Ep. 245 - The Insanity Of Student Loan Forgiveness
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Summary
Elizabeth Warren has come in with her Santa sack of toys and she is now offering college loan forgiveness for almost all Americans. We ll talk about why her plan is not only financially unsound but also morally atrocious. And speaking of atrocious, Bernie Sanders wants felons to vote in prison. He wants people including the Boston bomber and convicted rapists to vote. And we ll discuss why that doesn t work and shouldn t work.
Transcript
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Today on the Matt Walsh Show, Elizabeth Warren has come in with her Santa sack of toys and she
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is now offering college loan forgiveness for almost all Americans. We will talk about why
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her plan is not only financially unsound but also morally atrocious. And speaking of atrocious,
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Bernie Sanders wants felons to vote in prison. He wants people including the Boston bomber and
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convicted rapists in prison to vote and we'll discuss why that doesn't work and shouldn't work.
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Welcome to the show, everybody. Thanks for being here. Thanks for listening. We're going to talk
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about several things today, including student loan forgiveness. We'll get into that in just a moment
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because Elizabeth Sanders, Elizabeth Bernie Sanders unveiled her student loan debt relief plan and it
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is it's something to behold. So we'll get into that in just one second. But first,
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stamps.com, enter Walsh and you get all those amazing deals. All right. Elizabeth Warren is
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drowning in the polls. Not a lot of excitement around her campaign. Even after, I mean, she's
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tried a lot of things. Now she's live blogging the Game of Thrones and that didn't work. So
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not working out. Now she's going with the tried and true democratic strategy of, well, if I can't
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convince you to vote for me through conventional means, then I will just buy your vote. And that's
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what she's doing now. If she can't get young folks to vote for her by, by drinking brews on,
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on Instagram videos or by watching HBO, then she'll bribe them instead. And so that's where
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Elizabeth Warren's plan for student debt relief, which she announced yesterday has, um, uh, comes
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from. Now I want to talk a little bit about her plan specifically, and then I want to discuss
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why the whole idea of student loan forgiveness in general or student loan relief, we're calling
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it now is terrible. Uh, we'll do that, but, uh, let's start with her plan reading now from an
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article on CNN. It says, uh, Warren's proposal of forgiving outstanding student debt goes a
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significant step further than previous, um, democratic policy plans. Warren's plan would offer
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debt relief based on income households that make less than a hundred thousand a year would get
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$50,000 in loan cancellation with the amount of relief getting gradually smaller as income level
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goes up with households that make more than $250,000, not eligible for any debt relief at all.
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Altogether would write, it would wipe out all student debt, uh, including both federal and private
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loans for more than 75% of Americans without standing loans. Um, the universal free college portion of
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Warren's plan makes public college free for everyone, regardless of their finances. Uh,
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while Sanders, Bernie Sanders, his 2015 proposal offered free tuition for everyone, a 2017 bill
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back, uh, scaled back eligibility based on income, uh, blah, blah, blah. Okay. So by this plan,
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you could be, by this plan, you could be getting, you could be making 20 grand, uh, 200, you could be
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making $200,000 a year, uh, uh, in income as an engineer or a doctor or something, and you could still
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get your loans at least significantly discounted. Now here's the question, of course, how are we going
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to pay for this new bundle of, of goodies? Uh, go back to CNN for that. It says the campaign estimates
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that the plan would cost $1.25 trillion over 10 years. Um, the revenue from Warren's wealth tax
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proposal, a 2% tax on wealth above 50 million and a 3% tax on wealth above a billion would pay for her
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newest proposal according to her campaign. So, okay. So she claims, um, we can pay for this whole
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thing by taking money from the evil wealthy folks and redistributing it. Now there is of course,
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no reason at all to believe that this responsibility would ultimately land just on the wealthy. These
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kinds of proposals never remain as limited in practice as they were on paper. And this proposal
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is not even that limited on paper in the first place. Not to mention you have all the familiar
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problems of, of further encouraging job creators to leave the country, especially now that you're
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advertising that you're going to force them to pick up the tab for all of the student debt in the
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country. Um, and, uh, and you have the problem that these, these kinds of taxes tend to trickle down
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as, um, as the cost gets passed on to the working class. Um, so that's just the beginning of our
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problems, right? There are many other problems and I want to go through them one by one or as many as I
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can name in a few minutes. Number one, from a financial perspective, you are talking about
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doing something that will make inflation massively worse, which feeds the problem that you're
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supposedly trying to solve. So let me, here's a few lines from an editorial this morning on the
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national review, which talks about the inflation aspects of the aspect of this. Um, the says, uh,
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the inflation of college costs is a genuine concern and one that is of especially intense
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interest to the federal government, which thanks to the Obama administration made itself into a
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monopolist in the student loan business. But Senator Warren here proposes to put out a fire with
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gasoline, i.e. to mitigate the effects of inflation by dumping money on the problem. In inflation adjusted
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terms, government spending on higher education has never been higher. Um, it has climbed by nearly
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$2,000 per student since 2001. As the, as the foundation for economic education points out,
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Pell grant spending alone rose 72% in the few short years from 2008 to 2013 tuition and other expenses
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have risen right along with the spending. Um, and then, you know, it goes on from there. So, um,
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if you want to get control over tuition inflation, uh, as, as this, as the point, the national
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review is making is you got to turn off the, you got to turn off the spigot. You can't, you can't,
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you're making the problem worse, uh, by just dumping money onto a problem that has a lot to
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do with inflation. So that's the financial part of it. Second, uh, there are a lot of people, a lot
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of working class people who chose not to go to college, who accepted a life of lower income,
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um, because they couldn't afford it, you know, and they knew they couldn't afford it and they didn't
