I know that 1.00

00:39:52.920 Biden's idiot advisors 1.00

00:39:54.120 were playing with this. 1.00

00:39:55.560 I mean, this is so preposterous,

00:39:57.080 but it happens to be the case

00:39:58.400 with this Dark Brandon idea,

00:40:01.580 propagandistic idea

00:40:02.760 that Biden has been seen

00:40:04.240 by people

00:40:04.820 as relatively ineffectual

00:40:07.000 in the sort of

00:40:07.680 classic masculine sense.

00:40:09.440 And it was time

00:40:10.000 to crank up the imagery

00:40:11.300 in relationship

00:40:12.540 to his shadow side,

00:40:14.160 like his sort of

00:40:14.760 militaristic tough guy

00:40:16.300 shadow side.

00:40:17.200 And if you go look up

00:40:18.080 Dark Brandon on the web,

00:40:19.440 you can see all these memes

00:40:20.820 that people have produced,

00:40:22.840 putting him forward

00:40:23.620 as kind of an action hero.

00:40:25.260 And this is exactly

00:40:26.200 what I saw

00:40:26.840 with him posturing in Ukraine.

00:40:28.260 He was wearing

00:40:28.940 his black trench coat

00:40:30.100 and his, you know,

00:40:31.880 military Ray-Ban sunglasses

00:40:33.860 with reflective coating.

00:40:35.360 And there's a nice

00:40:36.320 air raid siren

00:40:37.160 going on in the background.

00:40:38.460 And it looks to me like,

00:40:40.220 it looks to me like

00:40:41.320 shallow narrative drama

00:40:43.240 of the sort

00:40:44.020 that you just described.

00:40:45.560 And then that makes

00:40:47.180 for a very convenient

00:40:48.140 distraction

00:40:48.900 when there were

00:40:49.460 important things

00:40:50.140 that should be being

00:40:51.000 dealt with

00:40:51.460 that aren't being

00:40:52.120 dealt with.

00:40:52.820 And I do believe

00:40:53.800 that the people

00:40:55.440 who posture and strut

00:40:57.140 in front of the world stage

00:40:58.980 and who think

00:40:59.600 image is everything

00:41:00.420 are willing to do

00:41:01.320 whatever they need to do

00:41:02.720 to put forward

00:41:03.520 the right image

00:41:04.920 independent of

00:41:05.800 the material reality.

00:41:07.000 That brings me

00:41:07.940 to a specific question

00:41:09.020 I had for you too.

00:41:10.480 You know,

00:41:10.820 I was surprised actually

00:41:12.260 when I reached out to you

00:41:13.280 to talk about

00:41:13.920 the Russian war

00:41:14.700 that you would

00:41:15.520 actually speak.

00:41:17.240 not because

00:41:18.200 I don't think

00:41:19.280 you have the courage

00:41:20.020 to,

00:41:20.340 because I think

00:41:21.260 you do.

00:41:22.000 But I don't see

00:41:23.340 there is anything

00:41:24.000 in this for you

00:41:25.120 at least in the short term

00:41:26.660 except loss.

00:41:27.960 As you already

00:41:28.800 pointed out,

00:41:29.760 if anybody

00:41:30.520 at the moment

00:41:31.400 stands up and says,

00:41:32.480 hey guys,

00:41:33.040 I don't know what

00:41:33.460 the hell we're doing here

00:41:34.360 but something's rotten

00:41:36.100 in the state of Denmark,

00:41:37.560 all you get out of that

00:41:39.120 is the kind of abuse

00:41:41.180 that's generally reserved

00:41:42.900 for people who are being

00:41:44.000 straightforwardly traitorous.

00:41:45.640 You know,

00:41:46.280 because we've already

00:41:46.920 decided who the good guys

00:41:48.200 are here

00:41:48.700 and it's us.

00:41:49.660 And, you know,

00:41:50.500 if you're anti-war

00:41:52.280 in Ukraine,

00:41:53.360 you're pro-Putin

00:41:54.420 and God,

00:41:55.220 you could hardly,

00:41:55.980 that's as bad

00:41:56.520 as being pro-Hitler,

00:41:57.740 let's say,

00:41:58.220 or being pro-Stalin.

00:41:59.860 And so,

00:42:00.820 why in the world

00:42:02.120 are you willing

00:42:02.800 to talk about this?

00:42:04.260 So yeah,

00:42:04.760 there's a lot to lose

00:42:05.780 by talking about it.

00:42:07.260 There's far more to lose

00:42:08.540 by not talking about it.

00:42:09.700 Look, Jordan,

00:42:10.200 I can't know what I know

00:42:11.960 and not say something

00:42:14.400 because what we stand

00:42:15.660 to lose

00:42:16.160 if we say nothing

00:42:17.920 and if we continue

00:42:18.840 down our current path

00:42:20.140 is so much greater

00:42:21.800 than whatever discomfort

00:42:23.380 a politician can endure

00:42:24.900 when people

00:42:26.700 scream things

00:42:28.720 that aren't true.

00:42:30.600 This really is

00:42:31.940 a significant problem

00:42:32.920 and I don't mean

00:42:33.960 to minimize in any way

00:42:35.460 the threat

00:42:36.380 that Vladimir Putin

00:42:37.360 may pose to the world.

00:42:38.640 I actually feel

00:42:40.120 the way I do,

00:42:41.120 not in spite of the fact

00:42:42.200 that he's a villain,

00:42:42.860 but because of it.

00:42:43.660 Because he's a villain,

00:42:45.260 because he's got

00:42:46.220 nuclear weapons

00:42:47.640 more than anybody else

00:42:51.260 in the world

00:42:51.960 in terms of counting up

00:42:53.360 the number of weapons,

00:42:54.360 the number of warheads,

00:42:55.860 we've got to be very careful

00:42:58.220 and because he's a villain,

00:43:00.260 we've got to make sure

00:43:01.740 we know what we're doing.

00:43:03.260 If we're going to fight

00:43:04.500 for Ukraine

00:43:06.040 on Ukraine's behalf

00:43:07.280 to the point

00:43:08.100 where we're committing

00:43:08.860 ourselves essentially

00:43:10.040 in order to defend

00:43:11.800 our own honor

00:43:12.760 now that we've started

00:43:13.460 into this,

00:43:14.040 if we're committing

00:43:14.660 ourselves to war,

00:43:15.700 we need to be clear

00:43:16.480 about that

00:43:16.920 with the American people.

00:43:18.420 Otherwise,

00:43:18.860 this is going to cost

00:43:19.540 a lot of lives.

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00:43:22.820 but I could only pay

00:43:23.640 for half of them.

00:43:24.740 An easy loan

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00:43:47.900 and apply for a loan

00:43:49.040 now at lamina.ca.

00:43:51.500 Okay, so on the GOP

00:43:54.460 side of things,

00:43:56.120 are you a lone voice

00:43:58.740 in your depiction

00:43:59.920 of the danger

00:44:00.800 that's associated

00:44:01.800 with the escalation

00:44:02.760 of this war

00:44:03.380 or what's the situation

00:44:05.080 on the Republican side

00:44:06.300 in terms of attitude

00:44:07.200 towards this war?

00:44:08.660 Is there anything

00:44:09.380 approximating a consensus?

00:44:11.140 How much

00:44:11.880 of the Republican Party

00:44:12.880 is more hawk-like?

00:44:15.600 What's the situation

00:44:16.700 on the ground

00:44:17.280 on the Republican side?

00:44:18.640 There's a small handful

00:44:19.380 of Republicans

00:44:20.040 but a growing number

00:44:21.400 of Republicans

00:44:22.000 who are starting

00:44:22.700 to express concerns.

00:44:25.840 A few of us

00:44:26.700 in the Senate,

00:44:27.420 probably two or three dozen,

00:44:30.180 maybe four dozen

00:44:30.900 in the House

00:44:31.700 who have started

00:44:32.160 to express concerns

00:44:33.120 about it.

00:44:34.480 And I think

00:44:35.520 the number is building

00:44:36.420 because people realize

00:44:38.760 what's at stake.

00:44:40.800 Well, what's surprising

00:44:41.960 though, Jordan,

00:44:42.420 is the number

00:44:42.880 of Democrats

00:44:43.660 who are not raising

00:44:45.060 these questions.

00:44:46.020 I've got allies

00:44:47.020 who I've worked with

00:44:48.820 for years

00:44:49.520 on the Democratic side

00:44:51.080 on issues dealing

00:44:53.040 with the war powers.

00:44:54.500 I've teamed up

00:44:55.300 with Democrats,

00:44:55.940 I've teamed up

00:44:56.400 with some very unlikely allies

00:44:58.900 like Bernie Sanders.

00:45:00.480 We've run measures

00:45:03.060 under the war powers

00:45:03.940 resolution.

00:45:05.160 The first time

00:45:06.020 the war powers act

00:45:07.360 was successfully invoked

00:45:09.060 by passing a resolution,

00:45:11.580 you know,

00:45:11.840 in that case

00:45:12.680 to get us out

00:45:13.420 of the undeclared war

00:45:15.540 in Yemen

00:45:16.140 was with me

00:45:18.680 and with Bernie Sanders.

00:45:20.120 But this time around,

00:45:21.020 I don't see any Democrats

00:45:22.580 in the Congress,

00:45:23.560 not in the House,

00:45:24.200 not in the Senate,

00:45:25.520 who are,

00:45:26.320 at least not publicly,

00:45:27.960 raising the concern.

00:45:30.020 saying,

00:45:30.980 hey,

00:45:31.740 maybe we shouldn't

00:45:32.480 be doing this.

00:45:33.540 I hope that will change.

00:45:35.280 I frankly expect

00:45:36.260 that to change,

00:45:37.460 but I haven't seen it yet.

00:45:41.500 We'll be right back.

00:45:43.060 First,

00:45:43.460 we wanted to give you

00:45:44.100 a sneak peek

00:45:44.860 at Jordan's new series,

00:45:46.400 Exodus.

00:45:52.360 The Hebrews

00:45:53.440 created history

00:45:54.880 as we know it.

00:45:57.220 You don't get away

00:45:58.240 with anything,

00:45:59.200 and so you might

00:45:59.800 think you can bend

00:46:00.680 the fabric of reality

00:46:01.740 and that you can

00:46:02.320 treat people instrumentally

00:46:03.540 and that you can

00:46:04.120 bow to the tyrant

00:46:05.080 and violate your conscience

00:46:06.300 without cost.

00:46:07.220 You will pay the piper.

00:46:08.580 It's going to call you

00:46:09.440 out of that slavery

00:46:10.260 into freedom,

00:46:11.600 even if that pulls you

00:46:12.900 into the desert.

00:46:16.920 And we're going to see

00:46:17.940 that there's something

00:46:18.720 else going on here

00:46:20.120 that is far more cosmic

00:46:21.680 and deeper

00:46:22.560 than what you can imagine.

00:46:24.060 The highest ethical spirit

00:46:27.060 spirit to which

00:46:28.120 we're beholden

00:46:29.140 is presented

00:46:30.380 precisely

00:46:31.180 as that spirit

00:46:32.620 that allies itself

00:46:34.000 with the cause

00:46:34.840 of freedom

00:46:35.440 against tyranny.

00:46:37.260 Yes, exactly.

00:46:38.360 I want villains

00:46:39.040 to get punished.

00:46:39.880 But do you want

00:46:40.400 the villains to learn

00:46:41.340 before they have

00:46:42.060 to pay the ultimate price?

00:46:43.220 That's such a

00:46:43.780 Christian question.

00:46:56.440 Well, you'd think

00:46:57.400 the lefties

00:46:58.100 would at least be

00:46:59.080 worried about

00:47:00.440 government,

00:47:01.680 corporate,

00:47:02.320 military,

00:47:03.000 industrial collusion.

00:47:04.720 Right, at minimum.

00:47:05.700 Now, we've seen

00:47:06.240 this weird shift

00:47:07.180 on the left, too,

00:47:08.040 because we've also seen

00:47:09.100 the left radically

00:47:10.060 support big pharma,

00:47:11.560 which is definitely

00:47:12.540 not something I ever

00:47:14.040 thought I would see

00:47:14.800 in my lifetime.

00:47:15.760 It's so utterly

00:47:16.400 preposterous.

00:47:17.360 But independent

00:47:18.500 of the other risks

00:47:19.620 that the war presents,

00:47:21.300 the risk of dumping

00:47:22.500 $113 billion

00:47:23.840 into the hands

00:47:25.020 of the corporate

00:47:25.800 part of the military

00:47:27.620 industrial complex,

00:47:28.780 you'd think,

00:47:29.420 would be something

00:47:29.940 that would raise 0.57

00:47:30.880 the hackles of,

00:47:31.980 let's say,

00:47:32.400 people like AOC

00:47:33.320 and Bernie Sanders.

00:47:34.500 And as you said,

00:47:35.560 there's been radio silence

00:47:36.820 on that front,

00:47:37.620 or perhaps even

00:47:38.500 the opposite of that,

00:47:39.540 like full-fledged

00:47:40.340 support for the,

00:47:41.220 you know,

00:47:42.180 the brave Ukrainian

00:47:43.980 Democrats,

00:47:45.220 those on the side

00:47:46.520 of democracy

00:47:47.120 in Ukraine,

00:47:47.740 let's say.

00:47:48.200 So that seems

00:47:48.780 a bit preposterous.

00:47:50.100 Now, you and I

00:47:50.960 also talked about

00:47:51.900 the fact that

00:47:52.740 there are material risks

00:47:54.940 in the escalation

00:47:56.000 of this war

00:47:56.880 to the integrity

00:47:58.240 of the American state.

00:48:00.320 You know,

00:48:00.600 you're not a big

00:48:01.440 government advocate,

00:48:02.360 and anytime there

00:48:03.740 is a war,

00:48:04.720 what you generally see

00:48:05.980 is not only

00:48:07.140 a tremendous amount

00:48:08.020 of tax money

00:48:08.800 dumped into the hands

00:48:09.900 of the corporate side

00:48:11.480 of the military-industrial

00:48:12.620 complex,

00:48:13.060 but a huge growth

00:48:14.180 in government bureaucracy

00:48:15.720 and overreach

00:48:16.480 that's very seldom

00:48:17.900 ruled back.

00:48:19.220 So what do you see

00:48:21.100 unfolding as a danger

00:48:24.000 on that front?

00:48:25.660 The modern nation-state,

00:48:27.160 by necessity,

00:48:28.500 when it fights wars,

00:48:31.300 it necessarily needs

00:48:32.700 to consolidate

00:48:33.400 as much power

00:48:34.240 as possible.

00:48:35.880 And so that concentration

00:48:36.900 of power tends

00:48:37.960 to cause the government

00:48:39.540 to become larger,

00:48:41.260 taxes to be more intrusive,

00:48:43.720 and I can use the word

00:48:45.220 taxes here broadly

00:48:46.420 because in the United States,

00:48:48.020 the way we finance

00:48:48.760 our government,

00:48:49.900 more government spending

00:48:51.000 ends up producing

00:48:52.240 a backdoor invisible tax

00:48:53.700 because we've just been

00:48:54.400 inflating our currency,

00:48:56.020 and people are making

00:48:58.800 the same amount of money,

00:49:00.380 but it buys less.

00:49:02.440 And once that happens

00:49:03.780 in order to fund a war,

00:49:05.740 when the war ends,

00:49:08.140 to the degree it ends,

00:49:09.880 government tends

00:49:10.660 not to recede.

00:49:11.780 The taxes tend to be in place,

00:49:14.060 at least for quite a while,

00:49:15.660 and the general levels

00:49:17.500 of government funding

00:49:18.460 might retreat some,

00:49:21.340 but never do they return

00:49:23.880 to pre-war levels.

00:49:25.220 There was a Harvard professor

00:49:26.280 named Roger Porter

00:49:27.140 who wrote a book about this

00:49:28.460 about 30 years ago

00:49:29.300 called War and the Rise of the State,

00:49:30.840 and I think we're seeing it

00:49:32.380 on display.

00:49:33.840 So, yeah,

00:49:34.480 that is another concern

00:49:35.700 is that as we do these things,

00:49:37.620 we become accustomed

00:49:38.840 to spending this much money

00:49:40.180 for Ukraine,

00:49:41.340 some of which is funneled

00:49:42.300 through this or that entity

00:49:44.000 within the State Department

00:49:45.200 or the USAID program

00:49:49.540 or some other program

00:49:51.000 through the Department of Defense.

00:49:53.820 Some of those funding levels

00:49:55.320 might go down,

00:49:56.900 but I doubt they will ever retreat

00:49:58.780 to the levels where they were

00:50:00.540 prior to this particular conflict.

00:50:03.040 And that's a deep concern.

00:50:04.200 It might also explain

00:50:05.180 why some progressives

00:50:06.260 are more inclined

00:50:07.160 to be supportive of this,

00:50:08.480 along with the fact

00:50:09.220 that it happens to be

00:50:09.940 their president,

00:50:10.660 a Democrat,

00:50:11.300 who's in office at the time.

00:50:12.620 If this were Trump doing this,

00:50:14.760 I can only imagine

00:50:16.200 many of them, at least,

00:50:18.960 would be calling

00:50:19.680 bloody horror over it.

00:50:21.940 Right.

00:50:22.620 Yeah, well,

00:50:23.080 Trump in his recent statements

00:50:24.580 has come out very bluntly,

00:50:28.260 because after all,

00:50:29.660 he is Trump,

00:50:30.500 on the war front,

00:50:32.000 claiming such things

00:50:33.020 as if he had been president,

00:50:35.900 this wouldn't have happened,

00:50:37.500 which I think

00:50:38.220 is a somewhat credible claim,

00:50:39.720 but also that

00:50:40.380 if he was president,

00:50:41.860 which is a non-zero possibility,

00:50:44.220 that he would end

00:50:45.100 the war in 24 hours.

00:50:46.580 You know,

00:50:47.320 and I'm not remarking on that

00:50:49.920 because I necessarily regard

00:50:51.960 the 24-hour claim as valid,

00:50:53.700 but I am remarking on it

00:50:55.140 because Trump has come out

00:50:57.240 very bluntly,

00:50:58.780 as opposed to this war,

00:51:00.900 and also highlighting its dangers.

00:51:03.420 And so that's

00:51:04.540 an interesting development.

00:51:06.040 I don't know what's happened

00:51:07.360 with the other people

00:51:08.440 who've thrown their hat

00:51:09.400 into the Republican primary ring

00:51:11.280 so far on the foreign policy front.

00:51:13.260 Do you have any sense of that?

00:51:15.220 They've been fairly quiet

00:51:16.640 on this war,

00:51:17.420 as far as I can tell.

00:51:18.400 I think he's the only one so far

00:51:20.100 who has raised a lot of concern

00:51:22.300 as bluntly as he did.

00:51:23.860 I believe Governor DeSantis

00:51:25.320 has expressed some concern with it.

00:51:28.800 I don't know exactly

00:51:30.160 how far he's delved into it,

00:51:32.040 but this is an early indication

00:51:34.500 of where I think

00:51:35.580 the Republican Party is going

00:51:36.880 to be expressing,

00:51:38.940 as Donald Trump

00:51:39.580 and Ron DeSantis

00:51:40.780 have both done,

00:51:42.700 expressing skepticism

00:51:43.800 about our involvement

00:51:44.900 in this conflict.

00:51:46.980 Okay, okay.

00:51:47.920 So let's go back

00:51:48.720 to the peace issue.

00:51:49.780 Now, because I've been trying

00:51:51.620 to figure out

00:51:52.300 what might constitute

00:51:53.600 the broad,

00:51:56.300 low-resolution outlines

00:51:57.760 of an acceptable stalemate

00:52:01.180 or even,

00:52:02.500 well, we could even aim

00:52:03.460 for a productive peace

00:52:04.660 with Russia over the long run

00:52:06.020 and with the Ukraine

00:52:07.500 integrally involved in that.

00:52:08.860 That would be a lovely

00:52:09.660 stretch goal, let's say.

00:52:11.380 But what you laid out

00:52:12.840 was something like

00:52:13.800 recognition of Russia's

00:52:16.060 dominion over Crimea.

00:52:18.160 And then, now,

00:52:19.360 so everyone who's watching

00:52:20.500 and listening knows

00:52:21.360 that in eastern Ukraine,

00:52:23.780 the majority of the population

00:52:25.860 are Russian native language speakers.

