The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - July 28, 2025


566. The Meaning Of： There’s No Such Thing as a Dragon


Episode Stats

Length

41 minutes

Words per Minute

138.11745

Word Count

5,774

Sentence Count

209

Misogynist Sentences

8

Hate Speech Sentences

10


Summary

Billy Bixby wakes up one morning and finds a dragon in his room. Why is this a good thing? What does it mean, and what does it teach us about the nature of reality? And why does it matter whether or not it's a dragon?


Transcript

00:00:00.000 So recently, I recorded some analysis of children's stories.
00:00:05.640 Once again, I had done this years ago with Pinocchio and the Lion King.
00:00:10.880 That was part and parcel of the lectures that I did at Harvard and at the University of Toronto.
00:00:16.940 More recently, I recorded an analysis of Snow White, the Grimm's brother version, and also of Hansel and Gretel.
00:00:24.620 So, I'm going to continue that today with a more recent book, a much more recent book called There's No Such Thing as a Dragon, the story in pictures by Jack Kent.
00:00:35.740 I used to read this to my Maps of Meaning class often as the first lecture because it touches on themes that are very relevant to a narrative understanding of the world.
00:00:50.140 A description of the structure through which we see the world is a story, and the motifs in stories represent cardinal elements of all of the environments that we encounter.
00:01:05.080 And I'll try to make that clear today in the discussion of there's no such thing as a dragon.
00:01:10.760 I want to show you a dragon that I have in my office here.
00:01:16.640 This is a sculpture from Mexico, which I got several years ago.
00:01:30.980 It's a circle, basically, and it has the head of a bird, kind of a monstrous bird, and it has wings like a dragon or like a bird, and it has a snake wrapped around the bird's neck.
00:01:43.000 But it's an analog of a dragon.
00:01:47.020 There's a book that I found very useful in my analysis of such things called An Instinct for Dragons by a man named David E. Jones.
00:01:56.920 And David Jones offers essentially an evolutionary explanation for the concept of dragon.
00:02:04.520 And he described a dragon as a tree, cat, snake, bird, like an amalgam of the features of tree, cat, snake, bird.
00:02:13.760 And of course, there's the element of fire as well.
00:02:18.580 And so, those are all elements of predator, you might say.
00:02:25.020 The kind of predator that have been preying on us or our evolutionary ancestors for millions of years.
00:02:35.000 We had tree-dwelling ancestors 60 million years ago.
00:02:38.320 And so, the dragon is an amalgam of the motifs of predator.
00:02:44.960 That's a good way of thinking about it, or of danger.
00:02:47.820 And the dragon battle is a narrative condensation of the drama of human beings.
00:02:59.680 The fact that we have to encounter the terrible, predatory unknown and to try to gather what's valuable that's hidden in it and to transform ourselves in that pursuit and to make our way forward as heroes.
00:03:18.440 And part of that is the ability to pay attention, to careful attention to the things that we might want to put aside and avoid.
00:03:27.180 And that's what this little story is about.
00:03:31.020 Billy Bixby was rather surprised when he woke up one morning and found a dragon in his room.
00:03:37.940 It was a small dragon, about the size of a kitten.
00:03:42.600 Well, so let's delve into the idea of dragon again.
00:03:46.420 So, the book's title is There's No Such Thing as a Dragon.
00:03:51.060 And whether or not something is real depends to some degree on your level of analysis.
00:04:00.240 So, obviously, bears are real and lions are real and Komodo dragons are real and crocodiles are real and fire is real.
00:04:08.820 Is an amalgam of all those things real?
00:04:11.940 Well, it's real in the way that an abstraction is real.
00:04:14.960 It's real in the way that the word predator or danger is real, right?
00:04:20.960 Because there's many diverse phenomena that are aggregated together in the notion, the conceptual notion of, say, predator or danger.
00:04:33.300 But that has very little to do with the reality of the concept.
00:04:39.400 Dragon is as real as predator.
00:04:41.680 Let's put it that way.
00:04:42.900 Now, the dragon concept is broader than mere predator because the dragon really stands for everything that lurks in the unknown as such.
00:04:55.540 And everything would be the danger that's part and parcel of the unknown, which is the place that the predators aggregate, let's say, but also the promise.
00:05:05.720 So, out in the unknown, which is the land of dragons, there are terrible dangers and great benefit.
00:05:13.600 Hence, the treasure that's associated with the dragon.
00:05:17.180 And the dragon contact story is, the dragon fight story is really among the oldest narratives that we possess.
00:05:27.120 So, it's an ancient motif, and it makes itself manifest in all sorts of stories.
00:05:34.080 Billy Bixby was rather surprised when he woke up one morning and found a dragon in his room.
00:05:39.640 It was a small dragon about the size of a kitten.
00:05:43.900 So, why is that relevant?
00:05:46.260 Well, Billy wakes up and there's something that's different about his environment.
00:05:52.720 And the difference makes itself manifest as something that's tiny to begin with, right?
00:05:58.720 And he's attending to it.
00:06:01.300 The dragon wagged its tail happily when Billy patted its head.
00:06:05.780 So, there's a moral already in the story there, which is that this little boy wakes up and something unexpected occurs.
00:06:14.400 And in principle, he could pretend it wasn't there or he could be afraid, but he interacts with it voluntarily.
00:06:21.520 And in consequence, this dragon is pleased.
00:06:26.100 Billy went downstairs to tell his mother.
00:06:28.580 There's no such thing as a dragon, said Billy's mother.
00:06:31.560 And she said it like she meant it.
00:06:34.000 Okay, so Billy's awake, and so he's playing the role of hero, and he's detected something anomalous and different.