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want to take on the debt. And that, that, that seemed like a prudent and wise decision that a
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lot of people in the working class made, I can't afford it. I'm not going to buy it. So what you're
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now saying to them is that their prudent and wise decision to not buy something they couldn't afford
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was actually foolish. They are suckers yet again, uh, because they should have just went ahead and
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bought it because they wouldn't have to pay for it anyway. They could have gone and not paid is what
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you're telling them. They made that sacrifice for nothing. Student loan forgiveness is a plan
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that helps the upper class and screws the middle and lower classes where most non-college grads
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reside. Uh, so just think about it. This is a plan to bail out people who are, you know, sometimes
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making 150, $180,000 a year while those making 60 or 50 or $40,000 a year are still going to be stuck
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with all of their debts, house, car, credit card, whatever. So it's, it's completely absurd. This
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is basically, uh, this is, you know, student loan forgiveness is essentially welfare for the upper
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class because that's where most college grads are. They're going to be middle, you know, upper middle
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class to upper class. Um, whereas the millions of people who did go to college oftentimes are lower
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middle to lower class. And so this is a plan that helps those people on the upper echelon while doing
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nothing for the people who are below them. Third problem. Uh, what about all the people who went to
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college and paid their debts? Okay. What about the person who has just paid the last dime on their
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$100,000 debt and made all those sacrifices along the way and had to work very hard to pay it off and
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they did it. And now they're going to turn around and see that everyone else's debt is just wiped clean
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anyway. Is that not an injustice? Is that not grossly unfair? Are you going to refund them?
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I mean, how can you possibly say, Oh, think about the sacrifices that these, there are many people
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are going to be in this situation who are just on the verge of paying off their loans. Think about all
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the sacrifices they had to make. Think about how their life has been affected by this. And now you're
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going to just wipe everyone else's clean after they, do they get a refund is the question.
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Um, how is it, you know, equality under the law is supposed to be guaranteed. How is it equality
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under the law to give this massive unearned bonus to a certain segment of the population while everyone
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else is out of luck? Fourth problem. Even putting aside the financially disastrous effects of a plan like
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this and putting aside how it screws the working class and it screws people who are responsible for
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their debts in the first place, we're still left with a very simple fact. Nobody forces anyone to
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take on these loans. That's a choice that you make. If you have student debt, you have it because you
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agreed to it. You signed on the dotted line. Now you can say, Oh, I was 19. I didn't know. Okay.
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But you still made that choice. You made a legal agreement. Everything else aside, it is immoral
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for a third party, such as the government or Elizabeth Warren to come in and say, Oh, nevermind.
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You don't have to fulfill your obligations and keep your promises. Just, just the very idea that
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Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders or any of these Democrats, the very idea that they would say, um,
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Oh, we're going to, I'm going to forgive that. Look, it's not for you to forgive. What do you mean?
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You're going to forgive it. You didn't grant the loan. It's not up to you to forgive it. And it's
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certainly not up to, to, to some other private citizen to, um, to have to come in and pay off the
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loan out of forgiveness. If you took the loan out, this is your responsibility. Um, and so that's really,
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you see that that's what you'd have to explain. And this is my challenge. Okay. To any college grads
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who are arguing for loan forgiveness, this is my challenge to you. Or if you're listening right
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now, this is what I want you to do. Present a morally and logically sound argument explaining
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why some other citizen should be forced by the state to pay your debt that you assumed by choice
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for a product that you bought and will keep. That's what you have to explain. And, and, and,
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and maybe phrase it in exactly these terms. Um, I believe someone else should be forced to pay my
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loans because, and then fill in the blank. Uh, I, I don't, I don't, I'm not sure that you can fill in
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the blank with it. And, and, and the point is, you know, we talk about student loan, uh, relief and
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forgiveness. And we talk about it in these sorts of abstract, ambiguous terms. No, what we're
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talking about. And if you are advocating for student loan forgiveness, what you are saying
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is that someone else, some other citizen should have to pay your loans. Um, that's what you're
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saying. And so you should at least phrase it that way and make your argument. Here's another way of,
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of, of looking at it. Uh, you're in debt. Okay. And it sucks. I know it's not fun. Um, maybe it's
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even unfair. Who knows? Uh, I don't know. You did agree to it, but, uh, but whatever the point is
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you're in debt. The debt has to be paid. Okay. Someone has to pay it. The debt you agreed to
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while purchasing the product you want and will keep that has to be paid. So it's, it can't just be
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erased. The only question is who should pay it? You or someone else? Should it, should it be the
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person who took on the debt, who pays it or the person who did not take on the debt? And so what
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you have to do is come up with an argument to explain why, uh, yeah, this debt has to be paid,
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but it shouldn't be by me. It should be by that guy over there. Fifth thing, whatever possible
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argument could be made, uh, whatever you might be able to put in the blanks there to say, uh, well,
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someone else should pay my loans because, um, it would clearly apply just as much to any other form
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of debt, mortgage, car, credit card. So if you're struggling with student loan debt and it's making
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your life difficult, um, but I didn't go to college and, but I'm struggling to pay my mortgage
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where, where, where's my get out of jail free car? Well, why are you special? I mean, why do you get
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to get this? And what about the rest of us who are stuck with debt and don't say, Oh, well, you can
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file for bank bankruptcy. Okay. Bankruptcy ain't free. That's not the same thing. You don't have to
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under these plans. You're not going to have to file for bankruptcy. You just get, you just get,
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you get, you just get to walk away from it. Like it never happened. Well, what about me?
