The Matt Walsh Show - Friendly Fire： Iran Ceasefire, INDIGNIDAD Amnesty & A.I. Supermodel Gone Rogue

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00:00:30.000 Welcome, gentlemen and lady, coming on later, to Friendly Fire. 0.87

00:00:41.540 We didn't know if we were going to have this show today because the world was supposed to end last night in nuclear holocaust, 0.94

00:00:48.680 and there was going to be a genocide perpetrated against the Persian people,

00:00:54.440 and Trump, you know, I supported him for three elections, but this is too far.

00:00:59.480 The left was freaking out about it, but there was a hysterical part of the right that was freaking out, and now it's fine.

00:01:05.700 We might have a ceasefire. The Iran war might be over. The Strait of Hormuz might be open.

00:01:12.060 We might actually be taking tax with the Iranians on the Strait of Hormuz, and in any case, there's a lot of dignity in establishing peace. 0.97

00:01:21.520 There's also a lot of dignity in Congress, where a Republican Congress lady thinks it's a really good idea to give amnesty to basically all the illegal aliens in the country. 0.94

00:01:31.200 That, threats from AI that could take us all down.

00:01:34.920 There's so much to get to.

00:01:36.860 But before we get to any of it, I want you to buy stuff from me.

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00:02:02.920 It's in honor of Easter weekend's incredibly daring mission to rescue the American Air Force officer from behind Iranian lines.

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00:02:37.000 We have a special guest also coming on.

00:02:38.980 Wait a minute, wait a minute. Are you, just excuse me, are you really not going to plug my book

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00:02:48.180 Wait, hold on, you write books?

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00:03:06.240 Yes, you can go, if you want a book without words, get mine.

00:03:09.220 If you want a book with Ben's signature, get his.

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00:03:13.400 an actual award-winning writer.

00:03:15.620 The actual words. The real words.

00:03:17.940 We also met. We have you on the show today.

00:03:22.360 Yeah. I mean, it's my favorite show to do,

00:03:24.200 so how could I not be?

00:03:26.760 You wouldn't miss it.

00:03:28.860 Yeah, no, and this is where I find out

00:03:30.500 about a new merch drop, which is great.

00:03:32.560 Terrorist Tears. I mean,

00:03:34.840 whose idea was that?

00:03:36.800 Do we know whose idea that was?

00:03:38.000 I think it was Donald Rumsfeld's idea.

00:03:40.540 I know he's dead,

00:03:41.740 but I think we got through some kind of advanced CIA technology.

00:03:45.980 He came up with the new Terrorist Tears Tumblr.

00:03:49.220 It is the kind of idea you would get from a dead man.

00:03:51.340 I cannot think of, if you're looking for merchandise that's just pure, like, boomer bait,

00:03:56.580 pure Fox News boomer bait merchandise, Terrorist Tears Tumblr.

00:04:02.420 I mean, yeah.

00:04:04.340 Beat Mondale.

00:04:04.860 That's good.

00:04:05.300 That's good.

00:04:05.700 We've got our new Beat Mondale Tumblr coming out next week, too, so that one will be great.

00:04:10.020 be sure to, that will be full price though. That won't be 50% off. We are back in the Middle East

00:04:15.480 though, sort of, maybe, maybe not. There was this amazing daring rescue mission where the CIA was

00:04:21.640 using crazy advanced technology and Sutterfuge to pull this guy out. He went down on Good Friday,

00:04:26.920 he hid in a crevice in a mountain, and then he was rescued on Easter Sunday. It's amazing. It's

00:04:32.960 wonderful. Thank God. What's more interesting to me, did you guys see the New York Times piece

00:04:37.240 on the internal deliberations about whether or not to go to war with Iran in the White House?

00:04:42.780 The Maggie Haberman piece, yeah?

00:04:44.580 Yeah, Haberman. So according to it, the guy arguing most vociferously against the strikes

00:04:50.840 was the vice president, J.D. Vance, who, as far as I can tell, has exactly my position

00:04:56.380 on the Iran war. He said, look, I don't think this is a good idea. I don't think it's going to work

00:05:02.620 in terms of actual regime change. I think we're being oversold here.

00:05:06.140 Looks like the chairman of the Joint Chiefs agreed with that.

00:05:08.260 Looks like Marco Rubio agreed with that.

00:05:09.960 People are trying to drive divisions between Vance and Rubio.

00:05:13.120 Looks like they were totally on the same page here.

00:05:15.420 Susie Wiles, the White House chief of staff, was on board, chairman of the Joint Chiefs.

00:05:18.800 According to the reporting, Pete Hegseth was more in favor of the strikes.

00:05:21.960 In any case, though, we were supposed to get nuclear disaster last night.

00:05:25.840 And instead, I guess we have a ceasefire.

00:05:29.440 We have none of us know anything about actual news reporting.

00:05:32.220 So we have Cabot Phillips, who does our actual hard news show.

00:05:36.140 Wired in Live. He's joining us too. Do we have a ceasefire?

00:05:40.940 Yes, of course. Donald Trump says we have a ceasefire, so there's definitely a ceasefire,

00:05:45.040 Michael. I interviewed a former Defense Department liaison last night, and he said,

00:05:51.480 look, given what the Iranians are reportedly demanding, and given all the complications

00:05:56.260 with Israel, who by all accounts wants this war to keep going, as we saw this morning with their 0.61

00:06:01.100 continued vomiting of Lebanon, given the Iranian desire to keep control of the strait.

00:06:07.540 He said, you're going to have fighting again within four days. And at this rate, it looks like

00:06:12.820 we'd be lucky to make it four more hours with this thing holding, given all of the latest news coming

00:06:17.960 out in the last hour. And Michael, I remember the morning that the war first broke out. You were

00:06:23.300 here on my lovely new set, which is still not as good as your set, but a beautiful new set here

00:06:29.320 for Wired In Live.

00:06:30.180 Everyone go tune in.

00:06:31.300 And you scoffed a bit.

00:06:33.180 We had a very nice young lady 1.00

00:06:34.580 come on the show.

00:06:35.180 I'm not going to say her name,

00:06:36.600 but she was in a big support

00:06:38.560 of this conflict

00:06:39.240 the morning it launched

00:06:40.100 and said,

00:06:40.660 there really are no potential downsides

00:06:42.900 to this war.

00:06:43.540 Do you remember that?

00:06:44.040 She said,

00:06:44.360 there are no potential downsides.

00:06:46.240 And you interjected and said,

00:06:48.120 well, I think there could be

00:06:50.060 some potential downsides.

00:06:50.900 I can think of a few. 0.98

00:06:52.060 Yeah, and that woman too, 0.99

00:06:53.180 I mean, she was a nice lady, 1.00

00:06:54.020 but she said,

00:06:54.700 this war is so important.

00:06:56.160 It's so great that America's involved 1.00

00:06:57.520 because it's such a great day

00:06:58.760 for the Persian people and the Persians have been waiting for this for so long and how wonderful for

00:07:03.500 the Iranian people. And I said, well, you know, respectfully, I like Persians and stuff, but why

00:07:09.260 am I supposed to care about that? I'm an American. Why is this? This is the best case you can make 1.00

00:07:14.640 for the war. So according to the reporting here, Bibi Netanyahu flies to the White House. They have

00:07:20.300 this high level meeting. Vance at the time was in Azerbaijan wrapping up that trip. But even with

00:07:25.940 the vice president out, everyone was saying, look, the Israelis are overselling this. I think

00:07:30.440 the CIA director, John Ratcliffe, said that. Same thing with the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of

00:07:34.900 Staff. And you're really probably not going to get regime change. I was always so skeptical

00:07:39.500 of this idea that the Iranians were going to just rise up and take over their government 1.00

00:07:44.220 because, you know, all we ever see is these hot Persian women smoking cigarettes, ripping off 1.00

00:07:50.740 their hijabs. I said, I don't think that's reflective, actually, of most of the Persian 1.00

00:07:54.440 people. And so obviously we're not getting regime change. The White House hasn't even really pushed

00:07:58.080 that for the last four and a half weeks or so. But by the end of this conflict, the question is,

00:08:03.180 is the straight opening? Does Israel want to go along with the ceasefire? Apparently not.

00:08:09.800 Will Trump do it anyway? Will Trump force it through? And what will we have gotten out of it?

00:08:16.160 You know, I just, I want to say just one thing that Israel, you know, as I keep saying every

00:08:20.900 time we do this show, Israel and the U.S. have many areas on the Venn diagram where our interests

00:08:27.160 are aligned. But Israel also has some areas that are quite serious that have nothing to do with us,

00:08:34.280 like the fact that they're surrounded by enemies. Their country is the size of a matchstick and

00:08:38.360 they're surrounded by enemies on either side. Anyone who's ever been to Israel, wherever you

00:08:42.640 stand, you can see people who want to kill you. I mean, it is quite remarkable. It is a remarkable 1.00

00:08:47.140 way to live. So the fact that they're still fighting and they're fighting especially with

00:08:51.520 Lebanon because Hezbollah has been hurling missiles into their country is not necessarily

00:08:56.840 violating the ceasefire. You know, I mean, they're not attacking Iran. They're defending

00:09:02.900 themselves against that. And that's something, you know, I'm glad they're doing, but it has

00:09:07.220 nothing to do with what decisions we should make. And I also just want to add about that New York

00:09:11.100 Times piece. When has the New York Times ever reported anything that concerns Donald Trump

00:09:15.860 that was one, true, and two, even its truths were not designed to hurt Trump in some way.