00:06:42.700 And he, in his juvenile, heroic manner, has decided to interact with it voluntarily, and that's already tamed it to some degree.
00:06:51.920 And now he brings it to the attention of the authorities.
00:06:54.900 And the authorities, essentially, have already decided how the world is constituted.
00:06:58.960 And their verdict is that there's no such thing as a dragon.
00:07:05.740 And Billy's mother is insistent upon this.
00:07:10.260 Billy went back to his room and began to dress.
00:07:13.300 The dragon came close to Billy and wagged its tail.
00:07:16.720 But Billy didn't pat it.
00:07:18.060 If there's no such thing as something, it's silly to pat it on the head.
00:07:21.380 Okay, so what's the psychological significance of this?
00:07:24.880 Well, there are things that aren't to be talked about in many families and in many households.
00:07:33.220 And the attitude that reigns in households like that is that if we just pretend that the terrible thing doesn't exist, that it will go away.
00:07:43.260 And that's a form of willful blindness.
00:07:48.120 I can tell you a story about willful blindness.
00:07:50.860 So, in the Egyptian creation myth of Horus, Osiris, Isis, and Seth, there is a characterization of willful blindness as the cardinal danger that presents itself to the state.
00:08:08.080 So, here's how the story goes.
00:08:09.540 Egypt is founded by a god hero named Osiris.
00:08:15.640 And Osiris is a great awake hero like Billy when he was young.
00:08:20.160 And he is the force or the spirit or the process that establishes the state.
00:08:24.900 He ventures out into the unknown wilderness and renders it habitable like God does in Genesis at the beginning of the biblical story.
00:08:34.700 Now, Osiris establishes the state and becomes the ruler god of Egypt.
00:08:42.760 But he has a brother named Seth.
00:08:46.860 And Seth becomes Satan through the Egyptian Coptic Christians as the centuries progress.
00:08:53.500 And Seth is the dragon-like force, you might say, that always emerges to threaten the state.
00:09:06.140 And Seth wants to overthrow Osiris so that he can become a ruler.
00:09:12.140 And Osiris is willfully blind.
00:09:16.040 And so, he turns a blind eye to the machinations of his evil brother and, in consequence, is overthrown by Seth.
00:09:24.800 And so, why is that relevant?
00:09:28.300 Well, it's because malevolence can make itself manifest in unexpected forms in your personal life, in your family life, in the community, in the state, in the nation, at every level.
00:09:43.280 But the proclivity to turn a blind eye to the emergence of what's unknown and malevolent is part of the causal pathway to the devastation of the stable and productive state.
00:09:56.480 So, that's all underneath this little story.
00:09:59.740 Billy went back to his room and began to dress.
00:10:02.120 The dragon came close to Billy and wagged its tail.
00:10:05.000 So, now, you know, as a small dragon, it's also indicating its relatively benevolent intent.
00:10:11.660 And so, one of the lessons you might derive from this is the notion that if you deal with a problem when it first wags its tail, then there's every reason to assume that it can be dealt with forthrightly and...
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00:10:55.280 Straightforwardly, and maybe productively as well.
00:11:00.280 And so, that's why the dragon in its small form here is still a benevolent force, right?
00:11:06.440 Something unknown can make itself manifest as a mere matter of interest.
00:11:11.940 And if it's not ignored, it can be dealt with appropriately.
00:11:15.480 But Billy didn't pat it.
00:11:16.880 If there's no such thing as something, it's silly to pat it on the head.
00:11:20.560 Okay, so now Billy has adopted his mother's stance of willful blindness and is applying it to the realities of his own experience.
00:11:29.960 Billy washed his face and hands and went down to breakfast.
00:11:32.920 The dragon went along.
00:11:34.440 It was bigger now, almost the size of a dog.
00:11:38.360 Okay, so now what's happening?
00:11:39.800 Well, apparently, or hypothetically, because the dragon, which is the anomaly, the predator, and also the place of possibility, because it's being ignored, it's growing.
00:11:54.980 And so, what's the moral of that story?
00:11:56.980 Well, it's the same moral that you can derive from the Egyptian myth of Osiris and Seth.
00:12:01.760 If you turn a blind eye to something, then it can grow until it becomes an overwhelming and demolishing force.
00:12:11.860 Imagine, here's an example, imagine that you get a tax notification in the mail from your local municipal authorities,
00:12:21.240 and instead of dealing with it, you ignore it, you throw it in the garbage, or you file it in some filing cabinet, or in some file folder that you never planned to open.
00:12:32.540 It's not like it just sits there, maintaining its form.
00:12:37.600 It mutates and shifts across time and grows into something that can be quite monstrous.
00:12:43.420 And all the anomalies, the unexpected occurrences that could turn themselves into predators with time,
00:12:54.440 have the proclivity to grow if they're ignored.
00:12:57.920 And so, this little book is a story about the danger of willful blindness.
00:13:02.320 Billy sat down at the table.
00:13:04.940 The dragon sat down on the table.
00:13:07.260 This sort of thing was not usually permitted.
00:13:09.340 So, now you can see that the anomalous occurrence, the unexpected occurrence, the emergence of the predator or the unknown
00:13:19.300 is starting to disrupt the stable subroutines of the family that make up tranquil domestic life and peace.
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00:14:27.220 The dragon sat down on the table.
00:14:31.820 This sort of thing was not usually permitted, but there wasn't much Billy's mother could do about it.
00:14:36.440 She'd already said there was no such thing as a dragon.
00:14:39.100 And if there's no such thing, you can't tell it to get down off the table.
00:14:43.840 You see that sort of thing happening in families where a child has a behavioral problem that's being ignored by the parents.
00:14:49.440 It's that the assertion is that there's nothing wrong with the child, let's say, or the child's behavior.