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Why don't I get that? And see what I, when I make this argument, say, well, what about me?
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I want something too, right? You can't say, Oh, that's selfish. That's so well, you're the one
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being selfish. I mean, if this is the way it's going to go now, where you, where the government
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just, you know, you've, you're, you're in a tough spot. So the government comes in with someone else's
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money and bails you out. Then, then it's perfect. It is perfectly valid for me to say, you know what?
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I want it too. Okay. I got this debt. I got that debt. I'm struggling with this. I want all that
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taken care of. Maybe you should have to pay for it. You know, if someone else has to pay your
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loans and maybe you should have to pay mine, you know what? I want you to pay my mortgage. That's
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what you should have to do because I don't want to pay it. It's hard for me. I could, I could,
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I could, I could pull out the violin and I could sing you a whole song, a whole sad song about how
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difficult it is to pay my mortgage. And so you should have to pay it. That's what I think. Yeah,
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I shouldn't have to, you should have to. Well, I mean, it was predatory. I mean,
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they never should have sold me this house in the first place. They should have known I can't afford
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it. Right. Sixth thing here, this whole problem can be solved long-term with a very simple societal
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change. We don't need loan forgiveness or free college or anything else. There's a very simple
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change that could be made. If people would just wait a couple of years before going to college.
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Okay. That, that, that's, that's really, I think that could almost solve all these problems.
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This idea. And I, you know, I, I just, I go on about this all the time because it's so obvious to me
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that number one, as I've said many times, you know, not everyone has to go to college and, and,
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and, uh, there are way more people going to college than should be.
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And, but that doesn't mean that, that everyone shouldn't go. Like if, if you are going to get
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into a line of work where a four year degree is actually necessary. And those kinds of jobs do
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exist. Obviously, if you want to be a doctor, lawyer, engineer, architect, you know, I could go on
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and on, um, those kinds of jobs exist. And so if you're going to get a job like that, if that's the
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plan, then yeah, going and getting a four year degree makes sense. And you should do that. And
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the good news there, there is that a lot of those are high paying jobs. So you'll be able to pay off
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the debt. Um, but if you don't know what you want to do with your life, if you have no idea what your
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skills are, what your interests are, what your abilities are, um, what your plan is five years
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down the road, I mean, if you have no clue, and that is the, the situation that most high school
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graduates are in at the age of 18 years old, then of course you shouldn't go right to college.
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There's no reason to, there is no good argument at all that anyone can make to explain why an 18 year
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old kid who doesn't know what he wants to do with his life should go right to college. What,
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what would be, explain this to me. What would be the downside of an 18 year old kid who doesn't
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know what he wants to do going and getting a job somewhere for a few years first, you can still go
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when you're 20. It's not a race. It'll be fine. It's not a competition. Um, I mean, there is a
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competition for jobs out there, but it's not, it's not a, it's not like we, you have to get to the
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finish line before the other person. So the point is, if there was a simple societal change that
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is perfectly feasible, that what the message we send the kids is, if you know exactly what you
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want to do with your life and you know, you need the four year degree, um, then maybe you could think
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about going there right after high school. But even in that case, I mean, even if you want to be a
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doctor, I don't see any downside to going and getting a job for a few years, saving up some money,
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getting some experience and then going. But at least in that case, I could see the argument maybe
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for going right there, but everybody else just go get a job. Okay. It doesn't matter what you're
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doing. Like go, go, even if you're willing to work at McDonald's or you're working at Walmart
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or, uh, you know, you're moving across the country for a few years, getting a job somewhere,
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whatever you're doing, just do something, get a job. In the meantime, you're making money,
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you're saving, uh, you're putting yourself in a, in a, in a better position to afford college.
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And most importantly, you're figuring yourself out. You're figuring out what you actually are
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good at and what you want to do. Because there is a huge difference between an 18 year old kid
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who's never had a job, uh, and is just getting out of high school and a 20 or 21 year old adult
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who's been in the workforce for a few years. There's a huge difference in maturity and in,
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in, in self-understanding in, in, in so many areas. So I don't, I mean, until someone can explain
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what's wrong with what I'm saying here, until someone can explain why we need every 18 year old
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to just go right to college without any interim in between until someone can explain that to me,
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that I'm going to say that my solution is the solution. And that's what we should do.
