The Matt Walsh Show - Daily Wire Backstage： Debate Me, Bro.

00:00:00.120 Hey everybody, this is Matt Walsh. Drop everything you're doing and check out the latest episode of Daily Wire backstage.

00:00:05.020 You're going to hear Ben Shapiro, Andrew Klavan, Michael Knowles, and yours truly talking about all the important issues affecting you and your family.

00:00:11.220 You don't want to miss it, unless you're a leftist, in which case, you're canceled.

00:00:30.000 Hi, everybody. That was like my fourth try at that during the countdown to the show.

00:00:37.320 Welcome to Daily Wire's backstage, brought to you by ExpressVPN.

00:00:41.740 Tonight, I am joined by Ben Shapiro, Matt Walsh, Andrew Klavan, maybe a surprise guest.

00:00:49.380 There's all sorts of stuff going on here. Obviously, the debate with all of the candidates.

00:00:56.160 We all want to know what Doug Burgum has to say about 2024.

00:00:58.820 We've all got Burgum Momentum. We've got Asa Hutchinson Feeder.

00:01:05.200 And of course, we will see the launch of the Chris Assants, the Croissants for short, for Mr. Christie's campaign.

00:01:12.900 Gentlemen, before we get too far into the show, predictions for the debate.

00:01:18.460 Absolute, cataclysmic boredom.

00:01:22.200 I mean, so here's the thing about this debate.

00:01:25.140 Basically, it's going to be all against DeSantis.

00:01:28.180 And the only question is whether DeSantis can survive.

00:01:30.520 DeSantis has been taking incoming for weeks.

00:01:32.340 He's dropped in the polls from in April.

00:01:35.760 He was in like the 24% range.

00:01:37.280 He's down to in the real politics polling average in the 14 to 15% range with a significant decline.

00:01:41.460 About half of that support has gone to Trump.

00:01:43.120 About half of that support has gone to Vivek.

00:01:45.060 The big question for DeSantis is can he weather the storm tonight?

00:01:49.500 Because I'm not of the opinion that he can actually win tonight in any way, shape or form.

00:01:53.120 So he's challenged on one side by Trump, who's 40 points ahead of the field.

00:01:58.140 But on the other side, by the entirety of the field, which is seeking to claw him down like a crab pot back in there so that somebody can take that second place slot.

00:02:07.080 The other contenders on the stage all have sort of various motivations for even being there in the first place.

00:02:12.480 So I'm not of the opinion, for example, that Vivek Ramaswamy actually believes he's going to be president of the United States.

00:02:16.740 To me, he seems like a candidate who pretty clearly is running for vice president of the United States, Senate in Ohio, or a media slot.

00:02:23.640 If you look at Mike Pence, Pence is there basically just to provide a counter to Trump.

00:02:28.260 He has to know that he has no shot at the actual nomination.

00:02:32.000 If you're Nikki Haley or Tim Scott, you're basically just hoping that you're standing around when somebody dies and that you have kind of a small percentage of the base.

00:02:38.920 And if you're Chris Christie, you're a kamikaze.

00:02:41.520 And Chris Christie is showing momentum in New Hampshire, which he's up to second by some polls in New Hampshire.

00:02:47.620 He's still like 14% and really doesn't have a real shot at the nomination,

00:02:50.680 which means that their real motivation on the stage is claw down DeSantis because basically everybody is now waiting for something bad to happen to Trump.

00:03:01.100 I mean, that really is the dynamic of the race because the only way to defeat Trump realistically,

00:03:06.040 there are only two possibilities and one really doesn't exist.

00:03:08.480 Possibility number one, you make the case to the American people and to the conservative base

00:03:11.700 that Donald Trump was a less than stellar president who would perform worse as president than you would

00:03:16.280 and that he made a series of mistakes that he will repeat.

00:03:19.100 That case has very little durability with the Republican base, which has a lot of faith in Trump by virtually every polling metric,

00:03:25.100 even if I think there's merit to the case that he underperformed, particularly in his last two years as president.

00:03:29.060 Then there's the second part of the case, which was always the case against Trump and particularly the case for DeSantis.

00:03:33.600 And that was the electability case. DeSantis' entire case for Trump was, I'm Trump but electable.

00:03:38.060 The problem is in order to say that Trump was unelectable, you have to say the one thing that Trump people don't want you to say,

00:03:42.580 which is he lost in 2020.

00:03:44.520 Because if you won't say he lost in 2020, he's not unelectable.

00:03:47.020 He was very electable in 2020 if he won, right?

00:03:49.160 And so his entire case that he won in 2020 and the entire field being very shy about saying,

00:03:53.340 no, it was a bad election, a lot of bad stuff happened, and you lost because you were in a bad race and you're a bad candidate

00:03:58.180 and you lucked out against Hillary Clinton because everyone hates Hillary.

00:04:01.140 People don't hate Biden as much as they hate Hillary.

00:04:03.520 That's the case that somebody is going to have to make.

00:04:05.440 No one has made it yet.

00:04:06.120 If one of those two cases doesn't get made, Trump's the nominee.

00:04:08.660 You also, you can't make the case in a primary race if you're trailing Trump by 30 to 50 points for some of the single digits.

00:04:16.200 I think you can make the case in a primary race saying that in general, I'll do better than Trump.

00:04:19.920 But the problem is you need to show polling data that suggests that unless what you say is that we already know how this race ends for Trump.

00:04:26.860 You don't know how the race ends for me because things could change.

00:04:29.240 But you know how the race ends for Trump because we already did this one time.

00:04:32.220 Do you want to do this thing again?

00:04:33.880 And honestly, I think that's a pretty robust case, but nobody's willing to make it because they're so afraid of saying the reality,

00:04:38.740 which is that Donald Trump did in fact lose to Joe Biden.

00:04:41.400 Yes, the rules were changed.

00:04:43.040 Yes, the media were corrupt.

00:04:44.720 Yes, the media job.

00:04:45.400 I was told by Judge Michael Ludig, a once respected conservative judge who now plays Ed McMahon to every hack on MSNBC.

00:04:53.940 I was told that 2020, I'm not joking, he said this, is the most fair election ever conducted in the history of the United States.

00:05:02.380 And because I want to stay on YouTube, I of course agree with that.

00:05:06.680 On the DeSantis point, I actually think, I don't see any way that he loses unless the people on the stage find a way to attack him from the right.

00:05:16.060 That's the one advantage that he has in this context.

00:05:18.020 Fox News debate, friendly audience, almost all the attacks against DeSantis have been, number one, just kind of ridiculous on the merits, but also they've been from the left.

00:05:27.980 I'll tell you the point, the one who's going to go kamikaze obviously is Christie.

00:05:31.680 Christie committed a murder-suicide against Marco Rubio in 2016.

00:05:34.880 He's going to try and do the same thing on the stage right now.

00:05:37.080 What he's going to do, he's going to say, Ron, everything you say is scripted.

00:05:40.440 We know the script because it was revealed to us.

00:05:41.980 And then he's going to say some line that Ron says.

00:05:45.840 He's going to play exactly the same prank on Rubio.

00:05:48.440 He's going to try to do the same thing with DeSantis, he did with Rubio.

00:05:50.580 Remember you were saying the same phrase over and over?

00:05:53.000 I have a slightly different analysis here.

00:05:54.840 I'm watching all this campaign.

00:05:57.700 And DeSantis, everything DeSantis says is true and effective, but he's not charming, and so he's losing points.

00:06:04.280 Everything Vivek says is charming but complete crap.

00:06:08.080 I mean, every word out of his mouth is complete nonsense, and he's gaining points.

00:06:11.160 So this seems to me that Senator Scott is the guy because he's absolutely charming and saying absolutely nothing.

00:06:16.620 So he should have a great evening.

00:06:19.540 And then, as for Trump, the fact that he lost this election, it reminds me of the scene in Game of Thrones where the dwarf is talking to the cripple,

00:06:30.180 and the cripple says, I'm not a cripple, and the dwarf says, I'm not a dwarf.

00:06:33.700 It's like he lost.

00:06:34.920 He lost the midterms.

00:06:36.300 He lost the next midterms.

00:06:37.680 He keeps losing.

00:06:38.460 He won by a short hair against the least likable candidate on earth by a fluke of the Electoral College, which I support.

00:06:48.640 But still, he's not going to win the general election.

00:06:51.380 I suppose the argument against it is, I agree, he won by a short hair against Hillary in these decisive states.

00:06:59.600 But then, actually before the election, the FBI saw him as enough of a threat to spy on his campaign.

00:07:06.680 Then the DOJ saw him as enough of a threat to consistently undermine his presidency.

00:07:11.080 Now, I think the Democrats see him as enough of a threat to upend two centuries of American history.

00:07:15.520 Yes, no question.

00:07:16.460 More than that, throw him in prison.

00:07:16.940 Is he enough of a threat or enough of a mark for them?

00:07:19.420 Like, they see someone who's vulnerable.

00:07:20.940 I don't know.

00:07:21.500 I mean, listen.

00:07:22.080 I have a question.

00:07:22.780 Does that matter?

00:07:24.000 Meaning, like, the one question that Trump has never been asked and has never answered is,

00:07:26.760 you say the election was stolen from you.

00:07:28.420 Let's say that's true.

00:07:29.560 What is your plan to un-steal Russia in 2024?

00:07:31.340 Right.

00:07:31.900 To avoid the lockdowns that permitted the policies to change the vote.

00:07:35.520 Now, before I explain to you my brilliant theories about everything in the world,

00:07:41.500 we have got to get to brains before beauty here.

00:07:44.700 We have our friend Candace Owens is actually in the field in Milwaukee right now at the GOP debate,

00:07:51.220 perhaps announcing a run for president.

00:07:53.280 I think she's polling higher than Judge Berger.

00:07:54.580 She would poll higher than everybody.

00:07:55.680 Candace, what is going on in Milwaukee?

00:07:58.780 Hey!

00:08:00.220 Well, I'll tell you one thing.

00:08:01.260 It's really hot, so if I look like I'm sweating, it's because it is unbelievable weather out here.

00:08:05.700 But people are very excited.

00:08:07.540 I'm listening to all of your predictions.

00:08:09.300 Tend to agree with Clavin tonight.

00:08:11.440 I think that I would not be sitting comfortably if I was walking in as a Santis,

00:08:15.160 obviously having lost effectively 10 points since June,

00:08:18.100 at least according to the Emerson College poll, which recently came up.

00:08:21.120 I think the person that everyone wants to watch tonight is Vivek because he kind of snuck up from behind.

00:08:26.080 This seemed to be a dog-on-dog fight between Trump and DeSantis.

00:08:30.000 Everyone was paying attention to them, slinging mud at each other,

00:08:32.260 and no one sort of watched the youngest candidate in the field.

00:08:35.220 And here's the truth.

00:08:36.060 He's hustled harder than the rest of them.

00:08:37.600 He's doing every podcast, big and small.

00:08:39.760 He's running this like a startup.

00:08:41.400 And I think that what Vivek said was accurate on my show when he said that what DeSantis is suffering from,

00:08:47.580 aside from a communication problem, I think there are too many people communicating on behalf of DeSantis,

00:08:52.120 and we don't know what his thoughts are versus his communications team's thoughts are.

00:08:56.300 But aside from that, I think he just had too much of a big start, too much money.

00:09:00.800 You know, he came in like a corporation, not like a startup,

00:09:03.180 and it's hard to know which direction to focus.

00:09:05.060 So the question tonight will be whether or not DeSantis can refocus his campaign,

00:09:08.860 actually listen to some of the criticism, and realize that, you know,

00:09:11.680 you've got a little bit of a personality problem.

00:09:13.180 We want you to sound a little bit more excited.

00:09:14.660 And by the way, he showed this issue back when he was debating Gillum,

00:09:18.440 Andrew Gillum, in the gubernatorial election.

00:09:20.300 You know, he struggled to get over the finish line.

00:09:22.720 Obviously, we don't have Trump here tonight,

00:09:24.200 so people are going to be paying attention to the next two candidates,

00:09:26.460 which are Vivek and DeSantis.

00:09:29.280 Ben, you might be right.

00:09:30.260 We might see Vivek go for DeSantis.

00:09:32.060 We might see them both try to stay clean.

00:09:34.000 Vivek has thus far kept his hands pretty clean.

00:09:37.120 So it will be interesting to see if he shifts his strategy.

00:09:39.920 Overall, I think Vivek will thrive in this environment

00:09:42.220 only because he's a true academic.

00:09:44.240 And I just imagine that he was probably in the debate club

00:09:46.700 back when he was in Yale, but who knows?

00:09:48.620 Do you, in fact, I can vouch for some of that.

00:09:51.540 Do you know, though, Candace, if any of this will change the polls?

00:09:56.260 So let's say they all tear each other to shreds,

00:09:58.480 and DeSantis murders Vivek, or Vivek murders DeSantis,

00:10:01.820 or they gang up and eat Chris Christie.

00:10:03.660 Does that actually affect the standing in the eyes?

00:10:06.860 That was a softball.

00:10:07.940 Do you think that affects the overall polls?

00:10:11.980 I think it will, and I think here's how it's going to affect it.

00:10:14.320 The names that we're not saying tonight.

00:10:15.960 You guys aren't saying Tim Scott.

00:10:17.280 You guys aren't saying Nikki Haley.

00:10:18.760 Well, where are those points going to go

00:10:19.880 when they realize that their candidates are effectively going nowhere?

00:10:22.160 We're not even talking about Pence.

00:10:23.360 I don't think any of you guys, at least since I've had you on, have mentioned Pence.

00:10:26.520 I think eventually their donors and their followers will say,

00:10:29.360 okay, this is obviously not going to work.

00:10:31.440 Where are we going to jump ship?

00:10:32.820 Are they going to jump on the DeSantis ship?

00:10:34.660 Are they going to jump on the Vivek ship?

00:10:36.000 I would assume if they're with Nikki Haley and Tim Scott,

00:10:38.200 they're probably not going to go on the Trump ship.

00:10:40.900 So I do think that if I'm making a prediction tonight

00:10:43.460 that Vivek will get a bump in the polls after this,

00:10:46.380 and for DeSantis, it's going to be all based on his performance tonight.

00:10:49.180 I don't know what I would be thinking if I was him.

00:10:50.840 Okay, anybody else with questions for our lovely friend in Milwaukee?

00:10:55.840 What are you hearing from the Doug Burgum camp?

00:10:58.060 Is he going to bring the magic that we have been promised?

00:11:01.280 And the gift cards that we've been promised.

00:11:04.940 Well, the crowd is wild for Doug Burgum.

00:11:08.280 And that is the truth.

00:11:10.540 The absolute truth.

00:11:13.520 That's great, Candice.

00:11:15.000 And just obviously before we go,

00:11:17.820 where do you stand on Asa Hutchinson?

00:11:20.840 Do you think he should be only a vice president,

00:11:23.620 or should he be at the top of the ticket?

00:11:27.100 I'd like to see him at the top of the ticket,

00:11:29.120 and if that doesn't work out, press secretary for sure.

00:11:31.600 Press secretary.

00:11:31.940 He's so good at communicating.

00:11:33.400 Candice, thank you so much.

00:11:34.440 You probably have to get in there.

00:11:35.400 Enjoy the debate.

00:11:36.340 We'll probably be texting you for updates.

00:11:38.660 And give our regards to all our pals out there.

00:11:42.620 Okay.

00:11:43.040 All right, guys.

00:11:43.540 We'll check in soon.

00:11:45.080 Bye-bye.

00:11:45.380 Can I say one thing?

00:11:46.940 Oh, two things.

00:11:47.520 No.

00:11:48.300 Only one.

00:11:50.340 The thing about they go after Trump,

00:11:52.400 the deep state goes after Trump because he's effective.

00:11:54.680 I reject that premise because the deep state will go after any Republican.

00:11:58.800 They hate all Republicans.

00:11:59.900 They hate DeSantis.

00:12:01.040 They'll do whatever they can to destroy you.

00:12:02.760 If you make it easier for them,

00:12:04.260 then they'll be able to destroy you even more.

00:12:05.560 Trump tends to make it easier for them.

00:12:06.980 Second, on DeSantis,

00:12:08.360 what I would love to hear DeSantis say,

00:12:10.060 maybe he's already said a version of this,

00:12:11.440 but I'd love to hear him say it tonight,

00:12:12.580 is just like, listen,

00:12:13.800 if you're looking for a homecoming king,

00:12:15.820 if you're looking for Mr. Personality,

00:12:17.380 I'm not that guy.