00:14:58.480 And so that assertion is perceived as the reality.
00:15:03.020 And then the problem has the proclivity to develop until it gets entirely out of hand.
00:15:09.980 And once the decision has been made that there's no problem there, then no amount of evidence about the problem is sufficient to shift the circumstances.
00:15:20.660 Mother made some pancakes for Billy, but the dragon ate them all.
00:15:26.700 Mother made some more, but the dragon ate those too.
00:15:29.660 That's another indication, let's say, that the dragon is associated symbolically with potential behavior problem on the part of Billy.
00:15:38.200 This anomalous occurrence, whatever it might be, is not only breaking the domestic rules with regards to its purchase on the table,
00:15:49.100 but is also interfering with Billy's ability to eat.
00:15:53.560 But Mother has to ignore that.
00:15:55.860 Mother kept making pancakes until she ran out of batter.
00:15:59.180 Billy only got one of them.
00:16:01.140 But he said that's all he really wanted.
00:16:03.800 Anyway, so now Billy is lying about the problem that's interfering with him even being able to eat to maintain his mother's fiction that there's no problem in the house.
00:16:19.940 Billy went upstairs to brush his teeth.
00:16:22.800 Mother started clearing the table.
00:16:24.760 The dragon, who was quite as big as Mother by this time, made himself comfortable on the hall rug and went to sleep.
00:16:30.900 So now the dragon has grown to the point, because it's being ignored, where it's more than a match for Mother herself.
00:16:37.780 Had she admitted to the existence of the problem to begin with and dealt with it when it first made itself manifest,
00:16:43.920 it could have stayed small and friendly, but now it's large enough to be a match for her.
00:16:50.620 By the time Billy came back downstairs, the dragon had grown so much he filled the hall.
00:16:56.180 Billy had to go around by way of living room to get to where his mother was.
00:17:00.000 I didn't know dragons grew so fast, said Billy.
00:17:03.860 There's no such thing as a dragon, said Mother firmly.
00:17:07.920 So now we have the situation where something unexpected and forbidden has made itself manifest in the house,
00:17:16.100 but everyone has decided to act as if it doesn't exist.
00:17:20.100 And the consequence of that is it's growing to the point where it dominates the house and is making all normal activity exceedingly difficult.
00:17:34.720 I'm sure you've been in households like that.
00:17:37.080 Hopefully yours isn't one of them.
00:17:38.880 Cleaning the downstairs took Mother all morning, what with the dragon in the way and having to climb in and out of windows to get from room to room.
00:17:48.240 Okay, so this is a humorous way of dealing with the fact that if a problem emerges in a household and it's not dealt with,
00:17:57.540 it can become so all-consuming that it makes all activity that should otherwise be simple and straightforward virtually impossible.
00:18:08.520 So a behavioral problem that's emerged in the course of a child's development can have exactly that aspect where there's denial,
00:18:21.860 which is more like willful blindness.
00:18:24.200 Willful blindness is a better way of thinking about denial.
00:18:26.540 It's just refusal to attend and modify perception and conception in face of new evidence.
00:18:34.800 The problem can get so large that nothing simple is simple anymore.
00:18:39.900 If there's unresolved conflict between a husband and a wife, for example,
00:18:44.420 it can get to the point where it's impossible for them to have a simple conversation about day-to-day things
00:18:51.060 because of the catastrophe, the dragon, that no one will speak about.
00:18:56.680 Maybe the suspicion of an affair, for example, or some other fundamental manifestation of mistrust
00:19:05.420 that's polluting and paralyzing the relationship to the point where nothing can be done in a simple manner.
00:19:12.520 Cleaning the downstairs took Mother all morning, what with the dragon in the way,
00:19:16.240 and having to climb in and out of windows to get from room to room.
00:19:19.200 Okay, so now Mother, who's a somewhat tyrannical and rigid sort,
00:19:25.160 has decided so emphatically that the dragon doesn't exist
00:19:31.480 that she's willing to put up with a tremendous amount of unnecessary trouble
00:19:36.860 to maintain her delusion.
00:19:40.680 She won't attend to the anomaly, let's say, to the trouble,
00:19:46.460 even though it's beginning to interfere with everything that she does.
00:19:51.540 By noon, the dragon filled the house.
00:19:54.180 Its head hung out the front door, its tail hung out the back door,
00:19:57.540 and there wasn't a room in the house that didn't have some part of the dragon in it.
00:20:02.080 If you've lived in a street with a household that has a substantial amount of trouble,
00:20:08.240 you've seen exactly this phenomena where the house is dilapidated and unkempt and the lawn is abandoned
00:20:19.000 and there's a miasma of negativity that surrounds the household
00:20:23.680 and you know that there's something monstrous going on inside it
00:20:27.720 that's pathologizing not only the inhabitants of the house
00:20:32.340 but beginning to spread out into the neighborhood itself,
00:20:36.680 then you've experienced exactly the situation that's being described in this book.
00:20:42.580 By noon, the dragon filled the house.
00:20:44.280 Its head hung out the front door, its tail hung out the back door,
00:20:47.460 and there wasn't a room in the house that didn't have some part of the dragon in it.
00:20:50.680 That's exactly the kind of household that people will walk across the street to avoid
00:20:55.660 if they're going somewhere.
00:20:58.040 When the dragon awoke from his nap, he was hungry.
00:21:01.840 A bakery truck went by.
00:21:03.780 The smell of fresh bread was more than the dragon could resist.
00:21:07.480 The dragon ran down the street after the bakery truck.
00:21:10.260 The house went along, of course, like the shell on a snail.
00:21:13.400 Okay, so now, because the dragon...
