Ep. 214 - The Victimization Flow Chart
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
168.56425
Summary
Why are Democrats so reluctant to condemn anti-Semitism? Well, it all has to do with the left's victimization flowchart, their equation of victimization, and it's all very complicated. Also, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez thrives on false narratives, and she was pushing another one yesterday, a pretty absurd one. And finally, I ll answer some interesting questions from listeners tackling subjects like the draft, atheists, and introversion.
Transcript
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Today on the Matt Walsh Show, why are Democrats reluctant to condemn anti-Semitism?
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Well, it all has to do with the left's victimization flowchart, their equation of victimization.
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And it's all very complicated, but we'll talk about that today, try to sort through it.
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Also, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez thrives on false narratives, and she was pushing another one yesterday, a pretty absurd one.
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But finally, I'll answer some interesting emails from listeners tackling subjects like the draft, atheism, introversion.
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So a lot of interesting stuff to talk about today on the Matt Walsh Show.
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I've been waiting for this moment my whole life, actually.
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Captain Marvel is without question, and I can say this as someone who has not seen it and never will,
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but it is without question the most significant human achievement of the last 2,000 years at least, aside from Black Panther.
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So it's, well, Black Panther and Moonlight, and then it's third.
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It's the third most significant human achievement in 2,000 years, and that's pretty good.
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By the way, my favorite genre of tweet, speaking of Captain Marvel, my favorite genre of tweet is the one where people invent conversations that they had with their woke kids.
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So you see this on Facebook sometimes, too, where someone will make up this conversation that they had with their very enlightened, you know, 5-year-old or 8-year-old.
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I don't know exactly why people do this, but you see it all the time.
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And it's not meant to be, it's hilarious, but it's not meant to be hilarious.
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Like, we're actually supposed to believe that the conversation happened.
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This is a conversation he claims that he had with his 10-year-old son.
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All these Marvel movies, this is the first one with a female lead.
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I wish women didn't have to wait till 1920 to vote.
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I bet if they could vote sooner, we'd have more women superhero leads by now.
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My favorite part of that made-up conversation where a 10-year-old connects Captain Marvel to women's suffrage,
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my favorite thing is that he claims that the 10-year-old actually said SMH, shaking my head.
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Now, my kid's not a 10-year-old, but is that how 10-year-olds speak now?
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So the House yesterday passed a resolution condemning hatred.
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There was a point to it originally, but that point was lost.
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So originally, it was supposed to be a resolution condemning specifically anti-Semitism and even more specifically,
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the anti-Semitism of Ilhan Omar, the freshman Democratic representative who seems to have a real problem with Jews.
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But Democrats or fellow Democrats didn't want to condemn the views of a Muslim woman.
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So instead, the resolution ended up, and this is just such a perfect illustration of the nature of politics these days and especially of the Democrat Party.
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So originally, it was supposed to be a resolution condemning Ilhan Omar's anti-Semitism.
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But then it became a resolution condemning all kinds of hatred.
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It condemns the hatred of, quote, African-Americans, Native Americans, other people of color, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, immigrants, and others.
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They just throw them all in there, you know, throw in the whole, the whole, the whole kit and caboodle.
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In fact, Omar celebrated the resolution pretending that it was a big win for her.
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You know, she came out and said, finally, we passed this resolution condemning hatred because I, the hatred is, is, is, I hate hatred myself.
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When originally it was supposed to be a resolution condemning her specifically.
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And she knows that, but she's trying to turn it into a big win for her.
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Now, there are some people who, who are, who seem to be confused about why the Democrats would be so hesitant
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to simply come out and, and register officially their disapproval of Omar's comments about Jews.
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It seems like, seems like a pretty easy thing to do.
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Especially when, and this is, I think the thing that confuses people is that most Jewish Americans are Democrats.
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So you're, it's, it's, it's not like, um, they would be defending some demographic that isn't part of their constituency,
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But the American Jews are, are in their constituency, yet they won't, they don't want to come out and do it.
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If you understand the victimization flow chart.
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Okay. Now in the past, I've talked about this before.