00:12:18.360 I admit it.

00:12:18.940 That's not who I am.

00:12:20.040 But if you're looking for a killer who's just going to get things done

00:12:22.080 and you can look at the scoreboard and look what he actually achieved,

00:12:24.520 then I'm your guy for that.

00:12:25.440 I think he just has to, you know.

00:12:26.480 That should always have been his message.

00:12:27.920 Yeah, right.

00:12:28.320 100%.

00:12:28.600 The big problem, I think, is that they're,

00:12:31.800 and listen, when you're explaining, you're losing,

00:12:33.060 but I think the reason why DeSantis' campaign has run into some choppy waters

00:12:37.040 is because he made a couple of core assumptions

00:12:39.060 about the nature of the Republican electorate that just are not true.

00:12:41.860 One of those core assumptions is that racking up wins

00:12:43.720 would actually matter to the electorate.

00:12:45.300 And this is a core assumption that is not true.

00:12:47.960 I mean, the fact is that DeSantis...

00:12:49.080 People have short memories.

00:12:50.000 Well, not only that.

00:12:50.900 DeSantis doing a thing is being treated exactly the same thing

00:12:53.380 as Vivek saying a thing.

00:12:54.560 So Vivek will say something like,

00:12:55.840 critical race theory is terrible,

00:12:57.080 and then DeSantis will pass a bill in Florida

00:12:58.700 banning critical race theory in the classroom.

00:13:00.460 And people are like, those are the same thing.

00:13:02.060 Those are basically the same thing.

00:13:03.440 And it's like, well, that's not the same thing at all.

00:13:06.300 So when he says, listen, I'm competent at being governor.

00:13:08.720 I'm competent at doing these things.

00:13:10.380 The Republican base doesn't vote for that anymore.

00:13:12.820 Like, the idea of core competency as a requirement for the office

00:13:16.500 went out with Trump because Trump had no experience ever.

00:13:19.020 Wait, wait, wait, wait.

00:13:20.140 Trump represents something.

00:13:21.740 I've always felt that there was Trump the person who is the person,

00:13:24.900 but there's also Trump the voice of the people,

00:13:26.420 and he embodies the voice of the people.

00:13:28.360 This is 60 years of culture war of telling the American people they stink.

00:13:34.100 Their country stinks.

00:13:34.820 Their religion stinks.

00:13:35.620 Their patriotism stinks.

00:13:36.780 Their way of life stinks.

00:13:37.780 Their race stinks.

00:13:38.900 Everything about him stinks.

00:13:39.860 And Trump, as far as I'm concerned, is a polite response to that.

00:13:42.580 The response could easily have been pitchforks and torches outside.

00:13:45.700 I don't disagree with any of that,

00:13:46.620 but that has nothing to do with actual policy wins on board.

00:13:49.520 What I'm saying, though, is there was a time

00:13:51.500 when a DeSantis would have been easily the frontrunner,

00:13:54.920 when people would have been paying attention to policy,

00:13:56.960 when people would have been paying attention to results.

00:13:59.380 They're not anymore because they're just too damned angry.

00:14:02.160 And I think the anger is justified, but it's also self-destructive.

00:14:04.420 But by the way, I'm with Ann Coulter circa 2016

00:14:08.020 when she wrote this book with a ridiculous title,

00:14:10.260 but it had good substance.

00:14:11.360 E Pluribus Awesome in Trump We Trust was the title.

00:14:15.060 But the thesis was that a lot of people think people voted for Trump

00:14:18.680 for his personality, forgetting about his policies.

00:14:22.040 She said it was the opposite.

00:14:23.020 And what I would say differentiates Trump from the other Republicans,

00:14:26.400 at least in my lifetime, are three big issues.

00:14:29.340 Immigration, which he, yes, other Republicans have been anti-immigration.

00:14:32.840 He took it a lot further and called Mexicans rapists and murderers.

00:14:36.100 Trade, every other Republican and every other Democrat in my lifetime

00:14:39.620 was for basically more free trade, more globalization.

00:14:42.180 Trump opposed that.

00:14:42.880 He's now calling for mercantilism in the 21st century.

00:14:45.200 And war.

00:14:46.660 Every president who gets elected would bomb Iraq.

00:14:49.760 That was a rite of passage for every president in my lifetime.

00:14:52.560 Donald Trump was generally opposed to these imperial wars.

00:14:55.280 Those are three priorities.

00:14:56.660 How did he advance those first two when he was in office?

00:14:59.740 Well, illegal immigration plummeted during his first year in office.

00:15:03.380 And then after it became clear that the established bureaucracy

00:15:08.680 was not going to enforce the laws, then immigration ticked up again.

00:15:11.360 But he had a massive drop in the first months of his presidency.

00:15:14.000 He built some of the wall.

00:15:14.820 This is what we're always hearing.

00:15:15.580 We're always hearing, well, for the first part, it was good.

00:15:18.740 But it's hard when you've got an entrenched bureaucracy.

00:15:20.620 Well, it's hard, but that's part of the problem.

00:15:22.860 Okay, when you're explaining you're losing, I said it about a campaign,

00:15:24.820 it also happens to be true of administrations.

00:15:26.420 When you're explaining why you didn't get the thing done,

00:15:27.740 the thing didn't get done.

00:15:28.320 I guess, except Trump's at 50% in the polls.

00:15:29.400 So it looks like he's winning.

00:15:30.480 No, he's winning.

00:15:31.060 He also didn't get it done because of the way he treated it.

00:15:32.640 Now you're changing the metric of winning.

00:15:33.940 So I'm not denying that he's winning the primaries.

00:15:36.160 Yeah.

00:15:36.540 He is winning the primaries.

00:15:37.320 The question is, did he advance the conservative agenda enough as president?

00:15:41.240 I think there are many legitimate objections to, for example,

00:15:45.020 his COVID handling.

00:15:45.940 Or, for example, handling of the BLM riots.

00:15:47.920 Or, for example, his spending habits.

00:15:49.840 I mean, there are a lot of problems.

00:15:51.200 But the thing that I most object to, aside from your person, just as a human,

00:15:56.480 the thing that I most object to is this idea, this intellectualization of Trump

00:16:00.340 as Trump was a basket of issues.

00:16:01.780 He was not.

00:16:02.480 He was an impulse.

00:16:03.140 The impulse is what Drew is saying.

00:16:04.540 The impulse was a giant pulsating orange finger to all of the people.

00:16:08.320 But he's a person.

00:16:09.100 And people matter in democratic politics.

00:16:11.320 So his personality does matter.

00:16:13.040 Stop shifting your argument, though.

00:16:13.540 I agree with you.

00:16:14.220 I think it was chiefly about personality, which is why right now he is shifting around

00:16:18.200 on a wide variety of issues.

00:16:19.800 And it doesn't seem to matter one iota.

00:16:21.620 On those core issues, he's pretty consistent.

00:16:23.000 It's not true that he didn't achieve things because he was up against the deep state.

00:16:27.140 Every Republican president, any conservative president,

00:16:29.920 is going to be up against the deep state.

00:16:32.140 He mistreats people.

00:16:33.420 And that's not the way you run politics.

00:16:35.320 He couldn't repeal Obamacare because he treated John McCain like a piece of garbage.

00:16:39.480 And all I hear from Trump's voice is, well, he is a piece of garbage.

00:16:41.820 I don't care.

00:16:42.520 I don't care.

00:16:43.160 You needed his vote.

00:16:44.100 You need his vote.

00:16:44.860 You kiss his ass a little bit and get his vote.

00:16:46.420 And also, the excuse that, well, he tried and they blocked it.

00:16:51.020 I could almost buy that if there's evidence that he really tried.

00:16:54.500 But, you know, for me, the number one unforgivable thing, putting aside,

00:16:58.160 COVID was bad.

00:16:59.100 BLM was bad.

00:17:00.480 But the fact that he didn't lock her up, like he ran on lock her up and then he's in office.

00:17:05.840 They would have prosecuted him the second he locked her up.

00:17:08.080 And a lot of Republicans would have opposed to him.

00:17:09.560 But there was no attempt.

00:17:10.360 There was no even discussion or attempt to actually hold any of these people accountable.

00:17:14.000 That's actually the one where I blame him the least.

00:17:15.520 Because there was actually, you know, a generally agreed upon idea that you did not prosecute

00:17:20.600 the person who was the candidate of the opposing party.

00:17:23.580 It's just that he was fibbing the entire election when he said he would.

00:17:25.560 Well, I know, but Trump's supposed to be the guy that does that.

00:17:27.380 That's what sets him apart.

00:17:28.340 So the transgressive speech didn't actually match the policy in a lot of ways.

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00:18:48.660 So here's the thing.

00:18:50.160 I will acknowledge that the arguments that we are currently making about his shortcomings

00:18:53.380 on policy have no truck with the base.

00:18:55.380 Right.

00:18:55.600 They don't.

00:18:56.380 Okay.

00:18:56.560 And this is the big problem for a lot of the other candidates.

00:18:58.540 DeSantis is like, look at my record.

00:18:59.720 Look at Trump's record.

00:19:00.380 My record as governor of Florida is better than Trump's record as president of the United

00:19:04.500 States, which, by the way, is fairly inarguable.

00:19:07.060 If you just look at what...

00:19:08.420 Look, I love DeSantis, so I'm not knocking him.

00:19:10.940 But it's easier to run a state than the United States.

00:19:12.660 That's a fair argument, but in terms of what DeSantis has done to reshape the state of

00:19:17.200 Florida in a conservative image, there is no question he's had significantly more progress.

00:19:20.780 And I'm...

00:19:21.500 Whether you're talking about shifting a 0.5 percentage point state to a 20 percentage

00:19:24.980 point state...

00:19:25.620 A lot of that was migration.

00:19:27.560 Yeah, but why was that in migration happening?

00:19:29.140 I can tell you because my family moved there.

00:19:30.340 Yeah, sure.

00:19:30.660 I'm personally responsible for almost 20 people in my immediate family and surroundings moving

00:19:34.940 to the state of Florida, and that is because of the governance of people like DeSantis.

00:19:37.920 So, but, again, I will fully acknowledge that it doesn't matter almost at all in this primary,

00:19:43.280 and this is the thing that DeSantis is finding out, which means that the only thing that he

00:19:47.760 could pitch, I think what he thought is, I'm going to pitch strong governance, plus I can

00:19:52.580 talk like Trump.

00:19:53.200 I can be confrontational.

00:19:54.520 I can be spicy.

00:19:55.540 I can say a lot of the same things, but I don't also have the kind of crazy attributes

00:19:59.340 of saying every weird thing that comes into my head and all of this.

00:20:01.680 Mika's face and all that.

00:20:02.640 Exactly.

00:20:03.220 And that didn't work because you can't out-Trump Trump.

00:20:06.500 And the former part of it, which is the solidity of governance, clearly is not of top priority

00:20:11.240 to the conservative movement, which is really interested right now continually, and again,

00:20:15.480 I understand the emotional appeal, of throwing the giant orange middle finger.

00:20:18.120 There's also-

00:20:19.240 There's no substitute for the giant orange middle finger.

00:20:20.880 It is fun to-

00:20:21.860 Listen, I've done it myself.

00:20:22.800 It is fun to go up to left-wing celebrities, I've done this, and explain to them that I personally

00:20:26.920 will vote for Trump before I vote for the Democrat if Trump is the nominee.

00:20:29.540 They lose their minds.

00:20:30.460 It's fun to do.

00:20:31.180 I totally get it.

00:20:32.040 It is fun.

00:20:32.960 Okay?

00:20:33.120 And by polling data, this is one of the big gaps between Trump and DeSantis.

00:20:35.540 It's Trump is fun, DeSantis is not.

00:20:37.120 Totally get it.

00:20:37.960 You know what's not really supposed to be fun?

00:20:40.520 Governing and winning.

00:20:41.720 Okay?

00:20:41.940 Governing and winning is supposed to be victory.

00:20:43.800 You know what?

00:20:44.100 You know what's not supposed to be fun?

00:20:45.560 Politics is not supposed to be about the entertainment value of the politics.

00:20:48.980 It's not.

00:20:49.400 You know, we live in a democracy, right?

00:20:50.960 Do you know-

00:20:51.380 Democracy has been about bread and circuses, and about at least appealing to people on a

00:20:57.820 basic level, going back to Pericles.

00:20:59.920 You know-

00:21:00.380 No, wait, wait, wait.

00:21:01.020 All of them lamented this.

00:21:02.200 Bread and circuses comes from-

00:21:04.040 My old friend, Juvenal, who was saying you gave up your democracy for bread and circuses.

00:21:08.880 That is the problem.

00:21:10.220 So it's like, that is the stage we're at now.

00:21:13.040 People are willing to give this stuff up for fun.

00:21:16.220 But I think we should add here for just a minute, because I'm not completely-

00:21:20.400 I mean, it's most likely Trump's going to be the nominee, but I'm not completely sold

00:21:24.460 on it.

00:21:25.280 The dissents campaign was objectively crappy from the very start, and it's gotten better,

00:21:29.960 and it's getting better.

00:21:31.300 But he started out going, basically, I'm little Trump.

00:21:34.620 I'm, you know, Trump 2.0.

00:21:36.000 I'm the nice Trump.

00:21:36.680 All the stuff he said, even his slogan, which I can't even remember anymore, was MAGA 2 or

00:21:42.100 whatever, you know.

00:21:42.780 It's a bad campaign.

00:21:43.880 And I think the people he fired, they look at that and they say, that's chaos, but it's

00:21:47.300 also an improvement.

00:21:48.540 His staff knew nothing about social media.

00:21:51.300 They didn't let him say the things he was going to say.

00:21:53.760 If they let him go, he's won elections before.

00:21:55.940 He's possible.

00:21:56.520 The other thing that dissents really needs to do, and they know it, and they have to

00:22:00.320 do it, he became famous not just because his policies were good.

00:22:03.740 Every politician makes this mistake.

00:22:04.980 They think they became popular because their policies are good.

00:22:06.800 It's not true.

00:22:07.740 He became famous because the entire media made him the enemy.

00:22:10.080 And he beat him up.

00:22:10.700 And he punched them in the face.

00:22:11.580 Yeah, yeah.

00:22:11.820 And he has avoided all confrontational media for the entirety of this campaign so far.

00:22:17.380 You cannot do that.

00:22:18.340 The reason that Vivek is doing well is because he goes into confrontational media spaces,

00:22:22.300 and he's confrontational.

00:22:23.680 Now, I think he's fibbing, but I think that he'll say things to the Atlantic.

00:22:26.640 And then five seconds later, he'll pretend he didn't say that thing to the Atlantic.

00:22:29.460 And then he'll crap all over Caitlin Collins for asking him about it.

00:22:32.240 But, DeSantis has to go into unfriendly spaces, and he has to punch people.

00:22:36.920 I think he assumed that he had stocked up enough goodwill with the base that he could

00:22:40.280 avoid that.

00:22:41.000 And he's wrong.

00:22:42.160 It's not true.

00:22:42.680 Speaking of going into unfriendly spaces, do I have to, this is a message to the producers,

00:22:49.140 this is not to the audience, this is not even to you gentlemen.

00:22:51.900 Do I have to talk about this stupid nonsense about the aliens coming into our spaces?

00:23:00.480 Do I...

00:23:01.040 This is because Trump didn't believe it.

00:23:01.920 They're telling me yes in my ear, too.

00:23:03.020 Are they?

00:23:03.700 Yeah, I don't know.

00:23:04.380 It's silent in my...

00:23:05.260 Do we have...

00:23:05.860 Did you...

00:23:06.160 I heard you made a documentary, Matt.

00:23:07.740 Is that true?

00:23:08.260 Yes, we did.

00:23:10.260 We...

00:23:10.620 We're going to play the entire thing, apparently.

00:23:13.520 It's about 45 minutes long.

00:23:18.200 I don't think...

00:23:19.340 Well, look, I don't think a lot of setup is necessary.

00:23:21.100 Obviously, Ben and I have had our disagreements over the alien issue, and it made me think,

00:23:27.300 and I've spent the last several weeks doing a deep dive, investigating.

00:23:32.220 What I was really trying to figure out is, his arguments are so terrible, and I've embarrassed

00:23:36.600 him so much in this debate over aliens, and yet he persists.

