The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - 510. The Greatest Hits

00:00:00.000 Hello, everybody. So, as you no doubt are aware, 2024, one of the most preposterous years possible is coming to a close, and it's been quite a trip, as I'm sure next year will be.

00:00:22.760 And what we have for you today is a compilation of highlight clips from the last year. It'll be a trip down memory lane for all of us. And, you know, welcome to the reminiscences.

00:00:39.240 Starting from the beginning, the College of Psychologists of Ontario, a regulatory board that was formed to monitor psychologists' relationships with their clients mainly, has been after you for, is it three years or is it longer than that?

00:00:59.080 It depends on the waves, but for this issue, it's been three or four years, yeah.

00:01:04.800 So, working professionals like doctors, lawyers, massage therapists even, are all overseen by regulatory boards.

00:01:12.240 What regulatory boards are supposed to do is give clients who've been basically abused by working professionals a place to go to, to complain to.

00:01:20.140 What happened to you is a bunch of people who weren't your clients, random people online from all over the world, complained about a number of your tweets, as well as comments you made on Joe Rogan.

00:01:30.060 The sorry, not beautiful tweet in reference to a extremely obese swimsuit model, a tweet criticizing the government of Canada, a tweet saying that physicians were moving women's breasts for being trans was criminal.

00:01:44.160 And one, I thought, fairly entertaining tweet suggesting that this is the tweet that people online are saying you were inciting suicide, which honestly, I think you'd have to have the IQ of a beetle in order to think that.

00:01:58.600 But anyway, you responded to someone who thought the world's population was too high and suggested that he should include himself in the depopulation he was already suggesting.

00:02:07.320 The gist of it is, it looks like your license is getting taken away.

00:02:11.140 I think probably the most comical element of this absolute charade is that the College of Psychologists and Behavior Analysts, because that's what they call themselves now in Ontario, convenient name change, they received perhaps, I don't know for sure, 15 complaints about me from people who, as Michaela pointed out, weren't my clients,

00:02:38.240 or even knew my clients or had anything to do with them, complaining about things that I said that were true and that needed to be said.

00:02:46.160 So, for example, with the Joe Rogan transcript, which was submitted in its totality as a complaint, I pointed out that stacking extremely unwieldy economic models, projecting out 100 years into the future on top of climate models that are in themselves unwieldy, was not anything approximating settled and genuine science, which is absolutely 100% the truth.

00:03:12.220 And you may have noticed, if you were paying attention, that the Democrats under Kamala Harris said nothing about climate in the last election, and so that narrative has turned.

00:03:22.320 Anyways, they're still pursuing me. Hypothetically, they found someone who doesn't know what planet they live on to serve as my re-education agent, even though we're squabbling over the details of that.

00:03:35.800 They don't want any of it made public. And that's not going to happen. They've received 25,000 complaints about their own behavior. And they admitted that.

00:03:46.080 And they're actually bound by their own rules, which they never pay any attention to anyways, to investigate all those complaints and to find out if they're justified.

00:03:53.920 And so it's just a complete bloody nightmare. And in principle, I am still scheduled to be re-educated by some social media expert, whatever the hell that is, so that I conduct myself more appropriately on social media.

00:04:10.280 And so God only knows how that's going to turn out. It's annoying and blackly comical at the same time. So we'll keep you posted on that front. 0.99

00:04:23.920 Okay, so how did we get from protecting vulnerable children from online sexual exploitation with a gigantic unnamed bureaucracy with indefinite rights and virtually no responsibility to whatever the hell hateful speech is?

00:04:45.280 I mean, first of all, we might ask ourselves, and Constantine, you can weigh in here too, is like the whole notion of hateful speech, that's a troublesome one for me, because there's an obvious element of subjective judgment in it, like a clearly obvious one.

00:05:01.120 So part of the problem is the premise. And the premise is widely accepted, because we accept this premise generally now in society, because this is where we're at.

00:05:12.440 But the premise is that the premise is that the government is responsible for keeping people safe, including the children.

00:05:20.340 And that's ignoring the best mechanism we already have to keep children safe, which is their parents.

00:05:26.620 So that's all in reference to this absolutely and utterly insane bill in Canada, C-63, which is grinding its way through the legislative process in Canada as we speak.

00:05:39.080 As was alluded to in the clip, it purports to be a bill that does nothing but save the children from online predators, particularly, let's say, of the sexual type.

00:05:51.920 And it's like, you know, it's pretty hard to mount an argument against that as an aim, but sandwiched in between the clauses that describe attempts to accomplish that end badly, I would say, because there's much more effective ways of doing it,

00:06:08.520 are these insane clauses that deal with speech that would be hateful towards protected groups.

00:06:18.220 Now, you have to understand, in Canada, since Bill C-16, in Canada, since Bill C-16, one of the protected classes,

00:06:26.640 I don't even understand how this functions legally, is gender expression.

00:06:31.560 And it's literally the case that gender expression is fashion. 0.67

00:06:35.560 And so, I just can't believe that any of this is true.

00:06:39.540 It's the case that criticizing someone's fashion choice in Canada could be construed as hate speech.

00:06:47.940 Now, then you might ask, well, what's the punishment for that?

00:06:50.580 Well, this is where things get far past the worst nightmares of both Kafka and George Orwell.

00:06:57.600 So, in this bill, there is a provision so that people who are afraid that someone they know might commit a hate crime can take that person in front of a provincial magistrate.

00:07:10.660 And if the magistrate agrees that there is a possibility that this person's fear is warranted, whatever that means,

00:07:20.120 I suppose that would be based on past behavior, perhaps, God only knows,

00:07:24.480 then that person can be fitted with an ankle bracelet and confined to their own quarters for periods of up to a year,

00:07:32.600 which is completely insane, obviously, and be subject to the continual monitoring of their bodily fluids on a daily basis,

00:07:43.580 I guess, so that, what, they're not supposed to consume alcohol, that would be part of it,

00:07:48.360 or any other illicit drug, including the marijuana, that the liberals themselves have made legal in a successful attempt to bribe the voters.

00:07:58.680 So, and I, oh, that's one little section of this Bill C-63.

00:08:04.700 Now, it's a long ways through the legislative process in Canada already,

00:08:08.500 and there's some real possibility that the head narcissist of Canada,

00:08:13.740 and that's Justin Trudeau and his band of minion supporters,

00:08:18.300 that would be Jagmeet Singh, who is the worst possible leader for the working class that you could imagine,

00:08:24.700 with his bespoke suits and his Rolexes.

00:08:28.700 Now, I have bespoke suits and a Rolex, too, and you might think, 0.97

00:08:31.960 well, that's pretty damn hypocritical.

00:08:33.740 It's like, yeah, I'm not a socialist who's claiming to be a champion of the working class, 0.97

00:08:38.680 so that's very different.

00:08:41.040 Cup of tea, you might say.

00:08:42.380 In any case, it's highly probable that Trudeau, before he disappears into the perdition that he so richly deserves,

00:08:50.060 as his liberal party will be eliminated as a political entity in Canada in the next election,

00:08:57.180 because of the absolute catastrophe of his nine years of rule,

00:09:01.020 during which Canada went from a country whose average, whose per capita gross domestic product

00:09:07.280 approximated that of the United States, so a country as rich as the United States,

00:09:11.800 to a country now whose, the inhabitants of whose richest province per capita,

00:09:18.380 that would be Ontario, are poorer than the inhabitants of the United States poorest state,

00:09:25.000 that would be Mississippi.

00:09:26.340 That's Justin Trudeau for us.

00:09:28.480 And so, I was discussing Bill C-63 with Bruce Party,

00:09:33.480 who's a remarkable and courageous professor of law.

00:09:37.660 There's actually one of those that exists,

00:09:39.500 a remarkable and courageous Canadian professor of law.

00:09:43.100 That's Bruce Party and Constantine Kissin.