00:52:27.900 Now, Ukraine,

00:52:29.620 Ukrainian as a language,

00:52:31.100 is quite allied

00:52:32.600 semantically with Russia.

00:52:34.600 So, but there are

00:52:35.380 a lot of Russian speakers,

00:52:37.040 particularly in eastern Ukraine.

00:52:39.440 And the Russians have claimed

00:52:41.200 that they have been targeted,

00:52:43.820 they have been the targets

00:52:44.860 of persecution

00:52:45.740 for their linguistic

00:52:46.900 minority status

00:52:48.640 or within the broader Ukraine

00:52:51.260 and that that's been a problem

00:52:52.640 and that part of the reason

00:52:53.640 Russia made its incursions

00:52:55.500 into Ukraine

00:52:56.340 was to protect its,

00:52:57.920 people it really regarded

00:52:59.060 as citizens

00:53:00.540 in the broader sense.

00:53:02.060 Now, you posited that

00:53:03.360 one possibility

00:53:05.140 on the peace front

00:53:06.040 would not only be

00:53:06.960 the recognition

00:53:07.660 of the Russian

00:53:09.060 possession of Crimea,

00:53:11.300 which happened

00:53:11.840 about nine, ten years ago,

00:53:13.680 but also that

00:53:14.700 some of the territories

00:53:16.500 that are subject

00:53:17.240 more to territorial dispute

00:53:18.820 in the east

00:53:19.540 might be placed

00:53:22.060 on the negotiating table

00:53:23.480 with regards

00:53:24.080 to Russian sovereignty.

00:53:25.220 And you could imagine

00:53:25.820 a situation

00:53:26.540 where the deal was,

00:53:29.660 well, why don't we

00:53:30.820 open up the discussion

00:53:33.120 to something like

00:53:34.000 a true plebiscite 0.83

00:53:35.640 or referendum

00:53:36.640 and let the people

00:53:38.040 in those areas

00:53:38.900 vote for who they

00:53:40.780 would rather be allied with

00:53:42.600 and if the UN

00:53:44.320 could get its act together

00:53:45.560 and act something

00:53:46.540 like a true objective arbiter,

00:53:49.420 which strikes me

00:53:50.100 as highly unlikely

00:53:50.960 given the dysfunction

00:53:51.920 of the UN,

00:53:52.820 but in any case,

00:53:54.260 then the people

00:53:54.920 of the Donbass region,

00:53:56.340 for example,

00:53:57.000 could exercise

00:53:58.140 their right

00:53:58.820 to self-determination

00:54:00.060 and that could be part

00:54:01.800 of the negotiating strategy.

00:54:03.140 Now, do you think

00:54:04.560 that that tentative vision

00:54:08.560 of what might constitute

00:54:09.780 a peace plan,

00:54:10.620 do you think that that's,

00:54:12.520 to put forward

00:54:13.200 something like that

00:54:14.000 is indicative

00:54:14.560 of the kind of weakness

00:54:15.900 that might embolden Putin?

00:54:18.420 I mean, if we're trying

00:54:19.180 to be critical

00:54:19.740 about that notion?

00:54:21.540 It could perhaps

00:54:22.720 and as I said

00:54:24.320 when we talked about

00:54:25.020 that a few minutes ago,

00:54:25.960 this was speculation

00:54:27.100 that occurred

00:54:27.820 during the first two,

00:54:30.280 maybe three quarters

00:54:31.160 of 2022.

00:54:33.640 Speculation that that's,

00:54:35.080 that might be

00:54:35.680 where we ended up.

00:54:37.800 Speculation on that front

00:54:38.820 has died down since then,

00:54:40.820 particularly in the last

00:54:42.280 month or two.

00:54:44.020 As you've seen,

00:54:45.100 Ukraine making

00:54:46.120 increasingly bold,

00:54:48.460 sometimes unrealistically

00:54:49.980 bold assertions

00:54:51.180 about what it wants to do.

00:54:52.800 For example,

00:54:53.940 Ukraine has been talking

00:54:55.460 about the fact

00:54:56.080 that it now wants

00:54:57.380 to take back

00:54:58.800 Crimea completely

00:55:00.080 and it wants

00:55:01.500 to completely purge

00:55:03.080 all of Russia

00:55:03.840 from anything

00:55:05.160 that, you know,

00:55:05.920 until fairly recently

00:55:06.920 was considered Ukraine.

00:55:10.040 Most of my colleagues,

00:55:11.240 even those who are

00:55:12.100 very supportive

00:55:13.420 of this conflict

00:55:15.980 and of what we're doing

00:55:17.040 with regard to the conflict,

00:55:18.020 don't regard that

00:55:18.720 as realistic.

00:55:20.000 Russia is now 0.89

00:55:20.680 so heavily invested

00:55:22.220 in Crimea

00:55:22.940 that that seems unlikely.

00:55:25.140 I wouldn't want

00:55:26.320 to rule it out,

00:55:26.920 but my point is this.

00:55:27.960 Given how aggressive...

00:55:30.180 I think it's worth,

00:55:31.080 probably worth ruling out.

00:55:32.640 I mean,

00:55:33.120 there isn't a chance

00:55:34.160 that Russia will allow 0.95

00:55:35.720 Crimea to be retaken

00:55:37.360 by Ukraine

00:55:37.980 without pushing this

00:55:39.580 right to the brink.

00:55:40.720 Right.

00:55:41.180 I certainly don't see it.

00:55:42.860 And now that Ukraine 0.95

00:55:43.980 has been,

00:55:45.000 has gone into this posture

00:55:47.460 of being very aggressive,

00:55:48.620 talking about

00:55:49.060 taking back Crimea,

00:55:51.080 pushing them out

00:55:51.600 of the Donbass

00:55:52.300 and everywhere else,

00:55:53.280 and then sending tanks

00:55:54.560 to Moscow's Red Square.

00:55:56.000 If all of a sudden

00:55:57.620 Ukraine were to

00:55:59.600 do an about-face

00:56:00.800 and say,

00:56:01.480 okay, never mind,

00:56:02.820 we'll give you

00:56:03.520 recognition of Crimea,

00:56:05.420 now let's talk about

00:56:06.520 what else you would need

00:56:07.560 to do it,

00:56:08.400 perhaps Russia could see 0.62

00:56:09.620 that as a sign of weakness

00:56:10.720 and then become

00:56:12.080 further emboldened

00:56:13.000 in his efforts.

00:56:13.900 That's why I think

00:56:14.560 this is so unfortunate.

00:56:15.600 And I think one of the reasons

00:56:16.820 why Zelensky

00:56:18.180 has felt so comfortable

00:56:19.760 being so bold in this

00:56:20.900 is that he's seen

00:56:22.180 the gravy train,

00:56:23.560 he's seen the immense support

00:56:26.080 from the United States

00:56:27.080 and I guess somewhat

00:56:28.860 understandably

00:56:29.680 has assumed,

00:56:31.180 okay, they're with me.

00:56:32.660 I've got the world's

00:56:33.340 greatest superpower behind me

00:56:34.680 so I can afford

00:56:35.520 to be bold.

00:56:36.920 But being bold

00:56:37.860 in that circumstance

00:56:38.800 might just ultimately

00:56:40.920 work to everyone's

00:56:42.260 disadvantage.

00:56:44.360 Okay, so I want to

00:56:45.780 flip this now a bit

00:56:47.080 if you don't mind

00:56:47.880 into a more

00:56:48.500 metaphysical domain.

00:56:49.600 So I've been recently

00:56:51.820 completed a seminar

00:56:55.100 on the biblical

00:56:56.140 book of Exodus

00:56:57.120 with a group of scholars

00:56:59.100 in Miami

00:57:00.420 and that's available

00:57:02.240 on the Daily Wire Plus platform,

00:57:04.140 the first eight of those

00:57:05.160 and the last nine

00:57:05.960 will be released very soon.

00:57:07.360 And one of the things

00:57:08.640 we talked about

00:57:09.560 given that we were discussing

00:57:10.840 the book of Exodus

00:57:11.620 was the nature

00:57:13.200 and the meaning

00:57:14.460 of the Ten Commandments.

00:57:15.920 And one of the most

00:57:16.860 mysterious commandments

00:57:17.960 but also one that I think

00:57:19.600 is incredibly

00:57:20.660 germane at the moment

00:57:23.100 is do not take

00:57:24.060 the Lord's name in vain.

00:57:26.120 Now, you know,

00:57:27.240 skeptics listening

00:57:28.040 might say

00:57:28.760 why in the world

00:57:29.520 are we talking about

00:57:30.400 such arcane matters?

00:57:31.620 But the reason we are

00:57:32.640 is because

00:57:33.120 I think you can make

00:57:34.540 a very strong case

00:57:35.540 that the commandments

00:57:36.880 constitute part of the

00:57:38.840 set of implicit

00:57:40.640 and explicit

00:57:42.640 a priori axioms

00:57:44.520 that govern

00:57:45.300 the polity

00:57:47.240 of free western states.

00:57:50.080 And in any case,

00:57:51.720 there are elementary

00:57:52.460 moral rules.

00:57:53.340 That's one way

00:57:53.940 of thinking about it.

00:57:54.740 Do not murder,

00:57:55.720 for example.

00:57:56.480 That seems,

00:57:57.140 you know,

00:57:57.860 reasonable.

00:57:58.580 Do not envy

00:57:59.300 what your neighbor has.

00:58:01.360 So no covetousness

00:58:02.840 which would be a good thing

00:58:04.100 for envious people

00:58:05.000 to contemplate

00:58:05.840 for a very long

00:58:06.600 period of time.

00:58:07.240 But this

00:58:07.540 do not take

00:58:08.260 the Lord's name in vain

00:58:09.320 is a very interesting one

00:58:10.500 because people generally

00:58:11.820 think that means

00:58:13.580 don't swear.

00:58:15.520 You know, 0.99

00:58:15.760 don't say goddamn 0.99

00:58:16.640 or something like that. 0.99

00:58:18.040 And that isn't

00:58:18.720 what it means.

00:58:20.100 What it means is

00:58:21.500 do not assign

00:58:23.420 holy motivations

00:58:25.200 to things you're doing

00:58:28.280 for your own

00:58:29.100 nefarious purposes.

00:58:30.600 That's what it means.

00:58:31.740 And I think

00:58:32.540 that's the cardinal sin

00:58:34.100 of our time.

00:58:35.640 And that's

00:58:36.780 what people do

00:58:37.780 when they claim

00:58:38.580 unearned moral virtue.

00:58:40.820 So moral virtue

00:58:41.640 is very hard

00:58:42.260 to establish.

00:58:43.280 And you can take it

00:58:44.300 out of the religious domain

00:58:45.360 and say that

00:58:46.120 your moral virtue

00:58:47.320 is actually

00:58:48.020 the same

00:58:49.000 as your social reputation.

00:58:51.740 Now,

00:58:52.160 it's a little more

00:58:52.820 complicated than that.

00:58:53.860 But if you're

00:58:54.580 a good person

00:58:55.300 and you act

00:58:55.920 productively

00:58:56.680 and generously

00:58:57.320 and reciprocally,

00:58:58.680 then you get

00:58:59.260 a reputation

00:58:59.800 for doing so.

00:59:01.160 And that reputation

00:59:02.060 is of incredible value.

00:59:04.000 It means people

00:59:04.600 will trade with you.

00:59:05.720 They'll interact with you.

00:59:06.760 They'll trust you.

00:59:08.080 It means that

00:59:08.680 if you run a business

00:59:09.620 that your customers

00:59:10.980 regard you as reliable

00:59:12.260 and will spread your name

00:59:14.080 around in a positive way.

00:59:15.620 And that's brand value

00:59:17.800 fundamentally.

00:59:18.720 And every business person

00:59:19.780 knows how

00:59:20.460 integrally important

00:59:21.820 to their economic success

00:59:23.580 brand value is.

00:59:24.680 That's earned moral virtue.

00:59:26.740 Unearned moral virtue

00:59:27.800 is what you attempt

00:59:28.820 to garner

00:59:29.360 if you're

00:59:30.440 narcissistic, 1.00

00:59:32.480 psychopathic, 0.99

00:59:33.400 Machiavellian, 0.89

00:59:34.140 and sadistic.

00:59:35.120 And that's

00:59:35.660 the dark tetrad

00:59:36.760 group of personality traits.

00:59:39.400 And what I see

00:59:40.420 happening continually

00:59:41.400 on the political front

00:59:42.560 at the moment,

00:59:43.200 and I would say

00:59:43.740 this is particularly

00:59:44.600 the case on the left,

00:59:45.960 is that

00:59:46.380 there's a battle

00:59:47.600 for the acquisition

00:59:48.900 of as much

00:59:49.560 unearned moral virtue

00:59:50.900 as possible.

00:59:52.060 And I think

00:59:52.640 that's what's happening

00:59:53.500 in this situation

00:59:54.420 is that

00:59:55.000 we can collapse

00:59:56.340 the situation

00:59:57.160 in Russia, Ukraine

00:59:58.100 into this simple narrative

00:59:59.300 which you just described,

01:00:00.540 which is,

01:00:01.260 you know,

01:00:01.760 heroic Ukrainians

01:00:03.120 embattled 0.94

01:00:05.060 by demonic tyrant 0.62

01:00:07.200 supported by

01:00:08.500 equally heroic

01:00:09.780 allies,

01:00:11.420 those being the,

01:00:12.540 you know,

01:00:13.160 shallowly pro-war 0.91

01:00:15.500 Westerners.

01:00:16.900 And that's a good

01:00:18.140 distraction

01:00:18.820 for more serious issues.

01:00:20.380 You mentioned

01:00:20.840 the fentanyl crisis

01:00:21.860 and that's only

01:00:22.600 one of many things

01:00:23.620 that we might be

01:00:24.380 attending too carefully

01:00:25.380 if we were wise.

01:00:26.600 And it also enables

01:00:27.860 everyone to stand up

01:00:29.000 and wave flags

01:00:30.260 and be heroic

01:00:31.460 and virtuous

01:00:32.080 without doing

01:00:32.820 one bit

01:00:34.080 of the effort

01:00:34.760 necessary

01:00:35.320 to actually

01:00:35.940 undertake that

01:00:36.680 in their life.

01:00:37.460 And I think

01:00:38.080 that is a compelling

01:00:38.920 motivation

01:00:39.520 for the acceptance

01:00:41.620 of these

01:00:42.440 three-pixel narratives.

01:00:45.280 And so,

01:00:46.060 and that just seems

01:00:46.860 to be happening

01:00:47.480 continually.

01:00:48.360 And so,

01:00:48.760 we're walking

01:00:49.800 ourselves

01:00:50.540 ever more blindly

01:00:52.600 towards an,

01:00:53.580 what,

01:00:54.520 incalculable abyss

01:00:56.000 proclaiming

01:00:57.140 all the way

01:00:58.000 that we're only doing

01:00:59.720 what good people

01:01:00.600 would be doing

01:01:01.380 because after all,

01:01:02.440 we're the good people

01:01:03.420 and we have,

01:01:04.240 you know,

01:01:04.580 nobility,

01:01:05.660 democracy,

01:01:06.300 and God

01:01:06.680 on our side.

01:01:08.140 So,

01:01:09.260 what do you think

01:01:10.220 about that?

01:01:11.380 Well,

01:01:11.740 as,

01:01:12.160 I mean,

01:01:12.480 you're a religious man,

01:01:13.760 you're a metaphysical

01:01:15.000 thinker to some degree.

01:01:16.140 What do you think

01:01:16.700 about that

01:01:17.260 as a set

01:01:18.220 of metaphysical

01:01:18.960 presumptions?

01:01:19.720 Do you think

01:01:20.040 that bears any

01:01:20.760 relationship

01:01:21.220 to our current

01:01:21.960 circumstance?

01:01:23.020 Without question,

01:01:24.020 it does.

01:01:24.760 Look,

01:01:25.280 biblical teachings

01:01:26.060 and certainly

01:01:27.580 the Ten Commandments

01:01:28.760 are instructive.

01:01:30.760 They're anything

01:01:31.320 but arcane

01:01:32.520 or esoteric

01:01:33.900 or outdated

01:01:35.100 in addition to,

01:01:37.300 regardless of

01:01:38.140 one's religious

01:01:38.920 worldview.

01:01:40.820 Many of us

01:01:41.800 as religious people

01:01:42.740 also regard them

01:01:44.220 as eternal truths

01:01:45.220 that are important

01:01:46.640 to our eternal

01:01:47.860 progression

01:01:48.340 and salvation.

01:01:49.540 But even if you

01:01:50.280 didn't,

01:01:51.260 if you look

01:01:51.660 at those Ten Commandments,

01:01:52.900 including those

01:01:53.740 that you just described,

01:01:54.900 they also outline

01:01:56.960 a formula

01:01:58.080 for happiness

01:01:58.920 because they

01:02:00.540 prescribe the manner

01:02:01.680 in which you

01:02:02.400 interact with

01:02:03.400 your fellow human beings.

01:02:05.160 There's no more

01:02:06.080 evil that

01:02:07.320 can come from humans

01:02:08.700 than when they

01:02:09.360 view themselves

01:02:10.160 as virtuous

01:02:12.000 and their actions

01:02:13.920 in a particular

01:02:14.480 cause

01:02:15.040 as so

01:02:15.880 unmitigatedly

01:02:17.900 right

01:02:18.940 that everyone

01:02:20.020 else must be wrong.

01:02:21.300 And when they're

01:02:22.220 confronting

01:02:22.740 a fellow being

01:02:24.320 or multiple

01:02:25.880 fellow beings

01:02:26.620 or a huge

01:02:27.220 nation of them

01:02:28.460 as undeserving

01:02:30.300 of virtue,

01:02:31.540 there's no more

01:02:32.060 evil that can come

01:02:33.040 in this world

01:02:33.520 than when that

01:02:34.620 paradigm comes

01:02:36.120 into play,

01:02:36.980 when that contrast

01:02:37.780 comes into play.

01:02:39.020 And so that's

01:02:39.500 one of the reasons

01:02:40.280 why I had not

01:02:42.280 heard before

01:02:43.280 that particular

01:02:44.000 analysis of taking

01:02:44.960 the Lord's name

01:02:45.540 in vain.

01:02:46.420 When you add

01:02:47.320 that to other

01:02:48.180 commandments,

01:02:49.540 biblical commandments,

01:02:50.560 including covetousness,

01:02:52.460 for example,

01:02:54.160 admonitions against

01:02:55.420 theft,

01:02:56.000 against adultery,

01:02:56.900 against killing,

01:02:58.220 those all kind of

01:02:59.880 have a consistent

01:03:00.720 theme in them.

01:03:02.140 And so, yeah,

01:03:02.680 I think that

01:03:03.600 can come into play

01:03:05.020 in circumstances

01:03:05.600 like these.

01:03:06.400 In fact,

01:03:06.700 I think that's

01:03:07.260 what drives

01:03:07.880 most wars.

01:03:08.980 People start to

01:03:09.580 think of themselves

01:03:10.280 as virtuous,

01:03:11.760 assign immense,

01:03:13.320 unmitigated virtue

01:03:14.100 to their own cause,

01:03:15.820 and assign evil

01:03:17.180 to their adversary.

01:03:19.120 And that's how

01:03:19.540 people get involved

01:03:20.300 in massive conflicts.

01:03:21.300 My car needed repairs,

01:03:23.280 but I could only

01:03:23.840 pay for half of them.

01:03:25.200 An easy loan

01:03:25.840 through lamina.ca

01:03:26.880 made the difference

01:03:27.660 between stressed-out

01:03:28.500 driving and a

01:03:29.360 smooth ride to work.

01:03:30.660 Mark went the extra

01:03:31.480 mile on his repairs

01:03:32.520 with a loan

01:03:33.100 from Brokers Lamina

01:03:34.140 at 1-800-NEW-CREDIT.

01:03:35.960 It's easy to apply

01:03:36.900 over the phone

01:03:37.540 or online

01:03:38.320 at lamina.ca.

01:03:39.860 Load up to $1,500

01:03:41.260 and get funds

01:03:42.440 in an hour

01:03:42.980 with no documents

01:03:44.100 or credit checks

01:03:45.080 and pay back

01:03:45.900 over three to seven months.