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In the past, I have called it, and I think I've contributed to some confusion, unfortunately,
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because in the past I've called it the, the victimhood pyramid.
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But I think that terminology is a little bit confusing.
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On the left, they have a flow chart of victimization.
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So not so much of victimhood, but of victimization.
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Um, literally charting the flow of victimization from one group to another.
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Uh, so just, just, just imagine this in your mind.
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And then the victimization flows to white women and then non-white men and then non-white women
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and then gay men and then lesbian women and then transgenders.
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Now the flow of victimization starts with white men, uh, which means that they victimize everyone.
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They cannot be victimized by anyone and they victimize everyone.
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And then on the other hand, and you have, uh, transgenders who are victimized by everyone
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You got white men at the top, the oppression, the persecution, the victimhood, uh, victimization,
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it all flows down and you can never reverse the flow ever.
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Um, it always goes, it's, it is a one way street.
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It can never go the other way, which means that, uh, white, you know, as I said, white
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White women cannot be victimized by nine, by non-white women.
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So in this chart, uh, Jews are counted as white for the purposes of the oppression Olympics
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and for the left's, uh, victimhood equations, they're going to basically count Jews as white,
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which means that if you're a Jewish man, then you get lumped in with a white man.
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So you're in that category and it's just, you can't, according to the left's way of looking
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at things, you, you can't be a victim, uh, of, of, of bigotry.
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Ilhan Omar as a non-white woman is several steps away on the flow chart from, especially
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a Jewish man, uh, from the left's point of view.
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And so she can't really be guilty of bigotry against Jews.
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And I'm not making this up, but this is not me just being flippant.
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And well, it is also me being flipped, but, but it's not just that this is, this is really
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what the left, this is what they teach in college.
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If you're spending it, you know, a hundred thousand dollars to send your kid to college.
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Give me the $100,000 and I'll tell you a kid about this.
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Let me, I can brainwash your kid into leftist, um, into leftist orthodoxy.
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If you want, if you give me a hundred thousand, I would do that for you.
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So only now if, when they teach it in college, they don't teach it as a victimization flow chart.
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They would talk about it in terms of privilege.
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So what they would say is that white men are the most privileged.
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And each person, if you, each person with more privilege cannot be victimized by someone with
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less this, yeah, this is literally what they teach.
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They can be victims of, you know, of, in, in, in other senses, they can be the victim
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Um, but they cannot be, uh, it's impossible to be racist against them.
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Um, so now this gets a little bit more complicated because you might point out that Muslims are
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So doesn't that put them at the end of the victim flow chart as the victimiest victims
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Um, instead of, as I, and I put transgenders at the, at, at the end of it, but wouldn't
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it actually be Muslims because it seems like no matter, you know, they don't, they're never
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condemned for, um, for homophobia, even though you see, especially in Muslim countries, not
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just homophobia, but you see violent, um, anti-gay, uh, bigotry.
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So, well, this becomes kind of an intense debate.
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This, this is a subject of intense debate among victimologists on the left.
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And I think that there's a, there's a difference of opinion.
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Uh, so I can't really, I can't decree on that, except I will say that I think, I think the
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reluctance to condemn Muslims, uh, especially when it comes to the anti-gay stuff, that that's
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more about the left's determination to keep the homophobia claims focused on white Christians.
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It's, it's not that they categorically refuse to condemn homophobia, uh, in the Muslim world.
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It's just more that if they're going to talk about homophobia, they want to talk about the
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If white Christians didn't exist, uh, if all white Christians were, were to evaporate, which
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I'm sure would be a, um, a reason for, for, for great celebration among many on the left,
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if that were to happen, then I think maybe they would, maybe, maybe then they would find
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some time to talk about all the gays being thrown off roofs and, uh, Saudi Arabia and
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And the chart, the chart can change by the way.
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Now white men will always be on that end of it, incapable of being victimized by anyone,
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but the other positions can move around and shift.
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And so there's, there's a little bit of jockeying.
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There's a competition within, within these groups to be more victimized than the other.
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It's very fascinating to watch that soap opera play out.
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And so you see how from, from this, um, there are many forms of actual oppression and many
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Jews are arguably, uh, the most oppressed group in history, period.