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And, uh, if you do that, then I think a lot of these problems start to go away there.
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Ultimately, you're going to have fewer people going to college because there's a, there are a lot of
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people who, if they take that interim period, they're going to discover in the meantime that,
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Oh, you know what? I don't really need to go to college. I, I, I figured out that I want to be
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a mechanic or I want to, uh, I want to get it to be electrician or, you know, something like that.
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Um, so there are going to be a lot of people don't end up going and the people who do go
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are going to be a little bit more mature and, uh, and, and wise about it. And, um, I think
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colleges are going to have to compete a little more for, to get students in, in the doors,
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because it's not going to be an automatic kind of conveyor belt system where you, the kids go
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right from high school to college and that's going to drive costs down. I just think this is the
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solution. Um, and we, so we don't need to do any of this other stuff. All right. Um,
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Bernie Sanders wants the Boston marathon bomber and a convicted rapists and other assorted
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ne'er-do-wells in jail to vote. Uh, watch this.
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You have said that you believe that people with felony records should be allowed to vote while in
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prison. Does this mean that you would support enfranchising people like the Boston marathon
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bomber, a convicted terrorist and murderer? Do you think that those convicted of sexual assault
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should have the opportunity to vote for politicians who could have a direct impact on women's rights?
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Okay. Thank you for the question. And, uh, and let me just say this,
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what our campaign is about and what I believe is creating a vibrant democracy today, as you may
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know, we have one of the lowest voter turnouts of any major country on earth. I want to see us have
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one of the highest voter turnouts. And by the way, what we're seeing is more young people getting
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involved in the political process, but not enough. And in my view, if young people voted at the same
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percentage that older people voted in this country, we would transform this nation. But to get to your
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point, we live in a moment where cowardly Republican governors are trying to suppress the vote. And in
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fact, right here, as you may know, in New Hampshire, the legislature and the governor are working hard to
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make it more difficult for young people to vote. And to me, that is an incredibly undemocratic,
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un-American process. And I say to those people, by the way, if you don't have the guts to participate
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in free and fair elections, you should get another job and get out of politics. All right. So we got to
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so here is, and to answer your question, as it happens in my own state of Vermont,
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from the very first days of our state's history, what our constitution says is that everybody can vote.
00:23:51.880
That is true. So people in jail can vote. Now, here is my view. If somebody commits a serious crime,
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sexual assault, murder, they're going to be punished. They may be in jail for 10 years, 20 years, 50 years,
00:24:07.180
their whole lives. That's what happens when you commit a serious crime. But I think the right to vote
00:24:13.940
is inherent to our democracy. Yes, even for terrible people. Because once you start chipping away,
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and you say, well, that guy committed a terrible crime, not going to let him vote, or that person
00:24:26.760
did that, not going to let that person vote, you're running down a slippery slope. So I believe that
00:24:32.960
people who commit crimes, they pay the price. When they got out of jail, I believe they certainly
00:24:37.540
should have the right to vote. But I do believe that even if they are in jail, they're paying their
00:24:41.520
price to society. But that should not take away their inherent American right to participate in our
00:24:48.300
democracy. Okay, a few things here. First of all, Democrats are super excited about voter turnout
00:24:57.560
among certain demographics, right? You don't see them down in the trailer parks in Alabama trying to
00:25:04.800
rustle up some votes. And I'm willing to bet the trailer parks probably have a low voter turnout also.
00:25:11.080
But you don't see that. They're not down there, not trying to get those folks out. Why is that?
00:25:14.640
Well, because those people are less likely to vote Democrat. So that's what this is about. Sanders
00:25:18.780
pretends to care about participation in our democracy, but he only wants certain people to
00:25:24.400
participate. So he's no better than the, quote, cowardly Republican governors that he's railing
00:25:29.660
against. Second, I'm doing everything in list format today, if you hadn't noticed. Participating in our
00:25:36.280
democracy by voting is not an inherent right. It is not a God-given right. It is not something that we
00:25:45.780
necessarily want everyone to do. It is not something that our country benefits from. Our country does not
00:25:53.200
automatically become more vibrant just because everyone is voting. Voting should be seen as much
00:25:59.940
more of a responsibility than a right. And in fact, in general, I think that we should be, if we're,
00:26:08.060
we should be using the, the R word responsibility more often than we use the R word rights. We should
00:26:16.580
be talking about our responsibilities more than our rights. And every right is, is accompanied
00:26:23.400
by a responsibility. And I think we should start looking at it more on those terms. So when you
00:26:30.940
frame it that way, um, instead of saying, oh, we all have, we all have a right to vote. No, we all
00:26:37.420
voting is a responsibility. And if it's a responsibility, that means that you should only do it
00:26:45.040
if you are a contributing, informed, knowledgeable member of society. Uh,
00:26:54.420
those are the people who we want voting. And that is how our democracy and our country becomes more
00:27:02.140
vibrant when you have contributing, informed, knowledgeable members of society voting.