01:03:47.500 Prop up your purchase

01:03:48.360 and apply for a loan

01:03:49.500 now at lamina.ca.

01:03:51.300 Mm-hmm.

01:03:53.280 Mm-hmm.

01:03:53.680 Yeah, well,

01:03:54.280 that's the two dimensions

01:03:55.740 of unearned moral virtue.

01:03:57.340 The first is

01:03:58.040 we're all good

01:04:00.400 without any effort,

01:04:02.200 and so that's

01:04:02.960 pretty damn convenient

01:04:03.960 because it actually

01:04:04.840 turns out to be

01:04:05.840 an extraordinarily

01:04:06.880 difficult endeavor

01:04:08.040 to actually be good

01:04:09.660 because the devil's

01:04:11.100 in the details

01:04:11.760 and you have to set

01:04:12.680 your house in order

01:04:13.600 from the levels

01:04:15.120 of the personal

01:04:16.360 all the way up

01:04:17.180 through the levels

01:04:17.760 of the social

01:04:18.460 to actually be good.

01:04:19.880 And that requires

01:04:21.180 a lifetime of commitment.

01:04:22.720 But also,

01:04:24.020 falling into that narrative

01:04:25.600 also gives you

01:04:26.440 a very convenient place

01:04:27.900 to put Satan himself.

01:04:29.480 So instead of having

01:04:30.320 to scrub your own conscience

01:04:31.740 and determine

01:04:32.720 where you might be,

01:04:34.020 let's say,

01:04:34.520 falling short

01:04:35.160 of the glory of God,

01:04:36.720 you can say,

01:04:37.500 well, no,

01:04:38.340 all the evil

01:04:39.160 is aggregated

01:04:40.440 conveniently

01:04:41.140 in the body

01:04:42.940 of our enemy

01:04:43.620 and this would be Putin

01:04:44.600 in this particular case.

01:04:45.680 you can heap

01:04:47.060 nothing but derisive

01:04:48.620 hellfire and scorn

01:04:50.000 upon him

01:04:50.480 and then you're

01:04:51.000 scot-free on that front too.

01:04:52.980 And so all of that's

01:04:53.680 a little too convenient.

01:04:54.820 I do think this interpretation,

01:04:56.460 by the way,

01:04:56.900 of taking the Lord's name

01:04:58.020 in vain,

01:04:58.460 I think it is

01:04:59.200 in keeping with

01:05:00.240 the original intent

01:05:01.100 of the formulators

01:05:01.960 of the commandments

01:05:02.700 because I've looked

01:05:03.920 at a lot of different

01:05:04.720 translations

01:05:05.320 and we beat this idea

01:05:06.640 to death

01:05:07.120 in this seminar

01:05:07.840 and this notion that,

01:05:10.620 well,

01:05:10.960 and it makes sense

01:05:12.020 conceptually too,

01:05:13.040 right?

01:05:13.220 I mean,

01:05:13.880 you can't imagine

01:05:14.800 that there could be

01:05:15.500 a greater evil

01:05:16.560 than doing the easy thing

01:05:18.820 for you

01:05:19.660 and then claiming

01:05:20.900 that that's actually

01:05:21.940 ordained by

01:05:23.100 omniscience,

01:05:24.580 omnipresence

01:05:25.200 and omnipotence itself.

01:05:27.360 That's right.

01:05:28.320 And I certainly think

01:05:30.160 your conclusion

01:05:31.500 makes a fair amount

01:05:32.800 of intuitive sense,

01:05:34.340 particularly if,

01:05:35.320 I don't understand you

01:05:36.320 to be saying

01:05:37.200 that blaspheming

01:05:38.960 is also not a bad thing.

01:05:40.260 I think blaspheming

01:05:41.440 desecrating

01:05:43.520 the name of God

01:05:44.620 is not something

01:05:46.100 that he smiles upon,

01:05:47.300 but I also think

01:05:48.220 there's a lot of truth

01:05:49.180 within what you're describing.

01:05:51.280 And this can come

01:05:53.500 into focus.

01:05:54.420 I like the framework

01:05:55.480 that you put together.

01:05:56.600 When you think about

01:05:57.240 something like

01:05:57.780 a national social credit score,

01:05:59.840 like what they've been

01:06:00.540 doing in China

01:06:01.200 or with an ESG score

01:06:04.060 as is starting to exist

01:06:05.760 in the corporate world,

01:06:07.100 if you can assign yourself

01:06:08.600 a number under something

01:06:10.200 that purports to be

01:06:11.140 an objective standard,

01:06:12.380 that can dramatically

01:06:14.560 accelerate the degree

01:06:16.320 to which you assign

01:06:17.340 virtue to yourself

01:06:18.420 and other people like you

01:06:20.080 and provide an equally

01:06:22.700 dangerous mechanism

01:06:24.660 by which you can assign

01:06:25.840 evil to others.

01:06:27.880 And that's why

01:06:28.900 it's so important

01:06:30.620 as long as we're

01:06:31.320 within the realm

01:06:32.300 of biblical teachings

01:06:33.460 to also remember

01:06:34.720 admonitions about,

01:06:36.500 you know,

01:06:37.580 looking first

01:06:38.640 to remove the beam

01:06:39.960 from your own eye

01:06:41.180 before trying to remove

01:06:42.220 the moat

01:06:42.700 from your neighbor's eye.

01:06:44.780 Right, right.

01:06:45.600 Yeah, well,

01:06:46.100 and I also think

01:06:47.520 that this easy moral virtue

01:06:50.480 that we're describing

01:06:51.540 does lift that burden

01:06:53.460 from people, right?

01:06:55.120 And I can understand

01:06:56.460 why people want

01:06:57.320 that burden lifted

01:06:58.600 because if it is

01:06:59.420 a beam in your eye

01:07:00.600 and a moat

01:07:01.480 and a beam,

01:07:02.200 by the way,

01:07:02.660 for people listening

01:07:03.480 is essentially a log

01:07:04.800 and the biblical injunction

01:07:06.940 there is

01:07:07.480 you might want

01:07:08.700 to be assured

01:07:10.120 to begin with

01:07:10.800 that you're a hell of a lot

01:07:11.720 blinder than you think

01:07:12.840 and that your assignation

01:07:14.640 of evil to nothing

01:07:15.820 but your opponents 0.99

01:07:16.580 is so unbelievably corrupt 0.99

01:07:18.520 on your part 0.98

01:07:19.180 that you can hardly imagine it.

01:07:20.580 And that's,

01:07:21.500 you know,

01:07:21.800 that's a very shocking thing

01:07:24.080 to realize in yourself

01:07:25.460 if you ever do realize that.

01:07:27.620 And it's no wonder

01:07:28.280 people want to avoid that.

01:07:29.620 But I really do think

01:07:30.880 it's the moral conundrum

01:07:31.900 of our time,

01:07:32.680 you know,

01:07:32.860 because you pointed out,

01:07:34.660 you talked about ESGs

01:07:35.940 and social credit scores

01:07:37.140 and so forth

01:07:37.820 because we're also doing

01:07:39.380 the same thing

01:07:40.280 on a broader,

01:07:42.200 on the broader

01:07:42.680 metaphysical front.

01:07:43.880 So, for example,

01:07:45.020 there is a panoply

01:07:46.120 of environmental

01:07:47.580 and economic concerns

01:07:49.320 that beset us.

01:07:51.420 For example,

01:07:52.360 we've overfished

01:07:53.120 the oceans terribly

01:07:54.140 and there's a variety

01:07:55.440 of things we're doing

01:07:56.180 environmentally

01:07:56.760 that are less than wise.

01:07:58.660 A multitude

01:07:59.320 of complex problems

01:08:01.320 that beset us.

01:08:02.860 That would require

01:08:03.780 some diligent effort

01:08:05.260 and sacrifice

01:08:05.980 to set right

01:08:06.900 as well as wading through

01:08:08.200 the cognitive complexity

01:08:09.640 necessary to actually

01:08:10.920 detail out the problems.

01:08:12.800 Something that people

01:08:13.600 like Bjorn Lomborg

01:08:14.600 are particularly good

01:08:15.500 at doing.

01:08:16.600 And instead,

01:08:17.180 what we do

01:08:17.700 is we collapse

01:08:18.540 all of the apocalyptic threats

01:08:20.580 into a single threat.

01:08:22.200 And so that's the threat

01:08:23.220 of environmental disaster.

01:08:25.100 We collapse

01:08:25.820 the multitudinous causes

01:08:27.540 of environmental disaster

01:08:29.200 into a single variable,

01:08:30.560 which is carbon.

01:08:31.380 And then we collapse

01:08:33.200 all the necessity

01:08:34.520 for pursuing moral virtue

01:08:36.540 into doing nothing

01:08:37.760 but being opposed

01:08:38.900 to carbon.

01:08:40.380 And then we proceed

01:08:41.380 merrily along our way.

01:08:43.100 And there's something

01:08:43.900 truly and catastrophically

01:08:47.340 dangerous about that,

01:08:48.900 particularly when

01:08:49.700 one of the consequences,

01:08:50.860 and we started to see

01:08:51.760 this unfold in Europe,

01:08:52.900 is that not only 1.00

01:08:53.760 do we put idiotic 1.00

01:08:55.620 virtue signaling policies 1.00

01:08:57.120 in place

01:08:57.820 that raise energy costs

01:09:00.400 for everyone,

01:09:01.900 falling most heavily

01:09:03.080 on the poor,

01:09:04.000 we make energy

01:09:05.080 much more unreliable

01:09:06.940 than it has been

01:09:07.800 in the past.

01:09:08.740 We increase

01:09:09.700 our dependence

01:09:10.400 on tyrants,

01:09:12.020 the tyrants

01:09:13.840 who control

01:09:14.360 the fossil fuel industry,

01:09:15.640 let's say,

01:09:16.040 outside of the West.

01:09:17.660 And we actually

01:09:19.420 increase the amount

01:09:20.880 of pollution

01:09:21.520 we're producing.

01:09:22.340 And so that's pretty much

01:09:24.000 failure on all fronts,

01:09:26.660 including those

01:09:27.680 defined by the people

01:09:29.040 who are putting forth

01:09:30.840 these propositions.

01:09:32.320 We see this

01:09:32.940 on the ESG front, too,

01:09:34.380 environment,

01:09:35.520 what is it,

01:09:36.740 social and governance.

01:09:38.280 This idea

01:09:38.960 that capitalists

01:09:40.180 have a moral,

01:09:42.420 what,

01:09:43.680 there's a moral imperative

01:09:44.720 for capitalists

01:09:45.840 to subsume

01:09:47.020 their capitalist enterprise

01:09:48.340 to a broader

01:09:49.820 stakeholder vision,

01:09:51.300 which is essentially

01:09:52.280 a vision of

01:09:53.580 state,

01:09:55.060 media,

01:09:56.480 and corporate

01:09:57.420 collusion,

01:09:58.540 and that virtue

01:09:59.400 is then defined

01:10:00.300 as that.

01:10:00.760 I see that happening

01:10:01.720 on the ESG front,

01:10:02.940 is that there are

01:10:04.120 no shortage of people

01:10:05.520 who've gamed

01:10:06.320 the capitalist system

01:10:07.660 out there.

01:10:08.600 Those are the sorts

01:10:09.220 of people that,

01:10:10.180 you know,

01:10:10.480 Russell Brand

01:10:11.140 and Joe Rogan

01:10:12.200 and Bernie Sanders

01:10:13.060 in his better moments

01:10:14.120 object to.

01:10:14.900 They've gamed 1.00

01:10:15.640 the damn system 1.00

01:10:16.580 100%. 1.00

01:10:17.520 They've accrued

01:10:18.420 a tremendous amount

01:10:19.280 of wealth

01:10:19.720 through mechanisms

01:10:20.860 that are essentially

01:10:21.720 corrupt,

01:10:22.280 they're guilty 1.00

01:10:23.140 as hell about it, 0.81

01:10:24.020 and now they're

01:10:24.440 looking for an easy

01:10:25.180 moral out.

01:10:26.680 And some of that's

01:10:27.900 genuine attempt

01:10:29.560 to deal

01:10:32.060 with the guilt

01:10:32.840 they actually have

01:10:33.960 and should have,

01:10:34.760 and some of it's

01:10:35.440 just for show,

01:10:36.640 but it's extraordinarily

01:10:37.800 dangerous.

01:10:38.580 We could make a

01:10:39.160 foray into that.

01:10:40.480 Was it yesterday

01:10:41.500 that a resolution

01:10:42.460 was passed?

01:10:44.340 Tell me about

01:10:45.240 the resolution

01:10:45.800 that was passed

01:10:46.420 with regard to

01:10:47.180 ESG policies

01:10:48.280 policies

01:10:48.920 in the Senate

01:10:50.220 and the House

01:10:50.940 yesterday,

01:10:51.560 right?

01:10:52.200 Yes.

01:10:52.660 So there was

01:10:53.440 regulation put out

01:10:54.820 by the Biden

01:10:55.840 administration

01:10:56.460 trying to

01:10:57.980 move ESG

01:10:59.380 forward

01:10:59.860 in the way

01:11:00.580 401k accounts,

01:11:02.320 retirement accounts

01:11:02.940 are managed.

01:11:04.060 And there is a process

01:11:05.160 under something called

01:11:05.920 the Congressional Review Act

01:11:07.040 that allows us to

01:11:08.120 pass a resolution

01:11:09.620 disapproving of it.

01:11:10.620 It's called

01:11:10.840 the Resolution of Disapproval.

01:11:12.660 That if passed

01:11:13.880 by both houses

01:11:14.620 and submitted

01:11:15.240 to the president,

01:11:16.060 unless it's vetoed

01:11:17.440 by the president,

01:11:18.560 then the regulation

01:11:20.760 in question

01:11:21.240 gets taken down.

01:11:22.520 So both houses

01:11:23.280 passed it

01:11:24.400 and it'll now

01:11:25.560 have the president's desk.

01:11:27.220 The president

01:11:27.640 is widely expected

01:11:28.660 to veto

01:11:30.120 that resolution

01:11:31.620 and we in all probability

01:11:32.960 with the virtual certainty

01:11:34.680 will not have

01:11:35.260 the two-thirds

01:11:35.800 supermajorities

01:11:36.580 in both houses

01:11:37.660 necessary to override

01:11:38.700 that veto. 0.96

01:11:39.920 This illustrates

01:11:40.920 a problem

01:11:41.540 within our system

01:11:42.320 of government

01:11:42.760 and that we've allowed

01:11:44.500 executive branch regulations

01:11:46.100 to make new law.

01:11:47.880 And then

01:11:48.200 the way

01:11:50.060 the Congressional Review Act

01:11:51.080 is written,

01:11:52.140 Congress has to undo it

01:11:53.760 with the acquiescence

01:11:54.840 of the same president

01:11:55.840 whose administration

01:11:57.160 put out the regulation

01:11:58.440 to begin with.

01:11:59.460 In our system

01:12:00.260 of government,

01:12:00.820 no one can make law.

01:12:02.000 You cannot make federal law

01:12:03.580 under Article I, Section 1

01:12:04.920 and Article I, Section 7

01:12:06.580 of the Constitution

01:12:07.540 without Congress

01:12:08.920 passing the same

01:12:09.900 piece of legislation

01:12:10.820 in the House

01:12:11.500 and of the Senate

01:12:12.640 and then present it

01:12:13.980 to the president.

01:12:15.060 So we need to flip that.

01:12:16.860 We need to take away

01:12:17.700 the ability

01:12:18.360 of the executive branch

01:12:20.020 to make new law,

01:12:21.020 new policy

01:12:21.920 tantamount to law

01:12:23.940 within the executive branch.

01:12:25.720 But this was a good exercise

01:12:27.280 with regard to ESG.

01:12:28.340 What we've signaled

01:12:29.000 is that a majority

01:12:29.940 of the House

01:12:30.440 and a majority

01:12:31.240 of the Senate

01:12:31.780 opposes ESG,

01:12:34.060 at least opposes

01:12:34.820 forcing ESG

01:12:36.340 onto the American economy

01:12:37.920 through things like this.

01:12:41.140 Okay, so just so people

01:12:42.500 who are listening

01:12:43.680 are clear about this.

01:12:44.920 So large companies,

01:12:47.100 Vanguard, BlackRock, etc.,

01:12:49.060 who aggregate pension funds

01:12:51.620 primarily,

01:12:52.980 but more than that.

01:12:53.980 So that would be

01:12:54.640 the pension funds

01:12:55.360 that all of you listening

01:12:56.420 and watching

01:12:57.360 are dependent on,

01:12:58.280 or almost all of you,

01:12:59.480 your own personal

01:13:00.320 pension investments.

01:13:01.220 they have decided

01:13:03.300 to subordinate

01:13:04.360 the interests

01:13:05.660 of the companies

01:13:06.660 whose enterprises

01:13:10.940 these funds

01:13:11.760 are invested in

01:13:12.800 to the demands

01:13:14.020 of the climate apocalypse,

01:13:16.640 essentially.

01:13:17.640 So the notion is,

01:13:18.820 well,

01:13:19.140 the environmental catastrophe

01:13:20.660 that besets us

01:13:21.720 is so severe

01:13:22.560 that mere fiduciary interest,

01:13:25.960 which would be

01:13:26.460 growing your pension,

01:13:27.340 is not sufficient.

01:13:28.500 You have to adopt 1.00

01:13:29.600 the net zero

01:13:32.280 Paris Accord goals

01:13:33.540 and your corporations

01:13:34.520 have to devote themselves

01:13:35.580 to that.

01:13:36.340 And then,

01:13:36.860 in addition,

01:13:37.560 it's not only

01:13:38.320 on the environmental front,

01:13:39.920 it's also on the social front,

01:13:42.080 which means that corporations

01:13:43.320 have to buy into

01:13:44.340 the entire diversity,

01:13:46.080 equity,

01:13:46.500 and inclusivity movement,

01:13:47.880 which is essentially

01:13:48.660 a radical left-wing movement,

01:13:50.180 or they're not doing

01:13:51.240 their duty properly

01:13:52.580 at the highest moral level.

01:13:54.440 Now,

01:13:54.740 the problem with that

01:13:55.840 is that

01:13:56.500 the responsibility

01:13:59.040 of investment funds

01:14:00.620 is to grow the,

01:14:02.120 is to preserve

01:14:02.980 and grow

01:14:04.260 the investments

01:14:05.620 of the people

01:14:06.500 who are,

01:14:07.780 for example,

01:14:08.300 going to be dependent

01:14:09.060 on their pensions,

01:14:09.880 and that that shouldn't

01:14:10.700 be subordinated

01:14:11.560 to any other interest.

01:14:13.200 Now,

01:14:13.520 the ESG pushers

01:14:14.720 have said,

01:14:15.240 oh, look,

01:14:15.660 we can have our cake

01:14:16.460 and eat it too,

01:14:17.100 because if we invest

01:14:18.780 responsibly,

01:14:20.760 whatever the hell

01:14:21.380 that means,

01:14:22.260 we're actually going

01:14:23.100 to see greater returns.

01:14:24.780 Now,

01:14:24.920 there's no empirical evidence

01:14:26.140 for that whatsoever.

01:14:27.320 In fact,

01:14:27.720 the CEO of Vanguard

01:14:29.020 in the last two weeks,

01:14:31.200 Vanguard was doing,

01:14:32.560 was pushing the ESG cart

01:14:35.180 assiduously,

01:14:36.420 just like BlackRock.

01:14:37.460 The Vanguard CEO

01:14:38.300 came out and said

01:14:39.380 that there's no evidence

01:14:41.420 whatsoever

01:14:41.980 that ESG investment

01:14:43.280 outperforms

01:14:44.500 non-ESG investment

01:14:45.860 over any stretch of time.

01:14:47.880 And so,

01:14:48.260 that whole story

01:14:49.220 is starting to fall apart,

01:14:50.340 but people should pay

01:14:51.480 very close attention

01:14:52.380 to this,

01:14:52.840 because your financial future

01:14:54.540 is at stake here.

01:14:55.420 The ESG pushers,

01:14:58.640 Vanguard,

01:14:59.920 somewhat less so now,

01:15:01.140 BlackRock,

01:15:02.020 State Street,

01:15:02.700 et cetera,

01:15:03.740 own 25%

01:15:05.880 of the biggest

01:15:06.920 500 companies

01:15:08.200 in the U.S.