00:09:45.760 And we were discussing that in the broader context of these

00:09:48.540 ridiculously authoritarian laws that are popping up,

00:09:54.000 not only in Canada,

00:09:54.920 because maybe it wouldn't be of all, all that interesting if it's only Canada,

00:09:58.920 but particularly in the UK, under the new Labour government,

00:10:02.360 and also in Australia, which is a country that's gone just completely out of its mind.

00:10:06.700 And so, we discussed all that in the context of

00:10:09.240 broader threat to free speech that's emerging

00:10:12.620 pretty much everywhere except the United States.

00:10:15.760 So, we'll see how that goes.

00:10:18.260 C-63 could easily be law in Canada.

00:10:20.740 Now, I recently moved to the United States.

00:10:22.540 Part of the reason for that was Bill C-63 because the other thing it does is

00:10:26.820 it enables informants of the same type, for example,

00:10:30.800 who had the great thrill of turning me in to the College of Psychologists

00:10:35.560 to go over all the public utterances you've ever made on any social media platform

00:10:42.260 to find anything that might be regarded as indicative of hate

00:10:46.280 defined in the broadest possible manner

00:10:48.980 so that they can turn you over to these new governmental agencies

00:10:53.440 that can investigate you.

00:10:55.200 And the punishments are extremely draconian.

00:10:58.440 And you know, in the UK, where similar legislation has already been implemented,

00:11:02.900 there are thousands of people who are being prosecuted for,

00:11:06.900 you know, Twitter crimes or Facebook crimes.

00:11:10.060 The police are hell-bent on, what do they call them?

00:11:13.080 Non-crime hate incidents in the UK.

00:11:15.180 And they're not precisely criminal, although they would be much more criminal in Canada

00:11:20.400 if this legislation passed.

00:11:22.420 Dreadful. Dreadful.

00:11:24.240 And so, and Trudeau is going to be the Prime Minister of Canada

00:11:27.240 in all likelihood till October of 2025.

00:11:30.380 So he's got a whole year to wreak havoc on the country

00:11:34.340 that's turned its back on him in the miserable fashion that,

00:11:38.720 what would you say, wounded narcissists are particularly expert at carrying out.

00:11:44.720 So, you know, he believes that he's God's gift to Canada, that's for sure.

00:11:49.100 And now that Canadians have turned their back on him, and justly so, 0.98

00:11:54.180 he's going to have precisely the attitude of the wounded narcissist

00:11:57.680 who presumes that, well, everyone in the country didn't deserve anyone as remarkable as him.

00:12:04.920 And that's a great platform upon which you would develop vengeful legislative moves.

00:12:13.140 So we're going to see a lot of that in Canada in the next nine months

00:12:16.600 before the Liberals disappear into the pit that they've dug for themselves.

00:12:20.880 And so what you're talking about there is being able to live a life of dignity.

00:12:31.760 So we, our values, our small c conservative values that we talk about with children all the time.

00:12:36.800 The idea of being able to take responsibility, not being a victim,

00:12:41.080 somebody who has a sense of duty towards others.

00:12:43.920 I don't disrupt my class, not just because I don't want to get a detention,

00:12:46.860 but because I wouldn't want to disrupt the learning from my classmates.

00:12:50.200 Being somebody who is able to sacrifice.

00:12:52.460 So that position on prayer, for instance, you know, the Muslim children,

00:12:56.320 well, they put up with not having a prayer room.

00:12:58.180 They make that sacrifice for the betterment of the whole.

00:13:00.580 The Jehovah Witness children, there's Macbeth that we teach as a set GCSE text.

00:13:06.580 It has witches in it. 1.00

00:13:07.480 They don't like the magic.

00:13:08.960 We also teach a Christmas carol, Christmas in there.

00:13:12.480 They don't like it because of Christmas,

00:13:14.140 but they put up with it because they think about,

00:13:17.220 they self-sacrifice for the betterment of the whole.

00:13:19.440 The Hindu children who think, well, we want our separate plates at lunch 1.00

00:13:23.100 because the eggs have touched the plates.

00:13:24.680 So we don't like that.

00:13:25.980 They too self-sacrifice so that for the betterment of the whole.

00:13:29.380 Because the problem with multiculturalism is that if each group is vying for their rights 0.99

00:13:34.860 and it's always, I want this, I want that,

00:13:37.240 and you're a racist or you're an Islamophobe unless I get it, 0.95

00:13:40.600 then we'll never be happy. 0.98

00:13:42.320 We'll never be successful.

00:13:43.420 And schools struggle with this because they are multicultural communities.

00:13:47.960 And unfortunately, our whole culture encourages them to divide children 0.50

00:13:52.520 according to race and religion and sexuality and so on.

00:13:55.520 So you have your LGBT group over there,

00:13:57.380 you have your Hindu group over there,

00:13:58.540 the Muslim group over here and so on.

00:14:00.120 Any of you billionaires out there listening who have spare money

00:14:03.420 is like you should give Catherine Burblesingh a call

00:14:06.720 because we could use about a hundred of her. 1.00

00:14:08.960 So that was Catherine Burblesingh that you just heard.

00:14:13.900 She runs a school in the UK called the Michaela School,

00:14:17.100 which it was reported just recently,

00:14:20.060 once again, top the charts in the UK for the educational achievement of her students.

00:14:25.900 Now, you remember in the UK, there are a multitude of very high quality private,

00:14:31.300 very expensive private schools.

00:14:33.180 Now, Catherine runs a state school and she doesn't select her incoming students.

00:14:40.420 So her school is in what you would.

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00:15:51.380 Describe as inner-city working-class London.

00:15:54.440 It's a rough place, the neighborhood.

00:15:56.760 And she has to take all comers. 0.67

00:15:58.500 And she places more of her students by percentage in top universities in the UK when they graduate.

00:16:06.620 She has a very high graduation rate, by the way, than any other school.

00:16:10.300 And the left, the radical leftist utopians who love children, hate her.

00:16:15.640 They hate her because she's, what does she describe herself as? 1.00

00:16:19.200 The UK's strictest headmistress.

00:16:21.340 Which is kind of a joke.

00:16:22.900 You know what I mean?

00:16:23.620 It's, she's, it's a bit of self-parody. 0.84

00:16:26.960 Tammy, my wife and I went to the Michaela school and watched her operation.

00:16:32.200 And it was just, it'd bring a tear to your eye, man.

00:16:34.920 It was so, it was something to see.

00:16:36.860 All these kids, they're in their uniforms.

00:16:39.300 They're disciplined.

00:16:41.340 There's no talking in the hallways, for example.

00:16:43.520 They're making a beeline to the next class.

00:16:45.320 And then when you walk into the class with your little group, none of the students even look at you when you walk in.

00:16:50.620 They're so focused on the teacher that their attention isn't broken for a minute.

00:16:55.000 Now that's a, that's completely unprecedented.

00:16:58.220 And the teachers too, they're just, and they're teaching those kids so fast that it's like,

00:17:03.240 it's higher intensity teaching and receiving than I saw in the best graduate seminars that I've ever seen.

00:17:10.520 It was something to see.

00:17:11.720 And the kids, we talked to a lot of the kids, they love it there because a lot of them came from really rough schools where they were,

00:17:18.360 especially if they had any pretensions to academic achievement, they were being pounded flat on a regular basis, you know.

00:17:23.880 And it's a terrible thing when you're a kid to go to a school that's dominated by bullies of the ideological type,

00:17:30.920 which would be the teachers, and then of the physical type, 0.97

00:17:33.460 which would be the bullies that the ideological teachers are too damn cowardly to regulate. 0.71

00:17:37.640 And so those kids, they came from rough schools and they were so happy to be in this school where they were literally safe and being educated. 0.65

00:17:46.920 And where all the teachers who were great, by the way, and I'm not saying that lightly,

00:17:52.200 were really devoted to making, to offering the opportunity to these children to become everything they could be.