00:23:41.000 And so it made me think, what is really going on here?

00:23:44.500 And I put together a report, and...

00:23:47.500 Take it away.

00:23:49.080 Please, take it away.

00:23:49.900 Please.

00:23:50.860 UFOs exist.

00:23:52.260 The U.S. government found quite a number of them, and they are indeed of non-human origin.

00:23:57.980 I'm just going to go, no.

00:24:00.280 We have spacecraft from another species.

00:24:03.420 There are no aliens.

00:24:05.400 Do we have the bodies of the pilots who piloted this craft?

00:24:08.540 Non-human biologics came with some of these recoveries.

00:24:11.720 We are not alone.

00:24:12.940 We're definitely not alone.

00:24:14.180 That mother...

00:24:15.140 That mother...

00:24:16.480 That mother...

00:24:16.500 You're back there.

00:24:17.200 It's not real.

00:24:18.120 It's not real.

00:24:27.980 Facts don't care about your feelings.

00:24:32.520 This catchy cliché was coined by Ben Shapiro, owner of the popular conservative news outlet,

00:24:38.860 The Daily Wire.

00:24:40.080 Mr. Shapiro recently targeted me in a public smear campaign after I provided a mountain of

00:24:45.160 evidence proving the existence of aliens.

00:24:48.140 For some reason, he refused to acknowledge the fact that we are simply not alone.

00:24:53.360 Well, Matt Walsh is a very controversial person for a number of reasons.

00:25:02.700 Dude really thinks that, like, the aliens are here.

00:25:05.000 Let's take this logically for just a moment to destroy Matt with facts and logic.

00:25:07.980 The evidence you're presenting me is going to have to be better than a guy saw a shadowy

00:25:11.360 image that appeared to defy the laws of physics, probably its aliens.

00:25:14.680 Again, this is a question of likelihood, Matt.

00:25:16.580 You have nothing.

00:25:17.380 I'm sorry.

00:25:17.760 You have nothing.

00:25:18.460 There are no aliens on planet Earth.

00:25:20.560 I don't believe it.

00:25:21.220 I don't see the evidence for it.

00:25:22.320 And I think all of this is a giant waste of time.

00:25:27.220 Sympathy poured in from around the world to comfort Mr. Shapiro after this public embarrassment.

00:25:33.140 However, he continues his anti-alien campaign to this day.

00:25:37.420 This irrational alienophobia, while easily dismissed as quackery, raises the question,

00:25:44.500 does Ben Shapiro pretend to hate aliens because he is one?

00:25:49.060 To protect the integrity of this investigation, all of the evidence you're about to be presented

00:25:55.340 was collected by our trained investigators.

00:25:57.520 Using the most advanced strategies, equipment, and techniques, we'll finally learn if the

00:26:03.120 one who smelt it dealt it.

00:26:05.120 In 2021, Young America's foundation hosted a speech at Florida State University featuring Ben Shapiro.

00:26:19.900 At this event, Mr. Shapiro demonstrated alien mind control capabilities in front of a live audience.

00:26:25.780 Hi, Ben.

00:26:26.240 How are you?

00:26:27.160 Doing okay.

00:26:27.660 How are you?

00:26:28.300 Great.

00:26:28.540 Um, how come you claim to be 5'9 even though you're like 5'5?

00:26:34.440 I don't know.

00:26:34.940 How tall are you?

00:26:37.160 You're 5'9?

00:26:38.040 I'm actually 5'9.

00:26:38.980 Okay, come over here.

00:26:39.660 Let's see.

00:26:39.880 Let's see.

00:26:39.960 Let's see.

00:26:40.880 Spatial perception is affected by distance, so considering the student in the video was close

00:27:03.340 enough to see Mr. Shapiro, it's reasonable to assume he was close enough to accurately

00:27:08.000 judge his height.

00:27:09.420 Yet, the young man's calculations were off by 4 inches.

00:27:13.460 Take another look.

00:27:14.320 A leaning expert on extraterrestrials testified on Twitter that aliens possess the ability

00:27:28.600 to control human minds, make us see things differently than they really are.

00:27:33.680 Did Ben Shapiro alter his perception in order to publicly own him?

00:27:39.600 Does this explain all of the college students Shapiro has destroyed?

00:27:43.420 According to Wikipedia, Ben Shapiro was born in January of 1984 in Burbank, California.

00:28:01.260 Our researchers checked online for any birth announcements with the name Ben Shapiro in

00:28:05.120 1984 and found nothing.

00:28:08.000 Aside from a certified birth certificate, no evidence exists that anyone named Ben Shapiro

00:28:12.760 was born on that day in Burbank or anywhere else.

00:28:21.460 Renowned physicist Stephen Hawking made a startling confession at some point before his death

00:28:25.940 that, unlike his contemporaries who speculated aliens are friendly explorers, he believed aliens

00:28:32.340 might actually hate humans.

00:28:34.160 Is there evidence Ben Shapiro is hostile towards humanity?

00:28:39.160 Our team pieced together this video from clips they found on the Daily Wire's website.

00:28:44.320 The company tried to suppress this evidence behind countless hours of newer content, but what

00:28:50.240 we were able to uncover is shocking.

00:28:58.940 Why do I hate Michael Knowles?

00:29:00.580 Because the gods have smiled upon Michael Knowles for no reason I can discern.

00:29:05.480 What the f***?

00:29:06.340 I'm going to be trapped in a locked room with Michael Knowles for a given period of time,

00:29:10.960 which sounds technically like the definition of hell.

00:29:13.900 Michael Knowles, a man who only fails upward.

00:29:16.940 You went to Yale.

00:29:17.760 I could not find any other productive thing that you had done in your entire life.

00:29:21.220 Michael Knowles, a man hired at this company for one job, did not do that job well, and

00:29:25.380 so was given a podcast.

00:29:26.420 You were an unemployable person, so we apparently just kept paying you.

00:29:30.420 And then I'm going to just hand this over to you.

00:29:32.660 We'll take a picture for the cameras.

00:29:33.760 This is really incredible.

00:29:34.620 There we go.

00:29:35.160 Thank you.

00:29:36.220 Absolutely.

00:29:36.940 No, no, no!

00:29:38.460 We've had many complaints about you walking around shirtless in the office.

00:29:42.300 See, in the movie, the pedophile's outside the room, Michael.

00:29:44.360 Never go in the dressing room when Knowles is in there.

00:29:46.280 Five more minutes and I was going to marry you and eat you.

00:29:47.900 Yeah, yeah, uh-huh.

00:29:48.520 That's why Michael Knowles will eventually pay the ultimate price when I run him over with my car.

00:29:55.820 We reached out to Mr. Shapiro for comment right before recording this video,

00:29:59.560 but our email went unanswered.

00:30:01.740 For more information and a closer look at the evidence, visit benshapiromightbeanalien.com.

00:30:12.000 Wow, Matt.

00:30:12.920 That was some really bang-up work.

00:30:14.720 Yeah, amazing.

00:30:15.420 Thank you.

00:30:16.360 I rest my...

00:30:17.940 Ah!

00:30:20.120 Don't believe it.

00:30:21.780 Don't believe it.

00:30:22.940 Yeah, it might just be the...

00:30:24.260 I don't believe it.

00:30:24.840 You guys don't believe it either.

00:30:26.020 No, I don't believe it at all.

00:30:27.020 I don't know what Matt's talking about.

00:30:27.540 Is that with the lighting, perhaps?

00:30:28.860 You don't...

00:30:29.540 I think, yeah.

00:30:30.160 No one believes it.

00:30:31.100 No one.

00:30:31.560 That's a great...

00:30:32.020 No one here believes it.

00:30:32.800 That's a great mask, actually.

00:30:34.900 The human mask that he puts on for...

00:30:37.180 Exactly.

00:30:37.980 Exactly.

00:30:38.460 That's what I'm talking about.

00:30:40.140 Yeah, I think...

00:30:41.580 You should just keep that on for the whole rest of this.

00:30:43.840 That's my life, apparently.

00:30:45.240 I like what's so interesting about the alien species is that they have beige-colored skin

00:30:50.320 just below the neck.

00:30:51.980 Well, that's actually what people have said.

00:30:53.520 They've said that my only scandal is my tan skin.

00:30:55.980 That's how they throw you off.

00:31:00.180 Yeah, well, it's incontrovertible.

00:31:02.760 I like that there's a lot of other shows that are doing very serious debate analysis

00:31:07.700 before the big debate.

00:31:09.160 Yeah.

00:31:09.580 And we played a five-minute video about...

00:31:11.540 I can't breathe in here.

00:31:12.620 I can't breathe in here like a...

00:31:14.040 Oh, Ben!

00:31:14.640 Oh, God.

00:31:15.000 There was just an alien where you're sitting.

00:31:17.700 Oh, well.

00:31:18.700 I felt like Joe Biden in there for a second.

00:31:20.540 I can't breathe.

00:31:21.440 I'm falling asleep.

00:31:22.080 I also love, at our multi-hundred-million-dollar media company,

00:31:26.240 I like that all of our gags cost about 14 cents at most.

00:31:30.940 Want to know why we're a couple hundred million?

00:31:33.880 That's how it works.

00:31:35.860 Can we officially put an end to this and all future discussions?

00:31:40.820 No, that was a setup for at least a 20-minute conversation.

00:31:44.240 Who is the most like an alien on the Republican debate stage?

00:31:46.900 Make...

00:31:47.560 You know, this is...

00:31:54.800 This is a good question, right?

00:31:55.800 Now you're thinking about it.

00:31:56.920 This is a credit to him.

00:31:59.360 Actually, it's not an insult.

00:32:00.860 But the answer is Mike Pence.

00:32:02.320 Because he's just so solid.

00:32:04.460 This guy, he doesn't sweat.

00:32:05.960 He doesn't blink.

00:32:06.680 He doesn't move.

00:32:07.500 He's unflappable.

00:32:09.500 And only he doesn't know that he sacrificed his career

00:32:13.560 when he saved the Republic by not overturning the election.

00:32:16.280 He's the only person in America.

00:32:17.320 He's a friendly alien.

00:32:18.300 He's a friendly one.

00:32:19.580 I do want to get to at least one topic that actually matters tonight.

00:32:27.120 But before we get to that, I want to plug Candace to go.

00:32:30.640 Thank heavens.

00:32:31.380 I was feeling inadequate.

00:32:32.200 Okay, before we do that, I want to get to...

00:32:35.560 You know Candace.

00:32:36.680 You saw her earlier today on the show.

00:32:38.140 Well, I want to take a moment to remind you that in case you weren't aware,

00:32:42.880 we are mere weeks away from the premiere of her new 10-part docuseries,

00:32:46.900 Convicting a Murderer.

00:32:48.060 The series will finally reveal the evidence that was omitted in the popular docuseries,

00:32:52.460 Making a Murderer.

00:32:53.440 If you know anything about Candace, you know that she loves to bust up media narratives.

00:32:57.960 Well, that is exactly what she's done in this new series.

00:33:01.460 Take a look.

00:33:01.960 This is a collect call from...

00:33:05.080 Hello, Steve.

00:33:05.680 ...an inmate at the Calumet County Jail.

00:33:07.920 The man served 18 years in prison until DNA evidence cleared his name.

00:33:11.560 The Two Rivers man was convicted of sexual assault in 1985,

00:33:15.080 but exonerated with DNA evidence in 2003.

00:33:19.060 So this is the infamous Avery lot?

00:33:22.120 Now, two years later, he again finds himself tied to a police investigation.

00:33:27.800 Accused of murdering Teresa Hallbuck on the Avery property.

00:33:31.080 Stephen Avery's 16-year-old nephew admitted his involvement in the rape and murder of Teresa Hallbuck.

00:33:36.920 The car is discovered just around the bend.

00:33:40.980 It was just this worldwide phenomenon.

00:33:43.240 I think they framed this guy.

00:33:44.320 I think he intended to crush the vehicle, but ran out of time.

00:33:47.700 Avery thinks the $36 million lawsuit he filed is why he's being targeted in this investigation.

00:33:55.640 1021 and 24 Main Street Cubs.

00:33:58.760 Do we have Stephen Avery custody?

00:34:00.320 Netflix made millions of dollars from making a murderer,

00:34:03.640 but the filmmakers left out very important details.

00:34:06.980 Mountains of evidence that you have not yet seen.

00:34:09.540 The blood vial.

00:34:10.380 The most egregious manipulation from the movie.

00:34:13.440 Interrogations.

00:34:14.080 That's when he started beating me because I told him that he's sick.

00:34:17.440 Cell phones.

00:34:18.380 And I saw melted plastic parts of a cell phone.

00:34:21.040 Interviews.

00:34:21.500 Her arms were pinned behind her head.

00:34:23.040 They made Stephen Avery look like a victim.

00:34:25.180 Do you believe your brother's guilty?

00:34:27.380 I don't know if I'm a suspect.

00:34:29.200 I got on the hide.

00:34:34.700 I'm getting sick and tired of media deception.

00:34:38.360 Evidence piling off.

00:34:39.620 Why would they omit so many different things?

00:34:41.580 Why are you editing my testimony?

00:34:43.540 I am not going to make the same mistake that the filmmakers did.

00:34:50.900 Rearranging the testimony.

00:34:52.860 They delete a portion of it at the end.

00:34:55.320 How could they claim to care about the truth?

00:34:57.360 They all know that Stephen Avery committed this crime.

00:35:00.380 The evidence forces me to conclude that you are the most dangerous individual ever to set foot in this courtroom.

00:35:12.180 Convicting a Murderer is available exclusively for Daily Wire Plus members.

00:35:19.960 Head on over to dailywire.com slash subscribe to sign up.

00:35:22.880 Right now you'll save 25% on your membership.

00:35:25.780 There has never been a better time, so sign up tonight.

00:35:28.500 I have to say, as a former court reporter, a guy who used to cover courts, everybody's guilty.

00:35:33.800 Everybody's guilty.

00:35:34.320 And every one of these shows is some sweet little white girl coming in and saying, I want to help people.

00:35:40.100 Here's a murderer.

00:35:40.720 I'll set him free.

00:35:41.600 They're like, no, no, that's not how you do that.

00:35:44.900 Also a great way of getting out of jury duty.

00:35:46.800 Just say that one.

00:35:48.000 It's true.

00:35:48.960 Yeah, I'm glad we're doing this because I remember Making a Murderer, and when that show came out,

00:35:53.620 it was whatever little bit of faith and humanity I had left to that point was gone.

00:35:57.700 And just the way that everyone bought that, there was no, and I remember very distinctly afterwards trying to tell people,

00:36:04.300 like, no, just spend five seconds on Google, and you'll clearly see some facts about this case.

00:36:09.440 Or serial.

00:36:10.420 Right.

00:36:10.920 Serial, yeah, that was the one.

00:36:12.780 Same girl.

00:36:14.000 Except just a different girl, but the same girl.

00:36:16.000 Speaking of human tragedy with more questions than answers, at least in the popular narrative,

00:36:22.380 we all know about this tragedy in Maui.

00:36:24.740 We were told 100 people dead.

00:36:26.140 Obviously, the number is probably an order of magnitude, at least higher than that.

00:36:29.640 Biden finally gets guilted into flying into Maui, and he decides to spend his time cracking jokes and falling asleep.

00:36:37.500 Yeah.

00:36:38.240 We are a community that relies on famine, on ohana, whether by blood or by friendship.

00:36:46.940 I don't want to compare difficulties, but we have a little sense, Jill and I, what it's like to lose a home.

00:36:56.700 Years ago, now 15 years ago, I was in Washington doing Meet the Press, and it was a sunny Sunday.

00:37:05.860 And lightning struck at home on a little lake that's outside of our home, not a lake, a big pond,

00:37:13.300 and hit a wire, and came up underneath our home into the heating ducts, the air conditioning duct.

00:37:21.820 To make a long story short, I almost lost my wife, my 67 Corvette, and my cat.

00:37:32.060 But all kidding aside, I watched the firefighters, the way they responded.

00:37:40.400 You know, there's an old expression.

00:37:42.680 I grew up right across the street from a fire hall in Claymont, Delaware.

00:37:48.560 You guys catch the boots out here?

00:37:52.940 That's a hot ground, man.

00:37:54.320 Pretty hot ground, man.

00:37:56.740 A thousand people dead, or more, many of them children.