01:15:09.000 These are

01:15:09.680 major league players.

01:15:11.980 And so,

01:15:12.380 the fact that

01:15:13.080 they're

01:15:13.680 gerrymandering

01:15:14.660 their financial

01:15:16.640 responsibility

01:15:17.500 in a very crooked

01:15:18.500 and underhanded way,

01:15:19.880 aggregating the votes

01:15:21.040 of all their

01:15:21.580 individual shareholders

01:15:22.760 into their own hands

01:15:24.160 into their own hands

01:15:24.180 and using that

01:15:24.900 to warp and dement

01:15:26.520 the structure

01:15:27.180 of the market.

01:15:28.240 This has real-world

01:15:29.260 consequences

01:15:29.980 for virtually everyone

01:15:31.700 or anyone

01:15:32.680 who has a pension.

01:15:34.260 We might as well

01:15:34.780 just go with that

01:15:35.700 and certainly

01:15:36.620 many, many investors

01:15:37.700 other than that.

01:15:39.080 And so,

01:15:39.620 that's another example

01:15:40.860 of this,

01:15:41.700 the pathology

01:15:42.500 of this proclivity

01:15:43.580 to pursue

01:15:44.320 unnerved moral virtue.

01:15:45.360 You have these

01:15:46.420 great fund managers

01:15:48.100 who are guilty

01:15:49.140 about their crookedness

01:15:50.540 and so they're

01:15:51.560 trying to atone

01:15:52.380 in a false way

01:15:53.280 by pretending

01:15:55.040 to ally

01:15:55.780 with this radical

01:15:56.760 leftist narrative

01:15:57.720 which is insanely

01:15:58.940 preposterous

01:15:59.720 to begin with.

01:16:00.760 They're doing that

01:16:01.420 in a way

01:16:01.760 that's destructive

01:16:02.620 to the financial

01:16:03.600 interests of the people

01:16:04.540 they're supposed

01:16:05.020 to serve.

01:16:06.420 And they're doing

01:16:07.840 that,

01:16:08.800 well,

01:16:09.820 instead of doing

01:16:10.540 the hard work

01:16:11.100 of actually trying

01:16:11.780 to put their

01:16:12.240 moral houses

01:16:13.020 in order.

01:16:13.960 Anyways,

01:16:14.260 that was pushed

01:16:15.080 back against

01:16:15.760 a bit

01:16:16.780 in the last week

01:16:18.200 by,

01:16:18.580 now how many

01:16:19.160 Democrats

01:16:19.620 were in favor

01:16:20.440 of the disapproval

01:16:21.980 measure?

01:16:22.800 In the Senate

01:16:23.440 I think it was

01:16:24.200 two or three.

01:16:25.780 I'm going to have

01:16:26.420 to check the

01:16:26.900 final vote tally.

01:16:27.940 I believe there

01:16:28.540 were two or three

01:16:29.220 as of the moment

01:16:30.260 I voted

01:16:30.740 who were with us

01:16:32.160 on that one.

01:16:32.780 And I'm not sure

01:16:34.120 about in the House

01:16:34.660 of Representatives

01:16:35.140 I assume there were

01:16:35.880 a small handful

01:16:36.520 over there as well.

01:16:37.960 But the...

01:16:38.840 Right,

01:16:39.060 but there were some

01:16:39.940 which is very interesting.

01:16:41.540 Yes.

01:16:41.820 There were any.

01:16:43.300 Right.

01:16:43.520 And so they're

01:16:44.960 seeing this thing

01:16:45.600 that you're describing

01:16:47.120 which is that

01:16:48.260 these fund managers

01:16:50.240 are subverting

01:16:51.500 the interests

01:16:52.220 of investors

01:16:52.940 from truck drivers

01:16:54.380 to teachers

01:16:54.980 from surgeons

01:16:57.420 to service station

01:16:58.620 attendants.

01:16:59.840 People who have

01:17:00.760 put their retirement

01:17:01.760 money into a fund

01:17:03.060 and are expecting

01:17:04.060 a return

01:17:04.540 are getting less

01:17:05.240 of a return

01:17:05.720 than they would

01:17:06.200 otherwise get

01:17:06.840 because they're

01:17:07.580 betraying their

01:17:08.140 fiduciary obligation.

01:17:09.260 But do not fear.

01:17:11.400 They probably say

01:17:12.360 to themselves

01:17:12.940 we're virtuous.

01:17:14.120 They assign

01:17:14.600 this unearned

01:17:15.720 moral virtue

01:17:16.500 to themselves

01:17:17.160 in doing it

01:17:17.700 and therefore say

01:17:18.560 not only is it

01:17:19.600 not wrong for us

01:17:20.340 to do this

01:17:20.800 it would be wrong

01:17:21.420 for us not to do this

01:17:22.840 and people who don't

01:17:23.600 do this

01:17:24.020 are themselves wrong

01:17:25.300 and so we must 0.99

01:17:26.280 crush them. 0.98

01:17:27.040 That's what ESG 0.70

01:17:27.920 is about.

01:17:28.680 It's not just about

01:17:29.520 them wanting

01:17:30.040 to assign virtue

01:17:31.040 to themselves

01:17:31.600 it's about

01:17:32.340 wanting to crush

01:17:33.400 anyone who doesn't 0.98

01:17:34.380 do that.

01:17:34.900 You see if

01:17:35.240 because if you

01:17:35.860 don't crush them

01:17:36.600 then they will

01:17:38.060 beat you

01:17:39.120 in the competitive race

01:17:40.180 because they understand

01:17:41.580 that what they're

01:17:42.180 doing is not

01:17:44.640 going to make

01:17:45.560 them competitive

01:17:46.200 in the free

01:17:46.800 marketplace of ideas.

01:17:48.520 Right.

01:17:49.140 Now you tangled up

01:17:50.180 the Chinese social

01:17:51.080 credit system

01:17:51.860 in this discussion

01:17:52.720 and so I figure

01:17:53.460 we should unpack

01:17:54.500 and elaborate on that.