00:27:07.360
But when you've got just a bunch of ignorant, when you've got a bunch of ignoramuses who, who you,
00:27:12.360
who you manage to, um, to shuffle into the, to herd into the polls on, on election day,
00:27:19.240
like cattle, and they just go in there and start pressing buttons randomly, or, you know,
00:27:25.060
based on the letter next to the name or based on whose name is prettier or, or, or based on whatever
00:27:29.680
poster they happen to see when they were stumbling half drunk into the polls that morning. Um,
00:27:35.100
that does not make our democracy more vibrant. That doesn't, that doesn't help our system at all.
00:27:40.600
All you're doing in that case is you are, you are canceling out the informed votes with all,
00:27:48.420
with all of these ignorant people. And that doesn't help us. So really what we want in this
00:27:55.900
country are fewer voters, not more. There should be fewer, whatever the voter turnout is, it should be
00:28:02.620
like half of that or a 10th of that. And, and that's how, that is how we make a, uh, a more powerful
00:28:10.940
and vibrant democracy. Um, but the whole idea is as far as prisoners go, uh, the whole idea is absurd
00:28:20.180
because they're in prison. Okay. We, we already take away their fundamental right to like walk outside
00:28:26.900
and look at the clouds, right? I mean, all of their rights really, or most of them are suspended in
00:28:32.120
prison. Your first amendment right is curtailed severely. Uh, you can't say whatever you want.
00:28:36.800
Uh, your second amendment right obviously is gone. You're not carrying guns. Uh, your fourth amendment
00:28:43.180
is basically gone. Prisoners have some basic rights, very basic, but by necessity and also for punitive
00:28:49.260
reasons, uh, many of their essential rights are either gone or severely limited. And we already know
00:28:54.740
that that's, that's the nature of prison. So voting is just one of them. It's not even the most important
00:28:59.540
one. Um, so this idea that there's some extra injustice and not allowing them to vote. I mean,
00:29:06.720
we keep them locked in a cage, right? For 20 hours a day. Like, what do you, I mean, and you're worried
00:29:13.200
that they're not voting. It seems to me that if we're saying, oh, well they, they have an inherent
00:29:18.140
right to vote. Well then I guess they have an inherent right not to be locked in the cage in the first place
00:29:22.280
too. Well then of course, at that point, now we have no more prisoner prisons and we have anarchy.
00:29:27.360
So it doesn't make any sense. Um, and, and the last thing is I agree actually with, uh,
00:29:35.100
with those who say that felons who get out of prison should be able to vote. Now I do think it's an
00:29:40.700
injustice that someone who's paid their debt to society and, um, you know, has gone through the
00:29:47.640
punishment and has reformed themselves. Uh, the idea that they can never vote again. Like if you,
00:29:53.180
if you commit a, you know, let's say you're someone, uh, robs a liquor store when they're 19
00:29:58.920
years old and they go to prison, they do their time. Uh, they get out, they get a job, they start
00:30:04.020
a family and now they're 50 years old. It's, it's been over 30 years since they committed the crime.
00:30:09.800
They have long since paid their debts to society. And at the age of 50, they still can't vote. Um,
00:30:16.340
that doesn't make any sense to me. And so, yeah, I think those people should be able to vote. And in
00:30:21.720
fact, those people could be very valuable voters. I mean, these are people who've, they've been in
00:30:26.160
the system. They've seen the government from sort of a different angle than a lot of us have. Uh,
00:30:31.320
they've got an experience. They've had, they have a sort of life experience that I think makes their
00:30:37.640
perspective interesting and valuable. Um, and so, yeah, I think those people should,
00:30:43.300
but the, those who are in prison are still paying their, are, they're still in the process of paying
00:30:49.860
their debt to society. Uh, and what's more, and this is the important fact, they are not contributing
00:30:57.580
members of society. Okay. These are people who have, because of their own actions, we have had to
00:31:04.420
segregate them from society and keep them locked away and take care of them, you know, pay for them
00:31:10.020
to pay to house them and feed them and everything else pay for medical care, everything else. Uh,
00:31:15.040
so these are in prison. I mean, these people are, are strains on society. They're not contributing.