00:38:00.360 This guy makes it about a kitchen fire he had, almost losing his car,

00:38:03.680 and how funny it is that his shoes are a little bit hot.

00:38:06.260 What's amazing, too, is the press coverage of this has been virtually non-existent.

00:38:10.420 Yeah.

00:38:10.680 Especially when you look back.

00:38:11.920 I mean, it's ridiculous at this point to care.

00:38:14.220 But the coverage of George W. Bush during Katrina,

00:38:17.720 where basically they made it sound as if he had blown really hard,

00:38:20.800 and that caused the hurricane and destroyed New Orleans,

00:38:23.100 which was destroyed by a thousand, not a thousand,

00:38:25.440 a hundred years of Democrat malfeasance in that city,

00:38:29.360 which didn't support the dams that were destroyed.

00:38:34.000 Yeah, the levees that were destroyed.

00:38:35.460 You know, this is an actual disgrace.

00:38:38.260 This is an actual American tragedy.

00:38:40.300 The worst fire in a hundred years.

00:38:42.620 The worst, most fatal fire in a hundred years.

00:38:45.140 3,000 people died on 9-11.

00:38:46.800 And this guy shows up, this guy shows up and talks about a kitchen fire that he had.

00:38:50.480 Falls asleep.

00:38:51.360 And, you know, I mean, it's...

00:38:53.700 And the media spinning for him is just...

00:38:55.700 And the media, not just spinning, they're not even covering, how did this happen?

00:38:59.580 Why were the roads blocked?

00:39:00.620 Where did the fires start?

00:39:01.540 Why wasn't it stopped?

00:39:02.440 All of those things are not being covered anywhere except by Brett Barrett.

00:39:05.060 Did you just say climate change?

00:39:06.480 It's climate change.

00:39:07.020 Climate change is always the excuse for complete human failure.

00:39:09.560 And remember, the big thing with Bush was that he flew overhead, Katrina, and looked over...

00:39:15.940 Rather than rappelling down into a flood zone, he flew overhead.

00:39:18.960 And that was the defining...

00:39:19.820 We were told by the media, they still say it's a defining image of his presidency,

00:39:22.960 an image that will live in infamy.

00:39:24.200 It was total disgrace.

00:39:25.280 That was two days after the hurricane hit.

00:39:28.700 Two days later, he's on the scene, not there physically because it's literally a flood.

00:39:33.480 It took Joe Biden two weeks to show up.

00:39:35.200 And also, by the way, that...

00:39:36.220 After a couple of vacations, right?

00:39:37.420 Right.

00:39:37.680 He was on vacation.

00:39:38.900 We can't remember...

00:39:39.720 We can't forget also the no comment when he was first asked about the victims of the fire.

00:39:43.160 He said no comment.

00:39:44.240 But also that clip there of him sleeping, it's actually true.

00:39:47.100 NBC News did run cover for him.

00:39:49.180 They ran a video, high resolution to show...

00:39:52.620 You could see the whites in his eyes.

00:39:53.720 He actually wasn't sleeping.

00:39:55.020 That's true.

00:39:55.420 He actually was not sleeping.

00:39:56.440 But that's more concerning.

00:39:58.020 The fact that you can't tell if he's awake or asleep.

00:39:59.920 But he's got his eyes open, but he's dead in the...

00:40:02.940 Yeah, his eyes are open, but he's just sitting there.

00:40:04.520 But you can see the breath.

00:40:05.300 I mean, he's breathing so deeply in that particular clip.

00:40:08.160 I mean, that's like REM breathing.

00:40:09.680 But in any case, it doesn't even matter.

00:40:11.040 I mean, the bottom line is that the great lie that the media have been telling about Joe Biden

00:40:14.540 for literally his entire career is that this is the captain of empathy.

00:40:18.140 He is such an empathetic human being.

00:40:19.760 His pitch is in 2020 as well.

00:40:21.400 He's just so filled with empathy for others and caring for others.

00:40:25.400 And sure, he has no actual vision.

00:40:26.760 This is the rip on him that Richard Ben Kramer writes about and what it takes.

00:40:29.440 That he has no actual vision.

00:40:30.500 He has no actual policies.

00:40:31.480 He doesn't actually care about things.

00:40:32.500 But he just has the connect, right?

00:40:34.240 He just connects with people.

00:40:35.560 And he's so empathetic.

00:40:36.560 And he's so caring.

00:40:37.380 It all goes back to the pain that he experienced when his wife and his daughter were killed

00:40:40.380 in that car crash.

00:40:41.280 And then it goes back to Bo's death and all the rest of this.

00:40:43.600 Here's the thing.

00:40:44.360 You can get away with that for decades when you're young, vigorous, and you can lie with

00:40:48.540 alacrity.

00:40:49.380 As you get older and that stuff falls away, all you look like is a callous narcissist who's

00:40:54.040 constantly citing himself in order to talk about himself rather than about others.

00:40:57.840 So in the Jewish community, I talked about this on my show.

00:41:00.160 In the Jewish community, when somebody dies, you hold what's called a shiva.

00:41:03.080 A shiva is seven days in which basically you shut down.

00:41:06.800 You live in your house.

00:41:07.740 You do not leave your house.

00:41:08.600 The entire community comes to you.

00:41:09.720 They bring you food.

00:41:10.940 You're supposed to pray three times a day.

00:41:12.200 So they bring an entire minion with them.

00:41:13.500 So they bring a Torah to your house.

00:41:14.960 The whole thing.

00:41:15.880 And they come and they just listen to you talk about your family and ask you questions

00:41:19.000 about the person who died.

00:41:20.660 Number one rule of visiting a shiva house or any house in mourning, do not talk about yourself.

00:41:24.920 Don't do it.

00:41:25.580 It's like the number one rule if somebody has died and you walk into a house in mourning

00:41:28.420 and you immediately start with, well, you know, my dad also died or, you know, I also

00:41:32.480 had a similar experience.

00:41:33.940 This makes you a garbage human.

00:41:35.980 You are not supposed to do that.

00:41:37.380 And every time Joe Biden runs into somebody who's experienced some sort of horrible tragedy,

00:41:41.420 sometimes tragedy that's his fault, as in the case of Afghanistan, he immediately starts

00:41:45.160 telling tales about how, well, I know exactly what that's like because I've gone through

00:41:49.340 exactly the same thing that you have because Bo came home in a flag-draped coffin, which

00:41:53.580 is a lie he didn't.

00:41:54.900 And he said, I mean, he tells these kinds of stories all the damn time because he is

00:41:58.840 a pathological narcissist who cares only about himself.

00:42:01.840 And then projecting that narcissism into faux empathy that the media eat up and pretend like

00:42:06.640 it actually, how would you like it if somebody came to, you know, your family got burned

00:42:09.280 to a crisp?

00:42:09.680 How would you like it if somebody arrived and like, well, there was that one time where

00:42:12.000 I had a bad kitchen fire?

00:42:12.920 Yeah, I almost lost my car.

00:42:13.920 So there are three theories here on what caused the fires.

00:42:19.160 The liberal establishment theory is that it was the sun monster.

00:42:22.780 It was climate change because we didn't placate Mother Gaia.

00:42:26.120 She burned Maui to a crisp.

00:42:27.960 The second theory is that this was malfeasance by the energy company, that they diverted all

00:42:33.360 their money into green energy policies to no avail, apparently.

00:42:37.840 And four years ago, they were acknowledging the risk of wildfires.

00:42:40.640 They didn't do anything to stop it.

00:42:41.960 So it was government incompetence.

00:42:44.000 There's a third theory, which I'm not saying is applicable here, but it's applicable a lot

00:42:47.720 of the time, which is that we know for a fact, many reports from the Department of Homeland

00:42:51.800 Security, that radical environmentalists start a lot of these fires, that arson is a concern.

00:42:56.420 We know arsonists were setting fires all over Maui, even within the last year.

00:43:00.640 We know that the Hawaiian Police Department was investigating that.

00:43:03.060 We've seen confirmed examples of many hundreds of these cases in recent years around the U.S.

00:43:08.820 What caused the fires?

00:43:11.260 I would guess the most likely thing is that there was an electrical fire and the winds

00:43:18.480 made it spread.

00:43:20.080 That's the most likely thing.

00:43:21.180 But why shouldn't you have a conspiracy theory when they're not telling you anything and they're

00:43:23.900 purposely lying to cover for...

00:43:26.320 I also don't know why that's a conspiracy theory when you're just positing possibilities.

00:43:29.580 Meaning, like, it's not impossible and you're not saying that it actually happened that way.

00:43:32.080 Well, from the very beginning, people were saying, like, Oprah burned things down so she

00:43:35.160 could...

00:43:35.300 Well, I mean, that kind of stuff is crazy.

00:43:36.800 Like, Oprah, I feel like, has better things...

00:43:38.420 I mean, she does own a space laser.

00:43:39.640 So, I mean, theoretically, you could...

00:43:40.820 But, you know, you don't even need to go that far.

00:43:44.200 First of all, I mean, I don't know how many of you guys have spent any time in Maui or in Lahaina.

00:43:48.000 So, that used to be because we're on the West Coast.

00:43:49.780 That was, like, my family's getaway every single year.

00:43:51.560 So, we were in Lahaina, like, seven out of ten years.

00:43:54.000 And it is just a spectacular little...

00:43:56.080 It was a spectacular little town.

00:43:57.700 It was a wonderful place to hang out.

00:43:59.320 And it was always packed to the brim this time of year because that's where you would

00:44:02.960 go to watch the sunset.

00:44:03.800 I mean, it's just a gorgeous place.

00:44:05.560 And the fact that it burned down this quickly is really insane.

00:44:08.740 It has nothing to do with climate change, by the way.

00:44:10.100 Every climatologist will tell you.

00:44:11.740 If they're worth their salt, it has nothing to do with climate change.

00:44:13.960 The temperature there is incredibly variable.

00:44:15.820 They've had a very dry summer.

00:44:17.060 They had a very wet winter.

00:44:18.100 They had a very dry summer.

00:44:19.180 But what this always comes down to, for me, every single time, is government mismanagement

00:44:22.980 of these disasters.

00:44:24.040 And you know the way you can tell?

00:44:25.000 It's when they start blaming the other stuff.

00:44:26.500 Right?

00:44:26.820 So when there was a hurricane that hit Florida and it knocked out a bridge, the bridge got

00:44:30.660 rebuilt inside of two days and things got fixed.

00:44:33.020 When the same hurricane then moved up into the Northeast and flooded part of the Northeast,

00:44:37.820 the media spent the next week talking about how climate change was responsible for the

00:44:40.800 fact that there was flooding in the streets of New Jersey, as though the human failures

00:44:45.000 there had nothing to do with anything.

00:44:46.560 The human failures here are astonishing.

00:44:48.580 I mean, astonishing.

00:44:49.300 There's an article from the AP today where they go into detail about what it was like to

00:44:54.440 be in Lahaina and what exactly was happening on a minute-to-minute basis.

00:44:56.820 The cops set up perimeters around Lahaina because there's only one road in and one

00:45:01.680 road out of Lahaina.

00:45:02.460 It's really hard to get in and get out.

00:45:03.740 That's particularly true if you're on Front Street, which is the part that's like right

00:45:05.840 by the water.

00:45:06.740 And it's a very crowded place all the time.

00:45:09.920 And they were telling people to turn back because there were downed electrical wires.

00:45:14.000 So you're talking about like triaging a problem.

00:45:16.060 How about like direct people around the electrical wires?

00:45:19.380 The people who disobeyed the cops lived.

00:45:20.920 The people who listened to the cops went back to Lahaina died because all of the winds just

00:45:24.000 picked up and rammed right through it.

00:45:26.020 That's why the question is not, well, there is a question of what started the fires.

00:45:29.680 But to me, no matter what started them, even if environmentalists did start them, the bigger

00:45:35.460 question is why was the fire, why did it kill a thousand people or more?

00:45:40.240 Why did they close the only roads out?

00:45:43.880 I'm not suggesting that it couldn't have simply been incompetence.

00:45:47.920 It probably was incompetence.

00:45:49.440 But you can certainly see why people would conclude, huh, something's a little screwy

00:45:55.180 here.

00:45:55.560 Is there something more going on?

00:45:57.000 This is the way you solve the problem of disinformation as Obama has always wants to

00:46:01.420 solve that problem by cutting out everybody who has an opinion different from his.

00:46:04.760 That's how he defines disinformation and misinformation.

00:46:07.820 The way you solve misinformation is by telling the freaking truth.

00:46:11.460 If you were the authorities, get the information, spread it to the people.

00:46:15.080 Then when other people come up with crazy conspiracy theories, they sound like crazy conspiracy

00:46:18.960 theories.

00:46:19.600 Now, crazy conspiracy theories sound like perfectly reasonable explanations because the government

00:46:24.340 is constantly lying.

00:46:24.660 Did you hear what the mayor of Maui says?

00:46:26.040 The mayor of Maui was confronted by a reporter in a small press gag.

00:46:29.320 What were there?

00:46:29.880 Half a dozen reporters there.

00:46:31.200 And here was his answer on how many kids are dead.

00:46:33.580 I don't know.

00:46:36.380 I wish I knew the answer.

00:46:36.820 Yes, you do.

00:46:38.440 How many children are missing?

00:46:41.460 You know.

00:46:42.000 I wish I knew the answer to that.

00:46:43.780 I would be happy to answer that.

00:46:44.920 You have no estimate as to how many children are missing?

00:46:47.660 Nothing?

00:46:47.780 I guess we can end this right now if you guys want.

00:46:51.340 Sorry.

00:46:51.840 This is one of the biggest questions that the people of Lhaina have, but you don't want

00:46:55.080 to answer that.

00:46:55.640 It always takes one or two to ruin it for everybody.

00:46:58.680 Please.

00:46:59.020 This is our first time.

00:46:59.940 This is our only opportunity.

00:47:00.340 Well, we could say that about you.

00:47:01.680 You've ruined it for everybody.

00:47:02.880 You're welcome to say it.

00:47:04.560 You're the media.

00:47:05.220 You can say whatever you want.

00:47:05.980 You're a disaster.

00:47:07.240 All right.

00:47:07.800 Okay.

00:47:09.200 You've been the worst mayor we could possibly imagine.

00:47:13.020 You won't even wait for your turn.

00:47:14.320 Respect?

00:47:14.960 Respect what?

00:47:15.820 This is the most dismal response we've ever had.

00:47:18.000 You won't wait for your turn.

00:47:19.480 You want to shout over these guys that are legitimate.

00:47:21.380 Why don't you give them the real answers then?

00:47:23.480 Give them the real answers.

00:47:24.760 That's not his question.

00:47:25.820 Let him.

00:47:26.060 Let him.

00:47:26.340 Yeah.

00:47:27.160 Yeah.

00:47:27.340 You can go.

00:47:28.480 You can go.

00:47:29.000 He is already.

00:47:29.600 All right.

00:47:30.280 Yeah.

00:47:30.380 Oh, sorry.

00:47:32.340 You know, one guy asking a tough question, not even a tough basic question, ruins it for

00:47:35.480 everybody.

00:47:35.960 I guess this is my other question.

00:47:37.400 Even if you could say, well, the cops shut down the roads because they just had no idea

00:47:41.360 what they were doing and they were downed power lines.

00:47:43.680 How is it?

00:47:44.700 I mentioned earlier, 3,000 people die on 9-11.

00:47:47.560 Here we're looking at 1,000 people, it seems to be the estimate.

00:47:51.000 A third of the worst tragedy in American history and the media basically black it out.

00:47:56.040 They blacked it out.

00:47:56.940 Why are they blacking it out?

00:47:57.960 I know.

00:47:58.140 I mean, the part, again, I just come back to the insanely obvious double standard with

00:48:03.320 regard to Biden.

00:48:04.500 Like, that's the pure, that's the, let's do it to protect Biden, basically.

00:48:08.000 100%.

00:48:08.360 100%.

00:48:09.560 Or the governor of Hawaii, who's a Democrat.

00:48:11.120 Yeah.

00:48:11.400 Or the mayor of Maui, who's a Democrat.

00:48:12.560 Or the senators who are Democrats.

00:48:13.480 I promise you that if this had happened in Florida, all you would get morning till night

00:48:17.520 is Ron DeSantis is to blame for this.

00:48:19.520 His emergency management response has been dismal.

00:48:21.580 Where was he?