00:17:59.540 And Burblesingh students ace the standardized tests, despite the fact that most of them are from, you know, 1.00

00:18:06.760 oppressed minority backgrounds to use the horrible progressive parlance. 0.92

00:18:11.400 And, you know, we need like a hundred of her. 1.00

00:18:14.160 A hundred Catherine Burblesings and the whole education system would be revolutionized. 0.99

00:18:19.280 She is a force of nature and tough as a boot. 0.99

00:18:22.480 And the cancel mob has come for her like dozens of times and coming for Catherine Burblesingh, 0.96

00:18:28.480 that's a very bad idea. 0.96

00:18:30.320 So she'll like chew you up and spit you out in no time flat. 1.00

00:18:34.280 And it was a privilege to go to her school and more power to her.

00:18:38.540 And again, she pulled off the same thing this year. 0.99

00:18:41.080 So, and, and got almost no credit for it from the idiot labor party in the UK, 1.00

00:18:46.200 despite the fact that she's actually doing what they promised to do. 0.99

00:18:50.400 That's why they're so annoyed with her because she's actually showed that it's possible 0.57

00:18:54.360 and she can do it efficiently and inexpensively and in a manner that would scale. 0.99

00:18:59.840 And of course, that's not happening because people would,

00:19:04.820 especially the radical progressive types,

00:19:06.660 they'd far rather moralize about a problem endlessly than actually solve it.

00:19:10.980 So yeah, Catherine Burblesingh, two thumbs up for her. 0.99

00:19:14.800 That's for sure.

00:19:15.760 Check her out. 0.99

00:19:16.420 The Michaela school in the UK, man, if every school was like that,

00:19:20.400 every kid would be a killer.

00:19:23.180 So, and not in the, you know, terrible sense that street killer emerges.

00:19:29.740 So out of the typical school.

00:19:31.480 I've said, if you worry about consequence, you will never, ever bring about change.

00:19:40.160 You won't bring about change.

00:19:41.120 I wouldn't walk out my front door if I were.

00:19:42.320 I wouldn't come to Canada if I was worrying about consequence,

00:19:44.540 getting sort of torn down by a communist government.

00:19:46.820 But if you worry about consequence, you won't bring about change.

00:19:49.860 An incompetent communist government.

00:19:51.960 An incompetent communist government. 0.96

00:19:52.580 You better be precise. 0.91

00:19:53.860 Yeah, yeah.

00:19:54.200 You should probably throw a bit of malevolence, wounded narcissism, malevolence in it too.

00:19:59.380 You know, just for the icing.

00:20:01.000 But so, so I, so I, so I, but when I come out of court that day with the injunction,

00:20:05.900 I was scared, I was scared in all honesty.

00:20:09.500 I've been in prison multiple times to do my work.

00:20:13.360 I spent a year, I've done a year of solitary confinement, which damaged me,

00:20:16.840 which was totally damaged me.

00:20:18.180 I went into prison with one person and come out another.

00:20:20.200 Yeah.

00:20:20.820 And I, so at that time, and it also damaged my family.

00:20:24.140 So at that time, I didn't play the film.

00:20:28.880 Right.

00:20:31.860 So this is interesting, I think.

00:20:33.680 I should have played the film.

00:20:34.640 These are adult, these are adult problems that haven't been dealt with because people

00:20:39.320 aren't allowed to speak.

00:20:40.780 And now children are at the brunt of it.

00:20:44.000 My wife, Tammy, interviewed Tommy with me.

00:20:46.760 Tommy is the most reviled man in the UK, I would say.

00:20:50.300 That's, that's an honest assessment.

00:20:53.520 He, he was a whistleblower with regard to the gangs in the UK.

00:20:58.560 And if, if you want to investigate an ugly story,

00:21:02.720 wander down that rabbit hole for a week or two,

00:21:06.140 there were thousands of young women who were 0.94

00:21:09.200 in the United Kingdom by organized gangs.

00:21:14.520 And the authorities work to still work to cover it up.

00:21:19.200 And many working class towns, many.

00:21:22.420 And, uh, well, Tommy Robinson's cousin was one of the girls who,

00:21:26.800 who got tangled up in that catastrophic mess.

00:21:29.920 And Tommy has been reviled as a right-wing provocateur, you know,

00:21:35.440 next door to a Nazi. 0.59

00:21:36.840 And he's paid a major league price for that.

00:21:40.380 Uh, he's in prison right now in the UK for contempt of court.

00:21:44.580 He had left the UK after our interviews and went to,

00:21:50.240 I believe he was in Spain, but he came back to face the music.

00:21:53.640 And they, they put him in prison and in a rough prison too,

00:21:58.160 even though it was a civil charge.

00:21:59.540 And even people I regard as sensible in the UK are ambivalent

00:22:04.300 with regards to Tommy, because he really is, he's from the streets.

00:22:08.000 He's a working class guy.

00:22:09.280 He's tough as a boot.

00:22:10.520 And he's, he's not, he's got the background you'd expect

00:22:14.780 from someone like that.

00:22:15.860 Like, but he's super smart and he's super dedicated.

00:22:19.080 And he's, he's amazingly intelligent and he's unstoppable.

00:22:25.520 Hopefully this next prison bout isn't going to do him in,

00:22:29.500 or he isn't killed in prison because that's a real possibility.

00:22:34.620 In the UK is going to have to,

00:22:36.420 the, the, the leadership of the conservatives

00:22:39.700 and the reform party are going to have to reconcile themselves

00:22:42.860 with the people that Tommy represents,

00:22:45.160 the genuine working class in Britain,

00:22:47.060 because they deserve a voice and need one.

00:22:50.320 And certainly Tommy is one of the few people who've provided that.

00:22:54.220 And Tommy isn't of the right class, you know,

00:22:57.380 and that's a problem in the UK.

00:22:59.280 And, but he's extremely brave.

00:23:02.020 And the gang story in the UK is the only thing,

00:23:07.740 the only story I know that's indicative of the state of disrepair

00:23:12.320 of the West, let's say, that's approximately horrific,

00:23:15.920 as horrific as the gang story is the surgery and mutilation story.

00:23:22.340 And, you know, we should be ashamed of ourselves deeply

00:23:25.700 for like five decades for both of those things.

00:23:28.360 And yet Tommy has been persecuted intensely and continually.

00:23:33.260 and now for being brave enough to point to the fact of these,

00:23:40.580 of the existence of these gangs

00:23:43.080 and for his role in identifying the true,

00:23:46.180 not only the true perpetrators, 0.96

00:23:47.860 but also the cowards and liars and enablers 0.99

00:23:52.600 who've covered this all up for literally for decades. 1.00

00:23:56.640 It's an ugly business.

00:23:58.260 Now, you know, this was the most contentious podcast,

00:24:04.080 riskiest podcast, maybe that I ever did.

00:24:07.420 And I did it in part at the insistence of my wife,

00:24:09.940 who'd been following Tommy, as I have been for many, many years.

00:24:13.420 And he conducted himself extremely well.

00:24:17.560 We got very little blowback for the podcast.

00:24:20.280 We did two of them, which is really remarkable

00:24:22.100 because Tommy Robertson is a red hot,

00:24:25.580 he's a, he's a, he's a red hot piece of iron

00:24:27.740 that you grasp at your peril,

00:24:29.480 but he comported himself extremely well.

00:24:31.880 He was really, really nervous in the studio,

00:24:34.260 you know, because he knew,

00:24:36.340 well, he knew what was at stake.

00:24:38.820 And I certainly believe that the consequence of this

00:24:41.660 was that he came out with his reputation much enhanced.

00:24:47.300 He's someone I admire.

00:24:49.560 Tommy's a tough guy.

00:24:50.600 And you can't stop him.

00:24:54.140 And he's paid a major price for it, him and his family,

00:24:57.740 like a price higher than I would say anyone else I know,

00:25:00.960 even maybe including Ayaan Hirsi Ali,

00:25:03.080 who's another person the left detests,

00:25:06.260 who's so brave and so upright.

00:25:08.320 It's so honorable that it's like,

00:25:10.060 it's a, it's a, it's painful to meet them.

00:25:13.200 You know, they're the sort of people

00:25:14.620 you kind of feel shame in their presence

00:25:16.260 because they're, they have the kind of courage 0.99

00:25:19.540 you could have if you weren't such a bloody coward. 0.98

00:25:22.600 So I hope Tommy manages to keep his head together, 1.00

00:25:27.560 given what's facing him at the moment.