00:31:21.640
And that should be that, that is the, uh, that should be the litmus test is it should be contributing
00:31:32.080
members of society. And that's, that is how our system was originally set up. Now, obviously back
00:31:38.500
in the, you know, in the early part of, of, uh, of our country's existence when, well, you could only
00:31:43.280
vote if you were a landowner. Well, the problem there is that you couldn't be a landowner if you
00:31:47.040
were a woman or if you were a black person. Uh, so obviously that was unjust because you're
00:31:51.500
disenfranchising people then based on gender and race. Clearly we can't do that. But these days,
00:31:56.980
um, that's, that's not the case anymore. It doesn't matter your gender, your race, you can be
00:32:02.040
legally and in every other sense, a contributing member of society. And so that's how I think we
00:32:06.440
should decide who can vote. Um, let's go to, uh, yeah, we'll do emails now. Uh, Matt wall show at
00:32:13.460
gmail.com. Matt wall show at gmail.com says, uh, this is from Carrie says, Matt, seriously,
00:32:21.760
what's up with the bee thing? I don't understand it. So Carrie is referring, I guess, to my flurry
00:32:27.460
of posts this weekend, talking about the arrival of my bees who, uh, I'm going to pick up a, an order
00:32:32.880
of bees, uh, today, actually, I'm starting a beehive. I'm becoming a beekeeper, as I mentioned
00:32:38.220
before. And, uh, so I was, I was, you know, I was, I think I tweeted about it this weekend, just,
00:32:43.940
you know, out of excitement, uh, to begin my, my journey as a beekeeper. The funny thing is that
00:32:48.420
my wife, you know, she agreed to this arrangement. I mean, she's known for like two years and I wanted
00:32:53.120
to start being a beekeeper. And so now it's finally happening. Then I was talking to her this weekend
00:32:57.240
and say, Oh, you know, I'm going to pick up the bees this week. And, um, and she said, Oh, so it's,
00:33:01.920
uh, so, you know, how many bees is it going to be? It's going to be like 200, 200, 300 bees. Right.
00:33:05.440
And I said, no, the original package will be about 10,000 bees. And then it will,
00:33:10.520
the hive will grow to 70 or 80,000 bees. And then I'll probably get more hives. Um, and she was
00:33:17.540
not pleased to learn that fact, but I mean, it's too late now it's happening. We're, we're going to
00:33:24.500
have 70,000 bees in our backyard, um, with our kids running around and playing. It's just, it is
00:33:29.720
happening. And then she said to me, she said, uh, she said, well, but, but my mom is allergic to bees
00:33:34.780
and now she's not going to be able to come over. And I said, Oh yeah, I hadn't thought of that.
00:33:41.640
I mean, that's not like that was the whole point here. Um, now, why do I want to be a beekeeper?
00:33:46.360
Well, uh, because for, for one thing, why not carry? I mean, why not be a beekeeper? Okay. Give
00:33:52.040
me one good reason to not be a beekeeper. And then maybe I won't be. And, uh, and also I think that it's,
00:33:57.520
uh, well, secondly, I think bees are fascinating creatures. And third, I think that, that I, I,
00:34:03.300
I'm, I believe that it's important for a man to have hobbies. Um, and if that hobby is one that
00:34:10.400
scares your mother-in-law away, well, that's just a win-win folks. That's all that is. All right.
00:34:15.740
This is from Steven says, Hey Matt, I've been a reader even before you started at the blaze. So
00:34:19.540
I'm happy to see your success so far and hope God continues to bless you as you continue to share
00:34:23.260
your viewpoint regarding speaking in tongues. I am a hundred percent on board with you. I've been in
00:34:28.240
multiple churches where speaking in tongues was widely accepted in most churches where this is
00:34:32.420
accepted. Speaking in tongues is equated with praying in the spirit. Um, despite absolutely
00:34:37.420
ignoring Paul's admonition that if someone speaks in tongues, there should be an interpreter.
00:34:41.580
I've seen multiple people spew out nonsense gibberish on a regular basis. In my opinion,
00:34:45.980
it's a show purely for self-aggrandizement, aggrandizement to put themselves on a pedestal
00:34:50.940
as being the holiest of the congregation. Every time that, that tongues are mentioned in the New
00:34:55.380
Testament, it is of the effect of preaching the word to someone that does not know of Jesus,
00:34:59.740
not just a bizarre prayer language. Paul also said in Philippians, um, do nothing from selfish
00:35:05.860
ambition or conceit, but in humility, count others more significant than yourselves. This idea of
00:35:10.780
speaking in tongues, as I've seen it in multiple churches does nothing more than elevate certain
00:35:14.940
people as being more holy than others. Uh, so in every sense, the way that speaking in tongues is
00:35:20.640
practiced in the vast majority of churches directly contradicts what the Bible tells us.
00:35:24.240
I believe that God can cause us to speak in tongues, to spread his word. But the way I see
00:35:29.900
it in our modern churches is, is it is nothing short of blasphemy. Sorry to write such a long
00:35:34.360
screed, but having seen this in practice in so many places, I feel very strongly about it. And, uh,
00:35:39.260
I will let that stand on its own because you put it very well. So thank you for that,
00:35:44.440
Stephen. This is from redacted great theocratic dictator, Matt. I am a recent seminary grad with
00:35:54.320
quite a bit of debt to pay off. You said you don't want to hear a recent grad with debt to advocate
00:35:59.420
for it because they're biased. So I will offer the complete opposite. I find this student loan
00:36:04.520
forgiveness by Warren to be absurd, though I stand to gain a lot financially from it. It is complete
00:36:09.440
exploitation of those that gave me a loan. And it is immoral to expect the American people's
00:36:14.280
tax dollars to pay for something I contractually agreed to pay. Long story short, I do not want
00:36:19.100
my student loans forgiven. I have my pride and my dignity. Uh, that is a wonderful attitude.