00:48:22.260 If George W. Bush were president, if Donald Trump were president and he didn't show up

00:48:24.960 for two weeks while he was on vacation.

00:48:26.980 I promise you, every single waking media moment.

00:48:29.660 And then if you went there and started telling fibs about how I had a kitchen fire.

00:48:33.200 Like, it's just, it's the most egregious possible thing.

00:48:37.080 And, you know, this is the one area where, I think, if you're going to say that Republicans

00:48:41.220 have sort of a prayer of a hope, it is that the Democrats have created such an immense

00:48:45.520 bubble around Joe Biden that he believes he can get away with legitimately anything.

00:48:49.260 And there may come a, maybe he can, or maybe there will come a point where he can't.

00:48:52.700 Maybe there will come a point where it doesn't matter almost who the Republican, I think

00:48:55.060 this is part of the logic behind Trump.

00:48:56.480 Many of the Republicans are like, well, you know what?

00:48:58.320 In the end, it's not going to matter who he nominate because Trump, because Biden is so

00:49:01.360 eminently beatable.

00:49:02.300 And there's just such a wellspring of dislike.

00:49:05.680 And that may be true.

00:49:06.660 And that's not totally implausible.

00:49:08.100 I mean, the fact is that they've been lying on his behalf for years on end.

00:49:11.880 He's presided over the worst foreign policy disaster of my lifetime in the pullout of

00:49:14.820 Afghanistan.

00:49:15.440 He's presiding over one of the worst natural disasters of my lifetime in Hawaii.

00:49:18.400 I think the economic disaster over which he's presiding is being soft peddled.

00:49:22.300 Like what we are watching right now in the economy in the next six months is going to come

00:49:26.520 to fruition.

00:49:26.620 It's working.

00:49:27.400 It's working.

00:49:28.880 All of that, I think that's the hope for Republicans is that it almost doesn't matter

00:49:33.180 who you nominate.

00:49:33.560 I don't know why you'd want to take the risk.

00:49:35.060 It seems to me the thing you'd want to do is nominate the person who has the best shot

00:49:38.240 of beating Joe Biden.

00:49:39.440 But I certainly understand the feeling, which is the dual appeal of maybe he's so weak

00:49:43.860 anybody can beat him and also screw you guys.

00:49:46.420 That's a pretty strong emotional appeal.

00:49:47.880 It's very powerful.

00:49:48.240 Very strong emotional appeal.

00:49:49.100 I think I'm open to the theories that there was malice and that some of this was intentional.

00:49:55.780 I mean, I think that's a perfectly valid thing is we need to explore it.

00:49:58.620 But right now, if I had to pick a theory, it just seems to be this is this is bureaucracy.

00:50:03.520 Like it exists to not work.

00:50:06.060 It exists to diffuse responsibility.

00:50:08.140 No one's held accountable.

00:50:09.300 And so in this case, you've just got all these different you've got the power company.

00:50:12.700 You've got the police.

00:50:14.060 You have local, you have the local government.

00:50:17.620 You have the people in charge of the water.

00:50:20.000 And you've got this woke guy that was on record saying that, you know, when we're distributing

00:50:23.560 water, we want to make sure we take into account equity.

00:50:25.760 So you've got all these various different realms that in a moment like this need to work

00:50:31.120 together and need to communicate in a competent way.

00:50:34.180 And they just don't.

00:50:34.820 It completely breaks down.

00:50:36.460 My problem with this theory, though, is that for years we've said bureaucracy doesn't work.

00:50:41.780 Bureaucracy is the problem.

00:50:42.700 We need to dismantle the bureaucracy.

00:50:44.360 But I'll tell you what, this bureaucracy, the federal bureaucracy, seems to work pretty

00:50:47.760 well when it comes to rounding up Midwestern grannies from January 6th.

00:50:50.860 I think the bureaucracy works pretty well when it comes to imprisoning political dissidents

00:50:55.220 and the lawyers for Donald Trump, who is currently the chief political rival to the president.

00:50:59.860 The bureaucracy seems to work pretty well spying on Catholic masses and arresting pro-lifers

00:51:04.680 and trying to throw pro-lifers in prison for 11 years that they're doing right now.

00:51:08.180 11 years pro-lifers are facing a completely unjust trial because they had the audacity to

00:51:12.660 oppose abortion.

00:51:13.560 So in many ways, the federal bureaucracy seems to be working all too well.

00:51:17.620 It works to defend itself.

00:51:19.300 To defend itself.

00:51:19.780 That's what it does.

00:51:20.680 They didn't care enough.

00:51:22.340 This is like a, that's politics.

00:51:24.300 But this being ready for a disaster is a practical concern where you have to actually care

00:51:28.980 about the lives of human beings.

00:51:30.460 And when DeSantis was available to help Florida after a hurricane, they called it his, this

00:51:35.860 is his Katrina.

00:51:37.100 When Ted Cruz went to Cancun, he's a senator.

00:51:40.380 He's not a governor.

00:51:41.260 He went to Cancun when there was a freeze, a cold freeze in Texas.

00:51:44.560 And the media declared that this meant that Ted Cruz did not give a crap about anybody

00:51:48.480 except himself and his family.

00:51:49.900 Joe Biden goes on vacation for two weeks.

00:51:52.140 And he's going back to vacation now.

00:51:53.820 And he's clearing the lid every single day.

00:51:55.800 And meanwhile, his FEMA team is going, well, it's really up to the localities.

00:51:58.980 To handle this sort of thing.

00:52:00.760 It's just, it's insanity to me.

00:52:03.940 And I understand, again, I keep, what I keep coming back to for Republicans, I get it.

00:52:07.520 I get the feeling that inevitably the pendulum has to swing back the other way.

00:52:11.440 And the people, the bad people have to get clocked.

00:52:13.140 I totally get it.

00:52:14.120 But that's, there's no rule that says that's true.

00:52:16.340 You know, the notion that the unjust will pay their price.

00:52:21.100 Well, there is something to this.

00:52:22.580 Because the thing that the Democrats have done repeatedly, they call it the curly effect.

00:52:29.160 They basically chase the non-Democrat voters out of localities by making it so unlivable there

00:52:35.420 that the only people left are the people who will vote for them.

00:52:37.700 So you get the doom loop in San Francisco.

00:52:40.360 That actually works if you happen to be in government.

00:52:42.420 Because the only people left in San Francisco will be the people who will vote you back into office

00:52:46.220 every single time.

00:52:47.460 Because they're doing fine.

00:52:49.180 They're living on the streets.

00:52:50.040 That's where they want to be.

00:52:51.340 That actually works.

00:52:53.100 The problem is it doesn't work for the entire nation because there's nowhere for the entire nation to go.

00:52:57.740 People in California can go to Florida.

00:52:59.920 People in America got nowhere to go.

00:53:02.080 So ultimately, this government is now so corrupt, so unresponsive, and so dishonest in dealing with the public

00:53:09.340 that there is some chance that the people will just say, you know what, we've had it.

00:53:12.840 They did it with Reagan.

00:53:13.740 They did it with Giuliani in New York.

00:53:15.100 They may well do it again, but to me, Trump is like a big fat elephant stuck in the door that he opened.

00:53:24.780 He opened the door of the future, but he's now stuck in it, and he's not going to let anybody get through it.

00:53:28.040 The only thing you're wrong about is there is a place for American conservatives to go.

00:53:31.480 We've seen it in the recent years, and that, of course, is hungry.

00:53:33.760 Now, speaking of human tragedy and speaking of protecting unborn life,

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00:54:49.720 Now, we've been floating some conspiracy theories.

00:54:51.840 Did you know this? By the way, you always say I never make you any money.

00:54:54.620 I finally made you like a little tiny bit of money.

00:54:57.720 What?

00:54:57.800 Like a little, like enough to buy you like a maybe-

00:55:00.200 My God.

00:55:01.080 So, this was a little unexpected.

00:55:04.720 I am the most popular game show host in America.

00:55:07.620 This show we started on the Daily Wire YouTube channel.

00:55:10.140 It is the yes or no game.

00:55:11.340 We've sold a bazillion of these games.

00:55:13.940 They, we sell out every single time.

00:55:16.500 We now have the expansion pack.

00:55:17.620 The expansion pack is the conspiracy theory pack.

00:55:20.940 And the producers of this very show want answers from four of the cards on this, on this game.

00:55:27.380 Just your, listen, you don't, you're not being held to anything.

00:55:30.040 Media Matters is going to clip it out anyway, but this is a safe space.

00:55:32.820 If I say something about 9-11, I'll pretend I never said it in a movie.

00:55:35.720 Hypothetically.

00:55:36.140 Don't worry.

00:55:36.500 Hypothetically.

00:55:36.920 That were to happen.

00:55:37.520 Your polls will go up.

00:55:38.300 These are, I did not write these cards.

00:55:40.480 I take no responsibility for them.

00:55:43.000 Just want to go round robin a little bit here.

00:55:46.280 This is a mean one.

00:55:47.400 This is actually a mean one.

00:55:48.280 I don't even want to say it.

00:55:49.660 Excuse me.

00:55:50.940 I mean, ask me the question, but I'll read it too.

00:55:55.380 Michelle Obama is a man.

00:55:57.440 Can I take that one?

00:55:58.480 Yeah.

00:55:59.300 I am increasingly convincing of some validity to that theory.

00:56:03.140 No, I really am.

00:56:03.840 I've seen, look, some people have looked into this, and I think especially with...

00:56:08.980 Who are they?

00:56:09.760 Joan Rivers.

00:56:10.740 She looked into it.

00:56:12.220 God's sake, Matt.

00:56:13.060 You're the only one in America who knows that women can't be men.

00:56:16.020 Stop it.

00:56:17.520 Well.

00:56:17.880 But the question is...

00:56:19.520 I don't know.

00:56:21.440 Look, some information has come out about Obama recently that also confirms what we were told

00:56:28.320 was once a conspiracy theory.

00:56:28.820 But he did like dudes.

00:56:29.740 He did like dudes.

00:56:30.540 That is the thing that he wrote about.

00:56:31.500 Yeah.

00:56:31.520 So, I don't know.

00:56:32.240 Girlfriend.

00:56:32.520 Which is a weird thing to write to a girlfriend, by the way.

00:56:34.180 Yeah.

00:56:34.540 A very weird thing to write to a girlfriend.

00:56:35.520 I can explain it.

00:56:36.220 Of course you can.

00:56:36.960 I can.

00:56:37.260 No, I can explain it.

00:56:38.160 I was waiting for this moment.

00:56:38.780 Listen, I know that I tap dance.

00:56:40.800 I've done musical theater.

00:56:42.000 I was by far the straightest man ever to enter my particular alma mater and live in New York

00:56:46.960 and L.A.

00:56:47.860 Because a lot of people there, they say one in four, maybe more.

00:56:51.140 And one thing I noticed is even the straight guys in these liberal enclaves act kind of

00:56:56.760 gay.

00:56:57.320 But he said he had fantasies about them.

00:56:58.860 Yeah, yeah.

00:56:59.360 But he...

00:56:59.740 Every day.

00:57:00.380 No, look.

00:57:00.840 He probably did fantasize about dudes.

00:57:02.600 But the way he wrote it, he said, look, I think we can transcend sex.

00:57:06.800 He actually was writing about transgenderism kind of early.

00:57:09.040 And he said, I think that we can transcend these things.

00:57:12.260 I want to be larger than my attraction to this, that, or the other thing.

00:57:15.920 But he also said, I just fantasize in my head, but I...

00:57:20.760 Channel it toward...

00:57:21.880 Yeah, he said something...

00:57:22.620 Yeah, I channel it toward my ruthless political ambition.

00:57:24.380 But he also said, I know my body tells me I'm a man, and so that's just what I'm going

00:57:29.760 to do, both in my identity and in my desires.

00:57:32.600 But the only male I've ever fantasized about sleeping with is Winnie the Pooh.

00:57:36.280 And I was very small, and we were just cuddling.

00:57:38.680 And I just think of you actually fantasizing every day about guys.

00:57:42.280 It's weird.

00:57:42.560 It's a weird thing.

00:57:43.060 It's a little strange thing.

00:57:43.560 By the way, that doesn't mean she's a dude.

00:57:45.240 You realize that he...

00:57:46.000 So there's a phenomenal interview at Tablet Magazine.

00:57:48.540 The reason this came up again is because there's a phenomenal interview with his biographer

00:57:51.480 in Tablet Magazine.

00:57:52.880 A serious biographer.

00:57:53.780 Everyone has dodged...

00:57:54.600 Why are we dodging this question?

00:57:55.820 Yeah, Michelle is obviously a man.

00:57:57.300 Oh, God, God.

00:57:58.520 Okay.

00:57:59.060 All right.

00:57:59.560 Stop.

00:57:59.980 Ben Shapiro.

00:58:00.740 Not a man.

00:58:01.700 She's a woman.

00:58:02.620 I heard Ben Shapiro say...

00:58:03.280 She's a very bad woman, by the way.

00:58:04.520 She's a woman.

00:58:06.280 She's not a man.

00:58:07.880 Also...

00:58:08.400 I'm disappointed in you, Ben.

00:58:09.500 I am.

00:58:10.440 I've always thought of you as a fearless truth teller.

00:58:13.380 But, you know...

00:58:14.020 For those who haven't read the interview between Obama's biographer...

00:58:17.800 Yeah, that's great.

00:58:18.200 ...and Tablet, it is fascinating.

00:58:19.940 Because one of the things that one of the interviewers says is that when they went to

00:58:24.440 interview Obama, Obama had like a stack of his writings on the table.

00:58:28.740 Like his old letters and stuff that he wouldn't let him see.

00:58:31.880 And it's the belief of the interviewer and the biographer as well that Obama would literally

00:58:35.580 sit there and like write journals to himself and then he would encode them in letters to

00:58:39.460 his girlfriends with the notion that in one day these letters would be discovered and

00:58:43.580 then eventually be used in biographies.

00:58:46.400 And of course, this thing got buried.

00:58:47.400 This thing got buried, right?

00:58:48.180 It ended up at Emory University.

00:58:49.300 No one quoted it.

00:58:49.940 Nobody ever talked about it because it would have been super awkward when he was running

00:58:53.080 for president.

00:58:53.640 I fantasize about sleeping with men every day.

00:58:55.440 It would have been kind of weird for him.

00:58:56.540 And it might have led to some further questions about whether that was acted upon by that

00:59:00.880 guy.

00:59:01.500 But the guy who uncovered it, David Garrow, he's a Pulitzer Prize winning biographer.

00:59:05.780 And a leftist.

00:59:06.800 And he's a leftist, yeah.

00:59:07.740 And as was the guy who interviewed him.

00:59:09.360 Yeah.

00:59:09.720 And we just have to ask why Joan Rivers died so suddenly after she said a certain thing

00:59:14.380 that was on that card.

00:59:15.180 Okay.

00:59:15.720 Next one on here.

00:59:16.980 Dinosaurs as we know them are fake.

00:59:21.080 Hmm.

00:59:22.740 What do you mean as we know them?

00:59:24.020 I don't know.

00:59:24.520 Interpret it as you like.

00:59:25.940 No.

00:59:26.540 Dinosaurs are not fake.

00:59:27.140 They have all testified to me that they are absolutely real.

00:59:30.040 They do.

00:59:30.680 Well, you were friends with them.

00:59:31.740 I was there.

00:59:32.540 Well, okay.

00:59:33.440 I think dinosaurs existed, but probably a lot.

00:59:37.000 The popular conception we have of them is like there's a lot of probably baseless conjecture.

00:59:43.080 Well, now they change it.

00:59:43.940 Now they say they look like chickens.

00:59:45.120 I mean, I said they have feathers in some of them.

00:59:46.400 Yeah.

00:59:46.700 Well, there's every possibility that some of the dinosaurs, and they acknowledge this,

00:59:51.060 by the way, are like the reconstruction of the lion in like 13th century Britain.

00:59:55.780 Yeah.

00:59:56.320 You know, where they tried to bring a lion back from Africa to Britain, and it died,

01:00:00.680 and it decomposed.

01:00:02.020 And by the time they got it back to Britain, it was basically like a bag of bones.

01:00:04.180 And so when they stuffed it back together, it looks like this bizarre cat-cow kind of

01:00:08.520 thing.

01:00:08.760 And it's possible we're doing that with the dinosaurs.