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00:21:30.280 It's been ignored because the problem has been ignored
00:21:33.400 because the household is rigid and tyrannical in its presuppositions.
00:21:40.200 The dragon has gone so large that chaos rules the house instead of order,
00:21:45.860 and the trajectory of the family is being determined by the emergent property
00:21:53.620 that no one has the courage to deal with.
00:21:57.640 The mailman was just coming up the path with some mail for the Bixbys
00:22:01.200 when their house rushed past him and headed down the street.
00:22:04.700 He chased the Bixbys' house for a few blocks, but he couldn't catch it.
00:22:08.060 Yeah, well, there's plenty in that too.
00:22:11.740 So, the mailman is a representation of the order of the state, let's say,
00:22:17.020 and the household has become so chaotic at this point
00:22:19.780 that the state itself can't deliver its message to the inhabitants.
00:22:25.240 And so, you can imagine what happens if your household becomes so chaotic
00:22:28.580 that it runs away, so to speak,
00:22:31.240 and so you don't get your mail and you don't get your notifications
00:22:34.080 and all that does is aggregate a lot more chaos around you
00:22:37.340 and cause all sorts of long-term trouble
00:22:39.580 and turn into this vicious, self-devouring spiral
00:22:44.620 that's like a dragon that eats its own tail,
00:22:47.040 which is a symbol of exactly that,
00:22:49.020 and all hell breaks loose.
00:22:51.640 When Mr. Bixby came home for lunch,
00:22:54.840 the first thing he noticed was that the house was gone.
00:22:58.300 Luckily, one of the neighbours was able to tell him which way it went.
00:23:02.800 So, there's a real tragedy brewing in this story
00:23:05.520 because, well, this happens to people, doesn't it,
00:23:09.720 when a father, let's say, comes home from work
00:23:13.220 and finds that the locks have been changed
00:23:17.140 and his wife is gone with the kids
00:23:18.860 and the question is exactly what happened
00:23:22.960 and the answer is invariably,
00:23:24.900 there was a terrible dragon in the house
00:23:28.300 that could have hypothetically been attended to
00:23:31.160 when it was still small
00:23:32.260 but that was ignored studiously by all who were involved
00:23:36.460 and grew to the point where it dominated the entire house
00:23:40.500 so that everything became cataclysmically difficult
00:23:42.900 and then it ran off with the house itself
00:23:45.280 and the man comes home
00:23:47.660 and the house is gone, so to speak,
00:23:50.580 because the dragon ran away with it
00:23:52.160 and his response is, I never saw it coming
00:23:55.320 and the first question that you might ask about
00:23:58.800 that kind of response is,
00:24:00.680 maybe that's because you didn't look, right?
00:24:04.400 There were warning signs of a thousand different kinds
00:24:09.060 making themselves manifest in a thousand different directions,
00:24:12.760 parts of the dragon scattered all over hell
00:24:15.140 and all over hell's half acre
00:24:17.160 but never underestimate the, what?
00:24:22.400 The insistence that someone who does not want to see
00:24:28.540 brings to bear on the maintenance of their blind delusion
00:24:33.600 and so Mr. Bixby's house ran away
00:24:36.520 because he wasn't paying enough attention
00:24:39.180 to what was going on inside it.
00:24:41.880 Mr. Bixby got in his car
00:24:44.700 and went looking for the house
00:24:46.340 He studied all the houses as he drove along
00:24:48.820 Finally, he saw one that looked familiar
00:24:51.260 Billy and Mrs. Bixby
00:24:53.580 were waving from an upstairs window
00:24:56.260 Mr. Bixby climbed over the dragon's head
00:25:00.080 onto the porch roof
00:25:02.220 and through the upstairs window
00:25:04.620 How did this happen?
00:25:06.920 Mr. Bixby asked
00:25:08.000 It was the dragon
00:25:10.040 said Billy
00:25:11.320 There is no such thing
00:25:13.780 Mother started to say
00:25:15.360 There is a dragon
00:25:17.040 Billy insisted
00:25:17.780 A very big dragon
00:25:18.820 and Billy patted the dragon
00:25:20.720 on the head
00:25:21.760 Okay, so now
00:25:22.860 I want to tell another story
00:25:24.820 that's associated with this
00:25:26.280 So
00:25:27.240 this is from
00:25:29.240 the Exodus narrative
00:25:31.960 near the end of it
00:25:33.860 the Exodus narrative
00:25:35.660 This is the story of Moses
00:25:37.320 leading the Israelites
00:25:38.400 away from tyranny
00:25:40.380 through the desert
00:25:41.140 to the promised land
00:25:42.280 and it extends over a number
00:25:44.000 of Old Testament books
00:25:45.580 Exodus, Numbers, and Leviticus
00:25:47.860 If I remember correctly
00:25:49.500 This
00:25:50.960 story
00:25:52.420 takes place
00:25:53.860 when the Israelites
00:25:56.080 are just on the
00:25:57.480 cusp of
00:25:59.100 their
00:25:59.720 movement
00:26:01.820 from the desert
00:26:03.000 to the promised land
00:26:05.060 So they go from
00:26:06.020 tyranny
00:26:07.260 which is
00:26:08.920 the rigidity
00:26:10.360 let's say
00:26:11.240 that Mrs. Bixby
00:26:12.700 makes manifest
00:26:14.340 in this story
00:26:15.860 to the desert
00:26:17.520 which is
00:26:18.340 a descent into chaos
00:26:19.940 before moving towards
00:26:21.620 the promised land
00:26:22.580 which is
00:26:23.180 the better future
00:26:24.140 Now
00:26:24.920 it's the fact
00:26:26.340 of the intermediary desert
00:26:27.780 that makes
00:26:29.960 the
00:26:30.400 tyrant
00:26:31.760 who won't
00:26:33.060 awaken
00:26:34.380 that motivates
00:26:36.900 the stubbornness
00:26:37.760 of the tyrant
00:26:38.420 who won't awaken
00:26:39.920 Mrs. Bixby
00:26:41.920 doesn't want to
00:26:42.720 contend with the dragon
00:26:43.700 because she would have
00:26:44.760 to abandon
00:26:45.480 some of her presuppositions
00:26:47.060 about
00:26:47.460 the state
00:26:48.720 of the household
00:26:49.560 and the world
00:26:51.020 and that would
00:26:52.360 throw her
00:26:53.360 into
00:26:53.840 a state of
00:26:55.040 at least
00:26:56.440 temporary confusion
00:26:57.720 and perhaps
00:26:58.280 serious confusion
00:26:59.300 so you don't go