00:36:26.800
I, I, it grieves me that your attitude is so rare, right? I mean, but that is, that's an American
00:36:36.580
attitude, right? That's, that's, that's how Americans should be that I don't want you to, I, I would,
00:36:43.920
I would turn it down if you offered it. I don't want you to just pay, take care of my responsibilities
00:36:48.140
for me. They are mine. And it, it means something like dignity and just being a self-sufficient
00:36:54.220
person and, and manning up and, you know, taking care of your, of your own business. I mean, that,
00:36:59.920
that means something. I want to do that. I don't want you to take that away from me. I don't,
00:37:06.360
I, and I especially don't want you to do it by taking from someone else.
00:37:10.160
I don't want some millionaire to be my sugar daddy and come in and, and, and do that. I'm a man,
00:37:17.300
you know, I've, I've got dignity. Um, that appears to be your attitude. And, uh, I think it's,
00:37:23.060
I think it's great. I just wish that you weren't such a rarity. I mean, I wish that you weren't one
00:37:28.640
out of a hundred. I wish that you were, you know, 90 out of a hundred had that attitude. And I think
00:37:33.360
there was a time in this country when most people had a similar attitude to yours. Um,
00:37:39.420
but these days people, they just, they, they have no, they certainly have no dignity. They have no
00:37:44.620
desire to be self-sufficient. Um, they just are looking for the easiest way. And so for them,
00:37:52.200
there's just, there's a total disconnect because it's like, they can't even, they can't offer any
00:38:02.100
arguments. They don't even understand why they need to offer arguments because for them, they say,
00:38:07.860
well, what do you mean? I mean, I have these loans. It's hard to pay them off. I don't like them.
00:38:13.120
Uh, so someone else should pay them. Of course they should. And if you ask them, well, why should
00:38:21.140
they pay? Well, because it's, it's, cause it's hard for me and I don't want to have to do it.
00:38:25.240
And that's their whole argument. It's not even an argument. It's, it's, it's the argument of a
00:38:29.100
two-year-old, but you hear this from grown adults. Um, all right, let's see from, uh, from Sam says,
00:38:40.880
hello, Matt, I recently joined a church. This is a first and a big first for me before this. I was
00:38:47.080
religious, but not in a good way. So I'll just leave that there. I have no education on church
00:38:52.420
or the teaching and have never read the Bible, honestly. So do bear with me if, if it, um, if
00:38:57.300
anything I say sounds wrong, since it probably is, and I'm new as new can be, but learning my fiance
00:39:03.240
got me to go and join. I'm 21. I never thought I would do this. So I've been going for something
00:39:07.520
like six weeks now. I'm enjoying it. And the lead pastor, I feel is good. My issue is thinking
00:39:12.460
about everything I'm being told here. They talk a lot about feeling the Holy spirit and hearing
00:39:16.540
Jesus and the word of God in one's life. Does feeling this or the ability to recognize what
00:39:21.300
God slash Jesus slash the Holy spirit is trying to tell me or lead me to get easier or more obvious.
00:39:27.240
I feel like I'm being told about a brand new color on the color wheel and people will point to it
00:39:31.320
and saying that it is the color, but I'm having a hard time seeing this color. Also talking about
00:39:36.180
how God has given me a purpose and a gift to fulfill that purpose. Um, how do you know the
00:39:41.300
purpose given and how do I know the gift slash talent given to fulfill that promise? If I find
00:39:46.120
the purpose, uh, I will chase it and build it. I remember something about three people going to
00:39:50.060
Jesus with gifts to showing that they had taken the gifts and created more gifts and the last one
00:39:55.180
didn't. And he was slothful and wicked. So how do I figure all this out? Any help with any of this
00:40:00.020
is greatly appreciated. Uh, well, great question, Sam, and congratulations on making a positive change in your
00:40:05.760
life. It takes guts to make changes. I mean, it takes guts to make changes, to, to realize that
00:40:11.000
changes need to be made and to, uh, and humility to realize that, okay, this is a, this is something
00:40:17.940
that I don't have in my life. I want to have it. And so I'm going to take that step. So that's,
00:40:22.020
that's awesome. Um, we've got two emails in a row here from people with, with an attitude that I wish
00:40:30.040
everyone had in our country would be so much better if everyone, if everyone was like Sam and, uh,
00:40:34.580
in the last email, we'd be in a much better country. Now as to your question, it is an
00:40:39.020
excellent question and an important one. I think it brings up an interesting point.
00:40:42.680
You talk about feeling the Holy spirit and hearing God in your life. And you're basically saying,
00:40:47.140
okay, well, when does that happen? Cause I'm going to church. I don't really feel it. I don't hear it.
00:40:51.280
Um, the comparison you made about a new color on the color wheel is very apt and insightful.