00:25:30.740 I think they put him in prison for nine months

00:25:32.840 for showing a movie about another scandal in the UK,

00:25:37.560 for showing a movie after the court had told him

00:25:40.440 that he wasn't allowed to show it.

00:25:42.740 He regarded that as an extension of his activity as a journalist.

00:25:46.420 And I believe Elon Musk shared the movie,

00:25:50.400 even if Elon didn't,

00:25:51.900 because I might be wrong about that,

00:25:53.160 although I know Elon has shared some of Tommy's material.

00:25:57.620 It was extremely widely disseminated on X.

00:26:07.820 When I was, I don't know, about 11 or 12 years old,

00:26:12.780 I had somewhat of an existential crisis

00:26:17.040 because it, I, there just didn't seem to be any meaning

00:26:20.400 in the world, like I, no meaning to life.

00:26:24.380 And so I actually read,

00:26:28.160 try to read all the religious texts.

00:26:30.460 At that age?

00:26:31.560 Yes.

00:26:33.060 Okay.

00:26:33.500 So I was a voracious reader as a kid.

00:26:37.360 So I, you know, obviously read the Bible.

00:26:42.480 I, um, I read the Quran, uh, the Torah,

00:26:48.740 you know, the, the various, uh, but, but on the Hindu side,

00:26:53.200 just, just trying to understand all these things.

00:26:55.680 Um, and, uh, obviously as a 12 year old,

00:26:58.520 you're not really going to understand these things super well,

00:27:00.960 but I've just.

00:27:01.320 Well, you understood it well enough

00:27:02.660 to have an existential crisis when you were 11 or 12.

00:27:05.120 Yeah.

00:27:05.460 I'm just trying to figure out.

00:27:05.880 Well, that's a start.

00:27:06.460 Does anyone have an answer that, that makes sense?

00:27:09.520 And then I started getting into, uh, the philosophy books.

00:27:13.440 Um, and I read, uh, quite a bit of Schopenhauer and Nietzsche.

00:27:18.480 And, uh, which is quite depressing to read as a, as a kid.

00:27:21.820 Yeah.

00:27:22.500 You might say that.

00:27:23.540 That's depressing as a, as an adult.

00:27:25.200 But, um, and, um, and, and, and, and, and none of them really seemed to have,

00:27:32.540 to me, answers that resonated, at least to me.

00:27:37.140 Um, and, um, so, but then I read, uh, Douglas Adams' Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy,

00:27:43.860 which is really a book on philosophy disguised as humor.

00:27:46.180 Mm-hmm.

00:27:46.580 And what Douglas Adams, the point that Adams tries to make there is that,

00:27:50.760 um, we don't actually know all the answers, obviously.

00:27:54.200 Yeah.

00:27:54.480 In fact, we don't even know what the right questions are to ask.

00:27:57.940 Yeah.

00:27:58.240 So there was a couple of cardinal moments in that Elon Musk interview.

00:28:01.440 I mean, the whole thing was a real privilege.

00:28:05.540 We went out to his Cybertruck factory, which is just an absolutely amazing building.

00:28:11.840 It's immense.

00:28:13.060 It's like five airports big.

00:28:15.800 It's, and he built it in no time flat.

00:28:18.900 And then he's making these preposterous, powerful electric vehicles that actually function,

00:28:26.260 despite government opposition, despite the fact that the government is pushing electric vehicles.

00:28:32.000 So, you know, that's a small part of Elon Musk's story.

00:28:35.840 And two things really happened in this interview that were worthy of note, I would say,

00:28:41.200 especially given what's transpired in relationship to Elon and the new Trump administration.

00:28:47.900 The first one was this clip here, because see, Elon pointed to something very important in that discussion.

00:28:56.800 He said that he had a profound existential crisis, questioning the meaning of life, you know, when he was.

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00:29:56.000 Well, when he was a very young teenager, and it's not that rare for really hyper-intelligent teenagers.

00:30:05.780 And he said that the way he resolved that essentially was to start to envision his life as a quest, right?

00:30:12.600 That he found deep meaning in pushing the limits.

00:30:15.500 Well, you can see that, for example, in his ambitions to go to Mars, in the ambitions that drive all of his companies, to push the limits and to explore and to ask questions and to investigate.

00:30:29.240 And that in that process of investigation and exploration and production, meaning itself is to be found.

00:30:37.300 And that's, well, that was a sufficiently profound realization for Elon that it did solve his, it did quell the storms of his existential crisis and put him on the pathway that he's been walking ever since in this radically successful manner.

00:30:54.620 And so that was very interesting to hear and to work through from a psychological perspective.

00:31:01.740 But the other thing that happened in that interview was that Musk talked a little bit about his experiences as a father whose child fell prey to the ideological machinations of the butchers and their lying enablers,

00:31:18.200 which at the moment includes virtually all psychologists and a large proportion of the medical establishment, absolutely unforgivable in my estimation and in his, you know, it's clear to me that part of Elon's determination to be the most formidable of enemies

00:31:36.800 in relationship to the woke mob was in no little consequence of the fact that he had been brutally lied to when he was in serious trouble with one of his children who did in fact transition and who is alienated from him.

00:31:50.500 You know, the typical physician, the typical psychologist, I say this to my own great shame, being a member of the profession of psychologists is to tell parents whose children are manifesting the kind of gender dysphoria, bodily dysmorphia, let's say,

00:32:08.000 that's actually quite common in early adolescence, especially among women, to tell them that that has to be rectified with puberty blockers and the most barbaric of experimental surgery.

00:32:20.500 It's so awful, that surgery, that you can't read it without, it's like, it's silence of the lambs bad.

00:32:28.320 It's, there's, it's inexcusable what's being done and part of the way that parents are talked into that is that the lying therapists tell them that if they don't participate in this stunningly brutal medical process,

00:32:47.460 that their children will commit suicide, that is the biggest lie that I've ever heard members of my profession utter.

00:32:55.120 There's absolutely no evidence whatsoever that that's true.

00:32:58.380 There never has been any evidence of that sort and anyone reasonably well-trained as a psychologist knows it.

00:33:06.220 And silence on this front is inexcusable and, well, Musk, you might say, what could you say about Elon?

00:33:15.180 He's decided not to be silent.

00:33:17.760 Right.

00:33:18.420 And so he's not, I would, he's not the person that you would choose to go to war against if you had a choice, but that choice has already been made.

00:33:27.340 And he's not the least bit happy that he lost one of his kids and he revealed that in some real detail on the podcast.

00:33:35.960 Really, it's awful.

00:33:38.740 And I know other families who've been affected in the same way.

00:33:41.100 It's, all of us should be deeply ashamed of the fact that we're complicit by our silence in this insane, devastating, deceitful, ideologically ridden, fetishistic, sexually hedonistic catastrophe.

00:34:02.520 Thankfully, many places are waking up, even the Labour Party in the UK, a party of whom virtually nothing good can or should be said, had enough sense to extend the ban on puberty blockers to minors throughout the UK.

00:34:19.960 So the Europeans are waking up. 0.63

00:34:22.080 Americans not yet, although many states, many states at the state level, there has been increasing pushback.

00:34:30.660 Thank God for that.

00:34:31.700 But Canada, of course, is still completely captured by the butchering woke ideologues and their, you know, Pied Piper leader, Trudeau.

00:34:42.400 So, yeah, the Musk interview was really something.

00:34:45.080 I probably talked too much during it, and that's too bad.

00:34:48.180 But it was a real privilege to talk to him and, you know, to see his mind in action.

00:34:54.600 He's a remarkable person.

00:34:55.820 You're going to go back to the UK, you said, if I got this right, near the end of October to face the music.

00:35:06.240 That's the plan.

00:35:06.920 And in the meantime, I presume your strategy so far has been certainly not to involve yourself in the demonstrations and so forth that have been occurring in the UK over the last few weeks.