00:27:00.320 from
00:27:00.780 conviction
00:27:03.020 to new learning
00:27:04.580 like this
00:27:05.440 you go from
00:27:06.280 conviction
00:27:06.840 to chaos
00:27:08.040 and confusion
00:27:08.800 to new learning
00:27:09.960 and the fact
00:27:11.100 of the intermediary
00:27:12.060 chaos and confusion
00:27:13.160 is enough
00:27:14.120 to dissuade
00:27:14.760 people from
00:27:15.540 attending
00:27:16.900 let's say
00:27:17.440 to the dragons
00:27:18.100 when they
00:27:18.600 make themselves
00:27:19.680 manifest
00:27:20.780 okay
00:27:21.560 so
00:27:21.960 the Israelites
00:27:23.200 are on the cusp
00:27:24.740 of moving to the promised land
00:27:26.380 they're close to getting
00:27:28.320 where they
00:27:28.820 they're close to finishing
00:27:31.000 the voyage
00:27:31.600 in the manner
00:27:32.200 that's been promised
00:27:33.240 but they
00:27:34.460 lose faith
00:27:35.540 and they get
00:27:36.260 whiny
00:27:37.100 and
00:27:37.700 complain
00:27:38.860 and
00:27:39.480 they get bitter
00:27:40.780 and resentful
00:27:41.620 and they
00:27:43.080 lose faith
00:27:45.020 in the
00:27:45.640 voyage forward
00:27:47.120 to the
00:27:48.420 promised land
00:27:49.480 and they
00:27:50.560 carp
00:27:52.120 and complain
00:27:52.800 and they
00:27:53.440 criticize Moses
00:27:54.540 and they
00:27:55.340 turn away
00:27:57.040 from
00:27:57.420 the divine
00:27:58.760 intuition
00:27:59.280 that's leading
00:27:59.920 them forward
00:28:00.460 and
00:28:00.920 because of that
00:28:02.420 God sends
00:28:04.500 poisonous snakes
00:28:06.760 to bite them
00:28:07.420 now
00:28:07.960 poisonous snakes
00:28:09.220 are
00:28:09.620 dragons
00:28:10.560 for all intents
00:28:11.420 and purposes
00:28:11.940 their bite
00:28:12.960 is the bite
00:28:13.720 of fire
00:28:14.440 although fire
00:28:15.260 is also a predator
00:28:16.280 and so
00:28:17.380 the
00:28:18.360 emergence
00:28:19.600 of the poisonous snakes
00:28:20.940 is a
00:28:22.120 narrative
00:28:22.780 representation
00:28:23.520 of
00:28:24.260 the manifestation
00:28:25.880 of
00:28:26.580 dragons
00:28:27.620 in consequence
00:28:29.820 of the Israelites
00:28:31.080 faithlessness
00:28:32.260 and so
00:28:33.500 their refusal
00:28:35.520 to walk
00:28:36.600 the proper
00:28:37.200 path
00:28:37.720 dooms them
00:28:38.880 to
00:28:39.300 encounter
00:28:40.320 with the
00:28:40.960 poisonous serpents
00:28:42.140 okay so now
00:28:43.520 there's poisonous
00:28:44.420 serpents
00:28:45.020 let's call them
00:28:46.380 small dragons
00:28:47.200 everywhere
00:28:48.040 and they're
00:28:49.120 getting bit
00:28:49.660 and that's not
00:28:50.420 good
00:28:50.720 and so
00:28:51.280 they go
00:28:51.860 to Moses
00:28:52.420 because they
00:28:54.240 know he has
00:28:54.840 a pipeline
00:28:56.180 to the divine
00:28:56.980 and they say
00:28:58.160 we know
00:28:59.760 you can
00:29:00.180 talk to
00:29:00.880 God
00:29:01.220 and
00:29:02.280 we're
00:29:03.980 sick and
00:29:04.720 tired of
00:29:05.080 being bit
00:29:05.480 by these
00:29:05.940 poisonous snakes
00:29:06.700 and
00:29:07.200 we're
00:29:08.160 willing to
00:29:08.720 do what's
00:29:09.220 necessary
00:29:09.720 to
00:29:10.100 deal with
00:29:11.180 them
00:29:11.320 maybe you
00:29:11.760 could
00:29:11.940 we're
00:29:13.220 willing to
00:29:13.840 do what's
00:29:14.340 necessary
00:29:14.780 to put us
00:29:15.360 back in
00:29:15.840 God's
00:29:16.240 good graces
00:29:16.920 maybe you
00:29:17.820 could ask
00:29:18.260 him to
00:29:18.560 call off
00:29:18.960 the snakes
00:29:19.500 and so
00:29:20.580 Moses has
00:29:23.400 a chat
00:29:23.740 with God
00:29:24.220 and God
00:29:24.780 who sent
00:29:26.680 the snakes
00:29:27.260 decides that
00:29:29.240 he's not
00:29:29.600 going to
00:29:29.960 get rid
00:29:30.280 of them
00:29:30.580 instead
00:29:31.440 he does
00:29:31.960 something
00:29:32.280 very
00:29:32.800 unexpected
00:29:33.900 he asks
00:29:35.480 the Israelites
00:29:36.100 to gather
00:29:37.360 all their
00:29:37.840 bronze
00:29:38.300 together
00:29:38.780 like they
00:29:40.780 gathered
00:29:41.220 gold
00:29:41.560 together
00:29:41.920 in an
00:29:42.280 earlier
00:29:42.520 episode
00:29:42.980 to make
00:29:43.520 the
00:29:43.920 golden
00:29:44.940 calf
00:29:45.420 which they
00:29:45.920 drunkenly
00:29:47.020 and
00:29:47.200 orgiastically
00:29:47.960 worship
00:29:48.520 they gather
00:29:49.380 all their
00:29:49.700 bronze
00:29:50.000 together
00:29:50.420 and
00:29:51.900 they're
00:29:53.360 to cast
00:29:54.020 a
00:29:54.440 stake
00:29:55.620 like
00:29:56.140 Moses
00:29:56.520 staff
00:29:57.160 a tree
00:29:58.360 a flagpole
00:30:00.020 a center
00:30:01.540 of the
00:30:02.000 world
00:30:02.420 a foundation
00:30:04.020 pole
00:30:04.500 and to
00:30:05.740 put a
00:30:06.100 serpent
00:30:06.360 on it
00:30:06.900 cast in
00:30:07.720 bronze
00:30:08.100 that's
00:30:09.660 large enough
00:30:10.200 so that the
00:30:10.760 Israelites can
00:30:11.420 see it at
00:30:11.880 some distance
00:30:12.560 and then
00:30:13.240 so they're
00:30:14.440 to cast
00:30:14.880 that
00:30:15.280 and
00:30:16.380 then
00:30:17.100 they're
00:30:17.340 all
00:30:17.600 to go
00:30:17.920 look
00:30:18.260 at it
00:30:18.720 and
00:30:19.880 if they
00:30:20.420 look
00:30:20.760 at it
00:30:21.280 then
00:30:22.860 they won't
00:30:23.520 be
00:30:23.880 affected
00:30:25.280 by the
00:30:27.480 poison
00:30:27.920 and so
00:30:29.620 the
00:30:31.100 Israelites
00:30:31.440 all go
00:30:32.140 they gather
00:30:33.460 up their
00:30:33.920 bronze
00:30:34.240 and they
00:30:34.600 cast
00:30:34.920 this
00:30:35.600 staff
00:30:37.720 tree
00:30:38.960 flagpole
00:30:40.920 and they
00:30:41.600 put a
00:30:42.220 serpent
00:30:42.440 on it
00:30:42.900 and they
00:30:44.040 all look
00:30:44.480 at it
00:30:44.840 voluntarily
00:30:45.480 and in
00:30:46.720 consequence
00:30:47.220 they're no
00:30:48.420 longer
00:30:48.920 affected
00:30:49.700 by the
00:30:50.180 poison
00:30:50.560 so the
00:30:51.600 snakes
00:30:51.840 don't
00:30:52.160 disappear
00:30:52.520 but now
00:30:52.940 the
00:30:53.120 Israelites
00:30:53.480 are