00:40:56.340
So I think this is part of the problem with the kinds of the kind of like charismatic movement in
00:41:05.060
the church in America and modern times. And I don't know if this is a charismatic church you're
00:41:08.660
going through, but there is a charismatic vein that you can find in almost any church in America,
00:41:14.480
um, where there is this incredible emphasis that is put on feeling so much so that you begin to think
00:41:24.080
that religion really is supposed to be like a drug, like opium, like Karl Marx famously said that
00:41:29.360
religion is the opiate of the masses. And, uh, and you start to feel defective. If you don't have that
00:41:35.080
feeling, if you don't get that high, that rush, um, if your experience is more dry, more sometimes
00:41:40.660
lonely, sometimes confused, even, even desolate, uh, at times. And what I would say is don't worry about
00:41:47.720
that. Um, don't worry about the feelings because they'll come, they'll go, they'll come back again.
00:41:52.960
It's not about that. Feelings are notoriously difficult to conjure up. And once you do,
00:42:00.040
they're notoriously difficult to retain and hold onto, and you can't slips out of your hands like,
00:42:04.960
like, like water. Right. Um, and the people who claim to always be moved by the spirit, uh,
00:42:12.700
to always be overcome with these feelings of, of joy and peace and so on. Maybe some of them are,
00:42:18.000
I mean, maybe some of them really that that's how it is, but there are also people who are moved.
00:42:22.220
I think they, they think that they're moved by the spirit or by God, but, um, but often I think
00:42:28.380
they're moved by the experience or by the music or, or just by the, uh, the, the sort of power of
00:42:35.360
suggestion from the people around them. Um, it's not necessarily the Holy spirit all the time. It
00:42:41.060
could be, you know, uh, but, but it's not always. Um, and there are people who are just more susceptible
00:42:49.180
to getting caught up in the moment in an environment, in a crowd where everyone is sort of feeling a
00:42:53.840
certain way. And there are people who are more likely to, to kind of share that feeling because
00:42:58.300
they're in the crowd. And it's, it's not necessarily because they're more spiritually in
00:43:02.540
tune than you are. It's just, they're a different kind of person. And especially if you're a more kind
00:43:07.460
of independently minded person, uh, a little bit less susceptible to suggestion and all of that,
00:43:12.680
then you're not going to be as caught up. Uh, and that's okay. I was talking to someone recently
00:43:19.780
who told me that, uh, they are overcome with a feeling of peace and comfort every time they go
00:43:27.840
to church. And I said, every time, really, every time you go to church, your whole life,
00:43:33.060
you're overcome with peace and comfort. And they said, yeah, every single time. And, and, uh,
00:43:38.320
now I very rarely feel that when I go to church, I'll be honest, sometimes on rare occasion,
00:43:43.840
but most of the time I am not overcome by peace and comfort. Um, and I'm not saying that this person
00:43:50.140
is lying. I believe that they really are. And I think that's great. That's a grace that was given
00:43:53.660
to them. It's good for them. Wonderful for me though. It's a struggle. And I think for most people it is.
00:43:59.420
And that's also okay. Um, and it's, it's not because I'm spiritually defective or, or you are,
00:44:04.140
we're just different sorts of people. I think the point here is that there is too much emphasis put
00:44:09.240
on the emotional experience. Uh, and faith is portrayed too much as a sort of joy ride,
00:44:15.900
a source of constant comfort or whatever. And so it ends up with this kind of gloss to it,
00:44:22.000
this air of unreality. Um, when the reality is for many Christians that faith is going to
00:44:29.280
often be a struggle and it's going to sometimes be painful and it's going to sometimes be dry
00:44:34.280
and difficult and a lot of other things. And the church doesn't want to deal with that much of the
00:44:41.480
time. We don't want to confront it. We don't want to talk about it. We don't want to look at it or
00:44:45.400
acknowledge it. And that makes it all the harder for those of us who are not blessed with that
00:44:50.920
charismatic gene. Uh, so I just, that's something to, to, to know going in. And once you know it,
00:44:59.160
put it to the side, don't worry about it. And if you're at church, it's good that you're there,
00:45:03.960
you're doing what you should be doing. Um, what I would recommend is don't, don't stand there or sit
00:45:09.660
there trying to get yourself to feel a certain way. Don't worry about that. Just be there, listen to the,
00:45:15.300
to the word that's being spoken. And, um, and that will come and go and, and don't, don't focus on
00:45:21.840
too much as for figuring out your purpose. Well, the good news is you're 21. You've got plenty of
00:45:25.660
time to do that. Uh, the fact that you're thinking about it and that you're searching is a great start.
00:45:30.620
It's, it already sets you apart from a lot of people who are in your position at your age, um,
00:45:37.280
who aren't even thinking about it or worrying about what they're going to do or what their ultimate
00:45:42.320
purpose is. So the fact that you want to know and are searching is good. And I would say,
00:45:50.420
so that would be my answers right now. It seems to me knowing almost nothing about you.
00:45:56.040
It seems to me that you're right now, your purpose is to seek and to search. And so that's what you're
00:46:02.300
doing and do that. Uh, and I think over time the picture will get clearer for you. So, all right.
00:46:09.040
Thanks for that. Thanks for that email. Uh, we will leave it there. Um, thanks for listening
00:46:28.560
I'm Michael Knowles, host of the Michael Knowles show. Democrats kick off a major 2020 town hall by
00:46:33.960
endorsing voting rights for terrorists and rapists. We examine the novel electoral strategy.