00:35:19.060 Except you also said that you were correcting certain misapprehensions about what's been said about you and also the information that's been spread around.

00:35:28.240 So you're going to, your plan is to stay out of the, to let the events unfold as they will, but you're going to go back to the UK and face the music.

00:35:38.220 That's the plan?

00:35:39.400 My plan is, my documentary is currently on 44 million views.

00:35:43.120 By the time they get me in jail, it'll be on 100 million.

00:35:45.520 So by all means, send me to jail.

00:35:47.340 You'll put more eyes on that film than I could ever dream of.

00:35:49.840 People need to realise the weaponisation of the court system against the people.

00:35:54.140 It's not right.

00:35:55.240 It's not right.

00:35:56.340 And people need to know what they're doing and how they're silencing dissident voices across the West.

00:36:01.540 They need to understand it.

00:36:02.800 If we're going to stop it, people need to understand it.

00:36:04.580 If Donald Trump gets elected, he needs to break this.

00:36:06.800 OK, the weaponisation of the courts, the unfair judiciary.

00:36:09.800 Do you know, I will watch what I say when I get into court before the judge.

00:36:13.240 Have you watched the film, Your Honour? 0.97

00:36:14.900 If you have watched the film and I'm still sat here facing prosecution, you're corrupt as well.

00:36:18.660 Because that film categorically proves all I've done was report the truth.

00:36:21.880 In what sane, freedom-loving world are we standing in where someone faces two years for reporting the truth?

00:36:28.020 Do we believe in the journalism or not?

00:36:29.740 Do we believe in freedom of the press or not?

00:36:31.400 The problem is so many journalists don't believe in it.

00:36:33.660 They believe in activism.

00:36:35.220 They're activists, not journalists.

00:36:36.800 They're total activists.

00:36:37.980 So my intention is on the 28th and 29th of October to put the British judiciary on trial in the world's eyes.

00:36:46.280 The film that Tommy Robinson is talking about is called Silenced, in case you want to watch it.

00:36:55.680 And Tommy did do exactly what he said he was going to do.

00:36:58.460 You know, he went back to face the judiciary in the UK and he didn't have to.

00:37:04.320 And he thought they'd put him in prison for two years.

00:37:08.540 And the last time he was in prison, he was in solitary for a fair bit of that.

00:37:12.580 Now, you have to understand that he's going to be, he was imprisoned after this interview for a civil matter.

00:37:20.200 And they put him in prison for very, very, very serious offenders, despite the fact that that isn't how they treat civil offenders.

00:37:29.920 And he did, he was in prison for showing this film when the court told him that he couldn't.

00:37:35.880 And so I hope he emerges well alive and also intact.

00:37:44.360 We'll see what happens.

00:37:46.140 You might want to keep your eye on that story, especially because the UK right now is a very unstable place.

00:37:52.820 You know, Keir Starmer, the UK labor leader, he came out like three weeks ago and said, I couldn't believe this.

00:37:59.420 I thought it was like an AI fake.

00:38:00.740 He basically said that the immigration policy that has characterized the UK, let's say for the last 10 years, something like that, was planned.

00:38:12.900 It was an open border plan, experiment to see what would happen if the UK opened its borders, just like the right-wing conspiracy theorists had suggested.

00:38:25.440 And that when people pointed that out, they were gaslighted.

00:38:30.880 They were told they were conspiracy theorists and liars.

00:38:34.400 And that that was all a dreadful mistake for which Starmer is now apologizing.

00:38:40.260 And I couldn't believe that when when he said it.

00:38:43.660 I mean, that was a prime minister of Britain said the prime minister of Great Britain said that.

00:38:47.980 And then the new leader of the Conservative Party, a lot of these policies came into play under the Conservatives, not the Labour Party.

00:38:54.060 And so the Conservatives, so to speak, and the new leader of the Conservative Party, Kemi Badnock, basically said the same thing the next day.

00:39:02.720 And so I don't know even what to say about the situation in the UK.

00:39:07.720 It's dreadful.

00:39:09.220 You know, they have electricity prices now, by the way, like Germany, that are five times higher than the...

00:39:16.240 This is prices for the electricity that runs all of the industrial infrastructure of, say, the UK and Germany.

00:39:25.320 It's five times as expensive in the UK as it is in the United States.

00:39:31.780 How's that going to work?

00:39:33.280 It's obvious what the consequences that will be.

00:39:35.540 There's no difference between cheap energy and a prospering economy.

00:39:39.720 Those are the same thing because energy is work.

00:39:42.740 And when you make work expensive, well, you don't have to be a genius to figure out what that means.

00:39:47.120 So the UK has a massive immigration problem, and no one has any idea what to do anything, what to do about it. 1.00

00:39:55.180 Stop the immigration process would be the first thing. 1.00

00:39:58.720 And their industrial infrastructure is collapsing, and the country is extremely divided.

00:40:06.260 We'll see.

00:40:07.300 We'll keep our eye on that very carefully.

00:40:08.820 You know, and Tommy Robinson, when he emerges from prison, assuming that he does, which is not a foregone conclusion,

00:40:15.480 it'd be very convenient for the authorities if something happened to happen to Tommy in prison.

00:40:21.340 And he got beat up really badly the last time he was in prison.

00:40:25.140 Because they put him in prison with people who were in prison, in the same prison, for conspiring to kill him.

00:40:31.760 That's the prison they put him in.

00:40:33.040 And so, and then, he got beat up really, really badly when he was in prison.

00:40:38.120 Lost a few teeth, and so he could easily not come out.

00:40:43.580 Anyways, we'll be following that, and we'll keep you informed.

00:40:47.080 And that's part of what's coming up in the next year.

00:40:58.280 You recently taught a course for Peterson Academy.

00:41:01.100 And so, thank you very much for that.

00:41:03.140 I thought I could update you a little bit about what's going on, just so you know, and so everybody else knows.

00:41:08.080 We have about 30,000 students now.

00:41:10.340 Wow.

00:41:11.560 And so, yeah, it took off like mad.

00:41:14.920 So, we've been, we did a pre-enrollment for three weeks.

00:41:18.040 And so, that was the enrollment so far.

00:41:20.360 So, we're thrilled about that.

00:41:21.800 Now, people seem very happy with the course offerings.

00:41:25.320 So, and, you know, we've set up the social media platform on Peterson Academy to have a goal, right?

00:41:34.260 The goal is for people to be able to exchange information related to their self-improvement on the educational side.

00:41:41.200 And so far, it's functioning that way.

00:41:43.320 And the fact that people have to pay essentially $500 a year to join also keeps the trolls and the bots and the bad corporate actors pretty much down to zero.

00:41:54.680 So, we launched Peterson Academy this year, a couple of months ago.

00:41:58.700 And we now have about 40,000 students.

00:42:02.020 So, and that's continuing to climb.

00:42:04.460 We have, I'm really happy with the way it's gone.

00:42:07.380 And so are the people who are on the academy.

00:42:09.560 So, it's already a very large educational institution.

00:42:12.600 And there's no reason at all to assume that that's not just going to continue.

00:42:16.140 By January of 2025, we'll be releasing four new eight-hour courses a month.

00:42:21.600 We have all the professors lined up.

00:42:23.700 Michaela, my daughter, who's been spearheading this along with her husband, Jordan Fuller.

00:42:28.700 They have a full curriculum sketched out for the next four years.

00:42:32.020 And we have the capital and the professors in place to, and the studio, everything is in place to make that a reality.

00:42:40.900 So, that's definitely going to happen.

00:42:42.220 We're in active negotiations about accreditation.

00:42:45.960 So, I think we'll crack that problem.

00:42:48.080 And it looks like we can bring the best professors in the world, because we have them, to the widest possible audience that's available in multiple languages.

00:42:58.700 For a cost that all the people who have been participating regard as probably too low, fundamentally.

00:43:07.880 And if we're going to make a mistake, that's a good side to err on.

00:43:12.000 And so, I've taught four or five courses for Peterson Academy.

00:43:17.120 They're not all released, but many of them are.