00:09:24.840 And I couldn't help, as I was reading that thing, to think that that piece was written by Tucker Carlson, 0.59

00:09:29.380 you know, that it was kind of like the evil Jews came in and overrode the American firsters.

00:09:34.180 And I just thought, I don't know about that.

00:09:36.280 You know, Trump has been very cautious about war making.

00:09:39.680 And I think that he is, I think he's done a good thing.

00:09:43.200 And I think that it's probably coming to an end one way or another. 0.68

00:09:47.100 But Israel's fight, Israel's not breaking the ceasefire if they're fighting with Hezbollah. 0.83

00:09:51.320 They have to fight with Hezbollah. 0.70

00:09:52.380 And it shouldn't have anything to do with our ceasefire.

00:09:54.520 It doesn't have anything to do with it.

00:09:55.420 The question still is, I think there's one question still has not been answered, which

00:10:03.300 why exactly was this necessary for America to get involved in right now?

00:10:09.020 I don't think we've ever gotten, to my mind, a sufficient answer to that.

00:10:13.700 Not like, well, maybe it'll work out, but why was it necessary?

00:10:17.380 Why did we have to do this right now?

00:10:20.960 I don't think there's been a good answer to that.

00:10:22.920 And especially when the nuclear program is used as the answer.

00:10:26.120 Well, we were told that it was obliterated back in like June.

00:10:29.860 So it's difficult to understand how both those things could be true, that the nuclear program

00:10:35.300 was obliterated, but also the nuclear program is why we had to launch this war. I don't think

00:10:41.180 we've gotten a good answer to that. And I also think that, and then how are we better off? How

00:10:46.700 has America benefited from it? Getting the straight back open, well, great. It was already

00:10:51.340 open before this. So it's hard to see that we could say that that was a good reason for the

00:10:57.280 war to start. And I also think that in my own personal view that I've been very open about is

00:11:03.400 that I don't think this is in America's best interest. I think that there were a lot of

00:11:07.580 breezy assurances made by proponents of this war early on. You guys were talking a little bit about

00:11:12.280 that, that there's basically no downside. It'll be perfectly fine. It's treating Iran like they're

00:11:19.860 not even a country. Or comparing it to Venezuela, totally different situation. And not enough

00:11:28.120 wrestling with the real ramifications of doing something like this. And I got to say,

00:11:33.380 that's one thing that's really frustrated me about this entire thing. And I think it was reflected

00:11:37.760 in the conversation yesterday about Trump's truth social post about how we're going to,

00:11:45.120 the entire civilization is going to die. And it's, for someone who tries to be reasonable

00:11:51.080 about these things, it's really frustrating because what I see is, yeah, on one side,

00:11:54.740 you have some people who do panic about it, and they act as though there's a chance that Trump 0.82

00:12:02.140 will actually just nuke Iran and kill everybody. And I think that most of us who are rational knew

00:12:09.540 that that was just not going to happen. But on the other end of the spectrum,

00:12:14.520 you have people who are proponents of this war and reflexive defenders of it,

00:12:18.300 acting as though there is no reasonable criticism a person could make of a president saying publicly

00:12:26.520 the entire civilization will die. Like a reasonable person, a rational person can

00:12:33.820 obviously without panicking, you're not being a panic in, you're not saying that the sky's

00:12:39.080 falling, but you can look at that and say, huh, you know, I don't know if that's the best strategy.

00:12:44.840 And I also don't know if morally it's like ever OK to threaten to kill an entire civilization, even if you get even if you get your way so that that's a conversation we can have.

00:12:57.480 And just like the bad faith and the dishonesty from from people on both sides, I find I find really frustrating because, look, here's the thing.

00:13:06.520 I agree with the people who say that, yeah, there's no way Trump was actually going to do that.

00:13:10.620 He's not going to do that. I get it. OK, well, then. But why are you saying it then?

00:13:14.620 I'll give you an answer on this.

00:13:16.440 Well, but if you're not going to do it and everybody knows you're not going to do it,

00:13:21.220 then the threat is totally meaningless. 0.73

00:13:23.340 Like the Iranian regime, they have access to Twitter. 0.90

00:13:26.700 I mean, they can see the conversation also. 0.87

00:13:29.600 And so if everybody in the world knows he's not going to do it, then the threat has no meaning. 0.99

00:13:36.280 And if they think that he will do it, but then he doesn't, well, now you just look like a fool. 0.99

00:13:41.880 You look like you're full of bluster. 0.97

00:13:44.040 I mean, when you make this threat, if you hold on, if you make this threat and you will never actually do it ever, no matter what they do, then then all you've done is made your threats completely, completely meaningless.

00:13:57.560 No. So the thought that the fear is that and I've seen people say this, they went from criticizing Trump for bombing Iran to criticizing Trump for not bombing Iran.

00:14:07.600 Bill Kristol came out. He said, this is a taco. Trump chickens out. And so the criticism is, well, this means you can't trust what Trump says.

00:14:13.460 But I don't think that's true. I think you can trust what Trump says if you know what he means.

00:14:18.780 And so, yes, no one, no reasonable person thought that Trump was going to drop

00:14:22.720 multiple nuclear weapons on Iran and genocide the entire population. So no one thinks he's

00:14:28.580 going to do that. But people do think he might do something. And this is one of the arguments

00:14:33.160 for some strikes in Iran. Again, I'm a skeptic on the strikes. But one of the arguments for it is

00:14:38.520 Trump is a dove. He advocates for peace. He doesn't want to get in these quagmires.

00:14:43.460 And then he kills Soleimani, or he drops the Moab, or he takes out Maduro, or in this case, 0.90

00:14:48.640 he takes out the Ayatollah, the most senior Muslim leader in the world. And he does these 0.87

00:14:52.120 things that allow him to maintain some unpredictability. So with that tweet that

00:14:56.040 he sent out, he goes, open the effing straits, or you'll all be living in hell. Praise be to Allah.

00:15:01.860 To me, what I really liked about that tweet is it seemed very disciplined. It seemed reckless at

00:15:06.980 first. But when you read that dry humor line at the end, all praise to Allah, you can see he's

00:15:12.180 being disciplined here, and he's mocking the way that they speak. The Iranians are the ones who I 1.00

00:15:16.360 say, the great Satan will go down in a ball of fire, you know, whatever. And so he's kind of 1.00

00:15:21.880 mocking the way that they speak. My argument for what he's doing, just in a short way, a concise

00:15:28.000 way, is there was good to be achieved here. I never thought the Iranian regime was going to fall.

00:15:34.740 I always thought that those kinds of comments were way overselling the war. The goods that are

00:15:39.820 achieved are you further weaken their nuclear program, which they're going to continue to

00:15:43.140 pursue. You really mess up their ballistics missiles program, which was being used to defend

00:15:48.220 the nuclear program. You sink their military. You kill the top like 15 layers of their government.

00:15:53.240 But the regime remains in place in a similar way that we saw in Venezuela. And especially if you

00:15:59.020 can make sure the Strait of Hormuz remains open so the best card that the Iranians have to play 0.94

00:16:03.280 doesn't actually redound to their benefit, then you have achieved some strategic objectives that

00:16:08.420 the U.S. has had for 47 years. Again, I'm very skeptical of the whole thing, but it doesn't mean

00:16:12.960 you don't accomplish nothing. I want to break in here on two points. First of all, Pete Hexeth,

00:16:19.120 the god of war, or secretary of war, whatever they call him, he said that the Iranians knew

00:16:24.180 exactly what Trump was talking about, that they knew exactly what he was going to hit. There was

00:16:28.340 nothing they could do about it. I think that that is probably exactly accurate. So Trump was making

00:16:33.500 a big fuss for the press and driving the press insane, as he loves to do. But in fact, the

00:16:37.480 arranged exactly what was coming. And it was bad, you know, stuff they were going to get hit on

00:16:41.780 Carg Island, they were going to get hit in their infrastructure. And I think that he was making a

00:16:46.680 deal insofar as it goes. But the other thing about this, and look, my point about this war from the

00:16:52.720 very beginning was, if it ends well, it'll be good. If it doesn't end well, it'll be bad, like

00:16:57.200 every war, essentially. But I thought that there was a good reason for doing it, although whether 0.88

00:17:02.360 we should be doing it now or not is a fair question. All kinds of questions are fair.