00:30:53.900 fortified
00:30:54.560 enough
00:30:55.020 so that
00:30:56.040 they're
00:30:56.580 immune
00:30:57.040 from the
00:30:57.500 poison
00:30:57.840 and then
00:30:58.840 that's a
00:30:59.600 symbol
00:30:59.960 that stake
00:31:00.720 with a
00:31:01.140 serpent
00:31:01.400 wrapped
00:31:01.720 around it
00:31:02.160 it's a
00:31:02.640 symbol
00:31:02.880 of healing
00:31:03.540 it's
00:31:04.260 the
00:31:04.560 staff
00:31:04.980 of
00:31:05.160 Asclepius
00:31:05.880 it's
00:31:06.560 the symbol
00:31:07.060 that
00:31:07.280 pharmacists
00:31:07.940 and
00:31:08.120 physicians
00:31:08.500 use
00:31:09.040 and the
00:31:10.060 upshot
00:31:11.240 of the
00:31:11.560 story
00:31:11.880 is that
00:31:12.620 voluntary
00:31:13.840 confrontation
00:31:14.900 in measured
00:31:16.440 doses
00:31:16.940 with what
00:31:17.980 might otherwise
00:31:18.840 poison you
00:31:19.780 what might
00:31:20.860 otherwise poison
00:31:21.720 you
00:31:22.040 strengthens
00:31:23.580 and redeems
00:31:24.460 you
00:31:24.800 and so
00:31:25.560 that's the
00:31:26.000 principle
00:31:26.420 let's say
00:31:27.160 of a
00:31:27.420 vaccine
00:31:27.900 where you
00:31:28.300 take a
00:31:28.660 small amount
00:31:29.240 of what
00:31:29.960 would
00:31:30.240 otherwise
00:31:31.020 kill you
00:31:31.540 and that
00:31:31.880 fortifies
00:31:32.460 you
00:31:32.640 but it's
00:31:32.980 also the
00:31:33.460 principle
00:31:33.820 of
00:31:34.240 learning
00:31:35.220 itself
00:31:35.800 because
00:31:36.240 when you
00:31:36.960 learn
00:31:37.360 you
00:31:38.580 encounter
00:31:39.020 something
00:31:39.440 that
00:31:39.740 is
00:31:40.360 challenging
00:31:40.820 and difficult
00:31:41.580 and that
00:31:42.100 might reshape
00:31:42.860 you
00:31:43.100 dramatically
00:31:43.640 and that
00:31:44.080 might even
00:31:44.520 knock you
00:31:45.340 into the
00:31:45.760 desert
00:31:46.060 before it
00:31:46.660 takes you
00:31:47.000 to the
00:31:47.220 promised
00:31:47.520 land
00:31:47.920 and you
00:31:48.860 stand on
00:31:50.340 that edge
00:31:50.900 of discovery
00:31:51.720 voluntarily
00:31:52.700 and in
00:31:54.360 consequence
00:31:54.780 you become
00:31:55.660 much stronger
00:31:56.720 which is what
00:31:57.480 Billy was
00:31:58.160 trying to do
00:31:58.820 at the
00:31:59.360 beginning of
00:31:59.840 this story
00:32:00.340 and what
00:32:00.720 his mother
00:32:01.260 dissuaded
00:32:02.500 him from
00:32:03.120 in her
00:32:03.940 willfully
00:32:04.520 blind
00:32:05.020 and
00:32:05.460 tyrannical
00:32:06.380 manner
00:32:06.780 that led
00:32:07.840 to the
00:32:08.260 dissolution
00:32:08.780 of the
00:32:09.260 entire
00:32:09.600 house
00:32:10.020 now
00:32:11.240 later
00:32:11.660 it turns
00:32:12.500 out
00:32:12.760 that
00:32:13.120 and this
00:32:14.340 is very
00:32:14.680 complicated
00:32:15.260 that
00:32:15.660 Christ
00:32:16.900 tells his
00:32:17.680 followers
00:32:18.100 in the
00:32:18.700 gospels
00:32:19.180 that unless
00:32:19.840 he's lifted
00:32:20.560 up like
00:32:21.620 the brazen
00:32:22.440 serpent
00:32:22.840 was lifted
00:32:23.400 up in
00:32:23.760 the desert
00:32:24.180 that there'll
00:32:25.040 be no
00:32:25.780 hope of
00:32:26.300 redemption
00:32:26.720 for mankind
00:32:27.760 and that's
00:32:29.720 a very
00:32:29.980 strange
00:32:30.540 narrative
00:32:31.560 segue
00:32:32.960 and what
00:32:34.000 does it
00:32:34.320 mean
00:32:34.600 well
00:32:35.980 the
00:32:37.200 crucifix
00:32:38.360 this is a
00:32:38.800 very profound
00:32:39.460 thing to
00:32:39.860 understand
00:32:40.260 it's almost
00:32:41.220 unutterably
00:32:41.860 profound
00:32:42.280 and it's
00:32:43.260 surprising that
00:32:43.860 it might emerge
00:32:44.500 in the midst
00:32:45.160 of a discussion
00:32:45.760 about this
00:32:46.260 little kid's
00:32:46.840 book
00:32:47.080 so
00:32:48.100 the
00:32:50.300 motif of
00:32:51.400 the brazen
00:32:51.920 serpent
00:32:52.340 is
00:32:53.060 it's the
00:32:55.260 presentation
00:32:55.860 of the
00:32:56.580 fact that
00:32:57.280 voluntary
00:32:58.440 encounter
00:32:59.120 with what
00:32:59.680 is
00:33:00.060 frightening
00:33:01.120 or even
00:33:01.700 poisonous
00:33:02.340 paralyzing
00:33:04.180 can be
00:33:05.820 redemptive
00:33:07.120 and so
00:33:08.040 then you
00:33:08.400 might ask
00:33:08.900 yourself
00:33:09.320 what's the
00:33:10.940 ultimate
00:33:11.280 exemplar
00:33:11.940 of that
00:33:12.380 what's the
00:33:13.720 worst of
00:33:14.780 all
00:33:15.140 poisonous
00:33:16.580 serpents
00:33:17.240 on a
00:33:18.000 staff
00:33:19.200 or a
00:33:19.820 flagpole
00:33:20.360 and the
00:33:21.460 answer to
00:33:21.920 that
00:33:22.260 biblically
00:33:23.300 is
00:33:23.760 the
00:33:24.720 crucifixion
00:33:25.500 because
00:33:26.420 death
00:33:27.980 by poison
00:33:29.260 can be
00:33:30.380 amplified
00:33:30.940 you might
00:33:31.440 say
00:33:31.760 into
00:33:32.140 the
00:33:32.760 worst
00:33:33.200 form
00:33:33.580 of
00:33:33.780 death
00:33:34.240 brought
00:33:34.900 about
00:33:35.220 by the
00:33:35.620 most
00:33:35.820 toxic
00:33:36.380 form
00:33:36.840 of
00:33:37.040 poison
00:33:37.500 and
00:33:38.220 the
00:33:38.360 worst
00:33:38.600 form
00:33:38.920 of
00:33:39.100 death
00:33:39.440 is
00:33:39.960 the
00:33:40.600 suffering
00:33:41.040 of
00:33:41.400 someone
00:33:42.660 who's
00:33:43.220 not only
00:33:43.980 innocent
00:33:44.420 but
00:33:44.920 positively
00:33:45.880 good
00:33:46.380 or even
00:33:46.980 sinless
00:33:47.700 the most
00:33:50.740 painful
00:33:51.260 and humiliating
00:33:52.220 possible
00:33:52.820 death
00:33:53.280 of the
00:33:54.060 best
00:33:54.380 possible
00:33:54.900 person
00:33:55.420 that's
00:33:56.540 the most
00:33:57.020 poisonous
00:33:57.720 serpent
00:33:59.840 and so
00:34:01.300 Christ
00:34:02.580 is making
00:34:03.080 the point
00:34:03.640 in this
00:34:05.100 symbolic
00:34:05.540 manner
00:34:05.960 that
00:34:06.320 the
00:34:06.960 crucifix
00:34:07.680 is
00:34:08.240 the
00:34:09.220 ultimate
00:34:09.620 exemplar
00:34:10.380 of the
00:34:10.840 brazen
00:34:11.280 serpent
00:34:11.820 and that
00:34:12.880 gazing