00:43:18.940 One on the Gospels, one on personality, one on Nietzsche, one on Piaget, one on personal planning and self-development.

00:43:28.400 That'll all be coming out.

00:43:30.180 All the professors who are participating are thrilled.

00:43:32.680 We've had offers from many of them to quit their jobs and work for us.

00:43:37.020 And that's going to happen with some of them, because we want to have some professors who are engaged in direct student-to-student contact.

00:43:43.780 And so, that's PetersonAcademy.com, and it's thriving.

00:43:49.060 I made mention of the social media element of it.

00:43:51.560 We took the best elements of the most popular social media platforms and integrated them into the...

00:43:57.780 What does the future hold for business?

00:44:00.460 Ask nine experts, and you'll get ten answers.

00:44:02.780 Bull market, bear market, rates will rise, rates will fall.

00:44:05.740 Can somebody please invent a crystal ball?

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00:45:17.800 Into the app and the participants use it continually and it's extremely positive.

00:45:29.240 Troll-free, bot-free, very, very positive and productive.

00:45:33.660 So, yeah, it's firing on all cylinders.

00:45:37.740 And so, you know, if you want to educate yourself, there's no reason not to join the academy.

00:45:44.780 Because one of the things you've done that I think is unprecedented and that's become perhaps more part of the public discussion

00:45:57.120 since you've teamed up with Trump is to make public health a political issue.

00:46:03.160 And so, you talked about the public health crisis and maybe you could lay out the dimensions of that crisis.

00:46:08.240 I mean, I know there's an obesity epidemic, there's a diabetes epidemic.

00:46:11.160 These are very, very serious problems.

00:46:13.700 And so, but you've concentrated on that in a way that just isn't characteristic of anybody on the political landscape at all.

00:46:20.100 Now it's become an issue that's front and center.

00:46:22.120 And so, I'd like to hear more about your thoughts.

00:46:24.780 Why you think that's such a fundamental priority, you know, compared to, say, free speech and war and peace?

00:46:32.620 Why health and what you see lay out the landscape of the problem and also the landscape of potential solution?

00:46:40.320 Yeah.

00:46:40.820 So, we are now the sickest country in the world.

00:46:45.460 We have the highest chronic disease burden in the world.

00:46:48.000 When my uncle was present, I was a, you know, 10-year-old boy.

00:46:52.880 Today, about 6% of Americans had chronic illness.

00:46:58.400 And today, 60%.

00:47:00.300 When my uncle was present, we spent zero in this country on chronic disease.

00:47:06.860 Zero.

00:47:07.880 And today, for many chronic diseases, first of all, there weren't even diagnoses and there weren't drugs available.

00:47:16.980 Today, we spend $4.3 trillion, so about 95% of our health budget.

00:47:24.280 It's the biggest, and it's five times our military costs.

00:47:29.640 It's the biggest item in our budget, and it is the fastest growing.

00:47:35.860 And not only that, so it's destroying our country economically, absolutely debilitating it.

00:47:42.320 All of our other issues are small towards it.

00:47:46.100 If you just measure its economic impact, it has other impacts.

00:47:50.920 77% of American children are no longer eligible for the military.

00:47:57.060 Yeah, well, so one of the things that's really worth contemplating in retrospect is just how revolutionary this year has been.

00:48:02.600 And it's really been something to watch personally, because so many of the people that I've interacted with on this podcast and personally now have key roles in the new American administration.

00:48:16.260 And so, you know, I watched that with some trepidation, because there are many difficult jobs that need to be done to set things right.

00:48:23.480 But it's so remarkable watching Kennedy make public health a political issue, really single-handedly.

00:48:32.080 That's something that he accomplished.

00:48:33.580 That's quite an accomplishment.

00:48:34.860 Now he's in a position, along with Mehmet Oz, to do something about it.

00:48:40.400 So now, you know, there's the opportunity to put your money where your mouth is, so to speak.

00:48:45.260 And they have an unparalleled opportunity with Trump and the public goodwill that surrounds the new administration to make some real changes.

00:48:54.440 It was interesting, too, to see what's transpired with regards to the Democrats.

00:49:00.900 You know, when I first interviewed RFK in the interview that YouTube took down, which I thought was utterly reprehensible interference with a presidential campaign,

00:49:11.840 I asked him when the left went too far, because I always ask Democrats that question, and they never answer it, ever.

00:49:20.860 And he didn't answer it.

00:49:22.440 He said, I'm not running that kind of divisive campaign.

00:49:25.320 In this interview, I asked him the same question.

00:49:28.600 And I think it's fair to say that in the aftermath of Kennedy's truncated run for presidency,

00:49:36.660 he's never stopped talking about when the left goes too far.

00:49:41.520 Right.

00:49:42.120 And the Democrats are really going to have to contend with that, because they made a large number of extremely large errors.

00:49:49.520 And I'm hoping they have enough residual expertise in leadership somewhere in the ranks of the party to reconstitute themselves.

00:49:59.100 Because, happy as I am that this remarkable band of Avengers has assembled themselves around Trump,

00:50:07.280 we know perfectly well from our long history in Democratic countries that the good guys need an opposition, too.

00:50:15.500 Because if they don't have an opposition, they quickly turn into the bad guys.

00:50:20.140 And it's highly probable that happens to everyone, because power is an extraordinarily tempting elixir, you might say.

00:50:28.320 And so I'm hoping that the Democrats transform themselves back into a party that could serve as intelligent opposition to the Trump crowd.

00:50:39.260 You know, the Democrats have been whining madly and publicly about the fact that the sneaky conservatives captured the new media,

00:50:49.260 you know, and which I think is absolutely hilarious, because there was no capture.

00:50:53.380 There were just people like Rogan and the other podcasters who sort of assembled in his wake, myself included,

00:51:04.220 who just started enterprises on a shoestring and said what we believe to be the truth and interviewed people without any tricks.

00:51:16.880 And the Democrats could have had a part of that, because a bunch of us, and I do believe that included Rogan at the time,

00:51:26.740 but it certainly included many of the other major podcast figures.

00:51:30.160 We invited all the Democrats to come and talk to us multiple times.

00:51:33.760 We got to them all through channels that they were communicating with,

00:51:37.720 because I knew people who were integrally situated within the Democrat hierarchy,

00:51:45.360 and we repeatedly offered to talk to them.

00:51:48.580 And the offers are genuine and in some ways risk-free.

00:51:52.320 Like, if you come on my podcast and you don't like the outcome, you can just scrap the podcast.

00:51:57.140 Like, no one's ever done that, but that is a genuine offer I make to my guests.

00:52:00.360 And if they say something they regret, I also tell them, well, we're not here to play some gotcha game. 0.99

00:52:05.260 If you say something the day later you think it was stupid, tell us. 0.87

00:52:08.940 And, you know, if you want us to remove 40 things, it's like, that's not going to happen. 0.98

00:52:13.060 We'll just scrap the podcast.

00:52:14.240 But if it's one or two things that you, you know, misspoke about, well, then we'll take them out.

00:52:19.800 Now, I believe only one person has taken us up on that offer about one thing they said, but it's a genuine offer.

00:52:26.660 However, the Democrats would talk to me behind the scenes, the senators and the congressmen whom I've met,

00:52:32.340 and that's many of them, but they'd never talk to me publicly.

00:52:34.940 And so, you know, what I heard someone on CNN say, well, the Democrats, they said, we need our own Rogan. 0.99

00:52:40.920 And I thought, you guys had Rogan, you dimwits. 0.98

00:52:43.620 Like, Joe Rogan is not your father's Republican. 0.98

00:52:46.440 He interviewed Bernie Sanders like four years ago because he voted for Bernie.

00:52:50.660 That's not a Republican thing to do in case you hadn't noticed.

00:52:53.360 And both Rogan and Sanders himself got nothing but pilloried by the woke cancel mob for doing that.

00:53:01.020 And so the Democrat failure on the new social media front is 100% their fault.

00:53:09.780 Not only their fault, but their fault in the face of repeated offers and repeated warnings.