00:17:08.300 I agree with Matt. These people who say there's no downside to a war are out of their freaking

00:17:13.020 minds. That's ridiculous. A war, we call it kinetic for a reason. We are fighting to build 1.00

00:17:18.420 a country. Trump is fighting to build a country and a North America that can stand up to the

00:17:23.240 onslaught from China that is coming, I would say, approximately 15 minutes. And I think that one of

00:17:29.660 the things that he has done, when he went into Venezuela, a lot of the people running out of 0.98

00:17:34.240 that country were suspiciously yellow, you know, suspiciously look like Chinese people. When he 0.98

00:17:39.020 went into Iran, a lot of that oil coming through the strait is going to China. Something like 40%

00:17:43.740 of their oil is for China. And that's stuff that China needs. And as they go forward,

00:17:49.820 and as Donald Trump sits down with Xi and says, oh, my friend, my good friend, we get along so

00:17:54.480 well, it would be a shame if you couldn't get your oil. It's going to matter who is in charge

00:17:59.400 of the Strait of Hormuz. And so I think that this is all about, I mean, Trump is actually doing a

00:18:04.480 visionary thing, which in America is forbidden because we live from not just election to

00:18:08.820 election, we live from poll to poll. But I think he actually is doing a visionary thing. I think

00:18:13.520 it is a good thing. I don't think it has to involve us changing the regime in Iran. I think

00:18:18.880 it has to do with our crippling them, which he seems to have done almost completely, as far as

00:18:23.700 I can tell. And yeah, you know, Matt is right again about that we didn't obliterate their

00:18:28.140 nuclear program before. I think now we may have buried a lot of their nuclear goods underground

00:18:33.540 such that it will be tough for them to get it out without our seeing them and going after them

00:18:38.440 again. So I don't know. I think he has accomplished something. And I think that he would like to get

00:18:42.620 out. I've been, you know, for the last two friendly fires, I've been saying time is running out.

00:18:47.040 And I think there are a lot of people who are, you know, thinking that we have to go in and

00:18:52.300 destroy everything in Iran to get rid of the leadership or change the regime. That's not

00:18:56.260 going to happen? Hold on, before Matt starts to just scream his rebuttal to that, I want you all

00:19:01.620 to realize out there that a lot is happening, and it's hitting everything from your paycheck to your

00:19:06.180 freedoms. So you can either guess or you can know. The Daily Wire gives you live breaking news,

00:19:11.140 investigative reporting, ad-free daily shows, and experts who are actually part of the story,

00:19:15.320 especially on Cabot's show. Join now at dailywire.com slash subscribe. Before we get to Cabot, Matt.

00:19:20.400 Yeah, I think, look, there's this weird thing we do now with wars where we talk about them

00:19:27.980 very theoretically, especially this latest one where we're sort of theorizing about,

00:19:33.880 well, maybe we're doing it for this reason. Maybe this is the reason. As though we don't have

00:19:38.680 leaders who are running the country whose responsibility is not to actually tell us

00:19:44.700 this stuff. You know, it used to be that for most of American history, when we went to war,

00:19:49.620 It was like kind of a big deal. And so the American people had to know why we're doing it.

00:19:54.920 That doesn't mean that the generals have to sit down at your kitchen table and lay out all the blueprints and lay out all the battle plans for you.

00:20:01.620 OK, some things are confidential. We get that. You want the element of surprise.

00:20:05.280 But a basic conversation about why are we doing this? Why now?

00:20:10.200 What you as Americans are going to pay the price for this one way or another.

00:20:14.500 You're going to pay a financial. At least there's a risk.

00:20:16.500 There's a risk if we if America goes to war in any part of the world, there is a serious risk to American people, to American livelihood, to American lives.

00:20:25.100 No one can deny that. And so for that reason alone, we have a right to know why are we doing this?

00:20:30.240 Why was this necessary right now? And well, what happens is that is that, you know, Trump says things and then some of us say, well, hold on.

00:20:39.320 But that can't be true. That doesn't sound exactly right. And then we're told by the proponents of the war.

00:20:43.700 Oh, well, you know, but that doesn't you can't take that seriously. He didn't really mean that. So Trump said obliterate the nuclear program. Well, but no, he didn't really mean obliterate it. Trump said we're going to the entire civilization is going to die. Well, obviously, he didn't really mean the entire civilization. Trump said the Iranian people will rise up and it will be regime change. Well, obviously not really a regime change. And then and then, Drew, you say, well, really, this is about positioning with China. Well, OK, but no one in power has said that. That is not what Trump has said.

00:21:09.220 I agree with you, but I do believe that that's part of the plan.

00:21:12.820 If he says that, he's telling China what he's doing and he doesn't want to do that.

00:21:17.900 But it doesn't work that way.

00:21:19.080 It's not that I disagree with you, Matt.

00:21:20.280 I just think that this is the way it is, you know?

00:21:22.960 I mean, I get it.

00:21:23.760 But I'm saying it shouldn't be.

00:21:24.720 I wish Trump were an eloquent, good spokesman for what he's doing.

00:21:28.280 He's not.

00:21:28.880 It's not about being eloquent.

00:21:30.080 It's not about being eloquent.

00:21:31.600 It's just about being straightforward and honest about what America is doing with our

00:21:38.200 money and our lives. What are we doing and why? We have a right to know. And this thing that we

00:21:45.700 hear from proponents where basically we have no right to know. Just have faith in Trump. Just

00:21:50.660 have faith. Hold on a second. Trump is not God, okay? He's not Jesus Christ. I'm not called upon

00:21:58.380 to have faith in him. I don't have faith in any politician. Faith? This is a call to faith in a

00:22:05.080 politician. It's the other way around. No, I don't have to trust him. You have to earn that trust

00:22:11.240 always. And it's not just, you can't cash in on past trust that you've earned. Has he not earned

00:22:16.680 the trust? You have to continue to earn it. I think he's earned trust on foreign policy.

00:22:19.040 I think he's earned the trust about this too. Yeah, I thought what he did in Venezuela was

00:22:26.280 great. That doesn't mean that what's happening right now is great. Trump has done some things

00:22:32.120 that are really good. He's also done things that are bad. I thought the way Trump handled COVID

00:22:36.060 was terrible. We all like to pretend that never happened.

00:22:38.780 But what about foreign policy? I'm saying on foreign policy in particular, I think he's earned

00:22:42.180 a lot of trust. I think he's done a lot of good things. I've generally supported what he's done

00:22:47.460 on foreign policy. This thing over here, though, is a whole new thing. And what I'm saying is that

00:22:52.540 I'm not convinced that this is in America's best interest or that it was necessary.

00:22:57.440 and no one in a position of power has made the case for why it is.

00:23:01.600 And when they do make the case, I'm immediately informed by pundits that the case they made was not actually the case

00:23:08.260 and that I should know that, yeah, they're saying that, but that's not really the reason.

00:23:12.080 There's some other reason that they, the pundits, can explain to me, but the administration cannot.

00:23:17.300 And I'm saying that that situation is untimely.

00:23:19.940 Matt, listen, I think all of these complaints are absolutely good.

00:23:24.840 But at the same time, I do think that something's happened that has been really good for America. 0.62

00:23:30.120 I think what he has done in Iran has already been good for us and will appear to be good for us pretty quickly in the course of history.

00:23:38.680 But you're absolutely right.

00:23:40.600 He doesn't explain anything.

00:23:42.980 The pundits have been awful about this.

00:23:45.280 I mean, there have been so many pundits on the left, I guess we'll call them whatever the anti-American pundits who are most pundits who have played this thing as if we were somehow, you know, our cities were being bombed.

00:23:57.580 You know, you read The New York Times and The Wall Street Journal.

00:23:59.960 It sounds like, you know, a rise in gas, which is bad.

00:24:02.680 It's bad. 0.59

00:24:03.240 But it sounds like Hiroshima and America, the way they play it. 0.57

00:24:06.820 The Wall Street Journal in one of the funniest, you know, headlines I'd seen saying if Trump ups this war, then it might strengthen Iranian resolve.

00:24:19.380 I thought, like the Black Knight in a Monty Python movie, how much stronger can their resolve be?

00:24:24.860 Nothing seems to convince them that they've been beaten.

00:24:27.260 So I praise them for their resolve.

00:24:29.820 However, however, stepping back from all of that stuff, which is all true.

00:24:34.060 I do look at this and I think we're in a better position now than we were six weeks ago.

00:24:38.600 And I think all the hand-wringing has also been wrong.

00:24:42.640 I think the hand-wringing is wrong.

00:24:44.080 And I think you're absolutely right about this, Walsh.

00:24:46.120 It's been driving me nuts, too.

00:24:47.520 These people say, oh, it's great.

00:24:49.400 There's not even a risk.

00:24:50.480 It's not even a problem.

00:24:51.280 It drives me nuts.

00:24:52.220 But on the other hand, I think the hand-wringing is equally wrong.

00:24:54.480 I think we are actually in a better place today than we were when the bombing started.

00:24:58.640 And I think if he can get out of it right about now, which is what I've been saying since for the last two friendly fires, right about now is when I think he should get out of it and make sure the straight is open if he can.

00:25:09.300 And that, I think, will be in a better position.

00:25:11.120 Kevin, are we in a better place right now than we were five weeks ago?

00:25:13.580 I think it's easy to say if things hold, if the ceasefire holds, then yeah.