01:00:10.540 And when you go in and you see all the bones put together, it's like, well, actually, the

01:00:13.800 neck wasn't that long, or this is a tailbone or something.

01:00:16.240 Yeah.

01:00:16.260 That's fine.

01:00:16.620 But also-

01:00:17.580 These dinosaurs exist?

01:00:18.100 Sure.

01:00:18.120 But we saw Jurassic Park.

01:00:19.320 They were obvious.

01:00:19.800 They were there.

01:00:20.500 Chris Pratt told me.

01:00:21.760 My take is that dinosaurs are real, but they were dragons.

01:00:27.560 That's my take.

01:00:28.240 I mean that sincerely.

01:00:30.400 Breathing fire or no?

01:00:30.900 No.

01:00:31.340 Like, in the sense that dinosaurs are this construction of modern, scientific, atheist,

01:00:36.660 materialist, stupid culture.

01:00:38.380 And dragons are the product of the intuition and imagination of every-

01:00:44.240 We can go back to aliens, aren't we?

01:00:45.520 And they were placed here by aliens.

01:00:47.960 No.

01:00:48.180 Yeah.

01:00:48.360 Basically, dragons are to dinosaurs what-

01:00:51.480 Drag me back.

01:00:52.120 Like, they were flying and breathing fire.

01:00:54.240 That's right.

01:00:55.120 They were at least flying.

01:00:56.400 Well, tear down.

01:00:56.760 Well, I mean, we know they're flying, but they're breathing fire.

01:00:59.400 They're-

01:01:00.120 The-

01:01:00.860 Whatever legend cropped up-

01:01:02.640 Look, they may have been breathing fire, but whatever legend cropped up that they were

01:01:05.340 breathing fire comes from a real place, like legends about all historical things.

01:01:09.560 I don't like that.

01:01:10.280 But I will say, you know, I watch a lot of nature documentaries with my kids, and when

01:01:13.440 you watch, especially about dinosaurs, and you have some, you know, scientist, it's

01:01:16.960 like, pulls out a fossil with one little line in it, and has this whole story.

01:01:21.060 Well, this is clearly a triceratops that was, you know, 40 tons and a female, and five

01:01:26.060 years old.

01:01:26.420 It's like, how can you possibly know all that?

01:01:27.980 Yeah.

01:01:28.100 So I think there's a lot of-

01:01:29.700 Yeah.

01:01:29.840 I mean, they didn't know their gender, first of all.

01:01:31.540 Who would?

01:01:32.240 How could they?

01:01:32.520 Who could?

01:01:33.120 Who could?

01:01:33.460 Nobody could.

01:01:33.980 Okay.

01:01:34.220 The things they said about Michelle.

01:01:35.700 The CEO-

01:01:37.140 Oh, this is going to get our company destroyed.

01:01:38.780 That's cool.

01:01:39.300 Really smart pick, guys.

01:01:40.440 This is great.

01:01:41.480 The CEO and founder of Facebook is a reptilian.

01:01:47.020 Not a dragon, but a reptilian.

01:01:48.740 Ben?

01:01:54.880 Robot, not alien.

01:01:56.620 Robot, not alien.

01:01:57.640 Robot, not alien.

01:01:58.120 He was constructed in a lab, not on planet Xenuf 10.

01:02:01.720 Yeah.

01:02:02.100 Like, he's not, he's not like a reptilian alien who's wearing a skin suit and here to destroy

01:02:06.920 humanity.

01:02:07.600 He is what we, in modern notions, call robots engineers.

01:02:15.080 Like, that is what he is.

01:02:16.540 I mean, I think the more interesting reptilian question is the guy on the plane, on the infamous

01:02:21.220 plane, the mother, it wasn't real.

01:02:23.280 Yeah.

01:02:23.460 Which is so strange.

01:02:24.260 Everyone's like, where is the woman?

01:02:26.120 Where did she go?

01:02:26.780 And then we found the woman.

01:02:27.920 Nobody ever asked, like, what about that guy?

01:02:29.460 Have we ever heard a word from him?

01:02:31.340 Yeah.

01:02:31.460 What did she see?

01:02:32.840 Maybe she saw him.

01:02:33.300 Yeah.

01:02:33.500 Did the guy, it was a real question.

01:02:34.760 Did that guy ever do any kind of interview and say.

01:02:36.220 And why, why was it okay to trace this poor woman down?

01:02:40.260 Right.

01:02:40.380 I think it's so awful.

01:02:42.500 It's so awful.

01:02:42.900 That, that they, they tracked this poor woman who had two shards at the, at the, uh, lobby,

01:02:49.580 you know, or at the, the bar.

01:02:50.700 She should have claimed parentage in the Biden family.

01:02:52.580 Somebody there were $20 million.

01:02:53.380 And they never would have found it.

01:02:54.300 And also, what does she have to apologize for?

01:02:55.840 Like, she, well, was she really.

01:02:57.920 That's crazy.

01:02:58.280 That's not the same thing.

01:02:58.760 Well, but also, but she really, whatever happened, she really thought that there was

01:03:02.220 some kind of reptilian monster on the plane.

01:03:04.220 And so she did the right thing with the information she had, which was to tell everybody.

01:03:07.800 Was there?

01:03:08.260 Right.

01:03:08.640 Well, we have the clip, actually.

01:03:09.640 We have this very important piece of journalism.

01:03:13.020 Say whatever you want.

01:03:15.060 I'm telling you, I'm getting the f*** off.

01:03:17.200 And there's a reason why I'm getting the f*** off.

01:03:20.000 And everyone can either believe it or they cannot believe it.

01:03:24.020 I don't give two f***s.

01:03:25.860 But I am telling you right now, that motherf***er, that motherf***er back there is not real.

01:03:33.840 And you can sit on this plane and you can f***ing die with them or not.

01:03:38.860 I'm not going to.

01:03:40.560 Would you have stayed on a plane after seeing that, right before it takes off?

01:03:43.440 Yeah.

01:03:45.560 Of course.

01:03:46.700 Of course.

01:03:47.200 If I can miss my flight for some crazy person.

01:03:48.940 Those are bad vibes to start on a plane.

01:03:51.860 No, I mean, I'm not getting off the plane unless Perszynski's on it or whatever.

01:03:56.560 Prigozian, right?

01:03:57.260 Prigozian, whatever his name is.

01:03:58.380 His mistake was getting Trump elected.

01:04:00.740 I think it offended Hillary.

01:04:01.920 He made the second most famous blunder.

01:04:06.300 The second most famous blunder is leading a revolt against the head of the Russian state

01:04:11.020 and then flying a plane close to his border.

01:04:13.620 The most famous is invading Russia in the wintertime, right?

01:04:15.940 He was like, you shouldn't do that.

01:04:17.580 Also, that plane committed suicide.

01:04:19.860 That's what Vladimir Putin says.

01:04:20.940 It fell off the fifth floor of a building.

01:04:22.460 I'm picturing Putin's dismay when he was running up to the field with his gun in hands and he

01:04:30.020 sees the burning wreckage and there's just Hillary standing with a bazooka and she beat

01:04:34.400 him to it.

01:04:35.020 He must have been so crestfallen.

01:04:37.180 Last one.

01:04:37.800 It's crazy when we find out Epstein was on that plane.

01:04:39.460 You know, at first I felt bad for the other people on the plane with Prigozian.

01:04:43.060 You know, head of the Wagner group leads the coup against Putin.

01:04:45.600 But then I thought, if you're sitting on the plane with Prigozian...

01:04:49.860 Well, it's a private plane, too, right?

01:04:50.900 It's obviously a private plane.

01:04:51.680 It's not like he was on a Southwest, right?

01:04:53.500 Yeah.

01:04:54.000 It's not, right?

01:04:54.740 Well, he's not A-list preferred, you don't think?

01:04:56.860 Right.

01:04:57.080 The head of the Wagner group?

01:04:58.060 If you're on the private plane with the head of the Wagner group, I...

01:05:02.540 Good bet that you're not the cleanest?

01:05:05.940 Yeah.

01:05:06.580 Yeah, you've got problems.

01:05:07.540 Hopefully there are no children aboard or something.

01:05:09.200 People are not responsible for themselves.

01:05:10.660 This is the final question to debate.

01:05:12.600 Taylor Swift is the clone...

01:05:14.600 What is this?

01:05:15.040 Taylor Swift is the clone of Xena LeVay, daughter of the infamous Satanist Anton LeVay.

01:05:24.320 Right, I remember.

01:05:25.000 I don't know.

01:05:25.140 Whoa, man, that's crazy.

01:05:26.260 Yes, I've never heard of that, but yes.

01:05:28.020 Yeah, she is, right?

01:05:29.180 You don't even have to explain beyond Satanist.

01:05:30.480 Yes.

01:05:31.180 Yeah.

01:05:31.780 Whoa, man, that's so weird.

01:05:33.820 Am I the only person who likes Taylor Swift, I think?

01:05:35.340 Yes.

01:05:36.180 Well, yeah, you're the only person who hasn't been just sucked into this, like, demonic cult.

01:05:40.920 I know, and the only non-millennial white girl.

01:05:43.620 The only thing is, she writes her own music, right?

01:05:46.300 She's got that going for her.

01:05:47.040 Not anymore, right?

01:05:47.480 She used to.

01:05:48.300 Her modern songs are one of those, like, 11 people write them.

01:05:52.360 I'm trying to give her some credit, but...

01:05:53.960 Well, she can't sing.

01:05:55.100 Nice leg.

01:05:56.840 Damn it, Drew.

01:05:57.820 All you care about is Xena or Taylor.

01:06:00.080 Damn it, Drew, you old perv.

01:06:01.440 Just cut it out.

01:06:01.960 Is it Xena?

01:06:03.920 Bill Buckley had that line.

01:06:04.960 And he was asked if he approved of miniskirts by some young gal, and he said, well, on you,

01:06:07.860 I do.

01:06:08.420 That's basically your point, Drew.

01:06:10.360 Absolutely.

01:06:11.120 Okay, well...

01:06:12.380 That was great.

01:06:13.140 I can't believe...

01:06:13.680 I can't believe that that was a best-selling...

01:06:16.120 So that's making money, eh?

01:06:17.740 Yeah, this...

01:06:18.960 Guys, that's great, you should go buy it.

01:06:20.360 The one...

01:06:20.840 I'll tell you, the one that really freaked me out, the Xena LeVay thing, man, especially

01:06:25.060 because, well, this guy's talking about aliens all the time.

01:06:27.460 I point out that it's probably demons.

01:06:29.900 And, man, that's some weird demonic stuff.

01:06:32.400 That's some occult, weird Satanist stuff.

01:06:34.540 If you play them forwards, they sound exactly the same.

01:06:37.100 Yeah, they do.

01:06:37.840 If you play them forwards, they sound...

01:06:39.800 People playing the game aren't going to have the benefit of that picture, so they're not

01:06:42.660 going to...

01:06:42.840 That's a real...

01:06:43.560 Yeah.

01:06:44.200 That's a deep cut.

01:06:44.760 That's a deep cut.

01:06:45.560 You have to...

01:06:45.920 Listen, the audience is the real creme de la creme of the political public, you know.

01:06:51.160 All right.

01:06:51.940 We have to get to...

01:06:52.820 That was a great segment.

01:06:53.300 I thought it was a good segment, by the way.

01:06:54.340 I loved it.

01:06:54.780 What we just did.

01:06:56.420 Every moment was gold.

01:06:57.680 Basically.

01:06:58.440 Now, we have to get to something that actually involves a colleague of ours, which we'll

01:07:01.680 get to in one second, but we have to get to a shameless plug that involves another

01:07:04.940 colleague of ours who happens to be in the place that conservatives escape to, which

01:07:08.340 is Hungary, and that would be Jeremy's soap.

01:07:11.900 Where is that guy?

01:07:12.860 He is gallivanting all about selling soap.

01:07:16.880 He's clean.

01:07:17.520 We're seeing it more every day.

01:07:19.120 He's a clean old man.

01:07:21.300 Mainstream brands openly insult their customer base, and they expect you to be okay with it.

01:07:25.620 Well, thankfully, Jeremy's Razors not only makes great products, but the company has

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01:07:54.520 Stop giving your money to woke corporations that hate you.

01:07:57.600 Go to jeremysrazors.com today.

01:08:00.480 You do the ad all wrong.

01:08:01.280 If you're going to do the ad right, you've got to close it.

01:08:02.300 You've got to hold it.

01:08:03.080 All right, let's see.

01:08:03.660 Can we get a nice, close shot there?

01:08:05.640 Hey, guys, you ready?

01:08:06.260 If you're going to do the ad, it's got to be like this.

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01:08:20.720 For all purposes.

01:08:21.540 There are literally no purposes for which you cannot use this particular cleaner.

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01:08:27.440 Absolutely, you could.

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01:08:32.440 that I just threw.

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01:08:36.800 We have an all-purpose cleaner.

01:08:37.740 That's pretty cool.

01:08:38.020 What is a paraben?

01:08:39.280 I have no idea.

01:08:39.880 I've been talking about it for weeks on the show.

01:08:41.460 No clue to paraben.

01:08:41.820 I think it's like seed oils.

01:08:43.700 All I know is it's bad.

01:08:44.960 It's like a quasi-ben.

01:08:46.060 It's like a paraben.

01:08:46.640 Yeah, it's a...

01:08:47.840 Really?

01:08:51.540 Cutting-edge hip humor on this show, folks.

01:08:54.440 Drew loved that one.

01:08:55.640 Starting in 1911.

01:08:56.840 So, a pal of ours, colleague of ours...

01:08:59.720 Yes.

01:09:00.240 ...is being threatened by Canada, America's evil top hat.

01:09:04.340 This is Jordan's fault for being Canadian.

01:09:06.740 Yes.

01:09:08.360 I never heard that before.

01:09:09.440 That's the first thing you said I loved.

01:09:10.680 Thank you.

01:09:11.420 No, I had a pun in that video.

01:09:12.780 America's evil top hat?

01:09:13.680 The America's evil top hat, and I had some joke about a cookbook that you also...

01:09:16.940 Oh, that was amazing.

01:09:17.720 Thank you.

01:09:18.000 That was a good joke.

01:09:18.500 All right, I've got two.

01:09:19.220 You're right.

01:09:19.460 That was a great joke.

01:09:20.540 So...

01:09:21.020 In 10 years.

01:09:22.260 Two in a decade.

01:09:24.200 Ontario is threatening to take away Jordan's psychology license.

01:09:29.480 The Superior Court of Justice ordered Jordan to pay 25 grand to the College of Psychologists

01:09:34.700 and upheld the order that he go through a so-called social media re-education program.

01:09:40.780 I pity the re-education program.

01:09:42.940 Can you imagine?

01:09:44.700 Like, yeah.

01:09:45.460 I will not tweet what you want me to tweet.

01:09:48.920 You know, they've been making this mistake with Jordan from the very beginning.

01:09:52.060 If they had just left him alone, he'd still be like teaching university classes.

01:09:56.340 For people who, you know, believe that the left in America does not want to actively shut

01:10:02.260 down speech, they do.

01:10:04.420 I mean, take a look again.

01:10:05.560 I mean, they want to destroy your life.

01:10:07.320 They really, really do.

01:10:08.740 I was explaining this to somebody, again, a friend of mine who's on the left, and I blew

01:10:13.020 his mind when I explained to him that if it comes down to Trump versus Biden, I will vote

01:10:16.800 for Trump, and it won't really take much to convince me of that, like, at all.

01:10:21.620 And he asked why, and I said because of this.

01:10:23.440 Because you want to trans my kids, you want to, or at least you want to make it good and

01:10:28.020 proper for the public schools to work to trans my kids.

01:10:30.420 You will attempt to shut me down if I speak freely.

01:10:33.320 And then they'll be like, no, no, no, that's not true at all.

01:10:35.340 Well, yes, it is.

01:10:36.820 Yes, it is.

01:10:37.440 I mean, look what they're doing in Canada.

01:10:38.760 Look what they're doing in the UK.

01:10:40.600 The goal here has always been, and will always be, to make traditional living illegal and

01:10:46.140 make personal sexuality public.

01:10:48.040 That's like the only thing that matters to these folks.

01:10:50.420 So in order, apparently, to be a licensed psychologist, you have to be fully insane in

01:10:54.500 Canada.

01:10:54.900 You have to actually parrot insanity back to people to be a licensed psychologist in Canada.