01:17:55.840 So one of the things

01:17:57.400 that gives a company

01:17:59.820 competitive advantage

01:18:01.200 for example

01:18:01.900 with regards to

01:18:02.800 being prioritized

01:18:04.800 for loans

01:18:05.460 under the ESG

01:18:06.380 framework

01:18:06.840 is that they regulate

01:18:08.960 their activities

01:18:10.420 so that they

01:18:11.140 minimize such things

01:18:12.400 as their carbon

01:18:13.200 footprint

01:18:13.860 their so-called

01:18:14.740 carbon footprint

01:18:15.520 and they abide

01:18:16.640 by these diversity

01:18:17.860 equity and

01:18:18.900 inclusivity mandates

01:18:20.040 that are

01:18:20.600 radically leftist

01:18:22.900 in the most

01:18:23.780 fundamental manner

01:18:24.720 and people still

01:18:26.040 might say

01:18:26.520 well you know

01:18:26.960 I don't have time

01:18:27.720 to think about this

01:18:28.680 even if it has

01:18:29.740 to do with my pension

01:18:30.780 but what people

01:18:31.860 should think about

01:18:32.640 is that this is

01:18:33.300 going to start

01:18:33.800 to affect them

01:18:34.600 personally

01:18:35.100 on the personal

01:18:36.600 front very very

01:18:37.500 rapidly

01:18:37.940 because if

01:18:39.040 corporations are

01:18:40.260 held to account

01:18:41.980 on the moral

01:18:42.780 front

01:18:43.320 for their

01:18:44.660 environmental

01:18:46.360 footprint

01:18:47.060 let's say

01:18:47.960 and their

01:18:48.940 failure to comply

01:18:50.500 with the radically

01:18:51.340 leftist dictates

01:18:52.780 of the DEI

01:18:53.860 apparatus

01:18:54.900 there's no reason

01:18:56.200 at all to assume

01:18:56.980 that that's not

01:18:57.640 going to be

01:18:58.460 extended to

01:18:59.340 typical citizens

01:19:00.680 and the probability

01:19:01.940 is very high

01:19:02.740 that it's going

01:19:03.340 to be

01:19:03.660 so for example

01:19:04.600 if we put

01:19:06.340 in place

01:19:06.900 digital currencies

01:19:07.800 which we're

01:19:08.580 trying to do

01:19:09.620 very diligently

01:19:10.700 at the moment

01:19:11.380 and that's

01:19:11.740 already happened

01:19:12.340 to some degree

01:19:13.020 in the form

01:19:13.520 of credit cards

01:19:14.340 because they're

01:19:15.300 a digital currency

01:19:16.120 of sorts

01:19:16.700 then what will

01:19:18.020 happen

01:19:18.420 and this is

01:19:18.980 already happening

01:19:19.580 in places

01:19:20.000 like China 0.66

01:19:20.620 is that all

01:19:21.700 of your

01:19:22.060 individual spending

01:19:23.320 is going to

01:19:23.940 be assessed

01:19:24.560 for its

01:19:25.160 concordance

01:19:25.880 with these

01:19:26.840 apocalyptic

01:19:27.580 environmental goals

01:19:29.240 and your

01:19:29.900 compliance

01:19:30.420 with such

01:19:31.460 things as

01:19:32.040 DEI

01:19:32.860 as the

01:19:33.540 DEI

01:19:34.220 ethos

01:19:35.200 and that

01:19:35.640 if you

01:19:36.220 don't abide

01:19:37.420 by those

01:19:38.020 norms

01:19:38.420 you will be

01:19:39.600 punished

01:19:40.060 but through

01:19:40.840 taxation

01:19:41.560 first of all

01:19:43.700 through moral

01:19:44.340 warnings

01:19:44.780 but then

01:19:45.360 through taxation

01:19:46.220 that's as certain

01:19:47.060 as the sun

01:19:48.100 will rise

01:19:48.680 tomorrow

01:19:49.100 and

01:19:49.880 there are

01:19:51.180 already plans

01:19:51.840 afoot

01:19:52.160 in all sorts

01:19:52.780 of different

01:19:53.240 domains

01:19:53.760 on the

01:19:55.040 international

01:19:55.520 governance

01:19:56.080 front

01:19:56.460 to ensure

01:19:57.400 that consumers

01:19:58.100 do bear

01:19:58.760 the brunt

01:19:59.220 of their

01:19:59.720 anti-environment

01:20:01.280 consuming

01:20:02.100 decisions

01:20:02.800 and that'll

01:20:03.560 mean less

01:20:04.060 meat

01:20:04.420 it'll mean

01:20:04.880 lower number

01:20:05.720 of calories

01:20:06.260 per day

01:20:06.860 it'll mean

01:20:07.660 something

01:20:08.060 approximating

01:20:08.860 rationing

01:20:09.500 because that's

01:20:10.020 already being

01:20:10.500 contemplated

01:20:11.120 in places

01:20:11.520 like the UK

01:20:12.240 it'll certainly

01:20:13.300 mean radical

01:20:14.520 limitations

01:20:15.180 on private

01:20:15.840 transportation

01:20:16.400 ownership

01:20:17.080 whether that's

01:20:18.180 a gas

01:20:19.240 fossil fuel

01:20:20.080 powered car

01:20:20.780 or an electric

01:20:21.680 car

01:20:22.100 because people

01:20:22.980 who are pushing

01:20:23.600 this already

01:20:24.160 know that we

01:20:24.800 don't have the

01:20:25.320 power grid

01:20:25.820 to support

01:20:26.480 widespread

01:20:27.160 distribution

01:20:27.900 of electric

01:20:28.500 vehicles

01:20:28.940 it'll mean

01:20:29.720 that you won't

01:20:30.380 be able to

01:20:30.760 travel by air

01:20:31.640 except

01:20:32.100 insofar as

01:20:33.200 you don't

01:20:34.000 exceed your

01:20:34.600 quota for

01:20:35.160 air travel

01:20:35.780 and people

01:20:36.620 might think

01:20:37.080 that's all

01:20:37.560 conspiratorial

01:20:38.400 but they

01:20:38.760 could go

01:20:39.100 and do

01:20:39.620 their own

01:20:39.980 research

01:20:40.380 and find

01:20:40.820 out very

01:20:41.240 rapidly

01:20:41.640 that it's

01:20:42.100 not

01:20:42.300 conspiratorial

01:20:43.120 at all

01:20:43.600 and so

01:20:44.880 that's all

01:20:45.660 part of

01:20:46.140 this problem

01:20:46.740 of the

01:20:47.280 demand

01:20:47.840 by the

01:20:48.460 top-down

01:20:49.100 globalist

01:20:49.800 utopian

01:20:50.280 types

01:20:50.700 to accrue

01:20:51.300 to themselves

01:20:51.840 unearned

01:20:52.360 moral virtue

01:20:53.020 it's like

01:20:53.920 we're going

01:20:54.460 to regulate

01:20:54.880 your behavior

01:20:55.820 to assuage

01:20:57.120 our guilt

01:20:57.980 and that's

01:20:59.060 that is an

01:21:00.000 absolutely

01:21:00.620 appalling

01:21:01.260 sin

01:21:02.400 let's say

01:21:03.240 to put it

01:21:03.680 very bluntly

01:21:04.480 and so

01:21:05.060 it was

01:21:05.280 heartening

01:21:05.680 to see

01:21:06.100 that some

01:21:06.860 Democrats

01:21:07.360 even are

01:21:08.000 starting to

01:21:08.500 alert themselves

01:21:09.260 to the fact

01:21:09.860 that this

01:21:10.760 might not

01:21:11.280 be in

01:21:11.640 anyone's

01:21:12.140 interest

01:21:12.580 our entire

01:21:13.680 system

01:21:14.180 is built

01:21:15.620 up on

01:21:16.280 the idea

01:21:16.880 in fact

01:21:17.600 the American

01:21:18.060 experience

01:21:18.540 from the

01:21:18.920 beginning

01:21:19.240 has been

01:21:19.680 built

01:21:19.920 around

01:21:20.120 the idea

01:21:20.580 that

01:21:20.820 dangerous

01:21:21.340 things

01:21:22.480 happen

01:21:23.000 with the

01:21:24.080 excessive

01:21:24.420 accumulation

01:21:24.940 of power

01:21:25.520 in the

01:21:25.760 hands

01:21:25.940 of the

01:21:26.140 few

01:21:26.340 that's

01:21:27.080 true

01:21:27.360 in

01:21:27.560 government

01:21:27.920 especially

01:21:28.460 it also

01:21:29.840 has its

01:21:30.360 own

01:21:30.520 manifestations

01:21:31.140 in the

01:21:32.420 business

01:21:32.740 world

01:21:33.120 that's

01:21:33.520 why

01:21:33.740 American

01:21:34.320 antitrust

01:21:34.900 laws

01:21:35.220 are built

01:21:35.660 up

01:21:35.840 around

01:21:36.380 consumer

01:21:37.300 protection

01:21:37.780 they're built

01:21:38.280 up around

01:21:38.920 ensuring

01:21:39.420 consumer

01:21:40.000 choice

01:21:40.400 because

01:21:40.760 when

01:21:41.000 consumers

01:21:41.420 have

01:21:41.680 options

01:21:42.140 there's

01:21:42.800 competition

01:21:43.320 and

01:21:43.520 competition

01:21:43.960 tends

01:21:44.320 to bring

01:21:44.720 down

01:21:45.000 prices

01:21:45.400 and

01:21:45.880 increase

01:21:46.380 quality

01:21:47.000 when

01:21:48.160 any

01:21:48.540 of those

01:21:48.840 things

01:21:49.100 are

01:21:49.380 destroyed

01:21:49.820 that is

01:21:50.740 when

01:21:50.980 the

01:21:51.200 levers

01:21:52.060 we have

01:21:52.400 in place

01:21:52.760 to control

01:21:53.520 to protect

01:21:54.600 us

01:21:54.840 against

01:21:55.280 the

01:21:55.500 dangerous

01:21:55.820 accumulation

01:21:56.260 of power

01:21:56.740 either in

01:21:57.600 government

01:21:57.960 or in

01:21:59.240 business

01:21:59.720 the

01:22:01.220 common

01:22:01.880 man

01:22:02.280 and the

01:22:02.520 common

01:22:02.760 woman 0.99

01:22:03.120 suffers

01:22:03.740 and

01:22:05.100 ultimately

01:22:05.580 all of

01:22:06.080 society

01:22:06.500 suffers

01:22:06.960 what you

01:22:07.920 have

01:22:08.160 with the

01:22:08.460 ESG

01:22:08.840 movement

01:22:09.160 is

01:22:09.400 something

01:22:09.640 that could 0.68

01:22:10.140 easily

01:22:10.700 combine

01:22:11.540 the

01:22:12.460 worst

01:22:13.620 of the

01:22:14.080 accumulation

01:22:14.700 of power

01:22:15.140 in business

01:22:15.820 and the

01:22:16.320 accumulation

01:22:16.680 of power

01:22:17.160 in government

01:22:17.680 into one

01:22:18.320 so

01:22:19.180 they understand

01:22:20.620 that

01:22:21.140 they're

01:22:22.300 running

01:22:22.640 working

01:22:23.440 against the

01:22:23.840 clock

01:22:24.040 they're

01:22:24.540 on a

01:22:25.100 collision

01:22:25.660 course

01:22:26.060 with reality

01:22:26.760 unless

01:22:27.480 they can

01:22:27.960 somehow

01:22:28.220 get

01:22:28.480 government

01:22:28.860 to strap

01:22:30.100 on

01:22:30.520 the

01:22:31.060 ESG

01:22:31.980 effort

01:22:32.640 and to

01:22:33.400 make it

01:22:33.760 the

01:22:33.940 government's

01:22:34.320 own

01:22:34.580 because

01:22:35.780 otherwise

01:22:36.260 ESG

01:22:37.220 and the

01:22:37.520 United States

01:22:38.040 could face

01:22:38.560 a demise

01:22:39.100 as a result

01:22:39.660 of antitrust

01:22:40.380 actions

01:22:40.860 because

01:22:41.300 ultimately

01:22:41.780 the ESG

01:22:42.500 agreements

01:22:43.040 presuppose

01:22:45.340 agreements

01:22:46.080 not to

01:22:46.720 compete

01:22:47.140 you've got

01:22:48.240 entities

01:22:48.540 saying

01:22:48.740 we're not

01:22:49.080 going to

01:22:49.420 compete

01:22:49.740 in this

01:22:50.240 way

01:22:50.540 for these

01:22:51.160 customers

01:22:51.560 let's all

01:22:52.060 agree

01:22:52.280 that we're

01:22:52.540 not going

01:22:52.860 to do

01:22:53.120 that

01:22:53.300 and exclude

01:22:53.960 anyone

01:22:54.180 who doesn't

01:22:54.660 that's

01:22:55.560 illegal

01:22:55.980 in fact

01:22:56.400 that carries

01:22:56.940 potentially

01:22:57.400 criminal

01:22:57.920 penalties

01:22:58.620 under our

01:22:59.120 antitrust

01:22:59.540 laws

01:22:59.900 and then

01:23:01.660 they could

01:23:02.040 also face

01:23:02.580 lawsuits

01:23:03.140 from shareholders

01:23:04.020 whose value

01:23:05.340 has been

01:23:05.800 diminished

01:23:06.220 as a result

01:23:06.900 of a

01:23:07.240 betrayal

01:23:07.640 of their

01:23:08.420 fiduciary

01:23:08.980 obligation

01:23:09.580 to their

01:23:10.060 investors

01:23:10.460 both of

01:23:12.240 those things

01:23:12.680 could find

01:23:13.640 their antidote

01:23:14.440 in government

01:23:15.140 again taking

01:23:16.200 on the

01:23:16.880 the

01:23:17.880 the aura

01:23:18.880 taking on

01:23:19.620 the objective

01:23:20.420 of ESG

01:23:21.440 and mandating it

01:23:22.740 through reporting

01:23:23.420 requirements

01:23:24.200 immunizing it

01:23:25.420 in one way

01:23:25.980 or another

01:23:26.320 refusing to

01:23:27.260 to go

01:23:28.920 after people

01:23:29.580 who have

01:23:30.000 engaged in

01:23:30.680 agreements

01:23:31.060 not to

01:23:31.420 compete

01:23:31.720 and that's

01:23:32.400 why this

01:23:32.660 vote yesterday

01:23:33.160 was so

01:23:33.520 important

01:23:33.920 it was

01:23:34.960 one of

01:23:35.280 the first

01:23:35.700 volleys

01:23:36.880 in the war

01:23:37.900 about

01:23:38.340 incorporating

01:23:39.020 ESG

01:23:39.560 into government

01:23:40.140 strapping it

01:23:40.700 on the

01:23:41.120 apparatus of

01:23:41.700 government

01:23:41.960 and forcing

01:23:42.580 it on

01:23:42.840 the American

01:23:43.220 people

01:23:43.600 even though

01:23:44.500 it is likely

01:23:44.960 to be

01:23:45.300 vetoed

01:23:45.860 I think

01:23:46.580 that veto

01:23:47.300 is going

01:23:49.300 to lead

01:23:49.740 to a lot

01:23:50.480 of change

01:23:50.900 because I

01:23:51.200 think a lot

01:23:51.700 of Americans

01:23:52.180 are tired

01:23:52.720 of this

01:23:53.020 thing

01:23:53.240 people

01:23:54.100 who in

01:23:54.820 the past

01:23:55.160 maybe even

01:23:55.900 voted

01:23:56.300 consistently

01:23:56.920 democratic

01:23:57.480 are being

01:23:58.420 frustrated

01:23:58.800 by this

01:23:59.240 as well

01:23:59.580 they should

01:23:59.920 be

01:24:00.160 so over

01:24:02.460 what time

01:24:03.180 span

01:24:03.640 is this

01:24:04.200 process

01:24:04.680 going to

01:24:05.220 unfold

01:24:05.740 I think

01:24:06.840 it will

01:24:07.040 happen

01:24:07.300 over the

01:24:07.600 next

01:24:07.780 two

01:24:08.000 years

01:24:08.320 I think

01:24:09.040 it will

01:24:09.200 end up

01:24:09.480 being a

01:24:09.960 big

01:24:10.280 topic

01:24:11.480 of

01:24:11.700 discussion

01:24:12.240 between

01:24:13.500 Governor

01:24:14.280 DeSantis

01:24:14.740 President

01:24:15.140 Trump

01:24:15.500 and the

01:24:15.760 other

01:24:15.920 Republicans

01:24:16.320 running

01:24:16.640 for

01:24:16.840 president

01:24:17.100 I think

01:24:17.320 all of

01:24:18.260 them

01:24:18.380 are going

01:24:18.580 to latch

01:24:18.880 onto

01:24:19.120 this

01:24:19.360 and present

01:24:19.740 it to

01:24:19.960 the American

01:24:20.340 people

01:24:20.620 as hey

01:24:20.920 we know

01:24:21.640 you don't

01:24:21.880 want this

01:24:22.320 we know

01:24:23.080 you don't

01:24:23.680 want your

01:24:24.000 entire fate

01:24:24.580 decided by

01:24:25.180 this awful

01:24:26.120 combination

01:24:26.660 of a few

01:24:27.180 big corporate

01:24:27.800 titans

01:24:28.220 on Wall

01:24:28.640 Street

01:24:28.860 and

01:24:29.800 a small

01:24:30.620 handful

01:24:31.040 of

01:24:31.780 executive

01:24:32.480 branch

01:24:32.860 bureaucrats

01:24:33.480 in

01:24:33.640 Washington

01:24:34.000 so

01:24:34.740 let's

01:24:35.420 do it

01:24:35.640 a different

01:24:35.920 way

01:24:36.140 let's

01:24:36.400 let the

01:24:36.700 free

01:24:36.880 market

01:24:37.120 work

01:24:37.480 and let's

01:24:38.180 let's

01:24:38.720 let our

01:24:38.960 system

01:24:39.220 of

01:24:39.360 government

01:24:39.560 work

01:24:39.840 so that

01:24:40.240 power

01:24:40.820 isn't

01:24:41.180 dangerously

01:24:41.700 combined

01:24:42.160 in the

01:24:42.400 hands

01:24:42.580 of the

01:24:42.780 few

01:24:43.000 right

01:24:44.340 well