00:25:17.400 And if we're able to get anything to the straight, then yeah, we're in a better place.

00:25:20.920 The big question, though, is can you actually get out right now?

00:25:24.420 I mean, yeah, Trump can say, oh, well, it's a ceasefire.

00:25:27.520 But if it's a one-sided ceasefire, if all that means is that we're no longer bombing

00:25:30.880 them, if the strait, if you're having to pay $2 million to get a tanker through the strait, 0.93

00:25:35.440 if the Iranians are still holding the energy economy globally hostage, then of course you're 0.75

00:25:41.720 not in a better position than you are in the long run. 0.99

00:25:44.700 And I do think, Andrew, I agree that the pundit class has been terrible messaging on this.

00:25:50.080 But we can be honest that the White House has been completely all over the place on

00:25:53.560 messaging.

00:25:53.900 One day, President Trump is saying, well, we can get out without the Strait of Hormuz.

00:25:57.680 The rest of the world can figure out oil on their own.

00:26:00.020 And then the next day, he's saying, if you don't open the Strait, we're going to bomb

00:26:02.180 you in oblivion.

00:26:02.740 So does the Strait matter or does it not matter?

00:26:04.760 And then one day, it's regime change.

00:26:06.360 Trump's saying, hey, when this conflict is over, this will be the best chance in generations

00:26:09.620 for you all to topple this regime.

00:26:11.800 And then the next day, regime change is not even mentioned by the State Department in

00:26:15.260 the list of objectives.

00:26:16.160 Can I bring a little Thucydides in here?

00:26:18.360 I mean, just a little to go back to the OG historian of war.

00:26:21.400 In the Peloponnesian War, Thucydides writes that nations go to war for three reasons, fear, interest, and honor.

00:26:29.420 And the late great historian of ancient Greece, Don Kagan, who was a right winger also, one of the few in academia,

00:26:34.920 he said everyone takes seriously the fear part, everyone takes seriously the interest part,

00:26:39.100 no one takes seriously the honor part because we live in this materialist society.

00:26:43.280 And so when you say, Matt, well, hold on, why is it? Give me the one reason why we went to war.

00:26:47.660 You know, or Cabot, you just mentioned that the rationale keeps changing.

00:26:51.220 I don't think it's changing so much as there were multiple reasons to go to war.

00:26:54.940 There is the fear that Iran could get a nuclear weapon. 0.53

00:26:57.740 Iran has been pretty open about pursuing a nuclear weapon for decades now.

00:27:01.080 And it might be overhyped how close they are to actually achieving a nuclear weapon. 0.93

00:27:05.360 I agree with that.

00:27:06.220 But they clearly want it.

00:27:07.240 And so that causes rational fear, certainly for the United States, but for the rest of the world.

00:27:11.360 In terms of interest, there's a lot of interest when we're talking about specifically the Strait of Hormuz,

00:27:16.320 where 20% of the oil for the global market flows through. To say nothing of petrochemicals,

00:27:21.840 to say nothing of fertilizer. They're in a geopolitically very important position.

00:27:26.600 And then there is honor. And this gets to your point, Drew, when we're talking about China.

00:27:30.540 You know, the United States is the global hegemon. American hegemony is predicated in no small part

00:27:35.120 on the petrodollar. If we were in a position where Iran has really strengthened its hand, 0.82

00:27:40.260 where China, rather, has really strengthened its hand in Iran, where countries, the Gulf states,

00:27:45.700 are starting to look more toward China than to the United States to protect them. We could be in a

00:27:49.840 world in which the petrodollar goes away, we end up with the petroyuan, China all of a sudden is 0.95

00:27:54.620 running the show globally, and America's stature would not just diminish a little bit, we would 0.85

00:27:59.940 lose our role as the global hegemon, which benefits us greatly. So I think the answer is

00:28:04.920 there were a billion reasons to go to war in Iran. The regime change part of it would just be

00:28:10.860 kind of a bonus, I guess, if we could have a regime that is favorable to the West in there.

00:28:15.520 But there were all these reasons. This is why so many presidents had considered doing it. So

00:28:19.120 I'm the guy, had I been on the NSC, I would have argued against these strikes,

00:28:23.220 as I've said again and again. To your point, Drew, can we trust the New York Times? I certainly

00:28:26.700 don't reflexively, but it is curious that the left is always trying to stoke division within

00:28:31.160 the Trump administration. The fact that here they're showing that Vance and Rubio, who were

00:28:35.860 supposed to be so far apart, are actually aligned. Yeah, they're trying to hit Trump and say that he's

00:28:40.480 the one who's the lone wolf here being duped by Bibi, and the rest of the admin is really smart

00:28:45.120 in America first. Yeah, the New York Times has its own rationale, certainly. But it seems to me here

00:28:50.500 that we might be able to rely on some of the reporting that's coming out. And I just think

00:28:54.880 it's a tricky call, and he had to get out after five weeks. And the point that I would make on

00:29:01.280 the ceasefire is Trump said at the beginning, this war, it's going to go on for about five weeks.

00:29:06.100 And then when five weeks and one day hit, my Twitter mentions blew up with, hey, Michael, are you going to start freaking out now?

00:29:13.080 Are you going to start getting concerned?

00:29:14.440 And I said, well, I'm starting to get a little more concerned.

00:29:16.420 But if the ceasefire holds, it will have come into place five weeks and two days after the war began.

00:29:23.880 That's pretty impressive. 0.64

00:29:24.920 Originally, he said four to six weeks, I think.

00:29:26.840 So he's right in there.

00:29:29.440 Listen, I just think that there are political considerations.

00:29:32.680 I keep saying this.

00:29:33.940 I do not want the left to take this country back. I mean, the left is far more dangerous.

00:29:39.340 The inside left is far more dangerous enemy to us than the Iranians. You know, and so I think 1.00

00:29:44.380 Trump is playing with fire when he lets his popularity sink as low as it has. But I still do

00:29:50.660 think that, you know, you have to be able to think beyond the interests of the press. The interests

00:29:57.640 of the press are Thursday. You know, they think like we're thinking as far as Thursday and this

00:30:02.000 could go bad that, you know, if gas prices go up, the disaster predictions that have come out of

00:30:07.960 this event have been so absurd that, you know, you can't even read the paper without, you know,

00:30:14.240 kind of just throwing it away and thinking, I can't get any information out of this.

00:30:18.480 The disaster predictions are absurd. Certainly the nothing could possibly go wrong idea is

00:30:24.440 nonsense. The way that, you know, the other thing I agree with you, Matt, about is the way that

00:30:29.680 people are savaged for talking about this as if it were a complex event with good and bad things

00:30:36.020 involved. But, but I do think, but I do think that Trump has earned our respect in terms of

00:30:42.560 foreign policy and in terms of visionary foreign policy, which in America means foreign policy 0.81

00:30:47.480 lasting beyond, you know, six weeks from now and thinking about the fact that the Chinese are

00:30:52.300 serious, you know, they're seriously going after Taiwan. They seriously mean to replace our 0.98

00:30:56.920 hegemony with their hegemony. And I think that Trump is basically confessing what he has to

00:31:02.420 confess, which is, which we all have to confess is we're an empire. We are an empire and we have

00:31:07.580 to solidify the Western hemisphere in order to remain the good empire instead of the bad empires

00:31:12.660 that are actually growing as we speak. Is there any reason though, is there any reason to think

00:31:18.300 that let's say the ceasefire holds and I don't know how likely that is to happen.

00:31:23.700 But let's say that it does. And then so then this is the, you know, the status quo. Whether or not this was worth it, whether or not it worked, whatever that means, because as we established, we don't really exactly know what the goals are.

00:31:39.140 um that's not something we can judge right now and and that's that's the other other frustrating

00:31:45.560 thing about the war proponents is that they're like as soon as the ceasefire was announced you

00:31:50.560 had people saying you see it all worked out fine it's been 10 seconds i mean yeah if if this goes

00:31:57.340 bad i'm not saying it's going to go bad because we're going to have a nuclear war i'm not i know

00:32:01.900 maybe there's some people saying oh it's going to be world wars i mean a nuclear holocaust

00:32:04.660 i am not saying that i think that most skeptics of the war aren't really saying that maybe

00:32:09.080 some of the loudest voices are, but most aren't. I think most of us who are skeptical are saying

00:32:13.800 that, yeah, it might work out fine in the short run, but there's no reason to think that in the 0.98

00:32:21.500 long term, we're going to be in a better position with Iran than we were before it. And there's 0.98

00:32:26.220 good reason to think that it might end up worse because what history has clearly shown us,

00:32:30.900 including the recent history of the Middle East, is that when you create a power vacuum, 0.73

00:32:35.060 if they've even successfully done that, which I don't know that they have. But even if they did

00:32:39.880 do that, especially in the Middle East, what happens is the power vacuum gets filled and it's

00:32:45.440 going to invariably be filled, not by like the nicest, most democratic, most liberal-minded,

00:32:52.960 secular people. It's going to be filled by the people who are the most brutal and the most

00:32:58.300 ruthless and the most, especially in the Middle East, the most fundamentalists are willing to