00:34:15.080 upon that
00:34:15.860 which is
00:34:16.300 the full
00:34:16.740 voluntary
00:34:17.340 confrontation
00:34:18.180 not only
00:34:18.760 with death
00:34:19.360 but with
00:34:19.920 hell
00:34:20.280 with malevolence
00:34:21.240 which is
00:34:22.140 part of the
00:34:22.900 crucifixion
00:34:24.420 and resurrection
00:34:24.900 story
00:34:25.560 is the
00:34:26.620 pathway
00:34:27.080 to
00:34:27.640 redemption
00:34:28.920 right
00:34:29.960 that
00:34:30.280 in order
00:34:31.020 to
00:34:31.380 make peace
00:34:32.360 with life
00:34:32.960 that
00:34:33.820 all of
00:34:34.540 its
00:34:34.700 aspects
00:34:35.300 no matter
00:34:35.780 how
00:34:36.220 terrible
00:34:37.120 and dark
00:34:37.800 have to be
00:34:38.940 confronted
00:34:39.540 voluntarily
00:34:40.240 and the
00:34:40.960 consequence
00:34:41.380 of that
00:34:41.940 is
00:34:42.360 universal
00:34:43.660 redemption
00:34:44.200 and the
00:34:45.480 alternative
00:34:45.880 theory
00:34:46.360 is that
00:34:47.080 one that
00:34:47.800 Mrs.
00:34:48.480 Bixby
00:34:48.820 seems to
00:34:49.400 be
00:34:49.720 clinging
00:34:50.380 to
00:34:50.700 and her
00:34:51.100 husband
00:34:51.380 as well
00:34:51.860 which is
00:34:52.300 that
00:34:52.560 the best
00:34:53.400 way to
00:34:53.820 establish
00:34:54.320 the order
00:34:54.820 that's
00:34:55.140 good
00:34:55.320 in your
00:34:55.580 household
00:34:55.920 is to
00:34:56.380 ignore
00:34:56.660 problems
00:34:57.200 when they
00:34:57.560 make
00:34:57.760 themselves
00:34:58.140 manifest
00:34:58.640 and
00:34:59.520 that's
00:35:00.160 definitely
00:35:00.800 not how
00:35:01.860 you learn
00:35:02.360 and it's
00:35:02.840 certainly
00:35:03.220 how your
00:35:04.320 household
00:35:04.820 ends up
00:35:05.380 disappearing
00:35:05.960 down the
00:35:07.040 street
00:35:07.300 when you're
00:35:07.780 at work
00:35:08.260 and you
00:35:08.900 don't expect
00:35:10.340 it
00:35:10.640 how did
00:35:11.940 this happen
00:35:12.500 Mr.
00:35:12.900 Bixby asked
00:35:13.620 it was the
00:35:14.460 dragon
00:35:14.840 said Billy
00:35:16.000 there's no
00:35:16.900 such thing
00:35:17.560 mother started
00:35:18.380 to say
00:35:18.840 there is a
00:35:19.580 dragon
00:35:20.020 Billy
00:35:20.660 insisted
00:35:21.260 two thumbs
00:35:22.240 up for
00:35:22.620 Billy
00:35:22.900 a very big
00:35:23.780 dragon
00:35:24.240 that makes
00:35:25.060 him a
00:35:25.320 hero
00:35:25.560 and Billy
00:35:26.220 patted
00:35:26.640 the dragon
00:35:27.180 on the
00:35:27.560 head
00:35:27.800 so finally
00:35:28.720 someone
00:35:29.320 has
00:35:30.560 called
00:35:31.200 attention
00:35:31.620 to the
00:35:32.100 problem
00:35:32.520 and that's
00:35:33.300 Billy
00:35:33.580 and so
00:35:34.380 that makes
00:35:35.240 him the
00:35:35.500 hero of
00:35:35.800 the story
00:35:36.180 and
00:35:36.800 see
00:35:37.760 in the
00:35:38.440 Egyptian
00:35:39.060 creation
00:35:39.660 myth
00:35:39.940 that I
00:35:40.280 described
00:35:40.660 earlier
00:35:41.120 so Billy
00:35:42.760 is the
00:35:43.420 son of
00:35:43.940 the man
00:35:44.360 who's
00:35:44.620 blind
00:35:44.960 to the
00:35:45.320 dragon
00:35:45.640 in this
00:35:46.100 story
00:35:46.440 in the
00:35:47.160 Egyptian
00:35:47.500 creation
00:35:48.020 myth
00:35:48.300 that I
00:35:48.620 described
00:35:49.020 earlier
00:35:49.520 Osiris
00:35:51.440 is willfully
00:35:52.200 blind
00:35:52.740 about
00:35:53.320 Seth
00:35:53.860 who's
00:35:54.420 his evil
00:35:54.840 brother
00:35:55.200 the spirit
00:35:55.880 of malevolence
00:35:56.600 itself
00:35:57.060 and Seth
00:35:58.200 chops Osiris
00:35:59.380 up and
00:35:59.940 into bits
00:36:01.180 he can't really
00:36:02.460 kill him
00:36:02.860 because he's
00:36:03.260 a god
00:36:03.680 chops him
00:36:04.400 into bits
00:36:04.800 and distributes
00:36:05.440 him all
00:36:05.720 around Egypt
00:36:06.280 and the
00:36:07.320 queen of
00:36:07.620 the underworld
00:36:08.160 Isis
00:36:08.740 makes herself
00:36:10.000 manifest
00:36:10.900 and makes
00:36:12.600 herself pregnant
00:36:13.340 with the
00:36:14.580 relevant part
00:36:15.740 of Osiris
00:36:16.680 and she
00:36:17.080 gives birth
00:36:17.680 to Horus
00:36:18.960 and Horus
00:36:20.260 is the
00:36:20.740 redeeming
00:36:21.360 Egyptian
00:36:21.820 god
00:36:22.280 and Horus
00:36:22.820 is the
00:36:23.160 famous
00:36:23.560 Egyptian
00:36:24.420 eye
00:36:24.960 and the
00:36:25.900 open eye
00:36:26.440 that can
00:36:26.840 see
00:36:27.260 and Horus
00:36:29.620 differs from
00:36:30.300 Osiris
00:36:30.960 in that
00:36:31.440 he's willing
00:36:32.180 to look
00:36:32.720 upon the
00:36:34.020 dragon of
00:36:34.760 malevolence
00:36:35.520 that would
00:36:36.080 be Seth
00:36:36.600 and admit
00:36:37.780 to its
00:36:38.240 existence
00:36:38.760 and so
00:36:39.400 Horus
00:36:39.800 goes back
00:36:40.440 to Egypt
00:36:41.700 and he
00:36:42.120 has a
00:36:42.440 terrible
00:36:42.820 Horus
00:36:43.860 Isis
00:36:45.280 makes herself
00:36:45.960 pregnant
00:36:46.420 Horus
00:36:47.560 develops
00:36:48.120 outside of
00:36:49.300 Egypt
00:36:49.720 alienated
00:36:50.820 from the
00:36:51.340 kingdom
00:36:51.640 that's now
00:36:52.180 ruled by
00:36:52.740 his evil
00:36:53.360 uncle
00:36:54.060 when he
00:36:55.040 matures
00:36:55.440 he goes
00:36:56.200 back to
00:36:56.620 Egypt
00:36:56.940 voluntarily
00:36:57.640 and he
00:36:58.520 takes on
00:37:00.200 Seth
00:37:00.660 and he
00:37:01.380 has a
00:37:01.700 terrible
00:37:01.980 battle
00:37:02.340 with Seth
00:37:02.820 because Seth
00:37:03.420 is a
00:37:03.740 terrifying
00:37:04.080 force
00:37:04.640 the force
00:37:05.480 of malevolence
00:37:06.140 itself
00:37:06.560 and Seth
00:37:07.800 tears out
00:37:08.400 one of
00:37:08.840 Horus'
00:37:09.700 eyes
00:37:10.060 which is
00:37:10.880 an indication
00:37:11.600 of just
00:37:12.320 how
00:37:12.800 catastrophic
00:37:13.920 the full
00:37:14.720 encounter
00:37:15.140 with malevolence
00:37:15.940 can be
00:37:16.440 but
00:37:17.720 Horus
00:37:18.700 defeats
00:37:20.400 Seth
00:37:20.720 banishes
00:37:21.320 him to
00:37:21.940 the nether
00:37:22.340 regions