01:24:44.580 that's

01:24:44.880 a true

01:24:45.180 fascism

01:24:45.900 that

01:24:46.280 union

01:24:46.920 corporate

01:24:47.720 and

01:24:48.160 government

01:24:48.580 and media

01:24:49.200 interests

01:24:49.680 at the

01:24:50.060 very

01:24:50.280 pinnacle

01:24:50.680 of power

01:24:51.280 it's

01:24:51.840 what

01:24:51.960 fascism

01:24:52.420 means

01:24:52.720 it's

01:24:53.000 the

01:24:53.160 definition

01:24:53.780 right

01:24:54.100 well

01:24:54.260 if

01:24:55.260 Antifa

01:24:55.880 was

01:24:56.220 the real

01:24:56.660 thing

01:24:57.020 that's

01:24:57.360 what

01:24:57.520 they

01:24:57.700 would

01:24:57.900 be

01:24:58.120 opposing

01:25:00.180 right

01:25:00.580 now

01:25:01.020 and so

01:25:01.940 how about

01:25:02.940 the

01:25:03.160 veto

01:25:03.520 decision

01:25:05.600 over what

01:25:06.540 time span

01:25:07.080 will that

01:25:07.500 unfold

01:25:07.960 in

01:25:08.460 relationship

01:25:08.940 to

01:25:09.240 Biden

01:25:09.540 he's

01:25:10.140 got

01:25:10.300 10

01:25:10.540 days

01:25:10.880 to

01:25:11.740 veto

01:25:12.380 it

01:25:12.640 I

01:25:12.780 suspect

01:25:13.060 it

01:25:13.260 won't

01:25:13.460 take

01:25:13.680 him

01:25:13.780 long

01:25:13.960 okay

01:25:14.260 okay

01:25:15.460 so

01:25:15.640 that's

01:25:15.900 coming

01:25:16.080 down

01:25:16.240 the

01:25:16.380 pipelines

01:25:16.780 very

01:25:17.060 quickly

01:25:17.380 well

01:25:17.620 one

01:25:17.860 of

01:25:18.020 the

01:25:18.160 presidential

01:25:18.660 candidates

01:25:19.360 Vivek

01:25:19.900 Ramaswamy

01:25:20.940 has

01:25:21.240 made

01:25:22.120 much

01:25:22.400 of his

01:25:22.760 career

01:25:23.280 out

01:25:23.980 of

01:25:24.260 battle

01:25:25.040 against

01:25:25.560 ESG

01:25:26.480 corporate

01:25:27.000 government

01:25:27.720 collusion

01:25:28.380 right

01:25:29.160 Vivek

01:25:30.120 set up

01:25:30.660 the

01:25:30.860 strive

01:25:31.200 funds

01:25:31.640 which

01:25:31.940 are

01:25:32.260 analogs

01:25:32.960 of

01:25:33.160 I

01:25:33.420 think

01:25:33.580 the 0.98

01:25:33.720 black

01:25:33.960 rock

01:25:34.200 investment

01:25:34.620 strategy

01:25:35.240 essentially

01:25:35.800 that

01:25:36.180 but

01:25:37.040 with

01:25:37.420 issuing

01:25:38.020 entirely

01:25:38.880 any

01:25:39.600 ESG

01:25:40.520 governance

01:25:41.200 requirements

01:25:41.840 and

01:25:42.180 he's

01:25:42.620 had a

01:25:42.840 fair

01:25:42.960 bit

01:25:43.120 of

01:25:43.260 success

01:25:43.600 with

01:25:43.820 that

01:25:44.020 in

01:25:44.260 the

01:25:44.400 free

01:25:44.600 market

01:25:44.940 and

01:25:45.180 is

01:25:45.340 certainly

01:25:45.560 making

01:25:45.900 that

01:25:46.140 central

01:25:46.540 to

01:25:46.800 his

01:25:47.020 platform

01:25:47.940 for

01:25:48.300 presidency

01:25:48.940 so

01:25:49.540 I'm

01:25:50.080 going to

01:25:50.220 release

01:25:50.500 a

01:25:50.620 discussion

01:25:50.980 I had

01:25:51.320 with

01:25:51.480 Vivek

01:25:51.860 on

01:25:52.120 this

01:25:52.360 channel

01:25:53.000 it's

01:25:54.200 possible

01:25:54.500 that it

01:25:54.780 will have

01:25:55.060 come out

01:25:55.400 before

01:25:55.700 the

01:25:56.180 discussion

01:25:56.600 that we're

01:25:56.960 having

01:25:57.240 although

01:25:57.480 I don't

01:25:57.780 think so

01:25:58.160 I think

01:25:58.440 we're

01:25:58.600 going to

01:25:58.760 release

01:25:59.020 our

01:25:59.220 discussion

01:25:59.600 first

01:26:00.040 so

01:26:00.900 this is

01:26:01.780 definitely

01:26:02.060 going to

01:26:02.440 be a

01:26:02.660 hot

01:26:02.840 topic

01:26:03.160 it's

01:26:03.400 too

01:26:03.560 bad

01:26:03.840 because

01:26:04.080 it's

01:26:04.260 quite

01:26:04.520 arcane

01:26:05.140 it's

01:26:05.760 hard

01:26:06.000 for

01:26:06.320 people

01:26:07.160 who

01:26:07.400 are

01:26:07.780 not

01:26:08.920 centrally

01:26:09.960 involved

01:26:10.380 on the

01:26:10.720 economic

01:26:11.100 or financial

01:26:11.760 or political

01:26:12.320 front

01:26:12.780 to understand

01:26:13.500 why

01:26:13.880 something

01:26:14.320 as

01:26:14.720 apparently

01:26:15.540 mundane

01:26:16.540 as

01:26:17.140 whatever

01:26:17.720 constitutes

01:26:18.460 ESG

01:26:19.200 might have

01:26:20.040 real world

01:26:20.540 consequences

01:26:21.160 for them

01:26:21.620 it's hard

01:26:21.960 to make

01:26:22.360 it a

01:26:22.820 trenchant

01:26:24.360 point

01:26:24.820 in the

01:26:25.500 imagination

01:26:25.900 of

01:26:26.320 Americans

01:26:26.760 but

01:26:27.180 it's

01:26:27.960 a good

01:26:28.200 thing

01:26:28.380 to try

01:26:28.680 to alert

01:26:29.100 people

01:26:29.440 to

01:26:29.640 just

01:26:30.200 exactly

01:26:30.640 how

01:26:30.860 dangerous

01:26:31.240 this

01:26:31.680 is

01:26:31.940 and

01:26:32.120 exactly

01:26:32.760 what's

01:26:33.280 at stake

01:26:33.900 for

01:26:34.120 them

01:26:34.340 the

01:26:34.760 subversion

01:26:35.480 of their

01:26:36.140 savings

01:26:36.880 to a

01:26:37.660 radical

01:26:38.240 anti-human

01:26:39.300 environmentalist

01:26:40.460 apocalyptic

01:26:41.100 agenda

01:26:41.840 allied

01:26:42.640 with this

01:26:43.320 radical

01:26:43.760 leftist

01:26:44.340 approach

01:26:44.760 to

01:26:45.120 the

01:26:46.780 amelioration

01:26:47.380 of social

01:26:47.880 problems

01:26:48.380 equity

01:26:48.780 diversity

01:26:49.420 and

01:26:50.000 inclusivity

01:26:50.600 make no

01:26:51.080 mistake

01:26:51.400 about

01:26:51.700 it

01:26:51.880 ladies 0.99

01:26:52.080 and

01:26:52.320 gentlemen

01:26:52.600 that's

01:26:53.200 precisely

01:26:53.560 what

01:26:53.860 ESG

01:26:54.280 mandates

01:26:54.660 do

01:26:55.160 and

01:26:55.800 that's

01:26:56.080 exactly

01:26:56.520 their

01:26:56.760 purpose

01:26:57.200 their

01:26:57.520 conscious

01:26:58.000 purpose

01:26:58.420 and

01:26:58.640 that

01:26:58.800 is

01:26:58.940 exactly

01:26:59.400 their

01:26:59.660 outcome

01:27:00.060 and

01:27:00.660 so

01:27:00.800 okay

01:27:01.360 so

01:27:01.580 Mike

01:27:01.840 please

01:27:02.700 go ahead

01:27:03.040 and

01:27:03.360 the

01:27:03.500 American

01:27:03.780 people

01:27:04.060 are

01:27:04.200 not 0.87

01:27:04.380 dumb 0.99

01:27:04.660 they 1.00

01:27:05.020 may

01:27:05.420 have

01:27:06.360 a

01:27:07.320 lot

01:27:07.740 on

01:27:08.220 their

01:27:08.340 hands

01:27:08.660 a lot

01:27:09.500 of

01:27:09.620 things

01:27:09.800 to

01:27:09.980 accomplish

01:27:10.400 and

01:27:10.700 therefore

01:27:10.920 not

01:27:11.160 a

01:27:11.280 lot

01:27:11.360 of

01:27:11.460 time

01:27:11.620 to

01:27:11.800 delve

01:27:12.120 into

01:27:12.360 exactly

01:27:12.800 how

01:27:13.040 ESG

01:27:13.440 works

01:27:13.740 or

01:27:13.880 what

01:27:14.080 it

01:27:14.200 is

01:27:14.360 but

01:27:14.780 they're

01:27:15.200 not 0.78

01:27:15.380 dumb 1.00

01:27:15.740 and 1.00

01:27:16.200 they're

01:27:16.700 smart

01:27:17.080 and

01:27:17.520 they

01:27:17.760 intuitively

01:27:18.220 know

01:27:18.800 that

01:27:19.260 it's

01:27:19.420 not a

01:27:19.780 good

01:27:19.960 thing

01:27:20.280 to

01:27:20.440 have

01:27:20.620 a

01:27:20.960 small

01:27:21.400 handful

01:27:21.740 of

01:27:21.980 corporate

01:27:22.360 elites

01:27:22.860 making

01:27:23.440 decisions

01:27:24.020 that

01:27:24.660 will

01:27:24.860 make

01:27:25.200 life

01:27:25.540 more

01:27:25.760 difficult

01:27:26.060 for

01:27:26.300 them

01:27:26.540 making

01:27:27.120 life

01:27:27.360 more

01:27:27.640 expensive

01:27:28.240 and

01:27:29.080 less

01:27:29.360 lucrative

01:27:29.880 in terms

01:27:30.300 of any

01:27:30.680 investments

01:27:31.060 they may

01:27:31.480 have

01:27:31.860 and

01:27:32.500 so

01:27:32.680 they

01:27:33.400 get

01:27:33.660 that

01:27:33.960 and

01:27:34.340 they

01:27:34.460 also

01:27:34.660 get

01:27:34.900 the

01:27:35.080 fact

01:27:35.280 that

01:27:35.480 these

01:27:36.460 big

01:27:37.020 business

01:27:37.720 elites

01:27:38.220 who

01:27:38.520 are

01:27:38.640 being

01:27:38.920 facilitated

01:27:39.660 who

01:27:40.620 want

01:27:40.900 to

01:27:41.060 be

01:27:44.200 in

01:27:44.400 making

01:27:44.960 the

01:27:45.520 people

01:27:45.760 less

01:27:46.000 poor

01:27:46.260 American

01:27:46.780 people

01:27:47.080 don't

01:27:47.300 take

01:27:47.500 kindly

01:27:47.860 to

01:27:48.060 that

01:27:48.260 and

01:27:48.500 that's

01:27:48.680 why

01:27:48.820 I

01:27:48.940 think

01:27:49.060 we

01:27:49.220 win

01:27:49.440 this

01:27:49.620 at

01:27:49.740 the

01:27:49.860 end

01:27:49.960 of

01:27:50.040 the

01:27:50.100 day

01:27:50.220 but

01:27:50.420 it's

01:27:50.920 going

01:27:51.000 to

01:27:51.080 require

01:27:51.340 some

01:27:51.580 effort

01:27:51.940 and

01:27:52.160 some

01:27:52.360 explanation

01:27:52.880 as to

01:27:53.420 how

01:27:53.540 this

01:27:53.740 works

01:27:54.060 right

01:27:55.540 well

01:27:55.800 DeSantis

01:27:56.380 has been

01:27:57.000 pushing

01:27:57.380 hard

01:27:57.700 back

01:27:58.100 against

01:27:58.440 ESG

01:27:58.900 with

01:27:59.120 certain

01:27:59.440 amount

01:27:59.620 of

01:27:59.760 success

01:28:00.040 and

01:28:00.360 there's

01:28:00.560 other

01:28:00.740 states

01:28:01.100 that

01:28:01.300 are

01:28:01.420 starting

01:28:01.760 to

01:28:01.980 join

01:28:02.280 in

01:28:02.720 that

01:28:02.900 fight

01:28:03.220 the

01:28:03.540 association

01:28:04.940 of

01:28:05.500 chief

01:28:14.200 vociferous

01:28:15.560 critics

01:28:15.880 of

01:28:16.120 the

01:28:16.260 ESG

01:28:16.660 movement

01:28:17.120 and

01:28:17.340 so

01:28:17.480 there

01:28:17.640 is

01:28:17.820 gathering

01:28:18.340 impetus

01:28:19.980 on

01:28:20.240 that

01:28:20.440 front

01:28:20.640 so

01:28:20.820 that's

01:28:21.060 a good

01:28:21.260 thing

01:28:21.480 to

01:28:21.640 see

01:28:21.820 so

01:28:22.360 what

01:28:22.660 are

01:28:23.600 your

01:28:23.940 plans

01:28:24.680 for

01:28:25.340 action

01:28:25.880 at

01:28:26.260 the

01:28:26.420 current

01:28:26.680 moment

01:28:27.040 how

01:28:27.440 are

01:28:27.940 you

01:28:28.100 setting

01:28:28.380 your

01:28:28.660 priorities

01:28:29.200 and

01:28:29.560 how

01:28:30.020 would

01:28:30.180 you

01:28:30.300 describe

01:28:30.700 them

01:28:30.900 to

01:28:31.020 the

01:28:31.160 people

01:28:31.380 who

01:28:31.520 are

01:28:31.640 watching

01:28:32.000 and

01:28:32.200 listening

01:28:32.540 look

01:28:33.340 my

01:28:33.900 priorities

01:28:34.480 always

01:28:35.100 stem

01:28:36.000 ultimately

01:28:36.560 from

01:28:37.280 a desire

01:28:37.840 to restore

01:28:38.460 the

01:28:38.700 constitution's

01:28:39.460 twin

01:28:39.880 structural

01:28:40.340 protections

01:28:40.940 twin

01:28:42.100 structural

01:28:42.480 protections

01:28:42.860 one

01:28:43.120 operates

01:28:44.200 we call

01:28:45.680 it

01:28:45.800 federalism

01:28:46.400 it

01:28:46.700 defines

01:28:47.100 the

01:28:47.280 relationship

01:28:47.720 between

01:28:48.120 our

01:28:48.340 national

01:28:48.700 government

01:28:48.920 the

01:28:49.080 federal

01:28:49.280 government

01:28:49.500 of the

01:28:49.680 United

01:28:49.860 States

01:28:50.160 and

01:28:50.880 the

01:28:51.160 states

01:28:51.520 and

01:28:51.660 their

01:28:51.800 political

01:28:52.080 subdivisions

01:28:52.780 like

01:28:53.080 cities

01:28:53.480 towns

01:28:53.840 and

01:28:54.500 counties

01:28:54.940 the

01:28:55.860 other

01:28:56.040 is

01:28:56.260 horizontal

01:28:56.840 and

01:28:57.240 it

01:28:57.380 defines

01:28:57.720 the

01:28:57.860 relationship

01:28:58.300 between

01:28:58.860 the

01:28:59.680 executive

01:29:00.100 branch

01:29:00.540 headed

01:29:01.480 by

01:29:01.680 the

01:29:01.820 president

01:29:02.140 the

01:29:02.640 legislative

01:29:03.060 branch

01:29:03.400 where

01:29:03.580 I

01:29:03.740 work

01:29:03.980 Congress

01:29:04.980 and

01:29:06.060 the

01:29:06.540 judicial

01:29:07.120 branch

01:29:07.540 that

01:29:08.220 interprets

01:29:08.720 the

01:29:08.860 laws

01:29:09.100 headed

01:29:09.300 by

01:29:09.500 the

01:29:09.660 Supreme

01:29:09.900 Court

01:29:10.220 we've

01:29:11.260 drifted

01:29:11.660 far

01:29:11.980 since

01:29:12.300 the

01:29:12.720 mid

01:29:13.300 to

01:29:13.520 late

01:29:13.760 1930s

01:29:14.700 in

01:29:14.840 this

01:29:15.000 country

01:29:15.320 from

01:29:15.740 both

01:29:16.460 the

01:29:16.640 vertical

01:29:16.860 protection

01:29:17.300 of

01:29:17.480 federalism

01:29:17.960 and

01:29:18.220 the

01:29:18.340 horizontal

01:29:18.700 protection

01:29:19.160 of

01:29:19.360 separation

01:29:19.800 of

01:29:20.020 powers

01:29:20.360 we have

01:29:21.380 done

01:29:21.700 that

01:29:22.000 as part

01:29:22.560 of this

01:29:22.840 effort

01:29:23.080 to

01:29:23.340 consolidate

01:29:23.920 government

01:29:24.400 power

01:29:24.820 into the

01:29:25.240 hands

01:29:25.460 of the

01:29:25.700 few

01:29:25.960 what

01:29:26.700 it's

01:29:26.860 done

01:29:27.040 is

01:29:27.180 taken

01:29:27.520 power

01:29:27.880 away

01:29:28.220 from

01:29:28.460 the

01:29:28.700 states

01:29:29.080 and

01:29:29.220 localities

01:29:29.800 and

01:29:30.360 moved

01:29:30.620 it

01:29:30.740 to

01:29:30.940 Washington

01:29:31.340 and

01:29:32.200 then

01:29:32.360 within

01:29:32.640 Washington

01:29:33.140 we've

01:29:33.440 taken

01:29:33.720 lawmaking

01:29:34.480 power

01:29:34.820 the

01:29:34.960 power

01:29:35.160 to

01:29:35.340 set

01:29:35.560 federal

01:29:35.900 policy

01:29:36.400 embodied

01:29:36.780 in

01:29:37.000 law

01:29:37.260 and

01:29:38.000 handed

01:29:38.280 over

01:29:38.520 to

01:29:38.740 unelected

01:29:39.280 unaccountable

01:29:39.840 bureaucrats

01:29:40.420 or in

01:29:40.740 some

01:29:40.940 cases

01:29:41.280 the

01:29:41.500 president

01:29:41.780 himself

01:29:42.280 all

01:29:43.580 of

01:29:43.740 this

01:29:43.900 has

01:29:44.060 inured

01:29:44.400 to

01:29:44.600 the

01:29:44.780 benefit

01:29:45.140 of

01:29:45.600 the

01:29:45.740 wealthy

01:29:46.080 the

01:29:46.400 well

01:29:46.580 connected

01:29:46.960 the

01:29:47.360 political

01:29:47.680 class

01:29:48.180 but

01:29:48.800 it's

01:29:48.940 been

01:29:49.080 harmful

01:29:49.340 to

01:29:49.540 everyone

01:29:49.820 else

01:29:50.160 you know

01:29:51.060 as of

01:29:51.300 a few

01:29:51.600 years

01:29:51.880 ago

01:29:52.120 a

01:29:52.280 disproportionate

01:29:52.960 number

01:29:53.240 of

01:29:53.700 the

01:29:53.860 wealthiest

01:29:54.280 counties

01:29:54.720 in

01:29:54.940 the

01:29:55.040 entire

01:29:55.340 United

01:29:55.640 States

01:29:55.980 were

01:29:56.240 suburbs

01:29:57.140 of

01:29:57.380 Washington

01:29:57.780 D.C.