00:33:02.080 kill the most people to claim power. So hold on, one point, just before you both start attacking 0.95

00:33:07.540 each other on this, well, hold on, I have to shift my framing here. I'm mirrored here. So

00:33:11.300 before you both, anyway, before you guys start going at it on this, it is worth pointing out,

00:33:15.520 I'm pretty opposed to regime change in Iran, not because the regime is good, it's an evil regime,

00:33:21.900 but because of your concerns, Matt. The issue is, if this ceasefire holds,

00:33:28.180 then we actually are in a situation that is much closer to what we saw in Venezuela,

00:33:32.780 which is they didn't get rid of the regime. They didn't get rid of the party. They got rid of the

00:33:36.200 top of it. They pointed a gun at number two, Delcy Rodriguez, and said, play ball with us or you're

00:33:40.460 next. It'll be worse for you than it was for Maduro. And the same could be true here. If you

00:33:44.240 get rid of Khamenei and who knows, Khamenei's junior seems to be in a coma right now, and you 0.51

00:33:50.100 just keep taking out all that top-level leadership, you leave the Islamic regime in place, then you

00:33:54.840 avoid the fear of total chaos there where the genuinely bad actors might come in, you cut off 0.55

00:34:00.040 the potential of a flourishing democratic whatever Iran. But you might have a rump regime in place

00:34:05.220 that can maintain order and also deal unfriendlier terms with the United States.

00:34:09.760 Before we get to Drew's point about how, Matt, you and I are totally wrong,

00:34:14.780 I have to say goodbye to Cabot. I am looking forward to welcoming Isabel. But more important

00:34:20.740 than any of that, I want to talk about our sponsor, Policy Genius. I don't know about you,

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00:34:57.100 about this more than the rest of us have thought about. Have you, you're going to, you're going to

00:35:02.420 disappear someday. No, no, no. I never die. Haven't you caught on now? You know, when you talk about

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00:35:11.740 That's a hot, yeah. But you got to get it, especially, and especially young people. This 0.95

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00:35:41.860 You know, Matt, do you take care of your family or are you as irresponsible as I am?

00:35:45.500 No, look at him for crying out loud.

00:35:48.020 Yeah, I've got, I got, they each have a piggy bank in their room and I put a quarter in a piggy bank every month.

00:35:55.800 And hopefully I live a lot of months.

00:35:57.200 So they'll have money when I'm gone.

00:35:59.200 But right now that's my whole plan.

00:36:00.480 Yeah, that's good.

00:36:01.500 Well, all the more reason we need to maintain dollar hegemony.

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00:36:42.800 Cabot, next time I'm going to try to shut

00:36:45.380 these other guys up so I get to hear more from you. Good to see you. Everyone go check out Wired

00:36:49.560 and Live, an actual excellent show that, in spite of ourselves, we have now put on The Daily Wire.

00:36:56.220 I'm very excited to see Isabel Brown. But first, last word, gentlemen, Ben, sorry, Matt and Drew.

00:37:04.540 Last word. Matt is wrong, you say, Drew. Yes, I want to take a moment here. You know, now,

00:37:10.000 I was alive during Vietnam, a terrible mistake, awful, the worst thing we ever did. 1.00

00:37:15.860 America sucks. 0.99

00:37:17.020 It was all this bad news. 1.00

00:37:18.700 You never read.

00:37:19.260 There is no such thing as a book that praises the war in Vietnam. 0.98

00:37:22.180 All I know is for 30 years afterwards, you didn't hear a peep out of the Chinese because 1.00

00:37:26.240 they were so scared of how crazy we were to fight them the way we did in this nowhere 1.00

00:37:30.900 backwater and try and keep them out.

00:37:33.600 I mean, it actually had a good effect ever since Trump's first presidency.

00:37:38.680 And I would go further and say George W. Bush, who I did not like what he did in the Middle East.

00:37:43.280 I did not like the way he handled the things he tried to do.

00:37:46.340 But the situation in the Middle East has steadily improved.

00:37:50.780 It is better now than it ever has been in my lifetime, which, as I say, goes back to Thucydides. 0.83

00:37:56.420 The mistake that or if it was a mistake, if it wasn't just sinister that Obama made in strengthening Iran,

00:38:04.120 created an opportunity for Trump to go to the other powers in the region and say, look,

00:38:10.580 do you want to deal with Iran or do you want to deal with Israel? And mostly they wanted to deal

00:38:14.340 with Israel, the one free country in the Middle East. So now you've got the UAE, you've got a 0.92

00:38:19.980 fairly progressive regime. You've got even Saudi Arabia kind of scratching their chin

00:38:24.120 and saying, look, we hate these guys. They hate Iran. They're bullies. They're the cause of all 0.73

00:38:29.340 the violence in the region. And they're saying, you know, we actually would rather deal with

00:38:33.720 Israel than with these guys. The situation in the Middle East is better than it has been, 0.87

00:38:39.080 as I say, before the 9-11. But, you know, 9-11 was the turning point and it has now gotten better. 1.00

00:38:46.520 These guys are tired of being bombed. They're tired of bombing. They're tired of seeing their

00:38:50.260 kids go off and get killed. There's sophisticated people in these regions. If you take a look at the

00:38:55.440 Secretary of State, the Minister of State, they call her in the UAE, she is one of the sophisticated

00:39:00.940 educated politicians alive. These are smart people who understand that if they want to be part of

00:39:05.340 the future, they're going to have to stop killing and raping people and acting like savages. So I 0.97

00:39:10.460 think that this is an opportunity. And I do think that a very clear path to something better has

00:39:16.060 been opened by this war in Iran. All of the rest of it, that there's no complexity to it, that 0.55

00:39:22.100 there's no negative to it, that it has to go on forever because Israel wants it to happen. All of 0.92

00:39:26.720 that stuff I think has got to be thrown out the window. And I do trust, this is where I agree with

00:39:31.600 you, Knowles. I trust Trump on this stuff because I realize what he wants is strength, American

00:39:37.280 hegemony, and prosperity. That's his whole thing. He wants people to say, that wonderful Trump,

00:39:42.560 he gave us prosperity. And I think that this is part of his scheme to do that over the long term.

00:39:47.760 Now, I agree that, you know, we need to bring a little dignity onto this show

00:39:53.220 instead of just having it be all of us.

00:39:55.480 I'm leaving it.

00:39:56.280 So we're very happy to have Isabel Brown joining us

00:40:00.300 because there's this new act.

00:40:02.360 While we're all debating, we're all focused on Iran,

00:40:06.040 there's a Republican member of Congress,

00:40:09.400 Maria Elisar, what's her name?

00:40:12.180 Maria Fernandez, whatever it is. 0.96

00:40:14.180 Salazar.

00:40:14.760 Salazar, I was going to say Elisar.

00:40:16.740 Maria Salazar is a Republican

00:40:18.340 who decided the best way to respond

00:40:22.180 to the first popular vote victory for Republicans in 20 years, a victory won largely on mass

00:40:27.800 deportations, is to propose a mass amnesty bill for illegal aliens that she is now calling the

00:40:34.740 Dignity Act, but the actual bill is not called the Dignity Act. It's called the Dignidad Act.

00:40:41.200 Hola, hola, Andele, Andele. Isabel, you got into a kerfuffle exposing the bill.

00:40:46.120 oh michael michael michael i love that you're pointing out that this is all happening while

00:40:52.640 the entire media apparatus and virtually everyone in government is banking on the fact that you are

00:40:57.640 just going to keep your eyes on the middle east of course there's also other disappointing things

00:41:02.460 happening here in washington it's tough to live here down the street from congress i gotta say

00:41:06.680 makes you pretty nauseous several times a day these are the same people who are still on like

00:41:11.080 a three-week recess because they refused to enact voter ID, which we also delivered a mandate on

00:41:16.840 in November of 2024. Dignidad Act is wildly frustrating. This was introduced by a Republican

00:41:23.380 member of Congress, and she insists to her dying breath is not a mass amnesty bill, but quite

00:41:28.960 literally is a mass amnesty bill. It would allow for a pathway for millions of people who came here

00:41:34.640 illegally as children to stay as permanent residents in the United States, would even allow

00:41:38.800 the Secretary of Homeland Security to welcome back up to four million people who were deported

00:41:44.740 from January 2017 on while they can reapply for dignity status from outside of the United States

00:41:51.820 and be granted permanent residency. It even prohibits the government from looking at criminal

00:41:56.880 gang databases at the federal or state level to determine if someone should stay in America. 0.91

00:42:03.260 It is bonkers insane. And there are upwards of like 30 Republican members of Congress

00:42:07.880 supporting this, you should be pissed about this. Why are they? It's a dumb question,

00:42:15.820 but you just think this is the most cartoonishly preposterous bill that Republicans, and it's about 0.99

00:42:23.800 a dozen, I think it's a dozen or 14 Republican members of Congress could propose. This woman, 0.98

00:42:28.880 by the way, now she's saying it's not amnesty, it's not amnesty. There's video footage of her

00:42:32.720 saying, well, look, I mean, eventually some legislator is going to come along and give

00:42:37.360 these people amnesty. So it's going to give them a pathway to citizenship, I should say. But right

00:42:41.260 now we just got to give them peace. We got to keep them here. So she's admitting on camera,

00:42:44.600 by the way, it would also effectively pass the DREAM Act, the DREAM Act, which was formulated 0.73

00:42:49.560 by Democrats 15 years ago to say that these doe-eyed little dreamer illegal aliens, who are

00:42:55.260 now like 50, by the way, that they all need to get mass amnesty and a pathway to citizenship.