01:10:59.560 Honestly, like, Jordan is going to make their lives so miserable.

01:11:03.400 It'll be fun to watch.

01:11:04.560 It'll be quite fun to watch, Jordan.

01:11:06.200 Actually, I would love to sit in the room watching Jordan take social media re-education

01:11:11.340 training.

01:11:11.960 It would be one of the great experiences of my life.

01:11:14.460 I would pay honest-to-God money to, like, be available in that room.

01:11:18.260 I would go get a Canadian bar license to go and be in that room while they try to teach

01:11:23.080 Jordan the things he can and cannot say on Twitter.

01:11:25.480 I just cannot imagine.

01:11:26.440 This is a man who, as psychology is facing this replication crisis, this whole crisis

01:11:33.180 of identity for the entire field, this man has done more good from the field of psychology

01:11:39.680 than anybody since at least Viktor Frankl and maybe just any psychologist ever.

01:11:44.880 More people are...

01:11:45.820 People come up to me with tears in their lives.

01:11:47.900 I'm not exaggerating.

01:11:48.920 And they will say, Michael, you know Jordan Peterson.

01:11:51.200 The man changed my life.

01:11:52.680 And grown men, like serious men.

01:11:54.720 And I think that's the guy that Castro's son goes after.

01:11:59.840 That's why.

01:12:00.540 That's why.

01:12:00.960 That's why.

01:12:01.340 Because he's changed their life for the better and he's made them feel better about being

01:12:04.340 men and he's made them understand what it means to be a man and he speaks...

01:12:07.880 You know, the funny thing about Jordan, too, is like...

01:12:10.880 You know, because he can have a harsh, you know, affect on Twitter where he just...

01:12:14.880 He gets so angry at these people because they pick on people who are smaller than them.

01:12:18.260 He hates bullies.

01:12:19.300 But he's the most gracious, kindly person that you could possibly meet.

01:12:23.960 Yeah.

01:12:24.080 And he genuinely cares about the people who are being stomped on and that's why they're

01:12:28.440 stomping on him.

01:12:29.060 Why wouldn't they?

01:12:29.960 Why wouldn't they?

01:12:30.440 By the way, you found the conspiracy theory I do believe in.

01:12:32.660 There's no question that Justin Ferdow is Castro's son.

01:12:35.220 There's like no question about this.

01:12:36.940 I agree.

01:12:37.440 Zero doubt.

01:12:38.340 I have started to keep an open mind on this because by some angles he sort of vaguely kind

01:12:44.600 of looks like Pierre or...

01:12:46.960 No, no.

01:12:48.340 I'm sorry that you're experiencing a stigmatism.

01:12:50.300 Yeah.

01:12:51.560 Okay, you're right.

01:12:52.820 You're right.

01:12:53.300 He's the son of the Cuban dictator.

01:12:55.200 By the way, I think what you said is really important because to me that's the even more

01:12:58.860 dire implication of stories like this.

01:13:00.440 There's the free speech angle, really important.

01:13:02.120 But the fact that this is what the psychology industry has become is people need to understand

01:13:07.820 that.

01:13:08.000 I mean, this is why I'm so skeptical and critical of it fundamentally.

01:13:12.480 Totally.

01:13:12.740 And I would, before I would advise any loved one to go see a psychologist, I would be very,

01:13:18.360 very careful because the entire industry has been totally ideologically captured.

01:13:23.460 I mean, there was a story a few days ago about a child psychologist, prominent one in California

01:13:27.200 somewhere, of course, I think, who was talking about gender, how some children are gender

01:13:31.500 minotaurs, or you could be a gender Prius.

01:13:35.420 Well, they made it illegal to practice actual psychology, right?

01:13:38.680 If a kid comes into you and says, I'm sexually confused, and then you say, well, maybe you

01:13:43.320 ought to wait on that and see how it develops.

01:13:45.120 It's perfectly normal at the age of 14 to be sexually confused.

01:13:48.360 That's a no-no.

01:13:49.060 That's conversion.

01:13:49.780 That's conversion.

01:13:50.340 And most psychologists have gone along with that completely, with very few exceptions,

01:13:54.740 and the ones that have not gone along with it, like George Pierce.

01:13:56.540 This is the irony of the so-called conversion therapy.

01:14:00.160 All therapy is, by definition, conversion therapy.

01:14:03.240 Yes, and why should you not be able to go to somebody and say, I'm gay, I'd like to not

01:14:08.360 be gay, can you possibly help me, and explore that?

01:14:11.460 I don't understand that at all.

01:14:12.580 Right, but if you go to any psychologist, you say, I have a mental problem, I've got some

01:14:17.340 block, can you convince me to think in a different way and behave in a different way?

01:14:21.320 That is a conversion.

01:14:22.340 Every time it's a type of conversion.

01:14:23.620 There is a strain, and it is a strain under fire, no question about it.

01:14:27.600 There's a strain of Christian psychology that I think can be very useful to people.

01:14:31.620 I think it's useful to people to talk to someone.

01:14:33.600 I think talking to someone who cares about you and doesn't have a stake in your life can

01:14:38.440 be immensely important.

01:14:40.180 But you're absolutely right about this.

01:14:41.700 I think it can be useful, but it can also cause more damage than it does good.

01:14:47.940 Well, if a person is incompetent or evil.

01:14:50.220 But I think, you know, I'm also critical of just the idea of like, well, go to therapy.

01:14:53.820 Everybody just always go to therapy.

01:14:55.120 I think what drives people to go to therapy oftentimes is just that they want to just

01:14:58.540 talk about themselves.

01:14:59.380 Right.

01:14:59.560 And they have a lot of fun talking about themselves, and they want to kind of wallow in their own

01:15:05.780 misery, and they want to tell their own story, and all the suffering they've gone through.

01:15:10.780 That's all they actually want to do.

01:15:12.100 That's why there's no, as far as I'm aware, no data supporting the idea that simple talk

01:15:16.240 therapy is worthwhile.

01:15:17.140 It has to be combined with cognitive behavioral therapy, right?

01:15:19.540 Which is an actual intervention by the psychologist saying, your train of thoughts, for example,

01:15:23.240 you're anxious, and your anxiety is being caused by this train of thoughts.

01:15:26.280 We need to intervene and say, is this train of thoughts logical?

01:15:28.760 Is this correct?

01:15:29.340 Are you actively realizing what you're doing?

01:15:31.600 That's CBT, right?

01:15:32.320 So CBT, actually, there's very good data to that, but that's an interventionist approach

01:15:36.460 to psychology.

01:15:37.500 I don't know when the confirmatory approach to psychology came about, but even Freud rejected

01:15:42.240 that.

01:15:42.600 I mean, what's amazing is that when Freud talks about, for example, polymorphous perversity,

01:15:47.980 right, this idea that there's like this human sex drive and that we're driven to, that

01:15:51.040 we're truly driven by the sex drive, he then suggests that that's bad, and that the way

01:15:54.720 that you actually end up being a productive human being is you sublimate that in favor

01:15:58.100 of, he does say this, I mean, you sublimate that, correct, in favor of higher purposes,

01:16:03.240 and the act of maturing is maturing out of treating those desires as primary and sublimating

01:16:08.740 them to higher desires and better things.

01:16:10.840 That means higher process of growing up.

01:16:12.400 It's only in the 1960s where they say, no, no, no, real authenticity is where you strip

01:16:15.540 away the sublimation.

01:16:16.500 Sublimation is a form of anxiety, and you have to deal with it.

01:16:18.880 There is an underlying philosophy to Freud, which he didn't intend, but it's simply built

01:16:24.440 into the system, where the true reality of you is your basest desires, and everything

01:16:30.940 else is laid on top of that.

01:16:32.320 And that's not always been the case.

01:16:33.880 I mean, if you think of Plato and the chariot analogy, all of our instincts, including our

01:16:39.120 noble instincts, are included in us, and they're part of who we are.

01:16:42.440 And I think that, you know, I have to say, on a more shallow level, I worked with a lot

01:16:48.760 of suicidal people.

01:16:49.760 I've been on hotlines and things like this.

01:16:51.640 50% of them call up to tell you why they can't be helped.

01:16:55.660 50% of them do not want to be helped.

01:16:57.580 50% of them are looking just for somebody to say, you're not awful.

01:17:01.180 And that's not a bad thing.

01:17:02.460 I don't think that's a bad thing.

01:17:03.440 I think that's helpful.

01:17:04.080 But I think one of the problems with the psychology industry is that the only hope, Jordan Peterson

01:17:12.980 is a good psychologist because he's a good philosopher.

01:17:15.540 And psychology is not really, the idea that it's like medicine or science, it's not exactly.

01:17:20.340 A good psychologist is someone that has a good idea of what a human being is supposed

01:17:25.660 to be.

01:17:26.340 Absolutely.

01:17:26.780 And that's what, you go to a psychologist with that question, what am I supposed to be?

01:17:29.540 How am I supposed to think?

01:17:31.140 What ways am I supposed to act?

01:17:32.760 And those are not medical questions.

01:17:35.320 Those are not scientific questions.

01:17:36.680 Those are philosophical questions.

01:17:37.980 The reason why Jordan Peterson is so effective is because he's just a good philosopher.

01:17:41.880 He's got a good sense.

01:17:42.500 He's got wisdom.

01:17:43.060 He's got a good sense of how a person is supposed to be.

01:17:44.780 You're right about this because when it comes to medicine, there is an agreed upon standard

01:17:48.700 of what you are trying to achieve.

01:17:50.560 When it comes to medicine, you come in, your leg hurts.

01:17:53.460 The idea is, how do I make it so my leg doesn't hurt and functions properly?

01:17:56.460 But functions properly is well understood.

01:17:57.840 A leg that functions properly lets you go places, supports your weight, all of these sorts

01:18:01.480 of things.

01:18:01.720 When you come in, you say, I as a human am not functioning properly, that requires some

01:18:05.980 explication.

01:18:06.600 What does it mean to function properly as a human?

01:18:08.340 And this is where you get into the philosophy section, right?

01:18:10.380 Because we have generate, we have millennia of traditions suggesting what it means to be

01:18:14.340 a properly functioning human being.

01:18:15.640 And really over the course of the last century and a half, we've decided that to be a fully

01:18:18.320 functioning human being means to essentially humor your basest desires.

01:18:22.700 That's what it means to be a fully functional human being.

01:18:24.680 And it's really all of these other impositions by society that have prevented you from engaging

01:18:28.940 in the great you that exists internally.

01:18:32.060 And that's where psychology has gone utterly wrong.

01:18:34.560 That's right.

01:18:35.100 And that is not what the history of philosophy tells us.

01:18:39.700 The history of philosophy has always said that there is an aspect of the human being that

01:18:43.020 knows right from wrong, that can reason to right from wrong, and that can impose restrictions

01:18:47.120 on its basic issues.

01:18:48.160 And that's built into the human person.

01:18:50.560 Psychology, like modern psychology, never asks, in order to accomplish what?

01:18:54.720 So again, when they say like heal your leg, it's in order to accomplish walking, in order

01:18:58.080 to accomplish carrying.

01:18:59.180 When they say, I want to be a whole human being, in order to accomplish what?

01:19:01.840 Because what you want to accomplish is going to be a large part of which direction we're

01:19:05.660 actually directing the healing.

01:19:07.480 If you say, I want to be non-anxious, and so I want to be non-anxious so that I can party

01:19:12.520 all night long and drink without worrying about it, then a psychologist theoretically could

01:19:17.480 do that.

01:19:17.840 They could say, you know what?

01:19:18.460 Don't worry about anything in your life.

01:19:19.800 Get rid of all of your worries.

01:19:20.760 Get rid of all of your cares.

01:19:21.660 Live off of welfare.

01:19:22.340 And do all those things, and you won't be anxious anymore, and your anxiety is healed.

01:19:25.220 But that's not a properly functional human being.

01:19:27.560 The other way to actually deal with the anxiety is to say, you're anxious about some things

01:19:30.700 that are actually real.

01:19:31.500 Let's figure out solutions that allow you to channel that in the most positive possible

01:19:34.340 direction for your flourishing and the flourishing of your family.

01:19:37.260 What's amazing, there used to be, in the olden days, before modern people ruined

01:19:40.680 everything, there was a simple answer that old Uncle Aristotle gave us, which is this idea

01:19:44.840 of the four causes.

01:19:45.700 We have a formal cause, a material cause, an efficient cause, and a final cause.

01:19:49.960 So the formal, for us, for people, the formal cause is the soul.

01:19:53.600 The material is the body, the matter.

01:19:56.200 The efficient is, well, God makes us, you know.

01:19:58.720 And the final cause is, Aristotle would say, happiness, eudaimonia, human flourishing.

01:20:05.440 We Christians would say, to know God and to love him forever and to serve him here on

01:20:09.020 earth.

01:20:09.180 Modern people say, that's BS, that's a bunch of mumbo-jumbo from a pre-scientific age.

01:20:14.660 Forget about the final cause stuff.

01:20:16.320 Forget about the formal cause.

01:20:17.280 You don't have souls.

01:20:17.960 You don't have any of that.

01:20:18.720 Come on, get out of here.

01:20:20.020 But they don't actually get rid of it.

01:20:22.700 What Aristotle understood is, you have to have an answer to that, and the modern people have

01:20:26.580 an answer to that.

01:20:27.080 They say now, instead of the formal cause being the soul, they say, well, you know,

01:20:30.600 man, it's just like my identity, man.

01:20:32.500 It's my whatever.

01:20:33.040 Authenticity.

01:20:33.120 And for the final cause, what do they say?

01:20:35.360 What the implicit final cause today, for human beings, as they say, is just to feel good.

01:20:40.460 You know, just to have pleasure.

01:20:41.920 Yeah.

01:20:42.220 Physical and muscular.

01:20:42.540 And it makes people miserable.

01:20:43.640 And also, they have forgotten the fact that to do right, to do right, is the path to feeling

01:20:49.000 better about yourself.

01:20:50.380 Yeah.

01:20:50.680 To do, you know, this...

01:20:51.620 Well, ironically, as we've gotten rid of death...

01:20:53.120 People speak as if there were no moral standards.

01:20:54.800 Well, but in order to understand that, because we become such a healthy, physically, general

01:21:00.300 people, and we live so long, ironically, our time horizon has disappeared.

01:21:04.480 And so the idea always, with eudaimonia, or simcha in Hebrew, or any of these words that

01:21:10.360 we're talking about, the idea was, over a long period of time, right, the way that you

01:21:14.020 establish whether you are happy, is you look back at your life, and you look at all the

01:21:17.560 things that you built, and the process of building those, and even the things that you're

01:21:21.460 most miserable about in the moment, may be the things that make you happiest.

01:21:24.160 There have been a bunch of studies where Roy Baumeister does a lot of really good work

01:21:27.080 on this, when he found that there is a wide differential between what people experience

01:21:30.680 as joy and what people experience as meaning.

01:21:32.800 They're not the same thing at all, and that becomes most apparent, obviously, when it comes

01:21:36.580 to children.

01:21:37.020 When it comes to children, what you experience as joy and what you experience as meaning

01:21:39.840 are very often incredibly disparate.

01:21:41.720 Yeah.

01:21:41.820 Because raising kids, as Matt knows even better than I do, because he's got six, but I've

01:21:44.860 got four, that's a lot of kids.

01:21:46.800 And it's not always, you know, roses and butterflies.

01:21:50.300 There are a lot of times when it is rough.

01:21:51.680 It is very difficult.

01:21:52.440 I mean, last night, when you're up in the middle of the night, three to five in the

01:21:54.720 morning, because your baby has too much snot, and you're sucking the snot out of the baby's

01:21:58.240 nose, the baby can breathe.

01:21:59.360 Is that joy?

01:22:00.160 No, but that's meaning.

01:22:01.260 And that meaning is what leads to heaven.

01:22:02.580 But that requires a time horizon.

01:22:03.920 But by the way, you also just corrected something.

01:22:06.900 I misspoke when I said the efficient cause is God.

01:22:09.000 The efficient cause for our creation is our parents, is our family.

01:22:13.020 That's the other thing that they totally deny, and they deny the truths that you're just

01:22:15.800 explaining.

01:22:16.100 There's also a distinction between joy and happiness.

01:22:17.880 I mean, happy, you win the lottery or happy for a day or whatever, you know, and then

01:22:21.260 you become miserable because you have money that you didn't earn.