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Yet that oppression doesn't really register on the left.
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Um, the Irish, uh, I mean, are, are also a very historically oppressed group.
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There aren't many groups that have had a harder time of it than the Irish, but again, it doesn't
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They don't really count that because their skin color is, uh, just way too light.
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There, there are, in fact, there are, there are whole historical events and eras that have
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to be wiped from the history books because they so contradict the victimization flow chart.
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The Barbary slave trade, for instance, where 200, for 200 years, um, hundreds of thousands of white
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Europeans were kidnapped, bought and sold as slaves by Africans.
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And that whole 200 year slice of history has been erased.
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You're not going to find it in the history books because it is such a complete contradiction of the
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They have to, they have nothing they can say about it.
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And, uh, that's basically how intersectionality works.
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And it requires you to make all of these omissions and to censor this and to forget about that.
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And it's why it's best not to adopt that mentality.
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And, um, instead to just, instead of having this, uh, complicated ideology of victimhood to
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This is kind of a comparatively small and petty thing, but I think it's, it's worth noting.
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Um, it's, it's pettiness is what makes it so revealing and therefore worth noting.
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There was a, there was something that happened yesterday that I thought was a very revealing
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So the, the far left, there's a website called raw story.
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And it, it, it, they very often publish misleading, dishonest articles about conservatives.
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Um, and, uh, yesterday they published one of their typically dishonest hit pieces and they
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were claiming that a conservative is boycotting, boycotting girl scout cookies because Alexandria
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And that's the claim that they make right in the headline.
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The headline is conservative calls for cookie boycott because AOC used to be a girl scout.
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Now the conservative is a columnist for a world net daily.
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If you actually take a brief look at her piece that is being referred to here on, uh, on world
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net daily, it, you see that the raw story headline and the article is a rather predictable
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In truth, um, what the, what the author is saying is that she's not going to be buying
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She never uses the word boycott or calls for everybody to stop by.
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She just says she's not going to buy the cookies because of the overall political and ideological
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shift that the girl scouts have undergone over the past several years.
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She, she accuses the organization correctly of pushing God and country and those values
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to the backseat in favor of left-wing causes and ideas.
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And she cites, for example, the girl scouts, well-known affiliation with Planned Parenthood.
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Um, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is, is mentioned, uh, only because the girl scouts celebrated
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So this author uses that as an example of, of, uh, the girl scouts political bias.
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And then at one point she says, you know, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez was a girl scout and, uh, she,
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Cortez represents sort of the ideological shift of the girl scouts.
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And so if you don't want your daughter to end up like her and have her values, then don't
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Um, but she never calls for, she never calls for a boycott at all.
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And she certainly doesn't call for a boy, for a boycott because Cortez used to be a girl
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So it's a dishonest headline in a leftist online rag.
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And, uh, certainly not the first, won't be the last in and of itself, not a big deal.
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If it weren't for the fact that Cortez herself seized on that headline, that lie, and she
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amplified it, which is what she does all the time.
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So Cortez posted a screenshot of Raw Story's headline on Twitter with her own snappy little
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caption where, you know, she mocks conservatives for boycotting, uh, Girl Scout cookies for such
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And her followers, of course, jumped on the bandwagon.
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They were heaping scorn on all the stupid conservatives who are boycotting the Girl Scouts
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Meanwhile, in realityville, no conservative is boycotting anything for that reason.
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Nobody is saying we're going to boycott this or that organization because Alexandria Ocasio
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Um, but notice the effort on Cortez's part, because the most natural thing would be if you
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see an article online and there's something about it that you want to share, what do you
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But notice how instead she takes a screenshot of the article's headline and then crops it
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down, you know, takes that little bit of effort and posts the screenshot to Twitter.
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Why did she do that rather than just posting the article?
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Because she knows that the headline is dishonest.
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And if you're able to actually click on the headline and go read the article, you're going to quickly
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discover that it's dishonest and she doesn't want anyone to do that.
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So instead, she just put the screenshot there, knowing that most people aren't going to take
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the effort to actually go to Google and investigate.
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They're just going to take it at its, at its word.