00:43:00.140 I mean, this thing is as rancid as a bill as ever I have seen.

00:43:06.580 Why?

00:43:07.660 Why are they doing it?

00:43:09.800 Oh, I think we all know the answer, honestly.

00:43:11.740 We lose enough seats during the midterms.

00:43:13.260 Yeah, literally.

00:43:14.580 It's so infuriating, honestly, because it is a betrayal.

00:43:18.060 It's the American people.

00:43:19.760 But it's also just like rocket science, apparently, for most people in Congress.

00:43:23.820 to how to govern on offense as a conservative and to conserve American borders, culture,

00:43:31.360 way of life, legal system. It's like we're so afraid of the potential that we might disappoint

00:43:37.440 some theoretical middle of the fence voter out there that really doesn't exist in 2026. So you

00:43:43.200 just change your entire strategy the minute that you get in office. I'll actually add this too

00:43:47.000 before opening it up to the rest of you guys. This is really interesting stuff. This bill was

00:43:50.480 introduced almost a year. All of a sudden, it's just now picking up traction while they're hoping

00:43:54.960 that you don't pay attention to any of this stuff. It is 261 pages. So it's a whole lot more

00:44:01.120 complicated than some simple way to reform immigration. And the byline of this bill is

00:44:06.800 literally called to secure the border and reform the immigration laws. Secure the border, but go 0.84

00:44:13.220 off. I actually interviewed Congressman Brandon Gill about this. This will be our episode for

00:44:17.040 tomorrow. He's one of the good ones left here in Washington. And I loved his take on it.

00:44:21.500 I think of a clip for you guys. You know, we're not going to sell out our entire country for an

00:44:27.320 extra five basis points of GDP growth, which seems to be the bargain that that the sort of

00:44:34.360 the libertarian wing in our party has made for a long time. We've got to move away from that.

00:44:39.380 And that is what we ran on, by the way. To your point, we ran on a platform of deportations.

00:44:45.360 And whenever you tell the American people that you're going to push mass deportations, you cannot turn around and introduce an amnesty bill.

00:44:54.260 You know, that really is like two middle fingers to the people who voted us and elected us and got us a trifecta and got President Trump the popular vote.

00:45:03.800 I mean, it's really a grotesque betrayal of everything we've been saying for years now.

00:45:09.660 If we betray our voters like this Dignity Act does, which, again, is an absolute abomination, I think it will be unforgivable.

00:45:18.300 It will be absolutely unforgivable, and we'll be dealing with this a decade from now.

00:45:24.360 That's exactly what they did in Britain, right? 0.99

00:45:26.400 They keep voting in people to stop the migrants coming in, and they keep letting the migrants coming in, whether it's left or right. 0.99

00:45:31.940 It's exactly the way that Britain has become whatever it is now. 1.00

00:45:36.360 I have a bill proposal.

00:45:37.800 It's called the all new denizens actually leave on mass bill or the on delay bill.

00:45:46.240 And I want, I don't know, maybe I'll send it to Brandon Gill and maybe he can introduce it.

00:45:50.960 I don't, you know, to me, this is the most important issue that I voted on.

00:45:55.680 I want mass deportations.

00:45:58.020 I don't just want the face tattooed criminals gone. 0.88

00:46:01.280 I want, we have upwards of 20 million illegal aliens.

00:46:04.440 We don't know how many illegal aliens we have. 0.97

00:46:05.940 I want them gone. It's not even anything necessarily about them. I'm sure the abuelas 1.00

00:46:11.080 are really nice, but abuela has to go too. Most abuelas have to go. Maybe a few exceptions. 1.00

00:46:16.400 They have to go too because you cannot have a system where you have the highest foreign-born 0.58

00:46:21.560 percentage of the population we've ever had, a massive collapse of social solidarity, 0.99

00:46:26.260 no trust in the most basic laws that we have in our country, and a popular election, an election

00:46:32.160 where you win the popular vote on this issue

00:46:34.200 and then you don't deliver on this issue.

00:46:36.120 Matt, are they doing enough to deliver?

00:46:38.700 Forget Congress.

00:46:39.680 Is the White House doing enough

00:46:40.720 to deliver on the issue?

00:46:43.580 Well, this is the thing.

00:46:44.800 I mean, I've, not to bring it back,

00:46:48.100 I'm trying to avoid bringing our conversation

00:46:51.320 circling back to Iran again. 0.99

00:46:53.060 We're going back to Iran.

00:46:54.320 I can't make a Farsi joke. 0.99

00:46:56.020 I can only make Spanish jokes. 1.00

00:46:58.220 I will admit this is one of the main reasons 1.00

00:47:01.700 why I have opposed it, opposed the Iran war, and I still do. It's like the first thing I thought of 0.99

00:47:08.720 because of how my mind works when I heard we were launching these strikes, is that

00:47:13.720 if Trump is going to do something that is politically risky, potentially politically

00:47:21.780 catastrophic, although maybe not, drastic, you know, raises some constitutional questions

00:47:30.660 And all of that, like a huge swing like that, you know, and using a lot of political capital, I would much rather it be on mass deportations of every single illegal immigrant in the country and also, and this is where we get to the constitutional questions, defying every federal judge who tries to stop him.

00:47:53.400 And here's the thing. Unlike some right-wing commentators, there are right-wing commentators

00:47:59.200 who are calling for mass deportations and will also insist that, yeah, we could do it. The people

00:48:03.960 will love it. We're not going to suffer any big political backlash. If anything, it'll be a red

00:48:08.800 wave because people will love it so much. Maybe it works out that way. I tend to doubt it. I'm not

00:48:13.860 sure exactly politically how this would play. I mean, if you did mass deportations, not just,

00:48:18.220 Michael, to your point, not just the face-tattooed criminals, but you're actually deporting people

00:48:22.460 who've been here for 10 years have never committed an additional crime aside from coming to the

00:48:26.260 country illegally, and you're deporting millions of them. I'm not sure how that plays, what that

00:48:31.500 looks like. We know that the media propaganda campaign, they would treat it like a nuclear

00:48:35.900 holocaust. We saw what they did when we were only deporting the face-tattooed criminals. We were 0.94

00:48:40.000 deporting sex offenders, pedophiles, Somali fraudsters, and they treated it that way. 1.00

00:48:44.960 You can only imagine if it was actual mass deportations of non-criminal aliens except 0.92

00:48:50.720 for the crime of coming here illegally. So I don't know. But what I'm saying, and it is possible,

00:48:55.080 I will admit this right now, that if you were to do that, and you were especially to do the second

00:49:00.020 part, which would be necessary, of basically flipping the middle finger to the federal judges

00:49:03.760 and saying, yeah, I get you guys don't like this. We're going to do it anyway. It needs to be done.

00:49:08.700 The federal judges are completely out of control. They've claimed power over the entire government.

00:49:14.460 They claim executive, judicial, and legislative power for themselves. There's no way to solve

00:49:19.220 that other than just, we're going to ignore you and do it and let the chips fall where they may.

00:49:23.380 And if you were to do that, I don't know how it plays out. It may end up being a political

00:49:27.160 catastrophe. I mean, it may end up being blue wave in the midterms, Democrat president, maybe.

00:49:33.660 That's a risk that I'm willing to take for that result because it must be done. And I think a lot

00:49:37.880 of Americans are willing to take it for that result. You know what? If we did mass deportations,

00:49:41.540 we did what had to be done. We reclaimed our country. And the consequence, I'm not convinced 0.56

00:49:46.020 to what happened. But if the consequence was that a Democrat gets elected in 2028 because people are

00:49:50.380 really mad about it, to me, that's a price. It's not a price I want to pay. It's a price worth

00:49:54.480 paying. I'm not willing to pay that price. Not that I get a choice in the matter. I don't want

00:49:59.840 to pay that price for Iran. I want to pay it for this. And here's the thing. I think that especially 1.00

00:50:06.780 recent history showed us that as a president, you typically don't get to take multiple huge

00:50:13.560 swings like this. You don't get, time is finite and the attention of the American people is finite

00:50:19.060 and there's not a lot of time. So it's like, if you're going to take a big swing, if you're going

00:50:23.720 to do something huge, you probably only get one. And I would hate to think that we've used it on

00:50:29.180 Iran. I think that, and if we're getting out of Iran now, great, because then you could argue 0.93

00:50:34.120 that maybe it doesn't end up being a huge thing if it only lasted a few weeks. And so let's go do 1.00

00:50:38.160 this thing over here, actual mass deportations. And I have to say, I think that's a totally

00:50:45.420 reasonable point of view, except for the fact that the idea of Trump focusing on something

00:50:50.840 and remaining focused on it is such a fantasy. It's like trying to imagine infinity. You know,

00:50:55.440 you just your mind can't comprehend it. But I but I think in terms of normal politics,

00:50:59.960 I think that's a perfectly reasonable point of view. If you're going to take the chance,

00:51:03.140 You'd rather he take it on illegal immigration. I think all told, I would agree with that. 1.00

00:51:08.760 I just can't imagine Trump focusing on anything for more than it takes, you know, more time than

00:51:14.340 it takes to send a tweet. You know, there's another problem here, which is I was speaking

00:51:17.700 to some members of Congress. This was a while ago. This was right when they came in the last year.