01:22:24.300 But joy is something you can experience even in grief, even in crisis.

01:22:28.440 And you're right.

01:22:29.000 It's totally connected to meaning.

01:22:30.560 It's totally connected to fulfilling who you are.

01:22:33.460 And it's iterations over time.

01:22:34.620 It has to do with iterations over time.

01:22:35.940 As the time horizon goes away.

01:22:37.540 Well, because in the moment, you're struggling, you're stressed out and all that stuff.

01:22:40.640 But the joy can be there even in those moments because you understand that this is what you're

01:22:45.700 here for, you know?

01:22:46.840 I mean, to suck the snot out of your baby's nose when that's when you, that's why you're

01:22:50.280 here.

01:22:50.820 That is, and that purpose does, I mean, I can say this because I'm now at the end of life.

01:22:55.780 You do look back and say, like, that was great.

01:22:58.500 You know, I'm so glad that happened.

01:23:00.260 Now, speaking of reasons we're here, there's one topic we have got to get to.

01:23:03.380 We talked about one of the Republican debates tonight.

01:23:06.560 But it's about to kick off in 10 minutes or so.

01:23:08.420 Yeah, the or I'm sorry, it's about to kick off in half an hour, but we got to get to

01:23:11.320 the member block.

01:23:12.340 The other Republican debate is going to be the debate or friendly conversation.

01:23:16.000 We'll find out what it is.

01:23:17.200 Oh, we know.

01:23:18.400 Between Trump and Tucker.

01:23:18.800 Well, probably we know.

01:23:20.740 First of all, what do you think?

01:23:22.380 Was it smart for Trump to skip the debate and talk to Tucker or is it going to hurt him?

01:23:26.640 And two, what are your predictions?

01:23:29.020 So, yes, it's very smart for him.

01:23:30.880 Yeah.

01:23:31.760 On a moral level, should he should he go to the debate?

01:23:34.400 Of course.

01:23:35.120 Does that matter?

01:23:35.920 One iota?

01:23:36.460 Of course not.

01:23:36.940 So this is the world in which we now live.

01:23:39.280 So is it smart for him to?

01:23:40.220 Yeah.

01:23:40.480 I mean, why would he show up for a debate where everybody's going to attack him and go after

01:23:43.900 him and find angles against him?

01:23:45.220 And he may fuss around for even a moment.

01:23:47.660 And that'll hurt him when he could just go hang out with Tucker in a pre-taped interview

01:23:50.640 for 45 minutes on Twitter or X or whatever we're calling it these days.

01:23:54.100 So, yeah, I will say this.

01:23:56.320 For all those people who are looking to nominate Trump because they believe that the debates

01:24:00.980 between Joe Biden and Donald Trump will be rock'em, sock'em, robots, entertainment.

01:24:03.840 I mean, I just have some, I have a bad piece of news for you.

01:24:07.400 There will be no debates between Joe Biden and Donald Trump.

01:24:09.720 It is not going to happen.

01:24:11.300 Joe Biden will not debate Donald Trump, not under any circumstances, no way, no how.

01:24:15.680 All he's going to say is, I don't debate people who are under indictment for attempting

01:24:18.980 to steal an election.

01:24:20.000 And the media will shrug.

01:24:21.180 And most of America will go, eh.

01:24:23.000 And then he'll go back to sleep in the basement.

01:24:24.760 There will be no debate.

01:24:25.300 Hold on.

01:24:25.480 So are you implying that Trump is going to be the nominee?

01:24:27.680 I mean, he's the odds on favor to be the nominee.

01:24:29.700 He's the odds on favor.

01:24:30.440 But you'd put your money on it?

01:24:32.380 Of course.

01:24:32.820 I mean, I always put my favorite, my money on the odds on favor.

01:24:35.340 That's why I'm wealthy.

01:24:36.360 I mean, I think.

01:24:38.100 But that's the one, I mean, obviously I agree with the, ultimately the smartest thing is

01:24:42.780 for Trump not to debate.

01:24:44.540 But the one argument that you could make that he should have debated is that Biden will

01:24:50.800 not debate him.

01:24:51.680 And so when Biden says he's not going to debate, now Trump will have no leg to stand on whatsoever

01:24:55.940 and objecting.

01:24:56.720 He'll still object, obviously.

01:24:57.900 And he'll just, you know, he'll have to depend on people having, you know, a memory that doesn't

01:25:02.100 last more than 10 seconds.

01:25:02.940 But it is, that is going to be a problem.

01:25:04.040 When Biden pulls out of the debates and Trump says, well, that's, you have to come face the

01:25:09.000 voters.

01:25:09.600 And then Biden's camp can say, well, what about you?

01:25:11.600 You didn't debate at all in the primaries.

01:25:12.740 That's a problem.

01:25:13.480 I will say that, I mean, I'm a huge Tucker fan.

01:25:16.200 I do wonder if the counter-programming thing here is the best strategy because he's going

01:25:22.320 to be interviewing with Tucker and it'll be on Twitter and you could go anytime and watch

01:25:25.620 it.

01:25:26.260 So it seemed like the smarter move probably would have been for him to go on, do a town

01:25:29.680 hall on CNN.

01:25:31.140 And then you have that direct comparison, counter-programming.

01:25:34.640 And then he could say, I got better ratings than you in that moment.

01:25:38.020 And that would be, well, that's the.

01:25:39.960 So it's also slap at Fox, obviously, because Tucker and Fox are at odds.

01:25:43.140 So speaking, speaking of, of therapists, I knew a therapist once who used to say the

01:25:47.020 most dangerous words in the English language are, but I love him.

01:25:51.080 You know, it's like what masochistic women do.

01:25:53.320 You say, this guy's cheating on you.

01:25:54.580 This guy's drinking too much.

01:25:55.500 This guy doesn't commit to you, but I love him, you know?

01:25:58.060 And I feel that that's the way Trump voters treat Donald Trump.

01:26:01.080 It's obvious that strategically he shouldn't debate.

01:26:03.660 It's obvious that morally he should.

01:26:05.300 And if I'm a voter with any kind of sense of myself and the responsibility of politicians

01:26:11.020 to me, rather than my responsibility to politicians, which is nil, I have no responsibility to politicians.

01:26:16.780 All the responsibility is theirs toward me.

01:26:19.080 You would be looking at him and saying, well, shouldn't you show up and make your case to

01:26:22.620 me?

01:26:23.160 Shouldn't you be talking to me?

01:26:24.640 But it doesn't matter what Trump does.

01:26:26.060 He can blow Georgia.

01:26:27.240 He can lead people to charge into the Capitol building stupidly.

01:26:31.160 He can do all the things that he, in fact, has done.

01:26:33.640 But they love him.

01:26:34.740 Let me ask, because where do you think, I mean, you kind of shrugged at the notion that

01:26:38.220 it was going to be a love fest between Trump and Tucker.

01:26:40.280 Where do you see potential points of conflict?

01:26:42.200 I could see potential points of conflict not in the promises that Trump is making, but in

01:26:47.860 his failures in office.

01:26:49.240 So I could see Trump's failure to finish the wall, perhaps coming up.

01:26:53.280 I could see Trump's...

01:26:54.960 Maybe the VAC stuff?

01:26:56.300 Well...

01:26:56.940 Tucker has made the point that Trump has fundraised millions off the January 6th, the indictments

01:27:05.740 and all that, but hasn't spent a dime to defend anything.

01:27:08.080 Well, I think it really should be obligatory for Tucker to ask him those questions.

01:27:11.080 I'll be very curious to see if Tucker does it.

01:27:12.920 I think he'll...

01:27:13.660 I think he has to bring up Fauci and the VAC stuff.

01:27:16.680 I could see some points of conflict in Tucker trying to make Trump live up to the intellectual

01:27:22.380 promise of Trump, as you would put it, rather than what we saw in practice, especially in

01:27:27.140 the last couple of years.

01:27:27.980 But my only question, as I guess the friendliest to Trump, you know, I still really like the

01:27:33.220 guy, but though I'm not...

01:27:34.320 I have no intention of endorsing in a primary.

01:27:36.320 My question is, morally, should he debate?

01:27:39.740 If it were another year, if it were another candidate, if it were another type of primary,

01:27:43.760 I'd say that the candidates have a responsibility to the voters to go and introduce themselves.

01:27:48.660 The thing with Trump is that we all know him.

01:27:52.160 The fact that this primary is a lot like 1888, the last time we had a former president running

01:27:56.440 for a non-consecutive second term.

01:27:58.640 What on earth could Trump possibly say?

01:28:02.060 What could Trump's rivals possibly say to him that would teach us anything new about

01:28:07.040 Donald Trump?

01:28:07.520 We already know him.

01:28:08.000 That's the wrong question, though, because an election is always a choice between specific

01:28:12.660 people.

01:28:13.240 So we should see Trump in comparison to Ron DeSantis.

01:28:15.740 We should see Trump in comparison to...

01:28:17.780 I also do want...

01:28:18.360 I do want to see him asked by somebody the simple question, you say that the election

01:28:22.900 of 2020 was stolen from you.

01:28:24.420 How do you plan to unsteal the 2024 election?

01:28:26.700 I mean, like...

01:28:27.440 Yeah, I'd like an answer to that.

01:28:28.520 Because honestly, if you love Trump, you should want an answer to that.

01:28:30.680 Yeah.

01:28:31.000 If you want him elected, you should want an answer to that.

01:28:32.420 Like, that's a question for everybody.

01:28:33.500 How about, like, if you're a Republican who wants Biden beat...

01:28:35.760 Yeah.

01:28:36.300 How do you plan on winning an election against Joe Biden in which you're going to spend the

01:28:41.820 entirety of next year in court?

01:28:43.020 The entirety.

01:28:43.540 He's got four cases in the first five months of next year slated for the calendar.

01:28:47.100 And every dime that's going into his campaign fund right now is going directly into his

01:28:51.520 legal defense.

01:28:52.540 Yeah.

01:28:52.680 I mean, another question I'd love to hear asked is, you're worth $10 billion.

01:28:56.100 Why are you using your campaign funds to fund your legal bills?

01:28:58.340 Why don't you just pay your own legal bills?

01:28:59.440 Like, that seems like...

01:29:00.180 Do you think he's worth $10 billion?

01:29:02.060 Don't ask me that question.

01:29:03.740 I mean, I obviously don't think he's worth $10 billion.

01:29:05.860 But he's not going to answer that, right?

01:29:06.880 So, I mean, like, so that means that, like, it seems to me that when people donate money

01:29:10.500 to Donald Trump's campaign, one of the questions they should be asking is, are you using that

01:29:14.900 to target Joe Biden?

01:29:16.380 Like, what?

01:29:17.040 Like, I thought that was the tacit guarantee is that you were going to run against Joe Biden

01:29:21.460 and not against Fannie Willis.

01:29:23.400 Meaning, like, yeah, you have to defeat Fannie Willis.

01:29:25.240 We'd like to see you...

01:29:25.720 Yeah, it's all part of the same...

01:29:26.660 But you have a legal defense fund.

01:29:28.060 By the way, I can show you how much Donald Trump cares about his legal defense fund.

01:29:30.380 His legal defense fund, which was set up, I don't know, a month ago, and got hacked on

01:29:34.440 Friday.

01:29:35.140 As of today, it is now Tuesday.

01:29:36.940 It has not been unhacked by the team Trump, nor have they complained about it.

01:29:41.020 They don't appear to care very deeply about whether that website for his legal defense

01:29:45.720 specifically is up and running because they're directing money from his campaign.

01:29:48.960 People are so identified with Trump that the way they see him, and I think this is fair,

01:29:53.620 by the way, I think he has been treated monstrously unfairly.

01:29:57.220 I think every one of these indictments, except the classified documents one, is completely

01:30:02.580 bogus, and I think the classified documents one is bogus when compared to what they did

01:30:06.660 to Hillary when she was doing the same thing.

01:30:08.780 So I think he's being treated so unfairly, and what people are saying is, this is terrible.

01:30:13.500 I protest.

01:30:14.380 I will stand up with him, and my feeling is, you know, I just want to do what's best for

01:30:18.880 the country.

01:30:19.940 I don't...

01:30:21.220 It's not that I think he can't win.

01:30:23.080 I think he's the least likely person.

01:30:24.240 That's why I would like to see somebody on the debate stage tonight get up and say,

01:30:26.900 listen, Donald Trump should not be in jail.

01:30:29.020 These indictments are bogus.

01:30:30.140 I will personally sign a check to Donald Trump's legal fund right now and take out a check

01:30:32.980 and write it, and then say, and if...

01:30:35.880 And I'm running against Donald Trump because I do not think he's the person who's most likely

01:30:39.100 to be Joe Biden.

01:30:39.900 Because both of those things are simultaneously true.

01:30:41.680 He should not be going to jail for this sort of stuff.

01:30:43.440 It also happens to be true simultaneously that you shouldn't, with a giant red target on

01:30:47.580 your back, then make yourself an even bigger target by doing dumb crap, like not turning

01:30:50.880 back in classified documents for no apparent reason, and then informing Walt Mauda, like shift

01:30:54.720 him around away from your lawyers.

01:30:56.020 That's right.

01:30:56.560 That's unbelievable.

01:30:57.320 That is the best thing that Ron DeSantis could do tonight, would be to come out and...

01:31:03.500 I guess this was sort of leaked in the debate, supposed debate memo, but if he came out and

01:31:07.660 said, this is complete BS, this is...

01:31:09.840 They're crossing the Rubicon.

01:31:11.100 This is a hideous miscarriage of justice, an upending of the political order.

01:31:14.160 I will personally donate to Trump's defense fund, and I think I've got a better shot,

01:31:18.060 and here's why.

01:31:18.560 But aside from purposely, aside from donating money to the defense fund, he has said all

01:31:25.540 that.

01:31:26.100 He has stood up...

01:31:26.560 Yes, but I think in order to, I mean just on a political level, in order to create a

01:31:31.460 defensive wall against the accusation that he's actively, secretly hoping that Trump

01:31:35.080 gets indicted, the actual signing of the check is symbolically important, because then he's

01:31:39.440 saying to people, listen, I'm putting my money where my mouth is, and I'm way less wealthy

01:31:42.720 than Donald Trump.

01:31:43.360 The other thing about crossing the Rubicon, by the way, it's not just Trump getting indicted

01:31:46.720 in Georgia, which seems to me the most egregious of these indictments.

01:31:50.380 You know, it's 18 other people, some of whom are being indicted.

01:31:53.320 Our friend, Jenna Ellis, she's getting indicted for being his lawyer.

01:31:56.240 Okay, I've got to say, why...

01:31:57.600 Okay, this one is on Trump, in the same way that some of the January 6th stuff.

01:32:00.780 Like, where is Trump signing checks for the people who went to bat for him?

01:32:04.780 He's not.

01:32:05.780 Is he not?

01:32:06.300 I find that, like, Jenna Ellis is openly appealing to people for her legal defense fund,

01:32:10.600 which I already figured out.

01:32:10.840 But they're saying, you know, you supported DeSantis, now you're a traitor.

01:32:13.480 That's right, she supports DeSantis.

01:32:14.600 However, I did enjoy her OnlyFans mugshot.

01:32:17.460 Did you see that?

01:32:18.640 I did not.

01:32:20.240 She's such an attractive lady.

01:32:22.300 God bless it, Drew.

01:32:23.380 No, she did.

01:32:24.520 She did it on purpose.

01:32:25.560 She put out this mugshot.

01:32:26.440 She looks great.

01:32:27.820 She sent it to me.

01:32:28.800 I thought, yeah, she should be an OnlyFans.

01:32:30.540 You should charge people to look at your mugshot.

01:32:32.120 That's the legal defense fund.

01:32:33.600 On that note, I suppose we'll talk more about the defendants, the indictments, OnlyFans,

01:32:39.740 and we will take your question.

01:32:40.760 In the member block, the member exclusive portion of our show continues now at dailywire.com.

01:32:46.860 If you are not a member, if you're just one of those freeloading hoi polloi watching now

01:32:50.620 on one of these despicable social networks, head on over.

01:32:54.080 Click the link in the description.

01:32:55.760 Subscribe right now.

01:32:56.860 We will see you there.

01:32:58.700 We will see you there.

The Matt Walsh Show - August 24, 2023

Daily Wire Backstage： Debate Me, Bro.

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