00:53:15.920 And even now, you know, I have people scouring behind the scenes to find Democratic leadership hopefuls who will come and talk.

00:53:25.600 And it's even now they're loath to do it.

00:53:29.620 They're loath to do it.

00:53:30.680 It's like, hey, have it your way.

00:53:33.040 You know, your legacy media allies have radically done themselves in, as you noticed.

00:53:41.580 And you have nowhere to turn except to your own media infrastructure, which doesn't exist, or to the podcast mob.

00:53:51.220 But their invitation is open and you refuse it.

00:53:55.460 So don't be whining about the fact that the new media is captured by the conservatives.

00:54:00.020 Jesus, you handed it to them on a silver platter.

00:54:03.820 So, and you still haven't learned.

00:54:12.620 Look at it this way.

00:54:14.040 So, for example, in this conversation, you know this to be the case.

00:54:17.860 Like, there's various ways that this conversation could go sideways, right?

00:54:21.800 Seriously.

00:54:22.560 Like, we could, either of us could try to win.

00:54:26.140 Either of us could try to demonstrate our intellectual superiority, right?

00:54:30.300 Each of us could misrepresent the other.

00:54:34.220 Or we could both try, and I do think we are, in fact, trying that.

00:54:37.500 And I think Alex is helping along with that just fine.

00:54:41.340 We could try to follow the thread of the exploratory truth and see if we could get somewhere.

00:54:46.660 Now, I don't think there is any difference between that, by the way, and what's expressed in the biblical text as the spirit of the Logos.

00:54:53.200 That's why we have dialogue.

00:54:54.960 I'm very interested in the possibility that truths emerge through evolving manuscripts.

00:55:02.520 Now, that's a very interesting idea, and it's totally different from divine inspiration.

00:55:07.840 And I want to pursue it because I don't believe in divine inspiration, but I would be prepared to believe in evolving manuscripts.

00:55:15.180 Yeah, so, yeah, there was a lot of cardinal conversations this year, and certainly the one with Dawkins was one of them.

00:55:22.240 I talked, there were four main players in the so-called four horsemen, the four horsemen of the atheist movement, right?

00:55:30.140 There was Christopher Hitchens and Sam Harris and Daniel Dennett and Richard Dawkins.

00:55:36.620 And I've talked to three of them publicly, Sam Harris, a number of times.

00:55:40.140 I had a very good conversation with Daniel Dennett.

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00:56:46.680 And then, you know, I had a conversation a while back with Dawkins that was made public, audio only.

00:56:57.700 And I was very much looking forward to this conversation, which I felt was very productive.

00:57:01.920 By the end of the conversation, Dr. Dawkins was excited about the idea that genetic transformation could occur at the human level in consequence of the cultural transformation that the spread of memes might produce.

00:57:22.000 And I would say those would include religious ideas.

00:57:24.340 And so we actually got somewhere scientifically on the hypothesis front.

00:57:28.360 The conversation was, it had its stuttering moments.

00:57:32.060 I think part of the problem, you see, is that there's a whole literature on the emergence of religious ideation that Dr. Dawkins and the atheist types, they just don't know.

00:57:45.180 And that's a big problem because it's a deep and profound literature.

00:57:48.700 The foremost exponent of that school was either Carl Jung or Mircea Eliade, who was the world's greatest historian of religions and a true genius with ideas that are rich with biological implications.

00:58:03.260 And that was part of what I wanted to discuss with Dawkins.

00:58:06.020 Now, I think one of the things that's interesting in the broader cultural context is that the atheist movement that those four gentlemen spearheaded has really, the air has really gone out of it.

00:58:17.620 And I think it's partly because there's, it doesn't offer anything positive on the existential front.

00:58:25.260 It's merely critical and look, terrible things need to be criticized, but something has to arise to replace them.

00:58:32.820 Now, even Dawkins can see that part of what's risen to replace these dreadful superstitions once they collapsed is superstitions, like say on the woke ideological side,

00:58:44.820 that are far worse than anything dreamt of by the mere Christians, and that's had a devastating effect on not only the universities, but on the scientific enterprise. 0.88

00:58:55.460 And there's no doubt that Dr. Dawkins is like keenly aware of that.

00:58:59.660 So that's a major problem for the, for the atheist crowd.

00:59:03.180 And it's also the case that the, there are elements of religious thinking that are much more sophisticated than the superstition that's parodied by the, by the atheist thought leaders.

00:59:19.820 I mean, even Harris, I mean, Harris has moved out of the public realm into the realm of the meditative.

00:59:27.900 He's basically become a Buddhist, and that's a pretty strange landing point for someone who was, you know, a standard bearer for kind of militant atheism.

00:59:40.620 Now, Harris might debate about whether or not he believes in God, so to speak, but the God of the Old Testament is ineffable, like the Buddhist, like the, the divine that's represented in Buddhism.

00:59:54.220 And so that's a semantic issue rather than a substantive issue.

00:59:58.780 The truth of the matter still is that Sam found his home in the meditative, in the contemplative world.

01:00:05.020 So, you know, and as I said, the steam has gone out of the atheist movement.

01:00:10.420 And many of the people who were associated with that movement, I wouldn't say peripherally, quite directly, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Neil Ferguson, Douglas Murray, they've come to radically rethink their stance.

01:00:23.100 So, and that's going to continue.

01:00:24.800 That's absolutely going to continue.

01:00:26.460 That's something we'll keep an eye on in this podcast.

01:00:29.020 The revitalization of the Judeo-Christian underpinnings of the West.

01:00:35.020 Dawkins, at some point, said something like, I don't care about these stories.

01:00:41.740 I care about the kind of science and the kind of prediction that can help us land, you know, a spaceship on the moon.

01:00:48.720 Yeah, I know, I missed an opportunity there.

01:00:49.940 And I was like, oh, I care more about why the hell would we want to land a spaceship on the moon?

01:00:55.120 Like, why would humans do that?

01:00:56.580 That's more interesting to me or more important than the fact that we're capable of doing it.

01:01:01.260 Well, it's also, there's two things there that are interesting.

01:01:05.000 The first is, while we landed on the moon, and for Dawkins, the fact that that's remarkable is self-evident.

01:01:10.640 It's like, for a psychologist, it's like, that's not self-evident, buddy.

01:01:13.360 There's lots of things we could have done and had been doing for a very long period of time before we landed on the moon.

01:01:18.700 So it's something like Star Trek, right?

01:01:22.780 To boldly go where no one has gone before.

01:01:25.740 It's the Mariner's journey.

01:01:26.680 It's the Mariner's story.

01:01:27.860 You know, you have all these stories, ancient stories, the story of Ulysses or the story of St. Brendan,

01:01:32.760 who goes out into the ocean and, you know, goes in a land that nobody has been before.

01:01:38.240 These are the stories that we care about.

01:01:40.140 The idea of going out into...

01:01:41.040 Oh, and they plant a flag.

01:01:42.120 Yeah.

01:01:42.500 Well, that's what we did on the moon.

01:01:43.940 That's right.

01:01:44.380 That's the staff of Moses.

01:01:46.080 It signifies the new center, right?

01:01:48.780 The center of identity.

01:01:50.000 It's the joining of something with identity.

01:01:52.160 That's why we plant flags or crosses when the explorers would encounter new land.

01:01:56.680 They would plant a vertical pole to say, this is an identity.

01:02:00.940 This is the new center of the world.

01:02:01.740 This is the new center.

01:02:02.440 Yeah.

01:02:02.800 So that was Jonathan Paggio.

01:02:04.420 And everything Jonathan Paggio says is worth listening to.

01:02:08.100 And that's something you can't say of most people and deeply worth listening to.

01:02:13.900 So Paggio has done many projects with me now.

01:02:18.180 He has his own podcast, The Symbolic World, and he's a very accomplished artist.

01:02:23.080 He's worked with me on the documentary series on Western civilization that's on the Daily Wire.

01:02:30.880 We journeyed through Jerusalem and went to the Church of the Holy Sepulcher and walked the Via Dolorosa, right?