00:51:23.060 And I said, guys, it's really all about the deportations. You really just have to get it

00:51:28.120 done. I was making really your points, Matt, which is, you know, this is it. It's going to be,

00:51:33.380 could be politically costly, but the American people do really want it at a deep level. And

00:51:38.340 it's transformational. The left has been open about the fact that their long-term electoral

00:51:43.400 strategy is to radically transform the demographics so that they can have a permanent majority.

00:51:47.780 We have to stop that. Time is running short on that. We're talking about time running short on

00:51:52.180 the Iranian nuclear program. Time might even be shorter on the domestic program of the Democrats.

00:51:57.660 So you really have to do it. Just go and deport Abuela. And I was speaking to these members of 0.98

00:52:03.080 Congress off the record. I won't say their names, but a lot of them did bring up the point. They

00:52:07.940 said, Michael, that's all well and good. We would love to do that. The problem is it's not only

00:52:12.780 opinion polls that we have to answer to. We also have to answer to the donor class, or we're not

00:52:18.360 going to get a crack at that. We also have to, and the donor class, by the way, doesn't want to

00:52:22.080 deport abuela. We also have to answer to the media because the media, even today, still has a lot of

00:52:27.980 power to tank these guys. And I'm sympathetic to their point of view because politics is very

00:52:33.840 complex and it's easy for a pundit. Can I be honest though? Yeah. Can I be honest? I'm just

00:52:40.020 tired of that excuse. And maybe this is a generational, but particularly when it comes

00:52:44.300 to Congress, I am sick and tired of people sitting down the street from me in Washington,

00:52:48.620 D.C. who have been here longer than twice the time I've been alive, who run every two

00:52:53.120 year on the same empty promises to fix all the issues in our country that then they have

00:52:57.500 no incentive to fix because they have nothing to run on in 24 months for receive a blank

00:53:02.020 check from the donor class and also get to manipulate the stock market behind our back

00:53:05.860 and make a net worth of four hundred thirteen million dollars all on Nancy Pelosi, who, 0.52

00:53:10.500 oh, by the way, has served in Congress for the last thirty eight years consecutively. 0.69

00:53:14.560 This woman was born before the invention of the microwave oven and the pen.

00:53:19.540 And these are the people who are telling young people, oh, you just have no idea what you're

00:53:23.680 thinking about.

00:53:24.640 Like the level of societal disconnect is astounding.

00:53:27.740 And I'm honest, tired of being told from so many people in Washington, oh, well, that's

00:53:32.340 just the way Washington works.

00:53:33.620 Like we don't have to accept that.

00:53:35.200 We don't have to live that way.

00:53:36.840 Our framers and our founders designed a system of government that was supposed to serve the

00:53:41.140 people and not the other way around.

00:53:42.600 and the people mandate on a silver platter in November of 2024.

00:53:46.940 That is inexcusable now to turn this around.

00:53:49.720 I think it's perfect how Congressman Brandon Gill said it.

00:53:51.760 It is unforgivable for Republican members of Congress to introduce mass amnesty bills.

00:53:56.960 That's not okay.

00:53:57.840 Look, I agree.

00:53:59.180 It can't be a generational stance because I agree with it.

00:54:01.620 We all agree on that.

00:54:03.000 We're all sick of it.

00:54:03.700 And we say this is totally unacceptable.

00:54:05.100 But there is that old maxim from systems, which is that the purpose of a system is what it does.

00:54:10.660 and the fact is we can complain until we're blue in the face, but if the incentives of the system

00:54:15.760 are such that, the incentives and the disincentives are such that the congressmen don't have any real

00:54:21.600 power to do it, and that they might even be able to get away with proposing a mass amnesty bill

00:54:26.380 in 2026, and they might not even suffer political consequences for that, you just think, okay,

00:54:31.040 there's a structural problem here that needs to change. This is why, by the way, to your point,

00:54:34.880 Matt, I had the same reaction, again, as someone who before, during, and after was quite skeptical

00:54:40.260 of the Iran strikes and argued against it. I do actually get why Trump is doing more stuff

00:54:46.340 in foreign policy than he might be able to get done in domestic policy. That said,

00:54:51.420 there have still been, what, over 700,000 deportations formally in the first year,

00:54:55.080 another million or more self-deportations, which we can track on multiple levels.

00:55:00.120 So there was something. We all want 10 million deportations. We want 15 million deportations.

00:55:03.700 But the reason he's playing more in foreign policy is actually because there are no district

00:55:08.540 judges in Bahrain. The reason he's doing it is because he has a lot more control to actually

00:55:13.000 affect things in foreign policy than he does in domestic policy. You can say that's a terrible

00:55:16.700 system. I agree that it is, but they're the ones who actually have to go out there and do the

00:55:22.160 things in the political order. It's much easier for pundits to complain about it, myself included,

00:55:26.380 as one of the people who complains. And that's, I mean, I think that that's correct. And so

00:55:32.800 doing something like this, I mean, it is, to your point, it's easy to talk about mass deportation,

00:55:37.860 especially for those of us who don't actually have to do it. But we have to acknowledge,

00:55:42.040 we have to be sober-minded about it if we're going to advocate for something like this,

00:55:45.480 and acknowledge, as we've talked about, it could be politically disastrous.

00:55:49.540 And more than that, it's like, it is a system shaking, it shakes the very, the system itself,

00:55:57.460 potentially catastrophically. I mean, it could tear everything down because as I said, it would

00:56:02.340 require, you can't do it if you're going to listen to the judges. And so we're talking,

00:56:07.100 And when I say that, oh, defy the judges, I don't mean to say it in some kind of breezy,

00:56:11.420 kind of casual way.

00:56:12.860 I understand what I'm saying.

00:56:14.300 That's not a small thing.

00:56:16.640 Everyone says, oh, that'd be a constitutional crisis.

00:56:18.880 Yeah, it probably would be.

00:56:20.300 But we're already in the crisis.

00:56:21.660 That's the point.

00:56:22.240 We're in a constitutional crisis already.

00:56:24.580 And so someone has to be willing to say, now's the time.

00:56:27.680 We're going to have this out right now.

00:56:29.560 Whatever happens is whatever happens afterwards.

00:56:32.040 We'll deal with that afterwards, but it must happen.

00:56:34.960 And here's the thing about Trump.

00:56:35.760 I also want to say this, because I think from Trump's perspective, he probably looks at right wing commentators like myself who criticize him pretty strenuously for things like Iran.

00:56:54.660 And his attitude is probably, hey, you're so ungrateful.

00:56:58.060 I mean, I've done all these things that no one else, no other president has ever done.

00:57:02.280 No one else has done these things.

00:57:03.620 And I'm actually done. 1.00

00:57:04.740 yeah, maybe I'm not doing full on mass deportations, but we went in, we got rid of some of the Somali 1.00

00:57:09.100 fraudsters. I mean, we've done more deportations than other presidents have. If you add self 1.00

00:57:13.100 deportations in, that is a real thing. We shut down the border. I mean, no president had done

00:57:17.180 that before me. And he probably looks at that and feels like, well, there's a kind of a lack

00:57:21.260 of gratitude there. Like we should be more appreciative of the actual good things that

00:57:24.780 he's done. And he has done some really significant good things. And I get that. Like I actually

00:57:30.260 understand. If I were in his shoes, I'd probably feel something like that. But here's the thing.

00:57:37.040 The reason why it's important, even for those of us who support Trump and have supported a lot of

00:57:44.620 the things that he's done, the reason why it's important for us to say it's not good enough,

00:57:49.160 like, yeah, be kind of ungrateful about it. Because you know what? Being grateful to politicians,

00:57:53.700 that's not part of the arrangement. We're not called upon to have an attitude of humility and

00:57:58.800 gratitude before our great politicians who run the country. It's actually supposed to be public

00:58:04.400 servant. That's the word we use for these people. That's not what the relationship has been

00:58:08.940 any time in recent history, but that's what it's supposed to be. Actually, you're our servant. You

00:58:14.500 work for us. That's what is supposed to set our system apart from many other systems that have

00:58:20.260 existed. Number one, it's not enough for us to just say, oh, I'm grateful for that. At least

00:58:26.420 she did something. But number two, it's because we recognize that Trump is willing to do things

00:58:33.460 that no other president is willing to do. That is why we cannot-

00:58:37.400 That's why we expect him.

00:58:39.060 Yeah.