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Um, like I said, it's a smetty, uh, a, a small petty thing, um, or smetty is what I just
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Uh, it is a small petty thing, but this is the small pettiness that Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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She's obsessed with the idea that conservatives are, are, are constantly attacking her for
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Uh, she's constantly looking for opportunities to make herself into the victim of unfair,
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And in, in almost every case, not every case, but in almost every case, the attacks are either
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absurdly exaggerated or invented out of whole cloth, but she's always looking for this to
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Uh, and this is another case where she's, she's promoting this lie to try to make conservatives
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look stupid and also to, to, uh, continue the narrative that everyone's talking about her
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So to put it more directly, Cortez is a lying propagandist.
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Uh, she's not the first of that type to walk the halls of Congress.
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She won't be the last, but her lies and propaganda tend to be more damaging than usual because of
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her platform and because she so successfully plays the kind of, uh, fun, innocent, idealist,
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unfairly maligned by petty right-wing lunatics card.
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That's the card that she's always playing and she plays it well and dishonestly.
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And in the process, all she's doing is creating more division, sowing more suspicion and contempt
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into the culture, into a culture that has more than enough of those things already.
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And I found it to be, yeah, I just found it to be contemptible.
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And the fact that it's such a small thing is what makes it even more contemptible.
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It's like, you couldn't have really, you had to latch onto that.
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You saw your name in a headline and it was attached to this.
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You couldn't, you couldn't have moved on from that.
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Answering emails a little bit earlier, because there are a few good ones that I want to have
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a chance to, to get into Matt wall show at gmail.com, Matt wall show at gmail.com.
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He says, Matt, I listened to your show from a few weeks ago, a few days ago, when a listener
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asked about your opinion about women being drafted.
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However, it struck a chord with me when you said, I'm paraphrasing that since he had lived
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through it and is an expert, his opinion is what matters, not mine.
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Why does that same response not ring true for kids who've lived through, say, say, for example,
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a school shooting and want to abolish the second amendment because they're now experts since
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I should be asking myself the same question because these kids are not experts.
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This is actually one of my, one of my many pet peeves is when people act like personal
00:22:10.860
experience automatically confers special knowledge or wisdom and makes them an authority on a certain
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Um, experience does not always confer knowledge or, or, or, you know, wisdom.
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Um, now in the case of the draft, yeah, that was an email from someone who fought on the front
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lines was a veteran and was of the opinion of the same opinion of, of almost every veteran
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I've spoke, I've, I've ever spoken to about, about this issue.
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His opinion was we should be drafting women and we shouldn't have women, um, on the front
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Now, in that case, I said his, his experience does make him an authority because I think
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being on the front lines of combat does give you, um, special relevant knowledge when it
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You're going, you're going to know more about modern combat, how it works, uh, the practical
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considerations, the psychological effects, et cetera.
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And, uh, and so if a bunch of people who've all had that experience are all saying, no,
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No, we shouldn't have women on the front lines of combat.
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Then I think that carries a lot of weight because yeah, if you've, that's one of those things
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where if you've done it, then you're, you are going to know a thing or two about it and
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you're probably going to know more than people who've never been there.
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Their word is not the first, last, and only word that anyone can speak.
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Everyone else has a right to contribute to the discussion and you could have plenty of
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valuable things to contribute to that discussion, even if you've never been to war.
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But I think this is a case where experience, because of the nature of the experience does
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involve knowledge, uh, creates, confers knowledge, right?
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On the other hand, being in the proximity of a school shooting does not confer knowledge
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about the second amendment, uh, or about constitutional law or about guns or about anything really,
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except the emotional impact and psychological, personal trauma of being involved in something
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And, and that's, uh, so that is a perspective that's, uh, it's, it's a valuable perspective,
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but, uh, but it's not a perspective that really has anything to do with gun rights.
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Um, it's a non sequitur to say, it's a non sequitur to say, well, their school was shut up.
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Therefore, we should listen to them about the second amendment.
00:24:41.560
Um, no, being in war requires knowledge about war.
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Being involved in a school shooting does not require any knowledge about anything.
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Um, tragically in much the same way that, uh, getting cancer doesn't make you a doctor.