01:29:58.180 this

01:29:58.420 is an

01:29:58.680 area

01:29:58.920 that

01:29:59.120 manufactures

01:29:59.780 nothing

01:30:00.220 there

01:30:01.000 are

01:30:01.080 no

01:30:01.220 gold

01:30:01.480 mines

01:30:01.780 here

01:30:02.120 it's

01:30:02.800 not

01:30:03.040 a

01:30:03.340 technological

01:30:04.120 innovation

01:30:04.940 hub

01:30:05.480 necessarily

01:30:06.060 the

01:30:06.740 money

01:30:06.920 is

01:30:07.080 here

01:30:07.220 because

01:30:07.420 the

01:30:07.640 power

01:30:07.960 is

01:30:08.140 here

01:30:08.300 concentrated

01:30:08.900 in

01:30:09.220 the

01:30:09.320 hands

01:30:09.560 of

01:30:09.700 a

01:30:09.800 few

01:30:09.960 elites

01:30:10.320 so

01:30:11.080 to

01:30:11.220 that

01:30:11.400 end

01:30:11.560 I've

01:30:11.920 been

01:30:12.060 pushing

01:30:12.340 for

01:30:12.560 years

01:30:12.980 a

01:30:13.300 reform

01:30:13.640 that

01:30:13.780 I'm

01:30:13.900 going to

01:30:14.060 push 0.64

01:30:14.260 aggressively

01:30:14.740 in

01:30:14.960 this

01:30:15.120 Congress

01:30:15.460 a

01:30:16.120 series

01:30:16.380 of

01:30:16.560 reforms

01:30:17.040 sometimes

01:30:17.540 known

01:30:17.960 under

01:30:18.220 the

01:30:18.360 banner

01:30:18.540 of

01:30:18.740 the

01:30:18.880 REINS

01:30:19.140 Act

01:30:19.440 that

01:30:20.240 would

01:30:20.680 require

01:30:21.860 that

01:30:22.180 any

01:30:22.380 time

01:30:22.580 an

01:30:22.720 executive

01:30:23.060 branch

01:30:23.560 regulation

01:30:24.520 in

01:30:25.260 effect

01:30:25.600 a

01:30:25.900 law

01:30:26.300 put

01:30:26.600 out

01:30:26.760 by

01:30:27.020 an

01:30:27.180 executive

01:30:27.480 branch

01:30:27.820 bureaucrat

01:30:28.360 for

01:30:29.300 that

01:30:29.480 to

01:30:29.640 take

01:30:29.820 effect

01:30:30.240 if

01:30:30.640 the

01:30:30.780 REINS

01:30:30.940 Act

01:30:31.100 were

01:30:31.300 to

01:30:31.500 be

01:30:31.680 passed

01:30:32.140 it

01:30:32.880 would

01:30:32.980 have

01:30:33.180 to

01:30:33.320 first

01:30:33.580 pass

01:30:33.920 both

01:30:34.180 houses

01:30:34.460 of

01:30:34.640 Congress

01:30:34.940 and

01:30:35.220 then

01:30:35.400 be

01:30:35.580 signed

01:30:35.840 into

01:30:36.120 law

01:30:36.380 by

01:30:36.860 the

01:30:37.060 president

01:30:37.420 otherwise

01:30:38.240 you're

01:30:38.600 circumventing

01:30:39.100 the

01:30:39.220 whole

01:30:39.340 process

01:30:39.760 I'm

01:30:39.980 going to

01:30:40.080 be

01:30:40.220 pushing

01:30:40.480 that

01:30:40.740 over

01:30:41.020 and

01:30:41.200 over

01:30:41.360 again

01:30:41.660 I'm

01:30:42.040 going

01:30:42.100 to

01:30:42.120 be

01:30:42.320 subdividing

01:30:43.240 it

01:30:43.360 out

01:30:43.560 incorporating

01:30:44.700 many

01:30:45.440 REINS

01:30:45.760 acts

01:30:46.060 into

01:30:46.500 other

01:30:46.920 legislative

01:30:47.540 provisions

01:30:48.160 whether

01:30:48.740 we're

01:30:48.940 talking

01:30:49.280 about

01:30:49.500 a

01:30:49.640 farm

01:30:49.860 bill

01:30:50.140 or

01:30:50.380 general

01:30:50.720 appropriations

01:30:51.480 bill

01:30:51.740 or

01:30:52.020 something

01:30:52.340 else

01:30:52.660 I

01:30:53.440 want

01:30:54.180 to

01:30:54.360 see

01:30:54.600 executive

01:30:55.160 branch

01:30:55.460 authority

01:30:55.900 subjected

01:30:57.640 to

01:30:58.420 a

01:30:59.080 review

01:30:59.360 by

01:30:59.640 Congress

01:31:00.040 and

01:31:00.460 to

01:31:01.000 not

01:31:01.520 take

01:31:01.740 effect

01:31:02.160 absent

01:31:03.020 Congress

01:31:03.460 enacting

01:31:04.040 it

01:31:04.160 into

01:31:04.400 law

01:31:04.640 my

01:31:05.120 car

01:31:05.380 needed

01:31:05.860 repairs

01:31:06.360 but

01:31:06.680 I

01:31:06.760 could

01:31:06.880 only

01:31:07.120 pay

01:31:07.360 for

01:31:07.540 half

01:31:07.920 of

01:31:08.060 them

01:31:08.260 an

01:31:08.560 easy

01:31:08.860 loan

01:31:09.120 through

01:31:09.300 lamina.ca

01:31:10.140 made

01:31:10.440 the

01:31:10.600 difference

01:31:10.920 between

01:31:11.240 stressed

01:31:11.580 out

01:31:11.780 driving

01:31:12.100 and

01:31:12.480 a

01:31:12.620 smooth

01:31:12.880 ride

01:31:13.200 to

01:31:13.380 work

01:31:13.680 Mark

01:31:14.120 went

01:31:17.540 at

01:31:17.740 1-800-NEW-CREDIT

01:31:18.980 it's

01:31:19.500 easy

01:31:19.660 to

01:31:19.880 apply

01:31:20.160 over

01:31:20.380 the

01:31:20.560 phone

01:31:20.800 or

01:31:21.120 online

01:31:21.580 at

01:31:21.900 lamina.ca

01:31:22.760 load up

01:31:23.440 to

01:31:23.600 $1,500

01:31:24.520 and get

01:31:25.420 funds

01:31:25.700 in an

01:31:26.000 hour

01:31:26.240 with

01:31:26.720 no

01:31:26.900 documents

01:31:27.360 or

01:31:27.640 credit

01:31:28.000 checks

01:31:28.360 and

01:31:28.740 pay

01:31:28.940 back

01:31:29.180 over

01:31:29.360 three

01:31:29.660 to

01:31:29.820 seven

01:31:30.040 months

01:31:30.400 prop

01:31:30.940 up

01:31:31.100 your

01:31:31.240 purchase

01:31:31.640 and

01:31:31.900 apply

01:31:32.200 for

01:31:32.420 a

01:31:32.580 loan

01:31:32.780 now

01:31:33.160 at

01:31:33.500 lamina.ca

01:31:34.420 And

01:31:36.980 do you

01:31:38.020 are you

01:31:38.720 optimistic

01:31:39.340 about your

01:31:39.920 chances

01:31:40.300 on that

01:31:40.800 front

01:31:41.120 how

01:31:41.420 is

01:31:41.780 that

01:31:41.980 battle

01:31:42.280 progressing

01:31:42.800 and

01:31:43.080 can you

01:31:43.860 detail

01:31:44.260 out

01:31:44.600 a little

01:31:45.020 bit

01:31:45.220 more

01:31:45.540 how

01:31:46.280 it

01:31:46.460 is

01:31:46.700 that

01:31:46.920 the

01:31:47.120 specific

01:31:47.540 changes

01:31:48.060 that

01:31:48.340 you're

01:31:48.520 making

01:31:48.760 on

01:31:48.960 the

01:31:49.080 legislative

01:31:49.560 front

01:31:49.940 would

01:31:50.440 in

01:31:51.060 principle

01:31:51.520 limit

01:31:52.080 the

01:31:52.380 continued

01:31:52.800 growth

01:31:53.180 and

01:31:53.340 expansion

01:31:53.860 of

01:31:54.160 this

01:31:54.460 centralized

01:31:55.480 power

01:31:56.040 elite

01:31:56.500 that

01:31:56.800 you're

01:31:57.020 describing

01:31:57.500 It would

01:31:58.540 decentralize

01:31:59.180 power

01:31:59.420 to a

01:31:59.760 very

01:31:59.960 significant

01:32:00.500 degree

01:32:00.840 it would

01:32:01.100 do

01:32:01.280 so

01:32:01.560 for

01:32:02.000 the

01:32:02.140 simple

01:32:02.360 reason

01:32:02.620 that

01:32:02.800 as

01:32:02.940 Congress

01:32:03.200 has

01:32:03.400 to

01:32:03.560 vote

01:32:03.780 on

01:32:03.960 things

01:32:04.320 say

01:32:05.640 like

01:32:05.840 the

01:32:06.080 clean

01:32:06.640 power

01:32:06.960 plan

01:32:07.260 rule

01:32:07.600 something

01:32:08.440 like

01:32:08.740 that

01:32:09.000 or

01:32:09.140 the

01:32:09.300 waters

01:32:09.600 of

01:32:09.740 the

01:32:09.820 United

01:32:10.060 States

01:32:15.020 branch

01:32:15.380 edicts

01:32:15.920 issued

01:32:16.260 over

01:32:16.520 the

01:32:16.660 last

01:32:16.880 few

01:32:17.100 years

01:32:17.460 that

01:32:18.400 have

01:32:19.400 a

01:32:19.560 dramatic

01:32:20.400 economic

01:32:20.980 impact

01:32:21.580 on

01:32:21.900 the

01:32:22.060 American

01:32:22.400 people

01:32:22.900 as

01:32:25.340 those

01:32:25.920 things

01:32:26.360 get

01:32:26.780 noticed

01:32:27.200 by

01:32:27.420 the

01:32:27.540 people

01:32:27.780 and

01:32:27.940 as

01:32:28.060 they

01:32:28.180 have

01:32:28.360 more

01:32:28.580 and

01:32:28.680 more

01:32:28.820 of

01:32:28.940 an

01:32:29.040 economic

01:32:29.400 impact

01:32:29.800 as

01:32:29.960 Americans

01:32:30.320 realize

01:32:30.720 that

01:32:30.880 they're

01:32:31.040 shelling

01:32:31.320 out

01:32:31.500 an

01:32:31.620 additional

01:32:32.000 two

01:32:32.580 to

01:32:32.760 three

01:32:33.000 trillion

01:32:33.400 dollars

01:32:33.700 a

01:32:33.880 year

01:32:34.180 every

01:32:35.340 year

01:32:35.800 an

01:32:36.520 increased

01:32:37.000 cost

01:32:37.700 of

01:32:37.900 goods

01:32:38.200 and

01:32:38.380 services

01:32:38.740 diminished

01:32:39.080 wages

01:32:39.440 unemployment

01:32:39.940 and

01:32:40.220 underemployment

01:32:41.000 because

01:32:41.640 of this

01:32:41.920 outsourcing

01:32:42.420 of

01:32:45.020 Congress

01:32:45.340 just

01:32:45.600 letting

01:32:45.880 the

01:32:46.080 executive

01:32:46.400 branch

01:32:46.680 continue

01:32:47.080 to

01:32:47.300 make

01:32:47.560 laws

01:32:47.880 more

01:32:48.400 importantly

01:32:48.760 once

01:32:49.220 we

01:32:49.360 get

01:32:49.560 things

01:32:49.880 like

01:32:50.080 this

01:32:50.280 passed

01:32:50.940 Congress

01:32:52.000 won't

01:32:52.860 have

01:32:53.200 the

01:32:53.340 temerity

01:32:53.760 it

01:32:53.900 won't

01:32:54.080 have

01:32:54.280 the

01:32:54.960 crazed

01:32:56.720 megalomania

01:32:58.480 necessary

01:32:59.060 to inflict

01:32:59.860 patently

01:33:01.040 bad

01:33:01.600 policies

01:33:02.340 that are

01:33:02.720 going to

01:33:02.980 hurt

01:33:03.220 the

01:33:03.440 American

01:33:03.680 people

01:33:03.940 on

01:33:04.160 the

01:33:04.280 American

01:33:04.560 people

01:33:04.960 and

01:33:05.620 there

01:33:05.720 will

01:33:05.820 be

01:33:05.960 accountability

01:33:06.360 for

01:33:06.780 those

01:33:06.980 who

01:33:07.100 vote

01:33:07.300 for

01:33:07.500 them

01:33:07.700 this

01:33:08.920 coupled

01:33:09.220 with

01:33:09.440 the

01:33:09.560 fact

01:33:09.700 that

01:33:09.840 we'd

01:33:10.000 have

01:33:10.120 to

01:33:10.260 cast

01:33:10.480 more

01:33:10.680 votes

01:33:11.040 on

01:33:11.400 more

01:33:11.600 topics

01:33:12.040 some

01:33:12.560 of

01:33:12.700 which

01:33:12.820 would

01:33:12.960 be

01:33:13.100 controversial

01:33:13.680 would

01:33:14.680 I

01:33:14.900 believe

01:33:15.180 ultimately

01:33:15.720 inure

01:33:16.760 to

01:33:17.000 the

01:33:17.280 benefit

01:33:17.780 of

01:33:17.940 the

01:33:18.040 people

01:33:18.320 as

01:33:18.520 Congress

01:33:18.780 would

01:33:18.980 say

01:33:19.200 you know

01:33:19.680 what

01:33:19.820 we don't

01:33:20.120 have to

01:33:20.420 weigh

01:33:20.580 in on

01:33:20.920 every

01:33:21.160 area

01:33:21.500 we're

01:33:22.320 supposed

01:33:22.600 to be

01:33:22.900 a

01:33:23.020 limited

01:33:23.220 purpose

01:33:23.580 national

01:33:23.980 government

01:33:24.800 established

01:33:25.480 for the

01:33:25.820 purpose

01:33:26.100 of

01:33:26.700 adopting

01:33:28.680 laws

01:33:29.200 on

01:33:29.640 national

01:33:30.180 defense

01:33:30.640 weights

01:33:30.940 and

01:33:31.100 measures

01:33:31.360 trademarks

01:33:31.820 copyrights

01:33:32.400 and

01:33:32.500 patents

01:33:32.840 regulating

01:33:33.620 trade

01:33:34.020 or

01:33:34.180 commerce

01:33:34.480 between

01:33:34.760 the

01:33:34.960 states

01:33:35.300 and

01:33:37.300 foreign

01:33:38.140 countries

01:33:39.220 and

01:33:40.440 there

01:33:40.620 are

01:33:40.720 a

01:33:40.820 few

01:33:40.960 other

01:33:41.180 powers

01:33:41.580 but

01:33:41.820 it's

01:33:42.100 a

01:33:42.260 relatively

01:33:43.260 small

01:33:43.680 box

01:33:44.120 that

01:33:44.320 those

01:33:44.520 fit

01:33:44.740 into

01:33:45.060 we

01:33:45.980 have

01:33:46.160 made

01:33:46.540 our

01:33:46.840 federal

01:33:47.180 government

01:33:47.560 almost

01:33:48.320 a

01:33:48.560 general

01:33:48.800 purpose

01:33:49.140 national

01:33:49.580 government

01:33:49.980 and

01:33:50.720 once

01:33:51.040 we've

01:33:51.260 done

01:33:51.440 that

01:33:51.720 Congress

01:33:52.440 has

01:33:52.840 not

01:33:53.020 wanted

01:33:53.180 to

01:33:53.360 cast

01:33:53.580 all

01:33:53.860 the

01:33:54.160 votes

01:33:54.800 that

01:33:54.960 would

01:33:55.100 have

01:33:55.260 to

01:33:55.380 cast

01:33:55.560 so

01:33:55.740 we've

01:33:55.960 outsourced

01:33:56.540 the

01:33:56.920 actual

01:33:57.180 thinking

01:33:57.540 on

01:33:57.760 that

01:33:57.940 to

01:33:58.100 the

01:33:58.240 so

01:33:58.400 called

01:33:58.640 experts

01:33:59.140 this

01:33:59.680 is

01:33:59.780 the

01:33:59.920 pipe

01:34:00.120 dream

01:34:00.340 of

01:34:00.560 the

01:34:00.700 progressive

01:34:01.060 movement

01:34:01.520 we're

01:34:01.880 going

01:34:09.220 of

01:34:09.420 the

01:34:09.580 unwashed

01:34:10.020 masses

01:34:10.420 as

01:34:10.780 they

01:34:10.940 see

01:34:11.180 it

01:34:11.340 right

01:34:11.660 without

01:34:12.740 the

01:34:13.100 messiness

01:34:13.600 yeah

01:34:13.880 well

01:34:14.100 so

01:34:14.360 a

01:34:14.800 couple

01:34:14.980 of

01:34:15.120 comments

01:34:15.540 on the

01:34:16.120 psychological

01:34:16.580 front

01:34:17.000 relationship

01:34:17.520 to

01:34:17.760 that

01:34:18.000 it's

01:34:18.140 like

01:34:18.340 first

01:34:19.640 of

01:34:19.800 all

01:34:20.020 you

01:34:21.220 might

01:34:21.420 ask

01:34:21.680 yourself

01:34:22.000 well

01:34:22.320 why

01:34:23.120 wouldn't

01:34:23.640 it

01:34:23.800 be

01:34:23.980 a

01:34:24.140 good

01:34:24.340 thing

01:34:24.740 for

01:34:25.120 a

01:34:25.480 centralized

01:34:25.920 federal

01:34:26.620 government

01:34:27.060 to

01:34:27.440 offer

01:34:27.920 largesse

01:34:28.740 to

01:34:29.340 its

01:34:29.720 populace

01:34:30.580 and

01:34:31.480 I

01:34:31.620 would

01:34:31.800 say

01:34:32.080 well

01:34:32.300 first

01:34:32.580 of

01:34:32.700 all

01:34:32.820 that's

01:34:33.160 actually

01:34:33.440 very

01:34:33.720 unlikely

01:34:34.260 because

01:34:34.700 that's

01:34:35.060 a

01:34:35.160 difficult

01:34:35.440 thing

01:34:35.720 to

01:34:35.880 manage

01:34:36.280 and

01:34:36.820 there's

01:34:37.020 no

01:34:37.220 real

01:34:37.580 evidence

01:34:38.020 that

01:34:38.320 centralized

01:34:38.920 governments

01:34:39.640 have

01:34:39.980 done

01:34:40.340 a

01:34:40.480 credible

01:34:40.760 job

01:34:41.120 of

01:34:41.280 that

01:34:41.560 in

01:34:42.140 the

01:34:42.240 last

01:34:42.500 150

01:34:43.120 years

01:34:43.500 and

01:34:43.880 there's

01:34:44.080 plenty

01:34:44.360 of

01:34:44.560 counter

01:34:44.860 evidence

01:34:45.300 the

01:34:45.820 more

01:34:46.300 widespread

01:34:47.820 that

01:34:48.260 attempt

01:34:48.660 the

01:34:48.980 more

01:34:49.280 likely

01:34:49.660 it

01:34:49.860 is

01:34:50.080 to

01:34:50.300 end

01:34:50.680 cataclysmically

01:34:51.660 but

01:34:52.120 then

01:34:52.300 there's

01:34:52.520 another

01:34:52.820 thing

01:34:53.520 to

01:34:53.680 consider

01:34:54.040 too

01:34:54.300 for

01:34:54.540 everyone

01:34:54.840 who's

01:34:55.100 watching

01:34:55.440 and

01:34:55.640 listening

01:34:55.940 is

01:34:56.220 that

01:34:56.440 you

01:34:57.300 know

01:34:57.420 a

01:34:57.580 lot

01:34:57.780 of

01:34:57.920 what

01:34:58.140 gives

01:34:58.460 your

01:34:58.680 life

01:34:58.980 meaning

01:34:59.360 at

01:34:59.620 the

01:34:59.780 individual

01:35:00.260 level

01:35:00.680 and

01:35:00.860 the

01:35:01.000 family

01:35:01.340 level

01:35:01.720 and

01:35:02.080 the

01:35:02.320 local

01:35:02.680 community

01:35:03.180 level

01:35:03.600 the

01:35:04.140 town

01:35:04.480 level

01:35:04.840 the

01:35:05.080 state

01:35:05.380 level

01:35:05.680 all

01:35:05.900 of

01:35:06.040 that

01:35:06.260 is

01:35:06.860 the

01:35:07.060 adoption

01:35:07.560 of

01:35:07.900 responsibility

01:35:08.740 that's

01:35:09.300 requisite

01:35:10.060 for

01:35:10.300 your

01:35:10.800 level

01:35:11.760 in

01:35:12.100 the

01:35:12.260 hierarchy

01:35:12.820 you know

01:35:13.960 and

01:35:14.280 you might

01:35:14.980 say

01:35:15.240 well

01:35:15.560 what

01:35:16.440 the

01:35:16.680 president

01:35:17.060 does

01:35:17.600 with

01:35:18.400 his

01:35:18.680 time

01:35:19.020 is

01:35:19.180 much

01:35:19.400 more

01:35:19.640 important

01:35:20.060 than

01:35:20.360 what

01:35:20.560 the

01:35:20.760 local

01:35:21.100 plumber

01:35:21.520 does

01:35:21.820 with

01:35:22.020 his

01:35:22.260 time

01:35:22.600 but

01:35:22.780 I'm

01:35:23.200 not

01:35:23.360 so

01:35:23.560 sure

01:35:23.780 that's

01:35:24.160 true

01:35:24.360 at

01:35:24.520 all

01:35:24.860 you

01:35:25.500 know

01:35:25.600 each

01:35:25.880 individual

01:35:26.400 has

01:35:26.880 their

01:35:27.160 bailiwick

01:35:27.760 of

01:35:28.300 divine

01:35:29.040 responsibility

01:35:29.840 and

01:35:30.760 so

01:35:31.060 does

01:35:31.240 each

01:35:31.460 couple

01:35:31.880 and

01:35:32.140 so

01:35:32.340 does

01:35:32.520 each

01:35:32.720 family

01:35:33.220 and

01:35:33.480 so

01:35:33.660 does

01:35:33.820 each

01:35:34.000 community

01:35:34.500 all

01:35:35.040 the way

01:35:35.320 up

01:35:35.520 that

01:35:35.740 hierarchy

01:35:36.280 of

01:35:36.520 responsibility

01:35:37.180 and

01:35:38.100 if

01:35:38.260 we

01:35:38.460 devolve

01:35:39.300 power

01:35:40.460 and

01:35:41.180 responsibility

01:35:41.900 up to

01:35:42.920 the

01:35:43.080 highest

01:35:43.400 echelons

01:35:43.960 of

01:35:44.160 government

01:35:44.560 we

01:35:45.180 denued

01:35:45.880 our

01:35:46.220 own

01:35:46.520 lives

01:35:46.960 of

01:35:47.340 psychological

01:35:48.480 significance

01:35:49.360 and

01:35:49.760 meaning

01:35:50.060 and

01:35:50.280 that's

01:35:50.560 all

01:35:50.740 found

01:35:51.020 through

01:35:51.220 the

01:35:51.380 adoption

01:35:51.740 of

01:35:51.940 responsibility

01:35:52.500 we

01:35:53.220 also

01:35:53.520 run

01:35:53.940 afoul

01:35:54.560 of

01:35:54.860 the

01:35:55.100 distributed

01:35:55.720 intelligence

01:35:56.400 that

01:35:57.000 all

01:35:57.600 sorts

01:35:57.920 of

01:35:58.100 local

01:35:58.420 decision

01:35:58.840 makers

01:35:59.260 allow

01:35:59.680 for

01:36:00.020 right

01:36:00.300 because

01:36:00.680 you

01:36:01.560 should

01:36:01.840 be

01:36:02.020 dealing

01:36:02.320 with

01:36:02.560 those

01:36:02.840 things

01:36:03.160 that

01:36:03.380 are

01:36:03.500 right

01:36:03.780 in front

01:36:04.140 of

01:36:04.360 you

01:36:04.780 because

01:36:05.440 you're

01:36:05.720 the

01:36:05.880 only

01:36:06.080 person

01:36:06.520 that

01:36:06.760 can

01:36:06.960 see

01:36:07.220 them

01:36:07.420 and

01:36:07.560 if

01:36:07.700 you

01:36:07.840 cede

01:36:08.120 that

01:36:08.360 power

01:36:08.700 to

01:36:09.020 abstract

01:36:09.860 authorities

01:36:10.380 they

01:36:10.640 blunder

01:36:11.020 around 1.00

01:36:11.340 stupidly 1.00

01:36:11.920 like 1.00

01:36:12.180 blind

01:36:12.580 giants

01:36:13.140 and

01:36:13.940 so

01:36:14.240 one

01:36:14.940 of

01:36:15.040 the

01:36:15.140 things

01:36:15.380 that

01:36:15.600 conservatives

01:36:16.140 can

01:36:16.520 consider

01:36:16.960 you

01:36:17.140 know

01:36:17.220 I've

01:36:17.400 had

01:36:17.540 a lot

01:36:17.760 of

01:36:17.880 success

01:36:18.280 with

01:36:18.540 this

01:36:18.740 on

01:36:18.920 the

01:36:19.060 lecture

01:36:19.360 front

01:36:19.780 is that

01:36:20.200 I've

01:36:20.740 made

01:36:20.900 the

01:36:21.060 case

01:36:21.300 continually

01:36:21.860 in my

01:36:22.280 talks

01:36:22.580 around

01:36:22.840 the

01:36:23.020 world

01:36:23.340 that's

01:36:23.920 about

01:36:24.100 400

01:36:24.580 of

01:36:24.860 them

01:36:24.980 now

01:36:25.320 that

01:36:26.060 the

01:36:26.880 sustaining

01:36:27.560 meaning

01:36:28.080 in

01:36:28.440 people's

01:36:28.960 lives

01:36:29.400 is

01:36:30.280 developed

01:36:31.220 as a

01:36:31.660 consequence

01:36:32.060 of the

01:36:32.560 adoption

01:36:32.960 of

01:36:33.220 maximal

01:36:33.760 personal

01:36:34.300 responsibility

01:36:35.060 so

01:36:35.640 there's

01:36:35.820 a

01:36:35.960 direct

01:36:36.240 relationship

01:36:36.800 between

01:36:37.180 responsibility

01:36:37.840 and

01:36:38.200 sustaining

01:36:38.640 meaning

01:36:39.060 and

01:36:39.560 then

01:36:39.660 if

01:36:39.800 you

01:36:39.940 cede

01:36:40.380 that

01:36:40.660 to

01:36:40.860 authorities

01:36:41.360 above

01:36:41.740 you

01:36:42.000 in

01:36:42.340 the

01:36:42.460 hopes

01:36:42.680 that

01:36:42.920 they'll

01:36:43.140 deliver

01:36:43.540 you

01:36:43.800 from

01:36:44.020 the

01:36:44.180 hands

01:36:44.440 of

01:36:44.580 your

01:36:44.760 enemies

01:36:45.140 you know

01:36:45.580 genuine

01:36:46.100 and

01:36:46.300 metaphysical

01:36:46.840 then

01:36:47.420 you

01:36:47.580 actually

01:36:47.980 exhaust

01:36:48.640 the

01:36:50.280 possibilities

01:36:50.920 of

01:36:51.280 your

01:36:51.440 life

01:36:51.880 and

01:36:52.420 you

01:36:52.560 leave

01:36:53.060 yourself

01:36:53.420 with

01:36:53.620 something

01:36:53.880 like

01:36:54.140 a

01:36:54.320 sterile

01:36:54.660 shell

01:36:55.140 you know

01:36:55.940 and

01:36:56.260 conservatives

01:36:56.800 could

01:36:57.060 do

01:36:57.180 a lot

01:36:57.500 better

01:36:57.820 job

01:36:58.360 on

01:36:59.020 that

01:36:59.260 front

01:36:59.540 of

01:36:59.700 communicating

01:37:00.240 that

01:37:00.660 to

01:37:00.840 young

01:37:01.080 people

01:37:01.520 it's

01:37:02.000 like

01:37:02.140 don't

01:37:02.500 look

01:37:02.740 to

01:37:02.920 the

01:37:03.100 government

01:37:03.500 to

01:37:04.120 save

01:37:04.500 you

01:37:04.780 partly

01:37:05.520 because

01:37:05.900 you

01:37:06.220 should

01:37:06.520 be

01:37:06.760 saving

01:37:07.300 yourselves

01:37:08.260 right

01:37:08.760 you

01:37:08.920 should

01:37:09.100 be

01:37:09.260 putting

01:37:09.480 in

01:37:09.700 the

01:37:09.840 effort

01:37:10.140 as

01:37:10.700 an

01:37:10.840 individual

01:37:11.320 as

01:37:11.920 the

01:37:12.100 member

01:37:12.340 of

01:37:12.520 a

01:37:12.620 couple

01:37:12.900 as

01:37:13.140 the

01:37:13.300 member

01:37:13.520 of

01:37:13.680 a

01:37:13.800 family

01:37:14.140 to

01:37:14.680 setting

01:37:15.040 your

01:37:15.280 own

01:37:15.460 house

01:37:15.740 in

01:37:15.900 order

01:37:16.160 and

01:37:16.440 if

01:37:16.640 you

01:37:16.900 allow

01:37:17.840 others

01:37:18.240 to

01:37:18.480 intercede

01:37:18.920 on

01:37:19.120 your

01:37:19.300 behalf