00:58:39.300 Right. That's why we cannot be satisfied.

00:58:41.220 Yeah, no, that's fair.

00:58:41.800 When I'm talking about mass deportations, and this is a credit to Trump, as well as being

00:58:49.200 a criticism and a call to action. I recognize that if he won't do this, I don't think anyone

00:58:55.800 else ever will. If Trump will not do this, I don't think, certainly no president in my lifetime

00:59:00.840 before him ever would have done it and didn't do it. I cannot imagine any president doing this if

00:59:05.900 he won't do it. And so that's why our message to Trump has to be, you've got to do it. If it's not

00:59:13.520 you, it won't be anybody. And we cannot be satisfied unless you do it. Because if we're

00:59:18.900 willing to say, okay, fine, Trump didn't do it. That's not us just saying, fine, Trump's not doing

00:59:23.060 it. It's us saying, okay, fine. It will never happen. Well, you mentioned recent history, Matt.

00:59:27.740 I think you have a show that is about recent history. Am I correct about that?

00:59:35.120 Yeah. Well, recent history, old history, we kind of go through the gamut.

00:59:39.960 The most recent episode we just put up was about the Civil War. So we've done,

00:59:45.000 our first episode was the real history of slavery. We did the real history of the American Indian

00:59:49.260 and the Indian Wars that were, you know, hundreds of years long campaign.

00:59:55.160 And then we just, we put up our most recent one about the Civil War.

00:59:59.500 And, you know, look, you got to become a subscriber, go watch the episodes.

01:00:03.860 I think that kind of on whichever side you're on,

01:00:07.480 you might be surprised by the way we handle the episodes.

01:00:10.220 I thought you meant whichever side, like Union or Confederate.

01:00:13.980 Whatever, whatever side, all different sides.

01:00:17.660 I think you'll be surprised by how we handle it,

01:00:18.940 Because what we're not trying to do is take the left-wing propaganda that has been disseminated by the school system and Hollywood and all that and replace it with our own sort of overly simplistic, cartoonish, kind of right-wing version of these events.

01:00:34.160 We're not doing that.

01:00:35.400 And especially with something like the Civil War, you kind of find that where, you know, you've got the mainstream narrative, which is that the Union, you know, the Confederates were all just evil Nazis, basically.

01:00:47.100 and the Union were freedom fighters.

01:00:49.740 But then you have the kind of response to that,

01:00:51.740 the revisionist side, that flips that on its head. 0.91

01:00:54.280 And now the Union are the evil demons and the Confederate.

01:00:58.120 And so what we're trying to do is actually take this

01:01:01.520 and look at it objectively and just tell you the story,

01:01:05.460 the real story of this episode in history.

01:01:08.460 I think we have a clip.

01:01:09.460 Which is complex.

01:01:10.800 Oh, we do.

01:01:11.200 Okay, then why am I babbling about it? 1.00

01:01:12.500 Just play the damn play. 0.99

01:01:13.040 I wanted to hear the babble. 0.99

01:01:17.100 I do believe that if people have committed treason against the United States of America,

01:01:23.860 their statutes should not be in the Capitol.

01:01:27.760 History is written by the victors.

01:01:29.300 And since the 1960s, we've been told mostly by people whose ancestors didn't even live here during the war

01:01:34.100 that the South committed treason.

01:01:36.820 But if the Confederates were traitors,

01:01:39.460 then why was Jefferson Davis never put on trial for treason?

01:01:44.180 What were Abraham Lincoln and Andrew Johnson afraid of?

01:01:49.180 Do they know something they're not allowed to say today?

01:01:53.180 It's time for the truth.

01:01:55.180 So here it is.

01:01:56.180 Robert E. Lee was a military genius and a man of immense honor.

01:01:59.180 He was beloved by Americans from the North and South for a century after the war.

01:02:04.180 This is the real history of the Civil War.

01:02:08.180 Now, enough about history. I want to talk about the future. We have very little time left,

01:02:18.360 but in two minutes, have you guys seen the story about Claude's new AI, which is so good

01:02:24.780 that Anthropic will not allow anyone to use the AI because it could just completely crash

01:02:31.620 our entire global system of data and security. Isabel, have you looked into this?

01:02:40.040 I have. And it's interesting, about a week and a half ago, my entire X feed was all

01:02:45.300 pro-Clawed messaging. And I hadn't really ever interacted with Anthropics AI before. I've played

01:02:51.280 with ChatGPT and Google Gemini and all of the fun things, Grok, of course. But they announced about

01:02:56.940 a week and a half ago that they released this where Claude can run your computer, your desktop.

01:03:03.760 You are away from your phone. You can tell Claude, hey, export a PDF of that business pitch I was

01:03:10.540 working on and eat to my boss. And it can do all of these things for you or edit a hundred photos

01:03:16.480 of this wedding. I just took a bunch of pictures as a wedding photographer while I'm out using this

01:03:21.260 preset and it'll do all of it for you. It can clean out your email inbox. It can basically be

01:03:26.280 you while you're out and about doing things. That was terrifying to me, and I couldn't believe how

01:03:31.100 many people were that excited about it. But I guess now in the week and a half since, it's gotten so

01:03:35.680 good that they're kind of pulling the reins back on some of this stuff. All right. We've got like

01:03:39.840 30 seconds left, but I know, Matt, you despise AI, and you think it's going to destroy all of

01:03:45.500 art and everything. Our sponsors over at Kalshi have a prediction market on whether or not we're

01:03:50.480 just going to stop AI. 10% of users believe any of the major big tech AI platforms will pause

01:03:56.980 their research out of concern for public safety. 90% of people know that they're just going to

01:04:01.300 keep trying to make money. Everyone's definitely become more cynical on this recently because

01:04:05.760 just over a year ago, 30% of people thought that the AI companies would say, you know what? We

01:04:10.260 actually don't want any more money. We're going to stop this for the common good or whatever.

01:04:13.640 Is it, I'm like a cautious AI bull. I don't even think it can do many of the things,

01:04:19.720 at least artistically, that people are pretending that it will do.

01:04:22.640 But should we stop it?

01:04:23.660 What do we do?

01:04:24.120 Round the horn, 10 seconds.

01:04:25.360 Should we stop AI?

01:04:27.660 Well, you know that I'm an apocalyptist, if that's a word, when it comes to AI.

01:04:34.800 I will say that, because look, there are certain things that AI can't do.

01:04:39.120 And so I take some solace in that.

01:04:40.820 There are innovations, ideas, creativity that AI is not capable of.

01:04:46.240 For example, like no AI could have ever come up

01:04:48.500 with the terrorist tears Tumblr.

01:04:51.060 No, it's just two.

01:04:52.620 That's the kind of brilliance.

01:04:55.200 That's the kind of brilliance that's going to get.

01:04:57.440 You know how badly we're setting up people to get bullied.

01:05:03.280 Like you're going to be out in public drinking

01:05:05.640 and someone's going, what's that?

01:05:06.720 I'm drinking terrorist tears.

01:05:08.620 Yeah, you're about to be drinking a swirly

01:05:10.040 is what you're going to be drinking.

01:05:11.440 Anyway, it's a great Tumblr.

01:05:14.440 You should definitely buy it.

01:05:15.820 All jokes aside.

01:05:17.740 Probably $75.

01:05:19.340 They ask me to do the ads, and then they have Matt here to do the anti-ads.

01:05:23.920 Say, no, don't.

01:05:24.560 Whatever Michael says to buy, don't buy it.

01:05:26.300 How much is the terrorist tumbler?

01:05:28.520 I think it's only like $400 or $700, I think, I assume.

01:05:31.600 I haven't looked at the prices recently.

01:05:34.120 You can get it.

01:05:35.160 Buy one, get one for the full price of the first one.

01:05:39.640 Drew, are you an A up?

01:05:40.680 Before we go, we have like three seconds.

01:05:42.440 No, I am a believer in the human race.

01:05:44.400 I believe it's a tool. We'll use it as a tool. We'll make it better. I think that it's spooky

01:05:48.980 what it does. This new one actually can create its own apps. So all those people who were told

01:05:53.240 to learn to code now have to learn to play the violin, I think is what they should have been

01:05:57.920 told in the first place. But no, I think, look, everything that we do needs regulation. There'll

01:06:02.900 be regulations, but it shouldn't be regulations stopping the development of it. It should be

01:06:07.320 regulations against using it for evil instead of good. And I think that once we use it for good,

01:06:12.080 people will add to it and create things. If people are not feeding it information,

01:06:16.200 it goes haywire. So it's still going to require the human race. I think it's going to be a great

01:06:22.400 new tool. We'll see what happens. Or there'll be a nuclear disaster tonight instead of last night.

01:06:28.680 It won't matter. Isabel, wonderful to see you. Matt, Drew, you were seen as well. Wonderful to

01:06:37.320 be with everybody out there in the audience. We'll catch you on the next Friendly Fire.

The Matt Walsh Show - April 09, 2026

Friendly Fire： Iran Ceasefire, INDIGNIDAD Amnesty & A.I. Supermodel Gone Rogue

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