00:37:22.760 of the
00:37:23.080 kingdom
00:37:23.340 and gets
00:37:24.240 his eye
00:37:24.620 back
00:37:24.960 now he
00:37:25.660 could
00:37:26.040 rule
00:37:27.320 Egypt
00:37:28.420 in consequence
00:37:30.380 of his
00:37:30.820 victory
00:37:31.160 but that
00:37:31.560 isn't what
00:37:31.900 he does
00:37:32.280 he
00:37:32.500 goes down
00:37:33.840 to the
00:37:34.140 underworld
00:37:34.720 where
00:37:35.160 Osiris
00:37:35.920 is languishing
00:37:36.820 in his
00:37:37.720 half-dead
00:37:38.340 state
00:37:38.800 and he
00:37:39.680 gives
00:37:40.180 Osiris
00:37:41.100 his eye
00:37:42.700 and now
00:37:43.560 his father
00:37:44.440 can see
00:37:45.160 and he
00:37:45.800 joins forces
00:37:46.680 with his
00:37:47.140 father
00:37:47.460 who can
00:37:47.840 now see
00:37:48.420 and the
00:37:49.480 conjoined
00:37:50.500 union
00:37:50.920 of Horus
00:37:51.720 who's
00:37:52.920 the vision
00:37:53.860 that's willing
00:37:54.400 to admit
00:37:54.900 to the
00:37:55.240 existence
00:37:55.640 of malevolence
00:37:56.540 and the
00:37:57.320 tradition
00:37:57.820 that can
00:37:58.360 now see
00:37:59.140 that's
00:37:59.760 Osiris
00:38:00.340 that becomes
00:38:01.300 the ruling
00:38:01.900 spirit of
00:38:02.620 Egypt
00:38:02.860 and is
00:38:03.620 the
00:38:04.040 model
00:38:05.440 for the
00:38:06.200 Egyptian
00:38:06.960 pharaohs
00:38:07.740 when they're
00:38:08.160 ruling
00:38:08.500 properly
00:38:09.580 and so
00:38:10.920 Billy is
00:38:12.080 a
00:38:12.420 avatar
00:38:13.740 of Horus
00:38:14.480 and he's
00:38:15.420 willing to
00:38:16.100 cast a
00:38:17.340 brave eye
00:38:17.980 on the
00:38:18.380 existence
00:38:18.820 of
00:38:19.280 the
00:38:20.800 dragon
00:38:21.180 and
00:38:22.420 to interact
00:38:23.900 with it
00:38:24.320 and Billy
00:38:26.240 patted the
00:38:26.760 dragon on
00:38:27.240 the head
00:38:27.680 the dragon
00:38:29.980 wagged
00:38:30.580 its tail
00:38:30.940 happily
00:38:31.360 then even
00:38:32.620 faster
00:38:33.160 than it
00:38:34.060 had grown
00:38:34.620 the dragon
00:38:35.720 started getting
00:38:36.320 smaller
00:38:36.780 soon
00:38:38.000 it was
00:38:39.180 kitten sized
00:38:39.860 again
00:38:40.260 well you
00:38:43.280 know in
00:38:43.640 the in
00:38:44.140 the garden
00:38:44.500 of Eden
00:38:44.860 there's a
00:38:45.340 serpent
00:38:45.720 and and
00:38:47.120 you might
00:38:48.300 ask well
00:38:48.940 why would
00:38:51.040 there be a
00:38:51.480 serpent in
00:38:52.840 a garden that
00:38:53.440 God had
00:38:53.800 created and
00:38:54.440 the answer
00:38:54.860 is well
00:38:55.960 when you
00:38:57.080 bind a
00:38:57.640 space
00:38:58.160 you can't
00:39:00.500 completely
00:39:01.080 separate it
00:39:02.120 from what's
00:39:03.260 outside of
00:39:03.940 it
00:39:04.060 the fact
00:39:06.580 of what
00:39:07.360 isn't in
00:39:08.000 the space
00:39:08.640 is going
00:39:09.320 to make
00:39:09.780 itself
00:39:10.140 manifest
00:39:10.600 inside the
00:39:11.420 space
00:39:11.740 so for
00:39:12.120 example you
00:39:12.620 can't keep
00:39:13.180 your children
00:39:13.720 completely
00:39:14.380 protected from
00:39:16.360 outside influences
00:39:17.420 they're going to
00:39:18.480 come into your
00:39:18.960 house one way or
00:39:19.680 another and if
00:39:20.920 you're so
00:39:21.740 protective that
00:39:22.720 you don't let
00:39:24.100 your children have
00:39:24.740 any contact
00:39:25.400 with the outside
00:39:26.140 world then you
00:39:27.040 become the
00:39:27.620 malevolence that
00:39:28.420 you're trying to
00:39:29.080 protect them
00:39:29.600 from and so
00:39:30.920 there's no way
00:39:31.820 of binding a
00:39:32.600 space without
00:39:33.160 having some
00:39:34.200 anomaly or
00:39:36.420 some inconsistency
00:39:37.920 or some of
00:39:39.520 what's unexpected
00:39:40.500 inside that
00:39:41.380 space and so
00:39:42.740 then the
00:39:43.600 question is how
00:39:44.320 do you deal
00:39:44.900 with the fact
00:39:45.660 of the eternal
00:39:46.340 serpent in the
00:39:47.140 garden let's
00:39:47.780 say and the
00:39:48.680 answer is laid
00:39:50.080 out in the
00:39:50.700 exodus story and
00:39:51.860 in the crucifixion
00:39:53.000 narrative which
00:39:53.700 is that you
00:39:55.040 don't attempt to
00:39:56.620 make the space
00:39:57.300 secure you
00:39:57.960 attempt to make
00:39:58.880 yourself brave
00:40:00.180 and forthright
00:40:01.020 enough to admit
00:40:03.100 to and attend
00:40:04.000 to the trouble
00:40:05.360 in your household
00:40:06.420 and in your
00:40:07.100 psyche and in
00:40:07.880 your state and
00:40:09.080 to contend with
00:40:10.100 it and in
00:40:10.740 consequence you
00:40:11.600 get braver and
00:40:12.880 more well
00:40:13.360 constituted and
00:40:14.700 then and then
00:40:17.680 chaos and order
00:40:18.500 can exist can
00:40:20.220 coexist happily and
00:40:21.760 productive peace
00:40:23.360 and interesting
00:40:24.200 adventure interesting
00:40:25.920 playful adventure
00:40:26.880 can make
00:40:28.280 themselves manifest
00:40:29.360 the dragon wagged
00:40:30.660 its tail happily
00:40:31.420 then even faster
00:40:33.160 than it had
00:40:33.920 grown the dragon
00:40:35.520 started getting
00:40:36.100 smaller soon it
00:40:39.000 was kitten sized
00:40:39.840 again I don't
00:40:41.600 mind dragons this
00:40:42.500 size said mother
00:40:43.360 why did it have
00:40:45.020 to grow so big
00:40:46.200 I'm not sure
00:40:47.820 said Billy but I
00:40:50.840 think it just
00:40:51.400 wanted to be
00:40:52.000 noticed so what's
00:40:56.040 the moral of the
00:40:56.820 story don't be
00:40:59.380 thinking that
00:40:59.840 dragons aren't
00:41:00.480 real that's the
00:41:02.060 first moral and
00:41:04.100 what's the second
00:41:04.700 moral if you
00:41:08.260 attend to them
00:41:08.900 when they first
00:41:09.440 make themselves
00:41:10.060 manifest then they
00:41:11.000 won't run away
00:41:11.580 with your house
00:41:12.340 and that's story
00:41:15.780 hour with JBP
00:41:16.900 today thanks very
00:41:18.780 much for your time
00:41:19.580 and attention bye
00:41:21.120 bye
00:41:26.820 g
00:41:37.700 M