01:37:19.780 you

01:37:20.020 put

01:37:20.660 yourself

01:37:21.060 in

01:37:21.240 a

01:37:21.400 state

01:37:21.700 of

01:37:21.940 like

01:37:22.240 childhood

01:37:23.040 abject

01:37:23.720 childhood

01:37:24.140 dependence

01:37:24.780 and

01:37:25.020 slavery

01:37:25.420 and

01:37:26.040 you

01:37:27.160 develop

01:37:27.580 tyrants

01:37:28.100 around

01:37:28.440 you

01:37:28.640 too

01:37:28.900 it's

01:37:29.340 a

01:37:29.520 really

01:37:29.840 bad

01:37:30.240 solution

01:37:30.840 yes

01:37:31.940 absolutely

01:37:33.360 you know

01:37:34.060 my

01:37:34.220 friend

01:37:34.820 Arthur

01:37:35.280 Brooks

01:37:35.680 has

01:37:36.340 written

01:37:36.600 a lot

01:37:37.000 on

01:37:37.200 this

01:37:37.380 topic

01:37:37.700 on

01:37:37.900 the

01:37:38.040 topic

01:37:38.720 of

01:37:39.260 finding

01:37:40.280 joy

01:37:40.720 including

01:37:41.760 happiness

01:37:43.720 as it

01:37:44.320 relates

01:37:44.680 to

01:37:45.000 one's

01:37:45.640 profession

01:37:46.260 one's

01:37:46.740 work

01:37:47.280 in

01:37:47.560 life

01:37:47.860 and

01:37:48.680 he

01:37:48.960 said

01:37:49.160 that

01:37:49.420 if

01:37:51.080 I'm

01:37:51.300 remembering

01:37:51.780 it

01:37:52.040 correctly

01:37:52.460 to

01:37:53.360 have

01:37:53.600 happiness

01:37:54.160 associated

01:37:54.720 with

01:37:54.940 one's

01:37:55.220 work

01:37:55.560 one

01:37:56.460 needs

01:37:56.660 to

01:37:56.780 have

01:37:56.940 a

01:37:57.060 job

01:37:57.240 that's

01:37:57.460 sufficiently

01:37:57.860 difficult

01:37:58.460 and

01:37:58.720 complex

01:37:59.260 that

01:38:00.160 it's

01:38:00.640 not

01:38:00.920 monotonous

01:38:02.280 that

01:38:03.320 it presents

01:38:04.820 at least

01:38:05.200 the opportunity

01:38:05.980 for upward

01:38:07.120 mobility

01:38:07.700 for

01:38:08.460 getting

01:38:09.720 ahead

01:38:10.320 whether

01:38:10.880 you

01:38:11.040 actually

01:38:11.440 realize

01:38:11.900 that

01:38:12.120 right

01:38:13.160 even

01:38:13.860 if

01:38:14.020 you

01:38:14.100 don't

01:38:14.320 realize

01:38:14.740 that

01:38:15.080 or

01:38:15.540 ascend

01:38:16.120 to

01:38:16.220 the

01:38:16.340 highest

01:38:16.560 levels

01:38:16.920 the

01:38:17.560 possibility

01:38:18.520 of it

01:38:18.980 is a

01:38:19.700 significant

01:38:20.100 factor

01:38:20.600 and

01:38:21.280 then

01:38:21.440 there

01:38:21.620 has

01:38:21.780 to

01:38:21.880 be

01:38:22.040 a

01:38:22.720 close

01:38:23.620 nexus

01:38:24.160 between

01:38:24.540 the

01:38:24.760 amount

01:38:25.040 of

01:38:25.360 effort

01:38:25.840 or

01:38:26.040 work

01:38:26.480 someone

01:38:26.760 puts

01:38:27.240 into

01:38:27.560 it

01:38:27.820 and

01:38:28.420 their

01:38:28.620 ability

01:38:28.960 to

01:38:29.220 ascend

01:38:29.660 and

01:38:30.580 so

01:38:30.800 when

01:38:31.100 those

01:38:31.320 factors

01:38:31.640 are

01:38:31.820 in

01:38:31.940 place

01:38:32.160 people

01:38:32.520 find

01:38:32.880 enjoyment

01:38:33.380 and

01:38:33.780 happiness

01:38:34.440 in

01:38:34.760 their

01:38:34.920 lives

01:38:35.260 and

01:38:35.460 their

01:38:35.640 work

01:38:35.940 coincides

01:38:36.880 well

01:38:37.200 with

01:38:37.380 their

01:38:37.500 lives

01:38:37.700 if

01:38:37.900 on

01:38:38.040 the

01:38:38.140 other

01:38:38.300 hand

01:38:38.500 you're

01:38:39.020 made

01:38:39.220 an

01:38:39.500 object

01:38:40.020 to be

01:38:40.600 acted

01:38:40.900 upon

01:38:41.320 as

01:38:41.640 happens

01:38:42.040 to

01:38:42.700 whatever

01:38:43.020 degree

01:38:43.500 a

01:38:43.780 government

01:38:44.060 incorporates

01:38:45.240 and

01:38:45.540 embraces

01:38:45.940 socialism

01:38:46.620 then

01:38:47.380 you

01:38:47.940 really

01:38:48.240 are

01:38:48.480 the

01:38:48.840 object

01:38:49.480 to be

01:38:49.760 acted

01:38:50.000 upon

01:38:50.340 by

01:38:50.520 the

01:38:50.660 government

01:38:50.880 you're

01:38:51.240 not

01:38:51.500 the

01:38:51.720 hammer

01:38:51.940 you're

01:38:52.240 the

01:38:52.360 nail 0.92

01:38:52.560 with

01:38:52.760 government

01:38:53.020 being

01:38:53.300 the

01:38:53.460 hammer

01:38:53.660 somebody 0.71

01:38:54.200 else

01:38:54.420 is

01:38:54.580 deciding

01:38:54.960 your

01:38:55.200 fate

01:38:55.480 deciding

01:38:56.200 the

01:38:56.620 circumstances

01:38:57.260 in which

01:38:57.960 you

01:38:58.200 and

01:38:58.400 your

01:38:58.660 family

01:38:58.940 find

01:38:59.280 yourselves

01:38:59.700 and

01:39:00.740 it

01:39:01.520 doesn't

01:39:01.920 contribute

01:39:02.400 to

01:39:03.160 happiness

01:39:03.600 we've

01:39:04.100 also

01:39:04.320 found

01:39:04.640 that

01:39:04.840 it's

01:39:05.100 not

01:39:05.520 an

01:39:05.700 efficient

01:39:06.020 means

01:39:06.400 of

01:39:06.560 running

01:39:06.760 anything

01:39:07.040 and

01:39:07.240 so

01:39:07.360 there

01:39:07.520 ends

01:39:07.720 up

01:39:07.880 being

01:39:08.100 less

01:39:08.660 wealth

01:39:08.980 less

01:39:09.320 prosperity

01:39:09.820 overall

01:39:10.320 and

01:39:10.600 so

01:39:10.740 as

01:39:10.900 you

01:39:11.040 mentioned

01:39:11.440 over

01:39:11.600 the

01:39:11.720 last

01:39:11.880 150

01:39:12.600 years

01:39:13.080 I

01:39:13.600 can't

01:39:13.880 think

01:39:14.020 of

01:39:14.120 a

01:39:14.240 single

01:39:14.460 example

01:39:14.940 where

01:39:16.220 on a

01:39:17.260 large

01:39:17.560 scale

01:39:18.060 something

01:39:19.340 tantamount

01:39:19.940 to

01:39:20.180 socialism

01:39:20.700 has

01:39:21.000 made

01:39:21.260 people

01:39:21.520 better

01:39:21.760 off

01:39:22.000 but

01:39:22.320 I

01:39:22.420 can

01:39:22.560 think

01:39:22.760 of

01:39:22.940 a

01:39:23.580 whole

01:39:23.780 lot

01:39:23.980 of

01:39:24.100 examples

01:39:24.560 where

01:39:25.240 lots

01:39:25.560 of

01:39:25.700 people

01:39:25.940 have

01:39:26.260 died

01:39:26.720 from

01:39:27.360 hunger

01:39:27.740 and

01:39:28.500 other

01:39:29.120 maladies

01:39:29.580 that

01:39:29.800 are

01:39:30.000 directly

01:39:30.400 traceable

01:39:31.000 to

01:39:31.200 that

01:39:31.380 kind

01:39:31.620 of

01:39:31.720 system

01:39:32.000 of

01:39:32.160 government

01:39:32.440 so

01:39:32.880 it's

01:39:33.020 yet

01:39:33.160 another

01:39:33.400 reason

01:39:33.780 to

01:39:34.260 eschew

01:39:34.680 socialism

01:39:35.480 you

01:39:35.700 know

01:39:35.800 when

01:39:36.020 Alexis

01:39:36.860 de Tocqueville

01:39:37.580 took his

01:39:38.340 tour in the

01:39:38.860 early

01:39:39.060 1830s

01:39:43.600 where

01:39:45.120 the

01:39:45.300 French

01:39:45.520 Revolution

01:39:46.000 hadn't

01:39:46.420 worked

01:39:46.660 as

01:39:46.840 well

01:39:47.080 one

01:39:48.620 of

01:39:48.740 the

01:39:48.860 things

01:39:49.100 that

01:39:49.260 he

01:39:49.380 observed

01:39:49.960 is

01:39:50.760 that

01:39:51.040 a

01:39:51.600 government

01:39:52.020 that

01:39:52.420 is

01:39:53.240 this

01:39:53.440 brooding

01:39:53.860 omnipresence

01:39:54.660 over

01:39:54.940 its

01:39:55.140 citizenry

01:39:55.760 ends

01:39:57.040 up

01:39:57.280 being

01:39:57.680 a

01:39:58.660 keeper

01:39:59.100 of

01:39:59.460 people

01:39:59.860 much

01:40:00.420 like

01:40:00.700 a

01:40:00.900 farmer

01:40:01.160 is

01:40:01.420 a

01:40:01.560 keeper

01:40:01.800 of

01:40:02.240 sheep

01:40:02.800 and

01:40:03.520 if

01:40:03.860 you

01:40:03.980 want

01:40:04.200 your

01:40:04.380 citizens

01:40:04.760 to

01:40:05.060 grow up

01:40:05.460 like

01:40:05.680 farm

01:40:05.960 animals

01:40:06.280 and

01:40:06.780 to

01:40:06.960 not

01:40:07.200 have

01:40:07.800 as

01:40:07.940 much

01:40:08.120 of

01:40:08.240 their

01:40:08.360 own

01:40:08.560 will

01:40:08.820 their

01:40:09.040 initiative

01:40:09.580 their

01:40:09.820 enjoyment

01:40:10.380 then

01:40:11.440 that's

01:40:11.700 how

01:40:11.800 you

01:40:11.940 would

01:40:12.080 do

01:40:12.240 it

01:40:12.460 otherwise

01:40:13.280 the

01:40:13.560 government

01:40:13.820 needs

01:40:14.480 to

01:40:14.860 not

01:40:15.120 play

01:40:15.360 that

01:40:15.600 role

01:40:15.900 and

01:40:16.600 I

01:40:17.140 think

01:40:17.320 that's

01:40:17.540 been

01:40:17.720 one

01:40:17.880 of

01:40:17.960 the

01:40:18.120 secrets

01:40:18.460 to

01:40:18.700 America's

01:40:19.220 success

01:40:19.680 is

01:40:20.240 that

01:40:20.360 our

01:40:20.480 form

01:40:20.700 of

01:40:20.860 government

01:40:21.080 was

01:40:21.320 designed

01:40:21.680 specifically

01:40:22.140 to avoid

01:40:22.700 that

01:40:22.900 kind

01:40:23.100 of

01:40:23.220 accumulation

01:40:23.660 of

01:40:23.920 power

01:40:24.180 right

01:40:25.960 right

01:40:26.360 well

01:40:26.660 we

01:40:26.940 could

01:40:27.320 discuss

01:40:27.980 that

01:40:28.360 technically

01:40:28.820 too

01:40:29.160 you know

01:40:29.420 there's

01:40:29.660 two

01:40:29.860 forms

01:40:30.340 of

01:40:30.560 reward

01:40:31.220 technically

01:40:33.020 speaking

01:40:33.520 there's

01:40:33.920 satiation

01:40:34.740 that's

01:40:35.520 the reward

01:40:36.040 that you

01:40:36.480 might

01:40:36.680 experience

01:40:37.120 let's

01:40:37.420 say

01:40:37.580 after

01:40:37.960 consuming

01:40:38.780 a

01:40:39.120 well

01:40:41.460 provisioned

01:40:42.320 thanksgiving

01:40:42.900 feast

01:40:43.460 and

01:40:44.080 basically

01:40:44.460 what

01:40:44.740 you

01:40:44.880 do

01:40:45.200 when

01:40:45.700 you're

01:40:45.900 satiated

01:40:46.420 is

01:40:46.700 drift

01:40:47.020 off

01:40:47.360 into

01:40:48.860 unconsciousness

01:40:49.940 right

01:40:50.760 you're

01:40:51.160 prone

01:40:51.700 to sleep

01:40:52.280 because

01:40:52.740 everything

01:40:53.480 is

01:40:53.740 satisfied

01:40:54.200 that's

01:40:54.660 the

01:40:54.880 same

01:40:55.100 word

01:40:55.340 as

01:40:55.500 satiated

01:40:56.060 and

01:40:56.320 that

01:40:57.100 is

01:40:57.300 one

01:40:57.580 form

01:40:57.940 of

01:40:58.140 contentment

01:40:58.820 but

01:40:59.800 what

01:41:00.440 people

01:41:00.800 generally

01:41:01.300 regard

01:41:01.700 as

01:41:01.920 happiness

01:41:02.380 is a

01:41:02.900 different

01:41:03.160 form

01:41:03.520 of

01:41:03.680 reward

01:41:04.100 and

01:41:05.000 happiness

01:41:05.520 emerges

01:41:06.000 in that

01:41:06.420 Arthur

01:41:06.720 Brooks

01:41:07.060 fashion

01:41:07.500 that you

01:41:07.860 just

01:41:08.160 described

01:41:08.700 is that

01:41:09.080 people

01:41:09.500 experience

01:41:10.500 enthusiasm

01:41:11.060 and joy

01:41:11.840 hope

01:41:12.360 engagement

01:41:13.280 meaning

01:41:13.780 so forth

01:41:14.520 when they

01:41:15.500 see

01:41:15.860 themselves

01:41:16.400 advancing

01:41:17.240 towards

01:41:18.160 a valued

01:41:18.900 goal

01:41:19.380 and that

01:41:20.580 means they

01:41:21.040 have to

01:41:21.420 have their

01:41:21.880 own

01:41:22.200 personally

01:41:22.880 valued

01:41:23.480 goals

01:41:23.980 so their

01:41:24.440 own

01:41:24.680 domain

01:41:25.080 of

01:41:25.260 expertise

01:41:25.700 and

01:41:26.060 striving

01:41:26.480 and then

01:41:27.620 the

01:41:27.940 landscape

01:41:28.280 has to

01:41:28.760 be

01:41:28.920 open

01:41:29.220 so that

01:41:29.720 they

01:41:29.920 can

01:41:30.300 see

01:41:30.560 themselves

01:41:30.960 moving

01:41:31.360 forward

01:41:31.860 and

01:41:32.080 uphill

01:41:32.480 and

01:41:33.400 the

01:41:33.820 joy

01:41:34.180 that

01:41:34.460 sustains

01:41:35.060 people

01:41:35.540 in

01:41:36.160 large

01:41:36.600 part

01:41:37.000 is a

01:41:37.620 consequence

01:41:38.200 of the

01:41:39.040 chemical

01:41:39.540 consequences

01:41:40.320 of that

01:41:40.800 form of

01:41:41.240 advancement

01:41:41.800 you know

01:41:42.600 so the

01:41:42.940 drugs of

01:41:43.400 abuse

01:41:43.840 that attract

01:41:44.460 people like

01:41:45.060 cocaine

01:41:45.480 and amphetamines

01:41:46.420 and so

01:41:46.780 forth

01:41:47.120 activate the

01:41:48.460 systems that

01:41:49.120 indicate

01:41:49.840 pathways

01:41:50.760 forward

01:41:51.400 and up

01:41:51.980 and so

01:41:53.080 you do

01:41:53.440 want to

01:41:53.780 constitute

01:41:54.200 your country

01:41:54.800 so that

01:41:55.200 people have

01:41:55.680 the opportunity

01:41:56.440 for forward

01:41:57.180 movement

01:41:57.680 that's

01:41:58.700 that's the

01:41:59.280 frontier myth

01:42:00.080 in some

01:42:00.460 sense that

01:42:01.040 allowed your

01:42:01.920 country to be

01:42:02.580 settled

01:42:02.920 in the first

01:42:04.840 place to be

01:42:05.480 settled in the

01:42:06.320 manner that it

01:42:06.820 was settled

01:42:07.400 and so

01:42:08.500 the notion

01:42:09.840 that what the

01:42:10.400 government should

01:42:10.980 do is provide

01:42:11.740 largesse so 0.89

01:42:12.580 we can all

01:42:13.060 become satiated

01:42:13.940 infants is a 1.00

01:42:14.760 damn it's 0.99

01:42:15.880 it's the kind 1.00

01:42:16.840 of state you

01:42:17.520 want to

01:42:18.360 inculcate if

01:42:19.720 you wanted

01:42:20.140 everybody to

01:42:20.820 be unconscious

01:42:21.500 and asleep

01:42:22.160 and you

01:42:22.680 regarded that as

01:42:23.600 the highest form

01:42:24.360 of human

01:42:24.760 achievement

01:42:25.240 instead of

01:42:26.180 being alert

01:42:26.760 and striving

01:42:27.460 and awake

01:42:28.100 and walking

01:42:29.120 consciously

01:42:29.680 uphill

01:42:30.160 and so it's

01:42:31.560 necessary to

01:42:32.300 distribute all

01:42:32.920 that responsibility

01:42:33.760 and power

01:42:35.160 down the

01:42:35.640 hierarchy to

01:42:36.320 the most

01:42:36.660 local levels

01:42:37.340 possible

01:42:37.880 it is the

01:42:38.740 antidote to

01:42:39.440 tyranny and

01:42:40.040 to slavery

01:42:40.540 and so I

01:42:41.600 wish you

01:42:42.020 success in

01:42:42.800 your attempts

01:42:43.360 to make

01:42:44.540 that case to

01:42:45.300 your colleagues

01:42:45.920 and to the

01:42:46.900 public at large

01:42:47.620 are you

01:42:48.320 optimistic about

01:42:49.540 the possibility

01:42:51.060 of success for

01:42:52.200 your ventures

01:42:52.960 look for reasons

01:42:55.620 that escape me

01:42:56.700 we haven't had as

01:42:57.860 many democrats

01:42:58.660 jump on board

01:42:59.340 with the idea

01:43:00.000 as I would

01:43:00.820 have hoped

01:43:01.260 I do think

01:43:02.100 it's coming

01:43:02.920 it's coming

01:43:03.480 at some point

01:43:04.100 and so that's

01:43:04.620 why I'm

01:43:05.400 breaking this

01:43:06.040 RAINS Act

01:43:06.520 approach into

01:43:07.380 smaller pieces

01:43:08.340 to see if I

01:43:08.900 can work it

01:43:09.400 into other

01:43:09.900 legislation

01:43:10.480 we might not

01:43:11.020 be able to

01:43:11.340 get it for

01:43:11.960 the whole

01:43:12.260 government

01:43:13.080 but we might

01:43:13.640 be able to

01:43:13.920 get it in

01:43:14.340 this or that

01:43:14.840 agency or

01:43:15.440 this or that

01:43:16.000 department

01:43:16.860 at least in

01:43:18.580 specified ways

01:43:20.200 and once we

01:43:21.400 become more

01:43:21.960 comfortable with

01:43:22.780 that I think

01:43:24.200 there's a real

01:43:24.760 opportunity to

01:43:26.000 get it in

01:43:26.440 there

01:43:26.640 there also may

01:43:27.780 be some

01:43:28.120 opportunities in

01:43:29.060 connection with

01:43:29.840 debt ceiling

01:43:30.560 increase

01:43:31.160 discussions

01:43:32.140 spending bill

01:43:32.980 discussions

01:43:33.560 in order to

01:43:34.720 bring in a

01:43:35.860 shorter term

01:43:36.700 version of

01:43:38.200 something like

01:43:39.080 the RAINS Act

01:43:39.780 and once the

01:43:41.140 American people

01:43:41.700 see this and see

01:43:42.420 this in motion

01:43:43.000 I think they're

01:43:43.560 going to like it

01:43:44.200 and I think it

01:43:44.680 will prove to

01:43:45.740 be popular

01:43:46.300 and it's with

01:43:48.120 very good reason

01:43:48.900 the American

01:43:49.320 people many of

01:43:50.400 them feel very

01:43:51.040 distant from

01:43:51.900 their national

01:43:52.720 government with

01:43:53.440 good reason

01:43:54.020 it is itself

01:43:55.060 distant from

01:43:55.660 where most of

01:43:56.140 them live

01:43:56.500 physically

01:43:56.900 but it's also

01:43:58.680 outside the hands

01:43:59.800 of many of the

01:44:00.600 people they just

01:44:01.460 elected to make

01:44:02.280 their laws

01:44:02.800 if I had a

01:44:04.760 nickel for

01:44:05.200 every time the

01:44:05.880 following scenario

01:44:06.960 unfolds

01:44:07.600 an executive branch

01:44:08.620 agency makes a

01:44:09.460 new law

01:44:10.240 these laws

01:44:11.380 many of them

01:44:11.880 carry criminal

01:44:12.480 penalties

01:44:12.860 they are otherwise

01:44:13.600 enforceable against

01:44:14.420 the American people

01:44:15.060 they are for all

01:44:16.100 intents and purposes

01:44:16.800 laws

01:44:17.180 they make a new

01:44:18.000 law and then

01:44:19.360 constituents write

01:44:21.220 letters saying

01:44:22.120 or make phone

01:44:23.340 calls saying

01:44:23.860 hey this is

01:44:24.740 killing us

01:44:25.280 this is making it 0.99

01:44:26.100 impossible for us

01:44:26.800 to run our

01:44:27.200 business

01:44:27.560 it's irrational

01:44:29.200 what do we do

01:44:30.140 members of

01:44:31.160 congress are

01:44:31.560 notorious for

01:44:32.280 writing back

01:44:32.800 saying you

01:44:33.400 know dear

01:44:34.100 sir dear

01:44:34.820 madam

01:44:35.120 those barbarians 1.00

01:44:37.640 over there at

01:44:38.300 that agency

01:44:39.140 x y or z

01:44:40.260 they're barbarians

01:44:42.260 and and i'm

01:44:43.220 i'm going to

01:44:44.600 write them

01:44:45.240 the agency

01:44:45.980 a harshly worded

01:44:46.920 letter and that's

01:44:47.800 most of the time

01:44:48.480 the end of it

01:44:49.160 the American people

01:44:50.660 have been sold

01:44:51.900 short on this

01:44:53.040 they have had

01:44:53.880 their birthright

01:44:54.700 sold out from

01:44:55.720 underneath them

01:44:56.500 as the task of

01:44:58.920 lawmaking has been

01:44:59.740 outsourced to

01:45:00.760 people who cannot

01:45:01.540 be fired

01:45:02.140 this is the closest

01:45:03.360 thing to despotism

01:45:04.700 that America has

01:45:05.480 ever seen

01:45:06.000 and once the

01:45:07.100 American people

01:45:07.580 realize what's been

01:45:08.440 happening over the

01:45:09.040 last eight and a

01:45:09.800 half decades

01:45:10.540 they're going to

01:45:12.080 demand this

01:45:12.720 okay well we also

01:45:14.640 we can tangle up

01:45:15.600 the first part of

01:45:16.320 our talk with the

01:45:17.000 last part then and

01:45:17.940 say well all of

01:45:19.280 the excess spending

01:45:20.440 and emergency

01:45:21.160 procurement on the

01:45:22.760 part of the

01:45:23.280 Russia-Ukraine

01:45:24.040 conflict as well as

01:45:25.200 the war against

01:45:26.180 environmental

01:45:27.300 degradation is

01:45:28.340 producing more and

01:45:29.620 more concentration of

01:45:30.700 power in the hands of

01:45:31.660 fewer and fewer people

01:45:32.620 at the corporate

01:45:33.280 government level and

01:45:34.380 that's a recipe for

01:45:35.580 tyranny for sure

01:45:36.500 it's also a recipe for

01:45:38.000 the kind of slavery

01:45:38.740 that deprives people of

01:45:41.080 their requisite

01:45:41.720 responsibility and

01:45:42.840 therefore their destiny

01:45:43.800 and so that seems

01:45:45.260 bad on all fronts

01:45:46.540 unless you want to be

01:45:47.460 an unconscious infant

01:45:48.600 and so that's also a

01:45:50.560 pretty dismal view of

01:45:51.660 what would you call it

01:45:53.460 the great adventure of

01:45:54.400 humanity

01:45:54.900 so all right

01:45:56.360 Senator Lee

01:45:57.560 we covered a lot of

01:45:58.800 territory today

01:45:59.880 wandering through the

01:46:01.560 complexities of the

01:46:02.820 Russia-Ukraine

01:46:04.260 and broader western

01:46:06.320 proxy war

01:46:07.320 that's one bloody

01:46:08.800 abysmal

01:46:09.420 chasm to

01:46:10.880 glance into

01:46:12.260 and I really appreciate

01:46:13.480 the fact that you're

01:46:14.320 willing to speak

01:46:14.880 forthrightly about it

01:46:15.900 today as I'm sure

01:46:16.800 the people who are

01:46:17.880 listening

01:46:18.260 will also appreciate

01:46:20.300 thank you to

01:46:21.060 all of you who are

01:46:22.040 listening and paying

01:46:22.880 attention and I hope

01:46:23.760 you keep listening and

01:46:24.920 paying attention because

01:46:25.880 there's a lot at stake

01:46:26.860 here more right now than

01:46:28.480 perhaps there ever has

01:46:29.580 been in some real sense

01:46:30.860 so to the Daily Wire

01:46:32.580 Plus folks who

01:46:33.600 facilitated this

01:46:34.480 conversation thank you

01:46:35.620 the film crew here in

01:46:36.840 Winnipeg because I'm in

01:46:38.320 Winnipeg today

01:46:39.080 much appreciated and

01:46:40.980 I'm going to flip over

01:46:43.080 now to the Daily Wire

01:46:43.920 Plus platform and talk to

01:46:45.300 Senator Lee for another

01:46:46.540 20 minutes to half an hour

01:46:48.200 about issues related to

01:46:50.580 our discussion today but

01:46:51.780 if you would like to

01:46:53.920 join us there and

01:46:55.380 provide some support to

01:46:56.540 the Daily Wire Plus

01:46:57.300 folks that would be

01:46:58.260 useful if you're

01:46:59.620 inclined and so

01:47:01.060 thanks again Senator

01:47:02.220 Lee it's always a

01:47:03.060 pleasure talking to you

01:47:03.980 pleasure's mine thank

01:47:05.200 you

01:47:05.420 hello everyone I

01:47:08.760 would encourage you to

01:47:09.520 continue listening to my

01:47:10.980 conversation with my

01:47:12.120 guest on

01:47:13.160 dailywireplus.com

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The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - April 06, 2023

346. Russia⧸Ukraine, ESG, gigantism and the West ｜ Senator Mike Lee

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