00:25:00.760
Um, but as I said, this is something people do a lot where they try to shut down a conversation
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by saying, oh yeah, well, I've been through this.
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And often I would say most of the time their personal experience doesn't really make their
00:25:23.420
Sometimes it makes it, sometimes it actually can arguably make it in some ways less credible.
00:25:30.060
Like for example, when, when, when we've had debates about ADHD, um, and I make certain
00:25:37.700
philosophical points about the human condition, the sort of flawed methodology involved in calling
00:25:44.040
Um, I make points about neuroscience and so on.
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I'm not an expert in any of those things, but I'm making points about them.
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I can study them and think about them just the same as anyone can.
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And, um, and I always get people, uh, in fact, the conversation always, every time, always
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devolves into people shouting at me that, well, my son has ADHD and you don't know what you're
00:26:10.300
What does that have to do with the objective realities we're discussing?
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That it doesn't make you right just because your son has ADHD does not make you an expert.
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And in fact, it could make you, it, it could cloud your ability to judge this objectively
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because if you, if your kid has it and you've already got them on drugs, well, then now you've
00:26:35.960
got a, an incentive to, to justify the decision you've already made.
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There doesn't mean that we shouldn't listen to your perspective.
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I'm just saying that there's also a clear bias that you have now as well.
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So whatever, whatever knowledge your experience might confer, I think it's sort of canceled
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out by the bias that you have in trying to justify decisions you've already made.
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Um, so, you know, another one is talking about abortion and someone says, well, you've never
00:27:07.040
It's simply not that that has nothing to do with the objective issues we're discussing.
00:27:11.980
So bringing up your person, this is why I don't like it is that when people do it in
00:27:15.980
many cases, um, what it really amounts to nothing more than emotional blackmail.
00:27:22.980
It's, it is not about enhancing the discussion or advancing the discussion.
00:27:26.520
It's about shutting it down and using their own personal issues as a kind of sledgehammer
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to bludgeon everyone with and to say, you're not allowed to talk about this.
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And I really, I, I, I just, I have come so much to, uh, dislike that strategy.
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And I, I, I, again, there are exceptions, but I, I, I just, I can't stand it.
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Anytime there are people that you can't, anytime you try to have a conversation about anything,
00:28:01.520
there's always someone who ruins it by getting into the, getting into some emotional, personal
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story that it doesn't, it doesn't advance the discussion.
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All it means is that now the rest of us can't be honest about our opinions anymore because
00:28:14.200
you have emotionally blackmailed us and said that, well, just so you know, guys, if you're
00:28:18.840
honest about your opinions, you're going to hurt my feelings because here's my personal
00:28:28.800
From Connor, he says, Matt, I think, uh, hi Matt.
00:28:32.000
I think in your show yesterday, you confused atheism with agnosticism.
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You said that atheism doesn't require faith because atheism is just the lack of faith.
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And this is a common misunderstanding that people have.
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Um, I, and I'm in the weird position now of, it's almost like I'm defending atheism or something.
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What I'm doing is I'm trying to define our terms.
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I think it's important to define our terms, to know what we're dealing with.
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Um, so, um, most people think that agnosticism is, as you said, I don't know.
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And if you listen, um, to pretty much any sophisticated, thoughtful, intelligent atheist,
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they will absolutely not say, I know God doesn't exist.
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Um, they might say in regards to a particular, uh, theological system or, or particular God,
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But, again, these are the thoughtful, sophisticated, I'm not talking about the atheists in a comment
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I'm talking about the, you know, the ones, the Sam Harris's of the world.
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Um, they are, so they might say it about, uh, about, about a particular theological system.
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Um, they're not going to say it about the kind of general concept of God, to include the deistic concept
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of a sort of, uh, first mover who's got everything going and is now somewhere not paying attention, right?
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So, um, now they may, they may think that or feel that way, that they know that God doesn't exist,
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but that's not the way they formulate their argument.
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They're going to speak in terms of probabilities.
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And so they're going to say something like, based on current evidence, it seems improbable
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that God exists, or something along those lines.
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Now, again, I, I think they're probably being more cautious in their wording of the argument
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than they actually are in their convictions inside their heads.