01:02:36.920 The road of the 12-stop road of Christ's journey to the crucifixion.

01:02:43.940 And so that was absolutely remarkable.

01:02:45.980 And then Paggio was also, I would say, in many ways, the lead participant in the Exodus seminar that the Daily Wire produced, which was about a 30-hour walk through the great story of Moses and the Israelites leaving the land of tyranny for the promised land across the desert of despair.

01:03:07.080 And, you know, Paggio's commentary on those stories was unbelievably illuminating.

01:03:13.180 I would say it's really the case—I was just talking to Greg Hurwitz, a friend of mine who was also a participant in the Exodus seminar and in the Gospel seminar, which we just released on Daily Wire beginning in December.

01:03:25.440 All the episodes of that aren't even out yet.

01:03:28.240 Greg participated, like Jonathan, in both the Exodus seminar and the Gospel seminar.

01:03:33.300 And I asked him the other day, you know, what the consequence of that participation was.

01:03:37.200 And he said very straightforwardly that it really transformed his life.

01:03:42.700 You know, and Greg was already a very knowledgeable person, right, and who had many accomplishments under his belt and had thought many things through deeply.

01:03:51.180 And I think that that was the effect of those seminars on all the participants.

01:03:56.440 And they were all very accomplished men.

01:03:59.000 And so—and then we had the great privilege of being able to bring them to a wide audience.

01:04:02.960 And with the full support of Daily Wire, which was really quite remarkable because it was an unlikely enterprise, right, to gather nine academics, reputable academics, around a table and have them do nothing but talk to one another

01:04:19.020 as they walk through these foundational stories.

01:04:25.540 I think it was 34 hours for the Exodus seminar and something like 25 for the Gospels.

01:04:31.820 And, well, we're going to continue with that endeavor as we move forward into the future.

01:04:35.920 We're planning a series on the Book of Revelation, which will be quite the trip, so to speak.

01:04:41.520 And the Daily Wire has been an unbelievably good partner in these endeavors, these unlikely endeavors.

01:04:49.180 And Jonathan, I learned so much from talking to him about these old stories.

01:04:53.640 It's—you know, it's like you have—there are parts of you that are fragmented.

01:04:59.700 They don't exactly have their place.

01:05:01.360 And they're pieces of stories that have been broken.

01:05:04.840 And if you encounter a great storyteller and interpreter like Pajot, then he brings all those things together.

01:05:11.160 And everything that you see transforms in consequence.

01:05:14.560 And he's a magician in that regard.

01:05:17.860 And—

01:05:17.960 The online MBA from Geese College of Business at the University of Illinois is an empowering experience.

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01:05:34.440 Well, it was a privilege to talk to him about the Dawkins interview because the formulations that Jonathan is generating, along with John Verveke, for example, both of whom lecture for Peterson Academy, by the way, are—they're the future, as far as I can see.

01:05:53.200 They're—they are the structure of interpretation that's going to replace, I would say, in some ways, the standard approach to these stories that has been promoted by—would I say traditional Christianity?

01:06:06.880 Depends on the tradition, because there are deep traditions in Christian interpretation.

01:06:12.360 Populist Christianity replace the interpretations of popular Christianity and supplant both the postmodern theoretical stance and the atheist materialist deterministic stance.

01:06:26.700 And that's happening, and it's going to continue to unfold as the West comes to a more conscious understanding of its foundations.

01:06:35.560 And hopefully this podcast will play a role in that, and the work I'm doing with Daily Wire, the work that's being undertaken by Peterson Academy, the work of ARC, the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship, this hybrid political philosophical organization that's being organized in London.

01:06:53.420 We have our next conference in February, it's become the go-to place for classic liberals and conservatives from all across the West.

01:07:02.240 And so all of those enterprises are moving in the same direction, and what we're hoping for is a revitalized—a revitalized understanding of the meaning of the foundational stories of the West.

01:07:12.680 And an understanding that's deep enough to be practically applicable in the daily lives of the people who have developed that understanding.

01:07:21.760 And I can see that unfolding, and it's a lovely thing to watch.

01:07:25.380 It's the thing we're pursuing with the tour.

01:07:27.920 Like, I'm on a pretty continual tour with my wife Tammy.

01:07:31.080 We're touring all through the United States from January through April.

01:07:35.180 You can find out about that at jordanbpeterson.com.

01:07:38.080 And then through Europe in May and June, and it's the same enterprise, right?

01:07:43.580 The telling of these old stories.

01:07:45.420 My new book, We Who Wrestle With God, is part of that enterprise.

01:07:49.040 And so we'll have the opportunity over the next year to watch as that continues to unfold.

01:07:54.740 So, and Pajot, he's going to play a key role in that.

01:08:01.620 Do it for the lulls.

01:08:03.120 Don't talk about it.

01:08:03.980 Don't talk about it.

01:08:04.900 Don't talk about it.

01:08:05.800 No.

01:08:06.460 Sorry.

01:08:07.200 No.

01:08:07.940 Mom, I don't want to wear that.

01:08:09.480 So what does that mean exactly?

01:08:12.440 Babies look like they're always on psilocybin mushrooms because they're like this.

01:08:16.900 I don't really believe in lesbians, by the way. 1.00

01:08:19.500 Exploding miniature penises. 1.00

01:08:21.480 Zero is a very low number. 0.99

01:08:23.100 Okay.

01:08:24.020 All right.

01:08:24.680 I'm out of here.

01:08:25.700 You know, when I watch something like that, the first thing that really strikes me as a miracle is that I still have a wife.

01:08:32.100 So, because I don't know how anybody can actually put up with me that actually has to live with me.

01:08:37.040 So, you know, I watched a bit of that compilation earlier and it made me turn red and it's done exactly the same thing again.

01:08:46.100 You know, I don't know.

01:08:47.900 I don't believe in lesbians. 1.00

01:08:49.240 I think that's a really funny, that's a really funny line.

01:08:52.040 It's also, it's also mostly true, by the way.

01:08:54.720 So, I apologize for all of those things that I said, I apologize.

01:09:00.780 And for many of the other things that I said that are equally, I don't know what, unforgivable, I probably apologize for them too.

01:09:10.660 So, but if you want more of it, you know which podcast to go to.

01:09:16.400 And thank you all for your support over the last year.

01:09:20.220 The YouTube channel continues to grow.

01:09:23.160 We're gathering about 100,000 people a month.

01:09:25.580 So, that's, you know, major progress.

01:09:28.200 And we're on a kind of wave on the alternative social media side because even the legacy media has admitted that they've been supplanted, which is, you know, a remarkable thing to be part of.

01:09:41.020 And the Instagram channel grows and the Facebook channel grows and the TikTok channel grows.

01:09:48.460 There's zero subscribers on TikTok two years ago and there's two and a half million now.

01:09:53.440 And I've got a new book deal by the looks of things for the next two books.

01:09:58.140 And one of them will be a continuation of this line of argumentation that I started with, We Who Wrestle With God, that'll focus on the story of Job and the Gospels, like the Gospel Seminar at Daily Wire.

01:10:10.560 I also did a course on the Sermon on the Mount for Peterson Academy.

01:10:16.400 So, no doubt, I'll continue to say, like, absurd and provocative things as we move forward into the future.

01:10:23.200 And thanks again for putting up with it.

01:10:25.280 It's as remarkable as all this has been.

01:10:28.220 I suspect that there's greater things, more remarkable things, more adventurous things yet to come.

01:10:36.100 And I would also like to say in closing, like, thank you to my crew, to my producer, Joy, who's been unbelievably helpful, to the Daily Wire enterprise altogether, to all the people around me, my logistics people and security people, to my wife and my family.

01:10:52.720 It's a team endeavor, that's for sure.

01:10:55.320 And I have a great team.

01:10:56.680 And that makes all this possible.

01:10:58.640 And thank you to all who've been watching and listening.

01:11:00.520 Your time and attention is much appreciated.

01:11:06.100 Thank you.

The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - December 30, 2024

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