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But we can only engage with the arguments as they're presented, not as we think the presenter
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really means them, which is, which is the point that I made about people do that to us,
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as theists, atheists do that to us all the time, where they, um, they act like the claim
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we're making is that God is a bearded man in the sky, um, who is sitting up there with
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his big staff or whatever on a, on a, on a literal, literal throne in the clouds looking
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And so that's the argument that they often engage with, but that's, that's, that's not
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the argument that a sophisticated, intelligent, thoughtful Christian or theist makes.
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There may be some more immature Christians who do think of God in those terms, but as
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an atheist, your responsibility is to engage with the sophisticated arguments that your opponents
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are actually making, not the argument that you think they're thinking, right?
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So I, I, I think on both sides, that's what we have to do.
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Eighth, um, agnosticism has that root, uh, gnosis or, or gnostic, right?
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So think of the ancient gnostics, the Christian gnostics who believe that spiritual liberation
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was attained through divine knowledge, not through atonement, but through knowledge.
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So, um, and there's still strands of, uh, of gnosticism around today.
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I mean, uh, uh, uh, I have a friend who's a Kabbalist and, you know, he, I talked to
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But, and, uh, and I, I've talked to him about Kabbalism many times and, uh, I've always
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Um, but as I've studied more about gnosticism, I've realized that, oh, okay, he's an, he's a
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Anyway, so it's, so, uh, gnosticism is all about knowledge, right?
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A true agnostic believes not only that God, God's existence is unknown, but this is what
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a real agnostic, okay, believes that God's existence is unknowable.
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So in that way, agnosticism is actually more dogmatic than atheism in a sense.
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An atheist, on the other hand, is a non-theist.
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That is the literal definition of the term, a non-theist, someone who is not atheist.
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An atheist, um, doesn't believe in theism, is not a theist.
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There is no positive truth claim necessarily involved in atheism.
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Now, every atheism does make positive truth claims, but just the, the generic form of atheism
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Um, so an atheist is, is, is seeking to shift the burden of proof back to the theist saying,
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you simply haven't proven your, your assertion.
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The common, uh, thing that you hear from atheists all the time is they'll say that, uh, well,
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you know, referring to atheism, it's like, it's like calling someone a non-stamp collector.
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You know, it's like defining someone by a hobby they don't have.
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And, you know, I think that that's, that's a reductive and oversimplifying on their part.
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But again, just the absolute generic form of atheism, that is kind of what it is.
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It's kind of an epistemological discussion, uh, ultimately.
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So you look at it like this, take a non-theological claim.
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Um, say that I, say that I claimed that the universe is exactly 100 trillion light years across.
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The whole universe, let's say I said, is exactly 100 trillion light years across.
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The atheist response to that claim is to say, I don't believe your assertion because
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Maybe you're right, but I don't, I, there's no reason to believe it because you don't have
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The agnostic response is to say, nobody can ever know exactly how big the universe is.
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Uh, and I have nothing else to say about it other than that.
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Now, in that particular example of the size of the universe, I, I'm more of the agnostic.
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I, I don't, I don't think we could ever know how big the universe really is.
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Um, when it comes to God, I'm a theist because I think there is good evidence, good evidentiary
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reasoning for believing, but more importantly, I also believe because, and this is where faith
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I believe because of the internal witness of the Holy Spirit, which is faith, um, and
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which has, we must admit, no evidentiary value to anyone outside of myself.
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So the fact that I have this internal conviction that I believe is granted from the Holy Spirit,
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I experience it within myself, which doesn't mean that it, that it, that it has no, um,
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I believe that it does, but it isn't, it's internal.
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Um, in such, in much the same way that my internal conviction about the love I have for my wife
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is extremely evidentiary for me, but not for anyone else.
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So for anyone else, uh, if I tell them that, uh, I love my wife and they ask for proof for evidence,
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well, I cannot put them inside my head so that they, or inside my heart, my, my soul,
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so that they can experience the love that I have for my wife, which is an experience more than an emotion.
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I could show them that, okay, I've done this and that for my wife, but you know, I could,
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I could show her the things that I could show this person, the things that I've done to prove it.
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And so that is some good evidence that I love my wife, but it doesn't tell the whole story.
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Um, because the whole story of love is not external.
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And so I would be diminishing and cheapening love if I claimed that I could completely and totally prove it
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through external things, because I would be removing the entire internal experience of love.
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Um, and I think God who is love is like that in my view.
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God, which I find to be compelling, uh, quite compelling.
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But then there is also the internal experience, which is faith.
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Um, and which is not something that we should be embarrassed by.
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This thing where Christians do where they say, oh, atheists have more faith than us.
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If you think there's something wrong with that, then I, then I, it seems to me that
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Um, so I, I, you know, I don't, I don't understand.
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I don't understand why many Christians are dead set on this idea that atheists have to
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Unless you think that there's something wrong with faith.
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Um, which in that case, why are you a Christian?
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Um, finally from Maria says, hi, Matt, love the show.
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I've been wanting to write to you about a show you did months ago about introversion.
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It was such a huge help to me as an introvert myself.
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I was fascinated to find out that you are also an introvert because you're so outspoken.
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And I know you go around giving speeches as well.
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My question is, how did you overcome your introversion in order to do what you do for a living?
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And I don't think of it as something that needs to be overcome.
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Um, I think it's awesome that you're an introvert and I don't think you need to look at it as
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something that you have to get past or overcome or whatever.
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It's not like there's something wrong with you.
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It's, there isn't something that needs to be fixed or changed because of this.
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So introversion, as I said, in that show, I did, it's not the same thing as shyness.
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You can, you can be a non shy introvert, just like you could be a shy extrovert.
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Um, my wife is kind of like, my wife is a huge, my wife is a quintessential extrovert in every
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sense, but she also has a certain shyness to her, which is, which is, which would, which
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would shock anyone who, who, uh, anyone who doesn't know her very well will be shocked
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by that to, to find out that she has a certain shyness to her, but she does in that she can
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be apprehensive sometimes in a social situation.
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But then once she gets into it, you know, she's a social butterfly and she's talking and
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she, and she loves it and she, and she just enjoys the experience.
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Uh, but there is that little bit of sometimes apprehension leading into the situation.
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Um, so, you know, I, I, I, I'm, I'm not shy at all.
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I don't, I'm, I'm not, I, I, uh, not only can I get up in front of a crowd of people and
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And in fact, the bigger the crowd is, the more I enjoy it.
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I've, I've spoken in front of a group of a thousand people.
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I've spoken in front of a group of 10 people and I really prefer the thousand, the 1000, the
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smaller groups make me less comfortable and the least comfortable, comfortable at all
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of all for me is when I have to have an individual small talk conversation.
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I would much prefer to be up in front of everybody and talking.
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That is because yeah, shyness is, you don't want to get on the stage.
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Being an introvert simply means that you feel energized by, um, not so much by small talk
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and social interaction, but by time alone, um, time to yourself, you enjoy being in your
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She does like, you know, time to herself, but a lot of times she'll say, uh, you know,
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But then a lot of times she'll spend that time, uh, on the phone talking to her friend
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She'll call up one of her, one of her girlfriends and talk on the phone.
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And now to me, that's completely, I can't even, it's mind boggling to me.
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Um, as an introvert, it's draining to be in a social situation.
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It zaps your energy and it's not where you feel the most at home and the most comfortable.
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So that's, there's nothing wrong with that at all.
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The world needs, uh, I mean, we can't all be talking 24 seven, right?
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So the world needs, I think the world needs both types.
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Um, and just to make that point, I, I, I talk to people all the time.
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It seems like it's a, it's a very common, uh, setup apparently to have introverts and extroverts
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And because then there's, you know, opposite attract and all that, but there's also, uh,
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kind of the, uh, you know, you kind of get both, you get both, you get both bases sort
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And I think it shows that we need that in society as well, even though I think society
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is skewed to be more, um, accepting and encouraging of extroverts, which means that we are victims.
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I think we belong to, we should be on the victimhood flow chart somewhere.
00:43:44.280
I'm Michael Knowles, host of the Michael Knowles show.
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